Illinois Tool Works Inc (ITW) 2025 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good day, everyone, and thank you for joining us for today's ITW third-quarter 2025 earnings webcast. Also, please be aware that today's session is being recorded. It is now my pleasure to turn the floor over to our host, Erin Linnihan, Vice President of Investor Relations. Welcome.

大家好，感謝各位參加今日的 ITW 2025 年第三季財報網路直播。另外，請注意，今天的會議將被錄影。現在我很高興將發言權交給我們的主持人，投資者關係副總裁艾琳·林尼漢。歡迎。

Thank you, Jim. Good morning, and welcome to ITW's third-quarter 2025 conference call. Today, I'm joined by our President and CEO, Chris O'Herlihy; and Senior Vice President and CFO, Michael Larsen.

謝謝你，吉姆。早上好，歡迎參加 ITW 2025 年第三季電話會議。今天，與我一同出席的有我們的總裁兼首席執行官克里斯·奧赫利希，以及高級副總裁兼首席財務官邁克爾·拉森。

During today's call, we will discuss ITW's third quarter financial results and provide an update on our outlook for full year 2025. Slide 2 is a reminder that this presentation contains forward-looking statements. We refer you to the company's 2024 Form 10-K and subsequent reports filed with the SEC for more detail about important risks that could cause actual results to differ materially from our expectations. This presentation uses certain non-GAAP measures, and a reconciliation of those measures to the most directly comparable GAAP measures is contained in the press release.

在今天的電話會議上，我們將討論 ITW 第三季的財務業績，並更新我們對 2025 年全年的展望。第 2 張投影片提醒大家，本簡報包含前瞻性陳述。有關可能導致實際結果與預期結果存在重大差異的重要風險的更多詳細信息，請參閱公司 2024 年 10-K 表格及隨後向美國證券交易委員會提交的報告。本次示範使用了某些非GAAP指標，新聞稿中包含了這些指標與最直接可比較的GAAP指標的調節表。

Please turn to slide 3, and it's now my pleasure to turn the call over to our President and CEO, Chris O'Herlihy. Chris?

請翻到第 3 張投影片，現在我很高興將電話交給我們的總裁兼執行長克里斯·奧赫利希。克里斯？

Thank you, Erin, and good morning, everyone. As detailed in our press release this morning, the ITW team continues to perform at a high level, successfully outpacing underlying end market demand and delivering solid operational and financial execution within a stable yet still challenging demand environment.

謝謝你，艾琳，大家早安。正如我們今天早上發布的新聞稿中所述，ITW 團隊繼續保持高水準的業績，成功超越了潛在的終端市場需求，並在穩定但仍充滿挑戰的需求環境中實現了穩健的營運和財務執行。

For the third quarter, revenue increased 3%, excluding a 1% reduction related to our ongoing strategic product line simplification efforts. Organic growth was 1%, a solid performance relative to end markets that we estimate declined low single digits and a 1 percentage point improvement from our second quarter growth rate. Favorable foreign currency translation contributed 2% to revenue.

第三季營收成長 3%，不包括因我們正在進行的策略性產品線簡化工作而導致的 1% 的下降。有機成長率為 1%，相對於我們估計將出現個位數低幅下滑的終端市場而言，這是一個穩健的表現，並且比我們第二季度的成長率提高了 1 個百分點。有利的匯率變動為收入貢獻了 2%。

Focusing on the bottom line, we achieved GAAP EPS of $2.81, grew operating income by 6% to a record $1.1 billion and significantly improved our operating margin by 90 basis points to 27.4%. We maintained excellent execution in controlling the controllables as enterprise initiatives contributed 140 basis points and effective pricing and supply chain actions more than covered tariff costs and positively impacted both EPS and margins in the quarter.

從獲利角度來看，我們實現了 GAAP 每股收益 2.81 美元，營業收入成長 6% 至創紀錄的 11 億美元，營業利潤率顯著提高了 90 個基點，達到 27.4%。我們在控制可控因素方面保持了出色的執行力，企業舉措貢獻了 140 個基點，有效的定價和供應鏈措施不僅彌補了關稅成本，而且對本季度的每股收益和利潤率都產生了積極影響。

Consistent with our long-term commitment to increasing annual cash returns to shareholders, on August 1, we announced our 62nd consecutive dividend increase, raising our dividend by 7%. Additionally, year to date, we have repurchased more than $1.1 billion of our outstanding shares.

為了履行我們長期以來增加股東年度現金回報的承諾，8 月 1 日，我們宣布連續第 62 次提高股息，將股息提高了 7%。此外，今年迄今為止，我們已回購了超過 11 億美元的流通股。

Furthermore, I'm encouraged by the significant progress on our next phase strategic growth priorities. We remain laser-focused on making above-market organic growth, powered by customer-backed innovation and defining ITW strength. The strategy is working, and we remain firmly on track to deliver on our 2030 performance goals, which include customer-backed innovation yield of 3%-plus.

此外，我對我們在下一階段策略性成長重點方面取得的顯著進展感到鼓舞。我們將繼續專注於實現高於市場平均的有機成長，以客戶支援的創新為動力，並確立 ITW 的優勢。該策略正在奏效，我們將繼續穩步實現 2030 年的績效目標，其中包括客戶支援的創新產出率達到 3% 以上。

As we stated before, ITW is built to outperform in challenging environments. As we look ahead to the balance of the year, we are narrowing our EPS guidance range, confident in our ability to continue leveraging the fundamental strength of the ITW business model, the inherent resilience of our diversified portfolio and the high-quality execution demonstrated every day by our colleagues worldwide.

正如我們之前所說，ITW 的設計旨在應對充滿挑戰的環境並取得優異的效能。展望今年剩餘時間，我們縮小了每股盈餘預期範圍，因為我們有信心繼續利用 ITW 商業模式的基本優勢、我們多元化投資組合固有的韌性以及我們全球同事每天展現的高品質執行力。

I will now turn the call over to Michael to discuss our third quarter performance and full year 2025 outlook in more detail. Michael?

現在我將把電話交給邁克爾，讓他更詳細地討論我們第三季的業績和 2025 年全年展望。麥可？

Thank you, Chris, and good morning, everyone. Leveraging the strength of the ITW business model and high-quality business portfolio, the ITW team delivered solid operational execution and financial performance in Q3. Starting with the top line, total revenue increased by more than 2%, driven in part by 1% organic growth, an improvement of 1 percentage point from Q2. Geographically, while North America organic revenue was flat and Europe was down 1%, Asia Pacific was a standout performer with a 7% increase, which included 10% growth in China.

謝謝你，克里斯，大家早安。憑藉 ITW 商業模式的優勢和高品質的業務組合，ITW 團隊在第三季度實現了穩健的營運執行和財務表現。從營收來看，總營收成長超過 2%，部分原因是 1% 的有機成長，比第二季提高了 1 個百分點。從地理上看，雖然北美地區的有機收入持平，歐洲地區下降了 1%，但亞太地區表現突出，成長了 7%，其中中國地區成長了 10%。

Consistent with ITW's do what we say execution, we continue to demonstrate strong performance on all controllable factors. Our enterprise initiatives were particularly effective this quarter, contributing 140 basis points to record operating margin of 27.4%, which expanded by 90 basis points year-over-year. Furthermore, our pricing and supply chain actions more than covered tariff costs and positively impacted both EPS and margin in Q3.

秉承 ITW 言出必行的原則，我們在所有可控因素方面都持續展現強勁的業績。本季度，我們的企業舉措尤其有效，為創紀錄的 27.4% 的營業利潤率貢獻了 140 個基點，年增 90 個基點。此外，我們的定價和供應鏈措施不僅彌補了關稅成本，而且對第三季的每股盈餘和利潤率都產生了積極影響。

Free cash flow grew 15% to more than $900 million with a conversion rate of 110%. GAAP EPS was $2.81 with an effective tax rate in the quarter of 21.8%. As detailed in the press release, the rate was driven by a benefit related to the filing of the 2024 US tax return, partially offset by the settlement of a foreign tax audit.

自由現金流成長 15%，超過 9 億美元，轉換率為 110%。以美國通用會計準則計算，每股收益為 2.81 美元，當季有效稅率為 21.8%。正如新聞稿中所詳述的那樣，該稅率的上漲是由於提交 2024 年美國納稅申報表帶來的收益，但部分被外國稅務審計的和解所抵消。

In summary, in what continues to be a pretty challenging demand environment, ITW delivered a strong combination of above-market growth with a revenue increase of 2% and solid operational execution, resulting in consistent improvement across all key performance metrics as evidenced by incremental margins of 65%, operating margins of more than 27% and GAAP EPS of $2.81, an increase of 6%, excluding a prior year divestiture gain.

總而言之，在持續充滿挑戰的需求環境下，ITW 實現了高於市場平均水平的成長，收入成長 2%，營運執行穩健，從而在所有關鍵績效指標上持續改善，增量利潤率達到 65%，營業利潤率超過 27%，GAAP 每股收益為 2.81 美元，增長 6%（不包括上一年剝離收益）。

Turning to slide 4 for a closer look at our sequential performance year-to-date on some key financial metrics. As you can see, ITW's organic growth rate, operating income, operating margins and GAAP EPS have all continued to improve in what has remained a mixed demand environment.

接下來請看第 4 張投影片，詳細了解我們今年迄今為止在一些關鍵財務指標上的連續業績。正如您所看到的，在需求環境依然喜憂參半的情況下，ITW 的自然成長率、營業收入、營業利潤率和 GAAP 每股收益均持續改善。

Turning to our segment results and beginning with automotive OEM, which led the way on both organic growth and margin improvement this quarter. Revenue was up 7% and organic growth was up 5% with growth in all three key regions. Strategic PLS reduced revenue by over 1%.

接下來看一下我們各業務板塊的業績，首先是汽車OEM業務板塊，該板塊在本季度實現了有機增長和利潤率提升，均處於領先地位。營收成長7%，有機成長5%，三大主要地區均成長。Strategic PLS 使收入減少了 1% 以上。

Regionally, North America grew 3%. Europe was up 2% and China was up 10%. The team in China continues to gain market share in the rapidly expanding EV market as customer-back innovation efforts drive higher content per vehicle. In our full year guidance, we have incorporated the most recent automotive build forecasts which are projecting a modest slowdown in the fourth quarter.

