EchoStar Corp (SATS) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the EchoStar Corporation first-quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please note that this conference is being recorded.

您好，歡迎參加 EchoStar Corporation 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，本次會議正在錄音。

I will now turn the conference over to your host, Dean Manson, Chief Legal Officer. Thank you. You may begin.

現在我將會議交給主持人、首席法律長 Dean Manson。謝謝。你可以開始了。

Thank you, and good morning. Welcome to EchoStar's first-quarter 2025 earnings call. We will begin with opening remarks from Hamid Akhavan, President and CEO; followed by Paul Orban, EVP and Principal Financial Officer; and John Swieringa, President of Technology and COO.

謝謝，早安。歡迎參加 EchoStar 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。我們將首先由總裁兼執行長 Hamid Akhavan 致開幕詞；接下來是執行副總裁兼財務長 Paul Orban；以及技術總裁兼營運長 John Swieringa。

We request that any participant producing a report not identify other participants or their firms as such (inaudible). We also do not allow audio recording, which we ask that you respect.

我們要求任何提交報告的參與者不要將其他參與者或其公司的身份透露給（聽不清楚）。我們也不允許錄音，請您尊重我們的決定。

All statements we make during this call, other than statements of historical fact constitute forward-looking statements made pursuant to the Safe Harbor provided by the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These forward-looking statements involve known and unknown risks, uncertainties and other factors that could cause our actual results to be materially different from historical results and from any future results expressed or implied by the forward-looking statements.

除歷史事實陳述外，我們在本次電話會議中所做的所有陳述均構成根據 1995 年《私人證券訴訟改革法案》規定的安全港做出的前瞻性聲明。這些前瞻性陳述涉及已知和未知的風險、不確定性和其他因素，可能導致我們的實際結果與歷史結果以及前瞻性陳述表達或暗示的任何未來結果有重大差異。

For a list of those factors and risks, please refer to our annual report on Form 10-Q for the quarter ended March 31, 2025, filed today, May 9, and our subsequent filings made with the SEC. All cautionary statements we make during this call should be understood as being applicable to any forward-looking statements we make wherever they appear.

有關這些因素和風險的列表，請參閱我們於今天（5 月 9 日）提交的截至 2025 年 3 月 31 日的季度 10-Q 表年度報告以及我們隨後向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件。我們在本次電話會議中所做的所有警告性聲明都應理解為適用於我們在任何地方所做的任何前瞻性聲明。

You should carefully consider the risks described in our reports and should not place any undue reliance on any forward-looking statements. We assume no responsibility for updating any forward-looking statements. We refer to OIBDA and free cash flow during this call. The comparable GAAP measure and a reconciliation for OIBDA is presented in our earnings release and in the case of free cash flow in our 10-Q.

您應該仔細考慮我們報告中所述的風險，並且不應過度依賴任何前瞻性陳述。我們不承擔更新任何前瞻性陳述的責任。我們在本次電話會議中提到了 OIBDA 和自由現金流。我們的收益報告中列出了可比較的 GAAP 指標和 OIBDA 的對帳情況，而我們的 10-Q 報告中則列出了自由現金流的情況。

With that, I'll turn it over to Hamid.

說完這些，我就把發言權交給哈米德。

Thank you, Dean. Welcome, everyone. Thank you for joining us today.

謝謝你，迪恩。歡迎大家。感謝您今天加入我們。

We have updated our format for today's earnings call to include the use of a slide show presentation. While this information has historically been included only in our quarterly filings, we have opted to include this slide deck format as part of our prepared remarks.

我們已更新今天的收益電話會議的格式，包括使用幻燈片演示。雖然這些資訊歷來僅包含在我們的季度文件中，但我們選擇將此投影片格式作為我們準備好的評論的一部分。

Last year, we set the foundation as a global provider of connectivity and entertainment solutions and services. We drove efficiencies across all our brands and invested in profitable growth. Our unique set of assets across satellite, video, wireless, and enterprise along with our US-based manufacturing position us well for the remainder of 2025 and beyond. We built upon our strong foundation in the first quarter and saw improvements in many key metrics.

去年，我們奠定了全球連結和娛樂解決方案及服務提供者的基礎。我們提高了所有品牌的效率並投資於獲利成長。我們在衛星、視訊、無線和企業領域的獨特資產以及我們在美國本土的製造能力使我們在 2025 年剩餘時間及以後佔據有利地位。我們在第一季鞏固了基礎，並看到許多關鍵指標有所改善。

I'll now comment on some details across our lines of business. Wireless' performance remains strong with 150,000 subscribers net adds in the first quarter as compared to an 81,000 net loss in the same period of 2024. Our consistent marketing efforts, combined with the ongoing optimization and recognition of our network performance are key factors in this success.

我現在將對我們業務範圍內的一些細節進行評論。無線業務表現依然強勁，第一季淨增用戶 15 萬，而 2024 年同期淨虧損 8.1 萬。我們持續的行銷努力，加上對網路效能的持續優化和認可，是這項成功的關鍵因素。

In the first quarter, we expanded the benefits of our prepaid and postpaid offerings to both our branded stores and digital sales channels and build up on gains in combining our services under the single Boost Mobile brand. We also increased our marketing spend and offers during the important tax return window, which seasonally increases demand for new devices and upgrades. These activities helped anchor our first-quarter subscriber growth and positions us well for additional opportunities in 2025.

在第一季度，我們將預付費和後付費服務的優勢擴展到我們的品牌商店和數位銷售管道，並透過將我們的服務整合到單一的 Boost Mobile 品牌下而不斷累積收益。我們還在重要的報稅期增加了行銷支出和優惠，這在季節性地增加了對新設備和升級的需求。這些活動幫助我們穩定了第一季的用戶成長，並為我們在 2025 年獲得更多機會做好了準備。

As a testament to our excellent network experience and competitive mix of offers in the quarter, we increased our wireless subscribers to approximately 7.15 million while improving the quality of our subscriber base as evidenced by 7.2% improvement in churn year over year and an increase in ARPU. Overall, we are satisfied with what we have managed to achieve over the past year, and we'll continue to focus on profitable subscriber additions.

本季度，我們的無線用戶數量增加至約 715 萬，證明了我們擁有出色的網路體驗和具有競爭力的報價組合，同時，用戶流失率同比下降 7.2%，ARPU 也上升，這體現在用戶群品質的提升上。整體而言，我們對過去一年的成就感到滿意，我們將繼續專注於增加獲利的用戶。

Furthermore, in light of recent economic uncertainty, we believe we have some of the most attractive offers in the market for consumers looking to capture the best value in the mobile business. In our Hughes business, we continue our progress in the enterprise domain. Our in-flight connectivity business recently announced universal compatibility of our terminals in the KA and KU bands, dual compatibility means our airline customers are not limited to one constellation, enabling cost effectiveness, flexibility, and an optimal passenger experience.

此外，鑑於最近的經濟不確定性，我們相信，對於希望在行動業務中獲得最大價值的消費者來說，我們擁有市場上最具吸引力的一些優惠。在我們的休斯業務中，我們繼續在企業領域取得進展。我們的機上連接業務最近宣布了我們在 KA 和 KU 頻段的終端的通用兼容性，雙重兼容性意味著我們的航空公司客戶不僅限於一個星座，從而實現了成本效益、靈活性和最佳乘客體驗。

We also recently announced membership in the Airbus HBCplus program, which gives us the ability to serve airlines with a line fit option at Airbus factory. These developments in addition to our expanded contracts for regional and wide-body aircraft with Delta Airlines add to our in-flight product offering and increase our backlog.

我們最近也宣布加入空中巴士 HBCplus 計劃，這使我們能夠為航空公司提供空中巴士工廠的線路適配選項。這些發展加上我們與達美航空擴大區域和寬體飛機合同，擴大了我們的機上產品供應並增加了我們的積壓訂單。

In Q1, we began (inaudible) of a new single panel version of our electronically suitable LEO antenna. This cost-effective, high-performance addition to the user terminal family is uniquely suited for global enterprise use due to its size, weight, and ease of installation. We have signed contracts from customers in Europe and India for our SD-WAN and AI ops capabilities. In Latin America, we finished deploying our multi-orbit managed network to support network and security services on LEO and geosatellites and secured additional demand for similar services for Brazilian national parks.

在第一季度，我們開始（聽不清楚）研發電子適用的 LEO 天線的新型單面板版本。此用戶終端系列具有成本效益和高性能，由於其尺寸、重量和易於安裝的特點，特別適合全球企業使用。我們已經與歐洲和印度的客戶簽訂了有關我們的 SD-WAN 和 AI 操作功能的合約。在拉丁美洲，我們完成了多軌道管理網路的部署，以支援低地球軌道和地理衛星上的網路和安全服務，並確保了巴西國家公園對類似服務的額外需求。

Finally, our HughesNet consumer business, we closed Q1 with over 850,000 broadband subscribers. In Q1, the performance of our Pay-TV business, consisting of DISH and Sling was in line with our expectations. DISH business and media sales performed well, and we delivered roughly 7% growth in OIBDA per subscriber. Despite macro headwinds in the Pay-TV landscape, we remain focused on acquiring and retaining the most profitable subscribers that value our service offerings.

