Companhia Siderurgica Nacional SA (SID) 2025 Q3 法說會逐字稿

(interpreted) Good morning, and thank you for waiting. Welcome to CSN's conference call to present the results for the third quarter of 2025. Today with us are the company's executive officers. We would like to inform you that this event is being recorded. (Operator Instructions) Today's event is also available on CSN's Investor Relations website at ri.csn.com.br, where the presentation can be found. A replay of this call will be available shortly after its conclusion.

（翻譯）早安，感謝您的耐心等待。歡迎參加 CSN 的電話會議，本次會議將介紹 2025 年第三季的業績。今天和我們在一起的是公司的高階主管。我們謹此通知您，本次活動正在錄影。（操作說明）今天的活動也可在 CSN 的投資者關係網站 ri.csn.com.br 上找到，簡報也已發布。本次通話結束後不久即可收聽錄音。

Before moving on, we would like to clarify that any forward-looking statements made during this conference call are based on the beliefs and assumptions of CSN's management and on information currently available to the company. Such statements involve risks, uncertainties and assumptions as they relate to future events and depend on circumstances that may or may not occur. Actual events may differ due to factors such as general economic conditions in Brazil and other countries, interest and exchange rate levels, future renegotiations or prepayment of obligations of foreign currency-denominated credits, tariffs in the US, Brazil, and other countries, changes in laws and regulations and general competitive factors on a global, regional or national level.

在繼續之前，我們想澄清一下，本次電話會議中所做的任何前瞻性陳述都是基於 CSN 管理層的信念和假設以及公司目前可獲得的資訊。此類聲明涉及風險、不確定性和假設，因為它們與未來事件有關，並且取決於可能發生也可能不會發生的情況。實際情況可能因巴西和其他國家的整體經濟狀況、利率和匯率水準、未來以外幣計價信貸義務的重新談判或提前償還、美國、巴西和其他國家關稅、法律法規的變化以及全球、區域或國家層面的總體競爭因素等因素而有所不同。

Now we'll turn the floor to Mr. Marco Rabello, Chief Financial Officer and Investor Relations Officer, who will present CSN's operational and financial highlights for the period. Mr. Rabello, you may go on.

現在，我們將把發言權交給財務長兼投資者關係長馬可·拉貝洛先生，他將介紹 CSN 在此期間的營運和財務亮點。拉貝洛先生，您可以繼續了。

(interpreted) Good morning, everyone. Thanks for joining us at another conference call of CSN. Today, we are here to talk about the performance of the third-quarter '25, a very special quarter, where we can see a better performance of the company in the whole of the year with historical operational records being hit, showing the CSN's continued strong in terms of efficiency, operational efficiency, but as committed to operational financial strictness and reaching results.

（翻譯）大家早安。感謝您參加CSN的另一次電話會議。今天，我們來談談 2025 年第三季度的業績，這是一個非常特殊的季度，我們可以看到公司全年業績有所提升，創下了歷史運營記錄，這表明 CSN 在效率和運營效率方面繼續保持強勁勢頭，同時致力於嚴格的財務運營和取得業績。

In a movement that had credit as the main topic, the company continued with a diversified operation able to extract results from different sectors of the economy, ensuring resilience and showing the strength of the group. As we see in the highlights of slide number 2, CSN was able to expand sales volume in all its segments of operation, and it had an accurate strategy commercially in the period and strong cost controls that drove results in this quarter. Therefore, CSN reached growth of 26% in EBITDA with BRL3.3 billion and EBITDA margin of 27%, a quarter-on-quarter growth of 330 bps points.

在以信貸為主題的運動中，該公司繼續進行多元化經營，能夠從不同的經濟部門獲取成果，從而確保韌性並展現集團的實力。正如我們在第 2 張幻燈片的亮點中所看到的，CSN 在其所有業務部門都實現了銷售量的增長，並且在這一時期內，它擁有準確的商業戰略和強有力的成本控制，從而推動了本季度的業績。因此，CSN 的 EBITDA 成長了 26%，達到 33 億雷亞爾，EBITDA 利潤率為 27%，較上季成長了 330 個基點。

That was also the third consecutive quarter where the company showed a drop in its leverage ratio, reaching 3.1x in the period compared to the 3.5x in the end of last year. That shows the financial discipline and the group's strong capital structure.

這也是該公司連續第三個季度槓桿率下降，本季達到 3.1 倍，而去年年底為 3.5 倍。這體現了該集團的財務紀律和穩健的資本結構。

Going to mining, another period of historical record, showing that the company is extracting more efficiency in logistics and its production capacity. That was the first time in history that CSN was able to ship more than 12 million tons with sales volume 5% above that of the previous quarter. In a quarter, we had growth showing the improvements in efficiency.

進入採礦業，又有一段歷史記錄表明，該公司正在提高物流效率和生產能力。這是CSN史上首次實現出貨量超過1,200萬噸，銷售量比上一季成長5%。本季度我們實現了成長，這表明效率有所提高。

In terms of costs and expenses, performance was equally positive with dilution of fixed costs and a better freight strategy, optimizing the operations results. we control things, everything is running as smooth as possible. But it's also true in the site that we don't control, price dynamics. The third quarter had an increase in iron ore prices, which led us to a growth of 57% in EBITDA in the quarter with more than BRL1.9 billion generated and gross margin of 44%.

就成本和費用而言，由於固定成本的降低和更優的貨運策略，營運績效同樣表現良好，營運結果也得到了優化。我們掌控一切，所有環節都在盡可能順利地運作。但網站上的價格波動也是我們無法控制的。第三季鐵礦石價格上漲，帶動該季度 EBITDA 成長 57%，營收超過 19 億雷亞爾，毛利率為 44%。

And still, we had a change in commercial strategy that led to an expansion in 4.4% of sales in the period. We've been very accurate in our commercial strategy and the market is very much pressured by the coming of imported material and the disputes in the local market.

儘管如此，我們的商業策略發生了變化，導致該時期銷售額成長了 4.4%。我們的商業策略非常精準，但進口原材料的湧入和本地市場的糾紛給市場帶來了巨大的壓力。

Last quarter, CSN stood out as the only company that was able to show growth of freight and EBITDA in a very adverse scenario. This strategy has a temporary effect, and therefore, we redirected routes to increase our sales channels. Therefore, the expansion of volume in still pressured market with record penetration of imported materials show the group's commercial strength and that steel consumption is still resilient in the country.

上個季度，在非常不利的情況下，CSN 是唯一一家能夠實現貨運量和 EBITDA 成長的公司。這種策略只能產生暫時的效果，因此，我們調整了路線以增加銷售管道。因此，在進口材料滲透率創紀錄、市場依然承壓的情況下，銷量卻實現了成長，這表明該集團具有強大的商業實力，也顯示該國的鋼鐵消費仍然具有韌性。

The best highlight in the period with regards to steel comes from costs. We had the lowest cost of steel production in the last four years, showing that the company is extracting better results in its industrial strategy, operating at full capacity, and optimizing its inputs. It's still early to say that the worst has passed, but it's the first time in a long while that we are seeing a better prospect for the steel industry as a whole. We are seeing a recovery of prices exported from China, then a lower import in the Brazilian spot market, and the first antidumping measure approved most recently. That favors the price dynamics for the future, enabling the necessary margin recovery for local producers.

這段時期鋼鐵業最大的亮點在​​於成本。在過去的四年裡，我們的鋼鐵生產成本最低，這表明公司在產業戰略方面取得了更好的成果，實現了滿載運轉，並優化了投入。現在說最糟糕的時期已經過去還為時過早，但這卻是很長一段時間以來，我們第一次看到整個鋼鐵業的前景有所改善。我們看到中國出口價格回升，巴西現貨市場進口下降，最近又批准了第一個反傾銷措施。這有利於未來的價格走勢，使本地生產商能夠恢復必要的利潤空間。

In the cement market, the quarter was also of historical results. The market has been very resilient, especially considering the high interest rates of the country. You can see that cement consumption grew this year, and the company was able to capture the favorable dynamics with a very right commercial strategy. And this quarter is a growth in sales and price increase.

水泥市場本季也取得了歷史性業績。考慮到該國的高利率，市場表現出了很強的韌性。你可以看到，今年水泥消費量有所成長，而該公司憑藉著非常正確的商業策略，抓住了這個有利的市場動態。本季銷售額成長，價格上漲。

With that, we had the second largest sales volume in CSN's history with more than 3.6 million tons sold and an operation increasingly efficient in terms of cost. These are the competitive advantages of the business, combining verticalization, fantastic mineral reserves, logistic network, low energy consumption and a good portfolio of products.

由此，我們實現了 CSN 史上第二高的銷售量，銷售量超過 360 萬噸，在成本方面營運效率越來越高。該企業的競爭優勢在於：垂直整合、豐富的礦產資源、完善的物流網絡、低能耗以及良好的產品組合。

All this performance led to the highest EBITDA in cement in CSN's history. BRL388 million this quarter, with EBITDA margin of 29%, way above the average of the sector. Finally, but not less important, we have the bottom part of the slide, another record reached in the quarter in the Logistics segment that showed an important driver for the group. This quarter, we had the highest volume of freight and cargo on our highway network -- railway network with record EBITDA of BRL550 million and an EBITDA margin above the 35%. That shows that this will unlock the value of assets with a new vehicle that concentrates the strategy for infrastructure, monetizing part of this amount.

所有這些業績使 CSN 水泥業務的 EBITDA 創下歷史新高。本季獲利3.88億雷亞爾，EBITDA利潤率為29%，遠高於產業平均。最後，但同樣重要的是，我們來看投影片的下半部分，物流部門在本季創下了另一項紀錄，這表明該部門是集團的重要驅動力。本季度，我們的公路網貨運量和鐵路網貨運量均創歷史新高，EBITDA 達到創紀錄的 5.5 億雷亞爾，EBITDA 利潤率超過 35%。這表明，這將透過一種新的工具釋放資產價值，該工具集中了基礎設施策略，並將其中一部分資金貨幣化。

On the right, we have the segment of energy that continues to benefit from the favorable market. This year, we had a low energy availability to be traded, but still the segment generated BRL54 million EBITDA with a margin of 35%. In short, we can see on the slide all the operational excellence experience with record production sales in mining, lower production costs in steel, and the best EBITDA in history in both cement and logistics. So stronger operation positioning CSN at a different level in terms of management and efficiency.

右側是持續受益於有利市場環境的能源板塊。今年，我們可供交易的能源供應量較低，但該業務板塊仍創造了 5,400 萬巴西雷亞爾的 EBITDA，利潤率為 35%。簡而言之，我們可以從幻燈片中看到所有卓越的營運經驗，包括採礦業創紀錄的產量銷售、鋼鐵業較低的生產成本，以及水泥和物流業史上最佳的 EBITDA。因此，CSN 的營運實力更強，在管理和效率方面處於不同的水平。

Going on to the next slide. Here, we show our EBITDA and EBITDA margin for the third-quarter '25. Here, we can see the best result for the year with BRL3.3 billion in EBITDA with a margin of almost 27%. On the right, it shows the contribution of mining this quarter with stronger volumes and better prices. In addition, we can see the contributions that were important in cement and logistics. So it's important to have a diverse operation that can show more resilience and also offset some one-time pressures in some markets.

