Companhia Siderurgica Nacional SA (SID) 2024 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Morning, ladies and gentlemen, at this time, we would like to welcome everyone to CSN's conference call to present results for the first-quarter 2024. We have with us the company's executive officers. We would like to inform you that this event is being recorded. (Operator Instructions) Today's event can be accessed at ri.csn.com.br, where the presentation is also available. The replay service will be available after the call.

早安，女士們、先生們，此時此刻，我們歡迎大家參加南航的電話會議，介紹 2024 年第一季的業績。我們有公司的執行官。我們謹通知您，該事件正在被記錄。（操作員說明）今天的活動可以透過 ri.csn.com.br 訪問，也可以在該網站上觀看演示。通話結束後將提供重播服務。

Before proceeding, please keep in mind that the forward-looking statements herein are mere expectations or trends and are based on the current assumptions and opinions of the company management and that future results, performance, and events may differ materially from those expressed herein, which do not constitute projections. Actual results, performances or events may differ materially from those expressed or implied by forward-looking statements as a result of several factors. Overall and economic conditions in Brazil and other countries, interest rate and exchange rate levels, future rescheduling or prepayment of debt denominated in foreign currencies, protectionist measures in the US, Brazil and other countries, changes in laws and regulations and general competitive factors, at a global, regional, or national basis.

在繼續之前，請記住，本文中的前瞻性陳述僅僅是預期或趨勢，並且基於公司管理層當前的假設和意見，未來的結果、業績和事件可能與本文中表達的內容存在重大差異，這不構成預測。由於多種因素的影響，實際結果、表現或事件可能與前瞻性陳述中明示或暗示的結果、表現或事件有重大差異。巴西及其他國家的整體和經濟狀況、利率和匯率水準、外幣債務的未來重新安排或提前償還、美國、巴西和其他國家的保護主義措施、法律法規的變化以及總體競爭因素，全球、區域或國家基礎。

Will now turn the conference over to Mr. Antonio Marco Campos Rabello, our CFO and Investor Relations Executive Officer, who will begin the presentation. You may proceed, Rabello.

現在將會議交給我們的財務長兼投資者關係執行長 Antonio Marco Campos Rabello 先生，他將開始演講。你可以繼續了，拉貝洛。

Good morning, everybody. My name is Marco Rabello. It is a pleasure to share with you the results of CSN. We -- I joined CSN in the second fortnight of March. I would like to thank the team and Marcelo Ribeiro for all of the support that I received in the transition period and for the deliveries that he gave us while he was at CSN. Thank you, Marcelo.

大家早安。我叫馬可·拉貝洛。很高興與大家分享南航的成果。我們－我在三月的第二個星期加入了南航。我要感謝團隊和馬塞洛·裡貝羅 (Marcelo Ribeiro) 在過渡期間給予我的所有支持，以及他在 CSN 期間為我們提供的服務。謝謝你，馬塞洛。

On slide number two, we see the main slides attained this quarter. Despite the fact that we faced several challenges regarding the price of our products, the beginning of the year was important to reinforce operating enhancements, beginning with mining, where we had record sales for the first quarter. The company benefited from this period, a drier period and we sold more than 9 million tons.

在第二張投影片上，我們看到了本季實現的主要投影片。儘管我們在產品價格方面面臨一些挑戰，但年初對於加強營運改善非常重要，首先是採礦業，我們第一季的銷售額創下了紀錄。該公司受惠於這段乾燥時期，我們的銷量超過 900 萬噸。

In terms of steel, this is the fifth quarter -- consecutive quarter of sales showing the normalization of the operation and the assertive commercial strategy by managing to compensate for a seasonally weaker quarter in the domestic market with increased sales abroad. We captured synergies, delivering a 26% EBITDA margin, something unheard of since we carried out the last acquisition.

就鋼鐵而言，這是連續第五個季度的銷售，顯示了營運的正常化和自信的商業策略，透過海外銷售的增加設法彌補了國內市場季節性疲軟的季度。我們實現了協同效應，實現了 26% 的 EBITDA 利潤率，這是自我們上次收購以來聞所未聞的。

Lastly, and not least important, we have an ESG. highlight with a publication of the 2023 integrated report with advances in emissions control. ESG is a strategic fundamental topic for CSN.

最後，同樣重要的是，我們有 ESG。發布 2023 年綜合報告，重點介紹排放控制的進展。ESG是南航的戰略基礎議題。

We go on to slide number 4, we see the EBITDA evolution. You see an impact of the price of iron ore and the impact on our results this quarter. Besides the seasonality of the period, the drop in the Platts price had an impact on the mining EBITDA. And on the consolidated results. There was a difference between the first-quarter '23 and the fourth-quarter '23, leading us to an EBITDA margin of 19% for the period.

我們繼續看第四張投影片，我們看到 EBITDA 的演變。您會看到鐵礦石價格的影響以及對我們本季業績的影響。除了該時期的季節性因素外，普氏價格的下跌也對礦業 EBITDA 產生了影響。以及綜合結果。23 年第一季和 23 年第四季之間存在差異，導致我們該期間的 EBITDA 利潤率為 19%。

In the next slide, we can see the CapEx and the working capital on the part of investments, the drop of 50% vis-a-vis the previous quarter is due to a seasonality of CSN that wants to concentrate investments for the end of the year. When we compare this with the same period year on year, we made significant advances in investment in steel and coke batteries, sintering, and the streamlining of UPV operations. We also had advances and capacity expansion projects in mining, mainly related to new P15 equipment purchases. In terms of working capital, a reduction in accounts receivable directly related to the weaker sales performed in the period, especially in mining because of a drop in the international prices.

在下一張投影片中，我們可以看到投資部分的資本支出和營運資金，與上一季相比下降了 50%，這是由於 CSN 的季節性因素，該公司希望將投資集中在年底年。與去年同期相比，我們在鋼鐵和焦炭電池、燒結以及UPV業務精簡方面的投資取得了顯著進步。我們在採礦業也有進展和產能擴張項目，主要與購買新的 P15 設備有關。就營運資金而言，應收帳款減少與期內銷售疲軟直接相關，特別是由於國際價格下跌而導致採礦業的銷售疲軟。

We go on to slide number 6, where we present the adjusted cash flow evolution with a negative result of BRL636 million, impacted by lower operating results, but also because of the negative impact of interest rates and the hedging with iron ore. This should be reverted the coming quarter with a change of prices we have observed in the last weeks.

我們繼續看第 6 張投影片，其中我們展示了調整後現金流的演變，結果為 6.36 億雷亞爾，這是由於經營業績下降的影響，也是因為利率和鐵礦石對沖的負面影響。隨著我們過去幾週觀察到的價格變化，這一情況應該會在下個季度恢復。

In slide number 7, we show you the leverage evolution and net debt buildup after two consecutive quarters of drop of leverage. We had an increase in the level of indebtedness of BRL1.2 billion when compared with the first quarter last year. This performance was expected because of the drop in prices of commodities. We're making the most at this moment to reinforce our commitment to continue to reduce leverage in the coming quarters and comply with the goals of the company. We will have more robust results in the coming quarters with seasonality acting in our favor in terms of volume and with an increase in price in iron ore and steel.

在第 7 張投影片中，我們向您展示了槓桿率連續兩季下降後的槓桿率演變和淨債務累積。與去年第一季相比，我們的債務水準增加了 12 億雷亞爾。由於大宗商品價格下跌，這一表現在預期之內。目前，我們正在盡最大努力強化我們的承諾，在未來幾季繼續降低槓桿並遵守公司的目標。我們將在未來幾季取得更強勁的業績，季節性因素對我們有利，而且鐵礦石和鋼材的價格也會上漲。

We also have strategic projects remarked upon in previous calls, we have a partner in energy and work with strategic investors for a minority stake in mining. These are topics that are extremely important because we need to have a diversified company with relevant action in different areas, and they will enable us to recycle our internal capital and of course, we will have a variation of leverage in less stable periods.

我們在先前的電話會議中也提到戰略項目，我們有能源合作夥伴，並與戰略投資者合作獲得採礦業的少數股權。這些主題非常重要，因為我們需要一家多元化的公司，在不同領域採取相關行動，它們將使我們能夠回收我們的內部資本，當然，我們在不太穩定的時期會有不同的槓桿。

In slide number 8, you see our debt amortization schedule. We show you the sound cash position. CSN has had with several million reais at our disposal. Additionally, the Company is very active in terms of rolling its debt with a focus on long-term operations and the local capital market. This quarter, we had the reissuance of bonds of last year. We have a raising of $700 million, maturing in 2030. Yesterday, we concluded our 15th simple debenture with a total value of BLR800 million divided in two series with the objective of investing in infrastructure for long-term and efficient structures.

在第 8 張投影片中，您可以看到我們的債務攤銷時間表。我們向您展示穩健的現金狀況。CSN 擁有數百萬雷亞爾可供我們支配。此外，該公司在債務滾動方面非常積極，並專注於長期營運和當地資本市場。本季度，我們重新發行了去年的債券。我們籌集了 7 億美元，將於 2030 年到期。昨天，我們完成了第 15 期簡單債券，總價值為 8 億博茨瓦納盧比，分為兩個系列，目的是投資基礎設施以實現長期高效的結構。

With this, we conclude the consolidated analysis of our performance, and we now go on to the highlights of each segment.

至此，我們對業績進行了綜合分析，現在我們將繼續討論每個細分市場的亮點。

On slide number 10, we see the steel performance. For the third consecutive quarter, we had a growth in sales because of the strong dynamism of the foreign market, especially SWT, offset by the drop in the domestic market. There was a price readjustment that was significant because of competition with imported material and because of the diversified mix. With higher concentration of lower added value products, this offset the increase in price and enabled us to have a good EBITDA at the beginning of the year.

在第 10 張投影片上，我們看到了鋼材的表現。由於國外市場（尤其是 SWT）的強勁活力，我們的銷售額連續第三個季度成長，抵消了國內市場的下降。由於與進口材料的競爭以及多樣化的組合，價格調整意義重大。由於低附加價值產品更加集中，這抵消了價格的上漲，使我們在年初獲得了良好的 EBITDA。

In slide number 11, you see a growth of 5.7% in steel production, referring to the enhancement of the production process that we have observed over the last few quarters, compared with the same period in '23 where we had some bottlenecks in production.

