Kirby Corp (KEX) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good day and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Kirby Corporation 2025 first quarter earnings conference call.

您好，感謝您的支持。歡迎參加 Kirby Corporation 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。

(Operator Instructions) Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to your first speaker today, Kurt Niemietz, Vice President of Investor Relations and Treasurer. Please go ahead.

（操作員指示）請注意，今天的會議正在錄音。現在，我想將會議交給今天的第一位發言者，投資者關係副總裁兼財務主管 Kurt Niemietz。請繼續。

Good morning, and thank you for joining the Kirby Corporation 2025 first quarter earnings call. With me today are David Grzebinski, Kirby's Chief Executive Officer; Raj Kumar, Kirby's Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer; and Christian O'Neil, Kirby's President and Chief Operating Officer. A slide presentation for today's conference call as well as the earnings release, which was issued earlier today can be found on our website.

早安，感謝您參加 Kirby Corporation 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。今天和我一起的還有 Kirby 的執行長 David Grzebinski； Kirby 執行副總裁兼財務長 Raj Kumar；以及 Kirby 總裁兼營運長 Christian O'Neil。今天的電話會議的幻燈片演示以及今天早些時候發布的收益報告可以在我們的網站上找到。

During this conference call, we may refer to certain non-GAAP or adjusted financial measures. Reconciliations of the non-GAAP financial measures to the most directly comparable GAAP financial measures are included in our earnings press release and are also available on our website in the Investor Relations section under Financials.

在本次電話會議中，我們可能會參考某些非公認會計準則或調整後的財務指標。非 GAAP 財務指標與最直接可比較的 GAAP 財務指標的對帳包含在我們的收益新聞稿中，也可在我們網站的「財務」下的「投資者關係」部分中找到。

As a reminder, statements contained in this conference call with respect to the future are forward-looking statements. These statements reflect management's reasonable judgment with respect to future events. Forward-looking statements involve risks and uncertainties, and our actual results could differ materially from those anticipated as a result of various factors. A list of these factors can be found in Kirby's latest Form 10-K and in our other filings made with the SEC from time to time.

提醒一下，本次電話會議有關未來的陳述均為前瞻性陳述。這些聲明反映了管理階層對未來事件的合理判斷。前瞻性陳述涉及風險和不確定性，由於各種因素，我們的實際結果可能與預期結果有重大差異。這些因素的清單可以在 Kirby 最新的 10-K 表格以及我們不時向 SEC 提交的其他文件中找到。

I will now turn the call over to David.

現在我將把電話轉給大衛。

Thank you, Kurt, and good morning, everyone. Earlier today, we announced first quarter earnings per share of $1.33, which compares to 2024 first quarter earnings of $1.19 per share.

謝謝你，庫爾特，大家早安。今天早些時候，我們宣布第一季每股收益為 1.33 美元，而 2024 年第一季每股收益為 1.19 美元。

Our first quarter results reflected improved market fundamentals in marine transportation and continued strong demand for power generation and distribution and services. These positive trends were partially offset by weather and navigational challenges in marine and continued supply delays in distribution and services. Overall, our combined businesses performed well during the core.

我們第一季的業績反映了海運市場基本面的改善以及對發電、配電和服務的持續強勁需求。但這些正面趨勢因海上天氣和航行挑戰以及分銷和服務持續供應延遲而被部分抵消。總體而言，我們的合併業務在核心期間表現良好。

In inland marine transportation, our first quarter results were considerably impacted by delay days. Throughout the quarter, our operations were challenged by winter storms, high winds, and fog across the Gulf Coast, as well as lock delays throughout the system. These weather and navigational issues slowed transit times and impacted the financial performance of our contracts of freight.

在內陸海運方面，我們的第一季業績受到延誤天數的顯著影響。整個季度，我們的營運面臨著墨西哥灣沿岸冬季風暴、大風和霧氣以及整個系統的鎖定延誤的挑戰。這些天氣和航行問題減慢了運輸時間並影響了我們的貨運合約的財務表現。

Overall, delay days increased 50% compared to the fourth quarter of 2024 and 15% from a year ago period. Despite these increases and delays, market conditions have improved from the fourth quarter due to better customer demand and limited barge availability, which contributed to favorable price improvements.

總體而言，延誤天數與 2024 年第四季相比增加了 50%，與去年同期相比增加了 15%。儘管存在這些增加和延誤，但由於客戶需求增加和駁船供應有限，市場狀況從第四季度開始改善，促進了價格的有利上漲。

From a demand standpoint, customer activity was strong in the quarter, with barge utilization rates running in the low to mid-90% range throughout the quarter. Spot prices were up in the low single digits sequentially and in the high single digits year over year. Term contract prices also renewed up higher with mid-single digit increases versus a year ago. Overall, margins for inland marine were right around 20% despite the poor operating conditions.

從需求角度來看，本季客戶活動強勁，整個季度駁船利用率都在 90% 左右。現貨價格較上月上漲低個位數，較去年同期上漲高個位數。定期合約價格也出現上漲，與去年同期相比上漲了中等個位數。總體而言，儘管經營狀況不佳，內陸航運的利潤率仍在 20% 左右。

In coastal marine market fundamentals remain steady with our barge utilization levels running in the mid to high 90% range. During the quarter, we saw continued strength in customer demand and limited availability of large capacity vessels, which resulted in mid-20% range price increases on term contract renewals.

沿海海運市場基本面保持穩定，我們的駁船利用率約 90%。本季度，我們看到客戶需求持續強勁，但大容量船舶供應有限，導致定期合約續約價格上漲 20% 左右。

Our planned shipyard maintenance on several large vessels that we mentioned last quarter continues to wind down, but was a headwind to coastal revenue and margins during the quarter. Overall, first quarter coastal revenues decreased 6% year over year, and operating margins were in the high single to low double digit range.

我們上個季度提到的幾艘大型船舶的船廠維護計畫正在逐步減少，但這對本季的沿海收入和利潤率造成了阻力。整體而言，第一季沿海地區營收年減 6%，營業利潤率處於高個位數至低兩位數範圍內。

Turning to distribution and services, demand was mixed across our end markets, with growth in some areas offset by softness or delays in other areas. In power generation, revenues were down 23% year over year as supply delays pushed some projects out of the quarter. However, the pace of inbound orders was strong, adding to our backlog with continued project wins from backup power and other industrial customers as the need for power remains critical.

談到分銷和服務，我們終端市場的需求好壞參半，一些地區的成長被其他地區的疲軟或延遲所抵消。在發電方面，由於供應延遲導致一些項目無法在本季度完成，收入比去年同期下降了 23%。然而，由於電力需求仍然至關重要，訂單流入速度強勁，並繼續贏得備用電源和其他工業客戶的項目，從而增加了我們的積壓訂單。

In oil and gas, even though a very soft conventional oil and gas business pushed revenues down 18% year over year, operating income was up 123% year over year, driven by e-frac and cost management initiatives.

在石油和天然氣領域，儘管非常疲軟的傳統石油和天然氣業務導致營收年減 18%，但在電子壓裂和成本管理措施的推動下，營業收入年增 123%。

In our commercial and industrial market, revenues grew 6% sequentially and 12% year-over-year, driven by growth in marine repair activity, while operating income was up 23% year-over-year due to favorable product mix and ongoing cost control initiatives.

在我們的商業和工業市場，受船舶維修活動成長的推動，收入環比增長 6%，同比增長 12%，而由於良好的產品組合和持續的成本控制舉措，營業收入同比增長 23%。

In summary, our first quarter results reflected continued strength and market fundamentals for both segments, despite meaningful weather impacts and supply delays. The inland market is strong and market conditions continue to support higher rates. In coastal industry-wide supply and demand dynamics remain favorable. Our large utilization is good, and we are realizing real rate increases. And distribution and services, strong demand for power gen is mostly offsetting weakness in oil and gas and in other areas.

綜上所述，儘管受到天氣影響和供應延遲的影響，但我們第一季的業績仍反映出兩個部門的持續強勁和市場基本面。內陸市場強勁，市場條件繼續支持更高的利率。沿海地區全行業供需情勢依然良好。我們的大量利用是件好事，而且我們正在實現實際利率的成長。而分銷和服務方面，對發電的強勁需求基本上抵消了石油、天然氣和其他領域的疲軟。

I'll talk more about our outlook later, but first I'll turn the call over to Raj to discuss the first quarter segment results and the balance sheet.

