Franklin BSP Realty Trust Inc (FBRT) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good day and welcome to Franklin BSB Realty Trust first quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions). I would now like to turn the conference over to Lindsey Crabbe, head of investor relations. Please go ahead.

大家好，歡迎參加富蘭克林 BSB 房地產信託 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。（操作員指令）。現在，我想將會議交給投資者關係主管 Lindsey Crabbe。請繼續。

Good morning. Thank you for hosting our call today and welcome to the FBRT first quarter earnings conference call. As the operator mentioned, I'm Lindsey Crabbe. With me on the call today are Richard Byrne, Chairman and CEO of FBRT, Jerome Baglien, Chief Financial Officer and Chief Operating Officer of FBRT, and Michael Comparato, President of FBRT.

早安.感謝您今天主持我們的電話會議，歡迎參加 FBRT 第一季財報電話會議。正如接線員所說，我是 Lindsey Crabbe。今天與我一起參加電話會議的還有 FBRT 董事長兼首席執行官理查德·伯恩 (Richard Byrne)、FBRT 首席財務官兼首席營運官傑羅姆·巴格利恩 (Jerome Baglien) 以及 FBRT 總裁邁克爾·康帕拉托 (Michael Comparato)。

Before we begin, I want to mention that some of today's comments are forward-looking statements and are based on certain assumptions. Those comments and assumptions are subject to inherent risks and uncertainties. I subscribe in our most recently filed SEC periodic reports, and actual future results may differ materially.

在我們開始之前，我想提一下，今天的一些評論是前瞻性的陳述，並且基於某些假設。這些評論和假設具有固有的風險和不確定性。我訂閱了我們最近提交給美國證券交易委員會的定期報告，但實際的未來結果可能會有重大差異。

The information conveyed on this call is current only as of the date of this call, April 29, 2025. The company assumes no obligation to update any statements made during this call, including any forward-looking statements, whether as a result of new information, future events, or otherwise, except as required by law.

本次電話會議所傳達的訊息僅截至本次電話會議召開之日（2025 年 4 月 29 日）為最新資訊。除非法律要求，否則本公司不承擔更新本次電話會議中所做的任何聲明（包括任何前瞻性聲明）的義務，無論是由於新資訊、未來事件或其他原因。

Additionally, we will refer to certain non-GAAP financial measures which are reconciled to GAAP figures in our earnings release and supplementary slide deck, each of which are available on our website at www.fbrtreit.com. We will offer the supplementary slide deck on today's call. With that, I'll turn the call over to Rich.

此外，我們將在收益報告和補充幻燈片中引用某些已根據 GAAP 數據進行調整的非 GAAP 財務指標。這些報告和幻燈片均可在我們的網站 www.fbrtreit.com 上取得。我們將在今天的電話會議上提供補充幻燈片。說完這些，我會把電話轉給里奇。

Great, thanks, Lindsey, and good morning, everyone and thank you for joining us today. As Lindsey mentioned, our earnings release and supplemental debt were published to our website yesterday. We will begin today's call on slide four. I'm going to review our first quarter results and then we will open the call as we always do for your questions.

太好了，謝謝你，林賽，大家早安，謝謝你們今天加入我們。正如 Lindsey 所提到的，我們的收益報告和補充債務已在昨天發佈在我們的網站上。我們將從第四張投影片開始今天的電話會議。我將回顧我們的第一季業績，然後我們將像往常一樣開始電話會議回答大家的問題。

I'll highlight the key developments for the first quarter. Jerry will cover our financial results in more detail. He'll also provide an update on our recently announced acquisition of New Point, and then Mike will discuss market conditions and the changes to our watch list and REO portfolio. So with that, I'll start with our team remained active in the first quarter.

我將重點介紹第一季的主要發展。傑瑞將更詳細地介紹我們的財務表現。他還將提供有關我們最近宣布的收購 New Point 的最新情況，然後 Mike 將討論市場狀況以及我們的關註名單和 REO 投資組合的變化。因此，首先我要說一下我們的團隊在第一季保持活躍。

We originated $341 million in new loan commitments. These new loans continue to enhance our portfolio because of the high quality of the underlying properties and borrowers and because of their compelling economics and low loan to value ratios.

我們發放了 3.41 億美元的新貸款承諾。這些新貸款繼續增強我們的投資組合，因為其基礎資產和借款人的品質很高，而且經濟效益很好，貸款價值比也很低。

We view market volatility as an important catalyst for generating opportunities, and we have a very strong track record of being a reliable capital provider in both stable and stress market conditions. Certainty of closing is extremely valuable to our borrowers, and we have consistently delivered for them. Turning to our current portfolio, we continue to cycle through the loans originated pre-interest rate hike.

我們將市場波動視為創造機會的重要催化劑，並且我們在穩定和壓力市場條件下作為可靠的資本提供者有著非常良好的記錄。交易的確定性對我們的借款人來說極為寶貴，我們也始終如一地為他們提供服務。回顧我們目前的投資組合，我們繼續循環發放加息前發放的貸款。

We received $353 million of loan repayments in the first quarter, predominantly from loans originated in 2021 and 2022. Our continued new originations plus these repayments have brought the percentage of our portfolio originated post-interest rate hike to 56%. This is certainly well ahead of our peers. We believe it is a vitally important statistic when evaluating the quality of a mortgage portfolio.

我們在第一季收到了 3.53 億美元的貸款償還款，主要來自 2021 年和 2022 年發放的貸款。我們持續的新貸款加上這些還款使我們的投資組合在利率上調後所佔比例達到 56%。這無疑遠遠領先於我們的同行。我們認為，在評估抵押貸款組合的品質時，這是一個至關重要的統計數據。

Our REO has created a near term drag on our earnings. However, the temporarily lower nim that REO causes may often be in our best interest. This is because we believe foreclosure can be a prudent strategy in some cases to obtain the highest possible recovery. This is also consistent with our proactive acknowledge and address mindset.

我們的 REO 短期內對我們的利潤造成了拖累。然而，REO 導致的暫時較低的 nim 可能往往符合我們的最佳利益。這是因為我們認為在某些情況下，取消抵押品贖回權是一種謹慎的策略，可以獲得最高的賠償。這也與我們積極主動承認和解決的心態一致。

This quarter we determined that the reserve we had on two office loans that are now held as REO should be charged off through distributable earnings. Consistent with our DE policy. This is how we went forward. Importantly, these charge-offs have already been recognized in GAAP earnings in prior quarters. As a result, our distributable earnings were negative.

本季度，我們確定，目前作為 REO 持有的兩筆辦公室貸款的儲備金應透過可分配收益沖銷。與我們的 DE 政策一致。我們就是這樣前進的。重要的是，這些沖銷已經在前幾個季度的 GAAP 收益中得到確認。結果，我們的可分配收益為負。

DE excluding realized losses worth $0.31 per fully converted share. This represents dividend coverage of 86%. For the avoidance of confusion, we have no new office loan loss reserve. We are simply running previously recognized GAAP losses through distributable earnings in accordance with our distributable earnings definition.

