Sea Ltd (SE) 2024 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good morning and good evening to all, and welcome to the Sea Limited First Quarter 2024 Results Conference Call. (Operator Instructions) And finally, I would like to advise all participants that this call is being recorded. Thank you. I'd now like to welcome Mr. M.C. Koh to begin the conference. Please go ahead.

大家早安、晚上好，歡迎參加 Sea Limited 2024 年第一季業績電話會議。 （操作員說明）最後，我想告知所有參與者，本次通話正在錄音。謝謝。現在我要歡迎 M.C. 先生。 Koh 宣布會議開始。請繼續。

Hello, everyone, and welcome to Sea's 2024 First Quarter Earnings Conference Call. I'm M.C., Sea's Investor Relations Director. On this call, we may make forward-looking statements which are inherently subject to risks and uncertainties and may not be realized in the future for various reasons, as stated in our press release. Also, this call includes a discussion of certain non-GAAP financial measures, such as adjusted EBITDA. We believe these measures can enhance our investors' understanding of the actual cash flows of our major businesses when used as a complement to our GAAP disclosures. For a discussion of the use of non-GAAP financial measures and reconciliation with the closest GAAP measures, please refer to the section on non-GAAP financial measures in our press release.

大家好，歡迎參加Sea 2024年第一季財報電話會議。我是 M.C.，Sea 的投資者關係總監。在這次電話會議中，我們可能會做出前瞻性陳述，這些陳述本身就存在風險和不確定性，並且可能由於各種原因在未來無法實現，如我們的新聞稿中所述。此外，本次電話會議也討論了某些非公認會計準則財務指標，例如調整後的 EBITDA。我們相信，這些措施可以增強投資者對我們主要業務實際現金流量的理解，作為我們公認會計準則揭露的補充。有關非 GAAP 財務指標的使用以及與最接近的 GAAP 指標的調整的討論，請參閱我們新聞稿中有關非 GAAP 財務指標的部分。

I have with me Sea's Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Forrest Li; President, Chris Feng; and Chief Financial Officer, Tony Hou. Our management will share strategy and business updates, operating highlights and financial performance for the first quarter 2024. This will be followed by a Q&A session, in which we welcome any questions you have. With that let me turn the call over to Forrest.

與我同行的有 Sea 董事長兼執行長 Forrest Li；總裁，克里斯·馮；和首席財務官托尼·侯。我們的管理層將分享 2024 年第一季的策略和業務更新、營運亮點和財務業績。接下來讓我把電話轉給福雷斯特。

Hello, everyone, and thank you for joining today's call. I'm pleased to share that we are kicking off 2024 with a strong quarter. All our 3 businesses have delivered solid growth with an improved profit profile.

大家好，感謝您參加今天的電話會議。我很高興地告訴大家，我們將以強勁的季度業績開啟 2024 年。我們的所有 3 項業務都實現了穩健成長，利潤狀況有所改善。

The macro environment in the past few years has been challenging. Many of you have been with us through this journey. Going through this period has made us leaner, fitter and savvier. While we will always face new challenges, we are now much more confident of our ability to weather headwinds well and adapt quickly to changing environments.

過去幾年的宏觀環境充滿挑戰。你們中的許多人與我們一起經歷了這段旅程。經歷這段時期，我們變得更瘦、更健康、更精明。雖然我們總是會面臨新的挑戰，但我們現在對自己抵禦逆風和快速適應不斷變化的環境的能力更加充滿信心。

With that, let me take you through each business performance. Starting with e-commerce. We are pleased to report that Shopee delivered strong growth this quarter, achieving its highest ever quarterly order GMV and revenue. In the first quarter, on a year-on-year basis, gross orders was up 57%, GMV was up 36% and revenue was up 33%. Unit economics has also improved. Our overall adjusted EBITDA loss narrowed to $22 million. And our Asian market achieved a positive adjusted EBITDA of $11 million this quarter.

接下來，讓我帶您了解每項業務績效。從電子商務開始。我們很高興地報告，Shopee 本季實現了強勁成長，實現了有史以來最高的季度訂單 GMV 和收入。第一季度，訂單總額較去年同期成長57%，GMV成長36%，營收成長33%。單位經濟效益也有所改善。我們調整後的 EBITDA 整體虧損收窄至 2,200 萬美元。我們的亞洲市場本季調整後 EBITDA 為 1,100 萬美元。

Shopee's operational priorities for 2024 continue to be enhancing our price competitiveness, strengthening our content ecosystem and improving service quality for our buyers. We are making good progress on all these fronts. On enhancing our price competitiveness, we continue to help sellers with upstream supply chain access to sell more easily on Shopee. On strengthening our content ecosystem, Shopee has become the largest live streaming e-commerce platform in Indonesia based on average daily live streaming order in the first quarter. Live streaming e-commerce unit economics also continued to improve quarter-on-quarter.

Shopee 2024 年的營運重點仍然是增強我們的價格競爭力、加強我們的內容生態系統以及提高為買家提供的服務品質。我們在所有這些方面都取得了良好進展。在增強價格競爭力方面，我們繼續幫助擁有上游供應鏈的賣家更輕鬆地在Shopee上銷售。在強化內容生態系統方面，Shopee已成為印尼第一季日均直播訂單量最大的直播電商平台。直播電商單位經濟效益也持續較上季改善。

On improving service quality for buyers, our integrated logistics capability has become a key differentiating factor of our service quality. We have put a lot of hard work into SPX Express. And today, it is one of the fastest and most intensive logistics operator in our market, quickly enhancing our customer experience. In the first quarter, above 70% of SPX Express orders in Asia were delivered within 3 days of order placement. And because of the scale we have achieved in our market, we have managed to steadily reduce its cost. SPX Express' cost per order decreased by 15% for Asia and 23% for Brazil year-on-year in the first quarter.

在提升買家服務品質方面，我們的綜合物流能力已成為我們服務品質的關鍵差異化因素。我們為 SPX Express 投入了大量的心血。如今，它已成為我們市場上速度最快、最密集的物流營運商之一，迅速提升了我們的客戶體驗。第一季度，亞洲 70% 以上的 SPX Express 訂單在下訂單後 3 天內交付。由於我們在市場上取得的規模，我們已經成功地穩步降低了成本。第一季度，SPX Express 在亞洲的每份訂單成本年減了 15%，在巴西的每份訂單成本較去年同期下降了 23%。

Having SPX Express in the Shopee ecosystem also allows us to efficiently roll out new features that benefit our buyers, such as the on-time guarantee program that we launched in Southeast Asia. This program provides a guaranteed delivery time for orders, and this certainty is well appreciated by our buyers. Another initiative we implemented is having Shopee directly manage the return and refund process. This has resulted in a 30% year-on-year increase in resolution time. In the first quarter, about 45% of cases were resolved within 1 day.

在 Shopee 生態系統中加入 SPX Express 也讓我們能夠有效地推出有利於買家的新功能，例如我們在東南亞推出的準時保證計畫。該計劃為訂單提供了保證的交貨時間，這種確定性受到了我們買家的高度讚賞。我們實施的另一項措施是讓 Shopee 直接管理退貨和退款流程。這使得解決時間比去年同期增加了 30%。第一季度，約45%的案件在1天內解決。

So taken together, these efforts increased operational efficiency, improve customer experience and reinforce Shopee's reputation as a reliable shopping destination. We will continue to push more on these operational priorities in the coming quarter and year. We expect these efforts to further differentiate Shopee from its competition and bring greater value to both our buyers and sellers.

總而言之，這些努力提高了營運效率，改善了客戶體驗，並鞏固了 Shopee 作為可靠購物目的地的聲譽。我們將在未來的季度和年度繼續推動這些營運重點。我們希望這些努力能進一步使 Shopee 從競爭對手中脫穎而出，並為我們的買家和賣家帶來更大的價值。

Next, turning to Digital Financial Services. We are pleased to report that SeaMoney has continued its strong growth momentum and profitability into 2024 while maintaining prudent risk management. Our efforts on user acquisition has produced significant growth in both user numbers and the loan book size. In the first quarter, our Digital Financial Services revenue grew 21%, and adjusted EBITDA grew 50% year-on-year. Consumer and SME loan active users, defined as those with loans outstanding by the end of the quarter, increased 42% year-on-year to more than 18 million this quarter. As of March 31, 2024, our consumer and SME loan principal outstanding reached $3.3 billion, up 29% year-on-year and up 5% quarter-on-quarter. Credit business is currently the primary driver of SeaMoney's revenue and profit growth. Our credit business benefits from Shopee's transaction model and user base.