從區域來看，北美成長了3%。歐洲上漲2%，中國上漲10%。中國團隊在快速成長的電動車市場中持續獲得市場份額，因為以客戶需求為導向的創新努力推動了每輛車更高的零件含量。我們在全年業績預期中納入了最新的汽車產量預測，預計第四季度產量將略有放緩。

For the full year, we continue to project that the Automotive OEM segment will outperform relevant industry builds by 200 to 300 basis points as we consistently grow our content per vehicle. On the bottom line, strong performance again this quarter with operating margin improving 240 basis points to 21.8%. And we're well positioned to achieve our goal from Investor Day of no to mid-20s operating margin by 2026.

預計全年汽車OEM細分市場將比相關行業平均高出200至300個基點，因為我們將持續提高每輛車的零件含量。本季業績依然強勁，營業利潤率提高 240 個基點至 21.8%。我們已做好充分準備，實現投資者日提出的目標，即在 2026 年實現 0% 至 25% 的營業利潤率。

Turning to Food Equipment on -- revenue increased 3% with 1% organic growth. While equipment sales were down 1%, our service business grew by 3%. Regionally, North America grew by 2%, driven by 1% growth in equipment and 4% growth in service. Demand remains solid on the institutional side. International, however, was down 1%. Operating margins improved 80 basis points to 29.2%.

食品設備業務方面－收入成長了 3%，其中有機成長為 1%。雖然設備銷售額下降了 1%，但我們的服務業務成長了 3%。從區域來看，北美地區成長了 2%，其中設備成長了 1%，服務成長了 4%。機構投資人方面的需求依然強勁。然而，國際市場卻下跌了1%。營業利益率提高 80 個基點至 29.2%。

For Test & Measurement and Electronics, revenue was flat this quarter as organic revenues saw a 1% decline. The demand for capital equipment in our Test & Measurement business has remained choppy as revenues declined 1%. In addition, electronics declined 2% as demand slowed in semiconductor-related markets.

測試與測量和電子產品業務本季收入持平，有機收入下降了 1%。由於營收下降了 1%，我們測試與測量業務對資本設備的需求一直不穩定。此外，由於半導體相關市場需求放緩，電子產品價格下跌了2%。

On a positive note, operating margin improved 260 basis points sequentially from Q2 to 25.4%. The excluding 50 basis points of restructuring impact in Q3 margins were 25.9% and both operating margins and revenues are projected to improve meaningfully in the fourth quarter.

值得一提的是，營業利潤率較第二季環比提高了 260 個基點，達到 25.4%。剔除重組對第三季利潤率 50 個基點的影響，第三季利潤率為 25.9%，預計第四季營業利潤率和收入都將顯著改善。

Moving to slide 6. Welding was a bright spot, delivering 3% organic growth, with a contribution of more than 3% from customer-back innovation. Equipment sales increased 6%, while consumables were down 2%. Industrial sales increased 3% in the quarter as North America was up 3% and international sales grew 4%, with China up 13%. Operating margin of 32.6% was up 30 basis points as the Welding segment continued to demonstrate strong margin and profitability performance.

切換到第6張投影片。焊接業務是一大亮點，實現了 3% 的有機成長，其中超過 3% 的成長來自客戶推動的創新。設備銷售額成長了 6%，而耗材銷售額下降了 2%。本季工業銷售額成長 3%，其中北美成長 3%，國際銷售額成長 4%，中國成長 13%。焊接業務板塊繼續保持強勁的利潤率和獲利能力，營業利潤率達到 32.6%，提高了 30 個基點。

In Palmers & Fluids, revenues declined 2%. Organic revenue declined 3%, which included a percentage point of headwind from PLS. Polymers declined 5% against a difficult comparison in the year ago quarter of plus 10%, while Fluids was flat in the quarter. The more consumer-oriented automotive aftermarket business was down 3%. But although the top line declined, the segment expanded margin by 60 basis points to 28.5%, supported by a strong contribution from Enterprise Initiatives.

Palmers & Fluids 的收入下降了 2%。有機收入下降了 3%，其中包括 PLS 帶來的 1 個百分點的負面影響。聚合物業務年減 5%，而去年同期則成長了 10%，這是一個艱難的比較基數；流體業務在本季度持平。以消費者為導向的汽車售後市場業務下降了 3%。儘管營收有所下降，但在企業計畫的強勁貢獻下，該部門的利潤率成長了 60 個基點，達到 28.5%。

Moving on to Construction Products on slide 7. Revenues were down only 1% as organic revenue declined 2% in the quarter, significantly better than last quarter's 7% organic decline. Revenue was also impacted by a 1% reduction from PLS. Regionally, revenue in North America declined 1%. Europe was down 3% and Australia and New Zealand decreased 4%. Despite market headwinds, the segment improved operating margin by 140 basis points to 31.6%.

接下來請看第 7 張投影片，內容是建築產品。本季營收僅下降 1%，有機營收下降 2%，遠優於上一季 7% 的有機降幅。收入也受到PLS 1%降幅的影響。從區域來看，北美地區的收入下降了 1%。歐洲下跌 3%，澳洲和紐西蘭下跌 4%。儘管面臨市場逆風，該業務板塊的營業利潤率仍提高了 140 個基點，達到 31.6%。

For Specialty Products, revenue increased 3% with organic revenue up 2%. And revenue included a percentage point of headwind from PLS. By region, revenue in North America declined 1% against a difficult comparison in the year-ago quarter of plus 8%, while international was up 7%, driven by consistent strength in our packaging and aerospace equipment businesses. Operating margin improved 120 basis points to 32.3%, supported by a strong contribution from enterprise initiatives.

特種產品收入成長 3%，其中有機收入成長 2%。收入中包含了來自 PLS 的一個百分點的不利影響。按地區劃分，北美地區的收入下降了 1%，而去年同期則增長了 8%，這是一個艱難的比較；國際地區的收入增長了 7%，這主要得益於我們包裝和航空航天設備業務的持續強勁增長。營業利益率提高了 120 個基點，達到 32.3%，這主要得益於企業各項措施的強勁貢獻。

With that, let's move to slide 8 for an update on our full year 2025 guidance. Starting with the top line, we remain well positioned to outperform our end markets in Q4. And we continue to project organic growth of 0% to 2% for the full year. Per our usual process, our guidance factors in current demand levels, the incremental pricing actions related to tariffs the most recent auto build projections and typical seasonality. Total revenue is projected to be up 1% to 3%, reflecting current foreign exchange rates.

接下來，讓我們翻到第 8 張投影片，了解我們 2025 年全年業績指引的最新情況。先從營收方面來看，我們仍然處於有利地位，預計在第四季超越我們的終端市場。我們繼續預測全年有機成長率為 0% 至 2%。按照我們通常的流程，我們的指導意見考慮了當前的需求水準、與關稅相關的增量定價措施、最新的汽車產量預測和典型的季節性因素。受當前匯率影響，預計總收入將成長 1% 至 3%。

On the bottom line, we're highly confident that the ITW team will continue to execute at a high level operationally on all the profitability drivers within our control. This includes our enterprise initiatives, which we now expect will contribute 125 basis points to full year operating margins, independent of volume.

總而言之，我們非常有信心，ITW 團隊將繼續在所有可控的獲利驅動因素方面保持高水準的營運執行力。這包括我們的企業計劃，我們現在預計這些計劃將為全年營業利潤率貢獻 125 個基點，與銷售量無關。

Additionally, we expect that tariff-related pricing and supply chain actions will more than offset tariff costs and favorably impact both EPS and margins. Our operating margin guidance of 26% to 27% remains unchanged.

此外，我們預計與關稅相關的定價和供應鏈措施將足以抵消關稅成本，並對每股盈餘和利潤率產生積極影響。我們維持26%至27%的營業利益率預期不變。

After raising GAAP EPS guidance by $0.10 last quarter, we are narrowing the range of our guidance to a new range of $10.40 to $10.50. Our EPS guidance range includes the benefit of a lower projected tax rate of approximately 23% for the full year and factors in that the top line is trending towards the lower end of our revenue guidance ranges.

繼上季將GAAP每股盈餘預期調高0.10美元後，我們將預期範圍縮小至10.40美元至10.50美元。我們的每股盈餘預期範圍包含了全年預計約23%的較低稅率帶來的利好，並考慮到營收正朝著我們營收預期範圍的下限發展。

With those two elements effectively offsetting each other, we remain firmly on track to deliver on our EPS guidance, including the $10.45 midpoint, which as a reminder, is $0.10 higher than our initial guidance midpoint in February.

由於這兩個因素有效地相互抵消，我們仍有望實現每股收益預期，包括 10.45 美元的中點，需要提醒的是，這比我們 2 月份的初始預期中點高出 0.10 美元。

To wrap up, we remain highly confident that the inherent strength and resilience of the ITW business model, combined with our high-quality diversified portfolio, and most importantly, our dedicated colleagues around the world, all put us in a strong position to effectively manage our way through a challenging macro environment.

綜上所述，我們仍然非常有信心，ITW 商業模式固有的優勢和韌性，加上我們高品質的多元化投資組合，以及最重要的，我們遍布全球的敬業同事，所有這些都使我們處於有利地位，能夠有效地應對充滿挑戰的宏觀環境。

However, the demand picture evolves from here, we remain focused on delivering differentiated financial performance and steadfastly pursuing our long-term enterprise strategy, which is squarely centered around making above-market organic growth defining strength for ITW.

然而，隨著需求情勢的變化，我們將繼續專注於提供差異化的財務業績，並堅定不移地執行我們的長期企業策略，該策略的核心是實現高於市場水平的內生成長，這定義了 ITW 的優勢。

With that, Erin, I'll turn it back to you.

艾琳，那麼，我就把麥克風交還給你了。

Thank you, Michael. Jim, will you please open the call for Q&A?

謝謝你，麥可。吉姆，請你開啟問答環節好嗎？

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

Jeff Sprague, Vertical Partners.

Jeff Sprague，Vertical Partners。

Good morning, everyone. Maybe just two for me, hit two different businesses, if I could. First, just on construction. Clearly, you've been working the playbook. And one of the things that just jumps off the page to me is this is the 11th quarter in a row of organic revenue declines and the margins are still going up in the business.

