Sea Ltd (SE) 2024 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good morning and good evening to all, and welcome to the Sea Limited third-quarter 2024 results conference call. (Operator Instructions)

大家早安、晚上好，歡迎參加 Sea Limited 2024 年第三季業績電話會議。 （操作員說明）

And finally, I'd like to advise all participants that this call is being recorded. I would now like to welcome Mr. M.C. Koh to begin the conference. Please go ahead.

最後，我想告知所有參與者，本次通話正在錄音。現在我歡迎 M.C. 先生。 Koh 宣布會議開始。請繼續。

Hello, everyone, and welcome to Sea's 2024 third-quarter earnings conference call. I am M.C., Sea's Investor Relations Director. On this call, we may make forward-looking statements, which are inherently subject to risks and uncertainties and may not be realized in the future for various reasons as stated in our press release.

大家好，歡迎參加Sea 2024年第三季財報電話會議。我是 M.C.，Sea 的投資者關係總監。在這次電話會議中，我們可能會做出前瞻性陳述，這些陳述本身就存在風險和不確定性，並且可能由於我們新聞稿中所述的各種原因而在未來無法實現。

Also, this call includes the discussion of certain non-GAAP financial measures such as adjusted EBITDA. We believe these measures can enhance our investors' understanding of the actual cash flows of our major businesses when used as a complement to our GAAP disclosures. For a discussion of the non-GAAP financial measures and reconciliation with the closest GAAP measures, please refer to the section on non-GAAP financial measures in our press release.

此外，本次電話會議也討論了某些非公認會計準則財務指標，例如調整後的 EBITDA。我們相信，這些措施可以增強投資者對我們主要業務實際現金流量的理解，作為我們公認會計準則揭露的補充。有關非 GAAP 財務指標的討論以及與最接近的 GAAP 指標的調節，請參閱我們新聞稿中非 GAAP 財務指標的部分。

I have with me Sea's Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Forrest Li; President, Chris Feng; and Chief Financial Officer, Tony Hou. Our management will share strategy and business updates, operating highlights and financial performance for the third quarter of 2024. This will be followed by a Q&A session, in which we welcome any questions you have.

與我同行的有 Sea 董事長兼執行長 Forrest Li；總裁，克里斯·馮；和首席財務官托尼·侯。我們的管理層將分享 2024 年第三季的策略和業務更新、營運亮點和財務業績。

With that, let me turn the call over to Forrest.

現在，讓我把電話轉給福雷斯特。

Hello, everyone, and thank you for joining today's call. I'm happy to report that it has been another solid quarter. We are seeing high growth across all our three businesses. Shopee is on track to deliver our full as of mid-20 year-on-year GMV growth. SeaMoney's loan book grew by over 70% year-on-year this quarter while maintaining a stable NPL ratio.

大家好，感謝您參加今天的電話會議。我很高興地報告，這又是一個穩定的季度。我們的三項業務都在高速成長。 Shopee 預計將實現截至 20 年中的 GMV 年比全面成長。本季SeaMoney的貸款帳簿年增超過70%，同時維持穩定的不良貸款率。

And for Garena, we now expect Free Fire's full year bookings to grow over 30% year-on-year. I'm very proud that we also improved our profitability while getting back to high growth. This quarter, Shopee achieved positive adjusted EBITDA in both Asia and Brazil. As we continue to focus on delivering growth, we expect Shopee to remain profitable going forward.

對於 Garena，我們現在預計 Free Fire 的全年預訂量將年增 30% 以上。我感到非常自豪的是，我們在恢復高成長的同時也提高了獲利能力。本季度，Shopee 在亞洲和巴西均實現了正向調整 EBITDA。隨著我們繼續專注於實現成長，我們預計 Shopee 將繼續保持獲利。

With that, let me take you through each business' performance in more detail. Starting with e-commerce. Shopee has delivered strong GMV and order volume growth this quarter, sustaining strong market leadership in our Asia market. User growth remains strong with average monthly active buyers in the third quarter growing by over 20% year on year.

接下來，讓我帶您更詳細地了解每項業務的表現。從電子商務開始。 Shopee 本季實現了強勁的 GMV 和訂單量成長，在亞洲市場保持了強勁的市場領導地位。用戶成長依然強勁，第三季平均每月活躍買家年增超過 20%。

We have improved our monetization in both commission and advertising take rate this quarter. On commissions, further market rationalization in Southeast Asia has led to industry-wide increases in commission take rate.

本季我們在佣金和廣告收入方面都提高了貨幣化水準。在佣金方面，東南亞市場的進一步合理化導致全行業佣金率的上升。

On advertising, our ad tech improvements attracted more sellers to our paid ad features. We simplified seller on-boarding, optimize the algorithm for traffic allocation and introduced a dashboard, making it easier for sellers to set their ad spend and ROI target. This helped our sellers both see the benefits of their ad spend and achieve better returns on it, driving up adoption of our ad offerings.

在廣告方面，我們的廣告科技改進吸引了更多賣家使用我們的付費廣告功能。我們簡化了賣家入職流程，優化了流量分配演算法，並引入了儀表板，讓賣家可以更輕鬆地設定廣告支出和投資報酬率目標。這幫助我們的賣家看到了廣告支出的好處並獲得了更好的回報，從而推動了我們廣告產品的採用。

Third quarter, ad-paying sellers increased by over 10% and ad-paying revenue per seller increased by over 25% year on year. Compared to the same quarter last year, Shopee's ad rate has improved by more than 30 basis points, and we see much more upside here.

第三季度，廣告付費賣家數量較去年同期成長超過10%，每位賣家的廣告付費收入較去年同期成長超過25%。與去年同期相比，Shopee 的廣告費率提高了 30 個基點以上，我們看到了更多的上升空間。

On the operations front, we remain committed to the same three priorities to deepen our competitive mode, enhancing our price competitiveness, improving our service quality and strengthening our content ecosystem. Price competitiveness continues to be a key value proposition that we bring to Shopee users. It is a strong anchor of our brand mind share among buyers.

在營運方面，我們仍然致力於深化我們的競爭模式、增強我們的價格競爭力、提高我們的服務品質和加強我們的內容生態系統的三個優先事項。價格競爭力仍然是我們為 Shopee 用戶帶來的關鍵價值主張。它是我們品牌在買家心目中的重要支柱。

In a recent survey conducted by [Portrait], Shopee received the highest score among e-commerce platforms for good product prices in our Asia market and Brazil. On service quality, investing in end-to-end logistics integration across our logistics partners has given us a vital and structural advantage over our peers.

在[Portrait]最近進行的一項調查中，Shopee在我們的亞洲市場和巴西的產品價格方面獲得了電商平台中最高的分數。在服務品質方面，對物流合作夥伴之間的端到端物流整合的投資使我們比同行擁有重要的結構性優勢。

Our buyers are happy with the cost savings we pass on to them and the better customer service we are able to provide. Our sellers also appreciated as we give them access to one-stop logistics solutions that are both reliable and cost-effective efficient.

我們的買家對我們為他們節省的成本以及我們能夠提供的更好的客戶服務感到滿意。我們的賣家也很感激我們為他們提供了可靠且具有成本效益的一站式物流解決方案。

SPX Express in particular continues to be a key differentiating factor for us. It has become a leading logistics service provider in our market with extensive coverage, faster delivery speeds and cost leadership. In the third quarter, half of SPX Express orders in Asia were delivered within two days of order placements. Cost per order also continued to improve quarter on quarter in both Asia and Brazil.

尤其是 SPX Express 仍然是我們的關鍵差異化因素。它已成為我們市場上覆蓋範圍廣、交貨速度更快、成本領先的領先物流服務提供者。第三季度，SPX Express 在亞洲的一半訂單在下單後兩天內交付。亞洲和巴西的每份訂單成本也持續較上季改善。

We have also made significant progress on the content ecosystem. Live streaming continues to be a popular format on both the supply and the demand side in our market. Our division in the second half of last year to invest in building Shopee's live streaming capability has paid off.

我們在內容生態系統方面也取得了重大進展。直播仍然是我們市場供需雙方的流行形式。我們部門去年下半年投資建立Shopee的直播能力已經得到了回報。

In the third quarter, our average daily unique streamers grew over 50% and the daily unique live streaming buyers grew over 15%, both quarter-on-quarter. Average basket size on winning has consistently increased over the past few quarters, driving improvements in its unit economics.

