TransAlta Corp (TAC) 2023 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good morning. My name is Joelle, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to TransAlta Corporation's Second Quarter 2022 Results Conference Call. (Operator Instructions)

早上好。我叫 Joelle，今天我將擔任你們的會議操作員。此時此刻，我謹歡迎大家參加 TransAlta Corporation 2022 年第二季度業績電話會議。 （操作員說明）

Ms. Valentini, you may begin your conference.

瓦倫蒂尼女士，您可以開始會議了。

Great. Thank you, Michelle. Good morning, everyone, and welcome to TransAlta's second quarter 2023 conference call. With me today are John Kousinioris, President and Chief Executive Officer; and Todd Stack, EVP Finance and Chief Financial Officer.

偉大的。謝謝你，米歇爾。大家早上好，歡迎參加 TransAlta 2023 年第二季度電話會議。今天和我在一起的有總裁兼首席執行官約翰·庫西尼奧里斯 (John Kosinioris)；財務執行副總裁兼首席財務官托德·斯塔克 (Todd Stack)。

Today's call is being webcast, and I invite those listening on the phone lines to view the recording slides that are posted on our website. A replay of the call will be available later today, and the transcript will be posted to our website shortly thereafter.

今天的電話會議正在網絡直播，我邀請那些在電話線上收聽的人觀看我們網站上發布的錄音幻燈片。今天晚些時候將提供電話會議的重播，會議記錄將在不久後發佈到我們的網站上。

All the information provided during this conference call is subject to the forward-looking statement qualification set out here on Slide 2. It's detailed further in our MD&A and incorporated in full for the purposes of today's call. All amounts referenced during the call are in Canadian currency, unless otherwise noted. The non-IFRS terminology used, including adjusted EBITDA, funds from operations and free cash flow are reconciled in the MD&A for your reference.

本次電話會議期間提供的所有信息均須遵守幻燈片 2 中列出的前瞻性聲明資格。我們的 MD&A 中對此進行了進一步詳細說明，並在今天的電話會議中完整納入。除非另有說明，通話期間提及的所有金額均以加拿大貨幣為單位。使用的非國際財務報告準則術語，包括調整後的 EBITDA、運營資金和自由現金流量，均在 MD&A 中進行了核對，供您參考。

On today's call, John and Todd will provide an overview of the quarter's results. After these remarks, we will open the call for questions. With that, let me turn the call over to John.

在今天的電話會議上，約翰和托德將概述本季度的業績。在這些發言之後，我們將開始提問。現在，讓我把電話轉給約翰。

Thank you, Chiara. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining our second quarter results call for 2023. As part of our commitment towards reconciliation, I want to begin by acknowledging that TransAlta's head office, where we are today is located in the traditional territories of the Niitsitapi, the people of the Treaty 7 region in Southern Alberta, which includes the Siksika, the Piikani, the Kainai, the Tsuut'ina and the Stoney Nakoda First Nations, as well as the home of Metis Nation Region 3.

謝謝你，基婭拉。大家早上好，感謝大家參加我們 2023 年第二季度業績發布會。作為我們和解承諾的一部分，我首先要承認 TransAlta 的總部（我們今天所在的位置）位於 Niitsitapi 的傳統領地是阿爾伯塔省南部條約7 地區的人民，其中包括錫克西卡人、皮卡尼人、凱奈人、楚蒂納人和斯托尼納科達原住民，也是梅蒂斯民族地區3 的故鄉。

TransAlta had another exceptional quarter. We're proud of the overall performance of our company and our employees. We delivered $387 million of adjusted EBITDA, a 39% increase over our Q2 2022 results and free cash flow of $278 million or $1.05 per share, a 94% increase over Q2 2022 results on a per share basis. Both metrics beat our expectations for the quarter. Our results benefited from continuing strong power prices in Alberta and Mid-C, lower natural gas commodity prices and the success of our asset optimization and hedging strategies.

TransAlta 又度過了一個出色的季度。我們對公司和員工的整體表現感到自豪。我們實現了 3.87 億美元的調整後 EBITDA，比 2022 年第二季度業績增長 39%，自由現金流為 2.78 億美元，即每股 1.05 美元，比 2022 年第二季度每股業績增長 94%。這兩項指標都超出了我們對本季度的預期。我們的業績得益於艾伯塔省和中部地區持續強勁的電價、較低的天然氣商品價格以及我們資產優化和對沖策略的成功。

Overall, the Alberta market was impacted by tighter supply conditions resulting from transmission constraints, which limited imports from adjacent markets, supportive power prices in adjacent markets, which also lowered net imports into Alberta and encouraged exports of power from Alberta to the Pacific Northwest, periods of overlapping outages and lower-than-normal wind resources, which impacted renewable generation.

總體而言，艾伯塔省市場受到輸電限制導致的供應緊張的影響，這限制了鄰近市場的進口，支持了鄰近市場的電價，這也降低了艾伯塔省的淨進口量，並鼓勵從艾伯塔省向太平洋西北地區的電力出口。重疊停電和風力資源低於正常水平，影響了可再生能源發電。

We also saw significantly lower fuel costs compared to last year given lower overall commodity prices and the impact of our hedging program. The higher realized prices, coupled with lower realized gas prices, delivered higher gross margins for our portfolio compared to Q2 2022. Our overall availability was 85%. Apart from our ongoing outage at Kent Hills, our performance had weaker availability due to higher planned outages in the hydro and gas segment, which was partially offset by better performance at Centralia compared to last year.

鑑於整體大宗商品價格較低以及我們的對沖計劃的影響，我們還發現燃料成本與去年相比顯著下降。與 2022 年第二季度相比，較高的已實現價格以及較低的已實現天然氣價格為我們的投資組合帶來了更高的毛利率。我們的總體可用性為 85%。除了 Kent Hills 持續停電之外，由於水電和天然氣領域計劃停電較多，我們的業績可用性也較弱，但與去年相比，Centralia 的業績較好，部分抵消了這一影響。

During the quarter, we delivered on a number of key priorities, beginning with the announcement of the proposed acquisition of TransAlta Renewables by TransAlta Corporation. This transaction will not only simplify our corporate structure, it will enhance our strategic position and provide alignment within our clean electricity growth plan, in a manner, that we believe will create value for all our shareholders. The combination will also deliver capital efficiencies and enhance cash flow predictability and diversification for both sets of shareholders while preserving the combined company's ability to realize future growth.

在本季度，我們實現了許多關鍵優先事項，首先是宣布 TransAlta Corporation 擬收購 TransAlta Renewables。這項交易不僅將簡化我們的公司結構，還將增強我們的戰略地位，並在我們的清潔電力增長計劃中提供一致性，我們相信這將為我們所有股東創造價值。此次合併還將提高資本效率，增強雙方股東現金流的可預測性和多元化，同時保留合併後公司實現未來增長的能力。

On the growth side, our development team continues to expand our pipeline, adding another 344 megawatts of growth projects, 300 megawatts of which are renewables projects based in the U.S. and Australia, and 44 megawatts relate to a new peaker initiative that we have here in Alberta, and then I'll be speaking about shortly.

在增長方面，我們的開發團隊繼續擴大我們的管道，增加了另外 344 兆瓦的增長項目，其中 300 兆瓦是位於美國和澳大利亞的可再生能源項目，44 兆瓦與我們在艾伯塔省，然後我很快就會談到。

The rehabilitation of Kent Hills is progressing well with 27 of 50 turbines fully reassembled. Turbines are being returned to service as commissioning activities are completed. And to date, 10 turbines have been fully placed back into operation and are earning revenues from New Brunswick Power.

肯特山的修復工作進展順利，50 台渦輪機中的 27 台已完全重新組裝。隨著調試活動的完成，渦輪機正在恢復運行。迄今為止，10 台渦輪機已完全恢復運行，並從新不倫瑞克電力公司賺取收入。

We are now anticipating that the repair cost will increase to about $140 million as we have opportunistically expanded the scope of work to include certain blade repairs, which will permit us to defer or avoid future maintenance at the site.

我們現在預計維修成本將增加至約 1.4 億美元，因為我們已機會主義地擴大了工作範圍，將某些葉片維修包括在內，這將使我們能夠推遲或避免未來在現場進行的維護。

We completed $35 million in share buybacks during the second quarter, bringing our total capital return to shareholders during the first half of the year to $71 million through the repurchase of 6.1 million common shares at an average purchase price of $11.62. Our current NCIB program was renewed in May, and we see it as a capital allocation alternative that will help us continue to enhance long-term shareholder value. And finally, with another quarter of strong cash flow, our balance sheet position is strong with excellent liquidity and cash on hand to fund our recently announced transaction with TransAlta Renewables as well as our growth projects.

我們在第二季度完成了 3500 萬美元的股票回購，通過以平均購買價格 11.62 美元回購 610 萬股普通股，上半年股東資本回報總額達到 7100 萬美元。我們目前的 NCIB 計劃於 5 月份更新，我們將其視為一種資本配置替代方案，將幫助我們繼續提高長期股東價值。最後，隨著又一個季度強勁的現金流，我們的資產負債表狀況強勁，擁有出色的流動性和手頭現金，為我們最近宣布的與 TransAlta Renewables 的交易以及我們的增長項目提供資金。

As you all know, a key priority for the company for 2023 is completing the construction of our contracted renewables projects. We currently have 678 megawatts of projects in the construction phase, representing an investment of $1.4 billion, with approximately $1.1 billion spent to-date and $300 million left to go. Our 130-megawatt Garden Plain wind farm here in Alberta is nearing completion.

眾所周知，公司2023年的首要任務是完成合同可再生能源項目的建設。目前，我們有 678 兆瓦的項目處於建設階段，投資額為 14 億美元，迄今已支出約 11 億美元，尚待投入 3 億美元。我們位於艾伯塔省的 130 兆瓦 Garden Plain 風電場即將竣工。

All 26 turbines have been assembled and we're pleased to announce that 23 units are in operation today and available to generate electricity to the grid. We expect to finalize commissioning and declare commercial operations in a week or so following resolution of an outstanding issue with the 3 remaining turbines. We expect the wind farm to contribute $15 million of contracted EBITDA annually. And so far, we're pleased with the performance of the Turbine at the site.

所有 26 台渦輪機均已組裝完畢，我們很高興地宣布，23 台渦輪機現已投入運行，可向電網發電。我們預計在解決剩餘 3 台渦輪機的未決問題後，將在一周左右完成調試並宣布商業運營。我們預計該風電場每年將貢獻 1500 萬美元的合同 EBITDA。到目前為止，我們對現場渦輪機的性能感到滿意。

Our Northern Goldfield solar project in Australia is also reaching its final stages of completion. All major equipment has been installed and construction work is largely complete. Energization and testing processes have commenced. The solar facility is beginning to generate electricity and is expected to achieve full commercial operations in the second half of 2023. This project will deliver approximately $9 million of adjusted EBITDA annually.

我們位於澳大利亞的 Northern Goldfield 太陽能項目也已進入最後完成階段。所有主要設備均已安裝完畢，施工工作已基本完成。通電和測試過程已經開始。該太陽能設施已開始發電，預計將於 2023 年下半年實現全面商業運營。該項目每年將帶來約 900 萬美元的調整後 EBITDA。

Construction at the Horizon Hill wind project in Oklahoma is also advancing well, and all major equipment has now been delivered to site. Turbine erection activities are underway, and we're pleased to report that 27 of the 34 wind turbines are fully assembled. Construction of the transmission interconnection is also underway. Although our turbine erection activities are progressing, the critical path to our schedule is the completion of the transmission line, which unfortunately is seeing some delay.

俄克拉荷馬州Horizo​​n Hill風電項目建設也進展順利，目前所有主要設備均已運抵現場。渦輪機安裝活動正在進行中，我們很高興地報告，34 颱風力渦輪機中的 27 台已完全組裝完畢。輸電互聯建設也正在進行中。儘管我們的渦輪機安裝活動正在取得進展，但我們計劃的關鍵途徑是完成輸電線路，不幸的是，輸電線路出現了一些延誤。

As a result, we're now expecting to reach commercial operations during the first half of 2024. At our White Rock East and West project, equipment deliveries are well advanced, and the final blade sets are due to arrive in August. In the meantime, tower assembly has commenced, along with the construction of the transmission interconnection. Horizon Hill and White Rock will contribute adjusted EBITDA of over $100 million annually to our company.

