Western Alliance Bancorp (WAL) 2024 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day, everyone. Welcome to Western Alliance Bancorporation's second-quarter 2024 earnings call. You may also view the presentation today via webcast through the company's website at www.westernalliancebancorporation.com.

今天是個好日子。歡迎參加 Western Alliance Bancorporation 的 2024 年第二季財報電話會議。您也可以透過公司網站 www.westernalliancebancorporation.com 透過網路廣播觀看今天的簡報。

I would now like to turn the call over to Miles Pondelik, Director of Investor Relations and Corporate Development. Please go ahead.

我現在想將電話轉給投資者關係和企業發展總監 Miles Pondelik。請繼續。

Thank you. Welcome to Western Alliance Bank's second-quarter 2024 conference call. Our speakers today are Ken Vecchione, President and Chief Executive Officer, and Dale Gibbons, Chief Financial Officer.

謝謝。歡迎參加西部聯盟銀行 2024 年第二季電話會議。今天我們的演講者是總裁兼執行長 Ken Vecchione 和財務長 Dale Gibbons。

Before I hand the call over to Ken, please note that today's presentation contains forward-looking statements, which are subject to risks, uncertainties, and assumptions. Except as required by law, the company does not undertake any obligation to update any forward-looking statements. For a more complete discussion of the risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from any forward-looking statements, please refer to the company's SEC filings included in the Form 8-K filed yesterday, which are available on the company's website.

在我將電話轉交給肯恩之前，請注意，今天的簡報包含前瞻性陳述，這些陳述受到風險、不確定性和假設的影響。除法律要求外，本公司不承擔更新任何前瞻性聲明的義務。有關可能導致實際結果與任何前瞻性陳述存在重大差異的風險和不確定性的更完整討論，請參閱昨天提交的8-K 表格中包含的公司向SEC 提交的文件，該文件可在公司網站上獲取。

Now for opening remarks, I'd like to turn the call over to Ken Vecchione.

現在，我想將電話轉給 Ken Vecchione 致開幕詞。

Thank you, Miles. Good morning, everyone. I'll make some brief comments about our second quarter earnings before turning the call over to Dale, who will review our financial results in more detail after I discuss our updated 2024 outlook. Tim Bruckner, back by popular demand, our Chief Credit Banking Officer for Regional Banking, will join us for Q&A.

謝謝你，邁爾斯。大家，早安。在將電話轉給戴爾之前，我將對我們第二季度的收益做一些簡短的評論，戴爾將在我討論我們更新的 2024 年展望後更詳細地審查我們的財務業績。我們的區域銀行業務首席信貸銀行官 Tim Bruckner 應大眾要求，將與我們一起進行問答。

Western Alliance earned $1.75 per share in the second quarter and demonstrated the bank's building momentum as our repositioning strategy has transitioned into earnings growth strategy. Growth will be accompanied by an elevated risk management architecture as well as enhanced liquidity profile and capital base.

西部聯盟第二季每股收益為 1.75 美元，隨著我們的重新定位策略轉變為獲利成長策略，展現了該銀行的建設勢頭。成長將伴隨著更高的風險管理架構以及增強的流動性狀況和資本基礎。

Thoughtful balance sheet growth in Q2 drove an upward inflection in net interest income from increased liquidity deployment into higher-yielding earning assets. We generated outsized core deposit growth of $4 billion and HFI loan growth of $1.7 billion or 14% on an annualized basis from Q1, which we expect will exceed our peers. CET1 capital remained at 11%. Deposit growth in excess of guidance lowered our HFI loan-to-deposit ratio by 2 points to 79%.

第二季資產負債表的良好成長推動了淨利息收入的上升，這是由於流動性配置增加到高收益資產而產生的。從第一季開始，我們的核心存款成長了 40 億美元，HFI 貸款成長了 17 億美元，年化成長率為 14%，我們預計這將超過同業。CET1資本維持在11%。存款成長超過指導，導致我們的 HFI 貸存比下降 2 個百分點，達到 79%。

Our liquidity profile was also bolstered by a $1.7 billion increase in securities and cash from quarter end, which allowed us to pay down borrowings by $634 million and broker deposits by $222 million. Our differentiated national commercial banking franchise uniquely positions us to generate sustained deposit growth from various business lines and deploy this liquidity into attractive, from no to low loss C&I commercial loans where we have deep segment and product expertise.

我們的流動性狀況也因季末增加了 17 億美元的證券和現金而得到增強，這使我們能夠償還 6.34 億美元的借款和 2.22 億美元的經紀人存款。我們差異化的全國性商業銀行特許經營權使我們能夠從各個業務線產生持續的存款增長，並將這種流動性部署到有吸引力的、從無損失到低損失的工商業貸款中，我們擁有深厚的細分市場和產品專業知識。

Asset quality overall is normalizing, which we expected. Total classified assets declined $33 million in the quarter to 93 basis points. Net charge-offs were 18 basis points of average loans, the majority of which relates to the Downtown San Diego office property we identified on this call a year ago when it migrated to substandard.

資產品質整體正在正常化，這符合我們的預期。本季分類資產總額下降 3,300 萬美元，至 93 個基點。淨沖銷額為平均貸款的 18 個基點，其中大部分與我們在一年前的電話會議中發現的聖地牙哥市中心辦公物業有關，當時該物業已轉為不合格。

I think it's also important to note the renewed earnings power of our franchise strengthens our ability to consistently compound capital and generate risk-adjusted earnings growth to support the Q3 and Q4 earnings ramp we had previously communicated. For the quarter, net interest income grew 39% annualized driven by higher average earning assets and an expanding NIM. Annualized deposits and HFI loan growth of 26% and 14%, respectively, pushed net interest income higher. Higher ending balances compared to average balances establishes a higher jumping off point to increase net interest income going forward. In total, pre-provision net revenue adjusted for the FDIC special assessment in Q4 and the rebate in Q1 is 22% annualized, and is poised to continue its upward trajectory.

我認為還需要注意的是，我們特許經營權的新盈利能力增強了我們持續複合資本和產生風險調整後盈利增長的能力，以支持我們之前溝通過的第三季度和第四季度盈利增長。在平均收益資產增加和淨利差擴大的推動下，本季淨利息收入年化成長 39%。年化存款和 HFI 貸款分別成長 26% 和 14%，推動淨利息收入上升。與平均餘額相比，較高的期末餘額為增加未來的淨利息收入建立了更高的起點。總體而言，根據第四季度 FDIC 特別評估調整的撥備前淨收入和第一季的回扣年化率為 22%，並有望繼續保持上升趨勢。

At this point, I'll turn the call over to Dale for a review of the financial results.

此時，我將把電話轉給戴爾，以審查財務結果。

Thanks, Ken. During the second quarter, Western Alliance generated pre-provision net revenue of $285 million, net income of $194 million, and EPS of $1.75.

謝謝，肯。第二季度，西部聯盟撥備前淨收入為2.85億美元，淨利為1.94億美元，每股收益為1.75美元。

Net interest income increased $58 million from Q1 to $657 million due to higher average earning asset balances and yields.

由於平均生息資產餘額和收益率較高，淨利息收入較第一季增加 5,800 萬美元，達到 6.57 億美元。

Non-interest income of $115 million decreased $15 million quarter-over-quarter, primarily from lower income from equity investments as well as softer mortgage revenue. Mortgage loan production rose 14% and interest rate lock commitment volume increased 24%, while the gain on sale margin compressed by 3 basis points.

非利息收入為 1.15 億美元，環比減少 1,500 萬美元，主要是由於股權投資收入減少以及抵押貸款收入疲軟。抵押貸款產量增加 14%，利率鎖定承諾量成長 24%，而銷售利潤率收益則壓縮 3 個基點。

Non-interest expense was $487 million, deposit costs of $174 million growth in quarter-over-quarter increase to find attractive loan growth amidst an elevated rate environment.

非利息支出為 4.87 億美元，存款成本環比增長 1.74 億美元，以在利率上升的環境中找到有吸引力的貸款增長。

Net interest income growth exceeded the increase in deposit costs by $21 million this quarter as mortgage warehouse deposit growth continues to benefit from market share gains amidst industry disruption in the first quarter.

本季淨利息收入成長超過存款成本成長 2,100 萬美元，因為第一季產業混亂期間抵押貸款倉庫存款成長繼續受益於市場份額的成長。

We believe Western Alliance's warehouse lending group has become the premier bank in the space. Considering our enhanced liquidity profile, we are well positioned to proactively lower the ECR cost of these deposits as the first rate cuts approaches. Provision expense of $37 million resulted from loan growth above industry trends as well as $23 million of net charge-offs.

我們相信西部聯盟的倉庫貸款集團已成為該領域的首屈一指的銀行。考慮到我們增強的流動性狀況，隨著第一次降息的臨近，我們有能力主動降低這些存款的 ECR 成本。撥備費用為 3,700 萬美元，原因是貸款成長高於行業趨勢以及 2,300 萬美元的淨沖銷。

Securities and cash increased $1.7 billion quarter-over-quarter and allowed for a further $634 million reduction in period-end borrowings. Loans held for investment grew $1.7 billion to $52.4 billion while deposits increased $4 billion and $66.2 billion at quarter end.

