Aehr Test Systems (AEHR) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Greetings.

問候。

Welcome to the Aehr Test Systems fiscal 2025 second quarter financial results call.

歡迎參加 Aehr Test Systems 2025 財年第二季財務業績電話會議。

(Operator Instructions) Please note, this conference is being recorded.

（操作員說明）請注意，本次會議正在錄製中。

I will now turn the conference over to your host, Jim Byers of PondelWilkinson Investor Relations.

我現在將會議交給東道主、PondelWilkinson 投資者關係部的吉姆·拜爾斯 (Jim Byers)。

You may begin.

你可以開始了。

Thank you, operator.

謝謝你，接線生。

Good afternoon and welcome to Aehr Test Systems second quarter fiscal 2025 financial results conference call.

下午好，歡迎參加 Aehr Test Systems 2025 財年第二季財務業績電話會議。

With me on today's call are Aehr Test Systems' President and Chief Executive Officer, Gayn Erickson, and CFO, Chris Siu.

參加今天電話會議的有 Aehr Test Systems 總裁兼執行長 Gayn Erickson 和財務長 Chris Siu。

Before I turn the call over to Gayn and Chris, I'd like to cover a few items.

在將電話轉給蓋恩和克里斯之前，我想先介紹一些內容。

This afternoon after market close, Aehr Test issued a press release announcing its second quarter fiscal 2025 results.

今天下午收盤後，Aehr Test 發布新聞稿，宣布其 2025 財年第二季業績。

That release is available on the company's website at aehr.com. This call is being broadcast live over the Internet for all interested parties, and the webcast will be archived in the Investor Relations page of the Aehr Test website.

該版本可在該公司網站 aehr.com 上取得。此次電話會議將透過網路向所有有興趣的各方進行現場直播，網路廣播將存檔在 Aehr Test 網站的投資者關係頁面中。

I'd like to remind everyone that on today's call, management will be making forward-looking statements today that are based on current information and estimates and are subject to a number of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from those in the forward-looking statements.

我想提醒大家，在今天的電話會議上，管理層將根據當前資訊和估計做出前瞻性聲明，並受到許多風險和不確定性的影響，這些風險和不確定性可能導致實際結果與預期結果存在重大差異。

These factors that may cause results to differ materially from those in the forward-looking statements are discussed in the company's most recent periodic and current reports filed with the SEC.

這些可能導致結果與前瞻性陳述中的結果有重大差異的因素在公司向美國證券交易委員會提交的最新定期報告和當前報告中進行了討論。

These forward-looking statements, including guidance provided during today's call, are only valid as of this date and Aehr Test Systems undertakes no obligation to update the forward-looking statements.

這些前瞻性陳述，包括今天電話會議期間提供的指導，僅在當前日期有效，Aehr Test Systems 不承擔更新前瞻性陳述的義務。

Now, with that, I'd like to turn the conference call over to Gayn Erickson, President and CEO.

現在，我想將電話會議轉交給總裁兼執行長 Gayn Erickson。

Thanks, Jim.

謝謝，吉姆。

Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to our second quarter fiscal '25 earnings conference call.

大家下午好，歡迎參加我們 25 財年的第二季財報電話會議。

Thanks for joining us today.

感謝您今天加入我們。

I actually have a number of topics that I'm going to go through.

實際上我有很多主題要討論。

I'll try and get through them quickly.

我會盡力快速完成它們。

We've had a lot of inbound requests for information and to clarify all the different markets that we have been expanding into, particularly a lot of questions around the AI side.

我們收到了很多資訊請求，並澄清我們一直在拓展的所有不同市場，特別是圍繞人工智慧方面的許多問題。

So I thought I would spend a little bit of time just making sure to bring everybody up to speed and normalize what everybody understands about that.

所以我想我應該花一點時間確保讓每個人都了解情況並規範每個人對此的理解。

So bear with me as I go through this.

請耐心等待我經歷這一切。

Chris will then cover some details related to our financials, a little bit shorter than normal, to make up for my longer portion of this thing, and then we'll open up for questions.

然後克里斯將介紹一些與我們的財務相關的細節，比平常稍微短一點，以彌補我在這件事上的較長部分，然後我們將開放提問。

I'll start with a brief overview of the quarter's key highlights and share updates on the key markets we're targeting for our semiconductor test and burn-in, including notable progress in those new markets.

我將首先簡要概述本季度的主要亮點，並分享我們針對半導體測試和老化的主要市場的最新情況，包括這些新市場的顯著進展。

We're excited to share the significant progress we've made on the key objectives we outlined at the start of the fiscal year, particularly expanding our product reach into additional large and fast-growing markets.

我們很高興與大家分享我們在本財年開始時概述的關鍵目標方面取得的重大進展，特別是將我們的產品覆蓋到其他大型且快速成長的市場。

Our market diversification into sectors such as artificial intelligence processors, gallium nitride power semiconductors, data storage devices, silicon photonics integrated circuits, and flash memory is driving new opportunities to attract customers and drive revenue growth.

我們的市場多元化進入人工智慧處理器、氮化鎵功率半導體、資料儲存設備、矽光子積體電路和快閃記憶體等領域，正在推動吸引客戶和推動收入成長的新機會。

This progress includes our wafer-level burn-in solutions and also the success we're achieving with the new semiconductor packaged part test and burn-in product lines we acquired through our acquisition of Incal Technology that we closed last August.

這項進展包括我們的晶圓級老化解決方案，以及我們透過去年八月收購的 Incal Technology 獲得的新半導體封裝零件測試和老化產品線所取得的成功。

This acquisition has led to the acceleration of our market diversification, with particular success and leverage expanding our total available market in AI processors.

此次收購加速了我們的市場多元化，取得了特別的成功，並擴大了我們在人工智慧處理器領域的可用市場總量。

We're pleased to report meaningful progress in our efforts to penetrate the high-power processors market, including artificial intelligence or AI processors, graphics processor units or GPUs, and application-specific integrated circuits or ASICs, AI processors, and accelerators.

我們很高興地報告，我們在滲透高功率處理器市場方面取得了有意義的進展，包括人工智慧或 AI 處理器、圖形處理器單元或 GPU、以及專用積體電路或 ASIC、AI 處理器和加速器。

These advancements include wins in both wafer-level burn-in and packaged part burn-in applications.

這些進步包括在晶圓級老化和封裝部件老化應用中的勝利。

Let me start with our new success with the AI processors for wafer-level test and burn-in.

讓我從我們在用於晶圓級測試和老化的人工智慧處理器方面取得的新成功開始。

Last month, we were thrilled to announce a major milestone for us, securing our first AI processor customer for wafer-level burn-in.

上個月，我們很高興地宣布了一個重要的里程碑，確保我們的第一個 AI 處理器客戶能夠進行晶圓級預燒。

After successfully demonstrating the performance and throughput of our systems at our headquarters here in California, this innovative AI customer selected our new high-power FOX-XP solution for production wafer-level test and burn-in of their AI processors.

在我們位於加州的總部成功展示了我們系統的性能和吞吐量後，這位創新的AI 客戶選擇了我們全新的高功率FOX-XP 解決方案來對其AI 處理器進行生產晶圓級測試和老化。

This includes initial volume production orders for multiple high-power FOX-XP systems and our proprietary WaferPak Contactors, which enable full wafer contact for testing and burning-in of AI processors in wafer form before system integration.

這包括多個高功率FOX-XP 系統和我們專有的WaferPak 接觸器的初始批量生產訂單，這些接觸器可實現全晶圓接觸，以便在系統集成之前以晶圓形式測試和預燒AI 處理器。

This achievement represents a significant technological and commercial breakthrough for Aehr, significantly expanding the market potential for our FOX-XP wafer-level test and burn-in systems.

這項成就代表了 Aehr 的重大技術和商業突破，顯著擴大了我們的 FOX-XP 晶圓級測試和老化系統的市場潛力。

AI processor burn-in is a significant opportunity for Aehr.

AI 處理器預燒對於 Aehr 來說是一個重要的機會。

AI processors have tens of billions to even greater than 200 billion transistors on a single semiconductor die.

AI 處理器在單一半導體晶片上擁有數百億甚至超過 2000 億個電晶體。

Transistors act as the fundamental building block, functioning as an electronic switch to control the flow of electrical current, essentially representing the on and off states necessary for processing information on digital circuits, allowing for the creation of complex logic operations within a single chip by combining numerous transistors together.

電晶體充當基本構建塊，充當控制電流流動的電子開關，本質上代表處理數位電路資訊所需的開和關狀態，允許透過組合在單個晶片內創建複雜的邏輯運算許多晶體管在一起。

Large, complex processors have always been subject to the challenge of early failure rates that are higher than the application requires.

大型、複雜的處理器始終面臨早期故障率高於應用要求的挑戰。

Companies like Intel, AMD, and NVIDIA have always had many of their products, and for some companies, all of their processors require a production burn-in for screening out early failures.

像英特爾、AMD 和 NVIDIA 這樣的公司一直擁有許多產品，對於某些公司來說，他們的所有處理器都需要進行生產老化，以排除早期故障。

This is also the case for AI processors and ASICs.

AI 處理器和 ASIC 也是如此。

Companies use test and burn-in systems to qualify a new process and AI processor design to determine the device's early failure rates, intrinsic and steady-state failure rate over time, and also how long the devices will last before they begin to fail due to the end-of-life wearouts.

公司使用測試和老化系統來驗證新製程和人工智慧處理器設計，以確定設備的早期故障率、隨時間推移的固有故障率和穩態故障率，以及設備在因以下原因開始故障之前的持續時間：壽命結束時的磨損。

This is really where our acquisition of Incal plays a huge role in our strategy for AI processors, as the Sonoma ultra-high-power package for test and burn-in system is extremely good for this qualification application.

這確實是我們收購 Incal 在我們的人工智慧處理器策略中發揮巨大作用的地方，因為用於測試和老化系統的 Sonoma 超高功率套件非常適合這種資格認證應用。

I'll also talk about Sonoma in more detail later.

稍後我還將更詳細地討論索諾瑪。

During the semiconductor qualification process, customers characterize the failure rates over time for a given device and then implement a production burn-in to effectively accelerate and induce the early failures so that these devices can be screened out and not shipped to customers.

在半導體鑑定過程中，客戶描述給定設備隨時間的故障率，然後實施生產老化以有效加速和誘發早期故障，以便篩選這些設備而不將其運送給客戶。

In the case of wafer-level burn-in and screening, they can remove the devices before they're packaged with other processors in high-bandwidth DRAM memory, or HBM, into very expensive packages using substrates like CoWoS packaging from TSMC.

在晶圓級老化和篩選的情況下，他們可以在將裝置與高頻寬 DRAM 記憶體（HBM）中的其他處理器一起封裝到使用台積電 CoWoS 封裝等基板的非常昂貴的封裝中之前將其移除。

Once you understand that AI processors need production burn-in, and then you look at devices such as Hopper or Blackwell from NVIDIA, or the AMD Instinct MI325X GPU accelerator, it becomes intuitively obvious why customers would like to move this production burn-in step to wafer-level, if they can, to avoid throwing away very expensive packages and the remaining good processors in HBM.

