Telefonica SA (TEF) 2023 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good morning. Thank you for standing by, and welcome to Telefónica's January-March 2023 Results Conference Call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, today's conference is being recorded.

早上好。感謝您的支持，歡迎參加 Telefónica 2023 年 1 月至 3 月的業績電話會議。 （操作員說明）提醒一下，今天的會議正在錄製中。

I would now like to turn the call over to Mr. Adrian Zunzunegui, Global Director of Investor Relations. Please go ahead, sir.

我現在想把電話轉給投資者關係全球總監 Adrian Zunzunegui 先生。請繼續，先生。

Good morning, and welcome to Telefónica's conference call to discuss January-March 2023 results. I'm Adrian Zunzunegui from Investor Relations.

早上好，歡迎參加 Telefónica 的電話會議，討論 2023 年 1 月至 3 月的結果。我是投資者關係部的 Adrian Zunzunegui。

Before proceeding, let me mention the financial information contained in this document has been prepared under International Financial Reporting Standards as adopted by the European Union. This financial information is unaudited.

在繼續之前，讓我提一下本文件中包含的財務信息是根據歐盟採用的國際財務報告準則編制的。此財務信息未經審計。

This conference call and webcast, including the Q&A session, may contain forward-looking statements and information relating to the Telefónica Group. These statements may include financial or operating forecasts and estimates or statements regarding plans, objectives and expectations regarding different matters.

本次電話會議和網絡廣播，包括問答環節，可能包含與 Telefónica Group 相關的前瞻性陳述和信息。這些報表可能包括財務或運營預測和估計，或關於不同事項的計劃、目標和期望的報表。

All forward-looking statements involve risks and uncertainties that could cause the final developments and results to materially differ from those expressed or implied by such statements. We encourage you to review our publicly available disclosure documents filed with the relevant securities market regulators. If you don't have a copy of the relevant press release and the slides, please contact Telefónica's Investor Relations team in Madrid or London.

所有前瞻性陳述均涉及風險和不確定性，可能導致最終發展和結果與此類陳述明示或暗示的內容存在重大差異。我們鼓勵您查看我們向相關證券市場監管機構提交的公開披露文件。如果您沒有相關新聞稿和幻燈片的副本，請聯繫 Telefónica 在馬德里或倫敦的投資者關係團隊。

Now let me turn the call over to our Chief Operating Officer, Mr. Angel Vila.

現在讓我把電話轉給我們的首席運營官 Angel Vila 先生。

Thank you, Adrian. Good morning, and welcome to Telefónica's first quarter conference call. With me today are Laura Abasolo, Eduardo Navarro and Lutz Schüler. As usual, we will first walk you through the slides, and we'll then be happy to take any questions.

謝謝你，阿德里安。早上好，歡迎來到 Telefónica 第一季度電話會議。今天和我在一起的有勞拉·阿巴索洛、愛德華多·納瓦羅和盧茨·舒勒。像往常一樣，我們將首先引導您瀏覽幻燈片，然後我們很樂意回答您的任何問題。

I would like to start highlighting how we continue to progress on our strategy and to deliver on our goals. Strong momentum continued in our core markets. In Spain, service revenue growth accelerated, and year-on-year OIBDA trend improved as we had anticipated. Brazil posted double-digit growth on both revenue and OIBDA. In Germany, 5G deployment progressed well, and financials remain robust. In the U.K., revenue stepped up another quarter.

我想開始強調我們如何繼續推進我們的戰略並實現我們的目標。我們的核心市場繼續保持強勁勢頭。在西班牙，服務收入增長加速，OIBDA 同比趨勢如我們預期的那樣改善。巴西的收入和 OIBDA 都實現了兩位數的增長。在德國，5G 部署進展順利，財務狀況依然強勁。在英國，收入又增加了一個季度。

Our scaled European cloud and cyber champion, Telefónica Tech, increased revenue by 44% year-on-year, largely outgrowing its market. And at Telefónica Infra, we continued progressing in FiberCo rollout, while Telxius again recorded very solid growth rates.

我們規模化的歐洲雲和網絡冠軍 Telefónica Tech 收入同比增長 44%，在很大程度上超過了其市場增長。在 Telefónica Infra，我們在 FiberCo 推出方面繼續取得進展，而 Telxius 再次錄得非常穩健的增長率。

Group-wise, the Open Gateway initiative, I joined the effort for leading telcos under GSMA sponsorship, was successfully presented during Mobile World Congress '23, whilst on the ESG side, our greenabler strategy continues anticipating regulatory needs.

在集團方面，開放網關計劃，我加入了 GSMA 贊助的領先電信公司的努力，在 23 年世界移動大會期間成功展示，而在 ESG 方面，我們的綠色戰略繼續預期監管需求。

Looking ahead, we are shaping opportunities in our core markets, such as in-market consolidation in Spain, stellar growth and lower capital intensity in Brazil, normalized levels of CapEx to sales in Germany and ongoing capture of synergies in VMO2, with more than 50% of run rate expected by year-end.

展望未來，我們正在我們的核心市場創造機會，例如西班牙的市場整合、巴西的強勁增長和較低的資本密集度、德國的資本支出與銷售額的正常水平以及 VMO2 的持續捕獲協同效應，超過 50預計到年底運行率的百分比。

Telefónica Tech, where we ambition to grow double digit this year, continues to be a source of value. Telefónica Infra will further expand its fiber networks, whilst assessing consolidation opportunities, and optionality remains on self-sustainable Telefónica Hispam.

Telefónica Tech 今年我們的目標是實現兩位數的增長，它仍然是一個價值來源。 Telefónica Infra 將進一步擴展其光纖網絡，同時評估整合機會，並且選擇性保留在可自我維持的 Telefónica Hispam 上。

Finally, from an industry point of view, the coming months are key for next fairer share regulation and a broad fairer regulation environment.

最後，從行業的角度來看，未來幾個月是下一次更公平的股票監管和更廣泛的更公平監管環境的關鍵。

On Slide 3, we can see that we had a strong start to 2023. Revenue growth accelerated during the quarter, both in organic and reported terms. Moreover, all business lines are growing, with a good uptake of price increases, supporting a sequential service revenue improvement to plus 4.2% year-on-year in organic terms.

在幻燈片 3 上，我們可以看到我們在 2023 年開局良好。本季度的收入增長加速，無論是有機收入還是報告收入。此外，所有業務線都在增長，對價格上漲的接受度很高，支持服務收入連續增長，有機增長同比增長 4.2%。

B2B continues to perform strongly with 9% year-on-year growth and remains one of the key and differentiating growth drivers of the group. Commercial traction has strengthened, with fiber and mobile contract accesses growing 16% and 7% year-on-year, respectively, whilst 5G deployment is progressing well.

B2B 繼續表現強勁，同比增長 9%，並且仍然是該集團的關鍵和差異化增長動力之一。商業牽引力增強，光纖和移動合同接入分別同比增長 16% 和 7%，同時 5G 部署進展順利。

Our focused investments in next-generation networks and quality of service allowed us to post record levels of NPS and lower churn rates in a quarter of proven pricing power. This resilient performance, coupled with proactive management of efficiencies within a streamlined operational model, resulted in the third consecutive quarter of underlying OIBDA growth year-on-year.

我們對下一代網絡和服務質量的重點投資使我們能夠以四分之一的經證實的定價能力發布創紀錄的 NPS 和更低的客戶流失率。這種彈性的表現，加上在簡化的運營模式中積極主動的效率管理，導致 OIBDA 連續第三個季度實現同比增長。

Financially speaking, net debt and leverage declined, despite seasonality in Q1. As such, the balance sheet remains strong with a light maturity profile, strong liquidity, limited debt refinancing ahead and a high portion of that in long-term fixed rate.

從財務上講，儘管第一季度存在季節性，但淨債務和槓桿率有所下降。因此，資產負債表保持強勁，到期日較輕，流動性強，未來的債務再融資有限，而且其中很大一部分是長期固定利率。

Lastly, and along the lines of legacy shutdowns, we announced the Spanish full copper switch off for April 2024, the best example of our sustainability pathway in the transformation of our networks.

最後，根據遺留停產路線，我們宣布將於 2024 年 4 月停用西班牙全銅纜，這是我們在網絡轉型中可持續發展路徑的最佳範例。

Moving to Slide 4 to review our key financial metrics and figures. In organic terms, revenue growth accelerated 1 percentage point to 4.9%, while OIBDA maintained a steady growth of 1.1%, with CapEx increasing by just 0.7%, all that resulting a 2.1% annual growth in OIBDA minus CapEx.

轉到幻燈片 4 來查看我們的關鍵財務指標和數據。從有機角度來看，收入增長加速 1 個百分點至 4.9%，而 OIBDA 保持 1.1% 的穩定增長，資本支出僅增長 0.7%，所有這些導致 OIBDA 減去資本支出後的年增長率為 2.1%。

In reported terms, revenue growth improved sequentially by 1.3 percentage points to 6.7% year-on-year, while underlying OIBDA increased 2.4% year-on-year. FX continued to be a tailwind in the quarter.

按報告計算，收入同比增長 1.3 個百分點至 6.7%，而基礎 OIBDA 同比增長 2.4%。外彙在本季度繼續成為順風。

Free cash flow reached EUR 454 million, along the usual CapEx and working capital seasonality in this period of the year, while net debt declined EUR 0.2 billion in the quarter or 3.5% lower year-on-year.

自由現金流達到 4.54 億歐元，符合今年這一時期通常的資本支出和營運資本季節性，而本季度淨債務減少 2 億歐元，同比下降 3.5%。

Moving to Slide 5. Let me tell you that we are well on track to fulfill our 2023 guidance of low single-digit growth in both revenue and OIBDA, and around 14% CapEx to sales, despite inflationary pressures. We expect the strong momentum and the current positive trends to continue further, supported by some price actions taking place in Q2. Energy cost pressure and overall inflation continues easing, further supporting our OIBDA evolution.

