美國合眾銀行 (USB) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to the US Bancorp's second quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) This call will be recorded and available for replay beginning today at approximately 10 AM Central Time.

歡迎參加美國合眾銀行 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）本次通話將被錄音，並於今天中部時間上午 10 點左右開始提供重播。

I will now turn the conference over to George Andersen, Director of Investor Relations for US Bancorp.

現在我將會議交給美國合眾銀行投資者關係總監喬治安德森。

Thank you, Jo, and good morning, everyone. Today, I'm joined by our President and Chief Executive Officer, Gunjan Kedia; and Vice Chair and CFO, John Stern. In a minute, Gunjan and John will be referencing a slide presentation together with their prepared remarks. A copy of the presentation, our press release, and all supplemental analyst schedules can be found on our website at ir.usbank.com. Please note that any forward-looking statements made during today's call are subject to risk and uncertainty.

謝謝你，喬，大家早安。今天，與我一同出席的還有我們的總裁兼執行長 Gunjan Kedia 和副董事長兼財務長 John Stern。一會兒，Gunjan 和 John 將參考幻燈片演示並發表他們準備好的發言。簡報、新聞稿以及所有補充分析師時間表的副本均可在我們的網站 ir.usbank.com 上查閱。請注意，今天電話會議上所做的任何前瞻性陳述均受風險和不確定性的影響。

Factors that could materially change our current forward-looking assumptions are described on page 2 of today's earnings presentation, our press release, and in reports on file with the SEC. Following our prepared remarks, Gunjan and John will take any questions that you have.

今天的收益報告第 2 頁、我們的新聞稿以及提交給美國證券交易委員會的報告中描述了可能嚴重改變我們當前前瞻性假設的因素。在我們準備好發言之後，Gunjan 和 John 將回答您的任何問題。

I will now turn the call over to Gunjan.

現在我會把電話轉給 Gunjan。

Thank you, George, and good morning, everyone. If I could please turn your attention to slide 3. In the second quarter, we reported earnings per share of $1.11 on net income of $1.8 billion. Core growth across our diversified fee income businesses and continued expense discipline more than offset a lighter spread income. We delivered strong year-over-year EPS growth as adjusted of approximately 13%.

謝謝你，喬治，大家早安。請大家注意看投影片 3。第二季度，我們報告每股收益為 1.11 美元，淨收入為 18 億美元。我們多元化費用收入業務的核心成長和持續的費用控制足以抵消利差收入的減少。經調整後，我們的每股盈餘年增強勁，約 13%。

Total fee revenue growth of 4.6% year over year reflected broad-based strength across our businesses and ongoing focus on execution and organic growth. John will discuss how we are navigating the current hire for longer interest rate environment and taking action to strategically position our balance sheet for near-term margin expansion. Notably, on an adjusted basis, we delivered 250 basis points of year-over-year positive operating leverage, the fourth consecutive quarter of revenue growth outpacing expense growth. We generated an 18% return on tangible common equity, a return on average assets of 1.08% and improved to a high 50s efficiency ratio. Asset quality trends and credit metrics remain stable, and capital levels came in well above regulatory capital minimums.

總費用收入年增 4.6%，反映了我們各項業務的全面實力以及對執行力和有機成長的持續關注。約翰將討論我們如何應對當前的長期利率環境，並採取行動策略性地定位我們的資產負債表以實現近期的利潤率擴張。值得注意的是，經過調整後，我們實現了同比增長 250 個基點的正營業槓桿，這是連續第四個季度收入增長超過支出增長。我們的有形普通股權益回報率為 18%，平均資產回報率為 1.08%，效率比率提高到 50% 的高水準。資產品質趨勢和信用指標保持穩定，資本水準遠高於監理資本最低要求。

Turning to slide 4. We provide a high-level view of US Bancorp today. A few things to highlight for this quarter, fee income now represents approximately 42% of total net revenue. We saw good sequential growth in total purchase volumes within Payment Services, and our Fortune 500 ranking improved from a year ago.

翻到幻燈片 4。今天，我們提供了對美國合眾銀行的高層看法。本季需要強調的幾點是，費用收入現在約佔總淨收入的 42%。我們看到支付服務的總購買量連續良好成長，我們的財富 500 強排名也比一年前有所提高。

Slide 5 provides an update on expense stabilization. This is one of our three major priorities. On the left, you will see that we have successfully delivered now seven consecutive quarters of stable expenses on an adjusted basis. We are driving meaningful productivity while also self-funding our investments in the franchise. For example, increases in payments and technology expenses were offset by reductions in personnel and occupancy costs.

幻燈片 5 提供了有關費用穩定的最新情況。這是我們的三大優先事項之一。在左側，您將看到我們已成功實現連續七個季度的調整後穩定支出。我們正在推動有意義的生產力，同時也為特許經營的投資提供自籌資金。例如，支付和技術費用的增加被人員和占用成本的減少所抵消。

On the right, we have highlighted a few of the digital investments we have made over the last five years to create modern, secure, and scalable platforms. We are now harvesting these investments to drive long-term productivity and sustainable positive operating leverage.

在右側，我們重點介紹了過去五年來為創建現代、安全且可擴展的平台所做的一些數位投資。我們現在正在利用這些投資來推動長期生產力和可持續的正向經營槓桿。

Slide 6 profiles our businesses and the strategies we are deploying to drive organic growth, our second major priority. The businesses highlighted in light blue represent areas where we are pursuing new strategies or transformative approaches. In our capital markets business, we are focused on introducing new product capabilities that leverage our existing balance sheet, such as ABS bonds, commodity hedging, and repo. The structured lending capabilities we are building are also delivering attractive growth in our C&I loans.

投影片 6 介紹了我們的業務以及我們為推動有機成長（我們的第二大優先事項）而部署的策略。淺藍色突出顯示的業務代表我們正在推行新策略或變革方法的領域。在我們的資本市場業務中，我們專注於引入利用現有資產負債表的新產品功能，例如 ABS 債券、商品對沖和回購。我們正在建構的結構化貸款能力也為我們的工商業貸款帶來了可觀的成長。

In our payments business, which is our third key priority, consumer spend remains resilient, especially in the nondiscretionary spend where we are slightly overweight. Corporate and government spend was muted this quarter, reflecting caution around economic uncertainty. Merchant Payment Services revenue, which is less than 7% of total firm-wide revenue, grew 4.4% year over year, supported by our tech-led strategy and strong focus on five strategic verticals. The businesses highlighted in dark blue are areas where we expect continued growth through a sharper and more urgent execution focus.

在我們的支付業務（我們的第三大重點）中，消費者支出依然保持彈性，特別是在我們略微超重的非自由支配支出方面。本季企業和政府支出較為溫和，反映出對經濟不確定性的謹慎態度。商家支付服務收入占公司總收入的不到 7%，但得益於我們以技術為主導的策略和對五大策略垂直領域的高度關注，年成長 4.4%。深藍色突出顯示的業務是我們期望透過更清晰、更緊迫的執行重點繼續實現成長的領域。

Finally, the mortgage, auto, and commercial real estate business portfolios, highlighted on the slide in gray, are core to our long-term growth strategies and are well positioned to grow when macro pressures ease.

最後，幻燈片上以灰色突出顯示的抵押貸款、汽車和商業房地產業務組合是我們長期成長策略的核心，並且在宏觀壓力緩解時能夠很好地實現成長。

On slide 7, we provide a snapshot of how our fee mix has evolved over the last 10 years in a positive way. While fee revenue as a percentage of total revenue was slightly higher a decade ago at about 45%, our revenue was skewed towards consumer fees, which have elevated exposure to market volatility and regulatory pressure. These dynamics contributed to fee income as a percentage of total revenue falling to 38% in 2023. We have been quite intentional in our strategy to invest in growing our trust and investment, wealth and capital market advisory services.

在第 7 張投影片中，我們簡要介紹了過去 10 年來我們的費用組合如何積極演變。雖然十年前費用收入佔總收入的比例略高，約為 45%，但我們的收入偏向消費者費用，這增加了市場波動和監管壓力的影響。這些動態導致費用收入佔總收入的百分比在 2023 年下降到 38%。我們的策略是有意投資於發展我們的信託和投資、財富和資本市場諮詢服務。

And today, institutional wealth and payments businesses collectively represent more than 75% of fee revenue. These are stable and profitable fees with underlying positive macro growth drivers, which support our sustainable revenue growth objectives.

如今，機構財富和支付業務合計佔費用收入的 75% 以上。這些費用穩定且有利可圖，具有潛在的積極宏觀成長動力，可支持我們實現可持續的收入成長目標。

Turning to slide 8. We are approaching the evolution of our balance sheet in an equally deliberate manner. At quarter end, C&I and credit card portfolios represented 47% of the balance sheet. This is up from 43% at the end of 2023. This quarter, these average loans grew 6.6% year over year, vastly outpacing total loan growth.

翻到第 8 張投影片。我們正在以同樣慎重的方式處理資產負債表的演變。截至季末，商業與工業及信用卡投資組合佔資產負債表的 47%。這一比例高於 2023 年底的 43%。本季度，這些平均貸款年增 6.6%，遠遠超過總貸款的成長。

These portfolios also support a higher percentage of multiservice clients at 51%, and we are prioritizing growth in these segments. To further optimize our balance sheet, we divested approximately $6 billion in mortgage and auto loans this quarter, taking advantage of a favorable rate environment for these asset sales to strategically reposition the balance sheet, both for stronger growth and in support of deeper client relationships.

這些投資組合也支持更高比例的多服務客戶（51%），我們優先考慮這些領域的成長。為了進一步優化我們的資產負債表，本季我們剝離了約 60 億美元的抵押貸款和汽車貸款，利用這些資產出售的有利利率環境，從戰略上重新定位資產負債表，以實現更強勁的增長並支持更深層次的客戶關係。

Let me now turn the call over to John, who will provide more details on the quarter and forward-looking guidance.

現在，我將把電話轉給約翰，他將提供有關本季和前瞻性指導的更多詳細資訊。

Thanks, Gunjan, and good morning, everyone. This is a good quarter for us as we made meaningful progress towards achieving our medium-term financial targets and work to position ourselves for future growth. If you turn to slide 9, I'll start with some highlights, followed by a discussion of second quarter earnings trends. We reported earnings per share of $1.11 and generated $7 billion of net revenue on flat expenses. Ending assets of $686 billion were impacted by seasonally elevated quarter end deposit flows.

謝謝，Gunjan，大家早安。這對我們來說是一個好的季度，因為我們在實現中期財務目標方面取得了有意義的進展，並努力為未來的成長做好準備。如果您翻到投影片 9，我將首先介紹一些亮點，然後討論第二季的獲利趨勢。我們報告每股收益為 1.11 美元，並在支出保持不變的情況下創造了 70 億美元的淨收入。期末資產為 6,860 億美元，受到季節性季末存款流量增加的影響。

Credit quality metrics remained stable. A modest reserve release of $53 million this quarter was largely reflective of favorable loan portfolio sales we executed to reposition the balance sheet. As of June 30, our CET1 capital level was 10.7%.

信貸品質指標保持穩定。本季釋放了 5,300 萬美元的適度儲備金，這主要反映了我們為重新定位資產負債表而進行的有利的貸款組合銷售。截至 6 月 30 日，我們的 CET1 資本水準為 10.7%。

Slide 10 provides key performance metrics. As the slide shows, we are making steady progress on our medium-term profitability and efficiency targets. Linked quarter, we delivered an improved return on average assets of 1.08% and so our efficiency ratio fall to 59.2%. While net interest margin declined 6 basis points sequentially, approximately half of the decline was temporary in nature and will not carry into the third quarter. This decline was driven by strategic loan portfolio sales as well as high residential mortgage paydown activity in April. The remaining impact was driven by elevated deposit pricing pressures and rotation into higher rate products. Importantly, we remain focused on action and initiatives to strengthen net interest income, and those efforts are fully reflected in our guidance.

投影片 10 提供了關鍵績效指標。正如幻燈片所示，我們在實現中期盈利能力和效率目標方面正在穩步前進。與上一季相比，我們的平均資產回報率提高了 1.08%，因此我們的效率比率下降至 59.2%。雖然淨利差較上季下降 6 個基點，但約有一半的降幅屬於暫時性，不會延續到第三季。這一下降是由戰略貸款組合銷售以及四月份住宅抵押貸款償還活動增加所致。其餘影響則是由存款定價壓力上升和轉向高利率產品所致。重要的是，我們仍然專注於加強淨利息收入的行動和舉措，這些努力充分反映在我們的指導中。

Slide 11 provides a balance sheet summary. Total average deposits decreased 0.7% linked quarter to $503 billion, in line with seasonal tax payment outflows and our emphasis on relationship-based deposits. Balance sheet management supported a funding mix that prioritize both non-interest-bearing and low-cost consumer deposits. Average consumer deposit balances increased $2.4 billion or 1.1% linked quarter, while the percentage of non-interest-bearing to total deposits remained stable at approximately 16%, and the deposit beta was 42%. Average loans totaled $379 billion, a decrease of 0.1% on a linked-quarter basis.

