明晟 (MSCI) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good day, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the MSCI Fourth Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. As a reminder, this call is being recorded. (Operator Instructions)

女士們、先生們，大家好，歡迎參加 MSCI 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。提醒一下，本次通話正在錄音。（操作員指令）

I would now like to turn the call over to Jeremy Ulan, Head of Investor Relations and Treasurer. You may begin.

現在，我想將電話轉給投資者關係主管兼財務主管 Jeremy Ulan。你可以開始了。

Thank you. Good day, and welcome to the MSCI Fourth Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. Earlier this morning, we issued a press release announcing our results for the fourth quarter 2024. This press release, along with an earnings presentation and brief quarterly update are available on our website, msci.com, under the Investor Relations tab.

謝謝。大家好，歡迎參加 MSCI 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。今天早些時候，我們發布了一份新聞稿，宣布了 2024 年第四季的業績。本新聞稿以及收益報告和簡短的季度更新可在我們的網站 msci.com 的「投資者關係」標籤上找到。

Let me remind you that this call contains forward-looking statements, which are governed by the language on the second slide of today's presentation. You are cautioned not to place undue reliance on forward-looking statements, which speak only as of the date on which they are made, are based on current expectations and current economic conditions and are subject to risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ materially from the results anticipated in these forward-looking statements. For a discussion of additional risks and uncertainties, please see the risk factors and forward-looking statements disclaimer in our most recent Form 10-K and in our other SEC filings.

讓我提醒您，本次電話會議包含前瞻性陳述，這些陳述受今天簡報第二張投影片中語言的約束。請注意不要過度依賴前瞻性陳述，這些陳述僅代表其作出之日的觀點，基於當前預期和當前經濟狀況，並受風險和不確定因素的影響，可能導致實際結果有所不同與這些前瞻性陳述中預期的結果存在重大差異。有關其他風險和不確定性的討論，請參閱我們最新的 10-K 表格和其他 SEC 文件中的風險因素和前瞻性陳述免責聲明。

During today's call, in addition to results presented on the basis of U.S. GAAP, we also refer to non-GAAP measures. You'll find a reconciliation of our non-GAAP measures to the equivalent GAAP measures in the appendix of the earnings presentation. We will also discuss operating metrics such as run rate and retention rate, important information regarding our use of operating metrics, such as run rate or retention rate, are available in the earnings presentation.

在今天的電話會議中，除了根據美國公認會計準則呈現的結果外，我們還參考了非公認會計準則指標。您可以在收益報告附錄中找到我們的非 GAAP 指標與等效 GAAP 指標的對帳表。我們還將討論運行率和保留率等營運指標，有關我們使用營運指標（例如運行率或保留率）的重要資訊可在收益報告中找到。

On the call today are Henry Fernandez, our Chairman and CEO; Baer Pettit, our President and COO; and Andy Wiechmann, our Chief Financial Officer. (Operator Instructions)

今天參加電話會議的有我們的董事長兼執行長亨利‧費爾南德斯 (Henry Fernandez)；我們的總裁兼營運長 Baer Pettit；以及我們的財務長 Andy Wiechmann。（操作員指令）

With that, let me now turn the call over to Henry Fernandez. Henry?

說完這些，我現在把電話轉給亨利費南德斯。亨利？

Thank you, Jeremy. Good day, everyone, and thank you for joining us.

謝謝你，傑瑞米。大家好，感謝大家的參與。

In 2024, MSCI delivered a strong financial metrics that once again, demonstrated our scale and leadership in servicing the global investment ecosystem. For the full year, we achieved organic revenue growth of almost 10%, adjusted earnings per share growth of 12.4%, and free cash flow growth of 21%. We also repurchased $810 million worth of MSCI shares for the full year.

2024年，MSCI 提供了強勁的財務指標，再次證明了我們在服務全球投資生態系統方面的規模和領導地位。全年我們實現了有機收入成長近 10%、調整後每股收益成長 12.4%、自由現金流成長 21%。我們也全年回購了價值 8.1 億美元的 MSCI 股票。

During the fourth quarter, and through yesterday, we repurchased over $425 million worth of MSCI shares, in alignment with our shareholder-centric capital allocation policy. In the fourth quarter, our operating metrics included organic subscription run rate growth of 8%, excluding FX headwinds, and 7% on a reported basis. Asset-based fee run rate growth of 15% and a retention rate of 93%. Our ABF run rate growth was driven by higher average AUM, aided by the highest quarterly cash inflows into equity ETFs linked to MSCI indices since the end of 2021, at more than USD 48 billion.

截至昨天，第四季我們回購了價值超過 4.25 億美元的 MSCI 股票，符合我們以股東為中心的資本配置政策。第四季度，我們的營運指標包括有機訂閱運行率成長 8%（不包括外匯不利因素）和報告基礎成長 7%。基於資產的費用運行率成長15%，保留率為93%。我們的 ABF 運行率成長受到更高平均 AUM 的推動，這得益於自 2021 年底以來與 MSCI 指數掛鉤的股票 ETF 的最高季度現金流入，超過 480 億美元。

Among client segments, we also had a strong quarter with hedge funds and wealth managers, as we grew our firm-wide subscription run rate growth by 15% and 12%, respectively, excluding FX. While active asset managers continue to face cyclical pressures, we posted 5% growth in subscription run rate, excluding FX, and a 94% retention rate with this segment.

在客戶細分領域，我們對沖基金和財富經理的業績也表現強勁，不包括外匯，全公司訂閱運行率分別成長了 15％ 和 12％。儘管主動資產管理者繼續面臨週期性壓力，但我們的認購運作率（不包括外匯）成長了 5%，該部分的保留率達到 94%。

In my remarks today, I will focus on three areas, in particular, that demonstrate the success of our strategy. Index, wealth and fixed income.

在今天的發言中，我將特別關註三個體現我們策略成功的領域。指數、財富和固定收益。

In Index products, the ecosystem linked to MSCI indices remains central to global investing. And in Q4, we saw a number of milestones. Last month, for example, one of our large asset manager clients launched a new ETF linked to an MSCI Climate Index with a record-breaking ceded investment of $2.4 billion from one of our large pension fund clients. This highlights the prominence of our indices, the network effect among our clients and the continuing demand for climate-related investment products.

在指數產品中，與 MSCI 指數掛鉤的生態系統仍是全球投資的核心。在第四季度，我們看到了許多里程碑。例如，上個月，我們的一個大型資產管理客戶推出了一檔與 MSCI 氣候指數掛鉤的新 ETF，我們的一個大型退休基金客戶創紀錄地投入了 24 億美元。這凸顯了我們指數的突出地位、我們客戶之間的網路效應以及對氣候相關投資產品的持續需求。

Clients increasingly won specialized portfolio construction tools while aligning with the frameworks classification systems and rules-based methodologies that MSCI has established standards. This has fueled demand for MSCI's custom index capabilities, including the [Foxsberry-F9] platform, which is now being fully integrated into our product suite. We also completed large index deals with two of the world's top investment banks, which Baer will discuss shortly.

客戶越來越多地獲得專業化的投資組合建立工具，同時與 MSCI 建立標準的框架分類系統和基於規則的方法保持一致。這推動了對 MSCI 客製化指數功能的需求，包括 [Foxsberry-F9] 平台，該平台現已完全整合到我們的產品套件中。我們也與世界兩大頂級投資銀行完成了大型指數交易，貝爾將在不久後對此進行討論。

In the Wealth segment in Q4, we achieved 12% subscription run rate growth with wealth managers, excluding FX. With a total wealth subscription run rate of $116 million. We also saw direct indexing AUM based on MSCI indices increased by 31% to nearly $130 billion. MSCI Wealth, a new MSCI brand, is helping wealth managers attract AUM by enabling them to build a scalable, personalized and outcome-oriented portfolios. Our client engagement levels with wealth managers are now higher than ever, as I have seen firsthand in meetings across Europe over the past months. MSCI's progress in wealth also reflects the benefits of our long-term investments, including in our data and technology, and a laser focus on evolving client needs.

在第四季的財富領域，我們與財富管理人員（不包括外匯）的認購運作率成長了 12%。總財富認購運行率為1.16億美元。我們也看到基於 MSCI 指數的直接指數化 AUM 成長了 31%，達到近 1300 億美元。摩根士丹利資本國際Wealth 是 MSCI 的一個新品牌，它透過幫助財富管理人員建立可擴展、個人化和以結果為導向的投資組合，幫助他們吸引 AUM。正如我過去幾個月在歐洲各地的會議上親眼所見，我們的客戶與財富經理的互動水平現在比以往任何時候都高。MSCI 在財富方面的進步也反映了我們長期投資的好處，包括對數據和技術的投資，以及對不斷變化的客戶需求的高度關注。

In fixed income products, during the fourth quarter, we drove fixed income run rate growth of 15% across all of our product lines, which is now $104 million. Most notably, we completed a large 7-figure fixed income portfolio management analytics deal with a U.S.-based asset manager displacing a major incumbent provider. We also secured our a first of its kind federal government contract in which the client will use our agency mortgage-backed security analytics to better understand the performance and risk of this huge market. Both of these wins stemmed from the work we have done to enhance our fixed income capabilities, including investing in hard to model assets like securitized products and mortgage-backed securities.

在固定收益產品方面，第四季度，我們所有產品線的固定收益運行率成長了 15%，目前為 1.04 億美元。最值得注意的是，我們與一家美國資產管理公司完成了一項 7 位數的大型固定收益投資組合管理分析交易，取代了一家現有的主要供應商。我們還獲得了首個聯邦政府合同，客戶將使用我們的機構抵押貸款支持證券分析來更好地了解這個巨大市場的表現和風險。這兩場勝利都源自於我們為增強固定收益能力所做的努力，包括投資難以建模的資產，例如證券化產品和抵押貸款支持證券。

Putting it all together, MSCI continues to benefit from the depth, diversification and resilience of our clients, product and revenue base. To the extent market levels and fund inflows remain supportive, we believe this will support active asset manager client budgets this year. MSCI is increasingly well positioned to expand our footprint among established and newer client segments alike, thanks to our data, models and technology. We believe these advantages can help us drive compounding growth across the years and across market cycles.

綜合起來，MSCI 繼續受益於我們客戶、產品和收入基礎的深度、多樣化和彈性。只要市場水準和資金流入保持支撐，我們相信這將支持今年主動資產管理客戶的預算。憑藉我們的數據、模型和技術，MSCI 越來越有能力擴大我們在現有和新客戶群中的影響力。我們相信這些優勢可以幫助我們實現多年、跨市場週期的複合成長。

And with that, let me turn the call over to Baer. Baer?

說完這些，讓我把電話轉給貝爾。貝爾？

Thank you, Henry. Greetings, everyone.

謝謝你，亨利。大家好。

Given our focus on client segment growth, I'd like to use this opportunity to review our progress in the fourth quarter, which highlighted the broad reach of our solutions and the underlying strength of our all-weather franchise. I will start with wealth managers where MSCI's recent investments have helped us build significant momentum across product lines.

