PNC Financial Services Group Inc (PNC) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Greetings. Welcome to the PNC Financial Services Group second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call.

問候。歡迎參加 PNC 金融服務集團 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Please note that today's conference is being recorded.

請注意，今天的會議正在錄音。

At this time, it's now my pleasure to turn the conference over to Bryan Gill, Executive Vice President and Director of Investor Relations.

現在，我很高興將會議交給執行副總裁兼投資者關係總監 Bryan Gill。

Mr. Gill, you may now begin.

吉爾先生，現在可以開始了。

Well, good morning. Welcome to today's conference call for the PNC Financial Services Group. I am Bryan Gill, the Director of Investor Relations for PNC, and participating on this call are PNC's Chairman and CEO, Bill Demchak; and Rob Reilly, Executive Vice President and CFO.

早安.歡迎參加今天的 PNC 金融服務集團電話會議。我是 PNC 投資者關係總監 Bryan Gill，參加本次電話會議的還有 PNC 董事長兼執行長 Bill Demchak 和執行副總裁兼財務長 Rob Reilly。

Today's presentation contains forward-looking information. Cautionary statements about this information, as well as reconciliations of non-GAAP measures are included in today's earnings release materials, as well as our SEC filings and other investor materials. These are all available on our corporate website, pnc.com under Investor Relations. These statements speak only as of July 16, 2025, and PNC undertakes no obligation to update them.

今天的演示包含前瞻性資訊。有關此資訊的警告性聲明以及非公認會計準則 (non-GAAP) 指標的對帳均包含在今天的收益發布資料以及我們向美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 提交的文件和其他投資者資料中。這些都可以在我們的公司網站 pnc.com 的「投資者關係」欄位中找到。這些聲明僅截至 2025 年 7 月 16 日有效，PNC 不承擔更新這些聲明的義務。

Now I'd like to turn the call over to Bill.

現在我想把電話轉給比爾。

Thank you, Bryan, and good morning, everyone. As you've seen, we had a very strong second quarter fueled by our continued focus on driving growth. We accelerated new customer acquisition while deepening relationships with existing customers across our businesses.

謝謝你，布萊恩，大家早安。如您所見，由於我們持續致力於推動成長，我們第二季的業績表現非常強勁。我們加快了新客戶的獲取，同時加深了與現有客戶的關係。

Loan growth increased even through an uncertain macro environment, and we delivered on what we said we would. Our approach to growing our businesses remains consistent. The disciplined way we go to market, bringing the best of PNC's people, products, and services to customers across our expanded franchise has continued to produce results.

即使在宏觀環境不確定的情況下，貸款成長仍然保持成長，我們也兌現了承諾。我們發展業務的方法始終如一。我們以嚴謹的方式進入市場，將 PNC 最好的人才、產品和服務帶給我們不斷擴大的特許經營範圍內的客戶，並持續產生成果。

We reported net income of $1.6 billion or $3.85 per diluted share. During the quarter, loans grew 2%, reflecting strong commercial loan growth fueled by the highest level of new production in 10 quarters. At the same time, we increased revenue 4% while holding non-interest expenses stable, which resulted in another quarter of positive operating leverage and 10% PPNR growth.

我們報告的淨收入為 16 億美元，即每股 3.85 美元。本季度，貸款成長了 2%，反映出強勁的商業貸款成長，這得益於 10 個季度以來的最高水準的新增貸款。同時，我們在保持非利息支出穩定的同時將收入提高了 4%，這導致本季度的經營槓桿率再次為正，PPNR 增長了 10%。

By now, you've seen our stress test results. We maintained our regulatory minimum stress capital buffer of 2.5%, and our start to trough capital depletion of 80 basis points was the lowest in our peer group. And as announced on July 3, our Board increased our common dividend by $0.10 or 6% earlier this month.

到目前為止，您已經看到了我們的壓力測試結果。我們維持了 2.5% 的監管最低壓力資本緩衝，從起始到最低谷的資本消耗為 80 個基點，是同業中最低的。正如 7 月 3 日宣布的那樣，本月初，董事會將普通股股息提高了 0.10 美元，即 6%。

Rob is going to go through our performance in more detail, but first, I'd like to share some of our business highlights from the quarter. As I mentioned, we continue to see strong results from the execution of our national growth strategy.

Rob 將更詳細地介紹我們的業績，但首先，我想分享本季的一些業務亮點。正如我所提到的，我們持續看到國家成長策略實施的強勁成果。

In C&IB, we saw strong growth in loans and commitments and our credit trends continue to be very good. Looking at fees, our capital markets and advisory trends remain solid, and as expected, treasury management continues to produce strong results.

在工商銀行，我們看到貸款和承諾強勁成長，我們的信貸趨勢持續保持良好。從費用來看，我們的資本市場和諮詢趨勢仍然穩固，正如預期的那樣，財務管理繼續產生強勁的業績。

In retail banking, we are accelerating customer growth. Our consumer checking accounts grew by 2% year over year, including 6% growth in the Southwest. We also saw record debit and credit card activity this quarter, and we remain on track with our $1.5 billion branch investment which we plan to open more than 200 branches in our expansion markets.

在零售銀行業務方面，我們正在加速客戶成長。我們的消費者支票帳戶年增 2%，其中西南地區成長 6%。本季度，我們的金融卡和信用卡活動也創下了歷史新高，我們 15 億美元的分支機構投資計劃仍在按計劃進行，計劃在擴張市場開設 200 多家分支機構。

Within our asset management business, we had positive net flows and new client acquisition increased 16% linked quarter. Inside of that, growth in our expansion markets accelerated as discretionary assets under management grew nearly 3 times that of legacy markets, albeit off a small base.

在我們的資產管理業務中，我們實現了正淨流量，新客戶獲取量較上季成長了 16%。其中，儘管基數較小，但我們擴張市場的成長速度加快，可自由支配的資產管理規模成長幾乎是傳統市場的 3 倍。

In closing, we continue to demonstrate the strength of our national franchise and deliver on our objectives. We are poised to further capitalize on our growth potential, and I remain very optimistic about our future.

最後，我們繼續展示我們國家特許經營的實力並實現我們的目標。我們準備進一步利用我們的成長潛力，我對我們的未來仍然非常樂觀。

And finally, I just want to take a minute to thank our talented employees for their efforts, which are vital to all of our success and growth.

最後，我只想花一點時間感謝我們才華橫溢的員工所做的努力，這對我們所有人的成功和成長至關重要。

With that, Rob will take you through the quarter. Rob?

接下來，Rob 將帶您回顧本季。搶？

Thanks, Bill, and good morning, everyone.

謝謝，比爾，大家早安。

Our balance sheet is on slide 4 and is presented on an average basis. For the linked quarter, loans of $323 billion increased $6 billion or 2%. Investment securities of $142 billion were stable, and our cash balance at the Federal Reserve was $31 billion, a decrease of $3 billion.

我們的資產負債表在第 4 張投影片上，以平均值呈現。就第一季而言，貸款總額為 3,230 億美元，增加了 60 億美元，增幅為 2%。1,420億美元的投資證券保持穩定，我們在聯準會的現金餘額為310億美元，減少了30億美元。

Deposit balances increased $2 billion and averaged $423 billion and our borrowings remain stable at $65 billion. At quarter end, AOCI was negative $4.7 billion, an improvement of $555 million or 11% compared with March 31.

存款餘額增加了 20 億美元，平均達到 4,230 億美元，而我們的借款維持穩定在 650 億美元。截至本季末，AOCI 為負 47 億美元，較 3 月 31 日改善 5.55 億美元，增幅 11%。

Our tangible book value increased to approximately $104 per common share, which was a 4% increase linked quarter and a 17% increase compared to the same period a year ago. We remain well capitalized with an estimated CET1 ratio of 10.5% and an estimated CET1 ratio inclusive of AOCI to be 9.4% at quarter end.

我們的有形帳面價值增加至每股普通股約 104 美元，較上季成長 4%，比去年同期成長 17%。我們的資本充足率仍然充足，預計 CET1 比率為 10.5%，而包含 AOCI 在內的 CET1 比率預計在季度末為 9.4%。

We continue to be well-positioned with capital flexibility. During the quarter, we returned approximately $1 billion of capital to shareholders, which included $640 million in common dividends and $335 million of share repurchases.

我們繼續保持良好的資本彈性。本季度，我們向股東返還了約 10 億美元的資本，其中包括 6.4 億美元的普通股股息和 3.35 億美元的股票回購。

As Bill just mentioned, our Board recently approved a $0.10 increase to our quarterly cash dividend on common stock, raising the dividend to $1.70 per share, and we expect repurchases in the third quarter to be between $300 million and $400 million.

正如比爾剛才提到的，我們的董事會最近批准將普通股季度現金股息增加 0.10 美元，使股息達到每股 1.70 美元，我們預計第三季的回購額將在 3 億美元至 4 億美元之間。

Our recent CCAR results underscore the strength of our balance sheet and as previously announced, our current stress capital buffer remains at the regulatory minimum of 2.5%.

