Western Alliance Bancorp (WAL) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good day, everyone. Welcome to Western Alliance Bancorporation's first quarter 2025 earnings call. You may also view the presentation today via webcast through the company's website at westernalliancebancorporation.com. I would now like to turn the call over to Miles Pondelik , Director of Investor Relations and Corporate Development. Please go ahead.

大家好。歡迎參加 Western Alliance Bancorporation 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。您也可以透過公司網站westernalliancebancorporation.com 的網路直播觀看今天的示範。現在我想將電話轉給投資者關係和企業發展總監 Miles Pondelik。請繼續。

Thank you. Welcome to Western Alliance Bank's first quarter 2025 conference's call. Our speakers today are Ken Vecchione, President and Chief Executive Officer, and Dale Gibbons, Chief Financial Officer. Before I hand the call over to Ken, please note that today's presentation contains forward-looking statements and are subject to risks, uncertainties and assumptions, except as required by law, somebody -- not undertake any obligation to update any forward-looking statements.

謝謝。歡迎參加西部聯盟銀行 2025 年第一季電話會議。今天的演講者是總裁兼執行長 Ken Vecchione 和財務長 Dale Gibbons。在我將電話交給肯之前，請注意，今天的演示包含前瞻性陳述，並受風險、不確定性和假設的影響，除非法律要求，否則某人——不承擔更新任何前瞻性陳述的任何義務。

For a more complete discussion of the risks and uncertainties that could cause our actual results to differ materially from any forward-looking statements, please refer to the company's SEC filings, including the Form 8-K filed yesterday, which are available on the company's website.

有關可能導致我們的實際結果與任何前瞻性陳述存在重大差異的風險和不確定性的更完整討論，請參閱該公司向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件，包括昨天提交的 8-K 表格，這些文件可在公司網站上查閱。

Now for opening remarks, I'd like to turn the call over to Ken Vecchione.

現在，作為開場發言，我想將電話交給 Ken Vecchione。

Thanks, Miles, and good afternoon, everyone. I'll make some brief comments about our first quarter earnings before handing all over to Dale to review our financial performance and drivers in more detail and then I'll close with some prepared remarks regarding our 2025 outlook and our Chief Banking Officer for Regional Banking, Tim Bruckner, will join us for Q&A.

謝謝，邁爾斯，大家下午好。我將對我們的第一季收益做一些簡短的評論，然後交給 Dale 來更詳細地回顧我們的財務業績和驅動因素，然後我將就我們的 2025 年展望發表一些準備好的評論，我們的區域銀行首席銀行官 Tim Bruckner 將加入我們的問答環節。

Before looking to our financial results, I want to thank people of Western Alliance as well as our customers and investors for the many kind notes and well wishes received during my leave of absence. I also want to express my appreciation to the other members of the executive leadership team for managing the company during my absence. I'm feeling great and excited to be back at work.

在介紹我們的財務表現之前，我要感謝西部聯盟的員工以及我們的客戶和投資者在我休假期間發來的許多善意的留言和良好的祝愿。我也要向其他執行領導團隊成員在我缺席期間對公司的管理表示感謝。我感覺很好，很高興能重返工作崗位。

But we often refer to Western Alliance as a bank for all seasons. That is already to serve our commercial clients' needs, irrespective of the macro environment. This is because our extensive sector expertise enables us to evaluate and structure business around perceived risks. The significant diversification of our business lines means we're able to consistently support profitability and risk-adjusted earnings while compounding tangible book value. In other words, we produced growth through all seasons.

但我們經常將西方聯盟稱為一家四季銀行。無論宏觀環境如何，這已經滿足了我們商業客戶的需求。這是因為我們豐富的行業專業知識使我們能夠根據感知風險評估和建立業務。我們業務線的顯著多樣化意味著我們能夠在增加有形帳面價值的同時持續支持獲利能力和風險調整後的收益。換句話說，我們一年四季都在成長。

Different pistons in our growth engine fire at different times during the economic cycle, but the net result is consistent, safe and sound loan and deposit growth even during times of uncertainty like the present. Over the past two years, West Alliance has significantly increased its capital and liquidity to fortify our balance sheet as potential market fluctuations, ensuring we are all well prepared for any changes in the US economy, including from tariffs.

我們的成長引擎中的不同活塞在經濟週期的不同時間點火，但即使在當前這樣的不確定時期，最終結果是一致、安全和穩健的貸款和存款成長。在過去兩年中，West Alliance 大幅增加了資本和流動性，以增強我們的資產負債表，應對潛在的市場波動，確保我們為美國經濟的任何變化（包括關稅變化）做好充分準備。

We have preliminarily evaluated our borrowers and do not see a meaningful number of them with significant transaction volume with China, Canada and Mexico since Western Alliance serves US companies dependent on largely domestic supply chains with limited international exposure.

我們已經對借款人進行了初步評估，發現其中與中國、加拿大和墨西哥有較大交易量的借款人並不多，因為西方聯盟為主要依賴國內供應鏈、國際影響力有限的美國公司提供服務。

Looking back on the first quarter, we are pleased with our execution that delivered financial results in line with expectations as we continue to prudently grow the balance sheet and maintain asset quality. Western Alliance's balance sheet growth supported solid pre-provision net revenue of $278 million, which equates to a $31 million or 12% year-over-year increase. Driving this increase was net interest income which grew $52 million year-over-year or 9%.

回顧第一季度，我們對我們的執行情況感到滿意，財務表現符合預期，我們繼續審慎地增加資產負債表並保持資產品質。Western Alliance 的資產負債表成長支持了 2.78 億美元的穩健撥備前淨收入，相當於年增 3,100 萬美元或 12%。推動這一成長的是淨利息收入，其年增 5,200 萬美元，增幅 9%。

Net interest income inclusive of deposit costs also grew $52 million year-over-year as ECR costs reverted to the prior year's first quarter level. Net interest margin held steady at 3.47%, declining only one basis point from the prior quarter, while adjusted NIM inclusive of deposit costs, expanded 17 basis points to 2.75% as a result of our accelerated ECR cost reduction efforts.

由於 ECR 成本恢復到去年第一季的水平，包括存款成本在內的淨利息收入也比去年同期增加了 5,200 萬美元。淨利差穩定在 3.47%，較上一季僅下降一個基點，而包括存款成本在內的調整後淨利差擴大 17 個基點至 2.75%，這得益於我們加快 ECR 成本削減力度。

Asset quality was stable. Net charge-offs declined 5 basis points in the quarter to 20 basis points which aligns with our full year view. The visioning for the quarter was $31 million, which was significantly below Q4 levels of $60 billion.

資產品質穩定。本季淨沖銷額下降了 5 個基點，至 20 個基點，這與我們的全年預測一致。本季的預期為 3,100 萬美元，遠低於第四季的 600 億美元水準。

While classified assets rose $186 million, nonaccrual loans declined by $25 million quarter-over-quarter to $451 million and moved 7 basis points lower as a percentage of funded HFI loans to 82 basis points. I know collateral values are affirmed by recent appraisals above loan values.

雖然分類資產增加了 1.86 億美元，但非應計貸款較上季減少 2,500 萬美元至 4.51 億美元，佔已融資 HFI 貸款的百分比下降了 7 個基點至 82 個基點。我知道最近的評估確認抵押品的價值高於貸款價值。

Dale will now take you through the rest of the results in more detail.

戴爾現在將向您更詳細地介紹其餘結果。

Thank you, Ken. Looking closer at the income statement, net interest income grew 9% year-over-year to $651 million and declined $16 million quarter-over-quarter, almost highly from two fewer days in Q1. Our battle of loan growth places us in a good position to drive continued net interest income growth with ending held for investment balances $1.1 billion higher quarter-over-quarter versus quarterly average increase of only $67 million. This loan growth is indicative of the improving profitability of our balance sheet and points to expanded NII going forward.

謝謝你，肯。仔細查看損益表，淨利息收入年增 9% 至 6.51 億美元，季減 1,600 萬美元，幾乎與第一季減少了兩天有關。我們的貸款成長之戰使我們處於有利地位，可以推動淨利息收入持續成長，期末持有投資餘額較上季成長 11 億美元，而季度平均增幅僅為 6,700 萬美元。貸款成長顯示我們的資產負債表獲利能力正在提高，並預示著未來 NII 將會擴大。

As Ken mentioned, net interest income inclusive of deposit costs increased $52 million from the prior year and $22 million quarter-over-quarter. Noninterest income was relatively stable year-over-year at $127 million. Mortgage loan production volume increased 25% annually, and the gain on sale margin was 19 basis points.

正如肯所提到的，包括存款成本在內的淨利息收入比上一年增加了 5,200 萬美元，比上一季增加了 2,200 萬美元。非利息收入與去年同期相比相對穩定，為 1.27 億美元。抵押貸款發放量年增25%，銷售利潤率為19個基點。

This quarterly decline in mortgage banking revenue was primarily related to lower gain on sale due to a decline in secondary trading gains. The smaller quarterly net servicing revenue from a lower MSR fair value change, net of hedging. The result, the reduction in income from equity investments was driven by an approximately $8 million charge on investment due to change in timing of income recognition, which we expect to fully recover over time.

抵押貸款銀行收入的本季下降主要與二級交易收益下降導致的銷售收益下降有關。扣除避險後，較低的 MSR 公允價值變動導致季度淨服務收入減少。結果，股權投資收入的減少是由於收入確認時間的變化而產生的約 800 萬美元的投資費用，我們預計這筆費用將隨著時間的推移而完全收回。

Noninterest expense was reduced $19 million to $500 million from the prior quarter as deposit costs declined $38 million to $137 million. Provision expense of $31 million replenished $26 million of net charge-offs as well as provided an incremental benefit to the reserve for commercial real estate, which we saw -- see as prudent given the current macro volatility. As a reminder, we focus on mitigating future losses by requiring low advance rates at the time of underwriting. This standard is validated by recent appraisals that show collateral values exceed lows.

