Starwood Property Trust Inc (STWD) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Greetings. Welcome to Starwood Property Trust's Fourth Quarter and Full Year 2023 Earnings Call. (Operator Instructions) Please note, this conference is being recorded.

問候。歡迎參加喜達屋地產信託 2023 年第四季和全年財報電話會議。 （操作員說明）請注意，本次會議正在錄製中。

At this time, I'll hand the conference over to Zach Tanenbaum, Head of Investor Relations. Zach, you may now begin.

這次，我將把會議交給投資人關係主管 Zach Tanenbaum。札克，​​你現在可以開始了。

Thank you, operator. Good morning, and welcome to Starwood Property Trust Earnings Call. This morning, the company released its financial results for the quarter and year ended December 31, 2023, filed its Form 10-K with the Securities and Exchange Commission, and posted its earnings supplement to its website. These documents are available on the Investor Relations section of the company's website at www.starwoodpropertytrust.com.

謝謝你，接線生。早安，歡迎參加喜達屋地產信託收益電話會議。今天上午，該公司發布了截至 2023 年 12 月 31 日的季度和年度財務業績，向美國證券交易委員會提交了 10-K 表格，並在其網站上發布了其收益補充報告。這些文件可在公司網站 www.starwoodpropertytrust.com 的投資者關係部分取得。

Before the call begins, I would like to remind everyone that certain statements made in the course of this call are not based on historical information and may constitute forward-looking statements. These statements are based on management's current expectations and beliefs and are subject to a number of trends and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from those described in the forward-looking statements.

在電話會議開始之前，我想提醒大家，本次電話會議中所做的某些陳述並非基於歷史信息，可能構成前瞻性陳述。這些陳述是基於管理層目前的預期和信念，並受到許多趨勢和不確定性的影響，這些趨勢和不確定性可能導致實際結果與前瞻性陳述中描述的結果有重大差異。

I refer you to the Company's filings made with the SEC for a more detailed discussion of the risks and factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from those expressed or implied in any forward-looking statements made today. The Company undertakes no duty to update any forward-looking statements that may be made during the course of this call.

我建議您參閱該公司向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件，以更詳細地討論可能導致實際結果與今天所做的任何前瞻性聲明中明示或暗示的結果存在重大差異的風險和因素。該公司不承擔更新本次電話會議期間可能做出的任何前瞻性陳述的責任。

Additionally, certain non-GAAP financial measures will be discussed on this conference call. A presentation of this information is not intended to be considered in isolation or as a substitute for the financial information presented in accordance with GAAP. Reconciliations of these non-GAAP financial measures to the most comparable measures prepared in accordance with GAAP can be accessed through our filings with the SEC at www.sec.gov.

此外，本次電話會議也將討論某些非公認會計準則財務指標。此資訊的呈現不應被孤立地考慮或作為根據 GAAP 呈現的財務資訊的替代。這些非 GAAP 財務指標與根據 GAAP 制定的最具可比性的指標的對帳可透過我們向 SEC 提交的文件 www.sec.gov 進行查看。

Joining me on the call today are Barry Sternlicht, the Company's Chairman and Chief Executive Officer; Jeff DiModica, the Company's President; and Rina Paniry, the Company's Chief Financial Officer.

今天和我一起參加電話會議的是公司董事長兼執行長 Barry Sternlicht； Jeff DiModica，公司總裁；以及公司財務長 Rina Paniry。

With that, I'm now going to turn the call over to Rina.

有了這個，我現在要把電話轉給莉娜。

Thank you, Zach, and good morning, everyone. Starting with our results. We reported distributable earnings or DE of $189 million or $0.58 per share for the quarter, and $663 million or $2.05 for the year. The strong quarter was highlighted by contributions across our businesses, although it likely does not constitute a run rate.

謝謝你，扎克，大家早安。從我們的結果開始。我們報告本季可分配收益或 DE 為 1.89 億美元，即每股 0.58 美元，全年可分配收益為 6.63 億美元，即每股 2.05 美元。我們整個業務的貢獻凸顯了這一季度的強勁表現，儘管它可能並不構成運作率。

We had outsized performance from our conduit this quarter after a slow start to the year and also had $0.04 of earnings related to commercial lending repayments, including prepaid penalties and foreign currency hedge on line.

經過今年開局緩慢之後，本季我們的管道表現出色，並且還獲得了 0.04 美元的與商業貸款償還相關的收益，包括預付罰款和線上外匯對沖。

GAAP net income was $71 million or $0.22 per share for the quarter, and $339 million or $1.07 per share for the year. GAAP book value per share ended the year at $19.95, with undepreciated book value at $20.93. These metrics were impacted by an increase in our commercial lending reserves, including increases in our general CECL reserve, charge-offs and impairments related to REO properties totaling $129 million and $351 million for the quarter and year.

該季度 GAAP 淨利潤為 7,100 萬美元，即每股 0.22 美元；全年淨利潤為 3.39 億美元，即每股 1.07 美元。截至年底，每股 GAAP 帳面價值為 19.95 美元，未折舊帳面價值為 20.93 美元。這些指標受到我們商業貸款準備金增加的影響，包括我們的一般 CECL 準備金增加、與 REO 財產相關的沖銷和減值，本季和本年度總計 1.29 億美元和 3.51 億美元。

I will begin my segment discussion with Commercial and Residential Lending, which contributed DE of $205 million for the quarter or $0.63 per share. In Commercial Lending, we originated $707 million of loans, which brings our full year originations to $1.1 billion. Repayments of $815 million in the quarter and $2.9 billion in the year outpaced fundings of $664 million and $1.7 billion.

我將從商業和住宅貸款部門開始我的部分討論，該部門為本季度貢獻了 2.05 億美元的 DE 或每股 0.63 美元。在商業貸款方面，我們發放了 7.07 億美元的貸款，這使我們全年的發放貸款達到 11 億美元。該季度的還款額為 8.15 億美元，全年的還款額為 29 億美元，超過了融資額的 6.64 億美元和 17 億美元。

Our portfolio of predominantly senior secured first mortgage loans ended the year at $15.9 billion with a weighted average risk rating of 2.9. This is consistent with last quarter despite downgrades of four loans totaling $502 million to a four risk rating, of which $450 million were U.S. office. Offsetting this were upgrades from a four to a three risk rating, totaling $197 million, including a $159 million formerly vacant office loan in Brooklyn that was converted to multifamily and brought current by the sponsor. In the quarter, we had one new foreclosure on a $61 million multifamily loan and one new non-accrual related to a $124 million office loan. Both loans were five-rated and will be covered in Jeff's remarks.

我們的投資組合以優先擔保第一抵押貸款為主，年末金額為 159 億美元，加權平均風險評級為 2.9。這與上個季度一致，儘管四筆貸款的評級被下調至四級風險評級，總金額為 5.02 億美元，其中 4.5 億美元為美國辦公室貸款。抵消這一影響的是風險評級從四級升級為三級，總額為 1.97 億美元，其中包括布魯克林先前空置的辦公室貸款 1.59 億美元，該貸款已轉換為多戶住宅，並由贊助商提供。本季度，我們新增了一筆 6,100 萬美元多戶貸款的取消抵押品贖回權，以及一筆與 1.24 億美元辦公貸款相關的新非應計利息。這兩筆貸款的評級均為五級，傑夫的演講將對此進行介紹。

Last quarter, I mentioned that our CECL balance doesn't tell the whole story of our asset reserves because some of our loans have been moved to REO and some loans that are still on our balance sheet have reported charge-offs. Although these have already been taken out of GAAP book value, neither of these appear in our CECL reserve. However, they are really no different than a specific reserve just on another financial statement line.

上個季度，我提到我們的 CECL 餘額並不能說明我們資產儲備的全部情況，因為我們的一些貸款已轉移到 REO，而一些仍在我們資產負債表上的貸款已報告沖銷。儘管這些已從 GAAP 帳面價值中扣除，但這些都沒有出現在我們的 CECL 儲備中。然而，它們實際上與另一家財務報表行上的特定準備金沒有什麼不同。

In the quarter, our general CECL reserve increased by $28 million to a balance of $307 million, of which 74% relates to U.S. office, while REO impairments increased by $101 million to a balance of $172 million. Together, these reserves represent 3% of our lending portfolio.

本季度，我們的一般 CECL 準備金增加了 2,800 萬美元，餘額為 3.07 億美元，其中 74% 與美國辦事處有關，而 REO 減損準備增加了 1.01 億美元，餘額為 1.72 億美元。這些準備金合計占我們貸款組合的 3%。

To clarify the REO component of this, I want to briefly discuss the GAAP accounting model. Once an asset is transferred into REO, it follows property accounting. This means it has held at amortized cost unless events or changes in circumstances indicate that its carrying amount may not be recoverable. We encountered these indicators on two previously foreclosed assets, which were either underwritten agreement or active discussion to be sold at our basis to unrelated third parties. Both transactions failed to materialize.

為了澄清其中的 REO 組成部分，我想簡要討論一下 GAAP 會計模型。一旦資產轉移到 REO，就會遵循財產會計。這意味著它以攤餘成本持有，除非事件或情況變化表明其帳面金額可能無法收回。我們在先前止贖的兩項資產上遇到了這些指標，這些資產要么是包銷協議，要么是根據我們的積極討論將其出售給不相關的第三方。兩筆交易均未能實現。

The first asset is our vacant building in Downtown L.A. that has a DE basis of $245 million. Because our current quarter negotiations to sell this asset were ultimately unsuccessful, we commissioned an updated appraisal, which resulted in an incremental $71 million GAAP impairment.

第一項資產是我們位於洛杉磯市中心的空置建築，其 DE 基礎價值為 2.45 億美元。由於我們本季出售該資產的談判最終未成功，因此我們委託進行了更新評估，導致 GAAP 減損增加了 7,100 萬美元。

The second asset is our office building in Houston that has a DE basis of $126 million. After an LOI at our basis was terminated last quarter, we engaged an updated appraisal. Shortly thereafter, we entered into an LOI with another unrelated third party to sell the property at a price lower than our basis. That transaction was also unsuccessful.

第二項資產是我們位於休士頓的辦公大樓，其 DE 基礎價值為 1.26 億美元。在上季終止我們基礎的意向書後，我們進行了更新的評估。此後不久，我們與另一個無關的第三方簽訂了意向書，以低於我們基準的價格出售該房產。那次交易也沒有成功。

Although the appraisal indicated full recovery of our basis, we conservatively utilized the value implied by the most recent LOI to determine our GAAP impairment of $30 million. You will find these impairments presented in the other loss common net line in our GAAP P&L, and reflected as a reduction of the property's common net line in our balance sheet.

儘管評估表明我們的基礎已完全恢復，但我們保守地利用最近的 LOI 隱含的價值來確定我們 3000 萬美元的 GAAP 減損。您會發現這些減損在我們的 GAAP 損益表中的其他損失共同淨額中列出，並在我們的資產負債表中反映為財產共同淨額的減少。

Next I will discuss our Residential Lending business. Our on-balance sheet loan portfolio ended the year at $2.6 billion, including $916 million of agency loans. The loans in this portfolio continue to repay at par with $60 million of repayments during the quarter and $239 million year-to-date. Given tighter spreads and a decline in longer rates, the mark-to-market on our portfolio improved by $152 million this quarter, partially offset by a negative hedge mark of $99 million. In our $450 million retained RMBS portfolio, lower prepaid speeds continued to benefit this book with tighter spreads contributing to a positive $6 million mark-to-market.