因此，我們現在預計將在 2024 年上半年實現商業運營。在我們的 White Rock East 和 West 項目中，設備交付進展順利，最終葉片組將於 8 月抵達。與此同時，塔架組裝以及輸電互連的建設也已開始。 Horizo​​n Hill 和 White Rock 每年將為我們公司貢獻超過 1 億美元的調整後 EBITDA。

Finally, our Mount Keith 132kV expansion project is also making progress with the gas insulated switch gear being installed in August. The project will achieve commercial operations in the second half of 2023 and contribute approximately $7 million of adjusted EBITDA annually. These projects, along with the Kent Hills rehabilitation, constitute the largest construction program that TransAlta has taken on in recent memory.

最後，我們的 Mount Keith 132kV 擴建項目也取得了進展，氣體絕緣開關設備已於 8 月安裝完畢。該項目將於2023年下半年實現商業運營，每年貢獻約700萬美元的調整後EBITDA。這些項目與肯特山修復工程一起，構成了 TransAlta 近年以來最大的建設項目。

Given the economic and construction environment, we're facing, we're overall pleased with how our projects are tracking. We're only slightly above budget on our 2 U.S. projects, and we're broadly on track with our timing for all of the projects. Within our development pipeline, we currently have 418 megawatts of advanced stage generation and transmission projects that we're advancing towards final investment decisions. They represent additional growth capital of approximately $730 million. They range from wind generation at Tempest to battery storage at WaterCharger.

考慮到我們面臨的經濟和建設環境，我們對項目的進展總體感到滿意。我們的 2 個美國項目僅略高於預算，而且所有項目的時間安排都基本步入正軌。在我們的開發管道中，我們目前擁有 418 兆瓦的高級發電和輸電項目，我們正在推進這些項目以做出最終投資決策。它們代表了約 7.3 億美元的額外增長資本。它們的範圍從 Tempest 的風力發電到 WaterCharger 的電池存儲。

I'm pleased to share that we've added our Pinnacle 1 and 2 projects to our advanced stage development pipeline. Pinnacle 1 and 2 will be a highly flexible and quick ramping peaking facility in Alberta designed to respond to volatile price environment. As Renewables' penetration advances over time in the province, our expectation is that demand for fast-ramping, highly responsive, flexible supply will be needed as the complement.

我很高興地告訴大家，我們已將 Pinnacle 1 和 2 項目添加到我們的高級開發管道中。 Pinnacle 1 和 2 將成為艾伯塔省高度靈活且快速的調峰設施，旨在應對波動的價格環境。隨著可再生能源在該省滲透率的不斷提高，我們預計將需要快速增長、反應靈敏、靈活供應的需求作為補充。

Our Pinnacle 1 and 2 project will leverage our existing infrastructure and interconnection at Keith Hills to deliver exactly this type of capacity. The project comprises four 11-megawatt (inaudible) generating units. The engines will be connected in pairs with each pair linked to the grid independently. We expect approvals and permits to be issued in Q4 with a potential in-service date in the second half of 2025. We also continue to advance our growth pipeline.

我們的 Pinnacle 1 和 2 項目將利用 Keith Hills 的現有基礎設施和互連來提供此類容量。該項目包括四台 11 兆瓦（聽不清）發電機組。發動機將成對連接，每對獨立連接到電網。我們預計將在第四季度發放批准和許可證，並可能在 2025 年下半年投入使用。我們還將繼續推進我們的增長渠道。

As you recall, in 2022, we added almost 2 gigawatts to our renewable development pipeline across all our regions, providing significant progress towards our longer-term goal of having 5 gigawatts of projects in the pipeline. For 2023, we have an in-year stated goal of adding another 1,500 megawatts of new sites to our pipeline to replenish our growth in the longer term.

您還記得，2022 年，我們在所有地區的可再生能源開發項目中增加了近 2 吉瓦，為實現我們在建項目 5 吉瓦的長期目標取得了重大進展。對於 2023 年，我們的年內既定目標是在管道中再增加 1,500 兆瓦的新站點，以補充我們的長期增長。

In the quarter, we added an additional 344 megawatts of future development opportunities. And so far, this year, we've added 630 megawatts or about 42% of our goal. Notably, in the second quarter, we acquired a 50% interest in the 320-megawatt Tent Mountain Pumped Hydro Energy storage project here in Alberta and a combined 300 megawatts of wind prospects in the U.S. and Australia. We see continuing strength in power prices in Alberta and the Pacific Northwest.

本季度，我們額外增加了 344 兆瓦的未來開發機會。今年到目前為止，我們已經增加了 630 兆瓦，即目標的 42% 左右。值得注意的是，在第二季度，我們收購了艾伯塔省 320 兆瓦帳篷山抽水蓄能項目 50% 的權益，以及美國和澳大利亞總計 300 兆瓦的風能項目。我們看到艾伯塔省和太平洋西北地區的電價持續走強。

In Alberta, forward power prices for the balance of the year are trading higher as a result of continuing conditions of tighter supply resulting from generation outages, delays in new asset entry and persisting transmission constraints that are limiting imports. We also continue to see supportive prices in adjacent markets, which are experiencing lower than normal hydrology.

在艾伯塔省，由於發電中斷導致供應持續緊張、新資產進入延遲以及持續限制進口的輸電限制，導致今年餘下時間的遠期電價上漲。我們還繼續看到鄰近市場的價格具有支撐性，這些市場的水文狀況低於正常水平。

With our strong results this quarter and improved market expectations for the rest of the year, we are once again pleased to increase our financial guidance for 2023. We're now expecting Alberta power prices to settle the year between $150 to $150 per megawatt hour, about $25 per megawatt hour higher than our guidance in Q1.

憑藉本季度的強勁業績以及今年剩餘時間市場預期的改善，我們很高興再次提高 2023 年的財務指導。我們現在預計艾伯塔省今年的電價將在每兆瓦時 150 至 150 美元之間，每兆瓦時比我們第一季度的指導高出約25 美元。

We're raising our expectations for adjusted EBITDA to a range of $1.7 billion to $1.8 billion, representing an increase of 17% over the midpoint of our prior guidance, and free cash flow is now expected to be in the range of $850 million to $950 million, an increase of 29% at the midpoint compared to our guidance at Q1.

我們將調整後 EBITDA 的預期上調至 17 億美元至 18 億美元的範圍，比我們之前指導的中值增長 17%，自由現金流目前預計在 8.5 億美元至 950 美元的範圍內百萬，與我們第一季度的指導相比，中值增長了29%。

I'll now turn it over to Todd for further discussion on the quarter's financial results.

我現在將其轉交給托德，以進一步討論本季度的財務業績。

Thank you, John, and good morning, everyone. I'll kick off my comments with a more detailed overview of our Alberta portfolio performance. When we announced our guidance in December, our outlook was based on Alberta power prices ranging between $105 to $135 per megawatt hour.

謝謝約翰，大家早上好。我將首先更詳細地概述我們艾伯塔省投資組合的表現。當我們在 12 月宣布指導意見時，我們的展望是基於阿爾伯塔省每兆瓦時 105 至 135 美元的電價。

Spot prices in the second quarter of 2023 continued to exceed our expectations, settling at $160 per megawatt hour versus $122 in 2022. Year-to-date, pricing through the first half of the year has been stronger than expected at $151 per megawatt hour, and we expect this strength to continue through the end of the year.

2023 年第二季度的現貨價格繼續超出我們的預期，穩定在每兆瓦時160 美元，而2022 年為每兆瓦時122 美元。今年迄今為止，上半年的定價強於預期，為每兆瓦時151 美元。我們預計這種勢頭將持續到今年年底。

As John noted, we now expect spot prices to average between $150 to $170 for the full year. Overall, we continue to realize higher merchant power pricing for energy and ancillary services across the merchant fleet in the first 6 months of the year, and we're able to optimize our available capacity across all fuel types.

正如 John 指出的那樣，我們現在預計全年現貨價格平均在 150 至 170 美元之間。總體而言，今年前 6 個月，我們繼續實現整個商隊的能源和輔助服務的更高商業電價，並且我們能夠優化所有燃料類型的可用容量。

The ability of our hydro fleet capture peak pricing was demonstrated throughout the second quarter with a realized energy price of $199 per megawatt hour, which represented a 25% premium over the average spot price and delivered a 53% stronger realized price versus 2022.

我們的水電艦隊捕獲峰值定價的能力在整個第二季度得到了證明，實現的能源價格為每兆瓦時 199 美元，比平均現貨價格溢價 25%，實現價格比 2022 年高出 53%。

Similarly, our gas fleet exceeded our expectations, capturing peak pricing throughout the quarter with a realized merchant price of $202 per megawatt hour, which represented a 27% premium to the average spot price. Our merchant wind fleet realized an average price of $75 per megawatt hour, which is below the average price of $96 we saw last year. But on a year-to-date basis, the merchant wind fleet has realized an average price of $83 per megawatt hour, which is tracking 11% higher than what the wind fleet realized in the first half of 2022.

同樣，我們的天然氣機組超出了我們的預期，在整個季度實現了峰值定價，實現的商業價格為每兆瓦時 202 美元，比平均現貨價格溢價 27%。我們的商業風力機隊的平均價格為每兆瓦時 75 美元，低於去年的平均價格 96 美元。但從今年迄今來看，商業風電機組的平均價格為每兆瓦時 83 美元，比 2022 年上半年風電機組的實現價格高出 11%。

Looking at the balance of the year for 2023, we have approximately 3,600 gigawatt hours of Alberta gas generation hedged at an average price of $102 per megawatt hour and roughly 88% of our acquired natural gas volumes are hedged at an attractive price of $2.27 per gigajoule. Our hedging activities aim to mitigate the impact of unfavorable market pricing on the Alberta gas fleet, and we continue to retain a significant open position in order to realize higher pricing during times of peak market demand, which was demonstrated in our strong Q2 and year-to-date results. Our financial results for the second quarter were strong.

看看2023 年的餘額，我們約有3,600 吉瓦時的艾伯塔省天然氣發電量以每兆瓦時102 美元的平均價格進行對沖，我們收購的天然氣量中約88% 以每千兆焦耳2.27美元的有吸引力的價格進行對沖。我們的對沖活動旨在減輕不利市場定價對艾伯塔省天然氣船隊的影響，我們繼續保留大量未平倉頭寸，以便在市場需求高峰時期實現更高的定價，這在我們強勁的第二季度和全年表現中得到了證明。最新結果。我們第二季度的財務業績強勁。

As John noted, we generated $387 million of adjusted EBITDA and an exceptional $278 million of free cash flow. Our performance in the second quarter was led by the gas fleet with adjusted EBITDA of $166 million, a 155% improvement over last year. The Gas segment benefited from expanding gross margins in the Alberta fleet through higher realized prices and lower input costs as hedged and market prices for natural gas declined significantly from last year.

正如約翰指出的那樣，我們產生了 3.87 億美元的調整後 EBITDA 和 2.78 億美元的自由現金流。我們第二季度的業績以天然氣車隊為首，調整後的 EBITDA 為 1.66 億美元，比去年提高了 155%。由於對沖和天然氣市場價格較去年大幅下降，天然氣部門受益於阿爾伯塔船隊毛利率的提高，實現價格上漲和投入成本降低。

The Hydro segment also outperformed with an adjusted EBITDA of $147 million, a 67% increase to the same quarter in 2022. Hydro benefited from strong realized pricing as well as from a 20% increase in production over 2022 levels due to higher water resources in the quarter. Higher water resources were driven by timing of the seasonal runoff and higher precipitation.

The Hydro segment also outperformed with an adjusted EBITDA of $147 million, a 67% increase to the same quarter in 2022. Hydro benefited from strong realized pricing as well as from a 20% increase in production over 2022 levels due to higher water resources in the四分之一.季節性徑流和降水量增加導致水資源增加。

The Wind and Solar segment underperformed quarter-over-quarter. Although we brought on new production from the Garden Plain facility, we experienced lower overall production due to pervasive weaker wind and solar resources in all regions compared to the same quarter last year. We also experienced lower realized merchant pricing in Alberta and lower environmental attribute revenue. Quarterly variability in wind resource is expected, and we remain confident in our fleet's ability to realize its long-term average production levels. Energy Marketing had similar performance to last year and in the quarter, delivered $49 million of gross margin and $43 million of adjusted EBITDA, which is another great result for the segment.