各位早安。如果可以的話，我可能就去兩家不同的店看看。首先，就建築方面而言。顯然，你一直在按部就班地執行計劃。讓我印象深刻的一點是，這已經是該公司連續第 11 個季度有機收入下降，但利潤率仍在上升。

Maybe just -- anything in particular beyond kind of the normal 80/20 blocking and tackling that's behind that mix changes or other things? And just your confidence to be able to move those margins up further if and when the revenues do ever inflect positively?

或許只是——除了通常的 80/20 阻擋和擒抱之外，還有什麼特別的因素導致了這種混合變化或其他情況？您是否有信心在營收出現改善時，進一步提高利潤率？

Sure. Yeah. So Jeff, I think the margins in construction are squarely related to two things. Number one, I think the quality of the construction portfolio. As we often say, we tend to operate in businesses which the cyclicality in their bad but long term are fundamentally very healthy. And our strategy is always to try and operate in the most attractive parts of those markets. And that's what you're seeing in construction.

當然。是的。傑夫，我認為建築業的利潤率與兩件事密切相關。首先，我認為是建築作品集的品質。正如我們常說的，我們傾向於從事那些週期性波動較大，但長期來看本質上非常健康的行業。我們的策略始終是努力在這些市場中最具吸引力的領域中開展業務。這就是你在建築業看到的現象。

We're in the most attractive parts of the market. We are executing very well from a business model perspective against those particular parts of the market. And that's ultimately what drives the margins. It's ultimately also what will drive the high-quality organic growth going forward. So very confident that not only will we grow in construction when markets recover, but grow at very high quality.

我們身處市場中最具吸引力的地帶。從商業模式的角度來看，我們在這些特定市場領域執行得非常出色。而這最終決定了利潤率。最終，這也將成為推動未來高品質有機成長的動力。我非常有信心，市場復甦後，我們不僅會在建築業發展壯大，而且還會實現高品質的成長。

Great. And then maybe you could elaborate a little bit on -- it sounds like you've got a fair amount of visibility on Test & Measurement improving in the fourth quarter. Maybe you could speak to that, anything in particular that you're seeing orders, end markets? I'll leave it there, let you answer.

偉大的。然後，您或許可以再詳細闡述——聽起來您對第四季度測試與測量工作的改進情況已經有了相當清晰的了解。您能否談談這方面，特別是您觀察到的訂單狀況和終端市場狀況？我就說到這兒，這個問題留給你回答。

Yeah. So I think it's -- Test & Measurement had a normal cyclical improvement in Q4, which we expect to achieve again this year. Q3 was a little bit mixed, obviously. We saw continued slowdown on the CapEx side. Really, we would believe on the basis of the tariff uncertainty in Q2, ultimately having a spillover effect in terms of CapEx demand into Q3.

是的。所以我認為——測試與測量在第四季度出現了正常的周期性改善，我們預計今年將再次實現這一目標。第三季的情況顯然有些喜憂參半。我們看到資本支出方面持續放緩。實際上，我們認為，基於第二季關稅的不確定性，最終將對第三季的資本支出需求產生外溢效應。

So we expect that to improve a little bit. And then the other thing we saw in Q3, which should improve is we saw a little bit of a deceleration in semi, which only represents about 15% of the segment, but where we saw some real green shoots in Q2, we saw somewhat of a deceleration, still growth, but a deceleration in Q3, and we expect that to get a little better.

所以我們預計情況會略有改善。我們在第三季看到的另一件事是半導體產業成長速度略有放緩，這應該會有所改善。半導體行業僅佔該細分市場的約 15%，但在第二季度我們看到了一些真正的復甦跡象，第三季度增速有所放緩，雖然仍在增長，但確實有所下降，我們預計這種情況會有所好轉。

Okay, great. Thank you.

好的，太好了。謝謝。

Andy Kaplowitz, Citi.

安迪‧卡普洛維茨，花旗銀行。

Good morning, everyone. Chris or Michael, you obviously didn't change your organic revenue growth guide for the year. I think last quarter, you talked about embedded in it was 2% to 3% organic growth for the second half, which means you still need a big uptick in Q4. I don't think comps get a lot easier for you in Q4 versus Q3. So it's just more pricing that's laddering in Q4? Because I think you just said, right, you're run rating as usual. Any other businesses get better in Q4 versus Q3?

各位早安。克里斯或邁克爾，你們顯然沒有改變今年的自然收入成長預期。我認為上個季度你提到，下半年的有機成長率預計為 2% 到 3%，這意味著第四季仍然需要大幅成長。我不認為第四季的業績比較會比第三季容易多少。所以第四季只是價格進一步上漲嗎？因為我覺得你剛才說了，對吧，你的跑分和往常一樣。還有哪些企業第四季業績比第三季有所改善？

Well, I think what we are -- to give you a little bit of color on Q4, and you have to factor in what we said in the prepared remarks that we are trending towards the lower end of the organic growth guidance for the full year. We typically see a sequential improvement from Q3 to Q4 in that plus a couple of points of growth, primarily driven by the Test & Measurement business. As Chris just mentioned, and offset by the typical seasonal decline that we're seeing in our construction business.

嗯，我認為我們正在做的——為了給你們稍微介紹一下第四季度的情況，你們必須考慮到我們在準備好的發言稿中所說的，我們全年有機增長的趨勢正趨向於預期範圍的下限。通常情況下，從第三季度到第四季度，我們會看到業績環比改善，再加上幾個百分點的成長，這主要得益於測試與測量業務的成長。正如克里斯剛才提到的那樣，這也被我們建築業目前所看到的典型季節性下滑所抵消。

So Q3 to Q4 revenue is up maybe 1 point or so. On the margin side, what we also typically see from Q3 to Q4 is a modest decline sequentially of about 50 basis points or so. So still in that 27% range and with a nice improvement on a year-over-year basis. And then the kind of the key driver of Q4 is then a more normal tax rate. So that's about a $0.10 headwind relative to Q3. So Q4 looks a lot like Q3 with the normal tax rate, and that's how you get to kind of the implied midpoint of our guidance here.

所以第三季到第四季的營收可能成長了1個百分點左右。在利潤率方面，我們通常也會看到從第三季到第四季出現小幅環比下降，降幅約 50 個基點左右。所以仍然維持在 27% 的範圍內，並且與去年同期相比有了不錯的改善。那麼，第四季的關鍵驅動因素就是更正常的稅率。所以相對於第三季來說，這大約會帶來 0.10 美元的不利影響。因此，第四季與第三季在正常稅率下非常相似，這就是我們在這裡所暗示的業績指引中點的由來。

Maybe just a comment or two on Q3. I think it was a little bit of an unusual quarter in the sense that we came into Q3 after a strong June. We had a strong July, perhaps related to some of the tariff announcement and related pricing actions.

關於第三季度，或許可以補充一、兩點意見。我認為這是一個有點不尋常的季度，因為我們在經歷了強勁的六月之後進入了第三季度。7 月業績強勁，可能與一些關稅公告和相關的定價措施有關。

And then we saw a little bit of a slowdown in August, actually pretty pronounced in August and then a more normal September and really a mixed bag in the quarter with a stronger automotive performance, certainly -- but also some of the green shoots we talked about last quarter in the order rates in places like Test & Measurement and semi didn't really materialize for us.

然後我們在 8 月份看到了一些放緩，實際上 8 月份的放緩相當明顯，9 月份則恢復了正常，本季度的情況喜憂參半，汽車行業的表現當然更強勁——但我們上個季度談到的一些復甦跡象，例如測試與測量和半導體領域的訂單率，並沒有真正出現。

So I think at the end of the day, though, we're able to offset some of this choppiness this macro softness with strong margin performance and as we typically do, we found a way to deliver a pretty solid quarter from a margin, earnings and free cash flow standpoint.

所以我覺得歸根結底，我們能夠透過強勁的利潤率表現來抵消一些宏觀經濟疲軟帶來的波動，而且正如我們通常所做的那樣，我們找到了一種方法，從利潤率、收益和自由現金流的角度來看，實現了一個相當穩健的季度業績。

Michael, helpful color. And speaking of that, I mean, you're well up already in your range in auto in terms of margin, almost 22% in the quarter. And auto markets, as you know, overall, don't feel that rate yet. So can you actually -- I know you did 5% organic growth, but can you actually push to the higher end of your low to mid-20s over the next couple of years? How should we think about that given you're kind of already there?

邁克爾，有用的顏色。說到這一點，我的意思是，就汽車產業的利潤率而言，你們已經遠遠超出預期，本季利潤率接近 22%。如你所知，汽車市場整體上還沒有感受到這種利率的影響。所以，你真的能做到嗎——我知道你實現了 5% 的自然增長，但你真的能在接下來的幾年裡將增長幅度提升到 20% 出頭到 25% 的水平嗎？既然你已經身處其中，我們該如何看待這個問題？

Yes. I think we're pretty confident in the margin the target we laid out kind of low to mid-20s by next year. I think there's still a lot of opportunity here from an enterprise initiative standpoint, primarily. You also see a pretty healthy dose of product line simplification again this quarter, which -- that's all short-term headwind to the top line but really positions the remainder of the portfolio for growth and higher margin performance as we exit some of the slower growth and less profitable typically product line. So the market builds -- will be what they are next -- in Q4, they will be a little bit lower probably than what we saw in Q3.

是的。我認為我們對明年設定的利潤率目標相當有信心，大概在20%到25%之間。我認為，從企業創新的角度來看，這裡仍然有很多機會。本季我們也看到了相當大幅度的產品線簡化，這雖然短期內會對營收造成不利影響，但隨著我們逐步淘汰一些成長較慢、利潤較低的產品線，實際上為剩餘產品組合的成長和更高的利潤率表現奠定了基礎。所以，市場建設——接下來第四季的情況如何——可能會比第三季略低。

So we won't have the same amount of operating leverage but we'll still outperform as we have historically in the builds. And next year, you should expect kind of our typical 2 to 3 points above build. Whatever that build number is, obviously, as we sit here today, we don't know that.

