Turning Point Brands Inc (TPB) 2025 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good morning, and welcome to the Turning Point Brands third quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please note that this event is being recorded.

早安，歡迎參加 Turning Point Brands 2025 年第三季財報電話會議。（操作說明）請注意，本次活動正在錄影。

I would now like to turn the conference over to Graham Purdy. Please go ahead.

現在我將把會議交給格雷厄姆·珀迪主持。請繼續。

Thank you, operator. Good morning, everybody, and I really appreciate you all joining the call. A little bit of a somber morning here for us in town here. Before we walk you through our Q3 results, I'd like to say a few words about the tragedy that hit our community yesterday with the UPS flight crash.

謝謝接線生。各位早安，非常感謝大家參加這次電話會議。今天早上，我們鎮上的氣氛有點陰沉。在向大家介紹我們第三季業績之前，我想先就昨天UPS航班墜毀事件給我們社區帶來的悲劇談幾句。

As I'm sure you're aware, we're a Louisville-based company. Aside from being a business partner of ours, UPS is really woven into the fabric of the Louisville community. In many ways, Louisville is a -- it's a very small town and the community is very tight-knit. And while we're fortunate that none of our employees were directly impacted or affected by the tragedy yesterday.

如您所知，我們是一家總部位於路易斯維爾的公司。除了是我們的商業夥伴之外，UPS 也真正融入了路易斯維爾社區的肌理中。從很多方面來看，路易斯維爾都是一個——它是一個非常小的城鎮，社區關係非常緊密。雖然我們很幸運，在昨天發生的悲劇中，我們沒有任何員工直接受到影響或影響。

It's likely that we have friends and loved ones that know somebody that was. Our heart goes out to the families of those that were directly impacted by the tragedy and then to the UPS family as they deal with this heartbreaking situation.

我們的朋友和親人很可能認識這樣的人。我們向受這場悲劇直接影響的家庭表達深切慰問，也向正在應對這令人心碎局面的 UPS 大家庭表示慰問。

And so with that, I'd like to turn the call back to the operator to get started.

那麼，接下來我將把電話轉回給接線生，讓他開始通話。

Thanks, Graham. Now I would now like to turn the conference over to Andrew Flynn, Chief Financial Officer. Please go ahead.

謝謝你，格雷厄姆。現在我謹將會議交給財務長安德魯‧弗林。請繼續。

Good morning, everyone. A short while ago, we issued a press release covering our Q3 results. This release is located in the IR section of our website at www.turningpointbrands.com. During this call, we will discuss our consolidated and segment operating results and provide some perspective on the operating environment and progress against our strategic plan.

各位早安。不久前，我們發布了一份新聞稿，介紹了我們第三季的業績。本新聞稿位於我們網站 www.turningpointbrands.com 的投資者關係 (IR) 部門。在本次電話會議中，我們將討論我們的合併及分部經營業績，並就經營環境和策略計畫的進展提供一些見解。

As is customary, I direct your attention to the discussion of forward-looking and cautionary statements in today's press release and the risk factors in our filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission. On the call today, we will reference certain non-GAAP financial measures. These measures and reconciliations to GAAP are in today's earnings release, along with reasons why management believes they provide useful information.

按照慣例，我請各位注意今天新聞稿中關於前瞻性聲明和警示性聲明的討論，以及我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中關於風險因素的說明。在今天的電話會議上，我們將提及一些非GAAP財務指標。這些措施以及與 GAAP 的調整都包含在今天的獲利報告中，同時也解釋了管理層認為這些措施能夠提供有用資訊的原因。

I will now turn the call over to our CEO, Graham Purdy.

現在我將把電話轉交給我們的執行長格雷厄姆·珀迪。

Thanks, Andrew. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining our call. Our consolidated third quarter results were better than expected and demonstrated continued progress against our plan. Revenue increased 31% to $119 million for the quarter, including $36.7 million net Modern Oral revenue, which includes $1.5 million of slotting fees that are accounted for as contra revenue.

謝謝你，安德魯。各位早安，感謝各位參加我們的電話會議。我們第三季綜合業績優於預期，顯示我們正按計劃持續取得進展。本季營收成長 31% 至 1.19 億美元，其中包括 3,670 萬美元的 Modern Oral 淨收入，其中包括 150 萬美元的插槽費，該費用計入抵減收入。

Adjusted EBITDA increased 17% to $31.3 million for the quarter. We are increasing adjusted EBITDA guidance to a range of $115 million to $120 million, up from $110 million to $114 million. We are increasing full year consolidated nicotine pouch sales guidance to a range of $125 million to $130 million, up from $100 million to $110 million. This includes both FRE and ALP.

本季調整後 EBITDA 成長 17% 至 3,130 萬美元。我們將調整後的 EBITDA 預期從 1.1 億美元至 1.14 億美元上調至 1.15 億美元至 1.2 億美元。我們將全年尼古丁袋銷售預期從 1 億至 1.1 億美元上調至 1.25 億至 1.3 億美元。這包括FRE和ALP。

We are particularly pleased with the growth of our white nicotine pouch brands. Their long-lasting vibrant flavor options, comfortable mouth feel and flexible nicotine levels have resonated with consumers. During the quarter, white pouch sales increased 628% year-over-year and 22% sequentially.

我們尤其對白色尼古丁袋品牌的成長感到滿意。其持久濃鬱的口味選擇、舒適的口感和靈活的尼古丁含量引起了消費者的共鳴。本季度，白色包裝袋的銷量較去年同期成長 628%，較上季成長 22%。

Some of you may have noticed that ALP, already one of the top D2C pouch brands in America, has started to appear on bricks-and-mortar shelves in select retailer tests. Recall that we initially expected ALP to be exclusive D2C for all of 2025. Suffice it to say, we are pleased that ALP is running ahead of schedule.

你們中的一些人可能已經注意到，ALP（美國頂級的 D2C 包裝袋品牌之一）已經開始在部分零售商的實體店面貨架上亮相。回想一下，我們最初預計 ALP 在 2025 年全年都將只採用 D2C 模式。總之，我們很高興看到工黨的工作進展比預期更快。

We believe the nicotine pouch space, like most other nicotine businesses, will ultimately feature five to six widely distributed brands that command most of the market. Analyst expectations for the size of the category differ, but most believe it will approach, if not exceed $10 billion in manufacturers revenue by the end of the decade.