風能和太陽能領域季度環比表現不佳。儘管我們從花園平原工廠帶來了新的產量，但由於與去年同期相比，所有地區的風能和太陽能資源普遍疲軟，我們的整體產量有所下降。我們還經歷了艾伯塔省的實際商業定價較低和環境屬性收入較低。預計風力資源會出現季度變化，我們對我們的船隊實現長期平均生產水平的能力仍然充滿信心。能源營銷部門的業績與去年相似，本季度實現了 4900 萬美元的毛利率和 4300 萬美元的調整後 EBITDA，這是該部門的另一個出色業績。

Corporate costs increased by $9 million, primarily due to higher incentive accruals, reflecting our strong performance and were also impacted by higher spending on strategic and growth initiatives and from the impact of inflationary pressures.

企業成本增加了 900 萬美元，主要是由於應計激勵措施增加，反映了我們的強勁業績，同時也受到戰略和增長計劃支出增加以及通脹壓力的影響。

Overall, TransAlta's results again exceeded our expectations and delivered a great first half of 2023. The strong performance of our hydro fleet continues to benefit our shareholders. In the second quarter, the hydro assets generated $147 million of EBITDA and are well on track to deliver over $500 million this year. This compares to over $500 million of EBITDA in 2022 and over $300 million in 2021.

總體而言，TransAlta 的業績再次超出了我們的預期，並在 2023 年上半年實現了出色的業績。我們水電船隊的強勁表現繼續讓我們的股東受益。第二季度，水電資產產生了 1.47 億美元的 EBITDA，今年有望實現超過 5 億美元。相比之下，2022 年的 EBITDA 超過 5 億美元，2021 年的 EBITDA 超過 3 億美元。

Although energy production and ancillary service volumes vary quarterly, they remain largely consistent on an annual basis. This provides long-term predictability and a floor to cash flows that is unique to this asset class. In Q2, while the strong water flows increased our energy sales, it did, at times, limit our ability to provide ancillary services into the market from these units. This resulted in lower ancillary sales from the Hydro segment year-over-year. When this occurs, we are able to backstop the ancillary service sales with our gas fleet, which we did in Q2.

儘管能源生產和輔助服務量按季度變化，但年度基本保持一致。這提供了長期可預測性和該資產類別獨有的現金流下限。在第二季度，雖然強勁的水流增加了我們的能源銷售，但有時確實限制了我們通過這些裝置向市場提供輔助服務的能力。這導致水電部門的輔助銷售額同比下降。當這種情況發生時，我們能夠通過我們的天然氣車隊支持輔助服務銷售，就像我們在第二季度所做的那樣。

During the quarter, we sold approximately 200 gigawatt hours of ancillary services from the gas fleet. Realized pricing continues to be strong with a premium on spot electricity prices of roughly 25% and with ancillary services earning approximately 50% of spot prices. Together, the higher realized prices on both energy and ancillary services and higher energy flows more than offset the impact of lower ancillary service volumes in the Hydro segment.

本季度，我們銷售了約 200 吉瓦時的燃氣車隊輔助服務。已實現定價繼續保持強勁，現貨電價溢價約 25%，輔助服務收入約佔現貨電價的 50%。總之，能源和輔助服務的較高實現價格以及較高的能源流量足以抵消水電領域輔助服務量較低的影響。

Before I turn things back to John, I'll turn to TransAlta Renewables to highlight key details of our acquisition announcement. As John mentioned, we are pleased to announce the path forward on our simplification efforts. We've entered into a definitive agreement where TransAlta will acquire all the issued and outstanding publicly held common shares of TransAlta Renewables. The $13 offer from TransAlta represents an 18.3% premium to TransAlta Renewables closing share price at July 10, 2023, and a 13.6% premium based on the prior 20-day volume weighted average price of the TransAlta Renewables common shares. Each TransAlta Renewables shareholder will have the ability to elect to receive $13 in cash for TransAlta Renewables share or 1.0337 TransAlta shares per TransAlta Renewables share or a combination of cash insurance.

在我把事情轉回約翰之前，我將向 TransAlta Renewables 強調一下我們收購公告的關鍵細節。正如約翰提到的，我們很高興地宣布我們簡化工作的前進道路。我們已達成一項最終協議，TransAlta 將收購 TransAlta Renewables 的所有已發行和流通的公眾持有的普通股。 TransAlta 提出的 13 美元報價較 TransAlta Renewables 截至 2023 年 7 月 10 日的收盤價溢價 18.3%，較 TransAlta Renewables 普通股之前 20 天成交量加權平均價溢價 13.6%。每位 TransAlta Renewables 股東都可以選擇以 13 美元現金換取 TransAlta Renewables 股票，或以每股 TransAlta Renewables 股票換取 1.0337 股 TransAlta 股票，或現金保險組合。

In each case, consideration is subject to pro-ration, with the maximum cash consideration being fixed at $800 million and the maximum share consideration being equal to 46.4 million TransAlta shares. Upon closing of the transaction, the pro forma ownership of the combined company will be approximately 85% held by current TransAlta shareholders and 15% held by current TransAlta Renewables shareholders.

在每種情況下，對價均按比例分配，最高現金對價固定為 8 億美元，最高股份對價等於 4,640 萬股 TransAlta 股票。交易完成後，合併後公司的預計所有權將由現有 TransAlta 股東持有約 85%，目前 TransAlta Renewables 股東持有 15%。

The Board of Directors of each company has independently determined that the transaction is in the best interest of their company and fair to their shareholders. The transaction was also unanimously approved by the independent members of the TransAlta Renewables Board, and they have unanimously recommended that R&W shareholders vote in favor of the transaction.

每家公司的董事會均獨立決定，該交易符合公司的最佳利益，並且對股東公平。該交易還得到了 TransAlta 可再生能源董事會獨立成員的一致批准，他們一致建議 R&W 股東投票贊成該交易。

In terms of next steps, we expect to obtain an interim order from the Alberta Court of King's Bench establishing the process for TransAlta renewable shareholder approval and will mail up the management information circular to TransAlta Renewables shareholders on or about August 25. The special meeting of TransAlta Renewables shareholders to consider the arrangement is expected to take place on or about September 26. The arrangement must be approved by at least 2/3 of the votes cast by TransAlta Renewables shareholders represented at the meeting and by a simple majority of the minority of public shareholders of TransAlta Renewables represented at the meeting. The transaction is subject to regulatory approvals and other customary closing conditions and is expected to close in early October.

就下一步而言，我們預計將獲得阿爾伯塔省國王法庭的臨時命令，建立 TransAlta 可再生能源股東批准程序，並將於 8 月 25 日左右向 TransAlta 可再生能源股東郵寄管理信息通告。 TransAlta Renewables股東預計將於9 月26 日左右考慮該安排。該安排必須獲得出席會議的TransAlta Renewables 股東至少2/3 的投票以及少數股東的簡單多數批准。 TransAlta Renewables 的公眾股東出席了會議。該交易尚待監管部門批准並滿足其他慣例成交條件，預計將於 10 月初完成。

And with that, I will turn the call back over to John.

然後，我會將電話轉回給約翰。

Thanks, Todd. As I look at our strategic priorities for 2023, our primary goal is to continue delivering clean power solutions to and be the supplier of choice for customers that are focused on sustainable growth and decarbonization.

謝謝，托德。在我審視 2023 年的戰略重點時，我們的首要目標是繼續為關注可持續增長和脫碳的客戶提供清潔能源解決方案，並成為他們的首選供應商。

In 2023, we're focused on progressing the following key goals: reaching final investment decisions on the equivalent of 500 megawatts of additional clean energy projects across Canada, the United States and Australia and delivering $75 million to $100 million in incremental EBITDA. Achieving COD on the Garden Plain winds, Northern Goldfield solar and Mt. Keith Transmission projects while progressing the White Rock Winds and Horizon Hills wind project to completion early in 2024; expanding our development pipeline by 1,500 megawatts with a focus on renewables and storage; completing the rehabilitation of Kent Hills Wind; advancing the long-term contractedness of our Alberta electricity portfolio; delivering permanent financing for our Oklahoma growth projects; and achieving EBITDA and free cash flow within our increased guidance ranges.

2023 年，我們將重點推進以下關鍵目標：對加拿大、美國和澳大利亞相當於 500 兆瓦的額外清潔能源項目達成最終投資決策，並實現 7500 萬至 1 億美元的增量 EBITDA。實現 Garden Plain 風電、Northern Goldfield 太陽能和 Mt. Keith Transmission 項目的 COD，同時推進 White Rock Winds 和 Horizo​​n Hills 風電項目於 2024 年初完工；將我們的開發管道擴大 1,500 兆瓦，重點關注可再生能源和存儲；完成 Kent Hills Wind 的修復工作；推進艾伯塔省電力投資組合的長期合同性；為我們俄克拉荷馬州的增長項目提供永久融資；並在我們提高的指導範圍內實現 EBITDA 和自由現金流。

I'd like to close by highlighting what I think makes TransAlta a highly attractive investment and a great value opportunity. First, our cash flows are robust and underpinned by a high-quality and highly diversified portfolio. Our business is driven by our contracted wind and solar portfolio, are unique, reliable and perpetual tighter portfolio and our efficient gas portfolio, all of which are complemented by our world-class asset optimization and energy marketing capabilities.

最後，我想強調一下我認為 TransAlta 成為極具吸引力的投資和巨大價值機會的原因。首先，我們的現金流強勁，並以高質量和高度多元化的投資組合為基礎。我們的業務由我們的合同風能和太陽能投資組合、獨特、可靠和永久更緊密的投資組合以及高效的天然氣投資組合推動，所有這些都得到了我們世界一流的資產優化和能源營銷能力的補充。

The acquisition of TransAlta Renewables will further diversify and increase the contractedness of our cash flows. Second, we're a clean electricity leader with a focus on tangible greenhouse gas emissions reductions. This year, we adopted a more ambitious CO2 emissions reduction target of 75% by 2026 from 2015 levels, and our Board has recently approved our commitment to Net Zero by 2045.

收購 TransAlta Renewables 將進一步多元化並增加我們現金流的收縮性。其次，我們是清潔電力的領導者，專注於切實減少溫室氣體排放。今年，我們制定了更加雄心勃勃的二氧化碳排放目標，即到 2026 年在 2015 年的基礎上減少 75%，而且我們的董事會最近批准了我們到 2045 年實現淨零排放的承諾。

Third, as noted earlier, we have a diversified and growing development pipeline and a talented development team focused on realizing its value. And fourth, our company has a sound financial foundation. Our balance sheet is strong, and we have ample liquidity to pursue and deliver growth. Finally, our people. Our people are our greatest asset, and I want to thank all our employees and contracts for the excellent work they have done to deliver our exceptional quarter.

第三，如前所述，我們擁有多元化且不斷增長的開發渠道和一支專注於實現其價值的優秀開發團隊。第四，我們公司有良好的財務基礎。我們的資產負債表強勁，並且擁有充足的流動性來追求和實現增長。最後是我們的人民。我們的員工是我們最大的資產，我要感謝我們所有的員工和合同人員為實現我們出色的季度所做的出色工作。

Thank you. I'll turn the call back over to Chiara.

謝謝。我會把電話轉回給 Chiara。

Thank you, John. Michelle, would you please open the call for questions from the analysts and media?

謝謝你，約翰。米歇爾，請您開始接受分析師和媒體提問好嗎？

(Operator Instructions) Your first question comes from Dariusz Lozny with Bank of America.

（操作員說明）您的第一個問題來自美國銀行的 Dariusz Lozny。

Maybe just at the outset, I was wondering if I could get your thoughts on the announcement yesterday from the Alberta Commission that put a pause on new applications for wind and solar. I don't believe there should be much of a material impact to your pending projects in the pipeline, but maybe if you can comment on that? And maybe more broadly, how do you see this sort of impacting your longer-term plans as far as where to concentrate your development pipeline?

也許在一開始，我想知道您是否可以了解您對艾伯塔省委員會昨天宣布暫停風能和太陽能新申請的看法。我認為不會對您正在進行的待決項目產生太大的實質性影響，但也許您可以對此發表評論嗎？也許更廣泛地說，您如何看待這種影響您的長期計劃以及集中開發渠道的地方？

Darius, and thanks for that question. I mean, look, -- the impact of the announcement yesterday will be limiting at least for a period of time, the advancement of renewable project in the province for that 6-month period while there's consideration being given to the pathways going forward. I have to say that from our own perspective, we have raised in the past the importance of making sure that we have a balanced approach to the growth that we're seeing in renewables in the province, I think if people have heard me say this before, it's like a 3-legged stool, and it's critical that the grid is clean, but also reliable and affordable.

