SAP SE (SAP) 2022 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and welcome to the SAP Q2 2022 Earnings Conference Call. Today's conference is being recorded.

美好的一天，歡迎參加 SAP 2022 年第二季度收益電話會議。今天的會議正在錄製中。

At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Anthony Coletta, Chief Investor Relations Officer. Please go ahead, sir.

在這個時候，我想把會議交給首席投資者關係官 Anthony Coletta。請繼續，先生。

Thank you, and welcome, everyone. Thanks for joining us today on our earnings call to discuss SAP's Q2 and first half 2022 results. On our Investor Relations website, you can find the deck supplementing today's call.

謝謝大家，歡迎大家。感謝您今天加入我們的財報電話會議，討論 SAP 的第二季度和 2022 年上半年業績。在我們的投資者關係網站上，您可以找到補充今天電話會議的套牌。

With me today are CEO, Christian Klein; and CFO, Luka Mucic, will make opening remarks. Scott Russell, who leads our customer success organization, is also with us for Q&A.

今天和我在一起的是首席執行官 Christian Klein；首席財務官 Luka Mucic 將致開幕詞。領導我們的客戶成功組織的 Scott Russell 也與我們一起進行問答。

Now let's do the safe harbor. During this call, we'll make forward-looking statements which are predictions, projections or other statements about future events. These statements are based on current expectations, forecasts and assumptions that are subject to risk and uncertainties that could cause actual results and outcomes to materially differ. Additional information regarding these risks and uncertainties may be found in our filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission, including but not limited to the risk factors section of SAP's annual report on Form 20-F for 2021.

現在讓我們做安全港。在本次電話會議中，我們將做出前瞻性陳述，即對未來事件的預測、預測或其他陳述。這些陳述基於當前的預期、預測和假設，這些預期、預測和假設受到風險和不確定性的影響，可能導致實際結果和結果存在重大差異。有關這些風險和不確定性的更多信息，請參見我們提交給美國證券交易委員會的文件，包括但不限於 SAP 2021 年 20-F 表格年度報告中的風險因素部分。

Unless otherwise stated, all financial numbers on this call are non-IFRS. Growth rates and percentage point changes are non-IFRS year-over-year at constant currencies. The non-IFRS financial measures we provide should not be considered as a substitute for or superior to the measures of financial performance prepared in accordance with IFRS.

除非另有說明，本次電話會議中的所有財務數字均非國際財務報告準則。增長率和百分點變化按非國際財務報告準則按固定匯率計算。我們提供的非 IFRS 財務指標不應被視為替代或優於根據 IFRS 編制的財務業績指標。

And with that, I'd like to turn it over to Christian.

有了這個，我想把它交給克里斯蒂安。

Yes. Thank you, Anthony, and thanks to all of you for joining today. This has been a good quarter for SAP despite the challenging political and macroeconomic environment. Our cloud and total revenue have exceeded market expectations and are progressing faster than we expected at 34% and 13% nominal, respectively. Our top line cloud performance is clearly ahead of plan, further accelerated by the COVID, macroeconomic environment and currency tailwinds.

是的。謝謝你，安東尼，也感謝你們今天的加入。儘管政治和宏觀經濟環境充滿挑戰，但這對 SAP 來說是一個不錯的季度。我們的雲計算和總收入超出了市場預期，並且分別以名義增長 34% 和 13% 的速度比我們預期的要快。我們的頂線雲性能明顯超前，COVID、宏觀經濟環境和貨幣順風進一步加速了我們的發展。

Customers are actually turning to us now more than ever to help them address their most pressing concerns: Business model transformation and process automation, supply chain resilience and sustainable operations. We see demand for SAP technology continuing to increase with an increased focus on transforming and automating mission-critical business processes and the core functions of an enterprise.

實際上，客戶現在比以往任何時候都更多地求助於我們，以幫助他們解決最緊迫的問題：商業模式轉型和流程自動化、供應鏈彈性和可持續運營。我們看到對 SAP 技術的需求持續增長，因為人們越來越關注任務關鍵型業務流程和企業核心功能的轉型和自動化。

As we have seen in previous economic pullbacks, companies that balance cost efficiency measures with strategic investments in technology are more resilient and better able to offset margin pressure. We are also seeing a powerful snowball effect from our platform and ecosystem businesses as the adoption of SAP solutions accelerates.

正如我們在之前的經濟回調中看到的那樣，平衡成本效率措施和技術戰略投資的公司更有彈性，也能更好地抵消利潤壓力。隨著 SAP 解決方案的採用加速，我們還看到我們的平台和生態系統業務產生了強大的滾雪球效應。

Let's take a look now at some of our top line numbers for Q2. In Q2, we hit the major milestone of cloud revenue becoming our largest revenue stream for the first time. Cloud revenue was up 24% at constant currency and up 34% at nominal levels. Current cloud backlog quotes accelerated at 25% and now exceeds EUR 10 billion, another first. Current cloud backlog for SAP S/4HANA hit a record 87% growth and stands at EUR 2.3 billion, driven by continued strong adoption of RISE with SAP. In addition, S/4HANA cloud revenue growth continued to accelerate at 72%.

現在讓我們看一下我們第二季度的一些頂級數字。在第二季度，我們首次實現了雲收入成為我們最大收入來源的重要里程碑。雲收入按固定匯率計算增長 24%，按名義水平增長 34%。當前的雲積壓報價以 25% 的速度增長，現已超過 100 億歐元，這是另一個第一。 SAP S/4HANA 目前的雲積壓達到創紀錄的 87%，達到 23 億歐元，這得益於 RISE 與 SAP 的持續強勁採用。此外，S/4HANA 雲收入增長繼續加速，達到 72%。

Customers are choosing us for the power of our integrated portfolio: First, core ERP; second, the SAP Business Technology Platform; and third, our best-in-class solutions. Our strategy is focused on investing in and capitalizing on the integration of these assets. This provides unmatched superior solutions for our customers and extensive cross-sell opportunities for SAP.

客戶選擇我們是因為我們的集成產品組合的強大功能：首先，核心 ERP；第二，SAP業務技術平台；第三，我們一流的解決方案。我們的戰略專注於投資和利用這些資產的整合。這為我們的客戶提供了無與倫比的卓越解決方案，並為 SAP 提供了廣泛的交叉銷售機會。

I'd like to now provide an update on our strategy execution. Since we initiated our transformation almost 2 years ago, our performance is well ahead of plan. SAP has always been acknowledged as the category leader for ERP. Now just as SAP invented ERP decades ago, we are leading the ERP transition to the cloud. This has led to over EUR 2.2 billion of current cloud backlog for SAP S/4HANA, as I mentioned earlier. The momentum we are seeing today increasingly comes from the power of being a platform company. Our Business Technology Platform now has a run rate exceeding EUR 1.4 billion, and there are more than 14,000 customers using the platform.

我現在想提供有關我們戰略執行的最新信息。自從我們在大約 2 年前開始轉型以來，我們的業績遠遠超出了計劃。 SAP 一直被公認為 ERP 領域的領導者。現在，正如幾十年前 SAP 發明 ERP 一樣，我們正在引領 ERP 向雲的過渡。正如我之前提到的，這導致 SAP S/4HANA 當前的雲積壓超過 22 億歐元。我們今天看到的勢頭越來越多地來自平台公司的力量。我們的商業技術平台現在的運行率超過 14 億歐元，有超過 14,000 名客戶使用該平台。

Turning to our core line of business solutions. They are all growing by double digits in both cloud revenue and current cloud backlog. We see customers increasingly choosing to adopt the full portfolio from SAP given the enhanced value from our integrated solutions. For example, many of our customers opt for our Intelligent Spend solutions to achieve cost savings across their entire direct and indirect spend as well as travel and expense and third-party workforce.

轉向我們的核心業務解決方案。它們在雲收入和當前云積壓方面都以兩位數的速度增長。我們看到客戶越來越多地選擇採用 SAP 的完整產品組合，因為我們的集成解決方案具有更高的價值。例如，我們的許多客戶選擇我們的智能支出解決方案，以在他們的整個直接和間接支出以及差旅和費用以及第三方勞動力方面實現成本節約。

The potential for cross-selling is tremendous. In Q2, we saw RISE with SAP being a cross and up-sell catalyst, with more than 85% of RISE deals including additional cloud solutions, and 77% of RISE customers adopting the SAP Business Technology Platform. We have also entered key new growth markets.

交叉銷售的潛力是巨大的。在第二季度，我們看到 RISE 與 SAP 成為交叉和向上銷售的催化劑，超過 85% 的 RISE 交易包括額外的雲解決方案，77% 的 RISE 客戶採用了 SAP 業務技術平台。我們還進入了關鍵的新增長市場。

Recognizing that no business can succeed in isolation, we pioneered a new approach in building the SAP Business Network. The SAP Business Network allows customers to connect real-time across their suppliers in industry-specific networks. This boosts transparency and provides the resilience so desperately needed in today's environment. Our new sustainability portfolio complements the SAP Business Network, enabling transparency across value chains, helping our customers to meet regulatory requirements and contribute to a sustainable future.

認識到任何企業都無法孤立地取得成功，我們開創了一種構建 SAP 業務網絡的新方法。 SAP Business Network 允許客戶在特定行業的網絡中跨供應商進行實時連接。這提高了透明度，並提供了當今環境迫切需要的彈性。我們新的可持續發展產品組合補充了 SAP 業務網絡，實現了價值鏈的透明度，幫助我們的客戶滿足監管要求並為可持續發展的未來做出貢獻。

Underpinning this leadership position is our business transformation as a service offering: RISE with SAP. Since RISE with SAP was launched at the beginning of last year, we have seen the offering going from gaining traction, to gaining momentum, to becoming the preferred choice for our customers as they move to the cloud. RISE with SAP helps customers with the hardest part of that transition, redesigning how their companies won. We offer customers so much more than a technology transition. RISE with SAP helps them: First, to redesign their end-to-end business processes; second, transition to a new agile ERP in the cloud; and third, innovate on the platform to design their own custom solutions.

支撐這一領導地位的是我們的業務轉型即服務產品：RISE with SAP。自去年年初推出 RISE with SAP 以來，我們已經看到該產品從獲得牽引力到獲得動力，再到成為我們客戶遷移到雲時的首選。 RISE with SAP 幫助客戶完成轉型中最困難的部分，重新設計他們公司的獲勝方式。我們為客戶提供的不僅僅是技術轉型。 RISE with SAP 幫助他們：首先，重新設計他們的端到端業務流程；第二，過渡到雲中的新敏捷 ERP；第三，在平台上進行創新，設計自己的定制解決方案。

In Q2, RISE customers included Moderna, ABB Information Systems, RWE, HeidelbergCement and Bridgestone.

在第二季度，RISE 的客戶包括 Moderna、ABB Information Systems、RWE、HeidelbergCement 和普利司通。

Moderna's pioneering vaccine is helping the world overcome the COVID-19 pandemic. They selected RISE with SAP to support their ambitious growth targets through scalable, automated end-to-end processes across research and development, sourcing and distribution and support functions.

Moderna 的開創性疫苗正在幫助世界戰勝 COVID-19 大流行。他們選擇 RISE with SAP 來支持其雄心勃勃的增長目標，通過跨研發、採購和分銷以及支持功能的可擴展、自動化端到端流程。

RWE, the leading German utility company, is adopting RISE with SAP to support its international expansion and its sustainability initiatives as part of its Growing Green strategy.