投影片 11 提供了資產負債表摘要。總平均存款環比下降 0.7% 至 5,030 億美元，與季節性稅收流出和我們對基於關係的存款的重視相一致。資產負債表管理支援優先考慮無息和低成本消費者存款的融資組合。平均消費者存款餘額較上季增加 24 億美元，增幅為 1.1%，而非計息存款佔總存款的比例維持穩定在 16% 左右，存款貝他係數為 42%。平均貸款總額為 3,790 億美元，季減 0.1%。

Balances were impacted by the sale of approximately $4.5 billion of residential mortgages and approximately $1 billion of auto loans. Excluding these sales, average loan growth was approximately 0.4% sequentially and 1.6% year over year. Notably, we strategically grew our C&I and credit card average loan portfolios 7.1% and 4.4%, respectively, on a year-over-year basis. At June 30, the ending balance of our investment securities portfolio was $174 billion, an increase of $3 billion from the prior quarter end. Fixed asset repricing and reinvestment of proceeds from our residential mortgage sale into investment securities resulted in an 8 basis point increase to the average investment portfolio yield.

約 45 億美元的住宅抵押貸款和約 10 億美元的汽車貸款的出售對餘額產生了影響。不包括這些銷售額，平均貸款成長率約為季增 0.4%，較去年同期成長 1.6%。值得注意的是，我們策略性地將商業和工業貸款及信用卡平均貸款組合分別年增 7.1% 和 4.4%。截至 6 月 30 日，我們的投資證券組合的期末餘額為 1,740 億美元，較上一季末增加 30 億美元。固定資產重新定價以及將住宅抵押貸款出售所得收益再投資於投資證券，導致平均投資組合收益率增加了 8 個基點。

Consistent with efforts to reposition the balance sheet, we opportunistically restructured approximately $1.25 billion of investment securities this quarter, resulting in a $57 million loss. The payback period on this transaction was less than two years and enhanced our net interest income trajectory.

為了調整資產負債表，我們本季趁機重組了約 12.5 億美元的投資證券，導致損失 5,700 萬美元。交易的回收期不到兩年，提高了我們的淨利息收入軌跡。

Turning to slide 12. Net interest income on a fully taxable equivalent basis totaled $4.08 billion. Linked quarter, the competitive deposit environment more than offset the benefits of fixed asset repricing.

翻到第 12 張投影片。以完全應稅等值計算的淨利息收入總計 40.8 億美元。與上一季相比，競爭激烈的存款環境抵消了固定資產重新定價的好處。

Slide 13 highlights trends in non-interest income. Total non-interest income totaled $2.9 billion, reflecting security losses of $57 million from the repositioning of the securities portfolio. Excluding security losses, total fee revenue of approximately $3 billion increased 4.6% year over year. This was driven by core growth and new business momentum across payments, trust and investment management, and other fee revenue.

幻燈片 13 重點介紹了非利息收入的趨勢。非利息總收入為 29 億美元，反映出證券投資組合重新配置造成的 5,700 萬美元的證券損失。不包括證券損失，總費用收入約 30 億美元，較去年同期成長 4.6%。這是由支付、信託和投資管理以及其他費用收入的核心成長和新業務勢頭推動的。

Turning to slide 14. Non-interest expense was $4.18 billion as we prudently managed expenses and further captured operational efficiencies across the business.

翻到第 14 張投影片。非利息支出為 41.8 億美元，因為我們審慎管理支出並進一步提高整個業務的營運效率。

Slide 15 highlights our credit quality performance. The ratio of non-performing assets to loans and other real estate was 0.44% at June 30, an improvement of 1 basis point linked quarter and 5 basis points better than a year ago. The second quarter net charge-off ratio of 0.59% and allowance for credit losses of $7.9 billion or 2.07% of period-end loans remained stable sequentially.

投影片 15 重點介紹了我們的信用品質表現。截至 6 月 30 日，不良資產與貸款及其他房地產之比為 0.44%，較上季改善 1 個基點，較去年同期改善 5 個基點。第二季淨核銷率為 0.59%，信貸損失準備金為 79 億美元，佔期末貸款的 2.07%，與上一季相比保持穩定。

Turning to slide 16. As of June 30, our CET1 capital ratio was 10.7%, a 2 basis point decline linked quarter. Given strong capital levels and earnings accretion, we elected not to replenish a maturing credit risk transfer, keeping our CET1 capital ratio flat sequentially. Results of this year's stress test, which revised our preliminary stress capital buffer to 2.6%, further demonstrated the company's ability to withstand a severe economic downturn, which is a testament to the strength quality and diversity of our balance sheet and prudent approach to risk management. Importantly, our CET1 capital ratio, including AOCI, improved to 8.9%.

翻到第 16 張投影片。截至 6 月 30 日，我們的 CET1 資本比率為 10.7%，季減 2 個基點。鑑於強勁的資本水準和獲利成長，我們選擇不補充到期的信用風險轉移，從而使我們的 CET1 資本比率保持連續穩定。今年的壓力測試結果將我們的初步壓力資本緩衝修改為 2.6%，進一步證明了公司抵禦嚴重經濟衰退的能力，這證明了我們資產負債表的強度、品質和多樣性以及審慎的風險管理方法。重要的是，包括 AOCI 在內的我們的 CET1 資本比率提高至 8.9%。

At the top of slide 17, we show a comparison of second quarter results to our earlier guidance. As expected, slightly lower net interest income was more than offset by better-than-expected fee income of approximately $3 billion in prudent expense management.

在第 17 張投影片的頂部，我們展示了第二季業績與我們先前的預測的比較。正如預期的那樣，略低的淨利息收入被審慎的費用管理帶來的約 30 億美元的費用收入（好於預期）所抵消。

I'll now provide forward-looking guidance for the third quarter and full year 2025, starting with the third quarter 2025 guidance. We expect net interest income for the third quarter on a fully taxable equivalent basis to be in the range of $4.1 billion to $4.2 billion. Total fee revenue is expected to be approximately $3 billion.

我現在將提供 2025 年第三季和全年的前瞻性指導，從 2025 年第三季指導開始。我們預計第三季以完全應稅等值計算的淨利息收入將在 41 億美元至 42 億美元之間。預計總費用收入約 30 億美元。

This compares to the second quarter total fee revenue of $2.98 billion. Total non-interest expense is expected to be $4.2 billion or lower in the third quarter. We expect to deliver positive operating leverage of 200 basis points or more on an adjusted basis.

相比之下，第二季的總費用收入為 29.8 億美元。預計第三季非利息總支出為 42 億美元或更低。我們預計調整後將達到 200 個基點或以上的正營業槓桿。

I'll now provide full year 2025 guidance, which is consistent with our previous guidance. Compared to full year 2024, we expect total net revenue growth on an adjusted basis at the lower end of our 3% to 5% range.

我現在將提供 2025 年全年指導，這與我們之前的指導一致。與 2024 年全年相比，我們預計調整後的總淨收入成長率將處於 3% 至 5% 區間的低端。

Our guidance assumes two rate cuts in 2025. For the full year, we expect to deliver positive operating leverage of 200 basis points or more on an adjusted basis.

我們的指導假設是 2025 年將降息兩次。就全年而言，我們預計調整後的營運槓桿將達到或超過 200 個基點。

Turning to slide 18. We continue to make measurable progress towards achieving our medium-term targets. As you can see on this slide, year over year, we have improved both our return on average assets and efficiency ratio while delivering high teens return on tangible common equity and mid-single-digit fee growth.

翻到第 18 張投影片。我們在實現中期目標方面繼續取得顯著進展。正如您在這張投影片上看到的，與去年同期相比，我們的平均資產回報率和效率比率都有所提高，同時實現了較高的有形普通股權益回報率和中等個位數的費用成長。

Let me now hand it back to Gunjan for closing remarks.

現在，請允許我把發言時間交還給 Gunjan 先生，請他做最後發言。

Thank you, John. And let me close on slide 19. Second quarter results were supported by a unique mix of diversified businesses that delivered strong sequential and year-over-year EPS growth this quarter. The resiliency of our business model offset some rate-driven softness in spread income with good growth in fees and continued expense discipline. Notably, we executed on our key expense initiatives and delivered meaningful positive operating leverage for the fourth consecutive quarter.

謝謝你，約翰。最後讓我以第 19 張投影片作為結束。第二季的業績得益於多元化業務的獨特組合，本季每股收益實現了強勁的環比和同比增長。我們業務模式的彈性透過費用的良好成長和持續的費用控制抵消了利差收入中由利率驅動的部分疲軟。值得注意的是，我們執行了關鍵的支出計劃，並連續第四個季度實現了有意義的正營運槓桿。

We are intentionally evolving our business mix to be more fee-intensive and attractive to greater diversification while also shifting the balance sheet to support a higher percentage of multiservice clients and improved spread revenue.

我們正在有意改進我們的業務組合，使其費用更加密集，並更具吸引力，實現更加多樣化，同時轉變資產負債表，以支持更高比例的多服務客戶和提高利差收入。

As we head into the back half of the year, we are well positioned and executing with urgency on our three key priorities: expense discipline, organic growth, and transformation of our payments business. Efforts this quarter supported meaningful progress towards our medium-term financial targets and ability to deliver sustainable EPS growth. I'm often reminded that the true strength of this company is driven by the day-to-day actions and choices of our talented teams. So on behalf of all my US Bank colleagues, I would like to thank our clients and our shareholders for their loyalty and support of our exceptional companies.

隨著我們進入下半年，我們已經做好準備並緊急執行我們的三個關鍵優先事項：費用控制、有機成長和支付業務轉型。本季度的努力為我們實現中期財務目標和實現可持續每股收益成長的能力取得了重大進展。我經常被提醒，這家公司的真正實力是由我們才華橫溢的團隊的日常行動和選擇所驅動的。因此，我謹代表美國銀行的所有同事，感謝我們的客戶和股東對我們優秀公司的忠誠和支持。

With that, we will now open the call for your questions.

現在，我們將開始回答大家的提問。

(Operator Instructions) Scott Siefers, Piper Sandler.

（操作員指示）斯科特·西弗斯、派珀·桑德勒。

John, I was hoping to start out on some NII dynamics. Maybe if you could spend a moment discussing where the margin goes from here off the [266] base. I think you mentioned part of the linked quarter decline was sort of transitory based on the actions you took in the second quarter. So what do you see as the best launching point? And kind of what would it take to move it higher or lower from here? In other words, the main puts and takes. I guess the final piece of it is maybe where we stand on the 3% medium-term margin aspiration.

約翰，我希望開始研究一些 NII 動態。也許您可以花一點時間討論一下從這裡開始 [266] 基數的邊距會變成什麼樣子。我認為您提到的環比季度下滑部分是基於您在第二季度採取的行動而產生的暫時現象。那您認為最好的起點是什麼？那麼，怎樣才能使它從現在開始升高或降低呢？換句話說，主要的投入和產出。我想，最後一個問題可能是我們對 3% 中期利潤率目標的立場。

Sure. Thank you, Scott. First of all, yeah, you're right on the net interest margin. We had 3 basis points of the 6 was really attributed to transitory things related to the sale that I mentioned kind of a grossing up balance sheet. So we expect that to reverse.

當然。謝謝你，斯科特。首先，是的，你對淨利差的看法是正確的。我們有 3 個基點，其中 6 個基點實際上歸因於與銷售相關的暫時性事物，我提到這是一種增加資產負債表的現象。因此我們預計這種情況將會逆轉。

I also expect sequential net interest income growth here in the third and fourth quarter as we move forward. We have a lot of positive momentum on the asset side driven by a lot of strategic actions that we mentioned throughout our remarks. We do have fixed asset repricing that will accelerate and be better than the first half of the year. We do the strategic actions we took in terms of the loan sales as well as the investment portfolio repositioning is going to help net interest income trajectory for the next several quarters. And then loan growth, we feel the pipelines are strong on C&I and card.

