艾司摩爾 (ASML) 2003 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by. Welcome to the ASML half year results 2003 conference call on October 15 2003. Throughout today's recorded presentation all participants will be in a listen-only mode. After the presentation there will be an opportunity to ask questions. If any participant has difficulty hearing the conference, please the star key followed by '0' on your push-button phone for operator assistance.

女士們、先生們，感謝你們的支持。歡迎參加 2003 年 10 月 15 日 ASML 2003 年半年業績電話會議。在今天的錄製演示過程中，所有參與者都將處於只聽模式。演示結束後將有機會提問。如果有任何參與者聽不清楚會議內容，請按按鍵電話上的星號鍵，然後按「0」尋求接線員的協助。

I would now like to turn the conference over to Mr. Doug Dunn. Please go ahead, sir.

現在我想將會議交給道格‧鄧恩先​​生。先生，請繼續。

Actually this is Craig DeYoung, Director of Investor Relations for ASML.

實際上，這是 ASML 投資者關係總監 Craig DeYoung。

We would like to welcome you to ASML's Q3 financial results conference call. Just a few ground rules, as you know, this call is scheduled for one hour. We would like to ask that you limit your questions to one, with one short follow up, so that we can handle as many questions as possible. I will turn the floor over to Doug here momentarily, but I am obliged to read the Safe Harbor statement, so bear with me.

歡迎您參加 ASML 第三季財務業績電話會議。只有幾個基本規則，如您所知，本次通話將持續一小時。我們希望您將問題限制為一個，並進行一次簡短的跟進，以便我們能夠處理盡可能多的問題。我馬上將發言權交給 Doug，但我有義務宣讀安全港聲明，所以請耐心聽我說完。

The matters discussed during this presentation include forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties including but not limited to: economic conditions, product and pricing, manufacturing efficiencies, new product development, ability to enforce patents, availability of raw materials and critical manufacturing equipment, trade environment and other risks indicated in filings with the US Securities and Exchange Commission.

本演講中討論的事項包括前瞻性陳述，這些陳述受風險和不確定性的影響，包括但不限於：經濟狀況、產品和定價、製造效率、新產品開發、執行專利的能力、原材料和關鍵製造設備的可用性、貿易環境以及向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中指出的其他風險。

So with that, I will turn the floor over to Doug Dunn, CEO.

因此，我將把發言權交給執行長 Doug Dunn。

Thanks Craig. One of these days, you will learn that off by heart.

謝謝克雷格。有一天，你會記住這一點。

Good morning, good afternoon and good evening, ladies and gentlemen around the world. Thank you joining in to our third quarter results call.

世界各地的女士們、先生們，早安、下午好、晚上好。感謝您參加我們的第三季業績電話會議。

This is Doug Dunn, speaking as CEO and there are many more important people here with me who will help me out with any difficult questions.

我是道格‧鄧恩 (Doug Dunn)，以執行長的身份發言，這裡還有許多更重要的人，他們會幫我解決任何難題。

I would like to begin with just a very quick summary of the quarter and then give maximum time to you to ask the questions that I am sure you are dieing to ask us.

首先，我想對本季做一個非常簡短的總結，然後給你們充足的時間來提出我相信你們很想問我們的問題。

So, the third quarter. Revenue of €370m, up by 12% quarter on quarter and 5% year on year. I think this supports our previous statements that we have been making all the way through this year that it is a year of moderate, but sustained growth and that as each quarter goes by, the sustained word comes I think, more and more relevant.

那麼，第三季。營收為 3.7 億歐元，季增 12%，年增 5%。我認為這支持了我們今年一直在說的一句話：今年是溫和但持續成長的一年，而且隨著每個季度的過去，「持續」這個詞我認為會越來越有意義。

So we are quite pleased that our customers are experiencing this very positive trend throughout the year.

因此，我們很高興看到我們的客戶全年都感受到這種非常積極的趨勢。

We have also made the point that there is of course a time lag between our customers having this experience of growth and it reflecting on our own fortunes and perhaps the heavy period of bookings at the end of Q3 maybe show some light that finally the reflection of our customers' growth now begins to impact on we systems companies.

我們還指出，在我們的客戶經歷這種增長和它反映在我們自己的命運之間當然存在一個時間差，也許第三季度末的大量預訂可能會表明，最終我們客戶的增長反映現在開始對我們系統公司產生影響。

In the quarter we saw 34 lithography tools, 28 new and 6 refurbished. The selling price for the new systems increased from 8.3 in Q2 to 10.8 reflecting the richer mix of twin [indiscernible] products in the quarter.

本季我們看到了 34 台光刻工具，其中 28 台是新的，6 台是翻新的。新系統的售價從第二季的 8.3 上漲至 10.8，反映出本季雙 [音訊不清晰] 產品組合更加豐富。

Our backlog, which is always an excellent bell weather for our next few quarter sales increased by 47% quarter on quarter to 91 systems. I must say that I do like saying that increased by 47% - it has a certain ring to it which I enjoy these days, having had three years of a rather lack luster backlog growth, so that is an excellent trend.

我們的積壓訂單始終是未來幾季銷售的晴雨表，季增 47%，達到 91 個系統。我必須說，我確實喜歡說增加了 47%——這個說法聽起來很有意思，最近我很喜歡，因為之前三年積壓訂單的增長都比較缺乏光彩，所以這是一個很好的趨勢。

Net loss for the period was reduced from €54m in Q2, I am talking Lithography here or Continued Operations down to €18m in Lithography for the quarter just completed.

本期間淨虧損從第二季的 5,400 萬歐元減少，我這裡指的是光刻業務或持續經營業務，至剛結束的季度的光刻業務 1,800 萬歐元。

Our gross margin improved from 22% to 25%. Again that is for Lithography tools.

我們的毛利率從22%提高到25%。這又是關於光刻工具的。

We ended the quarter with positive cash of just over €1.1b. We used €124m in debt reduction, so you can add those two numbers together to get a like for like comparison in our cash position and we completed the divestment of our Thermal Operations.

本季末，我們的現金為正，略高於 11 億歐元。我們使用了 1.24 億歐元來減少債務，因此您可以將這兩個數字加在一起，以獲得我們現金狀況的同類比較，並且我們完成了熱力業務的剝離。

That therefore summarizes the highlights of the quarter. There were very few lowlights, none of which I am going to tell you about anyway. Therefore, I think we had, on balance an interesting and a good quarter.

這就是本季的亮點總結。很少有不愉快的事情，無論如何我都不會告訴你。因此，我認為總體而言，我們度過了一個有趣且良好的季度。

Let me just make one comment on the backlog which is perhaps the most compelling number that I have mentioned to you so far. Indeed, we are pleased by that. Some 85% of that backlog is required in the next two quarters to be sold and to be shipped in the next two quarters. Of course the next two quarters will take more backlog and I guess will also take one or two cancellations so it is not an accurate predictor of what we are going to sell, but it is a good indication. Certainly compared to the end of Q2 it is a very positive improvement.

我只想對積壓訂單發表一點評論，這可能是迄今為止我向你們提到的最引人注目的數字。確實，我們對此感到高興。其中約 85% 的積壓訂單需要在接下來的兩個季度內售出並出貨。當然，接下來的兩個季度將會有更多的積壓訂單，我猜也會有一兩筆訂單被取消，所以這並不能準確預測我們將要銷售什麼，但這是一個很好的跡象。當然，與第二季末相比，這是一個非常積極的改善。

The backlog is a very natural number. It is what customers want to order and when they want to order it. We have little or no control on when they place those orders and you will understand that we have a very relatively small customer base. You can measure it on counting your fingers and therefore we do tend to get lumpy orders coming in and sometimes it appears synchronously at the same time. We can have a very healthy backlog certainly, or conversely occasionally, a very weak one.

積壓是一個非常自然的數字。這就是顧客想要訂購什麼以及何時訂購。我們幾乎無法控制何時下訂單，而且您會明白我們的客戶群相對較小。你可以用手指來數，因此我們確實會收到大宗訂單，有時這些訂單會同時同步出現。我們當然可以擁有非常健康的積壓訂單，或者相反，偶爾也會擁有非常薄弱的​​積壓訂單。

I think at the end of Q2 you saw the other side of that synchronicity when we had a weak backlog, and at the end of Q3 you have the positive side where we had a strong backlog.

我認為在第二季末，你會看到這種同步性的另一面，即我們的積壓訂單較少，而在第三季末，你會看到積極的一面，即我們的積壓訂單較多。

It is not a wide assumption to assume that the customer who placed six months orders at the end of Q3 will place another six months orders at the beginning of Q4, so be careful about making those extrapolations.

假設在第三季末下了六個月訂單的客戶會在第四季初再下六個月的訂單，這並不是一個廣泛的假設，因此在進行這些推斷時要謹慎。

It is a good trend. [indiscernible] indicate the persuasive nature of our product and our ability to [indiscernible] that product and sell to our customers worldwide and we are pleased by it. So with that, I will cease the introduction and pass it over via the operator for questions.

這是一個好的趨勢。 [聽不清楚]顯示了我們產品的說服力以及我們[聽不清楚]該產品並銷售給全球客戶的能力，我們對此感到滿意。因此，我將結束介紹並透過接線員將其交給提問者。

Ladies and gentlemen. At this time we will begin the question and answer session. If you have a question, please press star followed by '1' on your push-button phone. If you wish to cancel your request, please press star followed by '2'. Your questions will be answered in the order they are received. If you are using speaker equipment today, please put the handset down before making your selections. One moment please, for the first question.

女士們，先生們。現在我們將開始問答環節。如果您有疑問，請在按鍵電話上按星號，然後按「1」。如果您想取消請求，請按星號，然後按「2」。我們將按照收到問題的順序來答覆您提出的問題。如果您今天正在使用揚聲器設備，請在進行選擇之前放下聽筒。請稍等片刻，回答第一個問題。

The first question comes from Matthew Gale. Please state your company name followed by your question.

第一個問題來自馬修·蓋爾。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

It's with Goldman Sachs. Good afternoon.

這是高盛的。午安.

Two questions, one on the backlog breakdown and the second one on R&D.

兩個問題，一個關於積壓訂單的細目，另一個關於研發。

First on backlog, could you give us a little bit more insight into the swings we have seen in the Logic portion and the Microprocessor portion and maybe give us a little insight might have been caused by any reclassification of IBM from one to the other?

首先關於積壓訂單，您能否向我們詳細介紹一下我們在邏輯部分和微處理器部分看到的波動，並給我們提供一些見解，可能是由於 IBM 從一個部分到另一個部分的重新分類造成的？

Then I would just like to get a little bit of light on the Microprocessor portion of the backlog which was up pretty substantially quarter over quarter, but your North American portion of the backlog was down. So if you could shed any light there?

