阿里巴巴 (BABA) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Group's June Quarter 2024 Results Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in listen only mode. (Operator Instructions) I would now like to turn the call over to Rob Lin, Head of Investor Relations of Alibaba Group. Please go ahead.

集團 2024 年 6 月季度業績電話會議。此時，所有參與者都處於僅聽模式。 （接線員指示）我現在想將電話轉接給阿里巴巴集團投資者關係主管林羅布。請繼續。

Good day, everyone, and welcome to Alibaba Group's June Quarter '24 Results Conference Call. With us are Joe Tsai, Chairman; Edi Wu, Chief Executive Officer; Toby Xu, Chief Financial Officer. We have also invited John Fan, Co-Chairman, and CEO of Alibaba International Digital Commerce Group to join the call. This call is also being webcasted from the Investor Relations section of our corporate website. A replay of the call will be available on our website later today.

大家好，歡迎參加阿里巴巴集團 24 年 6 月季度業績電話會議。與我們在一起的還有董事長蔡崇信；吳艾迪，執行長；徐托比，財務長。我們也邀請了阿里巴巴國際數位商務集團聯席董事長兼執行長範約翰參加電話會議。我們公司網站的投資者關係部分也對此次電話會議進行了網路直播。今天晚些時候，我們的網站上將提供電話會議的重播。

Now let me quickly cover the safe harbor. Today's discussion may contain forward-looking statements, including without limitation statements about our strategies and business plans as well as our belief, expectation, and guidance about our business prospects such as the future growth of our business, revenue take rate, profitability and return on investments and share repurchases.

現在讓我快速覆蓋安全港。今天的討論可能包含前瞻性陳述，包括但不限於有關我們的策略和業務計劃的陳述，以及我們對業務前景的信念、期望和指導，例如我們業務的未來增長、收入利用率、盈利能力和回報率。

Forward-looking statements involve inherent risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ materially from our expected expectations. For detailed discussion of these risks and uncertainties, please refer to our latest annual report on Form 20-F and other documents filed with US SEC or announced on the website of Hong Kong Stock Exchange.

前瞻性陳述涉及固有風險和不確定性，可能導致實際結果與我們的預期有重大差異。有關這些風險和不確定性的詳細討論，請參閱我們最新的 20-F 表格年度報告以及向美國 SEC 提交或在香港聯交所網站公佈的其他文件。

Any forward-looking statements that we make on this call are based on assumptions as of today, and we do not undertake any obligation to these statements, except as required under applicable law. Please note that certain financial measures that we use on the call, such as adjusted EBITDA, adjusted EBITDA margin, adjusted EBITA, adjusted EBITA margin, non-GAAP net income, non-GAAP diluted earnings per share or ADS and free cash flow are expressed on a non-GAAP basis.

我們在本次電話會議中所做的任何前瞻性陳述均基於截至目前的假設，除非適用法律要求，否則我們對這些陳述不承擔任何義務。請注意，我們在電話會議中使用的某些財務指標，例如調整後的EBITDA、調整後的EBITDA 利潤率、調整後的EBITA、調整後的EBITA 利潤率、非GAAP 淨利潤、非GAAP 稀釋每股收益或美國存託股以及自由現金流以非公認會計準則為基礎。

Our GAAP results and reconciliation of GAAP to non-GAAP measures can be found in our earnings press release. Unless otherwise stated, growth rate of all stated metrics mentioned during this call refers to year-over-year growth versus the same quarter last year.

我們的 GAAP 結果以及 GAAP 與非 GAAP 指標的調整可以在我們的收益新聞稿中找到。除非另有說明，本次電話會議中提到的所有規定指標的成長率均指與去年同期相比的年成長率。

With that, I will turn over to Eddie.

這樣，我就把任務交給艾迪了。

Hello, everyone. In the new fiscal year, our strategies of user first and AI-driven are starting to bear fruit. This quarter's results reflect continued steady growth momentum. Taobao and Tmall Group achieved steady year-over-year growth in orders and in GMV. Alibaba International Digital Commerce, AIDC, revenue maintained strong growth.

大家好。在新的財年，我們的用戶至上和人工智慧驅動的策略開始取得成果。本季的業績體現了持續穩定的成長動能。淘寶和天貓集團訂單量和GMV年穩定成長。阿里巴巴國際數位商務（AIDC）營收維持強勁成長。

Alibaba Cloud revenue, excluding Alibaba consolidated subsidiaries, returned to positive growth, notably driven by core public cloud and AI products. And across other segments, we achieved better operational efficiency and monetization capabilities to varying degrees. This drove significant improvement in some loss-making businesses.

阿里雲營收（不包括阿里巴巴合併子公司）恢復正成長，主要受到核心公有雲和人工智慧產品的推動。在其他細分市場中，我們不同程度地實現了更好的營運效率和變現能力。這推動了一些虧損業務的顯著改善。

Taobao and Tmall Group maintained its user first strategy and continue to invest in key capabilities aimed to deliver quality products and services at attractive prices across diverse shopping needs of consumers. This quarter saw steady growth in GMV and order volume driven by a notable increase in purchase frequency.

淘寶和天貓集團維持用戶至上的策略，並持續投資關鍵能力，旨在滿足消費者多樣化的購物需求，以有吸引力的價格提供優質的產品和服務。本季度，由於購買頻率顯著增加，GMV 和訂單量穩定成長。

Internal and external data about e-commerce players' market share dynamics indicates a positive trend in our gradual market share stabilization, further validating the effectiveness of our investments into experience.

電商市場份額動態的內部和外部數據顯示我們的市場份額逐步穩定的正面趨勢，進一步驗證了我們經驗投資的有效性。

88 VIP members reached CAD42 million by quarter end. We will continue to explore and improve program benefits, product offerings and service experiences for this expanding premium member base. In TTG's operational strategy, we attach great importance to rich and diverse product offerings while focusing on investing and enhancing shopping experiences.

截至季末，88 位 VIP 會員的收入達到 4,200 萬加元。我們將繼續為這個不斷擴大的高級會員群體探索和改進計劃優勢、產品供應和服務體驗。在TTG的營運策略中，我們非常重視豐富多元的產品供應，同時專注於投資並提升購物體驗。

We continuously improve the efficiency in matching our products with user traffic and interest stable and sustainable growth. As orders and GMV continue to grow, we're advancing monetization step-by-step , including the launch of our new marketing tool, Quanzhantui.

我們不斷提高產品與用戶流量和興趣穩定持續成長的匹配效率。隨著訂單和 GMV 的持續成長，我們正在逐步推動貨幣化，包括推出新的行銷工具「全站推」。

Through algorithm upgrades, we aim to enhance the efficiency of merchants monetization while also improving the efficiency of traffic utilization and conversion of user traffic to purchases on our platform. We expect CMR growth to gradually align with GMV growth over the coming quarters.

透過演算法升級，我們旨在提升商家變現效率的同時，提高平台的流量利用效率和用戶流量轉換為購買的效率。我們預計未來幾季 CMR 的成長將逐漸與 GMV 的成長保持一致。

In our Cloud segment, we continue to pursue high-quality revenue and effectively execute our integrated cloud plus AI development strategy. This quarter, Alibaba's overall revenue, excluding Alibaba consolidated subsidiaries, grew 6%, with public cloud revenue maintaining double-digit growth.

在雲端領域，我們持續追求高品質收入，有效執行雲端+AI一體化發展策略。本季度，阿里巴巴整體營收（不包括阿里巴巴合併子公司）成長了6%，其中公有雲營收維持兩位數成長。

AI-related product revenues sustained a triple digit growth continuing to increase its share of public cloud revenue. We're seeing more major customers choosing Alibaba Cloud as their computer infrastructure for AI development. At the same time, Alibaba's proprietary large language models are gaining wider adoption.

人工智慧相關產品收入維持三位數成長，在公有雲收入中的份額持續增加。我們看到越來越多的主要客戶選擇阿里雲作為人工智慧開發的電腦基礎設施。與此同時，阿里巴巴專有的大語言模型正在獲得更廣泛的採用。

This year, Alibaba Cloud served as a major cloud service provider for the Olympic Games, providing cloud computing and AI services to Olympic broadcasting services, OBS. At the Paris Olympics, cloud-based live broadcast powered by Alibaba Cloud over satellite signals as the primary means of broadcast for the first time in Olympic history. 2/3 of broadcasters used live signals transmitted by Alibaba Cloud and real-time around the world, reaching billions of viewers.

