富蘭克林資源 (BEN) 2024 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to Franklin Resources Earnings Conference Call for the quarter ended March 31, 2024. Hello, my name is Sylvie, and I will be your call operator today. As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. (Operator Instructions)

歡迎參加富蘭克林資源截至 2024 年 3 月 31 日的季度財報電話會議。提醒一下，本次會議正在錄製中。 （操作員說明）

I would now like to turn the conference over to your host, Selene Oh, Chief Communications Officer and Head of Investor Relations for Franklin Resources. You may begin.

現在我想將會議交給主持人、富蘭克林資源公司首席傳播官兼投資者關係主管 Selene Oh。你可以開始了。

Good morning, and thank you for joining us today to discuss our quarterly results.

早安，感謝您今天加入我們討論我們的季度業績。

Statements made on this conference call regarding Franklin Resources, Inc., which are not historical facts are forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These forward-looking statements involve a number of known and unknown risks, uncertainties and other important factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from any future results expressed or implied by such forward-looking statements.

本次電話會議中有關富蘭克林資源公司的聲明並非歷史事實，而是 1995 年《私人證券訴訟改革法案》含義內的前瞻性聲明。與此類前瞻性陳述明示或暗示的任何未來結果存在重大差異的不確定性和其他重要因素。

These and other risks, uncertainties and other important factors are just described in more detail in Franklin's recent filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission, including in the Risk Factors and the MD&A sections of Franklin's most recent Form 10-K and 10-Q filings.

這些和其他風險、不確定性和其他重要因素在富蘭克林最近向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中進行了更詳細的描述，包括富蘭克林最近提交的10-K 表格和10-Q 表格的風險因素和MD&A部分。

Now I'd like to turn the call over to Jenny Johnson, our President and Chief Executive Officer.

現在我想將電話轉給我們的總裁兼執行長珍妮·約翰遜 (Jenny Johnson)。

Thank you, Selene. Hello, everyone, and thank you for joining us today to discuss Franklin Templeton's results for the second fiscal quarter of 2024. I'm joined by Matt Nicholls, our CFO and COO; and Adam Spector, our Head of Global Distribution.

謝謝你，塞琳娜。大家好，感謝您今天加入我們討論富蘭克林鄧普頓 2024 年第二財季的業績。以及我們的全球分銷主管 Adam Spector。

We'll answer your questions in just a few minutes. But first, I'd like to review some highlights from the quarter. In terms of public equity markets, 2023 was, to some extent, a tale of 2 markets, the Magnificent Seven and the S&P 493 with the former contributing the lion's share of returns.

我們將在幾分鐘內回答您的問題。但首先，我想回顧一下本季的一些亮點。就公共股票市場而言，2023 年在某種程度上是兩個市場的故事，即七大市場和標準普爾 493 指數，前者貢獻了最大份額的回報。

So far in 2024, in the public equity markets, we've seen a significant dispersion emerge in performance among the Magnificent Seven, leading to a better environment for fundamental research to capture alpha and when augmented by robust risk management can deliver compelling portfolio results for clients.

到2024 年為止，在公共股票市場，我們已經看到七巨頭之間的表現出現了顯著的分散，這為基礎研究捕捉阿爾法帶來了更好的環境，並且在強有力的風險管理的增強下，可以為投資者帶來令人信服的投資組合結果。

Given the current backdrop, we believe equity allocation should, in general, tilt towards sectors and regions that are being overlooked due to the heavy concentration in the largest companies. In addition, the theme of artificial intelligence will likely continue to be a significant stock driver, both positive and negative for the haves and have-nots over time.

在當前背景下，我們認為股票配置總體上應該向那些因大公司高度集中而被忽視的行業和地區傾斜。此外，人工智慧主題可能會繼續成為重要的股票驅動因素，隨著時間的推移，對富人和窮人來說既有積極的一面，也有消極的一面。

Meanwhile, on interest rates, consensus estimates currently indicate a notable decrease in the number of expected cuts for 2024 by the Federal Reserve from 6 to now 2. Fed speak increasingly signals openness to delaying rate cuts to later in the second half of this year on the back of improving economic growth and slower disinflation.

同時，在利率方面，目前的共識估計表明，聯準會2024 年預期降息次數顯著減少，從6 次減少到現在的2 次。今年下半年稍後持開放態度。

Against this background, while cash may continue to look attractive in the very near term, fixed income opportunities will likely provide a better total return option over high-yield and cash equivalents as the cutting cycle commences.

在此背景下，雖然現金在短期內可能繼續有吸引力，但隨著削減週期的開始，固定收益機會可能會提供比高收益和現金等價物更好的總回報選擇。

Looking at private markets, secular trends and macro tailwinds continue to create opportunities in alternative credit, secondary private equity and select areas of real estate. In addition, investor demand for private market exposure is increasing given its diversification benefits, potential for higher risk-adjusted returns and as a hedge against inflation.

縱觀私募市場，長期趨勢和宏觀順風繼續在另類信貸、二級私募股權和特定房地產領域創造機會。此外，鑑於私募市場的多元化優勢、更高風險調整回報的潛力以及對沖通膨的潛力，投資者對私募市場敞口的需求正在增加。

Broadly speaking, these signals point to a complex market environment that creates opportunities for active managers. This quarter, my executive team and I had the opportunity to travel extensively outside the U.S. to meet with many of our key clients to hear firsthand what is top of mind and how Franklin Templeton can better serve them.

從廣義上講，這些訊號表明複雜的市場環境為主動型基金經理人創造了機會。本季度，我和我的管理團隊有機會在美國以外的地方廣泛出差，與我們的許多重要客戶會面，直接了解他們的首要想法以及富蘭克林鄧普頓如何更好地為他們服務。

As a global active manager with $1.6 trillion in assets under management and operating in 35 countries around the world, we believe that Franklin Templeton is positioned to take advantage of the money in motion by assisting our clients with a broad range of investment capabilities across public and private assets in vehicles of choice.

作為一家管理1.6 兆美元資產並在全球35 個國家/地區開展業務的全球主動管理公司，我們相信富蘭克林鄧普頓能夠透過在公共和公共領域的廣泛投資能力協助我們的客戶，充分利用流動資金。

We were also pleased to learn that our clients recognize the steps we have taken over the past few years to further diversify and strengthen our presence in important markets and distribution channels outside the U.S. We, again, saw aggregate positive net flows in non-U.S. regions, which now have approximately $490 billion in assets under management.

我們也很高興地獲悉，我們的客戶認可我們在過去幾年中為進一步多元化和加強我們在美國以外的重要市場和分銷渠道的存在而採取的步驟。流量為正值目前管理約 4,900 億美元的資產。

Furthermore, a number of our clients continue to progress toward working with fewer asset managers and in this regard, expect not only a broad range of investment capabilities, but also other services, including technology, portfolio construction, customization and thought leadership.

此外，我們的許多客戶繼續朝著與更少的資產管理公司合作的方向發展，在這方面，他們不僅期望獲得廣泛的投資能力，還期望獲得其他服務，包括技術、投資組合建構、客製化和思想領導力。

At Franklin Templeton, we leverage the skills of multiple specialist investment managers to deliver expertise across a wide range of investment styles and asset classes. Our investment teams benefit from Franklin Templeton's scale, with centralized investments in content, technology, data and most recently, artificial intelligence where we're excited about collaborating with leaders in technology on AI platforms.

在富蘭克林鄧普頓，我們利用多位專業投資經理的技能，為各種投資風格和資產類別提供專業知識。我們的投資團隊受益於富蘭克林鄧普頓的規模，集中投資於內容、技術、數據以及最近的人工智慧，我們很高興與人工智慧平台上的技術領導者合作。

Moreover, the diversity of our model benefits our corporate shareholders, given that no single specialist investment manager at our firm represents more than 12% of adjusted operating revenue and most of our specialist investment managers are diversified within themselves as well.

此外，我們模式的多樣性有利於我們的公司股東，因為我們公司沒有任何一個專業投資經理佔調整後營業收入的 12% 以上，而且我們的大多數專業投資經理本身也實現了多元化。

Turning to highlights from the quarter. Ending AUM increased by 13% to $1.64 trillion from the prior quarter and increased by 16% from the prior year quarter due to the addition of Putnam as well as positive markets and net inflows. Average AUM increased by 13% and 11% to $1.58 trillion from the prior quarter and the prior year quarter, respectively.

轉向本季的亮點。由於普特南的加入以及積極的市場和淨流入，期末資產管理規模較上一季成長 13%，達到 1.64 兆美元，較上年同期成長 16%。平均資產管理規模較上一季和去年同期分別成長 13% 和 11%，達到 1.58 兆美元。

Investment performance continues to be strong and resulted in 62%, 51%, 62% and 69% of our strategy composite AUM outperforming their respective benchmarks on a 1-, 3-, 5- and 10-year basis, benefiting from the addition of Putnam.

投資表現持續強勁，導致我們 62%、51%、62% 和 69% 的策略組合資產管理規模在 1 年、3 年、5 年和 10 年基礎上跑贏各自的基準，這得益於普特南。

In terms of mutual funds, investment performance resulted in 51%, 60%, 44% and 56% of mutual fund AUM outperforming their peers on a 1-, 3-, 5- and 10-year basis, and performance strengthened versus peers across the 3-, 5- and 10-year time periods quarter-over-quarter.

互惠基金方面，投資表現使得互惠基金管理規模在1年、3年、5年及10年基礎上表現優於同業，且績效較同業有所增強，分別為51%、60%、44%及56 % 3 年期、5 年期和 10 年期的季度環比。

Our long-term net flows were $6.9 billion in the quarter, including reinvested distributions of $3.1 billion and $13.7 billion was funded out of the $25 billion allocation from Great-West. Long-term net inflows were spread across asset classes, investment vehicles and geographies. Fixed income, multi-asset and alternative assets led the way from an asset class perspective and we continue to see growth in our separately managed account, ETF and Canvas offerings. Each have achieved at least 4 consecutive quarters of net inflows and all are at record high AUM.

