Teekay Tankers Ltd (TNK) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to the Teekay Tankers Limited fourth-quarter 2023 earnings results conference call. (Operator Instructions). As a reminder, this call is being recorded.

歡迎參加 Teekay Tankers Limited 2023 年第四季財報電話會議。（操作員說明）。提醒一下，此通話正在錄音。

Now, for opening remarks and introductions, I would like to turn the call over to the company. Please go ahead.

現在，作為開場白和介紹，我想將電話轉給公司。請繼續。

Before we begin, I would like to direct all participants to our website at www.teekay.com, where you'll find a copy of the fourth-quarter and annual 2023 earnings presentation. Kevin and Stewart will review this presentation during today's conference call.

在開始之前，我想引導所有參與者訪問我們的網站 www.teekay.com，您可以在其中找到第四季度和 2023 年年度收益演示文稿的副本。凱文和史都華將在今天的電話會議上回顧這份簡報。

Please allow me to remind you that our discussion today contains forward-looking statements. Actual results may differ materially from results projected by those forward-looking statements. Additional information concerning factors that could cause actual results to materially differ from those in the forward-looking statements is contained in the fourth-quarter and annual 2023 earnings release and earnings presentations available on our website.

請容許我提醒您，我們今天的討論包含前瞻性陳述。實際結果可能與這些前瞻性陳述預測的結果有重大差異。有關可能導致實際結果與前瞻性陳述中的結果存在重大差異的因素的更多信息，請參閱我們網站上提供的第四季度和 2023 年年度收益發布和收益演示。

I will now turn the call over to Kevin Mackay, Teekay Tankers' President and CEO, to begin.

現在我將把電話轉給 Teekay Tankers 總裁兼執行長 Kevin Mackay。

Thank you, Ed. Hello, everyone, and thank you very much for joining us today for Teekay Tankers' fourth-quarter and annual 2023 earnings conference call. Joining me on the call is Stewart Andrade, Teekay Tankers' CFO.

謝謝你，艾德。大家好，非常感謝您今天參加 Teekay Tankers 第四季和 2023 年年度財報電話會議。與我一起參加電話會議的是 Teekay Tankers 財務長 Stewart Andrade。

Moving to our recent highlights on slide 3 of the presentation, Teekay Tankers reported adjusted net income of $99.5 million or $2.91 per share an increase from last quarter's levels of $76.6 million or $2.24 per share, respectively. The company's 2023 adjusted net income of $500.5 million or $14.65 per share was more than double our strong 2022 earnings and established a new record for Teekay Tankers' highest-ever annual net income.

轉向簡報幻燈片 3 中最近的亮點，Teekay Tankers 報告調整後淨利潤為 9950 萬美元或每股 2.91 美元，分別較上季度的 7660 萬美元或每股 2.24 美元有所增長。該公司 2023 年調整後淨利潤為 5.005 億美元，即每股 14.65 美元，是我們 2022 年強勁盈利的兩倍多，並創下了 Teekay Tankers 有史以來最高年度淨利潤的新紀錄。

Amid historically strong spot rates, the significant value of our high operating leverage is clear. As a reminder, for every $5,000 increase in tanker rates above our free cash flow breakeven of $16,000 per day, we expect to generate approximately $2.50 of annual free cash flow per share. We will provide further information of this later in the presentation.

在即期匯率歷史上強勁的情況下，我們高營運槓桿的重要價值是顯而易見的。提醒一下，油輪運價每增加 5,000 美元，超過每天 16,000 美元的自由現金流盈虧平衡點，我們預計每股每年將產生約 2.50 美元的自由現金流。我們將在稍後的演示中提供更多相關資訊。

In January, we gave notice to repurchase the remaining eight vessels on sale leaseback arrangements for $137 million. Once complete, this repurchase will bring the total number of vessels repurchased since March 2023 to 27 vessels for a total of $501 million, reducing our total debt outstanding to zero and decreasing our cash breakeven rates.

一月份，我們發出通知，以 1.37 億美元的價格回購剩餘的 8 艘售後回租船舶。一旦完成，此次回購將使自 2023 年 3 月以來回購的船舶總數達到 27 艘，總價值為 5.01 億美元，將我們的未償債務總額降至零，並降低我們的現金盈虧平衡率。

In line with our fixed quarterly dividend policy, we have declared a cash dividend of $0.25 per share for the fourth quarter of 2023. In the market, 2023 turned out to be the best year for mid-sized tanker spot rates in TNK's history due to a combination of strong oil demand growth, longer voyage distances, and low fleet growth.

根據我們的固定季度股利政策，我們宣布 2023 年第四季現金股利為每股 0.25 美元。在市場上，由於強勁的石油需求成長、更長的航程距離和較低的船隊成長，2023年成為TNK史上中型油輪即期運價最好的一年。

Rates have remained firm at the start of 2024, with seasonal and geopolitical factors adding to an already tight tanker market. Looking further ahead, we believe that strong tanker supply and demand fundamentals will continue to support tanker fleet utilization and rates over the next two years to three years, albeit with periods of pronounced spot rate volatility.

2024 年初，運價維持堅挺，季節性和地緣政治因素加劇了本已緊張的油輪市場。展望未來，我們認為，儘管即期運價波動明顯，但強勁的油輪供需基本面將在未來兩年至三年內繼續支持油輪船隊利用率和運價。

Finally, we sold two 2004-built Aframaxes during the fourth quarter for total proceeds of $46.5 million, recording a gain on sale of $10.4 million in December and an expected gain of approximately $11.5 million in Q1 of this year. Both of these vessels now have been delivered to their new owners.

最後，我們在第四季出售了兩艘2004 年建造的阿芙拉型油輪，總收益為4,650 萬美元，12 月份的銷售收益為1,040 萬美元，預計今年第一季的收益約為1,150 萬美元。這兩艘船現已交付給新主人。

Turning to slide 4, we look at dynamics in the spot tanker market. As mentioned on the highlights slide, mid-sized spot tanker rates during 2023 were the highest in Teekay Tankers' history, with rates averaging around $48,500 per day. Global oil demand grew by approximately 1.9 million barrels per day in 2023 per the IEA as the world continued to rebound from the COVID-19 pandemic, with particularly robust growth from China following the removal of travel restrictions at the start of the year as well as from India.

轉向幻燈片 4，我們研究現貨油輪市場的動態。正如亮點幻燈片中提到的，2023 年中型現貨油輪的費率是 Teekay Tankers 歷史上最高的，平均費率約為每天 48,500 美元。根據 IEA 的數據，隨著全球繼續從 COVID-19 大流行中反彈，2023 年全球石油需求將增長約 190 萬桶/日，特別是在年初取消旅行限制後，中國的成長尤其強勁，來自印度。

As a result, global oil demand moved above pre-pandemic levels for the first time to a record high of around 101 million barrels per day and has remained strong in the early part of 2024. Global oil supply also saw robust growth in 2023 despite OPEC-plus supply cuts due to high output from non-OPEC countries. Oil supply growth was particularly strong in the Americas, with US crude oil exports reaching a record high of over 4 million barrels per day.

