SAP SE (SAP) 2023 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by. Welcome, and thank you for joining the SAP Q1 2023 Earnings Conference Call. (Operator Instructions)

女士們，先生們，謝謝你們的支持。歡迎並感謝您加入 SAP 2023 年第一季度收益電話會議。 （操作員說明）

I would now like to turn over the conference to Anthony Coletta, Chief Investor Relations Officer. Please go ahead.

我現在想將會議轉交給首席投資者關係官 Anthony Coletta。請繼續。

Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome. Thank you for joining us. With me today are CEO, Christian Klein; CFO, Dominik Asam; and Scott Russell, Head of Customer Success. On this call, we will discuss SAP's results for the first quarter of 2023. You can find the deck supplementing this call as well as our quarterly statement on our Investor Relations website.

大家下午好，歡迎光臨。感謝您加入我們。今天和我在一起的是首席執行官 Christian Klein；首席財務官多米尼克·阿薩姆；和客戶成功主管 Scott Russell。在這次電話會議上，我們將討論 SAP 2023 年第一季度的業績。您可以在我們的投資者關係網站上找到補充此次電話會議的資料以及我們的季度聲明。

During this call, we'll make forward-looking statements which are predictions, projections or other statements about future events. These statements are based on current expectations and assumptions that are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results and outcomes to materially differ. Additional information regarding these risks and uncertainties may be found in our filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission, including, but not limited to, the Risk Factors section of SAP's annual report on Form 20-F for 2022.

在此次電話會議中，我們將做出前瞻性陳述，即對未來事件的預測、預測或其他陳述。這些陳述基於當前的預期和假設，這些預期和假設存在風險和不確定性，可能導致實際結果和結果出現重大差異。有關這些風險和不確定性的更多信息，請參閱我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件，包括但不限於 SAP 2022 年 20-F 表年度報告的風險因素部分。

Unless otherwise stated, all numbers on this call are non-IFRS and growth rates and percentage point changes are non-IFRS year-on-year at constant currencies. Non-IFRS financial measures we provide should not be considered as a substitute for or superior to the measures of financial performance prepared in accordance with IFRS.

除非另有說明，否則本次電話會議上的所有數字均為非 IFRS，增長率和百分點變化均為非 IFRS 同比固定貨幣。我們提供的非 IFRS 財務指標不應被視為替代或優於根據 IFRS 編制的財務業績指標。

Before we start, I would like to welcome Dominik, who joined SAP as our new CFO in March. It is great to have you on board, Dominik. I know the financial community is very much looking forward to speaking with you.

在我們開始之前，我要歡迎 Dominik，他於 3 月份加入 SAP，擔任我們的新任首席財務官。多米尼克，很高興你能加入。我知道金融界非常期待與您交談。

I would also like to call your attention to our upcoming financial analyst conference, which will take place on May 16 as part of our Sapphire event in Orlando, Florida. This will be broadcast on our website.

我還想提請您注意我們即將於 5 月 16 日舉行的金融分析師會議，這是我們在佛羅里達州奧蘭多舉行的藍寶石活動的一部分。這將在我們的網站上播出。

And with that, I'd like to turn the call over to Christian.

有了這個，我想把電話轉給克里斯蒂安。

Yes. Thank you, Anthony, and thanks to all of you for joining our first earnings call of 2023. This has been a very good Q1. We continue to see strong demand across our portfolio with customers choosing our solutions to solve their most strategic and pressing needs.

是的。謝謝安東尼，也感謝大家參加我們 2023 年的第一次財報電話會議。這是一個非常好的第一季度。我們繼續看到我們產品組合的強勁需求，客戶選擇我們的解決方案來解決他們最具戰略性和緊迫性的需求。

The strong momentum is reflected in our top line numbers. Current cloud backlog stands at over EUR 11 billion, up 25% this quarter. Cloud revenue grew 22%, up from 21% last quarter. For S/4HANA specifically, cloud revenue grew 75%, and current cloud backlog grew 79%. This strong performance has led to total Q1 revenue growth of 9%. And importantly, in Q1, we delivered double-digit operating profit growth, demonstrating the significance of Q4 2022 as a tipping point of our transformation.

強勁的勢頭反映在我們的營收數據中。當前的雲積壓訂單超過 110 億歐元，本季度增長 25%。雲收入增長了 22%，高於上一季度的 21%。特別是對於 S/4HANA，雲收入增長了 75%，當前的雲積壓增長了 79%。這種強勁的表現導致第一季度總收入增長了 9%。重要的是，在第一季度，我們實現了兩位數的營業利潤增長，證明了 2022 年第四季度作為我們轉型轉折點的重要性。

We have now entered a new phase. Our innovative portfolio is at the heart of our continued growth. In 2023, we are continuing to execute on our focused growth strategy with S/4HANA and BTP at the core. Our announcement in March that we came to an agreement to sell our stake in Qualtrics is an example of this focus on our portfolio. We believe that these transactions will unlock significant value for both companies and their shareholders: for SAP, to focus more on our core cloud growth and profitability; for Qualtrics, to expand its leadership in the XM category that it pioneered.

我們現在進入了一個新的階段。我們的創新產品組合是我們持續增長的核心。 2023 年，我們將繼續執行以 S/4HANA 和 BTP 為核心的重點增長戰略。我們在 3 月份宣布達成協議出售我們在 Qualtrics 的股份，這就是我們對投資組合的關注的一個例子。我們相信，這些交易將為公司及其股東帶來巨大的價值：對於 SAP，將更多地關注我們的核心雲增長和盈利能力；對於 Qualtrics，擴大其在其開創的 XM 類別中的領導地位。

This quarter, we also introduced powerful new offerings and innovations to help our customers generate significant new sources of value from their IT investments. I'd like to cover 3 examples: GROW with SAP, the launch of SAP Datasphere and the work we are doing to embed AI across our portfolio.

本季度，我們還推出了強大的新產品和創新，以幫助我們的客戶從他們的 IT 投資中獲得重要的新價值來源。我想介紹 3 個例子：與 SAP 一起成長、SAP Datasphere 的推出以及我們正在做的將 AI 嵌入我們的產品組合的工作。

Let's start with our new offering, GROW with SAP. We see significant growth potential with mid-market customers new to SAP. These are the companies that we expect to experience significant growth as they build their businesses. This new offering, GROW with SAP, provides them with a native ERP solution that can grow and scale with them with agility and speed. It includes our leading cloud-native ERP solution, S/4HANA Cloud.

讓我們從我們的新產品開始，GROW with SAP。我們看到了 SAP 新的中端市場客戶的巨大增長潛力。我們預計這些公司在建立業務時會經歷顯著增長。這一名為 GROW with SAP 的新產品為他們提供了一個原生的 ERP 解決方案，該解決方案可以與他們一起敏捷、快速地發展和擴展。它包括我們領先的雲原生 ERP 解決方案 S/4HANA Cloud。

Through rapid adoption services and our modular stack, mid-market customers can go live and see rapid results within weeks at a fixed price. GROW with SAP also includes SAP Business Technology Platform, so customers can design and automate business processes in a cloud-native way using SAP Build and create industry or LoB-specific enterprise apps without writing code.

通過快速採用服務和我們的模塊化堆棧，中端市場客戶可以在幾週內以固定價格上線并快速看到結果。 GROW with SAP 還包括 SAP Business Technology Platform，因此客戶可以使用 SAP Build 以雲原生方式設計和自動化業務流程，並創建行業或 LoB 特定的企業應用程序，而無需編寫代碼。

The second game-changing offering I'd like to discuss is the launch of SAP Datasphere. SAP Datasphere collects and federates business data across a customer's entire landscape, no matter where the data resides, including data from SAP and non-SAP sources. Importantly, this is not only a technical integration. Datasphere enables the business data fabric a powerful, semantically rich layer that builds the foundation for managing and steering the business end-to-end as well as applying AI based on high-quality, contextualized business data.

我想討論的第二個改變遊戲規則的產品是 SAP Datasphere 的推出。 SAP Datasphere 收集並聯合客戶整個環境中的業務數據，無論數據位於何處，包括來自 SAP 和非 SAP 來源的數據。重要的是，這不僅僅是技術集成。 Datasphere 使業務數據結構成為一個強大的、語義豐富的層，為管理和引導端到端的業務以及應用基於高質量、上下文化業務數據的 AI 奠定了基礎。

Our engineering teams are working closely together with 4 new strategic open data partners, Collibra, Confluent, Databricks and DataRobot, to integrate with SAP's Datasphere and deliver a superior data and AI layer for our customers. Datasphere is a great example of the power of our ecosystem-centric strategy.

我們的工程團隊正在與 4 個新的戰略開放數據合作夥伴（Collibra、Confluent、Databricks 和 DataRobot）密切合作，以與 SAP 的 Datasphere 集成並為我們的客戶提供卓越的數據和 AI 層。數據圈是我們以生態系統為中心的戰略力量的一個很好的例子。

As another example, today, we announced our partnership with UiPath to offer the UiPath Automation Platform to customers, which builds upon the strong momentum of SAP Build Process Automation. UiPath is also committed to their continued adoption of S/4HANA Cloud to run their own business operations.

再舉一個例子，今天，我們宣布與 UiPath 合作，為客戶提供 UiPath 自動化平台，該平台建立在 SAP Build Process Automation 的強勁勢頭之上。 UiPath 還致力於繼續採用 S/4HANA Cloud 來運行他們自己的業務運營。

Finally, let me touch on our efforts to embed AI across our portfolio. Our AI is built for business with AI capabilities built in to deliver strong business outcomes for our customers' most critical business functions. And with Datasphere, we laid the strongest data foundation in business. We are in advanced stages to apply generative AI across our portfolio, and we are working as an early release partner of OpenAI and together with other vendors. We are planning to announce new disruptive AI use cases. Stay tuned for Sapphire.