本季我們的長期淨流量為 69 億美元，其中包括 31 億美元的再投資分配，其中 137 億美元是從 Great-West 的 250 億美元撥款中出資的。長期淨流入分佈在不同資產類別、投資工具及地區。從資產類別的角度來看，固定收益、多元資產和另類資產處於領先地位，我們的獨立管理帳戶、ETF 和 Canvas 產品持續成長。每家公司已至少連續 4 個季度實現淨流入，且資產管理規模均創歷史新高。

Long-term inflows of $85 billion increased by 23% from the prior quarter and 37% from the prior year quarter. Excluding reinvested distributions, which are seasonally elevated in the prior quarter and inflows from Great-West, long-term inflows increased by 17% from the prior quarter and 15% from the prior year quarter.

長期流入額為 850 億美元，較上季成長 23%，較上季成長 37%。不包括上一季季節性增加的再投資分配和來自 Great-West 的資金流入，長期資金流入較上一季增加 17%，較去年同期增加 15%。

In terms of flows by asset class, fixed income net inflows were $8.3 billion, we saw client interest reflected in positive net flows into core bond highly customized corporate bond, multi-sector municipal and high-yield strategies.

就按資產類別劃分的流量而言，固定收益淨流入為 83 億美元，我們看到客戶興趣反映在核心債券、高度客製化的公司債券、多部門市政和高收益策略的正淨流入上。

Equity net outflows were $5.3 billion. We saw positive net flows into large-cap value and smart beta. Excluding reinvested distributions, which are seasonally elevated in the prior quarter, equity net outflows improved by 29% from the prior quarter. Multi-asset net inflows were $2.9 billion, driven by Franklin Templeton Investment Solutions, the Franklin Income Fund and Canvas, our custom indexing solution platform.

股票淨流出為 53 億美元。我們看到正淨流入大盤價值股和 smart beta 股。不包括上一季季節性上升的再投資分配，股權淨流出較上一季增加 29%。在富蘭克林鄧普頓投資解決方案、富蘭克林收入基金和我們的客製化索引解決方案平台 Canvas 的推動下，多資產淨流入達到 29 億美元。

Alternative net inflows were $1 billion, driven by growth in the private market strategies, which were partially offset by outflows in liquid alternative strategies.

另類投資淨流入為 10 億美元，主要受到私募市場策略成長的推動，但流動性另類策略的流出部分抵銷了這一成長。

Benefit Street Partners, Clarion Partners and Lexington Partners each had net inflows in the current quarter with a combined total of $1.4 billion. As we mentioned last quarter, in January, Lexington Partners closed its latest flagship global secondary fund with $22.7 billion of total capital commitments.

Benefit Street Partners、Clarion Partners 和 Lexington Partners 本季均實現淨流入，總計 14 億美元。正如我們上一季提到的，1 月份，Lexington Partners 關閉了其最新的旗艦全球二級基金，總資本承諾為 227 億美元。

Fund 10 ranks among the largest funds raised to date and significantly exceeded Lexington's private secondary fund, which closed with $14 billion in 2020, and we were delighted that approximately 20% of the capital raised in the fund came from the wealth management channel.

Fund 10 躋身迄今為止募集規模最大的基金之列，大幅超過了列剋星敦的私人二級基金，該基金2020 年募集資金達140 億美元，我們很高興該基金募集的資金中約20% 來自財富管理通路。

Also in January, Benefit Street Partners closed its 5th flagship private credit fund with $4.7 billion of total capital commitments, reflecting the strong demand for the asset class, BSP exceeded its fundraising target. We believe the current market opportunity and backdrop for U.S. direct lending and alternative credit in general is attractive, and BSP has significant underwriting experience, loan structuring expertise and focus on deep due diligence, which provides us with a competitive advantage.

同樣在 1 月，Benefit Street Partners 關閉了第五隻旗艦私人信貸基金，總資本承諾為 47 億美元，反映出對該資產類別的強勁需求，BSP 超出了其籌款目標。我們認為，美國直接貸款和另類信貸目前的市場機會和背景總體上很有吸引力，而且菲律賓央行擁有豐富的承保經驗、貸款結構專業知識並專注於深入的盡職調查，這為我們提供了競爭優勢。

In the wealth management channel, alternatives by Franklin Templeton has increased the number of product offerings and expanded platform placements, increasing market share and growing our client base. Our distribution force of more than 350 individual partners with our 50% group of alternative asset specialists to educate financial advisers and their clients on the potential benefits of private market investing.

在財富管理管道中，富蘭克林鄧普頓的替代方案增加了產品數量並擴大了平台佈局，增加了市場份額並擴大了我們的客戶群。我們的經銷團隊由 350 多名個人組成，其中 50% 是另類資產專家，旨在向財務顧問及其客戶介紹私募市場投資的潛在好處。

We expect a busy next 12 months across private markets.

我們預計未來 12 個月私募市場將非常繁忙。

From an investment vehicle perspective, ETF AUM ended the quarter at $24 billion and generated net inflows of approximately $1.6 billion representing another quarter of net inflows exceeding $1 billion and the tenth consecutive quarter of positive net flows. SMA AUM ended the quarter at $138 billion and generated positive net flows of nearly $3 billion, representing the fourth consecutive quarter of net inflows.

從投資工具的角度來看，ETF AUM 本季末達到240 億美元，產生約16 億美元的淨流入，這意味著淨流入又一個季度超過10 億美元，並且連續第十個季度淨流入為正值。 SMA 資產管理規模本季末達到 1,380 億美元，產生近 30 億美元的正淨流入，代表連續第四個季度出現淨流入。

Canvas generated net inflows of over $750 million with a robust pipeline and AUM increasing by 23% from the prior quarter to over $7 billion. Investment Solutions leverages our capabilities across public and private asset classes to pursue strategic partnerships. This quarter, Investment Solutions generated positive net flows with assets under management of over $75 billion, including the addition of Putnam.

Canvas 憑藉強勁的通路產生了超過 7.5 億美元的淨流入，資產管理規模較上一季成長了 23%，達到超過 70 億美元。投資解決方案利用我們在公共和私人資產類別中的能力來尋求策略夥伴關係。本季度，投資解決方案產生了正的淨流量，管理的資產超過 750 億美元，其中包括 Putnam 的加入。

This quarter, our institutional pipeline of one but unfunded mandates was $20 billion, a significant increase from the prior quarter and does not include the remaining allocation from Great-West Lifeco. The pipeline is one of the strongest it's been and remains diversified by asset class and across our specialist investment managers.

本季度，我們的機構管道中一項但尚未獲得資金的授權為 200 億美元，比上一季大幅增加，並且不包括 Great-West Lifeco 的剩餘撥款。該管道是迄今為止最強大的管道之一，並且在資產類別和我們的專業投資經理中仍然保持多元化。

With the close of our acquisition of Putnam on January 1, we are a $1.64 trillion investment manager. We've been pleased with the positive reaction from our clients and in the quarter, Putnam contributed positive net flows and its AUM increased by 8% to $160 billion or 18% since our announcement in May last year.

隨著我們於 1 月 1 日完成 Putnam 的收購，我們成為了價值 1.64 兆美元的投資管理公司。我們對客戶的正面反應感到滿意，自去年 5 月宣布以來，Putnam 貢獻了正的淨流量，其資產管理規模增加了 8%，達到 1,600 億美元，即 18%。

With our expanded capabilities, our AUM in the insurance and retirement channels now exceeds $650 billion. Putnam's investment performance continued to be strong, with 89% or higher of mutual fund AUM outperforming peers in the 1-, 3-, 5- and 10-year periods and 91% of mutual fund AUM in funds that are rated 4 or 5 star by Morningstar.

隨著我們能力的擴展，我們在保險和退休管道的資產管理規模現已超過6500億美元。 Putnam的投資表現持續強勁，89%或以上的共同基金管理規模在1年、3年、5年和10年期間表現優於同行，91%的共同基金管理規模為4星或5星評級的基金晨星公司提供。

We were also thrilled to see that Barron's ranked Putnam the #1 fund family for 1- and 5-year performance and #5 for the 10-year period.

我們也很高興看到《巴倫周刊》將 Putnam 基金家族的 1 年和 5 年業績排名第一，10 年業績排名第五。

Since the closing, we're also pleased to see that Putnam's average monthly gross sales has increased by approximately 30%, demonstrating the strength of Franklin Templeton's distribution.

自交易完成以來，我們也很高興看到 Putnam 的月均銷售總額增加了約 30%，這證明了富蘭克林鄧普頓的分銷實力。

Turning briefly to financial results. Adjusted operating income was $419.6 million, an increase of 0.6% from the prior quarter and a decrease of 4.7% from the prior year quarter.

簡要談談財務業績。調整後營業收入為 4.196 億美元，季增 0.6%，季減 4.7%。

As always, we continue to focus on disciplined expense management, while also continuing to invest in growth and innovation for the benefits of our clients and shareholders.

一如既往，我們繼續專注於嚴格的費用管理，同時繼續投資於成長和創新，以造福客戶和股東。

Before I turn the call over to you for your questions, I would like to thank our employees for their many contributions and always staying laser-focused on our clients' financial future. Now let's open it up to your questions. Operator?

在我將電話轉給您詢問您的問題之前，我要感謝我們的員工所做的許多貢獻，以及始終高度關注客戶的財務未來。現在讓我們來解答您的問題。操作員？

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

One moment for your first question which will be from Craig Siegenthaler at Bank of America.

請稍等一下，回答您的第一個問題，該問題將由美國銀行的克雷格·西根塔勒 (Craig Siegenthaler) 提出。

First, we have a big picture net flow question. Lots of ins and outs in the $7 billion, especially with the $14 billion and from -- Great-West. So how should we think about the core net flow run rate if we back the $14 billion out of the $7 billion of long-term net flows?

