Credo Technology Group Holding Ltd (CRDO) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by (Operator Instructions) I would now like to hand the conference over to Dan O'Neill. Go ahead.

女士們、先生們，感謝你們的等候（操作員指示） 我現在想將會議交給 Dan O'Neill。前進。

Good afternoon, and thank you all for joining us today for our fiscal 2024 fourth quarter and year ending earnings Call. I'm joined today by Bill Brennan Credo's, Chief Executive Officer; and Dan Fleming, Credo's, Chief Financial Officer.

下午好，感謝大家今天參加我們的 2024 財年第四季和年終財報電話會議。今天，執行長比爾布倫南克里多 (Bill Brennan Credo) 也加入了我的行列。和 Dan Fleming，Credo's 財務長。

I'd like to remind everyone that certain comments made in this call today may include forward-looking statements regarding expected future financial results, strategies and plans, future operations, the markets in which we operate and other areas of discussion. These forward-looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that are discussed in detail in our documents filed with the SEC.

我想提醒大家，今天的電話會議中發表的某些評論可能包括有關預期未來財務業績、策略和計劃、未來營運、我們營運的市場以及其他討論領域的前瞻性陳述。這些前瞻性陳述受到風險和不確定性的影響，這些風險和不確定性在我們向 SEC 提交的文件中進行了詳細討論。

It's not possible for the company's management to predict all risks nor can the company assess the impact of all factors on its business or the extent to which any factor or combination of factors may cause actual results to differ materially from those contained in any forward-looking statements.

公司管理階層不可能預測所有風險，公司也無法評估所有因素對其業務的影響，或任何因素或因素組合可能導致實際結果與任何前瞻性陳述中包含的結果有重大差異的程度。

Given these risks, uncertainties and assumptions, the forward-looking events discussed during this call may not occur and actual results could differ materially and adversely from those anticipated or implied. The company undertakes no obligation to publicly update forward-looking statements for any reason after the date of this call. To conform these statements to actual results or to changes in the company's expectations, except as required by law.

鑑於這些風險、不確定性和假設，本次電話會議中討論的前瞻性事件可能不會發生，實際結果可能與預期或暗示的結果有重大不利差異。該公司不承擔在本次電話會議之後以任何理由公開更新前瞻性陳述的義務。使這些陳述符合實際結果或公司預期的變化，法律要求的除外。

Also, during this call, we will refer to certain non-GAAP financial measures, which we consider to be important measures of the company's performance. These non-GAAP financial measures are provided in addition to and not as a substitute for or superior to financial performance prepared in accordance with US GAAP.

此外，在這次電話會議中，我們將提及某些非公認會計準則財務指標，我們認為這些指標是衡量公司績效的重要指標。這些非公認會計原則財務指標是根據美國公認會計原則編制的財務績效的補充，而不是替代或優於根據美國公認會計原則編制的財務業績。

A discussion of why we use non-GAAP financial measures and reconciliations between our GAAP and non-GAAP financial measures is available in the earnings release we issued today, which can be accessed in the investor relations portion of our website.

我們今天發布的收益報告中討論了我們為什麼使用非公認會計原則財務指標以及我們的公認會計原則和非公認會計原則財務指標之間的調節，您可以在我們網站的投資者關係部分訪問該報告。

With that, I'll now turn the call over to our CEO.

現在，我將把電話轉給我們的執行長。

Thank you for joining our fourth quarter fiscal '24 earnings call. I'll start by reviewing our results and then I'll provide highlights of what we see for fiscal '25. Our CFO, Dan Fleming; will then follow with a detailed discussion of our Q4 and fiscal year '24 results and provide our outlook for Q1. Credo is a pure-play high-speed connectivity company, delivering a range of optimized and innovative connectivity solutions to meet the needs of global data center operators and service providers.

感謝您參加我們的 24 財年第四季財報電話會議。我將首先回顧我們的結果，然後我將重點介紹我們對 25 財年的看法。我們的財務長丹‧弗萊明；然後，我們將詳細討論我們的第四季和 24 財年的業績，並提供我們對第一季的展望。 Credo 是一家純粹的高速連接公司，提供一系列優化和創新的連接解決方案，以滿足全球資料中心營運商和服務提供商的需求。

We leverage our core SerDes technology and unique customer-focused design approach to deliver a differentiated suite of solutions, including Active Electrical Cables or AECs, Optical DSPs, Line Card PHYs, SerDes Chiplets and SerDes IP licenses. For Ethernet port speeds ranging from 100 gig up to 1.6 terabits per second.

我們利用核心 SerDes 技術和獨特的以客戶為中心的設計方法來提供差異化的解決方案套件，包括主動電纜或 AEC、光纖 DSP、線路卡 PHY、SerDes Chiplet 和 SerDes IP 許可證。乙太網路連接埠速度範圍為每秒 100 GB 至 1.6 太比特。

We target the most difficult connectivity challenges facing the market. For a combination of architecture, system-level approach, power and performance are most differentiated. Credo is in a market environment of steadily increasing demand for optimized solutions with higher bandwidth and improved power efficiency, driven by the accelerating connectivity requirements of leading edge AI deployments.

我們瞄準市場面臨的最困難的連結挑戰。對於架構、系統級方法、功率和效能的組合來說，差異最大。 Credo 所處的市場環境對具有更高頻寬和更高能源效率的優化解決方案的需求穩步增長，這是由領先的人工智慧部署不斷加速的連接需求所推動的。

I'm pleased to say that during both fiscal Q4 and fiscal '24, Credo achieved record revenue. In Q4, we delivered revenue of $60.8 million and non-GAAP gross margin of 66.1%. In fiscal '24, Credo achieve revenue of $193 million and non-GAAP gross margin of 62.5%. The workload supported by our solutions changed significantly during the fiscal year and our growth was primarily driven by AI deployments across our entire portfolio.

我很高興地說，在第四財季和 24 財年，Credo 都實現了創紀錄的收入。第四季度，我們的營收為 6,080 萬美元，非 GAAP 毛利率為 66.1%。在 24 財年，Credo 營收 1.93 億美元，非 GAAP 毛利率為 62.5%。我們的解決方案支援的工作負載在本財年發生了顯著變化，我們的成長主要是由整個產品組合中的人工智慧部署所推動的。

In fiscal Q4, roughly three-quarters of our revenue was driven by AI workloads. Year was also notable as we diversified our revenue across additional customers and products. I'm proud of the team for delivering solid results across this shifting landscape and also for executing a strong quarterly sequential ramp throughout the year.

在第四財季，我們大約四分之三的收入是由人工智慧工作負載所驅動的。這一年也很引人注目，因為我們透過更多客戶和產品實現了收入多元化。我為團隊在不斷變化的環境中取得紮實的成果以及全年執行強勁的季度連續成長感到自豪。

In our AEC product line, we continued our market leadership and delivered our customers a range of solutions for port speeds ranging from 100 gig to 800 gig. Furthermore, our approach of delivering system-level solutions with customized hardware and software features has enabled us to build close collaborative relationships with our customers.

在我們的 AEC 產品線中，我們繼續保持市場領先地位，為客戶提供一系列連接埠速度從 100 GB 到 800 GB 的解決方案。此外，我們提供具有客製化硬體和軟體功能的系統級解決方案的方法使我們能夠與客戶建立密切的合作關係。

Over many design cycles across numerous customers. We have dramatically improved our speed to market in designing and qualifying our solutions, and this remains a key aspect of our competitive advantage. We believe this positions Credo with a unique value to the market that is difficult to replicate. With this, our AECs have quickly become the leading solution for in rack cable connectivity for single-agent speeds of 50 gigabits per second and above.

經過眾多客戶的多個設計週期。我們在設計和驗證解決方案方面極大地提高了上市速度，這仍然是我們競爭優勢的關鍵方面。我們相信，這使 Credo 具有難以複製的獨特市場價值。由此，我們的 AEC 已迅速成為機架內電纜連接的領先解決方案，單代理速度可達每秒 50 吉比特及以上。

In addition to the advantages of AECs that includes signal integrity, power form factor and reliability, our customers have embraced the opportunity to innovate with Credo as a design partner to optimize system local features that make their AI clusters more efficient.

除了AEC 的優勢（包括訊號完整性、電源外形尺寸和可靠性）之外，我們的客戶還抓住了與Credo 作為設計合作夥伴進行創新的機會，以優化系統本地功能，從而提高其AI 集群的效率。

From a customer engagement perspective, fiscal '24 was fruitful as we saw the successful ramp at a new hyperscale customer qualification at another and expansion of our AEC engagements with hyperscalers, Tier 2 data centers and service providers. AECs have quickly transitioned from a new concept to a de facto solution across many data center environments.

