Hafnia Ltd (HAFN) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to Hafnia's fourth-quarter and full-year 2024 financial results presentation. We will begin shortly.

歡迎參加 Hafnia 2024 年第四季和全年財務業績報告。我們很快就要開始了。

You will be brought through today's presentation by Hafnia's CEO, Mikael Skov; CFO, Perry Van Echtelt; VP, Commercial, Soren Winther; and EVP, Head of Investor Relations, Thomas Andersen. They will be pleased to address any questions after the presentation. (Operator Instructions)

您將聆聽 Hafnia 執行長 Mikael Skov 的今天的演講；財務長 Perry Van Echtelt；商業副總裁 Soren Winther； Thomas Andersen 執行副總裁兼投資者關係主管。他們將很樂意在演講結束後解答任何問題。（操作員指示）

During this conference call, some statements may be considered forward-looking, reflecting management's current expectations. These statements involve risks, uncertainties and other factors, many of which are beyond Hafnia's control, and that could cause actual results, performance or plans to differ significantly from those expressed or implied. Additionally, this conference call does not constitute an offer or solicitation to buy or sell any securities.

在本次電話會議中，一些聲明可能被視為前瞻性的，反映了管理階層目前的預期。這些聲明涉及風險、不確定性和其他因素，其中許多超出了 Hafnia 的控制範圍，並且可能導致實際結果、表現或計劃與明示或暗示的結果、表現或計劃存在重大差異。此外，本次電話會議不構成購買或出售任何證券的要約或邀請。

With that, I'm pleased to turn the call over to Hafnia's CEO, Mikael Skov.

說完這些，我很高興將電話轉給 Hafnia 的執行長 Mikael Skov。

Thank you. Hello, everyone. I'm Mikael Skov, CEO of Hafnia. Welcome to our fourth quarter 2024 earnings call, and thank you for joining us today. Joining me today are our CFO, Perry Van Echtelt; our VP of Commercial, Søren Winther; and our EVP and Head of Investor Relations, Thomas Andersen.

謝謝。大家好。我是哈夫尼亞執行長米凱爾·斯科夫。歡迎參加我們的 2024 年第四季財報電話會議，感謝您今天的加入。今天與我一起出席的還有我們的財務長 Perry Van Echtelt；我們的商業副總裁 Søren Winther；以及我們的執行副總裁兼投資者關係主管 Thomas Andersen。

Together, we will walk you through Hafnia's performance for the quarter.

我們將一起向您介紹 Hafnia 本季的表現。

Today's presentation will cover 4 key areas. I'll begin with a review of our fourth quarter performance and key highlights, followed by an overview of Hafnia and our market position. Søren will then discuss recent commercial developments and share our outlook for the product tanker market. Perry will review our financial results and capital allocation strategy. I will then conclude with an update on our ongoing sustainability initiatives and provide closing remarks.

今天的演講將涵蓋四個關鍵領域。我將首先回顧我們第四季度的業績和主要亮點，然後概述 Hafnia 和我們的市場地位。隨後，Søren 將討論最近的商業發展並分享我們對成品油輪市場的展望。佩里將審查我們的財務表現和資本配置策略。最後，我將介紹我們正在進行的可持續發展計劃的最新進展，並發表結束語。

Let's move to next slide. Before proceeding, I want to direct your attention to our safe harbor statement. Today's presentation will include forward-looking statements that involve risks and uncertainties. Our actual results may differ materially from these statements. This call does not constitute an offer to buy or sell securities.

讓我們看下一張投影片。在繼續之前，我想請您注意我們的安全港聲明。今天的演示將包括涉及風險和不確定性的前瞻性陳述。我們的實際結果可能與這些陳述有重大差異。本次電話會議並不構成購買或出售證券的要約。

Thank you for your attention, and let's start the presentation.

謝謝大家的關注，我們開始演講。

Let me begin by outlining some of the key highlights from the quarter and 2024. Going to Slide #4. I'm pleased to share that Hafnia delivered another year of strong results, underscoring our operational resilience and ability to generate value through market cycles. While market conditions moderated in the fourth quarter, we achieved a net profit of $79.6 million, bringing our full year net profit to $774 million, marking another year of great results. Our core operations continued to generate strong earnings with a total TCE income of $1.4 billion for the year.

首先，我概述本季和 2024 年的一些主要亮點。轉到幻燈片#4。我很高興地告訴大家，Hafnia 又取得了強勁的業績，這凸顯了我們的營運彈性和在市場週期中創造價值的能力。儘管第四季市場環境有所緩和，我們仍實現了 7,960 萬美元的淨利潤，使全年淨利潤達到 7.74 億美元，再次標誌著我們取得了優異的業績。我們的核心業務持續產生強勁的獲利，全年 TCE 總收入達 14 億美元。

This was further supported by our adjacent fee-generating businesses, which contributed $35.2 million in full year revenue.

這進一步得益於我們相鄰的收費業務，這些業務全年貢獻了 3,520 萬美元的收入。

Moving to Slide #5. Next, I would like to highlight Hafnia's key investment attributes. Hafnia is a global leader in the product and chemical tanker market, and we operate one of the largest and most diversified fleets in the industry. As owners and operators of more than 200 vessels across 8 pools, we provide a fully integrated shipping platform, which includes technical management, chartering services, pool management and a bunker procurement desk that has serviced over 1,400 vessels, both within our pools and for external shipowners.

移至投影片#5。接下來我想強調Hafnia的主要投資屬性。Hafnia 是產品和化學品油輪市場的全球領導者，我們經營著業內最大、最多樣化的船隊之一。作為 8 個聯營體中 200 多艘船舶的船東和營運商，我們提供完全整合的航運平台，其中包括技術管理、租船服務、聯營體管理和燃油採購服務，已為我們聯營體內部和外部船東的 1,400 多艘船舶提供服務。

As of December 31, 2024, our owned and chartered fleet comprised 125 vessels with a net asset value of approximately $3.8 billion. This equates to an NAV per share of around USD7.63 or NOK86.34 per share. Our own vessels have an average age of 9.1 years, which when compared to the global product tanker fleet average of approximately 14 years, reflects the long runway for operational efficiency and earnings potential for our fleet.

截至 2024 年 12 月 31 日，我們自有和租賃的船隊由 125 艘船組成，淨資產價值約為 38 億美元。這相當於每股資產淨值約為 7.63 美元或每股 86.34 挪威克朗。我們自己的船舶平均船齡為 9.1 年，與全球成品油油輪船隊約 14 年的平均船齡相比，這反映了我們船隊的運營效率和盈利潛力還有很長的路要走。

Additionally, as part of our ongoing fleet renewal strategy and commitment to a more sustainable maritime future, I'm happy to announce that we have in January, welcomed Ecomar Gascogne, the first of 4 dual fuel methanol chemical IMO II MRs ordered through our joint venture with Socatra of France. This marks a significant milestone in our decarbonization journey as these vessels can operate on both conventional fuel and methanol, paving the way for a transition to more sustainable fuel options. Through our active management approach and deep market expertise, we remain committed to driving sustainable growth, leading by example and positioning Hafnia for long-term success.

此外，作為我們正在進行的船隊更新策略和對更永續的海洋未來承諾的一部分，我很高興地宣布，我們已於 1 月迎來了 Ecomar Gascogne，這是我們透過與法國 Socatra 的合資企業訂購的 4 艘雙燃料甲醇化學品 IMO II MR 中的第一艘。這標誌著我們脫碳進程中的一個重要里程碑，因為這些船舶可以同時使用傳統燃料和甲醇，為向更永續的燃料選擇過渡鋪平了道路。透過積極的管理方法和深厚的市場專業知識，我們始終致力於推動永續成長，以身作則，為 Hafnia 的長期成功奠定基礎。

Let's move on to the next slide. The dislocation between our share price and NAV per share in late 2024 presented an attractive opportunity to enhance shareholder returns through share buybacks. In January, we completed our buyback program, having repurchased approximately 14.4 million shares at approximately 70% of NAV for an average of $5.33 per share and a total consideration of $76.7 million. Capital utilized for buybacks in December has been deducted from the total payout before declaring Q4 dividends. This approach ensures our total shareholder returns align with our payout policy, balancing returns and flexibility.

讓我們繼續看下一張投影片。2024 年末，我們的股價與每股淨值之間的錯位為透過股票回購提高股東回報提供了絕佳的機會。一月份，我們完成了回購計劃，以每股 5.33 美元的價格回購了約 1,440 萬股，約佔資產淨值的 70%，總對價為 7,670 萬美元。在宣布第四季度股息之前，12 月用於回購的資金已從總支出中扣除。這種方法確保我們的股東總回報與我們的派息政策保持一致，平衡回報和靈活性。

This also reflects our commitment to enhancing shareholder returns even amid market fluctuations as we position ourselves for sustainable growth.