最後，我們的 HughesNet 消費者業務在第一季結束時擁有超過 85 萬名寬頻用戶。第一季度，我們的付費電視業務（包括 DISH 和 Sling）的表現符合我們的預期。DISH 業務和媒體銷售表現良好，每位用戶的 OIBDA 成長了約 7%。儘管付費電視領域面臨宏觀阻力，我們仍然專注於獲取和留住那些重視我們服務產品的最賺錢的用戶。

Our video segment remained focused on operational efficiency, customer loyalty, and improving user experiences. These efforts helped increase ARPU, reduce nonprogramming variable cost per subscriber. This work will serve us well in the remainder of 2025 as we introduce new offerings to meet consumer demands and expand our cross-sell opportunities with Boost Mobile.

我們的影片部分仍專注於營運效率、客戶忠誠度和改善用戶體驗。這些努力有助於提高 ARPU，降低每個用戶的非編程變動成本。這項工作將在 2025 年剩餘時間內為我們提供良好的服務，因為我們將推出新的產品來滿足消費者的需求，並擴大與 Boost Mobile 的交叉銷售機會。

DISH TV finished the quarter with approximately 5.5 million subscribers and churn was 1.36% compared to 1.53%, a reduction of 11% for the same period of 2024. Our lower year-over-year churn is a result of our data-driven loyalty initiatives and bundled offers. DISH TV churn is now at the lowest level in over a decade, excluding the pandemic.

DISH TV 本季結束時擁有約 550 萬訂閱用戶，流失率為 1.36%，而 2024 年同期為 1.53%，下降了 11%。我們的客戶流失率年減是由於我們以數據為驅動的忠誠度計劃和捆綁優惠。除疫情影響外，DISH 電視的流失率目前處於十多年來的最低水準。

We also drove Pay-TV ARPU growth with a year-over-year increase of over $3 or 3% due to the full effect of 2024 price increases. Also, in spite of competitive headwinds in the extreme market, we closed the first quarter with 1.9 million subscribers.

受 2024 年價格上漲的全面影響，我們也推動了付費電視 ARPU 的成長，年增超過 3 美元或 3%。此外，儘管極限市場競爭激烈，我們第一季的用戶數仍達到 190 萬。

Now, I would like to turn it over to Paul Orban for commentary and color on the numbers.

現在，我想請保羅·奧爾班對這些數字進行評論和說明。

Thank you, Hamid.

謝謝你，哈米德。

Revenue was approximately $3.9 billion in the first quarter. That's down 3.6% year over year, primarily due to fewer subscribers at Pay-TV, partially offset by an increase in revenue from our wireless segment driven by ARPU growth and higher handset sales. OIBDA was $400 million in the first quarter, a decrease of $17 million year over year or approximately 15%. The decrease in OIBDA was primarily driven by increased marketing in wireless as well as decreased OIBDA from our Pay-TV segment due to fewer subscribers.

第一季營收約39億美元。與去年同期相比下降了 3.6%，主要原因是付費電視用戶數量減少，但無線部門收入因 ARPU 成長和手機銷量增加而增加，部分抵消了這一影響。第一季的 OIBDA 為 4 億美元，年減 1,700 萬美元，降幅約 15%。OIBDA 的下降主要是由於無線行銷的增加以及付費電視部門因用戶減少而導致的 OIBDA 下降。

EchoStar generated positive operating free cash flow of $77 million in the quarter, defined as free cash flow before debt service payments and nonoperating CapEx related to Echostar 25. We continue to expect positive operating free cash flow in 2025 as we remain disciplined in managing our operating cost structure while growing our wireless and Hughes enterprise businesses.

EchoStar 本季產生了 7,700 萬美元的正營運自由現金流，定義為債務償還和與 Echostar 25 相關的非營運資本支出之前的自由現金流。我們繼續預期 2025 年將出現正的經營自由現金流，因為我們在發展無線和休斯企業業務的同時，仍嚴格管理我們的營運成本結構。

Free cash flow, including debt service in the first quarter was negative $172 million, an improvement of $55 million compared to the prior year. This improvement was driven by a $299 million reduction in capital expenditures, including capitalized interest, primarily due to optimizing our 5G network spend, partly offset by lower cash flow from operating activities.

第一季包括債務償還在內的自由現金流為負 1.72 億美元，較上年同期改善 5,500 萬美元。這項改善是由於資本支出（包括資本化利息）減少了 2.99 億美元，這主要是由於優化了我們的 5G 網路支出，但部分被經營活動現金流的減少所抵消。

At the end of the first quarter, our total cash and marketable securities was $5.4 billion, a decrease of $464 million compared to year-end. This decrease primarily resulted from capital expenditures of $378 million, including capitalized interest and repurchases and redemptions of our near-term maturities, partially offset by cash generated from operating activities of $207 million.

第一季末，我們的現金和有價證券總額為 54 億美元，較去年末減少 4.64 億美元。這一減少主要由於 3.78 億美元的資本支出，包括資本化利息以及近期到期債券的回購和贖回，但部分被 2.07 億美元的經營活動產生的現金所抵消。

Today, we received $150 million from an add-on issuance to our 10 3/4 senior secured notes from a privately negotiated transaction.

今天，我們透過私下協商的交易，從 10 3/4 優先擔保票據的附加發行中獲得了 1.5 億美元。

Turning to our segment performance. Total wireless revenue in Q1 increased by 6.4% to $973 million, driven by 3.3% ARPU growth in higher handset sales. Service revenue grew 2.7% in Q1 sequentially accelerated from 1.3% in Q4. Due to increased subscriber activations, the wireless OIBDA loss increased to a negative $415 million compared to a negative $363 million last year.

談談我們的分部表現。第一季無線業務總營收成長 6.4%，達到 9.73 億美元，這得益於手機銷量成長導致 ARPU 成長 3.3%。第一季服務收入成長 2.7%，高於第四季的 1.3%。由於用戶啟動量增加，無線 OIBDA 損失從去年的負 3.63 億美元增至負 4.15 億美元。

Pay-TV revenue decreased by 6.9% to $2.5 billion due to a lower average Pay-TV subscriber base, partially offset by increased Pay-TV ARPU. Pay-TV OIBDA decreased to $730 million from $756 million while Pay-TV order per subscriber increased 6.8% year over year due to lower average Pay-TV subscriber base, partially offset by lower subscriber acquisition costs from fewer gross activations and lower personnel costs.

付費電視收入下降 6.9% 至 25 億美元，因為平均付費電視用戶群減少，但付費電視 ARPU 增加部分抵消了這一影響。付費電視 OIBDA 從 7.56 億美元降至 7.3 億美元，而每用戶付費電視訂單年增 6.8%，原因是平均付費電視用戶群較低，但總激活量減少和人員成本降低導致的用戶獲取成本降低，部分抵消了這一增長。

We continue to focus on retaining profitable customers and remain disciplined in our cost structure. Broadband and satellite services or BSS, revenue decreased by 3.1% to $371 million due to lower sales of broadband services to consumers and enterprise customers, partially offset by higher hardware sales to enterprise customers.

我們將繼續致力於留住獲利客戶，並嚴格控製成本結構。寬頻和衛星服務或 BSS 收入下降 3.1% 至 3.71 億美元，原因是面向消費者和企業客戶的寬頻服務銷售額下降，但部分被面向企業客戶的硬體銷售額增加所抵消。

We remain focused in the near term on accelerating our enterprise revenue in order to return this segment to profitable revenue growth. BSS OIBDA increased by 8.1% to $86 million from $79 million in the prior year due to lower SG&A, including a decline in bad debt expense.

短期內，我們仍將專注於加速企業收入的成長，以使該部門恢復獲利收入成長。由於銷售、一般及行政費用降低（包括壞帳費用下降），BSS OIBDA 從上年的 7,900 萬美元增加 8.1% 至 8,600 萬美元。

With that, I'd like to hand it over to John to cover our network deployment progress.

說完這些，我想把時間交給約翰來介紹我們的網路部署進度。

Thank you, Paul.

謝謝你，保羅。

We are the worldwide leader in developing and operationalizing a cloud-native open ran 5G network. And today, the Boost Mobile network provides 5G broadband coverage to over 80% of the US population. In combination with our partner networks, we are offering customers 99% coverage across the US.

我們是開發和營運雲端原生開放式 5G 網路的全球領導者。如今，Boost Mobile 網路已為超過 80% 的美國人口提供 5G 寬頻覆蓋。結合我們的合作夥伴網絡，我們為客戶提供全美 99% 的覆蓋率。

I'm also pleased to announce we have already met our June 14 FCC requirement by deploying 3GPP Release 17, a key enabler for 5G advanced across our network. Also, we now have more than 24,000 5G sites on air more than one month prior to our commitment date. These network enhancements further demonstrate our commitment to scaling our network and giving Boost Mobile customers access to the latest technology. As we have expanded and optimized the network, we've continued to drive a competitive customer experience, and we're outperforming the competition in many markets.