首先，我們有一個整體的淨流量問題。 70 億美元有很多來龍去脈，尤其是 140 億美元，來自 Great-West。那麼，如果我們支援 70 億美元長期淨流量中的 140 億美元，我們該如何考慮核心淨流量運行率呢？

So Craig, thanks for the question. Let me -- let me answer that question in first, kind of how we're positioning ourselves, and I will -- I promise you, I will get to those points and Adam can add some additional cover -- color. So -- the way we're positioned the firm, I think of it as in 4 key secular trends that has driven our acquisition strategy and what we think will drive flows now and in the future. So the first obviously is our movement to alternatives. We think that it's not going away, private credit is here to stay, banks are going to lend the same way that they've done in the past, private equity is here to stay. And so if you look at our breadth of capabilities from Lexington, Clarion, BSP, Alcentra we think we have the broadest alternatives capability of any traditional asset manager.

克雷格，謝謝你的提問。讓我——讓我先回答這個問題，我們如何定位自己，我會——我向你保證，我會講到這些要點，亞當可以添加一些額外的掩護——顏色。因此，我們對公司的定位方式，我認為是推動我們收購策略的 4 個關鍵長期趨勢，以及我們認為將推動現在和未來資金流動的因素。因此，第一個顯然是我們轉向替代方案的運動。我們認為這種情況不會消失，私人信貸將繼續存在，銀行將以與過去相同的方式放貸，私募股權將繼續存在。因此，如果你看看我們 Lexington、Clarion、BSP、Alcentra 的廣泛能力，我們認為我們擁有任何傳統資產管理公司最廣泛的替代能力。

And from a flow standpoint, obviously well known in the institutional space, what's really important is that the -- in the wealth channel, there's a desire to go from about a 5% allocation to a 15% allocation. And what's significant there, if you just take the 4 biggest wire houses a 1% increase in allocation is $130 billion. And what we're excited about is that as we mentioned in the prior comments and opening comments, Lexington's that fundraise was in the wealth channel. And believe me, that was years of learning starts and stops in blocking and tackling, learning about education, educating our own team, educating the advisers who are selling to be able to be successful in that. And we think we can take that same strategy with any of our alternatives.

從流量的角度來看，顯然在機構領域眾所周知，真正重要的是——在財富管道中，人們希望從大約 5% 的分配到 15% 的分配。重要的是，如果只考慮 4 家最大的電線公司，分配增加 1% 就是 1,300 億美元。我們感到興奮的是，正如我們在先前的評論和開場評論中提到的，列剋星敦的籌款是透過財富管道進行的。相信我，那是多年來在阻止和解決方面開始和停止的學習，學習教育，教育我們自己的團隊，教育銷售顧問，以便能夠在這方面取得成功。我們認為我們可以對任何替代方案採取同樣的策略。

The second -- I'm going to name 4 of them. The second is just customization. You're seeing from technology advances that clients want either specific vehicles or the portfolios to be customized. And so if you look at this quarter's trends, things like our SMA, which is positive, Legg Mason made us a top 3 SMA provider. You're seeing more and more flows going into SMAs, ETFs, while we were late arguably to the passive ETF space, we were actually early in the active ETF space. And today, at our $24 billion in ETFs, the largest category is actually active ETFs.

第二個——我將列出其中的 4 個。第二個只是客製。您從技術進步中看到，客戶希望客製化特定的車輛或產品組合。因此，如果你看看本季的趨勢，例如我們的 SMA，這是正面的，Legg Mason 使我們成為前 3 名 SMA 提供者。你會看到越來越多的資金流入 SMA、ETF，雖然我們在被動 ETF 領域的進展可以說是較晚的，但實際上我們在主動 ETF 領域的進展卻很早。如今，在我們 240 億美元的 ETF 中，最大的類別實際上是主動型 ETF。

And we're seeing that in markets like Europe, where the regulatory environment has changed, there's a greater demand now for ETFs. And we're having success in our like green bond and Paris Alliance. So a lot of the ESG ETFs are doing very well in Europe.

我們看到，在歐洲等監管環境變化的市場，現在對 ETF 的需求更大。我們在綠色債券和巴黎聯盟等領域也取得了成功。因此，許多 ESG ETF 在歐洲表現都非常好。

And then finally, in kind of that customization vehicle being -- vehicle (inaudible) is the direct indexing. And not only we're seeing positive flows consistently with Canvas. But we added 11 new partners to the 88 partners that we have with Canvas. And once you get embedded in -- from the -- in the pipes, you continue to see flow. So it's just a great opportunity.

最後，在某種客製化車輛中——車輛（聽不清楚）是直接索引。我們不僅看到 Canvas 持續帶來正面的流量。但我們在 Canvas 現有 88 個合作夥伴的基礎上又增加了 11 個新合作夥伴。一旦你嵌入——從——管道中，你就會繼續看到流動。所以這只是一個很好的機會。

But I think what gets us most excited about Canvas is the fact that as you're seeing this trend towards greater SMAs, Canvas was built as a technology platform. Some of the direct indexing were more about people who focused on tax optimization. This is truly a technology platform. So we can see taking traditional active portfolios of being able to tax optimize as well as tilting. And you have to have the right technology for that.

但我認為 Canvas 最讓我們興奮的是，當你看到這種更大 SMA 的趨勢時，Canvas 是作為一個技術平台構建的。一些直接索引更多的是針對專注於稅收優化的人。這確實是一個技術平台。因此，我們可以看到採用能夠稅收優化和傾斜的傳統主動投資組合。為此，您必須擁有合適的技術。

The third big trend, I think, is really global distribution. You have 1 billion people that are entering the middle class, 87% of those are in Asia. And so we've got that massive global distribution. We were in Taiwan in 1985. We were the first foreign manager in India. We have local asset management capabilities in emerging markets like in the Middle East, China, India, Brazil as well as local capabilities in a lot of developed markets. And so we think we're really uniquely positioned to take advantage of that trend. And as a matter of fact, this quarter, you saw non-U.S. flows were positive outside the U.S.

我認為第三大趨勢是真正的全球分銷。有 10 億人正在進入中產階級，其中 87% 在亞洲。所以我們擁有大規模的全球分銷。 1985年我們來到台灣。我們在中東、中國、印度、巴西等新興市場擁有本地資產管理能力，在許多已開發市場也擁有本地資產管理能力。因此，我們認為我們確實處於獨特的地位，可以利用這一趨勢。事實上，本季，美國以外的非美國資金流呈正值。

And then the fourth and, obviously, really important is the technology and technological advances. And that's where I would say, I think the players -- so far, if you play the AI move, you've been playing in the picks and shovels of artificial intelligence, it's going to be the firms that really figure out how to make this work for them to make it a competitive advantage that's important. You'll hear it about an announcement later this week where we are announcing a strategic partnership on some AI work that we're doing with one of those big players.

第四，顯然，真正重要的是技術和技術進步。這就是我要說的，我認為參與者 - 到目前為止，如果你玩人工智慧，你一直在玩人工智慧的鎬和鏟子，那麼真正弄清楚如何製造的公司將是這對他們來說是一項重要的競爭優勢。你會在本週稍後聽到一則公告，我們宣布與其中一家大型企業就一些人工智慧工作建立策略合作夥伴關係。

And then the secondary is blockchain. And we came out with a tokenized first one to have a 40 Act shareholder system on the public blockchain. We came out with the tokenized money market fund in 2021. So the first to do that, we are actually a node validator in the space with 11 different nodes. It's an area we know well, and we think it's going to be really significant. We announced a partnership with a UAE-based firm to leverage -- they're going to leverage our blockchain technology, shareholder servicing systems to launch a stable coin, and we'll be managing the portfolio there.

其次是區塊鏈。我們推出了第一個在公共區塊鏈上擁有 40 Act 股東系統的代幣化系統。我們在 2021 年推出了代幣化貨幣市場基金。這是我們熟悉的領域，我們認為它將非常重要。我們宣布與一家阿聯酋公司建立合作夥伴關係——他們將利用我們的區塊鏈技術、股東服務系統來推出穩定幣，而我們將在那裡管理投資組合。

So as you bring those together, now to answer your question, it's going to be -- it's about execution, right? And I could tell you, I think we found it was probably -- it's a challenge when you take -- you do 10 different acquisitions and you're trying to choose best athlete for your distribution team, and we genuinely believe we put together the best team, but there are headwinds to that where you get a new wholesaler in a region and you've broken relationships maybe with the prior wholesalers clients. And so it takes time to build those relationships back. But we feel like we're really seeing that pay off this quarter.

因此，當你將這些放在一起時，現在來回答你的問題，那就是——這與執行有關，對嗎？我可以告訴你，我認為我們發現這可能是一個挑戰，當你進行 10 次不同的收購時，你試圖為你的分銷團隊選擇最好的運動員，我們真誠地相信我們將最好的團隊，但是如果您在某個地區找到了新的批發商，並且您可能與以前的批發商客戶斷絕了關係，那麼就會遇到阻力。因此，重建這些關係需要時間。但我們覺得本季我們確實看到了回報。

You see it in our pipeline, I mean, to go from $13 billion to $20 billion and not have -- that's not any Great-West Life. That's just good, solid wins in the pipeline growth. Interesting statistic is our core sales, and we define core sales, sales less than $100 million. So these are the ones that just -- you get on an adviser's platform and they continue to just allocate to you. So excluding Putnam, those are up 14%. And again, those are where that wholesalers out there meeting and so a good success there.

我的意思是，你可以在我們的管道中看到，從 130 億美元到 200 億美元，但沒有——這不是任何 Great-West Life。這在管道成長方面取得了良好的、堅實的勝利。有趣的統計數據是我們的核心銷售額，我們定義核心銷售額，銷售額低於 1 億美元。所以這些就是──你進入顧問的平台，他們繼續分配給你。因此，如果不包括普特南，則增長了 14%。再說一次，這些都是批發商聚會的地方，所以在那裡取得了巨大的成功。

And then if you look at inflows, excluding reinvested distributions Great-West Life, they're up 17%. So we're positive in all those vehicles, we're positive outside the U.S. where we've got good pipeline strength.

