林德集團 (LIN) 2025 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Linde third quarter 2025 earnings call and webcast. (Operator Instructions) Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. And after the speakers' presentation, there will be a question-and-answer session.

女士們、先生們，大家好，感謝你們的耐心等待。歡迎參加林德公司2025年第三季財報電話會議及網路直播。（操作人員指示）請注意，今天的會議正在錄音。演講結束後，將進行問答環節。

I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Juan Pelaez, Head of Investor Relations. Please go ahead, sir.

現在我將把會議交給投資者關係主管胡安·佩拉埃斯先生。請繼續，先生。

Abi, thank you. Hello, everyone, and thanks for attending our 2025 third quarter earnings call and webcast. I'm Juan Pelaez, Head of Investor Relations, and I'm joined this morning by Sanjiv Lamba, Chief Executive Officer; and Matt White, Chief Financial Officer.

艾比，謝謝你。大家好，感謝各位參加我們2025年第三季財報電話會議和網路直播。我是投資者關係主管胡安·佩拉埃斯，今天早上和我一起的是執行長桑吉夫·蘭巴和財務長馬特·懷特。

Today's presentation materials are available on our website at linde.com in the Investors section. Please read the forward-looking statement disclosure on page 2 of the slides and note that it applies to all statements made during the teleconference. The reconciliations of the adjusted numbers are in the appendix to this presentation. Sanjiv will provide some opening remarks, and then Matt will give an update on Wendy's third quarter financial performance and outlook, after which, we will wrap up the Q&A.

今天的示範資料可在我們網站 linde.com 的「投資者」欄位中找到。請閱讀投影片第 2 頁的前瞻性聲明揭露，並注意該聲明適用於電話會議期間所做的所有陳述。調整後的數位核對錶請見本簡報的附錄。Sanjiv 將作開場致辭，然後 Matt 將介紹 Wendy's 第三季度的財務業績和展望，之後我們將結束問答環節。

Let me now turn the call over to Sanjiv.

現在我把電話轉給桑吉夫。

Thanks, Juan, and good morning, everyone. Once again, the third quarter has proven the strength and resilience of our model. EPS of $4.21 grew 7%. Operating cash flow grew 8% and and we generated $1.7 billion of free cash flow. The backlog remains at $10 billion, contractually securing long-term EPS growth while increasing our network density.

謝謝你，胡安，大家早安。第三季再次證明了我們模式的實力和韌性。每股收益為 4.21 美元，成長 7%。經營現金流成長了 8%，我們產生了 17 億美元的自由現金流。積壓訂單仍為 100 億美元，在合約上保障了長期每股收益成長，同時提高了我們的網路密度。

Despite the challenging macroeconomic environment, Linde employees continue to generate shareholder value while maintaining industry-leading results across key metrics that matter most to our investors. This culture of ownership, deeply ingrained throughout our organization is a foundation of our performance culture. And it serves us well in both good times and bad.

儘管宏觀經濟環境充滿挑戰，林德員工仍在不斷創造股東價值，並在對投資者而言最重要的關鍵指標上保持業界領先的績效。這種主人翁意識深植於我們整個組織，是我們績效文化的基礎。無論順境或逆境，它都能很好地幫助我們。

Given the current economic uncertainty, I thought it would be helpful to provide you an overview of what we are seeing around the world. Slide 3 provides the end market trends for organic sales which include both price and volume. Starting with consumer-related end markets, which make up about a third of global sales. Healthcare encompasses both institutional and home care sales, primarily for respiratory ailments. You may recall last year, we proactively pruned certain parts of the US home care portfolio. which laps by the end of this year.

鑑於當前經濟情勢的不確定性，我認為有必要向大家概述我們目前在世界各地看到的情況。幻燈片 3 提供了有機產品銷售的終端市場趨勢，包括價格和銷售量。首先從與消費者相關的終端市場開始，這部分市場約佔全球銷售額的三分之一。醫療保健涵蓋機構護理和家庭護理銷售，主要針對呼吸系統疾病。您可能還記得，去年我們主動精簡了美國家庭護理業務組合中的某些部分，這些業務組合將於今年年底到期。

Going forward, I expect health care to remain a stable and steadily growing segment. Food and Beverage continues to grow low to mid-single digits, driven by a combination of consumption trends and innovative application technologies that enhance food quality and preservation. This is a work horse of the portfolio that may not get a lot of the spotlight but it provides consistent growth and is remarkably resilient. Electronics at 9% of sales was the fastest-growing end market this quarter. Note, this 9% does not include an additional 2% of electronic sales in Taiwan through our nonconsolidated joint venture, which is also growing well.

展望未來，我預計醫療保健產業將保持穩定並持續成長。食品飲料產業持續保持個位數低至中等的成長，這得益於消費趨勢和創新應用技術的共同推動，這些技術提高了食品品質和保鮮效果。這是投資組合中的主力軍，雖然可能不太引人注目，但它能提供持續成長，並且具有非常強大的韌性。電子產品佔銷售額的 9%，是本季成長最快的終端市場。請注意，這 9% 不包括透過我們在台灣的非合併合資企業獲得的額外 2% 的電子產品銷售額，該合資企業也發展良好。

The 6% growth we achieved is evenly split between on-site project start-ups and demand for processed gases and advanced materials. Growth was fueled primarily by higher chip production in Korea, Taiwan and the US and some lower rent ships in China and Southeast Asia.

我們實現的 6% 的成長，一半來自現場專案啟動，另一半來自對加工氣體和先進材料的需求。成長主要得益於韓國、台灣和美國更高的晶片產量，以及中國和東南亞一些租金較低的船舶。

We observed increased fab activity in Q3, spurring merchant and packaged gas demand as well as new all side bidding opportunities, particularly for cutting-edge advanced nodes. I expect this end market to provide robust growth for some time and serve as an important part of our project backlog growth. Turning to industrial end markets, which account for about two-thirds of our sales. As many of you know, this is an area we've been cautious on for several quarters in a row. So recent macro trends have not been a surprise. Starting with metals and mining, which were slightly up, largely due to inflationary price increase, while base volumes were mostly negative. Metals trends were region-specific and also impacted by tariffs.

我們觀察到第三季晶圓廠活動增加，刺激了商用和包裝氣體的需求，以及新的全方位競標機會，特別是對於尖端先進節點而言。我預計這個終端市場將在一段時間內保持強勁成長，並成為我們專案積壓成長的重要組成部分。轉向工業終端市場，這部分市場約占我們銷售額的三分之二。正如你們許多人所知，我們在這個領域已經連續幾個季度保持謹慎態度。所以，近期的宏觀趨勢並不令人意外。首先來看金屬和採礦業，由於通膨導致價格上漲，這兩個產業略有成長，而基礎銷售大多為負值。金屬價格走勢具有地域性，並且受到關稅的影響。

China is up well line benefits from supplying Tier 1 customers, but I believe the trends for Tier 2 and Tier 3 steel mills are considerably more stressed, but we do not supply that. US been as bright spot for metals, not just production levels, but also new capacity opportunities as they've been supported by the new tariffs. Europe by contrast is the weakest as demand continues to drop led by weak industrial activity.

中國從供應一級客戶中獲得了豐厚的利潤，但我認為二級和三級鋼廠的趨勢壓力要大得多，但我們並沒有供應這些鋼廠。美國一直是金屬市場的亮點，不僅體現在產量水準上，也體現在新增產能機會上，因為新關稅政策支撐了這些機會。相較之下，歐洲經濟最為疲軟，受工業活動疲軟導致的需求持續下降。

We've been supplying steel mills for many decades, and we have seen the cycles. We have confidence in the competitiveness of our customers, but also the opportunity to deploy our applications that enable our customers to either reduce energy consumption, debottleneck and enhance efficiency. Chemicals and Energy are up 1%, driven by inflationary price increases. Overall, base volumes are down as chemicals is one of the most challenged end markets today. The US and China saw flat volumes. India continues to see moderate growth.

我們為鋼鐵廠供貨已有數十年，見證了產業的週期性波動。我們對客戶的競爭力充滿信心，同時也相信我們有機會部署我們的應用程序，使客戶能夠降低能耗、消除瓶頸並提高效率。受通膨價格上漲推動，化工和能源板塊上漲1%。整體而言，由於化學產品是目前最具挑戰性的終端市場之一，基礎銷售量有所下降。美國和中國的銷量持平。印度持續保持溫和成長。

While the rest of the world is seeing volume decline as they adapt to trade policies and lower demand. Europe remains the weakest with continued broad-based demand challenges. Fixed payments are being made. So the profit impact for us is therefore limited. Despite the current challenges, I expect this cycle to rebound as all prior ones have, especially given our confidence in the cost position of our top-tier customer base. Manufacturing, which grew at 3% year-on-year was the fastest-growing industrial end market. I start with the Americas.

同時，世界其他地區由於適應貿易政策和需求下降，銷量也在下滑。歐洲依然是最疲軟的市場，面臨持續全面的需求挑戰。正在進行固定付款。因此，對我們的利潤影響有限。儘管目前面臨挑戰，但我預計這一輪週期將像以往所有週期一樣反彈，尤其是考慮到我們對頂級客戶群的成本優勢充滿信心。製造業年增 3%，是成長最快的工業終端市場。我先從美洲說起。

We are seeing solid volume growth, especially in the United States. We seem to have lapped some of the tariff concerns, and this has translated into a healthy uptick in manufacturing activity. In addition, I'm pleased with the momentum in our commercial space business. Growth has been strong as we remain the trusted supplier of fuel for rocket launches and satellite propulsion systems. This sector continues to present exciting opportunities for Linde as we invest in additional capacity.

我們看到銷量穩定成長，尤其是在美國。我們似乎已經克服了一些關稅方面的擔憂，這轉化為製造業活動的健康成長。此外，我對我們商業航太業務的發展勢頭感到滿意。作為火箭發射和衛星推進系統值得信賴的燃料供應商，我們實現了強勁成長。隨著我們加大產能投入，該行業將繼續為林德帶來令人興奮的機會。

Turning to APAC. Manufacturing volumes are holding steady. China's numbers appear to be leveling off, while India remains on a strong growth trajectory. Europe, again, continues to face challenges with widespread softness in manufacturing activity. Summarizing these trends. Consumer markets are performing as one would expect. Pricing continues to track inflation. And despite some of the volume challenges from the ongoing industrial recession Linde is well positioned to supply as industrial activity and volumes recover. In other words, it's business as usual.