我們認為，像大多數其他尼古丁業務一樣，尼古丁袋市場最終將出現五到六個廣泛分銷的品牌，佔據大部分市場份額。分析師對該類別規模的預期各不相同，但大多數人認為，到本十年末，製造商的收入將接近甚至超過 100 億美元。

Our Q3 performance supports our long-term target of double-digit market share in the category. In order to best position the company to capitalize on this multibillion-dollar opportunity, we have made and will continue to make significant investments in the business and refine our route-to-market strategy to prioritize FRE and ALP, while continuing to generate strong cash flow from our heritage brands.

第三季的業績支持我們實現該品類市佔率達到兩位數的長期目標。為了讓公司能夠更好地掌握這一數十億美元的機遇，我們已經並將繼續對業務進行重大投資，並改善我們的市場通路策略，優先發展 FRE 和 ALP，同時繼續從我們的傳統品牌中產生強勁的現金流。

During the quarter, we raised $100 million of gross proceeds under our previously announced at-the-market offering program at an average share price of $98.59. We expect to opportunistically deploy this capital across a variety of high-return opportunities to accelerate the growth of our Modern Oral business.

本季度，我們透過先前宣布的市場發行計劃，以平均每股 98.59 美元的價格籌集了 1 億美元的總收益。我們預計將擇機將這筆資金用於各種高回報的投資機會，以加速我們現代口腔業務的成長。

Consistent with our policy of maintaining active buyback and sales authorizations to maximize capital markets flexibility, we plan to update our ATM prospectus supplement and buyback authorization to provide for $200 million of capacity under each program. We have no current plans to transact under the updated authorizations.

為了維持積極的回購和出售授權，以最大限度地提高資本市場的靈活性，我們計劃更新我們的 ATM 招股說明書補充文件和回購授權，以便在每個計劃下提供 2 億美元的容量。我們目前沒有計劃根據更新後的授權進行交易。

Key investment initiatives include reallocating sales and marketing resources, increasing the headcount of our sales force, improving our online presence, ramping up investment in chain accounts, expanding to international markets and building out US manufacturing to improve white pouch profitability and mitigate supply chain and tariff risk.

關鍵投資舉措包括重新分配銷售和行銷資源、增加銷售人員數量、改善線上業務、增加對連鎖客戶的投資、拓展國際市場以及在美國建立製造能力，以提高白袋的盈利能力並降低供應鏈和關稅風險。

We are pleased with our progress on the manufacturing front and expect to qualify the first production lines in the first half of 2026. We have been particularly encouraged by our ability to identify and onboard new sales talent. We are ahead of schedule in our goal of doubling the size of our sales force by the end of 2026.

我們對製造方面的進展感到滿意，預計將於 2026 年上半年完成首批生產線的驗收。我們尤其感到鼓舞的是，我們有能力去發現並招募新的銷售人才。我們提前完成了計劃，目標是在 2026 年底前將銷售團隊規模擴大一倍。

The rest of the Stoker's segment portfolio also performed better than expected in the quarter. Overall, Stoker's revenue increased 81% to about $74.8 million, reflecting a 4% increase in looseleaf, a 6% increase in MST and the aforementioned 628% increase in Modern Oral revenue.

Stoker 的其他業務部門在本季也表現優於預期。總體而言，Stoker 的收入增長了 81%，達到約 7,480 萬美元，其中散裝紙收入增長了 4%，MST 收入增長了 6%，而前面提到的 Modern Oral 收入增長了 628%。

During the third quarter, Zig-Zag revenue was down 11% to $44.2 million and down 6% sequentially. While this decline was anticipated and performance was ahead of our expectations, we continue to think it reflects some opportunity costs related to our focus on Modern Oral.

第三季度，Zig-Zag 的營收下降了 11%，至 4,420 萬美元，季減了 6%。雖然這種下滑在我們預料之中，而且業績也超出了我們的預期，但我們仍然認為這反映了我們專注於現代口腔醫學的一些機會成本。

With that, I'll hand the call over to Summer to walk through the progress of our key go-to-market initiatives.

接下來，我會把電話交給 Summer，讓她介紹我們關鍵市場推廣計畫的進度。

Thank you, Graham. As he noted, we continue to make significant investments to support our go-to-market strategies to prioritize FRE, while also continuing to generate strong cash flow from our legacy brands. Throughout the quarter, we continued to expand our efforts and our initiatives to support the growth of FRE focused on sales and marketing.

謝謝你，格雷厄姆。正如他所指出的，我們將繼續進行大量投資，以支持我們的市場進入策略，優先發展 FRE，同時繼續從我們的傳統品牌中產生強勁的現金流。本季度，我們繼續擴大努力和舉措，以支持 FRE 的發展，重點是銷售和行銷。

Our key initiatives to support FRE include: first, optimizing our approach to expand distribution, improve brand merchandising and minimize out of stocks. To support our growing sales organization and increase store footprint, we have developed new sales and merchandising tools to secure the ideal assortment, establish shelf space and execute a premium look and feel at retail.

我們支持 FRE 的主要措施包括：首先，優化我們擴大分銷管道、改善品牌行銷和減少缺貨情況的方法。為了支持我們不斷成長的銷售團隊並擴大門市規模，我們開發了新的銷售和商品陳列工具，以確保理想的商品組合、確定貨架空間，並在零售店營造高端的視覺和觸覺體驗。

Throughout the quarter, we also continued our expansion efforts not only into new stores within large-scale chains, but also expanded our SKU offerings. Toward the end of the quarter, we launched FRE Watermelon. Fruit flavors represent about a quarter of all OSB sales when excluding mint and wintergreen flavors. Watermelon is not merely a flavor extension, it is the fastest-growing fruit flavor in the nicotine pouch category, and FRE is uniquely positioned as a first mover with a complete strength offering.

