TotalEnergies SE (TTE) 2024 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good morning or good afternoon, everyone. Patrick Pouyanne speaking. So before Jean-Pierre will go through the second quarter financials, I have thought that midyear would be a good time to check-in on the progress that we have been making. I would say the great progress in just the last 10 months since we presented our strategy last September at the Investor Day in New York or I would say, balanced transition strategy, which is incurred on two fundamental pillars: the oil and gas on one side with a perspective of growth; and Integrated Power on the other side, and both pillars are driving the growth for the company.

大家早安或下午好。派崔克·普亞納發言。因此，在讓-皮埃爾公佈第二季度財務數據之前，我認為年中將是檢查我們所取得進展的好時機。我想說的是，自從我們去年9 月在紐約投資者日提出我們的策略以來，在過去10 個月裡取得了巨大進展，或者我想說的是，平衡的轉型策略，該策略基於兩個基本支柱：一方面是石油和天然氣具有成長的視角；另一方面是綜合電力，這兩個支柱都在推動公司的成長。

So during these last -- first semester and last quarter, beyond the excellent operational performance, which was delivered on our oil and gas pillar, we have sanctioned several major upstream projects. But I would like to remind you on the oil side, with the financial decisions, some three large FPSOs Kaminho in Angola, Sépia 2 and Atapu 2 and both which are world-class well productivity projects with low technical operating costs and the $20 per barrel sanctioning criteria, Angola is under $30 per barrel breakeven.

因此，在上個學期和上個季度，除了在我們的石油和天然氣支柱上實現的出色營運業績之外，我們還批准了幾個主要的上游項目。但我想提醒大家，在石油方面，在財務決策方面，安哥拉的三座大型FPSO Kaminho、Sépia 2 和Atapu 2 都是世界一流的油井產能項目，技術運營成本較低，20 美元按照每桶制裁標準，安哥拉的損益平衡點低於每桶30 美元。

So these are three major oil projects, but we also have sanctions on the LNG side, two important projects: the Marsa plant in Oman, Marsa LNG, which is a very ultra-low-emissions plant and the Ubeta gas project in Nigeria, which will supply Nigeria LNG. So these projects will not only contribute to the objectives to grow our upstream by 2% to 3% per year in the next five years, but they will also boost the underlying free cash flow generation and ultimately shareholder distributions.

這是三個主要的石油項目，但我們對液化天然氣方面也有製裁，兩個重要項目：阿曼的瑪莎工廠、瑪莎液化天然氣工廠，這是一個非常超低排放的工廠，以及尼日利亞的烏貝塔天然氣項目，這是一個非常超低排放的工廠。因此，這些項目不僅有助於實現我們的上游業務在未來五年內每年增長 2% 至 3% 的目標，而且還將促進潛在的自由現金流的產生和最終的股東分配。

On the second pillar, our Integrated Power, where we have reached quite a competing ROCE above 10% this quarter, and Jean-Pierre will come back on it. We have also made some strong progress towards deploying and completing our Integrated Power business model by acquiring flexible assets that allows us to extract maximum value from the renewable assets in three key markets in Texas, in the UK and in Germany.

在第二個支柱上，我們的綜合實力，本季度我們已經達到了 10% 以上的相當有競爭力的 ROCE，讓-皮埃爾將回歸這一點。我們也透過收購靈活的資產，在部署和完成我們的綜合電力業務模式方面取得了一些重大進展，這些資產使我們能夠從德克薩斯州、英國和德國三個主要市場的可再生資產中獲取最大價值。

We closed all CCGT deal in Texas and also announced the acquisition of the CCGT in the UK. Both of these markets, we know have all building blocks that define our Integrated Power model, renewables, flexible assets and of course, trading and customers as well in order to deliver clean firm power, which prices at a premium compared to a green intermittent renewable power.

我們完成了德克薩斯州的所有 CCGT 交易，並宣布收購英國的 CCGT。我們知道，這兩個市場都擁有定義我們的綜合電力模型的所有構建模組、可再生能源、靈活資產，當然還有交易和客戶，以便提供清潔的固定電力，與綠色間歇性可再生能源相比，其價格較高力量。

We also acquired flexible assets in Germany through our acquisition of Kyon Energy, a leading battery storage developer. And by the way, we just sanctioned the first 100-megawatt battery storage project developed by Kyon. This complements our leading position in offshore wind in that country as well as the acquisition of Quadra, our renewable energy aggregator with 9-gigawatt pipeline of aggregation of -- to commercialize.

我們也透過收購領先的電池儲存開發商 Kyon Energy 獲得了德國的靈活資產。順便說一下，我們剛剛批准了 Kyon 開發的第一個 100 兆瓦電池儲存專案。這補充了我們在該國離岸風電領域的領先地位，以及對Quadra的收購，Quadra是我們的再生能源聚合商，擁有9吉瓦的聚合管道——以實現商業化。

So we are clearly, I would say, this first half in a strong execution mode of the strategy. So don't expect any change. We are -- and there is, of course, still more to come. In particular, we have also announced recently that we made some important steps towards the FID of our Suriname Block 58 projects by the end of the year, which is, of course, a key milestone for us, our partners in Suriname.

因此，我想說，我們上半年顯然處於該策略的強有力執行模式中。所以不要期待任何改變。我們是——當然，還有更多的事情要做。特別是，我們最近還宣布，我們為在年底前實現蘇利南 Block 58 項目的最終投資決定邁出了一些重要步驟，這對我們蘇利南的合作夥伴來說當然是一個重要的里程碑。

And as a reminder, this is an operated 200,000 bipolar development with more than 700 million barrels of estimated recoverable oil. We have achieved, as I said, key steps, including the agreements on the field development area with the authorities, but also securing the hull of the FPSO to be able to sanction the projects and should be, I would say, end of the third quarter, beginning of the fourth quarter.

提醒一下，這是一個已營運 20 萬個兩極開發項目，估計可採石油量超過 7 億桶。正如我所說，我們已經實現了關鍵步驟，包括與當局就油田開發領域達成協議，而且還確保了 FPSO 的船體安全，以便能夠批准這些項目，我想說，應該在第三階段結束時季度，第四季開始。

I'll wrap up my introduction by just saying that our balanced strategy is so clearly in motion, but we are pushing on all fronts. We are making progress delivering and executing our plan, which will help us to reach our ambitious targets this year and delivering top-tier performance, but also preparing the future of the company. So we positioned the company to be -- to lead the pack, and we are determined to deliver to our shareholders of premium returns.

在結束我的介紹時，我只想說，我們的平衡策略非常明顯地在運轉，但我們正在各個方面推動。我們正在交付和執行我們的計劃，這將幫助我們實現今年雄心勃勃的目標並提供頂級業績，同時也為公司的未來做好準備。因此，我們對公司的定位是－引領潮流，並且我們決心為股東帶來豐厚的回報。

And that's the program that I propose you to show you at our next Investor Day, which this year will be in New York on October 2. You put that -- can put that date in your calendar. And so I look forward to meeting you there. But in the meantime, Jean-Pierre will give you all the details of the second-quarter results, and I will be happy to answer to your questions today together with Jean-Pierre.

這就是我建議您在下一次投資者日向您展示的計劃，今年將於 10 月 2 日在紐約舉行。所以我期待在那裡見到你。但與此同時，讓-皮埃爾將向您提供第二季度業績的所有細節，我今天很樂意與讓-皮埃爾一起回答您的問題。

Thank you, Patrick. So let's move to the financials. So the crude market remained supportive in the second quarter with Brent slightly increasing by 2% quarter-to-quarter to average $85 per barrel while the company average LNG price decreased by 3%. Refining margins continue to normalize with our European refining margin market down 37% quarter-to-quarter.

謝謝你，派崔克。那麼讓我們轉向財務方面。因此，第二季原油市場仍維持支撐，布蘭特原油價格較上季小幅上漲 2%，至每桶均價 85 美元，而公司液化天然氣平均價格下降 3%。煉油利潤持續正常化，歐洲煉油利潤市場較上季下降 37%。

In this context, TotalEnergies reported second quarter '24 adjusted net income of $4.7 billion with the first half '24 totaling close to $10 billion. The company generated $7.8 billion of cash flow during the second quarter of '24, and close to $16 billion for the first half of the year. Importantly, profitability remained robust with ROCE, return on capital average capital employed of close to 16% -- close to 17% at 16.6%. And we maintained strong CapEx discipline and [reiterated] 2024 net investment guidance of $17 billion to $18 billion for the year.

在此背景下，TotalEnergies 報告稱，24 年第二季調整後淨利潤為 47 億美元，24 年上半年總計接近 100 億美元。該公司在 2024 年第二季產生了 78 億美元的現金流，今年上半年則接近 160 億美元。重要的是，獲利能力依然強勁，ROCE、平均資本回報率接近 16%，接近 17%，達到 16.6%。我們維持嚴格的資本支出紀律，並[重申] 2024 年淨投資指引為 170 億至 180 億美元。

But last but not least, we continue to build on our strong track record of attracting -- of attractive shareholder distribution with $2 billion buybacks executed during the second quarter and up to $2 billion of buybacks authorized for the first -- for the third quarter '24. Also, the Board has maintained the second interim dividend at EUR0.79 per share, which is nearly a 7% increase year-over-year and is 20% higher compared to pre-COVID levels. First half '24 shareholder payout stands at 45% of Sepia 2.

但最後但並非最不重要的一點是，我們繼續鞏固吸引股東分配的良好記錄，在第二季度執行了20 億美元的回購，並在第三季授權了第一季高達20 億美元的回購。此外，董事會將第二次中期股息維持在每股 0.79 歐元，年成長近 7%，比新冠疫情前的水平高出 20%。 24 年上半年股東派息為 Sepia 2 的 45%。

Moving to the business segments, starting with hydrocarbons. So production was 2.44 million barrels of oil equivalents per day in the second quarter of '24, close to the high end of the guidance range. We continue to see good performance from project startups and ramp-ups including Mero 2 in Brazil, Akpo West in Nigeria, Block 10 in Oman, Absheron in Azerbaijan and multiple projects in North.

轉向業務領域，從碳氫化合物開始。因此，2024 年第二季的日產量為 244 萬桶石油當量，接近指引範圍的上限。我們繼續看到專案啟動和產能擴張的良好表現，包括巴西的 Mero 2、尼日利亞的 Akpo West、阿曼的 Block 10、阿塞拜疆的 Absheron 以及北部的多個專案。

Looking forward, production for the third quarter of '24 is expected to be stable between 2.4 million and 2.49 million barrels for oil equivalent per day. We would expect to start up on the anchor project in the US Gulf of Mexico in the third quarter. Exploration and production continues to perform well. We reported adjusted net operating income of $2.7 billion and cash flow of $4.4 billion. The company maintained its cost leadership with upstream OpEx per barrel below $5 per barrel during the second quarter.

展望未來，24 年第三季的產量預計將穩定在每天 240 萬桶至 249 萬桶油當量之間。我們預計美國墨西哥灣的錨定計畫將於第三季啟動。勘探和生產繼續表現良好。我們公佈的調整後淨營業收入為 27 億美元，現金流為 44 億美元。該公司第二季上游每桶營運成本低於每桶 5 美元，維持了成本領先地位。

In integrated LNG business, we continue to increase our structural resiliency by advancing commercialization of LNG through new medium-term Brent linked contracts with urgent buyers having recently signed two contracts for a total of 1.3 million tonnes per year.

在綜合液化天然氣業務方面，我們透過新的中期布蘭特原油掛鉤合同推進液化天然氣的商業化，繼續提高結構彈性，緊急買家最近簽署了兩份合同，每年總計 130 萬噸。

Turning to the results now, hydrocarbon production for LNG increased 1% quarter-to-quarter which includes entry into the Dorado upstream gas field in the Eagle Ford basin in the United States, and we progress on our objectives to increase upstream integration in the US to further improve resiliency. LNG sales decreased by 18% quarter-over-quarter, notably due to lower spot purchase in the context of lower LNG demand in Europe.

現在來看結果，液化天然氣碳氫化合物產量較上季成長1%，其中包括進入美國伊格爾福特盆地的多拉多上游氣田，我們在加強美國上游一體化的目標上取得了進展以進一步提高抗災能力。液化天然氣銷售量較上季下降 18%，主要是由於歐洲液化天然氣需求下降背景下現貨購買減少。

Integrated LNG adjusted net operating income and cash flow were both $1.2 billion in the second quarter. The results reflect a lower average LNG price and lower sales, as well as the impact of gas trading not really benefiting in the continued, low volatility environment. Energy trading continues to perform well. Given the evolution of oil and gas prices in the recent months and the lag effect on price formulas, we anticipate that our average LNG selling price should be around $10 per million BTU in the third quarter 2'24, which is higher compared to the second quarter.