接下來我將討論我們的住宅貸款業務。截至年底，我們的表內貸款組合達到 26 億美元，其中包括 9.16 億美元的機構貸款。該投資組合中的貸款繼續以面額償還，本季償還額為 6,000 萬美元，年初至今償還額為 2.39 億美元。鑑於利差收窄和長期利率下降，本季我們投資組合的以市價計算提高了 1.52 億美元，部分被 9,900 萬美元的負對沖標記所抵消。在我們保留的 4.5 億美元的 RMBS 投資組合中，較低的預付費速度繼續使本書受益，而更窄的利差導致按市值計算的正值達到 600 萬美元。

Next I will discuss our Property segment, which contributed $22 million of DE or $0.07 per share to the quarter. Of this amount, $13 million came from a Florida affordable housing fund. For GAAP purposes, we recorded an unrealized fair value increase related to this portfolio of $18 million in the quarter net of non-controlling interest. The value was determined by an independent appraisal, which we are required to obtain annually.

接下來我將討論我們的房地產部門，該部門為本季貢獻了 2,200 萬美元的 DE 或每股 0.07 美元。其中 1,300 萬美元來自佛羅裡達州經濟適用住房基金。就 GAAP 而言，我們記錄了本季與該投資組合相關的未實現公允價值成長 1,800 萬美元（扣除非控制權益）。該價值由獨立評估確定，我們需要每年進行一次評估。

Turning to Investing and Servicing. This segment contributed DE of $33 million or $0.10 per share to the quarter. Our conduit Starwood Mortgage Capital helped drive our outperformance in the quarter, completing five securitizations, totaling $467 million, which represented 61% of their securitization volume for the year. We expect to continue seeing higher volumes from this business in 2024 as loan maturities and originations pick up. The year is off to a good start with two securitizations totaling $118 million of loans completed in January.

轉向投資和服務。該部門為本季貢獻了 3,300 萬美元或每股 0.10 美元的 DE。我們的通路喜達屋抵押貸款資本 (Starwood Mortgage Capital) 幫助推動了我們在本季度的優異表現，完成了五項證券化，總額達 4.67 億美元，佔其全年證券化交易量的 61%。隨著貸款到期日和發放量的增加，我們預計 2024 年該業務的交易量將持續增加。今年有一個良好的開端，一月份完成了兩項總計 1.18 億美元貸款的證券化。

In our special servicer, fees increased to $14 million in the quarter due to $500 million of loan resolutions. These resolutions were offset by $1 billion of new transfers into active servicing, nearly two-thirds of which were office or contained in office component. Our named servicing portfolio ended the year at $98.7 billion, driven by $1.8 billion of new servicing assignments in the quarter and $6.7 billion during the year.

在我們的特殊服務商中，由於 5 億美元的貸款決議，本季費用增加至 1,400 萬美元。這些決議被 10 億美元的新轉入現役服務所抵消，其中近三分之二是辦公室或包含在辦公室部分。我們指定的服務投資組合到年底達到 987 億美元，這得益於本季 18 億美元的新服務任務和全年 67 億美元的新服務任務。

And on this segments property portfolio, we sold one asset in the quarter for $32 million. Since inception of this portfolio, we have sold 30 assets, totaling $412 million for DE gains of $144 million, demonstrating our ability to successfully acquire and reposition transitional real estate.

在該細分市場的房地產投資組合中，我們在本季以 3,200 萬美元的價格出售了一項資產。自該投資組合啟動以來，我們已出售 30 項資產，總計 4.12 億美元，DE 收益為 1.44 億美元，這證明了我們成功收購和重新定位過渡性房地產的能力。

Concluding my business segment discussion is our Infrastructure Lending segment, which contributed DE of $23 million or $0.07 per share to the quarter. We continue to see strong investing this quarter with $425 million of new loan commitments, bringing our total for the year to $1.1 billion. Its highest level since we acquired this business in 2018. Repayments totaled $182 million for the quarter, and $905 million for the year, with the portfolio ending the year at a balance of $2.6 billion.

最後我的業務部門討論是我們的基礎設施貸款部門，該部門為本季度貢獻了 23​​00 萬美元或每股 0.07 美元的 DE。本季我們繼續看到強勁的投資，新增貸款承諾達 4.25 億美元，使我們今年的貸款總額達到 11 億美元。這是我們自 2018 年收購該業務以來的最高水準。本季還款總額為 1.82 億美元，全年還款總額為 9.05 億美元，年末投資組合餘額為 26 億美元。

And finally this morning, I will address our liquidity and capitalization. Our leverage continues to remain low with an adjusted debt to undepreciated equity ratio of just 2.47x. This reflects the fourth quarter repayment of our $300 million unsecured notes, which leaves us with no corporate debt maturities until December 31, 2024, when our $400 million unsecured notes mature. In addition to low leverage, our liquidity position remains strong today at $1.2 billion. This does not include liquidity that could be generated through sales of assets in our Property segment or debt capacity that we have via the unsecured and term loan B market.

最後，今天早上，我將討論我們的流動性和資本化問題。我們的槓桿率持續保持在較低水平，調整後負債與未折舊股本比率僅為 2.47 倍。這反映了我們 3 億美元無擔保票據的第四季度償還情況，這使得我們在 2024 年 12 月 31 日之前沒有公司債務到期，屆時我們的 4 億美元無擔保票據到期。除了低槓桿之外，我們的流動性頭寸目前仍保持在 12 億美元的強勁水平。這不包括透過出售我們的房地產部門的資產或我們透過無擔保和定期貸款 B 市場擁有的債務能力所產生的流動性。

With that, I'll turn the call over to Jeff.

這樣，我就把電話轉給傑夫。

Thanks, Rina. Our industry originated more loans from late 2020 through early 2022 than any other period in our history, thus creating a significant amount of initial maturities in the late 2024 and early 2025. Fortunately, the 10-year treasury yield fell 100 basis points in the fourth quarter and forward SOFR made a similar move and is now pricing at a 175 basis point reduction to 3.6% in 2025.

謝謝，麗娜。我們的產業從2020 年底到2022 年初發放的貸款比歷史上任何其他時期都多，因此在2024 年底和2025 年初產生了大量初始到期債務。幸運的是，10 年期公債殖利率在第四季度下跌了100 個基點季度和遠期 SOFR 採取了類似舉措，目前定價為 2025 年下調 175 個基點至 3.6%。

While this more optimistic interest rate environment has reduced tail risk for the 90% of our assets that are not loans on U.S. office. The rate move to date has not been large enough to materially change U.S. office market outcomes as office pricing also has to deal with lower net effective rent, the persistence of work from home and a lack of liquidity in the office lending markets.

雖然這種更樂觀的利率環境降低了我們 90% 的非美國辦公室貸款資產的尾部風險。迄今為止，利率變動幅度還不足以實質改變美國辦公室市場的結果，因為辦公室定價還必須應對淨有效租金下降、在家工作持續存在以及辦公室貸款市場缺乏流動性的問題。

Being managed by one of the largest real estate private equity firms in the world, asset management has always been a hallmark of our company's outperformance and our entire team is focused on asset management today. We have had net realized gains on REO to date, but with lenders continuing to move away from the office sector, we have had multiple asset sales fall out of contract at our basis in recent months, and we are evaluating alternate disposition plans.

由世界上最大的房地產私募股權公司之一管理，資產管理一直是我們公司卓越表現的標誌，今天我們整個團隊都專注於資產管理。到目前為止，我們在 REO 上已經實現了淨收益，但隨著貸款人繼續撤離辦公部門，近幾個月來，我們的多項資產銷售都脫離了合同，我們正在評估替代處置計劃。

Rather than wait for a better option that may not come, we have uniquely moved over $600 million of loans into REO to date. These assets are now the focus of our asset management teams and our goal is to maximize shareholder value. We will continue to evaluate options including adding capital and repositioning assets rather than quickly selling into a distressed market with seller financing that could put a longer term drag on earnings.

迄今為止，我們沒有等待可能不會出現的更好選擇，而是將超過 6 億美元的貸款轉移到 REO。這些資產現在是我們資產管理團隊的重點，我們的目標是股東價值最大化。我們將繼續評估包括增加資本和重新定位資產在內的選擇，而不是透過賣方融資快速進入陷入困境的市場，這可能會對獲利造成長期拖累。

Rina mentioned we placed a $124 million five-rated office loan in Arlington, Virginia on non-accrual in the quarter. As you likely know, Greater DC has been the hardest hit by work from home with the majority of government employees still at home four years after COVID, making this long-term stable and consistent office market one of the most difficult to underwrite today.

Rina 提到，本季我們在維吉尼亞州阿靈頓發放了 1.24 億美元的五級辦公貸款，該貸款為非應計利息。如你所知，大華盛頓特區是在家工作的重災區，在新冠疫情四年後，大多數政府僱員仍然在家工作，這使得這個長期穩定且一致的辦公市場成為當今最難承保的辦公市場之一。

This loan went into payment default in the quarter and we are evaluating foreclosing in the coming quarters to either reposition or sell the assets. The property is operationally cash flow positive and has 4.5 years of remaining WALT. We will continue to look for accretive leasing while we decide on the right time to potentially sell the asset, assuming we take title.

這筆貸款在本季陷入付款違約狀態，我們正在評估未來幾季的取消抵押品贖回權，以重新定位或出售資產。該房產營運現金流為正，剩餘 WALT 期限為 4.5 年。假設我們獲得所有權，我們將繼續尋找增值租賃，同時決定可能出售資產的適當時間。

Rina also mentioned we foreclosed on our first multifamily loan in the quarter, a $61 million loan on a recently built multi in the Pacific Northwest that has been slow to reach stabilized occupancy. We choose to sell this asset. We expect to see a return of our basis in 2024. This asset is systemic of what we expect to see as this cycle moves to its next phase.

Rina 也提到，我們在本季取消了第一筆多戶型貸款的贖回權，這是一筆6,100 萬美元的貸款，貸款對像是太平洋西北地區最近建造的一棟多戶型住宅，該住宅的入住率一直很緩慢。我們選擇出售該資產。我們預計我們的基礎將在 2024 年回歸。隨著本週期進入下一階段，該資產是我們預期看到的系統性資產。

Undercapitalized borrowers who lack the staying power to protect assets until stabilization will be replaced by large balance sheets with staying power like ours, or we will move the assets to the substantial pools of third party capital that have been raised to recapitalize them. The majority of our industry's multifamily loans have stabilized debt yields above 6%, and assuming today's forward curve is correct, we expect most of these will be able to refinance at our loan proceeds or have sponsors who will see value in paying down their debt, buying interest rate caps and replenishing reserves to qualify for extensions.

資本不足的借款人在穩定之前缺乏持久力保護資產，他們將被像我們這樣具有持久力的大型資產負債表所取代，或者我們會將資產轉移到已籌集的大量第三方資本池中以對其進行資本重組。我們行業的大多數多戶家庭貸款都將債務收益率穩定在6% 以上，假設今天的遠期曲線是正確的，我們預計其中大多數將能夠用我們的貸款收益進行再融資，或者有贊助商看到償還債務的價值，購買利率上限並補充準備金以獲得延期資格。

Most of these borrowers bought new interest rate caps in 2022 or 2023 that were more expensive than they are today, so we expect them to do the same to qualify for extensions in 2024. Should they choose not to protect what is essentially a six plus cap multifamily asset and should we choose to foreclose, we expect to recover our basis or more if interest rates and cap rates continue to normalize going forward.

這些借款人中的大多數在2022 年或2023 年購買了新的利率上限，這些上限比現在的價格更高，因此我們預計他們也會這樣做，以獲得2024 年延期的資格。他們是否應該選擇不保護本質上六倍以上的利率上限多戶資產，如果我們選擇取消贖回權，如果利率和上限利率繼續正常化，我們預計將恢復我們的基礎或更多。

As I just mentioned, we have profitably bridged assets to stabilization in the past. We will be patient where we see long-term investment opportunities and believe there is significant liquidity at or near our basis on lease up multifamily assets where we don't choose to stay in them longer term.

正如我剛才提到的，我們過去已經成功地使資產穩定下來。如果我們看到長期投資機會，並相信租賃多戶資產的基礎上存在大量流動性或接近我們不選擇長期保留的多戶資產，我們將保持耐心。

Looking at our broader CRE lending portfolio, we proactively cut our office exposure in half since 2019, while also reducing our construction and future funding exposure by half. Pro forma for a data center loan that paid off in full last week, our future funding obligations sell to $800 million net of senior financing, a fraction of our company's typical and historic level. Less future funding obligations will allow us to maintain our significant liquidity as we look to pay off corporate debt maturities in December 2024 and March 2025.

