Telefonica SA (TEF) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good morning. Thank you for standing by, and welcome to Telefonica's January-March 2025 results conference call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, today's conference is being recorded.

早安.感謝您的支持，歡迎參加西班牙電信 2025 年 1 月至 3 月業績電話會議。（操作員指示）提醒一下，今天的會議正在被錄音。

I would now like to turn the conference call over to Mr. Torsten Achtmann, Director of Investor Relations. Please go ahead, sir.

現在，我想將電話會議交給投資者關係總監 Torsten Achtmann 先生。先生，請繼續。

Good morning, and welcome to Telefonica's conference call to discuss January to March 2025 results. I'm Torsten Achtmann from Investor Relations.

早安，歡迎參加西班牙電信的電話會議，討論 2025 年 1 月至 3 月的業績。我是投資者關係部門的 Torsten Achtmann。

Before proceeding, let me mention that the financial information contained in this document has been prepared under International Financial Reporting Standards as adopted by the European Union. This financial information is unaudited.

在繼續之前，我要提一下，本文件中包含的財務資訊是根據歐盟採用的國際財務報告準則編制的。此財務資訊未經審計。

This conference call and webcast, including the Q&A session, may contain forward-looking statements and information relating to the Telefonica Group. These statements may include financial or operating forecasts and estimates or statements regarding plans, objectives and expectations regarding different matters.

本次電話會議和網路廣播（包括問答環節）可能包含與西班牙電信集團相關的前瞻性陳述和資訊。這些聲明可能包括財務或營運預測和估計或有關不同事項的計劃、目標和期望的聲明。

All forward-looking statements involve risks and uncertainties that could cause the final developments and results to materially differ from those expressed or implied by such statements. We encourage you to review our publicly available disclosure documents filed with the relevant securities market regulators. If you don't have a copy of the relevant press release and the slides, please contact Telefonica's Investor Relations team in Madrid or London.

所有前瞻性陳述都涉及風險和不確定性，這可能導致最終發展和結果與此類陳述所表達或暗示的內容有重大差異。我們鼓勵您查看我們向相關證券市場監管機構提交的公開揭露文件。如果您沒有相關新聞稿和幻燈片的副本，請聯絡馬德里或倫敦的西班牙電信投資者關係團隊。

Now let me turn the call over to our Chief Operating Officer, Mr. Emilio Gayo.

現在，讓我將電話轉給我們的營運長艾米利奧·加約先生。

Good morning, and thank you for joining the call, my first call with the financial community. With me today are Laura Abasolo, Markus Haas, Lutz Schuler and Eduardo Navarro.

早安，感謝大家參加電話會議，這是我與金融界的第一次電話會議。今天和我一起的有 Laura Abasolo、Markus Haas、Lutz Schuler 和 Eduardo Navarro。

Welcome, everyone. It's a pleasure to have you here. I'd like to, please -- I'd like to start this call by highlighting our progress in operations, especially along our three main pillars: customer engagement; network transformation; and efficiency.

歡迎大家。很高興您能來。我想——我想先強調一下我們在營運方面取得的進展，特別是在我們的三大支柱方面：客戶參與度；網路轉型；和效率。

First, customer engagement. I am proud to report that we continue to excel in this area, with NPS score reaching new highs. Spain continues to lead the market, while Brazil and Germany show a strong and consistent improvement, a clear sign of our competitive strength.

首先，客戶參與。我很自豪地報告，我們在這一領域繼續表現出色，NPS 分數創下新高。西班牙繼續引領市場，而巴西和德國則表現出強勁而持續的進步，這清楚地表明了我們的競爭實力。

Our portfolio of products and services also continues to improve while we maintain focus on customer care. We have an outstanding market position of our digital ecosystem in Spain and Brazil. This allows for a very low level of churn and a differential ARPU.

在我們繼續關注客戶服務的同時，我們的產品和服務組合也在不斷改進。我們的數位生態系統在西班牙和巴西擁有卓越的市場地位。這使得客戶流失率和 ARPU 差異化達到非常低的水平。

Next, fiber and 5G. We rolled out fiber to over 1.5 million premises in the last three months, and we've reached 75% 5G coverage in our core markets. Our networks are virtualized, more efficient and flexible and more reliable.

接下來是光纖和5G。過去三個月，我們向超過 150 萬戶家庭鋪設了光纖，我們的核心市場已達到 75% 的 5G 覆蓋率。我們的網路是虛擬化的，更有效率、更靈活、更可靠。

Finally, efficiencies. We progressed in the sundown of legacy services with copper switch-off in Spain that will be completed this month. We shut down also 3G in Germany and 2G in Uruguay. In Hispam, we keep on executing our strategy and optimize our portfolio, including the sale of our operations in Argentina and Peru and the signing in Colombia in just three months.

最後，效率。我們在淘汰傳統服務方面取得了進展，西班牙的銅線關閉工作將於本月完成。我們也關閉了德國的 3G 網路和烏拉圭的 2G 網路。在 Hispam，我們繼續執行我們的策略並優化我們的投資組合，包括出售我們在阿根廷和秘魯的業務以及在短短三個月內在哥倫比亞簽約。

All of this shows that we continue to execute. We want to speed up this execution across businesses with an industrial rationale, accelerate financial flexibility and simplification and operate under technology and operational excellence.

所有這些都表明我們會繼續執行。我們希望以行業理念加快整個企業的執行速度，加速財務靈活性和簡化性，並在技術和卓越營運下運作。

In parallel, we have started a strategic review, which we expect to complete and share with you in the second half of the year. Please give us time to conclude this review and focus for now on the business operating performance.

同時，我們已經開始了策略審查，預計將在今年下半年完成並與大家分享。請給我們時間來完成這次審查，現在專注於業務營運績效。

Moving to slide 3. Our core businesses showed a strong performance. In Spain, growth accelerated across key commercial and financial metrics. The robust combination of our strong brands, best-in-class infrastructure, a matched portfolio and powerful channels continue to deliver strong results.

移至幻燈片 3。我們的核心業務表現強勁。在西班牙，主要商業和金融指標均加速成長。我們強大的品牌、一流的基礎設施、匹配的產品組合和強大的管道的強大組合繼續帶來強勁的業績。

In Brazil, momentum remains steady. Our leadership in the market remains intact, with a strong growth in mobile contract and fiber accesses. FX is impacting our reported accounts, but in local currency, we continue to grow clearly above inflation.

在巴西，發展動能依然穩定。我們在市場上的領導地位依然穩固，行動合約和光纖接入業務強勁成長。外匯影響了我們的報告帳戶，但以當地貨幣計算，我們的成長持續明顯高於通貨膨脹率。

In Germany, operating cash profitability remains strong, showing our efficiency focus. We have made changes to our Hispam portfolio as we continue to further reduce our exposure, and we are determined to progress in this direction.

在德國，經營現金獲利能力依然強勁，體現了我們注重效率。隨著我們繼續進一步減少風險敞口，我們對 Hispam 產品組合進行了調整，並決心朝這個方向前進。

Our main financial metrics are impacted by intense competition in the different markers and by ForEx in reported terms. Despite this, it is worth mentioning the growth in contract net adds in Q1, which we are seeing for the first time since Q4 '23. At group level, reported results were negatively affected by ForEx. However, in organic terms, we are growing in main metrics, and comps will ease around the year.

我們的主要財務指標受到不同市場的激烈競爭以及外匯報告的影響。儘管如此，值得一提的是，第一季合約淨增額有所增長，這是自23年第四季以來我們首次看到這種成長。從集團層級來看，報告結果受到了 ForEx 的負面影響。然而，從有機角度來看，我們的主要指標正在成長，而全年的年成長率將會放緩。

I'd like to highlight the differential growth of B2B, 5.4% year-on-year.

我想強調B2B的差異化成長，年增5.4%。

Finally, net debt has decreased. Free cash flow is affected by seasonality in Q1.

最後，淨債務減少了。自由現金流在第一季受到季節性的影響。

In summary, our core business, Spain, Brazil and Germany, continues to show resilience across all key metrics while, at the same time, we are reducing our exposure in Hispam.

總而言之，我們的核心業務，西班牙、巴西和德國，繼續在所有關鍵指標上表現出韌性，同時，我們正在減少在西班牙垃圾郵件中的曝光率。

Moving to slide 4. Here, we can show that we are on track to meet 2025 guidance in all financial metrics at constant perimeter, with Q1 results being fully aligned with internal expectations. In fact, we expect our performance to improve as the year progressed, as can be seen during the year, and operational trends continue our progress. As such, we can fully reiterate our 2025 outlook.

移至幻燈片 4。在這裡，我們可以證明，我們預計在恆定週長下實現所有財務指標的 2025 年指導目標，並且第一季的業績完全符合內部預期。事實上，我們預計我們的業績會隨著時間的推移而改善，正如今年所見，並且營運趨勢繼續取得進步。因此，我們可以充分重申我們對 2025 年的展望。

Revenue, EBITDA and EBITDAaL minus CapEx will grow in organic terms with CapEx to sales continue to decline. Free cash flow will be similar to the figures posted in 2024. We expect a lower leverage despite the temporary increase in Q1, which is mostly driven by ForEx and working capital seasonality. We also confirm 2025 cash dividend.