第二季綜合液化天然氣調整後淨營業收入及現金流均為 12 億美元。結果反映了液化天然氣平均價格下降和銷售下降，以及天然氣交易的影響在持續的低波動環境中並未真正受益。能源交易繼續表現良好。 Given the evolution of oil and gas prices in the recent months and the lag effect on price formulas, we anticipate that our average LNG selling price should be around $10 per million BTU in the third quarter 2'24, which is higher compared to the second四分之一.

Moving now to Integrated Power. As mentioned by Patrick, we recently enhanced our asset integration with several flexible capacity additions. Integrated Power once again delivered profitable growth with first half '24 adjusted net operating income of [$1.12 billion] up 36% compared to the first half of '23 due to activity growth. First half '24 cash flow totaled $1.3 billion, which is in line with the annual guidance of more than $2.5 billion. In addition, return on capital employed for the first -- for the 12 months ending June 13 increased to above 10%.

現在轉向整合電源。正如帕特里克所提到的，我們最近透過幾次靈活的產能增加增強了我們的資產整合。由於活動成長，Integrated Power 再次獲利成長，24 年上半年調整後營業淨收入 [11.2 億美元] 比 23 年上半年成長 36%。 24 年上半年現金流總計 13 億美元，符合超過 25 億美元的年度指引。此外，截至 6 月 13 日的 12 個月中，首次使用的資本回報率已增至 10% 以上。

In Downstream, Refining & Chemicals reported $640 million of adjusted net operating income and $1.9 billion of cash flow during the second quarter. Results reflect the sharp decrease in global refining margins since the end of the first quarter, which remained impacted by low diesel demand in Europe and market normalization following the disruption in Russian supply.

在下游領域，煉油與化工業務第二季調整後淨營業收入為 6.4 億美元，現金流為 19 億美元。業績反映出自第一季末以來全球煉油利潤急劇下降，仍受到歐洲柴油需求低迷以及俄羅斯供應中斷後市場正常化的影響。

The company's utilization rates improved to 40 -- to 84.5% from 79% in the first quarter of '24 mainly due to lower plant maintenance, which partially compensated the decrease in refining margins. For the third quarter '24, we anticipate that the refining utilization rates will benefit from the restart of the Donges refinery in France and will average above 85%.

該公司的利用率從 2024 年第一季的 79% 提高到 40% 至 84.5%，這主要是由於工廠維護減少，部分補償了煉油利潤的下降。 24年第三季度，我們預期煉油利用率將受惠於法國東格斯煉油廠的重啟，平均將達85%以上。

Marketing & Services benefited from the lower refining margins environment in the second quarter with adjusted -- net operating income increasing to $380 million, and cash flow increased by 38% sequentially to $660 million. At the company level, we have been, as usual, active in M&A on both sides with $1.9 billion of divestments and $1.6 billion of acquisitions over the first half of '24. Our net investment stands at $8.2 billion at midyear, and we confirm our '24 net investment guidance of $17 billion to $18 billion.

行銷與服務部受惠於第二季煉油利潤率較低的環境，調整後淨營業收入增至 3.8 億美元，現金流較上季成長 38% 至 6.6 億美元。在公司層面，我們一如既往地積極開展雙方的併購活動，2024 年上半年，我們進行了 19 億美元的撤資和 16 億美元的收購。截至年中，我們的淨投資為 82 億美元，我們確認 24 年淨投資指引為 170 億至 180 億美元。

During the second quarter, we reported a $1.2 billion working cap release, and we anticipate that the working cap builds reported during the first quarter will continue to reverse over the coming quarters. Gearing was stable quarter to quarter and improved by nearly 1% year-on-year at 10.2% at the end of the second quarter '24. As a reminder, we continue to anticipate structural dealing of around 7% to 8%, all else being equal.

在第二季度，我們報告了 12 億美元的工作上限釋放，我們預計第一季報告的工作上限建設將在未來幾季繼續逆轉。負債比率逐季維持穩定，截至 2024 年第二季末，負債比率年增近 1%，達 10.2%。提醒一下，在其他條件相同的情況下，我們繼續預期結構性交易將在 7% 至 8% 左右。

During the quarter, TotalEnergies successfully issued senior bonds in the US markets, totaling $4.25 billion, using conventional formats and privileging low maturities, the average maturity of this influence was indeed 27 years. Indeed, the Board of Directors decided to return flexibility on the format of the bond insurance and to be priority to low maturity.

本季度，TotalEnergies在美國市場成功發行了總額為42.5億美元的高級債券，採用傳統形式並優先考慮低期限債券，其平均期限確實為27年。事實上，董事會決定在債券保險的形式上恢復彈性，並優先考慮低期限。

Lastly, I am pleased to announce that after the capital increase reserved for employees, earlier this year, employee ownership in the company is now more than 8%. We also have strong support from our shareholders who supported all resolutions submitted to the vote at the recent Annual General Meeting.

最後，我很高興地宣布，今年年初員工預留增資後，公司員工持股比例現已超過8%。我們也得到了股東的大力支持，他們支持在最近的年度股東大會上提交投票的所有決議。

I will stop here and let the floor for the Q&A. Thank you.

我就講到這裡，讓大家來問答。謝謝。

(Operator Insructions)

（操作員說明）

Lydia Rainforth, Barclays.

莉迪亞·雷恩福斯，巴克萊銀行。

Thank you and good afternoon. Two questions, if I could. The first one, Patrick, I think you said that the 100-year anniversary for Total. And I know that you've kind of been very good at giving shares to the employees and things like that. Would you consider a special dividend for 100 years to celebrate the Total?

謝謝你，下午好。如果可以的話，有兩個問題。第一個，派崔克，我想你說的是道達爾成立 100 週年。我知道你們非常擅長分配股票之類的事情給員工。您會考慮派發 100 週年特別股息來慶祝道達爾集團的發展嗎？

And then the second one, actually, if I could just see more macro stuff at the moment. Clearly, there's a lot of moving parts to the cash flow towards the end of the year. Can you just walk us through both where we're finding is and where you see that going? And then also on LNG, just where you're signing some of the slopes on the contracts. Thank you.

然後是第二個，實際上，如果我現在能看到更多宏觀的東西的話。顯然，到年底現金流有很多變化。您能否向我們介紹一下我們所發現的情況以及您認為該情況的發展方向？然後還有液化天然氣，就在合約上簽署一些斜坡的地方。謝謝。

Okay. Good question, Lydia. Maybe I should give to you a special gift of another share to ask a question, but I'm afraid that today, we get -- we are not, as we already set up in our cash flow allocation, the privilege is dividend and buyback more than special dividend. We don't consider today; we are in an exceptional environment as the one which we benefited in 2022. So it was exceptional.

好的。好問題，莉迪亞。也許我應該給你一份特別的禮物，另一股來問問題，但恐怕今天，我們沒有，正如我們已經在現金流分配中設定的那樣，特權是股息和回購超過特別股息。我們不考慮今天；我們正處於一個特殊的環境中，我們在 2022 年受益匪淺。

We are not there. It's a good environment, but not exceptional. So I would say sorry to disappoint you, but I'm afraid we prefer to continue to maintain to increase the dividend year after year and to have a good buyback program.

我們不在那裡。這是一個很好的環境，但並不特別。所以我想說，很抱歉讓您失望，但恐怕我們更願意繼續維持年復一年增加股息並擁有良好的回購計劃。

Second, where do we do refining? Refining, I think it's clear that -- I think there is a form of -- it benefited during the last two years of some imbalances in the market created by the Russian flows, which were disrupted from Europe, from the US, from the normal flows. We have the feeling that now, in fact, the market has more or less restabilizing in the sort of normalization mode from this perspective, even if -- we can observe that the US are more and more chasing against all these great fleet of Russian oil. So it could have, again, some influence.

第二，我們在哪裡進行精煉？煉油，我認為很明顯，我認為有一種形式，在過去兩年中，它受益於俄羅斯資金流造成的市場失衡，這些失衡受到歐洲、美國和正常情況的干擾。我們有一種感覺，事實上，從這個角度來看，市場或多或少已經在正常化模式中重新穩定下來，即使——我們可以觀察到美國越來越多地追趕所有這些偉大的俄羅斯石油艦隊。所以它可能再次產生一些影響。

So that's one part. The other part is that the demand was not too -- was lower busier than the last two years, in fact. So the inventories are not so exceptional in fact. I expect that with the driving season during summertime, generally, there is more demand. So we could see, I would say, a better margin, today, it's quite low.

這就是一部分。另一部分是，事實上，需求並沒有比過去兩年更繁忙。因此，庫存實際上並沒有那麼特殊。我預計，隨著夏季駕駛季節的到來，需求通常會增加。所以我想說，今天我們可以看到更好的利潤率，但它相當低。

And in fact, we are -- when I say quite low, in fact, it's back to what it was normal before all these exceptional years. So I think our refiners, now, they have to come back to reality and to deliver good results with lower margins. But again, it's part -- at the same time, it's true that we benefit from a good oil price, in fact, $84, $85 per barrel, it's good. And so you saw you have -- you come back to a traditional integration between, I would say, when the price of oil is low, the margins in the refining are lower.

事實上，當我說相當低時，事實上，我們已經回到了所有這些特殊年份之前的正常狀態。因此，我認為我們的煉油廠現在必須回到現實，以較低的利潤取得良好的表現。但同樣，這是一部分——同時，我們確實受益於良好的油價，事實上，每桶 84 美元、85 美元，這很好。所以你看到你已經回到了傳統的整合，我想說，當石油價格較低時，煉油的利潤較低。

But generally, when it's a case, the marketing is benefiting of it. By the way, we've seen that in our -- in the -- during the last quarter. So I'm not -- I would say, I think we are more going into normalization of refining margins. And when we make our long-term plan, we are more on $35, $40 per ton than $70 or $80 per ton. So maybe because I was in charge of this segment, I know that what is a hard reality from time to time.

但一般來說，當出現這種情況時，行銷就會從中受益。順便說一句，我們在上個季度已經看到了這一點。所以我不是——我想說，我認為我們更致力於煉油利潤的正常化。當我們制定長期計劃時，我們更傾向於每噸 35 美元、40 美元，而不是每噸 70 美元或 80 美元。所以也許因為我負責這個部分，我常常知道什麼是殘酷的現實。

But again, this is typically the tip -- type of business, which is you need to have your machine, your refinery is running when the margin is good, and then you make the cash in. And then you need to be resilient when the margin is more normal. On the LNG, I would say, again, on the LNG, we negotiate quite a lot of new LNG contracts because all the strategy of the company is to buy Henry Hub and to sell Brent. In fact, so we are in the middle of that. It's difficult to answer to you because there is a lot of discussions around the world.

但同樣，這也是典型的業務類型，即您需要擁有自己的機器，您的煉油廠在利潤豐厚時運行，然後您就可以賺錢。距比較正常。在液化天然氣方面，我想說，在液化天然氣方面，我們談判了很多新的液化天然氣合同，因為該公司的所有策略都是購買亨利中心並出售布蘭特原油。事實上，我們正​​處於其中。很難回答你，因為世界各地有很多討論。

I would say, it's more commercial secret. So -- but again, the transformation of Henry Hub to Brent is good for the cash flow of the company, including in the market, we can see that at the end of the decade, it will be a softer market. So this is all the strategy of the company.

我想說，這更多的是商業機密。因此，但同樣，亨利港向布倫特的轉型對公司的現金流有好處，包括在市場上，我們可以看到，在本世紀末，市場將變得更加疲軟。這就是公司的全部策略。

Brilliant. Thanks very much.

傑出的。非常感謝。

Doug Leggate, Wolfe Research.

道格‧萊蓋特，沃爾夫研究中心。

Well, thank you. Good morning and good afternoon, everyone. Thanks for having me on. Patrick and Jean-Pierre, I wonder if I could ask you about your Suriname progress. My understanding is that when you laid out the strategy last year, Suriname was -- did not have a meaningful contribution to your 2028 cash flow.

嗯，謝謝。大家早安，下午好。謝謝你邀請我參加。派崔克和讓-皮埃爾，我想知道是否可以向你們詢問蘇利南的進展。我的理解是，當你們去年制定策略時，蘇利南並沒有對你們 2028 年的現金流做出有意義的貢獻。

But now you have an SPM fast-forward hull. And obviously, things look like they're moving a little quicker. It seems to me that Suriname could be a meaningful step-up in your cash flow in 2028. Full calendar year at current oil price is probably around $4 billion. Can you give us some color as to what you think the progress is?

但現在您有了 SPM 快轉船體。顯然，事情看起來進展得更快了。在我看來，蘇利南可能會在 2028 年對您的現金流產生有意義的提升。您能給我們一些關於您認為進展的資訊嗎？

That's true. But in fact, we have decided, as I said last year, that Suriname, we try to execute it in a quick mode, I would say, moving from the end of the appraisal by September last year to the FID. My objective is one year. For appraisals with FID, all the teams are being mobilized. By the way we are using innovative approach, including using the design of a good operator, which is developing projects next to Suriname, which first, they have a good design.

