EchoStar Corp (SATS) 2024 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to the EchoStar third-quarter 2024 earnings call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. I'll now turn the call over to Dean Manson, Chief Legal Officer. Please go ahead, sir.

歡迎參加 EchoStar 2024 年第三季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）謹此提醒，本次會議正在錄製中。我現在將把電話轉給首席法務官 Dean Manson。請繼續，先生。

Thank you. Welcome to EchoStar's third-quarter 2024 earnings call. We will begin with opening remarks from Hamid Akhavan, President and CEO; followed by Paul Orban, EVP and Principal Financial Officer; Gary Schanman, EVP and Group President of Video Services; John Swieringa, President of Technology and COO; and Jeff Boggs, SVP of Finance for Hughes, who is joining us as Paul Gaske is currently traveling for enterprise business meetings.

謝謝。歡迎參加 EchoStar 2024 年第三季財報電話會議。我們將首先由總裁兼執行長 Hamid Akhavan 致開幕詞；其次是執行副總裁兼財務長 Paul Orban； Gary Schanman，執行副總裁兼視訊服務集團總裁； John Swieringa，技術總裁兼營運長；休斯 (Hughes) 財務高級副總裁傑夫·博格斯 (Jeff Boggs) 加入我們，保羅·加斯克 (Paul Gaske) 目前正在出差參加企業商務會議。

We request that any participant producing a report, not identify other participants or their firms in such reports. We also do not allow audio recording, which we ask that you respect.

我們要求任何製作報告的參與者不要在此類報告中指明其他參與者或其公司。我們也不允許錄音，請您尊重這一點。

All statements we make during this call, other than statements of historical fact, constitute forward-looking statements made pursuant to the Safe Harbor provided by the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These forward-looking statements involve known and unknown risks, uncertainties, and other factors that could cause our actual results to be materially different from historical results and from any future results expressed or implied by the forward-looking statements.

我們在本次電話會議中所做的所有陳述（除歷史事實陳述外）均構成根據 1995 年《私人證券訴訟改革法案》規定的安全港所做的前瞻性陳述。這些前瞻性陳述涉及已知和未知的風險、不確定性和其他因素，可能導致我們的實際結果與歷史結果以及前瞻性陳述明示或暗示的任何未來結果有重大差異。

For a list of those factors and risks, please refer to our quarterly report on Form 10-Q for the quarter ended September 30, 2024, filed and accepted today, November 12, and our subsequent filings made with the SEC. We understand the SEC has some technical difficulties today disseminating all public company filings. So we posted the third-quarter 10-Q directly to our investor relations website a few hours ago.

有關這些因素和風險的列表，請參閱我們於今天（11 月 12 日）提交並接受的截至 2024 年 9 月 30 日的季度 10-Q 表格季度報告，以及我們隨後向 SEC 提交的文件。我們了解美國證券交易委員會目前在傳播所有上市公司文件時遇到一些技術困難。因此，幾個小時前，我們將第三季 10-Q 直接發佈到我們的投資者關係網站上。

Our 10-Q is now available on EDGAR as well. All cautionary statements we make during this call should be understood as being applicable to any forward-looking statements we make wherever they appear. You should carefully consider the risks described in our reports and should not place any undue reliance on any forward-looking statements.

我們的 10-Q 現在也可在 EDGAR 上使用。我們在本次電話會議中所做的所有警告性聲明均應被理解為適用於我們在任何地方做出的任何前瞻性聲明。您應該仔細考慮我們報告中所述的風險，並且不應過度依賴任何前瞻性陳述。

We assume no responsibility for updating any forward-looking statements. We refer to OIBDA and free cash flow during this call. The comparable GAAP measure and a reconciliation for OIBDA is presented in our earnings release and in the case of free cash flow, in our 10-Q.

我們不承擔更新任何前瞻性陳述的責任。我們在本次電話會議中參考了 OIBDA 和自由現金流。我們的收益報告中提供了可比較的 GAAP 衡量標準和 OIBDA 調節表，而就自由現金流而言，則在我們的 10 季報告中提供。

With that, I'll turn it over to Hamid.

有了這個，我會把它交給哈米德。

Thank you, Dean. Welcome, everyone. Thank you for joining us today.

謝謝你，迪恩。歡迎大家。感謝您今天加入我們。

For the past few earnings calls, we have postponed discussing certain aspects of our financing as transactions were under negotiation. However, I'm pleased to address these with you today. At the end of September, we announced a series of transactions which represents one of the largest and most comprehensive simultaneous M&A and balance sheet restructurings to date.

在過去的幾次財報電話會議中，我們推遲了討論融資的某些方面，因為交易正在進行談判。不過，我很高興今天能與大家討論這些問題。9月底，我們宣布了一系列交易，這是迄今為止規模最大、最全面的同時併購和資產負債表重組之一。

Of the transactions which have already been completed, first, TPG Angelo Gordon and a number of co-investors as well as DIRECTV provided $2.5 billion in financing to pay DISH DBS November debt maturity, interest and other operating needs. Second, we launched and successfully executed an exchange offer for the convertible notes, of which we received tenders from 92.9% of the 2025s and 98.5% of the 2026s.

在已完成的交易中，首先，TPG Angelo Gordon 和多家聯合投資者以及 DIRECTV 提供了 25 億美元融資，用於支付 DISH DBS 11 月債務到期、利息和其他營運需求。其次，我們發起並成功執行了可轉換票據的交換要約，其中 92.9% 的 2025 年和 98.5% 的 2026 年收到了投標。

Today, note holders who opted into the exchange will receive a combination of new [secure, straight] and convertible notes with a lower total principal amount due and maturities extended to 2030. Furthermore, certain convertible note holders will provide approximately $5.2 billion in additional financing via secured notes, which are due in 2029.

今天，選擇加入交易所的票據持有人將收到新的[安全、直接]和可轉換票據的組合，到期本金總額較低，期限延長至 2030 年。此外，某些可轉換票據持有人將透過擔保票據提供約 52 億美元的額外融資，該票據將於 2029 年到期。

Third, we issued $400 million in equity via a pipe facility subscribed by institutional investors. We expect both the secured notes and the pipe to be funded today. As a result of these transactions, the going concern disclosure we had in the first half of 2024 has been removed.

第三，我們透過機構投資人認購的管道融資發行了 4 億美元的股本。我們預計擔保票據和管道今天都會得到資助。由於這些交易，我們在 2024 年上半年的持續經營揭露已被刪除。

Finally, we agreed to sell our video services business, namely DISH and SLING, to DIRECTV, subject to successful closing of a DBS exchange offer and satisfying other customary closing conditions. The transaction would reduce EchoStar's consolidated debt by approximately $11.7 billion. The resulting combined Pay-TV company would benefit US Pay-TV consumers by providing more choices and better value in this highly competitive market.

最後，我們同意將我們的視訊服務業務（即 DISH 和 SLING）出售給 DIRECTV，前提是成功完成星展銀行交換要約並滿足其他慣例成交條件。這筆交易將使 EchoStar 的合併債務減少約 117 億美元。由此產生的合併後的付費電視公司將在這個競爭激烈的市場中提供更多選擇和更好的價值，從而使美國付費電視消費者受益。

The sale of our video services business to DIRECTV will take time. Assuming successful completion of the related exchange offer, we expect it to close in late 2025. While we are hopeful the DBS exchange will be successful, we now have a more robust foundation to operate and grow EchoStar's business independent of the exchange outcome. Looking at the bigger picture of our business, the recent transactions highlight the valuation of our spectrum assets.

將我們的視訊服務業務出售給 DIRECTV 需要時間。假設相關交換要約成功完成，我們預計 2025 年底完成。雖然我們希望星展銀行交易所能夠取得成功，但我們現在擁有更堅實的基礎來經營和發展 EchoStar 的業務，而不受交易所結果的影響。從我們業務的大局來看，最近的交易凸顯了我們頻譜資產的估值。

As we look to the future of connectivity and an AI-powered world, wireless connectivity will be a primary enabler, and wireless spectrum will be the most scarce resource, giving further rise to its valuation. We believe there are upwards of tens of billions of dollars in asset value that is not accounted for in our current market cap. Closing this gap could have a tremendous positive impact on our share price. We are focused on realizing this value for our shareholders through a robust development and the scaling of our mobile business.

當我們展望連接和人工智慧驅動的世界的未來時，無線連接將成為主要推動因素，無線頻譜將成為最稀缺的資源，從而進一步提升其估值。我們認為，還有數百億美元的資產價值尚未計入我們目前的市值。縮小這一差距可能會對我們的股價產生巨大的正面影響。我們致力於透過行動業務的強勁發展和規模化為股東實現這一價值。

As for EchoStar's third-quarter operating results, I am once again pleased with our team's execution. We continue to manage costs throughout the business and focus on profitable growth at a scale. The Pay-TV segment continued to create significant cash flow for the business during the quarter. We grew the SLING TV customer base and improved operational efficiencies on the DISH TV side and cost-effective initiatives.