我們最近的 CCAR 結果凸顯了我們資產負債表的強勁，並且正如先前宣布的那樣，我們當前的壓力資本緩衝仍保持在監管最低水平 2.5%。

Slide 5 shows our loans in more detail. During the second quarter, we delivered solid loan growth. Loan balances averaged $323 billion, an increase of $6 billion or 2% compared to the first quarter. The growth was driven by C&I, which increased $7 billion or 4%, reflecting strong new production and higher utilization.

幻燈片 5 更詳細地展示了我們的貸款。第二季度，我們的貸款實現了穩健成長。貸款餘額平均為 3,230 億美元，較第一季增加 60 億美元，增幅為 2%。這一成長主要由商業與工業 (C&I) 推動，增加了 70 億美元，即 4%，反映出強勁的新產量和更高的利用率。

Commercial real estate loans declined $1 billion or 4% as we continue to reduce certain exposures, and during the second quarter, our CRE office balances declined $500 million. Consumer loans were stable as growth in auto balances was offset by a decline in residential real estate loans and our total loan yield of 5.7% was stable with the first quarter.

由於我們繼續減少某些風險敞口，商業房地產貸款減少了 10 億美元，下降 4%，而在第二季度，我們的 CRE 辦公室餘額減少了 5 億美元。消費貸款保持穩定，因為汽車貸款餘額的成長被住宅房地產貸款的下降所抵消，我們的總貸款收益率為 5.7%，與第一季持平。

Slide 6 details our investment securities and swap portfolios. Average investment securities remain stable at $142 billion. During the second quarter, our securities yield was 3.26%, an increase of 9 basis points, and as of June 30, our duration was estimated to be 3.4 years.

投影片 6 詳細介紹了我們的投資證券和掉期投資組合。平均投資證券維持穩定在 1,420 億美元。第二季度，我們的證券收益率為 3.26%，增加了 9 個基點，截至 6 月 30 日，我們的期限估計為 3.4 年。

Our period end securities balances increased $5 billion or 3%, reflecting net purchases, the majority of which were residential mortgage backed securities with an average yield of 5.4%. Regarding our swaps, active received fixed rate swaps totaled $40 billion on June 30 with the receive rate of 3.62%, which increased 13 basis points linked quarter.

我們的期末證券餘額增加了 50 億美元，即 3%，反映出淨購買量，其中大部分是住宅抵押貸款支持證券，平均收益率為 5.4%。就我們的掉期交易而言，6 月 30 日，主動收到的固定利率掉期總額為 400 億美元，收到利率為 3.62%，較上季上升 13 個基點。

Forward starting swaps were $16 billion with a receive rate of 4.07% and approximately 40% of these swaps will become active in 2025.

遠期起始掉期金額為 160 億美元，接收利率為 4.07%，其中約 40% 將於 2025 年生效。

Slide 7 covers our deposit balances in more detail. Average deposits increased $2 billion driven by growth in CDs, both brokered and direct with a balance of consumer and commercial deposits remaining stable during the quarter.

投影片 7 更詳細地介紹了我們的存款餘額。受經紀和直接存單成長的推動，平均存款增加了 20 億美元，本季消費者和商業存款餘額保持穩定。

Non-interest bearing balances increased $1 billion and remained at 22% of total deposits and our rate paid on interest bearing deposits stayed essentially flat at 2.24%, up just 1 basis point.

無息餘額增加了 10 億美元，仍佔總存款的 22%，而我們支付的計息存款利率基本上保持在 2.24% 的水平，僅上漲了 1 個基點。

Turning to slide 8. We highlight our income statement trends. Comparing the second quarter to the first quarter, total revenue was up $209 million or 4%, and non-interest expense was stable, which allowed us to deliver 4% positive operating leverage and 10% growth in PPNR.

翻到幻燈片 8。我們重點介紹我們的損益表趨勢。與第一季相比，第二季總收入成長了 2.09 億美元，增幅為 4%，非利息支出保持穩定，這使我們能夠實現 4% 的正經營槓桿和 10% 的 PPNR 成長。

Provision was $254 million, reflecting the impact of changes in macroeconomic scenarios, tariff considerations, and portfolio activity, including loan growth. Our effective tax rate was 18.8% and second quarter net income was $1.6 billion or $3.85 per share.

撥備金額為 2.54 億美元，反映了宏觀經濟情境變化、關稅考量和投資組合活動（包括貸款成長）的影響。我們的有效稅率為 18.8%，第二季淨收入為 16 億美元，即每股 3.85 美元。

In the first half of the year compared to the same time last year, we've demonstrated strong momentum across our franchise. Total revenue increased $557 million or 5%, driven by higher net interest income and fee income growth.

與去年同期相比，今年上半年我們的整個特許經營業務表現出了強勁的發展勢頭。總收入增加了 5.57 億美元，即 5%，這得益於淨利息收入和費用收入的成長。

Non-interest expense increased $79 million or 1%, reflecting increased business activity, technology investments, and higher marketing spend and net income grew $321 million resulting in the EPS growth of 14%.

非利息支出增加了 7,900 萬美元，即 1%，反映了業務活動增加、技術投資和行銷支出增加，淨收入增長了 3.21 億美元，導致每股收益增長 14%。

Turning to slide 9. We detail our revenue trends. Second quarter revenue of $5.7 billion increased $209 million or 4% linked quarter. Net interest income of $3.6 billion increased $79 million or 2%. The growth was driven by higher loan balances, the continued benefit of fixed rate asset repricing, and one additional day in the quarter.

翻到第 9 張投影片。我們詳細說明了我們的收入趨勢。第二季營收為 57 億美元，季增 2.09 億美元，成長 4%。淨利息收入 36 億美元，增加 7,900 萬美元，即 2%。成長的動力來自於貸款餘額的增加、固定利率資產重新定價的持續收益以及本季的額外一天。

And our net interest margin was 2.8%, an increase of 2 basis points. Non-interest income increased $130 million or 7%. Inside of that, fee income increased $55 million or 3% linked quarter to $1.9 billion. Looking at the details, capital markets and advisory revenue increased $15 million, reflecting broad-based increase in capital markets activity, much of which occurred late in the quarter.

我們的淨利差為2.8%，增加了2個基點。非利息收入增加 1.3 億美元，增幅 7%。其中，費用收入較上季增加 5,500 萬美元，即 3%，達到 19 億美元。具體來看，資本市場和諮詢收入增加了 1500 萬美元，反映了資本市場活動的廣泛增長，其中大部分發生在本季末。

Card and cash management revenue grew $45 million or 7%, driven by seasonally higher consumer spending and growth in treasury management. Mortgage revenue decreased $6 million or 4%, primarily due to lower residential mortgage servicing activity.

受季節性消費支出增加和財務管理成長的推動，卡片和現金管理收入增加了 4,500 萬美元，增幅為 7%。抵押貸款收入減少 600 萬美元，即 4%，主要原因是住宅抵押貸款服務活動減少。

Another non-interest income of $212 million increased $75 million primarily reflecting Visa-related activity and other valuation adjustments.

另一項非利息收入為 2.12 億美元，增加了 7,500 萬美元，主要反映了與 Visa 相關的活動和其他估值調整。

Turning to slide 10. Our expenses remained well controlled and were stable linked quarter. Seasonally higher marketing spend and continued technology investments were more than offset by our disciplined expense management.

翻到第 10 張投影片。我們的支出仍然得到良好控制並且與上一季保持穩定。我們嚴格的費用管理足以抵銷季節性較高的行銷支出和持續的技術投資。

And as we previously stated, we have a goal to reduce costs by $350 million in 2025 through our continuous improvement program. As you know, this program funds a significant portion of our ongoing business and technology investments, and we're on track to achieve our full year target.

正如我們之前所說，我們的目標是透過持續改進計劃到 2025 年將成本降低 3.5 億美元。如您所知，該計劃為我們正在進行的業務和技術投資提供了很大一部分資金，我們有望實現全年目標。

Our credit metrics are presented on slide 11. Overall, credit quality remains strong with improvements in non-performing loans, delinquencies, and charge offs. Non-performing loans of $2.1 billion were down $184 million or 8%, driven by declines in both C&I and commercial real estate non-performing loans.

我們的信用指標在第 11 張投影片上展示。整體而言，信貸品質依然強勁，不良貸款、拖欠和沖銷情況有所改善。不良貸款為 21 億美元，下降了 1.84 億美元，降幅為 8%，主要是由於工商業和商業房地產不良貸款減少所致。

Total delinquencies of $1.3 billion declined $128 million or 9% compared with March 31, reflecting both lower consumer and commercial delinquencies. Net loan charge offs were $198 million, down $7 million and represent a net charge off ratio of 25 basis points.

總拖欠金額為 13 億美元，與 3 月 31 日相比減少了 1.28 億美元，降幅為 9%，反映出消費者和商業拖欠金額均有所下降。淨貸款沖銷額為 1.98 億美元，下降 700 萬美元，淨沖銷率為 25 個基點。

And our allowance for credit losses totaled $5.3 billion or 1.62% of total loans at the end of the second quarter, which included tariff considerations.