接下來是下一張投影片。這裡，我們展示的是 2025 年第三季的 EBITDA 和 EBITDA 利潤率。在這裡，我們可以看到今年的最佳業績，EBITDA 為 33 億雷亞爾，利潤率接近 27%。右側圖表顯示了本季採礦業的貢獻，產量更高，價格更好。此外，我們還可以看到水泥和物流領域的重要貢獻。因此，擁有多元化的業務非常重要，這樣可以展現更強的韌性，也能抵銷某些市場中的一次性壓力。

On the next slide, we show our activities in terms of investments. Here, we can see growth of 7.8% compared to the previous quarter, reflecting our efforts to maintain a high level of execution in our operations and operational records observed in the period, particularly the projects for the modernization of the company and better efficiency in our projects such as the P15 project.

下一張投影片，我們將展示我們在投資方面的活動。與上一季相比，我們可以看到成長了 7.8%，這反映了我們為維持營運和營運記錄的高水準執行力所做的努力，特別是公司現代化項目和提高項目效率的項目，例如 P15 項目。

Going to the next slide, slide number 5. Here, we show our net working capital. So here, we can see an increase of 13% this quarter compared to the previous quarter, reflecting more accuracy commercially speaking, in the period with an impact in accounts receivable. In addition to a reduction in the supplier line, due to the settlement of the forfeiting operations.

接下來是下一張投影片，第5張投影片。這裡展示的是我們的淨營運資本。因此，我們可以看到本季比上一季成長了 13%，這反映出在商業上更加準確，並對應收帳款產生了影響。由於沒收款項的結算，供應商線也減少了。

On the next slide, we show our adjusted cash flow that was negative at BRL815 million in third-quarter '25, which was better than the BRL1.4 billion negative of the previous period, but still a result that reflects the negative effect of financial expenses due to high interest rates and investment activities, and consumption of working capital. On the next slide, we show our net debt and leverage, and also the behavior of our net debt along the quarter.

下一張投影片顯示了我們 2025 年第三季調整後的現金流為負 8.15 億雷亞爾，雖然比上一季的負 14 億雷亞爾有所好轉，但仍然反映了高利率和投資活動導致的財務費用以及營運資金消耗的負面影響。下一張投影片展示了我們的淨債務和槓桿率，以及本季淨債務的變化。

As we can see on the left, the main message here is a reduction of leverage in the period with 10 basis points negative, going from 3.4% in the previous quarter to the 3.1x that we have this quarter, showing that the company has been able to align cash efficiency to record results, maximizing sales volumes, controlling costs, and increasing efficiency. In addition, it's important to show the efforts that management has been engaging to reduce indebtedness with leverage descending quarter on quarter towards the guidance that we provided at the end of last year for this year, even with all the adverse scenario in terms of interest rate, financial expenses, and exchange rate fluctuation.

從左側可以看出，主要訊息是本季槓桿率下降了 10 個基點，從上一季的 3.4% 降至本季度的 3.1 倍，這表明公司已能夠將現金效率與創紀錄的業績相匹配，最大限度地提高銷售量，控製成本，並提高效率。此外，值得一提的是，管理階層一直在努力降低債務，槓桿率逐季下降，朝著我們去年年底給出的今年業績指引邁進，即便利率、財務費用和匯率波動等情況都十分不利。

Also important to highlight is that deleveraging is organic without considering capital recycling projects that we are going to have for the future and that have the potential to reduce our leverage even faster. On the right, we see that net debt was impacted this quarter by negative cash flow, as I mentioned before, and the impact of the dividend payout.

還需要強調的是，去槓桿化是一個自然的過程，沒有考慮到我們未來將要進行的資本再利用項目，這些項目有可能更快地降低我們的槓桿率。如前所述，右側數據顯示，本季淨債務受到負現金流和股利支付的影響。

Going to the next slide, slide number 8, we show our indebtedness profile. So we can see that we continue at a very comfortable position vis-a-vis our short- and midterm obligations with BRL18.8 billion, an amount practically stable compared to the previous quarter and efficiency to cover our debt in the next three years. In addition, we continue to have active management to elongate amortization flows, working with the local capital market. In the quarter, the company had new funding and renegotiated bilateral contracts, extending amortization flows until 2030.

接下來是第 8 張投影片，我們將展示我們的負債狀況。因此我們可以看到，我們目前在短期和中期債務方面處於非常有利的地位，債務總額為 188 億雷亞爾，與上一季相比基本上保持穩定，足以在未來三年內償還債務。此外，我們繼續積極管理，與當地資本市場合作，延長攤銷期。本季度，該公司獲得了新的資金，並重新談判了雙邊合同，將攤銷期延長至 2030 年。

With that, we conclude our consolidated results, and we are going to move on now to slide number 10. Here, we show the highlights for the steel segment. On the first slide, we have the results of our commercial activity. So you see an increase of 4.4% in sales in the quarter, showing the change in the commercial strategy for the period, with the company implementing a more competitive attitude to return to competitive levels. The strategy that we had before a prioritized results and not volumes generated expected results, but it has a limited effect.

至此，我們的綜合業績報告就結束了，現在我們將進入第 10 張投影片。這裡，我們展示鋼鐵業的亮點。第一張投影片展示了我們的商業活動成果。因此，本季銷售額成長了 4.4%，這表明公司在本季的商業策略發生了變化，公司採取了更具競爭力的態度，以恢復到競爭水平。我們先前的策略優先考慮結果而不是數量，雖然產生了預期的結果，但效果有限。

So now it's important to resume volumes that shows that the market continues resilient and with a good level of steel consumption and especially in the domestic market. However, the market continues with high competition and a record of penetration of imported material.

因此，現在重要的是恢復銷量，這表明市場仍然具有韌性，鋼鐵消費水平良好，尤其是在國內市場。然而，市場競爭依然激烈，進口材料的滲透率也居高不下。

So how difficult it is to compete without the protection? As for the foreign market, we see a recovery of sales in the period, but still below historical results, given the difficulties to export in the context of tariff disputes and application of antidumping measures. On the next slide, when we talk about steel production, we show that the drop quarter on quarter and year on year is a consequence of the shutdown for the maintenance of blast furnace 2. It has not really hurt the performance of the company, quite the opposite.

那麼，如果沒有這種保護，競爭會有多困難？至於國外市場，我們看到該時期銷售額有所回升，但鑑於關稅爭端和反傾銷措施實施導致出口困難，仍低於歷史水準。在下一張投影片中，當我們談到鋼鐵產量時，我們會指出季度環比和年度同比下降是由於 2 號高爐停產檢修造成的。這並沒有真正損害公司的業績，恰恰相反。

If you go to the right of the slide, you see that the production costs decreased this quarter, reaching the lowest level of the four years, which reflects an increased efficiency in the production process, better optimization of raw materials, and better combustion process. Performance per ton had a drop this quarter, basically because of the lower prices in the period, which offset the production dynamic of costs and volumes. When you look at the annual comparison, we see solid growth of 22% in performance per ton.

如果你看向幻燈片的右側，你會發現本季生產成本下降，達到四年來的最低水平，這反映出生產過程效率的提高、原材料的更好優化以及燃燒過程的改善。本季每噸產量有所下降，主要是因為本季價格走低，抵銷了成本和產量方面的生產動態變化。從年度比較來看，每噸性能實現了 22% 的穩健成長。

Now we are going to go to financial performance of Steel works on slide 12, and we can see the impact of the price reduction had on revenues for the period. Even with the drop in prices below average price, it is hard to compete in a very hostile environment with record penetration of imported materials with prices that are subsidized and get to the Brazilian market. That shows the importance of having protective measures to have a better economy for local producers. But in addition to a pressure in prices, all the indicators controlled by the company are getting better.

現在我們將查看第 12 張幻燈片，了解鋼鐵廠的財務業績，我們可以看到降價對該期間收入的影響。即使價格降至平均價格以下，在進口材料價格享受補貼並湧入巴西市場的極其惡劣的環境下，也很難與之競爭。這表明採取保護措施對於改善當地生產者的經濟狀況至關重要。但除了價格壓力之外，公司控制的所有指標都在好轉。

CSN are having better efficiency in the production process, an operation that is increasing efficiency and that shows operational improvements when we compare to the results of 2024. In this context, important to mention all the adverse scenario, CSN is delivering EBITDA better than '24 and still is an important driver for growth this year. Now going to mining. On Slide 14, we show production and sales this quarter. So here, we can see two extraordinary results.

CSN 的生產流程效率更高，與 2024 年的結果相比，營運效率不斷提高，營運方面也取得了改善。在此背景下，值得一提的是，儘管存在各種不利情況，CSN 的 EBITDA 仍優於 2024 年，並且仍然是今年成長的重要驅動力。現在要去挖礦了。第 14 張投影片展示了本季的生產和銷售情況。所以在這裡，我們可以看到兩個非凡的結果。

The first is record production, the highest volume ever in the history of the company, which shows operational efficiency that the company is reaching in recent months, both in mines but also in the logistics chain as a whole. Then we have record sales with the highest volume in history and the first time that the company exceeded 12 million tons in a single quarter, which highlights the significant efficiency in production with the company with a tear of 4 million tons shipped in a single month for the first time.

首先是創紀錄的產量，這是公司歷史上最高的產量，這表明該公司近幾個月來在礦山以及整個物流鏈方面都達到了營運效率的水平。然後，我們創下了銷售紀錄，銷量達到歷史最高水平，公司首次在一個季度內銷量超過 1200 萬噸，這凸顯了公司生產效率的顯著提高，公司首次在一個月內出貨 400 萬噸。

As for financial performance on Slide 15, we can see that the growth in net revenue is a result of the combination of record volumes in shipments, better realized prices in line with the favorable demand trends seen in the quarter, in addition to the positive effect of the future quotation periods. In EBITDA, we have an even stronger performance with 57% increase in the period, profitability gains of 7.8 percentage points. This increase in profitability shows resumption of iron ore prices above $100 per ton and operating performance in the company, and effective cost management.

至於第 15 張投影片中的財務業績，我們可以看到，淨收入的成長是以下因素共同作用的結果：出貨量創歷史新高，根據本季有利的需求趨勢，價格實現得更好，以及未來報價期的正面影響。在 EBITDA 方面，我們表現更為強勁，本期成長 57%，獲利能力提升 7.8 個百分點。獲利能力的提高顯示鐵礦石價格恢復到每噸 100 美元以上，也顯示公司營運表現良好，成本管理有效。

On the next slide, we have the bridge reconciling the EBITDA this quarter compared to the previous quarter. The main factors that contributed to the strong evolution of results were better iron ore prices and future quotation periods that more than offset the increase in freight costs and third-party purchases.

下一張投影片展示了本季與上一季 EBITDA 的比較情況。促成業績強勁成長的主要因素是鐵礦石價格上漲和未來報價期延長，足以抵銷運費上漲和第三方採購增加的影響。

Now we are going to talk about cement on Slide 18. Here, we have an analysis of sales volume. Once again, the sector continues very dynamic, even with all the effects of interest rates with the Minha Casa Minha Vida program, the high level of employment in the real estate segment, driving cement consumption. So we have been able to use the whole logistics network to capture new markets with growth of 5% on sales, showing this trend. The 3.6 million tons sold this quarter was the second result ever in the company, but now with a price dynamics that is more favorable, reinforcing the sustainability of our performance.

現在我們要在第18張幻燈片上討論水泥。這裡我們對銷售量進行了分析。儘管受到利率的影響，加上「我的家，我的生活」計劃、房地產行業的高就業率以及水泥消費的增長，該行業仍然保持著非常活躍的狀態。因此，我們能夠利用整個物流網絡開拓新市場，銷售額成長 5%，這反映了這一趨勢。本季銷量達到 360 萬噸，是公司有史以來的第二個業績，但如今價格走勢更加有利，這增強了我們業績的可持續性。

On the next slide, we have the financial performance. We see an important increase quarter on quarter in terms of revenue and EBITDA. And the result was driven by competitive advantages in operations, an accurate commercial strategy, and a favorable demand in the cement sector. With that, we had the highest EBITDA in history, EBITDA margin going back to the level of 30%, which is significantly above the average in the sector. That shows that no matter how hard the scenario is in terms of competition or interest rates, CSN continues to show favorable results and robust profitability.