本季度，我們不僅繼續拓展大型連鎖店的新店，還擴大了我們的 SKU 產品範圍。本季末，我們推出了 FRE 西瓜口味。如果排除薄荷和冬青口味，水果口味約佔所有定向刨花板 (OSB) 銷量的四分之一。西瓜口味不僅僅是一種口味延伸，它是尼古丁袋品類​​中增長最快的水果口味，而 FRE 作為先行者，憑藉其全面的強度產品，佔據了獨特的市場地位。

Second, continuing to invest in and expand strategic marketing campaigns to accelerate brand awareness and consumer loyalty. We have been encouraged by engagement and early returns from our partnership with Professional Bull Riders and are exploring other brand partnerships and collaborations that align with FRE's Own Your Edge tagline and brand ethos.

第二，繼續投資和擴大策略行銷活動，以加快品牌知名度和消費者忠誠度的提升。我們與職業鬥牛士協會的合作取得了令人鼓舞的成果，並獲得了初步的回報。我們正在探索其他符合 FRE 「掌控你的優勢」標語和品牌理念的品牌合作。

With regards to Zig-Zag, we continue to execute marketing and sales initiatives that build upon our 145-year legacy and solidify our premium position across the segment. To build upon this legacy and reward our most loyal consumers while creating an opportunity for viral buzz, we launched a promotion called Zig-Zag for Life. This campaign offers an opportunity to win a lifetime supply of Zig-Zag cones to anyone who has or gets a Zig-Zag tattoo.

關於 Zig-Zag，我們將繼續執行行銷和銷售計劃，以鞏固我們 145 年的傳統，並鞏固我們在該領域的領先地位。為了延續這項傳統，回饋我們最忠實的消費者，同時創造病毒式傳播的機會，我們推出了一項名為「Zig-Zag for Life」的促銷活動。本次活動為所有擁有或即將擁有 Zig-Zag 紋身的人提供贏得終身 Zig-Zag 煙嘴的機會。

We also relaunched Zig-Zag Studio, a collaboration with creators and musicians to build upon the brand's strong association with pop culture. These campaigns magnify Zig-Zag's identity as an iconic brand and consumer interest has been encouraging. Of note, in the quarter, we also laid the groundwork for the launch of a new Zig-Zag product, Natural Leaf Flat Wraps to better compete in the ever-growing Natural Leaf segment of the wraps category.

我們還重新推出了 Zig-Zag Studio，這是與創作者和音樂家合作的項目，旨在鞏固品牌與流行文化的緊密聯繫。這些行銷活動提升了 Zig-Zag 作為標誌性品牌的形象，消費者的興趣也令人鼓舞。值得一提的是，在本季度，我們也為推出新的 Zig-Zag 產品——天然葉子扁平捲餅——奠定了基礎，以便在不斷增長的捲餅品類天然葉子細分市場中更好地展開競爭。

Lastly, turning briefly to Stoker's. We continue to see strong performance despite category pressure. In the quarter, we launched both a new product offering, Stoker's Fine Cut Wintergreen cans and Stoker's first-ever D2C site. Stoker's continues to be a steady heritage business with a very active and engaged consumer base.

最後，簡單談談斯托克。儘管面臨品類壓力，我們依然維持了強勁的業績。本季度，我們推出了新產品 Stoker's Fine Cut Wintergreen 罐裝飲料，以及 Stoker 的首個 D2C 網站。Stoker's 一直是一家穩步發展的傳統企業，擁有非常活躍且忠誠的消費者群體。

In closing, we continue to build our brands for the long term, execute against our omnichannel plan and win new consumers. Our focus is to prioritize strategic investments to maximize the value of our world-class brands and further strengthen our distribution capabilities.

最後，我們將繼續著眼長遠，打造品牌，執行全通路計劃，贏得新消費者。我們的重點是優先進行策略性投資，以最大限度地發揮我們世界一流品牌的價值，並進一步加強我們的分銷能力。

Let me now turn the call back over to Andrew to go through our financial results.

現在我把電話轉回給安德魯，讓他來介紹我們的財務表現。

Thank you, Summer. Sales were up 31% year-over-year to $119 million for the quarter. For the quarter, gross margin was 59.2%, which was up 360 basis points year-over-year and 210 basis points sequentially. The change in margin is mix driven, primarily related to our outsized growth in Modern Oral.

謝謝你，薩默。本季銷售額年增 31%，達到 1.19 億美元。本季毛利率為 59.2%，較去年同期成長 360 個基點，較上季成長 210 個基點。利潤率的變化是由產品組合驅動的，主要與我們在現代口腔領域的超額成長有關。

Reported SG&A was $44.5 million for the quarter, which was up $4.2 million sequentially. This increase was primarily driven by Modern Oral related sales and marketing investments as well as increased outbound freight charges to support our growing business. Adjusted EBITDA was up 17% year-over-year to $31.3 million for the quarter at a 26.3% margin.

本季報告的銷售、管理及行政費用為 4,450 萬美元，比上一季增加了 420 萬美元。這一成長主要是由於與 Modern Oral 相關的銷售和行銷投入，以及為支持我們不斷成長的業務而增加的出境貨運費用所致。本季調整後 EBITDA 年增 17% 至 3,130 萬美元，利潤率為 26.3%。

Going into segment performance. Zig-Zag sales decreased 11% year-over-year to $44.2 million for the quarter, but was ahead of our expectations. Gross margins increased 210 basis points to 57.5%, driven by mix shift and improved COGS pricing in certain Zig-Zag product categories. Stoker's net sales increased 81% year-over-year to almost $75 million for the quarter.

進入分段績效分析。Zig-Zag 的季度銷售額年減 11% 至 4,420 萬美元，但高於我們的預期。毛利率上升 210 個基點至 57.5%，這主要得益於產品組合的變化以及 Zig-Zag 某些產品類別的銷售成本定價的改善。Stoker公司本季淨銷售額年增81%，達到近7,500萬美元。

MST sales increased 6% year-over-year to $27 million for the quarter. Share in-store selling was up 130 basis points year-over-year to 12.1%. Loose leaf sales increased 4% year-over-year to $11 million. Our Modern Oral nicotine pouch sales, FRE and ALP, were up 628% year-over-year, achieving total revenue of $36.7 million. White pouch now accounts for 31% of our business, up from 26% in the second quarter and 6% a year ago.

