Turning Point Brands Inc (TPB) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good morning, and welcome to the Turning Point Brands Second Quarter 2025 Earnings Conference Call (Operator Instructions)

早安，歡迎參加 Turning Point Brands 2025 年第二季財報電話會議（操作員指示）

Please note, this event is being recorded. It is now my pleasure to turn the conference call over to Andrew Flynn, Chief Financial Officer. Please go ahead.

請注意，此事件正在被記錄。現在我很高興將電話會議交給財務長安德魯‧弗林 (Andrew Flynn)。請繼續。

Good morning, everyone. A short while ago, we issued a press release covering our Q2 results. This release is located in the IR section of our website at www.turningpointbrands.com. During this call, we will discuss our consolidated and segment operating results and provide some perspective on the operating environment and progress against our strategic plan.

大家早安。不久前，我們發布了一份新聞稿，介紹我們的第二季業績。本新聞稿刊登於我們網站 www.turningpointbrands.com 的投資者關係 (IR) 部門。在本次電話會議上，我們將討論我們的合併及分部營運業績，並分享一些關於營運環境和策略計畫進度的看法。

As is customary, I direct your attention to the discussion of forward-looking and cautionary statements in today's press release and the risk factors in our filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission. On the call today, we will reference certain non-GAAP financial measures. These measures and reconciliations to GAAP are in today's earnings release, along with reasons why management believes they provide useful information. I will now turn the call over to our CEO, Graham Purdy.

按照慣例，我請您注意今天的新聞稿中關於前瞻性和警示性聲明的討論，以及我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中的風險因素。在今天的電話會議上，我們將參考某些非公認會計準則財務指標。這些措施和與 GAAP 的對帳均包含在今天的收益報告中，同時也附有管理層認為它們提供有用資訊的原因。現在我將把電話轉給我們的執行長 Graham Purdy。

Thanks, Andrew. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining our call. Our consolidated second quarter results were better than expected and demonstrated continued progress against our plan. Revenue increased 25% to $116.6 million for the quarter, including $30.1 million in Modern Oral revenue. Modern Oral now accounts for 26% of our total revenue. Adjusted EBITDA increased 15% to $30.5 million for the quarter. We are increasing our adjusted EBITDA guidance to a range of $110 million to $114 million, up from $108 million to $113 million, inclusive of significant sales and marketing investments.

謝謝，安德魯。大家早安，感謝你們參加我們的電話會議。我們第二季的綜合業績優於預期，並表明我們的計劃繼續取得進展。本季營收成長 25% 至 1.166 億美元，其中包括 3,010 萬美元的 Modern Oral 營收。Modern Oral 目前占我們總收入的 26%。本季調整後的 EBITDA 成長 15%，達到 3,050 萬美元。我們將調整後的 EBITDA 預期從 1.08 億美元至 1.13 億美元上調至 1.1 億美元至 1.14 億美元，其中包括大量銷售和行銷投資。

We are increasing full year consolidated nicotine pouch sales guidance to a range of $100 million to $110 million, up from $80 million to $95 million. This includes both FRE and ALP. We are particularly pleased with the growth of our white nicotine pouch brands. Their long-lasting vibrant flavor options, comfortable mouthfeel and flexible nicotine levels have resonated with consumers, and we continue building FRE's presence in bricks and mortar.

我們將全年綜合尼古丁袋銷售額預期從 8,000 萬美元至 9,500 萬美元上調至 1 億至 1.1 億美元。這包括 FRE 和 ALP。我們對白色尼古丁袋品牌的成長感到特別高興。其持久鮮明的口味選擇、舒適的口感和靈活的尼古丁含量引起了消費者的共鳴，我們將繼續在實體店中打造 FRE 的影響力。

During the quarter, white pouch sales increased by nearly 8 times year-over-year and was up 35% sequentially. We believe ALP is now one of the top D2C pouch brands in America and is poised to expand into retail sooner than initially expected. We believe the nicotine pouch space, like most other nicotine businesses, will ultimately feature five to six widely distributed brands that command most of the market.

本季度，白色小袋銷量較去年同期成長近8倍，較上季成長35%。我們相信 ALP 現在是美國頂級 D2C 袋裝品牌之一，並且準備比最初預期更快擴展到零售領域。我們相信，與大多數其他尼古丁業務一樣，尼古丁袋裝領域最終將有五到六個廣泛分佈的品牌佔據大部分市場。

Analyst expectations for the size of the category differ, but most now believe it will approach $10 billion in manufacturers revenue by the end of the decade. Our Q2 performance supports our long-term target of double-digit market share in the category. In order to best position the company to capitalize on this multibillion-dollar opportunity, we have made and will continue to make significant investments in the business and refining our route-to-market strategy to prioritize white pouch while continuing to generate strong cash flow from our heritage brands.