由於存款成本下降 3,800 萬美元至 1.37 億美元，非利息支出較上一季減少 1,900 萬美元至 5 億美元。3,100 萬美元的撥備費用補充了 2,600 萬美元的淨沖銷額，並為商業房地產儲備帶來了增量收益，考慮到當前的宏觀波動，我們認為此舉是謹慎的。提醒一下，我們專注於透過在承保時要求較低的預付利率來減輕未來的損失。最近的評估結果證實了這個標準，顯示抵押品價值已超過最低點。

Turning to our net interest drivers continued improvement and interest-bearing deposit costs and overall liability funding of lower loan and securities yields. In Q1, the yield on total securities present 4 basis points to [463] held for investment loan yields decreased 14 basis points to [620], which reflected a full quarter rate cuts made during Q4 on our variable rate loan book.

談到我們的淨利息驅動因素持續改善以及計息存款成本和整體負債融資降低貸款和證券收益率。第一季度，投資貸款收益率下降 14 個基點至 [620]，至 [463]，這反映了我們在第四季度對浮動利率貸款帳簿進行了整整一個季​​度的降息。

Our cost of interest-bearing deposits declined 23 basis points as a function of our active management of deposit rates even without additional FMLC rate cuts since Q4. We continue to sustain momentum in lowering the fixed cost of funding is demonstrated by the interest-bearing deposit cost spot rate by adding 29 basis points below the average rate for the quarter.

即使自第四季以來 FMLC 利率沒有進一步下調，由於我們積極管理存款利率，我們的計息存款成本也下降了 23 個基點。我們持續維持降低融資固定成本的勢頭，計息存款成本即期利率比本季平均利率低 29 個基點就是明證。

As discussed earlier, net interest income declined $16 million from Q4 to approximately $651 million, almost entirely due to the smaller day count. Net interest margin remained relatively stable from Q4 3.47%. The impact of reduced HFI loan yields was mostly mitigated by a comparable decrease in interest cost of funding average earning assets.

如前所述，淨利息收入較第四季下降 1,600 萬美元至約 6.51 億美元，幾乎完全是由於天數較少造成的。淨利差與第四季相比保持相對穩定，為3.47%。HFI 貸款收益率下降的影響大部分被平均生息資產融資利息成本的相應下降所抵消。

Noninterest expenses declined $19 million quarter-over-quarter as deposit cost fell $38 million from both lower rates and smaller average balances. This decline offset normal seasonal increases in compensation and other expenses. Salaries and benefit expenses were higher from an annual incentive compensation plan bonuses earned from the achievement of various performance goals as well as higher payroll taxes.

非利息支出較上季下降 1,900 萬美元，因為利率下降和平均餘額減少導致存款成本下降 3,800 萬美元。這一下降抵消了薪酬和其他費用正常的季節性增長。薪資和福利支出較高，因為年度激勵薪資計畫獎金來自實現各種績效目標所獲得的獎金以及更高的薪資稅。

Our adjusted efficiency ratio of 56% compares favorably to the 57% ratio reported in the first quarter of 2024. Our remain asset sensitive on a net interest income basis, we are essentially interest rate neutral on an earnings basis in a ramp scenario. This offset is supported by a material projected ECR-related deposit cost decline this year and an increase in mortgage banking revenue.

我們的調整後效率比率為 56%，與 2024 年第一季報告的 57% 相比更為有利。在淨利息收入基礎上，我們的資產仍然敏感，但在利率上升的情況下，我們基本上在收益基礎上保持利率中立。這一抵消作用得到了預計今年 ECR 相關存款成本大幅下降以及抵押貸款銀行收入增加的支持。

Our updated rate forecast calls for 225 basis point rate cuts before the end of 2025. The balance sheet expanded $2.1 billion from year-end to $83 billion in total assets which reflected HFI loan and deposit growth of $1.1 billion and $3 billion, respectively. The seasonal rebound of mortgage warehouse deposits also allowed us to reduce borrowings by $1.4 billion. Total equity increased $508 million, inclusive of $293 million in proceeds from the issuance of REIT preferred equity.

我們最新的利率預測是，到 2025 年底之前，利率將下調 225 個基點。資產負債表總資產較年底增加 21 億美元，達到 830 億美元，其中 HFI 貸款和存款分別增加 11 億美元和 30 億美元。抵押貸款倉庫存款的季節性反彈也使我們減少了 14 億美元的借款。總股本增加了 5.08 億美元，其中包括發行 REIT 優先股所得的 2.93 億美元。

Finally, tangible book value per share climbed 14% year-over-year, aided by sustained organic profitability and some rate-driven relief for a negative AOCI position. HFI loan growth of $1.1 billion demonstrated gathering momentum toward the end of the quarter. C&I drove most of the growth supported by smaller contributions from commercial real estate and construction.

最後，受持續的有機獲利能力和利率驅動的負面 AOCI 狀況緩解的推動，每股有形帳面價值年增 14%。HFI 貸款成長 11 億美元，顯示本季末勢頭強勁。商業與工業推動了大部分成長，而商業房地產和建築業的貢獻較小。

Residential loans decreased $63 million. C&I loans now account for 44% of the HFI loan portfolio compared to 39% a year ago, while residential loans are 26% of the portfolio compared to 29%. These results exemplify the deep sector expertise and strong client relationships the company has fostered. I'd also like to add this expertise is concentrated in areas with inherently low embedded risk of loss, which we view as increasingly valuable amidst the changing macro backdrop.

住宅貸款減少6300萬美元。商業與工業目前，貸款佔 HFI 貸款組合的 44%，而一年前為 39%，而住宅貸款佔組合的 26%，而一年前為 29%。這些結果體現了該公司深厚的行業專業知識和牢固的客戶關係。我還想補充一點，這些專業知識集中在本質上具有較低損失風險的領域，我們認為在不斷變化的宏觀背景下，這些領域越來越有價值。

Regional Banking produced over $900 million of loan growth led by contributions from homebuilder finance and end market relationship banking. National Business Lines provided the remainder with Lender Finance, the main driver of its growth with smaller diversified increases from other areas. Our growth in lender finance has continued to gain traction from our relationships with private credit clients.

區域銀行業務的貸款成長超過 9 億美元，主要得益於房屋建築商融資和終端市場關係銀行業務的貢獻。國家業務線為剩餘部分提供了貸款融資，這是其成長的主要驅動力，其他領域的多元化成長較小。我們與私人信貸客戶的關係持續推動貸款融資的成長。

Deposits grew $3 billion in Q1, mostly in noninterest-bearing and were complemented by growth in savings and money market balances. Seasonal strength in mortgage warehouse was augmented by a solid results in such a way in our specialty Escrow Services.

第一季存款成長了 30 億美元，其中大部分為無息存款，同時儲蓄和貨幣市場餘額也成長。我們的專業託管服務取得了穩健的業績，增強了抵押倉庫的季節性優勢。

HOA solidified its market-leading position by posting a $900 million increase in quarterly growth during a seasonally strong quarter and surpassed $10 billion in deposits for the first time. Among specialty Escrow Services, Corporate Trust was -- stand out with nearly $300 million of growth in business Escrow Services generating approximately $100 million. Corporate rest momentum can continue to benefit from the positive rating actions Western Alliance received in February.

HOA 在季節性強勁的季度中實現了 9 億美元的季度增長，並首次突破 100 億美元的存款，從而鞏固了其市場領先地位。在專業託管服務中，企業信託脫穎而出，業務成長近 3 億美元，託管服務創造了約 1 億美元的收入。西方聯盟 (Western Alliance) 在二月獲得的正面評級行動可繼續為企業帶來獲利動力。

Turning to asset quality, criticized assets rose $254 million from increases of $68 million in special mention loans and $186 million in classified assets. These loans have been reserved or charged down to current as is market values and are revalued on an ongoing basis. Nonperforming assets as a percent of total assets eased 5 basis points from year-end to 0.6%. Quarterly net charge-offs were $26 million or 20 basis points of average loans.

談到資產質量，受批評資產增加了 2.54 億美元，其中關注類貸款增加了 6,800 萬美元，分類資產增加了 1.86 億美元。這些貸款已被保留或減記至當前市場價值，並持續進行重新估價。不良資產佔總資產的比例較年末下降5個基點至0.6%。季度淨沖銷額為 2,600 萬美元，即平均貸款的 20 個基點。

Provision expense of $31 million added reserves to cover charge-offs and augmented our CRE reserves. Our ACL for funded loans increased $15 million from the prior quarter to $389 million. The total loan ACL to funded loans was unchanged from the prior quarter at 77 basis points. Our ACL ratio is conservatively weighted to economic scenarios more pessimistic than economists are forecasting which include a weighted peak unemployment rate above 6%, continued reductions in CRE valuations with greater than 50% peak to trough contraction in office values and several quarters of negative GDP growth.

撥備費用 3,100 萬美元增加了儲備金，以彌補沖銷並增加了我們的 CRE 儲備金。我們的已發放貸款的 ACL 較上一季增加了 1500 萬美元，達到 3.89 億美元。總貸款 ACL 與已發放貸款比率與上一季持平，為 77 個基點。我們的 ACL 比率保守地衡量了比經濟學家預測更悲觀的經濟情景，其中包括加權峰值失業率超過 6%、CRE 估值持續下降、辦公室價值從峰值到谷底收縮超過 50% 以及幾個季度的 GDP 負增長。

The (technical difficulty) regularly provide more context behind our allowance methodology moved for ACL from 77 basis points to 1.35%. This incorporates the effect of credit-linked notes as well as low to no loss loan categories like equity fund resources, our low LTV and high FICO residential portfolio and mortgage warehouse. Additionally, we applied another method to compare our loan portfolio to peers since loan mix matters when establishing loss reserves from differences in embedded loss content across various portfolios.

