TKO Group Holdings Inc (TKO) 2003 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day. All sites are now on the conference line in a listen only mode. I would like to turn it over to your host, Mr. Phil Livingston. Go-ahead please, sir.

Thanks to all of you out there, and investors that are interested and have called in for the World Wrestling Entertainment second quarter earnings conference call. This is Phil Livingston. I'm the Chief Financial Officer, and I am sitting here with Linda McMahon, the Chief Executive Officer, here in our conference room. And some of our finance staff are also here, and I thank them for all they have done this quarter. And I thank all of our employees who are out there listening, and talent, for what was a great quarter. It is good to sit here and to have great numbers to talk about, and I think everybody that was involved in putting it together.

Our presentation -- we have a presentation that we're going to use, as we usually do, and it is on our website, which is www.corporate.wwe.com. I hope that all of you have already downloaded that and have that in front of you. If you haven't, I encourage you to do that quickly, here as we're going to start through that presentation. And I will draw your attention to each of those slides as we go ahead.

Before we start, I just want to point out, as we always do, is that the conference call and the information that we're about to give you contain a substantial amount of forward-looking information. We do our best to give you good visibility on to how our business is performing, and how we make our money. But things change in the real world. Business has substantial risks, and things can happen that we didn't anticipate. So I would point that out to you that there are many forward-looking statements in this call and in the information we provide, including our press release. And we give you the standard warning on that front.

On page 2 is the outline for what we're going to do today. Linda McMahon is going to give you some operational highlights of what happened during the quarter. And then she will turn it back over to me, and I will give you an overview of our financial results by segment of the business. And then we will give you a little summary of our outlook for the balance of the year. We're halfway through our year and we will give you a forecast as to how the rest of the year looks. And then we will take your questions, as we always do, and we look forward to those questions.

So with that, we will turn to slide 3, and I will turn it over to Linda McMahon for her comments on the operational highlights of the quarter.

Good morning everyone, and I certainly reiterate from Phil that we're very pleased to have all of you join us. It is always nice to be able to talk about a strong quarter. We did have a strong quarter. I think we did exactly what we have said we were going to be doing. We're focused on our business. We have been building these two separate brands, RAW and Smackdown. We have seen our television ratings stabilize, which is what I said that was our goal; we were going to work toward that. We are continuing to grow our international business.

And I just think we're putting in place what we promised we were going to do. We reduced our costs. We are managing our business. We have increased our profit margin. And we're looking in those areas of growth that are going to make sense to us.

Phil will go over all of the financial implications, but it certainly is nice to look at strong growth, and realize that we going to change our outlook, and our EBITDA range is going to go from about -- it is going to go to about 55 to 60 million from 42 to 47, which we had indicated in our last quarter. We did have some normalizing trends that Phil will speak to, some onetime occurrences this quarter. And he will go over those with you.

We're very pleased to see our pay-per-view numbers growing because, as you recall, we do now have separate pay-per-views presented by the different brands, as well as the co-pay-per-views that we're still producing this year. Those individual branded pay-per-views are performing as well or better than the combined pay-per-views at the same time frame last year.

And in addition, we have some increase in our out of period buys. So I am very pleased on the growth of the pay-per-view, and showing sort of an audacious, and I think, a little bodacious move on our part with the splitting of the brands and taking that half step back to move forward. We still have growth. We have leverage in our business to move forward with that, but we are on course to make those things happen.

Our international opportunities continue to grow. Our tours that we have had this year have been very successful for us, as you can see in slide 3. We have been in Australia, UK, Germany, Finland. Korea and Singapore are coming up again in December. We're back to Australia also again in December. And then we have we have tours already booked in February and March of '04. So we are looking forward to those live events continuing.

Our television deals are expanding. We have a new broadcast deal with Italia Uno in Italy, and with the Claxson Interactive Chilivision in Chile, both of which are going to be strong strong performers for us. So the international marketplace continues to be strong with the growth of licensees, as well as the tours and television.