一旦您了解 AI 處理器需要生產預燒，然後查看 NVIDIA 的 Hopper 或 Blackwell 等設備，或 AMD Instinct MI325X GPU 加速器，就會直觀地看出為什麼客戶想要移動此生產預燒步驟如果可以的話，可以達到晶圓級，以避免丟棄非常昂貴的封裝和HBM 中剩餘的良好處理器。

With Aehr providing the first-ever solution for wafer-level burn-in in an AI processor in partnership with this customer and their outsourced assembly and test, or OSAT, partner, we have shown that our high-power FOX-XP multiwafer systems and proprietary WaferPak Contactors can be a viable solution for testing and burn-in of AI processors in wafer form to avoid having to burn-in these devices in package or system form, where the cost of test and the cost of yield loss due to failing devices during burn-in is much more expensive and impactful to overall manufacturing yield.

隨著Aehr 與該客戶及其外包組裝和測試（OSAT）合作夥伴合作，為AI 處理器中的晶圓級預燒提供了首個解決方案，我們已經證明，我們的高功率FOX-XP 多晶圓系統和專有的WaferPak 接觸器可以成為測試和老化晶圓形式的AI 處理器的可行解決方案，以避免必須以封裝或系統形式老化這些設備，其中測試成本以及因故障設備而導致的良率損失成本老化期間的成本要高得多，並且對整體製造產量有影響。

We've already shown the solution working at our facility in California, and we'll begin shipping the production systems and WaferPaks already this month.

我們已經在加州的工廠展示了該解決方案的運作情況，並且我們將於本月開始運送生產系統和 WaferPaks。

The systems will have a very visible footprint at the OSAT they will be installed and used at, and we're working together on marketing this wafer-level production burn-in capability to other AI processor suppliers in partnership with this OSAT as I speak.

這些系統將在安裝和使用的 OSAT 上佔據非常明顯的位置，正如我所說，我們正在與該 OSAT 合作，共同向其他人工智慧處理器供應商推銷這種晶圓級生產預燒功能。

Now let me turn to the packaged part test and burn-in level of AI processors using our new Sonoma system.

現在讓我談談使用我們新的 Sonoma 系統進行的封裝零件測試和 AI 處理器的老化程度。

During the second quarter, we secured our first production AI processor customer for packaged part burn-in, receiving initial volume production orders for multiple Sonoma ultra-high-power systems.

在第二季度，我們獲得了第一個用於封裝零件老化的生產人工智慧處理器客戶，並收到了多個索諾瑪超高功率系統的初始批量生產訂單。

This customer is a large-scale data center hyperscaler, providing computing power and storage capacity to millions of individuals and organizations worldwide.

該客戶是一家大型資料中心超大規模供應商，為全球數百萬個個人和組織提供運算能力和儲存容量。

System shipments have already commenced to their OSAT contract manufacturer, doing test and burn-in for them in Asia.

該系統已開始向其 OSAT 合約製造商發貨，並在亞洲為他們進行測試和老化。

Again, this is for production burn-in screening of all devices shipped to screen out early failures.

同樣，這是為了對所有發貨的設備進行生產老化篩選，以篩選出早期故障。

This customer was and continues to use the Sonoma system for process and device qualification, as I detailed a few minutes ago.

正如我在幾分鐘前詳細介紹的那樣，該客戶曾經並將繼續使用索諾瑪系統進行工藝和設備鑑定。

The Sonoma system is a system that combines high parallelism of ultra-high-power devices under tests, or DUTs, with very high-current, high-performance power supplies that allow many voltage zones ranging from multiple core power zones to many other lower power zones on the same device, very flexible digital test resources per device, individually controlled liquid cooling of each device under test, and what we feel is the world's best software and user interface for device testing and debug for device qualification and reliability testing and

Sonoma 系統是一個將超高功率被測元件(DUT) 的高度並行性與極高電流、高效能電源結合的系統，該電源允許多個電壓區域，範圍從多個核心功率區域到許多其他較低功率區域同一設備上的多個區域，每個設備非常靈活的數位測試資源，每個被測設備的單獨控制液體冷卻，以及我們認為是世界上最好的用於設備測試和調試的軟體和使用者介面，用於設備資格和可靠性測試和

[bring-up].

[提出]。

I have personally heard from multiple customers that they often use the Sonoma system to debug the test patterns of their devices and use this data to feed back to their multi-million dollar ATE systems from the likes of Advantest and Teradyne.

我個人從多個客戶那裡聽說，他們經常使用 Sonoma 系統來調試其設備的測試模式，並使用這些數據反饋到 Advantest 和 Teradyne 等公司價值數百萬美元的 ATE 系統。

We have a large and growing installed base of Sonoma systems around the world at test labs, OSATs, and IDMs used for this qualification and reliability testing of new devices and semiconductor process nodes.

我們在世界各地的測試實驗室、OSAT 和 IDM 中擁有龐大且不斷增長的 Sonoma 系統安裝基礎，用於新裝置和半導體製程節點的資格和可靠性測試。

What is new is this is the first customer, and it's a large one, that is purchasing Sonoma for their volume production needs for test and burn-in of their AI processors.

新鮮的是，這是第一個客戶，而且是一個大客戶，購買索諾瑪是為了滿足其人工智慧處理器測試和老化的大量生產需求。

This is an area where the combination of Incal and Aehr was very well received by customers, as Incal simply did not have the support infrastructure worldwide as Aehr does to support the needs of production customers, nor did they have the manufacturing capacity that we do to build a large number of systems for production customers.

在這個領域，Incal 和 Aehr 的結合深受客戶歡迎，因為 Incal 根本沒有像 Aehr 那樣在全球範圍內擁有支援生產客戶需求的基礎設施，而且他們也沒有我們那樣的製造能力來滿足生產客戶的需求。為生產客戶建構大量系統。

We see significant potential to expand our packaged part test and burn-in business in the rapidly growing AI semiconductor market with our ultra-high-power Sonoma product line and already have a team working on multiple enhancements to address both qualification and production test and burn-in needs of a wide range of AI processor suppliers, test labs, and OSATs.

我們看到，憑藉我們的超高功率索諾瑪產品線，在快速成長的人工智慧半導體市場中擴展我們的封裝零件測試和老化業務的巨大潛力，並且已經擁有一個團隊致力於多項增強功能，以解決資格認證和生產測試和老化問題-滿足廣泛的人工智慧處理器供應商、測試實驗室和 OSAT 的需求。

Aehr is now able to offer our customers both the ability to do production wafer level burn-in of their AI processors and accelerators, as well as reliability qualification and production burn-in at the packaged part level with our Sonoma system.

Aehr 現在能夠為我們的客戶提供對其 AI 處理器和加速器進行晶圓級生產預燒的能力，以及使用我們的 Sonoma 系統在封裝部件級別進行可靠性鑑定和生產預燒的能力。

Aehr Test Systems is the only company in the world offering the flexibility to customers of both wafer level and package level test and burn-in solutions for AI processors.

Aehr Test Systems 是全球唯一為 AI 處理器的晶圓級和封裝級測試及老化解決方案客戶提供靈活性的公司。

We estimate that the combined market for wafer level and packaged part reliability test and production burn-in of AI processors will surpass $100 million annually in the future.

我們估計，未來人工智慧處理器的晶圓級和封裝件可靠性測試以及生產老化的綜合市場每年將超過 1 億美元。

The AI semiconductor processor market is growing very fast.

AI半導體處理器市場成長非常快。

According to the SNS Insider, the AI chip market size was valued at over $60 billion in 2023 and is expected to grow to over $600 billion by 2032, a 10x increase and a CAGR of almost 30% over that period.

根據 SNS Insider 報導，2023 年 AI 晶片市場規模將超過 600 億美元，預計到 2032 年將成長到 6,000 億美元以上，成長 10 倍，同期複合年增長率近 30%。

The types of processors and applications for AI processors or processors with AI focus is also expanding rapidly from the historical general-purpose GPU-based processors used for LLM generation and inference to application-specific integrated circuits aimed at specific accelerator functions in data centers and hyperscalers and edge AI processor used in autonomous vehicles, robotics, and security.

AI處理器或專注於AI的處理器的處理器和應用類型也在迅速擴展，從歷史上用於LLM生成和推理的基於GPU的通用處理器，擴展到針對資料中心和超大規模企業中特定加速器功能的專用積體電路用於自動駕駛汽車、機器人和安全的邊緣人工智慧處理器。

These devices and their applications demand extremely high quality, reliability, and security.

這些設備及其應用需要極高的品質、可靠性和安全性。

With our comprehensive product portfolio for reliability test and burn-in of AI semiconductors, we feel Aehr is poised to capture a meaningful share of this market.

憑藉我們用於人工智慧半導體可靠性測試和老化的全面產品組合，我們認為 Aehr 已準備好佔領該市場的重要份額。

Now let me talk about the expansion into our gallium nitride market.

現在讓我來談談我們氮化鎵市場的拓展。

Last week we were excited to announce another exciting milestone with our first gallium nitride, or GaN, semiconductor production order.

上週，我們很高興地宣布了我們的第一個氮化鎵（GaN）半導體生產訂單的另一個令人興奮的里程碑。

This customer is a leading automotive semiconductor supplier and a key player in the gallium nitride power semiconductor market.

該客戶是一家領先的汽車半導體供應商，也是氮化鎵功率半導體市場的關鍵參與者。

We're thrilled to have received their initial production purchase order marking their commitment to advancing volume production, wafer-level burn-in in other GaN devices using our FOX-XP platform.

我們很高興收到他們的初始生產採購訂單，這標誌著他們致力於使用我們的 FOX-XP 平台來推進其他 GaN 裝置的批量生產和晶圓級預燒。

This achievement expands our production wafer-level burn-in market for power semiconductors beyond silicon carbide applications used in electric vehicles, data center power conversion, and solar to now include GaN, a high-performance compound semiconductor optimized for mid-power applications such as data centers, solar energy, automotive systems, and consumer electronics and PCs.

這項成就擴大了我們的功率半導體生產晶圓級老化市場，超越了電動車、資料中心功率轉換和太陽能中使用的碳化矽應用，現在包括GaN，這是一種針對中等功率應用進行優化的高性能化合物半導體，例如資料中心、太陽能、汽車系統以及消費性電子產品和個人電腦。

Over the past 12 months we've collaborated with this lead customer using our FOX-NP system leading to their purchase of multiple WaferPak reference designs on a diverse set of GaN applications.

在過去 12 個月中，我們與該主要客戶合作，使用我們的 FOX-NP 系統，導致他們購買了針對各種 GaN 應用的多個 WaferPak 參考設計。

GaN offers a much broader application range than silicon carbide and is poised for significant growth in the coming decade.