鑑於我們專注於客戶群的成長，我想藉此機會回顧我們在第四季度的進展，這凸顯了我們解決方案的廣泛影響力和全天候特許經營的潛在實力。我先從財富管理公司開始，MSCI 最近的投資幫助我們在各個產品線上建立了強大的發展勢頭。

In Q4, we achieved firm-wide subscription run rate growth of 12% among wealth managers, excluding FX, bringing our total subscription run rate with that segment to $116 million. We also delivered 14% subscription run rate growth among wealth managers and analytics, excluding FX, which now totals over $25 million. In addition, we closed a large enterprise deal for the MSCL Wealth Manager platform, formerly known as Fabric.

第四季度，我們財富管理部門（不包括外匯）的全公司認購運作率成長了 12%，使該部門的總認購運作率達到 1.16 億美元。我們也實現了財富管理與分析（不包括外匯）訂閱運行率成長 14%，目前總額超過 2,500 萬美元。此外，我們也完成了一項 MSCL Wealth Manager 平台（原為 Fabric）的大型企業交易。

MSCI Wealth Manager has positioned us to support a wide range of use cases, including proposal generation, model portfolio construction and home office account management and monitoring. These use cases extend to ESG and Climate. In Q4, we achieved a 28% climate run rate growth among wealth managers, which totaled $7 million. We drove 67% ESG and climate recurring sales growth among that segment, which was $3 million.

MSCI Wealth Manager 讓我們能夠支援廣泛的用例，包括提案生成、模型投資組合建置以及家庭辦公室帳戶管理和監控。這些用例擴展到ESG和氣候。第四季度，我們實現了財富管理人員氣候運行率成長 28%，總額達到 700 萬美元。我們推動該部門 ESG 和氣候經常性銷售額成長 67%，達到 300 萬美元。

Turning to hedge funds. We achieved 15% subscription run rate growth, excluding FX, including our best ever Q4 recurring sales, driven by 46% recurring sales growth among hedge funds and index. We completed large deals with several multi-strategy hedge funds including conversions of a onetime float data sales into recurring subscription deals. These conversions showcase the value of our products as well as the growing liquidity of MSCI index-linked products.

轉向對沖基金。不包括外匯，我們的認購運行率增長了 15%，其中包括我們有史以來最好的第四季度經常性銷售額，這得益於對沖基金和指數 46% 的經常性銷售額增長。我們與多家多策略對沖基金完成了大型交易，包括將一次性浮動數據銷售轉換為定期訂閱交易。這些轉換展示了我們產品的價值以及 MSCI 指數掛鉤產品不斷增長的流動性。

Moving on to banks and broker-dealers. We delivered 7% subscription run rate growth, excluding FX, across product lines with particular strength from index where new recurring sales for the segment was over $7 million in Q4, growing almost 39%. In two of our most notable index business wins, we expanded our relationships with a pair of large investment banks in the Americas. As part of these deals, the bank's trading desks will use MSCI index data to support their origination of OTC derivatives and structured products and for Delta One use cases. Such examples confirm that market participants are increasingly using our content to enhance their research, risk management and alpha generation strategies.

轉向銀行和經紀交易商。我們實現了7% 的訂閱運行率增長（不包括外匯），所有產品線的訂閱運行率均有所增長，其中指數表現尤為強勁，該部門第四季度的新經常性銷售額超過700 萬美元，增長近39%。在我們最引人注目的兩場指數業務勝利中，我們擴大了與美洲兩家大型投資銀行的關係。作為這些交易的一部分，該銀行的交易部門將使用 MSCI 指數數據來支援其場外衍生性商品和結構化產品的啟動以及 Delta One 用例。這些例子證實，市場參與者越來越多地使用我們的內容來增強他們的研究、風險管理和阿爾法生成策略。

If we look at asset owners, MSCI achieved 11% subscription run rate growth, excluding FX, including almost 40% recurring sales growth in Q4 among asset owners and index. Our position among asset owners has also been strengthened by the continued importance of climate, along with our burdening capabilities in private assets.

如果我們看看資產所有者，MSCI 實現了 11% 的認購運行率增長（不包括外匯），其中資產所有者和指數在第四季度的經常性銷售增長接近 40%。氣候議題的持續重要性以及我們在私人資產方面的承擔能力也增強了我們在資產所有者中的地位。

We recently won a large climate index mandate with a U.K.-based asset owner, which is expected to result in $20 billion of AUM benchmark to an MSCI Climate index. Meanwhile, our run rate among asset owners and private capital solutions is now $78 million after growing 15% in Q4. As asset owners increase their allocations to private assets, we recently launched a new data set to support their growing interest in private credit.

我們最近贏得了英國資產所有者的大型氣候指數授權，預計將為 MSCI 氣候指數帶來 200 億美元的 AUM 基準。同時，我們在資產所有者和私人資本解決方案中的運行率在第四季度增長 15% 後目前為 7800 萬美元。隨著資產所有者增加對私人資產的配置，我們最近推出了一個新的數據集來支持他們對私人信貸日益增長的興趣。

Our new private credit data set provides terms and conditions, transparency on more than 2,800 private credit funds and more than 120,000 private credit holdings, to support various due diligence and portfolio management needs.

我們的新私人信貸資料集提供了超過 2,800 個私人信貸基金和超過 120,000 個私人信貸持有量的條款和條件以及透明度，以支援各種盡職調查和投資組合管理需求。

Turning finally to asset managers. We grew our firm-wide subscription run rate by 5%, excluding FX headwinds, while achieving a retention rate of 94%. In analytics, we landed a large deal with an asset manager in the Americas for our fixed income portfolio attribution and fixed income factor risk tools. This deal was enabled by our new AI portfolio Insight solution, and it further endorses the multiyear investments we have made in our fixed income franchise.

最後談談資產管理者。剔除外匯不利因素，我們的全公司訂閱運行率成長了 5%，同時實現了 94% 的保留率。在分析方面，我們與美洲的一家資產管理公司達成了一筆大筆交易，涉及我們的固定收益投資組合歸因和固定收益因素風險工具。這筆交易得益於我們新的 AI 投資組合洞察解決方案，它進一步證明了我們在固定收益業務方面所做的多年投資。

Another key asset manager win came with a large existing client in Europe, who expanded their use of MSCI's managed services, data management and enterprise risk and performance analytics. We also continue to support asset managers with tools for sustainability and the low carbon transition. Globally, we delivered a retention rate of nearly 95% among asset manager clients for our ASG and Climate product (inaudible). With asset managers in Europe, we added numerous large-ticket deals for our nature and biodiversity tools and for our climate scenario analysis and stress testing, regulatory solutions.

資產管理公司另一個重要的勝利來自歐洲的大型現有客戶，擴大了 MSCI 託管服務、資料管理和企業風險及績效分析的使用。我們也將持續為資產管理者提供永續發展和低碳轉型的工具支援。在全球範圍內，我們的 ASG 和氣候產品在資產管理客戶的留存率接近 95%（聽不清楚）。我們與歐洲的資產管理公司合作，為我們的自然和生物多樣性工具以及氣候情境分析和壓力測試、監管解決方案達成了許多大額交易。

As you can see, our product, data and technology investments are helping us expand our footprint with a range of clients across the capital markets ecosystem. All of this supports our ability to deliver attractive top line growth and profitability.

如您所見，我們的產品、數據和技術投資正在幫助我們擴大與資本市場生態系統中一系列客戶的連結。所有這些都支持了我們實現有吸引力的營收成長和獲利的能力。

And with that, let me turn the call over to Andy. Andy?

現在，讓我把電話轉給安迪。安迪？

Thanks, Baer, and hi, everyone. I continue to be really encouraged by the resilience of our results and the momentum we're seeing across product areas.

謝謝，貝爾，大家好。我們的業績表現和各產品領域的發展動能持續令我深受鼓舞。

Index subscription run rate growth with asset managers and asset owners was almost 7% and 12%, respectively. These client segments comprise nearly 70% of our index subscription run rate. Among hedge funds and broker-dealers, we drove 22% and 8% index subscription run rate growth, respectively, in the fourth quarter.

資產管理人和資產所有者的指數認購運行率分別成長近 7% 和 12%。這些客戶群占我們指數認購運行率的近 70%。在對沖基金和經紀交易商中，我們在第四季度分別推動了 22% 和 8% 的指數認購運行率成長。

Custom indexes and special packages grew 8% versus last year. Within the category, our custom index subscription run rate growth was mid-teens, while we had a lower contribution from special packages. An overall retention rate and index was 95%, with a retention rate of almost 96% with asset managers.

定制指數和特殊包裹比去年同期增長了 8%。在該類別中，我們的客製化指數訂閱運行率成長率達到十幾歲左右，而特殊套餐的貢獻較低。總體留存率和指數為 95%，其中資產管理人的留存率接近 96%。

Within asset-based fees, global cash inflows into equity ETS linked to MSCI indexes was $48 billion in the quarter, with particular strength in ETFs linked to developed markets outside the U.S., ESG and Climate and factors. Q4 cash inflows into ETF products linked to MSCI ESG and Climate indexes reached nearly $12 billion, our highest quarterly cash inflows since the first quarter of 2022. These inflows accounted for nearly 70% of global cash inflows into ESG and Climate equity ETF products in the fourth quarter.

在以資產為基礎的費用中，本季與 MSCI 指數掛鉤的股票 ETS 的全球現金流入為 480 億美元，其中與美國以外已開發市場、ESG 和氣候及因素掛鉤的 ETF 表現尤為強勁。第四季度，與 MSCI ESG 和氣候指數掛鉤的 ETF 產品的現金流入達到近 120 億美元，這是我們自 2022 年第一季以來的最高季度現金流入。這些流入資金佔第四季度全球 ESG 和氣候股票 ETF 產品現金流入的近 70%。

AUM and ETF and non-ETF products linked to MSCI Climate equity indexes grew by more than 50% from last year, driven by strong inflows into ETFs and a few key mandate wins from asset owners. Meanwhile, inflows into ETF products linked to MSCI Factor Indexes were almost $6 billion, with solid inflows into quality, value growth and momentum factors. These MSCI factor index-linked ETF inflows were the highest quarterly flows since the second quarter of 2021.

與 MSCI 氣候股票指數掛鉤的 AUM 和 ETF 及非 ETF 產品較去年增長了 50% 以上，這得益於 ETF 的強勁資金流入以及資產所有者的一些關鍵授權勝利。同時，與 MSCI 因子指數掛鉤的 ETF 產品的資金流入接近 60 億美元，其中品質、價值成長和動量因子的流入較為穩健。這些與 MSCI 因子指數掛鉤的 ETF 流入量是自 2021 年第二季以來的最高季度流量。

In Analytics, subscription run rate growth was 7%, excluding the impact of foreign currency and was supported by the large wealth and fixed income mandates previously mentioned. Analytics organic revenue growth was approximately 5% in the quarter.

在分析方面，不包括外幣的影響，訂閱運行率增長率為 7%，並受到前面提到的大量財富和固定收益授權的支持。本季分析有機收入成長約 5%。

As we previously indicated, the revenue growth was impacted by the timing of implementation related revenues compared to a year ago. The release of subscription revenues related to implementations can be lumpy and will fluctuate from period to period. Near term, we continue to expect recurring revenue growth rates will be slightly below run rate growth as we compare to periods with higher concentrations of these revenues a year ago.

