HF Sinclair Corp (DINO) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to HF Sinclair Corporation's second-quarter 2025 conference call and webcast. Hosting the call today is Tim Go, Chief Executive Officer of HF Sinclair. He is joined by Atanas Atanasov, Chief Financial Officer; Steve Ledbetter, EVP of Commercial; Valerie Pompa, Operations; and Matt Joyce, SVP of Lubricants and Specialties.

歡迎參加 HF Sinclair Corporation 2025 年第二季電話會議和網路廣播。今天主持電話會議的是 HF Sinclair 執行長 Tim Go。與他一同出席的還有財務長阿塔納斯·阿塔納索夫 (Atanas Atanasov)、商業執行副總裁史蒂夫·萊德貝特 (Steve Ledbetter)、營運總監瓦萊麗·龐帕 (Valerie Pompa) 和潤滑油及特種產品高級副總裁馬特·喬伊斯 (Matt Joyce)。

(Operator Instructions) And please note that this conference is being recorded.

（操作員指示）請注意，本次會議正在錄音。

It is now my pleasure to turn the floor over to Craig Biery, Vice President, Investor Relations. Craig, you may now go ahead, please.

現在我很高興將發言權交給投資人關係副總裁 Craig Biery。克雷格，現在你可以繼續了。

Thank you, Ellie. Good morning, everyone, and welcome to HF Sinclair corporation's second quarter 2025 earnings call. This morning, we issued a press release announcing results for the quarter ending June 30, 2025. If you would like a copy of the earnings press release, you may find it on our website at hfsinclair.com.

謝謝你，艾莉。大家早安，歡迎參加 HF Sinclair 公司 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。今天上午，我們發布了一份新聞稿，宣布了截至 2025 年 6 月 30 日的季度業績。如果您想要一份收益新聞稿的副本，您可以在我們的網站 hfsinclair.com 上找到。

Before we proceed with remarks, please note the Safe Harbor disclosure statement in today's press release. In summary, such statements made regarding management expectations, judgments or predictions are forward-looking statements. These statements are intended to be covered under the Safe Harbor provisions of federal security laws. There are many factors that could cause results to differ from expectations, including those noted in our SEC filings. The call also may include discussion of non-GAAP measures.

在我們繼續發表評論之前，請注意今天新聞稿中的安全港披露聲明。綜上所述，此類有關管理階層預期、判斷或預測的陳述均屬於前瞻性陳述。這些聲明旨在受到聯邦安全法的安全港條款的保護。有許多因素可能導致結果與預期不同，包括我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中提到的因素。電話會議也可能包括對非公認會計準則措施的討論。

Please see the earnings press release for reconciliations to GAAP financial measures. Also, please note any time-sensitive information provided on today's call may no longer be accurate at the time of any webcast replay or rereading of the transcript.

請參閱收益新聞稿以了解與 GAAP 財務指標的對帳情況。此外，請注意，今天電話會議中提供的任何時間敏感資訊在任何網路直播重播或重新閱讀記錄時可能不再準確。

And with that, I'll turn the call over to Tim.

說完這些，我會把電話轉給提姆。

Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining our call. During the second quarter of 2025, we made strong progress against our strategic priorities to improve reliability, optimization and integration. And I'm pleased to report we delivered sequential improvements over the last three quarters in our three key metrics: refining throughput, capture and lower operating costs, allowing us to return $145 million to stockholders through dividends and share repurchases in the current period.

大家早安，感謝你們參加我們的電話會議。2025 年第二季度，我們在提高可靠性、優化和整合的策略重點方面取得了重大進展。我很高興地報告，我們在過去三個季度中在三個關鍵指標上取得了連續的改善：煉油吞吐量、捕獲和降低營運成本，這使我們能夠在本期透過股息和股票回購向股東返還 1.45 億美元。

Looking forward, we remain focused on advancing these priorities further and with the majority of our turnarounds behind us in 2025, we believe we are well positioned to continue to execute our strategy and return excess cash to our shareholders.

展望未來，我們將繼續專注於進一步推進這些優先事項，並且隨著我們在 2025 年的大部分扭虧為盈，我們相信我們已做好準備繼續執行我們的策略並向股東返還多餘的現金。

Now let me cover our segment highlights. In Refining, for the second quarter, we successfully completed the scheduled turnaround activities at our Tulsa and Parco refineries. We also delivered sequential quarter improvements in capture and crude throughput despite heavy maintenance, weaker crude differentials and a rising RIN price environment.

現在讓我來介紹一下我們的部分亮點。在煉油業務方面，第二季度，我們成功完成了塔爾薩和帕科煉油廠的預定檢修活動。儘管面臨繁重的維護、原油價差走弱以及 RIN 價格上漲的環境，我們的捕獲量和原油吞吐量仍實現了連續幾季的成長。

In addition, we achieved operating expense per throughput barrel of $7.32, showing significant progress again towards our near-term goal of $7.25 per barrel. Looking ahead, we have one remaining turnaround at our Puget Sound refinery scheduled to begin at the end of the third quarter.

此外，我們實現了每桶 7.32 美元的營運費用，這再次表明我們朝著每桶 7.25 美元的近期目標邁出了重大進展。展望未來，我們普吉特海灣煉油廠還有一次檢修，計劃於第三季末開始。

In Renewables, we continue to deliver near breakeven EBITDA results in this tough economic environment as we continue to maximize our low CI feedstock mix while controlling our operating expenses. These results are indicative of how much we've improved our renewable diesel business, especially in light of the significant loss of BGC year-over-year.

在再生能源領域，我們在嚴峻的經濟環境下繼續實現接近盈虧平衡的 EBITDA 業績，因為我們繼續最大限度地利用低 CI 原料組合，同時控制營運費用。這些結果顯示我們的再生柴油業務取得了多大的進步，特別是考慮到 BGC 的年比大幅虧損。

In the second quarter, we began to partially recognize some benefits from the producers tax credit and expect to capture additional incremental PTC value in the third quarter. Our Marketing segment delivered $25 million in EBITDA and achieved an adjusted gross margin of $0.10 per gallon delivered by optimizing our business since the Sinclair acquisition.

在第二季度，我們開始部分確認生產者稅收抵免的一些好處，並預計在第三季度獲得額外的增量 PTC 價值。自收購 Sinclair 以來，透過優化業務，我們的行銷部門實現了 2500 萬美元的 EBITDA，並實現了每加侖 0.10 美元的調整後毛利率。

We also grew our branded supplied stores by a net of 55 sites during the quarter and up a net 155 stores over the past 12 months, both records for a quarter and for a trailing 12-month period, and we have over 80 additional supplied branded sites signed and targeted to bring online over the next 6 to 12 months.

本季度，我們的品牌供應商店淨增 55 家，過去 12 個月淨增 155 家，創下季度和過去 12 個月的最高紀錄，並且我們已簽約超過 80 個額外的品牌供應站點，計劃在未來 6 到 12 個月內上線。

In Lubricants & Specialties, we reported $55 million in EBITDA, which includes a significant $20 million in FIFO headwinds due to falling feedstock prices. During the period, sales volumes and product mix were impacted by our Mississauga turnaround. However, we continue to execute on our strategy, afford integrating our base oils into both finished and specialty businesses, most notably launching a Sinclair lubricants product offering in the United States.

在潤滑油和特種化學品領域，我們報告的 EBITDA 為 5,500 萬美元，其中包括由於原料價格下跌而導致的 2,000 萬美元的 FIFO 不利因素。在此期間，銷售量和產品組合受到密西沙加轉型的影響。然而，我們將繼續執行我們的策略，將我們的基礎油整合到成品和特種業務中，最引人注目的是在美國推出辛克萊潤滑油產品。

In our Midstream business, we delivered $112 million of adjusted EBITDA as we benefited from higher pipeline revenues and lower operating costs from our focused integration efforts since the HEP [buyout]. During the quarter, we returned $145 million in cash to shareholders, consisting of $50 million in share repurchases and $95 million in regular dividends.