因此，我們的營運槓桿作用不會像以往那麼大，但我們仍然會在建設方面取得優異的成績。明年，你們應該會期待我們通常會比往年高出 2 到 3 個百分點。顯然，就目前而言，我們並不知道那個版本號碼是多少。

Andy, just to add to that, the other big driver of margin improvement in auto is customer-back innovation. We're getting a real nice healthy contribution from that this year basically have to continue to accelerate over the next couple of years. and ITW innovation always comes to our margin.

安迪，補充一點，汽車產業利潤率提高的另一個主要驅動因素是客戶支援的創新。今年我們從中獲得了非常可觀的收益，基本上需要在未來幾年繼續加速成長。 ITW的創新始終是我們的利潤來源。

Appreciate the color, guys.

夥計們，欣賞一下這色彩吧。

Jamie Cook, Truist Securities.

Jamie Cook，Truist Securities。

The guidance relative to earlier in the year, I think earlier in the year, you assumed FX headwind of $0.30 that went positive or neutral last quarter, what's embedded in the guidance. You also have the benefits now from the lower tax rate.

與年初相比，我認為年初時你們假設匯率逆風為 0.30 美元，而上個季度這種逆風轉為正或中性，這都體現在業績指引中。現在您還可以享受較低稅率帶來的好處。

So I guess, Michael, I'm just trying to understand the puts and takes because it sounds like we have at least $0.40 of tailwind. You're lowering your organic growth to the -- sorry, your sales to the lower end, but it still seems like, I don't know, the guidance should be better, I guess, than what it is just based on those tailwinds. So if you can help me understand that I guess.

所以我想，邁克爾，我只是想弄清楚買賣雙方的立場，因為聽起來我們至少有 0.40 美元的順風。你們的有機成長放緩了——抱歉，是銷售額放緩了，但即便如此，我覺得，基於這些利好因素，業績指引應該比現在的情況要好一些。所以，如果你能幫我理解這一點，那就太好了。

Yeah, I think the short answer is that just given the choppy demand environment, we're maybe taking a more measured a more cautious approach to our guidance here as we go into Q4. We're off to a solid start in October, but things can change quickly as we saw both as an example, the auto builds, the swing in auto builds, semi not really panning out. So I think we're just being a little bit more measured in our guidance here with one quarter to go. And as always, we have a path to do a little bit better than what we were laying out for you.

是的，我認為簡而言之，鑑於當前需求環境波動不定，我們在進入第四季度時可能會採取更加謹慎和穩健的方式來發布業績指引。10 月我們開局不錯，但情況可能會迅速變化，例如，汽車製造、汽車製造的波動、半拖車並沒有真正發揮作用。所以我覺得，考慮到還有一個季度要過，我們在業績指引方面會更加謹慎一些。就像以往一樣，我們還有改進的空間，可以做得比我們之前向你們展示的更好。

You cut off initially, but I think you're talking about FX, what's embedded here is the current rates. As of today, and obviously, that they can change a little bit there a little bit of a headwind -- tailwind now relative to a headwind earlier in the year, but we're talking pennies. So I think in Q3, FX was favorable $0.04, but then other things like restructuring were unfavorable by a couple of pennies.

你一開始就說錯了，但我認為你指的是外匯，這裡包含的是當前匯率。截至目前，情況顯然可能會略有變化，現在可能會有一些逆風——相對於年初的逆風而言，現在是順風，但我們說的只是微不足道的差別。所以我認為第三季度，外匯因素有利，帶來了 0.04 美元的收益，但其他因素，例如重組，則帶來了幾美分的不利影響。

So there's some puts and takes there. And we've also embedded obviously, as we said in the prepared remarks, the lower full year tax rate of 23%, and we expect a more typical 24% to 25% tax rate here for the fourth quarter. So hopefully, that's helpful.

所以這裡面有一些進退兩難的情況。正如我們在準備好的演講稿中所說，我們也顯然考慮了全年較低的稅率 23%，我們預計第四季度的稅率將更典型地在 24% 到 25% 之間。希望這能有所幫助。

Okay, thank you. I'll get back in queue.

好的，謝謝。我重新排隊。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

Tammy Zakaria, JPMorgan.

Tammy Zakaria，摩根大通。

Hi, good morning to Team ITW. I hope you're doing well. Maybe on your long-term question for you. Given all the policy changes to incentivize bringing auto production back into the US. Do you perceive this to be an opportunity down the line given your market share with the big 3? Or would onshoring not be a net gain because you already supply parts to manufacture overseas. So how to think about that onshoring opportunity in other?

各位ITW團隊的朋友們，早安。希望你一切都好。或許這是你長期關注的問題。鑑於所有旨在激勵汽車生產回歸美國的政策變化。鑑於您在三大巨頭中的市場份額，您是否認為這在未來是一個機會？或者說，由於你已經向海外製造企業供應零件，所以將生產轉移到國內反而不會帶來淨收益。那麼，其他方面又該如何看待這種本土化機會呢？

Yeah. So Tami, I would say that largely, as we've said before, we're a producer we sell a company. And so we were already -- we're positioned to supply our auto customers anywhere in the world wherever they are based on our current manufacturing setup. And that will continue. So business coming back to the US would just mean more production for our US factories, but they're already here. So we don't see -- I mean, there wouldn't be a huge net benefit that we can see based on the fact that we're produced where we sell the company.

是的。所以塔米，我想說，正如我們之前所說，我們基本上是一家生產公司，我們出售的是一家公司。因此，憑藉我們目前的生產佈局，我們已經做好了向世界各地的汽車客戶提供服務的準備。這種情況還會繼續下去。因此，企業回流美國只會增加美國工廠的產量，但它們本來就在美國。所以，我們看不到——我的意思是，基於我們在銷售公司的地方生產這一事實，我們看不到巨大的淨收益。

Understood. And one question on PLS. I think it's about a 1% impact. Should we expect this to continue at that 1% range for the next few years? Or is this year more of a heavy lifting so it might fade as we go into next year and beyond?

明白了。還有一個關於PLS的問題。我認為影響大約是 1%。我們是否應該預期這種情況在未來幾年內繼續維持在 1% 左右？或者說，今年的工作量更大，所以這種勢頭可能會隨著明年及以後的到來而減弱？

Yeah. So we haven't the planning process completed yet to tell you. But basically, what I would say is that for us, PLS is a bottom-up activity. It's driven by our businesses. It's very much an essential part of the ongoing kind of strategic review that we do in a critical part of 80/20 in our divisions.

是的。所以，我們還沒有完成規劃流程，所以暫時無法告知您。但總的來說，我想說的是，對我們來說，PLS 是一項自下而上的活動。這是由我們的業務所驅動的。這是我們在各部門進行 80/20 策略調整的關鍵環節，也是我們持續進行的策略評估的重要組成部分。

And obviously, deep into the company, we have this very tried-and-trusted methodology requires a lot of discipline, but it's not a benefit that our divisions get from this. But the point is that there's -- it's bottom up. We don't have the numbers for 2026 yet. But whatever it is, it's something that makes sense in the context of -- it makes sense from a long-term growth perspective in terms of it provides strategic clarity around where we want to focus, effective resource deployment on the back of that.

顯然，在公司內部，我們有著一套非常成熟可靠的方法論，這需要很強的紀律性，但我們的各個部門並沒有從中獲得任何好處。但關鍵在於——它是自下而上的。我們還沒有2026年的數據。但無論是什麼，從長遠發展的角度來看，這都是有意義的，因為它為我們想要關注的重點提供了戰略上的清晰方向，並在此基礎上有效地部署了資源。

And also from a margin improvement standpoint, obviously, there's some cost savings, which are meaningful component of enterprise initiatives. And a lot of these projects have a payback of less than a year or so. So we very much see it PLS, whether it's 50 bps or 100 bps as an ongoing value creating activity in our divisions. And like I say, we've got a lot of positive experience and expertise on this, but it's going to be a bottom-up number basically.

從提高利潤率的角度來看，顯然可以節省一些成本，這是企業措施的重要組成部分。而且很多這類專案的投資回收期都不到一年左右。因此，我們非常重視 PLS，無論是 50 個基點或 100 個基點，這都是我們各部門持續創造價值的活動。正如我所說，我們在這方面有很多積極的經驗和專業知識，但這基本上是一個由下而上的數字。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Joe Ritchie, Goldman Sachs.

喬·里奇，高盛集團。

Thanks. Good morning, guys. I know that you'll typically like guide to trends. And I guess it's worth kind of thinking about potential initial framework with the moving pieces that you know today. Any color that you can kind of give us on how you're thinking about it, at least like this early on and what 2026 could look like?

謝謝。各位早安。我知道你通常會喜歡趨勢指南。我想，值得思考一下，在你目前所了解的各種因素的基礎上，如何建立一個潛在的初始框架。您能否大致談談您對2026年的看法，至少在目前這個階段，以及您對2026年可能的樣子有什麼設想？

Yeah. I mean I think as you say, Joe, we don't really give guidance until we have gone through our bottom-up planning process here and talk to the segments about their plans for 2026, and that doesn't happen until in November here.

是的。我的意思是，正如你所說，喬，我們只有在完成自下而上的規劃流程並與各個部門討論他們 2026 年的計劃之後，才會給出指導意見，而這要到 11 月份才會發生。

To give you a little bit of a way to think about this, maybe I think you should expect that for our usual process, our top line guidance will be based on run rates exiting Q4, we'd expect some continued progress on our strategic initiatives, including the contribution from customer-back innovation. We'd expect some market share gains and the combination of those things leading to above-market organic growth again in 2026. And then the big question is really what will the market give us.

為了讓您更好地理解這一點，我認為您應該預期，按照我們通常的流程，我們的營收指引將基於第四季度末的運行率，我們預計我們的策略舉措將持續取得進展，包括來自客戶回饋的創新所做出的貢獻。我們預計市場佔有率會有所成長，這些因素結合起來將在 2026 年再次帶來高於市場平均的內生成長。那麼，真正的問題在於市場會帶給我們什麼。

On the things within our control, we'd expect to see continued margin improvement and a healthy contribution from enterprise initiatives. You should expect to see some strong incremental margins that are probably above our historical average.