And one of the other things that we're doing relative to our television is looking at more pay-per-view opportunities as they are available for us. We do at this particular point utilize the pay-per-view events that we produce in the United States as specials to sell in the international television market, for which we get a premium. However, in those markets where pay-per-view is pervasive, as in the UK, potentially Germany now and Japan, we have the opportunity not to sell those as straight specials, but to sell them as pay-per-view events, generating more income both for the distributor, as well as for us. So those are opportunities that we continue to look for in the international marketplace.

Our Wrestlemania event coming up in March, on March 14th at The Garden, as you probably have seen by our press releases, sold out in record time. Tickets $55 to $755, which is still a staggering number for me, just blew out of there at record pace. So that gives us now the opportunity to really focus and concentrate on pushing those pay-per-view buys for Wrestlemania.

We will have activities all around New York City relative to Wrestlemania. And I will probably be talking about this again on our next quarterly conference call. But Wrestlemania is just in New York. We were there for Wrestlemania I. We're there for Wrestlemania X, and to be back now for WrestleMania XX is quite a coup for us.

Three generations of McMahons have now been promoting in Madison Square Garden. And just recently Vince was inducted into the Walk of Fame in Madison Square Garden. He is following his father, which was inducted to the Hall of Fame. And at that ceremony, we didn't say it, but one of the other presenters even said, do you realize that for over 80 years there has been a McMahon promoting in Madison Square Garden. So I think that heritage is quite impressive if you look at it over the years. And we hope several years from now, that maybe a Shane and/or Stephanie. I think the two of them really ought to be inducted as well. So we will stay up with that, and see if that follows.

Again, our business we're focusing on where we are seeing good barometers, our advertising sales. We went in conservatively to sell at about -- we sold at about 10 percent above our actual numbers from last year, and that is really proving to be very good for us in a market, which you might have been seeing some make-goods do on this final calendar quarter for other broadcast networks. We're actually been able to take down our reserves from last year, because we're managing, I believe, those sales much better, and selling on a conservative basis, but also getting our swap buys up.

You will see some opportunities for us relative to the Smackdown sales in that our television rights for these revenues have increased because of the new Smackdown deal, which went into effect this particular television quarter. But there is -- we're not selling that time now, and so there is a little bit of reduction in the television advertising sales.

So our programming, I think, is moving the way want it to in a time when you're seeing Nielsen and other broadcast networks talk about the loss of male teen, and where are they going, or males in general? Are numbers are holding and increasing, which is certainly good news for us.

Our branded merchandise sales -- and I will come back to one item on page 4, kind of at the beginning, it was a settlement of a lawsuit. But let's just talk about branded merchandise for a minute, and live events, which kind of roll into two of our key drivers. While our ratings have stabilized, we feel good about that, and they are stabilized and growing. The lag behind our live events -- and we're really focused on increasing our attendance at those live events. They are off. We find a softness there.

Live events traditionally -- if we do see some decline in ratings over the years, live events is kind of the last area to soften a bit, if you will, and a little bit later on to come back once the ratings have gone up. We had a wonderful opportunity of presenting quality entertainment to our fans as they are watching our programs every week. But it is coaxing them to come to the live events which is really grassroots in their marketplace is something we really have to focus on. And so we're trying a different areas to make our live events special, which include autograph signing, special events at the live events, etc.

So the leverage and the opportunity in that business, to get back to the sell out numbers at arenas around the country, is really strong. And we're looking to see that growth over the next few months as well. But keeping in mind that every television event we do and every event that you see broadcast begins with a live event, because if we didn't have a live event, we wouldn't be able to have our television event. So therefore we look to grow those. We look to continue to expand those live events outside of the United States.

It stands to reason that if you have reduction in your live attendance numbers, you're going to see a reduction in the total overall merchandise sales at those arenas. While are per caps are holding strong, fewer people means less total revenue. So you'll see some degradation in branded merchandise sales at live events.