然後，如果你看看資金流入情況，不包括 Great-West Life 的再投資分配，它們會成長 17%。因此，我們對所有這些車輛都持積極態度，我們對美國以外的地區也持積極態度，因為我們擁有良好的管道實力。

And then you take a firm like Putnam. And this is where we've talked about this, and I think you see it with Putnam, where the big distribution companies or big distributors are saying they want to consolidate the number of partners. And so you take a Putnam, we've actually grown Putnam sales by 30% since the acquisition. And that's just really, in some cases, where we're a preferred partner with a distributor, and they weren't and now they get the benefit of being part of that preferred partnership. It's where our 350-plus client-facing wholesalers can be out there telling the phenomenal story of the performance of the Putnam's funds. And so to see a 30% increase in really the first quarter of Putnam because of bringing it together that distribution is really exciting.

然後你就選擇像普特南這樣的公司。這就是我們討論過的地方，我想你在普特南也看到了這一點，大型分銷公司或大型分銷商表示他們希望整合合作夥伴的數量。以 Putnam 為例，自收購以來，我們的 Putnam 銷售額實際上成長了 30%。事實上，在某些情況下，我們是經銷商的首選合作夥伴，而他們不是，現在他們獲得了成為該首選合作夥伴關係的一部分的好處。在這裡，我們 350 多家面向客戶的批發商可以講述 Putnam 基金績效的非凡故事。因此，看到 Putnam 的第一季成長了 30%，因為將其分佈在一起，真的令人興奮。

So long-winded answer, Craig, but I think we're -- we feel like all that we've put together is coming together in distribution now.

克雷格，答案很囉嗦，但我認為我們——我們覺得我們所做的一切現在都在分發中。

We're looking forward to seeing your AI announcement later this week. We have a follow-up on outflows. Over the last 8 quarters, we added it up, Franklin had a $13 billion of all inflows. And I know this excludes realizations too. If we add up Lexington $10 million and Benefit Street $5 million. Combined, they add a $27 billion. So all flows look to have been maybe negative $14 billion excess 2 flagship fundraises. So a similar question, but (inaudible) on the alts business, how should we think about the (inaudible) net flow trajectory just given that dynamic?

我們期待在本週晚些時候看到你們的 AI 公告。我們對資金流出進行了追蹤。在過去 8 個季度中，我們將其加起來，富蘭克林的所有流入資金達到了 130 億美元。我知道這也不包括實現。如果我們將列剋星敦加起來 1000 萬美元，將福利街加起來 500 萬美元。合計增加 270 億美元。因此，所有資金流看起來可能比 2 旗艦融資額為負 140 億美元。這是一個類似的問題，但是（聽不清楚）在替代品業務上，考慮到這種動態，我們應該如何考慮（聽不清楚）淨流量軌跡？

So I think it's -- there's a little bit of noise in the alts numbers. If you just look in calendar year 2022 and 2023, we talked last time about how we raised $40 billion in the private markets. But the reality in our alternatives business, we raised $55 billion, and 80% of it was private markets. But the net change in AUM, you saw $40 billion added to the private markets AUM net, net of realizations, distributions, market, everything. But $16 billion negative in the liquid alts portfolio, which represents about 6% of our alts portfolio now. So that's where you're shifting from much -- the good news is it's the higher fee private markets that have had -- that had solid inflows in that window, but it was a little bit masked by the lower fee liquid alts.

所以我認為替代品數字中存在一些噪音。如果你看看 2022 年和 2023 年，我們上次談到了我們如何在私募市場籌集 400 億美元。但事實上，在我們的另類業務中，我們籌集了 550 億美元，其中 80% 來自私人市場。但資產管理規模的淨變化是，私募市場資產管理規模淨值增加了 400 億美元，扣除變現、分配、市場等一切因素。但流動性另類投資組合中存在 160 億美元的負值，目前約占我們另類投資組合的 6%。因此，這就是你正在轉變的地方 - 好消息是，在該窗口中，收費較高的私人市場有大量資金流入，但它被收費較低的流動性替代品所掩蓋。

Now fast forward to this -- I'll go this fiscal year. So the first 2 quarters, first of all, we said that we would be raising between $10 billion and $15 billion. That's our goal for the year. We're on track for that. We've raised about $7.3 billion in the private markets and another just under $2 billion in the liquid alts.

現在快進到這一點——我將進入本財年。因此，首先，我們在前兩個季度表示將籌集 100 億至 150 億美元的資金。這是我們今年的目標。我們正朝著這個目標邁進。我們已在私募市場籌集了約 73 億美元，並在流動性替代市場籌集了近 20 億美元。

But if you net out distributions, realizations, FX and market, and to be honest, market -- the only negative market was real estate with Clarion and the others were all positive. We'd say it nets to flat. So again, kind of a gross number there. But if you take away the distributions, realizations and FX, FX was actually pretty significant. Matt could probably give you more details on this, but we netted flat so far in the -- in this fiscal year.

但如果你扣除分配、變現、外匯和市場，老實說，市場——唯一的負面市場是歌樂的房地產市場，其他市場都是正面的。我們會說它的淨值持平。再說一遍，這是一個總數。但如果你去掉分配、變現和外匯，外匯其實相當重要。馬特可能會向您提供更多有關此問題的詳細信息，但本財年到目前為止，我們的淨收入持平。

Yes. Craig, just for perspective, I'd say, for the last quarter that we're just reporting on, realizations and distributions was $2.6 billion, for example, and we had negative FX of another $1 billion. But we do -- we get these questions, and I think we're going to try and improve our disclosure on this to try and help the question around this. Now we've got the bulk of our alternative assets together. Remembering in previous quarters, we've always said, when we were much smaller, we've always said, look, realizations and distributions just not -- they're just not significant enough to report and break down the explanation of AUM, but they're now getting to the point where we're going to start providing that level of detail. But just for information, the last quarter, again, the one we're reporting almost $2.6 billion of realizations and distributions and $1 billion negative FX.

是的。克雷格，我想說的是，我們剛剛報告的上個季度的變現和分配金額為 26 億美元，而我們的外匯負數為 10 億美元。但我們確實 - 我們收到了這些問題，我認為我們將嘗試改進對此的披露，以嘗試幫助解決這個問題。現在我們已經把大部分另類資產集中在一起了。記得在前幾個季度，我們總是說，當我們規模小得多時，我們總是說，看，實現和分配只是沒有——它們只是不夠重要，無法報告和分解 AUM 的解釋​​，但是他們現在已經到了我們將開始提供這種程度的細節的地步。但僅供參考，上個季度，我們再次報告了近 26 億美元的變現和分配以及 10 億美元的負外匯。

And Craig, the only thing I would add is that the other thing we've been able to do really is to work more closely with our distribution partners on the wealth management side over the last few quarters and we're able to secure calendar spots further into the future than we ever thought was possible. And I think that speaks well to our future fundraising as well.

克雷格，我唯一要補充的是，我們真正能夠做的另一件事是在過去幾個季度中與財富管理方面的分銷合作夥伴進行更密切的合作，並且我們能夠獲得日曆席位比我們想像的更遙遠的未來。我認為這也有利於我們未來的募款。

Next question will be from Glenn Schorr at Evercore.

下一個問題將來自 Evercore 的 Glenn Schorr。

So I wanted to talk about fixed income a little bit. So I see pension-funded status is much, much better and rates are higher. I like the $8.3 billion in flows in the quarter, but I don't know how much of that came from Great-West or something else? So maybe you could talk about that. And then bigger picture, is this -- do you feel this is the beginning of a broader trend, the long-awaited fixed income flows, maybe you can give us a little bit of insight from whether it be RFPs, client combos or the consultants on -- if we're at the (inaudible) of some larger flows into fixed income?

所以我想談談固定收益。所以我認為退休金資助的狀況要好得多，而且利率也更高。我喜歡本季 83 億美元的流量，但我不知道其中有多少是來自 Great-West 還是其他？所以也許你可以談談這個。然後更大的圖景是這樣的 - 您是否認為這是更廣泛趨勢的開始，期待已久的固定收益流，也許您可以從 RFP、客戶組合或顧問中為我們提供一些見解如果我們正處於（聽不清楚）一些較大的資金流入固定收益的情況？

Yes. Thanks, Glenn. So interestingly, let's face it. As long as people believe rates have peaked and potentially will come down, they're going to go longer duration, right? So the only thing is you're now starting to hear the noise for the first time where actually people think rates may be longer -- higher for longer and somebody was even talking about a potential rate increases. So that could slow things. But let me give you what we're seeing.

是的。謝謝，格倫。很有趣的是，讓我們面對現實吧。只要人們相信利率已經見頂並且可能會下降，他們的存續期就會更長，對嗎？所以唯一的事情是，你現在第一次開始聽到噪音，實際上人們認為利率可能會更長——更高，而且有人甚至在談論潛在的利率上漲。所以這可能會減慢速度。但讓我告訴你我們所看到的。

So we obviously had positive flows, but just looking at the pipeline, and the pipeline doesn't include any Great-West Life. If you add -- well, about 70-plus percent of the growth in the pipeline, is fixed income, and that crosses Western, Franklin and Brandywine. If you actually add BSP because I always think private credit really should be thought of in the fixed income because the decisions around that are often how you're thinking about your fixed income portfolio. The growth in the pipeline, 97% of it comes from fixed income.

所以我們顯然有積極的流量，但只要看看管道，管道不包括任何大西部人壽。如果你加上的話，那麼，大約 70% 以上的成長是固定收入，涵蓋了 Western、Franklin 和 Brandywine。如果你真的添加 BSP，因為我一直認為私人信貸確實應該在固定收益中考慮，因為圍繞這一點的決策通常就是你如何考慮你的固定收益投資組合。管道中的成長，97%來自固定收益。

So 6 of our top 10 gross selling funds in the last -- this past quarter were in fixed income, corporate bond, core bond, multi-sector, munis, highly customized (inaudible). So definitely demand in the last quarter. But if you actually look at the pipeline going forward, the institutional pipeline, you see very strong demand for fixed income.