我稍後會詳細談論我們的展望，但首先我會將電話轉給 Raj，討論第一季的分部業績和資產負債表。

Thank you, David, and good morning, everyone.

謝謝你，大衛，大家早安。

In the first quarter of 2025, marine transportation segment revenues were $476 million and operating income was $87 million with an operating margin of 18.2%. Total marine revenues inland and coastal together was steady as compared to the first quarter of 2024, and operating income increased $3.6 million or 4%. Compared to the fourth quarter of 2024, total marine revenues increased 2% and operating income increased 1%.

2025年第一季度，海運部門營收為4.76億美元，營業收入為8,700萬美元，營業利益率為18.2%。與 2024 年第一季相比，內陸和沿海的海運總收入保持穩定，營業收入增加了 360 萬美元，增幅為 4%。與 2024 年第四季相比，海運總收入成長 2%，營業收入成長 1%。

As David mentioned, fog and high winds along the Gulf Coast produced a 50% sequential increase in delay days that impacted operations and efficiency in inland, while planned shipyard activity impacted the coastal marine business. This was offset by solid underlying customer demand, improved pricing, and most importantly, execution.

正如大衛所提到的，墨西哥灣沿岸的霧和強風導致延誤天數連續增加 50%，影響了內陸的運作和效率，而計劃中的造船廠活動則影響了沿海海洋業務。但這一差距被穩固的潛在客戶需求、改進的定價以及最重要的執行力所抵消。

Looking at the inland business in more detail. The inland business contributed approximately 82% of segment revenue. Average barge utilization was in the low to mid 90% range for the quarter, which was better than the utilization scene in the fourth quarter of 2024.

更詳細地了解內陸業務。內陸業務貢獻了分部收入的約82%。本季駁船平均利用率在 90% 左右，優於 2024 年第四季的使用率。

Long-term inland marine transportation contracts, or those contracts with a term of one year or longer, contributed approximately 70% of revenue, with 61% from time charters and 39% from contracts of a freight man.

長期內河運輸合約（即期限為一年或一年以上的合約）貢獻了約 70% 的收入，其中 61% 來自定期租船合同，39% 來自貨運合約。

Improved market conditions contributed to spot market rates increasing sequentially in the low single digits and in the high single digit range year over year. Term contracts that renewed during the first quarter were up on average in the mid-single digits compared to the prior year.

市場條件改善導致現貨市場運價較上月分別以低個位數和高個位數的幅度較去年同期上漲。第一季續簽的定期合約數量與去年同期相比平均上漲了中等個位數。

Compared to the first quarter of 2024, inland revenues increased 2%, primarily due to higher utilization and pricing, offsetting the negative impacts of higher delay days. Inland revenues increased 3% compared to the fourth quarter of 2024, despite unfavorable weather-related conditions. Even with the difficult weather conditions, inland operating margins improved year by year driven by the impact of higher pricing and continued cost management, which helped stave off lingering inflationary pressures.

與 2024 年第一季相比，國內收入成長了 2%，這主要是由於利用率和定價提高，抵消了延誤天數增加的負面影響。儘管天氣條件不利，但國內收入與 2024 年第四季相比仍成長了 3%。儘管天氣條件惡劣，但受價格上漲和持續成本管理的影響，內陸地區營業利潤率逐年提高，有助於緩解持續的通膨壓力。

Now I'll move on to the coastal business. Coastal revenues decreased 6% year-over-year due to the higher number of shipyards in the quarter. The impact from these higher shipyards was felt throughout the quarter, but is beginning to wind down in the second quarter.

現在我要談沿海業務。由於本季造船廠數量增加，沿海收入年減 6%。這些較高造船廠的影響在整個季度都有所體現，但在第二季開始逐漸減弱。

Overall, coastal had an operating margin right around 10% as shipyards were partially offset by higher pricing and cost leverage. The coastal business represented 18% of revenues for the marine transportation segment. Average coastal barge utilization was in the mid to high 90% range, which is in line with the first quarter of 2024.

總體而言，沿海地區的營業利潤率約為 10%，因為造船廠的利潤被更高的定價和成本槓桿部分抵消。沿海業務佔海上運輸部門收入的18%。沿海駁船平均利用率在 90% 左右，與 2024 年第一季持平。

During the quarter, the percentage of coastal revenue on the term contracts was approximately 100%, of which approximately 100% were time charters. Renewal of term contracts were on average approximately 25% higher year over year. And we also noted that average spot market rates were up in the mid-single digit sequentially and around 20% year over year.

本季度，沿海定期合約收入佔比約為 100%，其中約 100% 為定期租船。定期合約的續約量較去年同期高出約 25%。我們還注意到，現貨市場平均價格環比上漲了中等個位數，年比上漲了 20% 左右。

With respect to our tank barge fleet for both the inland and coastal businesses, we have provided a reconciliation of the changes in the first quarter, as well as projections for 2025. This is included in our earnings call presentation posted on our website.

對於我們用於內陸和沿海業務的油駁船隊，我們提供了第一季的變化調節以及 2025 年的預測。這包含在我們網站上發布的收益電話會議簡報中。

At the end of the first quarter, the inland fleet had just over 1,100 barges representing 24.6 million barrels of capacity. And includes the newly acquired badges we announced today. We expect to end 2025 with a total of 1,117 inland barges representing 24.8 million barrels of capacity. Coastal marine is expected to remain unchanged for the year.

第一季末，內陸船隊擁有 1,100 餘艘駁船，運力達 2,460 萬桶。其中包括我們今天宣布的新獲得的徽章。我們預計到 2025 年底，內陸駁船總數將達到 1,117 艘，運力達到 2,480 萬桶。預計全年沿海海洋狀況將保持不變。

Now, I'll review the performance of the distribution and services segment. Revenues for the first quarter of 2025 were $310 million with operating income of $23 million and an operating margin of 7.3%. Compared to the first quarter of 2024, the distribution and services segments of revenue decrease by 7%, while operating income increased by approximately 3%. When compared to the fourth quarter of 2024, revenue decreased by $26 million and operating income decreased by $4 million.

現在，我將回顧一下分銷和服務部門的表現。2025 年第一季的營收為 3.1 億美元，營業收入為 2,300 萬美元，營業利潤率為 7.3%。與2024年第一季相比，分銷和服務部門的收入下降了7%，而營業收入則增加了約3%。與 2024 年第四季相比，營收減少 2,600 萬美元，營業收入減少 400 萬美元。

In power generation, revenues decreased 23% year over year as supply delays pushed some projects out of the quarter. Despite power generation revenues being down, we saw continued orders from data centers and other industrial customers for power generation and backup power installations. This contributed to a very healthy backlog of power generation projects. Power generation operating income was down 39% year by year, given the supply delays and had an operating margin in the mid to high single digits. Power generation represented 34% of total segment revenues.

在發電方面，由於供應延遲導致一些項目無法在本季度完成，收入年減了 23%。儘管發電收入下降，但我們看到資料中心和其他工業客戶對發電和備用電源裝置的訂單持續增加。這導致發電項目積壓量非常大。由於供電延遲，發電營業收入較去年同期下降39%，營業利潤率處於中高個位數。發電業務佔該部門總收入的34%。

On the commercial and industrial side, growth in marine repair offset lower activity levels in our on-highway and thermal king business driven by the ongoing trucking recession. As a result, commercial and industrial revenues were up 12% year-over-year and operating income increased 23% year over year driven by favorable product mix and ongoing cost savings initiatives. Commercial and industrial made up 52% of segment revenues with operating margins in the high single digits.

在商業和工業方面，船舶修理業務的成長抵消了持續的卡車運輸衰退導致的公路和熱力王業務活動水準下降。因此，在良好的產品組合和持續的成本節約措施的推動下，商業和工業收入較去年同期成長 12%，營業收入較去年同期成長 23%。商業和工業業務佔該部門收入的 52%，營業利潤率達到高個位數。

Compared to the fourth quarter of 2024, commercial and industrial revenues increased 6% as increased activity in marine repair was partially offset by softness in trucking -- in the trucking-related businesses. Operating income was up 13% over the same period driven by favorable product mix.

與 2024 年第四季相比，商業和工業收入成長了 6%，因為船舶修理活動的增加被卡車運輸（卡車運輸相關業務）的疲軟部分抵消。受良好產品組合的推動，營業收入較同期成長了 13%。

In the oil and gas market, we continue to see softness in conventional frac-related equipment as low recounts and tampered demand for new engines, transmissions, and parts throughout the quarter. This softness is being partially offset by execution and backlog for orders of e-frac equipment. This dynamic caused revenue to drop 17% sequentially and 18% year over year.