德國領先的公用事業公司 RWE 正在採用 RISE with SAP 來支持其國際擴張和可持續發展計劃，作為其“綠色成長”戰略的一部分。

The success of RISE with SAP in turn drove strong performance across our line of business applications, including S/4HANA. We see continued cross- and up-sell momentum, which means we continue to create about 2.5x the value from a customer after they have adopted RISE with SAP. We now have around 20,000 S/4HANA customers, up 15% year-over-year, with more than 60% of our customers being net new. We are also seeing strong momentum for S/4HANA in the cloud, with approximately 6,000 customers and over 600 wins in Q2.

RISE 與 SAP 的成功反過來推動了我們的業務應用程序線（包括 S/4HANA）的強勁表現。我們看到持續的交叉銷售和追加銷售勢頭，這意味著在客戶採用 RISE 和 SAP 後，我們將繼續從客戶那裡創造大約 2.5 倍的價值。我們現在擁有大約 20,000 名 S/4HANA 客戶，同比增長 15%，其中超過 60% 的客戶是新客戶。我們還看到雲中 S/4HANA 的強勁勢頭，在第二季度擁有大約 6,000 名客戶和超過 600 場胜利。

We are seeing increasing traction in the mid-market and in the start-up community. For example, the French unicorn, Doctolib, is an online and mobile booking platform that helps users find doctors and make appointments. They selected S/4HANA cloud as an easy-to-implement, robust, scalable solution providing fast time to value.

我們在中端市場和初創社區看到了越來越大的吸引力。例如，法國獨角獸 Doctolib 是一個在線和移動預約平台，幫助用戶尋找醫生和預約。他們選擇 S/4HANA 云作為一種易於實施、強大、可擴展的解決方案，可快速實現價值。

Now our order entry growth for S/4HANA cloud and on-premise clearly exceeded 30%, demonstrating significant gains in market share. SAP's business technology platform enables customer innovation and infrastructure integration. This quarter, the global leader, HeidelbergCement, decided to move from their on-premise ERP on Oracle to S/4HANA cloud on Azure. They will be using SAP's Business Technology Platform as an integration and development platform to provide access to SAP services.

現在，我們的 S/4HANA 雲和內部部署訂單增長明顯超過 30%，表明市場份額顯著增長。 SAP 的業務技術平台支持客戶創新和基礎架構集成。本季度，全球領導者 HeidelbergCement 決定從 Oracle 上的本地 ERP 遷移到 Azure 上的 S/4HANA 雲。他們將使用 SAP 的業務技術平台作為集成和開發平台，以提供對 SAP 服務的訪問。

Our sustainability solutions have taken on an even more important role given the energy crisis. ERGO Group, one of the largest insurance groups in Europe, has chosen SAP to help them navigate the highly regulated sustainability expectations of the financial services industry, of course, in Germany. ERGO aims to open new sustainable business practices, create climate-neutral business operations and create transparencies throughout its business by reporting in accordance with the international guidelines set out by the GRA.

鑑於能源危機，我們的可持續發展解決方案發揮了更加重要的作用。 ERGO Group 是歐洲最大的保險集團之一，它選擇 SAP 來幫助他們應對金融服務行業（當然是在德國）受到高度監管的可持續發展預期。 ERGO 旨在通過按照 GRA 制定的國際準則進行報告，開闢新的可持續商業實踐，創建氣候中和的業務運營，並在整個業務中創造透明度。

Our Intelligent Spend and Business Network division has taken on new meaning as companies plan for continued inflationary pressures and a need to diligently manage costs. Wins this quarter include BeiGene, the leading biotech company specializing in anti-cancer drugs. They chose SAP Ariba to quickly build a cloud-based procurement management platform to support different languages and regulations around the world, in addition to improving efficiency.

隨著公司計劃應對持續的通貨膨脹壓力和努力管理成本的需要，我們的智能支出和業務網絡部門具有了新的意義。本季度的贏家包括專注於抗癌藥物的領先生物技術公司百濟神州。他們選擇 SAP Ariba 來快速構建基於雲的採購管理平台，以支持全球不同的語言和法規，同時提高效率。

Turning to our customer engagement portfolio. Positivo Tecnologia, a Brazilian technology company, is using SAP CX solutions to automate their marketing campaigns based on customer behavior analysis. This will enable them to personalize their customer engagements and create more opportunities for customer cross-sell, upsell, conversion and retention.

轉向我們的客戶參與組合。巴西科技公司 Positivo Tecnologia 正在使用 SAP CX 解決方案根據客戶行為分析自動化營銷活動。這將使他們能夠個性化他們的客戶參與，並為客戶交叉銷售、追加銷售、轉換和保留創造更多機會。

In Q2, Asus, the global leader in personal computer, monitors, graphics cards and routers, chose SAP SuccessFactors to bring its vision for employees to life. The solution will provide a one-stop service supported by data analysis and insights.

在第二季度，個人電腦、顯示器、顯卡和路由器領域的全球領導者華碩選擇了 SAP SuccessFactors 來實現其對員工的願景。該解決方案將提供以數據分析和洞察為支撐的一站式服務。

SAP Signavio, part of our Business Process Intelligence portfolio, is going from strength to strength. Corning, which is one of the world's leading innovators in material science, selected the full SAP Signavio suite to drive governance and collaborative process management excellence as they transform their ERP systems. Customers this quarter also include Moët Hennessy and ALTANA, the German chemicals company.

SAP Signavio 是我們業務流程智能產品組合的一部分，正在不斷發展壯大。作為世界領先的材料科學創新者之一，康寧選擇了完整的 SAP Signavio 套件，以在他們改造 ERP 系統時推動治理和協作流程管理的卓越性。本季度的客戶還包括酩悅軒尼詩和德國化學品公司 ALTANA。

I'd like to spend a little time talking about our outlook. We are ending the second half of the year with a very strong cloud pipeline. Given our strategy maps directly on to our customers' most pressing challenges pressing, we see this shift from CapEx to OpEx spend combined with currency tailwinds completely offsetting the top line impact of our Russia exit.

我想花一點時間談談我們的前景。我們將以非常強大的雲管道結束今年下半年。鑑於我們的戰略直接針對我們客戶最緊迫的挑戰，我們認為這種從資本支出到運營支出的轉變加上貨幣順風完全抵消了我們退出俄羅斯的頂線影響。

On the bottom line, we are adjusting our guidance based on 2 onetime impacts: First, our intended full withdrawal from Russia; second, in the current macro environment, our customers are shifting to the cloud faster than expected as they continue to move from upfront capital expenditure to recurring operational expenditure. This leads to an additional transactional impact on our short-term profitability with clear midterm upside as our cloud strategy continues to pay off. We are managing a significant portion of these onetime impacts with additional measures around discretionary spend.

歸根結底，我們正在根據兩個一次性影響調整我們的指導：首先，我們打算全面撤出俄羅斯；其次，在當前的宏觀環境下，我們的客戶正在以比預期更快的速度遷移到雲，因為他們繼續從前期資本支出轉向經常性運營支出。隨著我們的雲戰略繼續獲得回報，這將對我們的短期盈利能力產生額外的交易影響，並具有明顯的中期上行空間。我們正在通過圍繞可自由支配支出的額外措施來管理這些一次性影響的很大一部分。

Looking beyond 2022, we are clearly ahead of plan to deliver upon the promise we made in October 2020 when we announced our new strategy. We are confident we will achieve double-digit operating profit growth in 2023 while keeping the promise of flat to slightly declining operating profit through 2021 and 2022 versus 2020. And we are well on track to achieving all the performance goals for our 2025 midterm ambitions.

展望 2022 年之後，我們顯然提前兌現了我們在 2020 年 10 月宣布新戰略時做出的承諾。我們有信心，我們將在 2023 年實現兩位數的營業利潤增長，同時保持與 2020 年相比，到 2021 年和 2022 年營業利潤持平或略有下降的承諾。我們正朝著實現 2025 年中期雄心的所有業績目標邁進。

On the bottom line, the investments we made over the last 2 years put us in a good position to deliver double-digit profit growth starting next year. Very importantly, we also have a strategic initiative in place to consolidate and simplify our portfolio. This will result in increased focus on our core high-growth solutions, providing even stronger synergies across our suite of solutions, complemented by potential acquisitions in our core. We will provide an update on our 2025 ambition in the next quarters once we have more clarity on the macroeconomic situation.

歸根結底，我們在過去 2 年所做的投資使我們處於有利位置，從明年開始實現兩位數的利潤增長。非常重要的是，我們還制定了一項戰略計劃來整合和簡化我們的產品組合。這將導致我們更加關注我們的核心高增長解決方案，在我們的解決方案套件中提供更強大的協同效應，並輔以我們核心的潛在收購。一旦我們對宏觀經濟形勢有了更清晰的了解，我們將在接下來的幾個季度提供關於 2025 年目標的最新信息。

In summary, this has been a good quarter. We made significant investments during 2021 and the first half of 2022, which now enables us to further scale our execution. Our strategy is perfectly aligned to the challenges our customers are facing, and we look forward to helping them come out of the current environment stronger and more resilient.

總而言之，這是一個不錯的季度。我們在 2021 年和 2022 年上半年進行了大量投資，現在這使我們能夠進一步擴大執行規模。我們的戰略與客戶面臨的挑戰完全一致，我們期待幫助他們從當前環境中變得更強大、更有彈性。

Thank you again for joining us today. And I will now hand over to Luka to talk through our results in more detail. Luka?

再次感謝您今天加入我們。我現在將交給 Luka 更詳細地討論我們的結果。盧卡？

Thank you, Christian. Yes, there are definitely many topics affecting businesses worldwide today and creating a challenging environment. Nonetheless, as Christian said, delivered a good quarter, proving that our strategy is working and our solution portfolio is meeting customer demand. Our portfolio is more relevant than ever for our customers and the transformation to the cloud continues to deliver them even more exciting opportunities. We're helping them transform their businesses, create more resilient supply chains and accelerate their sustainability efforts.

謝謝你，克里斯蒂安。是的，肯定有許多話題影響著當今世界各地的企業，並創造了一個充滿挑戰的環境。儘管如此，正如克里斯蒂安所說，我們實現了一個不錯的季度，證明我們的戰略是有效的，我們的解決方案組合正在滿足客戶的需求。我們的產品組合比以往任何時候都更適合我們的客戶，而向雲的轉型繼續為他們帶來更多令人興奮的機會。我們正在幫助他們轉變業務，創建更具彈性的供應鏈並加快他們的可持續發展努力。

In the second quarter, we saw robust double-digit cloud order entry growth with a particularly strong momentum in North America and Latin America. The trend towards larger cloud transactions also accelerated, and deals with a volume greater than EUR 5 million contributed 48% to our cloud order entry in the quarter. This was again driven by our RISE with SAP offering.

在第二季度，我們看到了強勁的兩位數雲訂單進入增長，其中北美和拉丁美洲的勢頭尤為強勁。大型雲交易的趨勢也加速了，交易量超過 500 萬歐元的交易為我們在本季度的雲訂單輸入貢獻了 48%。這再次受到我們 RISE with SAP 產品的推動。

Christian already talked about our ongoing cloud momentum and the fast-accelerating growth from S/4HANA and our Business Technology Platform. To reiterate, we continued driving strong top line growth, and cloud revenue became the largest revenue stream, up 24%. Our current cloud backlog exceeded EUR 10 billion for the first time and was up 25%, accelerating from the 23% growth that we saw in the first quarter. Again, the war in Ukraine had a dampening impact of 1 percentage point on that growth rate. S/4HANA current cloud backlog was up a record 87% and contributed more than EUR 2.2 billion to the overall current cloud backlog, becoming the biggest contributor.

