BW LPG Ltd (BWLP) 2024 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Hi, everyone, a warm welcome to BW LPG's third-quarter 2024 results.

大家好，熱烈歡迎 BW LPG 2024 年第三季業績。

The presentation today will be given by our CEO, Kristian; and our CFO, Samantha.

今天的演講將由我們的執行長克里斯蒂安 (Kristian) 進行；以及我們的財務長薩曼莎（Samantha）。

Afterwards, we will open up for a question-and-answer session.

之後，我們將進入問答環節。

Before we begin, I would like to highlight the legal disclaimers displayed on the current slide.

在我們開始之前，我想強調一下目前投影片上顯示的法律免責聲明。

Please also note that today's call is being recorded.

另請注意，今天的通話正在錄音。

I will now give the word to Kristian.

現在我將把這個話交給克里斯蒂安。

Hi, everyone, and thank you for taking time to join us today as we present our financial results and recent events.

大家好，感謝您今天抽出時間參加我們的財務業績和近期事件的報告。

It's been another eventful quarter for our company, so let's turn to slide 4 for the highlights and our market outlook.

對於我們公司來說，這又是一個多事之秋，因此，讓我們翻到第 4 張幻燈片來了解亮點和我們的市場展望。

Our time charter income per available day ended at $46,800, somewhat lower than the previous quarter, but above our guiding of $43,000 per day.

我們的每日定期租船收入最終為 46,800 美元，略低於上一季度，但高於我們預期的每日 43,000 美元。

The market went through a roller coaster during the quarter with rates fluctuating in the range from low $20,000 per day and back into the $50,000 per day within a short period of time.

本季度市場經歷了過山車式波動，利率在短時間內從每天 20,000 美元低點波動至每天 50,000 美元左右。

In addition to a great job done by our chartering team by navigating through the ups and downs, we are pleased to see that our downside protection through our time charter portfolio and FFAs took out quite a lot of this volatility.

除了我們的租船團隊在波動中出色地完成了工作之外，我們很高興地看到，透過定期租船組合和遠期運輸協議 (FFA) 提供的下行保護，我們消除了相當多的波動。

We're also very happy with the new ships starting to enter our fleet.

我們也很高興看到新船開始加入我們的船隊。

And as of today, we have 5 out of the 12 acquired Avance Gas ships safely delivered.

截至今天，我們收購的 12 艘 Avance Gas 船舶中已有 5 艘安全交付。

As explained in this slide, another four ships are expected to be delivered which are issued in time with right to receive dividends for Q3.

正如本幻燈片所述，預計將交付另外四艘船，這些船將按時發行，並有權獲得第三季的股息。

The Board has declared a dividend of $0.42 per share, which translates to 100% payout of the NPAT from our shipping activities.

董事會宣布每股派息 0.42 美元，相當於從航運業務派發 100% 的稅後利潤。

Moving on to product services, and as per our trading update in October, our trading activities benefited from a considerable uptick in the 12 months forward mark-to-market valuation of the trading portfolio, reflected in a net accounting profit of $58 million.

談到產品服務，根據我們 10 月的交易更新，我們的交易活動受益於交易組合 12 個月遠期市價估值的大幅上漲，反映在 5,800 萬美元的淨會計利潤中。

Although we're glad to see that the forward trading portfolio is becoming more valuable, the volatility in the trading markets may drive the portfolio valuation up or down before the positions are realized, and it's important to understand that it is the profitable realized trading positions, which matter as we move forward when they are eventually converted to cash in the bank accounts.

雖然我們很高興看到遠期交易組合的價值不斷上升，但交易市場的波動可能會在頭寸實現之前推動投資組合估值上升或下降，重要的是要明白，盈利的已實現交易頭寸因為它們最終會在銀行帳戶中轉換成現金，所以這一點很重要。

Two subsequent events since end-September were the refinancing of our $400 million revolving credit facility, which is now replaced by a new seven years and larger facility of $460 million.

自九月底以來，我們又完成了兩項後續活動：一是對我們的4 億美元循環信貸額度進行了再融資，現在該額度已被一項新的為期七年、金額更大的4.6 億美元的信貸額度所取代。

Samantha will comment more on this later.

薩曼莎稍後會對此發表更多評論。

In addition, we recently announced two sale and purchase transactions where we sold the 2007 vintage vessel BW Cedar from our India subsidiary at around $65 million while declaring a purchase option on the 2019-built BW Kizoku at just below $70 million, which is equivalent to a new building price in the mid-$80 million.

此外，我們最近宣布了兩筆買賣交易，其中，我們以約6500 萬美元的價格從印度子公司出售了2007 年建造的BW Cedar 號，同時宣布以略低於7000 萬美元的價格購買2019 年建造的BW Kizoku 號，相當於新建築的價格約為 8000 萬美元。

This is a strong testament to our business model, which creates optionality, we think, along the way, allowing us to harvest profits.

