Franklin BSP Realty Trust Inc (FBRT) 2024 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and welcome to the Franklin BSP Realty Trust Third Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. (Operator Instructions) Please note, this event is being recorded. I would now like to turn the conference over to Lindsey Crabbe, Director of Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

美好的一天，歡迎參加富蘭克林 BSP 房地產信託 2024 年第三季財報電話會議。（操作員說明）請注意，正在記錄此事件。我現在想將會議交給投資者關係總監林賽·克拉布 (Lindsey Crabbe)。請繼續。

Good morning. Thank you, Wyatt, for hosting our call today, and thanks, everyone, for joining us. With me on the call today are Richard Byrne, Chairman and CEO of FBRT; Jerry Baglien, Chief Financial Officer, and Chief Operating Officer of FBRT; and Michael Comparato, President of FBRT.

早安.感謝懷亞特今天主持我們的電話會議，也感謝大家加入我們。今天與我一起參加電話會議的是 FBRT 董事長兼執行長 Richard Byrne； Jerry Baglien，FBRT 財務長兼營運長；以及 FBRT 總裁 Michael Comparato。

Before we begin, I want to mention that some of today's comments are forward-looking statements and are based on certain assumptions. Those comments and assumptions are subject to inherent risks and uncertainties as described in our most recently filed SEC periodic reports and actual future results may differ materially.

在開始之前，我想提一下，今天的一些評論是前瞻性陳述，並且基於某些假設。這些評論和假設受到我們最近提交的 SEC 定期報告中所述的固有風險和不確定性的影響，未來的實際結果可能會存在重大差異。

The information conveyed on this call is current only as of the date of this call, November 5, 2024. The company assumes no obligation to update any statements made during this call, including any forward-looking statements, whether as a result of new information, future events or otherwise, except as required by law.

本次電話會議所傳達的訊息僅截至本次電話會議日期（2024 年 11 月 5 日）為止。除非法律要求，否則本公司不承擔更新本次電話會議期間所做的任何聲明的義務，包括任何前瞻性聲明，無論是由於新資訊、未來事件或其他原因。

Additionally, we will refer to certain non-GAAP financial measures which are reconciled to GAAP figures in our earnings release and supplementary slide deck, each of which are available on our website at www.fbrtreit.com. We will refer to the supplementary slide deck on today's call. With that, I'll turn the call over to Rich Byrne.

此外，我們將在我們的收益發布和補充幻燈片中參考某些與 GAAP 數據一致的非 GAAP 財務指標，每一項都可以在我們的網站 www.fbrtreit.com 上找到。我們將在今天的電話會議上參考補充幻燈片。這樣，我會將電話轉給 Rich Byrne。

Great. Thanks, Lindsey, and good morning to everyone, and thank you for joining us on this Election Day morning. As Lindsey mentioned, our earnings release and supplemental deck were published to our website yesterday. We're going to begin today's call on slide 4 by reviewing our third quarter results, and then we'll, as always, open the call to your questions.

偉大的。謝謝林賽，大家早安，謝謝您在這個選舉日早上加入我們。正如 Lindsey 所提到的，我們的收益報告和補充資料昨天已發佈到我們的網站上。我們將透過投影片 4 回顧我們第三季的業績來開始今天的電話會議，然後我們將像往常一樣開始電話會議，回答大家的問題。

Also, as always, I will provide a brief overview of the quarter's key developments, and then Jerry will discuss our financial results, and Mike will cover market conditions, our watch list and our REO portfolio.

此外，與往常一樣，我將簡要概述本季度的主要發展，然後 Jerry 將討論我們的財務業績，Mike 將介紹市場狀況、我們的觀察名單和我們的 REO 投資組合。

With all that, let me start out with an overarching comment about how we, and probably mostly every CRE lender, thinks about the world. When we think about our portfolio, we think about it in two buckets. Loans originated during the Fed's zero interest rate policy and loans originated post the unprecedented rise in rates. The underlying metrics of most loans originated pre-rate hikes have, as you all know, deteriorated since underwriting as property values have declined and LTVs rose as a result of the dramatic increase in rates.

綜上所述，讓我先對我們以及幾乎所有商業房地產貸款機構如何看待世界進行總體評論。當我們考慮我們的投資組合時，我們會分兩方面來考慮。貸款起源於聯準會的零利率政策期間，而貸款則起源於利率史無前例的上升之後。眾所周知，大多數在加息前產生的貸款的基本指標自承保以來已經惡化，因為利率急劇上升導致房地產價值下降和貸款價值價值上升。

The more serious problem, of course, with legacy loans has been and continues to be the significant deterioration in the office sector post COVID. Thankfully, our office exposure is now only 4% of our book. We received two full payoffs in office loans for $40 million in this quarter, and our pre-2024 originated traditional multi-tenant office exposure is now only $147 million or 2.6%.

當然，遺留貸款更嚴重的問題一直是並將繼續是新冠疫情後辦公部門的嚴重惡化。值得慶幸的是，我們的辦公室曝光度現在僅占我們帳簿的 4%。本季度，我們收到了兩筆 4,000 萬美元辦公貸款的全額還款，而我們 2024 年之前發起的傳統多租戶辦公室風險現在僅為 1.47 億美元或 2.6%。

In addition to the notional exposure decreasing meaningfully quarter-over-quarter, the remaining office exposure has already been significantly marked down in prior quarters to reflect current market conditions. By contrast to the legacy loans, both office and non-office, the loans we're originating post rate hikes are among the highest quality, lowest loan-to-value loans we have seen in many years, and were originated at some of the highest spreads that we've seen in years.

除了名目風險敞口較上季大幅下降外，剩餘的辦公室風險敞口在前幾季也已大幅下降，以反映當前的市場狀況。與傳統貸款（無論是辦公室還是非辦公室）相比，我們在加息後發放的貸款屬於我們多年來見過的質量最高、貸款價值比最低的貸款，並且源於一些我們多年來見過的最高價差。

We continue to make significant progress turning over our book by originating new loans at current interest rates and valuations and cycling through our legacy book. In all, approximately 40%, that's 4%-0% of our portfolio, was originated after January 2023. We think this stat will be an extremely important metric for all CRE lenders because it measures the recycling of our book into these new relatively attractive loans set off of remarked property valuations.