今年，阿里雲作為奧運主要雲端服務供應商，為奧運轉播服務OBS提供雲端運算和人工智慧服務。巴黎奧運會上，阿里雲雲直播透過衛星訊號作為主要轉播方式，在奧運史上尚屬首次。 2/3的廣播公司使用阿里雲在全球即時傳輸的直播訊號，覆蓋數十億觀眾。

Additionally, Alibaba Cloud's AI technology saw its first widespread application at the Paris Olympics, including 360-degree replays in real time, bringing pleasant surprises to the audience. Our long-term strategy for integrated cloud plus AI development comprises 3 key elements.

此外，阿里雲AI技術在巴黎奧運首次廣泛應用，包括360度即時回放，帶給觀眾驚喜。我們的雲端+人工智慧綜合開發長期策略包括三個關鍵要素。

One, we'll continue to optimize our cloud product offerings focusing on competitive sustainable growth margin and scalable public cloud products. This forms the foundation for Alibaba Cloud sustainable high-quality growth.

第一，我們將繼續優化我們的雲端產品，並專注於具有競爭力的可持續成長利潤和可擴展的公有雲產品。這為阿里雲持續高品質發展奠定了基礎。

Two, we'll strengthen synergies between cloud and AI products, not only supporting existing customers and implementing new AI capabilities on Alibaba Cloud, but also enabling AI native enterprises to scale and succeed on our platform. We're committed to capitalizing on both opportunities.

第二，我們將加強雲端和人工智慧產品之間的協同作用，不僅支援現有客戶並在阿里雲上實現新的人工智慧能力，而且使人工智慧原生企業能夠在我們的平台上擴展並取得成功。我們致力於利用這兩個機會。

Three, we'll continue to invest in R&D and AI CapEx to ensure the growth of our AI-driven cloud business. Looking to the medium and long term, we are confident that Alibaba's overall revenue, excluding Alibaba consolidated subsidiaries, will return to double-digit growth in the second half of the fiscal year with gradual acceleration thereafter. Through intensive R&D investment, we aim to sustain profitable growth while establishing ourselves as a leading cloud service provider for AI with healthy probability and market share leadership.

第三，我們將繼續投資研發和人工智慧資本支出，以確保人工智慧驅動的雲端業務的成長。從中長期來看，我們有信心阿里巴巴的整體營收（不包括阿里巴巴合併子公司）將在本財年下半年恢復兩位數成長，並在此後逐步加速。透過密集的研發投資，我們的目標是維持獲利成長，同時將自己打造成領先的人工智慧雲端服務供應商，擁有良好的機率和市場份額領先地位。

In international e-commerce, AIDC delivered 32% revenue growth this quarter. Our International business segment comprises a diverse business matrix, integrating both cross-border and local offerings as well as B2B and B2C formats. This presents numerous opportunities in terms of both operational models and market expansion potential, and Jiang Fan will provide a more detailed update momentarily.

在國際電子商務領域，AIDC 本季營收成長 32%。我們的國際業務部門包括多元化的業務矩陣，整合跨境和本地產品以及 B2B 和 B2C 業態。這在營運模式和市場拓展潛力方面都帶來了巨大的機遇，蔣凡將立即提供更詳細的更新。

Beyond e-commerce and cloud, we've implemented strategic realignments across our key Internet technology businesses through a thorough evaluation of their product capabilities and market competitiveness while maintaining product competitiveness.

除了電商和雲端之外，我們在保持產品競爭力的同時，透過對產品能力和市場競爭力的全面評估，對網路關鍵技術業務進行了策略調整。

Most of these businesses will now place a higher priority on monetization. This quarter, we've already seen these businesses significantly improve in profitability, and we expect this trend to continue in the coming quarters.

大多數這些企業現在將更加重視貨幣化。本季度，我們已經看到這些業務的獲利能力顯著提高，我們預計這一趨勢將在未來幾季繼續下去。

We expect most of these businesses to break even within 1 to 2 years and gradually contribute to profitability at scale. This new fiscal year is a pivotal one for Alibaba as we set our strategic direction and realized the successes of our transformation. We are fully confident in Alibaba's sustained healthy development into the future.

我們預計這些業務大部分將在 1 至 2 年內實現損益平衡，並逐步實現規模化盈利。新的財年對阿里巴巴來說是關鍵的一年，我們確定了策略方向，並實現了轉型的成功。我們對阿里巴巴未來的持續健康發展充滿信心。

Hi, everybody. It's my pleasure to share with you AIDC's latest business progress. Over the past quarter, AIDC maintained its rapid growth momentum with overall revenue increasing 32% year-on-year, primarily driven by our cross-border business. In terms of the three drivers we consistently focus on.

大家好。很高興與大家分享AIDC的最新業務進展。過去一個季度，AIDC保持了快速成長勢頭，整體營收年增32%，這主要得益於我們的跨國業務。就我們一貫關注的三個驅動因素而言。

First, ongoing business model and supply chain upgrades, Ali Express maintained rapid year-on-year order growth with the percentage of AE choice orders continuing to be high and gradually stabilizing and enhancing the certainty and consistency of user experience.

一是業務模式和供應鏈持續升級，速賣通訂單年比保持快速成長，AE精選訂單佔比持續較高，逐步穩定和增強用戶體驗的確定性和一致性。

Ali Express and China continue to jointly optimize logistics experience and significantly reduced average delivery time quarter-over-quarter. We further optimized the organic balance of user experience, product richness and efficiency across our marketplace, semi-consignment, and full consignment models. The unit economics of the Choice business improved by nearly 20% quarter-over-quarter.

速賣通與中國持續共同優化物流體驗，平均配送時間較上季大幅縮短。我們進一步優化了市場、半寄售和全寄售模式中使用者體驗、產品豐富度和效率的有機平衡。 Choice 業務的單位經濟效益較上季提高了近 20%。

Second, product and technology innovation. We advanced our AI and intelligent technologies across scenarios like AI customer service, cross-platform product placement, product description optimization, multilingual search, and price recommendations, which boosted efficiency and user experience. These innovations were deployed across our platforms and have served around 500,000 merchants and covered 100 million SKUs.

二是產品和技術創新。我們在人工智慧客服、跨平台置入性廣告、產品描述優化、多語言搜尋、價格推薦等場景中推廣人工智慧和智慧技術，提升了效率和使用者體驗。這些創新已部署在我們的平台上，已服務約 50 萬家商戶，覆蓋 1 億個 SKU。

Third, sustained growth in key markets. Ongoing improvement in user experience bolsters AE's confidence to step up investments in key markets to expand user base and maintain leadership as the exclusive e-commerce partner of the European Cup 2024, we effectively boosted AE and Trendyol's brand awareness. We're also exploring diverse localized business models.

三是重點市場持續成長。使用者體驗的持續改善增強了AE的信心，增加對關鍵市場的投資，擴大用戶基礎，維持作為2024年歐洲盃獨家電商合作夥伴的領先地位，有效提升了AE和Trendyol的品牌知名度。我們也正在探索多樣化的在地化商業模式。

In Turkey, Trendyol increased monetization and profitability, solidifying its e-commerce leadership and also enriched product offerings and marketing efficiency in the Gulf region while continuing in user growth. In Southeast Asia, Lazada achieved single months EBITDA profitability for the first time in July. This milestone reinforces our confidence to efficiently invest in the Southeast Asia market to consolidate our market share.

在土耳其，Trendyol 提高了貨幣化和獲利能力，鞏固了其電子商務領導地位，並豐富了海灣地區的產品種類和行銷效率，同時繼續實現用戶成長。在東南亞，Lazada 7 月首次實現單月 EBITDA 獲利。這項里程碑增強了我們高效投資東南亞市場、鞏固市場佔有率的信心。

So, in conclusion, our strategic focus is twofold, enhancing operational efficiency across all business segments, while on the other hand, actively investing in key markets to drive quality growth and scale with the goal of achieving more substantial profitability at scale in the future. Thank you.

因此，總而言之，我們的策略重點是雙重的，一方面提高各業務板塊的營運效率，另一方面積極投資關鍵市場，推動高品質成長和規模化，目標是在未來實現更可觀的規模獲利。謝謝。

This past quarter's financial performance continues to demonstrate our strategy to revitalize growth in our domestic commerce segments while reinforcing our leadership position. At the same time, we are improving the monetization and/or efficiency of our loss-making businesses with the goal of achieving sustainable business growth and profitability.

上個季度的財務表現繼續證明了我們重振國內商業領域成長的策略，同時鞏固了我們的領導地位。同時，我們正在提高虧損業務的貨幣化和/或效率，以實現可持續的業務成長和獲利能力。

Taobao and Tmall Group is winning the mind share of our consumers. This past quarter, we achieved high single-digit online GMV growth and double-digit order growth. AIDC continues to achieve robust revenue growth driven by rapid order growth in cross-border businesses, especially from Ali Express Choice.