證券和現金季增 17 億美元，使得期末借款進一步減少 6.34 億美元。截至季末，投資貸款增加 17 億美元，達到 524 億美元，存款增加 40 億美元，達到 662 億美元。

Finally, tangible book value per share continued its expansion, rising 3% or $1.49 from March 31 to $48.79. Loan growth was primarily driven in the C&I categories of $1.9 million, which offset continued purposeful reductions in residential and consumer loans of $179 million in construction and land of $69 million.

最後，每股有形帳面價值持續擴張，較 3 月 31 日上漲 3%，即 1.49 美元，至 48.79 美元。貸款成長主要由 C&I 類別的 190 萬美元推動，抵消了住宅和消費貸款 1.79 億美元的建築貸款和土地貸款 6,900 萬美元的持續有目的地減少。

Mortgage warehouse, tech and innovation, and fund banking loan grew loan mix diversification while we reduced our CRE concentration. On a year-over-year basis, C&I loans have grown $5 billion. Deposit growth of $4 billion was led by mortgage warehouse and followed by growth in Juris Banking and our digital consumer channel.

抵押貸款倉庫、科技和創新以及基金銀行貸款增加了貸款組合的多元化，同時我們降低了商業房地產的集中度。工商業貸款年增 50 億美元。抵押貸款倉庫帶動存款增加 40 億美元，其次是 Juris Banking 和我們的數位消費管道的成長。

Non-ECR, non-interest-bearing deposits have posted three consecutive quarters of growth and we are encouraged by the traction our diversified deposit channels are gaining, which should continue to drive growth in deposits that carry no direct or imputed interest cost.

非ECR、無利息存款已連續三個季度成長，我們對多元化存款管道的吸引力感到鼓舞，這將繼續推動無直接或推算利息成本的存款成長。

Turning now to our net interest drivers. The yield on total securities increased 21 basis points to 4.87%, recapturing two-thirds of the prior quarter's decline from HQLA build since conducted in the first quarter. Completing our accelerated liquidity build related to larger balance sheet repositioning efforts allow us to add more higher-yielding securities. Our liquidity position remains solid and unencumbered high-quality liquid assets were 53% of securities and cash compared to 52% last quarter. Securities and cash in total held steady at 26% of assets.

現在轉向我們的淨利息驅動因素。總證券收益率上升 21 個基點至 4.87%，收復了第一季以來 HQLA 建設中上一季降幅的三分之二。完成與更大的資產負債表重新定位工作相關的加速流動性建設，使我們能夠增加更多高收益證券。我們的流動性狀況依然穩固，無阻礙的優質流動資產佔證券和現金的 53%，而上季為 52%。證券和現金總計穩定在資產的 26%。

HFI loan yields increased 2 basis points due to asset repricing benefits from the ongoing higher rate environment. Back weighted loan growth momentum led to period-end loan balance exceeding average balances by $1.7 billion.

由於資產重新定價受益於持續的高利率環境，HFI 貸款收益率上升了 2 個基點。回算加權貸款成長動能導致期末貸款餘額超出平均餘額 17 億美元。

The cost of interest-bearing deposits was 6 basis points higher from the first quarter while the total cost of funds declined 3 basis points to 2.79% due to a deposit mix shift toward non-interest-bearing and a paydown of short-term borrowings.

計息存款成本較一季上升6個基點，而由於存款結構轉向無息以及償還短期借款，總資金成本下降3個基點至2.79%。

In aggregate, net interest income increased $58 million from higher average earning asset balances, which includes a full quarter's impact of the deployment of liquidity into securities towards the end of Q1 as well as a 3 basis points decline in the cost of liability funding.

總體而言，淨利息收入因平均收益資產餘額增加而增加了 5800 萬美元，其中包括第一季末將流動性部署到證券中的整個季度的影響以及負債融資成本下降 3 個基點。

Net interest margin expanded 3 basis points from the first quarter to 3.63% from the $5.9 billion increase in average earning assets as the growth was funded more from non-interest-bearing liabilities this quarter. Our adjusted efficiency ratio for the quarter was 52%. Net interest income growth is the primary contributor to this improvement.

淨息差較第一季擴大 3 個基點至 3.63%，平均獲利資產增加 59 億美元，因為本季成長較多來自無息負債。我們本季調整後的效率率為 52%。淨利息收入成長是這項改善的主要貢獻者。

Deposit costs increased $37 million from higher average ECR-related deposit balances. As noted earlier, these higher balances funded commercial loan growth and purchase floating rate securities that propelled strong net interest income growth. Other operating expenses were essentially flat quarter-over-quarter.

由於與 ECR 相關的平均存款餘額增加，存款成本增加了 3,700 萬美元。如前所述，這些較高的餘額為商業貸款成長提供了資金，並購買了浮動利率證券，從而推動了淨利息收入的強勁增長。其他營運支出較上季基本持平。

As Ken mentioned earlier, asset quality continues to normalize. Total classified assets declined $33 million in the quarter to 93 basis points of total assets. Non-performing assets were essentially flat from last quarter. Just under two-thirds of NPLs are paying as agreed when excluding the San Diego property that Ken cited earlier, which we expect to move into other real estate.

正如 Ken 之前提到的，資產品質繼續正常化。本季分類資產總額下降了 3,300 萬美元，佔總資產的 93 個基點。不良資產較上季基本持平。不包括肯早些時候提到的聖地亞哥房產，不到三分之二的不良貸款正在按約定支付，我們預計該房產將轉移到其他房地產。

Turning to slide 12. Quarterly loan growth -- quarterly net loan charge-offs were $22.8 million or 18 basis points of average loans. Most of the charge-offs this quarter were attributed to the San Diego office properties.

轉到投影片 12。季度貸款成長－季度貸款核銷淨額為 2,280 萬美元，即平均貸款的 18 個基點。本季的大部分沖銷都歸因於聖地牙哥的辦公物業。

Provision expense of $37.1 million cover net charge-offs and added reserves in concert with loan growth. Our allowance for funded loans increased $12 million from the prior quarter to $352 million.

3,710 萬美元的撥備費用用於支付淨沖銷和與貸款成長同步增加的準備金。我們的融資貸款準備金比上一季增加了 1,200 萬美元，達到 3.52 億美元。

Total loan ACL to funded loans ratio of 74 basis points was unchanged and covers 97% of non-performing loans.

總貸款 ACL 與融資貸款的比率保持在 74 個基點不變，涵蓋了 97% 的不良貸款。

Our focus on growing loans is indicating low-loss categories has resulted in a reserve levels lower than some years. Slide 13 shows our ACL lift from 74 basis points to 132 basis points when incorporating the effect in credit-linked notes, which insulate us to first loss credit unencumbered credits as well as loan no-to-low-loss categories like equity fund resources, our low LTV residential portfolio, and mortgage warehouse loans.

我們對成長貸款的關注表明，低損失類別導致準備金水準低於幾年。投影片13 顯示，當將信用掛鉤票據的影響納入其中時，我們的ACL 從74 個基點提升至132 個基點，這使我們免受首次損失信貸、無負擔信貸以及無貸款至低損失類別（如股權基金資源）的影響。

More specifically, for the credit-linked notes, we have in our possession, $447 million from insurers that we did conduct first losses on an $8.9 billion mortgage portfolio leaving us with zero loss risk. For our residential loans not covered by insurance, these mortgages have an LTV at only 62% at origination, which is slightly lower now to borrowers with FICO scores of 766 and debt-to-income ratios of 33% and have incurred no losses. For EFR capital call loans and mortgage warehouse credit, not only have we ever had a loss, but other banks have had pristine credit experience as well. We include this in a locked up for the ACL because we have a large proportion of our book in the very low risk categories and other institutions.

更具體地說，對於與信用掛鉤的票據，我們從保險公司獲得了 4.47 億美元，我們確實對 89 億美元的抵押貸款組合進行了首次損失，使我們的損失風險為零。對於我們沒有保險的住宅貸款，這些抵押貸款的貸款價值比僅為62%，對於FICO 分數為766、債務收入比為33% 的借款人來說，貸款價值比現在略低，但沒有造成任何損失。對於EFR資本通知貸款和抵押倉庫信貸，不僅我們曾經有過損失，而且其他銀行也有原始的信貸經驗。我們將其包含在 ACL 的鎖定中，因為我們的帳簿中很大一部分屬於極低風險類別和其他機構。

Our reserve level is supported by our low realized losses. We have consistently discussed our proactive mitigation strategy, along with our low advanced lending discipline, is employed -- ultimately these limit credit exposure.

我們的準備金水準受到我們較低的已實現損失的支撐。我們一直在討論我們採用的主動緩解策略以及我們的低高級貸款紀律，最終限制了信貸風險。

On slide 14, we present our historical look back on migration performance, which shows over the last three years, WAL ranks fourth or approximately one-third of the peer median on net charge-offs to average non-performing loans. Over the past decade, we ranked number one at only 9.6%. The table on the right shows our allowance numbers over 7 times in the last one net charge-offs, inclusive in the second quarter and places us in the top third among peers. Our ACL also covers our last four years of net charge-offs, which is the duration of our loan book by 4.3 times, which is the second best in the peer group during this timeframe.