轉到幻燈片 5。讓我告訴你，儘管存在通脹壓力，我們仍有望實現 2023 年收入和 OIBDA 低個位數增長的指導方針，以及約 14% 的資本支出佔銷售額。我們預計在第二季度發生的一些價格走勢的支持下，強勁勢頭和當前的積極趨勢將進一步延續。能源成本壓力和總體通脹繼續緩解，進一步支持我們的 OIBDA 發展。

As part of our shareholder remuneration, we canceled 25 million own shares, and we will be paying EUR 0.15 per share in cash, the second tranche of the 2022 dividend on the 15th of June. As for the 2023 dividend, EUR 0.15 per share will be payable on the 14th of December and another EUR 0.15 per share in June 2023, both in cash.

作為我們股東報酬的一部分，我們註銷了 2500 萬股自有股份，我們將在 6 月 15 日以現金支付每股 0.15 歐元的 2022 年第二批股息。至於 2023 年的股息，每股 0.15 歐元將於 12 月 14 日支付，每股 0.15 歐元將於 2023 年 6 月支付，均以現金支付。

Turning to Page 6. We continue working quarter after quarter to achieve our ambitious ESG targets. On the environmental side, our efforts in reducing Scope 3 emissions were once again recognized, as we have nominated CDP supplier engagement leader for the fourth consecutive year.

翻到第 6 頁。我們每個季度都在繼續努力，以實現我們雄心勃勃的 ESG 目標。在環境方面，我們在減少範圍 3 排放方面的努力再次獲得認可，因為我們連續第四年提名 CDP 供應商參與領導者。

Within the social pillar, we are pushing ahead with network rollouts to connect more people as well as promoting affordability with social tariffs. We're immensely proud that the World Benchmarking Alliance has, for the second year running, ranked Telefónica in top position within its Digital Inclusion Benchmark.

在社會支柱方面，我們正在推進網絡部署以連接更多人，並通過社會資費提高可負擔性。世界基準聯盟連續第二年將 Telefónica 評為其數字包容基準中的最高位置，我們為此感到無比自豪。

And on the government side, we highlight the renewal of ESG certifications across Telefónica Hispam, where we continue to lead the sector in sustainable financing.

在政府方面，我們強調了 Telefónica Hispam 的 ESG 認證更新，我們在可持續融資方面繼續引領該行業。

Moving to Slide 7. We can see that Telefónica España successfully started into the year with supportive commercial momentum and better financials. Fixed broadband and contract accesses posted our best quarterly performance since the end of the pandemic in Q3 '20. A new record low churn of 0.9% helped to deliver contract net adds for the third consecutive quarter and returned to year-on-year growth in fixed broadband for the first time since second quarter '19.

轉到幻燈片 7。我們可以看到 Telefónica España 以支持性的商業勢頭和更好的財務狀況成功地進入了這一年。固定寬帶和合同接入發布了自 20 年第三季度大流行結束以來的最佳季度表現。 0.9% 的新低流失率幫助連續第三個季度實現合同淨增加，並自 19 年第二季度以來首次恢復固定寬帶同比增長。

We achieved this better commercial momentum, despite the tariff revision that took place in mid-January, a proof point of our pricing power and meets an increasingly rational market.

儘管 1 月中旬進行了關稅修訂，但我們實現了更好的商業勢頭，這證明了我們的定價能力並滿足了日益理性的市場。

Service revenue growth accelerated to plus 1.0% in Q1 '23 driven by retail revenue growth, which accelerated by 0.8 percentage points versus the fourth quarter last year to 1.7% year-on-year. This acceleration is driven by a growing ARPU, better trading and double-digit growth of IT revenues.

在零售收入增長的推動下，服務收入在 23 年第一季度加速增長 1.0%，與去年第四季度相比增長 0.8 個百分點，同比增長 1.7%。這種加速是由不斷增長的 ARPU、更好的交易和 IT 收入的兩位數增長推動的。

Likewise, OIBDA continued its recovery path, limited its declined to 1.7% year-on-year as a result of the mentioned better revenue trends and despite higher personnel costs. OIBDA minus CapEx margin remained at benchmark organic levels of 26%.

同樣，OIBDA 繼續其複甦之路，由於上述更好的收入趨勢和更高的人員成本，將其同比下降限制在 1.7%。 OIBDA 減去資本支出利潤率保持在 26% 的基準有機水平。

Moving to Germany on Slide 8. It delivered a robust start to the year with another quarter of good commercial traction and sustained financial performance. The company implemented its More for More strategy across all brands and portfolios backed by its widely acknowledged network, products and services quality and extended ESG leadership. Telefónica Deutschland's 5G network is well on track to deliver around 90% population coverage by year-end 2023.

轉到幻燈片 8 上的德國。它以另一個季度良好的商業吸引力和持續的財務業績為今年開局強勁。該公司在其廣受認可的網絡、產品和服務質量以及擴展的 ESG 領導地位的支持下，在所有品牌和產品組合中實施了 More for More 戰略。 Telefónica Deutschland 的 5G 網絡有望在 2023 年底前實現約 90% 的人口覆蓋。

Revenue posted strong organic growth at 8% year-on-year in the first quarter. OIBDA grew 1.7% year-on-year, supported by operational leverage mainly mobile, which was partially offset by anticipated inflationary cost pressures.

第一季度收入實現了強勁的有機增長，同比增長 8%。 OIBDA 同比增長 1.7%，主要受到移動運營槓桿的支持，這部分被預期的通脹成本壓力所抵消。

Post the successful completion of the 3-year investment for growth program, Telefónica Deutschland returned to a normalized CapEx envelope, which declined 7.2% year-on-year to an 11.7% CapEx to sales, resulting in operating cash flow growth of 8.6% organic.

在成功完成為期 3 年的增長投資計劃後，Telefónica Deutschland 回到了正常的資本支出範圍，同比下降 7.2% 至 11.7% 的資本支出與銷售額，導致運營現金流有機增長 8.6% .

We now move on to Slide 9 to the U.K. and our joint venture, Virgin Media O2, which focused on operational progress and accelerating long-term growth drivers. VMO2 delivered resilient trading performance with a stable customer base of 58 million, while keeping churn steady and -- at low levels of just 1%. Broadband adds remained healthy during the quarter.

我們現在轉到英國和我們的合資企業 Virgin Media O2 的幻燈片 9，它專注於運營進展和加速長期增長動力。 VMO2 憑藉 5800 萬穩定的客戶群提供了彈性交易性能，同時保持穩定的客戶流失率 - 僅 1% 的低水平。本季度寬帶增長保持健康。

Network investment continued, with 108,000 premises deployed during the quarter and with 5G connectivity now available in over 2,100 cities. Q1 was the first full quarter of network rollout on behalf of nexfibre, and delivery is being prepared to ramp up through the year.

網絡投資繼續進行，本季度部署了 108,000 個場所，並且 5G 連接現已在 2,100 多個城市可用。第一季度是代表 nexfibre 推出網絡的第一個完整季度，交付量正準備在全年增加。

In the first quarter, revenue growth accelerated to plus 3.9% year-on-year organically, underpinned by the increase in mobile and nexfibre revenue. At the same time, OIBDA grew plus 1.4%, impacted by phasing of both fixed price increase and synergies and higher costs, mainly energy.

第一季度，在移動和 nexfibre 收入增長的推動下，收入增長加快，同比有機增長 3.9%。與此同時，OIBDA 增長了 1.4%，受到固定價格上漲和協同效應分階段以及更高成本（主要是能源）的影響。

Moving to Brazil on Slide 10. Vivo started 2023, posting once again a very strong set of results, both commercially and financially. Mobile market share reached 39% in February, increasing by 1 percentage point since Oi Mobile asset acquisition and by 2 percentage points in the contract segment to 43.7%. Vivo continues to be the clear market leader in a more rational environment.

轉到幻燈片 10 上的巴西。Vivo 從 2023 年開始，再次發布了一系列非常強勁的商業和財務結果。移動市場份額在 2 月份達到 39%，自收購 Oi Mobile 資產以來增加了 1 個百分點，在合同部分增加了 2 個百分點至 43.7%。在更加理性的環境中，Vivo 繼續成為明顯的市場領導者。

Vivo connected 813,000 new accesses to our FTTH network in the last 12 months, twice the performance of the second player in the market, thanks to our leading footprint and differential value proposition. Revenue growth accelerated to plus 12.1% year-on-year in Q1 '23, the highest revenue growth seen in 10 years, thanks to growing accesses, price increases and the good performance of digital services.

過去 12 個月，Vivo 為我們的 FTTH 網絡連接了 813,000 個新接入點，是市場上第二大運營商的兩倍，這要歸功於我們領先的足跡和差異化的價值主張。由於訪問量的增加、價格上漲和數字服務的良好表現，23 年第一季度的收入增長同比加速增長 12.1%，這是 10 年來最高的收入增長。

In terms of operational leverage, OIBDA minus CapEx grew 22.7% year-on-year as a result of growing OIBDA close to 10% and lower CapEx intensity, in line with the target of bringing it down below BRL 9 billion by 2023.

在運營槓桿方面，由於 OIBDA 增長接近 10% 且資本支出強度較低，OIBDA 減去資本支出同比增長 22.7%，符合到 2023 年將其降至 90 億雷亞爾以下的目標。

Slide 11 reviews the performance of Telefónica Tech, a global next-generation IT provider with a distinctive growth profile. Telefónica Tech continued to outperform the market in Q1 '23 with a 43% year-on-year revenue growth or plus 27% in constant perimeter, proving the benefits of its transformation into a leading scale provider of advanced IT solutions.