在石油和天然氣市場，我們繼續看到傳統壓裂相關設備的疲軟，因為整個季度的重新計算和對新引擎、變速箱和零件的需求受到抑制。這種疲軟被電子壓裂設備訂單的執行和積壓部分抵消。這種動態導致營收季減 17%，年減 18%。

However, despite the drop in revenues, operating income was up 7% sequentially and 123% year over year, driven by our e-frac business and cost management initiatives. Oil and gas represented 14% of segment revenue in the first quarter and had operating margins in the high single digits.

然而，儘管收入下降，但在我們的電子壓裂業務和成本管理措施的推動下，營業收入較上季成長 7%，較去年同期成長 123%。石油和天然氣業務佔第一季部門收入的 14%，營業利潤率達到高個位數。

Now I move on to the balance sheet. As of March 31, we had $51 million of cash with total debt of around $1.1 billion, and our net debt to EBITDA was just under 1.5 times. During the quarter, we had net cash flow from operating activities of $36.5 million.

現在我來看一下資產負債表。截至 3 月 31 日，我們擁有 5,100 萬美元現金，總債務約 11 億美元，淨債務與 EBITDA 比率略低於 1.5 倍。本季度，我們的營業活動淨現金流為 3,650 萬美元。

First quarter cash flow from operations was impacted by a working capital build of approximately $122 million. Driven by the underlying growth in in the business in advance of projects, especially in the power generation space. We expect to unwind some of this working capital as the year progresses.

第一季的經營現金流受到約 1.22 億美元營運資本累積的影響。受專案前期業務潛在成長的推動，尤其是在發電領域。我們預計隨著時間的推移，我們將釋放部分營運資金。

We use cash flow and cash on hand to fund $79 million of capital expenditures or CapEx, primarily related to maintenance of equipment. Additionally, as announced, we used $97.3 million to acquire some equipment from an undisclosed seller that comprised 14 barges, including 4 specialty barges and 4 high horsepower river boats.

我們使用現金流量和現金來資助 7,900 萬美元的資本支出或 CapEx，主要用於設備維護。此外，正如所宣布的，我們使用了 9,730 萬美元從一位未公開的賣家那裡購買了一些設備，其中包括 14 艘駁船，其中包括 4 艘特種駁船和 4 艘大馬力河船。

During the quarter, we also used $101.5 million to repurchase stock at an average price just over $101. Our repurchases have continued in the second quarter with another $23 million at an average price of $91.18 as of April 30. As of March 31, we had total available liquidity of approximately $334 million.

本季度，我們還使用了 1.015 億美元以平均略高於 101 美元的價格回購股票。我們在第二季繼續回購，截至 4 月 30 日，回購金額達 2,300 萬美元，平均價格為 91.18 美元。截至 3 月 31 日，我們可用的流動資金總額約為 3.34 億美元。

We are on track to generate cash flow from operations of $620 million to $720 million on higher revenues than EBITDA for 2025. We still see some supply constraints, posing some headwinds to managing working capital in the near term. Having said that, we expect to unwind this working capital as orders shift in 2025 and beyond.

我們預計在 2025 年實現 6.2 億至 7.2 億美元的營運現金流，營收將高於 EBITDA。我們仍然看到一些供應限制，這對短期內管理營運資金構成一些阻力。話雖如此，我們預計隨著 2025 年及以後訂單的變化，我們將解除這筆營運資金。

With respect to CapEx, we continue to expect capital spending to range between $280 million and $320 million for the year. Approximately $180 million to $220 million is associated with marine maintenance capital and improvements to existing inland and coastal marine equipment and facility improvements.

關於資本支出，我們繼續預期今年的資本支出將在 2.8 億至 3.2 億美元之間。約 1.8 億至 2.2 億美元用於海洋維護資本以及現有內陸和沿海海洋設備和設施的改進。

Approximately $100 million is associated with growth capital spending in both of our businesses and could be deferred depending on economic conditions. As always, we are committed to a balanced capital allocation approach and we'll use this cash flow to opportunistically return capital to shareholders and continue to pursue long term value creating value creating investment and acquisition opportunities.

約有 1 億美元與我們兩項業務的成長資本支出有關，並且可能會根據經濟狀況而推遲。像往常一樣，我們致力於平衡的資本配置方法，我們將利用這種現金流機會性地向股東返還資本，並繼續尋求長期創造價值的投資和收購機會。

I will now turn the call back over to David to discuss the remainder of our outlook for 2025.

現在我將把電話轉回給大衛，討論我們對 2025 年剩餘前景的展望。

Thank you, Raj. We're off to a solid start in 2025. While recent macro events have created some near-term uncertainty in places, we continue to see favorable fundamentals as the year progresses.

謝謝你，拉傑。2025 年，我們將有一個好的開始。儘管最近的宏觀事件在某些地方造成了一些短期不確定性，但隨著時間的推移，我們仍然看到有利的基本面。

Our current outlook in the marine market remains strong for the full year. Refinery activity is at high levels. Our barge utilization is strong in both inland and coastal. And rates continue to increase. And distribution and services, we are seeing strong demand for our power generation products and services, and we continue to receive new orders in manufacturing, both of which are helping to soften the decline in our oil and gas markets. Overall, we expect our businesses to deliver improving financial results as we move through the remainder of 2025.

我們對全年海洋市場的前景依然看好。煉油廠活動處於高水準。我們的駁船利用率在內陸和沿海地區都很高。而且利率還在持續上升。在分銷和服務方面，我們看到市場對發電產品和服務的需求強勁，並且我們繼續收到製造業的新訂單，這兩者都有助於緩解石油和天然氣市場的下滑。整體而言，我們預計我們的業務在 2025 年剩餘時間內將會取得更好的財務表現。

In Inland Marine, we anticipate positive market dynamics due to limited new barge construction in the industry combined with steady customer demand. With these strong market conditions, we expect our barge utilization rates to be in the low to mid 90% range throughout the year. Overall, inland revenues are expected to grow in the mid to high single digit range on a full year basis.

在內陸航運方面，由於業界新駁船建造數量有限，且客戶需求穩定，我們預期市場動態將呈現正面狀況。在強勁的市場條件下，我們預計全年駁船利用率將維持在 90% 左右。整體而言，預計全年國內收入將實現中高個位數成長。

However, I need to give the normal cautionary points. A potential tariff-induced recession or unforeseen changes in trade flows could cause a drop in demand, which would impact expected growth. That said, for now, we see revenues growing as planned and expect operating margins will gradually improve during the year from the first quarters levels and average around 200 to 300 basis points higher on a full year basis.

不過，我需要給出正常的警告點。潛在的關稅引發的經濟衰退或貿易流量的不可預見的變化可能會導致需求下降，從而影響預期的成長。儘管如此，就目前而言，我們看到收入按計劃增長，並預計年內營業利潤率將從第一季的水平逐步提高，全年平均提高約 200 至 300 個基點。

In coastal, market conditions remain solid, and the supply of vessels is favorable across the industry. Strong customer demand is expected throughout the remainder of the year with our barge utilization in the mid 90% range.

在沿海地區，市場狀況依然穩健，整個產業的船舶供應良好。預計今年剩餘時間內客戶需求將保持強勁，我們的駁船利用率將達到 90% 左右。

With the number of shipyard days declining and essentially 100% of the coastal fleet on term contracts, we expect a significant step up in revenues and margins through the remainder of the year. For all of 2025, we expect revenues to increase in the high single to low double digit range compared to 2024. Coastal operating margins are expected to improve to the mid-teens range on a full year basis.

隨著船廠作業天數的減少以及基本上 100% 的沿海船隊都簽訂了定期合同，我們預計今年剩餘時間內的收入和利潤將大幅增加。我們預計，2025 年全年的收入將比 2024 年成長高個位數至低兩位數。預計沿海地區全年營業利潤率將提高至十五六成左右。

In the distribution and services segment, we still see mixed results as dear term volatility driven by supply issues, customers deferring maintenance, and lower overall levels of activity in oil, gas partially being offset by orders for power gen.

在分銷和服務領域，我們仍然看到好壞參半的結果，因為供應問題導致的長期波動、客戶推遲維護以及石油、天然氣整體活動水平的下降被發電訂單部分抵消。

In commercial and industrial, the demand outlook and marine repair remains steady while on highway service and repair remains weak. In oil and gas, we expect revenues to be down in the high single to low double digit range as the shift away from conventional frac to e-frac continues to take place and customers continue to maintain considerable capital discipline.