GaN 的應用範圍比碳化矽廣泛得多，並且有望在未來十年內實現顯著增長。

While the largest market segment for silicon carbide, about 70%, is for the electric vehicle and EV charging infrastructure markets, GaN is very diversified and is not dominated by EVs or autos.

雖然碳化矽最大的細分市場（約 70%）是電動車和電動車充電基礎設施市場，但氮化鎵非常多元化，並非以電動車或汽車為主。

With many more end-use applications, there are many more customers and broader market for GaN semiconductor suppliers than for SiC with our fewer EV and charging customers, but are at higher volume per customer than the average customer for GaN suppliers.

與SiC 相比，GaN 半導體供應商擁有更多的最終用途應用，擁有更多的客戶和更廣泛的市場，而我們的電動車和充電客戶較少，但每位客戶的銷售量高於GaN 供應商的平均客戶。

With an expected compound annual growth rate, CAGR, exceeding 40%, the GaN market is projected to surpass $2 billion in annual device sales by 2029, according to Yole Group.

Yole Group 表示，預計 GaN 市場的複合年增長率 (CAGR) 將超過 40%，到 2029 年，裝置年銷售額預計將超過 20 億美元。

Additionally, Frost & Sullivan estimates GaN semiconductors will account for over 10% of the worldwide power semiconductor as soon as 2028.

此外，Frost & Sullivan 預計，最快到 2028 年，GaN 半導體將佔全球功率半導體的 10% 以上。

This transformative technology represents a significant growth opportunity for Aehr's wafer-level test systems and WaferPak full wafer contactor, positioning us to capitalize in the expansion of the GaN market.

這項變革性技術為 Aehr 的晶圓級測試系統和 WaferPak 全晶圓接觸器帶來了重大的成長機會，使我們能夠充分利用 GaN 市場的擴張。

My next topic is silicon photonics which continues to show signs of market adoption for chip-to-chip communication and for optical networking switching.

我的下一個主題是矽光子學，它繼續顯示出晶片間通訊和光網路交換市場採用的跡象。

We remain very enthusiastic about the silicon photonics market, particularly for the new application of silicon photonics integrated circuits for use in optical chip-to-chip communication that we see as a significant market opportunity for our products.

我們對矽光子市場仍然充滿熱情，特別是矽光子積體電路在光學晶片到晶片通訊的新應用，我們認為這對我們的產品來說是一個重要的市場機會。

Last year we shipped a new high-power configuration of our FOX-XP system to our lead customer for a new family of silicon photonics integrated circuits aimed at optical chip-to-chip communication.

去年，我們向我們的主要客戶提供了新的高功率配置的 FOX-XP 系統，用於針對光學晶片到晶片通訊的新矽光子積體電路系列。

This system with our proprietary WaferPak full wafer contactors allows for testing over 8,000 high power optical devices in parallel on each of nine wafers before they're singulated and placed into a fiber optic transceiver for data center and telecommunications infrastructure or for placement in co-packaged optics for optical chip-to-chip communication.

該系統配備我們專有的WaferPak 全晶圓接觸器，可以在9 個晶圓中的每一個上並行測試8,000 多個高功率光學器件，然後將它們分割並放置到用於資料中心和電信基礎設施的光纖收發器中或放置在共同封裝中用於光學晶片到晶片通訊的光學元件。

Multiple companies including AMD, NVIDIA, Intel, TSMC, and GlobalFoundries have announced product roadmaps for devices using optical chip-to-chip communication with new announcements in just the last week coming out of Taiwan on new silicon photonics based ICs by TSMC and NVIDIA.

AMD、NVIDIA、英特爾、台積電和 GlobalFoundries 等多家公司宣布了使用光學晶片間通訊的設備的產品路線圖，並於上週在台灣發布了台積電和 NVIDIA 推出的基於矽光子的新型 IC 的新公告。

The new FOX-XP system configuration with higher power WaferPaks enables production tests of up to 3,500 watts of power per wafer and up to nine full wafers in parallel.

配備更高功率 WaferPaks 的全新 FOX-XP 系統配置可實現每片晶圓高達 3,500 瓦功率和最多 9 個完整晶圓的平行生產測試。

It also includes Aehr Test's latest chamber configuration which has a smaller overall footprint and is compatible with Aehr's new WaferPak auto aligner that provides Aehr customers with fully automated material handling and hands-free operation of 6-to-12-inch wafers using industry standard wafer cassettes and foups and can also support mobile robot and overhead transfers of wafers in those foups.

它還包括Aehr Test 最新的腔室配置，該配置具有更小的整體佔地面積，並與Aehr 的新型WaferPak 自動對準器兼容，為Aehr 客戶提供全自動材料處理和使用行業標準晶圓的6至12 吋晶圓的免持操作晶圓盒和開合器，還可以支援移動機器人和這些開合器中晶圓的高架傳輸。

This is a system that we leverage for the production system for wafer-level burn-in of AI processors as well.

我們也將這個系統用於人工智慧處理器晶圓級預燒的生產系統。

We've designed a new -- a number of new WaferPaks for engineering and initial samples for this lead customer of our high-power silicon photonics solution this fiscal year.

我們在本財年為我們的高功率矽光子解決方案的主要客戶設計了一系列用於工程和初始樣品的新 WaferPaks。

These are very impressive devices with significant improvements in size, power, and data rates that we feel are likely to ramp to production in time to address the chip-to-chip optical communications market opportunity.

這些是非常令人印象深刻的設備，在尺寸、功率和數據速率方面都有顯著改進，我們認為它們可能會及時投入生產，以抓住晶片到晶片光通訊市場的機會。

The hard disk drive market is another opportunity for Aehr's wafer level test and burn-in systems, and we're excited about our opportunity for production burn-in and stabilization of devices used in hard disk drives using our FOX-CP systems and WaferPak Contactors.

硬碟市場是 Aehr 晶圓級測試和老化系統的另一個機會，我們對使用我們的 FOX-CP 系統和 WaferPak 接觸器進行硬碟中使用的設備進行生產老化和穩定的機會感到興奮。

Our lead customer for this application is ramping this year and has told us they will purchase multiple production systems from us over the next few quarters to support their planned production rollout and ramp.

我們該應用程式的主要客戶今年正在擴大規模，並告訴我們他們將在接下來的幾個季度從我們這裡購買多個生產系統，以支援他們計劃的生產部署和擴大。

This customer, first announced back in 2019 prior to the COVID-19 pandemic, initially purchased our FOX-CP single wafer test and burn-in solution to support the qualification and early test stages of this new product aimed at the enterprise and data center markets.

該客戶於2019 年COVID-19 大流行之前首次宣布，最初購買了我們的FOX-CP 單晶圓測試和老化解決方案，以支持這款針對企業和數據中心市場的新產品的資格認證和早期測試階段。

We view the data storage market both for hard disk drives and flash-based semiconductor solid-state disk drives as significant growth opportunities for our systems.

我們將硬碟和基於快閃記憶體的半導體固態磁碟機的資料儲存市場視為我們系統的重大成長機會。

These markets have applications with devices made up of multiple die in complex structures or in multiple die stacked on top of each other before they are put into higher level packages or systems.

這些市場的應用包括由複雜結構的多個晶片或彼此堆疊的多個晶片組成的設備，然後再將其放入更高級別的封裝或系統中。

These devices require exceptionally high levels of quality and long-term reliability of the die before they are put into the packages or systems which aligns perfectly with the capabilities of our wafer-level test and burn-in systems.

這些設備在放入封裝或系統之前需要極高的晶片品質和長期可靠性，這與我們的晶圓級測試和老化系統的功能完美契合。

And speaking of solid-state disk drives and NAND flash memory, we're making steady progress on our ongoing benchmarking project with a major flash memory supplier to evaluate the benefits of using our FOX-XP solution for wafer level test and burn-in other flash memory devices.

說到固態磁碟機和 NAND 快閃記憶體，我們正在與一家主要快閃記憶體供應商進行的基準測試專案取得穩步進展，以評估使用我們的 FOX-XP 解決方案進行晶圓級測試和老化測試的優勢快閃記憶體設備。

This application is for 100% test and burn-in of devices to be used in mission-critical applications such as enterprise storage.

該應用程式用於對企業儲存等關鍵任務應用程式中使用的設備進行 100% 測試和老化。

As part of this evaluation, we're advancing the development of a low-cost, high pin count, fine pitch MEMS-based WaferPak for full wafer contact to all NAND devices on a 300-millimeter wafer, including support for high-density 3D NAND technology supporting up to greater than 200 layers.

作為本評估的一部分，我們正在推進低成本、高引腳數、基於MEMS 的細間距WaferPak 的開發，用於與300 毫米晶圓上的所有NAND 裝置進行全晶圓接觸，包括對高密度3D的支援NAND 技術支援多達 200 層以上。

One of the key challenges with addressing the new devices on customers' NAND roadmap is that not only is there a significantly higher number of die per wafer, but the power per die and therefore power per wafer to test these wafers has increased significantly.

解決客戶NAND 路線圖上的新設備的關鍵挑戰之一是，不僅每個晶圓的晶片數量顯著增加，而且每個晶片的功率以及測試這些晶圓的每個晶圓的功率也顯著增加。

Support for high-power wafer testing is something that Aehr is particularly good at with our FOX-XP multi-wafer test and burn-in systems and WaferPaks.

Aehr 的 FOX-XP 多晶圓測試和老化系統以及 WaferPaks 特別擅長支援高功率晶圓測試。

This new WaferPak design is also capable to support DRAM testing should customers choose to pursue DRAM burn-in in the future.

如果客戶未來選擇進行 DRAM 預燒，這種新的 WaferPak 設計也能夠支援 DRAM 測試。

We aim to complete the proof-of-concept phase in a few months, enabling us to advance this benchmark to either a production solution evaluation or secure a commitment from the customer to develop a production test cell.

我們的目標是在幾個月內完成概念驗證階段，使我們能夠將該基準推進到生產解決方案評估或確保客戶承諾開發生產測試單元。

This would position us to generate our first revenue from this NAND opportunity as early as our next fiscal year.

這將使我們能夠在下一個財年最早從這個 NAND 機會中獲得第一筆收入。

We believe this represents the leading edge of a significant opportunity for our solutions for semiconductor memories, with the NAND flash market being the key initial focus.

我們相信，這代表了我們的半導體記憶體解決方案的重大機遇，其中 NAND 快閃記憶體市場是最初的重點。

Looking ahead, we see long-term potential to expand the DRAM wafer-level test and burn-in, further broadening our market reach.

展望未來，我們看到擴大 DRAM 晶圓級測試和老化的長期潛力，進一步擴大我們的市場範圍。

So you'll notice that I led with the new market opportunities, but we'll now provide an update on silicon carbide wafer-level test and burn-in, a market that in fact was almost 90% of Aehr's revenue last year.

因此，您會注意到，我引領了新的市場機會，但我們現在將提供有關碳化矽晶圓級測試和老化的最新信息，該市場實際上幾乎佔 Aehr 去年收入的 90%。

Aehr also continues to expand its presence in silicon carbide power semiconductor market, a critical sector for power conversion for electric vehicle traction inverters, charging infrastructure, and a range of industrial, data center, and infrastructure applications.