(技術難度) 定期為我們的配額方法提供更多背景信息，將 ACL 從 77 個基點轉移到 1.35%。這包括信用掛鉤票據的影響以及低損失或無損失貸款類別，如股票基金資源、我們的低 LTV 和高 FICO 住宅投資組合和抵押貸款倉庫。此外，我們採用了另一種方法將我們的貸款組合與同業進行比較，因為在根據不同投資組合中隱含損失內容的差異建立損失準備金時，貸款組合很重要。

Relative to peers, Western Alliance's loan portfolio is much more weighted to categories with very limited risk of loss. We have over $8 billion of mortgage warehouse loans, which were advances on mortgage properties while being escrowed for the GSEs with an average duration of about two weeks. We know no bank that has incurred loan losses in this category. Our $8 billion total compares to the peer median of just $69 million with several having no exposure at all which suppresses our relative reserve level.

與同業相比，西方聯盟的貸款組合更著重於損失風險非常有限的類別。我們擁有超過 80 億美元的抵押倉儲貸款，這些貸款是抵押財產的預付款，由政府支援企業託管，平均期限約為兩週。據我們所知，沒有任何一家銀行發生過此類貸款損失。我們的總額為 80 億美元，而同行的中位數僅為 6,900 萬美元，其中一些根本沒有敞口，這抑制了我們的相對儲備水準。

Our $14 billion in residential portfolio is larger than the peer median of $9.4 billion and also carries a high proportion of loans in high FICO, low LTV residential mortgages that we believe is not the case for the typical peer.

我們的住宅投資組合價值 140 億美元，高於同業中位數 94 億美元，而且其中很大一部分貸款是高 FICO、低 LTV 的住宅抵押貸款，我們認為這對於典型的同行來說並不常見。

Credit line notes to ensure $8.5 billion of this portfolio where we already have the funds to cover any losses that might emerge. Conversely, Western Alliance has de minimis consumer loans compared to a peer median of $3 billion. These loans require substantially higher reserve levels as they are generally supported by a single source of repayment and more easily disrupted by adverse life events. If you apply the peer median loan mix to our portfolio to comparable allowance would be over 1%.

信用額度票據可確保該投資組合中的 85 億美元，我們已經擁有足夠的資金來彌補可能出現的任何損失。相反，西方聯盟的消費貸款額度極低，而同業的平均為 30 億美元。這些貸款需要更高的儲備水平，因為它們通常由單一還款來源支持，並且更容易受到不利的生活事件的干擾。如果將同業中位數貸款組合應用到我們的投資組合中，可比津貼將超過 1%。

Turning to another look at capital levels, we believe reserves should be considered in the context of adjusted capital. Our CET1 capital ranks around the median of the peers. However, if you add to that, our lower adverse AOCI mark and the ACL to address that some peers may have capital trapped in their reserve. You can see our adjusted capital is 11%, which is flat since year end and ranks above the peer median for asset cover. This supports our confidence that our capacity to absorb any losses in contract with stable growth remains strong.

從另一個角度來看資本水平，我們認為應該在調整資本的背景下考慮儲備金。我們的 CET1 資本水準處於同業中位數左右。然而，如果你再加上我們較低的不利 AOCI 標記和 ACL 來解決一些同業可能將資本困在其儲備中的問題。您可以看到，我們的調整後資本為 11%，自年底以來一直保持平穩，且資產覆蓋率高於同業中位數。這增強了我們的信心，即我們吸收合約中任何損失並保持穩定增長的能力仍然強勁。

Our CET rate 1 ratio decreased approximately 13 basis points to 11.1% during the quarter as a result of strong loan growth. Our tangible common equity to total assets ratio remained 7.2%. In late March, we received proceeds of $293 million from the sale of preferred equity at our REIT subsidiary. We issued out of the reach in order to generate ongoing material after-tax dividend cost savings instead of issuing at the holding company. This issuance lifts our Tier 1 leverage ratio from 8.1% at year-end to 8.6%.

由於貸款強勁成長，本季我們的 CET 利率 1 比率下降了約 13 個基點，至 11.1%。我們的有形普通股權益與總資產比率維持在 7.2%。3 月底，我們從出售房地產投資信託子公司的優先股中獲得了 2.93 億美元的收益。我們發行超出範圍的股票是為了產生持續的稅後股利成本節約，而不是在控股公司發行。此次發行將我們的一級槓桿率從年底的 8.1% 提升至 8.6%。

Emblematic balance sheet with a lower risk profile, our risk-weighted assets to tangible assets ratio is among the lowest of peers at 70%. Tangible book value per share increased to $1.83 from year-end $54.10 as a function of organic earnings combined with $56 million reduction in negative AOCI position from a lower rate environment. Consistent upward growth in tangible book value per share remains a hallmark Western Alliance has been exceeded peers by six times over the past decade.

具有較低風險狀況的標誌性資產負債表，我們的風險加權資產與有形資產的比率是同業中最低的，為 70%。由於有機收益加上低利率環境下 AOCI 負部位減少 5,600 萬美元，每股有形帳面價值從年底的 54.10 美元增至 1.83 美元。每股有形帳面價值的持續成長仍是西方聯盟的標誌，過去十年來其成長速度已超過同業六倍。

I'll now turn the car back to Kenneth

我現在把車還給肯尼斯

Okay. Thanks, Dale. Our updated 2025 guidance is as follows, while we remain attentive to economic and macro developments, our balance sheet guidance remains unchanged at $5 billion loan growth and $8 billion of deposit growth for the full year as pipelines remain healthy with strong client engagement. Turning to capital, our CET1 ratio should remain above 11%, a level we have been above for a year as we produce solid risk-weighted loan growth.

好的。謝謝，戴爾。我們更新後的 2025 年指引如下，雖然我們仍然關注經濟和宏觀發展，但由於通路保持健康且客戶參與度高，我們的資產負債表指引保持不變，全年貸款增長 50 億美元，存款增長 80 億美元。談到資本，我們的 CET1 比率應保持在 11% 以上，隨著我們實現穩健的風險加權貸款成長，我們已經連續一年保持這一水平。

Net interest income should ascend sequentially throughout the year and is still expected to increase 6% to 8% for 2025, largely as a result of sustained loan growth and expanding net interest margin that approximates 2024 as level on a full year basis.

淨利息收入預計全年將持續上升，預計 2025 年仍將增長 6% 至 8%，這主要得益於貸款持續增長和淨息差擴大，按全年計算接近 2024 年的水平。

Noninterest income will follow net interest income trajectory of 6% to 8% growth due to the ongoing traction in cultivating deeper client relationships with commercial banking fee opportunities. Noninterest expense assisted by declining ECR costs from two rate cuts expected before December should land between 0% growth and 5% decline.

由於持續利用商業銀行收費機會培養更深層的客戶關係，非利息收入將遵循淨利息收入 6% 至 8% 的成長軌跡。預計 12 月前將有兩次降息，導致 ECR 成本下降，非利息支出將出現 0% 的成長和 5% 的下降。

We expect ECR costs in Q2 of $140 million to $150 million. Our revised full year ECR cost outlook of $485 million to $535 million incorporates our current rate assumptions and typical seasonal outflows of mortgage warehouse deposits in Q4. Asset quality should remain stable with full year net charge-offs hovering around 20 basis points. And last week, we now expect the effective tax rate for 2025 to be approximately 20%.

我們預計第二季的 ECR 成本為 1.4 億至 1.5 億美元。我們修訂後的全年 ECR 成本預期為 4.85 億美元至 5.35 億美元，其中包含了我們目前的利率假設以及第四季度典型的季節性抵押倉庫存款流出。資產品質應保持穩定，全年淨沖銷額徘徊在 20 個基點左右。上週，我們預計 2025 年的實際稅率約為 20%。

At this time, Dale, Tim and I will take your questions.

現在，戴爾、提姆和我將回答你們的問題。

(Operator Instructions) Casey Haire, Autonomous.

（操作員指令）Casey Haire，自主。

I appreciate all the color you gave on the ACL and it sort of does seem like it's done some very conservative macro assumptions, but it's just obviously, it's a major overhang on the stock for investors to see the ACL that low. Just wondering, is there any thought to use some qualitative reserves to just get that into a more tolerable level for the market?

我很欣賞您對 ACL 的詳細分析，它確實看起來做了一些非常保守的宏觀假設，但顯然，投資者認為 ACL 如此之低對該股是一個重大的負擔。只是想知道，是否有想過使用一些定性儲備來使其達到市場更可容忍的水平？

Well, I mean I think we've shown that our reserve is adequate, both in composition and when you add it with the capital. What I don't want to have happen is I want people to think, oh my gosh, have a reserve level that's lower than somebody else is there. After I've become an owner of Wise Reliance, is there a charge coming that's going to take the reserve to a higher level. We do not see that.

嗯，我的意思是，我認為我們已經證明我們的儲備是充足的，無論是在構成上還是在加上資本。我不希望發生這樣的事情，我希望人們會覺得，天哪，我的儲備水準比別人的還低。在我成為 Wise Reliance 的所有者之後，是否會採取一些措施將儲備提升到更高的水平？我們沒有看到這一點。

We continue to have a very rigorous methodology for determining our allowance and supporting that by what's taking place. We actually had a scenario this last quarter where we would have had a release of reserves in the CRE, but we instead put that into additional overlay on CRE and again, gets us to the higher levels we have now with a more conservative view using the S4 scenario from Moody's to be able to put on our commercial real estate office.

