MicroVision Inc (MVIS) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, and welcome to the MicroVision first quarter 2025 financial and operating results conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please note this event is being recorded. I would now like to turn the conference over to Drew Markham. Please go ahead.

下午好，歡迎參加 MicroVision 2025 年第一季財務與經營績效電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，此事件正在被記錄。現在我想將會議交給德魯·馬卡姆。請繼續。

Thank you, operator. Good afternoon. I'm here today with our Chief Executive Officer, Sumit Sharma; and our Chief Financial Officer, Anubhav Verma. Following their prepared remarks, our Chief Technology Officer, Glen DeVos, will join us, and we will open the call to questions. Please note that some of the information you will hear in today's discussion will include forward-looking statements, including, but not limited to, statements regarding status of commercial engagements, business, product and go-to-market strategies, level of customer and partner engagement, cash, liquidity and the impacts of recent financing activities, market landscape and opportunities, program volumes and timing, project developments, performance of our products and solutions, product sales and future demand, projections of future operations, cash flow and financial results, availability of funds and conditions for capital raising as well as statements containing words like believe, expect, plan or other similar expressions.

謝謝您，接線生。午安.今天我和我們的執行長 Sumit Sharma 以及財務長 Anubhav Verma 一起來到這裡。在他們準備好的演講之後，我們的技術長 Glen DeVos 將加入我們，並開始提問。請注意，您在今天的討論中聽到的一些信息將包括前瞻性陳述，包括但不限於有關商業合作狀況、業務、產品和市場進入策略、客戶和合作夥伴參與程度、現金、流動性和近期融資活動的影響、市場格局和機遇、計劃數量和時間、項目發展、我們的產品和解決方案的性能、產品銷售和未來資金的期望

These statements are not guarantees of future performance. Actual results could differ materially from the future results implied or expressed in the forward-looking statements. We encourage you to review our SEC filings, including our most recently filed Annual Report on Form 10-K and our quarterly reports on Form 10-Q. These filings describe risk factors that could cause our actual results to differ materially from those implied or expressed in our forward-looking statements. All forward-looking statements are made as of the date of this call, and except as required by law, we undertake no obligation to update this information.

這些聲明並不能保證未來的表現。實際結果可能與前瞻性陳述中暗示或表達的未來結果有重大差異。我們鼓勵您查看我們向美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 提交的文件，包括我們最近提交的 10-K 表年度報告和 10-Q 表季度報告。這些文件描述了可能導致我們的實際結果與前瞻性陳述中暗示或表達的結果有重大差異的風險因素。所有前瞻性陳述均截至本次電話會議之日做出，除法律要求外，我們不承擔更新此資訊的義務。

In addition, we will present certain financial measures on this call that will be considered non-GAAP under the SEC's Regulation G. For reconciliations of each non-GAAP financial measure to the most directly comparable GAAP financial measure as well as for all the financial data presented on this call, please refer to the information included in our press release and in our Form 8-K dated and submitted to the SEC today, both of which can be found on our corporate website at microvision.com under the SEC Filings tab. This conference call will be available for audio replay on the Investor Relations section of our website at www.microvision.com.

此外，我們將在本次電話會議上提供某些財務指標，根據美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 的 G 條例，這些指標將被視為非 GAAP 指標。有關每項非 GAAP 財務指標與最直接可比較的 GAAP 財務指標的對賬，以及本次電話會議上提供的所有財務數據，請參閱我們的新聞稿和今天提交給 SEC 的 8-K 表格中包含的信息，這兩份文件均可在我們公司網站 microvision.com 的“SEC 文件”選項卡下找到。本次電話會議的音訊重播可在我們網站 www.microvision.com 的投資者關係部分觀看。

Now I would like to turn the call over to our Chief Executive Officer, Sumit Sharma. Sumit?

現在我想將電話轉給我們的執行長蘇米特夏爾馬 (Sumit Sharma)。薩米特？

Thank you, Drew, and welcome, everyone, to this review of our first quarter 2025 results. I want to thank everyone for joining today's call. I will provide an update on the progress we have made towards commercial agreements in automotive and industrial markets as well as expansion towards the military market with our existing products. I will also provide context about our already announced Investor Day event being hosted in Redmond. First, I would like to begin our update in engagements with automotive RFQ opportunities.

謝謝您，德魯，歡迎大家參加我們 2025 年第一季業績的回顧。我要感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。我將介紹我們在汽車和工業市場商業協議方面取得的進展以及我們現有產品向軍事市場的擴張。我還將介紹我們已經宣布的在雷德蒙德舉辦的投資者日活動的背景資訊。首先，我想開始介紹我們與汽車 RFQ 機會的合作進度。

We remain engaged in 7 RFQs for automotive programs and make incremental progress. This has been really slow going because of OEMs focus shifting to their global plans. Lots of ebbs and flows we continue to deal with. On one hand, it is clear to us that the current global rebalancing of trade is expected to have a huge refocus on automotive OEMs resources on the supply chain issues. Advanced ADAS rollout is expected to be delayed with only very low volume LiDAR integration so far.

我們仍在參與 7 項汽車項目的 RFQ，並取得了逐步進展。由於 OEM 廠商將注意力轉移到其全球計劃上，因此這一進程確實非常緩慢。我們仍在應對許多起伏。一方面，我們清楚地看到，目前的全球貿易再平衡預計將使汽車原始設備製造商的資源重新集中在供應鏈問題上。由於迄今為止 LiDAR 整合量非常低，預計先進 ADAS 的推出將會推遲。

On the other hand, we are engaged in new upcoming RFQ and custom development opportunities. We continue to support these potential customers with patience with the quickest path to on-ramp for any type of project. In previous years, we focused on winning programs targeted for production with several years of customization in play. These deals could be described as the ones our competitors signed. In each agreement, the challenge we faced was not our technology or capability rather than the state of our balance sheet would always cause OEMs to pause.

另一方面，我們正在致力於即將到來的新的 RFQ 和客製化開發機會。我們將繼續耐心地為這些潛在客戶提供支持，為任何類型的專案提供最快的入門途徑。過去幾年，我們專注於贏得以生產為目標的項目，這些項目需要經過數年的客製化。這些交易可以說是我們的競爭對手簽署的。在每項協議中，我們面臨的挑戰不是我們的技術或能力，而是我們的資產負債表狀況總是會導致 OEM 停下來。

Let me elaborate a bit. Our competitors who went public as part of a de-SPAC collectively raised more than a $1 billion. OEMs required a strong balance sheet to feel confident that for the initial start, we had enough runway to fund their development. MicroVision has been running leaner on capital, so it was a huge challenge to get them comfortable with our cash on hand. Our competition has not fared well even after winning early engagements.

讓我詳細說明一下。我們的競爭對手透過 de-SPAC 上市，總共籌集了超過 10 億美元。 OEM需要強大的資產負債表，才能確信在最初啟動時，我們有足夠的資金來資助他們的發展。MicroVision 的資金一直在減少，因此讓他們對我們的現金感到滿意是一個巨大的挑戰。我們的競爭對手即使在早期贏得勝利之後表現也不好。

We strongly believe it is greenfield in this space with the LiDAR absolute required for advanced ADAS and autonomy. With the strengthening of our balance sheet with the High Trail deal, we are in a stronger position than previously. So we continue to drive and make progress, but I do not expect any substantial projects to be awarded with material production revenues in the near future. We intend to focus on finding custom development opportunities with OEMs. Make no mistake with the ebbs and flows of the automotive demand.

我們堅信，這一領域仍是一片新天地，LiDAR 對於先進的 ADAS 和自動駕駛絕對是必要的。隨著 High Trail 交易加強了我們的資產負債表，我們的地位比以前更強大。因此，我們會繼續努力並取得進展，但我預計近期不會有任何實質的專案獲得實質的生產收入。我們打算專注於尋找與 OEM 合作的客製化開發機會。不要誤以為汽車需求有起有落。

This will remain the largest opportunity that eventually could deliver millions of units shipped and billions of dollars of revenues generated from this segment. With our MOVIA, MAVIN and MOVIA S LiDAR products, we believe we have the entire suite of sensors to address all OEM inquiries. I remain very excited and optimistic about our Industrial segment, though. Our in-production MOVIA L sensor integrated with onboard perception software is an advanced solution, which is frictionless for our customers to integrate. We have delivered software integrated solutions to multiple potential partners since last year.

這仍將是最大的機遇，最終可能帶來數百萬台設備的出貨量以及數十億美元的收入。憑藉我們的 MOVIA、MAVIN 和 MOVIA S LiDAR 產品，我們相信我們擁有全套感測器來解答所有 OEM 疑問。不過，我仍然對我們的工業部門感到非常興奮和樂觀。我們正在生產的 MOVIA L 感測器與機載感知軟體整合是一種先進的解決方案，我們的客戶可以輕鬆整合。自去年以來，我們已向多個潛在合作夥伴交付了軟體整合解決方案。

These evaluations remain in flight. We continue to make progress in this space, and I expect these engagements will lead to commercial wins for us. With our partnership with ZF, we have no exposure to China tariffs and remain cost competitive with our economy of scales in MOVIA L and eventually MOVIA S. We remain fully engaged with our potential customers as they evaluate their rollout. Up to this point, none of our potential customers have made us aware of any impact on their timing due to the ongoing global trade rebalancing or tariffs.

這些評估仍在進行中。我們在這個領域不斷取得進展，我預計這些合作將為我們帶來商業上的勝利。透過與 ZF 合作，我們無需承擔中國關稅，並且憑藉 MOVIA L 和最終的 MOVIA S 的規模經濟，仍能保持成本競爭力。在潛在客戶評估其產品推出情況時，我們仍會與他們保持充分的聯繫。到目前為止，我們的潛在客戶均未讓我們意識到正在進行的全球貿易再平衡或關稅會對其時間表產生任何影響。

As I shared in our last earnings call, another segment we started expanding with engagements in 2024 was mobile autonomous robots, military and commercial vehicles with our LiDAR product. We have brought on a defense advisory board that will help us on opportunities to engage with Department of Defense with our software integrated sensor technology to potentially enable programs with drones and land vehicles as well as help us explore potential opportunities with larger companies in space for a partnership.

正如我在上次財報電話會議上所分享的，我們將在 2024 年開始擴展的另一個領域是使用我們的 LiDAR 產品的行動自主機器人、軍用和商用車輛。我們成立了一個國防顧問委員會，該委員會將幫助我們利用軟體整合感測器技術與國防部合作，從而有可能實現無人機和陸地車輛的計劃，並幫助我們探索與太空領域大型公司建立合作的潛在機會。

As I also mentioned previously, with our long history with delivering augmented reality for military, we remain focused on opportunities to leverage the large body of work. In this space, we expect to leverage our LiDAR products fused with radar and other third-party technologies into our software. We expect to partner with existing military primes to deliver full sensor intelligence solutions.

