Telkom Indonesia (Persero) Tbk PT (TLK) 2024 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day and thank you for standing by. Welcome to Telkom earnings call for first half of 2024 results. (Operator Instructions) Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I'd now like to hand the call over to pa Oky, VP Investor Relations. Thank you, please go ahead.

美好的一天，感謝您的支持。歡迎參加 Telkom 財報電話會議，了解 2024 年上半年業績。（操作員指示）請注意，今天的會議正在錄製中。現在我想將電話轉給投資者關係副總裁 pa Oky。謝謝，請繼續。

Thank you, gentlemen. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to PT Telkom Indonesia conference call for the unlisted result of first semester of 2024. There'll be an overview from our CEO, Ririek, of Telkom Group followed by the Q&A after the session.

謝謝你們，先生們。女士們、先生們，歡迎參加 PT Telkom Indonesia 電話會議，以了解 2024 年第一季非上市業績。Telkom 集團執行長 Ririek 將進行概述，隨後將在會議結束後進行問答。

Before we start, let me remind you that today's call and the responses to the questions may contain forward-looking statements within the meaning of Safe Harbor. Actual results could differ materially from projections or estimations and may involve risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to be different from what we discussed today.

在開始之前，讓我提醒您，今天的電話會議和對問題的答覆可能包含安全港含義內的前瞻性陳述。實際結果可能與預測或估計有重大差異，並且可能涉及風險和不確定性，這導致實際結果與我們今天討論的結果不同。

Ladies and gentlemen, it is my pleasure today to introduce Telkom's Board of Directors who are joining us today: mapa Ririek Adriansyah, as President, Director and CEO; mapa Heri Supriadi as Finance and Risk Management Director; ibu FM Venusiana, as Enterprise and Business Service Director; mapa Bogi Witjaksono, as Wholesale and International Service Director; mapa Budi Setyawan Wijaya, as Strategic Portfolio Director; Mr. Honesti Basyir, as Group Business Development Director; mapa Herlan Wijanarko, as Network & IT Solutions Director; and mapa Afriwandi as Human Capital Management Director.

女士們先生們，今天我很高興向大家介紹今天加入我們的 Telkom 董事會：mapa Ririek Adriansyah，總裁、董事兼執行長； mapa Heri Supriadi 擔任財務與風險管理總監； ibu FM Venusiana，擔任企業和商業服務總監； mapa Bogi Witjaksono，批發和國際服務總監； mapa Budi Setyawan Wijaya，擔任策略投資組合總監； Honesti Basyir 先生，擔任集團業務發展總監； mapa Herlan Wijanarko，網路和 IT 解決方案總監；瑪帕·阿夫里萬迪 (mapa Afriwandi) 擔任人力資本管理總監。

Also present are the Board Directors of Telkomsel, mapa Nugroho, as President, Director; mapa Daru Mulyawan, as Finance and Risk Management Director; mapa Derrick Heng as Marketing Director; and mapa Adiwinahyu Basuki Sigit as Sales Director. I now hand over the call to our President, Director, and CEO, mapa Ririek Adriansyah for his overview.

出席的還有 Telkomsel 董事會董事、總裁兼董事 Mapa Nugroho； mapa Daru Mulyawan，擔任財務與風險管理總監； mapa Derrick Heng 擔任行銷總監；和mapa Adiwinahyu Basuki Sigit 擔任銷售總監。我現在將電話轉交給我們的總裁、董事兼執行長 Mapa Ririek Adriansyah，聽聽他的概述。

Thank you. Oky. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to our conference call or the unaudited first semester of financial results. We appreciate the participation in this call. Ladies and gentlemen, we have seen 2024 as the year of better economic stability and growth compared to the year of 2023. The initial target of 5.2% economic growth rate in 2024 as compared to 5.05% growth in the previous year despite challenges such as declining commodity process and global economic condition.

謝謝。好的。女士們、先生們，午安。歡迎參加我們的電話會議或未經審計的第一學期財務表現。我們感謝您參與本次電話會議。女士們、先生們，與 2023 年相比，我們認為 2024 年是經濟更穩定和成長的一年。儘管面臨大宗商品加工下降和全球經濟狀況等挑戰，但2024年經濟成長率的初步目標為5.2%，而前一年為5.05%。

Domestic consumption is predicted to contribute more than half of Indonesian economic growth supported by high level of involvement and stable inflation rate of 2.5% plus or minus 1%. Indonesia is the highest employment rate country among G20 nations with employment level of almost 70%, although the source of employment comes from informal sector.

在高參與度和2.5%正負1%的穩定通膨率的支持下，國內消費預計將貢獻印尼經濟成長的一半以上。印尼是G20國家中就業率最高的國家，就業水準接近70%，儘管就業來源來自非正規部門。

Now, the elected president, Prabowo Subianto, and his administration commit to several current policies, signal stable investment climate and reduced political instability. Energy and food price volatility along with strong US dollar to Indonesian rupiah should be what's characterized. However, the remaining significant potential for food growth as expanding rates of high-tech products and maximizing the impact on employment could help boost our economic in the case of external financial pressures.

現在，當選總統普拉博沃·蘇比安托 (Prabowo Subianto) 及其政府承諾實施多項現行政策，這標誌著穩定的投資環境和減少的政治不穩定。能源和食品價格波動以及美元兌印尼盾走強應該是其特徵。然而，隨著高科技產品的增加和最大限度地提高對就業的影響，糧食成長的剩餘巨大潛力可能有助於在外部金融壓力的情況下提振我們的經濟。

Telecommunication industry contributes to the growth of high-tech products and business opportunity in increasing the economics of macro, micro, small, and medium enterprises or MSMEs plus equal commercial. GDP and household spend in growth in Indonesia will also create the effect of increased spending, including in the telecommunication sector.