轉向亞太地區。生產量保持穩定。中國的經濟成長率似乎趨於平穩，而印度的經濟仍保持強勁成長動能。歐洲製造業活動普遍疲軟，再次面臨挑戰。總結這些趨勢。消費市場表現符合預期。價格持續與通貨膨脹保持同步。儘管持續的工業衰退給產量帶來了一些挑戰，但隨著工業活動和產量的復甦，林德已做好充分準備進行供應。換句話說，一切照舊。

Finally, more recently, I've heard some talk of a potential recession and the possibility of an economic contraction. As far as I'm concerned, we've been in an industrial recession for more than two years. And here at Linde, we've taken proactive steps while navigating contractions across several industrial end markets. We've been making our model recession resistant for many years now, stressing on productivity and efficiency within our business, focusing on targeted high-quality growth while maintaining disciplined capital management.

最後，最近我聽到了一些關於可能出現經濟衰退和經濟萎縮的說法。在我看來，我們已經陷入工業衰退兩年多了。在林德，我們採取了積極主動的措施，以應對多個工業終端市場的萎縮。多年來，我們一直致力於打造能夠抵禦經濟衰退的模式，強調業務的生產力和效率，專注於有針對性的高品質成長，同時保持嚴格的資本管理。

Our operating model is designed to plan for the worst and be ready to capitalize on opportunities as they come. When things get tough, there is no group in the world that rather have in my corner, the (inaudible) team.

我們的營運模式旨在未雨綢繆，隨時準備抓住機會。當事情變得艱難時，世界上沒有哪個團體比我的（聽不清楚）團隊更願意站在我這邊。

I'll now turn the call over to Matt to walk through our financial results.

現在我將把電話交給馬特，讓他來介紹一下我們的財務表現。

Thanks, Sanjiv. Third quarter results can be found on slide 4. Sales of $8.6 billion were up 3% from last year and 1% sequentially. The Recent weakness in the US dollar led to a currency tailwind of 1%. Tuck-in acquisitions in Americas and APAC added another 1% and An engineering impact decreased 1% from project timing.

謝謝你，桑吉夫。第三季業績請見幻燈片4。銷售額達 86 億美元，比去年成長 3%，季增 1%。近期美元走軟帶來了1%的貨幣利多。美洲和亞太地區的收購增加了 1%，而工程方面的影響因專案進度而減少了 1%。

Excluding these items, year-over-year underlying sales increased 2%. Price increases of 2% were broad-based and aligned with globally weighted inflation except for helium, which continues to experience price pressure from excess supply. Overall volumes were flat as contribution from the project backlog was offset by weaker base volumes driven primarily by European industrial customers.

剔除這些項目後，年比基本銷售額成長 2%。除氦氣外，其他所有商品的價格均普遍上漲 2%，與全球加權通膨率一致；氦氣則持續面臨供應過剩帶來的價格壓力。整體銷售量持平，因為專案積壓訂單的貢獻被主要受歐洲工業客戶影響而導致的銷售基數下降所抵消。

As Sanjiv mentioned, the weaker industrial activity was not a surprise as trends mostly followed our guidance expectations. Underlying sales were flat sequentially and as seasonal increases in APAC were offset by seasonal decreases in EMEA. Note, we had a supplier settlement in the US home care business broken into two separate payments to Linde. The majority was paid Q3 2024, as disclosed in the 10-Q.

正如桑吉夫所提到的，工業活動疲軟並不令人意外，因為趨勢基本上符合我們的預期。基礎銷售額環比持平，亞太地區的季節性成長被歐洲、中東和非洲地區的季節性下降所抵銷。請注意，我們在美國家庭護理業務中與供應商達成的和解協議分兩筆支付給了林德公司。大部分款項已於 2024 年第三季支付，如 10-Q 文件中所揭露的。

While a final smaller payment was received in the second quarter 2025. The payments were covered prior excessive costs and resulted in a current quarter operating profit headwind of approximately 2% or 40 basis points versus last year, and 1% or 20 basis points sequentially. Aside from this, profit growth was primarily driven by price increases. EPS of $4.21 increased 7% or 4% more than operating profit primarily from a lower share count and tax rate. While the share count is part of our ongoing repurchase program, the tax rate relates to favorable timing versus the upcoming fourth quarter. We anticipate full year ETR to be in the mid- to high 23% range, which is similar to 2024.

2025 年第二季收到了最後一筆數額較小的款項。這些款項用於彌補先前的超額成本，導致本季營業利潤較去年同期下降約 2% 或 40 個基點，較上年同期下降約 1% 或 20 個基點。除此之外，利潤成長主要由價格上漲驅動。每股收益為 4.21 美元，成長 7%，比營業利潤增加 4%，主要原因是股份數量減少和稅率降低。雖然這筆股票回購是我們持續進行的股票回購計畫的一部分，但稅率與即將到來的第四季的有利時機有關。我們預計全年有效稅率將在 23% 的中高段位，與 2024 年的情況類似。

Slide 5 provides an update on capital management. Operating cash flow increased sequentially to $2.9 billion, or 8% over prior year. Second half operating cash flow is seasonally higher. So I expect a similar level for the fourth quarter. Overall, despite economic headwinds, the bar chart validates our resiliency through significant free cash flow generation.

第 5 張投影片介紹了資本管理的最新情況。經營現金流環比成長至 29 億美元，比上年增長 8%。下半年經營現金流通常高於往年同期水準。所以我預計第四季也會保持類似的水準。總體而言，儘管面臨經濟逆風，但長條圖證明了我們透過產生大量自由現金流展現出的韌性。

To the right, you can see how we deployed year-to-date capital with $4.2 billion invested into the business using our disciplined investment criteria and $5.3 billion return to shareholders. We have an underleveraged balance sheet with significant access to low-cost capital. So we're well positioned to capitalize on future opportunities.

在右側，您可以看到我們如何運用今年迄今為止的資本，我們運用嚴格的投資標準向業務投資了 42 億美元，並向股東返還了 53 億美元。我們擁有低槓桿率的資產負債表，並能大量獲得低成本資金。因此，我們已做好充分準備，把握未來的機會。

I'll wrap up with a guidance update on slide 6. Fourth quarter EPS guidance is $4.10 to $4.20. And or 3% to 6% growth. While this assumes a 2% FX tailwind, it also assumes an approximate 2% tax rate headwind, so these two mostly offset. As mentioned earlier, third quarter tax rate was slightly lower than the run rate, but we anticipate fourth quarter to be higher.

最後，我將在第 6 張投影片上更新指導意見。第四季每股收益預期為 4.10 美元至 4.20 美元，或成長 3% 至 6%。雖然這假設了 2% 的外匯利好，但也假設了大約 2% 的稅率逆風，因此這兩者基本上相互抵消。如前所述，第三季稅率略低於正常水平，但我們預計第四季稅率會更高。

There aren't any structural reasons rather just timing effects. It's possible there could be upside to this tax rate estimate, but time will tell. Excluding these two items, underlying EPS growth is holding in the mid-single-digit range as we maintain the assumption of base volume contraction at the top end of guidance, similar to last quarter. The quarter guidance rolls up to a full year range of $16.35 to $16.45 or 5% to 6% growth against the challenging macro backdrop.

不存在任何結構性原因，只是時機因素造成的。這個稅率估算結果可能有利多因素，但時間會證明一切。剔除這兩項因素後，基本每股盈餘成長將維持在個位數中段水平，因為我們維持了基本銷售量收縮的假設，與上個季度類似。在充滿挑戰的宏觀經濟背景下，本季業績預期全年為每股收益 16.35 美元至 16.45 美元，即成長 5% 至 6%。

In summary, we remain cautious on the outlook. It's difficult to identify near-term catalysts, which could materially improve industrial activity. for the remainder of 2025. And while we may take this prudent view, it does not negate our ability to generate shareholder value. Over the last two years, the global economy experienced recessionary industrial conditions with restrained capital activity. Linde has grown operating cash and EPS, mid- to high single digits while contractually securing a record high-quality project backlog.

總之，我們對前景仍持謹慎態度。很難找到能在2025年剩餘時間內顯著改善工業活動的短期催化劑。雖然我們可能採取這種謹慎的觀點，但這並不妨礙我們創造股東價值。過去兩年，全球經濟經歷了衰退的工業環境，資本活動受到抑制。林德公司實現了營運現金流和每股收益的中高個位數成長，同時透過合約獲得了創紀錄的高品質專案儲備。

Looking ahead, if conditions worsen, we're prepared to take appropriate mitigating actions. And when things recover, we're well positioned to capitalize. Either way, we won't spend time predicting the future, but rather focusing on the actions to shape it.

展望未來，如果情況惡化，我們已準備好採取適當的緩解措施。當情況好轉時，我們將佔據有利地位，從中獲利。無論如何，我們不會把時間花在預測未來上，而是專注於塑造未來的行動。

I'll now turn the call over to Q&A.

現在我將把電話轉入問答環節。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

Laurent Favre, BNP Paribas.

洛朗法夫爾，法國巴黎銀行。

My question is regarding the backlog. And I remember that three months ago, you were talking about defending the EUR7 billion by year-end despite startups. I was wondering if you think -- I mean, I'm not aware of any significance new intake in Q3. Are you expecting significant new projects coming in, in Q4?

我的問題是關於積壓的工作。我記得三個月前，你還在談論如何在年底前捍衛 70 億歐元的資金，儘管面臨新創公司的挑戰。我想知道您是否認為——我的意思是，我並不了解第三季會有任何重要的新增攝取量。您預計第四季會有重要的新項目嗎？

Thanks for that question. Obviously, the backlog at $7 billion. This is the sale of gas backlog is at a record level. I had said three months ago, my expectation is we will end the year with a seven handle on the backlog despite starting up $1 billion in projects during the course of the year. We're on track for that. And I believe at this stage, we are on track to getting that seven handle by the end of the year as well.