因此，全球石油需求首次超過疫情前水平，達到約 1.01 億桶/日的歷史新高，並在 2024 年初保持強勁。儘管由於非歐佩克國家的高產量而導致歐佩克+供應削減，但全球石油供應在2023年也出現了強勁增長。美洲的石油供應成長尤其強勁，美國原油出口量達到每天超過400萬桶的歷史新高。

Tanker demand saw a further boost from longer voyage distances during the year, which was the first full year following the EU's ban on Russian crude oil imports and the G7's price cap which came into effect in late 2022. As a result, over 90% of Russian crude oil exports moved long haul to India and China during the year. While Teekay Tankers does not participate in this trade, there has nonetheless been a significant overall boost to mid-sized tanker demand.

今年是歐盟禁止俄羅斯原油進口以及七國集團價格上限於 2022 年底生效後的第一個全年，更長的航程距離進一步提振了油輪需求。因此，今年俄羅斯 90% 以上的原油出口都透過長途運輸運往印度和中國。儘管 Teekay Tankers 不參與此貿易，但中型油輪需求整體上仍顯著成長。

Finally, despite an almost total absence of tanker recycling, the global tanker fleet saw less than 2% growth in 2023 due to a very small order book. This was far outweighed by tanker ton-mile demand growth of well over 7%, leading to an increase in fleet utilization and strong rates.

最後，儘管幾乎完全沒有油輪回收，但由於訂單量非常小，全球油輪船隊在 2023 年的成長不到 2%。遠超過 7% 的油輪噸英里需求增長遠遠超過了這一增長，導致船隊利用率提高和強勁的利率。

Spot tanker rates remained firm at the start of 2024 due to a combination of strong underlying fundamentals, seasonal factors such as weather delays, and various regional disruptions. I'll give more detail on these factors later in the presentation.

由於強勁的基本面、天氣延誤等季節性因素以及各種區域幹擾因素，現貨油輪運價在 2024 年初保持堅挺。我將在稍後的演示中詳細介紹這些因素。

Turning to slide 5, we provide an update on our Suezmax and Aframax size spot rates in the first quarter to date. Based on approximately 68% and 67% of revenue days booked, Teekay Tankers' first quarter-to-date Suezmax and Aframax size vessel bookings have averaged approximately $50,100 per day $50,900 per day respectively.

轉向投影片 5，我們提供了迄今為止第一季蘇伊士型和阿芙拉型型即期運價的最新資訊。根據約 68% 和 67% 的預訂收入天數，Teekay Tankers 第一季迄今的蘇伊士型和阿芙拉型船舶預訂量平均分別約為每天 50,100 美元和 50,900 美元。

Importantly, I once again highlight the value being created by TNK's eight vessel chartered in fleet, with seven ships trading in the strong spot market. With an average in-charter rate level of $25,400 per day, the chartered in fleet has a current mark-to-market value of approximately $60 million, which is in addition to our owned fleet.

重要的是，我再次強調 TNK 在船隊中租用的八艘船舶所創造的價值，其中七艘船舶在強勁的現貨市場上進行交易。包租機隊的平均包機費率為每天 25,400 美元，目前以市值計算的價值約為 6,000 萬美元，這還不包括我們自有機隊的價值。

Turning to slide 6, we look at tanker supply and demand fundamentals, which we believe will continue to support high tanker fleet utilization for at least the next two years to three years. Global oil demand is projected to grow by around 1.4 million barrels per day in 2024 as per the EIA, with further growth of 1.3 million barrels per day in 2025. This is in line with pre-pandemic levels of growth and indicates that demand growth for oil remains robust, with consumption projected to reach 103.7 million barrels per day by the end of 2025, 3 million barrels per day higher than the levels seen prior to the COVID-19 pandemic.

轉向幻燈片 6，我們專注於油輪供需基本面，我們相信這將至少在未來兩年至三年內繼續支持油輪船隊的高利用率。根據 EIA，預計 2024 年全球石油需求將成長約 140 萬桶/日，2025 年將進一步成長 130 萬桶/日。This is in line with pre-pandemic levels of growth and indicates that demand growth for oil remains robust, with consumption projected to reach 103.7 million barrels per day by the end of 2025, 3 million barrels per day higher than the levels seen prior to the嚴重特殊傳染性肺炎大流行.

Meanwhile, the outlook for tanker fleet supply remains extremely positive, with minimal tanker fleet growth expected over the next two years to three years. This is especially true for 2024 with just 9 million deadweight tonnes scheduled to be delivered, the lowest annual total since 1997.

同時，油輪船隊供應的前景仍然非常樂觀，預計未來兩年至三年內油輪船隊的成長幅度將很小。2024 年尤其如此，預計交付量僅為 900 萬載重噸，這是自 1997 年以來的最低年度總量。

The tanker order book remains small by historical standards at around 7% of the existing fleet size, while forward order book cover at global shipyards stands at 3.5 years, meaning there is little spare shipyard capacity until 2027. The combination of a low order book, an aging tanker fleet, and a lack of shipyard capacity until 2027 should lead to exceptionally low levels of tanker fleet growth over the next three years, including virtually no fleet growth in 2024.

以歷史標準衡量，油輪訂單量仍然很小，約為現有船隊規模的 7%，而全球造船廠的遠期訂單期限為 3.5 年，這意味著到 2027 年，船廠的閒置產能很少。訂單量低、油輪船隊老化以及 2027 年之前造船廠產能不足，這些因素綜合在一起，應會導致未來三年油輪船隊增長水平極低，包括 2024 年幾乎沒有船隊增長。

As shown by the chart on the bottom of the slide, tanker ton-mile demand growth is expected to outstrip fleet supply growth this year and in 2025, continuing the trend that started in 2022 and extended into 2023. This compounding impact of demand growth exceeding supply growth should continue to support high levels of tanker fleet utilization and firm tanker rates.

如投影片底部的圖表所示，預計今年和 2025 年油輪噸英里需求成長將超過船隊供應成長，延續 2022 年開始並延續到 2023 年的趨勢。需求成長超過供應成長的複合影響應繼續支持油輪船隊的高利用率和穩定的油輪運價。

Turning to slide 7, we look at various events that are impacting tanker trades this year, which are creating additional rate volatility in an already tight market. Starting on the right side of the slide, Russian crude oil exports flowing long haul to India and China via the shadow fleet should continue to support mid-sized tanker demand in 2024. In addition, there have been increased attacks on Russian refineries and storage facilities in recent weeks, which may cut Russia's ability to produce refined oil products and lead to more crude oil being available for export.

轉向幻燈片 7，我們研究了今年影響油輪交易的各種事件，這些事件在本已緊張的市場中造成了額外的費率波動。從下滑的右側開始，透過影子船隊長途運輸到印度和中國的俄羅斯原油出口應會繼續支持 2024 年中型油輪的需求。此外，最近幾週針對俄羅斯煉油廠和儲存設施的襲擊增加，這可能會削弱俄羅斯生產成品油的能力，並導致更多原油可供出口。

In terms of oil supply, the majority of production growth in 2024 is expected to come from non-OPEC countries in the Atlantic Basin, led by the United States, Brazil, and Guyana. Given that oil demand growth is expected to be concentrated in Asia, there could be an increase in Atlantic to Pacific crude oil movements, which would be beneficial for tanker ton-mile demand.

