Air Products and Chemicals Inc (APD) 2025 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and welcome to the Air Products fourth-quarter earnings release conference call. Today's conference is being recorded at the request of Air Products. Please note that this presentation and the comments made on behalf of Air Products are subject to copyright by Air Products, and all rights are reserved.

大家好，歡迎參加空氣產品公司第四季財報電話會議。應空氣產品公司要求，本次會議將進行錄製。請注意，本次演講及代表空氣產品公司所作的評論均受空氣產品公司版權保護，版權歸空氣產品公司所有，本公司保留所有權利。

Beginning today's call is Megan Britt. Please go ahead.

今天電話會議首先由梅根·布里特主持。請開始。

Hello, and welcome to the fourth-quarter and full-year fiscal 2025 earnings conference call for Air Products. Our prepared remarks today will be led by Eduardo Menezes, Chief Executive Officer; and Melissa Schaeffer, Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer.

大家好，歡迎參加空氣產品公司 2025 財年第四季及全年財報電話會議。今天，我們的演講將由執行長 Eduardo Menezes 和執行副總裁兼財務長 Melissa Schaeffer 領銜。

We have prepared presentation slides to supplement our remarks during the call, which are posted on the Investor Relations section of the Air Products website. During this call, we'll make forward-looking statements, which are our expectations about the future. These statements are based on current expectations and assumptions that are subject to various risks and uncertainties.

我們準備了演示文稿，以補充我們在電話會議期間的發言，這些演示文稿已發佈在空氣產品公司網站的投資者關係部分。在本次電話會議中，我們將發表一些前瞻性聲明，這些聲明表達了我們對未來的預期。這些陳述是基於當前的預期和假設，但存在各種風險和不確定性。

Our actual results could materially differ from these statements due to these risks and uncertainties, including, but not limited to, those discussed on this call and in the forward-looking statements and Risk Factors sections of our reports filed with the SEC. We do not undertake any duty to update any forward-looking statements.

由於這些風險和不確定性，我們的實際結果可能與這些聲明有重大差異，包括但不限於本次電話會議中討論的風險和不確定性，以及我們在提交給美國證券交易委員會的報告中的前瞻性聲明和風險因素部分中討論的風險和不確定性。我們不承擔更新任何前瞻性陳述的義務。

Please note in today's presentation, we will refer to various financial measures including earnings per share, capital expenditures, operating income, operating income margin, the effective tax rate and ROC either on a total company or a segment basis.

請注意，在今天的演示中，我們將提及各種財務指標，包括每股收益、資本支出、營業收入、營業利潤率、實際稅率和資本回報率，這些指標既可以按公司整體計算，也可以按業務部門計算。

Unless we specifically state otherwise, statements regarding these measures refer to our adjusted non-GAAP financial measures. Reconciliations of these measures to our most directly comparable GAAP financial measures can be found on our investor website in the relevant earnings release section.

除非另有明確說明，有關這些措施的聲明均指我們調整後的非GAAP財務指標。這些指標與我們最直接可比較的 GAAP 財務指標的調整表可以在我們投資者網站的相關收益發布部分找到。

It's now my pleasure to turn the call over to Eduardo.

現在我很高興把電話交給愛德華多。

Thank you, Megan. Hello, and thank you for joining our call today. Please turn to slide 3.

謝謝你，梅根。您好，感謝您今天參加我們的電話會議。請翻到第3張投影片。

Earlier today, we reported our fourth quarter and full fiscal year 2025 results. Our numbers show consistent progress related to commitments we shared earlier this year. We delivered earnings per share of $12.03, which is above the midpoint of our full-year fiscal guidance range.

今天早些時候，我們公佈了第四季度和 2025 財年全年業績。我們的數據顯示，我們在今年稍早做出的承諾方面取得了持續進展。我們實現了每股收益 12.03 美元，高於我們全年財務預期範圍的中點。

Our operating income margin of 23.7% and return on capital of 10.1% were also in line with our commitments for these metrics. Also, this year marks the 43rd consecutive year of increasing our dividend. In total, we returned $1.6 billion to our shareholders in fiscal 2025.

我們的營業利益率達到 23.7%，資本報酬率達到 10.1%，也符合我們對這些指標的承諾。此外，今年是我們連續第43年提高股利。2025財年，我們總共向股東返還了16億美元。

I'm encouraged we are setting challenging but achievable targets and delivering on those commitments. We have taken several key actions starting in the second quarter to focus on the core industrial gas business and expect to unlock earnings growth through productivity pricing, operational excellence and disciplined capital allocation. The last three quarters demonstrate that we are already making progress.

令我感到鼓舞的是，我們設定了具有挑戰性但又可實現的目標，並且正在履行這些承諾。從第二季開始，我們採取了幾項關鍵措施，專注於核心工業氣體業務，並期望透過提高生產力定價、卓越營運和嚴格的資本配置來釋放獲利成長潛力。過去三個季度的數據顯示，我們已經取得了一些進展。

Moving to slide 4. We have three key priorities for 2026 that were part of the strategy we shared earlier this year. First, we expect to deliver high single-digit annual EPS growth. To be clear, our 2026 guidance anticipates additional helium headwinds in a sluggish macroeconomic environment.

切換到第4張投影片。我們為 2026 年制定了三個重點優先事項，這些事項是我們今年稍早公佈的策略的一部分。首先，我們預期將實現高個位數的年度每股收益成長。需要明確的是，我們預期在宏觀經濟環境低迷的情況下，氦氣產業將面臨更多不利因素。

On our second priority, we will continue to make strides to optimize our large projects portfolio. We are working diligently to finalize our NEOM project and expect to improve our underperforming project portfolio with a goal of generating positive cash returns.

第二要務，我們將繼續努力優化我們的大型專案組合。我們正在努力完成 NEOM 項目，並期望改善我們表現不佳的項目組合，以實現正現金回報。

On our third priority, we continue to take actions to balance our capital allocation and improve our balance sheet. We expect to reduce our capital expenditures to roughly $2.5 billion per year following the completion of several large projects.

第三，我們將繼續採取措施平衡資本配置，改善資產負債表。我們預計，在幾個大型項目完成後，我們的資本支出將減少到每年約 25 億美元。

At this level of CapEx, we believe we can support our ongoing maintenance and invest in the traditional industrial gas projects while growing our dividend and longer term, returning additional cash to shareholders via share buybacks.

我們相信，在目前的資本支出水準下，我們可以支持我們持續的維護工作，投資於傳統的工業氣體項目，同時提高股息，並在長期內透過股票回購向股東返還更多現金。

In 2026, we expect our capital expenditures to be about $4 billion. In summary, we expect fiscal 2026 to demonstrate our commitment to continuously drive improvement in our core industrial gas business and growing alongside our customers.

預計到 2026 年，我們的資本支出將達到約 40 億美元。總而言之，我們預計 2026 財年將展現我們致力於不斷改進核心工業氣體業務並與客戶共同成長的決心。

Please turn to slide 5. We highlighted earlier this year that a portion of our productivity improvement will come from returning to an organizational headcount similar to what we had before we started several large clean energy projects. This slide offers a progress report on our actions in the savings that are being created.

請翻到第5張投影片。今年稍早我們曾強調，我們生產力提高的一部分將來自於恢復到啟動幾個大型清潔能源計畫之前的組織人員規模。此投影片展示了我們在節省成本方面所採取的行動的進展。

Since 2022, we have identified a total of 3,600 headcount reductions, which translates to [16%] of our peak workforce. We expect these reductions to contribute approximately $250 million in annual cost savings or $0.90 per share in earnings once the reductions are complete.

自 2022 年以來，我們已確定裁員 3,600 人，相當於我們員工人數高峰的 16%。我們預計，這些削減措施完成後，每年將節省約 2.5 億美元的成本，或每股收益增加 0.90 美元。

These cuts are not something we do lightly, but they are critical to offset inflation and adapt the organization to a lower level of CapEx spend. Our objective remains to return to staffing levels 2018 adjusted for employee growth to support new assets, minus any other productivity we can find with new initiatives like AI.

我們不會輕易做出這些削減措施，但這些措施對於抵銷通貨膨脹和使組織適應較低的資本支出水準至關重要。我們的目標仍然是恢復到 2018 年的員工人數水平，並根據員工成長情況進行調整，以支持新資產，同時減去我們透過人工智慧等新舉措所能獲得的任何其他生產力提升。

Moving to slide 6. We have a summary of our expected CapEx expenditures after 2026. As we have previously said, we are also moving forward with several underperforming projects, giving our commercial obligations and project steps.

切換到第6張投影片。我們彙整了 2026 年以後的預期資本支出。正如我們之前所說，考慮到我們的商業義務和專案步驟，我們也在推動幾個表現不佳的專案。

We have roughly $2.5 billion remaining to be spent on these projects from 2026 to 2028. Though these products are not expected to contribute materially to operating income, we continue to work to improve their results through commercial negotiations, operational improvement and productivity.

從 2026 年到 2028 年，我們大約還有 25 億美元可用於這些專案。儘管這些產品預計不會對營業收入做出重大貢獻，但我們將繼續透過商業談判、營運改善和提高生產力來改善其業績。

For our NEOM project, this slide reflects the CapEx related to our equity contribution to the overall project, which will be completed in 2027. Any further investments for ammonia dissociation in Europe will need to be approved separately.