最後，讓我談談我們為將 AI 嵌入我們的產品組合所做的努力。我們的 AI 專為具有內置 AI 功能的業務而構建，可為客戶最關鍵的業務功能提供強大的業務成果。借助 Datasphere，我們奠定了最強大的業務數據基礎。我們正處於在我們的產品組合中應用生成 AI 的高級階段，我們正在作為 OpenAI 的早期發布合作夥伴與其他供應商一起工作。我們計劃公佈新的顛覆性人工智能用例。請繼續關注藍寶石。

Let's now look at how our strategy and the strength of our portfolio and innovation is addressing the specific needs of our customers in today's challenging macroeconomic environment. SAP's strategy is geared towards a world where business transformation is foundational to their success, both now and in the future, where every organization benefits from being part of a collaborative network able to effectively manage today's supply chain challenges and where everything can operate sustainably.

現在讓我們看看我們的戰略以及我們產品組合和創新的優勢如何在當今充滿挑戰的宏觀經濟環境中滿足客戶的特定需求。 SAP 的戰略面向這樣一個世界，在這個世界中，業務轉型是他們現在和未來成功的基礎，在這個世界中，每個組織都可以從成為能夠有效管理當今供應鏈挑戰的協作網絡的一部分中受益，並且一切都可以可持續地運作。

Our offerings provide a pathway to solve many of the fundamental challenges that companies are facing today. This is behind the strong customer momentum we saw in Q1. RISE with SAP has become the preferred choice for customers transforming their businesses in the cloud. We are developing deep, broad-based partnerships around the globe.

我們的產品提供了解決公司當今面臨的許多基本挑戰的途徑。這是我們在第一季度看到的強勁客戶勢頭的背後原因。 RISE with SAP 已成為客戶在雲中實現業務轉型的首選。我們正在全球範圍內發展深入、廣泛的伙伴關係。

Here are some examples. In January, we announced the expansion of our long-standing partnership with BMW Group. This will help them accelerate their digital transformation and manage their end-to-end business processes in the cloud. Henkel has selected RISE with SAP to transform their digital landscape and move to the cloud.

這裡有些例子。一月份，我們宣布擴大與寶馬集團的長期合作夥伴關係。這將幫助他們加速數字化轉型並在雲端管理端到端業務流程。 Henkel 選擇 RISE with SAP 來轉變他們的數字環境並遷移到雲端。

Dolce & Gabbana, the [renewed] luxury goods leader, recently chose RISE to drive their finance transformation. And HP, the global technology leader operating in more than 170 countries, selected RISE with SAP and expanded its investment in Q1 to support business transformation for its customers around the globe. This quarter, we also saw significant enterprise go-lives for RISE with SAP, including AMD and Air India.

[更新的] 奢侈品領導者 Dolce & Gabbana 最近選擇了 RISE 來推動他們的財務轉型。而在 170 多個國家開展業務的全球技術領導者惠普選擇了 RISE with SAP 並擴大了其在第一季度的投資，以支持其全球客戶的業務轉型。本季度，我們還看到了 RISE with SAP 的重要企業上線，包括 AMD 和印度航空公司。

With S/4HANA public cloud, we are seeing strong adoption across the broad range of enterprise mid-market and start-up customers. Significant enterprise wins for S/4HANA public cloud include NEC Networks & System Integration Corporation and the benefits and reward services activity of the Sodexo Group, a global leader in employee benefits and engagement.

借助 S/4HANA 公共雲，我們看到廣泛的企業中端市場和初創客戶採用了它。 S/4HANA 公有云贏得的重要企業包括 NEC Networks & System Integration Corporation 以及 Sodexo Group 的福利和獎勵服務活動，Sodexo Group 是員工福利和敬業度方面的全球領導者。

We are also seeing strong adoption for S/4HANA public cloud and GROW with SAP with start-ups and companies new to SAP. Examples include the French aeronautic start-up, Flying Whales; in the U.S., NineDot Energy, a sustainable energy provider who got up and running in just 10 weeks; and REPETCO, the European plastics recycling company.

我們還看到 S/4HANA 公共雲和 GROW with SAP 與初創企業和 SAP 新公司的廣泛採用。例子包括法國航空初創公司 Flying Whales；在美國，可持續能源供應商 NineDot Energy 在短短 10 週內啟動並運行；和歐洲塑料回收公司 REPETCO。

We continue to also see excellent cross-sell and upsell through our success with RISE with SAP and S/4HANA Cloud. Our solution area momentum includes HCLTech, one of the world's leading technology companies, leading their HR transformation with SAP SuccessFactors, a competitive win against Workday; Hitachi High-Tech Corporation of Japan; and [Prawn], the Mexican food company, choosing SAP Business Technology Platform; A.S. Watson, the world's largest health and beauty retailer, renewing their investment in SAP Commerce Cloud; and continued momentum for our sustainability solutions, SAP Sustainability Control Tower and SAP Product Footprint Management, including the adoption of SAP Sustainability Control Tower by Soleum, the Brazilian producer of sustainable raw materials.

通過 RISE with SAP 和 S/4HANA Cloud 的成功，我們繼續看到出色的交叉銷售和追加銷售。我們解決方案領域的發展勢頭包括 HCLTech，世界領先的技術公司之一，通過 SAP SuccessFactors 引領他們的人力資源轉型，在競爭中戰勝了 Workday；日本日立高科技公司；墨西哥食品公司 [Prawn] 選擇了 SAP Business Technology Platform；作為。全球最大的健康和美容零售商 Watson 再次投資 SAP Commerce Cloud；我們的可持續發展解決方案 SAP Sustainability Control Tower 和 SAP Product Footprint Management 的持續發展勢頭，包括巴西可持續原材料生產商 Soleum 採用 SAP Sustainability Control Tower。

Let me turn now to our outlook and ambitions. These customer examples show how SAP is continuing to deliver despite the continued challenges being faced across nations and industries today. This is because our vision is directly tied to solutions that fortify our customers against those challenges and lead to stronger companies. Our strategic transformation has reached a new phase where we are now a force for transformation across industries worldwide.

現在讓我談談我們的前景和抱負。這些客戶示例展示了 SAP 如何在當今各個國家和行業面臨持續挑戰的情況下繼續交付成果。這是因為我們的願景與解決方案直接相關，這些解決方案可以幫助我們的客戶應對這些挑戰並打造更強大的公司。我們的戰略轉型已進入新階段，已成為全球跨行業轉型的生力軍。

We remain committed to our 2023 guidance updated to reflect Qualtrics as a discontinued operation. We plan to update our 2025 ambition during our Sapphire Financial Analyst Conference on May 16 and look forward to talking with many of you there.

我們仍然致力於更新我們的 2023 年指南，以反映 Qualtrics 已停止運營。我們計劃在 5 月 16 日的藍寶石金融分析師會議期間更新我們的 2025 年目標，並期待與大家交談。

In closing, we see significant opportunities for continued growth based on our own transformation into a leading cloud company. First, the strength of our current cloud backlog provides the foundation to grow and scale through increased upsell and cross-sell to our existing customer base.

最後，我們看到了基於我們自身轉型為領先雲公司的持續增長的重要機會。首先，我們當前云積壓的優勢為通過增加對現有客戶群的追加銷售和交叉銷售來實現增長和擴展奠定了基礎。

Second, we expect that our new offerings will power our growth in new markets and with those customers new to SAP, for example, with mid-market customers. We have a leaner and more agile operating structure. And our game-changing solutions are creating sustainably end-to-end business processes across industries. We are off to a good start in 2023 and remain optimistic about the unique value we offer our customers.

其次，我們預計我們的新產品將推動我們在新市場和 SAP 新客戶（例如中端市場客戶）中的增長。我們擁有更精簡、更靈活的運營結構。我們改變遊戲規則的解決方案正在跨行業創建可持續的端到端業務流程。我們在 2023 年有了一個良好的開端，並對我們為客戶提供的獨特價值保持樂觀。

Finally, I'm, of course, very happy to welcome Dominik Asam to SAP, our new CFO since March 7. Dominik, welcome to SAP, and welcome to your first earnings call. Over to you.

最後，當然，我非常高興地歡迎 Dominik Asam 加入 SAP，他是我們自 3 月 7 日以來的新任首席財務官。Dominik，歡迎來到 SAP，歡迎來到你的第一次財報電話會議。交給你了。

Yes. Thank you, Christian, for the warm introduction. And good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. It's my pleasure to speak with you for the first time ever as SAP's CFO, and I look forward to meeting as many of you as I can over the coming months. I'm delighted to join Christian and the rest of the management team and to actively contribute to the continued success of SAP around the globe.

是的。克里斯蒂安，謝謝你熱情的介紹。女士們先生們，下午好。作為 SAP 的首席財務官，我很高興第一次與你們交談，我期待著在接下來的幾個月裡盡可能多地與你們會面。我很高興加入 Christian 和管理團隊的其他成員，並為 SAP 在全球的持續成功做出積極貢獻。

First off, in March, we announced the sale of our stake in Qualtrics, which is now pending customary regulatory clearances. As such, all numbers today are based on continuing operations, i.e., excluding contributions from Qualtrics.

首先，在 3 月份，我們宣佈出售我們在 Qualtrics 的股份，該股份目前正在等待慣例監管許可。因此，今天的所有數字都是基於持續運營，即不包括 Qualtrics 的貢獻。

That said, fiscal year 2023 is already off to a solid start. In the first quarter, current cloud backlog and cloud revenue grew sequentially, while non-IFRS operating profit was back to double-digit growth in constant currencies. Cloud revenue was EUR 3.2 billion, up 22% year-over-year. And the trend towards larger cloud transactions continued with deals greater than EUR 5 million in value contributing 45% of our cloud order entry. This was driven by RISE with SAP. Software license revenues saw only a moderate decrease of 13%, mainly due to the favorable phasing of a few major transactions.