因此，上一季我們銷售量最高的 10 檔基金中，有 6 隻屬於固定收益、公司債、核心債券、多部門、市政債券、高度客製化（聽不清楚）。所以上個季度肯定有需求。但如果你真正專注於未來的管道，也就是機構管道，你會發現對固定收益的需求非常強勁。

And I would say that it's also pretty broad-based. If you take a look at that funding pipeline, it's really across all 4 of the fixed income firms we have, which all have very significant pipelines right now. And if you take a look at the products we're offering, we're positive in core in high yield and munis was our best-selling segment. So really broad-based fixed income appeal, not just one product.

我想說它的基礎也相當廣泛。如果你看一下融資管道，你會發現它實際上遍及我們擁有的所有 4 家固定收益公司，而它們目前都擁有非常重要的管道。如果你看一下我們提供的產品，我們對高收益的核心持樂觀態度，而市政債券是我們最暢銷的細分市場。因此，固定收益確實具有廣泛的吸引力，而不僅僅是一種產品。

Yes. And they're also -- last thing I'd say on that is they're also positioned differently in terms of their view on where rates are going. So that means where we've had some performance weaknesses. It's being offset not always fully but being partially offset by strength in other parts of the franchise.

是的。我要說的最後一件事是，他們對利率走勢的看法也不同。這意味著我們存在一些效能弱點。它並不總是被完全抵消，而是被特許經營其他部分的實力所部分抵消。

And on the institutional business that you asked about is strong, we're also positive in ETF and SMAs, muni ladders, to lots of different fixed income vehicles doing well for us.

關於您詢問的機構業務是否強勁，我們對 ETF 和 SMA、市政階梯以及許多對我們來說表現良好的不同固定收益工具也持積極態度。

Just (inaudible) follow up on that same topic is have allocations changed a lot? In other words, I hear you on the flows. That's a very bullish commentary for the forward look. But if you took a snapshot of a year ago and 2 year ago allocations to where we are now and maybe 2 years forward, do you think we'll see a major equity fixed income shift? Or I know it's a lot broader than that. But like will fixed income allocations be a lot higher 2 years out?

只是（聽不清楚）對同一主題的跟進是分配是否發生了很大變化？換句話說，我在流程中聽到了你的聲音。這是對前瞻性的非常樂觀的評論。但是，如果您對一年前和兩年前的分配情況進行快照，了解我們現在以及未來兩年的情況，您認為我們會看到股票固定收益的重大轉變嗎？或者我知道它的範圍比這要廣泛得多。但兩年後固定收益分配會高很多嗎？

Again, I think it depends on your view on rates. And as I think Adam or Matt mentioned, you -- our fixed income teams are all kind of spread out as far as their view on where rates go. The frankly, guys probably think a little bit higher for longer Western is probably more aggressively positioned for rate cuts. So I think it really depends on your views. I do think if rates stay higher for longer, it has impacts on returns on equity markets as far as expectations, private markets as well. So Glenn, I think -- again, I think it's going to depend on where people -- where they think they should position our portfolio. I don't know, Adam, do you want to add anything?

同樣，我認為這取決於您對利率的看法。正如我認為亞當或馬特所提到的，我們的固定收益團隊對利率走勢的看法各不相同。坦白說，人們可能認為利率會更高一些，因為西方國家可能會更積極地進行降息。所以我認為這真的取決於你的看法。我確實認為，如果利率長時間保持較高水平，就會對股市和私人市場的回報產生預期影響。所以格倫，我認為——再說一次，我認為這將取決於人們——他們認為應該將我們的投資組合定位在哪裡。我不知道，亞當，你想補充什麼嗎？

Yes. I think it depends on the client, right? You mentioned more fully funded pension plans, right? If we get a wave of more immunization going on, we're going to see that drive fixed income flows. At the same time, really in every channel around the world. What do we see is a move towards alternative. That money is coming out of all of the other traditional buckets. So I think both of those are kind of competing with each other and pushing fixed income allocations in the opposite direction.

是的。我認為這取決於客戶，對嗎？您提到了資金更充足的退休金計劃，對吧？如果我們進行更多的免疫接種浪潮，我們將看到這將推動固定收入流動。同時，確實在世界各地的每個管道。我們看到的是替代方案的發展。這筆錢來自所有其他傳統管道。因此，我認為這兩者都在相互競爭，並將固定收益分配推向相反的方向。

Next question will be from Dan Fannon at Jefferies.

下一個問題將由傑富瑞 (Jefferies) 的丹·範農 (Dan Fannon) 提出。

I guess, Matt, maybe we could start with some expense questions. So curious about what the delta was in comp versus your guidance and then as we think about the seasonal impacts of some of this quarter, how much do you expect to roll off as we go into 2Q? And then maybe update us on kind of the full year outlook for expenses.

我想，馬特，也許我們可以從一些費用問題開始。很好奇與您的指導相比，比較中的增量是多少，然後當我們考慮本季度某些時間的季節性影響時，您預計當我們進入第二季度時會減少多少？然後也許會向我們介紹全年支出前景的最新情況。

Yes. Thank you, Dan. Yes. So a couple of things on expenses around the second quarter, I'll get to the comp and benefits in a second. I'd just like to say that notwithstanding the higher resets around compensation calendar resets around compensation that I'll talk about in a minute and meaningfully higher markets. If you exclude Putnam, which was the main addition we had in the quarter, our expenses would have been flat. So notwithstanding higher performance fees than we expected, higher calendar resets than we expected and higher markets than we expected. Our expenses for the quarter would have been flat when you exclude Putnam. So hopefully, that demonstrates some discipline there. In terms of your specific question around comp and benefits for the second quarter.

是的。謝謝你，丹。是的。關於第二季開支的一些事情，我將立即討論薪資和福利。我只想說，儘管圍繞薪酬日曆進行了更高的重置，但我將在稍後討論薪酬和有意義的更高市場。如果不包括普特南（這是我們本季新增的主要業務），我們的支出將持平。因此，儘管績效費用高於我們的預期，日曆重置也高於我們的預期，市場也高於我們的預期。如果排除普特南，我們本季的支出將持平。希望這能反映出一些紀律。關於您關於第二季度薪資和福利的具體問題。

The difference is, I said it's around almost half of it is the performance fee, a little bit less than half is performance fee increase relative to where we thought it would be. And then there's these high -- I would say, we were expecting Canada resets their composition, but they're just higher than we thought they'd be. So things like the 401(k), mutual fund units in compensation -- deferred compensation plans, vacation accruals. They were all -- when you add all those things up, plus the performance fee delta, it adds up to about $30 million. So when you add the $30 million to, I think I guided [$815 million] on the call, that gets you to pretty much where the [$844 million] is where we ended up -- where we ended up. So that explains that part of your question.

差別在於，我說大約一半是績效費，相對於我們預期的績效費成長略低於一半。然後還有這些高點——我想說，我們預計加拿大會重新調整他們的組成，但它們只是比我們想像的要高。例如 401(k)、共同基金補償單位－遞延補償計畫、應計假期。當你把所有這些東西加起來，再加上績效費用增量時，總計約為 3000 萬美元。因此，當你加上 3000 萬美元時，我想我在電話會議中指導了 [8.15 億美元]，這幾乎可以讓你達到 [8.44 億美元] 的結果——我們最終的結果。這就解釋了你問題的那一部分。

In terms of the annual guide, last quarter, we guided to $4.6 billion, and that's excluding performance fees, but including the double rent that we've talked about around our New York City consolidation exercise. And I would increase that just slightly to probably $4.6 billion -- $4 billion to $4.65 billion, a very narrow range. So less than 1% higher, and that's really driven by the higher markets that we've experienced. If markets come back down again. as we've been experiencing very recently in the first part of this quarter, it wouldn't surprise me if our annual guide remains flat. But right now, (inaudible) remaining equal, we expect it to be just slightly higher for the annual guide.

就年度指引而言，上個季度我們指引為 46 億美元，其中不包括績效費，但包括我們在紐約市整合活動中討論過的雙倍租金。我會稍微增加到 46 億美元——40 億到 46.5 億美元，一個非常窄的範圍。所以上漲了不到 1%，這實際上是由我們經歷過的更高的市場推動的。如果市場再次下跌。正如我們最近在本季度第一部分所經歷的那樣，如果我們的年度指南保持不變，我不會感到驚訝。但現在，（聽不清楚）保持不變，我們預計年度指南會略高一些。

Great. That's helpful. And then maybe just a follow-up on that with regards to the effective fee rate I think you had talked about it coming into the mid 38s as the year progressed. So I guess, given where mix is AUM levels, all the dynamics that go into that, how do you see that trending?

偉大的。這很有幫助。然後也許只是關於有效費率的後續行動，我想你已經談到隨著今年的進展，它將進入 38 年代中期。所以我想，考慮到 AUM 等級的組合以及其中的所有動態，您如何看待這種趨勢？

Yes. Thank you for the question. So the EFR for the quarter dropped to 38.5. And I believe that's exactly how we guided for the quarter. And we're able to do that because we had a pretty good feel for the mix that we're coming in, in terms of flows. And I think I also pointed out that we were 1 basis point higher than usual, let's call it, or the effective fee rate for the last quarter was inflated by 1 basis point based on Lexington catch-up fees.

是的。感謝你的提問。因此該季度的 EFR 下降至 38.5。我相信這正是我們本季的指導方針。我們之所以能夠做到這一點，是因為我們對即將加入的混音在流量方面有很好的感覺。我想我還指出，我們比平常高了 1 個基點，或者說，根據列剋星敦追趕費，上個季度的有效費率被誇大了 1 個基點。

Going forward, on an annual basis, I would say that our EFR should remain in the 38s probably in the mid-38s, it will be slightly higher than that, driven by episodic alternative asset fees, as we've experienced over the last 12 months and highlighted those clearly, I think, in our results.