這是真的。但事實上，正如我去年所說，我們已經決定，蘇利南，我們嘗試以快速模式執行它，我想說，從去年 9 月結束評估轉向最終投資決定。我的目標是一年。為了進行 FID 評估，所有團隊都已動員起來。順便說一句，我們正在使用創新方法，包括使用優秀運營商的設計，該運營商正在蘇利南旁邊開發項目，首先，他們有一個良好的設計。

So trying to build on this FPSO, in fact, taking the design, which has the design of Guyana, in fact, to apply it, and it's quite efficient. So we move forward quickly. And so that means that the first sort of Suriname is targeted by, I would say, somewhere in mid-'28 beginning Q1, beginning '28. So it could be quite significant. To be clear, cash flow from Suriname, as you know, will be big because we have in fact, financing almost a full of it.

因此，嘗試在這艘FPSO的基礎上進行構建，事實上，採用了圭亞那的設計，事實上，應用它，而且非常有效。所以我們快速前進。因此，這意味著蘇利南的第一個目標是，我想說，在 28 年中期的某個時間，從第一季開始，從 28 年開始。所以這可能非常重要。需要明確的是，正如您所知，蘇利南的現金流將會很大，因為事實上我們幾乎擁有全部資金。

So we'll benefit from the cash flows in a very large way. So as the contribution of Suriname, not only to '28, but '29, 2030, 2031, 2032 will be important. That's why I'm insisting. By the way, I can tell you that in September, we will extend our guidance up to 2030, because with the rich portfolio we have, we can extend it. And Suriname, of course, will be part of the new -- the good color will give to our perspective by end -- by 2030.

因此，我們將從現金流中受益匪淺。因此，蘇利南的貢獻不僅對“28”，而且對“29”、2030、2031、2032 年也很重要。這就是我堅持的原因。順便說一句，我可以告訴你，在 9 月份，我們將把我們的指導延長至 2030 年，因為憑藉我們擁有的豐富的投資組合，我們可以將其延長。當然，到 2030 年，蘇利南將成為新的一部分——到年底，良好的色彩將為我們帶來新的視角。

That is very helpful. Can I ask a quick follow-up on a separate topic in the US. After your Lewis Energy acquisition, are you now comfortable that you have enough hedged gas exposure for your LNG? Or do you still intend to do further acquisitions in Lower 48?

這非常有幫助。我可以要求快速跟進美國的一個單獨主題嗎？收購 Lewis Energy 後，您現在是否對自己的液化天然氣擁有足夠的對沖天然氣風險感到放心？或者您還打算在 Lower 48 地區進行進一步的收購嗎？

No, we don't have enough. We are clear. We can make the math. We will take something like almost -- we have 10 million tons, we have 5 million tons in Rio Grande, so we need to increase. And by the way, I can tell you that we are working on another deal. So it will be step by self-deal. It's not a big one, but we are working on another one. And we should have news as well for you, but we'll give more color to you by September as well.

不，我們還不夠。我們很清楚。我們可以算一下。我們將採取類似的方式——我們有 1000 萬噸，我們在格蘭德河有 500 萬噸，所以我們需要增加。順便說一句，我可以告訴你，我們正在商定另一項協議。所以這將是一步一步的自我交易。這不是一件大事，但我們正在做另一件事。我們也應該為您提供新聞，但我們也會在 9 月之前為您提供更多資訊。

I think an important topic on which for me is important is to show you how we, in fact, all this LNG position on one part, on the upstream, but on the other side, on the downstream will be resilient and whatever the unrepriced environment will be, I think, is very important to demonstrate it, and we are acting on it. And on the uptream, there will be more to come for sure.

我認為對我來說很重要的一個重要主題是向您展示我們實際上如何在上游和另一方面下游的所有液化天然氣立場將具有彈性，無論未重新定價的環境如何我認為，展示這一點非常重要，我們正在採取行動。在上游，肯定還會有更多的事情發生。

Thank you so much, guys.

十分感謝大家。

Irene Himona, Bernstein.

艾琳希莫納，伯恩斯坦。

Thank you. Good afternoon. My first question is on marketing. In the second quarter, [Couche-Tard] declined about 16% year-on-year for a 2% lower sales volume. How should we think around the impact of your disposal to co-start versus underlying performance? So what happened if we exclude the sold assets?

謝謝。午安.我的第一個問題是關於行銷的。第二季度，[Couche-Tard] 年減約 16%，銷量下降 2%。我們該如何考慮您對共同啟動的處置與基本績效的影響？那麼如果我們排除已出售的資產會發生什麼事呢？

And my second question, Patrick, French politics has been quite volatile recently. And sovereign states can do a lot of things, impose windfall taxes, even golden shares. So I wanted to ask, is there something in particular there that concerns you in terms of a potential action by the French state that might be against the company’s interest? Thank you.

我的第二個問題，派崔克，法國政治最近相當不穩定。主權國家可以做很多事情，徵收暴利稅，甚至黃金股票。所以我想問，對於法國政府可能採取的可能損害公司利益的行動，您是否有特別擔心的事情？謝謝。

The first question is quite easy. In fact, it was more or less $20 million per month. So in the quarter, it’s $60 million, the impact of Couche-Tard. The assets in Germany and Netherlands and half of Belgium, so you can make the math. And in fact, we manage in terms of cash flow more or less to – we are okay with cash flow or it’s a net result, $20 million was a -- synergies -- sorry, not cash flow, tax result, so $20 million per month.

第一個問題很簡單。事實上，每月大約有 2000 萬美元。因此，本季 Couche-Tard 的影響為 6,000 萬美元。資產在德國、荷蘭和比利時的一半，所以你可以算算看。事實上，我們在現金流方面的管理或多或少是為了——我們對現金流沒問題，或者它是一個淨結果，2000 萬美元是——協同效應——抱歉，不是現金流，而是稅收結果，所以每月2000萬美元。

So you can find that you are right, it would be reduced to 2% to 3%. So it’s in line, in fact. So globally, the marketing is, I would say, a very -- performance equivalent to the one of last year if you deduct this Couche-Tard impact, okay? First point. And second one, honestly, the French politics. I think, first, I would say that TotalEnergies is more stable, which is good or it’s a stable company.

所以你可以發現你是對的，它會減少到2%到3%。事實上，這是一致的。因此，我想說，在全球範圍內，如果扣除 Couche-Tard 的影響，行銷的表現與去年相當，好嗎？第一點。老實說，第二個是法國政治。我認為，首先，我會說 TotalEnergies 更加穩定，這很好，或者說它是一家穩定的公司。

Honestly, I think there is a lot of noise around all that. On the golden share, by the way, has to be very clear, on it, there was a judgment, which was in 2002 by the European Court of Justice, which has obliged the French government, which previously had the golden share in TotalEnergies equity to cancel it because it was against a fundamental principle of remove of capital within the European Union. So it has been already judged.

老實說，我認為這一切都存在著很多噪音。順便說一句，關於黃金份額，必須非常清楚，對此，歐洲法院在2002年做出了一項判決，該判決要求法國政府承擔責任，而法國政府此前擁有TotalEnergies股權中的黃金份額取消它，因為它違反了歐盟內部撤資的基本原則。所以已經判斷過了。

So I know that some politicians are speaking to thinking against about it. And by the way, with the present law in France, just to clarify with you, it would require at least the French state to invest 5% of shares in TotalEnergies. So I understand that they have more -- better use of their money than investing billions in the company. So that’s politics. But again, this is not a point. I think as I told you before, already, you could see IDs like the one in the US, by the way, which is taxation on the buyback. The French politicians have all read, but something is happening there.

所以我知道一些政客正在反對考慮這個問題。順便說一句，根據法國現行法律，向您澄清一下，法國政府至少需要投資 TotalEnergies 5% 的股份。所以我知道他們可以更好地利用自己的資金，而不是向公司投資數十億美元。這就是政治。但話又說回來，這不是重點。我想正如我之前告訴過你的，你已經可以看到像美國那樣的 ID，順便說一句，這是回購稅。法國政客都讀過，但那裡正在發生一些事情。

So sometimes it’s a little difficult to argue for us again even if we have done it. But again, we will engage with wherever the new government is. And that’s, I think -- again, I don’t think you should consider it will fundamentally affect the interest of TotalEnergies.

所以有時即使我們已經做到了，再次為我們辯護還是有點困難。但同樣，無論新政府在哪裡，我們都會進行接觸。那就是，我認為——再說一遍，我認為你不應該認為這將從根本上影響 TotalEnergies 的利益。

Thank you, Patrick.

謝謝你，派崔克。

Biraj Borkhataria, RBC.

比拉傑‧博哈塔里亞 (Biraj Borkhataria)，加拿大皇家銀行。

Hi, thanks for taking my questions. My first one was on the deal you did with OMB in Malaysia. I noticed you listed that in the upstream bullets rather than integrated gas. But in the press release, you mentioned the deal will be an anchor for future growth in the country.

您好，感謝您回答我的問題。我的第一個問題是關於您與馬來西亞 OMB 達成的交易。我注意到您將其列在上游項目符號中，而不是集成氣體中。但在新聞稿中，您提到該交易將成為該國未來成長的支柱。

Just wondering if there’s any potential here to integrate yourselves into the LNG facility and whether that’s being discussed. And if not, could you just talk a bit about your growth plans there and the strategic rationale for that deal, if you can’t integrate into LNG.

只是想知道您是否有可能融入液化天然氣設施以及是否正在討論這一點。如果沒有，如果您無法融入液化天然氣，您能否談談您在那裡的成長計劃以及該交易的戰略理由。

And then the second question is just again on projects and on LNG. So Mozambique, there was an article recently around potential cost escalations. Could you just give us an update on where we are in expected budget and what the next steps are from here? Thank you.

第二個問題又是關於專案和液化天然氣的。莫三比克最近有一篇關於潛在成本上升的文章。您能否向我們介紹一下我們的預期預算狀況以及接下來的步驟是什麼？謝謝。

Yeah. On Malaysia, no, I think maybe it will be -- fundamentally, the gas revenues from the license in Malaysia is LNG netback, just to be clear. So for me, it’s integrated to the LNG value chain just to be clear, even if we don’t have -- so it’s a way that the price, gas price is settled. So first clarification.

是的。在馬來西亞，不，我認為也許會——從根本上說，馬來西亞許可證的天然氣收入是液化天然氣淨收益，只是需要澄清。因此，對我來說，澄清一下，它已整合到液化天然氣價值鏈中，即使我們沒有——所以這是一種解決價格、天然氣價格的方式。所以先澄清一下。

So the idea, of course, is to continue beyond it to have access to -- and we are already in discussions with some other actors, players, including, by the way, Petronas to beyond and they just started, by the way, the Jerun gas field, which just started this week, last week. So it’s quite a large a field and it’s producing 600 million [stored] per day, I think. So we’ll have a nice share of it.

因此，當然，我們的想法是繼續超越它，以獲得 - 我們已經在與其他一些參與者、參與者進行討論，包括順便說一句，馬來西亞國家石油公司（Petronas），順便說一句，他們剛剛開始Jerun氣田本週剛啟動，上週。所以這是一個相當大的領域，我認為它每天生產 6 億[儲存]。所以我們會分得一杯羹。

And so beyond it, there is more opportunities to develop. And so we have some plans. And of course, at the end, the more we can link that to the LNG world and to LNG pricing, this is the objective of the company. So we’ll work on it. On the Mozambique, I can tell you that everything has been settled with the contractors. So we are clear. We know where we are.

除此之外，還有更多的發展機會。所以我們有一些計劃。當然，最後，我們越能將其與液化天然氣世界和液化天然氣定價聯繫起來，這就是公司的目標。所以我們會努力解決這個問題。關於莫三比克，我可以告訴你，一切都已經和承包商解決了。所以我們很清楚。我們知道我們在哪裡。

In fact, it was more mature to be honest of the cost of the, I would say, frozen period, which was to be absorbed and discussed because since 2020 to 2024, we have frozen some words. We have some equipments which were, I would say, kept in different locations. So all that has been discussed, already settled with them. And so we are on the way to move forward. And we will -- as soon as we can update you, we will do it. But the progress has been done in many directions, including on security.

事實上，說實話，我想說的是，凍結期的成本更加成熟，這是需要吸收和討論的，因為從2020年到2024年，我們已經凍結了一些文字。我想說，我們有一些設備保存在不同的位置。所以所有的事情都已經討論過了，已經和他們解決了。因此，我們正在前進的道路上。我們會—一旦我們能向您通報最新情況，我們就會這樣做。但在包括安全在內的許多方面都取得了進展。

Now we try to regroup all the financial -- finances around the project. So as you know as well, there are some presidential elections in Mozambique coming soon. And so of course, for us, it’s important to be -- to have the confirmation that the new President will follow the same policy regarding these large projects. And so that’s where we are. So say by end of the year, we should clarify or we should be able to move forward.

現在我們嘗試圍繞該項目重新組合所有財務。如您所知，莫三比克即將舉行一些總統選舉。當然，對我們來說，重要的是要確認新總統將在這些大型項目上遵循同樣的政策。這就是我們現在的處境。所以說到今年年底，我們應該澄清，或者我們應該能夠向前推進。

Okay. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

Martijn Rats, Morgan Stanley.