我們繼續採用非常嚴格的方法來確定我們的津貼，並透過正在發生的事情來支持這一點。實際上，我們在上個季度曾設想過這樣一種情況，即我們本應釋放 CRE 中的儲備，但我們卻將其投入到 CRE 的額外覆蓋中，並再次以更保守的觀點使用穆迪的 S4 情景將​​我們帶到了現在的更高水平，以便能夠將其應用到我們的商業房地產辦公室中。

And then just switching to the guide for '25, everything seems to be tracking pretty well with the exception of fees. It sounds like that's coming from just more traction with your commercial clients. Just wondering if it's down year-over-year, and you've got a healthy high single-digit expectation, is there any help coming from mortgage or just the cadence of what looks to be a pretty steep ramp in the remaining quarters here?

然後切換到 25 年的指南，除了費用之外，一切似乎都很順利。聽起來這只是來自於您對商業客戶的更多關注。只是想知道，如果它同比下降，並且你有一個健康的高個位數預期，是否有來自抵押貸款的幫助，或者僅僅是剩餘幾個季度中看起來相當陡峭的增長節奏？

Yes. We see fee income rising in the second half of the year, buttressed from the seasonal increase in mortgage income, we expect mortgage income to remain flat year-over-year to prior year. Although I will say we are mindful that the recent rate volatility could impact consumer behavior. But all in, we expect noninterest income at this point to follow the net interest income trajectory.

是的。我們預計下半年費用收入將會上升，受抵押貸款收入季節性成長的支撐，我們預計抵押貸款收入將與去年同期持平。但我要說的是，我們注意到最近的利率波動可能會影響消費者行為。但整體而言，我們預期此時非利息收入將遵循淨利息收入軌跡。

Jared Shaw, Barclays Capital.

巴克萊資本的賈里德·肖 (Jared Shaw)。

Hey, good morning, everybody. Ken, it's great to have you back on the call. Looking forward to hearing more as we go through the summer. Maybe just the first, can you give a little color on some of the C&I growth dynamics where you're seeing strength and what was driving at this quarter?

嘿，大家早安。肯，很高興您再次來電。期待夏天聽到更多消息。也許只是第一個問題，您能否稍微介紹一下您看到的 C&I 成長動力以及本季的推動因素？

Yes. So let me just talk about the balance sheet. I think in its entirety to begin. But there's strong momentum on both sides of the balance sheet. For loans, the client pipelines are active and full and at this point, we expect Q2 loan growth to actually top Q1.

是的。那我只想談談資產負債表。我認為應該從整體開始。但資產負債表的兩邊都呈現強勁勢頭。對於貸款而言，客戶管道活躍且充足，目前我們預計第二季的貸款成長實際上將超過第一季。

Our national homebuilder group warehouse lending group, note finance, lender finance will all fuel the growth for the following quarters, all right. And then for with that, we see our deposits also tracking to our full year guide to support the loan growth that we're bringing in.

我們的全國房屋建築商集團倉庫貸款集團、票據融資、貸款人融資都將推動接下來幾季的成長。同時，我們看到我們的存款也追蹤我們的全年指南，以支持我們帶來的貸款成長。

Okay. And then I guess looking at the capital raise that was an interesting structure. Was the primary goal for that to raise Tier 1 leverage and are you happy with where that is now or could we expect to see some other maybe unique capital moves going forward?

好的。然後我想看看籌集的資金，這是一個有趣的結構。這樣做的主要目標是否是為了提高一級槓桿率？您對目前的狀況滿意嗎？或者我們可以期待未來看到一些其他獨特的資本措施？

Yes. It was to raise the Tier 1 leverage ratio, and we are happy with our level in kind of the mid-8% range. Again, if you juxtapose our Tier 1 leverage ratio compared to peers which maybe is a little below the median, but a much higher than median level of risk-weighted assets to total assets, we think that gives you a good balance and also shows you really confirmed by where we stand on a CET1 ratio of north of 11%.

是的。這是為了提高一級槓桿率，我們對 8% 左右的水平感到滿意。同樣，如果將我們的一級槓桿率與同行進行比較，後者可能略低於中位數，但風險加權資產與總資產的中位數卻高得多，我們認為這能給你帶來良好的平衡，也表明我們確實確認了我們的 CET1 比率在 11% 以上。

I might also note that we have a subordinated debt transaction that becomes callable this quarter. And we expect to call at least part of that in the near term, which will mitigate to some degree the cost of the preferred.

我還要指出的是，我們有一筆次級債務交易可於本季贖回。我們預計短期內至少會收回其中的一部分，這將在一定程度上降低優先股的成本。

So we did a preferred deal with the REIT. A lot of banks don't have this option because they don't have a reach to be able to do that. The rate on that preferred less that those dividends are tax deductible. If we pay dividends out of the holding company, they're not tax deductible, there just like common share dividends. But out of the REIT, they are tax deductible. And so the net to us is a lower-cost taxes than what it would have been if we had issued out of the parent.

因此我們與房地產投資信託基金達成了優先交易。許多銀行沒有此選項，因為他們無力做到這一點。優先股的利率低於股息的部分可以免稅。如果我們從控股公司支付股息，那麼這些股息就不能免稅，就像普通股股息一樣。但在房地產投資信託基金 (REIT) 之外，它們可以免稅。因此，對我們來說，淨稅收成本比我們從母公司發放的稅收成本要低。

Bernard Von Gizycki, Deutsche Bank.

伯納德·馮·吉茲基，德意志銀行。

Just on insurance costs and deposit service charges. So I know you engage your larger depositors about passing over the deposit insurance costs over to them if they want to maintain the level of insurance. I know it just was over about $1 million for the quarter, but service charges increased over $5 million. So I'm just wondering, is this mostly due to the larger depositors maintaining their insurance accounts and you're benefiting from higher service charges? Or was that the increase due to the change in pricing that you previously noticed from Gen 1?

僅涉及保險費用和押金服務費。因此，我知道，如果您的大儲戶想要維持保險水平，您會讓他們把存款保險成本轉嫁給他們。我知道本季的費用剛剛超過 100 萬美元，但服務費卻增加了 500 多萬美元。所以我只是想知道，這是否主要是因為較大的儲戶維持了他們的保險帳戶，而您從更高的服務費中受益？或者這是由於您之前從 Gen 1 中註意到的價格變化而導致的增長？

This is Ken. I also think the answer here is that we've put a full court press on improving our treasury managed services and outreach to our clients. And I think what you're seeing is that increase is showing up in the service charges for this quarter. And if you really look at it year-over-year, it's really up significantly for us. And so Tim Bruckner, who's sitting on my right, he's kind of led that charge to bring in more fee income.

這是肯。我還認為，答案是，我們全力以赴改善我們的財務管理服務和對客戶的擴展。我認為您看到的是本季服務費有所增加。如果你認真地看一下同比情況，你會發現我們的成長確實非常顯著。因此，坐在我右邊的 Tim Bruckner 就帶頭承擔了這項工作，以帶來更多的費用收入。

And we've been focusing on that for the last 18 months to 2 years, rolling out products, improving our products and service capabilities and delivery, and we're pleased to see that type of improvement.

在過去的 18 個月到 2 年裡，我們一直專注於此，推出產品，改進我們的產品和服務能力和交付，我們很高興看到這種改進。

Okay. And then my follow-up, just on the expenses for ECR-related deposit costs. I know the 2Q $140 million to $150 million is a small uptick versus 1Q. And I think you just raised the guide on that for full year. Could you just break down like is that higher expected ECR-related deposits, higher rate? What's driving that change?

好的。然後我的後續問題是有關 ECR 相關的存款成本的費用。我知道第二季的 1.4 億美元到 1.5 億美元與第一季相比只是小幅上漲。我認為您剛剛提高了全年的指導價。您能否具體分析一下，預期 ECR 相關存款是否會更高，利率是否會更高？是什麼推動了這項改變？

It's a really higher average balance. So Q4 was -- it came down, it build back up in the first quarter. So as you go from Q1 to Q2, we expect a higher average balance in ECR-related deposits, and that's what's kicking that up. We do not see spreads on ECR climbing from here.

這確實是一個較高的平均餘額。因此，第四季有所下降，但第一季又有所回升。因此，從第一季到第二季度，我們預計 ECR 相關存款的平均餘額會更高，這就是推動這一趨勢的原因。我們認為 ECR 利差不會從現在開始攀升。

Ebrahim Poonawala, Bank of America.

美國銀行的 Ebrahim Poonawala。

I guess maybe, Dan, just following up on the NII and the margin trajectory one. Remind us whether rate cuts, including of ECR costs, are helpful or neutral to the NII outlook. And when we think about the sequential improvement, is this more back half weighted? Is it a big step up in the fourth quarter when you think about just NII and the margin trajectory are going to play out for the remaining three quarters?

丹，我想也許只是跟進 NII 和邊際軌跡。提醒我們降息（包括 ECR 成本）對 NII 前景是否有幫助或中性。當我們考慮連續改進時，這是否更多地取決於後半部分？如果您只考慮 NII 並且利潤率軌跡將在剩餘三個季度中發揮作用，那麼第四季度是否會有大幅增長？

Yes, this is Ken. So on net interest income, we kind of see the net interest income sequentially growing quarter-to-quarter, certainly for Q2 and Q3. We do have two rate cuts in there, one in June, and I think the other in September is our forecast. And so what you'll see from us is net interest margin increasing gradually through the year.

是的，我是肯恩。因此，就淨利息收入而言，我們看到淨利息收入逐季環比成長，尤其是第二季和第三季。我們確實有兩次降息，一次是在六月，另一次是在九月，這是我們的預測。因此，您會看到我們的淨利差在全年逐漸增加。

But I think you'll see more of an increase in the adjusted net interest margin as ECR costs kind of rise a little bit in Q2 and then flatten to decline in the -- in Q3 and really in Q4 as volume also leaves us, right, for the warehouse seasonal mortgage exit.

