聯華電子 (UMC) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Welcome, everyone, to UMC's 2025 First Quarter Earnings Conference Call. (Operator Instructions) For your information, this conference call is now being broadcasted live over the Internet. Webcast replay will be available within an hour after the conference is finished. Please visit our website, www.umc.com, under the Investor Relations, Investors, Events section.

歡迎大家參加聯華電子 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）供您參考，本次電話會議現在正在透過網路現場直播。會議結束後一小時內將提供網路直播重播。請造訪我們的網站 www.umc.com，其「投資者關係」、「投資者」和「活動」部分。

Now I would like to introduce Mr. David Wong, Investor Relations Manager of UMC. Mr. Wong, please begin.

現在我想介紹聯華電子投資者關係經理 David Wong 先生。請黃先生開始。

Welcome to UMC's conference call for the first quarter of 2025. I'm joined by Mr. Chi-Tung Liu, CFO of UMC; and Mr. Michael Lin, Senior Director of Finance, because President Wang is absent due to urgent personal matter. In a moment, our CFO will present our first quarter financial results, followed by our key message to address UMC's focus and second quarter 2025 guidance.

歡迎參加聯華電子 2025 年第一季電話會議。與我一起參加的是聯華電子財務長劉啟東先生；以及財務高級總監林邁克爾先生，因為王總裁因緊急個人事務缺席。稍後，我們的財務長將介紹我們的第一季財務業績，然後傳達我們的關鍵訊息，即聯華電子的重點和 2025 年第二季的指導。

After our CFO's remarks, there will be a Q&A session. UMC's quarterly financial reports are available at our website, www.umc.com, under the Investors Financial section. During this conference, we may make forward-looking statements based on management's current expectations and beliefs. These forward-looking statements are subject to a number of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially, including the risks that may be beyond the company's control. For a more detailed description of these risks and uncertainties, please refer to our recent and subsequent filings with the SEC and the ROC securities authorities.

我們的財務長發言後，將有一個問答環節。聯華電子的季度財務報告可在我們的網站 www.umc.com 的「投資者財務」部分找到。在這次會議期間，我們可能會根據管理層目前的期望和信念做出前瞻性陳述。這些前瞻性陳述受到許多風險和不確定因素的影響，可能導致實際結果大不相同，包括可能超出公司控制範圍的風險。有關這些風險和不確定性的更詳細描述，請參閱我們最近和隨後向美國證券交易委員會和中華民國證券當局提交的文件。

During this conference, you may view our financial presentation material, which is being broadcasted live through the Internet. I would now like to introduce UMC's CFO, Mr. Chi-Tung Liu, to discuss UMC's first quarter 2025 financial results.

在這次會議期間，您可以觀看我們的財務簡報資料，該資料正在透過網路現場直播。現在我想介紹聯華電子的財務長劉啟東先生，討論聯華電子 2025 年第一季的財務表現。

Thank you, David. I'd like to go through the first quarter 2025 investor conference presentation material, which can be downloaded or view in real time from our website. Starting on Page 4, the first quarter of 2025 consolidated revenue was TWD57.86 billion with gross margin at around 26.7%. Net income attributable to the stockholder of the parent was TWD7.78 billion, and earnings per ordinary share were TWD0.62. Wafer shipment was flat sequentially compared to the previous quarter.

謝謝你，大衛。我想瀏覽一下 2025 年第一季投資者會議簡報資料，您可以從我們的網站下載或即時查看。從第4頁開始，2025年第一季合併營收為578.6億新​​台幣，毛利率約26.7%。歸屬母公司股東當期淨利為77.8億元新台幣，每股盈餘為0.62元新台幣。晶圓出貨量與上一季相比持平。

However, it was up 12% year over year for the same period of 2024. On Page 5, on the sequential comparison, wafer revenue declined 4.2% sequentially to TWD57.85 billion, mainly due to this one-time price adjustment in the beginning of calendar year. Gross margin was impacted by the lower ASP as well as the earthquake during the Chinese New Year holidays, it went down to 26.7% or TWD15.4 billion. And we expect to see margin recovery in the coming quarters. Operating expenses is under control, represent about 10.6% of the total revenue or TWD6.1 billion.

然而，2024 年同期這一數字年增了 12%。第五頁，與上一季相比，晶圓營收季減4.2%至578.5億新台幣，主要由於年初的一次性價格調整。毛利率受到平均售價較低以及農曆新年假期地震的影響，下降至 26.7% 或 154 億新台幣。我們預計未來幾季利潤率將會回升。營業費用受控，約佔總營收的10.6%或61億新台幣。

That gives us the overall operating income around TWD9.7 billion or 16.9 percentage points. In terms of nonoperating income, due to the weakness in the stock market, we have some losses coming from mark-to-market investments valuation, which is around TWD439 million loss. Total net income attributable to the shareholders of the parent in Q1 2025 was TWD7.777 million or EPS of TWD0.62 in Q1 '25. For the year-over-year comparison, revenue increased by 5.9%. This is mainly due to the wafer shipment increase, as I mentioned earlier, around 12% year-over-year wafer shipment increase, but offset by the ASP decline.

這使我們的整體營業收入達到約 97 億新台幣，即 16.9 個百分點。營業外收入方面，受股市疲軟影響，投資以市價估值產生一定損失，約4.39億新台幣。2025 年第一季歸屬於母公司股東的淨利潤總額為 777.7 萬元新台幣，即 2025 年第一季每股收益為 0.62 元新台幣。與去年同期相比，營收成長了5.9%。這主要是由於晶圓出貨量的增加，正如我之前提到的，晶圓出貨量年增約 12%，但被 ASP 下降所抵銷。

And for the net income comparison, we see a 25% year-over-year decline. And therefore, EPS also was lower in the same magnitude. On next page, cash position still remains over TWD100 billion. It's about TWD106 billion at the end of March 31. Our total equity now reached TWD390 billion at the end of Q1 2025.

而就淨收入而言，我們發現年減了 25%。因此，每股盈餘也出現相同幅度的下降。下一頁，現金部位仍超過 1,000 億新台幣。截至3月31日止，約1,060億新台幣。截至 2025 年第一季末，我們的總股本已達到 3,900 億新台幣。

On Page 6, there's a routine beginning of the year one-off price adjustments, which actually contribute to most of the revenue decline in Q1 of 2025. So roughly, the ASP declined by about 4% to 5% in Q1. For revenue breakdown, we see a good growth coming out of our Asian-based customers. It's now reaching around 66% of our total revenue. North America customers, on the other hand, represent about 22% of the pie.

第 6 頁顯示，年初進行了例行的一次性價格調整，這實際上導致了 2025 年第一季大部分收入的下降。因此，粗略估計，第一季的平均售價下降了約 4% 至 5%。就收入細分而言，我們看到來自亞洲客戶的收入實現了良好的成長。現在它已占到我們總收入的66%左右。另一方面，北美客戶約佔市場份額的 22%。

IDM show a mild growth, on Page 10, to 18% of the total revenue breakdown in Q1 '25. And Consumer segment is the strongest in Q1, mainly driven by WiFi, DTV, set-top box and [DDI]. And communication computers didn't really change that much. And we're happy to see our 40-nanometer and below revenue now over 50% of our total revenue now reached 53% in Q1 when 22 and 20-nanometer revenue account for 37% of the total revenue breakdown. In Q1, there was some disruption from earthquake but mainly this is also annual maintenance schedule.

IDM 呈現溫和成長，在第 10 頁，佔 25 年第一季總營收的 18%。消費領域在第一季表現最為強勁，主要受 WiFi、數位電視、機上盒和[直接投資]。而通訊計算機其實並沒有發生太大的變化。我們很高興地看到，40 奈米及以下製程的收入現在占我們總收入的 50% 以上，第一季達到 53%，而 22 奈米和 20 奈米收入佔總收入的 37%。第一季度，地震造成了一些幹擾，但主要這也是年度維護計畫。

So capacity in Q1 was lower. And for quarter 2, we see the back to normal capacity as well as some mild increase coming out of our Singapore fab due to the ramp is starting. On Page 14, our 2025 CapEx remain unchanged at USD1.8 billion. So this above is the summary of UMC financial results for Q1 2025. Next, I would like to share our key messages.