分析師對該類別規模的預期各不相同，但目前大多數人認為，到2020年，製造商的收入將接近100億美元。我們第二季的業績支持了我們在該類別中實現兩位數市佔率的長期目標。為了使公司能夠最好地利用這個價值數十億美元的機遇，我們已經並將繼續對該業務進行大量投資，並完善我們的市場路線策略，優先考慮白色小袋，同時繼續從我們的傳統品牌中產生強勁的現金流。

As we mentioned last quarter, key investment initiatives include reallocating sales and marketing resources, increasing the headcount of our sales force, improving our online presence, ramping up investment in chain accounts and developing US manufacturing. We have been particularly encouraged by our ability to identify and onboard new sales talent. Our goal is to approximately double the size of our 2024 sales force by the end of 2026.

正如我們上個季度所提到的，關鍵的投資舉措包括重新分配銷售和行銷資源、增加銷售人員數量、改善我們的線上業務、加大對連鎖帳戶的投資以及發展美國製造業。我們對自己發現和引進新銷售人才的能力感到特別鼓舞。我們的目標是到 2026 年底將 2024 年銷售團隊的規模擴大一倍左右。

So far, we are ahead of schedule and pleased with the initial results. The rest of the Stoker segment portfolio also performed better than expected in the quarter. Overall, Stoker's revenue increased 63% to about $70 million, reflecting a 3% decline in looseleaf, a 4% increase in MST. And as April mentioned, our Modern Oral revenue increased by nearly 8 times.

到目前為止，我們的工作已經提前完成，並且對初步結果感到滿意。Stoker 其餘部門投資組合在本季的表現也優於預期。總體而言，斯托克的收入增長了 63%，達到約 7,000 萬美元，其中活頁紙收入下降了 3%，而 MST 收入增長了 4%。正如 April 所提到的，我們的 Modern Oral 收入成長了近 8 倍。

During the first quarter, Zig-Zag revenue was down 6.9% to $47 million, but essentially flat sequentially despite our focus on the white pouch category during the quarter. For modeling purposes, people should recall that in the second half of the year, we will continue to face difficult year-over-year comps due to the wind down of our CLIPPER business and the deemphasis of the cigar category. With that, I'll hand the call over to Summer to walk through the progress of our key go-to-market initiatives.

第一季度，Zig-Zag 的營收下降 6.9% 至 4,700 萬美元，但儘管我們本季將重點放在白色袋裝產品類別上，但營收與上一季基本持平。為了建模的目的，人們應該記得，在今年下半年，由於我們的 CLIPPER 業務的逐漸減少和雪茄類別的不再受到重視，我們將繼續面臨困難的同比業績。接下來，我將把電話交給 Summer，讓他介紹一下我們主要上市計劃的進展。

Thank you, Graham. As he shared, we've made exciting progress in the Modern Oral category so far in 2025. Throughout the quarter, we continued to receive favorable consumer and trade feedback, reinforcing our portfolio's meaningful points of difference in strength, moisture and flavor. We also continue to see increasing order and repeat purchase rates online and in wholesale. This strong performance continues to give us confidence in our brand investments, particularly in sales and marketing.

謝謝你，格雷厄姆。正如他所分享的，到 2025 年為止，我們在現代口語類別中取得了令人興奮的進展。整個季度，我們持續收到消費者和貿易商的正面回饋，強化了我們的產品組合在強度、水分和風味方面的顯著差異。我們也看到網路上和批發的訂單和重複購買率不斷增加。這一強勁表現持續讓我們對品牌投資充滿信心，特別是在銷售和行銷方面。

Key initiatives in this space include; first, we will continue growing the size of our sales force to increase the frequency of store visits with a focus on expanding distribution, improving brand merchandising and minimizing out of stocks at retail. As a result, we expanded our distribution and product assortment with notable chain partners throughout the quarter.

該領域的主要舉措包括：首先，我們將繼續擴大銷售隊伍的規模，增加店內訪問頻率，重點是擴大分銷、改善品牌行銷和最大限度地減少零售缺貨。因此，我們在整個季度與知名連鎖合作夥伴擴大了分銷和產品分類。

Second, strategic marketing campaigns to accelerate brand awareness and consumer loyalty. For example, in the quarter, we announced a long-term partnership with Professional Bull Riders or PBR. Few sports deliver quite like PBR, and we believe this opportunity will enable free to connect with consumers who appreciate authenticity, seizing the moment and pushing boundaries, core tenets that align with FRE's brand ethos.

第二，進行策略行銷活動，提高品牌知名度和消費者忠誠度。例如，在本季度，我們宣布與職業騎牛協會（PBR）建立長期合作夥伴關係。很少有運動能像 PBR 一樣，我們相信這個機會將使我們能夠免費與欣賞真實性、抓住時機和突破界限的消費者建立聯繫，這些核心原則與 FRE 的品牌精神相一致。

We marked our debut with this partnership at the PBR World Final Championship at AT&T Stadium in May, where the free brand was woven into fan experiences and the competition itself. We are looking forward to the PBR season officially kicking off this fall and integrating this partnership into 360 marketing campaigns.