Aehr 也持續擴大其在碳化矽功率半導體市場的影響力，該市場是電動車牽引逆變器、充電基礎設施以及一系列工業、資料中心和基礎設施應用的功率轉換的關鍵領域。

Based on recent market forecasts and large suppliers of silicon carbide semiconductors, growth in silicon carbide sales outside of China should remain challenging before recovering in calendar 2026.

根據最近的市場預測和碳化矽半導體大型供應商的預測，在 2026 年恢復之前，中國以外的碳化矽銷售成長仍將面臨挑戰。

We believe we're well positioned in this market as we have a large customer base and are currently engaged in benchmarking efforts with multiple potential new silicon carbide customers around the globe, including in China.

我們相信，我們在這個市場中處於有利地位，因為我們擁有龐大的客戶群，目前正在與全球（包括中國）多個潛在的新碳化矽客戶進行基準測試。

While we remain cautiously optimistic about the opportunities in China, we also recognize the geopolitical, trade, and intellectual property risks associated with this market.

儘管我們對中國的機會保持謹慎樂觀，但我們也認識到與該市場相關的地緣政治、貿易和智慧財產權風險。

Recently, we filed a lawsuit in China against a local supplier for intellectual property infringement.

最近，我們在中國對一家當地供應商提起智慧財產權侵權訴訟。

This action relates to features of products by that company targeted at wafer-level burn-in in silicon carbide devices that we believe infringe on Aehr's intellectual property and patents granted to Aehr by the Chinese Patent Office.

這項訴訟涉及該公司針對碳化矽元件晶圓級預燒的產品特徵，我們認為這些產品侵犯了 Aehr 的智慧財產權以及中國專利局授予 Aehr 的專利。

Our current fiscal year forecast includes contemplated orders and revenue yet to be booked for silicon carbide wafer-level burn-in systems and WaferPaks destined for silicon carbide manufacturers in China.

我們目前財年的預測包括預計為中國碳化矽製造商預定的碳化矽晶圓級老化系統和 WaferPaks 訂單和尚未預訂的收入。

It is important to bring this to our shareholders' attention as recent trade-related developments in the US and the emergence of competitive offerings in China that we believe infringe on our intellectual property have heightened the risk associated with bookings and revenue from Chinese customers.

重要的是要讓我們的股東注意這一點，因為美國最近與貿易相關的發展以及中國出現的競爭性產品（我們認為侵犯了我們的知識產權）增加了與中國客戶的預訂和收入相關的風險。

As we look at the composition of our total revenue for this fiscal year, silicon carbide is expected to account for less than half of our total revenue as we've seen our expansion into additional other markets capture real market share gains.

當我們審視本財年總收入的組成時，碳化矽預計將占我們總收入的一半以下，因為我們已經看到我們向其他市場的擴張獲得了真正的市場份額收益。

AI processors, including wafer-level and packaged parts, could comprise as much as 40% of our total revenue this fiscal year, up from effectively zero revenue last year.

AI 處理器（包括晶圓級和封裝零件）可能占我們本財年總收入的 40%，而去年的收入實際上為零。

GaN, hard disk drives, silicon photonics integrated circuits, and other semiconductor packaged part revenues will comprise about another 20% of revenue.

GaN、硬碟、矽光子積體電路和其他半導體封裝零件收入將佔收入的另外 20% 左右。

We're not pivoting away from silicon carbide, but rather are generating what we see are the growth in the other market opportunities while not seeing the growth in silicon carbide this year like we saw last year.

我們並沒有放棄碳化矽，而是正在創造我們所看到的其他市場機會的成長，同時不會像去年那樣看到碳化矽的成長。

According to recent market research from companies such as Yole, the estimated revenue for silicon carbide semiconductors in 2024 was around $2.5 billion and expected to reach $10 billion by the end of the decade, a 4x increase.

根據 Yole 等公司最近的市場研究，預計 2024 年碳化矽半導體收入約為 25 億美元，預計到本世紀末將達到 100 億美元，成長 4 倍。

To put this into perspective, the semiconductor market is projected to grow from about $600 billion overall in '24 to over $1 trillion by the end of this decade.

從這個角度來看，半導體市場預計將從 20 世紀 24 年的約 6,000 億美元增長到本十年末的超過 1 兆美元。

So silicon carbide will be about 1% of the overall semiconductor market by 2030.

因此，到 2030 年，碳化矽將佔整個半導體市場的 1% 左右。

Aehr's innovative solutions are poised to capitalize on this growth in the overall semiconductor market by addressing the critical reliability needs of next-generation applications and leveraging key megatrends shaping the semiconductor industry.

Aehr 的創新解決方案準備透過滿足下一代應用的關鍵可靠性需求並利用塑造半導體產業的關鍵大趨勢，充分利用整個半導體市場的成長。

Reliability has become a critical priority across a wide range of industries, including combustion and electric vehicles, data centers, electrification of the world's infrastructure, and a wide range of artificial intelligence applications.

可靠性已成為許多行業的首要任務，包括內燃機和電動車、資料中心、世界基礎設施的電氣化以及廣泛的人工智慧應用。

Factors such as smaller semiconductor geometries, the increase in adoption of compound and optical semiconductors, and the complexities of ensuring semiconductor reliability on ever-increasing power and performance of semiconductors and advanced packaging are driving the demand for wafer-level and packaged part test and burn-in systems.

較小的半導體幾何形狀、化合物和光學半導體的採用增加以及在半導體功率和性能不斷提高以及先進封裝的情況下確保半導體可靠性的複雜性等因素正在推動對晶圓級和封裝部件測試和刻錄的需求- 在系統中。

Aehr's solutions are instrumental in reducing early operational failures and ensuring long-term device performance in these rapidly advancing markets.

Aehr 的解決方案有助於減少早期運作故障並確保這些快速發展的市場中的長期設備性能。

With strong customer engagements, expanding market opportunities, and innovative products designed to meet evolving demands, we're optimistic as we move into the second half of our fiscal year and maintain our previously stated financial guidance for the fiscal year.

憑藉強大的客戶參與度、不斷擴大的市場機會以及旨在滿足不斷變化的需求的創新產品，我們對進入本財年下半年並維持之前規定的本財年財務指引持樂觀態度。

As we've stated before, though, given the nature of our business, with our high average selling prices of a single production system and a set of WaferPaks, our quarterly revenue can experience significant variability if system orders anticipated by the quarter end are delayed by even a few days.

不過，正如我們之前所說，鑑於我們的業務性質，單一生產系統和一組 WaferPaks 的平均售價較高，如果季度末預期的系統訂單延遲，我們的季度收入可能會出現顯著變化甚至幾天。

This was the case in last quarter and one of the key reasons we do not provide quarterly guidance.

上個季度就是這種情況，也是我們不提供季度指引的主要原因之一。

In the case of both our new GaN and wafer-level AI customers, both requested us to prebuild systems that we fully expected to ship to them within the quarter.

對於我們的新 GaN 和晶圓級 AI 客戶來說，他們都要求我們預先建造系統，我們完全希望在本季度內向他們發貨。

However, the purchase orders were not finalized until after the quarter ended.

然而，採購訂單直到本季結束後才最終確定。

Looking ahead and above the quarter-to-quarter variations, we're excited about the current and emerging market opportunities for our products, which not only position us for a successful fiscal year, but also lay a solid foundation for long-term sustainable growth in years ahead.

展望未來，超越季度與季度的變化，我們對我們產品的當前和新興市場機會感到興奮，這不僅為我們成功的財年奠定了基礎，而且為長期可持續增長奠定了堅實的基礎未來幾年。

Lastly, and before I turn it over to Chris, it's with great sadness that we acknowledge the passing of Avi Ray-Chaudhuri, our EVP of Research and Development, who lost his battle with cancer last month.

最後，在我將其交給 Chris 之前，我們非常悲傷地承認我們的研發執行副總裁 Avi Ray-Chaudhuri 的去世，他上個月在與癌症的鬥爭中失敗了。

On behalf of everyone at Aehr Test, we extend our deepest sympathies to his family.

我們代表 Aehr Test 的所有人，向他的家人致以最深切的同情。

Avi's friendship, leadership, and the tremendous contribution to Aehr Test will always be remembered and cherished.

Avi 的友誼、領導能力以及對 Aehr Test 的巨大貢獻將永遠被銘記和珍惜。

It was an honor to work alongside Avi and he'll be deeply missed.

與阿維一起工作是我的榮幸，我們將深深懷念他。

In the interim, Don Richmond, our CTO, who previously held this role before Avi joined us a 1.5 year ago, has stepped in and assumed Avi's responsibilities at Aehr and would continue in this capacity until further notice.

在此期間，我們的 CTO Don Richmond 介入並承擔了 Avi 在 Aehr 的職責，他在 1.5 年前 Avi 加入我們之前擔任過這一職務，並將繼續擔任這一職務，直至另行通知。

With that, let me turn it over to Chris and then we'll open up the lines for questions.

接下來，讓我將其轉交給克里斯，然後我們將開放提問線。

Thank you, Gayn.

謝謝你，蓋恩。

Good afternoon, everyone.

大家下午好。

The company recognized bookings of $9.2 million in the second quarter of fiscal 2025 compared to $16.7 million in the first quarter of fiscal 2025.

該公司在 2025 財年第二季確認的預訂額為 920 萬美元，而 2025 財年第一季的預訂額為 1,670 萬美元。

At the end of the quarter, our backlog was $12.4 million.

截至本季末，我們的積壓訂單為 1,240 萬美元。

In the first six weeks of the third quarter of fiscal 2025, we received $14.2 million in additional bookings.

在 2025 財年第三季的前六週，我們收到了 1,420 萬美元的額外預訂。

This growth was driven primarily by the first AI processor customer utilizing our high-power FOX-XP solution for wafer-level production tests and burn-in of AI processors, which we announced in December.

這一增長主要是由於我們在 12 月宣布的第一個 AI 處理器客戶利用我們的高功率 FOX-XP 解決方案進行晶圓級生產測試和 AI 處理器的老化。

With this recent bookings, our effective backlog has now reached $26.6 million.

透過最近的預訂，我們的有效積壓訂單現已達到 2,660 萬美元。

Turning to our Q2 performance, which included a full quarter of the financial results from the Incal acquisition.

談到我們第二季的業績，其中包括收購 Incal 的整個季度的財務業績。

We faced a challenging environment due to overall softness in the silicon carbide-powered semiconductor market.

由於碳化矽驅動的半導體市場整體疲軟，我們面臨著充滿挑戰的環境。

Second quarter revenue totaled $13.5 million, a 37% decline compared to $21.4 million in Q2 last year.

第二季營收總計 1,350 萬美元，比去年第二季的 2,140 萬美元下降 37%。

A significant portion of this revenue was driven by demand for our WaferPaks and Sonoma ultra-high-power systems acquired from the Incal acquisition, which support high-volume production test and burn-in of AI processors.

