Everest Group Ltd (EG) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and welcome to the Everest Group Limited second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please note this event is being recorded. Now I would like to turn the conference over to your host today, Matthew Rohrmann, Senior Vice President and Head of HR. Please go ahead.

大家好，歡迎參加 Everest Group Limited 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，此事件正在被記錄。現在，我想將會議交給今天的主持人、高級副總裁兼人力資源主管 Matthew Rohrmann。請繼續。

Thank you, Keith. Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the Everest Group Limited second quarter of 2025 earnings conference call. The Everest executives leading today's call are Jim Williamson, President and CEO; and Mark Kociancic, Executive Vice President and CFO. We're also joined by other members of the Everest management team.

謝謝你，基斯。大家早安，歡迎參加 Everest Group Limited 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。主持今天電話會議的 Everest 高層包括總裁兼執行長 Jim Williamson 和執行副總裁兼財務長 Mark Kociancic。我們也與 Everest 管理團隊的其他成員一起參加了這項活動。

Before we begin, I'll preface the comments by noting that today's call will include forward-looking statements. Actual results may differ materially, and we undertake no obligation to publicly update forward-looking statements.

在我們開始之前，我想先指出，今天的電話會議將包括前瞻性陳述。實際結果可能有重大差異，我們不承擔公開更新前瞻性聲明的義務。

Management comments regarding estimates, projections and similar are subject to the risks, uncertainties and assumptions as noted in Everest's SEC filings. Management may also refer to certain non-GAAP financial measures. Available explanations and reconciliations to GAAP can be found in the earnings press release, investor presentation, and financial supplement on our website.

管理階層對估計、預測和類似內容的評論受 Everest 向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中所述的風險、不確定性和假設的影響。管理階層也可能參考某些非公認會計準則財務指標。在我們網站的收益新聞稿、投資者介紹和財務補充中可以找到可用的解釋和與 GAAP 的對帳。

With that, I'll turn the call over to Jim.

說完這些，我就把電話轉給吉姆。

Thanks, Matt, and good morning, everyone. Everest delivered a strong second quarter. Contributions from underwriting and investments drove net operating income of $734 million and an annualized operating ROE of nearly 20%. Our results underscore the strength and resilience of our platform.

謝謝，馬特，大家早安。Everest 第二季度表現強勁。承銷和投資貢獻推動營業淨收入達到 7.34 億美元，年化營業 ROE 接近 20%。我們的成果凸顯了我們平台的實力和彈性。

Underwriting profit totaled $385 million on a combined ratio of $90.4 million. This reflected light cat experience and $39 million of favorable prior year development in our Reinsurance attritional property book. We maintained prudent loss picks across our portfolio with a 60.1% loss ratio.

承保利潤總計 3.85 億美元，綜合成本率為 9,040 萬美元。這反映了我們再保險損耗財產帳簿中輕微的巨災經驗和 3,900 萬美元的上一年有利發展。我們在整個投資組合中保持謹慎的虧損選擇，虧損率為 60.1%。

Gross written premium declined slightly year over year. Reinsurance GWP rose 1.1%, while Insurance declined 3.1%. Growth excluding deliberate US Casualty portfolio actions in both divisions was 11% and 7%, respectively. Net investment income was strong at $532 million, supported by favorable private equity performance.

毛承保保費較去年同期略有下降。再保險總保費上漲 1.1%，保險則下降 3.1%。不包括有意採取的美國意外險投資組合行動，兩個部門的成長率分別為 11% 和 7%。受私募股權投資表現良好支撐，淨投資收入強勁，達到 5.32 億美元。

Moving on to Reinsurance, which delivered an excellent quarter, generating $436 million in underwriting profit, up $133 million from prior year. The combined ratio was 85.6%, reflecting improvements in our business mix and minimal catastrophe losses. Reserve releases improved the combined ratio by 1.3 points in the quarter, while losses associated with the recent UK court aviation ruling added 3.2 points. Improved mix drove a 30-basis point reduction in both the attritional loss ratio and attritional combined ratio to 56.7% and 84.1%, respectively.

再保險業務本季表現出色，承保利潤達 4.36 億美元，較上年同期成長 1.33 億美元。綜合比率為 85.6%，反映出我們的業務組合有所改善且災難損失降至最低。儲備金釋放使本季的綜合比率提高了 1.3 個百分點，而與英國法院最近的航空裁決相關的損失則增加了 3.2 個百分點。組合改善使損耗率和綜合損耗率分別下降 30 個基點至 56.7% 和 84.1%。

We continue to grow in property with premiums up about 8% over prior year. Property cat XOL grew over 15% and property pro rata north of 8% as risk-adjusted returns remain attractive. Our differentiated access to clients affords Everest high-quality opportunities despite rising competition. Casualty premiums declined 7.3%, while our casualty pro rata book was down 15% as we reduced targeted exposures.

我們的房地產業務持續成長，保費比前一年上漲了約 8%。由於風險調整後的回報仍然具有吸引力，房地產險 XOL 增長超過 15%，房地產按比例增長超過 8%。儘管競爭日益激烈，但我們差異化的客戶服務方式仍為 Everest 提供了高品質的機會。意外險保費下降了 7.3%，而由於我們減少了目標風險敞口，我們的意外險比例帳簿下降了 15%。

Primary casualty rates are rising, but the persistent level of ceding commissions and continued legal system of use inform our conservative approach. We continue to see attractive opportunities in our global specialty platform, particularly in engineering, renewable energy, and our world-class Parametric business.

初級傷亡率正在上升，但持續的佣金轉讓水平和持續使用的法律制度使我們採取保守的做法。我們繼續在我們的全球專業平台上看到誘人的機會，特別是在工程、再生能源和我們世界一流的參數業務領域。

Turning to midyear renewals. Property cat rate change met our expectations and risk-adjusted returns for our cat portfolio remain attractive. Importantly, terms and conditions are holding. Property cat rate for our portfolio was essentially flat at 6.1% as the vast majority of our signings were done at preferential rate and terms. We're also beginning to see the benefits of Florida tort reform, which has not been factored into our pricing.

轉向年中續約。房地產巨災保險費率變化符合我們的預期，且我們巨災保險投資組合的風險調整後回報仍然具有吸引力。重要的是，條款和條件仍然有效。由於我們絕大多數的簽約都是以優惠利率和條款完成的，因此我們投資組合中的房地產利率基本上持平於 6.1%。我們也開始看到佛羅裡達州侵權法改革的好處，但這還沒有計入我們的定價中。

Market conditions at [7, 1] largely follow the trends seen throughout the year. We continue to reshape the portfolio, expanding in US property, in Asia, and in Latin America, while reducing our US-exposed Casualty business. We have shed approximately $800 million of Casualty pro rata business since the beginning of 2024.

[7, 1] 的市場狀況基本上遵循全年的趨勢。我們持續重塑投資組合，擴大美國房地產、亞洲和拉丁美洲的業務，同時減少在美國的意外險業務。自 2024 年初以來，我們已按比例削減了約 8 億美元的意外險業務。

Our superior execution and deep relationships position Everest to optimize our share in attractive programs with core [stints], in many cases, with favorable economics. In short, our Reinsurance business is well positioned to deliver regardless of the external environment.

我們卓越的執行力和深厚的關係使 Everest 能夠在具有核心[職位]的有吸引力的專案中優化我們的份額，在許多情況下，這些專案都具有良好的經濟效益。簡而言之，無論外部環境如何，我們的再保險業務都能夠很好地發揮作用。

Moving on to Insurance, where we are rapidly reshaping our portfolio. The division recorded an underwriting loss of $18 million with a combined ratio of 102% and an attritional loss ratio of 68.7%. Results reflect ongoing prudent loss picks, particularly in casualty, as we continue to build our risk margin, lower earned premium, coupled with investments in our global platform led to a higher expense ratio.

接下來是保險，我們正在迅速重塑我們的投資組合。該部門承保損失為 1,800 萬美元，綜合成本率為 102%，損耗率為 68.7%。結果反映了持續審慎的損失選擇，特別是在意外險方面，因為我們繼續建立風險保證金，降低已賺保費，再加上對我們全球平台的投資，導致費用率更高。

Gross written premium declined approximately 3% year over year, driven by our 1 renewal strategy in North American Casualty, which will be completed in the third quarter. Casualty premiums decreased 27% in the quarter. 47% of Casualty business in the quarter was not renewed. This was partially offset by strong rate increases, which averaged 16% for the Casualty business we retained, led by excess umbrella and commercial auto, each increasing in the high teens.

承保保費總額年減約 3%，這得益於我們北美意外險的 1 個續保策略，該策略將於第三季完成。本季意外險保費下降了 27%。本季 47% 的意外險業務未續保。這被強勁的費率成長部分抵消，我們保留的意外險業務費率平均上漲了 16%，其中超額傘險和商用車險的費率上漲幅度最大，均達到了十幾歲的水平。

Importantly, rate exceeded expected loss trend across commercial auto, general liability, and umbrella lines. It's early, but we're already seeing results from our actions to improve the quality of our casualty portfolio. In the quarter, 88% of retail casualty gross written premiums had loss sensitive structures and 86% was in our best classes of business.

重要的是，商業汽車、一般責任險和綜合險的費率超過了預期的損失趨勢。雖然還為時過早，但我們已經看到了改善意外險組合品質的行動所取得的成果。本季度，88% 的零售意外險毛承保保費具有損失敏感結構，86% 屬於我們最好的業務類別。

Make no mistake, Everest Insurance is open for business to write well-priced and well-structured casualty accounts. Premium growth across all lines, excluding casualty, was 7% globally, with strength in specialty, Accident and Health, and across our International business.

