Icahn Enterprises LP (IEP) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good morning and welcome to the Icahn Enterprises LP fourth-quarter 2024 earnings call. (Operator Instructions)

早安，歡迎參加 Icahn Enterprises LP 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。（操作員指令）

We'll have Andrew Teno, President and CEO; Ted Papapostolo, Chief Financial Officer; and Robert Flint, Chief Accounting Officer. I would now like to hand the call over to Robert Flint, who will read the opening statement.

我們將邀請總裁兼執行長 Andrew Teno； Ted Papapostolo，財務長；以及首席會計長羅伯特·弗林特（Robert Flint）。現在我想將發言權交給羅伯特·弗林特，他將宣讀開場白。

Thank you, operator. The Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995 provides a safe harbor for forward-looking statements we make in this presentation, including statements regarding our future performance and plans for our businesses and potential acquisitions.

謝謝您，接線生。1995 年《私人證券訴訟改革法》為我們在本新聞稿中所做的前瞻性聲明提供了安全港，包括有關我們未來業績以及業務和潛在收購計劃的陳述。

Forward-looking statements may be identified by words such as expects, anticipates, intends, plans, believes, seeks, estimates, will or words of similar meaning and include, but are not limited to, statements about the expected future business and financial performance of Icahn Enterprises LP and its subsidiaries.

前瞻性陳述可以透過預期、預期、打算、計劃、相信、尋求、估計、將或類似含義的詞語來識別，包括但不限於關於 Icahn Enterprises LP 及其子公司預期未來業務和財務業績的陳述。

Actual events, results and outcomes may differ materially from our expectations due to a variety of known and unknown risks, uncertainties and other factors that are discussed in our filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission including economic, competitive, legal and other factors.

由於各種已知和未知的風險、不確定性和我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中討論的其他因素，包括經濟、競爭、法律和其他因素，實際事件、結果和成果可能與我們的預期有重大差異。

Accordingly, there's no assurance that our expectations will be realized. We assume no obligation to update or revise any forward-looking statements should circumstances change, except as otherwise required by law.

因此，不能保證我們的期望一定會實現。除非法律另有規定，我們不承擔因情況發生變化而更新或修改任何前瞻性陳述的義務。

This presentation also includes certain non-GAAP financial measures, including adjusted EBITDA. A reconciliation of such non-GAAP financial measures to the most directly comparable GAAP financial measures can be found in the back of this presentation.

本報告也包括某些非 GAAP 財務指標，包括調整後的 EBITDA。此類非 GAAP 財務指標與最直接可比較的 GAAP 財務指標的對帳表可在本簡報的後面找到。

We also present indicative net asset value. Indicative net asset value includes, among other things, changes in the fair value of certain subsidiaries which are not included in our GAAP earnings. All net income and EBITDA amounts we will discuss are attributable to Icahn Enterprises unless otherwise specified.

我們也提供了指示性淨值。指示性淨資產價值包括但不限於未包含在我們 GAAP 收益中的某些子公司的公允價值變動。除非另有說明，我們將討論的所有淨收入和 EBITDA 金額均歸屬於 Icahn Enterprises。

I'll now turn it over to Andrew Teno, our Chief Executive Officer.

現在我將把發言權交給我們的執行長 Andrew Teno。

Thank you, Rob, and good morning, everyone. NAV decreased $223 million from the third quarter of 2024. The two big events during the quarter were the decline in CVR Energy and an agreement to sell certain properties in our Real Estate segment.

謝謝你，羅布，大家早安。與 2024 年第三季相比，資產淨值減少了 2.23 億美元。本季的兩件大事是 CVR Energy 的下滑和出售我們房地產部門部分資產的協議。

CVI declined by $286 million in the quarter. As we discussed on the last call, crack spreads weakened in the fourth quarter and, when combined with a large turnaround, led CVI to cut its dividend. In response to what we believe was an attractive investment opportunity, we launched a tender offer and were successful in purchasing 878,000 shares. This is less than we had hoped for but we will remain price sensitive and monitor conditions going forward.

本季度，CVI 下降了 2.86 億美元。正如我們在上次電話會議上所討論的那樣，裂解價差在第四季度減弱，再加上業績大幅好轉，導致 CVI 削減了股息。為了抓住我們認為的有吸引力的投資機會，我們發起了要約收購，並成功購買了 878,000 股。這比我們所希望的要少，但我們將保持對價格的敏感度並監控未來的情況。

Recently, crack spreads have improved off their lows, which bodes well for CVI. In addition, we are excited that the change in administration may lead to the resolution of our outstanding litigation regarding small refinery exemptions, which has the potential to remove over $300 million or more of liabilities. As a reminder, during the last Trump administration, Wynnewood received small refinery exemptions.