淘寶和天貓集團正在贏得消費者的心智份額。上個季度，我們實現了高個位數的線上 GMV 成長和兩位數的訂單成長。在跨國業務訂單快速成長（尤其是速賣通精選）的推動下，AIDC 持續實現強勁的營收成長。

Ali Cloud's revenue quality is improving back to growth. Overall revenue, excluding Alibaba consolidated subsidiaries, grew over 6%, driven by double-digit public growth and increasing adoption of AI-related products.

阿里雲營收品質正在改善，恢復成長。在兩位數的公共成長和人工智慧相關產品的日益普及的推動下，不包括阿里巴巴合併子公司的整體收入成長了 6% 以上。

Our loss-making businesses are improving their monetization, operating efficiency significantly. For example, local service group and Lazada significantly narrowed their losses during the quarter. During this quarter, we repurchased a total of 630 million ordinary shares or 77 million ADS for a total of $5.8 billion. This includes the concurrent buyback of approximately 14.8 million ADS for $1.2 billion that was associated with our new CV issuance.

我們的虧損業務正在顯著提高其貨幣化和營運效率。例如，本地服務集團和Lazada在本季大幅收窄虧損。本季度，我們總共回購了 6.3 億股普通股或 7,700 萬股美國存託股，總價值為 58 億美元。這包括與我們新的 CV 發行相關的、以 12 億美元的價格同時回購約 1,480 萬股美國存託股。

As of June 30, 2024, we had 19 billion ordinary shares or approximately 2.4 billion ADSs outstanding. Compared to March 31, 2024, there was a 2.3% net reduction in our outstanding shares after accounting for shares issued in our ESOP. As of June 30, 2024, we still have $26.1 billion remaining in our share repurchase program.

截至 2024 年 6 月 30 日，我們擁有 190 億股普通股或約 24 億股已發行美國存託股。與 2024 年 3 月 31 日相比，考慮到員工持股計畫中發行的股票後，我們的流通股淨減少了 2.3%。截至 2024 年 6 月 30 日，我們的股票回購計畫仍有 261 億美元剩餘。

Additionally, as part of our plan to minimize annual of dilution and better utilize the cash generated by our domestic businesses, we have started to replace a portion of Ali Baba Group's ESOP incentives with long-term cash incentives for our employees starting last quarter.

此外，作為我們最大程度地減少年度稀釋並更好地利用國內業務產生的現金計劃的一部分，我們已開始從上季度開始用對員工的長期現金激勵來取代阿里巴巴集團的部分員工持股計劃激勵。

These cash incentives will be reflected as costs in our adjusted financial metrics, including segment EBITDA. While this change in compensation structure will lower adjusted EBITDA, it will also result in less ESOP dilution in the future.

這些現金激勵措施將作為成本反映在我們調整後的財務指標中，包括部門 EBITDA。雖然薪酬結構的這種變化將降低調整後的 EBITDA，但也將導致未來員工持股計畫的稀釋程度減少。

Total revenue. On a consolidated basis, total revenue was RMB243.2 billion, an increase of 4%. Adjusted EBITDA decreased 1% year-over-year to RMB45 billion. Excluding the effects of long-term cash incentives, adjusted EBITDA growth would have turned positive on a like-for-like basis.

總收入。合併總收入人民幣2,432億元，成長4%。調整後EBITDA年減1%至人民幣450億元。排除長期現金激勵的影響，調整後的 EBITDA 成長將在同類基礎上轉為正值。

Our non-GAAP net income was RMB40.7 billion, a decrease of RMB4.2 billion or 9%. Our GAAP net income was RMB24 billion, a decline of RMB9 billion or 27% primarily due to a decrease in income from operations and the increase in impairment of some investments, partly offset by the mark-to-market changes from our equity investments.

我們的非公認會計準則淨利為人民幣 407 億元，減少 42 億元，降幅為 9%。我們的 GAAP 淨利潤為人民幣 240 億元，下降人民幣 90 億元或 27%，主要是由於營業收入減少和部分投資減值增加，但部分被股權投資按市值計價的變化所抵消。

As of June 30, 2024, we continued to maintain a strong net cash position of RMB405.7 billion or $55.8 billion. Free cash flow decreased by RMB21.7 billion to RMB17.4 billion. This year-over-year decrease mainly reflected the increase in expenditure related to our investments in Alibaba cloud infrastructure and other working capital changes related to factors, including our planned reduction of direct sales businesses.

截至 2024 年 6 月 30 日，我們繼續保持強勁的淨現金頭寸，達 4,057 億元人民幣（558 億美元）。自由現金流減少人民幣217億元至人民幣174億元。這一同比下降主要反映了與阿里雲基礎設施投資相關的支出增加以及與計劃減少直銷業務等因素相關的其他營運資金變化。

Now let's look at cost trends as a percentage of revenue, excluding SBC during this quarter. Cost of revenue ratio decreased 1.1-percentage-points. Product development expenses ratio remained relatively stable. Sales and marketing expenses ratio increased 1.7-percentage-points year-over-year, primarily due to our increased investments in e-commerce businesses.

現在讓我們看看本季成本佔收入的百分比趨勢（不包括 SBC）。收入成本率下降 1.1 個百分點。產品開發費用率保持相對穩定。銷售及行銷費用率年增1.7個百分點，主要是因為我們加大了對電商業務的投入。

G&A expenses ratio increased 1.4-percentage-points. Excluding the provision of RMB3.1 billion from a one-time shareholder class action lawsuit, our G&A expenses ratio would have remained relatively stable. Now let's look at the segment results, starting with Taobao and Tmall Group.

一般及行政費用率上升 1.4 個百分點。剔除一次性股東集體訴訟中撥備的31億元人民幣，我們的一般及行政費用率將維持相對穩定。現在讓我們來看看細分市場的結果，首先是淘寶和天貓集團。

Revenue from Taobao and Tmall Group was RMB113.4 billion, a decrease of 1%. Revenue from our China commerce retail businesses was RMB107.4 billion, a decrease of 2% compared to RMB109.8 billion in the same quarter of 2023. Customer management revenue increased by 1% year-over-year, primarily due to a high single-digit year-over-year growth in online GMV, partly offset by decline in take rate.

淘寶及天貓集團營收1,134億元，下降1%。中國商業零售業務收入為人民幣1,074億元，較2023年同季度的人民幣1,098億元下降2%。下降所抵消。

The year-over-year take rate decrease was primarily due to increasing proportion of GMV generated from new models that currently have lower monetization rates. Direct sales and other revenue on the China commerce retail business was RMB27.3 billion, a decrease of 9%. As mentioned, we are proactively scaling down certain direct sales businesses, including those in Taobao and Tmall Group.

成交率較去年同期下降的主要原因是目前貨幣化率較低的新車型所產生的 GMV 比例不斷增加。中國商業零售業務的直接銷售及其他收入為人民幣273億元，下降9%。如前所述，我們正在積極縮減某些直銷業務，包括淘寶和天貓集團的直銷業務。

China commerce wholesale business revenue increased 16% to RMB6 billion, primarily due to an increase in revenue from value-added services provided to paying members. Taobao and Tmall Group adjusted EBITDA decreased by 1% to RMB48.8 billion, primarily due to the increase in investments in user experience and technology infrastructure, partly offset by the narrowing losses in certain businesses.

中國商業批發業務收入成長16%至人民幣60億元，主要因為向付費會員提供的增值服務收入增加。淘寶及天貓集團調整後EBITDA下降1%至人民幣488億元，主要因用戶體驗及技術基礎建設投資增加，但部分業務虧損收窄所抵銷。

But this increasing investment led to better consumer retention, increased the purchase frequency and positive feedback regarding the overall shopping experience. Revenue from Cloud Intelligence Group was RMB26.5 billion, an increase of 6%.

但這種不斷增加的投資帶來了更好的消費者保留率、增加了購買頻率以及對整體購物體驗的正面回饋。雲端智能集團收入人民幣265億元，成長6%。

Overall revenue, excluding Alibaba consolidated subsidiaries, grew over 6% year-over-year, driven by double-digit public cloud growth and increasing adoption of AI-related products. AI-related product revenue continued to grow at triple digits year-over-year.

在公有雲兩位數成長和人工智慧相關產品採用率不斷提高的推動下，不包括阿里巴巴合併子公司的整體營收年增超過 6%。人工智慧相關產品收入年增至三位數成長。

Cloud's adjusted EBITDA increased by 155% to RMB2.3 billion, the increase was primarily due to improving product mix through our focus on public cloud adoption and operating efficiency, partly offset by the increasing investments in customers and technology.