Christian 已經談到了我們持續的雲發展勢頭以及來自 S/4HANA 和我們的業務技術平台的快速增長。重申一下，我們繼續推動強勁的收入增長，雲收入成為最大的收入來源，增長 24%。我們當前的雲積壓首次超過 100 億歐元，增長 25%，高於第一季度 23% 的增長。同樣，烏克蘭戰爭對該增長率產生了 1 個百分點的抑制影響。 S/4HANA 當前的雲積壓增長了創紀錄的 87%，為當前的整體雲積壓貢獻了超過 22 億歐元，成為最大的貢獻者。

At our financial analyst conference, we introduced a new disclosure to reflect the evolution of our strategy. Our SaaS and PaaS portfolio combined grew an impressive 26%. And breaking it down, SaaS cloud revenue was up 24% and PaaS cloud revenue was up 40%. The strong cloud growth was primarily driven by an outstanding contribution of S/4HANA cloud, Qualtrics, the business Technology Platform and SAP Signavio. In addition, we also saw strong double-digit contributions from our other SaaS offerings, including Concur, which continued its path of recovery and grew by 20%.

在我們的財務分析師會議上，我們引入了一項新的披露，以反映我們戰略的演變。我們的 SaaS 和 PaaS 產品組合合計增長了 26%，令人印象深刻。細分來看，SaaS 雲收入增長了 24%，PaaS 雲收入增長了 40%。強勁的雲增長主要得益於 S/4HANA 雲、Qualtrics、業務技術平台和 SAP Signavio 的傑出貢獻。此外，我們還看到其他 SaaS 產品的強勁兩位數貢獻，包括 Concur，它繼續復甦並增長了 20%。

Fueled by this cloud revenue momentum as well as the strong growth in services revenue, our total revenue was up 5% in the quarter. Our cloud revenue performance was strong across all regions in the second quarter. EMEA increased by 27%, Americas by 22% and APJ by 26%. Germany had an outstanding cloud revenue performance, while the U.S., Brazil, Japan, India and Switzerland were particularly strong.

在這種雲收入增長勢頭以及服務收入強勁增長的推動下，我們的總收入在本季度增長了 5%。第二季度，我們所有地區的雲收入表現都很強勁。 EMEA 增長了 27%，美洲增長了 22%，APJ 增長了 26%。德國的雲收入表現出色，而美國、巴西、日本、印度和瑞士尤其強勁。

Let's now take a look at the bottom line, starting with gross margins. Due to revenue mix effects, our total gross margin decreased by 30 basis points to 73%. Very importantly, our cloud gross profit growth of 28% was supported by a continued upward trend of our cloud gross margin. Year-over-year, it expanded by more than 2 percentage points and reached 72%, and that is despite increased investments into our next-generation cloud delivery program.

現在讓我們看看底線，從毛利率開始。由於收入組合的影響，我們的總毛利率下降了 30 個基點至 73%。非常重要的是，我們的雲毛利率增長了 28%，這得益於我們的雲毛利率持續上升趨勢。同比增長超過 2 個百分點，達到 72%，儘管我們增加了對下一代云交付計劃的投資。

Our non-IFRS operating profit was down by 16% to EUR 1.680 billion, mainly driven by a reduced contribution from software licenses revenue as well as significant bad debt expenses related to the war in Ukraine. In addition, we incurred restructuring expenses of EUR 130 million mainly due to the exit from Russia, impacting IFRS operating profit, which was down 32% to EUR 673 million. Excluding the direct impact of the war in Ukraine, IFRS operating profit would have been down 3% and non-IFRS operating profit down 10%.

我們的非國際財務報告準則營業利潤下降 16% 至 16.80 億歐元，主要是由於軟件許可收入的貢獻減少以及與烏克蘭戰爭相關的大量壞賬費用。此外，我們產生了 1.3 億歐元的重組費用，主要是由於退出俄羅斯，影響了 IFRS 的營業利潤，下降 32% 至 6.73 億歐元。排除烏克蘭戰爭的直接影響，IFRS 營業利潤將下降 3%，非 IFRS 營業利潤將下降 10%。

Let me now turn to EPS and cash flow. The decline of earnings per share that you saw in the quarter reflects a contribution to financial income by Sapphire Ventures which was EUR 1 billion lower than over the same period last year.

現在讓我談談每股收益和現金流。您在本季度看到的每股收益下降反映了 Sapphire Ventures 對財務收入的貢獻，比去年同期減少了 10 億歐元。

Our IFRS effective tax rate was up 42.5 percentage points to 62.2%. This was mainly due to the reduction in tax-exempt income contributed by Sapphire Ventures and an additional increase of nondeductible expenses in the context of share-based compensation and restructuring expenses related to the war in Ukraine. As compared to that, our non-IFRS effective tax rate was only up 10 percentage points to 29.3% as it was unaffected by the increase in nondeductible expenses.

我們的 IFRS 有效稅率上升 42.5 個百分點至 62.2%。這主要是由於 Sapphire Ventures 貢獻的免稅收入減少，以及與烏克蘭戰爭相關的股權補償和重組費用的背景下不可扣除的費用額外增加。相比之下，我們的非國際財務報告準則有效稅率僅上升 10 個百分點至 29.3%，因為它不受不可扣除費用增加的影響。

Our free cash flow for the first 6 months came in at approximately EUR 2.81 billion (sic) [EUR 2.08 billion]. The year-over-year decline is mainly due to the reduced profitability in the quarter and impacts from working capital caused by our continuous move to the cloud.

我們前 6 個月的自由現金流約為 28.1 億歐元（原文如此）[20.8 億歐元]。同比下降主要是由於本季度盈利能力下降以及我們持續遷移到雲造成的營運資金影響。

In the second half, however, we expect a more favorable cash flow due to lower cash taxes and increased profitability. We are therefore reiterating our free cash flow outlook of above EUR 4.5 billion for the year.

然而，由於現金稅的降低和盈利能力的提高，我們預計下半年的現金流會更加有利。因此，我們重申了我們今年超過 45 億歐元的自由現金流展望。

On the tax line, we are updating our full year 2022 IFRS effective tax rate guidance to 34% to 38%. This adjustment mainly results from an updated projection of nondeductible expenses and the lower expected 2022 financial income contribution of Sapphire Ventures given current market conditions. As the updated nondeductible expenses are not included in non-IFRS, we continue to anticipate a full year non-IFRS effective tax rate of 23% to 27%, but now expect to be at the upper end of this range.

在稅收方面，我們將 2022 年全年 IFRS 有效稅率指引更新為 34% 至 38%。這一調整主要是由於對不可抵扣費用的更新預測以及在當前市場條件下 Sapphire Ventures 對 2022 年財務收入貢獻的預期較低。由於更新後的不可扣除費用不包括在非國際財務報告準則中，我們繼續預計全年非國際財務報告準則的有效稅率為 23% 至 27%，但現在預計將處於該範圍的上限。

Let's now turn to the outlook. As you've seen in today's release, we are reaffirming our revenue outlook for the full year. We are updating our operating profit outlook range to reflect the expected operating profit impact of approximately EUR 350 million from the war in Ukraine and a potential continued market decline of software licenses revenue due to the current macro environment.

現在讓我們轉向前景。正如您在今天的新聞稿中看到的那樣，我們重申了全年的收入前景。我們正在更新我們的營業利潤展望範圍，以反映烏克蘭戰爭對大約 3.5 億歐元的預期營業利潤影響以及由於當前宏觀環境導致的軟件許可收入潛在的市場持續下滑。

Finally, a few words on sustainability and some strategic initiatives. We continue to make progress on the sustainability front as both an enabler and an exemplar. We have the biggest positive impact through our solutions, and we have announced new innovations in the SAP Cloud for sustainable enterprise solution. For example, the enhanced SAP Product Footprint Management solution helps customers reduce product carbon footprints at scale. Further, Taulia announced a partnership with EcoVadis. We will provide ESG ratings for Taulia's Sustainable Supplier Finance solution.

最後，談談可持續性和一些戰略舉措。作為推動者和典範，我們繼續在可持續發展方面取得進展。我們通過我們的解決方案產生了最大的積極影響，我們宣布了 SAP Cloud 中的新創新，以實現可持續的企業解決方案。例如，增強的 SAP 產品足跡管理解決方案可幫助客戶大規模減少產品碳足跡。此外，Taulia 宣布與 EcoVadis 建立合作夥伴關係。我們將為 Taulia 的可持續供應商融資解決方案提供 ESG 評級。

We have also achieved positive milestones around diversity. For example, women in management have increased further to 28.8%. Demonstrating further positive impact, our SAP.IO Foundries has achieved its goal of supporting 200 companies in its portfolio that are managed or founded by underrepresented individuals earlier than expected.

我們還在多元化方面取得了積極的里程碑。例如，管理中的女性進一步增加至 28.8%。展示進一步的積極影響，我們的 SAP.IO Foundries 已經實現了支持其投資組合中的 200 家公司的目標，這些公司由代表性不足的個人管理或創立的公司比預期的要早。

So in conclusion, the results of this quarter once again proved that our strategy is resonating, confirmed by our current cloud backlog performance. In our discussion with customers, we are clearly seeing that they look to strategic investments in technology to help them solve their most pressing business imperatives. We are now ready to capitalize on our substantial growth investments over the last 18 months by delivering sustained growth and profitability expansion. This makes us confident that we're making strong progress towards our midterm ambition. And based on our strong cloud momentum and favorable currency development, we expect to provide an update to our ambition in the upcoming quarters.

因此，總而言之，本季度的結果再次證明了我們的戰略正在引起共鳴，我們當前的雲積壓表現也證實了這一點。在與客戶的討論中，我們清楚地看到他們希望對技術進行戰略投資，以幫助他們解決最緊迫的業務需求。我們現在準備好利用過去 18 個月的大量增長投資，實現持續增長和盈利能力擴張。這使我們確信我們正在朝著我們的中期雄心邁進。基於我們強勁的雲動力和有利的貨幣發展，我們預計將在未來幾個季度更新我們的雄心壯志。

Thank you, and we will now be happy to take your questions.

謝謝您，我們現在很樂意回答您的問題。

Operator, please open the line.

接線員，請打開線路。

(Operator Instructions) We will now take our first question from Frederic Boulan from Bank of America.

（操作員說明）我們現在將回答美國銀行的 Frederic Boulan 的第一個問題。

Fred from Bank of America. Two questions, please. One is around what's driving the change around license deceleration. Any specific end markets, size of clients, that you can point to? And what has changed versus Q1 when you gave that unchanged guidance? Considering we already had a fair amount of concern on end markets.

美國銀行的弗雷德。請教兩個問題。一是圍繞許可證減速的驅動變化。您可以指出任何特定的終端市場、客戶規模嗎？當您給出不變的指導時，與第一季度相比發生了什麼變化？考慮到我們已經對終端市場產生了相當多的關注。

And secondly, if you can touch around pricing. We have a high inflationary environment across your geography. Can you share with us the actions you're taking to pass that on to a degree? And if you can split that between cloud, maintenance and license.