在投影片 14 中，我們展示了對遷移績效的歷史回顧，這表明在過去三年中，WAL 在平均不良貸款淨沖銷方面排名第四，約為同行中位數的三分之一。過去十年，我們僅以9.6%排名第一。右表顯示，我們的津貼金額在上一次淨沖銷（包括第二季度）中增加了 7 倍以上，使我們在同行中名列前三。我們的 ACL 還涵蓋了我們過去四年的淨沖銷，這是我們貸款帳面期限的 4.3 倍，在該時間範圍內的同業中排名第二。

Our CET1 ratio remained 11%. Our tangible common equity ratio of the total assets moved down approximately 10 basis points from Q1 to 6.7% as asset growth and low-risk categories exceeded organic capital accretion from higher earnings.

我們的CET1比率保持在11%。由於資產成長和低風險類別超過了收益增加帶來的有機資本增值，我們總資產的有形普通股比率比第一季下降了約 10 個基點至 6.7%。

I think it's helpful to consider other sources of loss absorbing capital when evaluating our balance sheet -- viewing our CET1 capital ratio with AOCI marks and loss reserves as a percentage of risk-weighted assets, we ranked in the top third of our peer group. Notably, among the six peers on slide 14, with higher ACL to net charge-off ratios over the last 12 months, only two have higher adjusted capital ratios than WAL.

我認為在評估我們的資產負債表時考慮損失吸收資本的其他來源是有幫助的——查看我們的CET1 資本比率與AOCI 標記和損失準備金佔風險加權資產的百分比，我們在同行中排名前三分之一。值得注意的是，在投影片 14 上的六家同業中，過去 12 個月 ACL 與淨沖銷比率較高，只有兩家的調整後資本比率高於 WAL。

Finally, tangible book value per share increased to $1.49 from the end of Q1 to $48.79 from retained earnings growth, which equates to an annualized growth rate of approximately 13%. Our consistent upward trajectory and tangible book value per share has outpaced peers by 7 times since the end of 2013.

最後，由於留存收益成長，每股有形帳面價值從第一季末的 1.49 美元增至 48.79 美元，相當於年化成長率約 13%。自 2013 年底以來，我們持續的上升軌跡和每股有形帳面價值已超過同業 7 倍。

I'll now hand the call back to Ken.

我現在將把電話轉回給肯。

Okay. Thanks, Dale. Following our Q2 results, I would like to update the bank's 2024 guidance as follows.

好的。謝謝，戴爾。根據我們第二季的業績，我想更新該銀行的 2024 年指引如下。

A building pipeline provides clarity to continue loan growth at $1 billion per quarter in a safe, sound, and thoughtful manner. Our current loan-to-deposit ratio provides flexibility to selectively make more loans as opportunities arise. For the full year, loans are expected to grow $4.5 billion compared to the $4 billion previously, and deposits are expected to grow $14 billion, which is $3 billion above our previous forecast. Deposit growth in Q3 is expected to be $2 billion.

正在建造的管道為以安全、穩健和周到的方式繼續以每季 10 億美元的速度增長貸款提供了明確性。我們目前的貸存比提供了靈活性，可以在機會出現時選擇性地發放更多貸款。全年貸款預計將增加 45 億美元，而先前為 40 億美元，存款預計將增加 140 億美元，比我們先前的預測高出 30 億美元。第三季存款成長預估為 20 億美元。

Turning to capital. We expect our CET1 ratio to remain at or above 11%, capturing the forecasted increase in loan volume as organic earnings growth supports rising loans and investments.

轉向資本。我們預計我們的 CET1 比率將保持在 11% 或以上，反映了隨著有機盈利增長支持貸款和投資增加而預計貸款量的增長。

Net interest income is now expected to grow 9% to 14% from the Q4 2023 annualized jumping off point. Our rate outlook includes two 25 basis point cuts in the back half of the year. NIM is expected in the 3.60% area for the remainder of the year, and Q2 ending loan balance versus the average for deposits and loans provides continued net interest income momentum for the back half of the year.

目前預計淨利息收入將從 2023 年第四季的年化起點增加 9% 至 14%。我們的利率展望包括今年下半年兩次下調 25 個基點。預計今年餘下時間淨利差將維持在 3.60% 的水平，而第二季末貸款餘額與存款和貸款平均水平的比較為今年下半年提供了持續的淨利息收入動力。

Non-interest income should increase 15% to 25% from adjusted 2023 baseline levels. Our upward revision reflects growth in commercial banking fees as well as incremental improvement in other fee segments.

非利息收入應較調整後的 2023 年基準水準增加 15% 至 25%。我們的上調反映了商業銀行費用的成長以及其他費用領域的逐步改善。

Non-interest expense, inclusive of the ECR-related deposit costs is now expected to rise 9% to 13% from an annualized adjusted Q4 baseline of $1.74 billion primarily from the greater ECR-related deposits, which fund attractive balance sheet growth and grow earnings.

非利息支出（包括與ECR 相關的存款成本）目前預計將從年化調整後的第四季度基準17.4 億美元增長9% 至13%，主要來自與ECR 相關的存款增加，這些存款為有吸引力的資產負債表增長和盈利增長提供了資金。

In aggregate, these factors should enable WAL to sustain PPNR, to provide the organic capital to support balance sheet growth and the CET1 target, while offering us the ability to maneuver around various economic and operating environments.

總的來說，這些因素應該使 WAL 能夠維持 PPNR，提供有機資本來支持資產負債表成長和 CET1 目標，同時為我們提供應對各種經濟和營運環境的能力。

Asset quality is normalizing from historic lows and net charge-offs are expected to remain low by industry standards at 15 basis points to 20 basis points of average loans for the year.

資產品質正從歷史低點恢復正常，按照行業標準，淨沖銷將保持在較低水平，為今年平均貸款的 15 個基點至 20 個基點。

At this time, Dale, Tim, and I will take your questions.

這次，戴爾、提姆和我將回答你們的問題。

(Operator Instructions) Jared Shaw, Barclays.

（操作員指示）Jared Shaw，巴克萊銀行。

Hi. Good morning.

你好。早安.

Good morning, Jared.

早上好，賈里德。

Thanks. Maybe just looking at the loan growth, you've had great loan growth, obviously, this quarter. As we go forward, any change in sort of the geography of where that's coming? You look at the CRE portfolio that's been a little bit under pressure. Should we think that it still is coming from the same primary areas of C&I? Or could there be an expansion into some other areas?

謝謝。也許只看貸款成長，顯然本季貸款成長強勁。隨著我們的前進，未來的地理環境會發生什麼變化嗎？你看看商業房地產投資組合，它有點承受壓力。我們是否應該認為它仍然來自工商業的相同主要領域？或者是否可以擴展到其他一些領域？

Yeah. Thanks. Well, for the year and also for the quarter and also year-over-year, the majority of our growth has been coming in the C&I categories. And again, that's in a no or low loss loan segment. And I think we're going to continue to move forward in that manner. I think what you can expect for the rest of the year is to see continuous downward movement in our residential loan portfolio as you saw this quarter.

是的。謝謝。嗯，今年、本季以及年比，我們的大部分成長都來自工商業類別。再說一次，這是在無損失或低損失貸款領域。我認為我們將繼續以這種方式前進。我認為，今年剩餘時間裡，我們的住宅貸款組合將持續下降，正如本季所見。

I think you'll find CRE overall will be relatively flat. We will look for opportunities to finance -- we do like pockets of financing in the construction land and development. Most notably, we've always talked about this a lot banking segment will provide opportunity.

我認為你會發現 CRE 整體上會相對持平。我們將尋找融資機會——我們確實喜歡在建設用地和開發方面進行少量融資。最值得注意的是，我們一直在談論這很多銀行業務將提供機會。

But the short answer, I guess, is that mostly it's going to come in C&I, node financing, warehouse lending are the two areas that are going to lead the way.

但我想，簡短的答案是，主要將出現在商業和工業領域，節點融資和倉庫貸款是引領潮流的兩個領域。

Okay, thanks. And then just on the fee income side, are you assuming -- I guess, you're still assuming that the Fed funds cut flowing through to help with mortgage banking there as well? I guess what's the trajectory we could expect there following that -- those two cuts?

好的謝謝。然後就費用收入而言，您是否假設——我想，您仍然假設聯準會資金削減流動資金以幫助那裡的抵押貸款銀行業務？我想我們可以預期接下來的軌跡是什麼——這兩次削減？

Right. So for our forecast, we have a rate cut in September and a rate cut in December. We are forecasting a modestly declining mortgage income, mostly because the Q4 rate cut.

正確的。因此，對於我們的預測，我們將在 9 月和 12 月分別降息。我們預計抵押貸款收入將小幅下降，主要是因為第四季度降息。

Yes, it comes in a quarter that's seasonally low in terms of volume. So we would expect to see pickup from the rate cut in terms of mortgage volume really following to 2025 more so as a back end of Q4. So it's basically Q4 is a seasonally low quarter to begin with.

是的，它出現在銷售季節性較低的季度。因此，我們預計，到 2025 年，抵押貸款數量將因降息而有所回升，尤其是在第四季末。因此，第四季基本上是一個季節性低迷的季度。

Okay, thanks. I'll step back. Thank you.

好的謝謝。我會退後一步。謝謝。

Steven Alexopoulos, JPMorgan.

史蒂文‧阿萊克索普洛斯，摩根大通。

Hi, everyone.