收入、EBITDA 和 EBITDAaL 減去資本支出將有機成長，而資本支出與銷售額之比將繼續下降。自由現金流將與 2024 年公佈的數字相似。儘管第一季槓桿率暫時上升，但我們預計會下降，這主要是受外匯和營運資本季節性的影響。我們也確認了2025年的現金股利。

Moving to slide 5. We view the start of the year in our domestic market. Telefonica Spain commercial and financial performance continued to improve in the first quarter of the year. We have a strong commercial momentum. Q1 net adds were above Q1 '24 level, and we delivered customer growth in all accesses for our seventh quarter in a row.

移至投影片 5。我們認為今年的開局是國內市場。西班牙電信公司今年第一季的商業和財務業績持續改善。我們擁有強勁的商業勢頭。第一季淨增客戶數量高於 2024 年第一季的水平，且我們連續第七個季度實現了所有接入方式的客戶成長。

TV net adds were the best in more than six years. The growth in B2C is being driven by our cemented and flexible offering, an attractive ecosystem with a very positive performance and our focus on customer care and service excellence.

電視淨增幅創六年來新高。B2C 業務的成長得益於我們穩固而靈活的產品、具有非常積極表現的極具吸引力的生態系統以及我們對客戶關懷和卓越服務的關注。

I would like to highlight the increase in devices sold and the performance of Movistar Prosegur Alarmas, which is the second largest player in the alarms market in Spain. All this means Telefonica Spain has the best churn and ARPU compared with our competitors in the convergence market.

我想強調的是 Movistar Prosegur Alarmas 的設備銷售量的成長和其出色的業績，該公司是西班牙警報市場的第二大參與者。這一切意味著，與融合市場的競爭對手相比，西班牙電信西班牙公司擁有最佳的客戶流失率和 ARPU。

We have also seen strong growth in B2B fostered by double-digit growth IT sales in the corporate segment. These sales are thanks to our cutting-edge knowledged and highly experienced sales force, combined with the extension of long-term contracts with large enterprises.

我們也看到，受企業部門 IT 銷售額兩位數成長的推動，B2B 業務也實現了強勁成長。這些銷售得益於我們知識淵博、經驗豐富的銷售隊伍，以及與大型企業簽訂的長期合約。

Wholesale revenues declined in Q1 as was already anticipated. Nevertheless, the new long-term agreements signed in 2024 give stability to this revenue flow. As a result, domestic revenue grew by 1.7% year-on-year, with EBITDAaL accelerating by 1% quarter-on-quarter.

正如預期的那樣，第一季批發收入出現下降。儘管如此，2024 年簽署的新長期協議為這項收入流帶來了穩定性。因此，國內營收年增 1.7%，EBITDAaL 環比成長 1%。

On top of that, the reduction in CapEx led to a 2% improvement in operating cash flow generation. Let me say that our best practice CapEx to sales does not come at the expense of network coverage or quality.

除此之外，資本支出的減少導致經營現金流產生了 2% 的成長。我想說的是，我們最佳實踐的銷售資本支出並不會以犧牲網路覆蓋率或品質為代價。

We have passed 1.3 million premises with fiber in the last year, and we have already activated standalone across the 5G network. All this means advanced functionalities to our customers. In summary, a strong performance with an outstanding set of commercial and financial KPIs.

去年，我們的光纖覆蓋範圍已超過 130 萬戶，並且已經在整個 5G 網路上啟動了獨立運作。這一切對我們的客戶來說意味著先進的功能。總而言之，我們表現出色，擁有出色的商業和財務 KPI。

Turn to Slide 6. Telefonica Brazil again showed solid commercial momentum, remaining a leader in both postpaid and fiber. Vivo reached the largest customer base in its history. Vivo Total, our market-leading full bundle, grew 77% in accesses year-on-year. In addition, digital services penetration accelerated, reaching more than 11% of total revenue, thanks to our ecosystem of services.

翻到幻燈片 6。西班牙電信巴西公司再次展現出強勁的商業勢頭，在後付費和光纖領域保持領先地位。Vivo 擁有了史上最大的客戶群。我們市場領先的全套服務 Vivo Total 的訪客人數較去年同期成長了 77%。此外，由於我們的服務生態系統，數位服務滲透率加快，達到總收入的 11% 以上。

Revenue rose 6% above inflation due to the double-digit growth of our flagship services. This was driven by higher ARPU growth in mobile contract and fiber accesses, acceleration in digital services and a strong B2B performance.

由於我們的旗艦服務實現了兩位數的成長，收入比通貨膨脹率高出了 6%。這是由於行動合約和光纖接入的 ARPU 成長、數位服務的加速以及強勁的 B2B 表現所推動的。

Prepaid to postpaid migration is leading to ARPU growth and improved customer satisfaction. We are capturing an increasing share of wallet, thanks to our differential portfolio, ranging from connectivity to digital solutions. Despite this commercial boost, we achieved a 14.5% increase in EBITDAaL minus CapEx with margin expansion.

預付費到後付費的轉變正在帶來 ARPU 的成長和客戶滿意度的提高。由於我們涵蓋從連接到數位解決方案的差異化產品組合，我們正在獲得越來越大的市場份額。儘管商業業務有所成長，但我們的 EBITDAaL 減去資本支出仍實現了 14.5% 的成長，利潤率也有所擴大。

Finally, in April, we formalized agreement with ANATEL to migrate to the authorization regime. This is an important step that will enable greater business transformation and deliver positive commercial and financial impacts, thanks to an improved service quality to corporate customers, OpEx reduction and asset sales. In summary, Brazil is performing solidly, and we expect to maintain these results throughout the year.

最終，在四月份，我們與 ANATEL 正式達成協議，遷移至授權制度。這是一個重要的舉措，透過提高對企業客戶的服務品質、降低營運成本和資產出售，將實現更大的業務轉型並產生積極的商業和財務影響。總而言之，巴西表現穩健，我們預計全年將維持這樣的成績。

Moving to slide 7. Telefonica Deutschland maintained a robust commercial momentum in mobile with year-on-year growth in contract net adds. This was achieved with B2B customer wins and a stronger B2B partnerships as well as the attractiveness of the O2 brand. Both ARPU and churn in O2 contracts remained stable as we continue to focus on operational leverage in a market with increased commercial and promotional activity.

移至幻燈片 7。西班牙電信德國公司在行動領域保持了強勁的商業勢頭，合約淨增量同比增長。這是透過贏得 B2B 客戶、建立更強大的 B2B 合作夥伴關係以及 O2 品牌的吸引力來實現的。由於我們持續專注於商業和促銷活動不斷增加的市場中的營運槓桿，O2 合約中的 ARPU 和客戶流失率均保持穩定。

In the fixed segment, ARPU increased by 5% year-on-year based on improved value mix due to the demand for higher speed packets. Revenue was impacted by headwinds related to the B2B combined with weaker handset sales. However, this is in line with market trends.

在固定業務領域，由於對更高速度資料包的需求增加，價值組合得到改善，因此 ARPU 同比增長了 5%。收入受到 B2B 相關不利因素以及手機銷售疲軟的影響。但這符合市場趨勢。

EBITDAal still faced difficult year-on-year comps. Nevertheless, efficiency gains, combined with successfully implemented growth initiatives, in both the consumer and partner businesses helped maintain a stable EBITDA margin year-on-year.

EBITDAal 年比仍面臨困難。儘管如此，消費者業務和合作夥伴業務的效率提升以及成功實施的成長計劃有助於維持同比穩定的 EBITDA 利潤率。

EBITDAal minus CapEx grew by 4.8% year-on-year. I'd also like to highlight that German regulator confirmed the five-year spectrum prolongation until 2030. In summary, Telefonica Deutschland remains focused on operational improvement while, at the same time, increasing efficiency.

EBITDAal 減去資本支出年增 4.8%。我還想強調的是，德國監管機構確認將頻譜延長五年至2030年。總而言之，Telefonica Deutschland 繼續專注於營運改進，同時提高效率。

Moving to slide 8. Now I'd like to update you on Virgin Media O2. In Q1, despite a tougher trading environment, we remain focused on delivering fast and reliable connectivity, while protecting customer value. We continue to invest in our UK networks and services, ensuring we remain in a good position for the future.

移至幻燈片 8。現在我想向大家介紹一下 Virgin Media O2 的最新情況。在第一季度，儘管貿易環境更加艱難，我們仍然專注於提供快速可靠的連接，同時保護客戶價值。我們將繼續投資英國的網路和服務，確保我們在未來保持良好的地位。

Our 5G population coverage reached 77%, and we expanded our fixed network footprint to over 18.4 million premises passed, of which 7 million are fiber homes. In mobile, contract churn remained stable at a low 1.1% year-on-year, proving that our efforts to increase customer retention are working.