There's a bit of a softness also in the licensing market relative to our toys. Although the JAX has indicated to us that they feel we have bottomed out in that area, and certainly now holding, and starting to grow back both domestically and internationally. But I might mention that from THQ side with our videogames, Smackdown Here Comes the Pain, which just launched on PlayStation 2, had the largest opening single day sales of any videogame that they have launched under the WWE brand. And I think that is an incredibly strong indicator of what we can expect from the success of this game. And it is holding between the number three and number five game out there in the marketplace at this particular time. So I think those are all incredibly good barometers for us as we continue to look at our licensing programming.

On the branded merchandise sales, because we have split our brand, we wanted to be consistent. We had a WWE magazine, which really covered both, and a RAW magazine. We have now totally split those publications. The first Smackdown magazine goes on sale November 25th. That is this month. And RAW magazine will be the two brands that we will sell in conjunction with specials like the Addias (ph) publication, etc.

So all of those things are moving forward. And what we have seen in our initial offerings are not a fall off in subscriptions, but some of those -- a lot of the subscriptions for WWE are moving over to RAW. We will have to wait now and really grow that Smackdown. But it is a little early for us to tell how that is going to do.

So that is kind of I think a good overview on our licensing, except that we have done some other things. We have entered into agreement with AST for urban apparel. And John Cino (ph), on of our top stars, really has that kind urban rap appeal. And I think that will be an excellent way to push that apparel.

Steve Austin's book, Stone Cold Truth -- it started at number 11 on the New York Times bestseller list. It is already at number 9. so we're excited about that. We have new agreements up in Canada with Bell Mobility. All of those pushing our licensing program.

So I think that probably gives you a general kind of overview. I'm sure I might have missed some things. We did have in this particular quarter a settlement of a lawsuit that we have been working on, and that was with a company called Lewmar for an equipment production relative to the death of Owen Hart, in which we did recoup approximately $5.9 million of the payment that we had made. So that did come into our operating income as a one time. And Phil can be a little bit more specific about how that affects the numbers.

So again, please jot down your questions after this overview, and Phil will go into the financials aspect of it. And then I'll come back to you for any questions that you might like to ask.

Thank you, Linda. I'm looking now at page 6 of the presentation, which is the key drivers of our business, and we try to communicate as simply and as clearly as possible that these other three key things that we look at in our business and track, and we report these to you regularly.

Two of the three drivers are in good shape. Starting with the positives, the pay-per-view buys, as Linda mentioned, are consistent with a last year, and year-to-date even up a little better than that. We did in this quarter, and we talked about this a lot last quarter, we had four pay-per-view events in this quarter compared to three last year. And I'll normalize some of those results for you in the upcoming slides.

But the pay-per-view bias, the trends there are good. We have tried to show you also the second line here, the 935,000 buys versus 948 last year, with just three events compared year-over-year. Our ratings are solid, even trending up slightly lately. But on the negative side, average live event attendance is down 3 percent in the quarter, and down 7.3 present year-to-date, as Linda talked about, and is a major area of focus for us at this time.

Page 7, I won't cover this in detail, but it is a graph -- it is part of the package that we post every Thursday on our website, and we encourage you to look there and see where the weightings are from week to week. And you can track the ratings trends in our business via that graph that we provide you.

Page 8 is the basic guts of our results in the quarter. We had revenue of $94.4 million, which was up 4.5 percent. We had EBITDA of $28.8 million, which was up a lot more than a percentage would be a fair representation of. I would just say it was up a lot. You can see it is compared to only $3.5 million last year. We had net income from continuing operations of 16.9 million versus breakeven last year, and earnings per share of 25 cents versus 0 last year in the same quarter.

I think there are two significant unusual items that you have to consider when you look at these results. And that is that the four pay-per-view events in this quarter versus three last year, and then the $5.9 million settlement gain in the Lewmar case, which what is included in those numbers. I think all of those unusual things are very thoroughly described in our press release and in the notes at the bottom of page 8.

