(SE) 2022 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good morning and good evening. Welcome to the Sea Limited Fourth Quarter and Full Year 2022 Results Conference Call. (Operator Instructions) Please note this event is being recorded. I would now like to turn the conference over to Ms. Min Ju Song. Please go ahead.

早上好，晚上好。歡迎來到 Sea Limited 第四季度和 2022 年全年業績電話會議。 （操作員說明）請注意正在記錄此事件。我現在想把會議轉交給 Min Ju Song 女士。請繼續。

Hello, everyone, and welcome to Sea's 2022 Fourth Quarter and Full Year Earnings Conference Call. I am Min Ju Song from Sea's Group Chief Corporate Officer's office. Before we continue, I would like to remind you that we may make forward-looking statements, which are inherently subject to risks and uncertainties and may not be realized in the future for various reasons as stated in our press release.

大家好，歡迎來到Sea 2022年第四季度及全年收益電話會議。我是來自 Sea's Group 首席公司官辦公室的 Min Ju Song。在我們繼續之前，我想提醒您，我們可能會做出前瞻性陳述，這些陳述本質上受到風險和不確定性的影響，並且由於我們新聞稿中所述的各種原因，未來可能無法實現。

Also, this call includes a discussion of certain non-GAAP financial measures, such as adjusted EBITDA. We believe these measures can enhance our investors' understanding of the actual cash flows of our major businesses when used as a complement to our GAAP disclosures. For a discussion of the use of non-GAAP financial measures and reconciliation with the closest GAAP measures, please refer to the section on non-GAAP financial measures in our press release.

此外，此次電話會議還討論了某些非 GAAP 財務指標，例如調整後的 EBITDA。我們相信，這些措施在用作我們的 GAAP 披露的補充時，可以增強我們的投資者對我們主要業務的實際現金流量的了解。有關非 GAAP 財務措施的使用以及與最接近的 GAAP 措施的調節的討論，請參閱我們新聞稿中關於非 GAAP 財務措施的部分。

I have with me Sea's Chairman and Group Chief Executive Officer, Forrest Li; Group Chief Financial Officer, Tony Hou; and Group Chief Corporate Officer, Yanjun Wang. Our management will share strategy and business updates, operating highlights and financial performance for the fourth quarter and full year of 2022. This will be followed by a Q&A session in which we welcome any questions you have.

與我同行的還有 Sea 的董事長兼集團首席執行官 Forrest Li；集團首席財務官 Tony Hou；和集團首席企業官王延軍。我們的管理層將分享 2022 年第四季度和全年的戰略和業務更新、經營亮點和財務業績。隨後將舉行問答環節，歡迎您提出任何問題。

With that, let me turn the call over to Forrest.

有了這個，讓我把電話轉給福雷斯特。

Hello, everyone, and thank you for joining today's call. 2022 was another year of evolution for us, given the macro uncertainties, we pivoted decisively late last year to focus on efficiency and profitability. As a result, we began to see meaningful improvements in the bottom line. For the fourth quarter, our net income and the total adjusted EBITDA both turned positive. Moreover, we generated $320 million of cash from operations in the quarter.

大家好，感謝您參加今天的電話會議。 2022 年對我們來說又是發展的一年，鑑於宏觀不確定性，我們在去年底果斷地轉向專注於效率和盈利能力。結果，我們開始看到底線的顯著改善。第四季度，我們的淨收入和調整後的 EBITDA 總額均轉正。此外，我們在本季度的運營中產生了 3.2 億美元的現金。

It has not been an easy journey. We could make this significant shift within such a short period of time only because of the collective efforts of our Sea team as a whole and a very strong determination and resilience that our team has demonstrated. We took the hard path, but we believe this is the right path to achieve long-term success.

這不是一段輕鬆的旅程。我們能夠在如此短的時間內做出如此重大的轉變，完全是因為我們 Sea 團隊作為一個整體的共同努力，以及我們團隊表現出的非常強大的決心和韌性。我們走過了艱難的道路，但我們相信這是取得長期成功的正確道路。

As we continue this transition and manage sustainable growth going forward, we have adopted the approach of doing less, but doing this better. First, we sharpened our focus on areas with the greatest of potential across our businesses. We exited or downsized operations in noncore markets, streamlined our game pipeline with investments and project closures and deprioritized noncore initiatives.

隨著我們繼續這種轉變並管理未來的可持續增長，我們採用了少做但做得更好的方法。首先，我們更加關注業務中最具潛力的領域。我們退出或縮減了非核心市場的業務，通過投資和項目關閉簡化了我們的遊戲管道，並取消了非核心計劃的優先級。

These measures brought immediate cost improvements. More importantly, they allowed us to focus our managerial, operational and financial resources on doing the core things better. Meanwhile, we focused on doing better for our users across our digital ecosystem.

這些措施立即帶來了成本改善。更重要的是，它們使我們能夠將管理、運營和財務資源集中在更好地完成核心工作上。同時，我們專注於在整個數字生態系統中為用戶做得更好。

At Shopee, we continue to optimize customer services, seller management and logistics. And Garena, we worked to improve accessibility and the content quality of our core game. We have also been leveraging SeaMoney's strong synergies with the rest of our ecosystem to better serve the under addressed the financial needs in our market.

在 Shopee，我們不斷優化客戶服務、賣家管理和物流。而 Garena，我們致力於提高核心遊戲的可訪問性和內容質量。我們還一直在利用 SeaMoney 與我們生態系統其他部分的強大協同作用，以更好地服務於我們市場中未解決的金融需求。

I will elaborate more in detail during the segment discussions. Given the macro uncertainty and our recent strong pivot, we continue to closely monitor the market environment and adjust our pace and fine-tune our operations accordingly. As a result, there may be near-term fluctuations in our results and performance. However, we remain highly confident in the long-term growth potential of our markets and highly focused on capturing these opportunities.

我將在分部討論期間更詳細地闡述。鑑於宏觀不確定性和我們近期的強勁轉向，我們將繼續密切關注市場環境並相應地調整我們的步伐和微調我們的運營。因此，我們的結果和業績可能會出現短期波動。然而，我們仍然對我們市場的長期增長潛力充滿信心，並高度專注於抓住這些機會。

More importantly, our determination and ability to execute towards profitability enable us to start 2023 on a much stronger footing. Let's now discuss each business segment in detail.

更重要的是，我們實現盈利的決心和執行能力使我們能夠以更強大的基礎開啟 2023 年。現在讓我們詳細討論每個業務部門。

Starting with e-commerce. I'm pleased to share that Shopee's adjusted EBITDA turned positive for the fourth time in the fourth quarter of 2022. The improvement we achieved in core marketplace revenue and operating costs were key factors driving fourth quarter profitability.

從電子商務開始。我很高興與大家分享，Shopee 的調整後 EBITDA 在 2022 年第四季度第四次轉正。我們在核心市場收入和運營成本方面取得的改善是推動第四季度盈利的關鍵因素。

In the fourth quarter, GAAP revenue was $2.1 billion, up 32% year-on-year. This was mainly due to strong growth in core marketplace revenue. Within the core marketplace revenue, both transaction-based fees and advertising revenue increased as we deepened monetization and saw greater investments by sellers on our platform to serve buyers better.

第四季度，GAAP 收入為 21 億美元，同比增長 32%。這主要是由於核心市場收入的強勁增長。在核心市場收入中，基於交易的費用和廣告收入均有所增加，因為我們深化了貨幣化並看到賣家在我們的平台上進行了更多投資以更好地為買家服務。

Full year performance generally mirrors the trend of the fourth quarter with GAAP revenue growing 44% from 2021. In terms of operating costs, we made improvements for each of the major expenses in the fourth quarter. GAAP sales and marketing expenses improved by 34% quarter-on-quarter and 55% year-on-year driven by more targeted investments across shipping incentives and brand marketing. There were also sequential improvements in R&D and G&A expenses.

全年業績大致反映了第四季度的趨勢，GAAP 收入比 2021 年增長了 44%。在運營成本方面，我們在第四季度對每項主要費用進行了改進。 GAAP 銷售和營銷費用環比增長 34%，同比增長 55%，這得益於航運激勵和品牌營銷方面更有針對性的投資。研發和 G&A 費用也有所改善。

Now looking at each region. In our Asia market, we reported a positive adjusted EBITDA of $320 million in the fourth quarter. This represents a significant improvement from the previous quarter, which had an adjusted EBITDA loss of $270 million. In our other markets, the adjusted EBITDA loss also decreased by more than 50% quarter-on-quarter to $124 million.

