Wintrust Financial Corp (WTFC) 2023 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to Wintrust Financial Corporation's Third Quarter and Year-to-Date 2023 Earnings Conference Call. A review of the results will be made by Tim Crane, President and Chief Executive Officer; David Dykstra, Vice Chairman and Chief Operating Officer; and Richard Murphy, Vice Chairman and Chief Lending Officer.

歡迎參加 Wintrust Financial Corporation 2023 年第三季和年初至今的財報電話會議。總裁兼執行長 Tim Crane 將審查結果； David Dykstra，副董事長兼營運長；以及副主席兼首席貸款官理查德·墨菲。

As part of their reviews, the presenters may make reference to both the earnings press release and the earnings release presentation. Following their presentations, there will be a formal question-and-answer session.

作為評論的一部分，演講者可能會參考收益新聞稿和收益發布演示。在他們的演講之後，將舉行正式的問答環節。

During the course of today's call, Wintrust management may make statements that constitute projections, expectations, beliefs or similar forward-looking statements. Actual results could differ materially from the results anticipated or projected in any such forward-looking statements. The company's forward-looking assumptions that could cause the actual results to differ materially from the information discussed during this call are detailed in our earnings press release and in the company's most recent Form 10-K and any subsequent filings with the SEC.

在今天的電話會議期間，Wintrust 管理層可能會發表構成預測、期望、信念或類似前瞻性聲明的聲明。實際結果可能與任何此類前瞻性陳述中預期或預期的結果有重大差異。該公司的前瞻性假設可能導致實際結果與本次電話會議中討論的資訊有重大差異，這些假設在我們的收益新聞稿、該公司最新的10-K 表格以及隨後向SEC 提交的任何文件中都有詳細說明。

Also, our remarks may reference certain non-GAAP financial measures. Our earnings press release and earnings release presentation include a reconciliation of each non-GAAP financial measure to the nearest comparable GAAP financial measure.

此外，我們的言論可能會參考某些非公認會計準則財務指標。我們的收益新聞稿和收益發布簡報包括每個非公認會計準則財務指標與最接近的可比較公認會計準則財務指標的調節表。

As a reminder, this conference call is being recorded. I will now turn the conference over to Mr. Tim Crane.

謹此提醒，本次電話會議正在錄音中。我現在將會議交給提姆·克蘭先生。

Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Wintrust Wednesday. This is the day of the week we require all of our Wintrust staff to be on site. We're glad that you have joined us too for our third quarter earnings call. With me this morning are Dave Dykstra, our Chief Operating Officer; Rich Murphy, our Chief Lending Officer; Dave Stoehr, our Chief Financial Officer; and Kate Boege, our General Counsel.

大家早安。歡迎來到 Wintrust 星期三。這是一周中我們要求所有 Wintrust 員工都在現場的一天。我們很高興您也參加我們的第三季財報電話會議。今天早上和我在一起的是我們的營運長戴夫·戴克斯特拉 (Dave Dykstra)； Rich Murphy，我們的首席貸款官； Dave Stoehr，我們的財務長；和我們的總法律顧問 Kate Boege。

In terms of an agenda, I will share some high-level highlights. Dave Dykstra will speak to the financial results, and Rich will add some additional information and color on credit performance. I'll wrap up with just a few summary thoughts. And as always, we'll do our best to answer some questions.

在議程方面，我將分享一些高層要點。戴夫·戴克斯特拉 (Dave Dykstra) 將談論財務業績，里奇 (Rich) 將添加一些有關信用表現的額外資訊和色彩。我將僅總結一些想法。一如既往，我們將盡力回答一些問題。

Earnings or net income for the quarter were just over $164 million, up from both the second quarter and the period quarter last year. From our standpoint, a very solid result with good loan and deposit growth and continued good credit performance. As Rich will highlight, we are not seeing any systemic credit issues at this point.

該季度的獲利或淨利潤略高於 1.64 億美元，高於第二季和去年同期的水平。從我們的角度來看，這是一個非常堅實的結果，貸款和存款成長良好，信貸表現持續良好。正如里奇將強調的那樣，我們目前沒有看到任何系統性信用問題。

Our margin at 3.62% was within the range we expected, down essentially just for the impact of our hedging activities. We continue to benefit from a loan portfolio that prices relatively quickly. You'll recall that nearly 80% of our loans mature or reprice within a year. The resulting improvement in loan yield allows us to largely offset the increase in deposit costs, which I would add, we believe, are moderating at this point.

我們的利潤率為 3.62%，在我們預期的範圍內，主要是由於我們的對沖活動的影響而下降。我們繼續受益於定價相對較快的貸款組合。您可能還記得，我們​​有近 80% 的貸款會在一年內到期或重新定價。由此產生的貸款收益率的改善使我們能夠在很大程度上抵消存款成本的增加，我想補充一點，我們認為目前存款成本正在放緩。

Our growth in the relatively stable margin resulted in net interest income growth for the quarter and on a year-over-year basis. From a market standpoint, we continue to see isolated disruption among competitors. And as a result, we continue to add clients and create long-term franchise value. We expect that in the coming quarters, we will continue to grow loans and deposits.

我們相對穩定的利潤率成長導致本季和年比淨利息收入成長。從市場的角度來看，我們繼續看到競爭對手之間出現孤立的破壞。因此，我們不斷增加客戶並創造長期的特許經營價值。我們預計未來幾個季度，貸款和存款將繼續成長。

Our liquidity position remains strong. The deposit growth not only allowed us to fund good loan growth, but also to reduce the level of brokered deposits during the quarter.

我們的流動性狀況依然強勁。存款成長不僅使我們能夠為良好的貸款成長提供資金，而且還降低了本季經紀存款的水平。

Again, overall, a solid quarter, which we believe will compare well and, in fact, may differentiate us relative to many of our competitors. With that, I'll turn this over to Dave to provide some additional financial details.

總的來說，這是一個穩健的季度，我們相信這將是一個很好的比較，事實上，這可能會使我們與許多競爭對手區分開來。這樣，我會將其轉交給戴夫，以提供一些額外的財務詳細資訊。

Great. Thanks, Tim. First, with respect to the balance sheet growth, we were again pleased to see deposits for the quarter grew by approximately $1 billion or 9% on an annualized basis. This deposit growth was primarily in the form of interest-bearing retail deposits, and that growth allowed us to reduce our level of broker deposits by $392 million.

偉大的。謝謝，蒂姆。首先，就資產負債表成長而言，我們再次高興地看到本季存款成長約 10 億美元，以年化計算成長 9%。這種存款成長主要以計息零售存款的形式出現，這種成長使我們能夠將經紀人存款水準減少 3.92 億美元。

As to deposit composition, non-interest bearing deposits at the end of the quarter represented 23% of total deposits compared to 24% at the end of the second quarter. The slight reduction in the percentage of non-interest bearing deposits to total deposits is really more a reflection of the positive growth occurring in the interest-bearing categories, rather than any large losses of non-interest bearing deposit accounts.

從存款組成來看，季末無利息存款佔存款總額的比例為23%，而第二季末為24%。無利息存款佔存款總額比例的小幅下降，更反映了有息類別的正成長，而不是無利息存款帳戶的大幅虧損。

We've seen the non-interest bearing balances stabilized as evidenced by the $10.6 billion of average non-interest bearing deposit balances in the third quarter, being roughly equal to the $10.6 billion balance at the end of the second quarter. This strong deposit growth helped to fund solid loan growth of $423 million in the third quarter.

我們看到無息存款餘額趨於穩定，第三季平均無息存款餘額為 106 億美元，大致等於第二季末的 106 億美元餘額。強勁的存款成長為第三季 4.23 億美元的穩健貸款成長提供了資金。

Adjusting for the impact of the sale of certain commercial insurance premium finance loans during the third quarter, total loans increased $767 million or 7% on an annualized basis, which is consistent with our prior guidance of mid- to high single-digit loan growth. The increase in loans was primarily the result of draws on existing commercial real estate loan facilities as well as growth in the commercial portfolio.

在調整第三季出售某些商業保費融資貸款的影響後，貸款總額按年化計算增加了 7.67 億美元，即 7%，這與我們之前中高單位數貸款增長的指導一致。貸款的增加主要是由於現有商業房地產貸款設施的提取以及商業投資組合的成長。

Additionally, despite the loan sale transaction that reduced outstanding balances by $344 million at the end of the third quarter, the commercial insurance premium portfolio ended relatively unchanged, which is a good result. Rich Murphy will discuss the loan portfolio growth in more detail in just a bit.

此外，儘管貸款銷售交易使第三季末的未償餘額減少了3.44億美元，但商業保險保費組合最終保持相對不變，這是一個不錯的結果。 Rich Murphy 將稍後更詳細地討論貸款組合的成長。

The result of these and other balance sheet movements was growth in total assets of approximately $1.3 billion. The slightly reduced ending loan-to-deposit ratio of 92.1%, and risk-based capital ratios that were relatively stable to up a little.

這些和其他資產負債表變動的結果是總資產增加了約 13 億美元。期末存貸比略有下降，為92.1%，風險資本率則相對穩定小幅上升。

Overall, it was a very successful quarter in the growth of our franchise, our differentiated business model, exceptional service, and the unique positioning that we have in Chicago and Milwaukee markets continues to serve us well.