這有力地證明了我們的商業模式，我們認為，這種模式創造了可選性，讓我們能夠在過程中獲得利潤。

Our market outlook for Q4 and next year is positive as the export levels from the US Gulf have stabilized after a period of maintenance and slightly reduced exports.

我們對第四季和明年的市場前景持樂觀態度，因為美國墨西哥灣的出口水準在經過一段時間的維持和出口略有減少後已經趨於穩定。

However, it is important to note that the small market like the VLGC market is quite sensitive to only a few cargoes being added or taken out of the market.

然而，值得注意的是，像 VLGC 這樣的小型市場對於少量貨物的加入或退出市場非常敏感。

And at the moment, freight rates in US Gulf seem to have found an equilibrium level plus/minus $40,000 per day.

目前，美國墨西哥灣的運費似乎已經找到了每天上下浮動 40,000 美元的平衡水平。

There is currently little to no delays from the Panama Canal, which means that there is an upside potential from today's rate level the way we see it.

目前巴拿馬運河幾乎沒有延誤，這意味著從我們現在的費率水準來看，還有上行潛力。

Let's turn to page 6 for a closer look at the market fundamentals.

讓我們翻到第 6 頁來仔細看看市場基本面。

The market volatility we have been through lately is well illustrated in this slide.

這張幻燈片很好地說明了我們最近經歷的市場波動。

When you see the rate movements against the variation in US Gulf Coast loadings on the right side of the slide, it shows how finely balanced the VLGC market is at the moment with no delays in Panama.

當您在幻燈片右側看到費率變動與美國墨西哥灣沿岸裝載量的變化時，它顯示了目前 VLGC 市場是多麼的平衡，巴拿馬沒有延誤。

I used to say that our market is driven by three engines: exports from the US Gulf, exports from the Middle East, and the availability of Panama Canal slots for VLGCs.

我曾經說過，我們的市場由三個引擎驅動：美國墨西哥灣的出口、中東的出口以及巴拿馬運河的超大型氣體運輸船（VLGC）可用艙位。

The next round of US export capacity increase starts second half next year as energy transfer increased their ethane and LPG export capacity at the Nederland terminal in the US Gulf.

隨著能源轉移增加了美國墨西哥灣尼德蘭碼頭的乙烷和液化石油氣出口能力，美國下一輪出口能力增加將於明年下半年開始。

The enterprise terminal follow up in 2026 with their planned expansion.

企業終端將於2026年依計畫進行擴建。

And we estimate that the North American export will increase another 10 million tons from '24 to 2026 on the back of increased production of oil and natural gas in the US combined with increased terminal capacity.

我們預計，隨著美國石油和天然氣產量增加以及終端容量增加，北美出口量將從 2024 年到 2026 年再增加 1,000 萬噸。

Looking at the Middle East, the growth in export volumes is expected to ramp up from 2026 as Qatar commenced the expansion of their new LNG trains.

放眼中東，隨著卡達開始擴建新的液化天然氣列車，預計出口量將從 2026 年開始加速成長。

Abu Dhabi's LNG project is coming a bit later, we expect 2028.

阿布達比的液化天然氣計畫將會稍晚一些，我們預計在 2028 年。

Looking at the Panama Canal, it remains a wildcard in the market.

看看巴拿馬運河，它仍然是市場上的一個不確定因素。

And unexpectedly, we can see that the number of container vessels passing through the canal so far in Q4 has come down, leaving more slots available for VLGCs, and consequently, more VLGCs sailing the shortest route from the US Gulf to Asia.

出乎意料的是，我們發現第四季度迄今為止通過運河的貨櫃船數量有所下降，為超大型氣體運輸船留下了更多的可用艙位，因此，更多的超大型氣體運輸船將通過最短航線從美國墨西哥灣航行至亞洲。

Whether we will see more congestion in Panama is hard to predict.

我們很難預測巴拿馬是否會出現更嚴重的交通擁堵。

But the number of daily slots in the Neo Panama locks is fixed at 10 transits totally, both directions combined.

但新巴拿馬船閘每日的過境艙數量固定為 10 個，雙向合計。

So it takes only a couple of additional container or LNG vessels to pass through to tilt the availability of slots in the other direction.

因此，只需要幾艘額外的貨櫃船或液化天然氣船通過，就可以使可用艙位向另一個方向傾斜。

Let's turn to slide 8 for a look at the LPG demand side.

讓我們翻到第 8 張幻燈片來看看液化石油氣的需求面。

The picture is pretty much unchanged since our last update.