謝謝你的提問。顯然，積壓訂單高達 70 億美元。天然氣積壓訂單的銷售量已達到歷史最高水準。三個月前我就說過，儘管今年啟動了價值 10 億美元的項目，但我預計到年底我們的積壓訂單將達到 7 個。我們正朝著這個目標穩步前進。我相信，以我們目前的進度來看，到今年年底我們也能達到7個目標。

And you talked about new projects in -- on the steel side, in metals in the US. Can you talk about that opportunity? Is it something for the near term or do you see multiple opportunities over the next 12 to 18 months?

你談到了美國鋼鐵、金屬領域的新計畫。您能談談這個機會嗎？這是近期內可以實現的，還是您認為未來 12 到 18 個月內會有多個機會？

So I just want to make sure I understood that correctly. You're asking about opportunity pipeline broadly and then in the US.

所以我想確認一下我理解得是否正確。您問的是大範圍的商機管道，以及美國的具體情況。

No, it was more about Metro,I would say, traditional projects away from electronics, away from decarbonization.

不，我覺得更多的是關於地鐵項目，是遠離電子產品、遠離脫碳的傳統項目。

Good question there, Laurent. So yes, I think we are seeing that as a result of the tariffs that steel and metals broadly are likely to see some continued expansion in the US. We find ourselves well positioned with the right players who are contemplating that expansion. So the answer is, yes, we are looking at steel and metals opportunities and potential for new expansion projects, which will lead to greater gas demand, which we will either feed from our existing network or with additional assets that we are proposing to put.

勞倫特，你問得好。所以，是的，我認為由於關稅的影響，美國的鋼鐵和金屬產業可能會繼續擴張。我們發現自己處於有利地位，擁有合適的參與者，他們正在考慮擴張。所以答案是肯定的，我們正在關注鋼鐵和金屬行業的機會以及新的擴建項目的可能性，這將導致更大的天然氣需求，我們將透過我們現有的網路或我們計劃投入的額外資產來滿足這些需求。

Our next question comes from the line of Duffy Fischer with Goldman Sachs.

我們的下一個問題來自高盛的達菲費雪。

Yes. If you would, could you take a peek into next year? You've got, obviously, the Q4 guide out. that is a baseline to springboard into '26. How comfortable do you feel? What does the project startup look like next year? And then if you just kind of anniversary the price you have now, how much benefit does that look like it will bring in '26. So just anything that you can kind of see forward into 26 would be helpful.

是的。如果可以的話，您能否提前了解明年的情況？顯然，你們已經拿到了第四季的業績指南。那是進入2026年的一個基準。你感覺舒適嗎？計畫明年的啟動計畫會是什麼樣的？那麼，如果你只是把現在的價格維持在一定水平，那麼到 2026 年，這看起來能帶來多大的好處呢？所以，任何能讓你預見26歲的事情都會很有幫助。

So Duffy, in two weeks' time, we will have the entire team here going through a rigorous plan process. The planned presentations will happen there. And we will come back to you and give you good visibility on next year and provide the guide for next year as well in February, as we normally do, which you're aware of. So I want to go through that process. Our planning process is fairly rigorous.

所以達菲，兩週後，我們將讓整個團隊在這裡進行嚴格的計劃制定過程。計劃中的演講將在那裡舉行。我們會像往常一樣，在二月向您報告明年的情況，並提供明年的指南，您也知道這一點。所以我想經歷這個過程。我們的規劃流程相當嚴謹。

And I think that's what gives us the confidence to come out and give visibility on next year. I'll say a couple of things to kind of vet your appetite a little bit while you wait for us to come in February. The backlog that we have under execution, obviously, is a strong input into continued EPS growth that we are likely to see into next year and beyond. So expect that for sure.

我認為正是這一點給了我們信心，讓我們能夠站出來，讓大家了解明年的計畫。在你們等待我們二月到來的這段時間裡，我先說幾句，算是稍微激發一下你們的興趣。顯然，我們正在執行的積壓訂單將有力地推動每股收益持續成長，我們預計這種成長將持續到明年及以後。所以肯定要做好心理準備。

And of course, there is a variable in all of this, as you know. And our EPS algorithm, which holds well today and shows that management actions and capital allocation does what needs to do at the end of the day, the variable that we'll be looking at for next year will all be around the macro. And I think that's going to be one of the factors that we will spend a lot of time talking about and planning for to ensure that we have a solid guide when we come in February.

當然，如你所知，這一切中都存在變數。我們的 EPS 演算法目前表現良好，顯示管理階層的行動和資本配置最終都能達到預期效果。明年我們將關注的變數將全部圍繞著宏觀經濟。我認為這將是我們花很多時間討論和計劃的因素之一，以確保我們在二月到來時能夠有一個可靠的指南。

Matthew Dale, Bank of America.

馬修戴爾，美國銀行。

I could be wrong, but I think this is like the first quarter in some time where pricing didn't really move up sequentially and I don't know maybe it's just coincidence or rounding, but I think just a question on like the backdrop for pricing and whether you remain confident that you can continue to to move the needle just given some of the slower macro that we're talking about here.

我可能錯了，但我認為這是近段時間以來第一個價格沒有真正環比上漲的季度，我不知道這是否只是巧合或四捨五入的結果，但我想問的是，在當前宏觀經濟放緩的情況下，您是否仍然有信心繼續推動價格上漲？

Matt, this is Matt. I think when you think pricing sequentially, you're always going to have timing differences of when the anniversaries are for certain contracts for the escalations on certain contracts. So that's a normal part of our process. I always like to look at year-over-year as the key way to understand our pricing and then compare that to how the globally weighted inflation is.

馬特，我是馬特。我認為，如果按順序考慮定價，某些合約的周年紀念日和價格上漲的時間總是會有差異。所以這是我們流程中的正常環節。我總是喜歡透過同比數據來了解我們的定價情況，然後再與全球加權通貨膨脹率進行比較。

And when we look at the 2% we have year-over-year, that's pretty much aligned with what we're seeing in our geographies on a weighted inflation basis. So I probably wouldn't look too much into the sequential timing just because of some of the different timings of when increases occur.

當我們看一下同比 2% 的成長率時，這與我們按加權通膨率計算在各個地區所看到的成長率基本一致。因此，我可能不會太在意順序時間，因為某些成長發生的時間點可能不同。

Matt, I might just add one comment, which is helium and rare gases, which is a drag on pricing, has been something we've mentioned in the past as well now. Remember, helium and rare gases for us is a small portion of our revenue. So the overall impact for us at the enterprise level isn't that great. But nonetheless, that's been a drag for us, particularly in APAC, which you've probably seen.

馬特，我可能還要補充一點，氦氣和稀有氣體對價格造成了拖累，我們過去也提到過這一點。請記住，氦氣和稀有氣體對我們來說只占我們收入的一小部分。因此，對我們企業層面而言，整體影響並不大。但即便如此，這仍然給我們帶來了阻礙，尤其是在亞太地區，你可能已經看到了這一點。

David Begleiter, Deutsche Bank.

大衛‧貝格萊特，德意志銀行。

Matt, one more try on 26. Do you need base or organic volume growth to achieve your EPS growth algorithm next year?

馬特，再試一次26。明年要實現您的每股盈餘成長目標，您需要的是基本銷售成長還是有機銷售成長？

David, so when you think about the algorithm, there's the three parts, as we've described in the past. -- and the capital allocation part and the management action parts don't need any economic co. And as we've said time and time again, those two parts, we view kind of mid-single digit individually. And so the combination of those two should get us to about 10% or hopefully a little more without any help from macro.

大衛，所以當你思考這個演算法時，它由三個部分組成，正如我們之前描述的那樣。 ——資本配置部分和管理行動部分不需要任何經濟合作。正如我們反覆強調的那樣，這兩個部分，我們認為單獨來看，都屬於個位數中段。因此，這兩者結合起來應該能讓我們達到大約 10% 的目標，或者希望在不借助宏觀經濟手段的情況下還能略高一些。

And then the third piece is the macro, which really we view has two parts. The FX translation, given we're dollar functional and the base volumes that we see. Even though they're under contract to customers, how many molecules they take will drive that base volume. So that's the part that's been the drag, the headwind for a few years now. But the rest of the model continues to deliver on the algorithm, hence, why we've been able to achieve the growth we have with even the face of negative base volumes. And up until recently, unfavorable FX translation.

第三部分是宏觀層面，我們實際上認為它是由兩個部分組成。鑑於我們採用美元功能貨幣以及我們看到的基本交易量，外匯匯率轉換情況如下。即使他們與客戶簽訂了合同，他們所提取的分子數量也會影響基礎產量。所以，這就是過去幾年來阻礙我們前進的因素，也是前進的阻力。但模型的其他部分繼續按照演算法運行，因此，即使面對負基數交易量，我們也能達到這樣的成長。而且直到最近，FX翻譯一直都不盡人意。

So we feel quite good about management actions, and we feel quite good about our capital allocation portion of the backlog and we've talked about the strength of our backlog projects coming on stream. We've talked about the free cash flow that we can deploy on everything from stock repurchases to M&A activity. So we feel good that, that will deliver, and we feel good the management actions will continue to deliver. So the macro, as Sanjiv mentioned, we'll give more of an update on that on February and how we view that and how we will put that together in the guide in February.

因此，我們對管理層的舉措感到非常滿意，對積壓訂單的資本分配部分也感到非常滿意，並且我們已經討論過即將投產的積壓項目的實力。我們已經討論過，我們可以將自由現金流用於從股票回購到併購活動等各種用途。所以我們相信，這些措施將會奏效，我們也相信管理階層的行動將會繼續奏效。所以，正如Sanjiv所提到的，關於宏觀經濟方面，我們將在2月給予更多更新，說明我們如何看待宏觀經濟，以及如何在2月的指南中將其整合起來。

Tony Jones, Rothschild.

東尼瓊斯，羅斯柴爾德家族。

This is Mato speaking on behalf of Tony. So I'd just like to ask one question about the project backlog and what major end markets do you expect to drive growth once the electronic CapEx cycle peaks over the next year or so.

這是馬托代表托尼發言。所以我想問一個關於專案積壓的問題，以及您預計在電子資本支出週期在未來一年左右達到高峰後，哪些主要終端市場將推動成長。

Thanks. So our view remains that the electronic cycle doesn't peak next year. The electronic cycle in our mind is here for the next five to seven years and potentially a little bit beyond that as well with all the build-out that's contemplated. Now having said that, the visibility we have on the electronic cycle comes through the engagement with various of the leading semiconductor companies and who are currently contemplating fab expansion.