因此第一季的運力較低。對於第二季度，我們看到產能恢復正常，由於產能開始增加，新加坡工廠的產能也略有增加。第 14 頁，我們的 2025 年資本支出保持不變，為 18 億美元。以上就是聯華電子 2025 年第一季財務表現的摘要。接下來，我想分享我們的關鍵訊息。

I apologize for still putting Jason's picture here because it's rather short notice, and it's also more importantly, it's a very good picture. Our results in the first quarter were in line with our previous guidance with flattish wafer shipments and onetime pricing adjustments at the beginning of the year to reflect market conditions. First quarter highlights include 22/28-nanometer revenue hitting a record high, representing 37% of the total sales. That was driven by 46% quarter-over-quarter increase in 22-nanometer revenue from products such as OLED display driver IC, ISP as well as digital TV, WiFi and audio codec chips. We expect customers to tape-out additional 22-nanometer product in the coming quarters.

我很抱歉仍然把傑森的照片放在這裡，因為時間太短，而且更重要的是，這是一張非常好的照片。我們第一季的業績與先前的預期一致，晶圓出貨量持平，年初進行了一次性價格調整以反映市場狀況。第一季的亮點包括 22/28 奈米收入創下歷史新高，佔總銷售額的 37%。這是由於 OLED 顯示器驅動 IC、ISP 以及數位電視、WiFi 和音訊編解碼器晶片等產品的 22 奈米收入環比增長 46%。我們預計客戶將在未來幾季推出更多 22 奈米產品。

As customers increasingly migrate to our 22-nanometer logic and specialty platform for next-generation applications. Earlier this month, we also officially inaugurated our new Singapore Phase 3 fab, which provide additional 22-nanometer capacity to support future growth. Pilot runs are underway and is on schedule to ramp up to volume production in early 2026.

隨著客戶越來越多地遷移到我們的 22 奈米邏輯和專業平台以用於下一代應用。本月初，我們也正式啟用了新的新加坡三期晶圓廠，該晶圓廠將提供額外的 22 奈米產能以支援未來的成長。目前試運行正在進行中，預計將於 2026 年初實現大量生產。

The expansion in Singapore also further broadens our geographic diversification, enabling customers to strengthen their supply chain resilience. Meanwhile, in February, our Board of Directors proposed a cash dividend of TWD2.85 per share, which is subject to approval for shareholders -- from shareholders in the upcoming AGM on May 28.

在新加坡的擴張也進一步拓寬了我們的地域多樣化，使客戶能夠增強其供應鏈的彈性。同時，2月份，我們的董事會提議派發每股2.85新台幣的現金股息，但須經股東批准－即在5月28日即將召開的年度股東大會上獲得股東批准。

Looking ahead to the second quarter, we are expecting a moderate rebound in demand across all segments according to near-term alignment with our customers. Beyond that, of course, we have to be cautious about wafer demand projections, as policies and markets are still adjusting to the recent tariff announcements. To navigate this challenging environment, we are working closely with customers to monitor trends in end market demand.

展望第二季度，根據與客戶的近期協調，我們預期所有領域的需求都將適度反彈。除此之外，當然，我們必須對晶圓需求預測保持謹慎，因為政策和市場仍在適應最近的關稅公告。為了因應這一充滿挑戰的環境，我們正在與客戶密切合作，監測終端市場需求的趨勢。

We also strengthened our competitive advantage by focusing on execution of key technology products such as the 12-nanometer collaboration with US partners, and ensuring our customers have access to geographically diverse manufacturing options.

我們還透過專注於執行關鍵技術產品（例如與美國合作夥伴的 12 奈米合作）並確保我們的客戶能夠獲得地理位置分散的製造選擇，增強了我們的競爭優勢。

In addition, we are implementing cost reduction plans and accelerating AI and intelligent manufacturing systems to enhance operational efficiency. Through these key focuses, we are confident that UMC can maintain our financial and business resilience. Now let's move on to the second quarter of 2025 guidance. Wafer shipments will increase by 5% to 7% sequentially. ASP the in USD terms will remain flat.

此外，我們正在實施成本削減計劃，並加速人工智慧和智慧製造系統，以提高營運效率。透過這些重點關注，我們相信聯華電子能夠維持我們的財務和業務彈性。現在讓我們來看看 2025 年第二季的指引。晶圓出貨量將季增5%至7%。以美元計算的平均售價將維持不變。

Gross margin will be back to approximately 30% and capacity utilization rate will also recover to the -- around mid-70% range. As I mentioned earlier, the cash-based CapEx will remain unchanged at about USD1.8 billion. That concludes our remarks. Thank you all for your attention. And now we are ready for questions.

毛利率將恢復至30%左右，產能利用率也將恢復至70%左右。正如我之前提到的，現金資本支出將保持不變，約 18 億美元。我們的發言到此結束。謝謝大家的關注。現在我們可以回答問題了。

Thank you, Chi-Tung. And ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions)

謝謝你，Chi-Tung。女士們、先生們，我們現在開始問答環節。（操作員指示）

Sunny Lin, UBS.

瑞銀的 Sunny Lin。

Thank you very much for taking my questions. So my first question, I want to start from the tariff impact. And so for the short term, how are tariffs affecting the customer order behaviors for Q2 and second half? And how is that impacting your business planning? And it does seem like you're having a good recovery for Q2 sales, how much of that is driven by the pooling orders due to tariff?

非常感謝您回答我的問題。我的第一個問題，我想從關稅影響開始。那麼短期來看，關稅將如何影響第二季和下半年的顧客訂單行為？這對您的業務規劃有何影響？看起來你們第二季的銷售額確實正在復蘇，其中有多少是由關稅帶來的集中訂單推動的？

Okay. So UMC collaborate closely with customers for technology and product qualification across multiple fabs, reducing exposures to site-specific risk and ensuring supply chain resilience. We adopt a forward-looking approach to mitigate business risks, including a geographically diversified manufacturing footprint. And by 2027, we will have manufacturing base for our most advanced available technology in the U.S. UMC also has a healthy financial structure to navigate through macro uncertainties.

好的。因此，聯華電子與客戶密切合作，在多個晶圓廠進行技術和產品認證，從而降低特定地點的風險並確保供應鏈的彈性。我們採取前瞻性的方法來降低商業風險，包括地理多元化的製造足跡。到 2027 年，我們將在美國擁有最先進技術的製造基地。聯華電子也擁有健康的財務結構，能夠應對宏觀不確定性。

And although the escalating trade tensions and global tariff policies has increased uncertainties in the semi industry and we have not seen market demand change in the very near term, i.e., quarter 2 2025 yet. Of course, visibility in the second half is becoming very limited. And longer term, customers may decouple their internal manufacturing options and explore external wafer sourcing options. And UMC's strategic positioning, focusing on technology differentiation, global manufacturing diversification, product mix optimization and manufacturing excellence. So I think, in short, there's very little change we observe for the second quarter.

儘管不斷升級的貿易緊張局勢和全球關稅政策增加了半導體產業的不確定性，但我們尚未看到短期內（即 2025 年第二季）市場需求發生變化。當然，下半年的可見度變得非常有限。從長遠來看，客戶可能會分離其內部製造選項並探索外部晶圓採購選項。而聯華電子的策略定位，注重技術差異化、全球製造多角化、產品結構優化、製造卓越性。所以我認為，簡而言之，我們觀察到的第二季變化很小。

However, if you include our Q1 results plus our quarter 2 guidance, we think we are slightly ahead of our expectation at the beginning of the year. That will give us some buffer for the uncertainty -- the increasing uncertainty in the second half.