自上次更新以來，圖片幾乎沒有變化。

And directionally, the Asian region continued to grow their appetite for LPG in the residential sector in the Indian subcontinent, as well as Southeast Asia, while the pet chem sector in China specifically continue to expand their consumption of propane as feedstock.

從方向來看，亞洲地區對印度次大陸以及東南亞住宅領域液化石油氣的需求持續成長，而中國寵物化學產業則持續擴大對丙烷作為原料的消費。

The trade pattern, which has developed over the last years on the back of increased LPG demand in India, deserves attention.

近年來，由於印度液化石油氣需求增加，貿易格局有所發展，值得關注。

The country is absorbing close to 50% of the Middle East exports and all countries further East in Asia are increasingly dependent on sourcing LPG from the US, underpinning a growing need for long-haul shipping.

美國吸收了中東近50%的出口產品，亞洲所有東部國家都越來越依賴從美國購買液化石油氣，這支撐了長途運輸需求的不斷成長。

If you look at the VLGC fleet and the newbuildings, there is good visibility on the newbuilding deliveries over the next 18 months.

如果你看一下 VLGC 船隊和新造船，你會發現未來 18 個月新造船的交付情況非常好。

And for 2025, we have 13 vessels on our list over newbuilding deliveries.

到 2025 年，我們的名單上將有 13 艘新船交付。

Worthwhile to note is that the number of ships going into dry docks in 2025 will more than double from this year as we count approximately 80 ships due for dry dock next year.

值得注意的是，我們計算出明年將有大約 80 艘船舶進入乾船塢，因此 2025 年進入乾船塢的船舶數量將比今年增加一倍以上。

And then I leave the floor to you, Samantha, for an update on the financials.

然後，我請薩曼莎介紹一下財務狀況的最新情況。

Thank you, Kristian, and hello, everyone.

謝謝你，克里斯蒂安，大家好。

Coming to slide 11, we're very pleased to share that we delivered a solid shipping performance in a volatile quarter.

來到第 11 張幻燈片，我們非常高興地分享，我們在這個動蕩的季度中實現了穩健的運輸業績。

For Q3, we achieved a 98% fleet utilization and a TCE of USD46,500 per calendar day or $46,800 per available day.

第三季度，我們實現了 98% 的車隊利用率，TCE 為每日曆日 46,500 美元或每可用日 46,800 美元。

Maintaining a healthy time charter and FFA portfolio has been a key for success.

維持健康的定期租船和 FFA 組合一直是成功的關鍵。

In this quarter, the portfolio represents about 48 -- 45% of our shipping exposure.

本季度，該投資組合約占我們航運風險的 48% 至 45%。

For the fourth quarter, we have fixed a 90% of the available base at about $36,000 per day.

對於第四季度，我們已將 90% 的可用基數固定為每天約 36,000 美元。

Looking at 2024, our time charter-out fleet generates a profit of around USD31 million of our time charter in fleet.

展望 2024 年，我們的期租船隊將產生約 3,100 萬美元的利潤。

The remaining of our fixed time charter out portfolio is estimated to generate USD69 million for year '24.

我們剩餘的定期租船組合預計將在 24 年創造 6,900 萬美元的收入。

Next slide, please.

請看下一張投影片。

As shared in our earlier trading update, product services booked a strong quarter and yielded a net profit of USD58 million.

正如我們先前的交易更新中所分享的，產品服務本季表現強勁，實現淨利 5,800 萬美元。

The result was contributed by gross profit of USD71 million after netting off G&A and tax provisions.

該業績是由扣除一般行政費用和稅項撥備後的 7,100 萬美元毛利貢獻的。

The gross profit includes a unrealized mark-to-market gain of USD86 million, which consists of open cargo positions and hedges.

毛利包括8,600萬美元的未實現市價收益，包括未平倉貨物部位和避險。

This is offset by $14 million of a realized trading loss.

這被 1,400 萬美元的已實現交易損失所抵消。

The unrealized gain is expected to be realized in the future periods, although some volatilities are expected to impact the final realized results to be higher or lower.

未實現收益預計將在未來期間實現，儘管預計一些波動會影響最終實現結果的更高或更低。

At the end of Q3 '24, product services book equity position arrived at $128 million.

截至 24 年第三季末，產品服務帳面權益部位達到 1.28 億美元。

We would also like to highlight that the reported book equity does not include the unrealized physical shipping position of USD17 million, which was based on our internal valuation.

我們還要強調的是，報告的帳面權益不包括 1700 萬美元的未實現實體運輸頭寸，該頭寸基於我們的內部估值。

You can recall, we have announced a multiple-year term contract with the Enterprise Products Partners back in Q2.