但我認為，隨著 ECR 成本在第二季略有上升，然後在第三季和第四季趨於平穩並下降，調整後的淨利差將進一步增加，因為隨著倉庫季節性抵押貸款的退出，交易量也將減少。

So you'll see the adjusted net interest margin grow and that's going to bring the net interest income to that sequential pattern of growth, plus the loan growth itself is going to help us. And so to the extent that we could accelerate our loan growth and increase it at a faster pace that will give an increase to our average earning assets which will give more support to the net interest income. And that's how we get to our full year guide.

因此，您會看到調整後的淨利差有所成長，這將使淨利息收入呈現連續成長的模式，此外，貸款成長本身也會對我們有所幫助。因此，我們可以加快貸款成長速度，以更快的速度增加貸款，這將增加我們的平均收益資產，從而為淨利息收入提供更多支持。這就是我們得到全年指南的方式。

Got it. And, Ken, welcome back. I guess another question back to -- I heard deals respond from the reserves. But I think when you think about NII. And I know you spend a lot of time when you think about the stock performance, it's trading at seven times earnings.

知道了。肯，歡迎回來。我想另一個問題是──我聽到了儲備金的交易回應。但我認為當你考慮 NII 時。我知道您在考慮股票表現時會花很多時間，它的本益比為七倍。

Like what do you think you can do to improve shareholder returns. I'm not sure if I heard any sort of discussion around buybacks. But how do you get the stock to relate? How do you improve shareholder returns? Like what do you think needs to happen for the stock to react differently as we move forward?

例如，您認為您可以做些什麼來提高股東回報。我不確定我是否聽過有關回購的任何討論。但是如何讓股票產生關聯呢？如何提高股東回報？例如，您認為隨著我們繼續前進，需要發生什麼才能使股票做出不同的反應？

I think we need to do a better job kind of really promoting what we're doing and the strength of our diversified business model. We talked about that a little bit about being able to pivot from one sector or one business to another, depending on what's in favor, what might be at risk kind of going forward. And we were talking about this earlier and how some companies brought up the Southeast and what they're doing there. Well, we have $14 billion in loans and $14 million in deposits in the Southeast. And I don't know that gets enough attention.

我認為我們需要更好地宣傳我們正在做的事情以及多元化商業模式的優勢。我們稍微討論了從一個行業或一個業務轉向另一個行業或業務的能力，這取決於未來的有利條件和可能的風險。我們之前討論過這個問題，以及一些公司如何提出東南部以及他們在那裡做什麼。我們在東南部有 140 億美元的貸款和 1400 萬美元的存款。我不知道這是否引起了足夠的關注。

We have offices there. We've got people there. We've got people in some 40 states. But we haven't put a flag in some of those, so they don't -- it doesn't show up necessarily on an FDIC scan. But we're there, we're active and we're successful.

我們在那裡有辦公室。我們有人在那裡。我們的員工遍佈約 40 個州。但我們沒有對其中一些進行標記，因此它們不一定會顯示在 FDIC 掃描中。但我們在那裡，我們積極行動，我們成功了。

And would you consider some sort of -- like we've talked about bank M&A and maybe the regulatory environment improving, like would some sort of a strategic partnership that better sort of ex tax franchise value? Is that something that you would consider? Like how would you think about that?

您是否會考慮某種——就像我們談論的銀行併購以及監管環境的改善，例如某種戰略合作夥伴關係是否會對稅收特許經營權價值產生更好的影響？您會考慮這個嗎？那麼您對此有何看法？

No, I don't think so. I mean, look, -- it's hard to find another bank in our peer group that can grow the way we can grow on the balance sheet side and improve earnings the way we generally have improved earnings and improved really tangible book value over the last 10 years. So I don't think we're going to consider anything along those lines. Thank you.

不，我不這麼認為。我的意思是，看看——在我們的同行中很難找到另一家銀行能夠像我們一樣在資產負債表方面實現增長，並像我們過去 10 年里普遍提高盈利和提高有形賬面價值那樣提高盈利。所以我認為我們不會考慮任何類似的事情。謝謝。

Gary Tenner, D.A. Davidson.

加里·坦納（Gary Tenner），地方檢察官戴維森。

Good morning and, Ken, welcome back. A bit of a follow-up to that last question. Just in terms of if M&A is not on the docket, the stock's trading at 120% of tangible book and below your out tangible book and you don't have a big dividend payout ratio. So any more openness to use some capital for buyback at this level?

早安，肯，歡迎回來。對最後一個問題進行一些後續討論。就如果併購不在議程上，股票交易價格就是有形帳面價值的 120%，低於你的有形帳面價值，而且你的股利支付率也不會很高。那麼，在這個水準上，是否還有更多機會使用一些資本來回購？

So right now in times of uncertainty, you want to have excess capital and liquidity to either defend the bank against market or economic disruptions or be well positioned to take advantage of these disruptions. We've said since 2023 that we want to have a 11% CET1 floor, we are there. We position the best the bank's debt in terms of taking advantage of growth, go back to my opening statements, where a bank tends to grow through all different types of economic cycles.

因此，在目前不確定的時期，您需要擁有過剩的資本和流動性，以保護銀行免受市場或經濟混亂的影響，或做好充分準備利用這些混亂的機會。自 2023 年以來，我們就說過，我們希望將 CET1 底線設定為 11%，我們現在已經實現了。我們從利用成長的角度對銀行債務進行了最佳定位，回到我的開場白，銀行往往會在各種不同類型的經濟週期中實現成長。

I understand that there are many of our peers are lying back their stock, but that is more of a temporarily improving EPS through those stock repurchase programs. For us, we look to have that capital. We can deploy that capital into sound, safe and thoughtful loan growth. We believe we can deliver a return on average tangible common equity in Q1 was 13%, but we see that rising as we go forward into the mid-teens percentage. And we think over time, that is the best use of our capital.

我知道有很多同業正在回購股票，但這更多的是透過股票回購計畫暫時提高每股盈餘。對我們來說，我們希望擁有那筆資本。我們可以將這些資本投入穩健、安全和周到的貸款成長。我們相信，我們第一季的平均有形普通股權益回報率可以達到 13%，但隨著回報率進入十幾歲的中段，我們預計這一數字還會上升。我們認為，從長遠來看，這是對我們資本的最佳利用。

Additionally, we compete against very strong against the top 10 banks in the country with our national business lines. And when we go in to talk to clients, we need to kind of look like they do in terms of their CET1 ratios and liquidity profile. And having a larger CET1 or a higher CET1 ratio is very helpful in us being awarded business.

此外，我們以全國業務線與國內十大銀行展開激烈競爭。當我們與客戶交談時，我們需要了解他們的 CET1 比率和流動性狀況。擁有較大的 CET1 或較高的 CET1 比率對於我們獲得業務非常有幫助。

So we do use it as a competitive strength in terms of growing the balance sheet, where at this point, we're still not inclined to use it to buy back stock. We think the best longer-term value is doing what we're doing, and it's growing the company.

因此，我們確實將其用作擴大資產負債表的競爭優勢，但目前，我們仍然不傾向於用它來回購股票。我們認為最好的長期價值就是做我們正在做的事情，那就是發展公司。

Fair enough. Appreciate the thoughts there. And then -- as it relates to the positive second quarter loan growth commentary, I know it's still a little bit early in the quarter, but any visibility as to kind of how that may layer in over the course of the quarter, given the commentary about the first quarter loan growth being pretty late quarter?

很公平。感謝您的想法。然後 - 至於第二季度貸款增長的積極評論，我知道現在還處於本季度初期，但考慮到關於第一季度貸款增長相當晚的評論，對於這種增長將如何在本季度內顯現，是否有任何預見性？

Yes. I mean; to be honest, that's the hottest thing for us to forecast. My viewpoint is it always should come in early, and it always should come in on the first day of a quarter, it just never works out that way, unfortunately, you've always got deals to be done and completed by our clients.

是的。我是說;說實話，這是我們預測的最熱門的事情。我的觀點是，它總是應該儘早到來，並且總是應該在一個季度的第一天到來，但不幸的是，它從來沒有以這種方式發揮作用，你總是有交易需要與我們的客戶完成。

You've got lawyers in the way, and it's always a little later than we think. We're confident about our loan growth for the second quarter. My guess, it comes more towards the middle of the second quarter to the back half of the second quarter. But we make a very concerted effort here to push it up as quickly as we can into a quarter, but that is a hard task for us to accomplish every quarter.

你有律師在場，總是比我們想像的晚一點。我們對第二季的貸款成長充滿信心。我的猜測是，它更有可能發生在第二季中期到第二季後半段。但我們在這裡做出了非常一致的努力，以盡快將其推向一個季度，但這對我們來說每個季度完成都是一項艱鉅的任務。

Ben Gerlinger, Citi.

花旗銀行的本‧格林格 (Ben Gerlinger)。

Good morning and welcome back, Ken. Just a quick question. I want to follow up a little bit on the past couple -- and pay could be a dead horse here, but if you look, as you said, interest-bearing deposit costs, spot rates down 29 bps. So it gets you below three to end or to start April, why is the margin only going up gradually considering loan growth is pretty healthy in the month of March. I'm thinking it's a little bit more than gradual when you look at just the pace of which NII should increase. Am I missing something here?