從客戶參與的角度來看，24 財年是卓有成效的，因為我們看到了新的超大規模客戶資格的成功提升，以及我們與超大規模企業、二級資料中心和服務提供者的 AEC 合作的擴展。 AEC 已迅速從一個新概念轉變為跨許多資料中心環境的實際解決方案。

Based on customer feedback and forecasts, we continue to expect an inflection point in our AEC revenue growth during the second half of fiscal '25. Fiscal '24 was also a strong year for our optical DSP products. During the year, we achieved material production revenue with significant wins at domestic and international hyperscalers.

根據客戶回饋和預測，我們繼續預期 AEC 營收成長將在 25 財年下半年出現拐點。 24 財年對我們的光學 DSP 產品來說也是強勁的一年。年內，我們實現了材料生產收入，並在國內和國際超大型企業中取得了重大勝利。

Additionally, we continue to gain traction with optical module partners and customers due to our attractive combination of performance, power efficiency and system costs. AI back-end network deployments are a strong volume driver for the optical transceiver and AOC market, specifically for leading edge 100 gig per lane solutions.

此外，由於我們在性能、功效和系統成本方面具有吸引力的組合，我們繼續受到光模組合作夥伴和客戶的青睞。 AI 後端網路部署是光收發器和 AOC 市場的強大銷售驅動力，特別是對於領先的每通道 100 GB 解決方案。

As power efficiency has become a more critical factor, [Credo] responded with innovative architectural solutions that drastically reduce DSP power while maintaining interoperability and signal integrity at the optical module level. We've made great progress with our linear receiver optics DSPs. In November, we announced our LRODSP solutions and by March at AEC, we demonstrated production designs with 3800 gig module partners.

隨著功率效率已成為一個更關鍵的因素，[Credo] 採取了創新的架構解決方案來應對，這些解決方案可大幅降低 DSP 功耗，同時保持光模組層級的互通性和訊號完整性。我們的線性接收器光學 DSP 取得了巨大進步。 11 月，我們宣布了 LRODSP 解決方案，到 3 月，我們在 AEC 上與 3800 個 gig 模組合作夥伴進行演示了生產設計。

In a few months, since AEC, we've seen continued market acceptance and design activity. These products enable a significant power reduction versus a traditional 800 gig solution. The LRO architecture is the only way to achieve a sub 10 watt 800 gig module that meets existing industry optical standards and facilitates multi-vendor interoperability.

自 AEC 發布以來的幾個月內，我們看到了持續的市場接受度和設計活動。與傳統的 800 gig 解決方案相比，這些產品可顯著降低功耗。 LRO 架構是實現低於 10 瓦 800 gig 模組的唯一方法，該模組滿足現有行業光學標準並促進多供應商互通性。

We expect the benefits of LRO solutions to become even more impactful in next-generation 1.6T optical modules. I feel confident saying that the LPO architecture with no DSP has lost nearly all momentum in the market and that the LRO architecture is showing great promise. I'm encouraged by our customer traction in Q4, we were pleased to kick off multiple new optical DSP design engagements with the leading optical module manufacturers, both with our new LRODSP and our traditional full DSP solutions.

我們預計LRO解決方案的優勢將在下一代1.6T光模組中發揮更大的作用。我可以自信地說，沒有 DSP 的 LPO 架構已經失去了市場上幾乎所有的動力，而 LRO 架構正在展現出巨大的前景。我對第四季度的客戶吸引力感到鼓舞，我們很高興與領先的光學模組製造商啟動多項新的光學 DSP 設計合作，包括我們的新 LRODSP 和傳統的完整 DSP 解決方案。

Given our results to date and our customer engagements, we are on track to achieve our optical DSP revenue goal of 10% of our fiscal '25 revenue, and we are enthusiastic about future growth prospects in this category.

鑑於我們迄今為止的業績和客戶參與度，我們有望實現光學 DSP 收入目標，即占我們 25 財年收入的 10%，並且我們對該類別的未來成長前景充滿熱情。

Regarding our Line Card PHY business, our leadership in this market continues as we transition to more advanced process nodes that deliver improved product performance and power efficiency. During the year, we continued to add to our customer base and have multiple 100 gig per lane wins at industry leading Tier 1 OEMs and ODMs that serve the global data center market. These include 800 gig and 1.6T gearbox retimer and MACsec PHY products.

關於我們的線路卡 PHY 業務，隨著我們過渡到更先進的製程節點，以提高產品性能和功效，我們在該市場的領先地位仍在繼續。在這一年裡，我們繼續擴大客戶群，並在服務全球資料中心市場的行業領先的一級 OEM 和 ODM 中贏得了多個每通道 100 兆的訂單。其中包括 800 gig 和 1.6T 變速箱重定時器和 MACsec PHY 產品。

As we have discussed in the past, AI deployments are the driving force behind our growth for these leading edge devices. In the fourth quarter, we had success with both 50 gig and 100 gig per lane line current products, while 50 gig per lane solutions will continue to have lengthy life cycles. Our 100 gig per lane solutions will also start adding to our revenue in fiscal '25. We expect the Line Card PHY business will continue to grow and contribute nicely to our overall business in fiscal '25 and beyond. As we continue to invest and innovate in this market.

正如我們過去所討論的，人工智慧部署是我們這些前沿設備成長的驅動力。在第四季度，我們在每通道 50 GB 和 100 GB 現有產品上都取得了成功，而每通道 50 GB 解決方案將繼續擁有較長的生命週期。我們的每通道 100 演出解決方案也將在 25 財年開始增加我們的營收。我們預計線路卡 PHY 業務將繼續成長，並為我們 25 財年及以後的整體業務做出良好貢獻。隨著我們不斷在這個市場上投資和創新。

Lastly, I'll discuss our SerDes IP licensing and Chiplet businesses. In Q4, our SerDes licensing business delivered solid results flowing through our combination of speed, signal integrity, leading power efficiency, and breadth of offering. During fiscal '24, we won licensing business across a range of applications, process nodes and lane rates.

最後，我將討論我們的 SerDes IP 授權和 Chiplet 業務。在第四季度，我們的 SerDes 授權業務透過將速度、訊號完整性、領先的功效和產品範圍相結合，取得了堅實的成果。在 24 財年期間，我們贏得了一系列應用程式、流程節點和通道費率的授權業務。

Our wins ranged from 28 nanometer down to 4 nanometer at lane rates ranging from 28 gig to 112 gig. Our Chiplet business saw significant growth, led by our largest customer who deploys our SerDes Chiplets in a massive, AI cluster. This customer also engaged us to develop a next-generation Chiplet for future deployments, which is a testament to our leading technology and customer centric focus. We are entering fiscal '25 with a strong and diverse funnel of SerDes licensing and Chiplet opportunities.

我們的勝利範圍從 28 奈米到 4 奈米，通道速率從 28 gig 到 112 gig。在我們最大的客戶的帶領下，我們的 Chiplet 業務取得了顯著成長，該客戶在大型 AI 叢集中部署了我們的 SerDes Chiplet。該客戶還委託我們為未來的部署開發下一代 Chiplet，這證明了我們領先的技術和以客戶為中心的焦點。我們即將進入 25 財年，擁有強大且多樣化的 SerDes 授權和 Chiplet 機會管道。

In summary, the shift towards generative AI accelerated during our fiscal '24, and we see that continuing into the foreseeable future. Industry data and market forecasters point towards continued and growing demand for high bandwidth, energy-efficient connectivity solutions that are application optimized. Credo benefits from this demand due to our focus on innovative, low-power, customer-centric connectivity solutions for the most demanding applications.

總之，在我們的 24 財年，向生成式人工智慧的轉變加速了，我們認為這種趨勢將持續到可預見的未來。行業數據和市場預測人士指出，對應用優化的高頻寬、節能連接解決方案的需求持續增長。 Credo 受益於這項需求，因為我們專注於為最嚴苛的應用提供創新、低功耗、以客戶為中心的連接解決方案。

Our view into fiscal '25 and beyond has remained consistent for a number of quarters now. And this has only been reinforced by recent wins, production ramps and customers forecasts as they continue to formalize their AI deployment plan. And with that, Dan Fleming, our CFO; will now provide additional details.