正如我之前提到的，我們為軍方提供擴增實境技術已有悠久歷史，我們將繼續專注於尋找機會利用大量的工作成果。在這個領域，我們希望將我們的 LiDAR 產品與雷達和其他第三方技術整合到我們的軟體中。我們希望與現有的軍事專家合作，提供完整的感測器情報解決方案。

This segment benefits from all the hardware and software building blocks that already exist within MicroVision. We expect the first system and product prototypes for this segment to be available in six to nine months. Next week, we will host an Investor Day in Redmond. We are planning to make this an event in lieu of [annual CS] attendance. At this event, investors will get an opportunity to interact with our various technology offerings as well as demos of how we plan to enable potential customers, including ride along in our demo vehicle.

此部分受益於 MicroVision 中已經存在的所有硬體和軟體建置模組。我們預計該領域的首批系統和產品原型將在六到九個月內上市。下週，我們將在雷德蒙舉辦投資者日。我們計劃將此活動作為 [年度 CS] 出席活動的替代。在本次活動中，投資者將有機會接觸我們的各種技術產品以及我們計劃如何為潛在客戶提供支援的演示，包括乘坐我們的演示車輛。

Investors could have a deeper discussion with management on all the ups and downs of our journey so far as well as get confidence on the stronger path we expect moving forward. I'm going to keep my prepared remarks brief today as there are questions from several shareholders, and I'd like to address that as the main narrative.

投資者可以與管理層就我們迄今為止的所有起伏進行更深入的討論，並對我們預期的未來更強勁的道路充滿信心。由於有幾位股東提出了問題，今天我將簡短地回答我準備好的發言，我想以此作為主要內容。

I would like to turn over the call to Anubhav. Anubhav?

我想將電話轉給 Anubhav。阿努巴夫？

Thanks, Sumit. I'd like to begin by reiterating Sumit's comments. We're absolutely aligned with shareholders to quickly demonstrate step function progress towards our commercial engagements with industrial customers for near-term high volume-based revenue. We remain deeply engaged with them for testing and integration of our solutions into their fleet. Next, I'd like to discuss the impact of the recently announced global tariffs.

謝謝，Sumit。首先我想重申蘇米特的評論。我們與股東完全一致，迅速展示與工業客戶商業合作的階梯式進展，以實現近期的高銷售收入。我們一直與他們保持著密切的合作，以測試並將我們的解決方案整合到他們的車隊中。接下來我想討論一下最近宣布的全球關稅的影響。

While the situation continues to be dynamic and evolving, we believe MicroVision remains well-positioned as we have our manufacturing partner in France. As announced late last year, we secured a production commitment with ZF in France to be able to meet the anticipated high-volume demand from customers in the industrial space for our MOVIA L product.

儘管情況持續變化，但我們相信 MicroVision 仍處於有利地位，因為我們在法國擁有製造合作夥伴。正如去年年底宣布的那樣，我們與法國 ZF 達成了生產承諾，以滿足工業領域客戶對我們的 MOVIA L 產品的預期大批量需求。

We believe this does offer yet another pricing advantage to some of our customers given our minimal exposure to China-based manufacturing. Based on certain triggers, we are planning to bring up another site for MOVIA L production later this year to meet the demand. We continue to closely monitor the tariff policy developments and will provide more updates on this later in the year.

我們相信，鑑於我們對中國製造業的依賴程度較低，這確實為我們的一些客戶提供了另一個價格優勢。基於某些觸發因素，我們計劃在今年稍後建立另一個 MOVIA L 製作站點以滿足需求。我們將繼續密切關注關稅政策的發展，並將在今年稍後提供更多更新資訊。

Now let me provide the progress in each of the verticals we're focused on. Number one, automotive. We continue to be engaged in the 7 RFQs with automotive OEMs. However, the automotive industry is navigating a complex landscape shaped by actual and potential new tariffs. Some OEMs have suspended their annual guidance while some have quantified the potential impact of tariff-related costs.

現在讓我介紹一下我們關注的每個垂直領域的進展。第一，汽車。我們將繼續與汽車原始設備製造商進行 7 項 RFQ。然而，汽車產業正面臨由實際和潛在的新關稅所塑造的複雜局面。一些原始設備製造商已經暫停了年度指導，而一些原始設備製造商已經量化了關稅相關成本的潛在影響。

While LiDAR adoption appears to be a lower priority given the macroeconomic landscape, the direct impact of tariffs has pushed OEMs to focus even more on component costs and the origin of subsystems that go into their vehicles. OEMs will continue to go through the reformulation of existing and upcoming RFQs looking for cheaper LiDAR solutions that meet the desired performance criteria.

儘管考慮到宏觀經濟形勢，光達的採用似乎不是那麼優先，但關稅的直接影響已促使原始設備製造商更加關注零件成本以及車輛子系統的來源。OEM 將繼續重新制定現有和即將發布的 RFQ，尋找滿足所需性能標準的更便宜的 LiDAR 解決方案。

Especially with Glen joining us from the automotive industry, we're excited to pursue our continued engagement with automotive OEMs. This vertical, albeit slower, will be the primary driver for high-volume recurring business that gets us to scale. Number two, industrial with a focus on AGV/AMR and warehouse and factory automation.

尤其是來自汽車行業的 Glen 加入我們之後，我們很高興能夠繼續與汽車原始設備製造商合作。儘管這一垂直發展速度較慢，但它將成為推動我們擴大規模的大批量經常性業務的主要驅動力。第二，工業領域，重點關注 AGV/AMR 以及倉庫和工廠自動化。

With various efforts in flight in the industrial space, our team is focused on deep engagement with customers, including on-site working closely with their teams to support evaluation and integration of our solution into their fleet. We remain confident in the near-term demand from this vertical, especially after securing production capacity to meet this demand.

透過在工業領域的各種飛行努力，我們的團隊專注於與客戶進行深入接觸，包括與他們的團隊進行現場密切合作，以支援對我們的解決方案進行評估並將其整合到他們的機隊中。我們對該垂直產業的近期需求仍然充滿信心，尤其是在確保滿足此需求的生產能力之後。

We're seeing a lot of momentum in the AGV/AMR space as these companies continue to embrace autonomy and AI faster than others. With our current MOVIA technology and secure production capabilities, we're well-positioned to grow in this space. Number three, the Defense vertical.

我們看到 AGV/AMR 領域發展勢頭強勁，因為這些公司繼續比其他公司更快地擁抱自主性和人工智慧。憑藉我們目前的 MOVIA 技術和安全的生產能力，我們已準備好在這一領域實現成長。第三，防禦垂直領域。

In the last few months, we established the Defense Advisory Board to execute our strategy in the defense vertical to map new opportunities for our products globally and pursue monetization of our existing product portfolio through near-term partnerships. Leveraging our existing product portfolio, we're formulating our go-to-market with the support and guidance of our distinguished industry advisers.

在過去的幾個月裡，我們成立了國防顧問委員會來執行我們在國防垂直領域的策略，為我們的產品在全球範圍內規劃新的機遇，並透過近期合作實現現有產品組合的貨幣化。利用我們現有的產品組合，我們在傑出的行業顧問的支持和指導下制定行銷計劃。

The current administration has made the advancement of new technologies in defense a central priority, emphasizing rapid innovation through public/private partnerships. We will provide more updates on this at our upcoming Investor Day next week. We're thrilled to see our engineering team working closely with Glen to align our technology portfolio and strategically advance our product road map.

本屆政府已將國防新技術的進步作為首要任務，強調透過公私合作實現快速創新。我們將在下週的投資者日上提供更多相關更新。我們很高興看到我們的工程團隊與 Glen 密切合作，以調整我們的技術組合併策略性地推進我們的產品路線圖。

With the capital raise in the first quarter and a streamlined cash burn, our cash runway has extended into 2026. MicroVision remains well-positioned in the marketplace with diversified near-term revenue opportunities in the Industrial and Defense sectors. The expanded TAMs, streamlined cost structure and recent financings have solidified our position. Now let's review our Q1 financial performance. For the first quarter, we reported revenues of $0.6 million.

隨著第一季的資本增加和精簡的現金消耗，我們的現金流已延長至 2026 年。MicroVision 在工業和國防部門擁有多樣化的短期收入機會，在市場上仍佔據有利地位。擴大的 TAM、精簡的成本結構和最近的融資鞏固了我們的地位。現在讓我們回顧一下第一季的財務表現。第一季度，我們的營收為 60 萬美元。

This quarter's revenue was primarily driven by our sales in the industrial verticals. Expenses; our first quarter 2025 R&D and SG&A expenses were $14.1 million, including $1.9 million of noncash charges related to stock-based compensation expense and $1.4 million in noncash charges related to depreciation and amortization. Backing out these noncash charges, our R&D and SG&A expenses were only $11 million in the quarter. On a YoY basis, we have reduced our expenses by 45%. We expect the current level to be sustained through the rest of the year.

本季的收入主要來自於我們在工業垂直領域的銷售。費用；我們 2025 年第一季的研發和銷售、一般及行政費用為 1,410 萬美元，其中包括與股票薪酬費用相關的 190 萬美元非現金費用和與折舊和攤銷相關的 140 萬美元非現金費用。除去這些非現金費用，本季我們的研發和銷售、一般及行政費用僅為 1,100 萬美元。與去年同期相比，我們的開支減少了 45%。我們預計目前的水準將在今年剩餘時間內維持下去。

We believe our existing workforce and level of expenses will allow us to execute on the current business strategy. We believe our current engineering teams can support continued engagement with automotive OEMs and simultaneously scale faster with industrial and defense revenue opportunities in the near-term. We believe that the go-forward annual run rate of our cash, R&D and SG&A expense will be in line with our existing quarter. Q4 CapEx was $0.1 million, in line with our expectations. Now let's talk about our balance sheet.

我們相信，我們現有的勞動力和費用水準將使我們能夠執行當前的業務策略。我們相信，我們目前的工程團隊可以支持與汽車原始設備製造商的持續合作，同時在短期內利用工業和國防收入機會更快地擴大規模。我們相信，我們的現金、研發和銷售、一般及行政費用的未來年運行率將與我們現有的季度保持一致。第四季資本支出為 10 萬美元，符合我們的預期。現在我們來談談我們的資產負債表。

We finished the quarter with $69 million in cash and cash equivalents. In addition, the company has availability of $113.4 million under the ATM facility and about $30 million of undrawn capital under the current -- under the convertible note facility. Drawing on these facilities to their fullest extent requires additional authorized capital as well as certain favorable market conditions.

本季末我們的現金和現金等價物為 6,900 萬美元。此外，該公司在 ATM 貸款機制下擁有 1.134 億美元的可用資金，在現有可轉換票據機制下擁有約 3,000 萬美元的未提取資本。要充分利用這些設施，需要額外的授權資本以及某些有利的市場條件。

On the convertible note, we have approximately $33 million outstanding that converts at a fixed price of $1.59 or approximately $1.60. The $30 million second tranche remains undrawn and available for future drawdowns subject to certain limitations.

