Copa Holdings SA (CPA) 2024 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by, and welcome to Copa Holdings second quarter earnings call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this call is being webcast and recorded on August 8, 2024.

女士們、先生們，感謝你們的支持，並歡迎參加 Copa Holdings 第二季財報電話會議。 （操作員說明）謹此提醒，本次通話於 2024 年 8 月 8 日進行網路直播及錄音。

Now I will turn the conference call over to Daniel Tapia, Director of Investor Relations. Sir, you may begin.

現在我將電話會議轉交給投資者關係總監丹尼爾‧塔皮亞(Daniel Tapia)。先生，您可以開始了。

Thank you, [Gigi] and welcome everyone to our second quarter earnings call. Joining us today are Pedro Heilbron, CEO of Copa Holdings, and Jose Montero, our CFO. First, Pedro will start by going over our second quarter highlights, followed by wholesale to discuss our financial results immediately after we will open the call for questions from analysts. Copa Holdings' financial reports have been prepared in accordance with International Financial Reporting Standards.

謝謝你，[Gigi]，歡迎大家參加我們的第二季財報電話會議。今天加入我們的是 Copa Holdings 執行長 Pedro Heilbron 和我們的財務長 Jose Montero。首先，佩德羅將首先回顧我們第二季度的亮點，然後在我們開始徵求分析師提問後立即全面討論我們的財務表現。 Copa Holdings 的財務報告是根據國際財務報告準則編製的。

In today's call, we will discuss non-IFRS financial measures. A reconciliation of the non-IFRS to IFRS financial measures can be found in our earnings release, which has been posted on the company's website, Copa air.com.

在今天的電話會議中，我們將討論非國際財務報告準則的財務指標。非國際財務報告準則與國際財務報告準則財務指標的調節可以在我們的收益報告中找到，該報告已發佈在公司網站 Copa air.com 上。

Our discussion today will also contain forward looking statements not limited to historical facts that reflect the company's current beliefs, expectations and or intentions regarding future events and results. These forward-looking statements involve risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially and are based on assumptions subject to change. Many of these are discussed in our annual report filed with the SEC.

我們今天的討論還將包含前瞻性陳述，不限於反映公司當前對未來事件和結果的信念、期望和/或意圖的歷史事實。這些前瞻性陳述涉及風險和不確定性，可能導致實際結果出現重大差異，並且基於可能變化的假設。其中許多內容在我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的年度報告中進行了討論。

Now I'd like to turn the call over to our CEO, Mr. Pedro Heilbron.

現在我想將電話轉給我們的執行長 Pedro Heilbron 先生。

Thank you, Daniel, and good morning to all and thanks for participating in our second quarter earnings call. Before we begin, I would like to extend my sincere gratitude to all our co-workers for their commitment to the company. Their continuous efforts and dedication has kept Copa at the forefront of Latin American aviation to them, as always, my highest regards and admiration. Once again, we're pleased to report industry-leading financial results for the quarter. As stated in our earnings release yesterday, our 19.5% Q2 operating margin represents the second best Q2 result in the company's history.

謝謝丹尼爾，大家早安，謝謝您參加我們的第二季財報電話會議。在開始之前，我謹向所有同事對公司的奉獻表示誠摯的謝意。他們的持續努力和奉獻使 Copa 始終處於拉丁美洲航空業的最前沿，我一如既往地向他們致以最崇高的敬意和欽佩。我們再次很高興地報告本季業界領先的財務表現。正如我們昨天發布的財報中所述，第二季營業利潤率為 19.5%，是公司歷史上第二好的第二季業績。

Among the main highlights for the quarter. Passenger traffic grew 10.6% compared to the same period in 2023, while capacity increased by 9.7%, resulting in a 0.7 percentage point increase in load factor to 86.8%. Unit costs, excluding fuel, are [CASMex], came in at 5.6%, a 5.8% decrease compared to Q2 2023, mainly driven by lower maintenance costs and sales and distribution costs. Passenger yield came in at $0.121, 8.7% lower year over year. As a result, unit revenues or ration came in at $0.11 or 7.7% lower compared to Q2 '23.

本季度的主要亮點之一。與2023年同期相比，客運量成長10.6%，運能成長9.7%，載客率提高0.7個百分點，達86.8%。單位成本（不含燃料）[CASMex] 為 5.6%，與 2023 年第二季相比下降 5.8%，主要是由於維護成本以及銷售和分銷成本降低。客運收益率為 0.121 美元，年減 8.7%。因此，與 2023 年第二季相比，單位收入或配給量下降了 0.11 美元，即 7.7%。

On the operational front, Copa Airlines delivered an on-time performance of 87.6% and a completion factor of 99.7% for the quarter. Once again, positioning ourselves a month, the best in the industry. Furthermore, Cobalt was recently recognized by [Skytrax] for the ninth consecutive year as the best airline in Central America and the Caribbean. I would like to take this opportunity to recognize our more than 8,000 co-workers who day-in and day-out deliver a world-class travel experience for our customers. Their contributions are key to our success.

在營運方面，巴拿馬航空本季的準點率為 87.6%，完成率為 99.7%。再次將自己定位為行業最佳一個月。此外，Cobalt 最近連續第九年被 [Skytrax] 評為中美洲和加勒比地區最佳航空公司。我想藉此機會向我們 8,000 多名員工表示認可，他們日復一日地為我們的客戶提供世界一流的旅行體驗。他們的貢獻是我們成功的關鍵。

Turning now to our network in the month of June, we started three new destinations, [Raleigh-Durham] in the US Florianópolis in Brazil and two room in Mexico with visitations were now serving 85 destinations in 32 countries, solidifying our leadership position as the hub with the most international destinations in Latin America.

現在轉向我們的網絡，在6 月份，我們啟動了三個新目的地，即美國的[羅利-達勒姆]、巴西的弗洛里亞諾波利斯和墨西哥的兩個房間，目前已為32 個國家的85 個目的地提供服務，鞏固了我們作為拉丁美洲擁有最多國際目的地的樞紐。

With regards to our expectations for the rest of the year as we notified the market last week, on July 29, the Venezuelan government temporarily suspended commercial flights between Venezuela and several countries in the region, including Panama, forcing us to cancel our flight effective July 31, although the official notice mandate the suspension of flights until August 31. At this time, we cannot determine if this suspension will be extended.

關於我們對今年剩餘時間的預期，正如我們上週通知市場的那樣，7月29日，委內瑞拉政府暫時中止了委內瑞拉與包括巴拿馬在內的該地區多個國家之間的商業航班，迫使我們取消了7月起生效的航班。

With regards to cost, we continue to focus on our cost efficiency initiative and expect to deliver lower year-over-year unit cost for 2024 leading us once again to deliver industry-leading margins for the year. For sale will provide more details regarding our outlook.