透過以當前利率和估值發放新貸款以及循環處理我們的舊帳簿，我們繼續在帳簿週轉方面取得重大進展。總的來說，大約 40%，也就是我們投資組合的 4%-0%，是在 2023 年 1 月之後產生的。我們認為這項統計數據對於所有商業房地產貸款人來說將是一個極其重要的指標，因為它衡量了我們的帳簿的回收情況，以這些新的相對有吸引力的貸款來衡量房地產估值。

Our robust origination and repayment activity has resulted in over $1.6 billion of new loan commitments year-to-date. We are encouraged by repayments on our legacy portfolio this year. We've received $1 billion year-to-date and $510 million in the third quarter alone. Of course, payoffs are a blessing and a curse, but in the current market environment, we are pleased to see the liquidity in our portfolio.

年初至今，我們強勁的發放和還款活動已帶來超過 16 億美元的新貸款承諾。我們對今年遺留投資組合的償還感到鼓舞。年初至今，我們已收到 10 億美元資金，光是第三季就收到 5.1 億美元資金。當然，回報是福是禍，但在當前的市場環境下，我們很高興看到我們的投資組合具有流動性。

Our team has made headway resolving watch list loans and REO assets from our legacy portfolio. Currently, 154 out of our 157 positions in our book are risk rated 2 or 3, and our overall risk rating of the entire book is 2.2. We reduced our watch list loans from 7 to 3 this quarter, with only 1.3 of our book is represented by these watch list loans.

我們的團隊在解決我們遺留投資組合中的觀察名單貸款和 REO 資產方面取得了進展。目前，我們帳簿中的 157 個頭寸中有 154 個倉位的風險評級為 2 或 3，整個帳簿的總體風險評級為 2.2。本季我們將觀察名單貸款從 7 筆減少到 3 筆，這些觀察名單貸款僅占我們帳簿的 1.3 筆。

Three multifamily properties were upgraded due to credit-enhancing modifications and additional borrower equity coming to the table. One hospitality asset was sold at a price above our debt basis. Our foreclosure REO position, portfolio, increased in size to 13 positions this quarter. But as Mike will detail, it is likely to decline due to recently negotiated PSAs on four properties.

由於信用增強調整和額外借款人權益的出現，三棟多戶住宅得到了升級。一項酒店資產的出售價格高於我們的債務基礎。本季我們法拍 REO 部位、投資組合規模增加至 13 個。但正如麥克將詳細介紹的那樣，由於最近就四處房產談判達成了PSA，它可能會下降。

The balance of our foreclosure REO consists of primarily multifamily properties in strong markets. As Mike mentioned last quarter, while we would like to resolve the REO portfolio as quickly as possible, we believe there is value in holding some of these assets until we find the best possible execution.

我們法拍 REO 的餘額主要由強勁市場中的多戶型房產組成。正如麥克上個季度提到的，雖然我們希望盡快解決 REO 投資組合問題，但我們相信在找到最佳執行方案之前持有其中一些資產是有價值的。

Our liquidity position is robust. At the end of the quarter, we had $1.1 billion in available liquidity, which was strengthened by our CLO issuance near the end of the third quarter. The balance is higher than the previous quarter due to the timing of repayments and additional space on our warehouse lines, and we expect to deploy much of this liquidity, including $346 million of cash, in the relatively near future.

我們的流動性狀況強勁。截至本季末，我們擁有 11 億美元的可用流動性，第三季末我們發行的 CLO 增強了這一流動性。由於還款時間和倉庫線的額外空間，餘額高於上一季度，我們預計在不久的將來部署大部分流動資金，包括 3.46 億美元現金。

While we did not purchase stock in the third quarter, it is an important part of our capital allocation strategy. We have $31 million remaining on our buyback allocation and our Board has extended it through December 31, 2025.

雖然我們沒有在第三季購買股票，但這是我們資本配置策略的重要組成部分。我們的回購分配還剩 3,100 萬美元，董事會已將其期限延長至 2025 年 12 月 31 日。

FBRT is well-positioned. The team is effectively addressing positions, modifying loans, selling REO assets, and enhancing our overall credit quality of our loan portfolio through new originations. Our balance sheet features a robust multifamily-focused loan portfolio that we expect to perform well especially as market conditions stabilize. With all that, let me now turn the call over to Jerry.

FBRT 處於有利位置。該團隊正在有效地解決問題、修改貸款、出售 REO 資產，並透過新的發起來提高我們貸款組合的整體信用品質。我們的資產負債表具有強大的以多戶家庭為重點的貸款組合，我們預計該組合將表現良好，尤其是在市場狀況穩定的情況下。說了這麼多，現在讓我把電話轉給傑瑞。

Great. Thanks, Rich. And thanks, everybody, for being on today, appreciate it. Moving on to our results, let's start on slide 5 if you're following along. FBRT reported GAAP earnings of $0.30 per diluted common share this quarter and distributable earnings of a negative $0.10 per diluted common share. Distributable earnings, excluding realized losses, were $0.31 per diluted common share.

偉大的。謝謝，里奇。謝謝大家今天的到來，非常感謝。繼續我們的結果，如果您遵循的話，讓我們從幻燈片 5 開始。FBRT 公佈的本季 GAAP 每股稀釋普通股收益為 0.30 美元，每股稀釋普通股可分配收益為負 0.10 美元。扣除已實現虧損後，每股稀釋普通股的可分配收益為 0.31 美元。

This excludes $36.4 million of losses realized within the quarter related to our REO Walgreens portfolio, the majority of which was previously disclosed and recognized through GAAP earnings in second quarter. Walgreens is now fully realized with all losses to date through our distributable earnings.

這不包括本季與我們的 REO Walgreens 投資組合相關的 3,640 萬美元損失，其中大部分損失之前已通過第二季度 GAAP 收益披露和確認。沃爾格林現已透過我們的可分配收益完全實現了迄今為止的所有虧損。

Overall, our earnings benefited from higher conduit income and no increase to our CECL reserve in the third quarter. Net interest income was slightly lower quarter-over-quarter as our loan portfolio size decreased and REO remained relatively constant. We hope to reverse that in future quarters.

總體而言，我們的收益受益於管道收入的增加以及第三季度我們的 CECL 儲備並沒有增加。由於我們的貸款組合規模下降且 REO 保持相對穩定，淨利息收入環比略有下降。我們希望在未來幾季扭轉這種情況。

While GAAP and distributable earnings did not cover our quarterly dividend, we remain confident that our dividend level accurately reflects our portfolio's long-term stabilized earnings potential, and we're comfortable with the current level.

雖然公認會計準則和可分配收益並未涵蓋我們的季度股息，但我們仍然相信我們的股息水準準確反映了我們投資組合的長期穩定獲利潛力，並且我們對當前水準感到滿意。

Moving to slide 7, we can cover our origination activity. We added $380 million in new loan commitments during the quarter. Consistent with our strategy, these loans were primarily multifamily across the Southeast and Southwest. During the quarter, we also received a total of $510 million in loan repayments, primarily from the multifamily sector. But as Rich mentioned, also $40 million from office loans.