就可轉換債券而言，我們約有3,300萬美元未償還，可以1.59美元或約1.60美元的固定價格轉換。第二筆3000萬美元的可轉換債券尚未提取，未來可提取，但需遵守某些限制。

We're pleased to have found a strategic partner whose confidence in MicroVision's future has motivated an alignment of economic interest in step with our management team, employees and shareholders. Now let's talk about 2025 targets. We remain relentlessly focused on our execution.

我們很高興找到了一個策略夥伴，他對 MicroVision 的未來充滿信心，並促使我們與管理團隊、員工和股東的經濟利益保持一致。現在我們來談談2025年的目標。我們始終堅持不懈地專注於我們的執行。

We continue to have excellent engagement with industrial customers on their technology road maps. Based on the expected advancement in current customer engagement, along with targeted market opportunities, we believe we have line of sight to $30 million to $50 million in revenue over the next 12 to 18 months.

我們繼續與工業客戶就其技術路線圖保持良好的合作。根據目前客戶參與度的預期進步以及目標市場機會，我們相信未來 12 至 18 個月內我們的收入預計將達到 3,000 萬至 5,000 萬美元。

Our production commitment from our manufacturing partner, ZF, allows us to commit to high-volume deliveries to meet the anticipated demand from current customer projects. While we're not providing fiscal year 2025 guidance, this should help investors understand the size and level of engagements with customers for our MOVIA L sensors. As we expand our TAM into defense and other related areas and expand the solutions portfolio and accelerate our go-to-market strategy, we will provide more color on financial and business milestones for 2025 and 2026 in upcoming events.

我們的製造合作夥伴 ZF 的生產承諾使我們能夠承諾大量交付，以滿足當前客戶專案的預期需求。雖然我們沒有提供 2025 財年的指導，但這應該有助於投資者了解我們的 MOVIA L 感測器與客戶合作的規模和水平。隨著我們將 TAM 擴展到國防和其他相關領域，擴大解決方案組合併加速我們的市場進入策略，我們將在即將舉行的活動中為 2025 年和 2026 年的財務和業務里程碑提供更多細節。

To summarize, we're really excited about 2025 and beyond as MicroVision drives forward with significantly higher TAMs, including defense and industrial, expansive and broadening solutions advancements, solid balance sheet and superior trading metrics and a well-experienced team to execute the strategy.

總而言之，我們對 2025 年及以後的發展感到非常興奮，因為 MicroVision 將以顯著更高的 TAM 向前發展，包括國防和工業、擴展和拓寬解決方案的進步、穩健的資產負債表和卓越的交易指標以及執行該戰略的經驗豐富的團隊。

Operator, I would now like to open the line for questions.

接線員，我現在想開始回答問題。

(Operator Instructions) Casey Ryan, WestPark Capital.

（操作員指示）Casey Ryan，WestPark Capital。

Good afternoon, everybody. Great update. So the first question, I think, Anubhav, you mentioned the revenue for Q1 was actually from commercial sales. Is this the first quarter we've had some commercial sales versus, say, NREs or R&D work?

大家下午好。很棒的更新。所以我認為第一個問題是，Anubhav，您提到第一季的收入實際上來自商業銷售。這是我們第一季有商業銷售，而不是非房地產或研發工作嗎？

No, we have had commercial sales in the fourth quarter as well, Casey. So this is just a continued effort on that part.

不，凱西，我們在第四季也有商業銷售。所以這只是這方面的持續努力。

Okay. Let me see something here. Okay. Good. And so clearly, you all are calling it out as being focused in the industrial vertical, I think, is what we're -- or at least what I'm in the messaging.

好的。讓我看看這裡的東西。好的。好的。很明顯，大家都說我們的重點是垂直工業領域，我想，這就是我們 — — 或至少是我在傳達的訊息中是這樣的。

What's driving consumption, I guess, not that you need to know, but you're able to kind of give us this $30 million to $50 million range of potential revenues over the next 12 to 18 months. I'm just curious what maybe -- what is the thing that's controlling the pace of that, I guess? How fast those revenues come in?

我想，您不需要知道推動消費的因素是什麼，但您可以告訴我們未來 12 到 18 個月內潛在收入在 3000 萬到 5000 萬美元之間。我只是好奇──我想，是什麼在控制這種速度？這些收入來得有多快？

Yes. I'll take that one and Anubhav, maybe you can help a little bit. So I think what will drive that is primarily industrial. And industrial space, there is automation activities and there's also activities to deploy ADAS with the LiDAR integrated on to -- everything integrated onto the sensor. So that's what's driving it, but it's primarily in the industrial space.

是的。我會接受這個，Anubhav，也許你可以幫上一點忙。所以我認為推動這項進程的主要是工業。在工業領域，有自動化活動，也有部署整合 LiDAR 的 ADAS 的活動——一切都整合到感測器上。這就是推動它的因素，但它主要在工業領域。

Of course, all of us have very high hopes of what we want to achieve. But Q1 kind of froze up for almost everybody, right? There was a lot in decision, and we have worked through that now. Anubhav, do you want to add something?

當然，我們所有人都對自己想要實現的目標抱有很高的期望。但對幾乎所有人來說，第一季都有點停滯不前，對吧？有很多事情要做決定，現在我們已經解決了。Anubhav，你想補充點什麼嗎？

Yeah. And I think maybe, Casey, to add on, the trajectory of this $30 million to $50 million revenue is going to be -- is primarily driven by the end customers' deployment and rollout in their internal environment, which is, again, driven by their need to reduce costs and obviously increase productivity, right? So those are some of the primary driving factors behind our customers looking for these solutions to achieve these objectives.

是的。凱西，我想也許可以補充一下，這 3000 萬到 5000 萬美元的收入軌跡將主要由最終客戶在其內部環境中的部署和推出所驅動，而這又是由他們降低成本和明顯提高生產力的需求所驅動，對嗎？因此，這些是我們的客戶尋求這些解決方案以實現這些目標的一些主要驅動因素。

Yeah. Okay. So it doesn't -- it feels very closely connected to the end customer versus, say, the hardware manufacturer who's consuming your product isn't necessarily building up some large level of inventory or preordering product yet. It doesn't sound like.

是的。好的。因此，它感覺與最終客戶沒有非常緊密的聯繫，而消費你的產品的硬體製造商不一定會建立大量的庫存或預訂產品。聽起來不像。

No, yes. So this is the deployment across the customers' facilities and different environments that we are dealing with different customers in the AGV/AMR space.

不，是的。因此，這是跨客戶設施和不同環境的部署，我們正在與 AGV/AMR 領域的不同客戶打交道。

The customer can be classified as OEMs in this space. They're dealing with directly OEMs, so they don't build inventory. They are going to roll it out.

在這個領域，客戶可以歸類為 OEM。他們直接與 OEM 打交道，因此不會建立庫存。他們即將推出這項舉措。

In like real time. Yeah.

就像實時一樣。是的。

That's right.

這是正確的。

I see. Okay. That's helpful. And then would you be willing to characterize sort of the number of people you're dealing with, it's sort of more than one and less than 10? Would you care to characterize how many potential unique entities you guys are working with?

我懂了。好的。這很有幫助。然後，您是否願意描述您所處理的人數，人數是多於 1 人但少於 10 人？您願意描述一下你們正在與多少​​個潛在的獨特實體合作嗎？

Yeah, less than 10, yeah, definitely more than one, but less than 10.

是的，少於 10 個，是的，肯定不只一個，但少於 10 個。

Okay. Okay. That's helpful. Okay. So a couple of other items very quickly. You mentioned military, and I think you have some partners for military. And you mentioned drones. What's scope of the military opportunities as you see them? Is it sort of all vehicles across all branches? Is it potentially specific to like one branch or?

好的。好的。這很有幫助。好的。很快還有幾件其他的事情。您提到了軍事，我認為您在軍事方面有一些合作夥伴。您還提到了無人機。您認為軍事機會的範圍有多大？它是所有分支機構的所有車輛嗎？它是否有可能特定於一個分支？

We're -- think about our product. Our product is basically a sensor and software. We also have things that we've done in the past, which allow us to do sensor fusion with other technologies, but we can provide that. We are not a prime in the military space. We're also not bidding for -- planning to bid on like $1 billion contracts.

我們——考慮一下我們的產品。我們的產品基本上是一個感測器和軟體。我們過去也做過一些事情，這些事情使我們能夠將感測器與其他技術進行整合，但我們可以提供這種服務。我們並不是軍事領域的佼佼者。我們也沒有計劃競標價值 10 億美元的合約。

So we're going to be a technology partner for somebody else that's a prime to deliver something that needs to be solved. This really came back on our horizon last year that there was an opportunity where existing things that we have on the shelf, there may be interest for people to evaluate and we could get to from a standstill to a working demo for them very quickly. So we expanded on the existing set of products to engage as many folks as we can. I think the new part that you would see in the earnings call today talks about drones. I think as we have started looking into it, where the Department of Defense is focused on.

因此，我們將成為其他人的技術合作夥伴，以解決他們需要解決的問題。去年，我們確實再次意識到，我們有機會將現有的東西放在貨架上，人們可能會感興趣去評估，我們可以很快地從停滯狀態轉變為為他們提供可運行的演示。因此，我們擴展了現有的產品系列，以吸引盡可能多的人。我認為您在今天的收益電話會議上看到的新部分是有關無人機的。我認為，當我們開始研究國防部關注的重點時。

And of course, with the help of our advisory board that just has come on -- I mean, they just come online, right? We're just starting the engagement and most of them are not even fully familiar with our product portfolio yet. But they're getting us aligned with what the demand is.

當然，在我們剛成立的顧問委員會的幫助下——我的意思是，他們只是上線，對吧？我們才剛開始合作，他們中的大多數人甚至還不完全熟悉我們的產品組合。但他們讓我們與需求保持一致。

And one of the things that we will talk about next week and continue to talk about is things that we were doing in the automotive space with perception and sensor fusion can also be expanded to drones with some other mission that are in mind that the -- that our potential customer, which is Department of Defense and other smaller departments are evaluating. And they have engagements for that.

我們下週將要討論並將繼續討論的事情之一是，我們在汽車領域透過感知和感測器融合所做的事情也可以擴展到執行其他任務的無人機，我們的潛在客戶，即國防部和其他較小的部門正在評估這些任務。他們已經為此做出了約定。

So it was something that was natural to us that we could become part of that. And in this environment, where automotive is kind of like dormant or nearly dormant, but expected to come on in the future. Industrial is moving along. But again, it's at a pace that, of course, we'd like to want to go fast, but we have to wait patiently for engagements to get to the right level. This was an opportunity that came along. So it was important for us to get into it.

因此，我們能夠成為其中的一部分，這是很自然的事。在這種環境下，汽車產業處於休眠或接近休眠狀態，但預計未來會出現復甦。工業正在向前發展。但當然，我們希望進展速度加快，但我們必須耐心等待參與度達到適當的水平。這是一個隨之而來的機會。因此，對我們來說，參與其中非常重要。

And how many primes should we think about you working with? Is there one significant prime or do you have one now and you guys are open to working with multiple or are there multiple now that you guys are engaged with?