第三季度，我們的日均獨立主播數量較上季成長超過 50%，每日獨立直播買家數量較上季成長超過 15%。過去幾個季度，獲勝的平均籃子大小持續增加，推動了單位經濟效益的改善。

Our content effort has been particularly successful in Indonesia, our largest market in Asia. We have been the largest live streaming e-commerce platform there by both GMV and order volumes since the start of 2024, and our unit economics has improved steadily since then.

我們的內容工作在亞洲最大的市場印尼尤其成功。自 2024 年初以來，我們一直是 GMV 和訂單量最大的直播電商平台，自那時以來，我們的單位經濟效益穩步提高。

One recent boost to our content efforts has been a new collaboration between Shopee and YouTube in Indonesia. YouTube creators can now embed clickable buttons in their video that allows viewers to buy items from Shopee directly. We have just brought this collaboration to Thailand and Vietnam as well and look forward to extending this strategic partnership into more markets.

Shopee 和 YouTube 在印尼的新合作是我們內容工作的最新推動力之一。 YouTube 創作者現在可以在他們的影片中嵌入可點擊的按鈕，讓觀眾可以直接從 Shopee 購買商品。我們剛剛將這種合作帶到了泰國和越南，並期待將這種戰略夥伴關係擴展到更多市場。

Looking beyond Asia, we are also seeing good results coming out of Brazil. In the third quarter, average monthly active buyers grew by close to 40% year on year. We are encouraged to see that this new user cohorts are purchasing eager basket sizes than older cohorts, giving us better returns on investments and improving our unit economics. This allowed us to break even in Brazil on an adjusted EBITDA basis the first time ever.

放眼亞洲以外，我們也看到巴西取得了良好的表現。第三季平均每月活躍買家年增近40%。我們很高興地看到，這些新用戶群體比舊用戶群體更渴望購買一籃子的商品，這為我們帶來了更好的投資回報並改善了我們的單位經濟效益。這使我們在巴西首次實現了調整後 EBITDA 的收支平衡。

Despite only having been in the market for less than five years, Shopee recently received recognition as the best shopping site in the Folha Top of Mind Award, which recognized brands with the best mind share among consumers in Brazil. We feel very excited about Shopee's further growth opportunities there.

儘管進入市場不到五年，Shopee 最近在 Folha Top of Mind 大獎中被評為最佳購物網站，該獎項旨在表彰在巴西消費者心目中佔有率最高的品牌。我們對 Shopee 在那裡的進一步成長機會感到非常興奮。

In summary, I'm very happy with the strength that Shopee continues to show in both Asia and Brazil. Many of our markets still have very low e-commerce penetration rate. This puts us in a great position to continue to grow as e-commerce penetration improve.

總而言之，我對 Shopee 在亞洲和巴西繼續展現的實力感到非常高興。我們的許多市場的電子商務滲透率仍然很低。隨著電子商務滲透率的提高，這使我們處於繼續成長的有利位置。

Next, turning to digital financial services. We continued our strong momentum this quarter, delivering double-digit year-on-year growth in both revenue and EBITDA. Our key driver of growth continues to be credit lending which is in high demand, but still very underserved in our market.

接下來，轉向數位金融服務。本季我們持續保持強勁勢頭，營收和 EBITDA 均實現兩位數年成長。我們成長的主要驅動力仍然是信貸借貸，信貸借貸的需求量很大，但我們的市場服務仍然不足。

Shopee's user base in our market makes it highly efficient for us to acquire and serve credit users. Proprietary data from Shopee also allows us to better underwrite risk. In addition, we have diversified funding sources such as innovative asset-backed lending products and our digital banks in local markets that give us success to retail deposits. All of this has led us to scale up our credit business very quickly and profitably.

Shopee 在我們市場上的用戶基礎使我們能夠有效地獲取和服務信用用戶。 Shopee 的專有數據也使我們能夠更好地承保風險。此外，我們擁有多元化的資金來源，例如創新的資產支持貸款產品和本地市場的數位銀行，這使我們在零售存款方面取得了成功。所有這些使我們能夠快速擴大信貸業務並實現盈利。

In the third quarter, our loan book grew over 70% year-on-year, and we added 4 million first-time borrowers. Our consumer and SME loans active users reached about 24 million by the end of the quarter, growing more than 60% year on year. Despite high growth, our NPL 90-day ratio held stable in the third quarter at 1.2%.

第三季度，我們的貸款規模年增超過70%，新增首次借款人400萬人。截至本季末，我們的消費和中小企業貸款活躍用戶達到約2,400萬，年成長超過60%。儘管成長迅速，第三季我們的不良貸款 90 天比率仍穩定在 1.2%。

One of our risk management practices is to gradually increase loan size and tenure offerings to users. We typically engage first-time borrowers by offering SPayLater products with small credit limit and short tenure on their shop purchases.

我們的風險管理實踐之一是逐步增加向用戶提供的貸款規模和期限。我們通常透過向首次借款人提供信用額度較小且期限較短的 SPayLater 產品來吸引首次借款人的商店購物。

If the users show a healthy repayment track record, we offer them a higher credit limit, longer tenure options and other credit products, such as cash loans. This practice underpins our sustainable healthy growth.

如果使用者表現出良好的還款記錄，我們會為他們提供更高的信用額度、更長的期限選擇和其他信貸產品，例如現金貸款。這種做法支撐著我們永續健康成長。

Right now, our average loans outstanding per user is less than $200 with tenure period of just a few months. These loans are spread over a very large user base across different markets. Recently, we have been pushing off shop loan book growth more strongly, especially in Indonesia.

目前，我們每個用戶的平均未償還貸款不到 200 美元，期限只有幾個月。這些貸款分佈在不同市場的龐大用戶群。最近，我們一直在更強勁地推動商店貸款帳面成長，尤其是在印尼。

Off Shopee loans now account for more than half of our loan book there. One recent example of an off-shopping use case was to facilitate consumer large ticket purchases of in offline retail stores. In this case, we offer select users as they later limit extra credit products with higher credit limit. This initiative was very well received by our users. We will continue to explore further use cases in Indonesia and bring this success to our other markets.

Off Shopee 貸款現在占我們貸款總額的一半以上。最近的一個線下購物用例的例子是促進消費者在線下零售商店進行大額購買。在這種情況下，我們會向特定用戶提供，因為他們隨後會限制具有更高信用額度的額外信用產品。這項舉措受到了我們用戶的熱烈歡迎。我們將繼續在印尼探索更多用例，並將這一成功帶到我們的其他市場。

In summary, we see plenty of growth opportunities ahead in our market. Strong synergies with Shopee gives us a unique advantage and use cases beyond hockey are also very compelling. We are well positioned to grow our credit business and offer more financial services to address the huge, underserved demand in our markets.

總而言之，我們看到市場未來存在大量成長機會。與 Shopee 的強大協同效應為我們帶來了獨特的優勢，曲棍球之外的用例也非常引人注目。我們有能力發展信貸業務並提供更多金融服務，以滿足市場中巨大的、服務不足的需求。

Finally, turning to our digital entertainment business. Garena's strong growth has continued into the third quarter. Total bookings grew over 24%, and adjusted EBITDA grew over 34% year on year. This good performance is driven by the strength of Free Fire, which continues to be one of the largest mobile games in the world.

最後，轉向我們的數位娛樂業務。 Garena 的強勁成長一直持續到第三季。總預訂量較去年同期成長超過 24%，調整後 EBITDA 年成長超過 34%。這種良好的表現得益於《Free Fire》的實力，它仍然是世界上最大的手機遊戲之一。

Free Fire consistently had over 100 million daily active users in the third quarter, representing an impressive 25% year-on-year growth. In addition to Asia and the Americas, we were happy to see meaningful growth in other regions, such as North Africa over the past year. We view this region as a sizable untapped opportunity and has been ramping up both in-game campaigns and all top game events in this market.

第三季度，Free Fire 的每日活躍用戶持續超過 1 億，較去年同期成長 25%，令人印象深刻。除了亞洲和美洲之外，我們很高興看到其他地區（例如北非）在過去一年中實現了有意義的成長。我們認為該地區是一個巨大的未開發機會，並且一直在加強該市場的遊戲內活動和所有頂級遊戲活動。

Recently, we had a major e-sport tournament in Morocco, where thousands of teams participated, attracting millions of views on social media. We believe it was the largest attending off-line mobile game event ever held in North Africa. Our top priorities for Free Fire continue to be attracting, retaining and engaging our users.

