Stevanato Group SpA (STVN) 2024 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon. This is the Chorus Call conference operator. Welcome and thank you for joining the Stevanato Group second-quarter 2024 earnings call. (Operator Instructions)

午安.這是 Chorus Call 會議操作員。歡迎並感謝您參加斯蒂瓦那托集團 2024 年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員說明）

At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Ms. Lisa Miles, Senior Vice President, Investor Relations. Please go ahead, madam.

現在，我想將會議交給投資者關係高級副總裁 Lisa Miles 女士主持。請繼續，女士。

Good morning, and thank you for joining us. With me today is Franco Stevanato, Executive Chairman and Chief Executive Officer; and Marco Dal Lago, Chief Financial Officer. This morning, you can find a presentation to accompany today's results on the Investor Relations page of our website, which can be found under the Financial Results tab.

早安，感謝您加入我們。今天與我在一起的是執行董事長兼執行長 Franco Stevanato；和財務長 Marco Dal Lago。今天早上，您可以在我們網站的「投資者關係」頁面上找到與今天的業績相關的演示文稿，該頁面位於「財務業績」標籤下。

As a reminder, some statements being made today will be forward-looking in nature and are only predictions. Actual events and results may differ materially as a result of the risks we face, including those discussed in Item 3D entitled Risk Factors in the company's most recent annual report on Form 20-F, filed with the SEC on March 7, 2024. Please read our Safe Harbor statement included in the front of the presentation and in today's press release. The company does not assume any obligation to revise or update these forward-looking statements to reflect subsequent events or circumstances except as required by law.

提醒一下，今天發表的一些聲明本質上是前瞻性的，只是預測。由於我們面臨的風險，實際事件和結果可能會存在重大差異，包括公司於2024 年3 月7 日向SEC 提交的20-F 表格最新年度報告中標題為「風險因素」的第3D 項中討論的風險。請閱讀簡報開頭和今天的新聞稿中包含的安全港聲明。除法律要求外，本公司不承擔任何修改或更新這些前瞻性聲明以反映後續事件或情況的義務。

Today's presentation may contain non-GAAP financial information. Management uses this information in its internal analyses of results and believes this information may be informative to investors in gauging the quality of our financial performance, identifying trends in our results, and providing meaningful period-to-period comparisons. For a reconciliation of the non-GAAP measures, please see the company's most recent earnings press release.

今天的簡報可能包含非 GAAP 財務資訊。管理層在內部結果分析中使用這些信息，並相信這些信息可以為投資者提供有用的信息，幫助他們衡量我們的財務業績質量，識別我們的結果趨勢，並提供有意義的期間比較。有關非公認會計原則措施的調節，請參閱該公司最新的收益新聞稿。

And with that, I will now hand the call to Franco Stevanato for opening remarks.

現在，我將邀請法蘭哥‧史蒂瓦納托（Franco Stevanato）致開幕詞。

Thank you, Lisa, and thanks for joining us. Today, we will review our second-quarter performance, provide an update on market dynamics, and share some insights on the challenges and the ongoing initiatives to meet our objectives. For the second quarter, revenue was a little bit better than our expectation, driven by 9% growth in the BDS segment, but margins fell short to our forecast in the engineering segment, where delays led to higher costs on certain projects. We also incurred increased expenses related to the actions taken in the second quarter to address these delays. These factors combined are the main reason for the revision of our 2024 guidance.

謝謝你，麗莎，也謝謝你加入我們。今天，我們將回顧第二季的業績，提供最新的市場動態，並分享一些關於挑戰和實現我們目標的持續舉措的見解。第二季度，在 BDS 領域成長 9% 的推動下，收入略好於我們的預期，但工程領域的利潤率低於我們的預測，工程領域的延誤導致了某些項目的成本上升。我們還增加了與第二季為解決這些延誤問題而採取的行動相關的費用。這些因素綜合起來是我們修訂 2024 年指導的主要原因。

As you know, the engineering segment has experienced significant growth, more than doubling its revenue over the last four years. We scaled our operations to support this large volume of work, but persistent delays in the supply of electronic components and the complexity of certain projects prevented us from delivery as planned. The challenges are mostly limited to our Denmark operation and are related to certain highly customized projects. Our number one priority today is to advance this large volume of work in progress and bring these projects to completion, but this will take some time.

如您所知，工程部門經歷了顯著增長，在過去四年中其收入增加了一倍以上。我們擴大了業務規模以支援如此大量的工作，但電子元件供應的持續延誤和某些專案的複雜性使我們無法按計劃交付。這些挑戰主要局限於我們的丹麥業務，並且與某些高度客製化的專案有關。我們今天的首要任務是推進大量正在進行的工作並完成這些項目，但這需要一些時間。

Moving to slide 6, we are undergoing extensive efforts to optimize our engineering footprint, harmonize industrial processes, and enhance our supply chain and logistic strategies. Let me give you a concrete example of these efforts. In Denmark, we consolidated activities of two different production sites into a single location, so that the Danish team can focus on the advancement of our assembly and packaging technologies. At the same time, we're implementing a cross-site plan to better support our visual inspection teams in Denmark with our technical specialists in Italy. This will also increase the standardization of our technologies and processes across the engineering segment.

前往投影片 6，我們正在付出廣泛的努力來優化我們的工程足跡、協調工業流程並增強我們的供應鏈和物流策略。讓我給大家一個具體的例子來說明這些努力。在丹麥，我們將兩個不同生產基地的活動整合到一個地點，以便丹麥團隊可以專注於我們組裝和包裝技術的進步。同時，我們正在實施一項跨站點計劃，以更好地支援我們在丹麥的目視檢查團隊和我們在義大利的技術專家。這也將提高我們整個工程領域技術和流程的標準化。

While these initiatives include expenses that will impact our 2024 financial performance, it will help us optimize our operational structure, maximize efficiencies, and secure the success of ongoing projects. This is one of the primary areas of responsibility of Ugo Gay, our Chief Operating Officer, who joined the Stevanato Group in March. Ugo brings over 20 years of experience in the industry, having held both commercial and operations leadership positions at organizations such as Diasorin.

雖然這些舉措包括將影響我們 2024 年財務業績的費用，但它將幫助我們優化營運結構、最大限度地提高效率並確保正在進行的專案取得成功。這是我們的營運長 Ugo Gay 的主要職責之一，他於 3 月加入斯蒂瓦那托集團。Ugo 擁有 20 多年的行業經驗，曾在 Diasorin 等組織擔任商業和營運領導職務。

Long term, we believe the demand landscape for engineering remains favorable. Not only is the industry moving to secure supply chains and manufacturing capacity for fast-growing biologics, but we also see an increasing shift to upgrade infrastructure to better align with the requirements under Annex I. In addition to improving our execution in the engineering segment, we're still navigating through the effects of vial destocking. We see positive signals in the market with orders starting to materialize in certain smaller markets such as Latin America.

從長遠來看，我們相信工程的需求前景仍然有利。該行業不僅正在努力確保快速增長的生物製劑的供應鏈和製造能力，而且我們還看到越來越多的基礎設施升級轉變，以更好地符合附件一的要求。執行力外，我們仍在研究小瓶庫存減少的影響。我們看到市場發出正面訊號，拉丁美洲等某些較小市場的訂單開始落實。

In larger markets, we still expect a more gradual recovery. Our customers are sharing forecasts that point to improving demand, and they are beginning production planning. Accordingly, we are optimistic that vial orders will begin to pick up at the tail end of 2024, starting with bulk vials.

在較大的市場中，我們仍然預期復甦會更加緩慢。我們的客戶正在分享需求改善的預測，並且他們正在開始生產計劃。因此，我們樂觀地認為，小瓶訂單將在 2024 年底開始增加，首先是散裝小瓶。

Moving to our capacity expansion projects on slide 7, it is important to note that we are working through these challenges in the midst of a large demand-driven CapEx cycle. Last year, we successfully completed our Piombino Dese plant expansion, and we are continuing our multi-ramp-up of our expansion projects in Fisher, Indiana and Latina, Italy. In Fisher, our validation activities are going as planned, and we are progressing through the first set of customer audits.