謝謝。因此，我們仍然認為電子週期明年不會達到頂峰。我們認為，電子時代將持續五到七年，考慮到所有正在考慮的建設，它甚至可能會持續更久。話雖如此，我們對電子週期的了解來自於與多家領先的半導體公司的交流，這些公司目前正在考慮擴大晶圓廠規模。

So that's what gives me the confidence to give you that sense that I expect that electronics in the capital cycle or CapEx investments to continue for some time to come. Beyond that, today, we have a fairly strong pipeline of projects that we're working on. And that happens to be across a number of end markets. And I still feel pretty confident that we will continue to see growth certainly in electronics, as I mentioned, but also in a number of other areas, including steel in parts of the world where we continue to see some possible opportunities.

正因如此，我才有信心向大家傳達這樣的訊息：我預期電子產品在資本週期或資本支出投資中的地位將在未來一段時間內持續下去。除此之外，目前我們還有相當多的項目正在進行中。而這種情況恰好遍及多個終端市場。我仍然相當有信心，我們將繼續看到成長，正如我所提到的，電子產業將會成長，其他一些領域也會成長，包括世界某些地區的鋼鐵產業，我們繼續看到一些潛在的機會。

We mentioned the US is one. India is potentially another we expect chemicals and refining in other parts of the world to also continue to see some level of activity. And last but not least, while we don't explicitly look at decarbonization projects separately, they sit embedded within our end market Companies are still looking at their programs for decarbonization and that will continue to provide an opportunity pipeline that looks pretty good, certainly for projects that have strong economic basis on which to progress.

我們提到美國是其中之一。印度可能是另一個潛在的成長點，我們預計世界其他地區的化學和煉油產業也將繼續保持一定程度的活躍。最後但同樣重要的是，雖然我們沒有明確地單獨關注脫碳項目，但它們確實存在於我們的終端市場中。各公司仍在審視他們的脫碳計劃，這將繼續提供一個看起來相當不錯的機會管道，尤其對於那些具有強大經濟基礎的項目更是如此。

Vincent Andrews, Morgan Stanley.

文森安德魯斯，摩根士丹利。

Just wondering, as we're far enough along in the fourth quarter, are you getting any sense particularly maybe in Europe, that we'll see earlier than normal seasonal shutdowns? Or is the sense you're getting that -- I think there was a comment to this, that maybe there's a little bit less pessimism now that some of the trade deals have gotten pushed along. So just any thoughts on that would be helpful.

我只是好奇，現在已經進入第四季度的大部分時間了，您是否感覺到，尤其是在歐洲，我們會看到比往常更早的季節性停工？或者你感覺到的意思是——我想有人評論過這一點，隨著一些貿易協議的推進，現在的悲觀情緒可能有所減少。所以，大家有什麼想法嗎？

So generally, Vince in Europe, Q3 tends to have a seasonal impact, and my expectation remains that Q4 will largely be flat. When I look at the broader European context today, unfortunately, as you know, we are seeing negative volumes there sequentially. That industrial market remains soft. I don't see a catalyst for change in the near term to kind of change that fundamentally.

所以總的來說，Vince，在歐洲，第三季往往會受到季節性影響，我仍然預計第四季將基本持平。從更廣泛的歐洲視角來看，不幸的是，正如您所知，我們看到那裡的交易量連續出現負成長。工業市場依然疲軟。我認為短期內不會出現能夠從根本上改變現狀的催化劑。

I'll talk about a couple of geographies that are looking like we might see movement. So I'll start with Germany to begin with. The economy is slow. You probably just saw data that came out yesterday and this morning, suggesting that maybe a slight uptick there is an expectation, and again, we don't base our plans and strategy on hold. But generally, there is an expectation and hope in Germany that the spend on infrastructure the $500 billion that's been planned, will provide an impetus or momentum for industrial activity to pick up I don't see that happening before middle or maybe even Q3 of next year.

我將談談幾個看起來可能會出現市場波動的地區。那我就先從德國開始吧。經濟增速放緩。您可能剛剛看到了昨天和今天早上公佈的數據，這表明可能會出現小幅回升，這也是人們的預期。再次強調，我們的計劃和策略不會因此而停滯不前。但總的來說，德國人期望並希望，計劃中的 5000 億美元基礎設施支出將為工業活動的復甦提供動力或動力。我認為這種情況最早也要到明年年中，甚至可能要到第三季才會發生。

But nonetheless, that is something that people are looking forward to. UK economy, on the other hand, also large in the European context remains stagnant, and we aren't seeing much movement there. And I can't see really a catalyst there either for a fundamental change. there is a bright spot in Europe.

但即便如此，這仍然是人們所期待的事。另一方面，英國經濟雖然在歐洲也算是一個大國，但仍然停滯不前，我們沒有看到任何復甦的跡象。而且我也看不到任何能帶來根本變革的催化劑。歐洲確實存在一線希望。

I have to mention that, which is the Nordics. The Scandinavian businesses seem to be seeing growth. They seem to be seeing some momentum, and that's good news, but they aren't large enough to move the overall European context. So -- for the rest of the year, I expect that declining trend that we have in volumes to remain consistent. Sequentially, you should expect that to be flattish. Nothing beyond that at this stage.

我必須提一下，那就是北歐國家。北歐企業似乎正在經歷成長。它們似乎正在取得一些進展，這是個好消息，但它們的規模還不足以改變整個歐洲的模式。所以——在今年剩餘的時間裡，我預期銷售下降的趨勢將保持不變。從順序上看，你應該會預期它比較平坦。現階段暫無其他安排。

Patrick Cunningham, Citi.

派崔克‧坎寧安，花旗銀行。

One of the desired outcomes from the trade and tax policy is clearly an increase in US manufacturing. And it seems like we've lapped some of the tariff concerns. You started to see some uptick here -- how would you frame the market risk near term, which seems to be getting a bit better versus what maybe your customers are saying in terms of doing new projects, CapEx plans and level of certainty on sort of forward growth expectations?

貿易和稅收政策的預期結果之一顯然是提高美國製造業水準。看來我們已經克服了一些關稅上的擔憂。您已經開始看到一些好轉跡象—您如何看待近期市場風險？目前市場風險似乎有所好轉，但這與您的客戶在開展新項目、資本支出計劃以及對未來成長預期的確定程度方面的說法有何不同？

Patrick, that's a good question. Let me kind of give you a two-part answer to that. I'll talk to you about our US package business that reflects the near-term realities of what we're seeing and what we saw in Q3. We expect that to be consistent into Q4, and I'll give you a little bit of a sentiment view from what I'm hearing from customers as well.

派崔克，問得好。讓我分成兩部分來回答這個問題。我將和大家談談我們的美國包裹業務，這反映了我們目前所看到的以及第三季所看到的近期實際情況。我們預計這種情況會持續到第四季度，我也會根據我從客戶那裡聽到的一些回饋，向大家介紹我的看法。

Let's start with the package business. So the package business, the US package business grew mid-single digits organically. That's volume and price together. Gas volumes were down low single digit. They were impacted by Helium as well within that. So the industrial demand underlying there was quite stable. Hard goods sales were up mid-single digits. Volumes are particularly up due to growth in automation and equipment sales.

我們先從包裝業務說起。因此，美國包裹業務實現了中等個位數的自然成長。這是銷量和價格的總和。天然氣銷量已降至個位數低點。它們也受到了氦氣的影響。因此，那裡的工業需求相當穩定。硬商品銷售額實現了中等個位數的成長。銷售量大幅成長主要得益於自動化和設備銷售的成長。

Now that's usually a good sign because it shows that customers are preparing for order book pickup to happen and therefore, getting ready for that. So that's a good signal that we obviously track quite closely. So I'd say that growth in automation equipment suggesting that they're willing to make some of that upfront investment to be prepared for the orders as they come through.

這通常是一個好兆頭，因為它表明顧客正在為取貨做準備，因此正在為此做好準備。所以這是一個很好的信號，我們顯然會密切注意。所以我認為，自動化設備的成長表明他們願意進行一些前期投資，以便為即將到來的訂單做好準備。

Larger projects, and I think answer your question around customer sentiment now, I'd say that there remains a degree of caution. There is no question we've lapped the tariff concerns, but there still remains a degree of caution. And I think we see people progressing on looking at their major expansion projects or CapEx investment into the ground, but we still see a degree of caution around that.

對於規模較大的項目，我認為現在回答你關於客戶情緒的問題，我認為仍然存在一定程度的謹慎。毫無疑問，我們已經克服了關稅方面的擔憂，但仍需保持一定程度的謹慎。我認為我們看到人們正在逐步推進他們的重大擴張項目或資本支出投資，但我們仍然看到他們對此保持一定程度的謹慎。

Probably I say when I look at broader manufacturing the volumes are resilient, but suggest that, that trend is likely to continue into Q4 with hopefully the pickup happening in the first half maybe middle of next year in terms of actual projects on the ground, ensuring that volumes have a pickup.

就整體製造業而言，產量可能具有韌性，但我認為，這種趨勢可能會持續到第四季度，希望明年上半年或年中，實際項目能夠有所進展，從而確保產量回升。

John Roberts, Mizuho Securities.

約翰·羅伯茨，瑞穗證券。

I think China is lowering the prices quickly on electrolyzers, the same way they did on equipment for solar and wind. Do you think that might cause any recovery in green hydrogen ammonia? It's been very quiet in the last couple of years here.

我認為中國正在迅速降低電解槽的價格，就像他們降低太陽能和風能設備的價格一樣。你認為這可能會導致綠色氫氨的復甦嗎？過去幾年這裡一直很安靜。

John, I think the Chinese cost curve on electrolyzers alkaline in particular, has been declining for some time. This isn't necessarily new -- they've had a couple of hiccups around the scale-up technology being reliable and working through. But notwithstanding that, I fully expect Chinese electrolyzers to provide a very -- a good option in the market as people evaluate the economics of green hydrogen or renewable hydrogen. What I would say to you, though, is that the issues with renewable hydrogen are slightly more fundamental, and they come with three parts, and I know you know this, John, but I'm going to repeat this anyway. The first issue is around scalability of that technology because we are still talking in terms of 5-megawatt stacks, 20-megawatt stacks that isn't scale at which we can really operate.