截至第二季末，我們的信貸損失準備金總額為 53 億美元，佔貸款總額的 1.62%，其中包括關稅考量。

In summary, PNC reported a solid second quarter and we're well-positioned for the second half of 2025. Regarding our view of the overall economy, we're expecting continued economic growth in the second half of the year, resulting in real GDP growth of approximately 1.5% in 2025 and unemployment to increase to around 4.5% over the next 12 months.

總而言之，PNC 報告第二季業績穩健，我們為 2025 年下半年做好了準備。關於整體經濟的看法，我們預期下半年經濟將持續成長，2025年實質GDP成長率約為1.5%，未來12個月失業率將上升至4.5%左右。

We expect the Fed to cut rates once in 2025 with a 25 basis point decrease in December. Considering our reported first half operating results, third quarter expectations, and current economic forecasts, our full year 2025 guidance is as follows: for the full year 2025 compared to the full year 2024, we expect average loans to be up approximately 1% versus our prior guidance of stable.

我們預計聯準會將在 2025 年降息一次，12 月降息 25 個基點。考慮到我們報告的上半年經營業績、第三季預期和當前的經濟預測，我們對 2025 年全年的指導如下：與 2024 年全年相比，我們預計 2025 年全年平均貸款將比我們之前的穩定指導增長約 1%。

We expect full year net interest income to increase approximately 7%, up from our previous guidance of up 6% to 7%. We now expect non-interest income to be up approximately 4% to 5%, down slightly from our previous guidance of up 5%, primarily reflecting the continued level of heightened economic uncertainty.

我們預計全年淨利息收入將成長約 7%，高於我們先前預測的 6% 至 7%。我們現在預計非利息收入將成長約 4% 至 5%，略低於我們先前預測的 5% 的成長，主要反映了持續加劇的經濟不確定性。

Taking the component pieces of revenue together, we continue to expect total revenue to be up approximately 6%. We continue to expect non-interest expenses to be up approximately 1% and we expect our effective tax rate to be approximately 19%.

綜合考慮各部分收入，我們預計總收入仍將成長約 6%。我們繼續預計非利息支出將上漲約 1%，並且我們預計有效稅率將達到約 19%。

For the third quarter of 2025 compared to the second quarter of 2025, we expect average loans to be up approximately 1%, net interest income to be approximately up 3%, fee income to be up between 3% and 4%, other non-interest to be in the range of $150 million to $200 million.

對於 2025 年第三季與 2025 年第二季相比，我們預計平均貸款將成長約 1%，淨利息收入將成長約 3%，費用收入將成長 3% 至 4%，其他非利息收入將在 1.5 億美元至 2 億美元之間。

Taking the component pieces of revenue together, we expect total revenue to be up between 2% and 3%. We expect non-interest expense to be up approximately 2%, and we expect third quarter net charge-offs to be in the range of $275 million to $300 million.

綜合考慮各部分收入，我們預計總收入將成長 2% 至 3%。我們預計非利息支出將成長約 2%，我們預計第三季淨沖銷額將在 2.75 億美元至 3 億美元之間。

And with that, Bill and I are ready to take your questions.

現在，比爾和我已準備好回答你們的問題。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

David George, Baird.

大衛喬治，貝爾德。

Question on the pick up you had in loan growth in the quarter. A lot of it looks like it's coming from commercial. There's a pick up in the line of credit utilization, but would like to get some color and context around that growth and how sustainable you think it might be. And then I've got a quick follow up as well.

關於本季貸款成長是否回升的問題。其中很多看起來都像是來自商業廣告。信貸額度利用率有所回升，但希望了解這種增長的具體情況和背景，以及您認為這種增長的可持續性。然後我也會進行快速跟進。

Yeah, sure. It's Rob.

是的，當然。是羅布。

Yeah, so loan growth was strong in the second quarter, and it really was the combination of an uptick in utilization in part due to obviously some tariff related considerations, but importantly, for us, on top of that was also new production in large part from our growth markets, which is simply the fruition of years of working toward that.

是的，第二季的貸款成長強勁，這實際上是利用率上升的綜合作用，部分原因顯然是一些與關稅相關的考慮，但對我們來說，重要的是，除此之外，很大程度上還有來自我們成長市場的新產品，這只是多年努力的成果。

So it really was a combination that drove those higher levels. When we look to the balance of the year, the balance of '25, we don't have quite the same loan growth repeating. We do have some more loan growth than what we thought, so we raised, as you saw in our full year guidance average loans from stable to up 1%.

因此，這確實是一種推動更高水平的結合。當我們回顧今年的餘額，即 25 年的餘額時，我們並沒有看到完全相同的貸款成長。我們的貸款成長確實比我們想像的要多，因此，正如您在全年指導中所看到的，我們將平均貸款從穩定水平提高到了 1%。

To that end, staying on NII. Between the pick up and loan growth, Rob, and you added, as you mentioned, added to securities portfolio towards the end of the quarter, and your inherent positioning with asset repricing and swaps coming off, presumably, you continue to be in a pretty favorable NII position going into the back half and in the next year.

為此，繼續使用 NII。在經濟回暖和貸款成長之間，羅布，正如您所提到的，您在本季度末增加了證券投資組合，並且您在資產重新定價和掉期方面的固有定位即將實現，據推測，您在下半年和明年將繼續處於非常有利的 NII 地位。

Just want to get a sense as to how you're thinking about the trajectory of NII in the back half and then into '26.

只是想了解您如何看待 NII 在後半段以及 26 年的發展軌跡。

Yeah, sure. So because of the items that you mentioned, we did up our guidance for the full year from up 6% to 7% to 7% for NII, and the momentum will continue into '26. We won't get into specific guidance, but we expect a similar and sustained trajectory.

是的，當然。因此，由於您提到的因素，我們將全年 NII 預期從 6% 上調至 7%，而這一勢頭將持續到 26 年。我們不會給出具體的指導，但我們預期會出現類似且持續的軌跡。

Chris McGratty, KBW.

克里斯·麥格拉蒂，KBW。

Bill, kind of a big picture question for you. It feels like we're at a really important spot for the industry given what's happening in Washington, the political environment and the deregulatory environment. I'm interested in how are your updated views of how this may play out for PNC.

比爾，我想問你一個比較宏觀的問題。考慮到華盛頓的現狀、政治環境和放鬆管制的環境，我們感覺我們正處於一個對產業來說非常重要的位置。我感興趣的是，您對此事對 PNC 的影響有何最新看法。

You've talked about the benefits but also the frustration with scale over the years and also balancing with what is seemingly a little bit better organic growth outlook.

您談到了規模帶來的好處，但也談到了多年來規模擴大帶來的挫敗感，以及如何平衡看似更好的有機成長前景。

Look, ignoring what's happening in D.C., we're on a good path that new markets and new clients are giving us an organic growth opportunity that we haven't seen in years. At the margin, Washington comes in and out and regulations get easier and harder and we succeed in all of those environments.

你看，不管華盛頓發生了什麼，我們正走在一條好的道路上，新市場和新客戶為我們帶來了多年未見的有機成長機會。在邊際上，華盛頓的進進出出，監管變得越來越簡單和嚴格，我們在所有這些環境中都取得了成功。

So we're in an environment today where that -- where regulation gives us a bit of a tailwind which is a good thing, and you'll see that not just some of the capital ratios and adjustments and Basel III endgame and so on and so forth, but also I think through time and the amount of money we actually spend on what I'm just going to call busy work, yeah, responding to regulatory things that don't necessarily have a lot to do with core risk in the bank.

因此，我們今天所處的環境是，監管給我們帶來了一些順風，這是一件好事，你會看到，不僅僅是一些資本比率和調整以及巴塞爾協議 III 的最終結果等等，而且我認為，隨著時間的推移，我們實際上花費了大量的金錢，我稱之為繁忙的工作，是的，應對與銀行核心風險沒有太大關係的監管事務。

But all of that helps at the margin against the backdrop of a company that's actually growing clients and growing business at a pretty healthy clip. We feel pretty good about where we are.

但在公司客戶和業務實際上都在以相當健康的速度成長的背景下，所有這些都對公司產生了邊際幫助。我們對目前的狀況感到十分滿意。

John Pancari, Evercore ISI.

約翰·潘卡里（John Pancari），Evercore ISI。

Just wanted to get some additional color on your fee income outlook for the full year. Your fee trends came in pretty solidly in the second quarter. You cited the upside capital markets and a little bit of upside in other, but you had nudged your fee guidance is lower.

只是想對全年費用收入前景獲得一些額外的資訊。您的費用趨勢在第二季相當穩健。您提到了資本市場的上漲以及其他市場的一點點上漲，但您卻暗示費用指導會降低。

It looks like the street was already there, but you nudged that you lowered the economic uncertainty. If you could maybe just elaborate what's keeping you from getting a little bit more confident there. I know you said that you're seeing record pipelines in your capital markets business.

看起來這條街已經存在了，但你提醒你降低了經濟的不確定性。您能否詳細說明一下是什麼阻礙了您變得更有自信？我知道您說過，您的資本市場業務正在創下紀錄。

So maybe can you just talk about the puts and takes there and the rationale in nudging that lower.