在第 11 張投影片中，您可以看到鋼鐵產量增加了 5.7%，這是指我們在過去幾季觀察到的生產流程的改進，而 23 年同期我們在生產中遇到了一些瓶頸。

Now, we have a higher dilution of fixed cost, leading to a drop in slab in the first-quarter '24. As mentioned in the previous slide, this decrease was not sufficient to offset the drop of price. On the other hand, the expectation is that the cost will fall even further, but we will resume our performance in the coming quarter, where seasonality will play in our favor. There is also a drop in raw material and a more comfortable position once we have quotas for imported products.

現在，我們的固定成本稀釋度更高，導致 24 年第一季的板坯數量下降。正如上一張幻燈片中提到的，這種下降不足以抵消價格的下跌。另一方面，預計成本將進一步下降，但我們將在下個季度恢復業績，季節性因素將對我們有利。一旦我們有了進口產品配額，原料也會下降，處境也會更舒適。

On slide 13, we see the mining performance and despite seasonality, the company maintained operational excellence in recent quarters to deliver yet another production record for the year, overcoming the critical period of rainfall. Now, the readjustment in the price of iron ore was intense, a change of $30 per ton in the price practice this quarter, vis-a-vis the last quarter, offsetting all of the problems we saw and leading to a drop in EBITDA, reaching a margin of 40% this quarter.

在幻燈片 13 中，我們看到了採礦業績，儘管存在季節性因素，該公司在最近幾個季度仍保持卓越運營，克服了降雨的關鍵時期，創下了今年的生產新紀錄。現在，鐵礦石價格的調整很激烈，本季的價格做法與上季度相比每噸發生了 30 美元的變化，抵消了我們看到的所有問題並導致 EBITDA 下降，本季利潤率達到40% 。

On slide number 14, in greater detail, you will see the impact of this adjustment on our, especially in price provisions. This effect added to the effect of seasonality per volume were responsible for a difference of BRL1 billion between the last two quarters.

在第 14 號投影片上，您將更詳細地看到這項調整對我們的影響，特別是在價格規定方面。這種效應加上每銷量的季節性效應，導致了過去兩個季度之間 10 億雷亞爾的差異。

We look at the results of cement on slide number 16. And we can see that despite the seasonality with increased rainfall, the company maintained an assertive commercial activity with minor impact on the volume between the two quarters, differently from what we observed last year when we had more aggressive price strategies. This quarter, we see an enhancement in the competitive environment, allowing for a price adjustment in this quarter, which means we have a stable behavior of revenue despite the lower volumes. The message of this slide is a sound capture of synergy and operational efficiency gains, surpassing for the first time, the mark of 25% mark of adjusted EBITDA margin since the integration of assets. So we're on the right path to capture benefits with a sound and efficient financial performance.

我們查看第 16 號投影片上的水泥結果。我們可以看到，儘管季節性降雨量增加，但該公司仍保持著積極的商業活動，對兩個季度之間的銷量影響較小，這與我們去年觀察到的情況不同，當時我們採取了更激進的價格策略。本季度，我們看到競爭環境有所增強，允許在本季度進行價格調整，這意味著儘管銷量較低，但我們的收入表現穩定。這張投影片傳達的訊息是協同效應和營運效率收益的良好捕捉，自資產整合以來首次超過調整後 EBITDA 利潤率 25% 的大關。因此，我們正走在正確的道路上，以穩健、高效的財務表現來獲取利益。

With this, I would like to end the presentation on the segments. And I invite Helena Guerra to speak about the highlights in ESG.

至此，我想結束各部分的介紹。我邀請 Helena Guerra 來談談 ESG 的亮點。

Good morning, everybody. Thank you for the opportunity of presenting our results for the quarter. I couldn't begin the call without first referring to out poor solidarity to the disaster in Rio Grande do Sul. It is an economic and humanitarian tragedy due to climate change, and it reinforces the need to focus on climate change and the need for the society to adapt to avoid the impacts of this new reality, our deep solidarity and help to our associates in the region.

大家早安。感謝您有機會介紹我們本季的業績。在開始通話之前，我首先提到了對南里奧格蘭德州災難的團結不力。這是氣候變遷造成的一場經濟和人道主義悲劇，它強化了關注氣候變遷的必要性以及社會適應以避免這一新現實的影響的必要性，我們對此深表聲援​​並為我們在該地區的同事提供協助。

Even in extremely difficult working conditions, our employees have worked incessantly in a very competent way. Still maintain our dams stable despite this new volume of rainfall and to ensure that our company could be properly mobilized through different actions to help the people in Rio Grande do Sul to face this disaster.

即使在極其困難的工作條件下，我們的員工仍以非常稱職的方式持續工作。儘管降雨量增加，但仍保持我們的水壩穩定，並確保我們公司能夠透過不同的行動得到適當的動員，幫助南里奧格蘭德州的人們應對這場災難。

Although the call is for the first quarter of '24, we highlight the publication of the fourth edition of CSN report. CMIN was published yesterday. Both have been reviewed by outside auditors, and were complying with our obligations until 2026. We refer to this double materiality. It considers the impacts caused by the company environment frameworks, both risks and impact to the business, especially financial risk. This double materiality is part of the European system that was approved in 2023 and will become a mandatory practice. And this has been incorporated into the 2023 quarter.

儘管是 2024 年第一季的會議，但我們仍專注於 CSN 第四版報告的發布。CMIN 於昨天發布。兩者均已接受外部審計員的審查，並在 2026 年之前遵守我們的義務。我們指的是這種雙重物質性。它考慮了公司環境框架造成的影響，包括風險和對業務的影響，特別是財務風險。這種雙重重要性是 2023 年批准的歐洲體系的一部分，並將成為強制性做法。而這已納入2023年季度。

In the quarter, we have some actions referring to advance in health and safety. We have a decrease in the margins of CMIN. We have a dam that was improved in December. It had reached level one of stability. This was stated through an external audit. So all of the dams in the company have the highest level of safety.

在本季度，我們採取了一些涉及健康和安全方面進步的行動。我們的 CMIN 利潤率有所下降。我們有一座大壩在十二月得到了改善。它已經達到了穩定的一級。這是透過外部審計得出的結論。因此，公司所有的水壩都具有最高的安全等級。

We also highlight the evolution in our safety and operations. In the first quarter of '24, we surpassed the goal set forth regarding our accident frequency rate. The goal for 2030, we have reached in 2024. This is the best historical day. 1.62 accidents. And we also have an expressive reduction in the seriousness of accidents. Thanks to the program implemented in December called AGIR [to act]. And this has reduced the potential number of accidents in environmental management, more than 500 tons of cement produced according to the best rules in the world.

我們也強調了我們的安全和營運方面的演變。2024 年第一季度，我們超越了事故頻率設定的目標。2030年的目標，我們已經在2024年達成了。這是歷史上最好的一天。 1.62 事故。我們也顯著降低了事故的嚴重程度。感謝 12 月實施的名為 AGIR [採取行動] 的計劃。這減少了環境管理中潛在事故的數量，並按照世界上最好的規則生產了500多噸水泥。

In terms of emissions, very good result in Minas Gerais, almost 2,000 cubic meters an hour, allowing for good availability of water at Casa de Pedra, something fundamental for the project.

就排放量而言，米納斯吉拉斯州的排放量非常好，幾乎每小時 2,000 立方米，使 Casa de Pedra 能夠獲得良好的水供應，這對該項目至關重要。

In terms of diversity, we have increased women participation. We have reached 62% in the CSN group, 10% of women in leadership position compared to the same period last year. And of course, we participate with the evolution of CDP grade that has the largest data bank in the world. And we have become global leaders in environmental management, especially in terms of water, safety, and climate change.

在多樣性方面，我們增加了女性的參與。與去年同期相比，我們在 CSN 群體中的比例達到了 62%，其中領導職位中的女性比例為 10%。當然，我們也參與了擁有世界上最大資料庫的 CDP 等級的發展。我們已成為環境管理的全球領導者，特別是在水、安全和氣候變遷方面。

Thank you very much.

非常感謝。

Thank you, Elena. Before we go to the question-and-answer session, I would like to give the floor to our President, Benjamin Steinbruch, for his remarks.

謝謝你，艾琳娜。在我們進入問答環節之前，我想請我們的總統本傑明·斯坦布魯赫發言。

Well, good morning, everybody. Thank you for your participation in the CSN earnings call. I would I'd like to simply review some points and we will then open for questions and answers.

那麼，大家早安。感謝您參加 CSN 財報電話會議。我想簡單回顧一下一些觀點，然後我們將開放提問和解答。

I highlight what was said in the CMIN call, and CSN, in mining, we had a record production. However, we had a timely negative impact on prices, with a reduction of almost 20% and with a direct impact on EBITDA. This impact that we had in the first quarter will be eliminated as prices have increased 20% once again. We believe that that negative impact that we had in EBITDA in the first quarter will end up being positive in the second quarter. If we consider that mine is doing well in terms of production, it is working with control costs, this is the effect of direct price on EBITDA. And if we take into account the movement at the port enabling us to ship more tons through our ports.

我強調 CMIN 電話會議和 CSN 所說的話，在採礦業，我們的產量創歷史新高。然而，我們及時對價格產生了負面影響，價格下降了近 20%，並對 EBITDA 產生了直接影響。隨著價格再次上漲 20%，第一季的影響將被消除。我們相信，第一季 EBITDA 產生的負面影響最終將在第二季產生正面影響。如果我們認為礦場在生產方面做得很好，那麼它正在控製成本，這就是直接價格對 EBITDA 的影響。如果我們考慮到港口的移動，我們就可以透過港口運送更多噸的貨物。

Regarding steel, we had an increase in the amount of steel, but we focus a great deal on mix and price. We had an impact of the imported products and this issue has begun to be addressed by the government. Eventually, there will be a better protection of the domestic market, and we believe it will lead to better results in the second quarter. In cement, conditions are normal. We have been growing in terms of amount and margin. We have been able to raise the price.