約翰，我認為中國鹼性電解槽的成本曲線已經下降了一段時間了。這並非什麼新鮮事——他們在規模化技術的可靠性和運作方面遇到了一些小問題。儘管如此，我完全相信，隨著人們評估綠氫或可再生氫的經濟性，中國電解槽將為市場提供一個非常好的選擇。不過，我想對你說的是，可再生氫的問題更加根本，它包含三個方面，我知道你明白這一點，約翰，但我還是要再說一次。第一個問題是該技術的可擴展性，因為我們仍然在談論 5 兆瓦的堆疊、20 兆瓦的堆疊，這並不是我們真正能夠運作的規模。

So you have hundreds of modules to come together in case you want to build a 200 or 500-megawatt facility, which again, in the larger scheme of things, when you compare that to a large steam retail reformer is a fraction of what the steam methane reformers deliver. So I think from that scalability point of view, there is a challenge for electrolyzers as is the challenge around reliability in terms of being able to operate clearly not 24/7 because of the availability of renewable energy. But even from the grid, I think the ability to give that 247 consistently over the course of the year is still fairly challenged around electrolyzer technology. So that's the first piece.

因此，如果您想建造一座 200 或 500 兆瓦的設施，您需要將數百個模組組合在一起。然而，從更大的角度來看，與大型蒸汽零售重整裝置相比，這只是蒸汽甲烷重整裝置的一小部分。所以我認為，從可擴展性的角度來看，電解槽面臨著挑戰​​，就像可靠性方面的挑戰一樣，因為再生能源的可用性，電解槽顯然無法全天候運作。但即便從電網層面來看，我認為電解槽技術在全年持續提供 24/7 電力方面仍面臨相當大的挑戰。這是第一部分。

The second piece is what you referred to, which is capital efficiency or the lack thereof. And I think that's being addressed in part certainly by the Chinese more rapidly than anyone else. I've said this before, so at the risk of repeating myself, that's probably the cost curve on the capital side needs to probably get a reduction of between 60% to 70% before you start seeing an inflection point which makes renewable or green hydrogen more competitive.

第二點就是你提到的，也就是資本效率，或者說缺乏資本效率。我認為，中國正在以比其他國家更快的速度在一定程度上解決這個問題。我以前說過，所以即使有重複的風險，資本方面的成本曲線可能需要降低 60% 到 70%，才能開始看到轉折點，使再生能源或綠色氫能更具競爭力。

And last but not least, in all of this we shouldn't forget the fact that we need availability of electrons generally, but renewable energy, in particular, because that's what the preferred option for green or renewable hydrogen is. And as you know well, today, any electron gets taken out very quickly. And all of this build out on data centers and AI-led data center development means that renewable energy is going to get scarcer, if you will, from a renewable hydrogen perspective. So that's something also that is structural for now that needs to get addressed before we get to a point where you see that scale-up happen.

最後但同樣重要的是，在所有這些事情中，我們不應該忘記我們需要電力供應，尤其是再生能源，因為這是綠色或可再生氫的首選方案。如你所知，如今任何電子都會很快被移除。所有這些資料中心建設和人工智慧驅動的資料中心發展意味著，從再生氫的角度來看，再生能源將會變得越來越稀缺。所以這也是目前需要解決的結構性問題，在我們能夠看到規模化發展之前，這個問題需要先解決。

Jeff Zekauskas, JPMorgan.

Jeff Zekauskas，摩根大通。

In your commentary on the APAC segment, you said your prices would have been up or they were up in all areas, except for helium and rare gases. So if half of the penalty is Helium, maybe that's $15 million. And in your other segment, you're losing about $15 million in that segment used to earn about $15 million. So the helium hit there is at least $15 million, maybe it's $30 million, so it looks like maybe the helium penalty this quarter was $50 million year-over-year. It had to be a minimum of $30 million and so if you annualize that, that's trimming your EPS growth by about 2%, maybe it's 1.5% to 2.5%. Is that the correct math?

您在對亞太地區市場的評論中提到，除了氦氣和稀有氣體之外，所有領域的價格都上漲了或已經上漲了。如果一半的罰款是氦氣，那可能是 1500 萬美元。而在另一個業務板塊，你們正在虧損約 1,500 萬美元，而該板塊過去曾獲利約 1,500 萬美元。所以，氦氣造成的損失至少有 1,500 萬美元，也許是 3,000 萬美元，所以看起來本季氦氣造成的罰款可能比去年同期高出 5,000 萬美元。最低金額必須達到 3000 萬美元，如果按年計算，這將使每股收益成長率下降約 2%，或許在 1.5% 到 2.5% 之間。這樣計算正確嗎？

So I'm sure you've done the math. I'll let Matt kind of respond back to that. I'll just give you my flavor on what is happening to APAC pricing to just reconfirm that APAC pricing excluded helium and rare gases. So I would urge you to not forget that. So APAC pricing, excluding helium and rare gases, is positive. Now you have to remember in APAC also that China is going through deflation. So we do see that reflected the Chinese pricing more broadly. But Matt, what do you say to the math that Jeff just put.

所以我相信你已經算過了。我會讓馬特來回應這個問題。我只想和你談談我對亞太地區定價的看法，再次確認亞太地區定價不包括氦氣和稀有氣體。所以我懇請你們不要忘記這一點。因此，除氦氣和稀有氣體外，亞太地區的定價是積極的。現在你還要記住，亞太地區的情況是，中國正經歷通貨緊縮。所以我們看到，這更廣泛地反映了中國的定價策略。但是馬特，你對傑夫剛才給的數學計算有什麼看法？

Yes. I think on a high level, Jeff, would agree with the basics of your math. When you think about full year, we'll stick with full year basis rather than quarter. But on a full year basis, between helium are gas, if you take both the volume impact because you did see some curtailment of volume, whether it's for balloon or whether it's for MRI, coupled with some of the pricing impact you could argue on a year-on-year basis, that's probably a 1% to 2% impact, probably in the lower end of that range, but on the EPS year-on-year.

是的。我認為，傑夫，從宏觀層面來說，會同意你的基本數學觀點。如果考慮全年，我們會採用全年計算方式，而不是按季度計算。但從全年來看，氦氣和氣體，如果你考慮到銷量受到的影響（因為你確實看到銷量有所下降，無論是氣球還是 MRI），再加上價格方面的影響，你可以說，同比來看，這可能會對每股收益產生 1% 到 2% 的影響，可能在這個範圍的下限，但這會對每股收益產生同比影響。

That -- at APAC, unfortunately, is impacted the most. Given that's where the larger percentage of demand for those products are. But that is how I would summarize. I mean when you think about helium and rare gas, it is low single-digit percent of our global sales. And just given some of the volume and pricing impacts, you have seen an impact year-on-year related to that.

不幸的是，亞太地區受到的影響最大。因為這部分地區對這些產品的需求佔比更大。這就是我的總結。我的意思是，當你想到氦氣和稀有氣體時，它們只占我們全球銷售額的個位數百分比。考慮到銷量和價格方面的影響，我們已經看到與此相關的同比影響。

So I would say pretty much flows close to those numbers, but we hopefully have seen some stabilization definitely on the pricing of rare gases, and helium, I think it still remains to be seen on some of the Russian supply.

所以我認為實際流量基本上接近這些數字，但我們希望稀有氣體和氦氣的價格已經趨於穩定，我認為俄羅斯的一些供應情況還有待觀察。

Mike Sison, Wells Fargo.

麥克西森，富國銀行。

Sanjiv, I wanted to dig in a little bit on your comments on the chemical industry. Unfortunately, I see a red today for our sector in terms of stock prices. But you had commented that you saw the cycle will turn positive. We've seen a lot of companies this quarter have asset write-downs. There's more announcements of asset reductions or rationalization, particularly in Europe and other parts of the world.

Sanjiv，我想就你對化工產業的評論深入探討一下。不幸的是，就股價而言，我認為我們這個行業的今天將會下跌。但你曾說過，你認為這個週期會轉為正面的。本季我們看到很多公司都出現了資產減損。越來越多的企業宣布削減資產或進行資產合理化，尤其是在歐洲和世界其他地區。

So what do you think -- why do you think there could be a recovery in the sector over time. And I just worry that maybe the structural issues that could prevent a recovery anytime soon. So just curious on what you think needs to happen for that industry to turn the corner.

那麼你認為──你覺得隨著時間的推移，這個產業為什麼可能會復甦？我只是擔心一些結構性問題可能會阻礙經濟在短期內復甦。所以，我很好奇你認為這個產業需要發生什麼才能扭轉局面。

So Mike, that's a good observation. I think the chemical industry, as I said in my remarks, is probably the most impacted at this point in time. And therefore, every view on the industry are all perspectives and the industry tend to be quite negative.

麥克，你的觀察很到位。正如我剛才所說，我認為目前受影響最大的可能是化學工業。因此，對這個行業的每一種看法都只是不同的視角，而這個行業往往被認為是相當負面的。

The reality is, and you know this well, Mike, we've seen the chemical industry go through these cycles before. There are some elements that are structural. There is nothing that we have to accept that, particularly Europe, right? And we have seen the rationalization of capacity in Europe, supporting capacities elsewhere in the world. The one market where chemicals is still doing reasonably including in the last quarter was China.

事實上，麥克，你也很清楚這一點，我們以前就見過化學產業經歷這樣的週期。有些元素是結構性的。我們沒有什麼必須接受的，尤其是在歐洲，對吧？我們已經看到歐洲產能的合理化，從而支持世界其他地區的產能。包括上季在內，化工產品市場中唯一表現尚可的市場是中國。

Now obviously, a lot of capacity put in China on chemicals, which doesn't help the global supply-demand situation. But nonetheless, we have seen chemicals continue to have reasonable growth in China in the quarter and the expectation remains that, that will be the case. I do expect that with the rationalization in Europe, you will see the broader chemical asset base, start looking at the recovery or rebound over time.

很顯然，中國在化工領域投入了大量產能，不利於全球供需平衡。但儘管如此，我們看到本季中國化工產業繼續保持了合理的成長，預計這種情況還會持續下去。我預計隨著歐洲的合理化進程，更廣泛的化學資產基礎將開始出現復甦或反彈。

I'm not suggesting it's happening tomorrow anytime soon. but I do expect that cycle to turn. And based on the feedback we have from many of our customers now, the expectation remains that once the rationalization actions have been taken into account, there will be a fundamental shift back to a point where you will see that chemical industry come back a little.