最近，裂解價差已從低點回升，對 CVI 來說是個好兆頭。此外，我們很高興看到政府的變動可能導致我們關於小型煉油廠豁免的未決訴訟得到解決，這有可能消除超過 3 億美元甚至更多的債務。提醒一下，在上一屆川普政府期間，Wynnewood 獲得了小型煉油廠豁免。

Our Real Estate segment increased $292 million in the quarter. The increase was due to a combination of the sale of certain properties, which led us to fair value the remaining assets, a change from how we have valued these assets in prior periods. The GAAP equity attributable to IEP in Real Estate held steady. The investment funds were down approximately 1.6% for the quarter. The biggest decliner was our investment in Caesars and the largest gainer where our refinery hedges.

我們的房地產部門本季成長了 2.92 億美元。成長的原因在於出售某些資產，這導致我們對剩餘資產進行了公允估值，這與前期對這些資產的估值方式不同。歸屬於 IEP 房地產業務的 GAAP 權益保持穩定。本季投資基金下跌約1.6%。跌幅最大的是我們對凱撒的投資，漲幅最大的是我們的煉油廠對沖。

We ended the quarter with $1.4 billion of cash and cash equivalents at the holding company and an additional $915 million of cash at the funds. So as Carl liked to say, we have a significant war chest to take advantage of opportunities as they arise. Lastly, the Board has maintained the quarterly distribution at $0.50 per depositary unit.

截至本季末，控股公司持有現金和現金等價物 14 億美元，基金持有額外 9.15 億美元現金。正如卡爾所說，我們擁有充足的資金來抓住出現的機會。最後，董事會將季度分配維持在每股存託憑證 0.50 美元。

Now turning to our Investment segment. In terms of our TOP5 disclosed names, we see considerable value creation potential. At SWX, we see a gas utility that is closing its ROE gap to peers and separating the utility services business with significant growth opportunity. We see upside in both the gas utility and the services business.

現在轉向我們的投資部分。從我們揭露的 TOP5 名稱來看，我們看到了巨大的價值創造潛力。在 SWX，我們看到一家天然氣公用事業公司正在縮小與同業的 ROE 差距，並為公用事業服務業務帶來巨大的成長機會。我們認為天然氣公用事業和服務業務都有成長空間。

At AEP, we see new management closing its ROE gap, improving regulatory outcomes and benefiting from tremendous growth in electricity demand due to AI-driven data center demand. AEP recently announced the sale of a 20% stake in a portion of its transmission business, which helped to improve the balance sheet and was equivalent to issuing shares at a 70% premium to the then share price.

在 AEP，我們看到新的管理層正在縮小其 ROE 差距、改善監管結果並受益於人工智慧驅動的資料中心需求所帶來的電力需求的大幅成長。AEP近期宣佈出售部分輸電業務的20%股份，此舉有助於改善資產負債表，相當於以高於當時股價70%的價格發行股票。

At Caesars, Carl has significant respect for Tom Reeg and what he has accomplished. We believe we are buying a great business with tremendous real estate value, a great management team that is actively buying back shares and with a growing digital business, all at a free cash flow yield greater than 15%.

在凱撒娛樂，卡爾非常尊敬湯姆雷格以及他所取得的成就。我們相信，我們收購的是一家優秀的企業，它擁有龐大的房地產價值、優秀的管理團隊，正在積極回購股票，而且數位業務不斷成長，而且自由現金流收益率超過 15%。

IFF is a high-quality ingredients company that should see improving organic revenue growth and increasing margins from new management. IFF trades at a significant discount to its peers on EV to EBITDA.

IFF 是一家高品質原料公司，在新管理層的帶領下，其有機收入成長和利潤率將有所提高。IFF 的企業價值與 EBITDA 比率與其同業相比有大幅折扣。

At Bausch, we see considerable value both at BHC and BLCO. The funds ended the quarter approximately 22% net long. Adjusting for our refining hedges, the fund was 35% net long.

在 Bausch，我們看到 BHC 和 BLCO 都具有相當大的價值。本季末這些基金的淨多頭部位約為 22%。經過對我們的煉油對沖進行調整後，該基金的淨多頭部位為35%。

And now I will pass it over to Ted to cover our controlled businesses.