縱觀我們更廣泛的商業房地產貸款組合，自 2019 年以來，我們主動將辦公室風險敞口減少了一半，同時還將建築和未來融資風險敞口減少了一半。根據上週全額還清的資料中心貸款預計，扣除高級融資後，我們未來的融資義務將達到 8 億美元，這只是我們公司典型歷史水準的一小部分。未來融資義務的減少將使我們能夠維持大量的流動性，因為我們希望在 2024 年 12 月和 2025 年 3 月償還到期的公司債務。

While we expect to refinance these in the capital markets, should we choose not to, we have ample liquidity to repay them with cash while maintaining a significant liquidity cushion. As Rina said, we received $4.8 billion of repayments in 2023, and we funded $3.6 billion of loans. Our projected excess liquidity will allow us to continue to invest accretively in 2024, albeit still at a measured pace.

雖然我們希望在資本市場上為這些資金進行再融資，但如果我們選擇不這樣做，我們有充足的流動性可以用現金償還它們，同時保持大量的流動性緩衝。正如 Rina 所說，我們在 2023 年收到了 48 億美元的還款，並提供了 36 億美元的貸款。我們預期的過剩流動性將使我們能夠在 2024 年繼續增加投資，儘管步伐仍然謹慎。

We created this diversified company and have maintained low leverage over the years to the benefit of both our equity and debt investors. You've heard us say, we would like to be investment grade in the future. And to do that, we need to maintain our lower leverage and increase the amount of unsecured debt on our balance sheet as a percentage of total debt. The high-yield index hit 600 basis points over treasuries in the fall of 2022 and is at 355 basis points today. Our borrowing spreads have followed that trend.

我們創建了這家多元化的公司，多年來一直保持低槓桿率，以造福我們的股權和債務投資者。您已經聽過我們說過，我們希望未來成為投資等級。為此，我們需要保持較低的槓桿率，並增加資產負債表上無擔保債務佔總債務的百分比。 2022 年秋季，高收益指數較國債高出 600 個基點，目前為 355 個基點。我們的借貸利差也遵循了這一趨勢。

As we continued to lend in every quarter since COVID, we made many loans at higher asset spreads and finance them with nearly $2 billion of higher-cost bank lines, while still creating accretive shareholder returns. Should unsecured borrowing spreads continue to fall, we will be in a position to replace these expensive, really prepayable bank lines in the unsecured debt markets at little to no cost to us for the first time in our history. Pro forma for that debt replacement strategy, we would be in position to argue for a potential ratings upgrade as our unsecured debt percentage would increase substantially. I will note that our BB and BB plus corporate ratings were affirmed by all three rating agencies in the higher rate environment we faced in 2023.

自新冠疫情以來，我們每季都繼續放貸，以較高的資產利差發放了許多貸款，並用近 20 億美元的高成本銀行額度為其融資，同時仍然創造了增值的股東回報。如果無擔保借款利差持續下降，我們將能夠在無擔保債務市場上更換這些昂貴的、真正可提前償還的銀行額度，而這對我們來說是歷史上第一次，而成本幾乎為零。對於該債務替代策略，我們將有理由主張潛在的評等升級，因為我們的無擔保債務比例將大幅增加。我要指出的是，在 2023 年我們面臨的更高利率環境下，我們的 BB 和 BB+ 企業評級得到了所有三個評級機構的肯定。

As I just mentioned, the vast majority of our borrowings today are non-corporate debt. Our focus has always been on maintaining significant covenant ratio cushion in those facilities. We have a fixed charge covenant ratio, defined as EBITDA over cash interest expense of 1.4x on our non-corporate debt, as do most of our peers. Our lower leverage model creates lower interest expense, which in turn gives us significant flexibility under this and our other debt covenants.

正如我剛才提到的，我們今天的絕大多數借款都是非公司債務。我們的重點始終是在這些設施中維持顯著的契約比率緩衝。我們的非公司債務有固定費用契約比率，定義為 EBITDA 與現金利息費用之比為 1.4 倍，就像大多數同業一樣。我們較低的槓桿模型創造了較低的利息支出，這反過來又為我們在本債務契約和其他債務契約下提供了巨大的靈活性。

Our FCCR today sits at 1.8x, giving us billions of dollars of additional debt capacity should we choose to use it and over $100 million of EBITDA cushion, leaving us with tremendous flexibility on how to grow or further optimize the right side of our balance sheet going forward.

目前，我們的FCCR 為1.8 倍，如果我們選擇使用它，我們將獲得數十億美元的額外債務能力以及超過1 億美元的EBITDA 緩衝，使我們在如何增長或進一步優化資產負債表右側方面擁有巨大的靈活性向前走。

We are addressing two opportunities created by the noticeable pullback of regional banks in middle market CRE lending. Our Starwood Solutions business is now up and running, and we believe a significant portion of the demand for valuation and workout services will come from the regional banking system. We also hired a seasoned CRE professional to create a middle market lending vertical at STWD for the first time to focus on the $15 million to $50 million loan size that regional banks historically dominated, and we have historically not participated in. This smaller balanced loans segment offers premium unlevered yields, and we believe this increased ROE will be very accretive to shareholders in the coming years, albeit on less equity than in our large loan business.

我們正在應對地區銀行在中間市場商業房地產貸款顯著縮減所帶來的兩個機會。我們的喜達屋解決方案業務現已啟動並運行，我們相信評估和鍛鍊服務的很大一部分需求將來自區域銀行系統。我們還聘請了一位經驗豐富的CRE 專業人士，首次在STWD 創建中間市場貸款垂直領域，重點關注區域銀行歷來主導的1500 萬至5000 萬美元貸款規模，而我們歷來沒有參與過。這個規模較小的平衡貸款領域提供優質的無槓桿收益率，我們相信，儘管股本比我們的大型貸款業務少，但淨資產收益率的增加將在未來幾年為股東帶來巨大的增值。

Moving to our Energy Infrastructure Lending business. 2023 marks our highest origination volume year since we purchased the business from General Electric in 2018. We wrote $1.1 billion in loans in 2023, which is the same amount as we wrote in our core business, CRE lending. We continue to like the attractive risk reward of power and midstream assets. And with funding costs remaining steady, we were, again, able to earn above historic levered returns in this segment in 2023, and we expect to continue to grow this segment in 2024.

轉向我們的能源基礎設施貸款業務。 2023 年是我們自 2018 年從通用電氣收購該業務以來貸款量最高的一年。2023 年我們發放了 11 億美元的貸款，這與我們在核心業務商業地產貸款中發放的貸款金額相同。我們繼續看好電力和中游資產有吸引力的風險回報。由於融資成本保持穩定，我們再次能夠在 2023 年在該領域獲得高於歷史槓桿回報的回報，並且我們預計該領域將在 2024 年繼續成長。

Finally, our low leverage and uniquely diversified business model that was built to outperform in volatile markets has allowed STWD to earn the only positive total return in our sector since the beginning of COVID.

最後，我們的低槓桿率和獨特的多元化業務模式旨在在波動的市場中表現出色，使 STWD 能夠獲得自新冠疫情爆發以來我們行業中唯一的正總回報。

With that, I will turn the call to Barry.

這樣，我就把電話轉給巴里。

Thanks, Jeff. Thanks, Rina, and thanks, Zach. Good morning, everyone. I wrote a colorful quote in our press release, but I do think it's worth noting that the real estate industry just has a balance sheet crisis. It's affected nearly every asset class, maybe safe data centers. But even there, yields on costs have to rise to reflect the increased cost of capital. And the real estate distribution caused this economic situation.

謝謝，傑夫。謝謝，麗娜，謝謝，扎克。大家，早安。我在我們的新聞稿中寫了一段色彩繽紛的引言，但我確實認為值得注意的是，房地產行業剛剛出現了資產負債表危機。它幾乎影響了所有資產類別，也許也影響了安全資料中心。但即便如此，成本收益率也必須上升，以反映資本成本的增加。而房地產的分配造成了這種經濟狀況。

We were just an unintended consequence. But a material consequence for cities and municipalities as values drop and real estate values -- real estate taxes based on values will come down and cities and municipalities won't be able to fund their police fireman, waste management and schools. So the Fed has three victims of their current policy, and we are headed towards 300 basis point real rates unless they were lent. The first is the government themselves saying 5%, 5.3% on $33 trillion, a third of which rolls over this year.

我們只是一個意想不到的結果。但隨著價值下降和房地產價值的下降，對城市和市政當局來說，一個重大後果是基於價值的房地產稅將會下降，城市和市政當局將無法為其警察消防員、廢物管理和學校提供資金。因此，聯準會目前政策有三個受害者，除非借出資金，否則我們的實際利率將達到 300 個基點。第一個是政府自己說 33 兆美元的 5%、5.3%，其中三分之一會在今年結轉。

The second are the regional banks, which cannot stay solvent with these current interest rates, with $1.9 trillion of real estate exposure, not to mention the mark-to-market or not required mark-to-market on the securities book. And the third would be probably the entire real estate industry in the complex. People talk to me about the level of rates in the 4.3%, 10 years is not an issue. We all could adjust to it. We've adjusted to it before. But simply the pace of the increase, the rapid increase and of course, the statements that we were going to stay lower longer in December of 2021. And then actually easing into May of 2022, and the fact that the Fed relied on stale data or very delayed data for a third of its CPI, so when rents were flying, they showed no inflation. And now their rents are falling, they are still showing a significant increase in rents in the apartment and residential sector.

第二類是地區銀行，它們無法在目前的利率下保持償付能力，擁有 1.9 兆美元的房地產風險，更不用說按市值計價或證券帳簿上不需要按市價計價的銀行。第三個可能是綜合體中的整個房地產行業。人們跟我談論4.3%的利率水平，10年不是問題。我們都可以適應它。我們之前已經適應了。但只是成長的速度、快速成長，當然還有我們將在2021 年12 月保持較低利率更長一段時間的聲明。然後實際上到2022 年5 月就放鬆了，事實上聯準會依賴過時的數據或三分之一的消費者物價指數數據非常滯後，因此當租金飛漲時，它們並沒有顯示通貨膨脹。現在他們的租金正在下降，但公寓和住宅領域的租金仍然呈現大幅上漲。

So it's not clear why we use data for residential that's not current when we use current data for energy and for food. It would take a minute for the Fed to call Fannie and Freddie and find out what's really happening in the apartment market, in the residential markets. They have more data than you want on earth. And they would see that they are running the economy and the global markets and causing recession, both in Japan and now in parts of Europe. Based on the other governments, they need to increase rates to defend their currencies because of the Fed's actions.

因此，當我們使用最新的能源和食品數據時，我們還不清楚為什麼我們使用非最新的住宅數據。聯準會需要一分鐘的時間才能打電話給房利美和房地美，了解公寓市場、住宅市場的實際情況。他們擁有的數據比你在地球上想要的還要多。他們會發現他們正在操縱經濟和全球市場，並導致日本和現在歐洲部分地區的經濟衰退。根據其他政府的說法，由於聯準會的行動，他們需要提高利率來捍衛本國貨幣。

And when people outlawed the current Fed for their policies, they don't pay attention to the fact that $6 trillion of stimulus was hit the shelves or hit pocket books as the things on the shelves disappeared. And so inflation was simply too much money chasing too few goods. And that it was going to correct on its own, which is has the supply chains obviously fixed, and consumers are now running out of the $6 trillion. And the economy continues to be healthy, healthier than thinking most anyone thought because of fiscal spending, and they cannot impact the economy with -- or the job market with interest rates anymore.