這也反映了我們致力於提高股東回報，即使在市場波動的情況下，我們也為實現永續成長做好了準備。

At the end of Q4, our net loan-to-value ratio stood at 23.2%, increasing from the previous quarter, primarily due to a decline in vessel market values. Given this, I'm pleased to announce a payout ratio of 80% for the quarter. After deducting $49.1 million used in share buybacks in December, we will distribute $14.6 million or $0.0294 per share in dividends. Including share buybacks, our total shareholder payout for the full year reached $640.8 million, representing a payout ratio of 82.8%. Our strong financial position and disciplined capital allocation approach position us well to capitalize on favorable market conditions in 2025 and continue delivering value to our shareholders.

在第四季末，我們的淨貸款價值比率為 23.2%，較上一季增加，主要是由於船舶市場價值下降。有鑑於此，我很高興地宣布本季的派息率為 80%。扣除 12 月用於股票回購的 4,910 萬美元後，我們將派發 1,460 萬美元或每股 0.0294 美元的股息。包括股票回購在內，我們全年的股東總支出達到 6.408 億美元，支出率為 82.8%。我們強大的財務狀況和嚴謹的資本配置方法使我們能夠充分利用 2025 年的有利市場條件並繼續為股東創造價值。

Move to Slide #7. Søren will now be sharing the industry review and market outlook.

移至幻燈片#7。Søren 現在將分享產業回顧和市場展望。

Thank you, Mikael. I will begin with an update on the current market conditions in the product tanker and clean petroleum product markets where Hafnia primarily operates and share our outlook for the coming months.

謝謝你，米凱爾。我將首先介紹 Hafnia 主要營運的成品油輪和清潔石油產品市場的當前市場狀況，並分享我們對未來幾個月的展望。

The product tanker market experienced an extended period of strong earnings through the first 9 months of 2024, supported by high cargo volumes and longer ton miles as vessels rerouted via the Cape of Good Hope due to the situation in the Red Sea. In the fourth quarter, tanker rates came under pressure, primarily due to increased cannibalization from the crude sector. Further key market drivers such as daily loadings of clean petroleum products and oil on water dropped in the beginning of the quarter, mainly due to refinery maintenance and lower refinery margins.

2024 年前 9 個月，成品油油輪市場經歷了一段較長時間的強勁盈利期，這得益於紅海局勢導致船舶改道經好望角，貨運量增加，噸位里程增加。第四季度，油輪運價面臨壓力，主要原因是原油產業的蠶食加劇。本季度初，其他關鍵市場驅動因素（例如清潔石油產品和水上石油的日裝載量）有所下降，這主要是由於煉油廠維護和煉油廠利潤率下降。

Fortunately, clean petroleum product loadings on Handy to LR2 tankers rebounded significantly in December. This trend has continued in this quarter -- or in this first quarter. This recovery was largely driven by reduced crude tanker cannibalization and higher export volumes from the U.S. Gulf. As we can see, the cannibalization has reduced and is now at historical averages of about 1% to 2%, primarily due to improved crude tanker market conditions, technical difficulties for crude carriers to transport refined products and the recent sanctions on larger tankers.

幸運的是，12 月 Handy 至 LR2 型油輪的清潔石油產品裝載量大幅反彈。這一趨勢在本季——或者說第一季——仍在繼續。這種復甦主要是由於原油輪拆解減少和美國墨西哥灣出口量增加所致。我們可以看到，拆船率已經下降，目前處於歷史平均水平的 1% 至 2% 左右，這主要是由於原油輪市場狀況改善、原油輪運輸成品油遇到技術困難以及近期對大型油輪的製裁。

Let's move to Slide 9. An interesting dynamic. Here, we observed the evolution of trade patterns, while clean petroleum product loadings and ton-days for product tankers recovered following the late Q3 dip, earnings have not rebounded as strongly. This is mainly due to hampered market sentiment and limited cross-hemisphere trading, leaving tonnage static within regions. We have also noticed that laden voyage lengths have reduced after the initial market stress from the Red Sea closure.

讓我們轉到投影片 9。一個有趣的動態。在這裡，我們觀察到貿易模式的演變，雖然清潔石油產品裝載量和成品油輪的噸天數在第三季末下滑後有所回升，但收益並沒有強勁反彈。這主要是由於市場情緒低落和跨半球貿易有限，導致各區域內的噸位保持不變。我們也注意到，在紅海關閉最初造成市場壓力之後，載貨航程長度縮短。

We believe this is mainly due to increased refinery output in the U.S. Gulf, replacing the Middle Eastern trade volumes servicing European demand.

我們認為，這主要是由於美國墨西哥灣煉油廠產量增加，取代了滿足歐洲需求的中東貿易量。

Let's move on to Slide 10. We have conducted a detailed analysis of potential Red Sea reopening supply versus demand impacts. While it's widely known that Red Sea transit volumes remained low since early 2024, it's important to highlight the overall decline in clean petroleum product flows across hemispheres. Our analysis suggest that the potential impact of the Red Sea reopening may be more limited than initially anticipated. Should Red Sea transits become safe and reopen to normal tonnage, we estimate based on 2023 and 2024 data that Suez transit volumes regained will be the equivalent of approximately 227 MRs worth of added transportation demand.

讓我們繼續看第 10 張投影片。我們對紅海重新開放對供需的潛在影響進行了詳細分析。眾所周知，自 2024 年初以來，紅海的過境量一直很低，但必須強調跨半球清潔石油產品流量的整體下降。我們的分析表明，紅海重新開放的潛在影響可能比最初預期的要有限。如果紅海運輸恢復安全並恢復正常噸位，我們根據 2023 年和 2024 年的數據估計，蘇伊士運河恢復的運輸量將相當於增加約 227 MR 的運輸需求。

The corresponding tonnage demand reduction for volume losses traveling via the Cape of Good Hope is projected to be around 290 MR equivalents. Assuming the cross-hemisphere trade, the volume will return to historical averages, we estimate the net impact of the Red Sea reopening to be marginal at just 10 MR equivalents worth of tonnage demand reduction.

預計途經好望角的運輸量損失將相應減少約 290 MR 當量噸位需求。假設跨半球貿易量將恢復到歷史平均水平，我們估計紅海重新開放的淨影響很小，僅為減少 10 MR 當量的噸位需求。

Let's move on to Slide 11. A significant development in 2025 is the January OFAC listing of additional 183 vessels, which we believe will significantly impact the overall market supply/demand balance. The sanctioned tanker fleet is roughly equivalent in size to the entire newbuild tanker program through 2025. While sanctions primarily affect crude tankers, we see positive spillover effects for clean tankers. The de facto scrapping of sanctioned vessels will reduce crude tanker cannibalization and potentially shift more product tankers into dirty trades, tightening supply in the clean sector.

讓我們繼續看第 11 張投影片。2025 年的一個重大發展是 1 月 OFAC 列出了另外 183 艘船舶，我們認為這將對整體市場供需平衡產生重大影響。獲得批准的油輪船隊規模大致相當於2025年整個新建油輪計畫的規模。雖然制裁主要影響原油油輪，但我們看到這對清潔油輪產生了積極的溢出效應。事實上，拆解受制裁船隻將減少原油油輪的拆解，並可能使更多的成品油油輪轉向重油貿易，從而收緊清潔能源領域的供應。

Additionally, we estimate that around 400 non-OFAC listed dark fleet vessels remain engaged in Russian trade. The dark fleet is identified as tonnage with questionable ownership and predominantly older age profile, while the gray fleet is tied to more reputable ownership. This signals the potential for further sanctions from the EU and OFAC, which could further restrict tonnage availability.

此外，我們估計約有 400 艘未列入 OFAC 名單的暗艦隊船隻仍在從事俄羅斯貿易。暗色船隊是指所有權存疑且船齡較長的船舶，而灰色船隊則是指所有者信譽較好的船舶。這表明歐盟和外國資產管制辦公室可能會實施進一步製裁，從而進一步限制船舶噸位供應。

Let's move on to Slide 12. The effects of the OFAC sanctions are already becoming evident. Following the sanctions, China and India have announced that they will exclude sanctioned tankers from imports. We estimate that the replacement of sanctioned barrels will be equivalent of approximately 100 Suezmaxes. Early evidence supports this shift.

讓我們繼續看第 12 張投影片。OFAC制裁的影響已開始顯現。制裁實施後，中國和印度宣布將禁止受制裁的油輪進口。我們估計，被制裁的石油將相當於約 100 桶蘇伊士型油輪。早期證據支持這種轉變。

We have already in February, observed a decline in imports from Russia, Iran and Venezuela to China and India. This impact is also visible in a significant drop in ton miles produced by the sanctioned fleet, and we expect this trend to accelerate. Comparing the total deadweight increase expected from newbuilds in 2025, this de facto scrapping helps support the underlying support versus demand balance.