接下來，轉向數位金融服務。我們很高興地報告，SeaMoney 在保持審慎的風險管理的同時，在 2024 年繼續保持強勁的成長勢頭和盈利能力。我們在用戶獲取方面的努力使用戶數量和貸款規模都顯著增長。第一季度，我們的數位金融服務收入成長 21%，調整後 EBITDA 年成長 50%。消費者和中小企業貸款活躍用戶（定義為截至本季末未償還貸款的用戶）本季年增 42%，達到 1,800 萬以上。截至2024年3月31日，我們的消費者和中小企業貸款本金餘額達到33億美元，年增29%，季增5%。信貸業務目前是SeaMoney收入和利潤成長的主要驅動力。我們的信用業務受益於Shopee的交易模式和用戶基礎。

In addition, we are also seeing strong growth in off-Shopee loans, which include cash loans and off-Shopee SPayLater consumption loans. By the end of the first quarter, off-Shopee loans accounted for over 40% of our total consumer and SME loans outstanding. Going forward, we see further upside to improve our off-Shopee penetration across different markets as we continue to grow.

此外，我們還看到 Shopee 外貸款的強勁成長，其中包括現金貸款和 Shopee SPayLater 消費貸款。截至第一季末，Shopee 外貸款占我們未償還消費和中小企業貸款總額的 40% 以上。展望未來，隨著我們的不斷發展，我們看到了進一步提高我們在不同市場的非 Shopee 滲透率的上升空間。

As we build up our credit business, we continue to maintain a prudent approach to risk management. We generally begin by granting low credit limit, short-tenured loans to users to build their credit history. For users with good track record, we gradually increase the credit limit, loan tenure and credit product offering. As we gain more users and more data, we continuously fine-tune the risk model for each market. This allows us to grow our business while maintaining good risk control. Nonperforming loans past due by more than 90 days as a percentage of total consumer and SME loans remained stable at 1.4%. We anticipate further growth for our Digital Financial Services business throughout the year. As we healthily grow our user base, we will be able to offer a broader set of financial services to meet our users' needs in the future.

在我們發展信貸業務的同時，我們繼續保持審慎的風險管理方法。我們通常會先向使用者提供低信用額度、短期貸款，以建立他們的信用記錄。對於記錄良好的用戶，我們逐步提高信用額度、貸款期限和信貸產品供應。隨著我們獲得更多用戶和更多數據，我們不斷微調每個市場的風險模型。這使我們能夠在保持良好風險控制的同時發展業務。逾期超過 90 天的不良貸款佔消費和中小企業貸款總額的比例穩定在 1.4%。我們預計全年數位金融服務業務將進一步成長。隨著我們用戶群的健康發展，我們未來將能夠提供更廣泛的金融服務來滿足用戶的需求。

Finally, turning to our Digital Entertainment business. We are pleased to share that Garena expects to positive growth, with bookings up 11% year-on-year. This was led by Free Fire's strong performance across markets. In the first quarter, Free Fire's average MAU increased 24% year-on-year. Our operational priorities for Free Fire will remain consistent in 2024, improving user acquisition, engagement and retention. We continue to introduce play modes, redesign features and launch new content at a high -- all at a high frequency, allowing Free Fire to sustain high player engagement with its huge user base.

最後，轉向我們的數位娛樂業務。我們很高興地告訴大家，Garena 預計將實現正成長，預訂量將年增 11%。這是由 Free Fire 在各市場的強勁表現帶動的。第一季度，Free Fire 的平均每月活躍用戶年增 24%。我們的 Free Fire 營運重點將在 2024 年保持一致，以提高用戶獲取、參與度和保留率。我們持續以高頻率推出遊戲模式、重新設計功能並推出新內容，讓《Free Fire》能夠以其龐大的用戶群維持高玩家參與度。

In January, we launched Chaos, a major version update allowing players to vote for key events in the game setting. This interactive feature has made Chaos highly successful. And in April, we launched the Mechadrake version update, allowing players to team up to combat a mechanical monster in addition to the Euro pVp gameplay. Our constant efforts to understand the users' needs, address key issues from a product perspective and frequently introduce fresh and exciting content are paying off. In its seventh year, Free Fire is still one of the largest mobile games in the world by user scale and remains highly effective in attracting new users. According to Sensor Tower, Free Fire was the most downloaded mobile game globally in the first quarter. Given this track record of being able to sustain and grow Free Fire's massive global user base, we are confident of building Free Fire into an evergreen franchise.

一月份，我們推出了 Chaos，這是一個重大版本更新，允許玩家對遊戲設定中的關鍵事件進行投票。這種互動功能使 Chaos 取得了巨大成功。 4 月份，我們推出了 Mechadrake 版本更新，除了歐洲 pVp 遊戲玩法外，還允許玩家組隊對抗機械怪物。我們不斷了解用戶需求、從產品角度解決關鍵問題、頻繁推出新鮮精彩內容的努力正在得到回報。進入第七年，《Free Fire》仍然是全球用戶規模最大的手機遊戲之一，並且在吸引新用戶方面仍然非常有效。據 Sensor Tower 稱，《Free Fire》是第一季全球下載次數最多的手機遊戲。鑑於能夠維持和發展 Free Fire 龐大的全球用戶群的記錄，我們有信心將 Free Fire 打造成常青的特許經營權。

To conclude, we have a clear road map for profitable growth. Our results in the first quarter have given us a strong start to 2024, and we are well on track to deliver our full year guidance. With that, I will invite Tony to discuss our financials.

總而言之，我們有一個清晰的獲利成長路線圖。第一季的業績為我們 2024 年帶來了良好的開端，我們有望實現全年指引。接下來，我將邀請托尼討論我們的財務狀況。

Thank you, Forrest, and thanks to everyone for joining the call. For Sea overall, total GAAP revenue increased 23% year-on-year to $3.7 billion. This was primarily driven by GMV growth of our e-commerce business and the growth of our credit business. Our total adjusted EBITDA was $401 million in the first quarter of 2024 compared to an adjusted EBITDA of $507 million in the first quarter of 2023.

謝謝你，福雷斯特，也謝謝大家加入電話會議。 Sea 整體 GAAP 總營收年增 23% 至 37 億美元。這主要是由我們的電子商務業務的 GMV 成長和信貸業務的成長所推動的。 2024 年第一季調整後 EBITDA 總額為 4.01 億美元，而 2023 年第一季調整後 EBITDA 為 5.07 億美元。

On e-commerce, our first quarter GAAP revenue of $2.7 billion included GAAP marketplace revenue of $2.4 billion, up 33% year-on-year, and GAAP product revenue of $0.3 billion. Within GAAP marketplace revenue, core marketplace revenue, mainly consisting of transaction-based fees and advertising revenues, was $1.7 billion, up 47% year-on-year. Value-added services revenue, mainly consisting of revenues related to logistics services, was $0.7 billion, up 8% year-on-year. E-commerce adjusted EBITDA loss was $22 million in the first quarter of 2024 compared to an adjusted EBITDA of $208 million in the first quarter of 2023. For our Asian markets, we had an adjusted EBITDA of $11 million during the quarter compared to an adjusted EBITDA of $276 million in the first quarter of 2023. In our other markets, the adjusted EBITDA loss was $33 million, narrowing meaningfully from last year, when losses were $68 million. Contribution margin loss per order in Brazil improved by nearly 88% year-on-year to reach negative $0.04.

在電子商務方面，我們第一季的 GAAP 營收為 27 億美元，其中 GAAP 市場營收為 24 億美元，年增 33%，GAAP 產品營收為 3 億美元。在 GAAP 市場收入中，核心市場收入（主要包括以交易為基礎的費用和廣告收入）為 17 億美元，較去年同期成長 47%。加值服務收入（主要包括物流服務相關收入）為7億美元，較去年同期成長8%。 2024 年第一季調整後EBITDA 損失為2,200 萬美元，而2023 年第一季調整後EBITDA 為2.08 億美元。萬美元。巴西每筆訂單邊際貢獻損失較去年同期改善近 88%，達到負 0.04 美元。

Digital Financial Services GAAP revenue was up by 21% year-on-year to $499 million. Adjusted EBITDA was up by 50% year-on-year to $149 million. Digital Entertainment bookings were $512 million. GAAP revenue was $458 million. Adjusted EBITDA was $292 million.