幻燈片 11 回顧了 Telefónica Tech 的表現，Telefónica Tech 是一家全球下一代 IT 提供商，具有獨特的增長模式。 Telefónica Tech 在 23 年第一季度繼續跑贏市場，收入同比增長 43% 或固定周長增長 27%，證明了其轉型為領先的高級 IT 解決方案提供商的好處。

The growing partner ecosystems and its diversified team of around 6,000 professionals, with close to 4,000 certifications in strategic partners technologies, are key for Telefónica Tech to become a reference player in delivering differentiated digitalization journey with higher relevance of managed services.

不斷壯大的合作夥伴生態系統及其由約 6,000 名專業人員組成的多元化團隊，以及近 4,000 項戰略合作夥伴技術認證，是 Telefónica Tech 成為交付具有更高相關性的託管服務的差異化數字化之旅的參考參與者的關鍵。

Bookings increased by 40% over the last 12 months, which supports future revenue flows, leveraging Telefónica Tech's success, Telefónica's position in the B2B large global deals category clearly improved. According to industry analysts, Telefónica gained fourth place and entered the first division of telcos providing global IT services after years of steady progress from a regional player to a supra regional operator.

預訂量在過去 12 個月增加了 40%，這支持了未來的收入流，利用 Telefónica Tech 的成功，Telefónica 在 B2B 大型全球交易類別中的地位明顯提高。據行業分析人士稱，經過多年從區域性運營商向超區域運營商的穩步發展，Telefónica 排名第四，進入提供全球 IT 服務的電信公司的第一部門。

Turning to Slide 12. Telefónica Infra continued to consolidate its leading portfolio of FiberCos, which already cover 15 million premises as of March '23. Bluevia's deployment in Spain is progressing as planned and has already met more than 80% of its deployment target.

轉到幻燈片 12。Telefónica Infra 繼續鞏固其領先的 FiberCos 產品組合，截至 2023 年 3 月，該產品已覆蓋 1500 萬處場所。 Bluevia 在西班牙的部署正在按計劃進行，已經完成了 80% 以上的部署目標。

UGG in Germany continued to promote MOUs sign-ins, with more than 870,000 households as of the end of March. nexfibre in the U.K. is scaling up the team, processes and interaction with VMO2. FiBrasil is already present in 151 cities in Brazilian states, with 4.3 million premises passed.

UGG在德國持續推廣MOU簽到，截至3月底已有超過87萬戶入駐。英國的 nexfibre 正在擴大團隊、流程以及與 VMO2 的互動。 FiBrasil 已經在巴西各州的 151 個城市開展業務，通過了 430 萬處場所。

ON*NET Fibra Chile and ON*NET Fibra Colombia are both leading their markets with 3.7 million and 2.6 million premises passed, respectively. Moreover, Telxius posted again healthy financials with rising revenue and OIBDA growing for the fifth quarter in a row. Thanks to continuous cost management, Telxius achieved an impressive OIBDA margin of 54.2%.

ON*NET Fibra Chile 和 ON*NET Fibra Colombia 分別以 370 萬和 260 萬處場所通過率領先各自的市場。此外，Telxius 再次公佈健康的財務狀況，收入和 OIBDA 連續第五個季度增長。得益於持續的成本管理，Telxius 實現了令人印象深刻的 54.2% 的 OIBDA 利潤率。

I will now hand it over to Laura, who will review Hispam's operations and the group's financial results.

我現在將其交給 Laura，她將審查 Hispam 的運營和集團的財務業績。

Thank you, Angel.

謝謝你，天使。

Moving to Telefónica Hispam, we continue to focus on value growth, improving returns, while reducing investment -- invested capital in the region. Contract accesses grew plus 4% year-on-year, especially in Mexico and Colombia, with plus 13% and plus 7%, respectively. The transformation to fiber continues, supported by the InfraCos. Fiber uptake remained high at 30%, despite the fast FTTH deployment.

轉向 Telefónica Hispam，我們繼續專注於價值增長、提高回報，同時減少投資——在該地區的投資資本。合同准入同比增長 4%，尤其是在墨西哥和哥倫比亞，分別增長 13% 和 7%。在 InfraCos 的支持下，向光纖的轉型仍在繼續。儘管 FTTH 部署速度很快，但光纖使用率仍保持在 30% 的高位。

Revenue continued to grow and was up 1.6% year-on-year, thanks to the good performance in both contract and FTTH. OIBDA declined by 3.9%, mainly impacted by high commercial activity and the InfraCo model in Chile.

得益於合同和光纖到戶的良好表現，收入繼續增長，同比增長1.6%。 OIBDA 下降了 3.9%，主要是受到高商業活動和智利 InfraCo 模式的影響。

Turning to Slide 14. Telefónica maintains about 80% of its debt linked to fixed rates, mainly in euro, with an average life of 13.2 years, which places us in a comfortable position to face any market environment. We maintained a solid liquidity position of EUR 21.4 billion that, together with a live maturity profile, allows us to cover debt maturities over the next 3 years.

轉到幻燈片 14。Telefónica 將其約 80% 的債務與固定利率掛鉤，主要以歐元計價，平均壽命為 13.2 年，這使我們能夠輕鬆應對任何市場環境。我們保持了 214 億歐元的穩固流動性頭寸，再加上實時的到期情況，使我們能夠在未來 3 年內償還債務到期日。

Meanwhile, net financial debt and leverage ratio continued their downward trends. Net financial debt declined from EUR 26.7 billion in December to EUR 26.4 billion in March. Net debt to EBITDA ratio improved from 2.54x in December to 2.51x in March.

同時，淨金融負債和槓桿率繼續呈下降趨勢。淨金融債務從 12 月的 267 億歐元下降至 3 月的 264 億歐元。淨債務與 EBITDA 的比率從 12 月的 2.54 倍改善至 3 月的 2.51 倍。

As of March 2023, we have contained our debt-related interest cost at 3.87%, thanks to the solid position of fixed interest rates in strong currencies, which allow us to navigate the rising rates.

截至 2023 年 3 月，我們將與債務相關的利息成本控制在 3.87%，這要歸功於強勢貨幣的固定利率穩固地位，這使我們能夠駕馭不斷上升的利率。

I will now hand back to Angel, who will wrap up.

我現在將交還給 Angel，他將結束髮言。

To wrap up, on Slide 15, Q1 delivered again positive momentum, continuing with resilient performance, whilst further executing our strategy.

總而言之，在幻燈片 15 中，第一季度再次呈現積極勢頭，繼續保持彈性表現，同時進一步執行我們的戰略。

First, our differentiated and premium infrastructure is clearly taking off in terms of churn and NPS, which helped Q1 revenue growth to accelerate on the back of our proven pricing power. Furthermore, OIBDA maintained a steady performance, thanks to efficiencies that allow us to mitigate inflationary pressures.

首先，我們差異化和優質的基礎設施在客戶流失率和 NPS 方面明顯起飛，這有助於在我們經過驗證的定價能力的支持下加速第一季度的收入增長。此外，OIBDA 保持了穩定的表現，這要歸功於使我們能夠減輕通脹壓力的效率。

Second, our balance sheet was further strengthened, thanks to our proactive debt management.

其次，由於我們積極的債務管理，我們的資產負債表得到進一步加強。

Third, Q1 performance, coupled with maintained positive momentum, allow us to reiterate full year guidance and dividend.

第三，第一季度業績，加上保持積極勢頭，讓我們重申全年指引和股息。

Fourth, our sustainability pathway is demonstrated with the transformation of our networks. On ESG, we are progressing well and anticipating regulatory needs.

第四，我們的可持續發展路徑體現在我們網絡的轉型中。在 ESG 方面，我們進展順利並預期監管需求。

And finally, we continue to shape opportunities that should create value for our shareholders.

最後，我們繼續創造機會，為我們的股東創造價值。

Thank you very much for listening. We are now ready to take your questions.

非常感謝您的收聽。我們現在準備好回答您的問題。

(Operator Instructions) We will now take the first question. It comes from the line of David Wright from Bank of America.

（操作員說明）我們現在將回答第一個問題。它來自美國銀行的 David Wright 系列。

A couple from me, please. I noticed on the EBITDA beat today, it was quite material at the other level. I think you recorded about EUR 53 million. Consensus is give or take EUR 8 million. Now I understand some of that is driven by Telxius and Telefónica Tech, where you've obviously given some quite optimistic commentary in the presentation. So I wondered, could you give us a little bit of guidance where we could expect that line to trend this year, please? Or is there something else that is exceptional?

請給我一對。我注意到今天的 EBITDA 節拍，它在另一個層面上非常重要。我想你記錄了大約 5300 萬歐元。共識是給予或接受 800 萬歐元。現在我了解到其中一些是由 Telxius 和 Telefónica Tech 推動的，您顯然在演示文稿中給出了一些非常樂觀的評論。所以我想知道，你能否給我們一些指導，我們可以預計今年這條線的趨勢是什麼？或者還有什麼特別的地方嗎？

And maybe, Laura, just for you on Hispam. You've obviously seen the EBITDA -- year-on-year EBITDA decline starting to go into decline again, but I think that is partly due to the new state due to the InfraCo model, which means you're now bringing on wholesale cost. I wondered if you could give us an idea of what the EBITDA minus CapEx organic trend is perhaps Q4 and Q1 to really understand to what extent that decapitalization is working. So those 2 questions from me, a little detail.

也許，勞拉，只為你在 Hispam 上。你顯然已經看到 EBITDA - 同比 EBITDA 下降開始再次下降，但我認為這部分是由於 InfraCo 模型導致的新狀態，這意味著你現在帶來批發成本.我想知道您是否可以讓我們了解 EBITDA 減去資本支出的有機趨勢可能是第四季度和第一季度，以真正了解去資本化在多大程度上發揮作用。所以我提出的這兩個問題，有點細節。

David, on the first one on the EBITDA that we have in other companies and others, here, there are some businesses, which are included along this line, one of them being Telxius, the unit that for holds our submarine cable. We have some detail on Slide #12 on the performance of this unit, which is growing revenues at a high single-digit level -- sorry, EBITDA on double-digit level with 54% OIBDA margin. That's an actual business, which is performing very nicely, included in that line.