現在我將把權力交給泰德來負責我們控制的業務。

Thank you, Andrew. I will start at our Energy segment. Energy segment EBITDA was $99 million for Q4 '24 compared to $204 million in Q4 '23. This decrease was driven by reduced throughput and lower crack spreads. Q4 '24 refining margin per throughput barrel was $8.37 compared to $15.01 in the prior year quarter.

謝謝你，安德魯。我將從能源領域開始。24 年第四季能源部門 EBITDA 為 9,900 萬美元，而 23 年第四季為 2.04 億美元。下降的原因在於產量下降及裂解價差縮小。24年第四季每桶煉油利潤為 8.37 美元，而去年同期為 15.01 美元。

The main drivers for the decrease is due to lower crack spreads and unfavorable market derivative and inventory valuations.

下降的主要原因是裂解價差下降以及市場衍生性商品和庫存估值不利。

Q4 '24 renewable margin per vegetable oil throughput gallon was $0.79 compared to a loss of $0.90 in the prior year quarter. The drivers for the increase were lower cost of sales and an increase in the hobo [BOHO] spread. Q4 '24 average realized gate prices for UAN declined by 5% to $229 per ton, and ammonia increased by 3% to $475 per ton when compared to the prior year quarter.

24 年第四季每加侖植物油加工量的可再生利潤為 0.79 美元，而去年同期的虧損為 0.90 美元。推動這一成長的因素包括銷售成本下降以及流浪漢[BOHO]利差增加。與去年同期相比，2024 年第四季 UAN 平均實現門價下降 5% 至每噸 229 美元，而氨氣平均實現門價上漲 3% 至每噸 475 美元。

Now turning to our Automotive segment. Our Automotive business continues to lag compared to prior year results due to the self-inflicted wounds we discussed previously. We have recently announced a permanent CEO, who has implemented new initiatives and strategies to remediate the short-term challenges we are currently experiencing. Management's plan anticipates these challenges will be resolved and the results to be normalized by the second half of 2025.

現在轉向我們的汽車領域。由於我們之前討論過的自身原因，我們的汽車業務與去年同期相比繼續落後。我們最近宣布了一位常任首席執行官，他實施了新的舉措和策略來應對我們目前面臨的短期挑戰。管理層的計劃預計這些挑戰將得到解決，並且結果將在 2025 年下半年恢復正常。

During the quarter, a significant tenant in our Automotive real estate portfolio made a strategic decision to exit certain locations. We received an early termination payment of $42 million, and we have begun marketing these locations to prospective tenants and expect to fill them within the next 24 months. We have substantially completed the exit of our Aftermarket Parts business, which will be completed by the end of Q1 '25.

在本季度，我們汽車房地產投資組合中一個重要的租戶做出了退出某些地點的策略決策。我們收到了 4,200 萬美元的提前終止付款，並已開始向潛在租戶推銷這些地點，預計在未來 24 個月內將其租滿。我們已基本完成售後零件業務的退出，預計將於2025年第一季末完成。

Now turning to our other segments. Real Estate Q4 '24 adjusted EBITDA decreased by $5 million compared to the prior year quarter driven by reduced sales of single-family homes.

現在轉向我們的其他部分。房地產 24 年第四季調整後 EBITDA 與去年同期相比減少 500 萬美元，主要原因是獨棟住宅銷售下降。

Food Packaging's adjusted EBITDA attributable to IEP decreased by $6 million for Q4 '24 as compared to the prior year quarter. Volumes have increased, however, a shift in product mix and lower pricing led to a reduction in net sales.

與去年同期相比，食品包裝 24 年第四季歸因於 IEP 的調整後 EBITDA 減少了 600 萬美元。雖然銷量增加，但產品組合的變化和價格的下降導致淨銷售額減少。

As previously mentioned, there are opportunities to improve efficiency at the plants. However, we do not expect a meaningful impact until we execute a capital plan to modernize equipment and reduce the overall cost structure.

如前所述，工廠還有機會提高效率。然而，在我們執行資本計劃來實現設備現代化並降低整體成本結構之前，我們預計不會產生有意義的影響。

Home Fashion's adjusted EBITDA increased by $2 million as compared to the prior year quarter, mainly driven by lower material costs and improved manufacturing efficiencies.

Home Fashion 的調整後 EBITDA 與去年同期相比增加了 200 萬美元，主要由於材料成本降低和製造效率提高。

Pharma segment's adjusted EBITDA for Q4 '24 improved by $1 million as compared to the prior year quarter, mainly due to higher prescription growth. Recently, one of our developmental therapies cleared a significant FDA milestone, and we have begun preparing for clinical trials.