DE 不包括每完全轉換股份 0.31 美元的已實現損失。這意味著股利覆蓋率為 86%。為避免混淆，我們沒有新的辦公室貸款損失準備金。我們只是根據可分配收益定義，將先前確認的 GAAP 損失計入可分配收益。

Excluding our largest office loan, which is a triple net leased headquarters and distribution facility, our traditional multi-tenant exposure is only 2.1% of our total portfolio, and the remaining loans and assets have been significantly marked down to reflect market conditions. As we have discussed previously, we anticipate we will likely fall short of dividend coverage in the near term.

不包括我們最大的辦公室貸款（三重淨租賃總部和配送設施），我們的傳統多租戶風險敞口僅占我們總投資組合的 2.1%，其餘貸款和資產已大幅減記以反映市場狀況。正如我們之前所討論的，我們預計短期內我們可能無法達到股息覆蓋率。

This is because of the short-term drag from our REO and non-performing loan portfolios. Also, we are planning to keep cash balances somewhat higher than normal due to market conditions and to satisfy the upcoming cash component of our new point acquisition. Jerry will cover our dividend policy in his section. At quarter end, our liquidity stood at $913 million including $215 million in unrestricted cash.

這是因為我們的 REO 和不良貸款組合造成了短期拖累。此外，我們計劃根據市場情況將現金餘額保持在略高於正常水平，以滿足新積分收購的即將到來的現金部分。傑瑞將在他的部分介紹我們的股利政策。截至季末，我們的流動資金為 9.13 億美元，其中包括 2.15 億美元的非限制現金。

Our average risk rating at the quarter end was 2.2, with 146 of our 152 positions risk rated at two or three. Our watch list loans represent 4% of our total portfolio comprising six names at the end of the quarter. Mike will provide a comprehensive update on our watch list and REO in his remarks. Looking ahead, we are very excited about the pending acquisition of NewPoint.

本季末，我們的平均風險評級為 2.2，其中 152 個部位中有 146 個的風險評級為 2 或 3。截至本季末，我們的關註名單貸款占我們總投資組合的 4%，包含 6 家貸款公司。麥克將在他的演講中全面更新我們的關註名單和 REO。展望未來，我們對即將進行的 NewPoint 收購感到非常興奮。

We believe this transaction will provide meaningful synergies. It also aligns perfectly with our strategic focus on the multi-family sector and enhances the quality and consistency of our earnings. We think the acquisition will be another catalyst for driving long-term value for our stockholders. We believe that FBRT is well positioned for sustained growth.

我們相信此次交易將產生有意義的綜效。這也與我們對多戶型住宅領域的策略重點完美契合，並提高了我們的獲利品質和一致性。我們認為此次收購將成為推動股東長期價值的另一個催化劑。我們相信 FBRT 已做好持續成長的準備。

With the potential for our stock to trade at a premium to book value similar to other agency focused platforms, especially as we continue to successfully recycle the bulk of our legacy book into current vintage loans. So with all that, I'll hand it over to Jerry now

我們的股票有可能以高於帳面價值的價格進行交易，類似於其他以代理機構為中心的平台，特別是當我們繼續成功地將大部分遺留帳簿回收為當前的舊貸款時。好了，現在我把話題交給傑瑞

Great, thanks Rich I appreciate everyone being on the call today. I'm going to go over the first quarter results starting on slide five if you're following along. FBRT reported GAAP earnings of $23.7 million or $0.20 per diluted common share for the first quarter, and distributable earnings were negative $6.2 million or negative 0.12 or $0.12 for fully converted share.

太好了，謝謝 Rich，我很感謝今天參加電話會議的各位。如果您繼續往下看，我將從第五張投影片開始介紹第一季的業績。FBRT 報告第一季 GAAP 收益為 2,370 萬美元或每股稀釋普通股 0.20 美元，可分配收益為負 620 萬美元或負 0.12 美元，完全轉換股票為 0.12 美元。

Distributable earnings before realized losses were $31.9 million or $0.31 per fully converted common share. In the first quarter, we recognized $38.6 million and realized losses to distributable earnings representing the full specific reserve on our office assets within our foreclosure REO portfolio. This loss was previously accounted for in our GAAP earnings.

實現損失前的可分配收益為 3,190 萬美元，即每股完全轉換的普通股 0.31 美元。在第一季度，我們確認了 3,860 萬美元的可分配收益損失，這筆損失相當於我們法拍 REO 投資組合中辦公資產的全部特定儲備金。該損失之前已計入我們的 GAAP 收益中。

As Rich mentioned, our current exposure to the office segment is minimal. Our REO and non-performing loans also negatively impacted first quarter earnings. However, we are actively working to recover our invested capital in our REO properties, with our team successfully closing several asset sales each quarter.

正如里奇所提到的，我們目前對辦公領域的投資很少。我們的 REO 和不良貸款也對第一季的收益產生了負面影響。然而，我們正在積極努力收回我們在 REO 物業上的投資資本，我們的團隊每季都成功完成幾筆資產銷售。

In order to liquidate assets, we occasionally have been providing short term non-market financing for borrowers. In addition to REO. These loans also represent a short term drag on earnings. Since we do not get the full benefit of repurposing this equity, we will be monitoring dividend coverage for the coming quarters.

為了清算資產，我們偶爾會為借款人提供短期非市場融資。除了 REO 之外。這些貸款也會在短期內拖累獲利。由於我們未能從重新利用這些股權中獲得全部利益，因此我們將監控未來幾季的股利覆蓋率。

While we believe in the long-term earning power of the company to cover the dividend, if REO sales slow or volatile market conditions persist, it could be prudent to revisit our dividend in the short term. Our book value per fully converted common share at the end of the quarter stood at $14.95. The decrease in book value during the quarter primarily reflects our dividend payout exceeding our earnings level.

雖然我們相信公司的長期獲利能力足以支付股息，但如果 REO 銷售放緩或市場狀況持續動盪，短期內重新審視股息可能是明智之舉。本季末，我們每股完全轉換普通股的帳面價值為14.95美元。本季帳面價值的下降主要反映了我們的股利支出超過了獲利水準。

Costs associated with the pending acquisition of New Point and the first quarter grant of long-term incentive awards to our officers and employees, aligning their interests with the long-term stockholder value creation. Moving to slide seven. We have an overview of our origination activity. We originated $341 million in new loan commitments during the first quarter.

與即將收購 New Point 相關的成本以及第一季向我們的高階主管和員工授予的長期激勵獎勵，使他們的利益與長期股東價值創造保持一致。移至第七張投影片。我們對我們的發起活動有一個概述。我們在第一季發放了 3.41 億美元的新貸款承諾。

Our primary focus remained on multi-family, which accounted for 79% of our total origination volume for the quarter. We received $353 million in loan repayments during the quarter, with 10 loans paying off in full. Multi-family loans made up the majority of our paydowns, and $288 million of our paydowns were from loans originated in 2021 and 2022.