在商業和工業領域，需求前景和船舶維修保持穩定，而公路服務和維修仍然疲軟。在石油和天然氣領域，我們預計收入將下降個位數至兩位數的低位，因為從傳統壓裂到電子壓裂的轉變仍在繼續，而且客戶繼續保持嚴格的資本紀律。

And power generation, we anticipate continued strong growth in orders as data center demand and the need for backup power is very strong. We expect extended lead times for certain OEM products to continue and it will contribute to volatility in the delivery schedule of new products throughout 2025.

對於發電而言，我們預計訂單將繼續強勁成長，因為資料中心的需求和備用電源的需求非常強勁。我們預計某些 OEM 產品的交貨時間將持續延長，這將導致 2025 年全年新產品交付時間表的波動。

Overall, we expect total segment revenues to be flat to slightly down on a full year basis with operating margins in the high single digits, but very slightly lower than they were a year ago.

整體而言，我們預計全年總分部收入將持平或略有下降，營業利潤率將達到高個位數，但略低於去年同期。

To conclude, we're off to a solid start in 2025 and have a favorable outlook for the remainder of the year. Our balance sheet is strong, and we expect to generate significant free cash flow despite high levels of CapEx this year.

總而言之，我們在 2025 年取得了良好的開端，並對今年剩餘時間的前景持樂觀態度。我們的資產負債表強勁，儘管今年的資本支出水準很高，但我們預計仍將產生大量自由現金流。

Absent acquisitions, we would expect to use the majority of free cash flow for share repurchases. We see favorable markets continuing and expect our businesses will produce improving financial results as we move through the year.

如果沒有收購，我們預期大部分自由現金流將用於股票回購。我們看到良好的市場持續存在，並預期隨著時間的推移，我們的業務將產生更好的財務表現。

And as we look long term, we are confident in the strength of our core businesses and our long-term strategy. We intend to continue capitalizing on strong market fundamentals and driving shareholder value creation.

從長遠來看，我們對我們的核心業務和長期策略的實力充滿信心。我們打算繼續利用強勁的市場基本面並推動股東價值創造。

Operator, this concludes our prepared remarks. We are now ready to take questions.

接線員，我們的準備好的發言到此結束。我們現在準備好回答問題。

(Operator Instructions) Jonathan Chappell, Evercore ISI.

（操作員指示）Jonathan Chappell，Evercore ISI。

David, I want to ask about, not so much the acquisition that you announced this morning, but more of the path forward. It seems like we're in this interesting spot in inland where you're well off the bottom. The outlook is still pretty bright, but there's a lot of uncertainty in the broader market, and the macro, I imagine input costs and maintenance costs continue to go up. Are you seeing more opportunities coming from (technical difficulty) now? Where your balance sheet can provide you with a little bit more optionality on the M&A front?

大衛，我想問的不是您今天早上宣布的收購，而是未來的發展方向。看起來我們正處於內陸一個有趣的地方，你遠離了底部。前景仍然相當光明，但大盤和宏觀市場存在許多不確定性，我認為投入成本和維護成本將繼續上升。現在您看到了更多來自（技術難題）的機會？您的資產負債表能否在併購方面為您提供更多的選擇權？

Yeah, the short answer is yes. I would say, the environment's more constructive in terms of acquisition opportunities, but as John, it's really hard to predict those, but the environment's better than we've seen in the last three or four years for sure.

是的，簡短的回答是肯定的。我想說，就收購機會而言，環境更加有利，但正如約翰所說，這些真的很難預測，但環境肯定比過去三、四年好。

And obviously, from a capital deployment standpoint, that's our first priority. We'd love to do a consolidating marine acquisition. And as you would expect, we're always on the outlook -- looking out for those type of opportunities.

顯然，從資本部署的角度來看，這是我們的首要任務。我們很樂意進行一次合併性的海洋收購。正如您所期望的，我們始終保持前瞻性—尋找這類機會。

That said, as you've seen, absent that we're going to deploy our free cash and buy back stock, and that's -- it's pretty easy for us to buy the barge company we know the most about, but that said, our first priority would be trying to get a consolidating acquisition if possible, and the environment feels a lot better for that right now.

話雖如此，正如您所見，除非我們部署我們的自由現金併回購股票，否則我們很容易就能收購我們最了解的駁船公司，但話雖如此，我們的首要任務是盡可能進行合併收購，而目前的環境感覺要好得多。

Just for my follow up, pivot to DNS, and then a two-parter here, you mentioned the cost controls and your margins were better than we expected, I think than probably you expected in the first quarter, you have to fill your guides about the same. So one, is there some stickiness of those cost controls that can maybe even in a protracted soft oil and gas market help fulfill your margin.

只是為了我的後續問題，轉向 DNS，然後這裡有兩個部分，您提到成本控制和利潤率比我們預期的要好，我想可能比您在第一季度預期的要好，您必須填寫大致相同的指南。那麼，首先，這些成本控制是否具有一定的黏性，即使在長期疲軟的石油和天然氣市場中也能幫助您實現利潤。

And secondly, it just it feels like there's always building backlog and delays. Are we getting close to the point where this backlog really starts to translate into some revenue acceleration across any of the different segments within that category?

其次，感覺總是有建設積壓和延誤。我們是否已經接近這個積壓訂單真正開始轉化為該類別中不同細分市場收入加速成長的階段？

Yeah. Let me take that in pieces and Christian can chime in here as well. On the margin improvement, look, we've taken some strong, lean processes and throughout our whole distribution and services business.

是的。讓我把這一點分解開來，克里斯蒂安也可以加入。在利潤率提高方面，我們在整個分銷和服務業務中採取了一些強有力的精益流程。

So the margin should continue to improve. There is a mix issue, e-frac will be very high margins where -- whereas data center backup power is -- thinner margins and they -- and that's because the engine is such a big portion of that and it's hard to mark up the engine. So we get paid for our service and our engineering and our packaging really on those data center things but the margin is thinner. So there's always a mixed issue.

因此利潤率應該會繼續提高。存在一個混合問題，電子壓裂的利潤率非常高，而資料中心備用電源的利潤率較低，這是因為引擎佔了其中很大一部分，而且很難對引擎進行標記。因此，我們透過資料中心的服務、工程和包裝獲得報酬，但利潤卻很薄。因此總是存在混合問題。

That said, I would be disappointed if we -- if we're not able to continue to improve our margin outlook for the full year, but we're just not ready to declare that yet.

話雖如此，如果我們不能繼續改善全年利潤率前景，我會感到失望，但我們還沒有準備好宣布這一點。

The second part of your question really is, where's the pig in the python, right? And it's really been very difficult, with natural gas receipts more than the standby. We had a pretty good shipment period in the first quarter for data centers, which is diesel standby. The natural gas receipts have been a little slower, but your -- our second half, you should start to see the revenue start flowing through.

你的問題的第二部分實際上是，蟒蛇裡的豬在哪裡，對嗎？這確實非常困難，天然氣收入超過了備用金。我們第一季的資料中心出貨量相當不錯，是柴油備用電源。天然氣收入成長稍慢，但到下半年，你應該會看到收入開始流入。

We had one of our engine OEMs push out deliveries that were supposed to be in the first quarter to the third quarter. That sounds really negative, but what it is, is demand's pretty high. We just need to be higher in the pecking order with our OEM, which we're working on. I don't know, Christian, do you want to add anything?

我們的一家引擎原始設備製造商將原定在第一季的交貨推遲到了第三季。這聽起來確實很消極，但事實是需求相當高。我們只需要在與 OEM 的競爭中佔據更高的地位，我們正在為此努力。我不知道，克里斯蒂安，你還有什麼要補充嗎？

No, I think you summarized that very well. Power gen continues to grow. Demand is still really good. There are some challenges on the OEM supply side, particularly around engines, we're managing that as well as we can, but what you don't see is certainly any cancellations or change in behavior. What we see is, just some of this moving out to the right, as David said, revenue.

不，我認為你總結得很好。發電量持續成長。需求仍然很好。OEM 供應方面存在一些挑戰，特別是在引擎方面，我們正在盡力應對，但您肯定看不到任何取消或行為改變。我們看到的是，正如大衛所說，其中一部分向右移動，即收入。

Daniel Imbro, Stephens Inc.