馬丁‧拉茨，摩根士丹利。

Yeah. Hi, hello. I have two, if I may. I was -- my attention was drawn to the comments in the outlook statement where you talked about European gas prices in the range of $8 to $10 per MMBtu for the third quarter. And that struck me as somewhat of an unusual comment because I don’t know Total to call that often on near-term commodity prices. So from that perspective, it stood out, but it also took out because it seems quite low. TTF is a little bit more than $10 per MMBtu at the moment.

是的。你好。如果可以的話，我有兩個。我的注意力被展望聲明中的評論所吸引，其中您談到第三季歐洲天然氣價格為每 MMBtu 8 美元至 10 美元。這讓我覺得這是一個不尋常的評論，因為我不知道道達爾經常在近期大宗商品價格上這麼說。所以從這個角度來看，它很突出，但它也因為它看起來相當低而被淘汰。目前 TTF 略高於每 MMBtu 10 美元。

So I was wondering if you could elaborate a bit on that expectation and broadly where it comes from and the drivers behind it? And then the second thing I wanted to ask is on the previous earnings call. We talked a lot, of course, about the potential to either move the listing to the US or maybe not for the full headquarters, but at least the -- yeah, to move the main listing to the US. And a quarter has passed, and I was wondering if you have an update on those thoughts.

所以我想知道您是否可以詳細說明一下這種期望以及它的大致來源及其背後的驅動因素？我想問的第二件事是在之前的財報電話會議上。當然，我們談了很多關於將上市地點轉移到美國的可能性，或者可能不將整個總部轉移到美國，但至少——是的，將主要上市地點轉移到美國。四分之一已經過去了，我想知道你是否對這些想法有最新的了解。

Okay. Sorry to surprise you. Sometimes you tell me that we are a growing company. So today, we try to make it. Honestly, there is no -- we’ve seen -- we made a statement. Beginning of the year, at $8, we moved up to $10, $10.5. So to give you a range of $8 to $10 in summer time, there is nothing extraordinary because it’s not the best season.

好的。抱歉讓你大吃一驚。有時你告訴我我們是一家成長中的公司。所以今天，我們努力做到這一點。老實說，我們沒有——我們已經看到——我們發表過任何聲明。今年年初，我們從 8 美元漲到了 10 美元、10.5 美元。因此，在夏季為您提供 8 至 10 美元的價格並沒有什麼特別的，因為這不是最好的季節。

The third quarter is not the peak of the demand generally. And so as you know, the inventories, storages in Europe are quite well full. We don’t anticipate a big rebound unless there is an event. So that’s, I think, giving you this guidance is more reflecting what happens since the beginning of the year. So it’s a way to tell you.

整體而言，第三季並不是需求高峰。如您所知，歐洲的庫存和儲存非常充足。除非發生事件，否則我們預計不會大幅反彈。因此，我認為，向您提供這項指導更能反映今年年初以來發生的情況。所以這是告訴你的一種方式。

But again, when you say it’s low $8, it’s quite high compared to what we were experiencing before 2021. And it was more -- we had years at around $4 to $6 per million BTU. So $8 for European gas price, even today, it's $10.3 yesterday evening is a good price for -- not only for us, including for all Norwegian operations and UK operations, I would say. It's good for -- it's okay. It's lower than what we had in '22 and '23, but we've made no miracle on that, but still there has been a landing. And unless the weather will come again call next winter, we don't anticipate any point.

但話又說回來，當你說它低至8 美元時，與我們在2021 年之前經歷的情況相比，它是相當高的。 4 至6 美元左右的價格。因此，歐洲天然氣價格為 8 美元，即使在今天，昨天晚上的 10.3 美元也是一個不錯的價格——不僅對我們來說，包括所有挪威業務和英國業務，我想說。這對——沒關係。它比我們 22 年和 23 年的水平要低，但我們並沒有創造奇蹟，但仍然有所著陸。除非明年冬天天氣再次出現，否則我們預計不會有任何情況。

Having said that, there were the disruptions coming from other parts of the world, because the main driver today will be, is there is any tension, is there LNG supply, because the plant could have a problem somewhere in the world, then this market is very volatile because we don't have much margins between the supply and the demand on the LNG.

話雖如此，世界其他地區也出現了乾擾，因為今天的主要驅動力是，是否存在緊張局勢，是否有液化天然氣供應，因為世界某個地方的工廠可能會出現問題，那麼這個市場波動性很大，因為我們對液化天然氣的供應和需求之間沒有太多利潤。

So sorry to have surprised you, Martijn. On the US listing, no. I mean it's not -- I clarified that in the French newspaper, maybe it was in French, so we should translate it and distribute it to everybody, which I will ask Renaud and his team to do because we clarify what we want to do. What we want to do is fundamentally to transform the ADRs in shares, in ordinary shares. That's all.

很抱歉讓你感到驚訝，馬丁。在美國上市，沒有。我的意思是不是——我在法國報紙上澄清，也許是法語，所以我們應該翻譯它並分發給每個人，我會要求雷諾和他的團隊這樣做，因為我們澄清了我們想要做什麼。我們要做的是從根本上將美國存託憑證轉變為股票、普通股。就這樣。

And that means at the end, and we want these shares to be cross listed, I would say, if you want, between Paris and New York. That's fundamentally what I'd like to do. There is no -- nothing else. So transforming the ADRs in shares. The ADRs we made the test to -- we had questions with a quiz or questions to almost 40 long-term investors in the US.

這意味著最後，我們希望這些股票能夠交叉上市，我想說，如果你願意的話，可以在巴黎和紐約之間交叉上市。從根本上來說，這就是我想做的事。沒有——沒有別的了。因此，將美國存託憑證轉換為股票。我們測試的 ADR 是透過測驗或向美國近 40 名長期投資者提出的問題。

They see some positive, nothing negative because some investors do not like the complexity of the ADRs in terms of back office, in terms of managing it. Some investors could prefer to invest directly on the New York market and not going to the European market, Paris or London or Brussels, so that we do. So we are more in a technical -- we are in a technical move. We progress, just to tell you, we progress positively until now, and Jean-Pierre and his team will work on it. We will update you probably end of September.

他們看到了積極的一面，沒有消極的一面，因為一些投資者不喜歡美國存託憑證在後台和管理方面的複雜性。有些投資人可能更願意直接投資紐約市場，而不是去歐洲市場、巴黎、倫敦或布魯塞爾，所以我們就這麼做了。所以我們更多的是技術性的——我們是技術性的。我們取得了進展，只是告訴你，到目前為止我們取得了積極的進展，讓-皮埃爾和他的團隊將為此努力。我們可能會在九月底向您更新。

But technically, there is some technical matters between the different depository, in fact, firms between Europe -- or Europe on one side, the TCC on the other side. And so we made progress, and we'll be able to have a scheme. So it's fundamentally transforming the ADRs in shares. And so having -- giving more liquidity to the shares, which the shares could be, in fact, acquired over in Paris or on the New York market. That's what we want to do. It will add the liquidity. And so we hope it will help attracting more US investors. And as you know, today, we have a larger -- a stronger flow of US buyers than on the European side. That's what we want to do.

但從技術上講，不同的託管機構之間存在一些技術問題，事實上，歐洲之間的公司之間存在一些技術問題，或者一側是歐洲，另一側是 TCC。所以我們取得了進展，我們將能夠制定一個計劃。因此，它從根本上改變了股票中的美國存託憑證。因此，為股票提供更多的流動性，事實上，這些股票可以在巴黎或紐約市場上購買。這就是我們想做的事。它將增加流動性。因此，我們希望這將有助於吸引更多的美國投資者。如您所知，今天，美國買家的流動量比歐洲買家的流動量更大、更強勁。這就是我們想做的事。

Wonderful. That's crystal clear.

精彩的。那是非常清楚的。

Michele Della Vigna, Goldman Sachs.

米歇爾·德拉·維尼亞，高盛。

Thank you very much for the time. I've seen that you've been very active in adding more low-cost LNG supply to your portfolio in the last few months with Roubaix, with Marsa LNG. I'm wondering you must be marketing these volumes to customers at the moment. How do you find the demand appetite for more LNG? And are you comfortable to add more spot volumes to your portfolio, especially if the market starts to become more supplied in '26, '27? Thank you.

非常感謝您抽出時間。我發現，在過去的幾個月裡，你們一直非常積極地透過魯貝和瑪莎液化天然氣公司在你們的投資組合中增加更多的低成本液化天然氣供應。我想知道您現在一定正在向客戶推銷這些卷。您如何看待更多液化天然氣的需求？您是否願意在您的投資組合中增加更多現貨量，特別是如果市場在 26 年、27 年開始供應更多的話？謝謝。

Yeah. Good question. Thank you, Michele. Clearly, we have been successful in the last month. And I answered to a previous question, our strategy is to be able, in fact, to transform some gas -- I would say, gas volumes into brand volumes. And so we are active on the Asian markets. We have already announced 2 million tons of new LNG contracts since the beginning of the year to different, and there will be more to come. So you will be -- you will see -- I can tell you more deals to be announced in the next months. We are quite active.

是的。好問題。謝謝你，米歇爾。顯然，我們在上個月取得了成功。我回答了先前的問題，事實上，我們的策略是能夠將一些天然氣——我想說，天然氣量轉化為品牌量。因此，我們活躍於亞洲市場。自今年年初以來，我們已經宣布了 200 萬噸新液化天然氣合同，而且還會有更多合約。所以你會——你會看到——我可以告訴你未來幾個月將宣布更多交易。我們相當活躍。

As I said to -- as I answered, look, we have more or less 10 million tons today of US LNG, which is linked to Henry Hub. We sell part of it on the Henry Hub formula, and we want the rest to be installed on the brand formula, in fact, and the brand formula. And so the answer to your first question, there is an appetite today from Asian buyers and still at a good percentage. We don't, I would say, discount our LNG. Why? Because I think the lesson of the Asian buyers is that -- they have been afraid about what happened in '22, '23. So even if I could anticipate that there would be a softening in the market by '27, 2030, they think for them, it's better to hedge part of their own, I would say, purchase linked to the brand.

正如我所說 - 正如我回答的那樣，看，我們今天大約有 1000 萬噸美國液化天然氣，這些液化天然氣與亨利中心相連。我們在亨利中心配方上出售一部分，我們希望其餘的安裝在品牌配方上，事實上，品牌配方上。所以，第一個問題的答案是，今天亞洲買家有興趣，而且比例仍然很高。我想說，我們不會對液化天然氣打折。為什麼？因為我認為亞洲買家的教訓是——他們一直擔心 22 年、23 年發生的事情。因此，即使我可以預計到 2030 年 27 日市場將會疲軟，他們認為對他們來說，最好對沖他們自己的一部分，我想說的是，與該品牌相關的購買。

In fact, I think today, there is more confidence in the buyers side on the brands, and the stability of the oil market than on the LNG JKM index, which is, by the way, don't have the same depth than the TTF. So I think this is why you have some appetite on different countries. There are more countries buying LNG. In fact, it's not only China, Japan and Korea, Taiwan, Vietnam, India, India is -- has [low] appetite.

事實上，我認為今天買家對品牌和石油市場的穩定性比液化天然氣 JKM 指數更有信心，順便說一句，與 TTF 沒有相同的深度。所以我認為這就是為什麼你對不同國家有一些興趣。購買液化天然氣的國家越來越多。事實上，不只中國、日本和韓國、台灣、越南、印度——都有[低]胃口。

So adding more spot, we have added already. We have added with Rio Grande. We took 5 million tons. Marsa is smaller. It's 1 million tons. So -- but this is the one where we want also to develop a local barging, I would say, market within the Gulf with a specific market. And so yes, we are comfortable. But I think I will give you -- I will tell you, Michele, what the objective we have in end of September. It will show you exactly what you said, how do we manage this potentially softening of the market from '27 to 2030, what is remaining exposure from TotalEnergies. And you will realize that downstream, in fact, fundamentally, we will transform, and we are transforming Henry Hub into Brent. And I think this is good for our shareholders and for the future cash flows of the company.

所以添加更多的位置，我們已經添加了。我們加入了格蘭德河。我們拿了500萬噸。瑪莎較小。是100萬噸。所以，但我想說的是，我們也希望在海灣地區開發一個具有特定市場的本地駁船市場。所以，是的，我們很舒服。但我想我會告訴你，米歇爾，我們在九月底的目標是什麼。它將準確地向您展示您所說的內容，我們如何應對 27 年至 2030 年市場潛在的疲軟，以及 TotalEnergies 的剩餘風險敞口。你會意識到，下游，事實上，從根本上來說，我們將會轉型，我們正在將亨利港轉變為布蘭特原油。我認為這對我們的股東和公司未來的現金流都有好處。

Very clear. Thank you.

非常清楚。謝謝。

Lucas Herrmann, BNP Paribas.