MST本季銷售額年增6%，達2700萬美元。店內銷售份額較去年同期成長 130 個基點，達到 12.1%。散裝唱片銷售額較去年同期成長 4%，達到 1,100 萬美元。我們的現代口服尼古丁袋銷售額（FRE 和 ALP）年增 628%，總收入達到 3,670 萬美元。白色包裝袋目前占我們業務的 31%，高於第二季的 26% 和一年前的 6%。

Moving to the balance sheet. We ended the quarter with just over $201 million of cash. Free cash flow for the third quarter was negative $1 million, including the first coupon payment on our 7.625% high-yield bond issued in February of 2025. As Graham mentioned, during the quarter, we raised $100 million of gross proceeds and $97.5 million of net proceeds at an average price of $98.59 per share under our previously announced ATM program to support our white pouch growth initiatives. CapEx for the quarter was $3.8 million.

接下來查看資產負債表。本季末，我們持有的現金略高於 2.01 億美元。第三季自由現金流為負 100 萬美元，其中包括我們於 2025 年 2 月發行的 7.625% 高收益債券的第一筆票息支付。正如格雷厄姆所提到的，本季我們透過先前宣布的 ATM 計畫籌集了 1 億美元的總收益和 9,750 萬美元的淨收益，平均每股價格為 98.59 美元，以支持我們的白袋成長計畫。本季資本支出為380萬美元。

On to guidance and other items. As previously noted, we are increasing our full year 2025 adjusted EBITDA guidance to $115 million to $120 million from $110 million to $114 million and also increasing our anticipated total Modern Oral sales range to $125 million to $130 million from the previous range of $100 million to $110 million. This guidance reflects increased investment in our go-to-market plan as well as tariff and currency-related impacts.

接下來是指導和其他事項。如前所述，我們將 2025 年全年調整後 EBITDA 預期從 1.1 億美元至 1.14 億美元上調至 1.15 億美元至 1.2 億美元，並將 Modern Oral 的預期總銷售額範圍從先前的 1 億美元至 1.1 億美元上調至 1.25 億美元至 1.33 億美元。此指導意見反映了我們對市場推廣計劃的加大投入，以及關稅和貨幣相關影響。

For modeling purposes, the effective income tax range is 23% to 26% on a go-forward basis. Budgeted CapEx for 2025 is $4 million to $5 million, exclusive of projects related to our Modern Oral business. We expect to spend between $3 million to $5 million for the full year to supplement our Modern Oral PMTAs.

為便於建模，未來實際所得稅率範圍為 23% 至 26%。2025 年的預算資本支出為 400 萬至 500 萬美元，不包括與我們的現代口腔業務相關的項目。我們預計全年將花費 300 萬至 500 萬美元來補充我們的現代口腔 PMTA。

Now let me turn it back over to Graham.

現在我把麥克風交還給葛拉漢。

To conclude, we are pleased with our third quarter results, and I'll now turn it over to questions.

最後，我們對第三季的業績感到滿意，現在我將把提問環節交給各位。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

Eric Des Lauriers, Craig-Hallum.

埃里克·德·勞里耶，克雷格-哈勒姆。

Congrats on yet another fantastic quarter here. First question for me, just on the onshoring, nice to see. How should we think about this from a capacity standpoint? And how are you thinking about sort of COGS per unit for nicotine pouches produced onshore versus via your co-manufacturing partner right now?

恭喜你們又一個季度取得如此出色的成績。我的第一個問題是關於本土化生產，很高興看到這種情況。從產能角度來看，我們該如何看待這個問題？那麼，您目前是如何考慮在國內生產尼古丁袋與透過代工夥伴生產的尼古丁袋的單位銷售成本的呢？

Eric, thanks for the question. So the way we're thinking about the unit economics for our white pouch is with onshoring, we'll have sort of immediate savings in terms of inbound freight as well as avoidance around tariff. So we should have favorability on those two items out of the gates once we actually qualify the lines, which we're expecting in the first half of 2026. And then on an ongoing basis, as we get volume on those lines, we expect the unit economics to improve from there.

艾瑞克，謝謝你的提問。因此，我們對白色包裝袋的單位經濟效益的考慮是，透過本土化生產，我們可以在進口貨運方面立即節省成本，並避免關稅。因此，一旦我們真正確定了生產線，我們預計在 2026 年上半年，這兩個項目應該會一開始就獲得優勢。然後，隨著這些生產線產量的不斷增加，我們預期單位經濟效益將隨之改善。

Okay. Great. That's very encouraging. And then just any commentary on that capacity standpoint, how we should think about this?

好的。偉大的。這非常令人鼓舞。那麼，從能力角度來看，我們該如何看待這個問題呢？

Yes. Look, I think that as we've disclosed in the past, we feel good about the capacity that we've got with our third-party manufacturer. And the capacity that we get in the US will be additive to that. So we believe that we're in a very good position, both from an inventory perspective that we have on hand today as well as capacity on a go-forward basis.

是的。你看，我認為正如我們過去所透露的那樣，我們對與第三方製造商的合作能力感到滿意。而我們在美國所獲得的產能將在此基礎上增加。因此，我們相信我們處於非常有利的地位，無論是從我們目前的庫存情況，還是從未來的產能來看都是如此。

All right. That's encouraging. And then just as a kind of follow-up here. Could you comment on what you're seeing from an in-store market share perspective for your Modern Oral category here? Just any -- I know it's still very early and you're still rolling out, but any comments on early kind of in-store market share would be helpful.

好的。這令人鼓舞。然後，這裡就順便提一下後續問題。您能否從店內市場份額的角度談談您目前在現代口腔護理品類方面觀察到的情況？任何意見——我知道現在還處於非常早期的階段，你們還在推廣階段，但任何關於早期店內市場份額的評論都會很有幫助。

Yes. Look, it's -- we certainly haven't disclosed that publicly, but it's really sort of bifurcated at this point. Obviously, you have sort of a national perspective on where our market share sits from a national standpoint. As we grow our distribution base, we're really focused on share in-store selling. And I'll tell you, we're highly encouraged by those results.