在石油供應方面，預計2024年產量成長的大部分將來自大西洋盆地的非歐佩克國家，以美國、巴西和圭亞那為首。鑑於石油需求成長預計將集中在亞洲，大西洋至太平洋的原油運輸可能會增加，這將有利於油輪噸英里需求。

Disruptions to vessel transits in both the Panama and Suez Canals are also impacting the tanker market this year. While the Panama Canal is not a major transit corridor for crude oil tankers, the inability to transit the canal limits tankers owner's ability to reposition ships between the Pacific and Atlantic Basins and therefore creates inefficiencies, which from a tanker market perspective is generally positive as it leads to increased tanker utilization.

巴拿馬和蘇伊士運河的船舶過境中斷也影響了今年的油輪市場。雖然巴拿馬運河不是原油油輪的主要過境走廊，但無法通過運河限制了油輪船東在太平洋和大西洋盆地之間重新定位船舶的能力，因此造成效率低下，從油輪市場的角度來看，這通常是積極的，因為它導致油輪利用率提高。

With regards to the Red Sea, the increase in attacks on merchant shipping since last December is having an impact on tanker trade patterns. This is a dynamic situation. But in recent weeks, there have been an increasing number of ship owners and operators avoiding the region and seeking alternative routes that involve longer voyages.

就紅海而言，自去年 12 月以來商船遭受襲擊的增加正在對油輪貿易模式產生影響。這是一個動態的情況。但最近幾週，越來越多的船東和營運商避開該地區，尋求更長航程的替代航線。

For many vessels, this means sailing around the Cape of Good Hope, adding a significant number of voyage days and creating additional tanker ton-mile demand. For example, Suezmax voyage from Basra, Iraq, to the Mediterranean is about 4,000 nautical miles or 13 days via the Suez Canal compared to around 12,000 nautical miles or 40 days via the Cape of Good Hope. While it is impossible to predict how this situation will evolve, the rerouting of cargoes is likely to continue creating additional tanker demand in the near-term.

對於許多船舶來說，這意味著繞著好望角航行，增加大量航行天數並產生額外的油輪噸英里需求。例如，從伊拉克巴士拉到地中海的蘇伊士型油輪通過蘇伊士運河至地中海的航程約為 4,000 海里或 13 天，而通過好望角則約為 12,000 海里或 40 天。雖然無法預測這種情況將如何發展，但貨物的改道可能會在短期內繼續創造額外的油輪需求。

Finally, the expansion of the Trans Mountain pipeline to Vancouver, Canada, later this year will lead to a new source of Aframax specific demand. This pipeline with an increasing capacity of 590,000 barrels per day is intended to provide a new seaborne outlet for Canadian crude oil exports.

最後，今年稍後跨山管道擴建至加拿大溫哥華將為阿芙拉型油輪的特定需求帶來新的來源。這條管道的輸送能力將增加到每天 59 萬桶，旨在為加拿大原油出口提供新的海運出口。

Given that the terminal is restricted to Aframax sized vessels, is anticipated that the expansion could result in up to 30 to 35 Aframax loadings per month. This is an exciting development and has the potential to create significant Aframax demand once the pipeline is up and running, with the operator currently expecting the start of oil flows through the pipeline during the second quarter of 2024.

鑑於該碼頭僅限於阿芙拉型油輪大小的船舶，預計擴建後每月可裝載多達 30 至 35 艘阿芙拉型油輪。這是一個令人興奮的發展，一旦管道建成並運行，有可能創造大量的阿芙拉型油輪需求，營運商目前預計石油將於 2024 年第二季開始通過該管道。

So in sum, the numerous changes to trade patterns around the world, which I've just described, are leading to increased complexity and supply chain inefficiency, creating additional tanker demand as a result and spot rate volatility in what is already a fundamentally very tight market.

總而言之，我剛才描述的世界各地貿易模式的眾多變化正在導致複雜性增加和供應鏈效率低下，從而產生額外的油輪需求，並導致本已非常緊張的即期匯率波動。市場。

I'll now turn the call over to Stewart to cover the next two slides.

我現在將把電話轉給史都華來介紹接下來的兩張投影片。

Thanks, Kevin. Turning to slide 8, we outlined some of Teekay Tankers' key accomplishments in 2023.

謝謝，凱文。轉向幻燈片 8，我們概述了 Teekay Tankers 在 2023 年取得的一些主要成就。

As noted earlier in the presentation, financially, 2023 was a record-breaking year with the company generating just over $0.5 billion of adjusted net income and over $575 million of free cash flow. These strong results allowed us to transform our balance sheet, repurchasing 19 vessels from sale-leaseback arrangements and refinancing them with a new $350 million revolving credit facility, which provides us with greater financial flexibility.

正如前面介紹的那樣，從財務角度來看，2023 年是創紀錄的一年，該公司調整後淨利潤略高於 5 億美元，自由現金流超過 5.75 億美元。這些強勁的業績使我們能夠改變我們的資產負債表，透過售後回租安排回購19 艘船舶，並透過新的3.5 億美元循環信貸額度為其再融資，這為我們提供了更大的財務靈活性。

In addition, TNK ended the year with a net cash position of $226 million. As a reminder, after the repurchase of our final eight vessels in sale leaseback arrangements, we expect to be completely debt free by the end of the first quarter.

此外，TNK 年底的淨現金部位為 2.26 億美元。提醒一下，在透過售後回租安排回購最後八艘船舶後，我們預計到第一季末將完全擺脫債務。

2023 was also a year of strong operational performance with 99.8% fleet availability and zero lost time injuries, a metric that we don't often touch on during these quarterly investor calls, but which is extremely important for the safety of our crews and the reliability of our operations. Commercially, we continue to manage our lucrative time charter portfolio by extending in charters at rates well below the current spot market, enabling us to profit significantly from the spread.

2023 年也是營運績效強勁的一年，機隊可用性達到99.8%，誤工工傷為零，這是我們在季度投資者電話會議中不經常提及的指標，但這對於我們員工的安全和可靠性極為重要我們的營運。在商業上，我們繼續以遠低於當前現貨市場的價格延長租船來管理我們利潤豐厚的期租組合，使我們能夠從價差中大幅獲利。

With all of these accomplishments in 2023, the successful execution of our strategy has created significant value for our shareholders through a combination of returning capital via dividends and the appreciation of our share price. Since the beginning of 2023, we have generated total shareholder return of 109%, which further builds on the significant shareholder value Teekay Tankers created in 2022.

憑藉 2023 年取得的所有這些成就，我們策略的成功執行透過股息返還資本和股價升值​​相結合，為我們的股東創造了巨大的價值。自 2023 年初以來，我們的股東總回報率為 109%，這進一步鞏固了 Teekay Tankers 在 2022 年創造的重要股東價值。

Turning to slide 9, we highlight the potential for TNK to continue creating significant shareholder value in 2024, a year that we expect to be another strong tanker market. With 98% of our 51-vessel fleet operating in a strong spot tanker market that is supported by robust tanker supply and demand fundamentals and driven further by the various factors we have talked about today, we feel confident about our ability to continue creating shareholder value.