最近，我們在摩洛哥舉辦了一場大型電競錦標賽，有數千支隊伍參加，在社群媒體上吸引了數百萬人的觀看。我們相信這是北非有史以來舉辦的規模最大的離線手機遊戲盛會。我們對 Free Fire 的首要任務仍然是吸引、留住和吸引我們的用戶。

In the third quarter, Sensor Tower once again ranked the Free Fire as the number one most downloaded mobile game in the world. The number of users who downloaded and played Free Fire in the third quarter was up 25% year on year. User engagement has also remained high. And while we always try to keep ARPU at a healthy level, we saw an increase this quarter, thanks to strong item sales during our anniversary campaign update.

第三季度，Sensor Tower 再次將《Free Fire》評為全球下載量第一的手遊。第三季下載並玩《Free Fire》的用戶數量年增25%。用戶參與度也保持在較高水準。雖然我們始終努力將 ARPU 保持在健康的水平，但由於週年紀念活動更新期間的強勁商品銷售，我們在本季度看到了成長。

It is quite remarkable that a game of Free Fire's [Vintage] is able to grow its user base so steadily, and I believe this has a lot to do with our relentlessly user-centric approach. We make sure to release new content updates and in-game experiences very frequently, keeping things fresh even for seasoned gamers. Many of these updates are inspired by our local markets and social media trends.

《Free Fire》的《Vintage》一款遊戲能夠如此穩定地增長用戶基礎，這是非常了不起的，我相信這與我們堅持以用戶為中心的做法有很大關係。我們確保經常發布新的內容更新和遊戲內體驗，即使對於經驗豐富的遊戲玩家也能保持新鮮感。其中許多更新的靈感來自我們當地的市場和社交媒體趨勢。

In October, Free Fire was the first online game in the world to collaborate with the Zoological Park Organization of Thailand to bring their hugely popular baby pygmy hippo, Moo Deng, into the game. Our users love the hippo virtual items that we introduced in Free Fire.

10 月，《Free Fire》成為世界上第一款與泰國動物園組織合作的線上遊戲，將他們廣受歡迎的侏儒河馬寶寶 Moo Deng 引入遊戲中。我們的用戶喜歡我們在 Free Fire 中引入的河馬虛擬物品。

The shared user generated content on social media that went viral using more than 10 million views. This is just one example of how we leverage local trends to connect with users at an emotional level, making them feel that Free Fire is relevant and interesting. It also keeps Free Fire highly visible on social media, helping to join new users.

共享用戶在社群媒體上產生的內容被病毒式傳播，瀏覽量超過 1000 萬次。這只是我們如何利用當地趨勢在情感層面與使用者建立聯繫的一個例子，讓他們覺得《Free Fire》是相關且有趣的。它還使 Free Fire 在社交媒體上保持高度曝光，有助於吸引新用戶。

Beyond Free Fire, Garena launched Need for Speed Mobile in Taiwan, Hong Kong, and Macau at the end of October. Since its launch, it has ranked as the number one most downloaded racing game in all three markets according to Sensor Tower.

除了 Free Fire 之外，Garena 於 10 月底在台灣、香港和澳門推出了《Need for Speed Mobile》。根據 Sensor Tower 的數據，自推出以來，它已成為所有三個市場中下載量第一的賽車遊戲。

We are also strengthening our partnership with Tencent to bring Delta Force, a first-person technical shooting game, to PC and mobile users in several markets across Southeast Asia, MENA and Latin America.

我們也加強與騰訊的合作關係，將第一人稱技術射擊遊戲 Delta Force 帶給東南亞、中東和北非和拉丁美洲多個市場的 PC 和行動用戶。

To conclude, I'm happy that we delivered a very strong quarter with all three of our businesses posting high profitable growth. We have done well, and we will continue doing so. Thank you, as always, for your support.

總而言之，我很高興我們實現了非常強勁的季度，我們的所有三個業務都實現了高利潤成長。我們已經做得很好了，我們將繼續這樣做。一如既往地感謝您的支持。

With that, I invite Tony to discuss our financials.

接下來，我邀請托尼討論我們的財務狀況。

Thank you, Forrest, and thank you to everyone for joining the call. For Sea overall, total GAAP revenue increased 31% year on year to $4.3 billion in the third quarter of 2024. This was primarily driven by GMV growth of our e-commerce business and the growth of our digital financial services business. Our total adjusted EBITDA was $521 million in the third quarter of 2024 compared to an adjusted EBITDA of $35 million in the third quarter of 2023.

謝謝你，福雷斯特，也謝謝大家加入這通通話。對於 Sea 整體而言，2024 年第三季 GAAP 總營收年增 31%，達到 43 億美元。 2024 年第三季調整後 EBITDA 總額為 5.21 億美元，而 2023 年第三季調整後 EBITDA 為 3,500 萬美元。

On e-commerce, Shopee's gross orders grew 24% and GMV increased by 25% year on year. Our third quarter GAAP revenue of $3.2 billion included GAAP marketplace revenue of $2.8 billion, up 43% year-on-year, and GAAP product revenue of $0.4 billion.

電商方面，Shopee總訂單量較去年同期成長24%，GMV較去年同期成長25%。我們第三季的 GAAP 營收為 32 億美元，其中 GAAP 市場營收為 28 億美元，年增 43%，GAAP 產品營收為 4 億美元。

Within GAAP marketplace revenue, core marketplace revenue, mainly consisting of transaction-based fees and advertising revenues was $2 billion, up 49% year on year. Value-added services revenue, mainly consisting of revenues related to logistics services was $0.8 billion, up 29% year on year.

在 GAAP 市場收入中，核心市場收入（主要包括以交易為基礎的費用和廣告收入）為 20 億美元，較去年同期成長 49%。加值服務收入（主要包括物流服務相關收入）為8億美元，較去年同期成長29%。

E-commerce adjusted EBITDA was $34 million in the third quarter of 2024 compared to an adjusted EBITDA loss of $336 million in the third quarter of 2023. For our Asian market, we continued to achieve positive adjusted EBITDA following our second quarter of 2024 results, recording $31 million during the quarter, compared to an adjusted EBITDA loss of $306 million in the third quarter of 2023.

2024 年第三季電子商務調整後 EBITDA 為 3,400 萬美元，而 2023 年第三季調整後 EBITDA 虧損為 3.36 億美元。本季虧損3,100 萬美元，而2023 年第三季調整後EBITDA 虧損為3.06 億美元。

In our other markets, we achieved positive adjusted EBITDA of $4 million compared to an adjusted EBITDA loss of $40 million in the third quarter of 2023. Digital financial services gap revenue was up by 38% year-on-year to $616 million. Adjusted EBITDA was up by 13% year on year to $188 million.

在我們的其他市場，我們實現了 400 萬美元的調整後 EBITDA 正值，而 2023 年第三季調整後 EBITDA 虧損為 4000 萬美元。調整後 EBITDA 年成長 13%，達到 1.88 億美元。

As of the end of September, our consumer and SME loans principal outstanding reached $4.6 billion, up 73% year-on-year. This consists of $3.8 billion on book and $0.8 billion of book loans principal outstanding. Nonperforming loans past due by more than 90 days as a percentage of total consumer and SME loans was 1.2% at the end of the quarter.

截至9月底，我們的消費和中小企業貸款本金餘額達到46億美元，年增73%。其中包括 38 億美元的帳面貸款本金和 8 億美元的未償還帳面貸款本金。截至本季末，逾期超過 90 天的不良貸款佔消費和中小企業貸款總額的百分比為 1.2%。

Digital entertainment bookings were $557 million, up 24% year on year. GAAP revenue was $498 million. Adjusted EBITDA was $314 million. Returning to our consolidated numbers. We recognized a net nonoperating income of $50 million in the third quarter of 2024 compared to a net nonoperating income of $46 million in the third quarter of 2023.

數位娛樂預訂額為 5.57 億美元，年增 24%。 GAAP 收入為 4.98 億美元。調整後 EBITDA 為 3.14 億美元。回到我們的綜合數字。我們確認 2024 年第三季的非營業收入淨額為 5,000 萬美元，而 2023 年第三季的非營業收入淨額為 4,600 萬美元。

We had a net income tax expense of $93 million in the third quarter of 2024 compared to net income tax expense of $62 million in the third quarter of 2023. As a result, net income was $153 million in the third quarter of 2024 as compared to a net loss of $144 million in the third quarter of 2023.