大家好。

Hey, Steve.

嘿，史蒂夫。

Let me start on the ECR deposits. Can you just give more color on what drove such strong growth? And was the increase in the interest expense on those purely tied to the growth? Or did the rate -- the effective rate basically rise as well?

讓我從 ECR 存款開始。您能否詳細說明推動如此強勁成長的因素？這些利息支出的增加是否純粹與經濟成長有關？或者說，有效率──有效率基本上也上升了嗎？

Two questions there. First, the growth came in warehouse lending, all right? And what we have found from the first quarter disruption in the market, that Western Alliance's warehouse lending group has become really the premier platform to hold your escrow accounts on and also come to us for warehouse lending and MSR loans. So that volume is coming in for that reason.

有兩個問題。首先，成長來自倉庫貸款，好嗎？我們從第一季的市場混亂中發現，Western Alliance 的倉庫貸款集團已成為您託管託管帳戶以及向我們尋求倉庫貸款和 MSR 貸款的真正首選平台。因此，這個數量的出現就是因為這個原因。

Also, we've had a number of market share gains. New clients coming in, that's one type of market share gain, and existing clients that we currently have given us more of their deposits. So that's kind of push on that segment, which carries a higher ECR. Now with that liquidity, we've been paying down and we'll continue to pay down our short-term borrowings.

此外，我們的市佔率也有所增加。新客戶的加入是市場佔有率成長的一種形式，而現有客戶目前已經向我們提供了更多的存款。因此，這是對 ECR 較高的細分市場的推動。現在，有了這些流動性，我們已經並將繼續償還短期借款。

And to your other question, we do have several initiatives that we are launching to kind of work on the rate and see if we can push that rate downward as we go into Q3 and exit Q4.

對於你的另一個問題，我們確實正在啟動幾項措施來研究利率，看看我們是否可以在進入第三季和退出第四季時降低利率。

Okay. That's helpful. Ken, in terms of the deposit growth getting lifted again, were you guys just very conservative? Is growth coming in much more than you guys expected? And it's funny, when we look at the second half, you did $11 billion of deposits in the first half. I think you're guiding like $3 billion in the second half. I know there's some seasonality in the fourth quarter, but you're just being very conservative here.

好的。這很有幫助。Ken，就存款成長再次提振而言，你們是不是非常保守？成長是否比你們預期的多得多？有趣的是，當我們看下半年時，你在上半年存入了 110 億美元。我認為下半年你的指導金額約為 30 億美元。我知道第四季有一些季節性因素，但你們只是非常保守。

So let's talk about the seasonality first. In warehouse lending, we see an outflow of deposits every Q4. So some of the deposit growth in Q1 of 2024 was the return of those tax escrow payments that were made. And usually, that runs between $3 billion and $4 billion that flows out in Q4. So why I'm saying $3 billion net growth, then you can see that we're accounting for the $3 billion to $4 billion that's going to fly out the door or flows out the door at the end of the year.

那我們先來談談季節性。在倉庫貸款方面，我們每個第四季都會看到存款流出。因此，2024 年第一季的部分存款成長是已支付的稅收託管付款的回饋。通常情況下，第四季流出的資金在 30 億至 40 億美元之間。那麼，為什麼我說淨成長 30 億美元，那麼你可以看到，我們正在考慮年底將飛出或流出的 30 億至 40 億美元。

Where we're getting it from is -- what's interesting is for this quarter, as an example, 58% of our growth really came from our deposit-only channels. And so we've launched a number of them, as you probably know, business escrow services, corporate trust, Juris Banking, and of course, HOA, which started about 12 years ago when I first got -- first joined the bank. And that's where the deposit vertical growth is coming from. In addition, our consumer lending or consumer digital platform has really taken off, and we're doing quite well there. And we had another strong quarter in Q2, and we saw deposit growth growing $673 million.

我們的來源是——有趣的是，以本季為例，我們 58% 的成長確實來自我們的純存款管道。因此，正如您可能知道的那樣，我們推出了其中的一些服務，包括商業託管服務、企業信託、Juris Banking，當然還有 HOA，它是在大約 12 年前我第一次加入銀行時開始的。這就是存款垂直成長的來源。此外，我們的消費貸款或消費者數位平台已經真正起飛，而且我們在那裡做得很好。第二季度我們又經歷了一個強勁的季度，存款成長了 6.73 億美元。

So since we actually launched the consumer digital channel, I'll give you a number as of today, because our folks are very proud of it, that they just shopping you note. But inside of 1.5 years, that channel has moved up to about $4.5 billion. It just provides another channel for us that we didn't have before at cost point or price point, which is rather consistent with our commercial pricing, right?

因此，自從我們實際上推出了消費者數位管道以來，我今天會給您一個數字，因為我們的人們對此感到非常自豪，他們只是在購物時注意到您。但在 1.5 年內，該通路的價值已增至約 45 億美元。它只是為我們提供了另一個在成本點或價格點上沒有的管道，這與我們的商業定價相當一致，對嗎？

So we don't have a consumer base, as you know. So we don't have to worry about cannibalizing our consumer base and having them move from low rates to higher rates. Here, it's consistent with what's happening in our commercial book. And it provides another channel for us to use almost as a challenger channel to other deposits that are coming in to hold the line or try to push those deposits down over the long-term.

所以，如你所知，我們沒有消費者基礎。因此，我們不必擔心蠶食我們的消費者基礎並讓他們從低利率轉向高利率。在這裡，這與我們商業書中發生的情況是一致的。它為我們提供了另一個管道，幾乎可以作為其他存款的挑戰者管道，這些存款將保持穩定或試圖長期壓低這些存款。

Got it. That's very helpful. Thanks for taking my questions.

知道了。這非常有幫助。感謝您回答我的問題。

Ebrahim Poonawala, Bank of America.

易卜拉欣·普納瓦拉，美國銀行。

Thank you. I guess maybe as we think about lower rates and the NII outlook. Dale, If you don't mind reminding us, including the ECR-related deposit costs, how should we expect sort of NII to trend if those rate cuts from September and December continue into '25? Is that positive overall for the NII in NIM, inclusive of ECR or negative?

謝謝。我想也許是在我們考慮較低的利率和國家資訊基礎設施前景時。Dale，如果您不介意提醒我們，包括與 ECR 相關的存款成本，如果 9 月和 12 月的降息持續到 25 年，我們應該如何預期 NII 的趨勢？NIM 中的 NII 總體而言是積極的（包括 ECR）還是消極的？

And secondly, what determines whether you end up at the 14% versus the 9% for this year on NII outlook?

其次，是什麼決定了您今年的 NII 前景是 14% 還是 9%？

So yeah, just regarding your first inquiry, Ebrahim. Yeah. So we're fairly neutral on an aggregate of net interest income plus our deposit expenses. And maybe as Ken was alluding to earlier with the discussion about our mortgage operation, we're not sure that that's really going to kick in until we get a little more than one for the fourth quarter and then two moving into the beginning of 2025. A little more rate relief on the mortgage rate environment.

是的，關於你的第一次詢問，易卜拉欣。是的。因此，我們對淨利息收入加上存款支出的總額相當中立。也許正如肯早些時候在討論我們的抵押貸款業務時提到的那樣，我們不確定這是否真的會開始發揮作用，直到我們在第四季度獲得多一點的貸款，然後在2025 年初獲得兩個以上的貸款。對抵押貸款利率環境進行更多的利率減免。

So we feel comfortable with where we are. And I think within the relevant range that we're going to see later this year, we're going to be fairly neutral on -- I'm going to say, PPNR related to interest rate movements, both inclusive of interest expense and deposit costs.

所以我們對自己所處的位置感到很舒服。我認為，在今年稍後我們將看到的相關範圍內，我們將對與利率變動相關的 PPNR 保持相當中立，包括利息支出和存款成本。

And I'll take your second part of your question, which is what factors influence how we will perform in the second half of the year. I think you can expect Q3 that you'll see net interest income continue to rise. And then in Q4, you can expect net interest income more or less to be flat to Q3. And one of the factors there, one is our continued upward movement in loan growth. That's very important. And overall, our total revenue should, in Q4 should be relatively flat to Q3.

我將回答你問題的第二部分，即哪些因素影響我們下半年的表現。我認為您可以預期第三季淨利息收入將繼續上升。然後在第四季度，您可以預期淨利息收入或多或少與第三季度持平。其中因素之一是我們的貸款成長持續上升。這非常重要。整體而言，我們第四季的總營收應該與第三季相對持平。

So we are making up some of the decline in yield by having higher volume in loans and also working some other fee-based channels that we have. And then we've been working on those fee-based channels and developing them over the last year.

因此，我們正在透過增加貸款量以及我們擁有的其他一些收費管道來彌補收益率的下降。去年我們一直致力於這些收費管道的開發。

Got it. And I guess just a second question, Ken, I do want you to address from a credit standpoint, these are really low number as I get it. But it's been overhang on the stock for three or four years. Just talk to us outside of things going through the pipe, your visibility in terms of credit quality outlook over the next 6, 12, 18 months, where do we -- where do you anticipate some weakness, drivers of losses ex all the things that you have said are no loss kind of pieces of the loan book? I would appreciate that.