我並不是說這種情況明天就會發生，但我確實預期這種週期會轉變。根據我們目前從許多客戶那裡得到的回饋，預計一旦合理化措施到位，化學工業將會發生根本性的轉變，並且有所復甦。

Got it. And then just one quick follow-up. SG&A was up 9% year-over-year, sequential three. Any particularly, any reason for that trend? And how do you see that going forward?

知道了。然後，還有一個簡短的後續問題。銷售、一般及行政費用較去年同期成長 9%，較上季成長 9%。造成這種趨勢的原因是什麼？你如何看待未來的發展？

Yes. The answer for that is fairly simple, Mike. I always look at SG&A because quarterly trends have things in and out. You've got merit, you've got inflation, you've got stuff like that. I always look at year-to-date. Year-to-date, SG&A is up 1%. And really, I think when you dig a little bit deeper under that, we've got M&A impacting that by about a percent, we've got inflation impacting that by about 2%. And then we have, as you know, a whole restructuring set of actions happening, which take down our SG&A by 2%. So net-net, year-to-date, we're up about 1%.

是的。答案很簡單，麥克。我總是關注銷售、一般及行政費用，因為季度趨勢會反映出一些項目的增減情況。有功績，有通貨膨脹，還有諸如此類的事情。我總是看年初至今的數據。今年迄今為止，銷售、一般及行政費用增加了 1%。而實際上，我認為當你深入探究一下就會發現，併購活動對其影響約為 1%，通貨膨脹對其影響約為 2%。然後，如您所知，我們正在進行一系列重組措施，這將使我們的銷售、一般及行政費用降低 2%。所以總的來說，今年到目前為止，我們上漲了約 1%。

John McNulty, BMO Capital Markets.

John McNulty，BMO資本市場。

Maybe a follow-up around some of the European capacity closures. So it looks like there have been a lot announced at this point. And so far, you all seem like you've avoided being tied to too many of them likely a lot of good partnerships that you've kind of picked over the years. I guess can you help us to think about at least given the announcements that have come out in the last quarter or so if there's any speed bumps that we should be aware of as we look out over the next year or two where assets are getting shut down, maybe you get a big onetime payout and then the business disappears. I guess how should we be thinking about that?

或許可以跟進報道歐洲一些產能關閉的情況。看來目前已經公佈了許多消息。到目前為止，你們似乎都避免了與太多公司建立合作關係，這可能是你們多年來精心挑選的眾多良好合作關係。我想，鑑於過去一個季度左右發布的公告，您能否幫助我們思考一下，在未來一兩年內，當我們展望未來時，是否存在任何我們應該注意的障礙，例如資產關閉，也許你會得到一大筆一次性付款，然後業務就消失了。我想我們該如何看待這個問題呢？

John, I'd say to you that the rationalization has been something that we have looked at. And to some extent, we internally had kind of mapped out what we thought the pace of that would be. All of that's playing to exactly how we thought it would be.

約翰，我想告訴你，我們已經考慮過合理化這個問題。在某種程度上，我們內部已經大致規劃好了我們認為的發展速度。這一切都和我們預想的完全一樣。

So I'm not seeing any surprises in there. I would also say to you that there are a few customers that are below MTOP at the moment in Europe, largely around steel and chemicals. And I think we still are being paid. The thing that I look at when I look at these large customers is whether we're getting paid the fixed fee, and that's what contractually protects us from any exposure.

所以我覺得沒什麼好意外的。我還想告訴你們，目前歐洲有些客戶的預算低於 MTOP，主要集中在鋼鐵和化學工業。而且我認為我們仍然在領薪水。當我查看這些大客戶時，我會關注我們是否收到了固定費用，而這正是合約中保護我們免受任何風險的條款。

So we see that happen. I do not expect any significant rationalization impact of the order and kind of the way you defined it where things stand down with large one-off payments. We are just seeing -- again, it's the pedigree of the customers we have, the cost positions that they have, which ensure that these Tier 1 customers in the chemical sector that we serve will remain. They will be much, much the last man standing, if you will. And I feel good about that portfolio.

所以我們看到這種情況發生了。我不認為這項命令會對合理化產生任何重大影響，而且按照你對「大額一次性付款」的定義，事情不會因此而停滯不前。我們看到－再次強調，正是我們客戶的資質和成本優勢，確保了我們所服務的這些化學產業一級客戶能夠繼續留任。他們會是堅持到最後的一方。我對這個投資組合感到很滿意。

Josh Spector, UBS.

瑞銀集團的 Josh Spector。

I had a follow-up just on the manufacturing comments. I mean, I think if you look at the declines you're calling out in Europe and then the growth in the US side or Americas broadly, I mean you're doing much better than the PMI metrics than what we're looking at. So just curious if you could comment maybe in a little bit more detail by market or wins and how that is driving itself the quarter maybe some of that's redundant with your answer, Patrick, but I wasn't sure if there's anything else to add.

我針對製造業的意見進行了後續跟進。我的意思是，如果你看看你提到的歐洲經濟下滑，再看看美國或整個美洲地區的成長，你會發現你的表現比我們看到的 PMI 指標好得多。所以，我只是好奇您能否更詳細地評論一下，例如按市場或勝場情況來分析，以及這些因素如何推動本季業績。也許有些內容與您的回答重複了，帕特里克，但我不知道是否還有什麼要補充的。

Yes. So I think as I explained there, Josh, the manufacturing piece more broadly is seeing, two things are happening, right? We're lapping the tariff concerns or the trade concerns that were there, and I think that's resulted in manufacturing coming back and rebasing. So the uptick in manufacturing that I referenced earlier on is driven by that.

是的。所以我覺得正如我剛才解釋的那樣，Josh，從更廣泛的製造業角度來看，現在有兩件事正在發生，對吧？我們正在克服先前的關稅或貿易問題，我認為這導致了製造業的回歸和重新定位。因此，我前面提到的製造業成長正是由這種情況所推動的。

And then obviously, we are seeing some of the clarity that is now coming into the market, allowing people to plan and progress with their activity and potentially expansion in that space as well. I won't point out any specific elements. I'll give you a couple of examples. So the US manufacturing, clearly, I've given you the example of the US packaged gas business, that is a great proxy for US manufacturing has done well, mid-single-digit organic growth.

然後很明顯，我們看到市場正在逐漸明朗化，使人們能夠規劃和推進他們的業務活動，並有可能在該領域進行擴張。我不會指出任何具體細節。我舉幾個例子。所以很明顯，美國製造業表現良好，我舉了美國包裝氣體業務的例子，這很好地代表了美國製造業，實現了中等個位數的內生成長。

That is, of course, both price and volume. But I'll also give you examples in China, as an example, which we've been struggling with manufacturing being in steady decline. We have seen particularly around selective subparts of the manufacturing end market. We've seen EVs and batteries show some growth, so we are seeing a bit of mix back around the world.

當然，這包括價格和銷量。但我也會以中國為例，我們一直在努力應對中國製造業持續下滑的問題。我們尤其在製造業終端市場的特定細分領域中看到了這種情況。我們看到電動車和電池出現了一些成長，因此我們看到世界各地正在出現一些混合局面。

The US leaves that in terms of the manufacturing activity and the growth we see in there. We're seeing, obviously, India, I gave you the example of China, where we see manufacturing broadly remain struggling is Europe. And I think it should come as a surprise to you. We've been kind of looking at that, and it is exactly as we had expected, unfortunately.

就製造業活動和我們所看到的成長而言，美國的情況則有所不同。很明顯，我們看到印度的情況，我之前舉了中國的例子，我們看到製造業總體上仍在苦苦掙扎，歐洲也是如此。我想這應該會讓你感到驚訝。我們一直在關注這件事，不幸的是，結果正如我們所預料的那樣。

Now the expectation there is that the $500 billion spend in Germany is going to spur some of that manufacturing activity I'd love to tell you that it's going to happen on the first of January 2026, but you and I both know that by the time the German system puts its whole process around that, it's going to be a few quarters before we get the benefit of that. And you will see that play out. I think there's a certainty around that. But again, we'd love to watch for that to happen before we can really kind of comment on that.

現在人們期望德國的 5,000 億美元支出能夠刺激一些製造業活動。我很想告訴你，這將在 2026 年 1 月 1 日發生，但你我都清楚，等到德國的整個體系完成相關流程後，我們還需要幾個季度才能從中受益。你會看到事情的發展。我認為這一點是毋庸置疑的。但是，我們還是想先觀察事情的發展，然後再對此發表評論。

And Josh, this is Matt. The only other one thing I'd add to Sanjiv's points are, we do put commercial space in the manufacturing, that is growing and clearly driving some of the growth in that end market. That obviously will not correlate with PMI, given it's a very different type of growth trajectory, but that is also having a positive impact on the manufacturing end market.

喬希，這位是馬特。我唯一要補充的是，除了 Sanjiv 的觀點之外，我們確實在製造業中投入了商業空間，這正在發展壯大，並且顯然推動了終端市場的一些成長。鑑於成長軌跡截然不同，這顯然與 PMI 不相關，但這也對製造業終端市場產生了正面影響。

Matt, I don't know how I forgot that because I think the space is an end market by itself. I think -- it's about time we grew that enough to be able to show that as an end market. But yes, very healthy double-digit growth, feeling really good about aerospace broadly and commercial space specifically, Josh. And I'll just give a bit more color there just to say, look, the reason we're excited is not only have we seen as a reliable partner by almost all the space large companies.

馬特，我不知道我怎麼會忘記這一點，因為我認為這個領域本身就是一個終端市場。我認為——我們是時候發展到足以將其作為終端市場展示的程度了。是的，兩位數的健康成長，我對整個航空航太領域，特別是商業航太領域，都感到非常樂觀，Josh。我再補充一點，我們感到興奮的原因不僅是因為幾乎所有大型航太公司都視我們為可靠的合作夥伴。

But as the companies are ramping up their activity and accelerating their manufacturing process around both the production of engines, testing of engines and obviously launch, we see this significant opportunity for growth, and we are putting a lot of capacity on the ground today, particularly in the US, to serve that additional oxygen, nitrogen, hydrogen demand and, of course, rare gases for propulsion systems for satellites as well. So yes, that certainly sits in manufacturing, and Matt was absolutely right in just pointing that out.