早安，歡迎回來，肯。這只是一個簡單的問題。我想稍微跟進一下過去幾年的情況——薪酬在這裡可能是一個死馬，但如果你看一下，正如你所說的，有利息的存款成本，現貨利率下降了 29 個基點。因此，四月底或四月初的利率都低於三個百分點，考慮到三月的貸款成長相當健康，為什麼利率只是逐漸上升呢？我認為，如果只看 NII 的成長速度，它就不僅僅是漸進的了。我這裡遺漏了什麼嗎？

I do think that we're going to be more a little more stable on noninterest-bearing from here. I mean that has a strong recovery primarily ECR-related deposits going into the second quarter. I would say as well that there is a little bit of issue with pricing pressure. So we are seeing our loan growth, which we're confident about achieving. It is going to have a lower average spread relative to kind of the current -- what's currently on the balance sheet.

我確實認為，從現在開始，我們在無息貸款方面將會更加穩定。我的意思是，進入第二季度，主要與 ECR 相關的存款將出現強勁復甦。我還想說，定價壓力方面存在一些問題。因此，我們看到了貸款的成長，我們有信心實現這一目標。相對於目前資產負債表上的情況，它的平均利差將會較低。

And so that's going to be monthly dilutive to the margin over time. Again, we're really focused on PPNR and what we can do to drive that more than we are about managing the margin per se. And so we look -- and so PPNR obviously also includes the ECR costs that are in noninterest expense.

因此，隨著時間的推移，利潤率將會逐月減少。再次強調，我們真正關注的是 PPNR 以及我們可以做些什麼來推動這一點，而不是管理利潤本身。因此我們來看看 — — PPNR 顯然也包括非利息支出中的 ECR 成本。

Right. No, that makes sense. It seems like PPNR is going to go higher seemingly every quarter, year or two here, but obviously, great dependent towards the six or seven quarters out. But when you think about just the investment spend associated with PPNR, i.e., non-ECR-related deposits, is there anything incremental to a non-run rate perspective on investment, i.e., to get over the $100 billion that you still need to do? Or if the rules were changed and $100 billion was more like $50 million or something like that, would you be ready today?

正確的。不，這很有道理。看起來 PPNR 似乎每個季度、每一年或每兩年都會走高，但顯然很大程度上取決於未來的六到七個季度。但是，當您考慮僅與 PPNR 相關的投資支出（即非 ECR 相關的存款）時，從非運行利率角度來看，投資是否有任何增量，即獲得超過您仍然需要做的 1000 億美元？或者如果規則改變，1000 億美元變成 5000 萬美元或類似的數字，你今天準備好了嗎？

So embedded in our forecast and certainly in our PPNR guide is the fact that we continue to build out our LFI readiness. And we assume on a natural growth curve that somewhere at the end of '26, early '27 will be over $100 billion, and we are preparing to do that. And embedded in our expense base is about $30 million to do that, okay?

因此，在我們的預測中，當然也在我們的 PPNR 指南中，我們將繼續加強我們的 LFI 準備工作。我們假設根據自然成長曲線，26 年底或 27 年初的某個時候將超過 1000 億美元，我們正準備這樣做。我們的支出基礎中已經包含了大約 3000 萬美元用於實現這一目標，好嗎？

Now if your question is, if new rules or regulations come out, and kind of pushed that out a little bit, we don't have to be ready to cross over $100 billion. Then yes, there would be some expense savings as we would push out the development for that.

現在，如果你的問題是，如果有新的規則或法規，並稍微推遲這一點，我們不必準備超過 1000 億美元。是的，我們會推動相關開發，從而節省一些開支。

But I'll tell you, just on -- as much as this is a heavy lift for us inside of the company, and I don't think it really gets appreciated that or what type of heavy lift we're doing inside the company and simultaneously being able to grow the company the way we're growing it. The preparation for the LFI or Category 4 levels actually helps us make better decisions. It provides a better -- this cost around the table with better data. And so we are seeing some benefits from it immediately as we prepare to cross over that level in the future.

但我要告訴你，儘管這對我們公司內部來說是一項繁重的工作，但我認為人們並沒有真正意識到這一點，或者我們在公司內部做了哪些類型的繁重工作，同時能夠以我們的方式發展公司。對 LFI 或 4 類層級的準備實際上有助於我們做出更好的決策。它提供了更好的——這個成本表周圍有更好的數據。因此，當我們準備在未來跨越這一水平時，我們立即看到了一些好處。

Timur Braziler, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的 Timur Braziler。

Going back to the loan yield conversation, just the C&I loans that were put on back end of the quarter. I'm just wondering given rate activity, could you actually see those loan yields increase in 2Q or just some of the pricing pressures that you're talking through the loan production was below the kind of average balance for the first quarter?

回到貸款收益率的討論，只是本季末發放的 C&I 貸款。我只是想知道，鑑於利率活動，您是否真的看到這些貸款收益率在第二季度上升，或者只是您所說的一些定價壓力導致貸款產量低於第一季的平均餘額？

Yes. I was not -- you're going to see those loan yields increase over in Q2. Again, we have a rate decrease occurring in the second quarter, so that will put some pressure on the loan yields. Dale mentioned this in his comments that we are seeing some pricing pressure in the market.

是的。我沒有——你會看到這些貸款收益率在第二季度增加。再次，我們在第二季會降低利率，因此這將對貸款收益率帶來一些壓力。戴爾在他的評論中提到，我們看到市場上存在一些定價壓力。

So we're still winning deals, but there are a number of banks that are out there really searching and groping for loan growth. And sometimes they come in with pricing that for us doesn't make any sense, and we'll walk away from those deals. But there is some gradual downward pressure on loan yields.

因此，我們仍在贏得交易，但也有許多銀行正在積極尋找和摸索貸款成長。有時他們給予的定價對我們來說毫無意義，我們就會放棄這些交易。但貸款收益率面臨一些逐漸下行的壓力。

As Ken mentioned, we have two rate cuts expected. The first of those is at the June FOMC meeting, which is in the middle of the month. And so assuming it's a 25-basis point cut, that will move the preponderance of our loan book, lower by 25 bps as well. Again, it's only for 1/6 of the quarter, but you're going to get a haircut of a few basis points from that too.

正如肯所提到的，我們預計會有兩次降息。第一次是在六月中旬舉行的 FOMC 會議上。因此，假設降息 25 個基點，我們大部分的貸款也會隨之降低 25 個基點。再說一次，這只是季度的 1/6，但你也會因此損失幾個基點。

Great. And then my follow-up, just on credit. Maybe can you talk through the increase in C&I classified this quarter? And then as you look at the office portfolio, just the reappraisal rates, when I'm looking at Page 22 of the deck, just over the last couple of quarters, that's grown from 7% over 80% LTV in 3Q, that's over 25% of the portfolio today. I granted much of that did occur last quarter.

偉大的。然後是我的後續行動，僅基於信用。您能否談談本季 C&I 分類資料的成長情況？然後，當您查看辦公室投資組合時，僅查看重新評估率，當我查看第 22 頁時，僅在過去幾個季度中，該比率已從第三季度的 7% 增長到 80% 以上的 LTV，即今天投資組合的 25% 以上。我承認上個季度確實發生了許多這樣的情況。

I'm just wondering how granular with some of those reappraisals, now over 80%. And just with 40% of the office book maturing in '25, 75% maturing through '26 the current uncertainty in the macro change the way you potentially think about the risk profile of these upcoming maturities?

我只是想知道這些重新評估的詳細程度如何，現在超過 80%。而且由於 40% 的辦公室債券將在 25 年到期，75% 將在 26 年到期，當前宏觀的不確定性是否會改變您對這些即將到期債券的風險狀況的看法？

Sure. Yes, I'll take that. So first, with the substandard in our methodology and our risk rating, we are quick to move into substandard we use special mention very sparingly. And we do that because we have built our culture around elevation and then timely resolution. So that moves those loans into a very direct remediation strategy. So the movements in substandard are all fully secured, fully appraised and real estate back, not unlike the discussion we've had on past calls.

當然。是的，我接受。因此，首先，由於我們的方法和風險評級不合格，我們很快就會進入不合格狀態，我們很少使用特別提及。我們這樣做是因為我們建立了以提升和及時解決問題為核心的文化。這樣就將這些貸款轉入了非常直接的補救策略。因此，次級標準的變動都是完全有保障的，經過充分評估，並且房地產回歸，這與我們在過去的電話會議上討論過的並沒有什麼不同。

So when we look at the appraisal rates, everything that we underwrite. Let's talk about office. Everything that we underwrite in office, we go in at 55% or below on the appraised value. And then we have any additional fundings that would move on from there as we call it, good news money with signed leases and close support from the sponsorship.

因此，當我們查看評估率時，我們會承保所有內容。讓我們談談辦公室。我們在辦公室承保的所有項目，其估價都是 55% 或以下。然後，我們將得到任何額外的資金，正如我們所說，這些資金是透過簽署租約和贊助商的密切支持而獲得的好消息資金。

So through this cycle, we've been rigorous to make sure that we have that support dynamic and that if we don't have that dynamic, we take very timely moves to sort control over the asset. So as you see, those move up.

因此，在整個週期中，我們一直嚴格確保我們擁有這種支援動態，如果我們沒有這種動態，我們會及時採取措施對資產進行控制。正如你所見，它們上升了。

You also see the basis of appraisal move from a fair market value to a very conservative as is value, giving effect to current market conditions. So when you see those appraisal movements, the number is a small part of the story. The bigger part is the basis of the appraisal.

您還會看到評估基礎從公平市場價值轉變為非常保守的現狀價值，以反映當前的市場狀況。因此，當你看到這些評估變動時，數字只是故事的一小部分。更大一部分是評估的依據。

Chris McGratty, KBW.

克里斯·麥格拉蒂，KBW。

Great. Thanks. Welcome back, Ken. If I'm looking at slide 18, the guide, is there any reason why you would gear us away from the midpoint across PPNR? Are you leaning in any direction for any of the NII fees or expenses?