轉向幻燈片 9，我們強調 TNK 在 2024 年繼續創造顯著股東價值的潛力，我們預計這一年將成為另一個強勁的油輪市場。我們的51 艘船隊中有98% 在強勁的現貨油輪市場中運營，該市場受到強勁的油輪供需基本面的支持，並受到我們今天討論的各種因素的進一步推動，我們對繼續創造股東價值的能力充滿信心。

As a demonstration, if we used the trailing 12-month average of TNK's realized spot rates and project that forward, our annualized free cash flow would be approximately $16.30 per share or a free cash flow yield of approximately 28%. With this kind of operating leverage, strong prospects for mid-sized tankers moving forward, and a growing cash position, we're making progress in building Teekay Tankers' strategic optionality for future fleet reinvestment.

作為演示，如果我們使用 TNK 已實現即期匯率的過去 12 個月平均值並進行預測，我們的年化自由現金流將約為每股 16.30 美元，或自由現金流收益率約為 28%。憑藉這種營運槓桿、中型油輪的強勁前景以及不斷增長的現金狀況，我們在為 Teekay Tankers 未來船隊再投資建立策略選擇方面取得了進展。

I will now turn the call back to Kevin to conclude.

現在我將把電話轉回凱文來結束。

Thanks Stewart. In summary, as we experienced in 2023, the fundamentals of our business continue to be highly supportive for what could be a protracted period of mid-sized tanker market strength, most notably, a very positive tanker supply outlook grounded by a negligible multi-year newbuild delivery schedule. Oil demand continues to grow past the post-pandemic rebound. Beyond the fundamentals, a range of factors are introducing complexity and inefficiency into the market, tightening the supply and demand balance still further.

謝謝斯圖爾特。總而言之，正如我們在2023 年所經歷的那樣，我們業務的基本面繼續對中型油輪市場可能長期保持強勢提供高度支持，最值得注意的是，基於可忽略不計的多年供應前景，油輪供應前景非常樂觀。新船交付時間表。疫情後的反彈過後，石油需求持續成長。除了基本面之外，一系列因素正在為市場帶來複雜性和低效率，進一步收緊供需平衡。

Overall, we believe that our mid-sized tanker focus and spot market strategy places Teekay Tankers in an ideal position to continue capturing upside and realizing shareholder value moving forward.

總體而言，我們相信，我們對中型油輪的關注和現貨市場策略使 Teekay Tankers 處於理想的位置，可以繼續捕捉上漲空間並實現股東價值。

With that, operator, we're now available to take questions.

接線員，現在我們可以回答問題了。

Thank you. (Operator Instructions) Jon Chappell, Evercore.

謝謝。（操作員說明）Jon Chappell，Evercore。

Thank you. Good morning, Stewart and Kevin. First question is simply, what's next? You pointed out a great outlook for the industry. Your operating leverage is immense. You'll be debt free in a matter of weeks. What comes next that the deleveraging is done?

謝謝。早上好，史都華和凱文。第一個問題很簡單，下一步是什麼？您指出了該行業的美好前景。您的營運槓桿是巨大的。幾週之內你就會還清債務。去槓桿完成後接下來會發生什麼事？

Yeah. Jon, it's a good question. And I think it's really more of the same. I think we've been clear on -- over the last few quarters in explaining what our focus is.

是的。喬恩，這是個好問題。我認為這實際上更相似。我認為我們在過去幾個季度中已經明確地解釋了我們的重點是什麼。

Our strategy is to continue to both build the strong cash position to reinvest in our fleet and to reinvest in our business and, B, to reward shareholders through some of the capital allocation tools that we laid out in our capital allocation plan. So I think just because we've crossed the -- or we will cross the milestone of being debt-free, the strategy will remain the same.

我們的策略是繼續建立強大的現金狀況，以對我們的機隊進行再投資，並對我們的業務進行再投資，並且透過我們在資本配置計劃中列出的一些資本配置工具來獎勵股東。所以我認為，僅僅因為我們已經跨越了——或者我們將跨越無債務的里程碑，戰略將保持不變。

It seems like since the special dividend, I think, nine months ago now, there's been no real acceleration in the capital allocation. I don't think there's been much in terms of buyback, despite trading at a pretty big discount to most estimates of NAV. Do you think that that's something that accelerates now in 2024 as you wait for the opportunity to reinvest in the fleet?

我認為，自從九個月前的特別股息以來，資本配置似乎並沒有真正加速。我認為回購方面並沒有太多，儘管其交易價格比大多數資產淨值估計有相當大的折扣。您認為在 2024 年等待重新投資機隊的機會時，這種情況會加速嗎？

It's definitely something that, as I said, is in our tool bag. Nine months ago, when we rolled out our capital allocation plan, it was based on a holistic view of our needs as well as what shareholders are looking for. And I wouldn't read into the fact that we may not have used one or two of the tools so far.

正如我所說，這絕對是我們工具包裡的東西。九個月前，當我們推出資本配置計畫時，它是基於對我們的需求以及股東的需求的整體看法。我不會解釋這樣一個事實：到目前為止我們可能還沒有使用過其中一兩個工具。

We put them in there for a specific reason, and the discussion that we have at management level and with the board is always a holistic one around where we're going, where can we add the best value, and what should we do with the money we're generating. So I think I wouldn't read into the fact that we haven't used anything so far as something that indicates that we won't be using them in the future.

我們將它們放在那裡是有特定原因的，我們在管理層和董事會進行的討論始終是圍繞我們的發展方向、我們可以在哪裡增加最佳價值以及我們應該如何處理這些問題的整體討論。我們正在創造的錢。因此，我認為我不會解讀我們尚未使用任何東西這一事實，因為這表明我們將來不會使用它們。

Okay. Just one more quick one. I mean, selling older assets makes a ton of sense, especially at these levels, and you're continuing to do that. Should we maybe think about renewing the fleet through sale, and then just creating this massive buffer for when the cycle inevitably turns, and then being opportunistic at some point in the medium to distant future?

好的。只要再快一點就好了。我的意思是，出售舊資產非常有意義，尤其是在目前的水平上，而且您將繼續這樣做。我們是否應該考慮透過出售來更新機隊，然後在周期不可避免地發生轉變時創造巨大的緩衝，然後在中等到遙遠的未來的某個時刻採取機會主義？

I think there's a lot of ways you can look at it. And we're not agnostic -- sorry, we are agnostic to where we can bring the most value to shareholders over time. So in terms of what we're looking at, whether it's small acquisitions, large acquisitions, fleet dispositions, exiting individual ship assets as we did last quarter, those are all in the discussion that we have, both management and Board level.

我認為您可以透過多種方式來看待它。我們並不是不可知論者——抱歉，我們不知道隨著時間的推移，我們可以在哪裡為股東帶來最大的價值。因此，就我們所關注的內容而言，無論是小型收購、大型收購、船隊處置或像上季度那樣退出個別船舶資產，這些都在我們管理層和董事會層面的討論中。

Okay. Thank you, Kevin.

好的。謝謝你，凱文。

Thanks, Jon.

謝謝，喬恩。

Omar Nokta, Jefferies.

奧馬爾諾克塔，傑弗里斯。

Thank you. Hi, Kevin. Hi, Stewart. Thanks for taking my question. I do have a couple and definitely continuing the theme of Jon's question. Stewart, you mentioned in your opening comments about you're getting to the point now where you have optionality for future fleet reinvestment. And you've been selling the older vessels, makes sense. You haven't been replacing them with modern ones.