我們的 5G 人口覆蓋率達到 77%，並將固定網路覆蓋範圍擴大到超過 1,840 萬戶，其中 700 萬戶為光纖家庭。在行動領域，合約流失率年比保持穩定在 1.1% 的低位，證明我們提高客戶保留率的努力正在發揮作用。

The achievement to [expressed] this portfolio with better airtime's rates and multi-SIM offerings. In our fifth consumer business, ARPU grew once again supported by our value strategy.

此產品組合的成就體現在更優的通話費率和多 SIM 卡服務。在我們的第五個消費者業務中，在我們的價值策略的支持下，ARPU 再次成長。

Revenue has begun to grow again, excluding handsets and ex fiber, which reflects the successful phasing of price increases into service revenue. This contributed to EBITDA growth, further supported by cost efficiencies.

不包括手機和光纖在內的收入已開始再次成長，這反映了價格上漲已成功分階段轉化為服務收入。這促進了 EBITDA 的成長，並進一步提高了成本效率。

EBITDAal minus CapEx grew by 15.2%, and the margin improved, reflecting CapEx seasonality. Finally, the NetCo sale process has been paused to assess the best path forward to create value, and nexfibre will build towards a cumulative 2.5 million homes in 2025.

EBITDAal 減去資本支出成長了 15.2%，利潤率有所提高，反映了資本支出的季節性。最後，NetCo 銷售流程已暫停，以評估創造價值的最佳途徑，nexfibre 將在 2025 年累計建造 250 萬套住宅。

In summary, in UK, the team is focused on value while it continues to progress in nexfibre and 5G rollout to capture growth opportunities.

總而言之，在英國，該團隊專注於價值，同時繼續在 nexfibre 和 5G 推廣方面取得進展，以抓住成長機會。

Next slide, please. In Hispam, we have accelerated the execution of our strategy in the last three months. We completed the sale of Telefonica Argentina for EUR1.2 billion in February, with simultaneous signing and closing, eliminating execution risk.

請看下一張投影片。在 Hispam，我們在過去三個月中加快了戰略的執行。我們於 2 月以 12 億歐元完成了對西班牙電信阿根廷公司的出售，同時簽署和交割，消除了執行風險。

We have also signed a binding agreement to sell Telefonica Colombia, pending regulatory approval and agreements with minority shareholders.

我們也簽署了出售西班牙電信哥倫比亞公司的具有約束力的協議，但需獲得監管部門的批准以及與少數股東的協議。

Finally, just last month, we completed the sale of Telefonica Peru, which helped us avoid future liabilities and financial needs while the consolidation improves free cash flow outlook and leverage of the group. In summary, these steps marked a strong progress in simplifying our footprint and are also indicative of our financial discipline.

最後，就在上個月，我們完成了對西班牙電信秘魯公司的出售，這有助於我們避免未來的負債和財務需求，同時合併改善了集團的自由現金流前景和槓桿率。總而言之，這些舉措標誌著我們在簡化足跡方面取得了重大進展，也顯示了我們的財務紀律。

Moving on to slide 10, staying with Hispam. I'd like to now focus on the operational and financial performance. We record positive net adds in mobile contracts, the first in five quarters, thanks to better results in Chile and the launch of Movistar and Tigo's single mobile network in Colombia.

繼續看幻燈片 10，繼續討論 Hispam。我現在想重點談談營運和財務表現。由於智利業績更好以及 Movistar 和 Tigo 在哥倫比亞推出的單一行動網絡，我們記錄了行動合約的正淨增值，這是五個季度以來的首次。

On the fixed side, fiber-to-the-home keeps advancing with 98% of broadband now on fiber. Revenues dropped 3.4% mainly due to sales of copper in Chile in Q1 '24. However, this growth was partially offset by a 5% growth in service revenue in Mexico. EBITDAal minus CapEx fell 31% due to lower EBITDA and higher lease costs due to the single network launch in Colombia.

在固定方面，光纖到戶不斷發展，目前 98% 的寬頻都是透過光纖實現的。營收下降 3.4%，主要原因是 24 年第一季智利的銅銷售。然而，這一增長被墨西哥服務收入 5% 的增長部分抵消。由於 EBITDA 較低以及哥倫比亞單一網路推出導致租賃成本上升，EBITDAal 減去資本支出後下降了 31%。

Summary, in Hispam, we are happy with how the execution of our strategy has accelerated in the last quarter, which has resulted in a significant reduction in invested capital since December 2019.

總而言之，在 Hispam，我們對上個季度策略執行的加速感到滿意，這導致自 2019 年 12 月以來投資資本大幅減少。

And finally, before I pass on to Laura, on slide 11, I'd like to talk about the performance of our transversal units, Telefonica Tech and Infra.

最後，在將演講交給勞拉之前，我想在第 11 張幻燈片上談談我們的橫向部門 Telefonica Tech 和 Infra 的表現。

Firstly, Telefonica Tech, the engine of our B2B segment. We help our customer with the digital transformation of their processes and businesses, leveraging our unique combination of leading professionals, leading technologies and the best platforms, all supported by a global ecosystem of market-leading partners.

首先，Telefonica Tech 是我們 B2B 部門的引擎。我們利用領先的專業人員、領先的技術和最佳平台的獨特組合，幫助客戶實現其流程和業務的數位轉型，並由全球領先的合作夥伴生態系統提供支援。

I am delighted to say that Telefonica Tech has increased revenue 6.6% year-on-year. Commercial activity continued to grow, led by the private sector with bookings up 7%. The 15% expansion in the commercial funnel and Telefonica Tech's strong market recognition as a global leader position it well to capture further growth.

我很高興地說，Telefonica Tech 的營收年增了 6.6%。商業活動持續成長，私營部門的預訂量增加了 7%。商業通路的 15% 擴張以及 Telefonica Tech 作為全球領導者的強大市場認可度使其能夠更好地實現進一步成長。

Secondly, Telefonica Infra. Our fiber cost footprint reached 29 million premise passed, including fiber pass in Spain. We recently closed the sale of our stake in Nabiax. And finally, our submarine cable company, Telxius, continues to show strong profitability.

其次是Telefonica Infra。我們的光纖成本足跡已達到 2,900 萬戶，其中包括西班牙的光纖。我們最近完成了 Nabiax 股份的出售。最後，我們的海底電纜公司 Telxius 繼續表現出強勁的獲利能力。

I will now hand over to Laura, who will guide you through the main financial topics.

現在我將把主題交給勞拉，她將指導您了解主要的財務主題。

Thank you, Emilio. Moving to slide 12. We expect free cash flow generation to accelerate throughout the year as free cash flow profile is back-end loaded and will be managed efficiently. Q1 is affected by regular seasonality.

謝謝你，埃米利奧。移至投影片 12。我們預計自由現金流的產生將在全年加速，因為自由現金流狀況是後端加載的並且將有效管理。Q1 受到常規季節性的影響。

Free cash flow from continuing operations totaled minus EUR205 million versus minus EUR13 million in the same period of 2024. The higher year-on-year decline is explained by higher seasonality in working capital, leases and financial payments.

持續經營產生的自由現金流總計負 2.05 億歐元，而 2024 年同期為負 1,300 萬歐元。年比下降幅度較大是因為營運資金、租賃和財務支付的季節性較強。

The year-on-year average depreciation of the Brazilian real also affected, but we continue with our hedging strategy who has proven successful, approximately 60% with a combination of natural hedges and active hedging. And as we commented in our full year results last February, free cash flow continued to be key for driving business performance.

巴西雷亞爾的同比平均貶值也產生了影響，但我們繼續執行已被證明成功的對沖策略，其中約 60% 是透過自然對沖和主動對沖相結合實現的。正如我們在去年 2 月的全年業績中所評論的那樣，自由現金流仍然是推動業務績效的關鍵。

Net financial debt has decreased by EUR0.1 billion in the first three months of the year, while our net debt to EBITDA ratio has increased to 2.67 times due to free cash flow seasonality in this quarter. As the year progresses, free cash flow will gain traction heading to our stated free cash flow target. Furthermore, our net debt will be reduced to EUR25.8 billion after the sale of Peru and the signing of the binding agreement of Colombia and just the consolidation of net debt.

今年前三個月，淨金融債務減少了1億歐元，而由於本季自由現金流的季節性影響，我們的淨債務與EBITDA比率上升至2.67倍。隨著時間的推移，自由現金流將逐漸接近我們既定的自由現金流目標。此外，在出售秘魯、簽署哥倫比亞具有約束力的協議以及合併淨債務後，我們的淨債務將減少至 258 億歐元。

We maintain an ample liquidity, which, together with the smooth maturity profile, allows us to cover their maturities over the next three years. And the average cost of debt has been reduced year-on-year from 3.64% in March '24 to 3.49% in March 2025.

我們保持充足的流動性，加上平穩的到期日結構，使我們能夠在未來三年內涵蓋這些債券的到期日。平均債務成本較去年同期下降，從2024年3月的3.64%降至2025年3月的3.49%。

Moving to slide 14. At Telefonica, we have a pragmatic approach to ESG. We work exclusively on those levers that reduce risk and deliver value. For example, on the environmental front, we are hedging our energy cost via renewables. 30% of group electricity consumption is now covered by PPAs.