然而，如果將我們的第一季業績加上第二季指引計算在內，我們認為我們的業績略高於年初的預期。這將為我們的不確定性——下半年日益增加的不確定性——提供一些緩衝。

Got it. So basically, you are saying the growth in Q2 is not so much driven by pooling just a little bit. And so in that case, should we be less concerned about a meaningful drop-off going to second half because they are not much being pooling?

知道了。所以基本上，您說的是第二季的成長並不是很大程度上受到池化所推動的。那麼在這種情況下，我們是否應該不那麼擔心下半年會大幅下降，因為沒有太多資金被集中？

There's not that much pooling, you are correct, for quarter 2. There's some customers were sidelined and they want to take some precautionary actions, but there are some customers doing the opposite. So net-net impact for quarter 2 is very limited. So -- but again, we cannot really see through second half. And what we are seeing right now doesn't really suggest there will be a shortfall in the coming quarters.

您說得對，對於第二季度來說，並沒有那麼多的池化。有些客戶被邊緣化，他們想採取一些預防措施，但也有一些客戶採取了相反的做法。因此，第二季的淨影響非常有限。所以——但是，我們無法真正看透下半場。而我們目前看到的情況並不表示未來幾季會出現短缺。

Got it. Thank you. My follow-up question on tariff is in terms of the potential disruptions about the supply chain on the pricing side. And so if tariffs are pushed through either for finished goods or direct semi chips or both, based on your current discussions with clients, would you expect some impact on UMC's pricing and margin as well as maybe potentially everyone in the supply chain, we need to share the cost to some extent?

知道了。謝謝。我關於關稅的後續問題是關於定價方面供應鏈可能出現的中斷。因此，根據您目前與客戶的討論，如果對成品或直接半導體晶片或兩者徵收關稅，您是否預計這會對聯華電子的定價和利潤率以及可能對供應鏈中的每個人產生影響，我們需要在一定程度上分擔成本？

I think we don't have a generalized answer. So let me start with our UMC pricing policy or strategy. We don't compete purely on pricing. Our strategy is built around technology differentiation and manufacturing excellence via regionally diversified manufacturing basis. All that attribute work to insulate UMC and our customers away from low-entry barrier market.

我認為我們沒有一個通用的答案。那麼，讓我先從我們的 UMC 定價政策或策略開始。我們並不單純在價格上競爭。我們的策略是透過區域多樣化製造基礎實現技術差異化和製造卓越。所有這些特性都使 UMC 和我們的客戶遠離低進入障礙市場。

And despite the pricing pressures, UMC remain committed to deliver differentiated technology and ensuring our customers to gain market share through the long-term strategic partnership. And so our value proposition is really to work with our customers in a transparent method. Any disruption of the cost increase through tariffs, we believe we will co-work with our customers to come up with a solution.

儘管面臨價格壓力，聯華電子仍然致力於提供差異化技術，並透過長期策略合作夥伴關係確保我們的客戶獲得市場份額。因此，我們的價值主張實際上是以透明的方式與客戶合作。對於任何透過關稅增加成本的干擾，我們相信我們將與客戶共同努力找到解決方案。

Got it. And then I have a question on 28-nanometer. And so roughly, what's the utilization rates in Q1 and Q2? And how should we think about the mix of 22-nanometer within the whole 28- and 22-nanometer sales, let's say, going to second half of 2025?

知道了。然後我有一個關於 28 奈米的問題。那麼大致來說，第一季和第二季的使用率是多少？那麼，我們應該如何看待 22 奈米在整個 28 奈米和 22 奈米銷售中的組合，比如說到 2025 年下半年？

First of all, our guidance for second quarter is mid-70% for the company as a whole. Of course, 12 inch is higher than corporate average and 8 inch is below corporate average. Among 12, I would say, 22/28 is the better sector, if not the best sector. And right now, 22 and 28 represent 37% of our total revenue and 22 alone, I would say, is more than mid-teens and continue to increase. And that will be a key growth driver for UMC's 2025 growth.

首先，我們對第二季整個公司的預期是 70% 左右。當然，12吋高於企業平均水平，8吋低於企業平均。在 12 個板塊中，我想說 22/28 是較好的板塊，甚至可以說是最好的板塊。目前，22 和 28 占我們總收入的 37%，而我認為僅 22 一項的收入就超過了十五六倍，而且還在繼續增長。這將成為聯華電子 2025 年成長的關鍵成長動力。

That's very helpful. So mid-teen percentage that's in terms of total sales, correct?

這非常有幫助。那麼，就總銷售額而言，這個百分比是十幾歲左右，對嗎？

Correct.

正確的。

Thank you very much. And then maybe my last question. And so this partnership with Intel on 12-nanometer, what's the latest update that you could provide us? And would it be possible that we see an earlier production in 2026? And I guess, lately, given the maybe rising reshoring interest in the US, are you seeing much stronger demand for these collaborations?

非常感謝。這也許是我的最後一個問題。那麼，關於與英特爾在 12 奈米方面的合作，您能提供我們哪些最新消息？我們有可能在 2026 年看到更早的作品嗎？我想，鑑於最近美國對回流的興趣可能不斷上升，您是否看到對這些合作的需求更加強勁？

Maybe [Michael] can answer the question.

也許[Michael]可以回答這個問題。

Sure. The joint development work is on track. We are progressing well according to the project milestones. At this moment, we are verifying the silicon performance for the pilot line, and we expect the early PDK will be ready for the first wave of customer by 2026 as planned. In fact, we have been aligning with key customers on the device spec to speed up the ramp-up as quickly as possible.

當然。聯合開發工作正在順利推進。我們正在按照專案里程碑順利推進。目前，我們正在驗證試驗線的矽片性能，預計早期的 PDK 將按計劃在 2026 年為第一批客戶做好準備。事實上，我們一直在與主要客戶就設備規格進行協調，以盡快加快生產速度。

Right now, we are putting the process technology in Arizona fab. And so far, the progress is on track.

目前，我們正在亞利桑那州的工廠採用該製程技術。目前為止，進展一切順利。

Got it. And so basically, sales contribution, you guide still from 2027?

知道了。那麼基本上，您仍會從 2027 年開始預測銷售貢獻嗎？

Yes.

是的。

Got it. Thank you very much.

知道了。非常感謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Laura Chen, Citi.

花旗銀行的 Laura Chen。

Hi, thank you very much for taking my questions. I also want to know more about like your US cooperation. If only Intel's -- other than Intel, would you any -- have any opportunity to work with other IDMs in the United States?

你好，非常感謝您回答我的問題。我還想進一步了解你們與美國的合作。如果只有英特爾——除了英特爾，你們還有什麼——有機會與美國的其他 IDM 合作嗎？

We have plenty of US-based IDM customers as consistently among our top customers. And I think I don't need to mention the names, but you definitely know who they are. So from time to time, we have JDPs, we have capacity support. And that will continue to be our strategic collaboration going forward. So we do have other IDM customers in the US.

我們擁有眾多位於美國的 IDM 客戶，他們一直是我們的主要客戶。我想我不需要提及名字，但你肯定知道他們是誰。因此，我們時常會推出聯合開發計畫 (JDP)，提供產能支援。這將繼續是我們未來的策略合作。所以我們在美國確實有其他 IDM 客戶。

working closely with UMC. But of course, the current stage, the most important project is this 12-nanometer US footprint collaboration with the US partners.

與 UMC 密切合作。但當然，現階段最重要的項目是與美國合作夥伴進行的12納米美國足跡合作。

Understood. Because previously, I also have a news, I understand that management already kind of denied, but I'm just wondering like other than our current clients in US IDMs, is there any chance we can also work with Global Foundries on some sort of like joint venture or collaboration, any type of the cooperation?