對於我們的 NEOM 項目，此投影片反映了與我們對整個項目的股權投入相關的資本支出，該項目將於 2027 年完成。任何在歐洲進行的氨分解技術的進一步投資都需要另行批准。

After we bring these projects on stream, we expect capital expenditures of roughly $2.5 billion per year, which can sustain both our future growth and ongoing maintenance. For our blue hydrogen project in Louisiana, we have hard making new commitments until an uptake agreement is reached.

這些項目投入營運後，我們預計每年的資本支出約為 25 億美元，這不僅可以支持我們未來的成長，也可以支持持續的維護。對於我們在路易斯安那州的藍色氫能項目，在達成吸收協議之前，我們很難做出新的承諾。

In this slide, our capital investment for this project in '26 reflects only prior commitments on the project and we have excluded any spending beyond 2026. Like in the case of NEOM downstream investments, they would need to be justified and approved based on firm offtake commitments. I'll talk more about the Louisiana and NEOM projects in our next slide.

在此投影片中，我們 2026 年對該專案進行的資本投資僅反映了先前對該專案的承諾，我們已排除 2026 年以後的任何支出。與 NEOM 的下游投資一樣，這些投資需要有理有據，並根據確定的承購承諾獲得批准。下一張投影片我將詳細介紹路易斯安那州和NEOM計畫。

On traditional core growth, we expect to invest approximately $1.5 billion per year going forward. These are as operation hydrogen projects that we normally execute in 18 to 30 months, so there are always new products being added and completed products being removed from the list.

在傳統核心成長方面，我們預計未來每年將投資約 15 億美元。這些是我們通常在 18 到 30 個月內執行的氫能運作項目，因此總會有新產品加入，也會有已完成的產品從清單中移除。

The CapEx figures for fiscal year 2027 and beyond represents our expected average spend. Our focus will be, as always, on opportunities that meet our return thresholds with quality customers and contractual uptake.

2027 財年及以後的資本支出數據代表了我們預期的平均支出。我們將一如既往地專注於那些能夠達到我們預期回報標準、擁有優質客戶並能履行合約義務的機會。

Moving to slide 7. I wanted to close with a brief update on NEOM and Louisiana. Start with NEOM, the project is progressing well and is about 90% complete. Solar and wind power generation will be completed by early 2026, and we will start commissioning the electrolyzers and ammonia production. We expect to have ammonia production on stream with full product availability in 2027.

切換到第7張投影片。最後，我想簡單介紹一下NEOM和路易斯安那州的最新情況。先說說NEOM項目，該項目進展順利，已完成約90%。太陽能和風能發電將於 2026 年初完成，我們將開始調試電解槽和氨生產設備。我們預計氨的生產將於 2027 年全面投產並實現產品全面供應。

We are, of course, following the regulatory developments in Europe. It is important to highlight that the scale of the energy transition is such that the volumes required to meet even the smaller mandates such as the Red III EU mandate to convert 1% of fuel sold to RFNBO fuels would create a green hydrogen demand equal to approximately 7x the total production of our NEOM project by 2030.

我們當然會關注歐洲的監管動態。值得強調的是，能源轉型的規模如此之大，即使是較小的強制性要求，例如歐盟的 Red III 指令，即把 1% 的燃料銷售轉化為 RFNBO 燃料，到 2030 年，所需的綠色氫氣需求量也將相當於我們 NEOM 項目總產量的大約 7 倍。

Obviously, a significant part of the volume is expected to be supplied by local electrolyzers using renewable power, but it's important to highlight that our solution to bring green ammonia from Saudi Arabia for dissociation in Europe is competitive in terms of pricing and requires zero public subsidies.

顯然，預計很大一部分氨將由使用再生能源的本地電解槽供應，但值得強調的是，我們從沙烏地阿拉伯進口綠色氨並在歐洲進行分解的解決方案在價格上具有競爭力，並且不需要任何公共補貼。

As mentioned before, the market for green ammonia is also being developed, and that will be our main target for -- from the time the NEOM project starts. Additional feedback on the market development will be provided during 2026.

如前所述，綠色氨的市場也在發展中，這將是我們NEOM計畫啟動後的主要目標。2026 年將提供更多關於市場發展的回饋意見。

Regarding our blue hydrogen project in Louisiana, we are evaluating proposals to divest the carbon sequestration, and ammonia production assets. We will only go forward with this project if we can sign form offtake agreements for hydrogen and nitrogen from the facilities that will be owned and operated by Air Products.

關於我們在路易斯安那州的藍色氫能項目，我們正在評估剝離碳封存和氨生產資產的提案。只有當我們能夠簽署從空氣產品公司擁有和運營的設施中購買氫氣和氮氣的正式承購協議時，我們才會推進這個項目。

And of course, these agreements will need to comply with our return expectations with one or more high-quality counterparts. As previously committed, we expect to provide further updates related to this project prior to the end of 2025, so in less than two months from today.

當然，這些協議需要符合我們對一個或多個高品質交易對手的回報預期。正如先前承諾的那樣，我們預計將在 2025 年底之前，也就是從今天起不到兩個月的時間內，提供有關該專案的進一步更新。

Let me finish by saying that I'm excited to launch my first full operating year with Air Products team. We have been working hard to right the ship and bring the company back to a position where we can deliver maximum value to our shareholders, customers and employees.

最後我想說，我非常興奮能與空氣產品公司團隊一起開啟我的第一個完整營運年度。我們一直在努力扭轉局面，使公司重回正軌，從而能夠為我們的股東、客戶和員工創造最大價值。

Now I'll turn the call over to Melissa to discuss our financial results in greater depth and discuss our 2026 outlook. Melissa?

現在我將把電話交給梅麗莎，讓她更深入地討論我們的財務業績，並探討我們對 2026 年的展望。梅麗莎？

Thank you, Eduardo, and welcome and hello to those joining us on the call today. Please move to slide 8 for a high-level summary of our financial results.

謝謝愛德華多，也歡迎今天參加電話會議的各位。請翻到第 8 頁，查看我們財務表現的摘要。

We ended the fiscal year with earnings per share of $12.03, delivering our commitment to our shareholders and above market consensus. With respect to sales, favorable volume for on-site and non-helium merchant were more than offset by a 2% headwind from the prior year LNG divestiture as well as project backlog.

本財年結束時，每股收益為 12.03 美元，實現了對股東的承諾，並高於市場普遍預期。就銷售而言，現場和非氦氣貿易商的有利銷售量被上一年液化天然氣剝離以及專案積壓帶來的 2% 的不利影響所抵消。

Volume was also lower due to the reduced global helium demand. Partially was favorable for non-Helium merchant products across all regions. Operating income was down on volume and higher cost, partially offset by non helium price.

由於全球氦氣需求下降，銷售量也隨之降低。在所有地區，部分地區對非氦氣商家產品有利。營業收入因銷售量和成本上升而下降，但部分被非氦氣價格上漲所抵銷。

The higher costs were driven by depreciation, largely offset by productivity improvements, net of fixed cost inflation. Operating income margin of approximately 24% and declined 70 basis points compared to the prior year, largely driven by higher energy cost pass-through. Return on capital of 10.1% was lower versus prior year as we continue to exit on our project backlog, as we continue to exit on our project backlog.

成本上升主要是由於折舊，但生產率的提高在很大程度上抵消了成本上升，扣除固定成本通膨後，成本上升仍然顯著。營業利益率約 24%，較上年下降 70 個基點，主要原因是能源成本轉嫁增加。由於我們不斷退出專案積壓訂單，資本回報率為 10.1%，低於去年同期水準。

Moving now to slide 9. Our fiscal year earnings per share of $12.03 decreased $0.40 or 3% from prior year. driven by a 4% headwind from LNG divestiture and a 2% headwind from project exits. Without these discrete items, EPS would be up 3%.

現在來看第9張投影片。本財年每股收益為 12.03 美元，較前一年減少 0.40 美元，下降 3%。主要原因是液化天然氣剝離業務帶來的 4% 的負面影響以及專案退出帶來的 2% 的負面影響。剔除這些獨立項目後，每股收益將成長 3%。

Additionally, we continue to see headwinds from helium, including unfavorable comparable volume and pricing across regions. Despite these headwinds, we continue to deliver on our base business with stronger non-helium pricing actions, ongoing productivity across our segments and favorable on-site and merchant contributions.

此外，我們持續看到氦氣市場面臨不利因素，包括各地區可比銷售量和價格均不理想。儘管面臨這些不利因素，我們仍透過更強有力的非氦氣定價措施、各業務部門持續的生產力提升以及良好的現場和商家貢獻，繼續實現我們的基本業務目標。

Moving now to slide 10. I will provide an overview of our results by segment for the full fiscal year. You can find additional details of the quarterly segment results in the appendix. For the fiscal year, America's results were down 3%.

現在來看第10張投影片。我將概述我們各業務板塊在整個財年的表現。您可以在附錄中找到更多季度分部業績的詳細資訊。本財年，美國的業績下降了 3%。

As a reminder, we reported a onetime asset sale associated with an early contract termination at the request of a customer in the prior year fourth quarter, which alone resulted in a 3% headwind in the Americas. Additional drivers include headwinds from project exits and helium and higher maintenance-related costs. These were partially offset by strong non-helium pricing actions, productivity improvement and favorable on-site contributions from our HyCO business.