正如我們之前所指出的，與一年前相比，收入成長受到實施相關收入時間的影響。與實施相關的訂閱收入的發布可能會不連續，並且會在不同時期發生波動。短期內，我們繼續預期經常性收入成長率將略低於營運成長率，與一年前這些收入集中度較高的時期相比。

In our ESG and Climate reportable segment, subscription run rate growth was 10%, which excludes the impact of FX. Excluding FX headwinds, the subscription run rate growth for the segment was 14% in Europe, 11% in Asia, and 4% in the Americas. Our retention rate for the segment was over 93% with most of the cancels reflecting client down sales and not outright terminations.

在我們的 ESG 和氣候報告部分，訂閱運行率成長率為 10%，不包括外匯的影響。排除外匯不利因素，該部門的訂閱營運率成長率在歐洲為 14%，在亞洲為 11%，在美洲為 4%。我們該部門的保留率超過 93%，其中大多數取消反映了客戶銷售下降，而不是直接終止。

The multiyear investments we've made in data quality and new content and capabilities like biodiversity, nature, regulatory solutions and geospatial supported recent wins. In general, across our ESG and Climate franchise, we are benefiting from the breadth of our offering, data quality, large and comprehensive securities coverage across asset classes and the interoperability across MSCI products and frameworks.

我們在數據品質以及生物多樣性、自然、監管解決方案和地理空間等新內容和功能方面進行的多年投資支持了我們最近的勝利。總體而言，在我們的 ESG 和氣候特許經營中，我們受益於產品範圍的廣度、數據品質、跨資產類別的大型和全面的證券覆蓋範圍以及跨 MSCI 產品和框架的互通性。

In Private Capital Solutions, run rate growth was 15% over the same period last year, and we had a retention rate of 92%. In real assets, new recurring subscription sales improved, although we had some large cancels related to client events and vendor consolidation, particularly among developers, brokers and agents. We had very strong free cash flow in 2024, up 21% with some improvement in collection cycles in Q4, our capital position remained strong with gross leverage of 2.6 times 2024 EBITDA, we continue to be laser-focused on continuing to create value through disciplined capital allocation.

在私募資本解決方案方面，運作率比去年同期成長了 15%，保留率為 92%。在實體資產方面，新的定期訂閱銷售有所改善，儘管我們有一些與客戶活動和供應商合併相關的大量取消，特別是在開發商、經紀人和代理商中。2024 年，我們的自由現金流非常強勁，成長了21%，第四季的收款週期有所改善，我們的資本狀況保持強勁，總槓桿率為2024 年EBITDA 的2.6 倍，我們將繼續專注於透過嚴謹的資本配置。

Turning to our 2025 guidance, which we published earlier this morning. Our expense outlook assumes gradually increasing market levels throughout the year and reflects the ongoing reinvestments we make back into our business to fuel future growth and efficiencies. As we've seen in previous years, we expect adjusted EBITDA expenses to be about $35 million higher sequentially in Q1 2025, compared to Q4 of 2024, mostly driven by elevated compensation and benefits-related expenses.

談到我們今天早上發布的 2025 年指引。我們的費用前景假設全年市場水準將逐步上升，並反映出我們對業務的持續再投資，以促進未來的成長和效率。正如我們在前幾年所看到的，我們預計 2025 年第一季的調整後 EBITDA 支出將比 2024 年第四季環比增加約 3500 萬美元，這主要是由於薪資和福利相關費用增加所致。

Our CapEx guidance reflects our investments in software development across most parts of the business. Free cash flow guidance reflects higher cash tax payments in Q1, some of which we deferred during 2024. As a reminder, our 2024 free cash flow reflected cash tax timing impacts, of which about $30 million is resulting in elevated payments in 2025.

我們的資本支出指引反映了我們在大部分業務領域對軟體開發的投資。自由現金流指引反映了第一季更高的現金稅支付，其中一些我們在 2024 年推遲了。提醒一下，我們 2024 年的自由現金流反映了現金稅收時機的影響，其中約 3,000 萬美元導致 2025 年的付款增加。

Our interest expense guidance assumes our current debt levels and does not assume additional financings. We expect our Q1 effective tax rate to include a benefit from discrete items. Beyond Q1, we expect a quarterly operating effective tax rate of 19% to 21%.

我們的利息支出指引假設我們目前的債務水平，並不假設額外的融資。我們預計第一季的有效稅率將包括單一項目的收益。第一季以外，我們預計季度營業有效稅率為 19% 至 21%。

We're looking forward to an exciting year ahead. Our financial success and investments from 2024 provide a strong foundation for us to drive further growth in 2025. We have numerous large opportunities that we are poised to capitalize on. And with that, operator, please open the line for questions.

我們期待著激動人心的一年。我們在 2024 年取得的財務成功和投資為我們在 2025 年進一步成長奠定了堅實的基礎。我們擁有眾多的重大機遇，我們已準備好去利用它們。接線員，請打開熱線來回答問題。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指令）

Toni Kaplan with Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的托尼卡普蘭 (Toni Kaplan)。

Henry, I wanted to ask a question about how you're thinking about ESG ex climate, more on the subscription side than on the ABF side. Just how are you thinking about the potential growth rate for the business long term? Are we in sort of a cyclical challenging period and it accelerates? Or is this sort of the new normal? And what are the key factors that would dictate sort of what happens from here?

亨利，我想問一個問題，關於你對 ESG ex Climate 的看法，更多的是從訂閱方面而不是 ABF 方面。您如何看待該業務的長期潛在成長率？我們是否正處於一種週期性的挑戰期，而這種挑戰還在加速？還是這是一種新常態？那麼，哪些關鍵因素將決定接下來會發生什麼事呢？

Thank you, Toni. I've spent the last 4 weeks traveling through various cities in Europe. Visited over 50 clients in 4 weeks in 7 cities and some 5 countries or so. And so I've had a chance to discuss obviously this very critical topic for many of these clients, whether [it's] the managers or wealth managers, banks, insurance companies and the like. And I have not seen any let up in the commitment of all these European financial institutions to sustainability.

謝謝你，托尼。過去四週我遊歷了歐洲的各個城市。4週內拜訪了約5個國家、7個城市的50多位客戶。因此，我有機會與許多客戶討論這個非常關鍵的主題，無論是經理還是財富經理、銀行、保險公司等等。我沒有看到所有這些歐洲金融機構對永續發展的承諾有任何減弱。

Obviously, as I prepare to see each one of these clients, I read a lot of their material, the way they position, the way they look at their strategy, the way they describe themselves. And without any -- almost any exception, they are positioning themselves to live in a sustainable world. So with respect to Europe, the issue becomes that there is a new set of regulations that people have been adjusting to. They're rebranding their products. And therefore, there's been a little bit of a pause in launching a lot of new products.

顯然，當我準備見每一位客戶時，我閱讀了他們的大量資料，他們的定位方式，他們看待策略的方式，他們描述自己的方式。幾乎無一例外，他們都在努力讓自己生活在一個永續發展的世界。因此，就歐洲而言，問題在於人們一直在適應一套新的法規。他們正在重新塑造其產品的品牌。因此，許多新產品的推出都出現了稍微停滯的情況。

But it'd be very hard to believe that European investors, whether retail or institutional investors, will move away from their grain habits of investing according to sustainability principles.

但很難相信歐洲投資者，無論是散戶或機構投資者，都會放棄依照永續發展原則進行投資的習慣。

With respect to our product line, the product line needs to evolve from simply ratings and that report on ratings to the underlying data, the underlying information, the materiality of the signals that ESG presents for their investment process, et cetera. So therefore, the demand is there.

就我們的產品線而言，產品線需要從簡單的評級和評級報告發展到基礎數據、基礎資訊、ESG 為其投資流程呈現的訊號的重要性等等。因此，需求是存在的。

The -- obviously, the hiero and cyclical downturn is still here, but I don't see any -- but we also have to evolve and transform our product line to meet that demand. And part of that demand is compliance with a very heavy disclosures and regulatory requirements of European regulators of a lot of these financial institutions that they're not only European, but any other international global institutions that operate in Europe. So I'm pretty bullish on the opportunity there.

顯然，週期性衰退仍然存在，但我沒有看到任何變化——但我們也必須發展和改造我們的產品線以滿足這種需求。其中一部分要求是遵守歐洲監管機構對許多金融機構的非常嚴格的揭露和監管要求，這些金融機構不僅是歐洲的，而且是任何其他在歐洲運營的國際全球機構。所以我非常看好那裡的機會。

We're beginning to see a lot of this, early days, but we're beginning to see a lot of this in Asia Pacific with a lot of new regulations in Australia, in Japan, in Hong Kong, in Singapore, et cetera. So that's important. In the U.S., I think that, obviously, the new administration is not focused on sustainability. It's not focused, obviously, on climate. And therefore, we have to see how that evolves. But importantly, a lot of our clients in the United States have come to the view that sustainability and climate impact in their portfolio is here to stay and is a secular trend. Whether person A is present in the United States or Person B is present in the United States. So I think that a lot of this will move in the United States from the governmental sector to the private sectors, where it should belong to begin with, in people looking at their portfolio and the materiality of these factors in their portfolio. So I think it may take time, but it will come back and the demand will be there.

早期我們就開始看到很多這樣的情況，但我們開始在亞太地區看到很多這樣的情況，澳洲、日本、香港、新加坡等地都推出了許多新的法規。所以這很重要。在美國，我認為新政府顯然沒有關注永續性。顯然，它的重點不是氣候問題。因此，我們必須觀察其如何發展。但重要的是，我們在美國的許多客戶都認為，其投資組合中的永續性和氣候影響將繼續存在，並且是長期趨勢。無論 A 是否在美國，或 B 是否在美國。所以我認為，在美國，這些因素很大程度上將從政府部門轉移到私營部門，這本來就應該屬於私營部門，人們會關注他們的投資組合以及這些因素在投資組合中的重要性。所以我認為這可能需要時間，但它會恢復，需求也會存在。

Of course, as we have noted in our disclosures, we have been reevaluating our targets, our long-term targets. And at some point, hopefully, throughout -- at some point during the year, we will be putting that in the marketplace, but we don't know yet what those be because, obviously, this has been a little bit of a moving target.

當然，正如我們在披露中所指出的，我們一直在重新評估我們的目標，我們的長期目標。我們希望在某個時候，在今年的某個時候，我們會把它推向市場，但我們還不知道具體是什麼，因為很明顯，這是一個不斷變化的目標。

Manav Patnaik with Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的 Manav Patnaik。

Andy, I just wanted to follow up on your comment on the exciting year ahead. And I was hoping you could just contextualize that a bit with the environment. So this time last year, you talked about elevated cancels and then lower budgets following kind of a weak market period for your large clients.

安迪，我只是想跟進一下你對未來令人興奮的一年的評論。我希望您可以稍微將其與環境聯繫起來。所以去年這個時候，您談到了在大型客戶經歷一段疲軟的市場時期之後，取消訂單的情況有所增加，預算也有所降低。

So from where you stand today, like how do you look at the cancels and what are you hearing on the new budget environment, please?

那麼從您現在的立場來看，您如何看待這些取消以及您對新的預算環境有何看法？

Sure. Yes. So in general, as we've talked about rising markets are supportive for clients, both on the sales and cancels front. The momentum we've seen in equity markets and overall confidence in the sustainability of market levels is constructive to buying behaviors in certain areas, notably in the U.S., and so we have seen some encouraging signs.