關於鋼材，我們增加了鋼材的用量，但我們非常關注結構和價格。我們受到了進口產品的影響，政府已經開始解決這個問題。最終，國內市場將會得到更好的保護，我們相信這將帶來更好的第二季業績。在水泥中，情況是正常的。我們在數量和利潤方面一直在增長。我們已經能夠提高價格。

And cement has showed the potential that it truly has. And gradually with the synergies we have captured, we have a consolidated vision with the integration of LafargeHolcim and the production of our prior plans. The EBITDA, despite the negative effect, as I mentioned, basically due to the drop of Platt.

水泥已經顯示出它真正具有的潛力。隨著我們所獲得的協同效應，我們對拉法基豪瑞的整合和我們先前計劃的發展有了一個統一的願景。EBITDA，儘管有負面影響，正如我所提到的，主要是由於普拉特的下降。

Now regarding our investments, we continue our normal pace. We have a investment policy that is higher now for 2024. We're advancing at a normal pace, and the main investment that we have for P15 has been fully contracted. All of the equipment has been contracted the engineering side under a rapid development. And we believe that very briefly, we will have the P15 becoming operational. This is the main investment from the quantitative and qualitative viewpoint for the entire group and for mining.

現在，關於我們的投資，我們繼續正常的步伐。我們現在對 2024 年的投資政策更高。我們正在以正常的速度前進，P15的主要投資已經完全收縮。設備全部由工程方承包，發展迅速。我們相信，很快 P15 就會投入使用。從數量和品質的角度來看，這是整個集團和採礦業的主要投資。

In steel, we have caulking, sintering, and high furnace also underway. The leverage, of course, which is an issue of great concern, we have made commitments to remain below three times. We continue on with this commitment despite that slide into 1.3 due to the drop of EBITDA and also due to that drop of 20% in prices for iron ore, for Platts that seems to have recovered that price loss.

在鋼鐵方面，我們的填縫、燒結和高爐也在進行中。當然槓桿率是大家非常關心的問題，我們已經承諾保持在三倍以下。我們繼續履行這項承諾，儘管由於 EBITDA 下降以及鐵礦石價格下跌 20%，導致價格滑落至 1.3，但普氏能源資訊似乎已經彌補了價格損失。

We believe that very speedily, we will be able to once again have that commitment complied with the market. As we have been saying for almost two years, our goal is to always work between 2.5- and 3-times leverage and to attempt to be as close as possible as 2.5. We do have a significant investment program, notwithstanding that we believe in our operations, and we will quickly return to that level that we have set forth to comply with. I can say that mining, very broadly, is doing very well. It is under control. We have growing volume. The price has returned the cost is dropping and the port is doing very well. So all of the variables seem to be in place and working in harmony quarter after quarter as we were able to show this last quarter.

我們相信，很快我們將能夠再次讓這項承諾得到市場的認可。正如我們近兩年來一直所說的那樣，我們的目標是始終在 2.5 至 3 倍槓桿之間工作，並嘗試盡可能接近 2.5。儘管我們相信我們的運營，但我們確實有一項重要的投資計劃，我們很快就會恢復到我們設定的水平。我可以說，從廣義上講，採礦業的表現非常好。它已得到控制。我們的數量不斷增加。價格已經回歸，成本正在下降，港口狀況也非常好。因此，正如我們在上個季度所展示的那樣，所有變數似乎都已就位，並且每個季度都在和諧地發揮作用。

Regarding mining, what we have to do is more of the same. We truly don't need to make corrections or adopt major actions. With this resumption of price, we will once again go back to having the results that were forecast in our budget and we're quite calm when it comes to mining.

關於挖礦，我們要做的也差不多。我們確實不需要做出糾正或採取重大行動。隨著價格的恢復，我們將再次回到預算中預測的結果，並且在採礦方面我們非常平靜。

With cement, the same holds true. We're doing well, capturing synergy. We are working very close to our nominal volumes. When we lose something because of coal silos, for example, we do lose a bit of the nominal capacity because of this, but the productivity and the yield that we have set forth for ourselves are quite strong and we have had good receptivity on the part of the market, our costs are under control, allowing us to have growing margins as was a concrete fact in the first quarter of going beyond 25%.

對於水泥來說，也是如此。我們做得很好，正在發揮協同作用。我們的工作量非常接近我們的名義量。例如，當我們因為煤倉而損失一些東西時，我們確實因此損失了一些名義產能，但我們為自己設定的生產率和產量是相當強的，我們對此有很好的接受度在市場上，我們的成本受到控制，使我們的利潤率不斷增長，第一季的具體事實就超過了25%。

When it comes to the steel plant, this is where we have our major problems. There's nothing different, nothing unknown. It's simply an issue of management and ability to forecast. We had a serious problem with converters with co-sintering. Well, all of these problems are known at large, but as in any capital-intensive company, when you detect the problem, even though you know how to resolve it, even now though you know how to return to normalcy, you do depend on spare parts that should be immediately available and they're not.

對鋼鐵廠來說，這是我們面臨的主要問題。沒有什麼不同，沒有什麼未知。這只是一個管理和預測能力的問題。我們在使用共燒結轉爐時遇到了嚴重的問題。嗯，所有這些問題都是眾所周知的，但是就像在任何資本密集型公司一樣，當你發現問題時，即使你知道如何解決它，即使你現在知道如何恢復正常，你確實依賴於應該立即可用的備件，但實際上卻沒有。

And the delay because of the order, the articulated order for each type of equipment, can be impactful, despite knowing what we need, despite having a defined strategy to redress these variables. Unfortunately, this will take some time and we are presently in that phase where we are losing production.

儘管知道我們需要什麼，儘管有明確的策略來糾正這些變量，但由於訂單（每種類型設備的明確訂單）而造成的延遲可能會產生影響。不幸的是，這需要一些時間，而我們目前正處於生產損失的階段。

And though we know what needs to be done, we have to continue to live with that for an additional period. We are attempting to reduce that problem that we have with third parties in the market. We have been successful. The purchases are lower than our cost of operation, but we're getting ready to recover for our losses. The time of difficulty in production have gone beyond what we expected in the steel mills.

儘管我們知道需要做什麼，但我們必須在一段時間內繼續忍受這一點。我們正在努力減少與市場上第三方的問題。我們已經成功了。這些採購低於我們的營運成本，但我們正準備彌補損失。鋼廠生產困難的時​​間已經超出了我們的預期。

Now commercially, we have a highly competitive market because of the imported products. It is a pity that the Brazilian government proceeds so slowly with that reaction that we're expecting regarding imported products, not only in the steel segment. We have to be attentive to this and that quickly react quickly in all segments that impact our economy. This is not a timely issue with the general problem.

現在商業上，由於進口產品，我們擁有高度競爭的市場。遺憾的是，巴西政府對進口產品的反應進展如此緩慢，而不僅僅是在鋼鐵領域。我們必須關注這一點，並在影響我們經濟的所有領域迅速做出反應。這不是一個普遍問題的及時問題。

China attacks very strongly and truly impacts competition. Nobody can say let China come, we are ready. We are not, not in the automotive sector, not in chemistry, not in the consumption sector, or in the spare parts sector, and the damage take some time to recover from.

中國的攻擊非常強烈，確實影響了競爭。沒人能說讓中國來，我們已經準備好了。我們不屬於汽車產業，不屬於化學產業，不屬於消費產業，也不屬於零件產業，損失需要一些時間才能恢復。

The Brazilian government is under the obligation of reacting rapidly to protect the industry as a whole. We have seen this in the past, there is a drop in the share of industry in Brazilian GDP. and for each point that we drop, it takes threefold the effort to go back to our original position. Although the Brazilian government is somewhat attentive, it has been slow in terms of its reduction and not very aware in terms of what should be done with imported products. To give you an idea, the Brazilian government use the averages of the years '22, '23 to set up the average imported added 30% in amount and based on that past come up with a new import Levy.

巴西政府有義務迅速做出反應，保護整個產業。我們過去已經看到這一點，工業在巴西國內生產總值中所佔的份額有所下降。我們每丟掉一點，就需要三倍的努力才能回到原來的位置。巴西政府雖然有些用心，但削減速度緩慢，對進口產品的處理也不太了解。為了讓您了解一下，巴西政府使用 22 年、23 年的平均值來確定平均進口增量為 30%，並在此基礎上徵收新的進口稅。

Now, if the government would have wanted to inhibit imports, they should have base themselves on the averages as the United States did with a reduction of 30% to show that they're truly combating imports. Unfortunately, we have done the contrary, what will happen in May and June is that imports will be extremely strong and to set up this higher quota, and only after that, there will be a new levy, taxation levy. It continues to stimulate imports, which surely doesn't make very much sense and which is effectively hampering the entire Brazilian economy.

現在，如果政府想要抑制進口，他們應該像美國一樣以平均為基礎，減少 30%，以表明他們真正在打擊進口。不幸的是，我們做了相反的事情，五月和六月將會發生的情況是，進口將非常強勁，並且要設立更高的配額，只有在那之後，才會有新的徵稅，即徵稅。它繼續刺激進口，這肯定沒有多大意義，而且實際上阻礙了整個巴西經濟。

I repeat here, nobody can face up China. Nobody. When China is ready to export any type of product, it simply goes over everybody in any country. We have to be attentive to that and the faster and the stronger this action is, the better the protection for industry as a whole and for Brazilian economy. And this will have a huge repercussion, as it is already having in the consumption area. It's a issue that is pending and we have to wake up to this and act quickly.

我在這裡再說一遍，沒有人能對抗中國。沒有人。當中國準備出口任何類型的產品時，它就會超越任何國家的所有人。我們必須關注這一點，這項行動越快、越有力，對整個工業和巴西經濟的保護就越好。這將產生巨大的影響，因為它已經在消費領域產生了影響。這是一個懸而未決的問題，我們必須意識到這一點並迅速採取行動。

Very well. We're now going to open the floor for questions and answers. And we are at your entire disposal to answer your questions. Thank you very much for your attention and let us continue on.

很好。我們現在開始提問和回答。我們將竭誠為您解答問題。非常感謝您的關注，讓我們繼續。

(Operator Instructions) Daniel Sasson, Itaú BBA.