轉向幻燈片 7 上的產能擴張項目，值得注意的是，我們正在大型需求驅動的資本支出週期中應對這些挑戰。去年，我們成功完成了 Piombino Dese 工廠的擴建，並且我們正在繼續在印第安納州費雪和義大利拉蒂納進行多項擴建項目。在費雪，我們的驗證活動正在按計劃進行，並且我們正在完成第一組客戶審核。

During the quarter, we took delivery of our second and third syringe lines, and the installation and qualification activities are underway. Most importantly, we're on track to launch commercial production and generate our first commercial revenue from Fishers in the third quarter of 2024. During the second quarter, we hosted 40 customers for the opening of the new plant in Latina, to give them a first look at our new high-value solutions manufacturing facility. We expect to continue to expand our syringes production as part of our multi-year ramp-up in Latina.

本季度，我們接收了第二條和第三條注射器生產線，安裝和資格認證活動正在進行中。最重要的是，我們預計在 2024 年第三季啟動商業生產並從 Fishers 獲得第一筆商業收入。第二季度，我們接待了 40 位客戶，參加拉蒂納新廠的開幕典禮，讓他們先了解我們新的高價值解決方案製造廠。作為我們在拉丁地區多年擴張的一部分，我們預計將繼續擴大注射器生產。

We have two manufacturing plants at our Latina campus. As previously disclosed, the next phase in Latina is concentrated on the expansion of EZ-fill cartridges capacity to support a transition from bulk to ready-to-use products for an anchor customer. Activities tied to this project will launch next year. The expansion is designed to harmonize operations between the two sides. This includes the installation of new bulk and EZ-fill cartridge lines in the new plant and the upgrade of already operational lines in the regional Latina plant.

我們的拉丁園區有兩個製造工廠。如同先前所揭露的，Latina 的下一階段重點是擴大 EZ-fill 墨盒產能，以支援主要客戶從散裝產品向即用型產品的過渡。與該計畫相關的活動將於明年啟動。此次擴建旨在協調雙方的運作。這包括在新工廠安裝新的散裝和 EZ-fill 墨盒生產線，以及升級拉蒂納地區工廠已投入運作的生產線。

This approach is part of our wider strategy to enhance efficiency and production capacity, reduce lead times, and expand our offer of premium solutions. As expected, the ramp-up activities of our two new facilities are resulting in temporary inefficiencies on which Marco will elaborate further. With our teams focused on the execution in Latina and Fishers, we decided to further postpone any additional expansion in China for the coming 12 months. As a consequence, we're shifting some of these CapEx to Latina to accommodate the change in regional manufacturing preference for a large customer. Accordingly, we believe that we have sufficient capacity to support the demand in the region.

這種方法是我們提高效率和產能、縮短交貨時間並擴大優質解決方案範圍的更廣泛策略的一部分。正如預期的那樣，我們兩個新設施的啟動活動導致暫時效率低下，Marco 將進一步詳細說明這一點。由於我們的團隊專注於拉丁裔和漁民的執行，我們決定在未來 12 個月內進一步推遲在中國的任何額外擴張。因此，我們將其中一些資本支出轉移到拉丁美洲，以適應大客戶區域製造偏好的變化。因此，我們相信我們有足夠的能力來支持該地區的需求。

On slide 8, in summary, we are confident that we can successfully navigate through the challenges in front of us, and we are squarely focused on improving our execution. The core fundamentals of our business have not changed. The end markets we serve are healthy and growing. Demand for our products remains stronger.

總而言之，在投影片 8 上，我們有信心成功應對眼前的挑戰，並且我們完全專注於提高我們的執行力。我們業務的核心基礎沒有改變。我們服務的終端市場健康且不斷成長。對我們產品的需求依然強勁。

Our integrated solutions resonate with our customers, and we are operating in an environment with favorable secular tailwinds. We continue to see a durable, profitable growth path in front of us driven mainly by biologics. In fact, in the first half of 2024, biologics hit a record high of 35% of BDS revenues, which is creating strong demand especially in high-value solutions.

我們的整合解決方案引起了客戶的共鳴，而且我們正在一個長期有利的環境中運作。我們繼續看到一條主要由生物製劑驅動的持久、有利可圖的成長道路。事實上，2024 年上半年，生物製劑佔 BDS 收入的比例創下歷史新高，達到 35%，這創造了強勁的需求，尤其是高價值解決方案。

I will now hand the call over to Marco.

現在我將把電話轉給 Marco。

Thanks, Franco. Before we begin, I want to clarify that all comparisons refer to the second quarter of 2023 unless otherwise specified. And in the second quarter, foreign currency was immaterial. So all revenue comparisons exclude the currency translation.

謝謝，法蘭哥。在開始之前，我想澄清一下，除非另有說明，所有比較均指 2023 年第二季。在第二季度，外匯並不重要。因此，所有收入比較均不包括貨幣換算。

Starting on page 10, for the second quarter of 2024, revenue increased 2% to EUR260 million. This was driven by a 9% growth in the biopharmaceutical and diagnostic solutions segment, which offset the expected decline in the engineering segment. Our product diversity helped expand our mix of high-value solutions which grew 23% in the second quarter and represented approximately 40% of total revenue in the quarter. The increase in high-value solutions was favorable to gross profit margin. This offset lower revenue from EZ fill vials which adversely affected the mix within high-value solutions.

從第 10 頁開始，2024 年第二季的營收成長了 2%，達到 2.6 億歐元。這是由生物製藥和診斷解決方案領域 9% 的成長推動的，抵消了工程領域的預期下降。我們的產品多樣性幫助擴大了高價值解決方案組合，該解決方案在第二季度增長了 23%，約佔該季度總收入的 40%。高價值解決方案的增加有利於毛利率。這抵消了 EZ 灌裝瓶收入的下降，對高價值解決方案的組合產生了不利影響。

Gross profit margin was also tempered by three headwinds. First, the higher-than-anticipated cost in the engineering segment had the biggest effect on gross profit margin in the second quarter. Second, the impact from vial destocking causing the underutilization of our vial lines. And lastly, inefficiencies tied to the ramp-up phase of our new facilities.

毛利率也受到三個不利因素的影響。首先，工程板塊成本高於預期對第二季毛利率影響最大。其次，小瓶去庫存的影響導致我們的小瓶生產線利用率不足。最後，與我們新設施的啟動階段相關的效率低。

As a result of these temporary headwinds, gross profit margin decreased to 26%. It is important to point out that we believe that these headwinds are temporary and will gradually subside. In turn, we expect a step-up in margins. As we outlined during our Capital Markets Day, margin expansion is expected to be driven by the mix shift to high-value solutions, the benefit of scale and better leverage of our fixed assets and operational efficiencies.

由於這些暫時的不利因素，毛利率下降至 26%。需要指出的是，我們認為這些不利因素是暫時的，並且會逐漸消退。反過來，我們預期利潤率會上升。正如我們在資本市場日期間所概述的那樣，利潤率的擴張預計將受到向高價值解決方案的組合轉變、規模效益以及固定資產和營運效率的更好槓桿作用的推動。

For the second quarter, lower gross profit led to a decline in operating profit margin to 10.8%. And on an adjusted basis, operating profit margin was 12.8%. For the second quarter of 2024, net profit totaled EUR20.6 million, and diluted earnings per share were EUR0.08. On an adjusted basis, net profit was EUR24.5 million, and adjusted diluted earnings per share were $0.09. Adjusted EBITDA was EUR54 million, and adjusted EBITDA margin was 20.8%.

第二季度，毛利下降導致營業利益率下降至10.8%。經調整後，營業利益率為12.8%。2024年第二季淨利總計2,060萬歐元，稀釋每股收益為0.08歐元。調整後淨利為 2,450 萬歐元，調整後稀釋每股收益為 0.09 美元。調整後 EBITDA 為 0.54 億歐元，調整後 EBITDA 利潤率為 20.8%。

Moving to segment results on page 11. For the second quarter of 2024, revenue from the BDS segment increased 9% to EUR222.4 million, mostly driven by growth in high-performance syringes. The diversity in our product portfolio helped drive 9% growth despite a 40% decrease in revenue related to vials. Revenue from high-value solutions grew 23% to EUR103.4 million in the second quarter, while revenue from other containment and delivery solutions decreased 1% to EUR119 million.

轉到第 11 頁的分段結果。2024 年第二季度，BDS 部門的營收成長 9%，達到 2.224 億歐元，主要受到高性能注射器成長的推動。儘管與小瓶相關的收入下降了 40%，但我們產品組合的多樣性推動了 9% 的成長。第二季度，高價值解決方案的收入成長了 23%，達到 1.034 億歐元，而其他遏制和輸送解決方案的收入下降了 1%，達到 1.19 億歐元。

As expected, the increase in high-value solutions benefited gross profit margin, but segment margins continued to be unfavorably impacted by the ongoing effects of destocking as customer inventories continue to normalize and start-up inefficiencies in Latina and Fishers. As a reminder, these are natural inefficiencies that occur during the early phases of operations. These inefficiencies reflect the underabsorption of expenses as volumes, productivity, and revenue progressively grow to reach the target levels. As these facilities mature, we believe that this impact will decrease and that margins will improve accordingly.