我們於 5 月在 AT&T 體育場舉行的 PBR 世界總決賽上首次與該品牌合作，免費品牌融入了球迷體驗和比賽本身。我們期待 PBR 賽季於今年秋季正式拉開序幕，並將此次合作融入 360 行銷活動中。

We believe in the importance of building our brand for the long term, and we'll continue to invest to support growing consumer loyalty.

我們相信長期打造品牌的重要性，我們將繼續投資以支持不斷增長的消費者忠誠度。

With regards to Zig-Zag, we continue to execute marketing and sales initiatives that build upon our 145-year legacy and solidify our premium position in papers, cones and wraps. Recent new product introductions include the launch of hemp cones and pop tubes, which are singular cones available in our unbleached variety and sold in a reusable premium tube.

關於 Zig-Zag，我們將繼續執行行銷和銷售計劃，以鞏固我們 145 年的傳統，鞏固我們在紙張、錐體和包裝方面的領先地位。最近推出的新產品包括大麻錐和汽水管，它們是我們未漂白品種的單一錐體，並以可重複使用的優質管出售。

We have solid traction during this introductory period with more brand news to follow in upcoming quarters. As we shared last quarter, we anticipate second half headwinds within the Zig-Zag segment from cigars and CLIPPER lighters. Our expansion plans in these categories included investments behind some lower-margin products, which we deemphasized in light of tariff impacts and our reallocation of time and resources to our nicotine pouch initiative.

我們在此介紹期內擁有穩固的吸引力，並將在接下來的幾季中推出更多品牌新聞。正如我們上個季度所分享的，我們預計雪茄和 CLIPPER 打火機將在 Zig-Zag 領域下半年遭遇阻力。我們在這些類別的擴張計劃包括對一些低利潤產品的投資，考慮到關稅的影響以及我們對尼古丁袋計劃的時間和資源的重新分配，我們不再強調這些產品。

In closing, we continue building our brands for the long term, executing against our omnichannel plan and winning new consumers. We will continue to prioritize strategic investments to maximize the value of our world-class brands and further strengthen our distribution capabilities. Let me now turn the call back over to Andrew to go through our financial results.

最後，我們將繼續長期打造我們的品牌，執行我們的全通路計畫並贏得新消費者。我們將繼續優先考慮策略投資，以最大限度地提高我們世界級品牌的價值，並進一步加強我們的分銷能力。現在，讓我將電話轉回給安德魯，讓他介紹我們的財務結果。

Thank you, Summer. Sales were up 25% year-over-year to $116.6 million for the quarter. For the quarter, gross margin was 57.1%, which was up 310 basis points year-over-year and 110 basis points sequentially. The change in margin is mix driven.

謝謝你，Summer。本季銷售額年增 25%，達到 1.166 億美元。本季毛利率為 57.1%，較去年同期成長 310 個基點，較上季成長 110 個基點。利潤率的變化是由混合因素所驅動的。

Reported SG&A was $40.3 million for the quarter and up $3.9 million sequentially. The increase on a sequential basis is driven by continued investments in sales and marketing as well as temporarily elevated outbound freight charges. Adjusted EBITDA was up 15% year-over-year to $30.5 million for the quarter and a 26.1% margin.

本季報告的銷售、一般及行政費用為 4,030 萬美元，較上一季增加 390 萬美元。環比成長的動力來自於對銷售和行銷的持續投資以及暫時提高的出站運費。本季調整後的 EBITDA 年成長 15% 至 3,050 萬美元，利潤率為 26.1%。

Going into segment performance. Zig-Zag sales decreased 6.9% year-over-year to about $47 million for the quarter and is in line with recent quarterly performance. Gross margins declined 410 basis points, driven primarily by product mix due to an accelerated exit from our CLIPPER business.

進入細分市場表現。本季度，Zig-Zag 的銷售額年減 6.9% 至約 4,700 萬美元，與最近的季度業績一致。毛利率下降了 410 個基點，主要原因是我們加速退出 CLIPPER 業務導致產品組合下降。

Stoker's net sales increased 63% year-over-year to almost $70 million for the second quarter. Net sales for the MST portfolio grew 4% year-over-year to $29 million in the quarter. Share in-store selling was up 60 basis points year-over-year to 11.8%.