（操作員說明）Daniel Sasson，Itañ BBA。

My first question refers to that final testimony made by Benjamin on China and competition, the competition of imports is that the sector I've been facing for a year and a half. For Martinez, if you could comment on this new scheme for rates and quotas recently announced by the government. If this is something that could move the needle in terms of this competition due to imports, because of aspects that are not exactly fair, or is this just an initial step? What else should be done if this could stabilize the margins in the sector, or if it was still a very timid, a small step?

我的第一個問題涉及本傑明關於中國和競爭的最後證詞，進口競爭是我一年半以來一直面臨的行業。對於馬丁內斯，您能否評論一下政府最近宣布的這項新的費率和配額計劃。如果由於進口的原因，這可能會在這場競爭中起到推動作用，因為某些方面並不完全公平，或者這只是一個第一步？如果這可以穩定該行業的利潤，或者如果這仍然是一個非常膽怯的一小步，還應該做什麼？

My second question is to Benjamin. Benjamin, thank you for this opportunity. If you could, I'll comment on your mindset in terms of opportunities for growth, especially inorganic opportunities, acquisitions appear and you have to be ready for them. It's not something that you can predict beforehand. So how can you balance all of this out with that commitment with your capital structure and the leverage below three times? Simply so that we can understand which moment you will be taking this additional step to deleverage in the future and generate value that way would help us to understand some transactions that could take place in the short term. Thank you.

我的第二個問題是問本傑明的。班傑明，謝謝你給我這個機會。如果可以的話，我會評論您在成長機會方面的心態，尤其是無機機會、收購的出現，您必須為此做好準備。這不是你可以提前預測的事情。那麼，您如何平衡所有這些與您的資本結構和低於三倍的槓桿率的承諾？簡單地說，這樣我們就可以了解您將來將在哪個時刻採取這一額外步驟來去槓桿化並產生價值，這種方式將有助於我們了解短期內可能發生的一些交易。謝謝。

Hello, Daniel. Thank you for the question. Now, to speak about the commercial defense, I'm going to try to complement what Benjamin has said, so that you fully understand not only what is happening globally with this situation regarding other players in the sector, but specifically what happens with CSN. CSN presently has a portfolio where 50%, 51% comes from reverted material, linked. repainted, and in foil.

你好，丹尼爾。感謝你的提問。現在，談到商業防禦，我將嘗試補充本傑明所說的內容，以便您不僅充分了解全球範圍內該行業其他參與者的情況，而且具體了解 CSN 發生的情況。CSN 目前擁有一個投資組合，其中 50%、51% 來自連結的恢復材料。重新塗漆，並用箔紙包裹。

Now, we have this as a matter and the issue of commercial defense throughout the world is dealt with as a matter of survival in the United States that deals with this more and frankly, they implemented [323] as a matter of national security. So this became a very important issue in the worldwide scenario. It has to be dealt with a great deal of seriousness to add to what Benjamin said about China.

現在，我們把這個當作一個問題，全世界的商業防禦問題被當作一個生存問題來處理，而美國更多地處理這個問題，坦白說，他們將[323]作為國家安全問題來實施。因此，這成為世界範圍內一個非常重要的問題。必須非常嚴肅地對待本傑明關於中國的言論。

Nowadays to give you an idea what we have in terms of flat steel coming into Brazil, what arrives every month, I'm referring to 70%, 80% that comes in directly here. This is a unique, very peculiar situation and very typical for CSN.

現在，為了讓您了解我們每月到達巴西的扁鋼數量，我指的是直接進入巴西的 70%、80%。這是一個獨特的、非常奇特的情況，對於南航來說非常典型。

Besides everything that is happening is that we have become the trash can of the world. We're receiving material outside have specification with a coating that the market has put upward with generalized corrosion, compromising everything we have built in Brazil is an additional issue of extreme emergency. We cannot compete technically. Commercially, there is no competition, but technically, we have not been able to act correctly so as to block the entry of these products into the country.

除此之外，正在發生的一切是我們已經成為世界的垃圾桶。我們收到的外部材料具有符合市場規格的塗層，市場上存在普遍腐蝕，這會損害我們在巴西建造的一切，這是另一個極端緊急的問題。我們無法在技術上競爭。從商業上講，不存在競爭，但從技術上講，我們未能採取正確的行動來阻止這些產品進入該國。

Another important point, if we look at the worldwide scenario, Brazil is the only country in the world with its mouth open to China. And this is what is happening in Brazil at present, the most serious countries nowadays, what do they do? They privilege their industry, maintain employment competitiveness. And beyond that, in real time, they see what is happening with competition. CSN has never needed protectionism. That is an obsolete concept. I have been at CSN for 23 years. We have always been in the first quartile of prices. We never needed protection to compete. We have operational excellence and a commercial strategy in place.

還有很重要的一點，如果我們放眼世界範圍，巴西是世界上唯一對中國張口的國家。而這就是巴西目前正在發生的事情，當今最嚴重的國家，他們做了什麼？他們賦予自己的行業特權，保持就業競爭力。除此之外，他們還可以即時了解競爭情況。南航從來不需要保護主義。這是一個過時的概念。我在南航已經工作 23 年了。我們一直處於價格的前四分之一。我們從來不需要保護來競爭。我們擁有卓越的營運能力和適當的商業策略。

Another problem is our myopic vision. We're confusing a strictly technical topic with a political issue. We represent to China something negligent in terms of the imports. Brazil would not have any retaliation if we had applied the rules that other countries have applied. Nobody would stop buying corn grain from Brazil because our base steel imported is destroying the Brazilian market. From the political viewpoint, we have been greatly weakened.

另一個問題是我們的短視。我們將嚴格的技術主題與政治問題混淆了。我們向中國表示在進口方面存在一些疏忽。如果我們採用其他國家已採用的規則，巴西就不會遭到任何報復。沒有人會停止從巴西購買玉米穀物，因為我們進口的基礎鋼材正在破壞巴西市場。從政治角度來看，我們已經被大大削弱了。

That's the truth. As Benjamin mentioned, everything that the United States did they base themselves on an average and took away 70%. We leveraged this 1.3. When I speak about technical measures, and in the last call, I praised the government, I imagined that this issue would be dealt with in a stringently technical way, according to the World Trade Organization.

這是事實。正如本傑明所說，美國所做的一切都是基於平均水平，拿走了70%。我們利用了這個 1.3。當我談到技術措施時，在上次通話中，我讚揚了政府，我想像這個問題將按照世界貿易組織的說法，以嚴格的技術方式來處理。

Now, the three phases of CSN have been postponed. We have a case of pre-painted and two cases of tinfoil. They have been postponed. Well, this is a political issue. People are simply looking upon this two weeks ago, we had two people from the government carrying out in local verification, which is part of the regulations, the World Trade Organization to see about prices and costs. What should the government have done to enforce temporary measures while this investigation process was being carried out? This was not done, and it could have been done in three or four months. It's very possible that we will have to wait another year for this and tied down being to be resolved.

現在，南航三期工程已被推遲。我們有一箱預先塗漆的和兩箱錫紙的。他們已被推遲。嗯，這是一個政治問題。人們只是在兩週前關注這一點，我們有兩名來自政府的人員在當地進行核查，這是世界貿易組織法規的一部分，以了解價格和成本。在調查過程進行期間，政府應該採取哪些措施來執行臨時措施？這事沒做完，本來三、四個月就能做完的。很可能我們還要再等一年才能解決這個問題。

Now, as other plants, we focused on the technical part, and the three products of CSN were postponed. Now, the entire world has set up safeguards, sanctions of 25%. And I don't think that we are better than the world. Something wrong is going on here.

現在，和其他工廠一樣，我們專注於技術部分，南航的三個產品被推遲了。現在，全世界都設立了保障措施，制裁達25%。我不認為我們比世界更好。這裡出了問題。

To give you an idea of what was done, let's look at the idea of zinc material. The average that the government considered was 162,000 tons a year. The average imports for 2023 were 483,000 tons. If you look at 362 and multiply this by 1.3, you have 470,000. So the government is legitimizing the import of these zinc products, an innocuous and inefficient measure in offensive measure completely to combat unloyal competition as we have in Brazil. This shows us very clearly an event that extends to all other products.

為了讓您了解所做的事情，讓我們來看看鋅材料的想法。政府考慮的平均產量為每年 162,000 噸。2023年平均進口量為48.3萬噸。如果您查看 362，並將其乘以 1.3，則為 470,000。因此，政府正在使這些鋅產品的進口合法化，這是一種無害且低效的進攻性措施，完全是為了打擊巴西那樣的不忠誠競爭。這非常清楚地向我們展示了一個延伸到所有其他產品的事件。

The only thing that is somewhat different is the hot rolled coil. Perhaps they can help us somewhat, but the amount is very small compared to what is imported into Brazil. So, in this situation, as Benjamin mentioned, we see several industrial chains in Brazil that are suffering due to this problem. Steel is just beginning. Very soon, we will wake up with a Chinese manufacturing finished products in Brazil. They're now coming in through indirect imports. I do apologize for extending myself on this issue, but this should be looked upon in the correct fashion.

唯一有所不同的是熱軋捲。也許他們可以為我們提供一些幫助，但與巴西進口的數量相比，數量非常少。所以，在這種情況下，正如班傑明所提到的，我們看到巴西的幾個產業鏈因為這個問題而受到影響。鋼鐵才剛開始。很快，我們就會在巴西醒來，看到中國製造的成品。它們現在是透過間接進口進入的。對於在這個問題上的擴展，我深表歉意，但應該以正確的方式看待這個問題。

Now, regarding the CSN portfolio, it's very specific. It's very different. It's important to understand how relevant this is for CSN to such a point that the Brazilian steel market in the first quarter, this was not only CSN. We had a loss in mix. There was so much imported zinc that what was left to sell was [BQ], and the entire market is dropping, and we suffer more than other local competitors.

現在，關於 CSN 產品組合，它非常具體。這是非常不同的。重要的是要了解這對 CSN 有多重要，因為第一季的巴西鋼鐵市場不僅僅是 CSN。我們在混合方面遭遇了損失。進口鋅太多了，剩下來賣的就是[BQ]，整個市場都在下跌，我們比其他本地競爭對手遭受的損失更大。

Daniel, do forgive me for extending my comment, but I attempted to give you more color on this issue. It's really not been thoroughly explained for those who do not understand what is happening. Thank you, Daniel, for the question.