至於EchoStar第三季的經營業績，我再次對我們團隊的執行力感到滿意。我們繼續管理整個業務的成本，並專注於大規模的獲利成長。付費電視部門在本季繼續為該業務創造大​​量現金流。我們擴大了 SLING TV 客戶群，提高了 DISH TV 方面的營運效率以及具有成本效益的措施。

On the Hughes front, we continue our march toward expansion of our enterprise business, such as our in-flight aviation products and services. In parallel, we focus on acquiring and retaining high-value consumer subscribers at HughesNet.

在休斯方面，我們繼續拓展我們的企業業務，例如我們的機上航空產品和服務。同時，我們專注於在 HughesNet 上取得和留住高價值消費者訂閱者。

For our Boost Mobile brand, we continue to make improvements and saw additional subscriber growth in the third quarter, excluding the impact of the terminated ACP program. We'll talk more about the strategy and performance of the Boost Mobile in a few minutes, but we are -- we've improved the digital experience through a unified brand identity and offerings and added important new distribution through Apple retail channels.

對於我們的 Boost Mobile 品牌，我們繼續進行改進，並在第三季看到用戶的額外成長，排除終止 ACP 計畫的影響。我們將在幾分鐘內詳細討論 Boost Mobile 的策略和性能，但我們已經透過統一的品牌標識和產品改善了數位體驗，並透過 Apple 零售管道添加了重要的新分銷。

We continue to enhance and densify our Open RAN 5G wireless network. The FCC took a significant step in promoting competition in the wireless market by approving our updated build-out framework for our 5G network. This new framework will enable us to focus on driving competition faster in key markets, delivering lower cost offerings to consumers and accelerating and expanding our final build-out milestones for certain spectrum licenses. Overall, we made tremendous progress in realigning our business, addressing financial concerns and setting up EchoStar for growth over the coming years.

我們持續增強和密集化我們的 Open RAN 5G 無線網路。FCC 批准了我們更新的 5G 網路建置框架，在促進無線市場競爭方面邁出了重要一步。這個新框架將使我們能夠專注於更快地推動關鍵市場的競爭，為消費者提供成本更低的產品，並加速和擴大我們某些頻譜許可證的最終建設里程碑。總體而言，我們在調整業務、解決財務問題以及建立 EchoStar 以實現未來幾年的成長方面取得了巨大進展。

Before I turn the call over to Paul Orban for commentary on the financials and in light of the recent election, we look forward to working with the new administration on advancing US leadership in 5G, promoting competition both domestically and internationally, and driving innovation and growth with Open RAN, cloud native, and non-terrestrial network or NTN satellite solutions.

在我將電話轉交給保羅·歐爾班(Paul Orban) 以徵求對財務狀況的評論之前，並考慮到最近的選舉，我們期待與新政府合作，提升美國在5G 領域的領導地位，促進國內和國際競爭，推動創新和成長具有 Open RAN、雲端原生和非地面網路或 NTN 衛星解決方案。

Now over to Paul Orban.

現在交給保羅·歐爾班。

Thank you, Hamid. As Hamid mentioned, in late September, we announced a series of transactions that substantially restructured our balance sheet. These actions highlight our commitment to strengthen our financial position and strategically refocus on the future, resulting in the removal of our going concern disclosure.

謝謝你，哈米德。正如哈米德所提到的，九月底，我們宣布了一系列交易，大幅重組了我們的資產負債表。這些行動凸顯了我們對加強財務狀況和策略性地重新關注未來的承諾，從而取消了我們的持續經營揭露。

We ended the third quarter with over $2.7 billion of cash and marketable securities, including our restricted cash. We will fund the $2 billion of debt return this week from this restricted cash. We continue to manage all of our brands with a focus on financial discipline and a goal to onboard the highest quality subscribers, and as a result, these efforts are evident in our DISH and Boost Mobile churn rates this quarter.

截至第三季末，我們擁有超過 27 億美元的現金和有價證券，其中包括我們的限制性現金。本週我們將用這筆受限現金為 20 億美元的債務返還提供資金。我們繼續管理我們所有的品牌，重點關注財務紀律，並以吸引最高品質的訂戶為目標，因此，這些努力在本季度的 DISH 和 Boost Mobile 流失率中得到了體現。

Now let's review our financial performance for the third quarter. Revenue was $3.9 billion in the third quarter. That's down 5% year over year, primarily due to fewer subscribers. OIBDA was $317 million, down $49 million year over year, driven by higher network operating costs for more [sight on air] and lower gross margin related to fewer subscribers. As stated on previous calls, our teams are focused on maintaining positive operating free cash flow.

現在讓我們回顧一下我們第三季的財務表現。第三季營收為 39 億美元。年減 5%，主要是因為訂閱者減少。OIBDA 為 3.17 億美元，年減 4,900 萬美元，原因是更多[直播]帶來的網路營運成本增加以及與訂戶減少相關的毛利率降低。正如先前的電話會議所述，我們的團隊致力於保持積極的營運自由現金流。

We are on track to meet this goal in 2024, in part due to our financial discipline and by continuing to execute on our operational plan. Free cash flow for Q3, which includes our debt service, was negative $219 million, largely driven by cash interest. Year over year, free cash flow improved by $295 million, primarily driven by a $451 million decrease in capital spend for the network, which is in line with our prior guidance.

我們預計在 2024 年實現這一目標，部分原因是我們的財務紀律以及繼續執行我們的營運計劃。第三季的自由現金流（包括我們的償債）為負 2.19 億美元，這主要是由現金利息所驅動的。自由現金流年增了 2.95 億美元，主要是由於網路資本支出減少了 4.51 億美元，這與我們先前的指導一致。

This decrease in capital spend was slightly offset by the $49 million decrease in OIBDA. We continue to expect CapEx for the year to be roughly half of what it was in 2023. With that, I'd like to turn it over to Gary to discuss video services.

OIBDA 減少 4,900 萬美元，略微抵消了資本支出的減少。我們仍然預計今年的資本支出將約為 2023 年的一半。說到這裡，我想把它交給加里討論視訊服務。

Thank you, Paul. As Hamid mentioned, we made significant progress across the Pay-TV business in Q3 against priority initiatives supporting ARPU growth, customer engagement, and cost optimization. Despite a continuously challenging market landscape, we continue to operate favorably across key metrics of churn, net adds, and per subscriber profitability.

謝謝你，保羅。正如哈米德所提到的，我們在第三季的付費電視業務中取得了重大進展，並採取了支持 ARPU 成長、客戶參與度和成本優化的優先措施。儘管市場環境持續充滿挑戰，但我們在客戶流失、淨增加和每用戶獲利能力等關鍵指標上繼續保持良好營運。

In Q3, we achieved a year-over-year ARPU increase of 3.4% across the business, and our cost optimization initiatives continue to yield significant year-over-year SG&A and variable cost savings. These efforts drove substantial increases in OIBDA per sub growth versus Q3 2023.

第三季度，我們整個業務的 ARPU 年比成長了 3.4%，我們的成本優化措施繼續帶來顯著的同比 SG&A 和可變成本節省。與 2023 年第三季相比，這些努力推動了每細分成長的 OIBDA 大幅成長。

Throughout our businesses, we drove solid results by focusing on product innovation, customer experience improvements, AI, ML, and data-driven marketing efforts, AI-enabled advertising creative development and focused investment. On the DISH TV side, specifically, we finished the quarter with approximately 5.9 million subscribers, with Q3 churn 11 basis points lower than Q3 2023.

在我們的整個業務中，我們透過專注於產品創新、客戶體驗改善、人工智慧、機器學習和數據驅動的行銷工作、人工智慧支援的廣告創意開發和集中投資，取得了紮實的成果。具體來說，在 DISH TV 方面，我們本季的訂閱用戶數量約為 590 萬，第三季的用戶流失率比 2023 年第三季低 11 個基點。

SAC for activation also substantially improved year over year, driven by increased marketing efficiency. As mentioned last quarter, we launched our Netflix retention bundle and are very pleased with how it's performing and plan to pilot a Netflix acquisition bundle offer in the fourth quarter.

在行銷效率提高的推動下，活化的 SAC 也逐年大幅改善。如上季所提到的，我們推出了 Netflix 保留套裝包，對其表現非常滿意，並計劃在第四季度試行 Netflix 收購捆綁包。

On the SLING TV side, we grew in Q3 and now have over 2.1 million subscribers, 145,000 more than last quarter and our highest mark since 2022. We have driven a reduction in year-over-year SAC and an increase in return on marketing investment due to deploying proprietary AI models that effectively target, optimize offers, and retain high-quality subscribers.

在 SLING TV 方面，我們在第三季度實現了成長，目前訂閱用戶數量超過 210 萬，比上季增加 145,000，達到 2022 年以來的最高水準。由於部署了專有的人工智慧模型，可以有效定位、優化產品和留住高品質訂戶，我們推動了 SAC 的同比減少和行銷投資回報的增加。

We're very proud to have been recently named best live TV streaming service from two publications: US News & World Report and Tom's Guide. This is due in part to our continual focus on quality, as well as the rollout of additional differentiated product features, which resulted in 18 straight months of viewership growth and extending our lead in live TV streaming quality, according to Conviva.

我們非常自豪最近被《美國新聞與世界報道》和《湯姆指南》這兩家出版物評為最佳直播電視串流服務。Conviva 表示，這在一定程度上是由於我們對品質的持續關注，以及額外差異化產品功能的推出，導致收視率連續 18 個月增長，並擴大了我們在直播電視串流品質方面的領先地位。

Our focus in Q4 will be to continue this positive momentum in our key operational metrics for a strong finish to the year.