也就是說，2023 財年已經有了一個堅實的開端。第一季度，當前云積壓訂單和雲收入環比增長，而非 IFRS 營業利潤以固定匯率計算恢復到兩位數增長。雲收入為 32 億歐元，同比增長 22%。更大的雲交易趨勢繼續存在，價值超過 500 萬歐元的交易占我們雲訂單輸入的 45%。這是由 RISE with SAP 推動的。軟件許可收入僅出現 13% 的溫和下降，這主要是由於一些主要交易的有利階段。

Now let me talk and walk you through our financial performance. Current cloud backlog was EUR 11.1 billion, continuing its growth at scale by 25%. And S/4HANA current cloud backlog growth kept its strong momentum at 79%, driven by the strong adoption of RISE with SAP. In Q1, we added more than EUR 200 million to our S/4HANA current cloud backlog, leading to a total of EUR 3.4 billion.

現在讓我談談並向您介紹我們的財務業績。當前的雲積壓訂單為 111 億歐元，繼續以 25% 的規模增長。 S/4HANA 當前的雲積壓增長保持了 79% 的強勁勢頭，這得益於 RISE with SAP 的大力採用。在第一季度，我們的 S/4HANA 當前云積壓訂單增加了 2 億多歐元，總計 34 億歐元。

Our combined SaaS and PaaS portfolio continued to grow by 25%, with the SaaS cloud revenue up 22% and PaaS cloud revenue up 45%. This continued cloud momentum was again fueled by the strong contribution of S/4HANA Cloud and the Business Technology Platform. Supported by the underlying performance across all our revenue streams, total revenue was up 9% year-over-year, staying on the right trajectory.

我們合併的 SaaS 和 PaaS 產品組合繼續增長 25%，其中 SaaS 雲收入增長 22%，PaaS 雲收入增長 45%。 S/4HANA Cloud 和業務技術平台的強大貢獻再次推動了這種持續的雲勢頭。在我們所有收入流的基本表現的支持下，總收入同比增長 9%，保持在正確的軌道上。

Now let's take a brief look at our regional performance. In the first quarter, all regions delivered a robust cloud performance. Brazil, Germany and India achieved outstanding cloud revenue growth, while China, Japan, Mexico, the Netherlands, Switzerland and the United States performed particularly strong.

現在讓我們簡要回顧一下我們的地區表現。第一季度，所有地區都提供了強勁的雲性能。巴西、德國和印度實現了出色的雲收入增長，而中國、日本、墨西哥、荷蘭、瑞士和美國的表現尤為強勁。

Now moving on to the bottom line, our cloud gross profit grew by 27%, so 5 percentage points faster than the cloud revenues, driven not only by cloud revenue, but also further efficiency gains. This resulted in cloud gross margin improving from the year-ago period, expanding 2.9 percentage points to 71.4%.

現在轉向底線，我們的雲毛利潤增長了 27%，比雲收入快 5 個百分點，這不僅受到雲收入的推動，而且還受到進一步效率提升的推動。這導致雲毛利率較上年同期有所改善，擴大 2.9 個百分點至 71.4%。

In the first quarter, IFRS operating profit decreased 45%, primarily driven by the increase in share-based compensation expense by EUR 434 million, mainly reflecting the increase in our share price over the first quarter this year as compared to last year's decline over the same period; our targeted restructuring program of EUR 260 million; and finally, EUR 170 million provision for pre-existing regulatory compliance matters.

第一季度，IFRS 營業利潤下降 45%，主要受股權激勵費用增加 4.34 億歐元的推動，主要反映了我們今年第一季度的股價上漲，而去年同期有所下降同期；我們的目標重組計劃為 2.6 億歐元；最後，1.7 億歐元用於預先存在的監管合規事宜。

Finally, non-IFRS operating profit grew by 12%, evidencing our return to more profitable growth in the future. Earnings per share in the quarter increased by 8% to EUR 1.08. For IFRS earnings per share, please also keep in mind that the sale of Qualtrics is expected to be accretive to earnings per share. And significant stock-based compensation expenses, including grants related to its IPO, will be removed with the divestiture. The IFRS effective tax rate of Q1 was 40.5%, and the non-IFRS tax rate was 28.3%.

最後，非 IFRS 營業利潤增長了 12%，證明我們在未來將恢復到更有利可圖的增長。本季度每股收益增長 8% 至 1.08 歐元。對於 IFRS 每股收益，還請記住，出售 Qualtrics 預計會增加每股收益。資產剝離將取消大量基於股票的補償費用，包括與其 IPO 相關的贈款。第一季度 IFRS 有效稅率為 40.5%，non-IFRS 稅率為 28.3%。

Now looking to our cash generation. Free cash flow for Q1 came in at EUR 1.95 billion, down 9%, mainly due to the impact of the sale of trade receivables in the fourth quarter last year, which was weighing on Q1, and some first cash-out for our restructuring program. If adjusted for these effects, the underlying cash flow development was positive compared to the prior year, actually quite in line with the increase in operating profit.

現在期待我們的現金產生。第一季度的自由現金流為 19.5 億歐元，下降 9%，主要是由於去年第四季度銷售貿易應收賬款的影響，這對第一季度造成壓力，以及我們重組計劃的一些首次套現.如果針對這些影響進行調整，則基礎現金流量發展與上一年相比為正，實際上與營業利潤的增長相當一致。

Now let's move on to our financial outlook. Let me reiterate that we have now reflected the anticipated sale of our stake in Qualtrics and have updated the outlook accordingly. We are reaffirming our 2023 outlook for underlying continuing operations. Keep in mind, the disposal gain realized upon closing of the Qualtrics transaction will be included in profit after tax from discontinued operations. This will not impact operating profit and free cash flow for continuing operations. So please refer to our quarterly statements for additional details.

現在讓我們繼續我們的財務展望。讓我重申，我們現在已經反映了預期出售我們在 Qualtrics 的股份，並相應地更新了前景。我們重申我們 2023 年基礎持續經營的展望。請記住，在完成 Qualtrics 交易後實現的處置收益將計入已終止業務的稅後利潤。這不會影響持續經營的營業利潤和自由現金流。因此，請參閱我們的季度報表了解更多詳情。

Let's now discuss our nonfinancial targets. Our greenhouse gas emissions were 0 kilotons. We continue to be on track to be net neutral in our operations this year and are on track to achieve net zero across the entire value chain by 2030. SAP has successfully closed a new sustainability-linked revolving credit facility with a volume of EUR 3 billion and a tenor of 5 years, plus 2 1-year extension options, replacing the existing EUR 2.5 billion facility.

現在讓我們討論一下我們的非財務目標。我們的溫室氣體排放量為 0 千噸。今年，我們將繼續在我們的運營中保持淨中性，並有望在 2030 年之前在整個價值鏈中實現淨零排放。SAP 已成功關閉一項新的與可持續發展相關的循環信貸額度，金額為 30 億歐元5 年期限，外加 2 個 1 年期延期選擇權，取代現有的 25 億歐元貸款。

In line with SAP's strategic commitment, a sustainability component has been embedded for the first time that links the margin of the new facility to the company's net zero carbon and women in management ambitions. So our Q1 results give us confidence that we are moving in the right direction and are in a good position to achieve our goals for the year. We continue to build on our cloud momentum and remain focused on ushering our customers into the new digital world.

根據 SAP 的戰略承諾，首次嵌入了可持續性組件，將新設施的利潤率與公司的淨零碳和女性管理雄心聯繫起來。因此，我們第一季度的業績讓我們有信心，我們正朝著正確的方向前進，並且能夠很好地實現我們今年的目標。我們繼續在我們的雲動力的基礎上繼續發展，並繼續專注於將我們的客戶帶入新的數字世界。

Before moving to Q&A, I would like to say that we are very much looking forward to welcoming you to our financial analyst conference where we will provide updates to our 2025 ambition. As Anthony mentioned earlier, it will take place in conjunction with Sapphire in Orlando, and I'm looking forward to meeting you all there in person.

在開始問答環節之前，我想說，我們非常期待您參加我們的金融分析師會議，屆時我們將更新我們 2025 年的雄心壯志。正如安東尼之前提到的，它將與奧蘭多的藍寶石一起舉行，我期待著在那裡與大家見面。

Thank you. And we'll now be happy to take your questions.

謝謝。我們現在很樂意回答您的問題。

All right. Thank you. (Operator Instructions) So operator, please open the line.

好的。謝謝。 （接線員說明）所以接線員，請打開線路。

(Operator Instructions) So the first question is from the line of Stefan Slowinski with Exane BNP Paribas.

（操作員說明）所以第一個問題來自 Exane BNP Paribas 的 Stefan Slowinski。

Welcome to Dominik from the SAP analyst and investor community. Looking forward to discussing with you. So just to jump in with some questions for you, just one quick question and a follow-up. SAP had already indicated that they expected double-digit revenue growth in 2024. Based on what you've seen thus far in the Q1 performance, do you think you're still on track for that?

歡迎來自 SAP 分析師和投資者社區的 Dominik。期待與您探討。所以只是想問你一些問題，只是一個簡單的問題和一個後續問題。 SAP 已經表示，他們預計 2024 年的收入將實現兩位數增長。根據您迄今為止在第一季度的業績中看到的情況，您認為您是否仍有望實現這一目標？

And just a quick follow-up would be, when you look at the free cash flow and the conversion at SAP, what's there in terms of low-hanging fruit that you see that you can take advantage of to improve the free cash flow performance?