我們2024 年第三季的淨利為9,300 萬美元，而2023 年第三季的淨利為6,200 萬美元。淨利為1.53 億美元。

Thank you, Forrest and Tony. We're now ready to open the call to questions. Operator?

謝謝你們，福雷斯特和托尼。我們現在準備開始提問。操作員？

(Operator Instructions) Pang Vitt, Goldman Sachs.

（操作員指令）Pang Vitt，高盛。

Congratulations for the solid set of results. Two questions from me, both will be on e-commerce. Number one, could you provide us with more insight into the latest competitive landscape in the fourth quarter that you see currently?

祝賀取得了一系列可靠的結果。我的兩個問題都與電子商務有關。第一，您能否為我們提供有關您目前看到的第四季度最新競爭格局的更多見解？

We noticed that your social commerce competitor has been increasing its take rate, while we also noticed that the cross-border competitor expanded its presence in the region. So could you provide some comments around how this impacts your growth projections on both top and bottom lines, and how do you think about the overall strategy? That's question number one.

我們注意到您的社群商務競爭對手一直在提高其接受率，同時我們也注意到跨境競爭對手擴大了其在該地區的影響力。那麼，您能否就這如何影響您的營收和利潤成長預測提供一些評論，以及您如何看待整體策略？這是第一個問題。

Question number two, it will be related to the advertisement. Can you provide renewed -- we do notice that there's been a nice uptick, 30 basis points quarter on quarter in terms of that advertisement take rate. But what have you done exactly and differently that allow us to see this progress? Can you also share the insight on the potential ceiling for this ad take rate and the timeline for the ramp up process?

第二個問題，與廣告有關。您能否更新一下——我們確實注意到，廣告投放率季度環比增長了 30 個基點。但是您做了哪些具體和不同的事情讓我們看到了這一進展？您能否分享一下有關此廣告投放率的潛在上限以及提升過程的時間表的見解？

I think on the competitive landscape, as far as mentioned in the opening, we do see a stable competitive landscape. And in fact, if you look at our growth, our growth has been doing quite well, while we are improving our EBITDA to be possible in both Asia and Brazil.

我認為在競爭格局上，正如開頭所提到的，我們確實看到了穩定的競爭格局。事實上，如果你看看我們的成長，我們的成長表現相當好，同時我們正在提高我們的 EBITDA，以便在亞洲和巴西實現這一目標。

If you look at Q4, we do see our Q4 is doing quite well still with all the competitive environment that we are in, and we're maintaining our mid-20s GMV growth guidance for this year. As we shared before, majority of our sellers are local products, selling our local market. As a consequence, the impact from cross-border competitor probably relatively small to us at this stage.

如果你看看第四季度，我們確實看到，在我們所處的所有競爭環境中，第四季度的表現仍然相當好，並且我們維持了今年 20 年代中期的 GMV 成長指引。正如我們之前分享的，我們的大多數賣家都是本地產品，銷售我們本地市場。因此，現階段跨國競爭對手對我們的影響可能相對較小。

If we look at the ads take rate, there is a meaningful improvement of ad take rate. If you compare to the last year same quarter, we grew about 0.3% take rates on the ad side. We have done many things, actually, over the past few quarters. We did a sizable revamp to our ad system from a technical perspective.

如果我們看一下廣告投放率，就會發現廣告投放率有了顯著的提升。如果與去年同季度相比，我們的廣告方面的轉換率成長了約 0.3%。事實上，在過去的幾個季度裡，我們做了很多事情。我們從技術角度對廣告系統進行了相當大的改造。

Part of the take rate comes from the algorithm improvement to improve how well we can place as to a particular user's query. By doing that, we have a better conversion rate for our ad as a consequence that we can deliver better return investment to the sellers. We also tried to improve our traffic utilization algorithm for the ad so that we can have more flexibility in terms of when to display our organic ads versus display ad products to the buyers.

部分採用率來自演算法改進，以提高我們針對特定使用者的查詢的定位能力。透過這樣做，我們的廣告轉換率更高，因此我們可以為賣家提供更好的投資回報。我們也嘗試改進廣告的流量利用演算法，以便我們在向買家展示有機廣告和展示廣告產品的時間方面擁有更大的靈活性。

On top of that, we also improved the buyer -- sorry, the seller side ad product experience to make the sellers easier to utilize ad products. As a consequence, we can see that more and more sellers are using our ad products, which in turn, increased the pool of their products that we have in the app, which also help us in the end of the day to improve our ad efficiencies. Because the bigger pool that we have, the easier we can match to our user queries.

除此之外，我們也改善了買家——抱歉，賣家方的廣告產品體驗，讓賣家更容易使用廣告商品。因此，我們可以看到越來越多的賣家正在使用我們的廣告產品，這反過來又增加了我們應用程式中的產品池，這最終也幫助我們提高了廣告效率。因為我們擁有的池越大，我們就越容易匹配用戶查詢。

We believe that the potential of the ad product improvement is going to continue in the next few quarters. I think it's too early to comment on what the potential ceiling would be. I think the improvement will come in, and we will see the impact in the coming quarters while we are further improving our technology, rolling out new products to the sellers and also rolling out the improvement to all markets across our countries.

我們相信，廣告產品改進的潛力將在未來幾季持續存在。我認為現在評論潛在的上限還為時過早。我認為改進將會出現，我們將在未來幾季看到影響，同時我們將進一步改進我們的技術，向賣家推出新產品，並將改進推廣到我們國家的所有市場。

Alicia Yap, Citigroup.

艾莉西亞葉 (Alicia Yap)，花旗集團。

Hi. Good evening, management. Thanks for taking my questions. Also, congrats on the strong results. I have follow-up questions related to e-commerce. How should we be thinking about the shopping pools entering 2025, especially given a lower interest rate environment and also the resilient economic growth in Southeast Asia?

你好。晚上好，管理層。感謝您回答我的問題。另外，祝賀我們取得了優異的成績。我有與電子商務相關的後續問題。我們應該如何看待進入 2025 年的購物池，特別是考慮到較低的利率環境以及東南亞經濟成長的彈性？

Related to that, do you anticipate more intensified competition in Southeast Asia and also Brazil as we head into 2025? If so, how would management balance the market share growth for shopping versus profitability? If the competition picks up, we recently observed that Temu in Vietnam has been gaining pretty good traction, even though they just launched recently. Any comments would be appreciated. Thank you

與此相關的是，隨著我們進入 2025 年，您預計東南亞和巴西的競爭會更加激烈嗎？如果是這樣，管理層將如何平衡購物的市場份額成長與獲利能力？如果競爭加劇，我們最近觀察到越南的 Temu 已經獲得了相當好的吸引力，儘管他們最近才推出。任何意見將不勝感激。謝謝

I think it's probably a bit too early to comment on the 2025. So I think we're still monitoring the trend in Q4, and we probably will provide better guidance in 2024 in the coming quarter.

我認為現在對 2025 年發表評論可能有點太早了。

But in general, the way we think about this is, number one, we would like to make sure we can grow in a possible fashion. Number two is we think the profitable range, we would like to grow as much as possible. I think that's kind of probably how we think about it in terms of when we come into the next few quarters, in terms of competition, as I mentioned earlier, we are seeing a relatively stable competitive environment in South Asia.

但總的來說，我們思考這個問題的方式是，第一，我們希望確保我們能夠以可能的方式成長。第二是我們認為的獲利範圍，我們希望盡可能地成長。我認為這可能是我們在進入未來幾季時的思考方式，就競爭而言，正如我之前提到的，我們在南亞看到了相對穩定的競爭環境。

In Brazil, we didn't see any changes in the competitive environment, either. As you mentioned, we do see certain players coming to our market through a cross-border business, given that cross-border has been a relatively small part of our businesses, and we believe that cross-border has been a small part of the overall market as well.

在巴西，我們也沒有看到競爭環境有任何變化。正如您所提到的，我們確實看到某些參與者透過跨境業務進入我們的市場，因為跨境業務在我們業務中所佔的比例相對較小，而且我們認為跨境業務只佔整體業務的一小部分。

So the impact to us will be best limited. Even you look at those cross-border products that those places offering, if you compare the pricing for those products to our product in the platform, we still see a restively good pricing competitive advantage in our platform.