明白了。因為之前我也有消息，我知道管理層已經否認了，但我只是想知道，除了我們目前在美國 IDM 的客戶之外，我們是否有機會與 Global Foundries 進行某種合資或合作，任何類型的合作？

I don't want to comment on market rumors. I think for issue like this is so sensitive and important has to come from the official announcement from any company involved. But I think from -- again, from UMC's perspective, we're consistently looking for strategic options to enhance shareholders' value. Anything can help to increase our competitiveness as well as the shareholders' value, we will certainly look into that. And currently, there's no ongoing so-called merger activity right now.

我不想對市場謠言發表評論。我認為對於這樣一個如此敏感和重要的問題，必須由涉及的任何公司發布官方聲明。但我認為，從聯華電子的角度來看，我們一直在尋找策略選擇來提高股東價值。任何有助於提高我們的競爭力和股東價值的事情，我們一定會研究。目前，還沒有正在進行的所謂合併活動。

So again, we have to say that there's no merger ongoing right now. But it doesn't have to be merger. There are many other collaboration we can still pursue to enhance shareholders' value and returns. And that is our mandate, and we are continuing to explore all different kind of options.

因此，我們必須再次聲明，目前沒有正在進行的合併。但它不一定是合併。我們還可以進行許多其他合作來提高股東價值和回報。這就是我們的使命，我們將繼續探索各種不同的選擇。

Yes, certainly. My second question is about the margin. Obviously, into Q2, even though there's a lot of macro uncertainty, we see that the utilization rate improvement and also the gross margin back to 30%. So can we kind of assume that Q1 is the trough for the gross margin since we have the one-time pricing adjustment back in Q1, the overall demand seems to back to normal. So I'm just wondering what's our view on the overall gross margin trends going forward?

是的，當然。我的第二個問題是關於利潤。顯然，進入第二季度，儘管存在許多宏觀不確定性，但我們看到利用率有所提高，毛利率也回升至 30%。因此，我們是否可以假設第一季是毛利率的低谷，因為我們在第一季進行了一次性價格調整，整體需求似乎恢復正常。所以我只是想知道我們對未來整體毛利率趨勢的看法是什麼？

Unfortunately, we mentioned the second half, the visibility becomes very limited with a lot of increasing uncertainties. So it makes us very difficult to predict the numbers for the second half. We can only give the guidance a quarter at a time.

不幸的是，我們提到了下半年，可見度變得非常有限，不確定性也不斷增加。因此我們很難預測下半年的數據。我們每次只能給予一個季度的指導。

But our profitability is largely depend on product mix, pricing, utilization rate and ForEx movement and COGS. We have taken several initiatives to enhance our profitability that include business engagement, technology differentiation, driving the efficiency in operations and improving our CapEx efficiency to manage the depreciation impact.

但我們的獲利能力很大程度取決於產品組合、定價、使用率、外匯變動和銷貨成本。我們採取了多項措施來提高獲利能力，包括業務參與、技術差異化、提高營運效率和提高資本支出效率以管理折舊影響。

The current gross margin level reflects Q1 2025 one-time pricing adjustment as well as the depreciation increase, mainly coming from P6 in Thailand as well as the upcoming P3 in Singapore. And we are actively looking to improve our product mix, such as more specialty content and higher 22, 28 wafer shipments and drive the efficiencies in operations when our EBITDA margin can still remain intact.

目前的毛利率水準反映了2025年第一季的一次性價格調整以及折舊增加，主要來自泰國的P6以及即將在新加坡推出的P3。我們正在積極尋求改善我們的產品組合，例如更多的特種內容和更高的22、28晶圓出貨量，並在我們的EBITDA利潤率仍保持不變的情況下提高營運效率。

Okay, that's very fair. Thank you very much.

好的，這非常公平。非常感謝。

Brad Lin, Bank, America Securities.

布拉德林 (Brad Lin)，美國證券銀行。

Thank you for taking my question. Congrats on the solid 1Q result and also the bright second quarter guidance. I have two questions. The first question would be in terms of the customer type. Has UMC seen potential upside from maybe North America or IDM due to the current tariff issue? Thank you.

感謝您回答我的問題。恭喜第一季取得的穩健業績以及第二季的光明前景。我有兩個問題。第一個問題是關於客戶類型的。由於目前的關稅問題，聯華電子是否看到了來自北美或IDM的潛在上升空間？謝謝。

I think we do see customer -- increasing customer appreciation to UMC's regionally diverse manufacturing base. So for various reasons, customers may need to have certain type of product manufacturing in some specific manufacturing sites. And UMC with operations in Singapore, Taiwan, Japan and China and upcoming US capacities, I think our customers appreciate even more recently with the option we can offer. So I think that's the feeling and also the sense we get from the recent conversation with many of our major customers.

我認為我們確實看到客戶對聯華電子區域多元化製造基地的認可度不斷提高。因此，出於各種原因，客戶可能需要在某些特定的製造地點製造某種類型的產品。聯華電子在新加坡、台灣、日本和中國都有業務，而且即將在美國投產，我認為我們的客戶最近對我們所能提供的選擇更加讚賞。所以我認為這就是我們最近與許多主要客戶的對話中所得到的感受和理解。

That's very clear. But a follow-up question on that is that at what time do we expect to see so-called meaningful contribution from this kind of impact?

這非常清楚。但接下來的問題是，我們什麼時候才能看到這種影響所帶來的所謂有意義的貢獻？

So far, it's very difficult to quantify. But for our Singapore fab, probably the best example that the P3 is going to volume production in early 2026. And I think it's becoming a very pursuit after locations for its less impacted geopolitical tension. So certainly, if there is any demand exceeds the capacity we can offer, we will certainly see a better performance out of our Singapore site. And same argument can apply to any other site we have.

到目前為止，這還很難量化。但對於我們的新加坡工廠來說，最好的例子可能是 P3 將於 2026 年初投入量產。我認為，由於受地緣政治緊張局勢影響較小，這裡正成為人們熱衷的旅遊地點。因此，如果需求超出了我們所能提供的容量，我們新加坡工廠的表現肯定會更好。同樣的論點也適用於我們擁有的任何其他網站。

So I cannot give you a quantified answer for now. Just the customer appreciation certainly will endorse our customer relationship and the so-called stickiness for the longer term.

所以我現在無法給你一個量化的答案。僅僅是客戶的讚賞就肯定會鞏固我們的客戶關係以及所謂的長期黏性。

Got it. Hopefully that we can also gain more so-called LTA with that as well. If any, please do let us know. So my second question would be, well, end market demand. So could you also provide insight into the demand trends across the key end markets such as especially for automotive and also industrial as well as the consumer electronics?

知道了。希望我們也能藉此獲得更多所謂的 LTA。如果有的話，請告知我們。所以我的第二個問題是終端市場需求。那麼，您能否深入了解主要終端市場的需求趨勢，例如汽車、工業以及消費性電子產品？

Have there been any notable shift in the customer behavior or order patterns recently compared to our last earnings call? Thank you.

與我們上次的收益電話會議相比，最近客戶行為或訂單模式是否有明顯變化？謝謝。

Yes. For Q1, Consumer segment grew as our CFO alluded to, driven by WiFi, DTV set-top box and driver IC. But all the other segments such as Communication remained relatively flat, and we saw Computing kind of decline due to a softer demand in IO. Automotive for Q1 also declined due to softness in microcontrollers, DDI as well as power management. But as you know, for Q2, all major segments for Computing, Communications, Consumer will grow.