我還預計，隨著我們不斷前進，第三季和第四季的淨利息收入將實現連續成長。在我們在整個發言中提到的許多戰略行動的推動下，我們在資產方面有很多積極的勢頭。我們的固定資產重新定價確實會加速，而且會比上半年更好。我們在貸款銷售以及投資組合重新定位方面採取的策略行動將有助於未來幾季的淨利息收入軌跡。然後是貸款成長，我們認為商業和工業貸款以及信用卡貸款的管道很強勁。

We've been growing C&I at a 7% year-over-year clip card at 4% to 5% year-over-year clip. And CRE is starting to turn the tide there in terms of not being as much of a drag in terms of growth. And in terms of deposits, we're being active in remixing our deposit mix. We are -- intentionally, we moved out of some high-cost corporate and single-serve client, and we had moved into more of our consumer deposit base with our -- highlighted with our bank smartly product. So we feel very good about the trajectory of all these moves. And so that's going to help us both on the net interest income and margin side of things go forward.

我們的 C&I 業務年增率為 7%，年增率為 4% 至 5%。而且，商業不動產正在開始扭轉局勢，不再對經濟成長造成太大的拖累。在存款方面，我們正在積極調整我們的存款結構。我們有意擺脫一些高成本的企業和單一服務客戶，轉而利用我們的智慧銀行產品，更多地服務於消費者存款基礎。因此，我們對所有這些舉措的軌跡感到非常滿意。因此，這將有助於我們在淨利息收入和利潤方面取得進展。

And I would just say, in terms of our 3%, there's no change. Obviously, we know the margin dip this quarter, but it's not never linear, and we just -- we have those drivers that I just mentioned that are going to help us see through that 3% over the medium term.

我只想說，就我們的 3% 而言，沒有改變。顯然，我們知道本季的利潤率有所下降，但這並不是直線下降的，我們只是——我們有我剛才提到的那些驅動因素，它們將幫助我們在中期內實現 3% 的利潤率。

And Scott, let me add one other point. Even on deposit mix, even on the institutional side, you will observe very healthy growth in treasury management fees and our corporate trust fees, these are processing business that bring operational deposits that are also favorable to our mix. So that is also -- that focus will also help our NIM trajectory.

史考特，請容許我補充一點。即使在存款組合中，即使在機構方面，您也會觀察到財務管理費和公司信託費的非常健康的增長，這些都是處理業務，帶來營運存款，這對我們的組合也有利。所以這也是——這種關注也將有助於我們的 NIM 軌跡。

Perfect. Okay. Good. Thank you for that color. And then maybe the follow-up, John, when you talked about (inaudible), when you talk about expenses being, I think, $4.2 billion or lower in the third quarter, maybe just a second on where that flex could come from, if necessary.

完美的。好的。好的。謝謝你的那個顏色。然後也許接下來的問題是，約翰，當您談到（聽不清楚）時，當您談到第三季度的支出約為 42 億美元或更低時，如果有必要，也許您能稍微談談這種靈活性可能來自哪裡。

And kind of more broadly, I guess one of the concerns I hear from investors is that cutting costs to meet the operating leverage targets might just be preventing some necessary investments. Can you just sort of address that? I'm certain you all don't feel that way, but maybe if you could just spend a moment addressing it, please.

更廣泛地說，我想我從投資者那裡聽到的一個擔憂是，削減成本以達到營運槓桿目標可能會阻礙一些必要的投資。您能簡單解釋一下這個問題嗎？我確信你們都不這麼認為，但也許你們可以花一點時間來解決這個問題。

Sure. We certainly don't feel that way. We feel all the initiatives and investments we have made, we are harvesting that for all these sorts of things. And as Gunjan mentioned in her comments, we are self-funding in a number of the initiatives that we have. And so we feel very good about the levers that we had.

當然。我們當然不這麼認為。我們感覺到，我們所做的所有舉措和投資，都為所有這些事情帶來了收穫。正如 Gunjan 在她的評論中提到的那樣，我們的許多舉措都是自籌資金的。因此，我們對所擁有的槓桿感到非常滿意。

It's coming from things like the real estate that's going to be a continual driver. The combining of certain areas have found us efficiencies within our operations and other sorts of technology like groups. The productivity changes we've made and platform enhancements we've made. AI is certainly a buzzword, but there are things that we are deploying that has been helpful and will continue to be helpful going forward. There's just a lot of efficiencies and things that we are executing on on the expense side that's been helpful to us.

它來自房地產等行業，並將成為持續的驅動力。某些領域的結合使我們的營運和其他類型的技術（如團體）更有效率。我們所做的生產力改變和平台增強。人工智慧當然是一個流行詞，但我們正在部署的一些東西已經很有幫助，並且在未來將繼續有幫助。我們在費用方面執行的許多效率和措施對我們很有幫助。

And we have continued our investment. We continued our investment in terms of our tech spend, in terms of our investments in the business. That has not changed. And we feel really good about these things being pointed at our strategic objectives where we want to grow.

我們將繼續投資。我們繼續在技術支出和業務投資方面進行投資。這一點沒有改變。我們很高興看到這些事情與我們想要發展的策略目標相符。

And I'll just add, Scott, you've covered our company for a long time, and you've seen us operate very effectively at an efficiency ratio, much different from where we are today. It's a very streamlined simple business mix. We are quite big in the businesses we are in. So our conviction that we can operate the company and invest in the future growth at a slightly lower efficiency ratio is very real.

我還要補充一點，斯科特，你報道我們公司已經很長時間了，你也看到我們以非常有效的效率比率運營，與我們今天的情況大不相同。這是一個非常精簡的簡單業務組合。我們從事的業務規模相當大。因此，我們堅信，我們可以以略低的效率比率經營公司並投資未來的成長，這是非常真實的。

And in addition to the digital investments that John talked about, I do want to say that the real productivity that is coming from having spent more than $5 billion in digital investments over the last five years is very real.

除了約翰談到的數位投資之外，我還想說，過去五年來我們在數位領域投入的 50 多億美元所帶來的實際生產力是真實的。

And you will observe certain line items over time increase like technology, sales and marketing expenses, investments in our payments businesses because those are our strategic areas. And the real productive will be in some other categories. So we very much take the question that the productivity is not coming out of underinvesting in future growth.

隨著時間的推移，您會發現某些項目會增加，例如技術、銷售和行銷費用以及對支付業務的投資，因為這些都是我們的策略領域。而真正的富有成效的將在其他一些類別中。因此，我們非常擔心，生產力的提高並不是由於對未來成長的投資不足。

Perfect. All right. Thank you very much.

完美的。好的。非常感謝。

Stephen Alexopoulos, TD Cowen.

史蒂芬·亞歷克斯普洛斯（Stephen Alexopoulos），TD Cowen。

I wanted to start, so Gunjan, for you, a bigger picture question, if you will. So if we look at the guidance you provided to the market, hold expenses flattish, deliver positive operating leverage, 200 basis points or better, that's been the guide. You look at this quarter, you basically did that, right, 250 bps POL, maintain the outlook. Despite that, the stock, we'll see where it goes. It's down 4% right now pre-market.

首先，Gunjan，如果你願意的話，我想問你一個更宏觀的問題。因此，如果我們看一下您向市場提供的指導，保持支出平穩，實現正營運槓桿，200 個基點或更高，這就是指導。看看這個季度，你基本上做到了，對吧，250 bps POL，維持前景。儘管如此，我們仍將觀察股票的走勢。目前盤前股價已下跌 4%。

When you think of the financial targets, right, the desire to create shareholder value, is 200 basis points enough of an objective to get the stock working? And do you need to do more on the revenue side, right, to start moving the POL needle?

當您考慮財務目標時，對吧，創造股東價值的願望，200 個基點是否足以成為推動股票上漲的目標？您是否需要在收入方面做更多工作，以開始推動 POL 的發展？

So very thoughtful question, thank you. 200 basis points of positive operating leverage is very healthy in the long term, the opportunities and revenue growth. If you look at our portfolio and we really try to disaggregate some of our business lines, so you can see the underlying strength of how we have evolved the portfolio. The opportunities for growth are very, very real.

這個問題問得很有深度，謝謝。 200 個基點的正營運槓桿從長期來看非常健康，會帶來機會和收入成長。如果您看一下我們的投資組合，我們會真正嘗試分解我們的一些業務線，這樣您就可以看到我們如何發展投資組合的潛在優勢。成長機會非常非常真實。

And that's where you will see us sort of flex the EPS growth. The expense side was an important area of focus for us just to get the positive operating leverage in place. And I look back and reflect also on why the stock reaction. And it's less about the targets not being appropriate, but whether there is enough sustainability and consistency of delivery against it, which is why we report out sort of how we are progressing towards our medium-term target. We are very confident that as the confidence grows in our ability to march towards our medium-term targets in a consistent fashion, the stock would react to that.

這時你會看到我們的每股盈餘 (EPS) 成長有所提升。為了實現積極的經營槓桿，費用方面是我們關注的重要領域。我回顧並思考了股票反應的原因。這並不是說目標不合適，而是目標是否具有足夠的可持續性和一致性，這就是我們報告我們實現中期目標的進展的原因。我們非常有信心，隨著我們對持續實現中期目標的能力的信心不斷增強，股票也會對此做出反應。

Okay. That's fair. Maybe for John, even though loan growth was negatively impacted by the mortgage sales. You guys did have very solid underlying C&I growth. And I guess this goes to Scotty's question a minute ago, but if we look at your funding, right, assuming C&I loan growth continues to be strong, which is what we saw out of P&C yesterday at same thing. Talk about what is going to change from what happened this quarter where you saw a migration to higher cost deposit products. How can you fund that with lower-cost deposits and drive NIM expansion, say, the back half of this year? Thanks.

好的。這很公平。對約翰來說也許如此，儘管貸款成長受到了抵押貸款銷售的負面影響。你們確實擁有非常穩固的 C&I 成長。我想這與 Scotty 剛才提出的問題有關，但如果我們看一下您的資金狀況，對吧，假設 C&I 貸款成長繼續強勁，這正是我們昨天在 P&C 中看到的。談談本季發生的情況將會發生哪些變化，您看到存款產品轉移到成本更高的產品。您如何利用低成本存款為其提供資金並推動淨利差擴張（例如在今年下半年）？謝謝。

Great. Yes. Good question. Steven, I think the -- your observation is correct, and we do expect, as I mentioned on the previous question, growth in C&I and card and things like that that are going to position us for higher growth on the asset side, coupled with all the other things that I said. So there's certainly the asset side we feel good about.

偉大的。是的。好問題。史蒂文，我認為你的觀察是正確的，正如我在上一個問題中提到的那樣，我們確實預計，工商和信用卡等業務的增長將使我們在資產方面實現更高的增長，再加上我所說的所有其他事情。因此，我們當然對資產方面感到滿意。

On the deposit side, yes, we saw an increase of cost in that. But I think where we're leaning in is on the consumer side, which is appropriate because what we're doing is we're looking at things like our Bank Smartly product, which is a fantastic product for us. It's a product where clients set up both a card and a checking and/or savings account. And we have seen through this over 50% of the people that use this product is new to bank. We see that the multiservice client statistics on this cycle product are 3x what we would normally have on the retail side.

在存款方面，是的，我們看到成本增加。但我認為我們的重點是在消費者方面，這是合適的，因為我們正在做的是研究像我們的 Bank Smartly 產品這樣的東西，這對我們來說是一款很棒的產品。該產品允許客戶同時設定一張卡和一個支票和/或儲蓄帳戶。我們發現，使用該產品的人中超過 50% 都是銀行新用戶。我們發現，該週期產品的多服務客戶統計數據是零售方面的 3 倍。

And our acquisition cost is a lot lower, nearly a third of the cost we can take out in terms of acquisition with this product value proposition that we give to the clients. And so over time, what we are seeing is an improvement in our deposit portfolio and improved flexibility of our ability to price as we move forward. And that's really going to be the drivers of how we will manage over the long term, our funding costs.

而且我們的收購成本要低得多，幾乎是我們透過向客戶提供的產品價值主張所能節省的收購成本的三分之一。因此，隨著時間的推移，我們看到我們的存款組合有所改善，我們的定價能力也更加靈活。這才是我們長期管理融資成本的真正動力。

Got it. And John, I'm newer to your story. Why didn't that help this quarter, this Smartly product? And why isn't it going to help next quarter but didn't help this quarter?

知道了。約翰，我對你的故事還不太熟悉。為什麼 Smartly 產品對本季沒有幫助？為什麼它對下個季度沒有幫助，但對本季卻沒有幫助？

There was -- the deposit side was all -- it was on the commercial and retail side. So I'm not going to say it's just all retail. This is a deposit story. But what I'm referring to as I think about the go-forward deposit portfolio position, it's really about our flexibility and to move pricing as we think about the different deposit levers that we have, whether it's CD or the savings rate as the Fed moves rates and things like that. We have more ability than we would have otherwise in our retail book as a result of this.