我們對 25 財年及以後的看法在多個季度中一直保持一致。隨著他們繼續正式製定人工智慧部署計劃，最近的勝利、產量成長和客戶預測進一步強化了這一點。我們的財務長 Dan Fleming 說：現在將提供更多詳細資訊。

Thank you, Bill, and good afternoon. I will first provide a financial summary of our fiscal year '24 and then review our Q4 results, and finally discuss our outlook for Q1 and provide some color on our expectations for fiscal year '25.

謝謝你，比爾，下午好。我將首先提供 24 財年的財務摘要，然後回顧我們第四季度的業績，最後討論我們對第一季度的展望，並為我們對 25 財年的預期提供一些資訊。

Revenue for fiscal year '24 was a record at $193 million, up 5% year-over-year, driven by product revenue that grew by 8%. Gross margin for the year was 62.5%, up 448 basis points year-over-year. Our operating margin declined by 208 basis points as we continue to invest in R&D to support product development focused on numerous opportunities across our hyperscale customers. We reported earnings per share of $0.09 for the year, a $0.04 improvement over the prior year.

在產品收入成長 8% 的推動下，24 財年的營收達到創紀錄的 1.93 億美元，較去年同期成長 5%。全年毛利率為62.5%，較去年同期成長448個基點。由於我們繼續投資研發以支持專注於超大規模客戶的眾多機會的產品開發，我們的營業利潤率下降了 208 個基點。我們公佈的年度每股收益為 0.09 美元，比前一年增加 0.04 美元。

Moving on to the fourth quarter. In Q4, we reported record revenue of $60.8 million, up 15% sequentially and up 89% year-over-year. Our IP business generated $16.6 million of revenue in Q4. Up 193% year-over-year. IP remains a strategic part of our business. But as a reminder, our IP results may vary from quarter to quarter, driven largely by specific deliverables to pre-existing or new contracts.

繼續看第四季。第四季度，我們的營收達到創紀錄的 6,080 萬美元，較上季成長 15%，較去年同期成長 89%。我們的 IP 業務在第四季度創造了 1,660 萬美元的收入。較去年同期成長193%。知識產權仍然是我們業務的策略部分。但需要提醒的是，我們的智慧財產權結果可能會因季度而異，這主要是由現有或新合約的具體交付成果所驅動的。

While the mix of IP and product revenue will vary in any given quarter over time, our revenue mix in Q4 was 27% IP above our long-term expectation for IP, which is 10% to 15% of revenue. Our product business generated $44.1 million of revenue in Q4, down 15% sequentially and up 67% year-over-year. Our product business, excluding product engineering services, generated $40.8 million of revenue in Q4, up 2% sequentially.

雖然IP和產品收入的組合在任何給定季度都會隨著時間的推移而變化，但我們第四季度的收入組合是IP，比我們對IP的長期預期高出27%，即佔收入的10%到15%。我們的產品業務在第四季度創造了 4,410 萬美元的收入，比上一季下降 15%，比去年同期成長 67%。我們的產品業務（不包括產品工程服務）在第四季度創造了 4,080 萬美元的收入，比上一季成長 2%。

Our top four end customers are each greater than 10% of our revenue in Q4. Our team delivered Q4 non-GAAP gross margin of 66.1% above the high end of our guidance range and up 391 basis points sequentially, enabled by a strong IP contribution in the quarter. Our IP non-GAAP gross margin generally hovers near 100% and was 99.2% in Q4.

我們的四大最終客戶均占我們第四季營收的 10% 以上。我們的團隊在第四季度實現了非 GAAP 毛利率 66.1%，高於我們指引範圍的上限，並且比上一季成長了 391 個基點，這得益於本季強勁的智慧財產權貢獻。我們的 IP 非 GAAP 毛利率整體徘徊在 100% 附近，第四季為 99.2%。

Our product non-GAAP gross margin was 53.7% in the quarter, down 783 basis points sequentially and up 392 basis points year-over-year. The sequential decline was due to a change in product engineering services revenue. Total non-GAAP operating expenses in the fourth quarter were $32.7 million, below the midpoint of our guidance range and up 7% sequentially.

本季我們的產品非 GAAP 毛利率為 53.7%，季減 783 個基點，較去年同期上升 392 個基點。環比下降是由於產品工程服務收入的變化。第四季非 GAAP 營運支出總額為 3,270 萬美元，低於我們指引範圍的中點，比上一季成長 7%。

Our OpEx increase was a result of a 17% year-over-year increase in R&D as we continue to invest in the resources to deliver innovative solutions for our hyperscale customers and a 26% year-over-year increase in SG&A as we continue to invest in public company infrastructure.

我們的營運支出成長得益於研發年增 17%，因為我們持續投資資源，為超大規模客戶提供創新解決方案；SG&A 年比成長 26%，因為我們繼續投資上市公司基礎設施。

Our non-GAAP operating income was a record $7.5 million in Q4 compared to non-GAAP operating income of $2.4 million last quarter due to strong gross margin performance, coupled with top line leverage. Our non-GAAP operating margin was also a record at 12.3% in the quarter compared to a non-GAAP operating margin of 4.6% last quarter, a sequential increase of 771 basis points.

由於強勁的毛利率表現以及營收槓桿，我們第四季的非 GAAP 營業收入達到創紀錄的 750 萬美元，而上季度的非 GAAP 營業收入為 240 萬美元。本季我們的非 GAAP 營運利潤率也創歷史新高，達到 12.3%，而上季度的非 GAAP 營運利潤率為 4.6%，環比增長了 771 個基點。

We reported non-GAAP net income of $11.8 billion in Q4 compared to non-GAAP net income of $6.3 million last quarter. Cash flow from operations in the fourth quarter was $4.2 million. Capex was $3.2 million in the quarter, driven by R&D equipment spending and free cash flow was $1 million, an increase of $16.7 million year-over-year.

我們報告第四季度非 GAAP 淨利潤為 118 億美元，而上季度非 GAAP 淨利潤為 630 萬美元。第四季營運現金流為 420 萬美元。在研發設備支出的推動下，本季資本支出為 320 萬美元，自由現金流為 100 萬美元，較去年同期增加 1,670 萬美元。

We ended the quarter with cash and equivalents of $410.0 million, an increase of $0.9 million from the third quarter. We remain well-capitalized to continue investing in our growth opportunities while maintaining a substantial cash buffer. Our accounts receivable balance increased 33% sequentially to $59.7 million, while days sales outstanding increased to 89 days, up from 77 days in Q3. Our Q4 ending inventory was $25.9 million, down $5.6 million sequentially.

本季結束時，我們的現金及等價物為 4.1 億美元，比第三季增加了 90 萬美元。我們仍然擁有充足的資本，可以繼續投資於我們的成長機會，同時保持大量的現金緩衝。我們的應收帳款餘額較上季成長 33%，達到 5,970 萬美元，而應收帳款天數從第三季的 77 天增加到 89 天。我們第四季期末庫存為 2,590 萬美元，比上一季減少 560 萬美元。

Now turning to our guidance. We currently expect revenue in Q1 of fiscal '25 to be between $58 million and $61 million down 2% sequentially at the midpoint. We expect Q1 non-GAAP gross margin to be within a range of 63% to 65%. We expect Q1 non-GAAP operating expenses to be between $35 million and $37 million.

現在轉向我們的指導。我們目前預計 25 財年第一季的營收將在 5,800 萬美元至 6,100 萬美元之間，中點比上一季下降 2%。我們預計第一季非 GAAP 毛利率將在 63% 至 65% 之間。我們預計第一季非 GAAP 營運費用將在 3,500 萬美元至 3,700 萬美元之間。

The first quarter of fiscal '25 is a 14-week quarter. So included in this forecast is approximately $2 million in expenses for the extra week. We expect Q1 diluted weighted average share count, it should be approximately 180 million shares. We were pleased to see fiscal year '24 played out as expected. The rapid shift to AI workloads drove new and broad-based customer engagement, and we executed well to deliver the sequential growth we had forecast throughout the year.

25 財年第一季是一個為期 14 週的季度。因此，該預測中包括額外一周的約 200 萬美元費用。我們預計第一季稀釋後加權平均股數應約為1.8億股。我們很高興看到 24 財年的表現符合預期。向人工智慧工作負載的快速轉變推動了新的、廣泛的客戶參與，我們的表現很好，實現了我們全年預測的連續成長。

Our revenue mix transitioned swiftly through the year. In Q4, we estimate that AI revenue was approximately three quarters of total revenue, up dramatically from the prior year. As we move forward through fiscal year '25, we expect sequential growth to accelerate in the second half of the year from Q4 of fiscal '24 to Q4 of fiscal '25, we expect AI revenue to double year over year.