雲端運算的調整後 EBITDA 成長 155% 至人民幣 23 億元，成長主要歸因於我們透過專注於公有雲採用和營運效率來改善產品組合，但部分被客戶和技術投資的增加所抵消。

We're observing strong and sustained demand for AI products and solutions from our customers and are making significant investment to address this demand effectively. We believe our investments in AI capabilities and infrastructure will help strengthen our market leadership.

我們觀察到客戶對人工智慧產品和解決方案的強勁而持續的需求，並正在進行大量投資來有效滿足這一需求。我們相信，我們對人工智慧能力和基礎設施的投資將有助於加強我們的市場領導地位。

We are confident in our ability to balance these investments with steady profitability improvements, ensuring sustainable growth and value creation. Revenue from international commerce retail business increased 38% to RMB23.7 billion, primarily driven by order growth from Ali Express Choice as well as improvements in monetization. Revenue from our international commerce wholesale business increased by 12% to RMB5.6 billion, primarily due to an increase in revenue generated by cross-border related value-added services.

我們有信心平衡這些投資與穩定的獲利能力提高，確保永續成長和價值創造。國際商業零售業務營收成長38%至人民幣237億元，主要受到速賣通精選訂單成長以及貨幣化改善的推動。國際商業批發業務營收成長12%至人民幣56億元，主要因跨國相關增值服務收入增加。

AIDC's adjusted EBITDA was a loss of RMB3.7 billion, an increase of RMB3.3 billion compared to a loss of RMB420 million in the same quarter last year, primarily due to the increase in investments in Ali Express and Trendyol's cross-border business, partly offset by Lazada's significant reduction in operating loss from the improvements in its monetization and operating efficiency.

AIDC調整後EBITDA為虧損37億元人民幣，較去年同季度虧損4.2億元人民幣增加33億元人民幣，主要是由於對速賣通和Trendyol跨境業務的投資增加，由於貨幣化和運營效率的提高，Lazada 營運虧損大幅減少，部分抵消了這一影響。

Revenue from Cainiao Smart Logistics Network Limited was RMB26.8 billion and increased 16%, primarily driven by the increase in revenue from cross-border fulfillment solutions. Cainiao's EBITDA decreased by 30% to RMB618 million, primarily due to increased investments in cross-border fulfillment solutions, partly offset by improved operating efficiency.

菜鳥智慧物流網路有限公司的營收為人民幣268億元，成長16%，主要是由於跨境履行解決方案收入的成長所致。菜鳥的 EBITDA 下降 30% 至人民幣 6.18 億元，主要是由於對跨境履行解決方案的投資增加，但部分被營運效率的提高所抵消。

Revenue from local service group was RMB16.2 billion, an increase of 12%, driven by the order growth of both Amap and Ele.me and as well as revenue growth from marketing services. Adjusted EBITDA was a loss of RMB386 million compared to a loss of RMB2 billion in the same quarter last year, primarily due to improving operating efficiency and increasing scale.

本地服務集團營收為人民幣162億元，成長12%，主要受益於高德地圖和餓了麼訂單成長以及行銷服務收入成長。調整後 EBITDA 虧損 3.86 億元，而去年同期虧損 20 億元，主要是因為營運效率提高和規模擴大。

Revenue from our Digital Media & Entertainment Group was RMB5.6 billion, an increase of 4%. Adjusted EBITDA was a loss of RMB103 million compared to a profit of RMB63 million same quarter last year.

數位媒體娛樂集團營收56億元，成長4%。調整後 EBITDA 虧損 1.03 億元人民幣，而去年同期則獲利 6,300 萬元。

Revenue from all other segment increased 3% to RMB47 billion, primarily due to the increase in revenue from Freshippo, Alibaba Health and Intelligent Information Platform, partly offset by the decrease in revenue from Lingxi Games and Sun Art.

所有其他分部的收入成長3%至人民幣470億元，主要由於盒馬鮮生、阿里健康和智慧資訊平台的收入增加，但部分被靈犀遊戲和高鑫零售的收入下降所抵消。

Adjusted EBITDA from all other segment was a loss of RMB1.3 billion compared to a loss of RMB1.7 billion in the same quarter of 2023, primarily due to improved operating results from Sun Art, Freshippo, Alibaba Health and the Lingxi Games, partly offset by the increased investment in technology businesses.

所有其他部門的調整後EBITDA 為虧損人民幣13 億元，而2023 年同一季度為虧損人民幣17 億元，主要是由於高鑫零售、盒馬鮮生、阿里健康和靈犀遊戲的經營業績有所改善，部分原因是科技業務投資的增加抵消了這一影響。

To wrap up, as Eddie and Jiang Fan mentioned, for our Taobao and Tmall Group, as order and GMV growth, we are advancing monetization efforts step by step. We expect CMR growth to gradually align with GMV growth over the coming quarters.

最後，正如Eddie和蔣凡所提到的，對於我們的淘寶和天貓集團來說，隨著訂單和GMV的成長，我們正在一步步推進變現工作。我們預計未來幾季 CMR 的成長將逐漸與 GMV 的成長保持一致。

For Alibaba Cloud, we are pursuing high-quality revenue and effectively execute our integrated cloud plus AI development strategy. We are confident that revenue from external customers will return to double-digit growth in the second half of the fiscal year with gradual acceleration thereafter.

對阿里雲來說，我們追求高品質的收入，有效執行雲端+AI一體化的發展策略。我們有信心來自外部客戶的營收將在本財年下半年恢復兩位數成長，並在此後逐漸加速。

For AIDC, we focus on proactive investment to drive high-quality growth enhancing operating efficiency across all business lines. Our loss-making businesses are ending their monetization and operating efficiency. We expect most of these businesses to breakeven within one to two years and gradually contribute to the profitability scale.

對於AIDC，我們專注於主動投資，推動高品質成長，提高各業務線的營運效率。我們的虧損業務正在結束其貨幣化和營運效率。我們預計這些業務大部分將在一到兩年內實現損益平衡，並逐步貢獻獲利規模。

Thank you. That's the end of our prepared remarks. We can open up for Q&A.

謝謝。我們準備好的發言就到此結束。我們可以開放問答。

Hi, everyone, for today's call, you are welcome to ask questions in Chinese or English. A third-party translator will provide consecutive interpretation for the Q&A session. Please note that the translation is for convenience purposes only. In case of any discrepancy, our management statement in their language will prevail. If you are unable to hear the Chinese translation, bilingual transcripts of this call will be available on our website within one week after the meeting.

大家好，今天的電話會議，歡迎您用中文或英文提問。第三方翻譯將為問答環節提供交替傳譯。請注意，翻譯僅供參考。如有任何差異，以我們的管理層聲明為準。如果您聽不到中文翻譯，會議後一週內將在我們的網站上提供本次電話會議的雙語文字記錄。

Operator, we can now connect to the speaker and SI conference lines, start the Q&A session. Thank you.

接線員，我們現在可以連接發言者和 SI 會議線路，開始問答會話。謝謝。

Thank you. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions)

謝謝。我們現在開始問答環節。 （操作員說明）

Ronald Keung, Goldman Sachs.

姜羅納德，高盛。

And I want to ask a question about our take rates that with the high single-digit GMV growth and 1% CMR growth, it does imply a wider gap this quarter. But the management, you just mentioned about the narrowing gap that should come.

我想問一個關於我們的轉換率的問題，隨著 GMV 的高個位數成長和 1% 的 CMR 成長，這確實意味著本季的差距更大。但是管理階層，您剛才提到了應該縮小差距。

So how should we think about the take rate trajectory, the time needed for CMR to align with GMV? And can you talk a bit on what are the actual measures that we're doing? Is it software service fee or ad tech upgrades, how would these new products translate to Tabao and Tmall respective take rates into the next few quarters?

那麼我們應該如何考慮轉換率軌跡，也就是 CMR 與 GMV 保持一致所需的時間？您能談談我們正在採取的實際措施嗎？是軟體服務費還是廣告技術升級，這些新產品將如何轉化為淘寶和天貓在未來幾季各自的費率？

This is Eddie, and I'll take that first before handing over to Toby. In the Taobao and Tmall group, the priority at present very much has been on enhancing the user shopping experience so as to drive heightened purchase frequency and GMV.

這是艾迪，我先接過這通電話，然後再交給托比。在淘寶和天貓集團，目前的首要任務是提升用戶的購物體驗，從而帶動購買頻率和GMV的提升。

Now as market share stabilizes, which is what we certainly seen this quarter, we can start to accelerate the pace of our monetization efforts. But there are a few factors that you have to look at. First of all, the various new products we've launched, including live streaming, and including the RMB10 billion subsidy program have resulted in high user return and return to platforms and high user repurchase rates.