下一張幻燈片展示了財務業績。我們看到營收和 EBITDA 均實現了顯著的季度環比增長。這一結果得益於營運方面的競爭優勢、精準的商業策略以及水泥產業的良好市場需求。由此，我們實現了史上最高的 EBITDA，EBITDA 利潤率回升至 30%，遠高於業界平均。這表明，無論競爭或利率情況多麼艱難，CSN 都能繼續取得良好的業績和強勁的獲利能力。

Finally, the Logistics segment and another record in terms of performance in revenue and EBITDA. with a growing dynamic of cargo handling and efficiency, with the highest EBITDA ever recorded by CSM with a total of BRL500 million and margin above 45%. The performance shows that the segment is reaching a higher level of efficiency in cargo handling and shipment showing the potential of the operation.

最後，物流業務在收入和 EBITDA 方面再次創下紀錄。貨物處理和效率不斷提高，創下 CSM 有史以來最高的 EBITDA 紀錄，總額達 5 億雷亞爾，利潤率超過 45%。業績表明，該業務板塊在貨物裝卸和運輸方面達到了更高的效率水平，展現了該業務的潛力。

With that, I close the presentation of the segments, and I'm going to ask Helena to talk about our ESG highlights. ESG highlights, I'm sorry.

至此，我結束了本節的介紹，接下來請 Helena 談談我們的 ESG 亮點。抱歉，這裡只提ESG方面的內容。

(interpreted) Hello, everyone. Before going to details this quarter, I would like to highlight the performance of our ESG agenda connected to sustainable value to our company. In this quarter, we advanced consistently in three pillars that are part of our strategy and that are connected to financial performance and risk reduction, governance, social and (inaudible)

（譯）大家好。在詳細介紹本季業績之前，我想先重點介紹一下我們公司在實現永續價值方面所採取的 ESG 策略。本季度，我們在構成我們策略的三大支柱領域均取得了持續進展，這三大支柱與財務績效和風險降低、公司治理、社會責任和企業社會責任息息相關。（聽不清楚）

In safety, we continue our stability in terms of number of accidents, very close to '24, 30% below '21, 33% decrease in the number of high-potential severe incidents that has been our focus for '25, reaching the best results in our historical spirit. Safety advances were our strategy, focusing on our greatest value and reduction to risks, operational, legal, it avoids costs related to interruptions and et cetera. So the result shows an important advancement in the company and how we are best in terms of leadership.

在安全方面，我們在事故數量方面繼續保持穩定，與 2024 年非常接近，比 2021 年減少了 30%，高風險嚴重事故的數量減少了 33%，這是我們 2025 年的重點，我們秉承歷史精神取得了最佳成績。安全進步是我們的策略，專注於我們最大的價值和降低風險，包括營運風險和法律風險，從而避免與中斷等相關的成本。因此，結果顯示公司取得了重要進步，也顯示我們在領導力方面處於領先地位。

In environmental, we had the report that talks about our agenda targets and et cetera. At CSN, we had the plan of climate adaptation to improve the resilience of our assets, decrease physical risks related to climate and reduce emissions of greenhouse gases in the main segments of operation, driven by projects related to operational efficiency, energy efficiency, clean energy and better processes. And that has direct impact on mitigating climate transition risks, reduces our future exposure to regulatory costs, and also strengthens our competitiveness and extends access to capital connected to ESG, and shows that decarbonization is a strategy for the company and for the future.

在環境方面，我們有一份報告，其中談到了我們的議程目標等等。在 CSN，我們制定了氣候適應計劃，旨在提高資產的韌性，降低與氣候相關的物理風險，並減少主要營運部門的溫室氣體排放，該計劃透過與營運效率、能源效率、清潔能源和更佳流程相關的項目來實現。這將直接影響到緩解氣候轉型風險，降低我們未來面臨的監管成本，增強我們的競爭力，擴大與 ESG 相關的資本獲取管道，並表明脫碳是公司和未來的策略。

And in diversity and inclusion, we continue to have a more inclusive environment with more representativity with an 80% increase of female representation at the group. Diversity is a clear mechanism to reduce risks. We know that diverse teams have better results and strengthen the company in terms of productivity and long-term results.

在多元化和包容性方面，我們繼續創造更具包容性的環境，提高代表性，集團女性代表人數增加了 80%。多樣性是降低風險的有效機制。我們知道，多元化的團隊能夠取得更好的成果，並在生產力和長期績效方面增強公司的實力。

As a result of all these KPIs and others, we once again, we were recognized as a benchmark by important ESG agencies in the world with better credibility, transparency, and consistency in our trajectory. We were considered one of the best companies in terms of the score in ESG and a silver medal in EcoVadis. That shows to the market that we are building a robust company with real impact and reducing risks. And that is not separate from the business. It is part of our strategy, part of risk management. So what we are bringing shows that we are having less operational risks, less financial risk, and it generates value to our -- all our stakeholders, including our shareholders.

由於這些關鍵績效指標以及其他因素，我們再次被世界重要的 ESG 機構認可為標竿企業，我們在發展軌跡上具有更高的信譽度、透明度和一致性。我們在 ESG 評分方面被認為是最好的公司之一，並在 EcoVadis 評選中獲得了銀牌。這向市場表明，我們正在打造一家具有實際影響力並降低風險的強大公司。這與業務本身密不可分。這是我們策略的一部分，也是風險管理的一部分。因此，我們所取得的成就表明，我們的營運風險和財務風險都較低，並且為我們所有的利害關係人（包括我們的股東）創造了價值。

Thank you very much. Now we are going to hear our CEO, Benjamin Steinbruch.

非常感謝。現在我們將聽取執行長本傑明·史坦布魯赫的發言。

(interpreted) Good afternoon, everyone. Thanks for joining our conference call. As it was mentioned by Marcos before and by Elena, we had a quarter that we can call exceptional in terms of operational activity. We were able in all our sectors to record improvements and best production levels ever, also cost reductions. I think that we are working the right way.

（翻譯）大家下午好。感謝您參加我們的電話會議。正如馬科斯和埃琳娜之前提到的那樣，就營運活動而言，我們經歷了一個堪稱非凡的季度。我們所有業務部門都取得了進步，生產水平達到了歷史最高水平，同時成本也降低了。我認為我們的工作方向是正確的。

We are working hard to try and maximize our production with good results. That is seeking the optimal production level for each one of our sectors so that we can, regardless of better productivity and costs, also have the right price for each one of our activities.

我們正努力提高產量，並爭取良好成果。也就是說，我們要為每個部門尋求最佳的生產水平，這樣，無論生產效率和成本如何提高，我們都能為每項活動爭取到合適的價格。

Starting with mining, we had excellent news in terms of production, shipment with record in three corridors price stabilities in iron ore, which gave us the EBITDA margin of 1.9%, which we consider excellent comparing to past forecast. In sales, we were able to lower costs, working at an optimal level in terms of results. And we continue to work very hard to reduce costs, which is something that is in our control using what is best and also using our working capital as well as possible, always having an eye on prices.

先說說採礦業，我們在生產、發貨方面都傳來好消息，三個走廊的鐵礦石價格穩定，使我們的 EBITDA 利潤率達到 1.9%，與過去的預測相比，我們認為這是一個非常好的結果。在銷售方面，我們降低了成本，並在業績方面達到了最佳水平。我們將繼續努力降低成本，這是我們能夠控制的，我們將採用最佳方式，並盡可能有效地利用我們的營運資金，同時始終專注於價格。

In terms of production, had a higher percentage and, as a consequence, a drop in prices due to the mix, but still margins were kept at very good levels. And as you all know, we have this very aggressive uncontrolled competition of product -- imported products, which makes it very difficult for us to mirror what is going on in the world in terms of protective measures against imported goods and incentives to domestic production.

就生產而言，由於產品組合的變化，佔比更高，價格也隨之下降，但利潤率仍然保持在非常高的水平。如大家所知，我們面臨進口產品之間非常激烈且不受控制的競爭，這使得我們很難效仿世界其他國家在保護進口商品和激勵國內生產方面的做法。

In Brazil, we are a bit behind all this despite the efforts of the government, the Ministry of Commerce, and others, but we have to have a more active position with regards to the disorganized coming of imported products that really affect Brazilian products. We are almost prevented from exporting to other countries.

儘管政府、商務部和其他部門都做出了努力，但巴西在這方面還是有點落後。然而，對於無序進口產品湧入巴西市場，我們必須採取更積極的措施，因為這確實會影響巴西產品。我們幾乎無法向其他國家出口商品。

And in addition to not exporting, we have imported products coming in strongly in the country. So we believe the Brazilian government has to act on that because we have to do what others are doing in the world and really copy some of the protectionist measures that we have abroad. We have to protect our industry.

而且，除了不出口之外，我國的進口產品也大量湧入。所以我們認為巴西政府必須採取行動，因為我們必須效法世界其他國家的做法，真正複製我們在國外的一些保護主義措施。我們必須保護我們的產業。

In cement, we had very good results, BRL368 million, BRL378 million. The activity is strong, civil construction for the lower income population, also higher income, with strong demand and the sector amongst all the sectors is really heated in terms of demand. So more and more, we expect improvements in the cement sector. And logistics in terms of volumes transported, verticalization that we have also showed a very good performance. So operationally speaking, I would say that certainly, we are on the right path.

在水泥產業，我們取得了非常好的成績，業績達到 3.68 億雷亞爾和 3.78 億雷亞爾。土木工程產業活動活躍，面向低收入者和高收入者，需求旺盛，在所有產業中，該產業的需求最為旺盛。因此，我們越來越期待水泥產業能夠有所改善。就運輸量和垂直整合而言，物流方面我們也表現出色。所以從營運角度來看，我認為我們肯定走在正確的道路上。

We are doing what we have to do. Everyone engaged to reduce costs, working capital, improving prices, diversifying the market, doing whatever possible to work with better margins that will help us in the near future to deleverage the company together with other actions that we are paying attention to and discussing.

我們正在做我們必須做的事情。所有人都致力於降低成本、減少營運資本、提高價格、實現市場多元化，盡一切可能提高利潤率，這將有助於我們在不久的將來降低公司槓桿率，同時我們也在關注和討論其他措施。

So I would say that the quarter was better than expected. We are improving quarter on quarter. And I hope that this will go on. And we are doing whatever we can, whatever is possible, and almost whatever is impossible from the market's perspective to be able to reflect better performance into numbers that meet our priorities. that is to decrease the company's leverage levels. This is what I had to tell you.

所以我覺得這個季度比預期好。我們每季都在進步。我希望這種情況能夠持續下去。我們正在盡我們所能，做一切可能的事情，甚至包括從市場角度來看幾乎不可能的事情，以期將更好的業績轉化為符合我們優先事項的數字，即降低公司的槓桿水平。這就是我必須告訴你的事。

Once again, I would like to thank you all, and I'm going to turn the call back to Marco.

再次感謝大家，現在我把電話轉回馬可。

(interpreted) Thanks, Benjamin. We are going to start the Q&A session. We have all the company officers, our CEO, and we are here to take your questions.

（翻譯）謝謝你，本傑明。我們將開始問答環節。公司所有高階主管、執行長都在場，我們來回答您的問題。

(interpreted) (Operator Instructions) Gabriel Barra, Citi.

