Grupo Supervielle SA (SUPV) 2023 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the Grupo Supervielle third quarter 2023 earnings call. This is Ana Bartesaghi, Treasurer and IRO. A slide presentation will accompany today's webinar which is available in the Investors section of Grupo Supervielle's Investor Relations website. Today's conference call is being recorded. (Event Instructions) Speaking here in today's call will be Patricio Supervielle, our Chairman and CEO; and Mariano Biglia, our Chief Financial Officer. Also joining us is Alejandro Stengel, First Vice Chairman of the Board and CEO of Banco Supervielle. All will be available for the Q&A session.

大家早安，歡迎參加 Grupo Supervielle 2023 年第三季財報電話會議。我是 Ana Bartesaghi，財務主管兼 IRO。今天的網路研討會將附有幻燈片演示，可在 Grupo Supervielle 投資者關係網站的投資者部分查看。今天的電話會議正在錄音。 （活動說明）我們的董事長兼執行長 Patricio Supervielle 將在今天的電話會議上發言。以及我們的財務長馬裡亞諾·比格利亞 (Mariano Biglia)。加入我們的還有 Banco Supervielle 董事會第一副主席兼執行長 Alejandro Stengel。所有內容將在問答環節提供。

As a reminder, today's call will contain forward-looking statements based on management's current expectations and beliefs and subject to similar risks and uncertainties. And for you to a forward-looking statement section of our earnings release and recent filings with the SEC. We assume no obligation to update or revise any forward-looking statements to reflect new or changed events or circumstances.

提醒一下，今天的電話會議將包含基於管理層當前預期和信念的前瞻性陳述，並受到類似風險和不確定性的影響。請參閱我們的收益發布和最近向 SEC 提交的文件中的前瞻性聲明部分。我們不承擔更新或修改任何前瞻性陳述以反映新的或變更的事件或情況的義務。

Patricio Supervielle, our Chairman and CEO, will start the call discussing the key highlights for the quarter, our progress achieved to date on our strategic priorities for the year, as well as an update on macro views. Afterwards, Mariano Biglia, our CFO, will take a little look at our performance and near-term perspectives. This will be followed by a Q&A session.

我們的董事長兼執行長 Patricio Supervielle 將在電話會議上討論本季度的主要亮點、迄今為止我們在今年戰略重點方面取得的進展以及宏觀觀點的最新情況。隨後，我們的財務長 Mariano Biglia 將稍微審視我們的業績和近期前景。隨後將進行問答環節。

Patricio, please go ahead.

帕特里西奧，請繼續。

Thank you, Ana. Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us today. I will begin my presentation with slide 3. The momentum gained in the first half of the year carried on through the third quarter, allowing us to deliver our ROE of 18% in real terms. This good performance was supported by an effective asset and liability management, which contributed to a high name, significant growth in fee income across our business, and a prudent approach to lending leading to record gross NPLs.

謝謝你，安娜。大家，早安。感謝您今天加入我們。我將從幻燈片 3 開始我的簡報。上半年取得的勢頭一直持續到第三季度，使我們能夠實現 18% 的實際股本回報率。這一良好業績得到了有效的資產和負債管理的支持，這為我們的業務帶來了良好的聲譽、費用收入的顯著增長，以及導致不良貸款總額創紀錄的審慎貸款方式。

Our efforts to streamline operations over the past years have also yielded improved efficiency contributed to higher profitability. For the first nine months, our ROE increased to 13% from negative low single digits during the same period last year, reflecting the successful execution of our strategic plan amidst an increasingly challenging macro and political environment with very weak loan demand.

過去幾年我們簡化營運的努力也提高了效率，從而提高了獲利能力。前九個月，我們的股本回報率從去年同期的負低個位數上升至 13%，反映出我們在宏觀和政治環境日益嚴峻、貸款需求非常疲軟的情況下成功執行了戰略計劃。

Now let me quickly recap on the progress achieved across our different strategic alternatives. Starting with retail cash. Our enhanced digital capabilities and optimized branch network have allowed us to meet our goal of originating 50% of our personal loans digitally and remain focused on further advancing them. We successfully innovated with a quick investment function in our -- that allows us, customers, to invest in our money market funds 12, 13, 24 for 7 days to safeguard that transaction on funds from inflation. The number of retail clients investing for this platform increased by 10 times year on year, reaching 100,000 in October. In turn, assets under management also grew significantly up six times in nominal terms.

現在讓我快速回顧一下我們不同策略選擇所取得的進展。從零售現金開始。我們增強的數位能力和優化的分行網路使我們能夠實現 50% 的個人貸款以數位方式發放的目標，並繼續專注於進一步推進這些貸款。我們成功地創新了快速投資功能，使我們客戶能夠在 12、13、24 天內投資我們的貨幣市場基金 7 天，以保護資金交易免受通貨膨脹的影響。投資該平台的零售客戶數量較去年同期成長10倍，10月份達到10萬人。反過來，管理資產的名目價值也大幅增加了六倍。

As we continue to prioritize growth in the corporate segment, we've added new digital functions and completed our offering of working capital financing product suite. New corporate clients increased 6% year on year while we gain market share and from trade finance and time deposit balances. Loans increased 4% sequentially, while gains in share of wallet contributed to 120-basis-points increase in the transactions ratio compared to December of last year.

隨著我們繼續優先考慮企業部門的成長，我們添加了新的數位功能並完成了營運資本融資產品套件的提供。新企業客戶年增 6%，同時我們透過貿易融資和定期存款餘額獲得市場份額。貸款環比增長 4%，而錢包份額的增長導致交易比率較去年 12 月增長 120 個基點。

IOL, our online broker, continued to drive fee growth, demonstrating our ability to acquire and retain customers, achieving year-on-year increase across key KPIs. Monthly active users were up four times to 210,000 new accounts by over seven times, transaction by four times, and asset under management by 121% in real terms. Notably, we are achieving these results through a much more efficient and agile franchise, serving more clients more efficiently while improving NPS across all segments.

我們的線上經紀商 IOL 繼續推動費用成長，展示了我們獲取和留住客戶的能力，實現了關鍵 KPI 的同比增長。月活躍用戶數成長四倍，達到 21 萬個新帳戶，成長超過七倍，交易量成長四倍，管理資產實際成長 121%。值得注意的是，我們透過更有效率和靈活的特許經營來實現這些成果，更有效地為更多客戶提供服務，同時提高所有細分市場的 NPS。

Now please turn to slide 4. Foreign exchange reserves continued to decline further impacted by the negative commercial balance. The 23% devaluation last August contributed to a sharp increase in inflation in August and September against the backdrop of increased reference rates. The reference rate for LELIQs increased from 118% in August to 125% in September and 133% in October, in the context of accelerated inflation. Against this backdrop, credit to the private sector as a percentage of GDP dropped can all-time low of nearly 7%, while deposits accounted for 17% of GDP.