斯托克第二季的淨銷售額年增 63%，達到近 7,000 萬美元。本季 MST 產品組合的淨銷售額年增 4%，達到 2,900 萬美元。店內銷售份額較去年同期成長 60 個基點，達到 11.8%。

Stoker's chewing tobacco was the number 1 chewing brand in the quarter, gaining 160 basis points of share to 32.7% according to MSAI. Category performance was driven by a larger decline in premium loose leaf with Stoker's benefiting from consumer trade down. Our Modern Oral nicotine pouch sales, FRE and ALP were up nearly 8times year-over-year, achieving total revenue of $30.1 million, a 35% sequential increase. As Graham mentioned, white pouch accounts for 26% of our total revenue mix.

根據 MSAI 的數據，Stoker 嚼煙是本季排名第一的嚼煙品牌，市佔率成長 160 個基點，達到 32.7%。該類別業績表現受優質散葉煙銷量大幅下滑所驅動，而斯托克 (Stoker) 則受益於消費者的降價消費。我們的現代口服尼古丁袋銷售額、FRE 和 ALP 年比成長近 8 倍，總收入達到 3,010 萬美元，較上季成長 35%。正如 Graham 所提到的，白色小袋占我們總收入的 26%。

Moving on to the balance sheet. We ended the quarter with $109.1 million of cash and free cash flow for the second quarter was $11.2 million. CapEx for the quarter was $3.9 million. During Q3, we will have our first coupon payment on the $300 million, 7.625% bond that we issued in February of 2025.

繼續討論資產負債表。本季末我們的現金為 1.091 億美元，第二季的自由現金流為 1,120 萬美元。本季資本支出為 390 萬美元。在第三季度，我們將首次支付 2025 年 2 月發行的 3 億美元、利率 7.625% 的債券的票面利率。

On to guidance and other items. As previously noted, we are increasing our full year 2025 adjusted EBITDA guidance to $110 million to $114 million from $108 million to $113 million and also increasing our anticipated total Modern Oral sales range to $100 million to $110 million from the previous range of $80 million to $95 million.

關於指導和其他事項。如前所述，我們將 2025 年全年調整後 EBITDA 預期從 1.08 億美元至 1.13 億美元上調至 1.1 億美元至 1.14 億美元，同時將預期的 Modern Oral 總銷售額範圍從先前的 8,000 萬美元至 9,500 萬美元上調至 1 億美元。

This guidance reflects increased investment in our go-to-market plan as well as tariff and currency-related impacts. For modeling purposes, the effective income tax range is 23% to 26% on a go-forward basis. Budgeted CapEx for 2025 is $4 million to $5 million, exclusive of projects related to our Modern Oral business. We expect to spend between $3 million to $5 million for the full year to supplement our Modern Oral PMTAs. Now, let me turn it back over to Graham.

該指引反映了我們對市場進入計劃的投資增加以及關稅和貨幣相關影響。為了建模的目的，實際所得稅範圍為 23% 至 26%。2025 年的預算資本支出為 400 萬至 500 萬美元，不包括與我們的現代口腔業務相關的項目。我們預計全年將花費 300 萬至 500 萬美元來補充我們的現代口腔 PMTA。現在，讓我把話題轉回給葛拉漢。

To conclude, we are pleased with our second quarter results, and I'll now turn the call over to questions.

最後，我們對第二季的業績感到滿意，現在我將把電話轉交給提問者。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Eric Des Lauriers.

埃里克·德斯·勞里埃斯。

Great. Thank you for taking my questions. Congrats on a very impressive quarter here. Congrats on a very impressive quarter here. My first question is on ALP. Graham, I think you mentioned plans for the brick-and-mortar rollout were ahead of expectations. I'm just wondering if you could expand a bit on that and just how we should be thinking about the rollout of ALP from e-commerce to brick-and-mortar. Thanks.

偉大的。感謝您回答我的問題。恭喜您本季取得了令人印象深刻的成績。恭喜您本季取得了令人印象深刻的成績。我的第一個問題是關於 ALP 的。格雷厄姆，我想您提到實體店的推廣計劃超出了預期。我只是想知道您是否可以對此進行一些詳細說明，以及我們應該如何考慮將 ALP 從電子商務推廣到實體店。謝謝。

Yes. Look, I think that we've been pretty excited about the online results. In our estimation, they've grown the brand into one of the largest D2C brands. And I think that's given the team a lot of confidence to move forward with starting in bricks and mortar. It's super early innings.

是的。看，我認為我們對在線結果感到非常興奮。據我們估計，他們已經將該品牌發展成為最大的 D2C 品牌之一。我認為這給了團隊很大的信心，讓他們能夠從實體業務開始繼續前進。這是非常早期的局面。

And I think that as the bricks and mortar matriculate, obviously, they're a small sales organization right now. And so I would expect them to sort of plot along and gain stores over time as we sort of bend around the end of this year as they kind of just started the thought process of getting into it.