（解釋） （操作說明） Gabriel Barra，花旗銀行。

(interpreted) Perhaps the first point specifically when talking about leverage. Gjamin did mention some of this with regards to costs and how we can make this leverage go down. I think this is an important point for the company. But I would like to perhaps take a new perspective. This is something that I mentioned in the last call, which is divestment.

（解釋）或許在談到槓桿作用時，第一點尤其如此。Gjamin確實提到了一些關於成本的問題，以及我們如何降低這種槓桿作用。我認為這對公司來說很重要。但我或許想換個角度來看這個問題。這是我在上次電話會議中提到的，那就是撤資。

Perhaps you could talk a bit about that. You have a very rich portfolio today, and you can deleverage very fast with your assets. What would be the priorities of the company today? What would be the steps in this strategy of perhaps shuffling portfolio? I would like to understand your mindset on that, considering the different businesses of the company, mining, cement, logistics. So if you could share your view on that, it would really help us on that.

或許你可以談談這方面。你現在擁有非常豐厚的資產，而且你可以很快地降低資產槓桿。公司目前的首要任務是什麼？如果採用這種調整投資組合的策略，具體步驟是什麼？我想了解您對此的看法，考慮到公司涉及的不同業務，例如採礦、水泥、物流。如果您能分享一下您的看法，那將對我們非常有幫助。

Another thing is that we've seen the gains in volume, but margins were not as good this quarter. So I would like to hear from you the idea of value over volume, the commercial strategy of the company, particularly in steel, and also an outlook of your strategy for the fourth quarter that seems to be tougher in terms of margins. So what should we expect for the fourth quarter and next year? These are my points.

還有一點是，雖然銷量有所成長，但本季的利潤率並不理想。因此，我想聽聽您對價值而非數量的理念、公司的商業策略，特別是鋼鐵方面的策略，以及您對第四季度策略的展望，因為第四季度的利潤率似乎會更高。那麼，我們對第四季和明年應該抱持什麼樣的預期呢？我的觀點如下。

(interpreted) Gabriel, thanks for your question, for attending the call. I'm going to answer the first part of your question, and then I'm going to turn to Martinez. Leverage. I think it's important to remind you that we are into a deleveraging process along the year. We went from 3.5x to 3.1x.

（翻譯）加布里埃爾，謝謝你的提問，也謝謝你參加電話會議。我先回答你問題的第一部分，然後再請馬丁內斯回答。槓桿作用。我認為有必要提醒大家，我們今年將逐步降低槓桿。我們從 3.5 倍降到了 3.1 倍。

Our guidance was three until the end of the year. So we are following this target of the company's guidance. Nothing extraordinary on the company's EBITDA or cash helped us come here, just organic operational results of the company. So that alone show how the company is focused on deleveraging the company.

我們先前的指導意見是三年，直到年底。因此，我們正在按照公司指導方針的目標進行操作。公司 EBITDA 或現金方面並沒有什麼特別之處促使我們來到這裡，只是公司本身的營運表現良好。僅此一點就足以說明該公司致力於降低槓桿。

From now on, and we did mention that before and even in the presentation today, in addition to the continuous improvement of our operational results that we really believe we're going to continue improving in all segments. Cement and still are going to continue operational results. Mining is going to continue at a very high level of performance. And we also have strategic projects, the most important of which being the CSN infrastructure project. The group today has seven assets in infrastructure and logistics that will migrate to this new company.

從現在開始，正如我們之前以及今天的演示中提到的那樣，除了持續改進我們的營運績效之外，我們堅信我們將在所有領域繼續改進。水泥業仍將持續維持營運績效。採礦活動將繼續保持非常高的效率水準。我們還有一些戰略項目，其中最重要的是 CSN 基礎設施項目。該集團目前擁有七項基礎設施和物流資產，這些資產將轉移到這家新公司。

We are very much advanced in this operation. And this operation alone will bring in terms of additional liquidity to the group. The company is listed, we cannot give you the hard numbers, but we are going to have some important BRLbillion to deleverage the company is still in '26.

我們在這項行動中進展非常順利。僅此一項操作就能為集團帶來額外的流動資金。該公司已上市，我們無法提供確切的數字，但我們將獲得一些重要的巴西雷亞爾來降低公司槓桿率，該公司目前仍處於 2026 年。

And talking about that, the project is well advanced. In the next few weeks, we are going to give new announcements of the process, formal announcements for you to have a better knowledge of where we are at, and also the timeline that we have for the CSN infrastructure for the year of 2026.

說到這個項目，它目前進展順利。在接下來的幾周里，我們將發布有關該流程的新公告，正式公告，以便您更好地了解我們目前的進展情況，以及我們為 2026 年 CSN 基礎設施制定的時間表。

Obviously, the company has a very important number of assets energy participation, we already talked about that before. It is a subject that is on the table, but we have to have a proposal to make it effective. Discussions in energy continue to advance. It may come to reality, but it depends on negotiations moving on.

顯然，該公司擁有非常重要的能源資產，我們之前已經討論過這一點。這是一個已經提上日程的議題，但我們需要提出切實可行的方案才能使其有效實施。能源領域的討論仍在繼續。這或許會成為現實，但這取決於談判的進展。

And these are the central priority projects that we have in terms of recycling capital. Of course, as you mentioned, and I think that this is one of the strengths of the group, the group has values in its assets in mining in steel in Brazil and abroad, the value of CSN cement, which is a delevered company, and it is the best platform for the growth of cement in Brazil, CSN infrastructure. So assets that are very valuable.

這些是我們循環利用資金方面的中心優先項目。當然，正如您所提到的，我認為這是該集團的優勢之一，該集團在巴西和海外的鋼鐵礦業資產中擁有價值，CSN水泥的價值也很高，CSN水泥是一家去槓桿化公司，是巴西水泥行業發展的最佳平台，CSN基礎設施也是如此。所以，都是非常有價值的資產。

And if the company decides to divest, it will certainly be a high priority in the market, even if it's a minority sale. Even then, the focus of the company and what has been approved so far is CSN infrastructure that will bring an important amount to reduce leverage and energy that we are still discussion and at some point in time can become more mature.

如果該公司決定剝離資產，即使只是出售少數股權，也肯定會成為市場上的首要任務。即便如此，公司目前關注的重點以及已獲批准的項目是 CSN 基礎設施，這將帶來大量資金來減少槓桿和能源消耗，我們仍在討論中，並且在某個時候可能會變得更加成熟。

I'm going to turn to Martinez to answer your second question.

我將請馬丁內斯來回答你的第二個問題。

(interpreted) Thanks for your question. Going back to strategy in the second quarter, we are very much focused on value. We had a portfolio that was more adjusted. We still had the possibility of exporting to the US in coated materials.

（翻譯）謝謝你的提問。回到第二季的策略，我們非常注重價值。我們當時的投資組合更加靈活。我們仍然有可能以塗層材料的形式出口到美國。

And because of an operational issue, we could maximize results. Obviously, in the third quarter, and that is a curiosity. We generally read in analyst reports that import penetration is between 15% to 30%, which is out of the ordinary anywhere in the world. It's a very high number. But when you stop and observe CSN's portfolio, and this is very important.

由於操作上的問題，我們得以最大限度地提高業績。顯然，在第三季度，這很令人好奇。我們通常在分析報告中看到，進口滲透率在 15% 到 30% 之間，這在世界任何地方都是不尋常的。這是一個非常高的數字。但當你停下來觀察 CSN 的投資組合時，你會發現這一點非常重要。

You see in metal sheets, 45% of the market today is imported. In zinc, 40%valum, 55% prepainted 63%. So you see the situation that we had in the third quarter, a huge volume of imports.

你看，如今金屬板材市場45%的產品都是進口的。鋅，40%valum，55%預先塗裝63%。所以你可以看到我們在第三季遇到的情況，進口量龐大。

CSN is known as the coated materials, and we had to compete. It could not just feed the market to imported materials. So what we did was to have a more of a fighting strategy to recover markets that we needed in coated materials, and that was the strategy adopted. In terms of results, I think that this is a winning strategy because in the first quarter, we had 8% margin. In the second quarter, we were the only company that increased price in the Brazilian market, getting to 11%.

CSN是塗層材料領域的知名企業，我們必須與之競爭。它不能只向市場供應進口材料。因此，我們採取了更具戰鬥性的策略來恢復我們在塗層材料領域所需的市場，這就是我們採取的策略。就業成績而言，我認為這是一個成功的策略，因為第一季我們的利潤率達到了 8%。第二季度，我們是巴西市場上唯一一家漲價的公司，漲價幅度達 11%。

And in the third quarter, we grew sales, which was our objective. We could no longer export. We had to direct 25,000 tons of coated material to the domestic market, which was good. I think it was the right move with the possibility of correcting our portfolio for the coming months.

第三季度，我們的銷售額實現了成長，達到了我們的目標。我們已無法再出口。我們不得不將25,000噸塗層材料投放國內市場，這很好。我認為這是一個正確的舉措，有可能在未來幾個月內調整我們的投資組合。

Another important matter, Rafael, Gabriel, sorry, is the matter of demand in Brazil. This is very important. This year, Brazil should hit a historical record of apparent consumption. The market could be showing a drop, and this is not happening. We have robust demand.

拉斐爾、加布里埃爾，抱歉，還有一件重要的事情，那就是巴西的需求問題。這非常重要。今年，巴西的表觀消費量可望創歷史新高。市場可能會出現下跌趨勢，但這種情況並沒有發生。我們擁有強勁的需求。

What happens is that domestic sales in '25 should get to BRL12 million against BRL13,400 in 2023. So the room that we have to occupy the import space is very important. In the third quarter, we implemented something very important. We had price readjustments in distribution, civil construction, and in some segments of the industry. In October, I could say that almost 5% of our prices were adjusted, considering the whole revenues for October, which is very important data.

預計 2025 年國內銷量將達到 1,200 萬雷亞爾，而 2023 年將達到 13,400 雷亞爾。因此，我們佔據進口空間的空間非常重要。第三季度，我們實施了一項非常重要的措施。我們在分銷、土木工程和行業某些領域進行了價格調整。10 月份，考慮到 10 月份的總收入，我可以說我們調整了近 5% 的價格，這是一個非常重要的數據。

Another data we have been working on is antidumping measures. And here, we do thank the government in terms of direction is taken, but the intensity is still very low. The government should have been a lot more emphatic on antidumping.

我們一直在研究的另一項數據是反傾銷措施。在此，我們感謝政府所採取的方向，但強度仍然很低。政府本應更重視反傾銷問題。

CSN had a definite right of imports for metal sheets. And what's working now is that we are working on metal sheets as if it were a jurisprudence for the other materials. So what we think that's going to happen now different than what many people are saying, all in verifications of plants have been performed for all products with the exception of hot laminate. The technical note is practically completed in all markets as well. And we are very much sure that in the meeting of the G7 on November 27, we should be able to succeed on the antidumping of galvanized and prepainted products, which will give us more comfort in terms of competitivity.

CSN擁有金屬板材的明確進口權。現在行之有效的方法是，我們對待金屬板材就像對待其他材料一樣對待它。所以我們認為接下來會發生的情況與許多人所說的不同，除了熱層壓板之外，所有產品的所有工廠都已進行了驗證。技術說明在所有市場也基本完成。我們非常有信心，在11月27日舉行的七國集團會議上，我們應該能夠在鍍鋅和預塗產品反傾銷問題上取得成功，這將使我們在競爭力方面更有信心。

For the next quarter, Jin did talk about costs. We lowered costs for amounts close to BRL300. Our emphasis in costs continues very strong. And I think that we are going to levels in the amount of BRL3,000 per ton, obviously, optimizing production. So in blast furnace 3 -- we are working with less pellets, less coke, and maximizing the purchase of plates in a market that we have very favorable prices.