然後我想稍微介紹一下積壓訂單中微處理器部分的情況，該部分的數量比上一季大幅增加，但北美部分的積壓訂單數量卻有所下降。那你能解釋一下嗎？

The second question, on R&D, you have been doing an impressive job of bringing the R&D level down over the past four quarters. Quite recent [indiscernible] reports would lead one to believe that ASML is going to press ahead with 157 nanometer as well emergent lithography, do you think this R&D level on an absolute basis is something you can maintain, going forward? Or will we look to see that ramp up in the near future?

第二個問題，關於研發，過去四個季度，你們在降低研發水準方面做得非常出色。最近的 [音訊不清晰] 報導讓人相信 ASML 將推進 157 奈米以及新興光刻技術，您認為這種研發水準在未來能夠保持下去嗎？或者我們是否會期待在不久的將來看到這種增長？

Thank you.

謝謝。

The second one, first if I may.

第二個，如果可以的話，我是第一個。

Our position is that we have ramped down on the expenditure. Don't forget we designed, built, launched and introduced a twin-scan(ph.) in the period 1997 to 2001 and that took a lot of R&D activity that is now largely behind us. That helps in reducing our R&D. Equally well, you comment on the two major programs for next nodes(ph.), that is 193 immersion(ph.) and 157.

我們的立場是，我們已經削減了支出。別忘了，我們在 1997 年至 2001 年期間設計、建造、推出並推出了雙掃描（ph.），這需要大量的研發活動，現在這些工作基本上已經完成了。這有助於減少我們的研發。同樣，您對下一個節點（ph.）的兩個主要程式進行了評論，即 193 immersion（ph.）和 157。

At this point in time, different customers show a strong interest in both and therefore it is our obligation to give them, if we can, what they want.

此時，不同的客戶對兩者都表現出濃厚的興趣，因此，如果可以的話，我們有義務滿足他們的需求。

So to answer your question - in a nutshell, yes. We can maintain those two programs and EUE(ph.) and the other programs that you are not aware of yet, within our R&D spend that we have today in absolute dollar or euro terms.

所以回答你的問題——簡而言之，是的。我們可以在我們今天的研發支出（以絕對美元或歐元計算）範圍內維持這兩個項目以及 EUE（ph.）和其他您尚不清楚的項目。

It is not to say that we won't continue to reduce it as we see fit, if programs allow, nor at some future point would I say that we wouldn't increase it as well. But right now, the trend that you have seen will level out and there will be another small reduction perhaps next year as the second reduction in force takes effect in the middle of next year and yes, we can do all the programs, including 197(ph.), 157, 193 immersion 157, should customers require both those programs.

這並不是說，如果專案允許，我們不會按照我們認為合適的方式繼續減少它，也不是說在未來的某個時候我們不會增加它。但現在，您所看到的趨勢將會趨於平穩，也許明年還會有另一次小幅裁員，因為第二次裁員將在明年年中生效，是的，我們可以開展所有項目，包括 197（ph.）、157、193 浸入式 157，如果客戶需要這兩個項目的話。

That in itself is a question which we are prepared to wait for the answer from our customers.

這本身就是一個問題，我們準備好等待客戶的答案。

On the first one, I don't know frankly off hand really the split between Microprocessor, Micro-controllers and Logic, those two paths you mentioned, the 70% and 80% of our [indiscernible] use.

關於第一個問題，坦白說，我不知道微處理器、微控制器和邏輯之間的真正區別，您提到的這兩條路徑，即我們 [音訊不清晰] 用途的 70% 和 80%。

Frankly, we have customers that do some of each and therefore, if I may say so, not a particularly interesting question as to how we categorize them and I am certainly not going to indicate you what the customers are within those segments. You may be able to guess yourself, some of the names in there.

坦白說，我們的客戶各有各的用途，因此，如果可以這麼說的話，我們如何對它們進行分類並不是一個特別有趣的問題，而且我當然不會告訴您這些細分市場中的客戶是什麼。您也許能夠猜出其中的一些名字。

So, if I could suggest that you ignore that detail and look at the two combined Logic or MP or MCU and that is sufficient for our purposes.

因此，如果我建議您忽略該細節並查看兩個組合的邏輯或 MP 或 MCU，那麼這對於我們的目的來說就足夠了。

With respect to your original question, you have to remember that many of those customers have perhaps that part around the world, so we specify the region to the physical destination of the tool not where the [indiscernible] customers were held.

關於您最初的問題，您必須記住，許多客戶可能在世界各地都有該部件，因此我們將區域指定為工具的物理目的地，而不是[音訊不清晰]客戶所在的位置。

Okay. That's very thorough. Thank you.

好的。這非常徹底。謝謝。

That by the way was Peter Wennink. Many of you know him. He is the guy who keeps me honest on the numbers.

順便說一下，他就是彼得‧溫寧克 (Peter Wennink)。你們當中很多人都認識他。他讓我對數字保持誠實。

Next question, please, operator?

接線員，請問下一個問題？

Thank you, sir. The next question comes from Mr. Uche Orji. Please state your company name, followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Uche Orji 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hello guys. Uche Orji from JP Morgan. I have two questions.

大家好。摩根大通的 Uche Orji。我有兩個問題。

One is on gross margins and the second is around what do you expect in terms of orders coming into 2004?

一個是毛利率，第二個是您對 2004 年的訂單量有何預期？

Gross margins. How do we think about the trend of gross margins into Q4 and into next year, actually giving that the negotiations with Walkers(ph.) Council is being delayed a little bit? So how do you think this will trend and when that competition is done, how much impact do you think that will have on your margins?

毛利率。實際上，考慮到與 Walkers（音譯）Council 的談判稍微推遲了一點，我們如何看待第四季和明年的毛利率趨勢？那麼您認為這種趨勢會如何發展？當競爭結束時，您認為這會對您的利潤產生多大影響？

The second question is that it looks like all these [indiscernible] orders could be due to be shipped in the next six months. What is your expectation of 2004 orders essentially? Do you think that this is yet to come, or are you just going to help us characterize expectations for next year?

第二個問題是，看起來所有這些[音訊不清晰]訂單都可能在未來六個月內發貨。您對2004年的訂單預期基本上是什麼？您認為這還沒有發生嗎，或者您只是想幫助我們描述對明年的期望？

The gross margin that it would be fair to comment on, is the historical gross margin and you may assume from the backlog that we have on the books right now, the 91 systems, of which I explained 85% [indiscernible] very quiet in the next six months. Clearly we know the gross margins on those orders and indeed the gross margin will continue to trend upwards in the next quarter or two.

值得公平評論的毛利率是歷史毛利率，你可以從我們目前賬面上的積壓訂單中推斷出，91 個系統，其中我解釋過的 85% [音頻不清晰] 在未來六個月內非常安靜。我們清楚知道這些訂單的毛利率，而且毛利率確實會在接下來的一兩個季度繼續呈上升趨勢。

That is as far as we are prepared to go. We have no visibility on the size or mix or volume of orders for beyond the middle of Q2, which is normal these days in this industry and therefore when we know that, and we report that to you, then you will have some idea of the gross margin potential from it.

這就是我們準備要做到的極限。我們無法預測第二季中期以後的訂單規模、組合或數量，這在當今行業中很正常，因此，當我們知道這一點並將其報告給您時，您就會對其毛利率潛力有所了解。

As you know, Uche, it is very important to know the volume, because volume is the important line before the gross margin and as Doug said, we don't have a very clear view as to what the volume for 2004 will be, because our backlog is 85% for the next six months. So that is a question which is very difficult to answer right now, but historically we see gross margins trending upwards for the next two quarters.

如你所知，Uche，了解銷量非常重要，因為銷量是毛利率之前的重要線，正如Doug 所說，我們對 2004 年的銷量沒有一個非常清晰的認識，因為未來六個月我們的積壓訂單量為 85%。所以這個問題現在很難回答，但從歷史數據來看，我們預計未來兩季的毛利率將呈現上升趨勢。

I think that in a way that answers the questions also regarding next year's orders and volume and the Q4 backlog. We will know the end of the Q4 backlog 13 weeks from now and at that point we will report it.

我認為這在某種程度上也回答了有關明年的訂單和數量以及第四季度的積壓問題。13 週後我們將知道第四季度積壓訂單的結束情況，屆時我們將進行報告。

However to try to be more helpful there, as I explained to the last questioner, orders always come in lumps from customers and if you get two or three customers at once, it is a big lump. That could happen in Q3, towards the end of Q3. It would be unreasonable to expect that to be the same in Q4 and therefore I don't think you can draw any trend graphs from the Q3 backlog increase.

然而，為了盡力提供更多幫助，正如我向上一位提問者解釋的那樣，訂單總是成批地來自客戶，如果同時有兩三個客戶，那訂單量就會很大。這可能在第三季末發生。期望第四季度的情況相同是不合理的，因此我認為你無法根據第三季積壓訂單的增加繪製任何趨勢圖。

Just a quick follow up on that. In terms of the breakeven levels, you are programmed to bring breakeven levels lower. Where are we now?

對此進行快速跟進。就損益平衡水準而言，你被設定為降低損益平衡水準。我們現在在哪裡？

We are not [indiscernible]. Follow-ups are okay, but they take time from other questions. We are on time with the break even, okay? Perhaps we should announce the next question.

我們不是[音頻不清晰]。後續問題還可以，但是會佔用回答其他問題的時間。我們按時實現了收支平衡，好嗎？也許我們應該宣布下一個問題。

Thank you sir. Our next question comes from Mr. Oliver Brugen(ph.). Please state your company name, followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Oliver Brugen 先生（音譯）。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hello. It is Oliver Brugen from Peter Kavanagh.

你好。這是彼得·卡瓦納的奧利佛·布魯根。

I have a question on 157 and on the [indiscernible] of 157. It is lower than in the previous quarter. Have there been cancellations as suggested by TSNC(ph.), or have you shipped any 157 tools during this quarter?

我對 157 和 157 的 [音訊不清晰] 有疑問。低於上一季。是否有 TSNC（電話）所建議的取消情況，或者您是否在本季度運送了 157 件工具？

I won't comment on the TSNC(ph.) because it is not appropriate to comment on customers, specific paying customers. But to answer your question it has gone down for the good reason that we shipped two.

我不會對 TSNC（ph.）發表評論，因為對客戶、特定的付費客戶發表評論是不合適的。但要回答你的問題，數量下降是有原因的，因為我們發貨了兩輛。

12s(ph.)?

12秒（音程）？

22s(ph.).

22 先令（電話）。

Two different customers?

兩個不同的顧客？

Yes.

是的。

Going forward, how do you feel you are in terms of 193 Immersion development, compared to competitors, meaning when do you expect to see a Beta tool or an Alpha tool and when do you expect to be in volume production, if any?

展望未來，與競爭對手相比，您認為您在 193 Immersion 開發方面表現如何？也就是說，您預計何時能看到 Beta 工具或 Alpha 工具，以及您預計何時能夠實現大量生產（如果有的話）？

I think the simple answer is - and I will keep this fairly short, is that whenever our customers want 193 Immersion for production, we will have it ready for them.

