Draftkings Inc (DKNG) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and thank you for standing by.

您好，感謝您的支持。

Welcome to DraftKings fourth quarter 2024 Earnings Call.

歡迎參加 DraftKings 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。

(Operator Instructions) Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded.

（操作員指示）請注意，今天的會議正在錄音。

I would now like to hand the conference over to Alan Ellingson, DraftKings' Chief Financial Officer.

現在，我想將會議交給 DraftKings 的財務長 Alan Ellingson。

Please go ahead.

請繼續。

Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us today.

大家早安，感謝大家今天的參與。

Certain statements we make during this call may constitute forward-looking statements that are subject to risks, uncertainties and other factors, as discussed further in our SEC filings that could cause our actual results to differ materially from our historical results or from our forecast.

我們在本次電話會議中所做的某些陳述可能構成前瞻性陳述，這些陳述受風險、不確定性和其他因素的影響，正如我們在美國證券交易委員會的文件中進一步討論的那樣，這些陳述可能導致我們的實際結果與我們的歷史結果或預測存在重大差異。

We assume no responsibility to update forward-looking statements, other than as required by law.

除法律要求外，我們不承擔更新前瞻性陳述的責任。

During this call, management will also discuss certain non-GAAP financial measures that we believe may be useful in evaluating DraftKings' operating performance.

在本次電話會議中，管理層還將討論我們認為可能有助於評估 DraftKings 營運績效的某些非 GAAP 財務指標。

These measures should not be considered in isolation or as a substitute for DraftKings' financial results prepared in accordance with GAAP.

這些措施不應單獨考慮，也不應將其作為 DraftKings 按照 GAAP 編制的財務結果的替代。

Reconciliations of these non-GAAP measures to the most directly comparable GAAP measures are available in our earnings release and presentation, which can be found on our website and in our annual report on Form 10-K filed with the SEC.

這些非 GAAP 指標與最直接可比較的 GAAP 指標的對帳表可在我們的收益報告和介紹中找到，這些報告和介紹可在我們的網站上以及我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的 10-K 表年度報告中找到。

Hosting the call today, we have Jason Robins, Co-Founder and Chief Executive Officer of DraftKings, who will share some opening remarks and an update on our business.

今天電話會議的主持人是 DraftKings 聯合創始人兼首席執行官 Jason Robins，他將致開幕詞並介紹我們的業務最新情況。

Following Jason's remarks, I will provide a review of our financials.

根據傑森的發言，我將對我們的財務狀況進行回顧。

We will then open the line to questions.

然後我們將開始回答問題。

I will now turn the call over to Jason Robins.

現在我將把電話轉給傑森羅賓斯（Jason Robins）。

Good morning, and thank you all for joining.

早安，感謝大家的參與。

Today, I'm excited to share our strong 2024 results, our areas of focus for 2025 and why I'm enthusiastic about the next few years.

今天，我很高興與大家分享我們在 2024 年取得的強勁業績、我們 2025 年的重點領域以及我對未來幾年充滿熱情的原因。

We just wrapped up our 13th year of DraftKings, and I am more confident than ever in our growth trajectory and ability to capitalize on the substantial opportunity ahead of us.

我們剛結束了 DraftKings 成立的第 13 週年，我對我們的成長軌跡和利用未來巨大機會的能力比以往任何時候都更有信心。

My confidence begins with the year we had in 2024.

我的信心始於我們度過的 2024 年。

For the year, revenue increased 30% year-over-year to $4.8 billion.

全年營收年增 30% 至 48 億美元。

Adjusted EBITDA improved $332 million year-over-year to $181 million, and free cash flow was positive for the first time in our history.

調整後 EBITDA 年增 3.32 億美元，達到 1.81 億美元，自由現金流在我們的歷史上首次為正。

We acquired 3.5 million new customers at record low customer acquisition costs and increased our total customer base 42% year-over-year to $10.1 million.

我們以創紀錄的低客戶獲取成本獲得了 350 萬新客戶，我們的總客戶群年增了 42%，達到 1,010 萬美元。

I am also proud that our business is demonstrating strong operating leverage.

我也對我們的業務表現出強勁的經營槓桿感到自豪。

While revenue grew 30% in fiscal year 2024, our adjusted operating expenses increased only 5% year-over-year, we're normalizing for costs related to our acquisition.

雖然 2024 財年的營收成長了 30%，但我們的調整後營運費用年增了 5%，我們正在對與收購相關的成本進行正常化。

We expect this to continue as our revenue growth remains strong while our expenses approach scale as we continue to exert discipline and leverage new technologies across the organization.

我們預計這種情況將繼續下去，因為我們的收入成長保持強勁，而我們的支出接近規模，因為我們將繼續在整個組織內嚴格執行紀律並利用新技術。

Looking further ahead to the future, I'm excited about a number of vectors that could even further accelerate our growth.

展望未來，我對許多可以進一​​步加速我們成長的因素感到興奮。

Our structural sportsbook hold percentage is continuing to increase, and the long-term ceiling to prove higher than we forecast.

我們的結構性體育博彩持有百分比正在持續增加，長期上限將高於我們的預測。

Additional online gaming legalization in the US appears inevitable and more a question of when, not if.

美國進一步將網路遊戲合法化似乎是不可避免的，但這更多的是一個時間問題，而不是是否會發生的問題。

And our newer verticals such as digital lottery courier are only in their infancy.

而我們較新的垂直產業（例如數位彩票快遞）尚處於起步階段。

DraftKings is at the epicenter of a mega trend.

DraftKings 正處於大趨勢的中心。

Real money online gaming is a large and growing industry with secular tailwinds behind it.

真錢線上遊戲是一個龐大且不斷成長的行業，有著長期的順風優勢。

We believe we are well positioned to capture significant share, and we haven't even begun to expand outside the US and Canada, which we could explore as a longer-term opportunity.

我們相信，我們已做好準備，可以佔據相當大的份額，而且我們甚至還沒有開始向美國和加拿大以外的市場擴張，而我們可以將這些市場作為一個長期機會進行探索。

In 2025, one area of focus is extending our lead in live betting.

2025 年，我們的重點領域之一是擴大我們在現場投注方面的領先地位。

Our recent acquisitions of Simplebet, Sports IQ Analytics and Mustard Golf provide us with proven technology and analytical tools that will accelerate our product road map and bring the live betting experience to another level.

我們最近收購了 Simplebet、Sports IQ Analytics 和 Mustard Golf，為我們提供了成熟的技術和分析工具，這將加速我們的產品路線圖，並將現場投注體驗提升到另一個層次。

We will also focus on growing and further integrating our emerging verticals.

我們也將專注於發展和進一步整合我們的新興垂直產業。

For instance, Jackpocket, the number one digital lottery courier app has proven to be an efficient acquisition channel for the DraftKings ecosystem.

例如，排名第一的數位彩票快遞應用程式 Jackpocket 已被證明是 DraftKings 生態系統有效的獲取管道。

The app recently cracked the top 5 in the entertainment category of the App Store in the Mega Millions jackpot reached $1.2 billion.

這款應用程式最近在 Mega Millions 大獎中躋身 App Store 娛樂類別前五名，獎金達到 12 億美元。

Jackpocket is positioned to benefit from larger prices, more states and an expanded product offering that includes [scratch or gain] Lastly, we are focused on how we can intelligently deploy capital as our balance sheet grows.

Jackpocket 的定位是受益於更高的價格、更多的州和包括[刮刮卡或收益]在內的更廣泛的產品供應。

Now that we are generating significant positive free cash flow, we have more options available to us to maximize shareholder returns.

現在我們正在產生大量的正自由現金流，我們有更多的選擇來最大化股東回報。

This includes optimizing our capital structure by exploring opportunities in the debt markets while maintaining a prudent approach to leverage.

這包括透過探索債務市場的機會來優化我們的資本結構，同時保持審慎的槓桿方式。

We will continue to prioritize returning capital to our shareholders, while considering all options available to us in targeting the highest risk-adjusted returns.

我們將繼續優先向股東返還資本，同時考慮所有可用的選擇，以實現最高風險調整回報為目標。

In closing, I'm very excited about our trajectory in 2025 and beyond.

最後，我對我們 2025 年及以後的發展軌跡感到非常興奮。

With that, I will turn it over to our Chief Financial Officer, Alan Ellingson.

接下來我將把話題轉交給我們的財務長艾倫‧埃林森 (Alan Ellingson)。

Thank you, Jason.

謝謝你，傑森。

I'll start with the highlights, including our fourth quarter 2024 performance and our fiscal year 2025 guidance.

我將從亮點開始，包括我們 2024 年第四季的業績和 2025 財年的指引。

Please note that all income statement measures discussed except for revenue, are on a non-GAAP adjusted EBITDA basis.