達流斯，謝謝你提出這個問題。我的意思是，看，昨天宣布的影響將至少在一段時間內限制該省可再生能源項目在這 6 個月內的進展，同時考慮未來的道路。我不得不說，從我們自己的角度來看，我們過去已經提出了確保我們對該省可再生能源的增長採取平衡方法的重要性，我想如果人們聽到我這麼說的話以前，它就像一個三腳凳，網格乾淨至關重要，而且可靠且價格實惠。

And I think spending a bit of time to review, how the system maintains affordability and reliability as we begin to transition towards the lower emitting grid is critical. So we're looking forward to that consultation process that we'll be having that will involve the Alberta Utilities Commission. We take a long-term view on our development pipeline in Alberta, and I can tell you, it's business as usual for us in terms of trying to advance our projects here in specific response to a couple of your questions, we don't really see it having a significant impact on our advanced stage projects.

我認為花一些時間回顧一下，當我們開始向低排放電網過渡時，系統如何保持可承受性和可靠性至關重要。因此，我們期待著艾伯塔省公用事業委員會參與的磋商過程。我們對艾伯塔省的開發管道抱有長期的看法，我可以告訴您，對於我們來說，在嘗試推進我們的項目方面一切如常，具體回答了您的幾個問題，我們並不真正這樣做看到它對我們的高級項目產生重大影響。

WaterCharger and Tempest have Alberta Utilities Commission approval and we continue to advance those forward and are working hard to get them completed and announced this year. Pinnacle 1 and 2, which we've just announced would be gas investments in the province. So again, they wouldn't be impacted by the halt as we understand it, that is being put in place as a result of the Alberta Utilities Commission decision.

WaterCharger 和 Tempest 已獲得艾伯塔省公用事業委員會的批准，我們將繼續推進這些項目，並努力在今年完成並宣布。我們剛剛宣布的 Pinnacle 1 和 2 項目將是該省的天然氣投資。因此，按照我們的理解，他們不會受到暫停的影響，這是由於艾伯塔省公用事業委員會的決定而實施的。

In terms of where we're thinking overall in Alberta, I would say that we continue to be committed to all of our decarbonization and net zero targets. We continue to see demand for renewables in the province. We expect kind of renewables growth to continue once this review is completed in the province. We are, though, for sure, I would say, turning our minds to what other attributes the system will require in Alberta as it evolves in the coming decade and having fast response battery and some peaking capacity that can create that reliability and stability that the market will need periodically is also something we're looking at. And that's really what Pinnacle 1 and 2 are all about, along with WaterCharger.

就我們在​​艾伯塔省的整體思考而言，我想說的是，我們將繼續致力於實現所有脫碳和淨零目標。我們繼續看到該省對可再生能源的需求。我們預計，一旦該省的審查完成，可再生能源將繼續增長。不過，我想說的是，我們肯定會考慮，隨著阿爾伯塔省系統在未來十年的發展，該系統將需要哪些其他屬性，並擁有快速響應電池和一些峰值容量，這些屬性可以創造出系統的可靠性和穩定性。市場定期需要也是我們正在考慮的事情。這正是 Pinnacle 1 和 2 以及 WaterCharger 的真正意義所在。

If I could ask one more on the updated guidance for the full year. Obviously, very robust results, $200 million more on free cash flow. To the extent that the balance of the year continues to come in above expectations. Is there any possibility of perhaps raising the cash contribution in the R&W buy-in? Or is it more or less set as you guys announced earlier in July, and that's how you plan on proceeding?

我能否再詢問有關全年更新指導的問題。顯然，結果非常強勁，自由現金流增加了 2 億美元。今年的餘額繼續高於預期。是否有可能提高 R&W 收購中的現金出資？或者說，這或多或少是按照你們七月初宣布的那樣確定的，這就是你們計劃進行的方式？

Yes. No. So the transaction with TransAlta Renewables is fixed. There is, from our perspective, no prospect of any change in the composition of the consideration to that transaction.

是的。不會。所以與 TransAlta Renewables 的交易已經確定。從我們的角度來看，該交易的對價構成不會發生任何變化。

I'd just say that we are conscious that when the transaction closes, there might be some movement in shareholder interests from TransAlta Renewables side. And so you'll notice that we did reinstate our NCIB program back in May, and so we're very much able to go out and support the stock if there is some churn.

我只想說，我們意識到，當交易完成時，TransAlta Renewables 方面的股東利益可能會發生一些變化。因此，您會注意到，我們確實在 5 月份恢復了 NCIB 計劃，因此，如果出現一些波動，我們非常有能力出去支持股票。

Your next question comes from Mark Jarvi with CIBC.

您的下一個問題來自 CIBC 的 Mark Jarvi。

So just coming back to more to a couple of other questions. One, do you think this will have any impact on, I guess, the outlook for pricing or ancillary services here, if there is a little bit of a slowdown in the -- I guess, the penetration ramp up in renewables?

回到其他幾個問題。第一，我想，如果可再生能源的滲透率略有放緩，我想這會對這裡的定價或輔助服務的前景產生任何影響嗎？

And then just maybe clarify, you said nothing, no impact on Tempest, WaterCharger. What about some of the, I guess, the next stage of projects like Riplinger, Sunhills and I guess the last little question would be, if they do constraint where you can cite new projects, can you talk a little bit about the ability to build on existing sites, whether it's your thermal sites or legacy wind sites?

然後澄清一下，你什麼也沒說，對 Tempest、WaterCharger 沒有影響。我想，下一階段的一些項目，比如 Riplinger、Sunhills，我想最後一個小問題是，如果它們確實限制了你可以引用新項目的地方，你能談談構建的能力嗎？在現有站點上，無論是您的熱站點還是傳統風站點？

Yes. Mark, maybe I'll start with the back half of your question. Look, as we were progressing our development pipeline, the projects that were sort of next up in terms of moving through the process for us would have been Riplinger and Sunhills Solar. And I think generally, we would have been looking to begin advancing approvals for those projects kind of in the back half of this year and the early part of next year.

是的。馬克，也許我會從你問題的後半部分開始。瞧，當我們推進開發流程時，接下來要推進的項目是 Riplinger 和 Sunhills Solar。我認為總的來說，我們一直希望在今年下半年和明年初開始推進這些項目的批准。

So I would say that those projects, which we continue to work on would be a little bit delayed in terms of being sort of in the permitting queue to get them completed. We'll see how the consultation progresses. I think there's a strong desire on part of the province to ensure reliability in the grid, which makes sense for us. That's something that we've been speaking to.

所以我想說，我們繼續開展的那些項目在完成許可隊列方面會有點延遲。我們將看看磋商進展如何。我認為該省部分地區強烈希望確保電網的可靠性，這對我們來說是有意義的。這是我們一直在談論的事情。

And also, the notion of making sure that various stakeholders and rural parts of the province that are being impacted by the dramatic renewables growth that we've seen have been addressed. You also have to remember that our development pipeline also has an extensive exposure to projects in the United States and Australia. And we're able to accelerate and kind of, move the focus of the growth that we have in the different jurisdictions. But from a long-term perspective, I don't think we're expecting much in the way of change. It's sort of business as usual.

此外，確保該省的各個利益相關者和農村地區受到我們所看到的可再生能源急劇增長的影響的概念已經得到解決。您還必須記住，我們的開發渠道還廣泛涉及美國和澳大利亞的項目。我們能夠加速並在某種程度上將我們的增長重點轉移到不同的司法管轄區。但從長遠來看，我認為我們對變革的期望並不高。一切如常。

On your question on pricing, when we look at sort of 2024, the balance of 2023 and into probably even 2025, I would say, Todd, I'm not sure that we think that the announcements wouldn't have much in the way of a significant impact. There's plenty of projects that are under construction. There are some large gas plants that are looking coming in, most notably Kineticor and also the Suncor plant at the tail end of next year.

關於你關於定價的問題，當我們考慮 2024 年、2023 年的餘額甚至可能到 2025 年時，我想說，托德，我不確定我們是否認為這些公告不會有太大影響。產生重大影響。有很多項目正在建設中。有一些大型天然氣工廠正在考慮入駐，其中最引人注目的是 Kineticor 工廠以及將於明年底建成的 Suncor 工廠。

So the slowdown would be projects that are still a number of years away from being able to see the light of day. So I think in terms of our near-term view, I see very little impact.

因此，放緩的對像是那些距離落地還需要數年時間的項目。因此，我認為就我們的近期觀點而言，我認為影響很小。

And then just, when you think about some of your growth objectives or the main growth objective sort of 2 gigawatt, $3.6 billion, and you're seeing things like this maybe delay in Alberta, still some constraints on supply chain and costs. How would you frame that now in terms of your path-forward on that? If it takes a bit more time, I guys seem you guys are comfortable with that. How would you sort of frame your, I guess, willingness to stick to that time line versus just continue to be disciplined and you've got excess cash to use for the buyback. Just sort of your updated views in terms of how aggressively you push those goals, right now.

然後，當你考慮一些增長目標或 2 吉瓦、36 億美元的主要增長目標時，你會發現阿爾伯塔省可能會延遲，但供應鍊和成本仍然受到一些限制。您現在如何規劃您的前進道路？如果需要更多時間，我覺得你們對此感到滿意。我想，你會如何確定自己遵守時間表的意願，而不是繼續遵守紀律，並且你有多餘的現金可用於回購。只是根據您現在如何積極地推動這些目標來整理一下您的最新觀點。

Yes. Look, I'll begin by saying that the TransAlta TransAlta Renewables acquisition is, at least from our own perspective, a pretty significant acquisition of generation. I mean, we're acquiring kind of the economic interest in that balance, 1.2 gig essentially of generation that we didn't effectively own as a result of the structure that was there. But in terms of the incremental projects going forward.

是的。看，我首先要說的是，至少從我們自己的角度來看，對 TransAlta 可再生能源公司的收購是一次相當重要的發電收購。我的意思是，我們正在獲得這種平衡中的某種經濟利益，基本上是 1.2 兆瓦的發電量，但由於現有的結構，我們實際上並沒有擁有這些利益。但就未來的增量項目而言。

Look, we're remaining super disciplined. We won't do projects until we've derisked them as much as we possibly can and are comfortable with the contractual terms or when you're looking at projects like WaterCharger that our optimization team is ready to go in terms of what they will be doing to create value for our shareholder in those projects. So we think our targets are appropriate ones. We continue to advance them. We like our 418 megawatts of advanced stage projects that we're seeing get through.

看，我們仍然非常自律。在我們盡可能降低項目風險並對合同條款感到滿意之前，或者當您考慮像 WaterCharger 這樣的項目時，我們的優化團隊已準備好開始實施，否則我們不會開展項目在這些項目中為我們的股東創造價值。所以我們認為我們的目標是合適的。我們繼續推進它們。我們對我們看到的 418 兆瓦高級項目感到滿意。

I think for us, we're just going to remain super disciplined on our capital expenditures. We're not going to pull the trigger on projects unless we're getting the kind of returns that we need for them. And we think the appropriate contingency that we have, we think prices have stabilized, I would say. I think over the last little bit, what used to be about $1.5 million a megawatt for development has inched up, I'd say taught closer to 2, but it's kind of staying around 2.

我認為對我們來說，我們將在資本支出上保持嚴格的紀律。除非我們獲得了我們需要的回報，否則我們不會啟動項目。我想說，我們認為我們擁有適當的應急措施，我們認為價格已經穩定。我認為在過去的一段時間裡，曾經每兆瓦約 150 萬美元的開發費用已經小幅上升，我想說接近 2，但它有點保持在 2 左右。

On the wind side, we're a little bit concerned about the supply chain and kind of 25-ish, 26-ish. There's a lot of wind development that is going in place, and there's work to do for the OEMs to be able to supply all of that. But it's pretty much steady as she goes from a TransAlta perspective and always with a view of making sure, we're creating value for our shareholders.

在風電方面，我們有點擔心供應鏈以及 25 左右、26 左右的情況。許多風電開發項目正在進行中，原始設備製造商還需要做很多工作才能提供所有這些服務。但她從 TransAlta 的角度出發，並且始終以確保我們為股東創造價值的觀點來看，情況相當穩定。

We will be at our Investor Day in November, looking to update our targets broadly speaking to the end of the decade. It's amazing how quickly time goes by. So stay tuned for that, but I don't think there'll be any surprises in terms of what our approach is going forward.