您可能還記得，我們​​在第二季宣布與企業產品合作夥伴簽訂了多年合約。

The related fiscal volume has started to phase in our 12 months rolling mark-to-market valuation.

相關財政量已開始納入我們12個月滾動的以市價計價的估值中。

As such, we expect greater volatility in our unrealized position in the future quarters.

因此，我們預計未來幾季我們的未實現部位的波動性會更大。

For Q3, our average VAR was USD5 million on a well-balanced trading book, including cargoes, shipping, and derivatives.

第三季度，我們在包括貨物、航運和衍生性商品在內的均衡交易帳簿上的平均價值價值為 500 萬美元。

Coming to our financial highlights, on the back of a good performance from both shipping and product services, we reported a net profit after tax of USD120 million in Q3, including a profit of $12 million from BW LPG India and 55 -- sorry, $58 million from product services.

談到我們的財務亮點，在航運和產品服務良好表現的推動下，我們報告第三季度稅後淨利潤為1.2 億美元，其中包括來自BW LPG India 的1200 萬美元利潤和55——抱歉，是5800 萬美元百萬來自產品服務。

Profit attributed to equity holders of the company was $105 million, which translates to an earnings per share of $0.79. This translates into an annualized earnings yield of 23% when compared against our share price at the end of September.

歸屬於公司股東的利潤為 1.05 億美元，相當於每股收益 0.79 美元。與九月底的股價相比，這相當於年化報酬率為23%。

We reported a net leverage ratio of 21% in Q3, an increase from 12% reported at the end of June.

我們報告第三季的淨槓桿率為 21%，高於 6 月底的 12%。

The net leverage ratio change was driven mainly by increase in short-term trade finance and margin requirements, deposit pay for Avance Gas fleet acquisition, and increase in lease liability from the exercise of the purchase option for BW Kizoku.

淨槓桿率變動主要是由於短期貿易融資和保證金要求的增加、收購 Avance Gas 船隊的押金支付以及行使 BW Kizoku 購買選擇權導致的租賃負債增加。

These factors impacting the net leverage ratio as outlined above are mostly temporary.

上述影響淨槓桿率的因素大多是暫時的。

The delivery of Avance Gas fleets commenced in November and is expected to complete by the end of this month.

Avance Gas 船隊於 11 月開始交付，預計將於本月底完成。

When the fleet delivery finalizes, we expect that our net leverage ratio will gradually increase to approximately range of 30% to 35% as we draw down on our financing facility.

當船隊交付完成後，我們預計，隨著我們利用融資手段，我們的淨槓桿率將逐步上升至約 30％至 35％ 的範圍。

For Q3, our Board has declared a dividend of $0.42 per share, a 100% payout of shipping impact.

對於第三季度，我們董事會宣布派發每股 0.42 美元的股息，其中 100% 用於支付運輸費用。

This excludes the dividend to be paid to newly issued share to Avance Gas shareholders and ensures that existing shareholders are fully paid for.

這不包括向 Avance Gas 股東支付新發行股票的股息，並確保現有股東獲得全額支付。

This also shows our confidence to deliver growth to our business and our continuous commitment to return value to our shareholders.

這也顯示了我們對業務成長的信心以及對股東回報的持續承諾。

The balance sheet ended in quarter with a shareholder equity of USD1.6 billion, and our annualized Q3 return on equity.

本季末的資產負債表顯示股東權益為 16 億美元，而我們第三季的股本回報率為年化值。

Capital return employed were 30% and 26%, respectively.

資本回報率分別為30%和26%。

Looking at our year-to-date OpEx, it arrived at $8,400, a slight reduction than the previous quarter reported.

查看我們今年迄今為止的營運支出，其達到 8,400 美元，比上一季報告的略有減少。

For 2024, we expect our own fleet operating cash breakeven to be about $18,800 and $22,800 for the whole fleet, including time charter per vessels.

到 2024 年，我們預計我們自己的船隊的營運現金損益平衡點約為 18,800 美元，整個船隊的營運現金損益平衡點約為 22,800 美元，包括每艘船的定期租船。

As you can see, we continue to have a healthy repayment profile with outstanding shipping loan at $216 million of which $120 million is a term loan for BW LPG India, only due to be refinanced in 2026, a very manageable position.

如您所見，我們的還款狀況依然良好，未償還的航運貸款為2.16 億美元，其中1.2 億美元是BW LPG India 的定期貸款，將於2026 年再融資，這是一個非常易於管理的狀況。

On the liquidity side, we ended the quarter with a strong position of $750 million, paving the way for Avance Gas fleet delivery.

在流動性方面，我們在本季結束時擁有 7.5 億美元的強勁流動性，為 Avance Gas 船隊的交付鋪平了道路。

The vessels delivery have been smoothly taking place since November and scheduled to be completed at end of this month, as mentioned earlier.