正如預期的那樣，高價值解決方案的成長有利於毛利率，但隨著客戶庫存繼續正常化以及拉丁裔和漁民的啟動效率低下，分部利潤率繼續受到去庫存持續影響的不利影響。提醒一下，這些都是營運早期階段自然發生的低效率問題。這些低效率反映了隨著產量、生產率和收入逐步增長以達到目標水平而導致的費用吸收不足。隨著這些設施的成熟，​​我們相信這種影響將會減少，利潤率也會隨之提高。

As a result, in the second quarter of 2024, BDS segment gross profit margin was 27.7%. This represents a 390-basis-point decrease compared to the prior year. For the second quarter, operating profit margin for the BDS segment decreased to 14.5% from 19.8% in the same period last year. For the second quarter of 2024, revenue from the engineering segment decreased 26% to EUR37.2 million. As Franco noted, delays have led to higher cost on certain complex and highly customized projects in process. As a result, gross profit margin decreased to 10.3%, and operating profit margin declined to 2.6% for the second quarter.

因此，2024年第二季度，BDS類股毛利率為27.7%。與前一年相比下降了 390 個基點。第二季度，BDS業務的營業利潤率從去年同期的19.8%下降至14.5%。2024 年第二季度，工程部門的營收下降 26% 至 3,720 萬歐元。正如弗朗哥指出的那樣，延誤導致某些複雜且高度客製化的正在進行的項目成本更高。結果，第二季毛利率下降至10.3%，營業利潤率下降至2.6%。

It's important to mention that we currently see strong continued interest in our innovative market-leading technologies. With the actions we have ongoing, we believe that we can drive the necessary improvements to bring this project to completion, improve the segment's financial performance, and return to a profitable growth trajectory.

值得一提的是，我們目前看到人們對我們創新的市場領先技術持續產生濃厚的興趣。透過我們正在進行的行動，我們相信我們可以推動必要的改進，以完成該項目，改善該部門的財務業績，並恢復獲利成長軌道。

Please turn to the next slide for a review of balance sheet and cash flow items. We continue to carefully manage trade working capital to support the growth of our business. As expected, our inventory levels increased in the quarter mainly due to the establishment of baseline inventories in our new plants in US and Italy, including products that are expected to be delivered to customers in the future quarters. This was partially offset by collections of trade receivables.

請翻到下一張投影片來查看資產負債表和現金流量項目。我們繼續謹慎管理貿易營運資金，以支持我們業務的成長。正如預期，我們的庫存水準在本季度有所增加，主要是由於我們在美國和義大利的新工廠建立了基準庫存，包括預計在未來幾季交付給客戶的產品。這部分被貿易應收帳款收回所抵銷。

We ended the second quarter with cash and cash equivalents of EUR78.1 million and net debt of EUR238.2 million. Through a combination of our cash on hand, available credit lines, cash generated from operations, and our ability to assess additional financing, we believe that we have adequate liquidity to fund our strategic and operational priorities over the next 12 months.

在第二季末，我們的現金和現金等價物為 7,810 萬歐元，淨債務為 2.382 億歐元。綜合我們的手頭現金、可用信貸額度、營運產生的現金以及評估額外融資的能力，我們相信我們有足夠的流動性來為未來 12 個月的策略和營運重點提供資金。

As expected, capital expenditures for the second quarter of 2024 totaled EUR75.9 million as our demand-driven investments continue to ramp. In the second quarter of 2024, net cash from operating activities totaled EUR22.3 million. During the second quarter, we received proceeds of EUR3 million for the sale of a building in Denmark as part of our initiatives to optimize our footprint and gain operational efficiencies. Cash used in the purchase of property, plant, and equipment and intangible assets was EUR72.1 million. This resulted in negative free cash flow of EUR46.1 million in the second quarter.

如預期，隨著我們需求驅動的投資持續增加，2024 年第二季的資本支出總額為 7,590 萬歐元。2024 年第二季度，經營活動產生的現金淨額總計 2,230 萬歐元。第二季度，我們透過出售丹麥一棟建築獲得了 300 萬歐元的收益，這是我們優化足跡和提高營運效率措施的一部分。用於購買不動產、廠房和設備以及無形資產的現金為 7,210 萬歐元。這導致第二季自由現金流為負 4,610 萬歐元。

Lastly, on slide 13, we are updating guidance for fiscal 2024. Let me walk you through the changes. Starting with the engineering segment, which is the main reason for the revision, we now estimate revenue decrease of approximately 15% to 20% for fiscal 2024 compared with last year.

最後，在投影片 13 中，我們正在更新 2024 財年的指導。讓我帶您了解這些變化。從調整主要原因的工程部門開始，我們現在估計 2024 財年的營收與去年相比下降約 15% 至 20%。

Turning to the BDS segment, for fiscal 2024, we continue to anticipate mid-single digit revenue growth compared with last year, and we remain comfortable with the current consensus revenue estimate of EUR930 million for this segment. So when you add these all up, for fiscal 2024, we now expect revenue in the range of EUR1,090 billion to EUR1,110 billion, adjusted EBITDA in the range of EUR264 million to EUR272 million, and adjusted diluted EPS in the range of EUR0.48 to EUR0.50. As we consider the future trajectory, our long-term growth construct remains unchanged. We believe we have the right ingredients in place to return to double-digit growth and expand margins as outlined at our Capital Markets Day.

談到 BDS 細分市場，我們繼續預計 2024 財年的營收將比去年實現中個位數成長，並且我們對該細分市場當前 9.3 億歐元的共識收入預測仍然感到滿意。因此，當您將所有這些加起來時，我們現在預計2024 財年的收入將在10,900 億歐元至11,100 億歐元之間，調整後的EBITDA 將在2.64 億歐元至2.72 億歐元之間，調整後的稀釋後每股收益將在0.48 歐元至 0.50 歐元。當我們考慮未來的軌跡時，我們的長期成長結構保持不變。我們相信，我們已具備適當的條件，可以恢復兩位數成長並擴大利潤率，正如我們在資本市場日所概述的那樣。

Looking to next year, in the BDS segment, we have positive momentum in high-value solutions particularly in syringes which is a favorable tailwind. On the other side, we currently anticipate that our growth may be tempered by the current headwinds. This includes the pace of recovery in bulk and EZ-fill vials, which is the largest factor, and the timing of the effect of the corrective actions we are taking for the engineering segment. We will continue to update you on our progress, but we will provide formal guidance in March. We remain confident in our strategy and in our long-term growth prospects going forward. Thank you.

展望明年，在 BDS 領域，我們在高價值解決方案方面擁有積極的勢頭，特別是在註射器方面，這是一個有利的推動力。另一方面，我們目前預計我們的成長可能會受到當前不利因素的影響。這包括散裝和 EZ-fill 瓶的恢復速度（這是最大的因素），以及我們為工程部門採取的糾正措施的效果時間。我們將繼續向您通報我們的進展情況，但我們將在三月提供正式指導。我們對我們的策略和未來的長期成長前景仍然充滿信心。謝謝。

I will hand the call back to Franco.

我會將電話轉回給佛朗哥。

Thank you, Marco. In closing on slide 15, we are maintaining focus on our long-term objectives, and we are confident in our strategic direction. Despite the headwinds, we have still delivered organic growth primarily in high-value solutions. We are investing in the right areas and meeting customer demand.

謝謝你，馬可。在投影片 15 的最後，我們繼續關注我們的長期目標，並且我們對我們的策略方向充滿信心。儘管面臨阻力，我們仍然主要在高價值解決方案方面實現了有機成長。我們正在正確的領域進行投資並滿足客戶的需求。

In the near term, we must deliver on our commitments and sharpen our focus on solid execution across our main priorities. This includes the ongoing expansion in Latina, our ramp-up activities in Fishers, and improving our project delivery in engineering segment. The fundamentals of our business remain strong. We operate in a dynamic and growing market with favorable secular tailwinds.