展望未來，以年度計算，我想說我們的EFR 應該保持在38 多歲，可能在38 多歲中間，在偶發性另類資產費用的推動下，它會略高於這個數字，正如我們在過去12年所經歷的那樣我認為，在我們的結果中清楚地強調了這些。

And it can -- and the other thing that will help it be higher is a larger percentage of alternative assets and a higher percentage of equities. With the public markets going up as much as they did in the first quarter, obviously, as a percentage overall, our alternative assets came down a bit, so that brought the EFR pressure down slightly.

它可以——而另一件事將有助於它更高的是另類資產和股票的比例更大。顯然，隨著公開市場的上漲幅度與第一季相同，我們的另類資產的整體百分比有所下降，因此 EFR 壓力略有下降。

And then we had quite a few successes as Jenny mentioned in her remarks, in ETFs, Canvas, separately managed accounts. And all these things are lower fee rate businesses. It's less about fee erosion per se. I'd say, it's just more about the business mix. So for the next quarter specifically, we expect EFR to probably be even in the high 37, so let's say, high 37 to 38, but this is because of the success that we didn't anticipate as much success with Putnam because the overall Putnam business is a lower effective fee rate. They're kind of in the mid-35s.

正如 Jenny 在她的演講中提到的，我們在 ETF、Canvas、獨立管理帳戶方面取得了相當多的成功。所有這些都是收費較低的業務。這與費用侵蝕本身無關。我想說，這更多的是關於業務組合。因此，具體來說，對於下個季度，我們預計 EFR 可能會達到 37 的高位，所以可以說，高位 37 到 38，但這是因為我們沒有預期 Putnam 會取得如此大的成功，因為 Putnam 的整體表現業務是較低的有效費率。他們大約在 35 歲左右。

Faster inflows from Great-West Life at the lower end as we communicated, hopefully, clearly enough that those -- the $25 billion of AUM that we expect to come in from Great-West Life, that will ultimately, when we get it all in, that will be in the mid-teens. But the initial amount that we've got are all in the lower fee categories, things like investment-grade credit, for example, for general account. But then on top of that, we expect continued growth in our ETF, Canvas and separately managed accounts, all of which are lower fee rates.

當我們溝通時，希望能夠足夠清楚地表明，我們預計從Great-West Life 獲得的250 億美元的資產管理規模（AUM）最終會在我們全部投入後，從大西人壽（Great-West Life）的低端資金流入更快，那將是十幾歲左右。但我們最初獲得的金額都屬於較低費用類別，例如一般帳戶的投資等級信貸。但最重要的是，我們預計我們的 ETF、Canvas 和獨立管理帳戶將繼續成長，所有這些帳戶的費率都較低。

Now the reason why we keep the guide for the year in the 38s is because we have a view, again, as Jenny mentioned, of our alternative asset fundraising capabilities and expectations for the next 12 months, let's call it. So on an annual basis, we expect the mix of business around alternative assets, equities, fixed income and then these other areas of growth that I just mentioned, to offset the fee reductions that at times in various quarters could go into the high 37s, but that's just based for that 1 quarter -- on the mix that 1 quarter. But for the year, we expect to remain fairly stable in the 38 area.

現在，我們之所以將今年的指南保留在 38 年代，是因為正如 Jenny 所提到的，我們再次對我們的另類資產籌款能力和未來 12 個月的預期有一個看法，讓我們稱之為。因此，按年度計算，我們預計圍繞另類資產、股票、固定收益以及我剛才提到的其他增長領域的業務組合，將抵消各個季度有時可能高達 37 美元的費用削減，但這只是基於那一季度— —基於那一季的組合。但今年我們預計將在 38 區域保持相當穩定。

Next question will be from Ken Worthington at JPMorgan.

下一個問題將由摩根大通的肯·沃辛頓提出。

On the institutional pipeline, when you win an institutional fixed income mandate, are you getting a bunch of cash? Or are you getting a portfolio of securities that you transition and then remanage and do you get a sense of where the assets are coming from? If it's going into fixed income, is it investors going from rates to credit? Are they going from equities to fixed income? Are they going from cash to fixed income? Or are they just switching managers because of performance? So any view on what you've seen in this pipeline that's driving the fixed income success you're having?

在機構管道上，當你贏得機構固定收益授權時，你會得到一大筆現金嗎？或者您是否獲得了經過轉換然後重新管理的證券投資組合，並且您是否了解資產的來源？如果進入固定收益領域，投資人是否會從利率轉向信用？他們會從股票轉向固定收益嗎？他們會從現金轉向固定收益嗎？還是他們只是因為表現而更換經理？那麼，您對這條管道中看到的推動固定收益成功的因素有什麼看法嗎？

You might not like the answer, but the answer is yes. I think we're seeing all of those things, right? So often, people will switch managers because of performance. We see people beginning to extend duration out. Those are usually funded by cash. We should see some of the plus sectors being added to those are funded in a mix of different ways. And then, of course, on the retail side, it's typically a sale of a fund, so you really don't know where that's coming from.

你可能不喜歡這個答案，但答案是肯定的。我想我們正在看到所有這些事情，對嗎？很多時候，人們會因為績效而更換經理。我們看到人們開始延長持續時間。這些通常由現金資助。我們應該看到一些優勢產業被添加到以不同方式提供資金的產業中。當然，在零售方面，這通常是基金的銷售，所以你真的不知道它來自哪裡。

In terms of how folks fund things I would say that's a mix. We see 3 different ways. We see it being funded in cash. We see people using a transition manager and then sometimes we'll see folks fund to us with securities and ask us to get to the new point by a certain time. The other interesting thing we see in terms of how accounts are funded is actually outside of fixed income on the Canvas side, where we see significant use cases for Canvas as a tool to aid in the funding of accounts for taxable accounts we're able to do that in a much more tax-efficient way.

就人們如何資助事物而言，我想說這是一個混合體。我們看到了 3 種不同的方式。我們看到它是用現金資助的。我們看到人們使用過渡經理，有時我們會看到人們用證券向我們提供資金，並要求我們在某個時間到達新點。我們在帳戶融資方式方面看到的另一個有趣的事情實際上是在 Canvas 方面的固定收入之外，我們看到 Canvas 的重要用例作為一種工具來幫助我們能夠為應稅帳戶提供資金以一種更加節稅的方式做到這一點。

Okay. Great. And just on ETFs, how are you thinking about ETFs outside the U.S.? You're having nice success in your franchise within the States. How are you thinking about leveraging the brand? Or are you thinking about leveraging the brand you have and the ETF franchise that you've already built?

好的。偉大的。就 ETF 而言，您如何看待美國以外的 ETF？您在美國的特許經營業務取得了巨大成功。您如何考慮利用該品牌？或者您正在考慮利用您擁有的品牌和您已經建立的 ETF 特許經營權？

Yes. Our ETFs outside of the U.S. have grown in 2 important ways. One, I don't think this was the point of your question, but our single country ETFs, so ETFs that focus on the country, even if they're sold in the U.S. That's been a huge success for us. We were able to price those very competitively. But also in terms of ETFs that we're selling outside of the U.S. regardless of investment mandate, we've seen real growth there in Canada and in EMEA, in particular. Some of that is the single country flow. As Jenny mentioned in his remarks, we've seen some of the more sustainably oriented products go quite well. Green bonds, Paris-aligned, S&P 500 would be 2 that are examples of that.

是的。我們在美國以外的 ETF 在兩個重要方面取得了成長。第一，我認為這不是你問題的重點，但我們的單一國家 ETF，即專注於該國的 ETF，即使它們在美國出售，這對我們來說是巨大的成功。我們能夠以非常有競爭力的價格定價。但就我們在美國境外銷售的 ETF 而言，無論投資授權如何，我們都看到了加拿大和歐洲、中東和非洲地區的實際成長。其中一些是單一國家的流量。正如珍妮在演講中提到的，我們已經看到一些更注重永續發展的產品進展順利。綠色債券、巴黎協定、標準普爾 500 指數就是其中的兩個例子。

Outside of the U.S., we continue to see a mix of active, passive and smart beta. Passive is still the most significant portion of the market, but active has by far the highest growth rate.

在美國以外，我們繼續看到主動、被動和智慧貝塔的混合。被動式仍然是市場中最重要的部分，但主動式的成長率迄今為止最高。

And just to put things into context, I believe that if you look at our flow for this quarter, about half of it or so was from outside of the U.S. in terms of our ETF business. So really trying to expand that to the best we can and seeing very good results.

就具體情況而言，我相信，如果你看看我們本季的流量，就我們的 ETF 業務而言，大約一半左右來自美國以外的地區。因此，我們確實盡力將其擴展至最佳狀態，並看到了非常好的結果。

Next question will be from Alex Blostein at Goldman Sachs.

下一個問題將由高盛的 Alex Blostein 提出。

Jenny, I was hoping to dig into your comments from the prepared remarks when you talked about being quite busy over the next 12 months with respect to private markets. Could you, I guess, expand on that a little bit? And I'm assuming wealth is going to be part of the answer. So when you think about the opportunity set in the wealth channel and lots of other folks coming in, with offerings already and it seems like that part of the market is getting a little bit busier. What are you guys doing to make sure you don't miss the window and opportunity there?

Jenny，當您談到未來 12 個月私募市場將非常忙碌時，我希望能從準備好的發言中深入了解您的評論。我想你能稍微擴充一下嗎？我假設財富將成為答案的一部分。因此，當你想到財富管道中的機會以及許多其他人已經進入並提供產品時，這部分市場似乎變得有點忙碌。你們正在做什麼來確保自己不會錯過那裡的窗口和機會？

Yes. So I mean we're in the market with a few different things. And as Adam mentioned, we are getting on calendars. This stuff is laid out, we've probably surprised early on to learn this. I mean sometimes up to 2 years in advance. So the areas that we're talking -- Lexington obviously, has capabilities beyond their traditional Fund 10, where they've got middle market and co-invest offerings. In the case of real estate, Clarion's top 3 biggest funds are all perpetual. So they're always fundraising, although we definitely see kind of muted demand for real estate. They've got terrific performance. They've got terrific performance. And so I think when things shift back, Clarion should do very well there because they have very little exposure to office.