在成本方面，我們繼續關注成本效率計劃，預計 2024 年單位成本將同比降低，從而使我們今年再次實現行業領先的利潤率。待售將提供有關我們前景的更多詳細資訊。

To summarize, we delivered industry-leading financial results for the second quarter. We continue to deliver on our cost execution strategy. We keep expanding our network now serving 85 destinations across 32 countries, reinforcing Panama's position as the leading hub for international travel in Latin America. And we expect to deliver industry-leading operating margins for the year. As always, our team continues to deliver world-leading operational results while providing world-class service to our passengers. Finally, we firmly believe that our business model remains as robust and relevant as ever and that our hub of the Americas in Panama is the best connecting hub in Latin America, making us the best positioned airline in our region to consistently deliver industry-leading results.

總而言之，我們第二季的財務表現處於業界領先水準。我們繼續實施我們的成本執行策略。我們不斷擴大網絡，目前已為 32 個國家的 85 個目的地提供服務，鞏固了巴拿馬作為拉丁美洲領先國際旅行樞紐的地位。我們預計今年將實現領先業界的營業利潤率。一如既往，我們的團隊繼續提供世界領先的營運成果，同時為乘客提供世界一流的服務。最後，我們堅信，我們的業務模式仍然一如既往地穩健和相關，並且我們在巴拿馬的美洲樞紐是拉丁美洲最好的轉機樞紐，使我們成為本地區處於最佳地位的航空公司，能夠始終如一地提供業界領先的業績。

Now I'll turn over the call to Jose, who will go over financial results in more detail.

現在我將把電話轉給何塞，他將更詳細地討論財務表現。

Thank you, Pedro. Good morning, everyone, and thanks for being with us today. I'd like to join data in acknowledging our great team for all their efforts to deliver world-class service to our passengers.

謝謝你，佩德羅。大家早安，感謝您今天和我們在一起。我想與數據一起感謝我們偉大的團隊為向乘客提供世界一流的服務所做的一切努力。

I will start by going over our second quarter results. We reported a net profit for the quarter of $120.3 million or $2.88 per share. We reported a quarterly operating profit of $159.5 million, an operating margin of 19.5% in what is our seasonally lowest quarter of the year. Capacity came in at $7.4 billion available seat miles or 9.7% higher than in Q2 2023. Load factor came in at 86.8% for the quarter at 0.7 percentage point increase compared to the same period in 2023. Passenger yields decreased by 8.7% to [$12.1], mostly due to a revision of the unredeemed ticket revenue provision for tickets sold during the year 2024.

我首先回顧我們第二季的業績。我們報告本季淨利潤為 1.203 億美元，即每股 2.88 美元。我們報告的季度營業利潤為 1.595 億美元，營業利潤率為 19.5%，這是我們今年季節性最低的季度。運力為74 億美元的可用座位里程，比2023 年第二季高出9.7%。 12.1 美元] ]，主要是由於對 2024 年出售的門票的未兌換門票收入準備金進行了修訂。

As a result, unit revenues came in at $0.11 or 7.7% lower than in the second quarter of 2023. Excluding the revision related to the unredeemed ticket revenues, rather them would have decreased by 3.8% to 11.5 unit costs. Our CASM decreased to [$8.9 cents] or 2.1% lower year-over-year. And finally, our CASM, excluding fuel, came in at [$5.6 cents], a 5.8% decrease versus Q2 2023, mainly driven by lower aircraft maintenance costs due to an adjustment in leased aircraft return provisions of nine aircraft leases, which we extended during the quarter as well as lower sales and distribution costs due to the higher penetration of both direct channels and the lower cost NDC travel agency.

因此，單位收入比 2023 年第二季下降 0.11 美元，即 7.7%。 如果不包括與未兌換門票收入相關的修正，單位成本將下降 3.8%，至 11.5 單位成本。我們的 CASM 下降至 [8.9 美分]，年減 2.1%。最後，我們的CASM（不包括燃料）為[5.6 美分]，與2023 年第二季度相比下降了5.8%，這主要是由於我們對九架飛機租賃的租賃飛機返還條款進行了調整，導致飛機維護成本降低，我們在2023 年延長了這些條款。

Excluding the adjustment in leased aircraft return provisions, the company would have reported an ex-fuel CASM of [$5.8 cents] for the quarter, a 1.7% decrease year-over-year. Now I'm going to spend some time discussing our balance sheet and liquidity. As of the end of the second quarter, we had assets of close to $5.4 billion to cash short and long-term investments we ended the quarter with over $1.2 billion, which represents 35% of our last 12 months revenues.

如果不包括租賃飛機返還條款的調整，該公司本季的除燃油 CASM 為 [5.8 美分]，年減 1.7%。現在我將花一些時間討論我們的資產負債表和流動性。截至第二季末，我們擁有近 54 億美元的資產用於兌現短期和長期投資，本季結束時我們的資產超過 12 億美元，占我們過去 12 個月收入的 35%。

And in terms of debt, we ended the quarter with $1.8 billion of debt and lease liabilities came in with an adjusted net debt to EBITDA ratio of 0.6 times. I'm pleased to report that our average cost of debt, which continues to be comprised solely of aircraft-related debt is currently in the range of 3.6%. We have around 70% of our debt being fixed.

就債務而言，本季末我們的債務和租賃負債為 18 億美元，調整後的淨債務與 EBITDA 比率為 0.6 倍。我很高興地報告，我們的平均債務成本（仍然僅由飛機相關債務組成）目前在 3.6% 的範圍內。我們大約 70% 的債務得到了修復。

Turning now to our fleet. During the quarter, we received 3.73, so MAX 9 aircraft, ending the second quarter with a total fleet of 109 aircraft comprised of $0.68, three seven eight hundred's, $0.32 percent MAX 9 and [737-700s]. These figures include [737-800] freighter and the [9737-800] hundred's operated by Wingo. Also in the month of July, we received our first Boeing 7% MAX 8, increasing our total fleet size to 110 aircraft. Regarding the deliveries for the remainder of the year. Recently, Boeing notified us of further delays to a 2024 delivery stream.