丹尼爾·伊姆布羅（Daniel Imbro），史蒂芬斯公司

David, maybe on the inland side we start there, it's good to see barge utilization and spot pricing continue to pick up, I guess, can you talk about maybe where we exited 1Q on both utilization and spot and then related contract pricing was up mid singles. How did that exit the first quarter and how should we expect that to trend just given the strength we've seen in all the pricing and utilization.

大衛，也許我們從內陸地區開始，很高興看到駁船利用率和現貨價格繼續回升，我想，您能否談談我們在第一季度退出利用率和現貨價格的情況，然後相關合約價格在中期上漲。第一季的情況如何？鑑於我們在所有定價和利用率方面看到的強勁表現，我們應該如何預期其趨勢？

Yeah, well, Christian and I will tag team this a little bit. I'll start. Look, our utility exited the quarter in the mid-90s. I mean, essentially sold out. We really can't run much more than 95%, 96% and we've been even through April we've been running in that 95% to 96%. So demand is really strong. We are pushing pricing up, that -- the fourth quarter we had a very tiny pullback. We've made that back up.

是的，克里斯蒂安和我會組隊進行這個工作。我先開始。你看，我們的公用事業在 90 年代中期退出了該季度。我的意思是，基本上是賣完了。我們的運行率確實不能超過 95%、96%，甚至到 4 月份，我們的運行率也一直在 95% 到 96% 之間。所以需求確實很強勁。我們正在提高價格，但第四季度我們出現了非常小的回檔。我們已經將其恢復。

Spot pricing was up, sequentially 1% to 3%. In some cases a little higher than that. Term contracts were up, 3% to 5% on a year over year basis. But just remember on the first quarter the term contracts, there's not a lot of them being repriced. Those are typically second half loaded, and particularly the fourth quarter.

現貨價格較上季上漲 1% 至 3%。在某些情況下會略高於這個數字。定期合約年增 3% 至 5%。但請記住，第一季定期合約中重新定價的並不多。這些通常是在下半場，特別是第四節。

But I'll let Christian give you some more color on what we're seeing.

但我會讓克里斯蒂安給你更詳細地解釋一下我們所看到的情況。

Yeah. I think David summarized that well. First quarter is a rather smaller sample set for our contract renewals, as he referenced, it's a back half of the year loaded when you get a better sample set. However, the market conditions as we emerge out of Q1, you look at the things that we think about and watch every week here at Kerby, crack spreads, refinery utilization, chem activity barometers, all of those indicators are in really good shape. Crack spreads have spread and expanded back into the mid-20% range, which is great. Refinery utilization has gone up from the high-80s to the low-90s and pad 3, which is particularly important to us.

是的。我認為大衛對此進行了很好的總結。正如他所提到的，第一季是我們合約續約的一個相當小的樣本集，當你獲得更好的樣本集時，它是下半年加載的。然而，隨著我們走出第一季度，市場狀況有所好轉，看看我們在 Kerby 每周思考和關注的事情，裂解價差、煉油廠利用率、化學活動晴雨表，所有這些指標都處於良好狀態。裂解價差已經擴大並回升至 20% 左右的區間，這很好。煉油廠利用率已從 80 多度上升至 90 多度和 3 號機組，這對我們來說尤其重要。

And the chemical barometers that we look at, even though you see some pain in the earnings, and some of the major chemical manufacturers, their domestic operations remain very busy and quite strong. And we on the marine transportation side, haven't seen a pullback in volumes. So when you look at that in combination with the supply side, again, subjective view but we think there's probably 50 some odd barges on the older book.

而從我們觀察到的化學晴雨表來看，儘管獲利方面出現了一些下滑，但一些大型化學品製造商的國內業務仍然非常繁忙且強勁。而在海上運輸方面，我們還沒有看到運輸量出現下降。因此，當你結合供應方面來看這一點時，再次強調，這是主觀觀點，但我們認為舊書上可能有 50 多艘駁船。

Shipyard capacity is extremely tight. If you wanted to build a new 30,000 barrel tank barge, you're probably not going to get it delivered until late 2026. So if you take those demand and supply dynamics that we see, it's all very positive. Limited barge construction, good fundamentals and the measurables that have always been highly correlated to our success and barge pricing has gone to new all-time high levels, steels back up with some of the macro and in tariff activity.

船廠產能極為緊張。如果你想建造一艘新的 30,000 桶油駁船，那麼可能要到 2026 年底才能交付。因此，如果你看一下我們所看到的供需動態，你會發現一切都非常積極。有限的駁船建造、良好的基本面以及與我們的成功高度相關的可衡量因素，以及駁船定價已達到歷史新高水平，鋼材價格因一些宏觀和關稅活動而回升。

It will cost you $4.7 million to go build a plain vanilla 30,000 barrel tank barge. Now we've never seen that. $6.7 million for a black old barge. I mean, you can almost build a tow boat for what would cost you to build a single black old barge at this point, and tens are at $2.5 million.

建造一艘普通的 3 萬桶油輪將花費 470 萬美元。現在我們再也沒有見過這種情況。一艘黑色舊駁船售價 670 萬美元。我的意思是，現在建造一艘黑色舊駁船的費用幾乎可以建造一艘拖船，而建造數十艘駁船的費用則為 250 萬美元。

So steel has spiked back up. That should keep a lid on new construction and I think the actual shipyard capacity that's out there. It really is reduced, compared to the era when we were building hundreds of barges a year, a subjective opinion that, if you go to the high quality shipyards that you build a good tank barge, you're still at about 50, 60 a year is the capacity for the US Jones Act in the tank barge construction. So that's a long answer to your question, but as we exit Q1.

因此鋼鐵價格再次飆升。我認為這應該會限制新船建造數量以及實際的造船廠產能。與我們每年建造數百艘駁船的時代相比，這一數量確實減少了，主觀意見是，如果你去高品質的造船廠建造一艘好的駁船，那麼每年仍然只有大約 50 到 60 艘，這是美國瓊斯法案在駁船建造方面的產能。這是對你的問題的一個很長的回答，但是當我們退出 Q1 時。

Coming out of the winter months, which is the most challenging time to be a tow boater or managed tow boats, and we emerge at 20%-ish margins, headed into a good supply demand dynamic. These, I think I was feeling pretty good about the outlook.

冬季是拖船駕駛員或管理拖船最具挑戰性的時期，走出冬季，我們的利潤率達到 20% 左右，供需情況良好。這些，我想我對前景感覺相當不錯。

I'll stop there.

我就到此為止。

And maybe from a follow up related to that on the inland margin, if I put all those pieces together, it sounds supportive. I think 1Q margins are actually flat from 4Q despite the big increase in delay days. So if utilization and pricing are improving, hopefully delay days don't get sequentially worse. How should we expect inland margins to progress off this 20% level on 1Q as you move through the year to get to that full year guide of 200 to 300 basis points?

也許從與內陸邊緣相關的後續行動來看，如果我把所有這些部分放在一起，聽起來是可以支持的。我認為，儘管延遲天數大幅增加，但第一季的利潤率實際上與第四季度持平。因此，如果利用率和定價都在改善，希望延誤天數不會持續惡化。我們應該如何預期內陸利潤率會從第一季的 20% 水準上升到全年預期的 200 至 300 個基點？

Yeah, Daniel, in our prepared remarks, we basically reaffirmed guidance. We think inland margins will be up on average for the full year 200 to 300 basis points. We feel pretty good about that, and even with all the tariff noises, we're basically reaffirming our guidance on margin expansion.

是的，丹尼爾，在我們準備好的發言中，我們基本上重申了指導。我們認為內陸地區利潤率全年平均將上漲 200 至 300 個基點。我們對此感覺很好，即使有各種關稅噪音，我們基本上仍在重申對利潤率擴大的指導。

Our quarterly cadence, usually the third quarter is the best. The second quarter is always pretty good, and the first and the fourth quarters where they pulled back a little bit largely because of weather. So, yeah, rather not get into quarterly guidance here on margins. I just say again we like to look at it on a full year basis. We think the full average will be up as we reaffirmed in our guidance.

我們的季度節奏，通常第三季是最好的。第二季的表現總是相當不錯，而第一季和第四季的表現略有下降，主要是因為天氣原因。所以，是的，我們不想在這裡討論季度利潤率指引。我只是想再說一遍，我們喜歡從全年的角度來看這個問題。我們認為總體平均值將會上升，正如我們在指導中所重申的那樣。

Is there some upside to that? Maybe, it is really tight right now, but there are some macro headwinds out there that we're all watching, with the tariffs and does that impact the economy. Right now we're very confident in where we're at though.