該收入的很大一部分是由對 Incal 收購中獲得的 WaferPaks 和 Sonoma 超高功率系統的需求推動的，這些系統支援 AI 處理器的大量生產測試和老化。

WaferPak revenues came in at $8.6 million, accounting for 64% of our total revenue in the second quarter, an increase from 43% in the same period last year.

WaferPak 營收為 860 萬美元，佔第二季總營收的 64%，高於去年同期的 43%。

This highlights the important role of our WaferPaks as a key source of recurring revenue for our business.

這凸顯了我們的 WaferPaks 作為我們業務的主要經常性收入來源的重要角色。

Additionally, system sales from our Sonoma and [Tahoe] packaged part burn-in products made a substantial contribution to our second quarter revenue.

此外，我們的 Sonoma 和 [Tahoe] 封裝零件老化產品的系統銷售對我們第二季的收入做出了重大貢獻。

We are excited to see the significant progress we made to incorporate the Incal products into our product portfolio to address the AI market opportunities.

我們很高興看到我們在將 Incal 產品納入我們的產品組合以應對人工智慧市場機會方面取得了重大進展。

We believe our strategy to expand Aehr's product offerings to diversify into sectors beyond silicon carbide applications, such as AI, gallium nitride power conversion, and other sectors, will drive revenue growth in the future.

我們相信，我們擴大 Aehr 產品供應以多元化進入碳化矽應用以外的領域（例如人工智慧、氮化鎵功率轉換和其他領域）的策略將推動未來的收入成長。

Non-GAAP gross margin for the second quarter was 45.3% compared to 51.6% in the same period last year.

第二季非公認會計準則毛利率為 45.3%，去年同期為 51.6%。

The decline was primarily due to a lower overall revenue level compared to Q2 last year, partially offset by a favorable product mix of higher-margin WaferPaks.

下降的主要原因是與去年第二季度相比整體收入水平較低，但部分被利潤率較高的 WaferPaks 的有利產品組合所抵消。

Non-GAAP operating expenses in the second quarter were $5.9 million, a 19% increase from $5 million in Q2 last year.

第二季非 GAAP 營運費用為 590 萬美元，比去年第二季的 500 萬美元成長 19%。

The year-over-year increase is primarily due to incorporating a full quarter of Incal's operating expenses into our financial results, as well as higher legal and professional services fees.

年比成長主要是由於將 Incal 整個季度的營運費用納入我們的財務業績，以及更高的法律和專業服務費用。

We expect to incur higher legal fees in the next few quarters as we vigorously protect our intellectual property rights in China and defend the class action and derivative complaints in the United States.

由於我們在中國大力保護我們的智慧財產權，並在美國為集體訴訟和派生訴訟進行辯護，因此我們預計未來幾季將產生更高的法律費用。

In Q2, we recorded income tax benefits, totaling $217,000.

第二季度，我們記錄了總計 217,000 美元的所得稅優惠。

Non-GAAP net income for the second quarter, which excludes the impact of stock-based compensation, acquisition-related costs, the acquisition-related fair value adjustment to inventory, and the amortization of intangible assets, was $0.7 million, or $0.02 per diluted share for the second quarter.

第二季度非公認會計準則淨利潤為 70 萬美元，每股攤薄收益 0.02 美元，其中不包括基於股票的薪酬、收購相關成本、收購相關的庫存公允價值調整以及無形資產攤銷的影響第二季度的份額。

This compares to non-GAAP net income of $6.7 million, or $0.23 per diluted share, in the second quarter of fiscal 2024.

相比之下，2024 財年第二季非 GAAP 淨利為 670 萬美元，即稀釋後每股收益 0.23 美元。

Now turning to the balance sheet.

現在轉向資產負債表。

At the end of Q2, our cash, cash equivalents, and restricted cash totaled $35.2 million, down from $40.8 million at the end of Q1.

第二季末，我們的現金、現金等價物和限制性現金總計 3,520 萬美元，低於第一季末的 4,080 萬美元。

During the quarter, we used $5.9 million in operating cash flows, primarily to pay our suppliers and service providers.

本季度，我們使用了 590 萬美元的營運現金流，主要用於支付我們的供應商和服務提供者的費用。

With a strong balance sheet, we continue to invest in scaling our business and pursuing new market opportunities.

憑藉強勁的資產負債表，我們繼續投資擴大業務並尋求新的市場機會。

We have no debt and continue to allocate excess cash to money market funds.

我們沒有債務，並繼續將多餘的現金分配給貨幣市場基金。

In the second quarter, we earned $228,000 in interest income.

第二季度，我們獲得了 228,000 美元的利息收入。

On October 15, 2024, we filed a new S-3 Registration Statement with the Securities and Exchange Commission to support potential future financing needs.

2024 年 10 月 15 日，我們向美國證券交易委員會提交了新的 S-3 註冊聲明，以支持未來潛在的融資需求。

The new S-3 shelf filing for $100 million was approved by the SEC on October 25, and it's good for three years.

價值 1 億美元的新 S-3 擱置申請已於 10 月 25 日獲得 SEC 批准，有效期為三年。

Looking ahead to the remainder of fiscal 2025, which ends on May 30, 2025, we are reaffirming our previously provided guidance.

展望 2025 財年剩餘時間（即 2025 年 5 月 30 日結束），我們重申先前提供的指導。

As Gayn noted, we expect total revenue of at least $70 million with a non-GAAP net profit before taxes of no less than 10% of revenue.

正如 Gayn 指出的，我們預計總收入至少​​為 7000 萬美元，非 GAAP 稅前淨利潤不少於收入的 10%。

Lastly, looking at the Investor Relations calendar, Aehr Test will be participating virtually in the Needham Growth Conference on Thursday, January 16, 2025.

最後，查看投資者關係日曆，Aehr Test 將虛擬參加 2025 年 1 月 16 日星期四舉行的 Needham 成長會議。

We look forward to connecting with many of you during this event.

我們期待在這次活動中與你們中的許多人建立聯繫。

This concludes our prepared remarks.

我們準備好的演講到此結束。

We're now ready to take your questions.

我們現在準備好回答您的問題。

Operator, please go ahead.

接線員，請繼續。

(Operator Instructions) Christian Schwab, Craig-Hallum.

（操作員說明）Christian Schwab，Craig-Hallum。

Hey.

嘿。

Good afternoon, guys.

下午好，夥計們。

So Gayn, thank you for all the detail on all the different market opportunities.

Gayn，感謝您提供有關所有不同市場機會的所有詳細資訊。

I guess the question -- I really only have one question.

我猜想這個問題——我真的只有一個問題。

It's a question we get all the time is we've been at $65 million, $70 million here for three years.

我們一直被問到的一個問題是，三年來我們的收入一直是 6,500 萬美元、7,000 萬美元。

And what year is the inflection point of long-term sustainable growth?

長期可持續成長的轉捩點是哪一年？

You kind of ended with a summary of all that.

你最後總結了所有這些。

You feel confident in long-term sustainable growth.

您對長期可持續成長充滿信心。

I'm just wondering, do we start seeing strong top line growth rate next fiscal year, fiscal year '26 and beyond?

我只是想知道，我們是否會在下個財年、第 26 財年及以後開始看到強勁的營收成長率？

And if we do, what does that top line growth rate look like?

如果我們這樣做，那麼收入成長率會是什麼樣子？

Thank you, again.

再次謝謝你。

All right.

好的。

Christian, well, as you know and maybe not everyone else knows as well or understand, we have yet to give multiyear forecasts, which is going to feel a little less than what you were asking for.

克里斯蒂安，好吧，正如你所知，也許不是其他人都知道或理解，我們尚未給出多年預測，這會感覺比你所要求的要少一些。

But let me at least try and put it in perspective as well.

但至少讓我試著正確地看待它。

We had been -- if you go back and look at multiple quarters, we've been talking about some of these other markets and alluding or being very direct about some of the expansion, whether it be us talking about the investments in the silicon photonics, our initial engagement with customers in GaN 1.5 year ago that said we were evaluating them for production use in hopes that it would prove out that they need production burn-in, which we've now determined have, engagements with the flash memory.

如果你回顧多個季度，我們一直在談論其他一些市場，並暗示或非常直接地談論一些擴張，無論是我們談論矽光子學的投資，我們在1.5 年前與GaN 客戶進行了初步接觸，表示我們正在評估它們的生產用途，希望證明他們需要生產預燒，我們現在已經確定，與快閃記憶體的接觸。

And we even -- we were a little more guarded about it, but about a year ago, if you look at the notes, I was referring to another exciting application for a high-power application for wafer level burn-in we were engaged in, which was actually the leading edge of the AI stuff.

我們甚至 - 我們對此更加謹慎，但大約一年前，如果您查看筆記，我指的是我們正在從事的晶圓級老化的高功率應用的另一個令人興奮的應用，這實際上是人工智能的前沿。

Those were markets that we saw driving our revenue.

我們看到這些市場推動了我們的收入。

But candidly, most of the energy was, of course, about the silicon carbide and EV.

但坦白說，大部分精力當然都與碳化矽和電動車有關。

We saw those markets easily driving for -- as we talked about AI, this could be $100 million a year number, and flash memory is probably the largest among it, and DRAM larger than that.

我們看到這些市場很容易推動——當我們談到人工智慧時，這個數字可能是每年 1 億美元，而快閃記憶體可能是其中最大的，而 DRAM 則更大。

There are enormous opportunities in the space as a whole in semiconductors.

整個半導體領域存在著巨大的機會。

But of course, we were seeing this year-over-year growth of 40%, 50% for silicon carbide, and that seemed to be where the focus was.

當然，我們看到碳化矽年增 40%，年增 50%，這似乎是焦點所在。

So I've always tried to balance, particularly with our customers that still really need us for their silicon carbide ramps and their fabs they're putting in.

因此，我一直在努力保持平衡，特別是對於那些仍然真正需要我們為其碳化矽坡道和他們正在建造的晶圓廠提供服務的客戶。

We're not abandoning the silicon carbide.

我們不會放棄碳化矽。

I think we have the most competitive solution, the best roadmap as well to continue to meet customers' needs.

我認為我們擁有最具競爭力的解決方案、最好的路線圖以及持續滿足客戶需求的能力。

And we'll see that growth.

我們將會看到這種增長。

We think that silicon carbide still has a lot of legs on it, as we still anticipate 30% of electric vehicles by the end of the decade of total vehicles being electric vehicles.

我們認為碳化矽仍然有很大的優勢，因為我們仍然預計到本世紀末電動車總數將達到 30%。

It's just by contrast to all the craziness that was going on 1.5 years ago, it seems quite more disappointing.

與1.5年前的瘋狂相比，這似乎更令人失望。

So I think silicon carbide has a chance to grow next year from this year.

所以我認為碳化矽從今年開始明年還有機會成長。

I think the other markets, for sure, have a chance to grow year-over-year.