電信業有助於高科技產品的成長和商業機會的成長，從而提高宏觀、微觀、中小型企業或中小微型企業以及平等商業的經濟。印尼國內生產毛額和家庭支出的成長也將產生支出增加的影響，包括電信部門的支出增加。

Telkom Group has been transforming to digital services company serving both B2C and B2B segment. We are ready to catch up the opportunity of increasing telecommunication's steady growth. Our domination as incumbent telecommunication company enables us to become the retail economic catalyst for the nation. This is important while the industry is in the first solution having the first unique technology coupled with retention of the global geopolitical environment.

Telkom 集團一直在轉型為同時服務 B2C 和 B2B 領域的數位服務公司。我們已準備好抓住電信業穩定成長的機會。我們作為現有電信公司的主導地位使我們能夠成為國家零售經濟的催化劑。當該行業處於第一個擁有第一個獨特技術並保留全球地緣政治環境的解決方案時，這一點很重要。

On the B2C segment, we have implemented fixed mobile convergence or FMC strategy for one year since July 1, 2023, and proven the strategy is an effective track. Further tactical strategy by announcing Telkomsel as multiproduct offering, Telkomsel Lite and value, secondary brand to maintain market share, adjusted while we remain focused on profitability so far with positive impact and does not create price instability in the market. This has been evidence distribution of our ARPU during first semester of 2024.

在B2C領域，我們自2023年7月1日起實施固定移動融合或FMC策略已有一年，並證明該策略是有效的軌道。進一步的戰術策略是宣布Telkomsel 作為多產品產品、Telkomsel Lite 和價值、二級品牌以保持市場份額，並進行調整，同時我們仍然專注於盈利能力，迄今為止具有積極影響，並且不會造成市場價格不穩定。這是我們 2024 年第一季 ARPU 分佈的證據。

Mobile customer base grew at a healthy 4.3% to 159.9 million subscribers. As a result, normalized EBITDA margin has also been sustained at 51.9% for this semester. We remain of the view that, with necessary consolidation and healthy pricing, could be developed toward healthy competition.

行動客戶群健康成長 4.3%，達到 1.599 億用戶。因此，本學期正常化 EBITDA 利潤率也維持在 51.9%。我們仍然認為，透過必要的整合和健康的定價，可以朝著良性競爭的方向發展。

Moving forward, the synergy effect from the FMC initiatives serve as revenue uplift, OpEx efficiency, and CapEx effectiveness to ensure maximum effect of FMC strategy to our company's financial. As part of evolving our 5 Five Bold Moves strategy, our corporate performance and group make sure that all business processes achieved efficient results and no duplication processes within our organization.

展望未來，FMC 措施的綜效將體現在收入提升、營運支出效率和資本支出有效性上，以確保 FMC 策略對我們公司的財務產生最大影響。作為發展我們「五五大膽舉措」策略的一部分，我們的企業績效和團隊確保所有業務流程都取得了高效的結果，並且在我們的組織內沒有重複的流程。

This includes, for example, in the process of procurement where, thanks to a product of group purchase initiative, the rate of CapEx purchase for devices and network have improved quite meaningfully. Such a group integration process as additional made positive impact to digital content offerings, of which in the end, resulted to a better experience to our end customers and efficient content cost for the company. Moreover, we're also successful in transfer payment mostly in Indonesian rupiah contract to offset foreign exchange uncertainty.

例如在採購過程中，透過團購產品，設備和網路的CapEx採購率有了相當大的提升。這樣的集團整合過程對數位內容產品產生了額外的正面影響，最終為我們的最終客戶帶來了更好的體驗，並為公司帶來了高效的內容成本。此外，我們也成功地進行了轉移支付，主要以印尼盾合約形式進行，以抵銷外匯的不確定性。

Similarly in June 2024, the group has also initiated an early pension program. This affected more than 1,000 employees. This profile, in line with our budget, to optimize and fashion the workforce up as well as to create linear organization to 5 Bold Moves strategy.

同樣，2024年6月，集團也啟動了提早退休金計畫。這影響了 1,000 多名員工。此配置文件符合我們的預算，旨在優化和塑造員工隊伍，並根據 5 個大膽舉措策略創建線性組織。

The program cost us a total of IDR1.24 trillion with a payback of two years. That initiative is aimed to lift productivity of our capital and enhance shareholders' value in the future.

該計劃總共花費了 1.24 兆印尼盾，投資期為兩年。該舉措旨在提高我們資本的生產力並提高未來股東的價值。

On the B2B business, we continue to be agile and yet focus to create long-term sustainability growth of revenue on digital connectivity supported by platform expansions with data center and focus is on business-enabled. Our additional data center capacity within 2024 will be contributed mostly from hyperscale data center by 18-megawatt in Cikarang as well as our capacity expansion of all interverse data centers and RS data centers.

在 B2B 業務上，我們繼續保持敏捷性，但重點是在資料中心平台擴展的支持下，透過數位連接創造收入的長期可持續增長，並專注於業務支援。2024年我們新增的資料中心容量將主要來自Cikarang 18兆瓦的超大規模資料中心以及我們所有反向資料中心和RS資料中心的容量擴展。

The improvement of the established capacity in our data center could be allocated to anticipate more cloud storage and processing demand driven by artificial intelligence standards such as ultra-high definition content, virtual reality, and gaming. Commenting on the international of Telin, other profitable subsidiary of the support end-to-end data center connectivity by building from data center premises up to international gateway.

我們資料中心現有容量的提高可以用於預測由超高清內容、虛擬實境和遊戲等人工智慧標準驅動的更多雲端儲存和處理需求。在評論Telin國際公司時，另一家盈利子公司透過從資料中心場所到國際網關的建設來支援端到端資料中心連接。

With the international seekable backbone business as Telin, source of revenue, Internet connectivity quality and latency will improve, since Internet traffic could be reroute to the Southwest International Gateway. This not to be passed though Jakarta and Singapore anymore as many international gateways.