其次，如果你能觸及定價。我們在您所在的地區都處於高通脹環境。您能否與我們分享您為將其傳遞到學位而採取的行動？如果您可以在雲、維護和許可證之間進行拆分。

Yes. So let me first take the question right away on pricing. And indeed, I mean, what we are seeing is also across the world, high inflation and of course increasing costs. But at the same time, what we're also having, a very sticky cloud business. And with that, actually of course, we will -- we are planning to offset some of these cost increases we will see with additional price increases.

是的。因此，讓我首先立即提出有關定價的問題。事實上，我的意思是，我們在世界各地看到的也是高通脹，當然還有成本上升。但與此同時，我們還擁有一個非常具有粘性的雲業務。有了這個，實際上我們當然會 - 我們計劃通過額外的價格上漲來抵消其中一些成本增加。

And we are just in the planning for that. And we will release our new price schedule then in the upcoming weeks and months. But definitely, of course, we will and have to react to this inflationary pressure.

我們正在為此做計劃。我們將在接下來的幾周和幾個月內發布我們的新價格表。但當然，我們肯定會而且必須對這種通脹壓力做出反應。

And maybe, Luka, you can comment on the profit outlook, yes?

也許，盧卡，你可以評論利潤前景，是嗎？

Yes, absolutely. So first of all, in terms of the momentum that we are seeing on the software license side, and I will invite Scott also to make some comments around that.

是的，一點沒錯。首先，就我們在軟件許可方面看到的勢頭而言，我還將邀請 Scott 對此發表一些評論。

I mean, we were always, in our planning for the full year, even under normal conditions, we were assuming a negative software license performance in Q1 given that the prior year Q1 was very strong with double-digit growth. And so that was, for us back then, not a strong signal of something deteriorating fundamentally.

我的意思是，我們一直在計劃全年，即使在正常情況下，我們也假設第一季度的軟件許可業績為負，因為上一年第一季度非常強勁，實現了兩位數的增長。因此，對於當時的我們來說，這並不是一個從根本上惡化的強烈信號。

But we see now in Q2 is actually, on the one hand, a strong acceleration of the transition to the cloud that you see also in the very strong S/4HANA results that Christian has talked about. And that is not to the detriment of the total order entry for S/4HANA. As Christian has also said, with clearly more than 30% growth combined across cloud and on-premise, we're clearly gaining market share here. But the shift has become really more pronounced, and that's why we had the decline of 38%.

但我們現在在第二季度看到實際上，一方面是向雲過渡的強勁加速，你在 Christian 談到的非常強大的 S/4HANA 結果中也看到了這一點。這並不損害 S/4HANA 的總訂單條目。正如克里斯蒂安所說，雲計算和本地部署的總增長明顯超過 30%，我們顯然在這裡獲得了市場份額。但這種轉變變得更加明顯，這就是我們下降 38% 的原因。

And it's a combination, I would say, of this accelerating shift. Because in the current environment, the customer preferences for OpEx versus CapEx investments is clearly further increasing. And certainly in some markets, also macro concerns.

我想說，這是這種加速轉變的結合。因為在當前環境下，客戶對 OpEx 與 CapEx 投資的偏好顯然正在進一步增加。當然，在某些市場上，也存在宏觀問題。

Broadly speaking, I would say, and Scott, perhaps you can add then some flavor on it. We see a very constructive demand environment in Americas and in Asia. And in Europe, it's a little bit a tale of 2 cities. The closer you get to Russia and The Ukraine, so in our Middle and Eastern Europe region there, we clearly see a lower kind of conversion of pipeline to actual closings. In the rest of Europe, it was actually a very solid quarter as well, in particular on the cloud side of the house.

從廣義上講，我會說，斯科特，也許你可以在上面添加一些味道。我們看到美洲和亞洲的需求環境非常有建設性。在歐洲，這有點像 2 個城市的故事。離俄羅斯和烏克蘭越近，所以在我們的中東歐地區，我們清楚地看到管道向實際關閉的轉化率較低。在歐洲其他地區，它實際上也是一個非常穩固的區域，特別是在房子的雲側。

So when you take all of this together, indeed, after Q1, we left our guidance unchanged because we were focused on our ability to absorb the impact from the Russia exit as a direct impact. And when you take a look at that, we have now reduced our guidance for operating profit at the midpoint by EUR 250 million. The impact from Russia is actually EUR 350 million alone, and so we are actually absorbing a good part of that.

因此，當您將所有這些綜合起來時，事實上，在第一季度之後，我們保持我們的指導不變，因為我們專注於我們吸收俄羅斯退出影響作為直接影響的能力。當您仔細查看時，我們現在已將中點營業利潤的指導降低了 2.5 億歐元。僅來自俄羅斯的影響實際上就高達 3.5 億歐元，因此我們實際上正在吸收其中的很大一部分。

But you see now the indirect impact of the stronger shift from on-prem to cloud that comes along with it outside of Russia, and that is something that we have now come better to appreciate. And therefore, it made sense for us to derisk the outlook for 2022. But we now feel very confident that this outlook is safe and supports the continuation of the shift that we have seen in the first half to also extend into the second half.

但是你現在看到了在俄羅斯以外隨之而來的從本地到雲的更強烈轉變的間接影響，這是我們現在更好地理解的東西。因此，我們對 2022 年的前景不屑一顧是有道理的。但我們現在非常有信心，這種前景是安全的，並支持我們在上半年看到的轉變繼續延續到下半年。

Perhaps, Scott, any color commentary around the momentum and also the shift that you're seeing in the market?

斯科特，也許你對這種勢頭以及你在市場上看到的轉變有什麼色彩評論？

Yes, sure, Luka. In addition to what you described around this shift from the CapEx to the OpEx and the market conditions, what we've seen in the market since the launch of RISE is the willingness of companies to move their mission-critical workloads to the cloud run by SAP.

是的，當然，盧卡。除了您所描述的從資本支出到運營支出的轉變以及市場條件之外，自 RISE 推出以來，我們在市場上看到的是公司願意將其關鍵任務工作負載轉移到由樹液。

You now take the current environment, the need of a safe, secure, reliable, scalable platform that allows them to accelerate and grow is more relevant than ever, which means the demand continues to increase for RISE with SAP and S/4 in the cloud. But that correspondingly means the demand, combined with the other factors that Luka described, has -- is reduced. And we can see that as a validation of the strategy and acceleration of the strategy.

在當前環境下，對安全、可靠、可靠、可擴展的平台的需求比以往任何時候都更加重要，這意味著對雲中 SAP 和 S/4 的 RISE 的需求不斷增加.但這相應地意味著需求，再加上盧卡描述的其他因素，已經 - 減少了。我們可以將其視為對戰略的驗證和戰略的加速。

So whether you're Baker Hughes oilfield or ABB Information Systems or the Defense Logistics Agency or many others, these big organizations, let alone the 60% net new customers, their acceleration to move to a platform that they're looking at, not for 1 year, 2 year, 3 years, they're looking 5, 10 years out in their decisions that they're making here, and they're looking for that scalable cloud platform. So I see it as a positive, but it is certainly an accelerated shift.

因此，無論您是貝克休斯油田還是 ABB 信息系統公司或國防後勤局或許多其他機構，這些大型組織，更不用說 60% 的淨新客戶，他們加速遷移到他們正在尋找的平台，而不是為1 年、2 年、3 年，他們正在尋找 5 年、10 年的時間來做出他們在這裡做出的決定，他們正在尋找可擴展的雲平台。所以我認為這是一個積極的方面，但它肯定是一個加速的轉變。

Next question from Amit Harchandani from Citigroup.

花旗集團的 Amit Harchandani 的下一個問題。

Amit Harchandani from Citi. Two questions, if I may. My first question is with regards to the cloud momentum in the context of macro. Now you've talked about obviously strong secular drivers underpinning your portfolio. But if there was to be a stronger recession going into 2023, do you have any views on how do you think your cloud growth is likely to trend? What is the sort of discussions you're having with customers? Yes, they see a need for it today, but do you see that changing going forward? And the reason I ask this is because, typically in the past recessions that we have had, cloud was a small part. So would be keen to know your thoughts on the same.

花旗銀行的 Amit Harchandani。兩個問題，如果可以的話。我的第一個問題是關於宏觀背景下的雲動力。現在您已經談到了支撐您的投資組合的明顯強大的長期驅動因素。但是，如果到 2023 年出現更嚴重的衰退，您對您的雲增長可能趨勢有何看法？您正在與客戶進行什麼樣的討論？是的，他們今天看到了它的需求，但你看到這種變化了嗎？我問這個的原因是，通常在我們過去的經濟衰退中，雲只是一小部分。所以很想知道你對同樣的想法。

And the second question I have is with regards to your operating margin performance. We have seen 2 quarters in a row where the strength in the cloud seems to have been offset by weaker-than-expected operating margin outcome. Can you talk about what drove it on the OpEx side, particularly the sales and marketing expenses? And if you see merit on potentially giving better maybe quarterly guidance on operating margins as we go forward to reduce this lack of understanding.

我的第二個問題是關於您的營業利潤率表現。我們已經連續兩個季度看到，雲計算的實力似乎被弱於預期的營業利潤率結果所抵消。你能談談是什麼推動了運營支出方面的發展，尤其是銷售和營銷費用嗎？如果您看到在我們繼續減少這種缺乏理解的過程中可能會提供更好的營業利潤率季度指導的好處。

Yes. So let me take the first question on the outlook for cloud for the second half, but also for 2023. And of course, when you have conversation these days with our customers, I mean, first, what we clearly can confirm is that our cloud pipeline compared to 3 months ago actually increased. So we see stronger demand.

是的。因此，讓我提出關於下半年以及 2023 年雲前景的第一個問題。當然，當你這些天與我們的客戶交談時，我的意思是，首先，我們可以明確確認的是，我們的雲管道與3個月前相比實際上有所增加。因此，我們看到了更強勁的需求。

And why is that? It's not necessarily only the move to the cloud. When you talk about SAP and when you talk about RISE with SAP, it's about, is the CEO willing now to stop the business transformation of a car manufacturer? Or of a retailer? Or of a utility? The answer is clearly no. They want to continue full speed to build more resilient digital business models. When it comes to new license model; when it comes to more intelligent pricing, quoting; when it comes to reskilling the workforce, this is all SAP, this is all RISE with SAP, and there's no slowdown.

為什麼是這樣？不一定只是遷移到雲端。當您談論 SAP 以及 RISE with SAP 時，它是關於，CEO 現在是否願意停止汽車製造商的業務轉型？還是零售商的？還是實用程序？答案顯然是否定的。他們希望繼續全速打造更具彈性的數字商業模式。談到新的許可模式；當涉及到更智能的定價時，報價；在重新培訓勞動力方面，這完全是 SAP，這都是 SAP 的 RISE，並且沒有放緩。

The second one, of course, when you look into our portfolio and into the pipeline, oftentimes these days, companies see less of a demand challenge but a huge supply chain challenge. So also there, it comes to the resilient supply chain. So SAP Business Network, what can we do with IBP with our leading supply chain solutions to make these supply chains more resilient? So also there, the pipeline is up.