前往投影片 7，我們可以介紹我們的發起活動。本季我們新增了 3.8 億美元的貸款承諾。與我們的策略一致，這些貸款主要針對東南部和西南部的多戶家庭。本季度，我們也收到了總計 5.1 億美元的貸款償還，主要來自多戶住宅領域。但正如 Rich 所提到的，還有 4000 萬美元來自辦公室貸款。

Moving to slide 8. Our average cost of debt on our core portfolio stayed relatively flat at SOFR plus 2.03%. Near the end of the quarter, we closed a $1 billion CRE CLO. This is the 11 CLO our real estate platform has issued.

轉到投影片 8。我們核心投資組合的平均債務成本相對持平，為 SOFR 加 2.03%。接近季度末，我們完成了 10 億美元的 CRE CLO。這是我們房地產平台發出的第11份CLO。

We were pleased with the CLO execution with an 86.5% advance rate and a weighted average cost of funds of SOFR plus 1.99 before discount transaction costs. Importantly, the transaction featured a 36-month reinvestment period, which is the longest reinvestment period on any of the CLOs that we've executed, allowing us to maximize the duration of this accretive liability.

我們對 CLO 的執行感到滿意，預付款率為 86.5%，加權平均資金成本為 SOFR 加 1.99（折現交易成本前）。重要的是，該交易的再投資期為 36 個月，這是我們執行過的 CLO 中最長的再投資期，使我們能夠最大限度地延長這種增值負債的期限。

Additionally, we added over $100 million of ramp on the transaction to provide further borrowing capacity going into the fourth quarter. Demand from investors was strong, which led to oversubscription across all bond classes. With the addition of this CLO, 93% of our financings are nonrecourse, non-mark-to-market on our core book.

此外，我們還增加了超過 1 億美元的交易資金，以在第四季度提供進一步的借貸能力。投資者的需求強勁，導致所有債券類別出現超額認購。加上此 CLO，我們 93% 的融資在我們的核心帳簿上都是無追索權、非以市價計價的。

We continue to have meaningful space on our warehouse lines and have ample unrestricted cash. Combined with our CLO reinvest, available liquidity at quarter end, as Rich mentioned, totalled $1.1 billion. Our net leverage position remained at 2.7 times with our recourse leverage standing at 0.1 times at the end of the quarter. With that, I'll turn it over to Mike to give you an update on our portfolio.

我們的倉庫線上繼續擁有有意義的空間，並擁有充足的不受限制的現金。正如 Rich 所提到的，加上我們的 CLO 再投資，季度末的可用流動性總計 11 億美元。截至本季末，我們的淨槓桿部位維持在 2.7 倍，追索槓桿為 0.1 倍。接下來，我會將其轉交給麥克，讓他向您介紹我們產品組合的最新情況。

Thanks, Jerry, and good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us. I'm going to start on slide 12. Our $5.2 billion core portfolio consists of 157 loans with an average size of $35 million. 99% of those loans are senior mortgages with 95% of them being floating rate. Our favourite sector remains multifamily, accounting for 74% of our portfolio collateral.

謝謝傑瑞，大家早安。感謝您加入我們。我將從幻燈片 12 開始。我們 52 億美元的核心投資組合包括 157 筆貸款，平均規模為 3,500 萬美元。其中99%的貸款是高級抵押貸款，其中95%是浮動利率。我們最喜歡的行業仍然是多戶型，占我們投資組合抵押品的 74%。

During the quarter, we originated 16 loans at a weighted average spread of 421 basis points. The loans were across several different sectors. However, we found several attractive lending opportunities in construction. Our conduit platform had an excellent quarter, contributing generously to our performance.

本季度，我們發放了 16 筆貸款，加權平均利差為 421 個基點。這些貸款涉及幾個不同的部門。然而，我們在建築領域發現了一些有吸引力的貸款機會。我們的管道平台有一個出色的季度，為我們的業績做出了慷慨的貢獻。

As I previously mentioned, we consider the conduit to be a valuable earnings booster in favourable market conditions. However, it also serves as a valuable hedge against core balance sheet losses during more challenging times. This quarter, the conduit played its protective role, offsetting a portion of our earnings loss due to nonperforming loans in REO.

正如我之前提到的，我們認為在有利的市場條件下，該通路是一個有價值的獲利推動者。然而，在更具挑戰性的時期，它也可以作為核心資產負債表損失的有價值的對沖。本季度，管道發揮了保護作用，抵消了REO不良貸款造成的部分利潤損失。

With respect to multifamily, clearly FBRT's focus, we do see supply-demand dynamics changing for the positive in the coming years at the asset level. New multifamily supply will be cratering shortly and permits for new starts are at decade lows. Declines in new supply and construction starts signal a shift in favour of landlords. As a result, we anticipate not only the burn off of recent rental concessions, but also rent increases in 2026 through 2028.

就多戶住宅而言，顯然是 FBRT 的重點，我們確實看到未來幾年資產層面的供需動態將發生積極變化。新的多戶住宅供應很快就會大幅下降，新開工許可證也將降至十年來的最低水準。新供應量和開工量的下降標誌著房東的利益發生了轉變。因此，我們預計近期的租金優惠不僅會消失，而且 2026 年至 2028 年的租金也會上漲。

Loan demand and requests were plentiful throughout the quarter. Investors had convinced themselves the Fed was going to start a new easing cycle, and the 10-year treasury was hitting lower yields not seen in some time, toward the 3.6% level. Unfortunately, after the Fed rate cut, we witnessed the 10-year widen roughly 70 basis points in a relatively short period of time. We believe this may cause a pause in transaction while investors digest the move.

整個季度的貸款需求和請求都很充足。投資人確信聯準會將開始新的寬鬆週期，而 10 年期公債殖利率正觸及一段時間以來未見的更低水平，接近 3.6% 的水平。不幸的是，聯準會降息後，我們目睹了10年期公債在相對較短的時間內擴大了大約70個基點。我們認為，這可能會導致交易暫停，而投資者正在消化這項舉措。

We continue to see the bulk of the public mortgage REITs, together with the vast majority of banks, mostly regional and community banks, remain on the sidelines. Legacy loans, specifically office, will plague these groups for a long time to come. The New York Fed in its recently released white paper on extend and pretend believes that these banks are only prolonging the inevitable and ultimately making things worse.