是的。正如我們的財務長所提到的，對於第一季度，消費品部門在 WiFi、DTV 機上盒和驅動 IC 的推動下實現了成長。但所有其他領域（例如通訊領域）仍然保持相對平穩，並且由於 IO 需求疲軟，我們看到計算領域有所下滑。由於微控制器、DDI 以及電源管理的疲軟，第一季汽車市場的銷售也下滑。但正如您所知，對於第二季度，計算、通訊、消費等所有主要領域都將實現成長。

For Computing segments, we expect that growth will be driven by flash controller IC. For Communication will be increased from ISP, networking, flash controller as well as WiFi. For Consumer, it will grow due to continuous growth from DTV and set-top box. And last, but for Automotive, we expect that segment to be flattish, looking for Q2.

對於運算領域，我們預計成長將由快閃記憶體控制器 IC 推動。通訊將從 ISP、網路、快閃記憶體控制器以及 WiFi 增加。對消費者而言，由於數位電視和機上盒的持續成長，其消費量也將隨之成長。最後，對於汽車而言，我們預計該領域在第二​​季將保持穩定。

Should we expect any meaningful recovery from this auto industry, which seems to be, well, relatively softer for a while?

我們是否應該期待汽車產業出現有意義的復甦？目前汽車產業似乎相對疲軟。

So the Automotive right now, the inventory seems kind of relatively high, obviously, compared to other key segments of our business. So for now, we stay -- we remain a more conservative tone for the auto market.

因此，目前汽車產業的庫存顯然與我們業務的其他關鍵部門相比相對較高。因此就目前而言，我們對汽車市場仍持較保守的態度。

Got it. Thank you very much.

知道了。非常感謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Charlie Chan, Morgan Stanley.

陳查理 (Charlie Chan)，摩根士丹利。

Thanks for taking my question. Chi-Tung, my first question will be also on gross margin. So it seems like 1Q, you're doing a little bit better than the guidance of mid-20% and 2Q kind of hit the 30% amid some pricing pressure. Can you share with us some more color about which parts are doing better, better pricing or cost or just a kind of FX impact, so you can deliver better gross margin? Thank you.

感謝您回答我的問題。Chi-Tung，我的第一個問題也是關於毛利率的。因此看起來，第一季你們的表現比預期的 20% 中段要好一些，而第二季度在一定定價壓力下達到了 30% 左右。您能否與我們分享更多關於哪些部分錶現更好的細節，更好的定價或成本，或只是一種外匯影響，以便您可以提供更好的毛利率？謝謝。

Well, thank you for saying that's better. Personally, I don't think better. We never feel enough to pursue a better gross margin. I think it's a very important index internally for all the management team. So we continue to proactively deploy cost reduction efforts, including multi-source, streamline our operations, manage supply chain pricing and drive automation transformation.

好吧，謝謝你說這樣更好。就我個人而言，我並不認為這樣更好。我們永遠覺得追求更好的毛利率不夠。我認為對於整個管理團隊來說這是一個非常重要的內部指標。因此，我們持續積極部署降低成本的措施，包括多來源、簡化營運、管理供應鏈定價和推動自動化轉型。

So these measures kind of help us to offset or at least partially about those cost headwinds, including green energy, including yearly -- annually salary adjustment. So there are a couple of headwinds we need to offset through our cost reduction efforts. And in the beginning of the call, we mentioned that Q1, Q2 is slightly ahead of our expectations at the -- compared to the guidance we gave for the beginning of the year. But that kind of only give us the buffer. Hopefully, it's enough for the increasing uncertainty for the second half.

因此，這些措施有助於我們抵銷或至少部分抵銷這些成本阻力，包括綠色能源，包括每年的工資調整。因此，我們需要透過降低成本的努力來抵消一些不利因素。在電話會議開始時，我們提到，與年初給予的指導相比，第一季和第二季的表現略高於我們的預期。但這只是給我們提供了緩衝。希望這足以緩解下半年日益增加的不確定性。

So pursuing a better gross margin is the [analyst] mandate for management team. We hope we can do better.

因此，追求更高的毛利率是分析師對管理團隊的要求。我們希望能夠做得更好。

Sure. I hope you can keep it up. And second question is about your kind of a partnership with Intel in the US? So just out of curiosity, do you receive some request that some of your customers want you to accelerate that US operation with Intel?

當然。我希望你能堅持下去。第二個問題是關於您與美國英特爾的合作關係嗎？所以出於好奇，您是否收到一些客戶請求您與英特爾合作加速美國業務？

Because it seems like your foundry peer, right, seems to receive a similar request and even some customers are willing to pay higher wafer price for their chips to be produced in the US. I know you have the planned schedule for the 12-nanometer in the US, but I'm just curious whether you are receiving similar requests that hope you can speed up?

因為看起來你的代工同行似乎也收到了類似的請求，甚至一些客戶願意為在美國生產的晶片支付更高的晶圓價格。我知道你們有在美國製定的 12 奈米計畫時間表，但我只是好奇你們是否收到類似的請求，希望你們加快速度？

The answer is yes. I think most of the customers like to see the 12-nanometer solution as early as possible. And they also have a very aggressive product launch time, and they hope our 12-nanometer solution can catch up with their product road map. So yes, the pressure is there. We understand that, and we received inquiries from our call the early adopt customers.

答案是肯定的。我認為大多數客戶都希望儘早看到12奈米解決方案。而且他們的產品發佈時間也非常緊迫，他們希望我們的 12 奈米解決方案能夠趕上他們的產品路線圖。是的，壓力確實存在。我們理解這一點，並且我們收到了來自早期採用客戶的詢問。

And that's why we are under the pressure, try to expedite the whole process. But it's already a very aggressive process, I mean, time line. So it's also the first time we collaborate with our partners. And there's also many tests and need to be solved before we can even try to catch up with our aggressive time line. So again, this is -- there's a pressure and wish to do so.

這就是我們面臨壓力的原因，我們試圖加快整個進程。但這已經是一個非常激進的過程，我的意思是時間表。這也是我們第一次與合作夥伴合作。在我們努力趕上緊迫的時間表之前，還有很多測試需要解決。所以，再說一次，這是──存在著這樣做的壓力和願望。

But in reality, so far, we are on track with our planned schedule.

但實際上，到目前為止，我們的計劃都進展順利。

Got you. So besides the hope for you to accelerate the plan, do you also see some desire for you to even kind of reach out to more advanced nodes? Because I know you need to plan ahead, right, maybe 3 to 4 years if you want to further migrate to below 12-nanometer. I ask this question because that your industry peer already officially denied their future partnership with the US fab, which is Intel.

明白了。那麼，除了希望加速該計劃之外，您是否還看到了希望，甚至希望接觸更先進的節點？因為我知道你需要提前規劃，如果你想進一步遷移到 12 奈米以下，也許需要 3 到 4 年的時間。我問這個問題是因為您的行業同行已經正式否認了他們未來與美國晶圓廠英特爾的合作。

So I'm not sure if that gives you more room or your confidence you wish you to migrate to more advanced nodes that would adopt EUV.

所以我不確定這是否會給你更多的空間或讓你有信心遷移到採用 EUV 的更先進的節點。

So if you are using the market story as a background for this question, I have to be careful, right? So in that case, the answer is no. So we are only focusing on the current node, which is 12-nanometers. And that both companies decided and there's a contract between 2 companies to execute this 12-nanometer collaboration. And for UMC alone, of course, I can speak for UMC, we appreciate this collaboration with our US.

因此，如果您使用市場故事作為這個問題的背景，我必須小心，對嗎？所以在這種情況下，答案是否定的。因此我們只關注當前節點，即 12 奈米。兩家公司都做出了決定，並且簽訂了合約來執行這項 12 奈米合作。當然，僅就 UMC 而言，我可以代表 UMC 發言，我們很欣賞與美國的這項合作。

partner, and we offer our foundry know-how and the bulk of the technology structure and US partner offer the on-site capacity with very limited depreciation. So we think it's a very innovative mutual benefit collaboration. And certainly, we don't want to be limited to the current node only. However, this contract only cover 12-nanometer for now.