接下來一個季度，金確實談到了成本問題。我們降低了接近 300 雷亞爾的金額的成本。我們依然非常重視成本控制。我認為，透過優化生產，我們顯然會將價格提高到每噸 3000 雷亞爾的水平。所以在 3 號高爐中——我們使用的球團礦較少，焦炭也較少，並且最大限度地利用市場上非常優惠的價格購買鋼板。

So in terms of costs, we are at a very good trend. Prices were captured in October. We no longer have exports. The production has to come to the domestic market in products. And our belief is that the dumping, although slow, the dumping antidumping measures will implement partially in November, another in December, and perhaps the last products, which is less pragmatic in February.

因此，就成本而言，我們正處於非常好的趨勢中。價格資料採集於10月。我們已不再出口。生產出來的產品必須進入國內市場。我們認為，雖然傾銷措施進展緩慢，但反傾銷措施將在 11 月部分實施，12 月實施另一部分，而最後一批產品（這不太現實）可能會在 2 月實施。

With this scenario for the fourth quarter, I believe that we are going to go back to double digits in terms of margin. So this is more of an overall scenario. And if you want, we can talk a bit more about other markets and also cement.

根據第四季的這種情況，我相信我們的利潤率將恢復到兩位數。所以這更多的是一個整體情況。如果你願意，我們還可以再談談其他市場以及水泥產業。

(interpreted) Rafael Barcellos, Bradesco BBI.

（口譯）拉斐爾·巴塞洛斯 (Rafael Barcellos)，布拉德斯科 BBI。

My first question is the company has showing cash burn in recent quarters. Can you talk a bit about what would be the normalized number for the company? And what initiatives can be taken to reverse the scenario? You talked about interest rates, financial expenses a bit higher. What initiative can you have to reverse this position in the short term?

我的第一個問題是，該公司近幾個季度都出現了現金消耗的情況。您能談談貴公司的標準化數字應該是多少嗎？那麼可以採取哪些措施來扭轉這種局面呢？您談到了利率和略高的財務支出。短期內您可以採取哪些措施來扭轉這種局面？

And second question, I would like to go back to what Martinez mentioned. Talking a bit more about cement and other markets. So a follow-up. You mentioned that on November 27, you're going to have the G7 meeting, and we can have a favorable decision for galvanized. So is that correct?

第二個問題，我想回到馬丁內斯剛才提到的那件事。再多談談水泥和其他市場。所以，有個後續問題。您提到11月27日將舉行七國集團峰會，我們可能會在會上得到對鍍鋅鋼有利的決定。是這樣嗎？

And if you have any information of cold and hot laminates, when the date would be? And Martinez, if you could talk about the markets. We are seeing the market some attempt of improving prices in plain sheets. Could you talk about the market appetite in terms of prices?

如果您有關於冷熱層壓板的信息，請問大概什麼時候可以公佈？馬丁內斯，如果你能談談市場狀況就好了。我們看到市場上出現了一些試圖降低普通床單價格的嘗試。能否談談市場對價格的需求？

(interpreted) Rafael, thanks for your question. I think that first, when you talk about cash burn, the company was able to show in recent quarters a reduction in cash burn, as you mentioned, from BRL4 billion to 800 million in this last quarter. There is a series of initiatives in line for us to have a positive cash, which is what is expected. The new is better operational results as we are showing quarter after quarter, improving our operational results is the most sustainable way of turning negative cash to positive cash. This quarter, we delivered a better cash position and the pillars to improve results for the coming quarters in all segments are given.

（翻譯）拉斐爾，謝謝你的提問。我認為首先，談到現金消耗，正如您所提到的，該公司在最近幾個季度已經能夠證明現金消耗有所減少，從 40 億雷亞爾降至上個季度的 8 億雷亞爾。我們正在推動一系列舉措，以實現正現金流，這也是我們所期望的。新的變化是更好的營運業績，正如我們每季所展示的那樣，改善營運業績是將負現金轉正現金的最可持續的方式。本季度，我們的現金狀況有所改善，並已製定了未來幾季各業務板塊業績提升的支柱。

We talked about the cost control in mining, cement, and now in steel, where we reached the lowest cost of steel production of the last four years, and that remains for the future in our main core segments. We talked about price recoveries in cement and also signs of better prices in steel as well.

我們討論了採礦、水泥以及現在的鋼鐵業的成本控制，我們在鋼鐵生產方面實現了近四年來的最低成本，而且在我們主要的核心業務領域，這一目標將在未來繼續保持。我們討論了水泥價格回升的情況，以及鋼鐵價格改善的跡象。

And in mining, we continue going well in terms of profitability, generation of EBITDA, and we are going to carry on like this. So the part of operational results that will contribute to cash burn is happening and will continue for future periods, obviously, considering the seasonality issues that we have in some parts of the year. financial expenses, I did mention that, and you mentioned that too. We already saw this quarter a reduction of financial expenses compared to previous quarters. Here, you have a focus of the company in managing debt that are a bit more burdensome in our indebtedness profile.

在採礦方面，我們在獲利能力、EBITDA 產生方面繼續保持良好勢頭，我們將繼續保持這種勢頭。因此，導致現金消耗的營運業績部分正在發生，而且顯然會在未來幾個時期持續下去，考慮到一年中某些時段的季節性問題。財務費用，我之前提到過，你也提到過。本季度我們已經看到財務支出較前幾個季度有所減少。在這裡，公司重點關注的是管理那些在我們債務狀況中負擔較重的債務。

We are making investments -- a part of the investments that we have in our cash burn, have efficient credit lines. And we are also settling some funds that are a bit more expensive for the company, which has an impact on financial expenses, and that will happen on a reduction of cash burn compared to previous quarters.

我們正在進行投資——我們的部分投資用於現金消耗，並擁有高效的信貸額度。我們也要償還一些對公司來說成本較高的款項，這將對財務支出產生影響，與前幾季相比，現金消耗將會減少。

And investments, which is also an important lever in '26, you're talking about the CapEx that is very close or the same -- sorry, the CapEx of '25 is very close to the CapEx we had in '24. Still with the same CapEx, we had a huge development of P15, and in the company's structuring process, notably that led to better steel prices. So we are focusing on investments in projects that have better profitability for the group. And we are having actual results in our numbers based on the strategy. So organically, we are improving our cash position for the coming quarters.

投資也是 2026 年的重要槓桿，你提到的資本支出非常接近或相同——抱歉，2025 年的資本支出與 2024 年的資本支出非常接近。在資本支出不變的情況下，我們大力發展了 P15 項目，並且在公司的結構調整過程中，這尤其帶來了更好的鋼材價格。因此，我們專注於投資那些能為集團帶來更高獲利的項目。我們的數據也確實體現了這項策略帶來的實際效果。因此，我們正在逐步改善未來幾季的現金狀況。

In addition to that, I did talk about the CSN infra project together with other projects that the company can engage in the future will help the company deleverage faster than just based on operational results. And that will certainly have a direct impact in the volume of financial expenses and interest rates paid by the company. So we are very confident for the next quarters to be able to reverse this position.

除此之外，我還談到了 CSN 基礎設施項目以及公司未來可以參與的其他項目，這些項目將有助於公司更快地降低槓桿率，而不僅僅是依靠營運結果。這肯定會對公司的財務支出規模和支付的利息產生直接影響。因此，我們非常有信心在接下來的幾季扭轉這種局面。

The better operational results that we are showing alone without strategic movements should already bring enough credit for the company for everyone to understand that this is going to happen in the short period of time. Martinez can you answer the second question?

單憑我們目前取得的更好的營運業績，而沒有採取任何策略舉措，就已經足以讓公司獲得足夠的認可，讓每個人都明白，這種情況將在短期內發生。馬丁內斯，你能回答第二個問題嗎？

(interpreted) Another data they would talk about antidumping measures, very interesting. Only 45% of the volume exported in China has positive margin, 7% to 8%. So imagine the problem that we have with the closing of Europe. We became the yard of the road for Chinese material to come in. So just for you to have an idea, Asian markets that were relatively control, you get enough China is sending 4 million; Korea, 3 million, and Brazil, 2 million.

（解讀）他們還會談到反傾銷措施，這很有意思。中國出口產品中只有 45% 的利潤率為正，即 7% 到 8%。所以，想像一下歐洲封鎖會為我們帶來什麼問題。我們成了中國物資運進來的必經之路。為了讓你們有個概念，亞洲市場相對來說控制得比較好，中國出口了 400 萬，韓國 300 萬，巴西 200 萬。

So the a of products continue. So we do have to take some measures. Another important point that is very positive is that the industry as a whole woke up to understand that still import is just one problem. You get machinery, equipment, cars, consumer goods. What's happening is not steel that is coming at 30%.

所以產品系列仍在繼續。所以我們必須採取一些措施。另一個非常積極的方面是，整個產業終於意識到進口只是其中一個問題。你會得到機械、設備、汽車、消費品。現在的情況不是鋼材價格下跌 30%。

You have an import of machinery getting to 30% to 35%. So dumping starts to be a more structural problem as it has always been. But now with the reinforcement of value chains, we are probably going to have a better condition for the government to be a bit faster in the process.

你們的機械設備進口量佔比已達 ​​30% 至 35%。因此，傾銷問題開始演變成一個更嚴重的結構性問題，就像它一直以來那樣。但現在隨著價值鏈的加強，政府或許能夠更快地推動相關進程。

As for process, I'm absolutely convinced that we will certainly have repainted and Galvalum approved because we have all data, the technical is approved. Everything is working, all the verifications. And along the pipeline, hot laminates is going to be the last one because the process started in June '25 and the forecast is more to the middle of the year. In the other products, up to January '25, we can have this implemented. It's important to highlight that the government can optimize time, shorten time.

至於流程方面，我絕對相信我們一定能完成重新噴漆並獲得鍍鋁鋅認證，因為我們擁有所有數據，技術方面也已獲得批准。一切正常，所有驗證都通過了。而從管道來看，熱層壓板將是最後一個，因為該工藝於 2025 年 6 月開始，預計要到年中才能完成。在其他產品中，我們可以在 2025 年 1 月之前實現這一點。需要強調的是，政府可以優化時間，縮短時間。

In metal sheets, we had a very bad experience. We started in March '24, and we only had the process approved in August '25. I believe that the government has overcome now, and that's a lesson learned for us to use the metal sheet as a jurisdiction and approve to other materials. So I'm very much confident in terms of dumping. And we are not learning out of love. We are learning out of pain. And this is for the whole of the industry. There's no other way.

我們在金屬板材方面有過非常糟糕的經驗。我們從 2024 年 3 月開始，直到 2025 年 8 月才獲得流程批准。我認為政府現在已經克服了這個問題，這給我們上了一課，那就是以後應該以金屬板為準，批准使用其他材料。所以我對傾銷非常有信心。我們學習並非出於熱愛。我們是在痛苦中學習。這適用於整個行業。別無他法。

As for markets, I'll say that again. Although we have lots of imports, we also have a very high demand for you to replace part of what was imported, or better yet. If we had used the criteria that the United States have imports of 2021 multiplied by 0.7 and not 1.3, we would have a penetration that would be quite decent, being able to compete, assuring the government that there was competition with no problems. But import is still something that is going to consume us for some time because new players are coming to the market. Just for you to have an idea, we have another antidumping measures in metal sheet against Germany, Japan, and Netherlands. And today, probably in terms of circumvention, we also have materials from India coming to Brazil.