毫無疑問，Everest Insurance 已開始營業，提供價格合理、結構合理的意外傷害保險。全球範圍內，除意外險外，所有險種的保費增長率為 7%，其中專業險、意外險和健康險以及國際業務均表現強勁。

Specialty in A&H grew 40% and 24% year over year, respectively. In property, global premiums increased 5% with 21% international growth, offsetting a 2% decline in North America. While still attractive, the primary property market is increasingly competitive, especially in North America large accounts.

急救和健康專科業務較去年同期分別成長 40% 和 24%。在房地產領域，全球保費成長了 5%，其中國際保費成長了 21%，抵銷了北美地區 2% 的降幅。儘管一級房地產市場仍然具有吸引力，但競爭日益激烈，尤其是在北美的大客戶中。

Nonetheless, our long-term investments in talent and systems give us runway for disciplined growth. Our wholesale platform, Everest Evolution continues to capitalize on opportunities in the E&S market. We have expanded industry specialization and new offerings, driving growth in targeted higher-margin segments of the market.

儘管如此，我們對人才和系統的長期投資為我們提供了規範成長的空間。我們的批發平台 Everest Evolution 持續利用 E&S 市場的機會。我們擴大了產業專業化和新產品的供應，推動了目標高利潤市場的成長。

Our International Insurance business is progressing well, with a 23% growth rate this quarter and improving margins. We're making investments in key capabilities to support the business at scale. International is profitable with the more mature operations like UK wholesale and European retail achieving low 90s combined ratios this quarter.

我們的國際保險業務進展順利，本季成長率為 23%，利潤率也在提高。我們正在對關鍵能力進行投資，以大規模支援業務。國際業務實現盈利，英國批發和歐洲零售等較成熟的業務本季實現了 90% 的低綜合比率。

Moving to reserves. We continue to build risk margin in the current accident year. In Reinsurance, we recognized favorable development in well-seasoned property lines. In Insurance, we remain consistent with our booked position. Mark will provide additional commentary on reserves and our recently published global loss triangles.

轉入儲備。在當前事故年度，我們繼續建立風險邊際。在再保險領域，我們認識到成熟的財產險業務取得了良好的發展。在保險方面，我們保持與預定立場一致。馬克將對儲備金和我們最近發布的全球損失三角提供進一步的評論。

Now turning to capital management, which remains a strategic priority for Everest. In the second quarter, we repurchased $200 million worth of shares. Year to date, we have returned $400 million to shareholders in the form of buybacks, repurchasing approximately 1.2 million shares.

現在轉向資本管理，這仍然是 Everest 的策略重點。第二季度，我們回購了價值2億美元的股票。今年迄今為止，我們已以回購的形式向股東返還了 4 億美元，回購了約 120 萬股。

In closing, I'm encouraged by our progress and strong performance this quarter. Reinsurance continues to produce excellent results. In insurance, the expertise and capabilities we've built in property and specialty lines globally are proving beneficial. Our renewal strategy in US casualty has already improved the quality of the portfolio, which we believe will result in more consistent profitability over time.

最後，我對我們本季的進展和強勁表現感到鼓舞。再保險繼續取得優異的業績。在保險領域，我們在全球範圍內的財產和專業險領域所累積的專業知識和能力已被證明是有益的。我們在美國意外險領域的更新策略已經提高了投資組合的質量，我們相信隨著時間的推移這將帶來更穩定的獲利能力。

Looking ahead, we remain focused on executing across both businesses, managing the cycle with discipline, and building long-term value for shareholders. With that, I'll turn the call over to Mark.

展望未來，我們將繼續專注於兩項業務的執行、有紀律地管理週期以及為股東創造長期價值。說完這些，我會把電話轉給馬克。

Thank you, Jim, and good morning, everyone. Everest delivered a strong second quarter, generating $734 million of net operating income, an operating return on equity of 19.6%, and an annualized total shareholder return of 14.8%. Our results this quarter reflect strong contributions from both underwriting and our investment portfolio.

謝謝你，吉姆，大家早安。Everest 在第二季表現強勁，實現淨營業收入 7.34 億美元，營業股本回報率為 19.6%，年化股東總回報率為 14.8%。本季度的業績反映了承保和投資組合的強勁貢獻。

Starting with group results. Everest reported gross written premiums of $4.7 billion, representing a 0.7% decrease in constant dollars and excluding reinstatement premiums. As Jim mentioned, the combined ratio was 90.4% for the quarter, and these strong results were driven by relatively light catastrophe losses and favorable prior year reserve development from well-seasoned attritional property reinsurance reserves, representing a 1-point benefit to the combined ratio.

從小組結果開始。Everest 報告其總承保保費為 47 億美元，以不變美元計算下降了 0.7%，且不包括複效保費。正如吉姆所提到的，本季的綜合比率為 90.4%，而這些強勁的業績是由相對較輕的災難損失和去年經驗豐富的自然減損財產再保險準備金帶來的有利準備金發展所推動的，這為綜合比率帶來了 1 個百分點的好處。

This was partially offset by aviation-related losses associated with the UK court ruling, which contributed 2.5 points to the group combined ratio. The group attritional loss ratio increased 1.3 points to 60.1% in the quarter.

這部分被與英國法院裁決相關的航空相關損失所抵消，導致集團綜合成本率下降 2.5 個百分點。本季集團流失率上升1.3個百分點至60.1%。

Moving to Reinsurance. Gross written premiums increased 1.6% in constant dollars when adjusting for reinstatement premiums during the quarter. Consistent with prior quarters, solid growth in property and specialty lines were partially offset by continued discipline in casualty lines. The combined ratio was 85.6%, an improvement of 3.3 points from the prior year. Favorable prior year development contributed 1.3 points to the improvement.

轉向再保險。本季度，按恢復保費進行調整後，總承保保費以不變美元計算增長了 1.6%。與前幾季一致，財產保險和專業保險的穩健成長被意外險的持續嚴格控制所部分抵銷。綜合成本率為85.6%，較前一年提高3.3個百分點。去年的良好發展為這一增長貢獻了 1.3 個百分點。

Catastrophe losses were de minimis this quarter, while the prior year quarter included $120 million or 5 points on the combined ratio. The aviation losses associated with the Russia-Ukraine war of $98 million added 3.2 points to the reinsurance combined ratio. And we included these in a separate line item, as you would have seen in our earnings release and financial supplement. There were $14 million of reinstatement premiums associated with the aviation losses, bringing the net loss to $84 million.

本季的巨災損失微乎其微，而去年同期的巨災損失為 1.2 億美元，綜合比率為 5 個百分點。俄烏戰爭造成的航空損失達 9,800 萬美元，使再保險綜合成本率增加了 3.2 個百分點。我們將這些內容包含在單獨的項目中，正如您在我們的收益報告和財務補充中所看到的那樣。與航空損失相關的恢復保費為 1,400 萬美元，使淨損失達到 8,400 萬美元。

Moving to Insurance. Gross premiums written decreased 3.3% in constant dollars to $1.4 billion. Strong growth in other specialty and Accident and Health was more than offset by the aggressive actions we are taking in US casualty lines, centered around our 1 renewal strategy. As a result, Specialty Casualty gross written premiums fell to 22.2% of the Insurance segment mix, a decrease of over 7 points from the prior year quarter.

轉向保險業。以不變美元計算，毛保費收入下降 3.3% 至 14 億美元。我們圍繞著「1.0 更新策略」在美國意外險領域採取的積極行動，抵消了其他專業險和意外與健康險的強勁增長。結果，特殊意外險毛承保保費佔保險業務總額的比重下降至 22.2%，較去年同期下降了 7 個百分點。

The attritional loss ratio increased to 68.7% this quarter, reflecting our disciplined approach to setting and sustaining prudent loss picks as we build risk margin in our US casualty lines given the elevated risk environment.

本季的損失率上升至 68.7%，這反映出我們在風險環境升高的情況下建立美國意外險的風險保證金時，採取了製定和維持審慎損失選擇的嚴謹方法。

The 2024 global loss triangles we posted to our website in late June reflect the decisive reserving actions taken at year end. And we also enhanced the level of disclosure by adding detail and commentary to each line of business, and we plan to continue enhancing our disclosures moving forward and provide additional information around our reserve position.

我們在 6 月底發佈到網站上的 2024 年全球損失三角形反映了年底採取的果斷儲備行動。我們還透過為每個業務線添加細節和評論來提高披露水平，我們計劃繼續加強我們的披露工作，並提供有關我們的儲備狀況的更多資訊。

Our Q2 US casualty loss development is consistent with our expectations, and social inflation dynamics persist at levels that are within our assumptions. While it is still early, we believe the conservatism we are applying to our loss picks in conjunction with our underwriting actions and improved portfolio quality is building risk margin in our portfolio. Overall, the reserve position of our Insurance division is adequate.

我們第二季美國傷亡損失的發展與我們的預期一致，社會通膨動態持續保持在我們假設的水平。雖然現在還為時過早，但我們相信，我們在損失選擇上採取的保守態度，加上我們的核保行動和投資組合品質的提高，正在建立我們投資組合的風險保證金。整體而言，我們保險部門的儲備狀況充足。

The underwriting related expense ratio was 18.9%, with the increase driven by slower casualty earned premium growth from our 1 renewal strategy as well as the continued investment in our global platform. In the Other segment, the quarter includes a $20 million loss provision for our Intellectual Property business, which is in runoff, and the segment's combined ratio was also impacted by catastrophe losses of $10 million.

承保相關費用率為 18.9%，成長的原因是我們的 1 續保策略導致意外保險保費成長放緩，以及對我們全球平台的持續投資。在其他部門，本季包括我們智慧財產權業務的 2,000 萬美元損失準備金，該業務正在流失，該部門的綜合比率也受到 1,000 萬美元災難損失的影響。

Moving on, net investment income increased to $532 million for the quarter, driven by higher assets under management and alternative assets generated $110 million of net investment income in the quarter and benefited from strong returns in private equity investments.