如同先前所提到的，該船的交付自11月以來一直順利進行，預計在本月底完成。

Post-delivery, our liquidity is expected to remain healthy at a level of USD552 million supported by our shareholder loan and the seven-year revolving facility of $460 million, newly signed in November this year.

交付後，我們的流動性預計將保持在 5.52 億美元的健康水平，這得益於我們的股東貸款和今年 11 月新簽署的 4.6 億美元的七年期循環貸款。

We also -- we will also evaluate and start refinancing our vessels in early 2025, following the Avance Gas fleet's delivery.

我們還將在 Avance Gas 船隊交付後，於 2025 年初評估並開始對我們的船舶進行再融資。

We are very confident to maintain a healthy leverage and financing structure, as well as a sustainable repayment profile with a larger fleet.

我們非常有信心透過更大的船隊保持健康的槓桿和融資結構，以及可持續的還款狀況。

On the product services side, trade finance drawdown stood at a moderate level of $248 million or 30% of our available credit line, leaving a healthy headroom for the growth.

在產品服務方面，貿易融資提取額處於中等水平，為 2.48 億美元，占我們可用信貸額度的 30%，為成長留下了健康的空間。

With that, I conclude my update.

我的更新到此結束。

Back to you, Kaya.

回到你身邊，Kaya。

(Operator Instructions) Petter Haugen.

（操作員指令）Petter Haugen。

I have -- thank you.

我已經——謝謝。

Good afternoon.

午安.

Quick question on the process of taking those vessels from Avance, to what extent should one expect cost to come in earlier than revenues?

關於從 Avance 接收這些船隻的過程，快速提問，在多大程度上應該預期成本會早於收入？

Is it more or less back to back or should we, for instance, use a month of sort of overall lap here?

它是否大致是連續的，或者我們應該例如在這裡使用一個月的總體圈數？

Yeah, that's the first question.

是的，這是第一個問題。

Thanks, Petter.

謝謝，Petter。

I can just start off with saying that, of course, we pay for the ships now.

我首先要說的是，當然，我們現在要支付船費。

And when you fix the ships for the next voyage, we will not get -- we are not able to invoice before the vessel is about to discharge as per normal shipping practice.

當您為下一次航行確定船舶時，我們將無法收到—按照正常航運慣例，我們無法在船舶即將卸貨之前開立發票。

So there will be like normal delay, you can say, because we are not able to invoice our charters before the voyage that the ships have performed is finished.

因此可以說會出現正常的延誤，因為我們無法在船舶完成航行之前開立租船發票。

Okay.

好的。

So yeah, I understand there will obviously be a cash flow effect here.

是的，我明白這裡顯然會產生現金流效應。

But in terms of your P&L bookings, I suppose

但就你的損益帳目而言，我想

--

--

Samantha, I don't know if you -- would you like to say anything about that?

薩曼莎，我不知道你——你想對此說點什麼嗎？

Yeah, maybe just from -- well, commercial side, Kristian has just explained maybe a little bit from a financing perspective as the vessel is being delivered.

是的，也許只是從商業方面來說，克里斯蒂安剛從融資的角度解釋了一下船舶的交付情況。

We will be drawing down our financial facilities to finance each of the vessels.

我們將動用我們的融資能力來為每艘船舶提供資金。

I think the details, Petter, you can very well refer to the earlier deal structure, so to get a sense of how much each needs to be drawn down.

我認為細節，Petter，你可以很好地參考先前的交易結構，這樣就能了解每筆交易需要提取多少。

I won't be able to give you absolute number as the delivery is spread across the November to end of December.

由於交貨時間跨度為 11 月至 12 月底，因此我無法提供絕對數字。

Additionally, you would know that the depreciations will come in as we take ownership as well.

此外，您還會知道，當我們擁有所有權時，折舊就會發生。

Yes, naturally, yeah.

是的，當然，是的。

Okay, thank you.

好的，謝謝。

Just one more from me then, because from the asset market, it seems as if prices are still holding up to, well, more or less the same levels that we saw in the first half of the year as well.

我再說一句，從資產市場來看，價格似乎仍然維持在與我們今年上半年看到的大致相同的水平。

If you were to do something on the newer side now, how do you think that is going to compare to the Avance transaction?

如果您現在要做一些較新的事，您認為這與 Avance 交易相比如何？

Is it any -- sort of any data points that we could use to either mark the current resale price up or down from the Avance transaction?

是否有任何數據點可以用來標記當前轉售價格相對於 Avance 交易的上漲或下跌？

I think the market for the assets and the, let's say, sale and purchase market is pretty much unchanged for the new ships since last quarter.