現在看每個地區。在我們的亞洲市場，我們報告第四季度調整後的 EBITDA 為 3.2 億美元。這比上一季度有了顯著改善，上一季度調整後的 EBITDA 虧損為 2.7 億美元。在我們的其他市場，調整後的 EBITDA 虧損也環比下降超過 50% 至 1.24 億美元。

In Brazil, we continued to enjoy strong improvement in unit economies. Our contribution margin loss per order decreased by 54% from the previous quarter to $0.47. During 2022, we have been able to drive meaningful improvements in logistics costs to our ecosystem. This will remain an important area of focus going forward.

在巴西，我們繼續享受單位經濟的強勁改善。我們每筆訂單的貢獻保證金損失比上一季度下降了 54% 至 0.47 美元。在 2022 年期間，我們已經能夠顯著改善我們生態系統的物流成本。這仍將是未來的一個重要重點領域。

We believe that lowering the cost to serve will be key to our long-term growth by unlocking large, underserved user segments across our markets. While we have already seen early results from these efforts, there is still greater room for improvement.

我們相信，通過釋放我們市場中服務不足的大量用戶群，降低服務成本將是我們長期增長的關鍵。雖然我們已經看到這些努力的初步成果，但仍有更大的改進空間。

In addition to cost management, we remain highly focused on improving user experience. For example, we have been systematically reviewing and optimizing our process management for customer services. We focus not only on certain key metrics and targets for general user experience, but also on more proactive management of (inaudible).

除了成本管理，我們還高度關注改善用戶體驗。例如，我們一直在系統地審查和優化我們對客戶服務的流程管理。我們不僅關註一般用戶體驗的某些關鍵指標和目標，還關注更主動的管理（聽不清）。

On logistics, we have been working to provide a more efficient and reliable experience to our users. This includes reducing wait time, minimizing delivery losses, and providing a more seamless impact experience to both sellers and the buyers in managing logistics. The macro environment remains uncertain and there are still headwinds on consumption in our market.

在物流方面，我們一直致力於為用戶提供更高效、更可靠的體驗。這包括減少等待時間，最大限度地減少交付損失，以及在管理物流方面為買賣雙方提供更無縫的影響體驗。宏觀環境仍不明朗，市場消費仍面臨阻力。

With our recent pivot, we are showing a positive bottom line for the first time. As such, our focus this year will be to continue to solidify the efficiency gains and optimize the cost structure across our markets.

憑藉我們最近的支點，我們首次顯示出積極的底線。因此，我們今年的重點將是繼續鞏固效率收益並優化我們市場的成本結構。

In our Asian market, we will work to further strengthen our leading position and profitability. In Brazil, we will focus on driving the business towards profitability to capture the significant opportunity in this new market. GMV will largely remain an output for us in the near term.

在我們的亞洲市場，我們將努力進一步加強我們的領先地位和盈利能力。在巴西，我們將專注於推動業務實現盈利，以抓住這個新市場的重要機遇。短期內，GMV 在很大程度上仍將是我們的產出。

It is important to reemphasize our long-term focus on sustainable growth for Shopee. In our view, e-commerce penetration to our market remains low as compared to its full potential relative to off-line retail. Our market also enjoys highly favorable demographical trend in terms of their large and growing digital population.

重要的是要再次強調我們對 Shopee 可持續增長的長期關注。我們認為，與線下零售相關的全部潛力相比，電子商務對我們市場的滲透率仍然很低。就其龐大且不斷增長的數字人口而言，我們的市場也享有非常有利的人口趨勢。

This is further supported by long-term economic growth potential across our markets. The key question presented to us at this stage is how much of these underserved needs for online consumption we can sustainably address? This determines the size of the profitable (inaudible) we will be able to capture. We believe a large part of the answer lies in our ability to continue to improve the cost structure of our ecosystem through facility, technology, operational excellence and the most importantly an unwavering commitment to serve our users.

我們市場的長期經濟增長潛力進一步支持了這一點。現階段向我們提出的關鍵問題是，我們可以可持續地解決這些未得到滿足的在線消費需求中的多少？這決定了我們將能夠捕獲的盈利（聽不清）的大小。我們認為，很大一部分答案在於我們有能力通過設施、技術、卓越運營以及最重要的堅定不移的服務用戶承諾來繼續改善我們生態系統的成本結構。

We believe everything we are doing now is to best position us to achieve sustainable growth, profitability and the defensibility of our ecosystem in the long run.

我們相信，我們現在所做的一切都是為了讓我們處於最佳位置，以實現可持續增長、盈利能力和我們生態系統的長期防禦能力。

Now let's turn to digital entertainment. In 2022, online game as a market was broadly impacted by ongoing moderation in user engagement and monetization. Our game experienced a similar trend.

現在讓我們轉向數字娛樂。 2022 年，網絡遊戲市場受到用戶參與度和貨幣化持續放緩的廣泛影響。我們的遊戲經歷了類似的趨勢。

During the fourth quarter, Garena GAAP revenue was $949 million and bookings were $544 million. Quarterly active users reached 486 million with 44 million quarterly paying users. The paying user ratio and average revenue per user remains relatively stable quarter-on-quarter.

第四季度，Garena GAAP 收入為 9.49 億美元，預訂量為 5.44 億美元。季度活躍用戶達到 4.86 億，季度付費用戶達到 4400 萬。付費用戶比例和每用戶平均收入環比保持相對穩定。

For the full year of 2022, GAAP revenue was $3.9 billion, with bookings at $2.8 billion. Despite ongoing moderation, we remain highly focused on sustaining our current core game.

2022 年全年，GAAP 收入為 39 億美元，預訂量為 28 億美元。儘管持續適度，我們仍然高度專注於維持我們當前的核心遊戲。

We prioritize user engagement by offering better and more enjoyable experiences in our game. We have targeted initiatives for existing and retaining users. We have also been streaming live game content to improve accessibility and gameplay for all users across diverse markets.

我們通過在我們的遊戲中提供更好、更愉快的體驗來優先考慮用戶參與。我們針對現有用戶和保留用戶制定了有針對性的舉措。我們還一直在流式傳輸實時遊戲內容，以改善不同市場所有用戶的可訪問性和遊戲玩法。

In managing cost efficiency, we have comprehensively reviewed our publishing and self-development pipeline in line with our principle of doing less, but doing it better. As a result, we have divested and closed certain projects and remain selective about high potential projects to better direct our resources.

在管理成本效率方面，我們本著少做但做得更好的原則，全面審查了我們的出版和自主開發渠道。因此，我們剝離並關閉了某些項目，並對高潛力項目保持選擇性，以更好地引導我們的資源。

This year, we will focus on solidifying our strength in core games and communities while continuing to position ourselves to pursue long-term growth opportunities as they arise.

今年，我們將專注於鞏固我們在核心遊戲和社區方面的實力，同時繼續定位自己以尋求出現的長期增長機會。

Lastly, our digital financial services business. SeaMoney's GAAP revenue was $380 million in the fourth quarter of 2022, up 92% year-on-year. Adjusted EBITDA also turned positive for the first time at $76 million for the fourth quarter. The improvement in profitability was driven by both strong top line growth and optimization of sales and marketing spends.

最後，我們的數字金融服務業務。 SeaMoney 的 GAAP 收入在 2022 年第四季度為 3.8 億美元，同比增長 92%。第四季度調整後的 EBITDA 也首次轉為正數，達到 7600 萬美元。強勁的收入增長以及銷售和營銷支出的優化推動了盈利能力的提高。

For the full year of 2022, GAAP revenue was $1.2 billion, growing 150% year-on-year, and adjusted EBITDA loss was $229 million. As of the end of the fourth quarter, the total loans receivable on our balance sheet was $2.1 billion, net of allowance for credit losses of $239 million.

2022 年全年，GAAP 收入為 12 億美元，同比增長 150%，調整後的 EBITDA 虧損為 2.29 億美元。截至第四季度末，我們資產負債表上的應收貸款總額為 21 億美元，扣除信貸損失準備金 2.39 億美元。

Our SeaMoney business is a highly synergistic part of our digital ecosystem. For example, our mobile wallet has resulted in lower transaction costs and more stimulus transaction experience on Shopee.