我們繼續看到大部分公共抵押房地產投資信託基金以及絕大多數銀行（主要是地區和社區銀行）仍處於觀望狀態。遺留貸款，特別是辦公室貸款，將在未來很長一段時間內困擾這些群體。紐約聯邦儲備銀行在最近發布的關於延期和假裝的白皮書中認為，這些銀行只會延長不可避免的事情，最終使事情變得更糟。

Office continues to be very challenging. We are seeing assets trade at levels that were simply unfathomable a few years ago. We are also hearing anecdotes of lenders unwilling to take title to office assets to avoid the mark-to-market realities. CMBS office delinquency is up 100 basis points just month-over-month, hitting nearly 9.5%.

辦公室仍然非常具有挑戰性。我們看到資產交易的水平在幾年前簡直是難以想像的。我們也聽到一些貸方不願取得辦公室資產所有權以避免按市值計價的現實的軼事。CMBS 辦公室拖欠率較上月上升 100 個基點，達到近 9.5%。

We believe office delinquencies will surpass the all-time high, and perhaps meaningfully, of approximately 10.5% seen in 2012 after the GFC. Unfortunately, things could not be unhealthier in the office sector, and we believe the bottoming process will take another two to five years. We see no reason to be active in this space.

我們相信，辦公室拖欠率將超過 2012 年全球金融危機後約 10.5% 的歷史最高水平，這也許是有意義的。不幸的是，辦公室產業的情況再糟糕不過了，我們認為觸底過程還需要兩到五年的時間。我們認為沒有理由活躍在這個領域。

On the other hand, FBRT has taken the exact opposite position of extend and pretend. We believe wholeheartedly in acknowledge and address. We've written down the assets that needed to be written down and are proactively taking title to other assets in an effort to clean up the balance sheet as quickly as possible. We believe we can resolve REO faster than our borrowers who have seen their equity vanish due to meaningful declines in valuation.

另一方面，FBRT 採取了與擴展和假裝完全相反的立場。我們全心全意地相信承認和解決。我們已經減記了需要減記的資產，並正在積極取得其他資產的所有權，以盡快清理資產負債表。我們相信，我們可以比借款人更快解決 REO 問題，因為借款人的股權因估值大幅下降而消失。

Our goal is to get out of the proverbial woods as soon as possible. Addressing our issues head-on and resolving them proactively is the best way to accomplish that goal. And to that end, we made excellent progress this quarter.

我們的目標是盡快走出困境。正面解決我們的問題並積極解決它們是實現這一目標的最佳途徑。為此，我們本季取得了巨大進展。

Slide 14 is a summary of our watch list. Our watch list is down to three positions, but given the size, the watch list is truly only two loans, both 5-rated office assets that we have written down in previous quarters. We believe we will be taking title to the Denver office asset in Q4 or Q1 of next year.

投影片 14 是我們觀察清單的摘要。我們的觀察名單減少到三個位置，但考慮到規模，觀察名單實際上只有兩筆貸款，都是我們在前幾個季度減記的 5 級辦公資產。我們相信我們將在明年第四季或第一季獲得丹佛辦公資產的所有權。

Moving to slide 15, we hold 13 foreclosure REO positions at quarter end. The REO book is largely multifamily, and 4 of these properties are already under contract to be sold at or above current market values. Excluding the remaining Walgreens stores, the $18.5 million office building in Portland, and the four properties under PSA, the remaining REO portfolio consists of seven multifamily properties, four in North Carolina, two in Texas and one in Cleveland, Ohio.

轉到投影片 15，我們在季度末持有 13 個止贖 REO 部位。REO 的帳目主要是多戶住宅，其中 4 處房產已簽訂合同，將以當前市場價值或高於當前市場價值出售。不包括剩餘的沃爾格林商店、波特蘭價值1,850 萬美元的辦公大樓以及PSA 旗下的四處房產，剩餘的REO 投資組合包括七處多戶住宅房產，其中四處位於北卡羅來納州，兩處位於德克薩斯州，一處位於俄亥俄州克里夫蘭。

Our equity asset management team is fully engaged in stabilizing these assets as quickly as possible in order for us to maximize recovery on asset sales. While we are very comfortable owning real estate, and we believe there are positive tailwinds around the corner for fundamentals at the multifamily asset level, our goal is to liquidate the REO portfolio as quickly as possible and reinvest those proceeds into new origination. I cannot stress enough the exceptional progress the team has made on our watchlist and REO assets. We continue to be laser-focused on resolutions.

我們的股權資產管理團隊全力以赴盡快穩定這些資產，以便我們可以最大限度地回收資產銷售。雖然我們對擁有房地產感到非常滿意，我們相信多戶資產層面的基本面即將出現積極的推動力，但我們的目標是盡快清算 REO 投資組合，並將這些收益重新投資到新的項目中。我無法充分強調團隊在我們的觀察名單和 REO 資產上取得的非凡進展。我們繼續高度關注決議。

Lastly, we were happy to see sub-4% tenure as it brought a lot of hope back in the industry and had several visible industry names officially call a bottom. We've been in the higher for longer camp for a long time, but still called the multifamily valuation bottom several quarters ago.

最後，我們很高興看到低於 4% 的保有權，因為它給行業帶來了很大的希望，並且有幾個可見的行業名稱正式宣布觸底。我們長期以來一直處於較高、較長的陣營，但在幾個季度前仍稱多戶型估值已觸底。

That said, we simultaneously commented that we do not see a V-shaped recovery in multifamily values and believe we will bounce around these levels for a while. Thus far, that call has been largely on point, and at the moment, we continue to hold that view. As the 10-year blew back out to now over 4.3%, we are concerned about the headlights and the dear meeting once again.

儘管如此，我們同時表示，我們沒有看到多戶住宅價值出現 V 型復甦，並相信我們將在這些水平附近反彈一段時間。到目前為止，這項呼籲基本上是正確的，目前我們仍然堅持這一觀點。隨著 10 年期利率回升至目前超過 4.3%，我們再次擔心車頭燈和親愛的會議。

If we have truly averted recession, and we aren't saying we have, that means we should revert to a normalized positively sloping yield curve. If the Fed is targeting 3% to 3.5% Fed funds, that means a normalized yield curve is going to produce a 10-year treasury yield 100 to 150 basis points wider.

如果我們確實避免了經濟衰退，我們並沒有說我們已經做到了，那就意味著我們應該恢復正常化的正傾斜殖利率曲線。如果聯準會的目標是 3% 至 3.5% 的聯邦基金利率，這意味著標準化殖利率曲線將導致 10 年期公債殖利率擴大 100 至 150 個基點。

We believe a significant decline in long-term interest rates, such as a return to two handle yields on the 10-year treasury, is unlikely without a significant banking crisis. For all of those hoping for meaningfully lower rates, we would just say be careful what you wish for.