總體而言，這是我們特許經營成長非常成功的季度，我們的差異化業務模式、卓越的服務以及我們在芝加哥和密爾瓦基市場的獨特定位繼續為我們提供良好的服務。

Turning to the income statement categories, starting with the net interest income. For the third quarter of 2023, net interest income totaled $462.4 million, an increase of approximately $14.8 million as compared to the prior quarter, and an increase of $60.9 million as compared to the third quarter of 2022. I should note that the third quarter net interest income represents the highest quarterly amount ever recorded by the company. The increase in net interest income as compared to the prior quarter was primarily due to the increase in average earning assets of approximately $1.6 billion.

轉向損益表類別，從淨利息收入開始。 2023年第三季度，淨利息收入總計4.624億美元，比上一季增加約1480萬美元，比2022年第三季度增加6090萬美元。我應該注意到，第三季度淨利息收入利息收入是該公司有史以來最高的季度金額。淨利息收入較上季增加主要是由於平均生息資產增加約16億美元。

The net interest margin was 3.62% in the third quarter, which was just 4 basis points less than the prior quarter level of 3.66%. 3 of the 4 basis points of the decline was due to the impact of our interest rate hedging strategies, which are designed to protect our net interest income of interest rates decline. Accordingly, as we discussed on prior calls, our balance sheet composition, structure and repricing characteristics provided for a relatively stable net interest margin during the quarter.

第三季淨利差為3.62%，僅較上季3.66%低4個基點。 4個基點中的3個下降是由於我們的利率對沖策略的影響，這些策略旨在保護我們的淨利息收入免受利率下降的影響。因此，正如我們在先前的電話會議中所討論的那樣，我們的資產負債表構成、結構和重新定價特徵為本季度提供了相對穩定的淨息差。

Deposit pricing moderated in the third quarter of 2023, and we expect that to continue into the fourth quarter. Based on the current interest rate environment, we believe we can maintain our net interest margin within a narrow range around the current levels for the remainder of 2023. And I'd also like to note that total loans as of September 30, 2023, were $739 million higher than the average total loans in the third quarter of 2023. This provides momentum into the fourth quarter. This growth in the expected growth in the balance sheet and the relatively stable net interest margin should allow for future growth of our net interest income in the fourth quarter.

存款定價在 2023 年第三季有所放緩，我們預計這種情況將持續到第四季。基於目前的利率環境，我們相信我們可以在 2023 年剩餘時間內將淨利差維持在當前水準的窄幅區間內。我還想指出的是，截至 2023 年 9 月 30 日的貸款總額為比2023年第三季的平均貸款總額高出7.39 億美元。這為第四季提供了動力。資產負債表的預期成長和相對穩定的淨利差應該會為我們第四季的淨利息收入帶來成長。

Turning to the provision for credit losses. Wintrust recorded a provision for credit losses of $19.9 million in the third quarter compared to a provision of $28.5 million in the prior quarter, and $6.4 million provision expense recorded in the year ago quarter. The lower provision expense in the third quarter relative to the second quarter was primarily a result of lower net loan growth during the third quarter. Rich Murphy will talk about the credit loan characteristics in just a bit.

轉向信用損失準備金。 Wintrust 第三季的信貸損失撥備為 1,990 萬美元，而上一季的撥備為 2,850 萬美元，去年同期記錄的撥備費用為 640 萬美元。第三季撥備費用較第二季較低主要是由於第三季淨貸款成長較低。里奇·墨菲（Rich Murphy）將簡單談談信用貸款的特徵。

Regarding noninterest income and noninterest expense sections. Total noninterest income totaled $112.5 million in the third quarter, and was relatively stable when compared to the prior quarter, total of $113.0 million. As shown in the table in our earnings release, there are a number of relatively small changes to a variety of noninterest income categories. But in the aggregate, the changes netted to a slight decrease of $552,000 from the prior quarter. This illustrates the importance of having a diversified fee businesses that can contribute at various levels over time and the ability of those business lines to maintain a relatively stable level of noninterest income, despite what is a challenging mortgage environment.

關於非利息收入和非利息支出部分。第三季非利息收入總額為 1.125 億美元，與上一季的 1.130 億美元相比相對穩定。正如我們收益報告中的表格所示，各種非利息收入類別發生了一些相對較小的變化。但總體而言，這些變化比上一季小幅減少了 552,000 美元。這說明了擁有多元化收費業務的重要性，這些業務可以隨著時間的推移在不同水平上做出貢獻，以及這些業務線有能力維持相對穩定的非利息收入水平，儘管抵押貸款環境充滿挑戰。

On the noninterest expense categories. Noninterest expenses totaled $330 million in the third quarter of 2023, and we're up approximately $9.4 million when compared to the prior quarter total of $320.6 million. There are a few primary reasons for the increases which are related to the negative impacts of: one, occupancy cost of approximately $2.9 million from the impairment of 2 company-owned buildings that are no longer being used. Two, data processing costs of approximately $1.5 million from a termination of a duplicate service contract related to the acquisition of the wealth management business in 2023.

關於非利息費用類別。 2023 年第三季的非利息支出總計 3.3 億美元，與上一季的 3.206 億美元相比增加了約 940 萬美元。造成這一增長的幾個主要原因與以下負面影響有關：一是因不再使用的兩座公司擁有的建築物減值而產生約 290 萬美元的佔用成本。第二，因終止與 2023 年收購財富管理業務相關的重複服務合約而產生約 150 萬美元的資料處理成本。

Other salary costs of approximately $1.6 million related to acquisition severance charges -- acquisition-related severance charges and other contractually due compensation costs. And then we also had an increase in our commissions and incentive compensation of $4.3 million, primarily because of the adjustments to our incentive compensation accruals due to the strong earnings levels.

與收購遣散費相關的其他薪資成本約為 160 萬美元——與收購相關的遣散費和其他合約規定的應付補償費用。然後，我們的佣金和激勵薪酬也增加了 430 萬美元，主要是因為強勁的收入水準對我們的激勵薪酬應計額進行了調整。

The remainder of the variances in the noninterest expense categories, both positive and negative, generally offset to a relatively small remaining change. So despite the growth in the noninterest expenses and the uncommon nature of some of the items that I just noted, company's annualized ratio of noninterest expenses as a percent of average quarterly assets actually declined by 3 basis points to 2.41% in the third quarter.

非利息支出類別的其餘差異（無論是正數還是負數）通常會抵消相對較小的剩餘變化。因此，儘管非利息支出有所增長，而且我剛才提到的一些項目具有不尋常的性質，但第三季度公司非利息支出佔平均季度資產的年化比率實際上下降了3個基點，至2.41 %。

Additionally, our efficiency ratio remained stable at 56.9% in both the second and the third quarters of 2023. And similarly, the company's net overhead ratio was relatively stable at 1.59% in the third quarter, and increased just 1 basis point from the 1.58% recorded in the prior quarter.

此外，2023年第二季度和第三季度，我們的效率比率均穩定在56.9%。同樣，公司第三季度的淨管理費用率相對穩定，為1.59%，較2023年的1.58%僅增加1個基點記錄於上一季。

So in summary, this was a very solid quarter with strong loan and deposit growth, improved liquidity position, stabilized net interest margin with a steady outlook, a record level of net revenues, continued low levels of nonperforming assets and the second highest quarterly net income result in the company's history.

總而言之，這是一個非常穩健的季度，貸款和存款增長強勁，流動性狀況改善，淨息差穩定，前景穩定，淨收入創歷史新高，不良資產水平持續較低，季度淨利潤位居第二導致了公司的歷史。

We feel like we've managed well through a somewhat turbulent period thus far in 2023, delivering net income. That was a record for the first 9-month period of any fiscal year in the history of the company, and we have a positive outlook for continued growth in assets, revenues and earnings.

我們覺得 2023 年到目前為止，我們已經很好地度過了一段有些動盪的時期，實現了淨利潤。這是該公司歷史上任何財年前 9 個月的記錄，我們對資產、收​​入和收益的持續成長抱持著積極的前景。

So with that, I will conclude my comments and turn it over to Rich Murphy to discuss credit.

因此，我將總結我的評論並將其交給 Rich Murphy 討論信用問題。

Thanks, Dave. As noted earlier, credit performance continued to be very solid in the third quarter from a number of perspectives. As Dave noted and as detailed on Slide 6 of the deck, loan growth for the quarter was $423 million. If you adjust for the sale of the premium finance loans in July, total loans increased by $767 million or 7% on an annualized basis.

謝謝，戴夫。如前所述，從多個角度來看，第三季的信貸表現仍然非常穩健。正如 Dave 所指出的以及幻燈片 6 中詳細介紹的那樣，本季的貸款成長為 4.23 億美元。如果對 7 月份優質融資貸款的銷售進行調整，貸款總額將增加 7.67 億美元，按年化計算增長 7%。

This growth is due to a number of factors. Commercial premium finance volumes remain strong as we continue to see a significantly harder market for insurance premiums, particularly for commercial properties, resulting in higher average loan sizes. We also continue to see new opportunities as a result of consolidation within the premium finance industry. Finally, we saw good growth in commercial real estate, largely from draws on existing construction loans, and our leasing group had another solid quarter.

這種增長是由於多種因素造成的。商業保費融資量依然強勁，因為我們持續看到保費市場（尤其是商業房地產）的情況明顯嚴峻，導致平均貸款規模上升。我們也持續看到高端金融業整合帶來的新機會。最後，我們看到商業房地產的良好成長，主要來自現有建築貸款的提取，而我們的租賃集團又取得了穩健的季度業績。

This rate of loan growth when adjusted for the sale of loans in the quarter is in line with our guidance of mid- to high single digits. We also believe that loan growth for the fourth quarter will continue to be within our guidance for the following reasons. Commercial premium finance should continue to show solid growth. Our core C&I pipelines look very good, and our leasing teams continue to see significant demand in the market. And as we have noted on prior calls, we continue to benefit from disruptions in the banking landscape, and have seen numerous quality opportunities in our core businesses.