請注意，除收入外，討論的所有損益表指標均基於非 GAAP 調整後的 EBITDA。

As Jason mentioned, we had an excellent 2024, and I'm pleased to share that our fourth quarter was strong across our core value drivers.

正如傑森所說，我們度過了出色的 2024 年，我很高興地告訴大家，我們在第四季度在核心價值驅動方面表現強勁。

In the fourth quarter, we generated $1.393 billion of revenue, representing 13% year-over-year growth and $89 million of adjusted EBITDA.

第四季度，我們創造了 13.93 億美元的收入，年增 13%，調整後 EBITDA 為 8,900 萬美元。

Customer acquisition exceeded our expectations as newly acquired Sportsbook and iGaming customers continued to increase year-over-year, and our new digital lottery courier vertical benefited from the Mega Millions jackpot reaching $1.2 billion in late December.

客戶獲取量超出了我們的預期，因為新獲得的 Sportsbook 和 iGaming 客戶同比增長，而我們新的數位彩票快遞垂直業務受益於 12 月底達到 12 億美元的 Mega Millions 大獎。

Customer engagement and retention were strong.

客戶參與度和保留率很高。

Structural sportsbook hold percentage also continued to improve, increasing 80 basis points year-over-year to 11.2% for the quarter as our NFL Parley handle mix improved more than 600 basis points year-over-year.

結構性體育博彩持有百分比也持續改善，本季同比增長 80 個基點至 11.2%，因為我們的 NFL Parley 交易組合同比增長超過 600 個基點。

Promotional reinvestment outperformed our expectations in dollar terms.

以美元計算，促銷再投資超出了我們的預期。

Adjusted gross margins of 45% reflects our improving structural sportsbook hold percentage and our optimization of promotional offers despite a headwind from customer-friendly outcomes.

調整後的毛利率為 45%，反映了我們結構性體育博彩持有率的提高以及促銷優惠的優化，儘管面臨來自客戶友好型成果的阻力。

I'd also like to take a couple of minutes to comment on the first quarter of 2025.

我還想花幾分鐘時間對 2025 年第一季發表一些評論。

We are off to an excellent start, and that provides us incremental confidence in our fiscal year 2025 revenue and adjusted EBITDA guidance ranges.

我們開局良好，這讓我們對 2025 財年的收入和調整後的 EBITDA 指導範圍更有信心。

In January, our core value drivers resulted in revenue and adjusted EBITDA that exceeded our expectations for the month with an actual Sportsbook hold percentage of 11%.

1 月份，我們的核心價值驅動因素使收入和調整後的 EBITDA 超出了我們當月的預期，實際體育博彩持有百分比為 11%。

Additionally, month-to-date through February 11, our acquisition, retention and engagement continue to be strong, and our actual Sportsbook hold percentage was 13%.

此外，截至 2 月 11 日，我們的收購、保留和參與度持續保持強勁，我們實際的體育博彩持有百分比為 13%。

The Super Bowl, one of our tentpole acquisition and engagement base was a successful event for the company.

超級盃是我們重要的收購和參與基礎之一，也是公司成功的活動。

On Super Bowl Sunday, our customer acquisition was a bright spot as DraftKings Sportsbook app reached number one in the App Store in the sports category and number three across all apps.

在超級盃星期天，我們的客戶獲取是一個亮點，因為 DraftKings Sportsbook 應用程式在 App Store 運動類別中排名第一，在所有應用程式中排名第三。

From an engagement standpoint, we set our own daily record for Sportsbook handle at $436 million.

從參與度的角度來看，我們創下了體育博彩每日投注額 4.36 億美元的記錄。

Finally, debt mix trends were favorable as Same Game Parlay handle increased approximately 40% year-over-year which ultimately resulted in the highest Sportsbook growth gaming revenue day in the history of the company.

最後，債務組合趨勢良好，因為同場聯注處理量年增約 40%，最終導致公司歷史上體育博彩成長博彩收入最高。

Now moving on to our fiscal year 2025 guidance.

現在來看看我們的 2025 財年指引。

In November, we stated our expectation that fiscal year 2025 revenue would be in the range of $6.2 billion to $6.6 billion.

11 月，我們表示預計 2025 財年營收將在 62 億至 66 億美元之間。

Today, we are raising the low end and midpoint of our range due to the investments that we are making into our live betting offerings, including our acquisition of Simplebet.

今天，由於我們對現場投注產品的投資，包括對 Simplebet 的收購，我們提高了價格範圍的低端和中點。

We expect our live betting initiatives will be neutral to adjusted EBITDA in 2025 and positive to adjusted EBITDA in 2026 and beyond.

我們預計，我們的現場投注計劃對 2025 年的調整後 EBITDA 將產生中性影響，對 2026 年及以後的調整後 EBITDA 將產生正影響。

We now expect 2025 revenues of $6.3 billion to $6.6 billion, which represents year-over-year growth of 32% to 38%.

我們現在預計 2025 年的營收為 63 億美元至 66 億美元，年增 32% 至 38%。

We had also shared in November our expectation that fiscal year 2025 adjusted EBITDA would be in the range of $900 million to $1 billion.

我們也在 11 月分享了我們的預期，即 2025 財年調整後的 EBITDA 將在 9 億美元至 10 億美元之間。

Today, we are reaffirming that guidance range.

今天，我們重申該指引範圍。

It is early in the year, but the performance so far has been excellent across our core value drivers.

雖然今年才剛開始，但到目前為止，我們的核心價值驅動力表現都非常出色。

Importantly, our revenue and adjusted EBITDA guidance for fiscal year 2025 does not include the benefit of favorable year-to-date support outcomes nor the company launching mobile sports betting in Missouri.

重要的是，我們 2025 財年的收入和調整後 EBITDA 指引不包括年初至今有利的支持結果帶來的好處，也不包括公司在密蘇裡州推出行動體育博彩的好處。

In terms of additional fiscal year 2025 detail, we continue to expect structural sportsbook hold percentage of approximately 11% and now anticipate a Sportsbook net revenue margin in the range of 7% to 7.5%.

就 2025 財年的更多細節而言，我們繼續預計結構性體育博彩持有百分比約為 11%，現在預計體育博彩淨收入利潤率在 7% 至 7.5% 之間。

We now expect our adjusted gross margin to be in the range of 46% to 47%, which is slightly higher than midpoint relative to our expectations last quarter.

我們現在預計調整後的毛利率在 46% 至 47% 之間，相對於上個季度的預期，略高於中點。

We continue to expect stock-based compensation expense to represent approximately 6% of revenue.

我們繼續預期股票薪酬支出將佔收入的 6% 左右。

Finally, we expect the bridge between adjusted EBITDA and free cash flow to be $100 million and therefore, expect to generate free cash flow of approximately $850 million in fiscal year 2025.

最後，我們預計調整後的 EBITDA 與自由現金流之間的橋樑為 1 億美元，因此預計 2025 財年將產生約 8.5 億美元的自由現金流。

That concludes our remarks, and we will now open the line for questions.

我們的發言到此結束，現在我們將開始回答大家的提問。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指令）

Shaun Kelley, Bank of America.

美國銀行的肖恩·凱利（Shaun Kelley）。

Hi.

你好。

Good morning, everyone and thank you for taking my question.

大家早安，謝謝你們回答我的問題。

Jason or Alan, I wanted to start off with trends on the volume and handle growth side of the business.

傑森或艾倫，我想從數量趨勢開始，並處理業務的成長方面。

So we saw a handle growth across the industry slow a bit in the fourth quarter.

因此，我們看到第四季度整個行業的處理量成長放緩。

And I just wanted to know how much of a concern is that for you?

我只是想知道這對您來說有多大程度上令人擔心？

What do you think can drive reacceleration in 2025?

您認為什麼可以推動 2025 年重新加速？

And is a pickup necessary to kind of reach your outlook as you stated here.

正如您在此所述，這是實現您觀點的必要手段。

Thanks, Sean.

謝謝，肖恩。

Appreciate the question.

我很感謝你提出這個問題。

So definitely, a lot of factors, I think, can affect numbers that really are kind of masking reality.

所以，我認為，確實有很多因素會影響數字，而這些數字實際上會掩蓋現實。

So not a huge thing.

所以不是什麼大事。

But for example, in the fourth quarter, there was one less NFL game this year than the year -- or excuse me, in 2024 versus '23.

但例如，在第四季度，今年的 NFL 比賽比去年少了一場——或者對不起，是 2024 年比 2023 年少了一場。

So things like that can make a difference.

像這樣的事情可能會產生影響。

But we think probably the biggest impact was just distraction around the election.

但我們認為最大的影響可能只是選舉帶來的干擾。

Handle growth is still good, but it was a little less than what we're seeing now.

處理成長仍然良好，但比我們現在看到的要少一些。

I mean the reason I think we have confidence in '25 is we've seen a pretty rapid acceleration in handle growth.

我之所以對 25 年充滿信心，是因為我們看到了處理量成長的相當快速的加速。

You saw the same thing with some of the ratings, NBA was down a little bit.