偉大的。謝謝。歡迎回來，肯。如果我看第 18 張投影片（指南），您有什麼理由讓我們遠離 PPNR 的中點嗎？您是否傾向於任何 NII 費用或開支？

Chris, your question again is what? I think -- if I'm looking at your future guidance, is there any reason for us to assume the midpoint of the various ranges? Or are you leaning to the high or low end in any one of the three component of pre-provision earnings.

克里斯，你的問題又是什麼？我認為——如果我正在查看您未來的指導，我們是否有理由假設各個範圍的中點？或者，您是否傾向於撥備前收益三個組成部分中的任意一個的高端或低端。

I think the midpoint is appropriate. If I had my druthers in terms of what would happen by the end of 2025, we would have pushed a little harder on deposit growth and a little harder on loan growth based upon from the guidance we have here, and that would be kind of the primary driver of improved performance. But again, we want to be very attentive to changes in economic conditions that got have been rather frequent of late.

我認為中間點是合適的。如果我能決定 2025 年底會發生什麼，我們會根據目前的指導，更加努力地推動存款成長，更加努力地推動貸款成長，這將成為業績改善的主要驅動力。但再次強調，我們要密切注意最近相當頻繁的經濟狀況變化。

Okay. And then that point, Dale, if the revenue either mortgage or the growth doesn't come through, but can you speak to the degree to flex the expenses a little harder?

好的。那麼，戴爾，如果收入、抵押貸款或成長沒有實現，你能談談在多大程度上可以稍微靈活地減少開支嗎？

I think if there's any flex that's really going to drive PPNR upward will be higher loan growth and higher average earning assets that would drive the PPNR of higher. I think the flex on the expenses is pretty much what we've guided to at this point and I would not change that guide or change that in your model.

我認為，如果有任何因素能夠真正推動 PPNR 上升，那就是更高的貸款成長率和更高的平均收益資產，這將推動 PPNR 上升。我認為費用的彈性基本上就是我們目前所指導的，我不會改變這個指導或改變你的模型。

Jon Arfstrom, RBC.

加拿大皇家銀行的喬恩‧阿夫斯特羅姆 (Jon Arfstrom)。

Thanks. Hello, everyone. A question for you guys on the mortgage banking outlook. I think, Ken, you mentioned earlier, flat mortgage revenues year-over-year. Can you talk a little bit about your rate assumptions around those expectations? And is there a 10-year level where the volumes start to increase and there's upside to that outlook?

謝謝。大家好。我想問大家一個關於抵押貸款銀行前景的問題。肯，我認為您之前提到過，抵押貸款收入同比持平。您能否稍微談談圍繞這些預期的利率假設？是否存在 10 年期水平，交易量開始增加，並且前景有上行空間？

Yes. I mean in terms of mortgage rates and what we saw last year, the pickup in volume begins somewhere when the mortgage yield for the 30-year is $625 or lower. That's when we saw it to really see pickup in volume.

是的。我的意思是，就抵押貸款利率而言，以及我們去年看到的情況，當 30 年期抵押貸款收益率達到 625 美元或更低時，抵押貸款數量就會開始回升。那時我們才真正看到交易量在回升。

If you talk to the mortgage folks at AmeriHome, they'll tell you anything that crack 6% would really be a rate for the roses in terms of a much, much higher volume. So we're assuming that rates kind of stay where they are to getting a little bit better throughout the year and that's sort of what gives us this projection to keep mortgage income flat year-over-year.

如果你和 AmeriHome 的抵押貸款人員交談，他們會告訴你，從高得多的額度來看，6% 的突破實際上是一個非常好的利率。因此，我們假設利率在全年將保持現狀或略有改善，這讓我們預測抵押貸款收入將與去年同期持平。

I will tell you that we are watching consumer behavior, and we're mindful that the recent rate and market volatility could impact future consumer behavior and we'll wait to see how unfolds. But right now, we're sticking with the full year guide. It may come a little bit later in second quarter and then into the third quarter. I think April was a little choppy for consumers for the obvious reasons.

我會告訴你，我們正在關註消費者行為，我們注意到最近的利率和市場波動可能會影響未來的消費者行為，我們將拭​​目以待。但目前，我們仍堅持全年指南。它可能會在第二季度稍晚出現，然後進入第三季。我認為由於顯而易見的原因，四月的消費者狀況有些不穩定。

We've heard this persistent cry, refis are coming, refis are coming, and yet they seem to be going to perpetually put off. And there's two pieces, as Ken was mentioning, two pieces to that rate spread issue that we have. One of them is overall rates higher and then the other is the volatility in the premium price above like the 10-year treasury for the mortgage -- refinance.

我們聽到了這種持續不斷的呼聲，再融資即將到來，再融資即將到來，但它們似乎將永遠被推遲。正如肯所提到的那樣，我們的利率差問題有兩個面向。其中之一是整體利率較高，另一個是溢價的波動性，例如抵押貸款再融資的 10 年期公債。

And that's because, in part, they some of our concern, buyers are concerned, well, if I buy this mortgage now, but yet we see the volatility crush or we see rates decline for whatever reason that could happen, maybe a pullback in terms of tariff action, maybe action from the FOMC, we could see both of those collapsed.

部分原因是，我們的一些擔憂，買家擔心，如果我現在購買這筆抵押貸款，但我們看到波動性崩潰或利率下降，無論出於何種原因，可能是關稅行動的回調，可能是聯邦公開市場委員會的行動，我們可能會看到這兩者都崩潰。

And so if you're going to be buying financing mortgages, you're going to be in a refi business kind of out of the gate. And I think just more stability might mute the vol and the rates for what we have in a 30-year mortgage property relative to market -- independent market rates anyway.

因此，如果您要購買融資抵押貸款，那麼您一開始就會從事再融資業務。我認為，只要更穩定，就可能降低 30 年期抵押貸款相對於市場（獨立市場利率）的波動率和利率。

Yes. Okay. That makes sense. Any thoughts on the gain on the outlook. Would you -- do you think 19 basis points is nearly low? Or any thoughts on that outlook?

是的。好的。這很有道理。對於前景的收益有什麼想法嗎？您認為 19 個基點是否太低了？或對這種觀點有什麼看法？

I don't -- I can't say whether it's going to expand. I would say that 19 basis points is unusually low.

我不知道——我不能說它是否會擴張。我想說 19 個基點異常低。

Andrew Terrell, Stephens.

安德魯·特雷爾，史蒂芬斯。

Good morning, and again, welcome back. If I could ask on just Dale, you mentioned in the prepared remarks the Moody's rating change back in February. I was hoping you could maybe just discuss a bit more any incremental traction you're gaining in the Corporate Trust business following that news. I know it's been a point you guys have talked about for a couple of years now.

早安，再次歡迎回來。如果我可以只問戴爾，你在準備好的評論中提到了穆迪在二月的評級變化。我希望您能再多談一下您在該消息發布後在企業信託業務方面取得的進展。我知道這是你們幾年來一直在談論的一個話題。

Well, I think primarily what it does is, again, reinforces confidence in terms of the strength and stability of the company. It was also upgraded by Fitch at that same timeline. And so a lot of those are based upon kind of deposit rating as opposed to debt ratings, which already were an A-rated situation. So we think that's helpful. But again, it kind of gets back in terms of kind of closer to where we've been historically.

嗯，我認為它主要的作用是再次增強人們對公司實力和穩定性的信心。惠譽也在同一時間上調了其評級。因此，許多評級都是基於存款評級，而不是債務評級，而債務評級已經是 A 級了。所以我們認為這很有幫助。但從某種程度上來說，它又回到了我們歷史上所處的水平。

And we think, overall, it just promotes confidence, not just in Corporate Trust, but with our business Escrow services with our digital account products as well.

我們認為，總體而言，它不僅增強了信心，而且對我們的業務託管服務和數位帳戶產品也是如此。

I'll just add to that. I'm very proud of the Corporate Trust folks this quarter. They improved deposits $270 million. Our Corporate Trust business is now over $800 million in deposits, our business Escrow services is just about touching $1 billion.

我只想補充一點。我為本季的企業信託員工感到非常自豪。他們提高了 2.7 億美元的存款。我們的企業信託業務目前存款超過 8 億美元，我們的業務託管服務存款即將達到 10 億美元。

And so we've got six different digital or six different deposit platforms that are going gangbusters, led by, of course, HOA, which we now think we are the market share leader. And as Dale mentioned earlier, grew $900 million. So yes, I think the upgrade in investment-grade rating is going to help. I just think these deals take time. We've got to be awarded deals and then they've got to fund the deals and then we get those deposits.

因此，我們擁有六種不同的數字或六種不同的存款平台，它們正在蓬勃發展，當然，其中以 HOA 為首，我們現在認為我們是市場份額的領導者。正如戴爾之前提到的，成長了 9 億美元。所以是的，我認為投資級評級的提升將會有所幫助。我只是認為這些交易需要時間。我們必須獲得交易，然後他們必須為交易提供資金，然後我們才能獲得這些存款。

But we're encouraged by what's happening in all of our deposit channels, and I think it's supported by that upgrade by Moody's and by Fitch.

但我們對所有存款管道的進展感到鼓舞，我認為這也得到了穆迪和惠譽評級升級的支持。

Great. I appreciate the color. If I can go back to just some of the commentary on loan yields. I don't know if you guys have it, but could you share the weighted average yield on the new production for the first quarter? I'm just trying to get a sense of I hear you on the competitive front. Just trying to get a sense for how different new loans being put on or from the, call it, 620 or so book yield today?

