聯華電子 (UMC) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Welcome, everyone, to UMC's 2025 second quarter earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) And for your information, this conference call is now being broadcasted live over the Internet. Webcast replay will be available within two hours after the conference is finished. Please visit our website, www.umc.com, under the Investor Relations, Investors Events section.

歡迎大家參加聯華電子2025年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）供您參考，本次電話會議現在正在透過網路現場直播。會議結束後兩小時內將提供網路直播重播。請造訪我們的網站 www.umc.com，其「投資者關係」和「投資者活動」部分。

Now, I would like to introduce Mr. Michael Lin, Head of Investor Relations at UMC. Mr. Lin, please begin.

現在，我想介紹聯華電子投資者關係主管林邁克爾先生。請林先生開始。

Thank you and welcome to UMC's conference call for the second quarter of 2025. I'm joined by Mr. Jason Wang, President of UMC; and Mr. Chi-Tung Liu, the CFO of UMC. In a moment, we will hear our CFO present the second quarter financial results, followed by our President's key message to address UMC's focus and third quarter 2025 guidance. Once our President and CFO complete their remarks, there will be a Q&A session. UMC's quarterly financial reports are available at our website, www.umc.com, under the Investors Financials section.

感謝您並歡迎參加 UMC 2025 年第二季電話會議。與我一起參加的還有聯華電子總裁 Jason Wang 先生和聯華電子財務長 Chi-Tung Liu 先生。稍後，我們將聽取我們的財務長介紹第二季的財務業績，然後聽取我們的總裁關於 UMC 的重點和 2025 年第三季指導的重要資訊。我們的總裁和財務長結束演講後，將進行問答環節。聯華電子的季度財務報告可在我們的網站 www.umc.com 的「投資者財務」部分找到。

During this conference, we may make forward-looking statements based on management's current expectations and beliefs. These forward-looking statements are subject to a number of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially, including the risks that may be beyond the company's control. For a more detailed description of these risks and uncertainties, please refer to our recent and subsequent filings with the SEC and the ROC security authorities. During this conference, you may view our financial presentation material, which is being broadcast live through the Internet.

在這次會議期間，我們可能會根據管理層目前的期望和信念做出前瞻性陳述。這些前瞻性陳述受到許多風險和不確定因素的影響，可能導致實際結果大不相同，包括可能超出公司控制範圍的風險。有關這些風險和不確定性的更詳細描述，請參閱我們最近和隨後向美國證券交易委員會和中華民國證券當局提交的文件。在這次會議期間，您可以觀看我們的財務簡報資料，該資料正在透過網路現場直播。

Now, I would like to introduce UMC's CFO, Mr. Chi-Tung Liu, to discuss UMC's second quarter 2025 financial results.

現在，我想介紹聯華電子的財務長劉啟東先生，討論聯華電子 2025 年第二季的財務表現。

Thank you, Michael. I'd like to go through the 2Q '25 investor conference presentation material, which can be downloaded or viewed in real time from our website. Starting on page four. Second quarter of 2025, consolidated revenue was TWD58.8 billion, with a gross margin at around 28.7%. The net income attributable to the stockholder of the parent was TWD8.9 billion and earnings per ordinary shares were TWD0.71. Wafer shipment in quarter two increased to 967,000, up about 6.3% quarter-over-quarter.

謝謝你，麥可。我想瀏覽一下 2025 年第二季投資者會議的簡報資料，您可以從我們的網站下載或即時查看。從第四頁開始。2025年第二季合併營收為588億新台幣，毛利率約28.7%。歸屬於母公司股東的淨利為新台幣89億元，每股盈餘為新台幣0.71元。第二季晶圓出貨量增至96.7萬片，較上季成長約6.3%。

However, the effective NT dollar exchange rate also appreciated a similar magnitude from TWD30.81 in Q1 -- sorry, from TWD32.89 in Q1 to TWD30.81 in Q2. And utilization rate increased from 69% in Q1 to 76% in quarter two.

不過，新台幣有效匯率也從第一季的30.81新台幣升值了類似的幅度——抱歉，是從第一季的32.89新台幣升值到第二季的30.81新台幣。利用率從第一季的69%上升至第二季的76%。

Revenue as a result increased about 1.6% sequentially to TWD58.75 billion. Gross margin, as we mentioned earlier, reached 28.7% or TWD16.8 billion. This is already factored in around 3% of the ForEx impact, 3 percentage points in quarter two. Net income reached TWD8.8 billion or 15.1% net income percentage rate. EPS is TWD0.71 in second quarter compared to TWD0.62 in the previous quarter.

營收因此季增約1.6%，達到587.5億新台幣。毛利率，正如我們之前提到的，達到了28.7%或168億新台幣。這已經考慮到了外匯影響的約 3%，即第二季的 3 個百分點。淨利達88億新台幣，淨利率達15.1%。第二季每股收益為新台幣0.71元，上一季為新台幣0.62元。

On page six, for first half comparison, revenue increased by 4.7% to TWD115 billion. Gross margin reached 27.7% compared to 33.1% in the same period of 2024. Net income attributable to the shareholders of the parent for first half of 2025 was TWD16.67 billion or TWD1.34 in EPS terms. Cash remained over TWD100 billion, reached about TWD111 billion at the end of first half of 2025. And total equity for the company is now around [TWD337.04 billion]. ASP edged up a little bit in the second quarter, mainly due to the better product mix.

第六頁，與上半年相比，營收成長4.7％，達到1,150億新台幣。毛利率達 27.7%，而 2024 年同期為 33.1%。2025年上半年歸屬母公司股東淨利為新台幣166.7億元，每股盈餘為新台幣1.34元。現金維持在1,000億新台幣以上，至2025年上半年末達約1,110億新台幣。目前公司總股本約為[3370.4億新台幣]。第二季平均售價略有上漲，主要得益於產品組合的改善。

On page nine, for revenue breakdown, there's literally no change on a sequential comparison basis. Europe increased to 8% and Asia reached about 67%. IDM up slightly to 19% compared to 18% in the previous quarter. In terms of application breakdown, the change is also very minor. Consumer went down to 33% by 1% and communication increased by 1% to 41%. Advanced technology revenue continued to increase and now revenue below 40-nanometer represent more than half of the total revenue, reached 55% in quarter two while 22 and 28-nanometer represent 40% of the company's total revenue.