合作夥伴，我們提供我們的鑄造技術訣竅和大部分技術結構，而美國合作夥伴則提供折舊非常有限的現場產能。因此我們認為這是一次非常創新的互利合作。當然，我們不想僅限於當前節點。不過，該合約目前僅涵蓋12奈米。

Okay. That's a great answer as well. The last one, I think very kind of tactical short-term question. So I'm sorry, but did you maintain your full year guidance? And if that is the case, what's the implied half-on-half seasonality?

好的。這也是一個很好的答案。最後一個，我認為是一個非常具有戰術性的短期問題。很抱歉，但您是否維持了全年指導目標？如果確實如此，隱含的半季節性是什麼？

How much conservative can you bake in for second half?

下半年你能採取多少保守措施？

Our view for the whole 2025 hasn't really changed. Our view on 2025 foundry market is expected to grow in the mid- to high-teens percentage, like we mentioned earlier, the previous quarter. UMC's addressable market should grow around, I mean, low single-digits for our addressable market, which we intend, and we have declared we're going to outgrow that. Of course, I just mentioned that the first quarter plus the guidance for quarter 2 put us a little bit ahead of our expectation, but the uncertainties in second half may offset that, which we don't know clearly yet. So that's the current view for the whole 2025.

我們對整個 2025 年的看法並沒有真正改變。我們對 2025 年代工市場的看法是，預計其成長率將達到中高百分比，就像我們之前在上一季提到的那樣。聯華電子的潛在市場應該會成長，我的意思是，我們的潛在市場應該會以低個位數成長，這是我們的意圖，而且我們已經宣布我們將超越這一目標。當然，我剛才提到，第一季加上第二季的指引，讓我們稍微超出了我們的預期，但下半年的不確定性可能會抵消這一點，目前我們還不清楚。這就是目前對整個 2025 年的展望。

So we probably use like single digit, maybe mid-single digit at the full year guide and try to calculate the implied second half. Is that the right way to think about your narrative on the second half?

因此，我們可能會使用全年指南中的個位數，也許是中等個位數，並嘗試計算隱含的下半年。這是思考下半場敘述的正確方式嗎？

Yes. Let's stick to the qualitative statement that we're trying very hard to outperform our addressable market.

是的。讓我們堅持定性聲明，我們正在努力超越我們的潛在市場。

Okay. Okay. Thank you. Yes, I'll be back to the queue.

好的。好的。謝謝。是的，我會回到隊列。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Gokul Hariharan, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的 Gokul Hariharan。

Yes, hi Chi-Tung, David and Michael. My first question is on margins. I think you've kind of got back to 30% in Q2. How should we think about the cadence for margins? Because it looks like your implied expectation in the second half is going to be largely flattish looks like. So if that's the case, how should we think about margins?

是的，嗨，Chi-Tung、David 和 Michael。我的第一個問題是關於利潤的。我認為第二季的成長率已經回升至 30%。我們該如何考慮利潤的節奏？因為看起來你對下半年的隱含預期將基本持平。那如果是這樣的話，我們該如何考慮利潤呢？

And could you also refresh what is your expected depreciation growth? I think last time, you said high 20% for this year. Is that still the case given Q1, I think the increase was not that big sequentially?

您能否更新一下預期的折舊增長是多少？我認為上次您說過今年的最高目標是 20%。考慮到第一季的情況，情況是否仍然如此？我認為季增幅沒有那麼大？

Depreciation increase is still high 20% for 2025, each quarter sequentially going up. So we are facing higher depreciation expenses for every quarter. So that's the pressure. And for margin guidance, I think I have to highlight that about 2 percentage points in Q1 was impact from the earthquake. That's one-off.

到 2025 年，折舊率仍將保持在 20% 的高位，並且每季都會持續上漲。因此我們每季都面臨更高的折舊費用。這就是壓力。對於利潤率指導，我認為我必須強調，第一季約有 2 個百分點是受到地震的影響。這是一次性的。

So if you add back that 2%, the increase is more mild for the second half. And again, we are very sensitive to loading for the second half in terms of where we are for the margin. We know the factors such as pricing, the depreciation, but we don't know the factor for ForEx and loading. So of course, we continue to try to enrich our product mix by having more 22-nanometers. So all these factors blending together create the formula for our gross margin, especially in the second half.

因此，如果加上這 2%，下半年的增幅會更加溫和。再說一次，就利潤率而言，我們對下半年的負荷非常敏感。我們知道定價、折舊等因素，但我們不知道外匯和裝載的因素。因此，我們當然會繼續嘗試透過更多 22 奈米來豐富我們的產品組合。因此，所有這些因素結合在一起，形成了我們的毛利率公式，尤其是在下半年。

Understood. So is 22/28 combined now higher margins compared to the corporate average already or is it still not there yet?

明白了。那麼，22/28 的總利潤率與企業平均值相比是否已經較高了，還是還沒達到？

If you exclude the new depreciation out of Thailand P6 and Singapore P3, of course, it is. But if you include that, I'm not so sure, may not be the case. But the depreciation is there anyway with or without the extra 22/28 contribution. So of course, the more the merrier.

如果排除泰國P6和新加坡P3的新貶值，當然是的。但如果把那也算進去，我就不太確定了，可能不是這樣。但無論有沒有額外的 22/28 貢獻，折舊都會存在。所以當然是人越多越好。

That's fair. So just on the Singapore P3, are you having any thought about accelerating the capacity plan given you mentioned you're getting a lot more demand coming through for -- or interest coming through for Singapore fab? Because I think previously, you kind of slowed it down a little bit compared to previous plan given the demand outlook. Is that something that we could anticipate some change?

這很公平。那麼就新加坡 P3 而言，鑑於您提到您對新加坡晶圓廠的需求或興趣正在增加，您是否考慮加快產能計畫？因為我認為，考慮到需求前景，與之前的計劃相比，你們的速度有點放慢了。我們可以預見一些變化嗎？

I think that's definitely dynamic, okay? So the future capacity ramp for 12i Singapore will be depend on the alignment with our customer needs. And of course, we have begin to see a pickup in [tape-out] so that may or may not translate into a pickup in customer demand. But [tape-out] definitely already see the pickup. So it could happen, but the current plan still the production ramp, the mass production will be in early 2026.

我認為這絕對是動態的，好嗎？因此，12i 新加坡未來的產能提升將取決於是否符合顧客的需求。當然，我們已經開始看到[流片]數量的回升，所以這可能會或可能不會轉化為客戶需求的回升。但[tape-out]肯定已經看到了回升。所以這是有可能發生的，但目前的計劃仍然是產量提升，大規模生產將在 2026 年初進行。

Understood. And lastly, on the Intel collaboration. I think once you start the 12-nanometer revenue contribution, could you talk a little bit about what kind of customers you're seeing adopting this? And secondly, once you start the revenue contribution, what is the impact to your margins or EBITDA given the unique kind of arrangement that you have with Intel?

明白了。最後，關於與英特爾的合作。我認為，一旦您開始貢獻 12 奈米收入，您能否談談您看到哪些類型的客戶會採用這種技術？其次，一旦你們開始貢獻收入，考慮到你們與英特爾的獨特協議，這會對你們的利潤率或 EBITDA 產生什麼影響？

Okay. Michael can answer the first question. I can answer the second question.

好的。麥可可以回答第一個問題。我可以回答第二個問題。

Okay. As for now, our key focus on WiFi connectivity and high-speed interface SoC products. So in addition to this 12-nanometer large process, we're also exploring potential FinFET specialty technology solutions to further complement our portfolio with diverse product applications.

好的。目前，我們的重點是WiFi連接和高速介面SoC產品。因此，除了這個 12 奈米大製程之外，我們還在探索潛在的 FinFET 專業技術解決方案，以透過多樣化的產品應用進一步補充我們的產品組合。

As for the margin, certainly, we hope it's an enhancement to our corporate average, but it largely depends on the capacity utilization rate. And by structure, there's limited depreciation cost item in the COGS. But the overall US manufacturing probably will both higher manufacturing costs than the manufacturing in Taiwan. So these two factors will need to see how to offset each other.