透過 Telin 等國際可搜尋骨幹業務，收入來源、網路連接品質和延遲將得到改善，因為網路流量可以重新路由到西南國際網關。這將不再透過雅加達和新加坡等許多國際門戶。

Infrastructure has also been encouraging in this -- our business vehicle, Digital Infrastructure Indonesia will serve as minute to commence infrastructure asset managed service carry out Telekom's asset maintenance. We have confirmed that the legal day one of Digital Infrastructure Indonesia as a infrastructure managed service entity will be on the August 1, 2024. Then it assumes to have a higher duty as an asset owner of Telkom cyber industry in 2025.

基礎設施在這方面也令人鼓舞——我們的商業工具「印尼數位基礎設施」將作為啟動基礎設施資產管理服務以進行電信資產維護的標誌。我們已確認，印尼數位基礎設施公司作為基礎設施管理服務實體的第一天法定日為 2024 年 8 月 1 日。到2025年，將承擔作為Telkom網路產業資產所有者的更高責任。

We also hope that beside from FMC initiative, the establishment will also enable us to transfer, while also improve as leading infrastructure asset with additional investment to increase CapEx efficiency. On the B2B digital added services and the company initiative beside repairing for internal capability and hence, we also realigned our portfolio, especially in all subsidiaries, such as Signal, BOSNET, Metra Plaza.

我們還希望，除了FMC的舉措之外，該成立也將使我們能夠轉移並透過額外投資來提高作為領先基礎設施資產的能力，以提高資本支出效率。在 B2B 數位附加服務和公司計劃上，除了修復內部能力之外，我們還重新調整了我們的產品組合，特別是在所有子公司，例如 Signal、BOSNET、Metra Plaza。

That will be the end of my remarks. Next, I would like to hand over the presentation to ma Heri Supriadi, our Group Finance and Risk Management Director, to give you brief overview in regard to our financial performance. Thank you.

我的發言到此結束。接下來，我想將演講交給我們的集團財務和風險管理總監 ma Heri Supriadi，向您簡要介紹我們的財務表現。謝謝。

Thank you, pa Ririek. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. During the first semester of 2024 unaudited financial result, Telkom Group has delivered a healthy revenue growth of 2.5% year on year to IDR75.3 trillion. And with EBITDA achieved at IDR37.9 trillion, a slight decrease by1.3% year on year. The growth in our revenue has been mostly contributed from our continuing effort in promoting data and Internet services revenue amidst the continuing natural decline of our legacy revenue.

謝謝你，帕里里克。女士們、先生們，午安。在 2024 年第一季未經審計的財務表現中，Telkom 集團的營收年增 2.5%，達到 75.3 兆印尼盾。EBITDA 為 37.9 兆印尼盾，較去年同期小幅下降 1.3%。我們收入的成長主要歸功於我們在傳統收入持續自然下降的情況下持續努力促進數據和網路服務收入。

The slight decrease in EBITDA, however, occurred during the second quarter. We initiated an early retirement program, which has affected a total of around 1,000 employees and expenses of IDR1.24 trillion. This met personnel expenses jumped by 20.9% year on year during the semester.

然而，第二季 EBITDA 略有下降。我們啟動了提前退休計劃，總共影響了約 1,000 名員工，費用達 1.24 兆印尼盾。這導致本學期人員費​​用年增20.9%。

On the other side, we believe this initiative will not only create leaner organization, but also increase youth talent, efficiency, and productivity. Stripping out the one-off cost from the program, our normalized EBITDA stood at IDR39.1 trillion, of which grew by 1.9% and making the normalized EBITDA margin stabilized at 51.9% as compared to that in the first quarter of 2024. Meanwhile, our operating net income grew by 4.2% year on year to IDR13 trillion after stripping out of mark-to-market effect from go-to ERP costs and one-off from unlocking asset at Telkomsel level.

另一方面，我們相信這項措施不僅能打造更精簡的組織，還能提高青年人才、效率和生產力。剔除該計劃的一次性成本，我們的標準化 EBITDA 為 39.1 兆印尼盾，成長 1.9%，使標準化 EBITDA 利潤率與 2024 年第一季相比穩定在 51.9%。同時，剔除 ERP 成本的按市值計價效應以及 Telkomsel 層面解鎖資產的一次性影響後，我們的營運淨利潤年增 4.2%，達到 13 兆印尼盾。

Taking a deep dive into expenses breakdown beside the strategic initiative on early retainment program as the highlight during the quarter, the higher cost in interconnection has been attributed to the growth in revenue related to voice hubbing. The dilution of margin in the business, however, come following the decline in legacy business, including voice and SMS A2B revenue.

除了作為本季亮點的早期保留計劃的戰略舉措之外，深入研究費用細目，互連成本的上升歸因於與語音樞紐相關的收入的增長。然而，隨著語音和 SMS A2B 收入等傳統業務的下滑，該業務的利潤率也出現了稀釋。

After first semester of 2024, we have realized a total CapEx of IDR11.7 trillion, largely used for connectivity followed by spending for digital platform and services. CapEx realization to revenue was 15.5%, and hopefully, accelerated towards the end of the year at the level of 22% to 24% and gradually create significant additional revenue.

2024 年第一季後，我們的資本支出總額為 11.7 兆印尼盾，主要用於連接，其次是數位平台和服務支出。資本支出實現收入的比例為 15.5%，預計在年底加速至 22% 至 24% 的水平，並逐步創造大量額外收入。

And at the end of June, our liabilities saw net additional in the position. The increase was seen as we withdraw a certain debt used for dividend payment. Our gearing ratio, however, was maintained at a healthy level with net debt-to-EBITDA stood at 0.67 times at the end of June 2024.