But to make it even more simpler on page 9, we tried to normalize EBITDA for you. It includes the goods and the bads from both periods really. And when you take this year you take EBITDA of 28.8. If you were to take out the profit that we made from the fourth pay-per-view event that is in this quarter, that would be 3.3 million. You would take out. And if you took out the legal settlement from Lewmar of $5.9 million, you come down to normalized EBITDA of 19.6.

And in comparing onto last year's third quarter, last year in the third quarter we had an unusual settlement that cost us 5. And there are two different numbers -- they are the same number, but there are two different items. It makes it a little bit confusing, I'm sorry, but there are unrelated $5.9 million items. And last year was a negative, so you would add that back to last year to get to kind of a normalized EBITDA of 19.6 this year versus 9.4 last year. Still a tremendous increase in profitability year-over-year. And I tried to kind of summarize it for you there.

On page 10, this summarizes -- this is a pie chart of our revenue sources. We look at our business in these five streams that are really the business units and revenue sources that we derive for you; TV rights, and TV advertising, pay-per-view events, live events and branded merchandise. And I'm going to go through in detail each one of these areas in the upcoming slides.

Page 11 you see the live events total revenue was down the 2 percent. The significant items that gave us the down 2 percent were the attendance was off about 3 percent. International events, however, were up to 7 events from three events in '03. And that caused the average ticket price to go up about 6 percent to $40.70. So overall live event attendance, even though live event attendance was down, the revenue wasn't down that much, and the profit contribution was down even less.

On page 12 you see some details on our pay-per-view business. Overall the buys in the quarter were flat compared to the same time last year. We were well ahead of our plan. I would tell you we were well ahead of our outlook. And it is like the ratings and pay-per-view buys very focused on the core execution in our business, and holding. And as you'll recall from last year, our pay-per-view buys were down 25 percent. So we were conservative in forecasting them in estimating this year, and holding them steady; marketing them very well; holding them flat year-over-year. It has been a good year in pay-per-view buys so far.

On page 13 you see our TV rights fees are up 18 percent in the quarter. This is largely due to the fact that we had a change in our UPN deal with Viacom, and also increasing international rights, better prices, and more geographic expansion around the map.

On page 14, you see our TV advertising was $18.1 million, off 8 percent. Our prices and our sell through were better on RAW on Spike TV. But the UPN deal impacted the number of weeks that we were selling TV advertising. We're basically selling three fewer weeks than we were the prior year in collecting a rights fee from UPN. Even with that taken out, our sell through and our prices were off a little bit on our UPN Smackdown advertising.

On page 15, and this is a little more complicated, because there is a few more components here in this part of the business. But branded merchandise revenues were $17.7 million, down 10 percent. You also see on the positive side, you also see that our profit contribution from branded merchandise was up to 47 percent from 36 percent in the year before.

There are two basic reasons -- in our branded merchandise, merchandise sales, we described here are down 23 percent. And there are two basic reasons for that down 22 percent. The first is total attendance at events was off, and average event attendance was off about 3 percent. And we had fewer events year-over-year in total, and that added about 9 percent. So that, and the combination -- we have also changed the way we do our international merchandising deals, so that we have more of a royalty arrangement and not a merchandise -- straight merchandising arrangement internationally.

Our licensing business was off a little bit, not a lot. We had look toy sales, as Linda mentioned, offset by higher videogame sales. Our home video business is off a little bit due to the WWF World Wildlife Foundation lawsuit and the impact on our library. The number of titles we have historically in the business is being real rebuilt over time. So the bottom line is -- and branded merchandise revenue was off a little bit, but profit contribution was up as we move ahead in that area.