現在轉向我們的艦隊。本季度，我們收到了3.73 架MAX 9 飛機，第二季末，機隊總數為109 架飛機，其中0.68 架飛機，三七八百架，0.32% 的MAX 9 和[737-700s] 。這些數字包括由 Wingo 營運的 [737-800] 貨輪和 [9737-800] 百架貨輪。同樣在 7 月份，我們收到了第一架波音 7% MAX 8，將我們的機隊總規模增加到 110 架。關於今年剩餘時間的交付情況。最近，波音公司通知我們 2024 年的交付流程將進一步延遲。

And now we expect to receive only two additional MAX 8 during the remainder of the year to end the year with a total fleet size of 112 aircraft instead of 115 mentioned during last quarter's call. In terms of financing, we have already secured local financing for these deliveries as well as for the first three deliveries of 2025. As for 2025 fleet plan. We currently expect to receive 15 aircraft for the year, all Boeing 7% MAX 8. As mentioned before, we extended all of our nine operating leases expiring next year. Additionally, as contemplated in an up updated fleet plan, we expect to retire two of our Boeing 737-800 to end the year with a fleet of 125 aircraft.

現在，我們預計在今年剩餘時間內僅再接收兩架 MAX 8，直至年底，機隊總規模為 112 架飛機，而不是上季度電話會議中提到的 115 架。在融資方面，我們已經為這些交付以及2025年的前三架交付獲得了當地融資。目前，我們預計今年將接收 15 架飛機，其中 7% 均為波音 MAX 8。此外，根據更新後的機隊計劃，我們預計將退役兩架波音 737-800 飛機，到年底，機隊將擁有 125 架飛機。

Turning now to the return of value to our shareholders, I'm pleased to announce that the company will make its third dividend payment of the year $1.61 per share on September 13 to all shareholders of record as of August 30.

現在談到股東價值回報，我很高興地宣布，公司將於 9 月 13 日向截至 8 月 30 日在冊的所有股東支付本年度第三次股息，每股 1.61 美元。

As to our guidance, we can provide the following update for the full year 2024 due to the temporary suspension of our Panama Venezuela flights. We now expect to increase our capacity in ASMs to approximately 9% year-over-year instead of our previous expectation of approximately 10%. And we reaffirm our operating margin guidance to be within the range of 21% to 23%. We are basing our outlook on the following assumptions load factor of approximately 86.5% unit revenues in the range of [$11.5 cents], which account for the unexpected Venezuelan capacity reductions, weaker currencies in the region and a lower fuel cost environment. CASM ex-fuel in the range of [$0.059]. And we are now expecting an all-in fuel price of $2.70 per gallon.

至於我們的指導，由於我們的巴拿馬委內瑞拉航班暫時停飛，我們可以提供 2024 年全年的以下更新。我們現在預計 ASM 產能將年比增加至約 9%，而不是先前約 10% 的預期。我們重申營業利潤率指引在 21% 至 23% 的範圍內。我們的前景基於以下假設，單位收入約為 86.5%，範圍在 [11.5 美分] 範圍內，這是考慮到委內瑞拉產能意外減少、該地區貨幣疲軟以及燃料成本降低的環境。 CASM 不含燃料，範圍為 [$0.059]。我們現在預計總燃油價格為每加侖 2.70 美元。

Lastly, as you already know, last month after a career spanning over 30 years at Copa, I announced my decision to retire from the company by the end of 2024 being part of a Copa team here has been one of the joys of my life. Our companies in great form consistently delivering strong financial results with unit costs at the lowest level they have ever been while continuing to build our very strong balance sheet and returning value to the shareholders. We're currently engaged in an internal and an external search for my replacement, and I will remain with the company in an advisory role after my successful and my successor is named to assist with a smooth transition. Thank you.

最後，如你所知，在 Copa 工作了 30 多年後，上個月我宣布決定在 2024 年底從公司退休，成為 Copa 團隊的一員一直是我一生的樂趣之一。我們的公司狀況良好，始終如一地提供強勁的財務業績，單位成本處於歷史最低水平，同時繼續建立我們非常強大的資產負債表並為股東回報價值。我們目前正在內部和外部尋找我的繼任者，在我成功任命我的繼任者後，我將繼續在公司擔任顧問角色，以協助順利過渡。謝謝。

And with that, we'll open the call to some questions.

接下來，我們將開始詢問一些問題。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

Savi Syth, Raymond James.

薩維·賽斯，雷蒙德·詹姆斯。

Hey, good morning, everyone. And I guess congratulations on getting some time off from the airline world, Jose and the fix and up. And maybe can I ask on the and Venezuela, slight Ascension impacts, like how you're thinking about the impact, given the uncertainty that you alluded to, just what's in the guidance in terms of kind of how long this impacts and what kind of pressure it puts on unit revenue in the third quarter?

嘿，大家早安。我想恭喜你從航空界休息了一段時間，何塞和修復工作等等。也許我可以問一下關於委內瑞拉和委內瑞拉的輕微揚升影響，例如你如何看待這種影響，考慮到你提到的不確定性，指南中的內容包括這種影響的持續時間和影響的類型。第三季的單位收入造成壓力嗎？

Sure, Savi, and thank you for your for your good wishes there. And so let me start by saying that the Venezuela impact is included in the guidance. And we have taken a conservative assumption in terms of their capacity and their recent guidance here. And we assume that there will be a build up of the capacity related to Venezuela, either in Venezuela after August for on alternative markets. And the reason why the build up of capacities over a period of time, it will be a ramp-up of that capacity is because the flights we tend to sell. So but we expect basically to be back at full capacity by the center, let's say, in a ramp-up to occur between September and December. So that's and it's all again, just to reiterate, it's all included in the guidance, both in the capacity guidance on [interest] guidance.

當然，薩維，謝謝你的良好祝愿。首先我要說的是，委內瑞拉的影響力已包含在指南中。我們對他們的能力和最近的指導採取了保守的假設。我們假設與委內瑞拉相關的產能將會增加，無論是在八月之後在委內瑞拉的替代市場上。之所以在一段時間內增加運力，是因為我們傾向於銷售航班。因此，我們預計該中心基本上會恢復滿載運轉，比如說，在 9 月至 12 月之間進行加速。所以，這就是全部，只是重申一下，這一切都包含在指南中，包括在[興趣]指南的能力指南中。

As I said, that the impact is across second half is what you have here?

正如我所說，下半年的影響就是你在這裡所看到的？

Yes,

是的，

And not just Turkey makes sense. What can I say year-over-year Yes. And just if I might on the on the demand side, you've seen some meaningful in a local currency devaluation against US Dollar over the last several months. Are you seeing any perhaps either because of that or weakening of the economy, has any impact on demand or any change in point of sale direction?