在我們可控制的範圍內，我們預期利潤率將持續提高，企業各項措施也將做出可觀的貢獻。預計利潤率將大幅成長，可能高於我們歷史平均。

And I think that was kind of the big items, then there'll be some puts and takes around price and FX and lower share count that may skew favorably. I'd expect a similar tax rate this year. And then as usual, like I said, we'll update you in February, which will include our usual kind of segment detail to help everybody kind of think through what the year might look like.

我認為這些是比較重要的因素，接下來價格、匯率以及股票數量減少等方面可能會出現一些利空關係，這些因素可能會產生有利的影響。我預計今年的稅率與往年相差無幾。然後，就像我之前說的，我們會像往常一樣在二月份更新情況，屆時會提供一些細節信息，幫助大家思考一下今年的發展趨勢。

Okay. Great. That's helpful, Michael. And then I guess, just on capital deployment. I know you guys are doing the $1.5 billion buyback. It seems like you've got probably some room on your balance sheet if you wanted to lever up a little further and still stay investment grade. Like how are you guys like thinking about the right leverage for you going forward? And put that in the context of potential like M&A opportunities and what you guys are looking at across your different businesses?

好的。偉大的。那很有幫助，邁克爾。然後，我想，就只是資本部署的問題了。我知道你們正在進行15億美元的股票回購計畫。看起來，如果你想進一步提高槓桿率，同時又想保持投資等級信用評級，你的資產負債表上可能還有一些空間。你們覺得未來如何才能找到最適合自己的槓桿？然後把這些放在潛在的併購機會以及你們在不同業務領域正在關注的問題的背景下考慮呢？

Yeah. I mean I think we're sitting here at about 2 times EBITDA leverage, which is right in line with what our long-term target has been. The buyback specifically is really the allocation of the surplus capital that we generate, which is a big number for ITW, about $1.5 billion.

是的。我的意思是，我認為我們目前的槓桿率約為 EBITDA 的 2 倍，這與我們長期的目標完全一致。具體來說，回購實際上是對我們產生的盈餘資本的分配，這對 ITW 來說是一個很大的數字，大約 15 億美元。

And that's what is being allocated to the share buyback program and leads to a reduction in the overall share count of about 2%. But all of that only happens after we have invested in these highly profitable core businesses for both organic growth and productivity. We're fortunate that only consumes 20% to 25% of our operating cash flow.

這筆資金將用於股票回購計劃，這將導致總股本減少約 2%。但這一切只有在我們對這些高利潤的核心業務進行投資，以實現有機成長和提高生產力之後才會發生。我們很幸運，這只消耗了我們營運現金流的 20% 到 25%。

The second priority here is an attractive dividend that grows in line with earnings over time. Chris talked about this being our 62nd year of consecutive dividend increases up 7%. And then when all said and done, we still have a lot of capacity on the balance sheet for any type of M&A opportunities. As you may know, we have the highest credit rating in the industrial space, we have arguably the strongest balance sheet. And so there's a lot of room here if the right opportunities were to present themselves.

其次，要確保股息具有吸引力，並且能夠隨著獲利的成長而成長。克里斯談到，今年是我們連續第 62 年提高股息，漲幅達 7%。最後，總而言之，我們的資產負債表上仍有足夠的資金來應對任何類型的併購機會。如您所知，我們在工業領域擁有最高的信用評級，我們的資產負債表也堪稱最強勁。所以，如果出現合適的機會，這裡還有很大的發展空間。

Okay. Great, guys. Thank you.

好的。太棒了，夥計們。謝謝。

Stephen Volkmann.

史蒂芬·沃爾克曼。

Great. Thank you. Good morning, guys. So I'm curious whatever commentary you might wish to provide around what you're seeing on sort of price cost and obviously, it didn't impact you in the quarter. But are you seeing suppliers raising prices and you're kind of able to offset that, however you choose or you think maybe they're holding back and that's still to come? And then in that vein, just how do you ascertain that you will cover whatever cost? Will it be dollar for dollar or also on margin. Thanks.

偉大的。謝謝。各位早安。所以我很想知道您對目前價格成本的情況有何評論，顯然，這並沒有對您本季的業績造成影響。但是，您是否看到供應商提價，而您能夠以某種方式抵消這部分成本？或者您認為他們可能在觀望，漲價尚未到來？那麼，按照這個思路，你要如何確保能夠負擔所有費用呢？是以美元對美元結算，還是也允許追加保證金？謝謝。

Yeah. I think, Steve, the biggest driver of cost increases this year has been the tariff-related cost increases. And I think we've responded with both pricing actions that we've talked about and also supply chain actions. As you know, we are largely produced where we sell company. I think 93% or so of the company is produced where we sell.

是的。史蒂夫，我認為今年成本上漲的最大驅動因素是關稅相關的成本上漲。我認為我們已經透過之前討論過的價格調整措施和供應鏈調整措施做出了回應。如您所知，我們的產品主要在我們銷售公司所在地生產。我認為公司大約 93% 的產品都是在我們銷售的地方生產的。

We had a little exposure that we talked about earlier in the year. We've worked hard to mitigate that and put ourselves in a really good position. We've been able to, through those actions, offset the impact from tariffs this year and in Q3. As we said in our prepared remarks, price cost was positive both from a dollar-for-dollar earnings standpoint and also from a margin standpoint.

我們之前有過一次小小的曝光，我們在今年早些時候討論過。我們努力減輕了這種情況的影響，並使自己處於非常有利的地位。透過這些措施，我們已經能夠抵銷今年和第三季關稅帶來的影響。正如我們在準備好的演講稿中所說，無論從美元收益的角度來看，或是從利潤率的角度來看，價格成本都是正面的。

So I feel like at this point, we're kind of back to a more normal environment at this point, from a price cost standpoint, we have not completely caught up yet, but we've got a quarter to go. And then for next year, who knows what the tariff environment might mean for next year. But I think we feel very confident, given our track record here in terms of being able to manage whatever those cost increases, whether they are typical inflationary increases or tariff increases might be as we head into next year.

所以我覺得，從價格成本的角度來看，我們現在的情況已經基本恢復到正常水準了，雖然還沒有完全恢復，但我們還有四分之一的時間。至於明年，誰也說不準關稅環境會如何影響明年。但我認為，鑑於我們在這方面的過往記錄，我們非常有信心能夠應對任何成本增長，無論是典型的通貨膨脹增長還是明年可能出現的關稅增長。

Super. Okay. Thanks. And then just pivoting China was obviously really good for you guys this quarter. I'm wondering if you might be able to drill in there a little bit and give us a sense of what's driving that? And I don't know, maybe some of the CBI initiatives or something.

極好的。好的。謝謝。顯然，本季將重心轉向中國市場對你們來說非常有利。我想請您深入探討一下，讓我們了解背後的驅動因素是什麼？我不知道，也許是英國工業聯合會（CBI）的一些舉措之類的。

Yeah, do you want to go ahead, Chris.

好的，克里斯，你想繼續嗎？

Yeah. So basically, Steve, what's driving channel right now is auto in China, in particular, I think our penetration on EV in China, particularly with Chinese OEMs. We continue to make great progress on CBI and market penetration in China, particularly with Chinese OEMs. We continue to grow content per vehicle. As you know, China represents mid-60s in terms of percentage of worldwide EV builds. And we're growing nicely there, particularly with a strong position with Chinese OEMs.

是的。所以基本上，史蒂夫，目前推動通路發展的是中國的汽車市場，特別是我認為我們在中國電動車市場的滲透率，尤其是中國汽車製造商的滲透率。我們在CBI和中國市場滲透方面持續取得巨大進展，尤其是在中國OEM廠商方面。我們持續增加每輛車的內容。如您所知，中國在全球電動車產量中所佔比例約為 60% 左右。我們在中國的業務發展良好，尤其是在中國整車製造商中佔據了穩固的地位。

In addition, you mentioned CBI, I would say that China, even though it represents about 8% of our revenues, we certainly get disproportionate along of our patent activities in China in terms of the level of innovation activity that's going on. So yeah, innovation in China, particularly in automotive, is what's striking our progress there. And we're basically penetrating at a level well above the market.

此外，您提到了中國生物技術產業協會（CBI），我想說，儘管中國僅占我們收入的 8% 左右，但就創新活動的水平而言，我們在中國開展的專利活動絕對不成比例地增長。是的，中國的創新，尤其是在汽車領域的創新，正在推動我們在那裡取得進步。我們的市場滲透率基本上遠高於市場平均。

Yeah. And maybe to put some quantification around it. If I just look at kind of year-to-date in China, as Chris said, the big driver is our automotive business, up 15%. That's our largest business in China, but also Test & Measurement, Electronics up in the mid-teens, Palmers & Fluids up 10%, welding up 20%-plus

是的。或許還需要對其進行一些量化分析。如果我僅從中國今年迄今為止的情況來看，正如克里斯所說，最大的驅動力是我們的汽車業務，成長了 15%。這是我們在中國最大的業務，此外，測試測量、電子產品（成長15%左右）、帕默斯和流體產品（成長10%）、焊接產品（成長20%以上）也都成長了。

I mean I think the fueled by CBI certainly, in most cases here, I think the team is doing a really nice job overall, up 12% in China on a year-to-date basis. And pretty confident that the things again that are within our own control will continue to be -- have a positive contribution to the top and bottom line in Q4 and headed into next year.

我的意思是，我認為在大多數情況下，這主要得益於 CBI 的推動，我認為團隊整體上做得非常好，今年迄今為止在中國增長了 12%。我相當有信心，我們自身能夠控制的事情將繼續對第四季度的營收和利潤做出積極貢獻，並延續到明年。

Great. Thank you, guys.

偉大的。謝謝大家。

Julian Mitchell, Barclays.

朱利安米切爾，巴克萊銀行。

Hi, good morning. Maybe just wanted to start with the operating margins. So I think you mentioned, Michael, that next year, you should be above the historical incremental. And I guess you have that sort of placeholder of 35% to 40% dating back to the Investor Day.