繼續，本季淨投資收入增至 5.32 億美元，這得益於管理資產規模的增加和另類資產在本季度產生了 1.1 億美元的淨投資收入，並受益於私募股權投資的強勁回報。

Overall, our book yield decreased slightly to 4.6%, as foreign currency bonds with lower yields become a larger proportion of our portfolio. While our reinvestment rate remains north of 5%, we continue to have a short asset duration of approximately 3.4 years, and the fixed income portfolio benefits from an average credit rating of AA-.

總體而言，我們的帳面收益率略有下降至 4.6%，因為收益率較低的外幣債券在我們的投資組合中所佔比例較大。雖然我們的再投資率仍保持在 5% 以上，但我們的資產期限仍然較短，約為 3.4 年，固定收益投資組合受益於 AA- 的平均信用評級。

For the second quarter of 2025, our operating income tax rate was 16.4%, which was just below our working assumption of 17% to 18% for the year. Shareholders' equity ended the quarter at $15 billion, or $15.3 billion when excluding $252 million of net unrealized depreciation on available for sale fixed income securities.

2025 年第二季度，我們的營業收入稅率為 16.4%，略低於我們預計的全年 17% 至 18% 的稅率。本季末股東權益為 150 億美元，若扣除可供出售固定收益證券的 2.52 億美元淨未實現折舊，則股東權益為 153 億美元。

Book value per share ended the quarter at $358.8, an improvement of 12.1% from year-end 2024 when adjusted for dividends of $4 per share year to date. We continue to view share repurchases attractively as we repurchased 581,000 shares in the quarter, amounting to $200 million or an average of $344.30 per share, and we expect to take a tempered approach in the third quarter given wind season. And all other things being equal, we expect to look to resume the pace of share repurchases in the fourth quarter and into 2026.

本季末每股帳面價值為 358.8 美元，較 2024 年底（根據年初至今每股 4 美元的股息進行調整）成長 12.1%。我們繼續認為股票回購具有吸引力，因為我們在本季度回購了 581,000 股，總額為 2 億美元，平均每股 344.30 美元，考慮到風季，我們預計第三季將採取溫和的方式。在其他條件相同的情況下，我們預計第四季和 2026 年將恢復股票回購的步伐。

And with that, I'll turn the call back over to Matt.

說完這些，我會把電話轉回給馬特。

Thanks, Mark. Operator, we're now ready to open the line for questions. We do ask you limit your questions to one question plus one follow up, then rejoin the queue for any additional questions. Keith, over to you.

謝謝，馬克。接線員，我們現在可以開始回答問題了。我們確實要求您將問題限制為一個問題加上一個後續問題，然後重新加入隊列以回答任何其他問題。基思，交給你了。

(Operator Instructions) Andrew Andersen, Jefferies.

（操作員指示）安德魯·安德森，傑富瑞。

The underlying loss ratio insurance about 69% and if we look at year over year about 6-point increase, which is essentially the risk margin put in place. Over the next kind of one to two years, should we think of that 6% staying in place, but perhaps there's some benefit on mix shift to international and short tail?

基礎損失率保險約為 69%，如果我們看同比情況，則增加約 6 個百分點，這基本上就是風險保證金。在接下來的一到兩年內，我們是否應該考慮保持 6% 的水平，但向國際和短尾轉變也許會帶來一些好處？

Andrew, it's Mark. I think the approach that we want to take on this, there's a few pieces to unpack here. So obviously, we're committed to a risk margin given the uncertainty (technical difficulty). I think 2025 is a little heavier than we might see in the future, given the runoff of the older unremediated portfolio stemming from essentially Q3 last year.

安德魯，我是馬克。我認為我們要採取的方法是，這裡有幾個部分需要解開。顯然，考慮到不確定性，我們致力於風險保證金（技術難度）。考慮到去年第三季以來未修復的舊投資組合的流失，我認為 2025 年的情況會比我們未來可能看到的要嚴重一些。

Having said that, we're going to make sure that the data is supporting any conclusions that lead us to reduce the need for elevated loss picks, including that risk margin. I do think the mix of business will provide a meaningful impact in the overall loss ratio as it evolves and the net earned premium begins to grow in.

話雖如此，我們將確保數據支持任何導致我們減少高損失選擇需求的結論，包括風險保證金。我確實認為，隨著業務組合的發展和淨保費收入的成長，它將對整體損失率產生重大影響。

And to your point, the combination of the International business that we're writing and the increase in short tail lines here in North America are going to be the principal drivers of that. And I would also point to the fact that the percentage of casualty is -- has been reduced almost 7 points to a little over 22% in the second quarter's composition.

正如您所說，我們正在進行的國際業務和北美短尾航線的增加將成為實現這一目標的主要驅動力。我還要指出的是，第二季的傷亡率已下降近 7 個百分點，至略高於 22%。

So you can see that trend starting in place. The [yarn] will take a while to catch up, but that's kind of the overall view.

所以你可以看到這種趨勢已經開始。[紗線]需要一段時間才能趕上，但這就是總體觀點。

Thanks. And then on the expense, I think I heard you say some international investments. Were they maybe a little bit lumpier this quarter? And perhaps you could just talk about how you're thinking about the pace of international investments in insurance?

謝謝。關於費用，我想我聽到您提到了一些國際投資。本季他們的表現是不是有點不穩定？或許您可以談談您對國際保險投資步伐的看法？

Yeah, it's a bit lumpier. International is growing at a faster pace than North America. So proportionately becomes a larger component of the combined ratio. I think the key thing to look at with the expense ratio evolution in insurance is really our ability to leverage the infrastructure that we've built and continue to build in terms of premium evolution. It's really scaling that premium and the commensurate net earned premium that is going to cause that ratio to diminish over time.

是的，它有點粗糙。國際成長速度比北美更快。因此按比例成為綜合比率中較大的組成部分。我認為，保險費用率演變的關鍵在於我們是否有能力利用我們已經建立的並將繼續建造的保費演變基礎設施。這實際上是在擴大保費和相應的淨保費收入，從而導致該比率隨著時間的推移而減少。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Alex Scott, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的亞歷克斯·斯科特。

I wanted to ask about the Accident and Health growth. Certainly, in some areas of A&H stop loss, I think it's a harder market. And so maybe there's a good opportunity there. On the other hand, I think some of the health insurers have been experience in medical cost inflation is pressuring their businesses. So I'm just interested if you could provide a little more color on what you're doing there. Any nuances to the way you're approaching that market and growing just given a little more uncertainty for loss cost trend?

我想詢問一下意外和健康成長的情況。當然，在 A&H 停損的一些領域，我認為市場更加困難。所以也許那裡有一個很好的機會。另一方面，我認為一些健康保險公司已經經歷了醫療成本上漲給他們的業務帶來壓力。因此，如果您能提供更多關於您在那裡所做的事情的詳細信息，我很感興趣。考慮到損失成本趨勢的不確定性，您在進入該市場和發展該市場的方式上有何細微差別？

Sure, Alex. Good question. Look, we like the Accident and Health business. We have significantly diminished the health portion of A&H for us. We really should say accident and we are growing our Accident business, both in the US and in our International business at a strong clip.

當然，亞歷克斯。好問題。看，我們喜歡意外和健康業務。我們已經大大減少了 A&H 的健康部分。我們確實應該說是事故，而且我們的事故業務正在強勁成長，無論是在美國還是在國際業務中。

The type of business we're writing, things like business travel accident, where companies are procuring coverage for executives who are traveling around the world, participant accident where you have various groups who want accident cover for -- could be things like sports participation, nonprofit organizations, et cetera.

我們承保的業務類型包括商務旅行事故（公司為在世界各地旅行的高管購買保險）、參與者事故（有各種團體需要事故保險）——可能是體育參與、非營利組織等。

And so that's the kind of premium we're putting on the books. That tends to be very consistent performing. You're talking about very low severity, more of a frequency business, and the performance of that portfolio for us has been strong, which is why we're leaning into it.

這就是我們在帳面上所賦予的溢價。這往往是非常一致的表現。您說的是嚴重程度非常低、更多的是頻率業務，而該投資組合的表現對我們來說一直很強勁，這就是我們傾向於它的原因。

Got it. Follow-up question, I guess, just on reinsurance and the renewals. Can you talk a bit more about what you saw in terms of the terms and conditions and the competitive environment on that front? And just how you're seeing the trade-off between the growth and returns you can get versus capital return? And pretty attractive stock price to be buying that?

知道了。我想，後續問題只是關於再保險和續保。您能否詳細談談您所看到的條款和條件以及這方面的競爭環境？您如何看待成長和回報與資本回報之間的權衡？而且股價還很吸引人，值得買嗎？

Sure. Look, if you look at both the June 1 and July 1 renewals, our big midyear renewals, I think it's a pretty consistent story. So it -- at June 1, we had obviously the Florida renewal, as I indicated in my prepared remarks, overall pricing was flat, and generally, terms and conditions are not moving, which I think is a terrific sign and speaks to the underlying discipline in the property cat market.

當然。你看，如果你看 6 月 1 日和 7 月 1 日的續約，也就是我們年中的重要續約，我認為這是一個相當一致的故事。因此，正如我在準備好的發言中所指出的，6 月 1 日我們顯然在佛羅裡達州進行了續約，總體價格持平，一般來說，條款和條件沒有變動，我認為這是一個很好的跡象，表明了房地產市場的基本紀律。

And I think my expectation is certainly that that's going to sustain itself. And then with respect to 7/1, obviously, you have a much more diverse renewal with a number of markets around the world, having significant renewal dates. Their rates down slightly. But again, terms and conditions hold.

