Ares Commercial Real Estate Corp (ACRE) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, everyone. Welcome to Ares Commercial Real Estate Corporation's second-quarter earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions). As a reminder, this conference is being recorded on Tuesday, August 5, 2025. I would now like to turn the call over to Mr. John Stilmar, Partner of Public Markets Investor Relations. Please go ahead, sir.

大家下午好。歡迎參加 Ares Commercial Real Estate Corporation 第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指令）。提醒一下，本次會議將於 2025 年 8 月 5 日星期二錄製。現在我想將電話轉給公開市場投資者關係合夥人約翰‧史蒂爾馬先生。先生，請繼續。

Thank you, and good afternoon, everybody. Thanks for joining us on today's conference call. In addition to our press release and the 10-Q that we filed with the SEC, we have posted an earnings presentation under the Investor Resources section of our website at www.arescre.com.

謝謝大家，下午好。感謝您參加今天的電話會議。除了我們的新聞稿和向美國證券交易委員會提交的 10-Q 表之外，我們還在網站 www.arescre.com 的投資者資源部分下發布了收益報告。

Before we begin, I want to remind everyone that comments made during the course of this conference call and webcast as well as the accompanying documents contain forward-looking statements and are subject to risks and uncertainties. Many of these forward-looking statements can be identified by the use of words such as anticipates, believes, expects, intends, will, should, may and similar such expressions. These forward-looking statements are based on management's current expectations of market conditions and management's judgment. These statements are not guarantees of future performance, condition or results and involve a number of risks and uncertainties.

在我們開始之前，我想提醒大家，在本次電話會議和網路廣播以及隨附文件中發表的評論包含前瞻性陳述，並受風險和不確定性的影響。許多前瞻性陳述可以透過預期、相信、期望、打算、將、應該、可能等詞語以及類似的表達來識別。這些前瞻性陳述是基於管理階層對目前市場狀況的預期和管理階層的判斷。這些聲明並非對未來業績、狀況或結果的保證，並且涉及許多風險和不確定性。

The company's actual results could differ materially from those expressed in the forward-looking statements as a result of a number of factors, including those listed on its SEC filings. Ares Commercial Real Estate assumes no obligation to update any such forward-looking statements. During this call, we will refer to certain non-GAAP financial measures. We use these as measures of operating performance, and these measures should not be considered in isolation from or as a substitute for measures prepared in accordance with generally accepted accounting principles. These measures may not be comparable to like titled measures used by other companies.

由於多種因素（包括美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 文件中列出的因素），該公司的實際結果可能與前瞻性聲明中表達的結果有重大差異。Ares Commercial Real Estate 不承擔更新任何此類前瞻性聲明的義務。在本次電話會議中，我們將參考某些非公認會計準則財務指標。我們將這些作為經營績效的衡量標準，這些標準不應孤立地看待或取代根據公認會計原則編制的指標。這些措施可能無法與其他公司使用的類似措施相比。

Now I'd like to turn the call over to our CEO, Bryan Donohoe. Bryan.

現在我想將電話轉給我們的執行長布萊恩·多諾霍 (Bryan Donohoe)。布萊恩。

Thank you, John. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us. I am also joined today by Jeff Gonzales, our Chief Financial Officer; Tae-Sik Yoon, our Chief Operating Officer; as well as other members of the management and Investor Relations team. During the second quarter, we continued to execute on our strategic objectives. We maintained a strong balance sheet, which has driven our progress addressing our risk rated 4 and 5 loans and further reducing our office loans in the quarter.

謝謝你，約翰。大家下午好，感謝大家的參與。今天與我一同出席的還有我們的財務長 Jeff Gonzales、我們的營運長 Tae-Sik Yoon，以及管理和投資者關係團隊的其他成員。第二季度，我們繼續執行我們的策略目標。我們維持了強勁的資產負債表，這推動了我們解決風險等級為 4 和 5 的貸款問題並在本季度進一步減少辦公室貸款。

Importantly, the portfolio no longer includes loans collateralized by properties that are primarily used for life sciences. Given the progress we have made in narrowing the range of potential outcomes in our portfolio and having achieved our target balance sheet objective, we have begun investing in new and attractive loans. As we look forward, we expect origination activity to increase as we collect repayments and further address our risk rated 4 and 5 loans and reduce our office loan holdings.

重要的是，該投資組合不再包括以主要用於生命科學的財產作為抵押的貸款。鑑於我們在縮小投資組合中潛在結果範圍方面取得的進展以及實現了目標資產負債表目標，我們已經開始投資新的、有吸引力的貸款。展望未來，隨著我們收取還款、進一步解決風險等級為 4 和 5 的貸款並減少辦公室貸款持有量，我們預計貸款發起活動將會增加。

Let me now walk you through the details of the quarter and lay the foundation for how we see these activities unfolding in order to drive higher levels of distributable earnings and dividend coverage. During the second quarter, we reduced our office loans to $524 million, a decrease of 10% quarter-over-quarter and a decrease of 30% year-over-year.

現在，讓我向您介紹本季度的詳細信息，並為我們如何看待這些活動的展開奠定基礎，以推動更高水平的可分配收益和股息覆蓋率。第二季度，我們將辦公室貸款減少至 5.24 億美元，較上季下降 10%，年減 30%。

This decrease was driven by repayments, active asset management and the decision to accelerate resolutions. Across office loans, including our rated 5 office loan, we saw improved leasing fundamentals and broadly speaking, more positive capital markets around the sector, which may also impact the rate of resolutions. During the second quarter, we exited a $51 million office life sciences loan and took a $33 million realized loss, which was in excess of the prior quarter CECL reserve.

這一下降是由於還款、積極的資產管理和加速解決的決定。在包括我們評級為 5 的辦公大樓貸款在內的辦公大樓貸款中，我們看到租賃基本面有所改善，並且總體而言，該行業的資本市場更加積極，這也可能影響解決率。在第二季度，我們退出了一筆 5,100 萬美元的辦公室生命科學貸款，並承擔了 3,300 萬美元的已實現損失，超過了上一季的 CECL 儲備。

While we don't take any loss lightly, we believe the resolution of this loan creates greater stability in our portfolio. Reductions in federal funding for life science research led to further erosions in tenant demand and further elevated the supply-demand imbalance for life science properties. By exiting this loan, we removed significant unfunded commitments in the portfolio.