有——存款方面都是——它屬於商業和零售方面。所以我不會說這都是零售業。這是一個存款故事。但我所指的，當我考慮未來的存款組合部位時，實際上關乎我們的靈活性和定價的調整，因為我們會考慮我們擁有的不同存款槓桿，無論是存單還是儲蓄利率，因為聯準會會調整利率等等。因此，我們的零售帳簿上的能力比沒有此項功能時更強。

And then on the commercial side, we have a high beta, already a high beta type of product. So when the Fed does move, we can cut those rates or move those rates appropriately.

然後在商業方面，我們有一個高 beta，已經是一個高 beta 類型的產品。因此，當聯準會採取行動時，我們可以降低利率或適當調整利率。

Got it. Thanks for the color.

知道了。謝謝你的顏色。

Betsy Graseck, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的 Betsy Graseck。

A couple of follow-ups there. One is on the C&I book. And can you give us some color on the driver of that acceleration in growth and where we stand now with line utilizations 2Q? That would be helpful.

那裡有幾個後續行動。其中一個在 C&I 書上。您能否向我們介紹一下成長加速的驅動因素以及第二季生產線利用率的現況？那將會很有幫助。

Yeah. Betsy, it was -- the growth really in C&I was everywhere. It was very good to see -- I could give you the laundry list, but the highlights would be the utilization rate did tick up a little bit. It's about 30, 40 basis points, and it's a continuation of what the trends that we saw last quarter. We saw strength in our ABS lending portfolios.

是的。貝琪，工商企業的成長確實無所不在。看到這一點非常好——我可以給你一份清單，但亮點是利用率確實略有上升。大約是 30 到 40 個基點，這是我們上個季度看到的趨勢的延續。我們的 ABS 貸款組合表現強勁。

We saw strength in small business, led by health care and things of that variety, SBA as well. our expansion markets, middle market, we've been growing in various areas have been providing us nice growth year-on-year. And so there's just been a lot of good growth, and we have a lot of momentum, and the pipelines are strong.

我們看到了小型企業的實力，以醫療保健和類似的行業為首，SBA 也是如此。我們的擴張市場、中端市場，我們在各個領域的成長都為我們帶來了逐年良好的成長。因此，我們取得了許多良好的成長，並且發展勢頭強勁，通路也很強大。

And Betsy, let me add just one other thing to your question. For the last few years, we've been very intentional with also introducing new product capabilities, more structured credit capabilities, just reflecting a more sophisticated client base and their needs you're seeing the impact in these recent quarters of the groundwork that was laid over the last few years. And similarly the credit cards -- yes. Go ahead.

貝琪，請容許我補充一點關於你的問題。在過去的幾年裡，我們一直有意推出新的產品功能、更結構化的信貸功能，這反映了更複雜的客戶群及其需求，您在最近幾個季度看到了過去幾年奠定的基礎的影響。信用卡也同樣如此——是的。前進。

So that's advancing the private credit side of the business. Is that partly what's going on with the structured credit?

因此，這將推動私人信貸業務的發展。這是否部分反映了結構化信貸的情況？

That's helping, too.

這也有幫助。

That's helping as well. But it's broader than that.

這也有幫助。但它的意義比這更廣泛。

Okay. And then just a ticky-tacky question, but were there any gains or losses on the asset sales you did?

好的。然後這只是一個棘手的問題，但是您出售資產有收益還是損失？

No. There's nothing meaningful other than the reserve release that you saw this quarter.

不。除了本季看到的儲備釋放之外，沒有什麼有意義的事情。

Okay. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

Michael Mayo, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的麥可·梅奧。

I think these are for you, John, just still on the NIM. Did you say there was deposit competition that was 1 of the drags on the NIM? And also, I think I see RWA up $9 billion in a quarter when loans were flat and didn't quite understand why that happened.

我認為這些是給你的，約翰，你還在 NIM 上。您是否說過存款競爭是 NIM 的拖累因素之一？而且，我認為在貸款持平的情況下，RWA 在一個季度內增加了 90 億美元，我不太明白為什麼會發生這種情況。

Sure. Let me go to your second question first. On the RWA, yes, $9 billion up. I commented and just to reiterate, we had a couple of things happen. One, we elected to have some of the credit risk transfers that we've done in the past to roll off. That was about half. And the other half was commercial loan growth that we saw at the end of the quarter we saw strengthening, which is why we're commenting on C&I growth and saying that the pipelines are strong. There's a lot of activity. We felt like confidence improved throughout the quarter. So those are the underlying drivers for the RWA component.

當然。我先來回答你的第二個問題。就風險加權資產而言，是的，增加了 90 億美元。我評論了一下並重申一下，我們發生了幾件事。首先，我們選擇取消過去進行過的一些信用風險轉移。大約是一半。另一半是商業貸款成長，我們在本季末看到商業貸款成長有所加強，這就是我們對 C&I 成長發表評論並表示通路強勁的原因。有很多活動。我們感覺整個季度的信心都有所增強。這些就是 RWA 元件的根本驅動因素。

On the net interest margin side of the equation, I would say the deposit market is competitive. It has been for some time. I don't think anything is unique about this quarter versus others. Obviously, there was the market turmoil that started at the beginning of the quarter.

從淨利差的角度來看，我認為存款市場競爭激烈。已經有一段時間了。我認為本季與其他季度相比並沒有什麼獨特之處。顯然，本季初就出現了市場動盪。

But very quickly, people bounced. The clients have been very much resilient, and we feel like the pricing is appropriate and rational.

但很快，人們就放棄了。客戶的適應力很強，我們認為定價是合適且合理的。

All right. Now just because we hear from some others that yield-seeking behavior has really died down quite a bit. But going the lens out just on asset liability management generally, I guess you're not running the firm just for the NIM or NII, you're running it for revenues and value creation over time. I get it. But is there anything that you need to change holistically with asset liability management or that you've done over the past year that may show some results?

好的。現在只是因為我們從其他人那裡聽說，追求收益的行為確實已經減弱了很多。但從資產負債管理的角度來看，我認為你經營公司不只是為了淨利息收入或淨利息收入，而是為了長期創造收入和價值。我得到它。但是，您是否需要對資產負債管理進行整體上的改變，或者您在過去一年中所做的改變可能會產生一些效果？

Again, I'm just looking back a couple of years and you guys were caught with the unrealized securities losses, and that was an issue. And now here's NIMs falling short and it's deposits. And it just seems a little bit not in sync with the industry. Maybe as you said, it's going to pick up the next couple of quarters, and this thing will be in the past. But just any general thoughts about the process of ALM at USB?

再說一次，我回顧一下幾年前的情況，你們陷入了未實現證券損失，這是一個問題。現在，淨利息收益率 (NIM) 和存款都出現了短缺。這似乎與業界有點不同步。也許正如你所說，未來幾季情況會好轉，而這種情況將成為過去。但是對於 USB 的 ALM 流程有什麼整體想法嗎？

I think I acknowledge your comments, Mike. But I think that what we're doing is a lot of the actions that we're taking right now are about positioning for the future. Some of the sales that we talked about, the positioning on the securities book and everything like that. These are active actions that we're taking to move ourselves forward to get our -- we had some charts there about where we want to take the balance sheet and how that has grown into more support multiservice clients and things of that variety.

我想我承認你的評論，麥克。但我認為，我們現在採取的許多行動都是為了未來做準備。我們討論的一些銷售、證券帳簿的定位等等。這些都是我們正在採取的積極行動，以推動我們前進——我們有一些圖表，說明我們想要將資產負債表帶到哪裡，以及如何發展為更多支持多服務客戶和類似的事情。

We have the ALM processes in terms of managing interest rate risk and things of that variety. So we feel very good about those capabilities.

我們有管理利率風險及類似事項的 ALM 流程。所以我們對這些能力感到非常滿意。

I'd just also add, Mike, that we are strategically evolving both sides of the balance sheet to support a higher NII trajectory. So we have a very big mortgage book. It grew a lot during the post-COVID era. And that's why the focus on credit cards and commercial C&I loans, which have a better yield characteristic.

麥克，我還要補充一點，我們正在策略性地發展資產負債表的兩邊，以支持更高的 NII 軌跡。因此，我們的抵押貸款帳簿非常龐大。在後疫情時代，它發展迅速。這就是為什麼我們關注具有更好收益特徵的信用卡和商業 C&I 貸款。

On the deposit side, we are, in addition to the consumer deposit focus, you'll see we are defending those and defending market share there. We're also really going out the treasury management and the Corporate Trust franchise so that the institutional deposit profile is very good. So there's a lot of strategic efforts to create a faster NII trajectory.

在存款方面，除了關註消費者存款之外，您會看到我們正在捍衛這些存款並捍衛那裡的市場份額。我們也真正拓展了財務管理和企業信託特許經營權，以便機構存款狀況非常好。因此，我們需要做出許多戰略努力來創造更快的國家資訊基礎設施發展軌跡。

And just lastly, the 3% NIM, is that something that could be seen in a year, two years, five years? Any sense?

最後，3% 的淨利差是可以在一年、兩年或五年後實現的嗎？有道理嗎？

Well, for all the drivers that we talked about, we continue to expect that to be in the medium term. I would say that we have about four cuts over the cycle remaining within that assumption. More cuts are more helpful. Fewer cuts make it a little bit more of a slower pace. So those are kind of puts and takes to how we think about it.

嗯，對於我們討論的所有驅動因素，我們仍然預計這將是中期的。我想說，在這個假設範圍內，我們在本週期內大約還有四次降息。削減越多越有幫助。削減越少，節奏就越慢。所以這些都是我們對此的看法。

Otherwise, the initiatives that we're that we're talking about here are positioning ourselves for that interest income trajectory going forward.

否則，我們在這裡談論的舉措就是為未來的利息收入軌跡做好準備。

Great. Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。

John Pancari, Evercore ISI.

約翰·潘卡里（John Pancari），Evercore ISI。

Just on the balance sheet trends, I appreciate the loan growth color you gave and some of the deposit dynamics. In terms of the growth outlook from here, is it -- I know previously you had pretty much described it as modest growth on both fronts, I believe, on loan growth and deposits. Can you maybe just update us how you're thinking about it now, particularly since you're seeing some acceleration in the underlying trends within commercial and your seeing some growth in card? How are you thinking about that now? Thanks.

僅就資產負債表趨勢而言，我很欣賞您給出的貸款成長顏色和一些存款動態。就目前的成長前景而言，我知道您之前將其描述為貸款成長和存款兩個方面的溫和成長。您能否告訴我們您現在對此有何看法，特別是因為您看到商業領域的潛在趨勢有所加速，而且信用卡業務有所增長？您現在對此有何看法？謝謝。

Yeah. Thanks, John. I think certainly, when we started the year, as we were thinking about the budgeting, we looked out and assumed a modest pace of loan growth that more or less has transpired. But what we're saying and seeing is that there's been acceleration of -- and strategic focus on C&I and card for us, which you are seeing play out in terms of our C&I year-over-year growth, and we continue to see that and expect that to continue.

是的。謝謝，約翰。我認為，當然，當我們開始新的一年時，當我們考慮預算時，我們進行了展望並假設貸款增長速度適中，而這一情況或多或少已經發生了。但我們所說和看到的是，我們對 C&I 和信用卡的戰略重點一直在加速，您可以看到我們的 C&I 同比增長，我們將繼續看到這種情況並預計這種情況將繼續下去。

The card growth, we continue to expect to see that as well. So as I sit here today, we're better positioned on the loan growth side or we see better growth opportunities than we did at the beginning of the year.

我們預計卡片數量還會持續增加。因此，當我今天坐在這裡時，我們在貸款成長方面處於更有利的地位，或者我們看到了比年初更好的成長機會。

Okay. All right. Thanks. And then in terms of your revision to the 3% to 5% revenue guide, I know you cited the lower end now. How much of that decision to revise that was coming from the NII headwinds? And I guess, also put the other way, what are you seeing in terms of your growth expectation as you look at the trend in payments and fees?

好的。好的。謝謝。然後，關於您對 3% 至 5% 收入指南的修訂，我知道您現在引用的是下限。修改該決定的力度有多大是由於國家資訊基礎設施方面的不利因素造成的？我想，換句話說，當您觀察支付和費用的趨勢時，您對成長預期是怎樣的？

Are you comfortable still at the mid-single-digit growth level for overall fees and within the payments businesses as well?

您是否對整體費用和支付業務仍能維持中等個位數成長水準感到滿意？

Sure, absolutely. Yeah, let me start. So total revenue, obviously, is the two parts, and I'll start on the fee side. We feel very good about the momentum that we're building. Gunjan highlighted a number of those items on her comments.