第二個，當然，當你查看我們的產品組合和管道時，這些天，公司經常看到的不是需求挑戰，而是巨大的供應鏈挑戰。彈性供應鏈也是如此。那麼 SAP Business Network，我們可以通過 IBP 和我們領先的供應鏈解決方案做些什麼來使這些供應鏈更具彈性？同樣在那裡，管道已啟動。

And then when you -- utilities, oil and gas and others, of course, everyone wants to also transform into a more sustainable enterprise. And there, we have new technology. We're offering a green ledger, and also, that is of high demand. So when you would ask me today, we see a very robust pipeline. I see also no signs of a slowdown in the cloud with regard to our SaaS portfolio, with regard to our PaaS portfolio. So on that side, we are very confident.

然後當你——公用事業、石油和天然氣等，當然，每個人都想轉型為更具可持續性的企業。在那裡，我們擁有新技術。我們正在提供綠色分類帳，而且需求量很大。因此，當您今天問我時，我們看到了一個非常強大的管道。對於我們的 SaaS 產品組合和 PaaS 產品組合，我也沒有看到雲計算放緩的跡象。所以在這方面，我們非常有信心。

Yes. And perhaps just to complement this with 2 factors. Let's not forget that many of SAP's stronghold industries, I think, will not so much be subject to recessionary risk. I mean, we have the E&G industries, obviously, as a stronghold. We have pharma as a stronghold with Moderna. What we have seen now, we have all of the others essentially as well. We have retail as a stronghold. So I think that gives us also good support in addition to the strength of the portfolio.

是的。也許只是為了補充這兩個因素。我們不要忘記，我認為 SAP 的許多大本營行業不會受到衰退風險的影響。我的意思是，顯然，我們有 E&G 行業作為一個據點。我們將製藥作為 Moderna 的據點。我們現在所看到的，我們基本上也擁有所有其他人。我們有零售作為一個據點。所以我認為除了投資組合的實力之外，這也給了我們很好的支持。

And the other point is the backlog as well. I've talked about, I think, now for a number of quarters, not only do we see a significant surge in our current cloud backlog and the continued strength there. We actually had significantly higher growth rates in terms of cloud TCV and then the annualized contract values for a long time now since the advent of RISE with SAP. And so this gives us already a very strong coverage through what we have contracted and what will come in guaranteed into the current cloud backlog of future quarters and of course also into the revenue line. And that's an additional safety net that you don't necessarily already see in the current cloud backlog.

另一點也是積壓工作。我認為，我已經談到，現在已經有幾個季度了，我們不僅看到我們當前的雲積壓大幅增加，而且那裡的持續實力。自從 RISE with SAP 出現以來，我們實際上在雲 TCV 和年化合同價值方面的增長率明顯更高。因此，這已經為我們提供了非常強大的覆蓋範圍，涵蓋了我們已簽約的內容，以及未來幾個季度當前云積壓中的保證內容，當然還有收入線中的內容。這是一個額外的安全網，您不一定已經在當前的雲積壓中看到。

Now quickly on your operating margin topic. I think that's a valid point. But we have started actually, since the beginning of the year, I've already given some commentary around seasonality, including actually also the impact that we have to expect for -- from Russia in Q2. And I'm happy to expand on this.

現在快速討論您的營業利潤率主題。我認為這是一個有效的觀點。但實際上我們已經開始了，自今年年初以來，我已經對季節性進行了一些評論，實際上還包括我們必須預期的影響——來自俄羅斯在第二季度的影響。我很高興對此進行擴展。

First of all, in the quarter, in the first half year, you're absolutely right, the sales and marketing ratio has been significantly up. Why? Because we have front-loaded investments, and we were always clear about that. I said that on the Q4 call, that we have to expect negative profitability in the first half and then improvements in the second half year. You want to actually have your territories covered so that you can drive for the strong growth that we have expected, and that's exactly what has happened.

首先，在這個季度，在上半年，你是絕對正確的，銷售和營銷比例已經顯著上升。為什麼？因為我們有前期投資，而且我們一直很清楚這一點。我在第四季度的電話會議上說過，我們必須預計上半年的盈利能力會出現負增長，然後下半年會有所改善。您希望真正覆蓋您的領土，以便您可以推動我們預期的強勁增長，而這正是發生的事情。

So we added almost 3,800 hats on the go-to-market front year-over-year in the first half year. And obviously, that comes with incremental expenses. But that was planned and that will actually moderate in the second half year. And certainly for 2023, we expect a further reduction in the sales and marketing ratio.

因此，我們在上半年的上市前沿同比增加了近 3,800 頂帽子。顯然，這伴隨著增加的費用。但這是計劃好的，實際上在下半年會有所緩和。當然，到 2023 年，我們預計銷售和營銷比例會進一步下降。

Let's also not forget that COVID is pretty much behind us when it comes to customer engagement. So on the marketing side of the house, we have returned to physical events. With Sapphire coming back, yes, it costs a bit more than a purely virtual event, but I can ensure you that it also drives significantly more pipeline. And so from that perspective, that's a worthwhile investment that we see -- we will see the payoff on with the continued momentum on the revenue front.

我們也不要忘記，在客戶參與方面，COVID 遠遠落後於我們。所以在房子的營銷方面，我們已經回到了體育賽事。隨著 Sapphire 的回歸，是的，它的成本比純粹的虛擬活動要高一些，但我可以向你保證，它還會推動更多的管道。因此，從這個角度來看，這是我們看到的一項有價值的投資——我們將看到收益的持續增長勢頭。

So I think it's important that I use this opportunity to give you then also some more color commentary around how you should think about the second half year. I mean, on the CCB and on the cloud revenue side, it's essentially pretty much what I shared also as expectations in our Q1 call and after Q4. So we continue to believe that we will exit the year with a CCB growth rate that is similar to the one that we saw in Q4 2021. I'm also reasonably confident that we will be able to absorb the impact of Russia as a part of that. And it should be a pretty steady road from here on that we see in the second half year.

所以我認為重要的是，我利用這個機會給你一些關於你應該如何思考下半年的更多色彩評論。我的意思是，在建行和雲收入方面，這基本上是我在第一季度電話會議和第四季度之後分享的預期。因此，我們繼續相信，我們將以與 2021 年第四季度相似的 CCB 增長率結束這一年。我也有理由相信，我們將能夠吸收俄羅斯的影響，作為那。從這裡開始，我們在下半年看到的應該是一條相當穩定的道路。

On the cloud revenue front, it's quite similar. So you should expect a quite stable growth from what we have seen in Q2 as well, and there is a difference on the operating profit line. So in Q3, we're still expecting negative operating profit and then a return to positive operating profit in Q4, making then the room for the return to double-digit growth in 2023.

在雲收入方面，情況非常相似。因此，您應該期望我們在第二季度也看到相當穩定的增長，並且營業利潤線存在差異。因此，在第三季度，我們仍然預計營業利潤為負，然後在第四季度恢復為正營業利潤，從而為 2023 年恢復兩位數增長創造了空間。

Why is that so? Well, first of all, because as we said, the front-loaded investments that we made means that we will start to scale profits, in particular, towards the end of the year. We will have really digested the impact of the war in Ukraine in Q4. In particular, we will have released most of the employees that we still retain in Russia by then. And that will of course be released on the operating profit line as well. The comparables on the expense side will become a lot easier because last year, Q4, we had already very significant hiring and significant investments in pipeline generation and so on, as well as we anticipate a close of our pending divestiture in Q4, and that will of course provide help.

為什麼呢？嗯，首先，因為正如我們所說，我們所做的前期投資意味著我們將開始擴大利潤，特別是在年底之前。我們將在第四季度真正消化烏克蘭戰爭的影響。特別是，屆時我們將釋放大部分仍留在俄羅斯的員工。當然，這也將在營業利潤線上發布。費用方面的可比性將變得容易得多，因為去年第四季度，我們已經在管道生成等方面進行了大量招聘和重大投資，而且我們預計第四季度將結束我們未決的剝離，這將當然提供幫助。

Please remember last year, we had the Fioneer joint venture set up in Q3. And of course, we don't have a comparable event in Q3 of this year. Hopefully, that helps to understand the dynamic a bit better.

請記住，去年我們在第三季度成立了 Fioneer 合資企業。當然，我們在今年第三季度沒有類似的活動。希望這有助於更好地理解動態。

Next question from Adam Wood from Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的亞當伍德的下一個問題。

Just first of all, maybe on the assumptions for the second half on the profitability side. I mean, you've alluded to the shift to cloud and macro having an impact. Are you basically assuming a continuation of the situation in the second quarter, i.e., a little bit of weakness in parts of Europe hitting the licenses, and that continued cloud strength also impacting licenses for the second half? Or have you also made the assumption that as more macro cycles go, that weakness could spread to other parts of Europe and maybe to other parts of the world on licenses, and so there's a little bit of incremental caution? So just in terms of what you're assuming, particularly on the macro side, for the second half of this year.

首先，也許是對下半年盈利能力方面的假設。我的意思是，您已經提到向雲和宏觀的轉變會產生影響。您是否基本上假設第二季度的情況會延續，即歐洲部分地區的許可證略有疲軟，而持續的雲實力也會影響下半年的許可證？或者您是否還假設隨著更多宏觀週期的發展，這種疲軟可能會蔓延到歐洲其他地區，甚至可能會蔓延到世界其他地區的許可證，因此有一點點漸進式的謹慎？因此，就今年下半年的假設而言，尤其是在宏觀方面。

And then maybe secondly. As we look forward into next year, again, I think most investors I speak to are expecting a recession or certainly a slowdown. Could you maybe just talk a little bit about how you would manage the costs through that? Maintaining investments versus, as you say, already starting to focus on discretionary spend? And is there a level of growth where it would be impossible for you to grow EBIT double digit next year as the current guidance suggests?

然後也許是其次。當我們再次展望明年時，我認為與我交談過的大多數投資者都在期待經濟衰退，或者肯定會放緩。您能否簡單談談您將如何管理成本？維持投資，而不是如你所說，已經開始關注可自由支配的支出？是否存在按照當前指導建議的增長水平，您明年的息稅前利潤不可能達到兩位數？

Yes. Let me take this. So first of all on the second half guide, yes, so we -- actually, we don't see the software license to cloud transformation only happening in parts of Europe. This is actually something which is already happening at a global level. And we expect in our guidance that it will continue to happen at the same pace as what we have seen in Q2. And obviously, against this, we're running already with our cost flex program and productivity program that you have alluded to. And that of course means that we are taking out expenses in discretionary areas.

是的。讓我拿這個。所以首先在下半部分指南中，是的，所以我們 - 實際上，我們認為雲轉型的軟件許可不僅僅發生在歐洲部分地區。這實際上是已經在全球範圍內發生的事情。我們預計在我們的指導中，它將繼續以與我們在第二季度看到的速度相同的速度發生。顯然，與此相反，我們已經在運行您提到的成本彈性計劃和生產力計劃。這當然意味著我們要在可自由支配的領域中支出費用。

We have already slowed down hiring in Q2, as you have seen. With only 600 additions, we will further slow this down. And because we have actually already made significant moves with close to 5,500 additional employees in the last 3 quarters, so we are well set up to continue to capitalize on the growth opportunities without kind of adding on the investment front to the same extent.

如您所見，我們已經放緩了第二季度的招聘速度。僅添加 600 個，我們將進一步減慢速度。而且因為我們實際上已經在過去 3 個季度增加了近 5,500 名員工，因此我們已經做好準備繼續利用增長機會，而不會在同樣程度上增加投資方面。

The only exception here would be the continuation of our cloud delivery harmonization program which is well underway now. We have a very clear line of sight now that we'll complete in the first half, and then we'll make room to yet another significant step-up in cloud profitability. So from that perspective, we feel that we're appropriately covered, that the guidance is safe now, because what we saw in Q2 on the license side was not confined to only parts of Europe, but was actually a broad-based trend that we saw.

