Copa Holdings SA (CPA) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Copa Holdings second quarter earnings Call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this call is being webcast and recorded, August 7, 2025.

女士們、先生們，感謝你們的支持。歡迎參加 Copa Holdings 第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）提醒一下，本次通話將於 2025 年 8 月 7 日進行網路直播和錄音。

And I will now turn the conference call over to Daniel Tapia, Director of Investor Relations. Sir, you may begin.

現在我將電話會議交給投資者關係總監 Daniel Tapia。先生，您可以開始了。

Thank you, James, and welcome, everyone to our second quarter earnings call. Joining me today are Pedro Heilbron, CEO of Copa Holdings; and Peter Donkersloot, our CFO. Pedro. Pedro will begin with an overview of our second quarter highlights, followed by Peter, who will walk us through the financial results. After that, we'll open the call for questions from analysts.

謝謝詹姆斯，歡迎大家參加我們的第二季財報電話會議。今天與我一起出席的還有 Copa Holdings 執行長 Pedro Heilbron 和我們的財務長 Peter Donkersloot。佩德羅。佩德羅將首先概述我們第二季的亮點，然後彼得將向我們介紹財務表現。之後，我們將開始接受分析師的提問。

Copa Holdings' financial reports have been prepared in accordance with International Financial Reporting Standards. In today's call, we will discuss non-IFRS financial measures, which are reconciled to IFRS measures in our earnings release available on our website, copaair.com.

Copa Holdings 的財務報告是依照國際財務報告準則編製的。在今天的電話會議中，我們將討論非國際財務報告準則 (IFRS) 財務指標，這些指標與我們網站 copaair.com 上發布的收益報告中的國際財務報告準則 (IFRS) 指標相協調。

Our discussion today will also contain forward-looking statements, not limited to historical facts that reflect the company's current beliefs, expectations and our intentions regarding future events and results. These forward-looking statements involve risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially and are based on assumptions subject to change. Many of these are discussed in our annual report filed with the SEC.

我們今天的討論還將包含前瞻性陳述，不僅限於反映公司當前信念、期望以及我們對未來事件和結果的意圖的歷史事實。這些前瞻性陳述涉及風險和不確定性，可能導致實際結果大不相同，並且基於可能變化的假設。我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的年度報告中討論了其中的許多內容。

With that, I'll turn the call over to our CEO, Mr. Pedro Heilbron.

說完這些，我將把電話轉給我們的執行長佩德羅·海爾布隆先生。

Thank you, Daniel. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us. I'd like to begin by recognizing the outstanding efforts of our entire team. Their dedication and professionalism continue to be key behind Copa's success and our ability to deliver strong results quarter after quarter. We're pleased to report another strong quarter with a 21% operating margin and a 17.7% net margin, both among the best in the industry.

謝謝你，丹尼爾。大家早安，感謝大家的收看。首先，我要讚揚我們整個團隊的傑出努力。他們的奉獻精神和專業精神仍然是 Copa 成功以及我們能夠一季又一季取得強勁業績的關鍵。我們很高興地報告本季業績再次表現強勁，營業利潤率達 21%，淨利潤率達 17.7%，均位居行業前列。

These results underscore the strength and resilience of our business model, which combined with Copa's disciplined execution and cost leadership enable us to consistently deliver industry-leading margins and solid financial results.

這些結果凸顯了我們商業模式的優勢和彈性，再加上 Copa 的嚴格執行和成本領先優勢，使我們能夠持續提供業界領先的利潤率和穩健的財務表現。

Now I'll go over the key highlights for the quarter. Capacity increased by 5.8% year-over-year. Load factor reached 87.3%, an increase of 0.5 percentage points compared to Q2 '24. Passenger yields came in 4.1% lower year-over-year. Unit revenues or RASM declined 2.8% to $0.107.

現在我將回顧本季的主要亮點。運力較去年同期成長5.8%。載客率達 87.3%，比 2024 年第二季增加了 0.5 個百分點。客運收益率年減4.1%。單位收入或 RASM 下降 2.8% 至 0.107 美元。

Unit cost or CASM decreased 4.6% to $0.085, while CASM, excluding fuel, increased 3.2% to $0.058. Operationally, Copa Airlines once again delivered a world-leading on-time performance of 91.5% and a flight completion factor of 99.8%.

單位成本（CASM）下降4.6%至0.085澳元，而不含燃油的CASM則上漲3.2%至0.058澳元。營運方面，巴拿馬航空再次實現了全球領先的準點率，準點率高達91.5%，航班完成率高達99.8%。

Furthermore, Copa was recently recognized by Skytrax for the 10th consecutive year as the Best Airline in Central America and the Caribbean, and received the award for Best Airline Staff in Central America and the Caribbean. I would like to take this opportunity to congratulate our more than 8,500 dedicated coworkers whose commitment to excellence enables us to consistently deliver a world-class travel experience to our passengers.