我們第四季的重點將是在關鍵營運指標上繼續保持這種積極勢頭，以期在今年取得強勁的成績。

I'd like to turn it over to Jeff Boggs, who will cover broadband and satellite services now.

我想把它交給傑夫博格斯，他現在將負責寬頻和衛星服務。

Thank you, Gary. Our broadband and satellite services segment operates in the consumer, enterprise, and government markets. Our HughesNet consumer brand business continues to add subscribers on our JUPITER 3 satellite. We focus on offering affordable, high-speed, unlimited data service plans to new customers, while simultaneously providing high-value upgrade plans to our existing customers.

謝謝你，加里。我們的寬頻和衛星服務部門在消費者、企業和政府市場開展業務。我們的 HughesNet 消費品牌業務持續增加 JUPITER 3 衛星的訂閱者。我們專注於為新客戶提供價格實惠、高速、無限數據服務計劃，同時為現有客戶提供高價值的升級計劃。

We closed the quarter with approximately 912,000 subscribers. With the end of the ACP, we saw additional customer disconnects during the third quarter, which impacted our churn performance for the quarter. Despite these headwinds, our focus remains as in previous quarters on acquiring and retaining high-value customers for HughesNet.

本季末，我們的訂戶數量約為 912,000 名。隨著 ACP 的結束，我們在第三季度看到了更多的客戶斷開連接，這影響了我們本季的客戶流失率。儘管存在這些不利因素，我們的重點仍然是與前幾季一樣，為 HughesNet 取得和留住高價值客戶。

In the enterprise market, our Hughes Managed LEO business has now shipped over 10,000 Hughes manufactured user terminals based on our unique flat panel, electronically steerable antenna technology. Feedback from our customers continues to be very positive, and demand is increasing as we grow the business.

在企業市場，我們的 Hughes Managed LEO 業務現已發貨超過 10,000 個 Hughes 製造的基於我們獨特的平板電子可控天線技術的用戶終端。我們客戶的回饋仍然非常積極，隨著我們業務的發展，需求也不斷增加。

For the second year in a row, Hughes was recognized as the leader in the Gartner Magic Quadrant for managed network services, which is a testament to our ability to deliver cutting-edge, secure network services. Additionally, Hughes was named the 2024 Managed Security Service Provider of the Year by the CyberSecurity Breakthrough. The award recognized Hughes as a leader in providing businesses of all sizes with managed network and security solutions.

Hughes 連續第二年被評為 Gartner 託管網路服務魔力像限的領導者，這證明了我們提供尖端、安全網路服務的能力。此外，Hughes 也被 Cyber​​Security Breakthrough 評為 2024 年度託管安全服務提供者。該獎項表彰休斯在為各種規模的企業提供託管網路和安全解決方案方面的領導者地位。

Our in-flight entertainment and connectivity business continues to grow. We've also begun working with Gogo Business Aviation for use in their Galileo service, where our HDX ESA antenna successfully completed test flights and passed the FAA qualifications.

我們的機上娛樂和連接業務持續成長。我們也開始與 Gogo Business Aviation 合作，在他們的 Galileo 服務中使用我們的 HDX ESA 天線，成功完成了試飛並通過了 FAA 資格認證。

We continue to grow our presence in the DoD 5G networking market with a recent award from the US Army for their 5G Open RAN initiative at Fort Bliss, Texas, which is aimed at exploring the advantages of near real-time control of the radio access network. This award comes on top of the previously announced successes with the US Navy at Whidbey Island Naval Air Station and a naval base in Hawaii. These awards put us in a good position to participate in the government's Spiral 4 program, a 10-year $2.7 billion opportunity.

我們繼續擴大在國防部 5G 網路市場的影響力，最近獲得了美國陸軍在德克薩斯州布利斯堡的 5G Open RAN 計劃的獎勵，該計劃旨在探索無線接入網路近實時控制的優勢。該獎項是在先前宣布與美國海軍在惠德比島海軍航空站和夏威夷海軍基地的成功基礎上獲得的。這些獎項使我們能夠參與政府的 Spiral 4 計劃，這是一個為期 10 年、價值 27 億美元的機會。

EchoStar is uniquely positioned as both a satellite and mobile service provider to develop solutions with a global impact. The portfolio of products offered and our global S-band assets puts us in a unique position to provide such solutions as direct to device. We are already hard at work on this technology and have successfully tested it with our satellites over North America and Europe. We look forward to keeping you updated on our progress in this space. With that, I will turn it back to Hamid for an update on our retail wireless business.

EchoStar 作為衛星和行動服務供應商具有獨特的定位，致力於開發具有全球影響力的解決方案。所提供的產品組合和我們的全球 S 波段資產使我們處於獨特的地位，可以提供直接到設備等解決方案。我們已經在努力研究這項技術，並已通過北美和歐洲的衛星成功對其進行了測試。我們期待向您通報我們在這一領域的最新進展。至此，我將把它轉回給哈米德，以了解我們零售無線業務的最新情況。

Thank you, Jeff. Regarding retail wireless, we continue to progress in our operational enhancements in Q3. We are in a better spot. We are funded, have additional runway to support our obligations to the FCC, and can now anchor our efforts to capital allocation and on how to drive growth in the retail business. We are adjusting our plan due to the recent positive financial and regulatory developments.

謝謝你，傑夫。關於零售無線，我們在第三季繼續在營運增強方面取得進展。我們處於一個更好的位置。我們有資金，有額外的跑道來支持我們對聯邦通訊委員會的義務，現在可以將我們的努力集中在資本配置和如何推動零售業務的成長上。由於最近積極的金融和監管發展，我們正在調整我們的計劃。

As I mentioned on our last earnings call, we made a few significant changes to the business in July. With our refreshed brand and unified prepaid and postpaid experience across the Boost Mobile website and app, we provide consumers simple and flexible offerings. During the third quarter, we expanded our portfolio. As an example, we introduced a unique offer of providing consumers one year of free service when they purchase select Boost Mobile network-compatible 5G phones. We are now in a position where we are activating more than 50% of our all-new device sales on our own network.

正如我在上次財報電話會議上提到的，我們在 7 月對業務進行了一些重大調整。憑藉我們煥然一新的品牌以及 Boost Mobile 網站和應用程式上統一的預付費和後付費體驗，我們為消費者提供簡單且靈活的產品。第三季度，我們擴大了投資組合。例如，我們推出了一項獨特的優惠，當消費者購買精選的 Boost Mobile 網路相容 5G 手機時，為他們提供一年的免費服務。現在，我們超過 50% 的全新設備銷售都是在我們自己的網路上進行的。

We also expanded our relationship with Apple during the quarter. Customers can now purchase and activate Boost Mobile service through Apple retail stores, Apple.com, and Apple store app. These efforts have helped contribute to our first two consecutive quarters of net positive subs, excluding the impact of ACP subscribers since acquiring the business -- Boost Mobile business.

本季我們也擴大了與蘋果的關係。客戶現在可以透過 Apple 零售店、Apple.com 和 Apple store 應用程式購買並啟用 Boost Mobile 服務。這些努力幫助我們實現了連續前兩個季度的淨訂閱用戶數成長，排除了自收購 Boost Mobile 業務以來 ACP 用戶的影響。

We finished the quarter with 6.98 million wireless subscribers. As mentioned, excluding the loss of net ACP subscribers, we added approximately 62,000 subscribers in the third quarter. In addition to improvements in brand messaging, simplified plans and valuable partnerships, we furthered operational improvements to drive efficiencies across Boost Mobile, growing the number of accounts participating in AutoPay, streamlining our loyalty upgrade processes, increasing enrollment in add-on services like Boost Protect and migrating even more customers on to the Boost Mobile network.

本季結束時，我們的無線用戶數量為 698 萬。如前所述，不包括 ACP 淨訂閱用戶的流失，我們在第三季新增了約 62,000 名訂閱用戶。除了改善品牌資訊、簡化計劃和建立有價值的合作夥伴關係之外，我們還進一步改善運營，以提高Boost Mobile 的效率、增加參與AutoPay 的帳戶數量、簡化我們的忠誠度升級流程、增加Boost Protect 等附加服務的註冊人數並將更多客戶遷移到 Boost Mobile 網路。

We have seen a 29% improvement in churn in the third quarter on a year-over-year basis. ARPU improved year over year as well as from Q2, as we continue to focus on higher quality customers and improved customer experience and network optimization.

我們發現第三季的客戶流失率年減了 29%。隨著我們繼續關注更高品質的客戶以及改善客戶體驗和網路優化，ARPU 年比以及第二季度都有所提高。

We are encouraged by the current state of the business and are adjusting our plans to profitably increase our market share in 2025 as we benefit from owners' economics with our network. While there's plenty of work to do, we are pointed in the right direction and expect to continue to deliver improved results through the end of the year.

我們對目前的業務狀況感到鼓舞，並正在調整我們的計劃，以在 2025 年以盈利方式增加我們的市場份額，因為我們透過網路從所有者經濟中受益。儘管還有大量工作要做，但我們的方向是正確的，並期望在年底前繼續取得更好的成果。

Let me now hand the call to John to cover our network deployment progress.