根據本季貸款銷售調整後的貸款成長率符合我們中高個位數的指引。我們也認為，由於以下原因，第四季的貸款成長將繼續在我們的指導範圍內。商業保費融資應持續呈現穩健成長。我們的核心工商業管道看起來非常好，我們的租賃團隊繼續看到市場的巨大需求。正如我們在先前的電話會議中指出的那樣，我們繼續受益於銀行業格局的混亂，並在我們的核心業務中看到了許多優質機會。

In addition, we are looking at a number of lending teams and niche lending opportunities that come from dislocations at other regional banks. Offsetting this growth will be continued pressure on line utilization, which is down to 37% and is higher borrowing costs have negatively affected usage for the past several quarters, and we anticipate that higher borrowing costs will continue to cause borrowers to reconsider the economics of new projects, business expansion, and equipment purchases.

此外，我們正在尋找一些來自其他區域銀行混亂的貸款團隊和利基貸款機會。線路利用率持續面臨壓力，抵消了這一增長，線路利用率下降至37%，而且借貸成本上升對過去幾個季度的使用產生了負面影響，我們預計借貸成本上升將繼續導致借款人重新考慮新線路的經濟性。專案、業務擴展和設備採購。

In summary, we continue to be optimistic about loan growth for the balance of 2023, and we believe our diversified portfolio and position within the competitive landscape will allow us to grow within our guidance of mid- to high single digits and maintain our credit discipline.

總而言之，我們繼續對2023 年剩餘的貸款成長持樂觀態度，我們相信，我們多元化的投資組合和在競爭格局中的地位將使我們能夠在中高個位數的指導範圍內增長，並維持我們的信用紀律。

From a credit quality perspective, as detailed on Slide 13, we continue to see strong credit performance across the portfolio. This can be seen in a number of metrics. Nonperforming loans increased by $24 million in the quarter, from 26 basis points to 32 basis points. However, $20 million of this increase is in the premium finance portfolio. These loans are secured by the unearned premiums, and we would anticipate no additional losses.

從信用品質的角度來看，如投影片 13 所示，我們持續看到整個投資組合的信用表現強勁。這可以從許多指標看出。本季不良貸款增加 2,400 萬美元，從 26 個基點增加到 32 個基點。然而，這一增量中有 2,000 萬美元來自高端金融投資組合。這些貸款由未到期保費擔保，我們預計不會造成額外損失。

Overall, NPLs continue to be at historically low levels, and we are confident about solid credit performance of the portfolio going forward.

整體而言，不良貸款持續處於歷史低位，我們對投資組合未來穩健的信用表現充滿信心。

Charge-offs for the quarter were $8.1 million or 8 basis points, down from $17 million in the second quarter. And finally, as detailed on Slide 13, we saw stable levels in our special mention and substandard loans, with no meaningful signs of additional economic stress at the customer level.

本季的沖銷額為 810 萬美元，即 8 個基點，低於第二季的 1,700 萬美元。最後，如投影片 13 所示，我們看到特別關注貸款和次級貸款水準穩定，在客戶層面沒有額外經濟壓力的明顯跡象。

As noted in our last few earnings calls, we continue to be highly focused on our exposure to commercial real estate loans, which composed roughly 1/4 of our total portfolio. Higher borrowing costs and pressure on occupancy and lease rates are cause for concern, particularly in the office category.

正如我們在最近幾次財報電話會議中所指出的，我們繼續高度關注商業房地產貸款，該貸款約占我們總投資組合的 1/4。較高的借貸成本以及入住率和租賃率的壓力令人擔憂，特別是在辦公室類別。

On Slide 17, we've updated a number of the important characteristics in our office portfolio. Currently, this portfolio remains steady at $1.4 billion or 13% of our total CRE exposure, and only 3.4% of our total loan portfolio. Of the $1.4 billion of office exposure, 42% is medical office or owner occupied. The average size of a loan in the office portfolio continues to be around $1.3 million, and we have only 5 loans above $20 million.

在投影片 17 上，我們更新了辦公室產品組合中的一些重要特徵。目前，該投資組合穩定在 14 億美元，占我們 CRE 總風險敞口的 13%，僅占我們貸款組合總額的 3.4%。在 14 億美元的辦公室風險中，42% 是由醫療辦公室或業主佔用的。辦公室投資組合中貸款的平均規模仍然在 130 萬美元左右，而我們只有 5 筆貸款超過 2,000 萬美元。

We continue to closely monitor loans secured by office properties located within central business districts. Our CBD exposure is limited to $364 million or approximately 1/4 of the office portfolio. Half of this is in Chicago and half of this is in other cities. The bulk of our portfolio is located in suburban areas and areas outside central business districts. And NPLs in this category were flat quarter-over-quarter and continue to be at very nominal levels.

我們繼續密切監控以位於中央商務區的辦公物業擔保的貸款。我們的 CBD 風險敞口僅限於 3.64 億美元，約佔辦公室投資組合的 1/4。其中一半在芝加哥，一半在其他城市。我們的投資組合大多位於郊區和中央商務區以外的地區。該類別的不良貸款環比持平，並繼續保持在非常名義的水平。

We continue to perform portfolio reviews regularly on this portfolio, and we stay very engaged with our borrowers. As we have noted previously, we are not immune for the macro effects that challenge this product type, but we believe our portfolio is well constructed very granular and should perform well moving forward.

我們繼續定期對此投資組合進行投資組合審查，並與借款人保持密切聯繫。正如我們之前所指出的，我們不能倖免於挑戰這種產品類型的宏觀影響，但我們相信我們的投資組合結構良好，非常精細，並且應該在未來表現良好。

To better understand the stresses in our portfolio, our CRE team updated their deep dive analysis on every loan over $2.5 million, which will be renewing between now and the second quarter of 2024. This analysis, which covered 80% of all CRE loans maturing during this period resulted in the following.

為了更好地了解我們投資組合中的壓力，我們的CRE 團隊更新了對每筆超過250 萬美元貸款的深入分析，該分析將從現在到2024 年第二季度進行更新。該分析涵蓋了2024 年到期的所有CRE 貸款的80%這段期間產生了以下結果。

Roughly 1/2 of these loans will clearly qualify for a renewal at prevailing rates. Roughly 35% of these loans are anticipated to be paid off or will require a short-term extension at prevailing rates. The remaining 16% of these loans will require some additional attention, which could include a paydown or a pledge of additional collateral.

這些貸款中大約 1/2 顯然有資格以現行利率續約。這些貸款中約 35% 預計將得到償還或需要以現行利率進行短期延期。這些貸款的其餘 16% 需要額外關注，其中可能包括還款或額外抵押品的承諾。

We have back checked the results of these deep dives conducted during prior quarters, and have found that the projected outcomes versus actual outcomes were very tightly correlated. And generally speaking, borrowers whose loans deemed to require additional attention, continue to support their loans by providing enhancements, including principal reductions.

我們回溯了前幾季進行的深入研究的結果，發現預測結果與實際結果非常緊密相關。一般來說，那些被認為需要額外關注的貸款的借款人會繼續透過提供增強措施（包括本金減免）來支持其貸款。

Again, our portfolio is not immune from the rising effects -- from the effects of rising rates or the market forces behind lease rates, but we have been diligently identifying weaknesses in the portfolio and working with our borrowers to identify the best possible outcomes, and we believe that our portfolio is in reasonably good shape and situated to weather the challenges ahead.

同樣，我們的投資組合也不能免受不斷上升的影響——利率上升或租賃利率背後的市場力量的影響，但我們一直在努力找出投資組合中的弱點，並與借款人合作，以確定最佳的可能結果，我們相信，我們的投資組合狀況相當良好，能夠應對未來的挑戰。

That concludes my comments on credit, and I'll turn it back to Tim.

我對信用的評論到此結束，我會將其轉回給蒂姆。

Thanks, Rich. Just to wrap up our prepared remarks, we continue to believe that we're very well positioned, perhaps uniquely positioned to take advantage of the current environment with our diverse businesses. Although the last several quarters, we've taken steps to achieve an interest rate sensitivity position much closer to neutral, we will benefit from rates that may be higher for longer. And based on current economic conditions and current banking conditions, we expect a margin that will be reasonably stable in a narrow range around the current level for the coming quarters.

謝謝，里奇。總結一下我們準備好的發言，我們仍然相信我們處於非常有利的位置，也許具有獨特的優勢，可以透過我們的多元化業務來利用當前的環境。儘管在過去的幾個季度中，我們已採取措施使利率敏感度更接近中性，但我們仍將受益於可能在較長時間內保持較高利率的情況。根據當前的經濟狀況和當前的銀行業狀況，我們預計未來幾季的利潤率將在當前水準附近的窄幅區間內合理穩定。

Rich noted some evidence of slowing economic activity. I can tell you we remain very active but disciplined in what I would call a choppy market. But as also noted, there are clearly opportunities, and we will continue to pursue them aggressively in the coming months.

里奇注意到一些經濟活動放緩的證據。我可以告訴你，我們仍然非常活躍，但在我所說的波動市場中保持紀律。但正如我們所指出的，顯然存在著機會，我們將在未來幾個月繼續積極追求這些機會。

At this point, I'll pause and Latif, if you open it up, we can take some questions.

此時，我會暫停一下，拉蒂夫，如果你打開它，我們可以回答一些問題。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from the line of Jon Arfstrom of RBC Capital Markets.