我們將在 11 月的投資者日，尋求更新我們到本十年末的目標。時間過得真快。因此，請繼續關注這一點，但我認為我們的方法未來不會有任何意外。

And just a follow-up that you talked about maintaining good returns. How would you frame the returns on the advanced stage projects now that you have in front as you come to a final investment decision? And I'm particularly interested to see how the returns on something like Pinnacle 1 and 2 is square against some of the other projects that are in the advanced stage?

您剛才談到了保持良好回報的後續行動。當您做出最終投資決定時，您將如何確定高級階段項目的回報？我特別感興趣的是，像 Pinnacle 1 和 2 這樣的項目的回報率與其他一些處於後期階段的項目相比如何？

Yes. I mean, look, we look at it as -- we assess each project in light of the sort of risk elements associated with the projects. So we've got like an overall sort of hurdle rate that we tend to target for the company and then it either goes down or it goes up depending on the characteristics specifically that the project has, including whether or not you can put debt financing on it, how easy it is to actually construct it, how confident we are the data, what the contracting strategy is. So it is a -- you put a sort of lining scale in terms of the way we look at it.

是的。我的意思是，看，我們將其視為 - 我們根據與項目相關的風險要素的類型來評估每個項目。因此，我們有一個總體的門檻利率，我們傾向於為公司設定目標，然後它要么下降，要么上升，具體取決於項目的具體特徵，包括是否可以進行債務融資它的實際構建有多容易，我們對數據的信心有多大，承包策略是什麼。所以這是一個——你根據我們看待它的方式來衡量。

Certainly, projects like our WaterCharger, Pinnacle type projects would be higher returning projects than kind of contracted renewables. They need to be, candidly, given that there's a merchant component to what they have. So our focus in those projects would be to get our capital out of this quickly as we possibly can. So we expect much higher returns, whereas if you have a project that you've contracted for 15 or 20 years and gives you that stability of cash flow and the ability to put project financing or other debt against it, it's a different assessment.

當然，像我們的 WaterCharger、Pinnacle 類型項目這樣的項目將比合同可再生能源項目的回報更高。坦率地說，考慮到他們所擁有的東西中有商業成分，他們需要這樣做。因此，我們對這些項目的重點是盡可能快地籌集資金。因此，我們期望更高的回報，而如果您有一個合同期為15 或20 年的項目，並為您提供穩定的現金流以及以項目融資或其他債務作為抵押的能力，那麼這是一個不同的評估。

So I don't know if that gives you the kind of color that you need, but we do look at it from a broad portfolio perspective, I'd say. Todd, I don't know if you have anything else to add to that.

所以我不知道這是否能給你帶來你需要的顏色，但我想說，我們確實從廣泛的投資組合角度來看待它。托德，我不知道你還有什麼要補充的嗎？

Well, I was just going to add look, look, clearly, clearly inflation is higher, underlying rates higher. Yes. Taking that into consideration even on what would, I would call the standard fully contracted wind facility on our return expectations. So I would say that return expectations are inching up and and John really dove into the detail about merchant is really a whole different spectrum of return expectations.

嗯，我只是想補充一點，看，看，顯然，通脹更高，基本利率更高。是的。考慮到這一點，我將根據我們的回報預期將其稱為標準完全承包風電設施。所以我想說，回報預期正在緩慢上升，約翰真正深入研究了有關商家的細節，這實際上是一個完全不同的回報預期範圍。

No, that makes sense and good to hear the turns are inching up. What would you say would be the premium required can you quantify in terms of basis points or percentage-wise for that merchant exposure?

不，這是有道理的，很高興聽到轉彎正在緩慢上升。您認為所需的溢價是多少，您能以基點或百分比形式量化該商家的風險敞口嗎？

Let's put it this way, it's several hundred basis points higher than it would be for contracted renewables from a TransAlta perspective. So well north of 10%, put it that way. Well, north yes.

這麼說吧，從 TransAlta 的角度來看，它比合同可再生能源高出數百個基點。這麼說吧，遠高於 10%。嗯，北邊是的。

Your next question comes from Ben Pham with BMO Capital Markets.

您的下一個問題來自 BMO 資本市場的 Ben Pham。

Maybe just sort of on the clean electricity growth plan. Can you talk about some of the moving parts on White Rock Horizon? You talk about the timing being revised, we made context on the CapEx movement and a little bit of movement on the EBITDA for Horizon Health?

也許只是清潔電力增長計劃的一部分。您能談談《White Rock Horizo​​n》中的一些活動部分嗎？您談到了修改時間，我們對 Horizo​​n Health 的資本支出變動和 EBITDA 的一些變動做了背景介紹？

Yes, Ben, you came across is pretty muted, but I think I caught the gist of what you were asking. I mean in terms of the timing on the plan, look, our advanced stage projects are probably about another 25% to 30% of the targeted EBITDA that we want. We do expect to be bringing some of those forward. We like the fact that they're in multiple jurisdictions, there's an Alberta feel to them, but also a feel in Australia, where we continue to progress things going forward.

是的，本，你的語氣很平靜，但我想我抓住了你問的要點。我的意思是，就計劃的時間安排而言，我們的高級項目可能是我們想要的目標 EBITDA 的另外 25% 到 30%。我們確實希望將其中一些向前推進。我們喜歡他們位於多個司法管轄區的事實，他們有阿爾伯塔省的感覺，但也有澳大利亞的感覺，我們在那裡繼續取得進展。

We remain confident in hitting our target in terms of getting financial investment decisions on the 2 gigs by the end of 2025. We are seeing appropriate returns, I think, for the projects generally. But given the inflationary environment that we see, like we're even being more cautious than usual in terms of buttoning out the cost of developing the projects and derisking them as much as possible. So that's generally the approach. Todd?

我們仍然有信心在 2025 年底前實現兩項演出的財務投資決策目標。我認為，我們總體上看到了這些項目的適當回報。但考慮到我們所看到的通脹環境，我們在確定項目開發成本並儘可能降低風險方面甚至比平時更加​​謹慎。這就是通常的方法。托德？

And John, so you said there was a commenting on specific issues around Horizon Hill and White Rock delays in capital cost creep in there, I think, Ben. And so as John updated in the call, that the construction of the turbines facility is going extremely well, lots of progress there and it really is the transmission interconnections. I think on both sites that are really critical path in driving delays, and there's just some equipment supply in there and then the final interactions that need to be done. Yes. Sorry, Ben. I, I, I didn't, I didn't quite catch.

約翰，所以你說有人對 Horizo​​n Hill 和 White Rock 的具體問題發表了評論，因為那裡的資本成本緩慢上升，我想，Ben。正如約翰在電話中更新的那樣，渦輪機設施的建設進展非常順利，取得了很多進展，而且確實是傳輸互連。我認為在這兩個站點上，這確實是導致延遲的關鍵路徑，那裡只有一些設備供應，然後需要完成最終的交互。是的。對不起，本。我，我，我沒有，我沒聽清楚。

No, that's okay. It's good. The broader view first too on that. Can you also comment on, why is the, I know there's snow pack in Alberta, it's helping out that side, but we're seeing mostly drought conditions elsewhere. Is it just more regional difference? And then maybe just any comments on, how do you think about the resource projections you have in engineers with Q two being quite soft and how that peak into even how you underwrite projects as well?

不，沒關係。很好。首先也是更廣泛的觀點。你也可以評論一下，為什麼，我知道艾伯塔省有積雪，這對那邊有幫助，但我們在其他地方看到的大多是乾旱情況。難道只是地區差異更大？然後也許只是任何評論，您如何看待第二個問題相當軟的工程師的資源預測，以及如何在您承保項目的方式上達到頂峰？

Well, I think we did see an early melt this year and a lot of water came through in Q2 versus some that often spills into July in our Q3 results. We saw a lot of the melts come in Q2. But we did see high precipitation in the period as well. Long term, I mean, clearly, if the melt comes in Q2, we'll have less production in Q3. But as we kind of talk through there, even though we got the extra energy in the water in Q2, it did impact our ancillary services sales. So if we get a little bit less water in Q3, then we have the opportunity to offer more into the ancillary market from the facility. Longer term, we're still confident in the long run hydrology there and really no concerns on the long-run average production that we get from those facilities.

嗯，我認為我們今年確實看到了早期融化，並且在第二季度出現了很多水，而在我們第三季度的結果中，一些水經常溢出到 7 月。我們在第二季度看到了很多融化。但我們也確實看到了這段時期的高降水量。從長遠來看，我的意思是，顯然，如果第二季度熔化，我們第三季度的產量將會減少。但正如我們所說，儘管我們在第二季度在水中獲得了額外的能量，但它確實影響了我們的輔助服務銷售。因此，如果我們在第三季度獲得的水量減少一點，那麼我們就有機會從該設施向輔助市場提供更多水。從長遠來看，我們仍然對那裡的長期水文充滿信心，並且實際上並不擔心我們從這些設施獲得的長期平均產量。

Yes. I mean the kind of variability, we're seeing is kind of within the zone of what our expectations would be and what we've seen over the most a decade of data that we have. In fact, it goes a lot longer than that. I mean, this year, we had a lot of water in June. I think Ben, as you know, we don't have as much storage as we'd like on our systems. Here in Alberta, so you can't actually store the water. We've got a spill it and manage the river flows as we go forward. So in light of the overall management that we do there and the constraints that we have in the facilities, to Todd's point, we random and the just reporting where energy was generated from the fleet rather than ancillary services, but our gas fleet picked up the slack on the AS side.

是的。我的意思是，我們看到的這種變化是在我們的預期範圍內，以及我們在過去十年的數據中所看到的範圍內。事實上，它的時間比這要長得多。我的意思是，今年六月我們有很多水。我想 Ben，正如您所知，我們的系統上沒有足夠的存儲空間。在艾伯塔省，你實際上無法儲存水。我們已經處理了洩漏問題並在前進時管理河流。因此，根據托德的觀點，鑑於我們在那裡進行的整體管理以及設施中的限制，我們隨機且公正地報告了能源從車隊而不是輔助服務產生的位置，但我們的天然氣車隊獲得了AS 側鬆弛。

Maybe just one last one, if I may. You mentioned in response to the question around the 2025 target. RNW has been quite a significant transaction. Are you maybe suggesting that you really, like when you think RNW on a proportionate basis, you've effectively met your 2025 targets in a sense because it always was some sort of M&A in it. And then can you confirm you mentioned around Investor Day, there's going to be probably no change in methodology. Is it going to be still going on a gross basis that guidance or you may want to relook at that?

如果可以的話，也許只是最後一件事。你在回答有關2025年目標的問題時提到了這一點。 RNW 是一筆相當重要的交易。您是否可能表示，您真的像當您按比例考慮 RNW 時一樣，在某種意義上您已經有效地實現了 2025 年的目標，因為其中始終存在某種併購。然後你可以確認一下你在投資者日提到的，方法論可能不會發生變化。指導意見是否仍將在總體上繼續進行，或者您可能需要重新考慮這一點？

Yes. Look, when we talk internally about what we're doing and when you look at the TransAlta Renewables acquisition, I mean, we're spending quite a bit of money for that. It is growth from our perspective. We're preserving cash flows from those assets. We're not sort of explicitly saying that check, we've made the 2 gigawatt target.

是的。看，當我們在內部談論我們正在做的事情時，當你看看 TransAlta 可再生能源公司的收購時，我的意思是，我們為此花費了相當多的錢。從我們的角度來看，這是增長。我們正在保留這些資產的現金流。我們並沒有明確表示要進行檢查，我們已經制定了 2 吉瓦的目標。

We continue to advance and trying to add incremental megawatts going forward, and we're confident of moving that forward. The key criteria for us, is just making sure that the products that we do create value for our shareholders. I mean if all we needed to do is hit 2 gigs, we could do it, but you may not get the kind of projects from the company that you'd want us to have. So we're going to stay disciplined.

我們繼續前進，並努力增加未來兆瓦的增量，我們有信心推動這一進程。我們的關鍵標準是確保我們所做的產品為股東創造價值。我的意思是，如果我們需要做的只是完成 2 場演出，我們可以做到，但你可能無法從公司獲得你希望我們擁有的那種項目。所以我們要保持紀律。

In terms of Investor Day, you will be seeing sort of growth. We're not proposing to change the methodology or anything like that. It will be very much as we work through it, similar to what you're seeing now in terms of a long-range megawatt target, broad speaking, an annual pathway, EBITDA targets for the company and kind of our expectations on what the capital spend would be based on the best information we have at the time.