雖然我們不會輕視任何損失，但我們相信這筆貸款的解決方案將為我們的投資組合帶來更大的穩定性。聯邦政府對生命科學研究的資助減少，導致租戶需求進一步下降，並進一步加劇了生命科學地產的供需失衡。透過退出這筆貸款，我們消除了投資組合中大量未撥付的承諾。

The exit of this loan contributed to the 50% decrease in future funding commitments from $73 million in 1Q 2025 to $36.5 million as of June 30, 2025. We believe utilizing the strength of our balance sheet to exit the loan created greater certainty around our portfolio and allows us to get back to growth more quickly. We see this as an important advancement for the company as there are no remaining loans in the portfolio collateralized with properties that are primarily used for life sciences. We also changed the risk rating on an $81 million senior loan collateralized by an office property in Arizona to a risk rated 4 loan from a risk rating of 3.

這筆貸款的退出導致未來融資承諾減少 50%，從 2025 年第一季的 7,300 萬美元減少到 2025 年 6 月 30 日的 3,650 萬美元。我們相信，利用我們資產負債表的實力來退出貸款可以為我們的投資組合創造更大的確定性，並使我們能夠更快地恢復成長。我們認為這對公司來說是一個重要的進步，因為投資組合中不再有以主要用於生命科學的財產作為抵押的貸款。我們也將亞利桑那州一處辦公物業作為抵押的 8,100 萬美元優先貸款的風險評級從 3 級調整為 4 級。

While occupancy increased at this property during the quarter and the sponsor has historically supported the asset, the lease-up business plan is taking longer than expected and with maturity coming up in October, discussions regarding an extension or modification with the sponsor are taking place. Let me now shift to our overall risk rated 4 and 5 loans. As of June 30, 2025, we had 1 risk rated 5 loan and 4 risk rated 4 loans, maintaining the same number of risk rated 4 and 5 loans as we held last quarter. Notably, 2 of the 5 risk rated 4 and 5 loans comprised 75% of the outstanding principal balance.

雖然本季該物業的入住率有所增加，且發起人歷來支持該資產，但租賃業務計劃耗時比預期要長，並且將於 10 月份到期，目前正在與發起人討論延期或修改事宜。現在讓我來談談我們的整體風險評級為 4 和 5 的貸款。截至 2025 年 6 月 30 日，我們有 1 筆風險評級為 5 的貸款和 4 筆風險評級為 4 的貸款，風險評級為 4 和 5 的貸款數量與上一季相同。值得注意的是，5 筆風險評級為 4 和 5 的貸款中有 2 筆佔未償還本金餘額的 75%。

The first of these 2 loans is our risk rated 5 Chicago office loan with a carrying value of $146 million. Occupancy at this property has stabilized and remains above 90% with a weighted average lease term of more than eight years. Post quarter end, the positive momentum at the property continued as a significant tenant amended and extended its lease, resulting in a $3 million payment to our borrower upon which the borrower applied these proceeds to reduce the principal balance of the loan. While we continue to see positive momentum towards the business plan, we note that challenges remain in the office sector with respect to the depth of investor demand, financing availability and thus valuations for office properties.

這兩筆貸款中的第一筆是我們的風險評級為 5 的芝加哥辦公室貸款，帳面價值為 1.46 億美元。該物業的入住率已穩定並維持在 90% 以上，加權平均租賃期限超過八年。季度結束後，由於一位重要租戶修改並延長了租約，該物業繼續保持積極勢頭，導致我們向借款人支付了 300 萬美元，借款人利用這些收益來減少貸款的本金餘額。雖然我們繼續看到商業計劃的積極勢頭，但我們注意到辦公大樓領域在投資者需求深度、融資可用性以及辦公大樓估值方面仍然存在挑戰。

The second of the 2 largest risk rated 4 and 5 loans is our risk rated 4 Brooklyn, New York residential condominium loan with a carrying value of $113 million. This property continues to hit development milestones on budget with nearly all of the remaining necessary materials to complete construction procured, which mitigates supply chain and known tariff risks.

兩筆最大風險評級為 4 和 5 的貸款中的第二筆是我們的紐約布魯克林住宅公寓貸款，風險評級為 4，帳面價值為 1.13 億美元。該物業繼續在預算內實現開發里程碑，並已購買完成施工所需的幾乎所有剩餘材料，從而減輕了供應鏈和已知的關稅風險。

Subsequent to quarter end, the soft marketing launch began at the property, while the formal marketing and sales process is targeted to begin by 4Q 2025. Beyond these areas of focus in our loan portfolio, our risk rated 1 to 3 loans, which are primarily collateralized by multifamily, industrial and self-storage properties continue to perform well with strong overall execution of business plans.

本季末之後，該物業開始進行軟行銷，而正式的行銷和銷售流程預計將於 2025 年第四季開始。除了我們貸款組合中的這些重點領域之外，我們風險評級為 1 至 3 的貸款（主要由多戶住宅、工業和自助倉儲物業作為抵押）繼續表現良好，業務計劃整體執行強勁。

Specifically, during the second quarter, we upgraded a risk rated 3 $56 million loan collateralized by a hotel property to a risk rated 2 loan based on positively trending occupancy and operating cash flow levels. Beyond this positive risk rating upgrade, we believe the overall loan portfolio is much improved over recent quarters. Further, our balance sheet is positioned to both drive additional resolutions as well as invest our capital in new loans. To this end, following the end of the second quarter, we successfully executed our first investment commitments of the year.