丹尼爾，請原諒我發表評論，但我試圖在這個問題上為您提供更多資訊。對於那些不明白發生了什麼事的人來說，這確實沒有得到徹底的解釋。謝謝丹尼爾提出的問題。

Thank you, Martinez. Very clear.

謝謝你，馬丁內斯。非常清楚。

Now, regarding what Martinez said about import, I am in the United States. I came yesterday from Europe. I went to visit our units in Portugal and Germany and was able to speak to some people in the automotive sector, for example. What I can say is that they're terrified with what is happening when it comes to electrical cable from China. It's not something that is about to happen. It is happening.

現在，關於馬丁內斯所說的進口問題，我人在美國。我昨天從歐洲來。例如，我參觀了我們在葡萄牙和德國的單位，並與汽車行業的一些人進行了交談。我能說的是，他們對來自中國的電纜所發生的事情感到恐懼。這不是即將發生的事。它正在發生。

China is flooding the European ports with products that have no order. There is no sale, but they're anticipating everything, selling products to the ports in Europe and the United States, literally inundating these markets with vehicles.

中國正在將沒有訂單的產品大量湧入歐洲港口。沒有銷售，但他們期待一切，將產品銷售到歐洲和美國的港口，實際上車輛淹沒了這些市場。

I was able to ride in a Chinese car, in the car of the year, and I have to say the quality and the performance of the cars are impressive. It's going to be a worldwide challenge, this issue with China and the Europeans very clearly have shown their concern with the future of the European automotive industry as a whole.

我能夠乘坐中國汽車，乘坐年度汽車，我不得不說汽車的品質和性能令人印象深刻。這將是一個世界性的挑戰，中國和歐洲的這個問題非常清楚地表明了他們對整個歐洲汽車工業未來的擔憂。

It's something that is already happening, and from the viewpoint of quality that I said to prove, I saw it. It's an insane situation. They have electric cars that go from 0 to 100 in 2.1 seconds. The SUVs do this even faster. The comfort and the technical performance are fantastic. They leave nothing to be desired when it comes to European and American cars with a massive presence at the large European ports.

這是已經發生的事情，從我所說要證明的品質的角度來看，我看到了它。這是一個瘋狂的情況。他們的電動車可以在 2.1 秒內從 0 加速到 100。SUV 的速度更快。舒適度和技術性能都非常出色。當談到在歐洲大型港口大量存在的歐美汽車時，他們沒有什麼不滿意的地方。

It's not only steel. It's something that Brazil has to awaken to. The rest of the world already has. It's something much broader. We need to have a firm industrial policy that will enable our survival. Different things are going to happen very quickly when it comes to Daniel's question about the leverage for new investments, whether they are organic or acquisitions.

這不僅僅是鋼鐵。這是巴西必須覺醒的事。世界其他地方已經這樣做了。這是更廣泛的事情。我們需要有堅定的產業政策來確保我們的生存。當丹尼爾關於新投資槓桿的問題時，無論是有機投資還是收購，不同的事情很快就會發生。

Our great concern, Daniel -- my concern is about leverage specifically. We have been growing. We're putting in new assets into the group. It's the case of LafargeHolcim, EEE last year. Now, we always have that in-house and external commitment towards the leverage and minor falls as we had this quarter because of a sudden drop in prices of a commodity of 20% impacted our results. But I can say that with the measures adopted, it is very difficult to go beyond the three times in leverage.

我們非常關心，丹尼爾——我關心的是具體的槓桿作用。我們一直在成長。我們正在向集團注入新資產。去年拉法基豪瑞 (LafargeHolcim)、EEE 就是這樣的情況。現在，我們始終對槓桿和小幅下跌做出了內部和外部承諾，就像本季一樣，因為商品價格突然下跌 20% 影響了我們的業績。但我可以說，以目前採取的措施，槓桿要超越三倍是非常困難的。

As I mentioned, I believe that based on what we have been doing, we will quickly resume our normal margins of leverage. As part of this concern, what makes sense for us are only acquisitions that will enable us to reduce that level of leverage and net debt. Any type of acquisition that we will have to do or any type of investment that we want to carry out organically will be calculated very cautiously to ensure they do not represent an increase in leverage. This is our prime priority.

正如我所提到的，我相信根據我們一直在做的事情，我們很快就會恢復正常的槓桿率。作為這種擔憂的一部分，對我們來說有意義的是只有能夠使我們降低槓桿水平和淨債務的收購。我們必須進行的任何類型的收購或我們想要有機進行的任何類型的投資都將非常謹慎地計算，以確保它們不會導致槓桿率的增加。這是我們的首要任務。

We can only justify an acquisition going forward if something has enormous synergy with our present-day business to such a point that it will become a feasible way to enhance our EBITDA because of that enormous synergy that may exist. So you can remain calm that we will not carry out any type of investment, whether it is for organic growth or an acquisition that will break this rule. We are fully committed with deleveraging and we are going to do this quickly at whichever cost is necessary. No investment will be made if it will compromise this standard that prevails within CSN.

只有當某件事與我們目前的業務具有巨大的協同效應，以至於由於可能存在巨大的協同效應，它將成為提高我們的 EBITDA 的可行方式時，我們才能證明未來的收購是合理的。所以您可以保持冷靜，我們不會進行任何類型的投資，無論是為了有機成長還是為了打破這項規則的收購。我們完全致力於去槓桿化，並且我們將不惜一切代價迅速做到這一點。如果投資會損害 CSN 內的現行標準，則不會進行任何投資。

Well, thank you, Benjamin.

好吧，謝謝你，班傑明。

Rafael Barcelos, Radesco BBI.

拉斐爾·巴塞洛斯，拉德斯科·BBI。

I wish Marco Rabello a great deal of luck in his new position and thank Marcelo for his work delivered to CSN. The first question is to Marco. If you could speak about your initial perception that CSN, which will be the projects you will devote more time to in the company.

我祝 Marco Rabello 在新職位上一切順利，並感謝 Marcelo 為 CSN 所做的工作。第一個問題是問Marco的。如果您能談談您對CSN的初步看法，這將是您在公司會投入更多時間的專案。

My second question about the steel market is a question for Martinez. If you could give us an overview of the market, we heard your opinion on the new quota system caused by this flow of imports. But if we could hear more about the internal dynamic demand and the price environment, we saw a drop of prices this quarter. Now, what will happen with this dynamic in the second quarter and which is your price strategy vis-a-vis market share at CSN with the main products in the domestic market? Thank you.

我關於鋼鐵市場的第二個問題是問馬丁內斯的。如果您能為我們介紹市場概況，我們聽取了您對這種進口流動所導致的新配額制度的看法。但如果我們能更了解內部動態需求和價格環境，我們就會看到本季價格下跌。現在，第二季這種動態會發生什麼？謝謝。

Well, this is Marco. Thank you for your wishes. Of course, this is my personal opinion, but CSN does have a great advantage centered on very important pillars for the national and worldwide economy with a great deal of potential for growth, for unleashing value. And growth can be gained, of course, organically or through acquisitions.

嗯，這是馬可。謝謝你的祝福。當然，這是我個人的觀點，但南航確實擁有巨大的優勢，集中在國家和全球經濟的非常重要的支柱上，具有巨大的成長潛力，可以釋放價值。當然，成長可以透過有機方式或透過收購來實現。

We have a very specific year in terms of CapEx. We have significant CapEx for this year, as mentioned. First of all, we're going to seek funding with the best terms, with the best structures to bring a maximum return to the CapEx that we want for the year, especially in mining and in steel. There is a higher concentration of CapEx initially in both of these areas, always looking at leverage as Benjamin has underscored.

就資本支出而言，我們有一個非常具體的年份。如前所述，今年我們有大量資本支出。首先，我們將尋求具有最佳條款和最佳結構的資金，以便為我們今年想要的資本支出帶來最大回報，特別是在採礦和鋼鐵領域。資本支出最初集中在這兩個領域，正如本傑明所強調的那樣，始終關注槓桿。

But our average cost of debt, our debt schedule, there will be a large concentration. And we're going to see how to best support each segment to bring about the best profitability. All segments are showing an enhancement in their profitability, including the steel segment. Last year, of course, it faced some production bottlenecks.

但我們的平均債務成本，我們的債務時間表，將會有很大的集中度。我們將了解如何最好地支援每個細分市場以實現最佳盈利能力。所有部門的獲利能力都在增強，包括鋼鐵部門。當然，去年它遇到了一些生產瓶頸。

And obviously, we're going to support the acquisitions that will be carried out by the company with the best financial structure and bringing in the companies that will eventually be acquired in the different segments. Now, these are the main points of concentration for 2024.

顯然，我們將支持具有最佳財務結構的公司進行的收購，並引入最終將在不同領域被收購的公司。現在，這些是2024年的重點關注點。

Hello, Rafael. This is Martinez once again. I will allow myself to speak about the international market. It has been very helpful in terms of our volumes. We had the best quarter in terms of volumes. In the last five quarters, we got to 1,086,000. This was not perceived, but it is an enormous challenge for us at CSN to reach that figure as a group, as part of Benjamin's strategy of not putting all the eggs in the same basket. That is why we have operations with operational excellence outside of Brazil. And this has enabled us to hit these volume records in the last five quarters.

你好，拉斐爾。這又是馬丁內斯。我將允許自己談論國際市場。就我們的數量而言，這非常有幫助。就銷量而言，我們經歷了最好的季度。在過去的五個季度中，我們達到了 1,086,000。雖然這一點沒有被意識到，但對於我們 CSN 作為一個團隊來說，達到這個數字是一個巨大的挑戰，這是本傑明不把所有雞蛋放在同一個籃子裡的策略的一部分。這就是我們在巴西境外開展卓越營運的原因。這使我們能夠在過去五個季度創下這些銷售記錄。

Now, this has just come out in Bloomberg. Biden is planning to increase fourfold the rates for China. This is in Bloomberg. Please read this and see what is happening. This corroborates what we have mentioned here.

現在，這剛剛在彭博社發表。拜登計劃將中國的稅率提高四倍。這是彭博社的報道。請閱讀本文並看看發生了什麼。這證實了我們在這裡提到的內容。

Now, still speaking about China, if we imagine what happened in China some quarters ago, a year ago, nowadays, if you look at the industrial PMI of China, all of the indices in industry are growing. We have a recovery of industry in China. They're privileging the automotive and industrial sectors.