提醒一下，我們在上年第四季報告了一筆與客戶要求提前終止合約相關的資產出售，僅此一項就給美洲地區帶來了 3% 的負面影響。其他驅動因素包括專案退出和氦氣帶來的不利影響以及更高的維護相關成本。這些不利因素部分被強勁的非氦氣定價措施、生產力提升以及 HyCO 業務帶來的有利現場貢獻所抵消。

Asia fiscal year results were relatively flat, as lower helium was offset by favorable on-site, non-helium price and productivity. During the quarter, we made the decision to sell two coal gasification projects within Asia, which are now within assets held for sale.

亞洲財年業績相對平穩，氦氣價格下跌被現場非氦氣價格和生產率的有利因素所抵消。本季度，我們決定出售位於亞洲的兩個煤氣化項目，這些項目目前屬於待售資產。

Europe's FY25 results improved 4% as non-helium merchant pricing, productivity and favorable on-site contribution was partially offset by lower helium and higher costs associated with two depreciation and fixed cost inflation. The full-year Middle East and India equity affiliates income decreased 2% from prior year, primarily due to lower contributions from our Jazan joint venture.

歐洲 2025 財年的業績提高了 4%，非氦氣商家定價、生產力和有利的現場貢獻部分抵消了氦氣價格下降以及與兩次折舊和固定成本通膨相關的成本上升。全年中東和印度股權附屬公司營收較前一年下降 2%，主要原因是來自 Jazan 合資企業的貢獻減少。

The full-year results for the Corporate and other segment were primarily impacted by the headwind from the prior year sale of LNG, partially offset by lower changes to the sale of equipment project estimates and lower costs with our continued focus on productivity improvements.

公司及其他部門的全年業績主要受到上一年液化天然氣銷售不利因素的影響，但設備銷售項目估算的變化減少以及我們持續專注於提高生產率而導致的成本降低部分抵消了這一不利因素。

Moving now to slide 11. We continue to generate strong cash flows from our base business, supporting investments in both energy transition and traditional industrial gas projects. Additionally, we returned $1.6 billion in cash to our shareholders. We remain committed to disciplined cost control, a reduction in capital expenditures and strategic asset actions aimed at unlocking value and generating cash.

現在來看第11張投影片。我們的基礎業務持續產生強勁的現金流，為能源轉型和傳統工業氣體專案提供投資支援。此外，我們也向股東返還了16億美元現金。我們將繼續致力於嚴格的成本控制、減少資本支出以及旨在釋放價值和產生現金流的策略性資產行動。

Moving now to slide 12. We will review our outlook for fiscal 2026. For the full year, we expect to deliver earnings per share in the range of $12.85 to $13.15, an improvement of 7% to 9% from the prior year. Despite a helium headwind comparable to FY25, this growth is expected to be achieved through new asset contribution and continued focus on pricing actions and productivity.

現在來看第12張投影片。我們將重新檢視2026財年的展望。我們預計全年每股收益將在 12.85 美元至 13.15 美元之間，比上年增長 7% 至 9%。儘管氦氣產業面臨與 2025 財年類似的逆風，但預計透過新增資產投入和持續關注定價策略及生產力，仍能實現成長。

We also expect a 1% benefit from the rationalization of projects in large part due to the two Asia gasification assets we wrote down in fiscal 2025. We are focused on delivering these results in line with the five-year road map we introduced earlier this year.

我們也預計，由於我們在 2025 財年減記了兩項亞洲氣化資產，專案合理化將帶來 1% 的收益。我們正致力於按照今年稍早公佈的五年路線圖實現這些目標。

For the first quarter of 2026, we expect to deliver earnings per share in the range of $2.95 to $3.10, representing a 3% to 8% improvement from the prior year. Our outlook assumes growth from continued pricing actions and productivity as well as a benefit from the rationalization of projects and lower planned maintenance, partially offset by lower helium. As a reminder, we expect our first quarter to be lower sequentially due to normal seasonality.

我們預計 2026 年第一季每股收益將在 2.95 美元至 3.10 美元之間，比上年增長 3% 至 8%。我們的展望認為，持續的價格措施和生產力的提高將帶來成長，專案合理化和計劃維護減少也將帶來收益，但氦氣價格的下降將部分抵消這些成長。再次提醒，由於正常的季節性因素，我們預計第一季業績將環比下降。

With respect to capital, we expect to spend approximately $4 billion as we execute on our project backlog, including approximately $1 billion on traditional industrial gas projects and invest in ongoing maintenance. As we look to derisk our Louisiana projects and optimize our portfolio, we expect to be modestly cash flow positive in fiscal year 2026 and are committed to staying cash flow neutral through 2028 as we close out on several projects.

在資本方面，我們預計將投入約 40 億美元用於執行我們的專案積壓，其中包括約 10 億美元用於傳統工業氣體專案以及投資於持續維護。為了降低路易斯安那州計畫的風險並優化我們的投資組合，我們預計在 2026 財年將實現小幅正現金流，並致力於在 2028 年完成幾個專案後保持現金流平衡。

Now we'll open the call up for questions. Operator?

現在我們開始接受提問。操作員？

(Operator Instructions) Jeff Zekauskas, JPMorgan.

（操作說明）傑夫‧澤考斯卡斯，摩根大通。

In your opening remarks, I think you said that you were evaluating proposals to divest the carbon capture piece of the Louisiana project, but you're still evaluating whether you would proceed with the project. So could it be that those two events would be linked, that is you would sell the carbon capture piece to a party, and then work with them to provide them hydrogen or hydrogen and ammonia.

在你的開場白中，我想你說過你正在評估剝離路易斯安那州碳捕獲計畫的提案，但你仍在評估是否會繼續推進該計畫。那麼，這兩件事會不會有關聯呢？也就是說，你會把碳捕獲裝置賣給一方，然後與他們合作，提供他們氫氣或氫氣和氨氣。

Jeff. Yes, let me try to explain that. The idea of this project is basically to transform into a regular hydrogen and air separation project, where we supply hydrogen and nitrogen to someone that will produce ammonia. The CO2 that is being produced by the facility has to be sequester in order to -- for you to capture the 45Q credit, right? So what we're basically saying is that Air Products was developing by itself its own porous space to do that.

傑夫。好的，讓我來解釋一下。這個項目的理念基本上是將其轉變為一個常規的氫氣和空氣分離項目，我們向生產氨的人提供氫氣和氮氣。該設施產生的二氧化碳必須被封存，這樣你才能獲得 45Q 碳信用額，對吧？所以，我們基本上是說，空氣產品公司正在自行開發其獨特的多孔空間來實現這一目標。

And what we are trying to do at this point, we evaluate any proposals for someone to buy the porous spaces from us and provide the service of the CO2 sequestration or to just buy the porous space from us and provide the service from another location that this company may have.

而我們目前正在努力做的，是評估任何從我們這裡購買多孔空間並提供二氧化碳封存服務的提議，或者僅僅是從我們這裡購買多孔空間，然後從該公司可能擁有的其他地點提供服務的提議。

So that's the picture in terms of the CO2 situation. And yes, this is connected through the overall project. although if we decided not to go forward, of course, we still have this asset that is the porous space that we can try to monetize in the market.

以上就是二氧化碳情勢的概況。是的，這與整個專案息息相關。當然，如果我們決定不再繼續前進，我們仍然擁有這個可滲透的空間這一資產，我們可以嘗試將其在市場上貨幣化。

And as for the Alberta project, because the cost overruns have been so high, why don't you simply stop the project? Or what impede you from stopping it. And would that project have to be money losing on an EPS basis because the depreciates are -- will just be so high from the cost overruns when it comes -- if it comes on?

至於阿爾伯塔項目，由於成本超支如此嚴重，為什麼不乾脆停止該項目？還是什麼阻礙你阻止它？如果該專案啟動，由於成本超支導致折舊費用過高，那麼該專案是否必然會因每股盈餘而虧損？

Yes, Jeff. This project, as I explained before, we have a long-term commitment for almost 50% of the volume with a major customer that depends on us. So we have contractual commitment that we take very seriously. So we need to finish the project and supply the hydrogen to this customer. And we have some additional volume that we are working hard to find other ways to place in the market.

是的，傑夫。正如我之前解釋的那樣，在這個項目中，我們與一家依賴我們的大客戶簽訂了長期合同，承諾供應近 50% 的產量。因此，我們非常重視我們所承擔的合約義務。所以我們需要完成這個項目，並向這位客戶供應氫氣。我們還有一些額外的貨源，正在努力尋找其他方式來投放市場。

As you probably know, we already have infrastructure in place in Edmonton. We have two other sites that are connected through a pipeline. And this third site will also be connected there. So we can move the product from these three sites to basically all the refineries that are located in that area.

您可能已經知道，我們在埃德蒙頓已經具備了基礎設施。我們還有另外兩個站點透過管道連接。第三個站點也將與那裡連接。因此，我們可以將產品從這三個地點運送到該地區的所有煉油廠。

So that's the work we're doing with the additional volume. But our commitment to go forward is basically what we need to have in order to fulfill our contractual obligations.

這就是我們利用新增容量所做的工作。但我們繼續前進的決心，基本上是我們履行合約義務所必需的。

David Begleiter, Deutsche Bank.

大衛‧貝格萊特，德意志銀行。

Eduardo, on the cost savings and the employee headcount, is the 20,000 head count you're targeting a new base? Or could it go lower from there?