謝謝。嗨，凱文。嗨，斯圖爾特。感謝您提出我的問題。我確實有幾個並且肯定延續了喬恩問題的主題。斯圖爾特，您在開場白中提到您現在已經到了可以選擇未來機隊再投資的地步。你一直在出售舊船，這是有道理的。你還沒有用現代的取代它們。

So just wanted to check it and how you're thinking about the planned -- perhaps planned retooling of Teekay Tankers. Is it given the fact that asset values have started to really run away, are we -- are you thinking that maybe you closed the book on reinvestment in this upcycle? And is the plan basically you build a war chest and be prepared for investments when the market eventually rolls over?

所以只是想檢查一下，以及您如何考慮計劃中的——也許是計劃中的 Teekay Tankers 的重組。考慮到資產價值已經開始真正失控，我們——你是否認為你可能在這個上升週期結束了關於再投資的書？該計劃基本上是建立一個戰爭基金，並為市場最終好轉時的投資做好準備嗎？

That's one question I have. And then maybe the second part of that is perhaps, is tankers where you want to be long-term or are you thinking of diverting down the line?

這是我的一個問題。然後也許第二部分是，油輪是您想要長期存在的地方還是您正在考慮改道？

Hi, Omar. Thanks for the very good questions. So maybe taking the first one first. So we've been selling some vessels, a couple of vessels, our 2004 built, which were about to turn 20 years old and were drydock due. So that's just a normal part of moving those vessels on.

嗨，奧馬爾。感謝您提出非常好的問題。所以也許先拿第一個。因此，我們一直在出售一些船隻，其中有幾艘是我們在 2004 年建造的，這些船隻的船齡即將滿 20 年，即將進塢。所以這只是讓這些船隻繼續前進的正常部分。

In terms of looking at reinvestment, I guess, there's a couple of ways to look at it. Yes, asset prices are quite high. We also have a view that the tanker market is going to be very robust over the next few years.

在看待再投資方面，我想，有幾種看待它的方法。是的，資產價格相當高。我們也認為，未來幾年油輪市場將非常強勁。

So part of the consideration is always what are you paying for those assets, how much cash flow can you generate from them over the next few years, and you're potentially paying them down to a level that you'd be comfortable at. So just like time charters, in and out, are always looked at, we're also looking at S&P.

因此，部分考慮因素始終是您為這些資產支付的費用是多少，未來幾年您可以從這些資產中產生多少現金流，以及您可能會將其支付到您感到滿意的水平。因此，就像定期租船合約一樣，我們總是會關注進出期租船，我們也會關注標準普爾。

So I don't think that we've closed the book on the opportunity to buy vessels. So it's not that -- we haven't closed the book and we said, well, we'll just come back when asset values come down. So it's something that we're always evaluating.

所以我不認為我們已經結束了關於購買船隻機會的書。所以事實並非如此——我們還沒有結束這本書，我們說，好吧，當資產價值下降時我們就會回來。所以這是我們一直在評估的事情。

There's -- with our growing financial strength, we look at all sorts of opportunities, including the potential to acquire fleets, M&A, everything. So we are -- as Kevin likes to say, we are agnostic over the approach that we would take, and we look at all those things as opportunities to reinvest in the fleet.

隨著我們財務實力的不斷增強，我們正在尋找各種機會，包括收購船隊、併購等一切的潛力。因此，正如凱文喜歡說的那樣，我們對將採取的方法持不可知論，我們將所有這些事情視為對機隊進行再投資的機會。

So we are committed to reinvestment and we will -- if we can do it sooner and there's opportunities that we think will create value for shareholders, then we'll go ahead and do that. If we have to be more patient and wait, then we'll do that. So our eyes are always open, and we're looking for opportunities.

因此，我們致力於再投資，如果我們能更快地做到這一點，並且我們認為有機會為股東創造價值，那麼我們就會繼續這樣做。如果我們必須更加耐心等待，那麼我們就會這樣做。所以我們總是睜大眼睛，尋找機會。

In terms of the second part of your question about other segments, we're a tanker company. We've been in tankers since we were formed in 2007, and that is where our focus is. If we end up in a situation where we have a lot of capital to deploy and tankers -- and the window isn't open for tankers, but there's other opportunities in other segments, then of course, as a company, we would consider wherever we can create shareholder value.

關於你關於其他領域的問題的第二部分，我們是一家油輪公司。自 2007 年成立以來，我們一直致力於油輪領域，這也是我們的重點所在。如果我們最終遇到這樣的情況：我們有大量資本和油輪可供部署——而且油輪的窗口尚未打開，但其他領域還有其他機會，那麼當然，作為一家公司，我們會考慮在任何地方我們可以創造股東價值。

But we are a tanker company and that's what we've been focused on. And at the moment, there's no intention to pivot away from that.

但我們是一家油輪公司，這就是我們一直在關注的重點。目前，我們無意改變這一點。

Okay. Thanks, Stewart. I just was wondering if perhaps maybe the reason why we haven't seen the reinvestment is perhaps thinking a bit more strategically outside of tankers. And I guess at what point do you think -- as you highlighted at the end of the quarter, you'll pay off the capital leases. The cash is going to start to really accrue fairly rapidly in the next few quarters, assuming obviously, that market remains afloat.

好的。謝謝，斯圖爾特。我只是想知道我們沒有看到再投資的原因是否可能是在油輪之外進行了更具策略性的思考。我猜你認為在什麼時候——正如你在季度末強調的那樣，你將還清資本租賃。顯然，假設市場仍然活躍，那麼現金將在接下來的幾季開始真正迅速累積。

And as you highlighted, do you think it can last couple -- two or three years? Is there a point at which point you start to think, wow, the cash is building too much, we need to now move this? Have you thought about that? And is there like a cash balance trigger that really starts to make you think, okay, we have to put this capital to work?

正如您所強調的，您認為它可以持續幾年——兩到三年嗎？你會在某個時刻開始思考，哇，現金累積太多了，我們現在需要轉移這個嗎？你有想過嗎？是否存在現金餘額觸發器，真正開始讓您思考，好吧，我們必須將這筆資金投入使用？

I don't think that there's -- I don't think there is any trigger, first of all. Let's say that. I don't think there is a number or a trigger. And when we put in the capital allocation -- our capital allocation approach, which was a sustainable quarterly dividend, which, given our transformed balance sheet, we thought we would be able to continue to pay for the long-term and then the flexibility to pay special dividends when deemed appropriate.

首先，我不認為有任何觸發因素。這麼說吧。我認為沒有數字或觸發因素。當我們進行資本配置時——我們的資本配置方法是可持續的季度股息，考慮到我們轉變後的資產負債表，我們認為我們將能夠繼續長期支付，然後靈活地支付在認為適當時支付特別股息。

We did that for that exact reason. So we could be flexible and we could make large returns of capital or small returns of capital, depending on the position of the company and how we saw our prospects going forward.

我們正是因為這個原因才這麼做的。因此，我們可以保持彈性，可以獲得大額資本回報，也可以獲得小額資本回報，這取決於公司的地位以及我們對未來前景的看法。

So the situation that we're in now is we -- as you said, we're generating a lot of cash flow, which, at the end of the day, is equity value for shareholders. And as we've seen in the last year, quite a bit of that equity value has been -- has come through in terms of our share price.