這樣有什麼好處嗎？也許，現在確實很緊張，但是我們都在關註一些宏觀逆風，例如關稅，這是否會影響經濟。不過，我們現在對自己的處境非常有信心。

And I would just add one small piece of that and the fact that spot prices continue to be above term prices and that's where we like to be and where we like to see it this week as we continue to try to grow the margin.

我只想補充一點，現貨價格繼續高於定期價格，這正是我們希望看到的，也是本週我們希望看到的，因為我們將繼續努力提高利潤率。

Scott Group, Wolfe Research.

斯科特集團、沃爾夫研究公司。

I just want to follow up with that last comment you made about spot being above term. I know it sounds like there's not a lot of repricing activity in Q1, but why only 3% to 5% increase in contract rate given everything that you're talking about.

我只是想跟進一下您最後關於現貨超過期限的評論。我知道這聽起來好像第一季沒有太多的重新定價活動，但考慮到你所說的一切，為什麼合約利率只上漲了 3% 到 5% 呢？

Yeah, it's -- just a small set of contracts that renewed and every customer has a little different angle, but look, we're very positive with where we're at right now. And who we would always like higher contract pricing, but we do have sophisticated customers and they do tend to play us off each other, but we're very constructive about continued pricing improvements.

是的，這只是一小部分續約的合同，每個客戶都有一點不同的觀點，但看，我們對目前的狀況非常樂觀。我們總是希望獲得更高的合約價格，但我們確實擁有成熟的客戶，他們往往會讓我們互相競爭，但我們對持續的價格改進非常有建設性。

And you mentioned trade flows and tariffs. I'm just curious how you see this playing out and where you see the risks. Are there any opportunities? And then just more broadly on everything going on, like the administration seems to be trying to incentivize US shipbuilding. I don't know how you think about that impacting you.

您提到了貿易流量和關稅。我只是好奇您如何看待此事以及您認為風險在哪裡。有沒有任何機會？然後更廣泛地看待正在發生的一切，例如政府似乎試圖激勵美國造船業。我不知道您認為這會對您產生什麼影響。

Well, let me break down the tariff -- potential tariff impacts, really not seeing much impact other than steel prices up right now. I would say, there's three buckets short term, medium term, and long term for us. Short term tariffs, pricing on engines could go up. We're seeing -- most of our engine suppliers have domestic plants, but they're still buying parts and pieces from abroad. And so there is a little impact from that. That would be a negative. The positive in the short run is steel prices have really popped, which just makes the cost of new barges go up, which is really good for us.

好吧，讓我來分析一下關稅——潛在的關稅影響，除了目前鋼鐵價格上漲之外，實際上沒有看到太大的影響。我想說，對我們來說有三個目標：短期、中期和長期。短期關稅、引擎價格可能會上漲。我們看到——我們的大多數發動機供應商都有國內工廠，但他們仍然從國外購買零件。因此這會產生一點影響。那將會產生負面影響。短期內的正面因素是鋼鐵價格確實上漲，這導致新駁船的成本上升，這對我們來說確實是好事。

Medium term obviously would be more the economy. Do we see a pullback in the economy, as Christian referenced, our customers are not pulling back. We're not seeing it, part of that may just be from a competitive standpoint, particularly in the chemical standpoint, from the chemical side. These US plants have a great feedstock position and they're very efficient and there's a lot of new capacity there that's been built in the last five to six years. And so, they're the best assets in the chemical company's portfolio.

從中期來看，顯然更多的是經濟。我們是否看到經濟出現衰退，正如克里斯蒂安所提到的，我們的客戶並沒有衰退。我們沒有看到這一點，部分原因可能只是從競爭的角度來看，特別是從化學的角度來看，從化學方面的角度來看。這些美國工廠的原料狀況良好，效率很高，並且在過去五到六年中建造了大量新產能。因此，它們是化學公司投資組合中的最佳資產。

So when we think about the economy, there could be a little pullback. Again, we haven't seen signs of it. And then in the very long term, I think onshoring is really good for Kirby. We're essentially 100% domestic.

因此，當我們考慮經濟時，可能會出現一點回調。再次，我們還沒有看到它的跡象。從長遠來看，我認為在岸營運對 Kirby 來說確實是一件好事。我們基本上是 100% 國內企業。

On our DNS side, our manufacturing facilities are all here, and then of course on the Jones Act side, the more things that come on shore, that's better for our Jones Act fleet. Now, you asked specifically about the administration's effort on shipbuilding. That is really all about international shipbuilding, not really Jones Act at all.

在我們的 DNS 方面，我們的製造設施都在這裡，當然在瓊斯法案方面，上岸的東西越多，對我們的瓊斯法案船隊就越好。現在，您具體詢問了政府在造船方面的努力。這實際上與國際造船業有關，與瓊斯法案無關。

I think the administration is looking at China and China in the international ship supply area of -- they're about 70% market share on new construction, I think. The administration is trying to address that and stimulate maybe some more international shipbuilding capabilities here in the US. That's really not addressed for the Jones Act.

我認為政府正在關注中國在國際船舶供應領域的表現——我認為他們在新船建造方面佔有約 70% 的市場份額。美國政府正在努力解決這個問題，並刺激美國國內更多的國際造船能力。《瓊斯法案》實際上並沒有解決這個問題。

It may actually help us, we may have more maintenance options from shipyards stimulation, but we'll see. When we put all the tariff stuff together, it's probably a modest positive for us. There's all kinds of pluses and minuses and some unknowns, but, when you run through everything I just did, it's probably a small net positive for us.

它實際上可能對我們有幫助，我們可能會從船廠的刺激中獲得更多維護選擇，但我們拭目以待。當我們把所有的關稅因素放在一起時，這對我們來說可能是一個適度的利好。有各種各樣的優點和缺點，也有一些未知數，但是，當你回顧我剛才所做的一切時，它對我們來說可能是一個小小的淨利好。

And I might add one positive that we see in the executive order is an investment in marine training for the mariner, and I think that's I applaud the administration for addressing that and wanting to help US labor and US jobs and anything we can do to help grow the merchant marine and improve the opportunities for our merchant mariners is positive for Kirby, and there's some of that in the executive order.

我想補充的是，我們在行政命令中看到的一個積極方面是對海員培訓的投資，我認為，我讚賞政府解決這個問題，並希望幫助美國勞工和美國就業，我們可以做任何事情來幫助發展商船隊，改善我們的商船海員的機會，這對柯比來說都是積極的，行政命令中也提到了這一點。

Ken Hoexter, Bank of America.

美國銀行的肯‧霍克斯特 (Ken Hoexter)。

So you did not directly I guess, address your EPS growth target in '25 in the release that you set in the fourth quarter. I just wondering if there was any reason for that. Are you pulling it or are you changing it to 15% to 25% growth target?

因此，我猜您在第四季度發布的新聞稿中沒有直接提到 25 年的每股收益成長目標。我只是想知道這是否有任何原因。您是要拉低這一目標，還是將其改為 15% 至 25% 的成長目標？

And then secondly, I guess on rates. I understand the delay days and it absorbs capacity. So when that capacity gets freed up and you don't have the delayed days. Will we see additional pressure on yields? Is that something that you see as the capacity gets freed up? Maybe just -- yeah, I think express that. And then I have a follow up.

其次，我想是關於利率。我了解延遲天數並且它會吸收容量。因此，當產能釋放時，您就不會再有延誤的日子了。我們是否會看到收益率面臨額外壓力？您是否認為產能會被釋放？也許只是——是的，我想表達這一點。然後我有一個後續行動。

Yeah, we are reaffirming our EPS guidance. We should have probably been more explicit about that. But when you add up everything we said about it's the exact same guidance. So we are reaffirming that that percentage. I'll let Christian talk about the weather, and freeing up capacity.

是的，我們重申我們的每股盈餘指引。我們或許應該對此進行更明確的闡述。但是，當你把我們所說的一切加起來時，它就是完全相同的指導。因此我們重申該百分比。我會讓克里斯蒂安談論天氣和釋放容量。

No, I mean, you really honed in on something here, Ken, Q1 winter weather conditions artificially tightens the market. You're waiting to cross an open bay because the wind's blowing really hard, your trips a little longer, you chew up available capacity, and utility does tend to go up during the winter months. However, we are more profitable and there's more margin on every voyage when you're able to accomplish those voyages.