至於利潤率，當然，我們希望它能提高我們公司的平均水平，但這在很大程度上取決於產能利用率。從結構上看，COGS 中的折舊成本項目有限。但整體來說美國製造的製造成本可能都會比台灣製造高。因此，需要研究這兩個因素如何相互抵消。

So there's still many variables we have to wait until closer to 2027.

因此仍有許多變數，我們必須等到接近 2027 年才能知道。

Got it. And the capacity allocated into this arrangement, is that largely a static capacity that Intel has already allocated? Because obviously, they have a lot of capacity on 14-nanometer given that was a full node for Intel, right? So they probably have quite a bit of capacity even after some of the conversion. So is that a static allocation?

知道了。依照這種安排分配的產能，主要是英特爾已經分配的靜態產能嗎？因為顯然，考慮到 14 奈米對於英特爾來說是一個完整的節點，他們在 14 奈米方面擁有很大的產能，對吧？因此，即使經過一些轉換，他們可能仍然擁有相當大的容量。那這是靜態分配嗎？

Or is it something that is dynamic depending upon how demand goes?

或者它是根據需求變化而動態變化的事物嗎？

I will say it's more dynamic. However, it definitely need a certain economy of scale to start with and depends on how customer adoption for this technology and this collaboration. Certainly, we believe there could be upside if the market adoption is more than expectation.

我想說它更有活力。然而，它肯定需要一定的規模經濟才能開始，並且取決於客戶如何採用這項技術和這種合作。當然，我們相信，如果市場採用率超出預期，可能會有上漲空間。

Got it, yes, thank you very much.

明白了，是的，非常感謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Felix Pan, KGI.

潘家輝，凱基證券。

Hi, good afternoon. There are two questions from me. First of all, still on the semiconductor tariff potentially. I just want to double confirm, I think a couple of months ago, I think TSMC made a statement that customers should take care of the tariff things. I just wonder is that UMC also holding this kind of a view if that the tariff on semiconductor in place? That's my first question.

嗨，下午好。我有兩個問題。首先，半導體關稅仍有可能。我只是想再次確認一下，我想幾個月前，台積電就發表過聲明說客戶應該負責關稅事宜。我只是想知道，如果對半導體徵收關稅，聯華電子是否也會持有這種觀點？這是我的第一個問題。

So I cannot comment on our competitor. And I also mentioned earlier, UMC will adopt a very transparent cooperation alignment with our customers to cope with this potential tariff issues. So that's our thing. So how to deal with this possible potential tariff together with our customers is our key approach.

所以我無法評論我們的競爭對手。我之前也提到過，聯華電子將與客戶採取非常透明的合作方式來應對這一潛在的關稅問題。這就是我們的事。因此，如何與我們的客戶一起應對這種可能的潛在關稅是我們的關鍵方法。

Okay. So can I -- so that means you don't rule out the possibility that foundry also have to bear the cost at some degree if that's in place? Is that right?

好的。那麼我可以——這意味著如果存在這種情況，您不排除代工廠也必須在某種程度上承擔成本的可能性嗎？是嗎？

It's not what I said, no. What I said is we will cooperate with our customers in a very transparent environment and collaboratively to deal with this tariff issue.

這不是我說的，不是。我說的是，我們將在非常透明的環境中與我們的客戶合作並共同解決這個關稅問題。

Okay. Okay. Understood. The second question, I understood that the visibility for second half is still unclear. And I think besides the demand profile, can you just share a little bit if the up cycle -- if the -- potentially the down cycle is coming, assuming that, how you see the inventory level across the different applications from your perspective?

好的。好的。明白了。第二個問題，據我了解，下半年的前景仍不明朗。我認為除了需求概況之外，您能否稍微分享一下，如果上升週期 - 如果 - 潛在的下降週期即將到來，那麼從您的角度來看，您如何看待不同應用程式的庫存水平？

Okay. So as far as the inventory goes, the current days of inventory remain similar to first quarter 2025. In terms of applications, the DOI as well as the inventory for consumer electronics remain at a healthy level. However, days of inventory for Automotive and Industrial segments remains relatively high, and we expect that will take more time to digest. So obviously, we will continue to carefully monitor the ongoing impact of the tariff policy.

好的。因此就庫存而言，目前的庫存天數與 2025 年第一季相似。在應用方面，DOI 以及消費性電子產品的庫存仍處於健康水準。然而，汽車和工業領域的庫存天數仍然相對較高，我們預計需要更多時間來消化。因此，顯然，我們將繼續密切關注關稅政策的持續影響。

And it has obviously created a very challenging environment in the semiconductor supply chain.

這顯然為半導體供應鏈帶來了非常大的挑戰。

Okay. Can I just have a quick follow-up on that. I understood different from other cycle, currently, besides the auto, every all the application at a healthy level. But because of the 90 days -- the 90-day post for the tariff thing. So do you see the inventory like -- how likely to elevate in second quarter?

好的。我可以快速跟進一下這個問題嗎？我了解到與其他週期不同，目前，除了汽車之外，所有應用程式都處於健康水平。但由於 90 天——關稅事宜的 90 天期限。那麼您認為第二季庫存增加的可能性有多高？

Do you think this play like that and how serious for the inventory pop up?

您認為這種玩法對庫存的彈出有多嚴重？

Mentioned that there's not much so-called net-net impact from the tariff rush order yet in the second quarter. So it should translate to a normal inventory for the coming quarter. However, again, the second half visibility is very, very limited. So anything using the current data to assume may change overnight. So it's very difficult for us to give a comment on that.

提到第二季度關稅加急令所謂的淨影響還沒有太大。因此這應該轉化為下一季的正常庫存。然而，下半年的前景仍然非常有限。因此，使用當前數據進行假設的任何事物都可能在一夜之間發生變化。因此我們很難對此發表評論。

Okay. Yes, thank you.

好的。是的，謝謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Jason Zhang, CLSA.

里昂證券的 Jason Zhang。

Thank you for taking my questions. My first question is in terms of the advanced packaging. I think previously, you mentioned that UMC probably is moving -- will move into the advanced packaging market. So can you provide us more details or long-term plan in terms of this new area? And I also saw the news or rumors suggest that UMC is cooperating with US clients such as Qualcomm. So wondering if you can provide more details in terms of this new applications.

感謝您回答我的問題。我的第一個問題是關於先進封裝的。我認為之前您提到過 UMC 可能正在進軍先進封裝市場。那麼您能否向我們提供更多有關這個新領域的細節或長期計劃？而且我也看到有消息或傳聞稱聯華電子正在與高通等美國客戶合作。所以想知道您是否可以提供有關這個新應用程式的更多詳細資訊。

Thank you.

謝謝。

All right, thanks, Jason. Obviously, we can't really comment on specific customers. But as far as packaging-wise goes for -- we're very, very excited about our customer engagements in 3D wafer-to-wafer segments that encompasses RF front-end modules. also for sensor memory as well as logic, we've gotten the requirements, and they're actually picking up in terms of engagements.

好的，謝謝，傑森。顯然，我們無法對具體客戶發表評論。但就封裝而言——我們對涵蓋射頻前端模組的 3D 晶圓到晶圓領域的客戶合作感到非常興奮。對於感測器記憶體和邏輯，我們也已經獲得了需求，並且它們在參與度方面實際上正在增​​加。

As far as 2.5D Interposer, we have seen that the projects for -- HPC-related projects for interposers as well as a deep trench capacitor, these requirements have also continued to grow. So we expect that obviously will be a trend to come, and we will definitely prepare ourselves to accommodate these emerging trends.