短期內，我們必須兌現我們的承諾，並更加重視切實執行我們的主要優先事項。這包括在拉丁地區的持續擴張、在費雪的擴大活動以及改善我們在工程領域的專案交付。我們業務的基本面依然強勁。我們在一個充滿活力且不斷增長的市場中運營，並具有有利的長期順風。

Demand is robust, and we have a portfolio of products that are ideally suited to meet customer needs. We believe the business is well positioned to capitalize on these trends, and we are determined to return to durable double-digit organic growth, expand margins, and drive long-term shareholder value. Over the past few months, I had the opportunity to meet with many of our key stakeholders including customers, employees, and investors. As a CEO, I'm confident that we will achieve our long-term objectives.

需求強勁，我們擁有非常適合滿足客戶需求的產品組合。我們相信，該業務已做好充分利用這些趨勢的準備，我們決心恢復持久的兩位數有機成長、擴大利潤率並推動長期股東價值。在過去的幾個月裡，我有機會會見了我們許多主要的利害關係人，包括客戶、員工和投資者。作為首席執行官，我相信我們將實現我們的長期目標。

Operator, let's open it up for questions.

接線員，讓我們打開提問吧。

Thank you. (Operator Instructions)

謝謝。（操作員說明）

Jacob Johnson, Stephens.

雅各約翰遜、史蒂芬斯。

Maybe just on the engineering business, this business grew rapidly the past few years. We've heard about some weakness around capital equipment demand in the current environment. Do you think this is largely supply chain issues and within your control, or is there any softening in demand that you're seeing for engineering equipment?

也許只是在工程業務上，這幾年這個業務成長很快。我們聽說當前環境下資本設備需求有些疲軟。您認為這主要是供應鏈問題並且在您的控制範圍內，還是您看到工程設備的需求有所疲軟？

This is Franco speaking. So today, in order to put in context the engineering division, we more than doubled our revenue in the last two years, in particular in the middle of the context of the pandemic and supply chain shortages. Today, we are behind schedule in some complex new projects more than what was previously expected, and this is putting pressure on our performance on the business. Those temporary challenges are predominantly isolated to our Denmark operation on certain highly customized project at the late stage of development.

我是佛朗哥。因此，今天，為了了解工程部門的背景，我們的收入在過去兩年中增加了一倍多，特別是在疫情和供應鏈短缺的背景下。如今，我們在一些複雜的新項目上落後於計劃，超出了先前的預期，這給我們的業務績效帶來了壓力。這些暫時的挑戰主要與我們在丹麥的某些高度客製化專案在開發後期的業務有關。

And we are taking strong action to improve and recover the situation. We are confident that we can successfully navigate through these temporary challenges in front of us in the next few quarters. And by the way, the portfolio of order in the engineering division is solid, is strong with our big customer in particular in biologics.

我們正在採取強有力的行動來改善和恢復局勢。我們相信，在接下來的幾個季度中，我們能夠成功應對擺在我們面前的這些暫時的挑戰。順便說一句，工程部門的訂單組合很穩固，我們的大客戶尤其是生物製品領域的訂單組合很強大。

Got it. And then I guess I'll ask one on Fishers. You guys talked about seeing commercial revenues in 3Q. Was this always what was kind of assumed in guidance, or is this a slight benefit versus prior expectations? And I guess as we think about Fishers coming online in 3Q, should we think about that initial contribution as being kind of modest?

知道了。然後我想我會問一個關於費雪的問題。你們談到了第三季的商業收入。這是否始終是指南中的假設，或與先前的預期相比，這是一個微小的好處？我想當我們考慮第三季漁民上線時，我們是否應該認為最初的貢獻有點適度？

Correct, Jacob. It's a validation of future progress as planned. So practically, we are on track to launch commercial production in the third quarter of 2024, and we expect to generate commercial revenue also in the Q3 of this year. Today, the big attention, the big focus on all our organization is to perform validation and audit with all our US-based customers.

正確，雅各。這是對未來按計劃取得進展的驗證。因此，實際上，我們預計在 2024 年第三季啟動商業生產，並預計在今年第三季也能產生商業收入。今天，我們整個組織的最大關注點是與所有美國客戶一起進行驗證和審計。

On the guidance, the revenue are embedded in our guidance we provided.

在指導中，收入已包含在我們提供的指導中。

Paul Knight, KeyBanc.

保羅奈特，KeyBanc。

Franco, do you expect engineering system to grow in 2025? I mean, obviously, this is a reorg year.

Franco，您預期工程系統在 2025 年會成長嗎？我的意思是，顯然，今年是重組年。

We provided some color -- Marco speaking, sorry, Paul. We provide some color about 2025 about our preliminary thoughts on next year. It's a little bit early to provide guidance. We will provide guidance as usual after Q4 earnings call. What we can tell you today, again, is that we see strong demand in syringes in a value of Nexa and Alba suitable for biologics. And this is a good tailwind.

我們提供了一些顏色——馬可，對不起，保羅。我們提供了一些關於 2025 年的內容，以說明我們對明年的初步想法。現在提供指導還為時過早。我們將在第四季財報電話會議後照常提供指導。今天我們可以再次告訴您的是，我們看到對適合生物製品的 Nexa 和 Alba 注射器的強勁需求。這是一個很好的順風。

On the other side, we see some uncertainty about the timing of recovery of the vials and the timing of the effect of the actions we are taking for engineering. As Franco mentioned before, we see strong demand for our technology in engineering. Unfortunately, we are struggling to complete the testing on some highly customized project, and this is impairing a little bit our ability to bring on new contracts and advance on the projects.

另一方面，我們看到小瓶的回收時間以及我們正在採取的工程行動的效果時間存在一些不確定性。正如 Franco 之前提到的，我們看到工程技術的需求強勁。不幸的是，我們正在努力完成一些高度客製化專案的測試，這有點削弱了我們簽訂新合約和推進專案的能力。

So this is a little bit early to talk about specifically engineering for 2025.

因此，現在談論 2025 年的具體工程還為時過早。

Paul, if I can further give some more element, this complex line-up Marco is referring are new technology that our big customers was in particular on assembling technology on inspection where the average lead time is up to 20, 24 months. So we have faced now some challenges at the late stage of acceptance test at the end of May and June. It also is important to specify that this project are the first of a kind of machinery for our customer that are part of our long-term multiple line equipment.

Paul，如果我可以進一步提供更多元素，Marco 所指的這個複雜的陣容是我們的大客戶特別是在檢驗組裝技術方面的新技術，平均交貨時間長達 20、24 個月。所以我們現在在5月底、6月的驗收後期階段遇到了一些挑戰。同樣重要的是要指出，該專案是我們客戶的第一種機械，是我們長期多線設備的一部分。

So what do you see? One side, you see a big increase in demand on syringes, Nexa, and on cartridges ready to fill automatically. Our same customers are asking also to deliver new high sophisticated line for assembly and for inspection. These are the first line in our organization. Denmark is facing some temporary challenge, but under the new leadership of Ugo Gay, we already put in place all the action in order to recover and to be back on track in the next few quarters.

那你看到了什麼？一方面，您會看到對注射器、Nexa 和自動填充藥筒的需求大幅增加。我們的客戶還要求提供新的高精密裝配和檢測生產線。這些是我們組織的第一線。丹麥面臨一些暫時的挑戰，但在烏戈蓋伊的新領導下，我們已經採取了所有行動，以便在未來幾季恢復並重回正軌。

And then second question is Latina, which seems to -- I know you had a lot of -- another opening down there recently. What was the transfer of expansion was from what, Piombino or what? Can you just give us an update on Latina. It seems to be a lot bigger expansion than had been planned two years ago.

第二個問題是拉丁裔，我知道你有很多，最近那裡似乎又出現了一個空缺。擴張的轉移來自於什麼，皮翁比諾還是什麼？能為我們介紹一下拉丁裔的最新情況嗎？這似乎比兩年前計劃的擴張要大得多。

Yes, Paul. Practically, Latina was a -- we have decided that it became the second big hub in Europe in order to serve our customers for our Nexa syringes. The reason is why -- by the way, if you compare Latina with Fisher, we are two, three quarters ahead. Today, we already -- some many customer, we are generating commercial revenue.

是的，保羅。實際上，我們決定將拉丁區打造成歐洲第二大中心，以便為我們的 Nexa 注射器客戶提供服務。原因是——順便說一句，如果你將拉丁裔與費雪進行比較，我們領先兩到四分之三。今天，我們已經——一些客戶，我們正在創造商業收入。

Today, one of our major anchor customers have decided to increase capacity in Latina for this new technology for these cartridges ready to fill. You know that we are market leader on cartridges, both on cartridges bulk and also in technology. Today, we see there is more and more demand from these cartridges ready to fill from all the bio customer. In particular, this big customer want to -- we have a big capacity in Europe, in particular on the site of Latina. This is the reason for this further expansions.