我們的 SeaMoney 業務是我們數字生態系統中具有高度協同作用的部分。例如，我們的手機錢包在 Shopee 上帶來了更低的交易成本和更多刺激的交易體驗。

Shopee in turn has allowed the mobile wallet to grow its user base and build user habits more efficiently. With Shopee, our credit business is able to leverage a large captive user base, a highly relevant use case with significant scale and the wealth of user insights for more effective underwriting.

Shopee 反過來又讓移動錢包擴大了用戶群，更有效地培養了用戶習慣。借助 Shopee，我們的信貸業務能夠利用龐大的專屬用戶群、具有顯著規模的高度相關用例和豐富的用戶洞察力，以實現更有效的承保。

At the same time, Shopee Benefit has consumers enjoy more flexible payment options, successful credit and greater affordability. We expect our digital insurance, wealth management and the [bank] businesses to enjoy similar synergies with our e-commerce platform to serve a large, underserved community in our market.

同時，Shopee Benefit讓消費者享有更靈活的支付選擇、成功的信用和更高的負擔能力。我們希望我們的數字保險、財富管理和 [銀行] 業務與我們的電子商務平台享有類似的協同效應，為我們市場中服務不足的大型社區提供服務。

We see SeaMoney as an important long-term growth engine for us. We will continue to prioritize the ecosystem strategy in pursuing this significant opportunity with efficiency and profitability.

我們將 SeaMoney 視為我們重要的長期增長引擎。我們將繼續優先考慮生態系統戰略，以高效和盈利的方式追求這一重要機遇。

To conclude, our performance in the fourth quarter was an important demonstration of our ability to focus on profitability and deliver meaningful results. This is a testament to the strength and the resilience of our underlying business model and the execution capability of our team.

總而言之，我們在第四季度的表現是我們專注於盈利能力和取得有意義成果的能力的重要證明。這證明了我們基礎業務模型的實力和彈性以及我們團隊的執行能力。

Although we expect macro uncertainty to continue to cloud the horizon in the near term, the long-term potential of our businesses and the market remains fast. We plan to capture these opportunities while delivering strong and sustained shareholder returns over time.

儘管我們預計短期內宏觀不確定性將繼續籠罩在地平線上，但我們的業務和市場的長期潛力依然強勁。我們計劃抓住這些機會，同時隨著時間的推移提供強勁和持續的股東回報。

With that, I will invite Tony to discuss our financials.

有了這個，我將邀請託尼討論我們的財務狀況。

Thank you, Forrest, and thanks to everyone for joining the call. We have included detailed financial schedules together with the corresponding management analysis in today's press release and Forrest has discussed some of our financial highlights. So I will focus my comments on the other relevant metrics.

謝謝你，福雷斯特，感謝大家加入電話會議。我們在今天的新聞稿中包含了詳細的財務時間表以及相應的管理分析，Forrest 討論了我們的一些財務亮點。所以我將把我的評論集中在其他相關指標上。

For Sea overall, total GAAP revenue increased 7% year-on-year to $3.5 billion in the fourth quarter and 25% year-on-year to $12.4 billion for the full year of 2022. This was primarily driven by the improved monetization in our e-commerce and digital financial services businesses, partially offset by lower GAAP revenue in our digital entertainment business.

就 Sea 整體而言，第四季度 GAAP 總收入同比增長 7% 至 35 億美元，2022 年全年同比增長 25% 至 124 億美元。這主要是由於我們的貨幣化程度提高所致電子商務和數字金融服務業務，部分被我們數字娛樂業務的 GAAP 收入減少所抵消。

On e-commerce, our fourth quarter GAAP revenue of $2.1 billion included GAAP marketplace revenue of $1.8 billion, up 43% year-on-year and GAAP product revenue of $0.3 billion. For the full year of 2022, GAAP revenue of $7.3 billion included GAAP marketplace revenue of $6.2 billion, up 52% year-on-year, and GAAP product revenue of $1.1 billion.

在電子商務方面，我們第四季度的 GAAP 收入為 21 億美元，其中 GAAP 市場收入為 18 億美元，同比增長 43%，GAAP 產品收入為 3 億美元。 2022 年全年，GAAP 收入為 73 億美元，其中 GAAP 市場收入為 62 億美元，同比增長 52%，GAAP 產品收入為 11 億美元。

E-commerce adjusted EBITDA stands positive for the first time in the fourth quarter at $196 million. The improvements were mainly from more targeted investments in our sales and marketing spending, deepened monetization and other optimization of cost structure.

電子商務調整後的 EBITDA 在第四季度首次為正，為 1.96 億美元。這些改進主要來自對我們的銷售和營銷支出進行更有針對性的投資、深化貨幣化和其他成本結構優化。

Adjusted EBITDA for the fourth quarter was also positively impacted by approximately $80 million of accrual reversal resulting from changes in previous estimations of certain expenses as we made the management decision to strongly pivot to a clear focus on cost efficiency.

第四季度調整後的 EBITDA 也受到約 8000 萬美元的應計逆轉的積極影響，這是由於我們做出了強烈轉向明確關注成本效率的管理決定，導致先前對某些費用的估計發生變化。

2022 full year adjusted EBITDA loss improved by 34% year-on-year to $1.7 billion. Digital entertainment bookings were $544 million in the fourth quarter and $2.8 billion for the full year of 2022. The GAAP revenue was $949 million in the fourth quarter and $3.9 billion for the full year of 2022.

2022 年全年調整後的 EBITDA 虧損同比改善 34% 至 17 億美元。第四季度數字娛樂預訂量為 5.44 億美元，2022 年全年為 28 億美元。第四季度 GAAP 收入為 9.49 億美元，2022 年全年為 39 億美元。

Digital entertainment adjusted EBITDA was $258 million in the fourth quarter and $1.3 billion for the full year of 2022. In the fourth quarter of 2022, we also recognized an impairment of goodwill charge of $178 million pertaining to certain historical investments for the digital entertainment business.

第四季度數字娛樂調整後的 EBITDA 為 2.58 億美元，2022 年全年為 13 億美元。在 2022 年第四季度，我們還確認了與數字娛樂業務的某些歷史投資相關的商譽減值 1.78 億美元。

Impairment of goodwill are excluded from segment adjusted EBITDA calculation as it is not reflected of the underlying trends in our current quarter operating performance.

商譽減值不包括在部門調整後的 EBITDA 計算中，因為它沒有反映我們當前季度經營業績的基本趨勢。

Digital Financial Services GAAP revenue was up by 92% year-on-year to $380 million in the fourth quarter and up by 116% year-over-year to $1.2 billion for the full year of 2022. This was mainly driven by the growth in our credit businesses.

第四季度數字金融服務 GAAP 收入同比增長 92% 至 3.8 億美元，2022 年全年同比增長 116% 至 12 億美元。這主要是由於我們的信貸業務。

Adjusted EBITDA turned positive for the first time at $76 million in the fourth quarter and adjusted EBITDA loss was $229 million for the full year of 2022. Improvements in the bottom line was driven by both strong top line growth and optimization of sales and marketing spend. As of end of the fourth quarter, total loans receivable was $2.1 billion, net of allowance for credit losses of $239 million.

第四季度調整後的 EBITDA 首次轉為正值，達到 7600 萬美元，2022 年全年調整後的 EBITDA 虧損為 2.29 億美元。利潤的改善得益於強勁的收入增長以及銷售和營銷支出的優化。截至第四季度末，應收貸款總額為 21 億美元，扣除信貸損失準備金 2.39 億美元。

Nonperforming loans past due by more than 90 days as a percentage of our total gross loans receivable declined from less than 4% in the third quarter to less than 2%, mainly due to the shortening of loan write-off period in a certain market from 180 days to 120 days in the fourth quarter based on our assessment of historical credit losses. Without this change in write-off period, the ratio would be around 5%.