我們應該考慮與多少個素數合作？是否有一個重要的質數，或者您現在有一個並且您願意與多個合作，或者現在有多個您正在合作的素數？

What I -- from the amount of work that we've done on this so far, there are multiple primes. We can think about primes differently. I think in the past, when we talked about primes, we were talking about Lockheed or Northrop Grumman. Those are different programs. Now the primes are a lot of newer technology companies that are names that are new to the military space as a prime, and they have a different DNA.

從我們迄今為止所做的工作量來看，有多個素數。我們可以用不同的方式思考素數。我認為過去當我們談論素數時，我們談論的是洛克希德或諾斯羅普·格魯曼。那些是不同的程序。現在，Primes 是許多較新的科技公司，它們的名字在軍事領域尚屬新名字，並且具有不同的 DNA。

So much faster engagement and getting through, I would say, more in line with tech companies, other tech companies, but they are -- they address revenues less than $10 billion, less than $1 billion sometimes, right? So -- and there's multiple of them actually, not just one.

我想說，他們的參與度和處理速度要快得多，這更符合科技公司和其他科技公司的標準，但他們的收入有時低於 100 億美元，甚至低於 10 億美元，對吧？所以 — — 其實有多個，而不僅僅是一個。

Okay. All right. That's helpful. And then sort of last thing for me. I think you mentioned that you guys have expanded your capacity again. And I think over the last 12 months, maybe the second time you've done that. And so I suppose we're looking sort of compared to the revenue. But tell me why you're doing that. It sounds like your customers are asking you to ramp up.

好的。好的。這很有幫助。這對我來說是最後一件事。我想你提到你們再次擴大了你們的能力。我認為在過去的 12 個月裡，這可能是你第二次這樣做了。所以我想我們正在比較收入。但請告訴我你為什麼這麼做。聽起來您的客戶正在要求您加大力度。

We haven't expanded the capacity. What I think we're saying is that we expect to expand capacity later on this year based on agreements that we are able to get done. I think what capacity we have with ZF right now is perfectly adequate and sufficient, but we expect that if some agreements go a certain way we are going to expand our capacity.

我們還沒有擴大產能。我認為我們要說的是，根據我們能夠達成的協議，我們預計將在今年稍後擴大產能。我認為我們目前與 ZF 的合作產能是完全足夠且足夠的，但我們預計，如果某些協議能夠順利進行，我們將會擴大產能。

Okay. That's helpful. I suppose one nuance on that is sort of you talked about the $30 million to $50 million. If you do need to expand capacity, would it be fair to think that somehow we're sort of at $50 million or above that sort of part of that opportunity?

好的。這很有幫助。我想其中的一個細微差別就是您談到了 3000 萬到 5000 萬美元。如果確實需要擴大產能，那麼是否可以公平地認為，我們的投資金額在某種程度上達到了 5,000 萬美元或以上，這部分機會呢？

Yes. Yes. So I do think that, yes, if we end up expanding our capacity, we would hit the upper bound of that range, possibly beyond that.

是的。是的。所以我確實認為，是的，如果我們最終擴大我們的產能，我們將達到該範圍的上限，甚至可能超越這個上限。

Good. That's something to look forward then.

好的。這是值得期待的事。

Well, update. So thanks you for taking my questions.

嗯，更新一下。感謝您回答我的問題。

Jesse Sobelson, D. Boral Capital.

Jesse Sobelson，D. Boral Capital。

Hey, guys. thanks for update here, thank you for taking my qauedtion. It's good to see some progress on expanding the addressable markets. The first question I had was just on this defense piece of the business. Are you guys looking at strategic alliances that could potentially lead to equity investment or are you currently solely focused on commercial arrangements?

嘿，夥計們。謝謝你的更新，謝謝你回答我的問題。很高興看到在擴大目標市場方面取得了一些進展。我的第一個問題就是關於業務的防禦部分。你們是否正在考慮可能帶來股權投資的策略聯盟，還是目前只專注於商業安排？

We're primarily focused on commercial arrangements right now.

我們現在主要關注商業安排。

Yeah. Helpful to understand a little bit of detail there. I'm also just kind of curious -- we talked $30 million to $50 million in potential next 12 to 18 months. That's been reiterated here in the Q&A so far. But I am kind of curious, DoD seems to be a little bit more of a focus this quarter than it was in the past when that $30 million to $50 million number was initially presented.

是的。有助於了解那裡的一些細節。我也只是有點好奇——我們談論的是未來 12 到 18 個月的潛在收入 3000 萬到 5000 萬美元。到目前為止，我們在問答環節已經重申了這一點。但我有點好奇，國防部本季似乎比過去更受關注，當時最初提出了 3,000 萬至 5,000 萬美元的數字。

Piggybacking off of that conversation on capacity is defense work included in this potential $30 million to $50 million loose figure or is it something that's incremental to current expectations for the business?

圍繞產能的討論是否包括國防工作，這個潛在的 3000 萬到 5000 萬美元的粗略數字，還是對當前業務預期的一個增量？

Yeah, I think that's a great question, Jesse. No, look, I think the $30 million to $50 million, we believe, is primarily driven from the industrial vertical. For the defense vertical, it's still early days. But I think as Sumit pointed out, we're working to formulate our strategy and have more clarity in the upcoming events where we could provide and upgrade our revenue targets based on quantifying what kind of projects we're going to take part in through these partnerships like Sumit described. And I think one thing I would like to also highlight is obviously, MicroVision does have an existing intellectual property portfolio related to the AR piece that we have.

是的，我認為這是一個很好的問題，傑西。不，我認為 3000 萬到 5000 萬美元主要來自工業垂直領域。對於國防垂直領域來說，現在還處於早期階段。但我認為，正如蘇米特指出的那樣，我們正在努力製定我們的策略，並在即將舉行的活動中更加明確，我們可以根據量化我們將透過這些合作夥伴關係參與什麼樣的項目來提供和升級我們的收入目標，就像蘇米特所描述的那樣。我想強調的一點是，MicroVision 確實擁有與我們現有的 AR 產品相關的智慧財產權組合。

And obviously, we're, at this point, looking at all possible options as to how we can partner with other bigger players to accelerate their deployment and go-to-market as well. So that could result in monetization of that through different structures. But like I said, at this point, early days, and we would have more clarity on the revenue targets for this in the upcoming events.

顯然，目前我們正在尋找所有可能的選擇，以便與其他更大的公司合作，加速他們的部署和上市。因此這可以透過不同的結構來實現貨幣化。但就像我說過的，現在還處於早期階段，我們會在即將舉行的活動中更明確地了解收入目標。

Right. So it sounds like you're open to things such as co-development agreements and potential technology licensing in addition to manufacturing products to be used in end market equipment. Is that fair to say?

正確的。因此，聽起來除了製造用於終端市場設備的產品之外，您還對聯合開發協議和潛在技術許可等事項持開放態度。這樣說公平嗎？

Right. So I think mostly the way the defense contracts will be expected to work through the partnership structure that I described would be typically in the form of ED&T revenue, which is engineering, design and testing revenue, which is essentially the work or if I could draw an analogy for you, that's an NRE equivalent to what we have been talking about in the automotive world, where the government entities, if we are directly engaged with the government or the prime, as Sumit described, they would pay for the project where we are developing this.

正確的。因此，我認為國防合約預計透過我所描述的合作結構運作的方式主要是以 ED&T 收入的形式出現，即工程、設計和測試收入，這本質上是工作，或者如果我可以為你打個比方，那就是 NRE，相當於我們在汽車領域所談論的，如果我們直接與政府或主要部門合作，正如 Sumit 所描述的，政府實體將為我們正在開發的項目。

Keep in mind we already have the building blocks of the technology. So it's really just putting together the solution like the drone solution that Sumit mentioned, et cetera. But what it essentially translates into is the ED&T revenue that would start flowing through the system, and that's what I plan to update the numbers with once we have more clarity and more visibility into this sector.

請記住，我們已經擁有了該技術的基礎。因此，這實際上只是將解決方案組合在一起，就像 Sumit 提到的無人機解決方案等等。但它本質上意味著 ED&T 收入將開始流經整個系統，一旦我們對這個領域有了更清晰的了解和更多的可視性，我計劃用它來更新數字。

Appreciate the call here and IIt sounds like it's a little bit of a wait-and-see approach for the time being, but excited to see what happens here.

感謝您的來電，聽起來目前我們採取了一種觀望態度，但我很高興看到這裡會發生什麼。

I will now turn this call back over to Anubhav Verma, to read questions submitted through the webcast. Thank you.

現在我將把這通電話轉回給 Anubhav Verma，讓他閱讀透過網路直播提交的問題。謝謝。

Thank you, operator. All right. The first question, if we have the best-in-class sensor with the lowest price point, why are we not winning these industrial RFQ's?

謝謝您，接線生。好的。第一個問題是，如果我們擁有價格最低的一流感測器，為什麼我們沒有贏得這些工業 RFQ？

That's a good question. Actually, I think this is a reaction to some of the announcements that are coming from our other -- our competitors. I can tell you that we are engaged with multiple customers that are evaluating. One of the challenges that always happens in here is now that you have software, now they have hardware. I think like our investors, but also a lot of people just think about us as a LiDAR company.

這是個好問題。實際上，我認為這是對我們的其他競爭對手的一些聲明的反應。我可以告訴您，我們正在與多個正在評估的客戶接觸。這裡經常遇到的挑戰之一是，現在你有軟體，而他們有硬體。我認為，除了我們的投資者之外，還有很多人只認為我們是一家光達公司。

When you think about automotive, you just have to put a LiDAR with a point cloud. So in that sense, it's a LiDAR company. And there's a bunch of us competing in that space. In the industrial space, it is LiDAR plus the perception software on board. So there's integration, there's validation.

當你考慮汽車時，你只需要將 LiDAR 與點雲放在一起。從這個意義上來說，它是一家 LiDAR 公司。我們很多人都在那個領域競爭。在工業領域，它是 LiDAR 加上機載感知軟體。因此存在集成，存在驗證。

There's, I would say, 90% of all the discussions that we've been part of for the last eight months with a group of customers. It's all about what the software does and how the software will connect to their software and how the qualification is going to happen, actually more than eight months. So if you think about the evaluation part of it, it's not the hardware anymore. It is really how the software solves a specific problem for them. I get it.

我想說，在過去八個月裡，我們與一群客戶進行的討論中有 90% 都是這樣的。這一切都與軟體的功能、軟體如何連接到他們的軟體以及資格認證如何進行有關，實際上這個過程需要八個多月的時間。因此，如果您考慮它的評估部分，它就不再是硬體了。這實際上是軟體如何為他們解決特定問題。我得到它。

I think investors are frustrated, but I can assure you nobody is more frustrated than I am about this. But it takes whatever time it takes, but I don't think it's going to take forever. I think things will converge sometime soon. So you have to think about it, right? Yeah, you can have the best price point, but you also have to find an opportunity that you can actually sign a business that's profitable.