我認為答案很簡單——我會盡量簡短地回答，只要我們的客戶需要 193 Immersion 用於生產，我們就會為他們做好準備。

Okay. But do you have plans to ship Beta tools yet?

好的。但您有計劃發布 Beta 版工具嗎？

Yes. We have plans to ship tools.

是的。我們有運送工具的計劃。

But in Immersion?

但在沉浸感方面呢？

You are only talking about Immersion, right now?

現在您只談沉浸式體驗嗎？

Yes.

是的。

Yes.

是的。

And the timing for that?

時間是什麼時候？

When we ship them and [indinscernible] launch the product, we will let you know. Okay?

當我們發貨並推出產品時，我們會通知您。好的？

Okay. Thanks.

好的。謝謝。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from [indiscernible].

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自[音訊不清楚]。

Yes, it is [indiscernible]. Two quick questions.

是的，這是[音訊不清楚]。兩個簡單的問題。

One, can you comment on what your service income was or [indiscernible] revenue was this quarter and secondly, maybe it is possible to identify how many customers in the past two weeks placed this lump of orders?

首先，您能否評論一下本季您的服務收入或[音訊不清晰]收入是多少？其次，是否可以確定過去兩週有多少客戶下了訂單？

I will take the second one, because it is very simple. I don't know, between two and four, okay? That is as close as I can get. I don't see an accurate track of every customer, every day.

我會選擇第二個，因為它非常簡單。我不知道，二到四之間，好嗎？這是我所能達到的最接近的程度。我每天都看不到每位顧客的準確軌跡。

Regarding the service revenues, I will hand over to Peter to give you more detail on that one.

關於服務收入，我將交給彼得來向您詳細介紹。

The service sales were around the €57m in the second quarter.

第二季的服務銷售額約為 5700 萬歐元。

Thank you.

謝謝。

The next question comes from Mr. Tom Leach. Please state your company name, followed by your question.

下一個問題來自湯姆·利奇先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Yes. It is Tom Leach from Bennett Lawrence.

是的。他是《本內特勞倫斯》的湯姆利奇。

Forgive me, I don't know your company that well, but I am looking at the backlog number of 91 machines. Could you break that up for me as to how many of those machines are in which different geometries? In [indiscernible] numbers, I should say.

請原諒，我對貴公司不太了解，但我正在查看 91 台機器的積壓數量。您能否幫我解釋一下這些機器中有多少台是屬於哪些不同的幾何形狀？我應該說，以[音訊不清晰]的數字來說。

If you have an online facility there, I could refer you to our presentation, slide 12. It does tell you there precisely by value, not by number of units, but by value what the backlog is by technology note. So 47% is €248m, 42% is €193m and then there is a bit of 157nm and 365nm in there as well.

如果您在那裡有線上設施，我可以向您推薦我們的簡報第 12 張投影片。它確實會根據價值（而不是單位數量）準確地告訴您技術說明中的積壓量是多少。因此 47% 是 2.48 億歐元，42% 是 1.93 億歐元，然後還有一點 157nm 和 365nm。

That slide is up on your investor site?

這張幻燈片放在你們的投資者網站上了嗎？

Yes. Slide 12 is the one you want. It is by value, so you can't take 47% of €91m, you take 47% of €859m. So it is very, very roughly 47% is €248m and 42% is €193m.

是的。投影片 12 就是您想要的。這是按價值計​​算的，所以你不能拿走 9,100 萬歐元的 47%，而是拿走 8.59 億歐元的 47%。因此，非常粗略地計算，47% 為 2.48 億歐元，42% 為 1.93 億歐元。

Thank you so much.

太感謝了。

Thank you, sir. The next question comes from Mr. Jean D'Anjou. Please state your company name, followed by your questions.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Jean D'Anjou 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hi, gentlemen. This is Jean D'Anjou from CSFCB. I have one quick question.

嗨，先生們。我是 CSFCB 的 Jean D'Anjou。我有一個簡單的問題。

If I look at what happened in the last two weeks of the quarter, and these rush orders at the last minute, were you surprised by the timing, or were you surprised at the size of the orders from this client?

如果我看一下本季最後兩週發生的事情，以及最後一刻的緊急訂單，您是否對時間安排感到驚訝，或者您對這個客戶的訂單規模感到驚訝？

We were not surprised by the size because we are in discussion with clients regarding their orders for many weeks and often many months and never surprised in the terms of the size, plus or minus 10% or so. The timing is always a surprise, quite frankly, because customers always say 'we are ready to place orders', and then they haggle and negotiate for three or four more weeks and another couple of weeks. Then lo and behold some day they pop in with the piece of paper.

我們對這個尺寸並不感到驚訝，因為我們已經與客戶討論了數週甚至數月的訂單，並且從未對尺寸感到驚訝，上下浮動 10% 左右。坦白說，時機總是令人驚訝，因為客戶總是說“我們準備下訂單”，然後他們會再討價還價三、四個星期，然後再過幾個星期。然後你瞧，有一天他們拿著那張紙突然出現。

That is how it was at the end of Q3. So the timing of orders is always a surprise to the nearest week or two. But the size of the order is not usually a surprise within plus or minus 10%.

第三季末的情況就是這樣。因此訂單的下達時間總是比最近的一兩週更令人驚訝。但訂單規模通常不會在正負10%以內出現意外。

As I say, it was a gratuitous synchronous activity where two or three deals we had been working on, that we knew would come up sometime this year popped in at the end of some of our customers' fiscal year, for fiscal reasons and, yes, we were very delighted to receive them in the last part of September.

正如我所說，這是一項免費的同步活動，其中，我們一直在進行的兩三筆交易，我們知道這些交易將在今年某個時候出現，由於財務原因，它們出現在我們一些客戶的財政年度末，是的，我們很高興在九月下旬收到它們。

Okay, then I have a very quick follow up on Discontinued Operation. It is safe to assume that you will show no loss starting in Q4 on that front, after the agreement you have reached for the Thermal business?

好的，那麼我將快速跟進已停止營運的情況。就熱能業務達成協議後，是否可以肯定地說，從第四季度開始，你們在這方面將不會出現任何損失？

I have my hands around my CFO's throat - yes. The answer is yes.

是的，我已經掐住了財務長的喉嚨。答案是肯定的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thank you, sir. The next question comes from Mr. Johannes Reece (ph.), DRK in Frankfurt.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自法蘭克福 DRK 的 Johannes Reece 先生（音譯）。

Good afternoon. It is Johannes Reece, DRK in Frankfurt.

午安.我是法蘭克福的 DRK 的 Johannes Reece。

First a question with regard to the order intake and maybe the implication for the forthcoming quarters. Is it maybe right to say some of these have worked down a little bit early? Is the pipeline that you are seeing for the rest of the year?

首先要問的是有關訂單量以及對未來幾季的影響。是否可以說其中一些已經提前發揮作用了？您看到的這條管道是針對今年剩餘時間的嗎？

On the other side looking at what we see at the semiconductor company side that the utilization is permanently moving up, especially at the high end. But what this may be from the pipeline prospectus you are feeling for next year?

另一方面，從半導體公司的角度來看，利用率正在持續上升，尤其是在高端。但是，從您對明年的管道規劃說明書的感受來看，這可能意味著什麼？

Okay. A couple of good questions. I think that you are right. I think your words were locked down, some of the orders that we expected to take between September and December of this year. They actually came in September, so that was great. We are always pleased to receive orders early, but having got them once, you don't get them again until that order base runs out, so you are correct on that one.

好的。幾個很好的問題。我認為你是對的。我認為你的話已經確定了，我們預計將在今年9月至12月之間接到一些訂單。他們實際上是九月來的，所以這很棒。我們總是很高興能儘早收到訂單，但是一旦收到訂單，您就不會再收到訂單，直到訂單庫用完為止，所以您說得對。

You are also correct that most IT companies are using their capacity at a very high level of utilization. 90% and better. Certainly for the high technology at the leading edge, 95% and sometimes better.

您說得也對，大多數 IT 公司都以非常高的利用率利用其產能。 90% 及以上。當然，對於處於前沿的高科技來說，這個比例是 95%，有時甚至更高。

They will continue doing that until they have the courage of this sustainability as the last three or four quarters growth that they have been seeing, continues into the indefinite future. I guess they will then relax a little bit and place longer term orders. So think for the next quarter or two we can expect to see that kind of cautiousness continuing. In fact many CEOs of our customers have made those public statements.

他們會繼續這樣做，直到有勇氣實現這種可持續性，因為他們看到的過去三、四個季度的成長將持續到不確定的未來。我想他們會稍微放鬆一點並下達更長期的訂單。因此，我們認為在接下來的一兩個季度裡，這種謹慎態度將會持續下去。事實上，我們許多客戶的執行長都曾公開發表過這樣的聲明。

We are seeing still very short term orders just covering one or two quarters out, which obviously puts pressure on our cycle time, but we can respond to that. We are seeing our customers tell us, precisely what I tell you, that they have little courage and visibility beyond the six months period, and therefore steady as it goes. It has been a nice ride for the past three or four quarters. Everyone thinks it is going to continue, but let's not assume too much here and take each quarter by quarter.

我們看到的短期訂單仍然只涵蓋一兩個季度，這顯然給我們的周期時間帶來了壓力，但我們可以對此做出反應。我們看到客戶告訴我們，正如我所告訴你的，他們在六個月後幾乎沒有勇氣和預見性，因此會保持穩定。過去三、四個季度以來，一切進展順利。每個人都認為這種情況會持續下去，但我們不要假設太多，而是逐季來看。

Maybe a follow on question regarding the ASPs of the backlog. It is a little bit lower than ASPs that you have received in Q3. How much can we see this as a sign that you have peaked at that quarter and that you have maybe given a bit more discount like a software company, which is coming closer to the end of the quarter and maybe is more open to give maybe another percentage discount to the list price? Is it unfair to see it in this way?

也許是關於積壓的 ASP 的一個後續問題。它比您在第三季收到的平均售價略低。我們在多大程度上可以將此視為一個信號，表明你們在該季度已經達到頂峰，並且可能像軟體公司一樣給出了更多折扣，而軟體公司即將接近季度末，可能更願意在標價上再給予一定比例的折扣？這樣看是否不公平？

I am going to give you a quick answer because others are waiting and I feel it has been a long set of questions.

我將快速回答你，因為其他人正在等待，而且我覺得這是一個很長的問題。

The ESP is also a function of the mix of products that we have in the backlog and we sell. We have some that sell at a few million and some that sell in the teens of millions. Therefore a little shift on mix makes a big swing on the backlog on the ASP.

ESP 也是我們積壓產品和銷售產品組合的函數。有些產品的售價為數百萬，有些產品的售價則高達數千萬。因此，組合上的一點變化就會對 ASP 上的積壓產生很大的影響。

I kid you not it still isn't an easy sellers market out there. We do occasionally come under a little bit more pressure on pricing than we used to, perhaps in the year 2000. We can handle that, and we have cost reduction programs that will neutralize the effect of that.