所以我們現在所處的情況是——正如你所說，我們正在產生大量現金流，歸根結底，這就是股東的股權價值。正如我們去年所看到的，相當一部分股權價值已經透過我們的股價體現出來。

And we had over 100% total shareholder return during 2023. During 2022, it was even larger than that. So we feel like that equity value is being realized in terms of our share price. But then the question becomes, well, what do we do with that cash flow or that equity value and how do we best deploy that to create value for our shareholders?

2023 年，我們的股東總回報率超過 100%。2022 年，這一數字甚至更大。因此，我們認為股權價值正在透過我們的股價實現。但問題變成了，我們如何處理現金流或股權價值，以及我們如何最好地利用它來為股東創造價值？

And that's the conversations that we have. Should we return a certain amount to shareholders via direct capital return? Or do we think we'll create more value by having that financial strength that we can reinvest at the right time to create even more value? So that's really the basis of the conversations that we have.

這就是我們的對話。我們是否應該透過直接資本返還的方式向股東返還一定數額的資金？或者我們認為透過擁有可以在適當的時間進行再投資以創造更多價值的財務實力來創造更多價值？這確實是我們對話的基礎。

And as you rightfully note, if this market stays strong for the next two years, TNK will be in a much different position than we are today. And I would expect the conversations that we have around the capital allocation would be informed by that changing nature of our balance sheet. And again, we will use the same criteria, which is how do we create value for our shareholders, but the answers might be different as we move forward.

正如您正確指出的那樣，如果這個市場在未來兩年保持強勁，TNK 的處境將與我們今天的情況大不相同。我預期我們圍繞資本配置的對話將受到我們資產負債表不斷變化的性質的影響。同樣，我們將使用相同的標準，即我們如何為股東創造價值，但隨著我們的前進，答案可能會有所不同。

Thank you. That is a great situation to be in, nonetheless. So yeah, I appreciate those comments. And If I could just ask one quick one just on the market. Kevin, you were highlighting the Trans Mountain pipeline.

謝謝。儘管如此，這仍然是一個很好的情況。所以，是的，我很欣賞這些評論。如果我能快速問一下市場上的一個就好了。凱文，你強調了跨山管道。

And just want to get a sense from you, does this -- you mentioned the 30, 35 Aframax loadings. Is this a brand-new trade pattern that can start to evolve? Or is there already a market for Aframaxes in that region? And where do those cargos you think end up going?

只是想聽聽您的意見，您提到了 30、35 艘阿芙拉型油輪的裝載情況。這是一種可以開始演化的全新貿易模式嗎？或者該地區已經有阿芙拉型油輪的市場了嗎？您認為這些貨物最終會流向哪裡？

Yeah. It's a good question. At the moment, you have approximately one Aframax lifting a week, so it really is a significant uplift in export capacity. There's various markets that that crude can move into. It can move down to the US West Coast. It can move down to Panama to be put on VLCCs or co-loaded to send to a further over to Asia. It may even be put through the Panama Canal.

是的。這是一個好問題。目前，大約每周有一艘阿芙拉型油輪起重，因此這確實是出口能力的顯著提升。原油可以進入多個市場。它可以移動到美國西海岸。它可以南下至巴拿馬，裝上 VLCC 或共同裝載，送往更遠的亞洲。它甚至可能通過巴拿馬運河。

At this point in time, we don't know. All we know is that the operator is indicating that the pipeline will open and have oil flow at some point in second quarter of this year. But in terms of the destinations of those cargoes, we'll have to wait and see how the trading or the oil trading environment picks up on that oil and where they can probably make the best bar engine.

目前，我們還不知道。我們所知道的是，營運商表示該管道將在今年第二季的某個時間開通並有石油流動。但就這些貨物的目的地而言，我們將不得不等待，看看貿易或石油貿易環境如何影響這些石油，以及他們在哪裡可以製造最好的酒吧引擎。

So the only sure thing is that you can only load an Aframax out of Vancouver. You can't take a Suezmax or a VLCC in there. So from a demand perspective, it's a really exciting area that we're really keen to keep an eye on. And it could bode well with our capacity that we have currently in the US Gulf. And with our Suezmax fleet also trading around that area, it could move a really good dynamic for the mid-sized tanker space overall.

因此，唯一確定的是，您只能從溫哥華裝載阿芙拉型油輪。你不能在那裡攜帶蘇伊士型油輪或超大型油輪。因此，從需求的角度來看，這是一個非常令人興奮的領域，我們非常熱衷於關注。這對我們目前在美灣的能力來說是個好兆頭。由於我們的蘇伊士型油輪船隊也在該區域附近進行貿易，因此它可以為整個中型油輪空間帶來真正良好的動力。

Okay. That's very good. Thank you. Thanks for that color, and I'll turn it over. Thanks, guys.

好的。這是非常好的。謝謝。謝謝你的顏色，我會把它翻過來。多謝你們。

Thanks, Omar.

謝謝，奧馬爾。

Thank, Omar.

謝謝，奧馬爾。

Ken Hoexter, Bank of America.

肯‧霍克斯特，美國銀行。

Hey. Great. Good morning, Kevin and Stewart. It's amazing that -- this discussion so far in terms of finally getting rid of all that that debt and you're going to be debt free in a few weeks. It's just such an exciting turn. I want to talk about the market, though. We haven't talked much about the market.

嘿。偉大的。早上好，凱文和史都華。令人驚訝的是——到目前為止，我們的討論是關於最終擺脫所有債務，並且你將在幾週內擺脫債務。這真是一個令人興奮的轉折。不過我想談談市場。我們還沒有過多談論市場。

It seemed like rates right now are about $60,000 a day or trended, I guess, even in the back half of last quarter for both Afra, Suez. And you're averaging $50,000. I think the stock move this morning is showing a little bit of that disappointment in where rates are in the first quarter to date and then even where you averaged in the fourth quarter. Maybe run through, was that maybe some more moves of clean versus dirty? I don't know (technical difficulty) the market through the quarter, if that makes sense.

現在的費率似乎約為每天 6 萬美元，我猜，即使在上個季度後半段，阿夫拉和蘇伊士也是如此。你的平均收入為 50,000 美元。我認為今天早上的股價走勢顯示出一些令人失望的情況，第一季迄今的利率，甚至第四季的平均利率。也許跑遍了，這是否可能是更多乾淨與骯髒的動作？我不知道整個季度的市場（技術難度），這是否有意義。

Yeah. Hi, Ken. I can't speak to the TNK share price movement today or -- but in terms of the market, I think I would characterize it as being a slightly less robust fourth quarter than what we had the year prior, but still a historical level. TNK's performance in the fourth quarter was hampered slightly by some of our positioning at the end of Q3 with our Suezmax fleet, where we bunched up some ships and ended up having to take rates that were significantly lower at the back end of the third quarter than what we've seen since then. And that impacted our results for the fourth quarter.