所以對我們的影響最好是有限的。即使你看看那些地方提供的那些跨國產品，如果你將這些產品的定價與我們平台上的產品進行比較，我們仍然看到我們平台上具有相當好的定價競爭優勢。

So in that sense that unless there's a dramatic change on the price competitors from these players, we don't see that it will impact buyers' preference on how they purchase our platform too much.

因此，從這個意義上說，除非這些參與者的價格競爭對手發生巨大變化，否則我們認為這不會對買家購買我們平台的偏好產生太大影響。

John Choi, Daiwa.

約翰·崔，大和。

Okay. Congratulations on a solid set of results. I have two questions here. First of all, on the first question, what's the latest percentage of our orders handled by SPX in Asia and Brazil? I think you've noticed that we have started to reduce the shipping subsidies, and what is the near-term key driver for reducing the logistics cost per order? And what is our target going forward?

好的。恭喜您取得了一系列紮實的成果。我在這裡有兩個問題。首先，關於第一個問題，SPX在亞洲和巴西處理的訂單最新比例是多少？我想您已經注意到我們已經開始減少運費補貼，近期降低每筆訂單物流成本的關鍵驅動因素是什麼？我們未來的目標是什麼？

And my second question is about your unique economics. I think if you look at our live streaming, unique economics for live streaming versus our peers in the long term, what is our merchant feedback after Shopee raised the take rate and the timeline of our further increase in this area? Thank you.

我的第二個問題是關於你們獨特的經濟學。我想，如果你從長遠來看，我們的直播與同行相比，直播的獨特經濟性，在Shopee提高了接受率之後，我們的商家反饋是什麼，以及我們在這一領域進一步增加的時間表？謝謝。

On the SPX, as we mentioned, that we are increasing the SPX coverage and also how much percent that SPX deliver to Shopee platform.

關於 SPX，正如我們所提到的，我們正在增加 SPX 的覆蓋範圍以及 SPX 向 Shopee 平台交付的百分比。

In general, if you look at Asia, we have probably more than 50% and in Brazil, more than 70%, and this continued to grow, we believe, in the next few quarters. And -- but not only increasing the coverage, we are also working hard on both reducing the cost and increasing liquidity. More than half of orders delivered within two days now in Asia.

總的來說，如果你看看亞洲，我們可能超過 50%，而巴西則超過 70%，我們相信，在接下來的幾個季度，這一比例將繼續增長。而且，我們不僅在增加覆蓋範圍，還在努力降低成本和增加流動性。目前，亞洲超過一半的訂單在兩天內交付。

The key thing that we are doing to reduce the cost for SPX coming from all different parts of the value chain. For example, if you look at the first miles, we are working hard to match the costs between how well we can pick up the products from the sellers and how well sellers can prepare for their products. And that involves part of the seller management, part of the fleet management from our side.

我們正在做的關鍵事情是降低來自價值鏈各個不同部分的 SPX 成本。例如，如果你看一下最初的里程，我們正在努力匹配我們從賣家那裡提貨的程度和賣家為他們的產品做好準備的程度之間的成本。這涉及到賣家管理的一部分，以及我們這邊車隊管理的一部分。

If you look at the sorting centers, we're increasing the percentage of automations in our sorting centers and also the way that we manage the workers in our sorting center to make sure that the compensation has a closer linkage to the productivity. If you look at line haul, we're spending quite a lot of effort on improving how well we can utilize the line haul to make sure all the trucks are better utilized than it was before.

如果你看看分類中心，我們正在提高分類中心的自動化百分比，以及我們管理分類中心工人的方式，以確保薪資與生產力有更緊密的聯繫。如果您看看長途運輸，我們會花費大量精力來提高長途運輸的利用率，以確保所有卡車都比以前得到更好的利用。

Another thing, as you can imagine, the last mile is very important for our logistics management we are innovating on different formats of last mile hubs that we have. In the more remote area, we have more mobile last mile hubs than the more fixed last mile hubs that we usually have.

另一件事，正如你可以想像的，最後一英里對於我們的物流管理非常重要，我們正在對我們擁有的不同格式的最後一英里樞紐進行創新。在更偏遠的地區，我們擁有比通常擁有的更固定的最後一英里中心更多的移動最後一英里中心。

We're also using technology to improve how many orders one rider can deliver in the last mile by helping them to sequence the package a lot more efficiently and also helping them to figure out the route a lot more efficiently based on the traffic patents and based on the user behaviors.

我們還利用技術來提高騎士在最後一英里可以交付的訂單數量，幫助他們更有效地對包裹進行排序，並幫助他們根據交通專利和基礎數據更有效地確定路線。

Yes, again, it's probably not only one thing. There is across all the end-to-end value chain that we have for the logistics. In terms of the live stream on economics, the -- our live stream order percentage, if you look at the penetration to our platform as a percentage of orders has increased slightly quarter-to-quarter, and our unit economics has been improved meaningfully quarter to quarter, actually probably across all our markets.

是的，再說一次，這可能不只是一件事。我們的物流涵蓋整個端到端價值鏈。就直播經濟而言，如果您查看我們平台的滲透率（訂單百分比），我們的直播訂單百分比逐季度略有增加，並且我們的單位經濟效益在本季度得到了顯著改善到季度，實際上可能遍及我們所有的市場。

The -- as we shared before, we do believe that large team economics will continue to improve over the time. And in the long term, it will probably be similar to the platform economics in terms of if you come to -- if you compare to others for live streams, we generally have relatively good economics.

正如我們之前分享的，我們確實相信隨著時間的推移，大型團隊的經濟效益將繼續改善。從長遠來看，它可能與平台經濟學類似，如果你與其他直播串流進行比較，我們通常具有相對較好的經濟學。

For the take rate increase, we don't have a fixed timeline in terms of the take rate increase. I think we spent a lot of effort trying to balance our seller ecosystem to make sure that whenever we increase the take rate, we are delivering more value to our ecosystem partners. So it's something we will continue to evaluate and hear the feedback from access before we conduct any adjustment.

對於採取率的提高，我們沒有固定的採取率提高的時間表。我認為我們花了很多努力來平衡我們的賣家生態系統，以確保每當我們提高接受率時，我們都能為我們的生態系統合作夥伴提供更多價值。因此，在進行任何調整之前，我們將繼續評估並聽取訪問的回饋。

Thomas Chong, Jefferies.

托馬斯莊，杰弗里斯。

Hi, good evening. Thanks, management, for taking my questions. I have two questions. My first question is about the gaming business. Can management comment about pre-buyer life cycle and any new games to be expected coming soon? My second question is on the e-commerce side. Can management provide some updates about the logistics investment spending and its impact on EBITDA margin in coming quarters? Thank you.

嗨，晚上好。謝謝管理層回答我的問題。我有兩個問題。我的第一個問題是關於遊戲業務的。管理層能否評論一下預購買者的生命週期以及預計即將推出的任何新遊戲？我的第二個問題是關於電子商務方面的。管理層能否提供有關物流投資支出及其對未來幾季 EBITDA 利潤率影響的一些最新情況？謝謝。

Sure. Now for Free Fire, we are very excited to see that the growth is like, especially after like the challenge we face, some headwinds in terms of the like post-COVID situation.

當然。現在，對於《Free Fire》來說，我們非常高興看到其成長，尤其是在我們面臨挑戰之後，以及在新冠疫情之後的情況下遇到的一些阻力。

I think like we have been trying very, very hard in the past two years to continually improve the product through the very user-centric approach, and we start to see the payoff. We started with the great results like the beginning of this year and has been extending the trend for the -- pretty much for the whole year.

我認為過去兩年我們一直非常非常努力地透過以用戶為中心的方法不斷改進產品，我們開始看到回報。我們從今年年初的出色業績開始，並且一直在延續這一趨勢——幾乎全年。

And the Free Fire, in terms of the life cycle. I mean, as we always believe, Free Fire is more like a service and it's more like a platform instead of like a product. So from that perspective, we do have the ambition and the conviction to build up Free Fire as a nevergreen game and as an evergreen platform. And this is -- we see a very encouraged sign.

就生命週期而言，還有 Free Fire。我的意思是，正如我們始終相信的那樣，Free Fire 更像是一項服務，它更像是一個平台，而不是一個產品。所以從這個角度來看，我們確實有著雄心壯志和信念，將《Free Fire》打造成一款永不過時的遊戲和常青的平台。這是——我們看到了一個非常令人鼓舞的跡象。

And if you think about Free Fire has been a seven years, old game, and it's still like growing. And the new users coming into the game, the new user growth is even accelerated. So -- and from all those, we see the better engagement and we see the better retention. So from all those metrics, and it's a very, very strong sign that Free Fire is still at a very, very early stage.