現在，隨著市場佔有率的穩定（這就是我們本季所看到的），我們可以開始加快貨幣化工作的步伐。但您必須考慮一些因素。首先，我們推出的各種新產品，包括直播，包括百億補貼計劃，帶來了很高的用戶回報率和平台回報率，用戶復購率很高。

But it's going to take a bit of time to roll out the new monetization approaches and products for them to gain traction. But that's certainly what we're looking at doing over the coming few quarters.

但推出新的獲利方法和產品才能獲得吸引力還需要一些時間。但這肯定是我們在未來幾季要做的事情。

The second thing to look at is our new advertising product, Quanzhantui, that we're introducing. Of course, in order for this to achieve solid performance, you need more than just that product in place. You need effective coordination and synergy across three different pieces.

第二個看點是我們推出的新廣告產品－全戰推。當然，為了實現穩定的性能，您需要的不僅僅是該產品。您需要三個不同部分的有效協調和協同。

The first being user traffic on the Taobao platform. The second being having a sufficient number of advertisers taking part across a sufficient number of different sectors with sufficient coverage of different kinds of products. And then beyond that, it will take, say, six or more months to fully optimize the algorithms and also to optimize the user data.

首先是淘寶平台的使用者流量。第二是有足夠數量的廣告商參與足夠數量的不同產業，並充分涵蓋不同種類的產品。除此之外，還需要六個月或更長時間來全面優化演算法並優化用戶數據。

So, starting from the rollout of Quanzhantui back in April, it's likely to take something like 6 to 12 months of work to bring all of those different things together to achieve really solid progress and growth.

因此，從 4 月推出全戰推開始，可能需要 6 到 12 個月的時間才能將所有這些不同的事情整合在一起，以實現真正紮實的進步和成長。

So, in short, for those three different things to come together and for this all to really be working well, likely looking at something like 12 months from the initial launch date. And then to that, I'll hand over to Toby to also say a few words about technology service charge.

因此，簡而言之，要將這三項不同的事情結合在一起，並讓這一切真正運作良好，可能需要從最初發布之日起 12 個月左右的時間。然後，我將請 Toby 談談技術服務費。

Yes, this is Toby. Just to add regarding the technology service charge that we started talking about charging as of September on Taobao and on Idle Fish at a rate of 0.6%, and that is to be calculated on the basis of actually received GMV, actually received by the merchants. We've come to this decision in consideration of both prevailing market practice as well as opinion of our merchants, feedback from our merchants.

是的，這是托比。補充一下技術服務費，我們從9月開始講淘寶和閒魚上的收費是0.6%，是依照商家實際收到的GMV來計算的。我們做出這項決定是考慮了現行市場慣例以及我們商家的意見和商家的回饋。

Of course, we will have special measures to take good care of our SME merchants, in particular, those whose actual annual GMV is below a certain threshold either have that refunded or find other ways to provide assistance for them to expand their CASA base and grow their GMV to that threshold.

當然，我們會有特別的措施來照顧我們的中小企業商戶，特別是那些實際年GMV低於一定門檻的商戶，要么退還，要么通過其他方式幫助他們擴大CASA基礎，發展壯大。閾值。

So, I would expect that with this starting as of September, you can expect to see this making a difference in the financials over, say, the next seven months of this present fiscal year.

因此，我預計從 9 月開始，您可以預期這會對本財年接下來七個月的財務狀況產生影響。

Alicia Yap, Citigroup.

艾莉西亞葉 (Alicia Yap)，花旗集團。

I have a question on your AIDC business. How does management think about the overall competitive landscape now? And how will that evolve over time? What are the competitive advantage of Ali Express for both the merchants and consumer that will help you defend your market position in some of important countries?

我對你們的 AIDC 業務有疑問。管理階層如何看待現在的整體競爭格局？隨著時間的推移，這種情況將如何演變？全球速賣通對於商家和消費者有哪些競爭優勢，可以幫助您捍衛您在一些重要國家的市場地位？

And then a follow-up on that is with Lazada seems to be turning profitable starting in July. Is that a timeframe that you target to achieve profitability for Ali Express as well?

隨後，Lazada 的後續行動似乎從 7 月開始開始獲利。這也是您為速賣通獲利的目標時間範圍嗎？

Thank you. This is Jiang Fan. Well, the first thing I would say is that AIDC, unlike the other businesses within the Alibaba Group, comprises a number of different types of businesses. It's not a single business. We are present in many different local markets with local brands in those markets, with local teams operating them.

謝謝。這是蔣凡。嗯，我首先要說的是，AIDC 與阿里巴巴集團內的其他業務不同，它包含許多不同類型的業務。這不是單一業務。我們在許多不同的當地市場開展業務，在這些市場中擁有當地品牌，並由當地團隊經營。

And overall, AIDC is really a combination of both cross-border and local business. So, something that we're working on in that broader context of being in different markets with different local brands, local experience, local teams operating them is we're working on integrating and sharpening our -- integrating supply, especially supply and sharpening our advantage around supply -- product supply out of China.

整體而言，AIDC確實是跨國業務和本地業務的結合。因此，在更廣泛的背景下，我們正在努力整合和加強我們的供應，特別是供應和加強我們的供應鏈，特別是供應和加強我們的供應鏈。

On the consumer side, I think certainly one advantage we have is very good consumer brands with high brand recognition and certainly also working very hard to enhance the user experience on AE. In the past, AE was perhaps a low efficiency kind of platform that too often offered consumers a relatively poor user experience, but we've been working very hard on improving that.

在消費者方面，我認為我們擁有的一個優勢當然是非常好的消費品牌，具有很高的品牌認知度，當然也非常努力地增強 AE 上的使用者體驗。過去，AE 可能是一種低效率的平台，常常為消費者提供相對較差的使用者體驗，但我們一直在努力改進這一點。

As for Lazada, yes, as you noted, as I said earlier, we were EBITDA positive for the first time for a single month in July of this year. And we'll continue the adjustments as we have there while preserving our market share, finding ways to enhance efficiency and increase our profitability.

至於 Lazada，是的，正如您所指出的，正如我之前所說，我們在今年 7 月首次單月 EBITDA 為正值。我們將繼續進行調整，同時保留我們的市場份額，尋找提高效率和獲利能力的方法。

AE Choice is an important model that we've been investing in, and it's taken time to get to where it is. UE continues to optimize. In respect of AE Choice and over the next few quarters to come, we'll continue to make those efforts to drive higher efficiency and achieve high-quality growth.

AE Choice 是我們一直在投資的一個重要模型，我們花了一些時間才達到這個目標。 UE持續優化。就AE Choice而言，未來幾個季度，我們將繼續努力，推動更高效率，實現高品質成長。

Thomas Chong, Jefferies.

托馬斯莊，杰弗里斯。

My first question is about stock connect. Can management comment about our thoughts about the status of a primary listing and the triaging going into stock connect. And my second question is about our cloud business. Given that we are expecting the external cloud revenue back to double-digit growth in the second half of fiscal year and accelerate going forward, I just want to get some color with regard to our AI revenue contribution. What's the goal that we are looking for in the long run coming from AI?

我的第一個問題是關於滬港通的。管理階層能否評論一下我們對主要上市狀態和股票互聯互通分類的看法？我的第二個問題是關於我們的雲端業務。鑑於我們預計外部雲端收入在下半財年恢復兩位數成長，並在未來加速成長，我只想了解我們的人工智慧收入貢獻。從長遠來看，我們尋求人工智慧的目標是什麼？

Okay. Thomas, thank you for your question. I will take the first one, and then Eddie will answer the second question. Regarding your question about the Stock Connect, I guess your question is about the primary conversion at our end.

好的。托馬斯，謝謝你的問題。我先回答第一個問題，然後艾迪回答第二個問題。關於你關於滬港通的問題，我想你的問題是關於我們這邊的主要轉換。

Currently, we are actively pursuing Hong Kong primary listing. We will have an AGM on the 22nd of August. So, we have a proposal that's subject to the shareholders approved. And then, we are aiming to complete the conversion process after we obtained approval from the shareholders and get it completed before the end of August.

目前，我們正積極爭取香港第一上市。我們將於 8 月 22 日召開年度股東大會。因此，我們有一項提案需要股東批准。然後，我們的目標是在獲得股東批准後完成轉換程序，並在8月底之前完成。

Then you joined the Stock Connect, it was still subject to different exchanges sort of like per se. That's what one incentive procedure, just the procedure to go through. So that's the update on the status.