我認為投資者很沮喪，但我可以向你保證，沒有人比我更沮喪。但這需要一些時間，但我認為這不會花很長時間。我認為事情很快就會好轉。所以你必須考慮一下，對嗎？是的，你可以擁有最好的價格點，但你也必須找到一個可以真正簽約有利可圖的業務的機會。

And I'll give you a great example. Recently of more than one, less than 10 customers, there was one that we actually lost. But it was a small project. It was less than, I would say, 500 sensors is what they wanted. But what was the requirement for us to win that was to absorb something like almost $1 million worth of development.

我給你舉一個很好的例子。最近，在不只一個、不到十個的客戶中，我們實際上失去了一個。但這是一個小項目。我想說，他們想要的感測器數量少於 500 個。但是，我們要贏得勝利，就必須投入價值近 100 萬美元的開發資金。

And so pretty much at that point, yes, you can say we can get an announcement done, but it is not a sustainable model where you're actually burning through cash to win these things to just get the share price up. So long-term, it was not the smartest thing to take care of. But we are getting closer to the point for the right customer, for the right volume. It is time for us to push our chips in and actually take a risk for the right customer for the right volume, and we're getting closer to that. And again, you want not just one customer, you want multiple of them.

所以基本上到了那個時候，是的，你可以說我們可以發佈公告，但這不是一個可持續的模式，你實際上在消耗現金來贏得這些東西，只是為了提高股價。所以從長遠來看，這不是最明智的做法。但我們正在越來越接近找到合適的客戶、獲得合適的銷售量。現在是我們全力以赴、為合適的客戶、為合適的數量承擔風險的時候了，我們正在接近這個目標。再說一次，你想要的不只是一個客戶，你想要多個客戶。

So you have to reserve your capital based on who's the one that you want to make a bet behind. That's going to be advantageous long-term. And that could actually turn into a sustainable business because there will be others that will come on faster. So that's how we focus ourselves. I get this thing, the best-in-class sensor.

因此，你必須根據你想押注的對象來預留資金。從長遠來看這將是有利的。這實際上可能會成為一項可持續發展的業務，因為會有其他業務更快發展。這就是我們關注的重點。我得到了這個東西，這是一流的傳感器。

But what's best-in-class for MOVIA L? It's in production. It's very robust, solid state. MOVIA S, it's -- I think we're going to talk about that in Q3 this year when we're going to announce it publicly. But it's a 180-degree sensor, whereas you have our competition from China and the US.

但是 MOVIA L 的最佳表現是什麼？正在生產中。它非常堅固、穩定。MOVIA S，我想我們會在今年第三季公開宣布它時討論它。但它是一個 180 度感測器，而我們的競爭對手是來自中國和美國。

talking about they're making a 180-degree sensor. But if you know anything about physics, you'll know that their sensor, there's no way you can achieve 180 degrees because it's not -- they're just showing some rendering or we actually have samples that we will show next week, mechanical samples of what we expect out of that. So yeah, having a great sensor is the building block that is important.

談論他們正在製造一個 180 度感測器。但是如果你對物理學有所了解，你就會知道他們的感測器，你不可能實現 180 度，因為它不是 - 他們只是展示一些渲染，或者我們實際上有樣品，我們將在下週展示，這是我們期望的機械樣品。所以，擁有優秀的感測器是重要的基石。

Now comes the software for industrial that how can we actually enable them with a, let's say, some of the ADAS features that were developed by our team in Hamburg a long time ago and deploy that into industrial. So it's going to take some time, but I don't think it's going to take a very long time to get to some conclusion here.

現在談到工業軟體，我們如何真正利用我們漢堡團隊很久以前開發的一些 ADAS 功能來實現它們，並將其部署到工業中。所以這需要一些時間，但我認為不會花很長時間就能得出結論。

Thank you, Sumit. Of the prospective industrial customers that engage with MicroVision, how many are no longer involved? Have you lost some programs in your pipeline? Why? I guess you partly answered that. So maybe let me skip to the next one. How do you plan to compete with the existing players like Ouster and SIC in the industrial vertical?

謝謝你，Sumit。與 MicroVision 合作的潛在產業客戶中，有多少不再參與？您的管道中是否遺失了一些程式？為什麼？我想你已經部分回答這個問題了。所以也許我可以跳到下一個。您計劃如何與工業垂直領域的 Ouster 和 SIC 等現有參與者競爭？

That's a good question. The two ways that we're going to compete is, number one, we're going to sell our sensor with software on board. And since we have spent a lot of capital already developing this, and the same software is going to go across multiple customers as a standard, we're going to offer these features on there.

這是個好問題。我們的競爭方式有兩種：第一，我們將銷售帶有軟體的感測器。由於我們已經投入了大量資金來開發該產品，並且相同的軟體將作為標準面向多個客戶，因此我們將在該軟體上提供這些功能。

So no more customers have to worry about custom NREs or some features because the core development is all actually MicroVision's assets. So that's important because what they're getting is not just a sensor that would require a software team from us or from them to integrate, but they get a full-blown solution.

因此，客戶不再需要擔心客製化 NRE 或某些功能，因為核心開發實際上都是 MicroVision 的資產。這很重要，因為他們得到的不僅僅是一個需要我們或他們的軟體團隊來整合的感測器，而是一個完整的解決方案。

So we have to start engaging with industrial customers that are kind of focused on that, not just a LiDAR, but they want a solution. The other one is economy of scales. We have to start hitting price points that are significantly lower than any of the competition, and that means we have to aggregate a lot of volume. We have to be competitive there. I think other LiDAR companies are public as well.

因此，我們必須開始與專注於此的工業客戶接觸，他們不僅僅是想要光達，而是想要一個解決方案。另一個是規模經濟。我們必須開始達到比任何競爭對手都低得多的價格點，這意味著我們必須聚集大量的銷售。我們必須在那裡具有競爭力。我認為其他 LiDAR 公司也是上市公司。

You know their ASP. And the clear indication from everybody is that those ASPs are not sustainable. I think in the safety sensor space, SIC has got a very unique position. They have deployed that for many, many years. And ultimately, when we described our safety sensor last year, eventually, our intention is to go after that market as well.

您知道他們的 ASP。每個人都明確表示，這些平均售價是不可持續的。我認為在安全感測器領域，SIC 佔據著非常獨特的地位。他們已經部署這個技術很多年了。最後，當我們去年描述我們的安全感測器時，我們最終的目的也是進軍該市場。

But at the moment, we want to just focus on the non-safety industrial market with the software. I'm pretty sure that we can take on Ouster and I don't think there's any doubt that we have a better product. I think the spinners are the spinners, they may have some sort of reliability, but ultimately, they're mechanical sensors, right? And SIC is a mechanical sensor. But in limited life applications, perhaps they're okay.

但目前，我們只想專注於非安全工業市場的軟體。我非常確信我們可以與 Ouster 競爭，而且我認為毫無疑問我們會有更好的產品。我認為旋轉器是旋轉器，它們可能具有某種可靠性，但最終，它們是機械感測器，對嗎？而SIC是一種機械感測器。但在有限的使用壽命應用中，它們可能還不錯。

But if you want something robust, that has to go for a long period of time, I think the solid-state sensor would be very competitive. And even MAVIN, as we start transitioning it towards while automotive is doing its own thing, finding applications for it in commercial vehicle or military or agriculture mining, I think the robustness of the technology, we just have to make competitive, sign smart deals.

但如果你想要一些堅固的東西，並且需要長期使用，我認為固態感測器會非常有競爭力。甚至 MAVIN，當我們開始向汽車轉型時，汽車正在做自己的事情，在商用車或軍事或農業採礦中尋找應用，我認為這項技術的穩健性，我們只需要具有競爭力，簽署明智的交易。

So we're not starting off in the hole by financing somebody else's development. I think long-term, we're going to be okay and be very competitive and probably more profitable because our expenses are going to be low and our profit margins per project are going to be much more compelling, in my opinion. Glen, would you like to add some color on this? I think you've been on board and you've had a chance to look at this as well.

因此，我們不會透過資助其他人的發展而一開始就陷入困境。我認為，從長遠來看，我們會很好，而且非常有競爭力，而且可能更有利可圖，因為我們的開支會很低，而且每個專案的利潤率會更有吸引力，這是我認為的。格倫，你想給它一些顏色嗎？我想你已經參與其中並且也有機會了解這一點。

Yeah. Thanks, Sumit. Appreciate the opportunity. And I think to build on your comments, one, the sensor being a solid-state sensor not only does it have greater reliability and other sensing modalities we got away from electromechanical sensors for just that reason as well as, as you scale, having a solid-state solution gives you better positioning relative to reducing hardware costs while you scale. Basically it's a silicon solution, and it really allows you to achieve lower hardware costs than simply scaling up electromechanical solutions.

是的。謝謝，Sumit。感謝這次機會。我認為，基於您的評論，首先，作為固態感測器，它不僅具有更高的可靠性和我們擺脫機電感測器的其他感測模式，而且隨著規模的擴大，擁有固態解決方案可以讓您在擴大規模的同時更好地定位，從而降低硬體成本。基本上，它是一種矽解決方案，與簡單地擴大機電解決方案相比，它確實可以讓你實現更低的硬體成本。

So I think that's an important part of it. But as you said, it's not just a LiDAR sensor that delivers a point cloud. It has a significant amount of processing capability on board. And why that's important? It means that we can provide not just the point cloud, but we can provide perception, localization as well as the LCAS or the driver assistance feature sets and do that in a way that's essentially a bolt-on solution to the vehicle.

所以我認為這是其中的重要部分。但正如您所說，不僅僅是 LiDAR 感測器可以提供點雲。它具有強大的處理能力。為什麼這很重要？這意味著我們不僅可以提供點雲，還可以提供感知、定位以及 LCAS 或駕駛輔助功能集，並且以一種本質上是車輛附加解決方案的方式實現這一點。

So whether it's a forklift or a tugger or some other type of vehicle, you don't have to cut into the vehicle or disturb the vehicle architecture. You can simply bolt this solution on. And that's tremendous -- from an ease of implementation standpoint, that's very good. You don't have to add another ECU. So for a system cost standpoint, it's very good.

因此，無論是堆高機、牽引車或其他類型的車輛，您都無需切入車輛或破壞車輛結構。您可以簡單地採用這個解決方案。這太棒了——從易於實施的角度來看，這非常好。您不必新增另一個 ECU。因此從系統成本的角度來看，它非常好。

And then ultimately, from a TAM perspective, it's great because it means it opens up existing vehicles to your solution where you can essentially retrofit, all of which means time to revenue is reduced. So I think our -- the solution that we have with a smart sensor going into industrial will be very competitive and very compelling for the OEMs. Anubhav, I'll turn it back over to you.

最後，從 TAM 的角度來看，這很棒，因為這意味著它可以將現有車輛開放給您的解決方案，您可以在其中進行本質上的改造，所有這些都意味著縮短了收入實現時間。所以我認為，我們針對工業應用推出的智慧感測器解決方案對於原始設備製造商來說將非常具有競爭力且非常引人注目。阿努巴夫，我會把它交還給你。

Thanks, Glen. Let me take the next question. What are the 2025 milestones that shareholders should track in each market, including industrial, defense and automotive, design wins, custom development agreements, partnership agreements, ideas?