快速跟進就是，當您查看 SAP 的自由現金流和轉換時，您發現可以利用哪些唾手可得的成果來提高自由現金流績效？

I can start, and Dominik, you can build on top of it. I mean with regard to the question, Stefan, around the double-digit total revenue growth, I mean, Q1, we were pretty close to it, I have to say, with 9% at constant. And look, I mean over the course of the year, we expect a continued strong cloud momentum. So the weight of our cloud revenue will become higher and higher. And I guess it's fair to say from 2024 onwards on, SAP will deliver total revenue double-digit growth as we just have such a high recurring revenue stream, and it will become a more and more predictable business.

我可以開始，Dominik，你可以在此基礎上進行構建。我的意思是，關於這個問題，斯特凡，圍繞兩位數的總收入增長，我的意思是，第一季度，我們非常接近它，我不得不說，9% 不變。看，我的意思是在這一年中，我們預計雲計算將繼續保持強勁勢頭。所以我們雲收入的權重會越來越高。我想可以公平地說，從 2024 年開始，SAP 的總收入將實現兩位數的增長，因為我們擁有如此高的經常性收入流，而且它將成為越來越可預測的業務。

And with regard to the cloud revenue itself, maybe one last word there, I actually have to congratulate Scott and the team. And also, Scott, congratulations to your contract extension where we're happy to have you on board also for the upcoming years.

關於雲收入本身，也許最後一句話，我實際上要祝賀斯科特和團隊。另外，Scott，祝賀你的合同延期，我們很高興你也能在未來幾年加入我們。

I mean with the launch, as what I just mentioned, around SAP GROW and Datasphere, I mean we are also expanding now our innovation pipeline. And we actually will also harvest new bookings growth sources for the quarters to come. So we are actually very confident with regard to the total revenue growth and double digit in 2024 onwards on.

我的意思是，正如我剛才提到的，圍繞 SAP GROW 和 Datasphere 的發布，我的意思是我們現在也在擴展我們的創新管道。實際上，我們還將為未來幾個季度收穫新的預訂增長來源。因此，我們實際上對 2024 年以後的總收入增長和兩位數增長非常有信心。

On cash, I think -- I mean, first and foremost, if you want to improve cash, you have to increase profit and the kind of cash-related part of the profit. So that's about cost management, but I want to say that's kind of well embarked in our guidance.

關於現金，我認為——我的意思是，首先，如果你想改善現金，你必須增加利潤和利潤中與現金相關的部分。所以這是關於成本管理的，但我想說的是，這在我們的指導中已經很好地開展了。

If you want to talk about cash conversion, then you have to look into stuff like working capital. I know that in this context here, we have discussed prepayments to certain suppliers. We have also, of course, the accounts receivable. So collections is a big topic. And yes, I do want to put more focus on that because I do believe there is some potential to secure a better cash conversion.

如果你想談論現金轉換，那麼你必須研究營運資金之類的東西。我知道在這種情況下，我們討論了對某些供應商的預付款。當然，我們還有應收賬款。所以收藏是一個很大的話題。是的，我確實想更加關注這一點，因為我確實相信有一定的潛力來確保更好的現金轉換。

And also, our intention is really around the Sapphire Conference to give you a little bit more logic behind how the kind of profit converts into cash in our business model. So that's something I have on the agenda very clearly.

而且，我們的目的實際上是圍繞藍寶石會議，為您提供更多關於利潤如何在我們的商業模式中轉化為現金的邏輯。所以這是我在議程上非常明確的事情。

The next question is from the line of Frederic Boulan, Bank of America.

下一個問題來自美國銀行的 Frederic Boulan。

Christian and Dominik, welcome as well from my side. If I can ask a question more at the macro level. We've seen a number of peers in the U.S. and elsewhere experiencing some slowing demand. So you seem to be flagging still very strong growth in the U.S., Germany, a number of Asian countries. So can you maybe explain a little bit whether there's a shift in the type of projects, the demand you're seeing, any verticals or regions where there is some change in dynamics, any reprioritization of projects? I mean cloud, in particular, it's a big ticket for organizations. Are you seeing any shift in the pace of demand for that? Or on the contrary, the kind of underlying trends remain very much unchanged?

我也歡迎 Christian 和 Dominik。如果我可以在宏觀層面提出更多問題。我們已經看到美國和其他地方的許多同行的需求有所放緩。所以你似乎在暗示美國、德國和一些亞洲國家的增長仍然非常強勁。那麼，您能否解釋一下項目類型是否發生了變化，您看到的需求，動態發生變化的任何垂直行業或地區，項目的優先級是否重新調整？我的意思是雲，特別是它對組織來說是一張大票。您是否看到對此的需求速度有任何變化？或者相反，那種基本趨勢保持非常不變？

Yes, maybe I'll -- Christian, I'll start. This is Scott here. So I'll start and then maybe if you've got any additional comments. So first of all, I guess there's a -- the macro conditions, SAP is not immune to the macroeconomic environment that we're all experiencing and the uncertainty. But I think there's a couple of key points that we are seeing, which is reflected not only in the results that you see in Q1, but in the outlook and the pipeline that we have.

是的，也許我會——克里斯蒂安，我會開始。我是斯科特。那麼我將開始，然後也許如果你有任何其他意見。所以首先，我想有一個 - 宏觀條件，SAP 不能倖免於我們都在經歷的宏觀經濟環境和不確定性。但我認為我們看到了幾個關鍵點，這不僅反映在您在第一季度看到的結果中，還反映在我們的前景和管道中。

Customers are focused on the main thing. They are focused on their mission-critical processes, workflows, data to be able to serve their business. They're looking for profitable growth. And to achieve that, they need to make sure that their underlying technology, the architecture being delivered in a reliable, scalable, innovative way in the cloud is able to be rendered. And that's why we see such strength in S/4 cloud, both in our public and private additions. And it means that they're able to get the agility, they're able to handle uncertainty that the markets are undoubtedly presenting to them. So whilst there might be different conditions for other cloud properties when it comes to the core business processes and doing so in a reliable, agile way, there is no doubt that, that demand continues to be strong and we certainly have a positive expectation.

客戶專注於最主要的事情。他們專注於他們的關鍵任務流程、工作流和數據，以便能夠為他們的業務服務。他們正在尋找盈利性增長。為實現這一目標，他們需要確保能夠在雲中呈現其底層技術，即以可靠、可擴展、創新的方式交付的架構。這就是為什麼我們在 S/4 雲中看到如此強大的原因，無論是在我們的公共和私人添加中。這意味著他們能夠獲得敏捷性，他們能夠處理市場無疑呈現給他們的不確定性。因此，儘管在涉及核心業務流程並以可靠、敏捷的方式進行時，其他雲資產可能存在不同的條件，但毫無疑問，這種需求仍然強勁，我們當然抱有積極的期望。

The second is what Christian mentioned before, and I just want to reiterate the importance of the launch of capabilities like Datasphere. Companies are not only looking to be able to have their mission-critical capability, but then they want an agile, innovative platform that they can get insights from that data real time to be able, with SAP and non-SAP data, to make better decisions, more timely decisions through their business process. So the infusion of AI, the infusion of the orchestration with their open ecosystem, we see strong demand.

第二個是Christian之前提到的，我只是想重申推出像Datasphere這樣的能力的重要性。公司不僅希望能夠擁有他們的關鍵任務能力，而且他們還需要一個敏捷、創新的平台，他們可以從該數據中實時獲得洞察力，以便能夠利用 SAP 和非 SAP 數據，做出更好的決策，通過他們的業務流程做出更及時的決策。因此，人工智能的注入，編排及其開放生態系統的注入，我們看到了強勁的需求。

So I definitely see an expectation of shorter projects, shorter time line of engagements. There is no doubt that core process and data continues to be the key area, and that plays to SAP's strengths. That's where we're historically strong. And the outlook, notwithstanding the macroeconomic environment, continues to give us confidence going forward.

所以我肯定看到了對更短項目、更短參與時間線的期望。毫無疑問，核心流程和數據仍然是關鍵領域，這也是 SAP 的優勢所在。這就是我們歷史上的強項。儘管宏觀經濟環境不佳，但前景繼續讓我們充滿信心。

Christian, I don't know if you want to add.

Christian，不知道你要不要補充。

Look, I guess one important indicator is also just, I mean, we are reporting current cloud backlog ACV, but when you look at our TCV, the number is, of course, even much higher because especially our large enterprises, large clients, they really need time to fully migrate to the cloud. But I'm not aware of any single project where a customer now said, I'm going to stop or pause my ERP migration, my supply chain migration to the cloud. So also on the adoption side, we see continuous and seamless execution.

看，我想一個重要指標也只是，我的意思是，我們正在報告當前的雲積壓 ACV，但是當您查看我們的 TCV 時，這個數字當然要高得多，因為尤其是我們的大企業、大客戶，他們確實需要時間才能完全遷移到雲端。但我不知道有哪個項目的客戶現在說，我要停止或暫停我的 ERP 遷移，我的供應鏈遷移到雲端。因此，在採用方面，我們也看到了持續和無縫的執行。

And I don't know if I may, but on that cloud point, any change in dynamics in terms of private versus public demand?

而且我不知道我是否可以，但在那個雲點上，私人需求與公共需求方面的動態有任何變化嗎？

As Scott just said, I mean we have seen now an accelerated momentum in Q1. We reconfirmed our outlook for the year. We see a very healthy and strong pipeline for the year. So we're coming, thinking to execute strong in the cloud.

正如斯科特剛才所說，我的意思是我們現在已經看到第一季度的加速勢頭。我們再次確認了今年的展望。我們看到今年的管道非常健康和強大。所以我們來了，想在雲中執行強大的功能。

The next question is from the line of Michael J. Briest, UBS Limited.