您可以從一些收視率中看到相同的情況，NBA 的收視率略有下降。

It's bounced back quite a bit in the first quarter.

第一季已經出現大幅反彈。

So I think same thing on our end, we've seen the handle growth accelerate since the elections pass and especially into the new year.

所以我認為我們的情況也是一樣的，自選舉結束以來，特別是進入新的一年，我們看到句柄增長加速。

Great.

偉大的。

And if I could, just a follow-up on the strategic side, Jason.

如果可以的話，我想就戰略方面的問題進行跟進，傑森。

I wanted -- there's been a lot of news flow out there and buzz around events contracts and prediction markets entering the sports landscape.

我希望——現在有很多新聞流出，並且圍繞著賽事合約和預測市場進入體育領域進行討論。

So appreciate it's very early here, and this has been a moving target.

所以請理解，現在還為時過早，而且這是一個不斷變化的目標。

But just sort of what's DraftKings initial take here?

但 DraftKings 最初的看法是什麼？

Is this something you'd get into?

這是你會參與的事情嗎？

Or what can kind of project or differentiate you from that kind of offering?

或是什麼樣的項目或產品能讓您與同類產品有所區別？

Yeah.

是的。

I do think you're right, it's early.

我確實認為你是對的，現在還早。

We are watching it very actively.

我們正積極關注此事。

It's certainly something that we have keen interest in seeing how it plays out.

我們當然非常感興趣看看這件事將如何發展。

So I think there is some -- in the next couple of months, 60 days or so, there's going to be a CFTC ruling and all sorts of other things.

所以我認為在接下來的幾個月裡，大概 60 天左右，CFTC 將會做出裁決，以及其他各種事情。

So I think we'll know a lot more over the next few months.

因此我認為在接下來的幾個月裡我們會知道更多。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Stephen Grambling, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的史蒂芬‧格蘭布林 (Stephen Grambling)。

Hey.

嘿。

Thanks for the incremental detail on the Sportsbook.

感謝您提供有關體育博彩的更多詳細資訊。

The net revenue target looks like you're assuming a fairly modest reduction in promotional intensity at least as a percentage of GGR.

淨收入目標看起來好像您假設促銷強度至少佔 GGR 的百分比會減少。

If we zoom out, what are some of the major puts and takes that will influence the promotional reinvestment here and how that intensity may evolve longer term?

如果我們縮小範圍，哪些主要的優缺點會影響這裡的促銷再投資，以及這種強度將如何長期發展？

Yeah, it's -- sorry, you're talking about 2025?

是的，抱歉，您說的是 2025 年嗎？

Yeah, 2025 versus 2024.

是的，2025 年對 20​​24 年。

And then I guess if we think about how that will continue to, I guess, I would imagine trend lower as the industry matures, but -- just wondering if that's kind of the right case.

然後我想如果我們考慮這種情況將如何繼續下去，我想，我會想像隨著行業的成熟趨勢會降低，但是 - 只是想知道這是否是正確的情況。

[There was] quite a decline in our promotional intensity.

我們的促銷力道相當下降。

So I think maybe our analysts can work with you offline and help you on that.

因此我想我們的分析師也許可以與您線下合作並為您提供幫助。

But it's -- I think we're expecting a pretty meaningful decline in promotional intensity in 2025.

但我認為，我們預計 2025 年促銷強度將出現相當顯著的下降。

Got it.

知道了。

So I'll follow up with that.

我會繼續跟進。

Maybe then one more that I'll sneak in.

也許我還會偷偷溜進去。

Obviously, you started the buyback during a period where there was tougher hold.

顯然，你是在持有更嚴格的時期開始回購的。

How does volatility and hold impact your willingness to buy back?

波動性和持有如何影響您的回購意願？

And is there any specific approach to buy back either consistent or opportunistic as we think about how you will deploy capital going forward?

當我們考慮未來如何部署資本時，是否有任何具體的回購方法，無論是持續性回購還是機會性回購？

Yeah, Stephen, I'll take that.

是的，史蒂芬，我接受。

We're going to be fairly programmatic with it. we've communicated in the past that we'd like to tie it to our free cash flow, and we're just going to be very consistent quarter-over-quarter.

我們將以相當程序化的方式處理它。我們過去曾表示，我們希望將其與自由現金流掛鉤，並且我們將保持季度環比的一致性。

Great.

偉大的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

David Katz, Jefferies.

傑富瑞（Jefferies）的戴維·卡茨（David Katz）。

Thanks.

謝謝。

Good morning, everyone.

大家早安。

Going back to a question I've asked a whole bunch of times, but it feels more appropriate now, which is around in-play betting.

回到我問過很多次的一個問題，但現在感覺更合適，即關於比賽中投注的問題。

Can you just discuss the puts and takes and trajectory around in-play in the US as you see it, towards getting to the kind of volume levels that mix that we see, for example, in Europe?

您能否討論一下您認為的美國的比賽的走勢，以達到我們在歐洲看到的那種交易量水平？

Yeah.

是的。

I think that there's a couple of things.

我認為有幾件事。

One is obviously the product, and we've made a tremendous amount of headway, but also still feel we have a lot more we can do there.

第一個顯然是產品，我們已經取得了巨大的進展，但我們仍然覺得我們可以做得更多。

Very proud that we had the -- by far, industry's highest uptime for markets, including in-play during the Super Bowl.

我們非常自豪，迄今為止，我們擁有業內最高的市場正常運行時間，包括超級盃期間的比賽。

And so that's a big area of focus.

所以這是一個值得關注的重點領域。

Obviously, if the markets aren't up, people can't bet.

顯然，如果市場不上漲，人們就無法下注。

Secondly, I think beyond the product, really working with the broadcasters and the streamers to try to get low latency broadcast and streams available for customers that want to inflate bet on a more micro basis.

其次，我認為除了產品之外，還要與廣播公司和串流媒體進行真正的合作，嘗試為想要在更微觀的基礎上增加賭注的客戶提供低延遲的廣播和串流媒體。

It's hard when you're 20, 30 seconds behind.

當你落後20到30秒的時候，事情就很難辦了。

It almost makes the experience you have to play just on the app instead of watching the game, which I don't think is as good and certainly not what the broadcasters and leagues want.

這幾乎讓您只能在應用程式上玩遊戲而不是觀看比賽，我認為這不太好，當然也不是廣播公司和聯盟想要的。

So that's something I think, that can help, too.

所以我認為這也能有所幫助。

So really for us, it's both of those.

所以對我們來說，這兩者實際上都是如此。

It's working with the other stakeholders in the industry to help create an ecosystem that allows the customer to maximize their experience and then making sure on our end, we're building the best products and making sure they're up and running when the customers want to make bets.

它正在與行業中的其他利益相關者合作，幫助創建一個生態系統，使客戶能夠最大限度地提高他們的體驗，然後確保在我們這邊，我們正在打造最好的產品，並確保當客戶想要下注時，它們能夠正常運作。

Perfect.

完美的。

And if I can just follow up quickly for Alan.

我能不能快速跟進一下艾倫的情況。

My sense is there may have been an urged to raise the guidance given the really strong start we've seen so far year-to-date.

我的感覺是，鑑於今年迄今為止我們看到的強勁開局，有人可能敦促提高預期。

How did you sort of think about the urge and resist the urge.

您是如何看待這種衝動並抵抗這種衝動的？

I think it's very early in the year and we don't feel any obligation to get ahead of the numbers.

我認為今年還處於初期階段，我們不認為有任何義務領先這些數字。

We're seeing some really good positive strong trends, but let's stay consistent with what we've said in the past and let's see how the year progresses.

我們看到了一些非常好的積極強勁趨勢，但讓我們保持與過去所說的一致，讓我們看看今年的進展如何。

Yeah.

是的。

And remember, we're providing a range, too.

請記住，我們也提供一系列產品。

So there's already some kind of -- there's some moving parts built into that.

因此，其中已經內建了一些活動部件。

So I think, as Alan noted, it's very early in the year.

因此我認為，正如艾倫所說，現在還為時過早。

We feel like we still are very comfortable with the range we provided on the EBITDA side.

我們覺得我們對 EBITDA 方面提供的範圍仍然非常滿意。

And hopefully, there's some upside there.

希望這能帶來一些好處。

But as we saw in Q4, things can swing the other way, too.

但正如我們在第四季度看到的那樣，情況也可能朝著相反的方向發展。

So I didn't want to get out ahead of our skis.

所以我不想超出我們的滑雪板的極限。

Appreciate it.

非常感謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Carlo Santarelli, Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的卡洛桑塔雷利 (Carlo Santarelli)。

Hey, guys.

嘿，大家好。

Good morning.

早安.

Jason, Alan, whoever wants to take this one.

傑森、艾倫，無論誰想拿這個。

I think if you just look at the 35% revenue guidance, and factor in kind of the improvement in structural hold.