我認為，隨著實體店的不斷壯大，他們現在顯然是一個小型銷售組織。因此，我希望他們能夠逐步策劃並隨著時間的推移獲得商店，因為我們在今年年底左右就開始思考進入這個領域。

Got it. And should we think of the rollout for ALP as kind of following in the stores where FRE already is? Is it a bit of a different team or go-to-market strategy there? And then just kind of related to all that, just wondering how conversations with national chains are progressing.

知道了。我們是否應該將 ALP 的推出視為對 FRE 已在商店推出的一種追隨？那裡的團隊或市場策略是否有些不同？然後與所有這些相關的是，只是想知道與全國連鎖店的對話進展如何。

Yes, I'll take the first part of that question. Look, I think that inevitably, our goal with FRE is to be ubiquitously distributed across the United States. So eventually, there should be total overlap of those two brands. I think in the early innings, given the different sizes of the organizations, it will be a little bit hit and miss in terms of where that overlap may or may not exist.

是的，我回答這個問題的第一部分。看，我認為，我們對 FRE 的目標必然是在美國各地廣泛分佈。因此最終這兩個品牌應該會完全重疊。我認為，在早期階段，考慮到組織規模的不同，重疊是否存在可能會有點碰運氣。

And then with regards to expanding FRE in other national chain accounts and throughout the United States, we continue to see progress with the chains that we've spoken about in prior quarters. And throughout Q2, began to make significant progress with other nationally large recognized chains and are in the process of expanding in their geographies across the United States. So we're excited about the momentum that we have and more to come in short order.

然後，關於在其他國家連鎖帳戶和整個美國擴大 FRE，我們繼續看到我們在前幾個季度談到的連鎖店取得的進展。並且在整個第二季度，開始與其他全國大型知名連鎖店的合作取得重大進展，並正在向美國各地擴張。因此，我們對目前的發展勢頭感到興奮，並且很快就會有更多進展。

Ian Zaffino, Oppenheimer.

伊恩·扎菲諾，奧本海默。

Thank you very much. I wanted to just get a sense about the white pouch production, tariffs that you might be facing and then potential to maybe move production out of India. Thanks.

非常感謝。我只是想了解白色包裝袋的生產情況、可能面臨的關稅以及將生產轉移出印度的可能性。謝謝。

Ian, Andrew here. So as it relates to tariffs, as you've seen in the news, there's -- it's a dynamic environment. And what we're doing is we're focused on controlling our controllables. So we've built an inventory position around that product. So that gives us some insulation from a tariff increase -- we've also been negotiating with some of our suppliers across the board to get some reductions in our cost of goods.

伊恩，我是安德魯。因此，就關稅而言，正如您在新聞中看到的，這是一個動態的環境。我們正在做的是專注於控制我們可控的事物。因此我們圍繞該產品建立了庫存。因此，這讓我們免受關稅上調的影響——我們也一直在與一些供應商進行全面談判，以降低我們的商品成本。

And also, we've been looking at taking some price increases in different product lines. So we're managing the tariff headwind as best we can. And so as it relates to India and our production capabilities there, we've got plenty of capacity. So good news is we're feeling good about that.

此外，我們也一直在考慮提高不同產品線的價格。因此，我們正在盡力應對關稅逆風。就印度和我們在那裡的生產能力而言，我們擁有充足的產能。好消息是我們對此感覺很好。

And then in terms of the mitigation around the tariff exposure and bringing production to the US, we continue to invest. You'll see the CapEx was around $3.9 million for the quarter. So we continue to invest in that capability here in the United States.

然後，在減輕關稅風險並將生產轉移到美國方面，我們將繼續投資。您會發現本季的資本支出約為 390 萬美元。因此，我們將繼續在美國投資這項能力。

Okay. And then as a follow-up, would you be able to give us a breakout between ALP and FRE? And then also, what type of slotting fees are you facing now? Or did you pay last quarter? And how do we think about that going forward as far as cost to roll out and to expand distribution? Thanks.

好的。然後作為後續問題，您能否向我們介紹一下 ALP 和 FRE 之間的差異？另外，您現在面臨什麼類型的上架費用？還是您上個季度付款了？就推出和擴大分銷的成本而言，我們如何看待未來？謝謝。

Sure thing. So as much as I would love to disclose the ALP and FRE split, we've got a joint venture relationship with ALP, and it's something that we're not able to provide in terms of that split. In terms of slotting fees, look, this is a very exciting segment of the market, and it's competitive.

當然可以。因此，儘管我很想揭露 ALP 和 FRE 的拆分情況，但我們與 ALP 之間存在合資關係，因此我們無法就拆分提供這些資訊。就上架費而言，這是一個非常令人興奮的市場領域，而且競爭非常激烈。

And so we've got to pay fees to get into chains and all kinds of other retailers. And so that is something that we have invested in, and it's something that we will continue to invest in, and it's reflected in our top line guidance for the white pouch range that we disclosed this morning.