盧卡斯·赫爾曼，法國巴黎銀行。

Thanks very much for your time. Two, if I might. One, the first is just to JP, the hybrids, you've redeemed a portion again this quarter. Can you just remind us what the redemption possibilities are going forward, what the time frames are? And Patrick, apologies, but a general question for you, just on your own thoughts on China and Chinese oil demand development to look out over the next few years?

非常感謝你花時間陪伴。如果可以的話，兩個。一，第一個是 JP，混合動力，您本季再次贖回了一部分。您能否提醒我們未來的贖回可能性是什麼，時間範圍是多少？派崔克，抱歉，請問您一個一般性問題，請談談您對中國以及未來幾年中國石油需求發展的看法？

I guess I've been -- it's been a fascinating to see the extent to which gasoline demand is perhaps come -- to come under pressure from EV. You've obviously had a fair amount of switching diesel into gas, LNG trucks, et cetera. And demand increasingly feels, so it's coming from the chemical industry. And perhaps negating crude. But just -- I mean, just your own thoughts and insights into how you see Chinese oil demand developing next few years? Thank you.

我想我一直——看到汽油需求可能達到的程度是令人著迷的——受到電動車的壓力。顯然，您已經有相當多的時間將柴油換成天然氣、液化天然氣卡車等。需求日益強烈，因此它來自化學工業。也許還否定粗俗。但我的意思是，您對未來幾年中國石油需求發展的看法和見解？謝謝。

Yes. So concerning [agri rates] you're right. So we decided not to renew EUR1.5 billion in the second quarter because we use the flexibility offered by the rating agencies. If you can demonstrate that without renewing your rating, your credit is not affected, so you can use this flexibility. So we see -- because we have an over EU2.5 billion next year as in our agri portfolio. So we have to discuss with the rating agencies to see what we can do and so if we can, again, continue to lower the agri portfolio.

是的。所以關於[農業價格]你是對的。因此，我們決定在第二季不再續訂 15 億歐元，因為我們利用了評級機構提供的彈性。如果您可以證明，在不更新評級的情況下，您的信用不會受到影響，那麼您就可以利用這種靈活性。所以我們看到了——因為明年我們的農業投資組合將超過 25 億歐元。因此，我們必須與評級機構討論，看看我們能做什麼，以及是否可以再次繼續降低農業投資組合。

Thank you.

謝謝。

On the China North, having insights on the forecast of the Chinese market, it's not so easy for when you are, I would say I think we should not exaggerate as well what happens. I think my view is that the oil market for the time being, oil demand globally, continue to be driven by China, even if India is part also, is a growing country. I would take the assumption of 0.81% per year is a good assumption until we will see a real reverse. Does it affect China?

在中國北方，對中國市場的預測有深入的了解，這並不容易，我想說，我認為我們也不應該誇大所發生的事情。我認為我的觀點是，目前的石油市場，全球石油需求，繼續由中國推動，即使印度也是其中的一部分，是一個成長中的國家。我認為每年 0.81% 的假設是一個很好的假設，直到我們看到真正的逆轉。對中國有影響嗎？

I think we are today a little on the western side over, I would say, there's a little of China bashing. I would say, to try to say that the economy in China is slowing down. My view is that it's continuing to be quite active. And it's true that you have there some more of the EV sales are impressive. But I was recently discussing with the CEO of the #5 car manufacturer company.

我認為我們今天有點偏向西方，我想說，有一些對中國的攻擊。我想說的是，試圖說中國經濟正在放緩。我的觀點是它仍然非常活躍。確實，那裡的電動車銷量也令人印象深刻。但我最近正在與排名第五的汽車製造商公司的執行長進行討論。

And when I ask you his figures, it was still of 20%, 30%, it's not at 70%. And in fact, it's a little like in Europe. There are EVs. They are also hybrid cars. And so -- and the hybrid cars are also because the customers, in fact, are looking to the same issues wherever they are in China or in Europe.

當我問你他的數字時，它仍然是20%、30%，而不是70%。事實上，這有點像歐洲。有電動車。它們也是混合動力汽車。因此，混合動力車也是因為事實上，無論在中國或歐洲，客戶都在關注同樣的問題。

In fact, they want to have a, I would say, a reliable car for most of the time. But that's important to keep in mind. So yes, there is a trend. That's true. We see some -- we see also LNG becoming for trucks, a newer market. But fundamentally, I think for me, will not affect quickly the oil market. So keeping 1% of demand for the year, I think, is reasonable, which is where we are more or less, that's what we think that we take into account.

事實上，我想說的是，他們希望在大多數情況下擁有一輛可靠的汽車。但記住這一點很重要。所以是的，有一種趨勢。這是真的。我們看到了一些——我們也看到液化天然氣正在成為卡車的新市場。但從根本上來說，我認為對我來說，不會很快影響石油市場。因此，我認為，保持今年需求的 1% 是合理的，這或多或少是我們所處的位置，這就是我們認為我們要考慮的因素。

Okay. Thanks very much for the comments.

好的。非常感謝您的評論。

Alastair Syme, Citigroup.

阿拉斯泰爾·賽姆，花旗集團。

Thank you. Patrick, just one question. I just wanted to get your sense on competitiveness of opportunities in renewables. I know there was another German lease bid auction recently that you are one of the two bidders or winning bidders, but it was quite strange.

謝謝。派崔克，只有一個問題。我只是想了解您對再生能源機會競爭力的認識。我知道最近還有另一場德國租賃招標拍賣，您是兩個競標者之一或中標者之一，但這很奇怪。

I think your German partner probably pulled out because they thought the auction had become too expensive. And I get it, the market -- the markets always have a difference sort of thinking. But can you give us a sense of where that difference lies?

我認為你的德國夥伴可能退出是因為他們認為拍賣變得太貴了。我明白了，市場——市場總是有不同的思維。但您能否讓我們了解差異在哪裡？

Okay. If we made the bid, but if you think it’s competitive otherwise, we don’t do it, first comment. Second comment, in fact, when you look and you will understand what we’ve done in a few weeks, we are trying to just -- I think one of my colleague in Germany has made it public in an interview. In fact, fundamentally, we think that this block that we have acquired is just this license. It’s just next to the one we acquired in the first round.

好的。如果我們出價，但如果您認為它在其他方面具有競爭力，我們不會這樣做，請先發表評論。第二條評論，事實上，當你看的時候，你就會明白我們在幾週內所做的事情，我們正在努力——我想我在德國的一位同事已經在採訪中公開了這一點。事實上，從根本上來說，我們認為我們獲得的這個區塊就是這個許可證。它就在我們在第一輪中獲得的那個旁邊。

So we want to make synergies of development in order to be more efficient. And so that’s the objective. And this could go, by the way, the fact that the structure all the properties we have in offshore wind in Germany. So you will see the story coming later. So -- but again, what we’re seeing fundamentally. And the German partner, by the way, is a nice partner that we have announced yesterday that we went with them in Netherlands, so probably the Netherlands are good than Germany.

所以我們要發揮協同發展的作用，才能更有效率。這就是目標。順便說一句，這可能會影響我們在德國擁有的所有離岸風電資產的結構。所以你稍後會看到這個故事。所以——但我們再次看到的是我們從根本上看到的情況。順便說一句，德國合作夥伴是一個很好的合作夥伴，我們昨天宣布我們和他們一起去荷蘭，所以荷蘭可能比德國好。

In fact, he has a different view because he has another past portfolio in Germany. So we are building that portfolio, not exactly the same approach. But if we do it, it’s because -- and it’s linked to the German power market in fact. Because in Germany, German government has decided a policy with no nuclear, exiting coal. So it’s fundamentally renewable and gas market. So the gas, the power price will be driven by the gas, in fact.

事實上，他有不同的看法，因為他過去在德國有過另一份工作。所以我們正在建立這個投資組合，而不是完全相同的方法。但如果我們這樣做，那是因為——而且它實際上與德國電力市場有關。因為在德國，德國政府已經決定了無核、退出煤炭的政策。因此，它從根本上來說是可再生能源和天然氣市場。因此，事實上，天然氣、電價將由天然氣驅動。

And when you look to the perspective of the gas price in Europe, you can be optimistic on the electricity price in Germany. So that’s part of the link that we want to do. And so that’s why we are building today a full Integrated Power portfolio in Germany. It’s not only the offshore wind. And so you should never -- and I know, Alastair, it’s difficult for me to convince you. But you will see and why we are more profitable than others. You don’t -- you should not look to the renewable opportunity only. It doesn’t work like that.

當你從歐洲天然氣價格的角度來看時，你可以對德國的電價感到樂觀。這就是我們想要做的連結的一部分。這就是我們今天在德國建立完整的整合式電源產品組合的原因。這不僅僅是海上風。所以你永遠不應該──我知道，阿拉斯泰爾，我很難說服你。但你會明白為什麼我們比其他人更有利可圖。你不——你不應該只專注於再生能源的機會。它不是那樣工作的。

A green intermittent electron has no value or little value. What is good is to have a clean firm power for customers. That’s what we do in Germany. Yes, we need some renewable sources to have the clean part, but we need to combine them with flexible assets and flexible assets are batteries.

綠色間歇電子沒有價值或價值很小。好的就是為客戶擁有乾淨堅定的權力。這就是我們在德國所做的事情。是的，我們需要一些再生能源來獲得清潔部分，但我們需要將它們與靈活資產結合起來，而靈活資產就是電池。

TotalEnergies should participate to have -- we’ll find a way to have access to gas power plants in Germany. Otherwise, my speech will not be consistent. And so I can announce you the next steps of what we want to develop, that’s why also we bought this aggregator of renewables to give flexibility in trading the system.

TotalEnergies 應該參與其中——我們將找到一種方法來使用德國的天然氣發電廠。否則的話，我的講話就不會前後一致。因此，我可以向您宣布我們想要開發的下一步，這就是為什麼我們也購買了這個再生能源聚合商，以提供系統交易的靈活性。

So the fundamental business model we have is not renewable. Renewable profitability, it is what it is, and you know it. But where you make money, it’s when you combine these green electrons with the flexible asset, gas plants and you deliver to the customer of clean firm power. Then you increase a lot of value. And the renewable -- so do you allocate this profit, this value to the renewables or to the gas plants or to the batteries?

因此，我們的基本商業模式是不可再生的。可再生的獲利能力，就是這樣，你也知道。但是，當你將這些綠色電子與靈活的資產、天然氣發電廠結合起來，並向客戶提供清潔的固定電力時，你才能賺錢。那你就會增加很多價值。而再生能源——那你會把這個利潤、這個價值分配給再生能源、天然氣發電廠還是電池呢？

I don’t hear -- at the end this is the integrated model. And this is what we delivered to you quarter after quarter, and we’ll increase it. So that’s the business plan. So it’s not a matter only of opportunity of renewable, it’s a matter of integration. And that’s why today we have a return on capital employed of about 10%. The renewable assets alone will not be there. I admit it, but it’s not what we are looking to.

我沒聽說——最後這就是整合模型。這就是我們每個季度向您提供的內容，並且我們將增加它。這就是商業計劃。因此，這不僅是再生能源機會的問題，而是整合的問題。這就是為什麼今天我們的已動用資本報酬率約為 10%。僅可再生資產是不存在的。我承認，但這不是我們想要的。

Okay. I look forward to October. In the meantime, enjoy the Olympics.

好的。我期待著十月。同時，享受奧運。

So -- and you need to listen to me a little bit.

所以——你需要聽我說一點。

Christopher Kuplent, Bank of America.

克里斯多福‧庫普倫特，美國銀行。

Thank you very much. Let’s see whether I’ve listened enough, Patrick. Can I come back to the topic of green hydrogen and that deal that you’ve just announced with RWE? Can you comment a little bit about the competitiveness of the industry? You are instrumental in trying to create a clean hydrogen market. And it seems that deal in the Netherlands suggests you feel you're better off creating the value chain yourself rather than buying it at currently available prices. So I'd be interested to see what you feel you can give to us here.

非常感謝。讓我們看看我是否聽夠了，派崔克。我可以回到綠氫的話題以及您剛剛與 RWE 宣布的交易嗎？您能簡單評價一下這個產業的競爭力嗎？您在努力創建清潔氫市場方面發揮了重要作用。荷蘭的交易似乎表明，您覺得自己創建價值鏈比以當前可用價格購買價值鏈更好。所以我很想知道你覺得你能為我們提供什麼。

And if I may go back to the US and ask you a little bit around the idea of M&A and how attractive or not you feel your current acquisition currency is if it's not cash in terms of being able to do deals. Is that one element behind, let's say, improving the currency that you have in New York. And if I can sneak in a third question, I would expect net-debt to fall as the net working capital position drops into year-end. How much room do you give yourself to surprise us what more than 40% CSO means in terms of shareholder distributions? Thank you.