然後你加入了股票互聯互通，它仍然受到不同交易所的影響，就像本身一樣。這就是一種激勵程序，只是要經歷的程序。這就是狀態的更新。

This is Eddie. I'll take your second question about cloud. There's very, very robust demand among our customers for AI and AI relevant products. And if you look at the pipeline, you can see that, that demand is still far from being satisfied. So, we think it's a very clear-cut trend that revenue from external customers will achieve double-digit growth in the second half of the fiscal year.

這是艾迪。我將回答你關於雲的第二個問題。我們的客戶對人工智慧和人工智慧相關產品的需求非常非常強勁。如果你看看管道，你會發現，這種需求遠遠沒有被滿足。因此，我們認為來自外部客戶的收入將在本財年下半年實現兩位數成長是一個非常明顯的趨勢。

In terms of the breakdown of that AI product revenue. In terms of the revenue, pardon me, probably most of that growth will be driven by AI products. If you look at the industry as a whole, demand for CPU-based traditional cloud computing is relatively limited, where most of the growth is now focused on GPU-based AI product development. So, I would say something like more than half of that expected growth will be driven by AI products.

就人工智慧產品收入的細分而言。就收入而言，恕我直言，可能大部分成長將由人工智慧產品推動。從整個產業來看，基於CPU的傳統雲端運算需求相對有限，目前大部分成長集中在基於GPU的AI產品開發。因此，我想說一半以上的預期成長將由人工智慧產品推動。

Ellie Jiang, Macquarie.

艾莉江，麥格理。

Just first of all, a quick follow-up on the prior cloud question. Obviously, we are already showing some early indicators of the positive momentum and the management shared the strong demand. Given the current kind of macro positions and softened enterprise demand into the second half, just can you comment on kind of the mix impact, especially in the next several quarters?

首先，快速跟進之前的雲端問題。顯然，我們已經顯示出一些積極勢頭的早期指標，管理層也表達了強烈的需求。鑑於當前的宏觀狀況和下半年企業需求的疲軟，您能否評論一下混合影響，特別是在接下來的幾個季度？

And then also, the second question is on the Taobao and Tmall GMV reacceleration. So, we're encouraged to see our overall GMV momentum catching up. And actually, for the second quarter, we already caught up to industry pace reported by MBS. Motoring, can management comment on the key drivers behind the GMV reacceleration? And anything you can really talk on the return rate that we've seen across the ecosystem?

另外，第二個問題是關於淘寶和天貓GMV再加速的問題。因此，我們很高興看到我們的整體 GMV 勢頭迎頭趕上。事實上，在第二季度，我們已經趕上了 MBS 報告的行業步伐。駕駛方面，管理階層能否評論GMV重新加速背後的關鍵驅動因素？關於我們在整個生態系統中看到的回報率，您有什麼真正可以談論的嗎？

This is Eddie. I'll take the first question that has to do with cloud. Look, I think your question had to do with how macroeconomic conditions are resulting in softening enterprise demand. But that's not at all what we're seeing.

這是艾迪。我將回答與雲端有關的第一個問題。聽著，我認為你的問題與宏觀經濟狀況如何導致企業需求疲軟有關。但這根本不是我們所看到的。

What we see certainly among our own cloud customers is that their AI budgets for this year are higher, significantly higher than what they were last year. Any enterprise that is digitalized and relies on digitalization must be investing, it has to be investing in AI.

我們在自己的雲端客戶中看到的是，他們今年的人工智慧預算更高，明顯高於去年。任何數位化、依賴數位化的企業都必須投資，必須投資人工智慧。

All the industry is now that are using AI are leveraging it to enhance their competitiveness and efficiency. So, any enterprise that's in any way digitally reliant will certainly not scale down its investment in AI because to do so would impair their own competitiveness and efficiency. So that's a clear trend that we're seeing, and we're not seeing any kind of a slowdown or softening.

現在所有正在使用人工智慧的行業都在利用它來提高競爭力和效率。因此，任何對數位化有依賴的企業肯定不會縮減對人工智慧的投資，因為這樣做會損害自身的競爭力和效率。因此，這是我們看到的一個明顯趨勢，而且我們沒有看到任何形式的放緩或疲軟。

As to your second question on the recovery in GMV growth rate at TTG. I think really this comes down to our overall strategy for the Tabao and Tmall group, where the most important thing we're investing in is the underlying capabilities that allow us to deliver quality products on quality services attractive prices. And those really are the most basic parts of the user experience when it comes to e-commerce.

關於你的第二個問題，關於TTG GMV增速的恢復。我認為這實際上取決於我們對淘寶和天貓集團的整體策略，我們投資的最重要的事情是使我們能夠以優質服務和有吸引力的價格提供優質產品的基礎能力。這些確實是電子商務使用者體驗中最基本的部分。

Now if you look at TTG, we have an extremely rich and diverse product assortment and also a very complex, multifaceted user base. So, it's important for us to segment those consumers to make available to the different kinds of product supply and different kinds of service experience to cater to that diverse range of needs of those different segments.

現在，如果你看看 TTG，我們擁有極其豐富多樣的產品種類，以及非常複雜、多方面的用戶群。因此，對我們來說，對這些消費者進行細分，提供不同類型的產品供應和不同類型的服務體驗，以滿足這些不同細分市場的多樣化需求，這一點很重要。

And so that allows us to develop different kinds of supply capabilities for those different segments. And underlying all of that is our ongoing investment in optimizing supply chain and supply chain efficiency in order to be able to ensure we have quality products and quality services at attractive prices for those different consumer tiers.

因此，這使我們能夠為這些不同的細分市場開發不同類型的供應能力。所有這些的基礎是我們對優化供應鏈和供應鏈效率的持續投資，以便能夠確保我們以有吸引力的價格為不同的消費者階層提供優質的產品和優質的服務。

This is Toby, and I'll take that other question about return rates. Purchase return rates are increasing across the industry as a general trend. But in the case of Alibaba, our return rate is slightly lower than the industry average.

我是托比，我將回答有關退貨率的另一個問題。整個產業的採購退貨率不斷上升是大勢所趨。但就阿里巴巴而言，我們的退貨率略低於業界平均。

The second thing I would say is that the return experience is a very important part of customer experience overall. And when the consumer has a good experience around returns, that's going to be favorable for increasing retention and purchase frequency.

我要說的第二件事是，退貨體驗是整體客戶體驗中非常重要的一部分。當消費者在退貨方面獲得良好的體驗時，這將有利於提高保留率和購買頻率。

And I think it's simple to note that on our platform this year, if you look at our Net Promoter Score, NPS, especially among mid- and high-tier consumers, our NPS has improved considerably. So again, our return rate is slightly lower than the overall market average. And I certainly don't think that that's going to discourage merchants from investing and doing business on our platform.

我認為很容易注意到，今年在我們的平台上，如果你看看我們的淨推薦值（NPS），特別是在中高端消費者中，我們的 NPS 有了很大的提高。同樣，我們的退貨率略低於整體市場平均。我當然不認為這會阻止商家在我們的平台上投資和開展業務。

Gary Yu, Morgan Stanley.

加里·餘，摩根士丹利。

My question is regarding management comment about some of this loss-making business aiming to reach breakeven in the next one to two years. Could management share more detail in terms of individual segments including local services, AIDC as well as most of the retail business under the all-other segment. How should we look at the timing of kind of breakeven target in the next one to two years individually?

我的問題是關於管理層對一些旨在在未來一到兩年內實現盈虧平衡的虧損業務的評論。管理層能否分享更多有關各個細分市場的細節，包括本地服務、AIDC 以及所有其他細分市場下的大部分零售業務。我們該如何單獨看待未來一到兩年實現損益平衡目標的時機？

Okay. Thank you, Gary. I'll take that question. I think what Eddie and I was explaining is except for Taobao and Tmall that serve like the core businesses we mentioned previously, including Taobao Tmall Cloud and the AIDC, all the other businesses, some of those businesses are still loss-making at this stage and that they will be ramping up their efficiency and monetization and sort of enhance -- reduce their losses significantly in the next year or so, one or two years and to reach breakeven.

好的。謝謝你，加里。我來回答這個問題。我想我和Eddie所解釋的就是除了淘寶和天貓像我們之前提到的核心業務，包括淘寶天貓雲和AIDC，其他所有業務，其中一些業務現階段仍然是虧損的，他們將提高效率和貨幣化，並在未來一年左右、一兩年內大幅減少損失，並達到收支平衡。

And then afterwards, they will sort of like start to deliver a scalable sort of profitability going forward. How we are going to achieve that, it's quite -- as I was explaining, what we want -- those businesses do, they need to, on one hand, hear about the efficiency of the investment they are making, balance the scale and efficiency, which is very important.