現在讓我將電話轉交給 John，介紹我們的網路部署進度。

Thanks, Hamid. As Hamid mentioned at the start of the call, in September, the FCC took a significant step to promote competition in the wireless market by approving an updated framework for our 5G network build-out commitments. The new framework provides a 3-year extension for certain spectrum licenses, enabling us to focus resources on making our Boost Mobile business more competitive in markets where the Boost Mobile network is live and we have a retail presence. Americans will benefit from the updated framework, as it paves the way for us to provide 5G broadband access to more than 80% of the US population by the end of this year.

謝謝，哈米德。正如哈米德在電話會議開始時提到的那樣，9 月份，FCC 批准了我們 5G 網路建設承諾的更新框架，為促進無線市場競爭邁出了重要一步。新框架為某些頻譜授權提供了 3 年的延期，使我們能夠集中資源，使我們的 Boost Mobile 業務在 Boost Mobile 網路已上線且我們擁有零售業務的市場中更具競爭力。美國人將從更新的框架中受益，因為它為我們在今年年底前為超過 80% 的美國人口提供 5G 寬頻接入鋪平了道路。

That's an additional 30 million Americans covered by the Boost Mobile network since we achieved our last FCC commitments. We're committed to offering low-cost wireless plans and 5G devices to consumers nationwide, empowering American consumers with greater choice and flexibility when it comes to choosing a wireless provider. Plus, the updated framework enables us to more efficiently build our network and increase competition in highly populated areas.

自從我們兌現上次 FCC 承諾以來，Boost Mobile 網路覆蓋的美國人數量又增加了 3,000 萬人。我們致力於向全國消費者提供低成本無線套餐和 5G 設備，讓美國消費者在選擇無線供應商時擁有更多選擇和靈活性。此外，更新後的框架使我們能夠更有效地建立網路並增加人口稠密地區的競爭。

Today, the Boost Mobile network covers over 250 million Americans with 5G broadband and more than 208 million Americans with 5G voice, and we continue to expand and optimize the network. In fact, we will expand our [bonner] footprint to three additional markets in the coming weeks as Boston, Pittsburgh, and Seattle are set to go live with 5G voice, increasing our 5G voice coverage to over 216 million Americans by the end of the year.

如今，Boost Mobile 網路已覆蓋超過 2.5 億美國人的 5G 寬頻和超過 2.08 億美國人的 5G 語音服務，我們還在繼續擴展和優化該網路。事實上，隨著波士頓、匹茲堡和西雅圖即將上線5G 語音，我們將在未來幾週內將我們的[bonner] 足跡擴展到另外三個市場，從而在2019 年底將我們的5G 語音覆蓋範圍擴大到超過2.16 億美國人年。

In Q3, we invested $235 million in our network deployment compared to $686 million in Q3 of 2023. We continue to be disciplined with our approach as we transition from building and deploying to running and optimizing our network.

第三季度，我們在網路部署上投資了 2.35 億美元，而 2023 年第三季為 6.86 億美元。當我們從建置和部署網路過渡到運行和優化網路時，我們將繼續嚴格遵守我們的方法。

In regard to on-net customers, they received pure 5G on the Boost Mobile network and have extended coverage through our network partnerships, offering wireless customers coverage totaling 99% of the U.S. We continue to onboard additional customers on our network. And with traffic increasing, we are observing competitive network performance metrics.

至於網內客戶，他們在Boost Mobile 網路上獲得純5G 服務，並透過我們的網路合作夥伴擴大了覆蓋範圍，為美國99% 的無線客戶提供覆蓋範圍。 。隨著流量的增加，我們正在觀察有競爭力的網路效能指標。

In many markets, the Boost Mobile network is already outperforming our competitors. Now I'll turn it back over to Hamid.

在許多市場，Boost Mobile 網路的表現已經超越了我們的競爭對手。現在我將把它轉回給哈米德。

Thank you, John. With our November debt payment now secured in additional financing, EchoStar is well positioned to finish the year according to plan. In addressing our capital structure needs, we can now realize the true potential value of the business. The operational discipline we have exhibited all year will continue to serve us well into '25. We have made significant progress on our various lines of business, and we'll continue to build up on the positive momentum in the coming year.

謝謝你，約翰。由於我們 11 月份的債務支付現已獲得額外融資，EchoStar 已準備好按計劃完成今年的工作。在滿足我們的資本結構需求時，我們現在可以實現業務的真正潛在價值。我們全年展現的營運紀律將繼續為我們服務到 25 年。我們在各個業務領域都取得了重大進展，並將在未來一年繼續保持這一積極勢頭。

With that, we'll open it for Q&A from the analyst community. Operator, please give the instructions today.

這樣，我們將開放它以供分析師社群進行問答。接線員，請今天給指示。

(Operator Instructions) Rick Prentiss, Raymond James.

（操作員說明）Rick Prentiss、Raymond James。

Good morning, everybody. Couple questions. First, obviously, ACP, it looks like it's over, but can you help us understand -- is there any more ACP to come in 4Q or beyond? And how much was the ACP impact in Hughes?

大家早安。幾個問題。首先，顯然，ACP，看起來已經結束了，但是您能否幫助我們理解 - 第四季度或以後還會有更多 ACP 嗎？ACP 對休斯的影響有多大？

Rick, thanks for the question. Paul, if you --

里克，謝謝你的提問。保羅，如果你--

Yeah, the vast majority of the churn related to ACP hit in Q3. There's very little of those subscribers left in our subscriber base as of 9/30. And as it relates to the impact on Hughes, Jeff, do you want to take that?

是的，與 ACP 相關的絕大多數流失發生在第三季。截至 9 月 30 日，我們的訂閱者群中已所剩無幾。這關係到對休斯的影響，傑夫，你願意接受嗎？

Sure. I mean, most of our -- of the ACP related churn happened in Q3. And so that additional churn did impact our churn and our net subscribers in Q3. We think most -- we're through most of that. So we should see a better path forward.

當然。我的意思是，我們大部分與 ACP 相關的客戶流失發生在第三季。因此，額外的客戶流失確實影響了我們第三季的客戶流失和淨訂戶數量。我們想得最多——我們已經經歷了大部分。所以我們應該看到更好的前進道路。

Okay. And obviously, with the pipe done and the spectrum securitization done, money in the bank, start doing some profitable growth of subs. Help us understand what kind of targets you've got or what kind of go-to-market strategy you're going to do to try and grow the scale of the wireless -- the retail wireless business?

好的。顯然，隨著管道的完成和頻譜證券化的完成，銀行裡的錢開始做一些潛艇的獲利成長。請幫助我們了解您有什麼樣的目標，或者您將採取什麼樣的進入市場策略來嘗試擴大無線（零售無線業務）的規模？

Rick, that's obviously not something that we can get into a specifics here for a variety of reasons, including competitive dynamics. But you can imagine that having a very efficient, most modern network today gives us the agility that we think other carriers using legacy infrastructure and offerings and systems cannot match.

里克，由於各種原因（包括競爭動態），這顯然不是我們可以在這裡詳細討論的內容。但您可以想像，今天擁有一個非常高效、最現代化的網路為我們提供了其他使用傳統基礎設施、產品和系統的營運商無法比擬的敏捷性。

We are optimized for AI. We run on cloud, we are software-based, and we have the greatest security and based on standard, which United States is pushing across the world and frees us from using other suppliers, Chinese suppliers, other suppliers that cannot provide the same level of security.

我們針對人工智慧進行了優化。我們在雲端上運行，我們是基於軟體的，我們有最大的安全性，並且基於美國在全世界推行的標準，使我們免於使用其他供應商、中國供應商、其他無法提供同等水平的供應商。

So we think we have a lot of advantages here to push our agenda forward. Until now, we've not been -- we have not as much of a free hand in pushing, but of course, now it's better. Having said all of that, we're going to be focused on profitability and discipline, clearly accelerating the business, but never losing the sight that value creation also has a sight on ultimate profitability and sustainable value.

因此，我們認為我們有很多優勢來推動我們的議程。到目前為止，我們還沒有——我們沒有那麼多的自由度來推動，但當然，現在好多了。話雖如此，我們將專注於獲利能力和紀律，明顯加速業務發展，但永遠不要忽視價值創造也著眼於最終獲利能力和永續價值。

So more to come on this one. It's early days for us after having gotten all this good news recently, but we do have a significant amount of technical -- technological and other advantages that we have not yet demonstrated in the marketplace.

關於這一點還有更多內容。在最近收到所有這些好消息後，對我們來說現在還為時過早，但我們確實擁有大量尚未在市場上展示的技術和其他優勢。

I assume the profitability is pretty focused on trying to get people on net, both on the device side but also just trying to keep them on net to improve the profitability. Is that one of the focal points on growing subs?

我認為獲利能力主要集中在試圖讓人們上網，無論是在設備方面，還是試圖讓他們上網提高獲利能力。這是發展潛水艇的焦點之一嗎？

That would be by far the biggest opportunity. And as I mentioned earlier, now more than 50% of devices that are being activated, they're activated on net. So remember that the beginning of the year, we didn't have any devices -- almost beginning of the year, we didn't have any devices that were really compatible with our network. Our portfolio was very, very limited.