我不騙你，這仍然不是一個容易的賣方市場。我們偶爾確實會面臨比以前更大的定價壓力，也許在 2000 年是如此。我們可以解決這個問題，並且我們有成本削減計劃來抵消其影響。

The prime reason for any ASP shift, I think is more a function of mix than anything to do with discounting and price pressure.

我認為，任何 ASP 轉變的主要原因更多的是組合功能，而不是折扣和價格壓力。

Okay, thanks.

好的，謝謝。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from Mr. Steven Pelayo(ph). Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Steven Pelayo 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Steve Pelayo with Morgan Stanley. Peter I am curious about your slotting(ph) plans from a manufacturing standpoint for the remainder of the year? I assume all those manufacturing slots are taken up, is that correct? You cannot do any more turns(ph) business through the end of the year, correct?

摩根士丹利的史蒂夫‧佩拉約 (Steve Pelayo)。彼得，我很好奇您從製造角度對今年剩餘時間的安排計劃是什麼？我認為所有這些製造時段都已被佔用，對嗎？到年底你不能再做任何輪調業務了，對嗎？

That is correct. You could say that is largely correct because we now have 2.5 months left before the end of the year. Perhaps on some Stepper inventory or a lower [indiscernible] Scanner, we can do a [indiscernible] but you shouldn't expect miracles there.

沒錯。你可以說這基本上是正確的，因為現在距離年底還有 2.5 個月的時間。也許在某些步進機庫存或較低的[音頻不清晰]掃描器上，我們可以做一個[音頻不清晰]，但你不應該期待那裡出現奇蹟。

In light of the manufacturing [indiscernible] being locked up a little bit here, I am curious about your customers posturing, or mentality about lead times, and if they are starting to stretch at all? If they are actually starting to get an increased sense of urgency to get involved sooner rather than later, if you will [indiscernible]?

鑑於這裡的製造[音訊不清晰]有點受阻，我很好奇您的客戶對交貨時間的姿態或心態，以及他們是否開始延長交貨時間？如果他們實際上開始有了越來越強烈的緊迫感，想要儘早參與進來，您是否願意[音頻不清晰]？

I think if you look at what we have said before, that sale to order backlog, what we're seeing is 85% for the next six months. They're still very short term focused. If they really want to get in line and get long-term focus, you will see that the order lead times will start stretching also. The percentage of the six-month maybe will go down, and the second six months will go up. I don't think that has actually been happening yet. We were slightly above 90% in the second quarter for shipment in the next six months. We are 85% now, so you could say it is a trend down, but it is very minor.

我想如果你看看我們之前所說的，即銷售與訂單積壓，我們看到未來六個月的積壓率為 85%。他們仍然非常注重短期利益。如果他們真的想排隊並獲得長期關注，你會發現訂單交付週期也會開始延長。前六個月的比例可能會下降，而後六個月的比例可能會上升。我認為這實際上還沒有發生。我們第二季對未來六個月的出貨量的預測略高於 90%。現在我們已經達到 85%，所以你可以說這是一個下降趨勢，但幅度很小。

My last question was just relative to - when you look at your backlog, Doug I think you said it was unrealistic to extrapolate. I'd love to see 47% quarter-over-quarter growth every quarter.

我的最後一個問題只是相對於 - 當你查看你的積壓工作時，道格，我認為你說推斷是不現實的。我希望看到每個季度的環比增長率達到 47%。

We do Steve, we do.

我們確實這麼做了，史蒂夫，我們確實這麼做了。

Yes. When you think about it going into the fourth quarter, you guys have obviously some phenomenal bookings this quarter. I would imagine those bookings decline, but do you think the backlog declines?

是的。當你想到進入第四季時，你們本季顯然有一些驚人的預訂量。我可以想像這些預訂量會下降，但您認為積壓訂單量會下降嗎？

Over the fourth quarter period Steve?

在第四季期間，史蒂夫？

Yes.

是的。

That is tough. Because as you know, we were surprised with some order intake at the end of the quarter, coming in a bit earlier than we thought. It could happen I guess in Q4. I would not be at all surprised or even concerned if the backlog were to reduce in this coming period.

這很艱難。因為如你所知，我們對本季末的一些訂單量感到驚訝，比我們想像的要早一些。我猜這可能會在第四季度發生。如果積壓訂單在未來一段時間內減少，我一點也不會感到驚訝或擔心。

Okay. When you look out at these charts you show us from a regional perspective and from an end-use perspective. Where would you expect them to look at the end of the year? Do you expect any major changes one way or another? Are you looking to a specific region or a specific type of customer for the fourth quarter?

好的。當您查看這些圖表時，您可以從區域角度和最終用途角度向我們展示。您期望他們在年底時關注什麼？您是否期望會發生任何重大變化？您是否在尋找第四季度的特定地區或特定類型的客戶？

That's quite a heavy question. I cannot give you a thoughtful answer there Steve, so I will decline to do that and cut you off at this point. If you come back to our IR guys they might be able to help you there, but essentially not. I suspect Taiwan may start over the next few quarters to build itself again. But it is tough to give an honest valued judgment there.

這是一個相當沉重的問題。史蒂夫，我無法給你一個深思熟慮的答案，所以我會拒絕這樣做並打斷你的話。如果您回到我們的 IR 人員那裡，他們也許能夠幫助您，但基本上不能。我認為台灣可能會在未來幾季內開始重建。但在那裡做出誠實的評價卻很困難。

Okay, fair enough. Thanks Doug.

好吧，夠公平。謝謝道格。

Thank you. The next question comes from Mr. Nash Herrar(ph). Please state your company name, followed by your question.

謝謝。下一個問題來自 Nash Herrar 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hi gents, good afternoon, Nash Herrar of Citigroup. Two quick questions. Firstly at the end of the second quarter you actively cleaned up your backlog. You took some orders, which were out of the 12-month range and put them off the backlog number. Have you seen a trend from those customers to start pulling those orders back in again?

各位先生，下午好，我是花旗集團的納許‧赫拉爾 (Nash Herrar)。兩個簡單的問題。首先，在第二季末，你們積極清理了積壓的工作。您接手了一些超出 12 個月範圍的訂單，並將它們從積壓訂單數量中剔除。您是否發現這些客戶有再次撤回訂單的趨勢？

Secondly Doug, or Peter, you have highlighted the options program that you started with up to three customers at the end of June, and potentially rising up to six. Would you be able to give us an update on that as well? Thank you.

其次，道格或彼得，您強調了選擇權計劃，該計劃於 6 月底啟動，最多支援 3 名客戶，並有可能增加到 6 名。您能否向我們提供有關該問題的最新消息？謝謝。

On your first part, the quality of the backlog and the fact that we took out what we thought was suspicious or suspect orders and didn't worry you or ourselves with them. I think one or two of those have come back in again, because customers finally came clean and said they wanted them. It is a small amount though, so there isn't much of that. So we still have a very clean backlog in our opinion.

關於您的第一部分，積壓訂單的品質以及我們刪除了我們認為可疑或可疑的訂單並且沒有讓您或我們自己擔心的事實。我認為其中有一兩個又回來了，因為顧客最終坦白說他們想要它們。但數量很少，所以數量不多。因此，我們認為我們仍然有大量積壓工作。

Regarding the options, I will let Peter comment on that.

關於選項，我會讓彼得對此發表評論。

We didn't see any change in the number of customers that have signed up for the program, but we are expecting one or two to be very interested in something like this before the end of the year. So no big changes there in the third quarter.

我們沒有看到註冊該計劃的客戶數量有任何變化，但我們預計在年底之前會有一兩個客戶對這樣的事情非常感興趣。因此第三季不會發生大幅的變化。

That's grand. Thank you very much.

太棒了。非常感謝。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from Mr. Jim Fontanelli(ph). Please state your company name followed by your questions.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Jim Fontanelli 先生（音）。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hi, [indiscernible] Research. My first question, what impact do you think the likely introduction of immersion is going to have on your margin and revenue profile, over the course of the cycle? Is it a benefit?

你好，[音訊不清楚]研究人員。我的第一個問題是，您認為在整個週期中，沉浸式體驗的引入將對您的利潤率和收入狀況產生什麼影響？這是福利嗎？

The answer is yes, for two reasons. It is a more complex tool and I think we will be out there early with a superior product, therefore, the ability to generate somewhat higher margins. Also it extends the economic life of the node. Clearly we benefit from the continuation of the node without having to jump ship and moving to a new node. So it extends 193 potentially by another year or two, and that is very helpful to us.

答案是肯定的，原因有二。這是一種更複雜的工具，我認為我們將儘早推出更優質的產品，因此能夠產生更高的利潤。它也延長了節點的經濟壽命。顯然，我們可以從節點的延續中受益，而不必跳槽並轉移到新節點。因此，193 可能會再延長一兩年，這對我們非常有幫助。

I'll just put a plug in there if I may for our solution to immersion? The fact that we have two chucks(ph) is a serendipitous advantage, because it means that all of the meteorology that has to be done under water with our competitor's products, can be done on the beach so to speak. Our meteorology chuck, therefore we can measure accurately in dry, and then do the imaging under water. Measuring under water is much more complicated and prone to errors for our customers. So you should watch that very carefully with us.

如果可以的話，我可以在那裡插入一個插件來解決沉浸問題嗎？事實上，我們擁有兩個卡盤（ph）是一個意外的優勢，因為這意味著我們競爭對手的產品必須在水下進行的所有氣象學研究，都可以在海灘上進行。我們的氣象卡盤，因此我們可以在乾燥的環境下進行精確測量，然後在水下進行成像。對於我們的客戶來說，水下測量更加複雜，而且容易出錯。所以你應該和我們一起仔細觀察這一點。

Your next question was?

你的下一個問題是？

Sorry, can I just clarify that? Do you expect the margin benefit to be versus the 157 units, which are presumably pushed out by the extension of the immersion? Or versus twin scan without immersion?

抱歉，我可以澄清一下嗎？您是否預計利潤收益會與 157 個單位相比，這 157 個單位可能是由於浸入時間延長而推遲的？或與不浸入的雙掃描相比？

I think the answer is both. It is not certain that 157 will be pushed out actually. That is to be decided, I have my own opinion on that, but that is not for discussion right now. It depends upon the customer's requirements. Those who want 157 will get it, and therefore I imagine we will shift both in parallel. Although I think nature has a way finally of picking the winner through some natural selection process here. The margin will benefit I guess for both reasons.

我認為答案是兩者兼具。目前還不確定157是否會真正推出。這還有待決定，我對此有自己的看法，但現在不討論。這取決於客戶的要求。那些想要 157 的人將會得到它，因此我想我們將同時轉移兩者。儘管我認為大自然最終會透過某種自然選擇過程選出勝利者。我想，由於這兩個原因，利潤率都會受益。

Okay, great. Just quickly can I clarify, on the last question you said a small number. Would that be sub 10 for the scrubbed back re-entering the third quarter?