就投資者日而言，您將看到一定程度的增長。我們不建議改變方法或類似的東西。當我們努力完成它時，這將與您現在所看到的長期兆瓦目標、廣義而言、年度路徑、公司的 EBITDA 目標以及我們對資本的期望類似。支出將基於我們當時掌握的最佳信息。

Your next question comes from Rob Hope with Scotiabank.

您的下一個問題來自豐業銀行的 Rob Hope。

Just one for me. I want to think -- I want to ask about conceptually, how you're thinking about the peaker plant at Keephills. As we see Kineticor and Cascade and the Suncor project center service, is the expectation that kind of your coal to gas conversions could be seeing less utilization and won't have that ramping capacity that will be required in a renewable heavy environment, so that this peaker investment is allowing you to use existing infrastructures and then interconnection to better meet the more volatile pricing environment?

只給我一個。我想思考一下——我想從概念上問一下，你是如何看待Keephills 的峰化工廠的。正如我們所看到的 Kineticor 和 Cascade 以及 Suncor 項目中心服務，預計您的煤改氣可能會出現利用率較低的情況，並且不會具備可再生重環境中所需的爬坡能力，因此， Peaker投資是否可以讓您利用現有的基礎設施然後互連以更好地適應更加波動的定價環境？

Look, I think the way you characterized it is sort of an appropriate one as we see the evolution of the fleet. When you look at our coal to gas units, now we tend to describe them, and I think you've heard us describe them with kind of Alberta peaking units. There'll be periods of time where they'll be running at relatively high-capacity factors, and there will be other periods of time that we will need them as much. But I think you've hit the nail on the head when you're looking at not just Pinnacle 1 and 2, but even WaterCharger, for example, those are products that will be oriented towards meeting what we anticipate will be increasing intermittency in the grid and more significant volatility in terms of price movement.

看，我認為你描述它的方式是適當的，因為我們看到了艦隊的演變。當您查看我們的煤製天然氣裝置時，現在我們傾向於描述它們，我想您已經聽到我們用艾伯塔省峰值裝置來描述它們。在某些時期，它們會以相對較高的容量係數運行，而在其他時期，我們也同樣需要它們。但我認為，當您不僅關注 Pinnacle 1 和 2，甚至還關注 WaterCharger 時，您已經擊中要害，例如，這些產品將旨在滿足我們預期將增加的間歇性。網格和價格變動方面更顯著的波動。

So having fast response products will be critical, I think, going forward, both to meet the reliability of the grid is going to need, but also from our own perspective to create value for our shareholders. Different products under each of the different assets, some of them are more, what I would call, energy arbitrage assets. Some will be able to provide more ancillary services support, but we're very much looking as it relates to Alberta kind of 2 pathways. One would be an overall renewable build out in time as the province continues to make its transition to decarbonization. And secondly, what are those kind of reliability, fast responding -- sorry, capacity products that the province is going to need to ensure the stability of the grid. So those are the 2 pathways that we're looking at from an investment perspective.

因此，我認為，未來擁有快速響應的產品至關重要，既要滿足電網可靠性的需要，又要從我們自己的角度為股東創造價值。不同的產品下每個資產不同，有的比較多，我稱之為能源套利資產。有些將能夠提供更多的輔助服務支持，但我們非常關注與艾伯塔省的兩種途徑相關。其中之一是隨著該省繼續向脫碳轉型，及時建設整體可再生能源。其次，該省需要什麼樣的可靠性、快速響應——抱歉，容量產品來確保電網的穩定性。這就是我們從投資角度考慮的兩條途徑。

All right. Appreciate that. And actually maybe one follow up, you know, you did add some hedges in '24 and '25 that, you know, looks like to be a good pricing, but overall, how are you thinking about the kind of trade off of adding hedges in '24 and '25 versus where the forward curve is as well as just maintaining optionality?

好的。感謝。實際上，也許有一個後續行動，你知道，你確實在24 和25 年添加了一些對沖，你知道，這看起來是一個很好的定價，但總的來說，你如何考慮添加對沖的那種權衡'24 和 '25 與遠期曲線的位置以及僅保持選擇性？

Yes. Look, our hedging team is in there and steel, I think that the kind of pricing that we're getting in, and I'll talk mostly about '24 because '25 is a ways away and the market isn't all that liquid. But we're getting, I would say, some reasonable early liquidity in terms of 2024. I think we're seeing prices that are in the high 90s right now that are there. The team is happy with what they're seeing. They're layering on. And just you have to remember, we also have our C&I business, which is a multiyear business which provides hedging that goes out.

是的。聽著，我們的對沖團隊就在那裡，鋼鐵，我認為我們正在進入的定價，我將主要談論“24”，因為“25”還有很長的路要走，而且市場的流動性並不那麼好。但我想說的是，到 2024 年，我們將獲得一些合理的早期流動性。我認為我們現在看到的價格處於 90 多歲的高位。團隊對他們所看到的感到滿意。他們正在分層。您必須記住，我們還有 C&I 業務，這是一項多年期業務，提供對外對沖服務。

Typically, I think, on average, around 3 years, I would say, Todd, going forward. So we continue to do what we've always done, and that is look at our internal modeling, where we think the fundamental price is going to be, how do we derisk elements of the fleet at the same time, leaving enough open length in the fleet to be able to capture kind of the volatility that we expect will increase. I think as time goes by, it will become less about what you made in the 60% of the hours in the marketplace, but much more about how you did in that 25%, 30% of stronger hours in the market, and we're really focused on that part of the market and shifting the capabilities of our fleet to be responsive there.

通常情況下，我認為，托德，未來平均大約需要 3 年。因此，我們繼續做我們一直在做的事情，那就是看看我們的內部模型，我們認為基本價格將是，我們如何同時消除機隊元素的風險，在其中留下足夠的開放長度機隊能夠捕獲我們預計會增加的波動性。我認為，隨著時間的推移，你在市場上60% 的時間裡賺了什麼，會變得越來越重要，而更多地是在市場上25%、30% 的強勢時間裡你的表現如何，我們'我們真正專注於這部分市場，並改變我們機隊的能力，以便在那裡做出響應。

Your next question comes from Andrew Kuske with Credit Suisse.

您的下一個問題來自瑞士信貸銀行的安德魯·庫斯克。

I guess the first question is for John and it ties into some of your last comments there. When we look at the Alberta power market, we're having higher highs and lower lows. -- a very bifurcated market with maybe longer-term prices, sort an average down a bit. Some of that is reflected in your hedging program where '24 for '25, kind of flat on price, but you've got your gas hedges at a greater dollar value. Carbon prices obviously go up each year. All of that imply kind of lower margins. So I guess when you think about all that, is that kind of baseload hedging program to give business stability and certainly on a high degree of the cash flows and then you're trying to capture around it for that sort of 25% of the market where there's maybe greater volatility?

我想第一個問題是問約翰的，它與你最後的一些評論有關。當我們觀察艾伯塔省電力市場時，我們會看到更高的高點和更低的低點。 ——一個非常分裂的市場，可能具有長期價格，將平均值稍微下調。其中一些反映在你的對沖計劃中，其中'24對'25，價格持平，但你的天然氣對沖以更高的美元價值進行。碳價格明顯逐年上漲。所有這些都意味著利潤率較低。所以我想，當你考慮到這一切時，是一種基荷對沖計劃，可以提供業務穩定性，當然還可以提供高度的現金流，然後你試圖圍繞它佔領 25% 的市場份額哪裡可能存在更大的波動性？

I think -- Andrew, by the way, you've captured it sort of exactly right. That is the mindset. And the -- what's interesting is, in the past, when we've talked about average hours, they were really meaningful, at least from my own perspective, because there was -- the standard deviation around that was a little bit tighter, if you see what I'm saying, whereas now the path to the average is, what's really going to matter. I think if you go to '24, '25, '26, we've had these kind of discussions. I know with you in the past and others. So I think you've got it exactly right. It's how do you, kind of derisk the base and create that senses of predictability and that is both a revenue item at a cost item with the gas that we're procuring to kind of lock in margins as we go forward and then making sure that you've got fast responding length to be able to take advantage of the volatility when it comes and candidly, to create reliability for the grid here in the province of Alberta.

我認為——安德魯，順便說一句，你的捕捉完全正確。這就是心態。有趣的是，在過去，當我們談論平均工作時間時，它們確實很有意義，至少從我自己的角度來看是這樣，因為周圍的標準偏差有點嚴格，如果你明白我在說什麼，而現在通往平均水平的道路是，什麼才是真正重要的。我想如果你去 '24、'25、'26，我們已經進行過此類討論。我過去和其他人都知道。所以我認為你說得完全正確。問題在於你如何降低基礎風險並創造可預測性，這既是收入項目又是成本項目，我們採購的天然氣是為了在我們前進的過程中鎖定利潤，然後確保您擁有快速響應時間，能夠坦率地利用波動性，為艾伯塔省的電網創造可靠性。

And then maybe just on Pinnacle 1 and 2. And if I could maybe geek out a little bit on some of the conditions of those units -- it's been a while since I've looked at them, but my recollection is sort of, like 2 to 3 minutes to full load on a ramp rate, 10 minutes for efficiency and about 8,000 heat rate. Is that all about broadly, right?

然後也許就在 Pinnacle 1 和 2 上。如果我能稍微了解一下這些單位的一些條件的話——我已經有一段時間沒有看過它們了，但我的記憶有點像以斜坡速率2 至3 分鐘即可滿載，10 分鐘即可提高效率，熱率約為8,000。這就是廣義上的全部吧？

Yes. I think in terms of the ramp rates that you have, you've got it pretty much bang on the mark. I think their heat rate is probably a little bit higher. But at least from our own perspective, they'll be running at times when the heat rate isn't going to matter all that much from a pricing perspective, if you see what I mean, Andrew. What really matters is the speed with which they're able to respond, and that's our focus.

是的。我認為就你所擁有的斜坡率而言，你已經非常準確了。我認為他們的熱度可能更高一些。但至少從我們自己的角度來看，當熱耗率從定價角度來看並不那麼重要時，它們有時會運行，如果你明白我的意思，安德魯。真正重要的是他們的響應速度，這也是我們關注的焦點。

The other thing I would say is they were an opportunistic purchase that we made probably 2 years ago now. They became available on the market and in anticipation of the evolution of the market, we pick them up for pennies on the dollar, let's put it that way. So we're shipping them up here now from the Pac Northwest and look forward to advancing them...

我要說的另一件事是，它們是我們大約兩年前進行的一次機會主義購買。它們在市場上上市，並且考慮到市場的發展，我們以極低的價格購買它們，這麼說吧。因此，我們現在將它們從太平洋西北地區運送到這裡，並期待著推進它們......

So the pennies on the dollar, that sounds like very high ROIs.

因此，一分錢一分貨，這聽起來投資回報率非常高。

That's the goal.

這就是目標。

That's a good goal to have.

這是一個很好的目標。

Your next question comes from Naji Baydoun with iA Capital Markets.

您的下一個問題來自 iA Capital Markets 的 Naji Baydoun。

I just wanted to go back a bit to the topic of growth and CapEx pressures, just seeing a bit of sort of higher dollar investments on the wind side. I guess with things like WaterCharger and Pinnacle and maybe just a function of those specific assets in not specific markets, but are you seeing sort of better risk-adjusted returns on the solar storage side maybe versus wind? And if that's the case, what are some of the ways that maybe you can accelerate development on that side of the house thing is how most of the pipeline today is made up of wind projects?

我只是想回到增長和資本支出壓力的話題，只是看到風電方面的美元投資有所增加。我想像 WaterCharger 和 Pinnacle 這樣的東西，也許只是這些特定資產在非特定市場的函數，但你是否看到太陽能存儲方面的風險調整回報比風能更好？如果是這樣的話，有哪些方法可以加速房屋那一側的開發？今天的大部分管道都是由風能項目組成的？

Yes, Naji, I would say if you were to kind of draw a spectrum of kind of returns, I would say that we would see probably the lower level of returns more in contracted solar, I would say, higher returns than contracted wind. And look, we have a particular expertise in wind. And for us, that's not a core part of our business. And then it gets higher in the spectrum as you begin moving towards some of the peaking gas capacity that we're looking at and then some of the battery storage that we would be looking.