您好，早安。或許只是想先從營業利益率著手。所以我想你剛才提到過，邁克爾，明年你們應該會超過歷史平均。我猜想，從投資者日開始，你們就一直有 35% 到 40% 的佔位符。

So it's presumably in reference to that. But just wanted to understand as you look at next year on the margin side of things, is there a big kind of payback from the restructuring efforts that happened this year coming in -- price/cost maybe for this year as a whole is margin neutral and then that flips positive next year? Maybe just any sort of fleshing out of the thoughts on some of those margin moving parts, please?

所以，這大概是指那件事。但我想了解的是，從利潤率的角度來看，明年是否會有很大的回報，今年進行的重組工作是否會帶來顯著的回報——價格/成本可能在今年整體上是利潤率中性的，然後明年轉為正值？或許可以詳細闡述關於邊緣變化因素的一些想法？

Yeah. I think, Julian, the biggest driver of margin performance for, I'm going to say, the last decade or so has been the enterprise initiatives, and we've consistently put up 100 basis points of margin improvement from our strategic sourcing efforts and from our 80/20 front-to-back efforts. And so we would expect that to continue to be the case next year. Whether that's exactly 100 basis points or not, we won't know until we've rolled up the plans. But that will far outweigh any contributions from price cost for example.

是的。朱利安，我認為，在過去十年左右的時間裡，利潤率表現的最大驅動力是企業舉措，我們透過策略採購和 80/20 前後端整合，持續實現了 100 個基點的利潤率提升。因此，我們預計明年這種情況還會持續下去。究竟是不是剛好是 100 個基點，我們只有把所有方案匯總起來才能知道。但這將遠遠超過價格成本等方面的任何貢獻。

And then the other big element and which is a function of really what end market demand will do is if you look just at our performance year-to-date or in the third quarter, our incremental margins are significantly above kind of our historical 35% to 40%, including 65% in the third quarter. And you look at the margin performance this quarter in the automotive OEM business, where 5% organic growth translates into income growth of 20%-plus.

另一個重要因素，也是最終市場需求的體現，如果你只看我們今年迄今或第三季的業績，我們的增量利潤率明顯高於我們歷史上 35% 到 40% 的水平，其中第三季度達到了 65%。再看看本季汽車OEM業務的利潤率表現，5%的有機成長轉化為20%以上的營收成長。

So it's just an illustration of -- we don't need a lot of growth to put up some really differentiated performance from a margin and profitability standpoint. So I can't tell you, as we sit here today, what the incrementals might be for next year on the organic growth. But I would tell you, I believe that they -- it will probably be above the historical range that we just referenced.

所以這只是一個例子——我們不需要很大的成長就能在利潤率和獲利能力方面取得真正差異化的業績。所以，就目前而言，我無法告訴你們明年有機成長的增量會是多少。但我認為，他們的——很可能會高於我們剛才提到的歷史範圍。

That's helpful. And then just maybe one for Christmas, looking at slide 8 and that CBI contribution of sort of over 2 points to sales and the sort of partial offset from PLS headwinds that you discussed earlier on this call somewhat. And I realize this isn't how you look at it, and it's sort of really bottom-up driven. But if we're thinking about that spread of, say, CBI versus PLS enterprise-wide.

那很有幫助。然後，也許聖誕節可以考慮一下，看看第 8 張幻燈片，CBI 對銷售額的貢獻超過 2 個百分點，這在一定程度上抵消了您之前在電話會議上討論過的 PLS 不利因素。我知道你不是這樣看待這件事的，而且這實際上是一種由下而上驅動的現象。但如果我們考慮的是，比如說，CBI 與 PLS 在企業範圍內的分佈。

Is the assumption that, that should be more and more of a net positive as those CBI efforts that you talked about at the Investor Day a couple of years ago, increasingly get traction. Just trying to understand how to think about the delta between those two, understanding that they are independent bottom-up process.

假設隨著您幾年前在投資者日上談到的 CBI 舉措越來越取得進展，這將越來越成為一種淨積極因素。我只是想弄清楚如何看待這兩者之間的差異，因為我知道它們是獨立的自下而上的過程。

Yeah. I'm not sure there's a huge amount of correlation between the two, Julian. I mean CBI is really referencing our efforts around improving the quality of execution on innovation, whereas PLS we typically and our business is typically used for kind of product line pruning. I think the only correlation to is that there were affected to differentiation. PLS results is as a result of where we feel maybe we're on the same level of differentiation, and we're (inaudible) accordingly, where CBI, we're leaning in to basically create and develop more differentiated products.

是的。朱利安，我不確定這兩者之間有很大的相關性。我的意思是，CBI 實際上指的是我們為提高創新執行品質所做的努力，而 PLS 通常以及我們的業務通常用於產品線精簡。我認為唯一的關係是它們受到了分化的影響。PLS 的結果是因為我們認為我們可能處於同一差異化水平，因此我們（聽不清楚）相應地，CBI 則致力於創造和開發更多差異化產品。

For sure, you're going to see an improvement in CBI over time. We've already seen that. The number has actually doubled since 2018, directionally in the 1% range, it was 2% last year, trending 2.3% to 2.5% this year, well on track to get to 3%-plus by 2030. PLS is a circumstantial and ongoing review of our businesses by our businesses of their product lines, and they react accordingly. And as I said earlier, we see this as there's a lot of value creation comes from PLS but in a different way. So I'm not sure there's a huge amount of correlation between the two. I can take the two kind of differently.

可以肯定的是，隨著時間的推移，CBI 將會得到改善。我們已經看到了這一點。自 2018 年以來，這一數字實際上已經翻了一番，大致在 1% 的範圍內增長，去年為 2%，今年呈 2.3% 至 2.5% 的趨勢，很有可能在 2030 年達到 3% 以上。PLS 是我們各業務部門對其產品線進行持續性、情境性的審查，並據此做出相應反應。正如我之前所說，我們認為PLS能夠創造很多價值，但方式不同。所以我不太確定這兩者之間是否有很大的相關性。我可以對這兩件事有不同的理解。

But the sort of net spread of them should be increasingly positive, I suppose?

但我認為，它們的淨擴散幅度應該會越來越大，呈現正成長趨勢吧？

It should be. No, absolutely driven by improvements in CBI.

應該如此。不，完全是由CBI的改進所驅動的。

Correct. That's correct. I mean PLS, as Chris said, is an outcome of a process or 80/20 front-to-back process. We've talked about kind of in the long run, maintenance PLS being in that 50 basis points range. We have a little bit more this year. We've talked about specialty and kind of strategically repositioning that segment for faster organic growth.

正確的。沒錯。我的意思是，正如克里斯所說，PLS 是一個流程的結果，或者說是一個 80/20 的前後端流程的結果。我們已經討論過，從長遠來看，維護性PLS應該在50個基點的範圍內。今年我們多了一些。我們已經討論過專業領域，以及如何對該領域進行策略性重新定位，以實現更快的自然成長。

And then as Chris said, CBI will continue to improve from here. So that spread, to your point, will widen. But my thought for putting them right next to each other on slide 8. They're completely independent of each other. And so I just want to make sure that's clear that there's no linkage between the two. But mathematically, the spread will grow between the two. And net-net will be a more positive contributor to organic -- above-market organic growth as we go forward.

正如克里斯所說，CBI 將會繼續進步。所以，正如你所說，這種傳播範圍將會擴大。但我的想法是把它們並排放在第 8 張投影片上。它們彼此完全獨立。所以我想澄清一下，這兩者之間沒有任何關聯。但從數學角度來看，兩者之間的差距將會擴大。而總而言之，隨著我們不斷前進，淨利潤將對有機成長——高於市場平均的有機成長——做出更積極的貢獻。

That's great color. Thank you.

顏色真好看。謝謝。

Joe O'Dea, Wells Fargo.

喬‧奧迪亞，富國銀行。

Hi, good morning. Thanks for taking my questions. Can you talk about the tariff impact a little bit? There were periods of time earlier this year where the math would have suggested something up to 2% kind of price requirement to offset. And it seems like we're in an environment now where the pricing required is probably less than 1%. But anyway, any thoughts around that?

您好，早安。謝謝您回答我的問題。您能談談關稅的影響嗎？今年早些時候，曾有一段時間，根據數學計算，需要將價格提高到 2% 左右才能抵消損失。而我們現在所處的環境似乎要求的定價可能低於 1%。不過，大家對此有什麼想法嗎？

And then stepping back, it would seem like that's not necessarily a big hit to demand. And so the tariff kind of overhang would be more uncertainty related than magnitude of pricing required at this point related, but your thoughts on that?

退一步想來，這似乎不一定會對需求造成很大打擊。因此，關稅方面的不確定性與目前所需的定價幅度有關，而不是與價格的不確定性有關，您對此有什麼看法？

Yeah. I think price cost from in terms of kind of combined with supply chain actions, our ability to offset tariffs, I think, is not really the main event at this point. I think we've demonstrated that we know how to do that. And we've further mitigated the risk of any tariffs related specifically to China. So that part of the equation we feel really good about. I think the impact on demand is probably something we talked about also on the last call that it may have led to a little bit of a demand -- orders being frozen back in the April kind of Q2 time frame.

是的。我認為，就價格成本而言，結合供應鏈措施，以及我們抵銷關稅的能力，我認為，目前這並不是主要問題。我認為我們已經證明我們知道如何做到這一點。而且，我們也進一步降低了與中國相關的任何關稅風險。所以，我們對這部分結果非常滿意。我認為對需求的影響可能是我們在上次電話會議上也討論過的問題，這可能導致了一些需求——訂單在 4 月第二季左右被凍結。

And there's probably a little bit of overhang still from that. I mean I think we saw -- what's been a pretty choppy demand environment, as I said earlier, we had some positive order activity in June, July, then it slowed, April, May, kind of pretty choppy also.

而且可能還有一些懸垂部分。我的意思是，我認為我們看到——正如我之前所說，需求環境一直相當不穩定，我們在 6 月和 7 月出現了一些積極的訂單活動，然後就放緩了，4 月和 5 月也相當不穩定。

So I think the impact maybe from a demand standpoint, at least initially was maybe more significant and who knows kind of where we go from here into next year. But I think it's largely behind us at this point. Certainly, from a cost standpoint and maybe from a demand standpoint, this is no longer -- tariffs are no longer the kind of the minivan here.