好的，太好了。我可以快速澄清一下嗎，關於最後一個問題，您說的數字很小。對於重新進入第三節的受傷後衛來說，這會是低於 10 的成績嗎？

Yes, sub 10. Very much sub 10.

是的，低於 10。遠低於 10。

Thank you sir. The next question comes Mr. Jonathan Mennin(ph). Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自喬納森·門寧先生（音）。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Most of my questions have been answered, but I have two small ones. You have said that the signs of recovery you see are riddled with inconsistencies. Apart from the fact that you are getting 50% of the orders in the last week to the quarter, then you might see a bit of weakness after that. Any other glaring inconsistency that you see in this recovery? Are you confident that this is going to shape up as a recovery?

我的大部分問題都已得到解答，但還有兩個小問題。您曾說過，您所看到的復甦跡象充滿矛盾。除了你在本季度最後一周獲得了 50% 的訂單之外，之後你可能會看到一些疲軟。您發現這次復甦中還有其他明顯的不一致之處嗎？您是否相信這將會是一次復甦？

My second follow-up question is - your services revenue seems to have declined quarter-on-quarter, quite a bit if my numbers are right, they could be wrong. I was just wondering what the reason for that could be?

我的第二個後續問題是──你們的服務收入似乎環比下降了不少，如果我的數字正確的話，那可能是錯的。我只是想知道這到底是什麼原因造成的？

The inconsistency part really reflects two things. One is the hesitancy, the conservative approach, the caution, the lack of courage in one sense of our customers in giving anything more than a three to six month, or even two to six month backlog of orders. That is not entirely consistent with previous upturns. This may well be a break the mould situation here. Then there are some more kind of macroeconomic issues around, like in the USA growth, but still a loss of jobs. So many inconsistencies around, that is why I used the phrase riddled inconsistencies. But underneath all of that I am absolutely convinced that the past four quarters of growth for our customers, will continue for some time to come yet. Is that another four quarters, another four years? Time will tell.

不一致部分實際上反映了兩件事。一是我們的客戶猶豫不決、採取保守態度、謹慎態度，在某種意義上缺乏勇氣，不敢給出超過三到六個月甚至兩到六個月的積壓訂單。這與之前的好轉並不完全一致。這很可能是一個打破常規的情況。然後還有一些宏觀經濟問題，例如美國經濟成長，但仍失業。周圍存在著如此多的不一致之處，這就是我使用「充滿矛盾」這句話的原因。但總體而言，我堅信，過去四個季度我們的客戶所實現的成長還將持續一段時間。那是另外四個季度，還是另外四年？時間會證明一切。

Therefore I have enough conviction in what we have seen so far, to say that the upturn that has been actually with the industry now for a year will continue for some time to come. It is a relatively modest upturn by previous standards, and it has not yet hit the equipment industry big time. It may never hit the equipment industry big time. It may be more of a kind of gentle upturn. But let us make no mistake, the backlog that we saw grow in Q3, although to some extent is one offish because of [indiscernible] events of customers, is also indicative. I think the utilization that our customers now experience in their factories, and the growing confidence that they seem to have, makes them a little bit more inclined to splash out and place the orders with companies like ASML.

因此，我對我們迄今為止所看到的情況有足夠的信心，可以肯定地說，該行業實際上已經持續了一年的復甦態勢將在未來一段時間內持續下去。按照先前的標準來看，這是一次相對溫和的復甦，而且尚未對設備產業造成巨大衝擊。它可能永遠不會對設備產業產生巨大影響。這可能更像是一種溫和的上升趨勢。但我們不要誤會，我們看到第三季積壓訂單的成長，儘管在某種程度上是由於客戶的[音訊不清晰]事件造成的，但也具有指示意義。我認為，我們的客戶現在工廠的利用率以及他們似乎日益增強的信心，使他們更傾向於花錢向 ASML 這樣的公司下訂單。

[indiscernible] your question on the service sales that is correct. It has [indiscernible] that it went down. There are two reasons. One reason is that at this time, when customers are focusing on cost reduction in their [indiscernible]. When they come up to the point where they need to renew a service contract, they negotiate contracts with low service levels, so that they can actually [indiscernible] that is one. Also the sales of [indiscernible] options as separate over time. Another reason in this quarter is that we used to have the service business for the track(ph) business, which we saw, which was an integral part of our [indiscernible] service operation, which went up in the second quarter, so you can see the full impact of that in the third.

[音訊不清楚] 您關於服務銷售的問題是正確的。它已經[音訊不清晰]下降了。有兩個原因。原因之一是，目前客戶正專注於降低成本。當他們需要續約服務合約時，他們會協商簽訂服務水平較低的合同，這樣他們實際上就可以[音頻不清晰]，這就是其中之一。此外，[音訊不清晰]選擇權的銷售也是隨著時間的推移而分開的。本季度的另一個原因是，我們曾經擁有軌道業務的服務業務，這是我們[音頻不清晰]服務運營的一個組成部分，該業務在第二季度有所增長，因此您可以在第三季度看到它的全部影響。

Peter if I may ask one more question? The value of option that you are selling, where is it being recorded? Is it in the backlog or in the services?

彼得，我可以再問一個問題嗎？您所出售的選擇權的價值在哪裡記錄？它是在積壓還是在服務中？

You should see the options as a prepayment. It is a financing structure. It gives the holder of that option the right to demand the delivery of a product within a certain time. So it means if you buy an option, which is basically your prepayment [indiscernible], you have a piece of paper that when you hand it in at ASML you know you will get your tool in four or five months. So when you finally ship the tool the option premium will be deducted from the ultimate price of the tool.

您應該將這些選項視為預付款。這是一種融資結構。它賦予期權持有者要求在一定時間內交付產品的權利。所以這意味著如果你購買一個期權，這基本上是你的預付款[音頻不清晰]，你會有一張紙，當你把它交給 ASML 時，你知道你會在四五個月內拿到你的工具。因此，當您最終運送工具時，選擇權費用將從工具的最終價格中扣除。

So every option you sell will have an accompanying entry into your backlog number?

那麼，您出售的每一個選擇權都會在您的積壓訂單數量中附帶一個條目嗎？

No, because it is when they pull it off, is when it starts getting into the backlog. Basically the customer tells us when they want to exercise their co-option.

不，因為當他們完成任務時，任務就開始積壓了。基本上，客戶會告訴我們他們何時想要行使他們的選擇權。

Okay, thank you very much.

好的，非常感謝。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from Mr. Jay Deahna. Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Jay Deahna 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

J P Morgan. If you guys look at your manufacturing slotting activity, does it give you some level of confidence that the bookings for the next quarter or two are going to be reasonably robust and potentially up sequentially in the fourth quarter?

摩根大通。如果你們看一下製造業的開槽活動，是否會給你們一定程度的信心，相信下一兩個季度的訂單量將相當強勁，並且可能在第四季度環比上升？

My second question is, I notice that the backlog on your refurb business is substantially higher. Have you seen a potentially permanent mix shift to higher end refurb systems? That's it, thank you.

我的第二個問題是，我注意到你們的翻新業務積壓訂單量明顯較高。您是否看到潛在的永久性混合轉向更高端的翻新系統？就這樣，謝謝。

Your first question, which I think I understood. The backlog in Q4, the orders on the books in Q4 for delivery over the next 12 months, may well reduce. I don't necessarily think that the order intake will continue at the pace it did in September. Having placed the orders once, they won't place them again for a few more weeks or months, that's for sure. So it is quite likely that our backlog at the year-end may be down. I don't have any concern about that. I think we will still continue to take good solid bookings. I suspect that in one of the first two quarters of next year, we may well have another good booking period to refuel the second part of next year. That is how it is working out these days with our customer's kind of characteristics. Does that take your first part, did I understand you correctly?

您的第一個問題，我想我已經理解了。第四季的積壓訂單，即第四季度已登記併計劃在未來 12 個月內交付的訂單，可能會減少。我並不認為訂單量會繼續保持九月的速度。一旦下了訂單，他們肯定不會在幾週或幾個月內再次下訂單。因此，我們年底的積壓訂單很可能會減少。我對此並不擔心。我認為我們仍將繼續獲得良好的預訂。我認為明年前兩個季度中的某個季度，我們可能會有另一個良好的預訂期來為明年下半年加油。這就是我們現在根據客戶的特質所採取的措施。這是否是您的第一部分，我理解得對嗎？

Is that commentary based on your slot [indiscernible] plan, right now, which comes before hard copy purchase orders? Or are you just basically being conservative and if your customers decide to get excited as the quarter progresses, then potentially that could be different to the other direction?

該評論是否基於您目前的時段[音訊不清晰]計劃，該計劃先於硬拷貝採購訂單？或者您只是基本上持保守態度，如果您的客戶決定隨著季度進展而感到興奮，那麼可能會與其他方向有所不同？

You must come and visit us again Jay. We don't have a slot list these days, we have moved to newer and better ways of planning our production. So far let me just say that, although we had a good surge of orders at the end of Q3, we have had to disappoint no customer with deliveries. I don't imagine that is going to be the situation for some time yet.

傑伊，你一定要再來看我們。現在我們沒有節目單，我們已經轉向更新、更好的方式來規劃我們的製作。到目前為止，我只想說，儘管我們在第三季末的訂單量激增，但我們的交貨量並沒有讓任何客戶失望。我認為這種情況還不會持續太久。

Then on the refurb?

那麼翻新嗎？

What we have seen Jay is an increase of the refurb. We have seen a couple of things there. One is that the activity level of refurb systems, or secondhand systems, or used tools as we call them, has gone up over the last quarter. That is an indication that there is a need for some of those tools, and it is not all like we used to see, Steppers, it is definitely also used Scanners. Which means that there is a certain capacity need for those tools, but the customers don't have the CAPEX budget. So they still try to extend their capacity without paying the full amount for a new tool.

我們看到 Jay 的翻新工作有所增加。我們在那裡看到了一些事情。一是翻新系統、二手系統或我們所說的舊工具的活動水準在過去一個季度有所上升。這表明需要其中一些工具，而且它們並不像我們以前看到的步進機那樣，肯定也使用掃描器。這意味著這些工具有一定的容量需求，但客戶沒有資本支出預算。因此，他們仍試圖擴大產能，但又不支付新工具的全部費用。

That is a trend that we have seen over the last two to four months. Will that continue going forward, that potential, the availability of those tools? The reason why we started giving the refurb information in the backlog is that now for the first time we are seeing secondhand demand or used demand for Scanners, which, of course, sell at a significantly higher price than the Steppers. Which used to be the only used business that we had.