此外，巴拿馬航空最近連續第十年被 Skytrax 評為中美洲和加勒比地區最佳航空公司，並榮獲中美洲和加勒比地區最佳航空公司員工獎。我想藉此機會祝賀我們 8,500 多名敬業的同事，他們對卓越的追求使我們能夠始終如一地為乘客提供世界一流的旅行體驗。

In terms of our network, we continue to expand our Hub of the Americas in Panama with new service to San Diego, California, and we restarted flights to Caracas. Further, we recently announced plans to start service at the end of the year to Los Cabos, Mexico and Puerto Plata, Dominican Republic as well as restart flights to, also in the Dominican Republic and Salvador de Bahia in Brazil.

在我們的網路方面，我們繼續擴大我們在巴拿馬的美洲樞紐，開通了飛往加利福尼亞州聖地亞哥的新航班，並重新開通了飛往加拉加斯的航班。此外，我們最近宣布計劃於今年底開通飛往墨西哥洛斯卡沃斯和多明尼加共和國普拉塔港的航班，並重新開通飛往多明尼加共和國和巴西薩爾瓦多的航班。

Together with our earlier announcements of service to Salta and Tucuman in Argentina in September, this brings to eight the total number of new and returning destinations announced so far this year, further strengthening our position as the most complete and convenient connecting hub for travel in the Americas.

加上我們先前宣布的9月份飛往阿根廷薩爾塔和圖庫曼的航班，今年迄今宣布的新增和回程目的地總數已達8個，進一步鞏固了我們作為美洲最齊全、最便捷的旅行中轉樞紐的地位。

Going forward, we continue to see a healthy demand environment and remain focused on our competitive advantages. The best geographic position with our Hub of the Americas in Panama, low unit cost and a strong balance sheet and a passenger-friendly product with the best on-time performance. These pillars continue to drive our ability to consistently deliver industry-leading results.

展望未來，我們將繼續看到健康的需求環境，並繼續專注於我們的競爭優勢。我們的美洲樞紐位於巴拿馬，地理位置優越，單位成本低，資產負債表強勁，產品對乘客友好，準時率最高。這些支柱繼續推動我們始終如一地提供行業領先成果的能力。

With that, I'll turn the call over to Peter, who will go over our financials in more detail.

說完這些，我將把電話轉給彼得，他將更詳細地介紹我們的財務狀況。

Thank you, Pedro. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining our call today. I'd like to begin by echoing Pedro's appreciation for our team's continued commitment to delivering industry-leading results.

謝謝你，佩德羅。大家早安，感謝大家今天參加我們的電話會議。首先，我要贊同佩德羅對我們團隊持續致力於實現業界領先成果的讚賞。

For the second quarter, we delivered a net profit of $149 million or $3.61 per share, a 25% year-over-year increase in earnings per share. Operating income reached $177 million and an industry-leading operating margin of 21%, highlighting our ability to consistently generate strong profitability.

第二季度，我們的淨利潤為 1.49 億美元，即每股 3.61 美元，每股收益較去年同期成長 25%。營業收入達到 1.77 億美元，營業利潤率達到業界領先的 21%，凸顯了我們持續創造強勁獲利能力的能力。

On the cost side, CASM decreased 4.6% year-over-year to $0.085, driven primarily by a 17% reduction in the average fuel price per gallon. CASM ex fuel came in at $0.058, an increase of 3.2% compared to the second quarter of 2024, but consistent with our target for the year. This increase was mainly due to the nonrecurring benefit recorded in the second quarter of 2024 in the maintenance, materials and repair cost line associated with the return conditions of nine aircraft lease extensions.

成本方面，CASM 年減 4.6% 至 0.085 美元，主要原因是每加侖平均燃油價格下降 17%。CASM 不含燃料的價格為 0.058 美元，與 2024 年第二季相比成長了 3.2%，但與我們今年的目標一致。這一增長主要歸因於 2024 年第二季與九架飛機租賃延期的退貨條件相關的維護、材料和維修成本項目記錄的非經常性收益。

This was partially offset by the decline in sales and distribution expense driven by the continued successful execution of our NDC strategy and a reduction in passenger servicing costs, which reflects the year-over-year impact of the MAX nine grounding in 2024.

這被銷售和分銷費用的下降部分抵消，下降是由於我們繼續成功執行 NDC 策略以及乘客服務成本的降低所致，這反映了 2024 年 MAX 9 停飛的同比影響。

On the balance sheet front, we ended the quarter with $1.4 billion in cash, short-term and long-term investments, representing 39% of last 12-month revenue. This figure excludes over $600 million in predelivery deposits for future aircraft.

在資產負債表方面，本季末我們擁有 14 億美元現金、短期和長期投資，佔過去 12 個月收入的 39%。這一數字還不包括未來飛機交付前超過 6 億美元的訂金。

Additionally, we currently have 42 unencumbered aircraft, accounting for more than one-third of our fleet, further reinforcing our financial flexibility. Total debt stood at $2.1 billion, entirely related to aircraft financing. Our adjusted net debt-to-EBITDA ratio remained at an industry-leading 0.6 times, and our average cost of debt continues to be highly competitive at 3.5%.

此外，我們目前擁有 42 架未佔用的飛機，占我們機隊的三分之一以上，進一步增強了我們的財務靈活性。總債務為 21 億美元，全部與飛機融資有關。我們的調整後淨負債與 EBITDA 比率仍維持在業界領先的 0.6 倍，我們的平均負債成本持續保持極具競爭力的 3.5%。

With regards to the return of value to our shareholders, I'm pleased to announce that the company will make its third dividend payment of the year of $1.61 per share on September 15, to all shareholders of record as of August 29.