那麼，您能否談談其中的看跌期權和獲利期權以及降低該價格的理由？

Yeah. Sure, John. So if we go back to our January expectations relative to total non-interest income growth, we've set up 5%. We've got a small revision to that downward. So we're now saying 4% to 5%, so that's a 1% decline on an $8.4 billion-plus number. So pretty small.

是的。當然，約翰。因此，如果我們回顧 1 月對非利息收入總額成長的預期，我們設定的成長率是 5%。我們對此進行了小幅下調修改。所以我們現在說的是 4% 到 5%，也就是說在 84 億美元以上的數字上下降了 1%。非常小。

And we chalk that up to sort of the heightened uncertainty that emerged after January that we're all well aware of. And we've seen some soft spots in the first quarter with corporate spending activity. Mortgage is a touch less, and then as we discussed in a recent conference, private equity valuations, which is in other non-interest income have some headwinds relative to our expectations in January, but it's pretty small.

我們將此歸因於一月份之後出現的不確定性加劇，這一點我們都很清楚。我們發現第一季企業支出活動出現了一些疲軟現象。抵押貸款稍微少一點，然後正如我們在最近的一次會議上討論的那樣，私募股權估值（其他非利息收入）相對於我們 1 月份的預期有一些阻力，但阻力很小。

And to your point, the major categories, asset management's ahead of where we expected in January. Capital markets is right on what we expected in January. So we think it's -- fees are pretty good and they're obviously pretty resilient given everything that we've been through with the turbulence.

正如您所說，主要類別的資產管理超出了我們一月份的預期。資本市場與我們一月份的預期一致。因此我們認為——費用相當不錯，而且考慮到我們經歷的一切動盪，費用顯然具有相當強的彈性。

And then just separately, we're been hearing some of the banks citing somewhat higher or intensifying competitive pressure around loan pricing. A couple of the banks are citing tighter spreads that's impacting some of their fixed asset, loan pricing benefit.

另外，我們聽到一些銀行表示貸款定價的競爭壓力增加或加劇。一些銀行表示，利差收窄影響了它們的部分固定資產和貸款定價收益。

Can you maybe talk about what you're seeing out there in terms of loan pricing, particularly as loan growth is accelerating and I know your loan yields were flat this quarter. Is competition at all impacting that or is that really just the swap dynamics?

您能否談談您在貸款定價方面看到的情況，特別是在貸款成長加速的情況下，我知道本季度您的貸款收益率持平。競爭是否對此有影響，或者這實際上只是交換動態？

No. I think when you look at our spreads, our spreads are pretty consistent, so there's always competition. There's certainly no spread expansion. But we haven't seen a lot of contraction. If anything, we might have a little bit of spread pressure just because our asset mix, our loan mix tends recently to be sort of a higher credit quality, but nothing that's thrown us off our yields, but when rates are fairly steady, spreads are fairly steady, the yields are pretty steady.

不。我認為，當你查看我們的利差時，我們的利差相當一致，因此總是存在競爭。肯定不會有利差擴大的情況。但我們並未看到大幅收縮。如果有的話，我們可能會有一點利差壓力，因為我們的資產組合、我們的貸款組合最近傾向於更高的信用質量，但這並沒有影響我們的收益率，但當利率相當穩定時，利差相當穩定，收益率也相當穩定。

Competition seems pretty rational. Yeah. So I'm -- yeah, not much changed.

競爭看起來相當理性。是的。所以我——是的，沒有太大變化。

Scott Siefers, Piper Sandler.

史考特·西佛斯、派珀·桑德勒。

Let's see. Rob, I just wanted to ask a little on the margin dynamics. I think in the past, you all have talked about the margin potentially expanding up to like 2.90% by the end of the year. That's something you're still sort of pointing towards or hoping to achieve?

讓我們來看看。羅布，我只是想問一下關於保證金動態的問題。我想，過去大家都曾談論過利潤率到年底可能擴大到 2.90% 左右。這是您仍在追求或希望實現的目標嗎？

I guess as I think of things that the asset repricing story, it's pretty much become self-evident at this point. It's terrific. I would imagine deposit benefits just get tougher if the Fed isn't cutting as aggressively. I think you said you only have the one rate cut in December in your model.

我想，當我思考資產重新定價的故事時，它現在已經變得不言而喻了。太棒了。我想，如果聯準會不大幅降息，存款福利只會變得更加困難。我認為您說過，您的模型中 12 月只有一次降息。

So maybe how you're thinking about that trajectory would be great, please.

所以也許您對該軌蹟的看法會很棒，請問。

Sure. I think you summed it up well that nothing's changed. We're still tracking to that 2.90% range by the end of the year that I said on the first quarter earnings call.

當然。我認為你總結得很好，什麼都沒有改變。我們仍將追蹤我在第一季財報電話會議上所說的到年底的 2.90% 的範圍。

And then I guess a small one. Any rationale behind the thought that third quarter charge offs would increase? I guess it feels like there's been a couple quarters in a row where the expectation has turned out to be worse than the reality which is a good thing, but just curious if there's anything behind the thinking there.

然後我猜是一個小的。認為第三季沖銷額將會增加的理由是什麼？我想感覺好像已經連續幾季預期比現實更糟糕了，這是一件好事，但我只是好奇這背後是否有任何想法。

Yeah. Lower charge offs are definitely a better thing. Yeah. So, yeah, charge offs have come in favorably year-to-date relative to our expectations. We did lower our guide meaning improved. We've been running at estimated $300 million a quarter.

是的。降低沖銷額肯定是好事。是的。是的，今年迄今的沖銷情況與我們的預期相比是有利的。我們確實降低了我們的指導意義。我們每季的營運成本預計為 3 億美元。

We've been doing closer to $200 million. So we lowered our guide to $275 million to $300 million because there is still this sort of pipeline of charge offs related to commercial real estate office that we know is going to pull through, all fully reserved.

我們的收入已經接近 2 億美元。因此，我們將指導金額下調至 2.75 億美元至 3 億美元，因為我們知道仍有與商業房地產辦公室相關的此類沖銷管道，這些管道將會全部通過，並且全部保留。

So not an economic impact, but at some point, they will flow through, and we expect that to occur over the next several quarters. But other than that, the credit quality is very good.

因此，這不會對經濟產生影響，但在某個時候，它們會產生影響，我們預計這將在未來幾季發生。但除此之外，信用品質非常好。

Yeah. No, it seems that way.

是的。不，看起來是這樣。

Ebrahim Poonawala, Bank of America.

美國銀行的 Ebrahim Poonawala。

I guess, sorry if I missed this, Rob. Just talk to us how you're thinking about capital levels means yes, a bunch of like regulatory changes sort of on the comp, but as we think about the right target CET1 for PNC in a world where banks triple your size are seeing requirements coming lower, how do you think about it?

我想，如果我錯過了這個，我很抱歉，羅布。請與我們談談您對資本水準的看法，這意味著是的，公司會面臨一系列監管變化，但當我們考慮 PNC 的正確目標 CET1 時，在一個規模是您三倍的銀行看到要求降低的世界裡，您如何看待它？

Like I was going back, there've been times when you operated with a 9.5% CET1. Just what the thought process is even if you're not willing to sort of commit to a certain target today? Would love to hear how you think about your capital relative to larger peers just as we think about just the relative competitive advantage versus disadvantage.

就像我回去的時候一樣，曾經有一段時間你的 CET1 為 9.5%。即使您今天不願意致力於某個目標，那麼您的想法到底是怎麼樣的？我很想聽聽您如何看待您的資本相對於較大的同行，就像我們思考相對競爭優勢與劣勢一樣。

Sure. Yeah. Well, it's Rob. So yeah, so you saw we printed CET1 10.5% with AOCI included 9.4% in our recent stress tests that require 7%. So we're in a healthy excess capital position. The short answer is we think that the levels that we are right now with the rules still yet to be finalized feels about right.

當然。是的。嗯，這是羅布。是的，您看到我們在最近的壓力測試中列印了 CET1 10.5%，其中 AOCI 包括 9.4%，而壓力測試要求 7%。因此，我們的資本過剩狀況良好。簡而言之，我們認為，在規則尚未最終確定的情況下，我們目前的水平感覺是正確的。

We did up our share repurchases as a result in the second quarter and said that we're going to sustain that $300 million to $400 million of repurchases into the third quarter. Obviously, the highest and best use of our capital is for loans.

因此，我們在第二季增加了股票回購，並表示將在第三季維持 3 億至 4 億美元的回購規模。顯然，我們的資本最高和最佳用途是貸款。

We're pointed to and hopeful that we'll be able to use that capital towards that loan growth. But generally speaking, in terms of our capital levels, we feel like we're in the right place right now. We've got some flexibility.

我們希望能夠利用這些資金來促進貸款成長。但總體而言，就我們的資本水準而言，我們覺得我們現在處於正確的位置。我們有一定的彈性。

We've upped the share repurchases. We increased the dividend. So I think we're in a good spot.