數位金融服務 GAAP 營收年增 21% 至 4.99 億美元。調整後 EBITDA 年成長 50% 至 1.49 億美元。數位娛樂預訂額為 5.12 億美元。 GAAP 收入為 4.58 億美元。調整後 EBITDA 為 2.92 億美元。

Returning to our consolidated numbers. We recognized a net nonoperating loss of $18 million in the first quarter of 2024 compared to a net nonoperating income of $23 million in the first quarter of 2023. We had a net income tax expense of $79 million in the first quarter of 2024 compared to net income tax expense of $62 million in the first quarter of 2023. As a result, net loss was $23 million in the first quarter of 2024 as compared to net income of $87 million in the first quarter of 2023.

回到我們的綜合數字。我們確認2024 年第一季的營業外淨虧損為1,800 萬美元，而2023 年第一季的營業外淨收入為2,300 萬美元。第一季的淨營業外收入為7,900 萬美元。為8700 萬美元。

Thank you, Forrest and Tony. We are now ready to open the call to questions. Operator?

謝謝你們，福雷斯特和托尼。我們現在準備開始提問。操作員？

(Operator Instructions) The first question comes from the line of Pang Vitt of Goldman Sachs.

（操作員說明） 第一個問題來自高盛的Pang Vitt。

Good morning, good evening management team, and congratulations for a solid set of results. Two questions from me. Number 1, how do you derive confidence that you will be able to drive sustainable growth, especially once you start to lower the subsidies and move towards profitability? If your competitors decide to turn more aggressive, is there a way for you to probably react towards that? That's question number one.

早安，晚上好，管理團隊，恭喜取得了一系列紮實的成果。我有兩個問題。第一，您如何獲得能夠推動永續成長的信心，特別是一旦您開始降低補貼並轉向獲利？如果您的競爭對手決定變得更加激進，您是否有辦法對此做出反應？這是第一個問題。

On number 2, on gaming, given a very strong first quarter trends and results, how are you seeing trends towards second quarter and rest of the year? Can you provide color on what exactly you have done in order to derive growth? And any thoughts on the run rate of margin going forward as well?

第二，在遊戲方面，鑑於第一季的趨勢和結果非常強勁，您如何看待第二季和今年剩餘時間的趨勢？您能否詳細說明您為實現成長到底做了什麼？對未來的保證金運行率有什麼想法嗎？

It's Chris here. I will take the first question on the e-commerce side. I think for us, the most important thing is to work on the long-term competitive mode for e-commerce. I think to us, as I shared in the previous call, is number one, that cost to serve to make sure that we can serve the transactions to our buyer and sellers in a lower cost. Number 2 is the price competition of the product to make sure that the price for the same product, our platform is always better than the other platforms. To do that we have to work closely with the sellers, especially upper the value chains, to ensure that we can offer the lower price to the buyer always.

克里斯在這裡。我從電子商務方面回答第一個問題。我認為對我們來說，最重要的是要致力於電商的長期競爭模式。我認為，正如我在上一次電話會議中分享的那樣，對我們來說，服務成本是第一位的，以確保我們能夠以較低的成本為買家和賣家提供交易服務。第二是產品的價格競爭，以確保相同的產品，我們平台的價格總是比其他平台更好。為此，我們必須與賣家密切合作，尤其是價值鏈上游的賣家，以確保我們始終能夠向買家提供較低的價格。

Number three is the quality of services. As far as I mentioned quite a few times, that this is what the key areas we're focusing on to improve not only the delivery services to our consumers, but also the return services and the customer service experiences, et cetera. I think all the 3 things will contribute to our long-term competitiveness for our e-commerce businesses. As long as we can do this well, we believe that we can deliver the better value to our buyer sellers so we can grow better than the market that we operate in.

第三是服務品質。據我多次提到，這是我們關注的關鍵領域，不僅要改善對消費者的送貨服務，還要改善退貨服務和客戶服務體驗等。我認為這三件事都將有助於我們電子商務業務的長期競爭力。只要我們能做好這一點，我們相信我們可以為買家賣家提供更好的價值，這樣我們就能比我們所在的市場成長得更好。

At the same time, if you look at in the past few months, we do observe the overall market is in a stable -- more stable situation regarding to the competition point that you mentioned. And if the competitor does get more aggressive, I think we have to evaluate exactly what they did and how they did it. We will look at market by market, category by category to evaluate what's the best response we have.

同時，如果你看看過去幾個月，我們確實觀察到整體市場處於穩定的狀態——就你提到的競爭點而言，情況更加穩定。如果競爭對手確實變得更加激進，我認為我們必須準確評估他們做了什麼以及如何做。我們將逐一市場、逐一類別地考察，以評估我們的最佳反應是什麼。

But all in all, in the long term, it's the 3 things I mentioned earlier, the long-term company mode will create value for our market, to our consumers and our sellers. And we do believe that as long as we do well on that, we should be to grow well regardless of what competitor does in the short term. I think that will bring us to a better position in the market over the years. Of course, there might be fluctuation in the short term, up and down, but it shouldn't change the long-term picture.

但總而言之，從長遠來看，就是我前面提到的三件事，長期的公司模式將為我們的市場、我們的消費者和我們的賣家創造價值。我們確實相信，只要我們在這方面做得好，無論競爭對手在短期內做什麼，我們都應該取得良好的成長。我認為這將使我們多年來在市場上處於更好的地位。當然，短期內可能會出現上下波動，但不會改變長期格局。

On the gaming side, we are very happy to see what we have achieved in the Q1, right? And it's a pretty strong result and a strong trend. And we see these trends continued in Q2 so far. And in general, we are pretty optimistic about the rest of the year. I think as we shared in the last quarter, right? We expected we're going to achieve, specific for Free Fire, the double-digit growth, right? For the whole year. And I think like the current growth and the trend is pretty much kind of a reflection of what -- not just what we have done in the past quarter and actually reflected what we have done in the past 2 years, right?

在遊戲方面，我們很高興看到我們在第一季取得的成就，對吧？這是一個相當強勁的結果和強勁的趨勢。我們看到這些趨勢在第二季度仍在繼續。總的來說，我們對今年剩餘時間非常樂觀。我想正如我們在上個季度分享的那樣，對嗎？我們預計我們將實現兩位數的成長，特別是《Free Fire》，對吧？全年。我認為當前的成長和趨勢很大程度上反映了我們在過去一個季度所做的事情，而且實際上反映了我們在過去兩年所做的事情，對嗎？

And we have gone through some challenges and faced some tremendous headwind, especially after COVID, right? And -- but I think like we always believe, okay, ambition and our aspiration is building Free Fire into an evergreen franchise. So with that kind of a fundamental belief, and we didn't kind of like a rush to monetizing the game way may kind of continue to go down until -- until it's completely gone. And we very, very much focused on all the user experience and try to fine-tune the product and to -- and with a very, very much user-centric approach, right? And in the past 2 years, we have been conducted a lot of study trip right on the surveys, right on to go to talk to the gamers, ask what they like and what they don't like about Free Fire, why they play and why do not play. And the tremendous development effort is also spent on continually fine-tune the game based on the feedback we've received.

我們經歷了一些挑戰並面臨一些巨大的阻力，尤其是在新冠疫情之後，對嗎？而且 - 但我認為我們始終相信，好吧，我們的雄心和願望是將《Free Fire》打造成一個常青的特許經營權。因此，有了這種基本信念，我們不希望急於將遊戲貨幣化，這種方式可能會繼續下降，直到完全消失。我們非常非常關注所有用戶體驗，並嘗試微調產品，並且採用非常非常以用戶為中心的方法，對嗎？在過去的兩年裡，我們進行了大量的調查研究，然後去與玩家交談，詢問他們喜歡《Free Fire》什麼，不喜歡什麼，為什麼玩《Free Fire》，以及為什麼不玩。我們也根據收到的回饋，投入了大量的開發工作來不斷調整遊戲。

I think that is kind of what we have seen now is an accumulated result through those 3 efforts. And another factor I want to mention is we kind of observed -- the whole market has gone through the post-COVID situation now after like almost 2 years of that period, and we've been kind of like the gamers, we kind of focus on the gameplay. As we shared before, like during the (inaudible), during the COVID time like a gamer used to play a lot of game, right? And there's not much other options for entertainment, and they kind of feel burned out. And that's why right after COVID, there's a tremendous kind of like trends, right? And the gamers start to focus on other entertainment.