唯一的例外是繼續我們的雲交付協調計劃，該計劃目前正在順利進行。現在我們有一個非常清晰的視線，我們將在上半年完成，然後我們將為雲盈利能力的另一個顯著提升騰出空間。因此，從這個角度來看，我們認為我們得到了適當的覆蓋，該指南現在是安全的，因為我們在第二季度看到的許可證方面的情況不僅限於歐洲部分地區，而且實際上是一個基礎廣泛的趨勢，我們鋸。

And in 2023, look, I mean, we have said that we are committed to a double-digit growth over the 2022 numbers.

在 2023 年，我的意思是，我們已經說過，我們致力於在 2022 年的數字基礎上實現兩位數的增長。

Because that question might be asked, let me answer it proactively right away: Yes. And that would also include the divestiture. So whatever onetime gain we drive from that in 2022, we would build off the double-digit growth for 2023 on that basis.

因為這個問題可能會被問到，所以我馬上主動回答：是的。這也將包括資產剝離。因此，無論我們在 2022 年從中獲得什麼一次性收益，我們都將在此基礎上建立 2023 年的兩位數增長。

Frankly, we see ourselves set up very well with the investments that we have made now. We certainly don't see the need for additional investments in 2023, at the same levels of headcount increases as we saw in the last 2 years, to drive for those numbers. And there will be a very significant natural benefit from the ending of the cloud delivery harmonization program.

坦率地說，我們看到自己在現在所做的投資方面做得很好。我們當然不認為需要在 2023 年進行額外投資，以與過去 2 年相同的員工人數增長水平來推動這些數字。雲交付協調計劃的結束將帶來非常顯著的自然收益。

Just to give you a view here. In Q2, we had more than EUR 100 million in investments tied up in the cloud delivery harmonization program. We expect similar amounts in the second half year. Once this has tapered off, of course, that is already a very big help.

只是在這裡給你一個看法。在第二季度，我們在雲交付協調計劃中投入了超過 1 億歐元的投資。我們預計下半年會有類似的金額。當然，一旦這種情況逐漸減少，這已經是一個很大的幫助。

So I would say, if we continue to assume a difficult but not a doomsday macro environment for 2023, we're extremely confident that we will drive for the double-digit growth.

所以我想說，如果我們繼續假設 2023 年的宏觀環境艱難但不是末日，我們非常有信心推動兩位數的增長。

Yes. And Adam, maybe also just let me summarize it from a strategy perspective. When we look back, I mean, we started this transformation 2.5 years ago. And Scott, I guess it's fair to say that last year, it took a bit of time until really RISE took off. And we had good software quarters, a bit better than expected.

是的。亞當，也許也讓我從戰略的角度來總結一下。回顧過去，我的意思是，我們在 2.5 年前就開始了這種轉變。斯科特，我想公平地說，去年，真正 RISE 起飛花了一些時間。我們有很好的軟件季度，比預期的要好一點。

Now this year, also because of the macroeconomics, we're actually a bit below plan. But what we see is now, on the cloud, we have a super-resilient business. I mean, once you're going into this project and you're moving the ERP to the cloud, you are transforming, you are not going away. The renewal rates are super-high. And also, the backlog now we build up with the platform, Nestlé just celebrated a big go-live. Now we are co-innovating on the platform, building new apps surrounding the core. So we see new businesses also for the customers we already closed.

現在今年，也是因為宏觀經濟，我們實際上有點低於計劃。但我們現在看到的是，在雲上，我們擁有超強彈性業務。我的意思是，一旦你進入這個項目並將 ERP 遷移到雲端，你就在轉型，你不會離開。續訂率超高。而且，現在我們通過該平台建立的積壓訂單，雀巢剛剛慶祝了一個大的上線。現在我們正在平台上共同創新，圍繞核心構建新的應用程序。因此，我們也看到了我們已經關閉的客戶的新業務。

If you would have asked me 2 years ago, will all line of businesses grow double digit? Not all were in the shape and form of today. Also that one, super resilient now, good growth, gaining market share, back in procurement, SuccessFactor, the core is developing really well.

如果您在 2 年前問我，所有業務線都會增長兩位數嗎？並非所有人都具有今天的形狀和形式。還有一個，現在超級有彈性，增長良好，獲得市場份額，重新採購，SuccessFactor，核心發展得非常好。

And now with the little bit weaker software license business, I mean, for 2023, that gives us a higher recurring revenue share. That gives us even more confidence that we're going to make the double-digit operating profit growth because we actually clearly on plan. If you take out Russia on the profit side, we have a more resilient, more recurring revenue base, and the cloud actually performs well ahead of plan, I would say.

現在，隨著軟件許可業務的疲軟，我的意思是，到 2023 年，這給了我們更高的經常性收入份額。這讓我們更有信心，我們將實現兩位數的營業利潤增長，因為我們實際上顯然在計劃中。如果從利潤方面剔除俄羅斯，我們將擁有更具彈性、更經常性的收入基礎，而且云實際上比計劃表現得更好，我想說。

Yes. And perhaps just a last comment. You see that resilience also in our support revenues, which are essentially flat now for a long period of time despite the pronounced software license declines. So also there, the stickiness is extremely high. And we have actually, again, had very, very nice multipliers in terms of support to cloud conversions, actually this quarter around the 3x mark, which is quite remarkable. And I don't see this going away or changing any time in the foreseeable future either.

是的。也許只是最後的評論。您在我們的支持收入中也看到了這種彈性，儘管軟件許可證明顯下降，但現在很長一段時間內基本持平。所以在那裡，粘性非常高。實際上，在對雲轉換的支持方面，我們實際上有非常非常好的乘數，實際上本季度大約是 3 倍，這非常了不起。在可預見的未來，我也認為這種情況不會消失或改變。

Next question is from Johannes Schaller from Deutsche Bank.

下一個問題來自德意志銀行的 Johannes Schaller。

And Christian, we're very clear on the strong pipeline on the cloud side. But then if we look at Qualtrics and also some other software peers, there's a bit of commentary that deal cycles are maybe lengthening and things, tougher to get decisions done, really. So I just wanted to check with you. I mean, is Qualtrics really the exception here in your portfolio? And are you pretty confident that deal cycles are not lengthening in the rest of the cloud portfolio from what you see right now?

克里斯蒂安，我們非常清楚雲方面的強大管道。但是，如果我們看看 Qualtrics 和其他一些軟件同行，就會有一些評論說交易週期可能正在延長，而且事情變得更難做出決定，真的。所以我只是想和你核實一下。我的意思是，Qualtrics 真的是您投資組合中的例外嗎？您是否非常確信其他雲產品組合的交易週期不會像您現在看到的那樣延長？

And then second question just for Luka. Given the cloud investments are not really going to expand further into the second half, how should we think about the cloud gross margin trajectory? I mean, can we stay around that 72% level into the second half? Or how should we think about that?

然後是 Luka 的第二個問題。鑑於雲投資實際上不會進一步擴大到下半年，我們應該如何看待雲毛利率軌跡？我的意思是，我們能否在下半年保持在 72% 的水平？或者我們應該怎麼想？

Yes. Let me start with the Qualtrics question and the overall sentiment. I mean, with Qualtrics, the last 2 years, we built more and more integrated X plus O packages, how we call it, where we can embed Qualtrics in the business processes of our core applications. And you have seen how they have accelerated their growth. They are still on a high growth.

是的。讓我從 Qualtrics 問題和整體情緒開始。我的意思是，通過 Qualtrics，過去 2 年，我們構建了越來越多的集成 X plus O 包，我們如何稱呼它，我們可以將 Qualtrics 嵌入到我們核心應用程序的業務流程中。你已經看到他們是如何加速成長的。他們仍然處於高速增長狀態。

And in the second half of the year, further packages will come, the integration on the product side. We will launch a few more scenarios around RISE for the IT, where you can track and trace how is the sentiment with regard to the transformation. We're going to build in Qualtrics into our procurement portfolio. So high-growth areas where we see a lot of opportunities to attach Qualtrics. So actually, I'm very confident.

而在下半年，還會有更多的套餐，產品端的整合。我們將圍繞 RISE for IT 推出更多場景，您可以在其中跟踪和跟踪與轉型有關的情緒。我們將把 Qualtrics 構建到我們的採購組合中。因此，我們看到有很多機會附加 Qualtrics 的高增長領域。所以實際上，我非常有信心。

The deal cycles. When I look at RISE and S/4HANA, and let's start with the flagship product. The conversations are now going more around, I have certain parts of my businesses where I see huge optimization potential. So can we go on procurement faster? What can we do on billing automation? I want to launch new OpEx-related license models. Christian, can we move into that angle? Okay, fair. We are very flexible commercial-wise in RISE, let's go into these areas first.

交易週期。當我查看 RISE 和 S/4HANA 時，讓我們從旗艦產品開始。現在對話越來越多，我在某些業務中看到了巨大的優化潛力。那麼我們可以更快地進行採購嗎？我們可以在計費自動化方面做些什麼？我想推出新的 OpEx 相關許可模型。克里斯蒂安，我們可以進入那個角度嗎？好吧，公平。我們在 RISE 的商業方面非常靈活，讓我們先進入這些領域。

A delay? Maybe a shift of priorities, yes. But not a delay. And again, it's very important we are not only doing here a shift to the cloud. We're only with a shift to the cloud, I would say maybe the business case would not look as stong in such a macroeconomic time. But with everything around, with the resilience which comes with our products, this is not a discussion yet to stop any kind of deal cycles or actually delaying projects. And so this is where I'm also gaining a lot of confidence just through talking by my -- to my peers.

延遲？也許是優先事項的轉變，是的。但不是延遲。再說一次，非常重要的是，我們不僅要向雲遷移。我們只是轉向雲，我想說，在這樣一個宏觀經濟時期，商業案例可能看起來不會那麼強大。但考慮到周圍的一切，以及我們產品帶來的彈性，這還不是關於停止任何類型的交易週期或實際上延遲項目的討論。因此，通過與我的同齡人交談，我也獲得了很大的信心。

Scott?

斯科特?

Yes. Look, just to give it a bit more color to what you described, Christian. The first is, we are not just moving workloads, we're enhancing capabilities. And when they choose SAP, they're choosing an enhanced capability. They need a business that can manage inventory levels different than what they did before. They go from just in time to just in case. They're moving -- the ability to be able to manage multiple suppliers in real time because of disruptions to their supply chain. That's an enhanced capability.

是的。聽著，只是為了給你所描述的內容增添一點色彩，克里斯蒂安。首先，我們不僅在移動工作負載，還在增強功能。當他們選擇 SAP 時，他們選擇的是增強功能。他們需要一家能夠管理與以前不同的庫存水平的企業。他們從及時到以防萬一。他們正在移動——由於供應鏈中斷，能夠實時管理多個供應商的能力。那是一種增強的能力。

So what we are seeing in the deal cycles at volume is a sharper prioritization about the transformation plan, which is exceptionally good because it means we're very clear what outcomes need to be delivered in the cloud by when. But it is not about a delay of deal cycles, it's more about sharper transformation plans, which, of course, RISE with SAP brings as a part of the service. So that would be an overall statement.