我們增加了股票回購。我們增加了股利。所以我認為我們處於一個很好的位置。

The only thing I'd add, you might have seen a comment letter that BPI put out about one of the rating agencies, which is the binding constraint for the industry right now. And so we're all even in today's environment, higher than we need to be vis-a-vis regulatory rules.

我唯一想補充的是，您可能已經看到了 BPI 發布的關於其中一家評級機構的評論信，這是目前該行業的約束性約束。因此，即使在當今環境下，我們的監管規則也高於我們需要的水平。

But we're not necessarily there due to the rating agency rules, so there's some pushback on that, and that applies to all of us, not just our size or smaller or the giant banks. It's one of the things we're all dealing with and we need to work our way through.

但由於評級機構的規定，我們不一定能達到這個水平，因此存在一些阻力，這適用於我們所有銀行，而不僅僅是我們這種規模的銀行、小型銀行或大型銀行。這是我們所有人都在處理的事情之一，我們需要努力解決。

We've heard that. So thanks for mentioning that. And I guess just one follow up. Like on loan growth and capital markets, like is momentum picking up as we think about this conversation with clients and all of these?

我們聽說過。謝謝你提到這一點。我想只需跟進一次。就像貸款成長和資本市場一樣，當我們考慮與客戶的對話以及所有這些時，勢頭是否正在增強？

I'm just trying to get a sense of is there upside to growth outlook for the back half into '26. Should we be excited about that or is it still early days yet? We're still watching tariffs closely and like where do you kind of shake out between those two views?

我只是想知道 26 年下半年的成長前景是否還有上升空間。我們應該對此感到興奮嗎？還是現在還太早？我們仍在密切關注關稅，您如何看待這兩種觀點？

Like the one thing I will say on loan growth, because we've been terrible predicting it.

就像我要說的關於貸款成長的一件事，因為我們對此的預測一直很糟糕。

As an industry.

作為一個行業。

As an industry and well, which is, well, yeah, we don't put a prediction out there. But as I've said before, if there is loan growth in the industry, we will participate in it and likely do better just given our efforts in the newer markets.

作為一個行業，嗯，是的，我們不會做出預測。但正如我之前所說，如果行業中的貸款出現成長，我們就會參與其中，並且憑藉我們在新市場的努力，我們可能會做得更好。

The momentum is really good at the moment, but as we've seen, that can be disrupted pretty easily by the political environment and tariffs.

目前的勢頭確實很好，但正如我們所見，政治環境和關稅很容易打亂這種勢頭。

Steven Alexopoulos, TD Cowen.

史蒂文·亞歷克斯普洛斯（Steven Alexopoulos），TD Cowen。

I want to start maybe following up on what you just said in response to Ebrahim's question. So the commercial loan growth is coming from the newer markets, the higher growth MSAs. Is this really a function of new bankers and share gains? Are you guys seeing broad-based improved optimism across those faster growing MSAs?

我想開始跟進您剛才回答 Ebrahim 的問題時說的話。因此，商業貸款成長來自較新的市場和較高成長的 MSA。這真的是新銀行家和股票收益的結果嗎？你們是否看到那些快速成長的 MSA 中普遍存在樂觀情緒的提升？

It's largely share gain.

這主要是份額增長。

So more specific to PNC. Okay. Hey Bill, this is my first time on your call, and I wanted to take a minute and revisit the scale argument. We just had the big four banks report. When I look at your results compared to them, you guys are very efficient, right? You look at the retail banks, really solid good organic growth, growing checking accounts.

因此對於 PNC 來說更為具體。好的。嘿，比爾，這是我第一次接聽你的電話，我想花一點時間重新討論規模論點。我們剛收到了四大銀行的報告。當我將你們的成果與他們的成果進行比較時，我發現你們的效率很高，對嗎？看看零售銀行，它們確實實現了穩健的有機成長，支票帳戶也在不斷增長。

But you don't have the complexity of a $1 trillion plus bank. To me, you seem to be in the sweet spot, but I know you. You've talked quite a bit about needing more scale. What's the benefit to doing a larger deal moving much above your current size because you seem to be in a great spot right now?

但你並不像一家資產超過一兆美元的銀行那麼複雜。對我來說，你似乎處於最佳狀態，但我了解你。您已經多次談到需要擴大規模。由於您目前似乎處於一個很好的位置，那麼進行一筆比您目前規模更大的交易有什麼好處呢？

Well, you didn't hear us talk about doing a large deal. You just said bigger is better, and left to our own devices and organic growth, we will get there. The the argument for scale largely is around the very visible concentration, consolidation of retail share in the US.

好吧，你沒有聽到我們談論做一筆大交易。您剛才說越大越好，只要我們依靠自己的努力和有機成長，我們就能實現目標。規模的爭論主要圍繞著美國零售份額明顯的集中化和整合。

And to succeed long term as you watch the very big banks grow, we need to be in all markets and have really good products and low cost to serve those clients because that feeds the rest of our engine, right? I am 100% convinced we can grow our C&I franchise organically.

正如你所看到的，大型銀行正在不斷發展，為了取得長期成功，我們需要進入所有市場，擁有真正優質的產品和低成本來服務這些客戶，因為這將為我們的引擎提供動力，對嗎？我百分之百地相信我們可以有機地發展我們的 C&I 特許經營權。

There's a race on retail deposits, and that's why we have this big focus on the investment and building branches and we're refurbishing, I don't remember the number, Rob, but the majority of our old branches, we're rolling out, we're probably halfway through now the rollout of a new online banking.

零售存款競爭激烈，這就是為什麼我們如此重視投資和建設分支機構，我們正在進行翻新，我不記得具體數字了，羅布，但是我們正在推出大多數舊分支機構，現在我們可能已經完成了新網上銀行推出的一半。

We're going to put out new mobile, agentic AI and client service, all of the things you need to do to win in this space. With that comes the ability to spread marketing dollars, the ability to spread technology dollars, and everything else that is kind of self-evident and scale itself.

我們將推出新的行動、代理人工智慧和客戶服務，這些都是您在這個領域取得成功所需要做的一切。隨之而來的是傳播行銷資金的能力、傳播技術資金的能力，以及其他一切不言而喻和可擴大規模的能力。

And particularly the technology dollars which are increasing.

尤其是技術方面的投入正在增加。

Betsy Graseck, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的 Betsy Graseck。

4% positive operating leverage, very impressive, and I just wanted to get, and I know you've always got continuous improvement. Every year, wash, rinse, repeat, helping drive that buzz. How does AI impact the degree to which you can get even more efficient from here?

4% 的正營業槓桿，非常令人印象深刻，我只是想得到，而且我知道你們一直在不斷進步。每年，清洗、沖洗、重複，幫助推動這種熱潮。人工智慧如何影響您從這裡獲得更高效率的程度？

Is it just starting and we have to wait five years, or is it heavily embedded already in the results and it's here today or some other answer? I just wondering.

它是剛開始，我們還要等五年嗎？還是它已經深深嵌入結果中，今天就出現了，或者有其他答案？我只是好奇。

That's actually a really good way to state the question. So I can give you a million ways for using AI and thinking about AI, but the more interesting question is, how is it going to help you make more money or save costs.

這實際上是一種很好的提出問題的方式。因此，我可以為您提供一百萬種使用人工智慧和思考人工智慧的方法，但更有趣的問題是，它將如何幫助您賺更多的錢或節省成本。

And what's in use today that is saving us a lot of money principally in fraud related areas. So you see charges go way down in documents or that helps our employees get answers faster, in data lake creation, and burst through capacity, the clouds that help us deliver more accurate models faster.

目前所使用的技術主要在與詐欺相關的領域為我們節省了大量資金。因此，您會看到文件費用大幅下降，這可以幫助我們的員工更快地獲得答案，在資料湖創建和突破容量方面，雲端可以幫助我們更快地提供更準確的模型。

And then the basic, how do you save money through time, Betsy, is this continuation of automation that we've had largely in our back office for the last 10 years. This may accelerate it. But continuous improvement for years has been figuring out how to do the same workload with less and AI is going to be a big part of that, and we're looking at it in everything we do.

然後最基本的，你如何隨著時間的推移節省資金，貝琪，這是我們在過去 10 年裡在後台辦公室主要採用的自動化技術的延續。這可能會加速這一進程。但多年來的持續改進一直在研究如何用更少的資源完成同樣的工作量，而人工智慧將在其中發揮重要作用，我們在所做的每一件事中都會關注它。

So it's early days?

那麼現在還為時過早嗎？

I just don't think there's going to be this gigantic change in the cost base. I think you're just going to see, at least in our instance, our ability to keep expenses on the low end as it relates to people even as we invest in the technology.

我只是不認為成本基礎會發生如此巨大的變化。我想你會看到，至少在我們的例子中，即使我們投資於技術，我們仍然能夠將與人相關的支出保持在較低水平。

It'll be the same trend. Go through our line -- go through our employee cost line versus our tech line for the last 10 years, and I just think it continues and AI is the next leg of that in effect. More interesting, longer term is away from the cool stuff we all talk about in AI.