當然。是的。因此，總的來說，正如我們所討論的，市場上漲對客戶有利，無論是在銷售方面還是在取消方面。我們在股票市場看到的勢頭以及對市場水平可持續性的整體信心對某些地區（尤其是在美國）的購買行為具有建設性，因此我們看到了一些令人鼓舞的跡象。

On top of that, my excitement is coming from all the innovations we continue to make. And so we are getting traction in key areas across custom indexes, solutions in front-office analytics. Analytics insights, many of our private asset solutions and areas in climate. And so we continue to be very excited about the outlook there.

最重要的是，我的興奮來自於我們不斷做出的所有創新。因此，我們在自訂索引、前台分析解決方案等關鍵領域取得了進展。分析見解，我們的許多私人資產解決方案和氣候領域。因此，我們繼續對那裡的前景感到非常興奮。

Generally speaking, the environment is somewhat more constructive, and we are seeing a pickup in the pipeline in spots. There are some spots where we still see pressure and it will take some time to fully rebound. We do see some lingering pressures on active managers, particularly in Europe. But overall, we're seeing a shift in the dynamic.

整體而言，環境稍微更有利，而且我們看到一些地方的管道正在回溫。有些地方我們仍然面臨壓力，需要一段時間才能完全反彈。我們確實看到主動型管理者面臨一些揮之不去的壓力，尤其是在歐洲。但總體而言，我們看到了動態的轉變。

On the point of cancels. As you know from last year, we did have a concentration of cancels related to some big client events. We don't expect the same level of cancels in the first quarter here as a year ago. As I mentioned, rising markets should be somewhat supportive for clients, and we will still see some lumpiness in lingering noise. But overall, we're seeing encouraging signs and areas and the market environment is constructive across many areas. And as you know, and as I've mentioned before, you shouldn't focus too much on any one quarter.

即將取消。正如您從去年所了解的，我們確實集中取消了一些與一些大型客戶活動相關的活動。我們預計第一季的取消率不會與去年同期相同。正如我所提到的，不斷上漲的市場應該會給客戶帶來一定程度的支持，但我們仍會看到一些揮之不去的噪音。但總體而言，我們看到了令人鼓舞的跡象和領域，許多領域的市場環境都是正面的。如你所知，正如我之前提到的，你不應該過度關注任何一個季度。

Alex Kramm with UBS.

瑞銀的 Alex Kramm。

Just maybe to stay on that same topic. Can you maybe talk about how pricing conversations and impact should be this year? Obviously, in the last couple of years, you've been a little bit softer there with your competitors. Continue to be pretty aggressive. And as you said, the environment should be better.

可能只是繼續討論同一話題。您能否談談今年的定價對話和影響力應該如何？顯然，在過去的幾年裡，你們對競爭對手的態度已經稍微溫和了一些。繼續保持相當積極的態度。正如您所說，環境應該更好。

So maybe you can talk about pricing a little bit more and also maybe on a segment basis because it does seem like in ESG, you have some more opportunities to as this market has matured clearly.

因此，也許您可以多談談定價問題，也可以談談細分市場的問題，因為在 ESG 中，您似乎有更多的機會，因為這個市場已經明顯成熟。

Sure, sure. So Alex, as you alluded to across the company in 2024, the contribution from price increases to sales was slightly less than the contribution in 2023. As you alluded to, we did moderate price increases in certain spots.

當然，當然。所以亞歷克斯，正如您所提到的，2024 年整個公司的價格上漲對銷售的貢獻略低於 2023 年的貢獻。正如您所提到的，我們在某些​​地方確實適度提高了價格。

It is important to keep in mind that price increases are not just like-for-like. We are oftentimes providing clients with broader access, broader usage in addition to continually enhancing our products, which we capture through price increase. And so we are, as you know, very focused on capturing value and linking our price increases to the value that we're generating the clients.

重要的是要記住價格上漲並不只是同類價格的上漲。我們除了不斷改進產品外，還經常為客戶提供更廣泛的訪問管道和更廣泛的用途，並透過提高價格來實現這一點。因此，正如您所知，我們非常注重獲取價值，並將我們的價格上漲與我們為客戶創造的價值聯繫起來。

We do look at the overall pricing environment and client health as well as an input here. But the environment, client health, the value we continue to add are important drivers to enable us to capture value from our clients. It's something that we will continue to monitor closely and calibrate based on the dynamics we're seeing.

我們確實會關注整體定價環境和客戶健康狀況以及此處的投入。但是環境、客戶健康和我們持續增加的價值是我們從客戶那裡獲取價值的重要驅動力。我們將繼續密切監控並根據觀察到的動態進行調整。

But relative to competitors, we think we're very well positioned from an offering standpoint. And as you know, we are continually trying to take a long-term approach to pricing with our clients to be strong partners to them over time.

但相對於競爭對手，我們認為從產品供應的角度來看，我們處於非常有利的地位。如您所知，我們一直在努力採取長期的定價方式與客戶合作，以便長期成為他們強大的合作夥伴。

From a segment dimension, I don't want to get into too much color on pricing dynamics specifically. But as you alluded to, and as I mentioned, we think in many areas, we have a very strong value proposition based on the quality of our offering, which is best-in-class based on the breadth of coverage and depth of coverage that we have, the interoperability of our tools and the value of the ecosystem to our clients. And our ability to help them raise money, drive growth using our tools, are all things that position us well to face off against competitors. As you alluded to in places like ESG, we have seen some competitive wins, and we think we're well positioned there. But across the organization, we think we are well positioned relative to competitors as well.

從細分角度來看，我不想過度詳細討論定價動態。但正如你所提到的，正如我所提到的，我們認為在很多領域，我們有一個非常強大的價值主張，基於我們提供的產品的質量，我們的產品在覆蓋範圍和深度上都是一流的。我們擁有工具的互通性以及生態系統對客戶的價值。我們有能力幫助他們籌集資金、利用我們的工具推動成長，這些都讓我們在與競爭對手的較量中佔據有利地位。正如您在 ESG 等地方提到的那樣，我們已經看到了一些競爭勝利，並且我們認為我們在那裡處於有利地位。但在整個組織中，我們認為相對於競爭對手也處於有利地位。

Ashish Sabadra with RBC.

RBC 的 Ashish Sabadra。

Wanted to drill down further on, Andy, your comment on improving pipeline and a constructive environment. I was just wondering if you could also comment on how the sales cycles are trending? If you've seen any shortening there? That was obviously we elongated last year.

安迪，我想進一步深入了解你關於改善管道和建設性環境的評論。我只是想知道您是否也可以評論一下銷售週期的趨勢？如果您發現那裡有任何縮短？這顯然是我們去年延長的。

And on the innovation front, you talked about custom indices, but if you could just drill down further on the trends that you're seeing on the index front?

在創新方面，您談到了客製化指數，但您是否可以進一步深入了解您在指數方面看到的趨勢？

Sure. So as I alluded to, elevated markets and AUM levels are constructive (technical difficulty) confidence. They're translating through to in many places, higher revenue for asset managers, and that's constructive to budgets and buying behavior. I'd say the dynamics are very nuanced by geography, by clients, by segment. Although those things do work through to sales ultimately and in terms of the sales cycles, there -- we see some improvement there, but in many areas, it continues to be long.

當然。正如我所提到的，市場和 AUM 水準的提高是建設性的（技術難度）信心。在許多地方，這為資產管理者帶來了更高的收入，這對預算和購買行為都有積極作用。我想說，這種動態因地理位置、客戶和細分市場的不同而有很大差異。儘管這些事情最終會對銷售產生影響，就銷售週期而言，我們看到了一些改善，但在許多領域，銷售週期仍然很長。

As I alluded to earlier, the dynamics are slightly different between the U.S. and Europe. But overall, we are seeing constructive trends in general and in the U.S., in particular. We are seeing, as you alluded to, momentum across other client segments as well. And so areas like hedge funds, areas like wealth managers, asset owners, these are all areas where we've grown at solid growth rates and delivered solid growth rates in the current quarter. And so the dynamics can be slightly different in those areas.

正如我之前提到的，美國和歐洲之間的動態略有不同。但總體而言，我們看到的是正面的趨勢，尤其是在美國。正如您所提到的，我們也看到其他客戶群的蓬勃發展勢頭。因此，對沖基金、財富管理者、資產所有者等領域都是我們保持穩健成長率的領域，並且在本季實現了穩健的成長率。因此這些地區的動態可能會略有不同。

I'd say it's something that continues to evolve, and I think we are capitalizing on many of the innovations that we are generating. As I alluded to and you asked about on the custom index side, within that custom index subscription line, the growth in custom indexes was mid-teens. We continue to see very strong progress on the custom index front on the ABF side as well. Obviously, you can see visibility into what's going on in ETF flows, which were quite strong in the quarter. But if you even look beyond ETF flows into non-ETF passive, we've seen very strong traction in non-market cap weighted products.

我想說這是一個不斷發展的事物，而且我認為我們正在利用我們正在產生的許多創新。正如我所提到的以及您詢問的關於自訂指數方面的問題，在自訂指數訂閱線內，自訂指數的成長率達到了十幾歲左右。我們也繼續看到 ABF 方面的客製化指數取得了非常強勁的進展。顯然，您可以看到 ETF 流動情況，本季 ETF 流動情況相當強勁。但如果您甚至超越 ETF 流動範圍來看非 ETF 被動資產，我們就會發現非市值加權產品具有非常強勁的吸引力。

So these are rough figures, but in non-ETF AUM, we saw close to 35% growth. In AUM linked to our non-market cap indexes, including ESG and Climate and factor indexes, that compares to 20% in the non-ETF category overall, and 50% roughly within custom [index]. And so it's an important trend for us in institutional passive. Obviously, something that's helpful in direct indexing. We also see it on the structured products front with banks and within over-the-counter derivatives. And so this is an area where harnessing our position with clients, the standards that we have out there together with our capabilities on the index side and across the organization, we are uniquely positioned to be a leader on the custom index front, we're excited for it.

這些只是粗略的數字，但在非 ETF AUM 中，我們看到了接近 35% 的成長。在與我們的非市值指數（包括 ESG 和氣候指數）掛鉤的 AUM 中，相比之下，非 ETF 類別總體上佔 20%，而定制[指數]。所以這對我們機構被動而言是一個重要的趨勢。顯然，這對於直接索引是有幫助的。我們也在銀行結構化產品和場外衍生性商品中看到了這一點。因此，在這個領域，我們利用我們在客戶中的地位、我們現有的標準以及我們在指數方面和整個組織的能力，在定制指數方面處於領先地位，我們對此感到興奮。

Alexander Hess with JPMorgan.

摩根大通的亞歷山大‧赫斯 (Alexander Hess)。

Just to go back to the sort of the overall discussion of the trends in the subscription business. As it stands, organic subscription run rate growth of 8% in the quarter, a couple of quarters of growth about that level. Obviously, MSCI hasn't been at 8% grower in its history.

回到訂閱業務趨勢的整體討論。目前，本季有機訂閱運行率成長了 8%，接下來幾季的成長都維持在這個水準左右。顯然，MSCI 在其歷史上還沒有實現 8% 的成長率。

How do we get that cycle to turn? When would that -- how are you thinking about when that inflection might occur? Can you help us just to mention how close we are to potential reinflection reacceleration?