在我們的中游業務中，我們實現了 1.12 億美元的調整後 EBITDA，這是因為自 HEP [收購] 以來，我們重點關注的整合工作帶來了更高的管道收入和更低的營運成本。本季度，我們向股東返還了 1.45 億美元現金，其中包括 5,000 萬美元的股票回購和 9,500 萬美元的定期股息。

Since the Sinclair acquisition in March 2022, we have returned over $4.2 billion in cash to shareholders and have reduced our share count by over 58 million shares. As of June 30, 2025, we had approximately $750 million remaining on our share repurchase authorization, and we remain committed to returning excess cash to shareholders while maintaining our investment-grade balance sheet.

自 2022 年 3 月收購 Sinclair 以來，我們已向股東返還了超過 42 億美元的現金，並減少了超過 5,800 萬股的股份。截至 2025 年 6 月 30 日，我們的股票回購授權剩餘約 7.5 億美元，我們仍致力於將多餘的現金回饋給股東，同時維持投資等級資產負債表。

Also today, we announced that our Board of Directors declared a regular quarterly dividend of $0.50 per share, payable on September 4, 2025, to holders of record on August 21, 2025.

今天我們也宣布，董事會宣布派發每股 0.50 美元的定期季度股息，將於 2025 年 9 月 4 日支付給 2025 年 8 月 21 日登記在冊的股東。

Looking forward, we are encouraged by the continued strength in refining margins across our system, particularly in distillates. We believe our overall strategy is working and delivering visible organic growth to our bottom line, both in refining and our nonrefining segments, and we remain committed to executing our strategic priorities in order to continue to return cash to our shareholders.

展望未來，我們對整個系統煉油利潤率持續走高感到鼓舞，尤其是餾分油的利潤率。我們相信，我們的整體策略正在發揮作用，並為我們的煉油和非煉油部門的獲利帶來明顯的有機成長，我們將繼續致力於執行我們的策略重點，以繼續為股東帶來現金回報。

With that, let me turn the call over to Atanas.

說完這些，讓我把電話轉給阿塔納斯。

Thank you, Tim, and good morning, everyone. Let's begin by reviewing HF Sinclair's financial highlights. Today, we reported second quarter net income attributable to HF Sinclair shareholders of $208 million, or $1.10 per diluted share. These results reflect special items that collectively decreased net income by $114 million.

謝謝你，提姆，大家早安。讓我們先回顧一下 HF Sinclair 的財務亮點。今天，我們報告稱，第二季度歸屬於 HF Sinclair 股東的淨收入為 2.08 億美元，即每股攤薄收益 1.10 美元。這些結果反映出特殊項目導致淨收入總計減少 1.14 億美元。

Excluding these items, adjusted net income for the second quarter was $322 million, or $1.70 per diluted share compared to adjusted net income of $150 million, or $0.78 per diluted share for the same period in 2024.

不包括這些項目，第二季調整後淨收入為 3.22 億美元，即每股攤薄收益 1.70 美元，而 2024 年同期調整後淨收入為 1.5 億美元，即每股攤薄收益 0.78 美元。

Adjusted EBITDA for the second quarter was $665 million compared to $406 million in the second quarter of 2024. In our Refining segment, second quarter adjusted EBITDA was $476 million compared to $187 million in the second quarter of 2024. This increase was principally driven by higher adjusted refinery gross margins in both the West and Mid-Con regions, partially offset by lower refined product sales volumes.

第二季調整後 EBITDA 為 6.65 億美元，而 2024 年第二季為 4.06 億美元。在我們的煉油部門，第二季調整後的 EBITDA 為 4.76 億美元，而 2024 年第二季為 1.87 億美元。這一增長主要得益於西部和中部地區煉油廠調整後毛利率的提高，但成品油銷量的下降部分抵消了這一增長。

Oil charge averaged 616,000 barrels per day for the second quarter compared to 635,000 barrels per day for the second quarter of 2024. This decrease was primarily a result of turnaround activities at our Tulsa and Parco refineries during the second quarter of 2025.

第二季石油消耗量平均為每天 616,000 桶，而 2024 年第二季為每天 635,000 桶。這一下降主要是由於我們 2025 年第二季塔爾薩和帕爾科煉油廠的周轉活動所致。

In our Renewables segment, we reported adjusted EBITDA of negative $2 million in the second quarter, excluding the lower cost to market inventory valuation adjustment benefit of $24 million compared to $2 million of adjusted EBITDA for the second quarter of 2024. Our second quarter 2025 results were impacted by lower sales volumes and margins.

在我們的再生能源部門，我們報告第二季的調整後 EBITDA 為負 200 萬美元，不包括 2,400 萬美元的較低市場庫存估值調整收益，而 2024 年第二季的調整後 EBITDA 為 200 萬美元。我們的 2025 年第二季業績受到銷售量和利潤率下降的影響。

During the quarter, we recognized a partial benefit from the producer's tax credit. Total sales volumes were 55 million gallons for the second quarter of 2025 compared to 64 million gallons for the second quarter of 2024.

在本季度，我們確認了生產者稅收抵免的部分收益。2025 年第二季的總銷售量為 5,500 萬加侖，而 2024 年第二季的總銷售量為 6,400 萬加侖。

Our Marketing segment reported EBITDA of $25 million for the second quarter compared to $15 million for the second quarter of 2024. This increase was primarily driven by higher margins and migrating our mix of stores in the second quarter of 2025. Our Lubricants and Specialties segment reported EBITDA of $55 million for the second quarter compared to EBITDA of $97 million for the second quarter of 2024.

我們的行銷部門報告第二季的 EBITDA 為 2,500 萬美元，而 2024 年第二季的 EBITDA 為 1,500 萬美元。這一成長主要得益於利潤率的提高以及 2025 年第二季門市組合的遷移。我們的潤滑油和特種產品部門報告第二季的 EBITDA 為 5,500 萬美元，而 2024 年第二季的 EBITDA 為 9,700 萬美元。

This decrease was primarily driven by lower base oil margins in addition to lower sales volumes as a result of turnaround activities at our Mississauga facility.

造成這一下降的主要原因是基礎油利潤率較低，以及由於我們密西沙加工廠的周轉活動導致銷售量下降。

During the second quarter of 2025, we recognized a FIFO charge of $20 million in the quarter versus a FIFO charge of $14 million in the same period last year. Our Midstream segment reported adjusted EBITDA of $112 million in the second quarter compared to $110 million in the same period of last year. This increase was primarily driven by higher pipeline revenues and lower operating expenses, partially offset by lower volumes in the second quarter of 2025.

在 2025 年第二季度，我們確認了 2,000 萬美元的 FIFO 費用，而去年同期的 FIFO 費用為 1,400 萬美元。我們的中游部門報告第二季調整後 EBITDA 為 1.12 億美元，而去年同期為 1.1 億美元。這一成長主要得益於管道收入增加和營運費用降低，但 2025 年第二季的銷售下降部分抵消了這一增長。

Net cash provided by operations totaled $587 million in the second quarter, which included $179 million of turnaround spend. HF Sinclair capital expenditures totaled $111 million for the second quarter of 2025. As of June 30, 2025, HF Sinclair's cash balance was $874 million. As of June 30, we had $2.7 billion of debt outstanding with a debt-to-cap ratio of 22% and a net debt-to-cap ratio of 15%.

第二季經營活動提供的淨現金總計 5.87 億美元，其中包括 1.79 億美元的周轉支出。HF Sinclair 2025 年第二季的資本支出總計 1.11 億美元。截至 2025 年 6 月 30 日，HF Sinclair 的現金餘額為 8.74 億美元。截至 6 月 30 日，我們的未償負債為 27 億美元，負債與資本比率為 22%，淨負債與資本比率為 15%。

Let's go through some guidance items. With respect to capital spending for full year 2025, we still expect to spend approximately $775 million in sustaining capital, including turnaround and catalysts. This is down $25 million from 2024 and included a nonrefining Lubricants and Specialties turnaround in the first half of 2025. In addition, we expect to spend $100 million in growth capital investments across our business segments.