現在，仍然談到中國，如果我們想像幾個季度前、一年前中國發生的情況，現在，如果你看中國的工業PMI，所有工業指數都在成長。中國的工業正在復甦。他們給予汽車和工業部門特權。

When it comes to civil construction, which is fundamental, the Politburo is working with a policy that shows which are the restrictions for housing, for new developments. Prices in China, and this is good news, in this earthquake that we're living in Brazil, prices in China have been recovered by $20, $30. BQ is $535, $545. It was lower than that, almost at the level of $400, another interesting point.

當談到基礎性的土木建築時，政治局正在製定一項政策，該政策顯示了對住房和新開發項目的限制。中國的物價，這是個好消息，在我們生活在巴西的這次地震中，中國的物價已經恢復了20,30美元。BQ 為 535 美元、545 美元。另一個有趣的點是低於這個數字，幾乎在 400 美元的水平。

Well, the emphasis of China has never changed its employability, and they'll do everything for it. We base ourselves on the average of the first quarter of exports from China. It stands at 650 -- 711,000 tons of flat steel in the first quarter.

那麼，中國的重點從來沒有改變過它的就業能力，他們會為此竭盡全力。我們的依據是中國第一季出口的平均值。第一季扁鋼產量為650-71.1萬噸。

What does this mean? The imports in Brazil of 711,000 tons, mostly coming from China. If you annualize this, it's nothing. We're at a level of 3 million and an import penetration of '22, '23. Nothing has happened. We have to be more rigorous in terms of what we're doing.

這是什麼意思？巴西進口71.1萬噸，大部分來自中國。如果你把這個按年計算，那就沒什麼了。我們的人口水準為 300 萬，進口滲透率為「22、23」。什麼也沒發生。我們必須更加嚴格地對待我們正在做的事情。

In the United States, well, things are somewhat hyperbolic. They're at a different moment from us as a country. The demand did have problems in some sectors, theoretically impacted by high interest rates, a slowdown in construction, but we do have sectors that seem to be the exception. The automotive sector is doing very well, another important thing that is happening in the USA.

在美國，情況有些誇張。他們與我們國家處於不同的時刻。某些行業的需求確實存在問題，理論上受到高利率和建築業放緩的影響，但我們確實有一些行業似乎是例外。汽車產業表現非常好，這是美國正在發生的另一件重要事情。

Purchases are contained. Investors want to know what is the bottom of the well in terms of price. We're coming to a situation of stabilization. In January, it was $1,200 per ton. We're now down to $895, $910. We shouldn't have significant problems in price in the United States.

採購量已包含在內。投資者想知道價格的底部是什麼。我們正在走向穩定的局面。一月份的價格為每噸 1,200 美元。現在價格降至 895 美元、910 美元。我們在美國不應該遇到重大的價格問題。

At the USA plants, and this is interesting, I looked at the EBITDA. If you look at the difference, the operational difference, margins are doing very well, thank you, at 20%. The sector is profitable. It is being privileged by the government. There is national safety. The goal is full employability. There's Biden, the storing, and everything to work out as a pillar. The goal is the growth of the country.

在美國工廠，這很有趣，我檢查了 EBITDA。如果你看看差異，營運差異，利潤率表現非常好，謝謝，為 20%。該行業是盈利的。它受到政府的特權。有國家安全。目標是充分就業。有拜登、儲存以及所有需要解決的支柱。目標是國家的發展。

Now in Europe, it has been stable for some time. There was a discrete drop. The commercial defense measures were quite positive. Now to send BQ to Portugal, I pay anti-dumping of EUR53 and a sanction of EUR25. How to compete by employing people in Europe? You begin to question if this is correct. The world is closing down and we are completely different from other countries.

現在在歐洲，已經穩定了一段時間了。有一個離散的下降。商業防禦措施相當積極。現在要將 BQ 發送到葡萄牙，我需要支付 53 歐元的反傾銷費和 25 歐元的製裁費。在歐洲如何用人競爭？你開始質疑這是否正確。世界正在關閉，我們與其他國家完全不同。

In the case of Brazil, what is happening? In the first quarter, the demand was practically stable. Vis-a-vis the fourth quarter, we saw a official figure of $3.5 million. Annualized, it would be $14 million, 14.5 million, which was what we had last year.

就巴西而言，發生了什麼事？一季度，需求基本穩定。與第四季度相比，我們看到的官方數字為 350 萬美元。以年計算，這將是 1400 萬美元、1450 萬美元，這是我們去年的收入。

Now there has been a drop, I believe, in some exports. Unfortunately, this doesn't happen with the products that CSN has, where they have enormous capacity in China. They are coded products. Now in the Brazilian domestic market, the assembly plans are facing a very positive moment.

我認為現在一些出口有所下降。不幸的是，南航的產品並沒有發生這種情況，因為他們在中國擁有龐大的產能。它們是編碼產品。現在在巴西國內市場，組裝計畫正面臨著非常積極的時刻。

The second quarter, they forecast a growth that will be quite aggressive of 13%. Sales somewhat higher as they have good inventory. In sectors of distribution, 3%. These sectors linked to consumption, the white line and packaging, still very timid because consumers are holding back and we're holding back in the market.

他們預測第二季的成長將達到 13%，相當激進。由於庫存充足，銷售額略高。在分銷部門，3%。這些與消費、白線和包裝相關的行業仍然非常膽怯，因為消費者在猶豫，而我們在市場上也猶豫。

But I do not believe that the Brazilian market will close with figures lower than 2023. The CSN projection is to have a growth highly leveraged by civil construction. In the case of civil construction, we still have a carryover of launches of developments. We have launches in infrastructure by private initiative. We also have public works, of course, but they're not very significant. They're more sporadic and the confidence interest of civil construction is the highest compared to other chains.

但我不認為巴西市場的收盤數據會低於 2023 年。CSN 預測土木建築將實現成長。就土木建築而言，我們仍有開發案的結轉。我們透過私人倡議啟動了基礎設施建設。當然，我們也有公共工程，但它們並不是很重要。與其他連鎖店相比，它們更加分散，土木建築的信心利益最高。

With this scenario, to see what we can do, the cost iron ore of 115, 120 coal, 247. The real-dollar since the last call, BRL4.8 went to BRL5. And the BQ premium that I mentioned of 535, 545 compared to the nationalized import is 12% to 15%. So this premium is a limit basically to work with price corrections.

有了這個場景，看看我們能做什麼，鐵礦石成本115，煤炭120，247。自上次通話以來，實際美元匯率從 4.8 雷亞爾變為 5 雷亞爾。而我提到的535、545相對於國有化進口的BQ溢價是12%到15%。因此，這個溢價基本上是與價格調整配合使用的限制。

But at some point in time, in this second quarter, perhaps in the third quarter, because of these changes, we will have to make price corrections to make our margin somewhat more positive. The EBITDA margin and what we deliver in reais per ton that have had a great drop vis-a-vis the last two years. This is a scenario that we face in the Brazilian market, the great challenge for CSN.

但在某個時間點，在第二季度，也許在第三季度，由於這些變化，我們將不得不進行價格調整，以使我們的利潤率更加積極。與過去兩年相比，EBITDA 利潤率以及我們每噸交付的雷亞爾數量大幅下降。這是我們在巴西市場面臨的一個場景，對南航來說是一個巨大的挑戰。

And I have a limitation. I have to fight against the imported products. We have to fight with the weapons we have in-house. And in the products that CSN are losing market, 400,000, 350,000 a year, tin plates have dropped to half because of imports.

我有一個限制。我必須對抗進口產品。我們必須用我們內部擁有的武器進行戰鬥。而在CSN正在失去市場的產品中，每年40萬、35萬塊，鍍錫板由於進口已經減少到一半。

Besides everything I said about galvanized material, we do have problems with tin plates. And this was a process, a calculated anti-dumping with the in-local verification, and nothing has been done. There is no protection whatsoever. And CSN's request has been postponed.

除了我所說的有關鍍鋅材料的所有內容之外，我們確實存在鍍錫板的問題。這是一個過程，一個有計劃的反傾銷和當地核查，但什麼也沒做。沒有任何保護。而南航的請求已被延後。

So this is a scenario we face. We're going to continue producing volumes, working, as Benjamin says, at full steam, selling less for more, acting in different segments of industry, and we're ready to fight. We have no other way out but defend what we are producing. This is the scenario for Brazil.

這就是我們面臨的場景。我們將繼續大量生產，正如本傑明所說，全力以赴，以少賣多，在不同的行業領域開展業務，我們已經準備好戰鬥。我們沒有其他出路，只能捍衛我們正在生產的產品。這就是巴西的情況。

Thank you very much. So very clear. Thank you very much.

非常感謝。所以非常清楚。非常感謝。

Ricardo Monegaglia, Safra.

里卡多·莫內加利亞，薩夫拉。

I have two questions. The first, if you could share with us more details about which are the most obvious points to consolidate the cement industry in Brazil. And as part of these questions, if you could describe which is the process of analysis for investment at CSN, return on the cost of capital, the prior analysis, the minimum spread, and how that changes when we think about international companies. That is the first question.

我有兩個問題。首先，您能否與我們分享更多有關鞏固巴西水泥產業的最明顯要點的詳細資訊。作為這些問題的一部分，您能否描述一下 CSN 投資的分析流程、資本成本回報率、先前的分析、最小利差，以及當我們考慮國際公司時，這些變化是如何變化的。這是第一個問題。

The second question refers to the steel mill. The next two months, we'll have a pressure of imports. But if we could risk things and think of a more future outcome, if we can think about a margin recovery in your operation in Brazil. And which are the next main deliveries in the equipment refurbishment? Thank you for taking my questions.

第二個問題涉及鋼廠。未來兩個月，我們將面臨進口壓力。但是，如果我們可以冒險並考慮更多的未來結果，如果我們可以考慮您在巴西業務的利潤率恢復。設備翻新的下一步主要交付哪些？感謝您回答我的問題。

Hello, Ricardo. This is Edvaldo. Good afternoon. I will answer the first question. Regarding how to unleash value in cement, we have shown, as Benjamin said, the evolution of cement. That explains how the industry operates.