具體來說，在第二季度，我們根據積極的入住率和經營現金流水平，將一筆由酒店物業抵押的 5600 萬美元風險評級為 3 的貸款升級為風險評級為 2 的貸款。除了這次積極的風險評級升級之外，我們認為，最近幾季的整體貸款組合已經有了很大改善。此外，我們的資產負債表既可以推動額外的解決方案，也可以將我們的資本投資於新的貸款。為此，我們在第二季結束後成功履行了今年首批投資承諾。

We closed 4 senior loans totaling $43 million in loan commitments collateralized by self-storage properties. While this marks our initial deployment into new loans in 2025, the overall Ares debt business has remained actively engaged in the real estate market with a strong and growing pipeline of opportunities. In the past 12 months, the team has originated over $6 billion of new investment commitments, primarily focused on mixed-use industrial and multifamily assets. Supported by the scale and reach of the broader Ares real estate platform, we expect origination activities to build in the third quarter and in future periods.

我們完成了 4 筆優先貸款，總額為 4,300 萬美元，貸款承諾以自助倉儲資產作為抵押。雖然這標誌著我們在 2025 年首次部署新貸款，但 Ares 整體債務業務仍然積極參與房地產市場，並擁有強大且不斷增長的機會。在過去的 12 個月中，該團隊已獲得超過 60 億美元的新投資承諾，主要集中在混合用途工業和多戶型資產。在更廣泛的 Ares 房地產平台的規模和影響力的支持下，我們預計發起活動將在第三季及未來期間內建立。

While it is hard to predict timing, over the next 12 months, we expect the portfolio to be equal to or larger than it was as of 2Q 2025. From an earnings standpoint, we recognize that 2Q 2025 distributable earnings, excluding losses of $0.09 per share is below our dividend level of $0.15 per share. However, we remain confident that our earnings potential is in excess of the current dividend level. Our confidence in our earnings potential is derived from a number of levers that we can pull to enhance earnings, including the resolutions of our higher risk-weighted assets, redeploying our additional capital and making new loans.

雖然很難預測時間，但在未來 12 個月內，我們預計投資組合將等於或大於 2025 年第二季的水平。從收益的角度來看，我們認識到 2025 年第二季的可分配收益（不包括每股 0.09 美元的虧損）低於每股 0.15 美元的股息水準。然而，我們仍然相信我們的獲利潛力超過目前的股息水準。我們對獲利潛力的信心源於我們可以利用的一系列手段來提高獲利，包括解決高風險加權資產、重新部署額外資本和發放新貸款。

Looking ahead, we recognize that results may be uneven quarter-to-quarter, but our strategy remains clear, our execution purposeful and our outlook optimistic. Through our deliberate actions, we remain focused on accelerating resolutions on our higher-risk assets while not jeopardizing the integrity and strength of our balance sheet as we seek to clarify and demonstrate book value as quickly as possible. Ultimately, these actions and our return to investing in today's attractive environment should collectively begin to methodically rebuild our earnings in future periods.

展望未來，我們意識到季度業績可能不均衡，但我們的策略依然清晰，我們的執行有目的性，我們的前景樂觀。透過我們的深思熟慮的行動，我們仍然專注於加速解決高風險資產的問題，同時不危及資產負債表的完整性和強度，因為我們尋求盡快澄清和證明帳面價值。最終，這些行動以及我們在當今有吸引力的環境中重新投資應該會共同開始在未來有條不紊地重建我們的收益。

And with that, I'll turn the call over to Jeff, who will provide more details on our second quarter results.

說完這些，我將把電話轉給傑夫，他將提供有關我們第二季業績的更多細節。

Thank you, Bryan. For the second quarter of 2025, we reported a GAAP net loss of approximately $11 million or $0.20 per diluted common share. Our distributable earnings for the second quarter of 2025 was a net loss of approximately $28 million or $0.51 per diluted common share. This includes the impact from the realized loss of $33 million or $0.60 per diluted common share related to the exit of a Massachusetts office life sciences loan.

謝謝你，布萊恩。2025 年第二季度，我們報告的 GAAP 淨虧損約為 1,100 萬美元，或每股稀釋普通股 0.20 美元。我們 2025 年第二季的可分配收益為淨虧損約 2,800 萬美元，或每股稀釋普通股 0.51 美元。這包括因退出馬薩諸塞州辦公室生命科學貸款而造成的 3300 萬美元或每股稀釋普通股 0.60 美元的已實現損失的影響。

Distributable earnings for the second quarter, excluding this loss, was approximately $5 million or $0.09 per diluted common share. During the quarter, we also collected $3 million or $0.05 per diluted common share of cash interest on loans that were on nonaccrual and was accounted for as a reduction in our loan basis. In the second quarter of 2025, we collected an additional $30 million of repayments, bringing the year-to-date total repayments to $337 million, nearly 3x the amount of repayments in the first half of 2024.

不包括該損失，第二季的可分配收益約為 500 萬美元或每股稀釋普通股 0.09 美元。在本季度，我們還收取了 300 萬美元或每股稀釋普通股 0.05 美元的非應計貸款現金利息，併計入我們的貸款基礎減少。2025 年第二季度，我們又收回了 3,000 萬美元的還款，使年初至今的總還款額達到 3.37 億美元，幾乎是 2024 年上半年還款額的 3 倍。

The acceleration of repayments that began in the second half of 2024 and which has continued through the first half of 2025 have bolstered our liquidity position and further strengthened our balance sheet. While these repayments are having an impact on our near-term earnings, we believe our strengthened balance sheet provides us the flexibility to accelerate resolutions and opportunistically deploy capital into new loans. Reinforced by the repayments and purposeful execution, we maintained the financial flexibility and balance sheet positioning we achieved in the first quarter.

從 2024 年下半年開始並持續到 2025 年上半年的還款加速增強了我們的流動性狀況並進一步加強了我們的資產負債表。雖然這些還款對我們的近期收益產生了影響，但我們相信，增強的資產負債表為我們提供了靈活性，可以加快解決方案並適時將資本部署到新貸款中。透過償還和有目的的執行，我們保持了第一季實現的財務靈活性和資產負債表定位。

We maintained our net debt-to-equity ratio, excluding CECL, at 1.2x at the end of the second quarter, stable quarter-over-quarter, but down from 1.9x year-over-year. We reduced our outstanding borrowings further to $889 million at the end of the quarter, a decrease of 6% quarter-over-quarter and a decrease of 39% year-over-year. In addition, we reduced our unfunded commitments to $37 million at the end of the second quarter, a decrease of 50% quarter-over-quarter and a decrease of 58% year-over-year.