讓我們來看看一些指導事項。對於 2025 年全年的資本支出，我們仍預計將花費約 7.75 億美元的維持資本，包括轉虧為盈和催化劑。這比 2024 年減少了 2,500 萬美元，其中包括 2025 年上半年非煉油潤滑油和特種產品業務的扭虧為盈。此外，我們預計將在各個業務部門投入 1 億美元用於成長資本投資。

For the third quarter of 2025, we expect to run between 615,000 and 645,000 barrels per day of crude oil in our Refining segment, which reflects the planned turnaround at our Puget Sound refinery.

到 2025 年第三季度，我們預計煉油部門的原油日產量將在 615,000 至 645,000 桶之間，這反映了我們普吉特海灣煉油廠的計畫轉變。

We're now ready to take questions from the audience.

我們現在準備回答觀眾的提問。

(Operator instructions) Manav Gupta, UBS.

（操作員指示）Manav Gupta，瑞銀。

Very strong performance in Refining. Captures across both refining systems very strong. Just trying to understand, is this a function of something which happened during the quarter? Or is it also somewhere -- I mean, you took over, Tim, you had this policy that you want the most competitive refining system in the business. Is this also a function of you're kind of getting there where now your capture rates are matching some of the best in the business. So if you could help us understand the very strong capture rates in both regions.

在煉油方面表現非常強勁。兩個精煉系統的捕獲能力都非常強。只是想了解一下，這是本季發生的事情的功能嗎？或者它也在某個地方——我的意思是，當你接任時，你有這樣的政策，你想要業內最具競爭力的煉油系統。這是否也是您目前所取得的成就的體現，即您的捕獲率已達到業界最佳水準。因此，如果您能幫助我們了解這兩個地區的高捕獲率。

Manav, this is Steve Ledbetter. Thanks for the question. And we are quite proud of the performance and capture sequentially, as Tim mentioned, quarter-over-quarter for the past three quarters. Despite what we saw in terms of headwinds as far as heavy diffs narrowing A&S getting more expensive as well as the backwardation in the role, we continued to improve our overall leading crude performance, and that is really improving by creating flexibility of our crude slate and improving the mode of transportation of how we get that crude into our systems and on our integrated midstream assets. So it helps both ways.

馬納夫，這是史蒂夫·萊德貝特。謝謝你的提問。正如蒂姆所提到的，我們對過去三個季度的業績和環比增長感到非常自豪。儘管我們看到了巨大的差距縮小、A&S 變得更加昂貴以及現貨溢價等不利因素，但我們仍然繼續提高我們整體領先的原油表現，而這確實通過創造原油供應的靈活性和改善我們將原油運送到我們的系統和綜合中游資產的運輸方式而得到改善。所以這是雙向的。

I think larger than that, we ran very well. We produced and finished the products that we wanted. Our distillate production was up quarter-over-quarter over 10,000 barrels a day. We're continuing to focus on premium. And I think we're looking down the road and around the bend, and we're putting barrels in the markets that we see are coming short and taking advantage of those arbs.

我認為，比這更大一些，我們跑得很好。我們生產並完成了我們想要的產品。我們的餾分油產量較上季成長，每天超過 10,000 桶。我們將繼續關注高端產品。我認為，我們正在展望未來，當我們看到市場出現短缺時，我們會投入資金，並利用這些套利機會。

We're just getting better at this and making substantial different changes in how we take more nimble and accurate decisions, and we see that continuing as we move forward.

我們在這方面做得越來越好，並且在如何做出更靈活、更準確的決策方面做出了實質的改變，而且我們看到這種情況會隨著我們的前進而持續下去。

My follow-up quick here is, look, there were some buybacks in the quarter, margins are stronger. If things stay where they are, should we expect you to probably increase the pace of buybacks, but also there are a number of bolt-on opportunities out there in terms of both lubes and marketing.

我的後續問題是，你看，本季有一些回購，利潤率更高。如果情況保持不變，我們是否應該預期您可能會加快回購步伐，但在潤滑油和行銷方面也存在許多附加機會。

So how should we think about shareholder returns versus smaller bolt-on opportunities, which historically, you have done very well in acquiring stuff? And how should we think about the balance between those two for the cash that you're generating?

那麼，我們該如何看待股東回報與較小的附加機會呢？從歷史上看，你們在收購方面做得非常好。那麼，對於您所創造的現金，我們應該如何考慮這兩者之間的平衡呢？

Thanks, Manav. This is Atanas. It's a great question. We reiterate our strong commitment to our shareholder returns, as you could see in this past quarter, we're looking at 8%, 9%. If margins continue to be where they are, we anticipate to continue to execute on that priority.

謝謝，Manav。這是阿塔納斯。這是一個很好的問題。我們重申對股東回報的堅定承諾，正如您在上個季度所看到的，我們的目標是實現 8%、9% 的回報。如果利潤率繼續維持現狀，我們預計將繼續執行此優先事項。

History is a good indicator of how we've done. We've delivered historically double-digit returns, and we remain committed to that with respect to how do we balance between organic growth versus capital returns organic, we believe we can achieve both successfully given the cash flow generations in the business.

歷史可以很好地表明我們的成就。我們歷史上一直實現兩位數的回報，並且我們仍然致力於在有機增長與資本回報之間取得平衡，我們相信，考慮到業務中的現金流生成，我們可以成功實現這兩個目標。

And as we look at capital -- as we look at returns on organic projects, those are highly accretive at 20%-plus IRRs and multiples of around 4 times. So we believe we can achieve both and reward our shareholders with that success.

當我們查看資本時——當我們查看有機項目的回報時，這些項目的 IRR 和倍數都具有很高的增值性，分別為 20% 以上和 4 倍。因此，我們相信我們能夠實現這兩個目標，並以此成功回報我們的股東。

Ryan Todd, Piper Sandler.

瑞恩·托德、派珀·桑德勒。

Great. Maybe question for you on renewable diesel. How much if any of the [45z] credits were you able to accrue in the quarter? And how should we think about that pace changing going forward?

偉大的。也許我想問一下關於再生柴油的問題。本季您能夠累積多少 [45z] 積分（如果有）？那麼，我們該如何看待未來這種節奏的變化呢？

And then maybe more broadly on the R&D side, can margins continue to struggle despite some positive steps on the regulatory front? Can you maybe talk about what we need to see change for a more constructive macro backdrop there?

那麼從更廣泛的研發方面來看，儘管監管方面採取了一些積極措施，利潤率是否仍會繼續陷入困境？您能否談談我們需要看到哪些變化才能形成更具建設性的宏觀背景？

Yes, Ryan, this is Steve. So we were able to begin recognizing PTC in the second quarter, not fully. In the third quarter, we've worked through a number of appropriate contractual arrangements that will allow us to begin recognizing even more of that. We're not commenting on the exact number, but we've worked through the complexity and difficulty of this legislation and think we have a path forward to where we can capture the most value possible out of the PTC.

是的，瑞安，這是史蒂夫。因此，我們能夠在第二季開始確認 PTC，但還不完全確認。在第三季度，我們完成了一系列適當的合約安排，這將使我們能夠開始認識到更多的這一點。我們不對具體數字發表評論，但我們已經解決了這項立法的複雜性和困難性，並認為我們已經找到了一條可以從 PTC 中獲取最大價值的道路。

When you think about the overall structure of the proposed legislation the impacts from 45z and as well as RVO, like everyone else, we've been negatively impacted by the PTC versus the prior BTC framework, but we believe that this structure is supportive to our business relatively speaking.