I don't have any comments really out page 16. There is a more details on SG&A and profitability. Page 17 is our balance sheet. Out balance sheet is strong with $273 million in cash and short-term investments, very little debt. As you can see from our balance sheet and on page 18, cash flow continues to be good in the business. Cash flow is strong and this business is good cash producer.

I think the most important thing you might want to hear about is our outlook. On page 19 you see we have held revenue outlook steady at 325 to $350 million, but we have increased our EBITDA forecast to 55 to $60 million. And that does include the Lamar settlements in there too as well. And there are about $5 million of unusual nonoperating items that are in the 55 to $60 million, about $5 million positive. So a normalized result would be about 50 to $55 million of EBITDA, up from our last projection of 42 to $47 million of EBITDA for the year. So our outlook is up substantially. The bottom line there too is that earnings per share -- our outlook for earnings per share is 45 cents to 48 cents for the year.

So that is pretty much it on the overview. We had a good quarter. Revenue was up, profitability was up substantially. the trends in pay-per-view buys and ratings were good. We continue to take advantage of international opportunities for TV rights and more international events; we continue to press on that front, and continue to work on other strategic initiatives.

So with that, I will ask the operator to tee up questions from the audience, and we will be happy to take your questions at this time.

(OPERATOR INSTRUCTIONS) Dennis MacAlpine (ph) from the MacAlpine Associates (ph).

Would you talk about, under the new TV arrangement with UPN, how you handle make goods, and also the advertising? Since you are not selling advertising, when you report TV advertising, is that all RAW, or is there an imputed number? And then what did you do make goods? And I gather there aren't any at this point to speak of.

Would you also talk about your young male demographic and how that is those holding up, since some of the other network seem to be having problems in that area?

Let me talk a little bit about the UPN deal. We reported in this quarter, through the weeks that we were selling the advertising, we reported TV advertising revenue, Dennis. And then there were about ten weeks in this quarter that we sold the advertising. And in the last three weeks we recorded a rights' fee. And so it flips, the revenue does flip to the other line item in the income statement. And going forward, we will just report TV right fees from UPN. We will continue to report TV advertising revenue as we continue to sell a big chunk of the inventory of RAW on Spike TV.

So does that answer your question about -- you asked about make goods. To the extent that in the future that UPN sells the advertising, it is UPN's obligation to deliver on the make goods. We have been working down. We sold -- we delivered a lot of spots over the first six months of this year, and worked our ADU delivery way down during the quarter as a result of delivering a lot of spots for our past make goods that we have been working on.

So, Linda, maybe good talk about the young male demo?

We're certainly holding to that young male demo. And often on Thursday nights with our program on UPN we are, for male teens, often the number one network across all broadcasting for male teens. And in some of the other male demos we can be like third or fourth. So we're holding strong with that male demo. And Spike TV gives us on RAW on Monday nights, we are consistently holding that male audience.

I think it is a real advantage.

It is the younger male, and it is clearly an advance to us. There has been some speculation with Nielsen that young males are going to video games. Well, if they are, God bless them, because I hope they are playing Smackdown Here Comes the Pain. But we do have our other video games that are out there on those platforms as well.

So I think we are, and I don't mean to be flip, by that comments about the video games. I do think that we have the ability to reach to the interests of that young male viewer. And we're holding them clearly on our programming, as well as our ancillary products.

Somewhat tied to that, would you talk about your plans as far as establishing a cable network or utilizing more of your inventory that you have?

It is a bit premature, Dennis, although we certainly have hired a gentleman whose name is Tom Baracca (ph), who comes to us from AMC. He has also launched other networks like Comedy Channel, etc. He brings good experience with us. We're focusing at this particular point -- as Phil mentioned, we do have issues with our library relative to injunctions with the World Wildlife Fund. So Tom's particular focus right now is to get that library in orders, so that we only have to touch it once. And so for any opportunity for VOD, for home video, for video games, etc., it is clean and ready to use. So that is his primary focus now.