是的，納吉，我想說，如果你要繪製一個回報率譜，我會說，我們可能會在合同太陽能中看到較低水平的回報，我會說，比合同風能更高的回報。看，我們在風能方面擁有特殊的專業知識。對於我們來說，這不是我們業務的核心部分。然後，當您開始轉向我們正在尋找的一些峰值氣體容量，然後是我們將尋找的一些電池存儲時，它的頻譜會變得更高。

And I would say that even when we look at like Tent Mountain and some of the pump storage that we have, the kind of returns we would expect for those projects would be significantly higher. We do look at it from a portfolio perspective. There is a finite amount of storage and kind of, peaking gas that we would put in because what's critical, I think for those, kind of assets is to have those really strong optimization capabilities that you need to be able to extract value from them. We definitely have that in Alberta. So that is a focus for us. It's not something that is pervasive in terms of all parts of North America.

我想說，即使我們看看帳篷山和我們擁有的一些抽水蓄能設施，我們對這些項目的預期回報也會明顯更高。我們確實從投資組合的角度來看待它。我們投入的存儲量和峰值氣體是有限的，因為我認為對於這些資產來說，最重要的是擁有那些真正強大的優化能力，你需要能夠從它們中提取價值。我們在艾伯塔省肯定有這樣的東西。所以這是我們的重點。這並不是北美所有地區都普遍存在的現象。

So we continue to focus on, I would say, our investments still oriented towards green. You'll see the company continuing to execute on renewables as we go forward. We'll be opportunistic. I think on natural gas investments that we think we can add value to as a company. And we think that the -- we can get acceptable risk-adjusted returns for all of those types of projects as part of the portfolio that we're building out.

因此，我想說，我們繼續關注我們的投資仍然以綠色為導向。隨著我們的前進，您將看到該公司繼續致力於可再生能源。我們會投機取巧。我認為在天然氣投資方面，我們認為我們可以為公司增加價值。我們認為，作為我們正在構建的投資組合的一部分，我們可以為所有這些類型的項目獲得可接受的風險調整回報。

I also wanted to get your thoughts on the sort of emissions credit, be it inventory or annual generation. Does that change at all with the RNW buyout either in terms of the amount or strategy? Just how are you thinking about the sort of emissions credits post RMW?

我還想了解您對排放信用的看法，無論是庫存還是年度發電量。 RNW 收購後，這種情況在金額或策略上是否會發生改變？您如何看待 RMW 後的排放信用額度？

Great. Yes, we can talk about that.

偉大的。是的，我們可以談談這個。

Yes, not real big change, Naji. Renewables was typically selling the credits that have produced on an annual basis. And so TransAlta Renewables wasn't actually even carrying an inventory balance. That balance was all developed and held and strategized at the TransAlta Corp. level from both the hydro and the wind assets as well as purchased credits.

是的，這並不是真正的大改變，納吉。可再生能源通常出售每年產生的信用額度。因此，TransAlta Renewables 實際上甚至沒有庫存餘額。這種平衡全部是在 TransAlta 公司層面通過水電和風電資產以及購買的信貸來開發、持有和製定的。

So I mean, you'll notice we are carrying a fairly large balance in there. We have a lot of internal discussions about, how and when to utilize those credits. You'll see in Q2, we chose not to retire any credits and simply pay the $50 obligation from last year's production, and we'll continue to look to how to optimize that inventory level.

所以我的意思是，你會注意到我們那裡有相當大的餘額。我們對如何以及何時使用這些積分進行了很多內部討論。您將在第二季度看到，我們選擇不取消任何積分，只需支付去年生產的 50 美元義務，我們將繼續研究如何優化庫存水平。

Okay. So no changes to treasury then. Maybe just one last question for the hydro, again, on track for a very strong year. I think in the past, in a more normalized power price environment, I think you were talking sort of a $200 million-ish run rate EBITDA number for the hydro fleet. Is that still the right number, given what we're seeing in the market now, how the dynamics are playing out or do you think that, that number could be materially higher?

好的。所以財政部沒有任何變化。也許這只是水電的最後一個問題，再次，今年將迎來非常強勁的一年。我認為在過去，在更加標準化的電價環境中，我認為您所說的水電艦隊的運行率 EBITDA 約為 2 億美元。考慮到我們現在在市場上看到的情況、動態的發展情況，這個數字仍然是正確的嗎？或者您認為這個數字可能會更高？

Well, we've -- so I think you're right, your memory is right, Naji. I think when we were first thinking about the post-PPA period and we were thinking of our hydro performance. I think it was actually around $240 million that we were thinking the hydro run rate was going to be, and that was a little bit of a guess. We've seen it, I think, in '21, it was around $300 million and '22, it was just a little bit over 5%. And look, we're tracking to another, let's call it, 500 here on the hydro fleet.

好吧，我們——所以我認為你是對的，你的記憶是對的，納吉。我認為，當我們第一次考慮購電協議後時期時，我們正在考慮我們的水力性能。我認為我們認為水電運行率實際上約為 2.4 億美元，這只是一個猜測。我想，我們已經看到了，在 21 年，這一數字約為 3 億美元，而在 22 年，這一數字僅略高於 5%。看，我們正在追踪另一個，我們稱之為水力車隊的 500 輛。

But we've had really elevated pricing, I would say, in the province of Alberta over the course of at least the last 2 years, if you were to sort of ask me what I think kind of the normal run rate is. I mean, we'll see how the markets develop in '24 and '25. We would expect sort of average pricing to come down a little bit, but we would also expect volatility to be pretty meaningful. So the ability, I think, of the hydro fleet to capture those economic rents, I think, will remain high. Will they be $500 million. That's a big number. But the low 200s feels low-ish, I think, from my perspective as we go forward.

但我想說的是，至少在過去兩年裡，阿爾伯塔省的定價確實很高，如果你問我我認為正常運行率是多少的話。我的意思是，我們將看看 24 年和 25 年市場如何發展。我們預計平均價格會略有下降，但我們也預計波動性相當大。因此，我認為，水電艦隊獲取這些經濟租金的能力將仍然很高。他們會是5億美元嗎？這是一個很大的數字。但我認為，從我們前進的角度來看，200 多歲的低點感覺很低。

Yes. I think when we put those numbers out there in the 200s, it was really predicated on sort of the last 10 years or 20 years of the average probably in that $60 to $70 price range. I think we see a step change up from there. Carbon impact on power prices in Alberta will have a real impact somewhat through the balance of the decade, but then even into the 2030s will be very dramatic on the long-term power price. So it will go up and down. But I think the trend is definitely for much stronger prices over the next 10 years than we saw in say, the 2010s.

是的。我認為，當我們在 200 年代公佈這些數字時，它實際上是根據過去 10 年或 20 年的平均價格（可能在 60 至 70 美元的價格範圍內）得出的。我認為我們看到了從那裡開始的一步變化。碳排放對艾伯塔省電價的影響將在這十年的剩餘時間內產生一定程度的實際影響，但即使到 2030 年代，對長期電價的影響也將非常巨大。所以它會上升和下降。但我認為未來 10 年的趨勢肯定是價格比我們在 2010 年代看到的要強得多。

And Naji, I think as the grid change has been evolved with more renewables coming in, I think the value of hydro and the kind of reliability and ancillary services support that it provides in the marketplace will actually -- my view is it should increase over time. So I think we're really well positioned with the fleet.

納吉，我認為隨著更多可再生能源的出現，電網發生了變化，我認為水電的價值及其在市場上提供的可靠性和輔助服務支持實際上會——我的觀點是，它應該增加時間。所以我認為我們的機隊定位非常好。

Your next question comes from Patrick Kenny with National Bank Financial.

您的下一個問題來自國家銀行金融公司的帕特里克·肯尼。

John, I know you've had a whole day to think about it. But assuming there is a slowdown in renewables in Alberta beyond the 6-month period here, how might this change or how much -- how would you think about the commercial tension surrounding the next phase of corporate PPAs in Alberta? And do you think there might be an opportunity over the 6-month period to strike while the iron is hot related to some of your uncontracted renewable capacity in the province.

約翰，我知道你已經考慮了一整天了。但假設艾伯塔省可再生能源增長放緩超過6 個月，這種變化可能會發生什麼變化或變化程度有多大——您如何看待圍繞艾伯塔省下一階段企業購電協議的商業緊張局勢？您是否認為在 6 個月的時間內可能有機會在熱鐵時罷工，這與您在該省的一些未簽約的可再生能源產能有關。

Look, -- you're right. It's been 24 hours, I think, all look to the hour since the announcement has come up. And look, it's a decision that we know the province of Alberta wouldn't have taken like. I think they see some of the pressure points in the province and they're hearing some of the feedback they're getting from folks in parts of the province, and they want to make sure that we do this in a thoughtful way. So we completely understand that. I do think, to your point, that those projects that are through the queue, let's put it that way, like our Tempest project I think, are in a particularly good position now to be able to get PPAs and move on from a contracting perspective given their, I would say, comparative scarcity.

聽著，——你是對的。我想，自從公告發布以來，已經過去 24 小時了，所有人都在關注時間。看，我們知道阿爾伯塔省不會採取這樣的決定。我認為他們看到了該省的一些壓力點，也聽到了該省部分地區人們的一些反饋，他們希望確保我們以深思熟慮的方式做到這一點。所以我們完全理解這一點。我確實認為，就你的觀點而言，那些正在排隊的項目，讓我們這樣說吧，就像我認為的 Tempest 項目一樣，現在處於特別有利的位置，能夠獲得購電協議並從合同角度繼續前進我想說的是，考慮到它們相對稀缺。

I also am hopeful that it means that we can do more like we did with Lafarge on some of the other renewables that we have where we can get longer contracted contracts for some of our merchant renewables fleet, not so much from hydro, but certainly from the wind that we have in Alberta to be able to meet sort of the ESG and environmental goals that third parties have. As you know, Alberta is really the only truly deregulated market in the country. So the good thing about it is that there's people that are trying to meet their needs or coming to Alberta to kind of get the supply that they need to meet them.

我也希望這意味著我們可以像拉法基在我們擁有的其他一些可再生能源方面做更多的事情，我們可以為我們的一些商業可再生能源船隊獲得更長的合同合同，而不是來自水電，但肯定來自我們在艾伯塔省擁有的風能夠滿足第三方的 ESG 和環境目標。如您所知，艾伯塔省確實是該國唯一真正放鬆管制的市場。因此，好處是有人正在努力滿足他們的需求，或者來到艾伯塔省以獲得滿足他們所需的供應。

The challenge is, and I think this is what is reflecting the provinces position is that, that incremental build-out isn't necessarily built on fundamental supply and demand balances within the province. And so it's a balancing act in terms of going forward.

挑戰在於，我認為這反映了該省的立場，即增量建設不一定建立在該省內基本供需平衡的基礎上。因此，就未來而言，這是一種平衡行為。

And then I guess it's been less than a month since you announced the roll-up transaction. But just given the buckets performed well, I guess, validating your strategy of simplifying the story. I know the near-term priority is closing RNW here. But are there any other corporate structure optimization opportunities that you might be able to point to that might serve to keep the valuation momentum going beyond cleaning up RNW?

然後我想距離你宣布匯總交易還不到一個月。但我想，鑑於桶表現良好，驗證了您簡化故事的策略。我知道近期的首要任務是關閉 RNW。但是，除了清理 RNW 之外，還有其他公司結構優化機會可以幫助保持估值勢頭嗎？

Yes. I mean, look, we're focused on getting the RNW transaction done in that late September, actually, early October time frame. It's a critical thing that we need to do. We're pleased that it's been well received in the marketplace. We're focused on our upcoming Investor Day, where we're going to talk about kind of our pathways going out for the balance of the decade. Our M&A team, we have a small team, but they're a very capable team.

是的。我的意思是，我們的重點是在 9 月底（實際上是 10 月初）完成 RNW 交易。這是我們需要做的一件至關重要的事情。我們很高興它在市場上受到好評。我們的重點是即將到來的投資者日，我們將在會上討論我們在這十年餘下時間裡的發展路徑。我們的併購團隊，我們有一個小團隊，但他們是一個非常有能力的團隊。

They are continually looking at the funnel. It's a very wide funnel of opportunities that arise and they see stuff that ranges from renewables in each of our 3 jurisdictions to alternative fuels, which is kind of new to even occasionally some natural gas opportunities that might exist. So we're still active from that perspective, very mindful, Patrick on just the cost of things. We still find assets in the M&A market to be a bit expensive, I would say. That doesn't mean that there aren't opportunities there. I think there are. But we're going to be super disciplined and make sure that if we proceed with something, whatever we pay makes sense for our shareholders.