當您考慮擬議立法的整體結構時，45z 和 RVO 的影響，與其他人一樣，我們受到了 PTC 與之前的 BTC 框架的負面影響，但我們認為這種結構相對而言對我們的業務是有利的。

We're 100% domestic feedstock driven for our production, which gives us more qualified value both for LCFS as well as the RIN value. The ILO provision eliminations is helpful to us as we do run some where it's advantaged in our certain markets. The CarbLCFS amendment has now been passed. So we should see that step up moving forward. And then this large increase in the D4 RVO should be supportive to the entire renewable market structure as a whole.

我們的生產 100% 採用國內原料，這為我們的 LCFS 和 RIN 值提供了更合格的價值。ILO 條款消除對我們很有幫助，因為我們確實在某些特定市場中發揮了優勢。CarbLCFS 修正案現已獲得通過。因此，我們應該看到這項舉措不斷向前邁進。D4 RVO 的大幅增加應該會對整個再生能源市場結構起到支撐作用。

However, we do think that the RIN and the LCF values are going to have to do further work to cover that structural gap between PTC and BTC, but we like our position as this is currently structured.

然而，我們確實認為 RIN 和 LCF 值需要進一步的工作來彌補 PTC 和 BTC 之間的結構性差距，但我們喜歡我們的立場，因為這是目前的結構。

Yes. And Ryan, this is Tim. I'll just echo what Steve went through here. Our strategy has always been to keep this renewable diesel business breakeven a slight positive in these, what we consider to be trough and bottom-of-cycle conditions. And you can see we've done a good job of that over the last year or two. And just waiting for really the market structure to improve.

是的。瑞安，這是提姆。我只是想重複史蒂夫在這裡所經歷的事情。我們的策略一直是保持再生柴油業務在我們認為的低谷和週期底部條件下保持略微的損益平衡。您可以看到，過去一兩年我們在這方面做得很好。只是在等待市場結構真正改善。

I do think, as you pointed out, that the market structure will improve as we look forward. You saw the card group roll out their LCFS tanking. And while the credit bank is still in excess, it is starting to shrink, and we expect the LCF prices to continue to grow in the price as the bank continues to whittle down. You saw the RBO proposed numbers come out. Those numbers are very high, and we think the RIN prices have to go up as a result of those RVO numbers, if those RVO numbers are finalized as they were proposed.

正如您所指出的，我確實認為，隨著時間的推移，市場結構將會改善。您看到牌組推出了他們的 LCFS 坦克。儘管信貸銀行仍然過剩，但已開始萎縮，我們預計隨著信貸銀行的不斷減少，LCF 價格將繼續上漲。您已經看到 RBO 提出的數字已經出來了。這些數字非常高，我們認為，如果這些 RVO 數字按照提議最終確定，那麼 RIN 價格必須隨著這些 RVO 數字而上漲。

So we do think the market structure itself of the renewable diesel business. We will continue to improve, and we think we're positioned well to take advantage of it. And then the last thing I'll just mention, Steve and Atanas both mentioned this in their remarks, but we only partially recognized PTC so far. We do think we're positioning our contracts and doing the work to be able to recognize more of PTC in the third quarter, and we think that will also help our renewable piece of business going forward.

因此，我們確實考慮了再生柴油業務本身的市場結構。我們將繼續改進，我們認為我們已準備好充分利用這一優勢。最後我要說的是，史蒂夫和阿塔納斯都在他們的評論中提到了這一點，但到目前為止我們只部分認可了 PTC。我們確實認為，我們正在定位我們的合約並開展工作，以便能夠在第三季度確認更多的 PTC，我們認為這也將有助於我們未來的可再生業務的發展。

Great. Maybe one follow-up on the refinery on the overall, but certainly the refining side. But I think if you look at operational performance and the capital number, in the quarter despite some turnaround activity there, it seems like turnarounds again went very smoothly. Can you talk about how this fits into your efforts on operational improvement, where you think you are in the process of kind of getting refinery reliability operations turnaround, etc. to where they need to be.

偉大的。也許對煉油廠的整體情況進行一次跟進，但肯定是煉油方面。但我認為，如果你看一下營運績效和資本數字，儘管本季有一些扭虧為盈的活動，但似乎扭虧再次進行得非常順利。您能否談談這與您在營運改善方面的努力有何關聯，您認為您正處於煉油廠可靠性營運轉型等的哪個階段，並將其提升到所需的水平。

We've, -- once we complete the turnarounds this year, we'll have that, we have completed all of one cycle, if you will have the assets in the last five years. So our turnaround performance, we will have, I'll say caught up on our turnarounds coming out of COVID, coming out of the acquisitions. So we believe that we're positioned well going into the next five-year cycle around turnarounds.

一旦我們在今年完成扭虧為盈，我們就會實現這一目標，我們已經完成了一個週期，如果你擁有過去五年的資產的話。因此，我們的轉虧為盈表現將趕上 COVID 和收購帶來的扭虧為盈。因此，我們相信，我們已做好充分準備迎接下一個五年轉型週期。

We have continued to improve our turnaround structure, how we execute in the field and bringing in more and more technology to drive consistent performance. So what you're seeing is the work and the strategy that we've put in place, continuing to pay dividends in our reliability. And I think we're going to see that into the future.

我們不斷改進我們的周轉結構、我們在現場的執行方式，並引入越來越多的技術來推動持續的表現。所以，您所看到的是我們已經實施的工作和策略，它們繼續為我們的可靠性帶來回報。我認為我們將來會看到這一點。

Yes. And Ryan, this is Tim. We've said this before, maybe on the last call, I can't remember. But we think we're in the, call it, the fifth inning of our operational excellence journey having been through this first turnaround cycle that Val just mentioned. And you really are starting to see some of the inflection in the results that we're seeing reliability much improved.

是的。瑞安，這是提姆。我們之前說過這個，也許是在上次通話中，我不記得了。但我們認為，我們已經進入了卓越營運之旅的第五階段，已經經歷了瓦爾剛才提到的第一個轉機週期。而且您確實開始看到結果中的一些變化，我們看到可靠性得到了很大的提高。

You're seeing that in throughput capture much improved. We're seeing that as we continue to optimize and integrate these businesses, it's no coincidence that it's been a couple of years now since the Puget Sound, the Sinclair and the HEP acquisitions and the fruits of those labors are really starting to show up in the results now.

您會看到吞吐量捕獲有了很大的改善。我們看到，隨著我們繼續優化和整合這些業務，距離普吉特海灣、辛克萊和 HEP 收購已經過去了幾年，這些勞動的成果現在開始真正體現在結果中，這絕非巧合。

You're seeing it in OpEx per barrel as we continue to show that improvement going forward, now getting close to our near-term target. And that's both a numerator and a denominator impact that you're seeing in that OpEx per barrel number.

您可以從每桶營運成本中看到這一點，我們將繼續展現出未來的改善，現在已經接近我們的近期目標。這就是您在每桶營運支出數字中看到的分子和分母的影響。

And then lastly, as you point out, our CapEx is starting to show that as well. We had a heavy turnaround in the second quarter as we showed, but as we look into next year, and we talked about this earlier, we do think that our maintenance capital takes a significant step change down. And you'll start to see that again in our CapEx guidance when we issue that at the end of the year.

最後，正如您所指出的，我們的資本支出也開始顯示出這一點。正如我們所討論的，我們在第二季度實現了大幅好轉，但展望明年，正如我們之前所討論的，我們確實認為我們的維護資本將出現顯著的下降。當我們在年底發布資本支出指南時，您會再次看到這一點。

But all of those proof points that our strategy that we've been preaching on and have been talking about for the last year or two is really working and starting to deliver bottom line results.

但所有這些證據都表明，我們在過去一兩年裡一直在宣揚和談論的策略確實有效，並開始帶來最終成果。

Phillip Jungwirth, BMO.

菲利普·榮格沃思（BMO）。

In Lubricants, beyond the planned turnaround and the FIFO headwind, can you talk about the margin trajectory for this business in the quarter? How much of that weakness was April driven? And how are things -- how are you seeing things shape up so far in the third quarter?