這是我們在過去兩到四個月中看到的趨勢。這些工具的潛力和可用性是否會持續下去？我們開始在積壓中提供翻新資訊的原因是，現在我們第一次看到二手需求或舊掃描器的需求，當然，它們的售價比步行機高得多。這曾經是我們唯一的業務。

Yes there are a few trends. It is trending from Steppers and also into the Scanner world. There is some more activity. That means that there is more demand and more opportunity for us to book and to ship those systems.

是的，確實存在一些趨勢。這種趨勢從步進機開始一直延續到掃描器領域。還有一些活動。這意味著我們預訂和運送這些系統的需求更大，機會也更多。

Are your margins higher on the refurb Scanners?

翻新掃描器的利潤率是否更高？

It is very different. The secondhand business is a fast turn around business. It is driven by the demand from our customers and our ability to get a tool, a Stepper or a Scanner quickly. In one instance you will be able to find it quickly and get a good margin, in another instance you don't have a very good margin but you satisfy a customer. So it is very lumpy, it is not something that we control very well. It all depends on the demand and the availability of the tools.

這是非常不同的。二手生意是快速週轉的生意。這是由我們客戶的需求以及我們快速獲取工具、步進機或掃描器的能力所驅動的。在一種情況下，您將能夠快速找到它並獲得良好的利潤，而在另一種情況下，您的利潤雖然不是很好，但您卻讓客戶滿意。所以它非常不穩定，我們無法很好地控制它。這一切都取決於需求和工具的可用性。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thank you very much sir. The next question comes from Mr. Nicholas Gaudois. Please state your company name followed by your question.

非常感謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Nicholas Gaudois 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Deutsche Bank. My first question on the order backlog. In terms of the orders you saw in Q3, were there any that were incremental surprises from what you were expecting initially, for orders for the whole of the second half of this year? Or again is it purely timing in terms of the strength?

德意志銀行。我的第一個問題是關於訂單積壓。就您在第三季看到的訂單而言，與最初預期相比，今年下半年整個訂單是否有所增加，有哪些驚喜？或者這只是強度方面的時機問題？

My follow-up question is on product margins for Twin Scan(ph)?

我的後續問題是關於 Twin Scan(ph) 的產品利潤率嗎？

Mostly timing.

主要是時間問題。

Mostly timing okay. We don't get every mix quite right, and the customer sometimes comes through for a few more. I would say there were more positives than negatives this time around. In the past they have been negotiating for maybe 10 systems and they will end up placing orders for 8. This time they negotiated for 10 and they ended up placing orders for 11 or 12. So I you like, the trend has gone on the upside, rather than the downside, but it was mostly a timing issue.

大部分時間都還好。我們無法將每種混合物都做得非常完美，有時客戶會要求更多。我想說，這次的正面比負面的方面多。過去他們曾就大約 10 個系統進行過談判，但最終他們只訂購了 8 個。這次他們協商訂購了 10 份，但最終訂購了 11 或 12 份。所以我喜歡，趨勢是向上而不是向下，但這主要是一個時機問題。

Great. In terms of product margins. You have [indiscernible] recently that your cost for the Twin Scan could come down into 2004, due to both redesigning and also use of dual supplies for mechanical parts in particular. Could you elaborate a bit and tell us about how much you think costs could decline for a Twin Scan next year?

偉大的。就產品利潤率而言。您最近[音訊不清晰]表示，由於重新設計以及特別是機械部件使用雙重供應，您的 Twin Scan 成本可能會降至 2004 年。您能否詳細說明一下並告訴我們您認為明年雙胞胎掃描的成本會下降多少？

I don't think with respect, we will give this information to you. It is a competitive position we are in right now. Let me just confirm to you, we have very well put together plans for cost reductions for the next two years actually, not just for the next 12 months. Some are far reaching, some are less far reaching. They will ensure that we can maintain and support the kind of margins we used to get in the peak periods, once the volume recovers. The volume is a key [indiscernible]. But we certainly are not going to discuss the kind of cost reduction percentages that we have identified for our product, no I'm afraid not.

我認為，出於尊重，我們不會將這些資訊提供給您。這是我們目前所處的競爭地位。我只想向你確認一下，我們實際上已經制定了未來兩年的成本削減計劃，而不僅僅是未來 12 個月的計劃。有些影響深遠，有些影響則沒那麼深遠。他們將確保一旦銷售恢復，我們就能維持並支持我們在高峰期獲得的利潤率。音量是關鍵[音訊不清晰]。但我們肯定不會討論我們為產品確定的成本降低百分比，恐怕不會。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thank you very much sir. The next question comes from Mr. Ali Irani. Please state your company name followed by your question.

非常感謝您，先生。下一個問題來自阿里·伊拉尼先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Good afternoon gentlemen. Ali Irani with CIBC World Markets. I have a number of questions for you. One, I was hoping Doug that you could talk a little bit about the swing factor at year-end. A number of your competitors or peers in the equipment business are talking about some fab activity that's [indiscernible] to book, either early January or early December. I am wondering if you have taken this into account yet in your expectations for bookings and backlog in the fourth quarter?

先生們，下午好。加拿大帝國商業銀行世界市集 (CIBC World Markets) 的 Ali Irani。我有幾個問題想問你。首先，我希望道格你能稍微談談年底的波動因素。你們在設備業務領域的許多競爭對手或同行正在談論一些可以在 1 月初或 12 月初預訂的晶圓廠活動。我想知道您在對第四季度的預訂量和積壓訂單量進行預期時是否已經考慮到了這一點？

Yes I think we have. I have kind of hinted and said that I think the backlog could well reduce in the fourth quarter as we ship off it and don't replace it because of timing of next big buys. I think they could well come in Q1 of next year.

是的，我想我們有。我曾暗示並說過，我認為積壓訂單在第四季度可能會減少，因為我們會將其發貨，並且不會因為下次大宗採購的時間而進行替換。我認為他們很可能會在明年第一季上市。

So Doug, your bat right now is those for you, the swing orders would come in the January onwards time frame?

那麼 Doug，你現在的球棒就是這些，揮棒順序會在一月之後的時間範圍內出現嗎？

We don't get that kind of [indiscernible] data, but it isn't going to come in Q4 I am pretty sure.

我們沒有得到那種[音訊不清晰]數據，但我相當確定它不會在第四季度出現。

Peter, I am hoping that you could give us a little bit more perspective on the cost structure. In addition to the head count reduction; you have been on a very aggressive swing to adopt new suppliers in the US in particular. I am hoping you can give us some granularity there. Finally Peter also on pricing, with the...

彼得，我希望您能為我們提供更多關於成本結構的觀點。除了裁員之外；您一直在積極地引進新的供應商，尤其是在美國。我希望您能為我們提供一些詳細資訊。最後，Peter 還談到了定價，...

The cost structure on the product, do you mean?

您指的是產品的成本結構嗎？

On the supply side, the cost of goods, exactly. Also if you could give us an idea of pricing and whether, like [indiscernible] last night you are seeing OEMs like yourselves take a firmer stance on pricing?

從供應方面來看，確切地說是商品成本。另外，您能否向我們介紹一下定價情況，以及是否像昨晚 [音頻不清晰] 一樣，您是否看到像您這樣的 OEM 對定價採取了更為堅定的立場？

You mean the OEMs being the suppliers to the industry?

您的意思是 OEM 是該行業的供應商嗎？

Exactly. ASML for example.

確切地。以 ASML 為例。

People like us.

像我們這樣的人。

We always take a firm stand on pricing that is my first comment on the last part of your question there. Our stand hasn't shifted on that one. I guess in one or two occasions in the past 12 months or 3 or 4 even, we have been more inclined to consider strategic order taking and therefore buys from our customers. But we still maintain a price premium over our competition, and we still have an intention to maintain that for the rest of our natural lives or even beyond.

我們對定價始終持堅定立場，這是我對你問題最後一部分的第一個評論。在這一點上我們的立場沒有改變。我想，在過去 12 個月甚至 3、4 個月中，有一兩次我們更傾向於考慮策略性訂單，從而從客戶那裡購買。但我們仍然保持著高於競爭對手的價格，並且我們仍然打算在餘生甚至更長時間內保持這種價格優勢。

Without going into a lot of detail, because as you understand if we give out very detailed information about our cost of goods reduction and the percentage of total cost, that would benefit our competitors we think. But what I can tell you, because the goods reduction are focusing now mainly on the redesigned. You basically make the tool more efficient. We have not doubt about the effectiveness of our tool, as a matter of fact the reliability of the Twin Head Scan is now above what we actually planned. So the cost of goods reduction is really an effort encompassing all elements and all modules that form our tools. It is largely driven by the redesign efforts of the mechanical parts, of the electronic parts and also including the lens. I don't think I want to give more focus there but it is going to be substantial, that is why we feel that we can safely say that at least for the next two quarters we do anticipate an improving gross profit.

無需贅述，因為正如您所知，如果我們提供有關商品成本降低和總成本百分比的非常詳細的信息，我們認為這將使我們的競爭對手受益。但我可以告訴你，因為商品減價現在主要集中在重新設計上。您基本上使該工具變得更加高效。我們對於工具的有效性毫不懷疑，事實上雙頭掃描的可靠性現在已經超出了我們實際計劃的水平。因此，降低商品成本實際上是一項涵蓋構成我們工具的所有要素和所有模組的努力。這很大程度上是由機械部件、電子部件以及鏡頭的重新設計所推動的。我認為我不想把更多的注意力放在那裡，但它將會是實質性的，這就是為什麼我們覺得我們可以有把握地說，至少在接下來的兩個季度，我們確實預計毛利會有所提高。

Sorry, we are running out of time. I'd like to try and give everyone a chance. If there is time at the end Ali you are welcome back to ask your next question.

抱歉，我們的時間不多了。我想嘗試給每個人一個機會。如果最後還有時間，阿里，歡迎你回來提出下一個問題。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from Christina Osmena. Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自克里斯蒂娜·奧斯梅納。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Christina Osmena with Needham & Company. If you are willing Doug, could you gives us a revenue split for the third quarter between [indiscernible] 193 and 248 please?

克里斯蒂娜·奧斯梅納 (Christina Osmena) 與 Needham & Company 合作。道格，如果你願意的話，你能告訴我們第三季度在 [音頻不清晰] 193 和 248 之間的收入分配情況嗎？

Secondly, if you were expecting the timing of the next big orders to occur in Q1 and shipments have already been - [indiscernible] have already taken place for six months out. What kind of lead times do you think those Q1 orders are going to have to have to reflect?

其次，如果您預計下一批大訂單將在第一季發生，而發貨已經 - [音訊不清晰] 已經進行了六個月。您認為這些 Q1 訂單需要反映什麼樣的交貨時間？

If I take your second one first, one of my colleagues is looking at that split you asked for between I-line(ph) and so on.