我們已經在二月觀察到中國和印度從俄羅斯、伊朗和委內瑞拉的進口量下降。這種影響也體現在受制裁船隊的噸英里數大幅下降，我們預計這種趨勢將會加速。與 2025 年新造船預計的總載重量增長相比，這種事實上的拆解有助於維持潛在的支持與需求平衡。

Moving on to Slide 13. Taking the aforementioned factors into consideration, the overall supply outlook remains resilient. When we look at newbuilds through 2025 to 2028 across the tanker segments and factor in scrapping potential and lower utilization of aging vessels, the overall supply picture remains well balanced. Despite the order book for product tankers being approximately 22% as of February 2025, LR2s comprise over 50% of new tonnage expected in the next years. Historically, 70% of LR2 capacity has been absorbed into the dirty petroleum products trade.

移至幻燈片 13。綜合考慮上述因素，整體供應前景仍強勁。當我們觀察 2025 年至 2028 年油輪領域的新船建造情況，並考慮到報廢潛力和老舊船舶利用率較低時，整體供應狀況仍然保持平衡。儘管截至 2025 年 2 月成品油油輪訂單量約為 22%，但預計未來幾年 LR2 型油輪新增噸位將佔 50% 以上。從歷史上看，70% 的 LR2 運力已被吸收到污染石油產品貿易中。

This statement is further supported by the age profile of Suezmaxes and VLCCs alone.

蘇伊士型油輪和超大型油輪的船齡分佈進一步證實了這個說法。

Moving on to Slide 14. Overall, we maintain a constructive outlook for the product tanker segment into 2025. We continue to observe an increasing average age of the global product tanker fleet, and this trend has significant implications as older vessels are underutilized due to customer preference for younger tonnage. Global oil demand also remains robust. For the full year 2024, global oil demand has increased by 0.87 million barrels per day with a further increase of 1.1 million barrels per day to be expected for 2025.

移至投影片 14。整體而言，我們對 2025 年成品油油輪市場前景持樂觀態度。我們持續觀察到全球成品油輪船隊的平均船齡不斷增加，這一趨勢具有重大意義，因為由於客戶偏好較短噸位的船舶，導致老舊船舶未充分利用。全球石油需求也依然強勁。2024年全年，全球石油需求將增加87萬桶/日，預計2025年將進一步增加110萬桶/日。

Additionally, refinery maintenance accumulated at the start of the year are expected to be lower in the next months, paving the way for higher refinery runs. This will likely result in increased production and export of refined products, boosting global demand for product tankers.

此外，預計未來幾個月煉油廠維護量將在年初下降，為提高煉油廠開工率鋪平道路。這可能會導致成品油產量和出口增加，從而刺激全球對成品油油輪的需求。

Moving on to Slide 15. Perry will now bring you through the key financials for the fourth quarter.

移至投影片 15。佩里現在將向您介紹第四季度的主要財務狀況。

Thanks, Søren. As Søren mentioned, the product tanker market softened in the fourth quarter. Despite these challenges, Hafnia has continued to demonstrate a strong performance, achieving solid earnings for the quarter and for the full year.

謝謝，Søren。正如塞倫所提到的，成品油油輪市場在第四季有所疲軟。儘管面臨這些挑戰，Hafnia 仍然表現強勁，本季和全年都實現了穩健的獲利。

In Q4, we generated TCE income of $233.6 million, bringing our full year TCE income to $1.4 billion. Additionally, our commercial pool management and bunkering businesses continue to perform well, generating $6.9 million in the fourth quarter and $35.2 million for the full year. This all resulted in an adjusted EBITDA of $131 million for the quarter and $992 million for the year. Overall, we've achieved a net profit of $79.6 million for the quarter, which included a $13.6 million gain from the sale of a vessel. This brings our full year profit to $774 million, translating to a return on equity of 34.5% and a return on invested capital of 25%.

第四季度，我們的 TCE 營收為 2.336 億美元，全年 TCE 營收達到 14 億美元。此外，我們的商業泳池管理和加油業務繼續表現良好，第四季度創造了 690 萬美元的收入，全年創造了 3,520 萬美元的收入。這一切導致本季調整後的 EBITDA 達到 1.31 億美元，全年調整後的 EBITDA 達到 9.92 億美元。總體而言，本季我們實現了 7,960 萬美元的淨利潤，其中包括出售一艘船舶的 1,360 萬美元收益。這使我們的全年利潤達到 7.74 億美元，相當於股本回報率為 34.5%，投資資本回報率為 25%。

These results reflect yet another year of strong performance that we will continue to build upon.

這些結果反映了我們又一年的強勁表現，我們將繼續在此基礎上再接再厲。

And if we move on to the balance sheet on the next page. Our balance sheet remains robust despite vessel values declining from the third quarter. As a result of our proactive efforts in optimizing our balance sheet, we remain in a very strong financial position. At the end of the year, our cash balance stood at $195 million with a total liquidity of approximately $517 million. So this includes undrawn facilities of $322 million.

如果我們翻到下一頁的資產負債表。儘管船舶價值自第三季以來有所下降，但我們的資產負債表仍然強勁。由於我們積極努力優化資產負債表，我們的財務狀況仍然非常強勁。截至年底，我們的現金餘額為 1.95 億美元，總流動資金約為 5.17 億美元。因此，這包括 3.22 億美元未提取的貸款。

We've hedged approximately half of our interest rate exposure at a weighted average base rate of just over 2%, 2.01% to be exact, on a SOFR basis.

我們以略高於 2% 的加權平均基準利率（準確地說是 2.01%）對沖了大約一半的利率風險。

Our hedging strategy has been important in reducing our cost of debt and shielding us from the high interest rate environment, and we will continue to monitor market conditions to manage our financing costs effectively. At the end of Q4, our net LTV increased to 23.2%, while our NAV stood at USD7.63 per share. Given that our shares were trading at a significant discount to NAV in late '24, we added the repurchasing of shares at approximately 70% of our Q4 NAV to the mix of shareholder distributions. While the current share price of around 68% of our NAV reflects broader market sentiment rather than our underlying fundamentals, we remain focused on executing our strategy and demonstrating the strength of our business model through consistent operational performance and returns to shareholders.

我們的對沖策略對於降低債務成本和保護我們免受高利率環境的影響發揮了重要作用，我們將繼續監測市場狀況，以有效管理我們的融資成本。在第四季末，我們的淨 LTV 增至 23.2%，而我們的 NAV 為每股 7.63 美元。鑑於我們股票的交易價格在 2024 年末大幅低於資產淨值，我們將約佔第四季度資產淨值 70% 的股票回購添加到股東分配組合中。雖然目前股價約為我們資產淨值的 68%，反映的是更廣泛的市場情緒而非我們的基本面，但我們仍然專注於執行我們的策略，並透過持續的營運績效和股東回報來展示我們商業模式的實力。

If we move on to the next page to the operating summary. In Q4, our TCE income was based on 10,293 earning days, and we generated an average of TCE per day of $22,692. OpEx costs, which consist of vessel operating costs and technical management expenses were based on 9,430 calendar days in the quarter, leading to an average OpEx per day of $8,131. While the spot market softened in the quarter, it's important that we maintain a key focus on cost efficiency. We're constantly evaluating our performance also by benchmarking ourselves, and I'm pleased with our performance relative to peers under these circumstances, allowing us to operate at the most competitive levels.

如果我們進入下一頁查看營運摘要。在第四季度，我們的 TCE 收入是基於 10,293 個收入日，我們平均每天產生的 TCE 為 22,692 美元。營運成本包括船舶營運成本和技術管理費用，以本季的 9,430 個日曆日為基礎，平均每天的營運成本為 8,131 美元。儘管本季現貨市場有所疲軟，但我們仍需持續關注成本效率。我們也在透過自我基準來不斷評估我們的表現，在這種情況下，我對我們相對於同行的表現感到滿意，這使我們能夠在最具競爭力的水平上運作。

Looking at our Q1 coverage as of the 13th of February, we see tanker rates recovering. We remain optimistic about the underlying strong market fundamentals in the upcoming quarters. And if we move on to the next page. Based on our coverage for Q1 and full year 2025, we're on track to achieve solid earnings in 2025, driven by an anticipated uplift in the product tanker market. As of February 13, 2025, 67% of the total earning days in Q1 '25 have been covered at an average rate of $23,989 per day.

從我們截至 2 月 13 日的第一季報告來看，油輪運價正在回升。我們對未來幾季強勁的市場基本面仍然持樂觀態度。如果我們進入下一頁。根據我們對 2025 年第一季和全年的預測，受成品油輪市場預期上漲的推動，我們預計在 2025 年將穩健的獲利。截至 2025 年 2 月 13 日，2025 年第一季總收入天數的 67% 已被覆蓋，平均每天 23,989 美元。

And we also have 25% of the full year '25 earnings covered at an average of $24,062 per day.

而且，我們也涵蓋了 25 年全年收入的 25%，平均每天 24,062 美元。

And if you look at the right side of this slide, it presents as always the 3 scenarios outlining our potential full year '25 earnings. The first is based on analyst consensus forecast, while the second extrapolates the Q1 covered rates on the left to the available earning days in '25. And the last scenario applies full year covered rates to the available earning days in 2025. In all 3 scenarios, Hafnia is projected to generate robust net profits estimated to range around $300 million to $400 million. While down from the very high levels of the last 3 years, we still have a strong outlook on the market, underpinned by the market fundamentals we mentioned in the market section.