我們認為，如果不發生嚴重的銀行業危機，長期利率不太可能大幅下降，例如十年期公債殖利率回到兩把手水準。對於所有希望大幅降低利率的人，我們只想說要小心你的願望。

The FBRT team has been busy. We remain diligently focused on improving the credit quality of our portfolio, whether through new loan originations, credit-enhancing loan modifications, or actively managing our REO properties for future sale.

FBRT 團隊一直很忙。我們仍然致力於提高我們投資組合的信用質量，無論是透過新的貸款發放、信用增強貸款修改，還是積極管理我們的 REO 物業以供未來銷售。

We are fortunate to have one of the largest teams in the industry, which allows us to effectively manage all of the aforementioned tasks, and we are positioning ourselves to be a market leader exiting the woods. With that, I would like to turn it back over to the operator to begin the Q&A session.

我們很幸運擁有業內最大的團隊之一，這使我們能夠有效地管理上述所有任務，並且我們將自己定位為走出困境的市場領導者。這樣，我想將其轉回操作員以開始問答環節。

(Operator Instructions) Matthew Erdner, JonesTrading.

（操作員指示）Matthew Erdner，JonesTrading。

You touched on it briefly a little bit about the conduit business. I noticed that fixed rate loans increased to 5% from 3% quarter-over-quarter. Could you provide some additional color on what you're seeing here and kind of the expectation for the conduit business as a whole going forward?

您簡單地談到了管道業務。我注意到固定利率貸款較上季從 3% 增加到 5%。您能否對您在這裡看到的內容提供一些額外的資訊以及對整個管道業務未來的期望？

Matt, it's Mike. Thanks for the question. Look, I think the conduit had an exceptional third quarter. Obviously, rates are going to throw a little bit of a wet towel on that for coming quarters. If nothing else, a little bit of time for people to just digest where rates are.

馬特，是麥克。謝謝你的提問。看，我認為管道第三季表現出色。顯然，未來幾季的利率將會給這一點帶來一些影響。如果不出意外的話，人們需要一點時間來消化利率的情況。

The reality is, even with rates going out to current levels, CMBS still is one of the cheapest financing options in the marketplace. This move happened fast. It's a meaningful move. And I think we just need a little bit more time to digest it to really give better guidance on what it means for the conduit in the coming quarters.

現實情況是，即使利率達到目前的水平，CMBS 仍然是市場上最便宜的融資選擇之一。這一舉動發生得很快。這是一個有意義的舉動。我認為我們只需要多一點時間來消化它，以便真正就它對未來幾季的管道意味著什麼提供更好的指導。

Got you. Yes, that's helpful there. And then talking about CMBS, kind of the available-for-sale securities, looking at those 10 bonds that you guys kind of have, do you think of that as an additional source of income and liquidity? And how are you going to manage that book going forward?

明白你了。是的，這很有幫助。然後談論 CMBS，一種可供出售的證券，看看您擁有的 10 種債券，您認為這是收入和流動性的額外來源嗎？您今後將如何管理這本書？

Yes. I mean we've opportunistically been bond buyers when we thought the returns made sense versus whole loan origination. We have not been active buyers through the last few months of kind of the very aggressive credit spread tightening that we've seen.

是的。我的意思是，當我們認為回報相對於整個貸款發放更有意義時，我們就機會主義地成為債券買家。在過去幾個月我們所看到的非常積極的信貸利差收緊中，我們並不是積極的買家。

The returns in that space are fantastic for the bonds that we own. We do view it as some sort of liquidity management. But to be honest, the returns we're making in that book, there's just no reason to sell them. We can't generate the returns in whole loan origination that we can in the existing bond portfolio.

對於我們擁有的債券來說，這個領域的回報非常好。我們確實將其視為某種流動性管理。但說實話，就我們在那本書中獲得的回報而言，沒有理由出售它們。我們無法在整個貸款發放中產生與現有債券投資組合相同的回報。

Stephen Laws, Raymond James.

史蒂芬勞斯，雷蒙德詹姆斯。

Appreciate the comments in the prepared remarks. I wanted to follow up with the -- sorry, let me start with Mike. Mike, on the seven REOs I guess that you mentioned, four NC, two Texas, one Ohio that you guys are holding assets. Can you talk a little bit about (technical difficulty)

感謝準備好的評論中的評論。我想跟進——抱歉，讓我從麥克開始。麥克，我猜你有提到七個 REO，其中四個北卡羅來納州、兩個德州、一個俄亥俄州，你們持有資產。你能談談嗎（技術難度）

Excuse me, Stephen, it's a little choppy.

對不起，史蒂芬，有點不穩定。

Sorry about that. Let me see if this is better. Mike, can you talk about the sentiment in lease-up and potential timing of those monetizations? Is that a first half event, or is it something that's more backend loaded next year?

對此感到抱歉。讓我看看這個是否更好。麥克，您能談談租賃的情緒以及這些貨幣化的潛在時機嗎？這是上半年的活動，還是明年後端負載較多的活動？

Stephen, thanks for the question. As I mentioned, we've got four under contract. We're going to continue to chop away at the Walgreens portfolio. All five of those are on the market for sale right now. One of them is under contract. Would really hope to be done with Walgreens in its totality by the end of Q1 next year, chance maybe a few more selling in Q4 of this year of the remaining multifamily.

史蒂芬，謝謝你的提問。正如我所提到的，我們有四個合約。我們將繼續削減沃爾格林的投資組合。所有這五種產品目前都在市場上出售。其中之一已簽訂合約。我真的希望在明年第一季末之前完成與沃爾格林的全部合作，今年第四季可能還會有更多剩餘多戶住宅的銷售。

We'll have two that are going on the market either in December or early January that I would expect to have closed by the end of Q1. And then probably the remaining four or five that will be a little bit longer holds. But as I mentioned in the prepared remarks, it is clearly stabilize as fast as you can, move them as fast as you can. We are not looking for these to necessarily be profit centers.

我們將有兩個產品在 12 月或 1 月初上市，我預計將在第一季末關閉。然後剩下的四五個可能會更長一些。但正如我在準備好的發言中提到的，它顯然是盡可能快地穩定，盡可能快地移動它們。我們不認為這些一定是利潤中心。

If profits come out of them, that's a great byproduct of REO, but we really want to get this cash back and get it redeployed. A little bit more in Q1, a little bit throughout the course of 2025, and then just wrap it up, hopefully, by the end of next year.