我也很高興地宣布，我們已經透過部署 3GPP Release 17 滿足了 6 月 14 日的 FCC 要求，這是我們網路實現 5G 先進技術的關鍵推動因素。此外，我們目前已在承諾日期前一個多月投入使用超過 24,000 個 5G 站點。這些網路增強進一步表明了我們致力於擴展網路並讓 Boost Mobile 客戶能夠使用最新技術的決心。隨著我們擴展和優化網絡，我們繼續推動具有競爭力的客戶體驗，並且在許多市場上都超越了競爭對手。

During the first quarter, we invested $164 million in CapEx compared to $391 million in Q1 of 2024 as we continue to transition from the initial build-out of our network to running, optimizing, and monetizing it. A key priority for us continues to be migrating as much traffic as possible to our owned and operated 5G network to provide our pure 5G experience to our customers and reap the benefits of owner economics.

在第一季度，我們投資了 1.64 億美元的資本支出，而 2024 年第一季為 3.91 億美元，因為我們繼續從最初的網路建設過渡到運行、優化和貨幣化。我們的首要任務仍然是將盡可能多的流量遷移到我們擁有和運營的 5G 網絡，以便為我們的客戶提供純粹的 5G 體驗並獲得業主經濟效益。

Today, we have over 1.25 million customers on-net and are loading more than 75% of compatible devices on our network in the accelerated markets. We continue to focus on activating an increasing percentage of new customers directly on the Boost Mobile network as well as upgrading existing customers to our growing portfolio of Boost Mobile network compatible devices.

如今，我們擁有超過 125 萬網路客戶，並且在加速市場中我們的網路上加載了超過 75% 的相容設備。我們將繼續致力於在 Boost Mobile 網路上直接啟動越來越多的新客戶，並將現有客戶升級到我們不斷成長的 Boost Mobile 網路相容設備組合。

Just last month, we expanded our device portfolio to include iPad and Apple Watch with Android options in the near-term pipeline. We will continue to ramp up our progress throughout the year. In addition, we look forward to working with the FCC to increase CBRS power levels through its pending rule making. We see this as a key step to improving spectral efficiency, increased utilization of this band, and aligning the US with the rest of the world.

就在上個月，我們擴大了裝置組合，包括 iPad 和 Apple Watch，並在近期推出 Android 選項。我們將在全年繼續加快進步。此外，我們期待與 FCC 合作，透過其即將制定的規則來提高 CBRS 功率等級。我們認為這是提高頻譜效率、增加該頻段利用率以及使美國與世界其他國家保持一致的關鍵一步。

Now, I'd like to turn it back to Hamid for a few short closing comments.

現在，我想請哈米德做幾句簡短的結語。

Thank you, John. We are pleased with the performance of our business lines from the first quarter. In summary, our 2025 operating plan targets a positive operating free cash flow, optimized subscriber profitability from our Pay-TV segment, expansion of use enterprise, and continued growth from Boost Mobile.

謝謝你，約翰。我們對第一季業務線的表現感到滿意。總之，我們的 2025 年營運計畫旨在實現正營運自由現金流、優化付費電視部門的用戶獲利能力、擴大使用企業以及 Boost Mobile 的持續成長。

With that, we'll open it for Q&A from the analyst community.

有了它，我們將開放給分析師社群進行問答。

(Operator Instructions) Sebastian Petti, JPMorgan Chase & Company.

（操作員指示）摩根大通公司的塞巴斯蒂安·佩蒂。

Strong subscriber results in wireless, but success-based OpEx is pressuring EBITDA in the segment there. While you are making progress bringing customers on-net, just any help thinking about what some of the other potential cost levers could be within that segment as we think about the glide path to improved EBITDA drag there?

無線領域的用戶數量強勁，但基於成功的營運支出正在給該領域的 EBITDA 帶來壓力。當您在吸引客戶上網方面取得進展時，當您考慮改善 EBITDA 阻力的下滑路徑時，您是否能幫助我們思考該領域中可能存在哪些其他潛在的成本槓桿？

And then just another order term kind of question. Can you help us think about maybe perhaps your LEO -- lower orbit strategy, launching some satellites, but how do you see this fitting within your broader product suite in terms of not only perhaps on the D2D side in wireless, but also some of your enterprise efforts?

然後只是另一個順序項類型的問題。您能否幫助我們思考一下您的 LEO（低軌道戰略），發射一些衛星，但您認為這如何適應您更廣泛的產品套件，不僅是在無線的 D2D 方面，而且在您的一些企業努力中？

Great. Thanks for the question. Two here, I will take the first one. Maybe John can add to it. In terms of improving the economics of our new subscribers coming on, I think the first thing is we are adding now the significant majority of our customers directly on that. I think having the owner economics of having the customers be our own MNO network is probably one of the biggest improvements we can make in costs.

偉大的。謝謝你的提問。這裡有兩個，我選第一個。也許約翰可以補充一些內容。在提升新用戶的經濟效益方面，我認為首先我們要直接在此基礎上增加絕大多數客戶。我認為，讓客戶成為我們自己的 MNO 網路的所有者經濟學可能是我們在成本方面可以實現的最大改進之一。

And you see that trend will continue. So I think about 75% of the customers being added now that come down net. And John, you may want to correct me on that one if I don't have the right number.

您會發現這種趨勢將會持續下去。所以我認為現在新增的客戶中約有 75% 是淨增的。約翰，如果我沒有正確的數字，你可以糾正我。

Yes. Thanks, Hamid. I mean that's with respect to compatible devices. So one of the things that we're doing, Sebastiano, thanks for the question, is making sure when we have a handset that is in a market that's open for Boost Mobile with honor, that we're batting a very high percentage of it getting that device on net. We see that expanding in the back half of the year as a higher number of our devices that we're distributing are compatible with the network.

是的。謝謝，哈米德。我的意思是這是關於兼容設備。因此，塞巴斯蒂亞諾，感謝您的提問，我們正在做的事情之一就是確保當我們的手機進入對 Boost Mobile 開放的市場時，我們能夠將該設備接入網路並獲得很高的市場份額。隨著我們分銷的設備越來越多地與網路相容，我們預計今年下半年這一數字將會擴大。

Just to give you a feel for a good example would be additional competitive live phones with 15, 16 and 16 [ds] relative to what we've been previously distributing that's been noncompatible. On top of that, we have a lot of opportunities for upgrades of existing customers on compatible prices. So you should see those numbers expand in the back half of the year and going forward.

給您一個很好的例子，就是相對於我們之前分發的不相容產品，額外推出具有 15、16 和 16 [ds] 競爭力的現場手機。最重要的是，我們為現有客戶提供了許多以相容價格進行升級的機會。因此，你應該會看到這些數字在今年下半年及以後有所擴大。

In addition to that, with overall OpEx, we're certainly focused where we have the biggest opportunity to win. So you'll see us in the major markets where we've got strong network, making sure that we're expanding our business to local efforts there.

除此之外，就整體營運支出而言，我們當然會專注於最有可能獲勝的地方。因此，您會在主要市場看到我們擁有強大的網絡，確保我們將業務擴展到當地市場。

Back to you, Hamid, for you, please.

請把時間交還給你，哈米德。

And then we also are working, certainly not anything to report today in this earnings call, but we are working on a number of different -- more fundamental initiatives around distribution and how we go to market, in routes that may be more value-enhancing and less expensive, so more efficient. So those will show up starting back half of the year and into '26.

然後，我們也在努力，當然今天的收益電話會議上不會有任何報告，但我們正在研究一些不同的——更基本的舉措，圍繞分銷和我們如何進入市場，以可能更具價值、更便宜、更有效率的途徑。因此，這些將會從今年上半年開始出現，並持續到 26 年。

We certainly are not only focused on data optimization of the business, but also, we're looking at long-term trends of how we can change the economics fundamentally. So more to come on that one as the year progresses in a couple of few quarters from now.

我們當然不僅關注業務的數據優化，而且我們也在關注如何從根本上改變經濟的長期趨勢。因此，隨著未來幾個季度的進展，我們將對此做出更多了解。

On the LEO business, we have been hard at work. We are one of those companies don't make too many announcements, we're having some without a substance. We think that plenty in the market are making that. We don't need to participate in that. But we certainly have been very busy in terms of getting our plans ready and engineering ready, and we will make announcements when we feel is appropriate, but we certainly intend to be in the market as the leading provider of global direct-to-device connectivity using our [SD-WAN] internationally and AWS-4 domestically.

在LEO業務上，我們一直在努力工作。我們是那種不會發布太多公告的公司，我們發布的一些公告沒有實質內容。我們認為市場上有很多企業都在這麼做。我們不需要參與其中。但我們在準備計劃和工程方面確實非常忙碌，我們會在認為合適的時候發佈公告，但我們當然打算成為市場上領先的全球直接設備連接提供商，在國際上使用我們的 [SD-WAN]，在國內使用 AWS-4。

We are very much focused on it. It is a priority for us. It's one of the most important strategic priorities in terms of business development. And we just don't include that in our prepared remarks, simply because we don't think it's in our best interest to speak today until we have more substance to deliver to the market.