我認為其他市場肯定有機會逐年成長。

We're still getting our arms around it and doing some introductions as we're taking the Incal packaged part burn-in production system and marketing around the world, and at the same time, having conversations with customers about the wafer level.

我們仍在全力以赴並進行一些介紹，因為我們正在採用 Incal 封裝零件老化生產系統並在世界各地進行行銷，同時與客戶就晶圓級進行對話。

And we'll hopefully be able to give you more insight as to what that looks like.

我們希望能夠讓您更深入地了解它是什麼樣的。

And, of course, we'll provide our annual guidance in our July release, which will summarize the fiscal year and as we head into fiscal year '26.

當然，我們將在 7 月發布的報告中提供年度指導，該報告將總結本財年以及進入第 26 財年的情況。

Great.

偉大的。

Thank you for that, Gayn.

謝謝你，蓋恩。

No other questions.

沒有其他問題。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thanks, Christian.

謝謝，克里斯蒂安。

Jed Dorsheimer, William Blair.

傑德·多斯海默，威廉·布萊爾。

Hi.

你好。

Yes.

是的。

Thanks for taking my questions.

感謝您回答我的問題。

Gayn, despite the miss, backlog looks pretty strong.

蓋恩，儘管錯過了，但積壓的訂單看起來相當多。

So I'm just wondering, were there any tools on the shipping dock?

所以我只是想知道，裝運碼頭上有什麼工具嗎？

Is this more of a timing issue?

這更多的是時間問題嗎？

I'm guessing that it is, but I'm just curious if you could add any more color.

我猜是這樣，但我只是好奇你是否可以添加更多顏色。

And then I have some follow-up questions.

然後我還有一些後續問題。

Yeah, they were on the shipping dock, very much so.

是的，他們在裝運碼頭，非常如此。

Yes, we were quite frustrated.

是的，我們非常沮喪。

I don't want to get into it.

我不想涉足其中。

This isn't the first nor the last time we had -- I'll just say, one or more customers gets narrowed down to two, asking for some concessions and things that just seem quite unreasonable, recognizing it was the end of our fiscal quarter, and we dug our feet in at the same time.

這不是我們第一次也不是最後一次——我只是說，一個或多個客戶被縮小到兩個，要求一些讓步和看起來很不合理的事情，認識到這是我們財政的結束四分之一，我們同時陷入困境。

But it's very interesting that here several weeks after the quarter or even right afterwards, and now it's like, hey, I need you to ship ASAP.

但非常有趣的是，在季度結束後幾週甚至之後，現在就像是，嘿，我需要你盡快發貨。

So we're still working on that expectation management with our customers around that.

因此，我們仍在與客戶一起進行期望管理。

But yes, they're both orders for immediate shipments because we had prebuilt them into it.

但是，是的，它們都是立即發貨的訂單，因為我們已將它們預先內建到其中。

And had we had either one of those orders ahead of time, our quarterly number would have been significantly higher, but it just moved into this quarter.

如果我們提前收到其中任何一個訂單，我們的季度數字將會顯著更高，但它剛剛轉移到本季度。

Got it.

知道了。

Thanks for the color.

謝謝你的顏色。

Maybe to Christian's previous question but framed a little bit differently.

也許是針對克里斯蒂安之前的問題，但框架有點不同。

If I kind of read the tea leaves in terms of all of the market details that you provided at the beginning, it sounds like the hard disk drive, I think, for the HAMR process product or platform, that's the biggest near-term driver of the business beyond ex-silicon carbide.

如果我從您一開始提供的所有市場細節角度來解讀，我認為，對於 HAMR 流程產品或平台來說，這聽起來像是硬碟，這是近期最大的驅動因素。

But you've got a lot of different irons in the fire around AI and even HBM.

但圍繞 AI 甚至 HBM 有許多不同的問題。

So am I misunderstanding?

那我是不是理解錯了？

I'm just trying to understand near-term drivers that then potentially lead to inflection on future growth.

我只是想了解近期的驅動因素，這些驅動因素可能會影響未來的成長。

So we've never given a lot of clarity on what the hard disk drive application is.

因此，我們從未對硬碟應用程式給出太多的說明。

I'll just leave it at that.

我就這樣吧。

Not confirming or denying, okay?

不確認也不否認好嗎？

But realistically, if you look at it, so if you go just by the numbers, we did, what, $26 million something.

但實際上，如果你看一下，如果你只看數字，我們做了，什麼，2600 萬美元的事情。

We have $26 million something in backlog.

我們有 2600 萬美元的積壓訂單。

We have 75% almost to the dime of revenue scored and/or backlog of the $70 million.

我們有 75% 的收入幾乎是 7000 萬美元的收入和/或積壓的。

So we have like $16 million, $17 million to go, I think, whatever the math is.

所以我認為，無論計算結果如何，我們還有大約 1600 萬美元、1700 萬美元的資金。

We've identified what those customer opportunities are.

我們已經確定了這些客戶機會是什麼。

Here's upside and downside to each one of those, some of them could push out, et cetera.

其中每一個都有其優點和缺點，其中一些可能會被淘汰，等等。

So it's always a challenge to try and put a number around it.

因此，嘗試給出一個數字始終是一個挑戰。

You guys think this is easy.

你們認為這很容易。

It's not with the granularity of our stuff.

這與我們的東西的粒度無關。

But near term, we've got some silicon carbide orders in our expectation for Q4 with some new customers.

但短期內，我們預計第四季將收到一些新客戶的碳化矽訂單。

We've got more AI production, both in packaged part and wafer level burn-in.

我們在封裝零件和晶圓級老化方面都有更多的人工智慧生產。

I think both of those -- all three of those are probably bigger than the hard disk drive one in the near term.

我認為在短期內，這三個驅動器都可能比硬碟更大。

Over the next several years, as they ramp out, the hard disk drive business looks to be like really attractive, and there's some variation on some of the stuff we can't get into with respect to the forecast, but we're pretty happy with that, and they're very happy with us about that application.

在接下來的幾年中，隨著硬碟業務的發展，硬碟業務看起來非常有吸引力，我們無法預測的一些內容會存在一些變化，但我們非常高興對此，他們對我們對該應用程式感到非常滿意。

Flash, for sure, is bigger than everything, although maybe the AI stuff will end up being bigger than flash.

毫無疑問，快閃記憶體比一切都重要，儘管人工智慧的東西最終可能會比快閃記憶體更大。

We'll see how it plays out, but that's a year out, and we're not alluding to a timing of when the DRAM stuff comes.

我們將看看結果如何，但那是一年後的事了，我們並沒有提到 DRAM 的到來的時間。

But it's a pretty full plate.

但這是一個相當完整的盤子。

You hear it all the time.

你總是聽到它。

We're still doing benchmarks.

我們仍在進行基準測試。

Vernon and I will tell you; we've won customers that haven't placed orders yet for silicon carbide.

佛農和我會告訴你；我們贏得了尚未訂購碳化矽的客戶。

It's a very interesting market with -- and all the dynamics that are going on in there, winners and losers and market share shifts between customers, between the customers' customers, different model years that we have a lot of insight into, and the implications of both China and also just cars going to modules versus discrete devices, there's just a lot of moving parts.

這是一個非常有趣的市場，其中發生的所有動態、贏家和輸家、客戶之間、客戶的客戶之間的市場份額變化、我們深入了解的不同車型年份及其影響無論是中國還是汽車的模組與分立器件，都存在著許多移動部件。

But I try and use this 80-20 rule.

但我嘗試使用 80-20 規則。

Vernon and I talk about -- Vernon is our VP of Sales for people that don't know.

佛農和我談論－佛農是我們的銷售副總裁，為那些不知道的人服務。

We try to talk about this all the time.

我們一直試著談論這個問題。

We can't wake up every day and spend 80% of our time on silicon carbide.

我們不可能每天醒來，把80%的時間都花在碳化矽上。

We've spent a ton of energy.

我們已經花費了大量的精力。

We've got these great solutions.

我們有這些很棒的解決方案。

We've won these benchmarks.

我們贏得了這些基準。

The customers need us to be there.

客戶需要我們在那裡。

But most of the days we wake up, we're focusing on these other market opportunities where we can really have an impact.

但大多數時候，當我們醒來時，我們都會關注那些我們能夠真正產生影響力的其他市場機會。

And we'll let Adil, our VP of Operations or COO, deal with manufacturing capacity, just take the orders and ship them because we certainly bought the inventory against what we really believed forecast was going to be there last year.

我們將讓我們的營運副總裁或營運長阿迪爾（Adil）處理製造能力，只接受訂單並發貨，因為我們確實根據去年我們真正相信的預測購買了庫存。

Bought the inventory against those forecasts -- verbal forecast from customers that have pushed out, we still think are going to come.

根據這些預測購買庫存——來自已經推出的客戶的口頭預測，我們仍然認為將會出現。

Got it.

知道了。

One last question for me, and then I'll jump back in the queue.

問我最後一個問題，然後我會跳回隊列。

And maybe it's for Chris here.

也許是為了克里斯。

Just margins -- gross margin took a steep decline.

僅利潤率——毛利率急劇下降。

I'm assuming that that's mix shift from the WaferPaks to the Incal systems, Sonoma.

我假設這是從 WaferPaks 到 Incal 系統的混合轉變，索諾瑪。

But I'm just curious, do you expect this to -- do you expect to be at these levels?

但我只是很好奇，你是否期望達到這樣的水準？

You mentioned in backlog that you have some silicon carbide, I'm assuming some WaferPaks there.

您在積壓訂單中提到您有一些碳化矽，我假設那裡有一些 WaferPaks。

How should we think about the normal margin levels?

我們該如何看待正常的保證金水準？

As you certainly to achieve your $70 million would imply getting a pretty big bump in revenues.

當然，實現 7,000 萬美元就意味著收入會大幅增加。

How should we think about that for the rest of the year?

今年剩下的時間我們該如何思考這個問題？

Yes.

是的。

So you're correct, Jed.

所以你是對的，傑德。

So as we talked about it before, the Incal products, the gross margins is a little bit lower than what we have in legacy Aehr Test Systems and WaferPaks.

正如我們之前談到的，Incal 產品的毛利率比我們傳統的 Aehr 測試系統和 WaferPaks 的毛利率要低一些。

So the order you can think about it is the WaferPaks always has the best gross margin.

所以你可以考慮的順序是 WaferPaks 總是有最好的毛利率。

And then the Aehr Test Systems, and then would be the Incal system.

然後是 Aehr 測試系統，然後是 Incal 系統。

So it really depends on the product mix even within Incal because

因此，即使在 Incal 內部，這實際上也取決於產品組合，因為

--

--

The Incal consumables have

Incal 消耗品有

--

--

Yes, consumables have lower

是的，消耗品較低

[too].

[也]。

The other piece we haven't given a ton of -- I think we may have said in early discussions around the Incal acquisition.

另一件我們沒有給出太多的內容——我想我們可能在圍繞 Incal 收購的早期討論中已經說過了。

So we're at a good point right now.