現在請看投影片4。受商業負差的影響，外匯存底持續下降。去年8月貶值23%，在參考利率上調的背景下，導致8月和9月通膨急劇上升。在通膨加速的背景下，LELIQ 的參考利率從 8 月的 118% 升至 9 月的 125% 和 10 月的 133%。在此背景下，私部門信貸佔GDP的比例下降至近7%，創下歷史新低，而存款佔GDP的比例為17%。

Lastly, the significant deterioration in the fiscal balance and price distortions and controls leading to the elections are putting additional pressure on inflation with year-end consensus estimates expected at 185% for 2023 and 196% for the next 12 months. In turn, GDP is expected to contract 2% in 2023. The fiscal balance dipped below 2022 levels in September and is deteriorating even further in the fourth quarter following the significant hike in government spending and reductions in income and VAT taxes introduced by the government during the presidential election campaign, with fiscal primary deficit expected to reach 2.6% exceeding the IMF original target of 1.9%.

最後，財政平衡的顯著惡化以及導致選舉的價格扭曲和控制給通貨膨脹帶來了額外的壓力，年底共識預計 2023 年通膨率將達到 185%，未來 12 個月將達到 196%。反過來，GDP 預計將在2023 年收縮2%。9 月財政餘額跌至2022 年水準以下，並且在政府大幅增加支出以及政府在2020 年大幅削減所得稅和增值稅之後，第四季度財政餘額進一步惡化。總統競選期間，財政基本赤字預計將達到2.6%，超過國際貨幣基金組織原定的1.9%目標。

Turning to slide 5, looking ahead. Looking ahead, President-elect Javier Milei, is committed to introducing major reforms to reduce state intervention and address the loans standing structural imbalances in our economy. Overall, you see that there is no room for gradualism and transfer advance swiftly with major structural reforms. One of the first items on the agenda is to address the Central Bank's remunerated liabilities with a market-friendly approach and work towards eliminating the fiscal deficits.

翻到幻燈片 5，展望未來。展望未來，當選總統哈維爾·米萊致力於推行重大改革，以減少國家幹預並解決經濟中結構性失衡的貸款問題。整體來看，重大結構性改革沒有漸進主義和轉移快速推進的空間。議程上的首要項目之一是以市場友好的方式解決央行的有償負債問題，並努力消除財政赤字。

Our plans also include the originating capital flows and moving Argentina into an open market economy with a sustainable economic model. Importantly, he stated that his administration was strictly honor commitment. With plans also in core for the privatization of state and companies and a deregulation agenda. This was a clear and straightforward story, with the expected adjustments in relative prices of business evaluation, we foresee a difficult 6 to 12 month, followed by as a stabilization.

我們的計劃還包括原始資本流動以及將阿根廷帶入具有永續經濟模式的開放市場經濟。重要的是，他表示他的執政是嚴格兌現承諾的。國家和公司私有化以及放鬆管制議程的核心計劃也是如此。這是一個清晰明了的故事，隨著業務評估相對價格的預期調整，我們預計 6 至 12 個月將是艱難的，隨後將趨於穩定。

The market response has been very positive. And some of the insights and questions around Milei has started to be clear away by these declarations. Until revealed, we are prepared to navigate the near-term challenges and have hedged 100% of our capital in this inflation. We look forward to leveraging our agility to rebound strongly when the economy begins to stabilize and growing or voted by a strong 6% steam capital ratio.

市場反應非常積極。這些聲明已經開始澄清有關 Milei 的一些見解和問題。在披露之前，我們已做好應對近期挑戰的準備，並已在此次通膨中對沖 100% 的資本。我們期待在經濟開始穩定和成長或透過強勁的 6% 蒸汽資本比率投票時，利用我們的敏捷性強勁反彈。

With this, let me turn the call to Mariano. Please go ahead.

現在，讓我把電話轉給馬裡亞諾。請繼續。

Thank you, Patricio. And good day, everyone. Please refer to slide 6 for an overview of our performance for the nine-month period ended September 2023. Importantly, throughout the year, we did not lose focus on executing the strategy we have discussed in the past. We are pleased that in line with our timing expectations, our ROE for the nine months swung to a positive when compared with the same period of the prior year. More specifically, net income increased to ARS19 billion with ROE at nearly 13%, improvement from a net loss of ARS7 billion and negative ROE of almost 5% in the same period of last year. It makes us term revenue growth, lower costs and provisions, drove this year-on-year improvement in profitability.

謝謝你，帕特里西奧。大家好。請參閱投影片 6，了解我們截至 2023 年 9 月的九個月期間的業績概述。重要的是，在這一年中，我們並沒有失去對執行過去討論過的策略的關注。我們很高興與我們的時間預期一致，與去年同期相比，我們這九個月的股本回報率轉為正值。更具體地說，淨利潤增至 190 億澳元，淨資產收益率接近 13%，較去年同期的 70 億澳元淨虧損和近 5% 的負淨資產收益率有所改善。它使我們的長期收入成長、成本和撥備降低，推動了獲利能力的同比改善。

The revenue from net financial income increased 16% or over ARS27 billion, mainly reflecting higher spreads and volume for our investment portfolio. This could threaten margin continue into October and November. Net fees were up 9% or over ARS3 billion, mainly on the back of solid performance at IOL and our asset management business. In terms of costs, the rightsizing and operating efficiency initiatives implemented in 2022 resulted in an 8% decline in personnel expenses equivalent to ARS6.5 billion in sales.

淨財務收入成長了 16%，超過 270 億澳元，主要反映了我們投資組合的利差和交易量增加。這可能會威脅到 10 月和 11 月的利潤率。淨費用成長 9% 或超過 30 億澳元，主要得益於 IOL 和我們資產管理業務的穩健表現。在成本方面，2022 年實施的規模調整和營運效率措施導致人員費用下降 8%，相當於銷售額 65 億阿根廷比索。

Moreover, lower costs from streamlining operations, including selective branches closing and lower customer acquisitions and promotions, contributed to a 6% reduction in administrative expenses and D&A, equivalent to savings of ARS3.5 billion. In turn, the planned mix shift away from consumer finance, coupled with growth in corporate loans and tight credit scoring contributed to a 21% decline in loan loss provisions equivalent to ARS3.5 billion.