逾期 90 天以上的不良貸款占應收貸款總額的比例從第三季度的不到 4% 下降到不到 2%，這主要是由於某些市場的貸款核銷期限從根據我們對歷史信用損失的評估，第四季度為 180 天至 120 天。如果註銷期沒有這種變化，該比率將在 5% 左右。

Returning to our consolidated numbers. We recognized a net nonoperating income of $35 million in the fourth quarter of 2022 compared to a net nonoperating loss of $71 million in the fourth quarter of 2021.

回到我們的合併數字。我們確認 2022 年第四季度的非營業淨收入為 3500 萬美元，而 2021 年第四季度的非營業淨虧損為 7100 萬美元。

Our nonoperating income for the fourth quarter was primarily due to a $200 million net gain from 2022 convertible bond repurchase, partially offset by investment losses recognized amidst lower valuations in the broader markets. For the full year, our net nonoperating loss was $13 million compared to loss of $132 million for the full year of 2021.

我們第四季度的非營業收入主要是由於 2022 年可轉換債券回購帶來的 2 億美元淨收益，部分被大盤估值較低時確認的投資損失所抵消。全年，我們的淨非運營虧損為 1300 萬美元，而 2021 年全年虧損為 1.32 億美元。

We had a net income tax credit of $43 million in the fourth quarter of 2022 compared to net income tax expense of $106 million in the fourth quarter of 2021. The income tax credit was primarily due to recognition of deferred tax assets from certain tax losses carried forward from our e-commerce business, partially offset by income tax incurred by our Digital Entertainment business.

我們在 2022 年第四季度的淨所得稅抵免額為 4300 萬美元，而 2021 年第四季度的淨所得稅支出為 1.06 億美元。所得稅抵免額主要是由於確認了某些稅項虧損的遞延稅項資產從我們的電子商務業務中轉出，部分被我們的數字娛樂業務產生的所得稅抵消。

We recognized the deferred tax assets as we assess that it is more likely than not that our future taxable income will be sufficient to allow the deferred tax assets to be utilized. For the full year, our net income tax expense was $168 million compared to $333 million for the full year of 2021.

我們確認遞延稅項資產，因為我們評估我們未來的應稅收入很可能足以讓遞延稅項資產得到動用。全年，我們的淨所得稅支出為 1.68 億美元，而 2021 年全年為 3.33 億美元。

As a result, net income was $423 million in the fourth quarter of 2022 as compared to net loss of $616 million in the fourth quarter of 2021. This included negative impact of $178 million impairment of goodwill related to certain historical investments for the Digital Entertainment business and the positive impact of $200 million net gain on debt extinguishment as well as positive impact of approximately $130 million in accruals reversal. For the full year, net loss was $1.7 billion.

因此，2022 年第四季度的淨收入為 4.23 億美元，而 2021 年第四季度的淨虧損為 6.16 億美元。這包括與數字娛樂業務的某些歷史投資相關的 1.78 億美元商譽減值的負面影響2 億美元的淨收益對債務清償的積極影響以及約 1.3 億美元的應計費用逆轉的積極影響。全年淨虧損為 17 億美元。

With that, let me turn the call to Min Ju.

有了這個，讓我把電話轉給 Min Ju。

Thank you Forrest and Tony. We are now ready to open the call for questions. As usual, our Group Chief Corporate Officer, Yanjun Wang, will lead this task. Operator?

謝謝福雷斯特和托尼。我們現在準備好開始提問了。與往常一樣，我們的集團首席企業官 Yanjun Wang 將領導這項任務。操作員？

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from Pang Vitt from Goldman Sachs.

（操作員說明）我們的第一個問題來自高盛的 Pang Vitt。

Congratulations management team on a very strong quarter and solid turnaround. Two questions from me, please, on Shopee. Number one, can you please explain to us on the major drivers that led to this really fast on about in Shopee earnings this quarter? How did you manage to achieve this?

祝賀管理團隊取得了非常強勁的季度業績和穩健的轉變。請在 Shopee 上問我兩個問題。第一，您能否向我們解釋導致本季度 Shopee 收益增長如此之快的主要驅動因素？你是如何做到這一點的？

Is it by way of the take rate increase and big cost cutting? Or is there a deliberate attempt to cut off unprofitable GMV in order to achieve this? That's question number one.

是通過提高采用率和大幅削減成本來實現的嗎？還是有意切斷無利可圖的GMV來達到這個目的？這是第一個問題。

Question number 2, going forward, as you have already achieved solid turnaround in bottom line, how do you plan to balance between growth and profitability? How do we view confidence that growth will come back? And how do you view the current competitive landscape, especially direct from new social commerce player? Will you make sure that you maintain your market share? And is there any color or soft guidance that you can provide us when it comes to growth?

問題 2，展望未來，由於您已經實現了盈利的穩固轉變，您計劃如何在增長和盈利之間取得平衡？我們如何看待增長將恢復的信心？您如何看待當前的競爭格局，尤其是直接來自新社交商務玩家的競爭格局？你會確保保持你的市場份額嗎？在增長方面，您可以為我們提供任何色彩或軟性指導嗎？

Thank you, Pang. In terms of the drivers for our quick turnaround for Shopee, I think as we shared in the earnings and Forrest messaged earlier on, that it's on all fronts. In terms of top line, we managed to increase our take rate and deepened monetization across various types of revenue, including the core marketplace revenue, which are relatively high margin as well as other types of revenue as our sellers invest more in the platform to grow with us.

謝謝你，龐。就我們為 Shopee 快速轉變的驅動因素而言，我認為正如我們在收益和福雷斯特早些時候所傳達的信息中所分享的那樣，它在各個方面都是如此。在收入方面，我們設法提高了各種收入類型的收入率並加深了貨幣化，包括利潤率相對較高的核心市場收入以及其他類型的收入，因為我們的賣家更多地投資於平台以實現增長和我們。

And also on the cost front and expense front, we reduced sales marketing expense. If you noticed, our sales marketing for Shopee dropped more than 50% year-on-year, while GMV sustained and grew around 7% on the constant currency basis year-on-year. So that shows the resilience of our ecosystem and the strong leadership and execution excellence of our team in managing this fast transition over a few months' time to turn the platform into a positive bottom line, while still sustain a strong leadership of the platform.

在成本和費用方面，我們也減少了銷售營銷費用。如果你注意到的話，我們對 Shopee 的銷售營銷同比下降了 50% 以上，而 GMV 在固定貨幣基礎上同比持續增長了 7% 左右。因此，這顯示了我們生態系統的彈性以及我們團隊在幾個月的時間內管理這一快速過渡以將平台轉變為積極的底線的強大領導力和卓越執行力，同時仍然保持平台的強大領導力。

At the same time, we also enjoyed savings in our R&D and G&A expenses quarter-on-quarter. So on all fronts, we've been improving and also is well aligned with our previous target to turn quickly and decisively as we see macro uncertainties in our markets. And that has always been our ability to execute on what we deliver -- what we promised to the market and to our own teams.

與此同時，我們的研發和 G&A 費用也比上一季度有所節省。因此，在所有方面，我們一直在改進，並且與我們之前的目標非常一致，即在我們看到市場存在宏觀不確定性時迅速果斷地轉向。這一直是我們執行我們交付的東西的能力——我們向市場和我們自己的團隊承諾的東西。

As we shared, there has not been an easy quarter. There's a lot of hard work, and we make sacrifices. We exited the markets, we downsized operations, we walked through all these initiatives to decide which is core, which is less core, what we need to prioritize and what we need to deprioritize.

正如我們分享的那樣，這個季度並不輕鬆。有很多艱苦的工作，我們做出了犧牲。我們退出了市場，我們縮減了運營規模，我們通過所有這些舉措來決定哪些是核心的，哪些不是核心的，我們需要優先考慮什麼以及我們需要降低優先級。

With a lot of work condensed in a few months' time with a tremendous effort by the entire Sea team, and therefore, we managed to achieve this. And I think this also gives us much better confidence to navigate whatever challenges that might come our way in the future.

在整個 Sea 團隊的巨大努力下，幾個月的時間裡凝聚了大量工作，因此，我們成功地實現了這一目標。我認為這也讓我們更有信心應對未來可能遇到的任何挑戰。

Now in terms of outlook and balancing growth and profitability. So as we shared also, our outlook for markets in the long run remains very strong. Because of its demographic features, the young growing population, deepened digital penetration, vis-à-vis offline retail and also the economic growth potential of our region.