在潤滑油業務方面，除了計劃中的扭虧為盈和先進先出 (FIFO) 逆風之外，您能談談本季度該業務的利潤率走勢嗎？四月的疲軟態勢在多大程度上是由其造成的？情況怎麼樣－您認為第三季到目前為止情況如何？

Phil, this is Matt Joyce. Thanks for the question. Yes, I think if we look at the overall performance, you're absolutely right, FIFO headwinds and our planned turnaround at Mississauga, which was safely completed but we did come into some weather and found some work there that caused us to just take a little bit longer to get back to where we want it to be versus our scheduled plan.

菲爾，這是馬特喬伊斯。謝謝你的提問。是的，我認為如果我們看一下整體表現，您說得完全正確，先進先出 (FIFO) 逆風和我們計劃在密西沙加的周轉，雖然已安全完成，但我們確實遇到了一些天氣並在那裡發現了一些工作，這導致我們花了更長的時間才能回到我們想要的位置，而不是按照我們的計劃。

But the culmination of that, along with base oil margins, there was a big turnaround quarter for the industry. But what we saw is that Group 2s and Group 3s continue to be a bit long, and we foresee that continuing to be the case into quarter three, which has put some pressure on our base oils along the way.

但最終，隨著基礎油利潤率的提高，該產業迎來了一個大幅改善的季度。但我們看到，第 2 組和第 3 組原油的價格仍然有點長，我們預計這種情況將持續到第三季度，這給我們的基礎油帶來了一些壓力。

And if you look at the results with that a little bit less volume and the product mix, that has a lower profit margin profile, it culminated in the results we saw for the L&S business for the quarter.

如果你看一下銷量和產品組合略少、利潤率較低的結果，你會發現本季 L&S 業務的業績就是如此。

Yes. And so I would just chime in. It's Tim. A few years ago, base oil tightness, a major turnaround, FIFO headwinds that would have created some significant fluctuations in our quarterly results. And again, the work that Matt and his team have done to really smooth that out to stabilize the business. You see the fluctuations in the market just don't have nearly the same fluctuations that you see in our results now because of the integration work that the Lubes business has been able to do.

是的。因此我只想附和一下。是蒂姆。幾年前，基礎油緊張、重大轉變、先進先出 (FIFO) 逆風會對我們的季度業績造成一些重大波動。再次，馬特和他的團隊所做的工作確實使這個問題得以解決並穩定了業務。您會發現，由於潤滑油業務部門已經完成了整合工作，因此市場波動並不像我們現在的表現那麼劇烈。

Okay. Great. And then I know you don't have direct exposure to California, but wondering if you had any thoughts on the proposed Senate Bill 237 more so on the Energy Commission and CARB engaging with Western states on a more uniform gasoline spec. Maybe this doesn't have any traction, but just wondering if you had any thoughts on potential market impact and how it (technical difficulty) basis.

好的。偉大的。然後我知道你沒有直接接觸過加州，但我想知道你是否對擬議的參議院第 237 號法案有什麼看法，尤其是關於能源委員會和 CARB 與西部各州就更統一的汽油規格進行接觸。也許這沒有任何吸引力，但只是想知道您是否對潛在的市場影響以及它（技術難度）基礎有任何想法。

Yes. This is Steve. I think it's an interesting one, the proposals that are out there, there's a lot of rumors, and I know that there's been some things to get to a regional spec. I don't know that, that is going to be successful. And ultimately, if it is extended out from California as the base, I don't think it's going to be good for supply.

是的。這是史蒂夫。我認為這是一個有趣的問題，那裡有提案，有很多謠言，而且我知道有些事情需要達成區域規範。我不知道那是否會成功。最終，如果基地從加利福尼亞向外延伸，我認為這對供應不利。

And so ultimately, I don't know that, that's where it will land. Regardless of that, I think our capability to go make the various grades and get into Southern PADD 5 are extended both from our Navajo refining complex as well as our Rockies complex, and we have the ability to flex and take advantage of whatever the spec change may be at the time.

所以最終，我不知道它會落在哪裡。不管怎樣，我認為我們生產各種等級的產品並進入南 PADD 5 的能力已經從我們的納瓦霍煉油綜合體以及落基山脈綜合體延伸開來，而且我們有能力靈活地利用當時可能發生的任何規格變化。

But my personal opinion is I don't know that, that is going to land in a regional spec that is more stringent than what the current specs of the various regions are.

但我個人的看法是，我不知道這是否會成為比各地區現行規範更嚴格的區域規範。

Yes. And Phil, I'll just chime in too. We continue to watch all the activities and all the changes that are occurring in California, for sure. But our strategy, as we've talked about before, is to continue to directly supply more carb and more carb components through our Puget Sound refinery, which we are taking advantage of the project that we talked about over the last call to be able to supply even more barrels to that region.

是的。菲爾，我也想插嘴一下。當然，我們會繼續關注加州發生的所有活動和變化。但正如我們之前談到的，我們的策略是繼續透過普吉特海灣煉油廠直接供應更多的碳水化合物和更多的碳水化合物成分，我們正在利用上次通話中談到的項目，為該地區供應更多的石油。

And then two, to indirectly supply the neighboring states, whether it be Nevada, whether it be Arizona through our existing infrastructure and through our existing refineries in the West. And as you can see from our results, our West region is performing very well, taking advantage of some of the opportunities that are presented there.

其次，透過我們現有的基礎設施和西部現有的煉油廠，間接向鄰近各州供應石油，無論是內華達州還是亞利桑那州。從我們的結果可以看出，我們的西部地區表現非常好，充分利用了那裡出現的一些機會。

And if you look at demand in general, our -- the West diesel demand, quite honestly, is above five year highs right now. And that's because of some of the dynamics we just talked about, and of course, renewable diesel production being down. And with that higher petroleum diesel demand that we're seeing in the West, we're able to take full advantage of that.

如果你看一下整體需求，我們——西方的柴油需求，坦白說，目前已經超過了五年來的最高水準。這是因為我們剛才談到的一些動態因素，當然還有再生柴油產量下降。隨著西方對石油柴油的需求不斷增加，我們能夠充分利用這一優勢。

Joe Laetsch, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的喬·萊奇（Joe Laetsch）。

So I wanted to start with the refining macro and your views on supply demand here. Margins improved in the second quarter and remained supported in July. How are you viewing the balances today from both a supply demand perspective in the Mid-Con and Rockies?

所以我想從煉油宏觀和您對供需的看法開始。利潤率在第二季度有所提高，並在 7 月繼續保持穩定。您如何從中康乃狄克州和洛磯山脈的供需角度看待當今的平衡？

Yes, Joe, this is Steve. I think from a macro perspective, we would say the supply is more balanced than it was. If you look at the supply same period versus last year, it's actually down due to utilization. But overall, in terms of the balance and the demand aspects, we look at gas as relatively flat and our distillate demand as being up, and that's partially driven by some of the things Tim mentioned with lower RD and bio production and lower imported as well as the export economics on distillate.

是的，喬，這是史蒂夫。我認為從宏觀角度來看，供應比以前更加平衡。如果對比去年同期的供應量，就會發現由於利用率的原因，供應量實際上是下降的。但總體而言，就平衡和需求方面而言，我們認為天然氣需求相對平穩，而餾分油需求則有所上升，這部分是由於蒂姆提到的一些因素，例如研發和生物生產成本降低、進口和出口餾分油的經濟效益降低。

And so that looks like that's a good story longer term as well as we're about to jump into the harvest season and then step right into heating oil season. So longer kind of through the year, we see that diesel is going to be strong. We're very bullish on that. And gas will be trying to get to the end of the driving season and then tail off. But we're roughly net balance in our regions given current utilization and current demand patterns.