這將是同樣的趨勢。回顧過去 10 年我們的員工成本線與技術線，我認為它會持續下去，而人工智慧實際上是它的下一個階段。更有趣的是，長期來看，它遠離了我們在人工智慧中談論的那些酷東西。

You could be faster, you can solve models for all that stuff is that how might it change the overall delivery of financial services. And that occupies a lot of our time. So we keep talking about the tools. We don't actually talk about the clients and how you end up delivering financial services in a world where advice can be computer generated through in mobile and that's where we're spending all our time.

你可以更快地解決所有這些問題的模型，看看它如何改變金融服務的整體交付。這佔用了我們很多時間。所以我們一直在談論工具。我們實際上並沒有談論客戶，也沒有談論在這個可以透過行動裝置由電腦生成建議的世界中你最終如何提供金融服務，而這正是我們花費所有時間的地方。

Matt O'Connor, Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的馬特·奧康納。

I just wanted to get any thoughts you have on deposit pricing and how you're thinking about growth. Slide 7 shows just a very modest tick up in the rate paid, I think as you gre, the brokered. And just thoughts going forward. You've got plenty of deposits to grow loans given that loan to deposit ratio is so low, but my guess is you want to grow deposits still.

我只是想了解一下您對存款定價的看法以及您對成長的看法。投影片 7 顯示支付費率只是小幅上漲，我想如您所見，這是經紀費用。這只是未來的想法。鑑於貸存比如此之低，您有足夠的存款來增加貸款，但我猜您仍然希望增加存款。

It's Rob. So yeah, you're right on it. Rate paid in the quarter was pretty stable, up just 1 basis point over the first quarter. For the balance of the year, we do project more deposit growth, and the rate paid could actually go up a little bit, not huge, barring any rate cuts in addition to what we already expect at the end of the year, and that'll probably be more just sort of mix oriented rather than anything stack change wise.

是羅布。是的，你說得對。本季支付利率相當穩定，僅比第一季上漲 1 個基點。就今年的餘額而言，我們確實預計存款將有更多的增長，而且支付的利率實際上可能會略有上升，但不會大幅上升，除非在年底我們預期的利率之外再有任何降息，而且這可能只是一種混合導向，而不是任何堆疊變化。

But just as an aside, we are at least in the conversation as it relates to our new builds in the newer markets as to whether we should purposefully be more competitive in those markets to gain share faster. We're much more interested in actually just growing DDA households, but some of the optics, at least in some of the research pieces, in investors' minds or how fast are you actually growing deposits.

但順便說一句，我們至少在討論我們在新市場中的新建築是否應該有意識地在這些市場中提高競爭力，以更快地獲得份額。我們實際上更感興趣的是僅僅增加 DDA 家庭的數量，但至少在某些研究中，在投資者的心目中，或者存款的實際增長速度有多快。

Thus far, through this whole cycle, we've had one of the lowest cost deposit bases out there, and haven't had the chase rate at all, but it's at least part of our conversation internally right now as to whether or not we might change strategy on that particular parts of the markets we're trying to grow.

到目前為止，在整個週期中，我們擁有成本最低的存款基礎之一，並且根本沒有追逐利率，但目前我們內部正在討論是否要改變我們試圖發展的特定市場部分的策略。

And we do that all the time. It's deliberate and we'll pick our spot, but generally speaking, they are pretty stable. It might drift up a bit, but nothing of big magnitude.

我們一直都是這麼做的。這是經過深思熟慮的，我們會選擇我們的位置，但總的來說，它們相當穩定。它可能會稍微上升，但幅度不大。

And then just on the DDA accounts, and sorry if you've disclosed this, but do you give the level of the DDA accounts and any split between kind of the growth markets and the legacy markets in terms of growth rates?

然後僅關於 DDA 帳戶，如果您已經披露了這一點，很抱歉，但是您是否給出了 DDA 帳戶的水平以及在增長率方面增長市場和傳統市場之間的劃分？

Yeah. Year-to-date, we've grown, DDA's 2% and within that, 6% growth in the Southwest market, so you see that dynamic playing out there.

是的。今年迄今為止，我們的 DDA 成長了 2%，其中西南市場成長了 6%，所以你可以看到這種動態。

Just as an aside, this is an example of this issue for scale and needing to be in all markets. So we're going down into the Southwest, Southeast, and gaining share at a rapid pace. At the same time, our growth rate in our legacy markets, because we have the big banks building branches next to us here in Pittsburgh, is slowing down, Right?

順便說一句，這是一個規模問題以及需要涵蓋所有市場的例子。因此，我們正在向西南、東南地區進軍，並快速擴大市場份額。同時，由於大型銀行在匹茲堡附近設立分支機構，我們在傳統市場的成長率正在放緩，對嗎？

And so we're a player who can maintain market leading -- can grow and maintain market leading share in each market. And over time, that's going to happen, but that means you need to be in the markets, which is why we're going so heavy into the bill that we're doing.

因此，我們是能夠維持市場領先地位的參與者——能夠在每個市場中成長並保持市場領先份額。隨著時間的推移，這將會發生，但這意味著你需要進入市場，這就是我們如此重視這項法案的原因。

Ken Houston, Autonomous Research.

肯‧休斯頓，自主研究。

Just a question. Rob, you've mentioned and it's on one of the slides about starting to lock in higher yields and repricing risk and it just -- it looks like it wasn't a lot of new activity with the swaps book and the securities book was flat.

只是一個問題。羅布，你提到過，這是在一張投影片上關於開始鎖定更高收益率和重新定價風險的內容，看起來掉期帳簿並沒有太多新活動，證券帳簿也持平。

So I'm just wondering if you can kind of help us understand what you might be able to do as you look further out and start to think about protecting NII as you look ahead.

所以我只是想知道您是否可以幫助我們了解您在展望未來並開始考慮保護 NII 時可以做些什麼。

Yeah, sure. So yeah, we spoke about that on the first call. So from our perspective in terms of 2025, NII is largely bait. As we look into additional years out and that relates to the earlier question, we see ourselves sustaining that trajectory. So most of what we're doing and we've done a lot is sort of --

是的，當然。是的，我們在第一次通話中談到了這一點。因此，從我們 2025 年的角度來看，NII 在很大程度上是一個誘餌。當我們展望未來幾年並且這與先前的問題相關時，我們發現自己將維持這一軌跡。所以我們現在做的和已經做的很多事情都有點像--

Sustaining that growth rate.

維持這一成長率。

Sustaining that growth rate. And most of what we've done is sort of largely in place. So not a lot of activity relative to that in the last 90 days, but we're well positioned and feel good about the NII trajectory.

維持這一成長率。我們所做的大部分工作基本上都已經到位。因此，與過去 90 天相比，活動並不多，但我們已做好準備，對 NII 的發展軌跡感到樂觀。

And then just one follow up on the fees. I know you covered the fee categories and such, but just like within that capital markets business, you've got Harris Williams and you've got kind of the other related capital market stuff.

然後只需跟進一次費用。我知道您介紹了費用類別等，但就像在資本市場業務中一樣，您有哈里斯威廉斯（Harris Williams）以及其他相關的資本市場業務。

I think you said in the past that Harris Williams has kind of been fairly steady, but just wondering what you're seeing across the two sides of those businesses and what activity feels like underneath the surface.

我想您過去曾說過，哈里斯威廉斯一直相當穩定，但我只是想了解一下您對這兩家公司業務的雙方有何看法，以及表面之下的活動是什麼樣的。

Yeah. Capital markets, we feel good about it. Like I said, we are tracking to what we expected back in January. Harris Williams, which is our largest component of the capital markets segment, is about 30%, 40% of it, and they're tracking right on to what we expected, which is above last year, and last year was a pretty good year.

是的。資本市場，我們對此感覺良好。正如我所說的，我們正在追蹤我們一月份所預期的情況。哈里斯威廉斯 (Harris Williams) 是我們資本市場部門最大的組成部分，約佔 30% 到 40%，他們的表現完全符合我們的預期，高於去年，去年是相當不錯的一年。

What we saw at the end of the first quarter was just a pick up on our bread and butter FX and derivative based business volumes. So Harris Williams is kind of a headline item, but remember we have trading businesses and foreign exchange and derivatives and straight fixed income.

我們在第一季末看到的只是我們主要的外匯和衍生性商品業務量的回升。因此，哈里斯威廉斯 (Harris Williams) 有點像頭條新聞，但請記住，我們有交易業務、外匯、衍生性商品和直接固定收益。

We have new issue business. We've syndicated. There's a lot of stuff in there.

我們有新發行業務。我們已經聯合了。裡面有很多東西。

And to Bill's point, that was a little bit soft in the first quarter that has come back in the second quarter, and we expect to continue into the third quarter.

正如比爾所說，第一季的銷售略顯疲軟，但第二季已經回升，我們預計這種趨勢將持續到第三季。

Bill Carcache, Wolfe Research.

比爾‧卡卡什（Bill Carcache），沃爾夫研究公司。

Following up on the acceleration and loan production comments, are you hearing anything from clients on whether bonus depreciation and the tax bill could serve as a potential catalyst for incremental loan growth from your commercial clients?