如果你想想《Free Fire》已經是一款有七年歷史的老遊戲了，而且它仍然在成長。而新用戶進入遊戲，新用戶成長更是加速。因此，從所有這些中，我們看到了更好的參與度和更好的保留率。因此，從所有這些指標來看，這是一個非常非常強烈的跡象，顯示《Free Fire》仍處於非常非常早期的階段。

I think it gives us the confidence to continually grow the game through the engagement, through the better intention and through making the game, it's a more friendly experience for the new users. At the same time, to keep -- always keep the content fresh, local and to have a better engagement with the existing gamers as well.

我認為這讓我們有信心透過參與、透過更好的意圖以及透過製作遊戲來不斷發展遊戲，這對新用戶來說是一種更友善的體驗。同時，要始終保持內容新鮮、在地化，並與現有遊戲玩家更好地互動。

Rishabh Dhancholia, HSBC.

Rishabh Dhancholia，匯豐銀行。

Operator, please pause for a moment. The second question has not been answered yet. Give us a moment here.

接線員，請稍等一下。第二個問題還沒有答案。請給我們一點時間。

Regarding the second questions, regarding the question on the logistic investment. For our logistics businesses, it's rather more OPEC-driven rather than CapEx heavy driven businesses. The core capital investment is centered around our sorting machines and part of the improvement to the hub and to the sorting centers.

關於第二個問題，關於物流投資的問題。對於我們的物流業務來說，更多的是歐佩克驅動的業務，而不是資本支出驅動的業務。核心資本投資集中在我們的分類機以及樞紐和分類中心的部分改進。

So in that sense that it's relatively a smaller part of our overall spending to build our SPX businesses and is counted as part of the overall EBITDA as well. So we don't see that there will be a significant impact to the EBITDA margins from the -- from this perspective.

因此，從這個意義上說，它在我們建設 SPX 業務的總體支出中所佔的比例相對較小，並且也算是總體 EBITDA 的一部分。因此，從這個角度來看，我們認為 EBITDA 利潤率不會受到重大影響。

Rishabh Dhancholia, HSBC.

Rishabh Dhancholia，匯豐銀行。

So let's proceed for the next question. Divya Kothiyal, Morgan Stanley.

那麼讓我們繼續下一個問題。迪維亞·科蒂亞爾，摩根士丹利。

Yeah. Thank you very much. So my first question is just on the e-commerce business. Could you explain what's driven the 13% quarter-on-quarter growth in the sales and marketing expense? And if we look at it as a percentage of GMB as well, it's gone up slightly by about 10 basis points.

是的。非常感謝。我的第一個問題是關於電子商務業務的。您能否解釋一下是什麼推動了銷售和行銷費用較上季成長 13%？如果我們也將其視為 GMB 的百分比，它會小幅上升約 10 個基點。

Just if you can triangulate this, with your comments on competition being stable, when do we expect these sales and marketing expenses to start coming off and any outlook for next year on how to think about this number?

如果你能對這個問題進行三角測量，在你對競爭穩定的評論的情況下，我們預計這些銷售和行銷費用什麼時候開始減少，以及明年如何看待這個數字？

And the second question is on the DFS business. I mean, the general sense that we got on the DFS business is that the growth was being -- a more measured approach was being taken on the growth. But in this quarter, we've seen the growth actually accelerate quite a bit. Could you talk beyond Indonesia, you know, how the growth has really been panning out and what specific company initiatives have been taken to drive this growth? Thanks.

第二個問題是關於DFS業務。我的意思是，我們對 DFS 業務的普遍感覺是，正在採取一種更謹慎的方法來實現成長。但在本季度，我們看到成長實際上加快了很多。您能否談談印尼以外的情況，您知道，成長的實際情況如何，以及公司採取了哪些具體舉措來推動這種成長？謝謝。

For the first question, so typically, there are two things that might impact the sales and marketing growth, especially in Q3. I think one is if you look at our revenue growth, there is a meaningful growth on the revenue side as well. So in the way that we take a bit more from the seller side on the take rate. So typically, when we see that, we will spend a bit more to make sure that we compensate some of the seller take rate increase on our sales and marketing side. I think that's one.

對於第一個問題，通常有兩件事可能會影響銷售和行銷成長，尤其是在第三季。我認為，如果你看看我們的收入成長，你會發現收入方面也有有意義的成長。因此，我們從賣方收取更多的佣金。因此，通常情況下，當我們看到這種情況時，我們會多花一點錢，以確保我們補償銷售和行銷方面的一些賣方費用增加。我想那就是其中之一。

Second one is Q3. If you compare with Q2, Q3 is relatively more promotional season for e-commerce, where Q2 this year is more a lower season if you account the date. I think that's the two core drivers for the sales and marketing movement rather than a reaction to the competition side.

第二個是第三季。如果與第二季度相比，第三季相對來說是電商的促銷季，而今年的第二季度如果按日期算的話，則更多是淡季。我認為這是銷售和行銷運動的兩個核心驅動力，而不是對競爭方面的反應。

The -- on the second question regarding the digital financial service businesses. We are seeing growth not only in Indonesia, but also in the other markets. For example, we see relatively good growth in Thailand, Malaysia.

關於第二個問題，關於數位金融服務業務。我們不僅看到印尼的成長，還看到其他市場的成長。例如，我們看到泰國、馬來西亞的成長相對較好。

And also, we see early signs of well penetration in the Brazil market, where we started very late. We see meaningful penetration on Shopee from our SPayLater products. So part of the driver for the growth is that we penetrate more shopping users through various formats. So we can take more users to our digital financial service side. That's one.

此外，我們在巴西市場也看到了良好滲透的早期跡象，而我們在巴西市場的起步很晚。我們看到我們的 SPayLater 產品對 Shopee 產生了有意義的滲透。因此，成長的部分驅動力是我們透過各種形式滲透到更多的購物用戶。這樣我們就可以把更多的用戶帶到我們的數位金融服務端。這是一個。

Second one is we optimize our existing products to the users. For example, if you look at our both SPayLater and our cash loan products, we are doing a lot more risk-based pricing. We also provide a new type of products to target our more prime users. For example, we launched a term loan in Indonesia to target more prime users to make sure that we can address their needs as well.

第二個是我們向使用者優化現有的產品。例如，如果你看看我們的 SPayLater 和現金貸款產品，我們正在做更多基於風險的定價。我們還提供了一種新型產品來瞄準更多的主要用戶。例如，我們在印尼推出了一項定期貸款，以瞄準更多優質用戶，以確保我們也能滿足他們的需求。

On top of that, we also spent quite some effort to build user scenarios, new cases beyond the Shopee platform. For example, in Indonesia, as we shared in the opening that we rolled out the SPayLater for the off-line payment through the National QR code, the same initiative we have rollout in Philippines, in Malaysia as well.

除此之外，我們還花了相當多的精力來建立使用者場景，Shopee平台以外的新案例。例如，在印度尼西亞，正如我們在開場中分享的那樣，我們推出了 SPayLater，透過國家二維碼進行離線支付，我們在菲律賓和馬來西亞也推出了同樣的舉措。

We also rolled out the escalator for the specific use cases offline, like the cell phones and home appliance, et cetera. Some of this will continue in the next few quarters while we are expanding to more countries for those products and expand to more user cases. All those will help us to grow the digital financial services to a broader segment of users and penetrate to more use cases for those users.

我們還在線上下推出了針對特定用例的自動扶梯，例如手機和家用電器等。其中一些將在接下來的幾個季度繼續進行，同時我們將這些產品擴展到更多國家並擴展到更多用戶案例。所有這些都將幫助我們將數位金融服務擴展到更廣泛的用戶群體，並滲透到這些用戶的更多用例。

Rishabh Dhancholia, HSBC.

Rishabh Dhancholia，匯豐銀行。

Thank you for the opportunity. Two questions, please. What are your key priorities across each segment for 2025 and secondly, what are the initiatives undertaken in the DFS segment to drive user growth and penetration of various products and outlook for growth and margins in this segment, in the DFS segment?