（操作員說明）我們的第一個問題來自 RBC Capital Markets 的 Jon Arfstrom。

Tim, a question for you on topic you just discussed on the kind of the near-term versus medium-term margin outlook. Are you saying that beyond the fourth quarter, based on the asset pricing cadence that you see, that the margin can start to march higher in 2024? Is that stable in the fourth quarter, potentially moving higher in '24? Is that the message?

提姆，您剛才討論的一個問題是關於近期與中期利潤前景的問題。您是說，根據您所看到的資產定價節奏，第四季度之後，利潤率可能會在 2024 年開始走高？第四季是否穩定，24 年可能會走高？是這個消息嗎？

Yes. I mean I think there's obviously a number of moving pieces to this, Jon. At the moment, looking out a quarter or 2, we think, pretty stable. After that, I think there's signs that we would feel optimistic about. But clearly, there's a lot that goes into it past the next quarter or 2.

是的。我的意思是，我認為這顯然有很多令人感動的部分，喬恩。目前，我們認為，展望一、兩個季度，相當穩定。在那之後，我認為有跡象表明我們會感到樂觀。但顯然，下一兩個季度之後將會有很多事情發生。

Okay. How about hedging appetite? Is the plan to continue to hedge more? Do you feel like you've done what you need to do?

好的。對沖食慾怎麼樣？是否計劃繼續加大對沖力度？你覺得你已經做了你需要做的事情嗎？

Well, one, for those of you that are kind of following, there is a description of our hedges in the appendix that we share with everybody. That shows about $6.3 billion of hedges, 1 added in the first -- or in the third quarter. We've subsequently added another small hedge. And I think we would continue to kind of follow the market up, Jon, if we have the opportunity to do that.

嗯，第一，對於那些關注的人，我們在附錄中與大家分享了對我們的對沖的描述。這表明對沖金額約為 63 億美元，其中 1 是在第一季或第三季增加的。隨後我們又增加了另一個小對沖。我認為，喬恩，如果我們有機會這樣做，我們將繼續追蹤市場的趨勢。

As we've talked about, our desire is to certainly narrow the downside exposure on our margin. And performed well with the margin in the mid-3s. We work hard to stay in that range.

正如我們所討論的，我們的願望是縮小利潤率的下行風險。並且表現良好，差距在三分之三左右。我們努力保持在這個範圍內。

Okay. And then, Rich, a question for you on the premium finance nonperformers. Can you -- I think I understand it, but can you explain it? And why is it up? And when does this stuff get resolved naturally?

好的。然後，里奇，請教您一個關於優質金融不良企業的問題。你能——我想我明白了，但你能解釋一下嗎？為什麼會這樣呢？而這個事情什麼時候才能自然解決呢？

Yes. Well, 2 different buckets of loans there, Jon. And roughly equal to each other. If you look at Page 13, there is Slide 13. You can kind of see what the effects are. So I'll take each one individually.

是的。嗯，有兩桶不同的貸款，喬恩。且彼此大致相等。如果你看第 13 頁，有投影片 13。你可以看到效果是什麼。所以我將分別對待每一項。

In the P&C side, we are seeing a little bit more stress in the transportation area. So those loans are falling more delinquent more often. We do the analysis on those, and if there is a loss, we will take the loss, and then we'll get the unearned premium back from the carrier. So in that situation, there is some economic deterioration that is causing more of those numbers to go 90 days past due.

在財產險方面，我們看到運輸領域的壓力更大一些。因此，這些貸款的拖欠率越來越高。我們對這些進行分析，如果有損失，我們將承擔損失，然後我們將從承運人處收回未賺取的保費。因此，在這種情況下，經濟惡化會導致更多的數字逾期 90 天。

Now that's again, the loss given default is unchanged there, but you are seeing incidents of default group go up there in that category.

現在，違約損失沒有改變，但您會看到該類別中違約群體的事件增加。

The life category is a little bit different, it's a similar amount, about $10 million. And those really result from, as rates have come up and people get to the maturity of their loan, and they are looking at renewing that policy, they have to make a decision whether it still makes economic sense for them. And those conversations can get elongated, and we want to work with our clients and give them time to make that decision in an orderly fashion. So we are not necessarily automatically sending and canceling the policy and going back to the carrier. We want to make sure that we work with the client.

人壽類別有點不同，金額相似，大約1000萬美元。這些真正的原因是，隨著利率上升，人們的貸款到期，他們正在考慮更新該政策，他們必須做出決定，該政策對他們是否仍然具有經濟意義。這些對話可能會延長，我們希望與客戶合作，給他們時間以有序的方式做出決定。因此，我們不一定會自動發送並取消保單並將其退還給營運商。我們希望確保與客戶合作。

So those might extend beyond 90 days past due. But generally speaking, they're always going to be fully insured, and we wouldn't anticipate that there would be any problems there. Those loans that are 90 days past due that we have identified here, we would anticipate that those will be gone by the end of this month.

因此，這些期限可能會超過逾期 90 天。但一般來說，他們總是會得到充分的保險，我們預計不會有任何問題。我們在此確定的那些逾期 90 天的貸款，我們預計這些貸款將在本月底消失。

Okay. Okay. And on the commercial NPOs, if this is a persistent issue, you're saying that you're thinking that could remain elevated, but this is kind of the 9-month loan on a 12-month insurance contract. Is that that's the structure? Is that right?

好的。好的。對於商業非營利組織，如果這是一個持續存在的問題，那麼您是說您認為該問題可能會繼續升高，但這有點像 12 個月保險合約上的 9 個月貸款。是這樣的結構嗎？是對的嗎？

Yes. That's right. And we do think that loans within our P&C portfolio that apply to transportation will have a little bit more pressure, and you still may see ongoing default.

是的。這是正確的。我們確實認為，我們的財產和意外險投資組合中適用於交通運輸的貸款將面臨更大的壓力，而且您仍然可能會看到持續的違約。

A couple of important points there is that we are getting a pretty good sized premium on those, and we get reasonable late charges. So we are getting paid for that risk. So we're not all that concerned about it from that perspective. But we also are taking some measures here to make sure that we are -- our underwriting is maybe addressing some of those things. So we are getting a little bit tighter in that space. But generally speaking, again, while this is an elevated level, we're not concerned about future losses out of it.

有幾個重要的點是，我們在這些方面獲得了相當大的溢價，我們獲得了合理的滯納金。因此，我們正在為這種風險付出代價。因此，從這個角度來看，我們並不那麼關心它。但我們也正在採取一些措施，以確保我們的承保可能正在解決其中一些問題。所以我們在這個空間上變得有點緊張。但總的來說，雖然這是一個較高的水平，但我們並不擔心未來的損失。

Our next question comes from the line of Chris McGratty of KBW.

我們的下一個問題來自 KBW 的 Chris McGratty。

Dave, I want to go at the NII. Again, a lot of your peers are still defending the trough or trying to find the trough for 6 months out. You gave the guide for continued growth in NII in Q4, kind of a stable-ish margin and higher for longer. You've got that unique back book. But it would feel like NII continues to grow throughout 2024. Maybe the pace is not as significant. But is that a fair estimate based on what you see in the world?

戴夫，我想去 NII。同樣，你的許多同行仍在捍衛低谷或試圖在 6 個月後找到低谷。您給出了第四季度 NII 持續成長的指南，利潤率保持穩定，並且在較長時間內保持較高水準。你有那本獨特的背書。但感覺 NII 會在 2024 年持續成長。也許成長速度沒有那麼快。但根據你在世界上看到的情況，這是一個公平的估計嗎？

Well, yes, I think that's how we look at it, Chris. Obviously, the Fed kills the economy and loan growth slows quite a bit, that would have an impact. But the benefit of being diversified in our asset classes, as Rich has said many times in the past, is if one area slows down and other area is doing okay. So we do think we can keep growing our loans in that mid- to high single-digit range.

嗯，是的，我想我們就是這麼看的，克里斯。顯然，聯準會會扼殺經濟，貸款成長會大幅放緩，這會產生影響。但正如里奇過去多次說過的那樣，資產類別多元化的好處是，如果一個領域放緩，而其他領域表現良好。因此，我們確實認為我們可以繼續在中高個位數範圍內增加貸款。

And as Tim just talked about on the prior question, we think stable and potentially optimistic in the latter half of the year as far as the margin goes. But again, it depends on where the interest rate curve is and all that kind of stuff and how competitive deposit cost is. If that picks up right now, we said we see it moderating. So it's very positive.

正如蒂姆剛剛談到的上一個問題，我們認為下半年的利潤率將保持穩定且可能樂觀。但同樣，這取決於利率曲線的位置以及所有此類因素以及存款成本的競爭力。如果現在這種情況有所好轉，我們說我們看到它正在放緩。所以這是非常積極的。

So I guess a long-winded answer to say, yes, we still think we can grow mid- to high single digits, and we think the margin is stable. So if that's the case, we think we can have growth.

所以我想一個冗長的答案是，是的，我們仍然認為我們可以實現中高個位數的成長，而且我們認為利潤率是穩定的。因此，如果是這樣的話，我們認為我們可以實現成長。

Okay. Great. Just on the loan sales, can you just remind us -- you talked about it last quarter, kind of testing the (inaudible). I mean, should we expect more of that to occur? And was there a -- I assume there's a gain that showed up in the noninterest income. Just trying to get to logistics.