我們非常關注這一點。這對我們來說是當務之急。這是業務發展方面最重要的策略重點之一。我們只是沒有在準備好的發言稿中提到這一點，因為我們認為，在我們有更多的實質內容向市場發布之前，今天發表講話不符合我們的最佳利益。

That makes sense. And then, Hamid, if I could, one follow-up maybe for Paul. But where will the LEO assets sit under EchoStar outside of Hughes or at Hughes, somewhere else? Any color on how to think about that?

這很有道理。然後，哈米德，如果可以的話，我想問保羅一個後續問題。但是，除了休斯之外，EchoStar 的低地球軌道資產將位於休斯的哪裡，還是在其他地方？對此您有何看法？

LEO assets outside of Hughes, we don't really -- we have a small LEO asset with Elara, and that's our Syrian assets that we -- I think that still is a EchoStar level. It's on a Hughes --

休斯以外的 LEO 資產，我們實際上沒有——我們在 Elara 擁有小型 LEO 資產，這是我們在敘利亞的資產——我認為這仍然是 EchoStar 級別。休斯--

Both assets are at parent level.

這兩項資產均處於父級。

And the investments we've been making -- I mean, we have not obviously disclosed any of this, but I don't believe that we would put those assets in Hughes. I think we would keep the assets at a SATS level with the investments that we would make going forward on the LEO side.

至於我們一直在進行的投資——我的意思是，我們顯然沒有透露任何這些投資，但我不認為我們會把這些資產投入休斯。我認為我們會將資產保持在 SATS 水平，並在 LEO 方面進行投資。

Ric Prentiss, Raymond James.

瑞克普倫蒂斯、雷蒙詹姆斯。

This is Brent Penter on for Rick. First question, as you've continued to ramp net adds in wireless, what would you say is resonating most in the market that's helping you build this momentum specifically? And given 1Q is a seasonally slow period typically, is it right to think you should be able to improve further from this 150 level?

布倫特彭特 (Brent Penter) 代替里克 (Rick)。第一個問題，隨著你們不斷增加無線網路存取量，您認為市場上最能引起共鳴的是什麼，能夠具體幫助你們建立這種勢頭？並且考慮到第一季通常是季節性的淡季，您是否認為您應該能夠從這個 150 的水平進一步提高？

On the first part of the question, we have some of the most attractive offers in the market. In spite of the headlines that everybody else has in terms of having their offers being best in the market or in the market in terms of value, when you look at the actual details of what is included and what is not ours, it turns out to be the best value, and there's some hidden costs and hidden requirements and everybody else's offers a way that when people ultimately unpack and manage to unpack all the nuances that each offering includes, they realize that our offers are very attractive.

關於問題的第一部分，我們有一些市場上最具吸引力的報價。儘管其他所有人都在大肆宣揚他們的報價是市場上最好的，或者在價值方面是市場上最好的，但當你查看包含的內容和不包含的內容的實際細節時，就會發現我們的報價是最有價值的，而且還存在一些隱藏的成本和隱藏的要求，而且當人們最終解開並設法解開每個報價所包含的所有細微差別時，他們會意識到我們的報價。

The other thing is that we all benefited from a significant reduction in churn, as I mentioned in my prepared marks. We retain customers in a more significant way, which helps us with a net add. That's a testament to the great network that we have. And also, our contributions from digital sales is now very significant. So we did not have that in the past at Boost Mobile historically be the indirect branded shop sales, but now we've seen very significant contribution from the digital channel.

另一件事是，正如我在準備好的標記中提到的那樣，我們都受益於客戶流失的大幅減少。我們以更有效的方式留住客戶，這有助於我們實現淨增。這證明了我們擁有強大的網路。而且，我們從數位銷售中獲得的貢獻現在非常顯著。因此，Boost Mobile 過去並沒有透過品牌店間接銷售，但現在我們看到了來自數位管道的顯著貢獻。

To the second part of your question, I would not label the first quarter as historically low. For us, that is not true. The tax season has always been a very good season for us simply because the younger value-conscious segment in the market that has been our bread and butter and continues to be our focus have always used the tax return on their mobile devices and services, so we consider the first quarter actually one of the more productive quarters for us. I would not make any forward statements about our projections for the second quarter.

對於你問題的第二部分，我不會將第一季稱為歷史低點。對我們來說，事實並非如此。納稅季節對我們來說一直是一個非常好的季節，因為市場上較年輕的、注重價值的群體一直是我們的收入來源，並且仍然是我們的重點，他們一直在移動設備和服務上使用退稅，所以我們認為第一季度實際上是我們最富有成效的季度之一。我不會對第二季的預測做出任何前瞻性的陳述。

But I would say that our goal for the year is to deliver positive good adds for the rest of every quarter going forward. We're not going to look back in terms of growth any longer that -- we're on a growth pattern, we're not going to go back. So can't give you a finish to a statement about our performance. But every quarter will be good and seasonality will definitely play a role. And the first quarter is usually a good quarter for us.

但我想說，我們今年的目標是在未來的每個季度都帶來積極的良好成長。我們不會再回顧成長歷程──我們正處於成長模式中，我們不會倒退。因此，我們無法對我們的表現做出完整的陳述。但每季都會表現良好，季節性肯定會發揮作用。第一季對我們來說通常是一個好季度。

Got it. And then one more. In the 10-Q, you all noted CapEx should drop and then it sounds like it will increase again as you move toward your build-out deadline. How should we think about the timing of when you'll need to ramp CapEx again to meet those deadlines?

知道了。然後再來一個。在 10-Q 中，大家都注意到資本支出應該會下降，然後聽起來隨著建造期限的臨近，資本支出會再次增加。我們應該如何考慮何時需要再次增加資本支出以滿足這些期限？

No, that is accurate there. You'll see CapEx lower in '25 than we've shown you in 2024. And it will ramp up as our deadlines approach. However, given milestones that we've met recently, the 2026 deadline that we have more than likely will be pushed out to future years. So we will move to more of a success-based build meeting.

不，這是準確的。您會發現 2025 年的資本支出低於我們向您展示的 2024 年的資本支出。隨著最後期限的臨近，這一數字還將增加。然而，考慮到我們最近實現的里程碑，2026 年的最後期限很可能會推遲到未來幾年。因此，我們將轉向更以成功為基礎的建設會議。

When you look at the MVNO rolling costs that we pay for, say, a tower and the operating cost of those -- if you come to back to today's dollars at it costs more than what it cost to build the tower, we're going to build those towers. So it's going to ebb and flow based on where subscribers are at and what the need is.

當您查看我們為塔支付的 MVNO 滾動成本以及這些塔的運營成本時 - 如果您回到今天的美元，其成本高於建造塔的成本，我們就會建造這些塔。因此，它會根據訂閱者的位置和需求而起伏。

Marlane Pereiro, Bank of America Securities.

美國銀行證券公司的 Marlane Pereiro。

I just wanted to ask on Hughes on the bond specifically. I thought that you repurchased some of your Hughes secured bonds due next year. And you also issued the $150 million of the new spectrum notes. So I just want to be clear that those -- are those two related? And also, do you have some other uses for proceeds? The incremental capacity on the spectrum notes, how are you thinking about utilizing that? And do you expect to continue repurchasing the Hughes bonds?

我只是想具體詢問休斯有關債券的問題。我以為你回購了一些明年到期的休斯擔保債券。你們還發行了價值 1.5 億美元的新頻譜票據。所以我只是想明確一下——這兩者有關係嗎？另外，您還有其他收益用途嗎？頻譜記錄上的增量容量，您打算如何利用它？您是否預計繼續回購休斯債券？

Thank you, Marlane, for the questions. We obviously, as you know, Paul has mentioned, we are sitting on a significant amount of cash and balance sheet as a result of the financing we've had a few months back. We need to put that cash to use. And one of the best uses of that cash for us is some of our own securities that are in the market. These are undervalued securities. And when we look at it, we've diversified our investments for sure. We're not concentrating on any single source.

謝謝 Marlane 提出的問題。顯然，正如保羅所提到的，由於幾個月前獲得的融資，我們擁有大量現金和資產負債表。我們需要利用這些現金。對我們來說，這些現金的最佳用途之一就是在市場上購買一些我們自己的證券。這些都是被低估的證券。當我們審視它時，我們肯定已經實現了投資多元化。我們並不專注於任何單一來源。

But when we look at where we get the highest return with the lowest risk and one of those areas is buying our own debt that Paul decided to do. It's not a very significant amount. So it doesn't really move the needle in terms of our overall financials, but certainly, it's part of the basket that you'll use in (inaudible) in the short term and we benefit from. The second part of the question had to do with the $150 million raised at the lease sale of additional spectrum back bonds that we also had in there, and that's an obligation we have had to a party that needed to -- that we need to satisfy.