不，我的意思是，肯，你確實在這裡注意到了一些東西，第一季冬季天氣條件人為地收緊了市場。您正在等待穿越開闊的海灣，因為風很大，您的行程會更長一些，您會佔用可用的容量，而且在冬季，公用事業費往往會上漲。然而，當您能夠完成這些航行時，我們的利潤會更高，每次航行的利潤也會更高。

Again, a large contract of a affreightment piece of our portfolio becomes highly profitable when the trip times accelerate. And we're able to make more ton miles. The other thing we do when we come out of the winter months is we actually gain net capacity. What I mean by that is those days spent, waiting to cross the bay, or to get through a lock or for whatever weather delay it is, you're actually gaining barge days to sell as the weather gets better and you accelerate all of your voyages. So your fleet grows just because there's more available barge days to book in better weather months plus the margin on the affreightment trips.

再次，當航行時間縮短時，我們投資組合中一筆大型租船合約就會變得非常有利可圖。而且我們能夠行駛更多的噸位里程。冬季過後我們做的另一件事就是實際上獲得了淨容量。我的意思是，隨著天氣好轉以及所有航行的加快，您花費的那些時間，用於等待穿越海灣、通過船閘或任何天氣延誤，實際上，您獲得了可以出售的駁船航行時間。因此，您的船隊規模會擴大，因為在天氣較好的月份有更多可供預訂的駁船天數，再加上包船運輸的利潤。

Yeah. I mean the question would be do the competitors get more aggressive? I look, I -- Christian and his ops team are the preferred supplier out there, and people tend to want to work with us, reputationally and because we do a lot to save our customers money.

是的。我的意思是，問題是競爭對手是否會變得更具侵略性？我認為，我——克里斯蒂安和他的營運團隊是那裡的首選供應商，人們傾向於與我們合作，因為我們的聲譽好，而且我們為客戶省錢做了很多工作。

So there could be a small competitive impact, but, I think having more barge days to sell right now and our outlook, we're not worried at all, Ken.

因此，可能會產生很小的競爭影響，但我認為現在有更多的駁船可供銷售，而且我們的前景看好，我們一點也不擔心，肯。

And I guess that comes through in your contract pricing. The revenue per ton mile was down $11.08, so it's up 11% after upper-teens last year. That's all just a factor of exactly what you're talking about in terms of mileage and getting jammed at the ports. It's just some investors, I think don't understand that they're looking at those numbers and seeing the concern on pricing. So I don't know if you want to just maybe extrapolate on that and how that turns into maybe accelerating pricing opportunities.

我想這體現在你的合約定價上。每噸英里的收入下降了 11.08 美元，因此在去年十幾美元的收入基礎上又上漲了 11%。這只是您所說的里程和港口堵塞的一個因素。我認為，有些投資者不明白為什麼他們看到這些數字後會擔心價格。所以我不知道您是否想對此進行推斷，以及這將如何轉化為加速定價機會。

No, that is exactly right. Great point. That is weather-driven, efficiency driven, that gets better as the weather improves and you make more to miles, and more marginal and so you will see that improve. I'm confident of that. You've seen that if you followed Kirby for a very long time, you understand that there's a seasonality to that just exists.

不，完全正確。很好的觀點。這是由天氣和效率決定的，隨著天氣好轉，行駛里程會增多，邊際效益也會提高，所以你會看到情況有所改善。我對此很有信心。您會發現，如果您關注 Kirby 很長時間，您就會明白其中存在季節性。

And then can you relay that, I guess to the number of delay, not delay days -- ship shipyard days at coast wise and what we could see is in the acceleration into the second quarter and beyond.

然後，您能否轉述一下，我猜是延誤的次數，而不是延誤的天數——船舶在海岸造船廠的天數，我們可以看到的是第二季度及以後的加速。

Yeah. I mean, we're -- we had a very heavy first quarter. We're starting to get that equipment back in. You will see the coastal margins progress up each quarter going forward. I don't want to give you specific margin guidance, but our coastal business is about to really start to generate margins.

是的。我的意思是，我們第一季的業績非常艱難。我們正開始將這些設備運回來。您將會看到沿海邊緣在未來每季都會不斷擴大。我不想給你具體的利潤指導，但我們的沿海業務即將真正開始產生利潤。

Christian and I joke with our team that we got to get coastal margins above inland margins. So there's a little healthy competition internally here, but it's -- once we get these big shipyards done, you can imagine having a big ATB unit that's earning $40,000 to $50,000 a day in a 120 year -- 120 day shipyard. That's a lot of revenue. That's not there, but the cost is still there. So that's about to reverse and each quarter, second quarter will be a lot better than the first quarter. Third quarter will be even better than second quarter. So the progressions there can --

克里斯蒂安和我與我們的團隊開玩笑說，我們必須讓沿海邊緣高於內陸邊緣。因此，這裡內部存在一些良性競爭，但是，一旦我們建成這些大型造船廠，你可以想像擁有一個大型 ATB 單位，在 120 年（120 天）的造船廠內，每天可以賺取 40,000 至 50,000 美元。這可是一大筆收入。雖然沒有了，但是成本仍然存在。所以這種情況即將逆轉，每個季度，第二季度都會比第一季好很多。第三季將會比第二季更好。因此那裡的進展可以--

Yeah, that'll be the day I guess when we see coastal -- inland. Last one for me just M&A. Maybe can you just talk about the process? How long was this 14 barge discussion in working through and are there other opportunities? I would imagine that given some of the financial constraints we've seen of some of the smaller carriers that would have been maybe more opportunities, are you seeing that increase?

是的，我想那一天我們就能看見沿海和內陸了。對我來說最後一個只是併購。您能談談這個過程嗎？這 14 艘駁船的討論持續了多久？還有其他機會嗎？我想，考慮到我們看到的一些小型航空公司面臨的財務限制，這些航空公司可能會有更多的機會，您是否看到了這種成長？

I think in general, Kirby is the logical strategic acquirer for companies that want to sell particularly liquid marine assets. Those conversations, those relationships, exist and If something, is going to market, we almost -- always tend to get a look at it. Those relationships exist and those communication lines stay open and so, I don't want to comment too much on the deal that we did, but in general, we are the logical choice to at least have a conversation with if you're going to sell a liquid marine asset. We tend to see a lot of that, if that activity.

我認為，整體而言，對於想要出售流動性極強的海洋資產的公司來說，Kirby 是合乎邏輯的策略性收購者。這些對話、這些關係是存在的，如果某樣東西要進入市場，我們幾乎總是會去關注它。這些關係是存在的，這些溝通管道保持暢通，所以，我不想對我們所做的交易發表太多評論，但總的來說，如果你要出售流動海洋資產，我們是至少值得交談的合理選擇。如果有這樣的活動，我們往往會看到很多這樣的情況。

Yeah, and can't just add on that. I mean, it is a much more constructive environment for acquisitions right now, but yeah, predicting one is a tough thing to do.

是的，不能僅僅添加這一點。我的意思是，現在的收購環境更有建設性，但是，預測收購確實很難。

(Operator Instructions) Sherif Elmaghrabi, BTIG.

（操作員指示）Sherif Elmaghrabi，BTIG。

First, quick follow up on Scott's question. I believe it was Scott. I believe that in the past Q4 has historically been a big quarter for inland fleet repricing. Can you just give us an update on -- that's the case this year or should we expect a different cadence?

首先，快速跟進斯科特的問題。我相信那是斯科特。我相信，從歷史上看，第四季是內陸船隊重新定價的重要季度。您能否向我們提供最新消息——今年的情況就是這樣，還是我們應該期待不同的節奏？

No, I mean, our -- as you might imagine, most companies contract portfolios are a year-end calendar, and for us, the fourth quarter is always a big quarter for term contract renewals. Sometimes they slip, somebody will say, hey, give us another month, and we need to go get some more approvals, but no, it hasn't changed, Sherif. You should expect our fourth quarter renewal portfolio to -- that's the largest renewals. Probably 40% of the contract renewals occur in that fourth quarter. The first quarter is usually one of the lighter ones.

不，我的意思是，我們的——正如你可能想像的那樣，大多數公司的合約組合都是年終日曆，對我們來說，第四季度始終是定期合約續約的重要季度。有時他們會失誤，有人會說，嘿，再給我們一個月的時間，我們需要去獲得更多的批准，但是，警長，事情沒有改變。您應該期待我們第四季的續約組合——這是最大的續約。大概有 40% 的合約續約發生在第四季。第一季通常是比較輕鬆的季度之一。

That's helpful. And then, you mentioned crack spreads are pretty constructive at the moment. Last year, towards the end of last year, I remember pet chem activity was an area of support while crack spreads came in. So I'm curious about the dynamics of trading one versus the other. Is it possible to switch some of your punish from product focused capacity to carrying pet cams, or is the equipment more complicated than that?