大衛，關於我們在其他公司和其他公司的 EBITDA 的第一個，這裡有一些業務，包括在這條線上，其中之一是 Telxius，它是持有我們海底電纜的單位。我們在幻燈片 #12 上有一些關於該部門業績的詳細信息，該部門的收入以高個位數水平增長——抱歉，EBITDA 為兩位數水平，OIBDA 利潤率為 54%。那是一個實際的業務，表現非常好，包含在該行中。

Second element would be the Telefónica Tech companies that got acquired in the U.K. So we bought CANCOM U.K. and then a company called Incremental, and the Telefónica company we acquired in Germany and the DACH region called BE-terna. These are also included in this element of other companies, eliminations and others. These 2 companies are growing revenues double digit with margins of around 14%, 15%. So you have actual businesses, I would say, hidden jewels in this line, which are performing quite nicely.

第二個要素是在英國被收購的 Telefónica Tech 公司。所以我們收購了 CANCOM U.K.，然後是一家名為 Incremental 的公司，以及我們在德國和 DACH 地區收購的 Telefónica 公司，名為 BE-terna。這些也包括在其他公司、抵消和其他的這個元素中。這兩家公司的收入增長兩位數，利潤率約為 14%、15%。所以你有實際的業務，我會說，在這一行中隱藏的珠寶，表現非常好。

And the third relevant element in this line is the efficiencies that we are achieving on group corporate costs, given our efforts to optimize our operating models. So we would be aiming to continue providing positive results on this line in the coming quarters.

考慮到我們努力優化我們的運營模式，這條線中的第三個相關因素是我們在集團公司成本方面取得的效率。因此，我們的目標是在未來幾個季度繼續在這條線上取得積極成果。

David, on your question on Hispam, as you said, year-on-year variations are softer this quarter, and it has to do with the CapEx to OpEx model. And it also has to do that we are going faster commercially. These InfraCo models are allowing us to start connecting homes faster than what we have done with our own CapEx. And therefore, we have more commercial pressure. But at the same time, we are building a super strong value access base, so we will be stronger for the future.

大衛，關於你關於 Hispam 的問題，正如你所說，本季度同比變化較小，這與資本支出到運營支出模型有關。而且它還必須做到我們在商業上走得更快。這些 InfraCo 模型使我們能夠比我們自己的資本支出更快地開始連接家庭。因此，我們有更多的商業壓力。但與此同時，我們正在建立一個超強的價值獲取基礎，所以我們會在未來變得更強大。

I think when you look at Hispam, you have to look at it in each trajectory since the beginning of 2020 when we decided a new strategy as noncore. OIBDA minus CapEx has improved tremendously in the last 3 years. We have been posting very good results, as we transition to a leaner model, focused, as I said, on value customers and building on a different way of deploying infrastructure, but which has been very valid to build that value customer base.

我認為，當您查看 Hispam 時，您必須在自 2020 年初我們將新戰略確定為非核心以來的每個軌跡中查看它。 OIBDA 減去資本支出在過去 3 年裡有了巨大的改善。隨著我們過渡到更精簡的模型，我們一直發布了非常好的結果，正如我所說，專注於價值客戶並建立在部署基礎設施的不同方式上，但這對於建立價值客戶群非常有效。

We are better in general terms in market share, and these results were very much aligned with our expectations. Maybe Peru has been a bit softer due to the political environment, and also there's a lot of portability and we need to cool down the market there, but we are in that front.

總的來說，我們在市場份額方面更好，這些結果與我們的預期非常一致。也許秘魯由於政治環境的原因有點軟，而且有很多可移植性，我們需要給那裡的市場降溫，但我們在這方面處於領先地位。

I'd rather talk to you about the OIBDA minus CapEx for the full year, which is how we are working. We are working on a full year basis, and we have still ambition to grow OIBDA minus CapEx in 2023, as it's been the case in the accumulated from 2020.

我寧願和你談談全年的 OIBDA 減去資本支出，這就是我們的工作方式。我們正在全年工作，我們仍然有志於在 2023 年增加 OIBDA 減去資本支出，就像從 2020 年開始積累的情況一樣。

We keep on working on reducing capital employed. We keep focusing on being super rational on spectrum auction. We just had the Uruguay spectrum auction a couple of days ago, which was at reserved price, very well managed. Again -- and that should be following the strategy we already announced a few years ago, and we are executing thoroughly.

我們繼續致力於減少所使用的資本。我們一直專注於在頻譜拍賣上保持超級理性。幾天前我們剛剛舉行了烏拉圭頻譜拍賣，拍賣的價格是保留價，管理得很好。再次——這應該遵循我們幾年前已經宣布的戰略，我們正在徹底執行。

If I could just ask an additional follow-up. Just Angel, given that Q1 EBITDA in the other line, you said you want to remain positive, but is there any reason you shouldn't be sustaining those kind of levels given the growth in the underlying businesses and the acquisitions? Any reason not to imagine it trends broadly similarly for the rest of the year?

如果我可以問一個額外的後續行動。只是 Angel，鑑於第一季度的 EBITDA 在另一條線上，你說你想保持積極，但考慮到基礎業務和收購的增長，你有什麼理由不應該維持這種水平？有什麼理由不去想像它在今年餘下時間裡的趨勢大體相似？

Yes, we -- as you know, we don't guide by line, but the businesses which have -- and I was quite explicit about which companies are included in these other companies, these businesses are all of them in growth mode, both in revenues and in EBITDA, with steady margins. So those -- there would be no reason to, at least for the element that corresponds to those businesses, not to project them not only steady, but growing.

是的，我們 - 正如你所知，我們不按路線進行指導，但是有的企業 - 我非常明確地說明哪些公司包括在這些其他公司中，這些企業都處於增長模式，無論是在收入和 EBITDA 方面，利潤率穩定。所以那些 - 至少對於與這些業務相對應的元素，沒有理由不預測它們不僅穩定而且不斷增長。

We will now take the next question from the line of Georgios Ierodiaconou from Citi.

我們現在將接受來自花旗的 Georgios Ierodiaconou 的下一個問題。

I have 2 questions on Spain, please. The first one is just to understand the outlook we should expect in terms of ARPU for the business. And obviously, there were the price increases in January. We've seen the ARPU continue to grow, but perhaps not accelerate that much.

我有 2 個關於西班牙的問題，請問。第一個只是了解我們在業務 ARPU 方面應該預期的前景。顯然，1 月份的價格有所上漲。我們已經看到 ARPU 繼續增長，但可能不會加速那麼多。

So I was curious, Angel, if this is down to tougher comps because you need some price increases also in January last year or whether you are seeing optimization within Mi Movistar with perhaps that effect maybe also affecting the future quarters. So if you could give us an idea of the mix between those 2 effects.

所以我很好奇，Angel，這是否歸因於更嚴格的競爭，因為去年 1 月你也需要一些價格上漲，或者你是否在 Mi Movistar 內部看到優化，這種影響可能也會影響未來的幾個季度。所以，如果你能告訴我們這兩種效果之間的混合情況。

And also the comment you made earlier about more price increases in the second quarter, whether you feel confident that the excellent KPIs you reported in Q1 can be sustained even with these price increases you're putting through.

還有你早些時候關於第二季度更多價格上漲的評論，你是否有信心即使你正在經歷這些價格上漲，你在第一季度報告的優秀 KPI 也能持續下去。

And my second question is on B2B and the growth they are delivering. And obviously, that's not common for all the telcos in Europe. Do you mind just giving us a bit of an idea of what other growth drivers they are, how sustainable they are? And a bit like the comment you made earlier on some of the acquisitions in Telefónica Tech, if you can give us an indication on the gross margins of these revenues would be great.

我的第二個問題是關於 B2B 及其帶來的增長。顯然，這對歐洲的所有電信公司來說並不常見。您介意讓我們了解一下它們是什麼其他增長動力，它們的可持續性如何？有點像你之前對 Telefónica Tech 的一些收購發表的評論，如果你能告訴我們這些收入的毛利率會很好。

Thank you, Georgios, for the questions. You saw that in this first quarter, we made the highest price increase that we've done for a long, long time and potentially in history following the adjustments for inflation. And this has resulted not only in not suffering churn, but we have experienced the lowest churn in the last how many quarters. And you can see clearly in the slide the trend of improvement of the churn.

謝謝你，Georgios，提出問題。你看到，在第一季度，我們進行了很長一段時間以來的最高價格上漲，並且可能是在通貨膨脹調整後的歷史上。這不僅導致沒有遭受客戶流失，而且我們在過去幾個季度中經歷了最低的客戶流失。您可以在幻燈片中清楚地看到流失率的改善趨勢。

NPS, by the way, has gone up by 9 percentage points year-on-year, and the gap versus the second player has also widened. And ARPU has gone up to EUR 92.6, which is a growth of 1.7% year-on-year and is a growth if you look quarter-on-quarter of more than EUR 2 per share.

順便說一下，NPS 同比上升了 9 個百分點，與第二名的差距也拉大了。 ARPU 已升至 92.6 歐元，同比增長 1.7%，如果按季度看，每股收益超過 2 歐元，則屬於增長。

One of the questions that you may have is with a price increase of 6.8%, ARPU is growing 1.7% year-on-year, I should say that ARPU growth is in line with what we were expecting. The price increase was not applied to all the conversion base. It was applied to the Mi Movistar brand, not to the O2 brand, and it's not applied to all the ARPU components. It's applied to the fees, but not to extra consumptions, new digital services or advertising.

您可能有一個問題是價格上漲 6.8%，ARPU 同比增長 1.7%，我應該說 ARPU 增長符合我們的預期。價格上漲並未適用於所有轉換基礎。它適用於 Mi Movistar 品牌，而不是 O2 品牌，也沒有適用於所有 ARPU 組件。它適用於費用，但不適用於額外消費、新數字服務或廣告。

Also another relevant element is that the price increase was executed in the second half of January, so it's impacting not the full quarter, but at a fraction of the quarter. And there has been some repositioning that -- between our customer base, but it's not a significant element.