我認為我的期望肯定是這種情況將會持續下去。然後關於 7/1，顯然，您的續約將更加多樣化，全球許多市場都有重要的續約日期。他們的利率略有下降。但同樣，條款和條件仍然有效。

So you just see this very consistent view that says that discipline in the market is going to be sustained. And again, it informs our expectations as we go forward. And that's why we grew at the (inaudible) renewal. And in the pockets of the 7/1 renewal that we really liked, we also were able to deploy more capacity at really attractive margins.

因此，您會看到這種非常一致的觀點，即市場紀律將會持續下去。再次，它告知了我們前進的期望。這就是我們在（聽不清楚）更新中成長的原因。在我們真正喜歡的 7/1 續約中，我們也能夠以非常有吸引力的利潤率部署更多產能。

In terms of the trade-off between capital return and growth into the property cat market, I mean, the most important thing to note is we're doing both, and we have the capital strength to do both. I will say, though, that if you look at the expected return from property cat pretty much everywhere in the world and certainly in our peak zones like Southeast Windstorm or California earthquake and a bunch of the Japan, et cetera, the ROEs are still very, very strong, and I think would even exceed the attractiveness of repurchase.

就資本回報和房地產市場成長之間的權衡而言，我的意思是，最重要的是我們同時在做這兩件事，而且我們擁有同時做這兩件事的資本實力。不過，我想說的是，如果你看一下世界各地房地產巨災的預期回報，尤其是在東南風暴或加州地震以及日本等地的峰值區域，ROE 仍然非常非常強勁，我認為甚至會超過回購的吸引力。

So that's why we're continuing the strategy of pursuing both actions.

這就是我們繼續推行這兩項行動策略的原因。

Got it. That's helpful. Thank you.

知道了。這很有幫助。謝謝。

Gregory Peters, Raymond James.

格雷戈里彼得斯、雷蒙德詹姆斯。

I'm going to focus my first question on just the continuation on the pricing commentary. Listening to the broker calls and some of the other companies that have reported so far, we're hearing of pricing -- more pricing pressure than it seems to be that you're conveying that happened in your renewal.

我的第一個問題將集中在價格評論的延續上。透過聽取經紀人的電話和其他一些公司迄今為止的報告，我們了解到定價壓力比您在續約時傳達的要大。

Maybe it's more focused on the facultative market as opposed to the treaty market, but maybe you can just unpack why we're hearing about more pricing pressure, specifically on the 7/1 renewals than maybe you're talking to us about?

也許它更側重於臨時市場而不是條約市場，但也許您可以解釋為什麼我們聽到的定價壓力更大，特別是在 7/1 續約方面，而不是您與我們談論的？

Sure, Greg. I mean -- well, first of all, just to sort of contrast the 6/1 and the 7/1 renewal, I would say rate at the 6/1 renewal for Everest book was flat. The July renewal was down marginally, so call it in the 5% to 10% range. And again, you have a much more diverse set of renewals that are happening at 7/1, which is so Florida focused. And so -- and again, I think that's pretty consistent with what we've seen.

當然，格雷格。我的意思是——首先，只是為了對比 6/1 和 7/1 的續訂，我想說 Everest 書籍 6/1 的續訂費率是持平的。7 月續約量略有下降，因此降幅在 5% 至 10% 之間。再次強調，7 月 1 日將進行更多樣化的續約，這主要集中在佛羅裡達州。所以——我再次認為這與我們所看到的情況非常一致。

The fact that the 6/1 renewal, the fact that we write the vast majority of our programs at nonconcurrent terms, whether that's pricing, terms, conditions, et cetera, certainly speaks to part of that. I think it also has a lot to do with the choices that individual underwriters are making.

6/1 續約的事實，以及我們以非同時條款編寫的絕大多數計劃的事實，無論是定價、條款、條件等等，都無疑說明了其中的一部分。我認為這也與個別承銷商的選擇有很大關係。

If you're trying to position your cat portfolio at the very high layers, which is more risk remote, where you're competing with cat bond capacity, you probably are seeing more price pressure. We feel like we're in a sweet spot. We're away from the attritional losses. We're a lead market, and so we're getting to drive a lot of the underwriting action that's happening on the programs we're participating in.

如果您試圖將您的巨災投資組合定位在非常高的層次，即風險較小，與巨災債券承保能力競爭，您可能會看到更大的價格壓力。我們感覺自己處於最佳狀態。我們已遠離消耗性損失。我們處於領先市場，因此我們要推動我們所參與的專案中發生的許多承保行動。

And so we're not feeling the degree of price competition that maybe some brokers are speaking to. And then lastly, I think your instinct is right, which is they're dealing with a very broad set of data. It crosses treaty. They could absolutely be speaking about facultative individual risk is more competitive than treaty in my view. And then, of course, retail insurance is more competitive still.

因此，我們並沒有感受到一些經紀人所說的價格競爭程度。最後，我認為你的直覺是正確的，他們正在處理一組非常廣泛的數據。它違反了條約。在我看來，他們絕對可以談論任意個人風險比條約更具競爭力。當然，零售保險的競爭力仍然更強。

So that, I would imagine, explain some of the difference.

因此，我想這可以解釋一些差異。

Yeah. Thanks for the color. Just using the same format on the Insurance segment, I think your business mix skews to the larger side of the market versus the small and midsized market. And in insurance, we're hearing and seeing some pressure on rate there. I understand you're 1 renewal position on casualty, I see the growth in Accident and Health.

是的。謝謝你的顏色。僅在保險領域使用相同的格式，我認為您的業務組合偏向較大的市場而不是中小型市場。在保險方面，我們聽到並看到了一些利率壓力。我知道您在意外險方面有 1 個續保職位，我看到了意外險和健康險的增長。

Just trying to help -- if you could just help us sort of understand the moving pieces against what we feel like is increasing price competition in the larger end of the Insurance segment?

只是想幫忙——您能否幫助我們理解我們認為保險領域較大領域價格競爭日益激烈的動態因素？

Yeah. Well, first of all, that's right. The larger end of the market in retail insurance for property is definitely more competitive. Now, similar to comments I would make about treaty property on the reinsurance side, one of the reasons it's more competitive is because it corrected so strongly to the upside over the last several years that you've got significant embedded margin in those programs, and that's going to attract competition.

是的。嗯，首先，這是對的。零售財產保險市場的較大端無疑競爭更加激烈。現在，與我對再保險方面的條約財產的評論類似，它更具競爭力的原因之一是因為它在過去幾年中進行瞭如此強勁的上行修正，以至於您在這些計劃中獲得了可觀的嵌入式利潤，這將吸引競爭。

So it's important, in my mind, to distinguish between what rate change is doing and then where you think you are relative to adequacy. And we still feel like a lot of these programs are above what we consider adequate pricing to take risk.

因此，在我看來，區分利率變動的影響和你認為自己的利率是否足夠是很重要的。我們仍然覺得，許多這類專案的定價都超出了我們認為可以承擔風險的合理範圍。

But we are growing more selective. And you saw in the numbers that I described in my prepared remarks, are North America insurance -- Property Insurance business is more in a flat to down slightly mode at this point as we grow more selective. Now you look globally, and particularly in the international markets, slightly different competitive dynamic and also more of what I would call sort of upper middle market accounts. And we're seeing, again, very adequate pricing, and we're leaning into that and growing.

但我們的選擇性正在增強。你們從我準備好的發言中描述的數字中看到，隨著我們變得更加挑剔，北美保險——財產保險業務目前處於平穩或略有下降的模式。現在，放眼全球，特別是在國際市場，競爭動態略有不同，而且我稱之為中上市場帳戶的情況也更多。我們再次看到非常合理的定價，我們正朝著這個方向發展並不斷成長。

And so we continue to feel like the property market is very attractive. And then to your broader point, there are a lot of other parts of this market where we see attractive opportunities. We certainly talked about Accident and Health. I think our global specialties, and this is both a Reinsurance and Insurance comment.

因此我們仍然覺得房地產市場非常有吸引力。然後回到您更廣泛的觀點，我們在這個市場的許多其他領域看到了誘人的機會。我們當然談論了事故和健康。我認為我們的全球專長，這既是再保險也是保險評論。

We're growing strongly in areas like engineering and marine and our Parametric book. There's an energy transition taking place that we all know about that's providing terrific opportunities. So plenty of things for us to do in terms of deploying capital at very attractive returns.

我們在工程、海洋和參數書籍等領域發展強勁。我們都知道，正在發生的能源轉型將帶來巨大的機會。因此，在以極具吸引力的回報部署資本方面，我們可以做很多事情。

Thanks for the additional detail.

感謝您提供的更多詳細資訊。

Josh Shanker, Bank of America.

美國銀行的喬許‧尚克（Josh Shanker）。

I want to continue on the theme of, I guess, maybe not pricing, but cat a little bit. So PMLs were up in the quarter. They're up year over year. I think that's possible to say that maybe you could have and should have deployed more capital at risk a year ago, but hindsight 50-50 or 20-20. Can you talk a little about your desire to increase your PMLs into what some people are describing as softening markets?

我想繼續討論這個主題，我想，也許不是定價，而是一點點貓。因此本季 PML 有所上升。它們的數量逐年增加。我認為可以這麼說，也許你一年前就可以並且應該部署更多的風險資本，但事後看來，可能性只有 50-50 或 20-20。您能否簡單談談您希望在一些人所說的疲軟市場中增加 PML 的願望？

Yeah, Josh. Look, I think the first thing, just in terms of the premise of your question, we talk about softening. One of the things I'd like to remind folks about is that if -- if we were sitting at a price level that we experienced that this industry experienced in 2017, '18, '19 and then suddenly rates corrected to where they are now, we would call it one of the greatest hard markets in living memory.

是的，喬希。聽著，我認為首先，就你問題的前提而言，我們談論的是軟化。我想提醒大家的一件事是，如果我們處於 2017 年、2018 年、2019 年該行業所經歷的價格水平，然後價格突然調整到現在的水平，我們會稱之為有史以來最艱難的市場之一。

Rates are very strong in property cat. And I have absolutely no problem deploying incremental capacity for our best clients on well-structured accounts at the rates that we're receiving today and the rates, frankly, that I expect to be receiving next year.