從長遠來看，這似乎是一個好故事，因為我們即將進入收穫季節，然後直接進入暖氣油季節。因此，從今年來看，我們看到柴油的銷售量將會保持強勁。我們對此非常樂觀。而汽油需求量將會在駕駛季節結束前逐漸減少。但考慮到目前的利用率和目前的需求模式，我們所在地區的淨平衡大致是如此。

Yes. And Joe, I'll just chime in. This is Tim, that macro view has improved over the course of this year. There was a lot of concern earlier in the year that capacity growth would outshine demand growth. And really what we've seen play out over the years, that's not happening.

是的。喬，我也只是插嘴一下。這是蒂姆，宏觀觀點在今年有所改善。今年早些時候，人們非常擔心產能成長將超過需求成長。但事實上，根據我們這些年來所看到的情況來看，這種情況並沒有發生。

That demand growth is still ahead of, if not just breakeven with capacity growth, and that's favorable to refining perspectives and outlook. And I would just say that if you look longer term, the policies of this new administration are also strengthening the outlook for the refining industry. The CRA bill that basically are eliminated or reversed the ban on internal combustion engines in California, the Big Beautiful Bill that is taken away some of the artificial incentives for some of the EV vehicles.

需求成長仍領先於產能成長，甚至與產能成長持平，有利於改善前景和展望。我想說的是，如果從長遠來看，新政府的政策也正在加強煉油業的前景。《加州改革法案》基本上取消或推翻了加州對內燃機的禁令，而《美麗大法案》則取消了對部分電動車的人為激勵措施。

And at least in my opinion, that's really creating more of a global landscape that's more favorable to our refining industry as well. So the factors that Steve just mentioned, I think, have supported from just overall policy as well.

至少在我看來，這確實創造了更有利於我們煉油產業的全球格局。因此，我認為史蒂夫剛才提到的因素也得到了整體政策的支持。

Tim, that's helpful. And then on the crude side, there are several moving pieces between OPEC unwinds, Venezuela barrels coming back to the market, Canada wildfires and Mexico oil production. Could you just talk to what you're seeing from a light-heavy crude differential and availability standpoint currently as well as expectations going forward?

蒂姆，這很有幫助。原油方面，石油輸出國組織（OPEC）退出減產、委內瑞拉石油重返市場、加拿大山火和墨西哥石油生產等多個因素都在影響市場趨勢。您能否從輕質原油和重質原油的差異和可用性角度談談您目前看到的情況以及對未來的預期？

Yes, sure. Our view obviously, we -- the differentials are quite a bit more narrow than we've experienced in the past, and that stemmed kind of mid last year for TMX coming online and those barrels supporting a stronger or a narrow differential finding homes in abroad. What we're seeing in terms of the forward curve, we're still looking in Q3 around a $9 to $10 differential, but with further strengthening out in Q4 around $13.

是的，當然。我們的觀點顯然是——差異比我們過去經歷的要窄得多，這是因為去年年中 TMX 上線了，而那些支持更強或更窄差異的油桶在國外找到了歸宿。從遠期曲線來看，我們仍然預計第三季的差價將在 9 至 10 美元左右，但第四季將進一步增強至 13 美元左右。

And then I think longer term, in the next -- sometime in 2026, we're seeing a potential dip widening. We haven't really seen the OPEC expansion do much in terms of support or widening those differentials yet.

然後我認為從長遠來看，在 2026 年的某個時候，我們可能會看到下降趨勢擴大。我們還沒有真正看到 OPEC 擴張在支持或擴大這些差異方面發揮多大作用。

We think that longer term, it will, coupled with the production out running egress in Canada. But we found and have been nimble in our ability to go get more and different crudes into our kit because we're connected in many hubs. And I think that's one of the underlying reasons we mentioned earlier about our improved crude, specifically in the Mid-Con with our ability to touch those different barrels.

我們認為，從長遠來看，加上加拿大的生產退出，情況將會如此。但我們發現，我們有能力將更多不同的原油放入我們的工具包中，因為我們與許多樞紐都有連結。我認為這是我們之前提到的改進原油的根本原因之一，特別是在 Mid-Con，我們能夠接觸到不同的原油桶。

But yes, looking forward, it looks like we'll get some help in Q4, but not to the level that we've seen in the past couple of years before the TMX expansion.

但是，是的，展望未來，看起來我們會在第四季度得到一些幫助，但不會達到 TMX 擴張之前過去幾年所看到的水平。

Neil Mehta, Goldman Sachs.

高盛的尼爾·梅塔。

Would just love updated perspective on M&A on the refining landscape, I think we all saw the Reuters reporting with speculative around Benicia, but just your your perspective on the bar, how high it is, is it for you to do M&A? You've done really good deals over the last five to six years. So do you think you have the license of the market to go out more bolt-on, let's transformative or bolt-on type of assets? .

只是想了解煉油領域併購的最新情況，我想我們都看到了路透社對貝尼西亞的猜測性報道，但這只是您對門檻的看法，門檻有多高，您是否適合進行併購？在過去的五到六年裡，你們做了非常好的交易。那麼，您是否認為您擁有市場許可，可以推出更多附加資產、轉型資產或附加資產類型的資產？。

Yes. As you know, we do not comment on market rumors and those are market rumors in terms of what you saw in the past week or so. And I've already told you kind of what our focus is in our strategy is on the West and how we want to benefit and capture the opportunities that are out there.

是的。如您所知，我們不對市場謠言發表評論，而這些都是您在過去一周左右看到的市場謠言。我已經告訴過你們，我們的戰略重點是西方，以及我們希望如何從中獲益並抓住那裡的機會。

But in terms of M&A, we have done well in the past on M&A. We typically work countercyclically and look for value in terms of refining inorganic opportunities. That hasn't changed, and we will continue to look for those opportunities on a value perspective.

但在併購方面，我們過去在併購方面做得很好。我們通常逆週期行事，尋找精煉無機機會的價值。這一點沒有改變，我們將繼續從價值的角度尋找這些機會。

I would just say today, that bid-ask spread is still very wide. And you don't see a lot of refining deals happening over the last few years, and I think that's a result of that, that we're finding bid-ask spread. So we'll continue to be open to those opportunities, but it has to be, as you pointed out, at the right value at the right time and be the right asset.

我今天只想說，買賣價差還是很大。過去幾年裡，你看不到很多煉油交易發生，我認為這就是我們發現買賣價差的結果。因此，我們將繼續對這些機會持開放態度，但正如您所指出的，它必須在正確的時間以正確的價值出現，並成為正確的資產。

And at this point, we haven't found anything that we think will actually improve our portfolio at the right price and at the right time. I will tell you that we do think there are better inorganic opportunities to bolt-on in both our Marketing and our Lubes businesses right now. And so that's what we're continuing to look at. We do think that the opportunity is there. We're not looking for anything huge or transformational. We're looking for things that will bolt on and help us accelerate the organic strategy of growth that we've already got going, both at Marketing and in Lubes.

而目前，我們還沒有找到任何我們認為能夠在合適的價格和合適的時間真正改善我們投資組合的東西。我會告訴你，我們確實認為目前在我們的行銷和潤滑油業務中都有更好的無機機會可以補充。這就是我們將繼續關注的。我們確實認為機會是存在的。我們並不尋求任何巨大或變革性的東西。我們正在尋找能夠幫助我們加速已經在行銷和潤滑油領域實施的有機成長策略的事物。

And as we've talked about before, we're very pleased with the progress that we're making in both of those businesses. And to the extent that there is something out there that could help us accelerate that progress, we do think there's opportunities out there that we'll continue to look at.

正如我們之前談到的，我們對這兩項業務所取得的進展感到非常滿意。只要有什麼東西可以幫助我們加速這個進程，我們確實認為就存在著機會，我們會繼續關注。

Okay. That's really helpful, Tim. And then I just want to follow up on your comments around return of capital. I think the buyback was a little bit higher than most of us expected. In the quarter, the stock is still trading even after the bounce here below book value.