此外，精簡營運帶來的成本降低，包括關閉選擇性分公司以及減少客戶獲取和促銷活動，使管理費用和 D&A 減少了 6%，相當於節省了 35 億阿根廷比索。反過來，計劃中的組合從消費金融轉向，加上企業貸款的增長和嚴格的信用評分，導致貸款損失撥備下降了 21%，相當於 35 億阿根廷比索。

Other income and losses declined 6% or ARS1.6 billion, reflecting a lower credit card promotions, together with a reduction in turnover taxes paid on the lease and repo despite higher average volumes. All cases with saving and turnover tax can be found in our press release. Lastly, higher tax income led to a higher income tax charge in 2023.

其他收入和損失下降 6%，即 16 億阿根廷比索，反映出信用卡促銷活動減少，儘管平均交易量較高，但租賃和回購支付的流轉稅減少。所有涉及儲蓄稅和流轉稅的案例都可以在我們的新聞稿中找到。最後，更高的稅收收入導致 2023 年所得稅費用更高。

Now looking at our performance for the third quarter, starting with slide 7. Total assets grew below inflation in the quarter in an environment of overall weak retail credit demand and accelerated inflation, which reached 35%. We also reduced our position in our short-term central bank securities portfolio to nearly 40% of total assets at quarter end, down from 43% in the prior quarter. And the share of government securities to 6% this quarter from nearly 8% in the second quarter. Deposits also increased below inflation sequentially, reflecting lower time deposits from retail customers and corporates seasonally higher deposits in the prior quarter, reflecting the impact of the 13th salary and institutional funding as we manage assets and assets and liabilities to maximize mean and profitability. In turn, average assets volumes were up 3% sequentially as the average balance of the investment portfolio rose 12% as we maximized NIM and profitability, while the average deposit balance increased 4%.

現在看看我們第三季的表現，從投影片 7 開始。在零售信貸需求整體疲弱和通膨加速（達到 35%）的環境下，本季總資產成長低於通膨。季度末，我們也將短期央行證券投資組合的部位減少至總資產的近 40%，低於上一季的 43%。而政府證券的份額則從第二季的近8%增至本季的6%。存款也連續成長低於通膨率，反映了零售客戶定期存款的減少和上一季度企業存款的季節性增加，反映了我們管理資產以及資產和負債以最大化均值和盈利能力時第13 個月工資和機構資金的影響。反過來，隨著我們最大限度地提高淨利差和盈利能力，投資組合的平均餘額增長了 12%，平均資產量環比增長了 3%，而平均存款餘額則增長了 4%。

Moving on to slide 8. While total loan growth for the quarter was no inflation, we outperformed the industry trend with a sequential basis, with lows in real terms, declining 3%, drop of 7% for the system. During the first half of the year, our focus was on achieving profitable growth. However, in the third quarter, we shift our strategy to selectively target high-value corporate customers. We focused on those customers, particularly payroll loans, SMEs, and mid-market customers, where we have reciprocity with our transactional products. This approach help us to recover our market share in corporate loans, which increased above inflation. Meanwhile, the proportion of consumer financing or total loans has continued to decrease.

繼續看投影片 8。雖然本季的總貸款成長沒有通膨，但我們環比跑贏了行業趨勢，實際低點，下降了 3%，系統下降了 7%。上半年，我們的重點是獲利成長。然而，在第三季度，我們改變了策略，選擇性地瞄準高價值企業客戶。我們專注於這些客戶，特別是薪資貸款、中小企業和中端市場客戶，我們在這些客戶中與我們的交易產品有互惠關係。這種方法幫助我們恢復了公司貸款的市場份額，而該市場份額的成長速度超過了通貨膨脹。同時，消費金融或貸款總額的比重持續下降。

As shown on slide 9, the total of NPL ratio improved further, reaching a historic low of 1.7% in September, a healthier loan mix and the impact of tightening credit scoring criteria in prior quarters contributed to the improvement in the NPL ratio. Moreover, delinquency continue to improve sequentially. Lastly, the sale of some delinquent over market retail loans and former consumer finance loans contributed to bringing the government spread ratio to nearly 183%, up from 148% in the second quarter.

如投影片 9 所示，不良貸款率整體進一步改善，9 月達到 1.7% 的歷史低位，更健康的貸款結構以及前幾季收緊信用評分標準的影響推動了不良貸款率的改善。此外，拖欠率持續改善。最後，部分拖欠市場零售貸款和前消費金融貸款的出售促使政府利差率從第二季的 148% 上升至近 183%。

Turning to slide 10. Net financial margin increased nearly 17% sequentially to over ARS76 billion in the quarter. Higher investment portfolio volumes and yields more than offset lower loan portfolio NIM and contributed to an overall high NIM of 29% in the quarter. This represented a sequential increase of 260 basis points or 720 basis points year on year. Net service fee income stood out this quarter, increasing 14% sequentially and 30% year on year. As Patricio noted earlier, this increase was supported by a good performance across the business, with particular emphasis at IOL, our asset management business.

轉向幻燈片 10。本季淨財務利潤率環比增長近 17%，超過 760 億阿根廷比索。較高的投資組合數量和收益率足以抵消較低的貸款組合淨利差，並促成本季 29% 的整體高淨利差。這意味著環比增長 260 個基點，比去年同期增長 720 個基點。本季淨服務費營收表現突出，季增 14%，年增 30%。正如 Patricio 之前指出的那樣，這一增長得益於整個業務的良好業績，特別是我們的資產管理業務 IOL。

Now please turn to slide 12. The efficiency ratio for the quarter improved further to just below 52% from close to 63% in the prior quarter and 73% in the year-ago quarter. On a sequential basis, this performance was driven by revenue growth of 17% and reduction in expenses of close to 7%. For the for the nine-month period, expenses declined nearly 7% when revenues increased 17%.

現在請翻到投影片 12。本季的效率比上一季的接近 63% 和去年同期的 73% 進一步提高至略低於 52%。從環比來看，這一業績得益於 17% 的收入成長和近 7% 的費用減少。在這 9 個月期間，支出下降了近 7%，而收入則增加了 17%。

Moving on to capitalization on slide 13. We further to strengthen our capital base, increasing our Tier 1 ratio by 120 basis points sequentially to 16.9% at quarter end. Proved reserves and inflation adjustment of capital mainly drove the increase in the capital ratio and more than offset higher risk-weighted assets and deductions.