我認為，如果你只看 35% 的收入指引，並考慮到結構性持有的改善。

From a gross perspective, you kind of have a 17% head start on OSB revenue for the year.

從總體來看，今年 OSB 收入將領先 17%。

I would imagine that the handle component plus the promotional savings and the impact that would have on your net revenue is going to be -- should amount to something that's slightly higher than the 35% aggregate target with a little bit of drag from perhaps OSB and obviously, some moving parts in the other line?

我認為手把部分加上促銷節省的費用對您的淨收入的影響應該會略高於 35% 的總目標，也許 OSB 會造成一點拖累，顯然，另一條生產線上的一些活動部件也會造成拖累？

Is that a fair kind of reconciliation?

這是一種公平的和解嗎？

Yeah, I think that's pretty good.

是的，我認為這非常好。

I mean, listen, we do feel there's some upside.

我的意思是，聽著，我們確實感覺到一些好處。

Obviously, we provided a range on the guidance, and we're always out there trying to beat it.

顯然，我們提供了指導範圍，並且我們一直在努力超越它。

We have a number of initiatives planned throughout the year, both to improve top line handle in GGR and also to improve our promotional efficiency.

我們全年計劃採取多項舉措，既是為了提高博彩總收入，也是為了提高我們的促銷效率。

Obviously, we'll have to see how customer acquisition performs.

顯然，我們必須觀察客戶獲取的表現如何。

That's been something that's been better than expectation, which is great for the long term, but can drive promotions up in the meantime.

這是比預期要好的事情，長遠來看這是件好事，但同時也可以推動晉升。

So lots to do, I think.

我認為有很多事情要做。

But also, lots of upside.

但同時，也有很多好處。

And for us, I think it's really about making sure that we put a prudent guide out there but also have a number of initiatives that are lined up to hopefully help us beat it.

對我們來說，我認為這其實是為了確保我們制定出一份審慎的指南，同時也要採取一些舉措，希望能幫助我們克服它。

Helpful.

很有幫助。

Thank you.

謝謝。

And then if I could, just one follow-up on the adjusted sales and marketing.

如果可以的話，我只想跟進一下調整後的銷售和行銷情況。

Clearly, some activity later in the year, some acquisition activity, et cetera, that kind of drove those costs up. year-over-year.

顯然，今年稍後的一些活動、一些收購活動等等都推高了這些成本。與去年同期相比。

How are you guys kind of thinking about that line for 2025?

你們對於 2025 年的路線有什麼看法？

Is that something we could expect could come down somewhat or even perhaps meaningfully as we move through the year?

隨著時間的推移，我們是否可以預期這個數字會有所下降，甚至可能有意義地下降？

Yeah.

是的。

The way we think about some of those costs, especially in the long term, is we are trying to optimize around an EBITDA margin ultimately up close to 30%.

我們對其中一些成本的思考方式，特別是從長期來看，我們正試圖優化 EBITDA 利潤率，最終接近 30%。

And so you're going to see some fluctuations up and down as we pick up acquisitions and we're going to optimize the organization and continue to focus on streamlining our organization and our fixed cost to get to a place where we can deliver the EBITDA margins we've communicated.

因此，隨著我們進行收購，您將會看到一些波動，我們將優化組織，並繼續專注於精簡我們的組織和固定成本，以達到我們已經傳達的 EBITDA 利潤率。

Helpful.

很有幫助。

Thank you, both

謝謝你們

Robin Farley, UBS.

瑞銀的羅賓法利（Robin Farley）。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Just looking at your guidance, this is, I think, the second quarter in a row, you raised revenue guidance for '25, but the EBITDA guidance hasn't changed.

僅從您的指引來看，我認為這是您連續第二季上調 25 年的收入指引，但 EBITDA 指引並未改變。

And presumably, it's your push into the live betting space.

並且據推測，這是您進軍現場投注領域的舉措。

Can you help us think about what that would be adding presumably to 2026?

您能否幫助我們思考這可能會對 2026 年帶來什麼影響？

Thanks.

謝謝。

Yeah.

是的。

It's a great question, Robin.

這是一個很好的問題，羅賓。

So we haven't quantified that, but as Alan noted on the call, we do think that while EBITDA neutral this year, the investments we're making in the live betting will be EBITDA positive in 2026 and beyond.

因此，我們還沒有量化這一點，但正如艾倫在電話會議上指出的那樣，我們確實認為，雖然今年的 EBITDA 是中性的，但我們在現場投注方面的投資將在 2026 年及以後產生 EBITDA 正值。

So you're absolutely right, but we haven't quantified it at this time.

所以你完全正確，但我們目前還沒有量化它。

Okay.

好的。

And then as a quick follow-up, I think it was in your shareholder letter.

然後作為一個快速的跟進，我認為它在你的股東信中。

You mentioned exploring opportunities in the debt markets now that you have cash flow.

您提到，現在有了現金流，就可以探索債務市場的機會。

Is the suggestion there?

有建議嗎？

Would that be or to use for additional share repurchase?

那將用於額外的股票回購嗎？

Or kind of how should we think about that opportunity to use debt?

或者我們應該如何看待利用債務的機會？

Thanks.

謝謝。

I think initially, it will just be for general corporate purposes and just to establish our presence in the bet market with no specific focus in mind on it.

我認為最初它只是用於一般的公司目的，只是為了確立我們在博彩市場的地位，並沒有特別關注它。

Long term, we'll obviously look at the optimal way of growing the business and the right way to use our balance sheet to do so.

從長遠來看，我們顯然會尋找業務成長的最佳方式，以及如何正確利用我們的資產負債表來實現這一目標。

Okay, great.

好的，太好了。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Robert Fishman, MoffettNathanson.

羅伯特·菲什曼、莫菲特·納森森。

Hi.

你好。

Good morning.

早安.

Given the continued strength in customer acquisition, can you share more about the current levels of potation penetration in some of the older vintage states?

鑑於客戶獲取能力持續保持強勁，您能否分享更多有關一些釀酒老州目前的葡萄酒滲透水平的信息？

And how that compares to some of your newer states?

這與你們一些較新的州相比如何？

And maybe just the runway for higher penetration in the years ahead.

這或許只是為未來幾年實現更高的滲透率鋪平了道路。

I mean, as you may remember, and I think this is probably why you're asking, some of the earlier states didn't ramp as quickly as the newer states have.

我的意思是，您可能還記得，而且我認為這可能是您問的原因，一些較早的州的增長速度不如較新的州那麼快。

So it took a little longer to get to that population penetration.

因此，要達到這一人口滲透率還需要更長的時間。

Right now, our oldest states typically are at the highest in some cases of our overall states for population penetration, particularly states like New Jersey, which even though it took a little longer to get there, it's been around for a while.

目前，我們最古老的州在某些情況下通常處於總體州中人口滲透率最高的狀態，特別是像新澤西州這樣的州，儘管它花了更長的時間才達到這一水平，但也已經存在了一段時間。

That said, they're still growing.

話雖如此，它們仍在增長。

So I don't know where the ceiling could be.

所以我不知道天花板在哪裡。

And for us, I think it's just about continuing to build a product that we think appeals to a wide variety of customers and provides great entertainment and hopefully, as we do that, the audience will grow.

對我們來說，我認為這只是繼續打造一種我們認為能夠吸引各種客戶並提供出色娛樂的產品，並且希望隨著我們這樣做，觀眾人數將會成長。

I do think there's some secular tailwinds behind us.

我確實認為我們背後有一些長期的順風。

I think younger generations tend to participate more in these types of activities and also tend to do it more online and on mobile.

我認為年輕一代更傾向於參與此類活動，也更傾向於在線上和透過行動裝置進行此類活動。

So I think time is on our side in that sense.

所以我認為從這個意義上來說時間站在我們這一邊。

And maybe a quick follow-up then.

然後也許會進行快速跟進。

Can you discuss the ROI of your sponsorship strategies.

您能討論一下您的贊助策略的投資報酬率嗎？

You saw that record sign-up from the Tyson, Paul Netflix fight.

您看到了泰森和保羅 Netflix 比賽的記錄。

So how does this change your approach thinking about 2025?

那麼這會如何改變您對 2025 年的思考方式呢？

We're always looking for opportunities like that.

我們一直在尋找這樣的機會。

That one, to be fair, I mean, it was kind of lightning in a bottle.

公平地說，那一次就像是瓶中閃電。

I don't think anyone expected that Tyson, Jake Paul fight to have the mainstream appeal and to get the audience including Netflix, I mean, they had unbelievable traffic to the point where it was almost hard to keep up.

我想沒有人會想到泰森和傑克保羅的比賽會受到主流的關注並得到包括 Netflix 在內的觀眾的青睞，我的意思是，他們的流量大到幾乎難以跟上。

So that was one that was sort of a pleasant surprise and you're not going to always hit on that.