是的。你看，雖然我們還沒有公開披露這一點，但目前情況確實有些分化。顯然，從全國範圍來看，您對我們的市場份額處於什麼位置有一定的全國性看法。隨著我們分銷通路的拓展，我們非常注重提升店內銷售份額。我可以告訴你，我們對這些結果感到非常鼓舞。

Ian Zaffino, Oppenheimer.

伊恩·扎菲諾，奧本海默。

Really good quarter. Question would be, can you maybe talk about the MST and looseleaf growth there? What was driving that as far as price, volume and kind of market share, if you could talk about that?

本季表現非常出色。請問您能否談談MST和散葉生長的情況？如果可以的話，請談談是什麼因素驅動了價格、銷售和市場佔有率的變化？

Yes. I would say that it's a combination of a couple of those things. We grew share sequentially in the quarter as well as there was some favorability around pricing. I would note that we anticipate that there's going to be north of 900 million cans sold in that category. We still have less than 10% share, although it's high single-digit share. We think there's tremendous opportunity for further gains within MST. So we remain excited about the opportunity.

是的。我認為這是其中幾個因素共同作用的結果。本季我們的市佔率季增，同時價格方面也有一些利多因素。我想指出的是，我們預計該類別的罐頭銷量將超過 9 億罐。雖然我們的市佔率已經接近10%，但仍低於10%。我們認為MST領域還有巨大的進一步發展機會。因此，我們仍然對這個機會感到興奮。

Okay. And then on Modern Oral, can you just maybe help us understand the drivers there, FRE versus ALP? Maybe you could talk about each one and what you're seeing there. And then as you kind of continue to push into larger chains, what kind of cadence should we expect as those start to hit and as your discussions have been ongoing?

好的。關於現代口語，您能否幫我們理解其中的驅動因素，FRE 與 ALP 的差異？或許你可以談談每個地方，以及在那裡看到了什麼。然後，隨著你們繼續推進更大規模的連鎖店建設，當這些連鎖店開始推出產品時，我們應該期待怎樣的節奏？鑑於你們的討論一直在進行，我們該期待怎樣的節奏？

Sure. I'll take the first part of that question. To this point, we haven't disclosed the differentiation between FRE and ALP given the sensitivity around the partnership. What I can say is we saw healthy growth from both properties during the quarter. So we were excited about that.

當然。我來回答這個問題的第一部分。到目前為止，鑑於合作關係的敏感性，我們還沒有揭露 FRE 和 ALP 之間的差異。我可以肯定地說，本季這兩個物業的業績都實現了健康成長。所以我們對此感到很興奮。

Our ALP business continues to dominate from a B2C standpoint, but they are also making some inroads into some bricks-and-mortar accounts. We're highly encouraged by the results of some of those early tests in there. FRE had a very nice quarter, both online as well as in bricks and mortar.

從 B2C 的角度來看，我們的 ALP 業務仍然佔據主導地位，但他們也正在逐步打入一些實體店客戶。我們對其中一些早期測試的結果感到非常鼓舞。FRE本季業績非常好，線上和實體店的業績都很不錯。

I'll pass it over to Summer to answer the second part of the question there for you, Ian.

伊恩，我會把這個問題的第二部分交給薩默來回答。

We continue to make progress in both new chains and expanding our SKU assortment in existing chains. So we remain really excited and encouraged about our progress there. And in particular, with some of the partners we've had for a while, both sides continue to be happy with the partnership, and we're excited to see how it evolves in coming quarters.

我們在拓展新連鎖店和擴大現有連鎖店的 SKU 品種方面都持續取得進展。因此，我們對在那裡取得的進展仍然感到非常興奮和鼓舞。尤其是一些與我們合作已久的合作夥伴，雙方都對合作關係感到滿意，我們很期待看到這種合作關係在未來幾季的發展。

And as we look toward progressing in upcoming quarters, major chains are in the process of evaluating their planograms for next year, and we're in those conversations, same as our competitors. So we look forward to how the next few quarters roll out.

展望未來幾季的發展，各大連鎖店正在評估明年的商品陳列圖，我們也參與了這些討論，就像我們的競爭對手一樣。所以，我們很期待接下來幾季的發展。

Okay. And then if I could just ask one more here. As far as in Modern Oral, the promotions, how did you handle the promotions that we saw a couple of months ago? And how do you kind of navigate the landscape given that? Or what's kind of, I guess, your overall view of how the category is going to kind of play out over -- the competitive landscape is going to play out over the next, call it, quarter or two quarters or so?

好的。如果我能再問一個問題的話。至於Modern Oral的推廣活動，您是如何處理幾個月前我們看到的那些推廣活動的？那麼，在這種情況下，你該如何應對呢？或者說，您如何看待這個品類在接下來的一個季度或兩個季度左右的發展趨勢——競爭格局將如何變化？

Sure. Look, I remain bullish on the category. And one of those sort of foundational components about that bullishness is around the balance sheets that the large manufacturers have to deploy against converting consumers into the category. We believe we have a winning format as well as two winning brands that give us an opportunity to really chase after consumers. Obviously, Q3 was a brutal promotional quarter, but not for us.

當然。你看，我仍然看好這個領域。而這種樂觀情緒的基礎組成部分之一，是大型廠商必須動用資產負債表來吸引消費者購買該品類的產品。我們相信我們擁有成功的商業模式和兩個成功的品牌，這讓我們有機會真正吸引消費者。顯然，第三季度是一個競爭激烈的促銷季度，但對我們來說並非如此。

We sort of maintained the integrity of our pricing at retail. We continue to focus on the things that we know win for our brands, which is getting more shelf space, getting broader presence in the store. So we really did participate within the quarter as we saw the major competitors sort of deploy their promotional resources in the market.

我們基本上保持了零售價格的完整性。我們將繼續專注於那些我們知道能為我們的品牌帶來成功的事情，那就是獲得更多的貨架空間，在商店中獲得更廣泛的曝光。因此，我們看到主要競爭對手在本季積極參與了市場推廣活動。

And look, we think long term, there's going to be strategic opportunities for us to invest in opening up the funnel for the consumer, but we're taking a really measured approach and really reading our data and listening to what consumers are telling us within our online platforms, which gives us somewhat of a distinct advantage when we have that really direct touch point with our consumer.