另一個相關因素是價格上漲是在 1 月下半月執行的，因此它不會影響整個季度，而是影響該季度的一小部分。在我們的客戶群之間進行了一些重新定位，但這不是一個重要因素。

Also one relevant point when one looks at the translation of this into growth of revenues, not only of ARPU, is that we have in the wholesale line a less comparable metric year-on-year because we are selling less content, because we bought 55% of LaLiga, not having 100% of LaLiga. This is resulting in 1 percentage point less growth in service revenue.

另外一個相關的觀點是，當人們將其轉化為收入增長時，不僅是 ARPU，我們在批發線上的同比指標可比性較低，因為我們銷售的內容較少，因為我們購買了 55西甲的百分比，而不是西甲的 100%。這導致服務收入的增長減少了 1 個百分點。

So service revenue growth has accelerated in the Spanish operation to 1%. It would have been 2% growth in service revenue if we have had the same comparable perimeter of wholesale revenues through resale of contract. And this effect will annualize in the third quarter. So this detraction of 1 percentage point in the year-on-year comparison will disappear from the third quarter onwards.

因此，西班牙業務的服務收入增長加速至 1%。如果我們通過合同轉售獲得相同的批發收入可比範圍，那麼服務收入將增長 2%。而這種影響將在第三季度年化。所以這個同比下降1個百分點的下降，從三季度開始就會消失。

So we expect the effect of the price increases to continue kicking in into our revenue function. And given that we are 2.5 months into the price increase and a very good customer reaction, we think that the momentum is -- that the price increase has been digested and the momentum should continue along the lines that we are seeing.

因此，我們預計價格上漲的影響將繼續影響我們的收入功能。鑑於我們已經進行了 2.5 個月的價格上漲並且客戶反應非常好，我們認為勢頭是 - 價格上漲已經被消化並且勢頭應該沿著我們所看到的方向繼續。

Regarding the second question on B2B, I agree with you. We have a differential performance at Telefónica Group. B2B revenues are growing 9% in our Spanish operation. B2B are also -- revenues are also growing high single digits in our perimeter.

關於B2B的第二個問題，我同意你的看法。我們在 Telefónica Group 有不同的表現。我們西班牙業務的 B2B 收入增長了 9%。 B2B 也是——我們周邊的收入也在以高個位數增長。

This is a robust performance and is very much based on a few elements. We are growing market share, and especially in the SME category. We're also managing to stabilize the comms element of the B2B revenues with better performance in renewal of contracts. And potentially here, the performance of Telefónica units through the pandemic allowed us to gain the confidence from our customers, from our clients.

這是一個強大的性能，並且在很大程度上基於一些元素。我們正在擴大市場份額，尤其是在中小企業類別中。我們還設法穩定 B2B 收入的通信元素，並在續簽合同方面表現更好。潛在地，Telefónica 部門在大流行期間的表現使我們能夠從我們的客戶那裡獲得客戶的信心。

And then very important, we are growing in the IT and tech elements double digit. We made a very strong bet a few quarters ago on cloud cybersecurity, IoT and big data. And this is helping us -- help our customers in their own digitalization needs, and this is proving to be a key element in the growth of our businesses.

然後非常重要的是，我們在 IT 和技術元素方面取得了兩位數的增長。幾個季度前，我們在云網絡安全、物聯網和大數據方面下了很大的賭注。這正在幫助我們——幫助我們的客戶滿足他們自己的數字化需求，事實證明這是我們業務增長的關鍵因素。

The companies that we acquired in geographies like the U.K. and Germany, in Telefónica Tech are having EBITDA margins around between 10% and 15%, depending on the quarters, which are EBITDA margins, you were asking gross margin net of figure, but in EBITDA margins, they are in that line, the companies that we acquired and are included as we were discussing before in other and eliminations.

我們在英國和德國等地區收購的 Telefónica Tech 公司的 EBITDA 利潤率在 10% 到 15% 之間，具體取決於季度，即 EBITDA 利潤率，你問的是扣除數字後的毛利率，但在 EBITDA 中利潤率，他們在那條線上，我們收購的公司，正如我們之前在其他和消除中討論的那樣。

If I can ask just a clarification. Based on what you described, Angel, the price increases are coming now in the second quarter, is it fair to assume that the ARPU momentum should improve in the future quarters? I know you don't guide line by line. But broadly speaking, is that a fair assumption?

如果我可以問一個澄清。 Angel，根據你的描述，第二季度現在價格上漲，假設 ARPU 勢頭應該在未來幾個季度有所改善是否公平？我知道你不會逐行指導。但從廣義上講，這是一個公平的假設嗎？

We see -- with the [price increase] in mid-January, that was not effective the whole of the month. You have seen a positive evolution of the ARPU. So this ARPU levels are here to stay.

我們看到 - 隨著 1 月中旬的 [價格上漲]，整個月都沒有效果。您已經看到 ARPU 的積極發展。所以這個 ARPU 水平將保持不變。

We will now take the next question from the line of Joshua Mills from BNPP Exane.

我們現在將接受來自 BNPP Exane 的約書亞米爾斯的下一個問題。

A couple from me. The first one is actually just coming back on this ARPU point because there's been a few questions around this. Can we clarify exactly what gets included in the convergent ARPU definition? Is it purely the service revenue side of the -- or the service components of the contracts? And how much, if any, of the ARPU is made up of add-ons, like TVs, handsets, other bits and pieces?

我的一對。第一個實際上只是回到這個 ARPU 點，因為圍繞這個有一些問題。我們能否明確說明收斂 ARPU 定義中包含的內容？是純粹的服務收入方面還是合同的服務組成部分？有多少（如果有的話）ARPU 是由附加組件組成的，例如電視、手機和其他零碎的東西？

And the reason I ask is one of the reasons we might be seeing a slightly slower improvement in ARPU this quarter is that last year, you were doing more of these add-ons, and that probably boosted the ARPU to Q1 2022. So any clarification on what's in the ARPU and then what's in service revenue would be great.

我問的原因是我們可能會看到本季度 ARPU 的改善速度略有放緩的原因之一是去年，你做了更多這些附加組件，這可能將 ARPU 提高到 2022 年第一季度。所以任何澄清關於 ARPU 中的內容，然後是服務收入中的內容會很棒。

And then secondly, on the EBITDA trajectory in Spain, you've reiterated that there should be a steady improvement through the course of the year, reaching stabilization in the second half. I guess, if I think about the moving parts on the cost side, one of the tailwinds you had in the first half of the year, which won't repeat in the second half, is from lower content costs.

其次，關於西班牙的 EBITDA 軌跡，您重申在這一年中應該會穩步改善，並在下半年達到穩定。我想，如果我考慮成本方面的移動部分，你在今年上半年的順風之一，下半年不會重複，來自較低的內容成本。

So aside from a broadly improving service revenue trend through 2023, what other cost tailwinds will kick in, in the second half, which means EBITDA should be getting better rather than worse?

因此，除了到 2023 年服務收入趨勢普遍改善之外，下半年還會出現哪些其他成本有利因素，這意味著 EBITDA 應該變得更好而不是更糟？

Thank you for your questions. Let me try to give you more color on the ARPU. ARPU, of course, includes the communications, the connection, the mobile, the TV options, the TV add-ons, the mobile add-ons. It's the same definition of ARPU -- convergent ARPU that we have been applying consistently for now on the last years. The growth of ARPU that we're seeing year-on-year and quarter-on-quarter can be broken down across different ends.

謝謝你的問題。讓我試著給你更多關於 ARPU 的顏色。當然，ARPU 包括通信、連接、移動、電視選項、電視附加組件、移動附加組件。這與 ARPU 的定義相同——過去幾年我們一直在應用的聚合 ARPU。我們看到的 ARPU 的同比增長和環比增長可以分解為不同的端點。

On the positive side, More for More, the price increases, both the one that we had this year in January, last year, it was in the month of February. We also have the higher contribution of new services in the portfolio. The reduction of promotions is quite relevant. Market continues to be very rational, and the dilutive effect that promotions have on the calculation of ARPU is disappearing.

從積極的一面來看，價格上漲了，今年 1 月份，去年 2 月份都有。我們在投資組合中也有更高的新服務貢獻。促銷活動的減少是非常相關的。市場繼續非常理性，促銷對ARPU計算的稀釋作用正在消失。

On the negative side, we are experiencing a little bit less out of bundle on the mix because this convergent ARPU is a mix of the brand Mi Movistar and the brand O2. The growing penetration of the O2 brand is reducing slightly the ARPU. And then now that we have a few contents -- or less content on LaLiga and so on, we have the elements on lower revenue from advertising. But this ARPU, we see it, as I was saying before, resilient and visibly higher than it was 1 year ago.

不利的一面是，我們在組合中體驗到的捆綁銷售有所減少，因為這種融合的 ARPU 是品牌 Mi Movistar 和品牌 O2 的組合。 O2 品牌不斷增長的滲透率略微降低了 ARPU。然後現在我們有了一些內容——或者說西甲等方面的內容更少了，我們的廣告收入就會減少。但是正如我之前所說，我們看到這個 ARPU 具有彈性並且明顯高於 1 年前。

On the outlook on revenues, and then I will get to your question on cost on revenues, we see service revenue continuing to grow. And we are having less handset revenues than we had last year because we had a very strong performance in 2022 when we introduced a new Mi Movistar offer that included all type of electronic devices possibilities for the customer. So we have less handset and devices revenue, but service revenue growing.

關於收入前景，然後我會回答你關於收入成本的問題，我們看到服務收入繼續增長。而且我們的手機收入比去年少，因為我們在 2022 年的表現非常強勁，當時我們推出了新的 Mi Movistar 產品，其中包括為客戶提供的所有類型的電子設備可能性。因此，我們的手機和設備收入較少，但服務收入在增長。

This we see, through momentum in trading, the solid convergent ARPU that we continue to be the new digital services ecosystem. We see growth in communications and especially in IT in the -- and tech in the B2B side. The B2B digitalization and the impact of European recovery funds expected also in the second half, although we have less TV contents to wholesale.