下一個問題來自瑞銀有限公司的 Michael J. Briest。

You've obviously updated the guidance today for Qualtrics. There was a couple of things in the annual report which I guess were put there when Qualtrics was still part of scope. And that was current cloud backlog would grow at basically the same rate as last year, so 24%, and that you hope to be at a mid-70s gross margin in the cloud exiting the year. I wonder if you can address those 2 matters. I mean I guess Qualtrics is growing more slowly, so presumably, the cloud backlog growth rate should increase a bit from 24%?

您今天顯然已經更新了 Qualtrics 的指南。年度報告中有幾件事我猜是在 Qualtrics 仍然是范圍的一部分時放在那裡的。那就是當前的雲積壓將以與去年基本相同的速度增長，即 24%，並且您希望在今年退出的雲中達到 70 年代中期的毛利率。我想知道你是否可以解決這兩個問題。我的意思是我猜 Qualtrics 增長得更慢，所以大概雲積壓增長率應該從 24% 增加一點？

Yes. I think on the upgrade of the -- sorry, the change of the guidance to continuing operation, we really tried to embark that one for one what was basically in the guidance of Qualtrics. And then what is true is that, of course, the cloud gross margin of Qualtrics was higher than group average. So that has a slightly dilutive effect in terms of one-for-one transmission of that. But we are driving the absolute cloud gross margin very hard here.

是的。我認為在升級 - 抱歉，將指南更改為持續運營時，我們真的試圖開始一對一的操作，基本上是在 Qualtrics 的指導下。然後真實的是，當然，Qualtrics 的雲毛利率高於集團平均水平。因此，就一對一傳輸而言，這具有輕微的稀釋作用。但我們在這裡非常努力地推動絕對雲毛利率。

Yes. And I guess, Michael, important to note, what we also said last quarter is when you look actually in the second half of the year, but even more so next year, not only that S/4HANA and BTP are already growing stronger than Qualtrics today, but also our overall cloud revenue will also then over-pace the Qualtrics revenue. So we see actually in the outer years that it will actually help to accelerate our percentage growth rates, especially in the core business, but also for our overall cloud revenue stream.

是的。我想，邁克爾，需要注意的重要一點是，我們上個季度也說過，實際上是在今年下半年，但明年更是如此，不僅是 S/4HANA 和 BTP 已經比 Qualtrics 變得更強大今天，我們的整體雲收入也將超過 Qualtrics 收入。因此，我們實際上在外部幾年看到它實際上有助於加快我們的百分比增長率，尤其是在核心業務方面，同時也有助於我們的整體雲收入流。

Okay. And also, Dominik, I think the free cash flow guidance assumed that you would have a high triple-digit million factoring level in 2025. Can you just explain the logic of the factoring and whether it's something you think makes sense?

好的。而且，多米尼克，我認為自由現金流量指導假設你將在 2025 年擁有高達三位數的保理水平。你能解釋一下保理的邏輯嗎？你認為這是否有意義？

What I can explain is what we've seen to start with at the end of last year. So basically, we have 2 different types of transactions on the front. One is a very, I'd say, common vendor financing type of approach, I would call it, where we give very extended payment terms to certain customers who have liquidity crunches. And as we don't want to become a bank, frankly, because we have much better return opportunities in the operation business, we are selling these. So I think that's a practice which makes a lot of sense.

我能解釋的是我們從去年年底開始看到的情況。所以基本上，我們在前面有兩種不同類型的交易。我想說的是一種非常常見的供應商融資類型的方法，我稱之為，我們為某些流動性緊縮的客戶提供非常延長的付款條件。由於我們不想成為一家銀行，坦率地說，因為我們在運營業務中有更好的回報機會，所以我們正在出售這些。所以我認為這是一種很有意義的做法。

And now on top of that is also some more, yes, from our side, induced factoring, which I need to look into, frankly. I understand this is embarked in the guidance. So it's not going in the numbers we have shown you on the cash flow update. We've done just an adjustment for Qualtrics, not for any change on that front yet. But we really need to stick our heads together also on that technique, whether that makes a lot of sense for us or not. Should we change that, then that would have, of course, an impact on the free cash flow one for one. It's quite straightforward.

現在最重要的是，是的，從我們這邊來說，還有一些誘導因素，坦率地說，我需要調查一下。我理解這是在指導中著手的。因此，我們在現金流量更新中向您展示的數字不會出現這種情況。我們只是對 Qualtrics 進行了調整，尚未對這方面進行任何更改。但我們真的需要在這項技術上齊心協力，不管這對我們是否有意義。如果我們改變這一點，那當然會對自由現金流產生一對一的影響。這很簡單。

The next question comes from the line of Adam Wood with Morgan Stanley.

下一個問題來自 Adam Wood 與 Morgan Stanley 的對話。

And also, welcome, Dominik, from my side. I guess this is for you, Dominik. I think it's always interesting to have a fresh view on things from a new CFO. Obviously, you had to step in and assumed a guidance that had been made previously by the company. I think the feedback generally has been you seem to be more cautious on guidance in previous roles. Could you just talk a little bit about the work that you've done to get yourself comfortable with the outlook for this year and how you see that outlook relative to how you've guided and what you've looked at in previous companies and previous roles, please?

另外，歡迎 Dominik 發言。我想這是給你的，多米尼克。我認為從新任首席財務官那裡獲得對事物的全新看法總是很有趣。顯然，您必須介入並接受公司之前製定的指導。我認為反饋一般是你似乎對以前角色的指導更加謹慎。您能否談談您為使自己對今年的前景感到滿意而所做的工作，以及相對於您的指導方式以及您在以前的公司和以前的公司中的看法，您如何看待這種前景請問是角色嗎？

Okay. Sure. I'm not quite sure how I earned that reputation. I always try to provide as accurate a guidance as possible, as humanly possible. But still, of course, there's uncertainties around guidance, which also means that the further you move out, the more difficult it is to do so. So kudos to the team here who had the courage to go for that kind of '25 guidance at a time where they have entered into a very difficult transition. So I'm really impressed how closely we've been tracking to that now with the benefit of hindsight vision.

好的。當然。我不太確定我是如何贏得這個聲譽的。我總是盡量提供盡可能準確的指導，盡可能人性化。但是，當然，指導仍然存在不確定性，這也意味著你越往外走，就越難做到。因此，對這裡的團隊表示敬意，他們在進入非常艱難的過渡期時有勇氣接受那種 25 年的指導。因此，借助事後洞察力，我們現在一直在密切關注這一點，這給我留下了深刻的印象。

Now of course, I get myself comfortable with that guidance. Otherwise, I wouldn't sit here and read it out to you. I think it has been very solidly derived with a lot of logic. And yes, I did spend quite some time on that. And I will now really focus, from now to Sapphire, on what's happening over the next couple of years. But so far, I'm very encouraged by the solidity and insightful way this has been derived.

當然，現在我對這個指導感到很舒服。否則，我不會坐在這裡給你讀出來。我認為它是通過大量邏輯推導出來的。是的，我確實在這上面花了很多時間。從現在到 Sapphire，我現在將真正關注未來幾年發生的事情。但到目前為止，我對這種可靠和富有洞察力的方式感到非常鼓舞。

Don't forget there is this kind of already 82% of more predictable revenues. So that, frankly, makes it a little bit easier. And obviously, when you have a business model that has less uncertainty, it's also easier to predict and then you don't need to kind of put some cushion in for imponderability. So I think the quality of the business model is also part of how precisely you can guide or not.

不要忘記這種已經有 82% 的可預測收入。所以，坦率地說，這讓它變得容易了一點。很明顯，當你擁有一個不確定性較小的商業模式時，它也更容易預測，然後你就不需要為不可估量性做一些緩衝。所以我認為商業模式的質量也是你能不能指導的精確程度的一部分。

The next question is from the line of Toby Ogg with JPMorgan.

下一個問題來自摩根大通的 Toby Ogg。

And welcome from my side as well, Dominik. Just on the free cash flow, EUR 1.95 billion, I know we've talked about the various moving parts there, working capital restructuring, extra licenses in the quarter with a bit of tailwind. Just looking forwards on that, what specifically gives you the confidence that you can achieve the EUR 4.9 billion guidance for the year?

我也歡迎你，Dominik。就自由現金流而言，19.5 億歐元，我知道我們已經討論了那裡的各種活動部分、營運資本重組、本季度的額外許可證以及一些順風。展望未來，是什麼讓您有信心實現今年 49 億歐元的目標？

And then just more broadly, Dominik, you talked about certain aspects of the working capital there. What are some of the other aspects of the business that are going to be a priority for you?

然後更廣泛地說，多米尼克，你談到了那裡營運資金的某些方面。您將優先考慮的業務的其他方面是什麼？

Yes. I mean, for this year, I mean, of course, we have a very, very detailed bottom-up process, which we kind of vetted extensively, and that comes to that kind of conclusion. On top of that, let's say, you can use some rule of thumb. I mean I already alluded to that in my intro statement. In Q1, if you really back out that kind of factoring impact, which was weighing on Q1, you back out the kind of mid-double-digit millions, which have already been paid out of the EUR 260 million restructuring plan, you're actually seeing that the cash flow is quite nicely kind of scaling in comparison to prior year with the improvement in operating profit.

是的。我的意思是，對於今年，我的意思是，當然，我們有一個非常非常詳細的自下而上的流程，我們對此進行了廣泛的審查，並得出了這樣的結論。最重要的是，你可以使用一些經驗法則。我的意思是我已經在我的介紹聲明中提到了這一點。在第一季度，如果你真的取消了對第一季度造成壓力的那種保理影響，你取消了已經從 2.6 億歐元重組計劃中支付的那種中兩位數的數百萬美元，你是實際上，隨著營業利潤的提高，現金流量與上一年相比有了很好的擴展。

Now there's also a tax component you might want to consider. And if you do that same math from -- for the full year and you consider that, probably the full EUR 260 million will be paid out on the restructuring side and then you embark also that on the factoring side, you assume, well, we continue to do it, so no impact on that, you are in that ballpark. So I don't see why this should be a number that couldn't fly. And now we have to see, as discussed, what we do on the factoring, if anything, and then also what potential is there in the working capital to get something out of it.