至於市場，我再說一次。雖然我們進口了很多商品，但我們也非常希望你們能取代一部分進口商品，或者更好的是，用你們自己生產的商品來替換。如果我們採用美國 2021 年進口額乘以 0.7 而不是 1.3 的標準，那麼我們的市場滲透率將會相當不錯，能夠參與競爭，並向政府保證市場競爭不會出現問題。但進口仍然是我們未來一段時間需要關注的重點，因為不斷有新的競爭者進入市場。為了讓你們有個概念，我們也對德國、日本和荷蘭採取了另一項金屬板材反傾銷措施。而今天，就規避而言，我們可能也有來自印度的材料流入巴西。

So this scenario is becoming more complex, more difficult to be faced if we are not faster in our moves. As for markets, what I can say is the following. The market as a whole has very interesting signs. The agribusiness, and here I'm talking about farming equipment, silos, road equipment has suffered a bit, but we have signs of recovery. Of course, it's connected to interest rates, financing could be stronger, but this is not a market in which we see very strong drop.

因此，如果我們不加快行動速度，這種情況將變得越來越複雜，越來越難以應對。至於市場方面，我可以說如下。整個市場呈現出非常有趣的跡象。農業綜合企業，這裡我指的是農業設備、筒倉、道路設備，受到了一定程度的影響，但我們已經看到了復甦的跡象。當然，這與利率有關，融資可能會更強勁，但我們預計這個市場不會大幅下跌。

OEMs, although there is an import of vehicles, the market continues strong. We are selling a lot to the sector. And part of the volume that I lost to the US, I'm selling domestically instead of exporting, which is reasonable in terms of margin. Other markets are stable, like electronic appliances, packaging with a slight increase. And as the mix, this is going to improve.

儘管汽車進口量增加，但OEM市場依然強勁。我們向該行業銷售了大量產品。我失去的部分銷量（原本銷往美國）現在改為在國內銷售，而不是出口，從利潤率來看，這是合理的。其他市場保持穩定，例如電子電器，包裝行業略有成長。隨著混合比例的調整，這種情況會得到改善。

Overall, we believe the penetration rate in the domestic market this year will go down to 24%, 25% after a peak of 28, and we are working precisely on the conversion of what was imported to CSN. Prices, Rafael, as you asked, we implemented in October in our price portfolio an adjustment of 5%. I believe that nothing prevents us from keeping these prices until the end of the year.

總體而言，我們認為今年國內市場的滲透率將在達到 28% 的峰值後下降到 24%、25%，我們正在努力將進口產品轉化為國產產品。拉斐爾，正如你所問，我們在 10 月對價格組合進行了 5% 的調整。我認為沒有任何因素會阻止我們把這些價格維持到年底。

Obviously, we still have some things to do in the industry and to prepare to negotiate with OEMs in the beginning of next year. Preparation starts at the end of this year. But the scenario is more positive in my opinion, considering that in the case of coated materials, we are going to have antidumping measures, which will give me better conditions to compete in the market.

顯然，我們在行業內還有一些事情要做，並且需要為明年年初與原始設備製造商 (OEM) 進行談判做好準備。準備工作將於今年底開始。但我認為情況更樂觀，因為在塗層材料方面，我們將面臨反傾銷措施，這將為我在市場上競爭提供更好的條件。

For cement, I would say that this is a dream because cement, we had a recovery in the third quarter to margins of 30%. And I think in the fourth quarter, margins can be even better because the market should close at BRL66 million, BRL67 million a year. The market capacity is with competitive cost of BRL85 million, BRL87 million, and we are getting close to years of Olympic Games and the World Cup at BRL72 per ton. And we did that with a strategy of selling less to more clients, and that has been very successful. we are using our distribution network and logistics with the acquisition of (inaudible) and our assets in railway.

對於水泥產業來說，我認為這簡直是夢想成真，因為水泥產業在第三季實現了復甦，利潤率達到了 30%。我認為第四季利潤率可能會更好，因為市場年收入應該會達到 6,600 萬至 6,700 萬雷亞爾。市場產能具有競爭力，成本為每噸 8500 萬雷亞爾、8700 萬雷亞爾，而我們即將迎來奧運會和世界杯，價格為每噸 72 雷亞爾。我們採取的策略是向更多客戶銷售少量產品，而且非常成功。我們正在利用我們的分銷網絡和物流，以及收購（聽不清楚）和我們在鐵路領域的資產。

So cement to me is going to show this year and beginning of next year, something that has not been priced yet in civil construction. We have projects as the renovation project from the federal government that can be a catalyzer of growth, Minha Casa Minha Vida that's not new where we have a bit of a sector that is more still I would say, is middle-class properties.

所以，在我看來，水泥價格將在今年和明年年初上漲，而這在土木工程領域尚未充分體現。我們有聯邦政府的翻新項目，可以成為成長的催化劑；還有「我的家，我的生活」（Minha Casa Minha Vida）項目，這並不是什麼新鮮事，我們有一個相對來說比較穩定的領域，我認為是中產階級房產。

And here, this is based on financing. Now the government is increasing financing levels that can improve a lot. And in infrastructure that there is a lot to be done. We always say that, but we do believe that that can be a good lever. Civil construction in a virtuous cycle can carry along all other sectors.

而在這裡，這一切都是基於融資的。現在政府正在增加融資水平，這可以帶來很大的改善。基礎設施方面還有很多工作要做。我們總是這麼說，但我們確實相信這會是一個很好的槓桿。土木工程建設處於良性循環之中，可以帶動其他所有產業的發展。

So our prospect for the fourth quarter is to continue reducing costs -- we are going to capture prices, imports, and implement antidumping measures. Doing all that and having all actions in place, and still, we are going to go to double digits in 4Q and implement margins above 30%.

因此，我們對第四季的展望是繼續降低成本——我們將控制價格、進口，並實施反傾銷措施。即便我們採取了所有這些措施，所有行動都已到位，我們仍將在第四季度實現兩位數成長，並實現 30% 以上的利潤率。

(interpreted) Just a follow-up, Marco. Thank you for the breakdown in terms of cash generation. Just a small follow-up. In terms of working capital, could you say something in the short term? And Martinez, in your case, you talked about some products and what you expect in terms of antidumping. How about galvanized and cold limited products?

（翻譯）馬可，我再問一個後續問題。感謝您提供的現金流量產生狀況細分數據。補充一點。就營運資金而言，您能否談談短期情況？馬丁內斯，就你而言，你談到了一些產品以及你對反傾銷的預期。鍍鋅和耐寒產品呢？

(interpreted) Well, working capital I don't think we are not going to have major fluctuations. We had an impact because of accounts receivable this quarter because of a higher volume of commercial activity. If you keep the volume of activity in the coming quarters in accounts receivable, you're not going to have another impact. So you're going to keep the same pace. And a good part of the good EBITDA that we had this quarter will turn into cash keeping this same level of operation, accounts receivable, you will not have fluctuation. So there is a line the company is focusing a lot, which is inventories.

（翻譯）嗯，關於營運資金，我認為我們不會遇到大的波動。由於本季商業活動量增加，應收帳款對我們造成了一定影響。如果未來幾季應收帳款的交易量保持不變，就不會產生其他影響。所以你要保持同樣的速度。本季我們獲得的良好 EBITDA 的大部分將轉化為現金，並保持目前的營運水平，應收帳款不會出現波動。所以，該公司目前非常關注的一個方面是庫存。

And here, you might have some benefit in terms of working capital for the future. But we have an important work team to focusing on that. We see some impact in the third quarter, and that's why we have a larger volume of steel sold in this period, but we are doing that with all inventories of the company. Now metal sheet, we have the definitive right to antidumping. And fortunately, in this case, the government took 18 months too much.

這樣一來，你未來在營運資金方面可能會獲得一些好處。但我們有一個重要的工作團隊專注於此。我們在第三季度看到了一些影響，這就是為什麼我們在這段期間售出了更多的鋼材，但我們對公司的所有庫存都採取了這種做法。現在，對於金屬板材，我們擁有明確的反傾銷權。幸運的是，在這種情況下，政府多花了 18 個月的時間。

Prepainted is going to be approved in CMC meeting on November 27, coated end of December or the first meeting of CME in January, cold laminate the same, metal sheets for Japan, Netherlands, and others, April 26, and hot laminate March 26. These are the times we are working with. The government always has a cushion to expand. I am in Brazil today in meetings with and to talk about Brazil antidumping and also sanctions of the United States on Brazil, the tariffs. So I'm very optimistic because I see a new position of the government that can accelerate decisions.

預塗漆將在 11 月 27 日的 CMC 會議上獲得批准，塗層將在 12 月底或 1 月的 CME 第一次會議上獲得批准，冷層壓板也一樣，日本、荷蘭等地的金屬板材將在 4 月 26 日獲得批准，熱層壓板將在 3 月 26 日獲得批准。這就是我們所處的時代。政府總會留有擴張的空間。我今天在巴西與相關人士會面，討論巴西的反傾銷問題以及美國對巴西的製裁和關稅問題。所以我非常樂觀，因為我看到了政府的新立場，這可以加快決策速度。

(interpreted) Daniel Sasson, Itau BBA.

（口譯）Daniel Sasson，Itau BBA。

(interpreted) My first question is to Marco. Marco, could you talk about the level of flexibility that you can see in your CapEx for next year, important projects in expansion in mining. What has been already contracted? And where do you have room to postpone if that's the case, if you are considering that? And along the same line, if you get maturities of bank debt between the end of this year, '26, '27, you have about BRL14 billion, BRL15 billion. And have you already started renegotiating or rolling out these debts with banks as usual?

（譯）我的第一個問題是問馬可的。Marco，你能談談你明年在資本支出方面，特別是礦業擴張方面的重要項目，所看到的靈活性嗎？已經簽訂了哪些合約？如果是這樣，如果你正在考慮推遲，那麼你還有什麼空間可以推遲呢？同樣地，如果你把今年年底、2026 年、2027 年到期的銀行債務也算進去，你就會發現大約有 140 億雷亞爾到 150 億雷亞爾。你們是否已經像往常一樣開始與銀行重新協商或分期償還這些債務了？

And my second question goes back to deleveraging alternatives. Could you be a bit more specific in terms of the CE generation. You have been talking about having a strategic partner to this business, particularly, and also the monetization of infrastructure logistics assets, the pool of operational assets already, but also projects at what stage we are today. That's it.

我的第二個問題與去槓桿化替代方案有關。能否更具體地說明 CE 代數？您一直在談論為這項業務尋找策略合作夥伴，特別是基礎設施物流資產的貨幣化，以及現有的營運資產池，以及我們目前所處的專案階段。就是這樣。

(interpreted) Daniel, thanks for your questions. Well, first, CapEx. As we mentioned, the company is managing its CapEx very efficiently. We compare '25 to '25, same level of CapEx, but all levels of segments, bringing more volume, better operations, and reducing costs. So this clearly shows how CapEx is important for the company.

（翻譯）丹尼爾，謝謝你的提問。首先，是資本支出。正如我們所提到的，該公司對資本支出的管理非常有效率。我們將 2025 年與 2025 年進行比較，資本支出水準相同，但各個細分市場都實現了更高的產量、更好的營運和更低的成本。這清楚地表明了資本支出對公司的重要性。

As for '26, which is our short-term Obviously, we do have some flexibility on CapEx. This is always true. The priority is P15. We are going to deliver on time as agreed. So that is our top priority in terms of CapEx.