我們的收入結構在這一年中迅速轉變。在第四季度，我們估計人工智慧收入約佔總收入的四分之三，較上年大幅成長。隨著我們進入 25 財年，我們預計下半年從 24 財年第四季到 25 財年第四季的連續成長將加速，我們預計人工智慧收入將比去年同期翻倍。

As programs across a number of customers reach production scales. We expect fiscal year '25 non-GAAP gross margin to be within a range of 61% to 63% as product gross margins expand due to increasing scale. We expect fiscal year '25 non-GAAP operating expenses to grow at half the rate of top line growth. As a result, we look forward to driving operating leverage throughout the year.

隨著眾多客戶的專案達到生產規模。我們預計 25 財年非 GAAP 毛利率將在 61% 至 63% 之間，因為產品毛利率因規模擴大而擴大。我們預計 25 財年非 GAAP 營運支出的成長率將是營收成長率的一半。因此，我們期待全年提高營運槓桿。

And with that, I will open it up for questions.

接下來，我將開放提問。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

Quinn Bolton, Needham.

奎因·博爾頓，李約瑟。

Hey, guys. Congratulations on the results and nice to see you quantifying the AI revenue. I guess Bill or Dan, wanted to start with just sort of a couple of housekeeping questions. Can you give us sort of the percent of revenue from your largest four customers and were they all across different product lines? Are you starting to see consolidation back to AECs among that top four customer base?

大家好。恭喜您獲得結果，並很高興看到您量化人工智慧收入。我猜比爾或丹想從一些家務問題開始。您能否告訴我們來自您最大的四個客戶的收入百分比，他們是否都屬於不同的產品線？您是否開始看到四大客戶群中的 AEC 整合？

Quinn, let me comment on that. This is Dan. So as I mentioned in our prepared remarks, we had [four 10%] end customers in Q4. They were our two AEC hyperscalers that we've discussed previously, plus a large consumer company and our lead Chiplet customer. So by that list, you can kind of see a broad diversification of products represented.

奎因，讓我對此發表評論。這是丹.正如我在準備好的演講中提到的，我們在第四季度擁有 [4 個 10%] 終端客戶。它們是我們之前討論過的兩個 AEC 超大規模提供商，以及一家大型消費公司和我們的主要 Chiplet 客戶。因此，透過該列表，您可以看到所代表的產品的廣泛多樣化。

And I'll add to that by saying when our when our K is filed in the next few weeks, you'll see that we had [three 10%] end customers for the full year, and I'll lay those out for you essentially will see them soon enough. But our largest customer was our first AEC hyperscale customer, which we've talked about over the last few years, which was Microsoft at 26%.

我還要補充一點，當我們在接下來的幾週內提交 K 時，您會看到我們全年擁有 [三個 10%] 的最終客戶，我將為您列出這些基本上很快就會會見到他們。但我們最大的客戶是我們的第一個 AEC 超大規模客戶，我們在過去幾年中一直在談論這個客戶，佔 26% 的微軟。

And then the second was an AEC hyperscaler that came in at 20% for the year. And our the third 10% customer was the Chiplet customer that we had at 15%. So the key takeaway, though this year was if you go back to FY23 versus FY24, and we've been saying this for the last few quarters, FY24 was really the year in which revenue diversification materialized for us, both from a customer perspective and a product perspective as well. Hopefully that gives you some additional color, Quinn.

第二個是 AEC 超大規模供應商，今年的份額為 20%。我們的第三個 10% 客戶是我們擁有 15% 的 Chiplet 客戶。因此，關鍵的一點是，如果你回顧2023 財年和2024 財年，而且我們在過去幾個季度一直在說，2024 財年確實是我們實現收入多元化的一年，無論是從客戶角度還是從客戶角度來看。希望這能給你一些額外的色彩，奎因。

Yes, that's great, Dan, thank you. And then I guess on, Bill, I think if I caught your prepared script, you talked about ramping a second AEC customer and then qualifying a third from hyperscaler. Wondering if you could just give us a little bit of detail on the third hyperscaler. Is it a sort of AI application? Is it NIC to two ToRs or is it within a SWITCH? Can you give us any sense of the per lane speed or total cable speed on that third engagement?

是的，太好了，丹，謝謝你。然後我想，比爾，我想如果我看到你準備好的腳本，你談到瞭如何增加第二個 AEC 客戶，然後從超大規模提供者那裡獲得第三個客戶。想知道您是否能為我們提供一些關於第三個超大規模的細節。這是一種人工智慧應用嗎？它是連接兩個 ToR 的 NIC 還是在一個交換器內？您能否告訴我們第三次交戰中每條車道的速度或總電纜速度？

Sure, sure. So we've talked about in the past that the first program with this hyperscaler is a SWITCH rack to 50 gig per lane design, 400 gig ports. And we've seen this relationship developing a really similar way to the first to start with a single program. And after the first experience with AECs, we're now engaged with additional programs on the roadmap.

一定一定。因此，我們過去曾討論過，該超大規模擴展器的第一個項目是 SWITCH 機架，每個通道設計容量為 50 GB，連接埠數為 400 GB。我們已經看到這種關係的發展方式與第一個從單一程序開始的方式非常相似。在第一次體驗 AEC 之後，我們現在正在參與路線圖上的其他項目。

I mentioned the first program is a SWITCH rack and that we're working on additional programs for AI Appliance racks and these are at 100 gig per lane. And I mentioned that the plan that we're getting from them at this point is that we'll see this this third customer ramp in the second half fiscal year time frame. So that will contribute to the inflection point that Dan is referenced.

我提到第一個程序是 SWITCH 機架，我們正在為 AI Appliance 機架開發其他程序，每通道 100 GB。我提到，我們目前從他們那裡得到的計劃是，我們將在下半年財年的時間範圍內看到第三次客戶成長。因此，這將有助於丹被提及的轉折點。

Perfect. Thank you.

完美的。謝謝。

Tore Svanberg, Stifel.

托雷‧思文凱 (Tore Svanberg)、史蒂菲爾 (Stifel)。

Yes, thanks and congratulations on the record revenue . I had a question on -- Dan, your comment about a high revenue quarter Q4 fiscal '25. So based on my math sounds like AI revenue would be about $90 million. How should we think about the non-AI revenue over the next 12 months or in other words, that $60 million in non-AI revenue for Q4 '24. How will that progress over the next 12 months?

是的，感謝並祝賀創紀錄的收入。我有一個問題——丹，你對 25 財年第四季高收入季度的評論。因此，根據我的計算，人工智慧收入約為 9000 萬美元。我們應該如何看待未來 12 個月的非人工智慧收入，或者換句話說，24 年第 4 季的 6,000 萬美元非人工智慧收入。未來 12 個月內進展如何？

Yes. So based on our comments, we didn't provide specific revenue guidance for the full year but we wanted to provide you a framework to understand a little bit more definitively how we've been framing our revenue growth throughout the year.

是的。因此，根據我們的評論，我們沒有提供全年的具體收入指導，但我們希望為您提供一個框架，以便更明確地了解我們如何制定全年的收入成長。

And as you say, AI revenue, we expect to grow 100% Q4 to Q4 fiscal '24 and '25. If you look at the non AI revenue piece, what I would say is we can assume -- you can assume modest year-over-year growth. That's not what's driving our growth in the year. It's really these AI programs that are ramping largely in the second half of the year. So that's why we frame things as we did.

正如你所說，人工智慧收入，我們預計 24 財年和 25 財年第四季至第四季將成長 100%。如果你看看非人工智慧收入部分，我想說的是我們可以假設——你可以假設適度的年成長。這並不是推動我們今年成長的因素。事實上，這些人工智慧程式在今年下半年大幅成長。這就是我們這樣做的原因。

The other comment, I'll add to that as our overall fiscal year '25 outlook has not changed. We're just kind of getting a little bit more specificity. So we continue to expect that meaningful growth in the year. And that second half inflection point is it will be fast upon us here shortly driven by these AI programs.

我將補充另一條評論，因為我們 25 財年的整體前景沒有改變。我們只是變得更具體一點。因此，我們繼續預計今年會出現有意義的成長。下半年的轉折點是，在這些人工智慧程式的推動下，它很快就會出現在我們這裡。

Yes, that's great color. Perhaps a question for you, Bill. So it looks like your PAM4 DSP business is finally starting to take off, you're targeting 10% fiscal '25. First of all, how much was that revenue in fiscal '24? And could you talk to a little bit of the diversified customer base that you have for the PAM4 DSP business. You talked about growth in international and North America, but with not North America, we're talking about several hyperscalers driving that growth?