知道了。我想這是第二個問題，肯，我確實希望你從信用的角度來解決，據我所知，這些數字確實很低。但該股已經懸而未決三、四年了。只需與我們討論正在發生的事情之外，您對未來 6、12、18 個月的信用品質前景的了解，我們在哪裡 - 您預計哪些弱點，損失的驅動因素，除所有因素外你說的貸款簿都是無損失的那種嗎？我將不勝感激。

Yeah. I'm going to have Tim take that one.

是的。我要讓蒂姆拿那個。

Yeah. Thank you. So Dale, I think did a nice job of really covering some key measures of success in the portfolio in his discussion. So I'd start by saying we're very pleased with our portfolio performance. And then when we look forward, the -- we've taken every opportunity to describe, we focus on early elevation and early resolution.

是的。謝謝。因此，我認為戴爾做得很好，在他的討論中真正涵蓋了投資組合成功的一些關鍵衡量標準。首先我要說的是，我們對我們的投資組合表現非常滿意。然後，當我們展望未來時，我們利用一切機會來描述，我們專注於早期提升和早期解決。

So we really take a forward-looking approach when we view troubled loans, portfolio performance, and our ACL. So our forward estimates that Ken talked about, at 15 basis points to 20 basis points, include all current valuations, anticipated value-based changes to carry assets that may default and are based on the market conditions that we're living in today. So we update these values and assess each exposure always on an ongoing basis.

因此，當我們審視問題貸款、投資組合績效和 ACL 時，我們確實採取了前瞻性的方法。因此，Ken 談到的我們的前瞻性預測為 15 個基點到 20 個基點，包括所有當前估值、可能違約的資產的基於價值的預期變化，並且基於我們今天所處的市場狀況。因此，我們不斷更新這些值並評估每次暴露。

Got it. Thank you for taking my question.

知道了。謝謝你回答我的問題。

Brandon King, Truist Securities.

布蘭登金 (Brandon King)，Truist 證券公司。

Hey. Just a follow up on the credit conversation. So the guide implies some increase in net charge-offs for the second half of the year. But I just wanted to get a sense of what changed from last quarter to imply kind of a higher run rate.

嘿。只是信用對話的後續行動。因此，該指南意味著今年下半年的淨沖銷將會增加。但我只是想了解一下與上個季度相比發生了什麼變化，這意味著運行率更高。

Yeah. I think we really look at this all the time as a forward-looking estimate and we really didn't make a significant change in terms of percentage or dollars. We update based on current conditions, and we'll continue to do that. So from our standpoint, we're optimistic, and we are maintaining really a stable outlook on our portfolio.

是的。我認為我們一直將其視為前瞻性估計，並且我們確實沒有在百分比或美元方面做出重大改變。我們會根據當前情況進行更新，並將繼續這樣做。因此，從我們的角度來看，我們很樂觀，並且我們的投資組合前景保持穩定。

So we update our appraisals on our non-performing loans of approximately every six months. And we're getting more clarity. Some of these markets don't have a lot of transactions. And so as that comes in, we saw something in terms of the San Diego property we took back immediately. You see that here, that put us a little bit above the 15% kind of upper limit that we had as of our first quarter guidance. And so we expanded that to kind of 15% to 20%.

因此，我們大約每六個月更新一次不良貸款評估。我們的情況越來越清晰。其中一些市場的交易量並不大。因此，當我們看到這一點時，我們立即收回了聖地牙哥的財產。您可以在這裡看到，這使我們略高於第一季指引的 15% 上限。因此我們將其擴大到 15% 到 20%。

Okay. And just a follow-up on the San Diego loan. Could you expand on kind of the update there, news about being foreclosure and kind of your plan to deal with the asset?

好的。這只是聖地牙哥貸款的後續行動。您能否詳細介紹那裡的最新情況、有關取消抵押品贖回權的消息以及您處理該資產的計劃？

Yeah. Look, we were moving to foreclosure. We took the appraisal charge, as we described. We are going to work to reposition the asset increased occupancy. And then we'll also look to sell the building when we have the occupancy level at a higher level than it is today.

是的。看，我們正走向喪失抵押品贖回權。正如我們所描述的，我們承擔了評估費用。我們將努力重新定位資產以增加入住率。然後，當我們的入住率比現在更高時，我們也會考慮出售建築物。

So it's what you would expect anyone to do. Think of it as acquiring -- think of it as you going out and buying a property, what would you do to enhance the value. That's what we're going to be doing.

所以這就是你期望任何人都會做的事情。把它想像成收購——把它想像成你出去買一處房產，你會做什麼來提高價值。這就是我們要做的。

Okay. And then just lastly, really leaning into some mortgage warehouse deposits. Any thoughts around concentration levels? I know it's continuing to creep up there. But how do you feel about the concentration of your total deposit base, particularly within mortgage warehouse?

好的。最後，真正傾向於一些抵押倉庫存款。關於濃度水平有什麼想法嗎？我知道它還在繼續蔓延。但您對總存款基礎的集中度（尤其是抵押貸款倉庫內的集中度）有何看法？

Yes. So there's good news and interesting story here, okay? The good news is, as we continue to become one of the premier platforms in the industry, we're seeing all these deposits come in. That's great. We are also getting market share wins. That also is great.

是的。這裡有好消息又有趣的故事，好嗎？好消息是，隨著我們繼續成為業內領先的平台之一，我們看到所有這些存款都進來了。那太棒了。我們還贏得了市場份額。那也很棒。

The flip side of that is a higher concentration. And so you've seen our HQLA grow. And so we are not putting all of those -- all that liquidity out to finance loans, but rather holding that liquidity on our balance sheet and making a smaller spread. What we will do over time is work with our clients to work through or repositioned current pricing models given the liquidity that we have.

另一方面是濃度更高。您已經看到我們的 HQLA 不斷成長。因此，我們不會將所有這些流動性用於貸款融資，而是將這些流動性保留在我們的資產負債表上並縮小利差。隨著時間的推移，我們將與客戶合作，根據我們擁有的流動性，研究或重新定位目前的定價模式。

So a year ago, there was a premium placed on liquidity. And people said, if you want my liquidity, you have to pay up for it. Well, things have changed a little bit now. And as a premier platform, I think there's a discount that people have to take when coming to our platform for our service levels. The ability to do multiple things, not only handle their escrow deposits, but also provide financing. And we're going to see if they value it that way. And so we're going to work in that particular segment to scale down or push down some of the rates that we're paying.

因此，一年前，流動性受到溢價。人們說，如果你想要我的流動性，你就必須付出代價。嗯，現在情況已經發生了一些變化。作為一個首要的平台，我認為人們在進入我們的平台以獲得我們的服務水準時必須享受折扣。有能力做多種事情，不僅可以處理託管存款，還可以提供融資。我們將看看他們是否這麼看重它。因此，我們將在該特定領域開展工作，以縮小或壓低我們支付的某些費率。

The growth we've had is a great problem to have, and it gives us flexibility on leverage to be more aggressive in this repricing initiative that's underway.

我們所經歷的成長是一個很大的問題，它使我們能夠靈活地利用槓桿，從而在正在進行的重新定價措施中更加積極主動。

Great. Thanks for taking my questions.

偉大的。感謝您回答我的問題。

Timur Braziler, Wells Fargo.

帖木兒·巴西爾，富國銀行。

Hi, good morning. I'm wondering if you can provide us with an update on the large financial institution spend kind of what's left to be done there. And I'm just wondering if the faster growth rate of the balance sheet, what that implies for the timing of completion on some of those projects?

早安.我想知道您是否可以向我們提供有關大型金融機構支出的最新資訊以及尚待完成的工作。我只是想知道資產負債表的成長率是否更快，這對其中一些項目的完成時間意味著什麼？

Yeah. So we've indicated in the past that we're approximately three quarters of the way through with complying with where we need to be to tip over $100 billion. I wouldn't extrapolate too much from our growth rate for the past few quarters and say, make that trajectory in terms of where we're going to cross over $100 billion. We still have had about $6 billion of borrow funds, about $6 billion of broker deposits, and we're going to be paying that down in a more accelerated fashion. So you're going to see our total assets grow at a slower rate than what you've seen over the past few quarters.

是的。因此，我們過去曾表示，我們已經完成了大約四分之三的工作，以達到我們需要達到的目標，即超過 1000 億美元。我不會根據過去幾季的成長率進行過多推斷，並說，根據我們將突破 1000 億美元的軌跡來制定這一軌跡。我們仍然有大約 60 億美元的借款資金，大約 60 億美元的經紀人存款，我們將以更快的方式償還這些資金。因此，您將看到我們的總資產成長速度比過去幾季慢。

That said, though, we're well on track with this. We're developing whatever plans we need to finally get that. We do not see a significant step variable costs in front of us to be able to get over that, except for potentially what is related with a TLAC, total loss absorbing capacity. We need to do more debt there. But even in that situation, based upon a [thousands of rainy day] prototype, which I think is being revised, we had until '28 to kind of get there.