如果我可以回到美國，問您一些有關併購的想法，以及您認為當前的收購貨幣在能夠進行交易的情況下不是現金的情況下有多大吸引力。比方說，這是改善紐約貨幣背後的因素之一嗎？如果我可以偷偷地提出第三個問題，我預計隨著淨營運資本部位到年底下降，淨債務將會下降。就股東分配而言，超過 40% 的 CSO 意味著什麼，您給了自己多少空間讓我們感到驚訝？謝謝。

On the last question, I think you have the answer in the speech of Jean-Pierre. Jean-Pierre told you that we are confident we could come back to a gearing of 7%, 8%. So -- but it's part of the working capital build during the first quarter, which will be released along the year. More than 40%, more than 40%, I consume more than 40%. That's -- I think you have the figure for this quarter, what is it, 45%, so more than 40%, 45% today. So it's -- the guidance will not be changed. But the delivery will be real. You will see it.

關於最後一個問題，我想你在讓皮耶的演講中已經有了答案。讓皮耶告訴你，我們有信心恢復到 7%、8% 的負債比率。所以——但這是第一季營運資金建設的一部分，該資金將在全年釋放。 40%以上，40%以上，我消耗40%以上。那是——我想你已經知道了這個季度的數字，是多少，45%，所以超過 40%，今天是 45%。所以，指導方針不會改變。但交付將是真實的。你會看到它。

First question, Jean. Again, no, I think you are -- it's more complex than that. When you -- we have different ways to provide green hydrogen to refineries, which, again, because of the RFNBO regulation in Europe fits an economic score to make an added value because you avoid the ETS on one side and you create an additional new product and these new products according to Visa FNBO regulation in Europe has added value.

第一個問題，讓。再說一次，不，我認為你是——事情比這更複雜。當您——我們有不同的方式向煉油廠提供綠色氫氣時，同樣，由於歐洲的 RFNBO 法規，這符合經濟分數以產生附加價值，因為您一方面避免了 ETS 並且創造了額外的新產品而且這些新產品根據Visa FNBO在歐洲的監管具有附加價值。

The question is how much do you pay for the hydrogen, obviously, green hydrogen. In fact, we are looking to both ways, either we -- there are different ways, by the way. And normally, in France, we have made the tolling of green electrons, which was a tolling agreement with our liquid. We toll green electrons. We don't invest in the electrolyzer. They do well on it, and we toll it, so we have a tolling fee. And we will get the green hydrogen outside for -- out of the electrolyzer. That's the tolling one.

問題是你要花多少錢買氫氣，顯然是綠色氫氣。事實上，我們正​​在尋找兩種方式，順便說一下，有不同的方式。通常，在法國，我們已經對綠色電子進行了收費，這與我們的液體達成了收費協議。我們收費綠色電子。我們不投資電解槽。他們在這方面做得很好，我們收費，所以我們有過路費。我們將從電解槽中取出綠色氫氣。就是那個收費的。

We could have, as we explained, by the way, yesterday, we have begun just made the deal with RWE to share, to invest offshore wind and assets and to get 50% of the electrons in order to transform them into electrolyzers. It could be -- it will be in local electrolyzer, either for tolling or we are looking to maybe -- part of it could be invested by ourselves in order to compare the difference because it's an infant industry. So we want to invest into compare the different ways between tolling, investing, and that's where these electrons will go. And when we have third rule which is to just to purchase green electrons from abroad.

正如我們解釋的那樣，順便說一句，昨天我們剛開始與 RWE 達成協議，進行共享、投資離岸風電和資產並獲得 50% 的電子，以便將它們轉變為電解槽。它可能是——它將在當地的電解槽中，要么用於收費，要么我們正在尋找——其中一部分可以由我們自己投資，以便比較差異，因為這是一個新興行業。因此，我們想要投資比較收費、投資之間的不同方式，這就是這些電子的去向。當我們有第三條規則時，那就是只從國外購買綠色電子。

And then it's a question purely of competition, market. And being the first mover, we announced a deal with our products being the first mover from this perspective, I think, give us access to good price. And so when one day, two day, it's premature because all these discussions are moving on. But when we compare the different boots and again, it's more or less equivalent. Of course, the question of when you import, it's a question of competitiveness of your supplier. And they will take more risk probably because we are off taking. But that's part of the discussion we have with some suppliers.

這純粹是競爭和市場的問題。作為先行者，我們宣布了一項協議，從這個角度來看，我們的產品成為先行者，我認為這讓我們獲得了優惠的價格。因此，有一天、兩天，現在還為時過早，因為所有這些討論都在繼續。但當我們再次比較不同的靴子時，它們或多或少是相當的。當然，什麼時候進口的問題，就是你供應商的競爭力問題。他們可能會承擔更多風險，因為我們不再承擔。但這是我們與一些供應商討論的一部分。

So -- but I can tell you, at the end, all the deals we will sign will allow us to create value, not only to avoid the ETS, but on the top of it, to capture part of the added value of the RFNBO products, which are the results of the European regulations.

所以，但我可以告訴你，最後，我們將簽署的所有交易都將使我們能夠創造價值，不僅可以避免 ETS，而且最重要的是，獲得 RFNBO 的部分附加價值產品，這是歐洲法規的結果。

And again, this match well with this RFNBO framework, which is a sort of a regulated economy, which creates a bubble where you can develop some green hydrogen. I don't tell you from my demonstration that green hydrogen is cheap, but you can create an economic framework and some value for refineries and at least reducing the emissions and avoiding to pay these ETS. That's where we think about it.

再說一次，這與 RFNBO 框架非常匹配，這是一種受監管的經濟，它創造了一個泡沫，您可以在其中開發一些綠色氫。我並沒有從我的演示中告訴你綠色氫很便宜，但你可以為煉油廠創建一個經濟框架和一些價值，至少減少排放並避免支付這些碳排放交易體系。這就是我們思考的地方。

No, US M&A, you are too smart, no. We just want to -- we want to improve the value of the shares for you. So it's obviously not to make M&A directly now that's not the point. Again, as you know, we have a large and rich portfolio of projects, which would like to make more M&A with shares.

不，美國併購，你太聰明了，不。我們只是想—我們想為您提高股票的價值。所以現在直接併購顯然不是重點。再說一遍，如您所知，我們擁有大量且豐富的專案組合，希望透過股份進行更多併購。

So it's not the main driver. The main driver is fundamentally, as I answered -- [did you read] to transfer the ADAs and shares because it could be attractive to some US investors to invest directly in New York, in off shares. And it's just giving more liquidity. And if it's more attractive, we could think that it could help not I think, to fill the famous gap, but part of it.

所以它不是主要驅動力。正如我回答的那樣，主要驅動力從根本上來說是轉讓 ADA 和股票，因為它可能對一些美國投資者直接投資於紐約的場外股票具有吸引力。它只是提供了更多的流動性。如果它更具吸引力，我們可以認為它可以幫助填補這個著名的空白，而不是我認為的一部分。

So that's contribution to, I would say, the TSR of the company, which is already one of the best of the -- if not the best is the number one or number two or number one, I think since December '23, December '24. So it's improving the TSR of TotalEnergies to be more attractive. That's the objective fundamentally of this move.

因此，我想說，這對該公司的TSR 做出了貢獻，它已經是最好的公司之一——如果不是最好的話，也是第一、第二或第一，我認為自12 月23 日以來， 24.因此，它正在提高 TotalEnergies 的股東總回報 (TSR)，使其更具吸引力。這就是此舉的根本目標。

Thanks very much, Patrick. Thank you.

非常感謝，派崔克。謝謝。

Matt Lofting, JPMorgan.

馬特‧洛夫廷，摩根大通。

Hi, thanks for taking the questions. Two please, if I could. First, just coming back to the longer-term growth proposition of the company. I think you highlighted earlier some of the strides that you've made during the first half of the year in advancing projects and strategic execution.

您好，感謝您提出問題。如果可以的話，請給我兩個。首先，回到公司的長期成長主張。我認為您早些時候強調了今年上半年在推動專案和策略執行方面取得的一些進展。

If you think about in the context of oil and gas growth, 2% to 3% CAGR to '28 or the 4% energy production growth to 2030. How significant is the derisking of those objectives being through the last sort of six months, nine months, and what sort of key projects apart from Suriname outstanding for the second half of the year?

如果你考慮石油和天然氣成長的背景，到28 年複合年增長率為2% 到3%，或到2030 年能源產量成長4%。去風險有多重要。

And then secondly, I wanted to just come back on gas and LNG. I think in the press release this morning, you called out sort of strength around sort of China and India from a demand perspective? To what degree does TotalEnergies see that strength is seasonal versus structural? Thank you.

其次，我想重新使用天然氣和液化天然氣。我想在今天早上的新聞稿中，您從需求角度強調了中國和印度的實力？ TotalEnergies 在多大程度上認為力量是季節性的而不是結構性的？謝謝。

Okay. On the first one, thank you for the question first. So I think, again, we set this objective for the next five years in September '23, 2% to 3% renew, and we were very clear that the number of projects we had to sanction. And I think we've done a lot. I think most of the work has been done during the first six months. It's important because for us, it's clear, but it's a way to capture quickly, of course, and not to see more inflation coming tomorrow. So it was a key priority. So we have the two projects in Brazil. The one in Angola. Suriname will come soon again.

好的。關於第一個問題，首先謝謝你的提問。所以我認為，我們在 23 年 9 月再次設定了未來五年的目標，即 2% 到 3% 的更新，我們非常清楚我們必須批准的項目數量。我認為我們已經做了很多。我認為大部分工作已經在前六個月內完成。這很重要，因為對我們來說，這是明確的，但當然，這是一種快速捕獲的方法，並且不會看到明天出現更多的通貨膨脹。所以這是一個關鍵的優先事項。我們在巴西有兩個項目。那個在安哥拉。蘇利南很快就會再來。

So I would say -- and you had also a part -- if I could add that on Iraq, we are also progressing, but the other one on which we progress quickly to go to the first phase of Iraq. So that’s for the oil. On the LNG, we postponed P&G, Papua LNG, because it was too expensive, so not be volume driven. But we had the opportunity to sanction Marsa LNG to rebound.

所以我想說——你們也有參與——如果我可以補充一點，在伊拉克問題上，我們也在取得進展，但在另一個問題上，我們進展很快，進入了伊拉克問題的第一階段。這就是石油。在液化天然氣方面，我們推遲了寶潔公司、巴布亞液化天然氣項目，因為它太貴了，所以不以銷售為導向。但我們有機會制裁 Marsa LNG 反彈。

But we just joined the Ruwais LNG projects for 10%. So all that being less. So we have multiple options in the portfolio. And so I’m very confident to deliver this cash flow. But I’m even more confident in July '24 and September '23 because most of the work of sanction has been done. And so it’s progressing.

但我們剛剛加入了魯維斯液化天然氣計畫的 10%。所以這一切都更少了。所以我們的投資組合中有多種選擇。因此，我對交付這筆現金流非常有信心。但我對 24 年 7 月和 23 年 9 月更有信心，因為大部分制裁工作已經完成。所以它正在取得進展。

And again, I think in September, in October, October 2, I said September, it’s October 2 in New York. Of course, it will be part of the presentation to update you on the progress to this objective of 2% to 3% and even again to speak to you about up to 2030, because we have a portfolio which is rich and so we can -- we are confident about the growth we can deliver by this timeline. So that’s the point.

再說一遍，我想在 9 月、10 月、10 月 2 日，我說的是 9 月，在紐約是 10 月 2 日。當然，這將是演示的一部分，向您介紹實現 2% 至 3% 目標的最新進展，甚至再次與您談論到 2030 年的情況，因為我們擁有豐富的投資組合，因此我們可以 - - 我們對在此期限內實現的成長充滿信心。這就是重點。

So Suriname is a big one. Honestly, I think we are -- is the main one which will come in 2024, I think, in May. And Iraq Phase 1, we're going to 110,000 barrels per day, which is progressing very quickly as well. And by the way, very well. So the teams are doing an excellent job in Iraq.

所以蘇利南是一個大國家。老實說，我認為我們將在 2024 年 5 月實現這一目標。伊拉克第一階段，我們的產量將達到每天 11 萬桶，進展也非常快。順便說一下，非常好。所以這些團隊在伊拉克做得非常好。

On the LNG, India, China strength, it is -- no, I think you see something more fundamental in India. The investment -- you see an industry demand in India, in fact, coming. Indian government has really, I would say, invested in some gas infrastructure around the country. And you have more and more industries, not only refineries but others who are going to come to LNG into gas.

就液化天然氣、印度和中國的實力而言，不，我認為你在印度看到了一些更根本的東西。事實上，你會看到印度的投資需求正在到來。我想說，印度政府確實投資了全國各地的一些天然氣基礎設施。而且越來越多的產業，不僅是煉油廠，還有其他將液化天然氣轉化為天然氣的產業。

And I think it’s a trend even surprisingly at higher price than before '21. In '21, I think I answered questions, tell you that in India, it’s difficult to sell beyond $6, $7 per million Btu. In fact, we continue to develop the business it’s $9, $10, per MMBtu.