繼續投影片 13 上的資本化。我們進一步加強我們的資本基礎，將我們的一級資本充足率連續增加 120 個基點，至季末的 16.9%。資本探明儲備和通貨膨脹調整主要推動了資本比率的增加，並遠遠抵消了較高的風險加權資產和扣除額。

Before opening for Q&A, please turn to slide 14 to review our perspectives for the full year 2023. Considering the recent macro trends discussed by Patricio, you have us thinking of our perspective on the following line items. With respect to asset quality, given the recent performance, we now expect to close the year with an NPL of ratio of between 1.5% to 2%, a slight improvement from our prior expectations of 2.5% to 3%. Given the solid NIM performance of 25% year to date, we anticipate NIM for the year to remain slightly higher than the level reported in the first nine months, up from approximately 24% expected in our prior call.

在開始問答之前，請翻到投影片 14，回顧一下我們對 2023 年全年的看法。考慮到 Patricio 討論的近期宏觀趨勢，您讓我們思考了對以下項目的看法。資產品質方面，考慮到近期表現，我們預期年末不良貸款率將在1.5%至2%之間，較先前2.5%至3%的預期略有改善。鑑於今年迄今 25% 的穩健淨利差表現，我們預計今年的淨利差將略高於前九個月報告的水平，高於我們先前電話會議預期的約 24%。

With respect to fees, we now expect the brokerage and the asset management business to maintain the solid performance of starting the quarter when expectations were on other fees remain unchanged. This means sustained growth in brokerage fees, benefiting from higher volatility, soft insurance fees in real terms, and above bank fees to individuals expected to reprice in line with inflation. In addition, we continue to expect digital transformation and updated investments to grow below inflation, we now expect to see an acceleration due to investment in the fourth 2023.

在費用方面，我們現在預期經紀和資產管理業務將維持本季初的穩健表現，而其他費用的預期保持不變。這意味著經紀費用將持續增長，受益於較高的波動性、實際的軟保險費用以及預計將根據通貨膨脹重新定價的個人的銀行費用。此外，我們繼續預期數位轉型和更新投資的成長將低於通膨，我們現在預計由於 2023 年第四季的投資將出現加速。

In terms of profitability. We now anticipate ROE to be in the range of 10% to 12%, up from levels of close to 12% or so in the first half of the year. But below the amendments ROE, as inflation is expected to be higher in the last month of the year with the FX increases and inflation adjustment bonds reprice with the land of 60 days.

在盈利能力方面。我們現在預計 ROE 將在 10% 至 12% 之間，高於今年上半年接近 12% 左右的水平。但低於修正後的股本回報率，因為隨著外匯上漲和60天期限的通膨調整債券重新定價，今年最後一個月的通膨預計會更高。

Lastly, we expect to close the year with a Tier 1 ratio in the range of 17% to 18%, up from the 14% to 16% anticipated earlier. As a reminder, 100% of per capita remains ledged against inflation. Beyond these changes, note that our 2023 expectation for loans and deposits remain unchanged from our prior quarter views. Looking at 2024 with inflation expected to remain at high level, we expect loans to continue growing below inflation through the first half of next year, showing signs of recovery starting in the second half of the year, if the stabilization plan is successful in helping to control a lower inflation level. In turn, for next year, we expect the Baltics to begin recovering and growing in line with the inflation.

最後，我們預計今年結束時一級資本比率將在 17% 至 18% 之間，高於先前預期的 14% 至 16%。提醒一下，100%的人均仍然對抗通貨膨脹。除了這些變化之外，請注意，我們對 2023 年貸款和存款的預期與上一季的觀點保持不變。展望2024年，通膨預計將維持在高位，如果穩定計畫成功幫助經濟復甦，我們預計明年上半年貸款成長將繼續低於通膨，並在下半年開始出現復甦跡象。控制較低的通膨水準。反過來，我們預計明年波羅的海地區將開始復甦並隨著通貨膨脹而成長。

We expect to discuss our views for 2024 for more detail on our year-end call, as we have more visibility on the economic plan for year end. Now we are ready to open the floor for questions. Ana, please go ahead.

我們預計將在年底電話會議上討論我們對 2024 年的看法，以了解更多細節，因為我們對年底的經濟計畫有了更多的了解。現在我們準備開始提問。安娜，請繼續。

Thank you, Mariano. (Event Instructions) Ernesto Gabilondo, Bank of America.

謝謝你，馬裡亞諾。 （活動說明）Ernesto Gabilondo，美國銀行。

Thank you, Ana. Hi, good morning, Patricio, Mariano, Ana. Thanks for taking my call. My first question will be on the political outlook for Argentina. You have shown a couple of slides on this, but what do you think could be the key execution risks for the new administration? How do you see the possibility to implement structural reforms with a divided Congress as neither the officialism or all the right parties combined will have the majority? And also, I think it will be interesting to hear your view if Milei starts to cut jobs in the current government administration, if you see, if there could be a risk for social unrest?

謝謝你，安娜。嗨，早上好，帕特里西奧、馬裡亞諾、安娜。感謝您接聽我的電話。我的第一個問題是關於阿根廷的政治前景。您已經就此展示了幾張投影片，但您認為新政府的關鍵執行風險可能是什麼？您如何看待在分裂的國會中實施結構性改革的可能性，因為官僚主義或所有正確的政黨都不會佔多數？而且，我認為如果米萊開始在現任政府行政部門中裁員，聽聽您的看法將會很有趣，如果您認為，是否會存在社會動盪的風險？

Then my second question is on your LELIQ exposure. When looking to your balance sheet, it seems that half of the securities are LELIQ's and it is roughly 26% of your total assets. So, I wanted to hear your view on what you are expecting to do with the LELIQs. Yesterday we heard Banco Macro trying to get rid of the LELIQs by year-end. So wanted to hear from you is that it's something that you are also targeting or that will be more gradual?

那麼我的第二個問題是關於您對 LELIQ 的曝光。在查看您的資產負債表時，似乎有一半的證券是 LELIQ 的，大約是您總資產的 26%。所以，我想聽聽您對 LELIQ 的預期用途的看法。昨天我們聽說宏觀銀行試圖在年底前擺脫 LELIQ。所以想聽聽您的意見是，這也​​是您的目標，還是會更漸進？

And for my last question is on your ROE. So for this year, you have been guiding 10% to 12%, as you pointed out it will be lower than the first nine months considering that in December we can have higher FX depreciation and higher inflation, but just thinking on what should we think about next year, we think this ROE could be relatively stable, a little bit higher, lower. Some hint on that would be also very helpful. Thank you.