他們不斷地關注漏斗。這是一個非常廣泛的機會漏斗，他們看到的東西範圍從我們三個司法管轄區的可再生能源到替代燃料，這對於偶爾可能存在的一些天然氣機會來說都是新的。因此，從這個角度來看，我們仍然很活躍，非常注意帕特里克，只是考慮到成本。我想說，我們仍然發現併購市場的資產有點貴。這並不意味著那裡沒有機會。我認為有。但我們將非常自律，並確保如果我們繼續做某件事，無論我們付出什麼代價對我們的股東來說都是有意義的。

Your next question comes from Chris Varcoe with Calgary Herald.

您的下一個問題來自《卡爾加里先驅報》的克里斯·瓦爾科。

John, with all of the renewable projects in Alberta that have been proposed over the last couple of years, what impact do you think it's having on the Alberta market? And you talked about reliability concerns of some of the other issues. And I guess just taking a big picture, what are in the broader impact that you're seeing?

約翰，過去幾年艾伯塔省提出了所有可再生能源項目，您認為它對艾伯塔省市場產生了什麼影響？您還談到了其他一些問題的可靠性問題。我想從大局來看，您所看到的更廣泛的影響是什麼？

Chris, in terms of the renewable buildout coming into the province, I mean, I think -- so first of all, I would say, we have a lot to be proud of here in the province in terms, how much we decarbonize the grid. And I think that journey continues. I think if you go back, oh gosh, like probably even 5 years ago, certainly 10 years ago, our intent per megawatt generated in the province were probably more than double what they are today.

克里斯，就進入該省的可再生能源建設而言，我的意思是，我認為，首先，我想說，我們在該省有很多值得自豪的地方，我們對電網的脫碳程度。我認為這個旅程仍在繼續。我想，如果你回到過去，天哪，甚至可能是 5 年前，當然是 10 年前，我們在該省每兆瓦發電的意圖可能是今天的兩倍多。

So a tremendous amount has been accomplished and a lot of that was on the back of kind of the ship from coal to natural gas. We have seen significant renewables build-out in the province. That isn't surprising to us given kind of the state of the marketplace here in Alberta. And as a deregulated market, particularly given corporate ESG requirements, I think there was a rush that I think continues to be demand for renewables in the marketplace.

因此，我們已經取得了巨大的成就，其中很多都是在從煤炭到天然氣的運輸船的支持下完成的。我們已經看到該省可再生能源的大規模建設。考慮到艾伯塔省的市場狀況，這對我們來說並不奇怪。作為一個放鬆管制的市場，特別是考慮到企業 ESG 要求，我認為市場上對可再生能源的需求仍然旺盛。

In terms of impact, look, we've been talking for quite a while to here in Alberta, frankly, everywhere because it's similar challenges we're seeing everywhere that we operate about the importance of kind of aligning the importance of having clean generation with affordability and reliability. And what we're seeing with the renewables is more, I would say, a few things. So when it's a windy day or a super study day, you've got a lot of renewable generation that is actually in the marketplace.

就影響而言，坦率地說，我們在阿爾伯塔省討論了很長一段時間，在任何地方，因為我們在各地都看到了類似的挑戰，我們在經營過程中，將清潔發電的重要性與負擔能力和可靠性。我想說，我們在可再生能源方面看到的更多是一些事情。因此，當大風天或超級學習日時，市場上實際上有大量可再生能源發電。

And then if all of a sudden, the wind dies down or all of a sudden, we're getting to dusk and that we're getting into the evening, the solar just goes away. And it's not like at 50 megawatts, it's large amounts of generation that are online offline, if you see what I'm saying. So that increases the kind of volatility that you're seeing in the marketplace. And really, from an Alberta perspective, that's up to our gas and I'm saying gas because a little bit of coal, we have left is going to be converted to gas to backstop that and make sure that, that is there and in a way that is reliable and affordable for Alberta.

然後，如果風突然停了，或者突然我們到了黃昏，進入晚上，太陽就消失了。這與 50 兆瓦不同，它是大量在線離線發電，如果你明白我的意思的話。因此，這會增加您在市場上看到的波動性。事實上，從艾伯塔省的角度來看，這取決於我們的天然氣，我說天然氣是因為我們剩下的一點煤炭將被轉化為天然氣，以支持這一點，並確保它在那裡並且在一個對於艾伯塔省來說，這是可靠且負擔得起的方式。

I think the other element with the renewable build-out is I think it does create pressure on transmission. We have more dispersed generation coming across the province and kind of building out that transmission that you need to be able to take the power where it's being generated and move it to the populated areas or the industrial areas of the province is an incremental cost burden that we need to be mindful of.

我認為可再生能源建設的另一個因素是它確實對輸電造成了壓力。我們在全省範圍內有更分散的發電，並且建立了一種傳輸，您需要能夠將電力轉移到該省的人口稠密地區或工業區，這是一種增量成本負擔，我們需要留意。

And finally, just from a regulatory, permitting, supply chain, making sure that stakeholders in parts of the province that have seen quite a bit of development are being hurt is another third factor that I think needs to be addressed. So there's a lot of change. It's come relatively quickly. And we're seeing some of the impacts of that, and I think the province is trying to just make sure that we have thoughtful pathways going forward and that the pace, I think, is an appropriate pace to maintain that three-legged stool of clean, reliable and affordable for our problems.

最後，僅從監管、許可、供應鏈來看，確保該省部分地區經歷了相當大的發展的利益相關者受到傷害是我認為需要解決的另一個第三個因素。所以有很多變化。來得比較快。我們正在看到其中的一些影響，我認為該省正在努力確保我們有深思熟慮的前進道路，並且我認為，步伐是維持三足凳的適當步伐清潔、可靠且價格合理，可解決我們的問題。

Just a follow-up, sort of a 2-part question here. Maybe I'll start with the first one on that is you mentioned the stakeholders in rural Alberta being impacted. What are you hearing from rural landowners when you're proposing renewable projects? And how are you addressing their concerns?

只是一個後續問題，這裡有一個由兩部分組成的問題。也許我會從第一個開始，您提到艾伯塔省農村地區的利益相關者受到了影響。當您提出可再生能源項目時，您從農村土地所有者那裡聽到了什麼？您如何解決他們的擔憂？

Yes. I think from a stakeholders' perspective, I think it's very, very diverse. I don't think there is -- at least our experience would be that there isn't a single voice or a singular view on what we're seeing when we're out there getting things developed. I think there is a significant group of individuals that are welcoming of the development that's taking place in the sense of creating revenue streams for them and creating economic opportunities for people in those jurisdictions.

是的。我認為從利益相關者的角度來看，我認為這是非常非常多樣化的。我認為不存在——至少我們的經驗是，當我們在外面開發東西時，對於我們所看到的事情沒有單一的聲音或單一的觀點。我認為有相當一部分人對正在發生的發展表示歡迎，因為這為他們創造了收入來源，並為這些司法管轄區的人們創造了經濟機會。

I think of our operations in Southern Alberta and now even Central Alberta, for sure, there's jobs that are being created and opportunity for some of the landowners to create revenue. I think folks that have concerns, they are legitimate concerns, and we listen to them and it has everything to do with impact to birds and bird migration, [baths] to sidelines candidly in terms of being able to see. We live in a beautiful part of the world. So being able to have that view that you've always had in an appropriate way, I think, is an appropriate view and people express it. And with our responsibility to hear that out, it does impact how we cite things. It impacts where we cite them.

我認為我們在艾伯塔省南部以及現在甚至艾伯塔省中部的業務肯定會創造就業機會，並為一些土地所有者創造收入的機會。我認為那些有擔憂的人，他們是合理的擔憂，我們傾聽他們的意見，這與對鳥類和鳥類遷徙的影響密切相關，[洗澡]坦率地站在場邊，以便能夠看到。我們生活在世界一個美麗的地方。因此，我認為，能夠以適當的方式持有你一直持有的觀點，就是一種適當的觀點，人們會表達它。由於我們有責任聽清這一點，它確實會影響我們引用事物的方式。它影響我們引用它們的位置。

And I can tell you, we take the reclamation obligations that we have when it's all done very, very seriously. And we've actually reclaimed the first wind farm that was built in Alberta. So we have a sense of what that's about and returning the land to the state that it was in. We also have, as you know, years and years candidly decades of experience with mine reclamation. So it is critically important that, that work is done and it's done from people that are determined to do it in an appropriate way.

我可以告訴你，我們非常非常認真地對待這一切完成後的回收義務。我們實際上已經收回了在艾伯塔省建造的第一個風電場。因此，我們知道這是什麼意思，並將土地恢復到原來的狀態。正如您所知，我們還擁有數十年的礦山復墾經驗。因此，至關重要的是，這項工作已經完成，而且是由那些決心以適當的方式完成的人完成的。

So hopefully, that gives you a bit of a flavor. There isn't a singular point. It's everything from a spectrum of opportunity to concern about what happens at the end of the life of a wind farm and everything in between.

希望這能給你帶來一點味道。沒有一個奇點。它涵蓋了從一系列機會到關注風電場壽命結束時會發生什麼以及介於兩者之間的一切。

And just to ask you, what signal do you think the pause is sending to the industry? Will it impact your investment decisions? Or do you think the industry's investment decisions, such as perhaps looking at other jurisdictions because of the pause?

我只想問您，您認為暫停向行業發出了什麼信號？會影響您的投資決策嗎？或者您認為該行業的投資決策，例如可能會因為暫停而考慮其他司法管轄區？

Look, I think a lot of the companies that I think are in kind of a vanguard of building out new generation in Alberta, also have products in other jurisdictions. So they look at deploying capital in multiple places in the yard. I look at our company, we're in Canada, the U.S. and Australia. And the development environment and opportunity sets are relatively similar in all those jurisdictions. So to a certain extent, you're agnostic about where you go.

聽著，我認為許多我認為是艾伯塔省新一代建設先鋒的公司也在其他司法管轄區擁有產品。因此，他們考慮在院子裡的多個地方部署資本。我看看我們的公司，我們在加拿大、美國和澳大利亞。所有這些司法管轄區的發展環境和機會集都相對相似。所以在某種程度上，你對自己要去哪裡是不可知的。

I think with respect to this pause that we're seeing to have the consultation done, it's 6 months. We take a long-term view in terms of our projects. There's still a lot of projects that are effectively grandfathered and are being built out, including ours, and we're committed to seeing those through. I think we'll end up with -- I think, a thoughtful response from the Alberta Utilities Commission and the government when the consultation process is done.

我認為就這次暫停而言，我們希望完成磋商，為期 6 個月。我們對項目抱有長遠的眼光。仍然有很多項目實際上已經得到延續並正在建設中，包括我們的項目，我們致力於完成這些項目。我認為，當協商過程完成後，我們最終會得到艾伯塔省公用事業委員會和政府的深思熟慮的回應。

And I think, you know, we'll end up being better developers and builders of these assets that they go forward. I mean I can really speak for our company and on other companies, but it's -- we're staying the course that the project that we would have been putting in the development or in the permitting queue, sort of imminently, we're continuing to work on and develop with a view to seeing them being realized eventually in the longer term.

我認為，你知道，我們最終將成為他們前進的這些資產的更好的開發商和建設者。我的意思是，我真的可以代表我們公司和其他公司發言，但我們將繼續堅持我們本應放入開發或許可隊列中的項目，迫在眉睫，我們正在繼續努力和發展，以期最終在較長時期內實現這些目標。

(Operator Instructions) There are no further questions at this time. Please proceed.

（操作員說明） 目前沒有其他問題。請繼續。

Thank you, everyone. That concludes our call for today. If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to reach out to the TransAlta Investor Relations team later today or further on to next week. Thank you so much.

謝謝大家。我們今天的呼籲到此結束。如果您還有任何其他問題，請隨時在今天晚些時候或下週聯繫 TransAlta 投資者關係團隊。太感謝了。

Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes the conference call for today. We thank you for participating and ask that you please disconnect your lines.

女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束。我們感謝您的參與，並請您斷開線路。