儘管如此，我們在這方面進展順利。我們正在製定最終實現這一目標所需的任何計劃。我們認為，除了與 TLAC（總損耗吸收能力）相關的潛在因素外，我們沒有看到能夠克服這一問題的重大步驟可變成本。我們需要在那裡做更多的債務。但即使在這種情況下，基於[千個雨天]原型（我認為該原型正在修訂），我們直到 28 年才能實現這一目標。

Got it. And then maybe just following up on Ebrahim's question around rates. I guess how would the cadence of rate cuts potentially impact your ability to lower ECR costs and benefit some of the other mortgage-related activity, i.e., if we just have one rate cut or if the rate cuts are spread out, how would that affect your ability to maybe lower some of those ECR-related expenses?

知道了。然後也許只是跟進易卜拉欣關於利率的問題。我猜想降息的節奏會如何影響您降低 ECR 成本並使其他一些抵押貸款相關活動受益的能力，即，如果我們只降息一次，或者降息分散開來，這會如何影響您有能力降低一些與ECR 相關的費用嗎？

Look most importantly, the [fever] is broken on rates. I mean, so there's no places where others can go and get kind of substantially higher rates as we had when we were in an expected higher rate environment, if you go to treasuries or some of these other products and to be a competitor against deposit rates plus the situation within the banking space has become somewhat more relaxed as well. However, these are entities that control significant amounts of dollars, and so they can get something at or near what would be kind of the market rate of interest.

最重要的是，利率的[熱潮]已經被打破。我的意思是，因此，如果您選擇國債或其他一些產品並成為存款利率的競爭對手，那麼其他人就無法像我們處於預期的更高利率環境中那樣獲得更高的利率此外，銀行業內部的情況也變得更加寬鬆。然而，這些實體控制著大量美元，因此他們可以獲得等於或接近市場利率的東西。

But as I said earlier, I mean, we're in a position that we can, I think, start to kind of use our leverage with our strong balance sheet, with our strong delivery system within this space that we think we're now kind of the premier player to be able to effect a more significant cost mitigation strategy going forward.

但正如我之前所說，我的意思是，我認為我們可以開始利用我們強大的資產負債表的槓桿作用，以及我們認為現在在這個領域內強大的交付系統能夠在未來實施更重要的成本削減策略的主要參與者。

But a simple answer as rates move, total ECR rates of the Fed cuts 25 in September, you'll see that flow through, starting immediately.

但一個簡單的答案是，隨著利率的變化，聯準會 9 月的總 ECR 利率削減了 25，你會看到這種流動，立即開始。

Got it. And then maybe if I could just sneak one more question in around mortgage banking. There was a comment in the release on maybe elevated loans held for sale and doing more conforming mortgages. And then in the deck, part of the rationale for the higher fee income guide was that margins are firming up. It looks like gain on sale margin actually declined a little bit here. But are we starting to reach an equilibrium kind of with the new production? I guess what are the expectations for gain on sale margins in the context of the 2Q decline?

知道了。然後也許我可以再問一個有關抵押貸款銀行業務的問題。新聞稿中有一則評論是關於可能增加待售貸款和進行更符合要求的抵押貸款。然後在甲板上，較高費用收入指南的部分理由是利潤率正在強勢。看起來銷售利潤率實際上有所下降。但我們是否開始與新的生產達到某種平衡？我猜在第二季下滑的情況下，對銷售利潤率成長的預期是什麼？

Yes. So gain on sale margins in Q1 were higher than Q2. In Q2, you saw mortgage rates move back up above 7%. They're firming now, and we are optimistic, but we don't have it captured into our forecast yet that as more people get comfortable with that rate cuts are coming and with the shortage of supply and housing in the market that more people will start returning. They're seeing a little pickup now in refi activity, but we're looking forward to the purchase activity to really drive us.

是的。因此，第一季的銷售利潤率增幅高於第二季。第二季度，抵押貸款利率回升至 7% 以上。它們現在正在走強，我們很樂觀，但我們還沒有將其納入我們的預測中，即隨著越來越多的人對即將到來的降息感到滿意，並且隨著市場上供應和住房的短缺，更多的人會接受降息。他們現在看到改裝活動回升，但我們期待購買活動真正推動我們發展。

But from a forecast point of view, we're going to wait to see that flow through our P&L before we capture it in our go-forward consensus outlook.

但從預測的角度來看，我們將等待看到這種情況在我們的損益表中的流動，然後再將其納入我們的未來共識展望中。

Great. Thanks for the color.

偉大的。謝謝你的顏色。

Matthew Clark, Piper Sandler.

馬修·克拉克，派珀·桑德勒。

Hey, good morning. Thanks for the questions. Maybe just on the margin. It held up a little better than expected, up 3 bps. I think you had guided previously down 10 bps and that's despite kind of loans to earning assets coming down. Updated thoughts on kind of the near-term margin outlook?

嗨，早安。感謝您的提問。也許只是在邊緣。其表現略好於預期，上漲了 3 個基點。我認為您之前指導的利率下降了 10 個基點，儘管盈利資產的貸款有所下降。關於近期利潤前景的最新想法？

Yes. So we did pop it up 3 basis points. And again, with the excess liquidity, we did two things. With -- a lot of excess liquidity came in towards the back end of the first quarter, so we're able to deploy the average earning assets, that helped. And then also, we're paying down our -- and working hard to pay down our short-term borrowings.

是的。所以我們確實將其上調了 3 個基點。同樣，由於流動性過剩，我們做了兩件事。第一季末出現了大量過剩流動性，因此我們能夠部署平均獲利資產，這很有幫助。此外，我們正在償還我們的——並努力償還我們的短期借款。

As I said in my prepared remarks, going forward, Q3, Q4, you can see net interest margin holding very close to where we are now in the 3.60% area, and that includes the two rate cuts.

正如我在準備好的演講中所說，展望未來，第三季度、第四季度，您可以看到淨息差非常接近我們現在的 3.60% 區域，其中包括兩次降息。

Yes. Got it. And then just shifting gears to credit. Any color on the uptick in special mention this quarter. What drove that increase?

是的。知道了。然後就轉向信貸。本季特別值得一提的是任何顏色的上漲。是什麼推動了這項成長？

Yeah. We're really -- it's a balance with the prior four quarters of last year. So we were down from where we spent most of the year last year. Slight uptick, and it's just part of our early elevation as part of our ongoing review processes. I say that it was idiosyncratic or specific deal situations that brought credit into view. And then we will quickly as we always do, work through those to move them up or out.

是的。我們確實與去年前四個季度實現了平衡。因此，我們的業績較去年大部分時間有所下降。略有上升，這只是我們正在進行的審查流程中早期提升的一部分。我想說的是，正是特殊的或特定的交易情況引起了人們對信用的關注。然後我們將像往常一樣迅速解決這些問題，將它們向上或向下移動。

Yeah. I would note that whether you're looking at the special mention ratio or total dollars, Q2 was still below the trailing fourth quarter averages. So nothing out of the ordinary in that special mention move.

是的。我要指出的是，無論你是看特別提及率還是總美元，第二季仍然低於第四季的平均值。所以這個特別提及的舉動並沒有什麼不尋常的。

Great. Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。

Bernard Von Gizycki, Deutsche Bank.

伯納德·馮·吉茲基，德意志銀行。

Hey, guys. Good morning. So just a question on your interest rate sensitivity disclosures. I believe you might have made some changes in the 1Q disclosure versus the 10-K, given more granular assumptions on the deposit betas. So for 100 basis points decline in rates, you showed NII down about 7% at March 31. But I wonder if you could update that at 6.30% and believe NII could come in better given higher expected loan growth and benefit from wholesale deposit repricing. So I just wanted to see if you could provide some puts and takes there.

大家好。早安.所以只是關於您的利率敏感性披露的問題。我相信，考慮到對存款貝塔值的更細緻的假設，您可能對 1Q 的披露與 10-K 的披露進行了一些更改。因此，對於利率下降 100 個基點，您顯示 3 月 31 日的 NII 下降了約 7%。但我想知道您是否可以將其更新為 6.30%，並相信鑑於較高的預期貸款增長並受益於批發存款重新定價，NII 可能會出現更好的表現。所以我只是想看看你是否可以提供一些看跌期權和看跌期權。

Well, okay, so net interest income should come in higher as what you just said. But the volatility around that on a different interest rate assumption, again, this is a shock that we show, it's probably going to be fairly similar to what we showed you in the first quarter. So not a whole lot of difference there.

好吧，所以淨利息收入應該像你剛才所說的更高。但是，在不同的利率假設下，圍繞這一點的波動性再次是我們所展示的衝擊，它可能與我們在第一季向您展示的情況非常相似。所以沒有太大差別。

And again, I mean we look at it really looking at net interest income plus the delta that we're going to see in deposit costs, which is going to have kind of the opposite effect. And so the net between them gets to a fairly stable, I'll call, net interest-related items in PPNR combining those two elements.

再說一次，我的意思是，我們真正關注的是淨利息收入加上我們將在存款成本中看到的增量，這將產生相反的效果。因此，它們之間的淨額達到相當穩定的，我將其稱為 PPNR 中與這兩個要素相結合的淨利息相關項目。

Got it. And then just separately, just on the fee income, just a question on this. I know the equity investments were about $4 million, which were much lower than the previous two quarters. And I think there's some benefits on warrant income in prior quarters. Just wondering if you can provide any color -- any expectations from here going forward?