愛德華多，關於成本節約和員工人數，你設定的 20,000 人目標人數是新的基準嗎？或者它還能更低嗎？

Yes. This is what we are expecting to have at the end of this year. We continue to find ways to rationalize our workforce to make sure that we use all the technologies available. I think we demonstrate that we are reducing our SG&A year by year. And if I'm -- my recollection is correct, I think we said that our regional number when we were in 2018 was close to 18,500 people.

是的。這就是我們預計今年底能達到的目標。我們不斷尋找優化人員配置的方法，以確保充分利用所有可用技術。我認為我們已經證明，我們的銷售、管理及行政費用正在逐年降低。如果我沒記錯的話，我們當時在 2018 年說過，我們地區的人口接近 18,500 人。

And our objective is to go back to that number plus the people that we absolutely need to operate some assets that we added since that date. So I would say that we still have some room to go, but it's an ongoing process to always optimize and make sure that you are as competitive as possible.

我們的目標是恢復到先前的數字，再加上我們自那時以來新增資產營運絕對需要的人員。所以我覺得我們還有進步空間，但這是一個持續優化並確保自身盡可能保持競爭力的過程。

Very good. And just back on Louisiana. If you do move forward with that project with these offtake or partners you suggested, what would be the CapEx remaining to Air Products?

非常好。然後又回到了路易斯安那州。如果您按照您建議的方式推進該項目，並採用這些承購方或合作夥伴，那麼空氣產品公司還需要投入多少資本支出？

Yes. We will provide that data, Dave, when we update the project. I think it's -- I hope everybody understands that what we're saying is trying to summarize that no offtake deals, no FID. So Air Products started this project without having an offtake deal. We paused the project.

是的。戴夫，我們會在專案更新時提供這些數據。我認為──我希望大家都能理解，我們想表達的是，如果沒有承購協議，就沒有最終投資決定。因此，空氣產品公司在沒有簽訂承購協議的情況下就開始了這個計畫。我們暫停了該項目。

We're working hard to find solutions for that. the economics of the project when you look at the natural gas price, the infrastructure that we have in place and the 45Q, it is the right place to install blue hydrogen and blue ammonia projects. I think both other ammonia producers and even our competitors that doing similar projects in Texas and Louisiana saying exactly the same thing that you can be competitive even against gray ammonia in Europe.

我們正在努力尋找解決方案。從天然氣價格、我們現有的基礎設施以及45Q地區來看，該項目的經濟效益表明，這裡是建造藍氫和藍氨項目的理想地點。我認為其他氨生產商，甚至我們在德克薩斯州和路易斯安那州進行類似項目的競爭對手都表達了同樣的觀點，那就是即使與歐洲的灰色氨相比，你也能具有競爭力。

So we're working on that, trying to find a solution. I understand we are basically 45 days away from the end of the year. And if I really didn't think that we have a chance to have something, it would be much easier for me to say that today. But we still believe that we can find an interesting solution for this project, and we'll provide a full update before the end of this year.

所以我們正在努力尋找解決方案。我知道距離年底還有大約 45 天。如果我真的認為我們沒有機會取得什麼成就，那麼今天我就可以更輕鬆地說出這句話了。但我們仍然相信能夠為這個項目找到一個有趣的解決方案，我們將在今年年底前提供完整的最新進展。

Duffy Fischer, Goldman Sachs.

達菲費雪，高盛集團。

Just want to get some insights into the growth into next year. So at the midpoint of your guide, you're up 8%, but there's a negative 4% from helium. So that's really 12%. Melissa called out one from the shutdown of the sale of the Chinese assets, which gets you to 11%. So that 11% growth underlying?

想了解明年的成長情況。所以，在你的指南的中點，你上漲了 8%，但氦氣帶來了 -4% 的損失。所以實際上是 12%。梅麗莎指出，中國資產出售的停止導致損失，使損失達到 11%。所以，實質成長率是11%嗎？

Can you break that out kind of new projects, price, efficiencies, how you deliver that? And is that smooth throughout the year? Or are the oncoming projects back-end loaded?

能詳細說明一下這類新項目、價格、效率以及交付方式嗎？而且這種情況全年都如此嗎？或者即將開展的專案後端是否已經加載完畢？

Yes. We expect a contribution from new assets in both in Asia and the Americas that can give us around 2%, 3% growth. And then the balance will come from price and productivity. I would say half and half there. We are working very hard on the on the productivity side, as we mentioned on our headcount slide and on the pricing is a continuous work for us.

是的。我們預計來自亞洲和美洲新資產的貢獻可以為我們帶來約 2% 到 3% 的成長。最終的平衡將取決於價格和生產力。我覺得各佔一半吧。正如我們在人員編制幻燈片中提到的那樣，我們正在努力提高生產力，而定價也是我們持續努力的方向。

The helium headwind that we have is very similar to what we had this year. I would say that when we say that this is the headwind for 2026 is basically, agreements that we are reviewing and we're signing this year in 2025 or the previous year, now the fiscal year.

我們遇到的氦氣逆風與今年的情況非常相似。我認為，我們所說的 2026 年的不利因素，基本上是指我們正在審查和簽署的協議，這些協議要么是在 2025 年簽署，要么是在上一年簽署，也就是現在的財政年度。

Air Products, most of our volume comes from large liquid customers. As you know, our packaged gas business is basically limited to Europe. So we pretty much know where these agreements are going to be next year and that's where they are at the fourth quarter of this year.

空氣產品公司的大部分銷售量都來自大型液體客戶。如您所知，我們的包裝氣體業務基本上僅限於歐洲。所以我們基本上知道這些協議明年會發展到什麼程度，而它們在今年第四季的情況也正是如此。

So we're pretty comfortable that we understand well the headwind that we have in helium, in the base business, as I said, 3% of new assets and the balance coming from productivity and price.

因此，我們相當有信心，我們很好地了解了氦氣業務（基礎業務）面臨的不利因素，正如我所說，新增資產佔 3%，其餘部分來自生產力和價格。

Great. And I'm sure it's not your favorite subject, but helium was mentioned 29 times in your slide deck this quarter. What is your view on the helium industry going forward? Do you think we've stabilized at this point? So '26 will be the last year of headwind? Or do you think we continue to see headwinds in the '27 and '28 for that product?

偉大的。我知道這可能不是你最喜歡的主題，但本季你的幻燈片中提到氦氣的次數達到了 29 次。您如何看待氦氣產業的未來發展？你認為我們目前的情況穩定下來了嗎？所以2026年會是逆風的最後一年嗎？或者您認為該產品在 2027 年和 2028 年仍將面臨不利因素嗎？

I didn't count the number of times, Duffy, but thank you for pointing that. Yes, it's -- we have a lot of debates on that. If we have a structural change in the market or just part of the cyclicality that you always had in helium, right?

我沒有統計過次數，達菲，但謝謝你指出。是的，我們對此有很多爭論。如果市場發生結構性變化，或者只是氦氣市場一直以來存在的周期性波動的一部分，對吧？

I would say that there were some significant changes in the way the market operates because of the disappearance of the BLM as a major source of helium globally and in the United States. And that took away a little bit of the inventory that you had that were able to regulate the market a little bit. I think most of the major players now, they are now installing their own stores.

我認為，由於 BLM 不再是全球和美國的主要氦氣來源，市場運作方式發生了一些重大變化。這樣一來，原本能夠起到一定市場調節作用的庫存就減少了一些。我認為現在大多數主要玩家都在開設自己的門市。

So we have our own cavern, our two competitors, they have their own cavern as well. So I hope that this will help regulate the market a little bit. And from what I see today, I see still some decline in '27, but not at the same level that we had this year.

所以我們有自己的洞穴，我們的兩個競爭對手也有他們自己的洞穴。所以我希望這能對市場起到一定的調節作用。從我今天看到的來看，2027 年仍然會有一些下滑，但不會像今年這樣下滑。

And the best guess that we have is that, that will be the lowest point and the market will stabilize. But we need to see how the sources developed and how the effect of this storage of helium will have in the overall marketplace.

我們最好的猜測是，那將是最低點，市場將會趨於穩定。但我們需要觀察氦氣資源的發展情況，以及這種氦氣儲存方式將對整個市場產生怎樣的影響。

Patrick Cunningham, Citi.

派崔克‧坎寧安，花旗銀行。

If you decide to forgo downstream investment in NEOM maybe based on unfavorable regulatory environment, whatever it may be, what do the commercial options look like? And would you expect to see any positive EPS contribution in 2027 under a scenario where you have to sell ammonia exclusively?

如果您決定放棄對 NEOM 的下游投資（可能是由於不利的監管環境或其他任何原因），那麼商業選擇有哪些？如果只能銷售氨，您預期 2027 年每股盈餘會有任何正成長嗎？

Yes. We are still talking about the guidance for 2026, right? So we're going to work, we are working on this issue. We're going to work during the year. And by the end of 2026, we'll be able to give you more guidance on that.

是的。我們仍在討論2026年的指導方針，對吧？所以我們正在著手解決這個問題。我們打算在這一年工作。到 2026 年底，我們將能夠就此為您提供更多指導。

Now there's no question that in the beginning of this project, we'll need to commercialize the product as ammonia. The market for green and blue ammonia or low-carbon ammonia whatever you want to call, it's developing.