如果我先拿你的第二個，我的一位同事就會查看你要求的 I-line(ph) 之間的分割，等等。

I explained that the backlog of 91 systems, €850m or so is 85% required(ph) in the next two quarters. We run out of steam, if you like, in Q2 of next year. So we are expecting to take orders, continuing orders all the time. But if there are any more peaks late this year, early next year, by my guess, they will begin to fill up the Q2 and Q3 backlog. The kind of lead time we are getting is sometimes aggressively two or three months, but certainly three to eight months is a kind of lead time we are being given these days by customers. Which puts us under pressure around production, but that is the kind of pressure we like these days, after the last two or three years of famine, that we have been suffering from.

我解釋說，91 個系統的積壓訂單，約 8.5 億歐元，是未來兩個季度所需的 85% (ph)。如果你願意的話，我們將在明年第二季失去動力。因此，我們期待著接到訂單，並且一直接到持續的訂單。但如果今年年底、明年年初出現更多高峰，我猜測，它們將開始填補第二季和第三季的積壓訂單。我們獲得的交貨時間有時長達兩三個月，但目前客戶給我們的交貨時間肯定是三到八個月。這給我們的生產帶來了壓力，但這正是我們現在喜歡的壓力，在過去兩三年的飢荒之後，我們一直在承受這種壓力。

Regarding the split between technology, I think we are going to have to draw a blank today in this room. We give it six monthly. So we will give it to you at the end of the year, for the six-month period. But I would suggest it has not changed substantially from the middle of the year point. I have probably swung towards 193 a little bit.

關於技術之間的分歧，我認為我們今天在這個房間裡將不得不陷入一片空白。我們每六個月進行一次。所以我們會在年底把它交給你，為期六個月。但我認為從今年年中開始情況並沒有實質變化。我可能已經稍微轉向 193 了。

Okay, thank you.

好的，謝謝。

Thank you. The next question comes from Mr. Stuart Adrian. Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝。下一個問題來自 Stuart Adrian 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hi. Morgan Stanley. Post Q2 you mentioned two real things that gave you some confidence for the second half, in terms of ordering would be better than the first half. First off with five or six big projects and secondly you talk about the release of 2004 capital spending budgets. Do you think that we have seen all of the projects that you expected in the second half of the year already in Q3? Or do you think there is more to go in Q4?

你好。摩根士丹利。在第二季之後，您提到了兩件真實的事情，這讓您對下半年有了一些信心，就訂購而言，下半年會比上半年更好。首先是五、六個大項目，其次是發布2004年資本支出預算。您是否認為我們在第三季就已經看到了您預期在下半年出現的所有項目？或者您認為第四季還有更多事情要做？

In terms of '04 spending budgets, again the same type of question. Have you seen the majority of what you expect, or do you think that's really going to be a fourth quarter phenomenon?

就 2004 年支出預算而言，又是同一類型的問題。您是否看到了您所期望的大部分結果，或者您是否認為這真的會成為第四季度的現象？

We haven't seen all the deals come through yet Stuart. We are going to book quite a bit in Q4, probably we will bill more than we will book, probably, who knows on the timing issue. Therefore I keep saying the backlog may go down, it will not be a great concern to me from kind of a structural point of view.

斯圖爾特，我們還沒有看到所有交易都完成。我們將在第四季度預訂相當多的訂單，可能我們的帳單金額會比預訂金額還多，可能，誰知道時間問題呢。因此，我一直說積壓數量可能會減少，從結構角度來看，這對我來說不是一個大問題。

I think the release of customer capital budgets, which takes place in October/November, [indiscernible] now kind of thing; they are firming up their budgeting plans and so on. We will see that translating into orders for our Q2 and Q3 probably at the end of this year, a bit of it, and some of it at the beginning of next year, which is why I think we are going to see the order ramp. I could be wrong in a pleasant sense and see it all happening Q4, I don't kind of believe that will be the case. I think it is going to come through into Q1 next year.

我認為，客戶資本預算的發布（通常在 10 月/11 月）是現在這樣的；他們正在確定預算計劃等等。我們可能會在今年年底看到這些訂單轉化為我們第二季和第三季的訂單，一部分會在今年年底，一部分會在明年年初，這就是我認為我們會看到訂單增加的原因。從令人愉快的意義上來說，我可能是錯的，並且看到這一切都發生在第四季度，但我不太相信情況會是這樣。我認為它將會在明年第一季實現。

Peter, just in terms of operating working capital expectations for Q4. How do you expect inventories and accounts receivable and payable to move?

彼得，僅就第四季的營運資本預期而言。您預計庫存和應收帳款及應付帳款將如何變動？

As you saw in Q3, both the gross working capital elements, accounts receivable and inventories went down. Also a turnover of sales and cost of goods. I think that trend will continue in the fourth quarter. What you saw in the third quarter was that we used about €49m in cash from operations, but that has to do with the fact that we basically paid off some accrued liabilities, for instance the appeal case, which we accrued over the last 12 months, we were paid in the third quarter. There were some restructuring charges paid in the third quarter, so I would [indiscernible] incidental payments in the third quarter referring to those items of about €60m. I think the trend will continue and we will generate cash in the fourth quarter.

正如您在第三季看到的，總營運資本要素、應收帳款和庫存均下降了。還有銷售營業額和商品成本。我認為這一趨勢將在第四季持續下去。您在第三季度看到的是，我們使用了大約 4900 萬歐元的營運現金，但這與我們基本上償還了一些應計負債有關，例如，我們在過去 12 個月內累積的上訴案件，我們在第三季度獲得了支付。第三季支付了一些重組費用，因此，我將在第三季支付與這些項目相關的約 6,000 萬歐元的附帶費用。我認為這種趨勢將會持續下去，我們將在第四季產生現金。

Great, thanks.

太好了，謝謝。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from Mr. Michael Bryant. Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自邁克爾·布萊恩特先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Michael Bryant from Sound View. Doug I think I heard you say something to the effect that Taiwan may start to build itself again over the next few quarters. Does that mean that the boundaries haven't started to order in any kind of major way, so they were not part of the surprise to orders in the third quarter?

來自 Sound View 的邁克爾布萊恩特。道格，我想我聽到您說過類似這樣的話：台灣可能在未來幾季內開始恢復建設。這是否意味著邊界尚未開始以任何主要方式進行訂購，因此它們不是第三季訂單意外的一部分？

You have a way of putting words in my mouth. In fact there was some foundry(ph) business in our third quarter numbers. It is also a fact, if you look at our distribution of backlog that it is still un-typically Taiwan light. My comment was merely focused on that. I think we will see growth the memory segment continuing and we'll see growth in the foundry segment continuing to pick up. It has peaked and run a little bit faster. We had significant sales in China also, which is foundry as well, by the way, as you recognized.

你很會把話塞到我嘴裡。事實上，我們第三季的數據中有一些代工業務。事實上，如果你看一下我們的積壓分佈，你會發現它仍然不是典型的台灣光。我的評論僅僅集中於此。我認為我們將看到記憶體領域持續成長，並且我們將看到代工領域的成長繼續回升。它已經達到頂峰並且運行速度稍快一些。順便說一句，正如您所承認的，我們在中國也有相當可觀的銷售額，包括代工業務。

Understood. I was talking about the Taiwan foundries on rebuilding themselves.

明白了。我剛才談到了台灣鑄造廠的自我重建。

Could you talk a little bit about 193nm competition? Are you seeing any increase there or do you still think you have a pretty sizeable lead?

能談談 193nm 的競爭嗎？您是否看到了任何成長，或者您仍然認為自己擁有相當大的領先優勢？

Yes, I am bound to say I think we have a sizeable lead. I really believe that as well, but I am bound to say it anyway. There is competition, it is primarily a paper competition, but still it can be effective. You know we have glass and steel that works and the competition has - compared to our specification products, still paper replicas of glass and steel that might work in the future. I guess they will work ultimately. But still when the sharpness of urgent demand from our customer is not there, and they can afford to wait a quarter or two, a paper solution can sometimes look attractive and at least stall him placing the order. So we have to compete with that, but when it comes down to imaging on real silicon with 193, I believe we could modestly say that we have a significant advantage over the competition, whoever they may be.

是的，我必須要說，我認為我們領先優勢很大。我確實也相信這一點，但無論如何我都必須這麼說。存在競爭，雖然主要是紙面競爭，但仍然可以有效。您知道，我們擁有可用的玻璃和鋼材，而與我們的規格產品相比，競爭對手仍然提供未來可能可用的玻璃和鋼材的紙質複製品。我想他們最終會成功的。但是，當客戶的緊急需求並不強烈，並且可以等待一兩個季度時，紙質解決方案有時看起來很有吸引力，至少可以阻止他下訂單。所以我們必須與之競爭，但是當談到使用 193 在真正的矽上進行成像時，我相信我們可以謙虛地說，無論競爭對手是誰，我們都具有明顯的優勢。

Okay, thanks a lot.

好的，非常感謝。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from Mr. Andrew Griffin. Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自安德魯·格里芬先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hi, I'm with Merrill Lynch. A question for Peter. I wonder if you could just run through your cash flow objectives that you set at your analyst meeting, just over a year ago, and just talk about how that has panned out over the last 12 months please?

你好，我是美林證券的。問彼得一個問題。我想知道您是否可以簡單介紹一下您在一年多前的分析師會議上設定的現金流目標，並談談過去 12 個月的進展？

If you take those cash flow objectives and look where we are now. We had a target of €500m and we have beaten that target, close to €700m. The problem that we currently have is that at that time we did not foresee the operating loss that we have incurred in this year, because of the market. I think this is a big difference. If we look at the working capital element of it, we have met that 12-month target. But the operating line was significantly worse than we expected at the time.

如果你把這些現金流目標考慮進去，看看我們現在的狀況。我們的目標是 5 億歐元，現在已經超額完成了目標，接近 7 億歐元。我們目前面臨的問題是，當時我們並未預見今年因市場原因而產生的營運損失。我認為這是一個很大的區別。如果我們看一下其中的營運資金要素，我們已經實現了 12 個月的目標。但營運狀況明顯比我們當時預期的要差。

Are there going to be any other one-off tax effects? I know there were some deferred tax effects in the last 12 months.

還會產生其他一次性稅收影響嗎？我知道過去 12 個月存在一些遞延稅項影響。

No.

不。

So basically working capital and your operating profit are going to be the keys going forward?

所以基本上營運資金和營業利潤將成為未來的關鍵？

Yes.

是的。

Thanks very much.

非常感謝。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from Mr. Ori(ph) Paltar(ph). Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自 Ori(ph) Paltar(ph) 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Hello, I'm with Lehman Brothers. Two quick questions, I was just wondering whether cost of goods sold benefited from the head count reductions in Q3, and whether I can model OPEX, SG&A plus R&D at around €110m in Q4? Then I have one quick follow-up.

您好，我是雷曼兄弟的。兩個簡單的問題，我只是想知道銷售成本是否受益於第三季的員工人數減少，以及我是否可以將第四季度的營運支出、銷售、一般及行政費用加上研發費用估算為 1.1 億歐元左右？然後我有一個快速的後續問題。

On the cost of goods side, that has not benefited yet from the announced reductions. As we said most of the reductions will take place in the Netherlands and we foresee some delay in the implementation. The last part of your question was?