我認為，自上個季度以來，新船的資產市場和買賣市場幾乎沒有變化。

So I think there is no real change from the last, I would say, six to eight months in terms of valuation for newer ships or newbuildings, if that answers your questions.

因此，我認為，與過去六到八個月相比，新船或新造船的估價並沒有發生真正的變化，如果這回答了您的問題的話。

It does, Kristian.

確實如此，克里斯蒂安。

Thank you, that was all for me.

謝謝，對我來說就這些了。

Jørgen Lian.

約爾根‧利安 (Jørgen Lian)。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Hello, Kristian, Samantha, you are now taking on a bit more debt as part of the VLGC acquisition from Avance and you have a pretty rigid net leverage ratio dividend policy.

你好，克里斯蒂安，薩曼莎，作為從 Avance 收購 VLGC 的一部分，你們現在承擔了更多的債務，而且你們的淨槓桿率股息政策相當嚴格。

So just, any question or any more information about what we potentially need to account for to adjust the net leverage for the short-term effects that you mentioned, Samantha, or is that sort of set in stone on how to think about the dividend payouts going forward?

所以，對於我們可能需要考慮哪些因素來調整淨槓桿以應對您提到的短期影響，Samantha，您還有什麼問題或更多信息嗎？如何？

Well, I can start off by saying that the dividend policy is what it is, but it's always up to the Board to finally declare the dividend.

好吧，我首先要說的是，股利政策就是這樣，但最終宣布股利還是由董事會決定。

So it's not -- I mean, there's no change in that respect.

所以不是—我的意思是，在這方面沒有變化。

So I am -- I wouldn't -- it's hard for the management to comment any further on the future dividend payouts.

因此，我不會——管理層很難對未來的股息支付發表進一步評論。

But the dividend policy is what it is.

但股利政策就是如此。

All right.

好的。

And, Samantha, I don't know if you have anything to add on or if that's then irrelevant in terms of the net leverage ratio where you talked about short-term events or short-term impacts from product services.

薩曼莎，我不知道您是否還有什麼要補充的，或者這是否與您談論的短期事件或產品服務的短期影響的淨槓桿率無關。

Yeah, I think, Jørgen, you are referring to my comments about Q3, the elements are driving up the leverage ratio.

是的，我認為，尤爾根，您指的是我對第三季的評論，這些因素正在推高槓桿率。

I have mentioned a couple of things that -- for example, the product services are drawing on the trade finance and the margin finance, et cetera.

我提到過幾件事，例如產品服務正在利用貿易融資和保證金融資等等。

As you know very well that that's a reflection of a slight -- I would say, a slide of time of the number of the cargoes are carrying on our balance sheet, that would change by days.

正如你所知，這反映了一種輕微的變化——我想說，隨著時間的推移，我們的資產負債表上載運的貨物數量會發生變化。

So that's what I meant as a temporary effect similarly for the purchase of BW Kizoku as well.

所以這就是我所說的暫時影響，對於購買 BW Kizoku 也是如此。

So that's due to the accounting rules that we have to gross it up, which drives up the leverage ratio once we take over of the vessel, and then it would just be normal asset.

這是因為根據會計規則我們必須將其加總，一旦我們接管船隻，槓桿率就會上升，然後它就只是普通資產了。

All right.

好的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

And then finally for me, on the product services part of the business and just to make sure that we understand correctly, but the way you booked this is sort of on a 12-month forward-looking basis, right?

最後，對我來說，關於業務的產品服務部分，只是為了確保我們理解正確，但您預訂的方式是基於 12 個月的前瞻性基礎，對嗎？

So when we're talking about length and the unrealized position, that would be sort of a fair working assumption.

因此，當我們談論長度和未實現的位置時，這將是一種公平的工作假設。

Yes.

是的。

So the positions are -- the forward positions are spread, as we always have, over a 12 months forward rolling period.

因此，正如我們一直以來所做的那樣，遠期部位分佈在 12 個月的遠期滾動期內。

That's right.

這是正確的。

Okay, thank you.

好的，謝謝。

[Clement Mullins].

[克萊門特·馬林斯]。

Hi, good afternoon.

嗨，下午好。

Thank you for taking my questions.

感謝您回答我的問題。

I wanted to start by asking about the Q3 TCE.

我想先詢問有關 Q3 TCE 的問題。

Considering the guidance you provided alongside Q2 earnings, it seems the low-to-discharge accounting had a positive impact on earnings.

考慮到您在第二季度收益中提供的指導，低排放量會計似乎對收益產生了積極影響。

Could you talk a bit about that?

你能稍微談論一下這個嗎？

And secondly, do you expect low-to-discharge accounting to once again have an impact on Q4 earnings relative to the guidance you provided?