如果從中獲利，那是 REO 的一個很好的副產品，但我們真的希望收回這筆現金並重新部署。在第一季再多一點，在 2025 年整個過程中再多一點，然後希望在明年年底之前完成。

Great. Appreciate those comments. Jerry, I want to talk NII for a second. A little lower than I expected in Q3. Can you talk about the timing of repayments, which were pretty material, $500 million higher than I was looking for, versus new investments and kind of what a full quarter -- you thought full quarter impact there?

偉大的。感謝這些評論。傑瑞，我想談談 NII。略低於我對第三季的預期。您能談談還款的時間嗎？

And then as we look out the next quarter or two, what are the expectations around repayments? Is it going to take all the originations to keep the portfolio stable? Or do you expect some portfolio growth as we move forward?

然後，當我們展望下一兩個季度時，對還款的預期是什麼？是否需要投入所有資金才能維持投資組合穩定？或者您預計隨著我們的前進，投資組合會有所成長？

Yes. Maybe I'll just start with expectations. I mean I think we're tracking to kind of a normalized year in terms of repayments for us, which is turning roughly 1/3 of the portfolio. If you look at what we're at so far, I mean it's going to be another $300-plus million would be my guess on kind of the low end. Could be higher from there. Which Rich said is great and not great at the same time because we have to redeploy that.

是的。也許我會從期望開始。我的意思是，我認為就我們的還款而言，我們正在步入正常化的一年，大約佔投資組合的 1/3。如果你看看我們到目前為止的情況，我的意思是，我的猜測是，這將是另外 300 多萬美元，算是低端的。從那裡可能會更高。里奇說這很好，但同時也不太好，因為我們必須重新部署它。

I think we keep our projections updated to try and replace what's paying off. That's always the goal, that we're not shrinking the portfolio, and we try and line it up as close as we can. In terms of Q3, I don't think there is a tremendous drag from some of the mismatch on when stuff came back versus when we put it on.

我認為我們會不斷更新我們的預測，以嘗試取代那些有回報的東西。這始終是我們的目標，我們不會縮減投資組合，並且我們會盡力將其排列得盡可能接近。就第三季而言，我認為東西回來時與我們穿上它時的一些不匹配不會產生巨大的拖累。

I think more of the drag is just the turnover on the other assets, just the stuff that's less productive, the stuff that went from loan to REO. That really creates more drag than kind of the natural portfolio repayment, redeployment.

我認為更多的拖累只是其他資產的周轉，只是生產力較低的東西，從貸款到 REO 的東西。這確實比自然的投資組合償還、重新部署造成了更多的阻力。

Great. Appreciate that color and the comments in the prepared remarks. Certainly not a bad thing that people paying off as expected on time. And then one modelling question. You said you are likely to go REO in Q4, Q1. I think there's a $27 million specific reserve there. Will that run through DE on the transfer to REO? Or will that not run through DE until that asset is sold?

偉大的。欣賞這種顏色和準備好的評論中的評論。人們按期還款當然不是壞事。然後是一個建模問題。您說過您可能會在第四季、第一季度擔任 REO。我認為那裡有 2700 萬美元的專項儲備。轉移到 REO 時會透過 DE 運作嗎？或在資產出售之前不會通過 DE 運行？

The answer is, it depends. If we -- our policy on DE is if we think that loss is essentially crystallized or unrecoverable at that point, we'll run it through. Probably a decent likelihood on that one. If that's the place that we end up, we'll reassess value, reassess market at that time and come to a conclusion at that point.

答案是，這取決於情況。如果我們——我們對 DE 的政策是，如果我們認為損失在那時基本上已經明確或無法挽回，我們就會把它貫穿到底。可能是個不錯的可能性。如果這是我們最終的結果，我們將重新評估價值，重新評估當時的市場，並在那時得出結論。

Steve Delaney, JMP Securities

史蒂夫·德萊尼，JMP 證券

Rich, let me start with you, if I could. Maybe sort of a big picture question on the bridge business as you see it. Obviously, you shrunk in the third quarter, and I know Stephen Laws touched on some of this, but down to the 5.2%, the Fed is probably going to cut Thursday, the outlook for Fed funds futures, maybe we probably get below 4% here some point in late 2025.

里奇，如果可以的話，讓我從你開始。正如您所看到的，這可能是橋樑業務的一個大問題。顯然，第三季度有所萎縮，我知道斯蒂芬·勞斯（Stephen Laws）談到了其中的一些內容，但降至5.2％，美聯儲可能會在周四降息，聯邦基金期貨的前景，也許我們可能會低於4％ 2025 年末的某個時間點。

I mean I would think that would be very constructive for the bridge business. And as we think about your portfolio size and your leverage at 2.7, is it conceivable -- three turns of leverage is kind of I thin, what we normally view as sort of the top, close to the top end of the range. I'd view you as being slightly under-levered. If you were to move with the benefit of the Fed cuts and if you took your leverage up to three with your current equity base, it should put your portfolio at the $6 billion mark or slightly higher.

我的意思是，我認為這對橋樑業務非常有建設性。當我們考慮你的投資組合規模和 2.7 的槓桿率時，我認為三輪槓桿率是可以想像的，我們通常認為是頂部，接近範圍的頂端。我認為你的槓桿率有點低。如果您要受益於聯準會降息，如果您以當前的股本基礎將槓桿率提高到 3，那麼您的投資組合應該會達到 60 億美元大關或略高。

Is that a realistic outlook for 2025? And I know you're not going to force your operations to meet -- to hit a certain number. But I guess is my outlook realistic in terms of how you and the team see 2025? Sorry for the long-winded question.

這是 2025 年的現實前景嗎？我知道你不會強迫你的營運達到某個數字。但我想，就您和團隊對 2025 年的看法而言，我的展望現實嗎？抱歉問了這麼長的問題。

No, it's a good question. Thanks, Steve. I would answer it this way. As you've heard us say and we've said repeatedly across as many earnings calls as we can, the current vintage of new loans that we see today are amongst the best we've seen in years. And literally, every loan we put into our book increases the quality of our book. And the stat we're showing, we're going to keep updating it, is that 40% of our book is of these new loans.

不，這是一個好問題。謝謝，史蒂夫。我會這樣回答。正如您所聽到的，以及我們在盡可能多的財報電話會議上反复說過的那樣，我們今天看到的當前新貸款期限是多年來我們所見過的最好的。從字面上看，我們在書中投入的每一筆貸款都提高了我們書的品質。我們顯示的統計數據（我們將不斷更新）是，我們帳簿的 40% 是這些新貸款。

Without a doubt, if we see attractive new supply, we're going to put it on, and we have lots of capacity to do so. Before we even start thinking about increasing leverage, and we've always given a target, I think, somewhere between 2.25, 2.5 and 3, and we've always operated in that range or probably in the low end of that range almost every quarter since our inception.