我的最後一個問題是關於你們的交戰規則。因此，今年，您一直指導10％ 至12％，正如您所指出的，考慮到12 月我們可能會出現更高的外匯貶值和更高的通膨，這將低於前九個月，但只是想一想我們應該怎麼想關於明年，我們認為這個ROE可能會相對穩定，稍微高一點，低一點。對此的一些提示也會非常有幫助。謝謝。

Yes. Thank you, Ernesto. I will start by your first question, which is the execution risk of Milei program. First of all, we can see that Milei has shown to be a pragmatist. And this is interesting because in the way he's handling the organization of the different working teams to implement his reform, I know it's quite fluid, but he's pragmatic. And also in the way he's dealing with potential international relations.

是的。謝謝你，埃內斯托。我先回答你的第一個問題，即米雷計畫的執行風險。首先，我們可以看到米萊展現了一個實用主義者的性格。這很有趣，因為他處理組織不同工作團隊以實施改革的方式，我知道這是相當不穩定的，但他很務實。還有他處理潛在國際關係的方式。

In terms of the reform agenda, I think that the first step will be to get the approval of the national budget. And we have discussed this in our team, and we believe that it will be swift, and this has happened in the past. I mean, with new governments, he has a clear mandate, and we don't see reasons for not approving the national budget. Then, President-elect Milei has said that he wants to give to the Congress a jumbo law, including probably, we don't know yet, but probably it will include an agenda of deregulation and how to tackle the financial deficit. So, probably this will be in the first part of the year. I mean, this is a super law. And probably there will be second generation laws concerning privatizations that will happen in the second half of the year of 2024.

就改革議程而言，我認為第一步將是獲得國家預算的批准。我們已經在我們的團隊中討論過這個問題，我們相信這會很快，而且這種情況過去已經發生過。我的意思是，對於新政府來說，他有明確的授權，我們看不出有理由不批准國家預算。然後，當選總統米萊表示，他希望向國會提交一項龐大的法律，其中可能包括放鬆管制和如何解決財政赤字的議程，我們還不知道。因此，這可能會在今年上半年發生。我的意思是，這是一條超級法則。 2024 年下半年可能會推出第二代有關私有化的法律。

Another thing which is quite important also is that the people that are economic advisors at this stage have told us that they want to implement a fiscal financial equilibrium or fiscal financial balance from Day 1, which implies reducing 5% of GDP. And this eventually they can do without Congress, the need of Congress approval. Of course, there are various ways and it's not easy, but we have discussed that to achieve this 5% of reduction in GDP, they would have to tackle certain reduction of public works, some transfers to provinces, some items in social security, and also deficit in public enterprise is going to be more complicated, probably because it will need privatizations, but we believe that certain subsidies also could be tackled and with the change of relative prices. And also there will be a swing in the revenues from taxes from last year, so that will help improve their fiscal situation.

另一件也相當重要的事情是，現階段的經濟顧問告訴我們，他們希望從第一天起就實現財政金融平衡或財政金融平衡，這意味著GDP減少5%。而這最終他們可以在沒有國會的情況下完成，需要國會的批准。當然，方法是多種多樣的，也不容易，但是我們已經討論過，要實現GDP減少5%，就得解決一定的公共工程削減，一些省級轉移支付，一些社會保障項目，還有一些項目。公共企業的赤字也將變得更加複雜，可能是因為它需要私有化，但我們認為，隨著相對價格的變化，某些補貼也可以解決。去年的稅收收入也會出現波動，這將有助於改善他們的財政狀況。

And concerning the social unrest that you mentioned, yes, it is possible that there will be some social unrest, but we believe with our team that it will be confined to the Grand Buenos Aires and Grand Rosario, and the rest of the country where there was a clear mandate for a change of government we believe that the people will continue working and do their day jobs every day and there will not be any meaningful social unrest.

關於你提到的社會動盪，是的，可能會出現一些社會動盪，但我們的團隊相信，這將僅限於大布宜諾斯艾利斯和大羅薩裡奧，以及該國其他地區。這是更換政府的明確授權，我們相信人民將繼續工作並每天做好日常工作，不會出現任何有意義的社會動盪。

A very important element also is about the Supreme Court. We believe that Milei will propose the fifth candidate which is vacant, and this is going to be important to strengthen the independence of the judiciary. So, that's concerning your first question.

最高法院也是一個非常重要的因素。我們相信米萊將提出第五名空缺的候選人，這對加強司法獨立具有重要意義。這就是你的第一個問題。

Regarding the LELIQs exposure, we had a substantial exposure at the end of the 3Q, and this has been reduced significantly over this quarter, at this moment. So, and not only LELIQs but also Repos. We believe that, having heard what was conveyed by the economic advisors, that they want to go for a market-friendly solution, that there will be no surprises, that there will be no harm to the banks net worth. I think we all went more at ease, but having said that, we have decided to, as I said before, to significantly reduce our exposure and we will see what the measures they want to take in the future.

關於 LELIQ 的風險敞口，我們在第三季末有大量風險敞口，但目前該風險敞口在本季已大幅減少。所以，不只 LELIQ，還有 Repos。我們相信，在聽到經濟顧問所傳達的訊息後，他們希望尋求一個有利於市場的解決方案，不會出現任何意外，也不會對銀行的淨資產造成損害。我認為我們都更放心了，但話雖如此，我們已經決定，正如我之前所說，大幅減少我們的暴露，我們將看看他們將來想採取什麼措施。

But simply let me point out that the reason we had these LELIQs in the past was completely linked to the fact that the government imposed a regulation a floor in the rates of time deposits, the only way to compensate that was investing in LELIQs. But we believe that this will be removed, these punitive regulations will be removed swiftly and there will be also free rates, both for liabilities and assets, in the next year.

但我只想指出，我們過去擁有這些 LELIQ 的原因完全與政府對定期存款利率實行下限監管有關，唯一補償的方法就是投資 LELIQ。但我們相信，這一點將會被取消，這些懲罰性法規將迅速取消，明年負債和資產也將實施自由利率。

Mariano, I don't know if you want to add something on LELIQs

Mariano，我不知道你是否想在 LELIQs 上添加一些內容

I can only add to your comments. Hi, Ernesto, and thank you for your question. I only add that, as Patricio said, we have significantly reduced the exposure to LELIQs during October and November. We only have the LELIQs we use for minimum cash requirements. Remember that part, about 5% of the new cash reserves, we can integrate with LELIQs. So, the opportunity cost to be in cash instead of LELIQs is very high there, but that is only a minor amount. As of today, it's only ARS50 billion, which is significantly lower than what we had on September 30.