謝謝，格倫。我來回答下一個問題。股東應該在每個市場（包括工業、國防和汽車、設計勝利、客製化開發協議、合作協議、創意）追蹤的 2025 年里程碑是什麼？

Yeah. I think in industrial space, I think it's all about taking our sensors that we've talked about and signing commercial deals. Certainly, we make as many sales as possible of the less than 50, let's call them spot sales. I think that's how we refer to them always. But our focus, of course, is to finding a group of anchor customers that essentially take up all the capacity that we have deployed already.

是的。我認為在工業領域，一切都與我們所討論的傳感器以及簽署商業協議有關。當然，我們會盡可能多地銷售少於 50 件的商品，我們稱之為現貨銷售。我想我們總是這樣稱呼他們。但我們的重點當然是尋找一組能夠充分利用我們已部署的所有容量的主力客戶。

That's primarily the way you can gauge that industrial market is moving along. So you should be able to announce deals, then you'll start seeing backlogs and revenues and normal business on the MOVIA L. On MOVIA S, I think we're going to announce it publicly and there's -- again, engagement will start.

這主要是衡量工業市場發展的方式。因此，您應該能夠宣布交易，然後您將開始看到 MOVIA L 上的積壓、收入和正常業務。對於 MOVIA S，我認為我們將公開宣布它，並且 - 再次，參與將開始。

Pilot plan will be sometime next year and then some sort of ramp, but we expect to start engaging some customers with that technology, but it's not something that's going to have a material impact on the revenues that Anubhav talked about. On the defense side, I think the best way to imagine is, again, we're going to be a subcontractor to a prime.

試點計畫將在明年某個時候進行，然後會進行某種程度的提升，我們預計將開始讓一些客戶使用該技術，但這不會對 Anubhav 談到的收入產生實質影響。在國防方面，我認為最好的想像方式是，我們將再次成為主要承包商的分包商。

There will be most likely, as Anubhav has already mentioned, we would engage in some sort of customized development with some partial funding from them while we still maintain all the IP or exploration of our existing portfolio of technologies that we have shipped in the past and some sort of development agreements of what they want to see because anybody that wants to work deeply with the technology that's new to them, they always do a small project together to understand the team, understand the technology and the viability before they jump to the next one.

正如 Anubhav 已經提到的那樣，最有可能的是，我們將利用他們的部分資金進行某種定制開發，同時我們仍然保留所有知識產權或對我們過去提供的現有技術組合的探索，以及某種他們希望看到的開發協議，因為任何想要深入研究新技術的人，在進入下一個項目之前，他們總是一起做一個小項目來了解團隊，了解技術和可行性。

So defense would be that. And longer term, I think the opportunity in defense is there are smaller contracts, I'm saying sub-$500 million, maybe sub-$200 million contracts where maybe a pilot program of maybe several hundred units or something has to be built or several -- several hundred units have to be built, and you're part of those contracts where you have to deliver an integrated piece of hardware and software that kind of plugs into some device. So that's much more intimate. So the best way to engage in defense would be that.

所以防守就是這樣。從長遠來看，我認為國防領域的機會在於簽訂一些規模較小的合同，例如價值低於 5 億美元或低於 2 億美元的合同，在這些合同中，可能需要建造一個包含數百個單元的試點項目，而您需要提供可以插入某些設備的集成硬體和軟體。所以這更加親密。所以最好的防禦方式就是這樣。

In automotive, I think -- I'm going to have Glen actually comment on this. But in automotive, the best way to think about it is some sort of development agreement or early advanced prototyping for a future program that's coming or an RFQ that again will roll on for about a year before they'll award it. So that's about all we can do. But I don't expect meaningful revenues coming from it, but certainly some sort of partnership announcements for much smaller size opportunities.

在汽車領域，我認為——我會讓格倫對此發表評論。但在汽車行業，最好的思考方式是某種開發協議或即將到來的未來計劃的早期高級原型，或者在他們授予合約之前將再次持續約一年的 RFQ。這就是我們所能做的一切。但我並不期望從中產生有意義的收入，但肯定會帶來某種形式的合作公告，以爭取規模小得多的機會。

Yeah, I can add to that last comment, Sumit. The -- I think you -- the OEMs and talking to them as recently as last week, the OEMs are going through a bit of a reformulation on Level 3. And the good news is all Level 3 platforms still need LiDAR. So there's no change in approach in that regard. But really, the first generation had limited success, very low volumes and take rates.

是的，我可以補充最後一條評論，Sumit。我認為您——OEM 和他們上週的交談中，OEM 正在對 3 級進行一些重新制定。好消息是所有 3 級平台仍然需要 LiDAR。因此，在這方面的方法並沒有改變。但實際上，第一代產品的成功率有限，銷售量和接受率都很低。

And so now there's a bit of a kind of a refocusing on, well, what is that right solution. And I think predevelopment contracts are normally how the next step in that environment where they test out and showcase what the solution could look like and validate cost models as well as performance models and really trying to get to a value prop that the end consumer will buy.

因此，現在我們需要重新關注什麼是正確的解決方案。我認為預開發合約通常是該環境中的下一步，他們會測試並展示解決方案的樣子，並驗證成本模型和效能模型，並真正嘗試獲得最終消費者會購買的價值主張。

And what's exciting for us is in those discussions, and like I mentioned, as recently as last week, we have the portfolio that between long range as well as short range, wide field of view, extended range field of view, we have the portfolio that can really, I think, deliver a solution for them. So you probably have seen in the predevelopment contract prior to any big production contracts, but that's exactly where we are today.

令我們興奮的是這些討論，就像我上週提到的那樣，我們擁有涵蓋長距離、短距離、寬視野、擴展視野的產品組合，我認為我們的產品組合確實可以為他們提供解決方案。因此，您可能已經在任何大型生產合約之前的預開發合約中看到過，但這正是我們今天所處的狀態。

Thank you, Glen. All right. Next question. Given that MicroVision is engaged in seven automotive RFQs and the typical timeline suggests OEMs might be making decisions for model year 2028 programs around this time, can you provide any update on the status of these engagements and whether there has been any significant progress or indications of timelines accelerating or solidifying during the first quarter this year?

謝謝你，格倫。好的。下一個問題。鑑於 MicroVision 正在參與 7 項汽車 RFQ，並且典型的時間表表明 OEM 可能會在此時為 2028 年車型年計劃做出決策，您能否提供有關這些參與狀態的任何更新，以及今年第一季度是否有任何重大進展或時間表加速或鞏固的跡象？

Glen, do you want to take that since you have the most contact with the OEMs now?

格倫，由於您現在與 OEM 的聯繫最多，所以您想接受這個嗎？

Yeah. I think timing-wise, that's certainly the target is to be able to have solutions implemented in the model year or during calendar year '28. That, generally speaking, is the timing that we've been talking about. And so what that means is if you think about it, it's already virtually midyear '25. That means you have to have solutions that are fairly mature and ready to go.

是的。我認為從時間上來說，目標肯定是能夠在車型年或 28 日曆年實施解決方案。一般來說，這就是我們一直在談論的時機。如果你仔細想想，這意味著現在實際上已經是 25 年中了。這意味著您必須擁有相當成熟且隨時可用的解決方案。

And as I mentioned earlier, that's what's exciting about where we are in terms of the portfolio offering that we have, the software maturity that we have and the different solutions that we can provide. And I would say those are active discussions right now. Once the OEMs kind of settle in on the technical solution, then it can move very quickly. Model year '28, it would -- is still aggressive, but it's still feasible if the OEMs move quickly over the next -- really over the next, I would say, three months or so.

正如我之前提到的，就我們所擁有的產品組合、軟體成熟度以及我們可以提供的不同解決方案而言，這就是令人興奮的地方。我想說的是，這些都是目前正在進行的積極討論。一旦 OEM 確定了技術解決方案，它就可以快速發展。28 年款，這仍然很激進，但如果原始設備製造商 (OEM) 能夠在接下來的三個月左右迅速採取行動，這仍然是可行的。

Thank you, Glen. All right. Next question is defense related. Why will MicroVision successfully secure business in the defense industry after years of unsuccess in the automotive and industrial markets?

謝謝你，格倫。好的。下一個問題與防禦有關。為什麼 MicroVision 在汽車和工業市場多年失敗後，能夠成功獲得國防工業的業務？

Yeah. Maybe I'll just start and then turn it back over to you. A couple of things to highlight. One, these are very different markets. And if you think about automotive, there's really one application for LiDAR at this point in time.

是的。也許我會先開始，然後再把它交還給你。有幾件事需要強調。首先，這些市場非常不同。如果你考慮汽車，那麼目前 LiDAR 實際上有一個應用。

It's really Level 3 driver assistance and maybe some Level 2 functions, but it's really around ADAS. When you look at the defense industry, there's multiple avenues for the application of the technology. There's drones, there's the unmanned autonomous vehicles. There's also AR headsets, there's terrain mapping. So you have multiple areas where the technology is either being applied today in a very limited fashion or the defense industry is looking for solutions in a very aggressive fashion.

它實際上是 3 級駕駛輔助，也許還有一些 2 級功能，但它實際上是圍繞 ADAS 的。放眼國防工業，這項技術的應用途徑有多種。有無人機，有無人駕駛汽車。還有 AR 耳機和地形測繪。因此，在多個領域中，該技術要么以非常有限的方式應用，要么國防工業正在以非常積極的方式尋找解決方案。

So you have a much greater number of opportunities to apply our portfolio. And what's also really good is it's the same technology that we would be applying, broadly speaking, to automotive or to industrial. It is in a whole different field from a technology standpoint for MicroVision. It's really applying those assets that we have effectively across those other verticals.

因此您有更多機會應用我們的產品組合。而且真正好的一點是，從廣義上講，它是我們應用於汽車或工業領域的相同技術。從 MicroVision 的技術角度來看，這是一個完全不同的領域。這實際上就是將我們擁有的資產有效地運用到其他垂直領域。

Sumit, I'll turn it back to you.

Sumit，我會把它還給你。

Yeah. I think part of the question is like why after years of unsuccess in automotive and industrial, I think I get the frustration, but let's always focus on the reality of it. Let me be honest about this. Last year, we were deep into it with Daimler, as most of you know. And at that point, we chose to stop at a certain point because going forward, what it meant more than $20 million of OpEx with them not covering anything when the economy was going in the wrong direction.

是的。我認為問題的一部分是，為什麼在汽車和工業領域失敗多年後，我會感到沮喪，但讓我們始終專注於現實。讓我坦誠地講一下這一點。正如大多數人所知，去年我們與戴姆勒進行了深入合作。在那時，我們選擇在某個點停止，因為展望未來，這意味著超過 2000 萬美元的營運支出，而當經濟朝著錯誤的方向發展時，他們卻沒有承擔任何責任。

And it was clear from all the indication that the OEMs by themselves were struggling with the long-term timelines to deliver what they had said, okay? I would argue that if we had actually done that deal, we're not here right now. We would have been in a much worse position in my opinion. And the example of that -- in that example, really, if you look at what happened with -- I'm pretty sure investors want us to sign a deal, but we also have to evaluate because some of those investors wants trade on [their] information and move on to the next thing. But we really have to support the thesis that the company is going to be around to finish these contracts.