今天，我們的主要主要客戶之一決定增加拉丁地區的容量，以採用這種新技術來填充這些墨盒。您知道，我們是墨盒市場的領導者，無論是墨盒散裝還是技術方面。今天，我們看到所有生物客戶對這些可隨時填充的墨盒的需求越來越多。特別是，這個大客戶希望──我們在歐洲擁有很大的產能，特別是在拉丁地區。這就是進一步擴展的原因。

Matt Larew, William Blair.

馬特拉魯，威廉布萊爾。

Last quarter when you took down guidance for destocking, you communicated that you were trying to be conservative there, and you did beat, I think, our expectations for the second quarter on BDS. And it sounds like you're maintaining that outlook largely for the year. Now you've encountered issues in engineering, are you trying to take a similar approach now in terms of the way that you are communicating those challenges to investors?

上個季度，當你們取消去庫存指導時，你們表示你們試圖保持保守，我認為你們確實超出了我們對 BDS 第二季度的預期。聽起來您今年基本上維持了這一前景。現在您遇到了工程方面的問題，您是否正在嘗試採取類似的方法向投資者傳達這些挑戰？

Yeah, you mentioned they are two very different reasons for adjusting the guidance. We recognize we have to change the guidance twice in a year but, again, for two very different reasons. Vials destocking is affecting all the industry. And at the beginning of the year, we didn't detect the drop down for about 40% year over year in our vials demand, and this is the the specific reason why we had to review the guidance in Q1.

是的，你提到這是調整指導的兩個截然不同的原因。我們認識到我們必須在一年內兩次更改指導方針，但同樣是出於兩個截然不同的原因。小瓶去庫存正在影響整個產業。今年年初，我們沒有發現小瓶需求年減約 40%，這就是我們必須審查第一季指引的具體原因。

Engineering is a different where, as Franco explained, we more than doubled the size of the business. We are taking some highly customized projects. And matter of fact, we are delaying some acceptance from customers because they are really specific projects and customized ones. Matter of fact, we are spending more time to test the equipment. We had to add more resources in May and June to complete the staff work.

正如佛朗哥所解釋的那樣，工程是一個不同的領域，我們將業務規模擴大了一倍以上。我們正在進行一些高度客製化的項目。事實上，我們推遲了一些客戶的接受，因為它們確實是特定的項目和客製化的項目。事實上，我們正​​在花費更多的時間來測試設備。我們必須在五月和六月增加更多資源來完成人員工作。

So matter of fact, we are spending more time with more people on those projects, and this is affecting our profitability in the second quarter. At the same time, we took a conservative approach also in bringing in new customized projects. And this is the main reason why we are reviewing our guidance for fiscal 2024.

事實上，我們在這些項目上花了更多的時間和更多的人，這影響了我們第二季的獲利能力。同時，我們在引入新的客製化項目方面也採取了保守的態度。這就是我們檢視 2024 財年指引的主要原因。

Matt, if I can give some more color to the answer of Marco, so from our perspective, if you're going to isolate these temporary challenges, we will expect that the effects from vial destocking will be behind us. Also, like Marco mentioned in his remarks that we will gain leverage from the scale-up of our new operation in Latina and Fishers, and engineering segment should return to profitable growth in the next quarter. So we are excited that this can give us confidence in the future.

馬特，如果我能為馬可的答案提供更多的色彩，那麼從我們的角度來看，如果你要隔離這些暫時的挑戰，我們預計小瓶去庫存的影響將會過去。此外，正如 Marco 在演講中提到的那樣，我們將從擴大拉丁和漁民新業務中獲得槓桿作用，而工程部門應在下個季度恢復盈利增長。因此，我們很高興這可以讓我們對未來充滿信心。

Matt, one clarification, we don't expect the engineering segment to return to profitable growth next quarter. It will be in the coming quarters.

馬特，需要澄清一下，我們預計工程部門下個季度不會恢復獲利成長。這將在未來幾個季度進行。

Okay. And then just on CapEx, the -- took up the high end of the range there, I think the EUR335 million. This obviously is expected to be another big year of CapEx following last year. But just given, I think, Fishers validation that you're a little bit ahead of at least Street expectations, could you just provide us with sort of an outlook on CapEx over the next several quarters here as you're starting to continue to fill out those facilities with lines?

好的。然後就資本支出而言，--佔據了該範圍的高端，我認為是 3.35 億歐元。顯然，預計今年將是繼去年之後資本支出的另一個大年。但我認為，費雪證實您至少比華爾街的預期稍微領先一點，當您開始繼續填補空缺時，您能否為我們提供未來幾個季度資本支出的展望那些設施用線出來了？

Yes, we are on line with our CapEx plan for the year. So we reiterate our guidance for the year between EUR300 million to EUR335 million. So everything is going according to the plan, and we reiterate our guidance. It means that the second half of the year will be slightly below first half of the year with respect to cashout. But we are not talking about the big differences compared to the first half of the year.

是的，我們符合今年的資本支出計畫。因此，我們重申今年的指引為 3 億歐元至 3.35 億歐元。所以一切都在按計劃進行，我們重申我們的指導。這意味著下半年的兌現情況將略低於上半年。但我們並不是在談論與上半年相比的巨大差異。

Michael Ryskin, Bank of America.

麥可‧萊斯金，美國銀行。

This is [John Kim] on for Michael. Great to hear of the orders coming in in Latin America. And elsewhere, you talked about the customers, talking about the production planning coming in. Is that across the board as in all regions? And then what what sort of products can we expect to come after bulk vials and if there's a timeline expectation for that destocking to happen? Would appreciate those comments.

這是麥可的[約翰金]。很高興聽到拉丁美洲收到訂單。在其他地方，你談到了客戶，談到了即將到來的生產計劃。是像所有地區一樣全面嗎？那麼，在大量生產之後，我們可以預期會出現什麼樣的產品，以及是否有預期會出現去庫存的時間表？將不勝感激這些評論。

We are still navigating through the effects of the market vial destocking. We see today positive signs, like I mentioned to you in the market, with orders starting to materialize in certain smaller markets such as Latin America. In larger markets, we still expect a more gradual recovery, but our customers are sharing forecast that pointed to improving demand, and they are beginning production planning. This reinforced our confidence that vial orders will begin to pick up at the tail end of 2024 starting from bulk vials. So we are starting to see all overall positive signs from the market.

我們仍在研究市場小瓶去庫存的影響。今天我們看到了積極的跡象，就像我在市場上向您提到的那樣，訂單開始在某些較小的市場（例如拉丁美洲）實現。在較大的市場中，我們仍然預期復甦會更加緩慢，但我們的客戶正在分享表明需求改善的預測，並且他們正在開始生產計劃。這增強了我們的信心，小瓶訂單將在 2024 年底開始增加，從散裝小瓶開始。因此，我們開始看到市場的所有整體積極跡象。

And in the guide update today, you laid out for the fiscal '24 that high-value solutions, now you expect that to take up 36% to 39% of the total sales. And that's making progress towards your 2027 target. But 2Q is already 40%. So I'm wondering if that fiscal '24 target could even be higher?

在今天的指南更新中，您為 24 財年制定了高價值解決方案，現在您預計該解決方案將佔總銷售額的 36% 至 39%。這正在朝著您的 2027 年目標取得進展。但2Q已經是40%了。所以我想知道 24 年財政目標是否可以更高？

This is our guidance today about 2024, so we reiterate in absolute value that the revenue from high-value solutions, we can see strong demand, as mentioned, in the high-value share increased. Compared to initial guidance, as mentioned, we have seen pronounced reduction in sterile vials. But overall, we confirm our guidance in total numbers.

這是我們今天關於 2024 年的指導，因此我們重申高價值解決方案收入的絕對值，我們可以看到強勁的需求，正如前面提到的，高價值份額有所增加。如上所述，與最初的指導相比，我們發現無菌小瓶的數量明顯減少。但總的來說，我們確認了我們對總數的指導。

Obviously going down engineering, we are consequently increase the percentage on total revenue. About the midterm view, we feel confident to get that to 40% to 45% by 2027 with the growth in the coming years. Also, as mentioned by Franco, we see temporary vials stocking, so we expect to restart growing in vials for both the bulk and sterile. So other product lines will ramp up and not only value products.