如果你看一下這張投影片的右側，它一如既往地呈現了 3 種情景，概述了我們 25 年全年的潛在收益。第一個是基於分析師的一致預測，而第二個則將左側的 Q1 覆蓋率推斷為 25 年的可用獲利天數。最後一種情況是將全年覆蓋率應用於 2025 年的可用收入天數。在這三種情況下，Hafnia 預計都將產生強勁的淨利潤，估計約為 3 億至 4 億美元。儘管較過去 3 年的極高水準有所下降，但我們對市場前景仍然看好，這得益於我們在市場部分提到的市場基本面。

Mikael, over to you for the next few slides.

米凱爾，接下來的幾張投影片交給你了。

Thank you. We're moving to Slide #21. Moving on, I would like to provide insight into Hafnia's sustainability strategy and goals. As a recognized market leader, we understand our critical role in shaping a more sustainable future. We are actively driving the integration of sustainability principles throughout our operations to create a positive impact on our communities and stakeholders.

謝謝。我們正在轉到投影片#21。接下來，我想深入了解 Hafnia 的永續發展策略和目標。作為公認的市場領導者，我們了解我們在塑造更永續的未來方面發揮的關鍵作用。我們積極推動永續發展原則在整個營運過程中的整合，以對我們的社區和利害關係人產生積極影響。

Through collaboration with industry peers, regulators, international bodies and constant engagement with stakeholders, we are committed to developing long-term solutions that will address the maritime challenges, enabling us to not only future-proof our business, but also contribute meaningfully to the world.

透過與業內同行、監管機構、國際機構的合作以及與利益相關者的持續接觸，我們致力於制定應對海事挑戰的長期解決方案，使我們不僅能夠面向未來開展業務，而且能夠為世界做出有意義的貢獻。

Slide 22. Next, we understand the constantly evolving landscape of the world and actively seek initiatives where we can future-proof ourselves. We have embarked on several key strategic initiatives that we believe will play a key role in defining the maritime future. Most recently, we have announced the launch of Seascale Energy, a new joint venture bunker procurement entity between Hafnia Bunker Alliance and Cargill Pure Marine Fuels. This aims to transform marine fuel procurement services by delivering customers worldwide with cost efficiencies, transparency and access to sustainable fuel innovations.

投影片 22。接下來，我們了解不斷變化的世界格局，並積極尋求能讓我們面向未來的措施。我們已經啟動了幾項關鍵策略舉措，我們相信這些舉措將在定義航運未來方面發揮關鍵作用。最近，我們宣布成立 Seascale Energy，這是 Hafnia Bunker Alliance 和 Cargill Pure Marine Fuels 共同成立的新的合資燃料採購實體。其目的是透過為全球客戶提供成本效益、透明度和永續燃料創新，改變船用燃料採購服務。

By aligning our strategic investments with strong industry partnerships, we reinforce our position at the forefront of maritime innovation.

透過將我們的策略投資與強大的產業合作夥伴關係相結合，我們鞏固了我們在海事創新領域的領先地位。

Moving to Slide #23. Looking ahead in 2025, Hafnia is operating from a position of strength. While market dynamics remain complex with the evolving nature of sanctions, tariffs and developments in the Red Sea, I'm optimistic about Hafnia's ability to capitalize on the positive trajectory of the market. Our proven operational excellence and financial strength position us well to create long-term value. Having returned over $1.5 billion to shareholders over the past 3 years, we remain focused on disciplined fleet deployment and capital allocation while maintaining the flexibility to capture opportunities as they arise.

移至幻燈片#23。展望 2025 年，Hafnia 將擁有雄厚的實力。儘管隨著制裁、關稅和紅海局勢的發展不斷變化，市場動態仍然複雜，但我對 Hafnia 利用市場積極發展軌蹟的能力持樂觀態度。我們已證明卓越的營運能力和雄厚的財務實力使我們能夠創造長期價值。過去 3 年我們已向股東返還了超過 15 億美元，我們將繼續專注於規範的船隊部署和資本配置，同時保持靈活性以抓住出現的機會。

This concludes our presentation. With that, I would now like to open the call for questions.

我們的演講到此結束。現在，我想開始提問。

(Operator Instructions) Thank you, everyone. We will start the Q&A session now. I will start with the questions that have been posed in the chat in the Q&A section. So I'll just read out one that says, hello, why did you decide to pursue the share buyback program with such bad USDprices?

（操作員指示）謝謝大家。我們現在開始問答環節。我將從問答部分聊天中提出的問題開始。因此，我只想讀出一條內容，您好，為什麼您決定在美元價格如此糟糕的情況下推行股票回購計劃？

I can take that. I see there's more questions indeed on the share buyback. Why would we do them or why wouldn't we do it more? It's actually both questions on both sides. We did the share buyback in Q4 as part of the shareholder distributions in our dividend policy because we saw a big disconnect between the share price and the NAV.

我可以接受。我發現關於股票回購確實還有更多疑問。我們為什麼要這樣做或為什麼我們不多做這些事？這實際上是雙方的問題。由於我們發現股價與資產淨值之間存在很大脫節，因此我們在第四季度進行了股票回購，作為股利政策中股東分配的一部分。

So that's why we concluded the total program of around $50 million in Q4 and another $25 million in Q1. Going forward, we have our dividend policy that is connected to our net LTV. So in principle, we focus on cash distributions via dividends. But obviously, where we see a big disconnect, we always, as we have shown, have the opportunity to do the share buybacks as well.

這就是為什麼我們在第四季度完成了總額約 5000 萬美元的計劃，並在第一季完成了另外 2500 萬美元的計劃。展望未來，我們的股利政策與淨 LTV 掛鉤。因此原則上，我們專注於透過股利進行現金分配。但顯然，當我們看到存在巨大脫節時，正如我們所表明的那樣，我們也總是有機會進行股票回購。

Thank you, Perry. So I will actually move to the raise hand function now. Omar Nokta, can you please unmute yourself?

謝謝你，佩里。因此我現在實際上要轉到舉手功能。Omar Nokta，你能取消靜音嗎？

Yes, maybe a couple of questions more market related. I just wanted to get your sense given you're obviously very significant in terms of fleet and how you're operating. Just in reference to the sanctions that we've been seeing here, you mentioned China and India are appearing to -- or plan to adhere to the sanctions. I guess maybe just on that, what are you seeing from your vantage point at the moment in terms of how those 2 importers have been handling imports? And are you seeing kind of like a full adherence to the view that they're not bringing in sanctioned ships?

是的，也許有幾個問題與市場更相關。我只是想了解您的感受，因為您在機隊和營運方面顯然非常重要。就我們在這裡看到的製裁而言，您提到中國和印度似乎——或者計劃遵守制裁。我想也許就此而言，從您目前的角度來看，這兩家進口商如何處理進口？您是否看到他們完全堅持不引進受制裁船隻的觀點？

-- have they stepped up demand for compliant vessels? Can you give us some color on how things have been progressing there?

——他們是否增加了對合規船舶的需求？您能告訴我們那裡的情況進展如何嗎？

I guess that's for me, Mikael. Yes, on a general note, you can say that when it all kicked off in the end of January, there was a pretty big push already for other traders to cover the lost in terms of import volume, especially for crude into India and into China. It seems relatively evident that they are taking vanilla tonnes nowadays and to a large extent, also oil from other regions. To support that, you can, for instance, see that exports out of Iran has dropped more or less to 1/3 of what it was in January before the sanctions. So there is certainly some adherence to the -- to what they have said, and it's self-imposed essentially, right?

我想這對我來說是這樣的，麥可。是的，總的來說，你可以說，當這一切在一月底開始時，其他貿易商已經做出了相當大的努力來彌補進口量的損失，特別是進口到印度和中國的原油。比較明顯的是，他們現在正在進口大量香草，而且很大程度上也進口來自其他地區的石油。為了證明這一點，你可以看到，伊朗的出口量已經下降到製裁前 1 月出口量的三分之一左右。因此，他們肯定會堅持自己所說的話，而且這本質上是自我強加的，對嗎？

They have not said no to Russian oil, but they have said no to sanctioned tankers, rather OLFA I guess, to sanctioned tankers.

他們沒有拒絕俄羅斯石油，但他們拒絕了受制裁的油輪，我猜是 OLFA，拒絕了受制裁的油輪。

That's interesting. Okay. So you mentioned just -- it looks like Iran exports are down 1/3 from January. Did I hear that right?

那很有意思。好的。所以您剛才提到—看起來伊朗出口量比一月下降了三分之一。我沒聽錯吧？

Yes. I mean, although February data there is not completely to an end yet, right? You are seeing about 750,000 barrels versus about 2 million in January. That's the exact number.