毫無疑問，在這個專案初期，我們需要將該產品商業化為氨。綠色氨、藍色氨或低碳氨（無論你怎麼稱呼它）的市場正在發展。

So I expect that we're going to have the ability to sell some of our production in the beginning of the operation as green, and that percentage will grow with time. What is exactly the numbers, as you know, ammonia, its own market. It has different pricing dynamics. So we're going to need to wait a little bit more to give you a forecast for 2027.

因此，我預計在營運初期，我們將能夠以綠色產品的形式出售部分產品，並且隨著時間的推移，這一比例將會成長。具體數字是多少？要知道，氨氣有它自己的市場。它的定價機制有所不同。因此，我們需要再等一段時間才能給出 2027 年的預測。

Understood. And then maybe just a quick one on equity affiliate income. We saw meaningful growth in the Americas this quarter. Can you provide some color on what was driving that and what we should sort of expect for step up or step down across all of the regions and equity income next year?

明白了。然後或許可以簡單談談股權激勵收入。本季我們在美洲地區實現了顯著成長。您能否詳細說明一下導致這種情況的原因，以及我們應該對明年所有地區和股權收入的增減幅度作何預期？

Yes, I can ask Melissa to answer, but it's basically Mexico for us and they have been -- had a very strong second half of the year.

是的，我可以問梅麗莎，但對我們來說，這主要與墨西哥有關，而且他們今年下半年的表現非常強勁。

Yes. Thanks, Eduardo. So -- absolutely, so our Mexican joint venture did see improvements year over year. We do expect about a flat going into FY26. However, we did see a slight decline in our Jazan joint venture in '25, and we actually look for that to be a pickup in '26.

是的。謝謝你，愛德華多。所以——沒錯，我們的墨西哥合資企業確實逐年取得了進步。我們預計2026財年將保持穩定。不過，我們在 2025 年確實看到 Jazan 合資企業的業績略有下滑，但我們預計 2026 年業績將會回升。

And obviously, interest rates do impact that. So as interest rates do decline, we will see improvement on the equity affiliate contributions from our Jazan joint venture.

很顯然，利率確實會對此產生影響。因此，隨著利率下降，我們將看到來自 Jazan 合資企業的股權附屬公司貢獻有所改善。

Josh Spector, UBS.

瑞銀集團的 Josh Spector。

Eduardo, I wanted to just ask you about the decision on Louisiana. I mean, I think based on investor expectations, you might have had some license to maybe push out a decision there a little bit beyond year-end, but you're having the tax commitment to communicate something here in the next couple of months.

愛德華多，我想問你關於路易斯安那州的決定。我的意思是，我認為根據投資者的預期，你或許可以稍微推遲一下決定時間，直到年底之後，但你現在有稅務方面的承諾，需要在接下來的幾個月內公佈相關消息。

So I'm just curious if you could talk about the range of scenarios there. Is that a go or no-go meaning cancel decision? Or do you see a scenario where kind of some decision gets pushed out beyond the year-end timeframe.

所以我很好奇您能否談談這方面的各種情況。這是決定是否繼續進行，還是取消？或者您是否預見到某些決定會被推遲到年底之後的情況？

Yes. I understand the curiosity junction. We would like to be able to communicate more at this point, but we really need to wait until the end of the year. Again, this -- I would say that if we are telling you that we believe that we have a reasonable chance to communicate something by the end of this year, it means that we have very advanced negotiations and with counterparts on that.

是的。我理解好奇心交會點。我們現在很想與大家進行更多溝通，但真的需要等到年底。再說一次——我想說，如果我們告訴你們，我們相信在今年年底前有相當大的機會達成某種協議，這意味著我們與對方就此進行的談判已經取得了非常深入的進展。

But it is the largest project or would be the largest products ever built or probably any other industrial gas company. So it's a very complex negotiation and we have been working on that for several months now. I would say that from that perspective, it's going well.

但這將是迄今為止規模最大的項目，或者說是迄今為止建造的最大產品，也可能是任何其他工業氣體公司建造的最大產品。所以這是一場非常複雜的談判，我們已經為此努力了好幾個月了。從這個角度來看，我認為進展順利。

I -- my main concern on this project really is on the capital estimate for the project. When you look at this slide, you can see a picture of coal box that we manufacture for this project. So we have all the major equipment done.

我——我對這個專案的主要擔憂其實是專案的資金估算。當你看到這張投影片時，你可以看到我們為這個專案製造的煤箱的圖片。主要設備都已準備就緒。

We have all the engineering done, but we still need to do the construction. And the construction market in the United States is very hard at this point. A lot of competition from data centers and other people trying to build all the structures and coming from different industries and able to pay different prices. I think this is affecting projects for the entire chemical industry.

我們已經完成了所有的工程設計，但還需要進行施工。目前美國的建築市場非常艱難。來自資料中心和其他試圖建立各種基礎設施的人，以及來自不同行業、能夠支付不同價格的人，都帶來了極大的競爭。我認為這會影響整個化學產業的專案。

So we are looking at that very carefully trying to understand what is real, what is not and what is a bubble, with the point that if you look at our slides, you can see that we made a point about applying for a major air permit -- air sources permit there in Louisiana.

所以我們正在非常仔細地研究這個問題，試圖了解什麼是真實的，什麼是不真實的，什麼是泡沫。重點是，如果你看看我們的幻燈片，你會發現我們強調了申請路易斯安那州的主要空氣許可證——空氣源許可證。

And we did that because our potential counterparts asked us to have the flexibility of running the plant on a gray mold, if something happens with the CO2 sequestration that we didn't expect to do or still don't expect to do because the CO2 is a big contributor for the project.

我們這樣做是因為我們的潛在合作夥伴要求我們能夠靈活地使用灰黴菌來運行工廠，以防二氧化碳封存出現我們意想不到的情況，或者我們仍然不認為會發生的情況，因為二氧化碳是該計畫的重要貢獻者。

But it's something that the Air Products are doing, and we decided to apply for that major permit. And that will take several months. It will probably take up to mid-2026. And from there, you need to do civil construction. So really the peak of the mechanical and electrical construction would be like mid-2027.

但這是空氣產品公司正在做的事情，所以我們決定申請這項重要的許可證。這將需要幾個月的時間。可能要到2026年中期才能完成。然後，你需要進行土木工程建設。所以，機械和電氣建設的真正高峰期大概會在 2027 年中。

And the judgment that we need to make is how hot or not hot the US construction market will be at that point. So that's where we have been working a lot of details behind that decision, and we will communicate clearly where we are in the project before the end of this year.

我們需要做出的判斷是，屆時美國建築市場的熱門程度如何。所以，我們一直在研究這項決定背後的許多細節，我們將在今年年底前清楚地向大家說明我們在該專案上的進展。

Okay. And just a quick follow-up just with the guide for '26. Your comments are minimal volume growth to something to that extent. Just wonder if you could quantify minimal. Are we talking about near zero growth.

好的。最後再簡單跟進 2026 年的指南。你的評論對銷量成長的影響微乎其微。我想知道您能否量化一下“最小值”。我們說的是接近零成長嗎？

And basically, if we end up having a macro environment that looks like where we've been at the last couple of quarters, is that a risk to your guidance? Or is that largely baked in?

基本上，如果宏觀環境最終像過去幾季那樣發展，這對您的業績指引構成風險嗎？或者說，這很大程度上是既定事實？

Yes, sure. Thanks for the question. So let's be clear. So again, as we stated, we do see several new assets coming on stream, both in the Americas and in Asia. Those will be ramping towards the back half of this fiscal year.

當然可以。謝謝你的提問。所以，讓我們把話說清楚。所以，正如我們之前所說，我們看到美洲和亞洲都有幾項新的資產投入運作。這些項目將在本財年下半年逐步推展。

So there is growth in volume associated to new assets. From a market volume perspective, we're not forecasting a significant market growth at this time given the macroeconomic headwinds. However, if we see that improve, obviously, our results will improve. So definitely, volume from new assets but at this time, not forecasting significant market volume due to those headwinds.

因此，新增資產帶來了交易量的成長。從市場規模的角度來看，鑑於宏觀經濟逆風，我們目前預期市場不會有顯著成長。但是，如果我們看到這種情況有所改善，那麼很顯然，我們的結果也會有所改善。所以，新資產的交易量肯定會增加，但目前由於這些不利因素，預計市場交易量不會大幅增加。

Vincent Andrews, Morgan Stanley.

文森安德魯斯，摩根士丹利。

Just trying to reconcile the CapEx slide in this deck versus the one, the last one. It looks to us like your CapEx forecast for fiscal '26 has gone from about $3.1 billion to $4 billion. So first of all, is that correct? And secondarily, if it is, what's changed in that slide that's causing that?

我只是想把這頁投影片裡的資本支出數據和上一頁投影片裡的數據調和起來。在我們看來，您對 2026 財年的資本支出預測已從約 31 億美元增加到 40 億美元。首先，是這樣嗎？其次，如果確實如此，那麼導致投影片出現這種變化的原因是什麼？

Yes. Thanks, Vincent, for the question, and I'll take this one. So the CapEx guide that we gave in the second quarter, obviously was an estimate, right? So as we go through the year, we sit with all the regional presidents and really do a bottom-up forecast on the capital that we're going to spend over the next couple of years. So we've refined that.