顯然，在工程方面，我們增加了佔總收入的百分比。關於中期觀點，隨著未來幾年的成長，我們有信心在 2027 年將這一比例提高到 40% 至 45%。此外，正如 Franco 所提到的，我們看到臨時小瓶庫存，因此我們預計將重新開始在小瓶中進行散裝和無菌種植。因此其他產品線將會增加，而不僅僅是重視產品。

Patrick Donnelly, Citi.

派崔克唐納利，花旗銀行。

I will just ask two upfront. Franco, maybe just quickly on destocking piece, can you just talk about visibility, what you're hearing from customers, just expectations on that front as we work our way through the year. And then second, just on the China facility, how to think about the timing and the commitment to that region would be helpful.

我只會提前問兩個。Franco，也許只是快速討論去庫存問題，您能否談談可見性、您從客戶那裡聽到的情況以及我們全年工作中對這方面的期望。其次，就中國設施而言，如何考慮對該地區的時機和承諾將會有所幫助。

So just to clarify your question, Patrick, it was a little hard to hear you. Your first question was on destocking and asking about visibility into our customer forecast and the second question related to China and the timing on China. Is that correct?

所以，為了澄清你的問題，派崔克，聽你說的話有點困難。您的第一個問題是關於去庫存並詢問我們的客戶預測的可見性，第二個問題與中國以及中國的時間表有關。這是正確的嗎？

Yes.

是的。

So regarding destocking, just to give some number, the vial market, bulk vial market, is a market that have a size around EUR13 billion via area consumption. These are number approximately prepandemic. We're starting to face some issue with the destocking in 2023, also this year. So practically, we are entering the second year where we are facing this destocking issue.

因此，關於去庫存，僅給出一些數字，小瓶市場，散裝小瓶市場，是一個按面積消耗規模約為 130 億歐元的市場。這些數字大約是疫情前的數字。我們在 2023 年（今年也是如此）開始面臨去庫存的一些問題。實際上，我們正​​進入第二年面臨去庫存問題。

Today, what do we see that practically all our customers, international customers, regional customers that build a huge inventory for COVID vials and also for all the other therapeutic drugs. Now our customers are moving this situation of destocking. We are starting, like I mentioned before, to see particularly the smaller customer where they have more lean supply chain reactivation of order.

今天，我們看到幾乎所有的客戶、國際客戶、區域客戶都為新冠病毒小瓶以及所有其他治療藥物建立了龐大的庫存。現在我們的客戶正在轉移這種去庫存的情況。正如我之前提到的，我們開始特別關注較小的客戶，他們有更精益的供應鏈重新啟動訂單。

What is more related to international customers, we are starting to -- they are still soft in the demand on 2024, but they're starting to discuss forecast for 2025. So this is the reason why we're starting to see overall positive sign on the vial market.

與國際客戶更相關的是，我們開始討論 2024 年的需求仍然疲軟，但他們開始討論 2025 年的預測。這就是為什麼我們開始看到小瓶市場整體積極跡象的原因。

Regarding China, the factor -- by the way, China, Asia Pacific for Stevanato is still and will remain a strategic market because we see a very big opportunity particularly in biosimilars in the next year to come. It is also true that in Stevanato Group, we are very flexible in terms of follow the demand requested by our customers. We're also aware our customer is addressing the request in our modules to make investment in our modular.

關於中國，順便說一句，中國和斯蒂瓦那托亞太地區仍然是並將繼續是一個戰略市場，因為我們看到了一個非常大的機會，特別是在明年的生物仿製藥領域。確實，在斯蒂瓦那托集團，我們在滿足客戶的需求方面非常靈活。我們也知道我們的客戶正在滿足我們模組中的要求，以便對我們的模組進行投資。

So particularly, one of our major anchor customers, they just reallocated their needs from Asia. They've asked us to further reinforce our capacity into the plants of Latina. This the reason why we have partially reallocated our investment. We are increasing capacity in Italy. Also, because what we -- the capacity that we have in China today is sufficient to service satisfy the market.

特別是，我們的主要主要客戶之一，他們剛剛從亞洲重新分配了需求。他們要求我們進一步加強拉丁工廠的產能。這就是我們部分重新分配投資的原因。我們正在增加義大利的產能。另外，因為我們今天在中國擁有的產能足以滿足市場的需求。

David Windley, Jefferies.

大衛溫德利，傑弗里斯。

Hi, hopefully you can hear me. I wanted to ask, I'm trying to understand the guidance a little bit. From some scratch math I've done here, it looks like you need about 27% EBITDA margins in the second half from 21% in the first half and then incremental margins of something in the mid-50s percentage to kind of hit this new midpoint of the range. And clearly, with the the cost that you've incurred, the delays in projects, or the complexity of some of these projects, your margins have been negatively affected. I mean, effectively your incremental margins have been negative. Just wanted to understand how you see the progression from first half to second half.

你好，希望你能聽到我的聲音。我想問一下，我正在嘗試稍微理解一下指導。從我在這裡做的一些初步計算來看，看起來你需要在下半年將 EBITDA 利潤率從上半年的 21% 提高到 27%，然後增加 50 年代中期的利潤率，才能達到這個新的中點。的範圍。顯然，由於您所產生的成本、專案的延誤或其中一些專案的複雜性，您的利潤受到了負面影響。我的意思是，實際上你的增量利潤一直是負數。只是想了解您如何看待從上半場到下半場的進展。

Are you taking cost out of the business? It sounds like you're actually investing into. But again, wondering if you're taking cost out of the business that would help to support those high incremental margins to get to the much higher EBITDA targets in the second half.

您是否正在削減業務成本？聽起來你確實在投資。但同樣，想知道您是否正在削減業務成本，這將有助於支持這些高增量利潤率，從而在下半年實現更高的 EBITDA 目標。

We see a path similar to last year with respect of sequential growing between Q2, Q3, and Q4. So basically, we need to repeat what we have done last year. Overall, we are, let's say, we took the top, the higher cost in engineering second quarter. We expect to grow particularly with the good mix in high-value products, especially syringes. And we can leverage the ramp-up of Latina.

我們看到第二季、第三季和第四季之間的連續成長路徑與去年類似。所以基本上，我們需要重複去年所做的事情。總的來說，我們在第二季的工程成本方面處於領先地位。我們期望透過高價值產品（尤其是注射器）的良好組合來實現成長。我們可以利用拉丁裔的崛起。

And we will give you more comfort on this in the first half of the year. The ramp-up in Fishers and Latina was painful from the P&L perspective because we have all the structure in place. We have quality in place, information technology, controlling, logistic, planning. And we are -- we generated small amount of revenue first half of the year.

今年上半年我們將在這方面帶給您更多安慰。從損益角度來看，費希爾斯和拉丁裔的成長是痛苦的，因為我們已經準備好了所有結構。我們擁有到位的品質、資訊科技、控制、物流、規劃。今年上半年我們產生了少量收入。

Definitely for the second part of the year, we plan to ramp up significantly Latina and start generating some commercial revenue in Fishers. So this is one of the driver of the growth. And everything is embedded in our guidance basically to repeat what we have been able to do last year.

當然，在今年下半年，我們計劃大幅增加拉丁裔業務，並開始在漁民領域創造一些商業收入。所以這是成長的驅動力之一。所有內容都包含在我們的指導中，基本上是為了重複我們去年所做的事情。

David, if I can complement the answer of Marco, also we are making a lot of attention also under the leadership of Ugo Gay this year, the new Chief Operating Officer, to make a lot of attention in making a lot of improvement in efficiency internally in order to really to try to maximize and bring the full plans in Stevanato Group, the full function, it became extremely efficient. So these are negative side that we are starting to put a lot of attention. By the way, it will be an ongoing activity also for the next year.

大衛，如果我可以補充 Marco 的答案，今年我們在新任首席營運長 Ugo Gay 的領導下也非常重視，在內部效率方面做出了很多改進為了真正嘗試最大化並實現斯蒂瓦那托集團的完整計劃、完整功能，它變得非常有效率。因此，這些都是我們開始給予大量關注的負面影響。順便說一句，這也將是明年的持續活動。

Got it. Maybe a slight twist on the question, would you be willing to give us some sense of split? I don't think you did that in the updated guidance. I'm sorry if I missed it, but the sense of split of revenue contribution for the year between BDS and engineering?