這將是迄今為止最大的機會。正如我之前提到的，現在超過 50% 的被啟動設備是在網路上啟動的。所以請記住，今年年初，我們沒有任何設備 - 幾乎在今年年初，我們沒有任何與我們的網路真正相容的設備。我們的投資組合非常非常有限。

Today, we have a large portfolio of devices, including iPhone 15 and 16 and almost all of the Android devices that we're having today, they're all compatible with our network. So the supply base has expanded. So that becomes a much more reasonable task for us to take advantage of that owner economics.

如今，我們擁有大量設備，包括 iPhone 15 和 16 以及我們今天擁有的幾乎所有 Android 設備，它們都與我們的網路相容。因此供應基礎擴大了。因此，對我們來說，利用所有者經濟學的優勢就變得更加合理。

Good to have the DISH network and the EchoStar side of those transactions done. Thanks, guys.

很高興 DISH 網路和 EchoStar 方面完成了這些交易。謝謝，夥計們。

Walter Piecyk, LightShed.

沃爾特·皮西克，LightShed。

My first question, I guess, is just on the debt exchange. So assuming that these people are going to continue to dig in their heels. Let's just assume for sake of argument, I know you don't expect this, but how the deal hasn't happened. Is it -- I know you've got all this money now, the $5 billion, the equity portion. But is it reasonable to assume that you can continue to use the free cash flow from DBS to continue to fund the build-out in the marketing of the wireless business?

我想我的第一個問題是關於債務交換的。因此，假設這些人將繼續堅持己見。為了方便討論，我們假設一下，我知道你不會想到這一點，但這筆交易怎麼還沒發生。是嗎——我知道你現在已經擁有了所有這些錢，50 億美元，股權部分。但是，假設您可以繼續使用星展銀行的自由現金流來繼續為無線業務行銷的擴建提供資金，是否合理？

First of all, I want to say that if the exchange does not close successfully, we'll continue to operate our business. Our DISH business has been a business that this primary business of this institution, and we continue to operate it as we have always had. And I won't get into the specific of cash flows related to that business. That's not something that I'm prepared to speak to, but I just want to say that we -- for us, whether the transaction closes or not, we do have a path forward. Now that cash available to us from other sources that we have put on balance sheet.

首先我想說，如果交易所沒有成功關閉，我們將繼續經營我們的業務。我們的DISH業務一直是該機構的主要業務，我們將一如既往地繼續經營它。我不會詳細討論與該業務相關的現金流。這不是我準備談論的事情，但我只想說，對於我們來說，無論交易是否完成，我們確實有前進的道路。現在我們可以從其他來源獲得的現金已計入資產負債表。

We certainly can develop the business regardless of the developments that happen at DBS. Now the nuances of the cash between that entity and parent are something that is not going to change the course of our business in terms of value creation, and I won't comment on various specifics of it today.

無論星展銀行的發展如何，我們當然可以發展業務。現在，該實體和母公司之間現金的細微差別不會改變我們在價值創造方面的業務進程，我今天不會評論它的各種細節。

Got it. And then just on the wireless business. Obviously, you changed the administration. I think Malone was on the tape somewhere today saying he thinks Comcast and -- can merge with Charter. So obviously, you'd have a larger footprint of fixed assets out there.

知道了。然後就是無線業務。顯然，你改變了政府。我想馬龍今天在錄音帶上說他認為康卡斯特可以與查特合併。顯然，您將擁有更大的固定資產足跡。

When you think about the capacity that your network provides to a cable operator today, which doesn't have the network relative to you being a strategic asset in the future -- like I would -- again, first of all, I would guess that Comcast has a great deal of interest in utilizing your network as a second source to Verizon and would potentially expand what they can do beyond bundling today, especially if they own Charter. So I'm just curious like, how do you think about your willingness to add a significant wholesale customer versus not adding them and then maintaining some perhaps rare strategic value for the future?

當你考慮到你的網路今天為有線電視營運商提供的容量時，相對於你而言，該網路在未來不會成為戰略資產——就像我一樣——首先，我猜想康卡斯特對利用您的網路作為Verizon 的第二個來源非常感興趣，並且有可能擴大他們現在的捆綁業務以外的業務範圍，特別是如果他們擁有Charter。所以我很好奇，你如何看待你是否願意增加一個重要的批發客戶，而不是不增加他們，然後為未來保持一些可能罕見的策略價值？

Great for the questions. I'll start the answer, and I'll pass on to John to give you a bit more color and the specific from his point of view. Look, we have -- this is the largest economy in the world and the largest IT spending in the most technologically advanced country in the world in -- for networks is certainly justified.

非常適合提問。我將開始回答，然後我將轉交給約翰，從他的角度為您提供更多資訊和具體資訊。看，我們——這是世界上最大的經濟體，也是世界上技術最先進的國家中IT支出最大的國家——對網路來說當然是合理的。

And we have -- we just happen to have -- we find ourselves in a fortunate spot where we have a tremendous technological advantage and very solid spectrum position to capture a very large share of the market, and we have not even scratched the surface yet. So in many ways, we are prepared to take advantage of any opportunity that comes our way, whether it be opportunities on the retail side, wholesale side. We're looking forward to all of that. And underutilized network with tremendous technological advantages.

我們發現自己處於一個幸運的位置，我們擁有巨大的技術優勢和非常穩固的頻譜地位，可以佔領很大的市場份額，而且我們還沒有觸及表面。因此，在許多方面，我們準備好利用我們遇到的任何機會，無論是零售方面還是批發的機會。我們期待這一切。以及未充分利用的網路具有巨大的技術優勢。

John, if you want to comment any more specifics from your perspective or IT or capacity of the network?

John，您是否想從您的角度、IT 或網路容量的角度評論更多細節？

Hey, Walt, it's John. Thanks for the question. Going back many years, as we've talked about the potential for the network, we've discussed it -- we've essentially built a wholesale network, right? Even our Boost Mobile business accesses our 5G network as a wholesale network. And that's because we've always seen a significant upside and opportunity around building out a wholesale market.

嘿，沃特，我是約翰。謝謝你的提問。回到很多年前，當我們談論網路的潛力時，我們已經討論過——我們基本上已經建立了一個批發網絡，對嗎？甚至我們的 Boost Mobile 業務也將我們的 5G 網路作為批發網路存取。這是因為我們一直看到建立批發市場的巨大優勢和機會。

We've had numerous successful 5G SA roaming trials to make sure that we're ready to bring on additional major customers on to the network. We've been busy making sure that we have the 5G voice capacity available in the major markets to support those types of initiatives.

我們已經進行了多次成功的 5G SA 漫遊試驗，以確保我們準備好吸引更多主要客戶加入網路。我們一直忙於確保主要市場擁有可用的 5G 語音容量來支援這些類型的計劃。

Obviously, there's assets out there that are highly complementary to ours. And when you think about our macro coverage combined with, among other things, indoor and Wi-Fi coverage, we think there's some pretty compelling product capabilities there. So the market continues to develop, obviously, we'll be having discussions that we need to have to make sure that we can fully participate. And we think our network is ready for a significant growth in traffic, which is a good place to be, and we'll see sort of how the discussions of the markets develop.

顯然，那裡的資產與我們的資產高度互補。當您考慮我們的宏觀覆蓋範圍以及室內和 Wi-Fi 覆蓋範圍等情況時，我們認為其中有一些非常引人注目的產品功能。因此，市場繼續發展，顯然，我們將進行討論，以確保我們能夠充分參與。我們認為我們的網路已經準備好迎接流量的顯著成長，這是一個很好的地方，我們將看到市場討論如何發展。

That sounds to me like you're more interested in extracting strategic value through partnership as opposed to just basically making them buy the cow, so to speak?

在我看來，您更感興趣的是透過合作關係獲取策略價值，而不是只是讓他們購買乳牛，可以這麼說？

Look, we have not chartered a definitive course exactly how we are going forward. But all those options or any options on the table would be evaluated. We certainly know that we are vastly undervalued from perspective of how much assets we have. If you just take a look at tens of billions of dollars in inspection value that is not yet reflected in our share price, we think we can develop it through a number of angles.

看，我們還沒有訂定明確的前進方向。但所有這些選項或桌面上的任何選項都將被評估。我們當然知道，從我們擁有的資產數量來看，我們的價值被大大低估了。如果你只看一下尚未反映在我們股價中的數百億美元的檢查價值，我們認為我們可以透過多個角度來開發它。

Clearly, a retail angle for us is one that will be here is paramount. We continue to operate the business. Customers are delighted with the quality they experience today. Our churn indicates that. Our increase in ARPU indicates that without even us having pushed it for our retail business will continue to grow, and it's going to be a good competitor in this market.

顯然，零售角度對我們來說是最重要的。我們繼續經營業務。客戶對他們今天體驗到的品質感到滿意。我們的流失就說明了這一點。我們的 ARPU 成長表明，即使我們沒有推動我們的零售業務也將繼續成長，並且它將成為這個市場上的一個很好的競爭對手。

But as John mentioned, having so much excess capacity and IT systems that are modernized and ready for AI, ready for [Agility]. You can imagine that a number of partnership opportunities become real. Now, how this partnership opportunities are structured is something that time will tell and how we manage to make them happen.