所以我們現在正處於一個很好的時刻。

We, of course, do all these live, and you don't hear the construction in the background, but we're doing our remodel here, adding a huge amount of capacity capability out on the floor, cleanroom space, et cetera, before we move the Incal products over.

當然，所有這些都是我們現場進行的，你聽不到背景中的施工聲，但我們正在這裡進行改造，在地板、潔淨室空間等上增加大量的容量。

They're only a few miles down the road.

他們距路僅幾英里。

But that whole team and the manufacturing will be in here, we think, completed by the end of our fiscal year.

但我們認為，整個團隊和製造將在本財年末完成。

So it's only a few months out.

所以只剩下幾個月的時間了。

That facility is also burdening our cost of sales, too.

該設施也給我們的銷售成本帶來了負擔。

So that comes off our books by 1.5 year.

因此，這將在 1.5 年之前從我們的帳簿中扣除。

That's about $0.5 million a year or something like that, too.

這也相當於每年約 50 萬美元。

So we'll get some goodness out of this thing.

所以我們會從這件事中得到一些好處。

We don't really focus our energy on the goodness through of the Incal merger.

我們並沒有真正將精力集中在 Incal 合併帶來的好處上。

Mostly, it's the revenue opportunities and the customers, but there will be some operational efficiencies as well.

主要是收入機會和客戶，但也會帶來一些營運效率。

Great.

偉大的。

Thanks for the color.

謝謝你的顏色。

I'll jump back in the queue.

我會跳回到隊列中。

Thanks, guys,

謝謝你們，

(Operator Instructions) Tom Diffely, D.A. Davidson.

（操作員說明）Tom Diffely，D.A.戴維森。

Yeah.

是的。

Good afternoon and thanks for the question.

下午好，謝謝你的提問。

Gayn, curious what your view is of the Chinese market for silicon carbide if you are not successful in your patent infringement case.

Gayn，如果您的專利侵權案沒有勝訴，您對中國碳化矽市場的看法是什麼？

Is there still a market there for you?

那裡還有市場適合你嗎？

That's a good question.

這是個好問題。

Yes, I guess.

是的，我想。

I mean there's two things.

我的意思是有兩件事。

One of them is the patent infringement case against these guys, and the other one is our competitiveness.

其中之一是針對這些人的專利侵權案，另一個是我們的競爭力。

And obviously, the trade-related things between the US and China, particularly recently.

顯然，是中美與貿易相關的事情，特別是最近。

They're harder to get your finger on.

他們更難觸動你的手指。

The system, and I want to be careful too much, that system that we've named in our 10-Q, et cetera, it's not very good.

這個系統，我想非常小心，我們在 10-Q 中命名的系統等等，它不是很好。

I know that's kind of pretty directed.

我知道這很有針對性。

We've had feedback from customers that it's not working very well.

我們從客戶那裡得到回饋說它運行得不好。

It has repeatability issues.

它存在重複性問題。

It can't really do what we do.

它確實不能做我們所做的事情。

We have

我們有

[parallel advantage].

【並行優勢】。

We have a number of wafers.

我們有很多晶圓。

We have automation.

我們有自動化。

We have a lot of capability.

我們有很多能力。

But nevertheless, we're not just going to put up with people trying to encroach on us and step on patents that we have in China provided by the Chinese Patent Office, and so we're not going to put up with it.

但無論如何，我們不會只容忍那些試圖侵犯我們、踐踏我們在中國擁有的、由中國專利局提供的專利的人，所以我們不會容忍。

So there's two things.

所以有兩件事。

There's a legal aspect of this thing, and then there's just the flat-out competitiveness.

這件事有一個法律上的問題，然後就是徹頭徹尾的競爭。

And we have a team of people in China.

我們在中國有一個團隊。

I think we've already talked about it.

我想我們已經討論過了。

I think we had 14 customers in China over time.

我想隨著時間的推移，我們在中國有 14 個客戶。

One of them is wafer, the rest are packaged part from Aehr Test.

其中之一是晶圓，其餘的則是 Aehr Test 的封裝件。

So we've done business in China for a long time.

所以我們在中國做生意已經很久了。

It's not our plan to change.

這不是我們改變的計劃。

It's just some of the uncertainties related to how just trade things that make it a little bit harder to put your finger on.

只是與如何交易相關的一些不確定性讓你更難以確定。

And we're just trying to be open with that with people.

我們只是試圖向人們公開這一點。

Okay.

好的。

So maybe to summarize, if worst-case scenario, they're able to get away with whatever they've copied on their tool, you feel like you still have a pretty strong competitive advantage for both reliability and productivity versus their system as it is?

因此，也許總結一下，如果最壞的情況，他們能夠擺脫他們在工具上複製的任何內容，你會覺得與他們的系統相比，你在可靠性和生產力方面仍然具有相當強大的競爭優勢？

We do.

我們做到了。

You always have to be careful because people have roadmaps, and we have roadmaps, too.

你必須隨時小心，因為人們有路線圖，我們也有路線圖。

I don't want to get too carried away with that.

我不想對此太過得意忘形。

But yes, that is the case.

但是，是的，情況就是這樣。

And again, it's very focused on silicon carbide.

再說一遍，它非常關注碳化矽。

It has issues even testing gallium nitride.

即使測試氮化鎵也存在問題。

It doesn't do power semiconductors.

它不做功率半導體。

So it's kind of a specific niche target at something, but nevertheless, we're taking it seriously, at least in China.

所以這是一個特定的利基目標，但儘管如此，我們正在認真對待它，至少在中國是這樣。

Okay.

好的。

And then your concern over the orders this year is the concern that you lose them competitively or that they get pushed out?

那麼，您對今年訂單的擔憂是擔心失去競爭優勢還是被擠出？

Well, there's always -- I worry about a lot of stuff, Tom.

嗯，湯姆，我總是擔心很多事情。

But in general, when we were trying to describe China, we have a production system in our plans at least in those numbers.

但總的來說，當我們試圖描述中國時，我們的計劃中至少在這些數字上有一個生產系統。

We also have other opportunities in things like that, too.

我們在類似的事情上也有其他機會。

But an ASP of our wafer-level burn-in systems with sets of WaferPaks is several million dollars.

但我們配備 WaferPaks 的晶圓級老化系統的平均售價為數百萬美元。

And so, if something happens and there's some regulatory thing that slows us down or precludes us or something, I don't know really how to handicap that.

因此，如果發生了一些事情，並且有一些監管因素減慢了我們的速度或阻止了我們或其他事情，我真的不知道如何阻止這種情況。

That's a new one for me.

這對我來說是一個新事物。

There's always the -- they still buy us, but they don't take it by May.

總有——他們仍然購買我們，但他們不會在五月之前接受。

That's kind of the normal thing we've been dealing with.

這是我們一直在處理的正常事情。

I think a lot of people understand, a lot of our shareholders are experts in semiconductor, semiconductor

我想很多人都明白，我們很多股東都是半導體的專家，半導體

[tap].

[輕敲]。

Semiconductors are in a downturn right now.

目前半導體產業正處於低迷時期。

Outside of AI, there's a lot of -- it's tough out there in automotive customers, et cetera.

除了人工智慧之外，汽車客戶等領域也面臨許多困難。

And so, as those of us that have been here for a long time, this too shall pass.

因此，作為我們這些已經在這裡待了很長時間的人，這也會過去。

And if you look at it in the scheme of a couple or few year window, it always gets better.

如果你從幾年或幾年的角度來看它，它總是會變得更好。

So sometimes we wake up and things have been pushed out.

所以有時我們醒來時，事情已經被淘汰了。

You get a call from your customer and saying, oh, can you help us with pricing because we're struggling.

您接到客戶的電話，說，哦，您能幫我們定價嗎，因為我們正在苦苦掙扎。

And you're like, you are 50 times larger than I am.

你就像，你比我大50倍。

I'm not sure I can help you with your numbers, but we're here for you, kind of thing.

我不確定我可以幫助您處理您的號碼，但我們隨時為您服務。

So there's just some of that in the background.

所以只有一些背景。

Yeah.

是的。

Okay.

好的。

And maybe one last question on the flash market.

也許還有關於快閃記憶體市場的最後一個問題。

When you look at the opportunity for you specifically, is that going to be driven by a technology change here in the chip or the package, or what do you think really starts that market for you?

當您專門審視自己的機會時，這是否是由晶片或封裝中的技術變革驅動的，或者您認為什麼真正為您開啟了這個市場？

Yeah.

是的。

Flash memory is actually, Tom, as you know, from my history in HP, Agilent, Verigy running the memory business there for many, many years.

湯姆，如你所知，快閃記憶體實際上是我在 HP、Agilent、Verigy 經營記憶體業務很多年的歷史。

People refer to it as a treadmill.

人們稱之為跑步機。

You get on it, and you always have to keep going because the customers every two, three years are shipping more bits at the same price.

你堅持下去，你總是必須繼續前進，因為客戶每兩三年就會以相同的價格運送更多的比特。

So they have to always look at ways to be more and more cost effective.

因此，他們必須始終尋找越來越具有成本效益的方法。

That's true in the process equipment, the front-end equipment, and their backend equipment and test equipment.

製程設備、前端設備及其後端設備和測試設備都是如此。

So there are things specifically on the NAND flash roadmap that in addition to just cost disconnects, meaning I've got to ship way more flash memory in four years than I am today, and my revenue is not going to be up 4x.

因此，除了成本脫節之外，NAND 閃存路線圖上還有一些特別的事情，這意味著我必須在四年內出貨比現在更多的閃存，而且我的收入不會增長 4 倍。

How do I do it more cost effectively?

我該如何更有效地做到這一點？

So that's sort of a commercial requirement.

所以這是一種商業需求。

There's also technical issues.

還有技術問題。

And I was pretty specific in there to be clear.

為了清楚起見，我在那裡說得很具體。

These NAND devices are 3D stacked.

這些 NAND 設備是 3D 堆疊的。

They're not actually stacked.

它們實際上並沒有堆疊起來。

They're just printed.

它們只是印出來的。

Several -- there's how many NAND guys are out there, but they're all talking about 200-layer NAND.

那裡有很多 NAND 專家，但他們都在談論 200 層 NAND。

What that ends up being is you end up having way more power per device to think of like a 200-story building.

最終的結果是，每個設備最終擁有更多的電量，就像一座 200 層建築一樣。

And the amount of light when you light up the light on the first floor, that takes certain power.

當你點亮一樓的燈時，光量需要一定的電力。

But when you have light on 200 floors, you have 200 floors of lights on.

但當 200 層樓有燈時，200 層樓的燈就亮了。

When you go to test, there are some test methodologies whereby you can do things by testing multiple floors at a time.

當您去測試時，有一些測試方法可以讓您一次測試多個樓層。

But when you do that, all the energy is used as if you're lighting up all those floors.

但當你這樣做時，所有的能量都會被使用，就好像你照亮了所有這些樓層一樣。

Whereas in normal application, you're reading and writing data only on one floor at a time.