所以這是某種程度上的令人愉快的驚喜，而且你不會總是遇到這樣的情況。

But I think for kind of us the way we look at it is how do we make sure that we're establishing relationships with great companies that know how to put on great events and then getting good deals.

但我認為，我們看待這個問題的方式是如何確保我們與懂得如何舉辦大型活動並達成良好交易的優秀公司建立關係。

And if they hit big then great, but we don't want to count on that.

如果他們能取得巨大成功那就太好了，但我們不想依賴這一點。

It's really about establishing a good framework so that even in a kind of base case scenario, we get great ROI.

這實際上是為了建立一個良好的框架，以便即使在某種基本情況下，我們也可以獲得豐厚的投資報酬率。

So that's how we think about it.

這就是我們的想法。

And then if you happen to have the upside from something like what happened with the Tyson fight, then great, but that's not going to happen all the time.

如果你碰巧從泰森之戰中獲得了好處，那就太好了，但這種情況不會一直發生。

It doesn't happen very often, so you can't count on it.

這種事情並不常發生，所以你不能依賴它。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Ben Miller, Goldman Sachs.

高盛的班·米勒。

Great.

偉大的。

Thanks so much for taking my question.

非常感謝您回答我的問題。

I wanted to follow up on the prior live betting questions, given it was highlighted as an area of focus in '25.

我想跟進之前的現場投注問題，因為它在'25年被重點強調為重點關注領域。

I'm just curious how you think about that, how you think about greater adoption of live betting translating into the model between wallet share, growing wallet share with existing customers versus potentially unlocking new customer cohorts.

我只是好奇您對此有何看法，您如何看待更廣泛地採用現場投注轉化為錢包份額、增加現有客戶的錢包份額與潛在解鎖新客戶群之間的模型。

I think it's a big part of it, right?

我認為這是其中很重要的一部分，對嗎？

Most customers are not going to come in and make the first bet as a live bet, they're going to bet pre-match.

大多數顧客不會進來進行第一次現場投注，而是在賽前下注。

So it really is, as you noted, about getting our existing customers to continue to adopt live betting.

因此，正如您所說的，這實際上是為了讓我們現有的客戶繼續採用現場投注。

And if you look at the trends overseas, that's sort of story, right?

如果你看看海外的趨勢，這就是故事，對嗎？

It grew each year from more and more existing customer adoption to the point where now it's 70%, 80% of revenue in the UK for digital Sportsbook.

它每年都隨著越來越多現有客戶的採用而成長，現在它已佔英國數位運動博彩收入的 70% 至 80%。

So definitely feel like there's that kind of upside here.

因此確實覺得這裡有這種好處。

The US sports are very well built for in-play betting.

美國體育賽事非常適合賽中投注。

We saw a lot in the Super Bowl more this year than we had in prior years.

與往年相比，今年我們在超級盃上看到的比賽更多。

So that was a very encouraging sign.

這是一個非常令人鼓舞的跡象。

And I think as time goes on, we're going to continue to figure out ways to better create products that appeal to customers.

我認為隨著時間的推移，我們將繼續尋找更好的方法來創造更吸引客戶的產品。

And I just think also the natural evolution and maturity of the customer base, people are going to try new sports, they're going to try new bet types and that will lead to more live betting.

而且我認為，隨著客戶群的自然演變和成熟，人們會嘗試新的運動，嘗試新的投注類型，這將帶來更多的現場投注。

Great.

偉大的。

And then maybe just as a follow-up.

然後可能只是作為後續行動。

I'd love just on the DraftKings+ subscription.

我只想訂閱 DraftKings+。

Just any learnings early learnings from the pilot in New York and how that translated into any change customer behavior?

從紐約的試點中得到的早期經驗是什麼？

And the second part of that is just how you think about the economics of that offering between subscribers versus nonsubscribers.

第二部分是您如何看待訂閱者和非訂閱者之間提供的產品的經濟效益。

Yeah, it's a great question.

是的，這是一個很好的問題。

So it's really early and it's a very limited pilot.

所以現在還處於早期階段，而且還是一個非常有限的試點。

So we don't have enough data yet at this point, but it's something that I think could potentially have some real interest amongst the broader population from what we're early on seeing I think we wanted to make sure because we don't know what the economics are going to shake out at.

因此，我們目前還沒有足夠的數據，但從我們早期看到的情況來看，我認為這可能會引起廣大民眾的真正興趣，我們想確定一下，因為我們不知道經濟狀況將會發生怎樣的變化。

So part of why we kept it a very limited pilot is -- we didn't want to have a bunch of customers sign up for something that we then had to materially alter the economics because it wasn't backing out.

因此，我們將其保持在非常有限的試點範圍內的部分原因是——我們不希望有一大堆客戶簽署某項協議，然後我們不得不實質地改變經濟狀況，因為它不會退出。

So that was kind of the thinking on that.

這就是我的想法。

And really, we're going to kind of let this one run gather that data and then take a step back and say, is this something we want to continue to pursue?

實際上，我們會透過這次運行來收集數據，然後退一步考慮，這是我們想要繼續追求的東西嗎？

And what tweaks if any, do we need to make to the program before we roll it out to a broader audience.

在向更廣泛的受眾推出該計劃之前，我們需要做哪些調整（如果有的話）？

Great.

偉大的。

Thanks so much.

非常感謝。

Joe Stauff, Susquehanna.

喬·斯托夫，薩斯奎哈納。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Good morning, Jason and Alan.

早安，傑森和艾倫。

Jason, I was wondering if you can give us what you can, but your summary views on the state budget process thus far in terms of new markets, potential new markets or efforts to reduce gray and black markets and taxes.

傑森，我想知道您是否能告訴我們您能提供的相關信息，但請您總結一下您對迄今為止的州預算流程的看法，包括新市場、潛在新市場或減少灰色和黑市以及稅收的努力。

And then I wanted to ask about how to think about the timing of how you layer in, say, new live products throughout 2025, is it chunky, for instance, before March Madness?

然後我想問一下，你如何考慮在 2025 年推出新產品的時間安排，例如，在瘋狂三月之前推出新產品嗎？

Like what -- how to think about that?

就像什麼——如何看待這個問題？

Yeah.

是的。

So on the first question, it's -- this is the kind of sausage-making period where you're going to see lots of news come out -- but there's a whole lot of things that happen between now and when ultimate decisions get made on which states want to move forward with new legislation and anything else that happens in other states, including tax decisions.

因此，關於第一個問題，這是 — — 一個忙碌的時期，您將會看到很多新聞 — — 但是從現在到最終做出決定哪些州想要推進新立法以及其他州發生的任何其他事情（包括稅收決定）之間還有很多事情會發生。

So we're obviously right in the thick of it with our lobbying team trying to make sure that we're getting our points made and that we're helping push forward the policy that we believe is the correct policy, which is to have broad legalization with reasonable regulations and tax rates so that operators like us are able to compete with the ramp in the legal market, which is generating billions and billions of dollars every year.

因此，我們和遊說團隊顯然正處於這場鬥爭的中心，試圖確保我們的觀點得到表達，並幫助推動我們認為正確的政策，即通過合理的監管和稅率實現廣泛的合法化，以便像我們這樣的運營商能夠與合法市場競爭，合法市場每年創造數十億美元的收入。

In fact, what's really been interesting is the degree to which the online casino illegal market has grown over the last few years, and I think that's catching the attention of a lot of lawmakers.

事實上，真正有趣的是過去幾年在線賭場非法市場的增長程度，我認為這引起了很多立法者的注意。

It's actually a very similar story to what happened with sports betting, where a lot of the impetus for legalization came from the fact that it was already.

這實際上與體育博彩的情況非常相似，合法化的很大一部分動力來自於它已經合法化的事實。

So such a ramp in activity in the illegal market and so many people are already doing it that it made sense to protect consumers and generate tax revenue.

非法市場活動如此活躍，而且有這麼多人參與其中，因此保護消費者權益和增加稅收是明智之舉。

So I do think more and more policymakers are thinking about those things and are becoming aware of the size and scope of that illegal market.

因此我確實認為越來越多的政策制定者正在考慮這些事情，並開始意識到非法市場的規模和範圍。

So we're going to see how it plays out over the next few months.

因此我們將觀察未來幾個月的情況。

And obviously, there will be lots of news and headlines.

顯然，將會有大量的新聞和頭條新聞。

But in the end, there's quite a bit between now and when it ultimately resolves in each of these states.

但最終，從現在到各州問題最終得到解決之間還有相當長一段路要走。

That said, I do think we're going to have a little bit better year in terms of legalization.

儘管如此，我確實認為，就合法化而言，今年我們的業績會更好一些。

Last year was a tough year because it was the election and typically getting votes on gaming during an election year is hard.