但正如約翰所提到的，擁有如此多的過剩產能和現代化的 IT 系統，為人工智慧做好準備，為人工智慧做好準備[敏捷]。您可以想像許多合作機會成為現實。現在，這種合作機會是如何建構的，以及我們如何設法實現它們，時間會告訴我們答案。

But we are certainly aware of where we see it. And we have had our sights on building a business model -- full business models that can rapidly evolve and boost our just retail business, in addition to just playing in the consumer market, we can play in the wholesale and other partnership markets.

但我們當然知道我們在哪裡看到它。我們的目標是建立一種商業模式——能夠快速發展和促進我們的零售業務的完整商業模式，除了只在消費市場發揮作用之外，我們還可以在批發和其他合作市場中發揮作用。

More to come on this one, early days. I don't want to set an expectation for anyone that something is in the works today. I'm not -- I can't comment on that. It's far to be on the record on that. But we're very cognizant of what would it take for us to maximize the value in our equity share -- equity price.

在這方面，還有更多內容，仍處於早期階段。我不想讓任何人對今天正在進行的工作抱有期望。我不是——我無法對此發表評論。這件事還遠遠沒有記錄。但我們非常清楚如何才能使我們的股權價值（股權價格）最大化。

Thank you very much.

非常感謝。

Jonathan Chaplin, New Street Research.

喬納森·卓別林，新街研究。

So two related questions. First, wondering if you can give us an update, Hamid, on how things are progressing with contracts -- contract wins on the private network and the price side of the business?

所以兩個相關的問題。首先，哈米德，想知道您能否向我們介紹合約的進展情況——專用網路上的合約獲勝以及業務的價格方面？

And then you mentioned at the beginning of the call, there's this tremendous unrealized value in your spectrum portfolio. We value the portfolio at $65 billion, for what it's worth. I'm wondering if you can give us a sense of -- you said that your primary objective is to build a business that recognizes that value. At what point of trying to build a business, like how long will you give it a go before potentially shifting cost? Is it sort of two years, three years that you need to figure out whether you can be successful in building a business?

然後您在電話會議開始時提到，您的頻譜組合中有巨大的未實現價值。我們對該投資組合的估值為 650 億美元。我想知道您是否能給我們一種感覺——您說過您的主要目標是建立一家認識到這一價值的企業。在什麼時候嘗試建立一家企業，例如在可能轉移成本之前你會嘗試多長時間？你是否需要兩年、三年的時間來弄清楚你能否成功建立一家企業？

And then I'm wondering if you can give us some markers of how the enterprise wholesale piece of the business needs to be progressing for you to know that you're going to achieve that goal of building a business that would justify this $65 billion of value. Like where do we need to be in enterprise and wholesale revenues by the end of next year, say, to be on a trajectory to see that the business value capture the spectrum value?

然後我想知道您是否可以給我們一些標記，說明企業批發業務需要如何取得進展，以便您知道您將實現建立一家能夠證明這 650 億美元的業務合理性的業務的目標。例如，到明年年底，我們的企業和批發收入需要達到什麼水平，才能看到業務價值捕捉頻譜價值？

Right, three or four or five questions. That will lead to a comprehensive and strategic path forward, but I think these are great questions. I'll take it in piece bars. I took similar notes here, but if I missed any of them, please reiterate so I make sure I answer them.

對了，三、四、五個問題。這將導致一條全面的策略性前進道路，但我認為這些都是很好的問題。我會把它分成幾塊。我在這裡做了類似的筆記，但如果我錯過了其中任何一個，請重申，以便我確保回答它們。

I think when we talk about growing the business in wholesale, it's not necessarily just one angle. Wholesale is a broad term for everything other than consumer. So that is (inaudible) different directions. So it's not just one. Now private 5G networks is only one of those angles. And I actually believe that may be an angle that -- it's got a hockey stick type of future in it. It's picking up.

我認為，當我們談論發展批發業務時，不一定只是一個角度。批發是一個廣義術語，涵蓋除消費者以外的所有事物。所以這是（聽不清楚）不同的方向。所以這不僅僅是一個。現在，私有 5G 網路只是其中之一。我實際上相信這可能是一個角度——它有一個曲棍球棒類型的未來。它正在回升。

We just announced another base for military that we have had. This adds to our [forte] list. That's the third one that we have gotten. And we think there's a heck of a lot more to come from that. Just that one angle alone of using our technology, which is by the way, beyond just the spectrum. R

我們剛剛宣布了我們擁有的另一個軍事基地。這增加了我們的[強項]清單。這是我們得到的第三個。我們認為這還會帶來更多的好處。順便說一句，這只是使用我們技術的一個角度，這超出了頻譜範圍。右

Remember that we have capabilities from manufacturing to providing managed services, which we were rated for Gartner as being a leader. None of our competitors are even close to that. We can provide simply because we have a multifaceted business with Hughes, with satellite, and a bunch of other things that we can bring together. So that is developing.

請記住，我們擁有從製造到提供託管服務的能力，我們被 Gartner 評為領導者。我們的競爭對手都無法接近這一點。我們可以提供服務只是因為我們與休斯有多方面的業務，包括衛星以及我們可以整合的許多其他東西。所以這正在發展中。

However, I honestly that that's more of a (inaudible) type of thing. Those businesses take time to develop business cases for sale. And even government businesses take budget cycles and other things that make it a little bit longer term, but once they pick up, as they are picking up, you should expect (inaudible). I just wouldn't put it in a very immediate future.

然而，老實說，這更像是一種（聽不清楚）類型的事情。這些企業需要時間來開發用於銷售的商業案例。甚至政府企業也會採取預算週期和其他使其期限更長的事情，但一旦它們回升，隨著它們的回升，你應該期待（聽不清楚）。我只是不會把它放在不久的將來。

Having said that, on a wholesale business, there's a number of fronts. Just -- there are examples and others who want to go to market accessing the network. There may be host of solutions with application providers that are very large solution providers that are very large, maybe other operators in the market that just don't have access to mobile technology. So those are all for me and us, following the category of wholesale. I would think that -- I caution you that the wholesale business is not one that grows very consistently.

話雖如此，批發業務有很多面向。只是——有一些例子和其他人想要進入市場訪問網路。應用程式提供者可能有許多解決方案，這些解決方案提供者非常大，也許市場上的其他營運商無法使用行動技術。這些都是針對我和我們的，屬於批發類別。我認為－我警告你，批發業務並不是一個持續成長的業務。

There may be a window, just like the nature of the enterprise businesses, the windows of development and all of a sudden, big steps up. We did that in our aero business. We work for a long time to secure the first bit in aero businesses and almost there are hundreds of millions of dollars' worth of bookings and backlog and revenues start showing up. Same thing will happen in 5G, takes some time.

可能會有一個窗口，就像企業業務的本質一樣，發展的窗口一下子就大台階上來了。我們在航空業務中做到了這一點。我們花了很長時間努力確保航空業務的第一名，幾乎數億美元的預訂和積壓訂單以及收入開始顯現。5G 也會發生同樣的事情，需要一些時間。

I'm tempering your expectation on timing, but I don't want to temper your expectation in exuberance about how big of a potential that business is and how we are well positioned to access that. Now I want to shift a little bit about your second number. You mentioned about $65 billion valuation. If you think about $65 billion valuation, I'll just take it at face value. And let's say, a (stake) about $25 billion worth of enterprise value today.

我正在調整你對時機的期望，但我不想調整你對這項業務有多大潛力以及我們如何處於有利位置來實現這一目標的過度期望。現在我想稍微改變一下你的第二個數字。您提到估值約 650 億美元。如果你考慮 650 億美元的估值，我只會看表面價值。假設現在的企業價值約為 250 億美元（股權）。

Let's just call it that or even call it, $30 billion worth of enterprise value capture. That leaves us more than $30 billion worth of uncaptured fair market asset value on our books. And if you think about we have roughly 300 million shares, up -- we have 270. Full dilution will be 315, but let's call it 300 million shares. So $30 billion worth of unrealized assets, 30 -- 300 million shares. That speaks to $100 additional share price value that is not reflected in our current market cap, if we were just to catch up with fair market value of our spectrum assets.

我們就這樣稱呼它，甚至稱呼它為價值 300 億美元的企業價值捕獲。這使得我們帳簿上剩餘的公平市場資產價值超過 300 億美元。如果你想想我們大約有 3 億股，那我們有 270 股。完全稀釋為 315 股，但我們稱之為 3 億股。因此，價值 300 億美元的未變現資產，即 30 至 3 億股。如果我們只是為了趕上頻譜資產的公平市場價值，這意味著 100 美元的額外股價價值並未反映在我們當前的市值中。

Now we have network assets. We have other assets. For instance, the network has taken billions of dollars value that is already there, taking years to build it and $10 billion-plus worth of value, not even including those, I think just on an asset value, vastly, vastly underpriced on their -- I appreciate it is our job to realize that. Wholesale is one angle of doing that. We have other angles we're working on, direct to satellite and a few others.