我們的主要關注點仍然是多戶型住宅，佔本季總發起量的 79%。本季我們收到了 3.53 億美元的貸款償還，其中 10 筆貸款已全額償還。多戶型貸款占我們償還貸款的大部分，其中 2.88 億美元的償還貸款來自 2021 年和 2022 年發放的貸款。

Moving to slide eight, our average cost of debt on our core portfolio was silver plus 2.18%. At the end of the quarter, 81% of our financing was through CLOs, and we had reinvestment capacity available in two of these deals. We are actively monitoring the CLO market throughout 2025 to strategically access it when conditions are favorable.

轉到第八張投影片，我們核心投資組合的平均債務成本為白銀加上 2.18%。截至本季末，我們 81% 的融資是透過 CLO 進行的，並且我們在其中兩筆交易中擁有再投資能力。我們將在 2025 年全年積極監測 CLO 市場，以便在條件有利時策略性地進入該市場。

Our warehouse lines maintain substantial capacity at quarter end, and when combined with our CLO reinvestment availability and unrestricted cash, our total available liquidity stood at a strong $913 million. Our net leverage position was lower this quarter at 2.35 times with our recourse leverage standing at 0.3 times.

我們的倉庫線在季度末保持了相當大的容量，加上我們的 CLO 再投資可用性和無限制現金，我們的總可用流動資金達到了 9.13 億美元。本季我們的淨槓桿率較低，為 2.35 倍，追索槓桿率為 0.3 倍。

Finally, regarding our pending acquisition of NewPoint, we are pleased to report that the process is largely on schedule. We have already secured necessary regulatory approval from HUD and are actively engaged with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, anticipating their approvals early in the third quarter.

最後，關於我們即將進行的對 NewPoint 的收購，我們很高興地報告，該過程基本上按計劃進行。我們已經獲得了住房和城市發展部 (HUD) 的必要監管批准，並正在積極與房利美和房地美接洽，預計他們將在第三季初獲得批准。

Based on our current progress, we anticipate maintaining our previously announced closing timeline with an expected closing early in the third quarter. Upon the closing of the acquisition, we will publicly release certain historical financial statements for NewPoint and performance. With that, I'll turn it over to Mike to give you an update on our portfolio.

根據我們目前的進展，我們預計將維持先前宣布的結束時間表，預計在第三季初結束。收購完成後，我們將公開發布 NewPoint 的一些歷史財務報表和業績。接下來，我將把時間交給麥克，讓他向您介紹我們的作品集的最新情況。

Thanks, Jerry, and good morning, everyone. Thank you again for joining us. I'm going to start on slide 12. Our core portfolio totals $4.8 billion a quarter end, comprised of 152 loans averaging $32 million. Multi-family remains are preferred sector, securing 71% of the portfolio. Our core portfolio decreased this quarter, primarily due to continued loan repayments and a deliberate moderation to our origination pace.

謝謝，傑瑞，大家早安。再次感謝您的參與。我將從第 12 張投影片開始。我們的核心投資組合每季末總額為 48 億美元，由 152 筆貸款組成，平均每筆貸款 3,200 萬美元。多戶型剩餘的是優先領域，佔投資組合的 71%。本季我們的核心投資組合有所減少，主要是由於持續償還貸款以及有意放慢貸款發放速度。

In Q1, we witnessed very strong spread tightening and decided not to chase originations. Being incredibly active in 2024, we have the luxury of picking our spots on new loans and had no interest in chasing to the tightest spreads we had seen in years. That said, during the quarter, we originated 11 loans at a weighted average spread of 325 basis points.

在第一季度，我們見證了利差的大幅縮窄，因此決定不再追逐發行。由於 2024 年極度活躍，我們可以自由選擇新貸款的發放地點，而沒有興趣追求多年來最窄的利差。也就是說，在本季度，我們發放了 11 筆貸款，加權平均利差為 325 個基點。

Most of our new loans were originated in the first half of Q1. Unlike some traditional credit providers who may retract during periods of market stress, we have maintained our commitment to our borrowers by consistently closing loans on schedule. Echoing Rich's earlier point, the certainty we provide in closing is a highly valued commodity for our borrowers and a significant driver of the repeat business we see year after year.

我們的新貸款大多是在第一季上半年發放的。與一些可能在市場壓力時期撤回貸款的傳統信貸提供者不同，我們透過一致地按時發放貸款，保持了對借款人的承諾。與里奇先前的觀點相呼應，我們在交易結束時提供的確定性對於我們的借款人來說是一種非常寶貴的商品，也是我們年復一年重複業務的重要驅動力。

Many other lenders are also plagued with unaddressed legacy portfolio issues. This, coupled with ongoing market stress, may continue to create lending constraints from traditional credit providers and other commercial mortgage rates, potentially presenting further opportunities for FBRT. We believe our proactive approach to addressing legacy issues should position us favorably.

許多其他貸款機構也受到未解決的遺留投資組合問題的困擾。再加上持續的市場壓力，這可能會繼續對傳統信貸提供者和其他商業抵押貸款利率造成貸款限制，這可能會為 FBRT 帶來更多機會。我們相信，我們積極主動地解決遺留問題的方法將為我們帶來有利地位。

July 14 is a summary of our watch lists. You will see we have moved four loans to watch lists status in the first quarter, bringing our total watch list loans to six. Within our within our six watch list positions, one is a Georgia office loan that qualified for an extension in January 2025. Importantly, the borrower has continued to maintain current payments and reduce the principal balance as part of the extension agreement.

7 月 14 日是我們的觀察名單摘要。您將看到，我們在第一季已將四筆貸款移至關註名單，使我們的關註名單貸款總數達到六筆。在我們的六個觀察名單中，有一個是喬治亞州的辦公室貸款，該貸款於 2025 年 1 月獲得延期資格。重要的是，作為延期協議的一部分，借款人繼續維持當前付款並減少本金餘額。

The next property is a 307 unit student housing property in Norfolk, Virginia, which is risk rated a four. We entered into a loan modification with the borrower who is looking to liquidate the asset in the next six months to 12 months. The remaining four properties are new to the watch list this quarter and are all multi-family loans originated in 2021 and 2022.

下一處房產是位於維吉尼亞州諾福克的一處擁有 307 個單元的學生公寓，風險等級為四級。我們與借款人達成了貸款修改協議，借款人希望在未來六個月到十二個月內變現資產。其餘四處房產是本季新進入關註名單的，均為 2021 年和 2022 年發放的多戶住宅貸款。

One asset, a multi-family property in Austin, Texas, was recently taken REO. The remaining three properties are behind on business plan, and we are in active dialogue with the borrowers. While there was some additional migration to the watch list, the amount of discussions regarding loan modifications and problem loans has decreased dramatically in the first few in the last few months.

位於德州奧斯汀的一處多戶住宅資產最近被列入 REO 名單。其餘三處房產的商業計劃尚未完成，我們正在與借款人積極對話。雖然觀察名單中還有一些新增成員，但過去幾個月中，有關貸款修改和問題貸款的討論數量已大幅減少。

We believe this is a clear signal that we are much closer to the end of the modification workout cycle within FBRT than the beginning. As we have discussed on every earnings call for the past six quarters to eight quarters, we have taken an extremely proactive approach to resolutions and firmly believe we'll be out of the proverbial woods faster and sooner than any other market participant.