我認為這種趨勢甚至令人驚訝，而且價格比 21 年前更高。在 21 年，我想我回答了一些問題，告訴你，在印度，每百萬英熱單位的售價很難超過 6、7 美元。事實上，我們仍在繼續開發每 MMBtu 9 美元、10 美元的業務。

So I think there is a fundamental structural demand coming from India, and we are convinced that the Indian market will take the relay I would say, for the traditional, Korea, Japan, and even China. On China, probably it’s more seasonal today. I think is because there are already a lot of infrastructure. China is moving very quickly on these renewables, continue to increase its coal production.

因此，我認為印度存在著根本性的結構性需求，我們相信印度市場將接力傳統市場、韓國、日本甚至中國的接力棒。在中國，今天可能更具季節性。我認為是因為已經有很多基礎建設了。中國在這些再生能源方面進展非常迅速，並持續增加煤炭產量。

And again, the gas is more driven by transportation like it was mentioned by UCaaS or by industries. So the gas demand, LNG demand in China is not really driven by power today because the power is mainly coal and renewables. So that’s -- but there are some decisions. So Chinese recently have again -- spoke again about the equivalent of ETS CO2 market. But today, it’s quite small and limited, but they want to expand it to all the industries.

再說一遍，天然氣更多是由運輸驅動的，就像 UCaaS 或工業所提到的。因此，目前中國的天然氣需求、液化天然氣需求並不是真正由電力驅動的，因為電力主要是煤炭和再生能源。所以那就是——但是有一些決定。因此，中國人最近再次談論了相當於 ETS 的二氧化碳市場。但如今，它的規模相當小且有限，但他們希望將其擴展到所有行業。

So this type of drivers could really have an impact. So we see more of the Chinese market growing thanks to LNG industry and transportation more than power, in fact, on the LNG. So honestly, I think today, we have 400 million ton market. It will become 600 million ton market. But this 50% of demand increase will be absorbed quickly in four, five years. I think part of it today will already being absorbed in Southeast Asia, if we are not constrained by supply, in fact.

所以這種類型的驅動程式確實會產生影響。因此，我們看到中國市場的成長更歸功於液化天然氣產業和運輸，而不是電力，事實上，主要是液化天然氣。老實說，我認為今天我們有 4 億噸的市場。將成為6億噸的市場。但這50%的需求成長將在四、五年內迅速被吸收。事實上，我認為，如果我們不受供應限制，今天其中的一部分已經被東南亞吸收。

Today, we are -- because I remind you that we took 50 million tons from Asia to Europe. And since 2022, we did not increase the LNG production. It’s quite stable. So this would be easy to do. So this growth will come, and we have also many more countries open to LNG, this year is Vietnam as a terminal, Philippines we have a terminal. So in fact, in Southeast Asia, most of the countries will have -- be able to receive LNG. So then -- and if you can think that you will have a good supply, so price will soften, it would even incentivize the demand and accelerate the demand by the end of this decade. So I think -- and it’s not just seasonal obviously for sure.

今天，我們——因為我提醒你們，我們從亞洲向歐洲運送了 5000 萬噸貨物。自2022年以來，我們沒有增加液化天然氣產量。它相當穩定。所以這很容易做到。所以這種成長將會到來，我們還有更多的國家對液化天然氣開放，今年是越南作為終端，菲律賓我們有一個終端。事實上，在東南亞，大多數國家都能夠接收液化天然氣。那麼，如果你認為供應充足，那麼價格就會走軟，甚至會刺激需求，並在本十年末加速需求。所以我認為——而且這顯然不僅僅是季節性的。

Super. Thanks very much.

極好的。非常感謝。

Henri Patricot, UBS.

亨利‧派崔克，瑞銀集團。

Yes. I want to thank you for the update. Two questions, please. Maybe the first one, just coming back on the cost. I was wondering if you can comment on the inflationary pressure that you’re seeing, you mentioned P&G, LNG, where we saw cost and then postponed the project that’s quite specific? Or are you seeing [for the, perhaps] inflationary pressure. And then secondly, just a quick question on the CapEx guidance for the year. And where should you expect the cash outflows related to acquisitions to be offset by cash inflows from disposals this year? Thank you.

是的。我想感謝您的更新。請教兩個問題。也許是第一個，只是收回成本。我想知道您能否對您所看到的通膨壓力發表評論，您提到了寶潔公司、液化天然氣公司，我們看到了成本，然後推遲了非常具體的項目？或者你是否看到[也許]通膨壓力。其次，我想問一個關於今年資本支出指導的簡單問題。您預計今年與收購相關的現金流出將在哪裡被出售的現金流入所抵銷？謝謝。

The first question, I know has nothing to add, there is an inflation in our industry versus a low point where we were in 2020. Today, I would say we are 20% higher in most of the costs. But at 20%, we can manage it, and that’s why we can sanction our projects like the ones we have done, even if you can also take some innovative measures like making (inaudible) in order to manage these costs for the future.

第一個問題，我知道沒有什麼可補充的，與 2020 年的低點相比，我們這個行業出現了通貨膨脹。但在 20% 的情況下，我們可以管理它，這就是為什麼我們可以像我們所做的那樣批准我們的項目，即使您也可以採取一些創新措施，例如製作（聽不清楚）來管理這些成本未來。

Having said that Papua LNG probably a form of specificity because it’s isolated projects in I would say remote areas not many project by part. So probably as we said this before, we consulted additional western I would say suppliers. They are not really interested. There are some limited visuals. They think they could deliver more margins for them to make the project in the US and one in Papua. So what we are doing is looking to -- we have decided to go to a larger, I would say, supply over suppliers, in particular, Asian ones, India and Chinese.

話雖如此，巴布亞液化天然氣可能是一種特殊形式，因為它是偏遠地區的孤立項目，我想說的是，沒有太多項目是單獨進行的。因此，正如我們之前所說，我們諮詢了其他西方供應商。他們並不是真的感興趣。有一些有限的視覺效果。他們認為可以為他們在美國和巴布亞製作一個項目提供更多的利潤。因此，我們正在做的是尋求——我想說，我們決定擴大供應商的供應量，特別是亞洲供應商、印度和中國的供應商。

So we could have -- I think we should be able to come back to something more CapEx, which would be reasonable in this environment. But again, by the way, another point is that it was an inflation, but today, it’s more stabilizing in fact. Because, for example, in the rig market, in the drilling market, you begin the drilling contractors because we are facing also some supply chain equipment program.

所以我們可以——我認為我們應該能夠回歸更多的資本支出，這在這種環境下是合理的。但順便說一句，另一點是，這是通貨膨脹，但今天，它實際上更加穩定。因為，例如，在鑽孔機市場，在鑽井市場，你開始鑽井承包商，因為我們也面臨一些供應鏈設備計畫。

So it does not impact -- there is still some rigs which are not used in fact. So it’s -- so in fact, we don’t have -- they don’t have the full value chain, the full supply chain ready to execute also they would like to. So yes, there is inflation, but we manage it. And we’ll come back on that topic as well in the beginning of October.

所以它不會產生影響——實際上仍然有一些設備沒有被使用。所以，事實上，我們沒有──他們沒有完整的價值鏈、完整的供應鏈，他們也沒有準備好要執行。所以，是的，確實存在通貨膨脹，但我們控制住了它。我們也會在 10 月初再次討論這個主題。

The second one, yes, we already gave a guidance of $17 billion, $18 billion of net CapEx. And this will be, again, as Jean-Pierre told you, we reiterate this guidance. And I would say last year, for the five years business plan, we gave you $16 billion, $18 billion, I remember them well. And I would be surprised that we will not confirm $16 billion, $18 billion on October 2.

第二個，是的，我們已經給了 170 億美元、180 億美元淨資本支出的指引。正如讓-皮埃爾告訴您的那樣，我們將再次重申這一指導方針。我想說，去年，對於五年商業計劃，我們給了你們 160 億美元、180 億美元，我記得很清楚。令我驚訝的是，我們不會在 10 月 2 日確認 160 億美元、180 億美元。

Okay. And (inaudible) CapEx point you should be also within that range.

好的。 （聽不清楚）資本支出點也應該在這個範圍內。

Okay.

好的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Paul Cheng, Scotiabank.

Paul Cheng，豐業銀行。

Hi. Good morning. Two questions, please. I think this -- the first one is for Jean-Pierre. In your press release, you said the Integrated Power result was impacted by some seasonality like in Europe, on your Chesapeake seasonal demand. Can you help us to understand that how big is that impact? And maybe in general that what type of other visible seasonal pattern we should expect in the Integrated Power business for you? Second question, I think this is for Patrick. Any update for business? Thank you.

你好。早安.請教兩個問題。我認為第一個是給讓皮耶的。在您的新聞稿中，您表示綜合電力結果受到某些季節性因素的影響，例如歐洲的切薩皮克季節性需求。您能幫助我們了解這種影響有多大嗎？也許總的來說，我們應該在您的綜合電力業務中期待什麼類型的其他可見季節性模式？第二個問題，我想這是問派崔克的。業務有更新嗎？謝謝。

The main driver behind my comment is in relation with the CCGT that are less used in summer for obvious reasons compared to winter.

我的評論背後的主要驅動力與 CCGT 有關，與冬季相比，由於明顯的原因，CCGT 在夏季使用較少。

(multiple speakers)

（多個發言者）

Can you quantify, how big is that impact? And also other than that, is there any other seasonal pattern in the other quarters that we should be aware?

您能量化一下，影響有多大嗎？除此之外，其他季度還有其他我們應該注意的季節性模式嗎？

No. We are young in the Integrated Power. So we don't have enough long history of results to answer precisely to your question. So we just -- we have to explain why 500 is a little lower than the previous quarter. And when we look to the figures, one of the main explanation was just that the gas. The gas park power plant level of use in Europe was very low, less than 10% compared to something around 40%. So that's one explanation. And the first explanation is this one. Okay.

不，我們在綜合電力領域還很年輕。因此，我們沒有足夠長的歷史結果來準確回答您的問題。所以我們必須解釋為什麼 500 比上一季略低。當我們查看這些數字時，主要的解釋之一就是氣體。歐洲天然氣園區發電廠的使用水準非常低，不到 10%，約為 40%。這是一種解釋。第一個解釋就是這個。好的。

Now media, I mean, on business, just to tell you, we have, again, finished the appraisal of business. Now, we have some reserves. We are now working on the development scheme. As you know, we have been quite clear with you is positive. We have a lot of oil, but there is also from gas.

現在媒體，我的意思是，關於業務，只是告訴你，我們再次完成了業務評估。現在，我們有一些儲備。我們現在正在製定開發計劃。如您所知，我們已經向您明確表示這是正面的。我們有很多石油，但也有天然氣。

So the question will be can we find a way to develop this oil pool managing the gas and, I would say, reinjection in an economic way because, of course, all that end needs to fix the criteria of breakeven less than $30 per barrel or of course, less than $20. Our engineers are working on it. It's a little more complex to develop business than value in Suriname to be clear, because there is -- the gas quantity to manage is larger.

因此，問題是我們能否找到一種方法來開發這個油池，以經濟的方式管理天然氣和回注，因為當然，所有這一切都需要將盈虧平衡的標準確定為每桶低於 30 美元，或者當然，不到20美元。我們的工程師正在努力解決這個問題。需要明確的是，在蘇利南發展業務比價值複雜一些，因為需要管理的天然氣量更大。

But I think we have a clear -- it's a clear objective to the teams to deliver some value. And so we'll update you today. The agenda is again by end of '20 -- we are in mid '24, by end of '25 to have clarity probably before to say what -- where we are with this development. So we are working on it.

但我認為我們有一個明確的目標——為團隊提供一些價值。所以我們今天會向您通報最新情況。議程再次是在 20 年底之前 - 我們在 24 年中期，到 25 年底之前可能會清楚地說出什麼 - 我們目前的進展。所以我們正在努力。

Patrick, that -- we know there's a lot of gas, as you mentioned. But other than that, is the geological structure is complex or that is more straightforward, say contained to Suriname or Guyana.

派崔克，正如你所提到的，我們知道有很多天然氣。但除此之外，地質結構是複雜的還是更簡單的，例如蘇利南或圭亞那。

On business, I would say, I know the comments of one of my peers will say there is a lot of heterogeneity, difficult to find an oil pool. We have the oil pool. Of course, we have a core the pool, which is a better quality, like always in all the fields that I know sometime in the industry. And then you have the France of the pool, which are degraded quality, but it's always like that. But I think we have the pool.

在商業上，我會說，我知道我的一位同行的評論會說存在很多異質性，很難找到石油池。我們有油池。當然，我們有一個核心池，它的品質更好，就像我在行業中了解的所有領域一樣。然後是法國的泳池，品質下降了，但總是這樣。但我認為我們有游泳池。

The question is more, again, the capacity management of the -- so we have a pool of oil, which is big enough to make a development. The question is to manage with acceptable costs, all the gas, which will come with the oil and to be able to reinject it in the company in good conditions, knowing that we are, I remind you about few thousand-meter -- 3,000 meter water depth.