現在我們有了網路資產。我們還有其他資產。例如，該網路已經佔用了數十億美元的價值，需要數年的時間來建立它，以及價值超過100 億美元的價值，甚至不包括這些，我認為僅就資產價值而言，其定價大大大大低估了—— - 我很感激我們的工作就是認識到這一點。批發是這樣做的一個角度。我們正在研究其他角度，直接針對衛星和其他一些角度。

I just set your expectation that as we enter those spaces, they will take time to develop. We are fully focused on any opportunity. But when they fully materialize, the step function improvements will be significant.

我只是設定了你的期望，當我們進入這些空間時，它們需要時間來發展。我們完全專注於任何機會。但當它們完全實現時，階躍函數的改進將是顯著的。

And Hamid, just a follow up there. (multiple speakers)

哈米德，只是後續行動。（多個發言者）

Yes, go ahead. Please go ahead.

是的，繼續吧。請繼續。

Yes, I was just going to say, just to follow up. I recognize that these are big contracts with a long-life cycle, takes a long time to land. But when -- so not near term, but do you think sort of by the end of '25 or the end of '26, we'll see real evidence of that hockey stick starting to take shape?

是的，我只是想說，只是為了跟進。我體認到這些都是大合同，週期長，需要很長時間才能落地。但什麼時候——所以不是短期內，但你認為到 25 年底或 26 年底，我們會看到曲棍球棒開始成形的真正證據？

Yes, I should hope so. I mean '25 '26 is a very important window for us. I think market conditions are ever better, and advancement of AI and will drive traffic tremendously and the real-time connectivity to a cloud core, which we are uniquely positioned right now with running on AWS, all software based. I think the '25 '26 window is, to me, going to be a very important development window for this industry, and we find ourselves in a very fortunate position. So as it happens, we just have secured enough runway to be able to fund our developments during that window. So all the stars aligned.

是的，我希望如此。我的意思是“25”和“26”對我們來說是一個非常重要的視窗。我認為市場狀況越來越好，人工智慧的進步將極大地推動流量以及與雲端核心的即時連接，我們目前在 AWS 上運行且所有基於軟體的雲端核心處於獨特的地位。我認為「25」、「26」窗口對我來說將是這個行業非常重要的發展窗口，我們發現自己處於一個非常幸運的位置。因此，碰巧的是，我們剛剛獲得了足夠的跑道，以便能夠在該窗口期間為我們的開發提供資金。所以所有的星星都對齊了。

Thank, Hamid. I really appreciate it.

謝謝，哈米德。我真的很感激。

Michael Rollins, Citibank.

麥可羅林斯，花旗銀行。

So you had a lot of retail wireless subs. Can you unpack what's causing that retail business to lose EBITDA on a quarterly basis? And is there a path forward, just even on the current base where the profitability could be significantly enhanced? And this may be related, but I'm curious, if you look at the 5G revenue that you're recognizing in that specific segment, can you unpack the amount of revenue that's coming from spectrum leases versus what's being contributed from the retail wireless business? Since you have these separate -- I guess the question is, is the retail business really paying for capacity into that 5G segment?

所以你有很多零售無線重低音。您能否分析一下導致零售業務按季度損失 EBITDA 的原因？即使在目前的基礎上，是否有一條前進的道路可以顯著提高盈利能力？這可能是相關的，但我很好奇，如果你看看你在該特定細分市場中認識到的 5G 收入，你能否分析一下來自頻譜租賃的收入與零售無線業務貢獻的收入？既然你有這些單獨的 - 我想問題是，零售企業真的為 5G 細分市場的容量付費嗎？

And just how to think about that transfer pricing mechanism on a go-forward basis?

以及如何在未來的基礎上考慮轉讓定價機制？

I will pass back to Paul. (inaudible)

我將回傳給保羅。（聽不清楚）

So first of all, on the sequential EBITDA or OIBDA that you were talking about in retail wireless, you got to take into consideration that subsidy. In fact, and the cost that we incur on that. And that drives the majority of the variances that you see there. As it relates to your question on the 5G MNO revenue, you are correct that that does include intercompany charges for the subs that are on the MNO. But offsetting that was a third-party lease revenue that we had in prior periods that has been declining, driving that variance.

因此，首先，對於您在零售無線領域談論的連續 EBITDA 或 OIBDA，您必須考慮到補貼。事實上，以及我們為此付出的成本。這就是你看到的大部分差異的原因。由於它與您關於 5G MNO 收入的問題有關，因此您認為這確實包括 MNO 子公司的公司間費用，這是正確的。但抵消這一影響的是我們前期的第三方租賃收入一直在下降，從而推動了這種差異。

From a standpoint of describing exactly what that number is, we don't talk about that, but you will see that revenue amount grow over time as we load more subscribers on the MNO. And that's a good thing for us. Because what we're essentially doing is stop paying MVNO costs and then funding the operations for the MNO.

從準確描述該數字的角度來看，我們不會談論這一點，但您會看到，隨著我們在 MNO 上加載更多訂戶，收入金額會隨著時間的推移而增長。這對我們來說是一件好事。因為我們本質上要做的就是停止支付 MVNO 成本，然後為 MNO 的營運提供資金。

And just maybe more broadly. So as you think about that 5G retail business. What is like that medium or longer-term progression of margins? Like what's the right margin for that retail side? Recognizing that right now you're paying a bunch of resale costs to third parties, and then eventually, you'll be paying that potentially intercompany as you target more traffic to be on that.

也許更廣泛。當你想到 5G 零售業務時。中期或長期的利潤成長如何？例如零售方面的正確利潤是多少？認識到現在您正在向第三方支付大量轉售成本，然後最終，您將向潛在的公司間支付費用，因為您的目標是獲得更多流量。

Yes. From -- obviously, margins should increase. As we scale and we get the right level of subscribers on the MNO, you'll see obviously your margins increase because a lot of those costs will be fixed costs that are going to be amortized and depreciated versus an operating cost. So you should see that over time, improve.

是的。顯然，利潤率應該會增加。隨著我們規模的擴大，以及我們在 MNO 上獲得適當水平的訂戶，您會明顯看到利潤增加，因為其中許多成本將是固定成本，將相對於營運成本進行攤銷和折舊。所以你應該看到隨著時間的推移，情況會有所改善。

At the moment, we have not -- look, we have had tremendous amount of good news recently. I mean, as recently as just today in terms of access to funding and the FCC giving us a better playing field, which improves for the consumers, the market and for us, our ability to participate in the market. We are just using all of that and digesting all of that information into a model that is revised and refreshed. Again, all our previous models obviously did not anticipate all of this information, and now we're doing that. And as time goes on, we share with you elements of that model.

目前，我們還沒有——看，最近我們收到了大量的好消息。我的意思是，就在今天，就獲得資金而言，聯邦通訊委員會為我們提供了更好的競爭環境，這提高了消費者、市場和我們參與市場的能力。我們只是使用所有這些並將所有這些資訊消化到一個經過修改和刷新的模型中。同樣，我們之前的所有模型顯然都沒有預見到所有這些信息，而現在我們正在這樣做。隨著時間的推移，我們將與您分享模型的要素。

But also, I want to, as I mentioned, based on the earlier comments on earlier questions, this is a very dynamic market. And a situation improves and changes on a minute basis. Just for now, we're happy to say that the margins will improve. You can expect that. But exactly to what level, I think please give us some time to work on and share with you as time goes on next year.

而且，正如我所提到的，我想根據先前對早期問題的評論，這是一個非常活躍的市場。情況每分鐘都會改善和變化。就目前而言，我們很高興地說利潤率將會提高。你可以期待這一點。但具體到什麼程度，我想請給我們一些時間，隨著明年時間的推移，與大家分享。

Thanks very much.

非常感謝。

Chris Quilty, Quilty Analytics.

克里斯·奎爾蒂，奎爾蒂分析。

Got a question, switching over to the satellite side. EchoStar, I guess, along with Globalstar and Iridium, didn't join the MSSA, which is the Viasat-led effort to kind of pool all the spectrum of the MSS operators. So two questions for you. One, can you give us sort of your hot take on MSSA and your view towards it? And number two is, when you look at your strategy to get device manufacturers to adopt your direct device chip, what is your sort of go-to-market approach? Given the fact that we know Iridium-Qualcomm failed when they had a sort of a proprietary chipset effort, chipset service tie-in.

有個問題，切換到衛星端。我猜想，EchoStar 以及 Globalstar 和 Iridium 都沒有加入 MSSA，MSSA 是 Viasat 主導的項目，旨在匯集 MSS 運營商的所有頻譜。所以有兩個問題想問你。第一，您能為我們介紹一下您對 MSSA 的熱門看法以及您對此的看法嗎？第二個問題是，當您考慮讓設備製造商採用您的直接設備晶片的策略時，您的上市方法是什麼？鑑於我們知道銥星-高通公司在進行某種專有晶片組工作、晶片組服務捆綁時失敗了。

Sure. First part, related to mistake. Look, we -- actually, candidly, we don't necessarily -- frankly, we did not need to join that consortium. And the reason being that we have access to adequate spectrum resources of our own without having to partner with anybody. I think that's more of a spectrum availability partnership.