當人們宣布現任聯準會的政策為非法時，他們並沒有註意到6萬億美元的刺激計劃已經上架或隨著貨架上的東西消失而進入錢包的事實。因此，通貨膨脹就是太多的錢追逐太少的商品。而且它會自行糾正，供應鏈顯然已經修復，而消費者現在已經耗盡了 6 兆美元。由於財政支出，經濟持續健康，比大多數人想像的更健康，而且它們不能再透過利率影響經濟或就業市場。

When the half of your labor force is in healthcare, in education and in local governments, as you saw last month, 107,000 health care jobs have created. They're going to continue to be created despite anything the government does other than crushing what's left of the economy, which would probably be the retail sector or the services sector. And that would include layoffs at store, in the hotels, airlines, Goldman Sachs, all the investment banks, all the banks, that can only do with a real recession. You're going to have to be careful to land this plane softly. And the government spending continues at pace, and we are not getting construction job losses that we expected.

當你的一半勞動力在醫療保健、教育和地方政府工作時，正如你上個月看到的那樣，就創造了 107,000 個醫療保健工作。儘管政府除了摧毀經濟剩下的部分（可能是零售業或服務業）之外做了任何事情，它們仍將繼續被創造出來。這將包括商店、酒店、航空公司、高盛、所有投資銀行、所有銀行的裁員，這只能在真正的經濟衰退時進行。你必須小心地讓這架飛機輕輕著陸。政府支出仍在持續成長，但建築業就業的流失並未達到我們的預期。

Now, all the asset classes in real estate have been impacted differently. You are going to see and we continue to see a wave of multifamily assets complete there, and in the total number of units being completed is not out of line between single-family and apartments, but it shifted from 40-60 apartments, single-family to 60-40 apartment single-family. And that -- the good news is the markets are absorbing this, but it's causing market rents or existing rents to weaken, which is why we've been so confident, inflation will come down and it will show up eventually in the CPI numbers, is it a third of CPI. That wave of new supply fortunately will die at the end of -- middle of 2025, almost all those units will be complete and we'd expect to see rent growth accelerate again in the apartment markets.

現在，房地產中的所有資產類別都受到了不同的影響。你將會看到，我們將繼續看到一波多戶型資產在那裡竣工，在竣工的單位總數中，單戶住宅和公寓之間並沒有脫節，但它從40-60 套公寓轉變為單戶住宅，家庭以60-40戶單戶公寓為主。好消息是市場正在吸收這一點，但這導致市場租金或現有租金疲軟，這就是為什麼我們如此有信心，通膨將會下降，最終會在 CPI 數據中體現出來，是CPI的三分之一嗎？幸運的是，這波新供應潮將在 2025 年年中結束，幾乎所有這些單位都將竣工，我們預計公寓市場的租金成長將再次加速。

I think for that reason, with 40% of our lending book in the apartment space, we would like to get these assets back. We will make more money if we actually -- if our borrowers give us these assets back, our loans are 65% of typically of cost. We're buying it at -- our basis would be super attractive. And the best we can do when we lend is get our capital back in our coupons while we have infinite opportunity with well-positioned assets to make more money, frankly, if they were to fall into our lap. We've only had one default. And as mentioned in the call, we would expect to sell it at the basis of the loan very shortly.

我認為出於這個原因，我們 40% 的貸款簿都在公寓空間，我們希望收回這些資產。如果我們實際上——如果我們的借款人歸還這些資產，我們的貸款是通常成本的 65%，我們就會賺更多的錢。我們購買它的價格——我們的基礎將非常有吸引力。當我們放款時，我們能做的最好的事情就是將我們的資本收回到我們的息票中，同時我們有無限的機會利用定位良好的資產來賺更多的錢，坦率地說，如果它們落入我們的手中。我們只有一個預設情況。正如電話中提到的，我們預計很快就會在貸款的基礎上出售它。

But while there's light at the end of the tunnel because all of us believe, I believe, I think all of us believe, most -- all of us believe that the Fed has done hiking, when they lower rates is going to be very interesting. And I'm pretty sure they're aware of the consequences and the teetering side of regional banks, the losses that you cannot exactly track, both in office, resi and even in the industrial markets, which were being acquired at yields that are no longer market passing yields.

但是，儘管隧道盡頭有曙光，因為我們所有人都相信，我相信，我認為我們所有人都相信，大多數人都相信美聯儲已經升息，但當他們降低利率時將會非常有趣。我很確定他們意識到了後果以及地區銀行搖搖欲墜的一面，以及你無法準確追蹤的損失，無論是在辦公室、房地產市場，還是在工業市場，這些銀行的收購收益率都非常低。更長的市場傳遞收益率。

So there is strain in the real estate markets. We are in the ship. We are in the boat. We are navigating these waters. We are going to take some losses. We are going to be okay. We have set ourselves the company up with a massive amount of liquidity, the decline in future funding that Jeff mentioned, $800 million of net funding -- of future funding calls on us, it's really 60% construction, all of which is fine. And 40% is called good news, you committed to do a tenant improvement or lease a building.

因此，房地產市場存在壓力。我們在船上。我們在船上。我們正在這些水域航行。我們將承受一些損失。我們會沒事的。我們為自己的公司建立了大量的流動性，傑夫提到的未來資金的減少，8億美元的淨資金——未來資金的需求量，實際上是60%的建設，所有這些都很好。 40% 被稱為好消息，你承諾對租戶進行改善或租賃建築物。

And those will happen if they happen, the borrower may not actually even call the capital because he's worried that the money that goes into TI, the building may not be worse that when – or when -- if he goes and heads and puts these tenants in these buildings.

如果這些事情發生的話，借款人可能實際上甚至不會打電話給資本，因為他擔心流入TI 的錢，這座大樓可能不會比什麼時候更糟糕——或者什麼時候——如果他去並投入資金這些建築物中的這些租戶。

So I think we've certainly got a very diversified business model. We're delighted that we can invest incremental capital in the energy space right now, which is providing a very attractive double-digit yields. And we continue to build that book. It's actually the biggest it's ever been, I think, since we started. We bought that business from GE years ago.

所以我認為我們肯定有一個非常多元化的商業模式。我們很高興現在可以在能源領域投資增量資本，這提供了非常有吸引力的兩位數收益率。我們將繼續編寫這本書。我認為，這其實是我們成立以來規模最大的一次。幾年前我們從通用電氣收購了這項業務。

It is notable about the light at the end of the tunnel, the conduit markets are strong, and we've had a good launch this quarter, the credit spreads are coming in, the market's anticipating rates coming down, and AAAs have come in probably 60 basis points, 70 basis points across the board just in the last three months. That's the first sign that the markets are healing. And the CMBS markets are pretty wide open to act as a new exit strategy for borrowers who are trying to repay loans.

值得注意的是隧道盡頭的曙光，管道市場強勁，我們本季的推出情況良好，信貸利差正在出現，市場預期利率正在下降，AAA 可能已經進入60個基點，僅在過去三個月就全面上漲了70個基點。這是市場正在復甦的第一個跡象。 CMBS 市場非常開放，可以作為試圖償還貸款的借款人的新退出策略。

Heretofore, it was really just the existing lender. But now, if the asset is stable and secure and it's in probably one of the favorite asset groups, but even office is finding its way into conduits and securitizations and now like at 16% to 20% of the securitization might have office in its portfolio.

迄今為止，它實際上只是現有的貸方。但現在，如果該資產穩定且安全，並且可能屬於最受歡迎的資產類別之一，但即使是Office 也在尋找進入管道和證券化的方式，現在16% 至20% 的證券化可能在其投資組合中擁有Office 。

So you really are playing hand-to-hand combat, in our case, partnering with our borrowers and figuring out workable solutions, using our entire organization both here and in Europe to get through what is a challenging period. But I think we feel pretty comfortable that our dividend will be secure, very comfortable. Our dividend will be secured for the foreseeable future. And we just had a really significant payoff of a loan, a very large loan in the book. And there are some other things that are mentioned in Jeff's and Rina's comments that will provide additional liquidity to us. And we're very cognizant of getting through all of this.

因此，就我們而言，您實際上正在進行肉搏戰，與我們的借款人合作並找出可行的解決方案，利用我們在這裡和歐洲的整個組織來度過這個充滿挑戰的時期。但我認為我們感到非常放心，我們的股息將是安全的，非常放心。在可預見的未來，我們的股利將得到保障。我們剛剛還清了一筆非常可觀的貸款，一筆帳面上非常大的貸款。 Jeff 和 Rina 的評論中提到的其他一些事情將為我們提供額外的流動性。我們非常清楚如何度過這一切。

Sometimes, you don't really know. We'll be taking – I've visited recently an asset we took back in Washington, D.C., 1200 K Street's a beautiful building.

有時，你並不真正知道。我們將採取 - 我最近參觀了我們在華盛頓特區收回的資產，1200 K 街是一座美麗的建築。

It's an unimaginably now that equity our borrowers have lost, unfortunately. But in that case, we will reposition that office building as the apartment building. It's actually quite beautiful. And we'll just take a little bit of capital, but it will come out of our book. And when I look at the company, we have almost $1 billion of assets that aren't earning much, if anything. So that's additional earnings power as we've rationalized and redeploy the capital into things that could earn a substantial return on investment.

不幸的是，現在我們的借款人失去了資產，這是難以想像的。但在這種情況下，我們會將該辦公大樓重新定位為公寓大樓。它實際上非常漂亮。我們只需要一點點資本，但它會來自我們的書。當我審視這家公司時，我們擁有近 10 億美元的資產，但即使有收入，也沒有多少收入。因此，隨著我們對資本進行合理化並將其重新部署到可以賺取可觀投資回報的領域，這是額外的獲利能力。

This is actually as good a time to be a lender, maybe 2009 when we started the company, but we have to be very careful how much often we go, and we are still investing. Unlike many of our peers, we are actually still finding opportunities and playing here and there, taking through the opportunities that the team sees and it's -- that is good news for us. And we have an office loan in Europe that is 100% leased. It's going to repay. We know it will repay. And so our office exposure will continue to drop. Our biggest office loan in Europe.

這實際上是成為貸款人的好時機，也許是 2009 年我們創辦公司的時候，但我們必須非常小心我們去的頻率，而且我們仍在投資。與我們的許多同行不同，我們實際上仍在尋找機會，到處發揮，利用團隊看到的機會，這對我們來說是個好消息。我們在歐洲有一筆辦公室貸款，100%已出租。是會報應的。我們知道它會得到回報。因此，我們的辦公室風險將持續下降。我們在歐洲最大的辦公大樓貸款。

So the complexion of the portfolio is solid. We have a $15 billion loan book against the $25 billion, $27 billion, $26 billion asset base. So we are not just a commercial mortgage lender today, we have other businesses that are higher ROE businesses, that are continuing to accelerate, like the special servicer who is a – you just wonder how many of these office buildings are going to wind up in Eleanor's laps. But I would say a lot of them.

因此，投資組合的結構是堅實的。我們的資產基礎為 250 億美元、270 億美元、260 億美元，貸款總額為 150 億美元。因此，今天我們不僅僅是一家商業抵押貸款機構，我們還有其他更高 ROE 的業務，這些業務正在繼續加速發展，例如特殊服務商，您只是想知道有多少辦公大樓將被拆除躺在艾莉諾的腿上。但我會說很多。

And you will see a lot of people still have caps on their loans, and they can cover debt service, but they cannot refinance. And if anybody thinks that the real estate markets have prepared themselves, and that wouldn't be the case just yet. Although we do believe that, of course, if the Fed lowers rates where we expect 150 basis points real rates instead of 300 basis points of real rates, this will get much better faster in many asset classes that we're exposed to.