我們相信這是一個明確的訊號，表明我們距離 FBRT 中的修改鍛鍊週期的結束比開始更近。正如我們在過去六個季度到八個季度的每次收益電話會議上所討論的那樣，我們採取了極其積極主動的方式來解決問題，並堅信我們將比任何其他市場參與者更快、更早地擺脫困境。

Moving to slide 15, our foreclosure REO portfolio stood at 12 positions a quarter end. During the quarter, we sold four properties near or above our basis. We also have purchase and sale agreements in place for two additional properties at or above our basis and expect to close in the second quarter, and we have an additional three letters of intent.

移至投影片 15，我們的法拍 REO 投資組合在季度末佔據 12 個位置。在本季度，我們以接近或高於基準的價格出售了四處房產。我們也簽訂了另外兩處房產的買賣協議，價格等於或高於我們的基準，預計將於第二季完成，另外我們還有三份意向書。

We added two new properties to our foreclosure REO portfolio this quarter an office property in Denver and a multi-family property in Houston. As Rich and Jerry both covered, we wrote off the remaining specific charge on the Denver and Portland office buildings to distributable earnings this quarter and are comfortable with our current basis.

本季度，我們在止贖 REO 投資組合中增加了兩處新房產：位於丹佛的一處辦公大樓和位於休士頓的一處多戶住宅房產。正如 Rich 和 Jerry 都提到的，我們已將丹佛和波特蘭辦公大樓的剩餘特定費用從本季度的可分配收益中註銷，並且對目前的基礎感到滿意。

We do not think now is the right time to sell either of our office REO assets, but we will continue to review our options quarterly. The multi-family asset in Houston is one of the properties that has an LOI. We hope to have a favorable update about this property in Q2.

我們認為現在不是出售任何辦公室 REO 資產的合適時機，但我們將繼續每季審查我們的選擇。休士頓的多戶型資產是擁有意向書 (LOI) 的房產之一。我們希望在第二季度獲得有關該房產的有利更新。

Regarding the remaining multi-family REO properties, we're focused on quickly liquidating for the best possible outcome, even if it means holding some assets for stabilization. We recognize the earnings potential in these assets and want to redeploy the capital swiftly. Before we turn to questions, I also want to express my excitement about the NewPoint acquisition.

對於剩餘的多戶型 REO 房產，我們專注於快速清算以獲得最佳結果，即使這意味著持有一些資產以實現穩定。我們認識到這些資產的獲利潛力，並希望迅速重新部署資本。在我們開始提問之前，我還想表達一下我對 NewPoint 收購的興奮之情。

This acquisition is highly synergistic and is a natural expansion within our core competency, multi-family lending, adding a scaled CRE agency loan origination and servicing platform to FBRT. It strengthens our platform, expands our market reach, and positions FBRT for sustained growth.

此次收購具有高度的協同效應，是我們核心競爭力——多戶型貸款的自然擴展，為 FBRT 增加了一個規模化的 CRE 機構貸款發放和服務平台。它加強了我們的平台，擴大了我們的市場範圍，並使 FBRT 實現了持續成長。

The transaction should create book value growth and enhanced earning powers over time. We're dedicating to resolving the legacy loans and REO portfolio to fully realize the potential of the combined FBRT and NewPoint, which will set us apart in the middle market CRE lending space. With that, I would like to turn it back to the operator to begin the Q&A session.

隨著時間的推移，該交易將創造帳面價值成長並增強獲利能力。我們致力於解決遺留貸款和 REO 組合問題，以充分發揮 FBRT 和 NewPoint 合併後的潛力，這將使我們在中端市場 CRE 貸款領域脫穎而出。現在，我想將話題交還給接線員，開始問答環節。

We will now begin the question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions). Our first question comes from Matthew Erdner from Jones. Please go ahead.

我們現在開始問答環節。（操作員指令）。我們的第一個問題來自瓊斯公司的馬修‧艾德納 (Matthew Erdner)。請繼續。

Hey, good morning, guys. Thanks for taking the questions and I appreciate all of the colour as usual, with the current levels of REO that you guys kind of took, I want to switch over to the loan portfolio and kind of, where you guys see originating in the near term, are you going to ideally remain neutral and then any capital that is from, some REO sold, we should expect that to get.

嘿，大家早安。感謝您回答這些問題，像往常一樣，我很感激大家的關注，考慮到你們目前持有的 REO 水平，我想轉到貸款組合上，看看你們認為短期內貸款的來源，理想情況下您是否會保持中立，然後，對於來自部分 REO 出售的任何資本，我們應該預期會得到回報。

Tossed into the loan portfolio and the new originations or you guys going to kind of hold the REO proceeds in cash over the near term just kind of want to gauge your thoughts on how you're thinking about it.

投入貸款組合和新發起的貸款，或者你們將在短期內以現金形式持有 REO 收益，只是想衡量一下你們對此的看法。

Hey Matt, it's Mike. Thanks for the question. Yeah, I think we've always targeted a portfolio larger than where we're currently operating today. I think we're in this obviously unique moment where we're hoarding a little bit of cash to close on the new point acquisition, but I think we're positioned really well for that, at this point.

嘿，馬特，我是麥克。謝謝你的提問。是的，我認為我們的目標一直是打造比目前營運規模更大的投資組合。我認為我們正處於一個明顯獨特的時刻，我們正在囤積一些現金來完成新的積分收購，但我認為目前我們已經做好了充分的準備。

So. Any new capital that came in through REO sales, I think we would be, very proactively looking to put that back to work as soon as possible in new origination.

所以。我認為，我們將會非常積極地尋求盡快將透過 REO 銷售獲得的任何新資本重新投入到新的發起中。

Got it. That's helpful. And then Jerry, I kind of want to touch on expenses for the first quarter. Is a lot of that due to the NewPoint acquisition costs, or is there something that we should expect going forward that's similar to the first quarter?

知道了。這很有幫助。然後傑瑞，我想談談第一季的開銷。這在很大程度上是由於 NewPoint 的收購成本造成的嗎，還是我們應該預期未來會出現與第一季類似的情況？

You've got a little bit of NewPoint in there, so there's a few million dollars of transaction costs that are flowing through an OpEx this quarter, but you've also got similar to what we talked about in the fourth quarter, we're also carrying the REO expenses through there as well, which is elevating.

其中有一點 NewPoint，因此本季有幾百萬美元的交易成本透過 OpEx 流動，但您也遇到了與我們在第四季度討論的情況類似的情況，我們也將 REO 費用通過那裡承擔，這正在提升。

Our expenses versus kind of what I would expect on a run rate basis so it's this quarter is kind of a double whammy from, not just the REO but also some new point stuff that we basically pulled forward from the work that we already did.