第九頁的收入明細，以連續比較來看幾乎沒有變化。歐洲成長至8%，亞洲達到約67%。IDM 與上一季的 18% 相比小幅上漲至 19%。從應用細分來看，變化也非常小。消費者下降了 1%，達到 33%，而溝通則增加了 1%，達到 41%。先進技術收入持續增加，目前 40 奈米以下的收入佔總收入的一半以上，第二季達到 55%，而 22 和 28 奈米的收入占公司總收入的 40%。

On page 13, the capacity breakdown, we will continue to see some minor capacity increase for the third quarter, capacity increase will come from mainly 12X in Xiamen. And after the first six months, our CapEx budget for year 2025 remain unchanged at an estimate of USD1.8 billion. And the above is the summary of UMC results for second quarter 2025. More details are available in the report, which has been posted on our website. I will now turn the call over to President of UMC, Mr. Jason Wang.

在第 13 頁的產能細分中，我們將繼續看到第三季產能略有增加，產能增加主要來自廈門的 12X。經過前六個月，我們 2025 年的資本支出預算保持不變，預計 18 億美元。以上是聯華電子2025年第二季業績摘要。更多詳細資訊請參閱已發佈在我們網站上的報告。現在我將電話轉給 UMC 總裁 Jason Wang 先生。

Thank you, Chi-Tung. Good evening, everyone. Here, I would like to share UMC's second quarter results. In the second quarter, the utilization rate increased to 76% as wafer shipment grew 6.2% quarter-over-quarter, primarily driven by communications in image processors, NAND controllers, WiFi and LCD controllers.

謝謝你，Chi-Tung。大家晚上好。在這裡我想分享一下聯華電子第二季的業績。第二季度，利用率增加至 76%，因為晶圓出貨量較上季成長 6.2%，主要受到影像處理器、NAND 控制器、WiFi 和 LCD 控制器中的通訊推動。

While we experienced an increase in the overall utilization and the growth of our 22 and 28-nanometer portfolio, the unfavorable foreign exchange movement of the NT dollar kept our gross margin to 28.7% by nearly 3 percentage points.

雖然我們的整體利用率有所提高，並且 22 奈米和 28 奈米產品組合也有所增長，但新台幣的不利匯率走勢使我們的毛利率保持在 28.7%，降幅接近 3 個百分點。

Revenue from our 22 and 28-nanometer portfolio continued to grow sequentially, now accounting for 40% of total sales, a record high in both percentage and absolute dollar terms. Our industry-leading 22 and 28-nanometer solutions continue to win adoption by customers, and we expect to see further market share gains in wireless communications over the coming quarters.

我們的 22 奈米和 28 奈米產品組合的收入持續連續成長，目前佔總銷售額的 40%，無論以百分比或絕對美元計算，都創下歷史新高。我們業界領先的 22 奈米和 28 奈米解決方案繼續贏得客戶的採用，我們預計未來幾季無線通訊市場的份額將進一步擴大。

We have always believed that with the right differentiation, 22, 28-nanometer is a strong and long-lasting node with a robust product pipeline. In addition, the new Phase II facility at our Singapore Fab 12i set to start production in 2026, will enable UMC to better serve customers seeking diversified manufacturing for enhanced supply chain resilience.

我們始終相信，只要有正確的差異化，22、28 奈米是一個強大且持久的節點，擁有強大的產品線。此外，我們新加坡 Fab 12i 的新二期設施將於 2026 年投入生產，這將使聯華電子能夠更好地服務於尋求多元化製造以增強供應鏈彈性的客戶。

Looking ahead to the third quarter, we expect a mild increase in wafer shipments. However, adverse foreign exchange movement will lead to a decline in NT dollar revenue. We are closely monitoring the near-term uncertainties and risks as the market anticipate US tariff policies. To navigate macro and geopolitical headwinds, including foreign exchange risks, UMC will continue to actively manage our foreign exchange exposure and maintain financial flexibility to enhance our financial structure and business resilience.

展望第三季度，我們預期晶圓出貨量將溫和成長。然而，外匯走勢不利，將導致新台幣收入下降。由於市場預期美國關稅政策，我們正在密切關注近期的不確定性和風險。為了應對包括外匯風險在內的宏觀和地緣政治不利因素，聯華電子將繼續積極管理我們的外匯風險敞口並保持財務靈活性，以增強我們的財務結構和業務彈性。

Now, let's move on to the third quarter 2025 guidance. Our wafer shipment will increase by low single-digit percentage. However, NT dollar-denominated revenue is fully exposed to fluctuation in the foreign exchange rate. For instance, a 5% appreciation in the NT dollar will result in a corresponding 5% reduction in reported NT dollar revenue.

現在，讓我們來看看 2025 年第三季的指引。我們的晶圓出貨量將以低個位數百分比成長。然而，以新台幣計價的收入完全受到外匯匯率波動的影響。例如，新台幣升值5%將導致報告的新台幣收入相應減少5%。

ASP in the US dollar will remain firm. Q3 gross margin will be approximately Q2 gross margin subject to the foreign exchange effect. Therefore, our Q3 gross margin will be approximately equal to that of Q2 under the assumption the foreign exchange rate is at the current level. Capacity utilization rate will be in the mid-70% range. Our 2025 cash-based CapEx budget will remain unchanged at USD1.8 billion.

以美元計算的平均售價將維持堅挺。受外匯影響，第三季毛利率將與第二季毛利率大致相同。因此，假設外匯匯率處於當前水平，我們第三季的毛利率將與第二季大致相同。產能利用率將在70%左右。我們 2025 年的現金資本支出預算將維持不變，為 18 億美元。

That concludes my comments. Thank you all for your attention. Now we are ready for questions.

我的評論到此結束。謝謝大家的關注。現在我們可以回答問題了。

(Operator Instructions) Brad Lin, Bank of America.

（操作員指示）美國銀行的布拉德林 (Brad Lin)。

I have two questions. The first one will be on the ASP trend. So what's the initial outlook and view on the ASP trend into 2026, given the higher expense and cost? Obviously, we are happy to learn the stable ASP in near term. But yeah, any initial view for 2026?

我有兩個問題。第一個是關於 ASP 趨勢。那麼，考慮到更高的費用和成本，對 2026 年 ASP 趨勢的初步展望和看法是什麼？顯然，我們很高興在短期內了解穩定的 ASP。但是，對 2026 年有什麼初步看法嗎？

Well, I mean, typically, we don't guide anything beyond that, beyond 2025. So as you said, we can talk about the near term of ASP outlook, but you'll be interested in looking into a longer-term ASP projection. And so let's share about the ASP strategy.

嗯，我的意思是，通常我們不會指導超過 2025 年的事情。正如您所說，我們可以談論近期的 ASP 前景，但您會對研究長期的 ASP 預測感興趣。那麼讓我們來分享一下 ASP 策略。

We'll continue -- our goal is to continue to differentiate our technology offering and product mix and to maintain and improve our ASP resilience. We want to further widen the gap in technology offerings while increased revenue contribution by those respected notes following our rollout of the 22 and 28-nanometer technologies, we'll continue to provide specialty technology in 40 and 55-nanometer node where the percentage of our revenue contribution, competing with the pricing foundries will continue to decline.