是的。謝謝Vincent的提問，我會回答這個問題。所以，我們在第二季給出的資本支出指南顯然只是一個估計值，對吧？因此，在這一年中，我們將與所有地區總裁坐下來，真正自下而上地預測未來幾年我們將要花費的資本。所以我們對此進行了改進。

We've adjusted based on new wins in all the different regions and are estimating around a $4 billion CapEx. Obviously, maintenance is a component of that CapEx. We're looking to improve on maintenance and take that down, so this could improve that CapEx number. But again, that's really a bottoms-up review that we do as part of op plan. So there was a small variance between the Q2 time frame CapEx forecast and what we're projecting right now.

我們根據各個地區的新進展進行了調整，預計資本支出約為 40 億美元。顯然，維護是資本支出的一部分。我們希望改善維護工作並降低成本，這樣可以改善資本支出數字。但再次強調，這實際上是我們作為營運計劃的一部分而進行的自下而上的審查。因此，第二季資本支出預測與我們目前的預測之間存在一些差異。

Okay. And then just as a follow-up separately in the Corporate segment, which came in certainly better than what we had, and I believe better than where consensus was. The slide, and I apologize if you already spoke to this. The slide speaks to lower changes of sale of equipment project estimates. What does that mean?

好的。然後，作為後續調查，我們單獨對企業部門進行了調查，結果肯定比我們之前的結果要好，而且我認為也比普遍預期的結果要好。關於投影片，如果您已經談到這一點，我深表歉意。這張投影片顯示設備銷售項目估算的變化幅度較小。這意味著什麼？

Yes. Thank you. So we do have certain sales. It's a very small part of our business, but what you would call a sale of equipment. When we sell a project, to a company that's not going to be a long-term sale of gas project.

是的。謝謝。所以我們確實有一些促銷活動。這只是我們業務中很小的一部分，但你可以稱之為設備銷售。當我們把一個專案賣給一家公司時，那並不是一個長期的天然氣專案銷售。

We have had some cost increases associated to certain projects that are sale of equipment that are again accounted on a percentage of completion accounting perspective. So as cost increases there, we showed that in the P&L. We did have some smaller cost increases this year compared to last year, and that's really what you're seeing flow through there.

某些項目涉及設備銷售，因此成本增加，這些成本也是按照完工百分比會計方法計算的。因此，隨著成本的增加，我們在損益表中也反映了這一點。與去年相比，我們今年的成本確實有所小幅增長，而這正是你在那裡看到的實際情況。

Chris Parkinson, Wolfe Research.

克里斯帕金森，沃爾夫研究公司。

Let's talk about your base business a little bit, particularly electronics. Can you just go over kind of how we should be thinking about the intermediate to long-term growth algo that you have in your portfolio?

讓我們來簡單聊聊您的主要業務，特別是電子產品領域。您能否簡單介紹一下我們應該如何看待您投資組合中的中長期成長演算法？

And how that exposure evolves with M2, HPM growth and everything else. I'd love to hear your thoughts on that as well as where you think Air Products just broadly stands relative to peers in terms of what's embedded in, let's say, your non-large prone outlook as it relates to your backlog.

以及這種曝光度如何隨著 M2、HPM 的成長以及其他因素而演變。我很想聽聽您對此的看法，以及您認為 Air Products 相對於同行的整體地位如何，例如，在您看來，對於非大型企業而言，其積壓訂單情況如何。

Thank you, Chris. Yes, electronics represents roughly 17% of our total sales in Air Products. It's a very important segment for us. We were really the pioneers in the area, initially with Intel now with the other players. It's a market that is expanding very quickly.

謝謝你，克里斯。是的，電子產品約佔空氣產品公司總銷售額的 17%。這對我們來說是一個非常重要的部分。我們確實是這個領域的先驅，最初是和英特爾合作，現在又加入了其他廠商。這是一個快速擴張的市場。

We have plants that we are commissioning right now. We have investments on other plants in Asia that we're doing, and we are in the process of participating bids for several (inaudible), as you know, the investment in this area has been very, very strong.

我們目前正在調試一些工廠。我們在亞洲還有其他工廠的投資項目，並且正在參與幾個項目的競標（聽不清楚），正如您所知，該領域的投資非常非常強勁。

So it's probably the brightest area we have for our traditional business, and it's an area that we have been focused a lot. I really -- on your point on the other products, many would like to get a little more clarification exactly what you're asking other than the portfolio of new projects.

所以這可能是我們傳統業務中最有發展前景的領域，也是我們一直以來重點關注的領域。關於您提到的其他產品，許多人希望您能更清楚地說明，除了新項目組合之外，您究竟想問什麼。

Are you happy with where your existing electronics backlog exist relative to peers, given everybody has been wrong over the last few years? Or is that something you'd like to focus on as a CEO?

考慮到過去幾年大家的預測都出現了偏差，您對目前電子產品積壓訂單的市場地位相對於同業是否滿意？或者，身為CEO，這是你想重點關注的領域嗎？

Yes. No, no. I will never be happy with that because I always want to have more than that. We're working very hard to get some new opportunities. We believe that there are some new projects that we will be able to announce in 2026.

是的。不，不。我永遠不會滿足，因為我總是想要更多。我們正在努力爭取一些新的機會。我們相信，在2026年我們將能夠宣布一些新項目。

And I -- but I still believe that we have a very, very strong position in this market, and I have no other way to make comparisons with our competitors. I think our position on that market is stronger than it is in most markets.

而且——但我仍然相信我們在這個市場上擁有非常非常強大的地位，我也沒有其他方法可以與我們的競爭對手進行比較。我認為我們在該市場的地位比在大多數市場都更強。

And if I could add one point. So one of the assets that we spoke about is coming on stream this year is in the electronic space in Taiwan. So that's the starting of the ramp of that project. So that's one good example. But in the near term, where we're going to see improvements in the electronics space for Air Products.

如果我能補充一點的話。我們談到的今年即將投入營運的資產之一，是台灣的電子領域。這就是該專案啟動的開始。這是一個很好的例子。但就近期而言，我們將看到 Air Products 在電子領域取得進步。

Yes. And the reality is in these places, it's like a continuous project because they have so many expansions and we are always building new plants in Asia, and hopefully, we will be able to move that to other regions as well as these customers, they start to invest outside of Asia.

是的。而現實情況是，在這些地方，這就像一個持續不斷的項目，因為他們有很多擴張，我們一直在亞洲建造新工廠，希望我們也能將這種模式轉移到其他地區，因為這些客戶也開始在亞洲以外的地方投資。

Got it. And just as a quick follow-up. To the extent that you can, can you talk about just kind of how we should be thinking about the run rates from Uzbekistan as well as like GCA and some of these other projects which have had some maintenance or kind of been more start and go. Could you just perhaps just give us a little framework on how we should be thinking about those as well.

知道了。最後再補充一點。盡可能地，您能否談談我們應該如何看待烏茲別克斯坦的運行率，以及像GCA和其他一些進行過維護或更像是啟動和運行的項目？您能否提供我們一個框架，讓我們了解應該如何思考這些問題？

Yes. Uzbekistan is a very large syngas facility it's operating well. We had a maintenance this year, but it was scheduled maintenance this kind of plants you have to do that every few years.

是的。烏茲別克擁有一個規模非常大的合成氣生產設施，而且運作良好。我們今年進行了一次維護，但這是計畫內的維護，這類植物每隔幾年就需要進行一次維護。

So no real issues there and the plant is running at very high rates at this point. And GCA is a project that we are still working on to basically bring to completion, and it's one of the projects that we expect to contribute this year in 2026.

所以目前沒有出現任何實際問題，工廠正在以非常高的效率運作。GCA 是我們仍在努力完成的項目，也是我們預計在 2026 年做出貢獻的項目之一。

John Roberts, Mizuho Securities.

瑞穗證券的約翰羅伯茲。

Are you still anticipating doing ammonia cracking in Europe and building an ammonia cracker there?

您是否仍計劃在歐洲進行氨裂解並在那裡建造氨裂解裝置？

We are still waiting to see what the final regulation will be in Europe. As you know, they have this regulation to convert 1% of the fuels to (inaudible), this is for 2030 now. This has to be transposed by each country. There is other regulations that are probably not going to move. But this one, everything indicates that the -- what you see in most countries, they are even proposing higher percentage than that.

我們仍在等待歐洲最終的法規出爐。如你所知，他們有一項規定，要將 1% 的燃料轉換為（聽不清楚），這項規定是到 2030 年生效的。每個國家都需要進行相應的轉換。還有一些法規可能不會改變。但是，種種跡象表明——你在大多數國家看到的，他們甚至提出了比這更高的比例。

So I think Spain is 4%, Germany 1.5%. But all this has to be ratified and the expectation now is that we'll see this transposition of the regulations by March of 2026. So when the regulation comes out, then we're going to understand the size of the market with the best information we have today, it's not a huge percentage of the fuels.

所以我認為西班牙是 4%，德國是 1.5%。但所有這些都需要得到批准，目前的預期是，我們將在 2026 年 3 月之前看到這些法規的轉換。所以，當相關法規推出後，我們就能根據目前掌握的最佳資訊了解市場規模，它所佔燃料的比例並不大。

But when you think about green hydrogen volumes that are really, really small, that will generate a market. I think in our slides, we said that if the number is 1% is like 7x the volume of NEOM. At the current regulation levels that we see, that number is more like 20x.