房地產行業的利率非常高。我完全可以按照我們今天收到的利率以及坦率地說我預計明年將收到的利率，為我們結構良好的帳戶上的最佳客戶部署增量容量。

It's just simply -- these accounts are simply very, very well priced. In terms of the specific PMLs, it's always about risk and reward. And yes, we have increased net PMLs, but that's because of the pricing dynamics that I described and the attractive return profile that's available to us. It makes sense to take the risks we're taking. And we still remain well within the sort of risk guidelines that we've talked about every quarter with respect to earnings and capital at risk. So feeling good about that.

很簡單——這些帳戶的價格非常非常合理。對於具體的 PML 而言，它總是與風險和回報有關。是的，我們的淨 PML 有所增加，但這是因為我所描述的定價動態以及我們可以獲得的有吸引力的回報狀況。我們所承擔的風險是有意義的。我們仍然嚴格遵守我們每季討論過的有關收益和風險資本的風險準則。對此我感覺很好。

Just to break down the PML increase, some of that is certainly growth in our gross book in both divisions. And then we continue to optimize our hedging in terms of where we're purchasing our [cap ons], really focusing on managing tail exposures, offset somewhat by growth in assets under management in our Mt. Logan platform, which is doing a terrific job of raising funds.

僅就 PML 的成長而言，其中一部分肯定是我們兩個部門的總帳面收入的成長。然後，我們繼續優化我們在購買 [cap ons] 方面的對沖，真正專注於管理尾部風險敞口，但在一定程度上被我們 Mt. Logan 平台管理的資產的增長所抵消，該平台在籌集資金方面做得非常出色。

So when you balance all that out, I think we're making an excellent trade, and it's one that I expect to continue to play out in the coming renewal periods.

因此，當你平衡所有這些因素時，我認為我們正在進行一項非常出色的交易，我預計這種交易將在未來的更新期內繼續發揮作用。

By extension, is it wrong to say that maybe last year, you should have put more capital to work in PMLs and you're leaning into something that you've identified as an opportunity that was actually there last year. And two, the only other thing on the P&L, the PMLs currently are higher, I think, they were after the Katrina peak.

進一步說，如果說去年你應該在 PML 上投入更多資金，而你又傾向於去年就已存在的某個機會，這種說法是錯的嗎？其次，損益表中唯一的另一件事是，我認為 PML 目前較高，這是在卡崔娜颶風高峰之後發生的。

I'm just wondering, look, the system is very different at Everest. But I mean you're talking about how hard the market is, maybe scout and say, this is the real opportunity because a lot of you will say, oh, things are soft at this point in time right now, and you're actually deploying more capital. It looks like than you would have as a percentage of equity been 15 years ago?

我只是好奇，你看，珠穆朗瑪峰的系統非常不同。但我的意思是，你在談論市場有多難，也許偵察一下並說，這是真正的機會，因為你們很多人會說，哦，現在這個時候情況很疲軟，你實際上正在部署更多的資本。看起來您的股權百分比是 15 年前的嗎？

Yeah, Josh, I hate to repeat myself, but I think anyone that's describing the current cat environment is soft is not well informed. It is not soft. It may be softer than it was a year ago, rates have come down, whether that's 5, 10 points. But again, compared to where rates would have been -- and you can look at any of the broker rate indexes to prove this point out. They're up massively over where they were in the 20-teens.

是的，喬希，我不想重複自己的話，但我認為任何將當前貓的環境描述為軟弱的人都是不了解情況的。它不柔軟。它可能比一年前更疲軟，利率已經下降，無論是 5 個百分點還是 10 個百分點。但再次，與利率本來的水平相比——你可以查看任何經紀利率指數來證明這一點。與 20 世紀 10 年代相比，它們有了大幅增長。

This remains a very hard market. I'm not going to do the forensic accounting on where we were back in 2005, et cetera. But we think the risk/reward trade-off that's available to us today is pretty clear, and it speaks to the idea that we can deploy this capital and get rewarded for it.

這仍然是一個非常艱難的市場。我不會對我們 2005 年的情況進行法務會計等等。但我們認為，今天我們面臨的風險/回報權衡非常明確，這表明我們可以部署這些資本並獲得回報。

In terms of what we did last year, I mean, I don't see a lot of value in the retrospective other than to say, we're looking to -- where we want to grow on programs, we do it in a very disciplined fashion. You also have to reflect on the fact that clients, they don't always accept their markets doubling or tripling their line size in any given renewal. Some of these things you do have to work up over time, and we're certainly seeing that play out.

就我們去年所做的事情而言，我的意思是，我認為回顧除了說我們正在尋找——我們希望在專案上取得進展的地方，我們會以非常自律的方式去做之外，沒有太多的價值。您還必須考慮到這樣一個事實：客戶並不總是接受他們的市場在任何一次續約中將其產品線規模擴大一倍或兩倍。有些事情確實需要隨著時間的推移才能解決，而我們也確實看到了這種情況的發生。

Thank you very much.

非常感謝。

Brian Meredith, UBS.

瑞銀的 Brian Meredith。

Just two of them here. One just following on the P&L a little bit here, Jim. It looks like that where you did see some meaningful increase in exposure was hanging in to 120 and 150 year, particularly for the Southeast. Is it that you were kind of writing below the FHCF? Is that where the opportunities were. And is that also why maybe a rate that you guide was maybe better than the market because it's clearly where rate is probably better, down low.

這裡只有兩個。吉姆，這裡只是稍微關心一下損益表。看起來，您確實看到了一些有意義的曝光度增加，這種增加持續了 120 年和 150 年，特別是在東南部。您是在 FHCF 下面寫作嗎？那裡有機遇嗎？這是否也是為什麼您指導的利率可能比市場利率更好的原因，因為顯然利率較低時可能會更好。

And then also, should we expect potentially more susceptibility to, call it, lower-sized hurricanes here this season?

那麼，我們是否應該預期本季這裡更容易受到小型颶風的影響？

Sure, Brian. Look, the first thing I really just have to sort of reset the question a little bit in so far as I don't consider 120 or 150 down low. And if you go back to the pre 2023 rate correction down low would have been a 1 in 3, 1 in 4 maybe 1 in 5. So I feel like when you're trading at a 120 to 150, you're in the heart of these cat programs. And I do think it -- the fact that that's where we've been very consistently playing by the way, over the last couple of years.

當然，布萊恩。瞧，首先我真的需要稍微重新審視一下這個問題，因為我不認為 120 或 150 太低了。如果你回顧 2023 年之前的利率調整，那麼低點將是 1/3、1/4 甚至 1/5。所以我覺得當你以 120 到 150 的價格進行交易時，你就處於這些貓計劃的核心。我確實這麼認為——順便說一下，事實上，過去幾年我們一直都在那裡打球。

The fact that, that's our sweet spot certainly helped a bit on the rate change side because you're really seeing maximum competition in the more risk remote layers and especially where you start talking about competing with the cat bond players.

事實上，這是我們的最佳點，這無疑對利率變化方面有一定的幫助，因為你確實看到了風險更小的層級中的最大競爭，特別是當你開始談論與巨災債券參與者競爭時。

So I just -- I really don't see that as down low. And it's really consistent. It has nothing to do with sort of external factors. It's where we see the best risk-adjusted returns for these programs that we're participating on.

所以我只是——我真的不認為這是低級的。而且它確實很一致。這與外界因素無關。在這裡，我們看到了我們所參與的這些專案的最佳風險調整回報。

Makes sense. Thanks And then just pivot over to the Insurance segment. Just (inaudible), were there any changes? Or have you made any changes as far as the build-out of the, call it, European or International Insurance kind of business. I mean, we're still seeing it obviously. But any changes under your leadership? And when you think and where are we in that process? I know that can be quite expensive to build out an International Insurance operation.

有道理。謝謝，然後轉到保險領域。只是（聽不清楚），有什麼改變嗎？或者您是否對所謂的歐洲或國際保險業務的建設做出了任何改變？我的意思是，我們仍然明顯地看到這一點。但是在您的領導下有什麼改變嗎？您認為我們處於這個過程的哪個階段？我知道建立國際保險業務的成本可能相當高。

Yeah. So the first comment I would make, Brian, is I really -- I'm just so incredibly proud of the team that's building that business. And if you think about an organic build over a period of really just sort of three to four years, and getting a business to well north of $1 billion in premium, rapidly pushing $2 billion. And now turning an underwriting profit, I think that's a remarkable achievement. Many have tried, very few have succeeded, and we have certainly done that.

是的。所以布萊恩，我要說的第一句話是，我真的——我為創建這項業務的團隊感到無比自豪。如果你考慮在三到四年的時間內有機成長，那麼業務收入就會遠遠超過 10 億美元，並迅速達到 20 億美元。現在實現了承保盈利，我認為這是一項了不起的成就。許多人嘗試過，但很少人成功，而我們確實做到了。

In terms of the approach, there's consistency. I think one of the changes that we did make after I became CEO was to really just double down on the markets where we were already competing. And I think we are now represented, whether it's in Continental Europe and the UK market, in a couple of key markets in Latin America, or in the major broking centers in Asia, we have the geographic footprint that we need, and we're really just -- let's really focus on going deeper where we already have market access.

就方法而言，具有一致性。我認為，在我擔任執行長之後，我們做出的改變之一就是加倍投入我們已經參與競爭的市場。我認為，無論是在歐洲大陸和英國市場，還是在拉丁美洲的幾個主要市場，或者在亞洲的主要經紀中心，我們現在已經擁有了所需的地理覆蓋範圍，我們真的只是——讓我們真正專注於深入我們已經擁有市場准入的領域。

And that's beginning to really pay off. And you'll start to see it as the expense leverage gets into a better spot as the earned premium sort of catches up to the growth that we've been seeing. But the strategy, which is to be a lead market, to be a multinational market, to focus on large and specialty commercial risk, that has remained consistent and it's producing for us.