到六月底，我們的負債出現了淨增加。這一增長是因為我們撤回了用於支付股息的一定債務。然而，我們的資產負債比率維持在健康水平，截至 2024 年 6 月末，淨債務與 EBITDA 比率為 0.67 倍。

On B2C business, despite the deterioration, outsource spending, combined with the increasing dynamic of competition in the industry, the second quarter of 2024 has been steadily quarter for Telkomsel. In second quarter of 2024 alone, mobile revenue come at IDR28.6 trillion, which modestly grew by 0.4%, while IndiHome revenue was IDR6.6 trillion with an increase of 0.3%from the previous quarter. This brought our revenue for Telkomsel grew solidly by 29.9% to IDR57.2 trillion for the semester with EBITDA margin steady at 47%.

在 B2C 業務方面，儘管外包支出惡化，加上行業競爭日益激烈，但 Telkomsel 2024 年第二季的業績仍保持穩定。光是 2024 年第二季度，行動收入就達到 28.6 兆印尼盾，小幅成長 0.4%，而 IndiHome 營收為 6.6 兆印尼盾，較上季成長 0.3%。這使得 Telkomsel 本學期的營收穩定成長 29.9%，達到 57.2 兆印尼盾，EBITDA 利潤率穩定在 47%。

We have also managed further acceleration in our convergence penetration to 47% and reached digital asset users to around 80 million. Productivity improved driven by data payload, of which increased by 11.7% year on year, while customer base reached 159.9 million, an increase of 4.3% at the end of June 2024.

我們的融合滲透率進一步加快至 47%，數位資產用戶達到約 8,000 萬人。數據負載帶動生產力提升，年增11.7%；截至2024年6月，客戶規模達1.599億，成長4.3%。

Our continuous effort to give better customer excellence in digital services together with further push in synergy value initiative yield positive impact and maintain ARPU at a healthy level of IDR45,000. This is the spread of our recent introduction of Telkom satellite, which has proven to maintain healthy pricing and not creating price war.

我們不斷努力為客戶提供更好的數位服務，並進一步推動協同價值計劃，產生了積極影響，並將 ARPU 維持在 45,000 印尼盾的健康水平。這是我們最近推出的Telkom衛星的傳播，事實證明它可以保持健康的定價，不會製造價格戰。

Our IndiHome business has also been showing a consistent positive growth trajectory to capture the tremendous opportunity for growth in the fixed broadband business. We believe the journey of our next 10 million growth in customer life in the mass market segment. This has become our main strategic focus and marked by the recent launch of EZnet of which not only aim at expanding our fixed broadband business into a new segment, but also to grow our components use further.

我們的 IndiHome 業務也一直呈現持續積極的成長軌跡，抓住了固定寬頻業務的巨大成長機會。我們相信大眾細分市場的客戶生活將迎來下一個 1,000 萬的成長。這已成為我們的主要戰略重點，並以最近推出的 EZnet 為標誌，其不僅旨在將我們的固定寬頻業務擴展到新的細分市場，而且還進一步增加我們的組件使用。

Moving to wholesale and international business segment, in the first semester of 2024, the segment contributed com group revenue in the amount of IDR9.2trillion, grew by 13.1% year on year as the result of growing international wholesale voice business and digital connectivity infrastructure with this. Telin remain as one of the contributors to the segment with international connectivity as the main driver of the growth.

轉向批發和國際業務領域，2024 年第一季度，由於國際批發語音業務和數位連接基礎設施的增長，該領域為 com 集團貢獻了 9.2 萬億印尼盾的收入，同比增長 13.1%。Telin 仍然是該領域的貢獻者之一，國際連接是成長的主要驅動力。

In the meantime, we are continuing our journey and our attempt to unlock value of our data center business. We are exploring new strategic partner, of which, together, could accelerate the growth of our DC business, not only for domestic, but also in the regional Asia. As of first semester of 2024, our data center business has contributed IDR1 trillion to total group revenue, a solid increase by 22% growth year on year driven by higher traffic in Content Delivery Network or CDN.

同時，我們將繼續我們的旅程並嘗試釋放資料中心業務的價值。我們正在尋找新的策略合作夥伴，他們的共同努力可以加速我們的配送中心業務的成長，不僅在國內，而且在亞洲地區。截至 2024 年第一季度，我們的資料中心業務已為集團總收入貢獻了 1 兆印尼盾，在內容交付網路或 CDN 流量增加的推動下，年比穩健成長 22%。

On tower business, as of first semester of 2024, Mitratel keep maintaining its position as the largest tower provider in Southeast Asia in terms of tower owned. With more than 38,600 of towers and more than 58,600 of tenants, the tenancy rate still was improved to 1.52 times.

鐵塔業務方面，截至2024年上半年，以鐵塔擁有量計算，Mitratel持續維持東南亞最大鐵塔供應商的地位。塔樓數量超過38,600座，租戶超過58,600人，出租率仍提升至1.52倍。

On the standalone business, in the first half of2024, Mitratel recorded revenue of IDR4.5 trillion or grew by 7.8% year on year, driven by tower-leasing revenue. EBITDA and net income grew by 10.2% and 4.1% year on year, respectively. This resulted in strong EBITDA and net income margin of 83.1% and 23.9%. Furthermore, Mitratel demonstrated a strong financial position with relatively low leverage ratio of 1.8 times to net debt to EBITDA as compared to the industry.

獨立業務方面，2024年上半年，在鐵塔租賃收入的推動下，Mitratel錄得收入4.5兆印尼盾，年增7.8%。EBITDA和淨利潤較去年同期分別成長10.2%和4.1%。這導致強勁的 EBITDA 和淨利潤率分別達到 83.1% 和 23.9%。此外，Mitratel 表現出強勁的財務狀況，與該行業相比，淨債務與 EBITDA 的槓桿比率相對較低，為 1.8 倍。

Enterprise segment recorded revenue of IDR10.20 trillion during the first semester of 2024 or grew by 9.4% year on year driven by digital connectivity, contributed by high-speed Internet and digital services contributed by e-payment. We continue to strengthen our capabilities in the cloud business, digital IT services, and cybersecurity. This initiative by among few building strategic partnerships with global technology players.