至於 2026 年，這是我們的短期目標，顯然我們在資本支出方面有一定的彈性。這一點始終如此。優先級為P15。我們將按約定時間交付。所以這是我們在資本支出上的首要任務。

And the room that we have in terms of cash generation and others is going to be managed as ideally as possible. We do have the flexibility. It should be anything extremely material because our main focus is to continue improving the company's operational higher cash generation, more EBITDA, I'm sorry, as we are doing, and we delivered the best EBITDA ever of the year this quarter. So we have to take care in CapEx management because sometimes you remove it from somewhere and you have a drop in EBITDA. So to answer your question, we do have the flexibility, but it's not super material and our priority is P15.

我們將盡可能理想地利用好我們在現金流等方面的空間。我們確實有彈性。應該不會有什麼特別重大的事情發生，因為我們的主要重點是繼續改善公司的運營，提高現金流，增加 EBITDA，抱歉，我們正在這樣做，而且我們本季度實現了今年有史以來最好的 EBITDA。所以我們必須謹慎管理資本支出，因為有時你會從某個地方削減開支，就會導致 EBITDA 下降。所以回答你的問題，我們確實有這種靈活性，但並不十分重要，我們的首要任務是 P15。

In terms of maturities, basically, the maturities for '26 and '27 are bank credits with more of bilateral credits as we did this year. We are already renegotiating some maturities of the first half of '26. So far, negotiations have been very smooth. We are able to roll out maturities for the beginning of '26. We haven't started working with '27 yet.

就到期日而言，2026 年和 2027 年的到期日基本上都是銀行信貸，其中雙邊信貸比今年更多。我們已經在重新協商 2026 年上半年到期的一些款項。到目前為止，談判進展非常順利。我們能夠推出 2026 年初到期的債券。我們還沒有開始與「27」合作。

But in '26, we are very comfortable that we are going to be able to roll out the debt of '26. Some of for instance, we have a bond of '26. A small part of the bond for '26 is in the month of April. And we are still analyzing if we are going to use the company's cash to pay it out. We have two operations to happen, the one in infrastructure and others, and part of the cash can be used to pay debt along the year of '26.

但是，我們非常有信心在 2026 年償還 2026 年的債務。例如，我們有些債券的金額為 '26'。2026 年債券的一小部分將於 4 月發行。我們仍在分析是否要動用公司現金來支付這筆款項。我們有兩項業務要開展，一項是基礎建設，另一項是其他業務，部分現金可用於償還 2026 年的債務。

Well, I talked about '26, '27, and in terms of other deleveraging alternatives. C3E, we wanted to close it before -- but last year, we had the floods in May that postponed the discussion. We had to have a new engineering in all assets show to the market with an independent engineering that all assets were in perfect condition for the continuation of the operation to work with the assets that needed it. So we repowered some of the products with higher power, generating more cash and EBITDA for the company. So the process was a bit delayed.

我談到了 2026 年、2027 年以及其他去槓桿化的替代方案。C3E，我們之前就想關閉它——但是去年五月的洪水推遲了討論。我們必須對所有資產進行新的工程設計，向市場證明所有資產都處於完美狀態，可以繼續運營，並與所需的資產協同工作。因此，我們對一些產品進行了動力升級，使其功率更高，從而為公司創造了更多現金和 EBITDA。所以這個過程稍微耽擱了一些。

In the beginning, we had a new infrastructure debenture at C3E. And that also consumes some months because of the complexity of this structured finance. After everything completed, we are discussing with partners. We are very much focused. We believe we can be successful, but it's hard to say when, if it's going to be the next four or five months, but the operation itself does not really change the leverage position of the group. But it's important. We are focusing on everything that adds value, and we are pursuing this operation.

最初，我們在 C3E 發行了新的基礎設施債券。而且由於這種結構性融資的複雜性，這也需要花費幾個月的時間。所有工作完成後，我們將與合作夥伴進行討論。我們非常專注。我們相信我們能夠成功，但很難說何時成功，可能是在接下來的四、五個月內，但這項作業本身並不會真正改變集團的議價能力。但這很重要。我們專注於一切能創造價值的事情，並且正在推動這項業務。

With CSN infrastructure, we are very careful as a listed company, but we do expect the next few months to have a bit more formal announcement showing the advances that we had in this area. And what we can say is that it's very much connected to the plan for '26. We see a potential closing of this operation by mid next year. This is an operation that has been attracting several investors to the company. We have weekly meetings with stakeholders interested in the transaction, and we are very confident we are going to have a very successful transaction.

作為一家上市公司，我們在CSN基礎設施方面非常謹慎，但我們預計未來幾個月將發布更正式的公告，以展示我們在該領域的進展。我們可以說，這與 2026 年的計劃密切相關。我們預計該項目可能會在明年年中關閉。這項業務已經吸引了許多投資者加入該公司。我們每週都會與對此次交易有興趣的利害關係人舉行會議，我們非常有信心此次交易將會非常成功。

(interpreted) Guilherme Nippes, XP.

（譯者）Guilherme Nippes，XP。

(interpreted) My question has to do with the antidumping measures in steel. We are getting lots of questions. The market seems to be a bit more optimistic because many problems in terms of antidumping are being settled. And we are getting lots of questions about potential effect on prices. So I'd like to ask you this question, if you can help us out a rationale for potential impact because we see antidumping discussions in prevented about 300 laminates about 500.

（翻譯）我的問題與鋼鐵反傾銷措施有關。我們收到了很多問題。由於反傾銷方面的許多問題正在解決，市場似乎更加樂觀。我們收到了很多關於這可能對價格產生影響的問題。所以我想問您這個問題，如果您能幫我們分析一下潛在影響的理由，那就太好了，因為我們看到反傾銷討論阻止了大約 300 到 500 種層壓板的生產。

But we understand that because antidumping is against China, we can have part of this product changing routes. We saw that limits to South Korea and a part is going to be absorbed by the local industry. So my question is specifically about this point, and this discussion is how much do you think we could consider in terms of better prices and profitability of the products in the domestic industry? And when should we expect the antidumping on better prices? And with regards to the increases of 5%, what has to do with a better domestic environment, a better domestic market, or if it is related to antidumping.

但我們理解，由於反傾銷針對的是中國，因此我們可能會讓部分產品改變運輸路線。我們看到，這些限制因素僅限於韓國，一部分將被當地產業吸收。所以我的問題具體是關於這一點，也是關於這場討論的：您認為我們在國內產業中，在產品價格和盈利能力方面，可以考慮多少？那麼，我們什麼時候才能看到針對更優惠價格的反傾銷措施呢？至於這 5% 的成長，是與更好的國內環境、更好的國內市場有關，還是與反傾銷有關？

Martinez, I think the question is yours.

馬丁內斯，我認為這個問題應該由你來回答。

Yes. Guilherme. Okay. In terms of antidumping, first, I'm going to say what I always mentioned, which is the issue of premiums. So if you're thinking of BQ, $470, and you think of our product in the domestic market, which is $3,600, $3,700 the premium considering you have the quotas, right?

是的。吉列爾梅。好的。關於反傾銷問題，首先，我要說我一直提到的溢價問題。所以，如果你想到的是 BQ，470 美元，再想想我們在國內市場的產品，價格是 3600 美元、3700 美元，考慮到配額限制，溢價是 3700 美元，對吧？

So if it's outside the quota, the premium is already about 2%. And inside the quotas, it is about 10% to 12% that for B. when we go to antidumping measures for coated materials, and those that are affected in the market is, well, we have 50% of the coated market in Brazil.

所以如果超出配額，溢價已經約為 2%。在配額範圍內，大約有 10% 到 12% 的份額屬於 B。當我們對塗層材料採取反傾銷措施時，受影響的市場是，嗯，我們在巴西塗層市場佔有 50% 的份額。

And our products are connected to civil construction with a small percentage to automotive. So whatever happens in antidumping measures, if it's going to take another two, three days is very positive because certainly, it gives us a cushion to adjust prices. The best adjustment, obviously, is to sell even if I sold at the same price, more volume in terms of coated material. This is what we want because today, we have capacities that came from other competitors.

我們的產品主要與土木工程相關，只有一小部分與汽車產業相關。所以，無論反傾銷措施最終結果如何，如果還需要兩三天時間，那也是非常正面的，因為這無疑給了我們調整價格的緩衝期。顯然，最好的調整方法是即使價格不變，也要賣出更多塗層材料。這就是我們想要的，因為如今我們擁有的產能來自其他競爭對手。

So restricting imports is very positive in terms of competition, and it is still healthy for the Brazilian market. Just for you to have an idea, I don't have the number by heart. But I would say that in the first quarter, imports were close to 1 million tons. In the second, 1.3 million. And in the third quarter, it went down to 970.

因此，限制進口對競爭來說是非常正面的，而且對巴西市場來說仍然是健康的。為了讓你有個概念，我得說，我記不住那個數字。但我認為，第一季進口量接近100萬噸。第二，130萬。第三季度，這一數字下降到 970。

So this is a clear sign that those that are importing have realized that the market can change. And the government is giving signs of that, the last one to the metal sheet with a definite decision. In terms of models, which I think is what you want, I believe that we could recover 5% to 7.25% in quoted materials still keeping competitiveness in the domestic market.

這清楚地表明，進口商已經意識到市場將會改變。政府也正在釋放出這種訊號，最後一個金屬板已經做出了明確的決定。就模型而言（我認為這是您想要的），我相信我們可以在報價材料的基礎上再節省 5% 到 7.25%，同時保持國內市場的競爭力。

In terms of metal sheets, and we had a huge pressure of the market because we are the only producer, we almost did not adjust prices. This is the fact that I placed in the portfolio 7,000, 8,000 tons a month already leveraged our results. So the main lever is to make import levels a bit more civilized, 10% to 13%.

就金屬板材而言，由於我們是唯一的生產商，我們面臨著巨大的市場壓力，幾乎沒有調整價格。這就是我每月在投資組合中投入 7,000 至 8,000 噸已經取得成效的事實。因此，主要手段是將進口水準控制在 10% 到 13% 之間，使其更加合理。

Once again, this scenario is more positive to CSN because it is the pipeline of our products. B is the list of our problems, I would say. But I would say that if the government wants to be fast, it would do it in February and March. And we would have the completion of verifications in local that haven't done yet and the technical note as well, which is based on the regulations of the road trade organization. So this is what we are considering.

再次強調，這種情況對 CSN 更有利，因為這是我們的產品線。我認為，B 是我們的問題清單。但我認為，如果政府想要快速行動，那麼它會在二月和三月完成。我們還需要完成一些尚未完成的本地驗證工作，以及一份技術說明，該說明是根據道路貿易組織的規章制度編寫的。所以，這就是我們正在考慮的。

In terms of volume, we can always think of the fourth quarter, December. We don't see that some industries, for instance, electronic appliances, have a positive sign for the end of the year. We might have a higher capacity of consumers to consume within their wallet share, but the best segment is civil construction. And that shows in our cement results because CSN is almost the one-stop shop of the market in civil construction. We have a scanning that is very complete of the Brazilian market.

就銷量而言，我們可以參考第四季度，也就是12月。我們沒有看到某些行業，例如電子家電行業，在年底前呈現出積極的跡象。我們或許擁有更高的消費者消費能力，但最好的市場區隔是土木工程。這一點從我們的水泥業績就能看出來，因為 CSN 幾乎是土木工程市場上的一站式供應商。我們對巴西市場進行了非常全面的掃描。

I don't know if I missed any point but just let me know.