我們將繼續——我們的目標是繼續區分我們的技術產品和產品組合，並保持和提高我們的 ASP 彈性。我們希望進一步擴大技術產品的差距，同時透過這些受人尊敬的筆記增加收入貢獻，在我們推出 22 和 28 奈米技術之後，我們將繼續在 40 和 55 奈米節點提供專業技術，在這些節點上，我們的收入貢獻百分比與定價代工廠的競爭將繼續下降。

For the near term, the -- our CFO actually mentioned, our Q2 ASP saw a low single-digit increase driven by the higher 22 and 28 product mix. And in Q3, we expect the product mix remains unchanged. Therefore, ASP will remain firm for this year.

就短期而言，我們的財務長實際上提到，受 22 和 28 種產品組合的推動，我們的第二季平均銷售價格出現了低個位數成長。我們預計第三季的產品組合將保持不變。因此，今年的平均售價將保持堅挺。

Got it. And my second question would be, well, we have seen, well, in the presentation, 14-nanometer and below mix are listed in the slide at zero for a while but still listed in there. So should we expect the number to increase? And will that be from 12-nanometer or potentially also 6-nanometer?

知道了。我的第二個問題是，我們已經看到，在演示中，14 奈米及以下的混合物在幻燈片中列為零，但仍然列在那裡。那麼我們是否應該預期這個數字會增加呢？那會是 12 奈米還是也可能是 6 奈米？

Well, okay, 12-nanometer is still a bit far for us for that particular program and the cooperation with Intel is progressing well and remain on track according to the project milestone. At present, our both teams are working on very certain performance for the pipeline. And we expect that the earliest PDK will be ready for this first week customer in June 2026. We expect customer product tapeout to begin in 2027. So we'll probably see some revenue in that timeframe.

好吧，對於我們這個特定項目來說，12 奈米仍然有點遙遠，與英特爾的合作進展順利，並按照專案里程碑保持正常進行。目前，我們兩個團隊都在為管道的非常確定的性能而努力。我們預計最早的 PDK 將於 2026 年 6 月為該第一週客戶準備好。我們預計客戶產品將於 2027 年開始流片。因此我們可能會在這段時間內看到一些收入。

So I think that's the 12. And we continue margin in that direction. If we go beyond that, we don't have any concrete plan for anything beyond the 12-nanometer today. Our development effort will continue to focus on that and as we broaden our specialty technology portfolio on both ends. And so that is definitely on our roadmap. But once we have more Congress update, we will share it with you.

所以我認為是 12。我們會繼續朝這個方向努力。如果我們超越這個目標，那麼我們目前還沒有任何超越 12 奈米的具體計劃。我們的開發工作將繼續集中於此，並擴大我們在兩端的專業技術組合。所以這肯定在我們的路線圖上。但一旦我們有更多國會更新消息，我們將與你們分享。

Currently, the most important step is to deliver the highly competitive solution for mass production and 12-nanometer through our cooperation with our partners. And for anything beyond that, we will explore the future opportunity through the partnership arrangement and which we believe that will be mutual beneficial.

目前最重要的一步是透過與合作夥伴的合作，提供極具競爭力的量產和12奈米解決方案。除此之外，我們還將透過合作安排探索未來的機會，我們相信這將是互惠互利的。

Charlie Chan, Morgan Stanley.

陳查理 (Charlie Chan)，摩根士丹利。

And my first question is about the tariff impact of your customers be heavier? Do you see kind of pull in? And what does it impact to your second half or outlook?

我的第一個問題是，關稅對你們的客戶的影響會更大嗎？你看到有種拉力嗎？這對您的下半年或前景有何影響？

Sure. We do observe some of the demand upside in the Q2, and as well as Q3 is partly driven by the inventory buildup in anticipation of a potential US tariffs. And so for UMC's first half '25 results, which is in line with our guidance of the Q2 wafer shipment increased 6.2% to 3% quarter-over-quarter. While the Q3 demand increased on a higher base, we expect the shipment will still grow mildly sequentially. And so there are some observations about that.

當然。我們確實觀察到第二季的需求上升，而第三季的需求上升部分是由於預期美國可能徵收關稅而導致的庫存增加。因此，對於聯華電子 25 年上半年的業績而言，這與我們對第二季晶圓出貨量的預期相符，季增 6.2% 至 3%。儘管第三季需求在較高基數上成長，但我們預計出貨量仍將較上季溫和成長。因此，對此有一些觀察。

But given the 2025 market dynamics, such as the adjustment to the US policies and ongoing geopolitical and macro uncertainty, the usual seasonal pattern may be different. We, along with our customers, we're closely monitoring those end market signals.

但考慮到2025年的市場動態，例如美國政策的調整以及持續的地緣政治和宏觀不確定性，通常的季節性模式可能會有所不同。我們和我們的客戶正在密切關注這些終端市場訊號。

I see. And I think lots of discussion about the future advanced packaging technology, right? So Jason, can you share with us about your business development here? And also, I think you have some interposer capacity, right? How are we going to utilize those capacity going forward? And maybe some color about the potential applications.

我懂了。我認為關於未來先進封裝技術的討論很多，對嗎？那麼 Jason，您能與我們分享您在這裡的業務發展嗎？而且，我認為你們有一些中介能力，對嗎？我們今後將如何利用這些產能？也許還包含一些有關潛在應用的詳細資訊。

Sure. Well, I mean, we're not missing -- we don't want to miss out the advanced packaging opportunity. We are preparing our advanced packaging solution for what we see for the growing energy consumption of the cloud AI as well as the potential growth in the edge AI market. So first, to address the power efficiency requirement for the high computing processor, UMC is developing the 2.5D interposer with DTC and discreted DTC, which is that's going to be the roadmap coming up. And right now, the current interposer is moving on to the next generation, and we're waiting for to introduce this and expect to ramp after that.

當然。嗯，我的意思是，我們不會錯過——我們不想錯過先進封裝的機會。我們正在為雲端 AI 不斷增長的能源消耗以及邊緣 AI 市場的潛在成長準備先進的封裝解決方案。首先，為了滿足高運算處理器的功率效率要求，UMC 正在開發具有 DTC 和分立 DTC 的 2.5D 中介層，這將是即將推出的路線圖。目前，目前的中介層正在進入下一代，我們正在等待推出這項產品，並期望在此之後實現提升。

Second, the UMC is leveraging the scalable 3D wafer-to-wafer stacking and TSB to enhance the competitiveness of our specialty technology. We are currently in mass production for the extremely small form factor for the 5G and 6G RFIC. And based on the success of the 5G and 6G RFIC with the wafer-to-wafer stacking, we are also developing memory to memory stacking and memory to logic stacking service for the high-bandwidth computation requirements.