但當你考慮到綠色氫氣的產量非常非常小時，就會產生市場。我認為我們在幻燈片中說過，如果這個數字是 1%，那就相當於 NEOM 的 7 倍。按照我們目前看到的監管水平，這個數字更像是 20 倍。

Again, these volumes, they can be supplied by local production using electrolyzers with renewable power or they can be supplied by cracking ammonia coming from a place like Saudi Arabia. So it's really a way to do some arbitrage on power prices and so forth. So we need to see how these ends. We need to see how the market develops and what opportunities we have.

同樣，這些數量可以透過使用再生能源電解槽進行本地生產來供應，也可以透過裂解來自沙烏地阿拉伯等地的氨來供應。所以這其實是一種利用電力價格等進行套利的方法。所以我們需要看看這些事情最終會如何收場。我們需要觀察市場的發展趨勢以及我們面臨的機會。

if the project makes sense again. And if we have an offtake agreement, then we can do an FID and move forward with these projects. If not, will need to go in a different direction. But at this point, indications are that there will be a market, not a huge market, but very significant compared to the existing volumes in terms of green hydrogen and ammonia.

如果這個項目又變得有意義的話。如果我們達成承購協議，那麼我們就可以做出最終投資決定，並推動這些項目。否則，就需要另闢蹊徑。但就目前來看，種種跡象表明，將會出現一個市場，雖然市場規模不大，但與現有的綠氫和氨的產量相比，這個市場意義重大。

Laurence Alexander, Jefferies.

勞倫斯‧亞歷山大，傑富瑞集團。

Earlier this year, when you put out the target of 6% to 9% growth through 2019, what was your assumption around NEOM? Was it your predecessors framework of realized prices will be roughly double the market price? Was it just a placeholder, 10% IRR? Was it -- can you give us some sense of what was embedded in that framework from the NEOM asset.

今年早些時候，當你們提出在 2019 年實現 6% 至 9% 的成長目標時，你們對 NEOM 的預期是什麼？你的前任是否曾提出過「實際價格大約是市場價格的兩倍」這樣的框架？10%的內部報酬率只是一個佔位符嗎？是嗎？您能否為我們介紹一下 NEOM 資產框架中嵌入了哪些內容？

No, we didn't add any kind of very large contribution from NEOM. At this point, we have the contribution from the JV point of view. The contribution from the product that we'll need to sell from there is something that, as I said before, we need to continue to work on to get a better understanding of what the numbers will be. But on our guidance for that high single digits between now and the 29% we count with a minimum contribution from that project.

不，我們沒有從 NEOM 獲得任何巨額投資。至此，我們已經了解了合資方的貢獻。正如我之前所說，我們需要繼續研究從那裡銷售的產品所帶來的貢獻，以便更好地了解相關數字。但根據我們的指導，從現在到 29% 之間，該項目至少貢獻了 29% 的份額。

Matthew DeYoe, Bank of America.

馬修‧德約，美國銀行。

Two questions for you. I apologize, the first one is going to be a little long. So if I look at your performance versus Linde, Europe really shows the biggest opportunity for improvement. And notably, I think price there has kind of underperformed materially if you go back or look even to COVID or pre-COVID.

我有兩個問題想問你。抱歉，第一篇會有點長。所以，如果我看一下你們與林德的業績對比，歐洲市場確實展現了最大的提升空間。值得注意的是，我認為如果你回顧疫情期間或疫情之前的情況，你會發現那裡的價格表現明顯低於預期。

I know Helium is probably in there, but I think fundamentally, when electricity prices rolled over in '22 and '23, it looks like Air Products just like handed price back to customers and Linde didn't. And so net, you have a pretty wide margin differential between the two. I mean, when -- do you kind of agree with that view, but is there an opportunity to catch up on the price differential?

我知道氦氣可能在其中，但我認為從根本上來說，當 2022 年和 2023 年電價下跌時，空氣產品公司似乎只是把價格優勢讓給了客戶，而林德公司卻沒有。因此，總的來說，兩者之間存在著相當大的差距。我的意思是，你某種程度上同意這種觀點，但是有沒有機會彌補價格差異呢？

Or is raising price unilaterally like too difficult? And then, as my second, is there a world where you can just like monetize the $2 billion on cost in (inaudible) to another company that's looking to do a project along the Gulf Coast that might have maybe different strategic goals from Air Products. So I don't know, maybe you can get like 50% of that, right? Is there a word we can walk away with $1 billion and just say that's better than just a full project walk.

或者說，單方面漲價太難了？其次，我的第二個問題是，有沒有可能將（聽不清楚）20億美元的成本貨幣化，轉讓給另一家希望在墨西哥灣沿岸開展專案、且其戰略目標可能與空氣產品公司不同的公司？所以，我不知道，也許你能拿到其中的50%，對吧？有沒有一句話，我們就能帶著 10 億美元離開，然後說這比全面考察計畫好得多？

Yes. On the -- we start with the last question first, yes, absolutely. As I said, we have a lot of the critical equipment done for the project. the project has good economics. So that's definitely what would happen if we decide to cancel we would try to monetize as much as we can.

是的。關於——我們先從最後一個問題開始，是的，絕對的。正如我所說，我們已經為該專案完成了許多關鍵設備的準備工作。該項目具有良好的經濟效益。所以，如果我們決定取消，肯定會盡可能從中獲利。

And I don't think you're your estimate of 50% is a bad estimate at this point. But again, this is something that you need to go and understand and see how much you can recover from that. On your first question -- and I've seen your report on the prices in Europe.

我認為你目前估計的 50% 並不是一個糟糕的估計。但話說回來，這需要你自己去了解，看看你能從中恢復多少。關於你的第一個問題——我已經看過你關於歐洲價格的報告。

And I think we're still trying to understand exactly the comparisons there because when you do comparisons quarter by quarter or not in average for the year, you get to different results. And I think we can talk offline and explain a little bit of that to you. But when you look at performance in Europe.

我認為我們仍在努力理解其中的比較，因為如果按季度進行比較，而不是按年平均值進行比較，就會得到不同的結果。我想我們可以私下聊聊，我再給你解釋一下。但如果你看看歐洲的表現。

Yes, I understand our competitor improved a lot of their performance. I have a personal understanding for what exactly happened there. You always need to understand that Europe is -- it's easy to talk about as one market, but there are several different markets in Europe. It's easy to see that when you think about an island like the UK. But the reality is, when you talk about industrial gases, Iberia is an Ireland, Italy is an island.

是的，我了解到我們的競爭對手在業績上有了很大的提升。我個人對那裡究竟發生了什麼事有比較清晰的了解。你需要始終明白，歐洲雖然很容易被視為一個整體市場，但實際上歐洲是由幾個不同的市場組成的。當你想到像英國這樣的島國時，這一點就很容易理解了。但現實情況是，談到工業氣體，伊比利半島就像愛爾蘭，義大利就像一個島嶼。

And really the only large common market we have in Europe is the space between France and the Benelux in Germany. Eastern Europe also doesn't have the same geographical barriers, but the density also leads to the point that you have several different markets here. So when you think about that, and you forgot about Scandinavia, it's also a separate market.

實際上，我們在歐洲唯一的大型共同市場是法國和德國之間的比荷盧經濟聯盟地區。東歐雖然沒有同樣的地理障礙，但人口密度也導致這裡出現了幾個不同的市場。所以當你考慮到這一點，並且忽略了斯堪的納維亞半島時，它也是一個獨立的市場。

If you look at the positions that we have and the positions that our competitors have the margins are little -- you can understand a little bit the differences in margin. I'd not say that we cannot improve our business in Europe, we working through to do that, to make it better on every line of business that we have.

如果你看看我們和競爭對手的職位，你會發現利潤空間很小──你就能稍微理解利潤空間的差異了。我不會說我們不能在歐洲改進業務，我們正在努力改進，力求在我們所有的業務領域中做得更好。

But I think the difference in performance is a little smaller than what you are you were calculating there just because of the positions that we may have or not in places like Scandinavia or Eastern Europe. But -- so that's the point I can guarantee you we're not giving price back and we're working on our pricing day by day in Europe. And I look forward to have our group here reaching to you and talk about the difference on how you calculate that when you look at quarter results and annual cumulative results on pricing.

但我認為，由於我們在斯堪的納維亞半島或東歐等地可能擁有或不擁有的職位，實際表現上的差異比你計算出來的要小一些。但是——所以我可以向你保證，我們不會降低價格，我們正在每天努力調整我們在歐洲的定價。我期待我們團隊能與您聯繫，探討您在計算季度業績和年度累計業績定價時，計算方法上的差異。

Arun Viswanathan, RBC Capital Markets.

Arun Viswanathan，加拿大皇家銀行資本市場。

Just a clarification on the helium headwind. So I think maybe this year came in just slightly below your expectations. I think you're guiding at $0.55 to $0.60, maybe that's $0.49, so maybe that was a little bit better. Maybe you can just clarify that. And then on the helium headwind for next year, it looks like Q1 is maybe a negative 6%, but then the full year is negative 4%.

關於氦氣逆風的問題，需要澄清一下。所以我覺得今年可能稍微低於你的預期。我認為你的指導價是 0.55 美元到 0.60 美元，也許是 0.49 美元，所以也許稍微好一點。或許您可以解釋一下。至於明年氦氣逆風的影響，第一季可能為負 6%，但全年為負 4%。

So that appears to be projected to get better as you move through the year. What's your confidence in that, I guess? And is there a possibility that it could get worse? And then for my second question, just on CapEx, is there a possibility that maybe -- what kind of flex do you have there?