因此，我們必須支付費用才能進入連鎖店和各種其他零售商。這就是我們已經投資的東西，也是我們將繼續投資的東西，它反映在我們今天早上披露的白色小袋系列的頂線指導中。

Aaron Grey, Alliance.

亞倫·格雷，聯盟。

Hi, thank you for the questions. Congrats on the quarter. First question for me, I just wanted to talk about gross margins a bit, particularly Stoker's gross margin remains healthy. You called out mix kind of for the overall improvement in gross margin. Obviously, Stoker's was a highlight there. So just any color you can provide there, particularly as we think about pouches within that, that's a higher mix.

你好，謝謝你的提問。恭喜本季。我的第一個問題是，我只想談談毛利率，特別是 Stoker 的毛利率仍然保持健康。您提到了混合方式可以提高整體毛利率。顯然，斯托克是那裡的一大亮點。因此，您可以提供任何顏色，特別是當我們考慮其中的小袋時，這是一種更高的混合。

Historically, you had pointed to lower margins from pouches, but maybe better than you initially had expected. There's a lot of dynamics moving between DTC and brick-and-mortar. So maybe just any color in terms of how best to think about gross margins, particularly as we move forward. And it seems like we're going to get increasing mix in terms of coming from brick-and-mortar. Thank you.

從歷史上看，您曾指出小袋包裝的利潤率較低，但可能比您最初預期的要好。DTC 和實體店之間存在著許多動態變化。因此，也許就如何最好地考慮毛利率而言，任何顏色都是可行的，特別是隨著我們繼續前進。看起來，我們將從實體店獲得越來越多的混合。謝謝。

Yes. Thanks for the question, Aaron. Look, I think that we've got our Stoker's heritage business, which is our MST and our chewing tobacco brands. The margins there remain healthy and expanding. As it relates to Modern Oral, I think you rightly pointed out, there is -- you do have a mix of D2C versus bricks and mortar.

是的。謝謝你的提問，Aaron。聽著，我認為我們擁有斯托克的傳統業務，即我們的 MST 和嚼煙品牌。那裡的利潤率仍然健康並且不斷擴大。至於與 Modern Oral 相關，我認為您正確地指出了——您確實混合了 D2C 和實體店。

But I think in the early innings, we're pretty excited about where the margin profile of the business is. Now I think that we need to underscore that, as Andrew had mentioned in the last question, we intend to invest behind the brand. And so I think you can see a bit of lumpiness within the white pouch segment for us. But over the long haul, we have -- we're very bullish on the margin profile of the segment.

但我認為，在初期階段，我們對業務的利潤狀況感到非常興奮。現在我認為我們需要強調的是，正如安德魯在上一個問題中提到的，我們打算對該品牌進行投資。因此，我認為您可以看到，白色袋子部分對我們來說存在一些不平衡。但從長遠來看，我們對該部門的利潤率狀況非常看好。

Thank you. I appreciate that color there. Second question for me. Just as we think about pouch in the second half of the year. So guidance implies it will be roughly flat versus first half. I know there's some volatility in terms of new distribution and replenishing. So I wonder if you could provide some color in terms of new distribution you're expecting in the back half and what's embedded within that?

謝謝。我很欣賞那裡的顏色。我的第二個問題。正如我們下半年考慮袋子一樣。因此，指導意味著它將與上半年大致持平。我知道在新分銷和補貨方面存在一些波動。所以我想知道您是否可以提供一些關於您預期的後半部分新分佈以及其中包含的內容的詳細資訊？

And then maybe also some color in terms of how you're incentivizing the sales team that you're looking to double there. So any color you can provide in terms of how you're incentivizing them because this is a kind of different category in terms of growth you're seeing than some of the legacy categories you've seen, maybe where you're sourcing some of that sales force from? Thank you.

然後也許還會有一些關於如何激勵您希望加倍的銷售團隊的細節。那麼，您能否提供任何關於您如何激勵他們的詳細信息，因為就增長而言，這是一個與您見過的一些傳統類別不同的類別，也許您從哪裡獲得了一些銷售人員？謝謝。

Sure. So look, I think as long as it seems like it's been around, ALP has only been in the market for a few quarters now. And I think that a little bit of the guidance range is reflective of some of the unknown relative to the bricks-and-mortar launch and then ultimately, what the growth profile of both the brand properties will be on the D2C platforms.

當然。所以，我認為，儘管 ALP 看起來似乎已經存在，但它目前只在市場上存在了幾個季度。我認為，指導範圍在一定程度上反映了與實體店推出相關的一些未知因素，以及最終這兩個品牌在 D2C 平台上的成長情況。

In terms of how we go out and gain stores, obviously, that's a function of the amount of feet that you have on the street. We have continued to expand our sales force. I think we noted in the call that our plan is to double the 2024 sales force by the end of 2026.