是的。所以我的意思是我們在市場上有一些不同的東西。正如亞當所提到的，我們正在日曆上。這些東西已經擺好了，我們可能很早就知道這一點了。我的意思是有時最多提前兩年。因此，我們正在談論的領域——列剋星敦顯然擁有超出其傳統 Fund 10 的能力，他們在該領域擁有中間市場和共同投資產品。就房地產而言，歌樂最大的三大基金都是永續基金。因此，他們總是在籌集資金，儘管我們確實看到對房地產的需求減弱。他們有出色的表現。他們有出色的表現。因此，我認為當情況向後轉變時，歌樂應該會做得很好，因為他們很少接觸辦公室。

In the case of the private credit real estate debt is really interesting, and we're talking to several clients about that. Obviously, CLOs, structured credit, special situations. And then actually, we've been successful. I never know how much I can talk about, but in our -- in Venture, our Franklin Venture Group is in the wealth channel right now raising money and first fund raise there, and it's going very well.

就私人信貸房地產債務而言，這確實很有趣，我們正在與幾位客戶討論這一點。顯然，CLO、結構性信貸、特殊情況。事實上，我們已經成功了。我永遠不知道我能談論多少，但在我們的風險投資中，我們的富蘭克林創投集團現在正在財富管道籌集資金，並且在那裡籌集了第一筆資金，而且進展順利。

So you just had 2 between BSP and Lexington closed their flagship funds. So then you're in -- that they're digesting and investing in those cycles. They're doing more of their niche type strategies, but they're in markets with those. And they'll -- as soon as those are deployed, I think Lexington's probably deployed 60% of their LEX 10, they'll come back into the market for another flagship. But in the meantime, they've got their middle market and co-invest.

所以，BSP 和 Lexington 之間剛剛有 2 隻關閉了他們的旗艦基金。那你就知道他們正在消化並投資這些週期。他們正在採取更多的利基型策略，但他們在市場上也有這些策略。一旦部署完畢，我認為列剋星敦可能部署了 60% 的 LEX 10，他們就會回到市場推出另一款旗艦產品。但同時，他們已經擁有了中間市場並進行了共同投資。

And I cannot emphasize enough the -- in the wealth channel, it's 50% the right product and 50% where you got the heft on the distribution side. And I think that is often underestimated. Our 350-plus client-facing wholesalers, internal, external specialists included can sell to an adviser's entire book. If you don't have the breadth of capability that we have, that's incredibly expensive because let's say you're just an alternatives manager, you're only selling to 5% to 10% of that adviser's book. And so it gets really expensive to build the breadth of capability that we have. And the years of investment that we've done in the Academy, again, our Academy is global, where we've now been able to bring alternatives by FT, which is a website that has tons of training on how advisers should think about alternatives in their portfolios to supplement just that wholesaler being out there in the field, I think, has been really important.

我怎麼強調都不為過——在財富管道中，50% 是正確的產品，50% 是在分銷方面獲得影響力的。我認為這一點常常被低估。我們的 350 多家面向客戶的批發商（包括內部和外部專家）可以將整本書出售給顧問。如果您不具備我們所擁有的廣泛能力，那麼這將非常昂貴，因為假設您只是一名另類投資經理，您只能向該顧問的 5% 到 10% 的客戶出售產品。因此，建立我們擁有的廣泛能力的成本非常昂貴。經過多年對學院的投資，我們的學院是全球性的，我們現在能夠透過《金融時報》帶來替代方案，該網站提供了大量關於顧問應如何考慮替代方案的培訓我認為，在他們的產品組合中補充批發商在該領域的表現非常重要。

So very much focused on the wealth channel, really excited about it. I think we have a great suite of products to be able to meet the needs in that market and the distribution capability and expertise to be successful there.

所以非常關注財富管道，對此感到非常興奮。我認為我們擁有一套很棒的產品，能夠滿足該市場的需求，並且擁有在該市場取得成功的分銷能力和專業知識。

I got you. Okay. All makes sense. And then clarification for you guys on the pipeline. It sounds like there's a bunch of things in the institutional pipeline, as you discussed earlier. Is it -- could you guys help us just size the fee rate of the institutional pipeline, excluding Great-West as you described it? And then I guess is it fair to assume that the remaining piece of Great-West that's going to come in will be coming in at a much high fee rate? So kind of north of that teen-ish basis points, just given that the back end or what's come through came at a pretty low fee rate?

我接到你了。好的。一切都有道理。然後為大家澄清一下。正如您之前所討論的，聽起來機構管道中有很多事情。是嗎－你們能幫我們確定機構管道的費用率嗎？然後我想假設大西部的剩餘部分將以非常高的費率進入，這是否公平？考慮到後端或所發生的事情的費用率相當低，那麼在青少年基點之上？

And the pipeline is -- the fee rate is slightly up from last quarter. But look, any time you want it's institutional, so that's lower fee than your traditional EFRs. And then number two, it's heavily weighted in the fixed income -- well, the new stuff is heavily weighted in fixed income, but probably overall pipeline, I don't know, Adam, a 60-plus percent probably fixed income. So I never know if we give guidance on the actual numbers in the pipeline, but it's -- (inaudible) Matt, have we given guidance there?

正在醞釀的費用比上季略有上升。但你看，任何時候你想要的都是機構性的，所以這比傳統的 EFR 費用要低。第二，它在固定收入中佔很大比重——嗯，新東西在固定收入中佔很大比重，但可能是整體管道，我不知道，亞當，60%以上可能是固定收入。所以我永遠不知道我們是否對管道中的實際數字提供指導，但它是 - （聽不清楚）馬特，我們是否在那裡提供了指導？

I would say it's consistent with our institutional fee rate.

我想說這與我們的機構費率一致。

Got it. Okay.

知道了。好的。

It's in the mid- to high 20s, Alex, and then -- but it can be -- it's gone from anything from the mid- to high 20s to our overall effective fee rate. depending on the quarter and depending on the type of the -- the nature of the pipeline in a particular time. And then the -- to answer your second question, yes, the additional flows we expect to come in will be higher on average on the rest of the Great-West Life flow. And that's expected over the next 12 months. As we've said, we'll, of course, put that detail into our monthly flow. So you can see that, and then we'll provide detail on the effective fee rate when we have these calls and provide updated information.

亞歷克斯，它在 20 多歲中到高，然後 - 但它可以 - 從 20 到高到我們的整體有效費率。取決於季度和特定時間管道的類型。然後，回答你的第二個問題，是的，我們預期的額外流量平均會高於大西部人壽流量的其餘部分。預計未來 12 個月內會出現這種情況。正如我們所說，我們當然會將這些細節納入我們的每月流程中。所以您可以看到這一點，然後我們將在接到這些電話時提供有關有效費率的詳細資訊並提供更新的資訊。

Next question will be from Bill Katz at TD Cowen.

下一個問題將由 TD Cowen 的 Bill Katz 提出。

Okay. I apologize on London weather. So in terms of if I start with your reported net flows of 6.7 and I back out the 3.1 of dividends reinvested, which the industry doesn't include, I get down about 3.5. If I back out the initial capital from Great-West, that's minus $10 billion. If I then back out the $1.4 billion from the 3 alt managers you highlighted, I get to about $11 billion. And then if I back out the Canvas, ETF and the SMA, I think that gets about minus $18 billion for what I would consider to be a long-holding business. A, is that math correct? And B, if it is, what's the go-to plan here to sort of stabilize that part of the business?

好的。我對倫敦的天氣表示歉意。因此，如果我從您報告的 6.7 的淨流量開始，然後取消 3.1 的再投資股息（該行業不包括在內），我會得到大約 3.5。如果我收回 Great-West 的初始資本，那就是負 100 億美元。如果我從你強調的 3 位另類經理那裡收回 14 億美元，我得到的大約是 110 億美元。然後，如果我退出 Canvas、ETF 和 SMA，我認為對於我認為是長期持有的業務來說，這將導致大約負 180 億美元。 A、這個數學正確嗎？ B，如果是的話，穩定這部分業務的首選計劃是什麼？

So I'm not Matt Nicholls, I can't do the math that quickly. He probably could. So I couldn't quite follow all of that. But I will tell you that the growth areas where some of the things you wanted to pull out alternatives, ETFs, Canvas. I think we said consistently that those are our growth focuses and that they're growing a little faster than the rest of the business. If you take a look at the more traditional business and you look at our outflow rate our decay rate, it's really been stable to improving. So I think over the last few years, we've been able to do a very good job at protecting ourselves on the downside. And as we said earlier, I think Jenny pointed to a notion that we talk about in terms of core sales, which is our smaller sales, which are up pretty consistently at about 14% on average. So stable outflows, increasing quarter sales we're feeling pretty good about the traditional part of the business.

所以我不是馬特·尼科爾斯，我不能這麼快地做數學。他也許可以。所以我不能完全理解這一切。但我會告訴你，你想在成長領域中拿出一些替代品、ETF、Canvas。我認為我們一直說這些是我們的成長重點，而且它們的成長速度比其他業務快一些。如果你看一下更傳統的業務，看看我們的流出率和衰減率，它確實在穩定改善。所以我認為在過去的幾年裡，我們在不利的情況下保護自己方面做得非常好。正如我們之前所說，我認為 Jenny 指出了我們在核心銷售額方面談論的一個概念，即我們較小的銷售額，其平均成長率約為 14%。穩定的資金流出和不斷增加的季度銷售額讓我們對傳統業務部分感覺非常好。

And I'll just add, look, we've been very open and honest that we've been underrepresented in the retirement channel. As I mentioned on the last quarter's call, we were ranked 14th on Empower's platform, and it's similar in some of the others. And with this acquisition of Putnam and the relationship and the absorption of their retirement team as well as their target date products, 1/3 of retirement flows go to the qual side investment plans, and they've got phenomenal performance of their target date products as well as stable value, we think we are poised to -- and again, if we just take our market share, it's a massive increase -- the retirement channel is still a very traditional asset-oriented channel, traditional mutual funds, equities and fixed income.