所有跡像都表明，原始設備製造商本身正在努力在長期時間表內實現他們所說的目標，好嗎？我想說，如果我們真的達成了那項協議，我們現在就不會處於這樣的境地。我認為我們的處境會更糟。舉個例子——在這個例子中，如果你看看發生了什麼——我很確定投資者希望我們簽署協議，但我們也必須進行評估，因為其中一些投資者希望根據[他們的]資訊進行交易，然後轉向下一個項目。但我們確實必須支持這樣的論點：該公司將會完成這些合約。

That's a very important one. And Daimler, for example, was not the right one for us, right? It was not big enough. And I will tell you that the technical review and acceptance happened the year before in 2023. And I would say Anubhav and I actually were going to these meetings four months into it, four to five months into it, trying to convince them our balance sheet was going to be okay that the ATM was a medium that was going to allow us to raise and they wanted more capital because they wanted to make sure that if the ATM was not going to be exercised, their project would not be in trouble and they will have to come in and fund it.

這是非常重要的一點。例如戴姆勒就不適合我們，對嗎？它不夠大。而且我可以告訴你們，技術審查和驗收是在前一年，也就是2023年進行的。我想說的是，實際上，在專案進行了四個月、四五個月之後，Anubhav 和我參加了這些會議，試圖讓他們相信，我們的資產負債表不會有問題，ATM 是一種可以讓我們籌集資金的媒介，他們想要更多的資本，因為他們想確保如果 ATM 無法使用，他們的項目就不會陷入困境，他們將不得不介入並為其提供資金。

If you think about all of this, right, I mean, those kind of projects, so you can say I was unsuccessful in automotive. I wouldn't say that. It's just you want to get a deal done, but it's worth to get a bad deal done that's going to cause you to fail. So yeah, I expect you guys to come in next week and have some very, very direct questions. You're going to get direct answers with me as always.

如果你考慮所有這些，對，我的意思是，那些類型的項目，所以你可以說我在汽車領域沒有成功。我不會這麼說。你只是想完成一筆交易，但完成一筆糟糕的交易卻值得，因為這會導致你失敗。是的，我希望你們下週來並提出一些非常直接的問題。像往常一樣，您將直接得到我的答案。

But just think in this terms. At some point, the company has to survive. It's not just about to announce something and trade on it and move on. And if you have a customer that's really giving you an indication that they're not so certain about their timeline, but they expect to put all your money in and all your investors to come along with it, you got to really evaluate, right? So automotive has just been tough.

但只要這樣想就好了。到了一定時候，公司必須生存下去。這不僅僅是宣布某件事、進行交易然後繼續前進。如果你有一個客戶確實向你表明他們對自己的時間表不太確定，但他們希望投入你所有的錢，並且所有投資者都參與其中，你就必須真正評估，對嗎？所以汽車產業一直很艱難。

Industrial market is just going -- I mean, I would say it's going really, really well. I think we have -- we started the acquisition of Ibeo happened, all the asset transfer took a while. Production started late in 2023, in 2024. We did some work, which is any time you go into industrial space, you expect somewhere between 12 to 24 months for adoption. We got the samples out.

工業市場正在發展——我的意思是，我想說它發展得非常非常好。我認為我們已經——我們開始收購 Ibeo，所有資產轉移都需要一段時間。生產於2023年底至2024年開始。我們做了一些工作，即任何時候進入工業領域，你預計需要 12 到 24 個月的時間才能採用。我們把樣品拿出來了。

It's a very mature product. We started working on software, as I said, for the last nine months or more rather than hardware. So it's moving along. So I would not say that industrial has not been demonstrated. I know everybody -- in every earnings call, they want something announced that we can go forward, and we have tried to navigate.

這是一個非常成熟的產品。正如我所說，過去九個多月來，我們開始致力於軟體開發，而不是硬體開發。所以它正在繼續前進。所以我不會說工業化尚未被證實。我知道每個人——在每次財報電話會議上，他們都希望宣布一些我們可以繼續推進的事情，我們也一直在努力實現這些目標。

But now we're to the point where we have the group of target customers and it's time for us to push our chips in and take a risk with the customers that are high enough volume, and they're trustworthy because the things that they're saying they understand and acknowledge who we are. They see the balance sheet.

但是現在我們已經有了目標客戶群，是時候加大投入，冒險爭取那些數量足夠多的客戶了，他們是值得信賴的，因為他們理解並認可我們是誰。他們看到了資產負債表。

They see the strength of it, and they see that we can solve their problem right now without any investment from them. So I think like keep that in context, right? I think -- so I think what Glen is representing is the future where we're going to take it, things that we cannot imagine as MicroVision by itself, where the product is going to go.

他們看到了它的力量，他們看到我們現在可以解決他們的問題，而不需要他們進行任何投資。所以我認為應該把它放在上下文中，對嗎？我認為——所以我認為 Glen 所代表的是我們將帶領它走向的未來，那些我們無法想像 MicroVision 本身將走向的東西，以及產品將走向的地方。

I'm happy to answer all the questions about the past about automotive and industrial. Certainly, whatever frustration investors have, we can cover that. But I think the opportunity that we have, if we sort of break it out, the defense is not something we just entered into because it was kind of cool. We were given some indications that it was kind of important for us to be in this space because it's opening up. And we have the opportunity with no extra expenses to go address that of things that we've already created.

我很樂意回答有關汽車和工業過去的所有問題。當然，無論投資人遇到什麼挫折，我們都可以解決。但我認為，如果我們能夠突破它，我們就有機會，防守並不是我們剛剛進入的東西，因為它很酷。我們得到一些跡象表明，進入這個領域對我們來說很重要，因為它正在開放。我們有機會在不增加額外開支的情況下去解決我們已經創造的問題。

So certainly, we're expanding rather than just going towards the success. And I think in defense, we've done it in the past. We've had success there with multiple projects, multiple announcements. So defense is probably something that we're more confident on. And with Glen's help, of course, we can expand where we can be relevant in defense, specifically in drones and other military vehicles and, of course, AR.

因此，我們當然是在不斷擴張，而不僅僅是追求成功。我認為在防守方面我們過去已經這樣做了。我們在那裡已經成功完成了多個專案並發布了多個公告。因此，防守可能是我們更有信心的事情。當然，在格倫的幫助下，我們可以擴大國防領域的應用範圍，特別是無人機和其他軍用車輛，當然還有擴增實境 (AR)。

Thanks, Sumit. Next question. Would you say we are a LiDAR company or have we fully morphed into an autonomous systems company? And if we're now more of a systems company, how has that retooled our approach to securing these new opportunities mentioned, specifically industrial and defense?

謝謝，Sumit。下一個問題。您認為我們是一家 LiDAR 公司，還是我們已經完全轉型為自主系統公司？如果我們現在更像是一家系統公司，那麼這將如何改變我們的方法來確保所提到的這些新機遇，特別是工業和國防？

I think that's a really good question. If you think about the three segments, I'll start on one end, high-volume automotive, they will think of us as a LiDAR company for now that provides a clean point cloud and some software support. But really, they want to be the software company and they go develop. So we're just a LiDAR company there. A lot of our competition is in that space as well.

我認為這確實是一個好問題。如果你考慮這三個部分，我將從一端開始，即大批量汽車，他們現在會認為我們是一家提供清晰點雲和一些軟體支援的 LiDAR 公司。但實際上，他們想成為軟體公司並進行開發。所以我們只是一家 LiDAR 公司。我們的許多競爭對手也都在這個領域。

In industrial, we have already graduated to the next level where we are going to be -- we are shipping product and eventually, we expect to ship it in volume with software integrated on it. So the LiDAR is no longer LiDAR. It is an actual LiDAR solution, software that does something specific. Terms that we talk about like automotive ADAS, think about industrial ADAS. Those kind of features are enabled in this space for our customers.

在工業領域，我們已經進入了下一個階段——我們正在運送產品，最終，我們期望批量運送整合軟體的產品。因此，LiDAR 不再是 LiDAR。它是一個實際的 LiDAR 解決方案，是一種可以執行特定操作的軟體。我們談論的術語如汽車 ADAS，考慮工業 ADAS。我們在此空間中為客戶啟用了此類功能。

So therefore, they don't have to have huge investments in software development. They get a solution. They plug it and that solve a specific problem for them. When you think about the industrial space, now we are again, with much lower volume, margins. But now we're integrating our LiDAR, radar, other things that Glen will, of course, talk about as we move forward.

因此，他們不必在軟體開發上進行大量投資。他們得到了解決方案。他們將其堵住，這為他們解決了一個特定的問題。當你考慮工業領域時，我們現在的產量和利潤率又低得多。但現在我們正在整合我們的光達、雷達和其他東西，當然，格倫會在我們前進的過程中談論這些東西。

And significant more amount of software, but it's a full-blown solution that you could strap this thing on to a drone or strap this thing on to a military vehicle, and it could do autonomous [radars]. So we have, in my opinion, broadened through all three segments. In each segment, we are offering higher and higher value proposition.

雖然軟體數量更多，但這是一個成熟的解決方案，你可以把它綁在無人機或軍用車輛上，它可以自主[雷達]。因此，我認為我們已經拓展了所有三個領域。在每個領域，我們都提供越來越高的價值主張。

So we are transitioning towards more of a software solutions company based on our hardware from LiDAR, but also the capability of integrating other hardware from radar and other technologies into a few system that we can provide to the military and to industry. So I think our differentiation is naturally happening because the strength of our team in developing software is going to be highlighted more and more.

因此，我們正在轉型成為一家基於 LiDAR 硬體的軟體解決方案公司，同時也能夠將雷達和其他技術的其他硬體整合到我們可以提供給軍事和工業的幾個系統中。所以我認為我們的差異化是自然而然發生的，因為我們團隊在軟體開發方面的優勢將越來越凸顯。

We're going to talk about partnerships that we are enabling. It's not just because of our LiDAR and competitive price. It's our LiDAR competitive price and the software what it enables for folks. Glen, do you want to add something to this?

我們將討論我們正在建立的合作夥伴關係。這不僅僅是因為我們的 LiDAR 和具有競爭力的價格。我們的 LiDAR 具有競爭力的價格，而且軟體能夠為人們提供便利。格倫，你想補充一點嗎？

I think you really said it well, Sumit. And depending on the end market, we have the right solution. We're a high-performance LiDAR sensor for the automotive space. And on the other extreme, where we can provide the complete not just the LiDAR perception, but multimodal perception, the full localization and environmental mapping as well as features on top. And it's -- what's really impressive is that we have those assets across the entire company.