我們的支出與我根據運行率所預期的支出相比，所以本季有點像是雙重打擊，不僅僅是來自 REO，還有一些我們從已經完成的工作中提煉出來的新點子。

Got it. I was, I was actually going to say double whammy as it pertained to earnings and that once we get rid of the REO, not only do we get rid of that expense, but we get to redeploy that capital into, earning loans again.

知道了。我實際上是想說，這對收益來說是雙重打擊，一旦我們擺脫了 REO，我們不僅可以擺脫這筆開支，而且還可以重新部署這筆資本，再次獲得貸款。

That's right. Right, that makes sense. And then, I guess with the REO, how do you balance, whether you want to move a loan off your balance sheet or, kind of wait and hold, and try and possibly get a gain on sale on some of these assets.

這是正確的。對，很有道理。然後，我想，有了 REO，你該如何平衡，是否要將貸款從資產負債表中移出，或者等待並嘗試透過出售其中一些資產來獲取收益。

I mean, we look at every asset on a case by case basis, obviously, do we think that the assets stabilize? Do we think that the NOI is stabilized, do we think that there's an upside if we held it a little longer? What's the cost of holding it longer versus selling today? I mean, we're constantly doing a property by property analysis and and trying to maximize that recovery.

我的意思是，我們會根據具體情況審查每項資產，顯然，我們是否認為資產穩定了？我們是否認為淨利潤已經穩定下來，我們是否認為如果我們再持有一段時間就會有上行空間？與今天出售相比，長期持有的成本是多少？我的意思是，我們不斷地對每個房產進行分析，並試圖最大限度地恢復。

What I would say is there's no question that getting rid of the REO and redeploying that capital into, earning earnings power is top priority. So if it's, we're not holding an asset for an incremental gain three months to six months later, we're only going to hold an asset longer term if we think it meaningfully moves the needle on recovery.

我想說的是，毫無疑問，擺脫 REO 並將資本重新部署到盈利能力中是當務之急。因此，我們持有某項資產並不是為了在三個月到六個月後獲得增量收益，而只是在我們認為該資產能夠顯著推動經濟復甦時，我們才會長期持有該資產。

Got it. That's helpful. Thank you, guys. I appreciate it.

知道了。這很有幫助。謝謝你們。我很感激。

Thank you. Your next question comes from Randy Binner from B Reilly Securities. Please go ahead.

謝謝。您的下一個問題來自 B Reilly Securities 的 Randy Binner。請繼續。

Good morning, thanks. I if you would, could you expand a little bit on the commentary around the dividend potentially being revisited? I think if you said markets remain volatile and then REO does not process as expected. I just be interesting to kind of get, kind of some parameters around what that might look like.

早安，謝謝。如果可以的話，您能否稍微詳細闡述一下有關可能重新討論的股息的評論？我認為如果您說市場仍然不穩定，那麼 REO 就不會按預期進行。我只是對獲取一些可能看起來像的參數感興趣。

Yeah, I'll take that. I think what we're monitoring is how quickly can we turn over the REO assets. Volatility is its own category. That's just uncertainty and ability or decision whether we want to deploy or pause and conserve capital with a market that, has settled down now but was moving very rapidly the last few weeks.

是的，我會接受的。我認為我們正在監控的是我們能夠多快移交 REO 資產。波動性是一個獨立的類別。這只是不確定性和能力或決定，我們是否要部署或暫停並保存資本，因為市場現在已經穩定下來，但過去幾週發展非常迅速。

I think the REO is the bigger bogey in all this and that, you're holding $300 million or so of assets that are under earning relative to the equity we have deployed in our loan portfolio, and I think we want to be conscious of how much drag and, erosion of book value you have by undercovering that dividend.

我認為 REO 是這一切中最大的妖怪，你持有的 3 億美元左右的資產相對於我們在貸款組合中部署的股權而言收益不足，而且我認為我們要意識到，通過掩蓋股息，你的賬面價值會受到多大的拖累和侵蝕。

And if it, if we think it's more of a prolonged hold, do we want to stop that erosion of book value? That that's what we're going to monitor. I think, you've heard that we have pretty good traction in terms of turning some of these things over, but I think we're also conscious that, if it does get volatile, do some of those things fall out?

如果我們認為這更像是一種長期持有，我們是否想阻止帳面價值的侵蝕？這就是我們要監控的。我想，您已經聽說我們在扭轉這些事情方面有很好的進展，但我想我們也意識到，如果情況確實變得不穩定，這些事情是否會受到影響？

Do we end up holding them for a quarter or two longer than expected? That's all we're saying. I think we want to be conscious of the environment and And what that lack of earnings power on those assets does does to the book value.

我們最終是否會比預期多持有它們一兩個季度？這就是我們要說的。我認為我們要意識到環境以及這些資產缺乏獲利能力對帳面價值的影響。

Okay, that's helpful and then I guess the follow up there would be that there's a, considerable amount of cash going towards NewPoint. So how does the, how do you think of the of the expenditure of that cash versus going towards the dividend? I mean, I think it's, NewPoint is a fantastic transaction.

好的，這很有幫助，然後我想接下來會有大量現金流向 NewPoint。那麼，您如何看待這筆現金的支出與分紅呢？我的意思是，我認為 NewPoint 是一筆非常棒的交易。

It's good diversification synergy, it's going to be creative, but is there, is that a consideration that cash going out versus cash that could go to the dividends?

這是一種很好的多元化協同效應，它將富有創造力，但是，是否存在現金流出與用於分紅的現金之間的考慮？

I see that more as a short-term issue than a long-term issue in that like you heard from Mike and Rich, we have a little more cash and liquidity, cash to be created cash ahead of closing than we otherwise normally would and you'd be building up the loan book a little bit higher.

我認為這更多的是一個短期問題，而不是長期問題，因為就像你從邁克和里奇那裡聽到的一樣，我們擁有比平時更多的現金和流動性，在交易結束前要創造的現金比平時要多，而且你的貸款賬簿也會稍微高一些。

What you're going to do though is then deploy that cash into the new business line which, not immediately but over the next few quarters becomes accretive to the rest of the operations so that I kind of put in a different bucket altogether right that's just the construction zone part of building this into something broader in terms of a real estate platform, not something I would say looking out for, a year, two years is.

不過，你要做的就是將這筆現金部署到新的業務線中，雖然不是立即生效，但在接下來的幾個季度裡，它將對其他業務產生增值作用，所以我把它放在了一個完全不同的桶裡，對吧，這只是建設區的一部分，將其建設成更廣泛的房地產平台，而不是我要說的等待一年或兩年的事情。

The prime factor in the dividend consideration because we've sort of digested the implications of that if you will. The the other REO is more of a harder predict harder to predict drag in some cases, we have a pretty good sense of what new point is going to be the exact timing of unloading the other stuff is obviously market dependent and not as perfectly predictable.