因此，我們在大量交易週期中看到的是關於轉型計劃的更清晰的優先級，這非常好，因為這意味著我們非常清楚何時需要在雲中交付什麼結果。但這與延遲交易週期無關，更多的是關於更清晰的轉型計劃，當然，RISE with SAP 將其作為服務的一部分。所以這將是一個全面的陳述。

And then obviously then, between all of the different categories which are all growing at that double-digit growth, each of them will have a sharper business priority because businesses need to be clear about the outcomes that they're getting. That gives us confidence because, even in good times, SAP is strong, but in difficult times, we're even stronger.

然後很明顯，在所有以兩位數增長的不同類別之間，它們中的每一個都將具有更清晰的業務優先級，因為企業需要清楚他們獲得的結果。這給了我們信心，因為即使在好的時候，SAP 也很強大，但在困難的時候，我們會更加強大。

Yes. And just to add on that and to answer the question on the cloud margin. So first of all, I'm very pleased with the progress that we have made in 2022 despite the headwinds from the increasing investments in the cloud delivery harmonization program. The 2.3% cloud margin increase was actually a bit more than I would have expected, so we are now ahead of plan.

是的。只是補充一下，並回答有關雲邊緣的問題。因此，首先，我對我們在 2022 年取得的進展感到非常高興，儘管對雲交付協調計劃的投資增加帶來了不利影響。 2.3% 的雲利潤率增長實際上比我預期的要多一些，所以我們現在提前計劃了。

And when I take a look at the second half year, the investments will further slightly increase in the second half year. But on the same side, I mean, the cloud revenue growth is also very strong. So while I have at the beginning of the year said that we will look at a flattish cloud margin development for 2022, I think it's now likely that we will end up with a slight increase in the cloud margin already in 2022.

而我看下半年，下半年的投資會進一步小幅增加。但另一方面，我的意思是，雲收入增長也非常強勁。因此，雖然我在年初說過，我們將看到 2022 年的雲利潤率發展持平，但我認為現在很可能我們最終會在 2022 年實現雲利潤率的小幅增長。

And then obviously, with the investments tapering off in the first half year, actually, our cloud exit margin end of 2023 should be significantly higher than the 72% that you are highlighting or that you have been asking about.

然後很明顯，隨著上半年的投資逐漸減少，實際上，我們在 2023 年底的雲退出利潤率應該明顯高於您強調的或您一直在詢問的 72%。

The more important topic is that our absolute cloud profit is actually getting more and more ahead of our original planning. Because of the success in our cloud momentum and the great success of S/4HANA in particular, I think that's the bigger story to watch out for and one that we are certainly ahead in terms of where we thought we would be from a midterm ambition perspective as well.

更重要的話題是，我們的絕對雲利潤實際上是越來越超前於我們最初的計劃。由於我們的雲動力取得了成功，特別是 S/4HANA 取得了巨大成功，我認為這是一個值得關注的更大的故事，而且從中期雄心的角度來看，我們肯定會處於領先地位也是。

Our next question from Mohammed Moawalla from Goldman Sachs.

我們來自高盛的 Mohammed Moawalla 的下一個問題。

Great. I have 2 questions, please. The first one, maybe for both Christian and Scott. As we look at SAP's sort of cloud portfolio, it's pretty broad and I would be curious to understand the more kind of defensive lower-ASP aspect of the mix of the portfolio versus perhaps more discretionary aspect. I know S/4HANA momentum is pretty strong right now. But if we were to move to a more cautious or even more severe macroeconomic scenario next year, how do you sort of assess the risks of the different sort of pieces of the discretionary versus the more defensive aspects of the portfolio going forward? And impacting kind of backlog growth and revenue growth in the cloud?

偉大的。我有2個問題，請。第一個，也許對克里斯蒂安和斯科特都適用。當我們查看 SAP 的雲產品組合時，它非常廣泛，我很想了解該產品組合中更具防禦性的低 ASP 方面與可能更具自由裁量權的方面。我知道 S/4HANA 現在的勢頭非常強勁。但是，如果明年我們要轉向更加謹慎甚至更加嚴峻的宏觀經濟情景，您如何評估不同類型的可自由支配的部分與未來投資組合中更具防禦性的方面的風險？並影響雲中的積壓增長和收入增長？

And then the second one was for Luka. You talked about kind of the heavy investment this year. But as we think about cost flex, in the past, SAP has shown the significant ability to flex costs to protect margin. So in the context of your sort of expected double-digit EBIT growth next year, how do you sort of see the scope to kind of flex the cost base to kind of hit that target, even in the absence of -- say, with growth slowing?

然後第二個是給盧卡的。你談到了今年的巨額投資。但是當我們考慮成本彈性時，過去，SAP 已經顯示出通過彈性成本來保護利潤的顯著能力。因此，在您預計明年息稅前利潤將實現兩位數增長的背景下，您如何看待調整成本基礎以達到該目標的範圍，即使在沒有增長的情況下也是如此減速？

So maybe I'll start, Christian, and then you add comments. So on the first question around the portfolio and what's discretionary, it's interesting. Businesses have different views about what's discretionary and what's not, but I'll try to give it at a macro level.

所以也許我會開始，克里斯蒂安，然後你添加評論。所以關於投資組合的第一個問題以及什麼是可自由支配的，這很有趣。企業對什麼是可自由支配的，什麼不是自由支配有不同的看法，但我會嘗試在宏觀層面上給出它。

First of all, this is one of the advantages of SAP and our breadth of our portfolio. We're one of the only organizations, I would argue the only company, that is able to provide solutions that are able to enhance the customers', whether it's solving employee challenges and retention of their workforce, whether it be solving their supply chain disruptions, whether it be about managing their green line, sustainability, managing their contingent labor. So our breadth really helps us because each business will be faced with specific challenges, but through the relationship, they can expand.

首先，這是 SAP 的優勢之一，也是我們廣泛的產品組合。我們是唯一的組織之一，我認為唯一的公司能夠提供能夠增強客戶的解決方案，無論是解決員工挑戰和留住員工，還是解決供應鏈中斷，無論是關於管理他們的綠線、可持續性、管理他們的臨時勞動力。因此，我們的廣度確實對我們有幫助，因為每個企業都將面臨特定的挑戰，但通過這種關係，它們可以擴展。

Having said that, what we are seeing is the macroeconomic situation. Christian speaks a lot about the ability to be able to manage your supply chain disruptions, your ability to be able to source and manage your supplier base in a very diverse and real-time environment, they are consistent and strong. And so the core part of the portfolio, we see really strong demand and pipeline going forward. And I don't expect that to change because, even in a difficult environment, those needs become more apparent than ever.

話雖如此，我們看到的是宏觀經濟形勢。 Christian 談了很多關於管理供應鏈中斷的能力，以及在非常多樣化和實時的環境中尋找和管理供應商群的能力，它們是一致且強大的。因此，作為投資組合的核心部分，我們看到了非常強勁的需求和未來的管道。而且我預計這種情況不會改變，因為即使在困難的環境中，這些需求也比以往任何時候都更加明顯。

But then within the other parts of the portfolio, for example, some businesses are much more focused on the core HR operations which SuccessFactors provides. But they might not look at discrete solutions that they would consider to be discretionary. So they focus a lot more on the core capabilities if they're -- if they've got decisions to be made about finite operational, OpEx spend.

但在投資組合的其他部分，例如，一些企業更關注 SuccessFactors 提供的核心人力資源運營。但他們可能不會考慮他們認為是可自由裁量的離散解決方案。因此，如果他們需要做出關於有限運營和運營支出的決定，他們就會更加關注核心能力。

What I would say is clear. In past macroeconomic difficult environments or uncertainty, there was always pressure on IT spend. I do not expect that to be the same as in go forward. Technology spend continues to be a priority for companies as they need to be able to resist and manage the disruption and take advantage of opportunity. And that's why our pipeline continues to look strong across the portfolio and gives us confidence in the outlook.

我要說的很清楚。在過去的宏觀經濟困難環境或不確定性中，IT 支出始終存在壓力。我不希望這與前進中的情況相同。技術支出仍然是公司的優先事項，因為他們需要能夠抵抗和管理中斷並利用機會。這就是為什麼我們的管道在整個投資組合中繼續看起來很強勁，並讓我們對前景充滿信心。

Christian.

基督教。

And I mean, when you look into a business case justifying to do RISE with SAP, obviously, there's always a point on how can we outsource certain parts of IT? How can we outsource the one side of the house? Cybersecurity is a big topic. Let's not forget that, there are increasing concerns, which also makes the move to the cloud more needed.

我的意思是，當你研究一個證明與 SAP 一起做 RISE 的商業案例時，很明顯，我們如何外包 IT 的某些部分總是有道理的？我們如何將房子的一側外包出去？網絡安全是一個大話題。我們不要忘記，人們越來越擔心，這也使得遷移到雲變得更加必要。

But then second, as Scott just said, I mean, I give you a realtime example. Yesterday, with Samsung and other players in the semiconductor industry, we are now moving them with RISE with SAP, not only to the cloud, but we're actually building a very resilient supply chain. We are moving them to the network, where they find millions of suppliers and buyers also for their industry, and then we are building a resilient supply chain. And these are the scenarios which, especially in these times, are so crucial.

但其次，正如斯科特剛才所說，我的意思是，我給你一個實時的例子。昨天，與三星和半導體行業的其他參與者一起，我們現在正在通過 RISE with SAP 將它們遷移到雲端，而且我們實際上正在構建一個非常有彈性的供應鏈。我們正在將他們轉移到網絡，在那裡他們可以為他們的行業找到數以百萬計的供應商和買家，然後我們正在建立一個有彈性的供應鏈。這些場景，尤其是在這個時代，非常重要。

So it's about the move to the cloud, but even more important, it's about resiliency, it's about automation to offset some of the margin pressure and supply chain challenges our customers are facing.

所以這是關於向雲的遷移，但更重要的是，它是關於彈性，它是關於自動化來抵消我們客戶面臨的一些利潤壓力和供應鏈挑戰。

Yes. Just finally on the cost flex scope that you have discussed. I mean, as we have proven on past occasions that you rightfully point out, if we really had a severe downturn situation to manage, we have certainly scope for easily finding a mid- to high triple-digit million euro in savings across different expense line items, in terms of reduced headcount growth and third-party expenses and other discretionary expense items on top of what we anyway will see with the dissolution of the cloud delivery harmonization program. So we have of course significant scope to manage the bottom line in line with our commitment.

是的。最後是您討論過的成本彈性範圍。我的意思是，正如我們在過去的場合中證明的那樣，您正確地指出，如果我們真的要應對嚴重的經濟低迷形勢，我們當然可以輕鬆地在不同的支出項目中節省中高三位數的百萬歐元項目，包括減少的員工人數增長和第三方費用以及其他可自由支配的費用項目，我們無論如何都會看到雲交付協調計劃的解散。因此，我們當然有很大的空間來根據我們的承諾管理底線。

The next question from Michael Briest from UBS.

來自瑞銀的邁克爾布里斯特的下一個問題。

Yes. Christian, could you just say what you're waiting to see in the marketplace or your own sort of trends in order to revisit the midterm guidance?

是的。克里斯蒂安，您能否說出您在市場上等待看到的內容或您自己的趨勢，以便重新審視中期指導？

And then obviously, you're suggesting the cloud transition is faster. So you're substituting the 87% gross margin on-premise business with probably sort of 72% cloud business. I know Luka, at Sapphire, you were adamant that the EUR 11.5 billion EBIT in 2025 was well underpinned even if the mix changed. I'm wondering if you're happy to reendorse that today.