在高速網路和電子支付帶來的數位服務的推動下，數位連接的推動下，2024年第一季企業部門營收達到10.20兆印尼盾，年增9.4%。我們不斷增強在雲端業務、數位IT服務和網路安全方面的能力。這項舉措是與全球技術參與者建立策略夥伴關係的少數舉措之一。

Lastly, in regards to our guidance for 2024, looking at the latest development in the economy and further dynamic in the industry impairment, we are now aiming for our revenue to grow by low single digits for the year. This will come with EBITDA margin in the range of 50% to 52% and CapEx to revenue ratio of 22% to 24%. That would be the ending of my remarks and thank you for your kind attention.

最後，關於我們對 2024 年的指導，考慮到經濟的最新發展和產業減損的進一步動態，我們現在的目標是今年收入實現較低的個位數成長。EBITDA 利潤率將達到 50% 至 52%，資本支出與收入比率將達到 22% 至 24%。我的發言到此結束，感謝大家的關注。

(Event Instructions)

（活動須知）

(Operator Instructions) Kelsey Santoso, Goldman Sachs.

（操作員指示）Kelsey Santoso，高盛。

Hello, good afternoon, management. Thank you for the opportunity. This is Kelsey speaking. A couple of questions from my side, firstly, on your two cost items. First one is your G&A costs, so if we look at the quarterly basis instead of on semester basis, Q2 actually saw a 20% increase quarter on quarter and year on year. So can I check what led to the spike?

你好，下午好，管理層。謝謝你給我的機會。這是凱爾西的講話。我這邊有幾個問題，首先是關於你們的兩個成本項目。第一個是 G&A 成本，所以如果我們以季度而不是學期為單位來看，第二季度實際上環比和同比增長了 20%。那我可以檢查一下導致峰值的原因嗎？

And second one would be your personnel costs, understand that the spike in Q2 was due to the ERP. But can I confirm if this is already largely behind or if there's still some headwind remaining in the upcoming quarters? And my second question would be on your mobile business. So we saw that ARPU still declined slightly QoQ, while subs were still flattish. So how should we expect these to trend in the upcoming quarters and should there be any uplift that we can expect as you continue executing on the FMC strategy? Thank you.

第二個是你的人員成本，要知道第二季的飆升是由於 ERP 造成的。但我能否確認這是否已經在很大程度上落後了，或者在接下來的幾季中是否仍然存在一些阻力？我的第二個問題是關於您的行動業務。因此，我們看到 ARPU 仍然環比略有下降，而訂閱用戶仍然持平。那麼，我們應該如何預期這些在未來幾季的趨勢？謝謝。

Okay, Kelsey, your question, allow me to answer that one. On the -- in the second quarter of this year, we have kind of spending in the bonus for the 10 teams as part of the renumeration of the DOD and also the employee and -- POD. Second, personnel, will there be any headwind upcoming quarters? Basically, the ERP is a program that follow our transformation in making fixed mobile business becoming more efficient with the reminding those employee who cannot, really, let's say, catch up with our plan with new skill set and so on. We provide this ERP.

好吧，凱爾西，你的問題，請容許我回答。今年第二季度，我們為 10 個團隊支付了獎金，作為國防部以及員工和 POD 薪酬的一部分。其次，人員方面，接下來的幾季是否會出現阻力？基本上，ERP 是一個遵循我們轉型的計劃，旨在使固定行動業務變得更加高效，並提醒那些實際上無法跟上我們的計劃的員工掌握新的技能等等。我們提供此 ERP。

We see this ERP in the -- I think, in the -- I think, feel more years becoming -- unseen that we're going to do this again because this is part of the transformation, and this transformation in the process of the implementation and basically, we strengthen that one. This one, I think, one of the biggest part of the transformation, we don't have any plan in the near future for the -- another ERP. And the third question, ARPU, I will decline. I think this question comes to you, pa Derrick.

我們在——我認為，在——我認為，感覺更多年之後——看到了這個 ERP，我們將再次這樣做，因為這是轉型的一部分，而這種轉型正在實施，基本上，我們加強了這一點。我認為，這是轉型中最重要的部分之一，我們在不久的將來沒有任何計劃——另一個 ERP。第三個問題，ARPU，我會拒絕。我想這個問題是你問的，德瑞克爸爸。

Yes, yes, so good afternoon, Yes. This is Derrick. I will share some color on our ARPU. In our context, Telkomsel sustained stable ARPU at IDR45,000. And there are several factors that we think that's attributing to this. From a macro economy perspective, we see contraction of consumer purchasing power. And when we look at it from a pricing perspective, the Lebaran incentives out in end of March, impacted to spread the spending between Q1 and Q2.

是的，是的，下午好，是的。這是德里克。我將分享一些有關 ARPU 的資訊。在我們的背景下，Telkomsel 的 ARPU 保持穩定在 45,000 印尼盾。我們認為有幾個因素造成了這種情況。從宏觀經濟角度來看，我們看到消費者購買力在收縮。當我們從定價角度來看時，3 月底推出的開齋節激勵措施影響了第一季和第二季之間的支出分佈。

And we have maintained the current stake of our average pricing. In fact, there was higher monetization rate. We want to stay relevant and affordable to our customer needs and manage the competitiveness.

我們維持了當前平均定價的份額。事實上，貨幣化率更高。我們希望保持與客戶需求的相關性和價格實惠，並管理競爭力。

We have been selective to expand our engagement to the mass and youth segments. Our strategy with our new plans of Telkomsel Lite and by.U has helped us maintain our churn rate. There was also downside risk in terms of ARPU, which is maintained at a minimum.