移至投影片 14。在西班牙電信，我們對 ESG 採取務實的態度。我們專門致力於那些降低風險、創造價值的槓桿。例如，在環境方面，我們透過再生能源來對沖能源成本。目前，集團 30% 的電力消耗已由電力購買協議 (PPA) 覆蓋。

On the social side, we are connecting more people while providing secured services. For example, this quarter, we blocked 7.8 million cyber threats in Spain.

在社交方面，我們在提供安全服務的同時，也連結更多的人。例如，本季我們在西班牙阻止了 780 萬次網路威脅。

In terms of governance, all resolutions were approved at the last AGM, demonstrating shareholder confidence. Finally, our efforts have led to a positive socioeconomic contribution in the communities where we operate and are aligned with the United Nation's SDGs.

在治理方面，上次年度股東大會上所有決議均獲得批准，顯示了股東的信心。最後，我們的努力為我們所在的社區帶來了積極的社會經濟貢獻，並與聯合國的永續發展目標保持一致。

I will now hand back to Emilio, who will wrap up.

現在我將把發言權交還給艾米利奧，他將結束發言。

Thank you, Laura. So to conclude my presentation and before we open for questions, in the first quarter, we continued delivering and executing our strategy. Core units showed a solid performance. We keep on reducing our exposure to Hispam. This allows to relocate capital to core markets and core business while reducing leverage.

謝謝你，勞拉。因此，在我的演講結束之前，在我們開始提問之前，我們在第一季繼續交付和執行我們的策略。核心部門表現穩健。我們不斷減少接觸 Hispam 的機會。這使得資本能夠重新分配到核心市場和核心業務，同時降低槓桿。

In just three months, we execute the sales of Argentina and Peru and the signing of Colombia. We expect to persist on exploring options for all other markets in the region.

僅用三個月的時間，我們就完成了阿根廷、秘魯的銷售以及哥倫比亞的簽約。我們希望繼續探索該地區所有其他市場的選擇。

At the same time, we are focused on capturing further efficiencies. We are reiterating our annual guidance with better comps expected in the next quarters and, as usual, an acceleration in free cash flow generation along the year.

同時，我們致力於進一步提高效率。我們重申年度指導意見，預計下一季的業績將更好，並且像往常一樣，全年自由現金流的產生將加速。

We are delivering positive results that we have shared with you today, while we progress on our strategic reflection. This reflection is based on our guiding principles. First, customers are the core of everything we do. Second, technology and operational excellence are fundamental to our business. Third, we apply an industrial rationale to all our decision making. Fourth, our ultimate goal is to create value for all our stakeholders. All of this in a context where we believe that Europe will change. Our priority will be Europe, and we will maintain our leadership position in Brazil as a core market.

我們正在取得今天與大家分享的正面成果，同時我們的策略思考也在不斷進步。這種反思是基於我們的指導原則。首先，客戶是我們一切工作的核心。其次，技術和卓越營運對我們的業務至關重要。第三，我們將工業原理應用於所有決策。第四，我們的最終目標是為所有利害關係人創造價值。我們相信，這一切都發生在歐洲將會改變的背景下。我們的重點是歐洲，並將保持巴西作為核心市場的領導地位。

Thank you very much for your attention, and we are now ready to take your questions.

非常感謝您的關注，現在我們準備好回答您的問題。

Andrew Lee, Goldman Sachs.

高盛的 Andrew Lee。

I have heard your comments and heard about not asking around the strategic review. So going to try and tread the water on that a little bit. The first question was just on -- to Lutz and VMO2. You did the Daisy deal this week, but you've hit pause on the NetCo process ahead of the strategic review.

我聽到了您的評論，也聽說了不要詢問戰略評估。因此，我要嘗試稍微控制一下水勢。第一個問題是關於 Lutz 和 VMO2 的。本週你們完成了 Daisy 交易，但在策略評估之前你們暫停了 NetCo 流程。

On that NetCo decision to pause, obviously, you need to get going with fiber expansion plans. And so the question is, do you still see a capability to go after the buy element of your fiber expansion strategy in the coming months, i.e., you acquiring altnets? And how quickly can we see you starting to execute on that?

關於 NetCo 暫停的決定，顯然，您需要開始實施光纖擴展計劃。所以問題是，您是否仍然認為在未來幾個月內您有能力追求光纖擴展策略的購買要素，即收購 altnets？我們多久能看到您開始執行這個目標？

And then my second question was just on Spain. Again, Appreciate we have to wait for the strategic review, but there have been comments attributed to you in the press on the need to consolidate markets in order to strengthen TEF's position. In Spain, you're raising prices and growing, but not to the level of incumbents in concentrated markets elsewhere in Europe.

我的第二個問題是關於西班牙的。再次感謝我們必須等待策略評估，但媒體上已經有人評論需要整合市場以加強 TEF 的地位。在西班牙，價格在提高，市場也在成長，但還沒有達到歐洲其他集中市場現有企業的水平。

So the question is do you see that changing? Or is further inorganic effort required on your part? And I don't expect any specific comments, but can we assume that your thinking on consolidation in Spain would have to be limited to fixed line given Spanish mobile has only just consolidated from four to three players? Or do you not think you'll be involved in consolidation in Spain in any material way?

那麼問題是，您是否看到這種情況發生了變化？或者您需要付出進一步的無機努力？我並不期待任何具體的評論，但是，鑑於西班牙行動通訊剛從四家公司合併為三家公司，我們是否可以假設您對西班牙行動通訊整合的想法必須僅限於固定線路？或者您認為您不會以任何實質的方式參與西班牙的合併？

Should I go ahead, Emilio, with UK?

艾米利奧，我應該繼續和英國一起嗎？

Andrew, thank you very much for your questions. Regarding the Spain consolidation, we can't comment any specific operation. Our priority in Spain is to maintain commercial momentum to sustain organic growth and delivering our budget and executing our strategic plan.

安德魯，非常感謝您的提問。關於西班牙的合併，我們無法評論任何具體的操作。我們在西班牙的首要任務是保持商業勢頭，維持有機成長，完成預算並執行策略計劃。

As a group, our goal is to reinforce our core markets and core capabilities with financial and industrial rationale. We will focus on when we know, how to do as an industrial operator. We have already been an active player consolidation in our core markets. Remember, DPS, GVT, E-Plus, VMO2.

作為一個集團，我們的目標是透過財務和工業原理來加強我們的核心市場和核心能力。我們將專注於了解何時該如何成為工業運營商。我們已經是我們核心市場的積極整合參與者。記住，DPS、GVT、E-Plus、VMO2。

At the same time, we believe Europe needs large telecommunication and technology companies. We will consider economically profitable in market consolidation, but there will be no European consolidation unless we first consider in market consolidation. Any consolidation is positive, especially for the seasonality of the sector.

同時，我們認為歐洲需要大型電信和科技公司。我們會考慮在市場整合中實現經濟盈利，但如果我們先考慮市場整合，就不會實現歐洲整合。任何整合都是正面的，特別是對於該行業的季節性而言。

Finally, let me reiterate that our priority in Spain is to maintain commercial momentum to sustain organic growth and delivering our budget and executing our strategic plan.

最後，讓我重申一下，我們在西班牙的首要任務是保持商業勢頭，維持有機成長，實現預算並執行策略計劃。

I will let Lutz address to VMO2 question.

我會讓 Lutz 回答 VMO2 問題。

Yes. Thank you, Emilio. Well, so first of all, the debt deal, a very important step for us. And with that, we are creating what we call a B2B ServCo, and that is obviously operating on our mobile and our fixed network, but it is completely independent from this NetCo approach. The NetCo as you have heard, right, is -- this approach is paused for now. And I think this is linked to the timings Emilio has shared with us for the strategic review of Telefonica.

是的。謝謝你，埃米利奧。嗯，首先，債務協議對我們來說是非常重要的一步。由此，我們正在創建所謂的 B2B ServCo，它顯然在我們的行動和固定網路上運行，但它完全獨立於 NetCo 方法。正如您所聽到的，NetCo 是 - 這種方法目前已暫停。我認為這與埃米利奧與我們分享的西班牙電信策略評估的時間有關。

And we are, as we speak, progressing with expanding our fiber network and also upgrading our HFC network to fiber. So that continues. And of course, there are conversations going on with possible consolidation with altnet, which is not really dependent on creation of a NetCo.

正如我們所說，我們正在擴大光纖網絡，並將 HFC 網路升級為光纖。情況就這樣繼續下去。當然，目前正在討論與 altnet 進行合併的可能性，但這並不真正依賴 NetCo 的創建。

Back to you, Emilio.

回到你身邊，埃米利奧。

Andrew, just only to remark that we see clear value in developing the fiber in UK. Remember that Telefonica is the operator with the most and largest fiber deployment in Europe. And we own eight fiber costs with different models. We believe in the opportunities in the UK market, and we believe that fiber is going to be a key element on these opportunities.