你好，里卡多。這是埃德瓦爾多。午安.我來回答第一個問題。關於如何釋放水泥的價值，正如本傑明所說，我們已經展示了水泥的演變。這解釋了該行業的運作方式。

There is a forecast of an increase of 2% in the market this year. We had a first quarter with the seasonality normal for the period, but April already shows a reaction towards a more positive volume. We're implementing all of the synergies that we can.

預計今年市場將成長2%。我們的第一季季節性正常，但四月已經顯示出對更積極的成交量的反應。我們正在盡可能發揮所有協同作用。

And of course, they came about with the acquisition of LafargeHolcim. We're integralizing all of the synergies in our results. So we're going to continue to reduce costs. We had a reduction of almost 20% this quarter, vis-a-vis the same quarter last year, which is very positive. We will continue to invest in this reduction. We're working towards it through management and operational efficiency.

當然，它們是隨著拉法基豪瑞的收購而產生的。我們正在將所有協同效應整合到我們的成果中。因此，我們將繼續降低成本。與去年同期相比，本季我們的收入減少了近 20%，這是非常積極的。我們將繼續投資於這項削減。我們正在透過管理和營運效率來實現這一目標。

It's very important to remark, and Martinez can add something. There's a fundamental point to unleash the value of the cement industry. This is price. The cement price is of around $70 per ton, while in South American countries, the price is not less than $120. In Europe, $140, $150. And in the US, prices of the same magnitude, in some regions reaching $180 per ton. So clearly, we have opportunities to reduce costs and enhance prices. This will be a fundamental issue to have more sound results. Martinez?

這是非常重要的評論，馬丁內斯可以補充一些內容。釋放水泥產業價值有一個根本點。這是價格。水泥價格在每噸70美元左右，而在南美國家，價格不低於120美元。在歐洲，140 美元、150 美元。而在美國，價格也有相同的幅度，部分地區達到每噸180美元。顯然，我們有機會降低成本並提高價格。這是取得更好成績的根本性問題。馬丁內斯？

Well, Ricardo? That was very good, Edvaldo. Well, in these businesses, like the businesses we work in, of course, operational excellence is the main pillar. As Benjamin says, we always have to be ready for a war. When you have a low cost, you may be the last to die. And this is what I think every day here and every moment, myself and Edvaldo, when thinking about cement.

嗯，里卡多？非常好，埃德瓦爾多。嗯，在這些企業中，就像我們工作的企業一樣，當然，卓越營運是主要支柱。正如本傑明所說，我們必須隨時做好戰爭準備。當你成本低的時候，你可能是最後一個死的。這就是我和艾德瓦多每天、每時每刻思考水泥時所想的。

I personally had a very pleasurable experience. Since we acquired LafargeHolcim, CSN has become a very important player in the market. We're a player that -- well, we had a very strong point. We worked in the retail market, in the package market. 80% was our business. Now, CSN works with bulk and inventories that are very favorable. And we're surfing a very beautiful wave, especially with concrete.

我個人有一次非常愉快的經驗。自從我們收購LafargeHolcim以來，CSN已經成為市場上非常重要的參與者。我們是一個——嗯，我們有一個非常強的點的球員。我們在零售市場、包裝市場工作。 80%是我們的事。現在，CSN 的批量和庫存合作非常優惠。我們正在一個非常美麗的波浪中衝浪，尤其是在混凝土上。

Concrete are growing in Brazil. Why? Because we have a great deal of works. What happened? We're also making the most of the growth of concrete and putting more bulk material into the market. In the first quarter, as Marcelo likes to say, we had price over volume. We had a drop in volume, but not more than the market, of course. And it was smart to do this and leverage the price so that EBITDA reached 26%.

巴西的混凝土正在成長。為什麼？因為我們有很多作品。發生了什麼事？我們也充分利用混凝土的成長，並將更多散裝材料投入市場。在第一季度，正如馬塞洛喜歡說的那樣，我們的價格超過了數量。當然，我們的成交量有所下降，但幅度並沒有超過市場。這樣做並利用價格槓桿是明智之舉，使 EBITDA 達到 26%。

We clearly perceive that one of the levers is fundamental, as Edvaldo said. Cement is very sensitive. The price-volume ratio in cement is exponential. It's difficult not to work with that variable. So CSN, in the last few years, has always been doing the same. We have good product, bulk product, packaged product. We're in the concrete chain. We're not going to buy a concrete company. Our business is cement. We want to work with the end user. We have 20,000 clients registered. We sell regularly to 12,000 clients every month.

正如埃德瓦爾多所說，我們清楚地認識到其中一個槓桿是根本性的。水泥非常敏感。水泥的價量比是指數級的。不使用該變數是很困難的。所以南航在過去的幾年裡，一直在做同樣的事情。我們有好的產品、散裝產品、包裝產品。我們處於具體的鏈條中。我們不會收購一家混凝土公司。我們的業務是水泥。我們希望與最終用戶合作。我們有 20,000 名註冊客戶。我們每月定期向 12,000 名客戶銷售產品。

Now, this leaves us in a more comfortable position in terms of fragmentation. Operational excellence, mentioned by Edvaldo, is fundamental. Our plans have costs that are somewhat lower than the market. I'm saying something risky, perhaps. And insofar as possible, we're being more aggressive commercially, also in terms of market share and price. So this is our strategy. This is how we unharness value in cement. This has been an emblematic place that we have had in the last year because of the acquisition of LafargeHolcim. Thank you.

現在，這讓我們在碎片化方面處於更舒適的位置。艾德瓦爾多提到，卓越營運是根本。我們的計劃的成本略低於市場。也許我說的是有風險的話。在可能的範圍內，我們在商業上更加積極主動，在市場份額和價格方面也是如此。這就是我們的策略。這就是我們釋放水泥價值的方式。由於去年收購了拉法基豪瑞 (LafargeHolcim)，這成為我們去年獲得的一個具有像徵意義的地方。謝謝。

Very good. Thank you very much. I don't know if I could repeat the second question for the steel mill very quickly.

非常好。非常感謝。我不知道我是否可以很快向鋼廠重複第二個問題。

I did keep your question here, Ricardo. I haven't forgotten it. Now, how do we increase profitability and the margin in the steel mill? Two simple things, lowering the cost and increasing the price. An important thing, and Benjamin also mentioned this, we were using more plates produced. We insist on operational excellence. Unfortunately, and the bar that Benjamin raises is always very high, sometimes we're very critical day after day.

我確實把你的問題留在這裡了，里卡多。我沒有忘記它。現在，我們如何提高鋼廠的獲利能力和利潤率？兩件簡單的事情，降低成本和提高價格。重要的是，本傑明也提到了這一點，我們使用了更多生產的印版。我們堅持卓越營運。不幸的是，本傑明提出的標準總是很高，有時我們日復一日地挑剔。

But the truth is that we're looking at higher numbers, very ambitious numbers. This is not what happened in other quarters. I have participated in other processes with greater volumes in the company. So our bar is very high. I believe that in the second half of the year, we will harvest results from the cost of plates. The cost of plates is still prohibitive. We're speaking of BRL3,400. Nowadays, the plate market, to give you an idea, and I'm looking at what is happening, we can buy slab or plate at BRL610, BRL625. We can buy from China. Well, not to think about China, but from Vietnam, BRL580, BRL590. These are very attractive prices, and we're going to have to use them while our excellence has not been concluded.

但事實是，我們正在尋找更高的數字，非常雄心勃勃的數字。這在其他方面並沒有發生過。我參與過公司其他數量較多的流程。所以我們的門檻非常高。相信下半年我們會從板材成本上收穫成果。板材的成本仍然令人望而卻步。我們說的是 3,400 雷亞爾。如今，板材市場，給你一個想法，我正在關注正在發生的事情，我們可以以 BRL610、BRL625 的價格購買板坯或板材。我們可以從中國購買。好吧，不要考慮中國，而是越南，580雷亞爾，590雷亞爾。這些價格非常有吸引力，在我們的卓越表現尚未結束時我們將不得不使用它們。

Alexandre Lyra has worked on this to ensure that we can charge BRL3,000 per ton. It's what we desire for the year. And in the near future, we should go on to higher competitiveness quartiles as we had in the past.

Alexandre Lyra 致力於此，確保我們可以收取每噸 3,000 雷亞爾的價格。這是我們今年的願望。在不久的將來，我們應該會像過去一樣繼續保持更高的競爭力。

Regarding price, it's inevitable in the second half of the year to think of a price recomposition if we continue with the situation of iron ore, which has a pressure coal 250 to 140, and the premium at 12%. Regardless of the premium, we are going to have to make a price correction, and what we have done day after day is to work in the mix.

價格方面，如果繼續維持鐵礦石壓煤250-140，升水12%的情況，下半年不可避免的會考慮價格重組。無論溢價如何，我們都必須進行價格調整，而我們日復一日所做的就是在混合中工作。

As the mix of Brazil became impoverished because of the invasion of coded and galvanized product, we're buying more BQ material of low added value as part of this earthquake. We're trying to recompose volume, recompose the use of tin plates. I believe that in the second half of the year, you will be able to see more positive margins vis-a-vis the first and second quarters.

由於編碼和鍍鋅產品的入侵，巴西的產品組合變得貧困，作為這次地震的一部分，我們購買了更多低附加價值的 BQ 材料。我們正在嘗試重新組合體積，重新組合馬口鐵的使用。我相信，與第一季和第二季相比，今年下半年您將能夠看到更多的正利潤率。

As Benjamin mentioned, our measures are on the right path. They have the right intensity. It's simply a matter of time, and this will happen in the second half of the year. That would be the solution for margin. Thank you.

正如本傑明所說，我們的措施是正確的。他們有合適的強度。這只是時間問題，這將在下半年發生。這將是保證金的解決方案。謝謝。

That was very clear. Thank you.

這非常清楚。謝謝。

Marcio Farid, Goldman Sachs.

馬西奧·法里德，高盛。

Two follow-ups here. Benjamin and Martinez both spoke about how the US has dealt with the industry better than what has been done in Brazil. My question is, which is your appetite to carry out those investments that you mentioned previously to gain greater exposure in the USA via steel mills, and how do the recent events change this perception?