然後，他們將開始提供可擴展的盈利能力。我們將如何實現這一目標，正如我所解釋的，我們想要什麼——這些企業所做的，他們一方面需要了解他們正在進行的投資的效率，平衡規模和效率，這非常重要。

Secondly, they on one hand that they are making investment, they also need to care more about monetization. So, it's critical the enhanced monetization rate using their business model. So, with both more income and the sort of higher efficiency in the spending, they are moving towards the breakeven and profitability.

其次，他們一方面是在做投資，但也需要更關心變現。因此，利用他們的商業模式來提高貨幣化率至關重要。因此，隨著收入的增加和支出效率的提高，他們正在朝著損益平衡和獲利的方向邁進。

We can clearly see, as I -- during my prepared remarks, I explained -- I used two examples. One is a local service, and the other one is Lazada. I think Jiang Fan explained the Lazada. For local service, I think it's all about, on one hand, you need to increase the scale, i.e., you need to increase the order. On the other hand, you need to improve unit economics in, for example, in earnest case, it's about, all about it sort of like new delivery business, improve the unit economics continuously.

我們可以清楚地看到，正如我在準備好的演講中解釋的那樣，我使用了兩個例子。一種是本地服務，另一種是Lazada。我認為蔣凡解釋了Lazada。對於本地服務，我認為一方面是您需要擴大規模，即需要增加訂單。另一方面，你需要提高單位經濟效益，例如，在認真的情況下，這一切都有點像新的送貨業務，不斷提高單位經濟效益。

And then in Amap, I think it's all about, for example, the ride hailing businesses per all the unit economics need to improve. So, with both scale and efficiency improve, we are sort of -- we are able to reducing the losses very significantly and moving towards the profitability.

然後，在高德地圖，我認為這一切都與，例如，所有單位經濟效益需要改善的叫車業務有關。因此，隨著規模和效率的提高，我們能夠非常顯著地減少損失並實現盈利。

So, I think this is pretty much how this business will execute and the move towards profitability.

因此，我認為這幾乎就是該業務的執行方式和實現盈利的方式。

Jiong Shao, Barclays.

邵炯，巴克萊銀行。

My question is about the gap between CMR and GMV. It's great you achieved high single-digit for GMV growth this quarter. The gap between the two appears to be high single digit as well. Is that a high watermark going forward, especially you launched -- recently launched the Transat and especially when you start to charge a technology service fee starting in September. Any comments would be great.

我的問題是關於CMR和GMV之間的差距。很高興您本季的 GMV 實現了高個位數成長。兩者之間的差距似乎也高達個位數。這是一個高水位線嗎？任何評論都會很棒。

And related to that, I think Toby talked about 0.6% of GMV for the technology fees. But some of the smaller merchants are going to wave that. I was wondering, is that sort of a net number in terms of percentage of GMV? You think the technology service fees will bring to CMR? Any clarification would be great.

與此相關的是，我認為 Toby 談到了 GMV 的 0.6% 作為技術費。但一些規模較小的商家將不同意這一點。我想知道，這是以 GMV 百分比計算的淨數字嗎？您認為技術服務費會為CMR帶來什麼？任何澄清都會很好。

Okay. Thank you for the question. I'll take that. I think as previously, Eddie also in my prepared remarks, I think the gap between the GMV, online G&A and CMR reflect actually the drop of the take rate. Why the take rate dropped?

好的。謝謝你的提問。我會接受的。我想和之前一樣，Eddie 在我準備好的演講中也提到，我認為 GMV、線上 G&A 和 CMR 之間的差距實際上反映了轉換率的下降。為何收錄率下降？

Because currently, the -- some of the new models with a very high growth in GMV currently still have relatively low monetization, which will be ramped up in the next few quarters if you like. So that's why there's still a gap.

因為目前，一些GMV成長非常高的新車型目前的貨幣化程度仍然較低，如果你願意的話，未來幾季將會提高。所以這就是為什麼仍然存在差距。

As we also said, in the next few quarters, CMR growth will be at the same pace with GMV, which means take rate will start to get relatively stabilized. So that's what sort of we're expecting. And Eddie explained why GMVs currently grow faster than the take rate. The reason is because by executing our strategy, we first need to invest in the consumers, get more the purchase frequency from the consumers, then get the GMV growth.

正如我們也所說，在接下來的幾個季度，CMR 的成長將與 GMV 同步成長，這意味著轉換率將開始變得相對穩定。這就是我們所期待的。 Eddie 解釋了為什麼目前 GMV 的成長速度快於轉換率。因為執行我們的策略，首先需要對消費者進行投資，獲得消費者更多的購買頻率，然後才能獲得GMV的成長。

And as soon as we start to observe the GMV back to growth and then the market share becomes stabilizing, we will gradually ramp up the monetization sort of like a pace. A few things we're doing. Eddie explained transient, which is currently be rolling out. The penetration into traffic will take a number of quarters. So that will certainly improve the take rate, which means we accelerated the CMR growth.

一旦我們開始觀察 GMV 恢復成長，然後市佔率變得穩定，我們就會逐漸加快貨幣化速度。我們正在做的一些事情。 Eddie 解釋了目前正在推出的瞬態。滲透到交通中需要幾個季度的時間。因此，這肯定會提高採用率，這意味著我們加速了 CMR 的成長。

And secondly, with this software service fee charge will also help on the sort of like the take rate. A few other sort of like measures as well. So, these are all the things currently we have been. Why we started to do it because we see the growth back on the GMV, and we see the sign of stabilizing the market share.

其次，透過此軟體收取服務費也將有助於提高採用率。還有其他一些類似的措施。所以，這些就是我們目前所做的一切。為什麼我們開始這樣做是因為我們看到了GMV的成長，並且我們看到了市場份額穩定的跡象。

And then your question about the -- how it is clear for this 0.6 charge. It's on the completed transaction, completed GMV. So, it's charged on the completed GMV. However, we will refund back to some of the small and medium merchants, if their annual GMV is below certain threshold.

然後你的問題是──這個 0.6 的費用是如何清楚的。這是關於已完成的交易、已完成的 GMV。因此，它是根據已完成的 GMV 來收費的。但是，如果一些中小型商家的年度GMV低於一定閾值，我們將退款給他們。

Kenneth Fong, UBS.

肯尼思方，瑞銀集團。

I have one question maybe on the financial number. One is on the tax rate. I noticed that the tax -- the after-tax rate is quite high for the current quarter. Can you maybe explain what's the rationale behind? And how should we model the expense going forward?

我有一個關於財務數字的問題。一是關於稅率。我注意到本季的稅後稅率相當高。您能解釋一下背後的理由嗎？我們應該如何對未來的費用進行建模？

And the other thing is about the decline, 56% decline in our free cash flow. I understand that it is related to our investment on AI cloud as well as some one-off expenses or free cash flow on the planned reduction on direct sales business. Should we expect that to gradually normalize in the next one or two quarters, especially for the direct sales business part?

另一件事是關於下降，我們的自由現金流下降了 56%。據我了解，這與我們對AI雲的投資以及計劃削減直銷業務的一些一次性費用或自由現金流有關。我們是否應該預期這種情況會在未來一、兩個季度逐漸正常化，尤其是直銷業務部分？

Thank you, Kenneth. I'll take this question. Your first question is about tax rate. Because if you're using our P&L's tax divided by profit, you normally cannot reach a sort of like the real effective tax rate because we do have a lot of, if you like, a permanent difference is one-off items, which does not have tax implication there.

謝謝你，肯尼斯。我來回答這個問題。你的第一個問題是關於稅率。因為如果您使用我們的損益表的稅收除以利潤，您通常無法達到類似於實際有效稅率的程度，因為我們確實有很多（如果您願意的話）永久差異是一次性項目，這並不那裡有稅務影響。

We are monitoring on an adjusted basis on the tax rate, which is relatively stable in this quarter compared with last quarter. So, in terms of your model, I guess, probably we can -- our team can sort of like looking to Tmall and sort of communicate offline. So, this is your first question.

我們正在監測調整後的稅率，與上季相比，本季相對穩定。所以，就你的模型而言，我想，也許我們可以——我們的團隊可以有點像尋找天貓並進行線下交流。所以，這是你的第一個問題。

Okay. Your second question is about free cash flow. As I explained, there is quite a big significant drop of free cash flow. One of the reasons is the significant increase in expenditure on the AI infrastructure investments if you like. So, I think -- and the other reason, as I said, is because of the sort of -- because of the working capital changes in relation to like some of the business scale jobs.