其次，相對於您提供的指導，您是否預期低排放會計將再次對第四季收益產生影響？

Are you now referring to the IFRS adjustment?

您現在指的是 IFRS 調整嗎？

Exactly, yeah.

確實如此。

Yeah.

是的。

So -- I can say on a general basis, and then Samantha can also fill in here, that when the market is going up, there is -- the mechanism is that there is a negative IFRS adjustment.

所以 — — 我可以一般性地說，然後薩曼莎也可以在這裡填寫，當市場上漲時， — — 機制是存在負面的 IFRS 調整。

When the market is going down, you have a positive IFRS adjustment.

當市場下滑時，您會有一個積極的 IFRS 調整。

So that is the way IFRS is smoothing out the fluctuations during the year.

這就是 IFRS 平滑年度內波動的方式。

So that's just to kind of explain the mechanism on a general basis.

這只是從一般角度解釋機制。

Then, Samantha, if you could just comment on the IFRS adjustment for this quarter specifically.

那麼，薩曼莎，您能否具體評論一下本季的 IFRS 調整。

Yeah, so I think, Kristian, you captured most of the elements impacting IFRS 15.

是的，所以我認為，克里斯蒂安，你抓住了影響 IFRS 15 的大部分因素。

So it also, of course, has something to do with when the cargo is -- when the vessel is being ladened or in a last voyage.

當然，這也與貨物的時間——船舶裝載的時間或最後一次航行的時間有關。

In such a case, often, we are not able to give a forward-looking estimate.

在這種情況下，我們常常無法給出前瞻性的估計。

It can only -- after we have closed the quarter, we know exactly what's the impact.

只有在我們結束本季之後，我們才能確切地知道其影響是什麼。

So I will say, to answer your question is that, yes, there will be impact.

所以我要回答你的問題是，是的，會有影響。

As for the quantum as well as the direction, it's hard to give you advice over there, Clement.

至於數量以及方向，克萊門特，我很難給你建議。

Makes sense, thanks for the color.

有道理，謝謝你的顏色。

And given the sale of the Cedar, should we expect net proceeds to be distributed from the India JV to the parent or is there any appetite to buy another vessel in the JV level?

並且考慮到Cedar的出售，我們是否應該預期淨收益將從印度合資公司分配給母公司，或者是否有意在合資公司層級購買另一艘船舶？

And secondly, could you provide an update on the infrastructure investments in India?

其次，能否介紹一下印度基礎建設投資的最新情況？

Yeah, so on the sale of the Cedar, it's something, which will take place -- the delivery will take place in Q1, so then we will decide on how to distribute the net proceeds as and when we get to that point in time.

是的，關於 Cedar 的銷售，這將會發生——交付將在第一季進行，所以我們將決定如何在該時間點分配淨收益。

So I am -- we will get back to you in the next earnings release on how we have dealt with that.

所以我會—我們將在下次發布收益報告時向您報告我們是如何處理這個問題的。

When it comes to the infrastructure investments, there haven't been any major change since the last time, but we are proceeding according to plan, and hope to and expect to start the first phase of the construction of the terminal on this side of the new year, all going well.

至於基礎設施投資，自上次以來沒有任何重大變化，但我們正在按計劃進行，並希望並預計將開始這邊航站樓的第一階段建設。

That's helpful.

這很有幫助。

Thank you.

謝謝。

That's all for me.

對我來說這就是全部了。

Thank you for taking my questions.

感謝您回答我的問題。

August Klemp.

奧古斯特·克萊普。

Thank you.

謝謝。

A question kind of following up on Jørgen's question about product services, can you give some color on sort of -- I mean, Q3 was a fantastic result in the P&L with a very large ARB and kind of a more normalized rate, should we call it.

一個關於 Jørgen 關於產品服務問題的後續問題，您能否解釋一下——我的意思是，第三季度的損益表結果非常好，ARB 非常大，而且利率也更加正常化，應該我們稱之為。

Rates have been sort of flattish into Q4, while the ARB has come down.

利率在第四季度保持平穩，而 ARB 則有所下降。

Can you talk a little bit about sort of, in general, the environment this leaves for the product services division?

您能否簡要談談這給產品服務部門留下的整體環境？

Is it more difficult to extract value at this point?

此時要提取價值是否更加困難？

And secondly, seeing as it's unrealized, a large portion of the gain in Q3, which you will then realize kind of in the following quarters here, is there an argument to be made for paying out more than 100% of shipping NPAT because you will have a cash flow contribution from product services as well?

其次，鑑於第三季的大部分收益尚未實現，而這些收益將在接下來的幾個季度中實現，那麼是否有理由支付超過 100% 的運費稅後利潤，因為你會產品服務也對現金流有貢獻嗎？

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thanks, August.