是的。我的意思是，雖然二月的數據還沒有完全結束，對嗎？目前庫存約為 75 萬桶，而 1 月份庫存約為 200 萬桶。這就是確切的數字。

Got it. And then just a separate question. You had mentioned the cannibalization of crude going into product would slow or obviously stop perhaps altogether as a result of sanctions and the ships getting pulled away. I guess it sounded like the whole cannibalization theme had already ended or see that it kind of ended last year or late in the year. Are you still seeing pressures from that today in the product market?

知道了。然後只是一個單獨的問題。您曾提到，由於制裁和船隻被撤離，用於生產的原油的蠶食現象將會減緩或明顯停止。我想這聽起來好像整個蠶食主題已經結束了，或者看起來它在去年或年底就結束了。您今天在產品市場上是否仍看到這種壓力？

You can say that on a general note, the cannibalization is more or less back to normal averages, what you would expect from a new build program or anything to the tune of that. So you would see a hard trade-off in December and into January. Recent data will show that you actually have a little bit of an elevation in February. But if you drill into that, it will carry a couple of VLCCs that is going from the AG to the Red Sea. That doesn't count as cannibalization because it's an adjacent trade that is not really involving the international trading fleet, if you want.

你可以說，從總體上看，拆解程度或多或少已經恢復到了正常平均水平，這正是你對新建造程序或類似程序所期望的。因此，你會看到 12 月和 1 月的艱難權衡。最近的數據顯示，二月的漲幅實際上略有上升。但如果你鑽進去，它將運載幾艘從阿根廷前往紅海的超大型油輪。如果你願意的話，這並不算蠶食，因為這是一項相鄰的貿易，實際上並不涉及國際貿易船隊。

So I would say from December until date, you have -- you're back to or close to normal averages, as you would expect. I think it's merely related to a stronger crude market as well, of course, in that sense. And that's also why we believe at the end of last year that it would actually have come off earlier than it did eventually. But now we are where we are, yes.

所以我想說，從 12 月到現在，你已經恢復到或接近正常平均水平，正如你所期望的那樣。我認為從這個意義上來說，這當然也與原油市場走強有關。這也是為什麼我們在去年年底相信它實際上會比最終實現的時間更早。但現在我們處於現在的位置，是的。

Frode Mørkedal, I ask you to unmute yourself please.

Frode Mørkedal，請您取消靜音。

Yes. On the buyback, just to clarify, are you able to continue that program? Or do you have to declare a new buyback program if you wanted to? And secondly, what's the intention with the shares you intend to cancel?

是的。關於回購，我只是想澄清一下，您能繼續該計劃嗎？或者如果您願意的話，您是否必須宣布一項新的回購計劃？其次，您打算取消股票的目的是什麼？

Frode, thanks for that. To your last question, yes, the bulk of the treasury shares will indeed be canceled. And in terms of the -- yes, of the share buyback, we have the program that ran until was it late January up to $100 million. If we want to go further, then we'll discuss with the Board and would announce a buyback program going forward.

弗羅德，謝謝你。對於您的最後一個問題，是的，大部分庫存股確實將被取消。就股票回購而言，我們的計畫一直持續到 1 月底，金額高達 1 億美元。如果我們想進一步行動，我們將與董事會討論並宣布未來的回購計劃。

Okay. Understood. And just generally speaking, what's the verdict on the buyback versus dividends? Do you feel differently now after you completed the buyback? Or is that -- you still see that as a good tool in the toolbox?

好的。明白了。整體來說，回購與分紅的比較結果如何？完成回購後，現在感覺有什麼不同嗎？或者說——您仍然認為它是工具箱中的一個很好的工具？

Yes, I think...

是的，我認為…

Yes, I'll take that, Perry. Thanks, Frode. So I think what's important to understand here is that the -- we debate the dividend policy, if you like, with the Board every quarter, right? But in reality, I mean, our dividend policy that we have established is firm and here to stay. The share buybacks were kind of always for us more of an opportunistic approach, i.e., that once we see share price coming down to levels, as we saw now, you bought at 30% discount to NAV, we would look at it.

是的，我接受，佩里。謝謝，弗羅德。因此，我認為這裡需要理解的重要一點是——如果你願意的話，我們每季都會與董事會討論股利政策，對嗎？但實際上，我們制定的股利政策是堅定的，而且會一直持續下去。股票回購對我們來說一直是一種機會主義的做法，也就是說，一旦我們看到股價下跌到我們現在看到的以低於資產淨值 30% 的折扣購買的水平，我們就會考慮。

But it's probably the way to look at it is probably more of an opportunistic view when share prices in our view, are way too low rather than being a permanent thing. So the dividend policy, as you always knew it, and the share buybacks are what we try to do ad hoc if we see that share prices are way, way too low compared to the value of the company.

但我們認為，當股價過低時，這種看法可能更像是一種機會主義觀點，而不是永久性的。因此，如您所知，如果我們發現股價與公司價值相比太低，我們就會嘗試暫時採取股利政策和股票回購措施。

Yes. I agree. I totally understand. So as long as you cancel the shares, you will see the effect, right, with higher EPS, all else equal. Second question on the market really.

是的。我同意。我完全理解。因此，只要您取消股票，您就會看到效果，對的，在其他條件相同的情況下，每股盈餘會更高。第二個問題確實與市場有關。

The slide you showed on the Red Sea, which is really interesting, just to confirm, you basically conclude that if and when the Red Sea reopens, it doesn't really -- well, it has a very small impact on the market. That's the conclusion, right?

您展示的有關紅海的幻燈片非常有趣，只是為了確認一下，您基本上得出的結論是，如果紅海重新開放，它實際上不會——嗯，它對市場的影響非常小。這就是結論吧？

Correct. So basically, the volume that has been lost due to the Middle East and the Far East in reality being less competitive due to longer trade routes, first of all, higher freight, but certainly versus U.S. refiners delivering into Europe to a large extent. If you get that volume back, which you highly likely will because the arbitrage East to West will open quite significantly once the trading route becomes shorter, then you will be very close to a status quo versus where we were in Q3 and Q4 last year.

正確的。因此，基本上，由於貿易路線更長，運費更高，中東和遠東地區實際上競爭力較弱，但肯定與美國煉油廠在很大程度上向歐洲交貨有關。如果交易量恢復正常，這很有可能發生，因為一旦貿易路線變短，東西方的套利空間就會大大擴大，那麼與去年第三季和第四季相比，交易量將非常接近現狀。

Lewis Gregory, can we ask you to unmute yourself? Yes, we can hear you now.

路易斯·格雷戈里，我們可以請您取消靜音嗎？是的，我們現在可以聽到你的聲音。

I wasn't quite sure if I had unmute myself. Yes, you would think I would know that by now. I was hoping to talk a little bit about just given the focus on the buyback in Q4 and really how asset prices have trended. It looks like since maybe the middle of last year, at least MRs for we'll call a modern tonnage has started to kind of pull back. Realizing that no cycle is the same, but as you guys think about asset prices over the next 12 to 18 months, are you seeing the potential for asset prices to stabilize?

我不太確定我是否已取消靜音。是的，你可能認為我現在應該知道這一點。我希望稍微談談第四季的回購情況以及資產價格的實際趨勢。看起來，大概從去年年中開始，至少我們稱為現代噸位的 MR 型船已經開始回落。意識到沒有一個週期是相同的，但是當你們考慮未來 12 到 18 個月的資產價格時，你們是否看到資產價格穩定的可能性？

And really, what I wonder is, I think sometimes people focus on asset prices and they see markers from brokers. This decrease in asset prices, has there been any breadth in the S&P market around these indicated lower prices?

我真正想知道的是，我認為有時人們會關注資產價格，並且會看到經紀人給出的標記。資產價格下跌，標普市場是否出現了圍繞這些較低價格的波動？

Yes. Thank you for the question. This is Mikael. So yes, I think it is a really good question because as you say, if you look back historically through cycles, there's obviously a certain element of asset values and freight markets and long-term time charter markets. So I think what we are seeing now is actually more of a situation which you also saw in the dry bulk market is that the freight markets have been sliding a bit last year and now coming back.

是的。謝謝你的提問。這是米凱爾。是的，我認為這是一個非常好的問題，因為正如你所說，如果回顧歷史週期，顯然存在資產價值、貨運市場和長期租船市場的一定因素。所以我認為我們現在看到的情況實際上更像是乾散貨市場的情況，即貨運市場去年有所下滑，現在正在回升。

Asset prices went down at the end of last year, which is why our net loan-to-value also increased above 20%.

去年年底資產價格下跌，這就是為什麼我們的淨貸款價值比也增加了 20% 以上。

But you're not really seeing a lot of activity out there. And I think what you're going to see on asset prices is probably more of a -- what we call like a theoretical valuation mark rather than real transaction values because sellers are not going to buy lower prices and buyers are not going to buy unless they get a real bargain because they want to have more visibility of some of these uncertainties that Søren have just described in the market.