安德魯，只是想說，我們看到了在英國開發光纖的明顯價值。請記住，Telefonica 是歐洲光纖部署最多、規模最大的營運商。我們擁有八種不同型號的光纖成本。我們相信英國市場的機遇，我們相信光纖將成為這些機會的關鍵因素。

Just a follow-up to your comments on Spain. Obviously, I appreciate you can't comment too much. But if -- you've been having conversations at the EU level. Have they been encouraging on the scope to actually get consolidate -- in-market consolidation deals done in Europe versus previously?

這只是對您關於西班牙的評論的後續評論。顯然，我很感激你不會發表太多評論。但如果──你們一直在歐盟層級進行對話。他們是否一直在鼓勵實際的整合範圍——與以前相比，在歐洲完成的市場整合交易？

Yes. I mentioned, we believe that the market consolidation has to be the previous step before any European consolidation.

是的。我提到過，我們認為市場整合必須是任何歐洲整合之前的先行步驟。

Thank you, Andrew. Operator, next question, please.

謝謝你，安德魯。接線員，請問下一個問題。

Mathieu Robilliard, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的 Mathieu Robilliard。

Welcome, Emilio, to the call. I have two questions, please. The first one was on your free cash flow guidance. So you've tweeted a little bit in the sense that you're now guiding for free cash flow excluding discontinued operations. And the base to which we should compare it is a bit higher than it was -- including those operations, I think it's 2.83 or something around that. So that suggests that Peru and Argentina were very dilutive.

歡迎 Emilio 參加電話會議。我有兩個問題請問。第一個是關於您的自由現金流指導。所以你在推特上說了一點，表示你現在正在指導不包括已終止經營業務的自由現金流。我們應該將其與基數進行比較，基數比以前要高一些——包括那些操作，我認為是 2.83 左右。這顯示秘魯和阿根廷的股權稀釋程度非常大。

And I was wondering, is it because in 2024, there were some one-offs? Or was it just generically dilutive? And if we think about the disposal of Colombia and potentially Chile, should that add also a potential accretive impact on free cash flow when that happens?

我想知道，是不是因為 2024 年發生了一些一次性事件？或者它只是一般性的稀釋作用？如果我們考慮出售哥倫比亞和潛在的智利，那麼當這種情況發生時，這是否也應該對自由現金流產生潛在的增值影響？

And if I may, you say it should be similar, the free cash flow to -- in 2025 to 2024. Obviously, I'm not a native English speaker. In similar, does similar mean flattish? Or is it a bit more broader than that in terms of valuation?

如果可以的話，您說它應該是相似的，自由現金流在 2025 年至 2024 年之間。顯然，我不是英語母語人士。在相似中，相似是否意味著平坦？或者從估值角度來說，它的範圍比這更廣泛一些？

And then lastly, on the -- on Germany, 1&1 continues to insist that they will get some low-band spectrum. I don't know if you can give us any update on your thoughts on that one.

最後，關於德國，1&1 繼續堅持他們將獲得一些低頻段頻譜。我不知道您是否可以向我們更新您對此的想法。

Mathieu, thank you for your question, and thank you for the warm welcome. Related to the free cash flow, I would like to reiterate our guidance, and I'm going to let Laura to answer and to give you more details about your question.

馬修，感謝您的提問，也感謝您熱情的歡迎。關於自由現金流，我想重申我們的指導，我將讓勞拉來回答並為您提供有關您的問題的更多詳細資訊。

Thank you, Mathieu, for your question. There was a few questions within the free cash flow. The one was the guidance. One was the tweeting a bit, and I will explain that's not been the case. And third is the Peru and Argentina contribution so far and whether they were dilutive or not.

謝謝 Mathieu 的提問。自由現金流方面存在一些問題。一是指導。一是發了一些推文，我會解釋事實並非如此。第三是秘魯和阿根廷迄今為止的貢獻以及它們是否具有稀釋作用。

And also on the guidance, first answer, our guidance remains unchanged. We expect 2025 to be similar to 2024. Similar seems stable, around the same, plus/minus, you can call it flattish, if you want, but I think similar stable will be -- is what we said, is what we speak to at the moment.

關於指導，第一個答案是，我們的指導保持不變。我們預計 2025 年的情況將與 2024 年類似。類似看起來很穩定，大致相同，加/減，如果你願意，你可以稱之為持平，但我認為類似的穩定將是 - 這就是我們所說的，也是我們目前所說的。

We also said under the same consolidation perimeter, and perimeter has indeed changed. As you know, Argentina and Peru are now reported as discontinued operations. Argentina has already been deconsolidating since February 24, and Peru will be deconsolidated on April 1. So the free cash flow of Peru has gone through the free cash flow of Telefonica in Q1 under the discontinued operations line.

我們也說過，在同樣的合併週長下，週長確實發生了變化。如您所知，阿根廷和秘魯目前已被報告為停止營運。阿根廷已於2月24日起解除合併，秘魯將於4月1日起解除合併。因此，秘魯的自由現金流在第一季已經通過了西班牙電信公司停止營運業務下的自由現金流。

We are focusing indeed on the free cash flow generated from continuing operations. And if we do that, the base for 2024 would have improved EUR0.2 billion approximately. It is not because Argentina was dilutive. It's more because of the negative contribution from Peru, which, as you may remember, included the payments related to SUNAT. So there was more negative from Peru that offsetted the positive contribution from Argentina.

我們確實關注的是持續經營產生的自由現金流。如果我們這樣做，2024 年的基礎將增加約 2 億歐元。這並不是因為阿根廷被稀釋了。這更多的是因為秘魯的負面貢獻，您可能還記得，其中包括與 SUNAT 相關的付款。因此，秘魯的負面貢獻抵消了阿根廷的正面貢獻。

On the changing tweeting thing, I'm very happy to go through full free cash flow as well. We truly believe that as these companies are no longer in our perimeter, it doesn't make sense to keep on focusing on that. So we think continuing operations, free cash flow shows much better the underlying.

關於改變推特的事情，我很高興能夠經歷完全的自由現金流。我們確實相信，由於這些公司不再在我們的範圍之內，所以繼續關注它們是沒有意義的。因此，我們認為持續經營、自由現金流顯示出更好的基礎。

But if you include free cash flow from discontinued operations as well, then the base will be the EUR2.6 billion we reported last year, and we should include the EUR153 million negative you have on Slide 12. And under that permit -- and under that definition, we will also give a guidance of a stable free cash flow.

但如果還包括來自已終止經營業務的自由現金流，那麼基數將是我們去年報告的 26 億歐元，我們應該包括幻燈片 12 上的 1.53 億歐元負值。根據該許可和定義，我們還將提供穩定自由現金流的指導。

So we rather focus on continuing operations, free cash flow, but to simplify, we confirm a stable free cash flow under both metrics. So nothing has changed. We remain with the guidance we provided, and we are very committed, and we are very certain that we can achieve such guidance.

因此，我們更關注持續經營和自由現金流，但為了簡化起見，我們在兩個指標下都確認了穩定的自由現金流。所以什麼都沒有改變。我們將繼續堅持我們所提供的指導，我們非常堅定，我們非常有信心我們能夠實現這樣的指導。

And finally, you asked about Colombia and Chile. Chile, there's nothing to report on Chile. They are just rumors, and we won't say anything about deals until they don't happen. On the impact of Colombia, I think regulatory process will take longer than Argentina and Peru. And therefore, whatever impact is going to -- I mean, I think most of 2025 is going to include free cash flow of Colombia in any way. So it's too soon to talk about that because regulatory process will be longer, and we are expecting an outcome around Q4, late Q4.

最後，您詢問了哥倫比亞和智利的情況。智利，關於智利沒有什麼好報道的。這些只是謠言，在交易沒有發生之前我們不會談論任何事情。關於哥倫比亞的影響，我認為監管過程將比阿根廷和秘魯更長。因此，無論產生什麼影響——我的意思是，我認為 2025 年的大部分時間都會以任何方式影響哥倫比亞的自由現金流。所以現在談論這個還為時過早，因為監管過程將會更長，我們預計將在第四季度左右或第四季末得到結果。

So I hope I answered your questions, Mathieu.

所以我希望我回答了你的問題，馬修。

Regarding the question about Germany, let me hand over to Markus to give you more details.

關於德國的問題，請容許我把時間交給馬庫斯，讓他向您詳細介紹。

Thank you. Mathieu, I think, first of all, I think it's really a big achievement that Germany extended the spectrum for the next five years. I think this is a real game changer in the overall context.

謝謝。馬蒂厄，我認為，首先，我認為德國在未來五年內擴大光譜確實是一項重大成就。我認為從整體上看，這是一個真正的遊戲規則改變者。

To your question being it's our decisions to grant 2.5 megahertz in the low-band spectrum to 1&1 is directed to all the three established MNOs. As we all know, Telefonica Germany is already granting a spectrum sublease to 1&1 of 2 times 10 megahertz in the 2.6 band. This obligation will be extended, and Telefonica clearly will deliver against this request.