在跟進有關加速和貸款生產的評論之後，您是否聽到客戶表示獎金折舊和稅收法案是否可以成為商業客戶增量貸款成長的潛在催化劑？

Not directly. I mean intuitively, it should, but I don't know that I've heard of anybody running out ready to spend. I think that's the bill passed.

不是直接的。我的意思是，直覺上應該是如此，但我不知道是否聽說過有人已經準備好花錢了。我認為該法案已經通過。

And then on the topic of charging fintechs for consumer bank data, can you discuss how you're thinking about fintech data access fees?

然後，關於向金融科技公司收取消費者銀行數據費用的話題，您能否討論一下您對金融科技數據存取費用的看法？

We're in discussions on it. I applaud what JP did. I think they're exactly right. I think there's a big cost to keeping this data secure and producing a form that's readable for our clients. So we're thinking about it.

我們正在討論此事。我為 JP 的做法喝采。我認為他們完全正確。我認為保證這些資料的安全性並產生客戶可讀的表格需要花費很大的成本。所以我們正在考慮這個問題。

And then Bill, following up on your scale comments, does seeing some of your competitors enter into M&A transactions make you feel a greater sense of urgency in any way? Do you worry about falling behind certain peers by perhaps not taking advantage of a favorable regulatory environment under the current administration at a time where others are more active?

然後比爾，關於你關於規模的評論，看到一些競爭對手進行併購交易，你是否在某種程度上感到了更大的緊迫感？您是否擔心，在其他同業表現較活躍的時候，因為沒有利用現任政府有利的監管環境而落後於其他同業？

No.

不。

Mike Mayo, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的麥克·梅奧。

Could you share some light on the loan growth and how much you would consider from your traditional middle market relationship based sources? and if you -- by the way, if you mentioned utilization already, I might have missed it, but how the utilization did compared to more capital markets oriented type loan growth?

您能否分享一些有關貸款成長的情況以及您會從基於傳統中間市場關係的來源中考慮多少貸款？順便說一句，如果您已經提到了利用率，我可能錯過了，但是與更多以資本市場為導向的貸款成長相比，利用率如何？

And by the way, I thought you said you weren't going to have any loan growth. Are you assuming no loan growth this year? So I guess that's a bit more than expected, but I guess what I'm getting at is you said the loan growth might not all repeat.

順便說一句，我以為你說過你的貸款不會成長。您是否認為今年貸款不會成長？所以我想這比預期要多一點，但我想我要說的是，您說的貸款成長可能不會全部重複。

You have a disproportionate amount from your CIB. So it sounds like more of your loan growth is that capital markets variety as opposed to that kind of bread and butter middle market loan. Is that a correct conclusion, and if not, if you could educate me?

您的 CIB 金額不成比例。因此，聽起來您的貸款成長更多的是來自資本市場，而不是那種基本的中間市場貸款。這是正確的結論嗎？如果不是，您能告訴我嗎？

No, that isn't what happened, Mike. We -- two things. One was we saw continuation of utilization increase largely in sort of our asset-backed areas in some middle market. And then secondly, we just grew a lot of clients. The new markets are coming online.

不，事實並非如此，麥克。我們——兩件事。一是我們看到一些中端市場的資產支援領域的利用率持續大幅增加。其次，我們的客戶數量增加了很多。新的市場正在湧現。

The pre-screen activity and deal activity coming out of our new markets is multiples of what it is out of the legacy and it's starting to bear fruit and it's our traditional bread and butter clients of middle market to small or large corporate together with TM relationships and everything else we do is part of delivering all of PNC to new clients.

我們在新市場進行的預篩選活動和交易活動是傳統市場中的數倍，並且開始取得成果，這是我們傳統的支柱客戶，從中型市場到大型或小型企業，加上 TM 關係，我們所做的其他一切都是向新客戶提供 PNC 服務的一部分。

And across all industries, it was broad based across all our assets.

在所有行業中，它廣泛地涵蓋了我們所有的資產。

It's just us executing. The issue, I didn't say we weren't going to grow loans. I said we would. If there was loan growth out there, we'd get more than our fair share, but as you've seen, it's -- other than this quarter, it's been somewhat flatlined for a while, but our share gains, utilization increase pay dividends this year or this quarter.

這只是我們在執行。問題是，我並沒有說我們不會增加貸款。我說我們會的。如果貸款成長，我們將獲得超過我們應得的份額，但正如你所看到的，除了本季度之外，它在一段時間內一直處於平穩狀態，但我們的份額增長、利用率的提高將在今年或本季度帶來回報。

So is loan growth back to the industry or is it back for PNC? I mean you're implying market share gains more than it's coming back to the industry or is the appetite of your clients increasing?

那麼，貸款成長是回歸到產業還是回歸到 PNC？我的意思是，您暗示市場佔有率的成長幅度大於產業回流的幅度，還是您的客戶的胃口在增加？

But my guess is you're going to -- the utilization increase, you'll see broad-based just on the back of people, front-running tariff impact in their inventory levels. But the -- a big chunk of our growth is just organic growth, new clients and new markets, and I suspect we'll stand out on that.

但我的猜測是，隨著利用率的提高，你會看到廣泛的影響，這僅僅是由於人們的搶先關稅對其庫存水準的影響。但是——我們的成長很大一部分只是有機成長、新客戶和新市場，我相信我們會在這方面脫穎而出。

And the two words where you said not repeating, what did you mean by that?

還有你說的「不重複」這兩個字是什麼意思？

Say that again.

再說一次。

I thought -- in reference to loan growth, you said something to not repeating, or maybe I misheard that.

我認為——關於貸款成長，您說了一些不要重複的話，或者也許我聽錯了。

Maybe I can jump in. I'd just say in terms of loan growth, the tariff driven increase in utilization across broad assets is probably in some form present at all banks. We're different. Are these growth markets that are adding to that loan growth that are independent of sort of the reaction to the current environment?

也許我可以加入。我只想說，就貸款成長而言，關稅驅動的廣泛資產利用率成長可能以某種形式存在於所有銀行。我們不一樣。這些促進貸款成長的成長市場是否與對當前環境的反應無關？

The utilization number, does it go up or down from here is really a punt on tariffs. If tariffs went completely away and people would drop their inventories to old levels, you'd see utilization across the industry decline again which is one of the reasons to forecast aggressive loan growth.

利用率數字從現在開始是上升還是下降，實際上取決於關稅。如果關稅完全取消，人們將庫存降至原來的水平，你會看到整個產業的利用率再次下降，這是預測貸款大幅成長的原因之一。

So the market share you're saying is more a permanent driver of loan growth. The tariff driven part of that loan growth waits to be seen.

所以您所說的市場佔有率是貸款成長的更持久的驅動力。關稅對貸款成長的影響還有待觀察。

Gerard Cassidy, RBC Capital Markets.

加拿大皇家銀行資本市場 (RBC Capital Markets) 的 Gerard Cassidy。

Bill, your comments about the BPI making the letter to the rating agencies about the capital requirements may turn out to be the binding and straight rather than the regulatory requirements. In your guys' estimation based upon your working experience with both the regulators and the credit agencies, rating agencies, do they kind of work together or is this kind of a divide that is something new or do they ignore one another in the past?

比爾，你對 BPI 致評級機構有關資本要求的信函的評論可能最終會成為具有約束力和直接性的要求，而不是監管要求。根據你們與監管機構、信用機構和評級機構的工作經驗，你們認為他們之間是否存在合作，或者這種分歧是新出現的，還是他們過去相互忽視？

How is this going to maybe play out is what I'm trying to get at?

我想知道的是，這一切最終會如何發展？

Rob may have different comments. I don't think they talk to each other. On methodologies, on anything, it's frustrating.

羅布可能有不同的評論。我認為他們之間沒有互相交談。就方法論而言，就任何事情而言，這都令人沮喪。

There's an opportunity to reconcile the two views to the extent that they do that. It's obviously up to them.

只要他們這樣做，就有機會調和這兩種觀點。這顯然取決於他們。

Possibly the capital framework conference next week in Washington might shed some light on that possibly. And Bill and Rob, your guys' thoughts on this one. It's more of a macro question. Obviously, there's been a lot of talk about stablecoin.

下週在華盛頓舉行的資本框架會議可能會對此有所啟發。比爾和羅布，你們對此有什麼看法。這更像是一個宏觀問題。顯然，關於穩定幣的討論已經很多了。

You got the Coin Act down in Washington that's likely to be passed very soon. What are your guys' view on stablecoins and how it may impact the payments business for PNC as well as deposits? Any thoughts there?

華盛頓制定的《硬幣法案》很可能很快就會獲得通過。你們對穩定幣有何看法？它將如何影響 PNC 的支付業務以及存款？有什麼想法嗎？

Yeah. Let me take a bit of a broader angle on the whole thing and let's talk about crypto and payments and and stablecoin, how we may or may not play, I should say how we will play. First off, you should expect to see from us announcements with respect to using our payment technology to help crypto companies.