就我們如何走出去並獲得商店而言，顯然，這取決於街上的人流。我們不斷擴大銷售團隊。我想我們在電話會議中提到過，我們的計畫是到 2026 年底將 2024 年的銷售人員數量增加一倍。

And obviously, with that expanded sales footprint, we would expect increased rates of distribution from our historical averages. So I think we're pretty excited about the way that we've resourced the brand at this point in time. We're in a trench warfare format here, and I think that we feel like we're moving our staffing in a direction that gives us the effective capability to compete against the broader market.

顯然，隨著銷售範圍的擴大，我們預計分銷率將比歷史平均水平有所提高。所以我認為我們對目前為品牌提供資源的方式感到非常興奮。我們正處於陣地戰的形式，我認為我們正在調整我們的人員配置，以便我們能夠有效地與更廣泛的市場競爭。

Nick s Anderson, ROTH.

尼克安德森，羅斯。

Good morning. Thanks for taking the questions. First one for me. Just on the Modern Oral promotional environment. We saw some aggressive marketing activity in the first half of the year. Your gross margin suggests you haven't been participating in this discounting. Just what are you seeing out there in terms of the pricing environment? And how are you planning on positioning your products against maybe a more aggressive promotional backdrop? Thank you.

早安.感謝您回答這些問題。對我來說是第一個。只是關於現代口語的推廣環境。我們在今年上半年看到了一些積極的行銷活動。您的毛利率表明您尚未參與此折扣。就定價環境而言，您看到了什麼？在更具侵略性的促銷背景下，您打算如何定位您的產品？謝謝。

Yes. Look, I think that since the category became competitive, meaning once it became a category that was beyond just the market leader, we've seen consistent promotion from one manufacturer to the next quarter-to-quarter. I think what's interesting for us is we're incredibly excited about the promotional environment from the standpoint of building awareness around the category.

是的。看，我認為自從該類別變得具有競爭力以來，這意味著一旦它成為超越市場領導者的類別，我們就會看到從一個製造商到下一個季度的持續促銷。我認為對我們來說有趣的是，從建立該類別的知名度的角度來看，我們對促銷環境感到非常興奮。

With the current estimates now sort of cresting the $10 billion by the end of the decade. This is actually how it happens as the large companies spend a ton of money speaking to adult vapers, adult cigarette consumers. And so we're actually very excited about that opportunity.

根據目前的估計，到本世紀末，這一數字將達到 100 億美元。事實上，情況就是這樣的，因為大公司花了大量的錢來吸引成年電子煙使用者和成年香菸消費者。因此，我們對這個機會感到非常興奮。

As you've seen with the results of the first two quarters of this year, we've had high promotional environments from a large competitor entering the market. You've seen our results. And I think we remain sort of optimistic, number one, around the benefits that our product, we think brings the end consumer relative to the mouth feel and the satisfaction levels that we provide.

正如您在今年前兩個季度的業績中所看到的，大型競爭對手進入市場，為我們帶來了強勁的促銷環境。您已經看到了我們的成果。我認為，首先，我們對我們的產品將為最終消費者帶來的好處保持樂觀，我們認為這些好處與我們提供的口感和滿意度有關。

That's not to say that from time to time, we won't partner with a chain or what have you to increase sort of in-store foot traffic around our brand. But at the same time, we think that we're sort of uniquely positioned in the long haul to be a premium brand in this category. And so that really excites us.

這並不是說我們不會不時與連鎖店或其他機構合作來增加我們品牌的店內客流量。但同時，我們認為從長遠來看，我們擁有獨特的優勢，可以成為這個類別的高端品牌。這確實讓我們很興奮。

That's great. I appreciate that color. Second for me, just on the MRTP applications and the opportunity there. Is this a path you would consider going down? And if these applications are passed, how would it change the way you could kind of go about marketing your Modern Oral offering? Thank you.

那太棒了。我很欣賞那個顏色。其次，對我來說，只是關於 MRTP 應用程式和那裡的機會。這是一條你會考慮走的路嗎？如果這些申請獲得通過，這將如何改變您行銷現代口語產品的方式？謝謝。

Yes. No plans at this point in time, and we remain committed to the current PMTA process.

是的。目前還沒有計劃，我們仍然致力於目前的 PMTA 流程。

Gerald Pascarelli, Needham.

傑拉爾德·帕斯卡雷利，尼德姆。

Great, thanks very much. Good morning, everyone. I just had a question on your legacy MST business. Just understanding that you're going to prioritize Modern Oral, which obviously makes sense. Your legacy MST business has been incredibly consistent. It grew again on a very tough comp this quarter.

太好了，非常感謝。大家早安。我只是想問一下您遺留的 MST 業務。只是了解您將優先考慮現代口語，這顯然是有道理的。您的傳統 MST 業務一直保持著令人難以置信的一致性。本季度，儘管競爭非常激烈，但公司仍再次實現成長。

And in the current environment, it's seemingly just very well positioned as a value offering, right? And so just looking forward, how do you think about managing growth and driving continued distribution and market share gains in Stoker's MST with growing and rolling out your Modern Oral business, which is still very early days. So any color on the balance, I think, would be helpful. Thank you.