謝謝你給我這個機會。請教兩個問題。到2025 年，您在每個細分市場的主要優先事項是什麼，其次，DFS 細分市場為推動用戶成長和各種產品的滲透而採取的舉措是什麼，以及該細分市場、DFS 細分市場的成長和利潤前景是什麼？

For the key priorities for 2025, overall we feel like the entire marketing itself is strong tailwind from the macroeconomic perspective and there is a very, very strong growth potential. I would say without jumping to very, very specific each business overall, we will still maintain a very, very strong growth mindset and so the growth will be the focus and so we have a very, very strong momentum at this moment.

對於 2025 年的關鍵優先事項，整體而言，我們認為從宏觀經濟角度來看，整個行銷本身就是強大的推動力，並且存在著非常非常強勁的成長潛力。我想說的是，在不涉及非常非常具體的每一項業務的情況下，我們仍然會保持非常非常強勁的成長心態，因此成長將成為焦點，因此我們目前擁有非常非常強勁的勢頭。

If you see all our three businesses on the very good growth trend at this moment, we hope this trend will continue into 2025 and meanwhile, as we mentioned, we also focus on the quality of the growth. And I think for all our three businesses we hope our three businesses are getting to the stage and with a strong foundation to deliver not only the high growth rate but the very profitable growth as well. So that will be in the very big picture in terms of the priority for 2025.

如果你現在看到我們所有的三家業務都處於非常好的成長趨勢，我們希望這種趨勢能夠持續到2025年，同時，正如我們所提到的，我們也專注於成長的品質。我認為，對於我們所有的三項業務，我們希望我們的三項業務能夠登上舞台，並擁有堅實的基礎，不僅能夠實現高成長率，而且能夠實現非常有利可圖的成長。因此，這將成為 2025 年優先事項的大局。

Yes, if you look at the CMS part of the businesses, as I shared just now in the previous questions, we are further penetrating to the Shopee user base. We are optimizing our product to cover more users in our ecosystem and also building more use cases outside of Shopee ecosystem to serve our users better.

是的，如果你看看業務的CMS部分，正如我剛才在前面的問題中分享的那樣，我們正在進一步滲透到Shopee用戶群。我們正在優化我們的產品，以涵蓋我們生態系統中的更多用戶，並在 Shopee 生態系統之外建立更多用例，以更好地為我們的用戶服務。

I think that all will contribute to the growth over next year, not only for Indonesia, but also for many other countries we have our financial service businesses in. We don't observe any particular trend in terms of the margin shift in this quarter or in the next few quarters.

我認為，所有這些都將有助於明年的成長，不僅是印度尼西亞，而且是我們擁有金融服務業務的許多其他國家。季度裡。

Ranjan Sharma, JPMorgan.

蘭詹夏爾馬，摩根大通。

Hi, good evening, and thank you for the presentation. Two questions from my side, firstly on e-commerce. Can you share your thoughts around how much profitable growth is left in Southeast Asia because we presume that the penetration of the major urban centers is already quite high in Southeast Asia. And the corollary to that is with you becoming profitable in Brazil, could Shopee look at further expansion out of Asia?

你好，晚上好，謝謝你的演講。我這邊有兩個問題，第一個是關於電子商務的。您能否分享一下您對東南亞還剩下多少利潤成長的看法，因為我們假設東南亞主要城市中心的滲透率已經相當高了。隨之而來的必然結果是，隨著您在巴西實現盈利，Shopee 是否會考慮進一步向亞洲以外擴張？

The second question is on your cash and investments, which are close to $10 billion now. How much capital do you need to keep on the balance sheet, or is there a case for you to return some money back to the shareholders? Thank you.

第二個問題是關於你的現金和投資，目前已經接近100億美元。您需要在資產負債表上保留多少資本，或者您是否有理由向股東返還一些資金？謝謝。

In terms of the e-commerce penetration, if we look at the current e-commerce penetration in our major markets, we still see there is quite a lot of room that we can grow if you benchmark that with more advanced e-commerce market.

就電子商務滲透率而言，如果我們看看目前主要市場的電子商務滲透率，如果以更先進的電子商務市場為基準，我們仍然會發現我們還有很大的成長空間。

So overall, if you look at the market in a top-down way, we do believe that there's still meaningful room to grow the e-commerce penetration even in the cities, like, for example, if you look at Indonesia, look at the Jakarta area versus Java versus outside of Java.

因此，總的來說，如果你以自上而下的方式看待市場，我們確實相信，即使在城市中，電子商務滲透率仍然有很大的成長空間，例如，如果你看看印度尼西亞，看看雅加達地區與爪哇島與爪哇島以外地區。

In the Java cities, in Jakarta, around Jakarta or in other Java cities, we do see that meaningful penetration potential will be. Part of that will be driven the cost of optimization that we are doing. For example, by further reducing the cost for our SPay deliveries, and part of that will come from a better experience of buying from e-commerce like the service improvement that we are working on.

在爪哇城市、雅加達、雅加達週邊或其他爪哇城市，我們確實看到了有意義的滲透潛力。其中一部分將由我們正在進行的最佳化成本驅動。例如，透過進一步降低我們的 SPay 交付成本，其中一部分將來自更好的電子商務購買體驗，例如我們正在努力的服務改進。

Part of that will be driven by natural progressions of the population, some of the younger population were getting slightly older, so they have better purchasing power. And some of the other users who don't use e-commerce before, they will try e-commerce and be more frequent purchaser over time. So in all, we do believe that there's a meaningful room in terms of the penetration.

部分原因是人口自然增長推動的，一些年輕人口的年齡稍大一些，因此他們有更好的購買力。而其他一些以前沒有使用過電子商務的用戶，隨著時間的推移，他們會嘗試電子商務並成為更頻繁的購買者。總而言之，我們確實相信在滲透率方面有有意義的空間。

For the expansion outside of Asia, our core market out of Asia is Brazil right now, which we do believe there is a huge potential there. In the near term, let's say, in the next, it's very hard to predict anything too long term. But in the near term, we don't have any particular plan besides what we have right now.

對於亞洲以外的擴張，我們目前亞洲以外的核心市場是巴西，我們相信那裡有巨大的潛力。在短期內，比如說在接下來的一段時間裡，很難預測任何太長期的事情。但在短期內，除了目前的計劃外，我們沒有任何具體計劃。

In terms of the co-location, like to start with creating value and maximizing value for our shareholders is always the things on top of our mind. So we remain very open-minded. And actually, we constantly look at all the opportunities and review all the options how to create better value, how to make value for our shareholders. I mean, definitely, buyback is one of the ways, there is other options as well.

在同地辦公方面，從創造價值入手，為股東創造價值最大化始終是我們首要考慮的事情。所以我們保持非常開放的態度。事實上，我們不斷地尋找所有的機會並審查所有的選擇，如何創造更好的價值，如何為我們的股東創造價值。我的意思是，回購肯定是其中一種方式，還有其他選擇。

I think when there's certain opportunity appears, we will come out of the plan, and we will communicate with the shareholders timely and accordingly.

我想當有一定的機會出現的時候，我們就會拿出這個計劃，我們會及時和股東進行相應的溝通。

Sachin Salgaonkar, BofA.

Sachin Salgaonkar，美國銀行。

Hi. Thank you for the opportunity and congrats on a good set of numbers. First question is on Brazil. Clearly, and congrats for achieving an EBITDA margin break even out here. How should we think about the margins going ahead? Should it continue to hover around these levels given the investments that are coming out here? Related question of course is how do you look at the credit business evolving in Brazil going ahead?

你好。感謝您給我這個機會，並祝賀您取得了一系列不錯的成績。第一個問題是關於巴西的。顯然，恭喜您實現了 EBITDA 利潤率盈虧平衡。我們該如何考慮未來的利潤率？考慮到這裡的投資，它是否應該繼續徘徊在這些水平附近？當然，相關問題是您如何看待巴西未來信貸業務的發展？

Second question is when you think about incremental investments now that all your businesses are EBITDA break even, where do you see maximum amount of investment being made? Is it more towards logistics? Is it more towards DFS or anything else?

第二個問題是，當您考慮增量投資時，既然您的所有業務都實現了 EBITDA 收支平衡，您認為最大的投資金額在哪裡？是不是更偏向物流？是更傾向於DFS還是其他？

If you look at the Brazil market, it's our newest market, and we've been very happy that we achieved EBITDA even in the market in this quarter. It's still a very dynamic market.