截至第二季末，我們的淨負債權益比率（不包括 CECL）維持在 1.2 倍，較上季穩定，但低於去年同期的 1.9 倍。截至本季末，我們未償還借款進一步減少至 8.89 億美元，季減 6%，年減 39%。此外，我們在第二季末將未撥付承諾金額減少至 3,700 萬美元，較上季下降 50%，年減 58%。

Furthermore, we took proactive steps to further optimize our financial flexibility and capital structure. During the second quarter, we amended and extended our Morgan Stanley facility to reduce the current commitment to $150 million, but we have a built-in $100 million accordion option to increase the commitment to the previous size of $250 million. The reduced near-term commitment size with consistent terms allows us to more efficiently size our financing for our near-term needs, while the accordion supports growth as it comes to fruition.

此外，我們也採取積極措施進一步優化財務靈活性和資本結構。在第二季度，我們修改並延長了摩根士丹利的貸款額度，將目前的承諾額度減少至 1.5 億美元，但我們內建了 1 億美元的可折疊選項，可以將承諾額度增加至之前的 2.5 億美元。減少短期承諾規模並保持條款一致，使我們能夠更有效地根據短期需求確定融資規模，同時在實現成長時提供強大支持。

During the second quarter, we continued to focus on maintaining our liquidity position. As we have discussed in the past, we believe this continued focus on liquidity enables greater optionality to accelerate resolutions and opportunistically invest, both of which will have a positive impact on earnings.

在第二季度，我們繼續致力於維持流動性狀況。正如我們過去所討論過的，我們相信，持續關注流動性可以提供更大的選擇性，以加速解決方案並進行機會性投資，這兩者都將對收益產生積極影響。

Our liquidity position, as measured by available capital was $178 million as of June 30, 2025. This includes $94 million of cash. Turning to our CECL reserve. The total CECL reserve declined to $119 million as of June 30, 2025, a decrease of approximately $20 million from the CECL reserve as of March 31, 2025.

截至 2025 年 6 月 30 日，我們的流動資金狀況（以可用資本衡量）為 1.78 億美元。其中包括 9,400 萬美元現金。轉向我們的 CECL 儲備。截至 2025 年 6 月 30 日，CECL 儲備總額下降至 1.19 億美元，較 2025 年 3 月 31 日的 CECL 儲備減少約 2,000 萬美元。

This reduction was due to the exit of an office life sciences loan, loan repayments and other loan-specific attributes. The total CECL reserve at the end of the second quarter of $119 million represents approximately 9% of the total outstanding principal balance of our loans held for investment. 94% of our total $119 million CECL reserve relates to our risk rated 4 and 5 loans or $112 million. Overall, the $112 million of reserves represent 27% of the outstanding principal balance of risk rated 4 and 5 loans held for investment. Our book value of $9.52 per share includes the $119 million CECL reserve.

減少的原因是辦公室生命科學貸款的退出、貸款償還和其他貸款特定屬性。第二季末的 CECL 儲備總額為 1.19 億美元，約占我們為投資而持有的貸款未償還本金總額的 9%。我們的 CECL 儲備總額為 1.19 億美元，其中 94% 與風險評級為 4 和 5 的貸款有關，即 1.12 億美元。總體而言，1.12 億美元的儲備金佔投資持有的風險評級為 4 和 5 的貸款未償還本金餘額的 27%。我們的每股帳面價值 9.52 美元包括 1.19 億美元的 CECL 儲備金。

Our goal is to continue to prove out book value over time, and as Bryan stated, to enhance earnings and our dividend coverage. To conclude, the Board declared a regular cash dividend of $0.15 per common share for the third quarter of 2025. Third quarter dividend will be payable on October 15, 2025, to common stockholders of record as of September 30, 2025. At our current stock price on July 31, 2025, the annualized dividend yield on our third quarter dividend is above 13%.

我們的目標是隨著時間的推移繼續證明帳面價值，正如布萊恩所說，提高收益和股息覆蓋率。最後，董事會宣布 2025 年第三季每股普通股發放 0.15 美元的定期現金股利。第三季股利將於 2025 年 10 月 15 日支付給截至 2025 年 9 月 30 日登記在冊的普通股股東。以我們 2025 年 7 月 31 日的當前股價計算，我們第三季股息的年化股息殖利率超過 13%。

With that, I will turn the call back over to Bryan for some closing remarks.

說完這些，我將把電話轉回給布萊恩，請他發表一些結束語。

Thanks, Jeff. As we sit here today, halfway through 2025, we are proud of our progress and accomplishments. While we recognize that quarter-to-quarter earnings results may vary, our conviction remains firm and our strategy remains unchanged. The success and conviction of our strategy is evidenced by record low leverage, high levels of liquidity, double-digit decreases in our risk rated 4 and 5 loans and office portfolio over the last year and ACRE's 3Q 2025 return to new loan investing. We believe that this is the first of many investments as we reshape ACRE's portfolio for future growth.

謝謝，傑夫。今天，我們坐在這裡，2025年已經過去一半了，我們為我們的進步和成就感到自豪。雖然我們意識到季度獲利結果可能會有所不同，但我們的信念依然堅定，我們的策略依然不變。我們策略的成功和堅定信念體現在創紀錄的低槓桿率、高流動性水平、去年風險評級為 4 和 5 的貸款和辦公室投資組合的兩位數下降以及 ACRE 在 2025 年第三季度重返新貸款投資。我們相信，這是我們重塑 ACRE 投資組合以實現未來成長的眾多投資中的第一筆。

We believe that the power of the Ares platform and the greater Ares real estate team provides us with the right people, comprehensive capabilities and robust pipeline to continue to execute upon this strategy. Looking ahead, we're encouraged by the signs of stabilization and gradual improvement of the commercial real estate market, particularly driven by valuation stability due to the lack of new inventory in certain property types and submarkets. Through consistent execution, we are confident that ACRE is on the right track to drive shareholder value and benefit from the secular growth of the nonbank commercial real estate lending opportunity.