當然，絕對是如此。是的，讓我開始吧。因此，總收入顯然由兩部分組成，我將從費用方面開始。我們對我們正在建立的勢頭感到非常滿意。Gunjan 在她的評論中強調了其中的一些內容。

On the institutional business side, trust and fund services, we continue to gain market share, market activity. So that's going well. Treasury management, Gunjan highlighted with our newer capabilities merchant processing, we feel very good. They've had a couple of quarters now of increased year-over-year growth. We continue to -- or we expect to see that to continue to improve given the strategies that we're putting in place there.

在機構業務方面，信託和基金服務方面，我們繼續獲得市場份額和市場活躍度。一切進展順利。財務管理方面，Gunjan 強調了我們較新的商家處理能力，我們感覺非常好。他們已經連續幾個季度實現了同比增長。鑑於我們在那裡實施的策略，我們將繼續——或者我們期望看到這種情況繼續改善。

Our tax credit activities within the other revenue have been growing very nicely for us this year. And I would expect our other revenue to be north of $150 million for the remainder of the year. And so all these things are really at that plus the things in capital markets and other areas, we feel very good about our fee trajectory going forward, and that's embedded in the guide that we provided to you. On the net interest income side, I think, sure, it's been a little slower than at the beginning of the year, but we think that there is acceleration that can grow because of the things that we talked about.

今年，我們在其他收入中的稅收抵免活動發展非常順利。我預計今年剩餘時間我們的其他收入將超過 1.5 億美元。因此，所有這些事情加上資本市場和其他領域的事情，我們對未來的費用走勢感到非常滿意，並且這些都包含在我們向您提供的指南中。在淨利息收入方面，我認為，當然，它比年初要慢一些，但我們認為，由於我們討論的事情，它可能會加速成長。

It's embedded in our guide for the third quarter. And I'm not going to repeat all those things again, but that's the essence of it and why we feel like we'll be at the lower end of the range.

它嵌入在我們第三季的指南中。我不想再重複這些事情，但這就是問題的本質，也是為什麼我們覺得我們會處於範圍的低端。

Right. Thanks for that, John. And then put back to the fees and payments, still comfortable with the mid-single-digit range?

正確的。謝謝你，約翰。然後再把費用和付款放回去，仍然對中等個位數範圍感到滿意嗎？

Yes. Yes, absolutely.

是的。是的，絕對是。

Okay. All right. Thank you.

好的。好的。謝謝。

Erika Najarian, UBS.

瑞銀的 Erika Najarian。

My first question is for John. John, I'm wondering if you could share your LCR ratio, I guess to continue on the theme that a lot of analysts have brought up. We're all scratching our heads because so far, none of your larger or similar size or smaller peers have really talked about this outsized commercial pricing pressure. And given sort of overall flattish loan growth in the quarter and then the sale of some of those loans, I guess I'm wondering why -- was there any sort of liquidity optimization reason behind paying up for those deposits?

我的第一個問題是問約翰的。約翰，我想知道您是否可以分享您的 LCR 比率，我想繼續許多分析師提出的主題。我們都很困惑，因為到目前為止，無論是規模較大、類似規模還是較小的同行，都沒有真正談論過這種過大的商業定價壓力。考慮到本季整體貸款成長持平，以及部分貸款的出售，我想知道為什麼——支付這些存款背後是否存在某種流動性優化的原因？

No. There's no liquidity concerns. We have very healthy LCR ratios. We feel very strong about our portfolio. These are all actions we're taking to help our business objectives as well as our strategic objectives that we've talked about as well as our positioning for net interest income going forward. So it has everything to do with that and nothing to do with liquidity side of things.

不。不存在流動性問題。我們的流動性覆蓋率 (LCR) 非常健康。我們對我們的投資組合感到非常強勁。這些都是我們正在採取的行動，以幫助我們實現業務目標以及我們所討論的策略目標以及未來淨利息收入的定位。所以這與此有關，而與流動性方面無關。

Got it. And my next question is for Gunjan. And I think Scott asked this in the beginning of the call, but I just wanted to maybe reask it a different way. Clearly, you're embarking upon an inflection point for the company, and the stock hasn't yet reacted. I think a lot of the discussion with longer-term investors has been really honing in on the focus going forward.

知道了。我的下一個問題是問 Gunjan 的。我認為斯科特在通話開始時就問過這個問題，但我只是想換一種方式再問一次。顯然，公司正處於一個轉折點，但股票尚未做出反應。我認為與長期投資者的許多討論實際上都集中在未來的重點上。

So what I mean by that is it struck me that -- you mentioned in your prepared remarks, expense management is number one, and organic growth is number two. And you also printed the word harvest, which is not necessarily a word that we've heard from someone like JPMorgan. I guess like the question here is, did we just really underappreciate the modernization that USB was going through over the past five years and that there's a lot of sort of excess expenses to recycle because it just feels like focusing on expenses to drive positive up rating leverage may be good for the near term. But as I think about your longer-term shareholders and what they own, they typically own some of like the revenue outperformers like a JP or a Morgan Stanley and such.

所以我的意思是，我突然想到──你在準備好的發言中提到，費用管理是第一位的，有機成長是第二位的。而且您還印上了「收穫」這個詞，這不一定是我們從摩根大通這樣的人那裡聽到的詞。我想這裡的問題是，我們是否真的低估了 USB 在過去五年中經歷的現代化，並且有很多多餘的費用需要回收，因為感覺專注於推動積極的上行評級槓桿可能在短期內是有利的。但當我想到你的長期股東和他們所擁有的資產時，他們通常擁有一些收入表現優異的股票，例如摩根士丹利或摩根士丹利等。

Erika, thank you, very thoughtful question, and I appreciate the opportunity to just react to the totality of the thesis here on us. And just -- I know you know our company very well, but I'll just go back a few years to describe the reason for the priorities. We did a very attractive acquisition two years back. We were very efficient to integrate it, but we went into the banking crisis with a depleted capital base. And our focus at that point was to very quickly rebuild our capital, which we did. It caused some trade-offs in terms of expenses because we had just integrated a big bank and just not enough attention to the revenue growth story.

艾莉卡，謝謝你，這個問題問得非常有思想，我很感謝有機會對我們提出的整個論點做出回應。而且——我知道您非常了解我們的公司，但我只想回顧一下幾年前的情況來解釋一下優先考慮的原因。兩年前我們進行了一次非常有吸引力的收購。我們非常有效地進行了整合，但我們卻因資本基礎枯竭而陷入了銀行危機。我們當時的重點是迅速重建首都，我們做到了。由於我們剛剛整合了一家大銀行，而且對收入成長關注不夠，因此這導致了費用方面的一些權衡。

My focus on the expenses is entirely short term because it's the fuel that helps create positive operating leverage and also helps us invest in our growth businesses. I would say that our portfolio of businesses is actually very attractive. There's an extraordinary amount of organic growth opportunity in our 10 core businesses, and they're very balanced across multiple business cycles. So we definitely expect to be a growth story but you really do have to build credibility and positive operating leverage and bring the efficiency ratio down because that's the model we want to scale over time.

我對費用的關注完全是短期的，因為它是幫助創造積極經營槓桿的動力，也有助於我們投資成長型業務。我想說我們的業務組合實際上非常有吸引力。我們的十大核心業務擁有大量的有機成長機會，並且它們在多個商業週期中非常平衡。因此，我們當然期望實現成長，但你確實必須建立信譽和積極的營運槓桿，並降低效率比率，因為這是我們想要隨著時間推移而擴展的模式。

To your point on did you underinvest the productivity benefits of the technology, yes, these are very real. And on top of that, we are seeing the power of the AI tools that we are deploying. So we expect productivity to be a meaningful contributor to bottom-line growth.

關於您是否對該技術帶來的生產力效益投入不足的問題，是的，這些都是真實存在的。除此之外，我們也看到了我們正在部署的人工智慧工具的威力。因此，我們預計生產力將對底線成長做出有意義的貢獻。

I'm hearing your questions and the concerns around it. But if you just step back we had 13% growth in EPS. We had very healthy positive operating leverage. We are down to 59.2% for our efficiency ratio. We had very strong fee growth that are strengthening over time in all the right ways. And the portfolio mix, both the fees, the balance sheet, is all strengthening and improving. So outside of the day-to-day noise of this particular quarter, if you just look at the trajectory of the franchise, we are in a very, very good position.

我聽到了您的疑問和擔憂。但如果你回顧一下，我們的每股盈餘成長了 13%。我們擁有非常健康的正向經營槓桿。我們的效率比率下降至59.2%。我們的費用成長非常強勁，並且隨著時間的推移，以正確的方式不斷增強。投資組合、費用和資產負債表都在加強和改善。因此，除了本季的日常噪音之外，如果你只看特許經營的發展軌跡，我們處於非常非常有利的位置。

Thank you, Gunjan. And I think investors will be warm to what you said about focuses on expenses is entirely short term and that you're looking forward to growth. Thanks for taking my questions.

謝謝你，Gunjan。我認為投資者會對您所說的關注費用完全是短期的並且您期待增長感到高興。感謝您回答我的問題。

Gerard Cassidy, RBC.

傑拉德·卡西迪（Gerard Cassidy），加拿大皇家銀行。

John, I may have missed it, and I apologize, on the strategic sale of the portfolio that you identified, can you share with us why that action was taken? But second, could there be further or additional sales later in the year of parts of the portfolio?

約翰，我可能錯過了，我很抱歉，關於您確定的投資組合的策略性出售，您能與我們分享採取這一行動的原因嗎？其次，今年稍後是否還會有部分投資組合進一步出售或額外出售？

Sure. I'll start on the mortgage side. That was about $4.6 billion in total. So consistent with our comments around growing the balance sheet, we obviously have a slide in our deck talking about why we want to position our asset mix to multiservice clients. The mortgages were legacy Union transactions with a single service type client.

當然。我先從抵押貸款方面開始。總計約 46 億美元。因此，與我們關於擴大資產負債表的評論一致，我們的簡報中顯然有一張幻燈片，討論了為什麼我們要將我們的資產組合定位於多服務客戶。這些抵押貸款是與單一服務類型客戶進行的遺留聯盟交易。

And so -- and there were a certain vintage, it was a certain yield type that we found an opportunity with the rate market, et cetera, this quarter to effectively get out at par. We have reinvested those proceeds within the investment portfolio and gain a spread of probably $1.25 or so. And we got a little less than half the quarter of the benefit this quarter and we'll pick up the rest full quarter, obviously, in the third quarter.

因此 — — 對於特定的年份、特定的收益類型，我們在本季度發現了利率市場等機會，可以有效地以平價退出。我們已將這些收益重新投資於投資組合，並獲得約 1.25 美元左右的利差。本季我們獲得的收益略低於季度收益的一半，但顯然，我們將在第三季度獲得剩餘的整個季度收益。

But it's really about -- the mindset here is really about shifting the balance sheet being intentional about our asset mix and moving our balance sheet to support more multiservice clients, which is going to drive fee revenues, net interest income trajectory and all those things that we've been talking about.

但它的真正意義在於——這裡的思維方式實際上是關於轉變資產負債表，有意改變我們的資產組合，並轉變我們的資產負債表以支持更多的多服務客戶，這將推動費用收入、淨利息收入軌跡以及我們一直在談論的所有那些事情。

Very good. Thank you for the color. And then Gunjan, maybe you can share with us, what your view and the bank's view about stable coins? It appears that it's very likely stable coins would the potential passage of the coin at down in Washington will be real soon and how you think that might impact your payments businesses as well as your deposits?

非常好。謝謝你的顏色。那麼 Gunjan，也許您可以與我們分享您和銀行對穩定幣的看法？看起來，穩定幣很有可能很快就會在華盛頓通過，您認為這會對您的支付業務和存款產生什麼影響？

We are expecting that the bills will pass and stable coin operators will be operating in the industry. In some ways, it's one more payment rail. And the first level of focus is just interoperability. So when it starts to be operational. We should be able to accept and process stable coins as well as interoperate within the banking system. So that sort of what our focus is.

我們期待該法案能夠獲得通過，穩定幣運營商將在該行業開展業務。從某種程度上來說，它是另一種支付方式。第一級關注點就是互通性。當它開始運作時。我們應該能夠接受和處理穩定的貨幣以及與銀行系統進行互通。這就是我們的重點。

We are quite ready to pilot our own stable coin. There's a lot of partnership capabilities in the industry that allows you to stand that up. So we accept that this will be here. The use cases that we hear most about why this was needed or why there was important are cross-border in nature today. And as you know, they are institutional in nature. And we do not really have a big institutional cross-border payments business.