從商品成本方面來看，尚未從宣布的降價中受益。正如我們所說，大部分減排措施將在荷蘭實施，我們預計實施過程將會延遲。你的問題的最後一部分是什麼？

Operating expenses, SG&A, R&D, should I model €110m roughly flat for Q4 or will that move higher?

營運費用、銷售、一般及行政費用、研發費用，我是否應該將第四季的預測定為 1.1 億歐元，大致持平，還是會上升？

I think we can model what we have seen now in the third quarter, where R&D is probably going to be going forward between €65m and €70m a quarter and SG&A between €50m and €55m. That depends really on the R&D side, on the timing of some of the material.

我認為我們可以模擬我們現在在第三季度看到的情況，其中研發費用可能每季在 6500 萬歐元至 7000 萬歐元之間，銷售、一般及行政費用在 5000 萬歐元至 5500 萬歐元之間。這實際上取決於研發方面以及某些材料的時機。

Okay. One quick one on the options. If I understand it correctly, basically you are using the down payment to buy certain long-lead time items?

好的。關於選項，簡單介紹一下。如果我理解正確的話，基本上您是使用首付款來購買某些長交貨期的物品？

That is correct.

沒錯。

Therefore reducing the lead-time for your customers. Should we then not expect as more customers sign up for that, that your order intake will - the amount of customers queuing in slots becomes less and less. Therefore the order backlog numbers will tend to be lower than they perhaps were historically, and therefore also your long-term visibility will tend to be lower?

從而減少客戶的交貨時間。那麼，我們是否應該期望，隨著越來越多的客戶註冊，您的訂單量將會 - 排隊的客戶數量會越來越少。因此，訂單積壓數量可能會低於歷史水平，因此您的長期可見度也會降低？

One, I think the effect of the program is still marginal. But it will have a significant number of customer sign-up that will at least mean that we would have increased the flexibility, because we would have secured the long-lead time items. That is up to the customer, when they want to call the option. You always have the issue where you have a lot of customers doing that, and they all come at the same time. It will give pressure on the factory, but that is not the situation right now. I don't think that program has an impact right now on our backlog or on the visibility that we currently have.

第一，我認為該計劃的效果仍然不顯著。但它將擁有大量的客戶註冊，這至少意味著我們將增加靈活性，因為我們將獲得長交貨期的物品。這取決於客戶何時想要呼叫該選項。你總是會遇到這樣的問題：有很多顧客會這樣做，而且他們都同時來。這會給工廠帶來壓力，但現在情況並非如此。我認為該計劃目前不會對我們的積壓工作或我們目前的知名度產生影響。

Thank you.

謝謝。

I think we have time for only one or two more questioners' operator.

我認為我們只剩下時間再接聽一兩位提問者的電話了。

Thank you sir. The next question comes from [indiscernible]. Please state your company name followed by your question.

謝謝您，先生。下一個問題來自[音訊不清楚]。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

I have a follow-up on the gross margin please. Can you tell us how much of the improvement in Q3 was due to improvement in 200mm margins?

我想了解一下毛利率的情況。您能否告訴我們第三季的改善有多少是由於 200 毫米利潤率的提高？

Also, where do 300mm gross margin stand versus 200mm products?

另外，與 200mm 產品相比，300mm 產品的毛利率如何？

I think the improvements were largely in the 300mm field, because it concerns cost reductions. Those are most prominently in 300mm. I don't think we are going to give any break down on the profitability of 200mm and 300mm margins, because of competitive reasons. But generally 200mm margins have always been higher than 300mm. 300mm is improving that's as far as I'm going to go.

我認為改進主要集中在 300 毫米領域，因為這關係到成本的降低。其中最突出的是 300 毫米。由於競爭原因，我認為我們不會對 200 毫米和 300 毫米利潤率進行任何細分。但一般來說，200mm的邊距總是高於300mm。 300mm 不斷改進，這是我能達到的極限。

Okay. Just another quick question on your breakeven target of 130 units. Is this the order of the day? What are the measures that you are going to take beyond the workforce reduction, to reach this target?

好的。關於您的 130 個單位的損益平衡目標，我還有另一個簡單的問題。這是當務之急嗎？除了裁員之外，您還打算採取什麼措施來實現這一目標？

This target was mentioned taking into account the workforce reduction, but also as we mentioned last quarter, we have an efficiency action going on, which means we are consolidating certain operations. We are selling off buildings that we don't need, so it is a comprehensive package which includes lay offs and includes the reduction in the number of people, so you could say that €130m break even target is still there.

提出這一目標是考慮到裁員，但正如我們上個季度所提到的，我們正在採取效率行動，這意味著我們正在整合某些業務。我們正在出售不需要的建築，所以這是一個綜合性的方案，包括裁員和減少員工數量，所以你可以說 1.3 億歐元的收支平衡目標仍然存在。

The only thing that we want to mention is that here in the Netherlands, because of the anticipated delay of the execution of the program here, is that the €130m break even point will be reached at about a quarter later than we anticipated.

我們唯一想提的是，在荷蘭，由於預計該計劃的執行會延遲，達到 1.3 億歐元的收支平衡點將比我們預期的晚一個季度左右。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Now, one last question please.

現在，請問最後一個問題。

Ladies and gentlemen, the last question will be from Mr. Sekar Hominick. Please state your company name followed by your question.

女士們、先生們，最後一個問題來自 Sekar Hominick 先生。請說明您的公司名稱，然後提出您的問題。

Good afternoon. Prudential.

午安.保誠。

Doug, a question. First of all congratulations on a very, very impressive order number. My sense of view is 53 new units and previously we were expecting 27 to 30. Is there a risk that [indiscernible] that the new orders in Q4 are going to be lower than what you had in Q3, likely to be lower - is there a risk that basically we inverted Q3 into Q4? So it could be as low as 30 or so?

道格，有一個問題。首先恭喜您獲得了非常令人印象深刻的訂單號碼。我預計會有 53 個新單位，而之前我們預計會有 27 到 30 個。是否存在這樣的風險，即 [音頻不清晰] 第四季度的新訂單量會低於第三季度，甚至可能更低 - 是否存在這樣的風險，即我們基本上將第三季度顛倒為第四季度？那麼它可能低至 30 左右嗎？

First of all, thanks for your compliments on the order intake. It happens that our EVP of Sales is here, so I will pass your compliments directly on to him. Dave?

首先，感謝您對訂單量的讚揚。碰巧我們的銷售執行副總裁也在這裡，所以我會直接向他轉達您的讚美。戴夫？

All for one silly compliment?

就為了一句愚蠢的讚美？

Chasing funds in the last thirteen quarters.

過去十三個季度的追逐基金。

I think that the number of orders that we will take in this half year are probably at the top side of our expectation. Quite frankly I don't get too excited about whether the order comes in during the last week in September, or the first week in October. To me it is incidental.

我認為我們這半年接到的訂單數量可能已經超出我們的預期了。坦白說，我並不太關心訂單是在九月的最後一周還是十月的第一周到達。對我來說這只是偶然。

Getting the orders in [indiscernible] means a lot to you guys, and to you guys and my CFO because we stop the clock on the end of September and we will measure ourselves then. But that is a fictitious situation really.

在 [音訊不清晰] 獲得訂單對你們來說意義重大，對你們和我的財務長來說也是如此，因為我們會在 9 月底停止計時，然後我們會衡量自己。但這確實是一種虛構的情況。

So I am delighted by the way we are taking orders from new and old customers and by the [indiscernible] acceptance, and I just encourage my colleague Dave Chavoustie of Sales here, to bring all those orders in as quick as he can. We don't hold any orders back. We bring them in. We drag in through the door, screaming, so to speak, every day of every month of every quarter and that will continue through Q4 as well. We will see what Q4 [indiscernible] do for us as we go through the quarter.

因此，我很高興看到我們接受新舊客戶的訂單，並得到了[音訊不清晰]的接受，我只是鼓勵我的銷售同事 Dave Chavoustie 盡快完成所有這些訂單。我們不會保留任何訂單。我們把他們帶進來。我們拖著腳步走進門，大聲疾呼，可以說，每季、每個月的每一天都是如此，這種情況也將持續到第四季。隨著本季的推進，我們將看到 Q4 [音訊不清晰] 為我們帶來什麼。

It could be that they come battling in like they did in Q3, or that there is a bit of a [indiscernible] so that they all come piling in in Q1 of next year, and I am not going to get too excited by either of those two outcomes, because we will know the status through our discussions with customers so finally to take a snapshot of one particular moment in time is just for you analysts, who have to try and deduce from that.

可能是他們像第三季度那樣互相爭鬥，也可能是出現一些 [音頻不清晰] 的情況，以至於他們都會在明年第一季度蜂擁而至，而我對這兩種結果都不會感到太興奮，因為我們將通過與客戶的討論了解情況，所以最終對某個特定時刻進行快照只是為了讓你們分析師知道，你們必須嘗試從中推斷出來。

It is fairly easy for us because we know what is happening with customers in real time.

這對我們來說相當容易，因為我們即時知道客戶發生的情況。

So what you are really saying is that you didn't really see the broadening of projects, but projects were well identified and you got those early?

所以你真正的意思是，你並沒有真正看到專案的擴大，但是專案已經很好地確定了，而且你很早就得到了它們？

They were well identified. We got them somewhat earlier than we anticipated. That's great. Not for any real tangible insightful reason, just if you look at the timing and they all came in a little bit bigger than we thought, which is the good news. It means that our customers really were going out to bid for ten and then finding out that they needed eleven or twelve, which I think is a very positive sign. We should take some heart from that.

他們的身份已經很清楚了。我們比預期的要早一些收到它們。那太棒了。不是因為任何真正有形的深刻原因，只是如果你看一下時間，你會發現它們都比我們想像的要大一些，這是好消息。這意味著我們的客戶實際上出去競標十個，然後發現他們需要十一個或十二個，我認為這是一個非常積極的信號。我們應該為此感到振奮。

One last tactical question. We talked of a big increase in MPU numbers. My sense is that is of the 800 [indiscernible] gorilla. It is maybe 200 [indiscernible] gorilla. Am I right? A family of gorillas.

最後一個戰術問題。我們談到了 MPU 數量的大幅增加。我的感覺是，那是 800 隻 [音頻不清晰] 大猩猩。可能有 200 隻 [音訊不清楚] 大猩猩。我說得對嗎？一群大猩猩。

There are a whole lot of gorillas out there. There is a whole lot of monkey business around. I will let you speculate on that yourself.

那裡有很多大猩猩。周圍有很多猴子在搞鬼。我讓你自己去猜測這一點。

Thank you operator. Thank you for dialing in and spending your time with us.

謝謝接線生。感謝您撥通電話並花時間與我們溝通。

Ladies and gentlemen. This concludes the ASML half year results 2003 conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

女士們，先生們。ASML 2003 年上半年業績電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。