我們有選擇性地將我們的參與範圍擴大到大眾和青年群體。我們的策略以及 Telkomsel Lite 和 by.U 的新計劃幫助我們維持了客戶流失率。ARPU 也有下行風險，仍維持在最低水準。

We are maximizing our CDN strategy, our digital adoption through engaging digital ecosystem. We have also enriched our content offering to stimulate customer usage, which is seen in the payload growth both year on year as well as Q on Q.

我們正在透過參與數位生態系統來最大化我們的 CDN 策略和數位化採用。我們還豐富了我們的內容以刺激客戶使用，這可以從有效負載的同比增長以及環比增長中看出。

So if you look at what's next to come, we want to increase our product competitiveness to targeted segments to ensure ARPU stability through productivity gains, addressing the mass segment, youth customers, as well as maintaining and monetizing our high-value customers. We want to maintain subscriber growth and base through healthy market conduct.

因此，如果你看看接下來會發生什麼，我們希望提高目標細分市場的產品競爭力，透過提高生產力、滿足大眾細分市場、年輕客戶的需求，以及維護和實現我們的高價值客戶的盈利，確保ARPU 穩定性。我們希望透過健康的市場行為來維持用戶成長和基礎。

And then we also support our FMC's rollout strategy, increasing penetration into multilayer of segments by leveraging to grow unserved segment. If you look at our convergence penetration, year on year, we have already done to reach a state of 47% market product holding in our base. So that will continue our strategy to drive more engagement at the household segment perspective. Thank you.

然後，我們也支持 FMC 的推出策略，透過利用未服務成長的細分市場來提高對多層細分市場的滲透率。如果你看看我們的融合滲透率，我們已經達到了 47% 的市場產品佔有率。因此，這將繼續我們的策略，從家庭細分的角度推動更多的參與。謝謝。

Thank you for that. Can I just double check on the G&A cost? Didn't really catch that.

謝謝你。我可以仔細檢查一下 G&A 成本嗎？並沒有真正明白這一點。

On the G&A, basically, the increase on the second quarter, mostly coming from the team and bonus for the group of management.

在一般管理費用方面，基本上是第二季的成長，主要來自團隊和管理階層的獎金。

Okay, thank you.

好的謝謝。

Ranjan Sharma, JP Morgan.

蘭詹夏爾馬，摩根大通。

Hi, good afternoon, and thank you for the opportunity. Sorry, can I just again request clarification on why G&A costs are up 20% quarter on quarter? I apologize, the line is very unclear, so I asked this question again.

你好，下午好，謝謝你給我這個機會。抱歉，我可以再次要求澄清為什麼管理及行政成本較上季上漲 20% 嗎？抱歉，線路很不清楚，所以我又問了這個問題。

The other question that I have is on the early retirement program. Are there any costs -- book the Telkomsel level as well, about the Telkom Group? And lastly, on data center side, if you can help us understand how the lease rates are trending in Jakarta. Thank you.

我的另一個問題是關於提前退休計劃。是否有任何費用 - 預訂 Telkomsel 等級以及有關 Telkom 集團的費用？最後，在資料中心方面，您能否協助我們了解雅加達的租賃率趨勢。謝謝。

Hi, Ranjan. Could you repeat again your second and third questions, please?

嗨，蘭詹。您能再重複一次您的第二個問題和第三個問題嗎？

The early retirement program first, are there any costs booked within Telkomsel? And on the data center, if you can help us understand how the lease rates are trending in Jakarta.

首先是提前退休計劃，在 Telkomsel 內預訂是否需要支付任何費用？在資料中心方面，您能否協助我們了解雅加達的租賃率趨勢。

I'm sorry, your third question's on data centers you asked in regards to lease rates trending into Jakarta? Am I correct?

抱歉，您的第三個問題是關於您詢問的雅加達租賃費率趨勢的資料中心？我對麼？

Yeah, for the data center business.

是的，對於資料中心業務。

Data center business, okay. And number two is in regards to Telkom cell cost of early retirement?

資料中心業務還可以。第二個問題是關於提前退休的 Telkom 手機成本？

Your early retirement program costs that you booked. Are there any cost booked within Telkomsel?

您預訂的提前退休計畫費用。Telkomsel 內預訂需要付費嗎？

How within the Telkomsel for the ERP related cost? Okay, thank you.

Telkomsel 內如何支付 ERP 相關費用？好的謝謝。

Okay. On the G&A costs, as we explained before, this must be coming from the payment of the bonus for the -- and funding for the management of the company. And on the cost level, ERP-related costs in Telkomsel, we don't have that program in Telkomsel. This is from Telkom, the parent company because with regards to the, I think, transformation following the fixed mobile conversion and some also following the, I think, establishment of InfraCo, we need to basically mapping the talent that we need to increase the business. Those who cannot really follow after we do retrain and so on, we offer them the early retirement program.

好的。關於一般管理費用，正如我們之前解釋的，這必須來自支付獎金以及公司管理的資金。在成本層面，Telkomsel 的 ERP 相關成本，我們在 Telkomsel 沒有該計劃。這是來自母公司 Telkom 的說法，因為我認為，關於固網行動轉換之後的轉型，以及我認為 InfraCo 的建立之後的一些轉型，我們需要基本上映射我們需要增加業務的人才。對於那些在我們進行再培訓等之後無法真正跟隨的人，我們為他們提供提前退休計劃。

Please see this cost as basically our investment for the future, as we do expect by having this ERP, we then can free the space for the new talent with more, I think, relevant skill set with the business. And also DCRP, the way we calculate basically, we get the net present value of what we pay to them as compared if they stay with us. So this basically put in -- financially, this will benefit us in the medium term. And strategically, we also can fill up the talent in the company with the right skill set.