不只是土耳其才有意義。年復一年我能說什麼是的。就需求而言，您已經看到過去幾個月當地貨幣兌美元貶值帶來的一些有意義的影響。您是否認為由於經濟疲軟或經濟疲軟而對需求產生任何影響或銷售點方向發生任何變化？

Hi, Savi. Its Pedro. So of course, the Venezuela impact is immediate, a we are a network or line. So it affects beyond just the on the Panama Venezuela and having to cancel from one day to the other that that has an impact in our in our whole network. So it's in the guidance already for Q3 and the rest of the year, as Jose will mention. And then that also is combined with the weaker currency. That is that you alluded to it, which is affecting mostly Brazil, which is the most important market for anyone in South America and actually in Latin America. So that's the main impact we're dealing with. It also has a network impact in our case, otherwise demand, it's okay in spite of a lot of capacity growth it's from the industry in general.

嗨，薩維。是佩德羅。當然，委內瑞拉的影響是立竿見影的，因為我們是一個網路或線路。因此，它影響的不僅是巴拿馬和委內瑞拉，而且不得不日復一日地取消，這對我們整個網路都有影響。因此，正如何塞將提到的那樣，它已經在第三季和今年剩餘時間的指導中。然後這也與疲軟的貨幣結合。這就是你提到的，這主要影響巴西，對南美洲乃至拉丁美洲的任何人來說，巴西都是最重要的市場。這就是我們正在應對的主要影響。在我們的案例中，它也會對網路產生影響，否則需求就可以了，儘管整個產業的產能成長很大。

That's helpful. Thank you.

這很有幫助。謝謝。

Duane Pfennigwerth, Evercore ISI.

杜安‧芬尼格沃斯 (Duane Pfennigwerth)，Evercore ISI。

Hey, guys. Good morning and Jose. I don't know why you'd ever want to leave this industry. I think you're crazy.

嘿，夥計們。早安，何塞。我不知道你為什麼想離開這個行業。我認為你瘋了。

We agreed.

我們同意了。

Just to follow up on Savi's question is this is this a utilization hit? Or do you actually have aircraft parked at this time? And just maybe don't want to split hairs on your words, but you're assuming that by December this capacity is reallocated to Venezuela or to somewhere else in the network. Is that is that the right way to think about it?

只是為了跟進 Savi 的問題，這是否是一個利用率打擊？或是此時確實有飛機停放嗎？也許只是不想在你的話上吹毛求疵，但你假設到 12 月，這個容量會重新分配給委內瑞拉或網路中的其他地方。這是正確的思考方式嗎？

Sure. Yes, absolutely. That's the way to think about and there will be a ramp-up. So it's not like we will have the ability to redeploy everything immediately, but we're assuming that there's a ramp up of that capacity, but that essentially will be either Venezuela as well or somewhere else by the by the final part of the year. And so yes, and it's I think conservative is conservative in nature. But what have we done.

當然。是的，絕對是。這就是思考的方式，並且將會有一個加速。因此，我們並不是有能力立即重新部署一切，但我們假設這種能力會增加，但到今年年底，這基本上要么是委內瑞拉，要么是其他地方。所以是的，我認為保守本質上就是保守。但我們做了什麼。

Okay. And then just on the one of the things you called out in the release, this changed to an unredeemed ticket revenue provision. Can you just explain what that is and what changed and if that impact kind of continues?

好的。然後就你在新聞稿中指出的一件事，這變成了未兌換的門票收入條款。您能否解釋一下這是什麼以及發生了什麼變化以及這種影響是否會持續？

Yes, Duane. So it's a indeed as a revision to the unredeemed ticket revenue provision bad, we have four tickets that we sell or we are selling in the year 2024. So following IFRS 15 standards, we apply for every dollar sales replace unredeemed ticket factor. And then that gets reconciled after a year once the ticket just expire. And so what we did this year, just based upon observed behaviour, we reduced and somewhat the factory that we use so there is an assumption that there is a lesser percentage of tickets and that will expire next year.

是的，杜安。因此，這確實是對未兌換門票收入準備金的修訂，我們在 2024 年出售或正在出售四張門票。一年後，一旦票證到期，一切就會得到協調。因此，我們今年所做的，只是根據觀察到的行為，我們減少了我們使用的工廠，因此我們假設門票的比例較低，並且將於明年到期。

And so and we will therefore have to be in the factory were somewhat down and included that here. That's something that happens every year. But in this particular year, we just saw a difference in the behaviour of X5 group, and that's all included in the guidance is contemplated in the guidance and the revenue guidance as well. So it's something that we've included in there.

因此，我們必須在工廠中進行一些下降，並將其包含在這裡。這是每年都會發生的事情。但在這個特定的年份，我們剛剛看到 X5 集團的行為有所不同，這一切都包含在指導中，也包含在指導和收入指導中。所以我們已經將其包含在其中。

Okay. So maybe a way to think about it is less breakage, less breakage or lower assumed breakage going forward. And so that's it. That's a 2Q through, you know, the next 12 months impact. So that would impact the that's in this back half as well.

好的。因此，也許一種思考方式是減少破損、減少破損或降低未來的假設破損。就是這樣。你知道，這是第二季對未來 12 個月的影響。所以這也會影響後半部的內容。

So you've got an 18 sites, including the rest of guidance for the full year that we could be there.

所以你有 18 個地點，包括我們可能在那裡的全年指導的其餘部分。

Yes. Okay. Thank you very much.

是的。好的。非常感謝。

Gail Glazerman Mendez, JP Morgan.

蓋爾·格雷澤曼·門德斯，摩根大通。

Good morning. Good afternoon, everyone. Thanks for taking my question and best wishes. So Jose, on your new endeavours as well. And I have just a follow-up on the on the first question, I guess, you mentioned about demand still resilient despite all the capacity increase in the region. My question is, did you see any kind of oversupply in any of the markets that you guys operate or how comfortable are you with the yield assumptions you have for the upcoming quarters? Thank you.

早安.大家下午好。感謝您提出我的問題並致以最美好的祝愿。何塞，也談談你的新努力。我想，我想對第一個問題進行跟進，您提到儘管該地區的產能有所增加，但需求仍然具有彈性。我的問題是，你們經營的市場是否出現了任何供應過剩的情況，或者你們對未來幾季的收益率假設是否滿意？謝謝。

Okay. So I mean, it's what you're saying cannot be ignored. So there's always going to be more pressure on yields when when demand is growing at the pace that it has grown in Latin America, but the seats are being filled in load factors are not hurting in general terms, at least not in our case but when you add that up to other factors like likely weaker currencies, which by the way, the weaker currencies are, it's right now in a month could be different. It could strengthen again. And so we're not saying this is like a we're forecasting the year, but things could change. But if we had in growing capacity to the other factors I mentioned yes, there's going to be there's always going to be some impact on yields, but that's all factoring in our guidance.