好的。這真的很有幫助，蒂姆。然後我只想跟進您關於資本回報的評論。我認為回購金額比我們大多數人預期的要高一些。本季度，即使股價反彈至帳面價值以下，該股仍在交易。

Balance sheet is in pretty good shape. Is it fair to assume that you can kind of keep this run rate up at the forward curve? And could there even be upside?

資產負債表狀況良好。是否可以合理地假設，您可以將這種運行率保持在遠期曲線上？甚至可能存在好處嗎？

Neil, this is Atanas. Thanks for the follow-up question. Our goal is, again, to continue to meet and exceed expectations with respect to capital returns. We've got strong cash flow generation this quarter. As you can see, we were not looking to hoard cash. So we're returning it back to you, the shareholders.

尼爾，這是阿塔納斯。感謝您的後續提問。我們的目標是繼續滿足並超越資本回報的預期。本季我們的現金流強勁。正如你所見，我們並不打算囤積現金。因此，我們將其返還給你們，股東。

Yes. And Neil, as mentioned earlier in the call, we've got a history of returning cash to our shareholders. And I think that's what we can point to is our history and our focus and our commitment to do that will continue. I think, I said this in my prepared remarks, but if you think about it, and in terms of the 60 million of shares that we issued when we bought Sinclair, we have now bought back in 98% of those 60 million shares.

是的。尼爾，正如我們在電話會議中早些時候提到的，我們一直向股東返還現金。我認為這就是我們的歷史，我們的重點和承諾將會持續下去。我想，我在準備好的發言中說過這一點，但如果你仔細想想，就我們收購 Sinclair 時發行的 6000 萬股而言，我們現在已經回購了其中的 98%。

And then if you add back the shares that we issued as part of HEP, we have bought back a total of 72% of those total shares that we issued back then. So that's clearly one of our ways to add shareholder value and get cash back to our shareholders as to buy back those shares, and we continue to be committed to doing that with our excess cash.

然後，如果加上我們作為 HEP 一部分發行的股票，我們已經回購了當時發行的股票總量的 72%。因此，這顯然是我們增加股東價值並向股東返還現金的方式之一，即回購這些股票，我們將繼續致力於利用多餘的現金來做到這一點。

Theresa Chen, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的 Theresa Chen。

I have a follow-up question on the indirect exposure to PADD 5. Setting Puget aside for a minute. Just given the visible capacity reduction in California, from your Navajo facility in terms of the refined product placement, how much and how far West can you take that barrel? Is it largely to Phoenix? And then from SLC, how space can you actually utilize on your unit pipeline?

我有一個關於間接接觸 PADD 5 的後續問題。暫時將 Puget 放在一邊。鑑於加州的產能明顯減少，從納瓦霍工廠的成品油投放來看，您能將多少桶成品油運往西部，運送到多遠的地方？主要去鳳凰城嗎？然後從 SLC 來看，您在單位管道上實際上可以利用多少空間？

Can you regularly use there since there are shippers on that line, your neighboring SLC refiners, I imagine. Just wanted to understand how much can this realistically the needle on capture in the West segment as these California facilities close over the next 12 months.

由於那條航線上有托運人，我想您附近的 SLC 煉油廠是您經常使用的地方嗎？只是想了解一下，隨著這些加州工廠在未來 12 個月內關閉，這實際上能在多大程度上對西部地區產生影響。

Theresa, this is Steve. I think you've hit on exactly one of our key -- what we believe is one of our key strategic advantages. From our Navajo complex, we can take a good portion of our light products make there into the Phoenix market. That's as far as it goes out of the Navajo refinery.

特蕾莎，這是史蒂夫。我認為您恰好觸及了我們的一個關鍵點——我們認為這是我們的一個關鍵策略優勢。透過我們的納瓦霍綜合體，我們可以將在那裡生產的大部分輕工業產品銷往鳳凰城市場。這就是納瓦荷煉油廠所能到達的最遠距離。

But out of the Rockies complex, not only from our Salt Lake City, which cross refinery, but the other Wyoming refineries, we can take and optimize kind of upgrade barrels right through the valley, up north and then south into Las Vegas.

但在落基山脈綜合設施之外，不僅從我們的鹽湖城跨煉油廠，而且從懷俄明州的其他煉油廠，我們都可以將升級後的原油直接穿過山谷，向北再向南輸送到拉斯維加斯。

And we have ample space in terms of going and leveraging that integrated asset of -- which we think provides a differentiation for us. And as you rightly call out, that continues to be a hunting ground that we look to go capture moving forward and all the market fundamentals and dynamics point to us being in a leading space there. So we look forward to capturing that as it continues to play out.

我們在利用綜合資產方面擁有充足的空間——我們認為這為我們帶來了差異化。正如您所說，這仍然是我們希望在未來佔領的狩獵場，所有的市場基本面和動態都表明我們在那裡處於領先地位。因此，我們期待著捕捉到這現象的持續發展。

And Theresa, I would just say that pipeline that Steve mentioned, we have spare capacity on that today, but we also have opportunities to debottleneck that fairly simply and fairly straightforward when that time comes. So we believe there's still plenty of opportunity there. And yes, we think it can be meaningfully impactful to our West capture.

特蕾莎，我只想說，史蒂夫提到的那條管道，我們目前有閒置產能，但到時候我們也有機會相當簡單、相當直接地消除瓶頸。因此我們相信那裡仍有許多機會。是的，我們認為這會對我們佔領西方產生重大影響。

Understood. And on the comment on inorganic opportunities in the marketing and LSP segment, just curious how fragmented are the markets in your areas of specific interest either by product or by region, how much realistic run rate do you have on this inorganic strategy?

明白了。關於行銷和 LSP 領域的無機機會的評論，我只是好奇您所關注的領域的市場在產品或地區方面有多麼分散，您對這種無機策略的實際運作率是多少？

Yes. So we look to focus our branded put growth in the areas where we have logistics parity and can produce and get it on our midstream assets. That's where we have significant advantages. So you can imagine Pacific Northwest, you can imagine Southern PADD 5 in Vegas in the Rockies. When you think about fragmented market, there's larger players that are coming in, but there's still a lot to do in terms of 10 to 15 site chains that are looking to go simplify or have an exit route and our brand brings something very strong in those markets.

是的。因此，我們希望將品牌成長重點放在我們擁有物流平價且可以利用中游資產進行生產和獲取的地區。這就是我們的顯著優勢。所以你可以想像太平洋西北地區，你可以想像位於落基山脈拉斯維加斯的南部 PADD 5。當你考慮分散的市場時，會有更大的參與者進入，但對於 10 到 15 個希望簡化或有退出途徑的連鎖店而言，仍有很多工作要做，而我們的品牌在這些市場中帶來了非常強大的力量。

The brand recognition and awareness right through the Rockies into PADD 5 is quite strong, and it's something that is yet untapped. So the fragmentation is an aspect, but there's not been enough consolidation to take some of those opportunities off the table, and we look to go take advantage of some of that in our core markets.

從洛磯山脈到 PADD 5 的品牌認知和知名度都相當高，而且這項潛力尚未被開發。因此，碎片化是一個方面，但還沒有足夠的整合來消除其中的一些機會，我們希望在我們的核心市場中利用其中的一些機會。

And I would just say, Theresa, that the DINO brand has really been taking off here. You can see that in our organic growth results, both the record number of new stores we've added in the second quarter as well as over the last rolling 12 months.

我只想說，特蕾莎，DINO 品牌在這裡確實已經起飛。您可以在我們的自然成長結果中看到，我們在第二季以及過去 12 個月新增的門市數量都創下了歷史新高。

And so we're very pleased with the organic pace of growth that we've got going on. But as Steve mentioned, we do think there's even more opportunities to accelerate that through some inorganic opportunities, which we'll continue to look at along the way. You also asked about Lube, so I'll ask Matt to comment on that.