其次，聯華電子正在利用可擴展的 3D 晶圓到晶圓堆疊和 TSB 來增強我們的特色技術的競爭力。我們目前正在大規模生產 5G 和 6G RFIC 的超小尺寸產品。並且基於 5G 和 6G RFIC 在晶圓到晶圓堆疊方面的成功，我們也正在開發記憶體到記憶體堆疊和記憶體到邏輯堆疊服務，以滿足高頻寬運算需求。

Okay. And my last question, again, is always -- want to consult your -- pickup your points about the semiconductor cycle. But I believe this is the third consecutive year, we don't see the second half recoveries. What do you think is happening on this semiconductor industry? Why we don't see seasonality or so-called cyclicality, right? Because I remember in the past, you have like upcycle and shortage overcapacity and then correction but we see don't see that anymore.

好的。我的最後一個問題始終是—想諮詢您—了解您關於半導體週期的觀點。但我相信這是連續第三年，我們沒有看到下半年的復甦。您認為半導體產業正在發生什麼？為什麼我們看不到季節性或所謂的周期性？因為我記得在過去，有過上升週期、產能過剩和隨後的調整，但現在我們不再看到這種情況了。

I mean, certainly, the visibility is actually lower nowadays. You're absolutely right. When we start the year in 2025, we actually expect the 2025 growth outlook will be slightly better than our addressable market. And we think our addressable market is going to grow slightly at a low single digit. And we think we -- at this moment, we still expect our 2025 growth outlook will remain unchanged. So that stays.

我的意思是，現在的可見度確實較低。你說得完全正確。當我們開始 2025 年時，我們實際上預計 2025 年的成長前景將略好於我們的潛在市場。我們認為我們的潛在市場將以較低的個位數小幅成長。我們認為—目前，我們仍然預計 2025 年的成長前景將保持不變。所以就這樣保留了。

But beyond the 2025 or 2026, we have to closely working with our customers and sharing their visibility and as well as monitoring the DOI situation. As of today, I think the DOI is getting to the healthy level. We've seen that DOI approaching to the healthy level about a quarter or two quarters ago. And right now, the computer, consumer and communication segment is still healthy, remain healthy while the automotive and industrial still remain high. So I think while monitoring the macroeconomics as well as the DOI and then we can only hope that soon later, we will see the upcycle. But right now, the visibility is pretty low.

但到了 2025 年或 2026 年以後，我們必須與客戶密切合作，分享他們的可見度並監控 DOI 情況。截至今天，我認為 DOI 已達到健康水平。大約一個季度或兩個季度前，我們看到 DOI 接近健康水平。目前，電腦、消費和通訊領域仍然健康，而汽車和工業仍然保持高位。因此，我認為，在監測宏觀經濟和 DOI 的同時，我們只能希望不久之後就能看到上升週期。但目前，能見度相當低。

Okay. Yeah. So maybe try to again about Brad's question about pricing. So yeah, because obviously, FX impact over Taiwan, Taiwan foundry a lot in terms of gross margin. Would there be a factor you can put on the table to negotiate with your customers for next year's pricing?

好的。是的。因此也許可以再次嘗試回答布拉德關於定價的問題。是的，顯然外匯對台灣、台灣代工廠的毛利率影響很大。在與客戶協商明年的定價時，您是否可以提出一些因素？

I mean, we continue working with our customers in terms of pricing compensation closely, but those are more of a tactical conversation. I think, fundamentally, I reported earlier, I think our key focus is try to differentiate our technology offering, and so that we can continue to enhance our product mix improve the ASP resilience. And that's what we're marching.

我的意思是，我們繼續與客戶在定價補償方面密切合作，但這更多的是戰術對話。我認為，從根本上來說，正如我之前報告的那樣，我們的重點是嘗試使我們的技術產品與眾不同，這樣我們就可以繼續增強我們的產品組合，提高 ASP 的彈性。這就是我們所追求的。

And we have a very clear roadmap today that on many fronts of our technology development. So our goal is going to further widen the gap in technology offering and increase the revenue contribution from those expected notes and technology offering in which we think that we can make sure that our ASP can remain resilient.

如今，我們在技術發展的許多方面都有非常清晰的路線圖。因此，我們的目標是進一步擴大技術產品的差距，並增加預期票據和技術產品的收入貢獻，我們認為這可以確保我們的 ASP 保持彈性。

Gokul Hariharan, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的 Gokul Hariharan。

First of all, for the Singapore fab, 28-nanometer and 22-nanometer expansion, could you talk a little bit about what is the current pace of the ramp-up and the kind of customers that you're ramping up there. Obviously, some of the pricing negotiations that you had back in '22 and '23, obviously, had some price escalators. Could you talk a little bit about whether those prices later still exist given the environment has definitely changed somewhat. So that's on the 28-nanometer part, yes.

首先，對於新加坡晶圓廠的 28 奈米和 22 奈米擴建，您能否談談目前的擴張速度以及在那裡擴張的客戶類型。顯然，您在 22 年和 23 年進行的一些定價談判顯然存在一些價格調整。您能否談談，鑑於環境確實發生了一些變化，這些價格是否仍然存在？是的，這是 28 奈米部分。

Sure. Well, for the 12i Singapore facility, given the current market dynamics and customer alignment, we project the 12 Phase 3 production ramp will start in January 2026. And it will ramp up with a higher volume starting in the second half of 2026. And that's the current ramp plan.

當然。對於 12i 新加坡工廠，考慮到當前的市場動態和客戶協調，我們預計 12 第三階段的生產將於 2026 年 1 月開始。從 2026 年下半年開始，產量將進一步增加。這就是目前的坡道計畫。

Many of this ramp schedule and alignment is based on the customers' close communications. And right now, given the application ramp-up is going to be mainly in the communication with our 22-nanometer high-voltage devices, and we still believe our 22 and 28-nanometer high solution are differentiated from the market. And so the ASPs still remain very healthy at this point.

許多爬坡時間表和調整都是基於與客戶的密切溝通。目前，鑑於應用的成長將主要集中在與我們的 22 奈米高壓設備的通訊方面，我們仍然相信我們的 22 和 28 奈米高壓解決方案與市場有所不同。因此，ASP 目前仍然非常健康。

Got it. Secondly, on gross margins, so we are roughly in the mid-70s utilization, and we're kind of in the mid- to high 20s gross margin. I think depreciation definitely started to grow again and it looks like it's going to grow into the next couple of years as you bring in 12i.

知道了。其次，就毛利率而言，我們的利用率大約在 75% 左右，毛利率則在 25% 左右。我認為折舊肯定又開始增長了，而且隨著 12i 的推出，看起來未來幾年折舊還會繼續增長。

So could you talk a little bit about what is kind of the realistic pathway for us to get back to that mid-30s gross margins or low to mid-30s margins that we have talked about. Currency is not something that we control, but maybe talk about some of the other factors. Like is that kind of like a realistic goal that you're pursuing? And can I think back to some of the previous questions, can pricing be a realistic tool to kind of get there or is it more challenging to use price as a tool together?