現在還有一個您可能需要考慮的稅收組成部分。如果你對全年進行同樣的計算，你會考慮，可能會在重組方面支付全部 2.6 億歐元，然後你也會在保理方面開始，你假設，好吧，我們繼續這樣做，所以對此沒有影響，你在那個球場上。所以我不明白為什麼這應該是一個不能飛的數字。正如所討論的那樣，現在我們必須看看我們在保理方面做了什麼，如果有的話，還有營運資本有什麼潛力可以從中得到一些東西。

The other big kind of offset is, of course, the delta between cash settled and equity settled stock-based compensation where we have now the benefit that over time, there will be more and more equity settled. And then we have to think about how we cope with the dilution of that, of course. So that's another important topic.

當然，另一種較大的抵消是現金結算和股權結算的股票薪酬之間的差異，我們現在的好處是隨著時間的推移，將會有越來越多的股權結算。當然，我們必須考慮如何應對這種稀釋。這是另一個重要的話題。

And last but not least, besides the working capital, there's always the question about, what do you amortize? What do you capitalize? So there is the bonuses on the commissions for new deals. And there is, of course, the capital expenditures we have to do. So this is what we need to analyze.

最後但並非最不重要的一點是，除了營運資金之外，總是有一個問題，你攤銷了什麼？你大寫什麼？因此，新交易的佣金有獎金。當然，還有我們必須做的資本支出。所以這就是我們需要分析的。

And then what I'm trying to achieve is to really come to a simple model that what do we need? If we want to grow by EUR 1 billion of revenues, what is the kind of absorption of capital once we have reached this 2025 business model? Because I guess that is what kind of drives your valuation models, and this is something I really want to spend quite some time on in the coming weeks.

然後我想要實現的是真正得出一個我們需要什麼的簡單模型？如果我們想增加 10 億歐元的收入，一旦我們達到 2025 年的商業模式，需要什麼樣的資本吸收？因為我想這就是你的估值模型的驅動力，這是我真正想在未來幾週花很多時間的事情。

The next question comes from the line of Mark Moerdler with Bernstein.

下一個問題來自 Mark Moerdler 與 Bernstein 的對話。

Congratulations on the strong quarter when so many others are seeing weakness, especially in cloud. Dominik, welcome on board, and we're looking forward to spending time with you.

當許多其他人看到疲軟時，特別是在雲中，祝賀強勁的季度。 Dominik，歡迎加入，我們期待與您共度時光。

We saw a really nice acceleration in the gross margin of the business platform. Can you give us more color on what is driving the margin improvement, how you see the trajectory of that margin going forward and how does this translate into overall S/4HANA Cloud gross margin?

我們看到業務平台的毛利率出現了非常好的加速。您能否就推動利潤率提高的因素、您如何看待未來利潤率的軌跡以及這如何轉化為 S/4HANA 雲的整體毛利率提供更多信息？

Yes, Mark, happy to take that question. I mean, look, with every RISE deal, but actually also with every LoB deal we are going to sell in the future, the Business Technology Platform is front and center. We just also got a great Gartner rating that in the meantime, we have the best integration suite and we see an extremely high adoption, not only SAP to SAP where we are heavily criticized for on, which we really now fixed and now leading, but also to non-SAP. I mean you just have heard about all of our announcement, and we also have a very open API layer on the platform, which is really API first across all of our products.

是的，馬克，很高興回答這個問題。我的意思是，看，對於每筆 RISE 交易，但實際上對於我們將來要出售的每筆 LoB 交易，業務技術平台都是前沿和中心。我們還獲得了 Gartner 的高評價，與此同時，我們擁有最好的集成套件，而且我們看到了極高的採用率，不僅是 SAP 到 SAP，我們因此受到嚴厲批評，我們現在確實修復了這個問題，現在處於領先地位，但是也適用於非 SAP。我的意思是你剛剛聽說了我們所有的公告，我們在平台上還有一個非常開放的 API 層，這在我們所有的產品中都是真正的 API 優先。

And then second, even more important, we see that, of course, our own services organization, but even more so the ecosystem where we have over 500,000 SAP consultants out there that they are doing with us the move from NetWeaver to BTP. And our promise is we are not only lifting and shifting ERPs and supply chains to the cloud, we are also transforming those and reduce complexity. And now when the whole application logic sits on BTP, the easiest thing is then to build all of these industry LoB extensions on the platform, which drives consumption, adoption and, with that, more and more cloud revenue. For me, personally, the BTP is one of the biggest growth assets we have in the years to come.

其次，更重要的是，我們當然看到了我們自己的服務組織，但更重要的是我們擁有超過 500,000 名 SAP 顧問的生態系統，他們正在與我們一起從 NetWeaver 遷移到 BTP。我們的承諾是，我們不僅將 ERP 和供應鏈提升並轉移到雲端，我們還將對其進行轉型並降低複雜性。現在，當整個應用程序邏輯都位於 BTP 上時，最簡單的事情就是在平台上構建所有這些行業 LoB 擴展，這會推動消費、採用，並由此帶來越來越多的雲收入。就我個人而言，BTP 是我們未來幾年最大的增長資產之一。

The next question comes from the line of James Goodman with Barclays.

下一個問題來自 James Goodman 與 Barclays 的對話。

A financial one from me to welcome Dominik. I mean there's a debate in the market on the OpEx intensity of SAP. You've got global peers cutting heads and costs. But of course, investors are wanting SAP to invest for growth. So I wondered if I could ask you about your first impressions around the sort of cost ratios in the business and maybe specifically what that means for the current restructuring program and how much of that needs to necessarily be reinvested in the business in your view.

我向 Dominik 致以財務邀請。我的意思是市場上對 SAP 的運營支出強度存在爭論。你有全球同行削減人頭和成本。但當然，投資者希望 SAP 投資於增長。所以我想知道我是否可以問你關於業務成本比率的第一印象，也許具體來說這對當前的重組計劃意味著什麼，以及你認為其中有多少需要重新投資於業務。

And also specifically on stock-based compensation, you explained why it's slightly elevated at the moment because of the stock price, that it's approaching 7% of sales. I mean should we expect that to trend back down towards sort of more 5% of sales over time in line with previous comments?

並且特別是關於基於股票的薪酬，你解釋了為什麼它現在因為股價而略有升高，它接近銷售額的 7%。我的意思是，我們是否應該預期隨著時間的推移，銷售額會像之前的評論那樣回落到 5% 以上？

Yes. I think OpEx, in general, it's true that in comparison to what I've seen in prior industries, there are some things which strike you, which is a very, very high go-to-market cost, but I still need to learn better why that's necessary. I think as a customer or a former customer of SAP, I see there are so many well-entrenched customers where it's now really about what I call always gardening the situation as opposed to hunting. And normally, the gardening has to be a very technical discussion. But I'm sure that Scott will have his views on that.

是的。我認為 OpEx，總的來說，與我在之前的行業中看到的相比，確實有一些東西讓你印象深刻，這是非常非常高的上市成本，但我仍然需要學習更好的是為什麼這是必要的。我認為作為 SAP 的客戶或前客戶，我看到有如此多的根深蒂固的客戶現在真正關心的是我所說的總是園藝而不是狩獵。通常，園藝必須是一個非常技術性的討論。但我相信 Scott 對此會有自己的看法。

Research and development, we have a very broad portfolio. So I'm not sure it's totally comparable to real pure-play companies. But I think that's also the beauty of our portfolio that we can do that upsell and cross-sell. And then I also have the philosophy that on research and development, in every category you tackle, you really want to be leading in terms of the resources you can commit to that because the tech business is a winner-takes-it-all business, so we have to get careful on that front.

研發方面，我們擁有非常廣泛的產品組合。所以我不確定它是否完全可以與真正的純業務公司相提並論。但我認為這也是我們產品組合的優點，我們可以進行追加銷售和交叉銷售。然後我還有這樣一個理念，即在研發方面，在你處理的每個類別中，你真的希望在你可以投入的資源方面處於領先地位，因為科技行業是贏家通吃的行業，所以我們必須在這方面小心。

And then admin, there's, of course, always opportunities to get some operating leverage out by growing without growing the G&A base. So I would hope to see the G&A base being diluted over time via SAP, via standing for productivity improvements, automation and we really have to lead by example here. So there's certainly some opportunities.

然後是管理員，當然，總是有機會通過在不增加 G&A 基礎的情況下增長來獲得一些運營槓桿。所以我希望看到 G&A 基礎隨著時間的推移通過 SAP 被稀釋，通過支持生產力提高、自動化，我們真的必須在這里以身作則。所以肯定有一些機會。

Now stock-based compensation, I guess, I've of course done the kind of -- I've asked people how they came up with these kind of numbers and it makes sense. It is actually something that we clearly acknowledge as an economic burden. So it's not funny money, that's just not there. For me, as a newcomer to the industry, it's kind of baffling to see that all these other companies get away with kind of that non-SBC or pre-SBC numbers. So we have to think about what we do. We see that some large companies are changing the path there, and that's also something we have to make up our mind on. But clearly, that's a thing we need to watch and how do we avoid dilution to a larger degree for our shareholders.

現在基於股票的薪酬，我想，我當然做過那種——我問過人們他們是如何得出這些數字的，這是有道理的。這實際上是我們明確承認的一種經濟負擔。所以這不是可笑的錢，只是不存在。對我來說，作為這個行業的新人，看到所有這些其他公司都擺脫了那種非 SBC 或 SBC 之前的數字，我有點莫名其妙。因此，我們必須考慮我們的工作。我們看到一些大公司正在改變方向，這也是我們要下定決心的事情。但顯然，這是我們需要關注的事情，我們如何避免對股東的更大程度的稀釋。

By way of quick follow-up, could I just ask if the Board has reached any conclusions on the use of the Qualtrics proceeds?