當然。第一部分，與錯誤有關。聽著，我們 - 實際上，坦率地說，我們不一定 - 坦率地說，我們不需要加入該聯盟。原因是我們可以獲得足夠的自己的頻譜資源，而無需與任何人合作。我認為這更多的是頻譜可用性合作夥伴關係。

It's a bit of a convoluted larger group. I think here, we do have the -- again, unique position that we have access to that MSS spectrum rights globally and happen to have the same spectrum available terrestrially and also for space in the United States. So we really have a unique position as having the best rights on S-band around the world. And for us, there really isn't a incentive or need to participate in that alliance.

這是一個有點複雜的大群體。我認為在這裡，我們確實擁有——再次，獨特的地位，我們可以在全球範圍內獲得 MSS 頻譜權利，並且恰好在美國擁有相同的地面和太空頻譜。因此，我們確實擁有獨特的地位，擁有全球 S 頻段的最佳版權。對我們來說，確實沒有動力或需要參與聯盟。

We are hard and fast at work to make sure we take advantage of the rights we have, which I think compelling. And also our spectrum is primarily unused around the world, accessible to us only. And whereas the other bands are utilized and require optimizations and movements.

我們正在努力、快速地工作，以確保我們利用我們擁有的權利，我認為這是令人信服的。而且我們的頻譜主要在世界各地未使用，只有我們自己可以訪問。而其他頻段已被使用並需要優化和移動。

Now -- so from that perspective, we are in a very good shape. Now in terms of our device availability, I would say that we are focused on 5G. We are focused on a standard 5G, at least 17 or at least 18 and beyond. So everything we build is based on 3GPP specs. And I think that makes it so much easier.

現在——從這個角度來看，我們的狀況非常好。現在就我們的設備可用性而言，我想說我們專注於 5G。我們專注於標準 5G，至少 17 或至少 18 以上。因此，我們建構的所有內容均基於 3GPP 規範。我認為這讓事情變得容易多了。

And in fact, the only logical way for the chipset manufacturers to develop will be benefiting from the economics of just the regular mobile business volume because we stay within the main path of the standardization. So we think we are in a position to address both of those without having the need to participate in any other alliance. And hopefully, time will show that we can realize that value.

事實上，晶片組製造商發展的唯一合乎邏輯的方式將是受益於常規行動業務量的經濟性，因為我們仍然走在標準化的主要道路上。因此，我們認為我們能夠解決這兩個問題，而無需參與任何其他聯盟。希望時間會證明我們能夠實現這價值。

So maybe just to clarify on a point. I mean, traditionally, the MSS spectrums were not -- MSS spectrum bands were not designed into cellular chipsets. And that's always been the challenge, is to get that sort of design in at the hardware level. So if you're using the MSS spectrum, how do you get those bands designed in?

所以也許只是為了澄清一點。我的意思是，傳統上，MSS 頻譜不是——MSS 頻譜帶沒有設計到蜂巢晶片組中。這一直是個挑戰，就是在硬體層面實現這種設計。那麼，如果您使用 MSS 頻譜，如何設計這些頻段呢？

Right. So look, there's two aspects to -- I'll give you my best understanding of it. There's two aspects to making direct to device a satellite to device, the reality from a technology and chipset perspective. There's one aspect that is on the front end, having the access to the band, and that's more of a filtering, front end of the radio. That -- usually that is not most complex thing.

正確的。所以看，有兩個面向──我會給你我最好的理解。衛星到設備的直接連接有兩個方面，即技術和晶片組角度的現實。一方面是在前端，可以存取頻段，這更像是無線電的濾波前端。那——通常這並不是最複雜的事情。

There can be filters can be added and deleted. It's not that complicated. What is more complicated usually is the software that goes into developing the standardization, how does that work in terms of delay and Doppler and few other things. And those things are -- the best way to address that is to have it in the follow the 3GPP standardization, which we use as much of the technologies as much of the code base that has always been there. So we think this is the shortest path staying on that.

可以有過濾器可以新增和刪除。事情沒那麼複雜。更複雜的通常是用於開發標準化的軟體，它如何在延遲和多普勒以及其他方面發揮作用。解決這些問題的最佳方法是遵循 3GPP 標準化，我們使用的技術與一直存在的程式碼庫一樣多。所以我們認為這是最短的路徑。

And I think that the chipset manufacturers should realize and not realizing that the -- it's going to be a large market. This will be a very large market when it becomes available from the sky. It just eliminates the concept of being unconnected or not being connected to 8 billion plus -- to everyone in the world potentially. And so I think just an aspiration and the volume that can be imagined, I think, will drive the economics of the chipset development. And I think the chipset other factors are at work doing that today.

我認為晶片組製造商應該意識到，而不是意識到——這將是一個巨大的市場。當它從空中變得可用時，這將是一個非常大的市場。它只是消除了與超過 80 億人（可能是世界上的每個人）沒有聯繫或沒有聯繫的概念。因此，我認為只是一個願望和可以想像的數量，我認為，將推動晶片組開發的經濟性。我認為今天晶片組的其他因素正在發揮作用。

So we stay within that standards, and I think that's probably the best way to drive the economics for everyone.

因此，我們遵守該標準，我認為這可能是推動每個人經濟發展的最佳方式。

Operator, there's one additional question in the queue. So let's move to the final question.

接線員，隊列中還有一個問題。那麼讓我們來討論最後一個問題。

That will be coming from the line of Sam McHugh with BNP Paribas.

這將來自薩姆·麥克休（Sam McHugh）與法國巴黎銀行（BNP Paribas）的關係。

I just wanted to go back on the retail wireless side. I think under the network service agreement with AT&T, you talked about this $5 billion minimum payment over 10 years. Then the wireless business is quite a bit smaller, maybe than we anticipated at the time of signing that deal. So what I'm just trying to understand is, are you at the peak payments to AT&T? Or is there -- kind of as we see customers transition on that, how quickly should we see those roaming payments fall, if you follow me? Is there kind of a catch-up payment if you don't hit the minimum payment for them? And just had a bit of a timing and saying of that deal would be too helpful.

我只是想回到零售無線方面。我認為根據與 AT&T 的網路服務協議，您談到了 10 年內最低支付 50 億美元的問題。那麼無線業務的規模可能會比我們簽署該協議時的預期要小得多。所以我想了解的是，您是否處於向 AT&T 付款的高峰期？或者，當我們看到客戶對此進行轉變時，如果您關注我的話，我們應該多快看到這些漫遊費用下降？如果您沒有達到最低付款額，是否會有補付款？只要有一點時機，說這筆交易就太有幫助了。

John, if you would like to take that question?

約翰，你願意回答這個問題嗎？

Yes. Sam, John here. Thanks for the question. So as we've discussed before, we rely on T-Mobile's network and as well as AT&T's network to provide capacity for our subscribers. We're really on track with both agreements. T-Mobile was shaped in one direction, AT&T, a little bit in the other direction. And we're on track with making our minimum commitments there. I'd say both relationships are healthy and productive. And we really have a unique capability that I think isn't highlighted enough in terms of how we're able to go to market.

是的。山姆，約翰在這裡。謝謝你的提問。正如我們之前討論的，我們依靠 T-Mobile 的網路以及 AT&T 的網路為我們的用戶提供容量。我們確實正在按計劃落實這兩項協議。T-Mobile 是朝著一個方向發展的，而 AT&T 則是朝著另一個方向發展的。我們正在努力履行我們的最低承諾。我想說這兩種關係都是健康且有成效的。我們確實擁有一種獨特的能力，我認為在我們如何進入市場方面，這種能力還沒有得到足夠的重視。

And we have a customer on net with us. That customer actually has access to more towers than any other service because a subscriber can connect seamlessly to T-Mobile's network, as well as AT&T's network in conditions where we may not have the signal strength that we want to provide the best customer experience. So it's really an asset. The way you phrased the question was more on the side of a liability. But we think it's a really competitive element that we have as it relates to our network, our overall CapEx.

我們有一個網路客戶。該客戶實際上比任何其他服務都可以訪問更多的信號塔，因為在我們可能沒有足夠的信號強度來提供最佳客戶體驗的情況下，訂戶可以無縫連接到T-Mobile 的網絡以及AT&T 的網路。所以它確實是一項資產。你提出問題的方式比較像是承擔責任。但我們認為這是我們擁有的一個真正具有競爭力的元素，因為它與我們的網絡、我們的整體資本支出有關。

It's not a race to spend more CapEx. We're focused on making sure that we're -- we have a P&L mindset. And that now happens down to the site level. So we're very focused on leveraging these two unique agreements, both in and out of market to make sure we have the right economics to acquire profitable subscribers. And obviously, we're continuing to launch markets and working with our partners is a big part of that.

這不是一場花費更多資本支出的競賽。我們專注於確保我們擁有損益心態。現在這種情況發生在網站層級。因此，我們非常注重在市場內外利用這兩項獨特的協議，以確保我們擁有合適的經濟條件來獲取有利可圖的訂戶。顯然，我們正在繼續開拓市場，與合作夥伴的合作是其中的重要組成部分。

Thanks very much.

非常感謝。

Thank you, everyone, for your participation. And we can now close the call, operator.

謝謝大家的參與。接線員，我們現在可以結束通話了。

Thank you. This concludes today's conference. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.

謝謝。今天的會議到此結束。此時您可以斷開線路。感謝您的參與。