我們看到，通過交易勢頭，穩固的融合 ARPU 表明我們將繼續成為新的數字服務生態系統。我們看到通信領域的增長，尤其是 IT 領域和 B2B 領域的技術領域。 B2B 數字化和歐洲復甦基金的影響預計也會在下半年出現，儘管我們要批發的電視內容較少。

In EBITDA, the sound behavior of revenues has to continue contributing to continue the year-on-year recovery, and we aim to stabilization as -- and reiterate that we aim to stabilization at some point in the second half.

在 EBITDA 中，收入的良好表現必須繼續促進同比復甦，我們的目標是穩定——並重申我們的目標是在下半年的某個時候穩定下來。

Margins, you saw the first quarter at 36%. We expect margins to stand in the mid high 30s. And the CapEx will continue, of course, to be a benchmark, in line with what we had last year, which was 12% and because CapEx is behind.

利潤率，你看到第一季度為 36%。我們預計利潤率將處於 30 多歲的中高水平。當然，資本支出將繼續作為基準，與我們去年的水平一致，去年為 12%，因為資本支出落後了。

The cost components that will help us here, the personnel cost, once we have done all the negotiations, not only with employees in the collective agreement, but the employee side collective agreement, that cost increases slightly above 6% less than the price increases.

對我們有幫助的成本構成，人員成本，一旦我們完成所有談判，不僅與集體協議中的員工，而且與員工方的集體協議，成本增加略高於 6%，低於價格上漲。

Energy prices, we continue to expect a year-on-year decline, and we continue with efficiencies for network -- from network transformation, the savings of lower price of LaLiga and the continued efforts to make more efficient on digitized operating model.

能源價格，我們繼續預計同比下降，我們將繼續提高網絡效率——從網絡轉型、西甲較低價格的節省以及繼續努力提高數字化運營模式的效率。

So all in all, we expect the trend of recovery of EBITDA to continue. We reiterate that we expect in the second half, at some point, stabilization on the year-on-year comparison and margins of EBITDA to be in the high 30s.

因此，總而言之，我們預計 EBITDA 的複蘇趨勢將持續下去。我們重申，我們預計在下半年某個時候，EBITDA 的同比比較和利潤率將穩定在 30 多歲的高位。

We will now take the next question. It's from Mathieu Robilliard from Barclays.

我們現在開始下一個問題。它來自巴克萊銀行的 Mathieu Robilliard。

I have 2 questions, please. First, on Spain, you may have touched on it, but I could have missed it, which is on the pay TV, where I think since the end of April, you have no more regulatory obligation to wholesale it and no more regulation on the price at which you need to wholesale it.

我有 2 個問題，請。首先，關於西班牙，你可能已經觸及它，但我可能沒有註意到它，它在付費電視上，我認為自 4 月底以來，你沒有更多的監管義務來批發它，也沒有更多的監管您需要批發的價格。

How do you see that going forward? And when will it -- could it have an impact, the fact that you changed the prices or some of the providers join you or do not join you? Is that starting from September 2023?

您如何看待這方面的進展？它什麼時候會產生影響，你改變價格或一些供應商加入你或不加入你的事實？是從 2023 年 9 月開始嗎？

And then a second question on leverage. You showed good progress on your deleveraging on your slides, and I think rating agencies also see you delever. But at least for one of them, you still remain quite high in terms of the rating adjusted leverage.

然後是關於槓桿的第二個問題。您在幻燈片上的去槓桿化方面取得了良好進展，我認為評級機構也看到了您的去槓桿化。但至少對於其中之一，您在評級調整後的槓桿率方面仍然相當高。

And I was wondering if you could give us a bit of color in terms of what will lead you to deleveraging throughout 2023. I realize you don't give guidance, but if you can point out to the main elements that you expect will contribute to deleveraging.

我想知道您是否可以就導致您在整個 2023 年去槓桿化的因素給出一些說明。我知道您沒有提供指導，但如果您能指出您預計將有助於實現的主要因素去槓桿化。

Thank you, Mathieu, for your questions. The remedies that the CNMC had imposed from the DTS acquisition in 2015 expired as of 30th of April. So now Telefónica Spain has much more flexibility to shape the contents offering.

謝謝你，馬修，你的問題。中國有色集團於 2015 年對 DTS 收購實施的補救措施於 4 月 30 日到期。所以現在 Telefónica Spain 可以更靈活地塑造內容產品。

We are no longer a dominant player in the pay TV market given the much higher subscriber shares of our -- of other platforms, and we will assess in this newest scenario. The policy is that we want to apply, of course, always keeping competitive and being respectful with a competitive nature of the market.

鑑於我們 - 其他平台的用戶份額要高得多，我們不再是付費電視市場的主導者，我們將在這種最新情況下進行評估。當然，政策是我們要應用，始終保持競爭力並尊重市場的競爭性。

But we now have a different flexibility in terms of which content we could keep or we would also want to share, more flexibility on the pricing of such content, more flexibility on the bundling, more flexibility on elements like [must-carry] channels that we no longer have to carry.

但是我們現在在我們可以保留哪些內容或者我們也想分享哪些內容方面有了不同的靈活性，在這些內容的定價上有更大的靈活性，在捆綁上有更大的靈活性，在[必須攜帶]頻道等元素上有更大的靈活性我們不再需要攜帶。

So much more flexibility in order to shape our offer to be more attuned to the needs of our customers and also to be more efficient on the cost side of certain content that we could not need to carry going forward as well. So this is providing us much more commercial flexibility that we will use in order to continue to reinforce our very strong performance in the Spanish business.

更大的靈活性是為了使我們的報價更符合客戶的需求，並在某些我們不需要繼續推進的內容的成本方面更有效率。因此，這為我們提供了更多的商業靈活性，我們將使用這些靈活性來繼續加強我們在西班牙業務中的強勁表現。

And if I may follow up -- sorry, Laura. I think that the CNMC, you had bought the rights for, if I remember correctly, 3 or 5 years. The CNMC disputed the lengths of the contract. Has that been resolved in terms of LaLiga contract?

如果我可以跟進 - 對不起，勞拉。我認為 CNMC，如果我沒記錯的話，你已經購買了 3 或 5 年的權利。中國有色集團對合同期限提出異議。這在西甲合同方面已經解決了嗎？

The last auction was of LaLiga for 5 years. With the previous remedies, there was a restriction of us acquiring the rights for longer than 3-year period. Those remedies are no longer in place. But we still have dialogue with the CNMC, but that limitation is no longer applicable going forward.

上一次拍賣是 5 年的 LaLiga。使用之前的補救措施，限制我們獲得超過 3 年的權利。這些補救措施已不復存在。但我們仍然與 CNMC 進行對話，但這種限制在未來不再適用。

Mathieu, on your question on leverage and trajectory, we do not have a public leverage target ratio, but we do have a target of being committed to investment-grade credit rating, and deleverage remains a priority for us.

Mathieu，關於你關於槓桿和軌蹟的問題，我們沒有公開的槓桿目標比率，但我們確實有致力於投資級信用評級的目標，去槓桿仍然是我們的首要任務。

Our main driver is going to be a steady organic OIBDA improvement, and that has been the case. The CapEx peak being definitely behind, so the main driver for reducing net debt should be free cash flow generation.

我們的主要驅動力將是穩定的有機 OIBDA 改進，事實就是如此。資本支出峰值肯定已經落後，因此減少淨債務的主要驅動力應該是產生自由現金流。

On that regard, we are well on track to achieve a sound free cash flow in 2023. We see that growth accelerating forward throughout 2023, exceeding shareholders' remuneration, dividend commitments, hybrid coupons and, therefore, allowing for further deleverage.

在這方面，我們有望在 2023 年實現良好的自由現金流。我們預計整個 2023 年增長將加速，超過股東薪酬、股息承諾、混合息票，因此允許進一步去槓桿化。

That free cash flow generation is very much anchored in the positive underlying operating cash flow trend, but we see that we also optimize every single line below that.

自由現金流的產生很大程度上取決於積極的潛在經營現金流趨勢，但我們看到我們還優化了低於該趨勢的每一條線。

Another thing which is very important is how we are prioritizing balance sheet strength. Our prudent debt management has allowed us to be more resilient in the current environment. We have a very strong liquidity position and aligned maturity profile. And we are anticipating many of the liability management, so we are really tapping the markets at the right moment.

另一件非常重要的事情是我們如何優先考慮資產負債表的實力。我們審慎的債務管理使我們在當前環境下更具彈性。我們擁有非常強大的流動性頭寸和一致的到期情況。我們期待著許多負債管理，所以我們真的是在適當的時候開拓市場。

We continue having a very strict capital allocation. In organic, we also have a top quality asset base, which could complement the sound free cash flow generation.

我們繼續進行非常嚴格的資本配置。在有機方面，我們還擁有優質資產基礎，可以補充良好的自由現金流生成。

On the credit ratings, we have regular meetings with them. I think they have seen that we have fulfilled the guidance for the last few years, that we have started a strong start of the year, and we ended up the year very strong, despite everything that has happened. And we have shown our resilience, and rate agency value definitely are a strong commitment and welcome the measures we take to protect the credit rating.

在信用評級方面，我們定期與他們會面。我認為他們已經看到我們已經完成了過去幾年的指導，我們已經開始了今年的強勁開局，儘管發生了一切，但我們在這一年結束時非常強勁。而且我們已經顯示出我們的韌性，評級機構價值絕對是一個強有力的承諾，歡迎我們採取措施保護信用評級。

We will now take the next question from the line of Yemi Falana from Goldman Sachs.