我只想補充一點，看，我們一直非常開放和誠實，我們在退休管道中的代表性不足。正如我在上個季度的電話會議中提到的，我們在 Empower 平台上排名第 14 位，在其他一些平台上排名也類似。透過這次對Putnam的收購以及他們的退休團隊和目標日期產品的關係和吸收，1/3的退休流量流向了合格側投資計劃，他們的目標日期產品取得了驚人的表現除了穩定的價值之外，我們認為我們已經準備好——再說一次，如果我們只考慮我們的市場份額，這將是一個巨大的增長——退休管道仍然是一個非常傳統的以資產為導向的管道，傳統的共同基金、股票和固定收入。

And we just think with our distribution capability, not just to benefit from Empower, but taking that to all the different retirement platforms and gain more market share there.

我們只是想利用我們的分銷能力，不僅僅是從 Empower 中受益，而是將其帶到所有不同的退休平台，並在那裡獲得更多的市場份額。

And then the last thing I'd just add, Bill, is that this area you're trying to get to, which we actually have a little bit -- it's not really 18, but we think of it as I think it's more like 10 that we got to. But when you get to those numbers, it's very concentrated in areas where performance is even more important than usual, let's call it. And in those areas, performance has begun to improve, certainly on the equity side, in particular, quite significantly. So we've seen quite a slowdown in those outflows.

然後我要補充的最後一件事，比爾，是你想要到達的這個區域，我們實際上有一點 - 它並不是真正的 18，但我們認為它更像是10 我們必須做到。但當你看到這些數字時，你會發現它非常集中在性能比平常更重要的領域，我們可以這樣稱呼它。在這些領域，業績已經開始改善，尤其是在股權方面，尤其是相當顯著。因此，我們看到這些資金外流大幅放緩。

On the fixed income side in the couple areas, we've had some weaknesses there, as you know, but we've seen some improvement there, too. So it's a fairly concentrated situation you're referring to and one that as performance improves, you see a correlation of slowdown in outflows.

如您所知，在這兩個領域的固定收益方面，我們存在一些弱點，但我們也看到了一些改進。因此，您所指的是相當集中的情況，隨著績效的改善，您會看到資金流出放緩的相關性。

And Bill, I would add that it's sometimes difficult to separate investment product from the vehicle itself. We have a number of businesses where an investment team is positive, but they're positive because their SMA, their usage, their ETFs are all positive, and the mutual fund might be negative. So is that the core business, they're not, right? At the traditional asset class, they're gaining flow, but they're gaining it because of the vehicle choice, not necessarily because the mutual fund is positive.

比爾，我想補充一點，有時很難將投資產品與工具本身分開。我們有很多企業的投資團隊都是正面的，但他們之所以積極，是因為他們的 SMA、他們的使用情況、他們的 ETF 都是正面的，而共同基金可能是負面的。那麼這是核心業務，他們不是，對嗎？在傳統資產類別中，他們正在獲得流量，但他們獲得流量是因為投資工具的選擇，而不一定是因為共同基金是正面的。

That makes some sense. And just a follow-up on all of that, Matt, maybe for yourself, just your base fee rate, it just seems like it's bouncing around a little more than I would envision just given the sheer sizing of the platform today. So can you help me understand if you're going to be sort of in that 37% range plus for the next quarter. And then you sort of bounce back into the fourth? Is that input to a very high level of flow in the alts managers. And if that's the case, is that just vehicles that are just turning on from capital to raise? Or is that from new money coming in the door? And if so, where might that be?

這有一定道理。馬特，這只是所有這些的後續行動，也許是為了你自己，只是你的基本費率，考慮到今天平台的龐大規模，它的波動似乎比我想像的要大一些。那麼您能否幫我了解下個季度您是否會處於 37% 以上的範圍內。然後你又回到第四了？這是對另類投資經理人的高水準流動的輸入嗎？如果是這樣的話，這只是剛開始從資本中籌集資金的工具嗎？還是新資金進來了？如果是這樣，那可能在哪裡？

Well, remember, the annual guide I gave included the first quarter or so where we had an elevated EFR for the reason that I explained around the catch-up fees and so on. I think we were pretty close to 40 basis points at one point. We've been trying to be quite clear about that. So when you normalize that out, you get into the 38.

好吧，請記住，我提供的年度指南包括第一季左右的時間，我們的 EFR 有所提高，因為我解釋了追趕費用等問題。我認為我們一度非常接近 40 個基點。我們一直試圖弄清楚這一點。所以當你將其標準化後，你就會得到 38。

And then the only thing that's driving it down periodically from quarter-to-quarter is the areas of growth. And when you add those areas of growth up and you just a second ago, Bill, when you went through your analysis on the traditional side of the business versus other areas of growth. When you start adding up ETFs, Canvas, SMAs and then the flows from Putnam, the overall Putnam -- remembering that it's not just the flows coming from Great-West Life from Putnam, it's the $160 billion, which is 17% higher than when we announced transaction of AUM that's at a multiple basis -- multiple point lower than the EFR of Franklin.

唯一導致季度業績週期性下降的因素是成長領域。當你加入這些成長領域時，比爾，剛才你對傳統業務方面與其他成長領域進行了分析。當你開始將ETF、Canvas、SMA 以及來自普特南的流量加起來時，整個普特南- 請記住，這不僅僅是來自普特南的Great-West Life 的流量，還有1600 億美元，比之前高出17%我們宣布了以倍數計算的 AUM 交易——比富蘭克林的 EFR 低多個點。

So the fact that we've been more successful in that has -- that's what's driven the EFR down a little bit. But what we'd expect is that going into at least fiscal 2025, what we experienced at the beginning of fiscal 2024, depending on what products we have and everything that Jenny just read through or not, there's a possibility that it could step back up again into the higher 38 based on the episodic alternative asset fees. But that's just an exclamation around why it could go up a little bit more and down a little bit more than usual. It's those offsetting factors. It's basically a form of business mix plus the episodic activity out of alternatives.

事實上，我們在這方面取得了更大的成功，這就是 EFR 略有下降的原因。但我們預計，至少到 2025 財年，我們在 2024 財年年初所經歷的情況，取決於我們擁有什麼產品以及珍妮剛剛讀過或沒有讀過的所有內容，它有可能會回升根據偶發性另類資產費用，再次進入較高的38。但這只是為什麼它會比平常上漲一點、下跌一點的原因的感嘆。正是這些抵消因素。它基本上是一種業務組合加上替代方案中的間歇性活動的形式。

Bill, I'll also answer because I think you had the question on a little bit more of a breakdown of our third quarter. I've already gone into some detail on EFR. In terms of comp and benefits for the third quarter, we expect that to be around $820 million. That assumes performance fees of $40 million. That's lower than the previous quarters, driven by lower performance fees out of our real estate business for the reason that Jenny mentioned, it's important to note that the relative performance of Clarion is very strong, but the absolute valuation of real estate has come down, that's impacted the extent of performance fees. That's why we're guiding that down to $40 million from $50 million.

比爾，我也會回答，因為我認為你的問題是關於我們第三季的詳細情況。我已經詳細介紹了 EFR。就第三季的薪資和福利而言，我們預計約為 8.2 億美元。假設績效費為 4000 萬美元。這低於前幾個季度，這是由於 Jenny 提到的原因，我們的房地產業務業績費用較低，值得注意的是，歌樂的相對業績非常強勁，但房地產的絕對估值已經下降，這影響了績效費的程度。這就是為什麼我們將其指導金額從 5000 萬美元下調至 4000 萬美元。

IS&T, we expect it to remain at $150 million, occupancy, $80 million. As you all know, that's going to come down later on in fiscal 2025 based on the double rent going away. But for next quarter, we expect that to remain at $80 million. And then G&A, we expect to be probably around $175 million. It could be as high as $180 million because we're planning on spending more in advertising, but it won't go -- it shouldn't go a bit beyond that. So let's say, $175 million to $180 million in G&A.

IS&T，我們預計將維持在 1.5 億美元，入住率將維持在 8,000 萬美元。眾所周知，隨著雙倍租金的取消，這一數字將在 2025 財年稍後下降。但對於下個季度，我們預計該數字將保持在 8,000 萬美元。然後是 G&A，我們預計約為 1.75 億美元。它可能高達 1.8 億美元，因為我們計劃在廣告上投入更多資金，但它不會——它不應該超出這個數字。假設 G&A 為 1.75 億至 1.8 億美元。

And I already provided the annual guidance earlier on based on Dan Fannon's question.

我之前已經根據 Dan Fannon 的問題提供了年度指導。

This concludes today's Q&A session. I would now like to hand the call back over to Jenny Johnson, Franklin's President and CEO, for final comments.

今天的問答環節到此結束。現在我想將電話轉回富蘭克林總裁兼執行長珍妮·約翰遜 (Jenny Johnson)，以徵求最終意見。

Great. Well, everybody, thank you for participating in today's call. And once again, we would like to thank our employees for their hard work and dedication delivering this quarter. And we look forward to speaking to all of you again next quarter, and everybody stay healthy.

偉大的。好的，大家好，感謝您參加今天的電話會議。我們再次感謝我們的員工在本季度的辛勤工作和奉獻精神。我們期待下個季度再次與大家交談，祝大家保持健康。

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, this does indeed conclude today's conference call. You may now disconnect your lines.

謝謝。女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議確實結束了。現在您可以斷開線路。