好的。所以我的意思是，你所說的不容忽視。因此，當需求以拉丁美洲的成長速度成長時，收益率總是會面臨更大的壓力，但總體而言，載客率的席位填補並沒有受到損害，至少在我們的情況下不是這樣，但當你再加上其他因素，例如貨幣可能走弱，順便說一句，貨幣走弱，一個月後情況可能會有所不同。它可能會再次走強。因此，我們並不是說這就像我們預測的那樣，但情況可能會改變。但如果我們能夠提高我提到的其他因素的能力，是的，總是會對收益率產生一些影響，但這都是我們指導中考慮的因素。

A super clear. Thank you. And maybe a follow-up on this you mentioned about ending 2025 with nearly 10%. Fleet addition does imply that we can assume a lower yield in 2025 when compared to '24, giving us additional capacity where we're growing.

超級清晰。謝謝。也許是您提到的關於 2025 年結束時接近 10% 的後續行動。機隊的增加確實意味著我們可以假設 2025 年的產量將低於 24 年，為我們的成長提供額外的產能。

We're growing capacity in a measured way, and we're actually growing probably half what others are growing in our part of the world, and we're growing growing according to the needs. We have the opportunities we see a within our network. We're not trying to paid land from anyone else. And again, it's measured to our opportunity and to our network have what the industry in general is growing. So we're very, very comfortable with that. Plus we have a lot of flexibility to adjust along the way we can park, the 700 and harvest the engines or we can I keep them flying depending also on Boeing deliveries. So we have a lot of a lot of flexibility we feel.

我們正在以一種有節制的方式成長產能，實際上我們的成長量可能是我們所在地區其他國家成長量的一半，而且我們正在根據需求進行成長。我們在我們的網絡中看到了機會。我們並不是想向其他人支付土地費用。再說一次，它是根據我們的機會和我們的網路是否擁有整個行業的成長來衡量的。所以我們對此非常非常滿意。另外，我們有很大的靈活性來調整我們可以停放 700 並收穫發動機，或者我們可以讓它們繼續飛行，這也取決於波音的交付情況。所以我們感覺有很大的靈活性。

And we are profitability driven company. So so we'll make the best decisions we can to make sure that we maximize our profitability. And by the way, we have any guidance for 2025 yet. So stay tuned for that one. And you know our prelim guidance in November and then the full guidance in the February call.

我們是獲利驅動的公司。因此，我們將做出最好的決策，以確保我們的獲利能力最大化。順便說一句，我們還沒有 2025 年的指導。所以請繼續關注這一點。您知道我們 11 月的初步指導，以及 2 月電話會議的完整指導。

Very clear. Thank you both.

非常清楚。謝謝你們倆。

Thank you, Guil.

謝謝你，吉爾。

Stephen Trent, Citi.

史蒂芬‧特倫特，花旗銀行。

Yes, [Jose], good morning, gentlemen, and thanks for the time. And Pedro, I think still you know best wishes to you and thanks for all those times on the road and what have you? I really appreciate that, and thank you. And I was curious, just on thinking about to some extent. A follow-up on Gary's question in a different way. What do you look at your opportunities to grow? Any a high-level view on a, let's say, surfacing new destinations versus increasing frequencies to existing destinations or may be upgrading equipment or something along those lines?

是的，[何塞]，早安，先生們，感謝您抽出寶貴的時間。佩德羅，我想你仍然知道對你最良好的祝愿，感謝你在路上度過的所有時光，你有什麼？我真的很感激，也謝謝你們。我很好奇，只是在某種程度上思考。以不同的方式跟進加里的問題。您如何看待自己的成長機會？比方說，對於增加新目的地與增加現有目的地的班次或可能升級設備或類似的事情有什麼高層看法嗎？

I don't think this is Stephen. Pedro here. I don't think it's going to change much from what we've done in the past. Usually, you know, plus or minus 80% of our Asian growth comes from existing destinations, but additional frequencies and then the difference or new frequencies for new destinations both during the year that ratio won't change from March this year, we've added three destinations so far. Maybe we'll will to add a fourth one by the end of the year, and we expect something similar in the come in the coming years, somewhere between three and five new destinations each year as the region grows and our hub develops. We feel we have a plenty of opportunities, including increasing our daily frequencies where we also have opportunities valuable opportunities.

我不認為這就是史蒂芬。佩德羅在這裡。我認為我們過去所做的事情不會有太大改變。通常，您知道，我們亞洲成長的正負80% 來自現有目的地，但額外的班次以及新目的地的差異或新班次在這一年中這一比例從今年3 月起不會改變，我們已經到目前為止已增加三個目的地。也許我們會在今年年底前增加第四個目的地，我們預計未來幾年會出現類似的情況，隨著該地區的發展和我們的樞紐的發展，每年都會增加三到五個新目的地。我們覺得我們有很多機會，包括增加我們的日常頻率，我們也有機會，寶貴的機會。

Okay. That's super helpful, Pedro. Thank you very much on. And just one quick follow up here and I appreciate what you guys mentioned on Venezuela recently that's been a bit of chop in Ecuador and what have you on a high level, do the other sort of broad markets you guys serve or are we talking about relatively commerce situations where it, you know, more business as usual.

好的。這非常有幫助，佩德羅。非常感謝您。這裡只是一個快速的跟進，我很欣賞你們最近提到的委內瑞拉問題，厄瓜多爾的問題，以及你們在高級別上有什麼，你們服務的其他廣泛市場，或者我們正在談論相對你知道，在商業環境中，一切照常進行。

The rest of yes, even in reality, there isn't really any other country that has any sort of non more political type of situation right now that is of concern and you know, and there will always be something. There will always be something in our part of the world. We are born and raised in this part of the world, and we're used to all of this and we've been successful in the highs and lows, and we're comfortable knowing that, you know, it's for dealing with today's crisis. There will be a new one tomorrow and we'll strive always to run a company that can succeed beyond that.

其餘的，是的，即使在現實中，目前也沒有任何其他國家存在任何非政治性的局勢值得關注，而且你知道，而且總是會有一些事情。在我們的世界裡總是會有一些東西。我們在這個世界的這個地區出生和長大，我們已經習慣了這一切，我們在高潮和低潮中都取得了成功，我們很高興知道，你知道，這是為了應對當今的危機。明天將會有一個新的公司，我們將始終努力經營一家能夠超越這個目標的公司。

Yes. So great color, Pedro, in the developed market carriers that would love to do half of what you guys do so thanks very much.

是的。佩德羅，如此出色的色彩，在已開發市場的運營商中，他們願意做你們所做的一半，所以非常感謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

[Joel Frito, from Goldman Sachs].

[喬爾·弗里托，來自高盛]。

Hey, Good morning, guys. Thanks for taking my questions. I have two quick follow-ups. The first one relates to Venezuela. So you put out on the release that the capacity amounts of roughly 2% of your total capacity. I just wanted to double check if this is the same case for revenues or if it's a higher or lower amount?