但是，當我們考慮在哪裡可以以最低的風險獲得最高的回報時，其中一個領域就是保羅決定購買自己的債務。這不是一個很大的數字。因此，就我們的整體財務狀況而言，它實際上並沒有產生任何變化，但可以肯定的是，它是您在短期內會使用的（聽不清楚）籃子的一部分，並且我們會從中受益。問題的第二部分與我們透過租賃出售額外頻譜支持債券籌集的 1.5 億美元有關，這是我們對需要履行的一方應盡的義務。

We had committed to offer some additional bonds, issued some additional bonds that it had been due for many months, and we just honored that obligation. There's a lot of demand for that security for that bond, and we keep -- we just wanted to make sure that we meet that obligation. There was nothing else more to it.

我們承諾提供一些額外的債券，發行了一些已經到期個多月的額外債券，我們只是履行了這項義務。對該債券的擔保需求很大，我們堅持下去——我們只是想確保我們履行該義務。除此之外再無其他。

Both unrelated.

兩者互不相關。

Got it. Great. And then just on the buyback on the bond, why not the unsecured versus the secured?

知道了。偉大的。那麼，就債券回購而言，為什麼不選擇無擔保債券，而選擇有擔保債券呢？

There was no particular reason for it. We may be selling those bonds by a (inaudible) for who knows. I think that was a decision that was made. I don't think you could read anything into it in terms of secured versus unsecured.

沒有什麼特別的原因。我們可能會以（聽不清楚）的價格出售這些債券，誰知道呢。我認為這是一個已經做出的決定。我認為你無法從有擔保與無擔保的角度來解讀其中的任何內容。

Got it. And one more, if I could. Is there any update that you can provide on the status of the litigation with the DBS bondholders? There were reports earlier this week that a mediator could possibly be appointed. So just wondering if maybe that might signal there could be room for a settlement with bondholders or even reopen the door for discussions with DTV?

知道了。如果可以的話，再多說一句。您能否提供有關星展銀行債券持有人訴訟的最新進展？本週稍早有報道稱，可能會任命一名調解員。所以我想知道這是否可能意味著有與債券持有人達成和解的空間，甚至重新打開與 DTV 進行談判的大門？

Right. No, we don't have comment on that litigation.

正確的。不，我們對該訴訟不予置評。

Walter Piecyk, LightShed.

Walter Piecyk，LightShed。

Can you talk about what investments you're going to make in the -- (technical difficulty)

你能談談你打算在--（技術難度）

Walter, you're breaking up a bit. Could you just repeat your question or pick up the headset?

沃特，你有點崩潰了。您能重複一下您的問題或拿起耳機嗎？

Let me come back in the queue. I might need to (technical difficulty). Thanks.

讓我回到隊列中。我可能需要（技術難度）。謝謝。

Bryan Kraft, Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的布萊恩·克拉夫特。

I had a couple of wireless questions. I guess, first, I was wondering if you could just provide any color on where the new Boost customers are primarily coming from?

我有幾個關於無線的問題。我想，首先，我想知道您是否可以提供一些關於新的 Boost 客戶主要來自哪裡的資訊？

Secondly, I wanted to ask you about your ability to utilize third-party financing to fund handset subsidies and any IP working capital usage? So you don't have to use your own cash flow to fund them and obviously allow you to grow faster. So I just wanted just to see where you are on that.

其次，我想問您是否有能力利用第三方融資來資助手機補貼以及任何 IP 營運資金的使用情況？因此，您不必使用自己的現金流來為其提供資金，這顯然可以讓您更快地發展。所以我只是想看看你對此的看法。

And then lastly, I guess I just want to ask, are you looking at any opportunities to partner with other wireless operators and jointly building out any of your spectrum bands as a way of maybe doing it in a more capital-light way? And then also, if you're open to either selling or leasing maybe some pieces of the spectrum that you have for other operators, where you might not be using it? And could you use to generate some additional cash flow or if it's sold, bring capital in. Thank you.

最後，我只想問一下，您是否正在尋找機會與其他無線營運商合作並共同建立任何頻譜帶，以便以更輕資本的方式做到這一點？另外，您是否願意向其他業者出售或出租部分頻譜，而您可能不會使用這些頻譜？您是否可以用它來產生一些額外的現金流，或者如果它被出售，您可以帶來資本。謝謝。

Three different questions. I try to remember all and pass them out. The first question is that are we getting customers across all -- from all of the other players in the market at Boost Mobile. We're particularly pleased with the fact that we're getting some of the better customers because our ARPU on prepaid to our understanding is highest in the market today.

三個不同的問題。我盡力記住所有內容並將它們傳遞出去。第一個問題是，我們是否能夠從 Boost Mobile 市場上所有其他參與者獲得客戶。我們特別高興的是，我們獲得了一些更好的客戶，因為據我們了解，我們的預付費 ARPU 是目前市場上最高的。

We have the highest prepaid ARPU and is rising and has been historically highest has been. And we have had historically lowest churn now in ARPU in prepaid and very competitive with the best in the market churn from the others. It points out that we're getting the better -- a good cohort of subscribers. We're not getting subscribers that don't have any other options. I think it is a testament to the fact that the value overall -- it's considered the best.

我們擁有最高的預付費 ARPU，而且還在不斷上升，一直處於歷史最高水準。現在，我們的預付費 ARPU 流失率已達到歷史最低水平，並且與市場上流失率最高的其他公司相比極具競爭力。這表明我們正在取得更好的成績——擁有一群優秀的訂閱者。我們不會接收沒有其他選擇的訂閱者。我認為這證明了其整體價值——它被認為是最好的。

We're actually getting net positive reporting by a significant amount. Last year, we mentioned that beginning of the year, we were net port out at the beginning of 2024. By end of 2024, we were complete here situation month on month. Every month, we got the port-ins got significantly higher.

我們實際上獲得了大量淨正面報告。去年，我們在年初提到，我們將在 2024 年初完成網路移植。到 2024 年底，我們逐月完成了這裡的情況。我們每個月的移植量都顯著增加。

And today, we have vastly higher port-ins and port-out, that's a significant amount, we're obviously reporting that, which, again, is a testament to customers are recognizing the Boost Mobile network and value being the best in the market. When it comes to, I guess, device financing outside of our own capital, Paul, maybe you can take that piece?

今天，我們的連接埠存取和連接埠輸出量大幅增加，這是一個相當大的數字，我們顯然正在報告這一點，這再次證明客戶認可 Boost Mobile 網路並重視其在市場上的最佳表現。我想，說到我們自有資本以外的設備融資，保羅，也許你可以接受這一點？

Yes. Thanks. We definitely have access to various device finance partners. We first want to use our own cash on the balance sheet, but that may change over time if we feel it's strategic for us, and we'll be obviously opportunistic in that marketplace.

是的。謝謝。我們絕對可以接觸到各種設備融資合作夥伴。我們首先想在資產負債表上使用我們自己的現金，但如果我們認為這對我們具有戰略意義，那麼這種情況可能會隨著時間的推移而改變，而且我們顯然會在那個市場上抓住機會。

And as it comes to spectrum, look, I generally don't comment on about any sort of spectrum related or trading of assets that's not appropriate for the earnings call here. We always have every option available to us. We at the moment, we feel very comfortable where we sit in terms of our spectrum ownership.

至於頻譜，你看，我通常不會對任何與頻譜相關或不適合在收益電話會議上進行的資產交易發表評論。我們總是有各種可用的選擇。目前，就頻譜所有權而言，我們感到非常滿意。

There's a few things in the market that FCC is considering that will even enhance our position, such as enhancing the power level on CBRS, which would be vastly attractive to us. And so we believe there's several ways for us to raise capital and have enough resources to be and remain competitive in the market. And so we're not closing doors on anything. But certainly, I'm not here to discuss any sort of M&A or trading of spectrum.

FCC 正在考慮市場上的一些事情，這些事情甚至會增強我們的地位，例如提高 CBRS 的功率水平，這對我們來說非常有吸引力。因此，我們相信，我們可以透過多種方式籌集資金並獲得足夠的資源，從而保持市場競爭力。因此我們不會關閉任何大門。但可以肯定的是，我在這裡並不是要討論任何形式的併購或頻譜交易。

If I could ask just one quick follow-up. Could you provide any color on the prepaid versus postpaid mix of the new connects?

我能否快速問一個後續問題？您能否提供有關新連接的預付費和後付費組合的詳細資訊？

Yes. Look, I want to start by saying that -- responding to that by saying, we actually have stated and we are continuing, and you will see us even accelerate what we call merger or amalgamation of postpaid and prepaid. I think the concept of post versus prepaid is a 50-year-old concept that it no longer has significant value when you're talking about how much people pay upfront versus how much we pay. That whole gray scale of payment and credit rating is something that we are focused on, and we will eliminate and we are well down the path of doing that.