而在正常應用程式中，您一次只能在一層樓上讀取和寫入資料。

So the actual device in its application is using 1 to the 200th of the power, but you could do test methodologies to test 20 floors at a time, but then you need 20 times the power.

因此，實際設備在其應用中使用的是 1 到 200 的功率，但您可以使用測試方法一次測試 20 層樓，但隨後您需要 20 倍的功率。

That's a thermal problem, that's a tester resource problem.

這是一個熱問題，這是一個測試資源問題。

Those are things we're really good at.

這些才是我們真正擅長的事。

So I'm trying to give you some hints there as to what's going on.

所以我試著給你一些關於正在發生的事情的提示。

So there are some technical disconnects that we are looking to address as well as the commercial side on the NAND side.

因此，我們正在尋求解決一些技術方面的脫節以及 NAND 方面的商業方面的問題。

And by the way, DRAM, I'll go into that, too, just the whole HBM is super dynamic, and people are -- there's so many things going on with respect to -- because DRAM also needs to be burnt in.

順便說一句，DRAM，我也會討論這個問題，整個 HBM 是超級動態的，而且人們——有很多事情在發生——因為 DRAM 也需要被燒毀。

So how are you doing that again before you put it into an HBM stack onto a CoWoS package along with an AI processor?

那麼，在將其與 AI 處理器一起放入 CoWoS 套件的 HBM 堆疊中之前，您如何再次執行此操作？

So I like where we're at right now. here's a lot of vectors pointing towards this right now.

所以我喜歡我們現在所處的位置。現在有很多向量指向這一點。

Great.

偉大的。

Appreciate the color.

欣賞顏色。

Thanks, Gayn.

謝謝，蓋恩。

(Operator Instructions) Larry Chlebina, Chlebina Capital.

（操作員指令）Larry Chlebina，Chlebina Capital。

Hi, Gayn.

嗨，蓋恩。

I've got a question on your recent $10 million win on the GPUs for the accelerator.

我有一個關於你們最近在加速器 GPU 上贏得 1000 萬美元的問題。

I know you said that the potential market with the packaged part would be over $100 million a year down the road.

我知道您說過，封裝零件的潛在市場每年將超過 1 億美元。

But I'm looking at the wafer level portion of it.

但我正在研究它的晶圓級部分。

You said that, that customer was not NVIDIA, not the big guy.

你說那個客戶不是NVIDIA，不是大佬。

It has over 90% market share.

其市佔率超過90%。

So assuming it's the second largest, which is, I think, around 5%, and the $10 million represented two machines, that would be like 30, possibly 40 XPs for just doing the GPUs.

因此，假設它是第二大的，我認為約為 5%，並且 1000 萬美元代表兩台機器，那麼僅用於 GPU 就需要 30、可能 40 XP。

Is that the right way to look at that?

這是正確的看待方式嗎？

Okay.

好的。

So I don't want to help you with who the customer might be.

所以我不想幫助您了解客戶可能是誰。

So anyone listening, I'm ignoring you on that one, Larry.

所以任何人在聽，我都會忽略你，拉里。

Yes, the numbers are really big.

是的，數字確實很大。

You don't have to try very hard to fall out of bed and hit $100 million number.

你不必非常努力地從床上摔下來並達到 1 億美元的數字。

And we're not trying to [poo-poo] that.

我們並不是想[大便]那個。

But if this gets into available, addressable timing of this, it could be a lot bigger than that.

但如果這進入可用的、可尋址的時間，它可能會比這大得多。

Well, that's not really what I'm getting at.

嗯，這不是我真正的意思。

I'm actually getting at the next component on the accelerator, the HBM, high-bandwidth memory.

我實際上正在討論加速器的下一個組件，即 HBM、高頻寬記憶體。

The current 12-stack -- 8, 12-stacks, if you do the math on the silicon involved, it's about 6x the silicon in the GPUs currently.

目前的 12 堆疊——8、12 堆棧，如果對所涉及的矽進行計算，大約是目前 GPU 中矽的 6 倍。

And they're talking about going to 16 high stacks later this year with a roadmap to get to 24 high stacks next year, which would be 12 times the silicon.

他們正在討論今年稍後轉向 16 個高堆疊，並製定了明年達到 24 個高堆疊的路線圖，這將是晶片數量的 12 倍。

My point is when you're a fine pitch WaferPak, it just seems like you ought to have a ready, very interested bunch of potential customers wanting to see if you could help them on their yield issues that as they stack higher and higher, you could address that and help them out

我的觀點是，當你是一個精細的WaferPak 時，看起來你應該有一群準備好的、非常感興趣的潛在客戶，希望看看你是否可以幫助他們解決良率問題，隨著他們的產量越來越高，你可以解決這個問題並幫助他們

--

--

We talked a couple of years ago and imagine DRAM and what was going on, I would have been -- I certainly did say that we thought that was something probably more towards the end of the decade because companies just weren't that motivated to try and figure out how to do DRAM wafer-level burn-in compared to what they were doing.

幾年前，我們討論過 DRAM 以及正在發生的事情，我確實說過，我們認為這可能是本世紀末的事情，因為公司沒有動力去嘗試並找出與他們正在做的事情相比如何進行DRAM 晶圓級預燒。

And maybe it would take something else.

也許還需要其他東西。

And now you look at AI, which most of us weren't even talking about two years ago, right?

現在你看看人工智慧，兩年前我們大多數人甚至沒有談論過它，對嗎？

And you look at these, and it's like, wow, are you motivated now?

當你看到這些時，你會想，哇，你現在有動力了嗎？

So I agree with you in terms of the motivation to put in the DFT and [contest] modes and to try and address this issue.

因此，我同意你提出 DFT 和 [競賽] 模式並嘗試解決這個問題的動機。

I think part of the reason why HBM is more expensive than the GPUs is probably the terrible yields that they're experiencing.

我認為 HBM 比 GPU 更貴的部分原因可能是它們所經歷的糟糕的產量。

And hopefully, you can help them out on that.

希望你能幫助他們解決這個問題。

Well, that's on each stack, if you will, or each individual die.

好吧，如果你願意的話，那是在每一堆上，否則每個人都會死。

And then just -- I always have to remind people, the reason you do production burn-in is because things fail.

然後，我總是必須提醒人們，進行生產老化的原因是因為事情失敗了。

It's not to make you feel good.

這不是為了讓你感覺良好。

As soon as they stop failing, you would stop doing it.

一旦他們停止失敗，你就會停止這樣做。

So when I state, oh, people are doing a production burn-in of these devices, you have to recognize that means there is a material number of failures that they do not want to ship to their customer.

因此，當我說，哦，人們正在對這些設備進行生產老化時，您必須認識到這意味著他們不希望將大量故障發送給客戶。

Every one of those takes out all those HBM stacks in the CoWoS substrate, plus the package.

其中每一個都取出 CoWoS 基板中的所有 HBM 堆疊以及封裝。

So it's our whole premise about things moving to multichip modules that we've been touting for the last five, six, seven years with the leading edge of what's going on with wafer level.

因此，這是我們在過去五、六年、七年裡一直在宣揚的關於向多晶片模組轉移的整體前提，以及晶圓級的前沿技術。

At that time, we were struggling -- be like, okay, which devices is that going to look like?

當時，我們很苦惱 - 好吧，那會是什麼樣的設備？

And we kept saying, they're coming.

我們一直說，他們來了。

And because of Moore's Law is failing, it's failed, it's fallen down, you now need to put multiple devices together, and you need to stack them up and put them side-by-side in order to get the functionality that used to just be done with a shrink of a wafer.

因為摩爾定律失敗了，它失敗了，它崩潰了，你現在需要將多個設備放在一起，你需要將它們堆疊起來並並排放置，以獲得過去的功能。

So yes, more vectors heading our way, Larry.

所以，是的，更多的向量正在向我們襲來，拉里。

Assuming this comes to pass, would you be able to handle all that demand through the capacity of, potential capacity in Fremont?

假設這種情況成為現實，您能否透過弗里蒙特的潛在產能來滿足所有需求？

Is that even possible or

這可能嗎？

--

--

For those that haven't attended us, especially with our new facility upgrades that we're doing right here, we have -- the manufacturing capacity up here is bigger than I had at Verigy.

對於那些還沒有參加我們的人來說，特別是我們在這裡正在進行的新設施升級，我們這裡的製造能力比我在惠瑞捷的製造能力還要大。

So people might be shocked at that.

所以人們可能會對此感到震驚。

So there's always ways of doing it.

所以總有辦法做到這一點。

Keep in mind, we use subcontract manufacturers.

請記住，我們使用分包製造商。

In most cases, we have multiple suppliers of every subsystem.

在大多數情況下，我們的每個子系統都有多個供應商。

In many cases, like one of the hard things is your printed circuit boards and your assemblies, that could be increased a hundredfold if you needed, without actually impacting our resources.

在許多情況下，最困難的事情之一就是您的印刷電路板和組件，如果您需要，可以將其增加一百倍，而不會實際影響我們的資源。

So even though we do assembly test here, what we do is just a small piece to control the final assembly and quality before it ships, and we have some other tricks up our sleeves.

因此，儘管我們在這裡進行組裝測試，但我們所做的只是在發貨前控制最終組裝和品質的一小部分，我們還有其他一些技巧。

So right now, I have more capacity than demand by a lot, and we could increase our capacity significantly if we needed to for different market opportunities.

所以現在，我的產能比需求多很多，如果我們需要不同的市場機會，我們可以大幅增加我們的產能。

And when we bring customers through, by the way, that is very obvious when they walk -- when they come in and look at our facility, they kind of go, wow, okay, this is not your typical burn-in company in terms of the capacity we have.

順便說一句，當我們帶客戶過來時，這一點在他們走路時非常明顯——當他們進來看看我們的設施時，他們會說，哇，好吧，這不是典型的老化公司。能力。

Well, you've got great opportunities.

嗯，你有很好的機會。

I'll be looking forward to seeing you accomplish them.

我將期待看到您完成這些任務。

Okay.

好的。

I'm showing no further questions in the queue.

我在隊列中沒有顯示任何其他問題。

I'd like to turn it back to management for any closing remarks.

我想將其轉回管理層以供結束語。

Okay.

好的。

Thank you, operator.

謝謝你，接線生。

Everybody, I appreciate your time here.

各位，我很感謝你們在這裡度過的時光。

I know we tried to cover a lot of detail.

我知道我們試圖涵蓋很多細節。

I hope to see you at one of the investor conferences, or if you want, please get in contact with our IR folks, so we could set up a follow-on meeting to discuss your questions further.

我希望在一次投資者會議上見到您，或者如果您願意，請與我們的投資者關係人員聯繫，以便我們可以安排一次後續會議來進一步討論您的問題。

Until then, we'll see you next time.

到那時，我們下次再見。

This concludes today's conference, and you may disconnect your lines at this time.

今天的會議到此結束，此時您可以掛斷電話了。

Thank you for your participation.

感謝您的參與。