所以，隨著時間的推移，情況預計會好轉。你對此有多大信心？情況是否有可能惡化？我的第二個問題是關於資本支出，有沒有可能──你們在這方面有什麼彈性？

Would you go down to maybe $3.5 billion if necessary for fiscal '26? And how soon you make those decisions? What kind of freedom are you giving yourselves to or time to make some more difficult decisions, I guess, if you need to?

如果2026財年有必要，你們會把預算降到35億美元嗎？你多久會做出這些決定？我想，你們給自己留出了怎樣的自由，或者說，留出了多少時間來做一些更艱難的決定？

Great. Thanks. I'll take this question. So let's start on helium. So you are right. We had forecasted between $0.50 and $0.55 headwind on helium for the full year. We came in at $0.49. So a little bit better than we had forecasted, but not significantly off.

偉大的。謝謝。我來回答這個問題。那麼，我們就從氦氣開始吧。你說得對。我們先前預測，全年氦氣價格將面臨每盎司 0.50 美元至 0.55 美元的逆風。我們最終的報價是 0.49 美元。比我們預測的略好一些，但偏差並不大。

For FY26, we're looking about the same run rate as what we saw in FY25. Obviously, there are areas that we're going to continue to look to be able to push volume and price, but this is a difficult market. One of the things that I do want to remind everybody is that in Q1 last -- or this year, we had a bulk helium sale that we disclosed.

2026 財年，我們預計其運行速度與 2025 財年大致相同。顯然，我們會繼續關註一些領域，以期提升銷量和價格，但這是一個艱難的市場。我想提醒大家的一點是，去年第一季（或者說今年第一季），我們進行了一筆氦氣大宗銷售，並且已經披露了此事。

That is causing a significant headwind as we lead into FY26. So that is the difference in Q1 that you're seeing as a year-on-year comp that is giving us a little bit of a tough headwind. But again, full year, about 4% is what we're forecasting, 4% headwind coming into FY26. Now on CapEx.

這給我們進入 2026 財年帶來了很大的不利影響。所以，這就是第一季與去年同期相比存在的區別，這給我們帶來了一些不利影響。但同樣，我們預測全年成長率約為 4%，進入 2026 財年將面臨 4% 的不利因素。現在進入資本支出階段。

So for CapEx, it's really a component of execution against our projects, right? So as long as we're continuing to execute against the projects that we have in our backlog, we will see that $3.5 billion to $4 billion. That is not something that would significantly change or that we need to make a decision on.

所以對於資本支出來說，它實際上是我們專案執行的一個組成部分，對吧？只要我們繼續推進積壓的項目，我們就能實現 35 億至 40 億美元的收入。這不會發生重大改變，我們也不需要就此做出決定。

Now as for (inaudible), we obviously have commitments on purchase orders that were continuing to progress, but no new commitments are being made. So I don't see a significant variance or decision point that would change the FY26 CapEx forecast. So between $3.5 billion and $4 billion is a number that I am pretty confident on.

至於（聽不清楚），我們顯然有一些採購訂單正在繼續推進，但沒有新的訂單承諾。因此，我認為不會有任何重大差異或決策點，從而改變 2026 財年的資本支出預測。因此，我對35億美元到40億美元這個數字相當有把握。

Kevin McCarthy, Vertical Research Partners.

Kevin McCarthy，Vertical Research Partners。

Can you elaborate on the decision to sell to coal gasification projects in Asia curious about what exactly you're divesting, whether you have any firm deals in hand today? If so, cash proceeds and any impact on your sales in Asia?

您能否詳細說明一下向亞洲煤氣化項目出售資產的決定？我很想知道您具體剝離了哪些資產，目前是否有任何確定的交易？如果屬實，現金收益是多少？這對您在亞洲的銷售額有何影響？

Yes, Kevin. We -- as we explained, I think, two quarters ago, we have three major coal gasification in China -- projects in China where we own and operate the coal gasification part of the project. We have several others that we have the oxygen plant, but that's a different story.

是的，凱文。正如我們兩個季度前解釋的那樣，我們在中國有三個主要的煤氣化項目，我們擁有並運營這些項目的煤氣化部分。我們還有幾家其他工廠，裡面有氧氣廠，但那是另一個故事了。

Out of these three projects, (inaudible) is the largest one, and we have absolutely no issues with this project. It's operating. It's probably one of the largest coal gasification sites in the world, and this is continuing normally.

在這三個項目中，（聽不清楚）是最大的一個，我們對這個項目完全沒有任何問題。它正在運行。它可能是世界上最大的煤氣化廠之一，而且目前仍在正常運作。

We have two other sites that those are the sites we're taking actions that we have no operating issues, but we have customer issues. And we have been trying to work these issues for some time. These projects really -- they have been a drag for us in terms of operating profit. We have been booking only the sales that they have been able to pay.

我們還有另外兩個網站，我們正在對這兩個網站採取措施，這兩個網站本身沒有營運問題，但有客戶問題。我們一直在努力解決這些問題。這些項目確實拖累了我們的營業利潤。我們只接受他們能夠支付的訂單。

So the impact on sales is not exactly very large for us. And we decided to -- after several months of negotiation we decided to set these assets aside for sale. And we are in the middle of that process. I cannot give you specific data and value of when we can close this sale and the amount of money that we're going to be able to collect. But of course, we're trying to maximize the valuation.

所以，對我們來說，對銷售的影響並不算很大。經過幾個月的談判，我們決定將這些資產擱置出售。我們正處於這個過程之中。我無法提供具體的交易完成時間以及我們能夠收回的款項金額等具體數據和數值。當然，我們的目標是最大化估值。

And we believe that the entire asset may have a better owner than us and the current owner of the syngas to methanol to other things plant. So we hope that we'll be able to find that and monetize this asset better than what we would have if we keep running these plants.

我們相信，這筆資產或許有比我們和目前擁有該合成氣製甲醇及其他產品的工廠的所有者更合適的買家。所以我們希望能夠找到合適的投資標的，並比繼續運營這些工廠更好地實現這一資產的盈利。

Eduardo. My second question is a bit of an unusual one. Would you comment on the market for rare gases, like Crypton, Xenon, Neon, are you seeing any escalation of competitive intensity in Asia? And if so, is it meaningful? Or is it simply too small to matter given the small size of those markets.

愛德華多。我的第二個問題有點特別。您能否就稀有氣體市場（如氪、氙、氖）發表評論？您是否觀察到亞洲的競爭強度加劇？如果真是如此，那它有意義嗎？或者，考慮到這些市場的規模較小，這個問題根本無關緊要。

Yes. Air Products, unfortunately, is not a big player in this market, traditionally. So it's not something that we focus a lot. We have seen some degradation in pricing and increasing in the competition level from other players. But really, it's not something that affects us that much. So I don't think I would be the right person to give you a feedback on that.

是的。遺憾的是，傳統上，空氣產品公司並不是這個市場的主要參與者。所以這不是我們重點關注的事情。我們看到價格有所下降，來自其他競爭對手的競爭程度也加劇。但實際上，這件事對我們的影響並不大。所以我覺得我可能不是給你回饋的合適人選。

Mike Sison, Wells Fargo.

麥克西森，富國銀行。

One quick one on Louisiana. If you get to partners for sequestration pneumonia who want a similar return that you would want, is there still a good return on the hydrogen that you would do longer term? I suspect that -- that's kind of what the board of partner is looking for. So maybe just flesh that out as a scenario.

簡單介紹一下路易斯安那州。如果你找到的合作夥伴在隔離性肺炎方面也希望獲得與你類似的收益，那麼從長遠來看，氫能還能帶來良好的收益嗎？我懷疑——這正是合夥人董事會所希望看到的。所以或許可以把它詳細展開成一個場景。

Every -- we are looking at this, Mike, as a normal hydrogen project for us. So we have our criteria. The customer has its own criteria. And it needs to work for both sides for the product to move forward. That is all I can tell you.

麥克，我們把這看作是一個普通的氫能計畫。所以我們有了評判標準。客戶有自己的評判標準。產品要成功推進，就必須對雙方都有利。我只能告訴你這些。

If it doesn't work for them, you're not going to work for us. And I believe there is a room today to get to the right returns. As I said, to get the right returns, you need to have a commercial negotiation on pricing, but we also need to have a firm estimate on the capital cost, and that's also part of the equation here.

如果這對他們來說行不通，你也不會為我們工作。我相信，如今仍有空間獲得理想的回報。正如我所說，為了獲得合適的收益，你需要就價格進行商業談判，但我們也需要對資本成本有一個確切的估計，這也是這裡等式的一部分。

And that will conclude the Q&A portion of today's call. I would now like to turn the call back to Eduardo Menezes for any additional or closing remarks.

今天的電話會議問答環節到此結束。現在我想把電話轉回 Eduardo Menezes，讓他補充或作總結發言。

I would like to thank everyone again for joining our call today. We appreciate your interest in Air Products, and we look forward to discuss our results with you in the next few quarters. Thank you, and have a great day. Bye.

我再次感謝大家今天參加我們的電話會議。感謝您對空氣產品公司的關注，我們期待在接下來的幾季與您討論我們的業績。謝謝，祝您今天過得愉快。再見。

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that will conclude today's call. We thank you for your participation. You may disconnect at this time.

謝謝。女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線了。