是的，那是很棒的顏色。也許有個問題想問你，比爾。看來您的 PAM4 DSP 業務終於開始起飛了，您的目標是 25 財年實現 10% 的成長。首先，24 財年的收入是多少？您能談談 PAM4 DSP 業務的多元化客戶群嗎？您談到了國際和北美的成長，但不是北美，我們談論的是推動這種成長的幾個超大規模企業？

Yeah. So first of all, for fiscal '24, we did not we hadn't had that 10% number as an objective in fiscal '24. But we came pretty close to it. And so we feel like things are lined up well for fiscal '25 and beyond. I would say there's multiple drivers. Of course, we've got the first US hyperscaler in production. We've got a second in qualification.

是的。首先，對於 24 財年，我們沒有將 10% 的數字作為 24 財年的目標。但我們已經非常接近了。因此，我們認為 25 財年及以後的情況一切順利。我想說有多個驅動程式。當然，我們已經在生產第一台美國超大規模電腦。我們已經獲得了第二名的資格。

We're seeing a return to spending with non-US hyperscalers, and we've commented that we're very well positioned for when that spending turns back on. I would say that these are the primary contributors in fiscal '25. I will mention that we've got a lot of promising new engagements with optical module partners. And these new partners are really considered leaders in the industry.

我們看到非美國超大規模企業的支出有所回升，我們評論說，當這種支出重新開始時，我們已經做好了充分的準備。我想說，這些都是 25 財年的主要貢獻者。我要提到的是，我們與光學模組合作夥伴建立了許多有前景的新合作關係。這些新合作夥伴確實被認為是該行業的領導者。

And of course, that will lead that bridges to additional hyperscalers that are interested in looking at solutions with Credo. I will also say that we've spent a lot of time talking about the LRO architecture in really the last six months and we see growing momentum with that LRO architecture for sure. And that's in addition to the full DSP momentum that we're building. So hopefully that gives you the color that you're looking for.

當然，這將導致與其他有興趣使用 Credo 尋求解決方案的超大規模企業建立橋樑。我還要說的是，在過去的六個月裡，我們花了很多時間討論 LRO 架構，我們肯定看到 LRO 架構的成長動能。這還不包括我們正在打造的全面 DSP 勢頭。所以希望這能為您提供您正在尋找的顏色。

Thomas O'Malley, Barclays.

托馬斯·奧馬利，巴克萊銀行。

Hey, what's gone on guys and thanks for taking my question. I wanted to follow up on the AI guidance, obviously, if you take the comment that three quarters of the revenue was related to AI and Q4 and extrapolate that to next year. It's just a pretty big numbers. But I wanted to just kind of zoom in on this quarter. So you had four 10% customers, one of which was a consumer customer who we know is not AI related.

嘿，發生了什麼事，謝謝你們提出我的問題。顯然，如果您認為四分之三的收入與人工智慧和第四季度相關，並將其推斷到明年，我想跟進人工智慧的指導。這只是一個相當大的數字。但我想重點關注這個季度。所以你有四個 10% 的客戶，其中一個是我們知道與人工智慧無關的消費者客戶。

So that would kind of imply that the rest of your business was entirely AI if you just do that math. So could you just help me walk through is, is it kind of just rounding three quarters revenue? Or how should I be thinking about like the dollar amount because it obviously sounds like that's growing quite nicely. But just want to understand the base if you're giving some color on what that should grow for the entire year?

因此，如果你只做數學計算，那麼這意味著你的其餘業務完全是人工智慧。那你能幫我解釋一下嗎？或者我應該如何考慮美元金額，因為聽起來顯然增長得相當不錯。但只是想了解基礎，如果你要對全年應該生長的植物進行一些說明的話？

Yeah. We didn't give a precise number because it's hard for us to estimate in some cases how our end customers utilize our products. But we have a fair amount of certainty that three quarters or 75% is where we ended for Q4. So we kind of let's just kind of with the caveat. So you would use that and it's really looking best framework is as we exited fiscal '24 versus how we expect to exit fiscal '25. So as you know, these production ramps at these large customers can take time and they can pull in that can push out a quarter or so. So that's why we're framing it kind of fiscal year end of fiscal year end.

是的。我們沒有給出準確的數字，因為在某些情況下我們很難估計最終客戶如何使用我們的產品。但我們有相當多的確定性，四分之三或 75% 是我們第四季的結束時間。所以我們只是警告一下。因此，您可以使用它，它看起來確實是最好的框架，即我們退出 24 財年時的框架與我們預期退出 25 財年時的框架。如您所知，這些大客戶的產量提升可能需要時間，而他們可以將其推遲四分之一左右。這就是為什麼我們將其定為財政年度結束的原因。

Got it. And then I just wanted to ask I know you guys don't guide buy product segment, but just a little color on the product and the IP side because it's one pretty drastically over the last couple of quarters. So with the July guidance, with the gross margins being a bit better than expected, you would just assume that maybe the IP side or kind of staying higher sequentially.

知道了。然後我只是想問，我知道你們並不指導購買產品細分，而只是在產品和 IP 方面提供一點色彩，因為在過去的幾個季度中，情況非常顯著。因此，根據 7 月份的指導，毛利率略高於預期，您可能會認為 IP 方面可能會連續保持在較高水準。

Could you give us any color on the mix there into July? Is there any product growth or is most of the well -- obviously with the midpoint of revenue but down. But is there any IP color that you can give us? Does it stay at these kind of elevated rates after the big fiscal Q4? Thank you.

能為我們介紹一下 7 月的混合情況嗎？產品是否有成長，或大部分狀況良好——顯然收入處於中點，但有所下降。但是有什麼IP顏色可以給我們嗎？在第四季財報結束後，利率還會維持在如此高的水平嗎？謝謝。

Yes, sure. So just to reiterate what we had said for guidance for Q1 for gross margin of 63% to 65%. So really just kind of a modest sequential decline from Q4. So it's really driven by a few things. One is IP web revenue will decline sequentially quarter over quarter somewhat. So that will happen. However, if you look at (inaudible) that's kind of you should assume we're at historic averages, which we were in Q4, so kind of flat quarter over quarter.

是的，當然。重申我們所謂的第一季毛利率為 63% 至 65% 的指導意見。所以實際上只是比第四季略有連續下降。所以它確實是由一些事情驅動的。一是 IP 網路收入將逐季度有所下降。所以這將會發生。然而，如果你看一下（聽不清楚），你應該假設我們處於歷史平均水平，即我們在第四季度的水平，所以季度與季度持平。

So it's really the product gross margin. There's a bit of a revenue mix dynamic there as well. And a lot of this part of the theme of fiscal '25 will be increasing product margin, exclusive of product engineering services due to increasing scale as we kind of return to that road map where we really do drive operating margin and gross margin leverage as we increase in scale.

所以這其實是產品毛利率。這裡也有一些收入組合的動態。 25 財年主題的大部分內容將是提高產品利潤率，不包括產品工程服務，因為規模不斷擴大，因為我們有點回到路線圖，我們確實在提高營業利潤率和毛利率槓桿率，因為我們規模增加。

Vijay Rakesh, Mizuho.

維傑·拉克什，瑞穗。

Hi, Bill, and Dan, a good quarter here. I just a quick question on the LRO side. You mentioned the 800 gig LRO or the sub-10 power consumption and your engagement with this trend. Just wondering how many are CSPs are working with them on shipping that product? And how do you see those revenues ramping into '25 I guess -- calendar '25.

嗨，比爾和丹，在這裡度過了愉快的時光。我只是想問月球勘測軌道飛行器方面的一個簡單問題。您提到了 800 gig LRO 或低於 10 的功耗以及您對此趨勢的參與。只是想知道有多少 CSP 正在與他們合作運送該產品？您如何看待這些收入在“25”（我猜是“25”日曆）中的增長。

So the work is primarily being done right now with optical module manufacturers that we've got more than a handful that are working on designs now. We have delivered for samples to be the first hyperscale potential customer, and we see that continuing throughout this quarter.

因此，目前這項工作主要是與光學模組製造商一起完成的，我們現在有許多光學模組製造商正在進行設計。我們已經為第一個超大規模潛在客戶提供了樣品，我們認為這種情況將持續整個季度。

So as far as fiscal '25 goes, there is a possibility. We don't have much really forecasted in what we're looking at yet, but there's a possibility that we'll ramp for significant revenue in this fiscal year. But it's not something that's really built in.