我們現在將接受來自高盛的 Yemi Falana 的下一個問題。

Taking a step back from the results, it seems Spain was solid and you expect that to continue. Telxius and Telefónica Tech ultimately came in better than expected, and that should continue. But the area that was a bit soft was on the free cash flow side.

從結果來看，西班牙似乎很穩固，你預計這種情況會繼續下去。 Telxius 和 Telefónica Tech 最終的表現好於預期，而且這種情況應該會繼續下去。但有點疲軟的領域是自由現金流方面。

So maybe focusing in there, could you walk us through the cash flow items that get better through the year? I think you're expecting a reversal on the working capital side, for example. What's your level of confidence there? And could you talk us through any kind of key moving parts?

所以也許專注於那裡，你能帶我們了解一下今年變得更好的現金流項目嗎？例如，我認為您期望在營運資金方面出現逆轉。你在那裡的信心水平是多少？你能告訴我們任何一種關鍵的移動部件嗎？

Sure. No problem. Free cash flow for Q1 was aligned with our expectations. You see it's always very affected by seasonality in Q1, and free cash flow generation is generally back-end loaded. As I just said to Mathieu, we are well on track to achieve a sound free cash flow in 2023, and that growth will be accelerating forward to the end of 2023.

當然。沒問題。第一季度的自由現金流符合我們的預期。你看它總是受到第一季度季節性的影響，自由現金流的產生通常是後端加載的。正如我剛剛對 Mathieu 所說，我們有望在 2023 年實現良好的自由現金流，並且到 2023 年底，增長將加速。

The moving parts is the growing OIBDA on top line and also efficiencies and the lower CapEx, 1 percentage below that it was a year ago. You are seeing that OIBDA minus CapEx is already growing in Q1, and that should continue. Below operating cash flow, you're right, working capital should reverse, and it will have a positive balance.

移動部分是收入增長的 OIBDA 以及效率和較低的資本支出，比一年前低 1 個百分點。您會看到 OIBDA 減去資本支出在第一季度已經在增長，而且應該會繼續增長。低於經營現金流，你是對的，營運資金應該逆轉，它會出現正餘額。

Working capital in Q1 reflected seasonality, as always. Handset or supplier financing had no differential impact, and it's been really meaningless and not contributing to working capital. So it's been basically seasonality, deferred payments, and part of that is going to change as we approach in the year, as every year does.

第一季度的營運資金一如既往地反映了季節性。手機或供應商融資沒有任何不同的影響，而且它真的毫無意義，也沒有為營運資金做出貢獻。所以它基本上是季節性的，延期付款，並且隨著我們在這一年的臨近，其中一部分將會發生變化，就像每年一樣。

We will continue optimizing our financial payments. You have seen that our debt -- financial debt related cost is very attractive, and we will keep on working on that trend.

我們將繼續優化財務支付。你已經看到我們的債務——與金融債務相關的成本非常有吸引力，我們將繼續致力於這一趨勢。

In the case of tax, it's sometimes affected by refunds and payment in advance, but we expect a normalized tax payment standing at around 23%, which is below the nominal rate. We have to emphasize on the cash inflows from the U.K. JV, which is on track to deliver that. We gave a guidance of EUR 1.8 billion to EUR 2 billion.

就稅收而言，有時會受到退稅和預付款的影響，但我們預計正常化的稅收約為 23%，低於名義稅率。我們必須強調來自英國合資企業的現金流入，該合資企業有望實現這一目標。我們給出了 18 億至 20 億歐元的指導。

And then on leases, we are working on optimization. I think part of the peak came last year with inflation, FX and so on. It should be more stable this year, but we are also monitoring that very, very closely. So we will continue to manage every single line, starting from consolidating the improvement of the operational trends.

然後在租賃方面，我們正在努力優化。我認為去年達到頂峰的部分原因是通貨膨脹、外匯等。今年應該會更穩定，但我們也在非常、非常密切地監測。因此，我們將繼續管理每一條線，從鞏固改善運營趨勢開始。

And I think, very important to mention how resilient free cash flow has been in all those past years. Over the last 7 years, we generated as much of EUR 32 billion cumulative free cash flow, including EUR 3 billion on spectrum.

而且我認為，非常重要的是要提到過去幾年自由現金流的彈性。在過去的 7 年裡，我們產生了高達 320 億歐元的累計自由現金流，其中包括 30 億歐元的頻譜。

Very important to mention that spectrum in the core has been mostly secured, so that shouldn't be a detractor in free cash flow, a relevant one in the near term. And definitely, free cash flow continues for us to be an absolute priority and linked into the previous question from Mathieu are main lever for deleverage. So working on that, confident on a sound result for the full 2023.

非常重要的一點是，核心頻譜大部分已得到保護，因此這不應成為自由現金流的減損因素，這是近期的相關因素。當然，自由現金流對我們來說仍然是絕對優先事項，並且與 Mathieu 之前的問題相關聯是去槓桿化的主要槓桿。因此，為此努力，對整個 2023 年的良好結果充滿信心。

Very clear. Maybe just one follow-up. On the lease side, it seems like kind of inflation year-over-year was about 6%. Is that a clean number ex FX? Or is FX a driver within that cost bucket? And could you maybe give us a steer as to where you expect to be from a kind of lease inflation perspective on a full year basis kind of excluding FX? That'd be super helpful. Clearly, it does seem like free cash flow does materially improve through the year.

非常清楚。也許只是一個跟進。在租賃方面，同比通脹率似乎約為 6%。這是一個乾淨的數字 ex FX 嗎？或者 FX 是該成本範圍內的驅動因素嗎？您能否從全年的租賃通脹角度（不包括外匯）向我們介紹一下您期望達到的水平？那會非常有幫助。顯然，自由現金流似乎確實在這一年裡有了實質性的改善。

Yes. It's difficult to give guidance on inflation for leases because not every lease is affected by inflation. Some of them are affected by other indexes. And in some cases, we have very long-term leases. We can renegotiate, maybe lengthening the terms and getting better terms.

是的。很難就租賃的通貨膨脹提供指導，因為並非每項租賃都受到通貨膨脹的影響。其中一些受到其他指標的影響。在某些情況下，我們有非常長期的租約。我們可以重新談判，也許會延長條款並獲得更好的條款。

Last year, as you rightly said, it was a combination of FX, which, by the way, affected positively revenue and OIBDA, but it had the opposite effect in leases. Also some of the inflation of similar indices adjustments and also that we incorporated a new right of use of Oi, for instance, or build-to-suite we are doing in Germany.

去年，正如您所說的那樣，它是外彙的組合，順便說一句，它對收入和 OIBDA 產生了積極影響，但對租賃產生了相反的影響。還有一些類似指數調整的通貨膨脹，以及我們納入了 Oi 的新使用權，例如，我們正在德國進行的按套房建造。

So the full combination of that gave a least an uptake a little bit above the -- what should be the general trend. But it's not as easy to give you an inflation target because there's a lot of moving parts. But definitely, a priority for us, and we will keep optimizing this line.

因此，這一切的全面結合至少讓人們接受了一點——應該是總體趨勢。但是給你一個通脹目標並不那麼容易，因為有很多變動的部分。但絕對是我們的首要任務，我們將繼續優化這條線路。

We will now take the next question. It's from the line of Carl Murdock-Smith from Berenberg.

我們現在開始下一個問題。它來自 Berenberg 的 Carl Murdock-Smith 系列。

If I look at the income statement versus consensus, one of the biggest beats this quarter is net financial expense at EUR 266 million. That's quite a surprise and lower than every analyst in consensus given rising interest rates and 80% of debt being fixed.

如果我查看損益表與共識，本季度最大的節拍之一是淨財務費用為 2.66 億歐元。考慮到利率上升和 80% 的債務被固定，這非常令人驚訝，並且低於所有分析師的共識。

I was wondering if there are any positive one-offs in that cost line this quarter. Or should we be thinking the interest rate -- interest costs could be sustainably lower than previously expected going forward? So that's question number one.

我想知道本季度該成本線是否有任何積極的一次性調整。還是我們應該考慮利率——未來的利息成本可能會持續低於之前的預期？這是第一個問題。

Question number two is just on your comments about the legacy copper switch-off in Spain by April 2024. I was wondering if you could just expand a bit more on that in terms of quantitatively what could be the near-term financial impacts of that as we go past April 2024.

第二個問題只是關於你對 2024 年 4 月西班牙傳統銅礦關閉的評論。我想知道你是否可以在數量上進一步擴展它的近期財務影響是什麼，因為我們已經過了 2024 年 4 月。

Carl, on the financial expense question, I would say it's been rather the opposite. It may have been below -- sorry, expenses, net financial expenses below consensus, but that's because of the good management we are doing because there hasn't been significant one-offs. Actually, last year, we had some reversal of provisions for some items, so it was certainly more positive last year in the other side.

卡爾，關於財務費用問題，我想說的是恰恰相反。它可能低於 - 抱歉，費用，淨財務費用低於共識，但這是因為我們正在做的良好管理，因為沒有重大的一次性。實際上，去年我們對某些項目的準備金進行了一些逆轉，所以去年在另一方面肯定更積極。

So if you look at the year-on-year evolution, the good result is the management we are doing. We are benefiting from having a very high rate of 80% of fixed rates. We are also seeing that we had a big ramp-up in interest costs in Hispam and LatAm last year. That's more stable there.

所以如果你看一下同比的演變，好的結果是我們正在做的管理。我們受益於高達 80% 的固定利率。我們還看到，去年 Hispam 和 LatAm 的利息成本大幅上升。那裡比較穩定。

We have also reduced slightly the leverage ratio in real currency, and that's helping also a bit. But it's basically the debt-related financial expenses being very controlled and been optimized.

我們還略微降低了實際貨幣的槓桿率，這也有所幫助。但基本上是與債務相關的財務費用得到了很好的控制和優化。

On the other expenses, there are many bits and pieces. We have hedges. We have some commercial debt. We have -- anytime we have a fine or a contingency, it always has a tax element, and that's very, very volatile.