這是股息考慮中的首要因素，因為我們已經消化了其影響。其他 REO 更難預測，在某些情況下，我們非常清楚新的點位將會是卸載其他東西的確切時間，這顯然取決於市場，而且不是完全可預測的。

Hey Randy, it's Rich, Randy, it's Rich. I would just add that NewPoint we we disclosed, discussed is going to close early in the third quarter. I mean that's only a quarter away or maybe even less. So this need for some cash is going to go away pretty soon and you know we can get back to deploying more and adding to earnings power.

嘿，蘭迪，我是里奇，蘭迪，我是里奇。我只想補充一點，我們披露、討論過的 NewPoint 將在第三季初結束。我的意思是，距離目標只剩下四分之一甚至更少的時間。因此，對現金的需求很快就會消失，而且我們可以重新部署更多資金並增強獲利能力。

So and the other point I would make is we always set along with our board our dividend based on our earnings power, not based on, a quarter, the current quarter you're looking at, and we have had no concerns about our ability to cover our dividend, at least cover our dividend. It's just a question of the timing and that and that, goes back to the context for Jerry's remarks.

所以我想說的另一點是，我們和董事會始終根據我們的盈利能力來設定股息，而不是根據某個季度，也就是你所關注的當前季度，而且我們並不擔心我們支付股息的能力，至少是支付股息的能力。這只是一個時間問題，這又回到了傑瑞言論的背景。

All right, I appreciate the comments. Thank you.

好的，我很感謝你的評論。謝謝。

Thank you. Your next question comes from Tom Catherwood from BTIG. Please go ahead.

謝謝。您的下一個問題來自 BTIG 的 Tom Catherwood。請繼續。

Thank you and good morning, everybody. Maybe following up on Matt's questions on originations, I know they can be lumpy, but there was a sequential slowdown, and Mike, I think you mentioned most activity was during the first half of Q1. How have originations paced thus far into, and have you seen any shifts in your pipeline since tariffs were announced?

謝謝大家，早安。也許可以繼續回答 Matt 關於起源的問題，我知道它們可能會不一致，但有一個連續的放緩，而 Mike，我認為你提到大多數活動都發生在第一季的前半段。到目前為止，發起的步伐如何？自從關稅宣布以來，你們的頻道有任何變化嗎？

Hey, Tom, thanks for the question. Believe it or not, our originations have not really been lumpy at all. I think as you look across the platform in 2024, it was wildly consistent. I think we did like just around $1.1 billion every single quarter in 2024, and it's been relatively consistent deal flow for the beginning of 2025.

嘿，湯姆，謝謝你的提問。不管你信不信，我們的起源其實一點也不坎坷。我認為，當你回顧 2024 年的平台時，你會發現它非常一致。我認為我們在 2024 年每季的交易額確實約為 11 億美元，而且 2025 年初的交易流量也相對穩定。

We have essentially shut down origination on FBRT just in the very short term while we were cash gathering for the new point acquisition. So the pipeline for FBRT is really nonexistent until we feel like, that's completely ring fenced, the acquisition that is, which at this point I would say it is. So we'll probably be turning that back on.

在為新點收購籌集現金的短期內，我們基本上關閉了 FBRT 的發起。因此，FBRT 的管道實際上是不存在的，直到我們覺得收購已經完全得到保障，目前我認為已經得到保障。所以我們可能會重新啟用它。

Momentarily, but remember we're running other vehicles at the platform, so it's really just flipping a switch in the allocation policy that FBRT starts getting loan deal flow again. So, tons of deal flow is available as I mentioned in the prepared remarks, we saw a really aggressive tightening of spreads in kind of the last, four weeks to six weeks of the quarter.

暫時如此，但請記住，我們正在平台上運行其他工具，因此，這實際上只是在分配政策中撥動開關，FBRT 就會再次開始獲得貸款交易流。因此，正如我在準備好的評論中提到的那樣，有大量的交易流可用，我們看到在本季度的最後四周到六週內利差確實大幅收緊。

And I just didn't feel like there was a need to chase the levels that were, I would say 50 basis points inside of the tightest pricing that we saw kind of the peak valuations in Q4 '21, Q1 of '22. So we just selectively hit the pause button based on, spreads being at the tightest levels we've seen in a long time, but I do expect to flip that switch back on in short order for FBRT to start originating again.

我只是覺得沒有必要追逐那些水平，我想說的是，我們在 2021 年第四季度、2022 年第一季度看到的峰值估值的最緊定價範圍內有 50 個基點。因此，我們只是選擇性地按下暫停按鈕，因為利差處於我們長期以來所見的最窄水平，但我確實希望在短時間內重新打開該開關，以便 FBRT 再次開始起源。

Got you. And just to follow up on that, Mike, so you're seeing tons of deal flow, so it does it, is it suffice to say that you have not seen a change in that pace of deal flow since the tariffs were announced? Even though you're not.

明白了。麥克，為了跟進這個問題，您看到大量的交易流，所以確實如此，是否可以說，自從宣布關稅以來，您沒有看到交易流的速度發生變化？即使你不是。

I apologize for missing the second part of your question. I think we saw a tiny little blip of people kind of saying what happened. I don't think it was. It was a byproduct of tariffs which was a [70], 75 basis points swing in the 10 years in a matter of, I don't know, 5 days or 7 days, 10 days. So I think everybody just kind of took a deep breath and said what the heck's going on? It seems like things have calmed back down.

很抱歉我遺漏了您問題的第二部分。我想我們看到了一小部分人在談論發生的事情。我不認為是這樣。這是關稅的副產品，在 10 年內，關稅波動了 [70] 到 75 個基點，我不知道這只花了 5 天、7 天還是 10 天的時間。所以我想每個人都深深吸了一口氣，然後說到底發生了什麼事？看起來事情已經平靜下來了。

It seems like we've had a little bit of spread tightening again, issuance, CRE, CLO issuance picked up again, CMBF issuance picked up again. Rate came back in 30 basis points-40 basis points. So there's been a little bit of calm after that storm, and I would say, looking longer term, I think that it's probably a net positive for CRE overall. So. Yeah, I, we haven't seen much negative impact at all since that kind of 5 day or 7 day period.

看起來我們的利差再次略有收緊，發行量、CRE、CLO 發行量再次回升，CMBF 發行量再次回升。利率回落30個基點至40個基點。所以，那場風暴過後，情況稍微平靜了一些，我想說，從長遠來看，我認為這對 CRE 整體來說可能是一件好事。所以。是的，自那 5 天或 7 天以來，我們並沒有看到太大的負面影響。

Appreciate that, Mike. Thank you. And then the last one for me, what is your read on changes happening at Fannie, Freddie, and HUD and kind of any potential impacts on agency lending, either near term or longer term? I know it's a crystal ball question, but I assume that you've got some insights into it now that you're going through the whole NewPoint process.

非常感謝，麥克。謝謝。然後對我來說最後一個問題，您如何看待房利美、房地美和住房和城市發展部正在發生的變化以及對機構貸款的任何潛在影響，無論是短期還是長期？我知道這是一個水晶球問題，但我認為您現在已經經歷了整個 NewPoint 過程，對此已經有了一些了解。

I typically say my crystal ball shattered years ago and as it pertains to predicting the government that that one's really hard. I think that NewPoint has got a phenomenal team. I think that they have three licenses that are very highly coveted. I think that we've got a really unique and special opportunity here to build one of the most, creative and entrepreneurial platforms, for multi-family lending.