知道了。也許這個問題稍微有點曲折，你願意給我們一些分裂的感覺嗎？我認為您在更新的指南中沒有這樣做。如果我錯過了，我很抱歉，但是北斗系統和工程部門之間今年的收入貢獻分配的意義是什麼？

Yes, we, let's say, are in line with current consensus with respect of BDS around EUR930 million. That means a mid-single-digit growth in BDS. In engineering, we mentioned that we expect a decline between 15% to 20% compared to last year.

是的，可以說，我們與目前關於北斗系統的共識一致，約為 9.3 億歐元。這意味著北斗系統將出現中等個位數的成長。在工程方面，我們提到預計與去年相比將下降 15% 至 20%。

Okay. And then if I can ask one last one that's more long term. Thinking about your longer-term margin targets and the change -- so we've come to understand that high-value vials are quite profitable for you. Vials, I think you said, vials, maybe overall, were down 40%. Is the achievement of your longer term targets dependent on vials recovering the same percentage of your business that they were, say, a year or two years ago?

好的。如果我能問最後一個問題，那就是更長遠的問題。考慮到您的長期利潤目標和變化，我們了解到高價值的小瓶對您來說是相當有利可圖的。小瓶，我想你說過，小瓶可能整體下降了 40%。您的長期目標的實現是否取決於小瓶恢復與一年或兩年前相同的業務百分比？

David, today, once we will scale up our two new greenfield plants, in particular Latina and Fisher, we are confident that we'll continue really to match our adjusted EBITDA target that we share from 27%, about 30% and to stay in the high-value range of -- high-value solution product between 40% to 45%. This is where we are target.

大衛，今天，一旦我們擴大我們的兩個新的綠地工廠，特別是拉蒂納和費舍爾，我們有信心我們將繼續真正達到我們調整後的EBITDA 目標，我們所佔的比例從27%到30% 左右，並保持在高價值解決方案產品的高價值範圍在40%到45%之間。這就是我們的目標。

Today, we are growing a lot on the syringes, Nexa. We have a good pipeline on Alba technology. We have a lot of mid small program on syringes with bypass. And also, we have big program on cartridges ready to fill with some anchor customer. But we see more and more uptrend on the industry. The cartridges will turn into a ready to fill. So overall, we are confident on the number that we showed you.

今天，我們在註射器方面取得了很大進展，Nexa。我們在 Alba 技術方面擁有良好的管道。我們有很多關於帶有旁路注射器的中小型項目。而且，我們還有一個關於墨盒的大型計劃，準備好為一些主要客戶填充。但我們看到該行業越來越多的上升趨勢。墨盒將變為可填充狀態。總的來說，我們對向您展示的數字充滿信心。

And then actually, in the medium term, we see this appear in the vials destocking. We are taking action to be back on track for the engineering. And compared to the Capital Markets Day, we see a strong demand in syringes, as Franco was saying, the conversion, the acceleration of the conversion of cartridges to sterile. So we are offsetting some risk also in EZ-fill vials, but we are confident to drive the growth there in the same direction.

實際上，從中期來看，我們看到這齣現在小瓶庫存減少。我們正在採取行動，使工程重回正軌。與資本市場日相比，我們看到對注射器的強勁需求，正如弗朗哥所說，轉換，加速藥筒向無菌轉換。因此，我們也在抵消 EZ-fill 瓶中的一些風險，但我們有信心以相同的方向推動該領域的成長。

Larry Solow, CJS Securities.

拉里·索洛，CJS 證券。

All my questions were answered. I guess, just to follow up on David's question on the vial. So it does feel like you've seen some positive signs, and maybe you were hopeful for some of those positive signs that we're starting to see. But it also feels like you've not maybe as confident or certain that we get a recovery in '25, maybe some recovery. But is it fair to say that maybe you're a little bit less confident or you just don't want to necessarily stick your head and neck out and make a guide for '25 yet.

我所有的問題都得到了解答。我想，只是為了跟進大衛關於小瓶子的問題。所以感覺你確實看到了一些積極的跡象，也許你對我們開始看到的一些積極跡象充滿希望。但也感覺你可能沒有那麼有信心或確定我們會在 25 年復甦，也許會有所復甦。但公平地說，也許您有點不太自信，或者您只是不想全力以赴為 25 年制定指南。

But on the same respect, though, it doesn't feel like your confidence has diminished at all in the overall potential of vials and that we will get back to a level you thought you would get to, maybe just a little bit further out. Is that kind of fair to sum that up that way?

但從同樣的角度來看，你對小瓶的整體潛力的信心並沒有減弱，而且我們將回到你認為會達到的水平，也許只是更遠一點。這樣總結公平嗎？

We are confident the vial market is there. It's a necessary format for the industry. For 2025, there's uncertainty about the timing of the inflection point because we are monitoring it. But it's a little bit early to say that the January cycle will be at the level of we expect.

我們對小瓶市場的存在充滿信心。這是行業必要的格式。對於 2025 年，拐點的時間存在不確定性，因為我們正在監控它。但現在說一月份的周期將達到我們預期的水平還為時過早。

Today, we have a constant dialogue with our customers because we are involved with our customer not only in vial, with many program. We can move to syringes, on cartridges, DDS program. So today, we have an intense discussion at their supply chain level because also is one of the main concern to reduce it to normalize the level of stock. So all overall, the trend is positive.

今天，我們與客戶保持持續的對話，因為我們不僅在小瓶上與客戶打交道，還與許多項目打交道。我們可以轉向注射器、藥筒、DDS 計劃。因此，今天，我們在他們的供應鏈層面進行了激烈的討論，因為減少供應鏈以使庫存水準正常化也是主要關注點之一。總的來說，趨勢是正面的。

We see positive signings, more customer like I mentioned before that they're going back to normalize. The bigger customer, more when they have complex supply chain, there are multiple sites, this is something that we are more prudent. But there are constant intimate discussion that we have practically every week with our customer today.

我們看到了積極的簽約，更多的客戶，就像我之前提到的，他們將恢復正常化。客戶越大，供應鏈就越複雜，有多個站點，這是我們更謹慎的事情。但今天我們幾乎每週都會與客戶進行持續的親密討論。

And you mentioned some stuff on the -- a little update on the cartridge market. Can you just give us any more color? I know manufacturing capabilities capacity had been built out a little bit by some of your customers last year, but are we seeing some destocking there, too? It's a smaller market, so probably not. But could you just give us anything there, any update there?

您提到了有關墨盒市場的一些更新。你能給我們更多的顏色嗎？我知道去年你們的一些客戶已經增加了一些製造能力，但我們是否也看到了一些庫存的減少？這是一個較小的市場，所以可能不會。但你能給我們一些資訊嗎？

Larry, just to clarify the question, you're asking if we're also seeing destocking effects in cartridges?

拉里，為了澄清這個問題，你是問我們是否也看到墨盒的去庫存效應？

Or just any -- not destocking, just any update qualitatively in terms of --

或只是任何——不是去庫存，只是在品質方面進行任何更新--

We have not signed for a change in demand with our customers. Most we see are strong demand on Nexa syringes, and we see an increase in demand of cartridges ready to fill. For sure, on cartridges ready to fill, we are put in place high-speed line that this is something that will generate more bigger revenue in the later stage because now our engineering division is in a complex phase to build the technology for internal use. So overall, the demand is robust and in biologics is really strong at this moment.

我們尚未與客戶簽署需求變更協議。我們看到的大多數是對 Nexa 注射器的強勁需求，並且我們看到對可填充藥筒的需求增加。當然，在準備填充的墨盒上，我們部署了高速生產線，這將在後期產生更大的收入，因為現在我們的工程部門正處於構建內部使用技術的複雜階段。整體而言，需求強勁，目前生物製劑的需求非常強勁。

If I may just slip last question, just on cash flow expectations. I think your cash balance was about EUR75 million currently it looks like, I think so. Can you just give us any thoughts on that in light of your CapEx plans and will you need to raise any more -- maybe any more financing this year. Any thoughts on that?

我可以略過最後一個問題，關於現金流預期。我認為您目前的現金餘額約為 7500 萬歐元，我想是這樣。您能否根據您的資本支出計劃向我們提供任何想法，以及您是否需要籌集更多資金——也許今年需要更多融資。對此有什麼想法嗎？

So as mentioned, we have EUR78 million of cash on hand. We have availability on credit lines, and we are positive free cash flow from operations. So we believe we are in the position to finance the growth at least for the next 12 months.

如前所述，我們手頭上有 7800 萬歐元現金。我們有可用的信貸額度，並且我們的營運自由現金流為正。因此，我們相信我們至少有能力為未來 12 個月的成長提供資金。

And then looking ahead, we are still working on the plan for 2025. We are working on the budget to see a detailed plan for CapEx in 2025. We still have a balance sheet with a small leverage, just so we can leverage the opportunity to further invest in high-value products, obviously provided the internal rate of return is higher than our cost of capital.