我只能補充一下你的評論。你好，埃內斯托，謝謝你的問題。我只是補充一點，正如帕特里西奧所說，我們在 10 月和 11 月期間顯著減少了 LELIQ 的暴露。我們只有用於滿足最低現金需求的 LELIQ。請記住，大約 5% 的新現金儲備，我們可以與 LELIQ 整​​合。因此，用現金取代 LELIQ 的機會成本非常高，但這只是很小的一部分。截至今天，只有 500 億阿根廷比索，明顯低於 9 月 30 日的水平。

But also, we reduced the overall exposure to the Central Bank, not only going from LELIQs to Repos which is a first step because Repos are only one day, so that's very short-term, but we are also reducing by half -- we are now half the exposure to the Central Bank instruments as compared to September 30. So, that's also a major reduction. We are reducing basically deposits from institutional investors, institutional depositors, as mutual funds, or money markets funds. So, we have this lower balance, which is something we can manage adjusting the short term.

而且，我們還減少了對中央銀行的整體風險敞口，不僅從LELIQ 轉向回購協議，這是第一步，因為回購協議只有一天，所以這是非常短期的，而且我們也減少了一半-我們正在與 9 月 30 日相比，現在央行工具的曝險減少了一半。因此，這也是一個重大減少。我們主要減少來自機構投資人、機構儲戶、共同基金或貨幣市場基金的存款。因此，我們的餘額較低，這是我們可以在短期內進行調整的。

And then, regarding ROE, I think your third question was regarding ROE in 2024. But of course, it's still very hard to predict because we don't know all the measures that the government will take starting December 10. But what we can imagine, as Patricio said, is that the regulations, punitive regulations will be removed from day one. So, that's positive for ROE. But on the other hand, we want to be at least in the first months of the government, where we see that it's going to be a period of very high inflation and volatility, we want to be also more conservative, as we mentioned, we are reducing the exposure to Central Bank. We might increase something in treasury bonds as the perspectives can be better if the fiscal deficit problem is addressed, but with a more conservative stance, our ROE can be in the range of 5% to 10%.

然後，關於ROE，我認為你的第三個問題是關於2024 年的ROE。但是，當然，它仍然很難預測，因為我們不知道政府從12 月10 日開始將採取的所有措施。但我們可以想像什麼正如帕特里西奧所說，是法規，懲罰性法規將從第一天起就被取消。因此，這對 ROE 是有利的。但另一方面，我們希望至少在政府執政的頭幾個月裡，我們看到這將是一個通貨膨脹和波動性非常高的時期，我們也希望更加保守，正如我們所提到的，我們正在減少對央行的風險敞口。我們可能會增加一些國債，因為如果財政赤字問題得到解決，前景會更好，但如果立場更保守，我們的ROE可以在5%到10%的範圍內。

Again, it's very early to predict, we may adjust this when we report the full-year results, but that's our current estimate.

同樣，現在預測還為時過早，我們可能會在報告全年業績時對此進行調整，但這只是我們目前的估計。

Now. Thank you very much for all your answers. Very detailed. Thank you very much.

現在。非常感謝您的所有回答。非常詳細。非常感謝。

Thank you, Ernesto. Carlos Gómez at HSBC. Hello, Carlos?

謝謝你，埃內斯托。匯豐銀行的卡洛斯‧戈麥斯。你好，卡洛斯？

Hello, Ana. Thank you for the call and thank you for taking my question. First, actually, congratulations on the result because the last quarter has been quite different from before. Now, the question is, this seems to be related to your position in securities and the fact that you are reducing your position, is there going to be a correlation there? Do you expect -- I mean, from what I understand, I think the answer is yes. Do you expect that your profitability will be at a different level if you reduce the position significantly into next year?

你好，安娜。感謝您的來電，也謝謝您回答我的問題。首先，實際上，祝賀這個結果，因為上個季度與以前有很大不同。現在的問題是，這似乎與您的證券頭寸以及您正在減持頭寸有關，這之間是否存在相關性？你期望嗎——我的意思是，據我了解，我認為答案是肯定的。如果您在明年大幅減少頭寸，您預計您的獲利能力會達到不同的水平嗎？

And second, you seem to have taken a more proactive approach to lending. At the same time, you expect a contraction or a difficult period in the beginning of next year. Will you continue to be lending, I would say, more aggressively, gaining market share versus your peers into the next year or you'll wait until the economic situation is a bit clearer? Thank you so much.

其次，你們似乎採取了更積極主動的貸款方式。同時，您預計明年年初會出現收縮或困難時期。我想說，明年你會繼續更積極放貸，與同業相比獲得市場份額，還是會等到經濟情勢更加明朗？太感謝了。

Good morning, Carlos, and thank you for your question. In terms of our exposure to government securities and the fact that we would see less profitability going forward, it's difficult to establish correlations with the levels of uncertainty we see going forward and with lack of information as to exactly what the package that will be sent to Congress contains.

早安，卡洛斯，謝謝你的問題。就我們對政府證券的敞口以及未來盈利能力下降的事實而言，很難與我們未來看到的不確定性水平建立相關性，並且缺乏關於包裹將被發送到何處的信息。國會包含。

We think that what will happen is, as Mariano pointed out earlier, there will be significant deregulation in the financial sector. And that actually is an opportunity and generally will allow us to, for example, go away or move away from something that was very exceptional in terms of policy, like having floor rates which being deregulated will allow us to price deposits to market levels and therefore we believe in that context as the program moves forward have a more deregulated environment and allow us to maintain profitability.

我們認為，正如馬裡亞諾早些時候指出的那樣，將會發生的情況是，金融部門將大幅放鬆監管。這實際上是一個機會，通常會讓我們能夠放棄或放棄一些​​在政策方面非常特殊的東西，例如解除管制的最低利率將使我們能夠將存款定價到市場水平，因此我們相信，在這種情況下，隨著該計劃的推進，將會有一個更加放鬆管制的環境，並使我們能夠保持盈利能力。

But quite frankly it's very difficult to at this point be certain of what this will be. In terms of lending, we will continue to be proactive, because we will be focusing in the sectors that we consider are winners of this significant change in macroeconomic policy. Basically, export oriented companies that are in agribusiness in different sectors throughout the country and also in energy. And these sectors will experience significant growth. And we also see, for example, certain sections of construction like private residential construction picking up significantly. So, if you look at the specific opportunities within the average, you will be able to pick a couple of sectors with the growth potential and we will be going after those and we will continue to be proactive in lending to them.