製藥部門 24 年第四季的調整後 EBITDA 與去年同期相比增加了 100 萬美元，主要原因是處方藥成長較快。最近，我們的一種開發療法取得了 FDA 的重要里程碑，我們已經開始為臨床試驗做準備。

Now turning to our liquidity. We maintain liquidity at the holding company and at each of our operating subsidiaries to take advantage of attractive opportunities. As of quarter end, the holding company had cash and investments in the funds of $4.1 billion, and our subsidiaries had cash and revolver availability of $1.5 billion.

現在來談談我們的流動性。我們在控股公司和每個營運子公司保持流動性，以利用有吸引力的機會。截至季末，控股公司擁有現金和基金投資 41 億美元，我們的子公司擁有現金和循環信貸額度 15 億美元。

In summary, we continue to focus on building asset value and maintaining liquidity to enable us to capitalize on opportunities within and outside our existing operating segments.

總之，我們繼續專注於建立資產價值和保持流動性，以使我們能夠利用現有營運分部內外的機會。

Thank you. Operator, can you please open up the call for questions.

謝謝。接線員，您能否打開電話詢問問題？

Thank you so much. (Operator Instructions)

太感謝了。（操作員指令）

Andrew Berg, Post Advisory Group.

安德魯伯格 (Andrew Berg)，郵政顧問小組。

Thank you. Yeah, Just a couple of questions. With respect to the hedge fund, you guys ended with a net notional long of 22%, and I think you said it was 35% ex the Energy hedges. Can you remind me where you were at the end of the third quarter? Because I think overall, the fund was net short 2%. I don't recall what the figure was ex the Energy hedges.

謝謝。是的，我只想問幾個問題。就對沖基金而言，你們的淨名目多頭部位最終為 22%，我記得你們說過，扣除能源對沖後，淨名目多頭部位為 35%。你能提醒我第三節結束時你在哪裡嗎？因為我認為總體而言，該基金淨空頭2％。我不記得能源對沖的數字是多少。

And are you able to provide any commentary as to what point in the quarter you had flipped that position from being slightly negative to obviously much greater percentage long now?

您能否就本季度的哪個時間點，您將該頭寸從略微負面轉變為現在明顯更大的百分比多頭提供任何評論？

Yeah. Andrew, good morning. So if you look at the hedge fund, when you think about some of the hedges that are in there, a lot of them are due to the refining hedges. And if you looked at crack spreads and, I guess, just in general how the refining hedge is traded, when we see crack spreads come down, that's our time to take off some of those hedges. And as crack spreads go up or other refiners go up, that's when we put them back on. So it's just being opportunistic, I'd say.

是的。安德魯，早安。因此，如果你看一下對沖基金，當你想到其中的一些對沖時，你會發現其中許多都是因為煉油對沖。如果你看一下裂解價差，我想，你就會知道煉油對沖的一般交易方式，當我們看到裂解價差下降時，那就是我們取消部分對沖的時候了。當裂解價差上升或其他煉油商價格上漲時，我們就會將它們重新投入使用。所以我想說，這只是機會主義的行為。

Okay. So at the end of the third quarter, can you -- I don't know if you have that in front of you or we need to follow up afterwards, where you were -- what that net 2% short was once we take the hedges out, where you were?

好的。那麼在第三季末，您能否 - 我不知道您是否已經掌握了這些信息，或者我們需要事後跟進，一旦我們取消對沖，您的淨 2% 空頭規模是多少，您當時的狀況如何？

Yeah, we can follow up right after the call if you'd like.

是的，如果您願意的話，我們可以在通話後立即跟進。

Okay. Great. And then with respect to the Real Estate segment, you had a pretty significant adjustment to the indicative net asset value for that segment. Can you kind of walk us through what was causing that jump? I know the footnote it talks about, I guess, some valuation -- third-party valuation work.

好的。偉大的。然後就房地產部門而言，您對該部門的指示性淨資產價值進行了相當大的調整。您能向我們解釋一下導致這次跳躍的原因嗎？我知道它談到的腳註，我想，是一些估值——第三方估值工作。

But can you kind of give us a little bit better understanding where that was and how that came about and what were the underlying drivers for such a significant increase?

但是您能否讓我們更了解這是怎麼回事、是如何發生的以及如此大幅增長的根本驅動因素是什麼？

Yeah. Andrew, it's Ted. So prior to December 31, we felt that GAAP book value was a good proxy for indicative asset value for the segment. And what changed in the fourth quarter is we signed an agreement to sell certain properties that far exceeded the book value.