因此，就 25 財年而言，還是有可能的。我們還沒有對我們所關注的內容做出太多真正的預測，但我們有可能在本財年實現可觀的收入成長。但這並不是真正內建的東西。

Got it. So that should be incremental. On the Chiplet customer you expect customers obviously increasing CapEx quite a bit. And do you see say your traction growing proportionately like that starting to pick up as well? Thanks.

知道了。所以這應該是增量的。對於 Chiplet 客戶，您預期客戶明顯會增加相當多的資本支出。您是否看到您的吸引力也開始按比例增長？謝謝。

Yes. So the first customer that we've got in production and when we've talked about, we see that business really ongoing. Now, if they have a big increase in the spend on the cluster that's designed in-house. We'll definitely see a participation with that. But they've got multiple different paths that they're pursuing right now.

是的。因此，我們在生產中獲得的第一個客戶，當我們談論時，我們看到該業務確實在持續進行。現在，如果他們在內部設計的集群上的支出大幅增加。我們肯定會看到參與。但他們現在正在追求多種不同的道路。

But generally speaking, we continue to be bullish on Chiplets in general. We've got additional customers that are will be coming online in the future. Again, not much built in fiscal '25, but we're bullish on the segment.

但總的來說，我們還是看好 Chiplet。我們還有更多客戶將來會上線。同樣，25 財年並沒有太多建設，但我們看好該領域。

Vivek Arya, Bank of America.

維韋克·阿里亞 (Vivek Arya)，美國銀行。

Thank you for taking our question. This is (inaudible) on behalf of Vivek. I just want to go back to the AEC product line. Obviously, you are ramping your second customer, third customer also in qualification, the second half. How are you seeing the competitive dynamic just because Marvel and Astra are also launching their product here?

感謝您提出我們的問題。這是（聽不清楚）代表 Vivek。我只想回到 AEC 產品線。顯然，您正在下半年增加第二位客戶、第三個客戶的資格。您如何看待僅僅因為 Marvel 和 Astra 也在這裡推出產品而帶來的競爭動態？

Yes, at a high level, we have not seen a significant change in the competitive environment. So our objective has always been to be first to deliver and first qualify, and I think we've done a really good job on this objective with all of our customers. I would say that the one big advantage that we have competitively is the way we're organized. We have more than 100 people on our team that are dedicated to the AEC business.

是的，從高水準來看，我們沒有看到競爭環境有重大變化。因此，我們的目標始終是首先交付並首先獲得資格，我認為我們與所有客戶一起在這個目標上做得非常好。我想說，我們的一大競爭優勢就是我們的組織方式。我們的團隊中有 100 多名致力於 AEC 業務的人員。

And that includes that includes hardware and software development that includes qualification, production, fulfillment and support. And this really drives success with this objective to be able to deliver first and qualify first. I would say that as we go deeper with each customer relationship, we really see an increasing number of requests for customized hardware and software.

其中包括硬體和軟體開發，包括資格、生產、履行和支援。這確實推動了成功的目標，即能夠首先交付並首先獲得資格。我想說，隨著我們與每個客戶關係的深入，我們確實看到了越來越多的客製化硬體和軟體的請求。

I think from the standpoint of the number of SKUs that we're working on today, the numbers is more than 20 that are in active development from a different SKU perspective. So competitively, I would say we're unique in the sense that we're the single point of contact and we take full responsibility for all aspects of the relationships with our customers, and this really drives their satisfaction.

我認為從我們今天正在開發的 SKU 數量來看，從不同 SKU 的角度來看，正在積極開發的數量超過 20 個。因此，在競爭中，我想說我們是獨一無二的，因為我們是單一聯絡點，我們對與客戶關係的各個方面承擔全部責任，這確實提高了他們的滿意度。

When I talk more specifically about competition, we're really competing with groups of companies that need to do the same work that we're doing. But there's really no shortcut to it when you've got the complexity of having multiple suppliers involved and responsible for different aspects of one solution. It's really a far greater complexity than having one party like Credo being ultimately responsible.

當我更具體地談論競爭時，我們實際上是在與需要與我們做同樣工作的公司集團競爭。但是，當您遇到多個供應商參與並負責一個解決方案的不同方面的複雜性時，實際上沒有捷徑可走。這確實比讓像 Credo 這樣的一方承擔最終責任要複雜得多。

And so I guess with that said, the market is growing quickly and we do expect to see second sourcing in the future. This is natural and ultimately, our goal is to always be raising the competitive bar and ultimately serving our customers very well and driving their satisfaction. But I don't have specific feedback regarding the two potential competitors that you mentioned.

因此，我想話雖如此，市場正在快速成長，我們確實預計未來會看到第二次採購。這是很自然的，最終我們的目標是始終提高競爭標準，最終為我們的客戶提供良好的服務並提高他們的滿意度。但我沒有關於你提到的兩個潛在競爭對手的具體回饋。

Of course. And then as a follow-up, given NVIDIA is also entering this ethernet SWITCH market and that could potentially have some implications on AEC as a standard for connectivity. So I was wondering if you have any color there or if you've done any interoperability testing with the media solutions as well? Thank you.

當然。接下來，考慮到 NVIDIA 也正在進入乙太網路交換器市場，這可能會對 AEC 作為連接標準產生一些影響。所以我想知道你們是否有任何顏色，或者你們是否也對媒體解​​決方案進行了互通性測試？謝謝。

Sure. We've been really clear when we talk about the US hyperscalers, there is a desire to move to ethernet long term. And so I think it comes as no surprise that we've seen a lot of discussion around and around in NVIDIA and ethernet. We view this as a positive for us and our business. We've done testing, we've done testing with everybody that's out there from the standpoint of mix and switches. And so we feel really quite confident that there will be an opportunity for a shift for Internet connectivity and others. Again, we don't view this as really a surprise that the US hyperscalers are driving in this direction.

當然。當我們談論美國超大規模企業時，我們非常清楚，他們渴望長期轉向乙太網路。因此，我認為我們看到圍繞 NVIDIA 和乙太網路的大量討論也就不足為奇了。我們認為這對我們和我們的業務來說是積極的。我們已經完成了測試，我們已經從混音和切換的角度與所有人一起進行了測試。因此，我們非常有信心，網路連線和其他方面將有機會發生轉變。同樣，我們對美國超大規模企業朝這個方向發展並不感到意外。

Richard Shannon, Craig-Hallum.

理查德·香農，克雷格·哈勒姆。

Well, I guess -- thanks for taking my question. I apologize if this has been touched on before I got on the call late here. But Bill, just following up on your comments regarding custom cables and the increasing requests there, maybe even characterize your business now kind of what you expected going forward here in terms of its profile of customers versus that versus more commodity or standard. Is there much of any of that going on now or do you expect that to be a material contributors?

嗯，我想——謝謝你提出我的問題。如果我在很晚才接到電話之前就已經談到了這個問題，我深表歉意。但是比爾，只是跟進您對定制電纜的評論以及那裡日益增長的需求，甚至可能會根據客戶概況與更多商品或標準來描述您現在的業務，就像您期望的那樣。現在有很多這樣的事情發生嗎？

Well, I think that what we've seen is that every time we engage deeply with her with a customer and we open the door for innovation. Basically will we're open to special requests from a hardware standpoint from a firmware or software standpoint. What we're seeing is that customers really respond positively. So we've organized to be able to achieve these requests and really deliver on them.

嗯，我認為我們所看到的是，每次我們與她與客戶深入接觸時，我們就打開了創新之門。基本上，我們願意接受從硬體角度、韌體或軟體角度的特殊要求。我們看到客戶的反應確實正面。因此，我們組織起來能夠滿足這些要求並真正兌現它們。

So I think that more and more as we look into the future, I think that the very large percentage of what we ship will be, it will be customer-specific. There will be a market, a smaller market standard connectivity solutions like an 800 gig to 800 gig AEC with just two connectors and really nothing special. But we see the large majority of the volume being somewhat customer specific.

因此，我認為，隨著我們展望未來，我認為我們發貨的很大一部分將是針對特定客戶的。將會有一個市場，一個較小的市場標準連接解決方案，例如只有兩個連接器的 800 gig 到 800 gig AEC，實際上沒什麼特別的。但我們發現大部分的數量都是針對特定客戶。

Okay. Thanks for that clarification, Bill. My second question is on following up on your comments here about AI revenues doubling from this past fourth quarter to the next fourth quarter here. Maybe you can characterize the degree to which have back-end network revenues are built into this at all versus (inaudible) and because of the mix toward other applications you've been at historically?