對於您的問題，我們決定將低頻段的 2.5 兆赫頻譜授予 1&1，這是針對所有三個現有的 MNO 做出的。眾所周知，西班牙電信德國公司已經將2.6頻段的2倍10兆赫的頻譜轉租給1&1。這項義務將會延長，而西班牙電信公司顯然會履行這項要求。

On the low band, being it's reflects in its decision that 1&1 might want to approach its national roaming host Vodafone for such a grant first. So Telefonica Germany from that perspective, not in the lead for offering additional spectrum in that sense.

在低頻段，1&1 的決定反映出它可能希望首先與其全國漫遊主機沃達豐 (Vodafone) 接洽以獲得此類授權。因此，從這個角度來看，西班牙電信德國公司在提供額外頻譜方面並不處於領先地位。

Fernando Cordero Barreira, Banco Santander.

費爾南多·科德羅·巴雷拉，桑坦德銀行。

And also welcome, Emilio, to the call. The first question is on Spain. And as a follow-up on your comment on your priority on the commercial momentum, I would like to understand, which are your views regarding one of the key drivers, in my view, on the current trends on the Spanish market, which is even higher than 3% growth year-on-year on fixed broadband.

也歡迎 Emilio 參加電話會議。第一個問題是關於西班牙的。作為您關於商業發展勢頭優先事項的評論的後續，我想了解一下，您對西班牙市場當前趨勢的一個關鍵驅動因素有何看法，即固定寬頻的同比增長率甚至高於 3%。

In that sense, that also is allowing all the players to post net adds. And in that sense, also to understand, which is your view on how -- for how long this growth trend can persist. And what are the reasons behind this nice trend of the whole fixed broadband market in Spain?

從這個意義上來說，這也允許所有玩家發布淨增值。從這個意義上講，我們也要了解，您對這種成長趨勢能夠持續多久的看法。那麼西班牙整個固定寬頻市場呈現如此良好趨勢的原因是什麼？

And the second question is for Laura, and particularly on the financial structure. We have seen the disposals of Argentina and Peru, and more likely to come. I want to understand the impact of those disposals on your balance sheet flexibility, particularly on the impact on the credit rating.

第二個問題是問勞拉的，特別是關於財務結構。我們已經看到了阿根廷和秘魯的處置，並且很可能會出現更多處置。我想了解這些處置對你們資產負債表彈性的影響，特別是對信用評等的影響。

Should we expect that you can just directly reallocate the capital to be extracted from Hispam to any other initiative? Or can also we expect that the credit ratings may give you more flexibility given that the risk profile of the group is diminishing or is being reduced with the exit from Hispam, just to understand if there is a qualitative increased flexibility on your balance sheet for an exit and for Hispam?

我們是否應該期望您可以將從 Hispam 中提取的資金直接重新分配給任何其他計劃？或者我們可以預期，由於集團的風險狀況隨著退出 Hispam 而減弱或降低，信用評級可能會為您提供更多靈活性，只是為了了解您的資產負債表在退出和退出 Hispam 方面是否有質的靈活性的提高？

Fernando, thank you very much for your question. And again, thank you for your warm welcome. Talking about Telefonica Spain, first of all, to remind that Telefonica Spain, this Q1 has a really excellent performance, with all main services accelerating in year-on-year growth. We expect in the next quarters to follow with this performance. We don't see relevant change in the market with similar trends in terms of competition.

費爾南多，非常感謝您的提問。再次感謝你們的熱情歡迎。說到西班牙電信，首先要提醒大家的是，西班牙電信今年第一季的表現確實非常出色，所有主要業務都實現了同比增長。我們預計下一季仍將保持這一表現。我們沒有看到市場在競爭方面出現類似趨勢的相關變化。

In the case of our revenues, first of all, talking about B2C, I will say that our B2B -- B2C trends are really excellent, too. And we think we are able to maintain these trends because our base in structural advantage. We are talking about our brands. We are talking about our customer care policies. We are talking about our networks. This advantage permit us to pursue ahead the same kind of trends in B2C. Remember that we maintained the lowest ARPU and the highest NPS on the market.

就我們的收入而言，首先談到 B2C，我會說我們的 B2B——B2C 趨勢也非常好。我們認為我們能夠保持這些趨勢，因為我們有結構優勢。我們正在談論我們的品牌。我們正在討論我們的客戶關懷政策。我們正在談論我們的網路。這項優勢使我們能夠在 B2C 領域中追尋同樣的趨勢。請記住，我們保持了市場上最低的 ARPU 和最高的 NPS。

In terms of B2B, we realize that we are performing very well, too. We see growth ahead, and the funnels are increasing. And our capabilities, both in Telefonica Tech and Telefonica Spain, permit us to be very positive in the performance in the next quarters.

在 B2B 方面，我們意識到我們的表現也非常好。我們看到了未來的成長，並且漏斗正在增加。我們在西班牙電信技術公司和西班牙電信西班牙公司的能力使我們對下一季的業績非常有信心。

In terms of wholesale that, as you know, are declining is something that was predicted. It was based on a long-term agreement that gives us a sustainability, and it was included in our guidance. Then we can say that we see a strong performance ahead, and we are pretty sure about the -- and confident in the performance of Telefonica Spain.

就批發而言，如你所知，批發業務的下降是可以預見的。它基於一項賦予我們可持續性的長期協議，並包含在我們的指導中。那麼我們可以說，我們看到了未來強勁的表現，我們對西班牙電信西班牙公司的表現非常有信心。

Fernando, thank you for your question. Let me explain the impacts of the announced and executed sales. The sale of Argentina reduced leverage by 0.02x. In the case of Peru, it will reduce leverage by approximately 0.01 in Q2.

費爾南多，謝謝你的提問。讓我解釋一下已宣布和已執行的銷售的影響。出售阿根廷股票使槓桿率降低了 0.02 倍。就秘魯而言，其將在第二季降低槓桿約0.01。

But also very important to mention that Telefonica Group will no longer account for the negative operating cash flow nor consolidate the current or potential future debt of the company.

但同樣值得一提的是，西班牙電信集團將不再核算負經營現金流，也不會合併公司目前或未來的潛在債務。

Colombia has a further deleveraging impact we have accounted in the post closing. You can see we have included the deconsolidation of the Colombian net debt as of March, and the whole lot will bring our net debt as of today, post closing, at EUR25.8 billion.

哥倫比亞的去槓桿效應進一步顯現，我們已經在收盤後進行了核算。您可以看到，我們已經將截至 3 月的哥倫比亞淨債務分拆出來，所有這些將使我們截至今天（收盤後）的淨債務達到 258 億歐元。

But as we said, it's not only in the quantum, it's not only the ratio. It's definitely the quality of the free cash flow. And I can confirm, credit ratings see this as a very clear positive. And it will improve the quality of our free cash flow and the quality of our leverage ratios as well.

但正如我們所說，它不僅存在於量子中，也不僅僅存在於比率中。這絕對是自由現金流的品質。我可以確認，信用評級將此視為非常明顯的利多。這也將提高我們的自由現金流品質和槓桿率品質。

They also welcome the strict capital allocation, which can be deleveraged, but they also welcome when we reallocate to business where there's definitely higher returns, which is the case, because we are exiting businesses with lower returns than our core businesses, and they really welcome the simplification of the portfolio, that the free cash flows are higher quality in a simpler organization. And all of that has been achieved through these three disposals.

他們也歡迎嚴格的資本配置，這樣可以去槓桿，但他們也歡迎我們重新分配到肯定有更高回報的業務，事實就是如此，因為我們正在退出回報率低於核心業務的業務，他們非常歡迎投資組合的簡化，因為在更簡單的組織中，自由現金流的質量更高。而這一切都是透過這三次處置實現的。

On credit ratings, if I may add, we had already the annual meetings with them in the month of April. Stable outlook is maintained. As there's no specific concern whatsoever, just the opposite, we ended the year better than expected. And all these strategic capital allocation around Spain is being -- a clear positive.

關於信用評級，如果我可以補充的話，我們在四月已經與他們舉行了年度會議。維持穩定展望。由於沒有任何具體的擔憂，恰恰相反，我們以比預期更好的成績結束了這一年。西班牙周邊的所有這些戰略資本配置顯然都是正面的。

Obviously, the strategic review is pending, and we will announce on the second half of the year on that. And we will definitely do a special focus on the financial policy and the capital structure supporting that plan.

顯然，戰略評估尚未完成，我們將在今年下半年公佈結果。我們肯定會特別關注支持該計劃的財務政策和資本結構。

Laura, just to clarify. If I understood you well, what you are saying is that your balance sheet flexibility will improve on top of the pure quantitative effect from the disposals, given the, let's say, lower risk profile.

勞拉，只是想澄清一下。如果我理解正確的話，您說的是，考慮到風險狀況較低，除了處置帶來的純粹量化效應之外，您的資產負債表靈活性還將得到改善。

Absolutely. Yes, that's right, Fernando.