是的。安德魯，我是泰德。因此，在 12 月 31 日之前，我們認為 GAAP 帳面價值可以很好地代表該部門的指示性資產價值。第四季的變化是，我們簽署了一項協議，出售遠超帳面價值的某些房產。

So due to this event, we felt that the GAAP book value no longer represents the indicative fair value. So as a result, we marked these properties to the anticipated sales price. And to be consistent for the remaining assets within the segment, we just obtained appraisals and marked those properties accordingly. So that's what you would see the big jump of. The driver is really like [$290 million], but you'll see the actual absolute value is about $300 million quarter over quarter.

因此，由於此事件，我們認為 GAAP 帳面價值不再代表指示性公允價值。因此，我們將這些房產標記為預期銷售價格。為了與該部門內剩餘資產保持一致，我們只是獲得了評估並相應地標記了這些資產。這就是你所看到的巨大的飛躍。驅動因素實際上是 [2.9 億美元]，但你會發現實際絕對值環比增長約為 3 億美元。

Yeah. What was the composition of those properties?

是的。這些屬性的組成是怎麼樣的？

You mean the fair value jump so that the once we have a sale agreement in place, I would say it's about approximately a $200 million increase due to those properties, and the rest of the portfolio just broad strokes is about $90 million.

您的意思是公允價值躍升，因此一旦我們達成銷售協議，我會說這些房產的公允價值將增加約 2 億美元，而投資組合的其餘部分則大致增加約 9,000 萬美元。

(multiple speakers)

（多位發言者）

Was this primarily raw land or was it retail, office, industrial? I'm just trying to get a better sense, single family home of what was the underlying assets that that were so much higher than where you had a marked?

這片土地主要是未開發土地還是用於零售、辦公或工業？我只是想更了解單戶住宅的底層資產是什麼，為什麼其價格比你所標記的要高得多？

I think we mentioned on the last call that there was some properties that we were looking at, and I think it's at the press.

我想我們在上次電話會議上提到過，我們正在關註一些房產，我想這些已經向媒體公佈了。

Say that again, I'm sorry.

我再說一遍，對不起。

Yeah, we mentioned it on our last call, that we were exploring the sale of certain properties, so I think if you were to reference those comments you'd see where they are.

是的，我們在上次電話會議中提到，我們正在探討出售某些房產，所以我想如果你參考這些評論，你就會知道它們在哪裡。

Okay, I'll go back and look. I don't recall what kind of -- what type of properties those were. Thank you.

好的，我回去看看。我不記得那些是何種──何種類型的財產。謝謝。

Thank you. (Operator Instructions) Alright, as I see no further questions in the queue, I will turn it back to Andrew Teno for final remarks.

謝謝。(操作員指示)好的，由於我看到隊列中沒有其他問題，我將把話題轉回給 Andrew Teno 進行最後的評論。

Thank you. So I'd like to leave with a reminder that here at Icahn Enterprises, we are intensely focused on our activism strategy. We have unique advantages, including the Icahn brand name and a long history and willingness to wage proxy contest. It is this track record which frequently allows us to be invited to join boards and work cooperatively with our fellow directors to make the key changes that will drive shareholder value.

謝謝。所以我想提醒大家，在伊坎企業，我們非常注重我們的激進主義策略。我們擁有獨特的優勢，包括伊坎的品牌名稱、悠久的歷史和發起代理權爭奪戰的意願。正是這樣的業績記錄使我們經常被邀請加入董事會，並與其他董事合作，做出能夠推動股東價值的關鍵變革。

Furthermore, given our balance sheet, liquidity and permanent capital structure, we have the ability to tender for entire businesses, a tool most simply do not possess. Though our returns can be lumpy and dissatisfying at times as we continue to focus on our activist efforts at both our investment segment and controlled businesses, we believe they will bear fruit for all unitholders.

此外，鑑於我們的資產負債表、流動性和永久資本結構，我們有能力對整個企業進行投標，而大多數企業根本不具備這種工具。由於我們繼續專注於投資部門和控股業務的積極努力，我們的回報有時可能會不穩定且不盡人意，但我們相信，這些努力將為所有基金份額持有人帶來成果。

We'll speak soon. Bye.

我們很快就會說話。再見。

Thank you, and with that, we thank you all for participating and you may now disconnect.

謝謝您，最後，我們感謝大家的參與，現在您可以斷開連接了。