去年是艱難的一年，因為那一年是選舉年，而在選舉年期間透過遊戲獲得選票通常很困難。

People are just distracted campaigns and also don't want to take up any sort of issue that they even deem mildly controversial.

人們只是被競選活動所分散了注意力，也不想討論任何他們認為有一點爭議的問題。

So I think there will be a little bit more success this year, at least that's my hope.

因此我認為今年會取得更多成功，至少這是我的希望。

And then -- sorry, what was your second question again?

然後——抱歉，您的第二個問題是什麼？

Yeah.

是的。

Just knowing the effort on the live side of things in terms of the new products and so forth

只了解新產品等方面的現場工作

--

--

Like the timing?

喜歡這個時機嗎？

Am I right?

我說得對嗎？

Yeah, how to think about sort of the timing?

是啊，該如何考慮時機呢？

Yeah.

是的。

So we will introduce things throughout the year.

因此我們將全年推出新產品。

It's certainly though the case every year that we try to time certain launches around big events or new season launches.

當然，每年我們都會嘗試將某些產品的發佈時間安排在大型活動或新季節發表會期間。

So you'll see some stuff roll out at the beginning of baseball season.

因此，您會在棒球賽季開始時看到一些東西推出。

You'll also see some things, and this is true across our product.

您還會看到一些東西，這在我們的整個產品中都是如此。

The biggest time of the year for us is to roll things out just before the NFL season.

對我們來說，一年中最重要的時刻就是在 NFL 賽季開始前推出新產品。

A lot of planning and effort goes into making sure that we have the best possible product for NFL and then for NBA after that.

我們投入了大量的規劃和努力來確保我們能為 NFL 和 NBA 提供最好的產品。

So that's -- I think it will be pretty steady, but you will see some big rollouts right before the season is particularly right before the NFL season.

所以 — — 我認為它會相當穩定，但你會看到在賽季前，特別是在 NFL 賽季前的一些大規模推出。

And can I squeeze just one quick one.

我可以只擠一下嗎？

Could you just remind us, March Madness of last year, overall kind of hold, was that, say, favorable versus unfavorable.

您能否提醒我們一下，去年的瘋狂三月，總體而言，是有利的還是不利的。

It was unfavorable last year.

去年的情況並不樂觀。

Thanks a lot.

多謝。

Clark Lampin, BTIG.

克拉克·蘭平（Clark Lampin），BTIG。

Good morning.

早安.

Thanks for taking the question.

感謝您回答這個問題。

Jason, I wanted to ask a question around structural hold trends.

傑森，我想問一個有關結構性持有趨勢的問題。

I'm curious if you could give us a little bit more color around the assumption for '25 and what's embedded from a mix shift standpoint?

我很好奇，您是否可以給我們更多關於‘25’的假設以及從混合轉變的角度嵌入的內容？

You obviously called out some favorable data points around the Super Bowl with same game parlay trends -- have you seen more traction as that product has improved or shifts in engagement?

您顯然指出了超級盃期間一些有利的數據點，以及相同的遊戲聯注趨勢——隨著該產品的改進或參與度的轉變，您是否看到了更多的吸引力？

Just curious if you could give us a framework for the leading edge of player behavior in response to those products and whether that's been consistent with embedded expectations.

我只是好奇您是否可以為我們提供一個框架，以了解玩家對這些產品的反應的前沿行為，以及這是否與內在期望一致。

Yeah.

是的。

Actually, it's been a little bit better than expectation to date, which is why baked in that structural hold in our last guide.

實際上，到目前為止，情況比預期要好一些，這就是為什麼我們在上一份指南中加入了這種結構性支撐。

I should say, better than expectation today better than expectation this NFL season before in terms of what we thought would happen before the NFL season.

我應該說，就我們在 NFL 賽季開始前所認為的情況而言，今天的預期比之前的預期要好。

And NBA has continued to.

NBA 也繼續這麼做。

We've seen great bet mix improvement year-over-year in NBA and a lot of the learnings that we got in terms of how to better -- not just what products customers want, but also how to market and merchandise those products in a more effective way, I think, really paid dividends, both for NFL and thus far through NBA season.

我們看到 NBA 的投注組合逐年大幅改善，我們也學到了很多如何改進的東西——不僅僅是客戶想要什麼產品，還有如何以更有效的方式營銷和銷售這些產品，我認為，這確實為 NFL 和迄今為止的 NBA 賽季帶來了回報。

So that's been a lot of great work on our teams' end to do that.

因此，我們的團隊為此付出了很多出色的工作。

And it seems like there's still upside because each passing week, the numbers are continuing to improve.

而且似乎還有上行空間，因為每過一周，數字都在持續改善。

So we're very bullish on the outlook for structural hold for 2025, and hopefully, we can do even better.

因此，我們對 2025 年結構性維持的前景非常樂觀，並希望我們能夠做得更好。

That's great.

那太棒了。

I wanted to ask a second question, address, I guess, capital allocation and potential international expansion.

我想問第二個問題，我想涉及資本配置和潛在的國際擴張。

You've been consistent for a while and saying that you think DraftKings should be a global enterprise.

您一直堅持認為 DraftKings 應該成為全球性企業。

But to mention this time around seems a little bit more deliberate.

但這次提及似乎更刻意。

It came up in your prepared remarks.

它出現在您準備好的演講中。

Is that in response to market movements, opportunities that are presenting themselves to you now that weren't there before?

這是對市場趨勢的回應嗎？

Or do you believe this is -- maybe we're at a point in time with the progression of the US business and where you are over the next couple of years that it's now just more of a right place, right time situation.

或者您認為——也許我們正處於美國業務發展的某個時間點，而未來幾年您所處的位置現在更像是一個正確的地點、正確的時間的情況。

Just curious if you could give us any color on that.

我只是好奇您是否能向我們提供有關這方面的詳細資訊。

Thank you.

謝謝。

I mean international has always been of interest.

我的意思是國際一直受到人們的關注。

I don't think we deliberately meant to be any stronger on it this quarter than we ever have.

我認為我們本季並沒有刻意要比以往更強大。

It's kind of the same story actually, which is our primary focus, of course, remains to be the US OSB and IGaming space.

這實際上是同一個故事，當然，我們的主要關注點仍然是美國 OSB 和 IGaming 領域。

We've dipped our toe into some other places like digital lottery courier that we are very excited about, and [CLI] have a lot of upside within that overall, US gaming strategy, online gaming strategy.

我們已經涉足了其他一些領域，例如數位彩票快遞，我們對此感到非常興奮，並且[CLI]在整體美國遊戲戰略、線上遊戲戰略中具有很大的上升空間。

And it is true that a lot of the technology we're building could be useful overseas, but it doesn't mean that that's something that we're looking at in the immediate term, we're going to be more deliberate and opportunistic.

確實，我們正在開發的許多技術可能在海外有用，但這並不意味著這是我們短期內考慮的事情，我們將更加謹慎和抓住機會。

So I think for us, it's less like, hey, do we need to do something on the international front now?

因此我認為對我們來說，這並不是說，嘿，我們現在需要在國際方面做些什麼嗎？

Or should it be five years from now?

還是應該是五年後？

And more let's just continue to keep our eye on that and if the right opportunities emerge, be ready to go for it.

讓我們繼續關注這一點，一旦出現合適的機會，就做好抓住它的準備。

But that doesn't mean that, that's something that we have in the near-term horizon.

但這並不意味著這是我們近期內能夠實現的事情。

It's much more opportunistic than that.

這更具機會主義色彩。

We're very fortunate that we feel like we have a huge runway for us in the US and also in Canada.

我們非常幸運，我們覺得我們在美國和加拿大都擁有巨大的發展空間。

So there's really not like a burning need to rush international expansion.

因此，確實沒有迫切需要加速國際擴張。

So there may be a day where we say, look, this is something we just have to do, and we're going to figure it out over the next 12 months.

所以也許有一天我們會說，看，這是我們必須要做的事情，我們會在接下來的 12 個月內找到解決方案。

But right now, it's much more, hey, it's the right opportunity out there?

但是現在，情況更加糟糕，嘿，這是正確的機會嗎？

And if not, we'll just continue to focus on the US.

如果沒有，我們將繼續關注美國。

Okay.

好的。

Thank you very much.

非常感謝。

Dan Politzer, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的 Dan Politzer。

Hey.

嘿。

Good morning, everyone.

大家早安。

First, how do you think about the power of your brand right now for both sports and iGaming.

首先，您認為您的品牌目前對運動和線上遊戲領域的影響力如何。

And do you think that there's a digital opportunity, if at all, for additional brands in either vertical?

您是否認為，這兩個垂直領域中的其他品牌都存在數位化機會？

And I think about Golden Nugget getting all the success you had there is an obvious example, but figured I just check on your -- and where your head's at there.

我認為 Golden Nugget 取得的所有成功就是一個明顯的例子，但我想我只是想檢查一下你的想法。

Yes.

是的。

I think your -- Golden Nugget has been a great success.