但你實際上並沒有看到那裡有很多活動。我認為，你將看到的資產價格可能更像是我們所說的理論估值標記，而不是實際交易價值，因為賣家不會以更低的價格購買，而買家除非真的撿到便宜，否則也不會購買，因為他們希望更清楚地了解塞倫剛才在市場上描述的一些不確定性。

So I think you're going to see a bit of a standstill actually on this because nobody is going to be pressurized to take and sell assets at lower prices when you are looking into the next 2 to 4 years of a potential removal of a dark fleet sanctioned vessels, which is much, much larger than the current order book of newbuilds that's coming into the market. So I think right now, when it comes to at least to transactional value, I think, first and foremost, freight markets and long-term time charters have to show more activity before you're going to see actual marks that reflect underlying transactions.

因此，我認為你實際上會看到這方面的一些停滯，因為當你考慮未來 2 到 4 年內可能淘汰暗船隊批准的船隻時，沒有人會被迫以較低的價格收購和出售資產，而暗船隊批准的船隻比目前進入市場的新船訂單要大得多。因此我認為現在，至少就交易價值而言，我認為首先，貨運市場和長期租船合約必須表現出更多的活動，然後你才能看到反映基礎交易的實際標記。

Okay. Okay. Great. And then I did have one more question. And it's funny because today, as I look at MR rates in the Atlantic and the Pacific, they're kind of right on top of each other.

好的。好的。偉大的。然後我還有一個問題。這很有趣，因為今天當我查看大西洋和太平洋的 MR 率時，發現它們正好位於彼此之上。

But really, my question is, as we think about the dark fleet, I mean, roughly speaking, any kind of sense for -- I mean, I'm assuming all of it, but I'll defer to you, the team. How much of the dark fleet is trading Asia versus East? And as that happened, as the dark fleet unwinds, could you actually see that the Asian markets outperform the Atlantic markets? It seems like it's been the opposite over the last couple of years.

但實際上，我的問題是，當我們思考黑暗艦隊時，我的意思是，粗略地說，任何一種感覺——我的意思是，我假設了這一切，但我會聽從你們，團隊的意見。有多少黑暗艦隊在亞洲和東方之間進行貿易？當這種情況發生時，隨著黑暗艦隊的解散，你真的能看到亞洲市場的表現優於大西洋市場嗎？但過去幾年的情況似乎恰恰相反。

The Asian or the Far East market and the U.S. Gulf market to take that, the last part of it first, has been the strongest over the past 2 years really. And you can say in terms of the dark fleet, we are counting 400-plus ships that is trading in and out of Russia at the moment being the kind that has a bit of a questionable ownership structure, a little bit older age. Predominantly, these ships are actually loading out of the Baltic region and the Black Sea. It's more to the crude side when you look at the Asia Pacific Russian loadings, which is more sort of a Suezmax and Aframax game, which is certainly trading above the price cap.

亞洲或遠東市場以及美國海灣市場（首先是其後一部分）在過去兩年中表現最為強勁。就黑暗艦隊而言，我們統計了目前進出俄羅斯的船隻 400 多艘，這些船隻的所有權結構有點可疑，船齡也有點老。這些船隻主要從波羅的海地區和黑海裝載貨物。從亞太地區的俄羅斯裝載量來看，情況更偏向原油，更像是蘇伊士型油輪和阿芙拉型油輪的較量，其交易價格肯定高於價格上限。

So I think it's a worldwide thing really. If you have a full sanctioning of this fleet as well, whether or not that happens, it's hard to say. But if it happens, then it's more a total demand thing than anything else. Then you would have to have replacement barrels coming from something else, which would be the normal fleet it's our sort of fleets that would take over that trade, right.

所以我認為這確實是一個全球性的問題。如果您也對這支艦隊進行全面製裁，那麼是否會發生這種情況，就很難說了。但如果真的發生了，那麼這更多的是一個總需求問題，而不是其他任何問題。那麼你必須從其他地方獲得替換桶，也就是正常的船隊，也就是我們的船隊來接管這項貿易，對吧。

Clement Mullins, can I ask you to unmute yourself?

克萊門特·馬林斯，我可以請您取消靜音嗎？

I wanted to ask about your fleet positioning. You have a fairly modern fleet, especially including the vessels owned via the joint ventures. And I was wondering, how do you feel about your current split between LR2s, LR1s and MRs? Would you like to, let's say, bolster your exposure to any of those in the medium term?

我想問一下你們的艦隊定位。你們擁有一支相當現代化的船隊，特別是包括透過合資企業擁有的船隻。我想知道，您對目前 LR2、LR1 和 MR 之間的劃分有何看法？比如說，您是否希望在中期內增加對其中任何一項的投資？

Thank you. Yes. I think the way we normally answer these questions about the assets is really that we see the product tanker market as being one market, basically in the sense that what happens in the LR2 market eventually will also have an effect in the MR market and vice versa. So we're not really that sensitive about whether it's one size or the other that we invest in. It's actually more about pricing versus earning capability.

謝謝。是的。我認為我們通常回答這些有關資產的問題的方式實際上是將成品油輪市場視為一個市場，基本上是說 LR2 市場發生的事情最終也會對 MR 市場產生影響，反之亦然。因此，我們對於所投資的是哪一種規模並不是那麼敏感。事實上，這更多的是關於定價與獲利能力的問題。

To give you an example, back in late '21, when we bought 12 LR1s, the whole reason for that was not necessarily that we just wanted to strengthen our LR1 fleet. It was actually more that the pricing was almost similar to an equivalent age of a medium-range ship at the time. So the extra earning value by paying the same price was just much more attractive in the LR1 segment, which is why we went for that. But you can say in an ideal world, we wouldn't mind having equal distribution in all asset classes. But for us, it's really only about pricing and earning capability when we invest in ships.

舉個例子，早在 21 年末，我們就買了 12 艘 LR1 型油輪，這樣做的原因不一定只是因為我們想加強我們的 LR1 船隊。實際上，其定價幾乎與當時同等年齡的中程船相同。因此，以相同的價格獲得額外的收益價值在 LR1 領域更具吸引力，這就是我們選擇它的原因。但你可以說，在理想世界中，我們不介意所有資產類別的平等分配。但對我們來說，投資船舶真正考慮的只是定價和獲利能力。

Makes sense. In the past, you had mentioned some of your time chartered vessels had purchase options priced below market pricing. Asset values have declined a bit from the highs. And I was wondering how does current pricing compare to the options? And secondly, should we expect any of those to be exercised throughout 2025?

有道理。過去，您曾提到，您的一些定期租船的購買選擇權價格低於市場價格。資產價值已從高點略有下降。我想知道當前定價與選項相比如何？其次，我們是否應該預期其中任何一項措施將在 2025 年實施？

Yes. Thanks for that question. In general, the prices or the purchase prices that we have in these options are still in the money despite the correction that we saw in the last quarter. So we keep that in mind as long as we have the options and there's value, we have time to consider whether we buy them out or not. But overall, still in the money, yes.

是的。謝謝你的提問。總體而言，儘管上個季度出現了調整，但這些選擇權的價格或購買價格仍然有效。因此，我們牢記這一點，只要我們有選擇並且有價值，我們就有時間考慮是否將其收購。但總體來說，還是有錢的，是的。

Dimitrios Chavellas, can you please unmute yourself?

Dimitrios Chavellas，您能取消靜音嗎？

Okay. Thank you to the gentlemen over at Hafnia for the presentation and the update. How probable would you say that it is that moving closer to Q1 results for the current year that your guidance may not be as soft as it is right now? Because I mean, I'm a long-term minority shareholder investor in Hafnia. It's a top position for me.

好的。感謝 Hafnia 的先生們的演示和更新。您認為，隨著今年第一季業績的臨近，您的業績指引可能不會像現在這麼寬鬆，這種可能性有多大？因為我是 Hafnia 的長期少數股東投資者。對我來說這是一個頂級職位。

Fundamentally, I think it's a very quality play on the long term. What is going on is that the price today is falling by 10%, coinciding with the conclusion of your share buyback program, which should have boosted, I think, market sentiment a bit.

從根本上來說，我認為從長期來看，這是一項非常優質的投資。現在的情況是，今天的價格下跌了 10%，恰逢你們的股票回購計畫結束，我認為這應該會稍微提振市場情緒。

And I'm just trying to understand because it's more of a short-term thing. You touched upon some of the elements, the dark fleet included. It plays a role, I think, too, Yes. It's just that it's such a big drop and it doesn't make sense for me. And I'm trying to understand if it's just because the guidance isn't soft because there are so many uncertainty factors influencing the next like 12 to 18 months and if the guidance could get a bit less soft than it is currently perhaps as we -- as the management gets more visibility towards the running area.

我只是想了解一下，因為這更像是短期的事情。您談到了一些元素，包括黑暗艦隊。我認為它也發揮了作用，是的。只是下降幅度太大了，對我來說沒有意義。我想了解這是否僅僅是因為指導不夠寬鬆，因為有太多不確定因素影響著未來 12 到 18 個月的情況，並且如果指導能夠比現在稍微寬鬆一些，也許因為我們 - 隨著管理層對運行領域的了解越來越多。

Thank you so much for that. This is Mikael. So I'm not sure exactly what guidance you're referring to, but I'm assuming it's more of the analyst guidance in general or some of the covered rates. But I think in any case...