是的。聽著，我首先要說的是——對此的回應是，我們實際上已經聲明過，而且我們將繼續，你會看到我們甚至會加速所謂的後付費和預付費的合併。我認為後付費與預付費的概念已經有 50 年的歷史了，當你談論人們預付多少錢與我們實際支付多少錢時，它不再具有重要價值。整個支付和信用評級的灰度是我們關注的重點，我們將消除這種現象，而且我們已經朝著這個方向努力。

Having said that, and therefore, as a result of that, it doesn't make sense for us to talk about prepaid postpaid as we are working very hard, and you see us do this in the next couple of few quarters, we eliminate the concept of prepaid postpaid entirely. But just to answer your question because there may be a curiosity about what has it been in the past historical. If I look at today, if I look at first quarter, and use a traditional definition of postpaid, I would say, roughly 1/3 of net adds in the first quarter were postpaid net adds, just about 1/3 was postpaid.

話雖如此，因此，由於這個原因，我們談論預付費後付費是沒有意義的，因為我們正在非常努力地工作，你會看到我們在接下來的幾個季度中這樣做，我們完全消除了預付費後付費的概念。但只是為了回答你的問題，因為人們可能對過去的歷史感到好奇。如果我看今天，如果我看第一季度，並使用後付費的傳統定義，我會說，第一季大約 1/3 的淨增加量是後付費淨增加量，大約 1/3 是後付費。

Walter Piecyk, LightShed.

Walter Piecyk，LightShed。

Can you just talk about -- I know you don't want to give up any like competitive dynamics. But just in general, as we progress through 2025, is there a willingness to invest in more distribution, more advertising, things to kind of get the channel going? And I'm thinking also about Comcast is certainly thinking it feels like a pivot after their call, there was a lot of concern that we started was giving away free line for a year, something that didn't work for (inaudible), God knows how many years ago, but they get away free line for a year, they converted a lot of those to paying customers to Charter, Comcast is now replicating that and plan to be aggressive.

你能不能談談——我知道你不想放棄任何競爭動力。但總的來說，隨著我們進入 2025 年，人們是否願意投資更多的分銷、更多的廣告以及其他東西來推動管道的發展？我還想到了康卡斯特，他們肯定認為在他們打完電話之後，這感覺像是一個轉折點，我們開始提供一年的免費線路，這在（聽不清楚）時並沒有起作用，天知道這是多少年前的事了，但他們確實提供了一年的免費線路，並將其中許多轉化為 Charter 的付費客戶，康卡斯特現在正在復制這種做法，併計劃採取積極行動。

Not to ask if you're going to do free lines, but are you -- is there kind of a plan now that you've kind of gotten over the hump of positive net adds, and it looks like you're going to be net adds for the next couple of quarters? Churn is obviously much more reasonable now. I would think that you now consider next step in terms of investment for growth. I'm just curious if you can speak to that at all in terms of what the game plan is here?

我不是要問您是否會提供免費線路，而是問您是否會——現在您已經克服了淨增值的困難，並且看起來您將在接下來的幾個季度中實現淨增值，那麼現在有什麼計劃嗎？現在客戶流失顯然更合理了。我認為您現在正在考慮下一步的投資成長措施。我只是好奇，您是否可以談談這裡的遊戲計劃是什麼？

Walter, yes, absolutely. Nothing that we have delivered to date has been accidental in the sense that we put a lot of foundation in '24. '24, it was like fixing the basics and putting the foundation to get the good customers, to get value customers that are higher end of the value, consciousness is coming to us and you see the result of that today, and we are very pleased and proud of what we have done. We are working on additional distribution channel.

沃特，是的，絕對是。我們迄今所取得的成果都不是偶然的，因為我們在 24 年打下了許多基礎。 「24，這就像是打好了基礎，為獲得優質客戶、獲得高端價值客戶奠定了基礎，意識正在向我們襲來，你今天就看到了結果，我們對我們所做的事情感到非常高興和自豪。我們正在努力拓展額外的分銷管道。

Digital as already I have mentioned, has become a very significant contributor to our net adds of the quarter. And you have seen us even at what traditionally people have been referring to us as postpaid. Now, we all are increasing -- we will be increasing our roots to market, we're working on fundamental ways from the digital side, from a national retail side, from other non-distributional methods that require a significant amount of in-house development in business development before we actually surface them in the market.

正如我已經提到的，數位化已經成為我們本季淨增值的一個非常重要的貢獻者。您甚至可以看到我們傳統上被稱為後付費的服務。現在，我們都在不斷加強——我們將不斷紮根於市場，我們正在從數位化方面、從全國零售方面、從其他非分銷方式等方面進行根本性的努力，這些方法需要我們在業務開發方面進行大量的內部開發，然後我們才能將它們真正推向市場。

And I think you have touched on something important and that is route to market and access where people can buy from us and how we deliver the service and product to them, I think that's the key focus areas for us. I can only comment to this level and just say that, yes, more to come. I'm not promising that we necessarily in a very, very immediate time for this quarter but it's not -- it certainly is not too far, and you will see the results of that towards the end of this year and beyond.

我認為您提到了一些重要的事情，那就是進入市場的途徑和人們可以從我們這裡購買產品的管道以及我們如何向他們提供服務和產品，我認為這是我們關注的重點領域。我只能就這個層面發表評論，並且說，是的，還會有更多評論。我不能保證我們一定會在本季立即實現這一目標，但肯定不會太遠，您將在今年年底及以後看到結果。

The second question is Comcast downplays the impact that the kind of moving on the Verizon MVNO contracts that they have has on that going forward. However, they're still restricted under that contract to only sell bundled services where maybe there's an opportunity for them to sell to customers that they don't currently have, given that they're losing broadband customers.

第二個問題是康卡斯特淡化了其對 Verizon MVNO 合約的變動對未來發展的影響。然而，根據該合同，他們仍然受到限制，只能銷售捆綁服務，考慮到他們正在失去寬頻客戶，也許他們有機會向目前沒有的客戶銷售捆綁服務。

What's your viewpoint on a willingness to do an MVNO deal with them? And I guess, more importantly, if you did an MVNO deal with them, do they get the benefit of -- would an Xfinity customer get the benefit of not only your network, but the ability of those customers to then roam on to your AT&T and T-Mobile roaming partnership?

您對與他們進行 MVNO 交易的意願有何看法？我想，更重要的是，如果您與他們達成 MVNO 協議，他們是否會受益——Xfinity 客戶是否不僅可以享受您的網路的益處，還可以享受這些客戶隨後漫遊到您的 AT&T 和 T-Mobile 漫遊合作夥伴關係的能力？

I cannot comment about Comcast intentions and what might be best for them. Obviously, only they can comment on that. I can comment about our ability and willingness to partner. Look, we are going to look at every opportunity that comes our way. We are not close-minded to any sort of partnerships. We have demonstrated that globally in many ways in our other parts of business.

我無法評論康卡斯特的意圖以及什麼對他們最有利。顯然，只有他們才能對此發表評論。我可以評論一下我們合作的能力和意願。瞧，我們會抓住我們遇到的每一個機會。我們對任何形式的合作關係都持開放態度。我們已經在全球範圍內以多種方式在其他業務領域證明了這一點。

We're doing that today with content providers. We have to do that on a mobile business with anybody in the wholesale business. There are some discussions that would have to happen, obviously, with roaming partners. We cannot do this (inaudible) without their support. But if the economics of a deal be so much that is conducive to value enhancing to everyone, I think we would be working -- we'd be willing to consider and capitalize any discussions.

我們今天正在與內容提供者合作實現這一目標。我們必須與批發業務中的任何人一起在行動業務上做到這一點。顯然，我們必須與漫遊夥伴進行一些討論。如果沒有他們的支持，我們就無法做到這一點（聽不清楚）。但如果交易的經濟效益足以有利於提升每個人的價值，我認為我們會努力——我們願意考慮並利用任何討論。

I absolutely do not want to comment or imply in any way that we are discussing (inaudible) with Comcast or we are approaching Comcast. I want to be on the record that I am not commenting in any way about -- this is just a speculation. You asked me a question about Comcast, and I just referred to it, but I certainly don't want any implications that we are working with Comcast on anything.

我絕對不想以任何方式評論或暗示我們正在與康卡斯特討論（聽不清楚）或我們正在與康卡斯特接洽。我想鄭重聲明，我對此不做任何評論——這只是猜測。您問了我一個關於康卡斯特的問題，我剛才提到了這一點，但我當然不希望任何暗示表明我們正在與康卡斯特合作。

Does that work on the AT&T -- if you were able to do something with them, would those customers be able to then utilize the roaming relationships that you already have with AT&T and T-Mobile?

這對 AT&T 有用嗎——如果您能夠與他們合作，那些客戶是否能夠利用您與 AT&T 和 T-Mobile 已經建立的漫遊關係？

Technologically, yes, Walter, this is John. Technologically, yes, there's solutions and bats there, but it would come down to business deals.