而這確實開始帶來回報。隨著費用槓桿進入更好的狀態，隨著賺取的保費趕上我們所看到的增長，你就會開始看到這一點。但我們的策略始終如一，那就是成為領先市場、成為跨國市場、專注於大型和專業商業風險，並且正在為我們帶來效益。

Excellent. Thank you.

出色的。謝謝。

Meyer Shields, Keefe, Bruyette, & Woods.

邁耶·希爾茲、基夫、布魯耶特和伍茲。

I want to start with the Reinsurance segment, specifically of the reserve releases. You talked about the book of business being well seasoned property. And given the tail typically associated with property, is it reasonable to assume that unless there's some sort of inflection in loss trends that this sort of reserve release is sustainable as more of your reserves enter that well season stage?

我想從再保險部分開始，特別是儲備金的釋放。您談到商業書籍是成熟的財產。考慮到尾部通常與財產相關，是否有理由假設，除非損失趨勢出現某種拐點，否則隨著更多的儲備進入井季階段，這種儲備釋放是可持續的？

Meyer, I think your premise is correct. Obviously, we've got to see that play out, but we're taking the approach of making sure that -- those reserves are well seasoned. We're obviously just taking a fraction. We do think we've got very significant embedded margin in the Reinsurance division as a whole. I think you've seen that demonstrated the last couple of years with meaningful reserve releases in multiple lines led by property.

邁耶，我認為你的前提是正確的。顯然，我們必須看到這種情況的發生，但我們正在採取的方法是確保這些儲備人員經驗豐富。顯然，我們只取了一小部分。我們確實認為，我們在整個再保險部門擁有非常可觀的內含利潤。我想你已經看到了這一點，過去幾年，以房地產為首的多個行業的儲備金都有了有意義的釋放。

So right now, we feel very confident. It's been a consistent driver of margin in the business, and it's something that we see all things being equal, after it seasons being released into the quarterly P&Ls.

所以現在，我們感到非常有信心。它一直是業務利潤率的持續驅動力，在季度損益表中發布後，我們會看到所有條件都相同。

Okay. Fantastic. That's good to hear. On the International segment, if you -- can you talk about, I guess, the books exposure to deflation outside of the United States as a result of US tariffs? I mean, on premium on the loss side?

好的。極好的。聽到這個消息真好。在國際部分，您能否談談由於美國關稅導緻美國以外地區的通貨緊縮情況？我的意思是，損失方面的保費是多少？

Yeah. Meyer, I mean, it's a fair question. I mean, deflation on the loss side, living in a highly inflationary environment, particularly here in US casualty, I'd almost welcome some deflation. It would be a pleasant alternative. In terms of tariff activity and the (inaudible) on the business, I mean, obviously, we monitor it.

是的。邁耶，我的意思是，這是一個公平的問題。我的意思是，損失方面的通貨緊縮，生活在高度通貨膨脹的環境中，特別是在美國傷亡中，我幾乎歡迎一些通貨緊縮。這將是一個令人愉快的選擇。就關稅活動和（聽不清楚）業務而言，我的意思是，顯然我們會對其進行監控。

But at the end of the day, if you look at where we are international, we are barely beginning to scratch the surface of the markets we're competing in. And so, in terms of a headwind in opportunity and revenue, it's not on my radar really. I mean, we're focused on delivering a better value proposition to clients that resonates with them. And if we do that, we gain market share irrespective of any kind of turbulence in the external environment.

但歸根結底，如果你看看我們在國際上的地位，我們才剛開始觸及我們所競爭的市場的表面。因此，就機會和收入的逆風而言，這實際上不在我的考慮範圍內。我的意思是，我們專注於向客戶提供能夠引起他們共鳴的更好的價值主張。如果我們這樣做，無論外部環境如何動盪，我們都能獲得市場份額。

And then obviously, the piece -- when it comes to tariffs, the piece we do watch closely is loss cost trend here in the US, and we've seen no indication that, at least so far, that the tariffs have contributed to any sort of uptick in loss costs.

然後顯然，當談到關稅時，我們密切關注的是美國損失成本趨勢，我們還沒有看到任何跡象表明，至少到目前為止，關稅導致了損失成本的任何上升。

Okay. Fantastic. Thank you so much.

好的。極好的。太感謝了。

Michael Zaremski, BMO Capital Markets.

蒙特利爾銀行資本市場 (BMO Capital Markets) 的 Michael Zaremski。

Follow up on the expense ratio tick up. I believe the commentary for Mark and you all has been that we should be thinking about operating leverage. So once, I guess the 1 renewal strategy concludes we should start seeing some improvement -- in terms of the casualty growth, nonrenewal strategy, once that's over, is -- would that book start growing at kind of low doubles because that's where pricing is? Or how do we think about kind of juxtaposing the growth versus the expense ratio over the coming year?

追蹤費用率的上升情況。我相信馬克和你們所有人的評論都是，我們應該考慮經營槓桿。因此，我想一旦 1 個續約策略結束，我們就應該開始看到一些改善 - 就傷亡增長而言，非續約策略一旦結束 - 這本書是否會開始以低倍數增長，因為那是定價的地方？或者我們如何考慮在未來一年將成長與費用率進行比較？

Sure, Mike. Well, first of all, just in terms of where the casualty book is going to go and the opportunities we see in insurance, as we indicated, we will complete the casualty remediation in the third quarter. And I will just comment, I've done a number of book cleanup activities in my career, and I have never seen a remediation process executed this aggressively or with this much precision.

當然，麥克。嗯，首先，就傷亡險帳簿的去向以及我們在保險領域看到的機會而言，正如我們所指出的，我們將在第三季完成傷亡補救。我只想說，在我的職業生涯中，我做過許多書籍清理活動，但我從未見過如此積極或如此精確的補救過程。

We literally -- and I don't want to replay the whole history because I know you guys have been following it closely, but we literally developed action plans for each and every one of our casualty accounts. And in the entire year that we've been working away at this. I can count on one hand the number of times that our planned activity or planned actions did not take place.

我們確實——我不想重演整個歷史，因為我知道你們一直在密切關注，但我們確實為每個傷亡帳戶制定了行動計劃。我們整整一年都在為此努力。我可以用一隻手數出我們計劃的活動或計劃的行動沒有進行的次數。

So it's just exceptional and will wrap up very shortly. So look, after remediation is done, if you think about the other parts of the book, I talked a lot about them in my prepared remarks, whether it's our Specialty businesses, and that's in North America and an international comment, Accident and Health, really accident as the prior questions as we discussed.

所以這很特別，很快就會結束。因此，在補救措施完成後，如果您考慮一下本書的其他部分，我在準備好的評論中已經談了很多，無論是我們的專業業務，還是在北美和國際評論、事故和健康，真的是事故，就像我們之前討論過的問題一樣。

Property, shorttail lines, marine, all growing very strongly. Casualty in international markets is growing today. It's not offsetting the actions we're taking in North America, but it's growing very nicely. And I expect all of those things to continue.

房地產、短尾航線、海運均成長強勁。當今國際市場的傷亡日益增加。它並沒有抵消我們在北美採取的行動，但它的成長非常順利。我希望所有這些事情都能繼續下去。

And then as I -- again, as I said in my prepared remarks, we're open for business and casualty. We spend a lot of time engaging risk managers from some of the leading companies here in the US. On their casualty programs, we want to write those deals when they're well priced and well structured. And so I would not be opposed to the idea that at some point the casualty book starts growing again.

然後，正如我——再次，正如我在準備好的演講中所說的那樣，我們對業務和傷亡持開放態度。我們花費大量時間與美國一些領先公司的風險經理接觸。對於他們的意外險計劃，我們希望在價格合理、結構良好的情況下簽訂這些交易。因此，我並不反對傷亡記錄在某個時候再次開始增長的想法。

It obviously also has a lot of rate momentum. But we're only going to do that where the pricing, the terms, the conditions, the quality of the underwriting and the underlying risk meets our conditions. It's -- we're not here focused on producing a top-line growth outcome. It's about building the right portfolio that's sustainable and profitable. And I see an awful lot of things happening in the business that indicate we'll be able to do that.

顯然，它也具有很大的利率動量。但我們只有在定價、條款、條件、承保品質和潛在風險符合我們的條件時才會這樣做。我們在這裡並不專注於實現營收成長。這是為了建立可持續且有利可圖的正確投資組合。我看到行業中發生的很多事情表明我們能夠做到這一點。

Okay. Got it. That's helpful. My follow up is just on the London court decision. Is this now behind us? Or is there still some limit or, I guess, potential for movement there? And I guess also just you guys added a lot of risk margin on the casualty side. Was this not contemplated when you took the actions earlier this year to kind of add to the (inaudible) issue?

好的。知道了。這很有幫助。我只是在跟進倫敦法院的判決。這一切已經過去了嗎？或者我猜那裡是否仍然存在一些限制，或者存在運動的潛力？我想你們也在傷亡方面增加了很多風險邊際。當您今年早些時候採取行動來加劇（聽不清楚）問題時，難道沒有考慮到這一點嗎？

Yeah. So with respect to the first part of your question, our view is barring any totally unexpected shift in future legal decisions. This is done and dusted for us. We took a very conservative approach to selecting the number that we posted in the quarter. And now it's behind us as far as I'm concerned.