但隨著各公司加強生產力度，加快引擎生產、引擎測試以及發射等製造流程，我們看到了巨大的成長機會。如今，我們正在地面上投入大量產能，尤其是在美國，以滿足對氧氣、氮氣、氫氣以及衛星推進系統所需的稀有氣體的額外需求。所以，是的，這肯定屬於製造業範疇，馬特指出的這一點完全正確。

Kevin McCarthy, Vertical Research Partners.

Kevin McCarthy，Vertical Research Partners。

Sanjeev, you commented in the prepared remarks with regard to electronics, that you expect robust growth for some time. So I was wondering if you could unpack that for us a little bit. For example, what sort of industry level growth do you see over the next few years, however you think about that, square inches of silicon or otherwise? And in the past, I think that you've asserted that industrial gas demand into electronics actually grows at a premium rate due to shrinking nodes and maybe changes to chip architecture, et cetera. Is that still the case? And what is that premium? And how do you see it evolving with AI, data centers, et cetera?

桑吉夫，你在事先準備好的演講稿中談到電子行業時表示，你預計該行業將在一段時間內保持強勁增長。所以我想請您稍微解釋一下。例如，無論你從哪個角度來看，是矽片的平方英吋還是其他方面，你認為未來幾年產業層面會有怎樣的成長？過去，我認為您曾斷言，由於製程節點縮小以及晶片架構的變化等等，電子行業對工業氣體的需求實際上以更高的速度增長。現在情況仍然如此嗎？那額外費用是什麼？那麼，您認為隨著人工智慧、資料中心等技術的發展，它將如何演變？

Sure, Kevin. That's a great question. So as I said in the prepared remarks and also in the response to a question earlier, we still see a very robust pipeline for growth over the years to come over there. I think when you think about semiconductors broadly, the expectation remains that over the next five years or so, you should see semiconductor industry grow to $1 trillion. I think the expectation of growth between 9% to 11%, I think depends on which study you pick up.

當然可以，凱文。這是一個很好的問題。正如我在準備好的演講稿以及先前對一個問題的回答中所說，我們仍然看到未來幾年那裡將有非常強勁的成長前景。我認為，從廣義上講，半導體產業預計在未來五年左右的時間裡，其規模將成長到 1 兆美元。我認為預期成長率在 9% 到 11% 之間，具體數字取決於你選擇哪項研究。

Within that, clearly, as you're aware, logic is the steady growth element in there. And of course, memory more recently driven by BAM really is seeing a significant pickup as well, and that's where a lot of the capacities today, both in terms of logic for the GPUs as well as HBM and memory are really finding the investments play out.

其中，很顯然，正如你所知，邏輯是其中穩定成長的要素。當然，最近由 BAM 驅動的記憶體也確實出現了顯著增長，如今無論是 GPU 的邏輯電路，還是 HBM 和內存，許多投資都真正體現了這一點。

I would say to you that I expect that the 9% to 11% growth range is a good number to begin with. You will see, as it always happens once fabs come on the ground, in terms of actual consumption from an industrial gas perspective, we tend to start the plants up and obviously, you see a bit of a momentum there and then evens out and gives you that 9% to 11% longer term. So I feel good about how we will see that reflected both coming from logic as well as HBM, particularly, but memory more broadly as well.

我認為，9%到11%的成長區間是一個不錯的起點。你會發現，就像晶圓廠一旦投產後總是發生的那樣，從工業氣體的實際消耗量來看，我們往往會啟動工廠，顯然你會看到一些增長勢頭，然後趨於平穩，最終在長期內達到 9% 到 11% 的增長。所以我覺得我們會在邏輯和 HBM 中看到這種變化，尤其是在更廣泛的記憶體方面。

The second part of your question was around the intensity of gases. And the answer is absolutely yes. The more advanced nodes we see the intensity of gases goes up and has continued to go up. The tools that we now see with the OEMs who are putting the tools together or even looking at the next generation of tools and our R&D engagement with them suggest that, that gas intensity increased continues to be the case. And that's what gets us excited, right, that there is significant growth happening, but not just that you're actually seeing a higher intensity of gas application in that process as well. I know for a fact that one has done some really good work around that gas intensity analysis. If you want we can reach out to him, he can share some more information with you.

你問題的第二部分是關於氣體的強度。答案是肯定的。我們看到，隨著節點的演化，氣體強度會不斷增加，而這種增加動能仍在持續。我們現在看到的 OEM 廠商正在組裝工具，甚至正在研究下一代工具，而我們與他們的研發合作表明，氣體強度增加的情況仍在繼續。正是這一點讓我們感到興奮，對吧？不僅因為出現了顯著的成長，還因為在這個過程中天然氣的應用強度也顯著提高。我知道有人在氣體強度分析方面做了很多非常出色的工作。如果你願意，我們可以聯絡他，他可以和你分享更多資訊。

James Hooper, Bernstein.

詹姆斯·胡珀，伯恩斯坦。

My question is more on the margins in EMEA. I mean 36% is very, very impressive, and you've done over kind of 200 basis points year-on-year, excluding pass-through. But are we starting to reach terminal velocity on margins here? -- without kind of volumes coming back, how much further can we go? And what levers you're looking to pull to keep growing here?

我的問題更多是關於歐洲、中東和非洲地區的邊緣市場。我的意思是，36% 的增幅非常非常驚人，而且你們的年增長率比上年提高了 200 多個基點，還不包括轉嫁的利潤。但是，我們目前的利潤率是否已經接近極限了？ ——如果銷量沒有回升，我們還能走多遠？為了維持成長，你們打算採取哪些措施？

James, this is Matt. I think starting with -- yes, as you look at EMEA right now, clearly, you have negative volumes and positive price. And that combination is creating a very strong margin contribution result year-on-year. And as we mentioned on the volume side, the industrial on-site customers are primarily driving a portion of that, so we are still getting paid, but they are, in some cases, noticeably below the (inaudible) loans.

詹姆斯，這是馬特。我認為首先——是的，當你現在觀察歐洲、中東和非洲地區時，很明顯，銷量為負，價格為正。而這種組合帶來了非常強勁的年度獲利貢獻。正如我們在銷售方面提到的，工業現場客戶主要貢獻了其中的一部分，所以我們仍然能收到款項，但在某些情況下，他們的收入明顯低於（聽不清楚）貸款。

So you will get a little bit of a boost on that. When you see some recovery in those on-site customers, I don't expect any margin expansion, if anything, you might have a minor margin dilution simply as you start to bring up some of the power costs, which essentially flows through. So that component would have an impact on the recovery.

所以你會在那方面得到一些幫助。當現場客戶出現一些復甦跡象時，我不認為利潤率會有任何擴張，如果說有什麼變化的話，那就是利潤率可能會略有下降，因為電力成本會開始上漲，而這本質上是會傳導到其他方面的。因此，該因素會對恢復產生影響。

As far as base merchant and package recovery, that would be margin accretive, right? That would be, as you would expect, as that volume flows back through. So we've always tend to found in our history that in more difficult times, our margin expansion tends to be greater and that's simply because of the earnings algorithm that we talked about earlier, that you tend to have more contribution from management actions, which can be highly margin accretive. When we get recovery periods, we still get margin expansion but not at the same clip, simply because then you shift more of your growth towards volume. And you just get a little bit of a mix change effect there.

就基礎商家和套餐回收而言，那應該會增加利潤，對吧？正如你所預料的那樣，這是因為那部分液體會回流。因此，根據我們的歷史經驗，在更困難的時期，我們的利潤率擴張往往更大，這僅僅是因為我們之前討論過的盈利算法，即管理層的行動往往會帶來更大的貢獻，而這些行動可以極大地提高利潤率。當市場出現復甦期時，我們仍然可以實現利潤率擴張，但速度不會像以前那麼快，原因很簡單，因為那時你需要將更多的成長動力轉移到銷售上。這樣就能產生一點點混音變化的效果。

So that's how I think of EMEA, but they are doing what you would expect this model should do in the environment they're in, which is they're getting price to inflation, their fixed contracts are maintaining, as you would expect, and they're managing their cost back given the environment they're in.

這就是我對 EMEA 的看法，但他們正在做你期望這種模式在他們所處的環境中應該做的事情，那就是他們的價格與通貨膨脹率保持一致，他們的固定合約也如你所期望的那樣保持穩定，並且考慮到他們所處的環境，他們正在控製成本。

Laurence Alexander, Jefferies.

勞倫斯‧亞歷山大，傑富瑞集團。

Would you mind updating specifically on packaged gases two issues. One is what you're seeing in terms of demand trends there, particularly in sort of the welding applications. But also -- where we are on the regional consolidation in Europe versus the US. And how much further you think you can go in terms of consolidating the US market? Like where do you think your market share might top out.

能否具體更新一下關於包裝氣體的兩個問題？一方面是您所看到的市場需求趨勢，尤其是在焊接應用領域。但還有──歐洲與美國在區域整合上處於什麼位置。你認為在整合美國市場方面還能走多遠？你認為你的市佔率最終會達到多少？

Thanks, Laurence. So I described the US package business earlier on. And I think within that, the comment I made was we're seeing certainly on the hard goods side, in the last quarter, in fact, we saw mid-single-digit growth from an organic sales perspective.

謝謝你，勞倫斯。我之前已經介紹過美國的包裹業務了。我認為，我之前的評論是，我們確實看到，在上個季度，從有機銷售的角度來看，硬商品方面實現了中等個位數的增長。

Volumes were up, particularly driven around growth in automation and equipment. And that's a good sign because that shows that the building end of the manufacturing cycle is looking stronger. Obviously, some of that is going into large construction projects, including data center, something we don't normally talk about. But -- and obviously, LNG projects in the US, et cetera, which are driving some of that growth. And I think the growth still looks pretty robust.