關於向股東回報價值，我很高興地宣布，公司將於 9 月 15 日向截至 8 月 29 日登記在冊的所有股東派發今年第三次股息，每股 1.61 美元。

Regarding our fleet, during the quarter, we took delivery of three Boeing 737 MAX-8 aircraft, bringing our total fleet to 115 aircraft. We remain on track to end 2025 with a fleet of 125 aircraft, and I'm pleased to share that we have secured financing for all of our 2025 deliveries.

關於我們的機隊，本季我們接收了三架波音 737 MAX-8 飛機，使我們的機隊總數達到 115 架飛機。到 2025 年底，我們的機隊規模將達到 125 架飛機，我很高興地告訴大家，我們已經為 2025 年交付的所有飛機獲得了融資。

As for our 2025 outlook, we are reaffirming our full year operating margin guidance of 21% to 23%, supported by a healthy demand environment and continued cost discipline. We also maintain our expectation for capacity growth in ASMs in the range of 7% to 8% year-over-year. Our outlook is based on the following assumptions load factor of approximately 87%, RASM of approximately $0.112, ex-fuel CASM of approximately $0.058 and an all-in fuel price of $2.45 per gallon.

至於我們對 2025 年的展望，在健康的需求環境和持續的成本控制的支持下，我們重申全年營業利潤率預期為 21% 至 23%。我們也維持對 ASM 產能年增 7% 至 8% 的預期。我們的展望基於以下假設：載客率約為 87%、RASM 約為 0.112 美元、不含燃料的 CASM 約為 0.058 美元以及全包燃料價格為每加侖 2.45 美元。

To finalize, we remain confident that our proven business model, robust balance sheet and disciplined execution give us a solid foundation to continue delivering consistent growth, strong financial results and industry-leading margins. Thank you, and we'll now open the call for questions from the analyst.

最後，我們仍然相信，我們成熟的商業模式、強勁的資產負債表和嚴謹的執行力為我們繼續實現持續成長、強勁的財務業績和行業領先的利潤率奠定了堅實的基礎。謝謝，我們現在開始分析師提問環節。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Savi Syth, Raymond James.

薩維西斯、雷蒙德詹姆斯。

I know you mentioned healthy demand environment. But I was wondering if you could talk a little bit about what you're seeing in some of your biggest point-of-sale markets? And if there's any demand trends that stand out, good or bad in any of the kind of particular markets or even passenger segments?

我知道您提到了健康的需求環境。但我想知道您是否可以談談您在一些最大的銷售點市場中看到的情況？並且是否存在任何突出的需求趨勢，無論是在特定市場還是乘客群體中是好是壞？

Savi, in terms of -- if we think of load factors, we're increasing our load factor guidance and most markets have strong demand or at least steady demand. In some cases, yields are slightly down, industry capacity in our region for second half of the year, and industry includes all of us, of course, is growing in the high single digits. But we're still keeping up with load factors and again, as mentioned, increasing our guidance there. And that applies to most all of the markets we're serving.

薩維，就載客率而言，我們正在提高載客率指導，而且大多數市場都有強勁的需求或至少穩定的需求。在某些情況下，收益率略有下降，我們地區下半年的行業產能，當然包括我們所有人在內的行業，都在以高個位數成長。但我們仍在關注負載率，如上所述，再次提高我們的指導。這適用於我們所服務的大多數市場。

Got it. That's helpful. And I don't know if this is for Peter or for you, Pedro, but curious if you could share what you're seeing from Boeing. It seems like the aircraft are coming on time or early. And just any early thoughts into kind of 2026 capacity?

知道了。這很有幫助。我不知道這是針對彼得的還是針對你，佩德羅，但我很好奇你是否可以分享你對波音的看法。看起來飛機準時或提前到達。對於 2026 年的產能有什麼初步想法嗎？

So far, our deliveries here have been early. Every plane has come a week or two before what was projected or scheduled. Of course, everything is delayed if we go back to the original date, but they're delivering on time this year. Next year -- and we received, as Peter mentioned, three aircrafts so far. So the other 10 are going to come in the last five months of the year.

到目前為止，我們這裡的交貨都比較早。每架飛機都比預計或計劃提前一兩週到達。當然，如果我們回到原來的日期，一切都會延遲，但今年他們會準時交貨。明年——正如彼得所提到的，到目前為止，我們已經收到了三架飛機。另外 10 個將在今年最後五個月推出。

And next year, we have six deliveries, which will happen earlier, most are in the first half of the year. So we should expect that the bulk of the ASM that we're going to have this year are going to have a full year -- a greater full year impact in 2026, plus the six additional planes next year. So capacity, we're not guiding for 2026 yet, but it would be trending a little bit higher than this year.

明年，我們將有六次交付，交付時間會更早，大多數是在上半年。因此，我們應該預期，今年的大部分 ASM 將對全年產生更大的影響——2026 年全年的影響更大，再加上明年新增的 6 架飛機。因此，我們尚未預測 2026 年的產能，但趨勢會比今年略高。

Duane Pfennigwerth, Evercore ISI.