We will be utilizing more of our content on the VOD platform. Currently we have fanatics that's out there on DirecTV. But we're looking forward to more of our VOD products into the cable system. Down the road, we will be looking for growth in the VOD area, but it is a little premature to talk about that implementation today.

(OPERATOR INSTRUCTIONS) Mario Tabelli (ph) from Marathon Partners.

Nice to see a good quarter and thanks for the detail. It is always appreciated on the numbers. Two quick questions. On the pay-per-view buys, where you were referring to the strength of the pay-per-view business. I guess I'm a little bit confused Phil, I thought you said there might have been some year-to-date numbers where you're up. I am just sort of definitively -- I mean, you guys are not up year-to-date in total pay-per-view buys, right, fiscal year today?

We're just about -- go-ahead Phil.

Our total pay-per-view buys are 2.4 million this year versus 2.3 million last year. Right? Total bias-- you see that on slide 6.

No, I guess that is part of the problem. This is on the Web here. Okay.

So year-to-date we are. And, Mario, some of that, like the events over the events year-to-date, they are even up a little bit. And then some prior year buys were up. Prior year buys in this year versus prior year buys in last year, as you well know in our business, they are up to, and that contributes a good chunk of that. But even the six events that we have put on year-to-date are higher than they were last year. I think it is pretty significant.

I think it is very significant considering the brand split, and having those events, which have just been just been promoted by one brand.

What you have seen, the relationships to live events on pay-per-views, that relationship remains intact. You said something like live events will come back last, if that pay-per-view is indeed starting to increase here? Is that correct? Did I hear that right?

I think you mixed up a little bit with pay-per-view versus ratings. I said that live events tend to lag. If you see some decline in ratings, live events tend to hold stronger than the decline in ratings. And they also take a little longer to come back once the ratings stabilize and start to up. If that answers your question, I am not -- that is what I had spoken to you. You seem to have something relative to pay-per-view in there.

I will look at that -- the 24 5. I now see it more closely. Thanks.

Bobby Melnick from Terrier Partners.

I am wondering when you look at any period you want to use -- this quarter -- first semester of the year, or your annual outlook, I was wondering if you could generally give some guidance in terms of the relative contributions of domestic versus international?

In other words, at the moment the top line of the Company is down slightly. I'm just trying to get a sense what the rates of change would be for domestic versus international? And also whether, if the international is becoming more material, currency changes have had any impact in the reported numbers? Thanks.

I can tell you I asked that question this morning as to the proportion, or the amount of international revenue in our business this quarter. Was it this quarter or year to date, Michele, that you did for me?

In the quarter our international revenue was like 18 percent versus 15 percent last year. I think the Canadian dollar strengthening has got to have contributed part of that. I don't know how much exactly, but the Canadian dollar strengthening has got to be a little bit of that too. So what else was there in Bobby's question?

I think you answered that. The way we look, Bobby, at the international marketplace is clearly -- we believe that we are a global brand. We want to take opportunities where we can see the most significant return. The fact that we produce television on a weekly basis here in United States does the limit the extent to which we tour store internationally, until we get down pat, if you well, a more reasonable way, and a cost-efficient way to produce some television outside of the United States, which we're looking at.

But splitting the brands gave us the opportunity to have more tours outside of United States, more live events. And we will have a RAW tour and a Smackdown tour. And that is the way we break it up. So having that brand split gives us the ability to have more live offense outside of the United States. And as I said, we have three upcoming in December -- three events. We have a tour in February. And I don't have it in front of me, I thought I did, I believe the tour in February goes back to Europe, and the one in March goes back to Asia. I could have been just reversed. But that is where our plans are this particular time, growing those marketplaces where we are very strong.

We have often -- our programming in Malaysia on TV 3, one of the number one programs in that area, and is just amazing the popularity. So we want to continue to capitalize and grow those areas.

If you were to be asked a forward-looking question like, what would you envision the growth rates going forward for domestic and international, very broadly speaking, not really even post vis-a-vis the second half of this year or even next year. Just sort of generically, how do you all appraise the business, and what you see the growth rates coming?