我們相信，Ares 平台和更強大的 Ares 房地產團隊的強大力量將為我們提供合適的人才、全面的能力和強大的管道，以繼續執行這項策略。展望未來，商業房地產市場趨於穩定並逐步改善的跡象令我們感到鼓舞，尤其是由於某些房地產類型和次市場缺乏新庫存而導致的估值穩定。透過持續執行，我們相信 ACRE 正走在正確的軌道上，推動股東價值並從非銀行商業房地產貸款機會的長期成長中獲益。

In closing, we would like to take a moment to extend our deepest sympathies to the families of those who lost their lives during last week's tragedy at 345 Park Avenue. In times like these, we are reminded of the importance of standing together as a community with compassion, resilience and support for one another. We are keeping all who have been affected in our thoughts.

最後，我們想藉此機會向上週公園大道 345 號悲劇中遇難者的家屬表示最深切的慰問。在這樣的時刻，我們意識到團結一致、互相同情、堅韌不拔和支持的重要性。我們永遠懷念所有受影響的人們。

As always, we appreciate you joining our call today, and we'd be happy to open the line for questions.

像往常一樣，我們感謝您今天參加我們的電話會議，我們很樂意為您解答問題。

(Operator Instructions) Rick Shane, JPMorgan.

（操作員指示） 摩根大通 (JPMorgan) 的 Rick Shane。

Look, I'm curious, it sounds like from a balance sheet perspective, you feel like you've reached an inflection point in terms of starting to deploy capital, working through the nonaccruals. On a year-over-year basis, net revenue is down about 25%. Net interest income is down even more than that. Is the second quarter the trough? Or should we expect that because of the timing in the third quarter that it will be sequentially down again and then potentially start to rebuild from there?

看，我很好奇，從資產負債表的角度來看，你覺得你已經達到了開始部署資本、解決非應計專案的轉捩點。與去年同期相比，淨收入下降了約25%。淨利息收入的降幅甚至更大。第二季是低潮嗎？或者我們應該預期，由於第三季的時間安排，它將再次連續下降，然後可能從那裡開始重建？

Thanks for the question, Rick. So yes, we did reset our dividend in the first quarter to align with our strategic objectives. As you mentioned, we did reach our balance sheet positioning goals, which is allowing us to maximize some of the resolutions of our 4 and 5 loans and accelerate those and also begin to start investing in loans.

謝謝你的提問，里克。是的，我們確實在第一季重新設定了股息，以符合我們的策略目標。正如您所提到的，我們確實達到了資產負債表定位目標，這使我們能夠最大限度地解決第 4 筆和第 5 筆貸款的問題，並加速這些貸款的解決，同時開始投資貸款。

So as Bryan mentioned in his prepared remarks, we do expect to have the portfolio 12 months from now be at the level it's at today or higher. We do continue to source new loan opportunities, and we do expect to originate additional loans moving forward throughout the third quarter and in the fourth quarter that will -- should absorb any repayments that happen.

因此，正如布萊恩在其準備好的演講中提到的那樣，我們確實預計 12 個月後的投資組合將達到今天的水平或更高。我們確實在繼續尋找新的貸款機會，並且我們確實預計在第三季和第四季發放更多貸款，以吸收任何發生的還款。

Got it. And so does that imply if the balance sheet is going to be roughly the same size a year from now, but you're going to have presumably less drag from nonaccruals that even at a flat balance sheet, you would expect to see net interest income start to rebuild from here.

知道了。那麼這是否意味著，如果一年後資產負債表的規模大致相同，但你可能會受到來自非應計項目的拖累，即使在資產負債表持平的情況下，你也會預計淨利息收入將從現在開始重建。

Yes, that's correct.

是的，正確。

And remind me, I know I've got it, and we'll see it in the transcript, but what was the drag this quarter from nonaccruals on NII?

提醒我一下，我知道我已經明白了，我們會在成績單中看到它，但是本季度 NII 的非應計項目造成的拖累是什麼？

The drag is about $0.17.

阻力約為 0.17 美元。

Okay. And absolute dollars, I apologize.

好的。而且絕對的美元，我很抱歉。

Absolute dollars in the $8 million, $9 million range.

絕對金額在 800 萬美元至 900 萬美元之間。

Tom Catherwood, BTIG.

湯姆·卡瑟伍德（Tom Catherwood），BTIG。

Bryan, I appreciate your comments on origination activity increasing going forward and that it's likely to track repayments and watch list resolutions. Given your low debt levels, you could lever up that equity that comes back from repayments and really ramp originations beyond even past the repayment levels. Is that your plan as you're looking at through originations for the rest of '25?

布萊恩，我很欣賞你對未來發起活動增加的評論，並且它可能會追蹤還款和監視名單解決方案。鑑於您的債務水平較低，您可以利用從還款中收回的股權，真正提高貸款發放額，甚至超過還款水平。這是您在考慮 25 年剩餘時間的起源時制定的計劃嗎？

Yes. I appreciate the question, Tom. I think certainly -- and if you look at what Jeff walked through in terms of the accordion feature of the Morgan Stanley facility, I think that represents the fact that, as you know, there is more leverage available than what we have sought to utilize on our balance sheet. So yes, there is the opportunity to lever up as you put it.

是的。我很感謝你提出這個問題，湯姆。我認為當然——如果你看看傑夫在摩根士丹利工具的手風琴功能方面所講述的內容，我認為這代表了這樣一個事實，即如你所知，可用的槓桿比我們在資產負債表上試圖利用的槓桿要多。是的，正如您所說的，有機會提高槓桿率。

And I do think the earnings power will be reflective of what we try to reflect is a market that we think is constructive for whole loan originations and certainly a constructive market for repo or warehouse line debt against those assets. So we feel good about both the gross deployment and the net interest margin that we could create based on that borrowing even on a static level or increasing it, as you said.

我確實認為獲利能力將反映出我們試圖反映的是一個對整個貸款發放有利的市場，當然也是一個對這些資產的回購或倉儲債務有利的市場。因此，我們對基於借款創造的總部署和淨息差感到滿意，即使是在靜態水平或增加水平，正如您所說。

Got it. Appreciate that. And then if we think of just your origination pipeline as it's shaping up now, obviously, you put the money to work with the self-storage loans thus far in 3Q. But how is that pipeline shaping up for the rest of '25?