在當前環境下，它似乎非常適合作為價值產品，對嗎？那麼展望未來，您如何看待管理成長並推動 Stoker MST 的持續分銷和市場份額成長，同時發展和推出仍處於早期階段的 Modern Oral 業務？因此，我認為天平上的任何顏色都會有幫助。謝謝。

Yes. I think what we've seen in the early innings is that there's been relatively strong overlap between the Modern Oral stores that we've focused on gaining distribution in and our Stoker's MST portfolio, which has allowed us the opportunity to cross-sell in those environments.

是的。我認為我們在早期階段看到的情況是，我們專注於獲得分銷的 Modern Oral 商店與我們的 Stoker 的 MST 產品組合之間存在相對較強的重疊，這使我們有機會在這些環境中進行交叉銷售。

So I think you're seeing a function of the sort of the early day synergy that we actually are really bullish on long term as we grow out our sales force. And look, I think you rightly pointed out, Gerald, that what we've seen from the large competitors and some of their announcements over the last couple of years is that premium MST has been very susceptible to the white pouch category.

因此，我認為您看到的是早期協同效應的作用，隨著我們銷售團隊的壯大，我們實際上對長期發展非常看好。而且，傑拉爾德，我認為你正確地指出了這一點，我們從過去幾年的大型競爭對手和他們的一些公告中看到，優質 MST 很容易受到白色小袋類別的影響。

And what we see within the underlying dynamics of MST is that there's still a large audience of committed dippers in the US. We believe we've got one of the best brands that has incredible quality around it, and we continue to provide value to those consumers.

我們從 MST 的潛在動態中看到，美國仍然有大量忠實的白銀愛好者。我們相信，我們擁有最好的品牌之一，其品質令人難以置信，我們將繼續為消費者提供價值。

And from an MST brand standpoint, we feel great about sort of the potential opportunity that's still in front of us. There's still a lot of runway in terms of store growth that we can get into. There's still pricing opportunities in the segment. And so I think we're still bullish on our MST business on a go-forward basis and think that there's a ton of opportunity out there to harvest.

從 MST 品牌的角度來看，我們對眼前的潛在機會感到非常高興。就門市成長而言，我們還有很長的路要走。該領域仍然存在定價機會。因此，我認為我們仍然看好 MST 業務的未來發展，並認為其中有大量機會可供挖掘。

Got it, super helpful, thank you. Just last one for me. I know it's early, obviously, but if you could share any learnings that you may have had over the past two quarters with both of these brands just in terms of the consumer reception or any feedback that you've had -- if you've had any, that would be helpful.

明白了，非常有幫助，謝謝。對我來說這只是最後一個。我知道現在還為時過早，但如果您能分享過去兩個季度您在這兩個品牌方面的經驗，包括消費者的反饋或您收到的任何反饋——如果您有任何反饋，那將會很有幫助。

Yes, sure. We continue to hear incredibly positive feedback from both consumers and retailers, as Graham has talked about, the power of the brand and the unique differences between our products relative to competition, including our variety of nicotine strengths, mouth feel and moist pouch.

是的，當然。正如格雷厄姆所說，我們不斷聽到來自消費者和零售商的非常積極的反饋，包括品牌的力量以及我們的產品相對於競爭對手的獨特差異，包括我們各種不同的尼古丁濃度、口感和濕潤的包裝袋。

So we continue to see increased reorder rates, increased trade receptivity and are very excited about the opportunities as they proceed. We also, as I mentioned on the call, recently participated in the PBR event in Dallas in May. We had a variety of consumers that we were able to engage with live. We were very active in that event and the consumer reception while we were there was really tremendous.

因此，我們繼續看到重新訂購率的增加、貿易接受度的增加，並且對隨之而來的機會感到非常興奮。正如我在電話中提到的，我們也參加了 5 月在達拉斯舉行的 PBR 活動。我們擁有各種各樣的消費者，並且能夠與他們進行現場互動。我們在那次活動中非常活躍，消費者的反應也非常熱烈。

At this time, there are no further questions. I'd like to turn it back over to Mr. Purdy.

目前，沒有其他問題。我想把它交還給珀迪先生。

All right. Thanks, operator. Appreciate everybody joining the call today. We're pretty excited about our Q2 results, and we look forward to talking to you in about 90 days or so about Q3.

好的。謝謝，接線生。感謝今天參加電話會議的各位。我們對第二季的業績感到非常興奮，並期待在大約 90 天後與您討論第三季的業績。

Thank you. This concludes today's conference call. You may now disconnect.

謝謝。今天的電話會議到此結束。您現在可以斷開連線。