嘿，早上好，夥計們。感謝您回答我的問題。我有兩個快速跟進。第一個與委內瑞拉有關。因此，您發布的容量大約佔總容量的 2%。我只是想仔細檢查收入狀況是否相同，或者金額是否更高或更低？

And then on the second points related to the unredeemed ticket provisions, you guys did the revision in the recovery rates rise of the non-music ticket, but you have already sold a portion of the tickets for this year. Distribution in the second quarter is only related to the second quarter itself or it already accounts for some of the tickets you guys sold for the second half, meaning the impact could be lower in the second half of the year on the revenue side? Thank you very much.

然後關於第二點有關未兌換門票的規定，你們對非音樂門票的回收率上漲進行了修改，但今年的門票已經賣掉了一部分。第二季的分配只與第二季本身有關，或者已經佔了你們下半年售出的一些門票，這意味著下半年對收入的影響可能會較小？非常感謝。

Yes, [John], I'll do the second part first. It is actually a catch-up of the first half of the year. The second and third quarter won't really have that much of a significant impact because of [Zohr] and again, as I mentioned before, is included in the guidance for that's a good callout and indeed, the figure was also a little bit higher because in the second quarter of 2024, we included the assumption for both the first and the second quarter of the year. In terms of your first question was what's always going to happen in a network carrier like like gold price that we when we talk about a century, we're talking Panama, Venezuela, a sense and those are relatively short hauls.

是的，[約翰]，我會先做第二部分。實際上是對上半年的追趕。第二季和第三季不會真正產生那麼大的重大影響，因為[Zohr]，正如我之前提到的，它被包含在指導中，這是一個很好的標註，事實上，這個數字也有點高因為在 2024 年第二季度，我們納入了該年第一季和第二季的假設。就你的第一個問題而言，像金價這樣的網路營運商總是會發生什麼，當我們談論一個世紀時，我們談論的是巴拿馬、委內瑞拉，從某種意義上說，這些都是相對較短的運輸。

When we talk about revenues, we're talking about home network revenues, passengers originating in Venezuela or with destination Venezuela that go toward pump from all over our network. So those are going to be much longer hauls. So revenues are going to always be much higher than a sense in any similar situation. So we can say that revenues are going to be a little bit over doubles and just because it's short haul connecting it to long haul.

當我們談論收入時，我們談論的是家庭網路收入、源自委內瑞拉或目的地委內瑞拉的乘客，這些乘客從我們的整個網路流向泵站。所以這些將是更長的距離。因此，收入總是比任何類似情況下的感覺要高得多。因此，我們可以說，收入將增加一倍多一點，只是因為短途航班將其與長途航班連接起來。

Thank you. And again, it's showing the guidance, the impact is all in the guidance yet for clear. Thank you.

謝謝。再說一遍，它顯示了指導意見，影響全部在指導意見中，但尚未明確。謝謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Michael Linenberg, Deutsche Bank.

麥可‧林伯格，德意志銀行。

Oh hey, I'm Good morning, everyone. And Jose, I echo what's been previously of you're going to be missed by the investment community, so congratulations on your new move and you might my new well, we're basically going to do a lot of your work in my house and E&O and D&O, you may have and then lien on it. So I bit very nice anyway back to us on the Q&A on. I have a couple here. I didn't see anything in the release just around Boeing compensation on the MAX 9 grounding. I think last quarter, I think you had said that you I'd get to reach an agreement on. We're now looking at a year's loss of capacity. I think coming into this year, we thought your fleet was going to be 121 airplanes. It now looks like we're not going to get there until the end of 2025. How should we think about that compensation, does it even ever show up in the numbers on maybe it shows up in the cash flow? So I guess the question is, have you have you reached an agreement on that or is that still in the works?

喔嘿，我是大家早安。何塞，我同意之前的說法，投資界會懷念你，所以祝賀你的新舉動，你可能會成為我的新井，我們基本上會在我家裡做你的很多工作， E&O 和D&O，您可能擁有並留置它。所以我還是很高興在問答環節回覆了我們。我這裡有一對。我在新聞稿中沒有看到任何有關波音 MAX 9 停飛賠償的內容。我想上個季度，你曾說過我會就此達成協議。我們現在正在考慮一年的產能損失。我認為進入今年，我們認為你們的機隊將有 121 架飛機。現在看起來我們要到 2025 年底才能實現這一目標。所以我想問題是，你們是否已經就此達成協議，或仍在進行中？

And my guess is that's a very important question. Yes, we have reached agreement. I think it's a fair agreement. The agreement is of a confidential nature, but I need a fair and the way that accounting works, unfortunately, you can't claim like the benefit in one particular quarter. You have to. So we'll see. I think in summarize it terms, we'll see the impact on the D&A line on a smaller impact on the D&A line over the next call it, four years. So that's how it works because you basically book any benefit that you got from the agreement with them against the aircraft would say on the property, plant and equipment line I may you that flows through the P&L through the G&A line, and we expect that to flow through the P&L over the next four years.

我的猜測是這是一個非常重要的問題。是的，我們已經達成協議。我認為這是一個公平的協議。該協議具有保密性質，但我需要一種公平的會計工作方式，不幸的是，您不能在某個特定季度聲稱獲得這樣的好處。你必須這樣做。所以我們拭目以待。我認為總而言之，我們將看到對 D&A 線的影響在接下來的四年內對 D&A 線的影響較小。這就是它的運作方式，因為您基本上將從與飛機簽訂的協議中獲得的任何收益記入財產、廠房和設備行，我可能會通過 G&A 行流經損益表，我們希望流經未來四年的損益表。

Is it fair to say that it may be a smaller impact on the P&L, but maybe a larger on the cash flow because things like PDPs get pushed back. I mean the fact that you're not getting airplanes yet.

公平地說，這對損益表的影響可能較小，但對現金流的影響可能較大，因為像 PDP 這樣的事情會被推遲。我的意思是你還沒有得到飛機。

There's a portion there as well. Of course, [Kessel].

那裡也有一部分。當然，[凱塞爾]。

Okay, great. And then just my second question. When we looked at kind of the competitive backdrop I know there were a few questions asked about oversupply. I you know, I look at the Copa network and with the exception, I guess of Porto Allegro because of the floods in the airport closure. I don't see any route cancellations. But then when I look at Wingo based in Colombia and I kind of look at this year, there are a lot of routes that look like they're either being cancelled and there is a bit of churn there. And I presume that that's in response to just the competitive backdrop in Colombia, which may be a little bit more on, you know, intense than say what you're seeing on. Can you can you talk about that and maybe what you're seeing in that market? Thank you.