是的。因此，關於您問題的第一部分，我們的觀點是，禁止未來的法律判決出現任何完全出乎意料的轉變。對我們來說，這一切都已經完成了。我們採取了非常保守的方式來選擇本季發布的數字。就我而言，現在這一切都已經過去了。

Look, as we said when the Russian invasion of the Ukraine took place and Russia sees these aircraft, we did not have enough information at that point to make an informed decision about the ultimate loss from the aviation seizure because there were so many legal issues related to it and in terms of the coverage that would ultimately be applied. And that's why we have not posted a reserve for it until we got that clarity through this court decision. So it really bears no relation to any of the reserve actions that we took last year.

你看，正如我們所說的，當俄羅斯入侵烏克蘭並且俄羅斯看到這些飛機時，我們當時沒有足夠的資訊來對航空劫持的最終損失做出明智的決定，因為與之相關的法律問題以及最終適用的保險範圍方面有很多問題。這就是為什麼我們沒有為其設立儲備金，直到透過法院判決得到明確回應。所以它實際上與我們去年採取的任何儲備行動都沒有任何關係。

Understood. Thank you.

明白了。謝謝。

Dave Motemaden, Evercore ISI.

Dave Motemaden，Evercore ISI。

Just had a question on the attritional loss ratio in the Reinsurance business. So I did see, obviously, the releases there on the property side. You mentioned mix shift and that was driving the 30 basis points improvement there. Did you make any changes to your forward view of the loss picks on that Property business as well as the -- just given the releases that you experienced?

我剛剛對再保險業務的損耗率有一個疑問。因此，我確實看到了房地產方面的釋放。您提到了組合轉變，這推動了 30 個基點的改善。您是否對房地產業務的虧損前景以及所經歷的損失做出了任何改變？

No, David. We've been pretty consistent in our view on property. And when we talk about property loss picks and particularly in property cat, we take a very prudent perspective and prudent approach in terms of selecting an attritional loss ratio that can sustain sort of any movement in sensing loss activity. So that's been really a consistent approach for us over time.

不，大衛。我們對房地產的看法一直非常一致。當我們談論財產損失選擇，特別是財產損失時，我們採取非常謹慎的觀點和謹慎的方法來選擇能夠承受任何感知損失活動變動的損耗率。所以，這對我們來說確實一直是一致的做法。

In terms of the loss pick in the quarter, the other thing I would point out, because you did see that 30 basis point improvement related to mix is the earned premium mix of reinsurance will take some time to catch up to the written mix, net written mix between property and casualty. So I still think there's some juice in terms of the mix dynamic with our attritional loss pick.

就本季的損失選擇而言，我想指出的另一件事是，因為您確實看到與組合相關的 30 個基點的改善是再保險的已賺保費組合需要一段時間才能趕上已賺保費組合、財產和意外險之間的淨已賺保費組合。因此，我仍然認為，就混合動態而言，我們的消耗性損失選擇具有一定的優勢。

Got it. Yeah. Understood on that. And then just another question just on the growth in property on the reinsurance side. We're hearing a little bit more on -- from some broker reports a little bit more appetite to write aggregates. Just wondering what your view is on that and if you guys deployed any capacity in aggregate covers more so at midyear than you did in the past?

知道了。是的。明白了。然後還有一個問題是關於再保險方面的財產增長。我們從一些經紀人的報告中聽到了更多關於寫入總量的興趣。只是想知道您對此有何看法，以及您所部署的整體產能在年中是否比過去更充足？

So we're not really deploying capacity around aggregates. I think -- look, first of all, some people are going to do that, and that's their choice. I still think there's a bid ask spread between what clients would be willing to pay for most aggregate structures and then what responsible reinsurers would charge for those structures. So I just don't see there being a lot of trading that makes any sense.

所以我們其實並沒有圍繞聚合來部署容量。我認為──首先，有些人會這樣做，這是他們的選擇。我仍然認為，客戶願意為大多數整體結構支付的價格與負責任的再保險公司對這些結構收取的價格之間存在買賣價差。所以我認為有很多交易沒有任何意義。

I do think over time, there's obviously a lot of thought going into how do you create -- how do you start solving some of the risk management problems of our clients. In my view, it's not going to look anything like the aggregates of old, where you could just have this runaway sideways loss activity, but we're certainly very open to working with our clients to try to solve their problems.

我確實認為，隨著時間的推移，我們顯然會花很多心思去思考如何創造——如何開始解決客戶的一些風險管理問題。在我看來，它看起來與過去的總量完全不同，在以前的總量中，你可能會出現這種失控的橫向損失活動，但我們當然非常願意與我們的客戶合作，嘗試解決他們的問題。

Understood. Thank you.

明白了。謝謝。

Elyse Greenspan, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的伊莉絲‧格林斯潘。

My first question is on workers' comp. I was hoping to get more color on what you're seeing in the comp market in California. I know another insurer had flagged a huge uptick in cumulative trauma comp claims in the state. And then also, can you confirm how much of your book, your workers' comp focus in California today? And do you intend to keep pulling back there?

我的第一個問題是關於工傷賠償的。我希望能更詳細地了解加州同類市場的情況。我知道另一家保險公司已經注意到該州累積創傷賠償索賠大幅增加。另外，您能否確認一下，您的書中有多少內容是關於當今加州的工人補償的？您是否打算繼續撤退？

Sure, Elyse. First of all, before I get to California, just a broader comment. I mean, we're all waiting for the workers' comp market to begin recovering and I think there's enough indication that it needs to start doing that in terms of the fact that rates have come off. So consistently, we did see actually a rate uptick in our own portfolio in the quarter, which is certainly a positive thing to be seen.

當然，伊莉絲。首先，在談到加州之前，我先談一個更廣泛的評論。我的意思是，我們都在等待工傷賠償市場開始復甦，我認為有足夠的跡象表明它需要開始復甦，因為利率已經下降。因此，我們確實在本季度看到了我們自己的投資組合利率的持續上升，這無疑是一件好事。

In terms of California, it is a much smaller portion of our book than it was a year ago. And it's something where we did have a specialized underwriting unit that was focused on California comp. And essentially, we've stopped really focusing on that. With that specialized unit, we've run that piece down. And so we're only writing California comp when it's part of a broader portfolio. And I don't expect that to change.

就加州而言，它在我們的帳簿中所佔的比例比一年前要小得多。我們確實有一個專門承保部門，專注於加州公司保險。從本質上講，我們已經不再真正關注這一點了。有了那個專門的單位，我們就把那部分工作完成了。因此，只有當加州公司股票成為更廣泛投資組合的一部分時，我們才會撰寫該股票。我並不認為這種情況會改變。

Okay. Thanks. And then my second question is a clarification going back to just the Russia, Ukraine increase you guys took in the quarter. What percent of [recedence] have notified you of their losses at this point? And how many have made on private settlements? Because I believe brokers have noted that a lot of the claims have resolved with private settlements?

好的。謝謝。我的第二個問題是澄清一下本季你們對俄羅斯和烏克蘭的進口增加。目前有多少比例的 [recedence] 公司已經向你通報了他們的損失？有多少人已經私下達成和解？因為我相信經紀人已經注意到很多索賠已經透過私人和解得到解決？

Yeah. I mean, that's certainly been a widespread reality. I think -- look, the key thing for us is we've been in direct contact with our (inaudible) over the course of this process, which by the time we finally got legal clarity around how losses would be adjudicated. We have plenty of information to develop a loss that we have a high degree of confidence in.

是的。我的意思是，這確實是一個普遍存在的現實。我認為——對我們來說，關鍵在於我們在整個過程中一直與我們的（聽不清楚）保持直接聯繫，直到我們最終獲得有關如何裁決損失的法律明確性。我們擁有充足的資訊來產生我們高度確信的損失。

So whether they've actually tendered a loss or not, we have a beat on where this thing is going, which is why I feel really comfortable with the number we put up.

因此，無論他們是否真的承擔了損失，我們都知道事情的走向，這就是為什麼我對我們給出的數字感到非常滿意。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Andrew Kligerman, TD Cowen.

安德魯·克里格曼 (Andrew Kligerman)，TD Cowen。

Few clarifications. I'm looking at your Insurance segment, other underwriting expenses at 18.5% year to date versus 16.8% in the prior period. And Jim, you talked a little bit about going deeper in the international regions where you are. I look at that 18.5% versus your peers, and it looks like there might be 2, maybe 4, 5 points of potential improvement there. Maybe you could help frame the outlook for that as that business as you get through 1 renewal and potentially start growing. Where could that ratio go?

一些澄清。我正在查看您的保險部門，今年迄今為止的其他承保費用為 18.5%，而上一期為 16.8%。吉姆，您談到了在您所在的國際地區進行更深入的工作。我認為與你的同行相比，這 18.5% 似乎還有 2 點、4 點、5 點的潛在提升空間。也許您可以幫助建立該業務的前景，因為您已經完成了一次更新並有可能開始成長。那麼這個比例會達到什麼程度呢？

Yeah, Andrew, I agree with the idea that as we reach scale in these markets, we should certainly be in a much better spot than [18%], five-year to date or 18.9% in the quarter. Just the one thing I do want to table set for you a little bit in terms of how I think about this. Obviously, expenses are important. Our overall group expense ratio, I think, is best-in-class. Our reinsurance expense ratio is world leading.

是的，安德魯，我同意這個觀點，隨著我們在這些市場達到規模，我們的處境肯定會比五年來的 [18%] 或本季的 18.9% 要好得多。我只是想向你們稍微介紹一下我對此的看法。顯然，費用很重要。我認為，我們集團的整體費用率是同類中最好的。我們的再保險費用率世界領先。

So clearly, we understand how to be thoughtful about expenses and manage that line item very carefully. At the same time, there are two really important things happening that are driving what you're seeing printed. Number one, when it comes to the North America remediation, as I've articulated a number of times, we are not slowing down. I'm not worrying about top line, where if it makes sense to run off an account, we do it, we don't sit there and think, well, this is going to pressure the expense ratio.