好的。偉大的。關於貸款銷售，您能否提醒我們 - 您上個季度談過，有點測試（聽不清楚）。我的意思是，我們應該期待更多這樣的事情發生嗎？我認為非利息收入是否有增加。只是想進入物流領域。

Yes. Well, we're not planning on any right now. As you said, I mean, if you go back into the second quarter when we started to plan this and we did the sale early in the third quarter as we talked about on the last call. We really did it as a way to demonstrate that, that portfolio has liquidity. And it pays down very rapidly. We would expect the majority of that impact to be gone by the end of this fiscal year, since these are 9-month full payout loans, and we'll be 6 months into it. So there'll be very little, really left of that impact.

是的。好吧，我們現在沒有任何計劃。正如你所說，我的意思是，如果你回到第二季度，當我們開始計劃這一點時，我們在第三季度初就進行了銷售，正如我們在上次電話會議中談到的那樣。我們這樣做實際上是為了證明該投資組合具有流動性。而且回報非常快。我們預計大部分影響將在本財年結束時消失，因為這些是為期 9 個月的全額還款貸款，而我們將進入 6 個月。因此，這種影響其實已經所剩無幾了。

But we wanted to be able to demonstrate that we had liquidity. We wanted to be able to make sure we had a tool in case concentrations of those premium finance portfolio has got too high. And we wanted to be able to have the plumbing in place in case there was any future liquidity events that happened in the industry. So we just thought it was prudent to do the sale, put the plumbing in place, test it out and move forward.

但我們希望能夠證明我們擁有流動性。我們希望能夠確保我們擁有一個工具，以防這些優質金融投資組合的集中度過高。我們希望能夠做好準備，以防產業未來發生任何流動性事件。因此，我們只是認為進行銷售是謹慎的做法，將管道安裝到位，進行測試並繼續前進。

But right now, based upon the good deposit growth that we're having and our funding ability to continue to fund those loans and our loan-to-deposit ratio being in a spot that we like it, we don't have any expectations that we'll do another sale in the near term. But the facility is there in the event we need for some reason.

但目前，基於我們良好的存款成長以及我們繼續為這些貸款提供資金的融資能力，以及我們的貸存比率處於我們喜歡的水平，我們不抱有任何期望我們將在短期內進行另一次銷售。但如果我們出於某種原因需要，該設施就在那裡。

Perfect. And then maybe the last one, you went through all the moving parts of noninterest income, and I think the $0.5 million. How do we think about just the trajectory of your fees with mortgage obviously pretty depressed, but you've got other offsets from here?

完美的。然後也許是最後一個，你經歷了非利息收入的所有變動部分，我認為是 50 萬美元。我們如何看待您的費用軌跡，抵押貸款顯然相當低迷，但您還有其他抵消措施？

Yes. Well, mortgage and wealth management are 2 big areas. Service charges sort of just plug along and maybe grow with the growth of your business and retail accounts. But mortgages, the pipelines are pretty consistent, and they're in the 80%, 85% purchase business. Maybe that slows down a little bit in the winter months, since the majority of our originations come out of the Chicago, Milwaukee and Minnesota markets.

是的。嗯，抵押貸款和財富管理是兩大領域。服務費可能會隨著您的業務和零售帳戶的成長而成長。但抵押貸款、通路相當一致，而且它們都屬於 80%、85% 的購買業務。也許在冬季，這種情況會放緩，因為我們的大部分產品都來自芝加哥、密爾瓦基和明尼蘇達市場。

But applications, I think, are about as low as they go. So we would expect steady originations. Gain on sale margins have been holding in, a little above 2%. And so we think that will just plug along and then there might be some fluctuation depending upon movements in rates and the impact on mortgage servicing rights, but we try to hedge that impact pretty well, too.

但我認為，申請數量已經是最低的了。因此，我們期望穩定的起源。銷售利潤率一直保持在略高於 2% 的水平。因此，我們認為這只會持續下去，然後可能會出現一些波動，這取決於利率的變動和對抵押貸款服務權的影響，但我們也試圖很好地對沖這種影響。

So I think our personal opinion is I think mortgage probably bounces along here for the next couple of quarters. Hopefully, in the spring buying season, we see some green shoots and some improvement in the applications and the production. But I don't see anything that would indicate that it would increase rapidly in the near term or decrease rapidly. We just -- it's been plugging along at these levels for 4, 5, 6 months now. So we expect that to continue.

因此，我認為我們個人的觀點是，抵押貸款可能會在接下來的幾季中出現反彈。希望在春季購買季節，我們能看到一些新芽以及應用和生產的一些改進。但我沒有看到任何跡象表明它會在短期內迅速增加或迅速減少。我們只是 - 它已經在這些水平上堅持了 4、5、6 個月了。所以我們預計這種情況會持續下去。

Wealth management somewhat depends upon on the movement of the underlying assets under management and their valuations because the fees are based upon a lot of the values. But we continue to try to hire people and grow that business, but it's a little bit slower trajectory forward, but we would expect it to grow. So we've got some leasing income in there, et cetera, but the rest is pretty small.

財富管理在某種程度上取決於所管理的基礎資產的變動及其估值，因為費用是基於許多價值的。但我們繼續嘗試僱用人員並發展業務，但前進的軌跡有點慢，但我們預計它會成長。所以我們有一些租賃收入等等，但其餘的收入很小。

(Operator Instructions) Our next question comes from the line of Terry McEvoy of Stephens Inc.

（操作員說明）我們的下一個問題來自 Stephens Inc. 的 Terry McEvoy。

Maybe start with the question, the expense outlook for the fourth quarter. There were a couple items called out on the expense line right in the opening of the press release. But can you share some thoughts on 4Q? And maybe while I'm on, any initial thoughts on 2024 expenses, whether that will track kind of historical growth rates or we are hearing from some other banks that they're looking at expenses with some internal plans to kind of control that growth rate?

也許從第四季的費用前景這個問題開始。在新聞稿的開頭，費用欄上列出了一些項目。但您能分享一些關於 4Q 的想法嗎？也許在我發言的同時，對 2024 年支出有任何初步想法，是否會跟踪歷史增長率，或者我們從其他一些銀行那裡聽到他們正在通過一些內部計劃來考慮支出，以控制增長率？

Yes. Well, you're right, Terry. We call out about $6 million of sort of uncommon expenses that we wouldn't expect to recur in the fourth quarter. So that's $330 million. You take those doubts, $324-ish million or something like that. So probably somewhere plus or minus in that area for the fourth quarter.

是的。嗯，你是對的，特里。我們列出了大約 600 萬美元的不常見費用，我們預計這些費用不會在第四季度再次出現。也就是 3.3 億美元。你可以接受這些疑慮，約3.24 億美元。因此，第四季度該領域可能會出現正負。

We haven't really given guidance for '24 yet, but generally speaking, our thought is that we're a growth company. And we have lots of opportunities. We're uniquely positioned here in Chicago right now with our size and how we stack up against the competition. Basically, we're going against big banks and small community banks.

我們還沒有真正給出 24 世紀的指導，但總的來說，我們的想法是我們是一家成長型公司。我們有很多機會。我們目前在芝加哥處於獨特的地位，無論是我們的規模還是我們在競爭中的競爭力。基本上，我們反對的是大銀行和小型社區銀行。

There just aren't a lot of banks between $10 billion and $50 billion that are headquartered in the Chicago area. So we have a unique position here that we think we can take advantage of. And we also have our niche businesses that can help out.

總部設在芝加哥地區的資產規模在 100 億美元到 500 億美元之間的銀行並不多。因此，我們在這裡擁有獨特的地位，我們認為我們可以利用這一優勢。我們也有自己的利基業務可以提供協助。

So we've always thought of ourselves as a growth company. We still think we can grow. Deposits are out there and having good growth. And so we'd rather grow into this. And if we grow mid- to high single digits, we would expect that our noninterest expenses would grow at a rate less than that, maybe mid-single digits. And so we can leverage the infrastructure going forward.

所以我們一直認為自己是一家成長型公司。我們仍然認為我們可以成長。存款已經存在並且增長良好。所以我們寧願成長為這樣。如果我們成長中個位數到高個位數，我們預期非利息支出的成長速度將低於這個數字，也許是中個位數。因此我們可以利用未來的基礎設施。

If for some reason the growth doesn't come, there are certainly levers we can pull to try to reduce expenses. But the plan is to grow into it and leverage the infrastructure. And as I said, actually, our noninterest expenses, even with that $6 million in there, as a percent of average assets was down a little bit this quarter. So we're going to watch them. We're going to control them, but we're still expecting to be growing the franchise and taking advantage of opportunities in the marketplace. And that's always been the plan and continues to be the plan.

如果由於某種原因沒有實現成長，我們當然可以採取一些措施來減少開支。但計劃是向其中發展並利用基礎設施。正如我所說，實際上，我們的非利息支出（即使有 600 萬美元）佔平均資產的百分比在本季度略有下降。所以我們要觀察他們。我們將控制它們，但我們仍然期望擴大特許經營權並利用市場上的機會。這一直是並且仍然是計劃。

And then maybe as a follow-up, the $337 million of CRE growth in the third quarter, can you help us understand how much of that came from, kind of market opportunities, new customers, versus current customers? And how successful have you been in bringing or having them bring over their deposit relationships or business as well?

接下來，第三季商業房地產成長 3.37 億美元，您能否幫助我們了解其中有多少來自市場機會、新客戶與現有客戶？您在引進或讓他們引進存款關係或業務方面取得了多大成功？

Yes, I'll answer that sort of in reverse order. Pretty much any new opportunity that we're looking at, it's assumed that we're going to be getting meaningful deposits, that's number one. As it relates to the growth, as I said in my comments, the majority of what we're seeing there are draws on existing facilities that we have with existing customers. But there's a -- probably about 40% of that total comes from opportunities that we're seeing in the marketplace.