我認為您的 Golden Nugget 取得了巨大的成功。

And also for the first part of your question, I think the DraftKings brand is incredibly strong not just with sports, but with iGaming as well.

另外，對於您問題的第一部分，我認為 DraftKings 品牌不僅在體育領域非常強大，而且在 iGaming 領域也同樣強大。

I think we made a ton of headway building our brand in the iGaming market.

我認為我們在 iGaming 市場打造我們的品牌方面取得了巨大進展。

And I also think we've really improved the Golden Nugget Online product, which I think has helped improve that brand and has really helped the share and the growth trajectory of that brand as well.

而且我還認為我們確實改進了 Golden Nugget Online 產品，我認為這有助於提升該品牌，並且確實有助於提高該品牌的份額和成長軌跡。

So I don't see any reason we couldn't plug that into other front ends in terms of iGaming.

因此我認為我們沒有理由不能將其插入 iGaming 的其他前端。

It's not something we're actively looking at, at the moment.

目前，我們還沒有積極考慮這個問題。

But I do think we've built that capability and proven out that model.

但我確實認為我們已經建立了這種能力並證明了該模型。

On the sports side, I think it's probably less proven.

從運動方面來看，我認為這可能還沒有得到證實。

It doesn't mean it couldn't work, but there are reasons to believe that it's more effective strategy in iGaming than it is in sports.

這並不意味著它不起作用，但有理由相信它在 iGaming 中比在運動中更有效。

So that's why we focus more on iGaming state.

這就是我們更加關注 iGaming 狀態的原因。

Got it.

知道了。

And then I think in your filings, you can kind of backed into what gaming taxes were as a percentage of revenues.

然後我認為，在您的文件中，您可以支持博彩稅佔收入的百分比。

I was coming out to something around 37%, 38%.

我的結果大概是 37%、38% 左右。

As I think about your adjusted gross margin targets for 2025, are you anticipating that gaming taxes go up?

當我考慮您 2025 年的調整後毛利率目標時，您是否預期博弈稅會上漲？

And maybe as you think about kind of that out-year guidance you laid out a while ago, I mean, as we sit here today, what are you baking in, in terms of taxes?

也許當您想到您之前提出的年度預期時，我的意思是，當我們今天坐在這裡時，您在稅收方面考慮了什麼？

And maybe even some of the other costs within your cost of goods sold, like platform cost, market access fees or processing fees.

甚至可能還包括銷售成本中的其他一些成本，如平台成本、市場准入費或加工費。

Yeah, we -- it's a bit lower than what you said.

是的，我們 - 它比你說的要低一點。

So it's not 37%, 38%.

所以不是37%、38%。

But what we've assumed for 2025 is no change in taxes.

但我們假設2025年的稅收不會改變。

It's kind of the same approach we're taking on legalization or anything legislatively that until we have clear line of sight that something needs to be changed in our forecast.

這和我們在合法化或任何立法方面採取的方法類似，直到我們清楚地認識到我們的預測需要改變一些東西。

We're not going to change it.

我們不會改變它。

And right now, there's no reason to bake in higher tax rates because no state has actually increased our tax rate this year.

而目前，沒有理由提高稅率，因為今年沒有一個州真正提高稅率。

So obviously, something that could change and something that we are very focused on from a government affairs standpoint, but from a guidance standpoint, we didn't bake in any additional legalization.

因此顯然，有些事情可能會發生變化，從政府事務的角度來看我們也非常關注這一點，但從指導的角度來看，我們並沒有加入任何額外的合法化措施。

We don't have the Missouri launch in there, and we don't have any additional changes in terms of tax and regulation either.

我們沒有在密蘇裡州推出新產品，在稅收和監管方面也沒有任何額外的變化。

Thank you so much.

太感謝了。

Jed Kelly, Oppenheimer.

傑德凱利、奧本海默。

Hey.

嘿。

Great.

偉大的。

Thank you for taking my question.

感謝您回答我的問題。

It seems like your Jack pocket cross-sell is being pretty effective -- but does that give you a sense that you want to like invest more in Jack pocket in states where sports betting or iGaming is not legal.

看起來你的 Jack pocket 交叉銷售非常有效 - 但這是否讓你覺得你想在體育博彩或 iGaming 非法的州對 Jack pocket 進行更多投資。

And I know you've recently just touched on the NBA product earlier.

我知道您最近剛剛談到 NBA 產品。

Can you give us an update on where you think your NBA product is relative to your chief competitor?

您能否向我們介紹一下您認為您的 NBA 產品與主要競爭對手相比處於什麼位置？

Thanks.

謝謝。

Yeah.

是的。

I think Jackpocket has been great in terms of both the cross-sell and also, we had really strong customer acquisition during this last Mega Million $1.2 billion jackpot run.

我認為 Jackpocket 在交叉銷售方面表現非常出色，而且在最近一次 Mega Million 12 億美元大獎抽獎中，我們的客戶獲取能力也非常強勁。

So I do think that there's room to invest more there.

因此我確實認為那裡還有更多投資的空間。

And I think that for us, it's probably more effective in states where there's legal sports betting and iGaming because the LTVs in the immediate term are going to be higher because we can cross-sell right away.

我認為對我們來說，在體育博彩和 iGaming 合法的州，這種方法可能更有效，因為我們可以立即進行交叉銷售，因此短期內的 LTV 將會更高。

But certainly, if there are states that we think we can efficiently build a customer base similar to what we're doing in DFS I think that's also a great opportunity and one of the reasons that we feel excited about Jackpocket.

但可以肯定的是，如果我們認為我們可以在某些州有效地建立類似於我們在 DFS 所做的客戶群，我認為這也是一個很好的機會，也是我們對 Jackpocket 感到興奮的原因之一。

In terms of the NBA product, we think our product is as good as anyone in the market right now.

就 NBA 產品而言，我們認為我們的產品與目前市場上的任何產品一樣好。

And I think that, that is probably something I wouldn't have said a year or two ago.

我認為，這可能是一兩年前我不會說的話。

I think definitely not two years ago, maybe a year ago.

我認為肯定不是兩年前，也許是一年前。

But right now, I think it's as good, if not better than anything else out there.

但現在，我認為它和其他產品一樣好，甚至更好。

So really excited about the progress and proud of the progress our product and technology team has made.

我對我們的產品和技術團隊所取得的進步感到非常興奮，並感到自豪。

And I actually think there's a lot of upside, particularly on the live side, where I think we have a best-in-class clear advantage over the rest of the industry.

我確實認為我們有很多優勢，特別是在現場直播方面，我認為我們比業內其他公司有著一流的明顯優勢。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Brandt Montour, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的 Brandt Montour。

Good morning, everybody.

大家早安。

Thanks for taking my question.

感謝您回答我的問題。

Jason, I want to drill in on one of the comments you made in your prepared remarks that the long-term ceiling for hold is higher than you thought.

傑森，我想深入探討你在準備好的發言中提到的一個評論，即長期持有的上限比你想像的要高。

Could you just maybe flesh that out for us?

能為我們詳細說明一下嗎？

Is that just a mix comment?

這僅僅是一個混合評論嗎？

Is that a comment that you just sort of see your chief competitor sort of growing their parlay mix ever higher.

您是否認為您的主要競爭對手正在不斷提高他們的累積賭注組合？

But just the ceiling part is the part I'm focused on.

但我關注的只是天花板部分。

Yeah.

是的。

It's really because of the amount of increase we saw this year.

這確實是因為我們今年看到的成長量。

I think that if you sort of look at the curve and how much it's improved, and obviously, there's a lot of actions we've taken.

我認為，如果你看一下曲線並看看它改善了多少，顯然我們已經採取了很多行動。

So it's not just natural evolution, but it doesn't look like it's slowing down.

所以這不僅僅是自然進化，而且看起來它並沒有減緩的跡象。

It looks like it's accelerating.

看起來它正在加速。

So I don't know where the ceiling is, but we are fairly conservative in our multiyear plan.

所以我不知道上限在哪裡，但我們的多年計劃相當保守。

So I think that we haven't actually quantified it, so I want to give a number, but we were more conservative certainly than some of the numbers that have been thrown out by our chief competitor.

所以我認為我們實際上還沒有量化它，所以我想給出一個數字，但我們肯定比我們的主要競爭對手給出的一些數字更保守。

So I think that gives us confidence, too, that if they're seeing line of sight to that, that that's probably achievable for us, too.

所以我認為這也給了我們信心，如果他們看到了這一點，那麼我們也可能實現這一點。

Okay.

好的。

Great.

偉大的。

And then just a quick follow-up on iGaming.

然後簡單談談 iGaming。

Curious if you're having any concerns about what you're seeing in the promotional environment out there. if that's something that could get -- if that could heat up further if we don't get any new state legislation over the next couple of years?