我認為我們現在所看到的就是這三項努力的累積結果。我想提到的另一個因素是我們觀察到的——整個市場在經歷了差不多兩年的時間之後，現在已經經歷了新冠疫情之後的情況，我們有點像遊戲玩家，我們有點關注關於遊戲玩法。正如我們之前分享的，就像在（聽不清楚）新冠疫情期間，就像遊戲玩家玩很多遊戲一樣，對吧？而且沒有太多其他的娛樂選擇，他們感覺有點精疲力盡。這就是為什麼在新冠疫情之後，出現了類似的巨大趨勢，對嗎？遊戲玩家開始關注其他娛樂活動。

But after another 2 years, I think like now the whole gamer community globally, we see kind of that trend start to coming back and the gamers start kind of rejoined right at the gameplay basically for Free Fire. And this is a trend that not just happened specific in a single market and actually happened across all the markets, and we have the game operated. So in summary, I think like based on what has happened in the market and what we have done for Free Fire is pretty much a very, very good product market feed, right? And I think like we make Free Fire as an ideal product for gamers at the right timing when they are kind of -- have a strong appetite for -- to enjoy the gameplay. So we will do our best to continue this trend, right? And hopefully to continue to grow Free Fire, the user base and also the monetization part as well for the rest of the year.

但又過了兩年，我認為就像現在全球整個遊戲玩家社群一樣，我們看到這種趨勢開始回歸，玩家開始重新加入遊戲，基本上是為了《Free Fire》。這種趨勢不僅發生在單一市場上，而且實際上發生在所有市場上，而且我們已經經營了遊戲。總而言之，我認為根據市場上發生的情況以及我們為 Free Fire 所做的事情幾乎是一個非常非常好的產品市場回饋，對吧？我認為，當玩家有強烈的慾望享受遊戲樂趣時，我們會在適當的時機將《Free Fire》打造成一款理想的產品。所以我們會盡力延續這個趨勢，對吧？希望 Free Fire 在今年剩餘時間內能夠繼續擴大用戶群以及獲利部分。

Your next question comes from the line of Alicia Yap of Citigroup.

您的下一個問題來自花旗集團的 Alicia Yap。

I have a question related to Shopee. Just wondered, were you willing to return to loss-making to defend your share if the competition is indeed getting more aggressive? What other levers can you further pull to allow you to defend your share while also maintaining your profitability trend? And if we look at the commission take rate, excluding the advertising, how much more room can we actually still raise the commission take rate across different countries?

我有一個關於 Shopee 的問題。只是想知道，如果競爭確實變得更加激烈，你是否願意重新虧損捍衛自己的份額？您還可以進一步利用哪些其他槓桿來捍衛自己的份額，同時保持獲利趨勢？如果我們看看佣金率，不包括廣告，我們實際上還能提高不同國家的佣金率多少空間？

On the commission take rate, generally, we still see there is a meaningful room to increase the commission take rate, although probably not aggressive -- not as aggressive as last year in terms of increase. We also see there's a meaningful room on the ad take rate that we can look at. I think I shared this in the previous call as well that we believe that our ad take rate is still slightly lower than the peers that we see in other markets. So there is some meaningful room there.

就佣金率而言，總體而言，我們仍然認為佣金率還有很大的上升空間，儘管可能並不激進——增幅不如去年那麼激進。我們也發現廣告投放率還有很大的空間值得我們關注。我想我在之前的電話會議中也分享了這一點，我們相信我們的廣告投放率仍然略低於我們在其他市場看到的同行。所以那裡有一些有意義的空間。

And in terms of the competition, I think similar to the previous question that has been raised, the -- for us, the most important thing to focus on the long-term core competitiveness that cost us the price competitiveness, the service experience. And all those things will bring us a long-term advantage for us to outcompete the competitor in the market. In the short term, we have observed a more stable competition environment in the past few months. And if it changes, we will study it country by country, category by category. And evaluate what the best way to respond to that.

在競爭方面，我認為與先前提出的問題類似，對我們來說，最重要的是專注於長期的核心競爭力，而這讓我們失去了價格競爭力和服務體驗。所有這些都將為我們帶來長期優勢，使我們能夠在市場上擊敗競爭對手。短期來看，過去幾個月我們觀察到競爭環境更加穩定。如果發生變化，我們將逐一國家、逐一類別地進行研究。並評估對此做出反應的最佳方式是什麼。

Your next question comes from the line of Navin Killa from UBS.

您的下一個問題來自瑞銀集團 (UBS) 的 Navin Killa。

Actually I had a couple of questions. The first one was -- just trying to understand the strength in the GMV for e-commerce. How much of that is attributable to seasonality given the movement that we have seen around Lebaran this year? And therefore, I guess, in the context of that, I noticed that you haven't changed your GMV guidance of high single digit -- sorry, high teens growth. I'm just wondering how you think about that? And I guess the second question is on the logistics strategy. Clearly, we are starting to see some results. If you could share some numbers on the percentage of orders that are delivered on your own platform? And how do you see that number evolving in the medium to long term?

實際上我有幾個問題。第一個是——只是想了解電子商務的 GMV 實力。考慮到今年開齋節的走勢，其中有多少是季節性造成的？因此，我想，在這種情況下，我注意到你們沒有改變高個位數的 GMV 指導——抱歉，青少年的高成長。我只是想知道你對此有何看法？我想第二個問題是關於物流策略的。顯然，我們開始看到一些結果。您能否分享一些在您自己的平台上交付的訂單百分比的數字？您如何看待這個數字在中長期內的變化？

For the GMV, as Forrest said in the opening, in Q1, we did see very strong GMV growth. And part of that is contributing by the seasonality. This year, we have both Lunar New Year, and also the Ramadan falls into Q1. And the Ramadan holiday falls into Q2 versus the different patterns in the past few years. But we don't think that's the only reason. I think that's contributing part of reasons. Another part of the reason is that all the execution work we have done in the past few quarters start to give us benefits in terms of the top line growth and also the bottom line improvement impact is coming hand actually. The exact split, it's probably hard to really split that for -- in terms of both. But I do emphasize on that. It's not only seasonality, but also the hard work we have been doing are giving us the benefit on both the top line and bottom line.

對於 GMV，正如 Forrest 在開場白中所說，在第一季度，我們確實看到了非常強勁的 GMV 成長。其中一部分是季節性造成的。今年，我們既有農曆新年，也有齋戒月進入第一季。與過去幾年不同的模式，齋戒月假期屬於第二季。但我們認為這並不是唯一的原因。我認為這是部分原因。另一部分原因是，我們在過去幾季所做的所有執行工作開始為我們帶來收入成長的好處，而底線改善的影響實際上正在到來。確切的劃分，可能很難真正劃分——就兩者而言。但我確實強調這一點。這不僅是季節性的原因，而且我們一直以來的努力也為我們帶來了營收和利潤的雙贏。

For logistics, in Asia, we do deliver more than half of our orders through our own SPX Express. In Brazil, we probably have more than 70% now, and we will be looking at increasing the percentage over time. I think both will increase over time.

對於物流，在亞洲，我們超過一半的訂單是透過我們自己的 SPX Express 交付的。在巴西，我們現在可能超過 70%，我們將考慮隨著時間的推移增加這一比例。我認為兩者都會隨著時間的推移而增加。

Your next question comes from the line of Divya Kothiyal of Morgan Stanley.

你的下一個問題來自摩根士丹利的 Divya Kothiyal。

My first question is on the e-commerce business. Could you talk about the drivers for the 23% quarter-on-quarter reduction that we've seen in sales and marketing expense for this segment, especially with regards to where we are in terms of unit economics for live streaming e-commerce versus marketplace? And also if you can comment in which scenario do you think we can get back to the profitability levels of over 1% of GMV that we were able to achieve in the beginning of last year.