通過快速跟進，我能否問一下董事會是否已就 Qualtrics 收益的使用得出任何結論？

First of all, the proceeds are not in the bank yet, so we are going to close that transaction in the second half of the year. And the answer is, frankly, no. But of course, it's an item we have on the agenda. And what I want to say it's, from my perspective, providing us with great optionality. I mean the deployment of that capital, what we can do with it, it's crystal clear. And so we need to establish our pecking order, so to speak. And of course, it also depends on the strategic part. So we have some colleagues in the room who are taking care of that.

首先，收益還沒有存入銀行，所以我們打算在下半年完成這筆交易。坦率地說，答案是否定的。但當然，這是我們議程上的一個項目。我想說的是，從我的角度來看，它為我們提供了很大的選擇餘地。我的意思是該資本的部署，我們可以用它做什麼，這是非常清楚的。所以我們需要建立我們的啄食順序，可以這麼說。當然，這也取決於戰略部分。所以我們房間裡有一些同事正在處理這件事。

Again, coming here, what is very interesting is the huge organic growth opportunity we have. So I always like to be in a situation where M&A is a tool which can be done with kind of cold-blooded leap on the merits of the strategy. On the merits of the financials, we are not desperate to do anything because we have a strong organic growth opportunity. But still, there might be opportunities even with lower valuations, and that will play a role, too.

同樣，來到這裡，非常有趣的是我們擁有巨大的有機增長機會。因此，我總是喜歡這樣一種情況，即併購是一種工具，可以根據戰略的優點進行冷血飛躍。根據財務狀況，我們並不急於做任何事情，因為我們有強大的有機增長機會。但是，即使估值較低，也可能存在機會，這也將發揮作用。

The next question is from the line of Amit Harchandani with Citi Investment Research.

下一個問題來自花旗投資研究部的 Amit Harchandani。

Amit Harchandani from Citi. And welcome from my side as well, Dominik. Look forward to working with you. The question I have is with regards to how SAP is thinking about supporting not just cloud deployment, but also on-premise deployments going forward, particularly as it relates to driving through new innovation. There is still a significant proportion of your base that potentially needs to be migrated or is likely to want to stay on on-premise longer. So I would appreciate your thoughts on the same, where we are today, how much is left to go and how are you thinking about balancing on-premise versus cloud?

來自花旗的 Amit Harchandani。我也歡迎你，Dominik。期待與您合作。我的問題是關於 SAP 如何考慮不僅支持雲部署，還支持未來的本地部署，特別是因為它與推動新創新有關。您的基地中仍有很大一部分可能需要遷移，或者可能希望在內部部署更長時間。所以我很感激你對同樣的想法，我們今天在哪裡，還有多少事情要做，你如何考慮平衡內部部署與雲？

Yes. I can start and then, Scott, please also build on top of it. It's a very good question, and I'd love to answer it. And now, first, I mean, look, we have a huge installed base which is, first of all, a gift to have. And then second, what we now already communicated that there is the end of standard maintenance for all ERP releases lower than S/4HANA by the end of 2027. And I really would like to also say this today where we, clearly, there will be no extension of this time line.

是的。我可以開始，然後 Scott，也請在此基礎上進行構建。這是一個很好的問題，我很樂意回答。現在，首先，我的意思是，看，我們擁有龐大的安裝基礎，這首先是一份禮物。其次，我們現在已經傳達的信息是，到 2027 年底，所有低於 S/4HANA 的 ERP 版本的標準維護將結束。我今天真的很想說，很明顯，將會有這條時間線沒有延長。

Because why? Because at the end, we want to also use our R&D capacity and investments in the most effective way. And there are so many new technologies which we really want to embark on that we really wanted to deploy those in the cloud where also customers, by the way, get the most value out of it just when we look at the announcements we are doing around Sapphire, around ChatGPT.

因為為什麼？因為最後，我們還想以最有效的方式使用我們的研發能力和投資。我們真正想要採用的新技術如此之多，以至於我們真的想將它們部署在雲中，順便說一下，當我們查看我們正在做的公告時，客戶也能從中獲得最大價值藍寶石，圍繞 ChatGPT。

And then you also have to see that the world is becoming more and more isolated. And we actually differentiate also against many others in the market around our investments into globalization, into adhering to local regulations, data privacy requirements. And this is, of course, what we're going to continue to do, but cannot continue to do for all the other releases out there below S/4HANA. And that's why we definitely want to stick to our commitment to not extend our maintenance commitment, standard maintenance commitment beyond 2027 for everything below S/4HANA. Scott?

然後你還必須看到世界變得越來越孤立。事實上，我們在全球化投資、遵守當地法規和數據隱私要求方面也與市場上的許多其他公司有所不同。當然，這是我們將繼續做的事情，但不能繼續為 S/4HANA 以下的所有其他版本做。這就是為什麼我們絕對要堅持我們的承諾，即不將我們的維護承諾、標準維護承諾延長到 2027 年以後，適用於 S/4HANA 以下的所有內容。斯科特？

Yes, the only thing that I would add, just from a customer perspective, Christian, just to add on the large installed base that we have, the customer base have already made the decision to move to the cloud, but what is really clear is their journey will differ. Their transformation journey differs.

是的，我唯一要補充的是，從客戶的角度來看，克里斯蒂安，只是為了增加我們擁有的龐大安裝基礎，客戶群已經決定遷移到雲端，但真正清楚的是他們的旅程會有所不同。他們的轉型之旅各不相同。

So a bit of a reminder with the move with RISE when we announced it, it wasn't just a target architecture of being in the cloud, but it was helping customers on a transformation journey that fit their landscape. Some will have a longer period of time in leveraging their on-premise architecture. Others go straight to a greenfield in the cloud using our public edition. No matter what the journey, there are other capabilities that SAP brings to the table. Christian talked about the platform of growth of the BTP. That is across all of our customer base, let alone our other best-in-class line of business applications and our leadership in sustainability and supply chain.

因此，當我們宣布 RISE 的舉措時，這有點提醒，它不僅僅是在雲中的目標架構，而且它正在幫助客戶進行適合他們環境的轉型之旅。有些人將有更長的時間來利用他們的內部架構。其他人使用我們的公共版本直接進入雲中的綠地。無論旅程如何，SAP 都會提供其他功能。 Christian 談到了 BTP 的成長平台。這涉及我們所有的客戶群，更不用說我們其他一流的業務應用程序和我們在可持續發展和供應鏈方面的領導地位了。

So I guess my feedback is all customers are moving to a cloud-based architecture. They want the innovation, they want the ability for us to serve in a local regulatory-aligned framework, but also they want the innovation adoption at speed. And -- but then they've got a transformation road map with SAP, white-glove treatment to help them get there in their terms.

所以我想我的反饋是所有客戶都在轉向基於雲的架構。他們想要創新，他們希望我們能夠在當地監管框架內提供服務，但他們也希望快速採用創新。而且 - 但他們已經有了 SAP 的轉型路線圖，白手套待遇可以幫助他們按照自己的方式到達那裡。

I think that's different. Most other cloud companies will offer an outcome, but don't give too much guidance about how to get there. What SAP does is really leans into the journey, and that makes it much easier for customers to navigate the way forward and still benefit from where we're investing and innovating.

我認為那是不同的。大多數其他雲公司會提供一個結果，但不會給出太多關於如何實現的指導。 SAP 所做的是真正融入旅程，這讓客戶更容易駕馭前進的道路，並仍然從我們投資和創新的領域中受益。

The next question comes from the line of Kirk Materne with Evercore ISI.

下一個問題來自 Kirk Materne 與 Evercore ISI 的合作。

And congrats on the solid first quarter results. I was wondering -- I don't know if this is for Christian or Scott, but can you all just talk about sort of where we are on the cloud portfolio outside of S/4HANA, just where those businesses are? It looks like pretty stable, low double-digit growth. Do you feel like they can accelerate? Sort of what should we be thinking about sort of the cloud business outside of S/4HANA over the next 12 months? Or are there sort of some of the puts and takes there?

並祝賀第一季度的穩健業績。我想知道——我不知道這是給 Christian 還是 Scott 的，但你們能不能談談我們在 S/4HANA 之外的雲產品組合中所處的位置，這些業務在哪裡？它看起來非常穩定，兩位數的低增長。你覺得他們能加速嗎？在接下來的 12 個月裡，我們應該如何考慮 S/4HANA 之外的雲業務？或者那裡有一些 puts 和 takes 嗎？

I can start and then, Scott, please comment as well. I mean, first of all, when you look at our win rates, there is no doubt, and that's why I'm also so hopeful with regard to our new offering, GROW with SAP, that our win rates even stand alone for net new are extremely high in the ERP and the platform business.

我可以開始了，斯科特，也請發表評論。我的意思是，首先，當您查看我們的贏率時，毫無疑問，這就是為什麼我對我們的新產品充滿希望，與 SAP 一起成長，我們的贏率甚至獨立於淨新產品在 ERP 和平台業務方面都非常高。

Of course, in the LoBs, it's a tougher environment. But very important, SAP is winning in all of the cases where we can expand from the core. So you heard HCL. When we talk about total workforce management and you talk about new ways of packaging certain offerings, this all has to work together with the payroll, with the finance system of HCL.