我們如何讓這個循環運作起來？那會在什麼時候——您認為這種轉變何時會發生？您能否幫我們提一下，我們距離潛在的重新反射再加速還有多遠？

Sure, Alex. As you know, we've gone through a dynamic environment over the last couple of years. And so there have been a wide range of competing dynamics across client segments. Across product areas for us that have all fed into that overall subscription run rate growth.

當然，亞歷克斯。正如你們所知，過去幾年我們經歷了一個充滿活力的環境。因此，各個客戶群之間出現了各種競爭的態勢。我們各個產品領域都促進了整體訂閱運行率的成長。

Sitting here, looking forward, we continue to be, as I mentioned, excited about the opportunities in front of us. In the short term here, there's going to continue to be some noise, as I alluded to, as we see pressures working through the system. We see some of the lingering impacts of the outflows in asset management over the last couple of years. We see the lingering impacts from some elevated client events that have worked through the system.

坐在這裡，展望未來，正如我剛才提到的，我們繼續對眼前的機會感到興奮。從短期來看，正如我所提到的那樣，由於我們看到壓力在系統中發揮作用，因此仍會繼續存在一些噪音。我們看到過去幾年資產管理資金流出的一些揮之不去的影響。我們看到了透過系統發生的一些高級客戶端事件的持續影響。

But you can see in areas like index, we've seen a bit of momentum. Obviously, a strong quarter from recurring sales and recurring net new standpoint. And as I alluded to, we are seeing traction in some of those key growth areas, both from a client segment standpoint as well as from a content area standpoint. And so that, combined with some of the big secular opportunities, which we think we're well positioned to capitalize on in areas like wealth management, were relatively small today but growing at a healthy growth rate and have a differentiated value proposition there as well as in areas like PCS and the private asset space in general and then areas like fixed income and on the analytics side, we think we've got attractive opportunities in front of us that will help us fuel higher growth in the future.

但您可以看到，在指數等領域，我們看到了一些動力。顯然，從經常性銷售額和經常性淨新增量的角度來看，這是一個強勁的季度。正如我所提到的，無論是從客戶群的角度還是從內容領域的角度，我們都看到了一些關鍵成長領域的發展勢頭。因此，結合一些我們認為可以在財富管理等領域充分利用的重大長期機遇，這些機會目前規模相對較小，但增長速度健康，並且具有差異化的價值主張就像在PCS 和私人資產領域以及固定收益就像分析方面一樣，我們認為眼前有誘人的機會，這將有助於我們在未來實現更高的成長。

Owen Lau with Oppenheimer.

歐文·劉 (Owen Lau) 和奧本海默 (Oppenheimer)。

Could you please talk a little bit more about your Analytics segment? It looks like the run rate came down a little bit from last quarter. And I think you talked a little bit about the timing of subscription revenue in your prepared remarks. But could you please expand a little bit more on the driver of that? And how do you see the outlook going forward?

能否再詳細談談您的分析部分？看起來運行率比上一季略有下降。我覺得您在準備好的發言中談到了一些關於訂閱收入的時間問題。但您能否進一步闡述造成這現象的驅動因素？您如何看待未來的前景？

Sure. Yes. Owen, it's a good question. So let me actually take it in two parts.

當然。是的。歐文，這是個好問題。因此，我實際上將其分為兩部分來討論。

One, I'll focus on the subscription run rate growth, which if you exclude FX, was relatively consistent from the prior quarter. So I think it was around 7.1% organic subscription run rate growth in the third quarter, 6.7% in the fourth quarter, so both around 7%. The stated number was lower, so it did look like it dropped, but that was driven by a meaningful FX impact on the run rate, which as you know, FX impacts adjust the run rate immediately. So the appreciation in the U.S. dollar relative to areas like the euro and the pound translate through to a drop in the stated run rate. But as we alluded to, the organic run rate has been relatively steady, and we continue to see good momentum in areas like, as we called out fixed income, wealth.

首先，我將重點放在訂閱運行率的成長，如果不考慮外匯因素，訂閱運行率的成長與上一季相對一致。所以我認為第三季的有機訂閱運行率成長約為 7.1%，第四季為 6.7%，所以兩者都在 7% 左右。所述的數字較低，因此看起來確實下降了，但這是由於外匯對運行率的重大影響所致，如你所知，外匯影響會立即調整運行率。因此，美元相對於歐元和英鎊等貨幣的升值將導致預定運行率的下降。但正如我們所提到的，有機運行率一直相對穩定，我們繼續看到固定收益、財富等領域的良好勢頭。

Our insights offering continues to open new doors for us and create upsell opportunities. It's helping to improve the customer experience, bring scale to our clients and help them be more efficient within their large and complex workflows and adding additional value. So we continue to be excited about the momentum we're seeing in these key growth areas in analytics.

我們提供的見解不斷為我們打開新的大門並創造追加銷售機會。它有助於改善客戶體驗，為我們的客戶帶來規模，並幫助他們在龐大而複雜的工作流程中提高效率並增加額外的價值。因此，我們繼續對分析領域這些關鍵成長領域的發展勢頭感到興奮。

As always, there can be some lumpiness quarter-to-quarter. And so you saw we did see a bit of a pickup in cancels. That's to be expected as some of the noise that we've seen across the company in other segments is hitting analytics. But overall, we continue to be encouraged by the momentum we've seen in analytics.

像往常一樣，季度間可能會出現一些波動。所以您會看到，我們確實看到取消的數量增加。這是可以預料到的，因為我們在公司其他部門看到的一些噪音正在影響分析。但總體而言，我們繼續對分析領域所看到的勢頭感到鼓舞。

On the revenue front, as you alluded to, the revenue as we mentioned in prior quarters was impacted by the timing of implementation related revenues. So the revenue was slightly below run rate growth. The revenue growth was slightly below run rate growth in the quarter and this was, as a result, of a lower contribution from implementation related revenue releases, which is in line with what we expected in the comparable period a year ago, we did have a large amount of implementation-related revenue. So when we compare to those periods, the growth rate looks a bit lower.

在收入方面，正如您所提到的，我們在前幾個季度提到的收入受到實施相關收入時間的影響。因此收入略低於運行率成長。本季的營收成長略低於運行率成長，這是由於實施相關收入釋放的貢獻較低，這與我們對去年同期的預期一致，我們確實有一個大量與實施相關的收入。因此，當我們與那些時期進行比較時，成長率看起來會低一些。

We do expect in the very short term here that this will continue. So we expect the revenue growth to be slightly below the run rate growth in the next quarter. But I would focus on the run rate growth more generally as a sense as to the direction and trajectory of the segment. And as I mentioned, we continue to be excited there.

我們確實預計短期內這種情況將會持續下去。因此，我們預計下個季度的營收成長將略低於運行率成長。但我會更關注運行率的成長，以了解該領域的方向和軌跡。正如我所提到的，我們對此繼續感到興奮。

Kelsey Zhu with Autonomous.

Kelsey Zhu 與 Autonomous 合作。

So in private assets this quarter, I think we've seen declines in both retention rates and net new sales. I was wondering if you can provide a bit more color on that? I know you touched on that in the prepared remarks.

因此，我認為本季的私人資產留存率和淨新銷售額均有所下降。我想知道您是否可以提供更多詳細資訊？我知道您在準備好的發言中提到了這一點。

And for private capital solutions, I think at the time of the acquisition, you talked about accelerating revenue growth from mid- to high teens to 20%. So I was just wondering what's the time line to achieve that target?

對於私募資本解決方案，我認為在收購時，您談到了將收入成長從中高水準加速到 20%。所以我只是想知道實現該目標的時間表是怎樣的？

Sure. Sure, Kelsey. So yes -- and maybe I'll look at PCS separately from real assets because the dynamics are different, as you know. And this is the first quarter when we are reporting the two together here, and so it's worth dissecting them individually.

當然。當然，凱爾西。是的 - 也許我會將 PCS 與實際資產分開看待，因為正如你所知，它們的動態是不同的。這是我們第一次同時報告這兩個數據，因此值得分別進行分析。

On PCS, as you alluded to, we did see a slight slowdown in subscription run rate, but pretty steady growth at 15%. The sales and cancels can be a bit volatile, and we did see a bit of softness in the recurring net new in the quarter, although we are having good traction in landing new logos to the segment, we're seeing good traction with both asset owners and managers.

在 PCS 上，正如您所提到的，我們確實看到訂閱運行率略有放緩，但成長率相當穩定，達到 15%。銷售和取消可能會有點不穩定，我們確實看到本季經常性淨新業務有些疲軟，儘管我們在為該部門引入新標誌方面取得了良好的進展，但我們看到資產和負債方面的良好進展業主和管理者。

And asset owners where MSCI is, I think, bringing some opportunities with large organizations that are MSCI clients and not fully leveraging the [Virgis] offering or the PCS offering. And we've continued to see good momentum in EMEA and APAC. And so overall, we are still encouraged about the opportunity in PCS, and we see real opportunities there.

我認為，MSCI 為資產所有者帶來了一些機會，這些機會是 MSCI 的客戶大型組織，但並未充分利用 [Virgis] 產品或 PCS 產品。我們繼續看到歐洲、中東和非洲地區以及亞太地區的良好勢頭。因此總體而言，我們仍然對 PCS 中的機會感到鼓舞，並且我們在那裡看到了真正的機會。

Things like the index side, as you know, we were leased in the middle of last year, a wide range of benchmarks and indexes for the private asset space. We have been aggressively driving awareness around an adoption of those indexes. And those are things that, over time, will also lead into additional sales of not only our indexes, but our content more broadly. And there's a whole host of new innovations and content sets that we're releasing around private credit around additional data insights, both of which were leveraging AI to unlock that are creating robust opportunities for us.

例如指數方面，如你所知，我們在去年年中租賃了私人資產領域的各種基準和指數。我們一直在積極推動人們對這些指數的採用的認識。隨著時間的推移，這些因素不僅會帶來我們指數的額外銷售，還會帶來我們內容的更廣泛銷售。我們圍繞私人信貸和額外的數據洞察發布了一系列新創新和內容集，這兩者都利用人工智慧來解鎖，為我們創造了巨大的機會。

But as I said, it will be -- sales and cancels can be a little bit volatile quarter-to-quarter. But overall, we continue to be encouraged about the opportunity within PCS.

但正如我所說的，銷售額和取消量在每個季度之間可能會有點波動。但總體而言，我們仍然對 PCS 內部的機會感到鼓舞。

In real assets, we did see the same overall dynamics that we've been seeing for the last several quarters. So we were impacted by one large down sale with a client that has been feeling real pressure. We also felt some pressure, as I alluded to in the prepared remarks with brokers and agents. That's translating through to softness in our data and property Intel products. We are still seeing decent momentum in areas like our index intel, which gives market insights. And we have started to see some very early signs of improved traction in capital coming back into the space or seeing institutional money start to come back in, in the Americas and Europe, and we hope that, that is an early sign of transaction activity coming through at some point in the future and a pickup in activity.