知道了。然後分別談談費用收入，就此問題。據我所知，股權投資約為400萬美元，比前兩個季度低得多。我認為前幾季的認股權證收入有一些好處。只是想知道你是否可以提供任何顏色——對未來有什麼期望嗎？

Yes. That's a difficult thing for us to really prognosticate, and so we have equity positions in more than 500 companies. And which ones top or which ones to close is a process on how that looks. I mean there is some correlation with maybe M&A activity. That's been a little restrained for reasons that I think everyone is aware of.

是的。對我們來說，真正預測是一件困難的事情，因此我們持有 500 多家公司的股權。哪些是頂部的，哪些是要關閉的，這是一個關於外觀的過程。我的意思是，這可能與併購活動有某種相關性。由於我認為每個人都知道的原因，這有點受到限制。

So maybe that's been a factor here. I can't really project what it's going to be in third and fourth quarter other than we don't see anything really change going on. So we can -- maybe we've got the parameters of where the higher or lower areas could be and maybe somewhere in there. But there's nothing going on there that we think is going to be a magnitude change either better or worse, respectively.

所以也許這是一個因素。我無法真正預測第三季和第四季的情況，除非我們沒有看到任何真正的變化。所以我們可以——也許我們已經得到了較高或較低區域可能在哪裡的參數，也許在那裡的某個地方。但我們認為沒有任何事情會分別帶來巨大的變化，無論是好是壞。

Okay. Got it. Thanks for taking my questions.

好的。知道了。感謝您回答我的問題。

Chris McGratty, KBW.

克里斯·麥克格拉蒂，KBW。

Great. Thanks. Dale, if I look at your guide, in the ranges in your guide, it would seem that if you're at the midpoint of NII, you'll probably be at the midpoint of the expenses or the high end to high end. Is there a scenario where you're perhaps at the high end of expenses and then maybe the midpoint of NII? Or should we just think about them whatever our assumptions are they should be kind of consistent?

偉大的。謝謝。Dale，如果我看一下你的指南，在你指南的範圍內，如果你處於 NII 的中點，你可能會處於費用的中點或高端到高端。是否存在這樣的情況：您可能處於支出的高端，然後可能處於 NII 的中點？或者我們應該考慮它們，無論我們的假設是什麼，它們應該是一致的？

I mean I wouldn't put too much interdependence on the elements in here. There is a correlation, obviously, if net interest income moves up, what does that mean? Is that a relatively higher, either rates overall, maybe fewer rate cuts and/or better growth, and that can affect what's going on the expense side.

我的意思是我不會對這裡的元素有太多的相互依賴。顯然存在相關性，如果淨利息收入上升，這代表什麼？這是一個相對較高的整體利率，也許是較少的降息和/或更好的成長，這可能會影響支出方面的情況。

But in total, I mean, I think these parameters are reasonably pretty fair. I mean, if anything, we're -- maybe we think we're going to do a little better on the non-interest income side, maybe towards the upper end of that range, but the others, I think kind of a midpoint is fairly on target with what we would consider.

但總的來說，我的意思是，我認為這些參數相當公平。我的意思是，如果有的話，我們可能認為我們會在非利息收入方面做得更好一些，也許接近該範圍的上限，但其他方面，我認為是一個中點與我們考慮的目標相當一致。

Okay. That's helpful. Thanks. And then on the -- just going back to the balance sheet strategy. You talked about the expense build and HQLA and TLAC -- the capital target, the 11% plus that you've been with for the better part of the year, is there a scenario where that changes in your view materially either way now that you're kind of through the -- or through the worst of the crisis, and were a little bit more confident in your outlook?

好的。這很有幫助。謝謝。然後回到資產負債表策略。您談到了費用建​​設以及 HQLA 和 TLAC——資本目標，即您在今年大部分時間裡一直保持的 11% 以上，是否存在一種情況，您的看法會發生重大變化，因為您現在已經您是否已經度過了危機最嚴重的時期，並且對您的前景更有信心了？

Chris, you blanked out. You -- we missed the first part of that question. Could you repeat it for us, please?

克里斯，你腦子一片空白。你——我們錯過了這個問題的第一部分。請您為我們重複一次好嗎？

Sure. I guess just closing the loop on the $100 billion investment discussion. Is there a scenario where your 11% CET1 target, I guess, would move materially one way or the other, I guess, is the question.

當然。我想這只是結束 1000 億美元投資討論的循環。我想，是否存在一種情況，您的 11% CET1 目標會以某種方式發生重大變化，我想，這就是問題所在。

So we want to keep the 11% as a target, more or like for, as we've said before, growth that we're generating from earnings are going to be used to fund loan growth. So the progression from the CET1 level, 11% upward is going to be slower. It's not going to be as rapid as you've seen in the last six or seven quarters.

因此，我們希望將 11% 作為目標，或多或少像我們之前所說的那樣，我們從盈利中獲得的增長將用於為貸款增長提供資金。因此，從 CET1 水平開始，11% 的進步會更慢。它不會像過去六、七個季度那麼快。

And we -- if you're asking is there a stock repurchase program in our immediate future, the answer would be no because unlike many of our peers, we have a higher degree of comfort regarding loan growth coming from these low or no loss loan categories that we think, over the long-term, will propel the company forward at a faster rate for EPS. So that's what we plan to do.

如果你問我們在不久的將來是否有股票回購計劃，答案是否定的，因為與我們的許多同行不同，我們對來自這些低損失或無損失貸款的貸款增長感到更加放心我們認為，從長遠來看，這些類別將推動公司以更快的速度實現每股盈餘。這就是我們計劃要做的。

Yes. I actually wasn't -- for this time, I wasn't asking about the buyback, it was just more about balance sheet leverage and growth, but got you on there. Thanks, again.

是的。事實上，我不是——這一次，我不是在問回購，更多的是關於資產負債表槓桿和成長，但讓你知道了。再次感謝。

Samuel Varga, UBS.

塞繆爾·瓦爾加，瑞銀集團。

Hey. Good morning. I wanted to ask a question about the corporate trust business. Could you give us an update on where things stand, sort of where are the pipelines. You mentioned that the investment-grade rating is the catalyst here? Can you just give a broad update on where that business is at.

嘿。早安.我想問一個關於企業信託業務的問題。您能否向我們介紹最新情況，例如管道在哪裡。您提到投資等級是這裡的催化劑？能否簡單介紹一下該業務的最新情況？

Yeah. So yes, I think we're the only bank -- I'm pretty sure we're the only bank that has had positive ratings actions, if you want to call them that, from either Fitch or from Moody's. So we're both on outlook positive. Obviously, our ratings are not where we believe they should be. But we think that is encouraging in terms of direction.

是的。所以，是的，我認為我們是唯一一家採取積極評級行動的銀行，無論是惠譽還是穆迪，如果你想這樣稱呼的話，我很確定我們是唯一一家採取積極評級行動的銀行。所以我們都對前景持樂觀態度。顯然，我們的評級並未達到我們認為應有的水準。但我們認為這在方向上是令人鼓舞的。

We have gotten certainly good traction in our corporate trust operation, and we've tag-teamed with our corporate finance group, and deliver a combined product set for CLO administration, which we think has been helpful. So we're really quite optimistic of what that looks like while I would be glad to have a ratings increase on -- for both of those entities, we don't think it's necessary for us to continue to grow strongly in that category. We have more than $0.5 billion in deposits there presently.

我們在企業信託業務方面確實取得了良好的進展，並且我們與企業財務團隊合作，為 CLO 管理提供了一套組合產品，我們認為這很有幫助。因此，我們對此非常樂觀，同時我很高興看到這兩個實體的評級有所提高，我們認為我們沒有必要繼續在該類別中強勁增長。目前我們在那裡有超過5億美元的存款。

So I was on the road last week with the corporate trust group and our lender finance group. And combining those two together when calling on clients has put a pipeline of deals ready to close, not -- do not mean these deals have been mandated to us, of about -- there's like a pipeline of 30 clients that are going to close. And so putting those two things together has been very, very valuable where we have the ability to make investments or lend on the lender finance side. And as we do that, we expect the mandate on the corporate trust side.

因此，上週我與企業信託小組和貸方財務小組一起出差。當拜訪客戶時，將這兩者結合在一起，已經準備好完成一系列交易，而不是——並不意味著這些交易已被授權給我們，大約——大約有 30 個客戶即將完成。因此，將這兩件事放在一起非常非常有價值，因為我們有能力在貸方融資方面進行投資或貸款。當我們這樣做時，我們期望企業信託方面的授權。

But what's more importantly is the corporate trust program that we built. We took a few people from the large money center bank, after chatting with them during the interview process, I said what is needed to make this program successful and it really was rebuilding the technology, the architecture that's currently out there, and a higher level of customer service. And I can tell you from the five or six calls I had last week, that is exactly how our clients feel about, that we have the better technology in the industry and the service levels are meeting their expectations, is actually not exceeding them.

但更重要的是我們所建立的企業信託計畫。我們找了幾個來自大型貨幣中心銀行的人，在面試過程中與他們聊天后，我說要使這個專案成功需要什麼，它實際上是重建技術，目前存在的架構，以及更高的水平客戶服務。我可以從上週接到的五、六個電話中告訴你，這正是我們客戶的感受，我們擁有行業中更好的技術，服務水平滿足他們的期望，實際上沒有超過他們。

So it's pretty exciting for us. We're going to see how this thing moves forward. This is a build, so our corporate trust group in terms of deposits should do between $150 million to $200 million on average a quarter. And as our name gets out there and we continue to expand the group, I would hope for bigger and better things as we move into 2025. But right now, very, very pleased with that activity.