但坦白說，目前很難確定這會是什麼。在貸款方面，我們將繼續積極主動，因為我們將重點關注我們認為是宏觀經濟政策重大變化的贏家的行業。基本上，是全國各地不同行業的農業企業和能源出口導向公司。這些行業將經歷顯著成長。例如，我們也看到某些建築領域（例如私人住宅建築）顯著回升。因此，如果您關注平均水平內的具體機會，您將能夠選擇幾個具有成長潛力的行業，我們將追隨這些行業，並繼續積極主動地向它們提供貸款。

Okay.

好的。

Carlos, let me add something to what Alejandro said concerning the loans. If you look back to our history, we had always high NIMs due to good share in personal loans, and that was mainly due to a segment of senior citizens. However, in the last few years, there was a program from the government, which is called Argenta, that provided very much subsidized loans to retirees. This will be removed, and this will help user gain much better NIMs for personal loans in the future in an important business segment that we have also. So, I wanted to add this, I think it's quite important.

卡洛斯，讓我補充一下亞歷杭德羅關於貸款的說法。如果你回顧我們的歷史，我們的淨利差一直很高，因為個人貸款比例很高，而這主要是因為一部分老年人。然而，在過去幾年中，政府推出了一項名為 Argenta 的計劃，為退休人員提供大量補貼貸款。這將被刪除，這將有助於用戶未來在我們也擁有的重要業務領域獲得更好的個人貸款淨利差。所以，我想補充一點，我認為這非常重要。

Okay. That's an important consideration. And would you have a target as to how much of that you can do in the sector?

好的。這是一個重要的考慮因素。您是否有一個目標，即您可以在該領域做多少事情？

Well, we have around, at this stage, between 600,000 and 700,000 clients in this sector, and the loans, the demand is very low because the demand was -- as I said before, it was the government, the social security that was providing these loans, but with the fiscal therapy that will be implemented, these type of loans do not make sense. So, it will be -- we expect that it will grow.

嗯，現階段，這個行業大約有 60 萬到 70 萬名客戶，貸款需求非常低，因為需求是 - 正如我之前所說，是政府、社會安全提供的這些貸款，但隨著即將實施的財政療法，此類貸款沒有意義。所以，我們預期它會成長。

Okay. That's clear. Thank you so much.

好的。很清楚。太感謝了。

Thank you, Carlos. Brian Flores, Citibank.

謝謝你，卡洛斯。布萊恩·弗洛雷斯，花旗銀行。

Hi, team. Good morning. Can you hear me well?

大家好。早安.你聽得清楚我說話嗎？

Yes.

是的。

Perfect. Thank you, and as Carlos said, congratulations on the results, I think they're very, very strong. I think, maybe the sector has played defense extraordinarily, given the context, and now we perhaps-- we might be moving to offense, right? And I have a question that is related to what Carlos asked, which is, there might be a, probably in the first half of next year where inflation is high, maybe credit demand is still starting to come, but still not there.

完美的。謝謝，正如卡洛斯所說，祝賀結果，我認為它們非常非常強大。我認為，考慮到目前的情況，該部門可能表現得非常出色，現在我們可能會轉向進攻，對嗎？我有一個與卡洛斯所問的問題相關的問題，即可能在明年上半年，通貨膨脹率很高，信貸需求可能仍然開始出現，但仍然不存在。

I'm just wondering, if you're budgeting, maybe for slight chances that you see or seen low-single-digit ROEs in the first half, and then maybe a strong expansion in the second half or how are you thinking about that, right? Because I think mid-term is constructive, and I think I agree with all the visions you've shared, but maybe in the first part of the next year we might see some difficulties still. Do you think this is correct or do you think I am being a bit more pessimistic? Should I be a bit more optimistic? Anything is appreciated. Thank you.

我只是想知道，如果你在做預算，也許你在上半年看到或看到低個位數的股本回報率，然後可能在下半年出現強勁擴張，或者你是如何看待這一點的，正確的？因為我認為中期是建設性的，我認為我同意你們分享的所有願景，但也許在明年上半年我們可能仍然會看到一些困難。您認為這是正確的還是我有點悲觀？我應該更樂觀一點嗎？任何事物都會受到讚賞。謝謝。

Okay. First of all, I would like to state that we have been preparing the last three years for this change of profound structural changes that are occurring in the country. And we have an aggressive growth plan, particularly in corporates, that we started already in the third quarter. And we have gained, we have a model which is a product-oriented model and we have achieved significant operational efficiencies, simply to state, and this is related to your question, because the bank has, over the last three years, we have 800 employees less, at the group level we have 2,000 employees less, we have closed 50 branches, we have terminated a consumer finance business that was a loss making business, and we are positioned, as Alejandro mentioned earlier, that we are positioned to provide loans in companies that belong to value chains of expert led industries.

好的。首先，我想指出，過去三年來，我們一直在為該國正在發生的深刻結構性變化做準備。我們有一個積極的成長計劃，特別是在企業方面，我們已經在第三季開始實施。我們已經取得了成果，我們有一個以產品為導向的模型，我們已經實現了顯著的營運效率，簡單地說，這與你的問題相關，因為銀行在過去三年裡，我們有 800員工減少，在集團層面我們減少了2,000 名員工，我們關閉了50 家分行，我們終止了一項虧損的消費金融業務，正如亞歷杭德羅之前提到的，我們的定位是提供貸款屬於專家主導行業價值鏈的公司。

However, as you well said, with high inflation, demand is very low at this stage, and but consistent with what we believe will be the economic plan to tackle the LELIQs, there will be deregulation of rates. That means that we will be able to fix, there will be market rates for liabilities and market rates for assets. And that means that we will be able to start providing loans with positive margins for corporations in the first months because individuals probably, with high inflation, they will not be taking loans.

然而，正如您所說，在高通膨的情況下，現階段的需求非常低，但與我們認為解決 LELIQ 問題的經濟計劃相一致，利率將會放鬆管制。這意味著我們將能夠確定負債的市場利率和資產的市場利率。這意味著我們將能夠在頭幾個月開始為企業提供利潤為正的貸款，因為在高通膨的情況下，個人可能不會接受貸款。

But we believe that, yes, for a certain period of time, it will be more difficult to give loans, as you said. But after the change in relative prices and implementation of the initial steps of the program, we expect that after a period of high inflation the people will have an expectation of low inflation, then they will start to have more demand of loans in the second half of the year.

但我們相信，是的，在一段時間內，正如你所說，發放貸款將會更加困難。但經過相對價格的變化和計劃的初步實施，我們預計，經過一段時間的高通膨之後，人們會對低通膨產生預期，那麼下半年他們將開始有更多的貸款需求今年的。

So, I don't know if you want to add.