我的第一個問題是關於電子商務業務的。您能否談談我們看到該細分市場的銷售和行銷費用環比減少 23% 的驅動因素，特別是我們在直播電子商務與市場的單位經濟效益方面所處的位置？另外，您認為在哪種情況下我們可以恢復到去年初實現的 GMV 1% 以上的盈利水平。

My second question is on the DFS business. The marketing spends have remained elevated in this quarter. Could you talk about what parts of SeaMoney are these being allocated to? And what kind of traction you're seeing? And would it be fair to say that this segment's top line growth may actually deviate from the e-commerce growth going forward as you build new cases?

我的第二個問題是關於DFS業務的。本季的營銷支出仍然較高。您能談談這些被分配到 SeaMoney 的哪些部分嗎？您看到了什麼樣的吸引力？公平地說，當您建立新案例時，該細分市場的營收成長實際上可能會偏離未來的電子商務成長嗎？

Yes. On the e-commerce side of the questions. We do see a sizable reduction on the sales and marketing. The part of that is contributing that -- computing by the better UE from live stream that we see from Q4 to Q1. But part of that is also contributed to just general better performance in the marketplace in general. So for live streaming, there's a little bit of context on that, I think we do see our live stream volumes still growing in most of our markets. But the UE actually improved significantly for various markets. And in general, I think in the coming quarters, we will see similar patterns that our UE will continue to improve for live stream.

是的。關於電子商務方面的問題。我們確實看到銷售和行銷大幅減少。其中一部分是透過我們從第四季到第一季看到的即時串流中更好的 UE 進行計算。但這在某種程度上也有助於提高市場整體表現。因此，對於直播來說，有一些背景信息，我認為我們確實看到我們的直播量在大多數市場仍在增長。但對於各個市場來說，UE 實際上都有顯著改善。總的來說，我認為在接下來的幾個季度，我們將看到類似的模式，我們的 UE 將繼續改進直播。

In terms of the EBITDA for GMV, I think we will eventually go to that. I think that the number you mentioned 1%, I think that's a reasonable number to look at. And in long term, I think we shared that we believe that 2% to 3% is a meaningful number to look at.

就 GMV 的 EBITDA 而言，我認為我們最終會做到這一點。我認為你提到的1%這個數字是合理的數字。從長遠來看，我認為我們一致認為 2% 到 3% 是一個值得關注的有意義的數字。

I think just to add a little bit on the previous question that -- I make sure, I don't miss that. I think the question was on the guidance for the high-teen growth on the GMV for e-commerce. I think the number we see in Q1 has given us much stronger confidence in terms of achieving that, both the high single-digit GMV growth and even in the second half of the year. And we have been seeing a good trend in the latest markets as well. I think we will monitor the numbers. We will update the market when we see the through the quarter.

我想對上一個問題補充一點——我確定，我不會錯過這一點。我認為問題在於電子商務 GMV 的高青少年成長的指導。我認為我們在第一季看到的數字讓我們對實現這一目標更有信心，無論是高個位數的 GMV 成長，甚至是下半年。我們在最新市場也看到了良好的趨勢。我想我們會監控這些數字。當我們看到整個季度的情況時，我們將更新市場狀況。

I think there are many factors impacting the numbers. Part of that is just seasonality. Part of that is also in terms of the ForEx of the U.S. exchange rate, et cetera. But I think we will update the market when we see more numbers. Regarding the DFS, for DFS we do believe that still the last part of the DFS contributed by the credit businesses, I think, as we shared in the opening. If you look at the credit businesses at this point in time, still a sizeable part of that is contributed by the Shopee PayLater, which is growing together with the Shopee, although we do see better penetration over time within Shopee for Shopee PayLater. Besides Shopee PayLater, there's also many other use cases like buy cash loan, we call it BCL, which is not part of the Shopee payment system. It's a cash flow, you can take out to spend in any other places.

我認為影響數字的因素很多。其中一部分只是季節性。其中一部分也涉及美國匯率等。但我認為，當我們看到更多數字時，我們會更新市場情況。關於DFS，對於DFS，我們確實相信DFS的最後一部分仍然是由信貸業務貢獻的，我認為，正如我們在開場中分享的那樣。如果你看看目前的信貸業務，其中很大一部分仍然是由 Shopee PayLater 貢獻的，它與 Shopee 一起成長，儘管我們確實看到 Shopee PayLater 隨著時間的推移在 Shopee 中的滲透率有所提高。除了 Shopee PayLater 之外，還有許多其他用例，例如購買現金貸款，我們稱之為 BCL，它不屬於 Shopee 支付系統。這是一個現金流，你可以拿出來在任何其他地方花。

And also, we are increasing the use cases in other scenarios, for example, the off-line Shopee PayLater. You can -- for example, in (inaudible) you can scan a QR code. And using ShopeePay to scan a QR code and pay that with SPL, similar to a credit card experience. We also have handphone loans in reach as well, expanding to other markets. I think all those use cases will expand our financial businesses beyond the Shopee ecosystem.

另外，我們也在增加其他場景的使用案例，例如離線 Shopee PayLater。例如，您可以在（聽不清楚）中掃描二維碼。使用 ShopeePay 掃描二維碼並使用 SPL 進行支付，類似於信用卡體驗。我們也提供手機貸款，並擴展到其他市場。我認為所有這些用例都將把我們的金融業務擴展到 Shopee 生態系統之外。

In terms of the sales and marketing, I think our businesses has a fairly good margin, as you can see from the EBITDA. At the same time, our business is still in a very early stage. The penetration of Shopee is during the early stage, the cash loans during the early stage and many other use case have been in early stage. So we see there a huge potential there to grow over time. And in some quarters, we do see that there are good acquisition channels. In some quarters, we see a new product mix change because our new products coming out, et cetera. so there is an intention to acquire more users to our digital financial service ecosystem, given the very big unit economics we have seen so far. And the actual marketing spend depends a little bit on what we see on the customer acquisition cost and the UE we saw from the new users, plus the new products we are launching in different markets. It will fluctuate a little bit, just in practice.

在銷售和行銷方面，我認為我們的業務具有相當不錯的利潤率，正如您從 EBITDA 中看到的那樣。同時，我們的業務還處於非常早期的階段。 Shopee的滲透還處於早期階段，早期的現金貸款等許多用例都處於早期階段。因此，我們看到隨著時間的推移，那裡有巨大的成長潛力。在某些方面，我們確實看到有良好的收購管道。在某些季度，我們看到新產品組合發生變化，因為我們的新產品問世等等。因此，鑑於我們迄今為止所看到的巨大的單位經濟效益，我們有意為我們的數位金融服務生態系統吸引更多用戶。實際的行銷支出在一定程度上取決於我們所看到的客戶獲取成本和我們從新用戶看到的用戶體驗，以及我們在不同市場推出的新產品。只是在實踐中，它會略有波動。

Your next question comes from the line of Sachin Salgaonkar from Bank of America.

您的下一個問題來自美國銀行的 Sachin Salgaonkar。

Congrats on a good set of numbers. I have 2 questions. First question is on Shopee EBITDA. You already achieved EBITDA breakeven in Shopee for Southeast Asia. So should we think this is sustainable going ahead and we could see improvement in EBITDA out here? Or there was some seasonality factor specifically in this quarter, i.e., should we see some volatility in EBITDA or directly it should continue to improve?

恭喜您獲得了一組不錯的數字。我有 2 個問題。第一個問題是關於 Shopee EBITDA 的。您已經在東南亞 Shopee 實現了 EBITDA 盈虧平衡。那麼，我們是否應該認為這是可持續發展的，並且我們可以看到 EBITDA 的改善？或者本季存在一些季節性因素，即我們是否應該看到 EBITDA 出現一些波動，或者直接應該繼續改善？

And second question is on average revenue per user in the gaming business. We saw it be lower than the historical trends. So I just wanted to check anything specific happened in the quarter? Or is this a new trend going ahead?

第二個問題是遊戲業務中每個用戶的平均收入。我們看到它低於歷史趨勢。所以我只是想檢查一下本季發生的具體情況？還是這是未來的新趨勢？

Thank you. On the EBITDA side, it does contribute partially by the seasonality as well. Simply because in most of the market we are contribution margin positive. So we see a higher top line. It will help us on the EBITDA as well. The -- similar to the top line, we are observing the trend on how the market evolves during the quarter. I think we are about 1.5 months into the quarter. Our guidance, shared (inaudible) we are pretty confident of achieving that. And whether there is any changes to that, I think we will share with the market, yes.