而且，我們認為從長遠來看，未來會有策略機會讓我們投資，進而拓寬消費者的購買管道。但我們正在採取非常謹慎的方式，認真閱讀數據，傾聽消費者在我們線上平台上的回饋，這讓我們在與消費者建立真正直接的聯繫時，擁有了明顯的優勢。

So we'll be opportunistic in terms of the way we think about deploying our promotional dollars from a retail standpoint. But more importantly, we're really focused on getting our platform right in the store because we see when we do that, that we have a really great opportunity to win consumers.

因此，從零售角度來看，我們在考慮如何運用促銷資金時，會採取機會主義的態度。但更重要的是，我們真正專注於把我們的平台在商店裡做好，因為我們看到，當我們做到這一點時，我們就有非常好的機會贏得消費者。

Aaron Grey, Alliance Global Partners.

Aaron Grey，Alliance Global Partners。

This is John on for Aaron Grey. Congrats on the strong quarter. So I know in the prepared remarks, you touched on the go-to-market strategy progress. But in terms of distribution, do you still see meaningful white space opportunities for FRE more so near term?

這裡是約翰，替亞倫‧格雷報道。恭喜你們本季業績出色。我知道您在準備好的演講稿中提到了市場進入策略的進展。但就分銷而言，您是否仍認為 FRE 在短期內還有有意義的空白市場機會？

And for ALP, when should we expect to see meaningful brick-and-mortar distribution? Were some of the initial brick-and-mortar channel pilots to see how ALP and FRE performed? Just any more color on what you think may be the right approach to promote the brands alongside each other would be helpful.

對於ALP來說，我們什麼時候才能看到有意義的實體通路？最初的一些實體通路試點計畫是為了看看 ALP 和 FRE 的表現如何嗎？如果您能再詳細說說您認為推廣這兩個品牌的最佳方法，那就太好了。

Yes. Look, we're excited about the continued gains that we make. We've mentioned in past quarters and as well as on this call that we continue to invest in our sales infrastructure to further our distribution gains in the market. Some are just noted a second ago, we're pleased with our progress against the chain accounts, both large and small chains.

是的。我們對所取得的持續進步感到非常興奮。我們在前幾個季度以及本次電話會議上都提到過，我們將繼續投資於銷售基礎設施，以進一步擴大我們在市場上的分銷份額。有些消息是剛才提到的，我們對打擊鏈帳戶（包括大型鍊和小型鏈）的進展感到滿意。

We do have an account that shares both platforms, both FRE and ALP. We've been excited about the results of sort of that shared platform inside the store. There's a tremendous amount of white space for both brands, albeit a little bit more for ALP at this point in time, given the fact that we've been focused on bricks-and-mortar distribution out of the gate, and ALP has been focused on direct-to-consumer.

我們有一個帳戶，可以同時在 FRE 和 ALP 這兩個平台上使用。我們對店內共享平台的成果感到非常興奮。這兩個品牌都還有巨大的發展空間，儘管就目前而言，ALP 的發展空間更大一些，因為我們從一開始就專注於實體店分銷，而 ALP 則專注於直接面向消費者。

So I think there's a really great marriage there as we move forward with tremendous opportunities for both brands to effectuate a broad-based distribution and really screen to multiple consumer audiences to give us the greatest upside to capture consumers into either one of the franchises.

所以我認為這是一個非常好的結合，隨著我們向前邁進，兩個品牌都有巨大的機會實現廣泛的分銷，真正面向多個消費群體，從而最大限度地吸引消費者加入這兩個品牌中的任何一個。

Great. And second, how would it be best to think about the approach to balancing profitability and growth? 4Q embeds a little bit of EBITDA margin pressure and the company has been able to achieve sizable growth while maintaining a healthy EBITDA margin of 26% year-to-date in 2025. Do you expect you'll be able to maintain that? Or could there be some EBITDA margin pressure even beyond 4Q as you invest in the promotional pouch environment?

偉大的。其次，如何才能最好地思考如何平衡獲利能力和成長？第四季 EBITDA 利潤率略有壓力，但該公司在 2025 年迄今仍保持了 26% 的健康 EBITDA 利潤率，並實現了可觀的成長。你認為你能保持下去嗎？或者，隨著您在促銷包裝袋領域的投資，第四季度之後是否可能會出現 EBITDA 利潤率壓力？

Yes. Look, we're not certainly going to comment on our investment strategy specifically for competitive reasons. I would say that at this point in time, we've struck a sort of a healthy balance between growth and profitability. And so I think that we'll be measured in the future in terms of how we deploy our resources around high-return projects.

是的。你看，出於競爭原因，我們當然不會對我們的投資策略發表評論。我認為，目前我們已經在成長和獲利能力之間取得了一種健康的平衡。所以我認為，未來衡量我們的標準將是我們如何將資源部署到高回報項目上。

Nick Anderson, ROTH Capital Partners.

Nick Anderson，ROTH Capital Partners。

Congrats on the quarter. First one for me, just on Modern Oral. Given the growth in the category, have you seen any noticeable changes in shelf space allocation by retailers? I know someone mentioned the planogram phase going on now, but how do you expect that allocation of space to trend kind of going forward? And if Modern Oral products are gaining allocation, which products are losing allocation?

恭喜你本季取得佳績。這是我的第一篇，只講現代口說。鑑於該品類的成長，您是否觀察到零售商在貨架空間分配方面有任何明顯的變化？我知道有人提到了目前正在進行的貨架陳列圖階段，但您預計未來空間分配的趨勢會是怎樣的呢？如果現代口腔護理產品獲得了更多配額，那麼哪些產品的配額正在減少？

Yes. I'll take that question, and Graham can chime in as well. What we're hearing from retailers that they're really taking a methodical approach to how they do allocate space across their shelf and their back bar area, because they see the category dynamics shifting more to OST.

是的。我會回答這個問題，格雷厄姆也可以發表一下意見。我們從零售商那裡了解到，他們正在採取有條不紊的方法來分配貨架和吧台區域的空間，因為他們看到品類動態正在更多地轉向OST（其他商品和服務）。

And so they're being really diligent and deliberate about how they're allocating that space across the segments in the nicotine space and then being really thoughtful about which brands they're putting on shelf as well based on performance. And so we're happy to be part of those conversations.