因此，我們對目前的有機成長速度感到非常滿意。但正如史蒂夫所提到的，我們確實認為，透過一些無機機會可以加速這一進程，我們將繼續關注這些機會。您還詢問了潤滑油，所以我會請馬特對此發表評論。

Yes. Theresa, it's Matt here. We have over 300 lubricant marketers and manufacturers in the United States. And those brands often have -- those businesses have often have a heritage and a long history of great product solutions and offerings that could be very complementary to our business. And so we mentioned it earlier, we're really focused on looking at those opportunities when they become known to us and then whether or not they can help us accelerate our growth into these higher value established markets or some new adjacencies that we don't participate in today.

是的。特蕾莎，我是馬特。我們在美國擁有 300 多家潤滑油行銷商和製造商。這些品牌通常擁有悠久的傳統和出色的產品解決方案和產品的歷史，這些產品和產品可以與我們的業務形成良好的互補。正如我們之前提到的，我們真正關注的是那些我們所知的機會，以及它們是否能夠幫助我們加速向這些更高價值的成熟市場或一些我們目前尚未參與的新領域發展。

And in all cases, we're looking to use those to further develop our capabilities and competencies, whether that be through technology or supply chain in different markets that allow for us to get better reach to our customers and to serve the markets where we believe that we can win.

在所有情況下，我們都希望利用這些來進一步發展我們的能力和競爭力，無論是透過技術還是不同市場的供應鏈，使我們能夠更好地接觸客戶並服務於我們認為能夠取勝的市場。

Yes. And Theresa, we do think the Lubes and Specialties industry is fairly fragmented still. We have been a consolidator in that industry when we put Petro-Canada, Sonneborn and Red Giant together. And we do think there are more opportunities to do that. Our strategy overall in Lubes is to continue to grow that finished lubes put to soak up our excess base oils and to basically drive a multiple expansion in our Lubes business as we continue to integrate that base oil and finished lubes business.

是的。特蕾莎，我們確實認為潤滑油和特種產品產業仍然相當分散。當我們將加拿大石油公司、Sonneborn 和 Red Giant 合併在一起時，我們就成為了這個行業的整合者。我們確實認為還有更多機會可以做到這一點。我們在潤滑油方面的整體策略是繼續增加成品潤滑油，以吸收我們過剩的基礎油，並在我們繼續整合基礎油和成品潤滑油業務的同時，從根本上推動潤滑油業務的多重擴張。

Doug Leggate, Wolfe Research.

道格‧萊格特（Doug Leggate），沃爾夫研究公司。

I apologize a little later on. You managed to clash with our cousins over in London. So Tim, I wonder if I could ask two related questions related to the Renewables business. Frankly, you actually missed our Refining number, but you really not kicked our -- on the Renewable EBITDA this quarter.

我稍後會道歉。你成功地與我們在倫敦的表親發生了衝突。所以提姆，我想知道我是否可以問兩個與再生能源業務相關的問題。坦白說，您實際上錯過了我們的煉油數字，但您確實沒有踢我們的 - 本季的可再生 EBITDA。

And I'm trying to understand how much of that is repeatable and put differently, can you offer any kind of thoughts on what the sustainable EBITDA of the Renewable Diesel business could be assuming the user tax credit is continues.

我想了解其中有多少是可重複的，換句話說，您能否就再生柴油業務的可持續 EBITDA 提出任何看法，假設用戶稅收抵免繼續下去。

The second part of my question is related to SREs because obviously, you guys are exposed to that. And my understanding is that the comment period is due on the 8 August. But if SREs are granted, that's presumably negative for RINs, which is presumably negative for renewable diesel. So I'm wondering if you can reconcile those two things how you see the sustainable operating income or EBITDA for renewable diesel and what your stance is on SREs.

我的問題的第二部分與 SRE 有關，因為顯然你們接觸過這個。我的理解是，評論期將於 8 月 8 日截止。但如果授予 SRE，這可能對 RIN 產生負面影響，進而對再生柴油產生負面影響。所以我想知道您是否可以調和這兩件事，您如何看待再生柴油的可持續營業收入或 EBITDA，以及您對 SRE 的立場。

Yes, Doug, thanks for the question. And I know today was a busy day. So thank you, guys, for running around and participating in all these calls. I'm disappointed. We missed your refining number, but we'll do better next time.

是的，道格，謝謝你的提問。我知道今天是忙碌的一天。所以，感謝你們到處奔波並參與所有這些電話會議。我很失望。我們錯過了您的精煉號碼，但下次我們會做得更好。

(multiple speakers) -- Yes, you're going to on renewable diesel is my point.

（多位發言者）－是的，我的觀點是，你們將討論再生柴油。

No, I'll just give you a hard time, Doug, and we're very pleased with our refining results. And -- but we do know there's always -- we have more room for improvement, and we do have our sights to continue to improve in our Refining business. And we think next quarter will be -- will show even that more improvement as we continue this journey. So it's a fair observation to make do on that.

不，我只是要給你製造點麻煩，道格，我們對我們的精煉結果非常滿意。但我們確實知道，我們還有更多的改進空間，我們也確實希望繼續改進我們的煉油業務。我們認為，隨著我們繼續這趟旅程，下個季度將會顯示出更多的改善。因此，這是一個合理的觀察。

One renewable we're very pleased with kind of like we start our positioning on renewals. We think with RINs pricing, LCFS pricing that -- (technical difficulty)

我們對再生能源感到非常高興，就像我們開始對再生能源進行定位一樣。我們認為，透過 RIN 定價和 LCFS 定價，--（技術難度）

(technical difficulty) Once again, if we don't have any further questions, I'd now like to hand back over to Tim for any closing remarks.

（技術難題）再次，如果我們沒有其他問題，我現在想將發言權交還給蒂姆，請他做結束語。

(Operator Instructions) Ladies and gentlemen, please be on standby. We are currently experiencing a bit of a technical issue. Again, please be on standby. We will be back shortly. Thank you. (multiple speakers)

（操作員指示）女士們，先生們，請待命。我們目前遇到了一些技術問題。再次強調，請大家保持待命。我們很快就會回來。謝謝。（多位發言者）

Go ahead, Ellie.

繼續吧，艾莉。

If there are no further questions, we will now turn the call back over to Tim for any closing remarks.

如果沒有其他問題，我們現在將把電話轉回給蒂姆，請他做最後發言。

Thank you, Ellie, and we apologize for the drop there. But before we close, I want to give a shout out to all of our employees who rolled up their sleeves and put on their rally caps this quarter to deliver these strong results, refining throughput, capture and operating costs are all trending in the right direction, thanks to their hard work and dedication.

謝謝你，艾莉，我們對你的失誤深感抱歉。但在結束之前，我想向我們所有的員工致以誠摯的謝意，他們本季度捲起袖子、戴上集會帽，取得了這些強勁的業績，由於他們的辛勤工作和奉獻精神，煉油吞吐量、捕獲和運營成本都朝著正確的方向發展。

And our nonrefining segments continue to shine with our marketing and midstream businesses on pace for another record performance this year. All of these are indicators that our strategy is working.

我們的非煉油業務持續大放異彩，行銷和中游業務今年也有望再創紀錄。所有這些都表明我們的策略正在發揮作用。

Looking ahead, we are constructive on the fundamentals of each of our businesses, including Refining. And as always, our priorities remain the same, to improve our reliability; two, integrate and optimize our portfolio of assets; and three, return excess cash to our shareholders.

展望未來，我們對包括煉油在內的每項業務的基本面都持建設性態度。和以往一樣，我們的優先事項保持不變：一是提高我們的可靠性；二是整合和優化我們的資產組合；三是將多餘的現金回饋給股東。

Thank you for joining our call, and have a great day.

感謝您參加我們的電話會議，祝您有個愉快的一天。

This does conclude today's teleconference. Please disconnect your lines at this time. Have a wonderful day.

今天的電話會議到此結束。此時請斷開您的線路。祝您有美好的一天。