非常感謝。這是米凱爾。所以我不確定您指的是什麼指導，但我假設它更多的是一般的分析師指導或一些涵蓋的利率。但我認為無論如何...

Yes.

是的。

Yes, exactly. So I think in any case, I mean, I think what we are seeing at the moment, and I know it's a bit difficult these days because there's a lot of uncertainty around. Our view is exactly the same as your view in the sense that there seems to be a lot of uncertainty at the moment in the world, and therefore, people rather say, well, we will rather take the safe process of not sitting on too many exposures rather than being a bit safe on our portfolio. We don't understand. There's no factual reason why share price should drop today, for instance, or for that matter, what they did last week when we look at the long-term perspective of this business.

是的，確實如此。所以我認為無論如何，我的意思是，我認為我們目前看到的情況，我知道現在有點困難，因為周圍有很多不確定性。我們的觀點與您的觀點完全相同，因為目前世界上似乎存在許多不確定性，因此，人們寧願說，好吧，我們寧願採取安全的做法，不持有太多的風險敞口，也不願在我們的投資組合上保持一點安全。我們不明白。例如，當我們從這個行業的長期前景來看時，沒有任何事實理由可以解釋為什麼股價今天會下跌，或者說，上週股價會下跌。

We appreciate there's some uncertainty around the Red Sea and the war in Ukraine but I think as we try to illustrate here in our presentation, going back to where things were is not bad for our industry. What is bad is actually that when there's uncertainty and people stop taking long-term positions. So we are not sitting saying we'd love everything to go on as they were. We think when things go back to normal, which hopefully they will soon, the big issue here is that 16% of the tanker fleet are either in the dark fleet or sanctioned. And depending on what regulators decide and what happens to that fleet, that is way, way, way, above any form of newbuild entrants into the market.

我們理解紅海和烏克蘭戰爭存在一些不確定性，但我認為，正如我們在演示中試圖說明的那樣，回到原來的狀態對我們的行業來說並不是壞事。事實上，糟糕的是，當存在不確定性時，人們就會停止採取長期立場。因此，我們不會坐下來說我們希望一切按照原樣繼續下去。我們認為，當一切恢復正常時（希望很快就會恢復），這裡最大的問題是 16% 的油輪船隊要么處於黑暗船隊中，要么受到製裁。並且取決於監管機構的決定和船隊的情況，這遠遠超出任何形式的新船進入市場。

At the same time, as you have a demand scenario that's still strong when it comes to oil in general.

同時，整體而言，石油需求依然強勁。

So as you're saying, we can only assume this is like more spot day trading philosophy and sentiment rather than long-term perspective because for us over the next 2 to 4, 5 years, I mean, almost half of the fleet will have to go out for scrap and the order book is nowhere near to be able to replace it. So that's kind of our long-term perspective on it. Realizing in between, of course, the geopolitical uncertainties will always, in a way, provoke different reaction from different investors. But like you said, we certainly don't think there's any justification whatsoever on the development of the share price that we've seen lately.

所以正如你所說的，我們只能假設這更像是現貨日交易理念和情緒，而不是長期觀點，因為對我們來說，在未來 2 到 4、5 年內，幾乎一半的船隊將不得不出去報廢，而訂單量遠遠不足以取代它。這就是我們對此的長期看法。當然，要意識到地緣政治的不確定性總是會在某種程度上引起不同投資者的不同反應。但就像您所說的那樣，我們當然認為最近看到的股價走勢沒有任何道理。

(Operator Instructions) [Jan], may I ask you to take yourself off mute. Jan, can you hear us? So Jan, we can't actually hear you. If you would like to put your question into the chat or the Q&A instead.

（操作員指示）[Jan]，請您取消靜音。簡，你聽得到我們說話嗎？所以 Jan，我們其實聽不到你的聲音。如果您想將問題提交到聊天或問答中。

In the meantime, I will move over to a question that we've received in the chat from Oscar. We have -- how are you expecting the impact of possible tariffs on upcoming quarters? And as the share price is now lower, are you looking for share buybacks for Q1?

同時，我將轉到我們在聊天中收到的奧斯卡的一個問題。我們有—您預計可能的關稅將對未來幾季產生什麼影響？由於現在股價較低，您是否希望在第一季回購股票？

I'll take the tariffs. Well, it's a little bit hard to say and it becomes political what is going to happen. I think the honest answer is that any sort of uncertainty and turmoil in the market is simply good for shipping. If Mexico has to -- or product from Mexico to the U.S. Gulf has to be delivered from somewhere else, it's longer ton mile, the same product will be needed.

我會承擔關稅。嗯，這有點難說，而且會發生什麼事情已經變得政治化了。我認為誠實的回答是，市場上的任何不確定性和動盪都對航運有利。如果墨西哥必須——或者從墨西哥到美國墨西哥灣的產品必須從其他地方運送，那麼噸英里數就會更長，需要的產品也是一樣的。

Canadian crude coming into the Midwest of the U.S. in terms of tariffs there. You have already seen Vancouver export port open for nighttime berthing elevating their potential for loadings from 20 to 30 Aframaxes a month.

就關稅而言，加拿大原油進入美國中西部。您已經看到溫哥華出口港開放夜間停泊，每月裝載阿芙拉型油輪的可能性從 20 艘增加到 30 艘。

So in a sense, I think it's good for shipping. But it really becomes a very political question where -- and what tariffs is it going to be. It's even more difficult when you start looking at the potential Chinese build ships being tariffs coming into the U.S., which would be a major part of the fleet, not only for tankers, but for containers and dry cargo and everything else, and it seems difficult to see that that's going to follow through, but God knows, right? I don't know if that answered that question.

所以從某種意義上來說，我認為這對航運有利。但這其實是一個非常政治化的問題——關稅在哪裡以及具體是什麼樣的。當你開始考慮對進入美國的中國造船徵收關稅時，情況就變得更加困難了，這些船舶將成為美國船隊的重要組成部分，不僅是油輪，還包括集裝箱、幹散貨和其他所有船隻，而且似乎很難看出這將如何進行，但上帝知道，對吧？我不知道這是否回答了這個問題。

Okay.

好的。

And there was also another question, Gina, I think, on share buyback, right? And I think we did answer that previously that share buyback will be part of more of an opportunistic approach. So whenever we and the Board feel that the timing is right, price is right, then as I said, then we may look at it, but it will be more on an ad hoc basis.

吉娜，我想還有另一個問題，關於股票回購，對嗎？我認為我們之前確實回答過這個問題，股票回購將是一種機會主義方法的一部分。因此，只要我們和董事會認為時機合適、價格合適，那麼正如我所說，我們可能會考慮，但這將更多地以臨時為基礎。

Okay. And Mikael, we have a second question after about some of the buybacks of shares occurred in Q1 2025. As I understand, this comes out of Q1 dividends that will be paid. Can you confirm how many cents per share will the buyback reduce the Q1 dividend? Second question, what is your breakeven TCE rate currently?

好的。米凱爾，關於 2025 年第一季發生的部分股票回購，我們還有第二個問題。據我了解，這是來自第一季支付的股息。您能否確認回購將使第一季股利減少每股多少美分？第二個問題，您目前的損益兩平 TCE 利率是多少？

Sorry, it's Perry. I was on mute. I don't have the exact cents per share, but we bought back roughly $25 million of shares back in the quarter. So divided that by the net shares outstanding, you will have the number per share.

抱歉，我是佩里。我處於靜音狀態。我不知道每股的具體價格，但我們在本季回購了大約 2500 萬美元的股票。因此，用該數字除以淨流通股數，即可得到每股數量。

Thank you, Perry. Do we have any more questions either via the chat, the Q&A or via the raise hand function? I'm not actually seeing anything.

謝謝你，佩里。我們還有其他問題嗎？可以透過聊天、問答或舉手功能提出嗎？我其實什麼也沒看到。

Yes, there's 2 extra questions coming in, Gina. One more on buybacks and one on the U.S. listing. I can take that. Yes, I think we discussed a lot about the share buybacks.

是的，還有兩個額外的問題，吉娜。還有一個是關於回購的，還有一個是關於美國上市的。我可以接受。是的，我想我們討論了很多關於股票回購的問題。

And as Mikael indicated, we have a very consistent distribution policy in terms of how much we pay out of our net profit. Focus will be on cash dividends. And as and where we think that there is a very big disconnect, we have the tool of the share buybacks as well. So that is, I think, what we can say about it rather than having any strict mechanical way of looking at that.

正如米凱爾所指出的，就我們從淨利潤中支付多少錢而言，我們有一個非常一致的分配政策。重點將放在現金股利。當我們認為有很大脫節時，我們也可以採用股票回購的工具。所以，我認為，這就是我們可以說的，而不是用任何嚴格的機械的方式來看待它。

And then in terms of the U.S. listing, so we've been listed in the U.S. now for, what is it, about 10 months. We've definitely seen stronger interest from investors in the U.S. Also, the trading in the shares has been much stronger since we listed both in Oslo and the U.S.