杜安‧芬尼格沃斯 (Duane Pfennigwerth)，Evercore ISI。

Maybe you could just remind us on FX, what the impacts are from a top line perspective, from a yield perspective and from a CASM perspective, when we get a slightly weaker dollar? Maybe you could just remind us of that. And any trends to call out in local currencies that you're seeing?

也許您可以提醒我們，就外匯而言，當美元略微走弱時，從營收角度、殖利率角度和 CASM 角度來看，會產生什麼影響？也許你可以提醒我們這一點。您發現當地貨幣有趨勢嗎？

Yes. So most of the major currencies in South America and in Latin America, including Mexico too, are up year-over-year and also up in the last six months and since the last quarter. You could call it weakness of the US dollar or it doesn't really matter much. Most of our sales are south to north, so originating in the South.

是的。因此，南美洲和拉丁美洲（包括墨西哥）的大多數主要貨幣都比去年同期上漲，並且在過去六個月和上個季度以來也上漲。你可以稱之為美元疲軟，或者這其實並不重要。我們的大部分銷售是從南到北，因此源自南方。

So we tend to benefit when the currencies in Latin America are stronger like the case now. But it's not a significant difference year-over-year. I mean they're slightly up. So it's good. That's positive, but I wouldn't say that it's significant enough to make a huge difference.

因此，當拉丁美洲的貨幣像現在這樣走強時，我們往往會受益。但與去年同期相比，差異並不顯著。我的意思是它們略微上漲了。所以這很好。這是積極的一面，但我不會說它足以產生巨大的影響。

And I would add on the cost side, most of our costs are US dollar based. We have are based -- our main cost base in Panama, where we have fuel and our salaries in US dollar based or most of our salaries is in US dollar based. So that won't necessarily affect us on the FX side and cost.

我想補充一下成本方面，我們的大部分成本都是以美元計算的。我們的主要成本基地在巴拿馬，那裡有燃料，我們的工資以美元支付，或者說我們的大部分工資都是以美元支付的。所以這不一定會影響我們的外匯和成本。

Got it. And then just for my follow-up, it's been a while since we've talked about it, but maybe just an update on airport capacity at PTY, any infrastructure projects that may be going on? And is there sufficient runway to support your growth plans 2026, 2027 and beyond? What's the next kind of marker we should be looking at there?

知道了。然後只是為了我的後續問題，我們已經有一段時間沒有談論它了，但也許只是關於 PTY 機場容量的更新，任何可能正在進行的基礎設施項目？是否有足夠的跑道來支持您 2026 年、2027 年及以後的成長計畫？我們接下來應該關注哪種標記？

Yes, definitely. The airport actually is right now working on an expansion plan, which includes work on both runways, repair work, but one runway will be extended. left. It also includes improvement to the taxiways and between 10 and 12 additional gates to the new T2. This should all happen in the next three to four years.

是的，當然。該機場目前正在實施擴建計劃，其中包括對兩條跑道進行修繕，但其中一條跑道將延長。它還包括改善滑行道和在新 T2 航站樓增加 10 至 12 個登機口。這一切都將在未來三到四年內實現。

There's already, let's say, a prework or preplan by an international consultant. They have the funds earmarked for this project and are working closely with the airlines and civil aviation. So we see this moving ahead, and it's going to give the airport, I think, another 10 years at least of runway.

可以說，國際顧問已經做好了預先工作或預先規劃。他們為這個項目預留了資金，並與航空公司和民航部門密切合作。因此，我們看到這項工程正在向前推進，我認為這將為機場提供至少另外 10 年的跑道使用壽命。

Guilherme Mendes, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的吉列爾梅門德斯 (Guilherme Mendes)。

The first one is looking into 2026. So assuming that the industry continues to grow, let's say, by mid- to high single digits into next year, is it fair to assume that yields can remain pretty much where they are right now? And the second point to Peter, it's on the buybacks. If you can update us on how much you have executed in the second quarter of the year and how much is left out of the $200 million?

第一個是展望2026年。那麼，假設該行業繼續成長，比如說，明年的成長率達到中高個位數，那麼是否可以合理地假設收益率可以維持在目前的水平？我要向彼得提出的第二點是關於回購。您能否告訴我們您在今年第二季執行了多少資金以及這 2 億美元還剩下多少？

Yes. So I'll take your first question. So far, demand has been holding up and even though capacity has grown quite a bit in the last few years. But I should also mention that our yields and RASM has come down. It's been lower in '25 versus '24, and it was lower in '24 than in '23.

是的。那我來回答你的第一個問題。到目前為止，儘管過去幾年產能已有大幅成長，但需求仍保持穩定。但我還應該提到，我們的收益率和 RASM 已經下降。2025 年比 2024 年低，2024 年又比 2023 年低。

So we've seen yields come down as demand has grown in our region. But at the same time, we have lowered our unit cost and made up for most of that.

因此，我們看到隨著我們地區需求的增長，收益率下降了。但同時，我們降低了單位成本並彌補了大部分損失。

So we've been preparing for a long time since 10 years ago and also -- and especially after the pandemic, to deliver strong results in a lower yield environment. And that's why we've been so focused on efficiencies on cost. We have accomplished many of our goals, and we're not stopping there. So we're confident that we can be successful even on, let's say, flat yields like we're seeing right now or even lower yields.