所以我覺得，從需求角度來看，這種影響可能至少在初期更為顯著，至於明年情況會如何，誰也說不準。但我認為這件事基本上已經過去了。當然，從成本角度來看，或許從需求角度來看，情況已經不同了──關稅不再是這裡小型貨車的類型了。

And so what -- like what do you think the main event is in terms of seeing kind of an unlock of better demand, right? Because you're outgrowing markets, but that market growth rate not kind of all that inspiring at this point. And so in sort of this protracted kind of challenged demand environment if tariffs are kind of easing as a headwind. What do you think is the key to the box?

那麼——你認為釋放更大需求的主要因素是什麼？因為你們的成長速度超過了市場需求，但目前來看，市場成長率並不太令人鼓舞。因此，在這種長期需求疲軟的環境下，如果關稅有所放鬆，就會成為一種不利因素。你認為打開盒子的鑰匙是什麼？

Yeah. So I think, Joe, we take a long-term view here. We believe fundamentally, we're in really good markets for the long term. We're obviously through a period right now where there's quite a bit of contraction and uncertainty and so on and so forth in areas like construction. But our fundamental thesis is that we're in markets which we believe for the long term are attractive.

是的。所以我覺得，喬，我們應該從長遠角度來看這個問題。我們從根本上相信，從長遠來看，我們身處在非常好的市場。顯然，我們現在正處於一個經濟萎縮、充滿不確定性的時期，尤其是在建築等領域。但我們的基本理念是，我們所處的市場從長遠來看是具有吸引力的。

We want to make sure we're in the best part of those markets, and we believe that we are. We believe we can see quite clearly in areas like automotive and construction and historically in welding and food equipment that were outgrowing markets at the point in which the cycle turns, we'll be really well positioned to Michael's earlier point, not just for growth.

我們希望確保自己處於這些市場中最好的位置，我們相信我們做到了。我們相信，在汽車、建築以及歷史上焊接和食品設備等領域，當經濟週期轉向時，市場成長速度超過需求，我們將非常清楚地看到，正如邁克爾之前所說，我們將處於非常有利的位置，而不僅僅是為了成長。

But for even higher quality of growth on the basis that our incrementals have strengthened from historical levels on the basis of portfolio pruning around sustainable differentiation, coupled with very high-quality execution on the business model. So we feel pretty good about both the long term where we're just going through a carrier where we see some short-term demand issues. But we feel we've got a really good portfolio for long-term growth.

但為了實現更高品質的成長，我們透過圍繞永續差異化進行投資組合精簡，並在商業模式上進行非常高品質的執行，使增量成長從歷史水準得到加強。所以我們對長期前景相當樂觀，目前只是在與一家承運商打交道，我們看到了一些短期需求問題。但我們認為我們擁有一個非常適合長期成長的投資組合。

Maybe just tying that into test and measurement and what you're seeing there. It seems like in an environment, you're investing in CBI, like we hear a number of companies talking about innovation. It would seem like they need your equipment. Like are you seeing this kind of build up in terms of what would have kept them on the sidelines. But if they want to invest in innovation, it would seem like they're going to need your help.

或許可以把這一點與測試和測量以及你在那裡看到的情況聯繫起來。似乎在這樣的環境下，你正在投資 CBI，就像我們聽到許多公司談論創新一樣。他們似乎需要你的設備。你是否看到了這種導致他們一直待在場邊的原因？但如果他們想投資創新，似乎就需要你的幫助了。

Absolutely. That's correct. I mean, Test & Measurement is a really fertile space for us in terms of long-term growth. There's lots of new materials being developed. There's increasing stringency in innovation standards and quality standards, all of which are acquiring more and more exacting testing equipment, and that's where we play.

絕對地。沒錯。我的意思是，就長期發展而言，測試與測量對我們來說是一個非常有發展潛力的領域。目前正在研發許多新材料。創新標準和品質標準越來越嚴格，所有這些都需要越來越精密的測試設備，而這正是我們發揮作用的地方。

So again, short-term issues here around the CapEx environment and one. So a bit of compression in Q3, you were adding some CapEx freezing in Q2. But for the long term, this is a really, really healthy environment for us. It will be a healthy environment for us on the basis of the quality of innovation in Test & Measurement and also the end markets they're lining up against like biomedical and so on, all of which have very strong fundamentals going forward.

所以，這裡再次出現了與資本支出環境相關的短期問題，以及一個問題。所以第三季進行了一些壓縮，你們在第二季凍結了一些資本支出。但從長遠來看，這對我們來說是一個非常非常健康的環境。對我們而言，這將是一個健康的環境，這得益於測試與測量領域的創新質量，以及它們所面向的終端市場，例如生物醫學等，所有這些市場都具有非常強勁的未來發展基本面。

I appreciate it. Thank you.

謝謝。謝謝。

Nigel Coe, Wolfe Research.

Nigel Coe，Wolfe Research。

Thanks. Good morning, everyone. We cover a lot of ground here. Just want to go back to the comments around strong starts to the quarter and then it sort of peered out. Do you think there's any unusual behavior able to shut those around price increases or tariffs. Obviously, we have had the big tariff even middle of the quarter. Anything you'd call out there, number one? And then number two, obstruction actions in the first half of the year, did we see the full benefits in 3Q? Or is there still some benefit to come through 4Q?

謝謝。各位早安。我們在這裡涵蓋了很多方面。我想回到之前關於本季開局強勁，然後逐漸走下坡路的評論。你認為是否存在某種異常行為能夠阻止人們因價格上漲或關稅而採取行動？顯然，我們甚至在本季中期就面臨了高額關稅。你覺得最關鍵的是什麼？其次，今年上半年採取的阻撓行動，我們在第三季是否看到了全部成效？或者說，第四季是否還會出現一些利多因素？

Yeah. So let me start with kind of the cadence as we went through the quarter. And I'm not sure we have a great answer for you, Nigel. I mean I think like we said, June and July were really some of our better months with meaningful organic growth on a year-over-year basis, then a slowdown in August and a recovery in September. And if you look at net-net for Q3, we were actually pretty close to kind of typical run rates.

是的。那麼，讓我先從我們本季的節奏說起。奈傑爾，我不太確定我們能否給你一個完美的答案。我的意思是，就像我們之前說的，六月和七月是我們業績最好的幾個月，實現了同比顯著的自然增長，然後八月增速放緩，九月又有所復甦。如果從第三季的整體情況來看，我們的實際運作速度其實已經非常接近正常水準了。

But -- so the point I think we're trying to make, it's just a pretty choppy environment and things can change pretty quickly, but we're not really making any long-term forecast in terms of kind of what that may mean on a go-forward basis. Some of it may be related to the tariff announcements and the associated pricing but really hard to tell. Restructuring for us, it's a little bit of a misnom. I mean these are funds that expenses that are funding our 80/20 fund-back projects. And so there's no big restructuring initiative going on inside of ITW.

但是——所以我認為我們想表達的觀點是，目前的環境非常不穩定，情況可能會很快發生變化，但我們並沒有對未來可能的發展做出任何長期預測。其中一些可能與關稅公告和相關定價有關，但很難說清楚。對我們來說，重組這個詞用得有點不恰當。我的意思是，這些資金用於支付我們 80/20 資金支持計畫的各項開支。因此，ITW內部並沒有進行大規模的重組計畫。

Our spend this year will be similar to last year in that $40 million range. We try to kind of level load things and do a similar amount every quarter. But it's really a function of the timing of tens of projects across the company and when the divisions want to execute on those projects. So those restructuring savings are -- these are projects with PayEx of less than a year. So it happens pretty quickly. And it's part of what's funding the enterprise initiative savings that we're getting next year. But these are not big kind of restructuring traditional restructuring projects, these are all tied to 80/20 front-to-back as per usual so.

今年我們的支出將與去年類似，約 4,000 萬美元。我們盡量維持工作量的均衡，每季都做類似的事情。但這其實取決於公司內數十個專案的進度安排，以及各部門何時想要執行這些專案。因此，這些重組節省下來的資金——這些專案付款週期不到一年。所以這一切發生得很快。這也是我們明年將獲得的企業扶持計畫的資金來源之一。但這些並不是大型的傳統重組項目，它們都像往常一樣遵循 80/20 的前後端比例。

Yeah. Okay. Thanks, Michael, that's helpful. A quick one on welding. We've seen, I think, now two quarters of reflection in growth on equipment. But consumables remain sort of stepped down in that low single-digit decline in territory. Is that primarily a price differential between equipment and consumables or anything to call out?

是的。好的。謝謝你，邁克爾，這很有幫助。簡單講解焊接。我認為，我們已經看到了設備成長方面兩個季度的反思。但消費品市佔率仍保持著個位數的低幅下滑。這主要是設備和耗材之間的價格差異嗎？還是還有其他需要特別指出的地方？

Yeah. So Nigel, I think it's mainly because the consumer is more of a discretionary purchase. I mean commercial or consumables. I think, right? Is that right?

是的。所以奈傑爾，我認為這主要是因為消費者更多地將消費視為可自由支配的支出。我指的是商業用途或消耗品。我想應該是這樣吧？是這樣嗎？

And equipment (inaudible) nicely.

設備（聽不清楚）也很好。

Yeah. I think it's a little bit of a head scratcher to be honest with you, equipment up 6% and consumables down to -- within that, there are some of the welding. Some of the filler metals are actually showing positive growth. The other thing, what we're seeing is a pickup on the industrial side. So these are typically large heavy equipment manufacturers. And then the commercial side or the consumer side, is a little bit slower, where it's a little bit more of a exposed to the kind of consumer discretionary spending.

是的。說實話，我覺得這有點讓人摸不著頭腦，設備價格上漲了 6%，而耗材價格卻下降了——其中還包含一些焊接費用。某些填充金屬實際上呈現正成長趨勢。另一方面，我們看到工業領域的成長動能也越來越強勁。所以這些通常都是大型重型設備製造商。而商業方面或消費方面則稍顯緩慢，因為它更容易受到消費者可自由支配支出的影響。

So it's a little bit of a mixed picture. I think the real positive in welding is, this growth is fueled by CBI. And so it's not that the markets are picking up. It's really new products, primarily on the equipment side. as well as both in North America and international with some really nice growth in our European and in our China business. So that's probably the best answer I can give you.