是的，我會以相反的順序回答這個問題。幾乎我們正在尋找的任何新機會，都假設我們將獲得有意義的存款，這是第一位的。正如我在評論中所說，由於它與成長有關，我們所看到的大部分內容都利用了我們與現有客戶的現有設施。但其中約 40% 可能來自我們在市場上看到的機會。

As you know, a lot of other banks are really out of that space right now, and there are good opportunities out there for us to bring over clients. So it's a little bit of a mix, but the majority is still with existing clients and existing outstandings.

如您所知，許多其他銀行現在確實沒有這個空間，而我們有很好的機會來吸引客戶。因此，這有點混合，但大多數仍然是現有客戶和現有的優秀客戶。

Our next question comes from the line of David Long of Raymond James.

我們的下一個問題來自雷蒙德詹姆斯的大衛朗。

Thanks for the update on loan growth expectations. It sounds like the pipeline is still pretty good. My question, when I'm looking at the surveys of lenders, there's not a -- does not seem to be a big appetite to lend or much of a demand for loans as there has been. What's making Wintrust different here? How are you guys able to grow the portfolio when the market may be expecting more of a flattish outlook for loan growth?

感謝您提供有關貸款成長預期的最新資訊。聽起來管道還是很不錯的。我的問題是，當我查看貸款機構的調查時，發現貸款人似乎沒有像以前那樣有很大的貸款興趣或很大的貸款需求。是什麼讓 Wintrust 與眾不同？當市場預期貸款成長前景更加黯淡時，你們如何能夠擴大投資組合？

As we've talked about in the past, loan growth comes in many different forms for us. So you go back to a point when we are just out of the pandemic or in the middle of the pandemic and rates were very low. Life finance was just going crazy. Now that slowed down. But in the meantime, you have the P&C side kind of filling in that gap.

正如我們過去談到的，貸款成長對我們來說有多種不同的形式。所以你可以回到我們剛剛擺脫大流行或大流行中期的時候，比率非常低。人壽金融簡直要瘋了。現在速度減慢了。但同時，財險方面也在某種程度上填補了這一空白。

So having a multipronged approach to lending really does make a difference for us, in terms of when you have growth in certain areas. But more specifically, as it relates to maybe the core businesses, I would say that we've been pretty disciplined about the way our portfolio is constructed. A lot of banks right now would look at their CRE bucket and say it's probably more than ideal. We would say that right now, we still have an appetite for CRE loans. And so we're able to take advantage of that dislocation in the market.

因此，就某些領域的成長而言，採取多管齊下的貸款方式確實對我們產生了影響。但更具體地說，因為它可能與核心業務有關，我想說我們對投資組合的建構方式非常嚴格。現在很多銀行都會審視他們的商業房地產類別，並表示這可能非常理想。我們可以說，目前我們對商業房地產貸款仍然有興趣。因此，我們能夠利用市場的混亂。

Similarly, that with a lot of the -- David, as you know, in Chicago, we've had a tremendous amount of disruption with the players in Chicago, and we're seeing lots of opportunities on the C&I side for companies that we've been actively trying to bring over for some time. And they just, for whatever reason, stuck with the incumbent until they just couldn't take it any longer. And so as a result, we've been able to bring over a lot of those.

同樣，大衛，正如你所知，在芝加哥，我們對芝加哥的球員造成了巨大的干擾，我們在 C&I 方面看到了很多我們所關注的公司的機會。一段時間以來一直在積極嘗試帶過來。不管出於什麼原因，他們只是堅持現任者，直到他們再也無法忍受為止。因此，我們已經能夠帶來很多這樣的東西。

So we continue to be pretty bullish about growing that portfolio, particularly on the core side, we really see a lot of nice opportunities right now.

因此，我們仍然非常看好擴大該投資組合，特別是在核心方面，我們現在確實看到了許多不錯的機會。

And David, we've been disciplined on pricing, but loan demand is there. You just have to pick your spots, and we're getting a lot of looks.

大衛，我們在定價方面一直受到嚴格約束，但貸款需求是存在的。你只需要選擇你的位置，我們就會得到很多目光。

Yes, that's a great point, Tim. I mean where structures have been, if you go back 18 months ago, 24 months ago, structures were pretty loose. Pricing was pretty tight. And those were times where we were -- there were deals that we just stepped away from.

是的，這是一個很好的觀點，提姆。我的意思是，如果你回到 18 個月、24 個月前，結構是相當鬆散的。定價相當緊張。那些時候，我們剛剛放棄了一些交易。

Right now, you can get better structure, you can get better pricing. And we try to be very disciplined in that space.

現在，你可以獲得更好的結構，可以獲得更好的定價。我們努力在這個領域保持嚴格的紀律。

Yes. Well, I'd just say we can continue to grow deposits. We've proven for a couple of quarters that we can fund the loan growth, and our desire would be to continue to grow the deposit base. It's kind of the core of our franchise. And we've talked several times about the fact that we're 6%, 7%, 8% market share in deposits in the Chicago area, opportunities in Milwaukee as well. So even though the [6 30] deposit share results were pretty good for us, we think that's just the beginning.

是的。嗯，我只想說我們可以繼續增加存款。幾個季度以來，我們已經證明我們可以為貸款成長提供資金，我們的願望是繼續擴大存款基礎。這是我們特許經營的核心。我們已經多次談論過這樣一個事實：我們在芝加哥地區的存款市佔率為 6%、7%、8%，在密爾瓦基的機會也是如此。因此，儘管 [6 30] 存款份額結果對我們來說相當不錯，但我們認為這只是一個開始。

Yes. I would say sort of the macro summary on your question is that there is no shortage of opportunities to lend money out there right now. And I think there's a lot of banks that are just maybe unwilling for the deposits and capital reasons. So our job is to take advantage of this moment.

是的。我想說，對你的問題的宏觀總結是，現在不缺乏借錢的機會。我認為有很多銀行可能只是因為存款和資本原因而不願意這樣做。所以我們的工作就是要利用這個時機。

So it sounds like the strategy is still focused on organic growth because that's what the market is giving you. What is the appetite for M&A at this point? And what does the backdrop or what needs to change in the backdrop, maybe for you guys to be more opportunistic on that front to accelerate growth?

所以聽起來策略仍然側重於有機成長，因為這就是市場給你的。目前併購的意願如何？背景是什麼或背景需要改變什麼，也許你們在這方面更有機會主義以加速成長？

Well, there are acquisition-type opportunities. So whether that's a portfolio of loans or whether it's a piece of a business or in some cases, the conversations around kind of bank M&A are picking up. But we're pretty disciplined and some of these portfolios are challenged from a pricing perspective. And we don't need to do that kind of growth given the opportunities that we have.

嗯，有收購類型的機會。因此，無論是貸款組合還是業務的一部分，或者在某些情況下，圍繞銀行併購的討論都在升溫。但我們非常自律，其中一些投資組合在定價方面面臨挑戰。鑑於我們擁有的機會，我們不需要進行這種成長。

If some of those look like good opportunities to us, we may add some people, for example, in areas where we've got good businesses. There are some folks available in the market right now, but I think we'll stay pretty disciplined.

如果其中一些對我們來說是很好的機會，我們可能會增加一些人員，例如，在我們擁有良好業務的領域。現在市場上有一些人，但我認為我們會保持相當自律。

Got it. I appreciate the color there.

知道了。我很欣賞那裡的顏色。

Our next question comes from the line of Casey Haire of Jefferies.

我們的下一個問題來自 Jefferies 的 Casey Haire。

I guess just -- sorry if I missed this, I wanted to follow up a little bit more on the NIM discussion, but did you guys disclose what spot loan yields were and deposit costs at [9.30%]?

我想只是 - 抱歉，如果我錯過了這一點，我想對 NIM 討論進行更多跟進，但是你們是否透露了現貨貸款收益率和存款成本 [9.30%] 是多少？

No, we haven't done that. But what we could tell you is that the margin was right near the current level at the end of the period, and we're really focused on the net margin going forward. But deposit pricing has moderated, as you can see, and we expect that to continue into the fourth quarter. But no, we didn't provide that.

不，我們還沒有這樣做。但我們可以告訴您的是，期末利潤率正好接近當前水平，我們真正關注的是未來的淨利潤率。但正如您所看到的，存款定價已經放緩，我們預計這種情況將持續到第四季度。但不，我們沒有提供這一點。

Okay. Very good. And then just, I guess, switching to credit. The ACL on the core book at 1.51%, obviously very strong. Just curious, what kind of scenario are you guys baking in, be it slowdown, S3? Or any color on what kind of unemployment rate that which is driving your CECL modeling.

好的。非常好。然後，我想，就轉向信貸了。核心帳面上的ACL為1.51%，顯然非常強勁。只是好奇，你們正在經歷什麼樣的場景，是減速，S3？或用任何顏色來表示推動 CECL 建模的失業率類型。

Yes. Well, I mean we use a number -- we look at it a number of different ways. I mean, we used as a base, we use Moody's base case scenario, but we do also look at other economic scenarios to build our case. We don't have a big consumer portfolio. So unemployment is generally not a big impact in our models with correlation. We use a consumer real estate price index, the BAA credit spreads and a few other factors. Those didn't have a major impact quarter-over-quarter change.