謝謝，奧古斯特。

I can start with the last one.

我可以從最後一個開始。

I mean, if you look at how we distribute the profits from product services and the capital return to us as shareholders.

我的意思是，如果你看看我們如何分配產品服務的利潤和作為股東的資本回報。

I think you will get kind of the answer to your last question there.

我想你會在那裡找到你最後一個問題的答案。

And I think, with regards to actually -- if you can repeat your first question, August, because that was -- I lost my mind here now.

我認為，關於實際上——如果你可以重複你的第一個問題，奧古斯特，因為那是——我現在已經失去理智了。

That was a bit long, sorry.

有點長了，抱歉。

No, it's more about the market environment for product services now that the ARB has come in quite lot while shipping rates are more or less flattish from Q3.

不，現在更多的是關於產品服務的市場環境，因為 ARB 已經進入相當多的水平，而運費與第三季相比或多或少持平。

Yeah, I would say it's hard to guide exactly on how product services is performing from week to week and month to month.

是的，我想說很難準確地指導產品服務每周和每月的表現如何。

But they have many handles to pull.

但他們有很多可利用的把柄。

They have physical cargoes, FOB cargoes.

他們有實體貨物，離岸價貨物。

They have outlet positions in Europe and Asia where they have deliveries and commitments fixed on certain price mechanisms.

他們在歐洲和亞洲設有銷售點，並根據特定價格機制進行交貨和承諾。

They have derivative positions and shipping positions.

他們有衍生性商品部位和航運部位。

So they have, I would say, a wide range of ways to create profit and value even though the market is, like you say, in a state where the ARB is coming down and the shipping is also kind of flattish.

因此，我想說，儘管市場如您所說，ARB 正在下降，運輸量也持平，但他們仍有很多方法來創造利潤和價值。

So I would say it's -- on a general basis, it's hard for us to comment specifically how they may perform in a market like this, except for that they have many ways of positioning themselves depending on the prevailing market conditions.

因此我想說的是——總體而言，我們很難具體評論他們在這樣的市場中的表現，但他們可以根據當前的市場狀況，透過多種方式來定位自己。

So I'm sorry it's hard to be more specific, August.

所以很抱歉，奧古斯特，我很難說得更具體一些。

No, no, that's great.

不不不，太好了。

Thank you very much.

非常感謝。

And then finally, just kind of a housekeeping question, G&A was down quite a lot this quarter.

最後，這只是一個常規問題，本季的 G&A 費用下降了不少。

Any guidance there for Q4 and maybe also for depreciation as you take over the Avance vessels?

當您接管 Avance 船舶時，您對第四季度以及折舊方面有何指導？

I can just start off with the G&A because I think what we are doing is that we are accruing for bonus, tax, et cetera, which is based on realized profits, and that will go a little bit up and down during the year.

我可以從一般及行政事務開始，因為我認為我們正在做的是累積獎金、稅金等等，這是基於已實現的利潤，而這些在一年內會略有上升和下降。

Because we do this on a quarterly basis, adjusting it.

因為我們每季都會進行一次調整。

So I think you have to see the G&A over the year to get the full picture of how the G&A is playing out because there are certain elements of bonus, tax, et cetera, which is being adjusted from quarter to quarter.

因此，我認為您必須查看全年的一般及行政開支，才能全面了解一般及行政開支的運作情況，因為獎金、稅收等某些因素會逐季度進行調整。

And, Samantha, would you like to add anything there?

莎曼珊，你還有什麼要補充嗎？

Yeah, I think that's correctly said.

是的，我認為說得正確。

I think, if you're referring to contrast with the previous year, I will say that there is no drastic changes expected as we've seen last year.

我認為，如果您指的是與前一年進行對比，那麼我會說，預計不會出現像去年那樣的劇烈變化。

Okay, thank you very much.

好的，非常感謝。

(Operator Instructions) We have, during the Q&A session, also answered a few incoming questions on the chat channel.

（操作員指示）在問答環節中，我們也回答了聊天頻道中出現的一些問題。

Are there any more Q&As you would like to raise on the chat?

您還有其他想要在聊天中提出的問答嗎？

If not, I will round off the Q&A session.

如果沒有，我將結束問答環節。

It seems like we have answered all the questions here now.

現在看來我們已經回答了所有問題。

So I'd like to thank everyone for joining us.

所以我感謝大家的加入我們。

And I think that concludes our third-quarter 2024 result presentation.

我想這就是我們 2024 年第三季業績報告的結束。

So thanks, everyone, for dialing in, and we wish you a good rest of the day wherever you are in the world.

感謝各位的收聽，無論您身在何處，我們都祝您今天過得愉快。

Thank you.

謝謝。