好的，太好了。然後是我的第二個問題。當我們審視競爭背景時，我知道有人提出了一些關於供應過剩的問題。我你知道，我查看了 Copa 網絡，但我猜是 Porto Allegro，因為機場關閉時發生了洪水。我沒有看到任何航線取消。但當我看看總部位於哥倫比亞的 Wingo 時，我看看今年，有很多航線看起來要么被取消，要么有一些流失。我認為這只是對哥倫比亞競爭背景的回應，你知道，這可能比你所看到的更激烈。您能談談這個問題以及您在該市場中看到的情況嗎？謝謝。

Yes, hi. Pedro here. And you're right, you kind of answered the question. The Colombia market is very, very competitive, very intense and in lower yield. And so Wingo is constantly adjusting to market trends and to competition and where we are and where the opportunities are. So a year ago, they shifted a lot of capacity from international to domestic And lately, they have readjusted that a little for a little bit more international reduced domestic somewhat facial. So they're always adjusting to the market opportunity to remain profitable and successful. And and also conservative there. And they are again in a market that's been so volatile as they've tried to just be conservative and keep things under control. And that's been their formula to do well and and fill a niche in that very competitive market.

是的，嗨。佩德羅在這裡。你是對的，你已經回答了這個問題。哥倫比亞市場競爭非常非常激烈，而且產量較低。因此，Wingo 不斷根據市場趨勢和競爭以及我們所處的位置和機會進行調整。因此，一年前，他們將大量產能從國際轉移到國內。因此，他們總是根據市場機會進行調整，以保持盈利和成功。而且那裡也很保守。他們再次身處一個如此波動的市場，因為他們試圖保持保守並控制局勢。這就是他們在競爭激烈的市場中取得好成績並佔據一席之地的秘訣。

Okay. That's helpful. Pedro, if I could just squeeze one last one in on the share repurchase program, it did look like the shares were down a little bit. Was there any activity in this quarter, Jose and with your cash or liquidity at 35% of LTM revenue, should we be primed for maybe a follow-on? Or is that maybe a bit aggressive on my thinking? Thank you again, thanks for everything,

好的。這很有幫助。佩德羅，如果我能在股票回購計畫中擠出最後一點，看起來股價確實下跌了一點。 Jose，本季有任何活動嗎？或者這可能對我的想法有點激進？再次感謝你，感謝你所做的一切，

There was a deferral was actually revolve around $10 million worth of shares. And the first quarter we had bought some more. So so yes, we're of course, we have a lot of means by which we return value to our shareholders, including our dividend, but we also are a growing company. So we have a lot of aircraft coming over the next couple of years. And we also have to make sure that that we will fund the PDPs and et cetera, for our growth. So and we've also been actively buying leases. We have been actively buying aircraft. So we've deploy capital in different ways or over the year 2024.

延期實際上是圍繞著價值 1000 萬美元的股票進行的。第一季我們買了更多。所以，是的，我們當然有很多方法可以向股東回報價值，包括股息，但我們也是一家成長中的公司。因此，未來幾年我們將推出大量飛機。我們還必須確保為 PDP 等提供資金，以促進我們的發展。因此，我們也一直在積極購買租賃。我們一直在積極購買飛機。因此，我們在 2024 年以不同的方式部署資本。

Great. Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。

Alberto Valerio, UBS.

阿爾貝托·瓦萊裡奧，瑞銀集團。

I monitor gentlemen's, Pedro and Jose has a good look for the new site. I hope to see you around some sports events maybe as one might have. But my question's regarding the within that limited ticket, if there is any specific event that caused this a change in the behavior of the consumer?

我監視先生們，佩德羅和何塞對新網站有很好的看法。我希望能在一些體育賽事中見到你，也許就像人們可能會遇到的那樣。但我的問題是在有限的門票內，是否有任何特定事件導致消費者行為改變？

And my second question is whether your guidance is considering a further deterioration in the American market and some shift of the aircraft to Latin market. Thank you very much

我的第二個問題是，您的指導是否正在考慮美國市場的進一步惡化以及飛機向拉丁市場的轉移。非常感謝

And no particular consideration of a shift in the network in general terms, I think we expect the network to remain fundamental and the same in the same way. And in terms of the first question, it wasn't really an event. I mean, this happens every year and the board in particular, I think that the cause was that we decided to make this sort of almost, I say, retroactive because it's still part of 2024 but we just decided to be conservative in our approach in terms of the we are winning ticket revenue factor that we use.

一般而言，沒有特別考慮網路的轉變，我認為我們希望網路保持基本不變並以同樣的方式保持不變。就第一個問題而言，這並不是一個真正的事件。我的意思是，這種情況每年都會發生，特別是董事會，我認為原因是我們決定進行這種追溯，因為它仍然是 2024 年的一部分，但我們只是決定在我們的方法中保持保守我們使用的“我們正在贏得門票收入”因素。

Okay. Thank you very much.

好的。非常感謝。

Daniel McKenzie from Seaport Global.

海港全球公司的丹尼爾·麥肯齊。

Oh, hey, Hi, Jose. Congrats. I'm going out on a great run it. So it's been great working with you over the years. So I'm enjoying your arms. Yes, the couple of questions here. The plan to use the balance sheet in liquidity position to strengthen your competitive position, reinforcing network and product I'm going back to the press release. My first question is if this might mean an investment in another airline that might be in distress right now. First question and then what up or what opportunities are you seeing? And then how would you be how are you valuing that these potential opportunities? It would be great if you just elaborate a little bit more here.

哦，嘿，嗨，何塞。恭喜。我要出去跑得很好。所以這些年來與您的合作非常愉快。所以我很享受你的懷抱。是的，這裡有幾個問題。使用流動性資產負債表來增強競爭地位、增強網路和產品的計劃我將回到新聞稿。我的第一個問題是，這是否意味著對另一家目前可能陷入困境的航空公司進行投資。第一個問題，然後你看到什麼進展或機會？那麼您如何評價這些潛在機會呢？如果您能在這裡詳細說明一下，那就太好了。

I'll answer that one, then we usually don't play in that market and but we wouldn't comment either if we were doing something so simple. But if you look at our track record record. We've always been very conservative and grown organically. So I don't see that changing much in the future. But of course, we always be on, you know, we always be alert for any opportunity. And we did purchase at an airline in Colombia in 19 years, 19 years ago, which is now Wingo. So we've done it before, and we will always be alert, but we're a conservative operator when we look, you know, so to our past.