這裡有兩個後續行動。班傑明和馬丁內斯都談到美國在該行業的處理方式比巴西更好。我的問題是，您對進行您之前提到的那些投資以透過鋼廠在美國獲得更大的曝光度有何興趣，最近發生的事件如何改變這種看法？

The second question about your CapEx execution, it was somewhat weak this quarter. The trend is to increase this throughout the year, as you do historically. What is happening with P15? What we saw this quarter, this suggests a reduction in the pace, and Benjamin said you are disappointed with a delay in the ramp-up of steel plant. If you could speak about the timing, are you more delayed than what was expected? And if you have any visibility on this. Thank you very much.

關於您的資本支出執行的第二個問題，本季有點疲軟。趨勢是全年都會增加這一數量，就像歷史上一樣。P15 發生了什麼事？我們在本季看到的情況表明，這表明步伐有所放緩，本傑明表示，您對鋼廠產能的延遲感到失望。如果您能談談時間安排，您是否比預期延遲了更多？如果您對此有任何了解。非常感謝。

Hello, Marcio. This is Martinez, and then I will give the floor to Benjamin. Speaking about the US, we have no intention of putting the company in greater deleverage. Leverage is an order, and we comply with orders here. We don't question them. That issue of delivering is goal number one for the company.

你好，馬西奧。我是馬丁內斯，然後我將請本傑明發言。說到美國，我們無意進一步去槓桿。槓桿就是命令，我們這裡就遵守命令。我們不質疑他們。交付問題是公司的首要目標。

On the other hand, in the US, luckily, we have complied with the quotas that we have there. They're not minor quotas. We would like to have others. We're fighting for higher quotas in tin plates. The quota is 10,000 tons per year. The American market today lacks the supply of tin plates because of the closure of some plants.

另一方面，幸運的是，在美國，我們遵守了那裡的配額。它們不是小配額。我們希望有其他人。我們正在爭取更高的馬口鐵配額。配額為每年1萬噸。由於一些工廠的關閉，今天的美國市場缺乏鍍錫板的供應。

Now, in terms of galvanizing pre-painted products, we're working towards making our portfolio more attractive for the end client and to work spot. We want to be a true local player, so today we're looking at investments that are relatively of low cost, high return.

現在，在鍍鋅預塗漆產品方面，我們正在努力使我們的產品組合對最終客戶和工作場所更具吸引力。我們希望成為真正的本土企業，所以今天我們正在尋找相對低成本、高回報的投資。

Service centers, where instead of selling the coil, we can sell the cut materials and sell lower portions galvanized steel. Something that a player would do in the American market. In the US, the initial appetite now would be to consolidate the quotas we have and have a better walk-in into this quota to get more value from the portfolio. That is for the United States.

服務中心，我們可以出售切割材料並出售下部鍍鋅鋼，而不是出售捲材。玩家在美國市場會做的事情。在美國，現在的最初願望是鞏固我們擁有的配額，並更好地進入該配額，以從投資組合中獲得更多價值。那是針對美國而言的。

Benjamin, I don't know if you would like to add something.

班傑明，我不知道你是否願意補充一些東西。

I would like to say regarding the USA that perhaps is different from what it is from investments in Brazil, where mandatorily we have to respect the leverage and not surpass our commitment in the United States and Europe. Something different is happening. They are more advanced than we are in terms of decarbonizing and clean energy as part of the plan of $1.5 trillion of the Biden government. Well, we went after this and perceived they have destined BRL150 billion for investments that contemplate decarbonizing and clean energy, which is something completely atypical to speak about investments with subsidized interest rates in Brazil. This doesn't exist.

我想說的是，關於美國，這可能與在巴西的投資不同，在巴西，我們必須尊重槓桿，不得超越我們在美國和歐洲的承諾。一些不同的事情正在發生。作為拜登政府1.5兆美元計劃的一部分，他們在脫碳和清潔能源方面比我們更先進。好吧，我們對此進行了追踪，發現他們指定了 1500 億雷亞爾用於考慮脫碳和清潔能源的投資，這對於巴西的利率補貼投資來說是完全不尋常的。這個不存在。

Now, to speak about these investments, this is difficult to explain for Brazil, these loss funds. I mean, it's what's happening in the USA and Europe in capital intensive industries with the potential of enhancing their performance environmentally. So in the US, we are structuring investments. We want to make the most of this opportunity that the government is offering industries that want to invest in decarbonizing and clean energy.

現在，要談論這些投資，這對巴西來說很難解釋這些損失資金。我的意思是，這就是美國和歐洲資本密集產業正在發生的事情，這些產業有潛力提高其環保績效。因此，在美國，我們正在建立投資。我們希望充分利用政府為想要投資脫碳和清潔能源的產業提供的機會。

We knew that this existed in Europe. We saw decent proof receiving EUR2.5 million to go on to an electric furnace instead of a high furnace. SAB received 3 billion. Well, the government gave 30 billion as a loss fund to the industry. In the US, it is 150 billion. We're trying to fit into that and do something impactful because there's the financing lines at lower interest rates. So we're incredibly interested in investments, especially in the USA, contemplating these funding lines we do not have in Brazil.

我們知道這種情況存在於歐洲。我們看到了不錯的證據，收到了 250 萬歐元，繼續使用電爐而不是高爐。SAB獲得30億美元。那麼政府給了這個產業300億作為損失基金。在美國，這個數字是1500億。我們正在努力適應這一點並做一些有影響力的事情，因為有較低利率的融資額度。因此，我們對投資非常感興趣，尤其是在美國，考慮到我們在巴西沒有的這些融資額度。

We have a long steel project for the USA. We're going to eventually move this to flat steel and do something here as far -- as long as it is part of that program that exists in the USA. So we're devoting a great deal of time seeking alternatives for investments in the USA. Because of the effect of capital, they are self-justified. Now, this is a priority that we have when it comes to investments in activities that are similar to those we have in Brazil.

我們有一個針對美國的長期鋼鐵計畫。我們最終將把它轉移到扁鋼上，並在這裡做一些事情——只要它是美國現有計劃的一部分。因此，我們投入大量時間尋找在美國的投資替代方案。因為資本的作用，他們是自圓其說的。現在，這是我們在投資與巴西類似的活動時的優先事項。

Well, thank you. If you could speak about CapEx P15 and the moment of the steel plant. Thank you.

嗯，謝謝。如果您能談談資本支出 P15 和鋼鐵廠的時刻。謝謝。

Who is going to speak? Marco?

誰來發言？馬可？

I can do that, Benjamin.

我能做到，班傑明。

Very well. You can do so. Thank you.

很好。你可以這樣做。謝謝。

Marcio, thank you for the question. The CapEx, as we mentioned during the presentation, we do have a challenge of values that are above those of last year to invest in 2024. There is seasonality in CapEx connected to the way that CSN approves and disburses CapEx. Half was invested in the fourth quarter last year, and it is higher than the same quarter the previous year, showing that quarter on quarter, we will invest more.

馬西奧，謝謝你的提問。正如我們在演示中提到的，資本支出確實面臨 2024 年投資價值高於去年的挑戰。資本支出存在季節性，這與 CSN 批准和支付資本支出的方式有關。去年第四季投資了一半，比去年同季高，說明季度環比，我們會投資更多。

Regarding the CapEx for the year, we can see that this is feasible, feasible to reach the goal until the end of the year. Another way to disemburse CapEx is to work on the company's cash management to accompany the company's results during the year, cash generation, or make adjustments in CapEx. But what was announced for the company as a trend for the year will be maintained. If a novelty should arise, we will, of course, announce it in a timely fashion.

關於今年的資本支出，我們可以看到這是可行的，可以實現到年底的目標。支付資本支出的另一種方法是進行公司的現金管理，以配合公司年內的業績、現金產生或對資本支出進行調整。但該公司宣布的今年趨勢將會維持下去。如果出現新情況，我們當然會及時宣布。

Well, thank you.

嗯，謝謝。

And about the steel mill, a question you asked, looking at 2024 and the longer term, the investments in PV last year represented the highest in the last eight years. This year, we're going to make the same investment, a record investment in UPV, somewhat higher than the previous year. And of course, getting the positive results of all of the investments made so far. Now, these investments, along with a discussion of raw material, shows the effect will be more concentrated in the second half of the year. But month after month, we look at the results of these investments already made.

關於鋼鐵廠，你問的一個問題，從2024年和更長遠來看，去年光電投資是過去八年來最高的。今年，我們將進行同樣的投資，創紀錄地對 UPV 進行投資，比去年有所增加。當然，迄今為止所有的投資都取得了積極的成果。現在，這些投資以及對原材料的討論表明，其影響將更加集中在今年下半年。但月復一月，我們都會審視這些已經進行的投資的結果。

Our next question is in writing from Carolina Heimerman. Any comment on the acquisition of InterCement?

我們的下一個問題是卡羅萊納·海默曼以書面形式提出的。對收購InterCement有何評論？

Very well. We had a material fact a few days ago. We are celebrating discussions with the seller, of course, and with the main stakeholders of InterCement. We have until July to conclude these negotiations. At this point in time, we have no concrete fact that we can present to investors, but of course, they will all be communicated appropriately at the right time. We continue to evolve in our interaction, and this is an acquisition of great interest for the group.

很好。幾天前我們有一個重大事實。當然，我們正在慶祝與賣方以及 InterCement 的主要利益相關者的討論。我們必須在七月之前完成這些談判。目前，我們還沒有具體的事實可以向投資者介紹，但當然，我們都會在適當的時候進行適當的溝通。我們在互動中不斷發展，這是該集團非常感興趣的收購。

(Operator Instructions) The question-and-answer session has ended. We would like to return the floor to Mr. Marco Rabello, CFO, for his closing remarks. You can proceed, sir.

（操作員說明）問答環節已結束。我們請財務長 Marco Rabello 先生發表閉幕詞。您可以繼續了，先生。

Well, thank you all for your attendance at our results call for the first-quarter '24. With us and the presentation for the first quarter, I wish you all a very good weekend.

好的，感謝大家參加我們 24 年第一季的業績電話會議。透過我們和第一季的演示，我祝大家週末愉快。

The CSN earnings result has just ended. We wish you a very good day.

CSN財報剛結束。我們祝福您有個愉快的一天。