你會看到很多人的貸款仍然有上限，他們可以償還債務，但不能再融資。如果有人認為房地產市場已經做好準備，那麼事實還不是這樣。當然，儘管我們確實相信，如果聯準會將實際利率降低到我們預期的 150 個基點而不是 300 個基點，那麼我們所接觸的許多資產類別的情況會更快地好轉。

The office markets in the U.S. are unique. They're not like the European office markets. I recently returned from Germany, where rents were up 5% to 15% last year, and pretty much everything we've done in the construction has leased or pre-leased, Same is true in the Middle East and Asia. So this is a U.S. phenomenon really only. And there in the U.S., you have a bifurcation between the really good buildings, which actually remain full and are holding your tenants in the B and C. So I think U.S. office is going to look a lot like the mall market. The best malls are full, tenants scramble to get in them. They have pricing power, and the B and C malls are going the way of the dodo bird. And many of these generic buildings, we'll probably have to find alternative use, which might include tearing them down.

美國的辦公室市場是獨一無二的。它們與歐洲辦公室市場不同。我最近從德國回來，去年那裡的租金上漲了 5% 到 15%，我們在建築中所做的幾乎所有事情都是租賃或預租的，中東和亞洲也是如此。所以這其實只是美國的現象。在美國，真正好的建築之間存在分歧，這些建築實際上仍然滿員，並將您的租戶保留在 B 區和 C 區。所以我認為美國的辦公室看起來很像購物中心市場。最好的購物中心都爆滿了，租戶爭先恐後地進去。他們有定價權，B、C商場正在步渡渡鳥的後塵。對於許多這些通用建築，我們可能必須找到替代用途，其中可能包括拆除它們。

So the team has dug in. Everyone is in their seats where the Board is supportive and creative. We started Starwood Solutions, and I hope it becomes a meaningful contributor to our earnings growth going forward. And we thank you for your support.

因此，團隊已經全力以赴。每個人都坐在自己的座位上，董事會給予支持和創造力。我們創辦了喜達屋解決方案，我希望它能為我們未來的獲利成長做出有意義的貢獻。我們感謝您的支持。

With that, we'll take any questions, I guess.

我想，這樣我們就會回答任何問題。

(Operator Instructions) First question comes from Sarah Barcomb with BTIG.

（操作員說明）第一個問題來自 BTIG 的 Sarah Barcomb。

I'm wondering if you can talk a bit more about your new focus on middle market lending strategy. What's driving the decision to enter that market? Is it mostly a function of regional banks backing away or maybe reduce takeout liquidity on the large balance side? And would you consider looking at an existing middle market loan portfolio or primarily focused on new originations?

我想知道您是否可以多談談您對中間市場貸款策略的新關注。是什麼促使我們決定進入市場？這主要是由於地區銀行減少或減少了大額餘額方面的外賣流動性嗎？您會考慮考慮現有的中間市場貸款組合還是主要專注於新的貸款組合？

We definitely look at existing books if they were, I mean, they have to be performing. We're not really in the NPL business here. It's just -- it's really hard to run a public company because you don't have any earnings until you can restructure the loan, and that would -- it may not be much return on capital. As far as middle market, if you look at the pyramid of opportunities in the world, it's a pyramid that the biggest deals, over $1 billion deals, which we've written loans as large as I think $800 million.

我們肯定會關注現有的書籍，我的意思是，它們必須表現出色。我們這裡並不是真正從事不良貸款業務。只是——經營上市公司真的很困難，因為在重組貸款之前你沒有任何收入，而那可能——資本回報率不會很高。就中間市場而言，如果你看看世界上的機會金字塔，你會發現金字塔中最大的交易，超過 10 億美元的交易，我認為我們發放的貸款高達 8 億美元。

There are not that many of those. And today, there are not many large transactions being done. And most of our opportunities are refis, $160 million of multi loan. Those are the kinds of things you see at the moment, there are not any really giant transactions being financed, and most of those will probably get done in the CMBS markets right now.

這樣的人並不多。如今，進行的大額交易並不多。我們的機會大多是再融資，即 1.6 億美元的多重貸款。這些就是你目前看到的情況，沒有任何真正的大型交易正在融資，其中大部分交易可能會在 CMBS 市場上完成。

So in terms of opportunity, there are the best opportunities in the middle markets and the smaller loans, which have been cleared out by the regional banks, which are not lending. So recently in two different situations, we went out on assets we own, not in the REIT, but in the Starwood Opportunity Funds and one was an office building fully leased in Tennessee. The other one was a hotel in the Midwestern state. And you send out 128 books and you get four letters of intent and they're all from debt funds at 500 over. So we want to play in those markets. And the gentleman we hired to do that is actually sitting to my left. Say hi.

所以就機會而言，中間市場和較小的貸款有最好的機會，這些貸款已經被地區銀行清理掉了，不放款了。因此，最近在兩種不同的情況下，我們出售了我們擁有的資產，不是房地產投資信託基金，而是喜達屋機會基金，其中之一是田納西州完全租賃的辦公大樓。另一家是中西部州的一家旅館。你發出了 128 本書，你收到了四份意向書，它們全部來自 500 多美元的債務基金。所以我們想參與這些市場。我們僱來做這件事的那位先生實際上坐在我的左邊。打招呼。

Hi, guys.

嗨，大家好。

Hi, guys. That's Pawan Melgiri. Pawan joined us from Stellar. He was at Citi and Wells as a banker before that. And after Wharton, he spent nine years, I guess, at Stellar running their investments on both the debt and equity side. And we're super happy to have him joining us this week. So there will be work in progress.

嗨，大家好。那是帕萬·梅爾吉里。 Pawan 從 Stellar 加入我們。在此之前，他曾在花旗銀行和富國銀行擔任銀行家。我想，從華頓商學院畢業後，他在 Stellar 工作了九年，負責債務和股權的投資。我們非常高興他本週加入我們。因此，將會有一些工作正在進行中。

It's just another cylinder. It's obviously in the same sector, but it's a totally different scale asset. If we can build a giant book, that's a couple of billions of dollars of mid-market loans would be very happy.

這只是另一個圓柱體。顯然，它們屬於同一部門，但規模完全不同。如果我們能寫出一本巨著，那麼數十億美元的中端市場貸款就會非常高興。

Barry gave you the reasons why we're unlikely to buy a portfolio of loans. We like current loans. We don't want to bring in 4s and 5s, and we like current income. So as we've looked at that, we've also talked to probably three or four different middle market lenders about us buying a team, partnering with the team. We looked at a lot of different ways to do this.

巴里向您解釋了我們不太可能購買貸款組合的原因。我們喜歡當前的貸款。我們不想引進4s和5s，我們喜歡目前的收入。因此，正如我們所看到的那樣，我們還與可能三到四個不同的中間市場貸款機構討論了我們購買一支團隊並與該團隊合作的事宜。我們研究了很多不同的方法來做到這一點。

And ultimately, we decided with the data we have, with the infrastructure we have, that it made more sense to build this internally. And we realize that these are going to be smaller loans. We're not going to have 75-page investment committee decks on smaller loans. So we're working on ways to scale this business, using India resources and other that will allow us to scrape data and potentially asset management and underwrite, but they'll still go through our credit process as Starwood Property Trust.

最終，我們決定利用我們擁有的數據和基礎設施，在內部建立它更有意義。我們意識到這些貸款規模較小。我們不會有 75 頁的投資委員會關於小額貸款的報告。因此，我們正在研究擴大這項業務的方法，利用印度資源和其他資源，這將使我們能夠抓取數據並進行潛在的資產管理和承保，但他們仍將作為喜達屋地產信託經歷我們的信貸流程。

The hardest thing for us over the years on this is been deciding how can we put the same amount of credit attention. We have a Chief Credit Officer. Many of our peers don't. We have a separate underwriting function, 18 people that do nothing but underwrite loans and bring them through investment committee for us. Our originators don't do that, at most other shops, that's what an originator does. They take it through fruition. Our credit process is very bank-like. Barry set it up that way in 2009. We've never changed from that. We don't intend to change from that.

多年來我們在這方面最困難的事情是決定如何給予同樣多的信用關注。我們有一位首席信貸官。我們的許多同齡人不這麼認為。我們有一個單獨的承銷部門，有 18 個人，他們除了承銷貸款並為我們透過投資委員會帶來貸款之外什麼也不做。我們的原創者不會這樣做，在大多數其他商店，原創者就是這麼做的。他們將其付諸實踐。我們的信貸流程非常類似銀行。 Barry 在 2009 年就這麼定了。我們從未改變過。我們不打算改變這一點。

And we needed to find a way to be able to do this at the right cost, but we think it's a very large market, and we think it prices better than the large loan business. So we will earn a higher return on less dollars and hope that we can build it. So send us brokers, anybody, borrowers, please give us a call.

我們需要找到一種方法，能夠以適當的成本做到這一點，但我們認為這是一個非常大的市場，而且我們認為它的價格比大型貸款業務更好。因此，我們將以更少的資金獲得更高的回報，並希望我們能夠建造它。因此請向我們發送經紀人、任何人、借款人，請給我們打電話。

Next question, Stephen Laws with Raymond James.

下一個問題是史蒂芬·勞斯和雷蒙德·詹姆斯。

Two questions this morning. First, regarding Woodstar. Rina, I think in your prepared remarks, you mentioned it was a third-party appraisal that drove the valuation increase. But can you talk a bit about the cap rate where that asset is today? What gives you comfort in that? And any color on rent bumps that we expect to see in the second quarter?

今天早上有兩個問題。首先，關於伍德斯塔。 Rina，我想在您準備好的演講中，您提到是第三方評估推動了估值上漲。但您能談談該資產目前的上限利率嗎？是什麼讓你感到安慰？我們預計第二季的租金上漲會有什麼變化嗎？

Yes, Stephen, thanks a lot. Rina did mention that we're required to get an appraisal in the funds that, that is in. And so we got our required appraisal that came in a couple of months ago. I think you asked about cap rate. It's basically a 4.5% in-place asset level cap rate. We expect that forward income as we look to May, when rents get given to us by the State of Florida again. We expect them to be higher. They're based on, formulaically, on median income and CPI, both were higher this year. We expect them to be not insignificantly higher.

是的，史蒂芬，非常感謝。麗娜確實提到我們需要對現有資金進行評估。所以我們在幾個月前就得到了所需的評估。我想你問的是上限利率。這基本上是 4.5% 的現有資產水準上限。我們預計五月的遠期收入將由佛羅裡達州再次向我們提供租金。我們預計它們會更高。從公式上講，它們是基於收入中位數和消費者物價指數（CPI），而今年兩者都較高。我們預計它們不會高出很多。

If you remember, last year, we had a 3.8% holdback on our rents that we were allowed to put through as it's the first time in the State of Florida did that. They wanted to make sure that we weren't increasing rents at a pace that tenants couldn't keep up with. We're okay with that. We know we're going to get the money down the line. So we expect to be able to add 38% incremental onto the median income and CPI. So this year will probably be another year that we will be a fairly high number. And because of that, we will probably get capped again. And we'll...

如果你還記得，去年我們被允許推遲 3.8% 的租金，因為這是佛羅裡達州第一次這樣做。他們希望確保我們不會以租戶無法跟上的速度增加租金。我們對此表示同意。我們知道我們會得到這筆錢。因此，我們預期中位數收入和消費者物價指數 (CPI) 將能夠增加 38%。因此，今年可能是我們的數字相當高的另一年。正因為如此，我們可能會再次受到限制。我們會...

Just to figure that up, they allowed, I think, an 8% increase. By formula, it was like 11.3%, and the 3.8% or whatever, they did that rolls over to the next year. So we would think the rent -- pretty certain, the rent growth of between 5% and 10%. And again, if it's above 10%, they're not going to let you take it. So it will roll into 25%. So that's not so unusual asset – let me -- hold on a second. This is a very unusual asset class. You're 100% full. You're effectively full. The only vacancy you have is turning of units because your rents are 30%, 40% below market rents. So you run 97%. Actually, we have one issue with squatters in one city in Florida. But other than that, you're full and rents can't go down. So it's a totally different animal than market rate apartments, which are obviously softening in many markets. In some cases, rents are negative.