我通常會說我的水晶球幾年前就破了，而且預測政府的行動真的很難。我認為 NewPoint 擁有一支非凡的團隊。我認為他們擁有三個非常令人垂涎的許可證。我認為我們在這裡擁有一個真正獨特和特殊的機會來建立最具創造力和創業精神的多戶型貸款平台之一。

So I don't know what this administration is going to do next. I'm not sure this administration knows what they're going to do next, but I'm guessing that as long as the playing field is even for all of the participants on the field, I'm going to say I think we're going to have a mouse trap that's a little bit better than everybody else once it's all put together.

所以我不知道這屆政府下一步會做什麼。我不確定本屆政府是否知道下一步要做什麼，但我猜，只要所有參與者都處於公平的競爭環境中，我想，一旦一切準備就緒，我們就會擁有一個比其他所有人的捕鼠器都要好一點的捕鼠器。

Appreciate all the answers, thanks everyone.

感謝大家的回答，謝謝大家。

Thank you. Your next question comes from Steve DeLaney from Citizens JMP Securities. Please go ahead.

謝謝。您的下一個問題來自 Citizens JMP Securities 的 Steve DeLaney。請繼續。

Good morning, everyone. Certainly, exciting times there. Hey Bridge, how are you? (Multiple speakers) Obviously, the world is always changing. Having it strikes me that.

大家早安。確實，那是激動人心的時刻。嘿，Bridge，你好嗎？（多位發言者）顯然，世界總是在改變。擁有它讓我印象深刻。

The more tools you have in your toolbox, you probably don't use. Them all every day, but it sure adds, I think, to the franchise value. I guess to that point, Mike, how many lenders out there, real estate lenders actually have the products have both some agency multi-family product with Freddie Fannie.

您的工具箱中的工具越多，您可能就越不會使用。每天都是如此，但我認為這確實增加了特許經營權的價值。麥克，我想就這一點而言，有多少貸款機構，房地產貸款機構實際上擁有一些與房地美房利美合作的機構多戶型產品。

And also have an a conduit program, CBS Conduit, and the extension of that question, first about who compete, who will compete with you when you have your full set, okay, of products. Secondly, the borrowers, are there circumstances where you have.

並且還有一個管道計劃，CBS Conduit，以及該問題的延伸，首先是關於誰在競爭，當你擁有全套產品時，誰會與你競爭。其次，各位借款人，你們有沒有什麼狀況。

Long multi-family borrowers and certainly on maybe their core product, it fits for Freddie Fannie, but that they have other multi-family products that can't go there for one reason or another and therefore that they would find the conduit, a conduit loan to be more attractive. So just some top-down view of the what the market looks like.

長期多戶型借款人，當然可能是他們的核心產品，它適合房地美房利美，但他們還有其他多戶型產品，由於這樣或那樣的原因不能在那裡使用，因此他們會發現管道貸款更具吸引力。這只是一些自上而下的市場視角。

Yeah, thanks for the question, Steve, and I look, I think that this was the industrial logic of the acquisition. We have always preached, for the 10 years that I've been running Benefits Reach Real Estate Group, we want to have a one stop shop. We want to be a cradle to grave provider for a borrower. We can do a construction loan, a bridge loan, a CMBS permanent loan.

是的，謝謝你的提問，史蒂夫，我認為這是這項收購的產業邏輯。在我經營 Benefits Reach 房地產集團的 10 年時間裡，我們一直在宣揚，我們希望提供一站式服務。我們希望成為借款人從搖籃到墳墓的全程服務提供者。我們可以提供建築貸款、過橋貸款和 CMBS 永久貸款。

The one thing that we never had was an agency takeout, and I think it's a game changer. I really do. I think it's going to change our concept. I think we're going to look more like the agency lenders, it might take us 18 months to 24 months to get there, but maybe we're not comped to mortgage rates going forward. Maybe we're more comped to the agency space.

我們從來沒有遇到過的情況是代理商被收購，我認為這將改變遊戲規則。我確實如此。我認為它會改變我們的觀念。我認為我們將更像代理貸款機構，我們可能需要 18 個月到 24 個月才能實現這一目標，但也許我們不會在未來受到抵押貸款利率的影響。也許我們更適合代理領域。

We've talked about. And several times that you know we think that this is a clear path to trading above book value once we've integrated and grown the business together. But there's no one really out there that has it all, and I think that we will, and to your point, you kind of sold it better than I could is there aren't any agency lenders that have a conduit.

我們已經討論過了。有幾次，您知道，我們認為，一旦我們整合並共同發展業務，這就是一條以高於帳面價值進行交易的明確途徑。但實際上沒有人能夠擁有一切，我認為我們會有，就你的觀點而言，你比我更好地推銷了這一點，因為沒有任何代理貸款人擁有管道。

There aren't many agency lenders that have an actual balance sheet of their own that they use. There certainly aren't many that do construction financing, and we even have a pocket of equity investing that we do. So I truly believe that once we put these two companies together, we become the most interesting provider of capital in the multi-family sector literally overnight.

很少有代理貸款機構擁有自己使用的實際資產負債表。進行建築融資的公司肯定不多，我們甚至還進行了一些股權投資。因此我堅信，一旦我們將這兩家公司合併，我們將在一夜之間成為多戶型住宅領域最有趣的資本提供者。

There's going to be some teaching of the New Point folks of what we do. There's going to be some teaching of the benefit Street folks of what the New Point folks do, but I think once we integrate these teams and integrate these products, it's going to be something very unique.

我們將向 New Point 的人們傳授我們所做的事情。我們會向福利街的人傳授一些 New Point 人所做的事情，但我認為，一旦我們整合這些團隊並整合這些產品，它將會變得非常獨特。

Having covered some of those, your competitors and the participants in the space, I have to agree with with what you're saying as far as the breadth of your product line.

在介紹了您的一些競爭對手和該領域的參與者之後，我不得不同意您關於產品線廣度的說法。

Yeah, I think the unique thing, Steve, oh sorry to interrupt. I just like to add, I think the unique thing is if you look at historically the originators to the agency space. Almost all of them have tried to build out a balance sheet portion of the business, and most of them have not been successful in doing it.

是的，我認為這是獨一無二的，史蒂夫，哦，抱歉打擾了。我只是想補充一點，我認為獨特之處在於如果你從歷史上看代理領域的發起者。幾乎所有公司都曾嘗試建立業務的資產負債表部分，但大多數都沒有成功。

I think our building it the other way is what is really the differentiator here, and I just think that it's going to really stand out once we once we get these companies combined.

我認為我們以另一種方式建立它是真正的區別所在，而且我認為，一旦我們將這些公司合併起來，它就會真正脫穎而出。

Interesting and remind me how many licenses that Fannie and Freddie each have outstanding approximately.