就美國上市而言，我們現在已經在美國上市了，大約 10 個月。我們確實看到美國投資者的興趣越來越濃厚。此外，自從我們在奧斯陸和美國上市以來，股票交易也更加強勁。

with actually the bulk of the trading already going through the U.S. Stock Exchange.

實際上大部分交易已經透過美國證券交易所進行。

Okay. Thank you, Perry. We have a second half of the question from [Boris]about the TCE breakeven. What is your breakeven TCE rate currently?

好的。謝謝你，佩里。我們還有來自 [Boris] 的有關 TCE 盈虧平衡的第二半問題。您目前的損益兩平 TCE 利率是多少？

I have to look that up one second. So there's one other question as well on the breakdown, then I'll look at the number.

我必須查一下。因此，關於細目分類，還有一個問題，然後我會看一下數字。

What's your cash breakeven?

你的現金損益平衡點是多少？

Yes. So I said I have to look that up. If you look at the next question and I'll answer it later.

是的。所以我說我必須查一下。如果您看下一個問題，我稍後會回答。

We have what is the percentage breakdown of fleet trading on the spot market versus the fleet trading on period charters in 2025?

2025 年現貨市場船隊交易與定期租船交易船隊的比例是多少？

I can take that. So basically, if you look at the -- I'm not sure we have published these numbers yet. But I think for the time being, when you look at for the rest of the year, excluding what we have already fixed in the spot market, I think the numbers we put in the slides, correct me if I'm wrong, Perry and Thomas, is that we fixed 25% of the full year already at $24,000 per day. For the hedging part, which goes beyond what we fixed in the spot market, we've probably covered around 13% to 14%, which is on a combination of time charter contracts and the rest is spot exposure.

我可以接受。所以基本上，如果你看一下——我不確定我們是否已經公佈了這些數字。但我認為就目前而言，當你看今年剩餘時間的情況時，不包括我們已經在現貨市場上確定的金額，我認為我們在幻燈片中給出的數字，如果我錯了請糾正我，佩里和托馬斯，是我們已經將全年的 25% 確定為每天 24,000 美元。對於對沖部分，超出了我們在現貨市場上確定的範圍，我們可能已經覆蓋了大約 13% 到 14%，這是定期租船合約的組合，其餘的是現貨敞口。

Thank you, Mikael. We have another question about -- from [Molly] on any considerations for a Canadian listing. The American listing does not allow Canadian dividend tax credits.

謝謝你，米凱爾。我們還有另一個問題——來自 [Molly] 關於在加拿大上市的任何考慮。美國上市不允許加拿大股利稅收抵免。

Yes, I can take that one. We're at the moment, not pursuing listing on another stock exchange. So we have Oslo and the New York Stock Exchange at the moment.

是的，我可以接受這個。目前，我們還沒有尋求在其他證券交易所上市。目前我們有奧斯陸和紐約證券交易所。

Then I see a question on offset of buybacks in January against Q4 dividend. So for the Q4 dividend, we've offset what we spent on the buyback in Q4. So that's close to $50 million. For the Q1 dividend, we will set off the amount that we spent in Q1 on the share buyback, which is roughly $25 million.

然後我看到一個關於一月份回購抵銷第四季度股利的問題。因此，對於第四季度的股息，我們已經抵銷了第四季度回購的支出。這接近 5000 萬美元。對於第一季的股息，我們將抵銷第一季用於股票回購的金額，約 2,500 萬美元。

Thank you, Perry. We have a question from Jan who has asked, what has surprised you the most regarding the development of the rates since they have changed a lot since the second and third quarter earnings call, and there was no mentioning of an expected drop in rates?

謝謝你，佩里。Jan 向我們提出了一個問題，他問道，自從第二季和第三季的收益電話會議以來，利率已經發生了很大變化，而且沒有提到預期的利率下降，因此利率的發展最讓您感到驚訝的是什麼？

I think what has surprised us the most is that you have a strong buildup towards the latter part of Q3 into Q4 in terms of oil and water and ton miles. In that sense, the market was probably more tight in December than the rates have actually reflected. So our analysis when we spoke last in November was that you would have the cannibalization coming off, the tonne-mile was already creeping up. Loaded volumes was already going up.

我認為最讓我們驚訝的是，從第三季後期到第四季度，石油、水和噸英里數都有了強勁的成長。從這個意義上來說，12月份的市場可能比利率實際反映的更緊張。因此，我們去年 11 月談話時的分析是，會出現蠶食現象，噸英里數已開始上升。裝載量已經開始上升。

And I think probably sentiment is the big surprise to us in terms of having at some point of time, tight markets that was equivalent of some of the much higher earnings that we have seen, but not seeing that reflected in TCEs, although that fundamentals were actually coming along nicely and showing what they should be showing. It came later and it came into January. The market actually did go up, but not to the tune that one would have expected coming from the environment we have been in for the past couple of years.

我認為，情緒可能會讓我們感到意外，因為在某個時間點，市場緊張，相當於我們所見過的一些更高的收益，但卻沒有在 TCE 中得到反映，儘管基本面實際上進展良好，並顯示出應有的表現。它來得晚一些，已經到了一月。市場確實上漲了，但漲幅不如人們根據過去幾年所處環境所預期的那麼大。

Thank you, Søren. I am not seeing any more questions in the chat or the Q&A.

謝謝你，Søren。我在聊天或問答中沒有看到任何其他問題。

We have one open question. So for the Q4, we were around -- on the operating cash flow breakeven. So before dry docks, we were around $14,000. It will be in that range, maybe a little bit higher for Q1.

我們還有一個未解決的問題。因此，對於第四季度，我們的經營現金流已達到損益兩平。因此，在進入乾船塢之前，我們的成本約為 14,000 美元。它將處於該範圍內，對於第一季來說可能略高一些。

Okay. Great. Thank you, Perry. I'm not seeing any other questions coming through. I think we'll just take a couple of seconds to see if anything else comes through in the Q&A or chat or raise hand function.

好的。偉大的。謝謝你，佩里。我沒有看到任何其他問題。我想我們只需要花幾秒鐘看看在問答、聊天或舉手功能中是否還有其他內容。

Okay. We have one from [Frank Lopez]. Can you speak to any plans that might be in place for a global recession in 2025?

好的。我們有一個[弗蘭克洛佩茲]。您能談談針對 2025 年全球經濟衰退可能製定的任何計劃嗎？

So I think as far as Hafnia is concerned and our long-term strategy has always been to have a strong focus on our cash flow breakevens and to make sure that on the balance sheet part that we could basically make it and through any down cycle that may occur. And if you look at the way that Hafnia has kind of built the business over the years, and I alluded to it a little bit before, is that back in 2021, which is the last time we had a negative market, we were basically in a position to go out and be offensive and aggressive in the market and buy assets. when the industry in itself was suffering from poor results.

因此，我認為就 Hafnia 而言，我們的長期策略一直是高度關注我們的現金流盈虧平衡，並確保在資產負債表部分，我們基本上能夠實現這一目標，並度過可能發生的任何下行週期。如果你看看 Hafnia 多年來建立業務的方式，我之前稍微提到過，早在 2021 年，也就是我們上次遇到負面市場的時候，我們基本上處於可以出去進攻和積極購買資產的位置。當時該行業本身業績不佳。

So for us, it's really about the balance sheet discipline. It's not about only a recession in '25. That's just a general possession of how we want to run the business. We prefer to have more spot exposure and the counterweight to that has been to have control over the cost side and low cash flow breakeven at levels where we feel that even at the lowest points we've seen historically, Hafnia will still weather through it and more than that, hopefully also be able to reposition, modernize and even increase the fleet as we kind of go into a period of the next, say, 2 to 5 years where we do see there will be still a shortage of product tankers going forward.

所以對我們來說，這其實與資產負債表紀律有關。這不僅僅是 25 年的經濟衰退。這只是我們經營業務的整體思路。我們傾向於擁有更多的現貨敞口，而與之相對的平衡則是控製成本方面和低現金流盈虧平衡，我們認為即使在歷史上的最低點，Hafnia 仍然能夠渡過難關，更重要的是，希望能夠重新定位、現代化甚至增加船隊，因為我們進入了未來 2 到 5 年的時期，我們確實看到未來仍然會出現油輪短缺的情況。

Thank you, Mikael. I'm not seeing anything else coming through. So thank you, everyone, for your questions. So we have come to the end of today's presentation. Thank you so much for attending Hafnia's Fourth Quarter 2024 Financial Results Conference Call.

謝謝你，米凱爾。我沒有看到任何其他事情發生。謝謝大家的提問。今天的演講到此結束。非常感謝您參加 Hafnia 2024 年第四季財務業績電話會議。

You can find more information available online at hafnia.com. Thank you, everyone.

您可以在 hafnia.com 上找到更多資訊。謝謝大家。