謝謝。在 EBITDA 方面，季節性也確實有部分貢獻。只是因為在大多數市場中，我們的邊際貢獻率為正。所以我們看到了更高的收入。它也將對我們的 EBITDA 有所幫助。與頂線類似，我們正在觀察本季市場發展的趨勢。我認為本季已經過去 1.5 個月了。我們的指導，分享（聽不清楚），我們非常有信心實現這一目標。無論是否有任何變化，我認為我們都會與市場分享，是的。

For the game, I think that simply reflects we have a lot of new users to come to our game like specifically for Free Fire, right? And even like Free Fire has been in its seventh year, but we -- we very, very effectively attract new users. That's why we believe like the game can still go for a very, very long time. And when like we have the new gamers, new players come into the game and in general, I think like their kind of average spending is compared to the -- like more kind of like experience the gamers like who have played for longer time will be relatively low, right? And there is a really like the gamers will kind of play the game and the more they play, the better engagement then there is higher chance for the monetization. So I think that's -- there's nothing specifically about the monetization, it's kind of just reflect the fact that there is a very, very strong user growth for the game in the Q1.

對於這款遊戲，我認為這只是反映了我們有很多新用戶來到我們的遊戲，就像專門為《Free Fire》一樣，對吧？即使《Free Fire》已經進入第七年了，但我們非常非常有效地吸引了新用戶。這就是為什麼我們相信這款遊戲仍然可以持續非常非常長的時間。當我們有新玩家時，新玩家進入遊戲，總的來說，我認為他們的平均支出與玩了更長時間的玩家相比，更像是一種體驗。玩家確實會玩遊戲，玩的越多，參與度越高，貨幣化的機會就越高。所以我認為，沒有什麼具體關於貨幣化的內容，這只是反映了這樣一個事實，即第一季該遊戲的用戶成長非常非常強勁。

Your next question comes from the line of Piyush Choudhary from HSBC.

您的下一個問題來自匯豐銀行的 Piyush Choudhary。

And congratulations for a strong set of results. Two questions. Firstly, again, going back to 2024 guidance, after such strong performance, why -- like Shopee guidance of turning EBITDA positive in 2H has not been revised upwards? Do you expect volatility in the upcoming quarter? If you can comment on the competitive intensity in Indonesia, and across ASEAN after merger of TikTok and Tokopedia, like, has there been an increase in competition and thus you're keeping guidance unchanged? Any color over there will be helpful. That is the first question.

恭喜您取得了一系列強勁的成績。兩個問題。首先，再次回到2024年的指導，在如此強勁的表現之後，為什麼——像Shopee在2H中將EBITDA轉正的指導一樣沒有向上修正？您預計下一季會出現波動嗎？如果您可以評論一下 TikTok 和 Tokopedia 合併後印尼以及整個東協的競爭強度，例如，競爭是否有所增加，因此您保持指導不變？那裡的任何顏色都會有幫助。這是第一個問題。

Secondly, in DFS, is -- is it higher customer acquisition cost or even higher funding costs, which has led to margin drop? And if you can talk a little bit about the outlook for the margins in DFS?

其次，在DFS中，是否是更高的客戶獲取成本甚至更高的融資成本導致了利潤率下降？您能否談談 DFS 的利潤前景？

On the competition, we have seen the market has been relatively stable in terms of competition. We didn't see any similar signs of changes. To be honest, of course, we cannot predict what the competitors are doing, but we didn't see any particular signs of different competition.

在競爭方面，我們看到市場在競爭方面一直比較穩定。我們沒有看到任何類似的變化跡象。老實說，我們當然無法預測競爭對手在做什麼，但我們沒有看到任何不同競爭的特殊跡象。

On the guidance, again, I think we are very encouraged by the number we see in Q1. We are pretty confident on achieving what we shared. And I think we are coming to 1.5 months in Q2. I think we will look at the market a bit more. I think in the time when we have a better sense of the numbers, we will share with the market on how we look at the forward-looking guidance. There's no particular reason of that from competition or other reasons, yes.

在指導方面，我認為我們對第一季看到的數字感到非常鼓舞。我們對實現我們所分享的目標非常有信心。我認為第二季將達到 1.5 個月。我認為我們會更關注市場。我認為，當我們對數字有更好的了解時，我們將與市場分享我們如何看待前瞻性指引。是的，沒有什麼特別的原因是競爭或其他原因。

For the DFS question, the margin fluctuations more coming from the customer -- the acquisition costs rather than on the funding cost. In fact, our funding cost is actually getting better -- quarter-on-quarter. Again, the acquisition cost, a lot depending on what we see for the market and how much we spend on acquiring users versus the better they will bring to us in long term. And also depends on the new product launches we have in various markets.

對於DFS問題，利潤波動較多來自於顧客－購置成本而非融資成本。事實上，我們的融資成本實際上比上一季有所改善。同樣，獲取成本很大程度上取決於我們對市場的看法以及我們在獲取用戶上花費的金額以及他們長期為我們帶來的更好。也取決於我們在各個市場推出的新產品。

Your next question comes from the line of Ranjan Sharma from JPMorgan.

您的下一個問題來自摩根大通的 Ranjan Sharma。

Two questions, please. Firstly, on the sales and marketing expense, seems to have reduced to 2.9% of GMV for the e-commerce business. Based on your comments on competition, should we expect -- are you seeing the same level of spend in the second quarter as well? And the second question is on the fintech side. If you can shed some color on how much of the loan book is coming from Brazil or whether that will be our focus for the lending business given the strategy of some of your competitors in the market?

請教兩個問題。首先，在銷售和行銷費用方面，電子商務業務的 GMV 似乎已降至 2.9%。根據您對競爭的評論，我們是否應該預期 - 您是否也看到第二季的支出水平相同？第二個問題是金融科技方面的。您是否可以透露一下，有多少貸款簿來自巴西，或者考慮到您在市場上的一些競爭對手的策略，這是否將成為我們貸款業務的重點？

Yes. On the sales and marketing spend for e-commerce, we do see there is a reduction in Q1 by many different reasons. Part of that is due to the live streaming that the big investment done in the last -- in Q3 and Q4 last year start to give us the benefits. We don't need to expect so much part of that is general marketplace spending optimized. In the coming quarter, I believe that we'll continue to optimize our sales and marketing spending. And we do believe that the general trend will come down. Although, honestly, if you look at month-to-month, there will be some fluctuations even for our coming reasons of -- ForEx reasons, et cetera, yes.

是的。在電子商務的銷售和行銷支出方面，我們確實看到第一季因多種不同原因而減少。部分原因是去年第三季和第四季進行的大量投資開始為我們帶來好處。我們不需要期望其中有太多部分是針對一般市場支出進行最佳化的。在下個季度，我相信我們將繼續優化我們的銷售和行銷支出。我們確實相信整體趨勢將會下降。不過，老實說，如果你逐月查看，即使由於我們即將到來的原因——外匯原因等等，也會出現一些波動，是的。

For the loan book, we do have a high aspiration for Brazil. We do believe that Brazil can be a very good market for our digital financial service business. Although we only start Brazil mid-last year, which gives us a very short period of time to accumulate our loan book. So right now, the Brazil loan book is still, let's say, a relatively smaller share of our entire loan book businesses. I don't think we just closed the country-by-country split for the loan book. But yes, it's a small part of it, and it can be a potential good growth driver in future.

對於貸款簿，我們確實對巴西抱有很高的期望。我們確實相信巴西可以成為我們數位金融服務業務的一個非常好的市場。雖然我們去年年中才開始進入巴西，這給了我們很短的時間來累積我們的貸款。因此，目前巴西貸款業務在我們整個貸款業務中所佔的份額仍然相對較小。我不認為我們剛剛結束了貸款簿的國別分割。但是的，這只是其中的一小部分，它可能成為未來潛在的良好成長動力。

Your next question comes from the line of Jiong Shao of Barclays.

你的下一個問題來自巴克萊銀行的邵炯。

Congrats on the strong results. Two quick follow-ups on the e-commerce side. One is, I was wondering, could you talk about leading there in your improvement in unit economics throughout the quarter? And related to that, the percentage of live streaming in terms of the orders now. And that's I think that's the first question, which is why people are asking why Q2 is not a breakeven point for you.