所以情況有點複雜。我認為焊接行業真正的積極因素在於，這種增長是由CBI推動的。所以，並不是市場正在回升。我們推出的都是新產品，主要集中在設備方面。我們在北美和國際市場都取得了不錯的成長，尤其是在歐洲和中國市場。這大概是我能給你的最好答案了。

Okay, thanks. I appreciate that.

好的，謝謝。我很感激。

(inaudible) UBS.

（聽不清楚）瑞銀集團。

Hi. Thank you. Good morning. So I appreciate that you're saying that you're trending towards the lower end on the sales guidance. Can you just talk about some of the thinking for leaving that range unchanged and just kind of wider than you typically would for this time of year? I assume you're still thinking there could be some upside to get you to the midpoint or better for the year. And would that come from any particular segments or it sounds like more from demand than pricing. So just -- is that the right way to think about it?

你好。謝謝。早安.所以我很欣賞您所說的銷售預期正趨向下限。您能否談談為什麼保持這個範圍不變，並且比往年這個時候的通常範圍更寬一些？我猜你仍然認為可能會有一些上漲空間，使你達到年中目標或更高。這是否意味著需求將成長而非價格上漲？所以——這樣想對嗎？

Yeah. I mean I think typically, we update guidance kind of halfway through the year. And at this point, with a quarter to go, we're well within the ranges. And so we didn't see the need to kind of update the whole thing. And the decision was to narrow the range and to explain why we're not flowing through the benefit of the lower tax rate, which is really due to the fact that we're trending towards the lower end on the revenues.

是的。我的意思是，通常情況下，我們會在年中左右更新指導意見。而現在，距離賽季結束還有四分之一，我們完全在預期範圍內。因此，我們認為沒有必要對整個系統進行更新。因此，我們決定縮小範圍，並解釋為什麼我們沒有享受到較低稅率帶來的好處，這實際上是因為我們的收入正朝著較低的方向發展。

So that's our way of being as transparent as we can be around the guidance. So I think your question kind of Q3 versus Q4, I think we've kind of covered that. Again, the segment that typically shows the biggest pickup from Q3 to Q4 is our Test & Measurement business, and then that's partially offset by the construction being down, kind of typical seasonality. And when all is said and done, revenues from Q3 to Q4 should be up by a point or so.

所以，這就是我們盡可能做到指導方針透明化的方式。所以，關於你提出的 Q3 與 Q4 的問題，我認為我們已經討論過了。再次強調，從第三季度到第四季度，成長幅度最大的業務板塊是我們的測試與測量業務，但建築業的下滑在一定程度上抵消了這一增長，這屬於典型的季節性現象。最終，第三季到第四季的營收應該會成長一個百分點左右。

Certainly, we've also factored in, I should say, the lower auto bill forecast, there's been -- which is done by third-party kind of industry experts. And there's been some noise around some supplier issues for some of our customers, and all of that is included in our automotive projection here for the fourth quarter based on everything that we know as we sit here today. So hopefully, that answers your question.

當然，我們也考慮到了第三方行業專家預測的汽車帳單下降的因素。我們一些客戶的供應商出現了一些問題，這些問題都已納入我們根據目前掌握的所有資訊對第四季度汽車行業的預測中。希望這能解答你的疑問。

Okay. Appreciate it. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。謝謝。

Mig Dobre, Baird.

米格·多布雷，貝爾德。

Hey. Thank you for squeezing in. Good morning. I also kind of want to go back to the PLS discussion. And I guess my question is this, when you sort of look at your comments for delivering above normal incremental margins, how reliant are you on PLS in order to be able to do that? How important is PLS in that algorithm and just given how high your margins are, and I'm kind of looking almost across the board in your businesses, you are pretty outperforming anyone else out there that I'm looking at.

嘿。謝謝你抽出時間來。早安.我也有點想回到PLS的討論中。我想問的是，當你回顧你為實現高於正常水平的增量利潤所做的評論時​​，你對PLS的依賴程度有多高？PLS 在該演算法中有多重要？考慮到你們的利潤率如此之高，而且我幾乎全面考察了你們的業務，你們的表現遠超我所關注的其他任何競爭對手。

Is there a point in time here where it's rational to sort of say, hey, look, maybe we can come back on PLS because we can actually deliver more earnings growth and more return for shareholders by just trying to accelerate organic growth rather than improving the portfolio?

現在是否存在這樣一個時間點，讓我們理性地認為，嘿，或許我們可以重新投資PLS，因為我們可以透過加速內生成長而不是改善投資組合，從而實現更高的獲利成長和更高的股東回報？

Yes. So Mig, I think there is a relationship between PLS and incrementals and so on, but it's not the only factor. I mean PLS is an element of 20. It's not it's about holistic 80/20. So I think the implementation of the business model, again, the quality of the portfolio is ultimately what drives the incrementals ultimately drives the margins.

是的。所以 Mig，我認為 PLS 與增量等之間存在某種關係，但這並不是唯一的因素。我的意思是PLS是20的一個元素。這不是關於整體的 80/20 法則。所以我認為，商業模式的實施，以及投資組合的質量，最終才是推動增量成長並最終推動利潤率成長的因素。

In terms of your comment on, I guess, the comment on organic growth versus margin. And so from our standpoint, I mean, organic growth and operating margin and margin expansion kind of go hand in hand. And we talk about quality of growth. I think we've demonstrated that for instance, coming out of the pandemic, we saw a very health growth and margin expansion.

關於您提到的有機成長與利潤率的問題。因此，從我們的角度來看，有機成長、營業利潤率和利潤率擴張是相輔相成的。我們討論的是成長的品質。我認為我們已經證明，例如，在疫情結束後，我們看到了非常健康的成長和利潤率的擴張。

Winning over that period, we are investing in a very focused way in our businesses in innovation, strategic marketing, and that very much continues today. So really, it was calling the organic growth, 33% incrementals historically. We're now well above that, comfortably kind of visit the 40s. And that's, again, at a time when we are very much investing in our businesses in a very focused way our own innovations, reach marketing and so on.

在那段時間裡，我們專注於創新和策略行銷，並將這種投資重點放在業務發展上，而這種投資一直延續至今。所以實際上，它指的是有機成長，歷史上增幅為 33%。我們現在遠高於這個數值，輕鬆達到 40 多度。而且，同時，我們也非常集中地投資我們的業務，包括我們自己的創新、市場推廣等等。

So for us, the math is pretty simple with margins at 26% and with growth incremental margins at 35%-plus or even 40% plus right now. It's the operating leverage that is really driving the margins forward for the year. And as we look at 2030 and our 30% goal, that's a goal that's not going to be achieved through structural cost reduction. That's going to be achieved through continuous improvement in organic growth at high quality and high incremental margins. So we see the two as being correlated, I would say.

因此對我們來說，計算很簡單，利潤率為 26%，而成長增量利潤率目前在 35% 以上，甚至 40% 以上。今年真正推動利潤率成長的是經營槓桿。展望 2030 年以及我們 30% 的目標，這個目標是無法透過結構性成本削減來實現的。這將透過持續改進高品質、高增量利潤的有機成長來實現。所以我認為，這兩者之間存在相關性。

Understood. But in terms of maybe more for '26 asking the question that somebody else asked earlier, right, if CBI is contributing 2.3% to 2.5%. Maybe you can rethink product line simplification to some extent and maybe the end markets get better. Again, from my perspective, being able to get your organic growth back to that 4%, 5%-plus range. is really the thing that at this point seems to be needle moving in terms of both maybe investor sentiment as well as overall earnings growth. So I'm curious if -- I understand it's early for 2026. Curious though, if you think that it's plausible that we could be looking at that kind of growth as we can that next year. Thank you.

明白了。但就 2026 年而言，或許應該多考慮一下之前有人提出的問題，對吧，如果 CBI 的貢獻率為 2.3% 到 2.5%。或許你可以重新考慮簡化產品線，這樣終端市場的情況可能會有所改善。再次強調，在我看來，目前真正能對投資人情緒和整體獲利成長產生決定性影響的，是能否將有機成長率恢復到4%、5%以上的水準。所以我很好奇——我知道現在談論2026年還為時過早。不過，我很好奇，如果你認為我們明年有可能看到那種成長，那會怎麼樣？謝謝。

Hi. It's -- I think, Mig, we're probably, as we said earlier, running a little bit higher on PLS than kind of the normal maintenance run rate. We're doing that specifically in a business like Specialty Products, where we've talked about, we're strategically repositioning that segment for growth. I will tell you that in other segments and industries that I know you follow like food equipment and welding, that number is significantly lower, maybe even 0 in some cases.

你好。我想，米格，正如我們之前所說，我們目前的 PLS 運行速度可能比正常的維護運行速度要高一些。我們正在特種產品這樣的業務領域進行專門的策略調整，正如我們之前討論過的，我們正在對該細分市場進行策略性重新定位，以實現成長。我可以告訴你，在你關注的其他領域和行業，例如食品設備和焊接，這個數字要低得多，在某些情況下甚至可能為 0。

So it's not an across the board. And it's also not a number that we want to or even could manage from the corporate -- from corporate. This is such an integral part of our 80/20 front-to-back process. It's a bottom-up number. And if we were to say -- and it's tempting, I know -- I understand how you're thinking about it. It's stepping to say, okay, no more PLS, that also would say no more 80/20 front to back. And that is certainly not in anybody's long-term interest. I can promise you that.

所以這不是普遍現象。而且，這也不是我們想要或能夠從公司層級控制的數字——從公司層級控制的數字。這是我們 80/20 前後端流程中不可或缺的一部分。這是一個由下而上統計的數字。如果我們要說——我知道這很誘人——我理解你的想法。這相當於踏出了第一步，宣布不再採用PLS（產品生命週期標準），也意味著不再採用80/20的前後比例。這肯定不符合任何人的長遠利益。我可以向你保證。

All right. That makes sense. Thank you.

好的。這很有道理。謝謝。

Ladies and gentlemen, that was the final question in our queue for today. We'd like to thank you all for your participation in today's session, and you may now disconnect your lines. Please have a good day.

女士們先生們，這是我們今天提問的最後一個問題。感謝各位參加今天的會議，現在您可以斷開線路了。祝您有美好的一天。