從技術上來說，是的，沃爾特，這是約翰。從技術上來說，確實有解決方案和方法，但最終還是要看商業交易。

But does AT&T and T-Mobile restrict you from doing a pass-through deal like that?

但是 AT&T 和 T-Mobile 是否限制您進行這樣的轉手交易？

Yes, I think we've sort of already answered that. It would require cooperation from all parties to advance any wholesale relationships.

是的，我想我們已經回答了這個問題。任何批發關係的推進都需要各方的合作。

Adam Rhodes, Octus.

亞當·羅德斯，章魚。

You already touched on it briefly, but direct-to-device has certainly become a more mainstream topic. So a couple of years ago, when you announced the EchoStar DISH combination, each of the companies, SBM assets were discussed a significant rationale of the transaction. Can you provide any color on how EchoStar's unique positioning as a cooperator of terrestrial and satellite networks differentiates it and benefit it compared with others in the space?

您已經簡要地提到了這一點，但直接到設備無疑已經成為一個更主流的話題。幾年前，當您宣布 EchoStar DISH 合併時，每家公司、SBM 資產都討論了交易的重要理由。您能否介紹一下 EchoStar 作為地面和衛星網路合作者的獨特定位如何使其與太空領域的其他公司區分開來並受益？

Yes. So thank you for the question. We believe we have almost every -- we tick every box that is required to make the number one strategic play there. Most important of all, we do have the same spectrum and rights to a terrestrial and space to make it worth. And obviously, our S-band rights globally, highest ITU level authorization. And then obviously, in the US, we have the AWS-4.

是的。謝謝你的提問。我們相信，我們幾乎具備了在那裡實施首要戰略行動所需的一切條件。最重要的是，我們確實擁有相同的地面和太空頻譜和權利，以使其具有價值。顯然，我們的 S 波段權利在全球範圍內獲得了國際電信聯盟最高級別的授權。顯然，在美國，我們有 AWS-4。

So we don't have to work with anybody else, we don't have to find many other parties to collaborate with us to complement or complete the spectrum picture in -- our spectrum is not utilized in a way that we have to clean it, clear it like other bands, L-band and other bands have to do. So in a way, I think that highway is paved and ready for us.

因此，我們不必與任何其他人合作，也不必尋找許多其他方來與我們合作以補充或完成頻譜圖 - 我們的頻譜使用方式並不像其他頻段、L 波段和其他頻段那樣需要清理、清除。因此從某種程度上來說，我認為這條高速公路已經鋪好了，等待我們了。

But in addition to that, we have two other things that very -- almost nobody else has, we have both a satellite operator, manufacturer, technology provider as you have known from our comments on Hughes, and we are a key supplier to OneWeb, and we have been a supplier to other LEO systems in the past, global stars and others. So we are well positioned from the space perspective.

但除此之外，我們還有另外兩樣東西——幾乎沒有人擁有，我們既是衛星運營商，又是製造商，同時也是技術提供商，正如您從我們對休斯的評論中所了解的那樣，我們是 OneWeb 的主要供應商，過去我們一直是其他 LEO 系統的供應商，包括 Global Stars 等。因此，從空間角度來看，我們處於有利地位。

And then we're also the 5G ORAN national provider, the largest ORAN provider in the world practically now with partnership and roaming agreements with every carrier around the world. Many and all of this together for us is just the most natural thing because we are all in-house. We are the only company that can do it all in-house.

我們也是 5G ORAN 國家提供商，實際上是目前世界上最大的 ORAN 提供商，與世界各地的每家運營商都有合作和漫遊協議。對我們來說，所有這些結合在一起是最自然的事情，因為我們都在公司內部。我們是唯一一家能夠在內部完成所有工作的公司。

There may be a natural question as to why is it taking time, and the answer is we did not want to, and we would not have built a system that is not 5G ORAN, all standards. We would not have done that, simply because one of the benefits of the business case, one of the ways that the world will benefit from this is that it built into standard handsets. We do not have to manufacture, we do not have to subsidize. We do not have to uniquely market and distribute.

人們可能會自然而然地問，為什麼要花時間？答案是我們不想，也不會建立一個不符合 5G ORAN 和所有標準的系統。我們不會這麼做，因為商業案例的好處之一、世界將從中受益的方式之一就是它可以內建到標準手機中。我們不必製造，我們不必補貼。我們不必單獨進行行銷和分銷。

That will be built into every device that gets shipped. Those chipsets are in the making now, and the handsets will be available, and we don't want to have a satellite out there. If I had a satellite today, I would not launch it today. I would not because the satellite has a life of several years in the LEO system. And it's a satellite go up there, but there are no devices to talk to. What is the point? What is the point of depreciating a very expensive asset up in the sky without being able to get revenue from it?

這將內建到每台出廠的設備中。這些晶片組目前正在製造中，手機也將面對市，我們不想在那裡放置衛星。如果我今天有一顆衛星，我今天就不會發射它。我不會，因為這顆衛星在低地球軌道系統的壽命只有幾年。雖然有一顆衛星升空了，但是卻沒有可以通話的設備。重點是什麼？如果不能從中獲取收益，那麼貶值天空中非常昂貴的資產又有什麼意義呢？

So the timing of when the satellite has to go up versus an available population of usable devices, compatible devices on earth is a timing decision that is very important and that's why we are timing for that optimized window, it is not that we are late. If anybody else is doing it earlier, either they're not doing it based on 3GPP, 5G standard or if they do it, they're going to end up with devices that are not compatible with it.

因此，衛星升空的時間與地球上可用設備、相容設備的數量有關，這是一個非常重要的時間決定，這就是為什麼我們要選擇優化的時間窗口，而不是我們遲到了。如果其他人更早這樣做，那麼他們要么沒有基於 3GPP、5G 標準來做，要么即使他們這樣做，最終也會生產出與之不相容的設備。

So we are very excited about it. I think, as I mentioned earlier, it's a different question. We're not going to make announcements in an -- and overhang the market when we -- until we have the proper substance at hand, but we are not missing the window of opportunity. We will maximize our use of our business case, and we will be after taking advantage of this opportunity that's uniquely presented to us.

因此我們對此感到非常興奮。我認為，正如我之前提到的，這是一個不同的問題。在我們掌握適當的實質內容之前，我們不會發布任何聲明，也不會在市場上引起軒然大波，但我們不會錯過機會之窗。我們將最大限度地利用我們的商業案例，並充分利用我們面臨的這一獨特機會。

Thanks for the question. Operator, I think we should move to one more question given that we are reaching close to the end of the hour.

謝謝你的提問。接線員，考慮到時間已經快到了，我想我們應該再問一個問題。

Sam McHugh, BNP Paribas Asset Management.

法國巴黎銀行資產管理公司的 Sam McHugh。

Three short follow-up questions, I guess. First, on the net adds. You talk about government support programs. I guess that's maybe a lifeline. Could you maybe just dimension how much of a boost they are to net adds at the moment? That's number one.

我想，有三個簡短的後續問題。首先，網上新增。您談到了政府支持計劃。我想這也許是一條生命線。您能否估算一下它們目前對淨增量的推動作用有多大？這是第一點。

Second question was on the Hughes secured buyback. Why the Hughes box, not the EchoStar box? And I guess, why by secured versus unsecured? I think you said earlier, there was no reason, but I think the unsecured were actually cheaper than the secures at the time?

第二個問題是關於休斯擔保回購。為什麼是 Hughes 盒子，而不是 EchoStar 盒子？我想，為什麼是擔保的，而不是無擔保的？我想你之前說過，沒有理由，但我認為當時無擔保的其實比有擔保的便宜？

And then third, I think just to clarify, the T-Mobile and AT&T deals from what I always understood precluded you from white labeling. I think the T-Mobile deal was public. So you basically are saying you couldn't just offer an M&A without preagreement from AT&T and T-Mobile?

第三，我想澄清一下，據我所知，T-Mobile 和 AT&T 的交易阻止了您使用白標。我認為 T-Mobile 交易是公開的。所以您基本上是說，如果沒有 AT&T 和 T-Mobile 的事先同意，您就無法提出併購？

So three different questions. Let me remember, there was a question on lifeline. So when we -- when AT&T program kind of terminated, we started migrating our customers to our prepaid and various brands that we have. So we're not -- no longer breaking that out as that has become a bit of a mix in a way that it doesn't match or lend itself to individual or segment reporting. So we're not breaking that up.

所以有三個不同的問題。讓我記住，生命線上有一個問題。因此，當 AT&T 計劃終止時，我們開始將客戶遷移到我們的預付費和各種品牌。因此，我們不再將其分開，因為這已經變得有點混亂，與個人或分部報告不匹配或不適合。所以我們不會打破這一點。

There was a question about -- what was the second question? I apologize, quickly -- oh, yeah, I answered that previously. You should not read to it. I mean the fact that we're buying it, it's just a question that I think that was a fair question. What do we buy, what assets we buy. I suggest you don't read anything extra to it other than the fact that we thought that was available to us and it was available to us at a reasonable price and we thought we could probably buy it from a seller that could sell it to us for a proper amount.