知道了。非常感謝。然後，如果我們只考慮您目前正在形成的發起管道，顯然，您已將資金用於第三季迄今為止的自助倉儲貸款。但是這條管道在 2025 年剩餘時間內的進展如何呢？

Yes. We walked through a lot of what we've done on a platform basis. And I think that should be reflective of the fact that we feel we are in a strong standing position in this market as we think about nonbank lender participation continuing to increase. And I think our presence in the market has improved over the past five, six years, right? So I think we have a robust market to originate into.

是的。我們在平台上完成了許多工作。我認為這應該反映出這樣一個事實：隨著非銀行貸款機構的參與度不斷提高，我們覺得自己在這個市場上處於強勢地位。我認為過去五、六年來我們在市場上的地位有所提高，對嗎？所以我認為我們擁有一個強大的市場。

One thing I'd note is I think there's been so much volatility in rates. It's interesting. If you look at the first half of the year and look at treasuries, we ended up where we started, but with intraday volatility that was fairly historic.

我要指出的一點是，我認為利率波動太大。這很有趣。如果你回顧今年上半年並觀察國債市場，你會發現最終價格與開始時持平，但日內波動幅度卻是歷史性的。

And I mentioned that because I think the real estate industry is still coming to grips with these higher rates to some degree. I think it's to the benefit of the lending community over equity to -- on some basis. But deal velocity is coming back, but it ebbs and flows. So I just reflect that, but I do think that the pipeline has been consistent for us throughout the year, and that's a function of being able to refinance versus needing those willing buyers and sellers to consummate that transaction. So long-winded answer, Tom, but we feel good about the pipeline as we sit here today.

我提到這一點是因為我認為房地產行業在某種程度上仍在努力應對這些更高的利率。我認為從某種程度上來說，這比股權更有利於借貸界。雖然交易速度正在回升，但有起有落。所以我只是反映了這一點，但我確實認為，全年我們的管道一直保持一致，這是能夠再融資的功能，而不是需要那些願意的買家和賣家來完成交易。湯姆，你的回答很冗長，但今天我們坐在這裡，對這條管道感到很滿意。

Appreciate that, Bryan. And last one for me on the Chicago loan, given that occupancy is above 90% and you received a $3 million paydown in 3Q, is there a consideration to extending the loan beyond, obviously, what was the July maturity and then putting it back on accrual? Or is there something else that's keeping that at a 5 risk rating?

非常感謝，布萊恩。最後我想問一下關於芝加哥貸款的問題，假設入住率超過 90%，並且您在第三季度收到了 300 萬美元的首付，那麼是否有考慮將貸款期限延長至 7 月份到期日之後，然後再將其重新計入應計項目？或是還有其他因素導致其風險等級維持在 5 級？

Yes. With respect to the asset itself and our business plan, our interaction with the borrowers, certainly, we like to keep our borrowers in their seat as the equity owner. But I think you can read through what we described and think about this being a mid- to high single-digit yield. And I think that cash flow profile provides a lot of different options for us as we attempt to resolve it.

是的。就資產本身和我們的商業計劃以及我們與借款人的互動而言，我們當然希望讓借款人作為股權所有者。但我認為您可以閱讀我們所描述的內容，並認為這是一個中高個位數的收益率。我認為，當我們嘗試解決這個問題時，現金流量狀況為我們提供了許多不同的選擇。

And I think we've reflected over prior quarters, we'd like to move on from it. But we want to make sure that market value reflects the intrinsic value that we see in this asset as well. So the cash flow profile provides us those opportunities. I think we mentioned in the prepared remarks the fact that there's still stress from a valuation perspective around office assets generally. So while I don't see a pathway to returning it to accrual, we do think that the yield from this asset is such that we do have options available to us as we go through the next few months.

我認為我們已經對前幾季進行了反思，我們希望繼續前進。但我們希望確保市場價值也反映出我們所看到的該資產的內在價值。因此現金流狀況為我們提供了這些機會。我認為我們在準備好的評論中提到過，從估值角度來看，辦公資產總體上仍然存在壓力。因此，雖然我看不到將其恢復到應計的途徑，但我們確實認為該資產的收益率使得我們在接下來的幾個月中確實有可用的選擇。

Jade Rahmani, KBW.

傑德·拉赫馬尼（Jade Rahmani），KBW。

There's a ton of economic noise right now, and we're all trying to assess potential risks due to tariffs and other uncertainties. At the same time, one of your peers characterized the CRE lending market as frothy. I think I saw GSE multifamily quote at a spread inside of 100 basis points on stabilized multifamily.

目前經濟噪音很多，我們都在試圖評估關稅和其他不確定因素帶來的潛在風險。同時，您的一位同行認為商業房地產貸款市場存在泡沫。我認為我看到 GSE 多戶住宅的報價在穩定多戶住宅上的利差在 100 個基點以內。

So just curious your read of the landscape and if -- what your views are about real estate fundamentals, if you're seeing any deterioration in performance across the Ares platform, if your view is that things are stable? And then also a comment on the health of the -- or competitiveness of the CRE lending markets.

所以我只是好奇您對形勢的解讀，以及您對房地產基本面的看法是什麼，您是否看到 Ares 平台的性能有任何惡化，您是否認為情況是穩定的？然後也對 CRE 貸款市場的健康狀況或競爭力進行了評論。

Yes, it's a great question, Jade, and obviously, one we ponder most days here as investors in the sector. I would say that we've seen some relative stability, as I mentioned, Tom's question on as rates have coalesce where they've ended up here. I think you've got this -- you've got what's being printed today in terms of relatively stagnant markets from a leasing and fundamental perspective in certain asset classes.

是的，Jade，這是一個很好的問題，顯然，作為該行業的投資者，這也是我們大多數時間都在思考的問題。我想說我們已經看到了一些相對的穩定性，正如我所提到的，湯姆的問題是，隨著利率逐漸趨於穩定。我想你已經明白了這一點——從租賃和某些資產類別的基本面來看，今天印刷的市場相對停滯。

But with the forward supply-demand balance in multifamily and industrial and self-storage that are evolving from, I'd say, yellow towards green over the next 24 to 36 months. So I think while today, we have a little bit of a muted growth story or at least maybe said differently, a difficult to predict where the drivers of growth will come from in certain asset classes.