是的。嗨，肯。我無法談論今天的 TNK 股價走勢，但就市場而言，我認為我認為第四季度的表現略弱於去年，但仍處於歷史水平。TNK 在第四季度的業績受到了我們在第三季末蘇伊士型船隊的一些定位的影響，我們集中了一些船舶，最終不得不採取比第三季末明顯更低的費率。從那時起我們所看到的。這影響了我們第四季的業績。

But as you can see from our first quarter-to-date numbers, averaging $50,000 across both segments, they're extremely healthy numbers. They're back up to close to 2022 and early 2023 levels. And I think that is a function of the fact that the market is strong, demand is strong, and ton-mile is being expanded by all of those issues that I highlighted in the presentation.

但正如您從我們第一季迄今的數據中看到的那樣，這兩個細分市場的平均收入為 50,000 美元，這是一個非常健康的數字。它們將回升至接近 2022 年和 2023 年初的水平。我認為這是市場強勁、需求強勁以及我在演示中強調的所有這些問題正在擴大噸英里這一事實的結果。

So I think our view is the market should stay strong. There's obviously going to be volatility. You mentioned $60,000 a day. The LR2s have been at that level, but they're slowly coming off. The Aframaxes in the US Gulf have been $80,000 a day at points during the first quarter and have come off since then. Other areas, the Far East is still holding fairly strong.

所以我認為我們的觀點是市場應該要保持強勁。顯然會出現波動。你提到每天 6 萬美元。LR2 一直處於這個水平，但它們正在慢慢下降。第一季度，美灣地區的阿芙拉型油輪的租金一度達到每天 8 萬美元，此後價格有所下降。其他地區，遠東地區仍保持相當強勢。

So I think we're going to see -- while the fundamentals are strong, you're still going to see volatility. So capturing that and making sure that our fleet deployment is in the right areas at the right time to capture that volatility is going to be important to maintain the kind of returns that we had last year.

所以我認為我們將會看到——雖然基本面強勁，但仍然會看到波動。因此，抓住這一點並確保我們的機隊在正確的時間部署在正確的地區以捕捉這種波動性對於維持我們去年的回報非常重要。

And I'm confident that, looking at what we've been doing thus far in the first quarter, we should continue to perform well quarter over quarter. And I don't really focus on any individual quarter because, as I said, a lot depends on where the fleet ends up being positioned based on the voyages that we fix. But over a series of quarters, I'd expect us to be robust in terms of our performance.

我相信，看看我們第一季迄今為止所做的事情，我們應該會繼續每個季度都表現良好。我並不真正關注任何單一季度，因為正如我所說，很大程度上取決於我們確定的航次將船隊最終定位在哪裡。但在接下來的幾個季度中，我預計我們的業績將會強勁。

Yeah. I mean, it's a great run through, Kevin. And I'm not arguing the robustness. It certainly is robust. I mean, that's obviously what's generating the cash flow. I'm just arguing or trying to understand why such a consistent difference or underperformance relative to Clarkson averages, which would be the average of all the lanes. And I think I got it now from the end of third quarter that impacted fourth quarter.

是的。我的意思是，這是一次很棒的經歷，凱文。我並不是爭論其穩健性。它確實很堅固。我的意思是，這顯然是產生現金流的原因。我只是在爭論或試圖理解為什麼相對於克拉克森的平均水平（所有泳道的平均水平）存在如此一致的差異或表現不佳。我想我從影響第四季的第三季末開始就得到了它。

But was there more of that as you entered the first quarter? Or are you seeing then the next level of bookings improve from where you were? Just trying to understand if there's going to be an acceleration or, you mentioned, a couple of pullbacks versus other regions that are really strong. So is that just a more a factor of where your vessels are?

但進入第一季後，還有更多這樣的事情發生嗎？或者您看到下一階段的預訂量比以前有所改善？只是想了解與其他真正強勁的地區相比，是否會出現加速或您提到的一些回調。那麼這是否只是決定您的船隻所在位置的因素呢？

No, I think it's a factor of a broker's assessment of the market looks purely at a singular voyage. And when you're trading a fleet of 50 ships, some ships sit in demurrage; some ships are held up, waiting to go through canals. A lot of operational factors come in that impacts your final returns.

不，我認為這是經紀人對市場評估的一個因素，純粹是針對單一航次。當您交易一支由 50 艘船組成的船隊時，有些船會處於滯期費；有些船隻被擱置，等待通過運河。許多營運因素都會影響您的最終回報。

There's also the timing. It's not a straight average that you're getting -- that a broker calculates based on daily rates. It's fixing a certain amount of your fleet at a certain point in time in that quarter, and that has an impact. Sometimes, as I've said, in the back end of third quarter, not a very good impact; other times, the impact is really positive. So I wouldn't look at broker assessments and then judge every ship owner's performance necessarily against that on an individual quarter.

還有時機。您得到的並不是直接平均值，而是經紀商根據每日匯率計算出來的。它會在該季度的某個時間點修復一定數量的機隊，這會產生影響。有時，正如我所說，在第三節後半段，效果並不是很好；其他時候，影響確實是正面的。因此，我不會查看經紀人的評估，然後根據每季的表現來判斷每個船東的表現。

Great. And then I guess two quick, Stewart, questions. One, can you talk about the new breakeven level as you get past this final debt paydown, maybe just how we should think about that?

偉大的。然後我猜出兩個簡短的問題，史都華。第一，您能否談談當您通過最終債務償還後的新盈虧平衡水平，也許我們應該如何考慮這個問題？

And then secondly, you mentioned it's not the right time to buy yet. You want to keep looking at the market. Do you go back to the special dividend policy or do you enhance the buyback? Do you have like a favorite move in the interim if you're starting to build the cash that you were just talking previously about?

其次，你提到現在還不是購買的合適時機。你想繼續關注市場。是回歸特別股利政策還是加大回購力道？如果您開始累積之前提到的現金，那麼在此期間您有最喜歡的舉動嗎？

Yeah. Thanks, Ken. In terms of the breakeven level, so once we repurchase these final vessels, expect the breakeven level to be between $15,500 and $16,000 a day, depending on a few factors. But that's about where it is. So above that level, we would generate free cash flow -- positive free cash flow.

是的。謝謝，肯。就損益平衡水準而言，一旦我們回購這些最終船隻，預計損益平衡水準將在每天 15,500 美元至 16,000 美元之間，具體取決於幾個因素。但這就是它所在的地方。因此，高於該水平，我們將產生自由現金流——正的自由現金流。

And just to be clear, that's an all in number. It includes CapEx, maintenance CapEx, and everything else. So that's a fully baked number.

需要明確的是，這是一個全部數字。它包括資本支出、維護資本支出和其他一切。所以這是一個完全成熟的數字。

In terms of capital allocation, when we announced the capital allocation policy three quarters ago, we did characterize the special dividends as something that we would use periodically to return more capital to shareholders. We certainly haven't changed that.

在資本配置方面，我們在三個季度前宣布資本配置政策時，確實將特別股利定性為定期使用，以向股東返還更多資本。我們當然沒有改變這一點。

So it's not really a matter of going back to it. I guess, it's in place there, and it's what -- we're using it the way that we had intended to use it. And we are going to -- we'll continue to have discussions around when and how to use special dividend.