絕對地。是的，沒錯，費爾南多。

Akhil Dattani, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的阿希爾·達塔尼 (Akhil Dattani)。

I've got two as well, please, if I can. The first was just on changes that have been made to the organizational structure of Telefonica year-to-date. I just wondered if you could quickly update us on the major changes. I guess, we're aware of, obviously, Emilio, you coming in as the COO. Obviously, we've had a change at Spain and change at Telefonica Tech.

我也有兩個，如果可以的話，請給我一個。第一個是關於今年迄今為止西班牙電信組織結構的變化。我只是想知道您是否可以快速向我們通報重大變化。我想，我們顯然知道埃米利奧，您將擔任營運長。顯然，西班牙和西班牙電信技術公司都發生了變化。

I just wondered if there's any other major changes you'd highlight. And if you could maybe just help us understand the general thinking behind these changes. Is it just a new COO and a need to -- or desire to create some change? Or are there other specific initiatives in terms of what you're hoping to bring into the group through this change? That's the first question.

我只是想知道您是否還有其他重大變化需要強調。也許您能幫助我們理解這些變化背後的整體思路。這僅僅是新任營運長的需要或願望，以創造一些改變嗎？或者您希望透過這次變革為集團帶來其他具體舉措嗎？這是第一個問題。

And then the second question is around, I guess, a much bigger picture question around the strategic review. And it's not about any details. It's just more about the philosophy behind it. But you've probably seen there have been rumors around you as a group looking at some pretty transformational potential moves to the group as a function of that strategic review.

我想，第二個問題是關於策略評估的一個更大的問題。這與任何細節都無關。這更多的只是關於背後的哲學。但您可能已經看到，作為一個集團，您周圍有傳言稱，正在考慮根據該策略評估採取一些對集團具有相當變革意義的舉措。

I guess, what I'm trying to understand is when we see headlines on Bloomberg in regards to maybe a potential rights issue, maybe dividend costs, I guess, what I'm trying to understand is, could those sorts of major capital allocation changes end up being part of this? Or should we -- and so therefore, anything and everything is on the table. Or are these things being maybe slightly overplayed in the press, and these are more evolutionary rather than transformational?

我想，我想了解的是，當我們在彭博社看到有關可能的配股、股息成本的頭條新聞時，我想，我想了解的是，這些重大的資本配置變化最終會成為其中的一部分嗎？或者我們應該——因此，任何事情都可以考慮。或者這些事情可能被媒體稍微誇大了，它們更多的是進化而不是改變？

Akhil, thank you very much for your question. Talking about the organization, we have done some change related to some movement that has produced in the company. The rationale is to assure that we execute in the same way, and we execute our plan and deliver our budget. This is the main rationale of all changes that we have done.

Akhil，非常感謝您的提問。談到組織，我們已經根據公司內部發生的一些動向做出了一些改變。這樣做的理由是為了確保我們以同樣的方式執行，並執行我們的計劃和預算。這是我們所做的所有改變的主要理由。

Regarding there will be more changes after the strategic plan, I will not comment anything because it depends on the strategic review. We will see the results, and we'll share with you in the second half of the year any kind of change or any kind of transformation that we decide or not decide to do.

至於策略規劃之後還會有更多變化，我不會評論任何內容，因為這取決於策略評估。我們將看到結果，並將在下半年與大家分享我們決定或不決定要做的任何改變或轉型。

Akhil, thank you for the question. On the part of the transformational versus evolutionary movements on the capital structure, as everything else is really too soon to say anything or cover that. That will definitely be part of the strategic review we are undertaking.

Akhil，謝謝你的提問。關於資本結構的轉型與演化運動，目前談論或涵蓋其他一切還為時過早。這肯定是我們正在進行的策略審查的一部分。

We are going to review our capital strategy, which is the base that will support the rest, that will support best the plan. And we will present our conclusions as everything else in the second half of 2025.

我們將重新審視我們的資本策略，這是支持其餘部分的基礎，也是最佳支援計畫的基礎。我們將在 2025 年下半年公佈我們的結論。

Maybe let me share some points on the flexibility. When we started this strategic review with, I think the fact we are reducing our exposure to Hispam and the new group much more focused on core operations could support higher leverage than the previous configuration of the group.

也許我可以分享一些關於靈活性的觀點。當我們開始進行這項策略評估時，我認為，我們減少對 Hispam 的敞口，並且新集團更加專注於核心業務，可以支援比集團以前的配置更高的槓桿率。

We continue with a very strict capital allocation policy. Leverage ratio needs to be also in combination with the quantum, quality of free cash flow, liquidity, life and cost of debt, as I always emphasize. Asset recycling into EBITDA and free cash flow generating business is also part of the debate.

我們繼續實行非常嚴格的資本配置政策。正如我一直強調的那樣，槓桿率還需要與自由現金流的數量、品質、流動性、債務期限和成本相結合。資產回收轉化為 EBITDA 和自由現金流產生業務也是爭論的一部分。

We have plenty of options. And as I said at the beginning, a strategic review will include the most suitable capital structure to support this plan. And you can be sure that we will always look to finance anything in the most efficient way to maximize shareholder value.

我們有很多選擇。正如我在一開始所說，戰略審查將包括最合適的資本結構來支持該計劃。您可以放心，我們將始終尋求以最有效的方式為任何專案提供融資，以實現股東價值最大化。

As we said in the presentation and Emilio, the guidance of our strategic framework, one of them and probably the most important is the value creation for all stakeholders.

正如我們在演講中和埃米利奧所說，我們的策略框架指導其中之一，也可能是最重要的一點，就是為所有利害關係人創造價值。

James Ratzer, New Street Research.

詹姆斯·拉澤（James Ratzer），新街研究公司（New Street Research）。

So the first question was coming back to the free cash flow guidance. So thank you for the new base figure you've given. I think, if I look at EUR2.85 billion as the base for 2024, you're saying that would be flat or stay similar on an organic basis. So I'm estimating you'll have around EUR100 million to EUR150 million of FX weakness this year, assuming current FX rates are broadly stable.

所以第一個問題是回到自由現金流指導。感謝您提供新的基準數字。我認為，如果我以 28.5 億歐元作為 2024 年的基礎，您所說的將是該數字將保持平穩或在有機基礎上保持相似。因此，假設當前外匯匯率基本上穩定，我估計今年的外匯損失將達到約 1 億歐元至 1.5 億歐元。

So that would mean you should report around EUR2.7 billion to EUR2.75 billion of continuing operations free cash flow. Consensus though on the sheet you sent around is at EUR2.4 billion. So when you look at the consensus figures you've gathered, where do you think they're too low? Which line items stand out to you? Does a EUR300 million to EUR350 million gap is reasonably sizable?

所以這意味著你應該報告約 27 億歐元至 27.5 億歐元的持續經營自由現金流。不過，您發送的表格上的共識是 24 億歐元。那麼，當您查看所收集到的共識資料時，您認為它們在哪些方面太低了？哪些項目對您來說比較突出？3 億歐元到 3.5 億歐元的差距是否合理？

And then the second question I had, and maybe this is one for Markus, is really on Germany. I think a lot of people have been rather worried about what could be kind of pending mobile price war in Germany. And yet, this quarter, your O2 contract ARPU has recovered very strongly to being stable, having been down 3% in Q4. And I know there's a bit of an MTR boost in there, maybe about 140 basis points of that recovery.

我的第二個問題，也許這也是馬庫斯要問的，是關於德國的。我認為很多人都非常擔心德國即將爆發的手機價格戰。然而，本季度，您的 O2 合約 ARPU 已強勁恢復至穩定水平，而第四季度則下降了 3%。我知道這其中有一點 MTR 的推動，大概是復甦的 140 個基點左右。

But what else has really led to that improvement in ARPU you've seen in Q1? Can a stable ARPU be maintained for the year? Or can that maybe even get better through the year? It'd just be great to hear your views on how you're actually seeing the competitive environment in Germany and ARPU developing through the year.

但是，還有什麼因素真正導致了第一季 ARPU 的提高呢？全年能維持穩定的ARPU嗎？或者說這一年的情況可能會變得更好嗎？很高興聽到您對德國競爭環境和全年 ARPU 發展的看法。

James, thank you very much for your question. Laura and Markus will answer your questions.

詹姆斯，非常感謝您的提問。勞拉和馬庫斯將回答您的問題。

Thank you, James. I start with the free cash flow question. As you said, the basis for free cash flow from continuing operations to remain stable is a combination of many items, as usually. The most important is the growing organic EBITDAal minus CapEx, which is embedded in our guidance in 2025.

謝謝你，詹姆斯。我先從自由現金流問題開始。正如您所說，持續經營自由現金流保持穩定的基礎通常是多種因素的組合。最重要的是不斷增長的有機 EBITDAal 減去資本支出，這已包含在我們 2025 年的指導中。

It's true that FX could affect somehow negatively. But please, let me remind you that there's a very large natural hedge from FX at free cash flow level. And you see how much the impact we have in revenue diminishes as we go through the free cash flow -- the final free cash flow.