然後展望未來，我們仍在製定 2025 年的計畫。我們正在製定預算，以製定 2025 年資本支出的詳細計劃。我們仍然擁有一個小槓桿的資產負債表，這樣我們就可以利用機會進一步投資高價值產品，顯然前提是內部報酬率高於我們的資本成本。

Dan Leonard, UBS.

丹‧倫納德，瑞銀集團。

You made a comment that you're seeing an increasing shift to upgrade infrastructure to better align with Annex I requirements. Could you elaborate a bit more on that?

您評論說，您看到升級基礎設施的趨勢越來越明顯，以便更好地符合附件一的要求。能詳細說明一下嗎？

Yes. Practically, Annex I is a new recommendation that practically all overall is asking of the pharmaceutical industry to try to put in place on process that avoid any type of risk to put in danger the sterility of the product. So practically, which is the answer of Stevanato Group on this, our EZ-fill configuration because you're going to be serving no glass to glass configuration to our customer is helping really to avoid any type of generation of particles, can be particle from glass, delamination, or some particle that came from -- during the washing, sterilization, and (inaudible) program.

是的。實際上，附件一是一項新建議，幾乎所有製藥業都在要求其製定流程，以避免任何類型的風險危及產品的無菌性。實際上，這就是斯蒂瓦那托集團對此的回答，我們的EZ-fill 配置因為您不會向我們的客戶提供玻璃到玻璃的配置，這確實有助於避免任何類型的顆粒生成，顆粒可能來自玻璃、分層或來自清洗、滅菌和（聽不清楚）程序期間的某些顆粒。

So this is the reason why we feel that in the medium term, the adoption of EZ-fill vial can help Stevanato in order to boost our revenue. And on the top of this, if you're moving to our engineering segment is going to require more sophisticated, especially on line with a particular artificial intelligence that can further detect and improve the process of the pharma company. So all overall, Annex I in the medium term, we think that would be favorable for Stevanato Group.

因此，這就是為什麼我們認為從中期來看，採用 EZ-fill 小瓶可以幫助 Stevanato 增加我們的收入。最重要的是，如果您要轉向我們的工程領域，將需要更複雜的技術，特別是與特定的人工智慧相結合，可以進一步檢測和改進製藥公司的流程。因此，總的來說，從中期來看，我們認為附件一對斯蒂瓦那托集團有利。

Sure. And then as a follow-up, you mentioned that some of the CapEx shift from China to Latina was the result of a regional capacity preference change from an anchor customer. Could you discuss that a bit more Is that due to concerns from that customer about bio secure or anything specific you could point to?

當然。作為後續行動，您提到部分資本支出從中國轉移到拉丁美洲是由於主要客戶的區域產能偏好變化的結果。您能否再討論一下，這是由於該客戶對生物安全或您可以指出的任何具體問題的擔憂嗎？

I'm sorry, we don't have the internal details from the customer. We know that usually our global customer, they want to secure a global footprint. This the reason why most probably they have decided to make some modification from one region to another one, but we don't have more element in our hand.

抱歉，我們沒有客戶的內部詳細資料。我們知道，通常我們的全球客戶希望獲得全球足跡。這很可能是他們決定從一個區域到另一個區域進行一些修改的原因，但我們手中沒有更多的元素。

Curtis Moiles, BNP Paribas Exane.

柯蒂斯‧莫爾斯 (Curtis Moiles)，法國巴黎銀行 Exane。

First one, I just wanted to come back on the gross margin for the engineering segment. I think I heard you say that you took kind of the biggest impact of the higher costs in Q2. Does that mean that in the second half of the year, we should see that gross margin bounce back to a more normalized level, or what are you expecting there?

第一個，我只想回到工程部門的毛利率。我想我聽到你說你在第二季度受到了更高成本的最大影響。這是否意味著下半年我們應該會看到毛利率反彈至更正常的水平，或者您對此有何預期？

Back to sequential improvement for the projects in engineering, we took the second quarter on those big projects there. Nevertheless, we expect still some quarters before going back to the normal profitability in engineering. We still have to navigate and complete the project and satisfy our customers. And to do that, we need to put more effort and more people on the field in order to satisfy the customers.

回到工程專案的連續改進，我們在第二季度進行了那些大型專案。儘管如此，我們預計工程領域仍需幾季才能恢復正常獲利能力。我們仍然需要引導並完成該專案並滿足我們的客戶。為此，我們需要在現場投入更多的努力和更多的人員，以滿足客戶的需求。

Today, if I can also give some operational clarification, under the leadership of Ugo Gay, the new Chief Operating Officer, and not only Ugo, also Raffaele Pace that most of you, you met in the past event. We have really -- with their back, they are building a clear program in order really to review all our footprint to optimize all our factory, even more to prepare the engineering division for the next future growth with our customers.

今天，我也可以在新任營運長烏戈·蓋伊（Ugo Gay）的領導下，以及你們大多數人在過去的活動中遇到的拉斐爾·佩斯（Raffaele Pace）以及烏戈·蓋在伊（Ugo Gay）的領導下，做一些營運方面的澄清。在他們的支持下，我們確實正在製定一個明確的計劃，以便真正審查我們的所有足跡，以優化我們所有的工廠，甚至更多地為工程部門與我們的客戶一起未來的成長做好準備。

So these are all the action that were put in place. There is a clear governance in particular, starting from Denmark, and we count to have the first result in the next few quarters in front of us.

這些都是已採取的行動。尤其是從丹麥開始，有一個明確的治理，我們預計將在接下來的幾季中取得第一個結果。

Okay, that's helpful. And then the second question, again, you were talking about earlier how you were postponing the expansion in China and shifting it over to Latina, I think. Does that kind of indicate to us that you're going to come in at the lower end of the full-year CapEx range of EUR335 million, or is nothing really changing there?

好的，這很有幫助。然後是第二個問題，我想，您早些時候談到瞭如何推遲在中國的擴張並將其轉移到拉丁裔。這是否向我們表明您將處於全年資本支出 3.35 億歐元範圍的下限，或者實際上沒有任何變化？

It's not changing the guidance for CapEx. We expect between EUR300 million to EUR335 million. It's not making a big difference in 2024. It's more an impact we will consider for 2025 guidance.

它不會改變資本支出的指導。我們預計在 3 億歐元至 3.35 億歐元之間。到 2024 年，這不會產生太大影響。我們將在 2025 年指導中考慮更多的影響。

If I can say maybe, if there is no more question, some final word. Today, all the organization is squarely focused to face these temporary challenges. But also in the meantime, also we are excited in the company because we are also working for the future. So there is a high concentration and motivation in the company to deliver in particular with these new greenfield plants, this amazing program that we have around cartridges ready to fill.

如果我可以說也許，如果沒有其他問題的話，我可以說最後一句話。如今，整個組織都專注於應對這些暫時的挑戰。但同時，我們對公司也感到興奮，因為我們也在為未來而努力。因此，公司有高度的專注力和動力來交付，特別是這些新的綠地工廠，我們圍繞著準備填充的墨盒製定了這個令人驚嘆的計劃。

And today, all the organization, no matter it is in Europe. And at this stage, this is the big goal, to deliver the long-term agreement, the business plan that we have, the commitment made with our customers. This is the only thing that we will try to do every day.

今天，所有的組織，無論是在歐洲。在這個階段，這是一個大目標，即交付長期協議、我們的業務計劃以及與客戶所做的承諾。這是我們每天都會努力做的唯一一件事。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

Paul Knight, KeyBanc.

保羅奈特，KeyBanc。

On the third-party intercompany line item, what's in that? It seems to have obviously been huge as well. Is that internal supply of inspection systems for yourself? What is that exactly?

在第三方公司間訂單項目上，其中包含什麼？看起來顯然也很大。是內部為您提供檢查系統嗎？那到底是什麼？

Paul, we have there the glass forming machines that our engineering segment is providing to Fishers and Latina to expand our capacity.

保羅，我們的工程部門正在向 Fishers 和 Latina 提供玻璃成型機，以擴大我們的產能。

Okay, completely makes sense.

好吧，完全有道理。

That was the last question. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining. The conference is now over. You may disconnect your telephones. Thank you.

這是最後一個問題。女士們先生們，感謝您的加入。會議現已結束。您可以斷開電話。謝謝。