現在就前景和平衡增長與盈利能力而言。因此，正如我們所分享的那樣，從長遠來看，我們對市場的前景仍然非常樂觀。由於其人口特徵，年輕人口不斷增長，數字滲透率不斷加深，相對於線下零售以及我們地區的經濟增長潛力。

At the same time, we believe that all these efforts we are making in reducing the cost structure of our ecosystem, and strengthening our ability to serve our users with better user experience will allow us to capture a larger share of the pie in the long run and further strengthen our market leadership which is a dual role in addition to profitability we have for our Asian markets.

同時，我們相信，我們為降低生態系統的成本結構所做的所有這些努力，以及加強我們以更好的用戶體驗為用戶服務的能力，從長遠來看將使我們能夠佔據更大的市場份額進一步加強我們的市場領導地位，這是我們在亞洲市場的盈利能力之外的雙重角色。

So there is not a shift in our view about the long-term growth potential and focus of our business to capture this opportunity. In the near term, of course, we continue to see macro uncertainty, headwinds to consumption. So we will be adjusting and fine-tuning our pace and operations carefully in a highly dynamic manner, observe our markets from period to period and adjust accordingly.

因此，我們對抓住這一機會的長期增長潛力和業務重點的看法沒有改變。當然，在短期內，我們繼續看到宏觀不確定性、消費阻力。因此，我們將以高度動態的方式仔細調整和微調我們的步伐和運營，不時觀察我們的市場並做出相應調整。

And therefore, we also share that we may expect fluctuations in our performance and results in the near term from period to period. But on the other hand, I think we have demonstrated clearly our ability to execute both growth and profitability. So in the long run, we are very focused on sustainable growth and further defending and solidifying our ecosystem.

因此，我們也認為我們可能會預期我們的業績和結果在短期內會有所波動。但另一方面，我認為我們已經清楚地展示了我們實現增長和盈利的能力。因此，從長遠來看，我們非常關注可持續增長，並進一步捍衛和鞏固我們的生態系統。

Now in terms of competitive landscape, our view is that in the long run, investment in the ecosystem is important, but investment is not just solely in the shape of financial investment, but more importantly, in terms of operational capabilities, these local operational capabilities. This is still a heavy operational system that we need to build for our online retail marketplace.

現在在競爭格局上，我們的看法是，從長遠來看，生態系統的投資很重要，但投資不僅僅是金融投資，更重要的是在運營能力上，這些地方的運營能力。 .這仍然是我們需要為在線零售市場構建的一個繁重的操作系統。

Therefore, there will always be competitors or other entrants into the market with different angles, different positioning, different advantages, et cetera. But the beauty of e-commerce is that it requires a comprehensive set of skills and capabilities that need to be built over a relatively long period of time, especially in our markets where infrastructure are still very underdeveloped, and especially in Southeast Asia, where the markets are diverse and their individual -- many individual markets.

因此，總會有競爭者或其他進入者以不同的角度、不同的定位、不同的優勢等進入市場。但電子商務的美妙之處在於，它需要一套全面的技能和能力，需要在相對較長的時間內建立起來，尤其是在我們基礎設施還很不發達的市場，尤其是在東南亞，那裡的基礎設施還很不發達。市場是多種多樣的，而且它們各自獨立 -- -- 許多獨立的市場。

Collectively, these are large opportunities, but you have to conquer them one by one. And every market has its own environment, its own setting, its own requirements. Therefore, we believe we're unique in the sense that we're able to achieve strong market leadership market by market across so many markets in Southeast Asia.

總的來說，這些都是很大的機會，但你必須一個一個地去征服它們。每個市場都有自己的環境、背景和要求。因此，我們相信我們是獨一無二的，因為我們能夠在東南亞眾多市場逐個市場取得強大的市場領導地位。

And at the same time, quick turnaround of profitability, and that gives us confidence that we have more resources and capability not just financially, but also operationally and managerially to defend our ecosystem against any future competition, and we'll remain humble and remain vigilant on competition.

與此同時，盈利能力的快速轉變讓我們相信，我們不僅在財務上，而且在運營和管理上都有更多的資源和能力來保護我們的生態系統免受未來的任何競爭，我們將保持謙虛和警惕競爭上。

Our next question comes from Alicia Yap from Citigroup.

我們的下一個問題來自花旗集團的 Alicia Yap。

Congrats on the strong results. I have 2 questions. First is I wanted to follow up on the previous questions regarding how should we balance between growth versus the profitability? Is there any short-term margin target that management would hope to maintain for each of your business segments? For example, if there's any incremental margin improvement that you can achieve, then you would reinvest those incremental back to the business to drive faster growth? Because you already turned profitable on both, for example, the Shopee and the DFS. So I'm just wondering, is there a short-term margin target that you wanted to maintain and then any incremental that you can reinvest back to the business to drive faster growth?

祝賀你取得了優異的成績。我有兩個問題。首先，我想跟進之前關於我們應該如何在增長與盈利能力之間取得平衡的問題？管理層是否希望為您的每個業務部門維持任何短期利潤率目標？例如，如果您可以實現任何增量利潤改善，那麼您會將這些增量重新投資回業務以推動更快的增長嗎？因為您已經在 Shopee 和 DFS 上都實現了盈利。所以我只是想知道，是否有您想要維持的短期利潤率目標，然後您可以將任何增量再投資回業務以推動更快的增長？

Second is on your digital finance services, given you will be rolling out the Digibank's initiatives soon, will that affect your EBITDA profitability trend for 2023?

其次是關於您的數字金融服務，鑑於您將很快推出 Digibank 的舉措，這會影響您 2023 年的 EBITDA 盈利趨勢嗎？

Thank you, Alicia. In terms of short-term margin targets, so different business units are different. Of course, for Garena, our focus now is continue to stabilize our user base and providing better experience to our users on our core games; at the same time, continue to improve our profit margins.

謝謝你，艾麗西亞。在短期利潤率目標方面，所以不同的業務部門是不同的。當然，對於Garena，我們現在的重點是繼續穩定我們的用戶基礎，並在我們的核心遊戲上為我們的用戶提供更好的體驗；同時，繼續提高我們的利潤率。

I mean at more than 47% EBITDA margin, we believe that we are still very high compared to the industry average. And we have shown ability to achieve very high margin for the business before, and we'll continue to be very -- watching our margin closely to improve our efficiency.

我的意思是超過 47% 的 EBITDA 利潤率，我們相信與行業平均水平相比我們仍然非常高。我們之前已經展示了為業務實現非常高的利潤率的能力，我們將繼續密切關注我們的利潤率以提高我們的效率。

In terms of digital financial services, I think we -- still it's very early stage. We just turned a profitable for the first quarter, and we'll continue to expand the overall -- the service offerings to our users so that we can reach a broader user base and offer more diversified services and -- but the focus on that business is more on the quality and long-term sustainability and trust building with our users.

在數字金融服務方面，我認為我們 - 仍處於非常早期的階段。我們剛剛在第一季度實現盈利，我們將繼續擴大整體 - 為用戶提供的服務，以便我們能夠覆蓋更廣泛的用戶群並提供更多樣化的服務 - 但專注於該業務更多的是質量和長期可持續性以及與我們用戶建立信任。

It's not to us at this stage a speed-driven business. We believe building a solid foundation, leveraging the ecosystem advantages it has. Being part of a Sea ecosystem with the strong synergies with Shopee, in particular, is the most important thing at this stage.

在這個階段，這對我們來說不是速度驅動的業務。我們相信建立堅實的基礎，利用其擁有的生態系統優勢。成為與 Shopee 強大協同作用的 Sea 生態系統的一部分，尤其是現階段最重要的事情。

And for Shopee, it's going to be a market-by-market dynamic assessment. All our Asian markets are currently EBITDA-positive. Now Brazil market, which is relatively new, we've seen significant profitability improvement while we continue to see growth -- relatively stronger growth there compared to our Asia markets.

對於 Shopee，這將是逐個市場的動態評估。我們所有亞洲市場目前的 EBITDA 均為正值。現在巴西市場相對較新，我們看到盈利能力顯著提高，同時我們繼續看到增長——與我們的亞洲市場相比，那裡的增長相對強勁。

So I think it's going to be a highly dynamic process. For each market at any period of time, we'll assess the market condition the natural user growth rates, the competitive landscape, our operational cost structure in that market, and then we'll assess what would be a reasonable profit margin we could achieve in that market versus the growth we want to achieve in the market.