外匯確實可能會產生一些負面影響。但是請讓我提醒您，在自由現金流水平上，外匯具有非常大的自然對沖。您會發現，隨著我們經歷自由現金流（最終的自由現金流），我們對收入的影響會減少多少。

And also, as you know, we do financial hedges every year, and we commented that we have hedged quite a lot of our free cash flow coming from Brazil already. So the impact from free cash flow will be minimized.

而且，正如您所知，我們每年都會進行金融對沖，我們表示，我們已經對沖了來自巴西的相當多的自由現金流。因此自由現金流的影響將被最小化。

On that, growing organic EBITDAal minus CapEx, all our three main markets are growing operating cash flow and in organic terms. And as I said already, the quality of that is larger, as we are removing the FX volatility in Argentina and the uncertainty on future free cash flow impact from Peru.

在此基礎上，隨著有機 EBITDAal 減去資本支出的成長，我們所有三個主要市場的營運現金流都在有機成長。正如我已經說過的，其品質更高，因為我們正在消除阿根廷的外匯波動和秘魯對未來自由現金流影響的不確定性。

Below that, we will continue managing every line. There's a gap versus consensus. But let me tell you that last year, we also overperformed on consensus, and we overperformed on our guidance. So we have a good track record on managing every line below EBITDAal minus CapEx.

在此之下，我們將繼續管理每一行。與共識存在差距。但我要告訴你們，去年我們的表現超出了預期，也超出了我們的預期。因此，我們在管理 EBITDAal 減去 CapEx 以下的每項業務方面都有著良好的記錄。

We should expect a positive working capital contribution in 2025. Lease payments are less affected by changes in volume and lower inflation, very stable debt-related interest cost, very proactively managed, continue to optimize taxes.

我們預計 2025 年營運資本貢獻將為正。租賃付款受數量變化和通貨膨脹較低影響較小，債務相關利息成本非常穩定，管理非常積極，稅收繼續優化。

Dividends from VMO2, as we already announced, will be slightly lower, but we also have normalized hybrids and personnel payments, which are now part of the free cash flow. But nothing -- I mean, just the very granular management of every single line.

正如我們已經宣布的那樣，VMO2 的股息將會略低，但我們也已將混合和人員支付標準化，這些現在是自由現金流的一部分。但沒有什麼——我的意思是，只是對每一行進行非常細緻的管理。

Hispam still brings some uncertainty on the performance, although commercial performance has improved, as Emilio explained, but that needs to be settled.

Hispam 在性能上仍然帶來一些不確定性，儘管商業表現有所改善，正如 Emilio 所解釋的那樣，但這需要解決。

Argentina and Peru have already been sold. We are awaiting for regulatory authorizations in Colombia. Something may come, but the important is the strength of the core free cash flow as the pillar, and the strength and management of the other financial items that we will continue managing in the right way.

阿根廷和秘魯已經出售。我們正在等待哥倫比亞的監管授權。可能會發生一些事情，但重要的是核心自由現金流作為支柱的實力，以及我們將繼續以正確的方式管理的其他財務項目的實力和管理。

James, your question on Germany, I think, overall, the German -- on Germany, overall, the German mobile market structure remains intact. Yes, we saw some more promotional activity in the first quarter. But overall, I think the market is growing, and there's growth potential for all players in the market because there is still more demand for mobile data.

詹姆斯，你關於德國的問題，我認為，總體而言，德國——就德國而言，總體而言，德國行動市場結構保持完好。是的，我們在第一季看到了更多的促銷活動。但總體而言，我認為市場正在成長，並且市場所有參與者都具有成長潛力，因為對行動數據的需求仍然較大。

On Telefonica Germany, in -- on our commercial strategy, we remain committed to profitable growth on the back, clearly, of a fair share of available growth that's in all channels.

對於西班牙電信德國公司而言，在我們的商業策略中，我們將繼續致力於獲利成長，顯然，這要歸功於所有管道中相當一部分可用的成長。

Having said that, I think you mentioned the point. We drive in the mix profitable growth. and we have been able to stabilize our ARPU maybe as the only player in the German market, even taking into account the ex-MTR effect that you mentioned.

話雖如此，我認為您提到了這一點。我們推動混合獲利成長。即使考慮到您提到的 MTR 效應，我們可能也是德國市場上唯一的一家能夠穩定 ARPU 的公司。

So overall, we drive in the mix of high-value, mid-value and low-value profitable growth and see good momentum with our own offers.

因此，總體而言，我們推動高價值、中價值和低價值的獲利成長，並看到我們自己的產品/服務呈現良好勢頭。

So we are not worried about the market structure, that's the first message. Second message, clearly, yes, there are promotional activities, but in the mix, and that clearly shows the stable O2 postpaid ARPU. That's the key revenue source, and we clearly see that we are able to drive profitable growth.

因此我們並不擔心市場結構，這是第一個訊息。第二個訊息，顯然，是的，有促銷活動，但在組合中，這清楚地顯示了穩定的 O2 後付費 ARPU。這是主要的收入來源，我們清楚地看到我們能夠推動獲利成長。

And we have time for one more question, please.

我們還有時間再回答一個問題。

Keval Khiroya, Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的 Keval Khiroya。

And I have two, please. So firstly, you've been quite vocal on consolidation benefits. At a high level, do you think there would be benefits of mobile in market consolidation in Germany? Or do you feel you're now very much on a standalone path after you evolve your strategy post 1&1 leaving your network?

我有兩份。首先，您已經非常直言不諱地談論了合併的好處。從高層次來看，您認為行動技術對德國市場整合有什麼好處嗎？或者，在 1&1 離開網路後，您改變了策略，是否感覺自己現在走上了一條獨立的道路？

And secondly, the Spanish headcount reduction benefits drop-off in Q2, will you have other OpEx cuts, which come into effect to allow domestic EBITDA growth to sell accelerate? And if so, would you be able to elaborate on the source and magnitude of those, please?

其次，西班牙裁員福利在第二季下降，您是否會採取其他營運支出削減措施，以加速國內 EBITDA 成長？如果是的話，您能否詳細說明一下這些影響的來源和程度？

Keval, thank you very much for your question. Regarding the consolidation, especially in Germany, I have to tell that our priority in Germany is to grow our business organically. We see ahead of opportunities, as Markus mentioned before, leveraging our network of our brands.

Keval，非常感謝您的提問。關於合併，特別是在德國，我必須說，我們在德國的首要任務是有機地發展我們的業務。正如 Markus 之前提到的，我們預見了機遇，並利用了我們的品牌網絡。

But it's true that we believe Europe needs large telecommunication and technology companies, and market consolidation is needed to have a strong European telco sector.

但我們確實認為歐洲需要大型電信和科技公司，而且需要市場整合才能擁有強大的歐洲電信產業。

In Germany, there are already three very good mobile networks. We don't see too much space for one. We have a responsibility to consider all options, of course, but let me stress that our priority in Germany is organic growth.

在德國，已經有三個非常好的行動網路。我們認為沒有太多的空間。當然，我們有責任考慮所有選擇，但我要強調的是，我們在德國的首要任務是實現有機成長。

Regarding the question about the redundancy plan in Spain, our expectation is 2025 EBITDA to show higher year-on-year growth than in 2024. This is based on retail revenue growth. Remember, our revenue growth is -- even in -- retail revenue growth is even above the inflation. And we have some tailwinds coming from the redundancy plan that we launched the last year.

關於西班牙裁員計畫的問題，我們預計 2025 年 EBITDA 將比 2024 年實現更高的年成長。這是基於零售收入的成長。請記住，我們的收入成長——甚至——零售收入成長甚至高於通貨膨脹率。我們去年推出的裁員計畫也為我們帶來了一些有利因素。

The technological transformation, both in IT networks and the sundown of the copper permit us to see more efficiency. At the same time, all the simplification that we are doing in Spain, both in network system and processes, permit us to see again more efficiencies. Artificial intelligence and automation permit us to see commercial efficiencies, too. We see a lot of examples and permit us to see this efficiency.

IT 網路和銅線淘汰等技術轉型讓我們看到了更高的效率。同時，我們在西班牙進行的所有簡化，包括網路系統和流程，使我們再次看到了更高的效率。人工智慧和自動化也讓我們看到了商業效率。我們看到了很多例子，讓我們看到了這種效率。

And then we saw all of that, we believe that we are able to maintain the -- our EBITDA level, our performance in financial KPIs.

然後我們看到了所有這些，我們相信我們能夠保持我們的 EBITDA 水平和財務 KPI 的表現。

At this time, no further questions will be taken.

目前，不會回答任何其他問題。

Thank you very much for your participation. We hope we have provided some useful insights for you. Should you still have further questions, we clearly ask you to contact our Investor Relations department. Good morning, and thank you very much.

非常感謝您的參與。我們希望我們能為您提供一些有用的見解。如果您還有其他問題，我們明確要求您聯絡我們的投資者關係部門。早安，非常感謝。

Telefonica's January-March 2025 results conference call is over. You may now disconnect your line. Thank you.

西班牙電信2025年1-3月業績電話會議結束。現在您可以斷開線路了。謝謝。