有趣的是，讓我想起了房利美和房地美各自未償還的許可證數量。

I don't recall off the top of my head. I know that NewPoint is one of 19 that has all three.

我記不清了。我知道 NewPoint 是 19 家同時擁有這三種情況的公司之一。

Yeah, okay, great, yeah, and I can get that, but I think it's like a couple dozen, something like the 20, it's not 100, it's something like, 20 or 25, something in that ballpark and just to kind of size the playing field. All right, thanks for the colour.

是的，好的，太好了，是的，我可以理解，但我認為大概是幾十個，比如 20 個，不是 100 個，而是 20 個或 25 個左右，大概就是這個數，只是為了確定比賽場地的大小。好的，謝謝你的顏色。

Thanks Steve.

謝謝史蒂夫。

Thanks Steve.

謝謝史蒂夫。

Thank you. Your next question comes from Jason Stewart from Janney Montgomery Scott. Please go ahead.

謝謝。您的下一個問題來自 Janney Montgomery Scott 的 Jason Stewart。請繼續。

Hey, good morning. Thanks for taking the question. Quick follow up on new point. I know we don't have full financials, and we'll get those, at some point in the future. Do you have an initial ballpark of how much the agency business will be as a percentage of total revenue at close and then, out a year?

嘿，早安。感謝您回答這個問題。快速跟進新觀點。我知道我們還沒有完整的財務數據，但我們會在未來的某個時候獲得這些數據。您是否有初步的估計，即代理業務在年末和年末佔總收入的百分比是多少？

No, we haven't disclosed that yet. Well, you'll get more colour on that when we provide the financials in a couple months.

不，我們還沒有透露這一點。好吧，當我們在幾個月後提供財務數據時，您將對此有更多的了解。

Okay, yeah, just, with Michael's comment, it'd be helpful to know, how much of it is we're thinking about the concept shifting, towards a different concept, how much it is, but okay, following up on the dividend, if I look at distributable dividend coverage, Jerry for you before realize loss, in terms of that metrics, is that a specific metric you're looking at relative to the sustainability of the.

好的，是的，只是，根據邁克爾的評論，了解我們在多大程度上考慮將概念轉向不同的概念會很有幫助，但是好的，跟進股息，如果我看一下可分配股息覆蓋率，傑瑞在實現損失之前，就該指標而言，這是相對於可持續性的一個特定指標。

Is there a simple metric we can look at to follow going forward in our models let's say, and here's where your comfort level sits with the dividend.

是否存在一個簡單的指標，我們可以參考它在我們的模型中繼續前進，這就是您對股息的舒適度。

Yeah, I mean, I think it's If you look at where we've been. Some of the charge offs. I think we've been around 90%, give or take a little bit, I don't think we want to see a degradation to that. I, and I don't even think if we, I don't even know if we want to sit there if we think it's quarters on end either, right? I think if there's a clear path in a couple of quarters, that's not.

是的，我的意思是，如果你看看我們去過的地方，你就會明白這一點。一些沖銷。我認為我們已經達到了 90% 左右，或多或少，我認為我們不希望看到這一數字下降。我，我什至不認為如果我們，我什至不知道我們是否想坐在那裡，如果我們認為它是末端的四分之一，對嗎？我認為，如果幾個季度後有一條明確的道路，那就不是。

The end of the world, if you will. If we think it's four quarters, that's a little less appealing to us, so I think It it's more of a timing question than a just a delta to the coverage right we don't want to just run at 90% in perpetuity. I don't think we like Rich said, our goal has always been to pay out what we earn. We think that earnings power is there at the level we set it. It's just how quickly can we get back to it.

如果你願意的話，這就是世界末日。如果我們認為是四個季度，那對我們來說吸引力就小了，所以我認為這更多的是一個時間問題，而不僅僅是覆蓋率的增量，我們不想永遠以 90% 的速度運行。我不認為我們像里奇所說的那樣，我們的目標一直是支付我們所賺的錢。我們認為，獲利能力處於我們設定的水平。問題只是我們能多快恢復。

(Multiple speakers) So I think the metric to follow is how quick you get off the REO.

（多位發言者）因此，我認為要遵循的衡量標準是你多快擺脫 REO。

Yeah, and Jason, I would just point you again, we mentioned that last quarter, we think there's $0.25 to $0.30 of earning potential in the REO. It's a question of when, right? Is it two quarters from now or four quarters from now? But we know what the earning potential is in that REO portfolio. We just got to get it moved and got to get it redeployed.

是的，傑森，我只是想再次指出，我們提到上個季度，我們認為 REO 的獲利潛力為 0.25 美元到 0.30 美元。這只是時間問題，對吧？是從現在起兩個季度還是從現在起四個季度？但我們知道 REO 投資組合的獲利潛力。我們只需要將其移動並重新部署。

Yeah, okay, and then the second part of that is, how do you think about NewPoint as it relates to that metric because I think the previous disclosure was a creative to distributable EPS in the second half of 2026. So you have a second moving part to that metric, now.

是的，好的，然後第二部分是，您如何看待 NewPoint 與該指標的關係，因為我認為先前的揭露是 2026 年下半年可分配每股收益的創意。因此，現在這個指標有了第二個變動部分。

We do, but I have that in some ways is more projectable based on the nature of that business, right? So a good portion of those income streams are fairly sticky with the servicing portion. I think we have a pretty good back test on origination capabilities and targets there, so. I think we have a tolerance for kind of what that will be, at the same time it's also.

確實如此，但我認為從某種程度上來說，根據業務性質，這更具可預測性，對嗎？因此，這些收入流的很大一部分與服務部分緊密相關。我認為我們對發起能力和目標進行了相當不錯的回測，所以。我認為我們對這種情況有一定的容忍度，同時也是如此。

It's also a building factor in terms of what it's going to add as you kind of grow that MSR portfolio too, so there's some offset to kind of growing the book ahead of kind of hitting the distributable coverage, that in some ways is easier to understand and sort of factor in. What I don't want is the double drag right from the REO and sort of the integration of NewPoint if you will.

這也是一個建構因素，就 MSR 投資組合的成長而言，它會有所增加，因此在達到可分配覆蓋範圍之前，書籍的成長會有一定的抵消作用，從某種程度上來說，這更容易理解和考慮在內。我不想要的是 REO 和 NewPoint 整合帶來的雙重拖累。

Yeah. Okay, alright, appreciate the questions thanks.

是的。好的，好的，感謝您的提問。

Thanks Jason.

謝謝傑森。

Thank you. This concludes our question-and-answer session. I would now like to turn the conference back to Lindsey Crabbe for closing remarks.

謝謝。我們的問答環節到此結束。現在我想請林賽·克拉布 (Lindsey Crabbe) 致閉幕詞。

We appreciate you joining us today. Please reach out if you have any further questions. Thanks, and have a good day.

感謝您今天加入我們。如果您還有其他問題，請與我們聯絡。謝謝，祝您有美好的一天。

Thank you. The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

謝謝。會議現已結束。感謝您參加今天的演講。您現在可以斷開連線。