所以我認為這將是一個高度動態的過程。對於任何時間段的每個市場，我們將評估市場狀況、自然用戶增長率、競爭格局、我們在該市場的運營成本結構，然後我們將評估我們可以實現的合理利潤率在該市場與我們希望在市場上實現的增長。

As I said before, it's not necessarily a trade-off. If the business is -- growth is driven only by investment in sales marketing, it's not a good business we want to be in to begin with. And the fact that we're able to cut sales and marketing by more than 50% while sustaining GMV already itself a strong testament of the -- our ecosystem capability.

正如我之前所說，這不一定是一種權衡。如果業務是 - 增長僅由銷售營銷投資驅動，那麼這不是我們想要開始的好業務。事實上，我們能夠在維持 GMV 的同時將銷售和營銷削減 50% 以上，這本身就是對我們生態系統能力的有力證明。

So it doesn't necessarily go against each other. We don't necessarily think that growth and profitability need to be a trade-off. We do think that while we -- some of our measures that we are focused on such as cost structure improvement, logistics improvement, seller management, better consumer services and better buyer experience, all will improve the efficiency of any investment we make into our ecosystem and also improve the profitability as well as growth.

所以它不一定互相反對。我們不一定認為增長和盈利能力需要權衡取捨。我們確實認為，雖然我們——我們關注的一些措施，如成本結構改善、物流改善、賣家管理、更好的消費者服務和更好的買家體驗，所有這些都會提高我們對生態系統進行的任何投資的效率並提高盈利能力和增長。

So a lot of it depends on the natural growth, the macro environment, competitive landscape and our operational stage and views at any period of time in a market-by-market assessment. We don't have a single number for Shopee as a whole, but it's going to be a lot of bottom-up and dynamic assessment and fine-tuned operations.

所以在很大程度上取決於自然增長、宏觀環境、競爭格局以及我們的運營階段和對每個市場評估中任何時間段的看法。對於整個 Shopee，我們沒有一個單一的數字，但這將是很多自下而上的動態評估和微調操作。

So that's the trick of the business, but also, I think our range of strength in operating a highly diversified markets and with different development strategies. I think overall, we -- in long run, of course, we believe in sustainable growth, which also means profitable growth for the business, and we still see this as our strong growth engine.

所以這就是業務的訣竅，而且，我認為我們在經營高度多元化的市場和不同的發展戰略方面的實力範圍。我認為總體而言，從長遠來看，當然，我們相信可持續增長，這也意味著業務的盈利增長，我們仍然將其視為我們強大的增長引擎。

Our next question comes from Piyush Choudhary from HSBC.

我們的下一個問題來自匯豐銀行的 Piyush Choudhary。

Congratulations to the management on a strong set of results. Two questions. Firstly, on Shopee, can you discuss GMV growth trends quarter-on-quarter in local currency, which markets are doing better? And any color on the outlook for '23? How is customer behavior shaping with Shopee reducing promotions and shipping subsidy? I observe that your AOV has increased by around 22% in local currency terms. So what is driving that?

祝賀管理層取得了一系列出色的成績。兩個問題。首先，在 Shopee 上，你能討論一下以當地貨幣計算的季度環比 GMV 增長趨勢，哪些市場做得更好？對 23 年的前景有何看法？ Shopee 減少促銷和運費補貼如何影響客戶行為？我觀察到你們的 AOV 以當地貨幣計算增加了約 22%。那麼是什麼推動了這一點？

Secondly, can you give some insights on your CapEx for 2023, which segments would you be investing? And what kind of investments we should expect in 2023 to strengthen your ecosystem?

其次，您能否就 2023 年的資本支出提供一些見解，您將投資哪些領域？我們應該期望在 2023 年進行什麼樣的投資來加強您的生態系統？

Thank you, Piyush. In terms of GMV growth trends, as we previously shared that GMV remains output for us. It's not the key KPI as we continue to focus on tightening our efficiency and profitability as we have experienced. We think it would generally naturally come down the road.

謝謝你，皮尤什。在 GMV 增長趨勢方面，正如我們之前分享的那樣，GMV 仍然是我們的產出。這不是關鍵的 KPI，因為我們繼續專注於提高我們的效率和盈利能力，正如我們所經歷的那樣。我們認為它通常會自然而然地走下來。

And in terms of the different markets, generally speaking, our Asian market performed within our expectations. And Q4 remains a relatively strong market in terms of the demand by our buyers and consumption patterns. However, we are aware of weakness -- continued weakness in online physical consumptions by users across various markets and in particular, some of the markets like Malaysia, as we previously also shared before, remain relatively -- in terms of year-on-year comparison, probably particularly relatively slow.

而從不同的市場來看，總的來說，我們的亞洲市場表現在我們的預期之內。就我們買家的需求和消費模式而言，第四季度仍然是一個相對強勁的市場。然而，我們意識到疲軟 - 不同市場用戶的在線實體消費持續疲軟，特別是馬來西亞等一些市場，正如我們之前也分享過的那樣，仍然相對 - 同比而言比較起來，大概特別慢。

But of course, previously during COVID, some of these markets also happen to enjoy the strongest and the most spectacular growth during the COVID, so this remains tough comparison.

但當然，在 COVID 之前，其中一些市場也恰好在 COVID 期間實現了最強勁和最驚人的增長，因此這仍然是一個艱難的比較。

I think starting from '23, we'll generally see some -- we'll see some natural growth hopefully. But on the other hand, this is not something that we focus on and the macro uncertainty remains. And there are too many factors affecting the underlying consumption pattern that -- as a market leader that we will face.

我認為從 23 年開始，我們通常會看到一些——我們希望看到一些自然增長。但另一方面，這不是我們關注的重點，宏觀不確定性依然存在。作為市場領導者，我們將面臨太多影響潛在消費模式的因素。

And therefore, it's not a target that we focus on. So our message stays the same: GMV remains output. And we will discontinue any quarter-on-quarter disclosure of operating metrics like GMV and orders and we'll move to an annual disclosure in line with global peers.

因此，這不是我們關注的目標。所以我們的信息保持不變：GMV 保持輸出。我們將停止按季度披露 GMV 和訂單等運營指標，我們將轉向與全球同行一致的年度披露。

In terms of CapEx for 2023, most of the CapEx in terms of the biggest ticket items are servers and then followed by some of the logistics related machineries such as sorting machines, and then office and data center leases, et cetera.

就 2023 年的資本支出而言，就最大的票據項目而言，大部分資本支出是服務器，然後是一些與物流相關的機器，如分揀機，然後是辦公室和數據中心租賃等。

Now as we pivot to a strong focus on efficiency, we also have been significantly reducing and tightening our CapEx investments. So you still saw some CapEx spending in Q4 and may continue to see in Q1 earlier this year. But going forward, we expect, at least in the immediate future, CapEx spending shouldn't be a significant part of our overall expenses.

現在，隨著我們重點關注效率，我們也一直在大幅減少和收緊我們的資本支出投資。因此，您在第四季度仍然看到了一些資本支出，並且可能會在今年早些時候的第一季度繼續看到。但展望未來，我們預計，至少在不久的將來，資本支出不應占我們總支出的很大一部分。

The reason that we might still have some higher number in Q4 and Q1 is because the earlier commitments, as we shared in the previous quarter's earnings, some of the earlier commitments might arrive at a Q4 or Q1 timetable and that is not entirely within our control, and that might affect our financials. So it's a timing factor.

我們在第 4 季度和第 1 季度可能仍然有更高數量的原因是因為早期的承諾，正如我們在上一季度的收益中分享的那樣，一些早期的承諾可能會在第 4 季度或第 1 季度到達時間表，而這並不完全在我們的控制範圍內，這可能會影響我們的財務狀況。所以這是一個時間因素。

The next question comes from Thomas Chong from Jefferies.

下一個問題來自 Jefferies 的 Thomas Chong。

I have a question on Garena. Can you comment about the near-term trend and the full year outlook for the gaming business? I just want to get some color about whether we have any new games that we should be anticipating for this year? And my second question is about the total headcount. Can management comment about the number of headcounts in 2022? And how we should think about 2023, if we would do the hiring?