毫無疑問，如果我們看到有吸引力的新供應，我們就會投入，而且我們有足夠的能力這樣做。在我們開始考慮增加槓桿之前，我認為我們總是給出一個目標，介於 2.25、2.5 和 3 之間，而且我們幾乎每個季度都在該範圍內操作，或者可能在該範圍的低端操作自從我們成立以來。

But remember, Steve, we have $350 million of cash. We also have, as you've heard us detail, Mike's gone through, a lot of REO that we're cycling through and generating liquidity to put productive earnings power behind once we redeploy that into the current market. We have -- I think we have a long time before we need to think about whether or not we want to increase leverage.

但請記住，史蒂夫，我們有 3.5 億美元的現金。正如您所聽到的，麥克已經詳細介紹了我們，我們還擁有大量REO，我們正在循環利用這些REO，並產生流動性，一旦我們將其重新部署到當前市場，就可以將生產性盈利能力拋在後面。我認為我們還有很長一段時間才需要考慮是否要增加槓桿。

We just have a lot of added earnings power in the portfolio just without touching leverage. I think that's how we're thinking about it. As long as the market produces, which it has pretty consistently, attractive loans, we're going to put them on.

我們的投資組合只是在不觸及槓桿的情況下增加了很多獲利能力。我想這就是我們的想法。只要市場持續產生有吸引力的貸款，我們就會發放這些貸款。

And one of the reasons why these loans are so attractive is because most of the folks that we typically compete against for loans like this, whether it's banks or some of our public mortgage REIT comps or the private lenders or whoever it is, a lot of them are still on the sidelines given office exposure and other issues. And we've just had a great chance to look at pick of the litter and putting on good risk on our books. I hope that answered the question.

這些貸款如此有吸引力的原因之一是因為我們通常與此類貸款競爭的大多數人，無論是銀行還是我們的一些公共抵押房地產投資信託基金公司或私人貸方或無論是誰，都有很多由於辦公室暴露和其他問題，他們仍然處於觀望狀態。我們剛剛有一個很好的機會來觀察垃圾的挑選，並在我們的帳本上投入良好的風險。我希望這回答了問題。

No, very helpful.

不，非常有幫助。

And Steve, this is Mike. Let me just add a little something to that because just reading between the lines of your question, the demand for loans is massive right now. There is no shortage of opportunities to write loans. I think you were getting to, if rates come down, loan demand goes up. And I just want to be clear, we have a ton of loan demand right now.

史蒂夫，這是麥克。讓我補充一點，因為從你的問題的字裡行間就能看出，現在對貸款的需求是巨大的。不乏發放貸款的機會。我認為，如果利率下降，貸款需求就會上升。我只是想澄清一下，我們現在有大量的貸款需求。

There's no lack of investable or lendable opportunities. And look, the other thing that I would say is perspective matters so much, right? Yes, would a 4% Fed funds certainly be moving in the right direction? Of course. It's better than Fed funds at 5%. But if I told you three years ago that Fed funds were going to go from 0% to 4%, you would have said that's an unmitigated disaster.

不乏可投資或可貸款的機會。看，我要說的另一件事是觀點非常重要，對吧？是的，4% 的聯邦基金肯定會朝著正確的方向發展嗎？當然。比 5% 的聯邦基金利率好。但如果我三年前告訴你聯邦基金利率將從 0% 升至 4%，你會說這是一場徹頭徹尾的災難。

We still aren't out of any sort of big picture legacy loan problems with Fed funds at 4%. Yes, it's better, but it is not a panacea.

我們仍然沒有擺脫 4% 的聯邦基金遺留貸款問題。是的，它更好，但它不是萬能藥。

Got it. I appreciate that. And just a quick follow-up, Mike, for you on the conduit business. Could you quantify for us sort of the size of your locked pipeline of conduit commitments at this point? And how effective have your hedges been given the 70-basis point backup in the 10-year?

知道了。我很欣賞這一點。麥克，我想為您簡單介紹一下管道業務。您能否為我們量化一下您目前鎖定的管道承諾管道的規模？十年內 70 個基點的支撐對沖的效果如何？

We have really managed that book exceptionally well. And the best way to manage the conduit business is to sell loans. The best hedge is moving the book. We actually have zero rate locked or committed loans as we sit here today. We have sold everything on balance sheet, we have nothing to move, and we're kind of reloading inventory to get ready for the next transaction. The conduit is largely sitting in as good of a spot as it could from an exposure standpoint.

我們確實非常出色地管理了這本書。而管理通路業務的最佳方式就是出售貸款。最好的對沖就是移動這本書。當我們今天坐在這裡時，我們實際上擁有零利率鎖定或承諾貸款。我們已經賣掉了資產負債表上的所有東西，我們沒有什麼可以移動的，我們正在重新加載庫存，為下一次交易做好準備。從暴露的角度來看，導管大部分位於盡可能好的位置。

(Operator Instructions) Tom Catherwood, BTIG.

（操作員說明）Tom Catherwood，BTIG。

Mike, following up on a comment you made on Steve's question, your peers have been talking about accelerating transactions in 2025, creating more origination opportunities. Obviously, you're not waiting until 2025. What's different about FBRT's deal flow that allowed you to complete $1.6 billion of originations in 2024? And kind of how much of a pickup could we see in 2025?

Mike，在您對 Steve 的問題發表評論之後，您的同行一直在談論在 2025 年加速交易，創造更多的創始機會。顯然，你不會等到 2025 年。FBRT 的交易流程有何不同，讓您能夠在 2024 年完成 16 億美元的發起？2025 年我們能看到多少回升？

Thanks, Tom. Yes. Look, I think first and foremost, we didn't have the legacy issues that I think a lot of the competitive space has had to deal with. We have less than 5% office. A lot of the industry is at 25% plus in office. And we made a very good macro call at kind of the peak of valuations to focus our origination three years ago on nicer, newer vintage assets in large markets, and that call has paid dividends.

謝謝，湯姆。是的。看，我認為首先也是最重要的是，我們沒有我認為許多競爭領域必須處理的遺留問題。我們的辦公室比例不到 5%。該行業很多公司的任職率都在 25% 以上。三年前，我們在估值達到頂峰時做出了非常好的宏觀決策，將我們的創業重點放在大型市場上更好、更新的老式資產上，而這一決策已經帶來了紅利。

We just didn't have to play the amount of defence I think that most of the industry had to play around older vintage multi and certainly office. That let us play offense for most of '24. In addition to that, I think we have one of the broadest product offerings in the entire industry, certainly within the middle market. I mean we do everything from CMBS to traditional bridge, occasionally writing mezz loans.