是的。嗯，我的意思是我們使用一個數字——我們用多種不同的方式來看待它。我的意思是，我們使用穆迪的基本案例情境作為基礎，但我們也確實考慮了其他經濟情境來建構我們的案例。我們沒有龐大的消費者組合。因此，在我們的相關模型中，失業率通常不會產生很大的影響。我們使用消費者房地產價格指數、BAA 信用利差和一些其他因素。這些並沒有對季度環比變化產生重大影響。

The real reason the provision was less this quarter was we just had less loan growth this quarter. All the other factors sort of washed out. But roughly $10 million of that reduction was just due to less loan growth in the third quarter relative to the second quarter. But to answer your question generally is we use the Moody's model and we supplement that with a couple of other economic sources.

本季撥備減少的真正原因是本季貸款成長較少。所有其他因素都被淘汰了。但其中約 1000 萬美元的減少只是由於第三季貸款成長較第二季減少所致。但一般來說，我們使用穆迪模型來回答您的問題，並用其他一些經濟來源來補充該模型。

Our next question comes from the line of Jeff Rulis of D.A. Davidson.

我們的下一個問題來自 D.A. 的 Jeff Rulis。戴維森。

Just a couple of housekeeping items on the -- I just wanted to follow up. The co-work office credits you pushed out last quarter, is that largely done? Is there anything else you're trying to kind of manage out within the office side?

只是一些家務用品——我只是想跟進。您上季推出的共享辦公室積分已基本完成嗎？您還想在辦公室內解決其他問題嗎？

As we disclosed last quarter, that sale took up a roughly half of that portfolio. We will continue to explore options related to the rest of that exposure, and my guess is we'll hopefully get something done here relatively soon, but it just depends on what that market looks like. We are always looking at assets within the portfolio and determining kind of the best course of action, but nothing pending right now.

正如我們上季度所揭露的那樣，該銷售約佔該投資組合的一半。我們將繼續探索與其餘部分相關的選擇，我的猜測是我們希望很快就能在這裡完成一些工作，但這僅取決於市場的情況。我們一直在關注投資組合中的資產並確定最佳行動方案，但目前沒有任何懸而未決的事情。

Okay. And then on the -- back to the premium finance sales, kind of the testing the plumbing. I imagine some of that is just kind of mix management. But was there a credit portion of that? I mean, now that it sounds as if you're going to slow some of those sales despite a little pickup near term in non-performers or non-accruals, anything else on the premium finance that you might -- that's got a credit tinge to it that you want to kind of -- like you said, you're always looking at exiting riskier portfolios. Is there some concern in that book, I suppose?

好的。然後回到高級金融銷售，有點測試管道。我想其中一些只是混合管理。但這其中有功勞嗎？我的意思是，現在聽起來好像你要放慢其中一些銷售，儘管短期內不良貸款或非應計項目略有回升，但你可能會在溢價融資上做任何其他事情——這帶有信用色彩正如你所說，你總是在考慮退出風險較高的投資組合。我想那本書裡有什麼擔憂嗎？

No. There's no -- we didn't -- that sale really wasn't at all for credit. It was all a liquidity play and testing that for liquidity reasons. We, as Rich said, we really think those portfolios are low cost portfolio, so we don't worry about them from that perspective.

不，我們沒有──那次銷售根本不是為了賒帳。這完全是一種流動性遊戲，並出於流動性原因對其進行測試。正如里奇所說，我們確實認為這些投資組合是低成本投資組合，因此從這個角度來看，我們並不擔心它們。

Even on the life side, like Rich talked about, I mean you'll notice that the $10 million that was nonperforming, it's still accruing. We generally -- we'll allow some of these to go past due. But if for some reason, we are no longer 100% collateralized and we'll unwind the policy. So we just don't feel like and you can see historical loss rates of 0 basis points over the history of that portfolio would indicate that, that's how we manage that portfolio.

即使在生活方面，就像里奇談到的那樣，我的意思是你會注意到那 1000 萬美元的不良資產仍在累積。一般來說，我們會允許其中一些逾期。但如果由於某種原因，我們不再 100% 抵押，我們將解除保單。因此，我們只是不認為，您可以看到該投資組合歷史上 0 個基點的歷史損失率表明，這就是我們管理該投資組合的方式。

On the P&C side, we're not worried about the economics over the credit side of the equation. So the sale had nothing to do with credit. It had everything to do with liquidity.

在財產險方面，我們並不擔心信貸方面的經濟問題。因此，出售與信用無關。它與流動性密切相關。

Okay. Appreciate the clarification. Yes. It sounds pretty short duration stuff, anyway. I guess one last one on the -- just back on the margin. Sorry to kind of beat up on this, but the -- it sound like pretty back-end loaded loan growth in the quarter, talking about deposit pricing moderating. I guess in the short term, that kind of margin stability, is that conservatism kind of expectation of maybe more hedging headwinds or just being, again, conservative overall? Because it sounds fairly positive given those factors as you lead into the fourth quarter.

好的。感謝您的澄清。是的。無論如何，這聽起來持續時間很短。我想最後一件事就在——剛剛回到邊緣。很抱歉對此表示不滿，但是，在談論存款定價放緩時，聽起來本季後端貸款成長相當不錯。我想在短期內，這種利潤率的穩定性，是一種保守主義的預期，可能會更對沖逆風，還是只是整體上保守？因為考慮到進入第四季的這些因素，這聽起來相當積極。

Yes. I would think I would say it's fairly balanced. I mean we still have a CD book that reprices upward. I mean there will be movement in deposit costs. We just also believe that there's continued asset repricing, particularly in the 2 premium finance portfolios, which will continue to offset that. So I think it's a pretty balanced look. We're working hard to move the margin up as much as we can, but it's pretty balanced at this point.

是的。我想我會說這是相當平衡的。我的意思是，我們還有一本價格上漲的 CD 書。我的意思是存款成本將會改變。我們也相信，資產持續重新定價，特別是在兩個優質金融投資組合中，這將繼續抵消這種影響。所以我認為這是一個非常平衡的外觀。我們正在努力盡可能提高利潤率，但目前已經相當平衡。

I mean the hedging cost costs us 18 basis points in the quarter, but it's good risk management for a down rate scenario. But I'm not sure I'd use the word conservatism. We try to be realistic, and we just think we have a balanced book right now. So we think the margin will stay relatively stable. You could have a lot more deposit growth than you thought and maybe that puts some pressure on the margin, but that's okay because you bring in good deposits that adds to the franchise and allows you to fund good loan growth.

我的意思是，本季的對沖成本使我們損失了 18 個基點，但對於利率下調的情況來說，這是很好的風險管理。但我不確定我是否會使用保守主義這個詞。我們盡量現實，我們只是認為我們現在有一本平衡的書。因此我們認為利潤率將保持相對穩定。你的存款成長可能比你想像的要多得多，這可能會給利潤帶來一些壓力，但這沒關係，因為你帶來了良好的存款，這增加了特許經營權，並允許你為良好的貸款成長提供資金。

So the timing may go said, it goes up a couple of basis points or down a couple of basis points, but we think it will be in a relatively tight band going forward, just because of the structure and the repricing nature of both the sides of the balance sheet. That's all.

因此，時機可能會上升幾個基點或下降幾個基點，但我們認為未來將處於相對緊張的區間，這只是因為雙方的結構和重新定價性質資產負債表。就這樣。

Maybe just the last one then. Just the ideal environment that -- for the rate environment. If you think about margin a little further out, I mean, maybe that's the point of the hedges to keep it somewhat stable. But I guess if we spoke to it specifically, if the Fed does nothing, if we hike or we get cuts over time? And I guess, what would be the -- if we look at the balance of '24, the way you're positioned, what from a Fed standpoint is ideal?

也許只是最後一次。這正是利率環境的理想環境。如果你把保證金考慮得更遠一點，我的意思是，也許這就是對沖的目的，以保持其一定程度的穩定。但我想如果我們具體討論這個問題，如果聯準會什麼都不做，如果我們隨著時間的推移升息或降息會怎樣？我想，如果我們看看 24 年的平衡情況，你的定位方式，從聯準會的角度來看，什麼是理想的？

Well, as we talked about, we're much more neutral than we had been. And you can see that on -- I think it's Table 12 -- Table 8, sorry. We still are asset sensitive. We benefit a little bit if rates continue to stay high or move up. Who knows, we may get something in December or January here if the political kind of issues quiet down. But we're pretty square at this point. And so we're going to grow net interest income primarily through growth at this point, and that's what we're focused on doing.

嗯，正如我們所說，我們比以前更加中立。你可以在表 12 上看到這一點，抱歉，表 8。我們仍然對資產敏感。如果利率繼續保持高位或上升，我們會受益一點。誰知道呢，如果政治問題平息下來，我們可能會在十二月或一月得到一些東西。但我們在這一點上是相當一致的。因此，我們目前將主要透過成長來增加淨利息收入，這就是我們重點要做的事情。

I guess the other thing I would add is, obviously, not only is the hedging program helpful, but if rates turn down, the mortgage business will pick up relatively quickly. We think there's just a lot of refinance opportunity even with a moderate move there. So again, we like the diversity of our businesses as an element in helping to kind of stabilize the performance going forward.

我想我要補充的另一件事是，顯然，對沖計劃不僅有幫助，而且如果利率下降，抵押貸款業務將相對快速地回升。我們認為，即使採取溫和的舉措，仍有許多再融資機會。再說一次，我們喜歡我們業務的多樣性，因為它有助於穩定未來的表現。

Our next question comes from the line of Brody Preston of UBS.

我們的下一個問題來自瑞銀集團的布羅迪普雷斯頓。

I just want to ask a couple of quick questions on the composition of the loan portfolio. Do you happen to have what the percent of the portfolio, is that a shared national credits? And of that, what you happen to be to lead on?