但我認為，未來 24 到 36 個月內，多戶住宅、工業和自助倉儲的供需平衡將從黃色轉向綠色。因此我認為，雖然今天我們的成長情況有些低迷，或者至少可以說，很難預測某些資產類別的成長動力將來自哪裡。

I think over the next three to five years, you can make a case for that supply-demand imbalance leading to higher rent growth than we're seeing currently, right? In terms of your question on the debt markets, I think you've had a consolidation in the sector where banks have changed the way they participate in the market to some degree. I think you're seeing the larger participants probably take market share from some of the smaller -- and to the extent you're referencing a tightening or a frothy lending market, I think it depends on your perspective.

我認為，在未來三到五年內，供需失衡將導致租金成長高於目前水平，對嗎？關於您關於債務市場的問題，我認為債務市場已經經歷了整合，銀行在一定程度上改變了其參與市場的方式。我認為，你會看到較大的參與者可能會從一些較小的參與者手中奪取市場份額——至於你提到的緊縮或泡沫貸款市場，我認為這取決於你的觀點。

I think we're finding plenty to do with ROEs that would be in keeping with our subject sector from a historical perspective. And I'm sure our peers would say similar and also something that is a very attractive return on equity from any market participant across debt and equity, right?

我認為，從歷史角度來看，我們發現 ROE 與我們的主題產業有許多相似之處。我相信我們的同業也會說類似的話，而且對於任何債券和股票市場參與者來說，這都是非常有吸引力的股本回報率，對嗎？

The current income profile of lending today historically referenced, I find to be still very attractive. And I'd say one of the things, Jade, in that equation is we've also seen a reset in asset values, right? So your attachment point to these properties is lower than it would have been two, three years ago. And I think you have to take that into account as you think about the relative value in our sector versus other real asset type categories. So hopefully, that answered your question, but happy to delve further if helpful.

我發現，以歷史數據為參考，當今貸款的收入狀況仍然非常有吸引力。我想說的是，Jade，在這個等式中，我們也看到了資產價值的重置，對嗎？因此，您對這些屬性的依戀點比兩、三年前要低。我認為，當您考慮我們行業相對於其他實際資產類型類別的相對價值時，您必須考慮這一點。希望這能回答您的問題，但如果有幫助的話，我們很樂意進一步探討。

Yes, that's great. Exactly what I was looking for. And I think what you put forth is well reasoned, balanced as always. Can you comment on multifamily trends you're seeing? I think we've seen some mixed reports from the apartment REITs depending on the Sunbelt exposure. Curious as to your views on the multifamily space.

是的，太棒了。正是我所尋找的。我認為你提出的觀點一如既往地合理、平衡。您能評論一下您所看到的多戶趨勢嗎？我認為，我們看到了一些來自公寓房地產投資信託基金的混合報告，這取決於陽光地帶的曝光。好奇您對多戶型空間的看法。

Yes. Jade, it's something that, again, I'd say, echoes what I said in terms of the forward supply versus demand being in favor of rent growth. In the immediate case, the data sometimes can be difficult to digest, right? A lot of the CPI data is based on I'd characterize as more local mom-and-pop type landlords, in which case, there's probably a lot of loss to lease still in those rent rolls and you're seeing renewal rents outpace the degree of rent increases for new tenants.

是的。傑德，我想說，這與我所說的未來供需關係有利於租金成長的觀點相呼應。在眼前的情況下，數據有時會很難消化，對嗎？許多 CPI 數據是基於我認為更像本地夫妻店類型的房東，在這種情況下，這些租金單中可能仍然有很多租賃損失，而且你會看到續租租金的增長幅度超過了新租戶租金的增長幅度。

And so I think we're in a digestion phase. I would say that the -- it is very market to market and asset to asset in terms of underlying performance. I do feel like we've departed the stage where most owners are going to give up their right or their option to continue in their standing, if you will, right? So if you have an asset that might be over levered that you purchased in early '23 by way of example, I think you've made that option payment. You've cured a lot of debt service that you didn't anticipate paying due to higher rates.

所以我認為我們正處於消化階段。我想說的是——就基本表現而言，它是與市場和資產緊密相關的。我確實覺得我們已經脫離了大多數業主將放棄其權利或繼續保持其地位的選擇的階段，如果你願意的話，對嗎？因此，如果您擁有一項可能過度槓桿化的資產（例如您在 23 年初購買的），我認為您已經支付了選擇權費用。您已經償還了大量由於利率上升而未預期支付的債務。

And at this point, you're looking over the next 24 months to a more constructive environment for rents. Obviously, the proof will be in where those rents ultimately get. I don't think we're returning to a 5% to 7% rent growth market, but I think CPI plus would be reasonable based on the statistics that we are seeing. And again, I'd echo what I said earlier, the reset of basis for new loans against those assets, I think, is very, very attractive.

此時，您可以預見未來 24 個月的租金環境將會更加有利。顯然，證據在於這些租金最終流向何處。我認為我們不會回到 5% 到 7% 的租金成長市場，但根據我們看到的統計數據，我認為 CPI 加起來是合理的。我再次重申我之前所說的話，我認為，重新設定針對這些資產的新貸款基礎是非常非常有吸引力的。

Doug Harter, UBS.

瑞銀的道格·哈特。

Can you talk about your thought process and whether you considered repurchasing stock at the current discount to book dividend yield versus deploying that into new loans and \how -- what you thought about that -- those trade-offs?

您能否談談您的思考過程，以及您是否考慮過以當前折扣價回購股票以抵消股息收益率，還是將其用於新貸款，以及您如何看待這些權衡？

Yes, absolutely, Doug, and it's certainly a fair question, and we consider repurchases and the quantitative impact is fairly linear, right? So we certainly get it. Right now, we're in favor of investing in new loans as we try to reposition this portfolio and bring us back to scale and deployment and really recharacterize the book, which we think over the long term will be rewarding for our shareholders.