這很有幫助。然後，您提到裂解價差目前相當具有建設性。我記得去年，也就是去年年底，當裂解價差出現時，寵物化學品活動是一個支撐領域。因此，我對兩者之間的交易動態感到好奇。是否有可能將部分懲罰從以產品為中心的能力轉移到攜帶寵物攝像頭，或者設備是否比這更複雜？

So yes, the answer is yes, there's a large piece of our portfolio that is homogeneous. You can wash a barge out and move it from one service to another, clean it and ship services. So your typical 30,000 barrel, 10,000 barrel clean barges are homogeneous assets that can chase gasoline as well as they can chase benzene, toluene, [tailene]. So yeah, they're flexible, the assets themselves.

所以是的，答案是肯定的，我們的投資組合中有很大一部分是同質的。您可以清洗駁船並將其從一項服務轉移到另一項服務，對其進行清潔並提供船舶服務。因此，典型的 30,000 桶或 10,000 桶清潔駁船是同質資產，既可以運輸汽油，也可以運輸苯、甲苯，[泰琳]。是的，它們是靈活的，資產本身也是靈活的。

There are certain assets that are more products specific, black old barges that have thermal fluid heating systems, pressurized gas, barges, specific uses, but for the most part, the homogeneous pool of 30s and 10s are flexible to go in and out of the services.

某些資產是針對特定產品的，例如帶有熱流體加熱系統的黑色舊駁船、加壓氣體、駁船、特定用途，但在大多數情況下，30 年代和 10 年代的同質池可以靈活地進出服務。

Greg Wasikowski, Webber Research & Advisory.

Greg Wasikowski，韋伯研究與顧問公司。

Yeah, I wanted to follow up on Ken and John's questions from earlier on the M&A environment. David, what exactly has made it a more construction -- more constructive environment now versus the past few years? I would have thought that given that there hasn't been a ton of struggle in the past few years relative to pass down cycles and prices seem to have gone nowhere but up. I just would have thought it'd be harder to find the right opportunity at the right price. So you just tell me how I'm wrong there.

是的，我想跟進 Ken 和 John 之前關於併購環境的問題。大衛，與過去幾年相比，究竟是什麼讓現在的環境更具建設性？我原本以為，鑑於過去幾年傳承週期方面沒有出現太多困難，而且價格似乎一直在上漲。我只是以為以合適的價格找到合適的機會會更難。所以你只要告訴我我錯在哪裡就可以了。

No, it's so willing sellers, they don't want to sell at the bottom, right? And right now they're thinking, hey, look, things are better. If I do sell, I'm not selling at the bottom. I may be selling, mid-cycle and that's okay. They know, look, that with the financing market and whatnot. Just life is more difficult. So they might think that now is a better time to sell.

不，賣家太願意了，他們不想在最低價賣出，對嗎？現在他們在想，嘿，看，情況好多了。如果我確實要賣出，我不會在最低價賣出。我可能會在周期中期出售，這沒關係。他們知道，看，有融資市場等等。只是生活更加艱難。因此他們可能認為現在是出售的最佳時機。

But the conversations are up for sure, but there's still a bit off for spread. There's always a bit off for spread and we just need it to narrow, but at least the conversations are happening. I think, post COVID, everybody wanted to get their feet back on the ground, maybe pay down some debt. And now, it just feels like the conversations are just a little more constructive.

但對話肯定會增加，但仍有一些內容需要傳播。傳播總是有點偏差，我們只需要縮小它，但至少對話正在進行中。我認為，疫情過後，每個人都想重新站穩腳跟，或許還能償還一些債務。現在，感覺對話變得更有建設性了。

But again, it's so hard to predict the acquisitions. It's a price discovery type process and a lot of people have a lifestyle too that they -- they're thinking about whether they want to give it up or cash out. So it's, you just never know. I am not trying to be cagey or avoid the question. It's, yeah, everybody's got a little different angle on what they're looking for and why they might look for it.

但同樣，預測收購是非常困難的。這是一個價格發現類型的過程，許多人也有自己的生活方式——他們正在考慮是否要放棄或套現。所以，你永遠不知道。我並不是想保持謹慎或迴避這個問題。是的，每個人對於他們所尋找的東西以及為什麼尋找它都有一點不同的看法。

Is it fair to characterize that market as being, maybe two ends of the spectrum, one, being distressed sellers, which is, I guess probably what we're more familiar with your more impactful acquisitions of the past versus the other end of the spectrum, which would be more like opportunistic exits, and the past few years has maybe been somewhere in the middle where it's been a little bit more muddy and now it's getting more towards that more positive end of opportunistic exit. Is that fair to think about it that way?

是否可以公平地將該市場描述為兩個極端，一個是陷入困境的賣家，我想這可能是我們更熟悉的過去更有影響力的收購，而另一個極端，更像是機會主義的退出，過去幾年可能處於中間位置，情況有點混亂，現在它越來越傾向於機會主義退出的更積極一端。這樣想公平嗎？

It could be, yeah, I don't think that's an unfair characterization at all.

是的，有可能，我認為這根本不是一個不公平的描述。

And then one more if you don't mind, it just seems -- it seems like there's been a few more large orders since the last call, mostly appeared to be mostly replacement tonnage, but just always good to get your viewpoint on it.

如果您不介意的話，再問一個問題，似乎自上次通話以來似乎又有了一些大訂單，大部分似乎都是替換噸位，但總是能聽取您的觀點。

Yes, so I again, we subjectively look at the order book. We understand -- we know who's building what shipyard, and I can verify that in our opinion much of this appears to be replacement tonnage. You can look at the age of the expiring assets and in those portfolios for those that are building and can tell you with some level of confidence that it looks and feels like replacement tonnage not new growth.

是的，所以我再次主觀地查看訂單簿。我們了解——我們知道誰在建造哪個船廠，我可以證實，我們認為其中大部分似乎都是替換噸位。您可以查看即將到期的資產的年限，以及正在建造的投資組合，並且可以有信心地告訴您，它看起來和感覺起來像是替換噸位，而不是新的增長。

Greg, I actually think we'll see a reduction in the overall barge count this year.

格雷格，我實際上認為今年駁船總數將會減少。

And I would add it's difficult even today to expand your fleet with the pressure and the acute, shortage of mariners. So even if you wanted to grow your fleet, even if you're willing to invest at these, halcyon numbers, which doesn't make sense to invest at it $4.7 million for a clean 30, but say you wanted to do that and you wanted to get a boat and crew it up, it's still a challenge to grow your crew complement to effectively significantly grow your fleet. So again, most of this looks and feels like replacement tonnage.

我想補充一點，即使在今天，由於壓力和海員嚴重短缺，擴大船隊仍然很困難。因此，即使您想擴大船隊規模，即使您願意投資，但投資 470 萬美元購買一艘 30 噸的漁船是沒有意義的，但假設您想這​​樣做，並且想要獲得一艘船並配備船員，那麼增加船員人數以有效大幅擴大船隊規模仍然是一個挑戰。因此，再次強調，其中大部分看起來和感覺起來都像是替換噸位。

And the financing is still an issue for a lot of the -- a lot of the owners, again, one of the benefits of being a publicly traded company or access to capital, but I think what you see out there is the financial difficulty, and the cost associated with that -- with the mariner shortage most of this is replacement.

對許多船東來說，融資仍然是一個問題，這也是成為上市公司或獲得資本的好處之一，但我認為，你所看到的是財務困難，以及與此相關的成本——由於海員短缺，其中大部分是替換。

This concludes the question and answer session. I will now turn it back to Kurt Niemietz for closing remarks.

問答環節到此結束。現在請 Kurt Niemietz 致結束語。

Thank you, operator, and thanks again for everyone for joining us today. As always, feel free to reach out to me throughout the day and next week if there's any follow-up questions.

謝謝接線員，再次感謝大家今天的加入我們。像往常一樣，如果有任何後續問題，請隨時在今天和下週與我聯繫。

Thank you for your participation in today's conference. This does conclude the program. You may now disconnect.

感謝大家參加今天的會議。該計劃確實就此結束。您現在可以斷開連線。