因此，他們在尼古丁市場的各個細分領域分配空間時非常認真謹慎，並且根據產品表現，認真考慮哪些品牌上架銷售。因此，我們很樂意參與這些對話。

Yes. Look, I think we anticipate that the allocation of space for Modern Oral will grow given the underlying growth of the category. And I think it's really -- it's too difficult a question to answer specifically on which products will be displaced on the shelf because there's a lot of regional preferences around different types of products that sell nationally. So I think it's a little hard to say what could be displaced in that process. But from our standpoint, we think opening up more shelf space is just -- is a big tailwind for our business.

是的。你看，鑑於現代口腔護理類別的潛在成長，我們預期該品類的空間分配將會增加。我認為這確實是一個很難具體回答哪些產品會被擠出貨架的問題，因為對於在全國範圍內銷售的不同類型產品，存在著許多地區性的偏好。所以我覺得很難說在這個過程中哪些東西會被取代。但從我們的角度來看，我們認為開放更多貨架空間對我們的業務來說是一個巨大的利多因素。

Great. I appreciate that color. Second for me, just on the loyalty initiatives. You have ALP and FRE rewards programs online. Just wanted to get some color on how those are trending in terms of program growth and engagement, and if there's any noticeable difference in spend from these consumers in those loyalty ecosystems.

偉大的。我喜歡這個顏色。其次，我最重視的是會員忠誠度計畫。您在線上可以使用 ALP 和 FRE 獎勵計劃。我只是想了解這些項目在成長和參與度方面的趨勢，以及這些消費者在這些忠誠度生態系統中的消費是否有任何明顯的差異。

Yes. Look, I think having rewards programs on any D2C site is a smart strategy for a D2C brand because you're able to engage with those consumers that are loyal and coming back to purchase and engage with your brands. And those are really the customers that we highly value. And so as we continue to grow that program, we'll continue to evolve and engage with those consumers, and they're certainly the most valuable to us. And that first-party data and being able to understand their preferences is something that we're really focused on.

是的。我認為，對於任何 D2C 品牌來說，在任何 D2C 網站上設立獎勵計劃都是一個明智的策略，因為這樣可以與那些忠誠的消費者互動，讓他們不斷回來購買商品並與你的品牌互動。這些才是我們真正非常重視的客戶。因此，隨著我們不斷發展這項計劃，我們將繼續改進並與這些消費者互動，他們無疑是我們最有價值的。我們非常關注第一方數據以及了解他們的偏好。

Yes. And look, I'd like to add to that as well, both FRE and ALP, I think where we're particularly excited is the engagement with our subscription sign-ups on both platforms. While we haven't specifically pointed out what that growth is, we're very encouraged with the consumer adoption around our subscription service.

是的。而且，我還想補充一點，無論是 FRE 還是 ALP，我們尤其感到興奮的是我們在這兩個平台上的訂閱註冊參與度。雖然我們還沒有具體指出成長幅度是多少，但我們對消費者對我們訂閱服務的接受度感到非常鼓舞。

Gerald Pascarelli, Needham.

傑拉爾德·帕斯卡雷利，尼德姆。

Just on Modern Oral. Obviously, it's another very strong quarter, another very strong guidance raise here. But the guidance does imply that the trends that the revenue will slow, I think, to like mid-single-digit growth sequentially if you use the midpoint of the updated guidance here.

僅供現代口語使用。顯然，這又是一個非常強勁的季度，業績預期也再次大幅調高。但該指引確實暗示，收入成長趨勢將會放緩，我認為，如果採用更新後的指引的中點數值，則環比成長將放緩至中等個位數。

So if you could maybe just talk about some of the dynamics. Was there a potential pull forward in revenue in 3Q? Or is it fair to assume that there may be a certain degree of conservatism embedded in the new outlook just given some of the category dynamics? So any color there would be helpful.

所以，您能否談談其中的一些動態因素？第三季營收是否有可能提前成長？或者，考慮到某些類別動態，是否可以合理地假設，新的視角中可能蘊含著某種程度的保守主義？所以任何顏色都會有所幫助。

Yes. Gerald, great question. Thank you for asking. Look, I think the -- while we're excited about sort of the guidance increase, I think the area that we would point out is as we go out and we get on shelf and we negotiate those deals to get on shelf, that comes at the expense of contra revenue. And so I think in the out quarters, what you could expect from us is really to talk a little bit of the differential between our gross sales and net sales because of that dynamic of contra revenue. But that's really the area that speaks to your question.

是的。傑拉德，問得好。謝謝你的提問。你看，雖然我們對業績指引的提升感到興奮，但我想指出的是，當我們把產品上架銷售，並就上架銷售達成協議時，這會以犧牲部分收入為代價。因此，我認為在接下來的幾個季度裡，你們可以期待我們稍微談談由於抵銷收入的這種動態而導致的總銷售額和淨銷售額之間的差異。但這恰恰是能回答你問題的關鍵。

Got it. My next one is on gross margin for Stoker's specifically. Historically, a segment with gross margin that ranged in the high 50s or in the mid-50s to the high 50s. And over the past two quarters, now you're above 60%, which comes seemingly with negative mix shift from higher revenue growth in your Modern Oral portfolio.

知道了。接下來我要專門談談史托克公司的毛利率。從歷史上看，該業務板塊的毛利率在 50% 以上，或在 50% 以上。過去兩個季度，你的佔比已超過 60%，這似乎與 Modern Oral 產品組合收入成長較高帶來的負面組合變化有關。

So if you could just help us bridge what's driving this really strong margin? Have the margin profiles on both FRE and ALP come up maybe relative to where they were a few months ago as you continue to scale the brand? And I guess just like a long-winded way of asking like what's driving the 60%-plus margin in Stoker's?