偉大的。我很欣賞這個顏色。如果我可以回顧一下有關貸款收益率的一些評論。我不知道你們是否有，但你能分享第一季新產品的加權平均收益率嗎？我只是想了解我在競爭方面聽到了什麼。只是想了解一下，今天發放的新貸款與 620 左右的帳面收益率有何不同？

Riding -- coming in at 3 basis points lower, but our deposit costs are coming in 29 basis points lower. So we're seeing a slight decline in yields -- loan yields, but we're picking it back up in deposits.

騎行－下降了 3 個基點，但我們的存款成本下降了 29 個基點。因此，我們看到貸款收益率略有下降，但存款收益率正在回升。

Matthew Clark, Piper Sandler.

馬修克拉克、派珀桑德勒。

Thanks and good morning. Welcome back, Ken. Just on the kind of round out the discussion on margin and NII, it looks like you've got some pretty good visibility going into 2Q with the end-of-period loan growth, call it 617 and the drop in the spot rate. You would argue for a margin over 360 on a reported basis. But any sense for kind of where that margin ended at the end of the quarter, if you normalize it for any unusual fees?

謝謝，早安。歡迎回來，肯。就保證金和 NII 的討論而言，看起來您對第二季度的情況有了相當好的了解，因為期末貸款增長，也就是 617 和即期匯率下降。您將主張以報告為基礎的 360 以上的利潤率。但是，如果您根據任何不尋常的費用對利潤率進行標準化，那麼在季度末該利潤率的結束位置是怎樣的呢？

Well, we don't track what the margin is at -- sorry, at the end of the month or end -- sorry.

嗯，我們沒有追蹤利潤率——抱歉，是在月底或月底——抱歉。

Yes, end of the month. End of the month, yes.

是的，月底。是的，月底。

Yes. So, end of the month, right? I'll just say -- let me try to kind of give you this -- guy. I think when you think about the net interest margin, we kind of see it staying rather kind of moving slightly upwards in Q2 a little bit more in Q3 and then plateauing Q4 to Q3. That's the net interest margin.

是的。那麼，月底了，對吧？我只想說——讓我試著給你這個——夥計。我認為，當您考慮淨利差時，我們會看到它在第二季度保持略微上升的勢頭，在第三季度再上升一點，然後在第四季度到第三季度趨於平穩。這就是淨利差。

The adjusted net interest margin, in case of the VCR costs we kind of see second quarter and first quarter kind of being about the same and then we kind of see it growing net interest margin improving -- adjusted net interest margin improving stronger in Q3 and then again in Q4, that's probably the best guidance I can give you on that.

調整後的淨利差，就 VCR 成本而言，我們預計第二季和第一季的淨利差大致相同，然後我們看到淨利差在成長 - 調整後的淨利差在第三季和第四季將進一步改善，這可能是我能給你的最佳指引。

Yes, you're definitely going to see more leverage over the adjusted margin than just a reported margin. That's really -- that's closer to what we're focused on. It's more direct relationship to PPNR. What we don't want to do is we don't want to not underwrite -- we have liquidity, a reasonable credit opportunity that has strong credit metrics just because it might be decremental to the loan yields under the margin.

是的，您肯定會看到調整後的保證金比報告的保證金具有更大的槓桿作用。這確實——這更接近我們關注的重點。它與 PPNR 有更直接的關係。我們不想做的是，我們不想不承保——我們有流動性，有合理的信貸機會，有強大的信貸指標，只是因為它可能會降低保證金下的貸款收益率。

Okay. Fair enough. And then just on the criticized increase this quarter. Any thoughts on the outlook and migration in general, whether or not we might see some improvement? Or is this kind of environment makes a little more skeptical?

好的。很公平。然後就本季受到的批評有所增加。對於前景和移民整體情況有什麼看法？我們是否會看到一些改善？還是這種環境讓人更懷疑？

Our migration, as I mentioned, is really focused on real estate related, particularly office secured loans. So when we look at those, those have been in view now for a couple of years and we've been working our strategies on that.

正如我所提到的，我們的遷移主要集中在房地產相關領域，特別是辦公室擔保貸款。因此，當我們審視這些問題時，我們發現這些問題已經存在好幾年了，我們也一直在為此制定策略。

So when we look forward, we see the path to resolution as well as the necessary steps and we know the assets by name. Again, this is a floating rate portfolio. We're not waiting for a balloons or maturities here. So we've developed these assets early. So where I see it, it's flat in the coming quarter, we see it begin to move downward in the later part of the year.

因此，當我們展望未來時，我們會看到解決問題的途徑以及必要的步驟，並且我們知道資產的名稱。再次強調，這是一個浮動利率投資組合。我們並不是在等待氣球或到期債券。所以我們很早就開發了這些資產。因此，我認為，下一季它將持平，而下半年它將開始下降。

Anthony Elian, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的安東尼·埃利安。

Ken, good to hear you're feeling much better and welcome back. I want to start on loan growth. I know you mentioned that second quarter should talk. I know you mentioned that second quarter loan growth should top first quarter growth. But can you just share with us anecdotally anything you've heard since Liberation Day on what you've heard from your customers in terms of business investment, CapEx they may be thinking about, but that's on pause now. And if they're making any adjustments now given the elevated uncertainty from tariffs?

肯，很高興聽到你感覺好多了，歡迎回來。我想開始研究貸款成長。我知道您提到應該談論第二季度。我知道您提到第二季的貸款成長應該超過第一季的成長。但是，您能否與我們分享一下自解放日以來您從客戶那裡聽到的有關商業投資、資本支出方面的趣聞軼事，他們可能正在考慮這些，但現在已經暫停了。鑑於關稅不確定性增加，他們現在是否會做出任何調整？

Yes. So our clients are certainly mindful and cautious of what's going on. I would say the longer the tariff discussion stays in nimble, the more uncertainty and angst will be added to their outlook. But we're seeing a lot of our growth in Q2 come from longer-dated capital expenditure programs, i.e., national homebuilder finance, which we do a lot financing, and then we do the vertical construction on that. Those folks make a longer-term investment decisions, and we're funding them as such.

是的。因此，我們的客戶肯定會留意並謹慎地關注正在發生的事情。我想說，關稅討論持續的時間越長，他們的前景就會越充滿不確定性和焦慮。但我們看到第二季度的大部分增長來自較長期的資本支出計劃，即全國房屋建築商融資，我們對此進行了大量融資，然後我們在此基礎上進行垂直建設。這些人做出了長期投資決策，而我們也為他們提供資金。

And so those folks are, of course, mindful, but not immediately impacting their business mostly because there's somewhat of a housing shortage in the US. On the C&I side, lender finance seems to continue to push forward. We're actually seeing some improvements in tech in innovation.

當然，這些人很謹慎，但這並不會立即影響他們的業務，主要是因為美國存在一定程度的住房短缺。在商業和工業方面，貸款融資似乎繼續向前邁進。我們確實看到了技術創新方面的一些進步。

Although overall, that sector has slowed a little bit, certainly in deposit generation and liquidity events. But we seem to be winning more than our fair share of market deals that are out there are taking market share. And so that's giving us some confidence as well.

但總體而言，該行業有所放緩，尤其是在存款產生和流動性事件方面。但我們贏得的市場份額似乎超過了我們應得的份額，而其他交易正在搶佔市場份額。這也給了我們一些信心。

And then my follow-up on credit. If I think back to the early days of COVID, you guys were early in terms of proactiveness diving deeper into potential problem portfolios. Ken, it sounds like you did that again based on your prepared remarks and you don't see a significant number of borrowers or meaningful exposures to China or Canada. But are there any segments now within national business lines that you're just paying a little bit more attention to given the outsized uncertainty?

然後是我對信用的跟進。如果我回想一下 COVID 爆發初期，你們很早就開始積極主動地深入研究潛在問題組合。肯，聽起來你根據準備好的發言再次這樣做了，你沒有看到大量的借款人或對中國或加拿大的有意義的敞口。但是，考慮到巨大的不確定性，現在您是否對全國業務線中的某些部分更加關注？

We really look at our -- as Ken entered with our diversified business model as the strategy for any type of economy, and it plays out in this type of economy. So we're constantly at the table, dialing some of our businesses up a little bit, and we're seeing great results and we're dialing other businesses down.

我們確實將我們的多元化商業模式視為適合任何類型經濟的策略，並且它在這種類型的經濟中發揮作用。因此，我們一直在討論，稍微增加一些業務，並且看到了很好的結果，同時，我們也減少了其他業務。

So we're a bank going into this period with virtually no retailer energy exposure. No consumer exposure outside of our mortgage business. And all of our borrowers, for the most part, are domestic companies doing business in the US. That doesn't take the risk away, but it gives us a very manageable model with our diversified strategy where we can, we think manage through this better than most.

因此，我們是一家進入這段時期的銀行，幾乎沒有零售商能源風險敞口。在我們的抵押貸款業務之外，沒有任何消費者接觸。我們的借款人大多都是在美國開展業務的國內公司。這並不能消除風險，但它為我們提供了一個非常易於管理的模型，透過多元化策略，我們認為我們可以比大多數人更好地管理這個問題。

There are no further questions at this time. So I'll pass it back to Ken Vecchione for any closing remarks.

目前沒有其他問題。因此，我將把它交還給 Ken Vecchione 以供其做最後發言。

Yes. Thank you all for joining us, and thank you for, again for all your well wishes and look forward to seeing you on the road at conferences and then picking up again with you on our next earnings call. Thanks again.

是的。感謝大家加入我們，再次感謝你們的所有美好祝愿，並期待在會議上見到你們，然後在下次財報電話會議上再次與你們見面。再次感謝。

That concludes today's call. Thank you all for your participation. You may now disconnect your lines.

今天的電話會議到此結束。謝謝大家的參與。現在您可以斷開線路了。