我不知道我是否遺漏了什麼，但請告訴我。

(interpreted) Our next question is in writing by Nicolas from Bal, UK. He says congratulations on the results. What is the marginal cost of debt for rollovers and on new money in 3Q '25?

（翻譯）我們的下一個問題是由來自英國巴爾的尼古拉斯提出的書面問題。他表示祝賀取得好成績。2025 年第三季度，債務展期和新增資金的邊際成本是多少？

(interpreted) Nicolas, thanks for your question. The cost of the debt for rollovers this quarter was the same as the historical levels in the company. It has not changed our average leverage, which is at 10% of CDI and close or the same as the first and second quarters this year. What we saw and that may raise the curiosity of some investors is a fluctuation of some of our papers in debentures and others, but that is not related to rollovers that we have been executing this period.

（翻譯）尼可拉斯，謝謝你的提問。本季債務展期成本與公司歷史水準相同。這並沒有改變我們的平均槓桿率，目前為 CDI 的 10%，與今年第一季和第二季基本持平。我們看到一些債券和其他證券的價格出現了波動，這可能會引起一些投資者的好奇，但這與我們在此期間執行的展期無關。

So the effect on the papers is related to effects related to Brazil, large Brazilian companies, as we have seen in the news. And that brings some loss of confidence on stock of several Brazilian companies, but the cost of rollover has not changed compared to previous quarters.

因此，報紙受到的影響與巴西、巴西大型公司的影響有關，正如我們在新聞中所看到的。這導致一些巴西公司股票的信心下降，但展期成本與前幾季相比並沒有變化。

(interpreted) Our next question also in writing comes from Santander. Could you talk about the drivers for 4Q '25, and that leads you to reach the consolidated net leverage target of 3x by the end of the year?

（翻譯）我們的下一個問題也是以書面形式提出的，來自桑坦德銀行。能否談談2025年第四季的驅動因素，以及這些因素如何促使你們在年底前實現3倍的綜合淨槓桿率目標？

Secondly, market concerns continue about the imbalance in the steel business. Leverage indicators are high, and the mining business where most cash is located, consider that a problem for the management of liabilities for the future? And if so, what are the plans to address it? I believe that crystallizing value in the logistics business is a possibility, I suppose. Can you update us on this and other capital structure strategies that are seriously being considered now?

其次，市場對鋼鐵業的不平衡狀況依然感到擔憂。槓桿指標很高，而大部分現金都集中在礦業領域，這是否會對未來的負債管理造成問題？如果確實存在這種情況，那麼有什麼應對計畫？我認為，在物流業務中實現價值結晶是有可能的。您能否向我們介紹目前正在認真考慮的這項以及其他資本結構策略？

(interpreted) Thanks for your question. As for the fourth quarter of the year, the main drivers of the good results that we expect for the end of the year are the operational basis that we considered during this call. Mining, steel, and cement are operating at a very efficient level with a high production volume and a strictly controlled cost, which already brings a high expectation for the fourth quarter. And also, Martinez very clearly put it, the prices in the steel segment, we are finally seeing a positive trend in terms of steel prices. and also cement that is recovering now as of the third quarter this year.

（翻譯）謝謝你的提問。至於今年第四季度，我們預計年底將取得良好業績，而推動業績的主要因素是我們在本次會議中討論過的營運基礎。採礦、鋼鐵和水泥產業目前都以非常高的效率運轉，產量高，成本控制嚴格，這使得人們對第四季充滿期待。此外，正如馬丁內斯明確指出的那樣，鋼鐵價格方面，我們終於看到了積極的趨勢。水泥價格也從今年第三季開始復甦。

So all these operational assumptions make us believe that despite the seasonality we have in the fourth quarter this year, that the fourth quarter will continue to be a quarter of excellent performance for the company as we had in the fourth quarter '24. If you remember, 4Q '24 was very good in terms of results, and it didn't have the same foundations that we have today for the year of '25. As for leverage and mining, as you mentioned, continue very good. Leverage is not a problem to mining. It continues with more cash than debt.

因此，所有這些營運假設都讓我們相信，儘管今年第四季存在季節性因素，但第四季仍將像 2024 年第四季一樣，成為公司業績表現優異的季度。如果你還記得的話，2024 年第四季業績非常好，但它並沒有像我們今天這樣為 2025 年奠定基礎。至於槓桿和挖礦，正如你所說，做得非常好。槓桿對挖礦來說不是問題。該公司現金流大於負債。

And in still, which is the holding that in a way, consolidates the company's debt and cash -- the way to rebalance or adjust the capital structure, that perhaps what you're asking is focusing on deleveraging, which is what we have been doing in the last two years and most notably in 2025. And in '26, in addition to operational results, some operational results will be geared to deleveraging, but we have some nonorganic operations with CS Infra that will help us to bring the capital structure in still to a better point of balance.

而且，這種控股在某種程度上鞏固了公司的債務和現金——重新平衡或調整資本結構的方式，也許你所問的是專注於去槓桿化，這正是我們在過去兩年裡一直在做的事情，尤其是在2025年。2026 年，除了營運績效外，部分營運績效將用於去槓桿化，但我們與 CS Infra 的一些非內生性業務將有助於我們進一步平衡資本結構。

And remember, in addition to all these initiatives in the year of '25, for the first time in many, many years, CSN did not pay dividends in May as usual, and it is not going to pay dividends in November. It's also usual. So this is a show of the commitment of the company and the company's shareholders to deleverage the company. And when you talk about logistics, it is what I mentioned in the previous question. So I think I already detailed what is to come and when the operation is going to happen, which will certainly be a good lever for '26.

請記住，除了 2025 年的所有這些舉措之外，CSN 多年來第一次沒有像往常一樣在 5 月份支付股息，也不會在 11 月份支付股息。這也很奇怪。這體現了公司及其股東降低公司槓桿率的決心。至於物流，就是我在上一個問題中提到的部分。所以我覺得我已經詳細說明了接下來會發生什麼以及行動何時進行，這肯定會成為 2026 年的一個很好的槓桿。

(interpreted) Our next question in writing comes from Alvaro Rodrigue, he says, you extended amortizations to 2030. What is the weighted average cost of this new debt compared to the previous one? How much incremental interest burden should investors expect and refinancing? What portion of '26, '27 maturities has been already refinanced or prefunded? How much remains exposed to market conditions?

（翻譯）我們下一個書面問題來自阿爾瓦羅·羅德里格，他說，你們將攤銷期延長至 2030 年。與先前的債務相比，這筆新債務的加權平均成本是多少？投資者和再融資機構應預期增加多少利息負擔？2026 年和 2027 年到期的債務中，有多少部分已經進行了再融資或預先融資？還有多少資產仍受市場狀況的影響？

(interpreted) Alvaro, thanks for your question. Cost of refinancing. I just answered that one or two questions ago. No changes, the same costs that we had in previous quarters. '27 maturities.

（翻譯）阿爾瓦羅，謝謝你的提問。再融資成本。我剛才一兩個問題前才回答過這個問題。沒有變化，成本與前幾季相同。 2027年到期。

In '26, we have an important portion of the first quarter already refinanced. I don't have the numbers, but it's a relevant portion, almost the whole first half of '26 already addressed. '27, not yet. When you talk about how much that remains exposed to market condition in the short term, no exposure because in '26, we have already addressed in different ways, even with the CSN Infra operations that can pay out debt.

2026 年，我們已經完成了第一季很大一部分資金的再融資。我沒有具體數字，但這部分內容很重要，2026年上半年幾乎全部都已經討論過了。 2027年還沒有。當談到短期內仍有多大程度會受到市場狀況的影響時，答案是沒有風險敞口，因為在 2026 年，我們已經以不同的方式解決了這個問題，甚至透過 CSN Infra 的營運來償還債務。

So the next operation that we still have a discussion in terms of market conditions is the bond for '28 that we are going to need to refinance. And I understand this is very important for you. This is something that we want to start addressing, although maturity is only in two years' time, but we want to start addressing as fast as possible to have a window of efficiency until the end of this year or the beginning of next year to start addressing this bond of '28.

因此，接下來我們還需要根據市場情況討論的事項是 2028 年的債券，我們需要對其進行再融資。我知道這對你來說非常重要。雖然還有兩年才到期，但我們希望盡快開始著手解決這個問題，以便在今年年底或明年年初之前有一個有效的窗口期來著手處理這筆 2028 年的債券。

(interpreted) Our next question comes from Charles Waters from Sunglass Capital. What is the cost of debt rate of the new debt incurred in '25 to refinance maturing debt?

（翻譯）我們的下一個問題來自 Sunglass Capital 的 Charles Waters。2025 年為償還到期債務而產生的新債務的債務成本率是多少？

(interpreted) Charles, thanks for your question. I already answered, I think, that question. But if you have any more questions, just let me know.

（翻譯）查爾斯，謝謝你的提問。我想我已經回答過這個問題了。如果您還有其他問題，請隨時告訴我。

(interpreted) Next question, Constanta from. This says you mentioned you've been actively refinancing debt and that in the next two years, the majority of the refinancing are bank loans. Could you give us some color on what this refinancing has been like so far, covenants, if they are unsecured, do they have the same seniority as the bonds?

（翻譯）下一個問題，來自康斯坦察。這表明你提到你一直在積極進行債務再融資，並且在接下來的兩年裡，大部分再融資將用於銀行貸款。能否詳細介紹一下此次再融資目前的進展情況，包括契約條款，如果是無擔保貸款，它們的優先權是否與債券相同？

(interpreted) Constanta, thanks for your question. I think that refinancing is something that we already covered. I would just add that the market, in addition to the usual banks that we are still refinancing operations and continuing to lower the company -- lending to the company, we are having other banks that are interested in working with banks we haven't worked with before.

（翻譯）康斯坦察，謝謝你的提問。我認為我們已經討論過再融資的問題了。我還要補充一點，除了我們仍在進行再融資並繼續降低公司貸款的常規銀行之外，市場上還有其他一些銀行對我們以前從未合作過的銀行感興趣。

So this is not a problem for '25, and it's not a problem for '26. As for the rollover, that is being rolled over with the same conditions before and with the same bond guarantees. So we don't have anything that was rolled for '26 that is senior to company bonds, all have the same level of guarantee.

所以這對 2025 年來說不是問題，對 2026 年來說也不是問題。至於展期，展期條件和債券擔保均與之前相同。因此，我們沒有任何在 2026 年到期的、優先於公司債的債券，所有債券的擔保等級都相同。

(Operator Instructions) There are no further questions. I want to turn the call back to Antonio Marco, CFO and IR Officer, for his final remarks.

（操作說明）沒有其他問題了。我想把電話轉回給財務長兼投資者關係長安東尼奧·馬爾科，請他作最後總結發言。

Well, thanks, everyone. Thanks of all the members of CSN that contributed to a very special quarter, record results. And also thank you for attending this conference call. We are closing our conference call for the results of the 3Q '25, and we wish you all a very good week.

謝謝大家。感謝CSN所有成員為取得如此特殊的季度成績和創紀錄的業績所做的貢獻。也感謝各位參加本次電話會議。這次2025年第三季業績電話會議即將結束，祝大家一週愉快。

(interpreted) CSN's conference call is now closed. Have a very good day.

（翻譯）CSN的電話會議現已結束。祝您今天過得非常愉快。

Portions of this transcript that are marked (interpreted) were spoken by an interpreter present on the live call. The interpreter was provided by the company sponsoring this event.

本記錄中標有（已翻譯）的部分是由現場通話中的翻譯人員翻譯的。本次活動的翻譯人員由活動贊助公司提供。