當然，在 LoB 中，這是一個更艱難的環境。但非常重要的是，SAP 在我們可以從核心擴展的所有案例中都取得了勝利。所以你聽說過 HCL。當我們談論全面勞動力管理並且您談論包裝某些產品的新方法時，這一切都必須與工資單和 HCL 的財務系統一起工作。

And also very important to mention here CX. We do a restructuring in this area, but we are fully betting on CX just in a different way. Always when we are leading with our industry capabilities, where I actually claim that we know the industry is much better than anyone else out there, and we are leading with customers like core where we can talk about customer loyalty, where we need data from the ERP, where we can also build end-to-end value chains with commerce connected to the inventory, to the supply chain. This is where we are winning. And this is what we are following.

在這裡提及 CX 也非常重要。我們在這方面進行了重組，但我們以不同的方式完全押注於 CX。總是當我們以我們的行業能力領先時，我實際上聲稱我們知道這個行業比其他任何人都好得多，我們以客戶為核心，我們可以談論客戶忠誠度，我們需要來自客戶的數據ERP，我們還可以在其中建立端到端的價值鏈，將商業連接到庫存、供應鏈。這就是我們獲勝的地方。這就是我們正在關注的。

And then we will also -- we also see very strong win rates in the other lines of businesses. And I'm actually very, very happy to see Concur. I mean, of course, without any relation to the product itself, they went through a hard time through the pandemic, and they delivered another very strong quarter. So I'm very happy to also see Concur back on track. Scott?

然後我們也會——我們也會看到其他業務領域的贏率非常高。我真的非常非常高興見到 Concur。我的意思是，當然，與產品本身沒有任何關係，他們在大流行期間度過了一段艱難的時期，並且他們交付了另一個非常強勁的季度。所以我也很高興看到 Concur 重回正軌。斯科特？

Yes. Maybe 2 additional comments if I can add to what you described, Christian. The first is our core LoB solutions outside of S/4HANA Cloud and BTP are actually still growing quite strongly. And Christian mentioned Concur is a good example of that. So double-digit revenue growth that are strong. Each of them have their own competitive markets and dimensions, but the portfolio strengthens. And I do want to highlight transaction volumes, particularly Concur, BTP, Ariba, et cetera, where we're seeing a higher -- the supply network where we're seeing higher transaction volumes come back, which also helps from a sustainable revenue growth.

是的。如果我可以添加到你描述的內容中，也許還有 2 條額外的評論，克里斯蒂安。首先是我們在 S/4HANA Cloud 和 BTP 之外的核心 LoB 解決方案實際上仍在強勁增長。 Christian 提到 Concur 就是一個很好的例子。所以兩位數的收入增長非常強勁。他們每個人都有自己的競爭市場和規模，但產品組合得到加強。我確實想強調交易量，特別是 Concur、BTP、Ariba 等，我們看到更高的供應網絡，我們看到更高的交易量回歸，這也有助於可持續的收入增長.

The second comment that I would make, and we'll share more of this at Sapphire in more detail, but the ability for us to upsell, cross-sell our broader portfolio once you've got the base S/4 cloud and BTP, the multiples are undeniable. So as our customers move their mission-critical processes in the cloud, then their ability and the ease of which they can expand the SAP portfolio, whether it be supply chain, procurement, contingent labor, HR, they are able to do so in a really agile way. And that comes on the back of the real heavy lifting our engineering teams have done around the integration of the SAP portfolio that Christian mentioned before, that now comes to life to our customers.

我要發表的第二條評論，我們將在 Sapphire 更詳細地分享更多內容，但是一旦您獲得基礎 S/4 雲和 BTP，我們就有能力追加銷售、交叉銷售我們更廣泛的產品組合，倍數是不可否認的。因此，當我們的客戶將他們的關鍵任務流程轉移到雲中時，他們的能力和擴展 SAP 產品組合的便利性，無論是供應鏈、採購、臨時工、人力資源，他們都能夠在一個真正敏捷的方式。這是在我們的工程團隊圍繞 Christian 之前提到的 SAP 產品組合集成所做的真正繁重工作的背後，現在我們的客戶已經實現了這一點。

So that gives me confidence that the 2 go hand-in-hand. It's not about winning only in those independent markets, but the portfolio coming together and making it easier for customers to get the innovation value that they're looking for.

所以這讓我有信心兩者齊頭並進。這不僅僅是在那些獨立的市場中取勝，而是組合在一起的產品組合，讓客戶更容易獲得他們正在尋找的創新價值。

The final question comes from the line of Mohammed Moawalla with Goldman Sachs.

最後一個問題來自 Mohammed Moawalla 和 Goldman Sachs 的對話。

Dominik, nice to speak to you. Dominik, my question is around sort of SAP sort of cost structure as you look kind of going forward. No doubt, there's going to be leverage around the sort of gross margin. But as you look at some of the other line items, where do you think there's sort of scope for kind of efficiency? And I know, Christian, you've talked about potentially some R&D leverage in kind of the current plan. But as you talk about the great organic opportunities and given you're unlikely to do any large-scale M&A, how do you think of some of the kind of leverage areas around the cost outside of the gross margin?

多米尼克，很高興和你說話。多米尼克，我的問題是關於某種 SAP 的成本結構，因為你看起來有點前進。毫無疑問，圍繞這種毛利率會有槓桿作用。但是，當您查看其他一些項目時，您認為哪些地方可以提高效率？我知道，克里斯蒂安，你已經談到了當前計劃中潛在的一些研發槓桿。但是當你談到巨大的有機機會並且你不太可能進行任何大規模的併購時，你如何看待毛利率之外的一些圍繞成本的槓桿領域？

Well, I think there is, of course, a kind of natural pecking order in that type of industry. What are the things that need to scale with revenue? What are the things that can be kind of providing some good operating leverage? It's a little premature, frankly, for me to now jump to conclusion to say this is what we're going to do.

好吧，我認為在那種類型的行業中當然存在一種自然的等級順序。哪些事情需要隨著收入的增長而擴大？哪些東西可以提供一些良好的運營槓桿？坦率地說，現在就下結論說這就是我們要做的還為時過早。

What I can say is that whenever I've seen businesses really delivering improvements on that front, these were rarely kind of quantum leaps. It was more about a kind of grinding over many years where people have been driving operational excellence by continuous improvement. And I think there are great opportunities.

我能說的是，每當我看到企業真正在這方面做出改進時，這些都很少是質的飛躍。它更多地是一種多年來人們一直在通過持續改進推動卓越運營的磨練。我認為有很大的機會。

Frankly, I think the low-hanging fruit is probably harvested, and we have to now deploy some more sophisticated techniques. And what I would like to see here is that we create to spin that flywheel more strongly with a stronger focus on free cash flow. So don't expect any wild leaps in the near term on that. It will be a grinding work over many years to really mature the margin side even further.

坦率地說，我認為唾手可得的果實可能已經收穫，我們現在必須部署一些更複雜的技術。我想在這裡看到的是，我們創建的目的是為了更強勁地旋轉飛輪，更加關注自由現金流。因此，不要指望短期內會有任何飛躍。要使保證金方面真正進一步成熟，將是一項多年的磨練工作。

And just a few comments from my side. I mean today also for me personally is a very important point in our transformation. I mean we came to you 2.5 years ago with a new guidance, and we also asked you to give us the permission for certain investments to reduce our technical debt. And we did our homework. Looking at the gross margin and the gross profit performance in Q1, I hope you see that we delivered.

還有我這邊的一些評論。我的意思是，今天對我個人來說也是我們轉型中非常重要的一點。我的意思是我們 2.5 年前帶著新的指導來找你們，我們還要求你們允許我們進行某些投資以減少我們的技術債務。我們做了功課。看看第一季度的毛利率和毛利潤表現，我希望你看到我們交付了。

Now to Dominik's point, we have to find also additional levels. And the good piece is, yes, we have those. I mean, first of all, when you look at these RISE contracts in cloud, it's all around economies of scale. And especially in the outer years, this is where still a lot of workloads will be migrated to the cloud, and that actually allows us to scale the cloud operations also in a -- at a higher scale.

現在按照 Dominik 的觀點，我們還必須找到其他級別。好消息是，是的，我們有這些。我的意思是，首先，當你在雲中查看這些 RISE 合同時，它們都圍繞著規模經濟。尤其是在過去的幾年裡，仍然有很多工作負載將遷移到雲中，這實際上使我們能夠以更高的規模擴展雲操作。

And second, I mean, Thomas and Juergen, they will continue to invest. And I want to emphasize, no additional invest, but they will continue to invest also in continuously modernizing our technical stack. This is just a foundational topic for when you want to stay relevant in the cloud and to always sit on the latest and greatest technology. So no matter if it's about the elasticity of our database, no matter if it's about reducing the work you have to put in, in touching and supporting the stack. And by the way, ChatGPT will play even a role in that in cyber and the support of our cloud systems. So we have additional levers, and we will continuously work on that.

其次，我的意思是，Thomas 和 Juergen，他們將繼續投資。我想強調，沒有額外的投資，但他們將繼續投資，不斷使我們的技術堆棧現代化。這只是一個基礎主題，適用於您希望在雲中保持相關性並始終採用最新和最先進的技術。因此，無論是關於我們數據庫的彈性，還是關於減少您在接觸和支持堆棧方面必須投入的工作。順便說一下，ChatGPT 甚至會在網絡和我們的雲系統支持方面發揮作用。所以我們有額外的槓桿，我們將繼續努力。

Right. Thank you, Christian, and thank you, Mo. So -- and this concludes our call for today. Thanks for joining.

正確的。謝謝你，Christian，也謝謝你，Mo。所以——我們今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的加入。

Thank you, everyone. Thank you.

謝謝大家。謝謝。

Ladies and gentlemen, the conference has now concluded, and you may disconnect your telephone. Thank you for joining, and have a pleasant day. Goodbye.

女士們，先生們，會議現已結束，你們可以掛斷電話了。感謝您的加入，祝您度過愉快的一天。再見。