那麼，您能否稍微談談，讓我們回到 35% 左右的毛利率或 35% 左右的低點到中位數利潤率的現實途徑是什麼？貨幣不是我們能控制的，但也許可以談談其他一些因素。這就像是你追求的現實目標嗎？我可以回想一下之前的一些問題嗎？定價可以成為實現這一目標的現實工具嗎？還是同時使用價格作為一種工具更具挑戰性？

Well, absolutely. I mean, it's that our mission to continue to improve the gross margin back to the reasonable level. Given the current loading is frustrating -- fluctuating around the 70%, definitely putting some pressure in terms of the gross margin, while the depreciation increase. And so the focus is very clear. I kind of answered Charlie earlier that we are focused on technology development, technology offering, even a new technology offering and partnership engagement and with the product mix improved, and we think that we have a path going back to the reasonable level.

嗯，絕對是如此。我的意思是，我們的使命是繼續提高毛利率，使其回到合理水平。鑑於目前的負荷令人沮喪——在 70% 左右波動，肯定會給毛利率帶來一些壓力，而折舊也會增加。所以重點非常明確。我之前回答過查理，我們專注於技術開發、技術提供，甚至是新技術提供和合作夥伴關係，隨著產品組合的改善，我們認為我們已經找到了回到合理水平的方法。

For the past, we have been maintaining our foundry shares in our addressable market segment. Based on our current design pipeline, we anticipate more share gains in 2026 as well as going into 2027, particularly in the 22 and 28 nanometers pocket today. Now, while we rolled out the other technology offering, we think this will continue to improve and we will definitely march to the direction to go back to the right level of the gross margin level.

過去，我們一直在我們可尋址的市場領域中保持我們的代工份額。根據我們目前的設計流程，我們預計 2026 年以及 2027 年的份額將進一步成長，尤其是在當今的 22 奈米和 28 奈米領域。現在，當我們推出其他科技產品時，我們認為情況會繼續改善，我們一定會朝著回到毛利率正確水準的方向前進。

If I may add on to that, our annual depreciation growth is going to peak out. So if you recall, in year 2023, our depreciation expense increased by more than 20% year-over-year and similar magnitude for 2024. And similar magnitude for this year for 2025. But therefore, '26 and '27, the increased magnitude will be a lot less, could drop down to single digits. So hopefully, we will have better cost structure moving into year 2026 and '27.

如果我可以補充一點的話，我們的年度折舊成長將會達到高峰。所以如果你還記得的話，2023 年我們的折舊費用年增了 20% 以上，2024 年的折舊費用也增加了類似的幅度。2025 年的規模也與今年類似。但因此，26年和27年，增幅將會小很多，可能會降至個位數。因此希望我們在 2026 年和 2027 年能夠擁有更好的成本結構。

Maybe one more question on the high-voltage side for 28 and 22. Jason, do we have a pathway below 22-nanometer for high-voltage given there's been some discussion about some of the driver is related products moving below that, be it to some kind of a FinFET node, but enabling high voltage?

關於 28 和 22 的高壓側可能還有一個問題。傑森，鑑於已經討論過一些驅動器相關產品是否低於 22 奈米，我們是否有一條低於 22 奈米的高壓路徑，無論是某種 FinFET 節點，還是實現高壓？

It's definitely on our roadmap today. They are. And while we still believe the 22 HV will be the most compelling and competitive solution today as well as next couple of years. But yeah, the FinFET solution of the high voltage is on our roadmap, yeah.

這絕對是我們今天的路線圖。是的。我們仍然相信 22 HV 將是當今以及未來幾年最具吸引力和競爭力的解決方案。但是，是的，高壓 FinFET 解決方案在我們的路線圖上，是的。

And any timeline in terms of when you think customers will start demanding this?

您認為客戶何時會開始提出這種要求？

That was still aligning with our customers. And again, it's contemplating between the value proposition of the 22 versus the next node. And we are closely working on that. And I don't have a specific timeframe, but I kind of don't want to give a guess right now because giving all the data on hand, we're still seeing the 22-nanometer high voltage will have a lag. There will probably be another year to close to two years.

這仍然與我們的客戶保持一致。再次，它正在考慮 22 與下一個節點的價值主張。我們正在為此密切努力。我沒有具體的時間表，但我現在不想做出猜測，因為根據手頭上的所有數據，我們仍然看到 22 奈米高壓會存在滯後。大概還要一年到接近兩年的時間。

Understood. Maybe one last question. Several of the consumer fabless companies are guiding down Q3 quite meaningfully. Your own wafer orders are slightly moving up in Q3. Should we expect that there could be a pickup in Q4? Like every year seems to be a different seasonality but just wanted to understand how you think about that inventory cycle for many of the Asian consumer fabless companies, which are your key customers as well.

明白了。也許還有最後一個問題。幾家消費性無晶圓廠公司的第三季業績均大幅下滑。你們自己的晶圓訂單在第三季略有上升。我們是否應該預期第四季會出現回升？就像每年似乎都有不同的季節性，但我只是想了解您如何看待許多亞洲消費無晶圓廠公司的庫存週期，這些公司也是您的主要客戶。

Sure. I mean, the inventory situation actually is quite healthy with a major segment already. And auto and industrial, I think they're still kind of high, but the rest is actually quite healthy. At this point, given the visibility, we do not guide in Q4 at this time. But our view for the full year 2025 will remain unchanged. And again, I kind of touched that earlier that we expect our addressable market will grow by the low single digit, and we will still outgrow the addressable market in 2025.

當然。我的意思是，庫存狀況實際上已經相當健康，並且主要部分已經存在。而汽車和工業，我認為它們仍然處於較高水平，但其餘部分實際上相當健康。目前，考慮到可見性，我們目前不會對第四季度做出指導。但我們對 2025 年全年的展望將保持不變。我之前再次提到過，我們預計我們的潛在市場將以低個位數成長，並且到 2025 年我們的成長速度仍將超過潛在市場。

And the biggest challenge nowadays is really the visibility given the macro uncertainties and the geopolitical concerns, I think the customer is being cautious. It doesn't mean that they don't have demand. The question is they kind of want to play this thing in a different manner. So we're working consistent. And meanwhile, Q2 is growing, Q3 slightly sequentially. And Q4, we just have to play and see, and we will definitely report that next quarter. But meanwhile, we've seen the overall 2025 projection, it's still unchanged.