我們已經準備好試行自己的穩定幣。業界中有很多合作能力可以幫助您實現這一點。所以我們接受這個事實。如今，我們聽到最多的關於為什麼需要這樣做或為什麼它很重要的用例本質上是跨國的。正如你們所知，它們本質上是製度性的。而且我們其實並沒有大型的機構跨境支付業務。

Our payments businesses are a large card issuing business. And they are a large merchant, which is very focused on the small business and largely focused on the US. So we do not expect it to be sort of material to payments business anytime soon. I think the issue, though, is if it does become a consumer day-to-day B2B type of a product or a pervasive institutional payments product, then it would compete with treasury management services.

我們的支付業務是一項大型的發卡業務。他們是一家大型商家，非常關注小型企業，並且主要關注美國。因此，我們預計它不會很快對支付業務產生重大影響。但我認為問題在於，如果它確實成為消費者日常的 B2B 類型的產品或普遍的機構支付產品，那麼它將與財務管理服務競爭。

Gerard, I'll tell you there are a lot of things to be yet sorted out, both from a technology standpoint and the market structure. So I would just say at this point, we are quite ready to participate in it, quite ready to engage in the industry discussions around stable coin, but not anticipating immediate revenue impact to any of our businesses.

傑拉德，我可以告訴你，無論是從技術角度還是從市場結構來看，都有很多事情需要解決。所以我現在只想說，我們已經準備好參與其中，準備好參與有關穩定幣的行業討論，但預計不會對我們的任何業務產生直接的收入影響。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Ken Usdin, Autonomous Research.

肯‧烏斯丁（Ken Usdin），自主研究。

John, I just wanted to ask you real quick on the third quarter NII outlook and a little bit on the wholesale deposit costs. So I think you had mentioned in the conference circuit that there was just a kind of a hold back on giving customers some deposits. So I'm just wondering on that first point, you mentioned that you can start to bring down wholesale deposits when rates come down. But is there anything different about how you see that going in terms of a beta perspective? You guys used to be one of the faster up and down beta companies, it's a little slower this cycle so far. So what's changed or what's the nuance in the current environment about that?

約翰，我只是想快速問你一下第三季 NII 前景以及批發存款成本的問題。所以我認為您在會議中提到過，在向客戶提供一些押金方面存在某種限制。所以我只是對第一點感到疑惑，您提到當利率下降時，您可以開始降低批發存款。但是從測試角度來看，您對此有何不同看法？你們曾經是測試版上升和下降速度較快的公司之一，但到目前為止，這個週期的速度有點慢。那麼，當前環境下發生了什麼變化或有何細微差別？

Sure. So the comment at the conference was really about, at that moment in time, there were some conversations regarding that. I would say that largely abated. And I would say that as the quarter moved on, the quarter became all about just a general deposit environment that is competitive, which is constantly competitive. So we're always competing. We were very intentional this quarter, as I mentioned, in terms of growing our consumer deposit base, and we have been focused on that for some time.

當然。因此，會議上的評論實際上是關於當時的一些討論。我想說這種情況已基本減輕。我想說的是，隨著本季的推進，本季的存款環境已變得充滿競爭，競爭持續不斷。所以我們總是在競爭。正如我所提到的，本季我們非常有意擴大我們的消費者存款基礎，並且我們已經專注於此一段時間了。

It just shows up more now this quarter than it perhaps has because we also let go some higher cost deposits on the institutional side. Nothing really fundamentally changes on the beta side of the equation. We, at the beginning of the cycle, had talked about getting around 50% or getting to 50% plus in terms of the beta that assumed, of course, some sustained rate cut cycle. Obviously, this cut cycle has been a little bit different. But we assume that if the rate cut cycle persists and continues moving forward, we get back to that level, and it's the same drivers as we've talked about in terms of our mix of institutional versus retail. And so we still feel good about that assumption.

本季這種現像出現得比以前更多，因為我們也放棄了機構方面的一些高成本存款。等式的 beta 側實際上並沒有任何根本性的變化。在周期開始時，我們曾討論過讓利率達到 50% 左右或 50% 以上，當然，這需要一定的持續降息週期。顯然，這次減產週期有些不同。但我們假設，如果降息週期持續下去並繼續向前發展，我們就會回到那個水平，這與我們在機構和零售組合方面討論過的驅動因素相同。因此我們仍然對這個假設感到滿意。

Okay. And just given the moving parts that came through in the second quarter and the lower starting point, can you just help us understand [41, 42] like is there a bias on one side or the other that range? And what would be the -- get you to the bottom or get you to the top? Thank you.

好的。考慮到第二季出現的變化和較低的起點，您能否幫助我們理解[41, 42] 是否存在偏見？那麼什麼能讓你到達底部或頂部呢？謝謝。

Sure. So in terms of the puts and takes, obviously, the competitive nature of where rates go on the deposit side. That's going to be obviously one piece. I wouldn't say in the third quarter, a Fed rate cut or not is going to meaningfully drive anything different. I think the loan growth acceleration in C&I and card is real, and that can definitely help and be it more on the plus side. The strategic actions we have taken this quarter certainly have helped as well.

當然。因此，就看跌期權和看漲期權而言，顯然存款利率具有競爭性質。這顯然是一個整體。我不會說在第三季聯準會是否降息將會帶來任何重大變化。我認為工商業和信用卡貸款成長加速是真實的，這肯定會有所幫助，而且是更積極的一面。我們本季採取的策略行動無疑也起到了幫助作用。

And so these are all things that are adding up for us to be within that range for sure. And in terms of bias, there's no bias one way or the other. We just have to see how things play out. But we set ourselves up very nicely for the quarter.

所以所有這些因素加起來肯定能讓我們處於這個範圍內。至於偏見，則不存在任何偏見。我們只需看看事情如何發展。但我們為本季做好了充分的準備。

Okay. Thanks a lot, John.

好的。非常感謝，約翰。

Saul Martinez, HSBC.

匯豐銀行的索爾·馬丁內斯。

A lot of focus here on deposit cost and deposit competition. But if I look at the actual increase in interest-bearing liability costs, the much bigger impact came in short-term borrowing costs, which were up $32 million and long-term debt costs, which were up, I think, close to $60 million. So in aggregate, those two things are up close to $90 million or about 3 times the impact on funding cost of deposits. And it all entirely was due to much larger balances there. So just normally, you would have a corresponding positive impact on the asset side in terms of things like excess liquidity, but it doesn't seem to happen.

這裡重點關注的是存款成本和存款競爭。但如果我看一下計息負債成本的實際成長，更大的影響來自於短期借貸成本，增加了 3,200 萬美元，而長期債務成本則增加了近 6,000 萬美元。因此，總的來說，這兩件事對存款融資成本的影響接近 9,000 萬美元，或約為 3 倍。而這完全是由於那裡的餘額更大。因此，在正常情況下，你會在資產方面產生相應的正面影響，例如流動性過剩，但這似乎並沒有發生。

Can you just, John, walk us through what happened here? And is that sort of just a onetime increase that should go away? But just what's going on on the liability side beyond deposits that seems to be a drag?

約翰，你能向我們簡單介紹一下這裡發生的事情嗎？那麼，這種一次性的成長是否應該取消呢？但是，除了存款之外，負債方面還有哪些因素似乎造成了拖累呢？

Sure. So let me take the other side of the liability part of your question. So and I'll break it out. So on the short-term borrowings, we did have an increase this linked quarter. And a lot of that has to do with the increase to fund the security purchases. This is the gross up on the loan sales.

當然。那麼，讓我來談談你問題中有關責任的另一部分。那我就來解釋一下。因此，就短期借款而言，本季我們的短期借款確實有所增加。這在很大程度上與證券購買資金的增加有關。這是貸款銷售總額。

So when we put those loans and held for sale, we also did our security purchases and we knew the loan sale would occur within a month or so or 1.5 months and so we just use short-term borrowings temporarily to help support that. And so that goes away. That's part of the NIM story that I talked about earlier. That short-term borrowing cost goes away next quarter.

因此，當我們將這些貸款持有待售時，我們也進行了證券購買，並且我們知道貸款出售將在一個月左右或一個半月內發生，因此我們只是暫時使用短期借款來幫助支持這一點。這樣，這種情況就消失了。這是我之前談到的 NIM 故事的一部分。短期借貸成本將在下個季度消失。

Long-term debt, we have steadily improved our profile in terms of our debt coverage and things of that nature. We want to make sure we're in balance in terms of relationship between loans deposit and long-term debt. We feel like we've grown into that mix appropriately. And so I don't see us growing that from here on out from this particular level. Any issuance we do will just be here to replace other maturities and things like that. So the combination of those things are really kind of get to the heart of your question.

長期債務，我們在債務覆蓋率和諸如此類的事情方面穩步改善了我們的狀況。我們希望確保貸款存款和長期債務之間的關係保持平衡。我們感覺我們已經適當地成長為這種組合。因此，我認為從現在開始我們不會再從這個特定的層面發展。我們發行的任何債券都只是為了取代其他到期債券之類的。所以這些因素的結合確實觸及了你的問題的核心。

So the short-term borrowing should revert next quarter, and you have a little bit less pressure there? And is there a negative spread on those incremental short-term borrowings that should go away in terms of -- just thinking about the dollar NII impact of that happening next quarter.

那麼短期借款應該會在下個季度恢復，你們的壓力會小一點嗎？而這些增量短期借款是否存在應該消失的負利差 - 只考慮下個季度對美元 NII 的影響。

Yeah. The short-term borrowings are going to be on the margin on the higher end of the rate. So if you think about the 430, 440 type of range, maybe even more than that potentially. It's going to be on the higher end. And so as we had the loan proceeds, loan sale happen, we could also terminate the short-term borrowings associated with that, thus improving the margin.

是的。短期借款將處於利率較高端的保證金水準。因此，如果您考慮 430、440 類型的範圍，甚至可能更多。它將處於較高端。因此，當我們獲得貸款收益、貸款銷售時，我們也可以終止與此相關的短期借款，從而提高利潤率。

And so let me just -- outside of the details, it's worth just pointing out the why behind all of this. It takes a big chunk of loans that we can redeploy it to a much faster NII trajectory, although it created noise in this quarter because of the double counting. So I do want to just emphasize that point that these were actions we took in various parts of our balance sheet to just really evolve it to a more attractive mix.

因此，除了細節之外，我有必要指出這一切背後的原因。我們需要將大量貸款重新部署到更快的 NII 軌跡上，儘管由於重複計算，本季產生了噪音。因此，我確實想強調這一點，這些是我們在資產負債表的各個部分採取的行動，只是為了真正將其轉變為更具吸引力的組合。

Yeah. That's helpful. Then maybe just a quick one on payments and what the expectations are there. I mean on the issuing side, I guess we're leapfrogging -- or lapping, sorry, the prepaid headwinds and we should see some acceleration there in the second half? And just any color on how you're thinking about corporate payments. You mentioned just economic headwinds there. But are you optimistic that we'll see some improvement on the corporate payments side as we go into the second half?

是的。這很有幫助。然後也許只是快速詢問一下付款情況以及期望是什麼。我的意思是，在發行方面，我想我們正在跨越式發展——或者說，克服預付費方面的阻力，我們應該在下半年看到一些加速？以及您對公司支付的看法。您剛才提到了那裡的經濟逆風。但是，您是否樂觀地認為，進入下半年，企業支付方面將會出現一些改善？

Sure. Yeah. On the corporate payment side, I think the themes that we saw on the spend levels within the corporate T&E and government spend impacted this quarter. I would anticipate that impact kind of continues into the third. But then after that, I think that abates and we have -- what we'll take over is our initiatives that we have.

當然。是的。在企業支付方面，我認為我們在企業差旅費用和政府支出水準方面看到的主題對本季產生了影響。我預計這種影響會持續到第三階段。但在那之後，我認為這種情況會逐漸減弱，我們將接手我們已有的舉措。

We have a strong pipeline. You can kind of see that pipeline well in advance of bookings. And so we feel that will be very helpful and positive going forward, but maybe a little bit of short term here in the third quarter. On the issuing side of the equation, it's going to be a continual -- continuation of kind of what you saw this quarter. Obviously, we've lapped many of the prepaid headwinds that we saw.

我們擁有強大的管道。您可以在預訂之前提前看到該頻道。因此，我們認為這對未來將非常有幫助，而且是積極的，但在第三季度可能只是暫時的。從發行的角度來看，這將是本季所見情況的持續延續。顯然，我們已經克服了預付費領域遇到的許多困難。

And so the growth rate that you see there is reflective of just kind of where the market is, and that's probably a good marker for where we are in the second half.