銷量有所成長，主要得益於自動化和設備領域的成長。這是一個好兆頭，因為它顯示製造業週期中的建設環節正在走強。顯然，其中一部分資金將用於大型建設項目，包括資料中心，這是我們通常不會談論的話題。但是——顯然，美國的液化天然氣計畫等等，正在推動部分成長。而且我認為成長勢頭依然相當強勁。

And as manufacturing laps all these concerns around tariffs, et cetera, we have an opportunity to see a good growth pattern there as we look ahead into the future. On consolidation, I'll give you a global view and then I'll focus a bit on the US because that's where the action is. So there was consolidation and there are opportunities for consolidation on tuck-in acquisitions in the packaged gas space. And we've seen that now taking the model that we've got in the US, and we've applied that in elsewhere in the world, including in Asia and increasingly now looking at opportunities in Europe as well.

而隨著製造業逐漸擺脫關稅等種種擔憂，展望未來，我們有機會看到製造業呈現良好的成長態勢。關於整合，我會先給大家一個全球視角，然後再專注在美國，因為那裡才是真正的焦點。因此，包裝天然氣領域出現了整合，並且存在著透過收購進行整合的機會。我們已經看到，我們在美國取得的這種模式，已經應用到世界其他地方，包括亞洲，現在也越來越關注歐洲的機會。

So there are opportunities for consolidation globally. The biggest opportunity lies in the US. There is no question around that. And while I do not comment on the market share piece, I can only say this to you, I still believe we have a number of opportunities for tuck-in acquisitions in the US, and we have the balance sheet strength and the appetite to go about doing that.

因此，全球範圍內存在整合的機會。最大的機會在美國。這點毋庸置疑。雖然我不會對市佔率問題發表評論，但我只能說，我仍然相信我們在美國有很多進行補充收購的機會，而且我們有足夠的資產負債表實力和意願去實現這些目標。

From memory, I'm just trying to think back. I think we closed 18 deals last year globally. This year, we're saying about 1% of our sales are going to come from acquisitions. Much of that is going to be tuck-in acquisitions coming out of the packaged gas space. So we feel really good about that space. We expect significant opportunities still in that space for us to continue to do that.

我只是憑記憶回想一下。我認為我們去年在全球範圍內完成了18筆交易。今年，我們預計約有 1% 的銷售額將來自收購。其中大部分將是來自包裝天然氣領域的補充收購。所以我們對這個空間感到非常滿意。我們預計在這個領域仍有很大的發展機會，我們可以繼續這樣做。

And just if I may, on the cylinder rental price increases over the last five, seven years, given how soft the end markets have been, have you seen any material pushback or pricing fatigue where you may need to -- where you feel you need to walk back the cylinder rentals to help the market? Or just describe what's going on there?

恕我冒昧，關於過去五到七年氣瓶租賃價格的上漲，鑑於終端市場疲軟，您是否看到任何實質性的抵製或價格疲勞，以至於您可能需要——您是否覺得需要降低氣瓶租賃價格來幫助市場？或直接描述一下那裡發生了什麼事？

The easy answer is no. We have a robust rental process and of course, our customers see the value that comes out of that and the rental stream and the growth we've seen within that has matched CPI globally weighted CPI that we see as a proxy for price increases that we would normally expect. So we've seen exactly that trend come through on rentals as well.

簡單的答案是否定的。我們擁有完善的租賃流程，當然，我們的客戶也看到了從中獲得的價值，租賃收入的增長與全球加權平均消費者物價指數 (CPI) 的增長相符，而我們通常將全球加權平均消費者物價指數視為價格上漲的指標。所以，我們在租賃市場也看到了同樣的趨勢。

Arun Viswanathan, RBC Capital Markets.

Arun Viswanathan，加拿大皇家銀行資本市場。

Last quarter, you mentioned maybe some thoughts around this investment in Europe and your thoughts that maybe that would not continue. Maybe you can just provide an update and updated thoughts there as well as here in the US, you just mentioned strong opportunities. However, we're also seeing some rollbacks here. So maybe you can just kind of elaborate on how you think the path forward could look in both those regions from an industrial and investment standpoint.

上個季度，您提到了一些關於在歐洲的投資的想法，以及您認為這項投資可能不會繼續下去的想法。或許您可以提供那邊以及美國這邊的最新情況和想法，您剛才提到了一些很好的機會。然而，我們也看到一些倒退的跡象。所以，您能否詳細說明一下，從產業和投資的角度來看，您認為這兩個地區未來的發展道路會是什麼樣的呢？

Sure, Arun. So let me give you a quick -- I give a walk around the world, so you've got a sense of what the different end markets are doing. I'll now maybe channel that is the opportunity pipeline that we're looking at. So it's fair to say that most of our opportunity pipeline today comes from the Americas and Asia. That's where the opportunity pipeline today is providing projects that we're currently working on. And if those projects meet our investment criteria, then obviously, these are projects that then go into the backlog and get developed.

當然可以，阿倫。那麼，讓我快速地——帶你環遊世界，讓你了解不同的終端市場正在做什麼。我現在可能會把我們正在關注的機會管道引導到這個方向。因此，可以說我們目前大部分的商機都來自美洲和亞洲。這就是目前機會管道所提供的項目，也是我們目前正在進行的項目。如果這些項目符合我們的投資標準，那麼很顯然，這些項目就會進入待辦事項清單並得到開發。

Now, the US opportunity remains robust. We see opportunities across a spectrum of end markets. I gave examples of electronics earlier on. We talked a little bit about steel. Clearly, even in other end markets, we are seeing opportunities for growth in the US market. So it's a robust pipeline of projects that we see in that space.

目前，美國的投資機會依然強勁。我們看到各個終端市場都存在著機會。我之前舉過一些電子產品的例子。我們稍微聊了聊鋼鐵。顯然，即使在其他終端市場，我們也看到了美國市場的成長機會。因此，我們看到該領域有大量強勁的項目正在籌備中。

On Europe, I'm not sure I quite got your comment on this investment. What I would say to you is that the number -- the opportunity pipeline for Europe or EMEA, in our case, looks a little bit lighter when compared to either Americas or APAC, not surprising, as you would expect, just given the industrial weakness that is currently there in Europe, but we still do have a number of projects in Europe that are progressing, some of them are latest decarbonization, whereas others are related to growth in other different end markets. So we still see opportunity pipeline in Europe that over time as we develop that, we'll convert into projects that we will take into the backlog or into base growth.

關於歐洲，我不太明白您對這項投資的評論。我想說的是，就我們而言，歐洲或歐洲、中東和非洲地區的專案機會數量看起來比美洲或亞太地區要少一些，這並不奇怪，正如你所預料的那樣，考慮到歐洲目前存在的工業疲軟狀況。但我們在歐洲仍然有一些項目正在推進，其中一些是最新的脫碳項目，而另一些則與不同終端市場的成長有關。因此，我們仍然看到歐洲有很多機會，隨著時間的推移，隨著我們不斷發展，我們將這些機會轉化為待辦專案或基礎成長專案。

Mike Harrison, Seaport Research Partners.

麥克·哈里森，海港研究夥伴公司。

You have highlighted in the past some opportunities for AI to help you improve operational efficiency and productivity. I was wondering if you could speak about any new use cases that you've found for AI that you may be implementing as we get into next year?

您之前曾強調人工智慧在幫助您提高營運效率和生產力方面的一些機會。我想請您談談您發現的、可能在明年實​​施的任何新的人工智慧應用案例？

So Mike, I don't know how much time you have, but I could carry on the use cases for AI. Obviously, it's very topical. No discussion today is complete unless we've talked about AI. In our case, of course, we've been doing a lot of work with data, which we've been capturing for about 30 years plus and a lot of machine learning work that's been done over the last four or five years. So much of that is in deployment today.

麥克，我不知道你有多少時間，但我可以繼續講解人工智慧的應用案例。顯然，這非常具有現實意義。今天，如果我們沒有談到人工智慧，那麼任何討論都不算完整。當然，就我們而言，我們一直在進行大量的數據工作，這些數據我們已經收集了大約 30 多年，並且在過去四五年裡也進行了很多機器學習工作。目前其中很多都已投入使用。

Off the top of my head, I'd say to you, we have about 300 use cases or above that. And they range across the entire spectrum of operations, some of the front end of the sales process and some in our engineering and design process as well. So a healthy number of use cases, very robust deployment process. We have an AI council that ensures that, that deployment works well with the overall strategy that the company has laid out for ourselves. And we're excited about that.

我粗略估計，我們有大約 300 個或更多的使用案例。它們涵蓋了營運的方方面面，包括銷售流程的前端以及我們的工程和設計流程。因此，它擁有大量的應用案例和非常穩健的部署流程。我們設立了人工智慧委員會，以確保人工智慧的部署能夠與公司製定的整體策略良好契合。我們對此感到興奮。

And the one change I would say to you is rather than just look at stand-alone use cases for AI, we are now looking at different domains and trying to understand how we can introduce AI tools across the domain, so that we can harvest some value. We track AI projects just like we track all our productivity projects. It's on our internal platform in which they get reviewed and validated.

我想告訴大家的一點變化是，我們不再只關注人工智慧的獨立用例，而是著眼於不同的領域，並試圖了解如何將人工智慧工具引入各個領域，以便我們能夠從中獲得一些價值。我們對人工智慧專案的追蹤方式與對所有生產力專案的追蹤方式相同。它們會上傳到我們的內部平台，在那裡進行審核和驗證。

And the AI team, I can tell you has very stretching goal in terms of what it needs to deliver as a benefit. So we will use that -- look at every use case and look at the business case underpinning that. And those benefits are looking interesting and exciting as we speak. But again, all of that scales up over the next two to three years to have some major impact on the business.

我可以告訴你，人工智慧團隊在需要交付的效益方面，有著非常遠大的目標。所以我們會採用這種方法——審視每一個用例，並分析支撐這些用例的商業理由。就目前來看，這些好處確實令人感興趣且令人興奮。但同樣，所有這些因素都會在未來兩到三年內逐步擴大，對業務產生重大影響。

And I would now like to turn the call back to Juan Pelaez for any additional or closing remarks.

現在我想把電話轉回給胡安·佩拉埃斯，讓他補充一些內容或作總結發言。

Abi, thank you, and thanks, everyone, for participating in today's call. Have a great day.

Abi，謝謝你，也謝謝大家參加今天的電話會議。祝你有美好的一天。

Ladies and gentlemen, that will conclude today's conference call, and we thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.

女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束，感謝各位的參與。您現在可以斷開連線了。