我們只是不需要進行大量的防禦，我認為大多數行業都必須圍繞著較舊的老式多功能設備，當然還有辦公室。這讓我們在24年的大部分時間都在進攻。除此之外，我認為我們擁有整個行業最廣泛的產品供應之一，尤其是在中間市場。我的意思是，我們做從 CMBS 到傳統橋樑的所有業務，偶爾也會提供夾層貸款。

We have a construction loan business. I think we've got just a really, really interesting product offering that some people don't that keep us busier than most. And the last thing that I would say is I do think we bought a lot of street credibility over the past few years. COVID hit in March of 2020. We wrote our first post-COVID loan on April 22, 2020, and proceeded to be the only active lender in the market for the next six months.

我們有建築貸款業務。我認為我們提供了一個非常非常有趣的產品，但有些人卻沒有，這讓我們比大多數人更忙。我要說的最後一件事是，我確實認為我們在過去幾年裡贏得了許多街頭信譽。2020 年 3 月，新冠肺炎疫情襲來。我們於 2020 年 4 月 22 日發放了新冠疫情後的第一筆貸款，並在接下來的六個月內成為市場上唯一活躍的貸方。

In 2023, when everyone went to the sidelines, we closed over $1 billion of loans. I think that the market has come to the realization that when it's 72 and sunny outside, everybody extends credit. And BSP, when the proverbial hits the fan, stays in business. Spreads might be wider, leverage might be lower, covenants might be tighter, but we're still extending credit in those times. And I think the markets realize that maybe we're a good group to have a relationship with going forward.

2023 年，當所有人都觀望時，我們結清了超過 10 億美元的貸款。我認為市場已經意識到，當氣溫達到 72 度且外面陽光明媚時，每個人都會提供信貸。當這句諺語流行起來時，BSP 仍會繼續營業。利差可能會更大，槓桿可能會更低，契約可能會更嚴格，但我們仍然會在那個時候提供信貸。我認為市場意識到，也許我們是一個可以繼續發展的好團隊。

Tom, it's Rich. And just to add to all that is, you are right, a number of, listening to earnings calls like you do, a lot of competitors or fellow lenders are increasing or talking about increasing their origination activities or some of them even doing so now. But think about that context, $1.6 trillion of CRE loans are going to come due over the next three years. 50% of our market is bank loans.

湯姆，我是里奇。除此之外，你是對的，像你一樣聽取財報電話會議的許多競爭對手或其他貸方正在增加或談論增加他們的發起活動，或者其中一些人現在甚至正在這樣做。但考慮一下這種情況，1.6 兆美元的商業房地產貸款將在未來三年內到期。我們的市場50%是銀行貸款。

The banks are largely not participating in this renaissance of new lending. We'll see how much everybody else does. There's still, from a macro basis, a great opportunity to be a lender right now. And as Mike said, we're certainly picking up a lot of new clients from those left behind, whether it's banks or nonbank lenders.

銀行基本上沒有參與新貸款的復興。我們會看看其他人做了多少。從宏觀角度來看，目前仍然存在成為貸款人的絕佳機會。正如麥克所說，我們肯定會從留下來的客戶中獲得許多新客戶，無論是銀行還是非銀行貸款機構。

Appreciate those thoughts. And then kind of last one for me, maybe on dividend coverage. We understand the lag between repayments and originations and that flowing through to net interest income. But how long do you think it takes to redeploy your capital back into loans to the point where your DE is fully covering dividends?

欣賞這些想法。對我來說最後一個可能是關於股息覆蓋率。我們了解還款和發放之間的滯後性以及流向淨利息收入的滯後性。但您認為需要多長時間才能將您的資本重新部署到貸款中，直到您的 DE 完全覆蓋股息？

Yes, Tom. This is really an REO story. As soon as we get the REO gone and get it back into loans, we're back at coverage. This is -- we largely expected there to be a little bit of noise in the numbers as we cycled through kind of this REO and get it sold. But we're -- we could not be more confident in the earnings power of the platform once we get through this and stabilize.

是的，湯姆。這確實是一個 REO 的故事。一旦我們取消 REO 並將其重新轉化為貸款，我們就恢復了承保範圍。這是——我們很大程度上預計，當我們循環瀏覽這種 REO 並將其出售時，數字中會出現一些噪音。但一旦我們度過難關並穩定下來，我們就對該平台的獲利能力充滿信心。

The answer is we want to get there as fast as we can. Obviously, the market is going to dictate that timing as much as we are. I would have told you 70 basis points ago on the 10-year that we were going to get through it a little bit faster. Things might slow a little bit here, but we'll get through it all. We will get back there. And obviously, the goal is to get back there as soon as possible.

答案是我們希望盡快到達那裡。顯然，市場將像我們一樣決定這個時機。我會在 10 年 70 個基點前告訴你，我們會更快渡過難關。這裡的事情可能會慢一點，但我們會度過這一切。我們會回到那裡。顯然，我們的目標是盡快回到那裡。

But this is entirely an REO conversation, not a lack of investable or originate able opportunities.

但這完全是 REO 的談話，而不是缺乏可投資或可創造的機會。

And Tom, sorry to pile on, Mike and I talk about this every day, so we're all like-minded on this. We and our Board set our dividend policy based on our earnings power look. And we like to look at that not over like a quarter at a time, but what the earnings power of the company is.

湯姆，很抱歉囉嗦了，麥克和我每天都會談論這個問題，所以我們在這個問題上的想法是一致的。我們和董事會根據我們的獲利能力製定股利政策。我們不喜歡一次專注在一個季度，而是關注公司的獲利能力。

And so whether that takes one quarter or takes a little longer, not really a consideration. And as far as REO as well, remember, we have $350 million of cash. We have a lot more earnings power than we're demonstrating now, and we feel confident in the level of our dividend.

因此，無論這需要四分之一還是需要更長的時間，都不是真正需要考慮的因素。就 REO 而言，請記住，我們擁有 3.5 億美元的現金。我們的獲利能力比現在所展示的要強得多，而且我們對股息水準充滿信心。

And this concludes our question-and-answer session. I would like to turn the conference back over to Lindsey Crabbe for any closing remarks.

我們的問答環節到此結束。我想將會議轉回給林賽·克拉布（Lindsey Crabbe）發表閉幕詞。

We appreciate you joining us today. Please reach out if you have any further questions. We look forward to speaking with you soon. Thanks, and have a great day.

我們感謝您今天加入我們。如果您還有任何疑問，請與我們聯絡。我們期待盡快與您交談。謝謝，祝你有美好的一天。

The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

會議現已結束。感謝您參加今天的演講。您現在可以斷開連線。