而目前最大的挑戰實際上是宏觀不確定性和地緣政治擔憂下的可見性，我認為客戶正在變得謹慎。這並不意味著他們沒有需求。問題是他們想以不同的方式來玩這個遊戲。所以我們一直在堅持不懈地努力。與此同時，第二季度正在成長，第三季較上季略有成長。至於第四季度，我們只需要觀察一下，我們肯定會在下個季度報告。但同時，我們看到2025年的整體預測仍然沒有改變。

Sunny Lin, UBS.

瑞銀的 Sunny Lin。

So my first question is on 28-nanometer. So if we look at Q2, Jason, what's driving the revenue upfront, is it driven by the 22-nanometer migration or is it through a product mix upgrade? And then looking ahead, could you share a bit more on your share gain in wireless communications and maybe some of the other products going to 2026?

我的第一個問題是關於 28 奈米的。因此，如果我們看一下第二季度，Jason，是什麼推動了前期收入的成長，是由 22 奈米遷移推動的，還是透過產品組合升級？展望未來，您能否分享更多關於無線通訊領域的份額成長以及到 2026 年其他一些產品的成長？

Okay. Well, for the near term, the 22 and 28 revenue contribution increase is mainly coming out from the communication in Q2, computing and communications segment, but mainly on communications in Q2. Going forward, we are highly, highly confident in the continuous growth of 22 and 28 nanometers business in 2025 MPR going into 2026. The strong demand outlook is supported by the continued tape-out momentum, many different applications, thanks to our customers, of course. But again, it's really supported by UMC's differentiated technology and the regional manufacturing booking as well.

好的。嗯，就短期而言，22 和 28 的營收貢獻成長主要來自第二季的通訊、計算和通訊部門，但主要來自第二季的通訊。展望未來，我們對 2025 年 MPR 至 2026 年 22 奈米和 28 奈米業務的持續成長充滿信心。強勁的需求前景受到持續的流片勢頭和許多不同應用的支持，當然這要感謝我們的客戶。但同樣，它也確實得到了聯華電子差異化技術和區域製造預訂的支持。

This includes our 12i fab in Singapore, which the P3 fab expansion is on track, and we are on track to ramp in 2026. We'll begin contributing the revenue in the second half of 2026, and this will further strengthen our 22 and 28 capacity and support for the growing demand. The combination of the technology proposition, manufacturing quality and well-positioned capacity setup will ensure our 22 and 28 will remain the core growth engine for the next year, '26.

其中包括我們位於新加坡的 12i 晶圓廠，該廠的 P3 晶圓廠擴建工程正在按計劃進行，我們預計在 2026 年實現量產。我們將在 2026 年下半年開始貢獻收入，這將進一步增強我們的 22 和 28 產能並支持不斷增長的需求。技術主張、製造品質和良好的產能設定相結合，將確保我們的 22 和 28 仍將是明年（26 年）的核心成長引擎。

So on 12i, would you be able to price the wafers of the higher -- give a higher cost structure? And when you talk about high volume production starting from second half of 2026, any type of capacity that we should expect?

那麼在 12i 上，您能否為更高的晶圓定價—提供更高的成本結構？當您談到從 2026 年下半年開始的大批量生產時，我們應該期待什麼樣的產能？

Well, I mean, we kind of don't want to go exactly capacity size, but we are quickly ramping our P3. And we look at this 22 and 28 capacity on a total basis between our old authorities. And I think the old utilization rate across the different facility 22 and 28 were above October average. Even today, they are above our corporate average.

嗯，我的意思是，我們不太想精確地提高產能，但我們正在快速提升我們的 P3。我們將舊有權限中的容量總計視為 22 和 28。我認為 22 號和 28 號不同設施的舊利用率高於 10 月的平均水平。即使在今天，他們的表現也高於我們公司的平均水平。

And the question about the -- I kind of missed your earlier question, the first question.

關於這個問題——我有點錯過了你之前的問題，第一個問題。

Pricing for Singapore. Would you be able to price a bit higher given cost is higher as well?

新加坡的定價。考慮到成本也較高，您能否將價格提高一點？

No matter, I missed this. It's a sensitive subject. Well, right now, again, our pricing position is based on our technology offering our value proposition. And I think that's the baseline of the ASP.

沒關係，我錯過了。這是一個敏感話題。嗯，現在，我們的定價立場是基於我們提供的價值主張的技術。我認為這是 ASP 的基線。

In terms of the diversified location, we have to work with our customers to understand the needs, right? So we want them to stay competitive and we want them to acknowledge the differentiated offering of our technology as well as the geolocation benefit. It's a subject that we will talk about with our customers, but mainly on the technology differentiation as will see their competitiveness.

就多元化地點而言，我們必須與客戶合作以了解需求，對嗎？因此，我們希望他們保持競爭力，我們希望他們能認可我們技術的差異化產品以及地理定位優勢。我們會與客戶討論這個主題，但主要專注於技術差異化，以了解他們的競爭力。

Got it. That's helpful. I have a question on the Intel partnership. Seems like Intel is becoming less proactive in pursuing the foundry ambitions with the new management. So I wonder how does that affect the business development with the UMC? And let's say, if Intel want to scale down and then look to maybe sell the capacity, in that case, would UMC be interested in acquiring the capacity, assuming the price is reasonable?

知道了。這很有幫助。我對英特爾合作關係有疑問。在新的管理階層領導下，英特爾似乎在追求代工目標方面變得不那麼積極了。所以我想知道這會對與 UMC 的業務發展產生什麼影響？假設英特爾想要縮減規模，然後考慮出售產能，那麼在這種情況下，假設價格合理，聯華電子是否有興趣收購產能？

Well, first, I think it's hard to comment any speculation, and I don't want to comment about the partner priority within the company but I can only comment about our program. And our current program with them, like I said earlier, the cooperation with Intel is progressing very well and the milestones remain on track. And most importantly, both parties are very committed to this 12-nanometer cooperation. And so I see no change at this point, and we still have very high expectation with this program.

嗯，首先，我認為很難評論任何猜測，我不想評論公司內部的合作夥伴優先權，但我只能評論我們的計劃。正如我之前所說，我們目前與英特爾的合作項目進展順利，各項里程碑仍在按計畫進行。最重要的是，雙方都非常致力於這次12奈米的合作。所以我認為目前沒有任何變化，我們仍然對這個項目抱有很高的期望。

(Operator Instructions) Jason Tsang, CLSA.

（操作員指示）Jason Tsang，里昂證券。

Just wanted to follow up the impact from the FX ratio. Can you provide your FX ratios for Q3?

只是想追蹤外匯比率的影響。您能提供第三季的外匯比率嗎？

So first of all, every 1% move appreciation of NT dollars against US dollars, it will erode our gross margin of about 0.4 percentage points to 0.5 percentage points. That's where the 3 percentage points erosion come from on back of the 6% plus NT dollar appreciation against US dollars. And for Q3, we don't do forecast but we are using current ForEx rate, which is nearly 29.8 when we give our guidance. And a reminder, for quarter two, the weighted average was 30.1.