然後很明顯，您是在建議雲過渡更快。因此，您正在用可能 72% 的雲業務代替 87% 的毛利率本地業務。我知道 Luka，在 Sapphire，您堅信 2025 年 115 億歐元的息稅前利潤得到了很好的支撐，即使組合發生了變化。我想知道你是否樂意今天重新認可。

Yes. So Michael, what do we actually need to uplift our guidance? First of all, I would value if you guys could value again a bit more the growth in the cloud. And I mean, when I compare this to a year ago, it was all about the growth. Of course, we realize the market sentiment has shifted.

是的。所以邁克爾，我們實際上需要什麼來提升我們的指導？首先，如果你們能夠再次更重視雲計算的增長，我會很重視。我的意思是，當我將其與一年前進行比較時，一切都與增長有關。當然，我們意識到市場情緒已經發生了變化。

And look, we always said it's a 3-year transformation. And mathematically, it was always the case that the first 2 years are a bit more difficult on the operating profit side. But just yesterday, I did the math. If you now take out Russia for a second, we're even ahead of plan on operating profit. So we are well on plan on hitting our midterm ambitions.

看，我們總是說這是一個 3 年的轉變。從數學上講，前兩年在營業利潤方面總是有點困難。但就在昨天，我做了數學。如果您現在將俄羅斯排除在外，那麼我們的營業利潤甚至超出了計劃。因此，我們正在計劃實現我們的中期目標。

Now what do we need to have in order to give a new guidance? I would say, look, let us deliver a great half year 2. Let us show that the cloud is very resilient. And if the macroeconomic environment stays like it is, let's assume that, then you're going to see us beginning of next year updating the guidance. And I want to emphasize that you will not only see an update in the guidance on the top line. There is of course also then, an update to be expected on the bottom line.

現在我們需要什麼來提供新的指導？我想說，看，讓我們在第二年完成一個偉大的半年。讓我們證明雲是非常有彈性的。如果宏觀經濟環境保持不變，讓我們假設，那麼您將在明年年初看到我們更新指導。我想強調的是，您不僅會在最重要的指南中看到更新。當然，最後也會有更新。

Yes. And this will be a positive update all along because, as I said, it's not only the growth on the cloud side that is great from a momentum perspective, of course, it's also going to -- at the current FX levels materially supported by the currency. But this drives also much higher absolute cloud profit. And at the higher growth rates in the cloud, actually, that can overcompensate the margin differential in terms of what it contributes from an absolute profit perspective. And therefore, we expect our momentum to also flow through to the bottom line.

是的。這將一直是一個積極的更新，因為正如我所說，從動量的角度來看，不僅雲方面的增長非常好，當然，在當前的外匯水平上，它也將受到貨幣。但這也推動了更高的絕對雲利潤。實際上，在雲計算的較高增長率下，從絕對利潤的角度來看，這可能會過度補償利潤率差異。因此，我們預計我們的動力也將流向底線。

As we said, let's watch how the performance goes, what the macro does, if it stays at the same level. And also of course continue to prove out our performance from a backlog perspective. But then we have all ingredients in place for an update that will please investors of all tastes, I would say.

正如我們所說，讓我們看看性能如何，宏做了什麼，如果它保持在同一水平。當然，還要繼續從積壓的角度證明我們的表現。但是，我會說，我們已經準備好更新的所有要素，這將取悅各種口味的投資者。

And can I just ask? Previously, you had a 2023 target, and that was replaced in 2020 with '25 ambition. We're now in -- going to be in '23 in 6 months' time. Would you update '25? Or would you introduce a new midterm target beyond that?

我可以問一下嗎？以前，你有一個 2023 年的目標，但在 2020 年被 25 年的雄心取代。我們現在處於 - 將在 6 個月後進入 23 年。你會更新'25嗎？或者你會在此之外引入一個新的中期目標嗎？

No, we would look at updating 2025. And of course, we will give a guidance for 2023 that you can then compare to the -- to the old 2023 guidance. I would say that, probably on the cloud side, will look quite pleasant.

不，我們會考慮更新 2025 年。當然，我們將提供 2023 年的指導，然後您可以將其與舊的 2023 年指導進行比較。我會說，可能在雲端，看起來會很愉快。

Now we will take one final question, please. Thank you.

現在我們要回答最後一個問題。謝謝你。

Our final question comes from Mark Moerdler from Bernstein Research.

我們的最後一個問題來自 Bernstein Research 的 Mark Moerdler。

I appreciate the additional detail you've given on the call so far. I have 2 hopefully not-too-complex questions. The first is you've said that roughly 50% of S/4HANA SaaS was new customers, and you're winning in smaller customers. Can you give us any color on what percentage of the S/4HANA cloud revenues from new customers versus how much of the customer base is?

到目前為止，我感謝您在電話中提供的其他詳細信息。我有 2 個希望不太複雜的問題。首先是您說過大約 50% 的 S/4HANA SaaS 是新客戶，而您正在贏得較小的客戶。您能否告訴我們新客戶佔 S/4HANA 雲收入的百分比與客戶群的百分比？

And the second question is on return of cash. You've added EUR 500 million to available to buy back stocks. How should we think about the share count going forward, especially with the valuation of the stock being down where it is?

第二個問題是關於現金返還的問題。您增加了 5 億歐元用於回購股票。我們應該如何看待未來的股票數量，尤其是在股票估值下降的情況下？

I can start on the net new, and then Scott, you can build on that. So first, our net new customer share for S/4HANA cloud is 60%, so 6-0. And what kind of customers are those? Oftentimes, I mentioned it in my comments at the beginning, Doctolib is a unicorn in France, very successful, high growth, needs scalability, also wants to go expand the business now into other segments. This is where we are winning net new.

我可以從新的網絡開始，然後是 Scott，您可以在此基礎上再接再厲。首先，我們的 S/4HANA 雲淨新客戶份額為 60%，因此 6-0。這些客戶是什麼類型的？很多時候，我在開頭的評論中提到，Doctolib 是法國的獨角獸，非常成功，高增長，需要可擴展性，現在也想將業務擴展到其他領域。這就是我們贏得全新的地方。

We're also winning net new in larger customers, but of course much less as ERP is very sticky than, of course, in the midsize or the unicorn community. But again, you see it from the share of net new customers. I guess that also shows you what kind of value the product has to offer if you have such a high share of net new customers.

我們也在大客戶中贏得了全新的客戶，但當然，因為 ERP 的粘性比在中型或獨角獸社區中的粘性要小得多。但同樣，您可以從淨新客戶的份額中看到這一點。我想這也向您展示瞭如果您擁有如此高的淨新客戶份額，該產品必須提供什麼樣的價值。

Yes. Maybe I'll add 2 comments, Christian, if I can. The first, when we launched RISE, we obviously had a high proportion of net new, but also midsized customers when we first launched. As we scaled out the service, what we've seen increasingly is not only have we improved or increased the total customers moving to RISE, over 2,000 customers now moving to RISE, 400 in Q2, but also the proportion of larger customers which are in that mix of the revenue, of the order entry that you will see on larger customers, continues to lift.

是的。也許我會添加 2 條評論，克里斯蒂安，如果可以的話。首先，當我們推出 RISE 時，我們顯然在剛推出時擁有高比例的淨新客戶，但也有中型客戶。隨著我們擴大服務規模，我們越來越多地看到，我們不僅改善或增加了轉移到 RISE 的客戶總數，現在有超過 2,000 名客戶轉移到 RISE，第二季度有 400 名，而且更大的客戶比例也在增加。您將在大客戶身上看到的訂單條目的收入組合繼續提升。

That gives us obviously optimism in terms of our outlook, but also the revenue mix has an increasing proportion large of customers. That's not at the expense of the midsize. The midsized customers continue to expand. Our net new customers tend to be midsize or the unicorns that Christian mentions. But the big companies are now moving at scale to move across as well, which means the revenue mix of large companies is higher.

就我們的前景而言，這顯然使我們感到樂觀，而且收入組合中的客戶比例也越來越高。這不以犧牲中型為代價。中型客戶不斷擴大。我們的淨新客戶往往是中型企業或 Christian 提到的獨角獸企業。但現在大公司也在大規模跨界，這意味著大公司的收入組合更高。

Yes. And just to come back on the share buyback and the share count question. I think it's important to understand, we are buying back the shares, just as we did for the first share buyback that we did in the first half year, primarily in order to satisfy the equity-based compensation plans of our employees and counter any dilution for our shareholders. So essentially, we are not canceling those shares. And therefore, the -- you can expect that the aggregate share count will remain unaffected. But we make sure that we don't create additional dilution.

是的。只是回到股票回購和股票數量問題。我認為重要的是要理解，我們正在回購股票，就像我們在上半年進行的第一次股票回購一樣，主要是為了滿足員工基於股權的薪酬計劃並應對任何稀釋為我們的股東。所以本質上，我們不會取消這些股票。因此，您可以預期總份額數將不受影響。但我們確保不會造成額外的稀釋。

Why have we decided to buy back an additional EUR 500 million in shares? Very evidently, we are committed to continuously refilling our equity pool for the share-based compensation plans. And it is -- it makes sense to do a bit more on that in 2022, given where the share price currently is, and that we strongly believe that it does not underpin the true value of the company and its strategy. So that's why we decided to accelerate the volumes for 2022.

為什麼我們決定再回購 5 億歐元的股票？很明顯，我們致力於不斷為股權激勵計劃補充我們的股權池。考慮到目前的股價，而且我們堅信它並不能支撐公司的真正價值及其戰略，在 2022 年做更多的事情是有意義的。這就是為什麼我們決定加快 2022 年的交易量。

Outside of that, our capital allocation priorities remain unchanged. We of course will continue to invest as is reasonable and necessary in our organic business. We will continue to deleverage where it makes sense. And obviously, in the current interest rate environment, we will continue to be committed to that. Then we will pay an attractive dividend also in the future. If we have M&A opportunities, then we can pursue them, when there are tuck-ins also, out of the existing cash flow.

除此之外，我們的資本配置重點保持不變。當然，我們將繼續對我們的有機業務進行合理和必要的投資。我們將繼續在有意義的地方去槓桿化。顯然，在當前的利率環境下，我們將繼續致力於這一點。然後我們將在未來支付有吸引力的股息。如果我們有併購機會，那麼我們可以從現有的現金流中尋求它們，當也有額外收入的時候。

And on top of everything else, if we then have no other uses, of course, we might continue to accelerate some share buybacks to fuel the treasury stock for our equity programs for employees at attractive prices. This is not something I would rule out. But again, it will not result in a long-term reduction of our share count, as it's really meant to offset dilution.

最重要的是，如果我們沒有其他用途，當然，我們可能會繼續加速一些股票回購，以有吸引力的價格為我們的員工股權計劃提供庫存股票。這不是我會排除的。但同樣，它不會導致我們的股票數量長期減少，因為它實際上是為了抵消稀釋。

Thank you. And this concludes our call for today. Thank you.

謝謝你。我們今天的呼籲到此結束。謝謝你。

Thank you, everyone, for joining. Thank you.

謝謝大家的加入。謝謝你。

Thank you.

謝謝你。

Thank you. That concludes today's conference.

謝謝你。今天的會議到此結束。