因此，您所看到的成長率反映了市場的現狀，這可能是我們下半年狀況的一個很好的跡象。

And I can just add a little bit stepping back from any one of the businesses. Both our payments leaders are now in place since February, the transformative strategies are very much in place. We are supporting their efforts through this productivity that we are creating in many, many parts of our business. So there's the CPS, the corporate -- while they are -- they're looking at the muted spend this quarter. Their sales pipelines are very, very robust.

我還可以稍微補充一下對任何一項業務的回顧。我們的兩位支付主管自二月以來均已到位，轉型策略已基本到位。我們正在透過我們在業務的許多方面所創造的生產力來支持他們的努力。因此，CPS 和企業正在關注本季的低迷支出。他們的銷售管道非常非常強勁。

The product is very attractive in the market. Even merchant is very steadily posting strengthening fees. So we feel very good about the initiatives underway in payments and the execution against those.

該產品在市場上非常有吸引力。甚至商家也在穩定提高費用。因此，我們對正在進行的支付措施及其執行情況感到非常滿意。

Got it. Thank you.

知道了。謝謝。

Ebrahim Poonawala, Bank of America.

美國銀行的 Ebrahim Poonawala。

A couple of follow-up questions, and apologies if I missed it. On the pace of buybacks, adjusted CET1 hitting 8.9%, I'm assuming crosses 9% next quarter. Does that mean anything in terms of should we see by the $100 million go to $150 million, $200 million starting 3Q? I mean the (inaudible) pricing that are forecasting that row? Would love kind of how you're thinking about adjusted CET1 relative to the outlook for buybacks from here.

有幾個後續問題，如果我錯過了，請見諒。就回購速度而言，調整後的 CET1 達到 8.9%，我預計下個季度將超過 9%。這是否意味著我們是否應該看到從第三季開始 1 億美元增加到 1.5 億美元、2 億美元？我的意思是預測該行的（聽不清楚）定價？很想知道您對調整後的 CET1 與未來回購前景有何看法。

Sure, Ebrahim. In terms of the buyback, we had $100 million, which is consistent with the prior quarter. We have been continuing to do a good job in terms of balancing growth in our capital levels, as you pointed out, getting to 8.9% on ex AOCI is a good thing, and we continue to glide into our new capital ratio, but we're also focused on distribution.

當然，易卜拉欣。就回購而言，我們的回購金額為 1 億美元，與上一季持平。正如您所指出的，我們在平衡資本水準成長方面一直做得很好，達到 8.9% 的 AOCI 是一件好事，而且我們將繼續朝著新的資本比率邁進，但我們也專注於分配。

Certainly, we anticipate growing that over time. The question we have is for this particular third quarter as we are more upbeat about loan growth and things of that, right? So we'd rather deploy it there than $50 million or $100 million on the share buyback, I'd rather deploy it on the loan side of the equation, at least here in the short run. But over time, we are very much committed to getting back to that approximately 75% payout, and that's really what we are focused on is achieving that goal. Quarter-to-quarter, we'll lay that out for you, but that's our intent.

當然，我們預計這一數字會隨著時間的推移而增長。我們的問題是，對於這個第三季度，我們對貸款成長和類似情況更加樂觀，對嗎？因此，我們寧願將其部署在那裡，而不是將 5,000 萬美元或 1 億美元用於股票回購，我寧願將其部署在貸款方面，至少在短期內是如此。但隨著時間的推移，我們非常致力於恢復約 75% 的支出，而我們真正關注的是實現這一目標。我們會按季度向您說明，但這就是我們的目的。

Got it. And just two quick ones. One, when we talk about fees, I think if you go back a year or two, there was a lot of excitement around commercial products revenue. We saw sort of a pretty decent momentum. That's flatlined over the last four to five quarters.

知道了。簡單說兩點。首先，當我們談論費用時，我想如果回顧一兩年，商業產品收入引起了很多興奮。我們看到了一種相當不錯的勢頭。過去四到五個季度，這一數字一直持平。

Anything going on there? Like is there still a significant opportunity there? Or have we kind of captured most of it?

那裡發生什麼事了嗎？那裡是否還存在重大機會？或者說我們已經掌握了大部分內容？

Sure. I don't know if I acknowledged the flat for several quarters, it was double-digit growth last year. In the last two quarters, yes, it's been a little bit more subdued. I think the activity we saw this quarter really was very strong in some of our ABS and new product capabilities, commodities, derivative activity. With the market movements, we saw a lot of great growth there.

當然。我不知道我是否承認幾個季度以來一直持平，但去年卻實現了兩位數的成長。在過去兩個季度，情況確實有所緩和。我認為本季我們的一些 ABS 和新產品能力、商品和衍生性商品活動表現確實非常強勁。隨著市場的變化，我們看到了那裡的巨大成長。

It was offset, though, by a little bit lower investment-grade underwriting, high-yield underwriting, things of that variety. And so I view that as temporary. We still have - all of the conversations we've had on our capital market side is still very much in play, and we feel very confident about that going forward.

不過，這項優勢被投資等級承銷、高收益承銷以及諸如此類的承銷業務的較低水準所抵銷。所以我認為這只是暫時的。我們仍然 - 我們在資本市場方面進行的所有對話仍在進行中，我們對未來的發展充滿信心。

And Ebrahim, we're very confident about the capital market story. And just as a reminder, our franchise does not include core equity trading or investment banking. It's a very defined group. And the nature of the opportunity is a very large balance sheet that's being deployed with corporate clients that have very deep loyalty to us. And this product set just helps us get our fair share of fee revenue the balance sheet that is already being deployed. So the product build-out is really a talent play.

易卜拉欣，我們對資本市場前景非常有信心。需要提醒的是，我們的特許經營權不包括核心股票交易或投資銀行業務。這是一個非常明確的群體。而機會的本質是一份非常龐大的資產負債表，我們正在與對我們非常忠誠的企業客戶一起部署。而這套產品恰好幫助我們從已經部署的資產負債表中獲得公平份額的費用收入。因此，產品建構其實是一種才能的發揮。

You have to get the right expertise in place. And we did see some muted growth just for the last two quarters and the sentiment we're hearing is just a little bit of a caution around the tariff discussions, the rate movements to say. But if you look at the long-term trajectory and certainly outside of the last two quarters, the growth rate for some time has been very, very strong there.

您必須獲得正確的專業知識。我們確實看到過去兩個季度的成長有些放緩，我們聽到的情緒只是對關稅討論和利率變動有點謹慎。但如果你看一下長期軌跡，當然除了過去兩個季度之外，一段時間以來的成長率一直非常非常強勁。

And just last one, if I can ask both of you, like your narrative around fees, payments, expenses sounds very, very strong. I think the street lacks confidence in the NII outlook, right? We came in April, the count benefit sells like NII is going higher. Just talk to us your degree of confidence that as we -- kind of what you've laid out in terms of NII should grow from here, like what could go wrong to not make that happen, especially as we think about the opportunity of getting the NIM to 3% over the next maybe 12 to 18 months? Thanks.

最後一個問題，如果我可以問你們兩位的話，你們關於費用、付款、開支的敘述聽起來非常非常有力。我認為華爾街對 NII 前景缺乏信心，對嗎？我們是四月來的，計數福利的銷售就像 NII 一樣在走高。請告訴我們，您對 NII 的成長有多大信心，如果出現什麼問題會導致成長不順利，尤其是當我們考慮在未來 12 到 18 個月內將 NIM 提高到 3% 的機會時？謝謝。

Let me start, and then John, please add on here. So Ebrahim, we are we had a very fee-intensive franchise. We are at 42% of our total revenue, which is really very intentionally up. That's what sustains our earnings stability over multiple business cycles, and that's what sustains a very exceptional returns and 18% ROTCE return. So we are very committed to the fee side of the business, the NII side, we have confidence, but we are also doing it in a very multiserve client strategic way -- so when we keep reiterating the points around how we are building out the treasury management capabilities, the operational deposit capabilities on the institutional side.

讓我先開始，然後約翰，請在這裡補充。所以 Ebrahim，我們有一個收費非常密集的特許經營權。我們的總收入佔比為 42%，這確實是有意為之。這就是我們在多個商業週期中維持獲利穩定的原因，也是我們維持非常優異的回報和 18% ROTCE 回報的原因。因此，我們非常致力於業務的費用方面、NII 方面，我們有信心，但我們也在以一種多服務客戶策略的方式進行——因此，當我們不斷重申如何建立資金管理能力、機構方面的營運存款能力時。

And even on the consumer side is really improving the mix there. Client acquisition on the consumer side takes many forms. It's expensive to build our branches. It's expensive to run marketing campaigns. It's expensive to retain deposits through pricing and deposit-based awards. So we do have confidence that the entire franchise works to deliver consistent EPS growth.

甚至在消費者方面，情況也確實在改善。消費者方面的客戶獲取有多種形式。建立我們的分支機構非常昂貴。開展行銷活動的成本很高。透過定價和基於存款的獎勵來保留存款的成本很高。因此，我們確實有信心，整個特許經營權將實現持續的每股收益成長。

over time, which is what you've seen over the last two quarters. So that's the sort of the overall confidence in our revenue growth story and our EPS growth story while maintaining very strong return profiles. What would you add, John?

隨著時間的推移，這就是您在過去兩個季度所看到的情況。因此，這就是我們對我們的營收成長故事和每股盈餘成長故事的整體信心，同時保持非常強勁的回報狀況。約翰，您還有什麼要補充的嗎？

In terms of the net interest income, as you mentioned, I feel very confident about our ability to grow this quarter just given all the things that we talked about, and I won't repeat what Gunjan just said, but clearly, we've taken actions that are going to position us much better. So if there are bumps in the road for whatever reason, we weather that. And we feel that way, very confident.

就淨利息收入而言，正如您所提到的，考慮到我們討論的所有事項，我對我們本季度的增長能力非常有信心，我不會重複 Gunjan 剛才所說的話，但顯然，我們已經採取了行動，這將使我們處於更有利的地位。因此，無論出於何種原因，如果遇到困難，我們都會克服。我們也有這樣的感覺，非常有信心。

That's good that you feel confident because I agree with Gunjan, lots of good things going on but you had 20 questions on NII and yields and all of that.

您感到自信很好，因為我同意 Gunjan 的觀點，很多好事正在發生，但您針對 NII 和收益等提出了 20 個問題。

Ebrahim, we acknowledge that because we did three different transactions to position the balance sheet takes a little unpacking or why did the -- I appreciated Erika asking the question on the liquidity because if there was any question mark that this was because of a liquidity it wasn't. But I hope as we have had this conversation and as you understand what we are trying to do with the balance sheet, it's setting us up for a very attractive portfolio, both on the NII side and the fee side. So I want to shed the dialogue there.

易卜拉欣，我們承認，因為我們進行了三筆不同的交易來定位資產負債表，這需要一點解開，或者為什麼——我很感謝埃里卡提出關於流動性的問題，因為如果有任何問號表明這是由於流動性造成的，事實並非如此。但我希望，正如我們進行過這次談話並且您了解我們試圖用資產負債表做什麼一樣，這將為我們建立一個非常有吸引力的投資組合，無論是在 NII 方面還是在費用方面。所以我想在那裡展開對話。

And I appreciate that, and I think there's a lot of skepticism and I'm hoping you give less things to skeptics to pick on and more to the non-skeptics. So hopefully, we made a shift there.

我很感激這一點，我認為存在著許多懷疑論，我希望您少給懷疑論者挑剔一點，多給非懷疑論者挑剔一點。所以希望我們能在這方面做出改變。

Good advice, good advice. Thank you.

好的建議，好的建議。謝謝。

Bill Carcache, Wolfe Research.

比爾‧卡卡什（Bill Carcache），沃爾夫研究公司。

One final follow-up on the magnitude of the fixed rate asset repricing benefit that should persist from here. Can you discuss where you still see the greatest repricing potential across the left side of the balance sheet? And anything that you would say to give investors confidence? you've addressed this in different questions, but the idea that those repricing tailwinds are going to show through and not be tempered by other actions we saw this quarter. Anything that you could say there? Thanks.

最後再關註一下固定利率資產重新定價效益的幅度，這種效益從現在起應該會持續下去。您能否討論一下在資產負債表左側哪裡仍具有最大的重新定價潛力？您想說些什麼來增強投資人的信心？您在不同的問題中已經提到了這一點，但我們認為重新定價的順風將會顯現出來，並且不會受到我們本季看到的其他行動的影響。您有什麼可以說的嗎？謝謝。

Sure. So what I would just say is that in the second half, we'll have more volume. So we've given you ranges in terms of investment portfolio and loans we were probably on the low to mid side of that range in the first half of the year. We anticipate to be in the mid- to high end of that range in the second half of the year. The spreads are holding in nicely.