問題更多的是——我們有一個石油池，它足夠大，可以進行開發。問題是以可接受的成本管理所有的天然氣，這些天然氣將隨石油一起提供，並能夠在良好的條件下將其重新註入公司，我提醒您大約幾千米至 3,000 米水深。

So it's not -- it's part of the challenge. The more secure it is, the more expensive it will be. So that's a learning. So that's more now today for me, it's a question of [commercial] finding a way to make it profitable as for our criteria. And -- but I think I'm always optimistic, but I'm optimistic. So we have the right oil pool.

所以這不是——這是挑戰的一部分。越安全，就越貴。所以這就是一個學習。所以今天對我來說更重要的是，這是一個[商業]找到一種方法使其按照我們的標準盈利的問題。而且——但我認為我總是樂觀的，但我很樂觀。所以我們有合適的油池。

Very good. Thank you.

非常好。謝謝。

Bertrand Hodee, Kepler Cheuvreux.

伯特蘭霍迪，開普勒舍弗勒。

Thanks for taking my question. Two, if I may. First, on Suriname. Can you confirm and I just suppose your earlier comment points to an FID for 2024? But can you -- do you believe you can achieve still the $9 billion budget you've earlier penciled last year?

感謝您提出我的問題。如果可以的話，兩個。首先，關於蘇利南。您能否確認一下？但你能——你相信你還能實現去年稍早制定的 90 億美元預算嗎？

And the second question is on LNG. You've signed a 2 million ton long-term contracts to Asian customers, but you have taken a lot of offtake commitment in the last, let's say, 15 months including [Rio Grande] 5 billion tons QAC, QFS. And now, Ruwais. Do you have a target in terms of volumes you would like to secure on a long-term basis for Asian customers?

第二個問題是關於液化天然氣的。你們已經與亞洲客戶簽訂了一份 200 萬噸長期合同，但你們在過去（比如說 15 個月）中承擔了很多承購承諾，其中包括 [Rio Grande] 50 億噸 QAC、QFS。現在，魯韋斯。您是否有希望為亞洲客戶長期確保銷售的目標？

Okay. On the Suriname parts we are in the process to make the FID. So I don't have today the figure. What I can tell you is at the end, this development or the sanction because the cost CapEx or OpEx will be lower than $20 per barrel. But it's a strict criteri,a we are committed to it, so we'll meet that target. This is -- and if I say that is because I'm optimistic that we will achieve. So that's a point.

好的。對於蘇利南部分，我們正在製定最終投資決定。所以我今天沒有這個數字。我可以告訴你的是，最後，這項進展或製裁，因為資本支出或營運支出將低於每桶 20 美元。但這是一個嚴格的標準，我們致力於實現這一目標。如果我這麼說，是因為我對我們能夠實現的目標感到樂觀。這就是重點。

Secondly, on the LNG, okay, I described what we want to do. Fundamentally, we have some Henry Hub exposure. Part of it, we can resell Henry Hub. In particular, we have a good exposure. We have a good customer in South America, and they buy on Henry Hub basis. So this part Henry Hub to Henry Hub is fine for me. And then the rest of the Henry Hub, the objective is to be able to secure as much as we can on a brand basis and a medium -- long term medium, long-term basis we want to transform Henry Hub into Brent.

其次，關於液化天然氣，好吧，我描述了我們想要做的事情。從根本上說，我們有一些亨利中心的曝光。其中一部分，我們可以轉售亨利中心。特別是，我們有很好的曝光度。我們在南美洲有一個很好的客戶，他們是在亨利中心購買的。所以亨利中心到亨利中心的這一部分對我來說很好。然後是亨利樞紐的其餘部分，目標是能夠在品牌基礎和中長期基礎上盡可能確保我們希望將亨利樞紐轉變為布倫特原油。

So if we reach 100% perfect. And if we reach 80%, and 88% is a minimum we want to reach on this conversion, just to be clear. Because as we analyze the market to soften by the end of the decade, we want to protect the company, it's not necessary a 15, 20 years, you know, it's a question we could have also of five, seven years contract, which will help us to swallow a softer market and then to rebound.

所以如果我們達到100%完美。如果我們達到 80%，那麼 88% 是我們希望在此轉換中達到的最低值，需要明確的是。因為當我們分析到本世紀末市場將疲軟時，我們希望保護公司，沒有必要簽訂 15 年、20 年的合同，你知道，我們也可以簽訂 5 年、7 年的合同，這將幫助我們度過疲軟的市場，然後反彈。

So that's more the FID fundamentally. And it's true that what is behind is that my view and our view is that the oil market, because of OpEx position is probably more stable than the gas market from this perspective on medium, long term. So we are more bullish on the oil and on the Brent. And I would say, on some volatility we put have in this LNG market.

所以從根本上來說這更像是 FID。確實，我和我們的觀點是，從中長期角度來看，石油市場由於營運支出的地位可能比天然氣市場更穩定。因此，我們更加看好石油和布蘭特原油。我想說的是，我們在液化天然氣市場上存在一些波動。

Very clear. Thank you.

非常清楚。謝謝。

So we like the oil.

所以我們喜歡油。

Jean-Luc Romain, CIC Market Solutions.

Jean-Luc Romain，CIC 市場解決方案。

Thank you for taking my question. You have built an interesting value chain in Integrated Power in Texas. And in the last quarter, there have been very (inaudible) some very warm days. I was wondering how you can capture those. And the second question was you explained as your utilization rate for the European natural gas power plants was very low? Or was it in the US?

感謝您回答我的問題。您在德克薩斯州的 Integrated Power 中建立了一條有趣的價值鏈。在上個季度，有一些非常（聽不清楚）非常溫暖的日子。我想知道你如何捕捉這些。第二個問題你解釋你們歐洲天然氣發電廠的使用率很低？還是在美國？

No, I think on the contrary, we know that the gas-fired power plant that we have acquired. Most of their use is we need the climatization. It's the eating. It's IT wave. And the IT wave today in the US has been very strong in the last month. And so I think the results of the first quarter will be even better. So I can tell you, these gas plants are used at a very high rate today. So it was an excellent acquisitions. And by the way, they are used as they are driving the price at a point where the price of electricity is quite good. So that's really, I think, the demonstration.

不，我認為恰恰相反，我們知道我們已經收購了燃氣發電廠。它們的大部分用途是我們需要氣候化。就是吃東西。這是IT浪潮。今天美國的IT浪潮在上個月非常強勁。所以我認為第一季的業績會更好。所以我可以告訴你，這些天然氣工廠如今的使用率非常高。所以這是一次出色的收購。順便說一句，它們被使用是因為它們在電價相當好的情況下推動了價格。我認為這確實是一次演示。

And of course, we have some solar plants, we have some batteries and also, we can benefit with the batteries in the integration. So you will see the positive impact of this, I would say, flexible assets, I think, even more in the third quarter because the second quarter, I think we closed the deal. We don't have a full quarter yet. And by the way, the IT wave did not come in April, but a little later in June, July, et cetera. So that's clear, but it was clearing the model that when we study this acquisition, but -- so summertime was the best part of the year. We, by the way, it's compared to the wintertime in Europe, there is a sort of a counter seasonal effect between the Texas and Europe from this gas fire power plant point of view.

當然，我們有一些太陽能發電廠，我們有一些電池，而且我們可以從整合中的電池中受益。所以你會看到這一點的正面影響，我想說，靈活資產，我認為，在第三季甚至更多，因為我認為我們在第二季完成了交易。我們還沒有完整的季度。順便說一下，IT 浪潮並不是在 4 月到來，而是在稍晚的 6 月、7 月等。這很清楚，但是當我們研究這次收購時，它正在清除模型，但是 - 所以夏季是一年中最好的部分。順便說一句，與歐洲的冬季相比，從燃氣火力發電廠的角度來看，德克薩斯州和歐洲之間存在某種反季節效應。

Thank you very much.

非常感謝。

Jason Gabelman, TD Cowen.

賈森·加貝爾曼，TD·考恩。

Hey, thanks for squeezing me in. I wanted to ask two questions. The first one is on the gearing level. It was stable quarter-over-quarter. And I know you discussed an expectation it's going to decline. But I'm wondering if it stays at this level for longer? Or is there a level that it increases to that impacts the decisions around the distributions that you're paying out, specifically the buyback pace.

嘿，謝謝你擠我進來。第一個是槓桿水平。環比穩定。我知道你討論過它會下降的預期。但我想知道它是否會保持在這個水平更長的時間？或者是否會增加到一個水平，從而影響您所支付的分配的決策，特別是回購速度。

And then my other question is just on the quarter, we saw E&P OpEx move a few hundred million dollars higher quarter over quarter despite production being relatively flat. I was wondering what drove that, if that's structural or if that should reverse next quarter? Thanks.

我的另一個問題是關於本季的，我們看到勘探與生產營運支出環比增長了數億美元，儘管產量相對持平。我想知道是什麼推動了這種情況，這是結構性的還是下個季度會出現逆轉？謝謝。

The OpEx of E&P, we are lower than $5 per barrel. And I think I will come back to you, I think. On the gearing, no, monetary 10%, 8%, it has no impact on the decision on the buyback to be clear. So 10% gearing or 8% gearing, it's not making a difference. The 8% is more in, again, we had working capital build, which was quite big. We know there are some fiscal and other matters behind it. So we know that along the year, it will come back.

E&P 的營運支出低於每桶 5 美元。我想我會回到你身邊。關於槓桿率，不，貨幣10%、8%，這對回購決定沒有影響，這點要明確。因此，10% 的負債率或 8% 的負債率，沒有什麼區別。 8％更多的是我們建立的營運資金，這是相當大的。我們知道這背後有一些財政和其他問題。所以我們知道，這一年，它會回來。

So that's why Jean-Pierre do 8%. Last year, it was 6%, but the 5%, 6% was really exceptional from a very big working capital release, which is very exceptional. So for me -- but again, from the broad point of view, we don't make a difference from a buyback and return policy point of view, 8%, 10% 12%, et cetera. I think we are -- the balance sheet is strong enough to maintain that policy. More than 40%, it is what is driving us. More than 40% that --

這就是讓-皮埃爾選擇 8% 的原因。去年是6%，但是5%、6%確實是非常特殊的，因為流動資金釋放非常大，這是非常特別的。所以對我來說——但同樣，從廣泛的角度來看，我們從回購和退貨政策的角度來看沒有什麼區別，8%、10%、12% 等等。我認為我們的資產負債表足夠強大，足以維持這項政策。超過40%，這是我們的動力。超過 40% 的人認為——

Is there a gearing level?

有槓桿水平嗎？

No. It's more than 40% payout. That's the objective.

不，支付率超過 40%。這就是目標。

Okay. Thanks.

好的。謝謝。

Yeah. No, just -- I have the answer to your OpEx question more precisely. My team wrote me on the paper, but in fact, it's linked to some seasonal. We have some turnaround, I think, in the UK and Denmark, we have some more work programs of seasonal effect in the North Sea generally in the second quarter. That's the reason why.

是的。不，只是——我對您的營運支出問題有更準確的答案。我的團隊在紙上給我寫了一封信，但實際上，這與一些季節性有關。我認為，在英國和丹麥，我們有一些轉變，我們在北海通常在第二季有更多季節性影響的工作計劃。這就是原因。

But no, honestly, there is no monthly inflation. We'll be able to deliver less than that of our OpEx between today and the competitors we will maintain this OpEx of $5 per barrel until the end of the decade, it's deeply rooted in the portfolio and in the projects in which we invest.

但老實說，不存在每月通貨膨脹。我們將能夠交付比今天和競爭對手更少的營運支出，我們將維持每桶 5 美元的營運支出，直到本世紀末，它深深植根於我們投資的投資組合和專案中。

Great. Thanks.

偉大的。謝謝。

This was the last question. Back to you for any closing remarks you may have.

這是最後一個問題。如果您有任何結束語，請回覆您。

So thank you again. I think, again, this quarter, I think we have delivered our road map for the year. As I insisted, we have made a lot of progress on our, I would say, on our strategy and the execution of our growth from '23 to 2028. And we'll be able to demonstrate to you how the portfolio is growing, but also it's resilient to the volatility both -- it's fundamentally to drive the strategy to the volatility of optimization of costs, et cetera. And so I wish we will all meet met on October 2 in New York in the morning so that we could have some discussions and presentations. So thank you. I wish you all good holidays and happy to meet you in New York.

所以再次感謝你。我再次認為，本季我們已經交付了今年的路線圖。正如我所堅持的那樣，我想說的是，我們在策略和執行 23 年至 2028 年增長方面取得了很大進展。彈性－從根本上推動策略調適成本優化等波動。因此，我希望我們能夠在 10 月 2 日上午在紐約會面，以便進行一些討論和演示。所以謝謝。祝大家假期愉快，很高興在紐約見到你們。

Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes the conference call. Thank you all for your participation. You may now disconnect.

女士們、先生們，電話會議到此結束。感謝大家的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。