好的。你的第二個問題是關於自由現金流。正如我所解釋的，自由現金流大幅下降。原因之一是人工智慧基礎設施投資支出大幅增加。所以，我認為——正如我所說，另一個原因是——因為營運資本的變化與一些商業規模的工作有關。

For these business scale jobs, many of them, if you like, a majority of them are from those planned scale down, if you like. As I was explaining why our direct sales business within Taobao and Tmall dropped quite significantly, the reason is we proactively scaled down some of these 1P business is in Taobao and Tmall. The reason is we believe in some of these business categories, 1P format probably is not a more efficient format. So that's sort of practice.

對於這些業務規模的工作，如果您願意的話，其中許多工作都來自計劃規模的縮減（如果您願意的話）。我剛剛在解釋為什麼我們在淘寶和天貓的直銷業務下降幅度很大，原因是我們主動縮減了淘寶和天貓的一些1P業務。原因是我們認為在其中一些業務類別中，1P 格式可能不是更有效的格式。這就是一種練習。

But you will also have some of the businesses scale job was not because proactively did that. Some of it just like the overall market situation. For example, as I said, the revenue dropped from, for example, like Sanna, like Intime, all those businesses are in 1P.

但你也會有一些企業規模的工作並不是因為主動這樣做的。其中一些就像整體市場狀況一樣。舉個例子，就像我說的，收入下降了，例如像三娜，像銀泰，所有這些業務都是1P。

And the job of their scale actually impacts the working capital. I don't know, probably I can give a little bit more color on. Because for doing 1P business, on one hand, you are buying inventory from vendor. On the other hand, you sell it. And does the vendor normally give you a credit term like in 60 days or 90 days.

他們的工作規模實際上會影響營運資金。我不知道，也許我可以提供更多的顏色。因為對於做1P業務，一方面，你是從供應商購買庫存。另一方面，你把它賣掉。供應商通常會給你 60 天或 90 天的信用期限嗎？

If you can make your inventory turnover, i.e., sell inventory within a short period of time, shorter than the sort of credit term you've given, actually, you are generating cash flow, particularly if the size is going up, you are generating positive cash flow.

如果您能夠實現庫存週轉，即在比您給出的信用期限更短的時間內出售庫存，實際上，您正在產生現金流，特別是如果規模增加，您正在產生現金流正現金流。

So, on the contrary, if you're reducing the scale, you are -- it will have outflow on the working capital. But is that -- is this a permanent impact? To me, I think that this is a relatively temporary impact. During the process of reducing scale, we will see this outflow. But when the business size became stable, we will no longer see these types of outflow.

因此，相反，如果你縮小規模，那麼營運資金就會流出。但這是永久性的影響嗎？對我來說，我認為這是一個相對暫時的影響。在規模縮小的過程中，我們會看到這種流出。但當業務規模穩定後，我們就不會再看到這類資金外流。

James Lee, Mizuho.

詹姆斯李，瑞穗。

Great. My question is related to AI, more big-picture question for you guys. Can you talk about maybe implication of open-source large language model, how that impact the adoption of AI in China? And also, how should we think about large language model as that transition into agents? And how do we think the use cases may change for your merchants and customers?

偉大的。我的問題與人工智慧有關，這是給你們的更宏觀的問題。您能否談談開源大語言模型的影響，這對中國人工智慧的採用有何影響？而且，當大型語言模型轉變為智能體時，我們該如何看待它？我們認為用例可能會對您的商家和客戶產生怎樣的變化？

Thank you. Well, on your first question. In this recent wave of generative AI development, different companies have made different choices around whether to develop open or close source models. Alibaba Cloud is itself a cloud service provider. So, the clear choice for us has been to develop open-source large language models.

謝謝。好吧，關於你的第一個問題。在最近的生成式人工智慧發展浪潮中，不同的公司在開發開源模型還是閉源模型方面做出了不同的選擇。阿里雲本身就是雲端服務供應商。因此，我們明確的選擇是開發開源大型語言模型。

That's very helpful, of course, for developers. Developers want more control. They want more scope to optimize. So we feel that providing open source large language model to developers is advantageous for that. And that, of course, very much fits into our own strategy because we are a cloud service provider. So, it's doubly advantageous.

當然，這對開發人員來說非常有幫助。開發人員想要更多的控制權。他們想要更大的最佳化範圍。因此，我們認為向開發人員提供開源大語言模型對此是有利的。當然，這非常適合我們自己的策略，因為我們是雲端服務提供者。所以，這是雙重有利的。

They can develop their offerings using our open-source models, and then they're very likely to continue to select Alibaba to deploy those offerings at scale. So that's entirely consistent with our strategy.

他們可以使用我們的開源模型開發他們的產品，然後他們很可能會繼續選擇阿里巴巴大規模部署這些產品。所以這完全符合我們的策略。

As for the idea of agents, the models are becoming larger, more and more multimodal, with more and more parameters becoming stronger and more capable. And so, there will be a need for agents, I think, to deal with some of the more complex needs around inferencing, especially agents that can call on different underlying large models. I know lots of developers are working on it.

至於代理的想法，模型變得越來越大，越來越多模態，參數越來越多，變得越來越強大和能力更強。因此，我認為，需要代理來處理推理方面的一些更複雜的需求，特別是可以調用不同底層大型模型的代理。我知道很多開發人員正在致力於此。

But I think going into the future, this kind of development will become more automated.

但我認為未來這種開發將會變得更加自動化。

Let's open the last question.

我們來打開最後一個問題。

Youssef Squali, Truist.

尤瑟夫‧斯誇裡，真理主義者。

It's Youssef Squali from Truist. So just on the follow-up on the AI question. One, if I look at your CapEx, it's more than doubled year-on-year in Q1. Number one, is that a good run rate to work off of for the rest of the year?

我是來自 Truist 的 Youssef Squali。那麼關於人工智慧問題的後續。第一，如果我看一下你們的資本支出，第一季比去年同期成長了一倍以上。第一，今年剩餘時間的運作率是否良好？

And number two, as you get the return on those investments, can you help us just understand your framework of reference. One of the key questions we often get here, at least in the US is the ROI associated with the AI and kind of the timeline or the time or framework on which you kind of expect these investments to start bearing fruit, and maybe give us examples of where you're seeing early green shoots?

第二，當您獲得這些投資的回報時，您能否幫助我們了解您的參考架構。至少在美國，我們經常遇到的關鍵問題之一是與人工智慧相關的投資回報率，以及您期望這些投資開始取得成果的時間表或時間或框架，也許可以給我們一些例子您在哪裡看到了早期的綠芽？

Okay. I will take the first question, and Eddie will answer the second question. I think with respect to the CapEx, just like as you have observed from our reporting, increased very significantly. I think the reason is because we see clearly very strong demand and the backlog. That's why we are investing. We would expect in the next few quarters, we would expect a similar level of investments in CapEx going forward.

好的。我回答第一個問題，艾迪回答第二個問題。我認為就資本支出而言，正如您從我們的報告中觀察到的那樣，資本支出成長非常顯著。我認為原因是我們清楚地看到非常強烈的需求和積壓。這就是我們投資的原因。我們預計在接下來的幾個季度中，我們預計未來的資本支出投資水準將達到類似水準。

This is Eddie. So, to continue with the second part of this answer. Certainly, as Toby said, over the next several quarters, we expect to continue to be investing in AI CapEx at that kind of pace. And it's simply because we see a lot of demand, a lot of unmet demand from many clients and you look at the pipeline those clients have, you know there's going to be ongoing demand.

這是艾迪。那麼，繼續這個答案的第二部分。當然，正如托比所說，在接下來的幾個季度，我們預計將繼續以這種速度投資人工智慧資本支出。這只是因為我們看到了很多需求，來自許多客戶的大量未滿足的需求，並且你看看這些客戶擁有的管道，你知道將會有持續的需求。

So, whether it's for training or inference or API calls, what we see when we're making these kind of CapEx investments, as soon as we get a server up, a server is instantly running at full capacity. There's that kind of demand.

因此，無論是用於訓練、推理還是 API 調用，當我們進行此類資本支出投資時，我們看到，一旦伺服器啟動，伺服器就會立即滿載運行。有這樣的需求。

So, we can expect to see a very high ROI over these next quarters because we're building compute power to meet existing demand and that new compute power coming online is getting instantly taken up and running at full capacity on day one.

因此，我們預計在接下來的幾個季度中會看到非常高的投資回報率，因為我們正在建立計算能力來滿足現有需求，並且上線的新計算能力將在第一天立即被佔用並滿負荷運行。

Well, thank you, everyone, for joining. We will see you next quarter.

好的，謝謝大家的加入。我們下個季度見。

Thank you. That does conclude our conference for today. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

謝謝。我們今天的會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。