是的，道格，這當然是一個公平的問題，我們考慮回購，其量化影響是相當線性的，對嗎？所以我們當然明白。目前，我們傾向於投資新貸款，因為我們試圖重新定位這個投資組合，讓我們恢復規模和部署，並真正重新描述帳簿，我們認為從長遠來看，這將為我們的股東帶來回報。

But Beyond that, I think we -- there's the practical size of our company, which we have to consider those expense efficiencies. The scale of the portfolio I mentioned and how we finance that portfolio will benefit from parts of that scale. And then other factors come into play like covenants and prospects for our growth. So certainly, it's a tool that we have access to. We understand the quantitative aspects, but a little bit more goes into it before we would execute there.

但除此之外，我認為我們——還有我們公司的實際規模，我們必須考慮這些費用效率。我提到的投資組合的規模以及我們如何為該投資組合融資將受益於該規模的各個部分。然後其他因素也開始發揮作用，例如契約和成長前景。所以，這當然是我們可以使用的工具。我們了解量化方面，但在執行之前還需要進行更多的研究。

(Operator Instructions) Chris Muller, Citizens Capital Markets.

（操作員指示）克里斯·穆勒 (Chris Muller)，公民資本市場。

So can you walk me through the mechanics of the $33 million realized loss in the CECL release with $33 million loss on a $51 million loan and about a $20 million release. And I think you guys said that you sold -- or the property was sold below your reserve basis. So I'm just trying to understand how all that fits together.

那麼，您能否向我介紹一下 CECL 釋放中 3300 萬美元的已實現損失的機制，其中包括 5100 萬美元貸款中的 3300 萬美元損失和約 2000 萬美元的釋放。我認為你們說過，你們已經賣掉了——或者說，房產以低於底價的價格售出了。所以我只是想了解這一切是如何結合在一起的。

Yes. Thanks for the question, Chris. Yes, so as you saw, there was a $33 million gross loss in our earnings presentation, we broke out what the impact was that we had on the reserve there. So $19 million reserve. So the net difference that was affecting book value this quarter and that's running through GAAP earnings would be $14 million.

是的。謝謝你的提問，克里斯。是的，正如您所看到的，我們的收益報告中出現了 3300 萬美元的總損失，我們詳細列出了這對那裡的儲備造成的影響。所以儲備金是1900萬美元。因此，影響本季帳面價值併計入 GAAP 收益的淨差額將達到 1,400 萬美元。

So is the right way to look at that is that $51 million loan was fully reserved for and then it was sold for like $33 million?

那麼，正確的看法是，5,100 萬美元的貸款被全部預留，然後以 3,300 萬美元的價格出售？

It was a $19 million reserve on a $51 million loan.

這是一筆 5,100 萬美元貸款中的 1,900 萬美元儲備金。

Okay. Maybe we can take this offline later and just dig a little bit deeper. So I guess the other question I have here. So you guys talked about how the top two loans, I think you said were 75% of that problem loan bucket. So should we expect new originations going forward to be smaller in size? And it looks like the dynamic with third quarter originations is exactly playing out like that. So just curious how you guys are thinking about loan sizing on new originations going forward.

好的。也許我們可以稍後將其離線並進行更深入的挖掘。所以我想我這裡還有另一個問題。所以你們談到了前兩大筆貸款，我想你們說它們佔了問題貸款總額的 75%。那麼，我們是否應該預期未來新發​​行的規模會更小呢？看起來第三季的動態正是如此。所以我很好奇你們如何看待未來新貸款的規模。

Yes. It's a good question, Chris. I think that a couple of factors to take into account. One, with respect to the originations post quarter end, self-storage assets are generally going to be smaller in nature. I think structurally, we've also grown the rest of our platform such that we have a broader array of origination opportunities and capital sources in front of us today, and we have the potential to maybe split loans between those vehicles.

是的。這是個好問題，克里斯。我認為有幾個因素需要考慮。首先，就季度末後的發起而言，自助儲存資產的規模一般會較小。我認為從結構上來說，我們也擴大了我們平台的其他部分，以便我們今天擁有更廣泛的發起機會和資本來源，我們有可能在這些工具之間分配貸款。

And I think what that should lead to is better diversification while continuing to target the institutional borrower set institutional assets throughout the US. So I think the average ticket that goes into ACRE will likely come down to some degree, but we will maintain a bias towards the institutional asset class.

我認為這會帶來更好的多樣化，同時繼續以機構借款人在美國各地設立的機構資產為目標。因此，我認為進入 ACRE 的平均票價可能會下降，但我們仍將偏向機構資產類別。

And it appears we have no further questions today. Mr. Donohoe, I'd like to turn things back to you, sir, for any closing comments.

看來我們今天沒有其他問題了。多諾霍先生，先生，我想把話題轉回給您，請您做最後的評論。

Appreciate it, sir. And I just want to thank everybody for their time today. We appreciate your continued support of Ares Commercial Real Estate. We look forward to speaking with you all on our next earnings call. Thank you.

非常感謝，先生。我只想感謝大家今天抽出時間。感謝您對 Ares Commercial Real Estate 的持續支持。我們期待在下次收益電話會議上與大家交談。謝謝。

Thank you, Mr. Donohoe. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes our conference call for today. If you missed any part of today's call, an archived replay of this conference will be available approximately 1 hour after the end of this call through September 5, 2025, to domestic callers by dialing 1 (800) 677-7085 and to international callers by dialing 1 (402) 220-0665. An archived replay will also be available on a webcast link located on the homepage of the Investor Resources section of our website.

謝謝您，多諾霍先生。女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束。如果您錯過了今天電話會議的任何部分，可以在電話會議結束後約 1 小時後至 2025 年 9 月 5 日期間收聽本次會議的存檔重播，國內用戶撥打 1 (800) 677-7085 即可收聽，國際用戶撥打 1 (402) 220-0665 即可收聽。我們網站投資者資源部分主頁上的網路廣播連結也將提供存檔重播。

Again, thanks so much for joining us, everyone, and we wish you all a great day. Goodbye.

再次感謝大家的參與，祝福大家有個愉快的一天。再見。