所以，如果您能幫我們找出造成如此強勁利潤率的原因，那就太好了？隨著品牌規模的不斷擴大，FRE 和 ALP 的利潤率是否有所上升，與幾個月前相比是否有所改善？我想用一種比較囉嗦的方式來問：是什麼因素導致了 Stoker's 超過 60% 的利潤率？

Yes. Thanks for the question. So what's driving the higher margins in the segment is really mix. And what we're seeing is that we have a higher D2C in the Modern Oral part of that business. I think the thing that's important to keep in mind is that our freight expense is actually in SG&A and not in cost of goods. And so when you look at it, when you include the SG&A portion of that freight that's attributable, you will see some compression on the margins at the EBITDA line. But that's part of the driver.

是的。謝謝你的提問。因此，推動該細分市場利潤率上升的真正因素是產品組合。我們看到的是，在現代口腔護理業務領域，我們的直接面向消費者 (D2C) 比例更高。我認為需要記住的重要一點是，我們的運費實際上計入了銷售、一般及行政費用，而不是商品成本。因此，當你查看時，當你把應計入運費的銷售、一般及行政費用部分也算進去時，你會發現 EBITDA 行的利潤率有所下降。但那是驅動因素的一部分。

The other part of the driver is tariffs on a go-forward basis, we would expect to have more of an impact on tariffs. So as I think about the short term over the next couple of quarters, I would expect to see those margins come down just a bit due to margins, but also we'll still have a higher mix of D2C, which should elevate. But I'd expect net-net for those margins to come down just a bit.

另一個驅動因素是未來關稅，我們預計這將對關稅產生更大的影響。因此，展望未來幾季的短期前景，我預計利潤率會略有下降，但由於利潤率的原因，我們仍將保持較高的 D2C 比例，這應該會有所提升。但我預計這些利潤率最終會稍微下降一些。

Perfect. And then if I could just squeeze one more in. Just going back to some of the promo commentary. Graham, if you could just maybe provide I don't know, your near-term outlook on the category, what you expect from the promotional environment and whether or not you expect it to maybe become a little more rational in 2026 than it is currently? I would just love your thoughts there.

完美的。如果還能再擠出一個就好了。再回顧一下之前的宣傳評論。格雷厄姆，如果你能提供你對該品類近期前景的看法，你對促銷環境的預期，以及你是否認為到 2026 年它會比現在更加理性一些，那就太好了？我很想聽聽你的想法。

Yes. I appreciate the question. Look, you've got three well-run, well-financed companies with incredibly strong balance sheets. And they really -- this category sort of is an area that they have to win in, right? And so I think that with that as the backdrop, as they all fight for the consumer, I would anticipate that the promotional environment would be -- would remain healthy, driven by the large competitors in the category.

是的。感謝您的提問。你看，這裡有三家營運良好、資金雄厚、資產負債表非常穩健的公司。而且他們確實——在這個領域，他們必須取得勝利，對吧？因此，我認為在這種背景下，當他們都在爭奪消費者時，我預期促銷環境將保持健康，這主要得益於該品類中的大型競爭對手。

And from our standpoint, we're really focused in on building brand, building the connection with the consumer, both with our FRE and ALP properties and being really mindful of how we spend against the funnel and opening up for consumers. We certainly don't have the same types of resources that the large companies do, but we believe that we're -- our balance sheet for our size is it puts us in a really good position to sort of strike in the areas that make sense for our brands.

從我們的角度來看，我們真正專注於建立品牌，與消費者建立聯繫，無論是透過我們的 FRE 和 ALP 資產，還是非常注重我們在銷售漏斗中的支出，以及為消費者打開市場。我們當然沒有大公司那樣的資源，但我們相信，就我們目前的規模而言，我們的資產負債表使我們處於非常有利的地位，可以在對我們的品牌有意義的領域發動攻擊。

And so we're excited about the promotional activity from the standpoint of the growth of the category. This is the way the category gets to $10 billion or north by the end of the decade is by the conversion of cigarette consumers into Modern Oral, and there's no better companies to do that than the folks that own those cigarette brands.

因此，從品類成長的角度來看，我們對此次促銷活動感到非常興奮。到本十年末，該品類要達到 100 億美元甚至更高的規模，就是將捲菸消費者轉化為現代口含煙消費者，而沒有比擁有這些捲菸品牌的公司更適合做這件事的公司了。

So I remain bullish on the category. I'm particularly bullish on the large manufacturers converting consumers into Modern Oral. And I'm particularly excited about our brands and the properties of our brands relative to the variety of nicotine strengths, the flavors as well as the mouth feel. I think that when we have a consumer that tries our product, we have a really good shot at converting that consumer.

所以我仍然看好這個類別。我尤其看好大型廠商將消費者轉化為現代口腔護理產品。我特別對我們的品牌以及我們品牌的特性感到興奮，這些特性體現在尼古丁濃度的多樣性、口味以及口感等。我認為，當消費者嘗試我們的產品時，我們就有很大的機會轉化該消費者。

And so I don't anticipate that the landscape will lighten up anytime soon from a promotional standpoint. It's been going on for over a year now. There has been some large company in the space that has been on promotion at some point in time for well over a year now. And so I don't think it's going to change anytime soon from that standpoint. But we're just bullish and excited about our opportunity to win consumers because of our brand as well as the features and benefits of the product.

因此，從宣傳角度來看，我預期這種情況短期內不會好轉。這件事已經持續一年多了。該領域有一些大型公司，已經持續促銷一年多了。所以從這個角度來看，我認為這種情況短期內不會改變。但我們對憑藉我們的品牌以及產品的功能和優勢贏得消費者的機會充滿信心和興奮。

That concludes our Q&A session. I will now turn the call over to Graham Purdy for closing remarks.

我們的問答環節到此結束。現在我將把電話交給格雷厄姆·珀迪，請他作總結發言。

Thank you so much, everybody, for joining the call this quarter. Certainly, really excited about our Q3 results and really excited to talk to you as we bend around to 2026. So thank you so much for taking the time, and we'll talk to you all in a few months.

非常感謝各位參加本季的電話會議。當然，我們對第三季的業績感到非常興奮，也非常期待在展望 2026 年之際與您交流。非常感謝大家抽出時間，我們幾個月後再見。

Ladies and gentlemen, that concludes today's call. Thank you all for joining, and you may now disconnect.

女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝各位的參與，現在可以斷開連結了。