就 2.5D 中介層而言，我們已經看到，中介層 HPC 相關項目以及深溝槽電容器的項目，這些要求也持續成長。因此，我們預期這顯然會成為一種趨勢，我們一定會做好準備來適應這些新興趨勢。

Got it. So how is the contribution do you expect in the future if those kind of projects can start meaningful shipments or volumes in this year or in the future? Thank you.

知道了。那麼，如果這些項目能夠在今年或未來開始實現有意義的出貨量或產量，您預計未來會產生什麼樣的貢獻？謝謝。

This is still in a very early stage. So we don't expect to see significant revenue contribution in 2025.

這仍處於非常早期的階段。因此，我們預計 2025 年不會有顯著的收入貢獻。

Got it. So my second question is in terms of the demand side. I think your competitor in China also suggests that there's a very solid growth momentum on demand side and their utilization rate has a meaningful improvement since second half last year. So -- and you also gave a very solid growth in Q2.

知道了。我的第二個問題是關於需求方面的。我認為你們在中國的競爭對手也顯示需求方面有著非常強勁的成長勢頭，而且自去年下半年以來他們的利用率有了顯著提高。所以——你們在第二季也實現了非常穩健的成長。

So can we assume that there's structural improvements or recovery or growth in mature node? And/or do we see a lower competition from Chinese players because of this kind of recovery or improvement? And looking into the future, if this kind of demand can further increase. I mean, can our selling price or gross margin can be driven by this kind of meaningful growth? Yes. So I wonder if you can give us more color on this. Thank you.

那麼，我們可以假設成熟節點存在結構性改善、恢復或成長嗎？或者說，由於這種復甦或改善，我們是否會看到來自中國球員的競爭降低？並展望未來，這種需求是否會進一步增加。我的意思是，我們的售價或毛利率能否受到這種有意義的成長的推動？是的。所以我想知道您是否可以對此提供更多詳細資訊。謝謝。

Yes, I wish I could jump into that conclusion. I mean that would be great. But unfortunately, that's not what we see right now. What we are seeing is really for the first quarter and the second quarter guidance, we are a little bit ahead of year -- beginning of the year guidance. So it's doing slightly better, but not too much.

是的，我希望我能得出這個結論。我的意思是那會很棒。但不幸的是，我們現在看到的情況並非如此。我們看到的第一季和第二季的業績指引確實比年初的指引略有提早。所以它的表現稍微好一些，但也不是太多。

And the increasing geopolitical tensions and the potential tariffs certainly shadow the second half and visibility has become very unclear for the second half. So we cannot jump into the conclusion you mentioned. Although UMC continue to focus on the differentiated technology in order to cope with the upcoming new competitors. And our 22/28 platform is crucial for UMC strategy to move away from the commodity type of market. And we have probably the most competitive solution in 22/28 EHV, which has enabled UMC to become the leader in OLED display market.

不斷加劇的地緣政治緊張局勢和潛在的關稅無疑給下半年蒙上了陰影，下半年的前景變得非常不明朗。所以我們不能輕易地得出你提到的結論。儘管聯電繼續專注於差異化技術，以應對即將到來的新競爭對手。我們的 22/28 平台對於聯華電子擺脫商品類型市場的策略至關重要。我們可能擁有22/28 EHV領域最具競爭力的解決方案，這使得聯華電子成為OLED顯示器市場的領導者。

In addition, our 22 ultra-low-power and 22 ultra-low-leakage technology, these offerings deliver 30% to 50% power savings compared to standard 28-nanometer nodes. And it's ideal for IoT device wearables and AI application. So all this plus our diversified manufacturing location, we believe we are in a unique position to find out those potential commodity capacity no matter where you're located. So we are confident about our strategic position. So hopefully, that answers your questions.

此外，我們的 22 超低功耗和 22 超低洩漏技術，與標準 28 奈米節點相比，這些產品可節省 30% 至 50% 的功耗。它是物聯網設備穿戴式裝置和人工智慧應用的理想選擇。因此，所有這些加上我們多元化的生產地點，我們相信，無論您位於何處，我們都處於獨特的位置來發現那些潛在的商品產能。因此，我們對我們的戰略地位充滿信心。希望這能回答你的問題。

Understood. Thank you. I have no more question back to queue.

明白了。謝謝。我沒有其他問題需要回答。

Thank you.

謝謝。

And ladies and gentlemen, we are going to take the last question. And the last one, Ted Lin, HSBC.

女士們、先生們，我們來回答最後一個問題。最後一位是匯豐銀行的林泰德 (Ted Lin)。

Hi, thank you for taking my question.

你好，謝謝你回答我的問題。

So my question is with the ongoing tension between U.S. and China, do you foresee any potential impact to your China fab? Like for example, like foreign -- are you expecting your foreign customers to reallocate their orders from your China facility to maybe outside of China, such as Singapore or Japan or even Taiwan? And do you foresee your customer -- localized customer to maybe reallocate -- also allocate their orders to domestic China foundry?

所以我的問題是，鑑於美國和中國之間持續的緊張關係，您是否預見到這會對您的中國工廠產生任何潛在影響？例如，像外國——您是否希望您的外國客戶將他們的訂單從您的中國工廠重新分配到中國以外的地區，例如新加坡、日本甚至台灣？您是否預見到您的客戶（本地客戶）可能會重新分配 - 也將他們的訂單分配給中國國內的代工廠？

First of all, in order to mitigate the geopolitical tension, what we can do is, first, to 100% following the law. So no matter if export control for any of the local compliance requirements, UMC devotes all the resources to meet the compliance and the export control requirements. So we're following every rule out there. There's no gray area for that. And secondly, we are happy with our geographically diversified production base because you never know at what point of the time there will be requirement for customers to move around their production.

首先，為了緩和地緣政治緊張局勢，我們能做的就是，第一，百分之百地遵守法律。因此，無論出口管制是否符合任何當地合規要求，聯華電子都會投入所有資源來滿足合規性和出口管制要求。因此我們遵守所有規則。這其中不存在灰色地帶。其次，我們對我們地理上多樣化的生產基地感到滿意，因為你永遠不知道什麼時候客戶會需要轉移他們的生產。

In fact, our China fab today is actually enjoying higher than corporate average loading. And we're certainly also seeing customers need to see more capacity available in our Singapore, Taiwan or Japan fab. So all we can do is really try to be as diversified as possible and make sure all these fabs can support each other in many of our major technology and offerings. That's what we can do.

事實上，我們今天的中國工廠的負載實際上高於企業平均水平。我們當然也看到客戶需要看到我們在新加坡、台灣或日本的工廠有更多可用產能。因此，我們所能做的就是盡量多樣化，並確保所有這些晶圓廠都能在我們的許多主要技術和產品上相互支援。這就是我們能做的。

Okay, thank you. That's all I have.

好的，謝謝。這就是我所擁有的一切。

And ladies and gentlemen, we thank you for your questions. That concludes today's Q&A session. And I'll turn things over to UMC IR Manager for closing remarks. David, please.

女士們、先生們，感謝你們的提問。今天的問答環節到此結束。現在我將把話題交給 UMC IR 經理來做最後發言。請戴維。

Thank you, everyone, for joining us today. We appreciate your questions. As always, if you have any additional follow-up questions, please feel free to contact UMC at ir@umc.com. Have a good day.

感謝大家今天加入我們。我們感謝您的提問。與往常一樣，如果您有任何其他後續問題，請隨時透過 ir@umc.com 聯絡 UMC。祝你有美好的一天。

Thank you. And ladies and gentlemen, that concludes our conference for first quarter '25. We thank you for your participation in UMC's conference. There will be a webcast replay within 1 hour. Please visit www.umc.com under the Investors Events section.

謝謝。女士們、先生們，2025 年第一季的會議到此結束。我們感謝您參加 UMC 的會議。1小時內將會有網路直播重播。請造訪 www.umc.com 的「投資者活動」部分。

You may now disconnect. Thank you, and goodbye.

您現在可以斷開連線。謝謝，再見。