請將此成本視為我們對未來的投資，正如我們所期望的那樣，透過擁有此 ERP，我們可以為新人才騰出空間，我認為，他們擁有更多與業務相關的技能。還有 DCRP，我們基本上計算的方式，我們得到的是我們支付給他們的淨現值，與他們留在我們身邊的情況相比。所以這基本上是在財務上，這將使我們在中期受益。從策略上講，我們也可以用合適的技能來充實公司的人才。

Yeah, since the demand, they are higher than the supply side. We believe that the leasing rate still trend -- increasing the trend. But I think, in the long term, because there are so many player will come into Jakarta, maybe will be a rational, the rest will be a little bit decline.

是的，從需求方面來說，它們比供應方面要高。我們認為租賃率仍呈上升趨勢。但我認為，從長遠來看，因為有這麼多的球員會來到雅加達，也許會理性一些，剩下的會有點下降。

Does that answer your question?

這是否回答你的問題？

Thank you for that.

謝謝你。

Thank you very much.

非常感謝。

If I can just have a quick follow-up on the G&A side -- sorry, can I just have a quick follow-up on the G&A cost?

如果我可以快速跟進 G&A 方面的情況 - 抱歉，我可以快速跟進 G&A 成本嗎？

Yeah, sure.

好，當然。

So if the G&A costs are up because of payment of bonuses, I mean, that would have been paid last year as well, right? Why is it up 20% year over year basis?

因此，如果由於支付獎金而導致一般管理費用增加，我的意思是，去年也會支付，對嗎？為什麼比去年同期成長20%？

This month, the timing, ba, timing issue. By the end of the year, it is toward the full year. This is supposed to be normalized again. I think, increased by -- I think, the rate of how much the bonus is increased. And second, also the G&A, one of the contribution also coming from the allowance for bad debt in which we also believe it is in the good shape right now. This is supposed to be quite normal after the end of the year.

這個月，時機，ba，時機問題。到了歲末，就已經將近年關了。這應該會再次正常化。我認為，增加了——我認為，獎金增加的比率。其次，也是一般行政費用，其中一項貢獻也來自壞帳準備金，我們也相信壞帳準備金目前狀況良好。到了年底，這應該是很正常的事。

Okay, thank you.

好的謝謝。

Luis Hilado, Citi.

路易斯希拉多，花旗銀行。

Hi, good afternoon. Thanks for the call. We had three questions, the first is, on the wireless side, it seems to be that your revenue market share is still slipping. What's driving this growth gap? Is it because your usage is growing to the other operators? And is it mainly in Java that this happening or in the ex-Java areas where you're seeing the usage shifting?

嗨，下午好。感謝您的來電。我們有三個問題，第一個問題是，在無線方面，你們的營收市佔率似乎仍在下滑。是什麼推動了這種成長差距？是因為您的使用量比其他業者成長了嗎？這種情況主要發生在 Java 中，還是在您看到使用情況變化的前 Java 領域？

Second question is on fixed broadband, it seems to be quite slow for the entire industry aside from yourselves. What's the key bottleneck in driving better broadband subscriptions going forward?

第二個問題是固定寬頻，除了你們以外，整個產業似乎都很慢。推動寬頻訂閱發展的關鍵瓶頸是什麼？

And last question is on the ERP. As you mentioned, there'll be savings from that as well as having room to hire new talent. But in terms of the savings, can you quantify for us what the amount you're looking at for the medium term in terms of savings? Thank you.

最後一個問題是關於 ERP 的。正如您所提到的，這可以節省開支，並且有空間僱用新人才。但就節省而言，您能否為我們量化一下您在中期預計節省的金額是多少？謝謝。

Okay, this is Derrick. I'll answer your question on wireless. Well, what's our view on the current market mobile competition? Well, we see that our competition is expanding aggressively outside of Java. And that's the space that we want to make sure that we will defend aggressively.

好吧，這是德瑞克。我會回答你關於無線的問題。那麼，我們對當前市場移動競爭有何看法？好吧，我們看到我們的競爭正在 Java 之外積極擴張。這就是我們想要確保我們積極捍衛的空間。

With regards to our strategy, we will continue to tailor-fit pricing strategy, coupled with such a packaging. We will also be -- double down on physical culture and personalized offerings. So we will want to synchronize pricing the specific needs of each customer segment. We want to deliver superior customer experience.

關於我們的策略，我們將繼續量身訂做定價策略，再加上這樣的包裝。我們也將加倍致力於體育文化和個人化服務。因此，我們希望針對每個客戶群的特定需求同步定價。我們希望提供卓越的客戶體驗。

So we have also been working very hard to make sure that, at our touch points, we have convenient as well as seamless, efficient experience for our customers, and flexibility to respond to market dynamics to deliver maximum value. And we aim for a revenue share along with profitability while expanding footprint to maintain market share. If you look at our new initiatives like Telkomsel Lite, as well as value, it has gained traction where we see Facebook shares as a proxy, as well as our new market share in terms of gaining customer share.

因此，我們也一直在努力確保在我們的接觸點為客戶提供便利、無縫、高效的體驗，並靈活地回應市場動態以提供最大價值。我們的目標是獲得收入份額和盈利能力，同時擴大足跡以維持市場份額。如果你看看我們像 Telkomsel Lite 這樣的新舉措以及價值，你會發現它已經獲得了關注，我們將 Facebook 股票視為代理，以及我們在獲得客戶份額方面的新市場份額。

Your next question on the fixed broadband business, we are really focusing on accelerating fixed broadband penetration as a first mover by leveraging on our assets. And if you look at our strategy in terms of FMC, we want to maintain our leadership as the nation's largest convergent operator. So we want to drive productivity gains by bringing more value to customers at a household perspective.