當然。所以我想說的是，下半年我們的銷售量會更大。因此，我們給出了投資組合和貸款的範圍，今年上半年我們可能處於該範圍的低端到中端。我們預計今年下半年的銷售額將達到該範圍的中高端。利差保持良好。

And so I feel like that we have good momentum on that as well as we're getting more juice from the investment portfolio repositioning that we did of the $1.25 billion sale there as well as the $4.6 billion mortgage sales. So those are two key drivers that are going to help the overall positioning.

因此，我覺得我們在這方面勢頭良好，而且我們從投資組合重新定位中獲得了更多的收益，我們在那裡進行了 12.5 億美元的銷售，以及 46 億美元的抵押貸款銷售。因此，這是有助於整體定位的兩個關鍵驅動因素。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Chris McGratty, KBW.

克里斯·麥格拉蒂，KBW。

Just wanted to look at slide 16 for a moment on the capital. A lot of questions and a lot of discussion about the operating leverage that's in front of the company. I guess my question is, is there a scenario with the improved regulatory environment that you would consider another bank acquisition to help accelerate what you're trying to do on the NII front?

我只想看一下首都的第 16 張投影片。關於公司面臨的經營槓桿有很多問題和討論。我的問題是，在監管環境改善的情況下，您是否會考慮進行另一項銀行收購，以加速您在國家資訊基礎設施方面所採取的措施？

Good morning. The capital is building very nicely. And as you know, we are we are floating with the Cat 2 designation. And one of our reasons for building out the capital is to be ready for a cat designation. Our focus very much is on organic growth.

早安.首都建設得非常好。如您所知，我們正處於 Cat 2 級別。我們擴建首都的原因之一就是為貓咪指定做好準備。我們非常注重有機成長。

And our planning for the Cat 2 transition and the capital build is based on organic growth profiles. So I would say, to your question, the capital is built to support organic growth as we as we transition to a Cat 2 category designation.

我們對 Cat 2 轉型和資本建設的規劃是基於有機成長概況的。因此，對於您的問題，我想說，在我們向 Cat 2 類別過渡的過程中，建立資本是為了支持有機成長。

Okay. Great. Thank you for that clarification. And then maybe a reminder when the organic cross. Any changes to where you're thinking about crossing into Cat 2?

好的。偉大的。感謝您的澄清。然後也許當有機交叉時會有一個提醒。您考慮進入 Cat 2 的地方有什麼變化嗎？

No. No changes there. We've talked about no earlier than 2027. And I think you can see where our asset trajectory is a necessary consistent with what we've talked about in the past. So change there.

不。那裡沒有變化。我們討論過不早於 2027 年。我想您可以看到我們的資產軌跡與我們過去談論的內容是必要的一致。所以就在那裡改變。

Great. Thank you very much.

偉大的。非常感謝。

Matt O'Connor, Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的馬特·奧康納。

Any outlook comments on credit, the charge-offs have been amazingly stable. You had a little cleanup in CRE because C&I behaving very well. But any thoughts on just the overall level of charge-offs and reserves going forward? Thank you.

任何有關信貸的前景評論，沖銷情況都出奇地穩定。由於 C&I 表現非常好，所以您在 CRE 中進行了一些清理。但對於未來沖銷和儲備的整體水準有什麼看法？謝謝。

Sure. Thanks, Matt, and I appreciate the credit question. On the outlook there, the environment is very stable to improving, from a credit standpoint. We saw obviously a stable net charge-off ratio this quarter, but every -- all the other metrics are declining or in good shape. Even where we had things like a 90-day up a little bit, that's all -- there are some administrative loans in there as well that I've already cleared as well as some of the California fire impact.

當然。謝謝，馬特，我很感謝你的信用問題。從信貸角度來看，前景看好，環境非常穩定且正在改善。我們顯然看到本季的淨沖銷率保持穩定，但所有其他指標都在下降或狀況良好。即使我們的 90 天還款期限略有延長，但僅此而已——其中還有一些我已經清理過的行政貸款以及加州火災的部分影響。

So all the metrics are pointing positively. On the things like card and net charge-offs, just in general, we expect on the card side of things to be this year in 2025, a better charge-off rate than 2024. We expect the net charge-off ratio to remain here or improve, meaning going down in the coming quarters. So we feel very good about our credit profile right now.

所以所有指標都指向正向。對於信用卡和淨沖銷等方面，總體而言，我們預計 2025 年信用卡方面的沖銷率將比 2024 年更好。我們預計淨沖銷率將維持在這個水準或有所改善，這意味著未來幾季淨沖銷率將會下降。因此，我們現在對我們的信用狀況感到非常滿意。

Okay. Just that last comment, the charge-offs -- so the card charge-offs lower this year versus last year? And then did you mean overall charge-offs?

好的。只是最後一條評論，沖銷額——所以今年的信用卡沖銷額比去年低嗎？那你是指整體沖銷嗎？

Overall and coming down. There's some seasonality to charge off next quarter to go down. We expect that to happen. But just overall, when you look at 2025 net charge-off, that's going to be lower than 2024, card.

整體而言呈下降趨勢。下個季度會受到一些季節性因素的影響而下降。我們期待這種情況發生。但總體而言，當你查看 2025 年的淨沖銷額時，它會低於 2024 年的卡。

Yeah, okay. All right. Thank you.

嗯，好的。好的。謝謝。

Vivek Juneja, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的 Vivek Juneja。

I'm sorry to beat a dead horse. Just a little bit of clarity. I hear everything you're doing on NII and remixing the balance sheet with the sale of the resi mortgages, most of that, obviously. When I look at the segment data, which shows up in the corporate segment. But when I look at your corporate segment, and I hear you doing the multi-client and operational deposits and all that. I look at the net interest spread and that continues to come down every quarter and was down more sharply.

我很抱歉再說這些無用的話。只是稍微清楚一點。我聽說了你們在 NII 方面所做的一切，以及將資產負債表與住宅抵押貸款的銷售進行混合，顯然，其中大部分都是這樣的。當我查看細分數據時，它顯示在公司細分中。但是當我查看你們的公司部門時，我聽說你們在做多客戶和營運存款等等。我查看了淨利差，發現它每個季度都在下降，而且下降幅度更大。

So given everything you've just said, why does that continue to come down? And by the way, it was down linked quarter on the consumer side, too, but more trying to understand first on the corporate side what's going on.

那麼，考慮到您剛才所說的一切，為什麼價格還會繼續下降？順便說一句，消費者的季度環比成長也下降了，但我們首先要從企業方面了解正在發生的事情。

Sure. So a couple of things there. And I think you're talking about, Vivek, just to make sure the segment reports that we provide in -- on the consumer side as well as the commercial just to make sure I'm tracking. But the -- yeah. So a couple of things are going on in there.

當然。那裡有幾件事。我認為你所說的，Vivek，只是為了確保我們提供的消費者方面和商業方面的細分報告，只是為了確保我正在追蹤。但是——是的。其中發生了幾件事。

So the mortgage sale will be shown on the consumer side of the equation that will take place. In terms of the spread, net interest spread side of things, I think what's going on there more than anything is on FTP. They're just -- there's less credit for those sorts of deposits. And that's just kind of given the pools and all that sort of thing. So I wouldn't -- I think looking at the broader picture of NII is really the way to go for that.

因此，抵押貸款銷售將顯示在即將發生的等式的消費者方面。就利差、淨利息利差方面而言，我認為最重要的是 FTP。只是──這類存款的信用額度較少。這只是考慮到游泳池和所有類似的東西。所以我不會——我認為從更廣闊的角度來看 NII 才是真正可行的方法。

A couple of other little questions. The C&I growth that you are talking about, what are you seeing in terms of growth to loans to NBFIs? How much of that growth has come from this particular segment?

還有一些小問題。您談到的 C&I 成長，您認為 NBFI 貸款的成長情況如何？其中有多少成長來自於這一特定領域？

Sure. NBFI is a part of the growth that we saw this quarter in C&I. It's probably for this quarter, I would say, close to half of the growth that we have there. But as I said earlier, there's growth in virtually every other category, whether it's corporate loans, just in general, small business, health care, expansion markets on the middle market side of the equation. But we've had a good mix of all sorts of growth in that area.

當然。NBFI 是我們本季在 C&I 領域看到的成長的一部分。我想說，本季的增幅可能接近這數字的一半。但正如我之前所說，幾乎所有其他類別都在成長，無論是公司貸款、一般小型企業、醫療保健，還是中端市場的擴張市場。但我們在該地區實現了各種形式的良好成長。

One last, just a confirmation. You've talked recently about tech spend running at about $2.5 billion. Just want to confirm, is that still the number at which it is?

最後，僅確認一下。您最近談到技術支出約為 25 億美元。只是想確認一下，這個數字還是原來的數字嗎？

Yes, correct.

是的，正確。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Betsy Graseck, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的 Betsy Graseck。

I just wanted to make sure I understand how many more quarters or years you're planning on doing this balance sheet restructuring. I see that the held-for-sale EOP went up QQ. So I'm assuming you're in train, but how long should we expect this is going to be continuing for?

我只是想確保我了解您計劃在多少季度或幾年內進行資產負債表重組。我看到持有待售的 EOP 上漲了 QQ。所以我假設你已經在行動了，但是我們預期這種情況會持續多久呢？

Just to make sure I understand. I mean, yes, the held for sale was up this quarter because of that loan sale that we had been talking about -- the investment portfolio actions that we take are -- we've done a few of these over the last couple of quarters. It depends on interest rates. We always are looking at the market. I don't have anything in the plan necessarily as I look forward. But we're opportunistic when things come our way and pay down -- or excuse me, the payback period is appropriate and things like that that's when we take action.

只是為了確保我理解。我的意思是，是的，本季度持有待售資產有所增加，因為我們一直在談論的貸款出售 - 我們採取的投資組合行動是 - 我們在過去幾個季度中已經做了一些這樣的行動。這取決於利率。我們始終關注著市場。就我所期待的而言，我的計劃中並沒有什麼特別之處。但是，當事情進展順利時，我們就會抓住機會並付出代價——或者對不起，回報期是適當的，諸如此類的事情，那就是我們採取行動的時候。

And so I can't answer -- I don't think you've ever done, Betsy positioning the balance sheet in the right ways that you want to, to meet our client needs and make sure we're hitting our strategic objectives. That's really how we're running.

所以我無法回答——我認為你從來沒有這樣做過，貝琪，按照你想要的正確方式定位資產負債表，以滿足我們客戶的需求並確保我們實現我們的戰略目標。這確實是我們的運作方式。

Yes. I know Gunjan talked earlier about bringing down resi as a percentage of total, which you have significantly over the past year. And I'm wondering if there's a target resi percentage that you're moving towards if the market is there to help you move towards it?

是的。我知道 Gunjan 之前談到要降低住宅佔總住宅的百分比，而過去一年來這一比例已經大幅降低。我想知道，如果市場能夠幫助您實現這一目標，您是否會朝著目標住宅百分比邁進？

I just want to say we are very committed to the resi business. It's the core financial product that is nearest and dearest to a lot of people's financial affairs. And it's been muted for some time, but in a different rate environment, it is a very good source of fees and loan growth. It had just become oversized, especially with the Union Bank acquisition as well.

我只是想說我們非常致力於住宅業務。它是與許多人的財務狀況最密切相關的核心金融產品。雖然它已經低迷了一段時間，但在不同的利率環境下，它是費用和貸款成長的非常好的來源。它的規模已經變得過大，尤其是在收購了聯合銀行之後。

So this was opportunistically appropriate for us, but there is not a target to try and bring it down to. It's based on the needs of our customers and just making enough space on the balance sheet to accommodate the business growth that will come shortly because it's been a few years of muted growth.

因此，這對我們來說是一次機會，但沒有設定一個目標來嘗試將其降低。這是基於我們客戶的需求，並在資產負債表上留出足夠的空間來適應即將到來業務的成長，因為過去幾年的成長一直很緩慢。

Okay, thank you.

好的，謝謝。

There are no further questions at this time. Mr. Andersen, I turn the call back over to you.

目前沒有其他問題。安德森先生，我把電話轉回給您。

Thank you, Jo, and to everyone who joined our call this morning. Please contact the Investor Relations department if you have any follow-up questions. You can now disconnect the call.

謝謝喬，也感謝今天早上參加我們電話會議的所有人。如果您有任何後續問題，請聯絡投資者關係部門。您現在可以掛斷通話。

This concludes today's conference call. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。您現在可以斷開連線。