因此，我們從 10 年前就開始準備，尤其是在疫情之後，我們準備在低收益環境中取得強勁業績。這就是我們如此重視成本效率的原因。我們已經實現了許多目標，但我們不會就此止步。因此，我們有信心，即使在收益率持平（如目前）甚至更低的情況下，我們也能取得成功。

This is Peter here. So on the buybacks, as you stated, the Board has approved a $200 million program, and we have executed to date around half of that program, including around $10 million that we have executed year-to-date.

我是彼得。關於回購，正如您所說，董事會已經批准了一項 2 億美元的計劃，迄今為止我們已經執行了該計劃的大約一半，其中包括今年迄今為止我們執行的約 1000 萬美元。

Jens Spiess, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的 Jens Spiess。

Congrats on the solid results. I just want to ask on your Cargo business, which is doing -- continuing to do quite well. How do you see things going forward? Do you see any like slowdown in volumes due to like the higher like tariffs in general like tensions across the region? Or in reality, do you have visibility into that business?

祝賀您取得如此豐碩的成果。我只是想問一下你們的貨運業務，目前情況一直很好。您如何看待未來的發展？您是否認為由於關稅普遍提高以及地區緊張局勢導致貿易量出現放緩？或者實際上，您是否了解該業務？

Or is it very limited, like how much in advance basically, you have visibility here?

或者說，它非常有限，例如，基本上提前多久，你才能看到這裡？

Yes. Well, a few things. Yes, yes, we do not have visibility in the long term is pretty much short term. But I would also mention, yes, Cargo has been very strong in Q2 and the first half of the year. Most of our cargo moves in the belly of our passenger aircraft. So let's call it, it's a low-risk cargo. It's not a bed we're making. It's very low risk and it's making the best of all of our capacity.

是的。嗯，有幾件事。是的，是的，我們對長期前景沒有預見，只能預見短期前景。但我還要提到，是的，貨運在第二季和今年上半年表現非常強勁。我們的大部分貨物都在客機腹部運輸。所以我們姑且稱之為低風險貨物。我們做的不是床。風險非常低，而且可以充分利用我們所有的能力。

We also operate one cargo aircraft, which has done very, very well, a 737-800 freighter. So we're bringing a second one this month. By the end of this month, we'll have a second 737-800 freighter. This one will be leased, an operating lease. So that will also contribute to more cargo volume. But again, it will still be mostly moved in the belly of our passenger aircraft.

我們也經營一架貨機，這架貨機表現非常非常好，那就是 737-800 貨機。因此我們本月將推出第二個。到本月底，我們將擁有第二架 737-800 貨機。這棟建築將被租賃，為經營租賃。這也將有助於增加貨運量。但同樣，它仍然主要在我們的客機腹艙內運輸。

Okay. Perfect. And just assuming that demand remains healthy, how much should we expect in terms of an increase in cargo with the new freighter?

好的。完美的。假設需求保持健康，那麼我們預期新貨機的貨運量會增加多少？

Nothing really. It's just a single 737-800 freighter. So the change will not be significant. It's a bump up, but it will not -- it should not move the needle in a significant way.

沒什麼。它只是一架 737-800 貨機。因此變化不會很大。這是一個進步，但它不會——它不應該對指針產生重大影響。

Rogerio Araujo, Bank of America.

羅傑裡奧·阿勞霍，美國銀行。

Congratulations on the results. I have a couple here. Number one, on fuel price, you are guiding -- one of the assumptions for the guidance is $2.45 per gallon. We estimate this implies a price around 4% higher than the current curve indicates. Does that make sense? Is the jet fuel price assumed in the guidance somewhat conservative? In other words, if it remains as it is, could there be upside risks to the margin guidance? That's number one.

恭喜你取得這樣的成績。我這裡有一對。第一，關於燃油價格，你們給出的指導性假設之一是每加侖 2.45 美元。我們估計這意味著價格將比當前曲線高出約 4%。這樣有道理嗎？指南中假設的航空燃油價格是否有些保守？換句話說，如果維持現狀，保證金指導是否可能有上行風險？這是第一點。

And number two, moving now to the second half of the year, could you provide an early view on the expected trend on CASM ex fuel looking ahead into '26? And you've talked already about capacity and potential RASM. Any relevant expected change in margin levels or any trend you're seeing? Anything you could share with us would be great.

第二，現在進入下半年，您能否對 26 年 CASM 不含燃料的預期趨勢提供初步看法？您已經談到了容量和潛在的 RASM。保證金水準有任何相關的預期變化或您看到的任何趨勢嗎？如果您能與我們分享任何內容那就太好了。

Okay. Rogerio, this is Peter here. I would start saying that the fuel curve that we embedded in our guidance is something that we don't update every day. So when we did -- when we built our guidance, the fuel was around the $2.45 that we embedded in our guidance. Today, it might be slightly lower, but we don't update our fuel curve every day.