關於固定寬頻業務的下一個問題，我們真正專注於利用我們的資產，作為先行者加速固定寬頻的普及。如果你從 FMC 的角度來看我們的策略，我們希望保持我們作為全國最大融合營運商的領先地位。因此，我們希望從家庭角度為客戶帶來更多價值，進而提高生產力。

So hence, our increasing net at sub show strongly in our Q2 '24 aligned with positive growth in revenue. This is to context to our strategy that we ultimately want to secure and lock up households and grow via the ARPA, the average revenue per household.

因此，我們在 24 年第二季的子項目淨值成長與營收的正成長密切相關。這符合我們的策略，即我們最終希望保護和鎖定家庭，並透過 ARPA（每戶平均收入）來成長。

Let me add on fixed broadband growth in household context. I think where we have seen in the market so far, of course, yes, there's competitions among the fixed broadband players. However, we've seen there is a potential growth that we have addressed since Q2 where we have launched the penetrations aggressively on ARPU below 200,000 where we have EZnet.

讓我補充一下家庭環境中固定寬頻的成長情況。我認為到目前為止，我們在市場上看到的情況是，固定寬頻業者之間確實存在競爭。然而，我們已經看到了自第二季度以來我們已經解決的潛在成長問題，我們在 ARPU 低於 200,000 的 EZnet 上積極推出了滲透率。

This has addressed the affordability on the fixed broadband. And at the same time, it is aligned with our strategy to increase the penetration of fixed broadband. I think, as we aware of since the beginning when we transferred in the home to Telkomsel, our main objective is how to increase aggressively our penetrations of fixed broadband from 15% on the current situations to, of course, above that. And the only way we have to do it is with addressing our affordability. And with EZnet, we've seen that it is still maintaining the net debt in terms of additional subscribers.

這解決了固定寬頻的承受能力問題。同時，它也符合我們提高固定寬頻滲透率的策略。我認為，正如我們從家裡轉移到 Telkomsel 之初就意識到的那樣，我們的主要目標是如何積極地將我們的固定寬頻普及率從目前的 15% 提高到當然更高。我們要做到這一點的唯一方法就是解決我們的負擔能力問題。對於 EZnet，我們看到它在新增訂戶方面仍然維持淨債務。

However, of course, there's an impact on ARPU. We believe that this impact on the ARPU, we'll be able to balance with how we can able to improve our IndiHome both from the quality as well as on our value-add. We have improved our speed and also additional value-add service for our IndiHome subscribers in order to improve our ARPU in IndiHome segments.

然而，這當然會對 ARPU 產生影響。我們相信，這種對 ARPU 的影響，我們將能夠平衡如何從品質和附加價值方面改進我們的 IndiHome。我們提高了速度，並為 IndiHome 用戶提供了額外的增值服務，以提高 IndiHome 細分市場的 ARPU。

So basically, in a way, our strategy is to continuously improve our mid- to high segments on fixed broadband and also continuously penetrate our fixed functionalities.

因此，基本上，在某種程度上，我們的策略是不斷改進我們在固定寬頻上的中高端細分市場，並不斷滲透我們的固定功能。

Hi, Luis, on the ERP, I can basically describe to you how we kind of create this one in -- one of the, I think, parameter we use is MVP. Of course, by calculating this one, with the pay that we give to the early retirement as compared to the -- if they stay and we still pay them the salary and the MVP, the difference is positive.

嗨，Luis，關於 ERP，我基本上可以向您描述我們如何創建這個 ERP——我認為我們使用的參數之一是 MVP。當然，透過計算這一點，我們給提前退休的工資與——如果他們留下來，我們仍然向他們支付工資和 MVP 相比，差異是正數。

The other way to see this one is, these activities actually resulted the ERR around 21%. Or if we see in the average, I think the remaining term of most of the employees that follow this one is around five years. The payback period is just around 2.5 years to 3 years of period. So this is basically more positive to the company. That's maybe my explanation.

另一種看待這個問題的方式是，這些活動實際上導致了 21% 左右的 ERR。或者，如果我們平均來看，我認為大多數繼任者的剩餘任期約為五年。投資回收期約2.5年至3年。所以這基本上對公司來說是比較正面的。這也許就是我的解釋。

Thank you, pa. Just one follow-up question, I didn't catch the earlier answer to the question on whether there is going to be ERP in the second half and for next year or you're done for the year.

謝謝你，爸爸。只是一個後續問題，我沒有聽清楚之前關於下半年和明年是否會有 ERP 或今年已經完成的問題的答案。

I think for the -- in the future, we don't see that we need to do this one because in the fixed mobile convergent, FMC, most of the employees that can really have a catching with the new skill set that we need, already been identified and already follow this program. Also, with regard of the -- I think, infra that we established with the business model that we have, we also can reduce some people. The people also already follow this program as well. So with this, we see that, in the near future, there's no additional plan for the ERP.

我認為，在未來，我們認為我們不需要這樣做，因為在固定行動融合、FMC 中，大多數員工能夠真正掌握我們需要的新技能，已經確定並遵循該計劃。另外，我認為，我們用現有的商業模式建立的基礎上，我們也可以減少一些人。人們也已經遵循了這個計劃。因此，我們看到，在不久的將來，ERP 沒有額外的計劃。

Thank you, pa.

謝謝你，爸爸。

(Operator Instructions) I'm seeing no more questions from the line. Allow me to hand the call back to management for closing.

（操作員說明）我沒有看到線路中再有任何問題。請允許我將電話交還給管理層以結束。

Thank you very much, everyone, for participating in the call today. We apologize for those whose questions could not be addressed yet. If you have any questions further, please do not hesitate to contact us directly through the investors@telkom.co.id or you could always reach out to me directly. Thank you very much. Good afternoon.

非常感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。對於那些問題尚未解決的人，我們深表歉意。如果您還有任何疑問，請隨時透過 Investors@telkom.co.id 直接與我們聯繫，或者您也可以隨時直接與我聯繫。非常感謝。午安.

That does conclude today's conference call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect your lines.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。現在您可以斷開線路。