在實體資產方面，我們確實看到了與過去幾季相同的整體動態。因此，我們受到了一次大額降價銷售的影響，客戶一直感受到真正的壓力。我們也感受到了一些壓力，正如我在與經紀人和代理商的準備好的演講中提到的那樣。這意味著我們的數據和財產英特爾產品將變得更加柔軟。我們在諸如指數資訊等領域仍看到良好的勢頭，這為市場提供了洞察。我們已經開始看到一些非常早期的跡象，表明資本回流該領域的勢頭有所改善，或者看到機構資金開始回流，在美洲和歐洲，我們希望這是交易活動即將開始的早期跡象。某個時間點，活動會回升。

But in the fourth quarter, we really saw just a continuation of the trends that we've seen with probably an outsized contribution of cancels and what we would expect to see just from a couple of big items.

但在第四季度，我們確實看到了趨勢的延續，取消量可能會大幅增加，而且我們預計僅從幾個大項目中就可以看到這種趨勢。

Scott Wurtzel with Wolfe Research.

沃爾夫研究公司的斯科特沃澤爾 (Scott Wurtzel) 說。

I wanted to ask on the wealth segment. The growth has been pretty strong there. And just wanted to see if you can kind of share what sort of your strategic road map and priorities are for that opportunity as we move throughout 2025, to potentially try to maintain that elevated run rate growth?

我想問一下關於財富部分的問題。那裡的成長相當強勁。我只是想看看您是否可以分享一下，在 2025 年，您對這機會有什麼樣的策略路線圖和優先事項，以試圖保持較高的運行率成長？

Sure. So I think there's clearly an opportunity across all of our product lines. And some of those are in existing use cases across indexes and benchmarking and in other of our standard data used in the investment process. But we think we have much more significant opportunities to help with the scaling of wealth portfolios and the balancing act of central control of risk of portfolio construction with giving advisers insight and actionable tools. And we think there's an enormous opportunity there.

當然。所以我認為我們所有的產品線顯然都存在著機會。其中一些是跨指數和基準的現有用例，以及投資過程中使用的其他標準數據。但我們認為，我們還有更重要的機會來幫助擴大財富投資組合，並在為顧問提供洞察力和可操作的工具的同時，平衡投資組合建構風險的中央控制。我們認為其中蘊藏著巨大的機會。

And in fact, even just as Henry -- Henry and I crossed the Atlantic in opposite directions. So I spent the last few weeks in New York. And a lot of my meetings were with large wealth players. And there is a significant need for improvement in, I would say, both the analytical environment for the CIO office or the product control groups at the center, and for better tools for advisers. And there's a lot of legacy systems that stand in the place of that.

事實上，就在亨利——亨利和我跨越大西洋走向相反的方向。所以我在紐約度過了最後幾週。我的很多會議都是和大富豪們舉行的。我認為，資訊長辦公室或中心的產品控制小組的分析環境以及為顧問提供更好的工具都有待顯著改進。現在有許多遺留系統取代了它。

So I think we have a generalized opportunity across all of our content, including there's enormous amount of discussion and now action of moving more private asset products into the wealth segment. And there's daily news about that, that we all read. And we think we have an enormous opportunity there also to incorporate all of the private asset analytics that we had into the wealth segment, where often the -- some of the largest wealth managers are also clearly significant LPs on behalf of their clients as well as some of them even originating enacting as GPs in private markets. So both of those create opportunities for us.

因此，我認為我們在所有內容中都有一個普遍的機會，包括大量的討論和現在的行動，即將更多的私人資產產品轉移到財富領域。我們每天都會讀到有關該問題的新聞。我們認為，我們在那裡也有巨大的機會，將我們所有的私人資產分析納入財富領域，在這個領域，一些最大的財富管理公司往往也是代表其客戶的重要 LP，其中一些甚至最初在私人市場擔任GP。因此這兩者都為我們創造了機會。

So I think the key point that I would say is we've got very high levels of engagement. I've been in some of those meetings myself. And I think what we'll continue to see, we have attractive growth rates. But I think -- we -- as some of our solutions start to get traction I hope and believe, and this is our plan, that we get a virtuous circle where our credibility becomes earned as a serious player in the wealth segment, which I think we have all the capabilities to deliver.

所以我認為關鍵點是我們的參與度非常高。我自己也參加過一些這樣的會議。我認為我們將繼續看到有吸引力的成長率。但我認為——我們——隨著我們的一些解決方案開始受到關注，我希望並相信，這是我們的計劃，我們將獲得一個良性循環，我們的信譽將作為財富領域的一個重要參與者而贏得，我認為我們有能力實現這一目標。

And I'm quite confident that as we look forward into 2025, that this will be a really, really important year for us in well, and we will see both more significant deals with larger players, and we will establish ourselves with a great deal more credibility as a provider of solutions, data and content to wealth managers.

我很有信心，展望 2025 年，這對我們來說將是非常非常重要的一年，我們將與更大的參與者達成更重要的交易，我們將透過達成重大交易確立自己的地位。管理人員的解決方案、數據和內容提供者，我們擁有更高的可信度。

Craig Huber with Huber Research Partners.

Craig Huber 和 Huber Research Partners 合作。

Can you guys focus on AI here for a few minutes. I'd be curious if you can give us some concrete examples about where you're particularly excited where AI can help you on the cost efficiency side? Maybe also give us some examples of major beneficiaries on the revenue side, enhanced products. And long term, do you think that will help you on the pricing side? I think you can charge more for AI-enhanced products?

你們能花幾分鐘專注於人工智慧嗎？我很好奇，您能否給我們舉一些具體的例子，說明您特別感興趣的是人工智慧在哪些方面可以幫助您提高成本效率？也許還可以舉一些收入方面的主要受益者、增強型產品的例子。從長遠來看，您認為這對定價有所幫助嗎？我認為您可以對人工智慧增強型產品收取更高的費用嗎？

Sure. So let me take those in order. So I would say that from the efficiency point of view, very much leading the charge is in our data operations area where we are able to -- we've already seen the ability to significantly reduce the cost of data acquisition. But I think also importantly, because we still are growing business with a lot of demand to scale up our ability to get new categories of data with significantly less cost than we would have had in the past.

當然。讓我按順序來處理。因此我想說，從效率的角度來看，我們在資料操作領域處於領先地位，我們已經看到了顯著降低資料收集成本的能力。但我認為同樣重要的是，由於我們的業務仍在成長，需求很大，我們需要擴大獲取新類別資料的能力，而成本卻遠低於過去。

So if you look at certain areas, that is also been tied in, so the product transformation and the efficiency story kind of go hand in hand. So at present, for example, we've embarked on a scalable sort of mapping of private credit data using AI, which would simply have taken us, first of all, a lot more time. We would have hired -- had to hire a lot more humans. So it's both a speed to market is we're measurably lowering the cost of data acquisition. And extremely importantly, we're going to be able to build more attractive products and analytics on the back of that much more quickly.

因此，如果你看一下某些領域，你會發現這也是連結在一起的，因此產品轉型和效率故事是並行的。例如，目前我們已經開始使用人工智慧對私人信用資料進行可擴展的映射，這首先會花費我們更多的時間。我們本來需要雇用──或者必須僱用更多的人。因此，這不僅可以加快產品上市速度，又可以顯著降低資料採集成本。極其重要的是，我們將能夠更快地建立更具吸引力的產品和分析。

Clearly in -- generally, in software engineering, there are efficiencies to be had with AI. And we've built quite a number of those also into our 2025 budgets. So from a product point of view, I think that we've got some very interesting green shoots and that 2025 will be an important transformative year on the product side.

顯然，一般來說，在軟體工程中，人工智慧可以提高效率。我們還將其中相當一部分納入了 2025 年預算中。因此，從產品的角度來看，我認為我們已經看到了一些非常有趣的綠芽，並且 2025 年將是產品方面的重要轉型之年。

So we've mentioned the AI analytics insights, which we will continue to deepen and it is an important area for us. We will -- we currently brought to market for index, some thematic driver discovery using AI, which we've had -- which is currently in beta. We've had some very positive feedback from some very major clients and we'll be rolling that out shortly and addition versions of index insights will be coming out later in the year.

因此，我們提到了人工智慧分析洞察，我們將繼續深化這項洞察，這對我們來說是一個重要的領域。我們目前將使用人工智慧將一些主題驅動發現推向指數市場，這些發現目前仍處於測試階段。我們從一些非常重要的客戶那裡得到了非常積極的回饋，我們很快就會推出該功能，並且索引洞察的附加版本將在今年稍後推出。

Again, it's a confluence of data acquisition at scale and product innovation in -- notably in the climate area, both in ESG in terms of the scaling of data gathering and the quality control in areas like controversies, et cetera. But one example would be our geospatial data asset intelligence on which we worked with Google and which has a significant AI component. So I think that both in terms of our efficiencies and in terms of new product development, 2025 will be an extremely important year for AI delivery.

再次，這是大規模數據採集和產品創新的融合——特別是在氣候領域，以及 ESG 中數據收集的規模和爭議等領域的品質控制。但其中一個例子是我們與Google合作的地理空間資料資產智能，它包含重要的人工智慧元件。因此我認為，無論從我們的效率還是新產品開發的角度來看，2025 年對於人工智慧交付來說都將是極其重要的一年。

I think the jury is then still out, whether it creates kind of a raw pricing power. I don't think it has -- that it's inherently a pricing power topic. I think it's more an efficiency topic, and it's a creation of exciting and interesting new products. But I think it's not entirely clear if it's a district sense of pricing power thing, but I think it will be a massive innovation engine, and that should help us drive sales and growth.

我認為目前還不能確定這是否會產生某種原始定價權。我不認為有——這本質上是一個定價權的話題。我認為這更多的是一個效率主題，而且是令人興奮和有趣的新產品的創造。但我認為目前還不完全清楚這是否是一種地區定價權意識，但我認為這將成為一個巨大的創新引擎，這應該有助於我們推動銷售和成長。

Faiza Alwy with Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的 Faiza Alwy。

So you've alluded to some bifurcation in terms of geography around what you're seeing from your clients in the U.S. versus outside the U.S. So I'm wondering if you can put a finer point on that, share some color on where you think things might go from here internationally versus the U.S.?

所以你提到了你在美國客戶和美國以外客戶之間存在的地理差異。

And then separately, if I can just sneak in a housekeeping question. You talked about some conversions of onetime data into subscription. So curious if that -- I know that's normal course of business, but curious if that was at an outsized level?

然後另外，如果我可以偷偷問一個內部問題的話。您談到了將一次性數據轉換為訂閱的一些內容。所以很好奇——我知道這是正常的業務流程，但很好奇這是否達到了超大規模的水平？

Sure, sure, Faiza. So on the geographic differences here, listen, as I alluded to earlier, it's a very nuanced and dynamic picture. So it does vary client segment to client segment, even firm to firm here. But we have seen the pressure on asset managers linger a bit more in Europe. And that is something that I think is -- we're seeing both on the sales and cancel side. I think in general, they follow the same trends that the overall asset managers do, there can just be lags there.