Is there growth left in United States? It sounds like you think there is, although at the moment, if my math is right, 85 percent of this year's revenue versus -- excuse me -- 82 versus 85 is down a little, and if you back out the adjustment for the incremental revenues from the extra program, it sounds like the domestic business was slightly down this quarter, the international was slightly up this quarter.

Although I'm not particularly concerned about it quarter to quarter, when you look out over the next several years, do you see growth rates in the domestic business? And is it sort of quarter to 4 percent, 5 to 10 percent?

And then on the international side, is that 5 to 10 percent, 10 to 15 percent, 15 to 20 percent, your sort of ballpark guidance please?

Here's where I would like to keep it. It is really difficult to tag it to a percentage, because our leverage both domestically and internationally, and our key drivers, is dependent -- if you look domestically at live events, where we might be averaging on a live event basis somewhere in the 30 to 40 percent range for live attendance. And that might be little bit high for live events outside of our television, we're having a higher sell out rate for that on international basis.

But if you look at the potential to grow that domestically to 85, 90, 95 percent sell out basis, which we have had before, I can't predict that time frame for that swing. But that is where that growth potential is.

If you look on the pay-per-view side of growing, we are at about 4.5 million buys for this year, I'm not sure if that is going to grow substantially over the next year. That is a little bit dependent on our ratings and creativity and our store line. It is really hard to tie it and peg it.

Do I think we have greater opportunities upside for the international marketplace on a percentage basis, I certainly do. And that as you can see, as we continue to sell our television outside of United States, and be able to follow with our licensing program, live event tours and pay-per-view, where that technology is available,

I'm not trying to dodge your question on the percentage of growth. It is just really hard to peg it, because I can't -- I don't have a magic window on wireless operations outside of the United States and that potential, continued growth of pay-per-view outside of the United States and that potential. We're little bit dependent on the technology growth, but what I can say is that we are a content Company with library hours and continuing to produce nine hours on a weekly basis that gives us the opportunity to be poised to take advantage of all of those platforms both domestically and internationally.

I think one of the interesting things that you see in this quarter is the leverage that is in our business. And putting more butts in the seats, as we call it, the dollars -- there are huge dollars from the domestic live event attendance side, and on the pay-per-view side, there is huge dollars. And in the international side, the percentages have room to go yet. The percentages are probably greater on the international side. But there is a lot of -- as our pay-per-view buys are good, and as we go through the star cycle, and as the new guy merge, and the product gets hotter, the leverage, the profitability leverage is tremendous in this business. And I think we saw that this quarter. The dollars that came in basically were domestic pay-per-view buys, so it was a huge part of it.

How about another question, operator, if we have another one?

(OPERATOR INSTRUCTIONS) Andrew Etitenberri from Gabelli & Company.

Is it possible to break out the international revenue from the different segments that you have broken out, just in terms of television rights fees, event revenue, and possibly merchandise revenue?

I don't think we have done that in the past, frankly. Have we given that out in the past? I think maybe what we could do is give the -- do we -- we must give them our Q's. Even our 10-Q, the international revenues? Total international revenues.

So we can give you -- this is year-to-date Rich is giving me right here? So year-to-date in the six months, $32 million of revenue. And I think we'll give it to you by the segments that we use in our financial reporting too. The total for live event, or for what we call live and televised -- the live and televised segment is 27 million, Andy. And the branded merch segment is 4.8 million. Okay, does that help?

Yes, great.

There does not appear to be any further questions at this time. I would like to turn it back to management.

Okay. We appreciate everybody dialing in, and appreciate our employees too that listen in on the call this morning. And we hope to have another great quarter. We will report to you next quarter. Thank you, Linda, for your time today. And we thank all of you for dialing in, and we wish you all a good day. Thank you.

That concludes today's conference. You may now disconnect.