其他的開銷，還有很多零碎的。我們有樹籬。我們有一些商業債務。我們有 - 任何時候我們有罰款或意外情況，它總是有稅收因素，而且非常非常不穩定。

That's why we are working now in an increasingly focused market on interest rate raising. We are focusing more on the debt-related KPI, and that's been very well managed. But on the other, not big things in '23. I would say it was more beneficial in 2022, and this year actually is working. It's not helping us, just the opposite. It's the debt-related piece, which is bringing all the overperformance.

這就是為什麼我們現在在一個越來越關注加息的市場中工作。我們更多地關注與債務相關的 KPI，這得到了很好的管理。但另一方面，23 年並不是什麼大事。我會說它在 2022 年更有利，今年實際上正在發揮作用。這對我們沒有幫助，恰恰相反。這是與債務相關的部分，它帶來了所有的超額表現。

And regarding the benefits from the copper network shutdown, we -- as I was saying before, we have confirmed the determination to decommission our copper network by April '24. We will be one of the first telco players in the world to achieve this. And in fact, we are no longer adding subscribers on copper technology already since April this year.

關於銅網絡關閉的好處，正如我之前所說，我們已經確認在 24 年 4 月之前讓我們的銅網絡退役的決心。我們將成為世界上首批實現這一目標的電信運營商之一。事實上，自今年 4 月以來，我們就不再增加銅技術的訂閱者。

This will -- this brings -- it's already bringing OpEx and CapEx savings, as running fiber the home network is much cheaper on the back of lower maintenance and higher efficiency in terms of energy consumption. Fiber is 85% more efficient than copper.

這將——這帶來了——它已經帶來了運營支出和資本支出的節省，因為在較低的維護和更高的能源消耗效率的支持下，運行家庭網絡的光纖要便宜得多。光纖的效率比銅高 85%。

We're already capturing part of this in cost savings in energy, maintenance, lower failure rate, less call center retention and also in disposal of legacy assets, mainly copper, and some real estate, although this already peaked in 2022.

我們已經在節約能源、維護、降低故障率、減少呼叫中心保留以及處置遺留資產（主要是銅和一些房地產）方面取得了部分成果，儘管這已經在 2022 年達到頂峰。

So we think that efficiencies will continue increasing year by year until transformation is completed. We will need, during 2024, to continue some wholesale services, not retail, but wholesale services on copper for extra 6 months, and we will need some time for dismantling this after that.

所以我們認為效率會逐年提高，直到轉型完成。在 2024 年期間，我們將需要繼續一些批發服務，而不是零售，而是額外 6 個月的銅批發服務，之後我們將需要一些時間來拆除它。

But all in all, we estimate that we may have captured already 0.8 percentage points in OIBDA margin from permanent efficiencies of what we have been dismantling already so far. And we already have 90% of the fixed broadband customers in fiber.

但總而言之，我們估計我們可能已經從我們已經拆除的永久效率中獲得了 0.8 個百分點的 OIBDA 利潤率。我們已經擁有 90% 的光纖固定寬帶客戶。

And in the next 2 to 3 years, we could get an additional 1 percentage point of OIBDA margin improvement on this. Of course, there will be other moving pieces around, and this will also allow us to keep our CapEx to sales at a benchmark low level going forward.

在接下來的 2 到 3 年裡，我們可以獲得額外 1 個百分點的 OIBDA 利潤率改善。當然，還會有其他變動因素，這也將使我們能夠將我們的資本支出與銷售額保持在基準低水平。

Thank you, Carl. We have time for one last question, please.

謝謝你，卡爾。我們有時間回答最後一個問題。

Our last question comes from the line of Pilar Vico from Credit Suisse.

我們的最後一個問題來自瑞士信貸的 Pilar Vico。

I have 2 on my side. So the first one is on Spain, and I would like to get a bit more clarity on whether you're starting to see some sort of spin down. There were some comments in MasMóvil this week where they were highlighting the intensive promotional activity on the low end.

我身邊有2個。所以第一個是關於西班牙的，我想更清楚地了解你們是否開始看到某種減速。本週 MasMóvil 上有一些評論強調了低端產品的密集促銷活動。

So I'm not pretty sure how much of this is actually being reflected into the customer base. Angel mentioned that O2 has been quite strong this quarter. So it would be good if we could get a bit more clarity here on whether this promotion activities is impacting the base.

所以我不太確定其中有多少實際上反映到了客戶群中。 Angel 提到 O2 本季度表現相當強勁。因此，如果我們能夠在這裡更清楚地了解此促銷活動是否正在影響基地，那將是一件好事。

And the second one is on Brazil. It has been a very strong performance, so I'm not sure if part of this is already capturing benefits from the ICMS tax reduction, when to start expecting price increases or if there is any sort of mechanism in place in order just to capture this potential upside.

第二個是關於巴西的。這是一個非常強勁的表現，所以我不確定其中的一部分是否已經從 ICMS 減稅中獲益，何時開始預期價格上漲或者是否有任何形式的機制來捕捉這一點潛在的上升空間。

Thank you, Pilar. On your first question, we are seeing a limited spin down, the same way that maybe in other markets like the U.K. with cost of living crisis is impacting partially. In Spain, we are seeing a very, very limited spin down. We attribute to this the fact that we anticipated trends by adjusting from Fusión to Mi Movistar and making the bundle more flexible, more modular, more adaptable to the customer needs.

謝謝你，皮拉爾。關於你的第一個問題，我們看到了有限的降速，這與英國等其他市場可能受到生活成本危機的部分影響相同。在西班牙，我們看到了非常非常有限的降速。我們將這一事實歸因於我們通過從 Fusión 調整到 Mi Movistar 並使捆綁包更靈活、更模塊化、更能適應客戶需求來預測趨勢。

And this is, in the end, yes, the mix of O2 has been increasing. But at the same time, we have also been adding new digital services in our digital B2B ecosystem devices, and so on, that allow us to manage the different moving parts and, all in all, continue increasing the ARPU at the time that we improve NPS, NPS gap, and we reduce churn. So nothing that concerns us. And actually, we anticipated it with the reconfiguration of the Mi Movistar portfolio.

最後，是的，O2 的混合一直在增加。但與此同時，我們也在我們的數字 B2B 生態系統設備中添加了新的數字服務，等等，這使我們能夠管理不同的移動部分，總而言之，在我們改進的時候繼續增加 ARPU NPS，NPS 差距，我們減少了客戶流失。所以沒有什麼讓我們擔心的。實際上，我們在重新配置 Mi Movistar 產品組合時就預料到了這一點。

Regarding Brazil and ICMS, we passed that benefit to the customer. There was different timing of adjustments. This is a tax that is applicable state-by-state. Different states have applied different adjustments and in different moments of time. This process is over. We have passed this to the customer.

關於巴西和 ICMS，我們將利益傳遞給了客戶。有不同的調整時間。這是各州適用的稅。不同的州在不同的時間進行了不同的調整。這個過程就結束了。我們已將此傳遞給客戶。

On the other side, this has allowed us to increase prices according to inflation or thereabouts, both in fixed and in mobile. But the customers, thanks to this reduction of the tax, have not been suffering so much in their bills.

另一方面，這使我們能夠根據通貨膨脹或附近的情況提高固定和移動的價格。但是，由於減稅，客戶的賬單並沒有受到太大的影響。

And this has allowed us also in Brazil to continue growing ARPU, to grow NPLs, maintain or reduce churn and achieve the spectacular rates of growth that we have been posting in the results that you saw in the market.

這也讓我們在巴西能夠繼續增加 ARPU，增加不良貸款，維持或減少客戶流失率，並實現我們在市場上看到的結果中所公佈的驚人增長率。

So the ICMS, which I think was your question, it has been passed to the customers and has allowed, let's say, the customers today just the price increases without suffering such a big impact in their overall bill, including taxes.

所以 ICMS，我認為是你的問題，它已經傳遞給客戶並且允許，比方說，今天的客戶只是價格上漲，而不會對他們的整體賬單（包括稅收）產生如此大的影響。

So thank you very much for your questions -- sorry, go ahead Pilar.

非常感謝你提出的問題——抱歉，皮拉爾請繼續。

No. Just in terms of the promotional activity, is there anything that you are just spotting, which might be worried in terms of market moves or could trigger higher commercial activity?

沒有。就促銷活動而言，有沒有什麼是您剛剛發現的，可能會擔心市場走勢或可能引發更高的商業活動？

What we see is that the market continues to be a 2-tier market. Promotions are out of all the main brands in the higher ARPU, higher value segments. In the low end, there is more intensity of competition. I think that in their statement, MasMóvil was also pointing at, at the activity in those segments.

我們看到的是，市場仍然是一個二級市場。促銷活動來自更高 ARPU、更高價值細分市場中的所有主要品牌。在低端，競爭更加激烈。我認為，在他們的聲明中，MasMóvil 還指出了這些細分市場的活動。

So in the lower price, lower cost and lower ARPU segment, yes, there is more to be a competitive environment in those segments, but the market is confirming the rationality on the promotional activity and many other elements clearly in the mid- and high-end tiers. And yes, we will continue to see pressures on the low end.

所以在更低的價格、更低的成本和更低的 ARPU 細分市場，是的，這些細分市場有更多的競爭環境，但市場正在確認促銷活動和許多其他因素在中高端市場的合理性。結束層。是的，我們將繼續看到低端的壓力。

So with this, I would like to thank everybody. We hope that we have been able to respond to your questions. If there were questions left, please don't hesitate to contact our Investor Relations team. Thank you.

因此，我要感謝大家。我們希望我們能夠回答您的問題。如果還有疑問，請隨時聯繫我們的投資者關係團隊。謝謝。

Telefónica's January-March 2023 results conference call is over. You may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.

Telefónica 2023 年 1 月至 3 月的業績電話會議已經結束。您現在可以斷開線路。謝謝。