祝賀取得強勁的成果。電子商務方面有兩個快速跟進。我想知道，一個問題是，您能否談談整個季度單位經濟效益的改善？與此相關的是，直播目前在訂單中所佔的比例。我認為這是第一個問題，這就是為什麼人們會問為什麼第二季對你來說不是損益平衡點。

And then I had a follow-up question on the Shopee Express SPX business. You talked about over 50% orders in Asia are done through Shopee Express and 70% in Brazil. Do you have like a target number for the percentage for orders fulfilled by Shopee Express and the unit economics or contribution margin for the orders done through SPX? Is that any different from your average or better or worse? Any information or color or data point will be very, very appreciated.

然後我有一個關於 Shopee Express SPX 業務的後續問題。您談到亞洲超過 50% 的訂單是透過 Shopee Express 完成的，而巴西則有 70% 的訂單是透過 Shopee Express 完成的。您是否有 Shopee Express 履行的訂單百分比的目標數字以及透過 SPX 完成的訂單的單位經濟效益或邊際貢獻？這與您的平均水平有什麼不同，或者更好或更差嗎？任何資訊、顏色或數據點都將非常非常感激。

For live streaming, in terms of the percentage of orders, it's stable versus last quarter. I think we share the percentage of around 15% in South Asia last quarter. I think is relatively stable. Although the bucket size increase during this quarter because we optimized some of the category mix and the UE. In terms of the driver for the UE improvement, as I shared earlier, it's both. The live streaming part of the improvement and general marketplace improvement. Actually, on top of that, things we talked about the logistics, we also see a better logistics costs improved over time, which drives down the cost as well fundamentally.

直播方面，從訂單佔比來看，與上季相比保持穩定。我認為上個季度我們在南亞的比例約為 15%。我覺得還是比較穩定的。儘管本季的儲存桶大小有所增加，因為我們優化了一些類別組合和使用者體驗。就 UE 改進的驅動因素而言，正如我之前分享的，兩者都是。直播部分的改進和整體市場的改進。實際上，除此之外，我們還看到物流成本隨著時間的推移而改善，這也從根本上降低了成本。

In terms of the percentage of the orders through our own logistics, I think each market might evolve slightly just, so we probably don't have a fixed target for all the markets. Although what we can say is largely in average, I think we'll see a bigger part of the share of logistics will go to our own SPX. It should be more than what we have right now. But we probably wouldn't set a very, very specific target for all the markets.

就透過我們自己的物流的訂單百分比而言，我認為每個市場可能會略有變化，所以我們可能沒有針對所有市場的固定目標。雖然我們能說的大部分是平均水平，但我認為我們將看到物流份額的更大一部分將流向我們自己的 SPX。它應該比我們現在擁有的更多。但我們可能不會為所有市場設定非常非常具體的目標。

In terms of the unit economics for those orders, given that our cost per order for our own SPX is lower than the cost per order for 3PL in the market, essentially for every order we deliver in-house, we will be able to save a part of that cost, which essentially contributed part of the unit economic improvement that you see here. I think the degree of the UE difference is slightly varies market by market, but I think the trend is pretty stable across most markets that we are able to improve this over time even further.

就這些訂單的單位經濟效益而言，考慮到我們自己的 SPX 的每個訂單成本低於市場上 3PL 的每個訂單成本，基本上對於我們內部交付的每個訂單，我們將能夠節省該成本的一部分，實質上貢獻了您在這裡看到的單位經濟改善的一部分。我認為 UE 差異的程度因市場而異，但我認為大多數市場的趨勢相當穩定，隨著時間的推移，我們能夠進一步改進這一點。

Your next question comes from the line of Pang Vitt from Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.

您的下一個問題來自高盛的 Pang Vitt。請繼續。

Thank you very much. And 2 follow-up questions from my side. Firstly, on the logistics for Shopee Express as well, you did share that you see a greater unit economics for Shopee Express versus 3PL. Can you explain or walk us through a little bit on how you've done it differently? And how are you able to achieve this better unit economics and efficiencies versus 3PL as well? That's question number one. Question number two, earlier, you have mentioned that there is still room for advertisement take rate, especially versus global peers for Shopee? Can you share off the current ad take rate you've seen currently for Shopee? And what's the long-term target on what Shopee can achieve?

非常感謝。我這邊還有兩個後續問題。首先，關於 Shopee Express 的物流，您確實表示，與 3PL 相比，Shopee Express 具有更大的單位經濟效益。您能否解釋一下或向我們介紹一下您是如何以不同的方式做到這一點的？與 3PL 相比，您如何實現更好的單位經濟效益和效率？這是第一個問題。第二個問題，剛才您提到廣告投放率還有空間，特別是與全球同業相比，Shopee 的廣告投放率還有提升空間嗎？能分享一下目前看到的 Shopee 廣告投放率嗎？ Shopee能實現的長期目標是什麼？

Yes. On the logistics front, there are a couple of reasons it drives better UE. I think, number one, is there's a margin actually that the 3PL takes. So we retained our margin, as simple as that, that's number one. Even if you take that out, I think we're still better for a few reasons. One is, we are able to better plan our CapEx over a long period of time because we are able to forecast how our business is evolving. Not only just the total volume, but the volume split in different regions, in different routes, et cetera. So this helps us to optimize our CapEx and our operating model for a long period of time. That's one.

是的。在物流方面，有幾個原因可以推動更好的使用者體驗。我認為，第一，3PL 實際上有一定的利潤空間。所以我們保留了利潤，就這麼簡單，這是第一名。即使你把它去掉，我認為我們仍然更好，有幾個原因。一是，我們能夠在很長一段時間內更好地規劃我們的資本支出，因為我們能夠預測我們的業務如何發展。不只是總成交量，還有不同地區、不同路線等方面的成交量劃分。因此，這有助於我們長期優化資本支出和營運模式。這是一個。

Second one is given that we have a good forecast, even in the short term on our order volume upstream, for example, in the next week, what our volume would be or in the next day what the volume will be. This will help us to do a lot of operation -- planning better. For example, how many workers you want to come in to work today versus tomorrow, and how many trucks you want to prepare for pickup tomorrow or 2 days later. I think this will essentially help us to improve on the day to day operating efficiency.

第二個是我們有一個很好的預測，即使是在短期內我們上游的訂單量，例如，下週我們的數量將是多少，或者第二天的數量將是多少。這將幫助我們做很多操作——更好地規劃。例如，您希望今天和明天有多少工人來上班，以及您希望為明天或 2 天後的取貨準備多少卡車。我認為這將從根本上幫助我們提高日常營運效率。

Number 3 is even beyond the planning, we are able to retool quite a lot of the seller behaviors to optimize for our logistics. For example, the way that we pick up from the sellers, when the seller should pack their product, whether the seller should drop off versus pickup and all those things, we can do quite an influence on the upstream to optimize for the downstream fulfillment.

第三點甚至超出了計劃，我們能夠重新調整相當多的賣家行為來優化我們的物流。例如，我們從賣家那裡取貨的方式、賣家何時應該包裝產品、賣家是否應該送貨還是取貨等等，我們可以對上游產生相當大的影響，以優化下游的履行。

And number 4 is, as a technology company, we do have a better tax capability in terms of how do we -- using technology to optimize our (inaudible) supply chain and all those tools, all those automations and all those forecasting models we built will help us to essentially have a better efficiency through the fulfillment network. I think number 4 is because we can work together with the marketplace side, we can roll out quite a lot of new services to the consumers. But when we roll out new services, we can control the cost because we can do many of the new service planning end-to-end, together with the marketplace upstream.

第四點是，作為一家科技公司，我們在如何使用技術來優化我們的（聽不清楚）供應鏈以及所有這些工具、所有這些自動化以及我們建立的所有預測模型方面確實擁有更好的納稅能力將幫助我們透過履行網路從本質上提高效率。我認為第四是因為我們可以與市場方面合作，我們可以向消費者推出許多新服務。但是，當我們推出新服務時，我們可以控製成本，因為我們可以與上游市場一起進行端到端的許多新服務規劃。

I think one example that in the opening we gave is the on-time guarantee deliveries. To do that -- I think everybody can do that. Theoretically, you can always give a voucher to the fact that if you deliver late night? But how do you do that economically is a big question. How do you make sure that you can have a good forecast of your delivery end-to-end from the buyer placed the order, to the seller pack the order, to the first mile pickup order to the sorting center, and to the mid mile, to the last mile.