為了計算出這一點，我認為他們允許增加 8%。根據公式，大約是 11.3%，而 3.8% 或其他什麼，他們會結轉到下一年。因此，我們認為租金成長非常肯定，介於 5% 到 10% 之間。再說一次，如果超過 10%，他們就不會讓你接受。所以它將變成25%。所以這並不是什麼不尋常的資產——讓我——等一下。這是一個非常不尋常的資產類別。你已經100%飽了。你其實已經吃飽了。你唯一的空缺就是轉交單位，因為你的租金比市場租金低 30%、40%。所以你跑了97%。事實上，我們在佛羅裡達州的一個城市遇到了一個關於擅自佔地者的問題。但除此之外，你已經吃飽了，租金也降不下來。因此，它與市場價格公寓完全不同，市場價格公寓在許多市場都明顯疲軟。在某些情況下，租金是負的。

New leases in some markets, given the supplier going negative. So you can go read Rick Campos' comments to Camden's Property Trust or comments at EQR, and you get a very good sense of what's going on. Maybe the Fed should release these reports and adjust their numbers. They maybe they should fire 400 PhDs and get two people with a computer making full rents from rent.com and have a million data prints.

由於供應商出現負數，一些市場出現了新的租賃。因此，您可以閱讀 Rick Campos 對 Camden's Property Trust 的評論或 EQR 的評論，您會對正在發生的事情有一個很好的了解。也許聯準會應該發布這些報告並調整其數字。他們也許應該解僱 400 名博士，讓兩個人擁有一台電腦，從rent.com 全額出租租金，並列印一百萬份資料。

Yes, Stephen, it's interesting. We are more -- our rents -- even though our rents have gone up significantly, and that's driven the value increase that you've seen on our financials, our rents are more below market today than they were when we bought the portfolio. So market rents have gone up by more. And to Barry's point, to being 99% leased, that sort of almost ensures it.

是的，史蒂芬，這很有趣。我們更多的是——我們的租金——儘管我們的租金大幅上漲，這推動了您在我們的財務數據上看到的價值增長，但我們今天的租金比我們購買投資組合時的市場水平要低得多。因此市場租金上漲了更多。在巴里看來，99% 的出租率幾乎可以保證這一點。

So as we look to April, May, when we'll get more information on the forward rents, as I look at that in-place cap rate, the asset level cap rate that I quoted before, you can almost think of that as a mid to high 4s cap rate against where they see forward income coming at the -- with the increases that we have coming.

因此，當我們展望四月、五月時，我們將獲得有關遠期租金的更多信息，當我查看就地上限利率，即我之前引用的資產水平上限利率時，您幾乎可以將其視為中高4S 上限利率與他們預計未來收入的預期相比- 隨著我們即將增加。

But again, this sector -- the multi isn't impacted by new supply. Sadly, all of the 80/20 LIHTC deals. I mean, there's no affordable housing, not enough to be built. So you have no issues of supply in affordable. And that's one of the reasons for the differentiation to cap rate between what I'd say a market clearing price today would be for market multi and affordable housing project. You got a second question, Stephen?

但同樣，這個產業——多重市場不受新供應的影響。遺憾的是，所有 80/20 LIHTC 交易。我的意思是，沒有經濟適用房，也不足以建造。因此，您不存在負擔得起的供應問題。這就是我今天所說的市場多元化和經濟適用房屋項目的市場出清價格之間存在差異的原因之一。你還有第二個問題嗎，史蒂芬？

Yes. As a follow-up, I wanted to touch on -- I heard recently, you bought an $80 million loan out of a CLO. Can you maybe talk about that? How you think about managing collateral in your CLOs and kind of what drove that decision?

是的。作為後續行動，我想談談——我最近聽說，您從 CLO 中購買了 8000 萬美元的貸款。你能談談這個嗎？您如何看待管理 CLO 中的抵押品以及是什麼推動了這個決定？

You're good. That just came out deep into the reports in the last week or two, but I appreciate the call. CLOs for us have always been an opportunistic financing. A notes are our favorite financing. They have no recourse, they're term. They have no credit marks, and they have no crop. CLO is our second favorite form of financing.

你很厲害。這在過去一兩週的報告中才出現，但我很感謝您的來電。 CLO 對我們來說一直是一種機會主義融資。票據是我們最喜歡的融資方式。他們沒有追索權，他們是期限的。他們沒有信用分數，也沒有農作物。 CLO 是我們第二喜歡的融資形式。

We get rid of the mark, the ability to credit mark and we get rid of the recourse. And we've issued three CLOs to date, $3.375 billion in total of CLOs. And they've come in general, it spreads slightly inside, even with our issuing costs, slightly inside where our bank repo financing costs were and at slightly higher advance rates. That makes them very accretive to returns. And one of the things that makes them continually accretive for a longer period of time is as loans pay off that you reinvest in those CLOs.

我們擺脫了標記、信用標記的能力，並且我們擺脫了追索權。迄今為止，我們已經發行了三份 CLO，總價值為 33.75 億美元。總體來說，即使考慮到我們的發行成本，它仍然在內部略有擴散，稍微在我們銀行回購融資成本的範圍內，預付率略高。這使得他們的回報非常豐厚。使它們在較長時間內持續增值的原因之一是，當貸款還清時，您可以對這些 CLO 進行再投資。

We've done that, I think, $1.1 billion of reinvestments on 53 or 56 different loans over the life of these three CLOs that we have, which has been very good for us. But we think of the CLO as a partnership with our bond holders. We intend to issue again when it's accretive. But again, it will be opportunistic.

我認為，在我們擁有的這三份 CLO 的生命週期內，我們已經對 53 或 56 筆不同的貸款進行了 11 億美元的再投資，這對我們來說非常好。但我們將 CLO 視為與債券持有人的合作關係。我們打算在增值時再次發行。但同樣，這將是機會主義的。

We've said before that having a CLO finance only public company is more of a trade and not a business. The CLO market does go away at times. We've seen it go away in the last year from being accretive to repo. And when it is accretive, again, we will be back in the market. As part of being a partnership with our bondholders, and they allow us to reinvest, and that allows us to keep a lower cost of funds because we're not paying down the bonds sequentially, starting with AAA, which would increase our cost of funds. So reinvestment is good for us.

我們之前說過，擁有一家只提供 CLO 融資的上市公司更多的是一種交易，而不是一種業務。 CLO 市場有時確實會消失。去年我們看到它從增值轉向回購。當它再次增值時，我們將回到市場。作為與債券持有人合作的一部分，他們允許我們進行再投資，這使我們能夠保持較低的資金成本，因為我們不會從 AAA 級開始依次償還債券，這會增加我們的資金成本。所以再投資對我們有利。

What's good for them is being partnered with a partner like us who is willing and able to buy loans out when there is a default. We don't want to have defaulted loans in there and have to work them out within. And we've said for a long time that everyone has the desire to buy loans out. We'll see in difficult times who has the ability to buy loans out. So yes, we did buy a $81 million loan out of the CLO. That CLO was out of reinvestment. So that is costing us a higher cost of funds, by virtue of that $81 million, we'll pay off senior bonds.

對他們有利的是與像我們這樣願意並且能夠在出現違約時購買貸款的合作夥伴合作。我們不想在那裡出現拖欠貸款，因此必須在內部解決這些問題。我們長期以來一直在說，每個人都有購買貸款的願望。我們將在困難時期看看誰有能力購買貸款。所以，是的，我們確實從 CLO 購買了 8,100 萬美元的貸款。該 CLO 已不再進行再投資。因此，這導致我們的資金成本更高，憑藉這 8,100 萬美元，我們將償還優先債券。

But we want this to be a partnership with our bondholders. We want them to see that we're willing to step up. And when we come back to the market, we expect better pricing than the market because we've continued to do that. I think we bought $260 million of loans out of CLOs. I'm getting away from the reinvestments now. But we bought $260 million of loans out of these CLOs, which I think is very good for our platform. Next question, please.

但我們希望與我們的債券持有人建立夥伴關係。我們希望他們看到我們願意挺身而出。當我們回到市場時，我們預計會有比市場更好的定價，因為我們一直在這樣做。我認為我們從 CLO 中購買了 2.6 億美元的貸款。我現在正在擺脫再投資。但我們從這些 CLO 中購買了 2.6 億美元的貸款，我認為這對我們的平台非常有利。請下一個問題。

Our next question comes from Rick Shane with JPMorgan.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根大通的 Rick Shane。

Jeff, just one quick clarification. The $260 million, that was in the fourth quarter or that was for '23?

傑夫，我只是簡單地澄清一下。 2.6 億美元是第四季的還是 23 年的？

No, that's life to date in the quarter. If you go into TRAP, you can see that we bought an $81 million senior office loan out.

不，這就是本季度迄今為止的情況。如果您進入 TRAP，您可以看到我們購買了 8100 萬美元的高級辦公室貸款。

Got it. Okay. Thanks for the clarification. Look, I'd like to talk a little bit about 2 aspects of the -- well, first, REO. You guys have basically indicated that you are positioned to be long-term holders of REO and think that you're good operators and that this mitigates to some extent the charge-off risk associated with it.

知道了。好的。感謝您的澄清。聽著，我想談談 REO 的兩個面向。你們基本上已經表明，你們將成為 REO 的長期持有者，並認為你們是優秀的營運商，這在一定程度上減輕了與之相關的沖銷風險。

As we think about distributable earnings, is there enough cash flow off of those assets to come close to replacing what you were generating as lenders?

當我們考慮可分配收益時，這些資產是否有足夠的現金流來接近取代您作為貸款人產生的現金流？

Yes. It's a really interesting question. So a lot of the things that you're seeing go into our higher risk rated buckets, even the office, generally have 4 to 6 debt yields. They just don't have the 7 or 8 debt yield you might need to escape. So 4 to 6 debt yield means that there is cash after operating the office building, there is cash to distribute. It's just not quite enough to distribute to cover a new interest -- full interest loan.

是的。這是一個非常有趣的問題。因此，您看到的很多東西都屬於我們風險評級較高的類別，甚至是辦公室，通常都有 4 到 6 的債務收益率。他們只是沒有你可能需要逃避的 7 或 8 的債務收益率。所以4到6的債務收益率就意味著辦公室營運之後有現金，有現金可以分配。這還不足以支付新的利息——全額利息貸款。

So there is cash flow coming out. So the drag is less because of that, Rick. So we will take that into account. We certainly -- we've talked about a few assets that we would like to move on from because they don't pay current. We do care a lot about current income. So if an asset is sort of too big of a drag and it's more of an opportunity fund play where it's not going to pay something for an awful long time, that will be difficult on DE in the shorter run.

所以有現金流出來。因此，阻力較小，瑞克。所以我們會考慮到這一點。當然，我們已經討論過一些我們希望放棄的資產，因為它們不支付流動資金。我們確實非常關心目前的收入。因此，如果一項資產的拖累太大，而且更像是機會基金的遊戲，在很長一段時間內不會支付任何費用，那麼從短期來看，這對 DE 來說將是困難的。

I think you would only see us doing that if we feel really comfortable with our ability to cover our dividend away from that. If we started to feel like we were uncomfortable being able to cover it, we would probably move on those assets more quickly, and we wouldn't have the room. But fortunately, we've had some cushion in earnings, and we expect to have some cushion now so we'll be able to be flexible and choose what we want to keep longer and what we want.

我認為，只有當我們對自己有能力從中支付股息的能力感到非常滿意時，您才會看到我們這樣做。如果我們開始覺得無法涵蓋它，我們可能會更快地轉移這些資產，但我們就沒有足夠的空間了。但幸運的是，我們在收益方面有一些緩衝，我們預計現在也有一些緩衝，這樣我們就能夠靈活地選擇我們想要保留更長時間的東西和我們想要的東西。

So I think we've seen some numbers this week on percentages of assets in REO. And you just asked -- excuse me, in nonaccrual, and you just asked about REO. Between nonaccrual and REO, it's only 3.4% of our assets. So not a terrible burden yet. If you think -- as long as you cover the dividend by 1.034x, and if they don't even kick off any cash flow, you're going to be able to cover the dividend. I just made a scenario where they do kick off some cash flow, and we cover the dividend historically by more than 3.4%.