好的。感謝您的澄清，比爾。我的第二個問題是跟進您關於人工智慧收入從過去第四季度到下一個第四季度翻倍的評論。也許您可以描述後端網路收入內建到此中的程度與（聽不清楚）以及由於您歷史上使用過的其他應用程式的混合程度？

Yes, I would say that you're right on from the standpoint that the back-end networks are really driving the increase in revenue. And that's a general statement about AI, of course, AI networks are also kind of connected to the front end network, but the number of connections is small in comparison. So I'll say that we're seeing that continued increase in the density of connections in AI clusters.

是的，我想說，從後端網路真正推動收入成長的角度來看，您是對的。這是關於人工智慧的一般說法，當然，人工智慧網路也與前端網路有某種連接，但相比之下連接數量很少。所以我想說，我們看到人工智慧集群中的連接密度持續增加。

And it's really driven by the combination of increased GPU performance generally as those in that market are executing on the roadmap. But there's also a desire to increase the GPU utilization of some out there like Open AI, they published a document that said that the average utilization of a GPU is roughly 33% and so there's a big opportunity in that going with more parallelism. And really that drives a larger density or increased density in the number of connections, really specifically to the back-end scale up networks.

它實際上是由 GPU 效能的提高所推動的，因為該市場中的 GPU 效能正在按照路線圖執行。但 Open AI 等公司也希望提高 GPU 利用率，他們發布了一份文檔，稱 GPU 的平均利用率約為 33%，因此更多並行性帶來了巨大的機會。實際上，這會推動更大的密度或連接數量的增加，特別是對於後端擴展網路。

So we talk about scale out scale up what that means from the standpoint of how many connections somebody AEC connections are possible per GPU, some of the back-end clusters that were ramping in the second half will have two or four AECs per GPU.

因此，我們從每個 GPU 可以連接多少個 AEC 連接的角度來討論橫向擴展，這意味著什麼，下半年增長的一些後端集群每個 GPU 將有兩個或四個 AEC。

And we're working on next-generation platforms that will actually increase that number of connections to eight or even higher per GPU. And so I think if you take it to a rack level, AI Appliance rack level, we're seeing at density today of between 56 and 64 AECs per rack. And we expect this number to likely reach close to 280 per rack in the future. So this is something that will fuel the growth as well.

我們正在開發下一代平台，該平台實際上會將每個 GPU 的連接數量增加到 8 個甚至更多。因此，我認為如果將其提升到機架級別、AI 設備機架級別，我們今天看到的密度為每個機架 56 到 64 個 AEC。我們預計未來每個機架的數量可能會接近 280 個。因此，這也將推動成長。

Karl Ackerman, PNB Paribas.

卡爾·阿克曼，PNB Paribas。

Yes, thank you. Gentlemen. I have two. I suppose from the first question, Dan. Could you put a finer point on IP licensing revenue in the July quarter? Like is it cut in half? And do you see IP revenue remaining toward the upper end of your long term and the 2% range for fiscal '25?

是的，謝謝。先生們。我有兩個。我想從第一個問題開始，丹。您能否更詳細地介紹一下 7 月季度的 IP 授權收入？就像被切成兩半一樣？您認為智慧財產權收入是否仍接近長期上限以及 25 財年 2% 的範圍？

Yes. So for fiscal '25. We internally expect it to be near the high end of that long-term model, which again, is 10% to 15% of overall revenue. And so from a -- if I were in your shoes to model this, I would assume that it's kind of near a quarter of that annual amount in Q1. And if you do that, you should kind of solved within our gross margin range for Q1. That's helpful.

是的。 25 財年也是如此。我們內部預計它將接近長期模型的高端，即佔總收入的 10% 到 15%。因此，如果我站在你的角度來建模，我會假設它接近第一季年度金額的四分之一。如果你這樣做，你應該在我們第一季的毛利率範圍內解決。這很有幫助。

Thank you for that. Perhaps a question for you, Bill. There has been much discussion and confusion about where PAM4 DSPs can be used in in the network. For example, the use of active copper cable are being used for Internet connectivity, while AOCs and AECs to primary use case for connecting mix to ToR and or the middle row SWITCHES do. My other question is, do all AI networks require a full retimed DSP for either AOC or AEC connections? Thank you.

謝謝你。也許有個問題想問你，比爾。關於 PAM4 DSP 可在網路中的哪些位置使用，存在著許多討論和困惑。例如，有源銅纜用於互聯網連接，而 AOC 和 AEC 則用於將混合連接到 ToR 和/或中間行交換器的主要用例。我的另一個問題是，所有 AI 網路是否都需要用於 AOC 或 AEC 連線的完整重定時 DSP？謝謝。

So this is a much discussed topic in the industry. And I think a year ago when at OFC, there was a big discussion about the idea of eliminating the DSP. That really started a lot of a lot of effort in pursuing the solution. So there's many companies, many optical module companies that pursuit designs with no DSP. And I think generally the jury has come in and basically there's really no momentum in the market now for solutions with no DSP.

所以這是業界熱議的話題。我想一年前，在 OFC，我們對取消 DSP 的想法進行了一次大討論。這確實讓我們付出了很多努力來尋求解決方案。所以有很多公司，很多光模組公司追求無DSP的設計。我認為，一般來說，陪審團已經介入，基本上現在市場上對於沒有 DSP 的解決方案確實沒有動力。

So in the optical world that we see right now, the solution for LRO is really quite feasible. And we're showing that with multiple partners. We demonstrated three at OFC, Lumentum being the largest of the three partners. What we're seeing is that the solution successfully reduces power. And by the way, that was the entire objective of LPO was to reduce power of these connections

所以在我們現在看到的光學世界裡，LRO的解決方案確實是非常可行的。我們正在與多個合作夥伴一起展示這一點。我們在 OFC 展示了三個合作夥伴，Lumentum 是三個合作夥伴中最大的一個。我們看到該解決方案成功降低了功耗。順便說一句，LPO 的全部目標就是降低這些連接的功率

And so we've shown that we can deliver 800 gig modules with partners that go sub 10 watt, a sub-10 wants, which is really probably a 30% to 40% reduction in compared to what's typical in the market for fully retained solutions. And so the key with LRO is that we're able to maintain the industry standards as well as interoperability.

因此，我們已經證明，我們可以與合作夥伴一起提供800 個低於10 瓦的模組，低於10 瓦的需求，與市場上典型的完全保留解決方案相比，這實際上可能減少30% 到40 % 。因此，LRO 的關鍵是我們能夠維持產業標準和互通性。

And so you can you can literally use in a lower solution. And there's nothing special that you need to do. And so we see that especially for clusters, these are shorter connections and AOCs are likely also transceivers. But for the shorter connections that say 10 to 20 meters and especially in the cluster power is so critical that we see that entire market could be addressed by LRO solutions.

所以你可以在較低的解決方案中使用。您不需要做任何特別的事情。因此我們看到，特別是對於群集而言，這些連接較短，AOC 也可能是收發器。但對於較短的連接（例如 10 到 20 公尺），尤其是在叢集中，功率非常重要，因此我們認為 LRO 解決方案可以滿足整個市場的需求。

Now it's obviously, again going to be up to a given customer and their strategy. But the idea that there will be a large volume of solutions with no DSP. I think that really no longer exists from the customers that we're talking to.

現在顯然，這又取決於特定的客戶及其策略。但這個想法是，將會有大量沒有 DSP 的解決方案。我認為，對於我們正在交談的客戶來說，這種情況已經不存在了。

Suji Desilva, Roth.

蘇吉·德西爾瓦，羅斯。

Hi, Bill, hi, Dan. Congrats on the progress here. Just Bill, on your comments on the number of AECs per GPU increasing, I'm just curious, you know, in general that is that increasing the kind of the forecasting needs of your customers in the AI area versus traditional cloud versus three months ago. Are those AI lanes stable already anticipated? And is the cloud traditional cloud part coming back?

嗨，比爾，嗨，丹。恭喜這裡的進展。 Bill，關於您對每個GPU 的AEC 數量增加的評論，我只是很好奇，您知道，總的來說，與三個月前相比，與傳統雲相比，人工智慧領域的客戶預測需求有所增加。這些 AI 通道是否已預期穩定？雲端運算傳統雲端部分又回來了嗎？

Yes. I would say there's really no change in the programs that we talked about three months ago. I'd say the additional information that we're sharing today is that this need for more performance and more bandwidth. It's really something that we're seeing as we look at next-generation AI cluster designs. And so that's a bit of new information that the number of connections per GPU is doubling or even more than doubling. And that will obviously drive growth.