我有一個關於 Garena 的問題。您能否評論一下游戲業務的近期趨勢和全年展望？我只是想了解一下我們今年是否有任何值得期待的新遊戲？我的第二個問題是關於總人數。管理層能否評論 2022 年的員工人數？如果我們願意招聘，我們應該如何考慮 2023 年？

Thank you, Thomas. In terms of game pipeline, now as you're familiar with us, we don't discuss games that have not been publicly launched. And previously we mentioned that we have some games such as (inaudible) is being tested and it might get released this year. And then also, there are always games in the pipeline we are focused on.

謝謝你，托馬斯。在遊戲管線方面，大家已經很熟悉了，我們不討論尚未公開發布的遊戲。之前我們提到我們正在測試一些遊戲，例如（聽不清），它可能會在今年發布。此外，我們一直專注於開發中的遊戲。

But also more importantly, the key focus in the near term, still on the core games and in particular, Free Fire that we want to turn into a strong evergreen franchise. Although we continue to see some weakening in user trends in comparison to the significant growth it achieved during the COVID times, we do believe that there is a core defensible user base we can achieve, and it is a long-lasting franchise.

但更重要的是，近期的重點仍然是核心遊戲，尤其是 Free Fire，我們希望將其轉變為強大的常青特許經營權。儘管與 COVID 時代實現的顯著增長相比，我們繼續看到用戶趨勢有所減弱，但我們確實相信我們可以實現核心的可防御用戶群，並且這是一個持久的特許經營權。

So there are a lot of things the team are currently doing and focusing on with the best talent and some of the top creative people we have to deliver better user experience, more accessible game package, more efficient downloading and also in terms of the content that is more suitable for our users and more interesting to them, even despite their many years of experience of playing this game.

因此，團隊目前正在做很多事情並專注於最優秀的人才和一些頂級創意人員，我們必須提供更好的用戶體驗、更易於訪問的遊戲包、更高效的下載以及內容更適合我們的用戶，對他們來說更有趣，即使他們有多年玩這個遊戲的經驗。

So we think that still the focus in the immediate future. At the same time, we continue to form our core competency across some of the core genres that we have strong experience in and continue to observe any opportunities that my advice in the market and pick up new skills and new trends along the way.

所以我們認為這仍然是近期的重點。與此同時，我們繼續在我們擁有豐富經驗的一些核心類型中形成我們的核心競爭力，並繼續觀察我在市場上建議的任何機會，並在此過程中掌握新技能和新趨勢。

So while game is -- from a financial perspective, we saw some weak trends immediately, we are -- from an organizational perspective as a whole team, we are very focused on game in the long run because it is the closest to the younger generations, and we already have a very strong and big platform. Free Fire, despite its recent weakening, it's still one of the largest mobile game in the world and with very large user base and highly active spending a lot of time daily with us.

因此，雖然遊戲——從財務角度來看，我們立即看到了一些微弱的趨勢，但我們——從整個團隊的組織角度來看，從長遠來看，我們非常關注遊戲，因為它最接近年輕一代，我們已經有了一個非常強大的大平台。 Free Fire，儘管最近有所減弱，但它仍然是世界上最大的手機遊戲之一，並且擁有非常龐大的用戶群和高度活躍的用戶，每天花很多時間與我們在一起。

And we can do a lot of things with them and engage them much better and also deliver new and more content to them down the road. So this is something that we are very much focused on and will not give up on.

我們可以和他們一起做很多事情，更好地吸引他們，並在未來為他們提供更多新內容。所以這是我們非常關注並且不會放棄的事情。

In terms of headcount management, we had some headcount exercises, as we shared before, these are in relation to the operational changes we made, such as market exits, project closures, deprioritizing of initiatives, et cetera. We didn't have any particular target of a X percentage to cut for a wide number of teams.

在人員管理方面，正如我們之前分享的那樣，我們進行了一些人員編制工作，這些工作與我們所做的運營變更有關，例如市場退出、項目關閉、計劃優先級降低等。我們沒有為大量團隊削減 X 百分比的任何特定目標。

That's not how we do headcount exercises. So I think we also believe that with the successful completion of the major changes that we undertook in the past few months, we believe under the current environment, absence of any major shifts in our external conditions, that our major changes are completed, and we do not foresee major changes -- more major changes in this year and in the foreseeable future.

這不是我們進行人數統計的方式。所以我想我們也相信隨著我們在過去幾個月裡所做的重大變革的成功完成，我們相信在當前的環境下，我們的外部條件沒有任何重大變化，我們的重大變革已經完成，我們預計不會發生重大變化 -- -- 今年和可預見的未來會有更多重大變化。

Our next question comes from Jiong Shao from Barclays.

我們的下一個問題來自巴克萊銀行的邵炯。

I have 2 as well. The first is about Brazil. Will you be able to talk about the order growth year-over-year or quarter-over-quarter for Brazil? And also you cut the per-order loss pretty drastically, which is great from like $2 a year ago to now less than $0.50. Could you talk about the drivers behind that? And do you have any expectation for breakeven in Brazil?

我也有2個。首先是關於巴西。您能否談談巴西的訂單同比增長或環比增長？而且你還大大減少了每筆訂單的損失，從一年前的 2 美元到現在不到 0.50 美元，這已經很棒了。你能談談這背後的驅動因素嗎？您對巴西的盈虧平衡有何期待？

My second question is about take rate. Again, my calculation shows the take rate is now above 10%. And you have made a progress in take rate every single quarter over the last few years. I was wondering, do you have a target like for continued improvement for take rate this year?

我的第二個問題是關於 take rate。同樣，我的計算表明現在的採納率高於 10%。在過去的幾年中，您每個季度的採用率都取得了進步。我想知道，您今年是否有持續改進採納率的目標？

Thank you, Jiong. In terms of the Brazil market, we managed to make significant gain in efficiency in our operations and also partly as a result of our scaling that there's efficiency gain from -- naturally from scale.

謝謝你，炯。就巴西市場而言，我們設法在運營效率方面取得了顯著提高，部分原因是我們的規模擴大了效率——自然是規模。

The drivers behind the fast reduction in order loss per order, similar to our other Asian markets, coming from both top line growth as well as cost improvement, in particular, logistics costs that we are very focused operationally on reducing for our users. So that we can serve more underaddressed segment's profitability and sustainably down the road.

與我們其他亞洲市場類似，每筆訂單損失快速減少的驅動因素來自收入增長和成本改善，尤其是我們在運營上非常注重為用戶降低的物流成本。這樣我們就可以為更多未得到充分解決的細分市場的盈利能力提供服務，並在未來可持續發展。

This will be our focus in the near term. And while we don't give any projection or guidance on breakeven time, we also do think our market in Brazil can also grow profitably over the long run. There will be another significant opportunity that we should be able to capture.

這將是我們近期的重點。雖然我們沒有就盈虧平衡時間給出任何預測或指導，但我們也確實認為我們在巴西的市場從長遠來看也可以實現盈利增長。我們應該能夠抓住另一個重要機會。

And another thing is, as we shared before, the reason we are very focused on cost structure, in particular, logistics, is because we are trying to expand the profitable TAM for the market as a whole by addressing sellers and buyers who are underserved or unaddressed by existing players and having a better structure, having more target focus on the mass market allow us to be a differentiated player in the market, capturing a significant share of the pie in our view.

另一件事是，正如我們之前分享的那樣，我們之所以非常關注成本結構，尤其是物流，是因為我們正試圖通過解決服務不足或服務不足的賣家和買家的問題，為整個市場擴大有利可圖的 TAM現有參與者未解決問題並擁有更好的結構，更加專注於大眾市場，這使我們能夠成為市場上的差異化參與者，在我們看來佔據了相當大的市場份額。

Now in terms of the take rate. So we do believe there is still room for expansion on take rate. And just like our view about every market, we'll do it in a measured, paced way and with strong communication to our sellers and as our platform grows, and as we -- as sellers grow with us and invest more on our platform, while at same time growing their business. The overall take rate in the Brazil market, as you probably know, are obviously materially higher than many other markets.