因此，我認為本週我們已經看到了有關 REO 資產百分比的一些數據。你剛才問了──對不起，是非應計的，你剛才問了 REO。在非應計利息和 REO 之間，它僅占我們資產的 3.4%。所以還不是一個可怕的負擔。如果您認為，只要您支付 1.034 倍的股息，並且如果他們甚至不啟動任何現金流，您就能夠支付股息。我剛剛設想了一個場景，他們確實啟動了一些現金流，而我們歷史上支付的股息超過 3.4%。

So we don't see it as a major drag to distribute earnings, but it could become one. If the cycle continues, it could become one, if rates don't follow the forward curve, and we are aware and at our battle stations that this could get more difficult. But today, we feel okay about it.

因此，我們不認為它是分配收益的主要阻力，但它可能會成為一個。如果這個週期繼續下去，如果利率不遵循遠期曲線，它可能會變成一個週期，而且我們意識到，在我們的戰場上，這可能會變得更加困難。但今天，我們對此感覺還不錯。

Just to quickly sum up, I mean, they're all different, some of these assets. And we get a multi back, it's probably yielding 6% or 7% to 6.5%. So -- but that's kind of where we would expect to get assets back. And if the cap rates for multis are not 6.5% today.

快速總結一下，我的意思是，它們都是不同的，其中一些資產是不同的。我們得到了多重回報，它的收益率可能是 6% 或 7% 到 6.5%。所以——但這就是我們期望收回資產的地方。如果現在多重投資的上限利率不是 6.5%。

So having said that, if it's a single asset partnership that borrowed against us, they may not have access to money. They may just don't have the capital or the investors don't want to put the money up. But again, that we would love to get those back.

因此，話雖如此，如果是單一資產合夥企業以我們為抵押借款，他們可能無法獲得資金。他們可能只是沒有資金，或者投資者不想投入資金。但再次強調，我們很樂意把它們找回來。

The challenging assets would be the office buildings, like 1200 K Street, which I think we have that capability and it's now unlevered on our books. We can borrow the money to renovate and turn it into an apartment. That will just take a couple of years to go through the development process. Or we bring in a partner, he either buys it for us, we JV it with him. He puts up the money to renovate it, and we just establish a base property value and we go 50-50 or something like that.

具有挑戰性的資產是辦公大樓，例如 1200 K Street，我認為我們有這種能力，但現在在我們的帳面上沒有槓桿化。我們可以藉錢裝修，把它變成公寓。整個開發過程只需要幾年的時間。或者我們引入一個合作夥伴，他要么為我們購買，我們與他合資。他出錢翻新它，我們只需確定一個基本財產價值，然後我們就調整到 50-50 或類似的價格。

So we have a lot of flexibility. I mean, one of our loans that we know is -- I believe is money good. It's the American Dream Mall, which has had quite a long history. But I think we're probably $0.25 or $0.30 of construction costs on that asset, and it is ramping. It's burning through its free rent. The theme park is doing really well. I think it's making like $90 million of EBITDA. And we just got paid.

所以我們有很大的靈活性。我的意思是，據我們所知，我們的一項貸款是——我相信金錢是好的。這就是美國夢購物中心，已經有相當悠久的歷史了。但我認為該資產的建設成本可能為 0.25 美元或 0.30 美元，而且還在增加。它的免費租金正在燃燒。主題樂園做得非常好。我認為它的 EBITDA 收入約為 9000 萬美元。我們剛剛得到報酬。

90% of our original underwrite.

我們原來承保的90%。

Right. And we just got paid $50 million of the principal that's got paid down because we have cross-collateralization with another asset he has, another major mall, which did a CMBS transaction and funded $50 million to us for a base, for accounting like $0.69 on a dollar or something like that. So -- and I actually think we have a chance of getting a lot of money back. So there's upsides, too to our marks, and it's going to be all over the place. It's a little hard to figure out.

正確的。我們剛剛得到了已償還本金的5000 萬美元，因為我們與他擁有的另一項資產（另一個大型購物中心）進行了交叉抵押，該購物中心進行了CMBS 交易，並為我們提供了5000 萬美元的基礎資金，會計上的費用為0.69 美元。一美元或類似的東西。所以——我實際上認為我們有機會拿回很多錢。因此，就我們而言，也有好處，而且它會無所不在。有點難以弄清楚。

In one situation, one of our borrowers had $400 million against the $400 million loan or half of their costs. And we do think that we are expecting them to walk. That’s a pretty household named borrower, so that's a fairly significant hit to them. We don't want the building back. It's an office building. But if we get it back, we will be creative. The good news is we'll take the basis down appropriately, and it will be reflect in a book guide. Thank you.

在一種情況下，我們的一位借款人在 4 億美元的貸款中獲得了 4 億美元，或者說是其成本的一半。我們確實認為我們期待他們行走。這是一個名叫借款人的漂亮家庭，所以這對他們來說是一個相當大的打擊。我們不希望建築物回來。這是一棟辦公大樓。但如果我們把它拿回來，我們就會有創造力。好消息是我們將適當地減少基礎內容，並將其反映在書籍指南中。謝謝。

Next question, Don Fandetti with Wells Fargo.

下一個問題是富國銀行的 Don Fandetti。

Jeff, you know, the conduit volume was up this quarter. Can you talk a little bit about gain-on-sale margins on that production relative to normalized? And is this like a 1 to 2 quarter type opportunistic? Or could we see elevated levels for more of a mini secular type?

傑夫，你知道，本季的管道銷量有所增加。您能否談談該產量相對於標準化的銷售利潤率？這是否像1到2季的機會主義？或者我們可以看到更多迷你世俗類型的水平有所提高？

Yes. Don, thanks. I have Adam Behlman in the room, who runs LNR and runs the condo business for us, so I'll turn it over to him. But I would say that we are looking at this year as a comeback year. I think 2024 will feel a lot better. We had a great fourth quarter, with the first quarter starting off really well. I'll let Adam talk about it. But we've been profitable in this business because Adam probably won't go here, pretty much every quarter since we took the business over in -- or since we took over LNR, excuse me. And that's for a bunch of reasons. There's a lot of reasons for that.

是的。唐，謝謝。 Adam Behlman 也在我的房間裡，他負責 LNR 的營運並為我們經營公寓業務，所以我會將其交給他。但我想說，我們將今年視為捲土重來的一年。我認為 2024 年會感覺好很多。我們第四節表現出色，第一節開局也非常好。我會讓亞當談談這件事。但我們在這項業務中一直盈利，因為自從我們接管這項業務以來，或者自從我們接管 LNR 以來，亞當可能不會去這裡，幾乎每個季度，對不起。這是有很多原因的。這有很多原因。

We don't tend to do the bigger investment grade tighter loans. We tend to do smaller sized loans where you have a little bit more cushion. And we hedge interest rates, and we hedge 40% or so of the credit exposure in the loans, and that's a very expensive thing to do, but it creates consistency. So we've been really excited about having a consistent book that we think has some upside this year as we're seeing some green shoots in CMBS. But I'll turn it to Adam to discuss.

我們不傾向於提供更大的投資等級更嚴格的貸款。我們傾向於提供小額貸款，這樣您就有更多的緩衝空間。我們對沖利率，對沖貸款中 40% 左右的信用風險，這是一件非常昂貴的事情，但它創造了一致性。因此，我們對出版一本一致的書感到非常興奮，我們認為今年它有一些好處，因為我們看到了 CMBS 的一些萌芽。但我會把它交給亞當討論。

Yes. I mean, I think you can say, look, it's going to be a volume game. I think our net P&L will be consistent to what we've been doing over time throughout our business within SMC. I think the big problems you saw in total, we did $760 million of origination in 2023, we're aiming to beat that much earlier this year than I think that would have its tighter spreads on CMBS deals. The less opportunity for other lenders out there, we're just at the NBA conference, and we were the CMBS lenders of the Bell of the Ball, I think. The only guy who's left standing.

是的。我的意思是，我想你可以說，看，這將是一場規模遊戲。我認為我們的淨損益將與我們在 SMC 業務中一直以來所做的保持一致。我認為你所看到的大問題總共是，我們在 2023 年發起了 7.6 億美元的融資，我們的目標是在今年早些時候擊敗這個數字，我認為 CMBS 交易的利差會更小。其他貸款人的機會較少，我們剛剛參加 NBA 會議，我認為我們是球鐘的 CMBS 貸款人。唯一還站著的人。

The only guy who's left standing.

唯一還站著的人。

So there really isn't, there's a lot of people who realize....

原來如此，其實沒有，很多人都意識到了...

Not that many people at the ball.

舞會上的人並不多。

Right, so it was good to see that, and we're seeing it, we're getting our head of credit is bombarded, he hasn't gone home. very early these days, and neither have I. So it's, I think we're seeing a rebound.

是的，很高興看到這一點，我們正在看到這一點，我們的信貸主管遭到轟炸，他還沒有回家。這些天很早，我也沒有。所以，我認為我們正在看到反彈。

We used to do [1.2 billion to 1.5 billion].

我們以前做過[12億到15億]。

Yes. I think it's -- I'm hopeful that we're certainly not going to see what we did last year, definitely.

是的。我認為——我希望我們肯定不會看到去年所做的事情。

So we don't really quote gain on sale, but I would say it's consistent with historic levels. And one other thing in the CMBS market that I find interesting. We've pivoted to having a decent-sized 5-year CMBS market, and that's a newish phenomenon. We needed to get B piece buyers comfortable because it's -- they don't have a long of a period of time to accrete from a lower dollar price and a B piece on a 5 year, so they have to buy a higher dollar price B piece. So that was a little bit difficult to digest at first, but I think people are realizing there's a lot of value there.

因此，我們並沒有真正引用銷售收益，但我想說它與歷史水平一致。我覺得 CMBS 市場上的另一件事很有趣。我們已經轉向擁有較大的 5 年期 CMBS 市場，這是一個新現象。我們需要讓 B 級買家感到舒服，因為他們沒有很長的時間來從較低的美元價格和 5 年期的 B 級中積累，所以他們必須購買更高的美元價格 B片。所以一開始有點難以消化，但我認為人們已經意識到其中有很多價值。

So we look all the time at CMBS versus Dennis and Mark’s book of transitional floating rate lending. And today, I think the CMBS market we're quoting something like 275 over five-year swaps on a fixed rate basis for sort of multis, industrials, et cetera, maybe 350 over for hotels. And those numbers are really consistent with where we're quoting transitional floating rate, which are three-year loans floating with two, one-year extensions.

因此，我們一直在關注 CMBS 與丹尼斯和馬克的過渡性浮動利率貸款書籍。今天，我認為在 CMBS 市場上，我們對多種產品、工業產品等的五年期掉期報價約為 275 美元，對於酒店來說可能超過 350 美元。這些數字與我們引用的過渡性浮動利率確實一致，即三年期浮動貸款，並可延期兩年。

So the pricing wise, if you can get the certainty of not having to deal with that role and you have cash flow that has debt service coverage that can get you into the CMBS market. The CMBS market is very interesting for that transitional borrower who has a lot -- who has a decent amount of cash flow to go into in five years, where historically, they probably would have all gone into the transitional floating market because they didn't want to take 10-year debt. So that will help volumes. They're not quite as profitable because it's a five-year deal instead of a 10-year deal, but it will help volumes, and we think we can grow there.

因此，在定價方面，如果您能夠確定不必處理該角色，並且您擁有具有償債能力的現金流，則可以讓您進入 CMBS 市場。 CMBS 市場對於那些擁有大量資金的過渡借款人來說非常有趣，他們在五年內有相當多的現金流可以進入，從歷史上看，他們可能都會進入過渡浮動市場，因為他們沒有想要承擔10年期的債務。這將有助於銷售。他們的獲利能力不太好，因為這是一項為期五年的協議，而不是十年的協議，但這將有助於提高銷量，我們認為我們可以在那裡實現成長。

We can be a part of every securitization that takes place in the nonbanking 5 and 10-year world. And I'll tell you, Jeff's right, it's almost 70% of the new deals out there are really 5-year origination, which is taking the place and why we're below the ball because we're kind of taking where the floating rate market was. But market again, the floating rate side here is open, too, on the mid-market side. So hopefully, that's going to allow us to really capture a lot of that business.