好的。羅傑裡奧，我是彼得。我想說的是，我們在指導中嵌入的燃料曲線並不是每天更新的。因此，當我們制定指導時，燃料價格約為我們指導中所包含的 2.45 美元。今天，它可能會稍微低一些，但我們不會每天更新燃料曲線。

And to the best of our knowledge, that's the one we use to build our guidance. On the CASM ex fuels and that we're seeing for the second half, I would say that we remain committed with the $580 for the full year, and we don't see any seasonality on the CASM ex fuel. It should be much -- pretty much flat across the fourth quarter -- the four quarters.

據我們所知，這就是我們用來制定指導的。關於 CASM 不含燃料的價格以及我們對下半年的預期，我想說，我們仍然致力於全年 580 美元的價格，而且我們認為 CASM 不含燃料的價格不會受到任何季節性的影響。第四季——四個季度——應該基本上持平。

So we don't see a lot of seasonality. And we still don't provide any guidance for the CASM ex fuel on 2026, but I can tell you that we're working on a lot of initiatives to -- as it's part of our DNA to always be very cost driven and focused on our cost to make sure we maintain our absolute -- our competitive advantage on an absolute terms and on a relative terms on having a low CASM ex fuel.

所以我們看不到太多的季節性。我們仍然沒有為 2026 年的 CASM 燃料提供任何指導，但我可以告訴你，我們正在進行許多舉措 - 因為這是我們 DNA 的一部分，始終以成本為導向並專注於我們的成本，以確保我們保持絕對的 - 我們在絕對和相對條件下的低 CASM 燃料競爭優勢。

And on the RASM I can actually tell you that we've been continue seeing the similar trend that started in the second half of last year, and we expect our RASM for the second half of this year to be similar to the second half of last year.

關於 RASM，我可以告訴您，我們一直看到從去年下半年開始的類似趨勢，我們預計今年下半年的 RASM 將與去年下半年相似。

We see the trend to maintain similar with some markets behaving a little better, some markets are worse, but averaging around in the same neighborhood of second half last year. And that will be flat year-on-year and in line with our guidance of 11.2%.

我們看到趨勢保持相似，有些市場表現稍好，有些市場表現較差，但平均值與去年下半年大致相同。這將與去年同期持平，並符合我們 11.2% 的預期。

Michael Linenberg, Deutsche Bank.

麥可‧林伯格，德意志銀行。

Nice job this quarter. I want to go back to Savi's question just about demand, strength, and weakness across regions. We heard one of your competitors talk about Central America to the US being pretty weak. And I know it's not a market that you've historically been all that big in.

本季做得很好。我想回到薩維關於各地區需求、優勢和劣勢的問​​題。我們聽到你們的一位競爭對手說中美洲與美國的貿易關係相當薄弱。我知道，從歷史上看，這並不是你們所佔據的很大市場。

But when I think about all the routes, all the US destinations, you're adding the Panama, I'm sure the utility of Central American passengers of that hub is going up. But also domestic Colombia because it looks like that the domestic Colombia market is doing much better now. So sort of how that features into Wingo's results. So Pedro, if you could go into a little bit more detail or color on that, that would be great?

但當我考慮所有的航線、所有的美國目的地，再加上巴拿馬，我確信樞紐對中美洲乘客的效用會上升。但哥倫比亞國內市場也是如此，因為看起來哥倫比亞國內市場現在表現好得多。那麼這對 Wingo 的結果有何影響呢？那麼佩德羅，如果你能更詳細地解釋這個問題，那就太好了？

Yes. So we don't share a lot of specifics, but I can comment on the two markets that you're mentioning. So Central America to US has received a lot of capacity in the past, let's say, in the past two years. There's been a lot of growth in that market. And then we have the other issues, the migration, visa issues on top.

是的。因此，我們不會分享很多細節，但我可以對您提到的兩個市場發表評論。因此，在過去兩年中，中美洲至美國的航線運力得到了極大的提升。該市場已經取得了很大的成長。然後我們還有其他問題，像是移民問題、簽證問題。

Luckily, it's not a huge market for us. We don't fly nonstop Central America, US We connect through Panama, which is a little bit south of Central America. So it's not huge. But yes, Central America is one of our weaker markets right now, I would validate that.

幸運的是，對我們來說這不是一個巨大的市場。我們沒有直飛中美洲和美國的航班，我們經過巴拿馬轉機，巴拿馬位於中美洲稍南處。所以它不是很大。但是的，中美洲現在是我們較弱的市場之一，我可以證實這一點。

But again, not the most important market for us in that sense, especially at flow. We're very strong Central America to South America, and we're very strong Central America to the Caribbean. But to the US, that's not our number one strength. And yes, domestic Colombia is doing well, and that has favored Wingo, no doubt.

但從這個意義上來說，這對我們來說並不是最重要的市場，尤其是在流量方面。我們在中美洲至南美洲地區非常強大，我們在中美洲至加勒比海地區也非常強大。但對美國來說，這不是我們的第一優勢。是的，哥倫比亞國內市場表現良好，這無疑對溫戈有利。

Great. And then just my second question, Pedro. When I think about your positioning where you fly, there's not a lot of premium product offering. There may be one or two other carriers. I mean, you sort of stand head and shoulders above your -- most of your competition.

偉大的。這是我的第二個問題，佩德羅。當我考慮你們的飛行定位時，我發現並沒有提供太多的優質產品。可能還有一兩家其他業者。我的意思是，你比你的大多數競爭對手都高出一籌。

And to sort of borrow from Delta, they look at premium plus ancillary and they view that as their competitive moat, and I think we're approaching 60% of their revenue falls into that premium ancillary bucket.