當然，當然，Faiza。因此，關於這裡的地理差異，聽著，正如我之前提到的，這是一幅非常微妙和動態的圖景。因此，不同客戶群、甚至不同公司之間確實存在差異。但我們發現歐洲資產管理者面臨的壓力仍較大。我認為這是我們在銷售和取消方面都看到的情況。我認為總體而言，他們遵循與整體資產管理者相同的趨勢，只是可能存在滯後。

And so in the Americas, as you know, we're coming out of a period where we saw significant outflows for several years from many asset managers. I think with the market levels up, sustained momentum, a bit of confidence, we are starting to see that change. And hopefully, we start to see the same thing over time in EMEA, although we expect to see some lingering impacts continuing at least in the near term. And as you know, there are some large mergers -- potential mergers out there that could happen as well, which we are keeping our eyes on.

如你所知，在美洲，我們正走出一個連續幾年許多資產管理公司大量資金外流的時期。我認為隨著市場水準的上升、持續的勢頭和一點信心，我們開始看到這種變化。並且希望我們能隨著時間的推移在歐洲、中東和非洲地區看到同樣的事情發生，儘管我們預計至少在短期內會持續看到一些揮之不去的影響。正如您所知，有一些大型合併——也可能發生潛在的合併，我們正密切關注。

But overall, we do think the environment is encouraging. I think it's just going to impact different segments in different regions at different paces here. Sorry Faiza on the second question you had, the clarification was on what topic?

但整體而言，我們確實認為環境是令人鼓舞的。我認為這只會以不同的速度影響不同地區的不同部分。抱歉，Faiza，關於您的第二個問題，需要澄清的是什麼主題？

Well, I think we lost her. I'll follow up with you, Faiza, on the housekeeping item. Oh, the free float data sales. Yes, apologies for that.

嗯，我想我們失去她了。我會跟進你，Faiza，關於家務事的情況。哦，自由流通股數據銷售。是的，我很抱歉。

So yes, we do have, from time to time, it's part of our business. Oftentimes, we will sell our free float data package on a onetime basis. And clients when they get a handle on it and how to use it and the value they can derive from it, will convert to a ongoing subscription. And so that is something that we saw in the quarter. I wouldn't call it out as a significant item in the quarter. It's something we have seen in prior quarters as well, and it's part of our business model and part of our trend here. And I think there are a number of data offerings that we have where we can get in the door with clients sampling the data and then turn it into an ongoing relationship. So I wouldn't call out any outsized impact in the quarter from that.

所以是的，我們確實時不時地會這樣做，這是我們業務的一部分。通常，我們會一次出售我們的自由浮動資料包。當客戶掌握了它並知道如何使用它以及他們可以從中獲得的價值時，他們就會轉換為持續訂閱。這就是我們在本季看到的情況。我不會將其列為本季的重要項目。我們在前幾個季度也看到過這種情況，這是我們商業模式的一部分，也是我們趨勢的一部分。我認為，我們提供多種數據產品，可以幫助客戶取得數據樣本，然後將其轉化為持續的關係。因此，我不會指出這會對本季產生任何巨大影響。

George Tong with Goldman Sachs.

高盛的 George Tong。

I wanted to go back to new subscription sales and cancellation trends. You had expected cancellation trends to normalize and improve in the fourth quarter on a year-over-year basis. Can you elaborate on areas that may have surprised the upside or downside in the quarter with respect to cancels and also new sales? And when you expect net new recurring subscription sales to inflect the positive growth?

我想回顧一下新的訂閱銷售和取消趨勢。您預計第四季度的取消趨勢將較去年同期正常化和改善。您能否詳細說明本季在取消量和新銷售方面可能出現意外上漲或下跌的領域？您預期新淨經常性訂閱銷售額何時會帶來正成長？

Yes, sure. I mean I touched on a lot of this earlier and don't want to be too specific about trajectories or inflection points other than just to highlight that we are seeing encouraging signs, and you do as I alluded to earlier, a pretty strong quarter on the index subscription front, both on the sales and cancel side.

是的，當然。我的意思是，我之前已經談了很多，我不想太具體地談論軌跡或拐點，只是想強調一下，我們看到了令人鼓舞的跡象，正如我之前提到的，這是一個相當強勁的季度。

I wouldn't say there are any dramatic surprises. I think cancels in Q4 came in generally in line with what we had mentioned and what we were expecting. We do see lingering impacts, elevated level of client events and budget constraints. You can see there were elevated cancels in areas like real assets, which we've been seeing and expected.

我不會說會有什麼戲劇性的驚喜。我認為第四季度的取消情況總體上與我們所提到的和預期一致。我們確實看到了揮之不去的影響、客戶事件的增加以及預算限制。您可以看到，實體資產等領域的取消量大幅增加，這是我們已經看到並預料到的。

You saw retention rate was pretty solid in ESG are pretty consistent in ESG and climate to just above 93%. That stabilized over the prior quarter, but there are certain areas in ESG and climate where we have seen some elevated cancels like with corporates and corporate advisers. And analytics, just by its nature, tends to be lumpy, and we oftentimes do have elevated cancels in the fourth quarter, just given client renewals.

您會看到，ESG 的保留率相當穩定，且 ESG 和氣候的保留率相當一致，略高於 93%。這一數字較上一季有所穩定，但在 ESG 和氣候的某些領域，我們看到企業和企業顧問的取消率上升。從本質上講，分析往往是不穩定的，而且由於客戶續約，我們第四季的取消率常常會上升。

And so I'd say the dynamics we saw were pretty much in line with what we expected and we continue to be encouraged by the outlook but expect some lingering noise and impacts and probably some elevated degree of cancels from the factors that we've seen.

因此，我想說，我們看到的動態與我們的預期基本一致，我們繼續對前景感到鼓舞，但預計會有一些揮之不去的噪音和影響，而且可能會有一定程度的抵消，這些抵消可能是我們已經看到的因素。

Russell Quelch with Redburn Atlantic.

Redburn Atlantic 的 Russell Quelch。

Just wanted to ask a question on the partnership with Moody's in the ESG segment. Wonder what you're doing with the new data capabilities you talked about on the private side, given you now have access to their Orbis database, is this already something where you're seeing an impact on sales growth and product opportunities? I also wondered, is there an opportunity to increase the scope of this partnership?

只是想問一個關於與穆迪在 ESG 領域的合作的問題。想知道你們如何利用私人方面提到的新數據功能，鑑於你們現在可以訪問他們的 Orbis 資料庫，你們是否已經看到這對銷售成長和產品機會產生了影響？我還想知道，是否有機會擴大這種合作的範圍？

Yes. So the announcement that we made, I think, last summer, had three components to it. The first component was that Moody's analytics, not the Moody's Investor Service, the rating agencies, the Moody's Analytics, would be subscribing to a lot of our ESG data to be able to package it with their products and sell it to their clients, which are -- a lot of them are banks and insurance companies. So that was one part of the announcement, and we are we have already started doing a lot of that.

是的。所以我認為，我們去年夏天宣布的消息包含三個部分。第一個因素是穆迪分析公司（不是穆迪投資者服務公司，評級機構穆迪分析公司）將訂閱我們的大量 ESG 數據，以便能夠將其與他們的產品打包並出售給他們的客戶。 —很多是銀行和保險公司。這是公告的一部分，我們已經開始做很多這方面的工作了。

The second part of the announcement was that we had entered into a contract with Moody's that we will use their [zero end] data, the former zero end data base data base to create ESG scores on a large number of entities that are sitting in that database. I think it's probably going to be over 100 million entities with ESG scores that can be, again, combined with their products and our products.

The second part of the announcement was that we had entered into a contract with Moody's that we will use their [zero end] data, the former zero end data base data base to create ESG scores on a large number of entities that are sitting in that資料庫.我認為可能有超過 1 億個實體擁有 ESG 評分，這些評分可以再次與他們的產品和我們的產品結合。

The third part of the announcement was an intention. The first two were the actual bids, right. The third part of the announcement was an intention to work together on private credit. And of course, as you know, Moody's is very strong in credit analysis and probabilities of [default] and the like. And we're very strong, obviously, in a lot of databases and a lot of risk analysis and performance analysis of individual instruments and private credit and in funds. So the idea here is to explore the possibility of joining forces with those two complementary capabilities.

公告的第三部分是意向。前兩個是實際出價，對吧。公告的第三部分是雙方在私人信貸領域合作的意向。當然，如您所知，穆迪在信用分析和違約機率等方面非常強大。顯然，我們在許多資料庫以及大量個人工具、私人信貸和基金的風險分析和績效分析方面都非常強大。因此這裡的想法是探索將這兩種互補能力聯合起來的可能性。

Obviously, we're still talking. We're still working through things. And if there is some kind of agreement of that, it will be in due course. So those -- so I think that it's early days with respect to the synergistic revenues associated with this, both from their side and our side. And obviously, we'll report more as we see an upswing in a lot of this.

顯然，我們還在討論之中。我們仍在努力解決問題。如果雙方就此達成某種協議，將會適時進行。所以我認為，就他們和我們雙方而言，與此相關的協同收入還處於早期階段。顯然，當我們看到許多此類情況出現上升趨勢時，我們會報告更多情況。

Jason Haas with Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的 Jason Haas。

This is on for Jason Haas. I just wanted to ask on the expense guidance. For 2024, we saw expenses come in towards the low end of the range despite the run in AUM. I think last call, you guys might have signaled that we would be gravitating towards the high end of the range, versus where we ended up coming in. And so I'm just curious as to why that was the case this year. Is there may be some offsetting savings or something to do with what you're seeing in the environment that's keeping you from pressing on the gas a little bit more?

這是傑森哈斯 (Jason Haas) 的表現。我只是想問一下費用指導。展望 2024 年，儘管 AUM 規模擴大，但我們發現支出仍趨向區間低端。我認為最後一次，你們可能已經暗示我們將傾向於該範圍的高端，而不是我們最終進入的水平。所以我很好奇為什麼今年會出現這種情況。是否存在一些抵消性節省，或與您看到的環境因素有關，從而阻止您加大油門？

And then just wondering if you could talk to us about the puts and takes of the expense guidance range for 2025, understand the assumption on AUM levels gradually increasing throughout the year. Push anything outside of AUM that can take you guys either to the high end or low the guidance range in 2025?

然後我想知道您是否可以和我們談談 2025 年費用指導範圍的利弊，以了解 AUM 水平全年逐步增加的假設。在 2025 年，推動 AUM 之外的任何事物，可以使你們達到指導範圍的高端或低端嗎？

Sure, sure. So just on Q4, there can be a number of items that can swing the ultimate expenses up or down. Things like the ultimate bonus accrual can cause expenses to fluctuate a bit, things like severance levels and other noncomp expenses can cause things to swing a bit.

當然，當然。因此，僅在第四季度，就有許多因素可能導致最終費用上升或下降。諸如最終獎金累積之類的因素可能會導致費用出現一些波動，諸如遣散費水平和其他非補償費用之類的因素也可能導致事情發生一些變化。

You did pick up on in our messages earlier that we are expecting a jump in expenses in the first quarter. And so there can be some timing-related items. And then, as I alluded to, the main drivers, compensation and benefits-related expenses that is causing the sequential expenses to pick up from Q4 to Q1 here.