所以這對我們來說非常令人興奮。我們將看看這件事如何進展。這是一個構建，因此我們的企業信託集團平均每季的存款應在 1.5 億至 2 億美元之間。隨著我們的名字越來越出名，我們的團隊也不斷擴大，我希望在進入 2025 年時能取得更大、更好的成就。但現在，我對這項活動非常非常滿意。

Great. Thanks for that update. And then I just wanted to switch back to ECR deposits for one last question on that. Dale, if I understand correctly the mortgage warehouse deposits are sort of pulling up that paid rates. Is it fair to assume that if 4Q seasonality comes through and those deposits partially slow out that that alone will be enough to reduce the ECR rate regardless of whether we actually get cuts or not?

偉大的。感謝您的更新。然後我只想回到 ECR 存款來回答最後一個問題。戴爾，如果我理解正確的話，抵押貸款倉庫存款有點拉高了支付利率。是否可以公平地假設，如果第四季度季節性到來並且這些存款部分放緩，那麼無論我們是否真的削減，僅此一項就足以降低 ECR 利率？

Sure. So first off, I mean, as Ken alluded to earlier, we're expecting 100% or a little bit above deposit rate or, I would say, funding cost beta on the ECR as rates come down. And so if you get that effect and then coupled with an expected outflows seasonally not related to relationships in the fourth quarter, both should have a combined effect going from, say, a rate cut at their meeting in September into the fourth quarter, lower rate and lower balances, you're going to see a drop in non-interest expense.

當然。所以首先，我的意思是，正如 Ken 之前提到的，我們預計存款利率將達到 100% 或略高，或者我想說的是，隨著利率下降，ECR 的融資成本貝塔值將提高。因此，如果你得到了這種效果，然後加上與第四季度的關係無關的預期季節性資金流出，兩者應該會產生綜合效應，例如，從9 月份的會議上降息到第四季度，較低的利率和較低的餘額，你會看到非利息支出的下降。

Which gives us the confidence level that our EPS, as it -- as we move through Q3 and into Q4, we'll be on an upper trajectory, which is what we've been communicating since the beginning part of the year.

這讓我們有信心相信，隨著第三季和第四季的到來，我們的每股盈餘將處於較高的軌道上，這也是我們自今年年初以來一直在傳達的訊息。

Got it. Thanks for the color. I appreciate it.

知道了。謝謝你的顏色。我很感激。

Jon Arfstrom, RBC Capital Markets.

喬恩‧阿夫斯特羅姆 (Jon Arfstrom)，加拿大皇家銀行資本市場部。

Hey. Thanks. A couple of questions here. Can you guys talk about the competitive environment in your mortgage businesses? It seems like it's changed. You've kind of alluded to it, you've taken share. Just curious what happens when volumes pick up and how you take advantage of that?

嘿。謝謝。這裡有幾個問題。你們能談談你們抵押貸款業務的競爭環境嗎？好像變了。你已經提到過它，你已經分享了。只是好奇當銷量增加時會發生什麼以及如何利用它？

Okay. So what I'm talking about is the warehouse lending group, not the AmeriHome Group, right? That's going to be more and more dependent. But in the warehouse lending group, we've seen a couple of competitors recently dropped out of the market. One has said that they're selling loans, on sold loans.

好的。那我說的是倉庫借貸集團，而不是AmeriHome集團，對吧？這樣就會越來越依賴。但在倉庫貸款領域，我們看到一些競爭對手最近退出了市場。有人說他們正在出售貸款，出售的貸款。

And what's most important to our clients, and maybe this is really when people always say, why is it that you guys grow while others don't? Well, first is that we're a commercial bank, and we're national, and we just don't stick to a region. So that's one answer. The second answer is, we don't move in and out of markets, and people can count on us to always be there. Now terms and conditions may change because economic conditions change, but we don't pull out of the market and then jump back in.

對我們的客戶來說最重要的是什麼，也許這就是人們總是說的，為什麼你們成長而其他人卻沒有成長？首先，我們是一家商業銀行，我們是全國性的，我們不拘泥於某個地區。這就是一個答案。第二個答案是，我們不會進出市場，人們可以信賴我們永遠在那裡。現在，條款和條件可能會因為經濟狀況的變化而改變，但我們不會退出市場然後再跳回來。

And our clients remember that, especially around warehouse lending, where those lines sometimes can get shut down rather quickly and larger banks can make a determination of whether or not they want to be in the business or not. And that's a little bit more serendipitous. For us, we want to be in the business and we've got the economic terms and operating conditions tell us what it is we need to charge and how to be there to support our clients. And I think that's one of the reasons why we've become a premier go-to platform in that segment.

我們的客戶記得這一點，特別是在倉庫貸款方面，這些業務有時可能會很快被關閉，而較大的銀行可以決定是否願意參與該業務。這有點偶然。對我們來說，我們希望進入這個行業，我們已經掌握了經濟條款和營運條件，告訴我們需要收取什麼費用以及如何為我們的客戶提供支援。我認為這就是我們成為該領域首選平台的原因之一。

Okay. What -- there's been a lot of discussion on interest rates. What do you guys prefer from a rate perspective? Do you want a couple of cuts? Do you want more than a couple of cuts? What's ideal for you?

好的。什麼——關於利率有很多討論。從費率的角度來看，你們比較喜歡什麼？你想要剪幾刀嗎？您想要多剪幾​​次嗎？什麼對你來說是理想的？

Boy, that's a question for me and my therapist. (laughter) But for the most part, if rates keep coming down at a faster pace, what we would look for is the mortgage fee income to rise and that we can bring in volume on the loan side to help offset some of the rate decline that you would see on our loan portfolio. And that would be the -- that would be our approach.

天哪，這是我和我的治療師的問題。（笑聲）但在大多數情況下，如果利率繼續以更快的速度下降，我們希望抵押貸款費用收入增加，並且我們可以增加貸款規模，以幫助抵消部分利率下降您會在我們的貸款組合中看到。這就是我們的方法。

Dale, do you have a different opinion?

戴爾，你有什麼不同的看法嗎？

No, I agree. The other thing I would say is it's been a little bit about -- you can still think of this rate, the Chinese water torture on CRE, in particular, related to a higher rate environment where debt service costs is just -- has become burdensome over time and it's little the way at DSCR, debt service coverage ratios for the past few years and LTVs as cap rates have climbed.

不，我同意。我想說的另一件事是，你仍然可以想到這個利率，中國對商業地產的水折磨，特別是與償債成本只是較高的利率環境有關，已經成為負擔隨著時間的推移，隨著資本化率的攀升，DSCR、過去幾年的償債覆蓋率和LTV 都沒有什麼變化。

So relief on that, I think, would give the whole industry a little bit more headroom in terms of NPA materialization and issues related to maintaining strong asset volume.

因此，我認為，這一點的緩解將使整個行業在不良資產的實現和與維持強勁資產規模相關的問題方面獲得更多的空間。

Okay. Fair enough on that. And then, Dale, just a quick one on the provision. Given the updated charge-off guide and the growth guide, I think it suggests a relatively stable provision. Am I looking at it the right way? Or is there something else to consider?

好的。這一點很公平。然後，戴爾，簡單介紹一下這條款。鑑於更新後的沖銷指南和成長指南，我認為這顯示了相對穩定的規定。我以正確的方式看待它嗎？或是還有什麼需要考慮的嗎？

I think that's it. I would say, however, I mean, look, we've had good loan growth. We've had -- our loan-to-deposit ratio on a marginal basis for the past couple of quarters has been very low. We've kind of planned into our comfort level in terms of our liquidity profile. So if we had higher loan growth, you know how CECL works, of course, that demands the load up on provision costs irrespective of what earnings you've been able to draw from that in the present area.

我想就是這樣。不過，我想說的是，我們的貸款成長良好。過去幾個季度，我們的邊際貸存比率非常低。我們已經在流動性方面計劃了我們的舒適水平。因此，如果我們有更高的貸款成長，你當然知道 CECL 是如何運作的，這要求增加撥備成本，無論你在當前領域能夠從中獲得多少收益。

Which you saw in this quarter.

您在本季度看到了這一點。

Okay. All right. Fair enough. Thank you.

好的。好的。很公平。謝謝。

We have no further questions. So I hand the call back to Ken Vecchione for closing remarks.

我們沒有其他問題了。因此，我將電話轉回肯·維奇奧內 (Ken Vecchione) 進行總結演講。

Yeah. Well, thank you all for joining us. We feel very good about the quarter. Just a very special thank you to the 3,600-plus people that work throughout Western Alliance. They made this quarter happen. And a big thank you to them. And we look forward to our next conference call. Be well, everyone.

是的。好的，謝謝大家加入我們。我們對本季感覺非常好。特別感謝在 Western Alliance 工作的 3,600 多名員工。他們讓這個季度成為現實。非常感謝他們。我們期待下一次電話會議。祝大家一切順利。

Thank you, everyone, for joining us today. This concludes our call, and you may now disconnect your lines.

謝謝大家今天加入我們。我們的通話到此結束，您現在可以斷開線路了。