借用達美航空的例子，他們注重高端服務和輔助服務，並將其視為自己的競爭優勢，我認為他們接近 60% 的收入來自高端輔助服務。

As you build out cargo and you have a very meaningful premium product, you have lie flat on your MAX-9s, where is the premium ancillary percentage today, even in rough numbers? And where was that maybe five years ago? And aspirationally, where do you think you can take that? Because I truly believe that when we think about competitive moats, economic moats, that, that premium plus ancillary is something where you can shine.

當您建造貨物並擁有非常有意義的高端產品時，您已經在 MAX-9 上躺平了，即使是粗略的數字，今天的優質輔助百分比在哪裡？五年前它在哪裡？從理想角度來說，您認為您能實現什麼目標？因為我真的相信，當我們考慮競爭護城河、經濟護城河時，優質產品和附加產品就是你可以大放異彩的地方。

Yes. Thank you, Mike. You're totally right. We have a premium product advantage in our network, definitely. And I'm talking mostly of this intra-regional, intra-Latin America narrow-body network where we compete and where we have a leadership position.

是的。謝謝你，麥克。你完全正確。我們的網路絕對擁有優質產品的優勢。我主要談論的是這個區域內、拉丁美洲內部的窄體航空網絡，我們在其中參與競爭並且佔據領導地位。

We now have also a premium product advantage, which we're learning to monetize. I mean, it's -- we're doing much better in ancillary revenues -- in premium ancillary revenues like upgrade, for example, our frequent flyer program, seats premium economy, which we also have a nice premium economy across our fleet.

我們現在還擁有優質產品優勢，我們正在學習將其貨幣化。我的意思是，我們在輔助收入方面做得更好——在高級輔助收入方面，例如昇級，我們的飛行常客計劃，高級經濟艙座位，我們的機隊也擁有不錯的高級經濟艙。

And so every year, we're doing better than the previous year. We don't share specifics, but this year, we're doing quite well, and we see a lot of upside exactly in what you're saying for the reasons you're mentioning.

因此，每年我們的表現都比前一年更好。我們沒有分享具體細節，但今年我們做得相當好，而且由於您提到的原因，我們看到了許多好處。

Alberto Valerio, UBS.

瑞銀的 Alberto Valerio。

I would like if you can talk a little bit about competition. You mentioned that some tough markets and others a little bit better. Last time we spoke, we were talking about Argentina, maybe some new routes there. Brazil now with in Chapter 11, LatAm with a moderate growth.

我希望您能稍微談談競爭。您提到有些市場比較艱難，有些市場則稍微好一點。上次我們談話時，我們談到了阿根廷，也許談到了一些新的航線。巴西目前處於第 11 章，拉丁美洲則呈現溫和成長。

If you could talk a little bit about competition and the last one about Volaris, the partnership, the codeshare with Volaris, if you can provide some update how you have been doing?

如果您可以談一談競爭，最後談談 Volaris、合作夥伴關係、與 Volaris 的程式碼共享，您是否可以提供一些最新進展？

Alberto. So I won't mention other airlines. We don't give them free advertising for sure. But there has been a lot of capacity in our region, new capacity in the last two years, especially in the last two years, including 2025.

阿爾貝托。所以我就不提其他航空公司了。我們一定不會給他們免費廣告。但我們地區的產能已經很多了，特別是最近兩年新增產能，包括2025年。

As I mentioned, in the second half of the year, industry capacity is going to be up by about 9%. That includes Copa. Some airlines, which I would mention, have grown quite a bit. One in particular has grown a lot in our kind of markets in the intra-Latin America region. And we've dealt with that successfully. Our load factors are up. And even though yields are slightly down, as we have shared throughout the presentation and in the earnings release, we have also lowered our unit cost.

正如我所提到的，今年下半年，產業產能將成長約9%。其中包括 Copa。我想提到的一些航空公司已經取得了長足的發展。在我們這樣的拉丁美洲內部市場中，有一個市場成長特別迅速。我們已經成功解決了這個問題。我們的載客率上升了。儘管收益率略有下降，但正如我們在整個演示和收益報告中所分享的那樣，我們也降低了單位成本。

Of course, that's a good guy from fuel this year also. So we have a very well-focused business model with the strongest product and better cost. So we're in an excellent position to continue competing successfully.

當然，這也是今年燃料的好人。因此，我們擁有一個非常集中的商業模式，擁有最強大的產品和更優的成本。因此，我們處於有利地位，可以繼續成功競爭。

In terms of codeshare with Volaris, well, Mexico is, of course, one of the largest -- I think it's like the third largest aviation market in all of the Americas, including the US, a very important market for us. We did not have a partner in Mexico. We now do with Volaris. It's a codeshare that will be -- will continue being developed and expanded, and we hope it's going to be very beneficial for both airlines.

就與 Volaris 的程式碼共享而言，墨西哥當然是最大的市場之一——我認為它是包括美國在內的整個美洲第三大航空市場，對我們來說是一個非常重要的市場。我們在墨西哥沒有合作夥伴。我們現在與 Volaris 合作。這是一個將繼續開發和擴展的程式碼共享，我們希望它將對兩家航空公司都非常有利。

In our case, tying that very significant Mexican market to our network and then giving Volaris Mexico feed from our very strong South American, Central American and Caribbean network.