如果你看看巴西市場，它是我們最新的市場，我們很高興即使在本季的市場中也實現了 EBITDA。這仍然是一個非常活躍的市場。

But generally, we are hoping that we can further grow in the market with a possible manner, although there might be some fluctuation from time to time. But generally, I think we will look to use as a base for thinking. If you look at the credit businesses in Brazil, as I shared in the earlier questions, we started a few quarters ago, and we see very good penetration in Shopee through our SPayLater.

但總的來說，我們希望能夠以一種可能的方式在市場上進一步成長，儘管有時可能會出現一些波動。但總的來說，我認為我們會尋求將其作為思考的基礎。如果你看看巴西的信貸業務，正如我在前面的問題中分享的那樣，我們在幾個季度前開始，並透過我們的 SPayLater 在 Shopee 中看到了非常好的滲透率。

We also launched our cash loan product in Brazil with a very good take rate that we observed. More importantly, we are fencing our risk modeling in Brazil to a stage that we are a lot more comfortable with to grow further in the market. So generally, we are quite optimistic by the potential of our digital finance service business in Brazil in the coming quarters.

我們也在巴西推出了現金貸款產品，據我們觀察，其採用率非常高。更重要的是，我們正在將巴西的風險模型限制在一個我們更願意在市場上進一步發展的階段。因此總的來說，我們對未來幾季巴西數位金融服務業務的潛力相當樂觀。

And if you look at the investment to various businesses, we take a very prudent at for the investment. For example, if you look at any investment to logistics, we typically have a payback period, let's say, between 9 months to 36 months in the range. It typically can contribute to our EBITDA quite quickly through those investments by optimizing our cost structure.

如果你看看對各種業務的投資，我們對投資採取非常謹慎的態度。例如，如果您考慮對物流的任何投資，我們通常有一個投資回收期，比方說，在 9 個月到 36 個月的範圍內。透過優化我們的成本結構，它通常可以透過這些投資很快為我們的 EBITDA 做出貢獻。

If you look at the DFS side, DFS has generally been quite profitable businesses, as you can see from the numbers. The core investment for the DFS is probably on the user acquisition side to make sure we are attracting the right user to the platform. The way we look at it is we measure the profitability for each user we bring in to make sure that each user we bring in has a meaningful profit in the coming year.

如果你看看DFS方面，你可以從數字中看到，DFS通常是獲利相當可觀的業務。 DFS 的核心投資可能是在用戶獲取方面，以確保我們吸引合適的用戶到平台。我們看待這個問題的方式是衡量我們引入的每個用戶的獲利能力，以確保我們引入的每個用戶在未來一年都能獲得有意義的利潤。

The other type of investment, for example, on the e-commerce side, we do invest in acquiring new users as well. For that, we also take quite potent approach in terms of measuring each user's customer life cycle value against the cost to acquire the users.

另一種投資，例如在電商方面，我們也在獲取新用戶方面進行投資。為此，我們也採取了非常有效的方法來衡量每個使用者的客戶生命週期價值與獲取用戶的成本。

In most cases, the economics for those customer life cycle value will break even in a year's time in general, if you compare with the cost we spent on acquiring the users for most of the markets.

在大多數情況下，如果與我們為大多數市場獲取用戶所花費的成本進行比較，這些客戶生命週期價值的經濟效益通常會在一年內實現收支平衡。

Jiong Shao, Barclays.

邵炯，巴克萊銀行。

Thank you very much for taking my questions. Congrats on the very strong results. My first question is on the DFS business. You have made tremendous progress in this business over the last few quarters and your growth accelerated quite a bit this quarter both for revenue and for the loan book. I was wondering if you can impact that just talk about what are the main drivers for the next couple of years to grow this business? Is that regional expansion, product expansion, any key things for this business?

非常感謝您回答我的問題。祝賀取得了非常強勁的成果。我的第一個問題是關於DFS業務的。過去幾個季度，您在這項業務上取得了巨大進步，本季度收入和貸款帳簿的成長都大幅加快。我想知道您是否可以影響這一點，只是談談未來幾年發展這項業務的主要驅動力是什麼？區域擴張、產品擴張是該業務的關鍵嗎？

Second question is on the leverage in your e-commerce business model. Again, congrats for being profitable in Shopee again. For this business, is that sort of gradual improvement in profitability or once you reach certain scale, the leverage will just play itself out and the improvement in profits could be meaningful at times. Thank you.

第二個問題是關於您的電子商務業務模式的槓桿作用。再次恭喜Shopee再次獲利。對這個業務來說，是獲利能力逐漸提高，還是達到一定規模，槓桿作用就會發揮出來，利潤的提高有時可能是有意義的。謝謝。

So in terms of the digital finance service business, I think you're absolutely right that it's a business that we've been very happy with in terms of the growth. And if you look forward, the growth will essentially come from, number one, the user growth. We would like to more of our e-commerce users to our digital finance service users and over time attract our non-e-commerce users as well to become our digital finance service user in our platform. That's number one.

因此，就數位金融服務業務而言，我認為您說得完全正確，我們對這項業務的成長感到非常滿意。如果你展望未來，成長主要來自第一，用戶成長。我們希望更多的電子商務用戶成為我們的數位金融服務用戶，並隨著時間的推移吸引我們的非電子商務用戶成為我們平台上的數位金融服務用戶。這是第一名。

Number two is, of course, to essentially get more users to use our products, both from the existing products to optimize our offerings to different segment of users with the different risk profiles and also expanding our product assortment to address more management needs that the user might have across their life cycles. I think it's going to be both approach.

當然，第二點是從根本上讓更多的用戶使用我們的產品，既從現有產品出發，優化我們的產品，以適應具有不同風險狀況的不同細分用戶，也擴大我們的產品種類，以滿足使用者更多的管理需求。我認為這將是兩種方法。

The user growth plus the product operation, plus the product assortment additions for our users. The -- in terms of the country mix for DFS, I think we start with Indonesia. As I shared earlier, we see a very good growth in some other countries over the quarters. And I would expect the trend going to continue that the newer countries will benefit from the experience we learned from the earlier countries so that we are able to attract user more efficiently and also roll out products in a more targeted fashion.

用戶成長加上產品運營，加上為用戶增加的產品種類。就 DFS 的國家組合而言，我認為我們從印尼開始。正如我之前分享的，我們看到其他一些國家在這幾個季度出現了非常好的成長。我預計這一趨勢將持續下去，新的國家將受益於我們從早期國家學到的經驗，以便我們能夠更有效地吸引用戶，並以更有針對性的方式推出產品。

On the e-commerce profitability, I think it's probably both, whether it's a gradual improvement or potentially that is a big jump on profitability in a natural environment in a more stable environment without any external shocks, you will likely see a gradual improvement on the profitability as we grow our ecosystem and as we reduce the cost to serve our customers in our upstream, downstreams.

關於電商的獲利能力，我認為可能是兩者兼而有之，無論是逐步的改善，還是潛在的盈利能力的大幅躍升，在一個自然環境下，在一個更穩定的環境下，沒有任何外部衝擊，你可能會看到電子商務的逐步改善。

And we are also able to optimize our own operating expenses to serve the customers. For example, if you look at the customer service that we have, we have been growing orders quite a lot in the last few quarters, but we have managed it with the same amount of people, even small amount of people to serve those customers from our platform perspective.

我們也能夠優化自己的營運費用來服務客戶。例如，如果你看看我們的客戶服務，我們在過去幾個季度中的訂單量增長了很多，但我們用相同數量的人員來管理它，甚至是少量的人員來為這些客戶提供服務我們的平台視角。

So all those will contribute to a gradual improvement in profitability. But as the market becomes more stable over the years, there is a possibility that we see that is relatively sizable jobbing probabilities in future. I think, yes, to your question is that both possibilities, but the base case we're working on right now is that we're able to graduation gradually improve the profitabilities over the next few quarters.

因此，所有這些都將有助於盈利能力的逐步提高。但隨著市場多年來變得更加穩定，我們有可能看到未來相對較大的就業機會。我認為，是的，對於你的問題來說，這兩種可能性都有，但我們現在正在研究的基本情況是，我們能夠在未來幾季逐步提高獲利能力。

This concludes our question-and-answer session. I will now turn the call back over to Mr. M.C. Koh for closing remarks.

我們的問答環節到此結束。我現在將把電話轉回給 M.C. 先生。 Koh 致閉幕詞。

Thank you all for joining today's call. We look forward to speaking to all of you again next quarter.

感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。我們期待下季再次與大家交談。

The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

會議現已結束。感謝您參加今天的演講。您現在可以斷開連線。