現在就接受率而言。因此，我們確實相信在採用率方面仍有擴大的空間。就像我們對每個市場的看法一樣，我們將以有節制、有節奏的方式進行，並與我們的賣家進行強有力的溝通，隨著我們平台的發展，以及隨著我們——隨著賣家與我們一起成長並在我們的平台上投入更多，同時發展他們的業務。您可能知道，巴西市場的整體成交率明顯高於許多其他市場。

And there are, of course, more services being provided to the Brazilian sellers and buyers in view of some of the infrastructural differences in the market. Therefore, we believe this is a strong market, and we do focus on growing that market.

當然，鑑於市場中的一些基礎設施差異，向巴西賣家和買家提供了更多服務。因此，我們相信這是一個強大的市場，我們確實專注於發展這個市場。

The next question comes from Varun Ahuja from Crédit Suisse.

下一個問題來自 Crédit Suisse 的 Varun Ahuja。

Congrats on turning profitable. I've got a few questions. First, on the gaming side. If you look at your revenues right now, adjusted for the bookings, it's just 6% above pre-pandemic level. And if you look at the user base is around 20%. So how should we think like most of the benefits from the pandemic seems to have waned out by the fourth quarter. Do you see more stabilization now on the gaming side? Or are you seeing there's still more headwind in front of that?

恭喜轉虧為盈。我有幾個問題。首先，在遊戲方面。如果您現在查看您的收入，根據預訂進行調整，它僅比大流行前水平高出 6%。如果你看一下用戶群，大約是 20%。那麼我們應該如何看待這一流行病帶來的大部分好處似乎到第四季度就已經消失了。您現在在遊戲方面看到更多的穩定性了嗎？還是您看到前面還有更多阻力？

Second, sticking to gaming side, if you can give some color on the team strength on the R&D side? How many people are there on R&D side split between new game development and versus on Free Fire?

第二，堅持遊戲方面，能不能給研發方面的團隊實力點點顏色？研發方面有多少人分為新遊戲開發和 Free Fire？

And thirdly, again, on the gaming, any update on the right of first refusal that you have with Tencent coming in this year? Lastly, on e-commerce, if you give some color, qualitative or some numbers on HQ cost quarter-on-quarter? Because we have been historically giving some commentary on the HQ cost for the e-commerce, while this quarter, there's isn't much commentary. So I just want to see how that cost has trended during this quarter?

第三，關於遊戲，您對騰訊今年推出的優先購買權有何更新？最後，在電子商務方面，如果你給出一些顏色、定性或一些數字來說明總部成本的季度環比？因為我們一直在對電子商務的總部成本發表一些評論，而本季度沒有太多評論。所以我只想看看本季度該成本的趨勢如何？

Thank you, Varun. In terms of gaming, I think it's still too early to tell the trends. Obviously, COVID is such an unprecedented event. Nobody has any data on it. And also reopening together with inflation that had double headwinds from people's discretionary consumption power also further compounding the effects that we are seeing. And therefore, it's premature for us to project where the game trend is going to lend.

謝謝你，瓦倫。在遊戲方面，我認為現在判斷趨勢還為時過早。顯然，COVID 是這樣一個史無前例的事件。沒有人有任何數據。重新開放與通貨膨脹一起受到人們可自由支配的消費能力的雙重不利影響，也進一步加劇了我們所看到的影響。因此，我們現在預測遊戲趨勢將向何處借貸還為時過早。

But we have seen mobile games with long shelf life have seen also revival and when they have the right content and released at the right time are well received by users. So that can be achieved, of course, with a lot of creativity and efforts, and that's what we are focused on.

但我們看到保質期長的手游也開始復蘇，內容對了，發布對了時間，受到了用戶的歡迎。當然，這可以通過大量的創造力和努力來實現，而這正是我們所關注的。

We won't be able to give guidance on any short-term trends at this point yet. In terms of R&D and relationship with Tencent. Our R&D, while at the same time, we have been focusing on concentrating our resources and shared earlier and the divesting projects and deprioritizing less promising initiatives.

目前我們還不能就任何短期趨勢提供指導。在研發和與騰訊的關係方面。我們的研發，與此同時，我們一直專注於集中我們的資源並更早地共享和剝離項目並取消優先考慮不太有前途的計劃。

At the same time, we are moving people towards more focus on the core projects and more promising ones down the road. Therefore, there are shifts in the staffing. But overall, we maintain a very strong R&D team. In terms of relationship with Tencent, also, there has not been any change in the relationship. On the HQ cost trends, also trended downwards in terms of the efficiency gain we had in managing HQ costs. So there's Q-on-Q improvements on that as well.

與此同時，我們正在推動人們更加關注核心項目和更有前途的項目。因此，人員配置有所變動。但總的來說，我們擁有一支非常強大的研發團隊。在與騰訊的關係方面，也沒有發生任何變化。在總部成本趨勢方面，我們在管理總部成本方面的效率收益也呈下降趨勢。所以在這方面也有 Q-on-Q 改進。

The next question comes from Ranjan Sharma from JPMorgan.

下一個問題來自摩根大通的 Ranjan Sharma。

Two questions from my side. Firstly, on the cost side and adjusted EBITDA, have there been any severance costs accounted for in this period? And with the cost optimization initiatives that you have done, how should we think of R&D and G&A costs in 2023 versus 2022?

我這邊的兩個問題。首先，在成本方面和調整後的 EBITDA 中，這一期間是否有任何遣散費？通過您所做的成本優化計劃，我們應該如何看待 2023 年與 2022 年的研發和 G&A 成本？

Secondly, on the fintech side, the loan book is down from third quarter to fourth quarter, considering your comments around macro headwinds and -- which cloud's outlook, how should we think of the loan book growth going forward?

其次，在金融科技方面，考慮到您對宏觀逆風的評論以及 - 哪個雲的前景，我們應該如何看待未來的貸款增長？

Thank you, Ranjan. Now in terms of severance, the impact has not been very significant. And I think, it's comparable to the previous quarter, and we don't seem it to be material. So there was no separate disclosure. We don't think it will also have any material impact on our 2023 financials.

謝謝你，蘭詹。現在在遣散費方面，影響已經不是很大。而且我認為，它與上一季度相當，我們似乎並不重要。所以沒有單獨披露。我們認為這也不會對我們 2023 年的財務狀況產生任何實質性影響。

In terms of R&D and G&A costs in this year, we continue to focus on efficiency improvements and tightening and also make sure that our costs are efficient relative to the size of our platform and our businesses.

在今年的研發和 G&A 成本方面，我們繼續專注於提高效率和收緊成本，並確保我們的成本相對於我們的平台和業務規模而言是有效的。

In terms of the loan book growth, as we -- as I mentioned before, for the credit business and the extensive SeaMoney business as a whole, we don't expect to be -- at least at this stage that we're not going to invest significantly to drive rapid growth and land grabbing.

在貸款賬簿增長方面，正如我們 - 正如我之前提到的，對於整個信貸業務和廣泛的 SeaMoney 業務，我們預計不會 - 至少在這個階段我們不會大量投資以推動快速增長和土地掠奪。

We're more focused on building a solid business with strong underwriting and a strong user base serves them well and also diversify our offerings and also diversify our funding sources over time to build a sustainable long-term -- sustainable business with long-term growth. So that's something that, given the current macro uncertainty and synergistic play with Shopee, we do not think that the growth is a KPI for our team in terms of the loan book, more -- our KPI is more in terms of quality of the loan book and profitability of the business.

我們更專注於建立一個穩固的業務，擁有強大的承保能力和強大的用戶群，為他們提供良好的服務，並使我們的產品多樣化，並隨著時間的推移使我們的資金來源多樣化，以建立一個可持續的長期業務——具有長期增長的可持續業務.因此，考慮到當前的宏觀不確定性和與 Shopee 的協同作用，我們認為增長不是我們團隊在貸款賬簿方面的 KPI，更多 - 我們的 KPI 更多是在貸款質量方面業務的賬簿和盈利能力。

This concludes our question-and-answer session. I would like to turn the conference back over to Min Ju Song for any closing remarks.

我們的問答環節到此結束。我想將會議轉回給 Min Ju Song 作任何閉幕詞。

Thank you, operator, and thank you all for joining today's call. We very much look forward to speaking to all of you again next quarter. Thank you.

謝謝接線員，也感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。我們非常期待下個季度再次與大家交談。謝謝。

The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

會議現已結束。感謝您參加今天的演講。您現在可以斷開連接。