因此，我們顯然知道如何認真考慮開支並非常謹慎地管理該專案。同時，有兩件非常重要的事情正在發生，它們推動你所看到的印刷品。首先，談到北美的補救措施，正如我多次強調的那樣，我們不會放慢腳步。我並不擔心營業額，如果經營帳戶有意義，我們就會去做，我們不會坐在那裡想，這會給費用率帶來壓力。

And as I said, that's going to complete in the third quarter. And to your point, will become less of a headwind relative to expense rate as we put that behind us. And then the other and very much the other side of this coin, our International business is performing extremely well. It has a world-class loss ratio. And we want to fuel the growth of that business.

正如我所說，這將在第三季完成。正如您所說，當我們把這個問題拋在腦後時，相對於費用率而言，阻力就會減少。另一方面，我們的國際業務表現非常出色。它的損失率是世界一流的。我們希望推動該業務的成長。

Yes, we're going deeper in the markets where we already are and that will help us in terms of expenses because we don't have to open new operations in lots of different countries. But we're still hiring a lot of people.

是的，我們正在深入我們已經存在的市場，這將幫助我們節省開支，因為我們不必在許多不同的國家開設新的業務。但我們仍在招募大量員工。

We're still investing in technology. We're still out there marketing ourselves to drive that growth. So you've got two, to me, really, really sensible courses of action that both will tend in the short term to put upward pressure on the expense ratio. But then over time, as Mark indicated earlier, we're very confident that we're going to get into a better spot as we go forward. Hopefully, that helps.

我們仍在投資技術。我們仍在進行行銷以推動這一成長。因此，對我來說，有兩種非常非常明智的行動方案，它們都會在短期內對費用率造成上行壓力。但隨著時間的推移，正如馬克之前所說，我們非常有信心，隨著我們不斷前進，我們會進入一個更好的位置。希望這能有所幫助。

Yeah, that helps. Thanks. And then maybe just two just follow-up clarifications. A&H and Insurance and your Property cat business, just the returns. Just curious with the A&H book, what particular regions you're big in right now? And what type of return on capital you're seeing there?

是的，這有幫助。謝謝。然後可能只需要兩個後續澄清。A&H 和保險以及您的財產貓業務，只是回報。我只是對 A&H 書感到好奇，您現在在哪些特定地區很受歡迎？您看到的資本報酬率是什麼樣的？

And Jim, by one of your comments earlier on the property cat business saying it was more attractive than return -- repurchasing shares. I would think that implies like north of a 25% return on capital. Is that right for the property cat reinsurance?

吉姆，根據您之前對財產險業務的評論，它比回報——回購股票——更有吸引力。我認為這意味著資本回報率將超過 25%。這對於財產巨災再保險來說正確嗎？

Yeah. So let me -- let me start where you ended. Absolutely, it means north of 25% for property cat. And I think in some of the peak zones, whether it's southeast wind or (inaudible), et cetera, you're looking well higher than that. And I think, by the way, that's true of just about every cat market around the world. I'm a little more thoughtful or careful about European win, but pretty much everything else is well north of that kind of number.

是的。那麼讓我——讓我從你結束的地方開始。絕對的，這意味著財產損失將超過 25%。我認為在一些峰值區域，無論是東南風還是（聽不清楚）等等，你看到的都比這高得多。順便說一句，我認為世界各地的每個貓市場都是如此。我對歐洲的勝利更加深思熟慮或謹慎，但其他一切都遠遠超出了這個數字。

And hence, our interest in continuing to write the business, and it's also why a number of times during today's call, you've heard me push back on any notion that this is a soft market. Yes, rates are going down, but it's still outstanding. In terms of Accident and Health, and really all of our businesses, I think one thing that I can assure you is if we're growing something, it means the expected return meets or exceeds our threshold, which for the group, we've talked about mid-teens total shareholder return over the cycle, et cetera.

因此，我們有興趣繼續開展業務，這也是為什麼在今天的電話會議中，你們多次聽到我反駁「這是一個疲軟的市場」這一觀點。是的，利率正在下降，但仍然很低。就意外和健康險以及我們所有的業務而言，我認為我可以向你們保證的一件事是，如果我們正在發展某個業務，那就意味著預期回報達到或超過了我們的門檻，對於集團而言，我們已經討論過整個週期內中十幾歲的股東總回報，等等。

So I expect the Accident business to be healthily above that. And we write that business. It's still mainly a North America business, but we have a terrific emerging International business that's led out of London. The team there is doing a great job, a lot of growth, particularly in Europe, and increasingly in Asia. So I think there's tons of headroom in that business.

因此我預期意外事故業務將會健康發展。我們寫那項業務。它仍然主要是一家北美企業，但我們有一個非常出色的新興國際業務，它由倫敦引領。那裡的團隊做得非常出色，並且取得了很大的發展，特別是在歐洲，而且在亞洲也越來越活躍。所以我認為該業務有很大的發展空間。

And again, it's a business I know well from multiple carriers, and it's a low volatility business that can just deliver some really excellent returns as a gain scale.

再說一次，這是我從多家營運商那裡了解到的一項業務，它是一種低波動性業務，可以帶來一些非常出色的回報作為收益規模。

Thanks for the helpful insight.

感謝您提供的有益見解。

Katie Sakys, Autonomous Research.

凱蒂·薩克斯，自主研究。

I wanted to follow up on the discussion of the reserve release in the Reinsurance segment. I think, at least in recent years, we have become accustomed to really only seeing changes in your reserve assumptions at the end of the year. So I guess I was curious as to whether we can expect to see a more common cadence to attritional property reserve releases.

我想跟進再保險部門關於儲備金釋放的討論。我認為，至少在最近幾年，我們已經習慣只在年底看到儲備假設的變化。所以我很好奇我們是否可以期待看到更常見的消耗性財產儲備釋放節奏。

And then sort of tagging on to that, interesting to see that the reserve release on the reinsurance property lines wasn't quite enough to offset the charge on the Russian aviation losses. Any additional color that you can give for us on that?

然後附加一點，有趣的是，再保險財產險的準備金釋放並不足以抵消俄羅斯航空損失的費用。您能為我們提供更多關於此方面的更多資訊嗎？

Well, I think, as I said before, we do want to get into a quarterly cadence on development, obviously, where we can. Clearly, the data has to be there to support it. We feel real good about the margins that we have and the expected margins within the Reinsurance segment as a whole. So very confident about it.

嗯，我認為，正如我之前所說的，我們確實希望在可能的情況下，進入一個季度的開發節奏。顯然，必須有數據來支持它。我們對現有的利潤率以及整個再保險部門的預期利潤率感到非常滿意。對此非常有信心。

In the past, we've waited somewhat to be a little more conservative in terms of the emergence, but we're just taking a portion here of older property that well-seasoned. Now Russia, Ukraine, that's totally independent. That's something that we said back in 2022 when it was originally set up that was undefined. We didn't have the ability to make a provision for it given the uncertainties associated with it.

過去，我們在出現方面會等待一段時間，採取更保守的態度，但我們只是在這裡佔據了一部分成熟的老地產。現在俄羅斯、烏克蘭已經完全獨立。這是我們早在 2022 年最初設立時就說過的，當時還未定義。鑑於相關的不確定性，我們沒有能力為此做出準備。

So the concept of offsetting the two, just doesn't answer the equation. We really look at these things independently. Having said that, and I'll reiterate a comment I made earlier, we do feel very confident in the embedded margin that we foresee in the Reinsurance segment. So this is, I think, the beginning of a more normal cadence to your point.

因此，抵銷兩者的概念並不能解答這個等式。我們確實獨立地看待這些事情。話雖如此，我還是要重申我先前的評論，我們確實對我們預見的再保險領域的嵌入式利潤率非常有信心。所以，我認為，這是你的觀點更正常的節奏的開始。

Got it. Thank you. And then shifting to some of the premium growth figures. A very significant reacceleration in financial lines reinsurance growth this quarter, great to see. Could you give us a little bit more detail on your outlook for the line going forward over the next 12 to 18 months? And if you expect to continue to grow at a similar clip?

知道了。謝謝。然後轉向一些優質成長數據。很高興看到本季金融再保險業務成長顯著加速。您能否向我們詳細介紹一下未來 12 至 18 個月內該生產線的前景？如果您預計繼續以類似的速度成長呢？

Sure, Katie. Just in terms of maybe a little reminder for everybody on what's in there. For the most -- it's not financial lines, the way you might think of the Insurance business, D&O, et cetera. It's credit-exposed lines for the most part. And in particular, our Mortgage business is in that segment.

當然，凱蒂。只是為了稍微提醒大家裡面有什麼。對於大多數而言——它不是金融業務，您可能認為是保險業務、D&O 等。大部分都是信用暴露的額度。特別是我們的抵押貸款業務就屬於這一領域。

And you had a couple of meaningful mortgage transactions that contributed to that growth in the quarter. In terms of where we see the Mortgage business right now, rate levels in the Mortgage Reinsurance market have been under quite a bit of pressure. And so we're being very cautious in that particular line.

您有幾筆有意義的抵押貸款交易促進了本季的成長。就我們目前的抵押貸款業務而言，抵押貸款再保險市場的利率水準一直承受著相當大的壓力。因此，我們在這方面非常謹慎。

So I'm not going to give you any forward guidance, but I wouldn't necessarily expect that what you saw this quarter in the Financial Lines segment and Reinsurance would be a normal pace for the foreseeable future.

因此，我不會給您任何前瞻性的指導，但我並不一定期望您本季在金融線部門和再保險部門看到的情況在可預見的未來會保持正常速度。

Got it. Thank you.

知道了。謝謝。

Thank you. And that concludes the question-and-answer session as well as the event. Thank you so much for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect your lines.

謝謝。問答環節和活動到此結束。非常感謝您參加今天的演講。現在您可以斷開線路了。