所以這並不是回到過去的問題。我想，它就在那裡，這就是我們正在按照我們想要使用它的方式使用它。我們將繼續討論何時以及如何使用特別股利。

So at the moment, I would say that if there is capital allocation in addition to our fixed quarterly, that it's more likely to be in the form of special dividends than buybacks. The buyback program was put in place mainly to deal with if we thought there were sustained, long-term dislocations in the market, which was affecting our share price, so we could act opportunistically. But I would say that as we did in 2023, special dividends are more likely use of returning capital in the near-term.

所以目前，我想說，如果除了我們固定的季度之外還有資本配置，那麼它更有可能以特別股息的形式出現，而不是回購。回購計畫的實施主要是為了回應如果我們認為市場持續、長期的混亂，從而影響我們的股價，這樣我們就可以採取機會主義行動。但我想說，正如我們在 2023 年所做的那樣，特別股息更有可能在短期內用於資本返還。

Very helpful. Thanks, John. Thanks, Stewart. Appreciate the inputs.

很有幫助。謝謝，約翰。謝謝，斯圖爾特。感謝您的投入。

Thanks, Ken.

謝謝，肯。

Eirik Haavaldsen, Pareto Securities.

Eirik Haavaldsen，帕累託證券。

Yeah, hi. Thank you. So just a follow-up. I was just curious because -- did I understand you correctly when you said that you don't really have a limit as to how big your cash cost coffers could really grow here? Because, of course, you're already at very decent levels and, at current markets, that's growing rapidly. So you don't see swollen cash coffers as -- and there's no limit, basically, to where we can be.

是的，嗨。謝謝。所以只是後續行動。我只是很好奇，因為——當你說你對你的現金成本庫在這裡可以真正增長多少沒有真正的限制時，我是否正確理解了你的意思？當然，因為您已經處於非常不錯的水平，並且在當前市場上，這一水平正在迅速增長。因此，你不會看到現金金庫膨脹——基本上，我們的發展方向是沒有限制的。

Hi, Eirik. Thanks for the question. Right. So, we don't have a number in mind that says, once we reach this number, that we would feel compelled to do something with that capital. Again, it's looking at the opportunities in the market, the need for fleet reinvestment, our view on when those opportunities might arise, how much capital we would need to take advantage of those, and then making a decision around our overall capital allocation.

嗨，艾瑞克。謝謝你的提問。正確的。因此，我們心中並沒有一個數字表明，一旦達到這個數字，我們就會覺得有必要用這筆資金做一些事情。同樣，它正在考慮市場上的機會、機隊再投資的需要、我們對這些機會何時可能出現的看法、我們需要多少資本來利用這些機會，然後圍繞我們的整體資本配置做出決定。

So where we stand today, we think that we will continue to build balance sheet strength. And we will balance that off against returning capital to shareholders via our capital allocation policy that we've outlined.

因此，就目前的情況而言，我們認為我們將繼續增強資產負債表實力。我們將透過我們概述的資本分配政策來平衡這一點與向股東返還資本。

And we can't really look into the crystal ball and say, well, in 12 months from now, what will our decision be around capital allocation. But where we are today is that we're in the same place, roughly, when we announced our capital allocation nine months ago, which is our primary focus will continue to be on building financial strength so we can make reinvestments in the fleet, balance that off against -- and returning capital directly to shareholders.

我們無法真正了解水晶球並說，從現在起 12 個月後，我們將圍繞資本配置做出什麼決定。但我們今天的情況與九個月前宣布資本配置時的情況大致相同，我們的主要重點將繼續放在建立財務實力上，以便我們可以對機隊進行再投資，平衡反對——並將資本直接返還給股東。

And if and when we get to a stage that we think that's not the appropriate capital allocation policy and we should do something different, which could be investing that capital, it could be returning it to shareholders, whatever it is, then -- if we get to that stage, we will definitely communicate that to the market. And we'll go from there.

如果當我們到達一個階段時，我們認為這不是適當的資本配置政策，我們應該做一些不同的事情，這可能是投資這些資本，也可能是將其返還給股東，無論是什麼，那麼——如果我們到了那個階段，我們一定會向市場傳達這一點。我們將從那裡開始。

Okay. But I think previously, you said that newbuild prices weren't really attractive or these lead times were not really compelling. So does that change at all over the past six months?

好的。但我認為之前，您說過新建價格並不真正有吸引力，或者這些交貨時間並不真正引人注目。那麼過去六個月這種情況有改變嗎？

As I mentioned earlier, I mean, the new building prices are quite high. And as I said, I think one of the things we need to balance that off against, and I think probably all ship owners are, is the view of the market over the next few years and the strong cash flows that we could produce over that period and putting the context of -- or putting the cost of vessels in that context.

正如我之前提到的，我的意思是，新建築的價格相當高。正如我所說，我認為我們需要平衡的事情之一（我想可能所有船東都是如此）是對未來幾年市場的看法以及我們在此期間可以產生的強勁現金流週期並考慮到背景— —或考慮到船舶的成本。

There's also M&A potential opportunities. There's time charter opportunities. There's a number of things or ways that we could deploy that capital, and those are things that we're always looking at and analyzing. So there's nothing specific to (inaudible)

還有潛在的併購機會。有期租機會。我們可以透過很多事情或方式來部署這些資本，這些都是我們一直在關注和分析的事情。所以沒有什麼具體的（聽不清楚）

Okay. But finally, then, when you mentioned M&A and you -- I mean, you do highlight shareholder value creation here a number of times. But in terms of M&A, do you look at your price to NAV? Do you feel your share prices is fairly reflecting where the underlying values are at the moment? Just curious.

好的。但最後，當你提到併購時——我的意思是，你確實多次強調了股東價值的創造。但在併購方面，你會考慮你對淨值的定價嗎？您認為您的股價是否公平地反映了目前的基本價值？只是好奇。

Yeah. So we've traded -- our shares have traded in a range over the last 52 weeks. Obviously, they've -- we started the year at the beginning of 2023 at $28 a share. We traded up to over $64 a share. So it moves in a range. Sometimes, we probably thought that that range was more reflective of the underlying value of the company than others.

是的。因此，我們的股票在過去 52 週內一直在一定範圍內交易。顯然，我們在 2023 年初以每股 28 美元的價格開始了這一年。我們的交易價格高達每股 64 美元以上。所以它在一個範圍內移動。有時，我們可能認為這個範圍比其他範圍更能反映公司的潛在價值。

But I guess our focus is on running the company as best we can, creating shareholder value, and trying to illuminate our strategy and hoping that that is reflected adequately in the share price. If we think that there is a dislocation that we can -- that gives us an opportunity to buy back shares, we have that available to us, which we can use. But again, our focus is on long-term value creation, more so than short-term share price movements.

但我想我們的重點是盡我們所能經營公司，創造股東價值，並努力闡明我們的策略，並希望這一點能充分反映在股價中。如果我們認為有一種混亂，我們可以——這給了我們回購股票的機會，我們就可以利用它。但同樣，我們的重點是長期價值創造，而不是短期股價變動。

All right. That's fair. Thank you.

好的。這還算公平。謝謝。

Great. Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。

At this time, I would like to turn the call back over to the company.

這時我想把電話轉回公司。

Thank you for joining us today, and we'll speak to you next quarter.

感謝您今天加入我們，我們將在下個季度與您交談。

This concludes today's call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。