有一個問題──第二個問題是什麼？我很快道歉——哦，是的，我之前已經回答過這個問題了。你不應該讀它。我的意思是，事實上我們正在購買它，這只是一個問題，我認為這是一個公平的問題。我們買什麼，買什麼資產。我建議你不要閱讀任何額外的內容，除了我們認為我們可以得到它並且以合理的價格提供給我們並且我們認為我們可以從可以以適當的價格賣給我們的賣家那裡購買它。

And so there's no strategic -- no special strategic rationale for why we did A versus B, you could have done the other one if you had access to it in a reasonable way. And then the third question was, I think, John, maybe you want to answer that one?

因此，我們做 A 而不是 B 沒有任何戰略上的理由——沒有什麼特殊的戰略理由，如果你能以合理的方式接觸到它，你本可以做另一個。然後第三個問題是，我想，約翰，也許你想回答這個問題？

It's John again. Well, first of all, we've got strong relationships with AT&T and T-Mobile. We're on track with those partnerships and are productive. To the extent we want to enter new business arrangements with them, such as wholesale, that would require a new business deal and new cooperation to enter the wholesale market in a way that we could use their roaming services.

又是約翰。首先，我們與 AT&T 和 T-Mobile 建立了牢固的關係。我們與這些合作夥伴的合作進展順利，並且富有成效。如果我們希望與他們達成新的業務安排，例如批發，那就需要達成新的業務協議和新的合作，以便我們能夠使用他們的漫遊服務進入批發市場。

And you would expect that because if somebody showed up here for wholesale, depending on volume of the business to bring to the table, depending on what is the business case looks like and there's certainly -- there's no automatic on any wholesale. In my life, I've never seen a wholesale deal that is prewired.

你會預料到這一點，因為如果有人來這裡進行批發，這取決於要帶來的業務量，取決於商業案例是什麼樣的，而且肯定——任何批發都沒有自動化。在我的一生中，我從未見過預先接線的批發交易。

When somebody shows up, there's always a custom discussion, custom unique negotiations on economics. We cannot make a statement on behalf of anybody else as to whether that would agree or accept that in any custom negotiation what the outcome would be. So we're not answering you with a very tangible yes or no simply because the real answer, the proper answer, it depends.

當有人出現時，總會有一場關於經濟的客製化討論和客製化的獨特談判。我們不能代表任何其他人發表聲明，說明在任何客製化談判中是否同意或接受結果會是什麼。因此，我們不會用非常具體的「是」或「否」來回答您，因為真正的答案、正確的答案取決於具體情況。

I think we can take one more question given that we still have a couple of minutes left. So operator, please take one last question.

鑑於我們還有幾分鐘的時間，我想我們可以再回答一個問題。接線員，請回答最後一個問題。

Jonathan Chaplin, New Street Research.

喬納森·卓別林（Jonathan Chaplin），新街研究公司（New Street Research）。

Hamid, I was wondering if you could give us a little bit more color on your LEO aspirations? We saw that some layers have been launched. I think the total plan is for '28. I'm wondering how many have been launched so far?

哈米德，我想知道您是否可以向我們詳細介紹您對 LEO 的期望？我們看到一些層已經啟動。我認為總體計劃是針對 28 年的。我想知道到目前為止已經發射了多少個？

And then are you going to be able to do direct-to-device communications from this constellation? And if not, wondering how discussions with maybe Starlink or Kiper may have progressed on that front?

那麼，您是否能夠從這個星座進行直接到設備的通訊？如果沒有，想知道與 Starlink 或 Kiper 的討論在這方面可能會取得怎樣的進展？

So the LEO system that we have had historically, and we are in the process of continuing to work with it, it's an IoT in what we call a narrow band. It's not designed, we have never designed it, and it's never been meant to do a direct-to-consumer mobile device in your pocket. We call that a Leidos system. That's a [Syrian] system that we have had. The short answer to that is that we're not targeting it for that.

因此，我們歷史上一直擁有的 LEO 系統，以及我們正在繼續使用它的過程，都是我們所謂的窄頻物聯網。它不是設計出來的，我們從來沒有設計過它，它從來就不是用來做口袋裡直接面向消費者的行動裝置的。我們稱之為 Leidos 系統。這就是我們所擁有的（敘利亞）體系。簡短的回答是，我們並不是以此為目標。

Having said that, I want to be here mentioning that we have been doing messaging to device directly to mobile phones, for instance, a Pixel phone, Google Pixel phone. In Europe now using our S-band for a couple of years now, and that's been commercially available and our commercial customers on it. We can easily do the same thing in the United States.

話雖如此，我想在這裡提一下，我們一直在直接向手機設備發送訊息，例如 Pixel 手機、Google Pixel 手機。歐洲現在已經使用我們的 S 波段好幾年了，而且已經商業化，我們的商業客戶也在使用它。我們可以在美國輕易地做同樣的事情。

So doing the messaging that some of the other companies have done, just pure messaging in regional shape or form, here or there, it's not something, in fact, we did this before anybody else had done it. And we have done it all in-house assets. There's no partnership required between a mobile carrier and space carrier. We've done it all in-house, and we can do that.

因此，像其他一些公司那樣進行訊息傳遞，只是以區域形式進行純粹的訊息傳遞，無論是在這裡還是在那裡，這都不算什麼，事實上，我們在其他人這樣做之前就已經這樣做了。我們已經利用內部資產完成了所有工作。行動運營商和太空運營商之間不需要合作。我們已經在內部完成了所有工作，我們可以做到這一點。

But we're not focusing on that because our aspirations for direct to device is to bring in the service that would be undifferentiated from what you're already using your mobile device in your pocket, whether it be an Android on or iPhone, iOS phone anywhere in the world. And that is our aspiration. Nobody does that today in a proper way.

但我們並不關注這一點，因為我們對直接面向裝置的期望是推出與您口袋中已有的行動裝置無差別的服務，無論是世界任何地方的 Android 手機、iPhone 還是 iOS 手機。這就是我們的願望。如今沒有人能以適當的方式做到這一點。

If anybody is doing that or is planning to do that in advance of 2028, as you mentioned, 2028, I don't know, I want to say that it is either going to be regional. You're going to have incredible restrictions, you're going to get those hundreds of miles or kilometers on the border there of any country, you're going to start interviewing with the neighboring countries carriers and networks.

如果有人正在這樣做或計劃在 2028 年之前這樣做，正如您所說，2028 年，我不知道，我想說它要么是區域性的。你將面臨令人難以置信的限制，你將獲得任何國家數百英里或公里的邊境，你將開始與鄰國的營運商和網路進行採訪。

And yes, there are bits and pieces of, I guess, subcritical solutions that are not of any interest to us. Our interest is a universal solution, everywhere, no interference, no coverage holes, no restrictions. And that nobody is ahead of us, and I don't believe anybody is going to be ahead of us.

是的，我猜有一些亞臨界解決方案對我們來說不感興趣。我們的興趣在於一個普遍的解決方案，無所不在，沒有乾擾，沒有覆蓋漏洞，沒有限制。沒有人走在我們前面，我也不相信任何人會走在我們前面。

And would you pursue that with your own constellation? Or would it make more sense to partner?

您會用自己的星座來追求這個目標嗎？或合作更有意義？

Look, we certainly do not rely on anybody in order to get this thing done because we can do it all. Having said that, we have commercial animals, just like every other operator in the world, if the pieces parts of the picture can be complemented, provided help produce better by other people, we would absolutely take advantage. So there's no pride of ownership here.

你看，我們當然不依賴任何人來完成這件事，因為我們可以做到一切。話雖如此，我們也有商業動物，就像世界上其他所有運營商一樣，如果圖片的各個部分可以互補，並由其他人提供幫助以生產出更好的產品，我們絕對會利用這一點。因此，這裡不存在主人翁精神。

There's a pride of the ability to do it here because we have all the unique assets that over the past 15 years, EchoStar shareholders have created with a vision they have had starting 15 or 20 years ago buying these assets, where nobody else was thinking of them and bought every pieces of it and brought them together with a view that a day like this, we would be sitting here, having all of it in-house.

我們很自豪能夠在這裡做到這一點，因為我們擁有過去 15 年來所有獨特的資產，這些資產都是 EchoStar 股東在 15 或 20 年前開始購買的，他們懷著這樣的願景，在當時沒有其他人考慮過這些資產，他們買下了這些資產的每一部分並將它們整合在一起，希望有一天，我們能夠坐在這裡，將所有資產都納入內部。

Now that doesn't give me the permission or proud to say if somebody brought something better to the table that I could do even better on my own, then I would walk away from it. I would absolutely take advantage of it.

現在，這並沒有給我權利或自豪地說如果有人能提出更好的建議，而我自己可以做得更好，那麼我就會放棄它。我絕對會利用它。

And with that, we conclude today's conference. All parties may now disconnect. Have a good day.

今天的會議就此結束。各方現在都可以斷開連線。祝你有美好的一天。