好奇您是否對所看到的促銷環境有任何擔憂。如果這種情況發生——如果我們在未來幾年內沒有任何新的州立法，這種情況是否會進一步升溫？

I don't think so.

我不這麼認為。

I mean iGaming actually has declined year-over-year in '24 in promotional intensity.

我的意思是，iGaming 的促銷強度在 24 年實際上比去年同期有所下降。

Now it didn't go down as much as sports, but that's more a function of the fact that there hasn't been a lot of new iGaming legalization in the last three, four years.

現在它並沒有像體育那樣下降那麼多，但這更多的是因為在過去的三四年裡，iGaming 合法化的新情況並不多。

So naturally with more of the newer markets and sports having launched in the last couple of years, they're going to have much more decline since their customer acquisition relative to existing customers is much stronger in the early years.

因此，自然而然地，隨著過去幾年越來越多的新市場和新運動的推出，它們將遭遇更大的下滑，因為相對於現有客戶，他們在早年的客戶獲取能力要強得多。

So I think that's really what you're seeing in terms of the difference between the two, but both sports and iGaming went down, and I expect iGaming to continue to decline in 2025 in terms of promotional (multiple speakers) side, obviously, (inaudible) to grow, but we expect a decline.

所以我認為這確實是你看到的兩者之間的差異，但體育和 iGaming 都在下降，我預計 iGaming 在 2025 年在促銷（多位發言者）方面將繼續下降，顯然（聽不清楚）會增長，但我們預計會下降。

Barry Jonas, Truist Securities.

巴里喬納斯（Barry Jonas），Truist Securities。

Hey, guys.

嘿，大家好。

Good morning.

早安.

With the new higher Illinois tax in place for a bit now, can you talk about or maybe try to quantify what you've been able to do to offset the hit there?

由於伊利諾伊州新稅已經提高，您能否談談或嘗試量化您能採取哪些措施來抵消由此帶來的衝擊？

We've done some things like reduced promotional intensity and marketing in the state.

我們做了一些事情，例如減少在州內的促銷強度和行銷。

So that has helped.

這確實有幫助。

Obviously, it didn't completely offset it, but the business has done so well from other perspectives that we actually were able to continue to maintain that $900 million to $1 billion guidance even with the Illinois tax hit.

顯然，它並沒有完全抵消這一影響，但從其他角度來看，業務表現非常好，即使受到伊利諾伊州稅收的打擊，我們實際上仍能夠繼續維持 9 億至 10 億美元的指導價格。

So I feel very good about that and very excited about the overall trajectory of the business.

因此我對此感到非常高興，並對業務的整體發展感到非常興奮。

And we -- like I said, we're able to mitigate some of it, but we weren't able to mitigate all of it in Illinois.

而且我們 — — 正如我所說的，我們能夠緩解其中的一些影響，但我們無法在伊利諾伊州緩解所有影響。

That's helpful.

這很有幫助。

And then just with the Missouri launch, can you maybe frame or even quantify what the investment what we should expect for the investment this year, and it would be helpful to frame it relative to prior similarly sized launches in the past from a CAC perspective?

然後，就密蘇裡州的發布而言，您能否規劃甚至量化今年的投資預期，並且從 CAC 角度將其與過去類似規模的發布進行比較是否有幫助？

Thanks.

謝謝。

Yes.

是的。

We're not putting an exact number out there now because the timing is still up in the air.

我們現在還不能給出確切的數字，因為時間還不確定。

The earlier in the year, it is the less sort of overall on the year because we'll have more time to make it up, the less of an EBITDA hit.

越早開始，對全年整體的影響就越小，因為我們將有更多的時間來彌補，EBITDA 受到的打擊就越小。

So we're going to wait until they have a launch date set before we put a number out there.

因此，我們要等到他們確定發售日期後才會公佈具體數字。

But as soon as they do, we'll share that with everybody.

一旦他們做出決定，我們就會與大家分享。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Ben Chaiken, Mizuho.

瑞穗的本‧柴肯 (Ben Chaiken)。

Hey.

嘿。

Thanks for taking my questions.

感謝您回答我的問題。

First question was on payments.

第一個問題是關於付款的。

This one might be a little bit out there, but I'll take a shot.

這個可能有點不著邊際，但我會試試看。

With what feels like both social and political acceptance of crypto currency, do you envision a time when DraftKings would accept stable coin to the form of payment, the idea being reduced expenses to move money in and out of wallet among other items, and fully recognizing you may have other fish to fry, but any color you can provide or thoughts would be great.

隨著社會和政治對加密貨幣的接受，您是否設想過 DraftKings 會接受穩定幣作為支付方式，這樣可以減少將錢轉入和轉出錢包等的費用，並且充分認識到您可能還有其他事情要做，但您能提供任何意見或想法都很好。

Thanks.

謝謝。

Yeah, it's a great question.

是的，這是一個很好的問題。

I mean, it's certainly something we're looking at.

我的意思是，這確實是我們正在關注的事情。

It's not entirely a product road map question.

這不完全是一個產品路線圖的問題。

It's also getting regulators comfortable with it because regulators typically are cautious around crypto in the states, obviously, at a federal level, there's a lot of pro crypto deregulation, I think, coming.

這也讓監管機構對此感到滿意，因為各州的監管機構通常對加密貨幣持謹慎態度，顯然，在聯邦層面，我認為會出現許多支持加密貨幣的放鬆管制舉措。

But it's certainly -- and that certainly affects the state's perspective, but they still need to get comfortable.

但這肯定會影響國家的觀點，但他們仍然需要感到安心。

So there are only a handful of states that are open to it at the moment.

因此，目前只有少數幾個州對此持開放態度。

So it doesn't feel like a huge opportunity.

所以這看起來不像是一個巨大的機會。

But if that grows to a larger number of states, it's something that I think we take a more serious look at.

但如果這現象擴展到更多州，我認為我們應該更認真地考慮這個問題。

Understood.

明白了。

Appreciate it.

非常感謝。

And then I hear your comments on the promotional intensity being down from earlier in the call.

然後我聽到您在通話中談到促銷力度較之前有所下降。

But is it fair to say that you've allocated a little more to external marketing spend in '25?

但是否可以說你們在 25 年撥付了更多資金用於外部行銷？

My guess is that you're allocating some to Jackpocket and then also to embrace the stronger customer acquisition environment we've seen in the last few quarters.

我猜你會將一部分資金分配給 Jackpocket，同時也是為了迎接我們在過去幾季看到的更強勁的客戶獲取環境。

I guess, Am I thinking about that correctly?

我想，我這樣想對嗎？

And then any high-level cadence or waiting to the year to be aware of?

然後有任何高級節奏或等待年份才要注意嗎？

Thanks.

謝謝。

Yes.

是的。

So we have added a little and it's really Jackpocket.

因此我們添加了一些，它就真的是 Jackpocket 了。

OSB and iGaming is going to be pretty steady year-over-year.

OSB 和 iGaming 的同比增速將相當穩定。

So it's really Jackpocket.

所以它確實是 Jackpocket。

And that's going to be a little dependent on the jackpot environment.

這在一定程度上取決於大獎環境。

But we saw a pretty strong customer acquisition during this last Mega Millions run, so we want to make sure we're prepared to add a lot of really efficient customers if that happens again, which I think it will.

但在上一次 Mega Millions 運行期間，我們看到了相當強勁的客戶獲取量，因此，如果這種情況再次發生，我們希望確保我們準備好增加大量真正高效的客戶，我認為這種情況會發生。

I mean, at least they'll be one or two hopefully more because I don't know if everybody knows this, but they decreased -- or excuse me, increased the price of the ticket, which means that people either spend more, which is great. or people will spend the same but get less tickets, which then means jackpots will hit less, which means they'll roll more and get bigger.

我的意思是，至少他們會多一兩個，因為我不知道是否每個人都知道這一點，但是他們降低了——或者對不起，提高了票價，這意味著人們要么花更多錢，這很好。或者人們會花同樣的錢但買到更少的彩票，這意味著中頭獎的幾率會更小，也意味著他們會擲得更多、獎金更多。

So I think that's actually a really positive development for the digital lottery market.

所以我認為這對於數位彩票市場來說實際上是一個非常積極的發展。

Very helpful.

非常有幫助。

Thank you.

謝謝。

This concludes the question-and-answer session.

問答環節到此結束。

I would now like to hand the call back over to Jason Robins for closing remarks.

現在我想將發言權交還給傑森羅賓斯 (Jason Robins)，請他作最後發言。

Thanks, everybody, for joining us on today's call.

感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。

We're really excited about the trajectory for 2025 and beyond, and thank you for your continued support.

我們對 2025 年及以後的發展軌跡感到非常興奮，感謝您一直以來的支持。

Thanks.

謝謝。

This concludes today's conference call.

今天的電話會議到此結束。

Thank you for your participation.

感謝您的參與。

You may now disconnect.

您現在可以斷開連線。