首先，新台幣兌美元每公升值1%，就會侵蝕我們的毛利率約0.4個百分點至0.5個百分點。這就是新台幣兌美元升值 6% 以上導致人民幣匯率下滑 3 個百分點的原因。對於第三季度，我們沒有做預測，但我們使用當前的外匯匯率，當我們給予指引時，匯率接近 29.8。提醒一下，第二季的加權平均值為 30.1。

My second question is in terms of the competition. It seems like your Chinese competitors now have better or higher titrate currently. So do we see a better market or lower competitions in the mature nodes? And how can UMC benefit from this lower competition?

我的第二個問題是關於比賽的。看起來你們的中國競爭對手目前有更好或更高的滴定率。那麼，在成熟節點中，我們是否會看到更好的市場或更低的競爭？那麼聯華電子如何從這種較低的競爭中獲益呢？

Well, at this point, more than half of our revenue comes from specialty technology solutions, which serve our customer demand in differentiated technologies. For instance, our 222A, I kind of touched on earlier, is probably the most competitive solution in high-end smartphone OLED display market. In addition, our 22 ultra-low leakage and low-power technology will deliver another 30% to 50% better power saving compared to standard 28.

目前，我們一半以上的收入來自專業技術解決方案，這些解決方案可以滿足客戶對差異化技術的需求。例如，我之前提到的 222A 可能是高階智慧型手機 OLED 顯示器市場上最具競爭力的解決方案。此外，我們的 22 超低漏電和低功耗技術與標準 28 相比，可再節省 30% 至 50% 的電量。

So we are positioned ourselves as a specialty foundry partner focused on low leakage, low-power logic, embedded high voltage, embedded memory, RFSOI solutions. We want to continue to provide specialty technology where the percentage of revenue contribution in this space will increase and the percentage of the revenue contribution competing with the Chinese foundries will continue to decline. I think that's our focus. And I think that we have making quite a bit of progress already, and we think there's more room for us to improve on that.

因此，我們將自己定位為專注於低洩漏、低功耗邏輯、嵌入式高壓、嵌入式記憶體、RFSOI 解決方案的專業代工合作夥伴。我們希望繼續提供專業技術，該領域的收入貢獻百分比將會增加，而與中國代工廠競爭的收入貢獻百分比將繼續下降。我認為這是我們的重點。我認為我們已經取得了相當大的進展，我們也認為還有更多的改進空間。

Laura Chen, Citi.

花旗銀行的 Laura Chen。

Just a quick follow-up. I want to understand your view on the long-term gross margin outlook. We understand that there's a lot of moving parts, rising depreciation and also currencies, etc. But we do see that recently the utilization rate is kind of improving back to high 70%. And as we're moving into Q3 with the wafer shipment also going up. So what's our view on our so-called long-term gross margin target, if you can give us some more color on that.

只是一個快速的跟進。我想了解您對長期毛利率前景的看法。我們知道有很多因素在起作用，例如貨幣貶值、匯率上升等等。但我們確實看到，最近利用率正在回升至 70% 的高點。隨著我們進入第三季度，晶圓出貨量也在上升。那麼，我們對所謂的長期毛利率目標有何看法，您能否提供我們更多細節？

Well, I mean, right now, mid-70% is not great. And so obviously, loading will be one of the important focus. And to improve the loading, fundamentally, you have to provide competitive solutions to customers. So like I said, we focus on technology differentiation, focused on new technology development and then following with the key customer partners and engagement. So by doing that, we think the loading will increase. And so as well as the gross margin will get healthier.

嗯，我的意思是，現在，70% 左右並不是很好。因此，顯然，裝載將成為重要焦點之一。而要提高裝載量，從根本上來說，你必須為客戶提供有競爭力的解決方案。所以就像我說的，我們專注於技術差異化，專注於新技術開發，然後專注於關鍵客戶合作夥伴和參與。因此，我們認為這樣做可以增加負載。因此毛利率也會變得更健康。

And the other one is, of course, the cost for the depreciation increase, and Chi-Tung also touched that earlier, this couple of years, we have a significant depreciation increase. And after this 2025, I think the increased percentage will start getting more mild. And so while we improve the loading and maintaining the cost structure -- and the next thing is, of course, the ASP management.

另一個當然是折舊成本的增加，Chi-Tung 也提到，這幾年我們的折舊成本大幅增加。而2025年之後，我認為成長的百分比將會開始變得更加溫和。因此，在我們改善裝載量並維持成本結構的同時——接下來當然是 ASP 管理。

From ASP management and with the more compelling solution and you have a more diversified manufacturing site and manufacturing quality. And we think the ASP will -- the branded ASP will remain resilient. Not to mention, we will continue marching forward with our 12-nanometer development. And hopefully, that we can continue to improve the product mix as well.

透過 ASP 管理和更具吸引力的解決方案，您將擁有更多樣化的製造基地和製造品質。我們認為品牌平均售價將保持彈性。更不用說，我們將繼續推進 12 奈米技術的發展。並希望我們能夠繼續改善產品組合。

So giving all those is putting a roadmap for us to improve our market relevance and position as well as our financial performance. And for the past, we have already improved our structure profitability in terms of our breakeven point and continue. On that front, we already see an effect and benefit. But going forward, there's still work to do. And combining all those, we think we have a roadmap to march into a better result.

因此，所有這些都為我們改善市場相關性和地位以及財務表現提供了路線圖。過去，我們已經在損益平衡點方面提高了結構獲利能力，並將繼續提高。在這方面，我們已經看到了效果和好處。但展望未來，仍有工作要做。結合所有這些，我們認為我們已經有了走向更好結果的路線圖。

Sure. Chi-Tung, can you also remind us what will be the depreciation cost increase for this year or maybe next year?

當然。Chi-Tung，您能否提醒我們今年或明年的折舊成本將增加多少？

This year is low 20% year-over-year. Next year is still a very rough estimate. But as I mentioned, the magnitude of increase will decline significantly maybe to below 10%.

今年的年增幅較低，為 20%。明年仍然是一個非常粗略的估計。但正如我所提到的，增幅將大幅下降，可能降至10%以下。

Okay. My next question is also about our operation in China. As we know, we still have two fabs in China. Even though there's always very fierce competition, do we see any possibility that our IDM customers? If they want to like entering the Chinese market, they can also leverage our capacity there, thus to be kind of differentiation as well. So can you give us more update on your current strategy in China?