我只想問幾個關於貸款組合構成的簡單問題。您碰巧擁有投資組合的百分比是共享國家學分嗎？那麼，你會領導什麼？

Yes. So total [SNCs] in our portfolio are just over $1 billion. We're the lead on about 6% of that. I would also kind of point out that of our SNC portfolio, much of that is really tied to the businesses that we're in. Franchise Finance has a significant number of SNCs, where other banks are buying into our credits we're buying into their credits. Similarly like in the insurance space, similar things.

是的。因此，我們投資組合中的 [SNC] 總額剛超過 10 億美元。我們在其中約 6% 方面處於領先地位。我還想指出的是，在我們的 SNC 投資組合中，其中很大一部分確實與我們所處的業務相關。特許經營金融擁有大量 SNC，其他銀行正在購買我們正在購買的信貸他們的學分。就像在保險領域一樣，類似的事情。

So we're generally not a player in just buying into other people's deals. It really is -- our approach to this is just to facilitate the growth of individual business lines and making sure that we see how other banks are managing those credits. And so it's we believe it's a sound approach, but it also gives us some intel into how other competitors are working in that market.

因此，我們通常不會只是購買其他人的交易。事實上，我們的做法只是為了促進個別業務線的成長，並確保我們了解其他銀行如何管理這些信貸。因此，我們相信這是一種合理的方法，但它也讓我們了解其他競爭對手在該市場的運作方式。

Got it. And on the office portfolio, do you happen to have what the reserve and the reserve level and the average loan to value is?

知道了。在辦公室投資組合中，您的準備金、準備金水準以及平均貸款價值比是多少？

We don't disclose loan-to-value. We think that is a little bit of a misleading number, because whether it's a loan-to-value add based on time of origination or people are getting loans reappraised, we think it's a little bit of a misrepresentative number. I would say that our general loan policy we're typically going to be sub-70% and at time of origination.

我們不揭露貸款成數。我們認為這個數字有點誤導，因為無論是基於發放時間的貸款增值額還是人們對貸款進行重新評估，我們都認為這個數字有點不真實。我想說的是，我們的一般貸款政策在發起時通常會低於 70%。

Yes. And on the reserve side, it's really sort of included in our overall commercial real estate. We don't disclose a separate one for office. So it would be sort of included in the commercial real estate sector. We do have some qualitative factors that we apply, but we haven't disclosed the specifics for that line item.

是的。在儲備方面，它確實包含在我們整體商業房地產中。我們不會透露單獨的辦公室。所以它將被納入商業房地產領域。我們確實應用了一些定性因素，但我們尚未披露該訂單項目的具體細節。

Okay. Okay. Got it. And I know you talked a little bit about the analysis that you guys continue to do about the office loans that are coming due over the next 12 months. Do you happen to have the number -- I guess, the actual dollar amount of loans that are coming due over the next 12 months? And how does that look as we go forward through 2025?

好的。好的。知道了。我知道你們談到了你們繼續對未來 12 個月到期的辦公貸款進行的分析。您是否知道未來 12 個月內到期的貸款的實際金額？展望 2025 年，情況會如何？

Yes, I don't. We -- I would say that this -- you hear about the wall of maturities. I mean, as we looked at it and kind of just looked out through all of next year. We really don't see it. I mean it's really kind of spread out pretty evenly through '24 and '25. But I don't have the number that was in that population.

是的，我不知道。我們——我想說的是——你聽過成熟牆。我的意思是，當我們審視它時，我們就展望了明年一整年。我們真的看不到。我的意思是，它在 24 年和 25 年的分佈確實相當均勻。但我不知道該人群的具體人數。

We don't have it handy. Yes, I don't have it handy.

我們手邊沒有它。是的，我手邊沒有。

We just don't have it handy here.

我們這裡只是沒有方便的地方。

Yes. Yes. Understood. And so just one last one on the office book. You said you don't disclose the LTV, but do you happen to disclose -- do you happen to have what the debt service coverage ratio looks like?

是的。是的。明白了。就這樣，辦公室簿上只剩下最後一張了。您說您不披露 LTV，但是您是否碰巧披露了債務償還覆蓋率？

Again, we don't disclose that. But generally, we're -- we want to -- on a stressed basis, we're looking for a 1.2 coverage on deals that we do.

再次強調，我們不會透露這一點。但總的來說，我們——我們希望——在壓力的基礎上，我們正​​在尋求對我們所做的交易進行 1.2 的覆蓋率。

Okay. Okay. Got it. Dave, just I wanted to follow up on the sale of the premium finance loans. Did you -- I think we had talked about $500 million before, and it looks like it came in at like $344 million. What was the rationale behind selling less than the $500 million?

好的。好的。知道了。戴夫，我只是想跟進高級金融貸款的銷售情況。我想我們之前討論過 5 億美元，看起來大約是 3.44 億美元。賣出低於 5 億美元的原因是什麼？

No. Well, the $344 million was the outstanding balance at the end of the quarter, so that would have been the impact. We sold close to $500 million in early July. But because these loans pay down so quickly on a monthly basis, that $500 million at amortized down to $344 million by the end of the quarter. So that was the end of the quarter impact.

不。嗯，3.44 億美元是季度末的未清餘額，所以這就是影響。 7 月初，我們的銷售額接近 5 億美元。但由於這些貸款按月償還的速度如此之快，到本季末，這 5 億美元的攤銷額降至 3.44 億美元。這就是季度末的影響。

Got it. Okay. Thanks for the clarification. And to follow up on Chris' question, did you guys happen to book a gain on that through fee income at all? And if you did, do you know what the dollar amount is?

知道了。好的。感謝您的澄清。跟進克里斯的問題，你們是否碰巧透過費用收入獲得了收益？如果您這樣做了，您知道金額是多少嗎？

And the gain was roughly $1 million for the quarter.

該季度的收益約為 100 萬美元。

Okay. And that would be another income then?

好的。那這會是另一筆收入嗎？

Yes, sir.

是的先生。

Okay. And then the last one was just on the NIM trajectory. I know there's been a lot of discussion on it. I just wanted to ask how you're thinking about, I think you're calling for stability, maybe, as we go forward into 2024, which feels kind of right. But I guess how are you thinking about rate cuts at all? How will that impact the margin, just given the swaps that you put in. And then specifically on the swaps, the new ones that you put on, what will be the basis point kind of impact on the NIM in terms of drag from the new swaps?

好的。最後一個就在 NIM 軌道上。我知道對此有很多討論。我只是想問你是怎麼想的，我認為你在呼籲穩定，也許，當我們進入 2024 年時，這感覺有點正確。但我猜你是如何考慮降息的？考慮到您投入的掉期，這將如何影響利潤。然後特別是在掉期方面，您投入的新掉期，在新的拖累方面對淨息差的影響是什麼基點？互換？

Well, the drag right now is 18 basis points for the quarter. And you can see in our disclosure, the individual swaps primarily receive fix that go out in some cases 3 years, in some cases, 5 years with actually a forward start term. But if we start to get rates falling, we think we'll get better loan activity as the economy picks up. We think the mortgage business will pick up. Obviously, that's not a margin-related item. But we think that the offsetting factors to potential NIM compression come in other areas of the business. And so that's how we look at it. And that's when we talk about this, being in a narrow band as you get into some of these other factors, it gets a little bit harder to project exactly.

嗯，目前該季度的拖累是 18 個基點。您可以在我們的揭露中看到，個別掉期主要獲得修復，在某些情況下為 3 年，在某些情況下為 5 年，實際上有一個遠期啟動期限。但如果我們開始降低利率，我們認為隨著經濟復甦，貸款活動將會更好。我們認為抵押貸款業務將會回升。顯然，這不是與保證金相關的項目。但我們認為，潛在的淨利差壓縮的抵銷因素來自於業務的其他領域。這就是我們的看法。當我們談論這個問題時，當你考慮到其他一些因素時，處於一個狹窄的範圍內，準確地預測就會變得有點困難。

Yes. And I mean, before when rates went to 0, our margin was in the mid-2s. I mean, 50% to 60%. And we just never want to get back there. We think with these hedges we have in place now, if rates went to 0 again, we would stay above 3%. I mean, there'd be some compression, and we'd have offsets that Tim talked about, but we wouldn't go back into that mid-2 range based on this hedging position that we have in place.

是的。我的意思是，在利率降至 0 之前，我們的利潤率為 2 左右。我的意思是，50% 到 60%。我們只是永遠不想回到那裡。我們認為，有了這些對沖措施，如果利率再次降至 0，我們將保持在 3% 以上。我的意思是，會有一些壓縮，我們會有蒂姆談到的抵消，但我們不會根據我們現有的對沖頭寸回到中間 2 範圍。

I would now like to turn the conference back to Tim Crane for closing remarks. Sir?

現在我想請提姆·克蘭 (Tim Crane) 致閉幕詞。先生？

Yes. Guys, thank you very much for your time this morning. I hope we did a reasonable job answering your questions. This is a lot about blocking and tackling for us. We think we're uniquely positioned to take advantage of opportunities that we're seeing in the market. And as always, we'll work very hard to deliver good results. So thank you very much.

是的。夥計們，非常感謝你們今天早上抽出寶貴的時間。我希望我們合理地回答了您的問題。這對我們來說有很多關於阻擋和鏟球的內容。我們認為我們處於獨特的地位，可以利用我們在市場上看到的機會。一如既往，我們將非常努力，以取得良好的成果。非常感謝。

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。