我認為我們在開頭給出的一個例子是準時保證交貨。要做到這一點——我認為每個人都可以做到。理論上，如果你深夜送貨，你總是可以給一張代金券？但如何在經濟上做到這一點是一個大問題。如何確保您能夠對從買家下訂單、到賣家包裝訂單、到第一英里取貨訂單、到分揀中心、再到中途的整個交付過程有一個良好的預測，到最後一公里。

And the entire modeling process and the entire retooling sort of the seller behavior and associated behaviors that requires a lot more -- joint planning across the value chain. And because we can do it together, so we can do it more economically compared to if you work with the pure third parties. I think for all that reason putting together, we kind of are able to achieve better economics. And not only just the cost, but also better service levels, and differentiated services we can offer to the consumers in our market.

整個建模過程以及賣方行為和相關行為的整個重組需要更多 - 整個價值鏈的聯合規劃。因為我們可以一起做，所以與純粹的第三方合作相比，我們可以更經濟地做到這一點。我認為，基於所有這些原因，我們能夠實現更好的經濟效益。不僅是成本，我們還可以為市場上的消費者提供更好的服務水準和差異化服務。

Your next follow-up question comes from...

您的下一個後續問題來自...

And for the -- sorry, for the ad take rate, -- I don't think we just disclose the ad take rate actual number. But what we can share is that if you compare with our global peers, for example, in China or in the U.S., we are kind of like still meaningfully lower than where they are. We still have a few percentage to catch up to them. So there is meaningful room for us to increase the ad take rate. I think there are a few tools that we can deploy to do that. I think one is just having more seller presentation in terms of the -- to enhance the total pool of the skews they're utilizing the ad.

對於——抱歉，對於廣告佔用率——我認為我們不會只披露廣告佔用率的實際數字。但我們可以分享的是，如果你與我們的全球同行（例如中國或美國）進行比較，我們的水平仍然明顯低於他們。我們還有幾個百分點可以追上他們。因此，我們還有很大的空間來提高廣告投放率。我認為我們可以部署一些工具來做到這一點。我認為，只是有更多的賣家展示——以增強他們利用廣告的整體偏差。

In order to do that, we have to develop simpler ad products for the sellers to use. Unlike many of the sellers in multiple markets who are more familiar with the apps in our market, they have quite some sellers that left some with that. So we have to customize our app tool for those sellers to make sure that it's easier for them to adopt so they can -- so we can add more skews into our app pool. That's number 1.

為此，我們必須開發更簡單的廣告產品供賣家使用。與多個市場中的許多賣家更熟悉我們市場中的應用程式不同，他們有相當多的賣家留下了一些應用程式。因此，我們必須為這些賣家自訂我們的應用程式工具，以確保他們更容易採用，這樣我們就可以在我們的應用程式集區中添加更多的傾斜。那是1號。

Number 2 is to increase ad efficiencies through technology. We are spending quite lot of effort on making sure that we increase the conversion rates for our ad products, so the conversion ad, so we can actually serve more ad to our users because of increased conversion rate. And number 3 is to find a way to balance organic and add traffic better. So by having an enhanced product to balance the organic and ad products in a common frame, we can essentially dynamically adjust ad load. It depends on the conversion rate and the skew presentation and scenarios within our app. So by doing all the 3 things, we see that there is a meaningful potential to increase the ad take rate over the next few quarters.

第二是透過科技提高廣告效率。我們花費了大量的精力來確保提高廣告產品的轉換率，即轉換廣告，因此，由於轉換率的提高，我們實際上可以向用戶提供更多的廣告。第三點是找到一種方法來平衡自然並更好地增加流量。因此，透過擁有增強的產品來平衡通用框架中的有機產品和廣告產品，我們基本上可以動態調整廣告負載。這取決於我們應用程式中的轉換率以及傾斜呈現和場景。因此，透過完成這三件事，我們發現未來幾季的廣告投放率具有顯著的潛力。

The next follow-up question comes from Navin Killa from UBS.

下一個後續問題來自瑞銀集團 (UBS) 的 Navin Killa。

I just wanted to ask a question with regards to your cash, which obviously remains strong and continues to grow. I know several of your peers have started talking about buybacks and have even announced buybacks. What's your thinking on the use of the cash balance?

我只是想問一個關於您的現金的問題，您的現金顯然仍然強勁並且持續增長。我知道你們的一些同行已經開始談論回購，甚至宣布了回購。您對現金餘額的使用有何看法？

Yes. Thanks for the question. We currently don't have any sense on buybacks or any sort of thing. Our operation results are strong, and we are kind of quite confident on our outlook for each of the business lines and pretty much, we'll be focusing on these.

是的。謝謝你的提問。我們目前對回購或任何類似的事情沒有任何意義。我們的經營業績強勁，我們對每條業務線的前景都非常有信心，而且我們將重點放在這些業務線。

The next follow-up question comes from Alicia Yap from Citigroup.

下一個後續問題來自花旗集團的 Alicia Yap。

Two for me here. One is on the DFS. Can management share the ranking of the growth by the product or the services line and the ranking by the revenue or profitability contribution for your fintech products this quarter? And then second, I'm not sure if I missed it, but assuming if you will be relaunched in India in -- sometime in the future, what could be the incremental upside to the user and the (inaudible) if this become reality?

這裡給我兩個。其一是在 DFS 上。管理層能否分享一下你們的金融科技產品本季按產品或服務線劃分的成長排名以及按收入或盈利貢獻排名嗎？其次，我不確定我是否錯過了它，但假設您是否會在未來的某個時候在印度重新推出，對用戶來說可能會帶來哪些增量好處以及（聽不清楚）如果這成為現實？

For our DFS businesses, we are a few main business -- main product that we have. The SPL, Shopee PayLater, and BCL, buy cash loans. And the other -- the off-line product that we have, I think that at this point in time, the SPL in terms of outstanding, is still the biggest product. But if you look at the EBITDA contribution, the UE, the buy cash loan will have a higher UE than the Shopee PayLater. I think that's kind of like a rough picture, if you will.

對於我們的DFS業務來說，我們有一些主要業務—我們擁有的主要產品。 SPL、Shopee PayLater 和 BCL 購買現金貸款。另一個——我們擁有的離線產品，我認為在這個時間點上，SPL 就出色而言，仍然是最大的產品。但如果你看一下 EBITDA 貢獻、UE，購買現金貸款的 UE 將比 Shopee PayLater 更高。如果你願意的話，我認為這有點像是粗略的圖畫。

For Free Fire relaunch in India, at this moment, we are actively working with order -- like stakeholders, including like the regulators, the potential local partners, right? And to figure out what is the best plan to relaunch Free Fire in India. And well, if that is successful, I think that will be a meaningful potential upside in terms of the users and the bookings considering India is a very, very big market. And -- but just to clarify, at this moment for our outlook for the rest of the year in terms of the -- our like a double-digit growth, right? And this is not taking into the consideration of the relaunch of the India. So that's basically the -- make it to the -- basically, when we come out with guidance and outlook based on the current business, what we have seen for the existing kind of the trend of our current market for Free Fire.

為了在印度重新推出 Free Fire，目前我們正在積極與利害關係人合作，包括監管機構、潛在的當地合作夥伴，對吧？並找出在印度重新啟動 Free Fire 的最佳計劃是什麼。好吧，如果成功的話，考慮到印度是一個非常非常大的市場，我認為這對用戶和預訂將是一個有意義的潛在上升空間。而且 - 但只是為了澄清一下，目前我們對今年剩餘時間的展望 - 我們的增長像是兩位數，對吧？而且這還沒考慮到印度重啟的情況。因此，這基本上就是——基本上，當我們根據當前業務提出指導和展望時，我們所看到的是當前 Free Fire 市場的現有趨勢。

This concludes our Q&A session. I would now like to turn the conference back over to Mr. M.C. Koh for any closing remarks.

我們的問答環節到此結束。現在我想把會議轉回給 M.C. 先生。 Koh 的結束語。

Thank you all for joining today's call. We look forward to speaking to all of you again next quarter.

感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。我們期待下季再次與大家交談。

The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

會議現已結束。感謝您參加今天的演講。您現在可以斷開連線。