是的。我想說，我們三個月前討論的計劃確實沒有任何變化。我想說的是，我們今天分享的附加資訊是需要更高的效能和更多的頻寬。當我們研究下一代人工智慧叢集設計時，這確實是我們所看到的。因此，這是一些新訊息，即每個 GPU 的連接數量增加了一倍，甚至增加了一倍以上。這顯然將推動成長。

Now as it relates to we talk about front end networks and back-end networks and of course, AI clusters, they're all connected to the front end network. As that relates to general compute versus AI -- hard for us to see from a forecasting standpoint, how that breaks out because the same issues are used for both from a front end network perspective.

現在我們談論前端網路和後端網絡，當然還有人工智慧集群，它們都連接到前端網路。由於這涉及到通用計算與人工智慧——從預測的角度來看，我們很難看到這種情況如何爆發，因為從前端網路的角度來看，兩者都使用相同的問題。

But I would say generally that the momentum in the market for AI. there's no question. It's still a huge amount of momentum, and we see that really for the foreseeable future. If I talk about what's the trade-off for us? If there's a real return from general compute market share perspective. Of course, we'll benefit from that. We're really used in both and when we talk about the third swim lane, which is we have AI Appliances, general compute server rack. So these are both server racks.

但我想說的是人工智慧市場的發展動能。毫無疑問。這仍然是一個巨大的動力，我們在可預見的未來確實看到了這一點。如果我談論我們的權衡是什麼？如果從一般計算市場佔有率的角度來看有真正的回報。當然，我們會從中受益。當我們談論第三條泳道時，我們確實在這兩個泳道中都使用過，即我們擁有人工智慧設備、通用計算伺服器機架。所以這些都是伺服器機架。

We talk about the third swim lane being SWITCH racks, and we see that growing in popularity as well and especially as the market moves towards 100 gig per lane speeds.

我們談論的第三條泳道是 SWITCH 機架，我們看到它也越來越受歡迎，特別是隨著市場朝著每泳道 100 GB 的速度發展。

Got it. That's very helpful color, Bill, thanks. And then at staying on these and this increase in AECs per GPU, does that introduce a customization opportunity as well? I'm thinking kind of the old HiWire rack opportunity, things like that? Or are those more standard cables, but just more?

知道了。這是非常有用的顏色，比爾，謝謝。然後，在保持這些以及每個 GPU AEC 的增加的情況下，這是否也會帶來客製化機會？我在想舊的 HiWire 機架機會，類似的事情？或是那些更標準的電纜，但只是更多？

Yes, I'd say none of these are standard. So in the AI Appliance application, what we're seeing is that there's maybe little or zero standard products that are being designed right now. So all of them have special features. I will say that we're delivering cables with two connectors, three connectors ,four connectors, and even five connectors. And so it's -- when you give these really creative designers of the racks, just the entire AI Appliance rack. It's fun to see what they're going to come up with and we're very much open to making their rack design more efficient.

是的，我想說這些都不是標準的。因此，在人工智慧設備應用程式中，我們看到的是，目前正在設計的標準產品可能很少或為零。所以它們都有特殊的功能。我想說的是，我們提供的電纜有兩個連接器、三個連接器、四個連接器，甚至五個連接器。所以，當你給這些真正有創意的機架設計師時，只是整個人工智慧設備機架。看到他們將想出什麼東西很有趣，我們非常願意讓他們的機架設計更有效率。

Quinn Bolton, Needham.

奎因·博爾頓，李約瑟。

Hey, Bill, wondering if you could just sort of address the AEC versus ACC debate that seems to have kind of popped up after OFC is in NVIDIA is looking to use ACCs in its NV linked fabric. Do you see perhaps as a result of that growing adoption of ACC's or you think ACC's you're going to be really used case limited going forward?

嘿，Bill，想知道您是否可以解決一下在 OFC 加入 NVIDIA 後似乎突然出現的 AEC 與 ACC 爭論，NVIDIA 正在尋求在其 NV 連接結構中使用 ACC。您是否認為由於 ACC 的採用日益廣泛，或者您認為 ACC 的未來用例將會受到真正的限制？

Use case limited we don't see ACC's anywhere in the market other than what you described it in NVIDIA.

由於用例有限，除了您在 NVIDIA 中描述的之外，我們在市場上的任何地方都沒有看到 ACC。

Perfect. Very simple, thank you.

完美的。很簡單，謝謝。

Tore Svanberg, Stifel.

托雷‧思文凱 (Tore Svanberg)、史蒂菲爾 (Stifel)。

Yes, Svanberg. Just to follow up on. So first of all, Bill, in your prepared remarks, you talk about accelerating the speed to market pretty meaningfully. Is that a result of your engagements with customers or have you implemented internally any new technologies or anything like that to really get the product to market quicker?

是的，思文凱。只是為了跟進。首先，比爾，在您準備好的發言中，您談到加快上市速度非常有意義。這是您與客戶互動的結果，還是您在內部實施了任何新技術或類似技術，以真正更快地將產品推向市場？

I think it's really due to a number of things in the way that we've organized and also the way that we work with our customers. I think from the standpoint of our ability to collaborate, it's really on a different level. I mean, we've got weekly, if not daily interaction between our engineering teams at Credo and our customer.

我認為這實際上是由於我們的組織方式以及我們與客戶合作的方式所造成的。我認為從我們合作能力的角度來看，這確實處於不同的水平。我的意思是，我們 Credo 的工程團隊和客戶之間每週（如果不是每天）都會進行互動。

And so that relates directly to our ability to deliver for samples. And then when we talk about moving something into production, there's many different levels of qualification and we've taken complete ownership of that. And when we think about that, what does that mean? That means that we've got more than 10 thermal chambers that are in constant use and what are we doing there?

因此，這與我們交付樣品的能力直接相關。然後，當我們談論將某些東西投入生產時，有許多不同級別的資格，而我們已經完全擁有了它。當我們思考這一點時，這意味著什麼？這意味著我們有超過 10 個持續使用的熱室，我們在那裡做什麼？

So our customers ship us switches or appliances with that, the configuration that they want to be qualified that they're planning on taking in production. We run the qualification tests for them. So it's live traffic, varying temperature, varying voltage, and we're doing a lot of the work for them upfront. And so when they go into a final qualification mode, they know that what we're delivering is highly predictable because we've already delivered data based on their prescriptive test that with the equipment that they ship us.

因此，我們的客戶向我們運送交換器或設備，他們希望符合他們計劃投入生產的配置。我們為他們進行資格測試。因此，這是即時流量、變化的溫度、變化的電壓，我們正在為它們預先做很多工作。因此，當他們進入最終資格模式時，他們知道我們所提供的內容是高度可預測的，因為我們已經根據他們向我們運送的設備進行的規定測試提供了數據。

And so from the standpoint of delivering first, it's about being organized to respond quickly. Qualifying first, we're doing a lot of the work for our customers, and that's really taking it up a notch.

因此，從交付第一的角度來看，關鍵在於組織起來快速回應。首先獲得資格，我們為客戶做了很多工作，這確實使我們的工作更上一層樓。

Great. And just my last question is a clarification. I just want to make sure I mean, I think I got this right, but I just want to make sure that it is clear to everybody. So AI revenue three quarters that includes product and licensing revenue, and that is the number that you expect to double year over year Q4 fiscal '25?

偉大的。我的最後一個問題只是一個澄清。我只是想確保我的意思是，我認為我是對的，但我只是想確保每個人都清楚這一點。那麼，人工智慧收入的三個季度包括產品和授權收入，您預計這個數字將在 25 財年第四季同比翻一番？

That is correct.

那是對的。

Great. Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。

Thank you. And there are no further questions at this time. Mr. Brennan, I turn the call back over to you.

謝謝。目前沒有其他問題。布倫南先生，我將電話轉回給您。

So thanks to everybody for the questions. We really appreciate the participation, and we look forward to the continued conversation on the callbacks. Thank you.

謝謝大家的提問。我們非常感謝您的參與，並期待繼續就回電進行對話。謝謝。

And this concludes today's conference call. You may now disconnect, and everyone have a great day.

今天的電話會議到此結束。您現在可以斷開連接，祝大家有個愉快的一天。