好的。我的下一個問題也是關於我們在中國的業務。據我們所知，我們在中國仍有兩座晶圓廠。儘管競爭一直非常激烈，但我們是否看到我們的 IDM 客戶有任何可能性？如果他們想進入中國市場，他們也可以利用我們在那裡的產能，從而實現某種差異化。那麼，您能否向我們詳細介紹一下您目前在中國的策略？

Well, I mean, first of all, with our diversified manufacturing sites, we'll definitely be able to serve different customer needs. And if there is a customer needs for their product to be produced in our China facility, that's something that we very much welcome the sensing that we have a customer moving from China to other locations and we very much welcome that. And we believe a diversified manufacturing offering will give us a benefit of supporting customers with their supply chain resilience needs.

嗯，我的意思是，首先，憑藉我們多元化的生產基地，我們肯定能夠滿足不同客戶的需求。如果客戶需要在我們的中國工廠生產他們的產品，我們非常歡迎，如果感覺到客戶從中國轉移到其他地方，我們非常歡迎。我們相信，多樣化的製造產品將使我們能夠支援客戶的供應鏈彈性需求。

Right now, for the IDN customer moving into the China facility. There are certainly some signals, but I think the signal goes bilateral multiple different ways. And so we are working closely with different customers. And hopefully, we can fulfill their desire needs.

目前，IDN 客戶正在遷入中國工廠。確實存在一些信號，但我認為信號以多種不同的方式雙向傳遞。因此，我們正在與不同的客戶密切合作。希望我們能夠滿足他們的願望和需求。

Timm Schulze-Melander, Redburn.

提姆舒茲-梅蘭德，雷德本。

I had two, please. The first one is on pricing behavior and particularly just how rivals are behaving in terms of pricing in the communications segment. Is that disciplined pricing, particularly given the steady improvements in days of inventory or is pricing more challenging? And then I had a follow-up.

我有兩份。第一個是關於定價行為，特別是競爭對手在通訊領域的定價行為。這種定價是否具有紀律性，尤其是在庫存天數穩定改善的情況下，還是定價更具挑戰性？然後我進行了後續跟進。

When there's ample capacity available, pricing become a CapEx topic. So not until the capacity becomes tightened, I think the pricing will always be a topic. So I think from a behavioral standpoint, it's really subject to the capacity situation. So given that the current capacity situation different regions are different. And I think that conversation is still quite often.

當有足夠的可用容量時，定價就成為資本支出話題。因此，在產能變得緊張之前，我認為定價將一直是一個話題。因此我認為從行為的角度來看，這確實取決於容量。因此，鑑於當前的容量情況，不同地區的情況有所不同。我認為這種對話仍然很頻繁。

Okay. That's very helpful. The second one was in terms of the collaboration with Intel. Good to know that the PDK 2026 production, 2027 still on track. I had a two-parter there. Is just in terms of the work you're doing with your partner, do you see any impact from the headcount reductions? Does that does that influence that cooperation in any way?

好的。這非常有幫助。第二個是與英特爾的合作。很高興知道 PDK 2026 年投產，2027 年仍按計劃進行。我在那裡拍了兩集。就您與合作夥伴所做的工作而言，您是否看到裁員帶來的影響？這是否會對合作產生影響？

And then the second part, talking about gross margins and the outlook in '27, '28, this journey to get back into the 30s obviously, loadings are the most critical factor. But does this cooperation with Intel play a material part in your sort of medium-term gross margin outlook?

然後是第二部分，談論毛利率和 27 年、28 年的前景，在回到 1930 年代的旅程中，顯然負荷是最關鍵的因素。但是與英特爾的合作對你的中期毛利率前景有實質的影響嗎？

From an absolute dollar term, yes, it will. And because of the business model that we have, if we -- coming back to the question about the headcount and the commitment from our partners, is actually quite positive. I think the program itself then expanding from the R&D development now get into the high-volume production preparation. So there's a more involvement from different organizations.

從絕對美元價值來看，是的，會的。而且由於我們擁有的商業模式，如果我們——回到有關員工人數和合作夥伴承諾的問題，實際上是相當積極的。我認為該計劃本身已經從研發擴展至大批量生產準備。因此不同組織的參與度會更高。

So I would say from the environment standpoint, from a different organization, it's actually increased. But I can't really comment about the second situation, but I can tell you, we see more activity from various different departments and organization because we're moving from the R&D activity gradually start moving into a so-called high-volume production preparations. So you can see while we're extending the activity scope, there's actually more involved with the program today.

所以我想說，從環境的角度來看，從不同的組織來看，它實際上是增加了。但我無法對第二種情況發表評論，但我可以告訴你，我們看到更多來自不同部門和組織的活動，因為我們正在從研發活動逐漸轉向所謂的大量生產準備。所以你可以看到，雖然我們正在擴大活動範圍，但今天的計劃實際上涉及的內容更多。

Alex Chang, BNP.

英國國家銀行的 Alex Chang。

I only have one follow-up question regarding to your China business. So can you comment like in terms of utilization, how is your China fab utilization versus the overall utilization? And in terms of the price pressure, have you seen it eased in recent months or what is the outlook for the price pressure in China?

關於你們在中國的業務，我只有一個後續問題。那麼，您能否評論一下，就利用率而言，您的中國晶圓廠的利用率與整體利用率相比如何？就價格壓力而言，您認為近幾個月價格壓力是否有所緩解？或是中國的價格壓力前景如何？

Well, the 12X facility today is actually running at full capacity. So it's above our corporate average. And since that we are -- our different sites are mainly serving as the manufacturing facility, the business management is all centralized. At this point, there is no pricing differentiation between different locations for us.

嗯，今天的 12X 設施實際上已經滿載運作。所以它高於我們公司的平均水平。由於我們的不同站點主要用作製造工廠，因此業務管理都是集中的。目前，我們對不同地點之間的定價沒有差異。

Ladies and gentlemen, we thank you for all your questions. That concludes today's Q&A session. I'll turn it over to UMC Head of IR for closing comments.

女士們、先生們，謝謝你們提出的所有問題。今天的問答環節到此結束。我將把它交給 UMC IR 主管來做最後評論。

Thank you for attending this conference today. We appreciate your questions. As always, if you have any additional follow-up questions, please feel free to contact ir@umc.com. Have a good day.

感謝大家參加今天的會議。我們感謝您的提問。與往常一樣，如果您有任何其他後續問題，請隨時聯繫 ir@umc.com。祝您擁有美好的一天。

Thank you. And ladies and gentlemen, that concludes our conference for second quarter 2025. Thank you for your participation in UMC's conference. There will be a webcast replay within two hours. Please visit www.umc.com under the Investors Events section. You may now disconnect. Thank you again. Goodbye.

謝謝。女士們、先生們，2025 年第二季會議到此結束。感謝您參加 UMC 的會議。兩小時內將會有網路直播重播。請造訪 www.umc.com 的「投資者活動」部分。您現在可以斷開連線。再次感謝您。再見。