是的。讓我從更廣泛的角度來看待整個事情，讓我們來談談加密貨幣、支付和穩定幣，我們可能會或可能不會玩，我應該說我們將如何玩。首先，您應該會看到我們關於使用我們的支付技術來幫助加密公司的公告。

So now we are allowed to bank people in that business. And just given our raw capabilities, you would expect that we'll get some meaningful clients. Or secondly, we will enable our clients in the very near term to be able to use crypto to see if they -- to have a wallet, and to trade it.

所以現在我們被允許為從事該業務的人提供銀行服務。僅從我們的原始能力來看，您會期望我們會獲得一些有意義的客戶。或者其次，我們將在短期內讓我們的客戶能夠使用加密貨幣來查看他們是否擁有錢包並進行交易。

Thirdly, you would expect -- my expectation is an industry solution with respect to an industry-led stablecoin and we would clearly be part of that. Now what does all that necessarily mean in terms of payments and stablecoin and does it massively change the ecosystem today?

第三，你會期望——我的期望是一個關於行業主導的穩定幣的行業解決方案，我們顯然會成為其中的一部分。那麼，就支付和穩定幣而言，這一切意味著什麼？它是否會大大改變當今的生態系統？

I think despite a lot of the hype, there isn't really a cost advantage or a driving need to use stablecoin, at least in domestic commerce. There's use cases in terms of external transfers out of the country. There's use cases of just storing dollars out of the country, some of which will be stopped by the stablecoin bills simply because I know your customer rules.

我認為，儘管有很多炒作，但至少在國內商業中，穩定幣實際上並不具有成本優勢或使用穩定幣的迫切需求。在國外轉移方面有用例。有一些用例只是將美元儲存在國外，其中一些將被穩定幣法案阻止，因為我知道你的客戶規則。

Whether it takes off in cross-border commerce, I'm probably less bullish than some, but if it does, we will have it enabled inside of our pinnacle platform such that somebody gives us a payment file and our job is to optimize the cost of executing those payments, we'll be fully capable of using stablecoin in that payment stream.

它是否會在跨境貿易中流行起來，我可能不像有些人那麼樂觀，但如果它真的流行起來，我們將在我們的巔峰平台中啟用它，這樣有人給我們一個支付文件，我們的工作就是優化執行這些支付的成本，我們將完全有能力在該支付流中使用穩定幣。

The same way we use wire or we use ACH or we use PCOIN.

與我們使用電匯、ACH 或 PCOIN 的方式相同。

Just another tool.

只是另一個工具。

Yeah, it's just another thing. As it relates to deposits, am I worried that it's somehow going to drain deposits from the system? I am not. It's a good fear factor if you want to -- if we want to rile people up, but practically, there's trillions of dollars in money funds today that you could move in and out of using ACH linkages.

是的，這只是另一件事。既然它與存款有關，我是否擔心它會以某種方式耗盡系統中的存款？我不是。如果你願意的話，這是一個很好的恐懼因素——如果我們想激怒人們，但實際上，今天有數萬億美元的貨幣基金，你可以透過 ACH 連結轉入和轉出。

We're competitive on rates. If there's a bank scare and where does it run to, we saw that in '23, it all ran into the money funds. Maybe some will run the stablecoin at some point in the future, but ultimately, it comes back into our accounts as we've seen.

我們的價格具有競爭力。如果出現銀行恐慌，資金會流向哪裡？我們看到，在 23 年，所有資金都流向了貨幣基金。也許將來有些人會運行穩定幣，但最終，正如我們所見，它會回到我們的帳戶中。

This is going to be another payment tool. We're going to add it to the quiver of tools that we have. We're going to empower our clients if they want to use it because we do what our clients want. I think the revenue opportunities for us beyond just serving clients day to day are likely to be seen in our payment business and our treasury management business as we enable both new clients and then blockchain technology for existing clients.

這將是另一種支付工具。我們將把它添加到我們現有的工具庫中。如果客戶願意使用，我們就會給予授權，因為我們會做客戶想要做的事。我認為，除了日常為客戶提供服務之外，我們的收入機會也可能體現在我們的支付業務和財務管理業務中，因為我們既為新客戶提供服務，也為現有客戶提供區塊鏈技術。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Saul Martinez, HSBC.

匯豐銀行的索爾·馬丁內斯。

Just a real quick one on your retail lending strategy. You -- auto book has grown a bit. Cards are sort of flattish to down. Can you just give us an update on what your -- what the strategy is here? What you're doing?

我只想簡單介紹一下您的零售貸款策略。你——汽車書長大了一點。卡片有點平坦或向下。您能否向我們介紹一下您的最新情況—這裡的策略是什麼？你在幹啥？

Do you expect these businesses to grow? Is it important to grow and do you need to or does it make sense to look at inorganic growth for this to be -- for these businesses to become relevant as a part of your business mix?

您預期這些業務會成長嗎？成長是否重要？您是否需要成長？或者，考慮無機成長是否有意義？這些業務是否能夠成為您業務組合中相關的一部分？

Well, I'll answer the back part first. It is extremely unlikely that we would look at inorganic growth in the retail credit space simply because in most instances, the thing that's available to buy is broken and we are not experts at fixing a broker.

好吧，我先回答後面的部分。我們極不可能關注零售信貸領域的無機成長，因為在大多數情況下，可供購買的東西都是壞的，而我們又不是修復經紀人的專家。

We are building that expertise. We have heavy investment card. We would love to grow card balances, and we think we can do that simply through deeper penetration with our existing client base. Our auto book has been growing largely because we didn't run for the hills in the slight bubble of economy earlier last year I guess.

我們正在建立這種專業知識。我們有重金投資。我們希望增加卡片餘額，我們認為我們可以透過更深入地滲透現有客戶群來實現這一目標。我想，我們的汽車銷售量不斷成長，很大程度上是因為我們沒有在去年年初的經濟小泡沫中逃之夭夭。

RWA diets that others are on.

其他人正在進行的 RWA 飲食。

Yeah. So we're going to keep investing organically on product capability, credit underwriting, marketing offers, convenience for clients as it relates to the ability to open accounts online and so on and so forth and hopefully deepen cross-sell penetration of our existing clients but you won't see us buy somebody.

是的。因此，我們將繼續在產品能力、信用承保、行銷優惠、客戶便利（涉及線上開戶能力等）方面進行有機投資，並希望加深現有客戶的交叉銷售滲透，但你不會看到我們收購任何人。

Gerard Cassidy, RBC.

傑拉德·卡西迪（Gerard Cassidy），加拿大皇家銀行。

Bill or Rob, can you guys come in -- obviously, they had the big meeting up at Carnegie Mellon. I think it was yesterday with the AI investments. What could that mean for the Pennsylvania or the Pittsburgh area in terms of economic activity and obviously, I assume you guys will benefit from that as well?

比爾或羅布，你們能進來嗎——顯然，他們在卡內基美隆大學舉行了一次大型會議。我認為人工智慧投資是昨天的事。就經濟活動而言，這對賓州或匹茲堡地區意味著什麼？顯然，我認為你們也會從中受益？

I spent the better part of Monday and Tuesday as part of that conference. It's pretty exciting. We announced $92 billion of investment into Pennsylvania largely around building the energy and data structure in -- data infrastructure to support AI.

我花了周一和周二的大部分時間參加該會議。這非常令人興奮。我們宣布向賓州投資 920 億美元，主要用於建立能源和資料結構——支援人工智慧的資料基礎設施。

We have as a state sort of all of the core resources were in the right FEMA zone. We have lots of natural gas. We have analytic and college resources and talented people and people are kind of coming together to cause it to happen. So it's pretty exciting. The place is bustling.

作為一個州，我們已經將所有核心資源都歸類在正確的 FEMA 區域。我們擁有大量的天然氣。我們擁有分析資源、大學資源和人才，人們齊心協力實現這一目標。所以這非常令人興奮。這個地方很繁華。

That one of the things independent of my PNC job is I sit on the Allegheny Conference which looks at the 10-county zone here and the take up of available build spaces is I think land and large mega project sites, some of which have been there for years, they're disappearing fast, and it's pretty exciting.

與我的 PNC 工作無關的一件事是我參加阿勒格尼會議，該會議關注這裡的 10 個縣區域，我認為可用建設空間的佔用是土地和大型項目場地，其中一些已經存在多年，它們正在迅速消失，這是非常令人興奮的。

At this time, we've reached the end of our question-answer-session, and I'll hand the call back to Bryan Gill for closing comments.

此時，我們的問答環節已經結束，我將把電話交還給布萊恩·吉爾 (Bryan Gill) 進行總結發言。

Well, thank you, all for joining our call today and your interest in and support of PNC and please feel free to reach out to the IR team if you have any follow-up questions.

好吧，謝謝大家今天參加我們的電話會議，感謝您對 PNC 的關注和支持，如果您有任何後續問題，請隨時聯繫 IR 團隊。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your participation. This does include today's teleconference. You may now disconnect your lines and have a wonderful day.

女士們、先生們，感謝你們的參與。這確實包括今天的電話會議。現在您可以斷開線路並享受美好的一天。