您確實從我們之前的消息中得知，我們預計第一季的支出將會增加。因此可能會有一些與時間相關的事項。然後，正如我所提到的，主要的驅動因素是薪資和福利相關費用，這些費用導致第四季度至第一季的連續費用上升。

In terms of the overall guidance for the year, as you heard, our guidance is based on the assumption that markets gradually increase throughout the year. The overall approach has not changed where we are really continually trying to maximize the level of investment to drive top line growth while also driving attractive profitability and cash flow growth on a consistent basis. I'd say embedded in the expense guidance is our plan to continue to invest in those key secular growth areas like rules-based investing, private markets, front office analytics, are a modern architecture, AI-driven enhancements to our infrastructure, but also our solutions. And so we are -- we do have an ambitious agenda to continue to invest based on -- included in that expense guidance. But we are also continually focused on driving efficiencies. And importantly, we will continually calibrate the pace of spend through the year based on a whole host of factors, as we always do, looking at not only market levels, but business performance opportunities that we see out there and other factors. So we will keep you posted, but no change in our general approach to expenses.

就全年整體指導而言，正如您所聽到的，我們的指導是基於市場全年逐步增長的假設。整體方法並沒有改變，我們實際上一直在努力最大化投資水準以推動營收成長，同時持續推動有吸引力的獲利能力和現金流成長。我想說，費用指導包含了我們繼續投資於那些關鍵長期成長領域的計劃，例如基於規則的投資、私人市場、前台分析、現代架構、人工智慧驅動的基礎設施增強，還有我們的解決方案。因此，我們確實有一個雄心勃勃的議程，將繼續在此基礎上進行投資——包含在費用指導中。但我們也始終致力於提高效率。重要的是，我們將像往常一樣，根據一系列因素不斷調整全年的支出速度，不僅關注市場水平，還關注我們看到的業務績效機會和其他因素。因此，我們隨時會向您通報最新情況，但我們對費用的整體處理方法不會改變。

David Motemaden with Evercore ISI.

Evercore ISI 的 David Motemaden。

I had a question, a follow-up on pricing. So you guys mentioned that pricing was lower in -- or the price increase you guys took was lower in 2024 versus 2023, and that you had moderated some of the price increases in 2024. Does that mean that the price you guys captured in 2024 was below sort of the long-term average price increase that you guys have taken historically?

我有一個問題，關於定價的後續問題。所以你們提到定價較低 - 或者你們在 2024 年採取的價格漲幅低於 2023 年，並且你們在 2024 年已經緩和了一些價格上漲。這是否意味著你們在 2024 年獲得的價格低於你們歷史上長期平均價格漲幅？

And I guess, should we think about that being the same, higher or lower as we think about 2025?

我想，我們是否應該認為 2025 年這數字是相同、更高還是更低呢？

I would not -- yes, I would not -- I don't want to provide too much detail on the exact level and relative to historical levels. And just to be clear, the contribution to recurring sales from price increases in 2024 was slightly less than it was in 2023. And as you know, in 2023, it was elevated given the overall pricing environment.

我不會——是的，我不會——我不想提供太多關於確切水平和相對於歷史水平的細節。需要明確的是，2024 年價格上漲對經常性銷售的貢獻略低於 2023 年。如您所知，考慮到整體定價環境，2023 年的價格有所上漲。

Our approach continues to remain the same. I think there are areas where we do have pricing power. Importantly, there are areas where we continue to enhance our products and the value we're delivering to clients and price is a way that we can unlock that, although we are very thoughtful and measured and want to be constructive to our clients. And so those dynamics do differ across the company, but there are opportunities for sure, and there are areas where we will be measured.

我們的方法依然保持不變。我認為在某些領域我們確實有定價權。重要的是，我們在某些​​方面繼續改進我們的產品和我們為客戶提供的價值，而價格是我們實現這一目標的一種方式，儘管我們非常體貼和慎重，並希望為我們的客戶提供建設性的幫助。因此，這些動態在整個公司範圍內確實有所不同，但肯定存在機會，也存在需要我們衡量的領域。

Gregory Simpson with BNP Paribas.

法國巴黎銀行的格雷戈里·辛普森。

Actively managed ETFs for the fastest-growing part of the industry last year. I just wanted to ask if the ETF vehicle eventually started to replace the mutual fund? Do you think that changes the opportunity set for MSCI with active managers? Do you think it's positive, neutral or negative?

去年積極管理產業中成長最快部分的 ETF。我只是想問一下 ETF 工具最終是否開始取代共同基金？您認為這會改變 MSCI 主動型管理者所面臨的機會嗎？您認為它是積極的、中性的還是消極的？

No, it's definitely a positive. So we're extremely focused on this and been in a number of meetings myself on this topic in the end of last year and the beginning of this year. So in essence, in simplified form, it is -- it is a continuation of active strategies becoming more rules based. So -- and in turn, that plays extremely well to MSCI strength both as an index provider and as a provider of portfolio analytics and analysis. So there are -- there's a continuum of this of things which are much closer to index where we can help asset managers take active strategies and make them more rules-based and, if you like, indexify them.

不，這絕對是正面的。因此，我們非常關注這個問題，並在去年年底和今年年初就這個主題參加了多次會議。因此，從本質上講，用簡化的形式來說，它是主動策略的延續，並且變得更加基於規則。所以 — — 反過來，這對 MSCI 作為指數提供者和投資組合分析和分析提供者的實力發揮極大作用。所以，這一系列的事情更接近指數，我們可以幫助資產管理者採取積極的策略，使它們更加基於規則，如果你願意的話，還可以將它們指數化。

And then there is -- or closer to the index end of the spectrum. And -- but there are also a number of ways that we can help manage actually quite active strategies through helping clients build those portfolios through reflecting them as the risk management side of them, the portfolio construction side of things. So this is a huge focus for us right now. Going back to the regional thing on both sides of the Atlantic, it may have been somewhat more discussion in the U.S., or maybe I would say, more visibility, but it's definitely going to be a global trend. And overall, definitely a positive development for us that we're very focused on and where we're developing both more capabilities and new ways of pricing and adding value to our clients.

然後就有了——或者更接近頻譜的指數端。而且 — 但是，我們還可以透過多種方式來幫助管理實際上非常活躍的策略，即透過幫助客戶建立這些投資組合，將其反映為風險管理方面、投資組合建構方面。所以這是我們目前關注的重點。回顧大西洋兩岸的地區事務，在美國，這也許引起了更多的討論，或者我會說，更多的關注，但這肯定會成為全球趨勢。總體而言，這對我們來說絕對是一個積極的發展，我們非常關注這一點，我們正在開發更多功能以及新的定價方式和為客戶增加價值。

Alex Hess of JPMorgan.

摩根大通的亞歷克斯·赫斯。

There's a lot of discussion on today's call about product innovation and product rollouts and your products. But maybe on the inorganic side, how do you assess the M&A opportunity now in front of you? Obviously, across industries, there's a lot of talk about a pickup in M&A. Just wanted to see what you're seeing with it in your business specifically?

今天的電話會議中討論了許多有關產品創新、產品推出和您的產品的問題。但也許從無機方面來看，您如何評估現在面臨的併購機會？顯然，各行業都在討論併購活動的回升。只是想看看它在您的業務中具體發揮了什麼作用？

Thanks for that, Alex. The vast majority of our focus at MSCI is in organic growth. We have enormous opportunities in new use cases, new client bases, new product development. And importantly in putting together closer and more synergistic, many of the data sets, many of the models and many of the analytics that we already have in-house from climate and ESG data to private assets to connecting them with index to create portfolios that clients can create portfolios to look at risk analysis and so on and so forth. So that's been our primary [moat].

謝謝你，亞歷克斯。MSCI 的重點主要放在有機成長。我們在新的用例、新的客戶群和新產品開發方面擁有巨大的機會。重要的是，我們將許多數據集、許多模型和許多分析工具（從氣候和ESG 數據到私人資產）更緊密、更協同地整合在一起，將它們與指數聯繫起來，以創建客戶所需的投資組合。這是我們的主要[護城河]。

Of course, we look at almost everything that is out there for sale and we analyze it. We investigated it. But we feel that in order for us to deploy capital in those inorganic opportunities, they have to have a high rate of return, comparable to some of the returns that we get for organic investments.

當然，我們會查看幾乎所有在售的商品並進行分析。我們對此進行了調查。但我們認為，為了將資本投入到這些無機機會中，它們必須具有高回報率，可與我們從有機投資中獲得的一些回報率相媲美。

Of course, there are certain times in which the only way you can get into an area is through an acquisition like we did with [Berges] and real capital analytics and companies like that. And on the smaller side Fabric and [Foxberry], et cetera. But our predominant focus is organic growth with opportunistic bolt-ons, in the event they come in the strategic areas, and they are priced at the right level for us.

當然，在某些時候，進入某個領域的唯一途徑就是透過收購，就像我們收購 [Berges] 以及實際資本分析和類似的公司一樣。較小的一面有 Fabric 和 [Foxberry] 等等。但我們的主要關注點是透過機會性附加功能實現有機成長，前提是這些附加功能出現在策略領域，其定價對我們來說是合適的。

That concludes the question-and-answer session. I'd like to turn the call back over to Henry Fernandez for closing remarks.

問答環節到此結束。我想將電話轉回給亨利·費爾南德斯，請他作最後發言。

So thank you again for joining us today. As you can see, MSCI delivered strong financial results in '24. And we're very focused on improving our operating metrics, especially in the subscription busines with the backbone of improving client budgets and improving -- the improving environment. All of that demonstrates the resilience of our business model and the value that we provide to clients.

再次感謝您今天加入我們。如您所見，MSCI 在'24 年取得了強勁的財務業績。我們非常注重改善我們的營運指標，特別是在訂閱業務方面，以改善客戶預算和改善環境為支柱。所有這些都證明了我們的商業模式的彈性以及我們為客戶提供的價值。

As Baer indicated and I indicated, client centricity at MSCI starts from the top. So we spend more than 50% of our time at the top level of our company with talking to clients, understanding their needs, understanding how we can solve them, et cetera. So we're continuing to expand across key client segments. We're driving innovation. We're working with -- in partnership with clients to create efficiencies and scalability for their business.

正如貝爾和我所指出的，MSCI 的客戶中心主義從高層開始。因此，我們公司高層花費超過 50% 的時間與客戶交談，了解他們的需求，了解如何解決這些問題等等。因此，我們將繼續向主要客戶群擴展。我們正在推動創新。我們正在與客戶合作，為他們的業務創造效率和可擴展性。

As we mentioned, we are thoughtful and constructive on price increases, we have enormous pricing power, enormous, but that cannot be misused. It has to be consistent with creating value for our clients because we are a long-term compounder and as a long-term compounder, we want to be a long-term partner to our clients. So all of that gives us incredible strength and leadership in the areas of data models and technology and all of our capabilities. So we look forward to keeping you abreast of all our activities and development, and we thank you again for the time that you spent with us today.

正如我們所提到的，我們對漲價持深思熟慮和建設性態度，我們擁有巨大的定價權，巨大的，但不能被濫用。它必須與為我們的客戶創造價值保持一致，因為我們是一個長期複合商，作為長期複合商，我們希望成為客戶的長期合作夥伴。所有這些都使我們在數據模型和技術領域以及所有能力方面擁有了令人難以置信的實力和領導力。因此，我們期待著讓您了解我們的所有活動和發展，並再次感謝您今天與我們共度的時間。

Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect. Everyone, have a great day.

感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。祝大家有個愉快的一天。