我認為你說得非常好，Sumit。根據最終市場，我們有正確的解決方案。我們是汽車領域的高性能 LiDAR 感測器。而在另一個極端，我們不僅可以提供完整的 LiDAR 感知，還可以提供多模式感知、完整的定位和環境映射以及頂層功能。真正令人印象深刻的是，我們整個公司都擁有這些資產。

And so we can -- we're not having to develop that from ground up. We're really just having to integrate and apply it. And so I'm really excited about what we'll be able to do across all of those verticals with the technology that we have.

因此我們可以——我們不必從頭開始開發它。我們實際上只是需要整合並應用它。因此，我對於我們能夠利用現有的技術在所有這些垂直領域中所取得的成就感到非常興奮。

Thanks, Glen. Next question. Why is MicroVision asking for more shares? Why are you asking for more shares when approved shares before with the promise that it was needed to show OEMs we had financial stability, but we never got deals. Why should investors vote to approve another 200 million more shares when no meaningful deals have been announced in the last four years?

謝謝，格倫。下一個問題。MicroVision 為何要求增發股份？為什麼在之前批准股份時要求增加股份，並承諾需要向 OEM 證明我們的財務穩定性，但我們從未達成交易。在過去四年中沒有宣布任何有意義的交易的情況下，投資者為什麼要投票批准再增發 2 億股股票？

Yeah, I'll start with that, and Anubhav, perhaps you can help me on this one. So I think there are certain tools that the company needs to be able to work with our partners. And as I've said multiple times, and this is not the first earnings call I shared this, that the concern that obviously is coming up is the long-term viability of the company. Now if you go back to my prepared remarks, right, I tried to highlight that in there to give context, our competition, they raised a significant more capital because they went public with the de-SPAC. All along the way, we've been just raising as little as possible as we go forward.

是的，我就從那開始，Anubhav，也許你能在這件事上幫助我。因此我認為公司需要某些工具才能與我們的合作夥伴合作。正如我多次說過的，這不是我第一次在財報電話會議上分享這一點，顯然人們關注的問題是公司的長期生存能力。現在，如果你回顧我準備好的發言，對的，我試圖強調這一點，為了提供背景信息，我們的競爭對手，他們籌集了更多的資金，因為他們通過 de-SPAC 上市。一路走來，我們一直盡可能少地籌集資金。

So I know like the investors would love to hear like how are we being competitive, but capital matters because most of the customers, especially in the automotive, they expect you to invest $20 million, $25 million of your money while they have zero risk to get to some level of production and then have all the risk on top of that.

所以我知道投資者很想知道我們如何具有競爭力，但資本很重要，因為大多數客戶，特別是汽車行業的客戶，他們希望你投資 2000 萬美元、2500 萬美元，而他們卻沒有風險達到一定的生產水平，然後承擔所有風險。

So if you don't have the cash on hand, like some of our competition did, it has always been hard for us to convince them that we have viability that we have the support, that we have an anchor customer. And since our investor base is so diverse, it's really hard for us to point that, yeah, we have an investor that can actually come in and support us and somebody with a high reputation. I think Anubhav has done a great job to like try to get us to that point. We started with UBS.

因此，如果你手頭上沒有現金，就像我們的一些競爭對手那樣，我們就很難讓他們相信我們有生存能力，我們有支持，我們有主力客戶。由於我們的投資者群體非常多元化，我們很難指出，是的，我們有一位投資者可以真正進來支持我們，並且是一位享有盛譽的人。我認為 Anubhav 已經做了很大的努力來幫助我們達到這一點。我們從瑞銀開始。

That did not happen. Deutsche Bank has been helping us a lot. And now if you think about High Trail, I think we've done everything humanly possible to give them the confidence that we have anchor customer -- anchor investors that can step in at the right moment for any kind of deal because to get the deal done, it's not about technology, I can assure you that. It would be very hard for me to attract somebody like Glen to the company if it was like a big gap in technology or what magical things that can be built on top of what we already have. I think our problem has always been that they have to have a high confidence the company is going to survive for a period of time to execute on these and be able to expand the revenue base faster than other LiDAR companies.

但那並沒有發生。德意志銀行給了我們很大的幫助。現在如果你想想 High Trail，我想我們已經盡了一切努力讓他們相信我們擁有基石客戶——基石投資者，他們可以在適當的時機介入任何交易，因為要完成交易，與技術無關，我可以向你保證。如果技術上存在巨大差距，或者在現有基礎上還能創造出什麼神奇的東西，那麼我很難吸引像格倫這樣的人加入公司。我認為我們的問題一直是，他們必須高度相信公司能夠在一段時間內生存下來，從而實現這些目標，並且能夠比其他 LiDAR 公司更快地擴大收入基礎。

So to support that, the company needs certain tools. I think management is with a very close counsel with our Board of Directors, we've come up with what we believe is what we need as tools to go forward.

因此，為了支持這一點，公司需要某些工具。我認為管理層與董事會進行了非常密切的磋商，我們已經提出了我們認為前進所需的工具。

Yeah. And I think, Sumit, to add to the point, obviously, 200 million more shares doesn't mean that we're going to use those shares right away. It's more of an optics as well because when you are competing in defense contracts and big contracts, people would like to see the authorized capital, the number of outstanding shares as a percentage of your authorized capital to be some significant numbers. And I think we believe that $200 million would get us there. But I think I would just like to summarize four things that why now $200 million, right?

是的。我認為，Sumit，需要補充的是，顯然，增加 2 億股並不意味著我們會立即使用這些股票。這更像是一種視覺效果，因為當你在競爭國防合約和大合約時，人們希望看到授權資本，即流通股數佔授權資本的百分比是一些重要的數字。我認為我們相信 2 億美元可以讓我們實現這一目標。但我想我只想總結四件事，為什麼現在是 2 億美元，對嗎？

I'd like to point out for the last seven, eight months, look at our consistently heavy trading volume. What that signifies is the visibility of MicroVision on not just retail, but institutional radar screens. That sort of depicts the momentum that we already have generated, which is the most significant momentum that this company has ever seen in its recent history. Number two, in the last seven months, we had a $90 million investment commitment from one single investor. And I think you can count on fingers how many other companies have been able to do that.

我想指出的是，過去七、八個月，我們的交易量一直很高。這意味著 MicroVision 不僅在零售領域，而且在機構雷達螢幕上都具有可見性。這在某種程度上描述了我們已經產生的勢頭，這是該公司近代歷史上見過的最強勁的勢頭。第二，在過去的七個月裡，我們從一位投資者那裡獲得了 9,000 萬美元的投資承諾。我想，你可以數得出來有多少其他公司能夠做到這一點。

Number three, the quality of people who have joined MicroVision's executive team as well as the Defense Advisory Board, that tells you that this is the time when people are looking to go all chips in and believe in the future of the company. That itself is very significant of why the 200 million shares would get us to the stature of competing with the big boys.

第三，加入 MicroVision 執行團隊以及國防顧問委員會的人員素質表明，現在是人們願意全力投入並相信公司未來的時候了。這本身就非常重要，為什麼 2 億股能讓我們達到與大公司競爭的地位。

And I think the last thing is what I would say is this is more of an optics, which is a direct corollary of the first -- or the first three factors is what I can just say is the Investor Day event, we had to double our capacity since two years event -- since two years ago. That shows the interest of people interested in MicroVision. And that's just retail.

我認為最後要說的是，這更像是一種光學現象，它是第一點或前三個因素的直接推論，我只能說，在投資者日活動中，我們必須將產能自兩年前的活動以來翻倍。這顯示了人們對 MicroVision 的興趣。這只是零售業。

We have the second half of the day, lined up with quality financial institutions joining us to know more about MicroVision. So that highlights the visibility that MicroVision has generated and the momentum that we have seen in the past 12 to 15 months, which is incredibly positive. And obviously, given the geopolitics that we are seeing usher in across the globe. So that's why I feel more confident and why this 200 million share authorization would get us in that lead. We're running out of time.

我們有下半天的時間，與優質金融機構一起加入我們，以了解更多有關 MicroVision 的資訊。這凸顯了 MicroVision 所產生的知名度以及我們在過去 12 到 15 個月中看到的勢頭，這是非常積極的。顯然，考慮到我們目前看到的全球地緣政治情勢。這就是為什麼我感到更有自信，以及為什麼這 2 億股授權能讓我們領先。我們的時間不多了。

So maybe one last question. Sumit, what to expect on the Investor Day next week?

所以也許還有最後一個問題。Sumit，下週的投資人日有什麼期待嗎？

I think it's kind of important that I think CES has not been really that super expensive, and it's not really been easy for us to connect with our investors and analysts. So we decided that we're going to actually host it here annually about the same time. And it's, again, a great opportunity for us to show all the stuff we spend money, what we have created and what customers are going to align to.

我認為 CES 並不是特別昂貴，這一點很重要，而且我們與投資者和分析師的聯繫並不容易。因此我們決定每年大約在同一時間在這裡舉辦這項活動。這對我們來說又是一個絕佳的機會，可以展示我們花費的所有金錢、我們創造的一切以及客戶將關注的一切。

So without talking directly about any specific customers we've not announced, you can get a really good idea of where our technology is going to be deployed and ask specific questions, so you get confidence in the product portfolio. We certainly are also going to talk about our future plans with all our products.

因此，無需直接談論我們尚未公佈的任何具體客戶，您就可以很好地了解我們的技術將在何處部署，並提出具體問題，從而對產品組合充滿信心。我們當然也會談論我們所有產品的未來計劃。

Again, given the context that Anubhav has said that we're not expecting our cash expenses to increase, we're going to run it tight. It will be a good opportunity to really understand how we're going to manage that and still create value. And of course, longer term, I think we get a lot of questions from our investors all the time. And to be honest, right, even on our earnings call, it's very hard to address them because sometimes they're kind of out of context. They're more conversational.

再一次，鑑於 Anubhav 所說的我們預期現金支出不會增加，我們將會嚴格控制開支。這將是一個很好的機會，讓我們真正了解我們將如何管理這一點並創造價值。當然，從長遠來看，我認為我們一直都會收到許多投資者的問題。說實話，即使在我們的收益電話會議上，也很難解決這些問題，因為有時它們有點脫離背景。他們更善於交談。

So our intention is to have a session like we did last time where ask us anything and if we can answer it in a public forum that we've covered in the previous earnings call, we will absolutely do it. And so we're going to have a more direct dialogue so you have a clear understanding of what we're facing and where we're headed with it. So look forward to meeting you all again next week.

因此，我們的目的是像上次一樣舉行一次會議，在會議上您可以提出任何問題，如果我們可以在上次收益電話會議上討論過的公共論壇上回答您的問題，我們絕對會這樣做。因此，我們將進行更直接的對話，以便您清楚地了解我們面臨的問題以及我們的發展方向。期待下週再次與大家見面。

Thank you, Sumit. With this, I would like to wrap our first quarter earnings call. Thank you again, everybody, for joining us. We look forward to seeing you next week.

謝謝你，Sumit。至此，我想結束我們的第一季財報電話會議。再次感謝大家加入我們。我們期待下週見到您。

Thank you. This concludes today's conference. All parties may disconnect, and have a great day.

謝謝。今天的會議到此結束。各方均可斷開連接，並度過美好的一天。