我會回答這個問題，然後我們通常不參與該市場，但如果我們做如此簡單的事情，我們不會發表評論。但如果你看看我們的往績記錄。我們一直非常保守並且有機地成長。所以我認為未來這種情況不會有太大改變。但當然，我們總是在，你知道，我們總是對任何機會保持警覺。我們在19年，19年前，確實在哥倫比亞的一家航空公司購買過，就是現在的Wingo。所以我們以前就這麼做過，我們會一直保持警惕，但當我們回顧過去時，我們是一個保守的經營者。

Yes, understood. Okay. And second question here is I wonder if you can elaborate a little bit more on NDC, it seems to be driving revenue and cost savings. So I'm curious what percent of the tickets you're upselling today, what percent of the revenue it is and what the growth rate is in this in this particular segment at this point?

是的，明白了。好的。第二個問題是，我想知道您是否可以詳細說明 NDC，它似乎正在推動收入和成本節約。所以我很好奇你們今天追加銷售的門票的百分比是多少，佔收入的百分比是多少，以及目前這個特定細分市場的成長率是多少？

Right. So our direct connect strategy has been a huge success and it has driven some of our cash and a competitiveness and our lower cash and so has been very successful. A talking about the specific numbers, you know, in general terms a GDS. So so traditional the traditional GDS channel was over two thirds of our bookings when we started it towards the end of 2022. And today is much less than a quarter of our business. So talking like in general, in general terms, we are we're over 80% either direct or NBC channels today, over 80% travel agency connecting through NDC or copa.com bookings and the traditional high cost GVA GDS channel is really a small percentage of our business, relatively speaking.

正確的。因此，我們的直連策略取得了巨大的成功，它推動了我們的一些現金和競爭力以及我們較低的現金，因此非常成功。 A 談論具體的數字，你知道，籠統地說就是 GDS。因此，當我們在 2022 年底開始使用傳統 GDS 管道時，傳統 GDS 管道占我們預訂量的三分之二以上。因此，總的來說，我們現在有超過 80% 的直接管道或 NBC 管道，超過 80% 的旅行社透過 NDC 或 copa.com 預訂進行連接，而傳統的高成本 GVA GDS 管道確實很小相對而言，我們業務的百分比。

Okay. So able to upsell on 80% of the bookings now versus, you know, maybe a third in the past is the way to kind of think about that.

好的。因此，現在能夠對 80% 的預訂進行追加銷售，而過去可能只有三分之一是考慮這一問題的方式。

I'm not sure if I if I get exactly what you're asking, but bottle in copa.com plus NBC connections. So direct NDC connections are 80% below 80% of our business. And two years ago, it would have been only copa.com and other direct channels, which would have been in the 30% a range.

我不確定我是否完全明白你的要求，但在 copa.com 和 NBC 連接上裝瓶。因此，直接 NDC 連線占我們業務的 80% 以下。兩年前，只有 copa.com 和其他直接管道，比例在 30% 左右。

Understood. Okay. Thanks for the time you guys see exactly.

明白了。好的。謝謝你們花時間看清楚。

Tom Fitzgerald, TD Cowen.

湯姆·菲茨杰拉德，TD·考恩。

Hi, everyone. Thanks very much for the time and want to echo everyone's congrats to Jose, would you mind updating us on on just putting some numbers on the bookings and traffic for go through corporate revenues and just kind of where things stand versus pre-COVID and maybe any color you could add on just sectors sector the demand across the different sectors that you service out of Panama?

大家好。非常感謝您抽出寶貴的時間，並想回應大家對何塞的祝賀，您介意向我們介紹一下有關公司收入的預訂和流量的一些數字以及與新冠疫情之前相比的情況嗎？的不同行業的需求添加顏色嗎？

Yes. So I would say that in general terms and business travel is for only a quarter of our total of our total our revenue base, it is in it is these are people who travel for business purposes, not not necessarily people traveling business class. And then the remainder is in leisure and VFR, I would say leisure represents about 40% and then VFR is about call it 35%. So that there is a bit of a shift because before the pandemic, it was kind of a third, a third, a third. It's always still business. Rail is still a little bit less than where it was back end in 2019.

是的。因此，我想說，一般而言，商務旅行僅占我們總收入基礎的四分之一，因為這些人是出於商務目的而旅行，而不一定是商務艙旅行的人。剩下的就是休閒和 VFR，我想說休閒約佔 40%，然後 VFR 約佔 35%。因此，存在一些轉變，因為在大流行之前，這是第三次、第三次、第三次。它總是仍然是生意。鐵路運輸仍比 2019 年後端的情況略少。

Okay. That's really helpful. And then would you mind Eastern just kind of running through some of the tailwinds and levers you'll have next year to drive CASMex lower? Thanks again for the time everyone?

好的。這真的很有幫助。那麼您是否介意東方航空利用明年將有的一些有利因素和槓桿來推動 CASMex 下跌？再次感謝大家的時間？

Yes, there's still several items vary on the first one is densification of the fleet or subsector signing hundred fleet that is undergoing a densification of the whitespace. Kevin there's some of the headwinds that we have seen over the last couple of years of maintenance are still being worked on as the engines mature. Additionally, of course, there's growth value if we have growth of I mean on the low double-digit range, I would also aid in terms of our forecasting and there's maybe a tad more that can be done on the sales and distribution line with Copa Connect as well. So those those are, I would say, three, three buckets of tailwinds in terms of CapEx spend that we have on the table, right, plus, of course, keeping overhead under check and growing a sense that formula usually works.

是的，仍然有幾個項目有所不同，第一個是艦隊的緻密化或分部門簽署的百個艦隊正在經歷空白的緻密化。凱文，隨著引擎的成熟，我們在過去幾年的維護中看到的一些阻力仍在解決中。此外，當然，如果我們的成長是低兩位數範圍內的成長，我也會在我們的預測方面提供幫助，也許在銷售和分銷方面與 Copa 可以做更多的事情連接也行。因此，我想說，就我們桌面上的資本支出而言，這些是三、三桶順風車，對吧，當然，還要控制管理費用，並增強一種公式通常有效的感覺。

Yes. Thank you. At this time, I would now like to turn the conference back over to Pedro Heilbron for closing remarks.

是的。謝謝。現在，我想將會議轉回由佩德羅·海爾布隆 (Pedro Heilbron) 致閉幕詞。

Great. Thank you, and thank you all for participating in our Q2 earnings call, and thank you also for your continued support. Have a great day and you know where to find us. So thanks for your support.

偉大的。謝謝你們，謝謝大家參加我們的第二季財報電話會議，也謝謝你們的持續支持。祝您有美好的一天，您知道在哪裡可以找到我們。感謝您的支持。

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your participation. That concludes the presentation. You may disconnect and have a wonderful day.

女士們、先生們，感謝您的參與。演示到此結束。您可能會斷開連接並度過美好的一天。