我們可以成為非銀行五年期和十年期世界中發生的每一次證券化的一部分。我會告訴你，傑夫是對的，幾乎 70% 的新交易實際上都是 5 年期的，這正在發生，以及為什麼我們低於球，因為我們有點採取浮動的地方利率市場是。但市場方面，這裡的浮動利率方面在中間市場方面也是開放的。希望這能讓我們真正獲得很多生意。

It's good for borrowers to have choices, and we think they have more choices now, it's good for everybody. Thank you for the question, Don.

對借款人有選擇是好事，我們認為他們現在有更多選擇，這對每個人都有好處。謝謝你的提問，唐。

Next question Jade Rahmani with KBW.

下一個問題是 KBW 的 Jade Rahmani。

Are you seeing any projects eligible for conversion to data centers as an alternative use? This quarter, we saw a homebuilder agree to sell a vacant piece of land carried at $5 million for a whopping $180 million. So I just thought I'd ask if you're seeing any alternative use cases there?

您是否看到任何項目有資格轉換為資料中心作為替代用途？本季度，我們看到一家住宅建築商同意以 500 萬美元的價格出售一塊空置土地，售價高達 1.8 億美元。所以我只是想問一下您是否在那裡看到任何替代用例？

Wow. We have one asset. I'll speak to where this sort of made some sense. It's in L.A. And I'm going to quote the megawatts wrong because I'm out of my area of expertise, but I think we thought that the side of the building, it would be accretive if we get something like 90 megawatts, and we could only get 30. And the problem is they're in a Downtown environment, you can't create power. You can't put a power center next to it. Barry knows this better than anybody, and it's why you're seeing a lot of data centers in place like Virginia where they can create more power.

哇。我們擁有一項資產。我將談談這種做法的合理之處。這是在洛杉磯，我會錯誤地引用兆瓦，因為我超越了我的專業領域，但我認為我們認為建築物的一側，如果我們得到像 90 兆瓦這樣的東西，它會增加，而且我們只能得到30 個。問題是他們在市中心環境中，你無法發電。你不能在它旁邊放置一個電源中心。巴里比任何人都更了解這一點，這就是為什麼你會看到像維吉尼亞州這樣的許多資料中心，在那裡它們可以產生更多的電力。

So we could only take the power that was available on the grid to us, and there wasn't enough power available on the grid to accretively turn this into a data center, which we had hoped to do. So in areas that are infill, I think it will be more difficult in power oriented and in areas where there's more land, you can create that if you create a large enough data center, but Barry is an expert, I'm going to turn it to him.

因此，我們只能利用電網上可用的電力，而電網上沒有足夠的可用電力來將其逐漸轉變為資料中心，而這正是我們希望做到的。因此，在填充的區域，我認為以電力為導向會更加困難，並且在有更多土地的區域，如果您創建一個足夠大的數據中心，您可以創建它，但巴里是專家，我將轉向給他。

You've got to have the substations. It's underutilized. So to the extent that there are, yes, it's possible. And we're the fourth largest owner of data centers now in the world privately held. And it's quite a little business there. So we probably have to do a $3 billion capital raise in STWD. These things require a lot of money. They are gigantic commitment of capital.

你必須有變電站。它沒有得到充分利用。因此，就存在的程度而言，是的，這是可能的。我們現在是全球第四大私人資料中心所有者。那裡的生意相當小。因此，我們可能需要為 STWD 籌集 30 億美元的資金。這些東西需要很多錢。它們是巨大的資本承諾。

So yes, if we got lucky, and I was visiting a building that actually we did take back, but not the REIT, actually our opportunity fund. And there is a substation right next to it and the fiber's right there. So we could get lucky, not in the building, the building will stay a building, but we actually own the land next to the substation that's empty, it was going to be a multifamily site and maybe it will be a data center someday.

所以，是的，如果我們幸運的話，我參觀的是一座實際上我們確實收回的建築，但不是房地產投資信託基金，實際上是我們的機會基金。旁邊有一個變電站，光纖就在那裡。所以我們可能會很幸運，不是在大樓裡，大樓仍將是一棟大樓，但我們實際上擁有變電站旁邊的空地，它將成為一個多戶住宅區，也許有一天它會成為一個資料中心。

So yes, I mean, it does -- it requires the power. The land isn't worth anything other than its original use unless the power is there, and the power has to be available. So these are negotiations, utility by utility, and there's a long queue. And to some extent, the tenants can help break the queue or move around the order of the queue. But some states have made data centers a big business like Virginia, and others are catching up like Texas and California has no excess power, so California won't have any data centers for a while. But that's to the benefit of the places that do have a power.

所以是的，我的意思是，確實如此——它需要力量。除非有電力，否則土地除了原始用途之外沒有任何價值，而且電力必須可用。所以這些都是談判，逐一實用程序，並且有一個很長的隊列。在某種程度上，租戶可以幫助打破隊列或改變隊列的順序。但一些州已經把資料中心變成了一項大生意，例如弗吉尼亞州，而其他州正在迎頭趕上，例如德克薩斯州和加利福尼亞州沒有多餘的電力，所以加利福尼亞州在一段時間內不會有任何數據中心。但這對那些擁有權力的地方有利。

So yes, it'd be great. I'd love to have it. And it better be lucky than good. But I don't see in any of our current assets that I just -- I actually haven't looked if there's an extra power station next to the American Dream Mall. But in Washington, the office building is on K Street. No, I don't think it's there, our station there. Plus it would be the nicest-looking data center in the history of mankind. Most of these are ugly, built up concrete. Most cities won't want them inside. You just have to bury them inside an existing shell. The LA property would have worked if we could get the big box, big load-bearing floors, which you need for the equipment.....

所以是的，那就太好了。我很想擁有它。幸運比好更好。但我在我們現有的資產中沒有看到，我實際上沒有看過美國夢購物中心旁邊是否有一個額外的發電站。但在華盛頓，辦公大樓位於K街。不，我不認為它在那裡，我們的車站在那裡。另外，它將成為人類歷史上最漂亮的資料中心。其中大多數都是醜陋的混凝土建築。大多數城市不希望他們進入。你只需要將它們埋在現有的外殼內。如果我們能得到設備所需的大箱子、大承重地板，那麼洛杉磯的房產就可以了…

You have the high level Internet.

你擁有高水準的互聯網。

So we may not get the original basis, the asset Rina talked, we had a $250 million, $40 million book down to $150 million, I think.

因此，我們可能無法獲得原始基礎，Rina 談到的資產，我認為我們的帳面價值為 2.5 億美元、4000 萬美元，降到了 1.5 億美元。

Yes, that puts a floor under the value because $30 million, 30 megawatts, if somebody bought it for data centers, it doesn't have to be an office building or -- and we're working on a resi conversion there.

是的，這為價值奠定了底線，因為 3000 萬美元，30 兆瓦，如果有人購買它用於資料中心，它不一定是辦公大樓，或者 - 我們正在那裡進行 Resi 轉換。

So I just think it's a beautiful building and office downtown L.A. This is close to the worst market in the United States right now.

所以我只是認為這是洛杉磯市中心的一座美麗的建築和辦公室。這裡靠近目前美國最糟糕的市場。

So it's a race to the bottom, but that's certainly be in contention with San Francisco and Austin. Those are 2 really tough markets right now.

所以這是一場逐底競爭，但這肯定是與舊金山和奧斯汀的競爭。目前這是兩個非常艱難的市場。

Operator, any other questions?

接線員，還有其他問題嗎？

Yes. So our last question comes from Doug Harter with UBS.

是的。我們的最後一個問題來自瑞銀集團的道格·哈特。

Hoping you could give us an update on your casino loan in Australia, just given that there has been some news about that recently?

鑑於最近有一些相關新聞，希望您能給我們介紹您在澳洲賭場貸款的最新情況？

You mean the news about Taylor Swift stayed in the casino, that one? So she was there last night, it's in the papers today. So we're expecting a big income pop.

你是說泰勒絲留在賭場的新聞嗎？所以她昨晚就在那裡，今天報紙上也報了。所以我們預計收入會大幅成長。

Yes. Earnings for one quarter will be great. We actually -- we obviously don't own the casinos. They are held by a named firm, and we're less than half of the capital stack at our basis. They actually own the other half of the mortgage that we own on those assets.

是的。一個季度的收益將會非常可觀。事實上，我們顯然不擁有賭場。它們由一家指定公司持有，而我們的資本總額還不到我們的一半。他們實際上擁有我們擁有的這些資產的另一半抵押貸款。

So they're sort of 75% of the cap stack, if you will. We're 51, they're 49 in the debt and the equity. And they're continuing to support the property with a recent $0.5 billion infusion to cap stack. It's a fairly significant investment of the firms.

所以如果你願意的話，他們大概佔了上限的 75%。我們的債務和股權是 51 歲，他們是 49 歲。他們最近注入了 5 億美元的資金來繼續支持這個產業。這是公司相當大的投資。

So we're comfortable that they have the expertise and they'll straighten it out. They're using some of this money to renovate their properties, which they were -- they intended to renovate them. So they never finish that, but they are major Domo assets in these markets. And we're comfortable right now that this credit is fine.

因此，我們很高興他們擁有專業知識並且他們會解決問題。他們正在用其中的一些錢來翻新他們的房產，他們本來打算翻新它們。所以他們永遠不會完成這個任務，但它們是 Domo 在這些市場上的主要資產。現在我們對這種信用狀況感到滿意。

So we'll see if things change. But as you know, they're coming out of some licensing issues the prior owner had that has not been resolved as quickly as they hoped. But they are very, very supportive of the credit. So we'll see. They do want half the paper as well as all the equity.

所以我們會看看事情是否會改變。但如您所知，他們正在解決前任所有者遇到的一些許可問題，但這些問題尚未像他們希望的那樣解決。但他們非常非常支持信貸。所以我們拭目以待。他們確實想要一半的票據以及全部股權。

I would like to turn the call over to Barry for closing remarks.

我想將電話轉交給巴里，讓他發表結束語。

Thank you, everyone, for joining us. I hope we have continued reasonably good news, and I look forward to this company to go back on offense. We're all chomping at the bit more offense, not that we're not in the markets, but we are cherry picking and sitting on $1.2 billion of liquidity, and then having these nonaccrual assets, it's not the greatest position, but to be able to easily cover with the DE or dividend is certainly a very comfortable position we have.

謝謝大家加入我們。我希望我們繼續有相當好的消息，我期待這家公司重新進攻。我們都在咬牙切齒，並不是說我們不在市場上，而是我們正在精挑細選並坐擁 12 億美元的流動性，然後擁有這些非應計資產，這不是最好的位置，但要成為能夠輕鬆地用DE 或股息支付當然是我們擁有的一個非常舒適的位置。

You are aware, we mentioned some of the things we're -- one of the things we're selling in the first quarter, which will close (inaudible). So we are -- and the recent repayment of $0.5 billion of senior loan, that's the equity in the loan which is in a really good shape through to combat this next 8 months of relenting pressure from the Fed on the complex.

你知道，我們提到了我們正在做的一些事情——我們在第一季銷售的事情之一，該季度將結束（聽不清楚）。所以我們最近償還了 5 億美元的優先貸款，即貸款中的股權，該貸款的狀況非常好，可以應對未來 8 個月聯準會對綜合體施加的緩和壓力。

So thank you, and we're excited about the future of the company.

謝謝您，我們對公司的未來感到興奮。

This concludes today's teleconference. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.

今天的電話會議到此結束。此時您可以斷開線路。感謝您的參與。