在我們的案例中，我們將非常重要的墨西哥市場與我們的網絡聯繫起來，然後透過我們非常強大的南美、中美和加勒比網絡為 Volaris 墨西哥提供資訊。

Tom Fitzgerald, TD Cowen.

湯姆·菲茨杰拉德，TD Cowen。

Just kind of going back to Mike's question, how do you view the role of technology or the role technology can play in your revenue journey and like whether like dynamic pricing or better data analysis? I appreciate any color there.

回到麥克的問題，您如何看待技術的作用或技術在您的收入旅程中可以發揮的作用，例如動態定價或更好的數據分析？我欣賞那裡的任何顏色。

Yes. So a few things there. We -- since the pandemic, we have invested quite a bit in digital technology. A lot of it actually homemade, which also not only gives us the right digital technologies we need, but also a much better cost, not on a per passenger or per booking basis, like our Internet booking engine, which now is where most of our sales come through is Copa-owned, homemade, our app, which is right now in some international context, competing as one of the five top apps in the world, going against really, really top airlines for the number one place. That's also homemade.

是的。那裡有幾件事。自從疫情爆發以來，我們在數位科技方面投入了相當多的資金。其中許多實際上是自製的，這不僅為我們提供了所需的正確數字技術，而且成本更低，不是按每個乘客或每個預訂計算，比如我們的互聯網預訂引擎，現在我們的大部分銷售額都來自於巴拿馬航空旗下的自製應用程序，它目前在某些國際背景下，正在競爭世界五大應用程序之一，與真正的頂級航空公司爭奪第一名。這也是自製的。

And that's allowing us to better develop our ancillary revenues. Now in terms of, let's say, more sophisticated technologies that will allow for dynamic pricing, we work with third-party providers, we work with some of the best third-party providers. And I would say that we're in our infancy in terms of dynamic pricing and everything AI it's going to provide for pricing in the future and revenue management.

這使我們能夠更好地發展我們的輔助收入。現在就允許動態定價的更複雜的技術而言，我們與第三方供應商合作，我們與一些最好的第三方供應商合作。我想說的是，我們在動態定價以及未來人工智慧為定價和收入管理提供的一切方面都處於起步階段。

So we're not super developed there, but we're going that way, always in a very cost-conscious ROI-focused way, which is the Copa way.

因此，我們在該領域還沒有達到超級發達的水平，但我們正在朝著這個方向發展，始終以一種非常注重成本、注重投資回報率的方式，這就是 Copa 的方式。

I appreciate that, Pedro. That's really helpful color. And then just as a follow-up, would you mind reminding us where you are in your seat densification journey? Congrats on the nice results.

我很感激，佩德羅。這顏色確實很有幫助。然後作為後續問題，您介意提醒我們您在座位緻密化旅程中處於什麼位置嗎？恭喜你取得如此好的成績。

Yes, we are not as advanced as where we should have been right now, and that's because of the delivery delays, which have made us postpone a little bit. But we have, I think, a year to go. Out of our full fleet of 115 or so aircraft, we have 30 aircraft pending to take to 156 seats. So we have 30 aircraft pending in our densification project.

是的，我們現在還沒有達到應有的先進程度，這是因為交貨延遲，這讓我們稍微推遲了一點。但我認為，我們還有一年的時間。我們共有約 115 架飛機，其中 30 架飛機有待改裝，可容納 156 個座位。因此，我們的密集化專案有 30 架飛機待處理。

And I should highlight that our densification project is not sacrificing any of the comfort product advantages we have. We're maintaining a full comfortable real business class with real business class seats of 16 passengers, we're maintaining our four rows of premium economy with 34 pitch and then the rest of the cabin with very comfortable seats, recline, headrest, the whole thing. So we're not sacrificing that.

我要強調的是，我們的緻密化專案不會犧牲我們擁有的任何舒適產品優勢。我們保留了完全舒適的真正商務艙，設有 16 名乘客的真正商務艙座位，我們保留了四排 34 英寸的高級經濟艙，其餘艙位均配備非常舒適的座椅、傾斜度、頭枕等所有設施。所以我們不會犧牲這一點。

I am showing no further questions at this time. I would now like to turn it back to Pedro Heilbron for closing remarks.

我目前沒有其他問題。現在我想請佩德羅·海爾布隆作最後發言。

Thank you, operator, and thank you, James. Thank you all. for your questions and for participating in this call. We appreciate your continued interest and support, as always. And hopefully, very soon, we're going to be confirming an Investor Day, date it's going to be early, hopefully very early December in New York City. So stay tuned, and have a great day.

謝謝接線員，也謝謝詹姆斯。謝謝大家的提問和參加這次電話會議。我們一如既往地感謝您的持續關注和支持。希望我們很快就能確認投資者日，日期是 12 月初，地點在紐約市。請關注，祝您有美好的一天。

Thank you for participating in today's conference. This does conclude the program. You may now disconnect.

感謝大家參加今天的會議。該計劃確實就此結束。您現在可以斷開連線。