所以，不知道你要不要補充。

Brian, this is Alejandro. Two or three notes to your question. One is our business, as is also the economy of the country, is cyclical and typically you will find that the first half is always a bit slower than the second half. Of course, on top of this, in the first half of '24, you will have a lot of fiscal adjustment and the increase of inflation after some kind of adjustment to the exchange rate.

布萊恩，這是亞歷杭德羅。對你的問題有兩三個註解。一是我們的業務和國家的經濟一樣，都是週期性的，通常你會發現上半年總是比下半年慢一點。當然，除此之外，24年上半年，還會有大量的財政調整，並且在對匯率進行某種調整後，通貨膨脹也會加劇。

However, a couple of things for you to look at as we go through the first half. One is, you will have a much better energy balance because we used to have a net import of energy that we required. And we are now will be able to do export once the -- in the last quarter, basically in the last quarter during the third quarter of this year, you have the connection of dots that will allow you to be in the condition of exporting energy.

不過，在我們回顧上半場的過程中，有幾件事需要您注意。一是，您將擁有更好的能源平衡，因為我們過去需要淨進口能源。我們現在將能夠進行出口，一旦 - 在上個季度，基本上是在今年第三季度的最後一個季度，你有了點的聯繫，這將使你處於出口能源的狀態。

And second, there was a significant impact during this year of the drought -- the tail of the drought that we see now moving clearly away because the NIM is consolidated too. So, those two factors will actually help you deal with what would otherwise be a very recessionary context, particularly for consumption. But companies or enterprises linked to these value chains will probably continue to experience growth and will drive or help drive exports and the economy moving forward.

其次，今年的乾旱產生了重大影響——我們現在看到乾旱的尾部已經明顯消失，因為淨利差也得到了整合。因此，這兩個因素實際上將幫助您應對經濟衰退的情況，特別是對於消費而言。但與這些價值鏈相關的公司或企業可能會繼續成長，並將推動或協助推動出口和經濟向前發展。

Well, that is super helpful. Thank you very much.

嗯，這非常有幫助。非常感謝。

Thank you, Brian. I think we have a follow-up from Carlos Gómez. I don't know, Carlos, if this is correct or only that you forget to withdraw your hand?

謝謝你，布萊恩。我想我們有卡洛斯·戈麥斯的後續行動。我不知道，卡洛斯，這是正確的還是只是你忘記收回你的手？

No, no, it's actually correct. So, my question is about your hedging strategy. As you mentioned, you have 100% of the capital hedged. Can you remind us, is this purely through the securities portfolio, the dual bonds? Or do you use real estate more actively now? Or are there any other elements in your hedging strategy that are not those two? Thank you.

不不不，其實是對的。所以，我的問題是關於你們的對沖策略。正如您所提到的，您擁有 100% 的資本對沖。您能否提醒我們，這純粹是透過證券投資組合、雙重債券嗎？或者您現在更積極地利用房地產嗎？或者您的對沖策略中是否還有這兩個因素之外的其他要素？謝謝。

Okay. Thank you. This is an interesting question, because I think it differentiates us from the rest of the banks. We have a substantial position in mortgages, which we built during the Macro period and which represents today around 22% of our net worth, and this is quite interesting because it's more -- it's bigger than other banks, so it's on the private sector. Then the rest is -- yes, the rest is buildings and real estate and public treasury bonds. I don't know if you want to expand on that, Mariano?

好的。謝謝。這是一個有趣的問題，因為我認為這使我們與其他銀行不同。我們在抵押貸款方面擁有重要地位，這是我們在宏觀時期建立的，目前約占我們淨資產的 22%，這很有趣，因為它比其他銀行更大，所以它是在私營部門。然後剩下的就是——是的，剩下的是建築物、房地產和公共國債。我不知道你是否想進一步闡述這一點，馬裡亞諾？

Yes, those are the main three different asset classes, real estate, mortgages, and treasury bonds, while we have dual bonds which, as you know, they adjust by inflation or devaluation the higher or CER bonds which adjust by inflation. So, that's basically our hedge of net equity but we also have a long position in dual bonds so that also can be a source of shorter gains going to the fourth quarter and the first quarter.

是的，這些是主要的三種不同的資產類別：房地產、抵押貸款和國債，而我們有雙重債券，如您所知，它們通過通貨膨脹或貶值進行調整，而較高的或CER 債券則通過通貨膨脹進行調整。因此，這基本上是我們對淨股本的對沖，但我們也持有雙重債券的多頭頭寸，因此這也可以成為第四季和第一季較短收益的來源。

Yes, actually that was my follow-up. So, the hedge is versus inflation, right? And then, the US dollar position, I believe that your maximum is 5% of net worth or as a financial group you can perhaps go a bit further than that?

是的，實際上那是我的後續行動。那麼，對沖是針對通貨膨脹的，對嗎？然後，美元頭寸，我相信你們的上限是淨資產的5%，或者作為一個金融集團，你們也許可以比這個更進一步？

Yes, our spot position can only be balanced or short, but the spot position, we are balanced. And then, we can go up to 5% of Tier 1 with derivatives as futures and then extend to 30% with dollar-linked bonds, but dual bonds do not account in that position, so we actually have no limits on dual bonds. So, that's where we have a longer position for the higher of devaluation or inflation.

是的，我們的現貨部位只能是平衡或空頭，但是現貨部位，我們是平衡的。然後，我們可以將衍生性商品作為期貨提高到一級債券的5％，然後將與美元掛鉤的債券擴展到30％，但是雙債券不計入這個位置，所以我們實際上對雙債券沒有限制。因此，這就是我們對於貶值或通膨較高者持有較長部位的情況。

So, could you give us an idea about the current level of your long position in US dollar?

那麼，您能否向我們介紹一下您目前的美元多頭部位水準？

Now we are approximately at 125% of our equity, so we have 100% inflation plus 25% in dual bonds.

現在我們的權益大約是 125%，因此我們有 100% 的通貨膨脹加上 25% 的雙重債券。

That's very clear. Thank you so much.

這非常清楚。太感謝了。

Thank you, Carlos. I think we have reached the end of the Q&A session, so thank you for joining us today. We appreciate your interest in our company. We look forward to meeting more of you over the coming weeks or months and providing financial and business updates next quarter. In the interim, we remain available to answer any questions that you may have. Thank you, and have a good day.

謝謝你，卡洛斯。我想我們的問答環節已經結束了，所以感謝您今天加入我們。我們感謝您對我們公司的興趣。我們期待在未來幾週或幾個月內與更多的人見面，並提供下季度的財務和業務最新資訊。在此期間，我們仍然可以回答您可能提出的任何問題。謝謝你，有美好的一天。